From nobody Mon Feb 4 07:40:15 2019 Return-Path: X-Original-To: core@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: core@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id BF128130E83 for ; Mon, 4 Feb 2019 07:40:12 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -4.2 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-4.2 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_50=0.8, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_HI=-5] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id p2YvAFiRrFvd for ; Mon, 4 Feb 2019 07:40:10 -0800 (PST) Received: from mail-edgeS23.fraunhofer.de (mail-edges23.fraunhofer.de [153.97.7.23]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id DEB55130E81 for ; Mon, 4 Feb 2019 07:40:08 -0800 (PST) X-IronPort-Anti-Spam-Filtered: true X-IronPort-Anti-Spam-Result: =?us-ascii?q?A2H5DQAO4PJb/xoBYJliHAEBAQQBAQcEA?= =?us-ascii?q?QGBZQKCAmZwOYN4iBpdix2BYAiXXIE+Ow0jC4Q+g3AiPAIMAQMBAQIBAQICAmk?= =?us-ascii?q?cDIJmBE07AwEBAQEBAQEBASQBAQEBAQEBAQEBAQEBAQEaAg2BDRVBNQImAkkWD?= =?us-ascii?q?QEHAQGDHQGCAAEPpz6BL4VAhFcFCQGBAYp6gVc/gTgMhXoCAoFJY4I3glcCiSa?= =?us-ascii?q?GLI9IVQcCgRGBCQSEXIonBhiBSYgPBYcgLI0Nil2BdAuBVTMaJIM8hgeCZIdvP?= =?us-ascii?q?gEyAY5bAQE?= X-IPAS-Result: =?us-ascii?q?A2H5DQAO4PJb/xoBYJliHAEBAQQBAQcEAQGBZQKCAmZwOYN?= =?us-ascii?q?4iBpdix2BYAiXXIE+Ow0jC4Q+g3AiPAIMAQMBAQIBAQICAmkcDIJmBE07AwEBA?= =?us-ascii?q?QEBAQEBASQBAQEBAQEBAQEBAQEBAQEaAg2BDRVBNQImAkkWDQEHAQGDHQGCAAE?= =?us-ascii?q?Ppz6BL4VAhFcFCQGBAYp6gVc/gTgMhXoCAoFJY4I3glcCiSaGLI9IVQcCgRGBC?= =?us-ascii?q?QSEXIonBhiBSYgPBYcgLI0Nil2BdAuBVTMaJIM8hgeCZIdvPgEyAY5bAQE?= X-IronPort-AV: E=Sophos;i="5.56,253,1539640800"; d="scan'208";a="9060915" Received: from mail-mtaka26.fraunhofer.de ([153.96.1.26]) by mail-edgeS23.fraunhofer.de with ESMTP/TLS/DHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384; 04 Feb 2019 16:40:05 +0100 X-IronPort-Anti-Spam-Filtered: true X-IronPort-Anti-Spam-Result: =?us-ascii?q?A0B3FQCO3/Jb/xBhWMBiHgEGBwaBZQKCa?= =?us-ascii?q?E8hOYN4iBpdjQWXXIF5DSOESYQRPAIMAQMBAQIBAQJtHAyFZhVBNQImAkkWDQE?= =?us-ascii?q?HAQGDHQGCAQ+nOIEvhUCEVwUJAYEBjFE/gTgMhXoCAoFJY4I3glcCiSaGLI9IV?= =?us-ascii?q?QcCgRGBCQSEXIonBhiBSYgPBYcgLI0Nil2BdAqBVTMaJIM8hgeCZIdvPgMwAY5?= =?us-ascii?q?bAQE?= X-IronPort-AV: E=Sophos;i="5.56,253,1539640800"; d="scan'208";a="29219302" Received: from fgdemucivp01ltm.xch.fraunhofer.de (HELO FGDEMUCIMP11EXC.ads.fraunhofer.de) ([192.88.97.16]) by mail-mtaKA26.fraunhofer.de with ESMTP/TLS/AES256-SHA; 04 Feb 2019 16:40:05 +0100 Received: from [10.144.89.145] (10.80.233.50) by FGDEMUCIMP11EXC.ads.fraunhofer.de (10.80.232.42) with Microsoft SMTP Server (TLS) id 14.3.435.0; Mon, 4 Feb 2019 16:40:04 +0100 To: CC: , =?UTF-8?Q?Christian_Ams=c3=bcss?= , =?UTF-8?Q?G=c3=b6ran_Selander?= From: Jaro Fietz Message-ID: <8e2a1535-a0b8-c93b-9222-b3acba7dd9d0@aisec.fraunhofer.de> Date: Mon, 4 Feb 2019 16:41:18 +0100 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; Linux x86_64; rv:60.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/60.0 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Language: en-US X-TM-AS-Product-Ver: SMEX-11.0.0.4179-8.200.1013-24402.004 X-TM-AS-Result: No--1.116900-8.000000-31 X-TM-AS-User-Approved-Sender: No X-TM-AS-User-Blocked-Sender: No Archived-At: Subject: [core] Open Source c_OSCORE X-BeenThere: core@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: "Constrained RESTful Environments \(CoRE\) Working Group list" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 04 Feb 2019 15:40:13 -0000 Hey, I'm pleased to announce open-sourcing the c_OSCORE project, which is a minimal implementation of an OSCORE server in C for the 96Boards Nitrogen on top of Zephyr. It implements most required elements of the specification (version 14), but lacks for example replay protection. It handles the Tests Specification for OSCORE Test 1 [1] correctly, which I tested with aiocoap's plugtest-client. You can find the source code on github: https://github.com/Fraunhofer-AISEC/c_OSCORE BR, Jaro [1]: https://ericssonresearch.github.io/OSCOAP/test-spec5.html#get From nobody Mon Feb 4 10:45:48 2019 Return-Path: X-Original-To: core@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: core@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7FF98130EE9 for ; Mon, 4 Feb 2019 10:45:47 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -7.875 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-7.875 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIMWL_WL_HIGH=-4.553, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, FROM_EXCESS_BASE64=0.979, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-2.3, SPF_PASS=-0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (1024-bit key) header.d=ericsson.com header.b=OIVLom9C; dkim=pass (1024-bit key) header.d=ericsson.com header.b=Y8XcKg6q Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id hhnQ85_ZmZyp for ; 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i="5.56,560,1539628200"; d="scan'208,217"; a="34473637" MIME-Version: 1.0 Sensitivity: Importance: Normal X-Priority: 3 (Normal) In-Reply-To: References: , <08d7924f-55c5-f89a-c2f6-cccb3fa4d071@gmail.com> <3c66d20e-2db2-7e15-6080-ce3646f848f6@gmail.com> From: Abhijan Bhattacharyya To: "Carsten Bormann" , "Alexandre Petrescu" Cc: its@ietf.org, "core@ietf.org" Message-ID: Date: Tue, 5 Feb 2019 00:30:42 +0530 X-Mailer: Lotus Domino Web Server Release 9.0.1FP10HF213 April 26, 2018 X-MIMETrack: Serialize by http on InKolM02/TCS(Release 9.0.1FP10HF213 | April 26, 2018) at 02/05/2019 00:30:42, Serialize complete at 02/05/2019 00:30:42, Itemize by http on InKolM02/TCS(Release 9.0.1FP10HF213 | April 26, 2018) at 02/05/2019 00:30:42, Serialize by Router on InKolM02/TCS(Release 9.0.1FP10HF213 | April 26, 2018) at 02/05/2019 00:32:40, Serialize complete at 02/05/2019 00:32:40 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="=_alternative 00686F1D65258397_=" Archived-At: Subject: Re: [core] [ipwave] Adaptive RESTful Real-time Live Streaming for Things (A-REaLiST)' X-BeenThere: core@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: "Constrained RESTful Environments \(CoRE\) Working Group list" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 04 Feb 2019 19:02:58 -0000 --=_alternative 00686F1D65258397_= MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Thank you Carsten for your comments. No one can speak about CoAP better tha= n you! Alex, I have uploaded a new version of the draft. The links are given at the end = of this mail. I have indeed tried to address your concern in respect to mak= ing the draft more "IPv6-relevant". As Carsten rightly pointed out that the proposal works at the application l= ayer and is built on the foundation of CoAP, so it is Layer-3 agnostic. Als= o, as we all know, CoAP is designed for IPv6. However, implementation on IPv6 may influence the process of determining th= e maximum size of information segments. So, a new subsection has been added= as part of the design guidelines. The small addition reads as below: 6.3. Determining the segment size Size of the information segment in a CoAP message should be limited by t= he least possible MTU for the end-to-end channel. This is to ensure that there is= no undesired conversation state at the lower layers of the protocol stack d= ue to uncontrolled fragmentation leading to undesired explosion of traffic in = the network. For IPV6 network, the MTU can be determined using Path MTU Disc= overy (PMTUD) [RFC8201] which bestows the responsibility of determining the pa= th MTU on the end-points itself. The size of the segment should be guided by the recommendations as speci= fied in Section 4.6 of [RFC7252]. I hope this will now satisfy the criterion of finding IPv6 in the draft. Looping in CoRE list as well to announce the new version to the WG where th= is draft originates. Thank you. URL: https://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-bhattacharyya-co= re-a-realist-01.txt Status: https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-bhattacharyya-core-a= -realist/ Htmlized: https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-bhattacharyya-core-a-real= ist-01 Htmlized: https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/html/draft-bhattacharyya-c= ore-a-realist Diff: https://www.ietf.org/rfcdiff?url2=3Ddraft-bhattacharyya-cor= e-a-realist-01 With Best Regards Abhijan Bhattacharyya Consultant / Scientist, {Internet Protocols | 5G | Standardization}, = TCS Research, Tata Consultancy Services Building 1B,Ecospace Plot - IIF/12 ,New Town, Rajarhat, Kolkata - 700160,West Bengal India Ph:- +91 33 66884691 Cell:- +919830468972 | +918583875003 Mailto: abhijan.bhattacharyya@tcs.com Website: http://www.tcs.com ____________________________________________ Experience certainty. IT Services Business Solutions Consulting ____________________________________________ -----"its" wrote: ----- To: "Alexandre Petrescu" From: "Carsten Bormann" = Sent by: "its" = Date: 01/31/2019 06:12PM Cc: "Abhijan Bhattacharyya" , "Michael Richa= rdson" , its@ietf.org Subject: Re: [ipwave] Adaptive RESTful Real-time Live Streaming for Things = (A-REaLiST)' "External email. Open with Caution" > If TCP's state machine was a bottleneck, has one tried to use UDP > instead? I think that is indeed one of the advantages CoAP brings go the table here. > Does CoAP work on Ethernet? CoAP was designed to be able to run on UDP, which is on IP which in turn wo= rks very well on Ethernet. > Does CoAP work in an end-to-end manner or does it need protocol > conversion gateways? I works end-to-end (as long as your network doesn’t break UDP). > I want to ask you: please use IPv6 for CoAP and RESTful. CoAP was designed to work well over IPv6 (but works as well over IPv4). > Then I searched for the keyword ‘IPv6' in the draft. > […] > If you add ‘IPv6' considerations to it, then I will comment on it. For a CoAP application such as A-REaLiST, IPv6 makes little difference (bey= ond being able to assign addresses to both ends in the first place), so I d= on’t know there is a lot to say. Gr=FC=DFe, Carsten _______________________________________________ its mailing list its@ietf.org https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/its =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D-----=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D-----=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D Notice: The information contained in this e-mail message and/or attachments to it may contain = confidential or privileged information. If you are = not the intended recipient, any dissemination, use, = review, distribution, printing or copying of the = information contained in this e-mail message = and/or attachments to it are strictly prohibited. If = you have received this communication in error, = please notify us by reply e-mail or telephone and = immediately and permanently delete the message = and any attachments. Thank you --=_alternative 00686F1D65258397_= Content-ID: <> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Thank you Carsten for your comments. No one can speak about CoA= P better than you!

Alex,
I have uploaded= a new version of the draft. The links are given at the end of this mail. I= have indeed tried to address your concern in respect to making the draft m= ore "IPv6-relevant".

As Carsten rightly pointed ou= t that the proposal works at the application layer and is built on the foun= dation of CoAP, so it is Layer-3 agnostic. Also, as we all know, CoAP is de= signed for IPv6.
However, implementation on IPv6 may influence th= e process of determining the maximum size of information segments. So, a ne= w subsection has been added as part of the design guidelines. The small add= ition reads as below:

<Quote>
6.3. Determining t= he segment size Size of the information segment in a CoAP message should be limited by t= he least possible MTU for the end-to-end channel. This is to ensure that there is= no undesired conversation state at the lower layers of the protocol stack d= ue to uncontrolled fragmentation leading to undesired explosion of traffic in = the network. For IPV6 network, the MTU can be determined using Path MTU Disc= overy (PMTUD) [RFC8201] which bestows the responsibility of determining the pa= th MTU on the end-points itself. The size of the segment should be guided by the recommendations as speci= fied in Section 4.6 of [RFC7252].
</Quote>

<= font size=3D"2">I hope this will now satisfy the criterion of finding IPv6 = in the draft.

Looping in CoRE list as well to announce the new version to the= WG where this draft originates.

Thank you.



With Best Regards<= br> Abhijan Bhattacharyya
Consultant / Scientist,
{Internet Protocols | 5G | Standardization},
TCS Research,
Tata Consultancy Services
Building 1B,Ecospace
Plot -  IIF/12 ,New Town, Rajarhat,
Kolkata - 700160,West Bengal
India
Ph:- +91 33 66884691
Cell:- +919830468972 | +918583875003
Mailto: = abhijan.bhattacharyya@tcs.com
Website: http://www.tcs.com
____________________________________________
Experience certainty. IT Services
Business Solutions
Consulting
____________________________________________


-----"its" <its-bounces@ietf.org> wro= te: -----
alexandre.petrescu@gmail.com>
From: "Carste= n Bormann"
Sent by: "its"
Date:= 01/31/2019 06:12PM
Cc: "Abhijan Bhattacharyya" <abhijan.bhattacharyya@tcs.co= m>, "Michael Richardson" <mcr@sandelman.ca>, its@ietf.org
Subject: Re: [ipwave] Adaptive RESTful = Real-time Live Streaming for Things (A-REaLiST)'

"External email. Open with Cautio= n"

> If TCP's state machine was a bottleneck, has one tried to us= e UDP
> instead?

I think that is indeed one of the advantages = CoAP brings go the table here.

> Does CoAP work on Ethernet?
<= br>CoAP was designed to be able to run on UDP, which is on IP which in turn= works very well on Ethernet.

> Does CoAP work in an end-to-end m= anner or does it need protocol
> conversion gateways?

I works = end-to-end (as long as your network doesn’t break UDP).

> I= want to ask you: please use IPv6 for CoAP and RESTful.

CoAP was des= igned to work well over IPv6 (but works as well over IPv4).

> The= n I searched for the keyword ‘IPv6' in the draft.
> […]> If you add ‘IPv6' considerations to it, then I will comment on= it.

For a CoAP application such as A-REaLiST, IPv6 makes little dif= ference (beyond being able to assign addresses to both ends in the first pl= ace), so I don’t know there is a lot to say.

Gr=FC=DFe, Carste= n

_______________________________________________
its mailing lis= t
its@ietf.org
= https://www.ietf.org/= mailman/listinfo/its

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i="5.58,336,1544466600"; d="scan'208,217"; a="34636526" MIME-Version: 1.0 Sensitivity: Importance: Normal X-Priority: 3 (Normal) In-Reply-To: References: From: Abhijan Bhattacharyya To: "core@ietf.org" , its@ietf.org Message-ID: Date: Wed, 6 Feb 2019 02:07:09 +0530 X-Mailer: Lotus Domino Web Server Release 9.0.1FP10HF213 April 26, 2018 X-MIMETrack: Serialize by http on InKolM02/TCS(Release 9.0.1FP10HF213 | April 26, 2018) at 02/06/2019 02:07:09, Serialize complete at 02/06/2019 02:07:10, Itemize by http on InKolM02/TCS(Release 9.0.1FP10HF213 | April 26, 2018) at 02/06/2019 02:07:10, Serialize by Router on InKolM02/TCS(Release 9.0.1FP10HF213 | April 26, 2018) at 02/06/2019 02:07:11, Serialize complete at 02/06/2019 02:07:11 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="=_alternative 0071440C65258398_=" Archived-At: Subject: [core] Fw: New Version Notification for draft-bhattacharyya-core-a-realist-02.txt X-BeenThere: core@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: "Constrained RESTful Environments \(CoRE\) Working Group list" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 05 Feb 2019 20:37:26 -0000 --=_alternative 0071440C65258398_= MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Dear CoRE and IPWAVE, We submitted a quick version 2 of A-REaLiST draft. The major changes from 00 to 02 (through 01) are as below: 1) In Section 4, a note has been provided on the interpretation of Stream_= id sub-field at the consumer end-point. 2) Section 6.3 has been introduced (in version 01 itself) to provide a guid= ance on how information segment sizes can be determined for the end-to-end = channel for IPv6 backbone. 3) Version 01 had some formatting issues and incorrect ToC. That has been f= ixed. Looking forward to comments from stakeholders in both the lists. Thank you. = With Best Regards Abhijan Bhattacharyya Consultant / Scientist, {Internet Protocols | 5G | Standardization}, = TCS Research, Tata Consultancy Services Building 1B,Ecospace Plot - IIF/12 ,New Town, Rajarhat, Kolkata - 700160,West Bengal India Ph:- +91 33 66884691 Cell:- +919830468972 | +918583875003 Mailto: abhijan.bhattacharyya@tcs.com Website: http://www.tcs.com ____________________________________________ Experience certainty. IT Services Business Solutions Consulting ____________________________________________ -----Forwarded by Abhijan Bhattacharyya/KOL/TCS on 02/06/2019 01:56AM ----- To: "Abhijan Bhattacharyya" , "Suvrat Agrawa= l" , "Arpan Pal" , "Hemant Rath" , "Balamurali Purushothaman" From: internet-drafts@ietf.org Date: 02/06/2019 01:55AM Subject: New Version Notification for draft-bhattacharyya-core-a-realist-02= .txt "External email. Open with Caution" A new version of I-D, draft-bhattacharyya-core-a-realist-02.txt has been successfully submitted by Abhijan Bhattacharyya and posted to the IETF repository. Name: draft-bhattacharyya-core-a-realist Revision: 02 Title: Adaptive RESTful Real-time Live Streaming for Things (A-REaLiST) Document date: 2019-02-06 Group: Individual Submission Pages: 18 URL: https://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-bhattacharyya-co= re-a-realist-02.txt Status: https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-bhattacharyya-core-a= -realist/ Htmlized: https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-bhattacharyya-core-a-real= ist-02 Htmlized: https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/html/draft-bhattacharyya-c= ore-a-realist Diff: https://www.ietf.org/rfcdiff?url2=3Ddraft-bhattacharyya-cor= e-a-realist-02 Abstract: This draft presents extensions to Constrained Application Protocol (CoAP) to enable RESTful Real-time Live Streaming for improving the Quality of Experience (QoE) for delay-sensitive Internet of Things (IoT) applications. The overall architecture is termed "Adaptive RESTful Real-time Live Streaming for Things (A-REaLiST)". It is particularly designed for applications which rely on real-time augmented vision through live First Person View (FPV) feed from constrained remote agents like Unmanned Aerial Vehicle (UAV), etc. These extensions provide the necessary hooks to help solution designers ensure low-latency transfer of streams and, for contents like video, a quick recovery from freeze and corruption without incurring undue lag. A-REaLiST is an attempt to provide an integrated approach to maintain the balance amongst QoE, resource- efficiency and loss resilience. It provides the necessary hooks to optimize system performance by leveraging contextual intelligence inferred from instantaneous information segments in flight. These extensions equip CoAP with a standard for efficient RESTful streaming for Internet of Things (IoT) contrary to HTTP-streaming in conventional Internet. = = Please note that it may take a couple of minutes from the time of submission until the htmlized version and diff are available at tools.ietf.org. The IETF Secretariat =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D-----=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D-----=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D Notice: The information contained in this e-mail message and/or attachments to it may contain = confidential or privileged information. If you are = not the intended recipient, any dissemination, use, = review, distribution, printing or copying of the = information contained in this e-mail message = and/or attachments to it are strictly prohibited. If = you have received this communication in error, = please notify us by reply e-mail or telephone and = immediately and permanently delete the message = and any attachments. Thank you --=_alternative 0071440C65258398_= Content-ID: <> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Dear CoRE and IPWAVE,
We submitted a quick version 2 = of A-REaLiST draft.
The major changes from 00 to 02 (through 01) = are as below:

1) In Section 4, a note = has been provided  on the interpretation of Stream_id sub-field at the= consumer end-point.
2)= Section 6.3 has been introduced (in version 01 itself) to provide a guidan= ce on how information segment sizes can be determined for the end-to-end ch= annel for IPv6 backbone.

Looking forward to comments from = stakeholders in both the lists.

Thank you= . 

With Best Regards
Abhijan Bhattacharyya
Consultant / Scientist,
{Internet Protocols | 5G | Standardization},
TCS Research,
Tata Consultancy Services
Building 1B,Ecospace
Plot -  IIF/12 ,New Town, Rajarhat,
Kolkata - 700160,West Bengal
India
Ph:- +91 33 66884691
Cell:- +919830468972 | +918583875003
Mailto: = abhijan.bhattacharyya@tcs.com
Website: http://www.tcs.com
____________________________________________
Experience certainty. IT Services
Business Solutions
Consulting
____________________________________________


-----Forwarded by Abhijan Bhat= tacharyya/KOL/TCS on 02/06/2019 01:56AM -----
To: "Abhijan Bhattachar= yya" <abhijan.bhattacharyya@tcs.com>, "Suvrat Agrawal" <suvrat.a@tcs.com>, "Arpan Pa= l" <arpan.pal@tcs= .com>, "Hemant Rath" <hemant.rath@tcs.com>, "Balamurali Purushothaman" <<= a href=3D"mailto:balamurali.p@tcs.com" target=3D"_blank">balamurali.p@tcs.c= om>
From: internet-drafts@ietf.org
Date: 02/06/2019 01:55AM
Subject:= New Version Notification for draft-bhattacharyya-core-a-realist-02.txt
=
"External = email. Open with Caution"

A new version of I-D, draft-bhattacharyya-= core-a-realist-02.txt
has been successfully submitted by Abhijan Bhattac= haryya and posted to the
IETF repository.

Name: draft-bhattachar= yya-core-a-realist
Revision: 02
Title: Adaptive RESTful Real-time Li= ve Streaming for Things (A-REaLiST)
Document date: 2019-02-06
Group: = Individual Submission
Pages: 18
URL:         &n= bsp;  https://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-bhatt= acharyya-core-a-realist-02.txt
Status:         <= a href=3D"https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-bhattacharyya-core-a-reali= st/">https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-bhattacharyya-core-a-realist/
Htmlized:       https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-b= hattacharyya-core-a-realist-02
Htmlized:       https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/html/draft-bhattacharyya-core-a-realis= t
Diff:           https://www.ie= tf.org/rfcdiff?url2=3Ddraft-bhattacharyya-core-a-realist-02

Abst= ract:
   This draft presents extensions to Constrained Applica= tion Protocol
   (CoAP) to enable RESTful Real-time Live Strea= ming for improving the
   Quality of Experience (QoE) for dela= y-sensitive Internet of Things
   (IoT) applications. The over= all architecture is termed "Adaptive
   RESTful Real-time Live= Streaming for Things (A-REaLiST)". It is
   particularly desi= gned for applications which rely on real-time
   augmented vis= ion through live First Person View (FPV) feed from
   constrai= ned remote agents like Unmanned Aerial Vehicle (UAV), etc.
   = These extensions provide the necessary hooks to help solution
 &nbs= p; designers ensure low-latency transfer of streams and, for contents
&n= bsp;  like video, a quick recovery from freeze and corruption without<= br>   incurring undue lag. A-REaLiST is an attempt to provide an<= br>   integrated approach to maintain the balance amongst QoE, re= source-
   efficiency and loss resilience. It provides the nec= essary hooks to
   optimize system performance by leveraging c= ontextual intelligence
   inferred from instantaneous informat= ion segments in flight. These
   extensions equip CoAP with a = standard for efficient RESTful
   streaming for Internet of Th= ings (IoT) contrary to HTTP-streaming in
   conventional Inter= net.

                 &= nbsp;                    =                     &nbs= p;                     &n= bsp;


Please note that it may take a couple of minutes from the t= ime of submission
until the htmlized version and diff are available at t= ools.ietf.org.

The IETF Secretariat

=

=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D-----=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D-----=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D
Notice: The information contained in this e-mail
message and/or attachments to it may contain
confidential or privileged information. If you are
not the intended recipient, any dissemination, use,
review, distribution, printing or copying of the
information contained in this e-mail message
and/or attachments to it are strictly prohibited. If
you have received this communication in error,
please notify us by reply e-mail or telephone and
immediately and permanently delete the message
and any attachments. Thank you

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DIR:OUT; SFP:1101; SCL:1; SRVR:HE1PR07MB3276; H:HE1PR07MB4236.eurprd07.prod.outlook.com; FPR:; SPF:None; LANG:en; PTR:InfoNoRecords; MX:1; A:1; received-spf: None (protection.outlook.com: ericsson.com does not designate permitted sender hosts) x-ms-exchange-senderadcheck: 1 x-microsoft-antispam-message-info: s//SYWcQ0YamUQn93ghJAccCS5/tskb3HKgrTVJSFgmh41AbnqMl90OBEFH8o2nltevLoNhj0fmGXmguLG6j/TgSKK4MY/58lsN0133/hudx1ZJL92csYgpU/Axr2UAd8xPW29MTuOhxhyDCCqZ3QHFFTX+83ESaXJPAi8Gqqop0KTbSHaGx1emh4d/TbaHe+UbUUDSTI+1SokaB/82qxSaYKSWc6yWF3UqdqQuFf4MDxzS7JAAPFL63xhN6Lx2LYlUHfxCAgAJy4RvOaxDQ/GZOM/Dq84Wb+GaBzr89ET3XQLGX/g6PMNOHacuCCKHbtg5Ab3hxDY4d4pdIUFZxISFCtYV1TF4HxxdCS31uXcOm0e1Z38Nji6UeupeZ6HB5RaSw741OPDaD6nqt7PxDhfK+bjcHr2xdkG6dV/Bp3Co= Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-ID: <35BDE2B3B180F64FAF89C6FC74DDFD66@eurprd07.prod.outlook.com> Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable MIME-Version: 1.0 X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-Network-Message-Id: d9a1e623-1b96-4960-30a6-08d68c35eb11 X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-originalarrivaltime: 06 Feb 2019 13:20:52.2650 (UTC) X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-fromentityheader: Hosted X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-id: 92e84ceb-fbfd-47ab-be52-080c6b87953f X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-mailboxtype: HOSTED X-MS-Exchange-Transport-CrossTenantHeadersStamped: HE1PR07MB3276 X-OriginatorOrg: ericsson.com X-Brightmail-Tracker: H4sIAAAAAAAAA+NgFupkleLIzCtJLcpLzFFi42KZGbG9WNf0flSMwf9XNhb73q5ndmD0WLLk J1MAYxSXTUpqTmZZapG+XQJXxrQnB5gK3rNWzJx6gbGB8TpLFyMnh4SAicTNvmfsXYxcHEIC RxglZkz6wwzhfGWU2NzyHsF5PusmK4SzmEni2qGPYP0sAhOYJRaekIdITGaSWHenF2rYfUaJ yV27mECq2ATsJSav+cgIYosISEh0ft3PDmILC9hJfHjzhx0i7ixxb+kCVghbT2LtpdtMEBtU JI5dmwG2jRdozr8vR8DqGQXEJL6fWgNWwywgLnHryXwmiI8EJJbsOc8MYYtKvHz8jxWiPlri 1amT7BBxRYmz7x5C1ctKXJrfzQhytIRAE7vE/OcTgYo4gBxfiR2fSiHiNxkluv9+gWrWktjW uIoRws6WODJjD9QyGYnLGyazQTRsYpV4Mvkz2AYhgVSJ5WtboRrkJFb1PoSG/Xlmic37JSYw 6sxC8gSErSdxY+oUNgjbQ2Ly0+msELa2xLKFr5lngQNDUOLkzCcsCxhZVzGKFqcWJ+WmGxnr pRZlJhcX5+fp5aWWbGIEJpCDW36r7mC8/MbxEKMAB6MSDy/7kagYIdbEsuLK3EOMEhzMSiK8 5jOAQrwpiZVVqUX58UWlOanFhxilOViUxHn/CAnGCAmkJ5akZqemFqQWwWSZODilGhgzdORv 8Tw5L7RqS8ID9WkbX+bwGXjwC7L6Xr6f8N9bMWLp1Fwtu4+bRb7srpLYyzX7mO78q8t6Zkow vcgULV1tGv9JgMly6+wVKYpu8r1Cj7i4zS9ZPGhNPvnnt4Ld89+XJ+9v797Nsm/z7lc7/fiz f+xTKDTxqTOuUFx2gyspnXl+W1mCtI0SS3FGoqEWc1FxIgB588XOHAMAAA== Archived-At: Subject: [core] SenML FETCH/PATCH (draft-ietf-core-senml-etch) update X-BeenThere: core@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: "Constrained RESTful Environments \(CoRE\) Working Group list" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 06 Feb 2019 13:20:58 -0000 Hi all, I'm planning to update the SenML FETCH/PATCH draft to address the IETF 103 = conclusion of using separate media types. Here's the PR: https://github.com/core-wg/senml-etch/pull/1/files This version also keeps the "delete with PATCH null value" method as discus= sed in the meeting. We had another look at this and didn't see any reason w= hy this would not work well enough. Comments welcome! Based on the discussions at the IETF 103 there did not seem to be any other= major issues so this could move forward towards publication. One minor issues for media type registration: Do we need fragment IDs? I do= n't see strong need, but we could simply re-use the SenML fragment ID handl= ing also here. Cheers, Ari= From nobody Wed Feb 6 05:55:59 2019 Return-Path: X-Original-To: core@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: core@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 05A78124BAA for ; Wed, 6 Feb 2019 05:55:58 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -4.199 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-4.199 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-2.3] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id xiH02FUdwn5y for ; Wed, 6 Feb 2019 05:55:55 -0800 (PST) Received: from mailhost.informatik.uni-bremen.de (mailhost.informatik.uni-bremen.de [IPv6:2001:638:708:30c9::12]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 2B3B012008F for ; Wed, 6 Feb 2019 05:55:55 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at informatik.uni-bremen.de Received: from submithost.informatik.uni-bremen.de (submithost2.informatik.uni-bremen.de [134.102.200.7]) by mailhost.informatik.uni-bremen.de (8.14.5/8.14.5) with ESMTP id x16DtjUG003555 for ; Wed, 6 Feb 2019 14:55:50 +0100 (CET) Received: from [192.168.217.106] (p54A6CC50.dip0.t-ipconnect.de [84.166.204.80]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by submithost.informatik.uni-bremen.de (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 43vjdX6RbRz1Br7 for ; Wed, 6 Feb 2019 14:55:44 +0100 (CET) Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="Apple-Mail=_80BDD524-3679-4262-BA6D-1B406FE9A28C" Mime-Version: 1.0 (Mac OS X Mail 11.5 \(3445.9.1\)) From: Carsten Bormann X-Priority: 3 X-Mail-Calendar-Part: Yes Date: Wed, 6 Feb 2019 14:55:44 +0100 X-Mao-Original-Outgoing-Id: 571154141.9939899-97df12f9b2ee29df18a165873b768d33 Message-Id: <83E7C5E4-CA4B-477E-96ED-0EB840F589AE@tzi.org> References: <27EDA5EF-9D50-4A10-9F0E-9F8C6B4CDA76@tzi.org> To: "core@ietf.org WG" X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.3445.9.1) Archived-At: Subject: [core] Webex meeting details: CoRE Interim Meeting today 2019-02-06 X-BeenThere: core@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: "Constrained RESTful Environments \(CoRE\) Working Group list" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 06 Feb 2019 13:55:58 -0000 --Apple-Mail=_80BDD524-3679-4262-BA6D-1B406FE9A28C Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 125 minutes till today=E2=80=99s meeting. Webex details for this full interim are the same as the hallway meeting = we had on the 9th (four weeks ago); copied below. My proposed agenda: =E2=80=93 CoRAL: https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-hartke-t2trg-ciri-01 = https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-hartke-t2trg-coral-07 = https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-hartke-t2trg-coral-reef-00 = (These versions are quite recent, so it may be worth to have another = look before the meeting.) Admin: =E2=80=93 corr-clar WG adoption call Bash this proposed agenda here on the list or at the start of the = meeting. Gr=C3=BC=C3=9Fe, Carsten > Begin forwarded message: >=20 > From: Carsten Bormann > > Subject: [core] Webex meeting details: CoRE Hallway and Interim = Meetings before IETF104 > Date: January 9, 2019 at 16:01:15 GMT+1 > To: "core@ietf.org WG" > > Archived-At: = > >=20 >> CORE Working Group invites you to join this Webex meeting. >> =20 >> CoRE Hallway and Interim Meetings >> Every 2 weeks on Wednesday, from Wednesday, January 9, 2019, to = Wednesday, March 20, 2019 >> 4:00 pm | Greenwich Time (Reykjavik, GMT) | 1 hr >> Meeting number (access code): 649 598 697 >> Meeting password: constrained >>=20 >>=20 >> =20 >> Add to Calendar = =09 >> When it's time, join the meeting = . >> =20 >> Join by phone >> 1-650-479-3208 = Call-in toll number (US/Canada) >> =20 >> Can't join the meeting? = >> =20 >> IMPORTANT NOTICE: Please note that this Webex service allows audio = and other information sent during the session to be recorded, which may = be discoverable in a legal matter. By joining this session, you = automatically consent to such recordings. If you do not consent to being = recorded, discuss your concerns with the host or do not join the = session. _______________________________________________ core mailing list core@ietf.org https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/core --Apple-Mail=_80BDD524-3679-4262-BA6D-1B406FE9A28C Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="Apple-Mail=_FB53EC85-4531-41B5-B9A6-1768A480E42C" --Apple-Mail=_FB53EC85-4531-41B5-B9A6-1768A480E42C Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Type: text/html; charset=utf-8
125 = minutes till today=E2=80=99s meeting.
Webex details for = this full interim are the same as the hallway meeting we had on the 9th = (four weeks ago); copied below.

My proposed agenda:
=E2=80=93 CoRAL:
  https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-hartke-t2trg-ciri-01
  https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-hartke-t2trg-coral-07
  https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-hartke-t2trg-coral-reef-00
  (These versions are quite recent, so it may be worth = to have another look before the meeting.)
Admin:
=E2=80=93 corr-clar WG adoption = call

Bash this = proposed agenda here on the list or at the start of the = meeting.

Gr=C3=BC=C3=9Fe, Carsten


Begin forwarded message:

From: = Carsten Bormann <cabo@tzi.org>
Subject: = [core] Webex = meeting details: CoRE Hallway and Interim Meetings before IETF104
Date: = January 9, 2019 at 16:01:15 = GMT+1
To: = "core@ietf.org WG" <core@ietf.org>
Archived-At: = <https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/core/rjM1BQj5T-LWzH-y5Y2V= oW-7obE>

CORE Working Group invites you to join this = Webex meeting.
 
CoRE Hallway and = Interim Meetings
Every 2 weeks on Wednesday, from Wednesday, January 9, = 2019, to Wednesday, March 20, 2019
4:00 = pm  |  Greenwich Time (Reykjavik, = GMT)  |  1 hr
Meeting number (access code): 649 598 = 697
Meeting = password: constrained


 
Add to = Calendar
When it's time, join the = meeting.
 
Join by phone
1-650-479-3208 Call-in toll number = (US/Canada)
 
Can't join the = meeting?
 
IMPORTANT NOTICE: Please note that this Webex service = allows audio and other information sent during the session to be = recorded, which may be discoverable in a legal matter. By joining this = session, you automatically consent to such recordings. If you do not = consent to being recorded, discuss your concerns with the host or do not = join the = session.
=
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=09=09Join=20= Webex=20meeting=09=09=09=09=09=09=09=09=09=09=09=09= =09=09=09=09=09=09=09
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=09=09=09= =09=09=09
Meeting=20password:constrained
=09= =09

 
 
Join=20by=20phone =20
1-650-479-3208 Call-in=20toll=20= number=20(US/Canada) =20


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= --Apple-Mail=_FB53EC85-4531-41B5-B9A6-1768A480E42C-- --Apple-Mail=_80BDD524-3679-4262-BA6D-1B406FE9A28C-- From nobody Wed Feb 6 06:58:19 2019 Return-Path: X-Original-To: core@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: core@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 54C85124BF6; Wed, 6 Feb 2019 06:58:17 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -4.2 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-4.2 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-2.3] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id ns6nLQMXJ6Yu; Wed, 6 Feb 2019 06:58:15 -0800 (PST) Received: from mailhost.informatik.uni-bremen.de (mailhost.informatik.uni-bremen.de [IPv6:2001:638:708:30c9::12]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 19564126BED; Wed, 6 Feb 2019 06:58:11 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at informatik.uni-bremen.de Received: from submithost.informatik.uni-bremen.de (submithost2.informatik.uni-bremen.de [IPv6:2001:638:708:30c8:406a:91ff:fe74:f2b7]) by mailhost.informatik.uni-bremen.de (8.14.5/8.14.5) with ESMTP id x16Ew3Ku021273; Wed, 6 Feb 2019 15:58:08 +0100 (CET) Received: from [192.168.217.106] (p54A6CC50.dip0.t-ipconnect.de [84.166.204.80]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by submithost.informatik.uni-bremen.de (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 43vl1R1RVNz1Br6; Wed, 6 Feb 2019 15:58:03 +0100 (CET) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Mime-Version: 1.0 (Mac OS X Mail 11.5 \(3445.9.1\)) From: Carsten Bormann Date: Wed, 6 Feb 2019 15:58:02 +0100 Cc: draft-ietf-core-echo-request-tag@ietf.org X-Mao-Original-Outgoing-Id: 571157880.431689-ba9f5cfd41283b7f4d7f7f7e72d2ab7f Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Message-Id: <963CE8EA-ABAC-488A-8FA6-81431A2E5B06@tzi.org> To: "core@ietf.org WG" X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.3445.9.1) Archived-At: Subject: [core] Chair's review of draft-ietf-core-echo-request-tag-03.txt X-BeenThere: core@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: "Constrained RESTful Environments \(CoRE\) Working Group list" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 06 Feb 2019 14:58:17 -0000 In preparation for the impending working-group last call, I have reviewed draft-ietf-core-echo-request-tag-03.txt. Substantive comments are below; a set of small editorial comments is going to the authors in parallel. Gr=C3=BC=C3=9Fe, Carsten # Major Completely outlawing token reuse is throwing out the baby with the bathwater -- requiring stable storage for token numbers even in situations where that is not needed. (Of course, if you have that, keeping a token counter e.g. per DTLS connection is a great implementation strategy.) Instead, the recommendations about Token reuse should be specific to the cases covered. This does require some additional work. (The actual wording in Section 5 is closer to reason, but the introductory material gives a different impression.) The wording in Section 5 needs to be clarified that this is a requirement on clients, not a license to servers to base their operations on the assumption that this requirement is always fulfilled by a client -- the token processing rules of RFC 7252 still apply. # Minor * The document fails to mention that the "echo" function can also be provided at the application layer, e.g., with freshness tokens in "forms", as they are widely used with HTTP. It should make clearer that "Echo" is just a convention to provide these freshness tokens, in particular when there is no natural way to keep the freshness tokens in the application data. * Is "operation" the term we want to use henceforth? * The "MUST NOT process" in 2.2 is weird, as it is qualified by the undetermined "has freshness requirements". Maybe the text should focus on the concept of "fresh enough", which would also explain the license for the client to re-use Echo values in further requests. The time-based processing model ("RTT < T") is one way to handle "fresh enough", but certainly not a MUST -- there are event-based freshness models. * 2.2: Clarify "The CoAP client side of HTTP-to-CoAP proxies SHOULD respond to Echo challenges themselves" * 2.3 item 2 (time and state sync) is very opaque; its statements have not been analyzed in this review. * Section 3 is confused about Request-Tag Options and lists of those. Why was the option marked repeatable? Or, what is wrong with a non-repeatable Request-Tag Option that defaults to the empty string (as opposed to a repeatable one that by definition defaults to the empty array/"list")? * Section 6 (Security Considerations) MUST NOT use BCP14 language. Move the mandates up to where they belong. "Is not allowed" about implementation strategies also is weird requirements language (in particular when the prohibition is just a result on some other implementation choices that aren't really required). * Requiring a monotonic clock is a consequence of the implementation model proposed (time-based freshness) and is not needed with other forms of freshness. In any case, if the non-monotonisms are limited to below the freshness requirements (as they would be for most usages of civil time), the are inconsequential, so these security considerations require some qualification even when phrased as such. Monotonic vs. wall-clock is somewhat orthogonal to non-hackable vs. hackable, anyway. * Appendix A could contain some help with the selection of n. # Editorial * Title and Abstract. The title probably should mention CoAP. The abstract might want to say what the introduction already says: This is for supporting specific use cases (i.e., not all use cases will need these additions). * Introduction. The introduction could say earlier that Request-Tag is intended exclusively for combination with Block1 options. * Section 2 would benefit from discussing freshness as a concept first, and then introducing the Echo Option as one convention to achieve the objectives. In particular it should be clear that the rendition of Echo with a 4.01 may be an unusual case in many applications. * Section 3 would benefit from explaining that Request-Tag is only meant to be used with Block1 Options in requests. From nobody Wed Feb 6 07:39:43 2019 Return-Path: X-Original-To: core@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: core@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 719C8128CF3 for ; Wed, 6 Feb 2019 07:39:41 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -4.2 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-4.2 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-2.3] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id zwjCsiSGcRHS for ; Wed, 6 Feb 2019 07:39:39 -0800 (PST) Received: from mailhost.informatik.uni-bremen.de (mailhost.informatik.uni-bremen.de [IPv6:2001:638:708:30c9::12]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id CB39F12426E for ; Wed, 6 Feb 2019 07:39:38 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at informatik.uni-bremen.de Received: from submithost.informatik.uni-bremen.de (submithost2.informatik.uni-bremen.de [IPv6:2001:638:708:30c8:406a:91ff:fe74:f2b7]) by mailhost.informatik.uni-bremen.de (8.14.5/8.14.5) with ESMTP id x16FdT5G023809; Wed, 6 Feb 2019 16:39:35 +0100 (CET) Received: from [192.168.217.106] (p54A6CC50.dip0.t-ipconnect.de [84.166.204.80]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by submithost.informatik.uni-bremen.de (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 43vlxF5GXTz1Br6; Wed, 6 Feb 2019 16:39:29 +0100 (CET) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Mime-Version: 1.0 (Mac OS X Mail 11.5 \(3445.9.1\)) From: Carsten Bormann In-Reply-To: <67263A7E-E122-4B84-A0A8-577D5A37FF3B@ericsson.com> Date: Wed, 6 Feb 2019 16:39:28 +0100 Cc: core X-Mao-Original-Outgoing-Id: 571160366.997692-356085862f16d9a1977b7f10000961bd Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Message-Id: <8C82F5DA-2BAD-47C5-B9F2-D2D14AB917AA@tzi.org> References: <67263A7E-E122-4B84-A0A8-577D5A37FF3B@ericsson.com> To: =?utf-8?Q?Ari_Ker=C3=A4nen?= X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.3445.9.1) Archived-At: Subject: Re: [core] SenML FETCH/PATCH (draft-ietf-core-senml-etch) update X-BeenThere: core@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: "Constrained RESTful Environments \(CoRE\) Working Group list" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 06 Feb 2019 15:39:41 -0000 On Feb 6, 2019, at 14:20, Ari Ker=C3=A4nen = wrote: >=20 > One minor issues for media type registration: Do we need fragment IDs? = I don't see strong need, but we could simply re-use the SenML fragment = ID handling also here. Fragment IDs for patches boggles my mind. Any use for fragment IDs I can imagine would be about addressing results = of the patch process, not about addressing parts of the patch. But = maybe this is proof by lack of imagination. Gr=C3=BC=C3=9Fe, Carsten From nobody Wed Feb 6 08:15:13 2019 Return-Path: X-Original-To: core@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: core@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5721712D4EB for ; Wed, 6 Feb 2019 08:15:08 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -7.875 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-7.875 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIMWL_WL_HIGH=-4.553, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, FROM_EXCESS_BASE64=0.979, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-2.3, SPF_PASS=-0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (1024-bit key) header.d=ericsson.com header.b=D+JzrEHQ; dkim=pass (1024-bit key) header.d=ericsson.com header.b=D79EDaCs Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id rR3BL0YJSoT0 for ; Wed, 6 Feb 2019 08:15:05 -0800 (PST) Received: from sessmg23.ericsson.net (sessmg23.ericsson.net [193.180.251.45]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 0C67112D84D for ; 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Thu, 7 Feb 2019 03:18:48 -0800 (PST) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: IETF Meeting Session Request Tool To: Cc: cabo@tzi.org, core-chairs@ietf.org, core@ietf.org, aamelnikov@fastmail.fm X-Test-IDTracker: no X-IETF-IDTracker: 6.91.0 Auto-Submitted: auto-generated Precedence: bulk Message-ID: <154953832828.23547.5305132145875621353.idtracker@ietfa.amsl.com> Date: Thu, 07 Feb 2019 03:18:48 -0800 Archived-At: Subject: [core] core - New Meeting Session Request for IETF 104 X-BeenThere: core@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 List-Id: "Constrained RESTful Environments \(CoRE\) Working Group list" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 07 Feb 2019 11:18:48 -0000 A new meeting session request has just been submitted by Carsten Bormann, a Chair of the core working group. --------------------------------------------------------- Working Group Name: Constrained RESTful Environments Area Name: Applications and Real-Time Area Session Requester: Carsten Bormann Number of Sessions: 2 Length of Session(s): 1.5 Hours, 1.5 Hours Number of Attendees: 60 Conflicts to Avoid: First Priority: cbor cose ace suit httpbis artarea t2trg lpwan rats Second Priority: saag secdispatch sacm teep irtfopen 6tisch 6lo roll Third Priority: lwig detnet quic v6ops opsarea cfrg icnrg dnssd netconf netmod emu People who must be present: Carsten Bormann Alexey Melnikov Jaime Jimenez Resources Requested: Special Requests: Plse lso avd any potntlly IoT reltd BOFs&PRGs (e.g., coin) tht mght cme up. Prefer some time between the two meetings (48 h or more). Responsible AD *might* change to Barry Leiba before the meeting. --------------------------------------------------------- From nobody Thu Feb 7 03:33:18 2019 Return-Path: X-Original-To: core@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: core@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id C8A0213110B; Thu, 7 Feb 2019 03:33:16 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -4.199 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-4.199 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-2.3, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id beSiPpAo3xvA; Thu, 7 Feb 2019 03:33:15 -0800 (PST) Received: from mailhost.informatik.uni-bremen.de (mailhost.informatik.uni-bremen.de [IPv6:2001:638:708:30c9::12]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 9BEF9131110; Thu, 7 Feb 2019 03:33:14 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at informatik.uni-bremen.de Received: from submithost.informatik.uni-bremen.de (submithost2.informatik.uni-bremen.de [IPv6:2001:638:708:30c8:406a:91ff:fe74:f2b7]) by mailhost.informatik.uni-bremen.de (8.14.5/8.14.5) with ESMTP id x17BX28Y024473; Thu, 7 Feb 2019 12:33:07 +0100 (CET) Received: from [192.168.217.106] (p54A6CC50.dip0.t-ipconnect.de [84.166.204.80]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by submithost.informatik.uni-bremen.de (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 43wGQQ2pSbz1Br6; Thu, 7 Feb 2019 12:33:02 +0100 (CET) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Mime-Version: 1.0 (Mac OS X Mail 11.5 \(3445.9.1\)) From: Carsten Bormann In-Reply-To: <154953832828.23547.5305132145875621353.idtracker@ietfa.amsl.com> Date: Thu, 7 Feb 2019 12:33:01 +0100 Cc: core-chairs@ietf.org, core@ietf.org, aamelnikov@fastmail.fm X-Mao-Original-Outgoing-Id: 571231979.835163-9a2e816fa39a45806942675a14c131f1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Message-Id: References: <154953832828.23547.5305132145875621353.idtracker@ietfa.amsl.com> To: IETF Meeting Session Request Tool X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.3445.9.1) Archived-At: Subject: Re: [core] core - New Meeting Session Request for IETF 104 X-BeenThere: core@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: "Constrained RESTful Environments \(CoRE\) Working Group list" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 07 Feb 2019 11:33:17 -0000 On Feb 7, 2019, at 12:18, IETF Meeting Session Request Tool = wrote: >=20 > Plse lso avd any potntlly IoT reltd BOFs&PRGs (e.g., coin) tht = mght cme up. And maybe allow for more than 200 characters in that field :-) Gr=C3=BC=C3=9Fe, Carsten From nobody Fri Feb 8 07:37:18 2019 Return-Path: X-Original-To: core@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: core@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1598E1200D7; Fri, 8 Feb 2019 07:37:17 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.633 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.633 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_ADSP_CUSTOM_MED=0.001, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, NML_ADSP_CUSTOM_MED=0.9, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-2.3, SPF_SOFTFAIL=0.665] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id R8iguCnhfhnJ; Fri, 8 Feb 2019 07:37:14 -0800 (PST) Received: from oxalide-smtp-out.extra.cea.fr (oxalide-smtp-out.extra.cea.fr [132.168.224.13]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 9DB811228B7; Fri, 8 Feb 2019 07:37:13 -0800 (PST) Received: from pisaure.intra.cea.fr (pisaure.intra.cea.fr [132.166.88.21]) by oxalide-sys.extra.cea.fr (8.14.7/8.14.7/CEAnet-Internet-out-4.0) with ESMTP id x18FbAI9118983; Fri, 8 Feb 2019 16:37:10 +0100 Received: from pisaure.intra.cea.fr (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by localhost (Postfix) with SMTP id A8963204E2C; Fri, 8 Feb 2019 16:37:10 +0100 (CET) Received: from muguet1-smtp-out.intra.cea.fr (muguet1-smtp-out.intra.cea.fr [132.166.192.12]) by pisaure.intra.cea.fr (Postfix) with ESMTP id 950DD204E19; Fri, 8 Feb 2019 16:37:10 +0100 (CET) Received: from [10.8.35.150] (is154594.intra.cea.fr [10.8.35.150]) by muguet1-sys.intra.cea.fr (8.14.7/8.14.7/CEAnet-Internet-out-4.0) with ESMTP id x18FbAfk006181; Fri, 8 Feb 2019 16:37:10 +0100 To: Abhijan Bhattacharyya , Carsten Bormann Cc: its@ietf.org, "core@ietf.org" References: <08d7924f-55c5-f89a-c2f6-cccb3fa4d071@gmail.com> <3c66d20e-2db2-7e15-6080-ce3646f848f6@gmail.com> From: Alexandre Petrescu Message-ID: <603fbed4-0a32-456e-7883-28dbbc9f8ca4@gmail.com> Date: Fri, 8 Feb 2019 16:37:10 +0100 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows NT 10.0; WOW64; rv:60.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/60.5.0 MIME-Version: 1.0 In-Reply-To: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=windows-1252; format=flowed Content-Language: fr Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Archived-At: Subject: Re: [core] [ipwave] Adaptive RESTful Real-time Live Streaming for Things (A-REaLiST)' X-BeenThere: core@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: "Constrained RESTful Environments \(CoRE\) Working Group list" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 08 Feb 2019 15:37:17 -0000 Le 04/02/2019 à 20:00, Abhijan Bhattacharyya a écrit : > Thank you Carsten for your comments. No one can speak about CoAP better > than you! > > Alex, > I have uploaded a new version of the draft. The links are given at the > end of this mail. I have indeed tried to address your concern in respect > to making the draft more "IPv6-relevant". > > As Carsten rightly pointed out that the proposal works at the > application layer and is built on the foundation of CoAP, so it is > Layer-3 agnostic. Also, as we all know, CoAP is designed for IPv6. > However, implementation on IPv6 may influence the process of determining > the maximum size of information segments. So, a new subsection has been > added as part of the design guidelines. The small addition reads as below: > > > > 6.3. Determining the segment size > > Size of the information segment in a CoAP message should be limited by the least > possible MTU for the end-to-end channel. This is to ensure that there is no > undesired conversation state at the lower layers of the protocol stack due to > uncontrolled fragmentation leading to undesired explosion of traffic in the > network. For IPV6 network, the MTU can be determined using Path MTU Discovery > (PMTUD) [RFC8201] which bestows the responsibility of determining the path MTU on > the end-points itself. > > The size of the segment should be guided by the recommendations as specified in > Section 4.6 of [RFC7252]. > > > > I hope this will now satisfy the criterion of finding IPv6 in the draft. Thank you very much for this valuable action. It is very worth taking into consideration. From an implementation standpoint, I would like to learn whether some prototype features RESTful Real-time Live Streaming on IPv6, or not on IPv6. Alex > > Looping in CoRE list as well to announce the new version to the WG where > this draft originates. > > Thank you. > > URL: > https://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-bhattacharyya-core-a-realist-01.txt > Status: https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-bhattacharyya-core-a-realist/ > Htmlized: https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-bhattacharyya-core-a-realist-01 > Htmlized: > https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/html/draft-bhattacharyya-core-a-realist > Diff: > https://www.ietf.org/rfcdiff?url2=draft-bhattacharyya-core-a-realist-01 > > > With Best Regards > Abhijan Bhattacharyya > Consultant / Scientist, > {Internet Protocols | 5G | Standardization}, > TCS Research, > Tata Consultancy Services > Building 1B,Ecospace > Plot -  IIF/12 ,New Town, Rajarhat, > Kolkata - 700160,West Bengal > India > Ph:- +91 33 66884691 > Cell:- +919830468972 | +918583875003 > Mailto: abhijan.bhattacharyya@tcs.com > Website: http://www.tcs.com > ____________________________________________ > Experience certainty. IT Services > Business Solutions > Consulting > ____________________________________________ > > > -----"its" > wrote: ----- > To: "Alexandre Petrescu" > > From: "Carsten Bormann" > Sent by: "its" > Date: 01/31/2019 06:12PM > Cc: "Abhijan Bhattacharyya" >, "Michael Richardson" > >, its@ietf.org > > Subject: Re: [ipwave] Adaptive RESTful Real-time Live Streaming for > Things (A-REaLiST)' > > "External email. Open with Caution" > > > If TCP's state machine was a bottleneck, has one tried to use UDP > > instead? > > I think that is indeed one of the advantages CoAP brings go the table here. > > > Does CoAP work on Ethernet? > > CoAP was designed to be able to run on UDP, which is on IP which in turn > works very well on Ethernet. > > > Does CoAP work in an end-to-end manner or does it need protocol > > conversion gateways? > > I works end-to-end (as long as your network doesn’t break UDP). > > > I want to ask you: please use IPv6 for CoAP and RESTful. > > CoAP was designed to work well over IPv6 (but works as well over IPv4). > > > Then I searched for the keyword ‘IPv6' in the draft. > > […] > > If you add ‘IPv6' considerations to it, then I will comment on it. > > For a CoAP application such as A-REaLiST, IPv6 makes little difference > (beyond being able to assign addresses to both ends in the first place), > so I don’t know there is a lot to say. > > Grüße, Carsten > > _______________________________________________ > its mailing list > its@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/its > > =====-----=====-----===== > Notice: The information contained in this e-mail > message and/or attachments to it may contain > confidential or privileged information. If you are > not the intended recipient, any dissemination, use, > review, distribution, printing or copying of the > information contained in this e-mail message > and/or attachments to it are strictly prohibited. If > you have received this communication in error, > please notify us by reply e-mail or telephone and > immediately and permanently delete the message > and any attachments. 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This enables, for example, entities that may no= t have full context information about the endpoints/application to understa= nd what is exchanged in the data value records. Comments and questions welcome! Cheers, Ari Begin forwarded message: > From: > Date: 11 February 2019 at 23.53.52 EET > To: Carsten Bormann , Ari Keranen > Subject: New Version Notification for draft-keranen-core-senml-data-ct-00= .txt >=20 >=20 > A new version of I-D, draft-keranen-core-senml-data-ct-00.txt > has been successfully submitted by Ari Keranen and posted to the > IETF repository. >=20 > Name: draft-keranen-core-senml-data-ct > Revision: 00 > Title: SenML Data Value Content-Format Indication > Document date: 2019-02-11 > Group: Individual Submission > Pages: 5 > URL: https://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-keranen-core-s= enml-data-ct-00.txt > Status: https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-keranen-core-senml= -data-ct/ > Htmlized: https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-keranen-core-senml-data= -ct-00 > Htmlized: https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/html/draft-keranen-core-= senml-data-ct >=20 >=20 > Abstract: > The Sensor Measurement Lists (SenML) media type supports multiple > types of values, from numbers to text strings and arbitrary binary > data values. In order to simplify processing of the data values this > document proposes to specify a new SenML field for indicating the > Content-Format of the data. >=20 >=20 >=20 >=20 > Please note that it may take a couple of minutes from the time of submiss= ion > until the htmlized version and diff are available at tools.ietf.org. >=20 > The IETF Secretariat >=20 From nobody Tue Feb 12 09:28:29 2019 Return-Path: X-Original-To: core@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: core@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id DDC22127287; Tue, 12 Feb 2019 09:28:27 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -0.794 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-0.794 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, LOCALPART_IN_SUBJECT=1.107, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE=-0.0001, SPF_PASS=-0.001] autolearn=no autolearn_force=no Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id VAzLQazG9-ad; Tue, 12 Feb 2019 09:28:27 -0800 (PST) Received: from mail2.augustcellars.com (augustcellars.com [50.45.239.150]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id EE0E3128B33; Tue, 12 Feb 2019 09:28:23 -0800 (PST) Received: from Jude (67.23.203.6) by mail2.augustcellars.com (192.168.0.56) with Microsoft SMTP Server (TLS) id 15.0.1395.4; Tue, 12 Feb 2019 09:27:59 -0800 From: Jim Schaad To: CC: Date: Tue, 12 Feb 2019 09:27:54 -0800 Message-ID: <000901d4c2f8$4b69a640$e23cf2c0$@augustcellars.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook 16.0 Thread-Index: AdTC96VDrOIHYM79QVa0aA7suYbQ+w== Content-Language: en-us X-Originating-IP: [67.23.203.6] Archived-At: Subject: [core] draft-ietf-core-multipart-ct X-BeenThere: core@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: "Constrained RESTful Environments \(CoRE\) Working Group list" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 12 Feb 2019 17:28:28 -0000 An interesting question has come up with respect to this content type in the ACE Working group. Is there a way to indicate the different content types that one can deal with inside of this content type. One can have an ACCEPT option of types A, B, C and multipart. However, there is no way to say which types one is going to accept in the multipart. The multipart could return content types of D, E, F, and G. However the combination of all 4 may not be what is returned but instead a combination of two of them. Thus the client could understand D and E or D and F but not F and G. If you say ACCEPT 62, do you accept any combination of nested content types? Should something about this be placed into the draft? Also I note that this draft is currently expired and needs to be reposted. Jim From nobody Tue Feb 12 09:50:55 2019 Return-Path: X-Original-To: core@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: core@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5B4E612E7C1; Tue, 12 Feb 2019 09:50:53 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.901 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.901 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE=-0.0001, SPF_PASS=-0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 5DaTLfuxlYVr; Tue, 12 Feb 2019 09:50:51 -0800 (PST) Received: from wp382.webpack.hosteurope.de (wp382.webpack.hosteurope.de [IPv6:2a01:488:42:1000:50ed:8597::]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id C6E75127287; Tue, 12 Feb 2019 09:50:50 -0800 (PST) Received: from mail-qt1-f177.google.com ([209.85.160.177]); authenticated by wp382.webpack.hosteurope.de running ExIM with esmtpsa (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_128_GCM_SHA256:128) id 1gtcCl-0006p9-5c; Tue, 12 Feb 2019 18:50:47 +0100 Received: by mail-qt1-f177.google.com with SMTP id r9so3986038qtt.3; Tue, 12 Feb 2019 09:50:47 -0800 (PST) X-Gm-Message-State: AHQUAubQ0l0p7lYHZ2bL7AFxrReKIF2Tq+HabsPr+z7a3F7mCV4unLjR PgzDFzDdcGKB517kcBgKTvmXmdTWU0YugaYrAsE= X-Google-Smtp-Source: AHgI3Ib93JUriCCkO/rFfaXFML9Ub+3TSX44RRpN5txoqNDYKMPG0bxHo/VBghDTOAKpMOaUmnGMuA8oGBLSYs3Q1aQ= X-Received: by 2002:ac8:37f6:: with SMTP id e51mr3766552qtc.1.1549993846134; Tue, 12 Feb 2019 09:50:46 -0800 (PST) MIME-Version: 1.0 References: <000901d4c2f8$4b69a640$e23cf2c0$@augustcellars.com> In-Reply-To: <000901d4c2f8$4b69a640$e23cf2c0$@augustcellars.com> From: Klaus Hartke Date: Tue, 12 Feb 2019 18:50:10 +0100 X-Gmail-Original-Message-ID: Message-ID: To: Jim Schaad Cc: draft-ietf-core-multipart-ct@ietf.org, "core@ietf.org WG" Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-bounce-key: webpack.hosteurope.de; hartke@projectcool.de; 1549993850; 9c04c79f; X-HE-SMSGID: 1gtcCl-0006p9-5c Archived-At: Subject: Re: [core] draft-ietf-core-multipart-ct X-BeenThere: core@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: "Constrained RESTful Environments \(CoRE\) Working Group list" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 12 Feb 2019 17:50:54 -0000 For context: [1] [2] Jim Schaad wrote: > If you say ACCEPT 62, do you accept any combination of nested content typ= es? Yes. A CoAP request can include at most one Accept option and any response must exactly that value as Content-Format or be an error response. CoAP doesn't have a mechanism for negotiating the content formats of representations embedded in other representations. I stumbled upon the same problem with CoRAL. > Should something about this be placed into the draft? Yes. Proposed text: "CoAP doesn't have a mechanism for negotiating the content formats of representations embedded in application/multipart-core representations." > Also I note that this draft is currently expired and needs to be reposted= . Yes. Soon=E2=84=A2. Klaus [1] https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/ace/L1QPw1zHAj15nsKMe8AFDu6dcmI [2] https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/ace/vj5CYF8eRrra5yph2Z9ui3Gkllk From nobody Tue Feb 12 13:22:56 2019 Return-Path: X-Original-To: core@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: core@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4FBF0130DC2 for ; Tue, 12 Feb 2019 13:22:54 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -3.323 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-3.323 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIMWL_WL_HIGH=-0.001, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, FROM_EXCESS_BASE64=0.979, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-2.3, SPF_PASS=-0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (1024-bit key) header.d=ericsson.com header.b=CyEAL94o; dkim=pass (1024-bit key) header.d=ericsson.com header.b=PS4H9sAY Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 0CP-bu-W_h3e for ; 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Tue, 12 Feb 2019 13:25:16 -0800 (PST) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: internet-drafts@ietf.org To: Cc: core@ietf.org X-Test-IDTracker: no X-IETF-IDTracker: 6.91.0 Auto-Submitted: auto-generated Precedence: bulk Reply-To: core@ietf.org Message-ID: <155000671615.8595.8658896358631802998@ietfa.amsl.com> Date: Tue, 12 Feb 2019 13:25:16 -0800 Archived-At: Subject: [core] I-D Action: draft-ietf-core-senml-etch-01.txt X-BeenThere: core@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 List-Id: "Constrained RESTful Environments \(CoRE\) Working Group list" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 12 Feb 2019 21:25:16 -0000 A New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line Internet-Drafts directories. This draft is a work item of the Constrained RESTful Environments WG of the IETF. Title : FETCH & PATCH with Sensor Measurement Lists (SenML) Authors : Ari Keranen Mojan Mohajer Filename : draft-ietf-core-senml-etch-01.txt Pages : 9 Date : 2019-02-12 Abstract: The Sensor Measurement Lists (SenML) media type and data model can be used to send collections of resources, such as batches of sensor data or configuration parameters. The CoAP iPATCH, PATCH, and FETCH methods enable accessing and updating parts of a resource or multiple resources with one request. This document defines new media types for the CoAP iPATCH, and FETCH methods for resources represented with the SenML data model. The IETF datatracker status page for this draft is: https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-core-senml-etch/ There are also htmlized versions available at: https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-core-senml-etch-01 https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/html/draft-ietf-core-senml-etch-01 A diff from the previous version is available at: https://www.ietf.org/rfcdiff?url2=draft-ietf-core-senml-etch-01 Please note that it may take a couple of minutes from the time of submission until the htmlized version and diff are available at tools.ietf.org. Internet-Drafts are also available by anonymous FTP at: ftp://ftp.ietf.org/internet-drafts/ From nobody Wed Feb 13 21:29:47 2019 Return-Path: X-Original-To: core@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: core@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6526B130F99; Wed, 13 Feb 2019 21:29:45 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.9 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.9 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE=-0.0001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id a9qL5Txa8f3G; Wed, 13 Feb 2019 21:29:43 -0800 (PST) Received: from mail2.augustcellars.com (augustcellars.com [50.45.239.150]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id DFEA7130FCB; Wed, 13 Feb 2019 21:29:42 -0800 (PST) Received: from Jude (73.180.8.170) by mail2.augustcellars.com (192.168.0.56) with Microsoft SMTP Server (TLS) id 15.0.1395.4; Wed, 13 Feb 2019 21:29:11 -0800 From: Jim Schaad To: 'Klaus Hartke' CC: , References: <000901d4c2f8$4b69a640$e23cf2c0$@augustcellars.com> In-Reply-To: Date: Wed, 13 Feb 2019 21:29:07 -0800 Message-ID: <000001d4c426$36acc280$a4064780$@augustcellars.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook 16.0 Thread-Index: AQHZeLzgd60hRSXGqZKN3jc6SJcBfgFxWGrPpcnPMjA= Content-Language: en-us X-Originating-IP: [73.180.8.170] Archived-At: Subject: Re: [core] draft-ietf-core-multipart-ct X-BeenThere: core@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: "Constrained RESTful Environments \(CoRE\) Working Group list" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 14 Feb 2019 05:29:45 -0000 > -----Original Message----- > From: Klaus Hartke > Sent: Tuesday, February 12, 2019 9:50 AM > To: Jim Schaad > Cc: draft-ietf-core-multipart-ct@ietf.org; core@ietf.org WG = > Subject: Re: [core] draft-ietf-core-multipart-ct >=20 > For context: [1] [2] >=20 > Jim Schaad wrote: > > If you say ACCEPT 62, do you accept any combination of nested = content > types? >=20 > Yes. A CoAP request can include at most one Accept option and any = response > must exactly that value as Content-Format or be an error response. = CoAP > doesn't have a mechanism for negotiating the content formats of > representations embedded in other representations. I stumbled upon the > same problem with CoRAL. >=20 > > Should something about this be placed into the draft? >=20 > Yes. Proposed text: "CoAP doesn't have a mechanism for negotiating the > content formats of representations embedded in = application/multipart-core > representations." Potentially add "This is generally not an issue as an application is going to return = either a fixed set of embedded content types. Applications which have a need to return different sets of content = formats embedded in an application/multipart-core content can negotiate = this as a query parameter." I am not sure that this is the correct wording, but I think providing = guidance on a way to handle this problem is reasonable. Jim =20 >=20 > > Also I note that this draft is currently expired and needs to be = reposted. >=20 > Yes. Soon=E2=84=A2. >=20 > Klaus >=20 > [1] > https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/ace/L1QPw1zHAj15nsKMe8AFDu6dcm > I > [2] = https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/ace/vj5CYF8eRrra5yph2Z9ui3Gkllk From nobody Wed Feb 13 22:29:36 2019 Return-Path: X-Original-To: core@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: core@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id C57E9130F23; Wed, 13 Feb 2019 22:29:33 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.999 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.999 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=tcs.com Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 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--=_alternative 0023A23F652583A1_=-- From nobody Thu Feb 14 07:03:39 2019 Return-Path: X-Original-To: core@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: core@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 86CC4127598; Thu, 14 Feb 2019 07:03:27 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -4.2 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-4.2 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-2.3, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 4anZ_hH_eVAj; Thu, 14 Feb 2019 07:03:25 -0800 (PST) Received: from tuna.sandelman.ca (tuna.sandelman.ca [IPv6:2607:f0b0:f:3:216:3eff:fe7c:d1f3]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher AECDH-AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 113D9128BCC; Thu, 14 Feb 2019 07:03:25 -0800 (PST) Received: from sandelman.ca (unknown [IPv6:2607:f0b0:f:2:56b2:3ff:fe0b:d84]) by tuna.sandelman.ca (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0EE923826A; Thu, 14 Feb 2019 10:00:14 -0500 (EST) Received: by sandelman.ca (Postfix, from userid 179) id A87671DBD; Thu, 14 Feb 2019 10:03:23 -0500 (EST) Received: from sandelman.ca (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by sandelman.ca (Postfix) with ESMTP id A7050D4E; Thu, 14 Feb 2019 10:03:23 -0500 (EST) From: Michael Richardson To: core@ietf.org, "ace\@ietf.org" In-Reply-To: References: <9594d00cd7bc43e496c2c5073481e637@XCH-ALN-010.cisco.com> X-Mailer: MH-E 8.6; nmh 1.7+dev; GNU Emacs 24.5.1 X-Face: $\n1pF)h^`}$H>Hk{L"x@)JS7<%Az}5RyS@k9X%29-lHB$Ti.V>2bi.~ehC0; <'$9xN5Ub# z!G,p`nR&p7Fz@^UXIn156S8.~^@MJ*mMsD7=QFeq%AL4m Archived-At: Subject: Re: [core] [Ace] ace-coap-est-08: using /skg with Accept Option set to TBD287 X-BeenThere: core@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: "Constrained RESTful Environments \(CoRE\) Working Group list" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 14 Feb 2019 15:03:28 -0000 --=-=-= Content-Type: text/plain CORE people, the thread is here: https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/ace/L1QPw1zHAj15nsKMe8AFDu6dcmI Esko Dijk wrote: > Using a query is a good solution here; I would propose a query argument > as short as possible because we deal with constrained networks and we > want to avoid needless parsing in this case - the server only needs to > select between two format choices here, returning X.509 cert or PKCS#7 > with cert. Using a query really seems broken to me... > So to request PKCS#7 format , the default: > POST /est/skg > And to request X.509 format, the alternative that the server MAY support: > POST /est/skg?x Why not just use: POST /est/skx It's even shorter, and it's much more obvious if it is not supported. -- Michael Richardson , Sandelman Software Works -= IPv6 IoT consulting =- --=-=-= Content-Type: application/pgp-signature; name="signature.asc" -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- iQEzBAEBCAAdFiEEbsyLEzg/qUTA43uogItw+93Q3WUFAlxlgzsACgkQgItw+93Q 3WVWaggAtBkdWX2r2NfnQlQxU3GUKcB2nCkrX0KebcGGFNWWpoEkKqpxO+wRL4pp 0ZNJyqBdVBzBjVi678UaUvK4ZSzDqWAwmAYQaqzu3ePOZFJyd4sUFP7yJcBByP9l QEWHacqwoMCpVjIvsIYiiV8wSK65Rb3fpLCgOy17il7iYUy0j2aZ8rreK8nMuo/k TLyDpLCo6aNR4BwWrKr91NPv+RlQfKCHWMDvQsc1OHeAE7bcDzxNsG7qm3mDVbr7 V7KsZHKMYAcN/ZVGl0xvsWFXQ3rhHbN+3Xq6WQu8br7FxWGQk5PYaBopd+eEwWWj ym/EzORNwpur3CKD69avrnMWQQ4K/g== =RnBs -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --=-=-=-- From nobody Fri Feb 15 04:53:44 2019 Return-Path: X-Original-To: core@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: core@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id E2CD6130E73; Fri, 15 Feb 2019 04:53:42 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.632 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.632 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_ADSP_CUSTOM_MED=0.001, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, NML_ADSP_CUSTOM_MED=0.9, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-2.3, SPF_SOFTFAIL=0.665, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id lKnUBr8-Cq7a; Fri, 15 Feb 2019 04:53:39 -0800 (PST) Received: from oxalide-smtp-out.extra.cea.fr (oxalide-smtp-out.extra.cea.fr [132.168.224.13]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 4128F1275F3; Fri, 15 Feb 2019 04:53:39 -0800 (PST) Received: from pisaure.intra.cea.fr (pisaure.intra.cea.fr [132.166.88.21]) by oxalide-sys.extra.cea.fr (8.14.7/8.14.7/CEAnet-Internet-out-4.0) with ESMTP id x1FCratv066722; Fri, 15 Feb 2019 13:53:36 +0100 Received: from pisaure.intra.cea.fr (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by localhost (Postfix) with SMTP id 546FD206112; Fri, 15 Feb 2019 13:53:36 +0100 (CET) Received: from muguet1-smtp-out.intra.cea.fr (muguet1-smtp-out.intra.cea.fr [132.166.192.12]) by pisaure.intra.cea.fr (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3F41C2017FE; Fri, 15 Feb 2019 13:53:36 +0100 (CET) Received: from [10.8.35.150] (is154594.intra.cea.fr [10.8.35.150]) by muguet1-sys.intra.cea.fr (8.14.7/8.14.7/CEAnet-Internet-out-4.0) with ESMTP id x1FCrae6032630; Fri, 15 Feb 2019 13:53:36 +0100 To: Abhijan Bhattacharyya Cc: Carsten Bormann , "core@ietf.org" , its@ietf.org, its References: <08d7924f-55c5-f89a-c2f6-cccb3fa4d071@gmail.com> <3c66d20e-2db2-7e15-6080-ce3646f848f6@gmail.com> <603fbed4-0a32-456e-7883-28dbbc9f8ca4@gmail.com> From: Alexandre Petrescu Message-ID: Date: Fri, 15 Feb 2019 13:53:36 +0100 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows NT 10.0; WOW64; rv:60.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/60.5.0 MIME-Version: 1.0 In-Reply-To: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8; format=flowed Content-Language: fr Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Archived-At: Subject: Re: [core] [ipwave] Adaptive RESTful Real-time Live Streaming for Things (A-REaLiST)' X-BeenThere: core@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: "Constrained RESTful Environments \(CoRE\) Working Group list" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 15 Feb 2019 12:53:43 -0000 Abhijan, Thank you for the message. Le 14/02/2019 à 07:29, Abhijan Bhattacharyya a écrit : [...] > We made a PoC of the concept and the experimentation and outcomes are > presented in Pages 78-80 of > https://datatracker.ietf.org/meeting/103/materials/slides-103-core-consolidated-slides-07.pdf Thank you for the report. It shows photo of testbed with laptops and raspberry Pis, and a theoretical sketch of drone-to-access-point topology; it illustrates that video streaming with A-REaLiST has better performance numbers (F, PSNR, latency) than HTTP Streaming. I trust it and it is good for video. > But we used IPv4 pipe. While it is worth to do an experiment on how > IPv6 improves the performance (it can only improve I believe). It is good you used IPv4 pipe initially. The IPv6 (instead of IPv4) recommendation is not for providing better performance numbers (F, PSNR, latency) by using IPv6 instead of IPv4. But it is for scaling up the laptop demonstrator to numerous drones and access points outdoors where drones can fly, all while being connected to the Internet. Using IPv4 one may never be able to connect the drone-and-AP setting in the outdoors, because there is no cellular operator that gives enough IP addresses for a scaleable setting. In certain countries it is next to impossible, whereas in others it is still possible but just for a little time. IPv4 and NAT may be a solution, but that begs the question whether the drone-and-AP setting using A-REaLiST protocol can work across NAT. I can understand that A-REaLiST needs to initiate in just one direction (so it is compatible with NAT): video initiated from drone to operator; but outdoors the operator must also initiate control to the drone, tell it where exactly to point the camera - s/he will require you the other direction to work too (send initial TCP/IP from control station to drone), and that is probably little compatible with NAT. For these reasons, that have little to do directly with video latency, one must consider seriously IPv6 for A-REaLiST. > But otherwise there should not be much of an impact higher up by a > change in the network layer because CoAP is designed with 6LowPAN > pipe in consideration as already emphasised by Carsten. I am not sure 6LowPAN pipe is relevant for IPv6-over-OCB. I would say it is not relevant at all. But it is just a 'would'. Yes, the 6LowPAN technology is some times used on 802.15.4 links. The IPv6 technology without 6lowpan is some other times used on 802.15.4 links too. > May be we can discuss at length if we get an opportunity to present > this in a physical meeting. How is CoAP specified with respect to IPv6? MUST it use IPv6? Is it silent about the 'IPv6' keyword? How is CoAP specified with respect to directionality? Is CoAP compatible or incompatible with traversing NAT? How is CoAP specified with respect to end-to-end principles? MUST CoAP use intermediary gateways? Alex > > Thank you. > > With Best Regards Abhijan Bhattacharyya Consultant / Scientist, > {Internet Protocols | 5G | Standardization}, TCS Research, Tata > Consultancy Services Building 1B,Ecospace Plot - IIF/12 ,New Town, > Rajarhat, Kolkata - 700160,West Bengal India Ph:- +91 33 66884691 > Cell:- +919830468972 | +918583875003 Mailto: > abhijan.bhattacharyya@tcs.com Website: http://www.tcs.com > ____________________________________________ > Experience certainty. IT Services Business Solutions > Consulting ____________________________________________ > > > "its" wrote on 02/08/2019 09:07:10 PM: > >> From: "Alexandre Petrescu" To: >> "Abhijan Bhattacharyya" , "Carsten >> Bormann" Cc: "core@ietf.org" , >> its@ietf.org Date: 02/08/2019 09:08 PM Subject: Re: [ipwave] >> Adaptive RESTful Real-time Live Streaming for Things (A-REaLiST)' >> Sent by: "its" >> >> "External email. Open with Caution" >> >> >> Le 04/02/2019 à 20:00, Abhijan Bhattacharyya a écrit : >>> Thank you Carsten for your comments. No one can speak about CoAP >>> > better >>> than you! >>> >>> Alex, I have uploaded a new version of the draft. The links are >>> given at the end of this mail. I have indeed tried to address >>> your concern in > respect >>> to making the draft more "IPv6-relevant". >>> >>> As Carsten rightly pointed out that the proposal works at the >>> application layer and is built on the foundation of CoAP, so it >>> is Layer-3 agnostic. Also, as we all know, CoAP is designed for >>> IPv6. However, implementation on IPv6 may influence the process >>> of > determining >>> the maximum size of information segments. So, a new subsection >>> has > been >>> added as part of the design guidelines. The small addition reads >>> as > below: >>> >>> >>> >>> 6.3. Determining the segment size >>> >>> Size of the information segment in a CoAP message should be >> limited by the least >>> possible MTU for the end-to-end channel. This is to ensure >> that there is no >>> undesired conversation state at the lower layers of the >> protocol stack due to >>> uncontrolled fragmentation leading to undesired explosion of >> traffic in the >>> network. For IPV6 network, the MTU can be determined using >> Path MTU Discovery >>> (PMTUD) [RFC8201] which bestows the responsibility of >> determining the path MTU on >>> the end-points itself. >>> >>> The size of the segment should be guided by the >> recommendations as specified in >>> Section 4.6 of [RFC7252]. >>> >>> >>> >>> I hope this will now satisfy the criterion of finding IPv6 in the >>> > draft. >> >> Thank you very much for this valuable action. >> >> It is very worth taking into consideration. >> >> From an implementation standpoint, I would like to learn whether >> some prototype features RESTful Real-time Live Streaming on IPv6, >> or not > on IPv6. >> >> Alex >> >>> >>> Looping in CoRE list as well to announce the new version to the >>> WG > where >>> this draft originates. >>> >>> Thank you. >>> >>> URL: >>> https://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-bhattacharyya-core-a- >> realist-01.txt >>> Status: > https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-bhattacharyya-core-a-realist/ >>> Htmlized: > https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-bhattacharyya-core-a-realist-01 >>> Htmlized: >>> > https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/html/draft-bhattacharyya-core-a-realist > > >> Diff: >>> https://www.ietf.org/rfcdiff?url2=draft-bhattacharyya-core-a-realist-01 > >>> >> >>> >>> With Best Regards Abhijan Bhattacharyya Consultant / Scientist, >>> {Internet Protocols | 5G | Standardization}, TCS Research, Tata >>> Consultancy Services Building 1B,Ecospace Plot - IIF/12 ,New >>> Town, Rajarhat, Kolkata - 700160,West Bengal India Ph:- +91 33 >>> 66884691 Cell:- +919830468972 | +918583875003 Mailto: >>> abhijan.bhattacharyya@tcs.com > >>> Website: http://www.tcs.com >>> ____________________________________________ Experience >>> certainty. IT Services Business Solutions Consulting >>> ____________________________________________ >>> >>> >>> -----"its" > > wrote: ----- >>> To: "Alexandre Petrescu" >> > From: "Carsten Bormann" >>> Sent by: "its" Date: 01/31/2019 06:12PM Cc: "Abhijan >>> Bhattacharyya" >> >, "Michael Richardson" >>> >, its@ietf.org >>> Subject: Re: [ipwave] Adaptive RESTful >>> Real-time Live Streaming for Things (A-REaLiST)' >>> >>> "External email. Open with Caution" >>> >>>> If TCP's state machine was a bottleneck, has one tried to use >>>> UDP instead? >>> >>> I think that is indeed one of the advantages CoAP brings go the > table here. >>> >>>> Does CoAP work on Ethernet? >>> >>> CoAP was designed to be able to run on UDP, which is on IP which >>> in > turn >>> works very well on Ethernet. >>> >>>> Does CoAP work in an end-to-end manner or does it need >>>> protocol conversion gateways? >>> >>> I works end-to-end (as long as your network doesn’t break UDP). >>> >>>> I want to ask you: please use IPv6 for CoAP and RESTful. >>> >>> CoAP was designed to work well over IPv6 (but works as well over >>> IPv4). >>> >>>> Then I searched for the keyword ‘IPv6' in the draft. […] If you >>>> add ‘IPv6' considerations to it, then I will comment on it. >>> >>> For a CoAP application such as A-REaLiST, IPv6 makes little >>> difference (beyond being able to assign addresses to both ends in >>> the first > place), >>> so I don’t know there is a lot to say. >>> >>> Grüße, Carsten >>> >>> _______________________________________________ its mailing list >>> its@ietf.org >>> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/its >>> >>> =====-----=====-----===== Notice: The information contained in >>> this e-mail message and/or attachments to it may contain >>> confidential or privileged information. If you are not the >>> intended recipient, any dissemination, use, review, distribution, >>> printing or copying of the information contained in this e-mail >>> message and/or attachments to it are strictly prohibited. If you >>> have received this communication in error, please notify us by >>> reply e-mail or telephone and immediately and permanently delete >>> the message and any attachments. Thank you >>> >> >> _______________________________________________ its mailing list >> its@ietf.org https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/its >> From nobody Fri Feb 15 06:01:07 2019 Return-Path: X-Original-To: core@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: core@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id E898412D4E9 for ; Fri, 15 Feb 2019 06:01:05 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -4.3 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-4.3 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-2.3, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (1024-bit key) header.d=cs.helsinki.fi Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id PZucW7I_3Bsz for ; Fri, 15 Feb 2019 06:01:03 -0800 (PST) Received: from script.cs.helsinki.fi (script.cs.helsinki.fi [128.214.11.1]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id D7B2812D4E6 for ; Fri, 15 Feb 2019 06:01:02 -0800 (PST) X-DKIM: Courier DKIM Filter v0.50+pk-2017-10-25 mail.cs.helsinki.fi Fri, 15 Feb 2019 16:00:58 +0200 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=cs.helsinki.fi; h=date:from:to:subject:message-id:mime-version:content-type; s= dkim20130528; bh=hzAp2HqHFkTO2/8aLOoJT/sfVwaYxePqX4niOrivWWk=; b= P+BWDMpX69zpB4KSobR802+pjPECkJhd2ahz/WrmbzrR4tW+HzmdIsVj2NKszmhH wzfYYjJzcBjzCh5A1thTBlNHVj9LsVE3R31IYu8Vp2AePK78bu2B9dGzH4JlEhZh AFcIZaC/zX8R76v84M7Vlmya2pEaAY12ze+vItxtJ0c= Received: from dx6-cs-02.pc.helsinki.fi (dx6-cs-02.pc.helsinki.fi [193.167.160.58]) (AUTH: PLAIN kojo, TLS: TLSv1/SSLv3,256bits,AES256-GCM-SHA384) by mail.cs.helsinki.fi with ESMTPSA; Fri, 15 Feb 2019 16:00:58 +0200 id 00000000005A00C7.000000005C66C61A.00007B6C Date: Fri, 15 Feb 2019 16:00:58 +0200 (EET) From: Markku Kojo X-X-Sender: kojo@dx6-cs-02.pc.helsinki.fi To: core@ietf.org Message-ID: User-Agent: Alpine 2.20 (DEB 67 2015-01-07) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="US-ASCII" Archived-At: Subject: [core] Updated info related to draft-jarvinen-core-fasor X-BeenThere: core@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: "Constrained RESTful Environments \(CoRE\) Working Group list" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 15 Feb 2019 14:01:06 -0000 Dear CoRE people, As indicated by the core wg chairs in IETF-103 core wg meeting after the FASOR presentation, more information on the IPR related to FASOR would be helpful before making WG adoption call on the FASOR draft. This is to note that the patent claim owner has provided more information in its IPR disclosure posted on the "IETF Page of Intellectual Property Rights Disclosures" (https://datatracker.ietf.org/ipr/3346/). Hopefully this information turns out to be useful for people to come up with an opinion on the possible WG adoption of the draft. Best regards, /Markku From nobody Sat Feb 16 10:25:19 2019 Return-Path: X-Original-To: core@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: core@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 039EF130D7A; Sat, 16 Feb 2019 10:25:18 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.9 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.9 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE=-0.0001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id OT8VVYTj9g40; Sat, 16 Feb 2019 10:25:16 -0800 (PST) Received: from mail2.augustcellars.com (augustcellars.com [50.45.239.150]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id C3B9B126C7E; Sat, 16 Feb 2019 10:25:15 -0800 (PST) Received: from Jude (73.180.8.170) by mail2.augustcellars.com (192.168.0.56) with Microsoft SMTP Server (TLS) id 15.0.1395.4; Sat, 16 Feb 2019 10:25:08 -0800 From: Jim Schaad To: 'Klaus Hartke' CC: , References: <000901d4c2f8$4b69a640$e23cf2c0$@augustcellars.com> In-Reply-To: Date: Sat, 16 Feb 2019 10:25:06 -0800 Message-ID: <00f901d4c624$f313cb30$d93b6190$@augustcellars.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook 16.0 Thread-Index: AQHZeLzgd60hRSXGqZKN3jc6SJcBfgFxWGrPpc3KhGA= Content-Language: en-us X-Originating-IP: [73.180.8.170] Archived-At: Subject: Re: [core] draft-ietf-core-multipart-ct X-BeenThere: core@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: "Constrained RESTful Environments \(CoRE\) Working Group list" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sat, 16 Feb 2019 18:25:18 -0000 Looking at this, it does seem to be a strange way to deal with things. = Of course the problem is made even more of a pain if you think about the = possibility of having nested multipart contents. While the following does may not be the greatest solution, I think that = it might be a better answer: 1. Define a new target attribute: "mt-subtypes" which contains the = list of any content type which can be returned in a multipart content. = This could be at the top level or anyplace in a tree. 2. Define a new option: "mt-accept" which contains the list of = sub-content types that the client can deal with. This option would be = defined as advisory on the part of the server, that is it can return = content types which are not in the list, but where options exist in the = possible returned content tree the requested types, in order, SHOULD be = the ones chosen by the server. I would propose the option be = "Non-Critical, Safe, CacheKey, Repeatable". I am not sure if I believe that the new option is part of the cache key = or not. I can see arguments on both sides, but I think I come down to = yes. Carsten, I think that this issue (but maybe not this solution) needs = to be put onto the agenda for the interim meeting next Wed. Jim > -----Original Message----- > From: Klaus Hartke > Sent: Tuesday, February 12, 2019 9:50 AM > To: Jim Schaad > Cc: draft-ietf-core-multipart-ct@ietf.org; core@ietf.org WG = > Subject: Re: [core] draft-ietf-core-multipart-ct >=20 > For context: [1] [2] >=20 > Jim Schaad wrote: > > If you say ACCEPT 62, do you accept any combination of nested = content > types? >=20 > Yes. A CoAP request can include at most one Accept option and any = response > must exactly that value as Content-Format or be an error response. = CoAP > doesn't have a mechanism for negotiating the content formats of > representations embedded in other representations. I stumbled upon the > same problem with CoRAL. >=20 > > Should something about this be placed into the draft? >=20 > Yes. Proposed text: "CoAP doesn't have a mechanism for negotiating the > content formats of representations embedded in = application/multipart-core > representations." >=20 > > Also I note that this draft is currently expired and needs to be = reposted. >=20 > Yes. Soon=E2=84=A2. >=20 > Klaus >=20 > [1] > https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/ace/L1QPw1zHAj15nsKMe8AFDu6dcm > I > [2] = https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/ace/vj5CYF8eRrra5yph2Z9ui3Gkllk From nobody Mon Feb 18 13:32:41 2019 Return-Path: X-Original-To: core@ietf.org Delivered-To: core@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from ietfa.amsl.com (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id C473513104B; Mon, 18 Feb 2019 13:32:32 -0800 (PST) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: internet-drafts@ietf.org To: Cc: core@ietf.org X-Test-IDTracker: no X-IETF-IDTracker: 6.91.0 Auto-Submitted: auto-generated Precedence: bulk Reply-To: core@ietf.org Message-ID: <155052555275.25978.3733449239507405529@ietfa.amsl.com> Date: Mon, 18 Feb 2019 13:32:32 -0800 Archived-At: Subject: [core] I-D Action: draft-ietf-core-senml-etch-02.txt X-BeenThere: core@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 List-Id: "Constrained RESTful Environments \(CoRE\) Working Group list" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 18 Feb 2019 21:32:33 -0000 A New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line Internet-Drafts directories. This draft is a work item of the Constrained RESTful Environments WG of the IETF. Title : FETCH & PATCH with Sensor Measurement Lists (SenML) Authors : Ari Keranen Mojan Mohajer Filename : draft-ietf-core-senml-etch-02.txt Pages : 9 Date : 2019-02-18 Abstract: The Sensor Measurement Lists (SenML) media type and data model can be used to send collections of resources, such as batches of sensor data or configuration parameters. The CoAP iPATCH, PATCH, and FETCH methods enable accessing and updating parts of a resource or multiple resources with one request. This document defines new media types for the CoAP iPATCH, and FETCH methods for resources represented with the SenML data model. The IETF datatracker status page for this draft is: https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-core-senml-etch/ There are also htmlized versions available at: https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-core-senml-etch-02 https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/html/draft-ietf-core-senml-etch-02 A diff from the previous version is available at: https://www.ietf.org/rfcdiff?url2=draft-ietf-core-senml-etch-02 Please note that it may take a couple of minutes from the time of submission until the htmlized version and diff are available at tools.ietf.org. 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header.d=gmail.com Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id lfADD4M8JIib; Tue, 19 Feb 2019 01:58:05 -0800 (PST) Received: from mail-it1-x12f.google.com (mail-it1-x12f.google.com [IPv6:2607:f8b0:4864:20::12f]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id B667D130E94; Tue, 19 Feb 2019 01:58:04 -0800 (PST) Received: by mail-it1-x12f.google.com with SMTP id h6so4808797itl.1; Tue, 19 Feb 2019 01:58:04 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20161025; h=mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date:message-id:subject:to :cc; bh=C0yW2EVf5eB2m/jx3pBGOWCdp3xGjR9wbcAHh13LiME=; b=ZfVXMHjNSD5rMwROd4ZMOnOH6siA2LeVUlpurM9SM7fbLWPuPNHCUIbocIVnLXwWh7 TaeBvgJLwgw3ec+zNPN/Gukb+rbK6JWt3rmN36lirEg/G0w6Csovjf5UfZ0R7o4JguY/ 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AHgI3IbKQYUXZD5tBh9+UeWAqNfsTXBee007BSF18bhczeE/lx8bRbO06C7/o9SX/7/oNcdyooH8xeP7tEBVVE7fc1Q= X-Received: by 2002:a02:3b51:: with SMTP id i17mr10106280jaf.68.1550570283639; Tue, 19 Feb 2019 01:58:03 -0800 (PST) MIME-Version: 1.0 References: <000901d4c2f8$4b69a640$e23cf2c0$@augustcellars.com> <00f901d4c624$f313cb30$d93b6190$@augustcellars.com> In-Reply-To: <00f901d4c624$f313cb30$d93b6190$@augustcellars.com> From: Thomas Fossati Date: Tue, 19 Feb 2019 09:57:52 +0000 Message-ID: To: Jim Schaad Cc: Klaus Hartke , draft-ietf-core-multipart-ct@ietf.org, core@ietf.org Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="000000000000f4a7a605823c46a0" Archived-At: Subject: Re: [core] draft-ietf-core-multipart-ct X-BeenThere: core@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: "Constrained RESTful Environments \(CoRE\) Working Group list" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 19 Feb 2019 09:58:08 -0000 --000000000000f4a7a605823c46a0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable It has surfaced in the mailing list as well as in private exchanges that there are two ways of looking at multipart-ct: (A) as a mechanism to wrap multiple related things in a rigidly structured way; (B) as a mechanism to aggregate related thingsin flexible ways (e.g., the EST-coaps credentials). One approach to content negotiation for multiparts of kind (A) is to assign the aggregate a separate type altogether (overriding C-F 62 with something allocated on purpose from the FCFS portion of the codepoint space). This fits Accept=E2=80=99s semantics well. Content negotiation with multiparts of kind (B) needs something like Jim=E2= =80=99s proposal. The slight complication that potentially breaks Jim=E2=80=99s ap= proach is recursion. To support this, I think the draft could say: - multiparts of kind (A) SHOULD override the multipart C-F with their own; and - multiparts of kind (B) MUST not include other multiparts of the same =E2=80=9Ckind=E2=80=9D. The above would make a recursive multipart (i.e., a 62 embedded in another 62) illegal and give Jim=E2=80=99s new content negotiation a well-defined s= emantics. Cheers On Sat, Feb 16, 2019 at 6:25 PM Jim Schaad wrote: > > Looking at this, it does seem to be a strange way to deal with things. Of course the problem is made even more of a pain if you think about the possibility of having nested multipart contents. > > While the following does may not be the greatest solution, I think that it might be a better answer: > > 1. Define a new target attribute: "mt-subtypes" which contains the list of any content type which can be returned in a multipart content. This could be at the top level or anyplace in a tree. > > 2. Define a new option: "mt-accept" which contains the list of sub-content types that the client can deal with. This option would be defined as advisory on the part of the server, that is it can return content types which are not in the list, but where options exist in the possible returned content tree the requested types, in order, SHOULD be the ones chosen by the server. I would propose the option be "Non-Critical, Safe, CacheKey, Repeatable". > > I am not sure if I believe that the new option is part of the cache key or not. I can see arguments on both sides, but I think I come down to yes. > > Carsten, I think that this issue (but maybe not this solution) needs to be put onto the agenda for the interim meeting next Wed. > > Jim > > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: Klaus Hartke > > Sent: Tuesday, February 12, 2019 9:50 AM > > To: Jim Schaad > > Cc: draft-ietf-core-multipart-ct@ietf.org; core@ietf.org WG < core@ietf.org> > > Subject: Re: [core] draft-ietf-core-multipart-ct > > > > For context: [1] [2] > > > > Jim Schaad wrote: > > > If you say ACCEPT 62, do you accept any combination of nested content > > types? > > > > Yes. A CoAP request can include at most one Accept option and any response > > must exactly that value as Content-Format or be an error response. CoAP > > doesn't have a mechanism for negotiating the content formats of > > representations embedded in other representations. I stumbled upon the > > same problem with CoRAL. > > > > > Should something about this be placed into the draft? > > > > Yes. Proposed text: "CoAP doesn't have a mechanism for negotiating the > > content formats of representations embedded in application/multipart-core > > representations." > > > > > Also I note that this draft is currently expired and needs to be reposted. > > > > Yes. Soon=E2=84=A2. > > > > Klaus > > > > [1] > > https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/ace/L1QPw1zHAj15nsKMe8AFDu6dcm > > I > > [2] https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/ace/vj5CYF8eRrra5yph2Z9ui3Gkllk > > _______________________________________________ > core mailing list > core@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/core --=20 Thomas --000000000000f4a7a605823c46a0 Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
It has surfaced in the mailing list as well as in private = exchanges that there are two ways of looking at multipart-ct:
(A) as a m= echanism to wrap multiple related things in a rigidly structured way;
(B= ) as a mechanism to aggregate related thingsin flexible ways (e.g., the EST= -coaps credentials).

One approach to content negotiation for multipa= rts of kind (A) is to assign the aggregate a separate type altogether (over= riding C-F 62 with something allocated on purpose from the FCFS portion of = the codepoint space).=C2=A0 This fits Accept=E2=80=99s semantics well.
<= br>Content negotiation with multiparts of kind (B) needs something like Jim= =E2=80=99s proposal.=C2=A0 The slight complication that potentially breaks = Jim=E2=80=99s approach is recursion.

To support this, I think the dr= aft could say:
- multiparts of kind (A) SHOULD override the multipart C-= F with their own; and
- multiparts of kind (B) MUST not include other mu= ltiparts of the same =E2=80=9Ckind=E2=80=9D.

The above would make a = recursive multipart (i.e., a 62 embedded in another 62) illegal and give Ji= m=E2=80=99s new content negotiation a well-defined semantics.

Cheers=

On Sat, Feb 16, 2019 at 6:25 PM Jim Schaad <ietf@augustcellars.com> wrote:
>
>= Looking at this, it does seem to be a strange way to deal with things.=C2= =A0 Of course the problem is made even more of a pain if you think about th= e possibility of having nested multipart contents.
>
> While th= e following does may not be the greatest solution, I think that it might be= a better answer:
>
> 1.=C2=A0 Define a new target attribute: = =C2=A0"mt-subtypes" which contains the list of any content type w= hich can be returned in a multipart content.=C2=A0 This could be at the top= level or anyplace in a tree.
>
> 2.=C2=A0 Define a new option:= "mt-accept" which contains the list of sub-content types that th= e client can deal with.=C2=A0 This option would be defined as advisory on t= he part of the server, that is it can return content types which are not in= the list, but where options exist in the possible returned content tree th= e requested types, in order, SHOULD be the ones chosen by the server. =C2= =A0 I would propose the option be "Non-Critical, Safe, CacheKey, Repea= table".
>
> I am not sure if I believe that the new option= is part of the cache key or not.=C2=A0 I can see arguments on both sides, = but I think I come down to yes.
>
> Carsten, =C2=A0 I think tha= t this issue (but maybe not this solution) needs to be put onto the agenda = for the interim meeting next Wed.
>
> Jim
>
>
&g= t; > -----Original Message-----
> > From: Klaus Hartke <hartke@projectcool.de>
> = > Sent: Tuesday, February 12, 2019 9:50 AM
> > To: Jim Schaad &= lt;ietf@augustcellars.com>=
> > Cc: = draft-ietf-core-multipart-ct@ietf.org; core@ietf.org WG <core@ietf.org>
> > Subject: Re: [core] draft-ietf-core-multipart-ct
>= >
> > For context: [1] [2]
> >
> > Jim Schaa= d wrote:
> > > If you say ACCEPT 62, do you accept any combinat= ion of nested content
> > types?
> >
> > Yes. A = CoAP request can include at most one Accept option and any response
>= > must exactly that value as Content-Format or be an error response. Co= AP
> > doesn't have a mechanism for negotiating the content fo= rmats of
> > representations embedded in other representations. I = stumbled upon the
> > same problem with CoRAL.
> >
>= ; > > Should something about this be placed into the draft?
> &= gt;
> > Yes. Proposed text: "CoAP doesn't have a mechanis= m for negotiating the
> > content formats of representations embed= ded in application/multipart-core
> > representations."
&g= t; >
> > > Also I note that this draft is currently expired = and needs to be reposted.
> >
> > Yes. Soon=E2=84=A2.
= > >
> > Klaus
> >
> > [1]
> > https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/ace/L1QPw1zHAj15nsKMe8AFDu6dcm=
> > I
> > [2] https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/m= sg/ace/vj5CYF8eRrra5yph2Z9ui3Gkllk
>
> ____________________= ___________________________
> core mailing list
> core@ietf.org
> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/core
--
Thomas
--000000000000f4a7a605823c46a0-- From nobody Tue Feb 19 18:33:48 2019 Return-Path: X-Original-To: core@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: core@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 488CC13107D for ; Tue, 19 Feb 2019 16:19:16 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -4.19 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-4.19 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-2.3, SPF_PASS=-0.001, T_FILL_THIS_FORM_SHORT=0.01, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id t0ClSWnJ3Hq8 for ; Tue, 19 Feb 2019 16:19:14 -0800 (PST) Received: from mail.amsl.com (c8a.amsl.com [4.31.198.40]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher AECDH-AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id BA61D13104F for ; Tue, 19 Feb 2019 16:19:14 -0800 (PST) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by c8a.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 769041C5EB8; Tue, 19 Feb 2019 16:19:03 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com Received: from c8a.amsl.com ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (c8a.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id ShoWr1NTADxK; Tue, 19 Feb 2019 16:19:03 -0800 (PST) Received: from [64.170.98.194] (unknown [64.170.98.194]) by c8a.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPA id 461121C5EB3; Tue, 19 Feb 2019 16:19:03 -0800 (PST) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Mime-Version: 1.0 (Mac OS X Mail 7.3 \(1878.6\)) From: Megan Ferguson In-Reply-To: <20181207084309.330DCB81302@rfc-editor.org> Date: Tue, 19 Feb 2019 16:18:55 -0800 Cc: Akbar.Rahman@InterDigital.com, Ben Campbell , Alexey Melnikov , Adam Roach , Carsten Bormann , =?iso-8859-1?Q?Jaime_Jim=E9nez?= , esko.dijk@iotconsultancy.nl, core@ietf.org, RFC System Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Message-Id: References: <20181207084309.330DCB81302@rfc-editor.org> To: esko.dijk@philips.com X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.1878.6) Archived-At: X-Mailman-Approved-At: Tue, 19 Feb 2019 18:33:47 -0800 Subject: Re: [core] [Editorial Errata Reported] RFC7390 (5569) X-BeenThere: core@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: "Constrained RESTful Environments \(CoRE\) Working Group list" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 20 Feb 2019 00:19:16 -0000 Esko, As errata reports are only for errors at the time of publication, we = have deleted this errata report.=20 However, we have updated our database so that future communication about = the following RFCs will be sent=20 to the address requested (Esko.Dijk@iotconsultancy.nl). RFC 7390 RFC 8075 Please let us know if we can be of further assistance. RFC Editor/mf On Dec 7, 2018, at 12:43 AM, RFC Errata System = wrote: > The following errata report has been submitted for RFC7390, > "Group Communication for the Constrained Application Protocol (CoAP)". >=20 > -------------------------------------- > You may review the report below and at: > http://www.rfc-editor.org/errata/eid5569 >=20 > -------------------------------------- > Type: Editorial > Reported by: Esko Dijk >=20 > Section: 6.2 >=20 > Original Text > ------------- > Esko Dijk ("Esko.Dijk@Philips.com") >=20 > Corrected Text > -------------- > Esko Dijk ("Esko.Dijk@iotconsultancy.nl") >=20 > Notes > ----- > Change of contact email address due to change of employer >=20 > Instructions: > ------------- > This erratum is currently posted as "Reported". If necessary, please > use "Reply All" to discuss whether it should be verified or > rejected. When a decision is reached, the verifying party =20 > can log in to change the status and edit the report, if necessary.=20 >=20 > -------------------------------------- > RFC7390 (draft-ietf-core-groupcomm-25) > -------------------------------------- > Title : Group Communication for the Constrained = Application Protocol (CoAP) > Publication Date : October 2014 > Author(s) : A. Rahman, Ed., E. Dijk, Ed. > Category : EXPERIMENTAL > Source : Constrained RESTful Environments APP > Area : Applications > Stream : IETF > Verifying Party : IESG >=20 From nobody Tue Feb 19 21:48:29 2019 Return-Path: X-Original-To: core@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: core@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id DBBFB129619; Tue, 19 Feb 2019 21:48:26 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.9 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.9 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE=-0.0001, SPF_PASS=-0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id lgf5LnjD_yhQ; Tue, 19 Feb 2019 21:48:24 -0800 (PST) Received: from mail2.augustcellars.com (augustcellars.com [50.45.239.150]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 8689912D84D; Tue, 19 Feb 2019 21:48:23 -0800 (PST) Received: from Jude (73.180.8.170) by mail2.augustcellars.com (192.168.0.56) with Microsoft SMTP Server (TLS) id 15.0.1395.4; Tue, 19 Feb 2019 21:48:17 -0800 From: Jim Schaad To: 'Thomas Fossati' CC: 'Klaus Hartke' , , References: <000901d4c2f8$4b69a640$e23cf2c0$@augustcellars.com> <00f901d4c624$f313cb30$d93b6190$@augustcellars.com> In-Reply-To: Date: Tue, 19 Feb 2019 21:48:16 -0800 Message-ID: <026901d4c8df$e2251410$a66f3c30$@augustcellars.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_026A_01D4C89C.D4029760" X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook 16.0 Thread-Index: AQHZeLzgd60hRSXGqZKN3jc6SJcBfgFxWGrPAht6VX8BZPQLtqW3PYig Content-Language: en-us X-Originating-IP: [73.180.8.170] Archived-At: Subject: Re: [core] draft-ietf-core-multipart-ct X-BeenThere: core@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: "Constrained RESTful Environments \(CoRE\) Working Group list" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 20 Feb 2019 05:48:27 -0000 ------=_NextPart_000_026A_01D4C89C.D4029760 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable I did think about some of this when I put up the proposal. =20 For case (A), unless it is going to have options while doing a rigidly = structured response, there is no need to have a value different than = Accept 62. In fact if there is really only one structured response, = then there is not a need to have any accept option in the request at = all. =20 For case (B), I thought about the recursive case and that is why I put = the SHOULD and talked about options between multiple things while = building the response. I don=E2=80=99t think that there are going to be = enough cases of a tree structure being returned that anything needs to = be said about it one way or the other. If that type of detail is really = needed then I would expect that a GET would be replaced by a POST with = the details of the response needed in the content of the POST. =20 In the semantics, I wanted to provide a minimal amount of information. = Thus the language about using it to provide guidance for specific pairs = of content types that can go into a specific location. The other place = that I was thinking it might be useful would be in the case of a PUB-SUB = server returning multiple content types where the set of equivalents = might be restricted to the requested values rather than returning all = possibilities. =20 Jim =20 =20 From: Thomas Fossati =20 Sent: Tuesday, February 19, 2019 1:58 AM To: Jim Schaad Cc: Klaus Hartke ; = draft-ietf-core-multipart-ct@ietf.org; core@ietf.org Subject: Re: [core] draft-ietf-core-multipart-ct =20 It has surfaced in the mailing list as well as in private exchanges that = there are two ways of looking at multipart-ct: (A) as a mechanism to wrap multiple related things in a rigidly = structured way; (B) as a mechanism to aggregate related thingsin flexible ways (e.g., = the EST-coaps credentials). One approach to content negotiation for multiparts of kind (A) is to = assign the aggregate a separate type altogether (overriding C-F 62 with = something allocated on purpose from the FCFS portion of the codepoint = space). This fits Accept=E2=80=99s semantics well. Content negotiation with multiparts of kind (B) needs something like = Jim=E2=80=99s proposal. The slight complication that potentially breaks = Jim=E2=80=99s approach is recursion. To support this, I think the draft could say: - multiparts of kind (A) SHOULD override the multipart C-F with their = own; and - multiparts of kind (B) MUST not include other multiparts of the same = =E2=80=9Ckind=E2=80=9D. The above would make a recursive multipart (i.e., a 62 embedded in = another 62) illegal and give Jim=E2=80=99s new content negotiation a = well-defined semantics. Cheers On Sat, Feb 16, 2019 at 6:25 PM Jim Schaad > wrote: > > Looking at this, it does seem to be a strange way to deal with things. = Of course the problem is made even more of a pain if you think about = the possibility of having nested multipart contents. > > While the following does may not be the greatest solution, I think = that it might be a better answer: > > 1. Define a new target attribute: "mt-subtypes" which contains the = list of any content type which can be returned in a multipart content. = This could be at the top level or anyplace in a tree. > > 2. Define a new option: "mt-accept" which contains the list of = sub-content types that the client can deal with. This option would be = defined as advisory on the part of the server, that is it can return = content types which are not in the list, but where options exist in the = possible returned content tree the requested types, in order, SHOULD be = the ones chosen by the server. I would propose the option be = "Non-Critical, Safe, CacheKey, Repeatable". > > I am not sure if I believe that the new option is part of the cache = key or not. I can see arguments on both sides, but I think I come down = to yes. > > Carsten, I think that this issue (but maybe not this solution) needs = to be put onto the agenda for the interim meeting next Wed. > > Jim > > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: Klaus Hartke > > > Sent: Tuesday, February 12, 2019 9:50 AM > > To: Jim Schaad > > > Cc: draft-ietf-core-multipart-ct@ietf.org = ; core@ietf.org = WG > > > Subject: Re: [core] draft-ietf-core-multipart-ct > > > > For context: [1] [2] > > > > Jim Schaad wrote: > > > If you say ACCEPT 62, do you accept any combination of nested = content > > types? > > > > Yes. A CoAP request can include at most one Accept option and any = response > > must exactly that value as Content-Format or be an error response. = CoAP > > doesn't have a mechanism for negotiating the content formats of > > representations embedded in other representations. I stumbled upon = the > > same problem with CoRAL. > > > > > Should something about this be placed into the draft? > > > > Yes. Proposed text: "CoAP doesn't have a mechanism for negotiating = the > > content formats of representations embedded in = application/multipart-core > > representations." > > > > > Also I note that this draft is currently expired and needs to be = reposted. > > > > Yes. Soon=E2=84=A2. > > > > Klaus > > > > [1] > > https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/ace/L1QPw1zHAj15nsKMe8AFDu6dcm > > I > > [2] = https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/ace/vj5CYF8eRrra5yph2Z9ui3Gkllk > > _______________________________________________ > core mailing list > core@ietf.org =20 > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/core --=20 Thomas ------=_NextPart_000_026A_01D4C89C.D4029760 Content-Type: text/html; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

I did = think about some of this when I put up the proposal.

 

For case = (A), unless it is going to have options while doing a rigidly structured = response, there is no need to have a value different than Accept = 62.=C2=A0 In fact if there is really only one structured response, then = there is not a need to have any accept option in the request at = all.

 

For case (B), I thought about the recursive case and = that is why I put the SHOULD and talked about options between multiple = things while building the response.=C2=A0 I don=E2=80=99t think that = there are going to be enough cases of a tree structure being returned = that anything needs to be said about it one way or the other.=C2=A0 If = that type of detail is really needed then I would expect that a GET = would be replaced by a POST with the details of the response needed in = the content of the POST.

 

In the = semantics, I wanted to provide a minimal amount of information.=C2=A0 = Thus the language about using it to provide guidance for specific pairs = of content types that can go into a specific location.=C2=A0 The other = place that I was thinking it might be useful would be in the case of a = PUB-SUB server returning multiple content types where the set of = equivalents might be restricted to the requested values rather than = returning all possibilities.

 

Jim

 

 

From: = Thomas Fossati <tho.ietf@gmail.com>
Sent: Tuesday, = February 19, 2019 1:58 AM
To: Jim Schaad = <ietf@augustcellars.com>
Cc: Klaus Hartke = <hartke@projectcool.de>; draft-ietf-core-multipart-ct@ietf.org; = core@ietf.org
Subject: Re: [core] = draft-ietf-core-multipart-ct

 

It has = surfaced in the mailing list as well as in private exchanges that there = are two ways of looking at multipart-ct:
(A) as a mechanism to wrap = multiple related things in a rigidly structured way;
(B) as a = mechanism to aggregate related thingsin flexible ways (e.g., the = EST-coaps credentials).

One approach to content negotiation for = multiparts of kind (A) is to assign the aggregate a separate type = altogether (overriding C-F 62 with something allocated on purpose from = the FCFS portion of the codepoint space).  This fits = Accept=E2=80=99s semantics well.

Content negotiation with = multiparts of kind (B) needs something like Jim=E2=80=99s = proposal.  The slight complication that potentially breaks = Jim=E2=80=99s approach is recursion.

To support this, I think the = draft could say:
- multiparts of kind (A) SHOULD override the = multipart C-F with their own; and
- multiparts of kind (B) MUST not = include other multiparts of the same =E2=80=9Ckind=E2=80=9D.

The = above would make a recursive multipart (i.e., a 62 embedded in another = 62) illegal and give Jim=E2=80=99s new content negotiation a = well-defined semantics.

Cheers

On Sat, Feb 16, 2019 at = 6:25 PM Jim Schaad <ietf@augustcellars.com> = wrote:
>
> Looking at this, it does seem to be a strange way = to deal with things.  Of course the problem is made even more of a = pain if you think about the possibility of having nested multipart = contents.
>
> While the following does may not be the = greatest solution, I think that it might be a better = answer:
>
> 1.  Define a new target attribute: =  "mt-subtypes" which contains the list of any content = type which can be returned in a multipart content.  This could be = at the top level or anyplace in a tree.
>
> 2.  Define = a new option: "mt-accept" which contains the list of = sub-content types that the client can deal with.  This option would = be defined as advisory on the part of the server, that is it can return = content types which are not in the list, but where options exist in the = possible returned content tree the requested types, in order, SHOULD be = the ones chosen by the server.   I would propose the option be = "Non-Critical, Safe, CacheKey, Repeatable".
>
> I = am not sure if I believe that the new option is part of the cache key or = not.  I can see arguments on both sides, but I think I come down to = yes.
>
> Carsten,   I think that this issue (but maybe = not this solution) needs to be put onto the agenda for the interim = meeting next Wed.
>
> Jim
>
>
> > = -----Original Message-----
> > From: Klaus Hartke <hartke@projectcool.de>
&g= t; > Sent: Tuesday, February 12, 2019 9:50 AM
> > To: Jim = Schaad <ietf@augustcellars.com>
= > > Cc: draft-ietf-core-mul= tipart-ct@ietf.org; core@ietf.org WG <core@ietf.org>
> > = Subject: Re: [core] draft-ietf-core-multipart-ct
> >
> = > For context: [1] [2]
> >
> > Jim Schaad = wrote:
> > > If you say ACCEPT 62, do you accept any = combination of nested content
> > types?
> >
> = > Yes. A CoAP request can include at most one Accept option and any = response
> > must exactly that value as Content-Format or be an = error response. CoAP
> > doesn't have a mechanism for = negotiating the content formats of
> > representations embedded = in other representations. I stumbled upon the
> > same problem = with CoRAL.
> >
> > > Should something about this = be placed into the draft?
> >
> > Yes. Proposed text: = "CoAP doesn't have a mechanism for negotiating the
> > = content formats of representations embedded in = application/multipart-core
> > representations."
> = >
> > > Also I note that this draft is currently expired = and needs to be reposted.
> >
> > Yes. = Soon=E2=84=A2.
> >
> > Klaus
> >
> > = [1]
> > https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/ace/L1QPw1zHAj15nsKMe8AFDu6dcm=
> > I
> > [2] https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/ace/vj5CYF8eRrra5yph2Z9ui3Gkl= lk
>
> = _______________________________________________
> core mailing = list
> core@ietf.org
> = https://www.ietf.org/= mailman/listinfo/core

-- =
Thomas

------=_NextPart_000_026A_01D4C89C.D4029760-- From nobody Tue Feb 19 23:03:50 2019 Return-Path: X-Original-To: core@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: core@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9F876127287; Tue, 19 Feb 2019 23:03:48 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -4.2 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-4.2 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-2.3] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id VVrRELWSRw_d; Tue, 19 Feb 2019 23:03:46 -0800 (PST) Received: from mailhost.informatik.uni-bremen.de (mailhost.informatik.uni-bremen.de [IPv6:2001:638:708:30c9::12]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 2A7A212426A; Tue, 19 Feb 2019 23:03:45 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at informatik.uni-bremen.de Received: from submithost.informatik.uni-bremen.de (submithost2.informatik.uni-bremen.de [IPv6:2001:638:708:30c8:406a:91ff:fe74:f2b7]) by mailhost.informatik.uni-bremen.de (8.14.5/8.14.5) with ESMTP id x1K73XoK016092; Wed, 20 Feb 2019 08:03:39 +0100 (CET) Received: from [192.168.217.106] (p54A6C2FE.dip0.t-ipconnect.de [84.166.194.254]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by submithost.informatik.uni-bremen.de (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 4447qT4HzQz1Br7; Wed, 20 Feb 2019 08:03:33 +0100 (CET) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Mime-Version: 1.0 (Mac OS X Mail 11.5 \(3445.9.1\)) From: Carsten Bormann In-Reply-To: <026901d4c8df$e2251410$a66f3c30$@augustcellars.com> Date: Wed, 20 Feb 2019 08:03:32 +0100 Cc: Thomas Fossati , draft-ietf-core-multipart-ct@ietf.org, core@ietf.org, Klaus Hartke X-Mao-Original-Outgoing-Id: 572339010.995652-ad565c5c8c55f37fa13d7bda363a1b56 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Message-Id: References: <000901d4c2f8$4b69a640$e23cf2c0$@augustcellars.com> <00f901d4c624$f313cb30$d93b6190$@augustcellars.com> <026901d4c8df$e2251410$a66f3c30$@augustcellars.com> To: Jim Schaad X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.3445.9.1) Archived-At: Subject: Re: [core] draft-ietf-core-multipart-ct X-BeenThere: core@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: "Constrained RESTful Environments \(CoRE\) Working Group list" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 20 Feb 2019 07:03:49 -0000 On Feb 20, 2019, at 06:48, Jim Schaad wrote: >=20 > For case (A), unless it is going to have options while doing a rigidly = structured response, there is no need to have a value different than = Accept 62. In fact if there is really only one structured response, = then there is not a need to have any accept option in the request at = all. Case (A) is somewhat hypothetical now, so let me give an example to find = out whether that would be (A) or maybe even a new (C): We do a FETCH with an array of selectors, which was defined as a content = type of its own. The return might be a specially defined content type = for providing an array of responses, or it might simply be a = multipart-core, laying out the selector results in the same sequence = they were requested in the FETCH payload. The specific semantics of the = (sequence of objects in the) response body here come from the request = body and its media-type! (And the client might still use an Accept if there is another way to = represent the array of results as well but the client specifically wants = multipart-core.) Gr=C3=BC=C3=9Fe, Carsten From nobody Wed Feb 20 06:59:30 2019 Return-Path: X-Original-To: core@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: core@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id EE9F3130E09 for ; Wed, 20 Feb 2019 06:59:28 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -4.2 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-4.2 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-2.3] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id Y5QDdAjEen8M for ; Wed, 20 Feb 2019 06:59:27 -0800 (PST) Received: from mailhost.informatik.uni-bremen.de (mailhost.informatik.uni-bremen.de [IPv6:2001:638:708:30c9::12]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 58A7F129741 for ; Wed, 20 Feb 2019 06:59:27 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at informatik.uni-bremen.de Received: from submithost.informatik.uni-bremen.de (submithost2.informatik.uni-bremen.de [134.102.200.7]) by mailhost.informatik.uni-bremen.de (8.14.5/8.14.5) with ESMTP id x1KExJfL027575 for ; Wed, 20 Feb 2019 15:59:24 +0100 (CET) Received: from [192.168.217.106] (p54A6C2FE.dip0.t-ipconnect.de [84.166.194.254]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by submithost.informatik.uni-bremen.de (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 444LNR2Sq2z1Br6; Wed, 20 Feb 2019 15:59:19 +0100 (CET) From: Carsten Bormann Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 X-Mao-Original-Outgoing-Id: 572367556.905381-66407335b18840585003c4858454c3d1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Mime-Version: 1.0 (Mac OS X Mail 11.5 \(3445.9.1\)) Date: Wed, 20 Feb 2019 15:59:18 +0100 Message-Id: <9AD3C4BB-7965-4776-84C4-6B5BFDCAA262@tzi.org> To: core X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.3445.9.1) Archived-At: Subject: [core] Chair's review of draft-ietf-core-senml-etch-02.txt X-BeenThere: core@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: "Constrained RESTful Environments \(CoRE\) Working Group list" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 20 Feb 2019 14:59:29 -0000 In preparation for the impending working-group last call, I have reviewed draft-ietf-core-senml-etch-02.txt. Substantive comments are below; a set of small editorial comments is going to the authors in parallel. # Minor 1. The text of the draft does not contain an argument that the application of Patch Packs is idempotent. It probably should. 2. The text sometimes says "iPATCH" where it probably should be saying "PATCH and iPATCH". This should be checked throughout. 3. The term "resource" is sometimes used in lieu of "subset of SenML records that, when resolved, match a given name". Gr=C3=BC=C3=9Fe, Carsten From nobody Wed Feb 20 07:08:34 2019 Return-Path: X-Original-To: core@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: core@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id D5F74128B14 for ; Wed, 20 Feb 2019 07:08:32 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -4.199 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-4.199 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-2.3] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id QXeDq8kOyg3S for ; Wed, 20 Feb 2019 07:08:30 -0800 (PST) Received: from mailhost.informatik.uni-bremen.de (mailhost.informatik.uni-bremen.de [IPv6:2001:638:708:30c9::12]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 43F03127AC2 for ; Wed, 20 Feb 2019 07:08:30 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at informatik.uni-bremen.de Received: from submithost.informatik.uni-bremen.de (submithost2.informatik.uni-bremen.de [IPv6:2001:638:708:30c8:406a:91ff:fe74:f2b7]) by mailhost.informatik.uni-bremen.de (8.14.5/8.14.5) with ESMTP id x1KF8LNi005137 for ; Wed, 20 Feb 2019 16:08:26 +0100 (CET) Received: from [192.168.217.106] (p54A6C2FE.dip0.t-ipconnect.de [84.166.194.254]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by submithost.informatik.uni-bremen.de (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 444LZr5fCgz1Br6; Wed, 20 Feb 2019 16:08:20 +0100 (CET) Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="Apple-Mail=_33C8D3F6-EA05-4B0D-B1E0-F39500E2957C" Mime-Version: 1.0 (Mac OS X Mail 11.5 \(3445.9.1\)) From: Carsten Bormann X-Priority: 3 X-Mail-Calendar-Part: Yes Date: Wed, 20 Feb 2019 16:08:19 +0100 X-Mao-Original-Outgoing-Id: 572368097.216328-1255440109df8bbb4cdf9925987fe746 Message-Id: <9CA4B195-C8B7-46B3-AA04-AD0E9C406D1C@tzi.org> References: <83E7C5E4-CA4B-477E-96ED-0EB840F589AE@tzi.org> To: core X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.3445.9.1) Archived-At: Subject: [core] Fwd: Webex meeting details: CoRE Interim Meeting today 2019-02-20 X-BeenThere: core@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: "Constrained RESTful Environments \(CoRE\) Working Group list" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 20 Feb 2019 15:08:33 -0000 --Apple-Mail=_33C8D3F6-EA05-4B0D-B1E0-F39500E2957C Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 50 minutes till today=E2=80=99s meeting. Webex details for this full interim are the same as usual; copied below. My proposed agenda: Admin: =E2=80=93 Document status Technical: =E2=80=93 Content negotiation and multipart-core Gr=C3=BC=C3=9Fe, Carsten >> Begin forwarded message: >>=20 >> From: Carsten Bormann > >> Subject: [core] Webex meeting details: CoRE Hallway and Interim = Meetings before IETF104 >> Date: January 9, 2019 at 16:01:15 GMT+1 >> To: "core@ietf.org WG" > >> Archived-At: = > >>=20 >>> CORE Working Group invites you to join this Webex meeting. >>> =20 >>> CoRE Hallway and Interim Meetings >>> Every 2 weeks on Wednesday, from Wednesday, January 9, 2019, to = Wednesday, March 20, 2019 >>> 4:00 pm | Greenwich Time (Reykjavik, GMT) | 1 hr >>> Meeting number (access code): 649 598 697 >>> Meeting password: constrained >>>=20 >>>=20 >>> =20 >>> Add to Calendar = =09 >>> When it's time, join the meeting = . >>> =20 >>> Join by phone >>> 1-650-479-3208 = Call-in toll number (US/Canada) >>> =20 >>> Can't join the meeting? = >>> =20 >>> IMPORTANT NOTICE: Please note that this Webex service allows audio = and other information sent during the session to be recorded, which may = be discoverable in a legal matter. By joining this session, you = automatically consent to such recordings. If you do not consent to being = recorded, discuss your concerns with the host or do not join the = session. >=20 >=20 > _______________________________________________ > core mailing list > core@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/core = > _______________________________________________ > core mailing list > core@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/core --Apple-Mail=_33C8D3F6-EA05-4B0D-B1E0-F39500E2957C Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="Apple-Mail=_94AEA72B-F1BC-4427-B962-C642944E70BD" --Apple-Mail=_94AEA72B-F1BC-4427-B962-C642944E70BD Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Type: text/html; charset=utf-8
50 minutes till today=E2=80=99s = meeting.
Webex details for this full interim are the same as = usual; copied below.

My proposed = agenda:
Admin:
=E2=80=93 Document = status
Technical:
=E2=80=93 Content negotiation and = multipart-core

Gr=C3=BC=C3=9Fe, Carsten

Begin forwarded message:

From: Carsten Bormann <cabo@tzi.org>
Subject: = [core] Webex = meeting details: CoRE Hallway and Interim Meetings before IETF104
Date: January 9, 2019 at 16:01:15 GMT+1
To: "core@ietf.org WG" <core@ietf.org>
Archived-At: <https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/core/rjM1BQj5T-LWzH-y5Y2V= oW-7obE>

CORE Working Group invites you to join this = Webex meeting.
 
CoRE Hallway and = Interim Meetings
Every 2 weeks on Wednesday, from Wednesday, January 9, = 2019, to Wednesday, March 20, 2019
4:00 = pm  |  Greenwich Time (Reykjavik, = GMT)  |  1 hr
Meeting number (access code): 649 598 = 697
Meeting = password: constrained


 
Add to = Calendar
When it's time, join the = meeting.
 
Join by phone
1-650-479-3208 Call-in toll number = (US/Canada)
 
Can't join the = meeting?
 
IMPORTANT NOTICE: Please note that this Webex service = allows audio and other information sent during the session to be = recorded, which may be discoverable in a legal matter. By joining this = session, you automatically consent to such recordings. If you do not = consent to being recorded, discuss your concerns with the host or do not = join the = session.
=
= --Apple-Mail=_94AEA72B-F1BC-4427-B962-C642944E70BD Content-Disposition: attachment; filename=Webex_Meeting.ics Content-Type: text/calendar; x-unix-mode=0666; name="Webex_Meeting.ics" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable BEGIN:VCALENDAR=0APRODID:-//Microsoft=20Corporation//Outlook=2010.0=20= MIMEDIR//EN=0AVERSION:2.0=0AMETHOD:REQUEST=0ABEGIN:VTIMEZONE=0A= TZID:Greenwich=20Time=0ABEGIN:STANDARD=0ADTSTART:20170101T000000=0A= TZOFFSETFROM:+0000=0ATZOFFSETTO:+0000=0ATZNAME:Standard=20Time=0A= END:STANDARD=0AEND:VTIMEZONE=0ABEGIN:VEVENT=0ACLASS:PUBLIC=0A= DESCRIPTION:\n\n\n\nJOIN=20WEBEX=20= MEETING\nhttps://ietf.webex.com/ietf/j.php?MTID=3Dm01e0c6fecb1b951b749450d= ee33a432c\nMeeting=20number=20(access=20code):=20649=20598=20= 697\nMeeting=20password:=20constrained\n\n\n\nJOIN=20BY=20= PHONE\n1-650-479-3208=20Call-in=20toll=20number=20(US/Canada)=20\nTap=20= here=20to=20call=20(mobile=20phones=20only,=20hosts=20not=20supported):=20= tel:%2B1-650-479-3208,,*01*649598697%23%23*01*\n\n\n\nCan't=20join=20the=20= meeting?\nhttps://collaborationhelp.cisco.com/article/WBX000029055\n\n\nIM= PORTANT=20NOTICE:=20Please=20note=20that=20this=20Webex=20service=20= allows=20audio=20and=20other=20information=20sent=20during=20the=20= session=20to=20be=20recorded,=20which=20may=20be=20discoverable=20in=20a=20= legal=20matter.=20By=20joining=20this=20session,=20you=20automatically=20= consent=20to=20such=20recordings.=20If=20you=20do=20not=20consent=20to=20= being=20recorded,=20discuss=20your=20concerns=20with=20the=20host=20or=20= do=20not=20join=20the=20session.\n=0AX-ALT-DESC;FMTTYPE=3Dtext/html:=09=  
 
 
=09=09Join=20= Webex=20meeting=09=09=09=09=09=09=09=09=09=09=09=09= =09=09=09=09=09=09=09
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=09=09=09= =09=09=09
Meeting=20password:constrained
=09= =09

 
 
Join=20by=20phone =20
1-650-479-3208 Call-in=20toll=20= number=20(US/Canada) =20


=09 
=09= =09= Can't=20join=20= the=20meeting?=09 
 
IMPORTANT=20NOTICE:=20Please=20note=20that=20= this=20Webex=20service=20allows=20audio=20and=20other=20information=20= sent=20during=20the=20session=20to=20be=20recorded,=20which=20may=20be=20= discoverable=20in=20a=20legal=20matter.=20By=20joining=20this=20session,=20= you=20automatically=20consent=20to=20such=20recordings.=20If=20you=20do=20= not=20consent=20to=20being=20recorded,=20discuss=20your=20concerns=20= with=20the=20host=20or=20do=20not=20join=20the=20session.=0A= ATTENDEE;CN=3D"CORE=20Working=20= Group";ROLE=3DREQ-PARTICIPANT;RSVP=3DTRUE:MAILTO:core-chairs@ietf.org=0A= DTSTAMP:20190109T160000Z=0AUID:87eada8c-d7f0-4692-98c1-7d481cc9637e=0A= PRIORITY:5=0ADTSTART;TZID=3D"Greenwich=20Time":20190109T160000=0A= DTEND;TZID=3D"Greenwich=20Time":20190109T170000=0A= RRULE:FREQ=3DWEEKLY;INTERVAL=3D2;BYDAY=3DWE;UNTIL=3D20190320T170000Z=0A= SEQUENCE:1547045524=0ASUMMARY:CoRE=20Hallway=20and=20Interim=20Meetings=0A= TRANSP:OPAQUE=0AORGANIZER;CN=3D"CORE=20Working=20= Group":MAILTO:core-chairs@ietf.org=0A= LOCATION:https://ietf.webex.com/ietf=0ABEGIN:VALARM=0ATRIGGER:-PT5M=0A= ACTION:DISPLAY=0ADESCRIPTION:Reminder=0AEND:VALARM=0AEND:VEVENT=0A= END:VCALENDAR=0A= --Apple-Mail=_94AEA72B-F1BC-4427-B962-C642944E70BD Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Type: text/html; charset=us-ascii

_______________________________________________
core mailing list
core@ietf.org
https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/core
_______________________________________________
core mailing list
core@ietf.org
https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/core

= --Apple-Mail=_94AEA72B-F1BC-4427-B962-C642944E70BD-- --Apple-Mail=_33C8D3F6-EA05-4B0D-B1E0-F39500E2957C-- From nobody Wed Feb 20 08:03:32 2019 Return-Path: X-Original-To: core@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: core@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 888E5130E8E; Wed, 20 Feb 2019 08:03:27 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -0.921 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-0.921 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, FROM_EXCESS_BASE64=0.979] autolearn=no autolearn_force=no Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 9xdt8XCA1ZPS; Wed, 20 Feb 2019 08:03:24 -0800 (PST) Received: from prometheus.amsuess.com (alt.prometheus.amsuess.com [IPv6:2a01:4f8:190:3064::3]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ADH-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 65C6A128B01; Wed, 20 Feb 2019 08:03:16 -0800 (PST) Received: from poseidon-mailhub.amsuess.com (095129206250.cust.akis.net [95.129.206.250]) by prometheus.amsuess.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 2690A43569; Wed, 20 Feb 2019 17:03:14 +0100 (CET) Received: from poseidon-mailbox.amsuess.com (hermes.amsuess.com [10.13.13.254]) by poseidon-mailhub.amsuess.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6582E36; Wed, 20 Feb 2019 17:03:13 +0100 (CET) Received: from hephaistos.amsuess.com (hephaistos.amsuess.com [IPv6:2a02:b18:c13b:8010::71b]) by poseidon-mailbox.amsuess.com (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 271FC6A; Wed, 20 Feb 2019 17:03:13 +0100 (CET) Received: (nullmailer pid 27807 invoked by uid 1000); Wed, 20 Feb 2019 16:03:12 -0000 Date: Wed, 20 Feb 2019 17:03:12 +0100 From: Christian =?iso-8859-1?B?TS4gQW1z/HNz?= To: Carsten Bormann Cc: "core@ietf.org WG" , draft-ietf-core-echo-request-tag@ietf.org Message-ID: <20190220160311.GA19473@hephaistos.amsuess.com> References: <963CE8EA-ABAC-488A-8FA6-81431A2E5B06@tzi.org> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/signed; micalg=pgp-sha256; protocol="application/pgp-signature"; boundary="IJpNTDwzlM2Ie8A6" Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <963CE8EA-ABAC-488A-8FA6-81431A2E5B06@tzi.org> User-Agent: Mutt/1.10.1 (2018-07-13) Archived-At: Subject: Re: [core] Chair's review of draft-ietf-core-echo-request-tag-03.txt X-BeenThere: core@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: "Constrained RESTful Environments \(CoRE\) Working Group list" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 20 Feb 2019 16:03:31 -0000 --IJpNTDwzlM2Ie8A6 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Hello Carsten, thanks for the review, addressing the points that are not still being processed by the authors: On Wed, Feb 06, 2019 at 03:58:02PM +0100, Carsten Bormann wrote: > * Is "operation" the term we want to use henceforth? Would "transfer" be more suitable? It's probably well-aligned with RFC7959's use of the term to just give a precise definition again and use that. > * Section 3 is confused about Request-Tag Options and lists of those. > Why was the option marked repeatable? The option is repeatable to allow tiny proxies to satisfy all their blockwise-handling obligations by adding a per-sender Request-Tag option. (The alternative would be that they string-append to any existing Request-Tag option, which is somethign I'd perfer not to do as an implementor). That's outlined in section 3.5 but I agree that the wording is far from straightforward. > * Title and Abstract. The title probably should mention CoAP. The > abstract might want to say what the introduction already says: This > is for supporting specific use cases (i.e., not all use cases will > need these additions). Addressed in the next version. > * Introduction. The introduction could say earlier that Request-Tag > is intended exclusively for combination with Block1 options. Added. Note that the Request-Tag option can be present in messages that carry no Block1 option they are later messages of a combined Block1+Block2 oper..ransfer. > * Section 3 would benefit from explaining that Request-Tag is only > meant to be used with Block1 Options in requests. Added (note as above). Is a MUST NOT be used in response messages suitable there? Thanks for your input Christian --=20 To use raw power is to make yourself infinitely vulnerable to greater power= s. -- Bene Gesserit axiom --IJpNTDwzlM2Ie8A6 Content-Type: application/pgp-signature; name="signature.asc" -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- iQIzBAABCAAdFiEECM1tElX6OodcH7CWOY0REtOkveEFAlxtej0ACgkQOY0REtOk veGo4Q/+ONLswQ2sHSWucITuNAdmtEmhWduVof9j5mOnjh8uM2Mvk0hPyiu4fikj FKNgEbDHR2Os3CmImvu2UPJyp/rOlUeJ7HGHzHlVt4pP0Y+kZi7Uyg9GYxmQevpo fYAHLWzW2Kb2yg2Tg48gkyxg+oA4Def+R7ufYAZcdgFeVvS0I2Ez7f7SqHWfrLM4 1h298JZr0bNWVah7RZwzTnlUksk+MnINQuDW0H+QSDiFYCMVd+xoENY5GKDa/bSK zdgZn7Te++lIqjIGGrJA1BYvUYLkuQgGf5fJuWeo9yzpraWHz71Pl1i0YpAR6e4C O2qRZlLYl2jy/Xhl0GAz6SK5GUXLsuzHPk6bCM10L6wF4TSSGBLXMUdqEA0G2Wei l42+6nTmF8YgqR9RBOGJ2RtvkAb3sVVluoyyYi0zlbouexi9REsoWEv2vGa9tNHw 2MDZhFTNOPWl0Nr12V7UjwQ/fUzzjn2hcB5z/NQtTCi66GWe0u9GE+hOuqSq8ViZ viNu1qgKhIPFefOv9mxs3OD8iXioandVfei+K2BZF2ara2WROQGAGTZvjvhy0sAx jfnFIUiG9dFA926nNGHob8t811N+bJEl9XWZam64UPQbLk7Rvof0S/CpS0bLz71e xaTWeQhAmr05ptJk/yUJc6F+qHcQW7XyrKzWKUFCeuLvyOVL4jU= =QgVO -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --IJpNTDwzlM2Ie8A6-- From nobody Wed Feb 20 14:01:32 2019 Return-Path: X-Original-To: core@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: core@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id C7B4F129AA0; 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Ip=[194.218.146.197]; Helo=[mail.ri.se] X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-FromEntityHeader: HybridOnPrem X-MS-Exchange-Transport-CrossTenantHeadersStamped: HE1P189MB0329 Archived-At: Subject: Re: [core] Comments on draft-tiloca-core-oscore-discovery X-BeenThere: core@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: "Constrained RESTful Environments \(CoRE\) Working Group list" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 20 Feb 2019 22:01:31 -0000 --SU2SLK1l7f7zi9a2OfvoBJHfW7XfSDqYp Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="wlgCI4X9BeJ1dZM1I5YsiGQFxs4JYaB8y"; protected-headers="v1" From: Marco Tiloca To: Jim Schaad Cc: draft-ietf-ace-key-groupcomm-oscore@ietf.org, core@ietf.org, draft-tiloca-core-oscore-discovery@ietf.org Message-ID: <026314bb-caba-1568-c61b-14dc16183902@ri.se> Subject: Re: Comments on draft-tiloca-core-oscore-discovery References: <08a001d4b37f$c55111b0$4ff33510$@augustcellars.com> In-Reply-To: <08a001d4b37f$c55111b0$4ff33510$@augustcellars.com> --wlgCI4X9BeJ1dZM1I5YsiGQFxs4JYaB8y Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Language: en-US (updated the subject) Hello Jim, Thanks a lot for your comments and sorry for the late reply. Please, find our answers inline below. We have been updating our draft based on your input. Best, /Marco On 1/24/19 1:57 AM, Jim Schaad wrote: > I am having a huge problem understanding this document because I am > completely confused by the model that is being propagated here. =20 > > This document has a model that every group is going to be on a differen= t > resource. It is not clear that this is the same model as is being used= in > the ACE group communication document. Probably one of these two docum= ents > should provide a more explicit module of how things work if this is wha= t is > going to be desired. I was under the impression that a single join poi= nt > would be used for multiple groups at the same time. This may be accept= able > with this document but if so then it is really not clear. Sorry for the confusion. This document and the ACE document [1] are aligned and in fact follow the same model. We can especially clarify that this document uses two types of groups, namely "application group" and "security group". The concept of "application group" is already defined and used in the Resource Directory draft, and we recall it in Section 1.1 of this documen= t. Then, we can also explicitly include the definition of "security group", as a set of CoAP endpoints sharing common keying material for securing communications in a group setting. With particular reference to Group OSCORE, "security groups" are used in the same way both in the ACE document [1] as well as in this document. That said, the same and common model is such that: - Each "application group" uses only one OSCORE group as "security group"= =2E - A single join resource, i.e. join point, is associated to one "security group". - A "security group" and its join resource can be used by multiple "application groups". Also, to avoid further confusion, we have thought it's better to rename the parameter "oscore-gp" as "app-gp". This is in fact used as name of the "application group", and thus it is not strictly related to Group OSCORE. [1] https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-ace-key-groupcomm-oscore > This document appears to be pointed at dealing with multicast groups, b= ut > there does not seem to be any tie between multicast resources and join > request points. The document should also deal with the same issue for > pub-sub servers as that is of interest as well. The multicast resources are shared by all the members of a same "application group", registered in the RD and with its own IP multicast address. Instead, a join resource (i.e. join request point) is related to an OSCORE group used as "security group" by the "application group". The link between the two is the attribute currently named "oscore-gp", that can be used as search criterion. As mentioned above, we plan to rename it as "app-gp", to align it with its intended meaning defined in Section 5, i.e. name of an "application group". We didn't think of pub-sub servers, since Group OSCORE does not cover that communication model. However, we believe it may possible to generalize this document to cover also a pub-sub setting, building on [2]. At the same time, it is probably better to first see how security activities related to pub-sub develop. [2] https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-core-coap-pubsub-06#section-5 > This document appears to be missing the registration of the oscore-gp a= nd > oscore-gid attributes. I don't know but assume that there is (or shoul= d be) > a registry for these types of things. Specifically do these items allo= w for > multiple values or are they single valued? (I will assume that if they= are > multiple valued they should appear as multiple items just to make life > easier.) We are also considering where to possibly register those attributes, and there seems to be no easy answer. Since there is no registry for link target attributes, we thought of the "RD Parameter" registry [3], but it's probably not the best thing to do. In fact, other applications may still use those parameters in link registrations, that could tell RDs to act differently on them in some places [4]. However, that won't keep others from using those parameters for their purposes in general to-be-registered link-format data. More specifically on their values: - "oscore-gid" does not allow for multiple values, since an OSCORE Group has a single Group ID. - "oscore-gp" (to be renamed as "app-gp") allows for multiple values. When this happens, it in fact appears as multiple items, as we show in the example at the end of Section 5.2. We can make these points explicit in Section 5, in the bullet points about these parameters. [3] https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-core-resource-directory-19#section= -9.3 [4] For instance, not accept them as endpoint attributes, or treat them differently on lookup. All considering that, users must be prepared for RDs not implementing the special behavior. > Jim > > --=20 Marco Tiloca Ph.D., Senior Researcher RISE Research Institutes of Sweden Division ICT Isafjordsgatan 22 / Kistag=C3=A5ngen 16 SE-164 40 Kista (Sweden) Phone: +46 (0)70 60 46 501 https://www.ri.se --wlgCI4X9BeJ1dZM1I5YsiGQFxs4JYaB8y-- --SU2SLK1l7f7zi9a2OfvoBJHfW7XfSDqYp Content-Type: application/pgp-signature; name="signature.asc" Content-Description: OpenPGP digital signature Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="signature.asc" -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- iQEzBAEBCgAdFiEEOEo4cV326Z7GypVg7iZktA5Y2kMFAlxtzi0ACgkQ7iZktA5Y 2kObwAgAmtWBjqI50MjOCoeafsrG7nFZgxKIDM1vU60IiFovbf20YWhv2KlVoe6O lXigkIpW8gJ5T4HbrZ3EDaPPu+biKU7v3YlqE9m5uNXNb+PJU25fVoetLQrydbZt Zm28NRpWtWoIv8MubCAQXN55Xmm5YgAKwj+RP0MfisrTqdpe3GxaT4UO0FNRTQkP ihSEpfRNn6OHWJUvR88V1wsVaWxF9fFrm3PpEUAX9c3Gz3anQUM0UkAgRNvhSaWU 5304hGquYbnUIW+TrGbHp9e4hSq+Nhx43iu17mG75U96dnY2BDsVqF6VgK3F5gOf JZRJuBrV06tMnOsrTAPIcbSs2QdbyQ== =V60R -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --SU2SLK1l7f7zi9a2OfvoBJHfW7XfSDqYp-- From nobody Thu Feb 21 15:20:47 2019 Return-Path: X-Original-To: core@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: core@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id CD4EC12D4ED; Thu, 21 Feb 2019 15:20:46 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -4.2 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-4.2 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-2.3] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id AMkj93TtlAod; Thu, 21 Feb 2019 15:20:45 -0800 (PST) Received: from mailhost.informatik.uni-bremen.de (mailhost.informatik.uni-bremen.de [IPv6:2001:638:708:30c9::12]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 6AFEB126C7E; Thu, 21 Feb 2019 15:20:42 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at informatik.uni-bremen.de Received: from submithost.informatik.uni-bremen.de (submithost2.informatik.uni-bremen.de [IPv6:2001:638:708:30c8:406a:91ff:fe74:f2b7]) by mailhost.informatik.uni-bremen.de (8.14.5/8.14.5) with ESMTP id x1LNKX7o029490; Fri, 22 Feb 2019 00:20:38 +0100 (CET) Received: from [192.168.217.106] (p54A6C2FE.dip0.t-ipconnect.de [84.166.194.254]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by submithost.informatik.uni-bremen.de (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 4459SK4GGSz1Bp8; Fri, 22 Feb 2019 00:20:33 +0100 (CET) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Mime-Version: 1.0 (Mac OS X Mail 11.5 \(3445.9.1\)) From: Carsten Bormann Date: Fri, 22 Feb 2019 00:20:32 +0100 Cc: draft-ietf-core-hop-limit@ietf.org X-Mao-Original-Outgoing-Id: 572484030.3803051-039167e7e724254a73dcb763d8255945 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Message-Id: <7185933E-6816-435E-B668-2DB1367C279E@tzi.org> To: core X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.3445.9.1) Archived-At: Subject: [core] Chair's review of draft-ietf-core-hop-limit-02.txt X-BeenThere: core@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: "Constrained RESTful Environments \(CoRE\) Working Group list" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 21 Feb 2019 23:20:47 -0000 In preparation for the impending working-group last call, I have reviewed draft-ietf-core-hop-limit-02.txt. Substantive comments are below; a set of small editorial comments is going to the authors in parallel. # Major 1. Is adding a hop-limit option now a recommendation that applies to all CoAP proxies? 2. I don't understand the rule about using cached copies. As a general observation, rules like this should not simply be stated without a rationale why they are the way they are. # Minor 1. The text could include a sentence about what happens when a proxy does not understand the option (nothing bad, but loops consisting entirely of such proxies will not be terminated). 2. The way the diagnostic payloads are formed seems to rely on a space separator, but does not exclude its use inside the separated items. # Editorial 1. The terminology could be aligned some more (e.g., avoid "agent", use "request" or "response" instead of "message" where possible). Details in the editorial comments. Gr=C3=BC=C3=9Fe, Carsten From nobody Fri Feb 22 01:25:51 2019 Return-Path: X-Original-To: core@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: core@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id C4E1F128CE4; Fri, 22 Feb 2019 01:25:45 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.6 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.6 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW=-0.7, SPF_PASS=-0.001, UNPARSEABLE_RELAY=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id y1XhnSBiIbJP; Fri, 22 Feb 2019 01:25:44 -0800 (PST) Received: from orange.com (mta240.mail.business.static.orange.com [80.12.66.40]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher AECDH-AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id F0DAB128CB7; Fri, 22 Feb 2019 01:25:43 -0800 (PST) Received: from opfedar01.francetelecom.fr (unknown [xx.xx.xx.2]) by opfedar26.francetelecom.fr (ESMTP service) with ESMTP id 445QtZ2vCdzFqkv; Fri, 22 Feb 2019 10:25:42 +0100 (CET) Received: from Exchangemail-eme6.itn.ftgroup (unknown [xx.xx.13.32]) by opfedar01.francetelecom.fr (ESMTP service) with ESMTP id 445QtZ27S5zBrLG; Fri, 22 Feb 2019 10:25:42 +0100 (CET) Received: from OPEXCAUBMA2.corporate.adroot.infra.ftgroup ([fe80::e878:bd0:c89e:5b42]) by OPEXCAUBM7C.corporate.adroot.infra.ftgroup ([fe80::2c53:f99a:e2a9:19c6%21]) with mapi id 14.03.0435.000; Fri, 22 Feb 2019 10:25:42 +0100 From: To: Carsten Bormann , core CC: "draft-ietf-core-hop-limit@ietf.org" Thread-Topic: Chair's review of draft-ietf-core-hop-limit-02.txt Thread-Index: AQHUyjwU2aXJonTlXUmkQdG+hNvQqaXrXsKg Date: Fri, 22 Feb 2019 09:25:41 +0000 Message-ID: <787AE7BB302AE849A7480A190F8B93302EA23CEA@OPEXCAUBMA2.corporate.adroot.infra.ftgroup> References: <7185933E-6816-435E-B668-2DB1367C279E@tzi.org> In-Reply-To: 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aW50LiZxdW90OzxvOnA+PC9vOnA+PC9zcGFuPjwvcD4NCjxwIGNsYXNzPSJNc29Ob3JtYWwiPjxz cGFuIHN0eWxlPSJmb250LXNpemU6MTAuMHB0O2ZvbnQtZmFtaWx5OiZxdW90O0NvdXJpZXIgTmV3 JnF1b3Q7Ij48bzpwPiZuYnNwOzwvbzpwPjwvc3Bhbj48L3A+DQo8cCBjbGFzcz0iTXNvTm9ybWFs Ij48c3BhbiBzdHlsZT0iZm9udC1zaXplOjEwLjBwdDtmb250LWZhbWlseTomcXVvdDtDb3VyaWVy IE5ldyZxdW90OyI+cDQ0IC0gdHlwbyBhZGRyZXNzL0FkZHJlc3M8bzpwPjwvbzpwPjwvc3Bhbj48 L3A+DQo8L2Rpdj4NCjwvYm9keT4NCjwvaHRtbD4NCg== --_000_AM5PR0701MB2307AF330344860328775506977F0AM5PR0701MB2307_-- From nobody Fri Feb 22 13:47:12 2019 Return-Path: X-Original-To: core@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: core@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 018F8130E79; Fri, 22 Feb 2019 13:47:11 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.901 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.901 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE=-0.0001, SPF_PASS=-0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id ThqXZYy64hoO; Fri, 22 Feb 2019 13:47:08 -0800 (PST) Received: from mail2.augustcellars.com (augustcellars.com [50.45.239.150]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id E130A1275F3; Fri, 22 Feb 2019 13:47:07 -0800 (PST) Received: from Jude (50.252.25.182) by mail2.augustcellars.com (192.168.0.56) with Microsoft SMTP Server (TLS) id 15.0.1395.4; Fri, 22 Feb 2019 13:47:01 -0800 From: Jim Schaad To: , 'Carsten Bormann' , 'core' CC: References: <7185933E-6816-435E-B668-2DB1367C279E@tzi.org> <787AE7BB302AE849A7480A190F8B93302EA23CEA@OPEXCAUBMA2.corporate.adroot.infra.ftgroup> In-Reply-To: <787AE7BB302AE849A7480A190F8B93302EA23CEA@OPEXCAUBMA2.corporate.adroot.infra.ftgroup> Date: Fri, 22 Feb 2019 13:47:00 -0800 Message-ID: <039e01d4caf8$25b9c9e0$712d5da0$@augustcellars.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook 16.0 Thread-Index: AQHYz3v1ePoYqh77aS9g7esO8Fa65wKEfZudpdAsjoA= Content-Language: en-us X-Originating-IP: [50.252.25.182] Archived-At: Subject: Re: [core] Chair's review of draft-ietf-core-hop-limit-02.txt X-BeenThere: core@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: "Constrained RESTful Environments \(CoRE\) Working Group list" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 22 Feb 2019 21:47:11 -0000 > -----Original Message----- > From: core On Behalf Of > mohamed.boucadair@orange.com > Sent: Friday, February 22, 2019 1:26 AM > To: Carsten Bormann ; core > Cc: draft-ietf-core-hop-limit@ietf.org > Subject: Re: [core] Chair's review of draft-ietf-core-hop-limit-02.txt >=20 > Hi Carsten, >=20 > Thank you for the review. >=20 > Please see inline. >=20 > Cheers, > Med >=20 > > -----Message d'origine----- > > De : Carsten Bormann [mailto:cabo@tzi.org] Envoy=C3=A9 : vendredi 22 > > f=C3=A9vrier 2019 00:21 =C3=80 : core Cc : = draft-ietf-core-hop-limit@ietf.org > > Objet : Chair's review of draft-ietf-core-hop-limit-02.txt > > > > In preparation for the impending working-group last call, I have > > reviewed draft-ietf-core-hop-limit-02.txt. Substantive comments are > > below; a set of small editorial comments is going to the authors in > > parallel. > > > > # Major > > > > 1. Is adding a hop-limit option now a recommendation that applies to > > all CoAP proxies? >=20 > [Med] The intent is to provide infinite loop detection as a default = behavior > even in contexts where, e.g., clients do not support/insert the = option. The > behavior can be disabled by configuration. >=20 > Do you prefer the default behavior the other way around? My gut feeling is that the answer should be yes it should become a = recommended option for all CoAP proxies. I am not sure that this is the = time for that to happen. I think that in the next couple of years there = may be a larger need to develop some BCPs for proxies and that would be = the time to make the recommendation. Jim >=20 > > > > 2. I don't understand the rule about using cached copies. As a > > general observation, rules like this should not simply be stated > > without a rationale why they are the way they are. > > >=20 > [Med] The rule is to use the cache if the cached value is: > * equal to the one in the request: this one is trivial. > * less than the one in the request: this is to accommodate cases where = some > proxies sent requests on behalf of some clients. >=20 > Then, why not using the cache for greater values? This is to = accommodate, > for example, a topology change so that additional proxies are to be = visited > when processing a request. That change has triggered (out of band) = setting > of a greater value. This can be seen as a way to update the cache with = a > greater value. >=20 > > # Minor > > > > 1. The text could include a sentence about what happens when a proxy > > does not understand the option (nothing bad, but loops consisting > > entirely of such proxies will not be terminated). >=20 > [Med] I added this NEW text: >=20 > Note that > loops which involve only such proxies won't be detected. > Nevertheless, the presence of such proxies won't prevent infinite > loop detection if at least one CoAP proxy which support the = Hop-Limit > option is involved in the loop. >=20 > > > > 2. The way the diagnostic payloads are formed seems to rely on a = space > > separator, but does not exclude its use inside the separated = items. >=20 > [Med] Added an explicit sentence for this. >=20 > > > > # Editorial > > > > 1. The terminology could be aligned some more (e.g., avoid "agent", > > use "request" or "response" instead of "message" where > > possible). Details in the editorial comments. >=20 > [Med] Fixed. >=20 > > > > Gr=C3=BC=C3=9Fe, Carsten >=20 > _______________________________________________ > core mailing list > core@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/core From nobody Fri Feb 22 21:00:07 2019 Return-Path: X-Original-To: core@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: core@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 160A7130F03; Fri, 22 Feb 2019 20:59:53 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -4.199 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-4.199 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-2.3, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id gKg30Pk70HW0; Fri, 22 Feb 2019 20:59:50 -0800 (PST) Received: from mailhost.informatik.uni-bremen.de (mailhost.informatik.uni-bremen.de [IPv6:2001:638:708:30c9::12]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 1582E130EE8; Fri, 22 Feb 2019 20:59:49 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at informatik.uni-bremen.de Received: from submithost.informatik.uni-bremen.de (submithost2.informatik.uni-bremen.de [134.102.200.7]) by mailhost.informatik.uni-bremen.de (8.14.5/8.14.5) with ESMTP id x1N4xd72019444; Sat, 23 Feb 2019 05:59:45 +0100 (CET) Received: from [192.168.217.106] (p54A6C2FE.dip0.t-ipconnect.de [84.166.194.254]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by submithost.informatik.uni-bremen.de (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 445wx743sFz1Bp8; Sat, 23 Feb 2019 05:59:39 +0100 (CET) From: Carsten Bormann Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 X-Mao-Original-Outgoing-Id: 572590776.633619-15478b9ee2b3a7f7ffb62e3339313eb3 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Mime-Version: 1.0 (Mac OS X Mail 11.5 \(3445.9.1\)) Date: Sat, 23 Feb 2019 05:59:38 +0100 Message-Id: To: ace@ietf.org, core , cose , cbor@ietf.org, t2trg@irtf.org X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.3445.9.1) Archived-At: Subject: [core] Constrained Node/Network Cluster @ IETF104: DRAFT AGENDA X-BeenThere: core@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: "Constrained RESTful Environments \(CoRE\) Working Group list" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sat, 23 Feb 2019 04:59:53 -0000 Here is my usual eclectic condensed agenda based on the DRAFT AGENDA for IETF104. Remember that there is still quite some potential for changes. cose/teep and lpwan/t2trg are some annoying conflicts that meet the eye. I also don't like that I'll have to miss the cacao BOF (vs. core), dinrg/suit, coinrg/git. All times are CET (Central European Time) =3D=3D UTC +1 hours. Note = that there is no daylight saving time in effect at the time in Europe (this starts on the Sunday *after* IETF). (You can get pure UTC times on https://datatracker.ietf.org/meeting/agenda-utc, for those who want to listen from remote.) Gr=C3=BC=C3=9Fe, Carsten SATURDAY/SUNDAY, March 23/24. 2019 -- Hackathon (including various interops) (Grand Hilton Ballroom) -- Sun 1700-1900 Welcome Reception - Congress Hall 1/2 -- Sun 1800-2000 Hot RFC Lightning Talks - Congress Hall 3 MONDAY, March 25, 2019 0900-1100 Morning Session I Congress H 3 ART dispatch Dispatch WG - Joint with ARTAREA Congress H 2 INT 6man IPv6 Maintenance WG Congress H 1 IRTF pearg Privacy Enhancements and Assessments = Proposed Research Group Karlin 3 RTG bier Bit Indexed Explicit Replication WG 1120-1220 Morning Session II Congress H 1 INT *** 6tisch IPv6 over the TSCH mode of IEEE = 802.15.4e WG Congress H 2 SEC tls Transport Layer Security WG Karlin 1/2 TSV rmcat RTP Media Congestion Avoidance = Techniques WG 1350-1550 Afternoon Session I Karlin 1/2 INT *** 6lo IPv6 over Networks of = Resource-constrained Nodes WG Congress H 2 IRTF irtfopen IRTF Open Meeting Congress H 3 SEC secdispatch Security Dispatch WG 1610-1810 Afternoon Session II Congress H 2 ART httpbis Hypertext Transfer Protocol WG Congress H 3 IAB smart Stopping Malware and Researching Threats Karlin 1/2 INT dnssd Extensions for Scalable DNS Service = Discovery WG Berlin/Brussels IRTF qirg Quantum Internet Proposed Research Group Karlin 3 RTG *** roll Routing Over Low power and Lossy = networks WG Athens/Barcel. SEC oauth Web Authorization Protocol WG Congress H 1 TSV tsvwg Transport Area Working Group WG TUESDAY, March 26, 2019 0900-1100 Morning Session I Karlin 3 ART uta Using TLS in Applications WG - 1000 - = 1100 Karlin 1/2 INT homenet Home Networking WG Congress H 3 RTG rtgarea Routing Area Open Meeting Berlin/Brussels SEC *** cose CBOR Object Signing and Encryption WG Grand Hilton BR SEC *** teep Trusted Execution Environment = Provisioning WG Congress H 2 TSV quic QUIC WG 1120-1220 Morning Session II Berlin/Brussels INT *** lwig Light-Weight Implementation Guidance WG Congress H 1 IRTF qirg Quantum Internet Proposed Research Group Athens/Barcel. RTG bier Bit Indexed Explicit Replication WG Congress H 3 TSV tsvwg Transport Area Working Group WG 1350-1550 Afternoon Session I Berlin/Brussels ART *** core Constrained RESTful Environments WG Congress H 3 OPS anima Autonomic Networking Integrated Model = and Approach WG Congress H 2 SEC mls Messaging Layer Security WG Grand Hilton BR TSV tsvarea Transport Area Open Meeting 1610-1810 Afternoon Session II Congress H 1 INT *** lpwan IPv6 over Low Power Wide-Area Networks = WG Congress H 3 IRTF*** t2trg Thing-to-Thing Congress H 2 SEC tls Transport Layer Security WG WEDNESDAY, March 27, 2019 0900-1100 Morning Session I Karlin 1/2 IRTF*** dinrg Decentralized Internet Infrastructure Congress H 3 RTG detnet Deterministic Networking WG Berlin/Brussels RTG rift Routing In Fat Trees WG Grand Hilton BR SEC *** suit Software Updates for Internet of Things = WG Congress H 2 TSV quic QUIC WG 1120-1320 Morning Session II Grand Hilton BR IRTF cfrg Crypto Forum - 12:20 - 13:20 Grand Hilton BR SEC acme Automated Certificate Management = Environment WG - 11:20 - 12:20 1500-1700 Afternoon Session I Grand Hilton BR OPS wgtlgo Technology Deep Dive - Modern Router = Architecture BOF THURSDAY, March 28, 2019 0900-1030 Morning Session I Karlin 3 ART *** cbor Concise Binary Object Representation = Maintenance and Extensions WG Congress H 3 IRTF panrg Path Aware Networking RG Athens/Barcel. RTG babel Babel routing protocol WG Congress H 1 SEC mls Messaging Layer Security WG Berlin/Brussels SEC oauth Web Authorization Protocol WG 1050-1220 Morning Session II Congress H 3 GEN git GitHub Integration and Tooling WG Congress H 1 IRTF coinrg Computing in the Network Congress H 2 IRTF maprg Measurement and Analysis for Protocols 1350-1550 Afternoon Session I Congress H 1 INT intarea Internet Area Working Group WG Grand Hilton BR SEC *** rats Remote ATtestation ProcedureS BOF 1610-1810 Afternoon Session II Grand Hilton BR ART httpbis Hypertext Transfer Protocol WG Karlin 1/2 INT *** paw Predictable and Available Wireless BOF Berlin/Brussels OPS v6ops IPv6 Operations WG Congress H 2 SEC saag Security Area Open Meeting FRIDAY, March 29, 2019 0900-1030 Morning Session I Congress H 3 ART *** core Constrained RESTful Environments WG Grand Hilton BR INT 6man IPv6 Maintenance WG Berlin/Brussels SEC cacao Collaborative Automated Course of Action = Operations for Cyber Security BOF 1050-1250 Morning Session II Athens/Barcel. INT ipwave IP Wireless Access in Vehicular = Environments WG Congress H 1 IRTF icnrg Information-Centric Networking Grand Hilton BR SEC *** ace Authentication and Authorization for = Constrained Environments WG Karlin 1/2 TSV taps Transport Services WG From nobody Fri Feb 22 21:04:18 2019 Return-Path: X-Original-To: core@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: core@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 17360130E30; Fri, 22 Feb 2019 21:04:06 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -4.199 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-4.199 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-2.3, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id npd5YiMhh7wp; Fri, 22 Feb 2019 21:04:05 -0800 (PST) Received: from mailhost.informatik.uni-bremen.de (mailhost.informatik.uni-bremen.de [IPv6:2001:638:708:30c9::12]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id B2517128B33; Fri, 22 Feb 2019 21:04:04 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at informatik.uni-bremen.de Received: from submithost.informatik.uni-bremen.de (submithost2.informatik.uni-bremen.de [134.102.200.7]) by mailhost.informatik.uni-bremen.de (8.14.5/8.14.5) with ESMTP id x1N53tVK024751; Sat, 23 Feb 2019 06:04:01 +0100 (CET) Received: from [192.168.217.106] (p54A6C2FE.dip0.t-ipconnect.de [84.166.194.254]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by submithost.informatik.uni-bremen.de (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 445x2310zXz1Bp8; Sat, 23 Feb 2019 06:03:55 +0100 (CET) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Mime-Version: 1.0 (Mac OS X Mail 11.5 \(3445.9.1\)) From: Carsten Bormann In-Reply-To: Date: Sat, 23 Feb 2019 06:03:54 +0100 X-Mao-Original-Outgoing-Id: 572591032.521777-d2548c66452750c48513149efff3b1fa Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Message-Id: <2379FFCD-B44C-4BF7-986C-81BA83189575@tzi.org> References: To: ace , core , cose , cbor@ietf.org, t2trg@irtf.org X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.3445.9.1) Archived-At: Subject: Re: [core] [T2TRG] Constrained Node/Network Cluster @ IETF104: DRAFT AGENDA X-BeenThere: core@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: "Constrained RESTful Environments \(CoRE\) Working Group list" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sat, 23 Feb 2019 05:04:06 -0000 On Feb 23, 2019, at 05:59, Carsten Bormann wrote: >=20 >=20 > Here is my usual eclectic condensed agenda based on the DRAFT AGENDA > for IETF104. Remember that there is still quite some potential for > changes. And how could I forget: FRIDAY, March 22, 2019 =E2=80=94 Fri 0930=E2=80=931800 T2TRG Work Meeting =E2=80=94 Room TBD Gr=C3=BC=C3=9Fe, Carsten From nobody Fri Feb 22 21:58:17 2019 Return-Path: X-Original-To: core@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: core@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id C9949130F0D; Fri, 22 Feb 2019 21:58:15 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -4.199 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-4.199 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-2.3, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id pVuZhmeVtfEU; Fri, 22 Feb 2019 21:58:14 -0800 (PST) Received: from mailhost.informatik.uni-bremen.de (mailhost.informatik.uni-bremen.de [IPv6:2001:638:708:30c9::12]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id A3A27130E30; Fri, 22 Feb 2019 21:58:13 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at informatik.uni-bremen.de Received: from submithost.informatik.uni-bremen.de (submithost2.informatik.uni-bremen.de [IPv6:2001:638:708:30c8:406a:91ff:fe74:f2b7]) by mailhost.informatik.uni-bremen.de (8.14.5/8.14.5) with ESMTP id x1N5w1nH017640; Sat, 23 Feb 2019 06:58:06 +0100 (CET) Received: from [192.168.217.106] (p54A6C2FE.dip0.t-ipconnect.de [84.166.194.254]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by submithost.informatik.uni-bremen.de (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 445yDT2Zmkz1Bp8; Sat, 23 Feb 2019 06:58:01 +0100 (CET) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Mime-Version: 1.0 (Mac OS X Mail 11.5 \(3445.9.1\)) From: Carsten Bormann In-Reply-To: <039e01d4caf8$25b9c9e0$712d5da0$@augustcellars.com> Date: Sat, 23 Feb 2019 06:58:03 +0100 Cc: mohamed.boucadair@orange.com, core , draft-ietf-core-hop-limit@ietf.org X-Mao-Original-Outgoing-Id: 572594281.46174-b045296a03e0b14448c1d89d403f43a5 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Message-Id: References: <7185933E-6816-435E-B668-2DB1367C279E@tzi.org> <787AE7BB302AE849A7480A190F8B93302EA23CEA@OPEXCAUBMA2.corporate.adroot.infra.ftgroup> <039e01d4caf8$25b9c9e0$712d5da0$@augustcellars.com> To: Jim Schaad X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.3445.9.1) Archived-At: Subject: Re: [core] Chair's review of draft-ietf-core-hop-limit-02.txt X-BeenThere: core@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: "Constrained RESTful Environments \(CoRE\) Working Group list" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sat, 23 Feb 2019 05:58:16 -0000 On Feb 22, 2019, at 22:47, Jim Schaad wrote: >=20 > My gut feeling is that the answer should be yes it should become a = recommended option for all CoAP proxies. I am not sure that this is the = time for that to happen. I think that in the next couple of years there = may be a larger need to develop some BCPs for proxies and that would be = the time to make the recommendation. Right. So the specific question for the WG is: Are we ready to strongly recommend (on a =E2=80=9CSHOULD deploy=E2=80=9D = level) hop-limit as our proxy loop mitigation technique now? Or should we wait with such a recommendation until we have had a broader = view at proxy requirements? (E.g., then, MAYBE we might want to go for = Via-like loop prevention instead =E2=80=94 very big MAYBE, as Via is = expensive with IPv6.) I don=E2=80=99t have a strong opinion either way and therefore would = like some more feedback from the WG. In any case, the place in DOTS where it says how CoAP is used for DOTS = should also say =E2=80=9Cplease do deploy hop-limit where proxies are = used=E2=80=9D in the strength that the DOTS people are comfortable with. While the hop-limit draft is not heavily associated with DOTS, maybe it = would be useful to add some =E2=80=9Cnot just for DOTS=E2=80=9D language = as well (after all, that was the point of splitting it out). Gr=C3=BC=C3=9Fe, Carsten From nobody Sun Feb 24 02:07:52 2019 Return-Path: X-Original-To: core@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: core@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0FCF5130DE7 for ; Sun, 24 Feb 2019 02:07:51 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -4.302 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-4.302 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIMWL_WL_HIGH=-0.001, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-2.3, SPF_PASS=-0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (1024-bit key) header.d=ericsson.com header.b=A/n7LIBy; dkim=fail (1024-bit key) reason="fail (body has been altered)" header.d=ericsson.com header.b=BLA+Pe/8 Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id WPnaiPx2vACe for ; Sun, 24 Feb 2019 02:07:49 -0800 (PST) Received: from sesbmg23.ericsson.net (sesbmg23.ericsson.net [193.180.251.37]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id E9320126C01 for ; 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charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Since the agendas of CoRE meetings are usually packed and the T2TRG is only having a summary meeting during the IETF week, I'm planning to set up a side meeting on CoRAL at IETF 104, tentatively on Thursday in the first afternoon session. For planning purposes (e.g., room size), if you're interested in discussing CoRAL in Prague, I'd like to ask you to fill out the following form: https://goo.gl/forms/Qu3CH8VyXC5Aslv23 Klaus ------=_NextPart_000_0009_01D4CC31.26B72E70 Content-Type: application/pkcs7-signature; name="smime.p7s" Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64 Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="smime.p7s" MIAGCSqGSIb3DQEHAqCAMIACAQExCzAJBgUrDgMCGgUAMIAGCSqGSIb3DQEHAQAAoIIVZjCCAyAw ggIIoAMCAQICAR0wDQYJKoZIhvcNAQEFBQAwOTELMAkGA1UEBhMCRkkxDzANBgNVBAoTBlNvbmVy YTEZMBcGA1UEAxMQU29uZXJhIENsYXNzMiBDQTAeFw0wMTA0MDYwNzI5NDBaFw0yMTA0MDYwNzI5 NDBaMDkxCzAJBgNVBAYTAkZJMQ8wDQYDVQQKEwZTb25lcmExGTAXBgNVBAMTEFNvbmVyYSBDbGFz czIgQ0EwggEiMA0GCSqGSIb3DQEBAQUAA4IBDwAwggEKAoIBAQCQF0o1ncrwDZbHRPoWN/xIvb1/ gC01O+FvqGepvwMcTYxvMkfVQWikEwTBNQyahEP8XB3/ibPoFxjNkV/7iePqv05dfBsm03V57eaE 41flrSnE9Doo56V7hDZps/1edr2jLZnTkE4jKH0YY/FUOyaddluXQrL/rvBO7N05lU6DBn/nSUDI xQGyVFpmHT38+ek8Cp6BuHDwAYvkI1R8yK74kB4AlnLUVM9hI7zq+50CldG2uXE6aQg/D7ThQseI 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X-Original-To: core@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: core@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 878C9129532; Sun, 24 Feb 2019 04:06:34 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -4.2 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-4.2 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-2.3] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id kC9xHTRtE-GQ; Sun, 24 Feb 2019 04:06:32 -0800 (PST) Received: from mailhost.informatik.uni-bremen.de (mailhost.informatik.uni-bremen.de [IPv6:2001:638:708:30c9::12]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 151A7128CE4; Sun, 24 Feb 2019 04:06:31 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at informatik.uni-bremen.de Received: from submithost.informatik.uni-bremen.de (submithost2.informatik.uni-bremen.de [IPv6:2001:638:708:30c8:406a:91ff:fe74:f2b7]) by mailhost.informatik.uni-bremen.de (8.14.5/8.14.5) with ESMTP id x1OC6MrH005617; Sun, 24 Feb 2019 13:06:27 +0100 (CET) Received: from [192.168.217.106] (p54A6C2FE.dip0.t-ipconnect.de [84.166.194.254]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by submithost.informatik.uni-bremen.de (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 446kM20HHBz1Bp8; Sun, 24 Feb 2019 13:06:21 +0100 (CET) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Mime-Version: 1.0 (Mac OS X Mail 11.5 \(3445.9.1\)) From: Carsten Bormann In-Reply-To: Date: Sun, 24 Feb 2019 13:06:19 +0100 Cc: "core@ietf.org" , "t2trg@irtf.org" X-Mao-Original-Outgoing-Id: 572702777.597622-c24a2dd03a2e72f6d5bd3c8ce160b4cd Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Message-Id: <095ADBC4-3F53-46D1-9114-71344EB76B4B@tzi.org> References: To: Klaus Hartke X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.3445.9.1) Archived-At: Subject: Re: [core] CoRAL @ IETF104 X-BeenThere: core@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: "Constrained RESTful Environments \(CoRE\) Working Group list" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sun, 24 Feb 2019 12:06:34 -0000 On Feb 24, 2019, at 11:07, Klaus Hartke = wrote: >=20 > tentatively on Thursday in the first afternoon=20 > session. Rats! [sic] But this is probably an isolated conflict for very few of us, so this = slot may indeed be a good selection. Gr=C3=BC=C3=9Fe, Carsten From nobody Sun Feb 24 23:22:30 2019 Return-Path: X-Original-To: core@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: core@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1B169130E5B; Sun, 24 Feb 2019 23:22:28 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.599 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.599 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW=-0.7, SPF_PASS=-0.001, UNPARSEABLE_RELAY=0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 2JC2y_NgoG5A; Sun, 24 Feb 2019 23:22:26 -0800 (PST) Received: from orange.com (mta241.mail.business.static.orange.com [80.12.66.41]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher AECDH-AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 45BD1130E0A; Sun, 24 Feb 2019 23:22:26 -0800 (PST) Received: from opfedar05.francetelecom.fr (unknown [xx.xx.xx.7]) by opfedar21.francetelecom.fr (ESMTP service) with ESMTP id 447D0w2cDXz7ttX; Mon, 25 Feb 2019 08:22:24 +0100 (CET) Received: from Exchangemail-eme6.itn.ftgroup (unknown [xx.xx.13.92]) by opfedar05.francetelecom.fr (ESMTP service) with ESMTP id 447D0w1rR7z2xCT; Mon, 25 Feb 2019 08:22:24 +0100 (CET) Received: from OPEXCAUBMA2.corporate.adroot.infra.ftgroup ([fe80::e878:bd0:c89e:5b42]) by OPEXCAUBM34.corporate.adroot.infra.ftgroup ([fe80::7873:1668:636f:52c%21]) with mapi id 14.03.0435.000; Mon, 25 Feb 2019 08:22:24 +0100 From: To: Carsten Bormann , Jim Schaad CC: core , "draft-ietf-core-hop-limit@ietf.org" Thread-Topic: [core] Chair's review of draft-ietf-core-hop-limit-02.txt Thread-Index: AQHYz3v1ePoYqh77aS9g7esO8Fa65wKEfZudpdAsjoCAAHlDgIADS6DA Date: Mon, 25 Feb 2019 07:22:23 +0000 Message-ID: <787AE7BB302AE849A7480A190F8B93302EA24AAE@OPEXCAUBMA2.corporate.adroot.infra.ftgroup> References: <7185933E-6816-435E-B668-2DB1367C279E@tzi.org> <787AE7BB302AE849A7480A190F8B93302EA23CEA@OPEXCAUBMA2.corporate.adroot.infra.ftgroup> <039e01d4caf8$25b9c9e0$712d5da0$@augustcellars.com> In-Reply-To: Accept-Language: fr-FR, en-US Content-Language: fr-FR X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: x-originating-ip: [10.114.13.247] Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64 MIME-Version: 1.0 Archived-At: Subject: Re: [core] Chair's review of draft-ietf-core-hop-limit-02.txt X-BeenThere: core@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: "Constrained RESTful Environments \(CoRE\) Working Group list" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 25 Feb 2019 07:22:28 -0000 SGkgQ2Fyc3RlbiwgSmltLCBhbGwsDQoNCkkgZG8gYWdyZWUgd2l0aCBKaW0gdGhhdCBpdCBpcyBl YXJseSB0byBoYXZlIGEg4oCcU0hPVUxEIGRlcGxveeKAnSBsZXZlbC4gQXQgbGVhc3QgdGhhdCBp cyBub3QgdGhlIGludGVudCBvZiB0aGUgdGV4dCB3aGljaCB0cmlnZ2VyZWQgdGhlIGNvbW1lbnQu IA0KDQpUaGUgaW50ZW50IGlzIHRvIGFsbG93IGZvciBhIGNvbmZpZ3VyYWJsZSBiZWhhdmlvciBv ZiBwcm94aWVzIHdoaWNoIHN1cHBvcnQgdGhlIG9wdGlvbi4gVGhhdCB3b3JkaW5nIGNhbiBiZSB1 cGRhdGVkIHRvIGF2b2lkIG1pc2ludGVycHJldGF0aW9uLCBlLmcuLDoNCg0KT0xEOg0KICAgSWYg YSBDb0FQIHByb3h5IHJlY2VpdmVzIGEgcmVxdWVzdCB3aGljaCBkb2VzIG5vdCBpbmNsdWRlIGEg SG9wLUxpbWl0DQogICBvcHRpb24sIGl0IFNIT1VMRCBpbnNlcnQgYSBIb3AtTGltaXQgb3B0aW9u IHdoZW4gcmVsYXlpbmcgdGhlIHJlcXVlc3QNCiAgIHRvIGEgbmV4dCBob3AgKGFic2VudCBleHBs aWNpdCBwb2xpY3kvY29uZmlndXJhdGlvbiBvdGhlcndpc2UpLiANCg0KTkVXOg0KICAgQSBDb0FQ IHByb3h5IE1BWSBiZSBpbnN0cnVjdGVkLCB1c2luZyBhIGNvbmZpZ3VyYXRpb24gcGFyYW1ldGVy LCB0bw0KICAgaW5zZXJ0IGEgSG9wLUxpbWl0IG9wdGlvbiB3aGVuIHJlbGF5aW5nIGEgcmVxdWVz dCB3aGljaCBkbyBub3QNCiAgIGluY2x1ZGUgdGhlIEhvcC1MaW1pdCBvcHRpb24uDQoNCkNoZWVy cywNCk1lZA0KDQo+IC0tLS0tTWVzc2FnZSBkJ29yaWdpbmUtLS0tLQ0KPiBEZcKgOiBDYXJzdGVu IEJvcm1hbm4gW21haWx0bzpjYWJvQHR6aS5vcmddDQo+IEVudm95w6nCoDogc2FtZWRpIDIzIGbD qXZyaWVyIDIwMTkgMDY6NTgNCj4gw4DCoDogSmltIFNjaGFhZA0KPiBDY8KgOiBCT1VDQURBSVIg TW9oYW1lZCBUR0kvT0xOOyBjb3JlOyBkcmFmdC1pZXRmLWNvcmUtaG9wLWxpbWl0QGlldGYub3Jn DQo+IE9iamV0wqA6IFJlOiBbY29yZV0gQ2hhaXIncyByZXZpZXcgb2YgZHJhZnQtaWV0Zi1jb3Jl LWhvcC1saW1pdC0wMi50eHQNCj4gDQo+IE9uIEZlYiAyMiwgMjAxOSwgYXQgMjI6NDcsIEppbSBT Y2hhYWQgPGlldGZAYXVndXN0Y2VsbGFycy5jb20+IHdyb3RlOg0KPiA+DQo+ID4gTXkgZ3V0IGZl ZWxpbmcgaXMgdGhhdCB0aGUgYW5zd2VyIHNob3VsZCBiZSB5ZXMgaXQgc2hvdWxkIGJlY29tZSBh DQo+IHJlY29tbWVuZGVkIG9wdGlvbiBmb3IgYWxsIENvQVAgcHJveGllcy4gIEkgYW0gbm90IHN1 cmUgdGhhdCB0aGlzIGlzIHRoZSB0aW1lDQo+IGZvciB0aGF0IHRvIGhhcHBlbi4gIEkgdGhpbmsg dGhhdCBpbiB0aGUgbmV4dCBjb3VwbGUgb2YgeWVhcnMgdGhlcmUgbWF5IGJlIGENCj4gbGFyZ2Vy IG5lZWQgdG8gZGV2ZWxvcCBzb21lIEJDUHMgZm9yIHByb3hpZXMgYW5kIHRoYXQgd291bGQgYmUg dGhlIHRpbWUgdG8NCj4gbWFrZSB0aGUgcmVjb21tZW5kYXRpb24uDQo+IA0KPiBSaWdodC4gIFNv IHRoZSBzcGVjaWZpYyBxdWVzdGlvbiBmb3IgdGhlIFdHIGlzOg0KPiANCj4gQXJlIHdlIHJlYWR5 IHRvIHN0cm9uZ2x5IHJlY29tbWVuZCAob24gYSDigJxTSE9VTEQgZGVwbG954oCdIGxldmVsKSBo b3AtbGltaXQgYXMNCj4gb3VyIHByb3h5IGxvb3AgbWl0aWdhdGlvbiB0ZWNobmlxdWUgbm93Pw0K PiANCj4gT3Igc2hvdWxkIHdlIHdhaXQgd2l0aCBzdWNoIGEgcmVjb21tZW5kYXRpb24gdW50aWwg d2UgaGF2ZSBoYWQgYSBicm9hZGVyIHZpZXcNCj4gYXQgcHJveHkgcmVxdWlyZW1lbnRzPyAgKEUu Zy4sIHRoZW4sIE1BWUJFIHdlIG1pZ2h0IHdhbnQgdG8gZ28gZm9yIFZpYS1saWtlDQo+IGxvb3Ag cHJldmVudGlvbiBpbnN0ZWFkIOKAlCB2ZXJ5IGJpZyBNQVlCRSwgYXMgVmlhIGlzIGV4cGVuc2l2 ZSB3aXRoIElQdjYuKQ0KPiANCj4gSSBkb27igJl0IGhhdmUgYSBzdHJvbmcgb3BpbmlvbiBlaXRo ZXIgd2F5IGFuZCB0aGVyZWZvcmUgd291bGQgbGlrZSBzb21lIG1vcmUNCj4gZmVlZGJhY2sgZnJv bSB0aGUgV0cuDQo+IA0KPiBJbiBhbnkgY2FzZSwgdGhlIHBsYWNlIGluIERPVFMgd2hlcmUgaXQg c2F5cyBob3cgQ29BUCBpcyB1c2VkIGZvciBET1RTIHNob3VsZA0KPiBhbHNvIHNheSDigJxwbGVh c2UgZG8gZGVwbG95IGhvcC1saW1pdCB3aGVyZSBwcm94aWVzIGFyZSB1c2Vk4oCdIGluIHRoZSBz dHJlbmd0aA0KPiB0aGF0IHRoZSBET1RTIHBlb3BsZSBhcmUgY29tZm9ydGFibGUgd2l0aC4NCj4g DQo+IFdoaWxlIHRoZSBob3AtbGltaXQgZHJhZnQgaXMgbm90IGhlYXZpbHkgYXNzb2NpYXRlZCB3 aXRoIERPVFMsIG1heWJlIGl0IHdvdWxkDQo+IGJlIHVzZWZ1bCB0byBhZGQgc29tZSDigJxub3Qg anVzdCBmb3IgRE9UU+KAnSBsYW5ndWFnZSBhcyB3ZWxsIChhZnRlciBhbGwsIHRoYXQNCj4gd2Fz IHRoZSBwb2ludCBvZiBzcGxpdHRpbmcgaXQgb3V0KS4NCj4gDQo+IEdyw7zDn2UsIENhcnN0ZW4N Cg0K From nobody Mon Feb 25 02:40:51 2019 Return-Path: X-Original-To: core@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: core@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 69260130EC1 for ; 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Mon, 25 Feb 2019 10:40:42 +0000 From: Frank MATTHIAS KOVATSCH To: Carsten Bormann , Klaus Hartke CC: "t2trg@irtf.org" , "core@ietf.org" Thread-Topic: [core] CoRAL @ IETF104 Thread-Index: AdTMJaJppI2qLJJFQry5VUpOFoCoyQAE7c+AAC9JOJA= Date: Mon, 25 Feb 2019 10:40:42 +0000 Message-ID: References: <095ADBC4-3F53-46D1-9114-71344EB76B4B@tzi.org> In-Reply-To: <095ADBC4-3F53-46D1-9114-71344EB76B4B@tzi.org> Accept-Language: en-US Content-Language: en-US X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: x-originating-ip: [10.204.62.159] Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-CFilter-Loop: Reflected Archived-At: Subject: Re: [core] CoRAL @ IETF104 X-BeenThere: core@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: "Constrained RESTful Environments \(CoRE\) Working Group list" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 25 Feb 2019 10:40:50 -0000 PiBPbiBGZWIgMjQsIDIwMTksIGF0IDExOjA3LCBLbGF1cyBIYXJ0a2UgPGtsYXVzLmhhcnRrZUBl cmljc3Nvbi5jb20+IHdyb3RlOg0KPiA+DQo+ID4gdGVudGF0aXZlbHkgb24gVGh1cnNkYXkgaW4g dGhlIGZpcnN0IGFmdGVybm9vbiBzZXNzaW9uLg0KPiANCj4gUmF0cyEgW3NpY10NCg0KSSB3b3Vs ZCBhbHNvIHByZWZlciBhIGRpZmZlcmVudCBzbG90Li4uDQoNCkJlc3QsDQpNYXR0aGlhcw0K From nobody Tue Feb 26 03:20:01 2019 Return-Path: X-Original-To: core@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: core@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id A0916130E0A; 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Tue, 26 Feb 2019 03:19:55 -0800 (PST) X-Gm-Message-State: AHQUAuagrXvCkA+y0maVJpK0fSg/7sWFbeL0xIB1O1tBiViBO/K6PVQU Mu3EOl4g9g81MajwRZ8BaaQdBXBzH72AXGkzOGs= X-Google-Smtp-Source: AHgI3IYP/mdVElfHeaNF1u36U/TwTvgAzSr4CWG4A00QNNKZNMK5KpYIWN85ipbX681IQVq3BCr4k+lO4Wrtsxb0Oe0= X-Received: by 2002:a0c:81b4:: with SMTP id 49mr17329551qvd.144.1551179994469; Tue, 26 Feb 2019 03:19:54 -0800 (PST) MIME-Version: 1.0 References: <7185933E-6816-435E-B668-2DB1367C279E@tzi.org> <787AE7BB302AE849A7480A190F8B93302EA23CEA@OPEXCAUBMA2.corporate.adroot.infra.ftgroup> In-Reply-To: <787AE7BB302AE849A7480A190F8B93302EA23CEA@OPEXCAUBMA2.corporate.adroot.infra.ftgroup> From: Klaus Hartke Date: Tue, 26 Feb 2019 12:19:18 +0100 X-Gmail-Original-Message-ID: Message-ID: To: mohamed.boucadair@orange.com Cc: Carsten Bormann , core , "draft-ietf-core-hop-limit@ietf.org" Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" X-bounce-key: webpack.hosteurope.de; hartke@projectcool.de; 1551179998; 9fb11adc; X-HE-SMSGID: 1gyamB-0000Uz-L3 Archived-At: Subject: Re: [core] Chair's review of draft-ietf-core-hop-limit-02.txt X-BeenThere: core@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: "Constrained RESTful Environments \(CoRE\) Working Group list" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 26 Feb 2019 11:20:01 -0000 Mohamed Boucadair wrote: > Carsten Bormann wrote: > > 2. I don't understand the rule about using cached copies. As a > > general observation, rules like this should not simply be stated > > without a rationale why they are the way they are. I assume you're referring to this rule: A CoAP proxy which understands the Hop-Limit option MUST NOT use a stored response unless the value of the Hop-Limit option in the presented request is less than or equal to the value of the Hop-Limit option in the request used to obtain the stored response. (This matches the language in [1].) Let's say proxy receives a request and has a matching Hop Limit Reached error response in its cache. If the hop limit in the request is equal to the hop limit in the request for the stored response, then the stored error response can be returned. If the hop limit is less, then the stored error response can also be returned. (If 6 hops are not enough to reach the server, then 3 hops are also not enough.) If the hop limit is greater, then the stored error response cannot be returned. (The server might not be reachable in 6 hops, but it might be reachable in 7 hops.) (This assumes that the number of hops to reach a server doesn't change. If it changes, then a stored error response might be served incorrectly until its max-age expires.) I have to admit that I never checked if this also makes sense for stored responses that are not a Hop Limit Reached error response... Klaus [1] https://tools.ietf.org/html/rfc7252#section-5.6 From nobody Tue Feb 26 04:43:32 2019 Return-Path: X-Original-To: core@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: core@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 83049124C04; Tue, 26 Feb 2019 04:43:30 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=tcs.com Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id kd_Tw2lNFOuJ; Tue, 26 Feb 2019 04:43:25 -0800 (PST) Received: from indelg02.tcs.com (indelg02.tcs.com [203.200.109.58]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 100281200B3; 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i="5.58,415,1544466600"; d="scan'208,217"; a="37146468" X-DISCLAIMER: FALSE MIME-Version: 1.0 Sensitivity: Importance: Normal X-Priority: 3 (Normal) In-Reply-To: References: , <08d7924f-55c5-f89a-c2f6-cccb3fa4d071@gmail.com> <3c66d20e-2db2-7e15-6080-ce3646f848f6@gmail.com> <603fbed4-0a32-456e-7883-28dbbc9f8ca4@gmail.com> From: Abhijan Bhattacharyya To: Alexandre Petrescu Cc: Carsten Bormann , its@ietf.org, "core@ietf.org" , its Message-ID: Date: Tue, 26 Feb 2019 18:13:12 +0530 X-Mailer: Lotus Domino Web Server Release 9.0.1FP10HF213 April 26, 2018 X-MIMETrack: Serialize by http on InKolM02/TCS(Release 9.0.1FP10HF213 | April 26, 2018) at 02/26/2019 18:13:12, Serialize complete at 02/26/2019 18:13:13, Itemize by http on InKolM02/TCS(Release 9.0.1FP10HF213 | April 26, 2018) at 02/26/2019 18:13:13, Serialize by Router on InKolM02/TCS(Release 9.0.1FP10HF213 | April 26, 2018) at 02/26/2019 18:13:14, Serialize complete at 02/26/2019 18:13:14 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="=_alternative 0045DFCA652583AD_=" Archived-At: Subject: Re: [core] [ipwave] Adaptive RESTful Real-time Live Streaming for Things (A-REaLiST)' X-BeenThere: core@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: "Constrained RESTful Environments \(CoRE\) Working Group list" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 26 Feb 2019 12:43:31 -0000 --=_alternative 0045DFCA652583AD_= Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Hi Alex, >Thank you for the report. ..... I trust it and it is good for >video. Thank you. >The IPv6 (instead of IPv4) recommendation is not for providing better perf= ormance numbers (F, PSNR, latency) by using IPv6 instead of IPv4. >But it is for scaling up the laptop demonstrator to numerous drones and >access points outdoors where drones can fly, all while being connected to = the Internet. >Using IPv4 one may never be able to connect the drone-and-AP setting >in the outdoors, because there is no cellular operator that gives >enough >IP addresses for a scaleable setting.=20 > .............. For these reasons, that have little to do directly with v= ideo latency,=20 > one must consider seriously IPv6 for A-REaLiST. All your points are taken. We appreciate them as the fundamental considerat= ions for moving towards IPv6. Even India is now have an enormous IPv6 adopt= ion since the LTE roll-out. A-REaLiST, as mentioned earlier, is IP backbone= agnostic. >I am not sure 6LowPAN pipe is relevant for IPv6-over-OCB. Well, we never intended to say that we transfer video over 6LowPAN. We refe= rred to 6LowPAN just to highlight the fact that CoAP by design is compatibl= e with IPv6 and works well for sensors deploying 6LowPAN stack. >How is CoAP specified with respect to IPv6? MUST it use IPv6? Is it > >silent about the 'IPv6' keyword? ........=20 CoAP is an application layer protocol and can work on both IPv4 and IPv6. T= he specification (RFC 7252) has plenty of mentions about IPv6 (11 times in = the body of the specification. 5 more in the reference section). You may pl= ease check here (https://tools.ietf.org/html/rfc7252). Yes it is an end-to-end protocol. The end-points may connect directly (just= like what we did during the presented experiments) or you may go through v= ia proxies or gateways.=20 Traversing the NAT will be possible if you have the setting done through po= rt-mapping , etc. just like any other system. May be we can discuss more if we get a chance to meet face to face. Thank you. Happy to discuss more. With Best Regards Abhijan Bhattacharyya Consultant / Scientist, {Internet Protocols | 5G | Standardization},=20 TCS Research, Tata Consultancy Services Building 1B,Ecospace Plot - IIF/12 ,New Town, Rajarhat, Kolkata - 700160,West Bengal India Ph:- +91 33 66884691 Cell:- +919830468972 | +918583875003 Mailto: abhijan.bhattacharyya@tcs.com Website: http://www.tcs.com =5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F= =5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F Experience certainty. IT Services Business Solutions Consulting =5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F= =5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F -----"its" wrote: ----- >To: Abhijan Bhattacharyya >From: Alexandre Petrescu=20 >Sent by: "its"=20 >Date: 02/15/2019 06:24PM >Cc: Carsten Bormann , its@ietf.org, "core@ietf.org" >, its >Subject: Re: [ipwave] Adaptive RESTful Real-time Live Streaming for >Things (A-REaLiST)' > >"External email. Open with Caution" > >Abhijan, > >Thank you for the message. > >Le 14/02/2019 =E0 07:29, Abhijan Bhattacharyya a =E9crit : >[...] >> We made a PoC of the concept and the experimentation and outcomes >are >> presented in Pages 78-80 of=20 >> >https://datatracker.ietf.org/meeting/103/materials/slides-103-core-co >nsolidated-slides-07.pdf > > >Thank you for the report. > >It shows photo of testbed with laptops and raspberry Pis, and a >theoretical sketch of drone-to-access-point topology; it illustrates >that video streaming with A-REaLiST has better performance numbers >(F, >PSNR, latency) than HTTP Streaming. I trust it and it is good for >video. > >> But we used IPv4 pipe. While it is worth to do an experiment on how >> IPv6 improves the performance (it can only improve I believe). > >It is good you used IPv4 pipe initially. > >The IPv6 (instead of IPv4) recommendation is not for providing better >performance numbers (F, PSNR, latency) by using IPv6 instead of IPv4. >But it is for scaling up the laptop demonstrator to numerous drones >and >access points outdoors where drones can fly, all while being >connected >to the Internet. > >Using IPv4 one may never be able to connect the drone-and-AP setting >in >the outdoors, because there is no cellular operator that gives >enough >IP addresses for a scaleable setting. In certain countries it is >next >to impossible, whereas in others it is still possible but just for a=20 >little time. > >IPv4 and NAT may be a solution, but that begs the question whether >the >drone-and-AP setting using A-REaLiST protocol can work across NAT. I >can understand that A-REaLiST needs to initiate in just one direction > >(so it is compatible with NAT): video initiated from drone to >operator;=20 >but outdoors the operator must also initiate control to the drone, >tell=20 >it where exactly to point the camera - s/he will require you the >other=20 >direction to work too (send initial TCP/IP from control station to=20 >drone), and that is probably little compatible with NAT. > >For these reasons, that have little to do directly with video >latency,=20 >one must consider seriously IPv6 for A-REaLiST. > >> But otherwise there should not be much of an impact higher up by a >> change in the network layer because CoAP is designed with 6LowPAN >> pipe in consideration as already emphasised by Carsten. > >I am not sure 6LowPAN pipe is relevant for IPv6-over-OCB. I would >say=20 >it is not relevant at all. But it is just a 'would'. > >Yes, the 6LowPAN technology is some times used on 802.15.4 links. >The=20 >IPv6 technology without 6lowpan is some other times used on 802.15.4=20 >links too. > >> May be we can discuss at length if we get an opportunity to present >> this in a physical meeting. > >How is CoAP specified with respect to IPv6? MUST it use IPv6? Is it > >silent about the 'IPv6' keyword? > >How is CoAP specified with respect to directionality? Is CoAP=20 >compatible or incompatible with traversing NAT? > >How is CoAP specified with respect to end-to-end principles? MUST >CoAP=20 >use intermediary gateways? > >Alex > > >>=20 >> Thank you. >>=20 >> With Best Regards Abhijan Bhattacharyya Consultant / Scientist,=20 >> {Internet Protocols | 5G | Standardization}, TCS Research, Tata >> Consultancy Services Building 1B,Ecospace Plot - IIF/12 ,New Town, >> Rajarhat, Kolkata - 700160,West Bengal India Ph:- +91 33 66884691=20 >> Cell:- +919830468972 | +918583875003 Mailto: >> abhijan.bhattacharyya@tcs.com Website: http://www.tcs.com >> =5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F= =5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F= =5F=5F=5F=20 >> Experience certainty. IT Services Business Solutions=20 >> Consulting =5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F= =5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F >>=20 >>=20 >> "its" wrote on 02/08/2019 09:07:10 PM: >>=20 >>> From: "Alexandre Petrescu" To: >>> "Abhijan Bhattacharyya" , "Carsten >>> Bormann" Cc: "core@ietf.org" , >>> its@ietf.org Date: 02/08/2019 09:08 PM Subject: Re: [ipwave] >>> Adaptive RESTful Real-time Live Streaming for Things (A-REaLiST)'=20 >>> Sent by: "its" >>>=20 >>> "External email. Open with Caution" >>>=20 >>>=20 >>> Le 04/02/2019 =E0 20:00, Abhijan Bhattacharyya a =E9crit : >>>> Thank you Carsten for your comments. No one can speak about CoAP >>>>=20 >> better >>>> than you! >>>>=20 >>>> Alex, I have uploaded a new version of the draft. The links are >>>> given at the end of this mail. I have indeed tried to address >>>> your concern in >> respect >>>> to making the draft more "IPv6-relevant". >>>>=20 >>>> As Carsten rightly pointed out that the proposal works at the=20 >>>> application layer and is built on the foundation of CoAP, so it >>>> is Layer-3 agnostic. Also, as we all know, CoAP is designed for >>>> IPv6. However, implementation on IPv6 may influence the process >>>> of >> determining >>>> the maximum size of information segments. So, a new subsection >>>> has >> been >>>> added as part of the design guidelines. The small addition reads >>>> as >> below: >>>>=20 >>>> >>>>=20 >>>> 6.3. Determining the segment size >>>>=20 >>>> Size of the information segment in a CoAP message should be >>> limited by the least >>>> possible MTU for the end-to-end channel. This is to ensure >>> that there is no >>>> undesired conversation state at the lower layers of the >>> protocol stack due to >>>> uncontrolled fragmentation leading to undesired explosion of >>> traffic in the >>>> network. For IPV6 network, the MTU can be determined using >>> Path MTU Discovery >>>> (PMTUD) [RFC8201] which bestows the responsibility of >>> determining the path MTU on >>>> the end-points itself. >>>>=20 >>>> The size of the segment should be guided by the >>> recommendations as specified in >>>> Section 4.6 of [RFC7252]. >>>>=20 >>>> >>>>=20 >>>> I hope this will now satisfy the criterion of finding IPv6 in the >>>>=20 >> draft. >>>=20 >>> Thank you very much for this valuable action. >>>=20 >>> It is very worth taking into consideration. >>>=20 >>> From an implementation standpoint, I would like to learn whether >>> some prototype features RESTful Real-time Live Streaming on IPv6, >>> or not >> on IPv6. >>>=20 >>> Alex >>>=20 >>>>=20 >>>> Looping in CoRE list as well to announce the new version to the >>>> WG >> where >>>> this draft originates. >>>>=20 >>>> Thank you. >>>>=20 >>>> URL:=20 >>>> https://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-bhattacharyya-core-a- >>> realist-01.txt >>>> Status: >> >https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-bhattacharyya-core-a-realist/ >>>> Htmlized: >> https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-bhattacharyya-core-a-realist-01 >>>> Htmlized: >>>>=20 >> >https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/html/draft-bhattacharyya-core-a-real >ist >> >>=20 >>> Diff: >>>> >https://www.ietf.org/rfcdiff?url2=3Ddraft-bhattacharyya-core-a-realist- >01 >> >>>>=20 >>>=20 >>>>=20 >>>> With Best Regards Abhijan Bhattacharyya Consultant / Scientist,=20 >>>> {Internet Protocols | 5G | Standardization}, TCS Research, Tata >>>> Consultancy Services Building 1B,Ecospace Plot - IIF/12 ,New >>>> Town, Rajarhat, Kolkata - 700160,West Bengal India Ph:- +91 33 >>>> 66884691 Cell:- +919830468972 | +918583875003 Mailto: >>>> abhijan.bhattacharyya@tcs.com >> >>>> Website: http://www.tcs.com =20 >>>> =5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F= =5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F Experience >>>> certainty. IT Services Business Solutions Consulting=20 >>>> =5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F= =5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F >>>>=20 >>>>=20 >>>> -----"its" > >> wrote: ----- >>>> To: "Alexandre Petrescu" >>> > From: "Carsten Bormann"=20 >>>> Sent by: "its" Date: 01/31/2019 06:12PM Cc: "Abhijan >>>> Bhattacharyya" >>> >, "Michael Richardson"=20 >>>> >, its@ietf.org=20 >>>> Subject: Re: [ipwave] Adaptive RESTful >>>> Real-time Live Streaming for Things (A-REaLiST)' >>>>=20 >>>> "External email. Open with Caution" >>>>=20 >>>>> If TCP's state machine was a bottleneck, has one tried to use >>>>> UDP instead? >>>>=20 >>>> I think that is indeed one of the advantages CoAP brings go the >> table here. >>>>=20 >>>>> Does CoAP work on Ethernet? >>>>=20 >>>> CoAP was designed to be able to run on UDP, which is on IP which >>>> in >> turn >>>> works very well on Ethernet. >>>>=20 >>>>> Does CoAP work in an end-to-end manner or does it need >>>>> protocol conversion gateways? >>>>=20 >>>> I works end-to-end (as long as your network doesn’t break UDP). >>>>=20 >>>>> I want to ask you: please use IPv6 for CoAP and RESTful. >>>>=20 >>>> CoAP was designed to work well over IPv6 (but works as well over >>>> IPv4). >>>>=20 >>>>> Then I searched for the keyword ‘IPv6' in the draft. […] = If you >>>>> add ‘IPv6' considerations to it, then I will comment on it. >>>>=20 >>>> For a CoAP application such as A-REaLiST, IPv6 makes little >>>> difference (beyond being able to assign addresses to both ends in >>>> the first >> place), >>>> so I don’t know there is a lot to say. >>>>=20 >>>> Gr=FC=DFe, Carsten >>>>=20 >>>> =5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F= =5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F it= s mailing list=20 >>>> its@ietf.org =20 >>>> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/its >>>>=20 >>>> =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D-----=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D-----=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D Notice: The in= formation contained in >>>> this e-mail message and/or attachments to it may contain=20 >>>> confidential or privileged information. If you are not the >>>> intended recipient, any dissemination, use, review, distribution, >>>> printing or copying of the information contained in this e-mail >>>> message and/or attachments to it are strictly prohibited. If you >>>> have received this communication in error, please notify us by >>>> reply e-mail or telephone and immediately and permanently delete >>>> the message and any attachments. Thank you >>>>=20 >>>=20 >>> =5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F= =5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F it= s mailing list=20 >>> its@ietf.org https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/its >>>=20 > >=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F= =5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F >its mailing list >its@ietf.org >https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/its > --=_alternative 0045DFCA652583AD_= Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Type: text/html; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-ID: <>
Hi Alex,

>Thank you for the report. .....  I trust it and it is good for
>video.

Thank you.

>The IPv6 (instead of IPv4) recommendation is not for p= roviding better performance = numbers (F, PSNR, latency) by using IPv6 instead of IPv4.
>But it is fo= r scaling up the laptop demonstrator to numerous drones and
>access points outdoors where drones can = fly, all while being connect= ed to the Internet.>Using= IPv4 one may never be able to connect the drone-and-AP setting
>in = the outdoors, because there is no= cellular operator that gives
>enough >IP addresses for a scaleable setting. 
> ..............  For these reasons, that have little to do dir= ectly with video latency,&nb= sp;
> one must consider seriously IPv6 for A-REaLiST.

All your points are taken. We appreciate them as the fun= damental considerations for moving towards IPv6. Even India is now have an = enormous IPv6 adoption since the LTE roll-out. A-REaLiST, as mentioned earl= ier, is IP backbone agnostic.

>I am no= t sure 6LowPAN pipe is relevant for IPv6-over-OCB.
<= br>
Well, we never intended to say that we transfer video = over 6LowPAN. We referred to 6LowPAN just to highlight the fact that CoAP b= y design is compatible with IPv6 and works well for sensors deploying 6LowP= AN stack.

>H= ow is CoAP specified with respect to IPv6? MUST it use IPv6? Is it>
>s= ilent about the 'IPv6' keyword? ........ 

CoAP is an application la= yer protocol and can work on both IPv4 and IPv6. The specification (RFC 725= 2) has plenty of mentions about IPv6 (11 times in the body of the specifica= tion. 5 more in the reference section). You may please check here (https://tool= s.ietf.org/html/rfc7252).

Yes it is an end-to-= end protocol. The end-points may connect directly (just like what we did du= ring the presented experiments) or you may go through via proxies or gatewa= ys. 
Traversing the NAT will be possible if you have the set= ting done through port-mapping , etc. just like any other system.

May be we can discuss more if we get a chance to meet face = to face.

Thank you. Happy to discuss more.


With Best Regards
=0DAbhijan Bhattacharyya
=0DConsultant = / Scientist,
=0D{Interne= t Protocols | 5G | Standardization},
=0DTCS Res= earch,
=0DTata Consultancy Services
=0DBuilding 1B,Ecospace
=0DPlo= t -  IIF/12 ,New Town, Rajarhat,
=0DKolkata - 700160,West Bengal=0DIndia
=0DPh:- +91 33 66884691
=0DCell:- +919830468972 | +91858387= 5003
=0DMailto: abhijan.bhattacharyya@tcs.com
=0DWebsite: http://www.tcs.com
=0D=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F= =5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F= =5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F
=0DExperience certainty. IT Services
= =0D Business Solutions
=0D Consulting
=0D=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F= =5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F= =5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F
=0D


-----"its" <its-bounces@ietf.org> wrote: -----

>To: A= bhijan Bhattacharyya <abhijan.bhattacharyya@tcs.com>
>From: Alexa= ndre Petrescu
>Sent by: "its"
>Date: 02/15/2019 06:24PM
&g= t;Cc: Carsten Bormann <cabo@tzi.org>, its@ietf.org, "c= ore@ietf.org"
><core@ietf.org>, its <its-bounces@ietf.org>
>Subject: Re: [ip= wave] Adaptive RESTful Real-time Live Streaming for
>Things (A-REaLiS= T)'
>
>"External email. Open with Caution"
>
>Abhij= an,
>
>Thank you for the message.
>
>Le 14/02/2019 = =E0 07:29, Abhijan Bhattacharyya a =E9crit :
>[...]
>> We ma= de a PoC of the concept and the experimentation and outcomes
>are
= >> presented in Pages 78-80 of
>>
>https://datatracker.ietf.org/meeting/103/materials/slides-103-cor= e-co
>nsolidated-slides-07.pdf
>
>
>Thank you f= or the report.
>
>It shows photo of testbed with laptops and ra= spberry Pis, and a
>theoretical sketch of drone-to-access-point topol= ogy; it illustrates
>that video streaming with A-REaLiST has better p= erformance numbers
>(F,
>PSNR, latency) than HTTP Streaming. I= trust it and it is good for
>video.
>
>> But we used = IPv4 pipe. While it is worth to do an experiment on how
>> IPv6 im= proves the performance (it can only improve I believe).
>
>It i= s good you used IPv4 pipe initially.
>
>The IPv6 (instead of IP= v4) recommendation is not for providing better
>performance numbers (= F, PSNR, latency) by using IPv6 instead of IPv4.
>But it is for scali= ng up the laptop demonstrator to numerous drones
>and
>access p= oints outdoors where drones can fly, all while being
>connected
&g= t;to the Internet.
>
>Using IPv4 one may never be able to conne= ct the drone-and-AP setting
>in
>the outdoors, because there is= no cellular operator that gives
>enough
>IP addresses for a s= caleable setting. In certain countries it is
>next
>to impossi= ble, whereas in others it is still possible but just for a
>little t= ime.
>
>IPv4 and NAT may be a solution, but that begs the quest= ion whether
>the
>drone-and-AP setting using A-REaLiST protocol= can work across NAT. I
>can understand that A-REaLiST needs to init= iate in just one direction
>
>(so it is compatible with NAT): v= ideo initiated from drone to
>operator;
>but outdoors the oper= ator must also initiate control to the drone,
>tell
>it where = exactly to point the camera - s/he will require you the
>other
&g= t;direction to work too (send initial TCP/IP from control station to
&g= t;drone), and that is probably little compatible with NAT.
>
>F= or these reasons, that have little to do directly with video
>latency= ,
>one must consider seriously IPv6 for A-REaLiST.
>
>&g= t; But otherwise there should not be much of an impact higher up by a
&g= t;> change in the network layer because CoAP is designed with 6LowPAN>> pipe in consideration as already emphasised by Carsten.
>>I am not sure 6LowPAN pipe is relevant for IPv6-over-OCB. I would>say
>it is not relevant at all. But it is just a 'would'.
&= gt;
>Yes, the 6LowPAN technology is some times used on 802.15.4 links= .
>The
>IPv6 technology without 6lowpan is some other times us= ed on 802.15.4
>links too.
>
>> May be we can discuss= at length if we get an opportunity to present
>> this in a physic= al meeting.
>
>How is CoAP specified with respect to IPv6? MUS= T it use IPv6? Is it
>
>silent about the 'IPv6' keyword?
&g= t;
>How is CoAP specified with respect to directionality? Is CoAP >compatible or incompatible with traversing NAT?
>
>How is= CoAP specified with respect to end-to-end principles? MUST
>CoAP >use intermediary gateways?
>
>Alex
>
>
>= ;>
>> Thank you.
>>
>> With Best Regards Ab= hijan Bhattacharyya Consultant / Scientist,
>> {Internet Protocol= s | 5G | Standardization}, TCS Research, Tata
>> Consultancy Servi= ces Building 1B,Ecospace Plot - IIF/12 ,New Town,
>> Rajarhat, Ko= lkata - 700160,West Bengal India Ph:- +91 33 66884691
>> Cell:- += 919830468972 | +918583875003 Mailto:
>> abhijan.bhattacharyya@tcs.com Website: http://www.tc= s.com
>> <http://www.tcs.com/> =5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F= =5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F= =5F=5F=5F=5F=5F
>> Experience certainty. IT Services Busin= ess Solutions
>> Consulting =5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F= =5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F= =5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F
>>
>>
>> "its" <its-bounces@ietf.org= > wrote on 02/08/2019 09:07:10 PM:
>>
>>> From= : "Alexandre Petrescu" <alexandre.petrescu@gmail.com> To:
>>>= ; "Abhijan Bhattacharyya" <abhijan.bhattacharyya@tcs.com>, "Carsten
= >>> Bormann" <cabo@tzi.org> Cc: "core@ietf.org" <core@ietf.org>,
>>> its@ietf.org Date: 02/08/2019 09:08 PM Subjec= t: Re: [ipwave]
>>> Adaptive RESTful Real-time Live Streaming f= or Things (A-REaLiST)'
>>> Sent by: "its" <its-bounces@ietf.org>>>>
>>> "External email. Open with Caution"
>&= gt;>
>>>
>>> Le 04/02/2019 =E0 20:00, Abhijan = Bhattacharyya a =E9crit :
>>>> Thank you Carsten for your co= mments. No one can speak about CoAP
>>>>
>> better=
>>>> than you!
>>>>
>>>> Ale= x, I have uploaded a new version of the draft. The links are
>>>= ;> given at the end of this mail. I have indeed tried to address
>= >>> your concern in
>> respect
>>>> to mak= ing the draft more "IPv6-relevant".
>>>>
>>>>= ; As Carsten rightly pointed out that the proposal works at the
>>= ;>> application layer and is built on the foundation of CoAP, so it>>>> is Layer-3 agnostic. Also, as we all know, CoAP is desig= ned for
>>>> IPv6. However, implementation on IPv6 may influ= ence the process
>>>> of
>> determining
>>= >> the maximum size of information segments. So, a new subsection
= >>>> has
>> been
>>>> added as part of = the design guidelines. The small addition reads
>>>> as
&= gt;> below:
>>>>
>>>> <Quote>
&g= t;>>>
>>>> 6.3. Determining the segment size
&g= t;>>>
>>>> Size of the information segment in a Co= AP message should be
>>> limited by the least
>>>&g= t; possible MTU for the end-to-end channel. This is to ensure
>>&g= t; that there is no
>>>> undesired conversation state at the= lower layers of the
>>> protocol stack due to
>>>&= gt; uncontrolled fragmentation leading to undesired explosion of
>>= ;> traffic in the
>>>> network. For IPV6 network, the MTU= can be determined using
>>> Path MTU Discovery
>>>= > (PMTUD) [RFC8201] which bestows the responsibility of
>>> = determining the path MTU on
>>>> the end-points itself.
&= gt;>>>
>>>> The size of the segment should be guid= ed by the
>>> recommendations as specified in
>>>&g= t; Section 4.6 of [RFC7252].
>>>>
>>>> </= Quote>
>>>>
>>>> I hope this will now sat= isfy the criterion of finding IPv6 in the
>>>>
>> = draft.
>>>
>>> Thank you very much for this valuab= le action.
>>>
>>> It is very worth taking into co= nsideration.
>>>
>>> From an implementation standp= oint, I would like to learn whether
>>> some prototype features= RESTful Real-time Live Streaming on IPv6,
>>> or not
>&g= t; on IPv6.
>>>
>>> Alex
>>>
>&= gt;>>
>>>> Looping in CoRE list as well to announce t= he new version to the
>>>> WG
>> where
>>&= gt;> this draft originates.
>>>>
>>>> Tha= nk you.
>>>>
>>>> URL:
>>>> = https://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-bhattachar= yya-core-a-
>>> realist-01.txt
>>>> Status:<= br>>>
>https://datatracker.ietf.org/d= oc/draft-bhattacharyya-core-a-realist/
>>>> Htmlized:>> https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-bhattach= aryya-core-a-realist-01
>>>> Htmlized:
>>>&g= t;
>>
>https://datatracker.ietf.= org/doc/html/draft-bhattacharyya-core-a-real
>ist
>>
= >>
>>> Diff:
>>>>
>https://www.ietf.org/rfcdiff?url2=3Ddraft-bhattacharyya-core-= a-realist-
>01
>>
>>>>
>>> <= br>>>>>
>>>> With Best Regards Abhijan Bhattach= aryya Consultant / Scientist,
>>>> {Internet Protocols | 5G= | Standardization}, TCS Research, Tata
>>>> Consultancy Ser= vices Building 1B,Ecospace Plot - IIF/12 ,New
>>>> Town, Ra= jarhat, Kolkata - 700160,West Bengal India Ph:- +91 33
>>>> = 66884691 Cell:- +919830468972 | +918583875003 Mailto:
>>>> <= a href=3D"mailto:abhijan.bhattacharyya@tcs.com" target=3D"=5Fblank">abhijan= .bhattacharyya@tcs.com
>> <mailto:abhijan.bhattacharyya@tcs.com>
>>>> Website: http://www.tcs.com <http://www.tcs.com/>
>>>> =5F=5F= =5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F= =5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F Experience
>>&= gt;> certainty. IT Services Business Solutions Consulting
>>&g= t;> =5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F= =5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F
>&= gt;>>
>>>>
>>>> -----"its" <its-bounces@ietf.org<= /a> <mailto:= its-bounces@ietf.org>>
>> wrote: -----
>>>&g= t; To: "Alexandre Petrescu" <alexandre.petrescu@gmail.com
>>>&= gt; <mailto:alexandre.petrescu@gmail.com>> From: "Carsten Bormann" >>>> Sent by: "its" Date: 01/31/2019 06:12PM Cc: "Abhijan
= >>>> Bhattacharyya" <abhijan.bhattacharyya@tcs.com
>>= ;>> <mailto:abhijan.bhattacharyya@tcs.com>>, "Michael Richar= dson"
>>>> <mcr@sandelman.ca <mailto:mcr@sandelman.ca>>, its@ietf.org
>>>> <= ;mailto:its@ietf.org> Subject: Re: [ipwave] Adaptive RESTful
>>>> Real-time = Live Streaming for Things (A-REaLiST)'
>>>>
>>>= > "External email. Open with Caution"
>>>>
>>&g= t;>> If TCP's state machine was a bottleneck, has one tried to use>>>>> UDP instead?
>>>>
>>>>= I think that is indeed one of the advantages CoAP brings go the
>>= ; table here.
>>>>
>>>>> Does CoAP work o= n Ethernet?
>>>>
>>>> CoAP was designed to b= e able to run on UDP, which is on IP which
>>>> in
>&g= t; turn
>>>> works very well on Ethernet.
>>>>= ;
>>>>> Does CoAP work in an end-to-end manner or does i= t need
>>>>> protocol conversion gateways?
>>>= ;>
>>>> I works end-to-end (as long as your network does= n’t break UDP).
>>>>
>>>>> I want t= o ask you: please use IPv6 for CoAP and RESTful.
>>>>
&g= t;>>> CoAP was designed to work well over IPv6 (but works as well = over
>>>> IPv4).
>>>>
>>>>>= ; Then I searched for the keyword ‘IPv6' in the draft. […] If y= ou
>>>>> add ‘IPv6' considerations to it, then I wi= ll comment on it.
>>>>
>>>> For a CoAP appli= cation such as A-REaLiST, IPv6 makes little
>>>> difference = (beyond being able to assign addresses to both ends in
>>>> = the first
>> place),
>>>> so I don’t know the= re is a lot to say.
>>>>
>>>> Gr=FC=DFe, Car= sten
>>>>
>>>> =5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F= =5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F= =5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F its mailing list
>>>&g= t; its@ietf.org <= ;mailto:its@ietf.org>
>>>> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/its
= >>>>
>>>> =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D-----=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D--= ---=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D Notice: The information contained in
>>>>= this e-mail message and/or attachments to it may contain
>>>&= gt; confidential or privileged information. If you are not the
>>&= gt;> intended recipient, any dissemination, use, review, distribution,>>>> printing or copying of the information contained in this= e-mail
>>>> message and/or attachments to it are strictly p= rohibited. If you
>>>> have received this communication in e= rror, please notify us by
>>>> reply e-mail or telephone and= immediately and permanently delete
>>>> the message and any= attachments. Thank you
>>>>
>>>
>>&g= t; =5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F= =5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F its m= ailing list
>>> its@ietf.org https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/its
>= >>
>
>=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F= =5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F= =5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F
>its mailing list
>its@ietf.org
>https://www.ietf.org/mail= man/listinfo/its
> --=_alternative 0045DFCA652583AD_=-- From nobody Tue Feb 26 05:28:26 2019 Return-Path: X-Original-To: core@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: core@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 85255130E5D; Tue, 26 Feb 2019 05:28:23 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.6 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.6 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW=-0.7, SPF_PASS=-0.001, UNPARSEABLE_RELAY=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id yaaZrcAQj1g4; Tue, 26 Feb 2019 05:28:21 -0800 (PST) Received: from orange.com (mta240.mail.business.static.orange.com [80.12.66.40]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher AECDH-AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id C572E1200B3; Tue, 26 Feb 2019 05:28:20 -0800 (PST) Received: from opfedar03.francetelecom.fr (unknown [xx.xx.xx.5]) by opfedar20.francetelecom.fr (ESMTP service) with ESMTP id 44804g0X6Fz8tXP; 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charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64 MIME-Version: 1.0 Archived-At: Subject: Re: [core] Chair's review of draft-ietf-core-hop-limit-02.txt X-BeenThere: core@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: "Constrained RESTful Environments \(CoRE\) Working Group list" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 26 Feb 2019 13:28:24 -0000 SGkgS2xhdXMsIA0KDQpBZ3JlZS4gVGhlIHJlYXNvbmluZyBpcyBzdHJhaWdodGZvcndhcmQgZm9y IGVycm9yIGNvZGVzLiANCg0KRm9yIHRoZSBmZXcgY2FjaGVhYmxlIHN1Y2Nlc3MgY29kZXMsIHdl IG1haW50YWluZWQgdGhlIHNhbWUgd29yZGluZyBiZWNhdXNlIGEgY2hhbmdlIG9mIHRoZSBob3At bGltaXQgaXMgc2VlbiBhcyBhIGhpbnQgb2YgYSB0b3BvbG9neSBjaGFuZ2UgYW5kIHRodXMgYXMg YSB0cmlnZ2VyIHRvIGNoZWNrIHRoZSBmb3J3YXJkaW5nIHBhdGguIFRoZSBjb25kaXRpb25zIGFy ZSBhcyBmb2xsb3dzOiANCiogVGhlIGZvcndhcmRpbmcgcGF0aCBpcyBjaGFuZ2VkIGJldHdlZW4g dGhlIHByb3h5IGFuZCB0aGUgc2VydmVyIChlLmcuLCBhZGRpbmcgbmV3IHByb3hpZXMgdG8gdGhl IHBhdGgpLiBTdWNoIHBhdGggbWF5IG5vdCBiZSBsb29wLWZyZWUuIA0KKiBUaGUgY2xpZW50IGlz IGluZm9ybWVkIG91dCBvZiBiYW5kIHRvIGluY3JlYXNlIHRoZSBpbml0aWFsIGhvcCBsaW1pdCB0 byBhY2NvbW1vZGF0ZSB0aGUgaW5jcmVhc2Ugb2YgaG9wcy4NCg0KQ2hlZXJzLA0KTWVkDQoNCj4g LS0tLS1NZXNzYWdlIGQnb3JpZ2luZS0tLS0tDQo+IERlwqA6IEtsYXVzIEhhcnRrZSBbbWFpbHRv OmhhcnRrZUBwcm9qZWN0Y29vbC5kZV0NCj4gRW52b3nDqcKgOiBtYXJkaSAyNiBmw6l2cmllciAy MDE5IDEyOjE5DQo+IMOAwqA6IEJPVUNBREFJUiBNb2hhbWVkIFRHSS9PTE4NCj4gQ2PCoDogQ2Fy c3RlbiBCb3JtYW5uOyBjb3JlOyBkcmFmdC1pZXRmLWNvcmUtaG9wLWxpbWl0QGlldGYub3JnDQo+ IE9iamV0wqA6IFJlOiBbY29yZV0gQ2hhaXIncyByZXZpZXcgb2YgZHJhZnQtaWV0Zi1jb3JlLWhv cC1saW1pdC0wMi50eHQNCj4gDQo+IE1vaGFtZWQgQm91Y2FkYWlyIHdyb3RlOg0KPiA+IENhcnN0 ZW4gQm9ybWFubiB3cm90ZToNCj4gPiA+IDIuIEkgZG9uJ3QgdW5kZXJzdGFuZCB0aGUgcnVsZSBh Ym91dCB1c2luZyBjYWNoZWQgY29waWVzLiAgQXMgYQ0KPiA+ID4gICAgZ2VuZXJhbCBvYnNlcnZh dGlvbiwgcnVsZXMgbGlrZSB0aGlzIHNob3VsZCBub3Qgc2ltcGx5IGJlIHN0YXRlZA0KPiA+ID4g ICAgd2l0aG91dCBhIHJhdGlvbmFsZSB3aHkgdGhleSBhcmUgdGhlIHdheSB0aGV5IGFyZS4NCj4g DQo+IEkgYXNzdW1lIHlvdSdyZSByZWZlcnJpbmcgdG8gdGhpcyBydWxlOg0KPiANCj4gICAgQSBD b0FQIHByb3h5IHdoaWNoIHVuZGVyc3RhbmRzIHRoZSBIb3AtTGltaXQgb3B0aW9uIE1VU1QgTk9U IHVzZSBhDQo+ICAgIHN0b3JlZCByZXNwb25zZSB1bmxlc3MgdGhlIHZhbHVlIG9mIHRoZSBIb3At TGltaXQgb3B0aW9uIGluIHRoZQ0KPiAgICBwcmVzZW50ZWQgcmVxdWVzdCBpcyBsZXNzIHRoYW4g b3IgZXF1YWwgdG8gdGhlIHZhbHVlIG9mIHRoZSBIb3AtTGltaXQNCj4gICAgb3B0aW9uIGluIHRo ZSByZXF1ZXN0IHVzZWQgdG8gb2J0YWluIHRoZSBzdG9yZWQgcmVzcG9uc2UuDQo+IA0KPiAoVGhp cyBtYXRjaGVzIHRoZSBsYW5ndWFnZSBpbiBbMV0uKQ0KPiANCj4gTGV0J3Mgc2F5IHByb3h5IHJl Y2VpdmVzIGEgcmVxdWVzdCBhbmQgaGFzIGEgbWF0Y2hpbmcgSG9wIExpbWl0DQo+IFJlYWNoZWQg ZXJyb3IgcmVzcG9uc2UgaW4gaXRzIGNhY2hlLiBJZiB0aGUgaG9wIGxpbWl0IGluIHRoZSByZXF1 ZXN0DQo+IGlzIGVxdWFsIHRvIHRoZSBob3AgbGltaXQgaW4gdGhlIHJlcXVlc3QgZm9yIHRoZSBz dG9yZWQgcmVzcG9uc2UsIHRoZW4NCj4gdGhlIHN0b3JlZCBlcnJvciByZXNwb25zZSBjYW4gYmUg cmV0dXJuZWQuIElmIHRoZSBob3AgbGltaXQgaXMgbGVzcywNCj4gdGhlbiB0aGUgc3RvcmVkIGVy cm9yIHJlc3BvbnNlIGNhbiBhbHNvIGJlIHJldHVybmVkLiAoSWYgNiBob3BzIGFyZQ0KPiBub3Qg ZW5vdWdoIHRvIHJlYWNoIHRoZSBzZXJ2ZXIsIHRoZW4gMyBob3BzIGFyZSBhbHNvIG5vdCBlbm91 Z2guKSBJZg0KPiB0aGUgaG9wIGxpbWl0IGlzIGdyZWF0ZXIsIHRoZW4gdGhlIHN0b3JlZCBlcnJv ciByZXNwb25zZSBjYW5ub3QgYmUNCj4gcmV0dXJuZWQuIChUaGUgc2VydmVyIG1pZ2h0IG5vdCBi ZSByZWFjaGFibGUgaW4gNiBob3BzLCBidXQgaXQgbWlnaHQNCj4gYmUgcmVhY2hhYmxlIGluIDcg aG9wcy4pIChUaGlzIGFzc3VtZXMgdGhhdCB0aGUgbnVtYmVyIG9mIGhvcHMgdG8NCj4gcmVhY2gg YSBzZXJ2ZXIgZG9lc24ndCBjaGFuZ2UuIElmIGl0IGNoYW5nZXMsIHRoZW4gYSBzdG9yZWQgZXJy b3INCj4gcmVzcG9uc2UgbWlnaHQgYmUgc2VydmVkIGluY29ycmVjdGx5IHVudGlsIGl0cyBtYXgt YWdlIGV4cGlyZXMuKQ0KPiANCj4gSSBoYXZlIHRvIGFkbWl0IHRoYXQgSSBuZXZlciBjaGVja2Vk IGlmIHRoaXMgYWxzbyBtYWtlcyBzZW5zZSBmb3INCj4gc3RvcmVkIHJlc3BvbnNlcyB0aGF0IGFy ZSBub3QgYSBIb3AgTGltaXQgUmVhY2hlZCBlcnJvciByZXNwb25zZS4uLg0KPiANCj4gS2xhdXMN Cj4gDQo+IFsxXSBodHRwczovL3Rvb2xzLmlldGYub3JnL2h0bWwvcmZjNzI1MiNzZWN0aW9uLTUu Ng0K From nobody Tue Feb 26 06:30:43 2019 Return-Path: X-Original-To: core@ietf.org Delivered-To: core@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from ietfa.amsl.com (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id A99C5130E5D; Tue, 26 Feb 2019 06:30:41 -0800 (PST) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: internet-drafts@ietf.org To: Cc: core@ietf.org X-Test-IDTracker: no X-IETF-IDTracker: 6.92.1 Auto-Submitted: auto-generated Precedence: bulk Reply-To: core@ietf.org Message-ID: <155119144166.715.8098290688365269811@ietfa.amsl.com> Date: Tue, 26 Feb 2019 06:30:41 -0800 Archived-At: Subject: [core] I-D Action: draft-ietf-core-hop-limit-03.txt X-BeenThere: core@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 List-Id: "Constrained RESTful Environments \(CoRE\) Working Group list" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 26 Feb 2019 14:30:42 -0000 A New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line Internet-Drafts directories. This draft is a work item of the Constrained RESTful Environments WG of the IETF. Title : Constrained Application Protocol (CoAP) Hop Limit Option Authors : Mohamed Boucadair Tirumaleswar Reddy Jon Shallow Filename : draft-ietf-core-hop-limit-03.txt Pages : 6 Date : 2019-02-26 Abstract: The presence of Constrained Application Protocol (CoAP) proxies may lead to infinite forwarding loops, which is undesirable. To prevent and detect such loops, this document specifies the Hop-Limit CoAP option. The IETF datatracker status page for this draft is: https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-core-hop-limit/ There are also htmlized versions available at: https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-core-hop-limit-03 https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/html/draft-ietf-core-hop-limit-03 A diff from the previous version is available at: https://www.ietf.org/rfcdiff?url2=draft-ietf-core-hop-limit-03 Please note that it may take a couple of minutes from the time of submission until the htmlized version and diff are available at tools.ietf.org. Internet-Drafts are also available by anonymous FTP at: ftp://ftp.ietf.org/internet-drafts/ From nobody Tue Feb 26 06:40:30 2019 Return-Path: X-Original-To: core@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: core@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id D57C9130E5D for ; Tue, 26 Feb 2019 06:40:28 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.6 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.6 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW=-0.7, SPF_PASS=-0.001, UNPARSEABLE_RELAY=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id N-kX-KtQrjnr for ; Tue, 26 Feb 2019 06:40:26 -0800 (PST) Received: from orange.com (mta135.mail.business.static.orange.com [80.12.70.35]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher AECDH-AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 7DDDF128CE4 for ; Tue, 26 Feb 2019 06:40:26 -0800 (PST) Received: from opfednr00.francetelecom.fr (unknown [xx.xx.xx.64]) by opfednr25.francetelecom.fr (ESMTP service) with ESMTP id 4481gr68P9zCrq0; Tue, 26 Feb 2019 15:40:24 +0100 (CET) Received: from Exchangemail-eme6.itn.ftgroup (unknown [xx.xx.13.20]) by opfednr00.francetelecom.fr (ESMTP service) with ESMTP id 4481gr5VknzDq7h; Tue, 26 Feb 2019 15:40:24 +0100 (CET) Received: from OPEXCAUBMA2.corporate.adroot.infra.ftgroup ([fe80::e878:bd0:c89e:5b42]) by OPEXCAUBMA1.corporate.adroot.infra.ftgroup ([fe80::f04d:ad3c:61de:a175%21]) with mapi id 14.03.0435.000; Tue, 26 Feb 2019 15:40:24 +0100 From: To: "Carsten Bormann (cabo@tzi.org)" CC: "core@ietf.org" Thread-Topic: (Chair's review) TR: New Version Notification for draft-ietf-core-hop-limit-03.txt Thread-Index: AdTN4TH0Ek4X9B27QZ2qxYSm69RoRg== Date: Tue, 26 Feb 2019 14:40:23 +0000 Message-ID: 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XJjxZ5dMCpLVaiJCCCOr+QsY2FdVLwMAAA== Archived-At: Subject: Re: [core] Chair's review of draft-ietf-core-echo-request-tag-03.txt X-BeenThere: core@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: "Constrained RESTful Environments \(CoRE\) Working Group list" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 27 Feb 2019 15:13:22 -0000 SGkgQ2Fyc3RlbiwNCg0KVGhhbmtzIGZvciB5b3VyIHJldmlldyEgVGhlcmUgd2VyZSBhIGxvdCBh IGdvb2QgY29tbWVudHMuIEkgdXBkYXRlZCB0aGUgR2l0SHViIHZlcnNpb24gYmFzZWQgb24geW91 ciBjb21tZW50cy4NCg0KaHR0cHM6Ly90b29scy5pZXRmLm9yZy9yZmNkaWZmP3VybDE9aHR0cHM6 Ly90b29scy5pZXRmLm9yZy9pZC9kcmFmdC1pZXRmLWNvcmUtZWNoby1yZXF1ZXN0LXRhZy50eHQm dXJsMj1odHRwczovL2NvcmUtd2cuZ2l0aHViLmlvL2VjaG8tcmVxdWVzdC10YWcvZHJhZnQtaWV0 Zi1jb3JlLWVjaG8tcmVxdWVzdC10YWcudHh0DQoNCk9uIFdlZCwgRmViIDA2LCAyMDE5IGF0IDAz OjU4OjAyUE0gKzAxMDAsIENhcnN0ZW4gQm9ybWFubiB3cm90ZToNCg0KPiogVGl0bGUgYW5kIEFi 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JiVHucgRyghYW7WMR/q5p5g9xf4FR4KYP8feFo2HWFks0b9ufYq0Kw2KpdtVj5SU3VCFHu/wxsjl1Ib7m1hzWe/Z7g6cqWeaqk0XE4H/5703/YI8pk1e38eGiGU9EYul7OMU14JABYZgFFtqzHuvNxLTyD8OZpkR5iFrKPwbwxUUH5BqlT9BGvf283tPeu5dHYUTW6+jk0U1onGEPPePwXE96x5plbe6UAtvUf6XD2BTQftjieS58u9sQoW7eEn2PYrrz7iD7ULG1zWPoQUXoLVF/kyhwIpdgUT0ulaV+hDU877+JSCzw7fNgg6yT1iXdtwEi/1/Kyf89F7q/tlp0yL+bkeDVe0SqN3Ay0Tepz4Gu4Ry/hAP27USvioSbBTvqSONdqBYoXKC+u4fUV2dDhOaRP2bmBkLWYayhZLq/AU= Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="_000_BL0PR06MB504266C49731E364DB096A019A750BL0PR06MB5042namp_" MIME-Version: 1.0 X-OriginatorOrg: Trilliant.com X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-Network-Message-Id: 25407382-66aa-4faa-c485-08d69d1841e4 X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-originalarrivaltime: 28 Feb 2019 01:01:22.8050 (UTC) X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-fromentityheader: Hosted X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-id: 4f6fbd13-0dfb-4150-85c3-d43260c04309 X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-mailboxtype: HOSTED X-MS-Exchange-Transport-CrossTenantHeadersStamped: BL0PR06MB4803 Archived-At: Subject: [core] Use of CBOR tags in "draft-ietf-core-yang-cbor" X-BeenThere: core@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: "Constrained RESTful Environments \(CoRE\) Working Group list" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 28 Feb 2019 01:01:34 -0000 --_000_BL0PR06MB504266C49731E364DB096A019A750BL0PR06MB5042namp_ Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Hi YANG to CBOR users In some cases, using a SID instead of a delta can simplify implementations. My current specific use case is the encoding of an 'anydata' in a logger. This can be accomplished by tagging the SID with a specific CBOR tag. See example below. Another use case for CBOR tags is the encoding of a 'date-and-time' typedef= defined in https://tools.ietf.org/html/rfc6021#section-3 . This typedef is currently encoded using a 20 byte string (e.g. "2014-10-2= 6T12:16:31Z"). If we allow the use of the already existing 'Epoch-based date/time' tag, th= is information can be encoded using a 4 byte integer. See example below. YANG tree: +--ro logger* SID 1000524 +--ro notification anydata +--ro timestamp? SID 1000525 +--ro sequence-number SID 1000526 ---n yang-library-change SID 1000465 +--ro hash SID 1000466 CBOR diagnostic notation: { 1000524 : [ { SID tag(1000465) : { 1 : h'8A934D83672F309E' }, +1 : 1(1551296644), +2 : 123 } ] } CBOR encoding: A1 # map(1) 1A 000F444C # unsigned(1000524) 81 # array(1) A3 # map(3) D8 63 # tag(99) 1A 000F4411 # unsigned(1000465) A1 # map(1) 01 # unsigned(1) 48 # bytes(8) 8A934D83672F309E # "\x8A\x93M\x83g/0\x9E" 01 # unsigned(1) C1 # tag(1) 1A 5C76E884 # unsigned(1551296644) 02 # unsigned(2) 18 7B # unsigned(123) Question: * Should we support the 'Epoch-based date/time' tag in 'draft-ietf-core= -yang-cbor' ? * Should we support the 'Absolute SID' tag in 'draft-ietf-core-yang-cbo= r' ? * Is so, can we get this tag allocated by IANA only based on an IETF dr= aft? (Do we need to wait for the RFC) * Any other use cases for CBOR tags: * phys-address in ietf-yang-types (https://tools.ietf.org/html/rfc60= 21) ? * mac-address in ietf-yang-types (https://tools.ietf.org/html/rfc602= 1) ? Regards Michel Veillette --_000_BL0PR06MB504266C49731E364DB096A019A750BL0PR06MB5042namp_ Content-Type: text/html; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

Hi YANG to CBOR users

 

In some cases, using a SID inst= ead of a delta can simplify implementations.

My current specific use case is= the encoding of an 'anydata' in a logger.

This can be accomplished by tag= ging the SID with a specific CBOR tag.

See example below.

 

Another use case for CBOR tags = is the encoding of a 'date-and-time' typedef defined in https://tools.iet= f.org/html/rfc6021#section-3 .

This typedef is currently encod= ed using  a 20 byte string  (e.g. "2014-10-26T12:16:31Z"= ;).

If we allow the use of the already existing 'Epoch-b= ased date/time' tag, this information can be encoded using a 4 byte integer= .

See example below.<= /o:p>

 

YANG tree:

 

+--ro logger*     &n= bsp;          SID 1000524=  

   +--ro notification &nb= sp;      anydata

  +--ro timestamp?  =         SID 1000525

   +--ro sequence-number  = ;   SID 1000526

 

---n yang-library-change    &= nbsp;SID 1000465

   +--ro hash   = ;             S= ID 1000466

 

CBOR diagnostic notation:<= /o:p>

 

{

  1000524 : [

    {

      SID tag(1000465)= : {

        1= : h'8A934D83672F309E'

      },=

      +1 : 1(1551296644),

      +2 : 123<= o:p>

    }

  ]

}

 

CBOR encoding:

 

A1         &nb= sp;            =         # map(1)

   1A 000F444C      = ;            # unsig= ned(1000524)

   81       &n= bsp;            = ;       # array(1)

      A3    &n= bsp;            = ;       # map(3)

         D8 63 = ;            &n= bsp;    # tag(99)

          = ;  1A 000F4411         # unsig= ned(1000465)

         A1 &n= bsp;            = ;       # map(1)

          = ;  01           = ;       # unsigned(1)

          = ;  48           = ;       # bytes(8)

          = ;     8A934D83672F309E # "\x8A\x93M\x83g/0\x9E&quo= t;

         01 &n= bsp;            = ;       # unsigned(1)

         C1 &n= bsp;            = ;       # tag(1)

          = ;  1A 5C76E884         # unsig= ned(1551296644)

         02 &n= bsp;            = ;       # unsigned(2)

         18 7B         &= nbsp;        # unsigned(123)<= /span>

 

Question:

  • Should we support the 'Epoch-based date/time' tag in 'draft-ietf-core= -yang-cbor' ?
  • Should we su= pport the 'Absolute SID' tag in 'draft-ietf-core-yang-cbor' ?
  • Is so, can we get this tag allocated by IANA only based on an IETF d= raft? (Do we need to wait for the RFC)
  • Any other use cases for CBOR tags:

 

 

Regards

Michel Veillette

--_000_BL0PR06MB504266C49731E364DB096A019A750BL0PR06MB5042namp_-- From nobody Thu Feb 28 13:10:26 2019 Return-Path: X-Original-To: core@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: core@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8370D130FD9; Thu, 28 Feb 2019 13:10:23 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -0.92 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-0.92 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, FROM_EXCESS_BASE64=0.979, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=no autolearn_force=no Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id U7bhtMPjp6YS; Thu, 28 Feb 2019 13:10:20 -0800 (PST) Received: from prometheus.amsuess.com (alt.prometheus.amsuess.com [IPv6:2a01:4f8:190:3064::3]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ADH-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 33B67130FE8; Thu, 28 Feb 2019 13:10:13 -0800 (PST) Received: from poseidon-mailhub.amsuess.com (095129206250.cust.akis.net [95.129.206.250]) by prometheus.amsuess.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 03DA643614; Thu, 28 Feb 2019 22:10:10 +0100 (CET) Received: from poseidon-mailbox.amsuess.com (hermes.amsuess.com [10.13.13.254]) by poseidon-mailhub.amsuess.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 27ADA36; Thu, 28 Feb 2019 22:10:07 +0100 (CET) Received: from hephaistos.amsuess.com (hephaistos.amsuess.com [IPv6:2a02:b18:c13b:8010::71b]) by poseidon-mailbox.amsuess.com (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id D6A7C6A; Thu, 28 Feb 2019 22:10:06 +0100 (CET) Received: (nullmailer pid 797 invoked by uid 1000); Thu, 28 Feb 2019 21:10:06 -0000 Date: Thu, 28 Feb 2019 22:10:06 +0100 From: Christian =?iso-8859-1?B?TS4gQW1z/HNz?= To: Jaime =?iso-8859-1?Q?Jim=E9nez?= Cc: core , Carsten Bormann , "draft-ietf-core-resource-directory@ietf.org" Message-ID: <20190228211005.GD15212@hephaistos.amsuess.com> References: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/signed; micalg=pgp-sha256; protocol="application/pgp-signature"; boundary="ey/N+yb7u/X9mFhi" Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: User-Agent: Mutt/1.10.1 (2018-07-13) Archived-At: Subject: Re: [core] Chair's review of draft-ietf-core-resource-directory-19 X-BeenThere: core@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: "Constrained RESTful Environments \(CoRE\) Working Group list" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 28 Feb 2019 21:10:24 -0000 --ey/N+yb7u/X9mFhi Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Disposition: inline Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Hello Jaime, thanks for the review. I've rearranged them a bit to ease further processing, but will basically respond point-to-point: Asking back ----------- > p20 p28 p31 p38 and others - There does not seem to be a common way to > present REST interactions in the examples of the document. Please use > always the same form. For example similar to: >=20 > : -> > : > > : > >=20 > Which in markdown would look like: > ~~~~ > Int: EP -> IPv6 Multicast Address (FF0X::FE) or [MCD1] > Req: GET coap://[MCD1]/.well-known/core?rt=3Dcore.rd* > Res: 2.05 Content > ;rt=3D"core.rd";ct=3D40, > ;rt=3D"core.rd-lookup-ep";ct=3D40, > ;rt=3D"core.rd-lookup-res";ct=3D40, > ~~~~ >=20 > p23 - Sorry for asking, but why is base URI only mandatory when filled > by the Commissioning Tool? Wouldn't it be better to make it always > mandatory to avoid the differentiation? That'd require the registrant to find out its currently preferred IP address, keep track of it and serialize it -- something it may often not need to do for any other purpose. For example, non-TCP CoAP devices in a 6LoWPAN deployment can be sure to never need base URIs, and don't even need to consider at runtime when to update their base address as long as their registration lifetime is not "long-living" in RFC6879 terms (hours or days). Applications that talk to the device exclusively through the RD (such as LwM2M, or the extension at [1]) need the base URI to be absent, so not requiring the base URI also helps not conflicting with existing deployments. [1]: https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-amsuess-core-resource-directory-exte= nsions-00#section-2 > p26 - Section 5.3.1 seems like could use a bit of reordering, I can > explain this in another email or call with the authors. Looking forward to any suggestion. > p22 - Endpoint Name "mostly mandatory" is ambiguous. If the ep name is > not needed to register to an RD then it is optional. If, on the other > hand the RD needs an ep name and assigns one then it is mandatory ( > btw if the RD assigns the ep name, shouldn't it return that > information to the ep, together with the location within the rd, once > the registration is successful? ) The endpoint name is mandatory in the information model, but not always mandatory in the registration URI. As for the "mostly mandatory" phrase, I'll try to phrase that better (together with the base URI which is also mandatory or optional depending on some criteria). As for the device learning the endpoint name, my expectation is that that is bound to the security context (eg. for certificates, it can be the certificate identifier), so registrant and RD would already agree on it. A registrant can use the endpoint lookup interface to retrieve the ep name of its registration, but admittedly that's a bit intricate -- are there applications for a registrant learning its endpoint name that'd warrant adding mechanism to learn it more easily? > p41 p42 - Just to clarify, is then the tuple [endpoint,sector] the way > RD identifies endpoints? Or is it derived from the device's > credentials? > > - "A given endpoint that registers itself, needs to proof its > possession of its unique (endpoint name, sector) value pair." - "An > Endpoint (name, sector) pair is unique within the et of endpoints > registered by the RD. An Endpoint MUST NOT be identified by its > protocol, port or IP address as these may change over the lifetime of > an Endpoint." The tuple (endpoint name, sector) is how the RD identifies endpoints. It may learn the registrant's endpoint name and sector from explicit registration argumemts or from the the credentials. > p15 - I wonder why there is no DHCP/DHCP6 option to discover RD > defined, is there no interest by those deploying RD? If the authors > find it relevant, it could be added as a new draft or as part of this > one in a similar way as the RDAO option on a new section 4.2 AFAICT it just has not come up so there was no need to (given that in 6LoWPAN deployments TTBOMK the ND configuration is more prevalent). Do you know of any interested parties or setups? Otherwise the answer is probably still "no such option is defined at the time of writing" (but can be added easily by anyone later). Easy editorial fixes -------------------- > p1 - "Web interfaces" is often used interchangeably with "REST interfaces= " it'd be better to use one only, maybe the latter. > p6 - RDAO is under-defined in the terminology section, expanding the acro= nym is too short for a definition. > p6 - "Only information SHOULD be stored in the resource directory that ca= n be obtained by querying ..." could be "Information SHOULD be stored in th= e resource directory only if it can that can be obtained by querying ..." > p8 - The Commissioning Tool (CT) should be added to the architecture on t= he Registration Interface. > p6 - the last paragraph of Section 2 "For several operations.... circumst= ances" could probably go before the enumeration of the terminology. > p10 =E2=80=93 change content-type (ct)/content-format (ct) > p44 - typo address/Address Thanks, will be fixed by the next version. [193] Being discussed among authors ------------------------------- The questions I don't feel comfortable answering have been put into the authors' issue tracker. > p3 p12 - I think we could move on and update the term "machine-to-machine= " to "Internet of Things" throughout the document, unless there is a specif= ic need to keep M2M still there. [194] with suggestion for change > p33 - As per the document structure, there are two interfaces: registrati= on and lookup. Shouldn't they be at the same level in the document? Registr= ation is 5.3, shouldn't lookup be 5.5 instead of 6? [195] with suggestion for change > p30 - lt, base and extra-attrs were already explained in 5.3 you might > want to keep it as it is or change it by adding a reference to 5.3 and > comment on the changes that the Registration Update has over the > Registration. [196], though I don't really see yet what to do about it; I'll try for some text. > "The entries for "Failure" are quite repetitive for 4.00 and 5.03. Can we= factor these out a bit? > The entry "HTTP support" is surprising; maybe this item should be explain= ed beforehand. (It seems all it is saying is that HTTP does not do multicas= t or /.well-known/core?)" [191] as you mentioned; waiting for feedback from the authors. > Github Issue 190 (below) raises the need to define a bit better what the = ep name is supposed to contain. To me, we could keep it mandatory and add s= ome guidelines for its creation, in OMA for example they are defined as an = URN http://www.openmobilealliance.org/release/LightweightM2M/V1_1-20180710-= A/HTML-Version/OMA-TS-LightweightM2M_Core-V1_1-20180710-A.html#7-3-1-0-731-= Endpoint-Client-Name > "All we know from the draft is that it is =E2=89=A4 63 bytes. But we need= to say that it is a UTF-8 string. Not entirely sure we want =F0=9F=98=88= =F0=9F=91=84=F0=9F=91=BD as an endpoint name either. Same for sector." [190] as you mentioned; there's some things we'll definitely need to do (state it's UTF-8 or ASCII); outlawing Unicode by properties is tricky, and I wouldn't even know which ASCII characters to permit. I'm leaning towards allowing daemon-kissing aliens, but waiting for authors' opinions. > p3 - "with limited RAM and ROM" Adding a reference to the expected RAM > and ROM would be good. https://ieeexplore.ieee.org/document/6970748/ > provides an estimation of <2kB of minimum RAM and <30kB of minimum ROM > for common IoT OSs. [197], hoping anyone has more reliable numbers than I do. Thanks again; I'll follow up as the referenced issues bear fruit Christian [190]: https://github.com/core-wg/resource-directory/issues/190 [191]: https://github.com/core-wg/resource-directory/issues/191 [193]: https://github.com/core-wg/resource-directory/issues/193 [194]: https://github.com/core-wg/resource-directory/issues/194 [195]: https://github.com/core-wg/resource-directory/issues/195 [196]: https://github.com/core-wg/resource-directory/issues/196 [197]: https://github.com/core-wg/resource-directory/issues/197 --=20 To use raw power is to make yourself infinitely vulnerable to greater power= s. -- Bene Gesserit axiom --ey/N+yb7u/X9mFhi Content-Type: application/pgp-signature; name="signature.asc" -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- iQIzBAABCAAdFiEECM1tElX6OodcH7CWOY0REtOkveEFAlx4TioACgkQOY0REtOk veH2PBAAlO/TqwxHSPtIBi/gLdIarxaHqsdKqffsu+fDVW5hbb3sR17Kbsn9GC8i TQEBNsKkPr9uMI2fEj1szy6peG0esXfiPNrm3cDiQPScVVXPOTDD9HPHPD4p5nVY 9v9TmRHrIltdvmykHxNFygFrFvEmaIrt8TSzjYbopsNSZUoMw/fxRsikwHTpnAxg cA152aSxE4vbk/Cc+QvF2FNxGnQPRTeU6RJwdhnIHTrThFUgMt5JSFAGA/Xj4V1k /S96Yb3N9uQF2ENq3yyznlG9HWKYhfDg+4B92hgK656xzLiqpgbylqDxK7J+k5Hg t+XBogmE9nZE2p7+C8GjuWCoPM8q3kFo2tDklK2cgpMHDuHjkKYpkRa4LtSDUGEE M0PAkyEf8AKSplEtzwmQk3xQ3uvIX3ZYfj56vGDcmJAtWBz/vL3dc0sxpMLqWayp 1DaNQr5QF3vm2m8p6MN/6zSc8to7n77UkdMe03qZq6XhVvfWnia/cWuOXqfHz+MR nrVCc8C+XHNnvK6WQLsDXSNMr17/Wf6lxzsAYF5PlGivm7OKuAcktbvQcFE4Bycb iM8Ci/RjYSpgrviXFxF8MviVIdn4i+VUp6YjztmfiwWFzgjbZvd8cVMCFdEoIpn7 mlHFswMSKBiyVlyPi8Ec6qY0/LGsovXBR/7sv59t5eCzCiibsdk= =1PA7 -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --ey/N+yb7u/X9mFhi-- From nobody Thu Feb 28 18:51:50 2019 Return-Path: X-Original-To: core@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: core@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id BA093131132 for ; Thu, 28 Feb 2019 18:51:48 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.901 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.901 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE=-0.0001, SPF_PASS=-0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id Sytcynw40i1m for ; Thu, 28 Feb 2019 18:51:46 -0800 (PST) Received: from mail2.augustcellars.com (augustcellars.com [50.45.239.150]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 98AA7131131 for ; Thu, 28 Feb 2019 18:51:46 -0800 (PST) Received: from Jude (73.180.8.170) by mail2.augustcellars.com (192.168.0.56) with Microsoft SMTP Server (TLS) id 15.0.1395.4; Thu, 28 Feb 2019 18:51:00 -0800 From: Jim Schaad To: 'core' Date: Thu, 28 Feb 2019 18:50:57 -0800 Message-ID: <036f01d4cfd9$99b054f0$cd10fed0$@augustcellars.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook 16.0 Thread-Index: AdTP2Ol2S1ivo9DlQ9OP4mlzCK7U9A== Content-Language: en-us X-Originating-IP: [73.180.8.170] Archived-At: Subject: [core] Responses to PUB/SUB messages X-BeenThere: core@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: "Constrained RESTful Environments \(CoRE\) Working Group list" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 01 Mar 2019 02:51:49 -0000 I have ended up with an odd ball question about the Pub/Sub system. For the purpose of security, a message that goes to the pub/sub server is marked with a group identifier and a key identifier. This makes complete sense. The question that I have is there any concept of doing a response in some manner to something that is on a Pub/Sub server or does that just become a new publish? The concept exists for a multicast and the question exists can one simulate doing a multicast operation via a Pub/Sub server. Jim From nobody Thu Feb 28 23:33:53 2019 Return-Path: X-Original-To: core@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: core@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id E9E53129508 for ; Thu, 28 Feb 2019 23:33:51 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -4.199 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-4.199 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-2.3, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 6rz2GlOIRUFF for ; Thu, 28 Feb 2019 23:33:50 -0800 (PST) Received: from mailhost.informatik.uni-bremen.de (mailhost.informatik.uni-bremen.de [IPv6:2001:638:708:30c9::12]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 8CE58126C7E for ; Thu, 28 Feb 2019 23:33:49 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at informatik.uni-bremen.de Received: from submithost.informatik.uni-bremen.de (submithost2.informatik.uni-bremen.de [134.102.200.7]) by mailhost.informatik.uni-bremen.de (8.14.5/8.14.5) with ESMTP id x217Xemq017722 for ; Fri, 1 Mar 2019 08:33:45 +0100 (CET) Received: from [192.168.217.106] (p54A6C2FE.dip0.t-ipconnect.de [84.166.194.254]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by submithost.informatik.uni-bremen.de (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 449h443pNTz1Bp8; Fri, 1 Mar 2019 08:33:40 +0100 (CET) From: Carsten Bormann Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Mime-Version: 1.0 (Mac OS X Mail 11.5 \(3445.9.1\)) Date: Fri, 1 Mar 2019 08:33:37 +0100 Message-Id: To: core X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.3445.9.1) Archived-At: Subject: [core] New units for SenML X-BeenThere: core@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: "Constrained RESTful Environments \(CoRE\) Working Group list" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 01 Mar 2019 07:33:52 -0000 SenML (RFC 8428) has been a bit of a success story for this WG, at least = (but not only) with respect to pickup by other SDO. While we are = filling gaps in the specification itself (fetch/(i)patch, data-ct), = another item receives attention: SenML=E2=80=99s unit registry, which = can be useful for other SDOs even beyond the direct use of the SenML = data format. In this context, a few units popped up that are somewhat in style with = the Celsius exception that RFC 8428 provides. Instead of just having = them registered silently, maybe it is good to have some attention for = them here in the WG. To that end, based on input from OMA (but all = mistakes are mine), I have written a draft: Name: draft-bormann-senml-more-units Revision: 00 Title: Additional Units for SenML Document date: 2019-02-27 Group: Individual Submission Pages: 4 Status: = https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-bormann-senml-more-units/ Htmlized: = https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-bormann-senml-more-units-00 Abstract: The Sensor Measurement Lists (SenML) media type supports the indication of units for a quantity represented. This short document registers a number of additional unit names in the IANA registry for Units in SenML. Discussing physical quantities and their units may be not be the CoRE = WG=E2=80=99s center of gravity, but if you care about the integrity of = SenML, please have a look into this short draft. The IANA policies = allow us to go ahead with registration before this is an RFC (even = before any working group adoption!), which would fit well with OMA = timelines, so some feedback from the WG now would help getting that = right. Sorry for forgetting the WG name in the draft name and going directly to = the name senml =E2=80=94 news of a new SenML WG are greatly exaggerated = :-) Gr=C3=BC=C3=9Fe, Carsten