From bruno.chatras@orange.com Mon Oct 1 02:09:19 2012 Return-Path: X-Original-To: dispatch@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: dispatch@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id F35C421F85E6 for ; Mon, 1 Oct 2012 02:09:18 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.998 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.998 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-2.599, J_CHICKENPOX_33=0.6, UNPARSEABLE_RELAY=0.001] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.30]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id SflcxahbfMyP for ; Mon, 1 Oct 2012 02:09:17 -0700 (PDT) Received: from relais-inet.francetelecom.com (relais-ias91.francetelecom.com [193.251.215.91]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3612921F85C7 for ; Mon, 1 Oct 2012 02:09:17 -0700 (PDT) Received: from omfedm07.si.francetelecom.fr (unknown [xx.xx.xx.3]) by omfedm10.si.francetelecom.fr (ESMTP service) with ESMTP id 12B412640EB; Mon, 1 Oct 2012 11:09:16 +0200 (CEST) Received: from Exchangemail-eme1.itn.ftgroup (unknown [10.114.1.186]) by omfedm07.si.francetelecom.fr (ESMTP service) with ESMTP id E3F014C027; Mon, 1 Oct 2012 11:09:15 +0200 (CEST) Received: from PEXCVZYM12.corporate.adroot.infra.ftgroup ([fe80::81f:1640:4749:5d13]) by PEXCVZYH01.corporate.adroot.infra.ftgroup ([::1]) with mapi id 14.02.0298.004; Mon, 1 Oct 2012 11:09:15 +0200 From: To: David Hanes Thread-Topic: [dispatch] draft-hanes-dispatch-fax-capability-02 Thread-Index: AQHNm/xLee61c7fOckm+GPzevg+7wZecpraAgAAF24CAABo2gIADc9k1gAPzsyA= Date: Mon, 1 Oct 2012 09:09:15 +0000 Message-ID: <31903_1349082556_50695DBB_31903_5565_1_88CAD1D4E8773F42858B58CAA28272A008DD1F@PEXCVZYM12.corporate.adroot.infra.ftgroup> References: <201209111858.q8BIwvvW006046@freeze.ariadne.com> <506326B5.7090009@alum.mit.edu> <48CAA1D0-A0DE-4D1E-816E-6BB22902B4AD@cisco.com> <54633A5E61DC84429CB9FE3D9143C72118008EA7@MBX.dialogic.com> <23170_1348819872_50655BA0_23170_6953_2_88CAD1D4E8773F42858B58CAA28272A008C17C@PEXCVZYM12.corporate.adroot.infra.ftgroup> <1317445A-E2EF-4ECE-AFB9-F630A302236B@cisco.com> In-Reply-To: <1317445A-E2EF-4ECE-AFB9-F630A302236B@cisco.com> Accept-Language: fr-FR, en-US Content-Language: fr-FR X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: x-originating-ip: [10.197.38.6] Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-PMX-Version: 5.6.1.2065439, Antispam-Engine: 2.7.2.376379, Antispam-Data: 2012.10.1.81517 Cc: "Dale R. Worley" , DISPATCH Subject: Re: [dispatch] draft-hanes-dispatch-fax-capability-02 X-BeenThere: dispatch@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.12 Precedence: list List-Id: DISPATCH Working Group Mail List List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 01 Oct 2012 09:09:19 -0000 SGkgRGF2aWQsDQoNCkkgZG9uJ3Qgc2VlIGEgc3Ryb25nIG5lZWQgdG8gZXhwbGljaXRseSBtZW50 aW9uIEcuNzI2IChHLjcyNiBpcyBqdXN0IGFuIGV4YW1wbGUgYW55d2F5KSBidXQgSSBmaW5kIGEg Yml0IGNvbmZ1c2luZyB0byBjcmVhdGUgYSBkZWZpbml0aW9uIG9mIHBhc3MtdGhyb3VnaCB0aGF0 IGlzIG1vcmUgcmVzdHJpY3RpdmUgdGhhbiB0aGUgb25lIHVzZWQgaW4gVi4xNTIuIElmIHRoZXJl IGlzIGEgZ29vZCByZWFzb24gZm9yIGRvaW5nIHRoYXQsIEkgdGhpbmsgd2Ugc2hvdWxkIGV4cGxh aW4gaXQgc29tZXdoZXJlIGluIHRoZSBkcmFmdC4uLg0KDQpCQyANCg0KDQoNCj4gLS0tLS1NZXNz YWdlIGQnb3JpZ2luZS0tLS0tDQo+IERlwqA6IERhdmlkIEhhbmVzIFttYWlsdG86ZGhhbmVzQGNp c2NvLmNvbV0NCj4gRW52b3nDqcKgOiB2ZW5kcmVkaSAyOCBzZXB0ZW1icmUgMjAxMiAyMjozOQ0K 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IGZhbHNpZmllZC4KVGhhbmsgeW91LgoK From dhanes@cisco.com Mon Oct 1 13:49:48 2012 Return-Path: X-Original-To: dispatch@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: dispatch@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 59BD41F0D3F for ; Mon, 1 Oct 2012 13:49:48 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -10.149 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-10.149 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=-0.150, BAYES_00=-2.599, J_CHICKENPOX_33=0.6, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_HI=-8] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.30]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id WlFIQlkuSHUg for ; Mon, 1 Oct 2012 13:49:47 -0700 (PDT) Received: from av-tac-rtp.cisco.com (av-tac-rtp.cisco.com [64.102.19.209]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id CE4EC1F0D36 for ; Mon, 1 Oct 2012 13:49:46 -0700 (PDT) X-TACSUNS: Virus Scanned Received: from rooster.cisco.com (localhost.cisco.com [127.0.0.1]) by av-tac-rtp.cisco.com (8.13.8+Sun/8.13.8) with ESMTP id q91Knf0l013206; Mon, 1 Oct 2012 16:49:41 -0400 (EDT) Received: from rtp-dhanes-8911.cisco.com (rtp-dhanes-8911.cisco.com [10.117.39.194]) by rooster.cisco.com (8.13.8+Sun/8.13.8) with ESMTP id q91Kndq6029947; Mon, 1 Oct 2012 16:49:39 -0400 (EDT) Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v1084) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 From: David Hanes In-Reply-To: <31903_1349082556_50695DBB_31903_5565_1_88CAD1D4E8773F42858B58CAA28272A008DD1F@PEXCVZYM12.corporate.adroot.infra.ftgroup> Date: Mon, 1 Oct 2012 16:49:47 -0400 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Message-Id: References: <201209111858.q8BIwvvW006046@freeze.ariadne.com> <506326B5.7090009@alum.mit.edu> <48CAA1D0-A0DE-4D1E-816E-6BB22902B4AD@cisco.com> <54633A5E61DC84429CB9FE3D9143C72118008EA7@MBX.dialogic.com> <23170_1348819872_50655BA0_23170_6953_2_88CAD1D4E8773F42858B58CAA28272A008C17C@PEXCVZYM12.corporate.adroot.infra.ftgroup> <1317445A-E2EF-4ECE-AFB9-F630A302236B@cisco.com> <31903_1349082556_50695DBB_31903_5565_1_88CAD1D4E8773F42858B58CAA28272A008DD1F@PEXCVZYM12.corporate.adroot.infra.ftgroup> To: X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.1084) Cc: "Dale R. Worley" , DISPATCH Subject: Re: [dispatch] draft-hanes-dispatch-fax-capability-02 X-BeenThere: dispatch@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.12 Precedence: list List-Id: DISPATCH Working Group Mail List List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 01 Oct 2012 20:49:48 -0000 Hi Bruno, I will let other folks on this list who have an expertise in FoIP also = chime in here but I have never seen passthrough with G.726 implemented = in the real world and in my own lab testing it was not as reliable as = G.711. Also, the reference to V.152 is simply for implementation = assistance. The G.726 codec is not mentioned in the sections I reference = and I have not seen V.152 implemented in the real world either. My point = here is that in reality neither G.726 nor V.152 are practical = alternatives that have any sort of widespread adoption. So, I question = whether folks will find it confusing when in reality only G.711 is being = used for fax passthrough. In fact, I think you could make the argument = that bringing up G.726 or any other codec in this draft could actually = introduce some confusion.=20 The reason that we need to be restrictive on the codec is that if = multiple codecs are supported for passthrough then you could run into = the scenario where UAs express a preference for passthrough but they are = each using a different codec. This could lead to a mismatch scenario = where the fax call fails. With G.711 being the only codec for a = passthrough preference, then this scenario should not occur. I am not = sure that we want to create the ability to have UAs expressing a = passthrough preference with the potential for mismatched codecs. An = option here would be to explicitly define other passthrough codec = options but that seems unnecessary with G.711 being the de facto = standard. Another option would be to go down this path and then hope = that the UAs could negotiate a passthrough codec that works for both. = However, you still have the possibility of the UAs not agreeing on a = common passthrough codec. Restricting the codec to G.711 for passthrough = ensures that UAs that express a passthrough preference will be using the = same codec. I hope my thinking here makes sense and is inline with how = preferences are supposed to function.=20 -David On Oct 1, 2012, at 5:09 AM, wrote: > Hi David, >=20 > I don't see a strong need to explicitly mention G.726 (G.726 is just = an example anyway) but I find a bit confusing to create a definition of = pass-through that is more restrictive than the one used in V.152. If = there is a good reason for doing that, I think we should explain it = somewhere in the draft... >=20 > BC=20 >=20 >=20 >=20 >> -----Message d'origine----- >> De : David Hanes [mailto:dhanes@cisco.com] >> Envoy=C3=A9 : vendredi 28 septembre 2012 22:39 >> =C3=80 : CHATRAS Bruno RD-CORE >> Cc : James Rafferty; Gonzalo Salgueiro; Paul Kyzivat; Dale R. Worley; >> DISPATCH >> Objet : Re: [dispatch] draft-hanes-dispatch-fax-capability-02 >>=20 >>=20 >> Hi Bruno, >>=20 >> You are correct in that V.152 does propose G.726 as a passthrough = codec in >> addition to G.711. However, this draft only references sections 6 and = 6.1 of >> V.152 where G.726 is not mentioned and it states that a G.711 variant = is >> required at a minimum. Please correct me if I am wrong but in real = world >> scenarios I have only seen G.711 being used for passthrough and that = is why >> it is the codec explicitly defined. Are you recommending that G.726 = be >> included as an option in this draft? Or do you think we need more >> clarification that G.711 is the only codec that we are supporting = based on >> the reference to V.152? >>=20 >> Thanks, >> David >>=20 >>=20 >>=20 >>=20 >> On Sep 28, 2012, at 4:11 AM, >> wrote: >>=20 >>> The proposed definition for the pass-through mode assumes that G.711 = is >> used as a voice-band codec. This is indeed the most likely = configuration. >> However, as far as I can remember, the pass-through mode as described = in >> V.152 is not restricted to G.711 (e.g. G.726 is possible as well). >>> BC >>>=20 >>>> -----Message d'origine----- >>>> De : dispatch-bounces@ietf.org [mailto:dispatch-bounces@ietf.org] = De la >> part >>>> de James Rafferty >>>> Envoy=C3=A9 : mercredi 26 septembre 2012 19:56 >>>> =C3=80 : Gonzalo Salgueiro; Paul Kyzivat >>>> Cc : Dale R. Worley; DISPATCH >>>> Objet : Re: [dispatch] draft-hanes-dispatch-fax-capability-02 >>>>=20 >>>> +1 >>>>=20 >>>> James >>>>=20 >>>> -----Original Message----- >>>> From: dispatch-bounces@ietf.org [mailto:dispatch-bounces@ietf.org] = On >> Behalf >>>> Of Gonzalo Salgueiro >>>> Sent: Wednesday, September 26, 2012 12:22 PM >>>> To: Paul Kyzivat >>>> Cc: Dale R. Worley; DISPATCH >>>> Subject: Re: [dispatch] draft-hanes-dispatch-fax-capability-02 >>>>=20 >>>> +1 >>>>=20 >>>> Gonzalo >>>>=20 >>>> On Sep 26, 2012, at 12:00 PM, Paul Kyzivat wrote: >>>>=20 >>>>> This sounds pretty reasonable to me. >>>>>=20 >>>>> Thanks, >>>>> Paul >>>>>=20 >>>>> On 9/26/12 11:33 AM, David Hanes wrote: >>>>>> How about the following descriptions for T.38 and passthrough in = the >> IANA >>>> Considerations section? >>>>>>=20 >>>>>> t38: The device supports the image/t38 media type [RFC 3326] = and >>>> implements ITU-T T.38 for transporting the ITU-T T.30 and T.4 fax = data >> over >>>> IP. >>>>>>=20 >>>>>> passthrough: The device supports the audio/pcmu and audio/pcma = media >>>> types [RFC4856] for transporting ITU-T T.30 and T.4 fax data using = the >> ITU-T >>>> G.711 codec. Additional implementation recommendations are in ITU-T = V.152 >>>> Sections 6 and 6.1. >>>>>>=20 >>>>>> Thanks, >>>>>> David >>>>>>=20 >>>>>>=20 >>>>>>=20 >>>>>>=20 >>>>>>=20 >>>>>>=20 >>>>>> On Sep 11, 2012, at 2:58 PM, Dale R. Worley wrote: >>>>>>=20 >>>>>>>> From: David Hanes >>>>>>>>>=20 >>>>>>>>> The "t38" value is better described as "supports the image/t38 >>>>>>>>> media type[RFC3362] which encodes page images using the ITU-T = T.38 >>>>>>>>> fax protocol[T.38]". That specifies the media type and adds a >>>>>>>>> reference to the RFC, which includes more details of the = specific >>>>>>>>> ITU recommendations involved. There are probably some >>>>>>>>> implications of what values of the T.38 SDP attributes are >>>>>>>>> supported -- is there a default set of attributes which = constitute >>>>>>>>> a baseline version of image/t38? >>>>>>>=20 >>>>>>> (I can't remember if in the past I mistakenly considered the fax >>>>>>> media type to be application/t38 (which was proposed in >>>>>>> ietf-mmusic-sdp-t38-00), but the fact that the fax media type is >>>>>>> image/t38 makes it impossible to use the +sip.app-subtype media >>>>>>> feature tag to select fax-capable UAs.) >>>>>>>=20 >>>>>>>> I like the image/t38 media and RFC specifics that you added = above >>>>>>>> and I will include these updates in the next version. >>>>>>>=20 >>>>>>> Ideally, we should point to all the standards needed to define = the >>>>>>> feature (although in practice, in many respects there is only = one >>>>>>> practical way to implement this, so we could force people to = figure >>>>>>> things out for themselves). >>>>>>>=20 >>>>>>>> You also mention specific T.38 attributes. I am not aware of a >>>>>>>> default set of attribute values. It seems that each vendor has >>>>>>>> certain defaults but it is probably safe to say that many are >>>>>>>> commonly set the same. Thinking this through though, it seems = like >>>>>>>> the goal of this feature tag is to signal the preference that = the >>>>>>>> call lands at a fax capable, or more specifically in this case, = a >>>>>>>> T.38 capable UA. Once the T.38 capable UAs are connected, = shouldn't >>>>>>>> they handle the T.38 attribute exchange/negotiation within SDP? >>>>>>>> This is how it works now. It seems that just specifying T.38 = would >>>>>>>> be enough in this case and then the UAs can deal with the T.38 >>>> attribute settings within SDP. >>>>>>>=20 >>>>>>> Yes, I agree. >>>>>>>=20 >>>>>>> I wanted to ensure that +sip.fax would require a sufficient set = of >>>>>>> image/t38 features (expressed as T38* attributes) that any two = UAs >>>>>>> that met the specification would be able to communicate (at = least >>>>>>> with a "baseline" capability). Otherwise there could be = multiple, >>>>>>> incompatible groups of "sip.fax" UAs. That would indicate that = the >>>>>>> sip.fax values should be finer-grained than simply "t38". >>>>>>>=20 >>>>>>> But looking at the T.38 spec, annexes D and H, it appears to me = that >>>>>>> T.38 is designed for maximum negotiation and compatibility, and = so >>>>>>> there should be little risk of incompatibility if we do not = place >>>>>>> any requirements on the T38* attribute values that are = supported. >>>>>>>=20 >>>>>>>>> The definition of "passthrough" is incomplete as it stands. = The >>>>>>>>> meaning is "supports the audio/pcmu and audio/pcma media >>>>>>>>> types[RFC4856] for the transmission of fax images encoded >>>>>>>>> (somehow) as an analog audio stream, which is in turn encoded >>>>>>>>> using G.711". But what is the description of "somehow" and = the >> proper >>>> reference for it? >>>>>>>>=20 >>>>>>>> The "somehow" here is defined by ITU-T T.30, T.4, and T.6 and = these >>>>>>>> are modulated using common schemes like V.21 and V.17 so that = the >>>>>>>> fax communication is now an analog stream. I am not sure that = we >>>>>>>> need this level of detail though. This audio stream generation >>>>>>>> happens with every fax machine and gateway. Passthrough is very >>>>>>>> simple. We are just replacing human speech over G.711 with an >>>>>>>> analog fax stream. G.711 has been used on the PSTN for decades = on >>>>>>>> T1/E1 spans for handling voice and fax. Basically, when we use = the >>>>>>>> term passthrough, we are saying treat fax like a G.711 voice = call. >>>>>>>> With that being said, wouldn't just referencing G.711 be enough >>>>>>>> from a media feature tag and user preference perspective? >>>>>>>>=20 >>>>>>>>> I don't know fax technologies well enough to know what it is, >>>>>>>>> though I'm certain that there is a specific standard intended = here. >>>>>>>=20 >>>>>>> As I see it, there is a series of decoding steps: >>>>>>>=20 >>>>>>> - from the incoming RTP packets, the stream of PCM octets is >>>>>>> extracted based on the RTP standards >>>>>>>=20 >>>>>>> - from the PCM octets, an analog signal is constructed via G.711 >>>>>>> (PCMA or PCMU) >>>>>>>=20 >>>>>>> - from the analog signal, a bit stream is constructed via >>>>>>> V.21/V.17/V.* >>>>>>>=20 >>>>>>> - from the bit stream, a fax image is constructed via = T.30/T.4/T.6 >>>>>>>=20 >>>>>>> and encoding is done in the reverse order. >>>>>>>=20 >>>>>>> So to specify how meaning is encoded in the packets, you need to >>>>>>> specify that entire stack of standards. Or, to ensure >>>>>>> interoperability, you have to require implementation of a = minimal >>>>>>> subset of all those choices. >>>>>>>=20 >>>>>>> The reality is a bit messier, I think, because machines probably >>>>>>> negotiate which "modem" protocol they use (V.21, etc.), and they = may >>>>>>> negotiate which fax encoding they use. >>>>>>>=20 >>>>>>> But since fax machines work in practice, there is a standard (or = a >>>>>>> ubiquitous de-facto standard) that specifies the two higher = levels >>>>>>> of the encoding stack. >>>>>>>=20 >>>>>>> So I think it is necessary to provide specification of the two >>>>>>> higher levels, the "modem" encoding and the page encoding. But = I >>>>>>> strongly suspect that there are standards or well-understood = BCPs >>>>>>> that can be referenced -- without excluding any practical >>>>>>> implementation from being in conformance with "sip.fax". >>>>>>>=20 >>>>>>>>> Do we want to require PCMU and PCMA support, or PCMU *or* PCMA >>>>>>>>> support? >>>>>>>>=20 >>>>>>>> As with the T.38 SDP attributes, is this something that we want = to >>>>>>>> address in this draft or just leave it to the SDP portion? With >>>>>>>> only 2 codec options, you could have "passthrough-g711=CE=BC" = and >>>>>>>> "passthrough-g711a" values. However, in reality most folks >>>>>>>> implementing passthrough will accept either G.711 variety. >>>>>>>=20 >>>>>>> As I said above, I want to ensure that if a call that specifies >>>>>>> "sip.fax" arrives at a UA that registers with "sip.fax", then = the >>>>>>> fax call will succeed in practice. Otherwise, defining sip.fax >>>>>>> hasn't gained what we want. >>>>>>>=20 >>>>>>> But given that every SIP G.711 implementation I've ever seen >>>>>>> supports both PCMU and PCMA, I would suggest that we require = *both* >>>>>>> as part of the definition. With that, the definition ensures >>>>>>> interoperability, but it does not (in practice) further = constrain any >>>> implementation. >>>>>>>=20 >>>>>>>>> What encoding parameter values are required for support? I = expect >>>>>>>>> we want to add that the audio stream is single-channel and we >>>>>>>>> probably want to specify that it is at 8000Hz sample rate. >>>>>>>=20 >>>>>>> Or perhaps those parameters are effectively fixed by = T.4/T.6/T.30 >>>>>>> (regarding channels) and G.711 (for the bitrate). >>>>>>>=20 >>>>>>>>> Also, the reference to the T.38 spec is given as informative, >>>>>>>>> whereas it is used normatively. >>>>>>>>=20 >>>>>>>> Thanks. I will get that fixed in the next version. >>>>>>>=20 >>>>>>> Dale >>>>>>=20 >>>>>>=20 >>>>>=20 >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> dispatch mailing list >>>>> dispatch@ietf.org >>>>> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dispatch >>>>>=20 >>>>=20 >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> dispatch mailing list >>>> dispatch@ietf.org >>>> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dispatch >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> dispatch mailing list >>>> dispatch@ietf.org >>>> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dispatch >>>=20 >>>=20 >> = __________________________________________________________________________= __ >> _____________________________________________ >>>=20 >>> Ce message et ses pieces jointes peuvent contenir des informations >> confidentielles ou privilegiees et ne doivent donc >>> pas etre diffuses, exploites ou copies sans autorisation. Si vous = avez >> recu ce message par erreur, veuillez le signaler >>> a l'expediteur et le detruire ainsi que les pieces jointes. Les = messages >> electroniques etant susceptibles d'alteration, >>> France Telecom - Orange decline toute responsabilite si ce message a = ete >> altere, deforme ou falsifie. Merci. >>>=20 >>> This message and its attachments may contain confidential or = privileged >> information that may be protected by law; >>> they should not be distributed, used or copied without = authorisation. >>> If you have received this email in error, please notify the sender = and >> delete this message and its attachments. >>> As emails may be altered, France Telecom - Orange is not liable for >> messages that have been modified, changed or falsified. >>> Thank you. >>>=20 >>> _______________________________________________ >>> dispatch mailing list >>> dispatch@ietf.org >>> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dispatch >=20 >=20 > = __________________________________________________________________________= _______________________________________________ >=20 > Ce message et ses pieces jointes peuvent contenir des informations = confidentielles ou privilegiees et ne doivent donc > pas etre diffuses, exploites ou copies sans autorisation. Si vous avez = recu ce message par erreur, veuillez le signaler > a l'expediteur et le detruire ainsi que les pieces jointes. Les = messages electroniques etant susceptibles d'alteration, > France Telecom - Orange decline toute responsabilite si ce message a = ete altere, deforme ou falsifie. Merci. >=20 > This message and its attachments may contain confidential or = privileged information that may be protected by law; > they should not be distributed, used or copied without authorisation. > If you have received this email in error, please notify the sender and = delete this message and its attachments. > As emails may be altered, France Telecom - Orange is not liable for = messages that have been modified, changed or falsified. > Thank you. >=20 From john.atkinson@genband.com Tue Oct 2 06:38:43 2012 Return-Path: X-Original-To: dispatch@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: dispatch@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8F29521F8525 for ; Tue, 2 Oct 2012 06:38:43 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -5.999 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-5.999 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-2.599, J_CHICKENPOX_33=0.6, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-4] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.30]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id rdI1EZLBsVZu for ; Tue, 2 Oct 2012 06:38:42 -0700 (PDT) Received: from exprod7og126.obsmtp.com (exprod7og126.obsmtp.com [64.18.2.206]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 575A821F8505 for ; Tue, 2 Oct 2012 06:38:39 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail.genband.com ([63.149.188.88]) (using TLSv1) by exprod7ob126.postini.com ([64.18.6.12]) with SMTP ID DSNKUGruXiEpSavQwzdi3G9m+Nb1TY0xEozo@postini.com; Tue, 02 Oct 2012 06:38:41 PDT Received: from owa.genband.com ([172.16.21.97]) by mail.genband.com over TLS secured channel with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.4675); Tue, 2 Oct 2012 08:37:40 -0500 Received: from GBPLMAIL01.genband.com ([fe80::70bf:29d1:2cfe:42b5]) by GBEX01.genband.com ([::1]) with mapi id 14.02.0318.001; Tue, 2 Oct 2012 08:37:40 -0500 From: John Atkinson To: David Hanes , "bruno.chatras@orange.com" Thread-Topic: [dispatch] draft-hanes-dispatch-fax-capability-02 Thread-Index: AQHNoBZNNovlKh8YzUSalArUe3jNsJemBETQ Date: Tue, 2 Oct 2012 13:37:39 +0000 Message-ID: <585B1724B58FF74DB231F9B6CDD159F4E7803E0F@gbplmail01.genband.com> References: <201209111858.q8BIwvvW006046@freeze.ariadne.com> <506326B5.7090009@alum.mit.edu> <48CAA1D0-A0DE-4D1E-816E-6BB22902B4AD@cisco.com> <54633A5E61DC84429CB9FE3D9143C72118008EA7@MBX.dialogic.com> <23170_1348819872_50655BA0_23170_6953_2_88CAD1D4E8773F42858B58CAA28272A008C17C@PEXCVZYM12.corporate.adroot.infra.ftgroup> <1317445A-E2EF-4ECE-AFB9-F630A302236B@cisco.com> <31903_1349082556_50695DBB_31903_5565_1_88CAD1D4E8773F42858B58CAA28272A008DD1F@PEXCVZYM12.corporate.adroot.infra.ftgroup> In-Reply-To: Accept-Language: en-CA, en-US Content-Language: en-US X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: x-originating-ip: [99.224.119.7] Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-OriginalArrivalTime: 02 Oct 2012 13:37:40.0352 (UTC) FILETIME=[17D46000:01CDA0A3] X-TM-AS-Product-Ver: SMEX-8.0.0.4160-6.500.1024-19230.003 X-TM-AS-Result: No--42.959000-8.000000-31 X-TM-AS-User-Approved-Sender: No X-TM-AS-User-Blocked-Sender: No Cc: "Dale R. Worley" , DISPATCH Subject: Re: [dispatch] draft-hanes-dispatch-fax-capability-02 X-BeenThere: dispatch@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.12 Precedence: list List-Id: DISPATCH Working Group Mail List List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 02 Oct 2012 13:38:43 -0000 Ry43MjYgc3BlYyBzYXlzIHRoYXQgMzJrYnBzIGFkcGNtIG1heSBoYW5kbGUgIHVwIHRvIDI0MDBi cHMsIHNvIGl0IHdvbid0IGhhbmRsZSBmYXggdmVyeSB3ZWxsLiAgVGhlcmVmb3JlLCBJIGFncmVl IHRoYXQgd2UgZG9uJ3QgbmVlZCB0byBpbmNsdWRlIEcuNzI2LTMyIGFzIGEgcGFzc3Rocm91Z2gg YWx0ZXJuYXRpdmUuICBUaGUgcXVvdGUgZnJvbSBHLjcyNiBiZWxvdyBhbHNvIGluZGljYXRlcyBH LjcyNi00MCBjYW4gb25seSBoYW5kbGUgMTIwMDBicHMgLSBzbyBhZ2FpbiBub3Qgc3VpdGFibGUg Zm9yIGZheCBwYXNzdGhyb3VnaCANCg0KDQoNCkkuOCBEYXRhIHBlcmZvcm1hbmNlDQpWb2ljZWJh bmQgZGF0YSBwZXJmb3JtYW5jZSB1cCB0byAyNDAwIGJpdC9zIHVzaW5nLCBmb3IgZXhhbXBsZSBt b2RlbXMgY29uZm9ybWluZyB0bw0KUmVjb21tZW5kYXRpb24gVi4yMSwgVi4yMiBiaXMsIFYuMjMg 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b3RpZnkgdGhlIHNlbmRlciBhbmQgZGVsZXRlIHRoaXMgbWVzc2FnZSBhbmQgaXRzIGF0dGFjaG1l bnRzLg0KPiBBcyBlbWFpbHMgbWF5IGJlIGFsdGVyZWQsIEZyYW5jZSBUZWxlY29tIC0gT3Jhbmdl IGlzIG5vdCBsaWFibGUgZm9yIG1lc3NhZ2VzIHRoYXQgaGF2ZSBiZWVuIG1vZGlmaWVkLCBjaGFu Z2VkIG9yIGZhbHNpZmllZC4NCj4gVGhhbmsgeW91Lg0KPiANCg0KX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19f X19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX18NCmRpc3BhdGNoIG1haWxpbmcgbGlzdA0KZGlz cGF0Y2hAaWV0Zi5vcmcNCmh0dHBzOi8vd3d3LmlldGYub3JnL21haWxtYW4vbGlzdGluZm8vZGlz cGF0Y2gNCg== From gsalguei@cisco.com Tue Oct 2 08:00:49 2012 Return-Path: X-Original-To: dispatch@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: dispatch@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9EAE621F8505 for ; Tue, 2 Oct 2012 08:00:49 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -10.249 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-10.249 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=-0.250, BAYES_00=-2.599, J_CHICKENPOX_33=0.6, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_HI=-8] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.30]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id dSFxIQZfqKGQ for ; Tue, 2 Oct 2012 08:00:48 -0700 (PDT) Received: from av-tac-rtp.cisco.com (av-tac-rtp.cisco.com [64.102.19.209]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id C2D9521F8472 for ; Tue, 2 Oct 2012 08:00:42 -0700 (PDT) X-TACSUNS: Virus Scanned Received: from chook.cisco.com (localhost.cisco.com [127.0.0.1]) by av-tac-rtp.cisco.com (8.13.8+Sun/8.13.8) with ESMTP id q92F0fcK022056 for ; Tue, 2 Oct 2012 11:00:41 -0400 (EDT) Received: from dhcp-64-102-154-150.cisco.com (dhcp-64-102-154-150.cisco.com [64.102.154.150]) by chook.cisco.com (8.13.8+Sun/8.13.8) with ESMTP id q92F0eO3018163; Tue, 2 Oct 2012 11:00:40 -0400 (EDT) Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v1283) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 From: Gonzalo Salgueiro In-Reply-To: <585B1724B58FF74DB231F9B6CDD159F4E7803E0F@gbplmail01.genband.com> Date: Tue, 2 Oct 2012 11:00:42 -0400 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Message-Id: <8A7C5039-1BC8-4FD5-B0E2-B5758B1F21F6@cisco.com> References: <201209111858.q8BIwvvW006046@freeze.ariadne.com> <506326B5.7090009@alum.mit.edu> <48CAA1D0-A0DE-4D1E-816E-6BB22902B4AD@cisco.com> <54633A5E61DC84429CB9FE3D9143C72118008EA7@MBX.dialogic.com> <23170_1348819872_50655BA0_23170_6953_2_88CAD1D4E8773F42858B58CAA28272A008C17C@PEXCVZYM12.corporate.adroot.infra.ftgroup> <1317445A-E2EF-4ECE-AFB9-F630A302236B@cisco.com> <31903_1349082556_50695DBB_31903_5565_1_88CAD1D4E8773F42858B58CAA28272A008DD1F@PEXCVZYM12.corporate.adroot.infra.ftgroup> <585B1724B58FF74DB231F9B6CDD159F4E7803E0F@gbplmail01.genband.com> To: John Atkinson X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.1283) Cc: "Dale R. Worley" , DISPATCH Subject: Re: [dispatch] draft-hanes-dispatch-fax-capability-02 X-BeenThere: dispatch@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.12 Precedence: list List-Id: DISPATCH Working Group Mail List List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 02 Oct 2012 15:00:49 -0000 Thanks John. While you might be able to squeak by with 32k ADPCM, it is = far from ideal and certainly not recommended. The reality is passthrough = =3D> G.711, so the text should represent that. I really like the = proposed text and would prefer we move forward with that. Gonzalo On Oct 2, 2012, at 9:37 AM, John Atkinson wrote: > G.726 spec says that 32kbps adpcm may handle up to 2400bps, so it = won't handle fax very well. Therefore, I agree that we don't need to = include G.726-32 as a passthrough alternative. The quote from G.726 = below also indicates G.726-40 can only handle 12000bps - so again not = suitable for fax passthrough=20 >=20 >=20 >=20 > I.8 Data performance > Voiceband data performance up to 2400 bit/s using, for example modems = conforming to > Recommendation V.21, V.22 bis, V.23 and V.26 ter, will not be subject = to significant degradation over 32 kbit/s > ADPCM links provided the numbers of such links do not exceed the = limits of Recommendation G.113. > Voiceband data performance at 4800 bit/s using, for example modems = conforming to > Recommendation V.27 bis, can be accommodated with 32 kbit/s ADPCM but = will be subject to additional degradations > over and above that expected from standard 64 kbit/s PCM links. More = care will need to be exercised in using such a > service. > Voiceband data at speeds up to 12 000 bit/s can be accommodated by 40 = kbit/s ADPCM. The performance of > V.33 modems operating at 14 400 bit/s over 40 kbit/s ADPCM is for = further study. >=20 > John=20 >=20 > -----Original Message----- > From: dispatch-bounces@ietf.org [mailto:dispatch-bounces@ietf.org] On = Behalf Of David Hanes > Sent: Monday, October 01, 2012 4:50 PM > To: bruno.chatras@orange.com > Cc: Dale R. Worley; DISPATCH > Subject: Re: [dispatch] draft-hanes-dispatch-fax-capability-02 >=20 > Hi Bruno, >=20 > I will let other folks on this list who have an expertise in FoIP also = chime in here but I have never seen passthrough with G.726 implemented = in the real world and in my own lab testing it was not as reliable as = G.711. Also, the reference to V.152 is simply for implementation = assistance. The G.726 codec is not mentioned in the sections I reference = and I have not seen V.152 implemented in the real world either. My point = here is that in reality neither G.726 nor V.152 are practical = alternatives that have any sort of widespread adoption. So, I question = whether folks will find it confusing when in reality only G.711 is being = used for fax passthrough. In fact, I think you could make the argument = that bringing up G.726 or any other codec in this draft could actually = introduce some confusion.=20 >=20 > The reason that we need to be restrictive on the codec is that if = multiple codecs are supported for passthrough then you could run into = the scenario where UAs express a preference for passthrough but they are = each using a different codec. This could lead to a mismatch scenario = where the fax call fails. With G.711 being the only codec for a = passthrough preference, then this scenario should not occur. I am not = sure that we want to create the ability to have UAs expressing a = passthrough preference with the potential for mismatched codecs. An = option here would be to explicitly define other passthrough codec = options but that seems unnecessary with G.711 being the de facto = standard. Another option would be to go down this path and then hope = that the UAs could negotiate a passthrough codec that works for both. = However, you still have the possibility of the UAs not agreeing on a = common passthrough codec. Restricting the codec to G.711 for passthrough = ensures that UAs that express a passthrough preference will be using the = same codec. I hope my thinking here makes sense and is inline with how = preferences are supposed to function.=20 >=20 > -David >=20 >=20 >=20 > On Oct 1, 2012, at 5:09 AM, > wrote: >=20 >> Hi David, >>=20 >> I don't see a strong need to explicitly mention G.726 (G.726 is just = an example anyway) but I find a bit confusing to create a definition of = pass-through that is more restrictive than the one used in V.152. If = there is a good reason for doing that, I think we should explain it = somewhere in the draft... >>=20 >> BC >>=20 >>=20 >>=20 >>> -----Message d'origine----- >>> De : David Hanes [mailto:dhanes@cisco.com] Envoy=C3=A9 : vendredi 28=20= >>> septembre 2012 22:39 =C3=80 : CHATRAS Bruno RD-CORE Cc : James = Rafferty;=20 >>> Gonzalo Salgueiro; Paul Kyzivat; Dale R. Worley; DISPATCH Objet : = Re:=20 >>> [dispatch] draft-hanes-dispatch-fax-capability-02 >>>=20 >>>=20 >>> Hi Bruno, >>>=20 >>> You are correct in that V.152 does propose G.726 as a passthrough=20 >>> codec in addition to G.711. However, this draft only references=20 >>> sections 6 and 6.1 of >>> V.152 where G.726 is not mentioned and it states that a G.711 = variant=20 >>> is required at a minimum. Please correct me if I am wrong but in = real=20 >>> world scenarios I have only seen G.711 being used for passthrough = and=20 >>> that is why it is the codec explicitly defined. Are you recommending=20= >>> that G.726 be included as an option in this draft? Or do you think = we=20 >>> need more clarification that G.711 is the only codec that we are=20 >>> supporting based on the reference to V.152? >>>=20 >>> Thanks, >>> David >>>=20 >>>=20 >>>=20 >>>=20 >>> On Sep 28, 2012, at 4:11 AM, >>> wrote: >>>=20 >>>> The proposed definition for the pass-through mode assumes that = G.711=20 >>>> is >>> used as a voice-band codec. This is indeed the most likely = configuration. >>> However, as far as I can remember, the pass-through mode as = described=20 >>> in >>> V.152 is not restricted to G.711 (e.g. G.726 is possible as well). >>>> BC >>>>=20 >>>>> -----Message d'origine----- >>>>> De : dispatch-bounces@ietf.org [mailto:dispatch-bounces@ietf.org]=20= >>>>> De la >>> part >>>>> de James Rafferty >>>>> Envoy=C3=A9 : mercredi 26 septembre 2012 19:56 =C3=80 : Gonzalo = Salgueiro;=20 >>>>> Paul Kyzivat Cc : Dale R. Worley; DISPATCH Objet : Re: [dispatch]=20= >>>>> draft-hanes-dispatch-fax-capability-02 >>>>>=20 >>>>> +1 >>>>>=20 >>>>> James >>>>>=20 >>>>> -----Original Message----- >>>>> From: dispatch-bounces@ietf.org [mailto:dispatch-bounces@ietf.org]=20= >>>>> On >>> Behalf >>>>> Of Gonzalo Salgueiro >>>>> Sent: Wednesday, September 26, 2012 12:22 PM >>>>> To: Paul Kyzivat >>>>> Cc: Dale R. Worley; DISPATCH >>>>> Subject: Re: [dispatch] draft-hanes-dispatch-fax-capability-02 >>>>>=20 >>>>> +1 >>>>>=20 >>>>> Gonzalo >>>>>=20 >>>>> On Sep 26, 2012, at 12:00 PM, Paul Kyzivat wrote: >>>>>=20 >>>>>> This sounds pretty reasonable to me. >>>>>>=20 >>>>>> Thanks, >>>>>> Paul >>>>>>=20 >>>>>> On 9/26/12 11:33 AM, David Hanes wrote: >>>>>>> How about the following descriptions for T.38 and passthrough in=20= >>>>>>> the >>> IANA >>>>> Considerations section? >>>>>>>=20 >>>>>>> t38: The device supports the image/t38 media type [RFC 3326] = and >>>>> implements ITU-T T.38 for transporting the ITU-T T.30 and T.4 fax=20= >>>>> data >>> over >>>>> IP. >>>>>>>=20 >>>>>>> passthrough: The device supports the audio/pcmu and audio/pcma=20= >>>>>>> media >>>>> types [RFC4856] for transporting ITU-T T.30 and T.4 fax data using=20= >>>>> the >>> ITU-T >>>>> G.711 codec. Additional implementation recommendations are in = ITU-T=20 >>>>> V.152 Sections 6 and 6.1. >>>>>>>=20 >>>>>>> Thanks, >>>>>>> David >>>>>>>=20 >>>>>>>=20 >>>>>>>=20 >>>>>>>=20 >>>>>>>=20 >>>>>>>=20 >>>>>>> On Sep 11, 2012, at 2:58 PM, Dale R. Worley wrote: >>>>>>>=20 >>>>>>>>> From: David Hanes >>>>>>>>>>=20 >>>>>>>>>> The "t38" value is better described as "supports the = image/t38=20 >>>>>>>>>> media type[RFC3362] which encodes page images using the ITU-T=20= >>>>>>>>>> T.38 fax protocol[T.38]". That specifies the media type and=20= >>>>>>>>>> adds a reference to the RFC, which includes more details of=20= >>>>>>>>>> the specific ITU recommendations involved. There are = probably=20 >>>>>>>>>> some implications of what values of the T.38 SDP attributes=20= >>>>>>>>>> are supported -- is there a default set of attributes which=20= >>>>>>>>>> constitute a baseline version of image/t38? >>>>>>>>=20 >>>>>>>> (I can't remember if in the past I mistakenly considered the = fax=20 >>>>>>>> media type to be application/t38 (which was proposed in=20 >>>>>>>> ietf-mmusic-sdp-t38-00), but the fact that the fax media type = is >>>>>>>> image/t38 makes it impossible to use the +sip.app-subtype media=20= >>>>>>>> feature tag to select fax-capable UAs.) >>>>>>>>=20 >>>>>>>>> I like the image/t38 media and RFC specifics that you added=20 >>>>>>>>> above and I will include these updates in the next version. >>>>>>>>=20 >>>>>>>> Ideally, we should point to all the standards needed to define=20= >>>>>>>> the feature (although in practice, in many respects there is=20 >>>>>>>> only one practical way to implement this, so we could force=20 >>>>>>>> people to figure things out for themselves). >>>>>>>>=20 >>>>>>>>> You also mention specific T.38 attributes. I am not aware of a=20= >>>>>>>>> default set of attribute values. It seems that each vendor has=20= >>>>>>>>> certain defaults but it is probably safe to say that many are=20= >>>>>>>>> commonly set the same. Thinking this through though, it seems=20= >>>>>>>>> like the goal of this feature tag is to signal the preference=20= >>>>>>>>> that the call lands at a fax capable, or more specifically in=20= >>>>>>>>> this case, a >>>>>>>>> T.38 capable UA. Once the T.38 capable UAs are connected,=20 >>>>>>>>> shouldn't they handle the T.38 attribute exchange/negotiation = within SDP? >>>>>>>>> This is how it works now. It seems that just specifying T.38=20= >>>>>>>>> would be enough in this case and then the UAs can deal with = the=20 >>>>>>>>> T.38 >>>>> attribute settings within SDP. >>>>>>>>=20 >>>>>>>> Yes, I agree. >>>>>>>>=20 >>>>>>>> I wanted to ensure that +sip.fax would require a sufficient set=20= >>>>>>>> of >>>>>>>> image/t38 features (expressed as T38* attributes) that any two=20= >>>>>>>> UAs that met the specification would be able to communicate (at=20= >>>>>>>> least with a "baseline" capability). Otherwise there could be=20= >>>>>>>> multiple, incompatible groups of "sip.fax" UAs. That would=20 >>>>>>>> indicate that the sip.fax values should be finer-grained than = simply "t38". >>>>>>>>=20 >>>>>>>> But looking at the T.38 spec, annexes D and H, it appears to me=20= >>>>>>>> that >>>>>>>> T.38 is designed for maximum negotiation and compatibility, and=20= >>>>>>>> so there should be little risk of incompatibility if we do not=20= >>>>>>>> place any requirements on the T38* attribute values that are = supported. >>>>>>>>=20 >>>>>>>>>> The definition of "passthrough" is incomplete as it stands. =20= >>>>>>>>>> The meaning is "supports the audio/pcmu and audio/pcma media=20= >>>>>>>>>> types[RFC4856] for the transmission of fax images encoded >>>>>>>>>> (somehow) as an analog audio stream, which is in turn encoded=20= >>>>>>>>>> using G.711". But what is the description of "somehow" and=20= >>>>>>>>>> the >>> proper >>>>> reference for it? >>>>>>>>>=20 >>>>>>>>> The "somehow" here is defined by ITU-T T.30, T.4, and T.6 and=20= >>>>>>>>> these are modulated using common schemes like V.21 and V.17 so=20= >>>>>>>>> that the fax communication is now an analog stream. I am not=20= >>>>>>>>> sure that we need this level of detail though. This audio=20 >>>>>>>>> stream generation happens with every fax machine and gateway.=20= >>>>>>>>> Passthrough is very simple. We are just replacing human speech=20= >>>>>>>>> over G.711 with an analog fax stream. G.711 has been used on=20= >>>>>>>>> the PSTN for decades on >>>>>>>>> T1/E1 spans for handling voice and fax. Basically, when we use=20= >>>>>>>>> the term passthrough, we are saying treat fax like a G.711 = voice call. >>>>>>>>> With that being said, wouldn't just referencing G.711 be = enough=20 >>>>>>>>> from a media feature tag and user preference perspective? >>>>>>>>>=20 >>>>>>>>>> I don't know fax technologies well enough to know what it is,=20= >>>>>>>>>> though I'm certain that there is a specific standard intended = here. >>>>>>>>=20 >>>>>>>> As I see it, there is a series of decoding steps: >>>>>>>>=20 >>>>>>>> - from the incoming RTP packets, the stream of PCM octets is=20 >>>>>>>> extracted based on the RTP standards >>>>>>>>=20 >>>>>>>> - from the PCM octets, an analog signal is constructed via = G.711=20 >>>>>>>> (PCMA or PCMU) >>>>>>>>=20 >>>>>>>> - from the analog signal, a bit stream is constructed via >>>>>>>> V.21/V.17/V.* >>>>>>>>=20 >>>>>>>> - from the bit stream, a fax image is constructed via=20 >>>>>>>> T.30/T.4/T.6 >>>>>>>>=20 >>>>>>>> and encoding is done in the reverse order. >>>>>>>>=20 >>>>>>>> So to specify how meaning is encoded in the packets, you need = to=20 >>>>>>>> specify that entire stack of standards. Or, to ensure=20 >>>>>>>> interoperability, you have to require implementation of a=20 >>>>>>>> minimal subset of all those choices. >>>>>>>>=20 >>>>>>>> The reality is a bit messier, I think, because machines = probably=20 >>>>>>>> negotiate which "modem" protocol they use (V.21, etc.), and = they=20 >>>>>>>> may negotiate which fax encoding they use. >>>>>>>>=20 >>>>>>>> But since fax machines work in practice, there is a standard = (or=20 >>>>>>>> a ubiquitous de-facto standard) that specifies the two higher=20= >>>>>>>> levels of the encoding stack. >>>>>>>>=20 >>>>>>>> So I think it is necessary to provide specification of the two=20= >>>>>>>> higher levels, the "modem" encoding and the page encoding. But=20= >>>>>>>> I strongly suspect that there are standards or well-understood=20= >>>>>>>> BCPs that can be referenced -- without excluding any practical=20= >>>>>>>> implementation from being in conformance with "sip.fax". >>>>>>>>=20 >>>>>>>>>> Do we want to require PCMU and PCMA support, or PCMU *or* = PCMA=20 >>>>>>>>>> support? >>>>>>>>>=20 >>>>>>>>> As with the T.38 SDP attributes, is this something that we = want=20 >>>>>>>>> to address in this draft or just leave it to the SDP portion?=20= >>>>>>>>> With only 2 codec options, you could have "passthrough-g711=CE=BC= "=20 >>>>>>>>> and "passthrough-g711a" values. However, in reality most folks=20= >>>>>>>>> implementing passthrough will accept either G.711 variety. >>>>>>>>=20 >>>>>>>> As I said above, I want to ensure that if a call that specifies=20= >>>>>>>> "sip.fax" arrives at a UA that registers with "sip.fax", then=20= >>>>>>>> the fax call will succeed in practice. Otherwise, defining=20 >>>>>>>> sip.fax hasn't gained what we want. >>>>>>>>=20 >>>>>>>> But given that every SIP G.711 implementation I've ever seen=20 >>>>>>>> supports both PCMU and PCMA, I would suggest that we require=20 >>>>>>>> *both* as part of the definition. With that, the definition=20 >>>>>>>> ensures interoperability, but it does not (in practice) further=20= >>>>>>>> constrain any >>>>> implementation. >>>>>>>>=20 >>>>>>>>>> What encoding parameter values are required for support? I=20= >>>>>>>>>> expect we want to add that the audio stream is single-channel=20= >>>>>>>>>> and we probably want to specify that it is at 8000Hz sample = rate. >>>>>>>>=20 >>>>>>>> Or perhaps those parameters are effectively fixed by=20 >>>>>>>> T.4/T.6/T.30 (regarding channels) and G.711 (for the bitrate). >>>>>>>>=20 >>>>>>>>>> Also, the reference to the T.38 spec is given as informative,=20= >>>>>>>>>> whereas it is used normatively. >>>>>>>>>=20 >>>>>>>>> Thanks. I will get that fixed in the next version. >>>>>>>>=20 >>>>>>>> Dale >>>>>>>=20 >>>>>>>=20 >>>>>>=20 >>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>> dispatch mailing list >>>>>> dispatch@ietf.org >>>>>> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dispatch >>>>>>=20 >>>>>=20 >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> dispatch mailing list >>>>> dispatch@ietf.org >>>>> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dispatch >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> dispatch mailing list >>>>> dispatch@ietf.org >>>>> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dispatch >>>>=20 >>>>=20 >>> = _____________________________________________________________________ >>> _______ _____________________________________________ >>>>=20 >>>> Ce message et ses pieces jointes peuvent contenir des informations >>> confidentielles ou privilegiees et ne doivent donc >>>> pas etre diffuses, exploites ou copies sans autorisation. Si vous=20= >>>> avez >>> recu ce message par erreur, veuillez le signaler >>>> a l'expediteur et le detruire ainsi que les pieces jointes. Les=20 >>>> messages >>> electroniques etant susceptibles d'alteration, >>>> France Telecom - Orange decline toute responsabilite si ce message = a=20 >>>> ete >>> altere, deforme ou falsifie. Merci. >>>>=20 >>>> This message and its attachments may contain confidential or=20 >>>> privileged >>> information that may be protected by law; >>>> they should not be distributed, used or copied without = authorisation. >>>> If you have received this email in error, please notify the sender=20= >>>> and >>> delete this message and its attachments. >>>> As emails may be altered, France Telecom - Orange is not liable for >>> messages that have been modified, changed or falsified. >>>> Thank you. >>>>=20 >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> dispatch mailing list >>>> dispatch@ietf.org >>>> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dispatch >>=20 >>=20 >> = ______________________________________________________________________ >> ___________________________________________________ >>=20 >> Ce message et ses pieces jointes peuvent contenir des informations=20 >> confidentielles ou privilegiees et ne doivent donc pas etre diffuses,=20= >> exploites ou copies sans autorisation. Si vous avez recu ce message=20= >> par erreur, veuillez le signaler a l'expediteur et le detruire ainsi = que les pieces jointes. Les messages electroniques etant susceptibles = d'alteration, France Telecom - Orange decline toute responsabilite si ce = message a ete altere, deforme ou falsifie. Merci. >>=20 >> This message and its attachments may contain confidential or=20 >> privileged information that may be protected by law; they should not = be distributed, used or copied without authorisation. >> If you have received this email in error, please notify the sender = and delete this message and its attachments. >> As emails may be altered, France Telecom - Orange is not liable for = messages that have been modified, changed or falsified. >> Thank you. >>=20 >=20 > _______________________________________________ > dispatch mailing list > dispatch@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dispatch > _______________________________________________ > dispatch mailing list > dispatch@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dispatch >=20 From mary.ietf.barnes@gmail.com Sun Oct 7 10:02:55 2012 Return-Path: X-Original-To: dispatch@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: dispatch@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2EF7B21F86FE for ; Sun, 7 Oct 2012 10:02:55 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -103.321 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-103.321 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.277, BAYES_00=-2.599, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW=-1, USER_IN_WHITELIST=-100] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.30]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id LOgyevGQmbei for ; Sun, 7 Oct 2012 10:02:54 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail-lb0-f172.google.com (mail-lb0-f172.google.com [209.85.217.172]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2FDD821F86F7 for ; Sun, 7 Oct 2012 10:02:53 -0700 (PDT) Received: by mail-lb0-f172.google.com with SMTP id k13so2680390lbo.31 for ; Sun, 07 Oct 2012 10:02:53 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20120113; h=mime-version:in-reply-to:references:date:message-id:subject:from:to :cc:content-type; bh=U0gIFqRtnyNGcrTLWi6599qALuVKvYnpcBmPFg5QRwk=; b=vRC2OSBSz/SB2IAY0SpPgQi99rzTvvy+6s/ZsvBzv1MkvS4SNfKqOuVKGZlWjm7qxI IpzHu+jnjilEBpTGwVzO4CCOmLMVecfPCaFbEw5aa5O7agA4BckAL+K6s+1iw1rshJ9M h0E7wRsOPiOjSptruJJMux+sUeWlAiTE+VR08XQZE+vudwslnGfAsP7nwlCnuVq3kfZi sW70yk1gBfg8zqQZZb+PzCgTmxfWIgx2J4t3LzTYRdYJsmuHQV17VoaqzcZcTZYecyGu jFdJg7NCHmfQbXLYRowrc8Wc91jr9p22TquwnGT4rGptApGoPNWasNiAkwLiB63d+CYs gvHQ== MIME-Version: 1.0 Received: by 10.152.108.66 with SMTP id hi2mr1748845lab.11.1349629372883; Sun, 07 Oct 2012 10:02:52 -0700 (PDT) Received: by 10.114.69.139 with HTTP; Sun, 7 Oct 2012 10:02:52 -0700 (PDT) In-Reply-To: <20121004195444.4067.72806.idtracker@ietfa.amsl.com> References: <20121004195444.4067.72806.idtracker@ietfa.amsl.com> Date: Sun, 7 Oct 2012 12:02:52 -0500 Message-ID: From: Mary Barnes To: DISPATCH Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary=bcaec54eecc859638504cb7b1347 Cc: fluffy@iii.ca Subject: Re: [dispatch] dispatch - Requested session has been scheduled for IETF 85 X-BeenThere: dispatch@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.12 Precedence: list List-Id: DISPATCH Working Group Mail List List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sun, 07 Oct 2012 17:02:55 -0000 --bcaec54eecc859638504cb7b1347 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Please note that at this point in time, we only have one request for agenda time @ IETF-85 -TERQ and there is one other document currently under discussion. Note that we were extremely loose with deadlines for this meeting: http://trac.tools.ietf.org/wg/dispatch/trac/wiki Please contact the chairs ASAP if you will be pursuing a topic for IETF-85 (no later than 5pm Pacific on Monday, Oct. 8th). Regards, Mary. On Thu, Oct 4, 2012 at 2:54 PM, "IETF Secretariat" wrote: > Dear Cullen Jennings, > > The session(s) that you have requested have been scheduled. > Below is the scheduled session information followed by > the original request. > > dispatch Session 1 (2:00:00) > Friday, Morning Session I 0900-1100 > Room Name: Grand Ballroom D > --------------------------------------------- > > > > Request Information: > > > --------------------------------------------------------- > Working Group Name: > Area Name: > Session Requester: > > Number of Sessions: 1 > Length of Session(s): 2 Hours > Number of Attendees: 125 > Conflicts to Avoid: > First Priority: atoca avtcore avtext bfcpbis bliss clue codec core cuss > drinks ecrit geopriv insipid mmusic p2psip payload rtcweb salud simple > sipclf sipcore siprec soc vipr xmpp xrblock > Second Priority: opsarea tsvarea tsvwg > > > > Special Requests: > The ADs would like DISPATCH to avoid the same kind of conflicts that are > avoided for area meetings - that is, please avoid conflicting with other > area meetings, any Bofs, and other WGs in RAI. > --------------------------------------------------------- > > --bcaec54eecc859638504cb7b1347 Content-Type: text/html; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Please note that at this point in time, we only have one request for agenda= time @ IETF-85 -TERQ and there is one other document currently under discu= ssion. =A0 =A0Note that we were extremely loose with deadlines for this mee= ting:
http://trac.to= ols.ietf.org/wg/dispatch/trac/wiki

Please contact the chairs AS= AP if you will be pursuing a topic for IETF-85 (no later than 5pm Pacific o= n Monday, Oct. 8th). =A0=A0

Regards,
Mary.

On Thu, Oct 4, 201= 2 at 2:54 PM, "IETF Secretariat" <agenda@ietf.org> w= rote:
Dear Cullen Jennings,

The session(s) that you have requested have been scheduled.
Below is the scheduled session information followed by
the original request.

dispatch Session 1 (2:00:00)
=A0 =A0 Friday, Morning Session I 0900-1100
=A0 =A0 Room Name: Grand Ballroom D
=A0 =A0 ---------------------------------------------



Request Information:


---------------------------------------------------------
Working Group Name:
Area Name:
Session Requester:

Number of Sessions: 1
Length of Session(s): =A02 Hours
Number of Attendees: 125
Conflicts to Avoid:
=A0First Priority: atoca avtcore avtext bfcpbis bliss clue codec core cuss = drinks ecrit geopriv insipid mmusic p2psip payload rtcweb salud simple sipc= lf sipcore siprec soc vipr xmpp xrblock
=A0Second Priority: opsarea tsvarea tsvwg



Special Requests:
=A0 The ADs would like DISPATCH to avoid the same kind of conflicts that ar= e avoided for area meetings - that is, please avoid conflicting with other = area meetings, any Bofs, and other WGs in RAI.
---------------------------------------------------------


--bcaec54eecc859638504cb7b1347-- From dhanes@cisco.com Mon Oct 8 07:45:34 2012 Return-Path: X-Original-To: dispatch@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: dispatch@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 148A521F853A for ; Mon, 8 Oct 2012 07:45:34 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -10.419 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-10.419 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.180, BAYES_00=-2.599, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_HI=-8] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.30]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id a1sb1l8NhRgk for ; Mon, 8 Oct 2012 07:45:33 -0700 (PDT) Received: from av-tac-rtp.cisco.com (av-tac-rtp.cisco.com [64.102.19.209]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7766821F87B7 for ; Mon, 8 Oct 2012 07:45:33 -0700 (PDT) X-TACSUNS: Virus Scanned Received: from rooster.cisco.com (localhost.cisco.com [127.0.0.1]) by av-tac-rtp.cisco.com (8.13.8+Sun/8.13.8) with ESMTP id q98EjNdS025476; Mon, 8 Oct 2012 10:45:23 -0400 (EDT) Received: from rtp-dhanes-8918.cisco.com (rtp-dhanes-8918.cisco.com [10.117.39.201]) by rooster.cisco.com (8.13.8+Sun/8.13.8) with ESMTP id q98EjNiV011316; Mon, 8 Oct 2012 10:45:23 -0400 (EDT) Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v1084) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii From: David Hanes In-Reply-To: <201210011959.q91JxaqU017941@freeze.ariadne.com> Date: Mon, 8 Oct 2012 10:45:53 -0400 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Message-Id: References: <201210011959.q91JxaqU017941@freeze.ariadne.com> To: DISPATCH X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.1084) Subject: [dispatch] draft-hanes-dispatch-fax-capability-03 X-BeenThere: dispatch@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.12 Precedence: list List-Id: DISPATCH Working Group Mail List List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 08 Oct 2012 14:45:34 -0000 The latest version (03) has been uploaded. The main changes are: - Rewrite of the descriptions for t38 and passthrough in Section 6. - Moving of the T.38 reference from informative to normative - Additional references added for T.30, T.4, and V152 - Additional reference citations throughout the body of the draft Please review and let me know if any additional edits are needed. -David On Oct 1, 2012, at 3:59 PM, Dale R. Worley wrote: >> From: David Hanes >> >> How about the following descriptions for T.38 and passthrough in the >> IANA Considerations section? >> >> t38: The device supports the image/t38 media type [RFC 3326] and >> implements ITU-T T.38 for transporting the ITU-T T.30 and T.4 fax >> data over IP. >> >> passthrough: The device supports the audio/pcmu and audio/pcma media >> types [RFC4856] for transporting ITU-T T.30 and T.4 fax data using >> the ITU-T G.711 codec. Additional implementation recommendations are >> in ITU-T V.152 Sections 6 and 6.1. > > Those sound good to me. Of course, these specifications are the > minimum requirements. (Which means that supporting T.30 is > *mandatory*.) Thus (in regard to Bruno's item) the device may support > G.726 (or any other codec for passthrough), but is not required to do > so. > > I am assuming that each layer of the protocol stack (audio/*, G.*, > T.*) has a proper set of negotiation/fallback mechanisms, but I expect > that the designers have verified that. > > Dale From gsalguei@cisco.com Mon Oct 8 20:45:36 2012 Return-Path: X-Original-To: dispatch@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: dispatch@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id CBF1E21F87A2 for ; Mon, 8 Oct 2012 20:45:36 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -10.438 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-10.438 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.161, BAYES_00=-2.599, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_HI=-8] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.30]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id SvdzlcQKLe4i for ; Mon, 8 Oct 2012 20:45:36 -0700 (PDT) Received: from av-tac-rtp.cisco.com (av-tac-rtp.cisco.com [64.102.19.209]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2A60321F875D for ; Mon, 8 Oct 2012 20:45:33 -0700 (PDT) X-TACSUNS: Virus Scanned Received: from chook.cisco.com (localhost.cisco.com [127.0.0.1]) by av-tac-rtp.cisco.com (8.13.8+Sun/8.13.8) with ESMTP id q993jWCh011830 for ; Mon, 8 Oct 2012 23:45:32 -0400 (EDT) Received: from rtp-gsalguei-8914.cisco.com (rtp-gsalguei-8914.cisco.com [10.116.132.53]) by chook.cisco.com (8.13.8+Sun/8.13.8) with ESMTP id q993jV0d004771; Mon, 8 Oct 2012 23:45:31 -0400 (EDT) Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v1283) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 From: Gonzalo Salgueiro In-Reply-To: Date: Mon, 8 Oct 2012 23:45:31 -0400 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Message-Id: <496D90CA-A575-49C7-B882-37F722B2CBB0@cisco.com> References: <20121004195444.4067.72806.idtracker@ietfa.amsl.com> To: Mary Barnes , Cullen Jennings X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.1283) Cc: DISPATCH , fluffy@iii.ca Subject: Re: [dispatch] dispatch - Requested session has been scheduled for IETF 85 X-BeenThere: dispatch@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.12 Precedence: list List-Id: DISPATCH Working Group Mail List List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 09 Oct 2012 03:45:36 -0000 Chairs -=20 The authors of draft-hanes-dispatch-fax-capability have just released = the -03 version addressing all of the feedback received and currently = view the draft as stable. At this point we would like to solicit some = advice on its fate. We view the draft as nothing more than an IANA registration draft that = is very limited in scope and trivially simple. IMO this alone precludes = it from requiring any new WG to be spun up. IMHO it doesn't currently = fit in any existing WG, so we view it as a perfect candidate for an = AD-sponsored individual submission. Our hope was that this decision = would be obvious and uncontroversial to the point where we could make = this decision on the list prior to Atlanta. If that isn't possible then = we could fill a (admittedly short) time slot to discuss this draft. Thanks, Gonzalo On Oct 7, 2012, at 1:02 PM, Mary Barnes wrote: > Please note that at this point in time, we only have one request for = agenda time @ IETF-85 -TERQ and there is one other document currently = under discussion. Note that we were extremely loose with deadlines = for this meeting: > http://trac.tools.ietf.org/wg/dispatch/trac/wiki >=20 > Please contact the chairs ASAP if you will be pursuing a topic for = IETF-85 (no later than 5pm Pacific on Monday, Oct. 8th). =20 >=20 > Regards, > Mary.=20 >=20 > On Thu, Oct 4, 2012 at 2:54 PM, "IETF Secretariat" = wrote: > Dear Cullen Jennings, >=20 > The session(s) that you have requested have been scheduled. > Below is the scheduled session information followed by > the original request. >=20 > dispatch Session 1 (2:00:00) > Friday, Morning Session I 0900-1100 > Room Name: Grand Ballroom D > --------------------------------------------- >=20 >=20 >=20 > Request Information: >=20 >=20 > --------------------------------------------------------- > Working Group Name: > Area Name: > Session Requester: >=20 > Number of Sessions: 1 > Length of Session(s): 2 Hours > Number of Attendees: 125 > Conflicts to Avoid: > First Priority: atoca avtcore avtext bfcpbis bliss clue codec core = cuss drinks ecrit geopriv insipid mmusic p2psip payload rtcweb salud = simple sipclf sipcore siprec soc vipr xmpp xrblock > Second Priority: opsarea tsvarea tsvwg >=20 >=20 >=20 > Special Requests: > The ADs would like DISPATCH to avoid the same kind of conflicts that = are avoided for area meetings - that is, please avoid conflicting with = other area meetings, any Bofs, and other WGs in RAI. > --------------------------------------------------------- >=20 >=20 > _______________________________________________ > dispatch mailing list > dispatch@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dispatch From pkyzivat@alum.mit.edu Tue Oct 9 08:23:47 2012 Return-Path: X-Original-To: dispatch@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: dispatch@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 427B621F8554 for ; Tue, 9 Oct 2012 08:23:47 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -0.376 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-0.376 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.061, BAYES_00=-2.599, FH_RELAY_NODNS=1.451, HELO_MISMATCH_NET=0.611, RDNS_NONE=0.1] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.30]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id mX+TWTWUA-Js for ; Tue, 9 Oct 2012 08:23:42 -0700 (PDT) Received: from qmta02.westchester.pa.mail.comcast.net (qmta02.westchester.pa.mail.comcast.net [IPv6:2001:558:fe14:43:76:96:62:24]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4665721F8710 for ; Tue, 9 Oct 2012 08:23:42 -0700 (PDT) Received: from omta11.westchester.pa.mail.comcast.net ([76.96.62.36]) by qmta02.westchester.pa.mail.comcast.net with comcast id 91ey1k0060mv7h0513PmiX; Tue, 09 Oct 2012 15:23:46 +0000 Received: from Paul-Kyzivats-MacBook-Pro.local ([50.138.229.164]) by omta11.westchester.pa.mail.comcast.net with comcast id 93JZ1k00g3ZTu2S3X3JZNg; Tue, 09 Oct 2012 15:18:33 +0000 Message-ID: <50744051.7010405@alum.mit.edu> Date: Tue, 09 Oct 2012 11:18:41 -0400 From: Paul Kyzivat User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Macintosh; Intel Mac OS X 10.7; rv:15.0) Gecko/20120907 Thunderbird/15.0.1 MIME-Version: 1.0 To: dispatch@ietf.org References: <20121004195444.4067.72806.idtracker@ietfa.amsl.com> <496D90CA-A575-49C7-B882-37F722B2CBB0@cisco.com> In-Reply-To: <496D90CA-A575-49C7-B882-37F722B2CBB0@cisco.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: Re: [dispatch] dispatch - Requested session has been scheduled for IETF 85 X-BeenThere: dispatch@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.12 Precedence: list List-Id: DISPATCH Working Group Mail List List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 09 Oct 2012 15:23:47 -0000 WFM On 10/8/12 11:45 PM, Gonzalo Salgueiro wrote: > Chairs - > > The authors of draft-hanes-dispatch-fax-capability have just released the -03 version addressing all of the feedback received and currently view the draft as stable. At this point we would like to solicit some advice on its fate. > > We view the draft as nothing more than an IANA registration draft that is very limited in scope and trivially simple. IMO this alone precludes it from requiring any new WG to be spun up. IMHO it doesn't currently fit in any existing WG, so we view it as a perfect candidate for an AD-sponsored individual submission. Our hope was that this decision would be obvious and uncontroversial to the point where we could make this decision on the list prior to Atlanta. If that isn't possible then we could fill a (admittedly short) time slot to discuss this draft. > > Thanks, > > Gonzalo > > > > On Oct 7, 2012, at 1:02 PM, Mary Barnes wrote: > >> Please note that at this point in time, we only have one request for agenda time @ IETF-85 -TERQ and there is one other document currently under discussion. Note that we were extremely loose with deadlines for this meeting: >> http://trac.tools.ietf.org/wg/dispatch/trac/wiki >> >> Please contact the chairs ASAP if you will be pursuing a topic for IETF-85 (no later than 5pm Pacific on Monday, Oct. 8th). >> >> Regards, >> Mary. >> >> On Thu, Oct 4, 2012 at 2:54 PM, "IETF Secretariat" wrote: >> Dear Cullen Jennings, >> >> The session(s) that you have requested have been scheduled. >> Below is the scheduled session information followed by >> the original request. >> >> dispatch Session 1 (2:00:00) >> Friday, Morning Session I 0900-1100 >> Room Name: Grand Ballroom D >> --------------------------------------------- >> >> >> >> Request Information: >> >> >> --------------------------------------------------------- >> Working Group Name: >> Area Name: >> Session Requester: >> >> Number of Sessions: 1 >> Length of Session(s): 2 Hours >> Number of Attendees: 125 >> Conflicts to Avoid: >> First Priority: atoca avtcore avtext bfcpbis bliss clue codec core cuss drinks ecrit geopriv insipid mmusic p2psip payload rtcweb salud simple sipclf sipcore siprec soc vipr xmpp xrblock >> Second Priority: opsarea tsvarea tsvwg >> >> >> >> Special Requests: >> The ADs would like DISPATCH to avoid the same kind of conflicts that are avoided for area meetings - that is, please avoid conflicting with other area meetings, any Bofs, and other WGs in RAI. >> --------------------------------------------------------- >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> dispatch mailing list >> dispatch@ietf.org >> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dispatch > > _______________________________________________ > dispatch mailing list > dispatch@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dispatch > From richard@shockey.us Thu Oct 11 15:04:46 2012 Return-Path: X-Original-To: dispatch@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: dispatch@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id B839A1F0C5C for ; Thu, 11 Oct 2012 15:04:46 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -100.613 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-100.613 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=1.651, BAYES_00=-2.599, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, IP_NOT_FRIENDLY=0.334, USER_IN_WHITELIST=-100] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.30]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id OlubSIS6s-0U for ; Thu, 11 Oct 2012 15:04:46 -0700 (PDT) Received: from oproxy9.bluehost.com (oproxy9.bluehost.com [69.89.24.6]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with SMTP id E3CA41F0C3E for ; Thu, 11 Oct 2012 15:04:45 -0700 (PDT) Received: (qmail 10194 invoked by uid 0); 11 Oct 2012 22:04:24 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO box462.bluehost.com) (74.220.219.62) by oproxy9.bluehost.com with SMTP; 11 Oct 2012 22:04:24 -0000 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; q=dns/txt; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=shockey.us; s=default; h=Content-Type:MIME-Version:Message-ID:Date:Subject:In-Reply-To:References:To:From; bh=7POTzs5p7IVtuwPNkyeX4B8bsDF96DD72iDhUFf8MZ4=; b=npHeIiGvslTw4b8xHqztUV0lZI/nR+GNn+F997/GSf5jESqCRr0gL4+HSDTefS7UhHGTkYn2ysWEfe/gn5ZanzValSgQBE1CP7bkWCYDJ6oRmFXUUSMsawes/8wE/Sou; Received: from [71.191.243.130] (port=59744 helo=RSHOCKEYPC) by box462.bluehost.com with esmtpa (Exim 4.76) (envelope-from ) id 1TMQrf-0005Eq-Dl; Thu, 11 Oct 2012 16:04:23 -0600 From: "Richard Shockey" To: "'Mary Barnes'" , "'DISPATCH'" , "'Cullen Jennings \(fluffy\)'" References: <20121004195444.4067.72806.idtracker@ietfa.amsl.com> In-Reply-To: Date: Thu, 11 Oct 2012 18:04:20 -0400 Message-ID: <016501cda7fc$5e417e00$1ac47a00$@us> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0166_01CDA7DA.D72FDE00" X-Mailer: Microsoft Office Outlook 12.0 Thread-Index: Ac2krZr6GQlFK2KgQGOm0yGHOJcPkgDTbqHg Content-Language: en-us X-Identified-User: {3286:box462.bluehost.com:shockeyu:shockey.us} {sentby:smtp auth 71.191.243.130 authed with richard@shockey.us} Subject: Re: [dispatch] dispatch - Requested session has been scheduled for IETF 85 X-BeenThere: dispatch@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.12 Precedence: list List-Id: DISPATCH Working Group Mail List List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 11 Oct 2012 22:04:46 -0000 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0166_01CDA7DA.D72FDE00 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit DISPATCH Chairs. I would like to present to DISPATCH in Atlanta the potential work of the SIP Forum on our proposed work to create profiles for the Video Relay Service for the hearing impaired. Though at this time, no new protocol work is anticipated the work itself may be of significant interest to the larger RAI community and in general represents a significant advancement of real time communications to a long neglected community. From: dispatch-bounces@ietf.org [mailto:dispatch-bounces@ietf.org] On Behalf Of Mary Barnes Sent: Sunday, October 07, 2012 1:03 PM To: DISPATCH Cc: fluffy@iii.ca Subject: Re: [dispatch] dispatch - Requested session has been scheduled for IETF 85 Please note that at this point in time, we only have one request for agenda time @ IETF-85 -TERQ and there is one other document currently under discussion. Note that we were extremely loose with deadlines for this meeting: http://trac.tools.ietf.org/wg/dispatch/trac/wiki Please contact the chairs ASAP if you will be pursuing a topic for IETF-85 (no later than 5pm Pacific on Monday, Oct. 8th). Regards, Mary. On Thu, Oct 4, 2012 at 2:54 PM, "IETF Secretariat" wrote: Dear Cullen Jennings, The session(s) that you have requested have been scheduled. Below is the scheduled session information followed by the original request. dispatch Session 1 (2:00:00) Friday, Morning Session I 0900-1100 Room Name: Grand Ballroom D --------------------------------------------- Request Information: --------------------------------------------------------- Working Group Name: Area Name: Session Requester: Number of Sessions: 1 Length of Session(s): 2 Hours Number of Attendees: 125 Conflicts to Avoid: First Priority: atoca avtcore avtext bfcpbis bliss clue codec core cuss drinks ecrit geopriv insipid mmusic p2psip payload rtcweb salud simple sipclf sipcore siprec soc vipr xmpp xrblock Second Priority: opsarea tsvarea tsvwg Special Requests: The ADs would like DISPATCH to avoid the same kind of conflicts that are avoided for area meetings - that is, please avoid conflicting with other area meetings, any Bofs, and other WGs in RAI. --------------------------------------------------------- ------=_NextPart_000_0166_01CDA7DA.D72FDE00 Content-Type: text/html; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

DISPATCH Chairs. 

 

I would like to present to DISPATCH in Atlanta the potential work of = the SIP Forum on our proposed work to create profiles for the Video = Relay Service for the hearing impaired. Though at this time, no new = protocol work is anticipated the work itself may be of significant = interest to the larger RAI community and in general represents a = significant advancement of real time communications to a long neglected = community.

 

 

From:= = dispatch-bounces@ietf.org [mailto:dispatch-bounces@ietf.org] On = Behalf Of Mary Barnes
Sent: Sunday, October 07, 2012 1:03 = PM
To: DISPATCH
Cc: fluffy@iii.ca
Subject: = Re: [dispatch] dispatch - Requested session has been scheduled for IETF = 85

 

Please note = that at this point in time, we only have one request for agenda time @ = IETF-85 -TERQ and there is one other document currently under = discussion.    Note that we were extremely loose with = deadlines for this meeting:
http://trac.too= ls.ietf.org/wg/dispatch/trac/wiki


Please contact the = chairs ASAP if you will be pursuing a topic for IETF-85 (no later than = 5pm Pacific on Monday, Oct. 8th).   

Regards,
Mary. =

On Thu, Oct 4, 2012 at 2:54 PM, = "IETF Secretariat" <agenda@ietf.org> wrote:

Dear Cullen = Jennings,

The session(s) that you have requested have been = scheduled.
Below is the scheduled session information followed = by
the original request.

dispatch Session 1 = (2:00:00)
    Friday, Morning Session I 0900-1100
  =   Room Name: Grand Ballroom D
    = ---------------------------------------------



Request = Information:


-------------------------------------------------= --------
Working Group Name:
Area Name:
Session = Requester:

Number of Sessions: 1
Length of Session(s):  2 = Hours
Number of Attendees: 125
Conflicts to Avoid:
 First = Priority: atoca avtcore avtext bfcpbis bliss clue codec core cuss drinks = ecrit geopriv insipid mmusic p2psip payload rtcweb salud simple sipclf = sipcore siprec soc vipr xmpp xrblock
 Second Priority: opsarea = tsvarea tsvwg



Special Requests:
  The ADs would = like DISPATCH to avoid the same kind of conflicts that are avoided for = area meetings - that is, please avoid conflicting with other area = meetings, any Bofs, and other WGs in = RAI.
---------------------------------------------------------

 

------=_NextPart_000_0166_01CDA7DA.D72FDE00-- From mary.ietf.barnes@gmail.com Fri Oct 12 10:05:21 2012 Return-Path: X-Original-To: dispatch@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: dispatch@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 37A6221F87A2 for ; Fri, 12 Oct 2012 10:05:21 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -103.373 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-103.373 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.225, BAYES_00=-2.599, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW=-1, USER_IN_WHITELIST=-100] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.30]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id mV5CE33JYec3 for ; Fri, 12 Oct 2012 10:05:20 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail-lb0-f172.google.com (mail-lb0-f172.google.com [209.85.217.172]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id E7DB921F8789 for ; Fri, 12 Oct 2012 10:05:19 -0700 (PDT) Received: by mail-lb0-f172.google.com with SMTP id k13so2456762lbo.31 for ; Fri, 12 Oct 2012 10:05:19 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20120113; h=mime-version:in-reply-to:references:date:message-id:subject:from:to :cc:content-type; bh=drDaRrrC7KgkydxnsqAD1MzGhLfYwjoGYQvYYRdPPLA=; b=jOFgRRb1DtliMbkXR8fy/irk+dORj2ny8WR2HN0flhopLY+TOutUwKLJ4BspkIQ1pa 3F2Ew1hBovxjrs8VCqzqEnyOjIEs6hWKAvHjl1LvpXHA8nNLpnkeOr3EuZzYrVJGZRDj kiZL/Um93vVlwT80kuV3r06ZHyCSR62cFe1YCmcNGilDHzBCFqjOV9WgBxZk+Okj9wXi e/NRnVcHE4kB171ROeyvnBpbdO67zz+oJNuQ+fNGgLvpFaGh4V3kgN1xs6c2z8DfkVX5 /WKIoN5QiqcfYadwPub6wKVxLuTpsC4U88zx/e9tVkQneQ/6N1H3b52mH+X1ESWxskfo vBiw== MIME-Version: 1.0 Received: by 10.152.108.66 with SMTP id hi2mr4478606lab.11.1350061518872; Fri, 12 Oct 2012 10:05:18 -0700 (PDT) Received: by 10.114.69.139 with HTTP; Fri, 12 Oct 2012 10:05:18 -0700 (PDT) In-Reply-To: <016501cda7fc$5e417e00$1ac47a00$@us> References: <20121004195444.4067.72806.idtracker@ietfa.amsl.com> <016501cda7fc$5e417e00$1ac47a00$@us> Date: Fri, 12 Oct 2012 12:05:18 -0500 Message-ID: From: Mary Barnes To: Richard Shockey Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary=bcaec54eecc841e12504cbdfb13a Cc: "Cullen Jennings \(fluffy\)" , DISPATCH Subject: Re: [dispatch] dispatch - Requested session has been scheduled for IETF 85 X-BeenThere: dispatch@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.12 Precedence: list List-Id: DISPATCH Working Group Mail List List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 12 Oct 2012 17:05:21 -0000 --bcaec54eecc841e12504cbdfb13a Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 We can plan to give you time at the end of the meeting (after the end of the "official" portion of the WG session). If you can send the chairs your charts, then we'll have them ready to go. Mary. On Thu, Oct 11, 2012 at 5:04 PM, Richard Shockey wrote: > DISPATCH Chairs. **** > > ** ** > > I would like to present to DISPATCH in Atlanta the potential work of the > SIP Forum on our proposed work to create profiles for the Video Relay > Service for the hearing impaired. Though at this time, no new protocol work > is anticipated the work itself may be of significant interest to the larger > RAI community and in general represents a significant advancement of real > time communications to a long neglected community. **** > > ** ** > > ** ** > > *From:* dispatch-bounces@ietf.org [mailto:dispatch-bounces@ietf.org] *On > Behalf Of *Mary Barnes > *Sent:* Sunday, October 07, 2012 1:03 PM > *To:* DISPATCH > *Cc:* fluffy@iii.ca > *Subject:* Re: [dispatch] dispatch - Requested session has been scheduled > for IETF 85**** > > ** ** > > Please note that at this point in time, we only have one request for > agenda time @ IETF-85 -TERQ and there is one other document currently under > discussion. Note that we were extremely loose with deadlines for this > meeting: > http://trac.tools.ietf.org/wg/dispatch/trac/wiki**** > > > Please contact the chairs ASAP if you will be pursuing a topic for IETF-85 > (no later than 5pm Pacific on Monday, Oct. 8th). > > Regards, > Mary. **** > > On Thu, Oct 4, 2012 at 2:54 PM, "IETF Secretariat" > wrote:**** > > Dear Cullen Jennings, > > The session(s) that you have requested have been scheduled. > Below is the scheduled session information followed by > the original request. > > dispatch Session 1 (2:00:00) > Friday, Morning Session I 0900-1100 > Room Name: Grand Ballroom D > --------------------------------------------- > > > > Request Information: > > > --------------------------------------------------------- > Working Group Name: > Area Name: > Session Requester: > > Number of Sessions: 1 > Length of Session(s): 2 Hours > Number of Attendees: 125 > Conflicts to Avoid: > First Priority: atoca avtcore avtext bfcpbis bliss clue codec core cuss > drinks ecrit geopriv insipid mmusic p2psip payload rtcweb salud simple > sipclf sipcore siprec soc vipr xmpp xrblock > Second Priority: opsarea tsvarea tsvwg > > > > Special Requests: > The ADs would like DISPATCH to avoid the same kind of conflicts that are > avoided for area meetings - that is, please avoid conflicting with other > area meetings, any Bofs, and other WGs in RAI. > ---------------------------------------------------------**** > > ** ** > --bcaec54eecc841e12504cbdfb13a Content-Type: text/html; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable We can plan to give you time at the end of the meeting (after the end of th= e "official" portion of the WG session). =A0 If you can send the = chairs your charts, then we'll have them ready to go.=A0

=
Mary.=A0

On Thu, Oct 11, 2012 at 5:04 PM,= Richard Shockey <richard@shockey.us> wrote:

DISPATCH Chairs.=A0

=A0

I would like to present to DISPATCH in Atlant= a the potential work of the SIP Forum on our proposed work to create profil= es for the Video Relay Service for the hearing impaired. Though at this tim= e, no new protocol work is anticipated the work itself may be of significan= t interest to the larger RAI community and in general represents a signific= ant advancement of real time communications to a long neglected community. =

=A0<= /p>

=A0

=A0

Please note that at this point in time, we only have o= ne request for agenda time @ IETF-85 -TERQ and there is one other document = currently under discussion. =A0 =A0Note that we were extremely loose with d= eadlines for this meeting:
http://trac.tools.ietf.org/wg/dispatch/trac/wiki

<= div>


Please contac= t the chairs ASAP if you will be pursuing a topic for IETF-85 (no later tha= n 5pm Pacific on Monday, Oct. 8th). =A0=A0

Regards,
Mary.

On Thu,= Oct 4, 2012 at 2:54 PM, "IETF Secretariat" <agenda@ietf.org> wrote:

Dear Cullen Jennings,=

The session(s) that you have requested have been scheduled.
Belo= w is the scheduled session information followed by
the original request.=

dispatch Session 1 (2:00:00)
=A0 =A0 Friday, Morning Session I 0900-= 1100
=A0 =A0 Room Name: Grand Ballroom D
=A0 =A0 --------------------= -------------------------



Request Information:


--= -------------------------------------------------------
Working Group Name:
Area Name:
Session Requester:

Number of Se= ssions: 1
Length of Session(s): =A02 Hours
Number of Attendees: 125Conflicts to Avoid:
=A0First Priority: atoca avtcore avtext bfcpbis bl= iss clue codec core cuss drinks ecrit geopriv insipid mmusic p2psip payload= rtcweb salud simple sipclf sipcore siprec soc vipr xmpp xrblock
=A0Second Priority: opsarea tsvarea tsvwg



Special Requests:<= br>=A0 The ADs would like DISPATCH to avoid the same kind of conflicts that= are avoided for area meetings - that is, please avoid conflicting with oth= er area meetings, any Bofs, and other WGs in RAI.
---------------------------------------------------------

=

=A0

<= /div>

--bcaec54eecc841e12504cbdfb13a-- From christer.holmberg@ericsson.com Mon Oct 15 03:33:07 2012 Return-Path: X-Original-To: dispatch@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: dispatch@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 757D621F869E for ; Mon, 15 Oct 2012 03:33:07 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -5.078 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-5.078 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=-0.918, BAYES_05=-1.11, HELO_EQ_SE=0.35, J_CHICKENPOX_33=0.6, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-4] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.30]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 8b0DjkMeWqwr for ; Mon, 15 Oct 2012 03:33:05 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mailgw2.ericsson.se (mailgw2.ericsson.se [193.180.251.37]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id DD97E21F86CA for ; Mon, 15 Oct 2012 03:33:04 -0700 (PDT) X-AuditID: c1b4fb25-b7f956d0000011c3-55-507be65fd00a Received: from esessmw0247.eemea.ericsson.se (Unknown_Domain [153.88.253.125]) by mailgw2.ericsson.se (Symantec Mail Security) with SMTP id EC.C3.04547.F56EB705; Mon, 15 Oct 2012 12:33:03 +0200 (CEST) Received: from ESESSHC012.ericsson.se (153.88.183.54) by esessmw0247.eemea.ericsson.se (153.88.115.93) with Microsoft SMTP Server (TLS) id 8.3.279.1; Mon, 15 Oct 2012 12:32:51 +0200 Received: from ESESSMB209.ericsson.se ([169.254.9.182]) by ESESSHC012.ericsson.se ([153.88.183.54]) with mapi id 14.02.0318.001; Mon, 15 Oct 2012 12:32:51 +0200 From: Christer Holmberg To: 'Gonzalo Salgueiro' , John Atkinson Thread-Topic: [dispatch] draft-hanes-dispatch-fax-capability-02 Thread-Index: Ac2grreP1mZPfJBcRJ2vIkq0RDyr/gKEW0GA Date: Mon, 15 Oct 2012 10:32:50 +0000 Message-ID: <7594FB04B1934943A5C02806D1A2204B013285@ESESSMB209.ericsson.se> References: <201209111858.q8BIwvvW006046@freeze.ariadne.com> <506326B5.7090009@alum.mit.edu> <48CAA1D0-A0DE-4D1E-816E-6BB22902B4AD@cisco.com> <54633A5E61DC84429CB9FE3D9143C72118008EA7@MBX.dialogic.com> <23170_1348819872_50655BA0_23170_6953_2_88CAD1D4E8773F42858B58CAA28272A008C17C@PEXCVZYM12.corporate.adroot.infra.ftgroup> <1317445A-E2EF-4ECE-AFB9-F630A302236B@cisco.com> <31903_1349082556_50695DBB_31903_5565_1_88CAD1D4E8773F42858B58CAA28272A008DD1F@PEXCVZYM12.corporate.adroot.infra.ftgroup> <585B1724B58FF74DB231F9B6CDD159F4E7803E0F@gbplmail01.genband.com> <8A7C5039-1BC8-4FD5-B0E2-B5758B1F21F6@cisco.com> In-Reply-To: <8A7C5039-1BC8-4FD5-B0E2-B5758B1F21F6@cisco.com> Accept-Language: en-US Content-Language: en-US X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: x-originating-ip: [153.88.183.18] Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Brightmail-Tracker: H4sIAAAAAAAAA+NgFmplkeLIzCtJLcpLzFFi42KZGfG3Vjf+WXWAwZQ7ehZLJy1gtZg7xc/i ybqP7BZXJ/9gcmDx+Pv+A5PHlN8bWT1u7rnG6LFkyU+mAJYoLpuU1JzMstQifbsEroxH7/Yx Fty7wFjRuqaBpYFxw2nGLkZODgkBE4kTe++wQ9hiEhfurWfrYuTiEBI4xShxZ8pRFghnJ6PE ty0rWSGcJYwSP081MncxcnCwCVhIdP/TBukWEYiUmAPWzcnBLOAh0dx5gwnEFhawk/j+8AA7 RI29xIKjK5ghbCOJOzd+gF3BIqAqMe/lDLB6XgFviQ0n97JD7LrOKrGlpZEFJMEpYCvxuOMI mM0IdOr3U2uYIJaJS9x6Mp8J4gUBiSV7zjND2KISLx//Y4WwFSU+vtrHCHIzs4CmxPpd+hCt ihJTuh+yQ+wVlDg58wnYeCEBbYmWxRPYJzBKzEKyYRZC9ywk3bOQdC9gZFnFKJybmJmTXm6k l1qUmVxcnJ+nV5y6iREYlQe3/FbdwXjnnMghRmkOFiVxXuute/yFBNITS1KzU1MLUovii0pz UosPMTJxcEo1MHq0qgtOMN0UYMvH6lXc5ZryaY+ITY5wbnTw9y/x4rnt9+/Vl4jOkJpg+E5e TuCeumeVBYvCxJUzeau+8JrNZ/l/zbh3WkjenvWzDx55HL1MVer58gU6AoW1x8uNduwz0Hso 3JrlfC+Gw1IqPcv/0vKmhaKl2YtiXZrVL3+aob7RQVR0emOiEktxRqKhFnNRcSIA/7inzpgC AAA= Cc: "Dale R. Worley" , DISPATCH Subject: Re: [dispatch] draft-hanes-dispatch-fax-capability-02 X-BeenThere: dispatch@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.12 Precedence: list List-Id: DISPATCH Working Group Mail List List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 15 Oct 2012 10:33:07 -0000 DQpIaSwNCg0KV2hlbiB3ZSdyZSBkb2luZyB0aGlzLCBJIHdvbmRlciB3aGV0aGVyIGl0IHdvdWxk IGJlIHVzZWZ1bCB0byBkZWZpbmUgYSBmZWF0dXJlIGNhcGFiaWxpdHkgaW5kaWNhdG9yIGluIHRo ZSBzYW1lIHNob3QuDQoNCkkgZG9uJ3QgaGF2ZSBhIHVzZS1jYXNlIGF0IHRoZSBtb21lbnQsIGJ1 dCBJIGd1ZXNzIHRoZXJlIGNvdWxkIGFsc28gYmUgYSBuZWVkIGZvciBtZWRpYSBhd2FyZSBpbnRl cm1lZGlhcmllcyB0byBpbmRpY2F0ZSB0aGVpciBmYXggY2FwYWJpbGl0aWVzLg0KDQpSZWdhcmRz LA0KDQpDaHJpc3Rlcg0KDQoNCg0KIA0KDQotLS0tLU9yaWdpbmFsIE1lc3NhZ2UtLS0tLQ0KRnJv bTogZGlzcGF0Y2gtYm91bmNlc0BpZXRmLm9yZyBbbWFpbHRvOmRpc3BhdGNoLWJvdW5jZXNAaWV0 Zi5vcmddIE9uIEJlaGFsZiBPZiBHb256YWxvIFNhbGd1ZWlybw0KU2VudDogMi4gbG9rYWt1dXRh 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YW4vbGlzdGluZm8vZGlzcGF0Y2gNCj4gPiBfX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19f X19fX19fX19fX19fX19fXw0KPiA+IGRpc3BhdGNoIG1haWxpbmcgbGlzdA0KPiA+IGRpc3BhdGNo QGlldGYub3JnDQo+ID4gaHR0cHM6Ly93d3cuaWV0Zi5vcmcvbWFpbG1hbi9saXN0aW5mby9kaXNw YXRjaA0KPiA+DQo+DQo+IF9fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19f X19fX19fDQo+IGRpc3BhdGNoIG1haWxpbmcgbGlzdA0KPiBkaXNwYXRjaEBpZXRmLm9yZw0KPiBo dHRwczovL3d3dy5pZXRmLm9yZy9tYWlsbWFuL2xpc3RpbmZvL2Rpc3BhdGNoDQo+IF9fX19fX19f X19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fDQo+IGRpc3BhdGNoIG1haWxp bmcgbGlzdA0KPiBkaXNwYXRjaEBpZXRmLm9yZw0KPiBodHRwczovL3d3dy5pZXRmLm9yZy9tYWls bWFuL2xpc3RpbmZvL2Rpc3BhdGNoDQo= From christer.holmberg@ericsson.com Mon Oct 15 04:21:52 2012 Return-Path: X-Original-To: dispatch@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: dispatch@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7420821F8715 for ; Mon, 15 Oct 2012 04:21:52 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com 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Worley" , DISPATCH Subject: Re: [dispatch] draft-hanes-dispatch-fax-capability-02 X-BeenThere: dispatch@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.12 Precedence: list List-Id: DISPATCH Working Group Mail List List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 15 Oct 2012 11:21:52 -0000 DQpIaSwgDQoNCj5JZiB5b3UgYXJlIGRvaW5nIHRoYXQsIHRoZW4gc3VyZWx5IHlvdSBuZWVkIHRv IGRlZmluZSBmZWF0dXJlIGNhcGFiaWxpdHkgaW5kaWNhdG9yIGVxdWl2YWxlbnRzIGZvciBhbGwg dGhlIGV4aXN0aW5nIG1lZGlhIHJlbGF0ZWQgbWVkaWEgZmVhdHVyZSB0YWdzIGFzIHdlbGwuDQoN Ck1heWJlIHdlJ2xsIG5lZWQgdG8gZG8gdGhhdCBhdCBzb21lIHBvaW50LCBidXQgSSBkb24ndCBz ZWUgd2h5IHdlIHNob3VsZCBoYXZlIHRvIGRvIHRoYXQganVzdCBiZWNhdXNlIHdlIGRlZmluZSBv bmUgZm9yIGZheC4NCg0KUmVnYXJkcywNCg0KQ2hyaXN0ZXINCg0KDQo+IC0tLS0tT3JpZ2luYWwg TWVzc2FnZS0tLS0tDQo+IEZyb206IGRpc3BhdGNoLWJvdW5jZXNAaWV0Zi5vcmcgW21haWx0bzpk aXNwYXRjaC1ib3VuY2VzQGlldGYub3JnXSBPbiANCj4gQmVoYWxmIE9mIENocmlzdGVyIEhvbG1i 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DQo+IGRpc3BhdGNoQGlldGYub3JnDQo+IGh0dHBzOi8vd3d3LmlldGYub3JnL21haWxtYW4vbGlz dGluZm8vZGlzcGF0Y2gNCj4gX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19f X19fX19fX18NCj4gZGlzcGF0Y2ggbWFpbGluZyBsaXN0DQo+IGRpc3BhdGNoQGlldGYub3JnDQo+ IGh0dHBzOi8vd3d3LmlldGYub3JnL21haWxtYW4vbGlzdGluZm8vZGlzcGF0Y2gNCg== From pkyzivat@alum.mit.edu Mon Oct 15 06:38:38 2012 Return-Path: X-Original-To: dispatch@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: dispatch@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id EF52E21F869E for ; Mon, 15 Oct 2012 06:38:38 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -0.357 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-0.357 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.080, BAYES_00=-2.599, FH_RELAY_NODNS=1.451, HELO_MISMATCH_NET=0.611, RDNS_NONE=0.1] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.30]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id XldRG7XU-z4j for ; Mon, 15 Oct 2012 06:38:38 -0700 (PDT) Received: from qmta06.westchester.pa.mail.comcast.net (qmta06.westchester.pa.mail.comcast.net [IPv6:2001:558:fe14:43:76:96:62:56]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 121BA21F844B for ; Mon, 15 Oct 2012 06:38:37 -0700 (PDT) Received: from omta04.westchester.pa.mail.comcast.net ([76.96.62.35]) by qmta06.westchester.pa.mail.comcast.net with comcast id BRTd1k0020ldTLk56ReigK; Mon, 15 Oct 2012 13:38:42 +0000 Received: from Paul-Kyzivats-MacBook-Pro.local ([50.138.229.164]) by omta04.westchester.pa.mail.comcast.net with comcast id BRZR1k00s3ZTu2S3QRZRsE; Mon, 15 Oct 2012 13:33:26 +0000 Message-ID: <507C10B0.5070305@alum.mit.edu> Date: Mon, 15 Oct 2012 09:33:36 -0400 From: Paul Kyzivat User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Macintosh; Intel Mac OS X 10.7; rv:15.0) Gecko/20120907 Thunderbird/15.0.1 MIME-Version: 1.0 To: dispatch@ietf.org References: <201209111858.q8BIwvvW006046@freeze.ariadne.com> <506326B5.7090009@alum.mit.edu> <48CAA1D0-A0DE-4D1E-816E-6BB22902B4AD@cisco.com> <54633A5E61DC84429CB9FE3D9143C72118008EA7@MBX.dialogic.com> <23170_1348819872_50655BA0_23170_6953_2_88CAD1D4E8773F42858B58CAA28272A008C17C@PEXCVZYM12.corporate.adroot.infra.ftgroup> <1317445A-E2EF-4ECE-AFB9-F630A302236B@cisco.com> <31903_1349082556_50695DBB_31903_5565_1_88CAD1D4E8773F42858B58CAA28272A008DD1F@PEXCVZYM12.corporate.adroot.infra.ftgroup> <585B1724B58FF74DB231F9B6CDD159F4E7803E0F@gbplmail01.genband.com> <8A7C5039-1BC8-4FD5-B0E2-B5758B1F21F6@cisco.com> <7594FB04B1934943A5C02806D1A2204B013285@ESESSMB209.ericsson.se> In-Reply-To: <7594FB04B1934943A5C02806D1A2204B013285@ESESSMB209.ericsson.se> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: Re: [dispatch] draft-hanes-dispatch-fax-capability-02 X-BeenThere: dispatch@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.12 Precedence: list List-Id: DISPATCH Working Group Mail List List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 15 Oct 2012 13:38:39 -0000 On 10/15/12 6:32 AM, Christer Holmberg wrote: > > Hi, > > When we're doing this, I wonder whether it would be useful to define a feature capability indicator in the same shot. > > I don't have a use-case at the moment, but I guess there could also be a need for media aware intermediaries to indicate their fax capabilities. What does it mean for an intermediary to have fax capabilitity? Fax is an endpoint feature. It should not be necessary for intermediaries to be involved, other than in the sense that they are involved in the general process of session establishment. It is a *bad* thing if every time we define a new endpoint feature we then have to consider extending intermediates to support it. This is exactly contrary to the philosophy of the internet. Thanks, Paul From christer.holmberg@ericsson.com Mon Oct 15 06:57:36 2012 Return-Path: X-Original-To: dispatch@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: dispatch@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id DE54921F870E for ; Mon, 15 Oct 2012 06:57:36 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -6.113 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-6.113 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.136, BAYES_00=-2.599, HELO_EQ_SE=0.35, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-4] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.30]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id DWzzm3b0mF92 for ; Mon, 15 Oct 2012 06:57:36 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mailgw1.ericsson.se (mailgw1.ericsson.se [193.180.251.45]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id E189521F870B for ; Mon, 15 Oct 2012 06:57:35 -0700 (PDT) X-AuditID: c1b4fb2d-b7fea6d000002ccb-42-507c164ea89b Received: from esessmw0237.eemea.ericsson.se (Unknown_Domain [153.88.253.125]) by mailgw1.ericsson.se (Symantec Mail Security) with SMTP id 9B.14.11467.E461C705; Mon, 15 Oct 2012 15:57:34 +0200 (CEST) Received: from ESESSHC007.ericsson.se (153.88.183.39) by esessmw0237.eemea.ericsson.se (153.88.115.90) with Microsoft SMTP Server (TLS) id 8.3.279.1; Mon, 15 Oct 2012 15:57:33 +0200 Received: from ESESSMB209.ericsson.se ([169.254.9.182]) by ESESSHC007.ericsson.se ([153.88.183.39]) with mapi id 14.02.0318.001; Mon, 15 Oct 2012 15:57:33 +0200 From: Christer Holmberg To: 'Paul Kyzivat' , "dispatch@ietf.org" Thread-Topic: [dispatch] draft-hanes-dispatch-fax-capability-02 Thread-Index: Ac2grreP1mZPfJBcRJ2vIkq0RDyr/gKEW0GAAAIxXAAABPfWIA== Date: Mon, 15 Oct 2012 13:57:33 +0000 Message-ID: <7594FB04B1934943A5C02806D1A2204B01459A@ESESSMB209.ericsson.se> References: <201209111858.q8BIwvvW006046@freeze.ariadne.com> <506326B5.7090009@alum.mit.edu> <48CAA1D0-A0DE-4D1E-816E-6BB22902B4AD@cisco.com> <54633A5E61DC84429CB9FE3D9143C72118008EA7@MBX.dialogic.com> <23170_1348819872_50655BA0_23170_6953_2_88CAD1D4E8773F42858B58CAA28272A008C17C@PEXCVZYM12.corporate.adroot.infra.ftgroup> <1317445A-E2EF-4ECE-AFB9-F630A302236B@cisco.com> <31903_1349082556_50695DBB_31903_5565_1_88CAD1D4E8773F42858B58CAA28272A008DD1F@PEXCVZYM12.corporate.adroot.infra.ftgroup> <585B1724B58FF74DB231F9B6CDD159F4E7803E0F@gbplmail01.genband.com> <8A7C5039-1BC8-4FD5-B0E2-B5758B1F21F6@cisco.com> <7594FB04B1934943A5C02806D1A2204B013285@ESESSMB209.ericsson.se> <507C10B0.5070305@alum.mit.edu> In-Reply-To: <507C10B0.5070305@alum.mit.edu> Accept-Language: en-US Content-Language: en-US X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: x-originating-ip: [153.88.183.17] Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Brightmail-Tracker: H4sIAAAAAAAAA+NgFnrCLMWRmVeSWpSXmKPExsUyM+Jvra6fWE2Awep2I4ulkxawWqzYcIDV gcnj7/sPTB5LlvxkCmCK4rJJSc3JLEst0rdL4Mq4NPMTU8F11opX+yaxNTAeZuli5OSQEDCR +Pt6A5QtJnHh3nq2LkYuDiGBU4wSP27uZYdwdjJK/F9wEMpZwijxYdUCpi5GDg42AQuJ7n/a IN0iAqESNy4cZQKxhQXsJL4/PMAOEbeXWHB0BTOE7SRxs/sKI4jNIqAqsf7vYzaQMbwC3hJL d5lDjN/NJnHt5jmwOZwCOhJbpzwBu44R6Lrvp9aAxZkFxCVuPZnPBHG1gMSSPeeZIWxRiZeP /7GCzJQQUJRY3i8HUa4jsWD3JzYIW1ti2cLXYOW8AoISJ2dCjBcCircsnsA+gVF8FpINs5C0 z0LSPgtJ+wJGllWMwrmJmTnp5YZ6qUWZycXF+Xl6xambGIExdXDLb90djKfOiRxilOZgURLn 5Ura7y8kkJ5YkpqdmlqQWhRfVJqTWnyIkYmDU6qBUeaFt4n99qWLUhZoHDN+e/ncM1tT1hOz T8tvZbJoPL9ahe+Ye8zvnO1bNDrsOWMnPveqXXXzfuRmvpdKvas1pO/2f5RdvsEqJHe30b6A AxeC1V1uyp9rk5jV9+S0w5ftTfVBTrYi81JFjr2eoP/+tsf5kztPT7mkGTDhn8jPFEvlbzVc Jtat9kosxRmJhlrMRcWJAHja/dV3AgAA Subject: Re: [dispatch] draft-hanes-dispatch-fax-capability-02 X-BeenThere: dispatch@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.12 Precedence: list List-Id: DISPATCH Working Group Mail List List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 15 Oct 2012 13:57:37 -0000 Hi,=20 >> When we're doing this, I wonder whether it would be useful to define a f= eature capability indicator in the same shot. >> >> I don't have a use-case at the moment, but I guess there could also be a= need for media aware intermediaries to indicate their fax capabilities. > >What does it mean for an intermediary to have fax capabilitity? >Fax is an endpoint feature. It should not be necessary for intermediaries = to be involved, other than in the sense that they are involved in the gener= al process of session establishment. I was thinking whether there e.g. could be some mixer entity, which needs t= o support specific fax mechanisms. But, maybe that's not the case. Regards, Christer= From pkyzivat@alum.mit.edu Mon Oct 15 07:11:26 2012 Return-Path: X-Original-To: dispatch@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: dispatch@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 60FF211E80A4 for ; Mon, 15 Oct 2012 07:11:26 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -0.357 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-0.357 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.080, BAYES_00=-2.599, FH_RELAY_NODNS=1.451, HELO_MISMATCH_NET=0.611, RDNS_NONE=0.1] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.30]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id o7awv1dcMFUR for ; Mon, 15 Oct 2012 07:11:26 -0700 (PDT) Received: from qmta12.westchester.pa.mail.comcast.net (qmta12.westchester.pa.mail.comcast.net [IPv6:2001:558:fe14:44:76:96:59:227]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id CF73211E809A for ; Mon, 15 Oct 2012 07:11:25 -0700 (PDT) Received: from omta05.westchester.pa.mail.comcast.net ([76.96.62.43]) by qmta12.westchester.pa.mail.comcast.net with comcast id BQtE1k0060vyq2s5CSBW9K; Mon, 15 Oct 2012 14:11:30 +0000 Received: from Paul-Kyzivats-MacBook-Pro.local ([50.138.229.164]) by omta05.westchester.pa.mail.comcast.net with comcast id BS6p1k00g3ZTu2S3RS6q2k; Mon, 15 Oct 2012 14:06:50 +0000 Message-ID: <507C1860.5000900@alum.mit.edu> Date: Mon, 15 Oct 2012 10:06:24 -0400 From: Paul Kyzivat User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Macintosh; Intel Mac OS X 10.7; rv:15.0) Gecko/20120907 Thunderbird/15.0.1 MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Christer Holmberg References: <201209111858.q8BIwvvW006046@freeze.ariadne.com> <506326B5.7090009@alum.mit.edu> <48CAA1D0-A0DE-4D1E-816E-6BB22902B4AD@cisco.com> <54633A5E61DC84429CB9FE3D9143C72118008EA7@MBX.dialogic.com> <23170_1348819872_50655BA0_23170_6953_2_88CAD1D4E8773F42858B58CAA28272A008C17C@PEXCVZYM12.corporate.adroot.infra.ftgroup> <1317445A-E2EF-4ECE-AFB9-F630A302236B@cisco.com> <31903_1349082556_50695DBB_31903_5565_1_88CAD1D4E8773F42858B58CAA28272A008DD1F@PEXCVZYM12.corporate.adroot.infra.ftgroup> <585B1724B58FF74DB231F9B6CDD159F4E7803E0F@gbplmail01.genband.com> <8A7C5039-1BC8-4FD5-B0E2-B5758B1F21F6@cisco.com> <7594FB04B1934943A5C02806D1A2204B013285@ESESSMB209.ericsson.se> <507C10B0.5070305@alum.mit.edu> <7594FB04B1934943A5C02806D1A2204B01459A@ESESSMB209.ericsson.se> In-Reply-To: <7594FB04B1934943A5C02806D1A2204B01459A@ESESSMB209.ericsson.se> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Cc: "dispatch@ietf.org" Subject: Re: [dispatch] draft-hanes-dispatch-fax-capability-02 X-BeenThere: dispatch@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.12 Precedence: list List-Id: DISPATCH Working Group Mail List List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 15 Oct 2012 14:11:26 -0000 On 10/15/12 9:57 AM, Christer Holmberg wrote: > > Hi, > >>> When we're doing this, I wonder whether it would be useful to define a feature capability indicator in the same shot. >>> >>> I don't have a use-case at the moment, but I guess there could also be a need for media aware intermediaries to indicate their fax capabilities. >> >> What does it mean for an intermediary to have fax capabilitity? >> Fax is an endpoint feature. It should not be necessary for intermediaries to be involved, other than in the sense that they are involved in the general process of session establishment. > > I was thinking whether there e.g. could be some mixer entity, which needs to support specific fax mechanisms. But, maybe that's not the case. Say more. I can see how a conference focus (one sort of mixer) might want to indicate support for fax. But then a conference focus will typically be viewed as an endpoint, not an intermediary. In what circumstance is an intermediary (in the sense you mean) a mixer? Thanks, Paul From christer.holmberg@ericsson.com Mon Oct 15 07:21:35 2012 Return-Path: X-Original-To: dispatch@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: dispatch@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 894C411E80E3 for ; Mon, 15 Oct 2012 07:21:35 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -6.114 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-6.114 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.135, BAYES_00=-2.599, HELO_EQ_SE=0.35, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-4] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.30]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id GU4YGXTlVhGH for ; Mon, 15 Oct 2012 07:21:35 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mailgw2.ericsson.se (mailgw2.ericsson.se [193.180.251.37]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0E5D311E80DE for ; Mon, 15 Oct 2012 07:21:33 -0700 (PDT) X-AuditID: c1b4fb25-b7f956d0000011c3-f5-507c1bec5957 Received: from esessmw0184.eemea.ericsson.se (Unknown_Domain [153.88.253.125]) by mailgw2.ericsson.se (Symantec Mail Security) with SMTP id FD.DB.04547.CEB1C705; Mon, 15 Oct 2012 16:21:32 +0200 (CEST) Received: from ESESSHC020.ericsson.se (153.88.183.78) by esessmw0184.eemea.ericsson.se (153.88.115.81) with Microsoft SMTP Server (TLS) id 8.3.279.1; Mon, 15 Oct 2012 16:21:32 +0200 Received: from ESESSMB209.ericsson.se ([169.254.9.182]) by ESESSHC020.ericsson.se ([153.88.183.78]) with mapi id 14.02.0318.001; Mon, 15 Oct 2012 16:21:31 +0200 From: Christer Holmberg To: 'Paul Kyzivat' Thread-Topic: [dispatch] draft-hanes-dispatch-fax-capability-02 Thread-Index: Ac2grreP1mZPfJBcRJ2vIkq0RDyr/gKEW0GAAAIxXAAABPfWIP//4WsA///bUiA= Date: Mon, 15 Oct 2012 14:21:31 +0000 Message-ID: <7594FB04B1934943A5C02806D1A2204B0145FC@ESESSMB209.ericsson.se> References: <201209111858.q8BIwvvW006046@freeze.ariadne.com> <506326B5.7090009@alum.mit.edu> <48CAA1D0-A0DE-4D1E-816E-6BB22902B4AD@cisco.com> <54633A5E61DC84429CB9FE3D9143C72118008EA7@MBX.dialogic.com> <23170_1348819872_50655BA0_23170_6953_2_88CAD1D4E8773F42858B58CAA28272A008C17C@PEXCVZYM12.corporate.adroot.infra.ftgroup> <1317445A-E2EF-4ECE-AFB9-F630A302236B@cisco.com> <31903_1349082556_50695DBB_31903_5565_1_88CAD1D4E8773F42858B58CAA28272A008DD1F@PEXCVZYM12.corporate.adroot.infra.ftgroup> <585B1724B58FF74DB231F9B6CDD159F4E7803E0F@gbplmail01.genband.com> <8A7C5039-1BC8-4FD5-B0E2-B5758B1F21F6@cisco.com> <7594FB04B1934943A5C02806D1A2204B013285@ESESSMB209.ericsson.se> <507C10B0.5070305@alum.mit.edu> <7594FB04B1934943A5C02806D1A2204B01459A@ESESSMB209.ericsson.se> <507C1860.5000900@alum.mit.edu> In-Reply-To: <507C1860.5000900@alum.mit.edu> Accept-Language: en-US Content-Language: en-US X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: x-originating-ip: [153.88.183.17] Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Brightmail-Tracker: H4sIAAAAAAAAA+NgFvrILMWRmVeSWpSXmKPExsUyM+Jvre4b6ZoAgx/3VS2WTlrAarFiwwFW ByaPv+8/MHksWfKTKYApissmJTUnsyy1SN8ugSvj3bV3zAXnuSv+/v3I0sA4mbOLkZNDQsBE 4vPVRcwQtpjEhXvr2boYuTiEBE4xSvzYfoMRwtnJKLFu6gImCGcJo8TPI59Zuxg5ONgELCS6 /2mDdIsIaEkcuHKZBcRmFtCW+H99HSOILSxgJ/H94QF2iBp7iQVHVzBD2H4Sf6aeAqthEVCV 2PxtG1gvr4C3xKSeTVC75rNLTO68D5bgFNCRWLLhHiuIzQh06vdTa5gglolL3HoynwniBQGJ JXvOQ70jKvHy8T+wOyUEFCWW98tBlOtILNj9iQ3mzmULXzND7BWUODnzCdgqIaB4y+IJ7BMY JWYh2TALSfssJO2zkLQvYGRZxSicm5iZk15upJdalJlcXJyfp1ecuokRGG0Ht/xW3cF455zI IUZpDhYlcV7rrXv8hQTSE0tSs1NTC1KL4otKc1KLDzEycXBKNTCq/T+dbHvQd9VGlbnlZkWP j95fdqt+/d/Nc7Y3bHS179R+Pde2amdXzY9kRbNQ5ZSoB3Ue/aGPVQ67vNNeqBMcI8QQUBYt 427Zzz03ct+r4I1Pq/zvvl1x5l9wtGb+xT/i64MffvscNX9LxMW6rJIzu+2s2fuzTi7PsWfY uHVi+/0na1qOS1YrsRRnJBpqMRcVJwIAghGII4QCAAA= Cc: "dispatch@ietf.org" Subject: Re: [dispatch] draft-hanes-dispatch-fax-capability-02 X-BeenThere: dispatch@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.12 Precedence: list List-Id: DISPATCH Working Group Mail List List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 15 Oct 2012 14:21:35 -0000 Hi,=20 >>>> When we're doing this, I wonder whether it would be useful to define a= feature capability indicator in the same shot. >>>> >>>> I don't have a use-case at the moment, but I guess there could also be= a need for media aware intermediaries to indicate their fax capabilities. >>> >>> What does it mean for an intermediary to have fax capabilitity? >>> Fax is an endpoint feature. It should not be necessary for intermediari= es to be involved, other than in the sense that they are involved in the ge= neral process of session establishment. >> >> I was thinking whether there e.g. could be some mixer entity, which need= s to support specific fax mechanisms. But, maybe that's not the case. > > Say more. > > I can see how a conference focus (one sort of mixer) might want to indica= te support for fax. But then a conference focus will typically be viewed as= an endpoint, not an intermediary. > > In what circumstance is an intermediary (in the sense you mean) a mixer? I don't have any use-case at moment. OTOH, the hasn't been really much (if = any) focus on fax when int intermediary media functions have been discussed= . But, keep in mind that the reason for proxy-feature was that the intermedia= ries could not be seen as endpoints (read: they could not be represented by= the contact uri). Anyway, no need to speculate. If there at some point will be a need for a f= ax fci we can discuss it :) Regards, Christer From gsalguei@cisco.com Mon Oct 15 10:05:54 2012 Return-Path: X-Original-To: dispatch@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: dispatch@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6A61D11E80F5 for ; Mon, 15 Oct 2012 10:05:54 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -10.453 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-10.453 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.146, BAYES_00=-2.599, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_HI=-8] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.30]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id Bgyxz57wJkZv for ; Mon, 15 Oct 2012 10:05:54 -0700 (PDT) Received: from av-tac-rtp.cisco.com (av-tac-rtp.cisco.com [64.102.19.209]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id D669E11E80EE for ; Mon, 15 Oct 2012 10:05:53 -0700 (PDT) X-TACSUNS: Virus Scanned Received: from chook.cisco.com (localhost.cisco.com [127.0.0.1]) by av-tac-rtp.cisco.com (8.13.8+Sun/8.13.8) with ESMTP id q9FH5q24003718 for ; Mon, 15 Oct 2012 13:05:52 -0400 (EDT) Received: from rtp-gsalguei-8914.cisco.com (rtp-gsalguei-8914.cisco.com [10.116.132.53]) by chook.cisco.com (8.13.8+Sun/8.13.8) with ESMTP id q9FH5pek015808; Mon, 15 Oct 2012 13:05:51 -0400 (EDT) Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v1283) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii From: Gonzalo Salgueiro In-Reply-To: <7594FB04B1934943A5C02806D1A2204B0145FC@ESESSMB209.ericsson.se> Date: Mon, 15 Oct 2012 13:05:51 -0400 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Message-Id: <9C69C2A0-1A2A-4689-B844-6180902D1182@cisco.com> References: <201209111858.q8BIwvvW006046@freeze.ariadne.com> <506326B5.7090009@alum.mit.edu> <48CAA1D0-A0DE-4D1E-816E-6BB22902B4AD@cisco.com> <54633A5E61DC84429CB9FE3D9143C72118008EA7@MBX.dialogic.com> <23170_1348819872_50655BA0_23170_6953_2_88CAD1D4E8773F42858B58CAA28272A008C17C@PEXCVZYM12.corporate.adroot.infra.ftgroup> <1317445A-E2EF-4ECE-AFB9-F630A302236B@cisco.com> <31903_1349082556_50695DBB_31903_5565_1_88CAD1D4E8773F42858B58CAA28272A008DD1F@PEXCVZYM12.corporate.adroot.infra.ftgroup> <585B1724B58FF74DB231F9B6CDD159F4E7803E0F@gbplmail01.genband.com> <8A7C5039-1BC8-4FD5-B0E2-B5758B1F21F6@cisco.com> <7594FB04B1934943A5C02806D1A2204B013285@ESESSMB209.ericsson.se> <507C10B0.5070305@alum.mit.edu> <7594FB04B1934943A5C02806D1A2204B01459A@ESESSMB209.ericsson.se> <507C1860.5000900@alum.mit.edu> <7594FB04B1934943A5C02806D1A2204B0145FC@ESESSMB209.ericsson.se> To: Christer Holmberg X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.1283) Cc: DISPATCH Subject: Re: [dispatch] draft-hanes-dispatch-fax-capability-02 X-BeenThere: dispatch@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.12 Precedence: list List-Id: DISPATCH Working Group Mail List List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 15 Oct 2012 17:05:54 -0000 >=20 > Anyway, no need to speculate. If there at some point will be a need = for a fax fci we can discuss it :) >=20 My intent was very deliberately endpoint focused. I don't have a real = use case I can think of for intermediaries requiring definition of a = feature capability indicator. I think it is something worth thinking = about and something I'd be happy to work with you on but I'd prefer it = be separate from this very simple and scope restricted draft. Cheers, Gonzalo= From gonzalo.camarillo@ericsson.com Thu Oct 25 03:30:47 2012 Return-Path: X-Original-To: dispatch@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: dispatch@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7247D21F8997 for ; Thu, 25 Oct 2012 03:30:47 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -106.22 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-106.22 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.029, BAYES_00=-2.599, HELO_EQ_SE=0.35, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-4, USER_IN_WHITELIST=-100] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.30]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id aUNAXNu9aXL3 for ; Thu, 25 Oct 2012 03:30:47 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mailgw2.ericsson.se (mailgw2.ericsson.se [193.180.251.37]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7D96821F8995 for ; Thu, 25 Oct 2012 03:30:43 -0700 (PDT) X-AuditID: c1b4fb25-b7f956d0000011c3-fa-508914d2f1ce Received: from esessmw0237.eemea.ericsson.se (Unknown_Domain [153.88.253.125]) by mailgw2.ericsson.se (Symantec Mail Security) with SMTP id 25.72.04547.2D419805; Thu, 25 Oct 2012 12:30:42 +0200 (CEST) Received: from [131.160.126.249] (153.88.115.8) by esessmw0237.eemea.ericsson.se (153.88.115.91) with Microsoft SMTP Server id 8.3.279.1; Thu, 25 Oct 2012 12:30:41 +0200 Message-ID: <508914D1.60207@ericsson.com> Date: Thu, 25 Oct 2012 13:30:41 +0300 From: Gonzalo Camarillo User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows NT 6.0; rv:15.0) Gecko/20120907 Thunderbird/15.0.1 MIME-Version: 1.0 To: DISPATCH X-Enigmail-Version: 1.4.4 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="ISO-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Brightmail-Tracker: H4sIAAAAAAAAA+NgFnrNJMWRmVeSWpSXmKPExsUyM+Jvre4lkc4Ag45L4hZLJy1gdWD0WLLk J1MAYxSXTUpqTmZZapG+XQJXxo9D0gWtrBVz3x9ja2BsZ+li5OCQEDCRWN/p2cXICWSKSVy4 t54NxBYSOMUosalRtIuRC8heyyjxYd86FpAEr4CmxKd5JxhBbBYBVYnWCydZQWw2AQuJLbfu g9WICgRLnNu4jQ2iXlDi5MwnYHERAQWJvZcOsILsFRawkli7jxFir6TEm8k3wUqYBfQkplxt YYSw5SW2v53DDHGPtsTyZy0sExj5ZyGZOgtJyywkLQsYmVcxCucmZuaklxvppRZlJhcX5+fp FaduYgQG2MEtv1V3MN45J3KIUZqDRUmc13rrHn8hgfTEktTs1NSC1KL4otKc1OJDjEwcnFIN jL32y3i2d/aXGak45rf7zGvR7dqUfk4r4UiT/xpTbs3znyc5npwqcmTeV6/4bX1PhXS/6/M4 LnRWYTp467KbxkKv/WeW+bBW17x/mxbarnVFV3NmytdE5ddSQWJPujUFMvez6ja6Hn15RKbG t8BYr+Wl/w0ZkSWeSdtqXdIlm5tuiu2M+iOkxFKckWioxVxUnAgAZNwW3P4BAAA= Subject: [dispatch] Comment on draft-hanes-dispatch-fax-capability-03 X-BeenThere: dispatch@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.12 Precedence: list List-Id: DISPATCH Working Group Mail List List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 25 Oct 2012 10:30:47 -0000 Hi, the draft below looks good in general. I only have a very minor comment: http://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-hanes-dispatch-fax-capability-03 When the draft talks about "call setup", it refers to the process whereby an INVITE request is routed to the appropriate user agent. The thing is that some readers will probably think about call set up as the offer/answer exchange. Keeping this in mind, the two first sentences of Section 3 may result confusing for some readers. Even though this is a minor comment, clarifying it should be a matter of editing a few sentences. It should not take long at all. Thanks, Gonzalo From mary.ietf.barnes@gmail.com Thu Oct 25 08:46:08 2012 Return-Path: X-Original-To: dispatch@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: dispatch@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id AFDD521F889E for ; Thu, 25 Oct 2012 08:46:08 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -103.399 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-103.399 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.199, BAYES_00=-2.599, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW=-1, USER_IN_WHITELIST=-100] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.30]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id rPNbTUbQK4UV for ; Thu, 25 Oct 2012 08:46:08 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail-la0-f44.google.com (mail-la0-f44.google.com [209.85.215.44]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id AA9D121F88CD for ; Thu, 25 Oct 2012 08:46:07 -0700 (PDT) Received: by mail-la0-f44.google.com with SMTP id b11so1828428lam.31 for ; Thu, 25 Oct 2012 08:46:06 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20120113; h=mime-version:in-reply-to:references:date:message-id:subject:from:to :cc:content-type; bh=Ry0vjFHt9Y4DNt200lZu1W1VcLngX9+Gw0Cc4AZ535s=; b=Jm3CFXUiuHbpZd0qRzI5RciaPdsXumQmCql9RgNz6BKrWs7LKwC4yLU17iWjo/i4D8 yZFwB46geoAT4R8h8PMLIuQxc8YZz2ihlVmhwp7LhUaNZoJMsZsklr1dobF25LwIuQVv pKhXvNHBfZfB9PCkIhIeSfZcxbxlRxB3+mJt2ZyHEVtFBUQru0gqw5lo9MFXN9EZXW9N LhUsFNjJuF+TMVfEtiQd8S1K9lR/e+f0BR+4pHCyJWugDm4PIx2K7HarATaIZvPJk8v4 xZUkQxRvLuABRUgKHboIaHvz8CC2Y+ocnhqcJ4cRs03MLma9DBadCwWYo8xkKJsjMo4p DL7A== MIME-Version: 1.0 Received: by 10.112.38.163 with SMTP id h3mr1472733lbk.134.1351179961344; Thu, 25 Oct 2012 08:46:01 -0700 (PDT) Received: by 10.114.69.139 with HTTP; Thu, 25 Oct 2012 08:46:01 -0700 (PDT) In-Reply-To: <508914D1.60207@ericsson.com> References: <508914D1.60207@ericsson.com> Date: Thu, 25 Oct 2012 10:46:01 -0500 Message-ID: From: Mary Barnes To: DISPATCH Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary=e0cb4efe2a7a9fa54f04cce41999 Cc: Cullen Jennings , draft-hanes-dispatch-fax-capability@tools.ietf.org Subject: Re: [dispatch] Comment on draft-hanes-dispatch-fax-capability-03 X-BeenThere: dispatch@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.12 Precedence: list List-Id: DISPATCH Working Group Mail List List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 25 Oct 2012 15:46:08 -0000 --e0cb4efe2a7a9fa54f04cce41999 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Gonzalo has agreed to AD sponsor this document pending feedback from the WG. If anyone has any concerns about progressing this document as such please respond on the list, giving your reasons no later than Nov 1st, 2012. I you agree on the progression of this document, it would also be helpful to reply indicating such. Thanks, Mary Barnes DISPATCH WG co-chair On Thu, Oct 25, 2012 at 5:30 AM, Gonzalo Camarillo < Gonzalo.Camarillo@ericsson.com> wrote: > Hi, > > the draft below looks good in general. I only have a very minor comment: > > http://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-hanes-dispatch-fax-capability-03 > > When the draft talks about "call setup", it refers to the process > whereby an INVITE request is routed to the appropriate user agent. The > thing is that some readers will probably think about call set up as the > offer/answer exchange. Keeping this in mind, the two first sentences of > Section 3 may result confusing for some readers. > > Even though this is a minor comment, clarifying it should be a matter of > editing a few sentences. It should not take long at all. > > Thanks, > > Gonzalo > > _______________________________________________ > dispatch mailing list > dispatch@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dispatch > --e0cb4efe2a7a9fa54f04cce41999 Content-Type: text/html; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Gonzalo has agreed to AD sponsor this document pending feedback from the WG= . =A0If anyone has any concerns about progressing this document as such ple= ase respond on the list, giving your reasons no later than Nov 1st, 2012. I= you agree on the progression of this document, it would also be helpful to= reply indicating such.

Thanks,
Mary Barnes
DISPATCH WG co-chair=

On Thu, Oct 25, 2012 at 5:30 AM, Gonzalo= Camarillo <Gonzalo.Camarillo@ericsson.com> wro= te:
Hi,

the draft below looks good in general. I only have a very minor comment:
http://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-hanes-dispatch-fax-ca= pability-03

When the draft talks about "call setup", it refers to the process=
whereby an INVITE request is routed to the appropriate user agent. The
thing is that some readers will probably think about call set up as the
offer/answer exchange. Keeping this in mind, the two first sentences of
Section 3 may result confusing for some readers.

Even though this is a minor comment, clarifying it should be a matter of editing a few sentences. It should not take long at all.

Thanks,

Gonzalo

_______________________________________________
dispatch mailing list
dispatch@ietf.org
https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dispatch

--e0cb4efe2a7a9fa54f04cce41999-- From kevin@kpfleming.us Thu Oct 25 09:03:26 2012 Return-Path: X-Original-To: dispatch@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: dispatch@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id D78C421F892B for ; Thu, 25 Oct 2012 09:03:26 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.976 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.976 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-2.599, FM_FORGED_GMAIL=0.622, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW=-1] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.30]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id QRSiEkdKfGhb for ; Thu, 25 Oct 2012 09:03:26 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail-ia0-f172.google.com (mail-ia0-f172.google.com [209.85.210.172]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id ECF5121F8901 for ; Thu, 25 Oct 2012 09:03:25 -0700 (PDT) Received: by mail-ia0-f172.google.com with SMTP id o25so1637109iad.31 for ; Thu, 25 Oct 2012 09:03:25 -0700 (PDT) X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=google.com; s=20120113; h=mime-version:in-reply-to:references:date:message-id:subject:from:to :cc:content-type:x-gm-message-state; bh=ld3p0UtMVHMHNHLoB+0fzpCZKrAyCwK1COhnUz+bgbo=; b=FJuql8EqIpFukUB3JYdcZq0KweHbjgmOUdpoqrD3/gzWIBWuSxb6eOb3URaWuJAkCJ hDRDsujs7Vq4LVy5S3dgC8tThD2+y5S47yCl9VDxFTEuDh4yCHQ00bb5+O0AGl/D21F/ QWf73nQ/WY+/wVJH3ynlETGnKdLCt/1FhBKF3rD6WhSeOp51SF47zbegmDuhsWePFGtd P3Va18dWhQrxt60AnKAjSa7EABnLyJ6Z/hYOY8LQBJSf//atfnxhNmtG5emonwJuM058 VWnFQQVOb+0Tc5aTIn116p2TBZeiv2MVeuJmTzA31Jg9GvtWy6gzeWBjEwqK731oPkyL C8tg== MIME-Version: 1.0 Received: by 10.50.214.66 with SMTP id ny2mr6442178igc.21.1351181005597; Thu, 25 Oct 2012 09:03:25 -0700 (PDT) Received: by 10.42.117.74 with HTTP; Thu, 25 Oct 2012 09:03:25 -0700 (PDT) In-Reply-To: References: <508914D1.60207@ericsson.com> Date: Thu, 25 Oct 2012 12:03:25 -0400 Message-ID: From: Kevin Fleming To: Mary Barnes Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary=14dae9341199ddab8904cce457a1 X-Gm-Message-State: ALoCoQnWwMZvCxbpv5cX6aL5PBzPsSIkucwRU1v8K4IpeppVgKGHLvoulo/hXSjEpQOdKHLSP3/j Cc: Cullen Jennings , DISPATCH Subject: Re: [dispatch] Comment on draft-hanes-dispatch-fax-capability-03 X-BeenThere: dispatch@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.12 Precedence: list List-Id: DISPATCH Working Group Mail List List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 25 Oct 2012 16:03:27 -0000 --14dae9341199ddab8904cce457a1 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 On Thu, Oct 25, 2012 at 11:46 AM, Mary Barnes wrote: > Gonzalo has agreed to AD sponsor this document pending feedback from the > WG. If anyone has any concerns about progressing this document as such > please respond on the list, giving your reasons no later than Nov 1st, > 2012. I you agree on the progression of this document, it would also be > helpful to reply indicating such. > > I support this draft progressing towards publication, and if AD sponsored is the most expedient route, then so be it. --14dae9341199ddab8904cce457a1 Content-Type: text/html; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable On Thu, Oct 25, 2012 at 11:46 AM, Mary Barnes <mary.ietf.barnes@g= mail.com> wrote:
Gonzalo has agreed to AD sponsor this document pending feedback from the WG= . =C2=A0If anyone has any concerns about progressing this document as such = please respond on the list, giving your reasons no later than Nov 1st, 2012= . I you agree on the progression of this document, it would also be helpful= to reply indicating such.


I support this draft progressing= towards publication, and if AD sponsored is the most expedient route, then= so be it.=C2=A0
--14dae9341199ddab8904cce457a1-- From richard@shockey.us Thu Oct 25 10:23:42 2012 Return-Path: X-Original-To: dispatch@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: dispatch@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id C1E2921F89A7 for ; Thu, 25 Oct 2012 10:23:42 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -101.275 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-101.275 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=1.323, BAYES_00=-2.599, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, USER_IN_WHITELIST=-100] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.30]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id NjSPtLZc9Xz1 for ; Thu, 25 Oct 2012 10:23:41 -0700 (PDT) Received: from oproxy12-pub.bluehost.com (oproxy12-pub.bluehost.com [50.87.16.10]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with SMTP id 8E37021F89A4 for ; Thu, 25 Oct 2012 10:23:41 -0700 (PDT) Received: (qmail 12361 invoked by uid 0); 25 Oct 2012 17:23:16 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO box462.bluehost.com) (74.220.219.62) by oproxy12.bluehost.com with SMTP; 25 Oct 2012 17:23:16 -0000 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; q=dns/txt; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=shockey.us; s=default; h=Content-Type:MIME-Version:Message-ID:Date:Subject:In-Reply-To:References:Cc:To:From; bh=0qM3kDi4oUPXo5rG1R5QR3rtZpwIIfGDCWz1ant8IFI=; b=H62m7KfjkdfnZMOnSLB7cu6kfOvF9hqTs9Z9rG4cr7otugKhwbtljZlTG1gPpLYbf4MFzWow24OZU3OWOZI82yuzRXVSAAERHpLgeSU5MctfqYv/hkWg9YTXIj0WY3jq; Received: from [71.191.243.130] (port=59153 helo=RSHOCKEYPC) by box462.bluehost.com with esmtpa (Exim 4.76) (envelope-from ) id 1TRR9H-0008Bt-GD; Thu, 25 Oct 2012 11:23:16 -0600 From: "Richard Shockey" To: "'Mary Barnes'" References: <508914D1.60207@ericsson.com> In-Reply-To: Date: Thu, 25 Oct 2012 13:23:12 -0400 Message-ID: <007e01cdb2d5$6a087610$3e196230$@us> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_007F_01CDB2B3.E2F6D610" X-Mailer: Microsoft Office Outlook 12.0 Content-Language: en-us Thread-Index: Ac2yykXubK7JmGWHTc+8Ctw3mk4yFwACu50w X-Identified-User: {3286:box462.bluehost.com:shockeyu:shockey.us} {sentby:smtp auth 71.191.243.130 authed with richard@shockey.us} Cc: 'Cullen Jennings' , 'DISPATCH' Subject: Re: [dispatch] Comment on draft-hanes-dispatch-fax-capability-03 X-BeenThere: dispatch@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.12 Precedence: list List-Id: DISPATCH Working Group Mail List List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 25 Oct 2012 17:23:42 -0000 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_007F_01CDB2B3.E2F6D610 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable I also support this draft moving forward as soon as practically = possible.=20 =20 From: dispatch-bounces@ietf.org [mailto:dispatch-bounces@ietf.org] On = Behalf Of Kevin Fleming Sent: Thursday, October 25, 2012 12:03 PM To: Mary Barnes Cc: Cullen Jennings; DISPATCH Subject: Re: [dispatch] Comment on = draft-hanes-dispatch-fax-capability-03 =20 On Thu, Oct 25, 2012 at 11:46 AM, Mary Barnes = wrote: Gonzalo has agreed to AD sponsor this document pending feedback from the = WG. If anyone has any concerns about progressing this document as such = please respond on the list, giving your reasons no later than Nov 1st, = 2012. I you agree on the progression of this document, it would also be = helpful to reply indicating such. =20 =20 I support this draft progressing towards publication, and if AD = sponsored is the most expedient route, then so be it.=20 ------=_NextPart_000_007F_01CDB2B3.E2F6D610 Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

I also support this draft moving forward as soon as practically = possible.

 

From:= = dispatch-bounces@ietf.org [mailto:dispatch-bounces@ietf.org] On = Behalf Of Kevin Fleming
Sent: Thursday, October 25, 2012 = 12:03 PM
To: Mary Barnes
Cc: Cullen Jennings; = DISPATCH
Subject: Re: [dispatch] Comment on = draft-hanes-dispatch-fax-capability-03

 

On Thu, Oct = 25, 2012 at 11:46 AM, Mary Barnes <mary.ietf.barnes@gmail.com> = wrote:

Gonzalo = has agreed to AD sponsor this document pending feedback from the WG. =  If anyone has any concerns about progressing this document as such = please respond on the list, giving your reasons no later than Nov 1st, = 2012. I you agree on the progression of this document, it would also be = helpful to reply indicating such.

 

 

I = support this draft progressing towards publication, and if AD sponsored = is the most expedient route, then so be = it. 

------=_NextPart_000_007F_01CDB2B3.E2F6D610-- From christer.holmberg@ericsson.com Thu Oct 25 11:53:00 2012 Return-Path: X-Original-To: dispatch@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: dispatch@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id A525821F8816 for ; Thu, 25 Oct 2012 11:53:00 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -6.135 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-6.135 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.113, BAYES_00=-2.599, HELO_EQ_SE=0.35, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-4] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.30]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id CQYp4CUtsssT for ; Thu, 25 Oct 2012 11:53:00 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mailgw7.ericsson.se (mailgw7.ericsson.se [193.180.251.48]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 58F2521F87A0 for ; Thu, 25 Oct 2012 11:52:59 -0700 (PDT) X-AuditID: c1b4fb30-b7f936d0000018b3-53-50898a894738 Received: from esessmw0191.eemea.ericsson.se (Unknown_Domain [153.88.253.125]) by mailgw7.ericsson.se (Symantec Mail Security) with SMTP id B8.0E.06323.98A89805; Thu, 25 Oct 2012 20:52:58 +0200 (CEST) Received: from ESESSHC005.ericsson.se (153.88.183.33) by esessmw0191.eemea.ericsson.se (153.88.115.84) with Microsoft SMTP Server (TLS) id 8.3.279.1; Thu, 25 Oct 2012 20:52:57 +0200 Received: from ESESSMB209.ericsson.se ([169.254.9.182]) by ESESSHC005.ericsson.se ([153.88.183.33]) with mapi id 14.02.0318.001; Thu, 25 Oct 2012 20:52:57 +0200 From: Christer Holmberg To: 'Richard Shockey' , 'Mary Barnes' Thread-Topic: [dispatch] Comment on draft-hanes-dispatch-fax-capability-03 Thread-Index: AQHNspvO25gg73VcEEWhdNsi+t7I1JfKCOuAgAAE3YCAABZKAIAAOkbQ Date: Thu, 25 Oct 2012 18:52:57 +0000 Message-ID: <7594FB04B1934943A5C02806D1A2204B01EA24@ESESSMB209.ericsson.se> References: <508914D1.60207@ericsson.com> <007e01cdb2d5$6a087610$3e196230$@us> In-Reply-To: <007e01cdb2d5$6a087610$3e196230$@us> Accept-Language: en-US Content-Language: en-US X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: x-originating-ip: [153.88.183.16] Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="_000_7594FB04B1934943A5C02806D1A2204B01EA24ESESSMB209ericsso_" MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Brightmail-Tracker: H4sIAAAAAAAAA+NgFuplkeLIzCtJLcpLzFFi42KZGfG3VrerqzPA4NtRToulkxawWnRMZrP4 vH8/s8WMHwYOLB5Tfm9k9dg56y67x5IlP5k8Jn48wxzAEsVlk5Kak1mWWqRvl8CVMX/iDpaC SdYVy9o7mRsYdxp3MXJySAiYSKw+tIYZwhaTuHBvPVsXIxeHkMApRolvnQcZIZydjBIL76xm h3CWMEp0zn8NlOHgYBOwkOj+pw3SLSIQIdG2YAZYmFnAQ2LTXCOQsLCAp8Skk4dZIEq8JKa+ 38AMUiIi4CZx+10BSJhFQFXi3Z6tYDfwCnhL/Pl4lAli0z1GibYjt9lB6jkFDCVeXPAAqWEE uvP7qTVMIDazgLjErSfzmSDuF5BYsuc81C+iEi8f/2OFsBUldp5tZ4aoz5fY9vAjC8QuQYmT M5+A2UIC2hItiyewT2AUn4Vk7CwkLbOQtEDEdSQW7P7EBmFrSyxb+JoZxj5z4DETsvgCRvZV jOy5iZk56eXmmxiBUXpwy2+DHYyb7osdYpTmYFES59VT3e8vJJCeWJKanZpakFoUX1Sak1p8 iJGJg1OqgXH7ldce6zvjs7evObmIO//mvN+szflP/q1qbd/y6QOD1kz2i093FSx6Hv97ymcX i5lPDH+evLNYfbev0gvrNddN33w8dr7n4lmmv2uDzAq7lnFtZuu6GBflMNG/Z7ulqd7EnKcX o0xONG/OF1l7oHfDrUyvKYFG8V05sx1/818wXZEqmjmz7rOiEktxRqKhFnNRcSIAfN0IVqAC AAA= Cc: 'Cullen Jennings' , 'DISPATCH' Subject: Re: [dispatch] Comment on draft-hanes-dispatch-fax-capability-03 X-BeenThere: dispatch@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.12 Precedence: list List-Id: DISPATCH Working Group Mail List List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 25 Oct 2012 18:53:00 -0000 --_000_7594FB04B1934943A5C02806D1A2204B01EA24ESESSMB209ericsso_ Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable I thought people with concerns were asked to speak up. But, I guess people = had conserns that the draft won't move forward unless they give their suppo= rt, so I also want to indicate that I support moving the draft forward :) Regards, Christer ________________________________ From: dispatch-bounces@ietf.org [mailto:dispatch-bounces@ietf.org] On Behal= f Of Richard Shockey Sent: 25. lokakuuta 2012 20:23 To: 'Mary Barnes' Cc: 'Cullen Jennings'; 'DISPATCH' Subject: Re: [dispatch] Comment on draft-hanes-dispatch-fax-capability-03 I also support this draft moving forward as soon as practically possible. From: dispatch-bounces@ietf.org [mailto:dispatch-bounces@ietf.org] On Behal= f Of Kevin Fleming Sent: Thursday, October 25, 2012 12:03 PM To: Mary Barnes Cc: Cullen Jennings; DISPATCH Subject: Re: [dispatch] Comment on draft-hanes-dispatch-fax-capability-03 On Thu, Oct 25, 2012 at 11:46 AM, Mary Barnes > wrote: Gonzalo has agreed to AD sponsor this document pending feedback from the WG= . If anyone has any concerns about progressing this document as such pleas= e respond on the list, giving your reasons no later than Nov 1st, 2012. I y= ou agree on the progression of this document, it would also be helpful to r= eply indicating such. I support this draft progressing towards publication, and if AD sponsored i= s the most expedient route, then so be it. --_000_7594FB04B1934943A5C02806D1A2204B01EA24ESESSMB209ericsso_ Content-Type: text/html; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
I thought people with concerns we= re asked to speak up. But, I guess people had conserns that the draft won't= move forward unless they give their support, so I also want to indicate that I support moving the draft forward :)
 
Regards,
 
Christer

From: dispatch-bounces@ietf.org [ma= ilto:dispatch-bounces@ietf.org] On Behalf Of Richard Shockey
Sent: 25. lokakuuta 2012 20:23
To: 'Mary Barnes'
Cc: 'Cullen Jennings'; 'DISPATCH'
Subject: Re: [dispatch] Comment on draft-hanes-dispatch-fax-capabili= ty-03

I also support this draft moving forward a= s soon as practically possible.

 

From: dispatch-bounces@ietf.org [mailto:dispatch-bou= nces@ietf.org] On Behalf Of Kevin Fleming
Sent: Thursday, October 25, 2012 12:03 PM
To: Mary Barnes
Cc: Cullen Jennings; DISPATCH
Subject: Re: [dispatch] Comment on draft-hanes-dispatch-fax-capabili= ty-03

 

On Thu, Oct 25, 2012 at 11:46 AM, Mary Barnes <mary.ietf.bar= nes@gmail.com> wrote:

Gonzalo has agreed to AD sponsor this document pendi= ng feedback from the WG.  If anyone has any concerns about progressing= this document as such please respond on the list, giving your reasons no l= ater than Nov 1st, 2012. I you agree on the progression of this document, it would also be helpful to reply indica= ting such.

 

 

I support this draft progressing towards publication= , and if AD sponsored is the most expedient route, then so be it. 

--_000_7594FB04B1934943A5C02806D1A2204B01EA24ESESSMB209ericsso_-- From bruno.chatras@orange.com Fri Oct 26 10:29:23 2012 Return-Path: X-Original-To: dispatch@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: dispatch@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6625F21F8545 for ; Fri, 26 Oct 2012 10:29:23 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.298 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.298 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.299, BAYES_00=-2.599, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, UNPARSEABLE_RELAY=0.001] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.30]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id w9kbGrI3NAr8 for ; Fri, 26 Oct 2012 10:29:22 -0700 (PDT) Received: from relais-inet.francetelecom.com (relais-ias92.francetelecom.com [193.251.215.92]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3930A21F84EC for ; Fri, 26 Oct 2012 10:29:22 -0700 (PDT) Received: from omfedm06.si.francetelecom.fr (unknown [xx.xx.xx.2]) by omfedm11.si.francetelecom.fr (ESMTP service) with ESMTP id EC6683B43A7; Fri, 26 Oct 2012 19:29:20 +0200 (CEST) Received: from Exchangemail-eme1.itn.ftgroup (unknown [10.114.1.183]) by omfedm06.si.francetelecom.fr (ESMTP service) with ESMTP id CB1E027C083; Fri, 26 Oct 2012 19:29:20 +0200 (CEST) Received: from PEXCVZYM12.corporate.adroot.infra.ftgroup ([fe80::81f:1640:4749:5d13]) by PEXCVZYH02.corporate.adroot.infra.ftgroup ([::1]) with mapi id 14.02.0298.004; Fri, 26 Oct 2012 19:29:20 +0200 From: To: Christer Holmberg , 'Richard Shockey' , 'Mary Barnes' Thread-Topic: [dispatch] Comment on draft-hanes-dispatch-fax-capability-03 Thread-Index: AQHNspvOCo+nfhky2kmsXivutNbNoJfKCOuAgAAE3YCAABZKAIAAOkbQgAF7FVA= Date: Fri, 26 Oct 2012 17:29:19 +0000 Message-ID: <15377_1351272560_508AC870_15377_13919_1_88CAD1D4E8773F42858B58CAA28272A00A3629@PEXCVZYM12.corporate.adroot.infra.ftgroup> References: <508914D1.60207@ericsson.com> <007e01cdb2d5$6a087610$3e196230$@us> <7594FB04B1934943A5C02806D1A2204B01EA24@ESESSMB209.ericsson.se> In-Reply-To: <7594FB04B1934943A5C02806D1A2204B01EA24@ESESSMB209.ericsson.se> Accept-Language: fr-FR, en-US Content-Language: fr-FR X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: x-originating-ip: [10.197.38.5] Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="_000_88CAD1D4E8773F42858B58CAA28272A00A3629PEXCVZYM12corpora_" MIME-Version: 1.0 X-PMX-Version: 5.6.1.2065439, Antispam-Engine: 2.7.2.376379, Antispam-Data: 2012.10.26.122415 Cc: 'Cullen Jennings' , 'DISPATCH' Subject: Re: [dispatch] Comment on draft-hanes-dispatch-fax-capability-03 X-BeenThere: dispatch@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.12 Precedence: list List-Id: DISPATCH Working Group Mail List List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 26 Oct 2012 17:29:23 -0000 --_000_88CAD1D4E8773F42858B58CAA28272A00A3629PEXCVZYM12corpora_ Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable +1 De : dispatch-bounces@ietf.org [mailto:dispatch-bounces@ietf.org] De la par= t de Christer Holmberg Envoy=E9 : jeudi 25 octobre 2012 20:53 =C0 : 'Richard Shockey'; 'Mary Barnes' Cc : 'Cullen Jennings'; 'DISPATCH' Objet : Re: [dispatch] Comment on draft-hanes-dispatch-fax-capability-03 I thought people with concerns were asked to speak up. But, I guess people = had conserns that the draft won't move forward unless they give their suppo= rt, so I also want to indicate that I support moving the draft forward :) Regards, Christer ________________________________ From: dispatch-bounces@ietf.org [mailto:dispatch-bounces@ietf.org] On Behal= f Of Richard Shockey Sent: 25. lokakuuta 2012 20:23 To: 'Mary Barnes' Cc: 'Cullen Jennings'; 'DISPATCH' Subject: Re: [dispatch] Comment on draft-hanes-dispatch-fax-capability-03 I also support this draft moving forward as soon as practically possible. From: dispatch-bounces@ietf.org [mailto:dispatch-bounces@ietf.org] On Behal= f Of Kevin Fleming Sent: Thursday, October 25, 2012 12:03 PM To: Mary Barnes Cc: Cullen Jennings; DISPATCH Subject: Re: [dispatch] Comment on draft-hanes-dispatch-fax-capability-03 On Thu, Oct 25, 2012 at 11:46 AM, Mary Barnes > wrote: Gonzalo has agreed to AD sponsor this document pending feedback from the WG= . If anyone has any concerns about progressing this document as such pleas= e respond on the list, giving your reasons no later than Nov 1st, 2012. I y= ou agree on the progression of this document, it would also be helpful to r= eply indicating such. I support this draft progressing towards publication, and if AD sponsored i= s the most expedient route, then so be it. ___________________________________________________________________________= ______________________________________________ Ce message et ses pieces jointes peuvent contenir des informations confiden= tielles ou privilegiees et ne doivent donc pas etre diffuses, exploites ou copies sans autorisation. Si vous avez recu= ce message par erreur, veuillez le signaler a l'expediteur et le detruire ainsi que les pieces jointes. Les messages el= ectroniques etant susceptibles d'alteration, France Telecom - Orange decline toute responsabilite si ce message a ete al= tere, deforme ou falsifie. Merci. This message and its attachments may contain confidential or privileged inf= ormation that may be protected by law; they should not be distributed, used or copied without authorisation. If you have received this email in error, please notify the sender and dele= te this message and its attachments. As emails may be altered, France Telecom - Orange is not liable for message= s that have been modified, changed or falsified. Thank you. --_000_88CAD1D4E8773F42858B58CAA28272A00A3629PEXCVZYM12corpora_ Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

+1

 

De : disp= atch-bounces@ietf.org [mailto:dispatch-bounces@ietf.org] De la part de Christer Holmberg
Envoy=E9 : jeudi 25 octobre 2012 20:53
=C0 : 'Richard Shockey'; 'Mary Barnes'
Cc : 'Cullen Jennings'; 'DISPATCH'
Objet : Re: [dispatch] Comment on draft-hanes-dispatch-fax-capa= bility-03

 

I thought people with concerns were asked to speak up. But, I g= uess people had conserns that the draft won't move forward unless they give= their support, so I also want to indicate that I support moving the draft forward :)

 

Regards,

 

Christer

 

From: dispatch-bounces@ietf.= org [mailto:dispatch-bounces@ietf.org] On Behalf Of Richard Shockey
Sent: 25. lokakuuta 2012 20:23
To: 'Mary Barnes'
Cc: 'Cullen Jennings'; 'DISPATCH'
Subject: Re: [dispatch] Comment on draft-hanes-dispatch-fax-capabili= ty-03

I also support this draft moving forward as soon as practica= lly possible.

 

From: dispatch-bounces@ie= tf.org [mailto:dispatch-bounces@ietf.org] On Behalf Of Kevin Fleming
Sent: Thursday, October 25, 2012 12:03 PM
To: Mary Barnes
Cc: Cullen Jennings; DISPATCH
Subject: Re: [dispatch] Comment on draft-hanes-dispatch-fax-capabili= ty-03

 

On Thu, Oct 25, 2012 at 11:46 A= M, Mary Barnes <mary.ietf.barnes@gmail.com> wrote:

Gonzalo has agreed to AD sponso= r this document pending feedback from the WG.  If anyone has any conce= rns about progressing this document as such please respond on the list, giv= ing your reasons no later than Nov 1st, 2012. I you agree on the progression of this document, it would also be helpful = to reply indicating such.

 

 

I support this draft progressin= g towards publication, and if AD sponsored is the most expedient route, the= n so be it. 

______________________________________________________________________=
___________________________________________________

Ce message et ses pieces jointes peuvent contenir des informations confiden=
tielles ou privilegiees et ne doivent donc
pas etre diffuses, exploites ou copies sans autorisation. Si vous avez recu=
 ce message par erreur, veuillez le signaler
a l'expediteur et le detruire ainsi que les pieces jointes. Les messages el=
ectroniques etant susceptibles d'alteration,
France Telecom - Orange decline toute responsabilite si ce message a ete al=
tere, deforme ou falsifie. Merci.

This message and its attachments may contain confidential or privileged inf=
ormation that may be protected by law;
they should not be distributed, used or copied without authorisation.
If you have received this email in error, please notify the sender and dele=
te this message and its attachments.
As emails may be altered, France Telecom - Orange is not liable for message=
s that have been modified, changed or falsified.
Thank you.
--_000_88CAD1D4E8773F42858B58CAA28272A00A3629PEXCVZYM12corpora_-- From andrew.hutton@siemens-enterprise.com Tue Oct 30 06:36:51 2012 Return-Path: X-Original-To: dispatch@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: dispatch@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id C403A21F84C2 for ; Tue, 30 Oct 2012 06:36:51 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.598 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.598 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-2.599, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.30]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id rb-KnxVfu+aR for ; Tue, 30 Oct 2012 06:36:51 -0700 (PDT) Received: from senmx11-mx.siemens-enterprise.com (senmx11-mx.siemens-enterprise.com [62.134.46.9]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id B796021F84C1 for ; Tue, 30 Oct 2012 06:36:50 -0700 (PDT) Received: from MCHP01HTC.global-ad.net (unknown [172.29.42.234]) by senmx11-mx.siemens-enterprise.com (Server) with ESMTP id 0EAB61EB8422; Tue, 30 Oct 2012 14:36:49 +0100 (CET) Received: from MCHP04MSX.global-ad.net ([169.254.1.76]) by MCHP01HTC.global-ad.net ([172.29.42.234]) with mapi id 14.02.0318.001; Tue, 30 Oct 2012 14:36:39 +0100 From: "Hutton, Andrew" To: Mary Barnes , DISPATCH Thread-Topic: [dispatch] Comment on draft-hanes-dispatch-fax-capability-03 Thread-Index: AQHNssfdTBUhy/7z0UKwFjs7nAex45fR4XJQ Date: Tue, 30 Oct 2012 13:36:39 +0000 Message-ID: <9F33F40F6F2CD847824537F3C4E37DDF0131B2BC@MCHP04MSX.global-ad.net> References: <508914D1.60207@ericsson.com> In-Reply-To: Accept-Language: en-US Content-Language: en-US X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: x-originating-ip: [172.29.42.225] Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="_000_9F33F40F6F2CD847824537F3C4E37DDF0131B2BCMCHP04MSXglobal_" MIME-Version: 1.0 Cc: Cullen Jennings , "draft-hanes-dispatch-fax-capability@tools.ietf.org" Subject: Re: [dispatch] Comment on draft-hanes-dispatch-fax-capability-03 X-BeenThere: dispatch@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.12 Precedence: list List-Id: DISPATCH Working Group Mail List List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 30 Oct 2012 13:36:51 -0000 --_000_9F33F40F6F2CD847824537F3C4E37DDF0131B2BCMCHP04MSXglobal_ Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable I support the draft moving forward by whatever means possible. Regards Andy From: dispatch-bounces@ietf.org [mailto:dispatch-bounces@ietf.org] On Behal= f Of Mary Barnes Sent: 25 October 2012 16:46 To: DISPATCH Cc: Cullen Jennings; draft-hanes-dispatch-fax-capability@tools.ietf.org Subject: Re: [dispatch] Comment on draft-hanes-dispatch-fax-capability-03 Gonzalo has agreed to AD sponsor this document pending feedback from the WG= . If anyone has any concerns about progressing this document as such pleas= e respond on the list, giving your reasons no later than Nov 1st, 2012. I y= ou agree on the progression of this document, it would also be helpful to r= eply indicating such. Thanks, Mary Barnes DISPATCH WG co-chair On Thu, Oct 25, 2012 at 5:30 AM, Gonzalo Camarillo > wrote: Hi, the draft below looks good in general. I only have a very minor comment: http://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-hanes-dispatch-fax-capability-03 When the draft talks about "call setup", it refers to the process whereby an INVITE request is routed to the appropriate user agent. The thing is that some readers will probably think about call set up as the offer/answer exchange. Keeping this in mind, the two first sentences of Section 3 may result confusing for some readers. Even though this is a minor comment, clarifying it should be a matter of editing a few sentences. It should not take long at all. Thanks, Gonzalo _______________________________________________ dispatch mailing list dispatch@ietf.org https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dispatch --_000_9F33F40F6F2CD847824537F3C4E37DDF0131B2BCMCHP04MSXglobal_ Content-Type: text/html; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

I support the draft movin= g forward by whatever means possible.

 <= /p>

Regards=

Andy

 <= /p>

From: dispatch= -bounces@ietf.org [mailto:dispatch-bounces@ietf.org] On Behalf Of Mary Barnes
Sent: 25 October 2012 16:46
To: DISPATCH
Cc: Cullen Jennings; draft-hanes-dispatch-fax-capability@tools.ietf.= org
Subject: Re: [dispatch] Comment on draft-hanes-dispatch-fax-capabili= ty-03

 

Gonzalo has agreed to AD sponsor this document pendi= ng feedback from the WG.  If anyone has any concerns about progressing= this document as such please respond on the list, giving your reasons no l= ater than Nov 1st, 2012. I you agree on the progression of this document, it would also be helpful to reply indica= ting such.

 

Thanks,

Mary Barnes

DISPATCH WG co-chair<= o:p>

On Thu, Oct 25, 2012 at 5:30 AM, Gonzalo Camarillo &= lt;Gonz= alo.Camarillo@ericsson.com> wrote:

Hi,

the draft below looks good in general. I only have a very minor comment:
http://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-hanes-dispatch-fax-ca= pability-03

When the draft talks about "call setup", it refers to the process=
whereby an INVITE request is routed to the appropriate user agent. The
thing is that some readers will probably think about call set up as the
offer/answer exchange. Keeping this in mind, the two first sentences of
Section 3 may result confusing for some readers.

Even though this is a minor comment, clarifying it should be a matter of editing a few sentences. It should not take long at all.

Thanks,

Gonzalo

_______________________________________________
dispatch mailing list
dispatch@ietf.org
https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dispatch

 

--_000_9F33F40F6F2CD847824537F3C4E37DDF0131B2BCMCHP04MSXglobal_--