From sumanth@cablelabs.com Mon Feb 1 05:57:51 2010 Return-Path: X-Original-To: drinks@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: drinks@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8F18B28C12E for ; Mon, 1 Feb 2010 05:57:51 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -0.463 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-0.463 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-2.599, HELO_EQ_MODEMCABLE=0.768, HOST_EQ_MODEMCABLE=1.368] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id g+zf2kUYY399 for ; Mon, 1 Feb 2010 05:57:50 -0800 (PST) Received: from ondar.cablelabs.com (ondar.cablelabs.com [192.160.73.61]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 80D2828C117 for ; Mon, 1 Feb 2010 05:57:50 -0800 (PST) Received: from kyzyl.cablelabs.com (kyzyl [10.253.0.7]) by ondar.cablelabs.com (8.14.3/8.14.3) with ESMTP id o11DwNkd027152; Mon, 1 Feb 2010 06:58:23 -0700 Received: from srvxchg.cablelabs.com (10.5.0.15) by kyzyl.cablelabs.com (F-Secure/fsigk_smtp/303/kyzyl.cablelabs.com); Mon, 1 Feb 2010 06:58:23 -0700 (MST) X-Virus-Status: clean(F-Secure/fsigk_smtp/303/kyzyl.cablelabs.com) Received: from srvxchg.cablelabs.com ([10.5.0.15]) by srvxchg ([10.5.0.15]) with mapi; Mon, 1 Feb 2010 06:58:24 -0700 From: Sumanth Channabasappa To: Richard Shockey , "drinks@ietf.org" Date: Mon, 1 Feb 2010 06:58:21 -0700 Thread-Topic: [drinks] Scheduling for Anaheim Thread-Index: Acqh5FCS/XY7mDz2SsKsvXhTwZ0BNgBXt5xQ Message-ID: <76AC5FEF83F1E64491446437EA81A61F7CD4B2A6A1@srvxchg> References: <007901caa1e4$51376240$f3a626c0$@us> In-Reply-To: <007901caa1e4$51376240$f3a626c0$@us> Accept-Language: en-US Content-Language: en-US X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: acceptlanguage: en-US Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Approved: ondar Subject: Re: [drinks] Scheduling for Anaheim X-BeenThere: drinks@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF DRINKS WG List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 01 Feb 2010 13:57:51 -0000 Rich, =20 Thanks for raising the question. You are correct in that there has not been= formal activity on the list. However, as hinted back in December, a few of= us are interested in this work. And as a follow-up, we have regrouped sinc= e a couple of weeks ago (offline) to collaborate and make progress. To be s= pecific, our goal is to collect open issues, incubate discussions and poten= tial resolutions, and to continue to make progress starting where we left o= ff last year. Accordingly, we plan to provide updates and transition these = technical discussions to this list at the earliest, and on a periodic basis= (in the upcoming days/weeks). And as a result, we hope to have progress ca= ptured as updates to the Internet-Drafts associated with this work, prior t= o Anaheim. Instead of listing the folks who are interested and involved, I will let th= em speak for themselves. =20 - S ________________________________ From: drinks-bounces@ietf.org [mailto:drinks-bounces@ietf.org] On Behalf Of= Richard Shockey Sent: Saturday, January 30, 2010 12:42 PM To: drinks@ietf.org Subject: [drinks] Scheduling for Anaheim I want to point out again that there has been zero activity on this list si= nce Dec 19 and no discussion of next steps etc. =20 The chairs have to make a determination on what to do about meeting.=20 =20 If there is interest now is the time voice your opinion one way or another. =20 Richard Shockey Shockey Consulting Chairman of the Board - SIP Forum richard(at)shockey.us Voice +1 703593-2683 Skype/AIM/Facebook LinkedIn - rshockey101 =20 From alexander.mayrhofer@nic.at Thu Feb 4 06:35:08 2010 Return-Path: X-Original-To: drinks@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: drinks@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 337A028C0FA for ; Thu, 4 Feb 2010 06:35:08 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -9.43 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-9.43 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-2.599, HELO_EQ_AT=0.424, HOST_EQ_AT=0.745, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_HI=-8] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id DGbAPVF4QLLQ for ; Thu, 4 Feb 2010 06:35:07 -0800 (PST) Received: from mail.sbg.nic.at (mail.sbg.nic.at [192.174.68.200]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id D057A3A690A for ; Thu, 4 Feb 2010 06:35:02 -0800 (PST) Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]) by mail.sbg.nic.at with XWall v3.45 ; Thu, 4 Feb 2010 15:35:47 +0100 Content-class: urn:content-classes:message MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable x-mimeole: Produced By Microsoft Exchange V6.5 Date: Thu, 4 Feb 2010 15:35:47 +0100 Message-ID: <8BC845943058D844ABFC73D2220D466508E4669D@nics-mail.sbg.nic.at> In-Reply-To: X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: Thread-Topic: [drinks] Drinks: Dead, Alive, or just sleeping it off Thread-Index: AcqAwxEeYnCtorEOS8CbnLuPTkkLwQk4WHIA References: From: "Alexander Mayrhofer" To: "Cullen Jennings" , X-XWALL-BCKS: auto Cc: rai-ads@tools.ietf.org Subject: Re: [drinks] Drinks: Dead, Alive, or just sleeping it off X-BeenThere: drinks@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF DRINKS WG List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 04 Feb 2010 14:35:08 -0000 =20 Cullen Jennings wrote on Saturday, December 19, 2009: > I'm happy to get any suggestions on what we should do with=20 > this WG but here's my straw man plan from what I currently=20 > know. We watch and see if multiple people are willing to put=20 > in the effort needed over the next few months and we make=20 > significant progress between now and the next meeting. And I=20 > don't mean a small burst of energy the week before the draft=20 > deadline. I'm sure lots of people have good intentions of=20 > working on this but if it does not actually make a high=20 > enough priority that people do work on it, then I suggest we=20 > shelve the work until this becomes top priority again and=20 > close the WG. No work would be lost, the mailing list could=20 > remain open and drafts will continue to exist on the web.=20 [WG Chair hat on] I agree that there has been little activity in the last few months in 2009 in this group. The inactivity towards the end of 2009 was definitely also a personal fault from myself, since i was greatly distracted from DRINKS for personal reaons.=20 However, starting with the beginning of the year, parts of the original author team of the requirements as well as the protocol draft have picked up work again. I am (with my WG hat off) part of that team. I'm pleased that Jean-Francois Mule has also managed to acquire two new members for that team. There are currently 8 people in that team, and all of them have assured that they are willing to invest significant amount of work/time into the documents. The team holds weekly conference calls (three so far in 2010), and will report progress back to WG chairs as well the main DRINKS list. One valueable outcome of one of the first calls was that there were some issues discovered in the SPEERMINT terminology, on which parts of the DRINKS work is based.=20 Therefore, i am confident that the group will be able to demonstrate significant progress before IETF 77, and therefore i object shutting down the WG prematurely.=20 > I've also considered if a charter with a greatly reduced=20 > scope to help get something small done, then move on to=20 > something bigger. But if there is zero energy to do work, it=20 > won't matter how small the charter is so the reduced charter=20 > did not seem like it would help. Obviously, our milestones are way outdated - again, this is primarily the fault of the WG chairs - an action item taken away from Stockholm was creating new milestone, but hasn't been completed since then. I'm picking up the work on new, realistic milestones, and i am also open for discussion around simplifying (or splitting?) the charter - either via phone, email or in person during the Anaheim meeting.=20 But, as outlined above - i am confident that the "energy level" in the group has significantly risen since December, and that the work is making progress. Alex From mmaharishi@tnsi.com Wed Feb 10 12:25:56 2010 Return-Path: X-Original-To: drinks@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: drinks@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id BB81428C22C for ; Wed, 10 Feb 2010 12:25:56 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.599 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.599 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-2.599] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id wCQBTK8WCHuP for ; Wed, 10 Feb 2010 12:25:55 -0800 (PST) Received: from tnsi.com (relayus.tnsi.com [208.224.248.44]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 72BDF28C16F for ; Wed, 10 Feb 2010 12:25:54 -0800 (PST) Received: from ([172.17.7.231]) by relayus.tnsi.com with ESMTP with TLS id 4440551.40447934; Wed, 10 Feb 2010 15:26:55 -0500 Received: from TNS-MAIL-NA.win2k.corp.tnsi.com ([172.17.7.214]) by MAIL-HUB-NA.win2k.corp.tnsi.com ([172.17.7.231]) with mapi; Wed, 10 Feb 2010 15:26:55 -0500 From: "Maharishi, Manjul" To: Sumanth Channabasappa , Richard Shockey , "drinks@ietf.org" Date: Wed, 10 Feb 2010 15:26:52 -0500 Thread-Topic: [drinks] Scheduling for Anaheim Thread-Index: Acqh5FCS/XY7mDz2SsKsvXhTwZ0BNgBXt5xQAdMBUdA= Message-ID: <754963199212404AB8E9CFCA6C3D0CDA0D87558C00@TNS-MAIL-NA.win2k.corp.tnsi.com> References: <007901caa1e4$51376240$f3a626c0$@us> <76AC5FEF83F1E64491446437EA81A61F7CD4B2A6A1@srvxchg> In-Reply-To: <76AC5FEF83F1E64491446437EA81A61F7CD4B2A6A1@srvxchg> Accept-Language: en-US Content-Language: en-US X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: acceptlanguage: en-US Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable MIME-Version: 1.0 Subject: Re: [drinks] Scheduling for Anaheim X-BeenThere: drinks@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF DRINKS WG List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 10 Feb 2010 20:25:56 -0000 >> Instead of listing the folks who are interested and involved, I will let= them speak for themselves. I too have been part of these discussions, and support the continuation of = this effort. Manjul -----Original Message----- From: drinks-bounces@ietf.org [mailto:drinks-bounces@ietf.org] On Behalf Of= Sumanth Channabasappa Sent: Monday, February 01, 2010 8:58 AM To: Richard Shockey; drinks@ietf.org Subject: Re: [drinks] Scheduling for Anaheim Rich, Thanks for raising the question. You are correct in that there has not been= formal activity on the list. However, as hinted back in December, a few of= us are interested in this work. And as a follow-up, we have regrouped sinc= e a couple of weeks ago (offline) to collaborate and make progress. To be s= pecific, our goal is to collect open issues, incubate discussions and poten= tial resolutions, and to continue to make progress starting where we left o= ff last year. Accordingly, we plan to provide updates and transition these = technical discussions to this list at the earliest, and on a periodic basis= (in the upcoming days/weeks). And as a result, we hope to have progress ca= ptured as updates to the Internet-Drafts associated with this work, prior t= o Anaheim. Instead of listing the folks who are interested and involved, I will let th= em speak for themselves. - S ________________________________ From: drinks-bounces@ietf.org [mailto:drinks-bounces@ietf.org] On Behalf Of= Richard Shockey Sent: Saturday, January 30, 2010 12:42 PM To: drinks@ietf.org Subject: [drinks] Scheduling for Anaheim I want to point out again that there has been zero activity on this list si= nce Dec 19 and no discussion of next steps etc. The chairs have to make a determination on what to do about meeting. If there is interest now is the time voice your opinion one way or another. Richard Shockey Shockey Consulting Chairman of the Board - SIP Forum richard(at)shockey.us Voice +1 703593-2683 Skype/AIM/Facebook LinkedIn - rshockey101 _______________________________________________ drinks mailing list drinks@ietf.org https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/drinks This e-mail message is for the sole use of the intended recipient(s)and may contain confidential and privileged information of Transaction Network Serv= ices. Any unauthorised review, use, disclosure or distribution is prohibited. If = you are not the intended recipient, please contact the sender by reply e-mail a= nd destroy all copies of the original message. From bernie@ietf.hoeneisen.ch Sun Feb 7 02:10:56 2010 Return-Path: X-Original-To: drinks@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: drinks@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 055753A68B5; Sun, 7 Feb 2010 02:10:55 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.336 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.336 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.263, BAYES_00=-2.599] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id xolPlMSWSQGG; Sun, 7 Feb 2010 02:10:53 -0800 (PST) Received: from softronics.hoeneisen.ch (softronics.hoeneisen.ch [62.2.86.178]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 204B13A6898; Sun, 7 Feb 2010 02:10:52 -0800 (PST) Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]) by softronics.hoeneisen.ch with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1Ne47J-0000n8-A6; Sun, 07 Feb 2010 11:11:49 +0100 Date: Sun, 7 Feb 2010 11:11:49 +0100 (CET) From: Bernie Hoeneisen X-X-Sender: bhoeneis@softronics.hoeneisen.ch To: speermint@ietf.org, drinks@ietf.org, ietf@ietf.org Message-ID: User-Agent: Alpine 2.00 (DEB 1167 2008-08-23) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed X-SA-Exim-Connect-IP: 127.0.0.1 X-SA-Exim-Mail-From: bernie@ietf.hoeneisen.ch X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No (on softronics.hoeneisen.ch); SAEximRunCond expanded to false X-Mailman-Approved-At: Thu, 11 Feb 2010 08:14:27 -0800 Subject: [drinks] BOF / New Mailing List E2MD (E.164 To MetaData) DDDS application X-BeenThere: drinks@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF DRINKS WG List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sun, 07 Feb 2010 10:10:57 -0000 Dear RAI, DNS (and related topics) experts Please be informed that a new mailing list has been created recently for discussion related to a proposed DDDS application 'E.164 to MetaData' (E2MD). If you are interested in this topic, please subscribe to the new Mailing List via: https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/e2md E2MD is proposed to hold E.164-related information that does not fit the normal use cases for E2U. Known use cases include information that describes the structure of the E.164 numbering plan, and records which do not represent end-user communication URIs. A BOF about E2MD has been proposed for the upcoming IETF in Anaheim: http://trac.tools.ietf.org/bof/trac/#RAI Note: E2MD has been formerly known as E2M (a naming conflict with a legacy SIP WG item required a change of the acronym for this BOF) cheers, Bernie -- http://ucom.ch/ Tech Consulting for Internet Standardization From alexander.mayrhofer@nic.at Mon Feb 15 09:52:38 2010 Return-Path: X-Original-To: drinks@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: drinks@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2DA6928C201 for ; Mon, 15 Feb 2010 09:52:38 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -9.289 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-9.289 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.141, BAYES_00=-2.599, HELO_EQ_AT=0.424, HOST_EQ_AT=0.745, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_HI=-8] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id wfVKR6WBJdry for ; Mon, 15 Feb 2010 09:52:37 -0800 (PST) Received: from mail.sbg.nic.at (mail.sbg.nic.at [192.174.68.200]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0C09028C1F0 for ; Mon, 15 Feb 2010 09:52:36 -0800 (PST) Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]) by mail.sbg.nic.at with XWall v3.45 ; Mon, 15 Feb 2010 18:54:06 +0100 Content-class: urn:content-classes:message MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable x-mimeole: Produced By Microsoft Exchange V6.5 Date: Mon, 15 Feb 2010 18:54:05 +0100 Message-ID: <8BC845943058D844ABFC73D2220D466508E47137@nics-mail.sbg.nic.at> X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: Thread-Topic: Agenda planning for DRINKS in Anaheim. Thread-Index: AcquZ92OaXdPWgWiTaGPLYheuYl6WQ== From: "Alexander Mayrhofer" To: X-XWALL-BCKS: auto Subject: [drinks] Agenda planning for DRINKS in Anaheim. X-BeenThere: drinks@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF DRINKS WG List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 15 Feb 2010 17:52:38 -0000 All, For the working group meeting in Anaheim, a 1.5 hour meeting slot has been requested. We'd like to start with Agenda planning, so please email the WG chairs if you intend to present current or new work to the group in that meeting. Thanks, Alex=20 From dschwartz@xconnect.net Thu Feb 18 03:44:07 2010 Return-Path: X-Original-To: drinks@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: drinks@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id D5CFD3A7CBF for ; Thu, 18 Feb 2010 03:44:07 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -0.745 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-0.745 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.365, BAYES_05=-1.11] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id tU2Sqo8qFzyP for ; Thu, 18 Feb 2010 03:44:07 -0800 (PST) Received: from outlook.xconnect.net (outlook.xconnect.net [212.25.92.170]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8F1D528C0FD for ; Thu, 18 Feb 2010 03:44:05 -0800 (PST) Received: from ISR-JLM-MAIL1.xconnect.co.il ([172.16.100.8]) by ISR-JLM-MAIL1.xconnect.co.il ([172.16.100.8]) with mapi; Thu, 18 Feb 2010 13:45:45 +0200 From: David Schwartz To: Richard Shockey Date: Thu, 18 Feb 2010 13:45:45 +0200 Thread-Topic: [drinks] Scheduling for Anaheim Thread-Index: Acqh5FCS/XY7mDz2SsKsvXhTwZ0BNgOqnZig Message-ID: <6EA53FAD386F9D46B97D49BFE148D5140603A386@ISR-JLM-MAIL1.xconnect.co.il> References: <007901caa1e4$51376240$f3a626c0$@us> In-Reply-To: <007901caa1e4$51376240$f3a626c0$@us> Accept-Language: en-US Content-Language: en-US X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: acceptlanguage: en-US Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable MIME-Version: 1.0 Cc: "drinks@ietf.org" Subject: Re: [drinks] Scheduling for Anaheim X-BeenThere: drinks@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF DRINKS WG List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 18 Feb 2010 11:44:07 -0000 Hi Rich Sorry for taking my time to chime in on this. Basically, I feel the work should continue as we all know this area is in d= ire need of standardization.=20 I would however prefer that the work be on the open list and not on a priva= te list limited to a select few (even if it is these select few who are doi= ng all the work). I myself have recently started attending the weekly call = and have been pushing for the work to return to the DRINKS list at large. David ________________________________________ From: drinks-bounces@ietf.org [drinks-bounces@ietf.org] On Behalf Of Richar= d Shockey [richard@shockey.us] Sent: Saturday, January 30, 2010 9:42 PM To: drinks@ietf.org Subject: [drinks] Scheduling for Anaheim I want to point out again that there has been zero activity on this list si= nce Dec 19 and no discussion of next steps etc. The chairs have to make a determination on what to do about meeting. If there is interest now is the time voice your opinion one way or another. Richard Shockey Shockey Consulting Chairman of the Board - SIP Forum richard(at)shockey.us Voice +1 703593-2683 Skype/AIM/Facebook LinkedIn - rshockey101 From dschwartz@xconnect.net Thu Feb 18 03:53:18 2010 Return-Path: X-Original-To: drinks@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: drinks@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5AC193A7B39 for ; Thu, 18 Feb 2010 03:53:18 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.542 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.542 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=1.057, BAYES_00=-2.599] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id qS3fFjif+Vwn for ; Thu, 18 Feb 2010 03:53:17 -0800 (PST) Received: from outlook.xconnect.net (outlook.xconnect.net [212.25.92.170]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 460BC3A7664 for ; Thu, 18 Feb 2010 03:53:17 -0800 (PST) Received: from ISR-JLM-MAIL1.xconnect.co.il ([172.16.100.8]) by ISR-JLM-MAIL1.xconnect.co.il ([172.16.100.8]) with mapi; Thu, 18 Feb 2010 13:54:57 +0200 From: David Schwartz To: "drinks@ietf.org" Date: Thu, 18 Feb 2010 13:54:57 +0200 Thread-Topic: LUF and LRF (again) Thread-Index: AQHKsJExYF8XQFhPYESVG9kVczJAtg== Message-ID: <6EA53FAD386F9D46B97D49BFE148D5140603A388@ISR-JLM-MAIL1.xconnect.co.il> Accept-Language: en-US Content-Language: en-US X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: acceptlanguage: en-US Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable MIME-Version: 1.0 Subject: [drinks] LUF and LRF (again) X-BeenThere: drinks@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF DRINKS WG List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 18 Feb 2010 11:53:18 -0000 In our discussions on the weekly call the issue of scope of charter came up= again (sigh) with the age old question of do we limit ourselves to target = definition (i.e. WHO --> LUF) or do we tackle the bigger issue of target ro= uting (i.e. HOW or WHERE --> LRF). The answer to this question affects many= aspects of what is being provisioned and as such it is crucial to resolve = at this stage. Can people weigh in on this now please so we can better prepare for Anaheim= ? (Personally, I am in favor of including the LRF - will send a more detailed= email at a later point explaining my thoughts on this) David= From mmaharishi@tnsi.com Thu Feb 18 06:15:13 2010 Return-Path: X-Original-To: drinks@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: drinks@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id F13EE3A7CFD for ; Thu, 18 Feb 2010 06:15:12 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.599 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.599 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-2.599] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id ntPowcvy8+7Z for ; Thu, 18 Feb 2010 06:15:09 -0800 (PST) Received: from tnsi.com (relayus.tnsi.com [208.224.248.44]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4558B3A7CBD for ; Thu, 18 Feb 2010 06:15:07 -0800 (PST) Received: from ([172.17.7.231]) by relayus.tnsi.com with ESMTP with TLS id 4440551.40702000; Thu, 18 Feb 2010 09:16:41 -0500 Received: from TNS-MAIL-NA.win2k.corp.tnsi.com ([172.17.7.214]) by MAIL-HUB-NA.win2k.corp.tnsi.com ([172.17.7.231]) with mapi; Thu, 18 Feb 2010 09:16:41 -0500 From: "Maharishi, Manjul" To: David Schwartz , "drinks@ietf.org" Date: Thu, 18 Feb 2010 09:16:40 -0500 Thread-Topic: LUF and LRF (again) Thread-Index: AQHKsJExYF8XQFhPYESVG9kVczJAtpHL6Byg Message-ID: <754963199212404AB8E9CFCA6C3D0CDA0D881DC567@TNS-MAIL-NA.win2k.corp.tnsi.com> References: <6EA53FAD386F9D46B97D49BFE148D5140603A388@ISR-JLM-MAIL1.xconnect.co.il> In-Reply-To: <6EA53FAD386F9D46B97D49BFE148D5140603A388@ISR-JLM-MAIL1.xconnect.co.il> Accept-Language: en-US Content-Language: en-US X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: acceptlanguage: en-US Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable MIME-Version: 1.0 Subject: Re: [drinks] LUF and LRF (again) X-BeenThere: drinks@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF DRINKS WG List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 18 Feb 2010 14:15:13 -0000 Hi David, I liked the way you characterized it - Who->LUF, How/Where->LRF (maybe this= was discussed earlier, and I just didn't catch it). I am in favor of including LRF in the DRINKS charter/scope. Without that, t= he scope gets severely limited, and becomes just one step away from any of = the regulatory bodies data (line ownership and portability). Manjul -----Original Message----- From: drinks-bounces@ietf.org [mailto:drinks-bounces@ietf.org] On Behalf Of= David Schwartz Sent: Thursday, February 18, 2010 6:55 AM To: drinks@ietf.org Subject: [drinks] LUF and LRF (again) In our discussions on the weekly call the issue of scope of charter came up= again (sigh) with the age old question of do we limit ourselves to target = definition (i.e. WHO --> LUF) or do we tackle the bigger issue of target ro= uting (i.e. HOW or WHERE --> LRF). The answer to this question affects many= aspects of what is being provisioned and as such it is crucial to resolve = at this stage. Can people weigh in on this now please so we can better prepare for Anaheim= ? (Personally, I am in favor of including the LRF - will send a more detailed= email at a later point explaining my thoughts on this) David _______________________________________________ drinks mailing list drinks@ietf.org https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/drinks This e-mail message is for the sole use of the intended recipient(s)and may contain confidential and privileged information of Transaction Network Serv= ices. Any unauthorised review, use, disclosure or distribution is prohibited. If = you are not the intended recipient, please contact the sender by reply e-mail a= nd destroy all copies of the original message. From kcartwright@tnsi.com Thu Feb 18 06:57:17 2010 Return-Path: X-Original-To: drinks@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: drinks@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6614E3A7F7A for ; Thu, 18 Feb 2010 06:57:17 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.599 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.599 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.000, BAYES_00=-2.599] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 5125MGH2bPKP for ; Thu, 18 Feb 2010 06:57:16 -0800 (PST) Received: from tnsi.com (relayus.tnsi.com [208.224.248.44]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 691AD3A7EBB for ; Thu, 18 Feb 2010 06:57:15 -0800 (PST) Received: from ([172.17.7.231]) by relayus.tnsi.com with ESMTP with TLS id 4440551.40703910; Thu, 18 Feb 2010 09:58:50 -0500 Received: from TNS-MAIL-NA.win2k.corp.tnsi.com ([172.17.7.214]) by MAIL-HUB-NA.win2k.corp.tnsi.com ([172.17.7.231]) with mapi; Thu, 18 Feb 2010 09:58:50 -0500 From: "Cartwright, Kenneth" To: David Schwartz , "drinks@ietf.org" Date: Thu, 18 Feb 2010 09:58:49 -0500 Thread-Topic: LUF and LRF (again) Thread-Index: AQHKsJExYF8XQFhPYESVG9kVczJAtpHL85kg Message-ID: <754963199212404AB8E9CFCA6C3D0CDA0D881DC633@TNS-MAIL-NA.win2k.corp.tnsi.com> References: <6EA53FAD386F9D46B97D49BFE148D5140603A388@ISR-JLM-MAIL1.xconnect.co.il> In-Reply-To: <6EA53FAD386F9D46B97D49BFE148D5140603A388@ISR-JLM-MAIL1.xconnect.co.il> Accept-Language: en-US Content-Language: en-US X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: acceptlanguage: en-US Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable MIME-Version: 1.0 Subject: Re: [drinks] LUF and LRF (again) X-BeenThere: drinks@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF DRINKS WG List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 18 Feb 2010 14:57:17 -0000 Maybe I missed something, but I did not know there was any question about t= his. We are definitely covering LRF and the LUF. But just on a side note, I'd not say that the LUF =3D Who and the LRF =3D = WHERE. I'd say that the LUF =3D WHERE (where is the ultimate destination) and the = LRF =3D HOW (how to get to the ultimate destination). Ken -----Original Message----- From: drinks-bounces@ietf.org [mailto:drinks-bounces@ietf.org] On Behalf Of= David Schwartz Sent: Thursday, February 18, 2010 6:55 AM To: drinks@ietf.org Subject: [drinks] LUF and LRF (again) In our discussions on the weekly call the issue of scope of charter came up= again (sigh) with the age old question of do we limit ourselves to target = definition (i.e. WHO --> LUF) or do we tackle the bigger issue of target ro= uting (i.e. HOW or WHERE --> LRF). The answer to this question affects many= aspects of what is being provisioned and as such it is crucial to resolve = at this stage. Can people weigh in on this now please so we can better prepare for Anaheim= ? (Personally, I am in favor of including the LRF - will send a more detailed= email at a later point explaining my thoughts on this) David _______________________________________________ drinks mailing list drinks@ietf.org https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/drinks This e-mail message is for the sole use of the intended recipient(s)and may contain confidential and privileged information of Transaction Network Serv= ices. Any unauthorised review, use, disclosure or distribution is prohibited. If = you are not the intended recipient, please contact the sender by reply e-mail a= nd destroy all copies of the original message. From richard@shockey.us Thu Feb 18 07:19:04 2010 Return-Path: X-Original-To: drinks@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: drinks@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5F3603A7F84 for ; Thu, 18 Feb 2010 07:19:04 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.323 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.323 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.276, BAYES_00=-2.599] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id k9FeHUDBJbsX for ; Thu, 18 Feb 2010 07:19:03 -0800 (PST) Received: from outbound-mail-352.bluehost.com (outbound-mail-352.bluehost.com [66.147.249.13]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with SMTP id 61E003A7EE1 for ; Thu, 18 Feb 2010 07:19:03 -0800 (PST) Received: (qmail 16578 invoked by uid 0); 18 Feb 2010 15:20:46 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO box462.bluehost.com) (74.220.219.62) by oproxy1.bluehost.com.bluehost.com with SMTP; 18 Feb 2010 15:20:46 -0000 DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=default; d=shockey.us; h=Received:From:To:Subject:Date:Message-ID:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding:X-Mailer:Thread-Index:Content-Language:X-Identified-User; b=AK+fZP1cb31jDjbTOxKA5R9qiuV/94NX0QK3B5wh16b2ennc1hZgETaVpodTj8EgzZGJVN9Is8QyBrxjSQ0zWkKcyRp9b+2HQR3T3ZWnfL3eYcq2x6++Sfz2bZoTbrNC; Received: from pool-96-241-62-33.washdc.fios.verizon.net ([96.241.62.33] helo=RSHOCKEYPC) by box462.bluehost.com with esmtpa (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1Ni8BJ-0000fq-UQ for drinks@ietf.org; Thu, 18 Feb 2010 08:20:46 -0700 From: "Richard Shockey" To: Date: Thu, 18 Feb 2010 10:20:42 -0500 Message-ID: <010201cab0ad$efd895e0$cf89c1a0$@us> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: Microsoft Office Outlook 12.0 Thread-Index: AcqqgdOJSt7/cAxKRwi+OqS/nxjz5wGLAzMg Content-Language: en-us X-Identified-User: {3286:box462.bluehost.com:shockeyu:shockey.us} {sentby:smtp auth 96.241.62.33 authed with richard@shockey.us} Subject: [drinks] FW: Guidance on Interim Meetings, Conference Calls and Jabber Sessions X-BeenThere: drinks@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF DRINKS WG List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 18 Feb 2010 15:19:04 -0000 A reminder .. -----Original Message----- From: wgchairs-bounces@ietf.org [mailto:wgchairs-bounces@ietf.org] On Behalf Of Cullen Jennings Sent: Wednesday, February 10, 2010 1:50 PM To: Working Group Chairs Subject: Guidance on Interim Meetings, Conference Calls and Jabber Sessions May I remind all chairs that if you are going to have a interim meeting, conference call, or jabber session for you WG, please, go read http://www.ietf.org/iesg/statement/interim-meetings.html Thanks, Cullen From pp3129@att.com Thu Feb 18 07:25:46 2010 Return-Path: X-Original-To: drinks@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: drinks@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8015A3A7F85 for ; Thu, 18 Feb 2010 07:25:46 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -106.599 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-106.599 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.000, BAYES_00=-2.599, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-4, USER_IN_WHITELIST=-100] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id pU-5XJpCmUd2 for ; Thu, 18 Feb 2010 07:25:45 -0800 (PST) Received: from mail167.messagelabs.com (mail167.messagelabs.com [216.82.253.179]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 968A03A7EE4 for ; Thu, 18 Feb 2010 07:25:45 -0800 (PST) X-VirusChecked: Checked X-Env-Sender: pp3129@att.com X-Msg-Ref: server-3.tower-167.messagelabs.com!1266506846!16922415!1 X-StarScan-Version: 6.2.4; banners=-,-,- X-Originating-IP: [144.160.20.146] Received: (qmail 21314 invoked from network); 18 Feb 2010 15:27:27 -0000 Received: from sbcsmtp7.sbc.com (HELO mlpd194.enaf.sfdc.sbc.com) (144.160.20.146) by server-3.tower-167.messagelabs.com with DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA encrypted SMTP; 18 Feb 2010 15:27:27 -0000 Received: from enaf.sfdc.sbc.com (localhost.localdomain [127.0.0.1]) by mlpd194.enaf.sfdc.sbc.com (8.14.3/8.14.3) with ESMTP id o1IFRIcc010916 for ; Thu, 18 Feb 2010 10:27:18 -0500 Received: from gaalpa1msgusr7a.ugd.att.com (gaalpa1msgusr7a.ugd.att.com [135.53.26.15]) by mlpd194.enaf.sfdc.sbc.com (8.14.3/8.14.3) with ESMTP id o1IFREeg010826 for ; Thu, 18 Feb 2010 10:27:14 -0500 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft Exchange V6.5 Content-class: urn:content-classes:message MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Date: Thu, 18 Feb 2010 10:27:21 -0500 Message-ID: <35FE871E2B085542A35726420E29DA6B035F86EB@gaalpa1msgusr7a.ugd.att.com> In-Reply-To: <754963199212404AB8E9CFCA6C3D0CDA0D881DC633@TNS-MAIL-NA.win2k.corp.tnsi.com> X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: Thread-Topic: [drinks] LUF and LRF (again) Thread-Index: AQHKsJExYF8XQFhPYESVG9kVczJAtpHL85kggAAG2XA= References: <6EA53FAD386F9D46B97D49BFE148D5140603A388@ISR-JLM-MAIL1.xconnect.co.il> <754963199212404AB8E9CFCA6C3D0CDA0D881DC633@TNS-MAIL-NA.win2k.corp.tnsi.com> From: "PFAUTZ, PENN L (ATTCORP)" To: Subject: Re: [drinks] LUF and LRF (again) X-BeenThere: drinks@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF DRINKS WG List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 18 Feb 2010 15:25:46 -0000 I think the issue is at least partly that of *distinguishing* LUF and LRF per the Speermint model in a drinks implementation. There are use cases in which one wants drinks to handle the LUF function and leave the LRF to other means and some in which the functions may be combined. Penn Pfautz AT&T Access Management +1-732-420-4962 -----Original Message----- From: drinks-bounces@ietf.org [mailto:drinks-bounces@ietf.org] On Behalf Of Cartwright, Kenneth Sent: Thursday, February 18, 2010 9:59 AM To: David Schwartz; drinks@ietf.org Subject: Re: [drinks] LUF and LRF (again) Maybe I missed something, but I did not know there was any question about this. We are definitely covering LRF and the LUF. But just on a side note, I'd not say that the LUF =3D Who and the LRF = =3D WHERE. I'd say that the LUF =3D WHERE (where is the ultimate destination) and = the LRF =3D HOW (how to get to the ultimate destination). Ken -----Original Message----- From: drinks-bounces@ietf.org [mailto:drinks-bounces@ietf.org] On Behalf Of David Schwartz Sent: Thursday, February 18, 2010 6:55 AM To: drinks@ietf.org Subject: [drinks] LUF and LRF (again) In our discussions on the weekly call the issue of scope of charter came up again (sigh) with the age old question of do we limit ourselves to target definition (i.e. WHO --> LUF) or do we tackle the bigger issue of target routing (i.e. HOW or WHERE --> LRF). The answer to this question affects many aspects of what is being provisioned and as such it is crucial to resolve at this stage. Can people weigh in on this now please so we can better prepare for Anaheim? (Personally, I am in favor of including the LRF - will send a more detailed email at a later point explaining my thoughts on this) David _______________________________________________ drinks mailing list drinks@ietf.org https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/drinks This e-mail message is for the sole use of the intended recipient(s)and may contain confidential and privileged information of Transaction Network Services. Any unauthorised review, use, disclosure or distribution is prohibited. If you are not the intended recipient, please contact the sender by reply e-mail and destroy all copies of the original message. _______________________________________________ drinks mailing list drinks@ietf.org https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/drinks From kcartwright@tnsi.com Thu Feb 18 08:09:06 2010 Return-Path: X-Original-To: drinks@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: drinks@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 67C403A7FAA for ; Thu, 18 Feb 2010 08:09:06 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.599 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.599 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.000, BAYES_00=-2.599] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id FfPbWAHH5yGe for ; Thu, 18 Feb 2010 08:09:05 -0800 (PST) Received: from tnsi.com (relayus.tnsi.com [208.224.248.44]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 42B6628C253 for ; Thu, 18 Feb 2010 08:09:04 -0800 (PST) Received: from ([172.17.7.231]) by relayus.tnsi.com with ESMTP with TLS id 4440551.40706955; Thu, 18 Feb 2010 11:10:35 -0500 Received: from TNS-MAIL-NA.win2k.corp.tnsi.com ([172.17.7.214]) by MAIL-HUB-NA.win2k.corp.tnsi.com ([172.17.7.231]) with mapi; Thu, 18 Feb 2010 11:10:35 -0500 From: "Cartwright, Kenneth" To: "PFAUTZ, PENN L (ATTCORP)" , "drinks@ietf.org" Date: Thu, 18 Feb 2010 11:10:33 -0500 Thread-Topic: [drinks] LUF and LRF (again) Thread-Index: AQHKsJExYF8XQFhPYESVG9kVczJAtpHL85kggAAG2XCAAAszEA== Message-ID: <754963199212404AB8E9CFCA6C3D0CDA0D881DC766@TNS-MAIL-NA.win2k.corp.tnsi.com> References: <6EA53FAD386F9D46B97D49BFE148D5140603A388@ISR-JLM-MAIL1.xconnect.co.il> <754963199212404AB8E9CFCA6C3D0CDA0D881DC633@TNS-MAIL-NA.win2k.corp.tnsi.com> <35FE871E2B085542A35726420E29DA6B035F86EB@gaalpa1msgusr7a.ugd.att.com> In-Reply-To: <35FE871E2B085542A35726420E29DA6B035F86EB@gaalpa1msgusr7a.ugd.att.com> Accept-Language: en-US Content-Language: en-US X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: acceptlanguage: en-US Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable MIME-Version: 1.0 Subject: Re: [drinks] LUF and LRF (again) X-BeenThere: drinks@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF DRINKS WG List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 18 Feb 2010 16:09:06 -0000 Agreed. After discussing this further I see the point that the LUF may or = may not return the ultimate destination (the WHERE). So perhaps my stateme= nt that LUF always returns the ultimate destination was too strict. There = are cases where the LUF would just return some identifier that represents t= he WHO, while not returning the ultimate destination. Mapping what is happening in the real world onto these Speermint abstractio= ns is "interesting". Ken -----Original Message----- From: drinks-bounces@ietf.org [mailto:drinks-bounces@ietf.org] On Behalf Of= PFAUTZ, PENN L (ATTCORP) Sent: Thursday, February 18, 2010 10:27 AM To: drinks@ietf.org Subject: Re: [drinks] LUF and LRF (again) I think the issue is at least partly that of *distinguishing* LUF and LRF per the Speermint model in a drinks implementation. There are use cases in which one wants drinks to handle the LUF function and leave the LRF to other means and some in which the functions may be combined. Penn Pfautz AT&T Access Management +1-732-420-4962 -----Original Message----- From: drinks-bounces@ietf.org [mailto:drinks-bounces@ietf.org] On Behalf Of Cartwright, Kenneth Sent: Thursday, February 18, 2010 9:59 AM To: David Schwartz; drinks@ietf.org Subject: Re: [drinks] LUF and LRF (again) Maybe I missed something, but I did not know there was any question about this. We are definitely covering LRF and the LUF. But just on a side note, I'd not say that the LUF =3D Who and the LRF =3D WHERE. I'd say that the LUF =3D WHERE (where is the ultimate destination) and the LRF =3D HOW (how to get to the ultimate destination). Ken -----Original Message----- From: drinks-bounces@ietf.org [mailto:drinks-bounces@ietf.org] On Behalf Of David Schwartz Sent: Thursday, February 18, 2010 6:55 AM To: drinks@ietf.org Subject: [drinks] LUF and LRF (again) In our discussions on the weekly call the issue of scope of charter came up again (sigh) with the age old question of do we limit ourselves to target definition (i.e. WHO --> LUF) or do we tackle the bigger issue of target routing (i.e. HOW or WHERE --> LRF). The answer to this question affects many aspects of what is being provisioned and as such it is crucial to resolve at this stage. Can people weigh in on this now please so we can better prepare for Anaheim? (Personally, I am in favor of including the LRF - will send a more detailed email at a later point explaining my thoughts on this) David _______________________________________________ drinks mailing list drinks@ietf.org https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/drinks This e-mail message is for the sole use of the intended recipient(s)and may contain confidential and privileged information of Transaction Network Services. Any unauthorised review, use, disclosure or distribution is prohibited. If you are not the intended recipient, please contact the sender by reply e-mail and destroy all copies of the original message. _______________________________________________ drinks mailing list drinks@ietf.org https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/drinks _______________________________________________ drinks mailing list drinks@ietf.org https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/drinks This e-mail message is for the sole use of the intended recipient(s)and may contain confidential and privileged information of Transaction Network Serv= ices. Any unauthorised review, use, disclosure or distribution is prohibited. If = you are not the intended recipient, please contact the sender by reply e-mail a= nd destroy all copies of the original message. From Ray.Bellis@nominet.org.uk Thu Feb 18 08:20:10 2010 Return-Path: X-Original-To: drinks@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: drinks@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 94D123A7E8D for ; Thu, 18 Feb 2010 08:20:09 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -5.356 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-5.356 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=1.242, BAYES_00=-2.599, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-4] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id owx4Gf7IMMR9 for ; Thu, 18 Feb 2010 08:20:07 -0800 (PST) Received: from mx4.nominet.org.uk (mx4.nominet.org.uk [213.248.199.24]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2EC0C3A7EEB for ; Thu, 18 Feb 2010 08:20:06 -0800 (PST) DomainKey-Signature: s=main.dk.nominet.selector; d=nominet.org.uk; c=nofws; q=dns; h=X-IronPort-AV:Received:In-Reply-To:References:To:Cc: Subject:MIME-Version:X-Mailer:Message-ID:From:Date: X-MIMETrack:Content-Type; b=b4bzFAUgJMxUI88cvmyP2NBbYqY9Zpc+0OGZbl6NSZQq06PofndJIUsv Rs9f4BDWu/MaW4DK5v+PBg2NSxaYOATldtMI5mEzLVk1GOANKVS8poURg sWdtthY2LOEzxbO; DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=simple/simple; d=nominet.org.uk; i=Ray.Bellis@nominet.org.uk; q=dns/txt; s=main.dkim.nominet.selector; t=1266510110; x=1298046110; h=from:sender:reply-to:subject:date:message-id:to:cc: mime-version:content-transfer-encoding:content-id: content-description:resent-date:resent-from:resent-sender: resent-to:resent-cc:resent-message-id:in-reply-to: references:list-id:list-help:list-unsubscribe: list-subscribe:list-post:list-owner:list-archive; z=From:=20Ray.Bellis@nominet.org.uk|Subject:=20Re:=20[drin ks]=20LUF=20and=20LRF=20(again)|Date:=20Thu,=2018=20Feb =202010=2016:21:47=20+0000|Message-ID:=20|To:=20"Cartwright,=20Kenneth"=20 |Cc:=20"drinks@ietf.org"=20 |MIME-Version:=201.0|In-Reply-To:=20<754963199212404AB8E9 CFCA6C3D0CDA0D881DC766@TNS-MAIL-NA.win2k.corp.tnsi.com> |References:=20<6EA53FAD386F9D46B97D49BFE148D5140603A388@ ISR-JLM-MAIL1.xconnect.co.il>=09<754963199212404AB8E9CFCA 6C3D0CDA0D881DC633@TNS-MAIL-NA.win2k.corp.tnsi.com>=0D=0A =09<35FE871E2B085542A35726420E29DA6B035F86EB@gaalpa1msgus r7a.ugd.att.com>=20<754963199212404AB8E9CFCA6C3D0CDA0D881 DC766@TNS-MAIL-NA.win2k.corp.tnsi.com>; bh=VGFNPe0kg9aF3nojllAcQpOA2YeHArx6oDMCjXbWYFM=; b=MjWcrOdYhMgVAIfslsxrxIhF9RjRrKxRcHrUGGDzAay+14322kFAopjF sWL8rtkAMl1fYv2lHnETn3Xw2KuvjVXBcfFiilaydIb2xDhj83nUEeJgZ qV3xcbB4Ehd9KOl; X-IronPort-AV: E=Sophos;i="4.49,498,1262563200"; d="scan'208";a="16431669" Received: from notes1.nominet.org.uk ([213.248.197.128]) by mx4.nominet.org.uk with ESMTP; 18 Feb 2010 16:21:48 +0000 In-Reply-To: <754963199212404AB8E9CFCA6C3D0CDA0D881DC766@TNS-MAIL-NA.win2k.corp.tnsi.com> References: <6EA53FAD386F9D46B97D49BFE148D5140603A388@ISR-JLM-MAIL1.xconnect.co.il> <754963199212404AB8E9CFCA6C3D0CDA0D881DC633@TNS-MAIL-NA.win2k.corp.tnsi.com> <35FE871E2B085542A35726420E29DA6B035F86EB@gaalpa1msgusr7a.ugd.att.com> <754963199212404AB8E9CFCA6C3D0CDA0D881DC766@TNS-MAIL-NA.win2k.corp.tnsi.com> To: "Cartwright, Kenneth" MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Lotus Notes Release 8.5 December 05, 2008 Message-ID: From: Ray.Bellis@nominet.org.uk Date: Thu, 18 Feb 2010 16:21:47 +0000 X-MIMETrack: Serialize by Router on notes1/Nominet(Release 7.0.1FP1 | May 25, 2006) at 18/02/2010 04:21:48 PM, Serialize complete at 18/02/2010 04:21:48 PM Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="=_alternative 0059E2AB802576CE_=" Cc: "drinks@ietf.org" Subject: Re: [drinks] LUF and LRF (again) X-BeenThere: drinks@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF DRINKS WG List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 18 Feb 2010 16:20:10 -0000 This is a multipart message in MIME format. --=_alternative 0059E2AB802576CE_= Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" > There are cases where the LUF would > just return some identifier that represents the WHO, while not > returning the ultimate destination. That's closest to my vision for DRINKS et al. The LUF says "WHO", and in many cases "roughly WHERE". That "roughly WHERE" corresponds to the "destination group" term that I introduced. The LRF then turns "roughly WHERE" into "this particular ingress point". > Mapping what is happening in the real world onto these Speermint > abstractions is "interesting". It sure is, although FWIW what I've described above is pretty much the proposed model for the UK number portability database, should OFCOM ever decide to mandate one. Ray -- Ray Bellis, MA(Oxon) MIET Senior Researcher in Advanced Projects, Nominet e: ray@nominet.org.uk, t: +44 1865 332211 --=_alternative 0059E2AB802576CE_= Content-Type: text/html; charset="US-ASCII"
> There are cases where the LUF would
> just return some identifier that represents the WHO, while not
> returning the ultimate destination.

That's closest to my vision for DRINKS et al.

The LUF says "WHO", and in many cases "roughly WHERE".

That "roughly WHERE" corresponds to the "destination group" term that I introduced.

The LRF then turns "roughly WHERE" into "this particular ingress point".

> Mapping what is happening in the real world onto these Speermint
> abstractions is "interesting".

It sure is, although FWIW what I've described above is pretty much the proposed model for the UK number portability database, should OFCOM ever decide to mandate one.

Ray

--
Ray Bellis, MA(Oxon) MIET
Senior Researcher in Advanced Projects, Nominet
e: ray@nominet.org.uk, t: +44 1865 332211


 --=_alternative 0059E2AB802576CE_=-- From sumanth@cablelabs.com Thu Feb 18 14:13:55 2010 Return-Path: X-Original-To: drinks@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: drinks@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 913113A8078 for ; Thu, 18 Feb 2010 14:13:55 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -0.463 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-0.463 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-2.599, HELO_EQ_MODEMCABLE=0.768, HOST_EQ_MODEMCABLE=1.368] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id mUsSe7OZjtqg for ; Thu, 18 Feb 2010 14:13:54 -0800 (PST) Received: from ondar.cablelabs.com (ondar.cablelabs.com [192.160.73.61]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 42DD73A7BDA for ; Thu, 18 Feb 2010 14:13:51 -0800 (PST) Received: from kyzyl.cablelabs.com (kyzyl [10.253.0.7]) by ondar.cablelabs.com (8.14.4/8.14.4) with ESMTP id o1IMFYY3012916 for ; Thu, 18 Feb 2010 15:15:34 -0700 Received: from srvxchg.cablelabs.com (10.5.0.15) by kyzyl.cablelabs.com (F-Secure/fsigk_smtp/303/kyzyl.cablelabs.com); Thu, 18 Feb 2010 15:15:34 -0700 (MST) X-Virus-Status: clean(F-Secure/fsigk_smtp/303/kyzyl.cablelabs.com) Received: from srvxchg.cablelabs.com ([10.5.0.15]) by srvxchg ([10.5.0.15]) with mapi; Thu, 18 Feb 2010 15:15:34 -0700 From: Sumanth Channabasappa To: "drinks@ietf.org" Date: Thu, 18 Feb 2010 15:15:33 -0700 Thread-Topic: General updates based on offline discussions... Thread-Index: AQHKsJExYF8XQFhPYESVG9kVczJAtpHMbOpA Message-ID: <76AC5FEF83F1E64491446437EA81A61F7CD4B2B213@srvxchg> References: <6EA53FAD386F9D46B97D49BFE148D5140603A388@ISR-JLM-MAIL1.xconnect.co.il> In-Reply-To: <6EA53FAD386F9D46B97D49BFE148D5140603A388@ISR-JLM-MAIL1.xconnect.co.il> Accept-Language: en-US Content-Language: en-US X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: acceptlanguage: en-US Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Approved: ondar Subject: [drinks] General updates based on offline discussions... X-BeenThere: drinks@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF DRINKS WG List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 18 Feb 2010 22:13:55 -0000 As an FYI, some of us who expressed interested in DRINKS have gotten togeth= er since late-Jan, with weekly calls, to discuss and make progress. To clar= ify, these calls were/are not "official DRINKS calls", but offline calls be= tween interested participants aimed at re-building the momentum, which we s= eemed to have lost late last year. The plan has always been to get the disc= ussions jumpstarted on the DRINKS mailing list. This email is an attempt to summarize the current thoughts, and an effort t= o solicit feedback on the DRINKS list going forward (as planned). =3D The I-D authors and the participants suggest the following prior to the= cutoff for the next IETF: a) Address comments and questions raised on the I-Ds so far (see below) b) Update the following I-Ds, based on a):=20 - Requirements (http://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-drinks-usecases-requi= rements-00) - Protocol (http://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-mule-drinks-proto-01) c) Based on the recommendation/decision in Stockholm, the decision is to se= parate the protocol definition into two parts: transport-agnostic details (= e.g., data models) and transport-specific extensions (e.g., use with SOAP/H= TTP, RESTful web services etc.). Accordingly, draft-mule-drinks-proto will = continue to be transport-agnostic, and we plan to submit a *new* I-D for SO= AP/HTTP as the transport (again, based on discussions in Stockholm). The un= derstanding is that if participants are interested in alternative transport= s, they will submit additional I-Ds specifying usage. =20 =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D SUMMARY of unaddressed comments, specific thoughts and open issues =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D > Should we, or should we not use, NAPTRs within the provisioning data stru= cture? After discussing the pros and cons of this topic, the current proposal is= to keep the NAPTR data structure as-is, and we can add non-NAPTR data in s= eparate data structures. If there is disagreement, please volunteer to help= us change the data structure. =20 > Questions around LUF and LRF (again!) While we can address some of this in DRINKS (see thread already started b= y David, earlier today), perhaps SPEERMINT should tackle this? Specifically= , there is confusion as to whether the LUF is a domain name or an AoR (we t= hink it is the latter). Some of the participants (Alex, Ken, Manjul, David)= plan to check with SPEERMINT on this. > Support for portability use cases, specifically around TN public identiti= es This is important, and volunteers (primarily David) are discussing use ca= ses that will be proposed for this topic. > Suggestions to simplify the data model Volunteers (primarily Alex) are trying to address this. Specific suggesti= ons are encouraged. > Questions around the requirements or use cases Please provide specific comments on any use case or requirement that is u= nclear or contentious > Open questions under discussion What is the scope of the LRF functionality within the protocol? What comprises the SED? =3D=3D=3D=3D If I missed anything, I encourage others to chime in. Thanks! - S From sumanth@cablelabs.com Thu Feb 18 14:23:27 2010 Return-Path: X-Original-To: drinks@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: drinks@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id D872C3A7971 for ; Thu, 18 Feb 2010 14:23:27 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -0.463 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-0.463 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-2.599, HELO_EQ_MODEMCABLE=0.768, HOST_EQ_MODEMCABLE=1.368] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id DuzMGHdb7b-B for ; Thu, 18 Feb 2010 14:23:27 -0800 (PST) Received: from ondar.cablelabs.com (ondar.cablelabs.com [192.160.73.61]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 25BDA3A7445 for ; Thu, 18 Feb 2010 14:23:27 -0800 (PST) Received: from kyzyl.cablelabs.com (kyzyl [10.253.0.7]) by ondar.cablelabs.com (8.14.4/8.14.4) with ESMTP id o1IMPAqD013586; Thu, 18 Feb 2010 15:25:10 -0700 Received: from srvxchg.cablelabs.com (10.5.0.15) by kyzyl.cablelabs.com (F-Secure/fsigk_smtp/303/kyzyl.cablelabs.com); Thu, 18 Feb 2010 15:25:10 -0700 (MST) X-Virus-Status: clean(F-Secure/fsigk_smtp/303/kyzyl.cablelabs.com) Received: from srvxchg.cablelabs.com ([10.5.0.15]) by srvxchg ([10.5.0.15]) with mapi; Thu, 18 Feb 2010 15:25:11 -0700 From: Sumanth Channabasappa To: Alexander Mayrhofer , "Drinks@ietf.org" Date: Thu, 18 Feb 2010 15:25:09 -0700 Thread-Topic: Agenda planning for DRINKS in Anaheim. Thread-Index: AcquZ92OaXdPWgWiTaGPLYheuYl6WQCgP09w Message-ID: <76AC5FEF83F1E64491446437EA81A61F7CD4B2B215@srvxchg> References: <8BC845943058D844ABFC73D2220D466508E47137@nics-mail.sbg.nic.at> In-Reply-To: <8BC845943058D844ABFC73D2220D466508E47137@nics-mail.sbg.nic.at> Accept-Language: en-US Content-Language: en-US X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: acceptlanguage: en-US Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Approved: ondar Subject: Re: [drinks] Agenda planning for DRINKS in Anaheim. X-BeenThere: drinks@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF DRINKS WG List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 18 Feb 2010 22:23:27 -0000 I would like to propose the following (tentative) agenda items (and nominat= e some presenters :) ). 1) Updates to the use cases and requirements - 15 mts=20 Presenters: Sumanth and/or use case authors (e.g., David Schwartz for po= rtability use cases) 2) Updates to the protocol document, and update regarding the proposed I-D = for using SOAP - 20 mts Presenter: Ken Cartwright? 3) Open Issues; see my earlier email for current list (30 mts) Presenter: TBD (who wants LUF v/s LRF? :-P ) =20 - S -----Original Message----- From: drinks-bounces@ietf.org [mailto:drinks-bounces@ietf.org] On Behalf Of= Alexander Mayrhofer Sent: Monday, February 15, 2010 10:54 AM To: Drinks@ietf.org Subject: [drinks] Agenda planning for DRINKS in Anaheim. All, For the working group meeting in Anaheim, a 1.5 hour meeting slot has been = requested. We'd like to start with Agenda planning, so please email the WG = chairs if you intend to present current or new work to the group in that me= eting. Thanks, Alex _______________________________________________ drinks mailing list drinks@ietf.org https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/drinks From richard@shockey.us Fri Feb 19 09:40:09 2010 Return-Path: X-Original-To: drinks@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: drinks@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id EB8433A7FB7 for ; Fri, 19 Feb 2010 09:40:09 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.344 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.344 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.255, BAYES_00=-2.599] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id oPD6oSi1j6X2 for ; Fri, 19 Feb 2010 09:40:09 -0800 (PST) Received: from outbound-mail-360.bluehost.com (outbound-mail-360.bluehost.com [66.147.249.254]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with SMTP id DB4C73A7D70 for ; Fri, 19 Feb 2010 09:40:08 -0800 (PST) Received: (qmail 20477 invoked by uid 0); 19 Feb 2010 17:41:56 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO box462.bluehost.com) (74.220.219.62) by oproxy2.bluehost.com with SMTP; 19 Feb 2010 17:41:56 -0000 DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=default; d=shockey.us; h=Received:From:To:Subject:Date:Message-ID:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding:X-Mailer:Thread-Index:Content-Language:X-Identified-User; b=SoDt/aqZ3bhznPSm5v9FY4JyaE78XPVDScnDHWOptF5PdfitIwTPHqKC/hbaveqjuK+0rHHaDgBBJ202pLq9Ut2JVkL1Hmztn9oHPxoKvIwf3KiGMdzCsCBrKQjpviV0; Received: from pool-96-241-62-33.washdc.fios.verizon.net ([96.241.62.33] helo=RSHOCKEYPC) by box462.bluehost.com with esmtpa (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1NiWrT-00008I-Sy for drinks@ietf.org; Fri, 19 Feb 2010 10:41:56 -0700 From: "Richard Shockey" To: Date: Fri, 19 Feb 2010 12:41:52 -0500 Message-ID: <009701cab18a$d28b05d0$77a11170$@us> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: Microsoft Office Outlook 12.0 Thread-Index: Acqleuy+8WtJcsldSuWPpp+Q4dBsNAMD71Vw Content-Language: en-us X-Identified-User: {3286:box462.bluehost.com:shockeyu:shockey.us} {sentby:smtp auth 96.241.62.33 authed with richard@shockey.us} Subject: [drinks] FW: [Enum] BOF / New Mailing List E2MD (E.164 To MetaData) DDDS application X-BeenThere: drinks@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF DRINKS WG List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 19 Feb 2010 17:40:10 -0000 A reminder of what some of the discussion about metadata as the result of the LUF is all about -----Original Message----- From: enum-bounces@ietf.org [mailto:enum-bounces@ietf.org] On Behalf Of Bernie Hoeneisen Sent: Thursday, February 04, 2010 4:18 AM To: IETF DISPATCH list; IETF ENUM list; dnsop@ietf.org; dnsext@ietf.org; EPP Provreg Subject: [Enum] BOF / New Mailing List E2MD (E.164 To MetaData) DDDS application Dear DNS, ENUM and RAI experts, Please be informed that a new mailing list has been created for discussion related to a proposed DDDS application 'E.164 to MetaData' (E2MD). If you are interested in this topic, please subscribe to the new Mailing List via: https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/e2md E2MD is proposed to hold E.164-related information that does not fit the normal use cases for E2U. Known use cases include information that describes the structure of the E.164 numbering plan, and records which do not represent end-user communication URIs. A BOF about E2MD has been proposed for the upcoming IETF in Anaheim: http://trac.tools.ietf.org/bof/trac/#RAI Note: E2MD has been formerly known as E2M (a naming conflict with a legacy SIP WG item required a change of the acronym for this BOF) cheers, Bernie _______________________________________________ enum mailing list enum@ietf.org https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/enum From richard@shockey.us Sat Feb 20 12:02:16 2010 Return-Path: X-Original-To: drinks@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: drinks@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 497D228C14C for ; Sat, 20 Feb 2010 12:02:16 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.378 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.378 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.221, BAYES_00=-2.599] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id Vf+21dAL7iY5 for ; Sat, 20 Feb 2010 12:02:16 -0800 (PST) Received: from outbound-mail-359.bluehost.com (outbound-mail-359.bluehost.com [66.147.249.253]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with SMTP id 1CDAC28C131 for ; Sat, 20 Feb 2010 12:02:16 -0800 (PST) Received: (qmail 17903 invoked by uid 0); 20 Feb 2010 19:57:28 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO box462.bluehost.com) (74.220.219.62) by oproxy1.bluehost.com.bluehost.com with SMTP; 20 Feb 2010 19:57:28 -0000 DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=default; d=shockey.us; h=Received:From:To:Cc:References:In-Reply-To:Subject:Date:Message-ID:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding:X-Mailer:Thread-Index:Content-Language:X-Identified-User; b=nD7MrP0TWAWrzWqbVPcorbocM4cbVLnp7GlK8ZMCJL2Sz40VHtoPyTUt7nDtbDFxSEFCNTyzpsopN/U7Uo+SVk8DcJckmtqvR5mnaIZbrNrAglaKMkARyEB2klNkgAZ1; Received: from pool-96-241-62-33.washdc.fios.verizon.net ([96.241.62.33] helo=RSHOCKEYPC) by box462.bluehost.com with esmtpa (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1NivSB-0007tq-Ph; Sat, 20 Feb 2010 12:57:28 -0700 From: "Richard Shockey" To: "'Bernie Hoeneisen'" , "'E.164 To MetaData BOF discussion list'" References: In-Reply-To: Date: Sat, 20 Feb 2010 14:57:24 -0500 Message-ID: <003c01cab266$ec61c840$c52558c0$@us> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: Microsoft Office Outlook 12.0 Thread-Index: AcqyTSgwGF/4l9DBSwa4B6TEfGzp+QAFhDuw Content-Language: en-us X-Identified-User: {3286:box462.bluehost.com:shockeyu:shockey.us} {sentby:smtp auth 96.241.62.33 authed with richard@shockey.us} Cc: drinks@ietf.org, enum@ietf.org Subject: Re: [drinks] [e2md] Summary of Use Cases X-BeenThere: drinks@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF DRINKS WG List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sat, 20 Feb 2010 20:02:16 -0000 SPID and CNAM right now are the poster childs for E2M ..or SPN ( Service Provider Network ) aka TN to Operator in modern ITU SG2 terms. DRINKS has a liaison from ITU-T specifically asking that fields for this code be reserved in any provisioning protocol developed by DRINKS. It's currently the principal result of LUF in numerous private commercial ENUM applications though it does not fully address the use case for MVNO's where some form alt-SPID is required as well to distinguish between the retail service provider and the underlying network operator. In ENUM terms this means that the result of the LUF is not the end point destination or transit network gateway but only the portability corrected operator of record based on authoritative national numbering databases. The data associated with the LRF is then presumed to be a private data exchange between bilateral transit partners and is the result of the E2M translation is performed by a secondary step. All of these parameters are used in private closed carrier ENUM applications for SMS MMS and Voice routing or in SIP location look ups, though how SIP deals with metadata is IMHO a long standing issue and is another WG in and of itself. -----Original Message----- From: e2md-bounces@ietf.org [mailto:e2md-bounces@ietf.org] On Behalf Of Bernie Hoeneisen Sent: Saturday, February 20, 2010 11:53 AM To: E.164 To MetaData BOF discussion list Subject: [e2md] Summary of Use Cases Dear e2md list, After soliciting input on market need evidence for e2md, I can provide you with a list of use cases to be considered for e2md: Legacy use cases: - cnam - unused/void - send-n Penn Pfautz - information for routing decisions based on certain characteristics associated with a number Kenneth Cartwright - Payment Type: PrePaid | PostPaid - Network Type: TDMA | GSM - Region Code: A numeric value indicating a region within a country. - Service Provider Name: The name of the current service provider. - SPID: A string of characters identifying the current service provider. And some other thoughts that have crossed my mind (for illustrative purposes only as I have not verified the usefulness of the following use cases): - Charging information (useful for premium rate numbers) - Assignee address information for premium rate numbers (abuse, complaints) - Number Portability information (partly overlaps with Service Provider Name, SPID and an existing Enumservice) - Service hours for a certain numbers - Location Information - PSAP (Public Safety Answering Point) associated with a fixed phone number (depending on the content this might be an ENUM use case instead) These are 15 (potential) use cases! Did I forget anything? Please drop a note to this list, in case you know about more use cases. Thanks a lot to those of you who answered my request! cheers, Bernie _______________________________________________ e2md mailing list e2md@ietf.org https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/e2md From alexander.mayrhofer@nic.at Mon Feb 22 00:35:58 2010 Return-Path: X-Original-To: drinks@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: drinks@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id BDAFB28C262 for ; Mon, 22 Feb 2010 00:35:58 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -9.366 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-9.366 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.064, BAYES_00=-2.599, HELO_EQ_AT=0.424, HOST_EQ_AT=0.745, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_HI=-8] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id Dz94AsSWJvgF for ; Mon, 22 Feb 2010 00:35:58 -0800 (PST) Received: from mail.sbg.nic.at (mail.sbg.nic.at [192.174.68.200]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9A70628C0E6 for ; Mon, 22 Feb 2010 00:35:56 -0800 (PST) Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]) by mail.sbg.nic.at with XWall v3.45 ; Mon, 22 Feb 2010 09:37:52 +0100 x-mimeole: Produced By Microsoft Exchange V6.5 Content-class: urn:content-classes:message MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Date: Mon, 22 Feb 2010 09:37:53 +0100 Message-ID: <8BC845943058D844ABFC73D2220D466508EBF156@nics-mail.sbg.nic.at> X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: Thread-Topic: FYI: Preliminary Agenda for IETF 77 Thread-Index: AcqzmlMyc0FXW71RTb+AgSY7MA1xfg== From: "Alexander Mayrhofer" To: X-XWALL-BCKS: auto Subject: [drinks] FYI: Preliminary Agenda for IETF 77 X-BeenThere: drinks@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF DRINKS WG List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 22 Feb 2010 08:35:58 -0000 FYI, The *preliminary* Agenda for the 77th IETF meeting in Anaheim has been published: https://datatracker.ietf.org/meeting/77/agenda.html DRINKS has been assigned a 1:15 slot on Wednesday morning (March 24, 09:00 - 10:15). Note that this may be subject to change - the final Agenda will be published on Feb 26th. Alex From bernie@ietf.hoeneisen.ch Wed Feb 24 06:20:32 2010 Return-Path: X-Original-To: drinks@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: drinks@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3782A28C181; Wed, 24 Feb 2010 06:20:32 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.415 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.415 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.184, BAYES_00=-2.599] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id pttvnmvr4FM4; Wed, 24 Feb 2010 06:20:31 -0800 (PST) Received: from softronics.hoeneisen.ch (softronics.hoeneisen.ch [62.2.86.178]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id B5F9728C108; Wed, 24 Feb 2010 06:20:30 -0800 (PST) Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]) by softronics.hoeneisen.ch with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1NkI8K-0003dg-2N; Wed, 24 Feb 2010 15:22:36 +0100 Date: Wed, 24 Feb 2010 15:22:36 +0100 (CET) From: Bernie Hoeneisen X-X-Sender: bhoeneis@softronics.hoeneisen.ch To: drinks@ietf.org, speermint@ietf.org Message-ID: User-Agent: Alpine 2.00 (DEB 1167 2008-08-23) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: MULTIPART/Mixed; BOUNDARY="37663318-1922192837-1267020046=:10552" Content-ID: X-SA-Exim-Connect-IP: 127.0.0.1 X-SA-Exim-Mail-From: bernie@ietf.hoeneisen.ch X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No (on softronics.hoeneisen.ch); SAEximRunCond expanded to false Subject: [drinks] [e2md] charter discussion kick-off (fwd) X-BeenThere: drinks@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF DRINKS WG List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 24 Feb 2010 14:20:32 -0000 This message is in MIME format. The first part should be readable text, while the remaining parts are likely unreadable without MIME-aware tools. --37663318-1922192837-1267020046=:10552 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; FORMAT=flowed; CHARSET=US-ASCII Content-ID: Dear speermint / drinks participant For the E2MD (E.164 To MetaData) BoF during IETF-77 in Anheim we are currently discussing the charter proposal. As e2md is closely related to what you are defining in DRINKS and SPEERMINT, we kindly ask you to review the charter and provide feedback to the list by the end of this month (Feb 2010). Looking forward to a fruitful discussion! cheers, Bernie ---------- Forwarded message ---------- Date: Wed, 24 Feb 2010 15:00:46 From: Bernie Hoeneisen To: E.164 To MetaData BOF discussion list Subject: [e2md] charter discussion kick-off Hi, After we have collected the use cases, the e2md work continues with the charter. To ensure we have no (unknown) open issues with the charter during the BoF, we kindly ask you to review the proposal for the e2md charter. The latest version can be found on: http://ucom.ch/ietf/e2md-bof/e2md-proposed-charter.txt For your convenience I attached the current version to this email. Please send any feedback, issues and other comments concerning the proposed e2md charter to by the end of this month (Feb 2010). cheers, Bernie -- http://ucom.ch/ Tech Consulting for Internet Standardization --37663318-1922192837-1267020046=:10552 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; NAME=e2md-proposed-charter.txt Content-Transfer-Encoding: BASE64 Content-ID: Content-Description: Content-Disposition: ATTACHMENT; FILENAME=e2md-proposed-charter.txt RS4xNjQgdG8gTWV0YURhdGEgKEUyTUQpIChwcm9wb3NlZCBjaGFydGVyKQ0K LS0tLS0tLS0tLS0tLS0tLS0tLS0tLS0tDQoNCkxhc3QgTW9kaWZpZWQ6IDIw MTAtMDItMjQNCg0KQWRkaXRpb25hbCBpbmZvcm1hdGlvbiBpcyBhdmFpbGFi bGUgYXQgdG9vbHMuaWV0Zi5vcmcvd2cvZTJtZA0KW25vdCB5ZXQgaW4gdXNl XQ0KDQoNCkNoYWlyKHMpOg0KDQogICAgKiBUQkENCg0KUmVhbC10aW1lIEFw cGxpY2F0aW9ucyBhbmQgSW5mcmFzdHJ1Y3R1cmUgQXJlYSBEaXJlY3Rvcihz KToNCg0KICAgICogUm9iZXJ0IFNwYXJrcyA8cmpzcGFya3NAbm9zdHJ1bS5j b20+DQogICAgKiBDdWxsZW4gSmVubmluZ3MgPGZsdWZmeUBjaXNjby5jb20+ DQoNClJlYWwtdGltZSBBcHBsaWNhdGlvbnMgYW5kIEluZnJhc3RydWN0dXJl 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06:39:32 2010 Return-Path: X-Original-To: drinks@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: drinks@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8E6ED28C192 for ; Wed, 24 Feb 2010 06:39:32 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.389 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.389 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.209, BAYES_00=-2.599, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id z8XCye0ZEawq for ; Wed, 24 Feb 2010 06:39:31 -0800 (PST) Received: from outbound-mail-360.bluehost.com (outbound-mail-360.bluehost.com [66.147.249.254]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with SMTP id 68D2C28C184 for ; Wed, 24 Feb 2010 06:39:31 -0800 (PST) Received: (qmail 24036 invoked by uid 0); 24 Feb 2010 14:41:38 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO box462.bluehost.com) (74.220.219.62) by oproxy2.bluehost.com with SMTP; 24 Feb 2010 14:41:38 -0000 DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=default; d=shockey.us; h=Received:Message-ID:Date:From:User-Agent:MIME-Version:To:Subject:Content-Type:X-Identified-User; b=cu9ppyMzFKYXnw6rRu7SxdhOce72XoXYv3fWp5A6KXankCrBXbuoTrMWeQFd2WB7x2O+LGlgG9QNgbVG95FYdnFpbj5BdyeZj5GQftP/2QLFve4yTWR9L3lFCX+r1jwk; Received: from pool-96-241-62-33.washdc.fios.verizon.net ([96.241.62.33] helo=[192.168.1.9]) by box462.bluehost.com with esmtpa (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1NkIQj-0003LM-W4 for drinks@ietf.org; Wed, 24 Feb 2010 07:41:38 -0700 Message-ID: <4B853AA0.9090105@shockey.us> Date: Wed, 24 Feb 2010 09:41:36 -0500 From: Richard Shockey User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.1; en-US; rv:1.9.1.7) Gecko/20100111 Thunderbird/3.0.1 MIME-Version: 1.0 To: drinks@ietf.org Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="------------010302040606010100010400" X-Identified-User: {3286:box462.bluehost.com:shockeyu:shockey.us} {sentby:smtp auth 96.241.62.33 authed with richard+shockey.us} Subject: [drinks] Reminder ID cut off dates. X-BeenThere: drinks@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF DRINKS WG List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 24 Feb 2010 14:39:32 -0000 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --------------010302040606010100010400 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit *From: *IETF Secretariat > *Date: *February 22, 2010 9:00:01 PM CEST *To: *ietf-announce at ietf.org *Subject: **Internet Draft Cut-off Dates Reminder * This is a reminder that the Internet Draft Cut-off Dates are approaching. The initial draft (version -00) cut-off date is Monday, March 1, 2010. These submissions are due by 17:00 PST (01:00 Tuesday, March 2 UTC). The Internet Draft final submission (version -01 and up) cut-off is Monday, March 8, 2010 at 17:00 PST (01:00 Tuesday, March 2 UTC). All drafts can be uploaded using the ID submission tool located here: https://datatracker.ietf.org/idst/upload.cgi _______________________________________________ IETF-Announce mailing list IETF-Announce at ietf.org https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ietf-announce -- Richard Shockey Shockey Consulting Chairman of Board SIP Forum Voice +1 703 593 2683 Skype etc : rshockey101 --------------010302040606010100010400 Content-Type: text/html; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

From: IETF Secretariat <ietf-secretariat at ietf.org>

Date: February 22, 2010 9:00:01 PM CEST

To: ietf-announce at ietf.org

Subject: Internet Draft Cut-off Dates Reminder 

 


This is a reminder that the Internet Draft Cut-off Dates are approaching.


The initial draft (version -00) cut-off date is Monday, March 1, 2010.
These submissions are due by 17:00 PST (01:00 Tuesday, March 2 UTC).

The Internet Draft final submission (version -01 and up) cut-off is
Monday, March 8, 2010 at 17:00 PST (01:00 Tuesday, March 2 UTC).

All drafts can be uploaded using the ID submission tool located here:
https://datatracker.ietf.org/idst/upload.cgi
_______________________________________________
IETF-Announce mailing list
IETF-Announce at ietf.org
https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ietf-announce 
-- 
Richard Shockey
Shockey Consulting
Chairman of Board SIP Forum
Voice +1 703 593 2683
Skype etc : rshockey101
--------------010302040606010100010400--