From nobody Wed Feb 25 10:30:58 2015 Return-Path: X-Original-To: hops@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: hops@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 45C7A1A1AA3; Wed, 25 Feb 2015 10:26:00 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.9 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.9 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9] autolearn=unavailable Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 2tNZza0NLPPl; Wed, 25 Feb 2015 10:25:49 -0800 (PST) Received: from ietfa.amsl.com (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 424131A0470; Wed, 25 Feb 2015 10:25:49 -0800 (PST) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: IETF Secretariat To: "IETF Announcement List" X-Test-IDTracker: no X-IETF-IDTracker: 5.11.2 Auto-Submitted: auto-generated Precedence: bulk Message-ID: <20150225182549.21611.14441.idtracker@ietfa.amsl.com> Date: Wed, 25 Feb 2015 10:25:49 -0800 Archived-At: X-Mailman-Approved-At: Wed, 25 Feb 2015 10:30:50 -0800 Cc: aaron.falk@gmail.com, hops@ietf.org Subject: [hops] New Non-WG Mailing List: hops -- Measuring deployability of new transport protocols X-BeenThere: hops@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15 Reply-To: ietf@ietf.org List-Id: Measuring deployability of new transport protocols List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 25 Feb 2015 18:26:00 -0000 A new IETF non-working group email list has been created. List address: hops@ietf.org Archive: http://www.ietf.org/mail-archive/web/hops/ To subscribe: https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/hops Purpose: How Ossified is the Protocol Stack? [HOPS] There has been long term and increasing interest in deploying transport protocols with alternate dynamics and behaviors to TCP and UDP. The IETF has standardized several new protocols including DCCP, UDP-lite, SCTP and several changes to TCP including ECN and LEDBAT. All of these new technologies have resulted in deployment challenges blamed on intentional and unintentional interference by middleboxes such as NATs and firewalls. This has lead to approaches such as building new protocols over UDP or HTTP to make traffic look like something a middlebox would expect. However, both these approaches have shortcomings and a variety of ameliorating engineering approaches are being considered [1], [2], [3]. What is missing is a study with more than anecdotal evidence of the nature of the problem and the portions of the network in which it manifests. One of the best analyses to date is [4] which measures from a very small number of locations: 49 residential, 17 enterprise, and 142 locations in total. In the interest of getting ground-truth data about the nature of the problem, we are organizing an informal effort starting with a meeting (BarBoF) at the March IETF in Dallas to coordinate with network stack, browser, and middlebox vendors, as well as network and service operators, on collecting and reporting statistics about middlebox impact on transport sessions. The objective is to determine a set of measurements that can be made as a side effect of the normal operation of the networking stack, and a reporting format that provides some visibility into the scope and nature of middlebox impact while addressing end-user privacy and business confidentiality concerns. This activity is an outcome of the recent IAB workshop on Stack Evolution in a Middlebox Internet [5]. For additional information, please contact the list administrators. From nobody Thu Feb 26 12:04:01 2015 Return-Path: X-Original-To: hops@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: hops@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 734461ACD01 for ; Thu, 26 Feb 2015 12:00:39 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.999 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.999 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001] autolearn=ham Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 4ANsVp9J5b6r for ; Thu, 26 Feb 2015 12:00:38 -0800 (PST) Received: from mail-vc0-x236.google.com (mail-vc0-x236.google.com [IPv6:2607:f8b0:400c:c03::236]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 5D9D91ACC8D for ; Thu, 26 Feb 2015 12:00:28 -0800 (PST) Received: by mail-vc0-f182.google.com with SMTP id id10so4767373vcb.13 for ; Thu, 26 Feb 2015 12:00:27 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20120113; h=mime-version:date:message-id:subject:from:to:content-type; bh=7On3hLi27Pz4zekee7hkjoQnGR4h42KsAKKukSk9uBk=; b=HFdZfIckjyhCJ876ez4bZ5fbt8EkA+aDTZhpQ1V2JjqhzlgyHzFwWBn8UwpqLjcCi4 IlK1lSBa6xgpGwfoCZruCE9Az4V/gQXSeeETy/kl8CLgziEVeNFSQgwn4zrtGZbhkFxT +Fy+4OLRyKcFXcdwkpGBsn8e1sCEjXauVkM74ltwruPr3Ktsx6uk56Cg8LggnqtXhxX2 vnlSFNEZLKsqzoMuyt9orQg8CWBMdvnoPw2DguFLQdFQ8WeSU2KEz/P6aEFzmH7FCmwP BfYXr9SgFEOs81/JHQgmM1P92GGDP55iSWSSfMqhGWm+y8newXXSLPzn5aPc13pyY0st l0OQ== MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Received: by 10.52.28.19 with SMTP id x19mr10070025vdg.39.1424980827369; Thu, 26 Feb 2015 12:00:27 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.52.37.132 with HTTP; Thu, 26 Feb 2015 12:00:27 -0800 (PST) Date: Thu, 26 Feb 2015 15:00:27 -0500 Message-ID: From: Aaron Falk To: hops@ietf.org Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary=20cf3078112606f80b05100334a1 Archived-At: X-Mailman-Approved-At: Thu, 26 Feb 2015 12:03:59 -0800 Subject: [hops] BarBoF logistics (preliminary) X-BeenThere: hops@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15 Precedence: list List-Id: Measuring deployability of new transport protocols List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 26 Feb 2015 20:00:39 -0000 --20cf3078112606f80b05100334a1 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 For folks mapping out their IETF week, the current plan is to hold the BarBoF on Sunday night, March 22, at 21:30. I believe I have found a place we can meet that is actually near a bar. The tentative location is the "International Foyer" in the Fairmont. The subscription rate on the list is still fairly high so I plan to re-transmit this again in a few days. --aaron --20cf3078112606f80b05100334a1 Content-Type: text/html; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
For folks mapping out their IETF week, the current plan is= to hold the BarBoF on Sunday night, March 22, at 21:30.=C2=A0 I believe I = have found a place we can meet that is actually near a bar.=C2=A0 The tenta= tive location is the "International Foyer" in the Fairmont. =C2= =A0

The subscription rate on the list is still fairly hi= gh so I plan to re-transmit this again in a few days.

--aaron
--20cf3078112606f80b05100334a1--