From ipp-bounces@pwg.org Sat Oct 1 12:09:31 2016 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ietfarch-ipp-archive@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: ietfarch-ipp-archive@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 164CC12B114 for ; Sat, 1 Oct 2016 12:09:31 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.886 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.886 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, HEADER_FROM_DIFFERENT_DOMAINS=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE=-0.0001, RP_MATCHES_RCVD=-2.996, SPF_PASS=-0.001, T_DKIM_INVALID=0.01] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=fail (2048-bit key) reason="fail (message has been altered)" header.d=apple.com Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id dOKPqoqVrlso for ; Sat, 1 Oct 2016 12:09:30 -0700 (PDT) Received: from www.pwg.org (www.pwg.org [50.116.7.199]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 14BB012B0F8 for ; 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Sat, 01 Oct 2016 12:09:22 -0700 (PDT) From: Michael Sweet Date: Sat, 01 Oct 2016 15:09:19 -0400 Message-id: To: ipp X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.3226) X-Brightmail-Tracker: H4sIAAAAAAAAA+NgFupmluLIzCtJLcpLzFFi42IRbCgM1n3E+SHcoOmZjMWxfS9ZHBg95i2e zhTAGMVlk5Kak1mWWqRvl8CVce3GaqaCaawVB++8Y25g3MHcxcjJISFgInHi20SmLkYuDiGB vYwSTRufsMIlXqxig0gcZJRY8H8KO0iCV0BQ4sfkeyxdjBwczALyEgfPy4KEmQW0JL4/amUB sYUE/jFKXG+UALGFBSQkjvcvBJvJJqAm8XtSH5jNIqAq0X35HzNEjbHEvXN3mSHG20i8WvWb DcQWERCVOPZzCTPIKgkBWYnZv7xAzpEQuMsqce7rI9YJjAKzkFw0C+GiWUguWsDIvIpRKDcx M0c3M89IL7GgICdVLzk/dxMjKPSm2wnuYDy+yuoQowAHoxIP74Kf78OFWBPLiitzDzFKc7Ao ifPe+/QuXEggPbEkNTs1tSC1KL6oNCe1+BAjEwenVAMjS7zAvZJjx0SzefpXX/qWk9/uu93P /HpRtb3GRc0ks49L1h/71por7/767zfOuxqnZ0pcfKVxYlm07BG5U02N122Pe9gLMM34eL0v idkqQK+zyMgjKTB5zp+I6xlTX7y/aT1rZ8HXrSqHfG/fz7qaIfZD8KfpgSne9lwsFY/jZj84 XCUdFV2gxFKckWioxVxUnAgAc1Kg5B4CAAA= X-Brightmail-Tracker: H4sIAAAAAAAAA+NgFupiluLIzCtJLcpLzFFi42IRbCiW1H3E+SHc4Nk6dotj+16yODB6zFs8 nSmAMYrLJiU1J7MstUjfLoEr49qN1UwF01grDt55x9zAuIO5i5GTQ0LAROLEi1VsELaYxIV7 64FsLg4hgYOMEgv+T2EHSfAKCEr8mHyPpYuRg4NZQF7i4HlZkDCzgJbE90etLCC2kMA/Ronr jRIgtrCAhMTx/oWsIDabgJrE70l9YDaLgKpE9+V/zBA1xhL3zt1lhhhvI/Fq1W+wG0QERCWO /VzCDLJKQkBWYvYvrwmMfLOQHDEL4YhZSI5YwMi8ilGgKDUnsdJYL7GgICdVLzk/dxMjOIQK g3cw/llmdYhRgINRiYfX4/v7cCHWxLLiytxDjBIczEoivKfZP4QL8aYkVlalFuXHF5XmpBYf YpTmYFES57X98C5cSCA9sSQ1OzW1ILUIJsvEwSnVwNhdM+Nd8Es73zhf9ejQxVk37zHbvHq/ NvATo/FzoxcfP8p97b5wrLMr9mnX3y8BybN0dNJbrSoP8Vb2B5uIcSXzMXBkM7hEz2JcGPe4 blmv0bSSKd9iPqr9yK2cK7PVeZ//F5GPf0Imn4x+2vV2Hh/fST7LM3K7rr/847+3MH7LvP4r 885uF1ZiKc5INNRiLipOBAA/UKmMHQIAAA== Subject: [IPP] Registration for "output-bin" value 'auto' X-BeenThere: ipp@pwg.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15 Precedence: list List-Id: Internet Printing Protocol Workgroup discussion list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: ipp-bounces@pwg.org Sender: "ipp" All, Apple would like to register a new "output-bin" keyword value of 'auto', which specifies that a Printer automatically chooses the correct output tray for the given Job Template attributes. The registration template is as follows: Attributes (attribute syntax) Keyword Attribute Value Reference ----------------------- --------- output-bin (type2 keyword) [PWG5100.2] auto [APPLE20161001] _________________________________________________________ Michael Sweet, Senior Printing System Engineer _______________________________________________ ipp mailing list ipp@pwg.org https://www.pwg.org/mailman/listinfo/ipp From ipp-bounces@pwg.org Sat Oct 1 16:01:44 2016 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ietfarch-ipp-archive@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: ietfarch-ipp-archive@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3FA32128B37 for ; Sat, 1 Oct 2016 16:01:44 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.886 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.886 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, HEADER_FROM_DIFFERENT_DOMAINS=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE=-0.0001, RP_MATCHES_RCVD=-2.996, SPF_PASS=-0.001, T_DKIM_INVALID=0.01] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); 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charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: ipp-bounces@pwg.org Sender: "ipp" All, I have posted the minutes from the September 26, 2016 IPP 3D conference call to: http://ftp.pwg.org/pub/pwg/ipp/minutes/ippv2-concall-minutes-20160926.pdf Our next conference call is at our new day and time this Wednesday, October 5, 2016 at 1pm ET. _________________________________________________________ Michael Sweet, Senior Printing System Engineer _______________________________________________ ipp mailing list ipp@pwg.org https://www.pwg.org/mailman/listinfo/ipp From ipp-bounces@pwg.org Sat Oct 1 16:08:40 2016 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ietfarch-ipp-archive@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: ietfarch-ipp-archive@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 725D6128874 for ; Sat, 1 Oct 2016 16:08:40 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.886 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.886 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, HEADER_FROM_DIFFERENT_DOMAINS=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE=-0.0001, RP_MATCHES_RCVD=-2.996, SPF_PASS=-0.001, T_DKIM_INVALID=0.01] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); 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Sat, 1 Oct 2016 16:08:31 -0700 (PDT) MIME-version: 1.0 Received: from [17.153.31.246] by nwk-mmpp-sz08.apple.com (Oracle Communications Messaging Server 8.0.1.1.0 64bit (built Jun 15 2016)) with ESMTPSA id <0OEE00ALK5M4BG30@nwk-mmpp-sz08.apple.com>; Sat, 01 Oct 2016 16:08:31 -0700 (PDT) From: Michael Sweet In-reply-to: <61EBB88E-EBB5-4D3E-A988-5E3498328782@hp.com> Date: Sat, 01 Oct 2016 19:08:27 -0400 Message-id: <69E64E55-1697-41ED-98BE-A5838D2B1B3F@apple.com> References: <61EBB88E-EBB5-4D3E-A988-5E3498328782@hp.com> To: Smith Kennedy X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.3226) X-Brightmail-Tracker: H4sIAAAAAAAAA+NgFtrJLMWRmVeSWpSXmKPExsUi2FAYrPvB8UO4wZk+U4tj+16yWLzq2sXs wOSxa9tOJo95i6czBTBFcdmkpOZklqUW6dslcGX8vbCereA1f8XWhqmMDYybebsYOTkkBEwk Ll88xNjFyMUhJLCXUaLj3XZmmMS9zc+hEgcZJf5tu8EIkuAVEJT4MfkeSxcjBwezgLzEwfOy IGFmAS2J749aWSDq3zFKnFw0mR0kISwgIXG8fyErSL2wgJ/Ezr9MIGE2ATWJ35P6WEFsTgEr iXXzGsHiLAKqEive9rNCzJSXaLhzhQVirY3E3z/n2EBsIQFLifePj4GNFxHQkPgwpZkNZLyE gKzE7F9eICdICOxgk3je95ppAqPwLCRXz0K4ehaSqxcwMq9iFMpNzMzRzcwz00ssKMhJ1UvO z93ECArr6XaiOxjPrLI6xCjAwajEw7vg5/twIdbEsuLK3EOM0hwsSuK8tz69CxcSSE8sSc1O TS1ILYovKs1JLT7EyMTBKdXAeKjx1Jk1bvGvQx4bmP+4v6TrYdqqnVqPdiz5tu9yUOcnmXk1 p6Tu8jHyhz682xlR6tkcvTQ/tfw78waHBk+zz+c4eTmPJ0ZY/7YxeqWgoRhVy9dtl/N09vSe luWZ2pm7t3ryOsyJTwq+9+tHVFmc2FWzP46WPMJP9A6/vrmus2PKiads7zWfK7EUZyQaajEX FScCAIQc1NFMAgAA X-Brightmail-Tracker: H4sIAAAAAAAAA+NgFmpgkeLIzCtJLcpLzFFi42IRbCiW1H3v+CHc4MYDOYtj+16yWLzq2sXs wOSxa9tOJo95i6czBTBFcdmkpOZklqUW6dslcGX8vbCereA1f8XWhqmMDYybebsYOTkkBEwk 7m1+zghhi0lcuLeerYuRi0NI4CCjxL9tN8ASvAKCEj8m32PpYuTgYBaQlzh4XhYkzCygJfH9 USsLRP07RomTiyazgySEBSQkjvcvZAWpFxbwk9j5lwkkzCagJvF7Uh8riM0pYCWxbl4jWJxF QFVixdt+VoiZ8hINd66wQKy1kfj75xwbiC0kYCnx/vExsPEiAhoSH6Y0s4GMlxCQlZj9y2sC o+AsJIfOQjh0FpJDFzAyr2IUKErNSaw01kssKMhJ1UvOz93ECA7PwuAdjH+WWR1iFOBgVOLh 9fj+PlyINbGsuDL3EKMEB7OSCG+ww4dwId6UxMqq1KL8+KLSnNTiQ4zJQOdPZJYSTc4Hxk5e SbyhiYmBibGxmbGxuYk5acJK4ry2H96FCwmkJ5akZqemFqQWwWxh4uCUamC0OHtwUZvbqui4 OVpvvRxuSyo29N3+ZrbWT1WPo3GG3jXb7+2BMUF39/MLLTxctnLb1JxXwdrXl+6cHhPwLK13 +fE75QubtipPqDhuVRSds7nz+merVpZTM6SzWWx4Dfhl2R4pvZjjf2Ljq+BDpdw99RPuX5/s d/bUqwahU/uSUnZUd33NFbdSYinOSDTUYi4qTgQAdStiPJMCAAA= Cc: "ipp@pwg.org" Subject: Re: [IPP] New stable draft of IPP Finishings 2.1 available for review X-BeenThere: ipp@pwg.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15 Precedence: list List-Id: Internet Printing Protocol Workgroup discussion list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: ipp-bounces@pwg.org Sender: "ipp" Smith, One comment inline, we can talk more on the Wednesday concall... > On Sep 27, 2016, at 12:59 AM, Kennedy, Smith (Wireless Architect) wrote: > > Greetings, > > I have posted for review a new stable draft of IPP Finishings 2.1. It is available here: > > http://ftp.pwg.org/pub/pwg/ipp/wd/wd-ippfinishings21-20160926.pdf > http://ftp.pwg.org/pub/pwg/ipp/wd/wd-ippfinishings21-20160926.docx > http://ftp.pwg.org/pub/pwg/ipp/wd/wd-ippfinishings21-20160926-rev.pdf > http://ftp.pwg.org/pub/pwg/ipp/wd/wd-ippfinishings21-20160926-rev.docx > > Highlights within include the following: > > * Made some modifications to the "printer-finisher" definition including updates to 'Table 2 - Keywords for "printer-finisher"'. > > * Added a new "printer-finisher-supplies" attribute that conveys the finisher unit's supplies information, which is defined in "Printer Finishing MIB" [RFC3806] but has no IPP equivalent. > > * Added a comment to section 5.3 "job-pages-per-set" asking for a description of how "job-pages-per-set" would work in the case where the Job contains multiple Documents. This is defined by the "multiple-document-handling" attribute, just as for the rest of the Job Template attributes. Conceptually we want to have a "pages-per-set" Document Template attribute, although I suspect that it would not see much use - "job-pages-per-set" is for things like PWG Raster Format where the Client is providing its own copies/sets to the Printer (multiple documents merged at the Client) rather than sending a high-level format (PDF) and asking the Printer to produce multiple sets/copies. Printers sophisticated enough to support the Document object are probably going to support PDF... (so maybe we can just reference the section on "multiple-document-handling" in RFC2911bis and say why there is no equivalent Document Template attribute?) _________________________________________________________ Michael Sweet, Senior Printing System Engineer _______________________________________________ ipp mailing list ipp@pwg.org https://www.pwg.org/mailman/listinfo/ipp From ipp-bounces@pwg.org Sat Oct 1 22:30:51 2016 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ietfarch-ipp-archive@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: ietfarch-ipp-archive@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9C07812B093 for ; Sat, 1 Oct 2016 22:30:51 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -4.896 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-4.896 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, HEADER_FROM_DIFFERENT_DOMAINS=0.001, RP_MATCHES_RCVD=-2.996, SPF_PASS=-0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id FZMI3-s_DSPw for ; Sat, 1 Oct 2016 22:30:50 -0700 (PDT) Received: from www.pwg.org (www.pwg.org [IPv6:2600:3c01::f03c:91ff:fe70:b03f]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 31A1412B03B for ; Sat, 1 Oct 2016 22:30:50 -0700 (PDT) Received: by www.pwg.org (Postfix, from userid 1002) id A1862440D; Sun, 2 Oct 2016 05:30:49 +0000 (UTC) Received: from www.pwg.org (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by www.pwg.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7279227B2; Sun, 2 Oct 2016 05:30:45 +0000 (UTC) X-Original-To: ipp@pwg.org Delivered-To: ipp@pwg.org Received: by www.pwg.org (Postfix, from userid 1002) id AEA18415D; Sun, 2 Oct 2016 05:30:43 +0000 (UTC) Received: from NAM02-BL2-obe.outbound.protection.outlook.com (mail-bl2nam02on0090.outbound.protection.outlook.com [104.47.38.90]) by www.pwg.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 06191259F for ; Sun, 2 Oct 2016 05:30:42 +0000 (UTC) Received: from DF4PR84MB0284.NAMPRD84.PROD.OUTLOOK.COM (10.162.193.22) by DF4PR84MB0283.NAMPRD84.PROD.OUTLOOK.COM (10.162.193.21) with Microsoft SMTP Server (version=TLS1_2, cipher=TLS_ECDHE_RSA_WITH_AES_256_CBC_SHA384_P384) id 15.1.639.5; Sun, 2 Oct 2016 05:30:40 +0000 Received: from DF4PR84MB0284.NAMPRD84.PROD.OUTLOOK.COM ([10.162.193.22]) by DF4PR84MB0284.NAMPRD84.PROD.OUTLOOK.COM ([10.162.193.22]) with mapi id 15.01.0639.015; Sun, 2 Oct 2016 05:30:40 +0000 From: "Kennedy, Smith (Wireless Architect)" To: "ipp@pwg.org" Thread-Topic: Why are some attributes that provide a dateTime data type allowed to specify "no-value" while others are not? Thread-Index: AQHSHG4ckkRahzKj+U2CQETatrNCYQ== Date: Sun, 2 Oct 2016 05:30:40 +0000 Message-ID: <2518EDD8-B120-46DF-B9EF-DA50CBE99344@hp.com> Accept-Language: en-US Content-Language: en-US X-MS-Has-Attach: yes X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: authentication-results: spf=none (sender IP is ) smtp.mailfrom=smith.kennedy@hp.com; x-ms-exchange-messagesentrepresentingtype: 1 x-originating-ip: [75.174.42.172] x-ms-office365-filtering-correlation-id: 6e2b2c5d-b5f2-46ac-82c2-08d3ea853f46 x-microsoft-exchange-diagnostics: 1; DF4PR84MB0283; 6:u2UqoMb/P8JlMYZQh12i3J4HJadLx1RY12ZBLLSNdcVwupdjBbbdKV3YjIYMtAE4Gxb7VNppzVNj0maUdJ3hbESjrC7opukgqWuoF1897gEjl9HWnIPBqBnfSyhkUy1I2l8xruBAiL5t12bpL/AKV58L+mLX56b5ZWNBvLZGG4reVRvDxbAPmNP+IEPCrwJ7ojZriUZRbjlC5BPYoAIU+AshRe4qKbK9jVD5AbGyrzlPt2duKSgnhYlg2RVEr1NTQ46o4/yhsfGAImqM7J8+h4jgy4mcDR9eoRSagY5B06M=; 5:lz7aM8ePwWAeazczwd21B0pKgQ+OLC4A0OAcULoWU4PucWMNutl5FY7Cgu7funlfJkCVcr2nwTQvhDm/7Zy9JdqNZhi7MTUQ6/u8/rVR2o6Z7w5yECSG9byMuWzRbpVWnkljcj4ZDrJQ+sbsFQb4Dg==; 24:ZZdhTEyC3Lo7E//ETlnxUvRXG+liGe9jj89pLRhHCduPa6o9812Qqe28HKvK5tZWapNxFY458ClvB/gfwzzgfxp5BWk1zLVP+PzlcJFi1tk=; 7:lrQvqefyBnDLdk/mOXgTcd24/TL+MCZZzXqOCXywdvuwNn8A4pCsVzI31HDeOBGibuQeDb3PSXDwLr+MF/sFUPd7DTBRGlFIHCoTVq8odnFT9Mzn3HCkvtkKWO8KPDiEdyzj8AUGQDmtk57vmhQuyVZFTnI50LLuhlLghoEQ10tMhA2Sosn/DUjE82URHU18SnFPpuCC3HrswuxmyYwh6Tpa+hPf1vnW59pqxcCs0S5i1avd73d3fLgShZLf8bVqyCSeTrbLUBcQykn9frqi3aRymtnokX7iR4goIL2kNyR154VAix94vM3Xai2FwJE+ x-microsoft-antispam: UriScan:;BCL:0;PCL:0;RULEID:;SRVR:DF4PR84MB0283; x-microsoft-antispam-prvs: x-exchange-antispam-report-test: UriScan:(20558992708506); x-exchange-antispam-report-cfa-test: BCL:0; PCL:0; RULEID:(102415321)(6040176)(601004)(2401047)(8121501046)(5005006)(10201501046)(3002001); SRVR:DF4PR84MB0283; BCL:0; PCL:0; RULEID:; SRVR:DF4PR84MB0283; x-forefront-prvs: 0083A7F08A x-forefront-antispam-report: SFV:NSPM; SFS:(10019020)(6009001)(7916002)(199003)(6602003)(189002)(83716003)(6916009)(305945005)(450100001)(82746002)(3660700001)(107886002)(92566002)(2900100001)(77096005)(99286002)(2501003)(68736007)(110136003)(66066001)(189998001)(7736002)(81156014)(86362001)(8676002)(106116001)(105586002)(97736004)(106356001)(87936001)(81166006)(1730700003)(7846002)(3846002)(54356999)(10400500002)(11100500001)(99936001)(8936002)(2351001)(3280700002)(229853001)(33656002)(2906002)(122556002)(50986999)(586003)(5660300001)(36756003)(5002640100001)(5640700001)(6116002)(101416001)(102836003)(104396002); DIR:OUT; SFP:1102; SCL:1; SRVR:DF4PR84MB0283; H:DF4PR84MB0284.NAMPRD84.PROD.OUTLOOK.COM; FPR:; SPF:None; PTR:InfoNoRecords; A:1; MX:1; LANG:en; received-spf: None (protection.outlook.com: hp.com does not designate permitted sender hosts) spamdiagnosticoutput: 1:99 spamdiagnosticmetadata: NSPM MIME-Version: 1.0 X-OriginatorOrg: hp.com X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-originalarrivaltime: 02 Oct 2016 05:30:40.1136 (UTC) X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-fromentityheader: Hosted X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-id: ca7981a2-785a-463d-b82a-3db87dfc3ce6 X-MS-Exchange-Transport-CrossTenantHeadersStamped: DF4PR84MB0283 Subject: [IPP] Why are some attributes that provide a dateTime data type allowed to specify "no-value" while others are not? X-BeenThere: ipp@pwg.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15 Precedence: list List-Id: Internet Printing Protocol Workgroup discussion list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="===============4143378153887393054==" Errors-To: ipp-bounces@pwg.org Sender: "ipp" --===============4143378153887393054== Content-Language: en-US Content-Type: multipart/signed; boundary="Apple-Mail=_2E43D63C-DF04-4D96-9F1D-CF5B8C51E3C2"; protocol="application/pkcs7-signature"; micalg=sha1 --Apple-Mail=_2E43D63C-DF04-4D96-9F1D-CF5B8C51E3C2 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Greetings, While running the IPP Everywhere Self Certification suite against a = printer that has no persistent clock, we saw several failures having to = do with the state of some time related attributes. When I started = digging into those attributes, I discovered that some attributes, such = as "date-time-at-processing" or "date-time-at-completed", are defined as = (dateTime | no-value) while others such as "date-time-at-creation" or = "printer-current-time" are simply defined to be of type "dateTime". And = yet the description of "printer-current-time" in even the latest draft = of RFC 2911bis allowed the attribute to have the out-of-band value = 'no-value'. What is the right thing to do in these cases? And should it be = acceptable if a Printer that lacks a clock reports 'no-value' for = "printer-config-change-date-time"? If it is OK to return 'no-value' then = I think tests I-9 and I-14 may need to be fixed. Thoughts? Smith /** Smith Kennedy Wireless Architect - Client Software - IPG-PPS Standards - IEEE ISTO PWG / Bluetooth SIG / Wi-Fi Alliance / NFC = Forum / USB IF Chair, IEEE ISTO Printer Working Group HP Inc. */ --Apple-Mail=_2E43D63C-DF04-4D96-9F1D-CF5B8C51E3C2 Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="smime.p7s" Content-Type: application/pkcs7-signature; name="smime.p7s" Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64 MIAGCSqGSIb3DQEHAqCAMIACAQExCzAJBgUrDgMCGgUAMIAGCSqGSIb3DQEHAQAAoIIOQDCCBmEw ggVJoAMCAQICEDtXE7awITX7XkZ1ymyyxOEwDQYJKoZIhvcNAQEFBQAwgcoxCzAJBgNVBAYTAlVT MRcwFQYDVQQKEw5WZXJpU2lnbiwgSW5jLjEfMB0GA1UECxMWVmVyaVNpZ24gVHJ1c3QgTmV0d29y azE6MDgGA1UECxMxKGMpIDE5OTkgVmVyaVNpZ24sIEluYy4gLSBGb3IgYXV0aG9yaXplZCB1c2Ug b25seTFFMEMGA1UEAxM8VmVyaVNpZ24gQ2xhc3MgMiBQdWJsaWMgUHJpbWFyeSBDZXJ0aWZpY2F0 aW9uIEF1dGhvcml0eSAtIEczMB4XDTA5MDkwMjAwMDAwMFoXDTE5MDkwMTIzNTk1OVowgfcxCzAJ BgNVBAYTAlVTMSAwHgYDVQQKExdIZXdsZXR0LVBhY2thcmQgQ29tcGFueTEfMB0GA1UECxMWVmVy 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ipp@pwg.org Received: by www.pwg.org (Postfix, from userid 1002) id 6F028415D; Sun, 2 Oct 2016 10:49:13 +0000 (UTC) Received: from mail-in5.apple.com (mail-out5.apple.com [17.151.62.27]) by www.pwg.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 51D072617 for ; Sun, 2 Oct 2016 10:49:12 +0000 (UTC) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; d=apple.com; s=mailout2048s; c=relaxed/simple; q=dns/txt; i=@apple.com; t=1475405352; h=From:Sender:Reply-To:Subject:Date:Message-id:To:Cc:MIME-version:Content-type: Content-Transfer-Encoding:Content-ID:Content-Description:Resent-Date:Resent-From: Resent-Sender:Resent-To:Resent-Cc:Resent-Message-ID:In-reply-to:References:List-Id: List-Help:List-Unsubscribe:List-Subscribe:List-Post:List-Owner:List-Archive; bh=kDV1wc2GfenaMCg0v6RNL/WX3vPzNlU/a+uc+omFnGs=; b=3CXZ3Io56EvuCMK7WUg9ZzSWiQg87S3Ut1UN3O3oOWh379TQ9INfJh9TkCnKRG68 bTwZiMuR5aCWMIEZuWmdUDC8K0M72Z6jEg83HxROdIZN0sVKRWgzLPYn9FYNf/4d NmnF0LG0VnwSjDp5oKUcmPbX53ugyyNEi26RblJyHnZbCR02VIG9CKXQ1A102pX3 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-0400 Message-id: <2E6E2B92-5D84-4560-87BF-7074991047B2@apple.com> References: <2518EDD8-B120-46DF-B9EF-DA50CBE99344@hp.com> To: "Kennedy, Smith (Wireless Architect)" X-Brightmail-Tracker: H4sIAAAAAAAAA+NgFrrELMWRmVeSWpSXmKPExsUi2FAYoavx7EO4we+p7BbH9r1ksXjVtYvZ gclj17adTB7zFk9nCmCK4rJJSc3JLEst0rdL4Mp4fuErU8EG7YrzrfPYGxj7VbsYOTkkBEwk 9u3uYQexhQT2Mkrc7gqCid9+MA8qvp5RYvq6OBCbV0BQ4sfkeywgNrNAmMTtFd/Zuhi5gGqm M0l0P5rNDJIQFpCQON6/kBUkISzQxCix8dhdsElsAmoSvyf1sUJskJHY8OQoI4jNKWAlsWvh TCYQm0VAVeLlqS5GiA3yEg13rrBAbLaROHvzNyPERZYS+76cBZspIuAg8XzJJxaImZfZJJbP K5zAKDQLybGzkBwLYWtJfH/UChTnAFtx8LwsRFhT4tm9T+wQtrbEk3cXWBcwsq1iFMpNzMzR zcwz1UssKMhJ1UvOz93ECIqE6XbCOxhPr7I6xCjAwajEw+vx/X24EGtiWXFl7iFGaQ4WJXHe +5/ehQsJpCeWpGanphakFsUXleakFh9iZOLglGpgnNohsn7XL+bFbA9OqE1lvNz/fHZLJpf5 m4UrNKdf8VzHV611aatW8JnTv8135vOk7NdwsxKaX/FbvrJjnanFLC0lDYZLnF9M9t3XTive kJXcODFMQ/as88LXxhpMB3i2Pr+xJX6LX+qNZf++ry6NaOWLi7mybc3H6QdkfeufrF9x5NaC +ROFuZVYijMSDbWYi4oTARBpJLdlAgAA X-Brightmail-Tracker: H4sIAAAAAAAAA+NgFjrFIsWRmVeSWpSXmKPExsUiuJrJTlf92Ydwg+2bDS2O7XvJYvGqaxez A5PHrm07mTzmLZ7OFMAUxWWTkpqTWZZapG+XwJXx/MJXpoIN2hXnW+exNzD2q3YxcnJICJhI 3H4wjx3CFpO4cG89G4gtJLCeUWL6ujgQm1dAUOLH5HssIDazQJjE7RXfgWq4gGqmM0l0P5rN DJIQFpCQON6/kBUkISzQxCix8dhdsKlsAmoSvyf1sUJskJHY8OQoI4jNKWAlsWvhTCYQm0VA VeLlqS5GiA3yEg13rrBAbLaROHvzNyPERZYS+76cBZspIuAg8XzJJ5YJjAKzkBw4C8mBELaW xPdHrUBxDrCxB8/LQoQ1JZ7d+8QOYWtLPHl3gXUBI9sqRoGi1JzESlO9xIKCnFS95PzcTYyg oG4ojNjB+H+Z1SFGAQ5GJR7eBT/fhwuxJpYVV+YeYpTgYFYS4ZV7+iFciDclsbIqtSg/vqg0 J7X4EONERqDHJjJLiSbnA2MuryTe0MTEwMTY2MzY2NzEnJbCSuK8th/ehQsJpCeWpGanphak FsEcxcTBKdXA6GtXwPzvzxGpjZNqFfbrfTmr/3/HjJcNF7YfSTN8tEB42eI+1q9FzecS/z/a paRntX769+ZjDaqzBJYZhV/buETWQvUTg+xTlwPTucVbPm8oMm3YyFqkUNjWc1rOnkv1Ublo 8bsFrhwp+dN/VDMu2b203m6hYquFenSpjldF7eK7llYbmU81KrEUZyQaajEXFScCAIySWADd AgAA Cc: "ipp@pwg.org" Subject: Re: [IPP] Why are some attributes that provide a dateTime data type allowed to specify "no-value" while others are not? X-BeenThere: ipp@pwg.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15 Precedence: list List-Id: Internet Printing Protocol Workgroup discussion list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="===============5293578360028635594==" Errors-To: ipp-bounces@pwg.org Sender: "ipp" --===============5293578360028635594== Content-type: multipart/alternative; boundary="Boundary_(ID_zbDvWdtzIYuk5xc0IQTR5Q)" --Boundary_(ID_zbDvWdtzIYuk5xc0IQTR5Q) Content-type: text/plain; CHARSET=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Smith, The date-time-at-creation attribute doesn't have a no-value in the syntax because the value is set at creation of the job - it will always have a value. The -at-processing value is set when the job enters the processing state and the -at-completed value is set when the job enters a terminating state. I'll need to research why we changed printer-current-time to allow no-value - it shouldn't. Either the printer supports printer-current-time or not. If the current time is unknown (waiting to get network time or have the date/time set through other mean) the value should be the unknown out-of-band value. Sent from my iPad > On Oct 2, 2016, at 1:30 AM, Kennedy, Smith (Wireless Architect) wrote: > > Greetings, > > While running the IPP Everywhere Self Certification suite against a printer that has no persistent clock, we saw several failures having to do with the state of some time related attributes. When I started digging into those attributes, I discovered that some attributes, such as "date-time-at-processing" or "date-time-at-completed", are defined as (dateTime | no-value) while others such as "date-time-at-creation" or "printer-current-time" are simply defined to be of type "dateTime". And yet the description of "printer-current-time" in even the latest draft of RFC 2911bis allowed the attribute to have the out-of-band value 'no-value'. > > What is the right thing to do in these cases? And should it be acceptable if a Printer that lacks a clock reports 'no-value' for "printer-config-change-date-time"? If it is OK to return 'no-value' then I think tests I-9 and I-14 may need to be fixed. > > Thoughts? > > Smith > > /** > Smith Kennedy > Wireless Architect - Client Software - IPG-PPS > Standards - IEEE ISTO PWG / Bluetooth SIG / Wi-Fi Alliance / NFC Forum / USB IF > Chair, IEEE ISTO Printer Working Group > HP Inc. > */ > > > > _______________________________________________ > ipp mailing list > ipp@pwg.org > https://www.pwg.org/mailman/listinfo/ipp --Boundary_(ID_zbDvWdtzIYuk5xc0IQTR5Q) Content-type: text/html; CHARSET=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: quoted-printable
Smi= th,

The date-time-at-creation attribute doesn't have a no-value in t= he syntax because the value is set at creation of the job - it will always h= ave a value. The -at-processing value is set when the job enters the process= ing state and the -at-completed value is set when the job enters a terminati= ng state.

I'll need to research why we changed printer-current-time= to allow no-value - it shouldn't. Either the printer supports printer-curre= nt-time or not. If the current time is unknown (waiting to get network time o= r have the date/time set through other mean) the value should be the unknown= out-of-band value.

Sent from my iPad

On Oct 2, 2016,= at 1:30 AM, Kennedy, Smith (Wireless Architect) <smith.kennedy@hp.com> wrote:

Greetings,

While= running the IPP Everywhere Self Certification suite against a printer that h= as no persistent clock, we saw several failures having to do with the state o= f some time related attributes. When I started digging into those attributes= , I discovered that some attributes, such as "date-time-at-processing" or "d= ate-time-at-completed", are defined as (dateTime | no-value) while others su= ch as "date-time-at-creation" or "printer-current-time" are simply defined t= o be of type "dateTime". And yet the description of "printer-current-time" i= n even the latest draft of RFC 2911bis allowed the attribute to have the out= -of-band value 'no-value'.

What is the righ= t thing to do in these cases? And should it be acceptable if a Printer that l= acks a clock reports 'no-value' for "printer-config-change-date-time"? If it= is OK to return 'no-value' then I think tests I-9 and I-14 may need to be f= ixed.

Thoughts?

= Smith

/**
 &nbs= p; Smith Kennedy
   Wireless Architect -= Client Software - IPG-PPS
   Standards - IE= EE ISTO PWG / Bluetooth SIG / Wi-Fi Alliance / NFC Forum / USB IF
=    Chair, IEEE ISTO Printer Working Group
   HP Inc.
*/


_______________________________________________
ipp mailing list
ipp@pwg.o= rg
= https://www.pwg.org/mailman/listinfo/ipp
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Thread-Index: AQHSHK1R2sM0kyhiJE+MZPi0sIas1Q== Date: Sun, 2 Oct 2016 13:03:06 +0000 Message-ID: <6BE0C7A7-BCB6-42C4-A93A-80CA944FF06A@hp.com> References: <2518EDD8-B120-46DF-B9EF-DA50CBE99344@hp.com> <2E6E2B92-5D84-4560-87BF-7074991047B2@apple.com> In-Reply-To: <2E6E2B92-5D84-4560-87BF-7074991047B2@apple.com> Accept-Language: en-US Content-Language: en-US X-MS-Has-Attach: yes X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: authentication-results: spf=none (sender IP is ) smtp.mailfrom=smith.kennedy@hp.com; x-ms-exchange-messagesentrepresentingtype: 1 x-originating-ip: [75.174.42.172] x-ms-office365-filtering-correlation-id: ac55c171-0ccb-4d97-d77e-08d3eac473ec x-microsoft-exchange-diagnostics: 1; DF4PR84MB0284; 6:I9ll6Xpe8rS8c6/EGXei5OflJf6QZp5m1o0ybckpjf9yc73zi51PD4odp+gXGeLIqUvPj+yvpDNjncZkakyPzcU3Etu7TfpxGn5YHUg6ityI3AsQm5KysKrBzWW+Es56C6njvQ5Zc9k6hQ7NFly5b37zuSV6NanNBRNaqderNiOG+VV/IyPdVfPCw4a3ueslujiOFWxSTa1FvHwhKQUngjGRfUgfTjbN86C6KhJkBrYoRIzI33xeksUyscRiJtVrzyBBQ6Tx8KuhyOVTj2pgK550thOzju+l8ovrEo7+4ZA=; 5:Geev164rBIXmFxw0BfXwFD/YOxUKezNYMU1792kZ/shrGMeynBmmnfdubeI99kVW6GMy4Rbw25PPFW5kEKq3OlZ7MzkPMZeZARnr3O7H91boh+ITGLtojvJXrok8gHX8bLvHsU7LDlYoHUU7XkyuTQ==; 24:mwDIrA691t2lYrDUahfFnvYV6uk2yszH6cYjVF1wbcuHn5qyprZbaqaD51b4uXYiSPP91grAlukOF4UCksypn+pSywt2uHy20yj1/tcgLsk=; 7:U1n/jdwQki2vL9PZPVi+CNPHYZMp1BKENuLnUtSgGQThWQI/g1uNJ55TckB1W6mZh5rIZyrN4ZOOnJ2mGMIL06Xt9wy1nQ8GozuoSbAlvMpwLlryxghOAFu4NK6O6f7pRw9Dtk4L7DTYi7fnpOJzcEgCZi1EZ9L8LswxEts8pkVG8z+ymmvGGjzoKyYU6g4hIyT2G93mkYuaD8pbrVWlwSeYDAupXBNmDtxYuZ/6JXXIYEh7QqaePVtIbohbGeGQZmpONzQe3FvNhFwCzhd48/v5rQBYJls+3E6JE0DmzgJ0jdwXwYFpO0hdG68v9arZ x-microsoft-antispam: UriScan:;BCL:0;PCL:0;RULEID:;SRVR:DF4PR84MB0284; x-microsoft-antispam-prvs: x-exchange-antispam-report-test: UriScan:(158342451672863)(20558992708506)(31960201722614)(73583498263828); x-exchange-antispam-report-cfa-test: BCL:0; PCL:0; RULEID:(102415321)(6040176)(601004)(2401047)(8121501046)(5005006)(10201501046)(3002001); SRVR:DF4PR84MB0284; BCL:0; PCL:0; RULEID:; SRVR:DF4PR84MB0284; x-forefront-prvs: 0083A7F08A x-forefront-antispam-report: SFV:NSPM; SFS:(10019020)(7916002)(377424004)(377454003)(199003)(6602003)(189002)(24454002)(105586002)(8936002)(54356999)(8666005)(189998001)(7736002)(50986999)(76176999)(68736007)(81166006)(81156014)(7906003)(5002640100001)(99286002)(99936001)(2900100001)(86362001)(7846002)(19617315012)(97736004)(5660300001)(16236675004)(36756003)(87936001)(33656002)(122556002)(3660700001)(66066001)(110136003)(19580405001)(3846002)(77096005)(102836003)(8676002)(101416001)(2950100002)(15975445007)(6116002)(92566002)(6916009)(82746002)(5003630100001)(2906002)(106356001)(106116001)(83716003)(10400500002)(3280700002)(586003)(4326007)(19580395003)(11100500001)(7059030)(104396002); DIR:OUT; SFP:1102; SCL:1; SRVR:DF4PR84MB0284; H:DF4PR84MB0284.NAMPRD84.PROD.OUTLOOK.COM; FPR:; SPF:None; PTR:InfoNoRecords; A:1; MX:1; LANG:en; received-spf: None (protection.outlook.com: hp.com does not designate permitted sender hosts) spamdiagnosticoutput: 1:99 spamdiagnosticmetadata: NSPM MIME-Version: 1.0 X-OriginatorOrg: hp.com X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-originalarrivaltime: 02 Oct 2016 13:03:06.7341 (UTC) X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-fromentityheader: Hosted X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-id: ca7981a2-785a-463d-b82a-3db87dfc3ce6 X-MS-Exchange-Transport-CrossTenantHeadersStamped: DF4PR84MB0284 Cc: "ipp@pwg.org" Subject: Re: [IPP] Why are some attributes that provide a dateTime data type allowed to specify 'no-value' while others are not? X-BeenThere: ipp@pwg.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15 Precedence: list List-Id: Internet Printing Protocol Workgroup discussion list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="===============0521208612020715833==" Errors-To: ipp-bounces@pwg.org Sender: "ipp" --===============0521208612020715833== Content-Language: en-US Content-Type: multipart/signed; boundary="Apple-Mail=_421B97FC-2E59-43AA-A658-F40BC90ACB57"; protocol="application/pkcs7-signature"; micalg=sha1 --Apple-Mail=_421B97FC-2E59-43AA-A658-F40BC90ACB57 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="Apple-Mail=_9C707612-06CA-4CB9-AD76-FE639D973848" --Apple-Mail=_9C707612-06CA-4CB9-AD76-FE639D973848 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Hi Mike, If the Printer has no battery-maintained clock and doesn't have = something like NTP configured to allow it to determine the time once it = has powered up, it isn't clear to me how the Printer will set the value = of "date-time-at-creation" to something other than 'no-value'. Does it = just set it to the epoch? I had thought perhaps the Client might be = always sending the "Date" HTTP Header field and the Client might set its = clock that way, but I see many clients that don't include that header = field in their requests. RFC 2911 section 4.4.30 = (https://tools.ietf.org/html/rfc2911#section-4.4.30 = ) says this: 4.4.30 printer-current-time (dateTime) This Printer attribute indicates the current date and time. This value is used to populate the Event Time Job Description attributes: "date-time-at-creation", "date-time-at-processing", and "date-time- at-completed" (see Section 4.3.14). The date and time is obtained on a "best efforts basis" and does not have to be that precise in order to work in practice. A Printer implementation sets the value of this attribute by obtaining the date and time via some implementation-dependent means, such as getting the value from a network time server, initialization at time of manufacture, or setting by an administrator. See [IPP-IIG] for examples. If an implementation supports this attribute and the implementation knows that it has not yet been set, then the implementation MUST return the value of this attribute using the out-of-band =E2=80=99no-value=E2=80=99 meaning not configured. See = the beginning of section 4.1. RFC 2911bis = (https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-sweet-rfc2911bis-11#section-5.4.30 = ) = didn't change this very much: 5.4.30 = . = printer-current-time (dateTime) This RECOMMENDED Printer attribute indicates the current date and time. This value is used to populate the Event Time Job Status attributes: "date-time-at-creation", "date-time-at-processing", and "date-time-at-completed" (see Section 5.3.14 = ). The date and time is obtained on a "best efforts basis" and in practice does not have to be precise in order to be useful. A Printer implementation sets the value of this attribute by obtaining the date and time via some implementation-dependent means, such as getting the value from a network time server, initialization at time of manufacture, or setting by an Adminstrator. See [RFC3196 = ] and [PWG5100.19 = ] = for examples. If an implementation supports this attribute and the implementation knows that it has not yet been set, then the implementation MUST return the value of this attribute using the out-of-band 'no-value' meaning not configured. See the beginning of Section 5.1 = . If the DHCP leases don't contain an NTP field (option 42, if I'm not = mistaken) then this puts a setup burden on the printers that would most = likely not have a persistent battery supported clock. Smith /** Smith Kennedy Wireless Architect - Client Software - IPG-PPS Standards - IEEE ISTO PWG / Bluetooth SIG / Wi-Fi Alliance / NFC = Forum / USB IF Chair, IEEE ISTO Printer Working Group HP Inc. */ > On 2016-10-02, at 4:49 AM, Michael Sweet wrote: >=20 > Smith, >=20 > The date-time-at-creation attribute doesn't have a no-value in the = syntax because the value is set at creation of the job - it will always = have a value. The -at-processing value is set when the job enters the = processing state and the -at-completed value is set when the job enters = a terminating state. >=20 > I'll need to research why we changed printer-current-time to allow = no-value - it shouldn't. Either the printer supports = printer-current-time or not. If the current time is unknown (waiting to = get network time or have the date/time set through other mean) the value = should be the unknown out-of-band value. >=20 > Sent from my iPad >=20 > On Oct 2, 2016, at 1:30 AM, Kennedy, Smith (Wireless Architect) = wrote: >=20 >> Greetings, >>=20 >> While running the IPP Everywhere Self Certification suite against a = printer that has no persistent clock, we saw several failures having to = do with the state of some time related attributes. When I started = digging into those attributes, I discovered that some attributes, such = as "date-time-at-processing" or "date-time-at-completed", are defined as = (dateTime | no-value) while others such as "date-time-at-creation" or = "printer-current-time" are simply defined to be of type "dateTime". And = yet the description of "printer-current-time" in even the latest draft = of RFC 2911bis allowed the attribute to have the out-of-band value = 'no-value'. >>=20 >> What is the right thing to do in these cases? And should it be = acceptable if a Printer that lacks a clock reports 'no-value' for = "printer-config-change-date-time"? If it is OK to return 'no-value' then = I think tests I-9 and I-14 may need to be fixed. >>=20 >> Thoughts? >>=20 >> Smith >>=20 >> /** >> Smith Kennedy >> Wireless Architect - Client Software - IPG-PPS >> Standards - IEEE ISTO PWG / Bluetooth SIG / Wi-Fi Alliance / NFC = Forum / USB IF >> Chair, IEEE ISTO Printer Working Group >> HP Inc. >> */ >>=20 >>=20 >>=20 >> _______________________________________________ >> ipp mailing list >> ipp@pwg.org >> https://www.pwg.org/mailman/listinfo/ipp --Apple-Mail=_9C707612-06CA-4CB9-AD76-FE639D973848 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Type: text/html; charset=utf-8 Hi Mike,

If the Printer has no battery-maintained clock = and doesn't have something like NTP configured to allow it to determine = the time once it has powered up, it isn't clear to me how the = Printer will set the value of "date-time-at-creation" to something other = than 'no-value'. Does it just set it to the epoch? I had thought = perhaps the Client might be always sending the "Date" HTTP Header field = and the Client might set its clock that way, but I see many clients = that don't include that header field in their requests.

RFC 2911 section 4.4.30 (https://tools.ietf.org/html/rfc2911#section-4.4.30) says = this:

4.4.30 printer-current-time = (dateTime)

   This Printer = attribute indicates the current date and time. =  This
   value is used to populate the Event Time Job = Description attributes:
   "date-time-at-creation", = "date-time-at-processing", and "date-time-
  =  at-completed" (see Section 4.3.14).

   The date and time is = obtained on a "best efforts basis" and does not
  =  have to be that precise in order to work in practice.  A = Printer
   implementation sets the value of this attribute = by obtaining the date
   and time via some = implementation-dependent means, such as getting the
  =  value from a network time server, initialization at time = of
   manufacture, or setting by an administrator. =  See [IPP-IIG] for
   examples.  If an implementation supports this = attribute and the
  =  implementation knows that it has not yet been set, then = the
   implementation MUST return the value = of this attribute using the
   out-of-band =E2=80=99no-value=E2=80=99 meaning = not configured.  See the beginning of
  =  section 4.1.

RFC 2911bis (https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-sweet-rfc2911bis-11#section-5= .4.30) didn't change this very much:

5.4.30.  =
printer-current-time (dateTime)


   This RECOMMENDED Printer attribute indicates the current date and
   time.  This value is used to populate the Event Time Job Status
   attributes: "date-time-at-creation", "date-time-at-processing", and
   "date-time-at-completed" (see Section 5.3.14).

   The date and time is obtained on a "best efforts basis" and in
   practice does not have to be precise in order to be useful.  A
   Printer implementation sets the value of this attribute by obtaining
   the date and time via some implementation-dependent means, such as
   getting the value from a network time server, initialization at time
   of manufacture, or setting by an Adminstrator.  See [RFC3196] =
and
   [PWG5100.19] for examples.  If an implementation supports this
   attribute and the implementation knows that it has not yet been set,
   then the implementation MUST return the value of this attribute using
   the out-of-band 'no-value' meaning not configured.  See the =
beginning
   of Section 5.1.

If = the DHCP leases don't contain an NTP field (option 42, if I'm not = mistaken) then this puts a setup burden on the printers that would most = likely not have a persistent battery supported clock.

Smith

/**
    Smith Kennedy
    = Wireless Architect - Client Software - IPG-PPS
  =   Standards - IEEE ISTO PWG / Bluetooth SIG / Wi-Fi Alliance / NFC = Forum / USB IF
    Chair, IEEE ISTO Printer = Working Group
    HP Inc.
*/



On 2016-10-02, at 4:49 AM, Michael Sweet <msweet@apple.com> = wrote:

Smith,

The date-time-at-creation attribute doesn't have a no-value = in the syntax because the value is set at creation of the job - it will = always have a value. The -at-processing value is set when the job = enters the processing state and the -at-completed value is set when the = job enters a terminating state.

I'll = need to research why we changed printer-current-time to allow no-value - = it shouldn't. Either the printer supports printer-current-time or = not. If the current time is unknown (waiting to get network time or have = the date/time set through other mean) the value should be = the unknown out-of-band value.

Sent = from my iPad

On Oct 2, 2016, at 1:30 AM, = Kennedy, Smith (Wireless Architect) <smith.kennedy@hp.com> wrote:

Greetings,

While running the IPP Everywhere Self = Certification suite against a printer that has no persistent clock, we = saw several failures having to do with the state of some time = related attributes. When I started digging into those attributes, I = discovered that some attributes, such as "date-time-at-processing" = or "date-time-at-completed", are defined as (dateTime | no-value) while = others such as "date-time-at-creation" or "printer-current-time" are = simply defined to be of type "dateTime". And yet the description of = "printer-current-time" in even the latest draft of RFC 2911bis = allowed the attribute to have the out-of-band value 'no-value'.

What is the right thing to do in these cases? = And should it be acceptable if a Printer that lacks a clock reports = 'no-value' for "printer-config-change-date-time"? If it is OK to return = 'no-value' then I think tests I-9 and I-14 may need to be fixed.

Thoughts?

Smith

/**
   Smith = Kennedy
   Wireless Architect - Client Software = - IPG-PPS
   Standards - IEEE ISTO PWG / = Bluetooth SIG / Wi-Fi Alliance / NFC Forum / USB IF
  =  Chair, IEEE ISTO Printer Working Group
  =  HP Inc.
*/



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https://www.pwg.org/mailman/listinfo/ipp

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--Apple-Mail=_421B97FC-2E59-43AA-A658-F40BC90ACB57-- --===============0521208612020715833== Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline _______________________________________________ ipp mailing list ipp@pwg.org https://www.pwg.org/mailman/listinfo/ipp --===============0521208612020715833==-- From ipp-bounces@pwg.org Sun Oct 2 08:42:29 2016 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ietfarch-ipp-archive@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: ietfarch-ipp-archive@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 77740128DF6 for ; Sun, 2 Oct 2016 08:42:29 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -4.781 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-4.781 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AC_DIV_BONANZA=0.001, BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_ADSP_CUSTOM_MED=0.001, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, FREEMAIL_FORGED_FROMDOMAIN=0.001, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, HEADER_FROM_DIFFERENT_DOMAINS=0.001, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, RP_MATCHES_RCVD=-2.996, SPF_PASS=-0.001, T_DKIM_INVALID=0.01] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=fail (2048-bit key) reason="fail (message has been altered)" header.d=gmail.com Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id uFfShCvI9LYD for ; Sun, 2 Oct 2016 08:42:27 -0700 (PDT) Received: from www.pwg.org (www.pwg.org [IPv6:2600:3c01::f03c:91ff:fe70:b03f]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id B8CA8127071 for ; Sun, 2 Oct 2016 08:42:27 -0700 (PDT) Received: by www.pwg.org (Postfix, from userid 1002) id EC5844422; Sun, 2 Oct 2016 15:42:25 +0000 (UTC) Received: from www.pwg.org (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by www.pwg.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id BE01227B2; Sun, 2 Oct 2016 15:42:16 +0000 (UTC) X-Original-To: ipp@pwg.org Delivered-To: ipp@pwg.org Received: by www.pwg.org (Postfix, from userid 1002) id 68EBE415D; Sun, 2 Oct 2016 15:42:14 +0000 (UTC) Received: from mail-io0-x229.google.com (mail-io0-x229.google.com [IPv6:2607:f8b0:4001:c06::229]) by www.pwg.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id B042A2617 for ; Sun, 2 Oct 2016 15:42:13 +0000 (UTC) Received: by mail-io0-x229.google.com with SMTP id e66so100164365iod.1 for ; Sun, 02 Oct 2016 08:42:13 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20120113; h=mime-version:from:date:message-id:subject:to; bh=rq4BEdZY64nu7PC0GLasNNgNVFh5hFH+sPRUKpUApi0=; b=YOHyA5vUjExr1GiIIDbrNcu6oP4RJ+ft66o7A9+/OfuuIVC1VaPWcrh89ABRVHFQsi o9hzKVd77OUgY6BxqJ3o7j4A7FOa1x7g1hMaxxB8r2BMzVOncjJcRI4UogKOx9UBwxsa LT8ovgV+MDvKmyLOWPzDhjKH10TT/3LDhZRkd0xQ+ry1z3xRUFbV4eZaoLZ7WBEylVvB bspWu+o17DiDw7V6f0mp5tfBFWPvaRSJzE9rU3Y94R30RSQ+lbm/ky0LE5fSaZZWg4cz i25pyiBaG+RL0sd3MK0eDxRovrb0sR8AGbwJC7u4VuBXq7zywaq/VADfqqxEJkUCLSaa bY8Q== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20130820; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:from:date:message-id:subject:to; bh=rq4BEdZY64nu7PC0GLasNNgNVFh5hFH+sPRUKpUApi0=; b=IqUmLdfihOEOFdPdMw59hLKf6kJ517hXbQN55jVltQkL0XTBSO8Anrq7DJEyCyFhxM 1XPsqOPepqdNG6kQF5p9AsXZzUgdhZUqXg4gSMlraXvy9ioeONkWKQYi6JZpOPHrTp6a mYy6TvCnbzjWOyyCcAGmqi4xTfwbojGom9bbZcZwoSiK2voo5NmVX6AJgMybQkRBiGUP 0q4aGe4ICx/EuKzDVaLgdBnmdLgfbsuNCo8j/KOCMjIyYBudBeUilnsrogKkkzTagL48 IJNVhlDpCIi3iwwnQT99ktY2vlTaEf822gsaTpzblC26yCsvC8YGNVmGv6DEAdMKZMb0 D4IQ== X-Gm-Message-State: AA6/9Rmc4vuKEqIUZWrEa8Acote2Y/FEG509puDgewVo1AQ+ejfwsX/lWhQxHBQO2N8BSjtkhKRdnRPcw99R+w== X-Received: by 10.107.187.71 with SMTP id l68mr5116827iof.77.1475422933029; Sun, 02 Oct 2016 08:42:13 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 Received: by 10.107.147.6 with HTTP; Sun, 2 Oct 2016 08:41:52 -0700 (PDT) From: Ira McDonald Date: Sun, 2 Oct 2016 11:41:52 -0400 Message-ID: To: "ipp@pwg.org" , Ira McDonald Subject: [IPP] Required real-time clock prevents System Service use by some printers X-BeenThere: ipp@pwg.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15 Precedence: list List-Id: Internet Printing Protocol Workgroup discussion list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="===============7083529487212702132==" Errors-To: ipp-bounces@pwg.org Sender: "ipp" --===============7083529487212702132== Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary=94eb2c076050d11c1a053de3ab90 --94eb2c076050d11c1a053de3ab90 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 Hi, The System Service requirement for a running tick counter and for an actual RTC w/ meaningful time would prevent the use of any Resource operations by some printers. Also, the firmware update and graceful restart abilities, which move away from traditional vendor- and model-specific approaches and improve Managed Print Service compatibility. Questions: (1) Should we reduce the various "date-time-at-xxx" attributes to RECOMMENDED? -- Comment - they are REQUIRED in IPP Everywhere (2) Should we allow the various "time-at-xxx" attributes to be trivial implementations (i.e., without meaningful tick counter)? -- Comment - they are REQUIRED in RFC2911/RFC2911bis, with some ambiguity about implementation Note that I've personally been a proponent of required RTC with meaningful date/time for years, so I'm conflicted about bringing this subject up. WDYT? Cheers, - Ira Ira McDonald (Musician / Software Architect) Co-Chair - TCG Trusted Mobility Solutions WG Chair - Linux Foundation Open Printing WG Secretary - IEEE-ISTO Printer Working Group Co-Chair - IEEE-ISTO PWG Internet Printing Protocol WG IETF Designated Expert - IPP & Printer MIB Blue Roof Music / High North Inc http://sites.google.com/site/blueroofmusic http://sites.google.com/site/highnorthinc mailto: blueroofmusic@gmail.com Jan-April: 579 Park Place Saline, MI 48176 734-944-0094 May-Dec: PO Box 221 Grand Marais, MI 49839 906-494-2434 --94eb2c076050d11c1a053de3ab90 Content-Type: text/html; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Hi,

The System Service requirement for a running tick counte= r and
for an actual RTC w/ meaningful time would prevent the use o= f any
Resource operations by some printers.=C2=A0 Also, the firmwa= re update
and graceful restart abilities, which move away from tra= ditional
vendor- and model-specific approaches and improve Managed=
Print Service compatibility.

Questions:

=
(1) Should we reduce the various "date-time-at-xxx" attribu= tes to
RECOMMENDED?
-- Comment - they are REQUIRED in IPP= Everywhere

(2) Should we allow the various "t= ime-at-xxx" attributes to be
trivial implementations (i.e., w= ithout meaningful tick counter)?
-- Comment - they are REQUIR= ED in RFC2911/RFC2911bis,
with some ambiguity about implement= ation

Note that I've personally been a pr= oponent of required RTC
with meaningful date/time for years, = so I'm conflicted about
bringing this subject up.

=
WDYT?

Cheers,
- Ira

<= div>
Ira McDonald (Musician / Software Architect)
Co-Chai= r - TCG Trusted Mobility Solutions WG
Chair - Linux Foundation Open Prin= ting WG
Secretary - IEEE-ISTO Printer Working Group
Co-Chair - IEEE-I= STO PWG Internet Printing Protocol WG
IETF Designated Expert - IPP &= Printer MIB
Blue Roof Music / High North Inc
http://sites.google.com/site/blueroofmusic
http://sites.google.com/site/highnorthinc
mailto: blueroofmusic@gmail.c= om
Jan-April: 579 Park Place=C2=A0 Saline, MI=C2=A0 48176=C2=A0 734-= 944-0094
May-Dec: PO Box 221=C2=A0 Grand Marais, MI 49839=C2=A0 906-494-= 2434

--94eb2c076050d11c1a053de3ab90-- --===============7083529487212702132== Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline _______________________________________________ ipp mailing list ipp@pwg.org https://www.pwg.org/mailman/listinfo/ipp --===============7083529487212702132==-- From ipp-bounces@pwg.org Sun Oct 2 09:20:18 2016 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ietfarch-ipp-archive@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: ietfarch-ipp-archive@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id CE3E7126D74 for ; Sun, 2 Oct 2016 09:20:18 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -4.782 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-4.782 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AC_DIV_BONANZA=0.001, BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, FREEMAIL_FORGED_FROMDOMAIN=0.001, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, HEADER_FROM_DIFFERENT_DOMAINS=0.001, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, RP_MATCHES_RCVD=-2.996, SPF_PASS=-0.001, T_DKIM_INVALID=0.01] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=fail (2048-bit key) reason="fail (message has been altered)" header.d=comcast.net Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id nF3AA1kgakEq for ; Sun, 2 Oct 2016 09:20:17 -0700 (PDT) Received: from www.pwg.org (www.pwg.org [IPv6:2600:3c01::f03c:91ff:fe70:b03f]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 41A7C124281 for ; Sun, 2 Oct 2016 09:20:17 -0700 (PDT) Received: by www.pwg.org (Postfix, from userid 1002) id ABF3B4412; Sun, 2 Oct 2016 16:20:16 +0000 (UTC) Received: from www.pwg.org (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by www.pwg.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id E5EBD27B2; Sun, 2 Oct 2016 16:20:10 +0000 (UTC) X-Original-To: ipp@pwg.org Delivered-To: ipp@pwg.org Received: by www.pwg.org (Postfix, from userid 1002) id C23DD415D; Sun, 2 Oct 2016 16:20:09 +0000 (UTC) Received: from resqmta-ch2-07v.sys.comcast.net (resqmta-ch2-07v.sys.comcast.net [IPv6:2001:558:fe21:29:69:252:207:39]) by www.pwg.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 50FEB2617 for ; Sun, 2 Oct 2016 16:20:06 +0000 (UTC) Received: from resomta-ch2-17v.sys.comcast.net ([69.252.207.113]) by resqmta-ch2-07v.sys.comcast.net with SMTP id qjTRbZ0XCff8qqjUibigWG; Sun, 02 Oct 2016 16:20:04 +0000 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=comcast.net; s=q20140121; t=1475425204; bh=hSDZ2grifAZQup7ig18PwFLBqnY+wc3Pbs5yLMskZ+I=; h=Received:Received:MIME-Version:To:From:Subject:Date:Content-Type; b=ZPJMKQweDoAkufDHacjyjlKxxkq7YXFbdSqedEQB02nZ+elq/NMBmxtMuchRFjE+a z3IsNFR621vU/tZJA6rVeZbfIR+aZ9zFb/hczfcNEG1IbfkdVarfZLBIGXWYIwYT3L Lg2pKgGWygh+TMBH3uiDw+8lM5wObekVKqx71BuOtxkZqdKYsoeJkq7UN7llS/iu0M 63LTqa0q/cKU54ekC11DfsISsgt9muq6QDtvsARzQ5njGRAci0OcjmZ4yEg2AJGHLT ZH0QFbY36CXSGSChIJu25lvaCv6wlkhbqLK0hRiLLnM7ZqHQANh1d2HRvd6umd71WR UTM7G3ekB3QKA== Received: from [IPv6:::ffff:192.168.2.172] ([50.169.174.173]) by resomta-ch2-17v.sys.comcast.net with SMTP id qjUhbHZFObKqdqjUhbMzAq; Sun, 02 Oct 2016 16:20:04 +0000 MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Ira McDonald , "ipp@pwg.org" From: Date: Sun, 2 Oct 2016 12:20:03 -0400 Importance: normal X-Priority: 3 In-Reply-To: References: X-CMAE-Envelope: MS4wfLiPRrAXiI0Ly1tvfGbfFfhtgVBr9SFKUVNqgCSA4qXksKIzgB1mIp6rH2jbWH8Oq3PjD+l0AQ2NvaOZgrGuYz6VYSIKA2/Q5xiawz3Cyu1J7ae6HJ7Z H2cBfjZmZC5Xp5VnaO0w5CoO4c3wRLMvP6qE+GPW/dfOPILkdMdLAzgP5/63wmAySmGcPUYUUyLOk/OH0yk0DxYPu/GZYR4P4yX36r9dfD7RUvgcP0NpfHPH Message-Id: <20161002162009.C23DD415D@www.pwg.org> Subject: Re: [IPP] Required real-time clock prevents System Service use by someprinters X-BeenThere: ipp@pwg.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15 Precedence: list List-Id: Internet Printing Protocol Workgroup discussion list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="===============2453628527122608884==" Errors-To: ipp-bounces@pwg.org Sender: "ipp" --===============2453628527122608884== Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="_B0EE46DC-C293-4ABD-A06F-7BDC5AE50590_" --_B0EE46DC-C293-4ABD-A06F-7BDC5AE50590_ Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" I am surprised to see the RTC (a term I have disliked since it means someth= ing else at the detailed hardware level) or NTP question come up again. Thi= s was an issue with the printer MIB 15 years ago, but since even the most m= inor device seems to have time keeping capabilities today, I did think it w= as an non-issue. Smith=E2=80=99s message suggests this may be wrong. But I = suggest that any imaging system complex enough to concern itself with syste= m functions will have timekeeping capability. Unless someone can come up wi= th a real and valid example of a networked imaging device for which system = service capability is appropriate that does not have timekeeping capability= , I suggest that these time related attributes remain required. Thanks, Bill Wagner From: Ira McDonald Sent: Sunday, October 2, 2016 11:42 AM To: ipp@pwg.org; Ira McDonald Subject: [IPP] Required real-time clock prevents System Service use by some= printers Hi, The System Service requirement for a running tick counter and for an actual RTC w/ meaningful time would prevent the use of any Resource operations by some printers.=C2=A0 Also, the firmware update and graceful restart abilities, which move away from traditional vendor- and model-specific approaches and improve Managed Print Service compatibility. Questions: (1) Should we reduce the various "date-time-at-xxx" attributes to=20 RECOMMENDED? -- Comment - they are REQUIRED in IPP Everywhere (2) Should we allow the various "time-at-xxx" attributes to be trivial implementations (i.e., without meaningful tick counter)? -- Comment - they are REQUIRED in RFC2911/RFC2911bis, with some ambiguity about implementation=20 Note that I've personally been a proponent of required RTC with meaningful date/time for years, so I'm conflicted about bringing this subject up. WDYT? Cheers, - Ira Ira McDonald (Musician / Software Architect) Co-Chair - TCG Trusted Mobility Solutions WG Chair - Linux Foundation Open Printing WG Secretary - IEEE-ISTO Printer Working Group Co-Chair - IEEE-ISTO PWG Internet Printing Protocol WG IETF Designated Expert - IPP & Printer MIB Blue Roof Music / High North Inc http://sites.google.com/site/blueroofmusic http://sites.google.com/site/highnorthinc mailto: blueroofmusic@gmail.com Jan-April: 579 Park Place=C2=A0 Saline, MI=C2=A0 48176=C2=A0 734-944-0094 May-Dec: PO Box 221=C2=A0 Grand Marais, MI 49839=C2=A0 906-494-2434 --_B0EE46DC-C293-4ABD-A06F-7BDC5AE50590_ Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Type: text/html; charset="utf-8"

I am surprised to see the RTC (a ter= m I have disliked since it means something else at the detailed hardware le= vel) or NTP question come up again. This was an issue with the printer MIB = 15 years ago, but since even the most minor device seems to have time keepi= ng capabilities today, I did think it was an non-issue. Smith=E2=80=99s mes= sage suggests this may be wrong. But I suggest that any imaging system comp= lex enough to concern itself with system functions will have timekeeping ca= pability. Unless someone can come up with a real and valid example of a net= worked imaging device for which system service capability is appropriate th= at does not have timekeeping capability, I suggest that these time related = attributes remain required.

Thanks,

Bill Wagner

 

 

 

From: Ira McDonald
Sent: Sunday, October 2, 2016 11:42 AM=
To: ipp@pwg.org; Ira McDonald
Subject: [IPP] Re= quired real-time clock prevents System Service use by someprinters

 

<= div>

Hi,The System Service requ= irement for a running tick counter and

for an actual RTC w/ meaningful time would prevent the use of any

Resource operations by some printer= s.  Also, the firmware update

vendor- and model-specific approaches and= improve Managed

Print Service compatibility.

Questions:=

(1) Should we reduce the various "date-time-a= t-xxx" attributes to
RECOMMENDED?

=

-- Comment - they are REQUIRED in IPP Everywhere<= /span>

 

(2) Should we allow the various "time-at-xxx" attribute= s to be

trivial implementations (= i.e., without meaningful tick counter)?

-- Comment - they are REQUIRED in RFC2911/RFC2911bis,

with some ambiguity about implementat= ion

 

Note that I've personally been a proponent o= f required RTC

with meaningf= ul date/time for years, so I'm conflicted about

=

bringing this subject up= .

= WDYT?

Cheers,

- Ira

Ira McDonald (Musician / Sof= tware Architect)
Co-Chair - TCG Trusted Mobility Solutions WG
Chair -= Linux Foundation Open Printing WG
Secretary - IEEE-ISTO Printer Working= Group
Co-Chair - IEEE-ISTO PWG Internet Printing Protocol WG
IETF De= signated Expert - IPP & Printer MIB
Blue Roof Music / High North Inc=
http://sites.google.com/site/blueroofmusic<= /span>
http://sites.google.com/site/high= northinc
mailto: blueroofmusic@gmail.com
Jan-April: 579 Park Place&n= bsp; Saline, MI  48176  734-944-0094
May-Dec: PO Box 221 = Grand Marais, MI 49839  906-494-2434

 

= --_B0EE46DC-C293-4ABD-A06F-7BDC5AE50590_-- --===============2453628527122608884== Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline _______________________________________________ ipp mailing list ipp@pwg.org https://www.pwg.org/mailman/listinfo/ipp --===============2453628527122608884==-- From ipp-bounces@pwg.org Sun Oct 2 09:49:16 2016 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ietfarch-ipp-archive@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: ietfarch-ipp-archive@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 891B112B0C9 for ; Sun, 2 Oct 2016 09:49:16 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -4.786 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-4.786 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, HEADER_FROM_DIFFERENT_DOMAINS=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE=-0.0001, RP_MATCHES_RCVD=-2.996, SPF_PASS=-0.001, T_DKIM_INVALID=0.01] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); 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X-BeenThere: ipp@pwg.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15 Precedence: list List-Id: Internet Printing Protocol Workgroup discussion list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64 Errors-To: ipp-bounces@pwg.org Sender: "ipp" U21pdGgsCgo+IE9uIE9jdCAyLCAyMDE2LCBhdCA5OjAzIEFNLCBLZW5uZWR5LCBTbWl0aCAoV2ly ZWxlc3MgQXJjaGl0ZWN0KSA8c21pdGgua2VubmVkeUBocC5jb20+IHdyb3RlOgo+IAo+IEhpIE1p a2UsCj4gCj4gSWYgdGhlIFByaW50ZXIgaGFzIG5vIGJhdHRlcnktbWFpbnRhaW5lZCBjbG9jayBh bmQgZG9lc24ndCBoYXZlIHNvbWV0aGluZyBsaWtlIE5UUCBjb25maWd1cmVkIHRvIGFsbG93IGl0 IHRvIGRldGVybWluZSB0aGUgdGltZSBvbmNlIGl0IGhhcyBwb3dlcmVkIHVwLCBpdCBpc24ndCBj bGVhciB0byBtZSBob3cgdGhlIFByaW50ZXIgd2lsbCBzZXQgdGhlIHZhbHVlIG9mICJkYXRlLXRp bWUtYXQtY3JlYXRpb24iIHRvIHNvbWV0aGluZyBvdGhlciB0aGFuICduby12YWx1ZScuCgpQcm9i YWJseSB0aGUgYmVzdCB0aGluZyBpcyB0byBvbWl0IHRoZSBhdHRyaWJ1dGUgaWYgdGhlIFJUQyBp cyBub3QgY29uZmlndXJlZCB3aGVuIHRoZSBqb2IgaXMgY3JlYXRlZCwgb3Igbm90IGFjY2VwdCBu ZXcgam9icyB1bnRpbCB0aGUgY2xvY2sgaXMgc2V0Li4uICBCdXQgYSBzdHJpY3QgaW50ZXJwcmV0 YXRpb24gb2YgdGhlIHNwZWMgd291bGQgaGF2ZSB0aGUgUHJpbnRlciBjb3B5aW5nIHRoZSAnbm8t dmFsdWUnIGZyb20gInByaW50ZXItY3VycmVudC10aW1lIiB0byB0aGUgImRhdGUtdGltZS1hdC1j cmVhdGlvbiIgYXR0cmlidXRlLgoKPiBSRkMgMjkxMSBzZWN0aW9uIDQuNC4zMCAoaHR0cHM6Ly90 b29scy5pZXRmLm9yZy9odG1sL3JmYzI5MTEjc2VjdGlvbi00LjQuMzApIHNheXMgdGhpczoKPiAK PiA0LjQuMzAgcHJpbnRlci1jdXJyZW50LXRpbWUgKGRhdGVUaW1lKQo+IAo+ICAgIFRoaXMgUHJp bnRlciBhdHRyaWJ1dGUgaW5kaWNhdGVzIHRoZSBjdXJyZW50IGRhdGUgYW5kIHRpbWUuICBUaGlz Cj4gICAgdmFsdWUgaXMgdXNlZCB0byBwb3B1bGF0ZSB0aGUgRXZlbnQgVGltZSBKb2IgRGVzY3Jp cHRpb24gYXR0cmlidXRlczoKPiAgICAiZGF0ZS10aW1lLWF0LWNyZWF0aW9uIiwgImRhdGUtdGlt ZS1hdC1wcm9jZXNzaW5nIiwgYW5kICJkYXRlLXRpbWUtCj4gICAgYXQtY29tcGxldGVkIiAoc2Vl IFNlY3Rpb24gNC4zLjE0KS4KPiAKPiAgICBUaGUgZGF0ZSBhbmQgdGltZSBpcyBvYnRhaW5lZCBv biBhICJiZXN0IGVmZm9ydHMgYmFzaXMiIGFuZCBkb2VzIG5vdAo+ICAgIGhhdmUgdG8gYmUgdGhh dCBwcmVjaXNlIGluIG9yZGVyIHRvIHdvcmsgaW4gcHJhY3RpY2UuICBBIFByaW50ZXIKPiAgICBp bXBsZW1lbnRhdGlvbiBzZXRzIHRoZSB2YWx1ZSBvZiB0aGlzIGF0dHJpYnV0ZSBieSBvYnRhaW5p bmcgdGhlIGRhdGUKPiAgICBhbmQgdGltZSB2aWEgc29tZSBpbXBsZW1lbnRhdGlvbi1kZXBlbmRl bnQgbWVhbnMsIHN1Y2ggYXMgZ2V0dGluZyB0aGUKPiAgICB2YWx1ZSBmcm9tIGEgbmV0d29yayB0 aW1lIHNlcnZlciwgaW5pdGlhbGl6YXRpb24gYXQgdGltZSBvZgo+ICAgIG1hbnVmYWN0dXJlLCBv ciBzZXR0aW5nIGJ5IGFuIGFkbWluaXN0cmF0b3IuICBTZWUgW0lQUC1JSUddIGZvcgo+ICAgIGV4 YW1wbGVzLiAgSWYgYW4gaW1wbGVtZW50YXRpb24gc3VwcG9ydHMgdGhpcyBhdHRyaWJ1dGUgYW5k IHRoZQo+ICAgIGltcGxlbWVudGF0aW9uIGtub3dzIHRoYXQgaXQgaGFzIG5vdCB5ZXQgYmVlbiBz ZXQsIHRoZW4gdGhlCj4gICAgaW1wbGVtZW50YXRpb24gTVVTVCByZXR1cm4gdGhlIHZhbHVlIG9m IHRoaXMgYXR0cmlidXRlIHVzaW5nIHRoZQo+ICAgIG91dC1vZi1iYW5kIOKAmW5vLXZhbHVl4oCZ IG1lYW5pbmcgbm90IGNvbmZpZ3VyZWQuICBTZWUgdGhlIGJlZ2lubmluZyBvZgo+ICAgIHNlY3Rp b24gNC4xLgoKUkZDIDI1NjYgKElQUC8xLjApIGRpZCBub3QgaGF2ZSB0aGUgc2Vjb25kIHBhcmFn cmFwaC4uLiAgVW5kZXIgb3VyIGN1cnJlbnQgZ3VpZGFuY2UgZm9yICduby12YWx1ZScgYW5kICd1 bmtub3duJyB1c2FnZSwgdGhpcyBhdHRyaWJ1dGUgU0hPVUxEIHJlcG9ydCAndW5rbm93bicgd2hl biB0aGUgZGF0ZSBhbmQgdGltZSBpcyBub3QgeWV0IGNvbmZpZ3VyZWQgc2luY2UsIGxpa2UgInBy aW50ZXItZ2VvLWxvY2F0aW9uIiwgdGhlcmUgaXMgYWx3YXlzIGEgY3VycmVudCBkYXRlIGFuZCB0 aW1lIC0gdGhlIHZhbHVlIGlzIG1lcmVseSB1bmtub3duLgoKV2Ugc2hvdWxkIGRpc2N1c3Mgd2hl dGhlciB0byBjaGFuZ2UgdGhpcyB0byAndW5rbm93bicgd2hlbiBSRkMyOTExYmlzIGhpdHMgQVVU SDQ4IGF0IG91ciBXZWRuZXNkYXkgY29uZmVyZW5jZSBjYWxsLgoKX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19f X19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fCk1pY2hhZWwgU3dlZXQsIFNl bmlvciBQcmludGluZyBTeXN0ZW0gRW5naW5lZXIKCl9fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19f X19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fCmlwcCBtYWlsaW5nIGxpc3QKaXBwQHB3Zy5vcmcKaHR0cHM6 Ly93d3cucHdnLm9yZy9tYWlsbWFuL2xpc3RpbmZvL2lwcAo= From ipp-bounces@pwg.org Sun Oct 2 09:56:43 2016 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ietfarch-ipp-archive@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: ietfarch-ipp-archive@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 43BCA12B00C for ; 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Sun, 2 Oct 2016 17:03:01 +0000 (UTC) Received: from www.pwg.org (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by www.pwg.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 27F2827B2; Sun, 2 Oct 2016 17:02:55 +0000 (UTC) X-Original-To: ipp@pwg.org Delivered-To: ipp@pwg.org Received: by www.pwg.org (Postfix, from userid 1002) id 8FFB0415D; Sun, 2 Oct 2016 17:02:53 +0000 (UTC) Received: from mail-it0-x230.google.com (mail-it0-x230.google.com [IPv6:2607:f8b0:4001:c0b::230]) by www.pwg.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id C55BB259F for ; Sun, 2 Oct 2016 17:02:52 +0000 (UTC) Received: by mail-it0-x230.google.com with SMTP id o19so78333692ito.1 for ; Sun, 02 Oct 2016 10:02:52 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20120113; h=mime-version:in-reply-to:references:from:date:message-id:subject:to :cc; bh=srdGRi+BytnCDC0h5KlxTp4m3n0iX/yq46UECCUhUbU=; b=ijQOmbF9cFZQQCwy53eAkG7pki7Ez2t2OjOaMgo+phq+fKmfDrZS7m1qT50vDIv8be 5hYiBOiEQbgH1OmtryyfIhBSAkwVpQ1D+gUfgHEMRCpx+pkYXL2wKr/OJ3KVn1kN8Bwp V4/WdGtse5YiiEdaHRIZKK1TJTKft/SC96FjxItB9ppn0Jk5ZpYk5D3nT7qrO6Ycyrv/ C2rUQaniXJFV0Ew6EhCUiYBk/0GZ5wIRhRDVXdvi8p2RntYrnktSWruNbjgKXbxtJwZ7 bOrzc5p+tMEESLsi2l084UqFajk+r/9aapnSH8x5Sm1tZiqvkRc+tGGWmJ6mfJg578e5 xMXQ== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20130820; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:in-reply-to:references:from:date :message-id:subject:to:cc; bh=srdGRi+BytnCDC0h5KlxTp4m3n0iX/yq46UECCUhUbU=; b=U3nTt3AypXE2U8TUPePqSbmYeHoanemqTIZKB0rBAa6ROmgFNoYq8OOKSW2QnfFjLs FTfGaXq/n207+TlNu2kH/2avKY+c+y1fLXw5+1RQWUacQyrPFxSYCPmvT4mlEevS/kuL LYsvqLjX6ko/aTNvfgMQWNUTO9qOjGey+z0PdcQd6fnlqwjmh0+m3FMm/z7K7n27CaU7 F/RCpDoqcHYpiyoyA3hgjUs2PQ3WKn/0bqgvcXItKJYQXTAuhEfebHep8UB+xm1w9ws4 EoKnTlYY9RB67GPy0uTbPG491MMsJAN8KxuQekIo2B6Axp2uHpIblglkFAy5li+tX88i JfjA== X-Gm-Message-State: AA6/9RkfQvzGywR9vjgVXzlwohY/3N0YuwLkS/akgBDNV5y6f/AR4g9Vfrv0brzcR1dAVGj7Fg+FNbiAnChUqA== X-Received: by 10.36.22.67 with SMTP id a64mr13375818ita.66.1475427772021; Sun, 02 Oct 2016 10:02:52 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 Received: by 10.107.147.6 with HTTP; Sun, 2 Oct 2016 10:02:31 -0700 (PDT) In-Reply-To: <57f133b4.c1ca6b0a.79975.407bSMTPIN_ADDED_MISSING@mx.google.com> References: <57f133b4.c1ca6b0a.79975.407bSMTPIN_ADDED_MISSING@mx.google.com> From: Ira McDonald Date: Sun, 2 Oct 2016 13:02:31 -0400 Message-ID: To: Bill Wagner , Ira McDonald Cc: "ipp@pwg.org" Subject: Re: [IPP] Required real-time clock prevents System Service use by someprinters X-BeenThere: ipp@pwg.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15 Precedence: list List-Id: Internet Printing Protocol Workgroup discussion list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="===============6513397017971346088==" Errors-To: ipp-bounces@pwg.org Sender: "ipp" --===============6513397017971346088== Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary=001a114453be3e4265053de4cc71 --001a114453be3e4265053de4cc71 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Hi Bill, Thanks for that reasoned response. I agree with you. Sorry for probably having abused "RTC". I didn't mean necessarily the discrete chip w/ battery. Useful network Printers (i.e., accessible via some network path, wired or wireless), can maintain a running tick counter aligned with some network notion of localized time easily. Mike also just articulated the constraints better than I did. Read on. I'd like to see consumer, modest printers able to use and discover all installed Resources with System Service. Cheers, - Ira Ira McDonald (Musician / Software Architect) Co-Chair - TCG Trusted Mobility Solutions WG Chair - Linux Foundation Open Printing WG Secretary - IEEE-ISTO Printer Working Group Co-Chair - IEEE-ISTO PWG Internet Printing Protocol WG IETF Designated Expert - IPP & Printer MIB Blue Roof Music / High North Inc http://sites.google.com/site/blueroofmusic http://sites.google.com/site/highnorthinc mailto: blueroofmusic@gmail.com Jan-April: 579 Park Place Saline, MI 48176 734-944-0094 May-Dec: PO Box 221 Grand Marais, MI 49839 906-494-2434 On Sun, Oct 2, 2016 at 12:20 PM, wrote: > I am surprised to see the RTC (a term I have disliked since it means > something else at the detailed hardware level) or NTP question come up > again. This was an issue with the printer MIB 15 years ago, but since eve= n > the most minor device seems to have time keeping capabilities today, I di= d > think it was an non-issue. Smith=E2=80=99s message suggests this may be w= rong. But > I suggest that any imaging system complex enough to concern itself with > system functions will have timekeeping capability. Unless someone can com= e > up with a real and valid example of a networked imaging device for which > system service capability is appropriate that does not have timekeeping > capability, I suggest that these time related attributes remain required. > > Thanks, > > Bill Wagner > > > > > > > > *From: *Ira McDonald > *Sent: *Sunday, October 2, 2016 11:42 AM > *To: *ipp@pwg.org; Ira McDonald > *Subject: *[IPP] Required real-time clock prevents System Service use by > someprinters > > > > Hi, > > The System Service requirement for a running tick counter and > > for an actual RTC w/ meaningful time would prevent the use of any > > Resource operations by some printers. Also, the firmware update > > and graceful restart abilities, which move away from traditional > > vendor- and model-specific approaches and improve Managed > > Print Service compatibility. > > Questions: > > (1) Should we reduce the various "date-time-at-xxx" attributes to > RECOMMENDED? > > -- Comment - they are REQUIRED in IPP Everywhere > > > > (2) Should we allow the various "time-at-xxx" attributes to be > > trivial implementations (i.e., without meaningful tick counter)? > > -- Comment - they are REQUIRED in RFC2911/RFC2911bis, > > with some ambiguity about implementation > > > > Note that I've personally been a proponent of required RTC > > with meaningful date/time for years, so I'm conflicted about > > bringing this subject up. > > WDYT? > > Cheers, > > - Ira > > Ira McDonald (Musician / Software Architect) > Co-Chair - TCG Trusted Mobility Solutions WG > Chair - Linux Foundation Open Printing WG > Secretary - IEEE-ISTO Printer Working Group > Co-Chair - IEEE-ISTO PWG Internet Printing Protocol WG > IETF Designated Expert - IPP & Printer MIB > Blue Roof Music / High North Inc > http://sites.google.com/site/blueroofmusic > http://sites.google.com/site/highnorthinc > mailto: blueroofmusic@gmail.com > Jan-April: 579 Park Place Saline, MI 48176 734-944-0094 > May-Dec: PO Box 221 Grand Marais, MI 49839 906-494-2434 > > > --001a114453be3e4265053de4cc71 Content-Type: text/html; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Hi Bill,
<= br>
Thanks for that reasoned response.=C2=A0 I agree with you.

=
Sorry for probably having abused "RTC".=C2=A0 I didn't = mean necessarily
the discrete chip w/ battery.=C2=A0 Useful networ= k Printers (i.e., accessible
via some network path, wired or wirel= ess), can maintain a running tick
counter aligned with some networ= k notion of localized time easily.

Mike also just articu= lated the constraints better than I did.=C2=A0 Read on.

I= 'd like to see consumer, modest printers able to use and discover
all installed Resources with System Service.

Cheers,
- Ira


Ira McDonald (Musician / Softwa= re Architect)
Co-Chair - TCG Trusted Mobility Solutions WG
Chair - Li= nux Foundation Open Printing WG
Secretary - IEEE-ISTO Printer Working Gr= oup
Co-Chair - IEEE-ISTO PWG Internet Printing Protocol WG
IETF Desig= nated Expert - IPP & Printer MIB
Blue Roof Music / High North Inchttp://sites.google.com/site/blueroofmusic
http://sites.google.com/site/highnorthinc<= /a>
mailto: blueroofmusic@gmail.com
Jan-April: 579 Park Place=C2=A0 Saline, MI= =C2=A0 48176=C2=A0 734-944-0094
May-Dec: PO Box 221=C2=A0 Grand Marais, = MI 49839=C2=A0 906-494-2434


On Sun, Oct 2, 2016 at 12:20 PM, <wam= wagner@comcast.net> wrote:
=

I am surprised to see the= RTC (a term I have disliked since it means something else at the detailed = hardware level) or NTP question come up again. This was an issue with the p= rinter MIB 15 years ago, but since even the most minor device seems to have= time keeping capabilities today, I did think it was an non-issue. Smith=E2= =80=99s message suggests this may be wrong. But I suggest that any imaging = system complex enough to concern itself with system functions will have tim= ekeeping capability. Unless someone can come up with a real and valid examp= le of a networked imaging device for which system service capability is app= ropriate that does not have timekeeping capability, I suggest that these ti= me related attributes remain required.

Thanks,

Bill Wagner

=C2=A0

=C2=A0

=C2=A0

From: Ira McDonald
Sent: <= /b>Sunday, October 2, 2016 11:42 AM
To: ipp@pwg.org; Ira McDonald
Subject: [IPP] Requir= ed real-time clock prevents System Service use by someprinters

=C2=A0<= /p>

Hi,=

The System Service requirem= ent for a running tick counter and

for an actual RTC w/ meaningful time would prevent the u= se of any

Resourc= e operations by some printers.=C2=A0 Also, the firmware update

and graceful restart abilities= , which move away from traditional

vendor- and model-specific approaches and improve Manage= d

Print Service compatibility.

<= div>

Questions:=

(1) Should we reduce= the various "date-time-at-xxx" attributes to
RECOMMENDED?=

-- Comment - th= ey are REQUIRED in IPP Everywhere

=C2=A0

(2) Should we allow the various "time-at-xxx" attribute= s to be

trivial im= plementations (i.e., without meaningful tick counter)?=

-- Comment - they are REQUIRED in= RFC2911/RFC2911bis,

with some ambiguity about implementation

<= /div>

=C2=A0

<= div>

Note that I've personally been a propone= nt of required RTC

with meaningful date/time for years, so I'm conflicted about

bringing this subject up.

WDYT?

Cheers,

- Ira

Ira= McDonald (Musician / Software Architect)
Co-Chair - TCG Trusted Mobilit= y Solutions WG
Chair - Linux Foundation Open Printing WG
Secretary - = IEEE-ISTO Printer Working Group
Co-Chair - IEEE-ISTO PWG Internet Printi= ng Protocol WG
IETF Designated Expert - IPP & Printer MIB
Blue Ro= of Music / High North Inc
http://sites.googl= e.com/site/blueroofmusic
http= ://sites.google.com/site/highnorthinc
mailto: blueroofmusic@gmail.com<= /a>
Jan-April: 579 Park Place=C2=A0 Saline, MI=C2=A0 48176=C2=A0 734-944-0094=
May-Dec: PO Box 221=C2=A0 Grand Marais, MI 49839=C2=A0 906-494-2434<= u>

=C2=A0


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charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: ipp-bounces@pwg.org Sender: "ipp" Ira, > On Oct 2, 2016, at 11:41 AM, Ira McDonald wrote: > > Hi, > > The System Service requirement for a running tick counter and > for an actual RTC w/ meaningful time would prevent the use of any > Resource operations by some printers. How exactly? TLS basically requires the date and time to be set to generate an X.509 certificate or do validation of certificates in things like firmware updates and applications. > Also, the firmware update > and graceful restart abilities, which move away from traditional > vendor- and model-specific approaches and improve Managed > Print Service compatibility. > > Questions: > > (1) Should we reduce the various "date-time-at-xxx" attributes to > RECOMMENDED? > -- Comment - they are REQUIRED in IPP Everywhere Given that we require TLS, we are requiring a real-time clock of some sort and thus we should make these REQUIRED (better for accounting). > (2) Should we allow the various "time-at-xxx" attributes to be > trivial implementations (i.e., without meaningful tick counter)? > -- Comment - they are REQUIRED in RFC2911/RFC2911bis, > with some ambiguity about implementation These should follow the same rules as for Jobs - copy the printer-up-time/system-up-time value while running, report 0 if the time is before the service started. > Note that I've personally been a proponent of required RTC > with meaningful date/time for years, so I'm conflicted about > bringing this subject up. I think that ship sailed as soon as we required TLS. And for resource validation we need a date and time as well. I think the only ambiguity is "how does the date and time get set", which should be talked about in security considerations since the wrong date/time can have consequences. (thus the work in the IETF for a secure version of NTP) > > WDYT? > > Cheers, > - Ira > > Ira McDonald (Musician / Software Architect) > Co-Chair - TCG Trusted Mobility Solutions WG > Chair - Linux Foundation Open Printing WG > Secretary - IEEE-ISTO Printer Working Group > Co-Chair - IEEE-ISTO PWG Internet Printing Protocol WG > IETF Designated Expert - IPP & Printer MIB > Blue Roof Music / High North Inc > http://sites.google.com/site/blueroofmusic > http://sites.google.com/site/highnorthinc > mailto: blueroofmusic@gmail.com > Jan-April: 579 Park Place Saline, MI 48176 734-944-0094 > May-Dec: PO Box 221 Grand Marais, MI 49839 906-494-2434 > > _______________________________________________ > ipp mailing list > ipp@pwg.org > https://www.pwg.org/mailman/listinfo/ipp _________________________________________________________ Michael Sweet, Senior Printing System Engineer _______________________________________________ ipp mailing list ipp@pwg.org https://www.pwg.org/mailman/listinfo/ipp From ipp-bounces@pwg.org Sun Oct 2 10:17:23 2016 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ietfarch-ipp-archive@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: ietfarch-ipp-archive@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7F02C126D74 for ; 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a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20130820; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:in-reply-to:references:from:date :message-id:subject:to:cc; bh=Teyb2vtojN98vnmQZDp2JxU0HmNlby4tkQ6iMb82XLg=; b=QL/wBz5qGxRWlqloQF4un+F7WVRflM3FMhKpqmRYv1vMuO1wWRSoj2xUrF7bGl5l4T WvQQ+Rseos9Hb27SGMdFdtNy0P3Wgc4bnmyfXXk5ObyoyDpsAvnND2IA4BAyre3lmCDN g5MjynhnMVoQEOW4uLr4lnLqJbvQgAGO+ltBDVOiW+usSZrIovA6849KutN4MIeeL8Nq zl9BPT62cCwYX7xrH00gNcZ5/2YubSqYH+yEJtIdP+tmzlllwvucDLC+9UubZXHIn5Jq q6eKIf60lSaRZP4IEeFPAYnDKfD1TUmP2j/lidY8xLoxmVETZhtLarhZMDfCZdVyVMhe b25Q== X-Gm-Message-State: AA6/9RlS5CxKRayoLbyaH6mjMkobfEmCWQE/FKZcgrhyTrKNx0I+x/JiRHznU5fDeu3ldsJHJRCK4rsb3lIMQw== X-Received: by 10.36.163.69 with SMTP id p66mr1206623ite.6.1475428632524; Sun, 02 Oct 2016 10:17:12 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 Received: by 10.107.147.6 with HTTP; Sun, 2 Oct 2016 10:16:52 -0700 (PDT) In-Reply-To: References: From: Ira McDonald Date: Sun, 2 Oct 2016 13:16:52 -0400 Message-ID: To: Michael Sweet , Ira McDonald Cc: "ipp@pwg.org" Subject: Re: [IPP] Required real-time clock prevents System Service use by some printers X-BeenThere: ipp@pwg.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15 Precedence: list List-Id: Internet Printing Protocol Workgroup discussion list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="===============2001126154929311013==" Errors-To: ipp-bounces@pwg.org Sender: "ipp" --===============2001126154929311013== Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary=94eb2c049858887c77053de4ff19 --94eb2c049858887c77053de4ff19 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 Hi Mike, Very good points. TLS means the system must have a reasonable notion of network time. And TLS is certainly a must-have for firmware or most other Resource-related operations. I'd be happy to get some input on the Security Considerations section about the importance of meaningful network time (e.g., for both session restart and certificate validation/revocation). I was feeling very queasy about downgrading required attributes from IPP Everywhere, which ought to be our "floor" for printers with System Service. Shouldn't we require IPP Everywhere in System Service? Cheers, - Ira Ira McDonald (Musician / Software Architect) Co-Chair - TCG Trusted Mobility Solutions WG Chair - Linux Foundation Open Printing WG Secretary - IEEE-ISTO Printer Working Group Co-Chair - IEEE-ISTO PWG Internet Printing Protocol WG IETF Designated Expert - IPP & Printer MIB Blue Roof Music / High North Inc http://sites.google.com/site/blueroofmusic http://sites.google.com/site/highnorthinc mailto: blueroofmusic@gmail.com Jan-April: 579 Park Place Saline, MI 48176 734-944-0094 May-Dec: PO Box 221 Grand Marais, MI 49839 906-494-2434 On Sun, Oct 2, 2016 at 1:09 PM, Michael Sweet wrote: > Ira, > > > On Oct 2, 2016, at 11:41 AM, Ira McDonald > wrote: > > > > Hi, > > > > The System Service requirement for a running tick counter and > > for an actual RTC w/ meaningful time would prevent the use of any > > Resource operations by some printers. > > How exactly? > > TLS basically requires the date and time to be set to generate an X.509 > certificate or do validation of certificates in things like firmware > updates and applications. > > > Also, the firmware update > > and graceful restart abilities, which move away from traditional > > vendor- and model-specific approaches and improve Managed > > Print Service compatibility. > > > > Questions: > > > > (1) Should we reduce the various "date-time-at-xxx" attributes to > > RECOMMENDED? > > -- Comment - they are REQUIRED in IPP Everywhere > > Given that we require TLS, we are requiring a real-time clock of some sort > and thus we should make these REQUIRED (better for accounting). > > > (2) Should we allow the various "time-at-xxx" attributes to be > > trivial implementations (i.e., without meaningful tick counter)? > > -- Comment - they are REQUIRED in RFC2911/RFC2911bis, > > with some ambiguity about implementation > > These should follow the same rules as for Jobs - copy the > printer-up-time/system-up-time value while running, report 0 if the time is > before the service started. > > > Note that I've personally been a proponent of required RTC > > with meaningful date/time for years, so I'm conflicted about > > bringing this subject up. > > I think that ship sailed as soon as we required TLS. And for resource > validation we need a date and time as well. > > I think the only ambiguity is "how does the date and time get set", which > should be talked about in security considerations since the wrong date/time > can have consequences. (thus the work in the IETF for a secure version of > NTP) > > > > > > WDYT? > > > > Cheers, > > - Ira > > > > Ira McDonald (Musician / Software Architect) > > Co-Chair - TCG Trusted Mobility Solutions WG > > Chair - Linux Foundation Open Printing WG > > Secretary - IEEE-ISTO Printer Working Group > > Co-Chair - IEEE-ISTO PWG Internet Printing Protocol WG > > IETF Designated Expert - IPP & Printer MIB > > Blue Roof Music / High North Inc > > http://sites.google.com/site/blueroofmusic > > http://sites.google.com/site/highnorthinc > > mailto: blueroofmusic@gmail.com > > Jan-April: 579 Park Place Saline, MI 48176 734-944-0094 > > May-Dec: PO Box 221 Grand Marais, MI 49839 906-494-2434 > > > > _______________________________________________ > > ipp mailing list > > ipp@pwg.org > > https://www.pwg.org/mailman/listinfo/ipp > > _________________________________________________________ > Michael Sweet, Senior Printing System Engineer > > --94eb2c049858887c77053de4ff19 Content-Type: text/html; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Hi Mike,

Very g= ood points.=C2=A0 TLS means the system must have a reasonable
noti= on of network time.=C2=A0 And TLS is certainly a must-have for firmware
=
or most other Resource-related operations.

I'd be ha= ppy to get some input on the Security Considerations section
about= the importance of meaningful network time (e.g., for both session
rest= art and certificate validation/revocation).

I was feeling= very queasy about downgrading required attributes from
IPP E= verywhere, which ought to be our "floor" for printers with System=
Service.=C2=A0 Shouldn't we require IPP Everywhere in Sy= stem Service?

Cheers,
- Ira



Ira McDonald (Musician / Software Architect)
Co-= Chair - TCG Trusted Mobility Solutions WG
Chair - Linux Foundation Open = Printing WG
Secretary - IEEE-ISTO Printer Working Group
Co-Chair - IE= EE-ISTO PWG Internet Printing Protocol WG
IETF Designated Expert - IPP &= amp; Printer MIB
Blue Roof Music / High North Inc
http://sites.google.com/site/blueroofmusic
http://sites.google.com/site/highnorthinc
mailto: blueroofmusic@gma= il.com
Jan-April: 579 Park Place=C2=A0 Saline, MI=C2=A0 48176=C2=A0 = 734-944-0094
May-Dec: PO Box 221=C2=A0 Grand Marais, MI 49839=C2=A0 906-= 494-2434


On Sun, Oct 2, 2016 at 1:09 PM, Michael Swee= t <msweet@apple.com> wrote:
Ira,

> On Oct 2, 2016, at 11:41 AM, Ira McDonald <blueroofmusic@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> Hi,
>
> The System Service requirement for a running tick counter and
> for an actual RTC w/ meaningful time would prevent the use of any
> Resource operations by some printers.

How exactly?

TLS basically requires the date and time to be set to generate an X.509 cer= tificate or do validation of certificates in things like firmware updates a= nd applications.

> Also, the firmware update
> and graceful restart abilities, which move away from traditional
> vendor- and model-specific approaches and improve Managed
> Print Service compatibility.
>
> Questions:
>
> (1) Should we reduce the various "date-time-at-xxx" attribut= es to
> RECOMMENDED?
> -- Comment - they are REQUIRED in IPP Everywhere

Given that we require TLS, we are requiring a real-time clock of som= e sort and thus we should make these REQUIRED (better for accounting).

> (2) Should we allow the various "time-at-xxx" attributes to = be
> trivial implementations (i.e., without meaningful tick counter)?
> -- Comment - they are REQUIRED in RFC2911/RFC2911bis,
> with some ambiguity about implementation

These should follow the same rules as for Jobs - copy the printer-up= -time/system-up-time value while running, report 0 if the time is before th= e service started.

> Note that I've personally been a proponent of required RTC
> with meaningful date/time for years, so I'm conflicted about
> bringing this subject up.

I think that ship sailed as soon as we required TLS.=C2=A0 And for r= esource validation we need a date and time as well.

I think the only ambiguity is "how does the date and time get set"= ;, which should be talked about in security considerations since the wrong = date/time can have consequences. (thus the work in the IETF for a secure ve= rsion of NTP)


>
> WDYT?
>
> Cheers,
> - Ira
>
> Ira McDonald (Musician / Software Architect)
> Co-Chair - TCG Trusted Mobility Solutions WG
> Chair - Linux Foundation Open Printing WG
> Secretary - IEEE-ISTO Printer Working Group
> Co-Chair - IEEE-ISTO PWG Internet Printing Protocol WG
> IETF Designated Expert - IPP & Printer MIB
> Blue Roof Music / High North Inc
> http://sites.google.com/site/blueroofmusic > http://sites.google.com/site/highnorthinc
> mailto: blueroofmusic@gmail= .com
> Jan-April: 579 Park Place=C2=A0 Saline, MI=C2=A0 48176=C2=A0 734-944-0094
> May-Dec: PO Box 221=C2=A0 Grand Marais, MI 49839=C2=A0 906-494-2434
>
> _______________________= ________________________
> ipp mailing list
> ipp@pwg.org
> https://www.pwg.org/mailman/listinfo/ipp

_________________________________________________________
Michael Sweet, Senior Printing System Engineer


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Sun, 2 Oct 2016 10:43:38 -0700 (PDT) MIME-version: 1.0 Received: from [17.153.70.79] by nwk-mmpp-sz10.apple.com (Oracle Communications Messaging Server 8.0.1.1.0 64bit (built Jun 15 2016)) with ESMTPSA id <0OEF00JAHL8LWD40@nwk-mmpp-sz10.apple.com>; Sun, 02 Oct 2016 10:43:38 -0700 (PDT) From: Michael Sweet In-reply-to: Date: Sun, 02 Oct 2016 13:43:32 -0400 Message-id: <27F0F6D9-3E9C-4775-8B84-559B9040C111@apple.com> References: To: Ira McDonald X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.3226) X-Brightmail-Tracker: H4sIAAAAAAAAA+NgFtrJLMWRmVeSWpSXmKPExsUi2FAYruvl/jHcYOU9HYvXr5ayWxzb95LF gclj56y77B7zFk9nCmCK4rJJSc3JLEst0rdL4MqY+PweY0GrcsWsN8eYGxi7ZboYOTkkBEwk Zuz7ztLFyMUhJLCXUeLP5YmMMIkprTfYIBKHGCUuXTjLDJLgFRCU+DH5HlAHBwezgLzEwfOy IGFmAS2J749aoQa9ZZSYMe8aK0hCWEBC4nj/Qig7SuLO48NMIDabgJrE70l9YHFOgWCJ2xee s4DYLAKqEvMOfGGHGCov0XDnCgvEXhuJ6Tvvs4HYQgJngC6dqQNygwjQ4iXPFUFMCQFZidm/ vEBOkBDYwCYx8fgc9gmMwrOQXD0L4epZSK5ewMi8ilEoNzEzRzczz1QvsaAgJ1UvOT93EyMo rKfbCe9gPL3K6hCjAAejEg/vBZaP4UKsiWXFlbmHGKU5WJTEee9/ehcuJJCeWJKanZpakFoU X1Sak1p8iJGJg1OqgXGdde1+XZdV1zZfu6RbInKuRC68PtCBZVXNEvu6/hvLC2Zd4mfbJ5KR 13h6auzpM8df7Vjea5CYHMwouuaLWf312SLK8uv/XG7N8OOcVfNacnfkvrmhv1/fPnNR5kTE yrd3ZzGob1y4rTzbY4bNsTt/w+p+viy3+spxbXYS/7rmNRPYHQ6al1crsRRnJBpqMRcVJwIA MDpgv0wCAAA= X-Brightmail-Tracker: H4sIAAAAAAAAA+NgFmpgkeLIzCtJLcpLzFFi42IRbCiu0vVy/xhuMGGxtMXrV0vZLY7te8ni wOSxc9Zddo95i6czBTBFcdmkpOZklqUW6dslcGVMfH6PsaBVuWLWm2PMDYzdMl2MnBwSAiYS U1pvsEHYYhIX7q0Hsrk4hAQOMUpcunCWGSTBKyAo8WPyPZYuRg4OZgF5iYPnZUHCzAJaEt8f tbJA1L9llJgx7xorSEJYQELieP9CKDtK4s7jw0wgNpuAmsTvSX1gcU6BYInbF56zgNgsAqoS 8w58YYcYKi/RcOcKC8ReG4npO++DHSckcIZR4s9MHZAbRIAWL3muCGJKCMhKzP7lNYFRcBaS Q2chHDoLyaELGJlXMQoUpeYkVproJRYU5KTqJefnbmIEh2dh+A7Gf8usDjEKcDAq8fBqsn8M F2JNLCuuzAWGBAezkghvkDNQiDclsbIqtSg/vqg0J7X4EGMy0PUTmaVEk/OBsZNXEm9oYmJg YmxsZmxsbmJOmrCSOK/th3fhQgLpiSWp2ampBalFMFuYODilGhgjNzvOzjuc/fhY94t9HR2P 5bSa65mV73FpLb7zYEq5TB3fsZtfn+w72/uzdILW5nlrnb5Erm6cvvLarr9Cd0tKpc+Jv5yi 1GHwpV8wVKf/SWwnU65BVuaEdnHDvB8FT7hWTJs8w03mwfdFXE4nrh3Kz3PaduSrrN793XUs W72l23yU7hnZ7fytxFKckWioxVxUnAgAdHINP5MCAAA= Cc: "ipp@pwg.org" Subject: Re: [IPP] Required real-time clock prevents System Service use by some printers X-BeenThere: ipp@pwg.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15 Precedence: list List-Id: Internet Printing Protocol Workgroup discussion list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: ipp-bounces@pwg.org Sender: "ipp" Ira, > On Oct 2, 2016, at 1:16 PM, Ira McDonald wrote: > > Hi Mike, > > Very good points. TLS means the system must have a reasonable > notion of network time. And TLS is certainly a must-have for firmware > or most other Resource-related operations. > > I'd be happy to get some input on the Security Considerations section > about the importance of meaningful network time (e.g., for both session > restart and certificate validation/revocation). > > I was feeling very queasy about downgrading required attributes from > IPP Everywhere, which ought to be our "floor" for printers with System > Service. Shouldn't we require IPP Everywhere in System Service? I wouldn't go quite that far, but definitely recommend IPP Everywhere and require IPP/2.x. > > Cheers, > - Ira > > > > Ira McDonald (Musician / Software Architect) > Co-Chair - TCG Trusted Mobility Solutions WG > Chair - Linux Foundation Open Printing WG > Secretary - IEEE-ISTO Printer Working Group > Co-Chair - IEEE-ISTO PWG Internet Printing Protocol WG > IETF Designated Expert - IPP & Printer MIB > Blue Roof Music / High North Inc > http://sites.google.com/site/blueroofmusic > http://sites.google.com/site/highnorthinc > mailto: blueroofmusic@gmail.com > Jan-April: 579 Park Place Saline, MI 48176 734-944-0094 > May-Dec: PO Box 221 Grand Marais, MI 49839 906-494-2434 > > > On Sun, Oct 2, 2016 at 1:09 PM, Michael Sweet wrote: > Ira, > > > On Oct 2, 2016, at 11:41 AM, Ira McDonald wrote: > > > > Hi, > > > > The System Service requirement for a running tick counter and > > for an actual RTC w/ meaningful time would prevent the use of any > > Resource operations by some printers. > > How exactly? > > TLS basically requires the date and time to be set to generate an X.509 certificate or do validation of certificates in things like firmware updates and applications. > > > Also, the firmware update > > and graceful restart abilities, which move away from traditional > > vendor- and model-specific approaches and improve Managed > > Print Service compatibility. > > > > Questions: > > > > (1) Should we reduce the various "date-time-at-xxx" attributes to > > RECOMMENDED? > > -- Comment - they are REQUIRED in IPP Everywhere > > Given that we require TLS, we are requiring a real-time clock of some sort and thus we should make these REQUIRED (better for accounting). > > > (2) Should we allow the various "time-at-xxx" attributes to be > > trivial implementations (i.e., without meaningful tick counter)? > > -- Comment - they are REQUIRED in RFC2911/RFC2911bis, > > with some ambiguity about implementation > > These should follow the same rules as for Jobs - copy the printer-up-time/system-up-time value while running, report 0 if the time is before the service started. > > > Note that I've personally been a proponent of required RTC > > with meaningful date/time for years, so I'm conflicted about > > bringing this subject up. > > I think that ship sailed as soon as we required TLS. And for resource validation we need a date and time as well. > > I think the only ambiguity is "how does the date and time get set", which should be talked about in security considerations since the wrong date/time can have consequences. (thus the work in the IETF for a secure version of NTP) > > > > > > WDYT? > > > > Cheers, > > - Ira > > > > Ira McDonald (Musician / Software Architect) > > Co-Chair - TCG Trusted Mobility Solutions WG > > Chair - Linux Foundation Open Printing WG > > Secretary - IEEE-ISTO Printer Working Group > > Co-Chair - IEEE-ISTO PWG Internet Printing Protocol WG > > IETF Designated Expert - IPP & Printer MIB > > Blue Roof Music / High North Inc > > http://sites.google.com/site/blueroofmusic > > http://sites.google.com/site/highnorthinc > > mailto: blueroofmusic@gmail.com > > Jan-April: 579 Park Place Saline, MI 48176 734-944-0094 > > May-Dec: PO Box 221 Grand Marais, MI 49839 906-494-2434 > > > > _______________________________________________ > > ipp mailing list > > ipp@pwg.org > > https://www.pwg.org/mailman/listinfo/ipp > > _________________________________________________________ > Michael Sweet, Senior Printing System Engineer > > _________________________________________________________ Michael Sweet, Senior Printing System Engineer _______________________________________________ ipp mailing list ipp@pwg.org https://www.pwg.org/mailman/listinfo/ipp From ipp-bounces@pwg.org Mon Oct 3 04:15:16 2016 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ietfarch-ipp-archive@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: ietfarch-ipp-archive@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id D643412B065 for ; 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boundary="===============5717618420327461762==" Errors-To: ipp-bounces@pwg.org Sender: "ipp" --===============5717618420327461762== Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary=001a114049626d3907053df40e00 --001a114049626d3907053df40e00 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 Hi, In my editor's draft of IPP System Service, I've added two new operations for associating Resources with Printers (in addition to the current methods of Create-Printer and HTTP PUT as described in IPP Shared Infrastructure Extensions): Allocate-Printer-Resources (printer-id, resource-ids) Deallocate-Printer-Resources (printer-id, resource-ids) Particularly for systems with multiple Print Service instances, these would allow more flexible Resource management. I propose the verb "Allocate" (as in memory allocation) rather than "Assign" to avoid confusion with "output-device-assigned". WDYT? Cheers, - Ira Ira McDonald (Musician / Software Architect) Co-Chair - TCG Trusted Mobility Solutions WG Chair - Linux Foundation Open Printing WG Secretary - IEEE-ISTO Printer Working Group Co-Chair - IEEE-ISTO PWG Internet Printing Protocol WG IETF Designated Expert - IPP & Printer MIB Blue Roof Music / High North Inc http://sites.google.com/site/blueroofmusic http://sites.google.com/site/highnorthinc mailto: blueroofmusic@gmail.com Jan-April: 579 Park Place Saline, MI 48176 734-944-0094 May-Dec: PO Box 221 Grand Marais, MI 49839 906-494-2434 --001a114049626d3907053df40e00 Content-Type: text/html; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Hi,
<= br>
In my editor's draft of IPP System Service, I've added two= new
operations for associating Resources with Printers (in additi= on
to the current methods of Create-Printer and HTTP PUT as
described in IPP Shared Infrastructure Extensions):

=C2=A0 = Allocate-Printer-Resources (printer-id, resource-ids)

=C2=A0 D= eallocate-Printer-Resources (printer-id, resource-ids)

Particu= larly for systems with multiple Print Service instances,
these wou= ld allow more flexible Resource management.

I propose the verb= "Allocate" (as in memory allocation) rather
than &= quot;Assign" to avoid confusion with "output-device-assigned"= ;.

WDYT?

Cheers,
- Ira
Ira McDonald (Musician / Software Architect)
C= o-Chair - TCG Trusted Mobility Solutions WG
Chair - Linux Foundation Ope= n Printing WG
Secretary - IEEE-ISTO Printer Working Group
Co-Chair - = IEEE-ISTO PWG Internet Printing Protocol WG
IETF Designated Expert - IPP= & Printer MIB
Blue Roof Music / High North Inc
http://sites.google.com/site/blueroofmusic
http://sites.google.com/site/highnorthinc
mailto: blueroofmusic@gma= il.com
Jan-April: 579 Park Place=C2=A0 Saline, MI=C2=A0 48176=C2=A0 = 734-944-0094
May-Dec: PO Box 221=C2=A0 Grand Marais, MI 49839=C2=A0 906-= 494-2434

--001a114049626d3907053df40e00-- --===============5717618420327461762== Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline _______________________________________________ ipp mailing list ipp@pwg.org https://www.pwg.org/mailman/listinfo/ipp --===============5717618420327461762==-- From ipp-bounces@pwg.org Mon Oct 3 05:04:19 2016 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ietfarch-ipp-archive@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: ietfarch-ipp-archive@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5A30312B17C for ; Mon, 3 Oct 2016 05:04:19 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -4.782 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-4.782 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AC_DIV_BONANZA=0.001, BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, FREEMAIL_FORGED_FROMDOMAIN=0.001, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, HEADER_FROM_DIFFERENT_DOMAINS=0.001, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, RP_MATCHES_RCVD=-2.996, SPF_PASS=-0.001, T_DKIM_INVALID=0.01] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=fail (2048-bit key) reason="fail (message has been altered)" header.d=comcast.net Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id AW2AOWO7JHOF for ; Mon, 3 Oct 2016 05:04:17 -0700 (PDT) Received: from www.pwg.org (www.pwg.org [IPv6:2600:3c01::f03c:91ff:fe70:b03f]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8F71912B189 for ; Mon, 3 Oct 2016 05:04:17 -0700 (PDT) Received: by www.pwg.org (Postfix, from userid 1002) id 882724422; Mon, 3 Oct 2016 12:04:16 +0000 (UTC) Received: from www.pwg.org (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by www.pwg.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 60D622675; Mon, 3 Oct 2016 12:04:12 +0000 (UTC) X-Original-To: ipp@pwg.org Delivered-To: ipp@pwg.org Received: by www.pwg.org (Postfix, from userid 1002) id 1CD073520; Mon, 3 Oct 2016 12:04:11 +0000 (UTC) Received: from resqmta-po-12v.sys.comcast.net (resqmta-po-12v.sys.comcast.net [IPv6:2001:558:fe16:19:96:114:154:171]) by www.pwg.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 67C2C2626 for ; Mon, 3 Oct 2016 12:04:09 +0000 (UTC) Received: from resomta-po-20v.sys.comcast.net ([96.114.154.244]) by resqmta-po-12v.sys.comcast.net with SMTP id r1yZb1zK1lHMYr1yZb2ilm; Mon, 03 Oct 2016 12:04:07 +0000 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=comcast.net; s=q20140121; t=1475496247; bh=daqdTmzqhkYhmCq0+YDUuZctLE05VqcNl8Pep3uc/bg=; h=Received:Received:MIME-Version:To:From:Subject:Date:Content-Type; b=KTaURkJjeeA0YY8oFIjslYhFVrxnlS0guxCaGmrK8KQZAlXv7lsjR7CCwnV/E6+9V QR+MTt4Xw0tdzCnW08Q1AUvGVDQvlP0F+9+dEfpwWwIiOJMOf84GNfHxUWwwOXePS/ PXARYRbD2Vag04w8Y+8ZwaCrol6u49DtmmioYYQOjiCbOp5DUwOVJgjEx+P3J39D3H 9j7VmOrrWYbbqTh+CKK4r9cE2RmByuT7Fczx63dbI21vY57EPdnSZ7r+bnZweHGLR9 VKBYzhiTxyF3x8V3ApqTr7K1OOVDYGg6y9FBYyzwiheO1ZxvzBT2Gt0dR+k/qIwTJQ svehL2IMzQdLw== Received: from [IPv6:::ffff:192.168.2.172] ([50.169.174.173]) by resomta-po-20v.sys.comcast.net with SMTP id r1yYbjdFea6sur1yZbRJmv; Mon, 03 Oct 2016 12:04:07 +0000 MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Ira McDonald , "ipp@pwg.org" From: Date: Mon, 3 Oct 2016 08:04:06 -0400 Importance: normal X-Priority: 3 In-Reply-To: References: X-CMAE-Envelope: MS4wfB81+DdmD/PVnGIpzRKP0l9t+DP2Vo6cAVSX6A9gtlk6ZonsVD+B5tdyVdqGU2Sd03poHL9xt5xAFKxqtFrt/UqncbedoIQ8KICMbnrD3aLXUg9x8Ozu vnTUxQBrze+oqbo4NLKFNntyLtuyfDHQjBhcYp3tBaM9ylfFONuT6tFgeAnXU0mGGypLaEd++PI5BcYIeaO+JdwnBBtB2Nj7S3y/tnFMrdh68dflAGqWNkrK Message-Id: <20161003120411.1CD073520@www.pwg.org> Subject: Re: [IPP] Proposed System Service operations for Printers w/ Resources X-BeenThere: ipp@pwg.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15 Precedence: list List-Id: Internet Printing Protocol Workgroup discussion list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="===============4020747055847574287==" Errors-To: ipp-bounces@pwg.org Sender: "ipp" --===============4020747055847574287== Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="_1ECACA09-42EC-4DDE-BFA1-864C3B6FC726_" --_1ECACA09-42EC-4DDE-BFA1-864C3B6FC726_ Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Ira, =E2=80=98Allocate=E2=80=99 sounds good to me, especially since the resource= may be shared. Thanks, Bill Wagner From: Ira McDonald= --_1ECACA09-42EC-4DDE-BFA1-864C3B6FC726_ Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Type: text/html; charset="utf-8"

Ira,

=E2=80= =98Allocate=E2=80=99 sounds good to me, especially since the resource may b= e shared.

Thanks,

Bill Wagn= er

 

 

 

From: Ira McDo= nald
Sent: Monday, October 3, 2016 7:15 AM
To: ipp@pwg.org; Ira McDonald
Subject: [IPP] Proposed System Servi= ce operations for Printers w/ Resources

 =

Hi,

=

In my editor's draft of IPP System Service, I've added two n= ew

operations for associating Res= ources with Printers (in addition

to the current methods of Create-Printer and HTTP PUT as=

described in IPP = Shared Infrastructure Extensions):

  Allocate-Printer-Resources (printer= -id, resource-ids)

  Deallocate-Printer-Resources (printer-id, resource-= ids)

Particularly for systems wit= h multiple Print Service instances,

these would allow more flexible Resource = management.

I propose the verb &q= uot;Allocate" (as in memory allocation) rather

than "Assign&qu= ot; to avoid confusion with "output-device-assigned".<= /span>

WDYT?

Cheers,

<= /div>

- Ira<= /span>

<= span style=3D'font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Times New Roman",serif'>Ira McD= onald (Musician / Software Architect)
Co-Chair - TCG Trusted Mobility So= lutions WG
Chair - Linux Foundation Open Printing WG
Secretary - IEEE= -ISTO Printer Working Group
Co-Chair - IEEE-ISTO PWG Internet Printing P= rotocol WG
IETF Designated Expert - IPP & Printer MIB
Blue Roof M= usic / High North Inc
http://sites.google.co= m/site/blueroofmusic
http://sites.= google.com/site/highnorthinc
mailto: blueroofmusic@gmail.com
Jan-Apr= il: 579 Park Place  Saline, MI  48176  734-944-0094
May-D= ec: PO Box 221  Grand Marais, MI 49839  906-494-2434

 

= --_1ECACA09-42EC-4DDE-BFA1-864C3B6FC726_-- --===============4020747055847574287== Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline _______________________________________________ ipp mailing list ipp@pwg.org https://www.pwg.org/mailman/listinfo/ipp --===============4020747055847574287==-- From ipp-bounces@pwg.org Mon Oct 3 05:48:46 2016 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ietfarch-ipp-archive@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: ietfarch-ipp-archive@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7956712B262 for ; Mon, 3 Oct 2016 05:48:46 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -4.466 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-4.466 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AC_DIV_BONANZA=0.001, BAYES_00=-1.9, HEADER_FROM_DIFFERENT_DOMAINS=0.001, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, MIME_HTML_MOSTLY=0.428, RP_MATCHES_RCVD=-2.996, SPF_PASS=-0.001] 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Oct 3 08:19:18 2016 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ietfarch-ipp-archive@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: ietfarch-ipp-archive@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id E68F812B36C for ; Mon, 3 Oct 2016 08:19:18 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -4.353 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-4.353 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AC_DIV_BONANZA=0.001, BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_ADSP_CUSTOM_MED=0.001, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, FREEMAIL_FORGED_FROMDOMAIN=0.001, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, HEADER_FROM_DIFFERENT_DOMAINS=0.001, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, MIME_HTML_MOSTLY=0.428, RP_MATCHES_RCVD=-2.996, SPF_PASS=-0.001, T_DKIM_INVALID=0.01] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=fail (2048-bit key) reason="fail (message has been altered)" header.d=gmail.com Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 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c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20120113; h=mime-version:in-reply-to:references:from:date:message-id:subject:to :cc; bh=uCGo8JnDvKTjRi4OSOZp0YZj0n3CyJNlxISwriJNAII=; b=utctVpu8m3Rg/bXDUZf/YAO8BqzM3f72kKsbH9Pd14OpBMAtWY7DvZWDtMTLX/y0jF L0NYLaeqHK7wkH82BwiDxjqoc0/5hCe/+CyE4Jx8eKDcfhL2AxHPqOulF9UiN2HEQ0RK BUcr+Y/SvjnWhrWno9HGRF5dBa3IqMB/ollxs2/lZEDMX2sp/LK5sw3U8U9cj9sCRSgc WekXc/hyJ/GJIZduiuyKJwoqyOP4KPbuweKxACBhkGynsXJJKqmqr5sQ9z9Pppij4XIm 9scEUCCaOIO8M7uzjfRj7Lvhn7Uiskv3tKjnm+RKPnhYLA2dArXmmrDAX6Cyb8MayWOS C24A== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20130820; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:in-reply-to:references:from:date :message-id:subject:to:cc; bh=uCGo8JnDvKTjRi4OSOZp0YZj0n3CyJNlxISwriJNAII=; b=Q9mJLh2NGRTHZtxXEP0G139HU4+818PR+RCUpocNn1JuvLhXi7h/p2n2KYlch51SP0 AXwiPm9rW1YvcGa22OFTEONUJmOMStR14Pbw6MPuVkuuyZmb0Y4Ovh9cmS1TR6qlKPbI aEPCPwXBHp1ruEW73hJ2AJ09OU3NyV4QBLika2gpOKzzcbpqyCaLbEsT7XZlZQpPQmD+ ZtCl16lZroDvuHUcy7PErkLti+ZB8zSpdTsystw9fgLcejXAQm9Tt/jqNfFiO8YAJdpy PR3tOm9cU0JX3NRBnZv+pMdvwNpAh/yEuTvgA4Tl1+dtIGX6sVwdQyHx2l050XLL1PyA ZYlA== X-Gm-Message-State: AA6/9Rks5pVa19pAXH3jvLpHu13BX7/zJ+9sq71Dc/4PTQQRjHdfEwycFpBYruPslB+GZqYNy2Pj6vOu6Q1VQg== X-Received: by 10.36.22.67 with SMTP id a64mr17268664ita.66.1475507942373; Mon, 03 Oct 2016 08:19:02 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 Received: by 10.107.147.6 with HTTP; Mon, 3 Oct 2016 08:18:41 -0700 (PDT) In-Reply-To: References: <20161003120411.1CD073520@www.pwg.org> From: Ira McDonald Date: Mon, 3 Oct 2016 11:18:41 -0400 Message-ID: To: "Zehler, Peter" , Ira McDonald Cc: "ipp@pwg.org" Subject: Re: [IPP] Proposed System Service operations for Printers w/ Resources X-BeenThere: ipp@pwg.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15 Precedence: list List-Id: Internet Printing Protocol Workgroup discussion list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="===============8722134443817413413==" Errors-To: ipp-bounces@pwg.org Sender: "ipp" --===============8722134443817413413== Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary=001a114453bec4e9fc053df7761a --001a114453bec4e9fc053df7761a Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Hi Pete, Structural changes from Nancy's original SM Resource Service: (1) No longer any Resource Service (2) All Resources are owned by the System (3) Improved set of Resource-level operations (Create, SendResourceData, Install are all REQUIRED before allocation of any Resource) (4) New "resource-state" (pending, available, installed, canceled, aborted) replaces dubious resource leases (my original lousy idea). Printer-scope Resources can be allocated to more than one instance of Print Service. We have avoided using the first-class verb "Associate" to avoid confusion with security/access-control aspects. A number of Resources can (usually will) be pre-installed on a System at manufacturing time. These can be allocated with Create-Printer (with the operation attribute "resource-ids"). Also later implicitly allocated with HTTP PUT request (per IPP Shared Infra Ext). But when an Admin has later installed a bunch of new Resources (fonts, forms, ICC profiles), we want to use a first-class operation to allocate them to specific Printers. For this case "Acquire" is the wrong semantic and "Release" would be overloaded (we have avoiding ever doing this in System Service drafts). WDYT? Cheers, - Ira Ira McDonald (Musician / Software Architect) Co-Chair - TCG Trusted Mobility Solutions WG Chair - Linux Foundation Open Printing WG Secretary - IEEE-ISTO Printer Working Group Co-Chair - IEEE-ISTO PWG Internet Printing Protocol WG IETF Designated Expert - IPP & Printer MIB Blue Roof Music / High North Inc http://sites.google.com/site/blueroofmusic http://sites.google.com/site/highnorthinc mailto: blueroofmusic@gmail.com Jan-April: 579 Park Place Saline, MI 48176 734-944-0094 May-Dec: PO Box 221 Grand Marais, MI 49839 906-494-2434 On Mon, Oct 3, 2016 at 8:48 AM, Zehler, Peter wrote: > When it comes to resources that can be shared and are =E2=80=9Cowned=E2= =80=9D by another > entity (i.e. Resource Service) I prefer =E2=80=9CAcquire=E2=80=9D and = =E2=80=9CRelease=E2=80=9D. > > > > Peter Zehler > > Xerox Corp. > Global Development Group > 800 Phillips Rd, 111-04A > Webster NY, 14580-9701 > Email: Peter.Zehler@Xerox.com > Office: +1 (585) 265-8755 > Fax: +1 (585) 422-0238 <%2B1%20%28585%29%20265-8755> > Mobile: +1 (585) 329-9508 > > > > *From:* ipp [mailto:ipp-bounces@pwg.org] *On Behalf Of * > wamwagner@comcast.net > *Sent:* Monday, October 3, 2016 8:04 AM > *To:* Ira McDonald ; ipp@pwg.org > *Subject:* Re: [IPP] Proposed System Service operations for Printers w/ > Resources > > > > Ira, > > =E2=80=98Allocate=E2=80=99 sounds good to me, especially since the resour= ce may be shared. > > Thanks, > > Bill Wagner > > > > > > > > *From: *Ira McDonald > *Sent: *Monday, October 3, 2016 7:15 AM > *To: *ipp@pwg.org; Ira McDonald > *Subject: *[IPP] Proposed System Service operations for Printers w/ > Resources > > > > Hi, > > In my editor's draft of IPP System Service, I've added two new > > operations for associating Resources with Printers (in addition > > to the current methods of Create-Printer and HTTP PUT as > > described in IPP Shared Infrastructure Extensions): > > Allocate-Printer-Resources (printer-id, resource-ids) > > Deallocate-Printer-Resources (printer-id, resource-ids) > > Particularly for systems with multiple Print Service instances, > > these would allow more flexible Resource management. > > I propose the verb "Allocate" (as in memory allocation) rather > > than "Assign" to avoid confusion with "output-device-assigned". > > WDYT? > > Cheers, > > - Ira > > Ira McDonald (Musician / Software Architect) > Co-Chair - TCG Trusted Mobility Solutions WG > Chair - Linux Foundation Open Printing WG > Secretary - IEEE-ISTO Printer Working Group > Co-Chair - IEEE-ISTO PWG Internet Printing Protocol WG > IETF Designated Expert - IPP & Printer MIB > Blue Roof Music / High North Inc > http://sites.google.com/site/blueroofmusic > http://sites.google.com/site/highnorthinc > mailto: blueroofmusic@gmail.com > Jan-April: 579 Park Place Saline, MI 48176 734-944-0094 > May-Dec: PO Box 221 Grand Marais, MI 49839 906-494-2434 > > > --001a114453bec4e9fc053df7761a Content-Type: text/html; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Hi Pete,

Structural = changes from Nancy's original SM Resource Service:
(1) No long= er any Resource Service
(2) All Resources are owned by the Sy= stem
(3) Improved set of Resource-level operations (Create, SendRe= sourceData,
Install are all REQUIRED before allocation of any Reso= urce)
(4) New "resource-state" (pending, available, inst= alled, canceled, aborted)
replaces dubious resource leases (my ori= ginal lousy idea).

Printer-scope Resources can be allocated to= more than one instance
of Print Service.=C2=A0 We have avoided us= ing the first-class verb "Associate"
to avoid confusion = with security/access-control aspects.

A number of Resources ca= n (usually will) be pre-installed on a System
at manufacturing tim= e.=C2=A0 These can be allocated with Create-Printer (with
the oper= ation attribute "resource-ids").=C2=A0 Also later implicitly allo= cated with
HTTP PUT request (per IPP Shared Infra Ext).=C2=A0 But = when an Admin has
later installed a bunch of new Resources (fonts,= forms, ICC profiles), we
want to use a first-class operation to a= llocate them to specific Printers.
For this case "Acquire&quo= t; is the wrong semantic and "Release" would be
overload= ed (we have avoiding ever doing this in System Service drafts).

WDYT?

Cheers,
- Ira


Ira McDonald = (Musician / Software Architect)
Co-Chair - TCG Trusted Mobility Solution= s WG
Chair - Linux Foundation Open Printing WG
Secretary - IEEE-ISTO = Printer Working Group
Co-Chair - IEEE-ISTO PWG Internet Printing Protoco= l WG
IETF Designated Expert - IPP & Printer MIB
Blue Roof Music /= High North Inc
http://sites.google.com/sit= e/blueroofmusic
http://sites.google.com/= site/highnorthinc
mailto: blueroofmusic@gmail.com
Jan-April: 579 Park Place= =C2=A0 Saline, MI=C2=A0 48176=C2=A0 734-944-0094
May-Dec: PO Box 221=C2= =A0 Grand Marais, MI 49839=C2=A0 906-494-2434


On Mon, Oct 3, 2016 at 8:48 AM, Zehler, Pete= r <Peter.Zehler@xerox.com> wrote:

When it comes to resources that can be shared and ar= e =E2=80=9Cowned=E2=80=9D by another entity (i.e. Resource Service) =C2=A0I= prefer =E2=80=9CAcquire=E2=80=9D and =E2=80=9CRelease=E2=80=9D.<= /u>

=C2=A0

Peter = Zehler

Xerox Corp.
Global Development Group
800 Phillips Rd, 111-04A
Webster NY, 14580-9701
Email: Peter.Zehler@Xerox.com
Office: +1 (585) 265-= 8755
Fax: +1 (585)= 422-0238
Mobile: +1 (585) 329-= 9508

=C2=A0

From: ipp [mailto:ipp-bounces@pwg.org] On Behalf Of wamwagner@co= mcast.net
Sent: Monday, October 3, 2016 8:04 AM
To: Ira McDonald <blueroofmusic@gmail.com>; ipp@pwg.org
Subject: Re: [IPP] Proposed System Service operations for Printers w= / Resources

=C2=A0

Ira,

=E2=80=98Allocate=E2=80=99 sounds good to me, especi= ally since the resource may be shared.

Thanks,

Bill Wagner

=C2=A0

=C2=A0

=C2=A0

From: Ira McDonald
Sent: Monday, October 3, 2016 7:15 AM
To: ipp@pwg.org= ; Ira McDonald
Subject: [IPP] Proposed System Service operations for Printers w/ Re= sources

=C2=A0

Hi,=

In my editor's draft of IPP System Service, = I've added two new

operations for associating Resources with Printe= rs (in addition

to the current methods of Create-Printer and HTT= P PUT as

described in IPP = Shared Infrastructure Extensions):

=C2=A0 Allocate-P= rinter-Resources (printer-id, resource-ids)

=C2=A0 Deallocate= -Printer-Resources (printer-id, resource-ids)

Particularly for systems with multiple Print Ser= vice instances,

these would allow= more flexible Resource management.

I propose the verb "Allocate" (as in m= emory allocation) rather

than "Assign= " to avoid confusion with "output-device-assigned".

WDYT?

Cheers,

- Ira

Ira McDonald (Mus= ician / Software Architect)
Co-Chair - TCG Trusted Mobility Solutions WG
Chair - Linux Foundation Open Printing WG
Secretary - IEEE-ISTO Printer Working Group
Co-Chair - IEEE-ISTO PWG Internet Printing Protocol WG
IETF Designated Expert - IPP & Printer MIB
Blue Roof Music / High North Inc
http://sites.google.com/site/blueroofmusic=
http://sites.google.com/site/highnorthinc
mailto: bluero= ofmusic@gmail.com
Jan-April: 579 Park Place=C2=A0 Saline, MI=C2=A0 48176=C2=A0 734-944-0094 May-Dec: PO Box 221=C2=A0 Grand Marais, MI 49839=C2=A0 906-494-2434

=C2=A0


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([13.41.230.31]) by USA7109MR009.ACS-INC.COM with ESMTP/TLS/AES128-SHA256; 03 Oct 2016 10:31:47 -0500 Received: from USA7109MB004.na.xerox.net ([169.254.4.48]) by USA7109HT001.na.xerox.net ([13.41.230.31]) with mapi id 14.03.0294.000; Mon, 3 Oct 2016 10:31:47 -0500 From: "Zehler, Peter" To: Ira McDonald Thread-Topic: [IPP] Proposed System Service operations for Printers w/ Resources Thread-Index: AQHSHWeM2e7xUqfgUk2uB3wPVB8I4KCW9X0A//+4WYCAAH4EgP//rpIA Date: Mon, 3 Oct 2016 15:31:46 +0000 Message-ID: References: <20161003120411.1CD073520@www.pwg.org> In-Reply-To: Accept-Language: en-US Content-Language: en-US X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: x-originating-ip: [13.41.230.92] MIME-Version: 1.0 Cc: "ipp@pwg.org" Subject: Re: [IPP] Proposed System Service operations for Printers w/ Resources X-BeenThere: ipp@pwg.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15 Precedence: list List-Id: Internet Printing Protocol Workgroup discussion list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: 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Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline _______________________________________________ ipp mailing list ipp@pwg.org https://www.pwg.org/mailman/listinfo/ipp --===============5403563013287106799==-- From ipp-bounces@pwg.org Mon Oct 3 09:10:10 2016 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ietfarch-ipp-archive@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: ietfarch-ipp-archive@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 58C691293E8 for ; Mon, 3 Oct 2016 09:10:10 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -4.353 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-4.353 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AC_DIV_BONANZA=0.001, BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_ADSP_CUSTOM_MED=0.001, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, FREEMAIL_FORGED_FROMDOMAIN=0.001, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, HEADER_FROM_DIFFERENT_DOMAINS=0.001, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, MIME_HTML_MOSTLY=0.428, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE=-0.0001, RP_MATCHES_RCVD=-2.996, SPF_PASS=-0.001, T_DKIM_INVALID=0.01] 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[IPv6:2607:f8b0:4001:c06::236]) by www.pwg.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id A63B42626 for ; Mon, 3 Oct 2016 16:04:01 +0000 (UTC) Received: by mail-io0-x236.google.com with SMTP id r145so125435619ior.0 for ; Mon, 03 Oct 2016 09:04:01 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20120113; h=mime-version:in-reply-to:references:from:date:message-id:subject:to :cc; bh=eVRIG9C/PPGn0DA25KfnNIeIFtBKvld5dKrcST86f0Q=; b=LFQ2T2+w64x/lyDKueR3cXm5GuY//TJYMhUlzHTCRXY+s2je8QFAcrovoWAHs0jhC/ l3j+FfTGMcL6/5o1GedYXbsvJwAeIYhLPEYiNUZ4nRBXJS2dl6xaFL39TQp+2CXNTIe7 J4MBfxlvisO0CM2Swp6815My2tfCYWNNEg4CknLy0k6d4v+8g3fPslkDjRqA0GEiZzZy WxXa7g+15T2DUETzFDdEVgY9HMdZiCLkrEbRXR9O6zgwVrfvJG2FppTvuCgVgjoKGtV7 j6Lk8FZMGsIiw0mLNDdvzwaQap6gCzk7eLyot6TNUgB0aoZBPANrPUci+uMs2lpK/OSe koIw== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20130820; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:in-reply-to:references:from:date :message-id:subject:to:cc; bh=eVRIG9C/PPGn0DA25KfnNIeIFtBKvld5dKrcST86f0Q=; b=JmfeY7VZehAAw9pRJFzbUyIMbT2WBEZn2DepS7uT1VcvbE572qWP/EXzSXfvVenAju MgN8gwlqOKe7Mq8+qeSVkfBHqxLqi70Wq3PB8WD7bmoA9QJuqOkv7GfvNVz9lY9WrXzk l7o7kqLU/Oe51FPq26N+LnwxUKskwW/fxaaAD/v/Dlw7+WgofAwYpvXdbo0df6ZFE1vv NJm3DdqDC9enJovW61sx+5H1h0H6HrJKh0e79pDcdW1bTerK3LunThvBMdfKY/E9M5Z/ 7IG0ybrQymwjT3Nth+uw4+m2tsvy08nGHtHVNBql3g+GOmhnh9yA72mi6qBQkDlytUTy 7LlA== X-Gm-Message-State: AA6/9RmGP1vQixeqXnsFaFXPIsxKa2gtdn/gjMTnnPtqmRGZljVl2nqmNOJpkzH0LD0ZNUmo9Pp+UaFO6LLkNQ== X-Received: by 10.107.39.76 with SMTP id n73mr26235555ion.180.1475510640773; Mon, 03 Oct 2016 09:04:00 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 Received: by 10.107.147.6 with HTTP; Mon, 3 Oct 2016 09:03:40 -0700 (PDT) In-Reply-To: References: <20161003120411.1CD073520@www.pwg.org> From: Ira McDonald Date: Mon, 3 Oct 2016 12:03:40 -0400 Message-ID: To: "Zehler, Peter" , Ira McDonald Cc: "ipp@pwg.org" Subject: Re: [IPP] Proposed System Service operations for Printers w/ Resources X-BeenThere: ipp@pwg.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15 Precedence: list List-Id: Internet Printing Protocol Workgroup discussion list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="===============4787136973485509182==" Errors-To: ipp-bounces@pwg.org Sender: "ipp" --===============4787136973485509182== Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary=001a114049629b13db053df81749 --001a114049629b13db053df81749 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Hi Pete, A given *instance* of a Resource in the current spec (after a LOT of discussion) can only use Create-Resource, Send-Resource-Data (NOT by reference, per Mike's reservations about access control), and Install-Resource on a single target System. An admin script could create/send/install a Resource on more than one System. Cheers, - Ira Ira McDonald (Musician / Software Architect) Co-Chair - TCG Trusted Mobility Solutions WG Chair - Linux Foundation Open Printing WG Secretary - IEEE-ISTO Printer Working Group Co-Chair - IEEE-ISTO PWG Internet Printing Protocol WG IETF Designated Expert - IPP & Printer MIB Blue Roof Music / High North Inc http://sites.google.com/site/blueroofmusic http://sites.google.com/site/highnorthinc mailto: blueroofmusic@gmail.com Jan-April: 579 Park Place Saline, MI 48176 734-944-0094 May-Dec: PO Box 221 Grand Marais, MI 49839 906-494-2434 On Mon, Oct 3, 2016 at 11:31 AM, Zehler, Peter wrote: > Ira, > > Given the changes, =E2=80=9CAllocate=E2=80=9D and =E2=80=9CDeallocate=E2= =80=9D work for me. Since the > resource is now owned by each system will there be a way to deploy a > resource across multiple systems? > > Pete > > > > Peter Zehler > > Xerox Corp. > Global Development Group > 800 Phillips Rd, 111-04A > Webster NY, 14580-9701 > Email: Peter.Zehler@Xerox.com > Office: +1 (585) 265-8755 > Fax: +1 (585) 422-0238 <%2B1%20%28585%29%20265-8755> > Mobile: +1 (585) 329-9508 > > > > *From:* Ira McDonald [mailto:blueroofmusic@gmail.com] > *Sent:* Monday, October 3, 2016 11:19 AM > *To:* Zehler, Peter ; Ira McDonald < > blueroofmusic@gmail.com> > *Cc:* wamwagner@comcast.net; ipp@pwg.org > > *Subject:* Re: [IPP] Proposed System Service operations for Printers w/ > Resources > > > > Hi Pete, > > Structural changes from Nancy's original SM Resource Service: > > (1) No longer any Resource Service > > (2) All Resources are owned by the System > > (3) Improved set of Resource-level operations (Create, SendResourceData, > > Install are all REQUIRED before allocation of any Resource) > > (4) New "resource-state" (pending, available, installed, canceled, aborte= d) > > replaces dubious resource leases (my original lousy idea). > > Printer-scope Resources can be allocated to more than one instance > > of Print Service. We have avoided using the first-class verb "Associate" > > to avoid confusion with security/access-control aspects. > > A number of Resources can (usually will) be pre-installed on a System > > at manufacturing time. These can be allocated with Create-Printer (with > > the operation attribute "resource-ids"). Also later implicitly allocated > with > > HTTP PUT request (per IPP Shared Infra Ext). But when an Admin has > > later installed a bunch of new Resources (fonts, forms, ICC profiles), we > > want to use a first-class operation to allocate them to specific Printers= . > > For this case "Acquire" is the wrong semantic and "Release" would be > > overloaded (we have avoiding ever doing this in System Service drafts). > > WDYT? > > Cheers, > > - Ira > > > Ira McDonald (Musician / Software Architect) > Co-Chair - TCG Trusted Mobility Solutions WG > Chair - Linux Foundation Open Printing WG > Secretary - IEEE-ISTO Printer Working Group > Co-Chair - IEEE-ISTO PWG Internet Printing Protocol WG > IETF Designated Expert - IPP & Printer MIB > Blue Roof Music / High North Inc > http://sites.google.com/site/blueroofmusic > http://sites.google.com/site/highnorthinc > mailto: blueroofmusic@gmail.com > Jan-April: 579 Park Place Saline, MI 48176 734-944-0094 > May-Dec: PO Box 221 Grand Marais, MI 49839 906-494-2434 > > > > On Mon, Oct 3, 2016 at 8:48 AM, Zehler, Peter > wrote: > > When it comes to resources that can be shared and are =E2=80=9Cowned=E2= =80=9D by another > entity (i.e. Resource Service) I prefer =E2=80=9CAcquire=E2=80=9D and = =E2=80=9CRelease=E2=80=9D. > > > > Peter Zehler > > Xerox Corp. > Global Development Group > 800 Phillips Rd, 111-04A > Webster NY, 14580-9701 > Email: Peter.Zehler@Xerox.com > Office: +1 (585) 265-8755 > Fax: +1 (585) 422-0238 <%2B1%20%28585%29%20265-8755> > Mobile: +1 (585) 329-9508 > > > > *From:* ipp [mailto:ipp-bounces@pwg.org] *On Behalf Of * > wamwagner@comcast.net > *Sent:* Monday, October 3, 2016 8:04 AM > *To:* Ira McDonald ; ipp@pwg.org > *Subject:* Re: [IPP] Proposed System Service operations for Printers w/ > Resources > > > > Ira, > > =E2=80=98Allocate=E2=80=99 sounds good to me, especially since the resour= ce may be shared. > > Thanks, > > Bill Wagner > > > > > > > > *From: *Ira McDonald > *Sent: *Monday, October 3, 2016 7:15 AM > *To: *ipp@pwg.org; Ira McDonald > *Subject: *[IPP] Proposed System Service operations for Printers w/ > Resources > > > > Hi, > > In my editor's draft of IPP System Service, I've added two new > > operations for associating Resources with Printers (in addition > > to the current methods of Create-Printer and HTTP PUT as > > described in IPP Shared Infrastructure Extensions): > > Allocate-Printer-Resources (printer-id, resource-ids) > > Deallocate-Printer-Resources (printer-id, resource-ids) > > Particularly for systems with multiple Print Service instances, > > these would allow more flexible Resource management. > > I propose the verb "Allocate" (as in memory allocation) rather > > than "Assign" to avoid confusion with "output-device-assigned". > > WDYT? > > Cheers, > > - Ira > > Ira McDonald (Musician / Software Architect) > Co-Chair - TCG Trusted Mobility Solutions WG > Chair - Linux Foundation Open Printing WG > Secretary - IEEE-ISTO Printer Working Group > Co-Chair - IEEE-ISTO PWG Internet Printing Protocol WG > IETF Designated Expert - IPP & Printer MIB > Blue Roof Music / High North Inc > http://sites.google.com/site/blueroofmusic > http://sites.google.com/site/highnorthinc > mailto: blueroofmusic@gmail.com > Jan-April: 579 Park Place Saline, MI 48176 734-944-0094 > May-Dec: PO Box 221 Grand Marais, MI 49839 906-494-2434 > > > > > --001a114049629b13db053df81749 Content-Type: text/html; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Hi Pete,

A given *instance* of a Resource in the current spec (after a LOT
of discussion) can only use Create-Resource, Send-Resource-Data
(NOT by reference, per Mike's reservations about access control),
=
and Install-Resource on a single target System.

An admin= script could create/send/install a Resource on more than
one Syst= em.

Cheers,
- Ira


Ira McDonald (M= usician / Software Architect)
Co-Chair - TCG Trusted Mobility Solutions = WG
Chair - Linux Foundation Open Printing WG
Secretary - IEEE-ISTO Pr= inter Working Group
Co-Chair - IEEE-ISTO PWG Internet Printing Protocol = WG
IETF Designated Expert - IPP & Printer MIB
Blue Roof Music / H= igh North Inc
http://sites.google.com/site/= blueroofmusic
http://sites.google.com/si= te/highnorthinc
mailto: blueroofmusic@gmail.com
Jan-April: 579 Park Place= =C2=A0 Saline, MI=C2=A0 48176=C2=A0 734-944-0094
May-Dec: PO Box 221=C2= =A0 Grand Marais, MI 49839=C2=A0 906-494-2434


On Mon, Oct 3, 2016 at 11:31 AM, Zehler, Pet= er <Peter.Zehler@xerox.com> wrote:

Ira,

Given the changes, =E2=80=9CAllocate=E2=80=9D and = =E2=80=9CDeallocate=E2=80=9D work for me.=C2=A0 Since the resource is now o= wned by each system will there be a way to deploy a resource across multipl= e systems?

Pete

=C2=A0

Peter Zehler

Xerox Corp.
Global Development Group
800 Phillips Rd, 111-04A
Webster NY, 14580-9701
Email: Peter.Zeh= ler@Xerox.com
Office: +1 (585= ) 265-8755
Fax: <= span style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif">+1= (585) 422-0238
Mobile: +1 (585= ) 329-9508

=C2=A0

From: Ira McDonald [mailto:blueroofmusic@gm= ail.com]
Sent: Monday, October 3, 2016 11:19 AM
To: Zehler, Peter <Peter.Zehler@xerox.com>; Ira McDonald <blueroofmusic@gmail.com>
Cc: wamwa= gner@comcast.net; ipp@= pwg.org


Subject: Re: [IPP] Proposed System Service operations for Printers w= / Resources

=C2=A0

Hi Pete,

Structural changes from Nancy's original SM Reso= urce Service:

(1) No longer any Resource Service

(2) All Resources are owned by the System<= /u>

(3) Improved set of Resource-level operations (Creat= e, SendResourceData,

Install are all REQUIRED before allocation of any Re= source)

(4) New "resource-state" (pending, availab= le, installed, canceled, aborted)

replaces dubious reso= urce leases (my original lousy idea).

Printer-scope Resources can be allocated to more tha= n one instance

of Print Service.=C2=A0 We have avoided using the fi= rst-class verb "Associate"

to avoid confusion wi= th security/access-control aspects.

A number of Resources can (usually will) be pre-inst= alled on a System

at manufacturing time.=C2=A0 These can be allocated = with Create-Printer (with

the operation attribute "resource-ids").= =C2=A0 Also later implicitly allocated with

HTTP PUT request (per IPP Shared Infra Ext).=C2=A0 B= ut when an Admin has

later installed a bunch of new Resources (fonts, for= ms, ICC profiles), we

want to use a first-class operation to allocate them= to specific Printers.

For this case "Acquire" is the wrong seman= tic and "Release" would be

overloaded (we have a= voiding ever doing this in System Service drafts).

WDYT?

Cheers,

- Ira


Ira McDonald (Musicia= n / Software Architect)
Co-Chair - TCG Trusted Mobility Solutions WG
Chair - Linux Foundation Open Printing WG
Secretary - IEEE-ISTO Printer Working Group
Co-Chair - IEEE-ISTO PWG Internet Printing Protocol WG
IETF Designated Expert - IPP & Printer MIB
Blue Roof Music / High North Inc
http://sites.google.com/site/blueroofmusic=
http://sites.google.com/site/highnorthinc
mailto: bluero= ofmusic@gmail.com
Jan-April: 579 Park Place=C2=A0 Saline, MI=C2=A0 48176=C2=A0 734-944-0094 May-Dec: PO Box 221=C2=A0 Grand Marais, MI 49839=C2=A0 906-494-2434

=C2=A0

On Mon, Oct 3, 2016 at 8:48 AM, Zehler, Peter <Peter.Zehler@xero= x.com> wrote:

When it comes to resources that can be shared and ar= e =E2=80=9Cowned=E2=80=9D by another entity (i.e. Resource Service) =C2=A0I= prefer =E2=80=9CAcquire=E2=80=9D and =E2=80=9CRelease=E2=80=9D.<= /u>

=C2=A0

Peter Zehler

Xerox Corp.
Global Development Group
800 Phillips Rd, 111-04A
Webster NY, 14580-9701
Email: Peter.Zeh= ler@Xerox.com
Office: +1 (585= ) 265-8755
Fax: <= span style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif">+1= (585) 422-0238
Mobile: +1 (585= ) 329-9508

=C2=A0

From: ipp [mailto:ipp-bounces@pwg.org] On Behalf Of wamwagner@comcast.net
Sent: Monday, October 3, 2016 8:04 AM
To: Ira McDonald <blueroofmusic@gmail.com>; ipp@pwg.org
Subject: Re: [IPP] Proposed System Service operations for Printers w= / Resources

=C2=A0

Ira,

=E2=80=98Allocate=E2=80=99 sounds good to me, especi= ally since the resource may be shared.

Thanks,

Bill Wagner

=C2=A0

=C2=A0

=C2=A0

From: Ira McDona= ld
Sent: Monday, October 3, 2016 7:15 AM
To: ipp@pwg.org= ; Ira McDonald
Subject: [IPP] Proposed System Service operations for Printers w/ Re= sources

=C2=A0

Hi,

In my editor's draft of IPP System Service, I= 9;ve added two new

operations for associating Resources with Printers (= in addition

to the current methods of Create-Printer and HTTP PU= T as

described in IPP Shar= ed Infrastructure Extensions):

=C2=A0 Allocate-Print= er-Resources (printer-id, resource-ids)

=C2=A0 Deallocate-Pri= nter-Resources (printer-id, resource-ids)

Particularly for systems with multiple Print Service= instances,

these would allow mor= e flexible Resource management.

I propose the verb "Allocate" (as in memor= y allocation) rather

than "Assign&quo= t; to avoid confusion with "output-device-assigned".

WDYT?

Cheers,

- Ira

Ira McDonald (Musicia= n / Software Architect)
Co-Chair - TCG Trusted Mobility Solutions WG
Chair - Linux Foundation Open Printing WG
Secretary - IEEE-ISTO Printer Working Group
Co-Chair - IEEE-ISTO PWG Internet Printing Protocol WG
IETF Designated Expert - IPP & Printer MIB
Blue Roof Music / High North Inc
http://sites.google.com/site/blueroofmusic=
http://sites.google.com/site/highnorthinc
mailto: bluero= ofmusic@gmail.com
Jan-April: 579 Park Place=C2=A0 Saline, MI=C2=A0 48176=C2=A0 734-944-0094
May-Dec: PO Box 221=C2=A0 Grand Marais, MI 49839=C2=A0 906-494-2434

=C2=A0

=C2=A0


--001a114049629b13db053df81749-- --===============4787136973485509182== Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline _______________________________________________ ipp mailing list ipp@pwg.org https://www.pwg.org/mailman/listinfo/ipp --===============4787136973485509182==-- From ipp-bounces@pwg.org Tue Oct 4 10:32:36 2016 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ietfarch-ipp-archive@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: ietfarch-ipp-archive@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2C00B1293FC for ; Tue, 4 Oct 2016 10:32:36 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -4.467 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-4.467 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, HEADER_FROM_DIFFERENT_DOMAINS=0.001, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, MIME_HTML_MOSTLY=0.428, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE=-0.0001, RP_MATCHES_RCVD=-2.996, SPF_PASS=-0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 4EgX5ZBMXsuc for ; 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SCL:1; SRVR:DF4PR84MB0281; H:DF4PR84MB0284.NAMPRD84.PROD.OUTLOOK.COM; FPR:; SPF:None; PTR:InfoNoRecords; MX:1; A:1; LANG:en; received-spf: None (protection.outlook.com: hp.com does not designate permitted sender hosts) spamdiagnosticoutput: 1:99 spamdiagnosticmetadata: NSPM MIME-Version: 1.0 X-OriginatorOrg: hp.com X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-originalarrivaltime: 04 Oct 2016 17:32:21.7220 (UTC) X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-fromentityheader: Hosted X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-id: ca7981a2-785a-463d-b82a-3db87dfc3ce6 X-MS-Exchange-Transport-CrossTenantHeadersStamped: DF4PR84MB0281 Cc: "ipp@pwg.org" Subject: Re: [IPP] New stable draft of IPP Finishings 2.1 available for review X-BeenThere: ipp@pwg.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15 Precedence: list List-Id: Internet Printing Protocol Workgroup discussion list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="===============2029434589815860094==" Errors-To: ipp-bounces@pwg.org Sender: "ipp" --===============2029434589815860094== Content-Language: en-US Content-Type: multipart/signed; boundary="Apple-Mail=_8B3CFC24-5FDB-4CA8-9A0C-3B226FEFFC68"; protocol="application/pkcs7-signature"; micalg=sha1 --Apple-Mail=_8B3CFC24-5FDB-4CA8-9A0C-3B226FEFFC68 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="Apple-Mail=_B00B286E-3E0B-468B-B662-F6999518E287" --Apple-Mail=_B00B286E-3E0B-468B-B662-F6999518E287 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Hi Mike, > On 2016-10-01, at 5:08 PM, Michael Sweet wrote: >=20 > Smith, >=20 > One comment inline, we can talk more on the Wednesday concall... >=20 >> On Sep 27, 2016, at 12:59 AM, Kennedy, Smith (Wireless Architect) = wrote: >>=20 >> * Added a comment to section 5.3 "job-pages-per-set" asking for a = description of how "job-pages-per-set" would work in the case where the = Job contains multiple Documents. >=20 > This is defined by the "multiple-document-handling" attribute, just as = for the rest of the Job Template attributes. >=20 > Conceptually we want to have a "pages-per-set" Document Template = attribute, although I suspect that it would not see much use - = "job-pages-per-set" is for things like PWG Raster Format where the = Client is providing its own copies/sets to the Printer (multiple = documents merged at the Client) rather than sending a high-level format = (PDF) and asking the Printer to produce multiple sets/copies. Printers = sophisticated enough to support the Document object are probably going = to support PDF... >=20 > (so maybe we can just reference the section on = "multiple-document-handling" in RFC2911bis and say why there is no = equivalent Document Template attribute?) >=20 I started adding some text, and then it occurred to me that the value of = "job-pages-per-set" has to be, or ought to be, an exact multiple of the = total number of pages in the Job. I updated it thus: The RECOMMENDED "job-pages-per-set" Job Template attribute specifies the = number of input pages that constitute a set for finishing processes. = The value of "job-pages-per-set" must be a multiple of the total number = of pages of all Documents in the Job. For example, if a Client submits a = 14 page PWG Raster Format [PWG5102.4] Document for printing that = actually contains two copies of four duplex pages each, the Client could = specify a "job-pages-per-set" Job Template attribute with a value of 7, = a "sides" attribute with a value of 'two-sided-long-edge', and a = "finishings" attribute with a value of 4 (staple) to have the Printer = staple two Sets of four sheets. Figure 4 shows a graphical = representation of this example. That sentence I added makes clear how the pages taken from one or more = Documents in a Job relate to the value found in this attribute, assuming = there isn't some way that finishings could be set per-document in a Job. = (Hoping that isn't possible...) --Apple-Mail=_B00B286E-3E0B-468B-B662-F6999518E287 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Type: text/html; charset=us-ascii Hi Mike,

On 2016-10-01, at 5:08 PM, Michael Sweet <msweet@apple.com> = wrote:

Smith,

One comment inline, we can talk more on the Wednesday = concall...

On Sep 27, 2016, at 12:59 AM, Kennedy, Smith (Wireless = Architect) <smith.kennedy@hp.com> wrote:

* Added a comment to section 5.3 "job-pages-per-set" asking = for a description of how "job-pages-per-set" would work in the case = where the Job contains multiple Documents.

This is defined by the "multiple-document-handling" = attribute, just as for the rest of the Job Template attributes.

Conceptually we want to have a "pages-per-set" = Document Template attribute, although I suspect that it would not = see much use - "job-pages-per-set" is for things like PWG Raster Format = where the Client is providing its own copies/sets to the Printer = (multiple documents merged at the Client) rather than sending a = high-level format (PDF) and asking the Printer to produce multiple = sets/copies.  Printers sophisticated enough to support the = Document object are probably going to support PDF...

(so maybe we can just reference the section on = "multiple-document-handling" in RFC2911bis and say why there is no = equivalent Document Template attribute?)


I started = adding some text, and then it occurred to me that the value of = "job-pages-per-set" has to be, or ought to be, an exact multiple of the = total number of pages in the Job. I updated it thus:

The RECOMMENDED "job-pages-per-set" Job Template attribute specifies the number of input pages that constitute a set for finishing processes. =  The value of "job-pages-per-set" must be a multiple of the total number of pages of all Documents in the Job. For example, if a Client = submits a 14 page PWG Raster Format [PWG5102.4] Document for = printing that actually contains two copies of four duplex pages each, the Client could specify a "job-pages-per-set" Job Template attribute with a value of 7, a "sides" attribute with a value of 'two-sided-long-edge', and a "finishings" attribute with a value of 4 (staple) to have the Printer staple two Sets of four sheets. Figure 4 shows a = graphical representation of this example.

That sentence I = added makes clear how the pages taken from one or more Documents in a = Job relate to the value found in this attribute, assuming there isn't = some way that finishings could be set per-document in a Job. (Hoping = that isn't possible...)


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--Apple-Mail=_8B3CFC24-5FDB-4CA8-9A0C-3B226FEFFC68-- --===============2029434589815860094== Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline _______________________________________________ ipp mailing list ipp@pwg.org https://www.pwg.org/mailman/listinfo/ipp --===============2029434589815860094==-- From ipp-bounces@pwg.org Tue Oct 4 11:34:11 2016 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ietfarch-ipp-archive@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: ietfarch-ipp-archive@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 834EC129426 for ; Tue, 4 Oct 2016 11:34:11 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -4.896 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-4.896 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, HEADER_FROM_DIFFERENT_DOMAINS=0.001, RP_MATCHES_RCVD=-2.996, SPF_PASS=-0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Received: from mail.ietf.org 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DF4PR84MB0284.NAMPRD84.PROD.OUTLOOK.COM (10.162.193.22) by DF4PR84MB0281.NAMPRD84.PROD.OUTLOOK.COM (10.162.193.19) with Microsoft SMTP Server (version=TLS1_2, cipher=TLS_ECDHE_RSA_WITH_AES_256_CBC_SHA384_P384) id 15.1.649.16; Tue, 4 Oct 2016 18:34:00 +0000 Received: from DF4PR84MB0284.NAMPRD84.PROD.OUTLOOK.COM ([10.162.193.22]) by DF4PR84MB0284.NAMPRD84.PROD.OUTLOOK.COM ([10.162.193.22]) with mapi id 15.01.0649.021; Tue, 4 Oct 2016 18:34:00 +0000 From: "Kennedy, Smith (Wireless Architect)" To: PWG IPP WG Reflector Thread-Topic: IPP Finishings 2.1: New draft posted Thread-Index: AQHSHm3fBQOxWqUj80KB6JbpJdNVvw== Date: Tue, 4 Oct 2016 18:33:59 +0000 Message-ID: <95F90476-8768-4898-9224-5DD186C06F57@hp.com> Accept-Language: en-US Content-Language: en-US X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: authentication-results: spf=none (sender IP is ) smtp.mailfrom=smith.kennedy@hp.com; x-ms-exchange-messagesentrepresentingtype: 1 x-originating-ip: [15.65.252.14] 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SFS:(10019020)(6009001)(7916002)(189002)(6602003)(199003)(8676002)(105586002)(11100500001)(8936002)(106356001)(77096005)(106116001)(33656002)(81156014)(81166006)(83716003)(99286002)(87936001)(229853001)(82746002)(97736004)(68736007)(92566002)(2906002)(2900100001)(66066001)(5660300001)(6916009)(19580395003)(7846002)(15975445007)(122556002)(86362001)(5002640100001)(36756003)(7736002)(10400500002)(110136003)(450100001)(305945005)(3660700001)(50986999)(101416001)(102836003)(586003)(3280700002)(54356999)(189998001)(6116002)(107886002)(3846002)(104396002); DIR:OUT; SFP:1102; SCL:1; SRVR:DF4PR84MB0281; H:DF4PR84MB0284.NAMPRD84.PROD.OUTLOOK.COM; FPR:; SPF:None; PTR:InfoNoRecords; MX:1; A:1; LANG:en; received-spf: None (protection.outlook.com: hp.com does not designate permitted sender hosts) spamdiagnosticoutput: 1:99 spamdiagnosticmetadata: NSPM Content-ID: <560F11340AF0A54E879344E1E483160A@NAMPRD84.PROD.OUTLOOK.COM> MIME-Version: 1.0 X-OriginatorOrg: hp.com X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-originalarrivaltime: 04 Oct 2016 18:33:59.8710 (UTC) X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-fromentityheader: Hosted X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-id: ca7981a2-785a-463d-b82a-3db87dfc3ce6 X-MS-Exchange-Transport-CrossTenantHeadersStamped: DF4PR84MB0281 Subject: [IPP] IPP Finishings 2.1: New draft posted X-BeenThere: ipp@pwg.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15 Precedence: list List-Id: Internet Printing Protocol Workgroup discussion list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: ipp-bounces@pwg.org Sender: "ipp" Greetings, I have just posted another new draft of IPP Finishings 2.1: http://ftp.pwg.org/pub/pwg/ipp/wd/wd-ippfinishings21-20161004.pdf http://ftp.pwg.org/pub/pwg/ipp/wd/wd-ippfinishings21-20161004.docx http://ftp.pwg.org/pub/pwg/ipp/wd/wd-ippfinishings21-20161004-rev.pdf http://ftp.pwg.org/pub/pwg/ipp/wd/wd-ippfinishings21-20161004-rev.docx Changes include: * In section 5.3 , enhanced definition of "job-pages-per-set" to clarify that the value needs to be an exact multiple of the number of pages in all Documents in the Job, which also clarifies the expectations of how that attribute value is set in the case of a multiple document Job. * Modified the "job-constraints-supported" attribute example at the end of section 6.9: * Removed mention of "media-source"='tray-2' because the input source doesn't matter. * Added a second value to "finishings" and "finishing-template" so that the example illustrates that attributes in a constraint can have more than one value even when the attribute itself is defined to have only one value. Also called this out with an additional sentence below the example. * Moved open curly braces to the same line as the equal sign to reduce number of lines used * Modified the "job-resolvers-supported" attribute example at the end of section 6.9: * make the resolution either use "short-edge-feed" or to change the media source to 'tray-1' (usually a manual feed input source, at least on HP printers) where the user might be instructed via a prompt to provide the needed media size and feed orientation. * Moved open curly braces to the same line as the equal sign to reduce number of lines used * Removed mention of alternate stitching angles because they don't resolve the problem Cheers, Smith /** Smith Kennedy Wireless Architect - Client Software - IPG-PPS Standards - IEEE ISTO PWG / Bluetooth SIG / Wi-Fi Alliance / NFC Forum / USB IF Chair, IEEE ISTO Printer Working Group HP Inc. */ _______________________________________________ ipp mailing list ipp@pwg.org https://www.pwg.org/mailman/listinfo/ipp From ipp-bounces@pwg.org Tue Oct 4 14:19:41 2016 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ietfarch-ipp-archive@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: ietfarch-ipp-archive@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3901A1294B6 for ; Tue, 4 Oct 2016 14:19:41 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -4.896 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-4.896 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, HEADER_FROM_DIFFERENT_DOMAINS=0.001, RP_MATCHES_RCVD=-2.996, SPF_PASS=-0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id o63UTuDwhJRt for ; Tue, 4 Oct 2016 14:19:39 -0700 (PDT) Received: from www.pwg.org (www.pwg.org [IPv6:2600:3c01::f03c:91ff:fe70:b03f]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8A759129509 for ; Tue, 4 Oct 2016 14:19:39 -0700 (PDT) Received: by www.pwg.org (Postfix, from userid 1002) id 625A7477F; Tue, 4 Oct 2016 21:19:38 +0000 (UTC) Received: from www.pwg.org (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by www.pwg.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 72CD0415F; Tue, 4 Oct 2016 21:19:34 +0000 (UTC) X-Original-To: ipp@pwg.org Delivered-To: ipp@pwg.org Received: by www.pwg.org (Postfix, from userid 1002) id D38664160; Tue, 4 Oct 2016 21:19:33 +0000 (UTC) Received: from NAM01-BN3-obe.outbound.protection.outlook.com (mail-bn3nam01on0130.outbound.protection.outlook.com [104.47.33.130]) by www.pwg.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 70BCF2626 for ; Tue, 4 Oct 2016 21:19:32 +0000 (UTC) Received: from DF4PR84MB0284.NAMPRD84.PROD.OUTLOOK.COM (10.162.193.22) by DF4PR84MB0284.NAMPRD84.PROD.OUTLOOK.COM (10.162.193.22) with Microsoft SMTP Server (version=TLS1_2, cipher=TLS_ECDHE_RSA_WITH_AES_256_CBC_SHA384_P384) id 15.1.649.16; Tue, 4 Oct 2016 21:19:31 +0000 Received: from DF4PR84MB0284.NAMPRD84.PROD.OUTLOOK.COM ([10.162.193.22]) by DF4PR84MB0284.NAMPRD84.PROD.OUTLOOK.COM ([10.162.193.22]) with mapi id 15.01.0649.021; Tue, 4 Oct 2016 21:19:31 +0000 From: "Kennedy, Smith (Wireless Architect)" To: "ipp@pwg.org" Thread-Topic: "trimming-when" member attribute - why no keyword corresponding to 'no-trimming'? Thread-Index: AQHSHoT+zMlNg9EjG0qWeeChD5QuTg== Date: Tue, 4 Oct 2016 21:19:30 +0000 Message-ID: <951C2F76-DC72-45E5-8300-0402C12BA3C2@hp.com> Accept-Language: en-US Content-Language: en-US X-MS-Has-Attach: yes X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: authentication-results: spf=none (sender IP is ) smtp.mailfrom=smith.kennedy@hp.com; x-ms-exchange-messagesentrepresentingtype: 1 x-originating-ip: [75.174.42.172] x-ms-office365-filtering-correlation-id: 0809a82b-1115-43e5-cfc9-08d3ec9c2183 x-microsoft-exchange-diagnostics: 1; DF4PR84MB0284; 6:aOD1GiDowqigO2pZ2U81Q+JV0qzV6YIj7aPio79ftBN3HeyHq+k+A1QswAR9Xe5A4dil/TRTdds+HvYSia0oYNStHxccqQqxtmdhefIl4fcE7EHz4tTUduYem8/B7fyUgCFObQHXoMSLMbc2dBYWNeg45cIhM1fd+euapclxjojyJ4+41xfP3Nq9XRx3JLmzL393ERknju71VGRbmeQ2PfdXsdZKdtnK3QWqcwgC2rqG+kOJMT4AWPG0AYlsuXmuz80qK86yz1+rwNM+SGW1L46/7SBxQOrnhn/ESW3yp/90BxpqCXSpI57JGCEjtFzm; 5:3J0kVTcAizd2RSJfeNK3yTL9uwNf682F0Q1D/xQp1P9Y8UclVbZ7f4DPYvPLNDirx9o7IPOsXPRH7aMc1dw0UIDxkuNQX/YMk+1vu+7IK8Sz5rsc5L40qGtGKB8YvT5ugTxRN4fQ6azgOpI/ePDDoEQVEtiHiYTcH+Pn9IRUC08=; 24:Y4KI114w41hiuSMY6Jvdfu/qk4GtYyU0hMnkc9XdtNT4ZZ4rrPyV1yf5FgyXWbV5Ha/SySXkPYO3C6WhAtleX5SwQ+2h3BNGoxhsNLziS+U=; 7:5z3aeJR1rSt8W4g+1JT0P44n7oLr3b3pPgvkRYySkowu2WSjpdrMPY4praDxiz8BdWvcDCMkwa5A9fzVvb7qo33cdMduKp+a4a68XptIoj/olW432ANEexpJyxLKXOOP+5qKbQ+2gUxpYhI2xF2dkWT6t8qB56XKqepHKpj0V6O8KuePg495ttlb8qPkf/Bl3x52e4Oam8wIxZB5Tw7SU8osawKZou5rAgkojUNu9ddt7LEXamiqbQb0+aw55MPh1B9rnihcpRWXFxGhdy3TZsmXvwybHNWznbuvlUo/ix2QzBVwDD2R0lPuz2i5/7qT+rD0bZ8HfigO0ek75n6Rnw== x-microsoft-antispam: UriScan:;BCL:0;PCL:0;RULEID:;SRVR:DF4PR84MB0284; x-microsoft-antispam-prvs: x-exchange-antispam-report-test: UriScan:; x-exchange-antispam-report-cfa-test: BCL:0; PCL:0; RULEID:(102415321)(6040176)(601004)(2401047)(8121501046)(5005006)(10201501046)(3002001); SRVR:DF4PR84MB0284; BCL:0; PCL:0; RULEID:; SRVR:DF4PR84MB0284; x-forefront-prvs: 00851CA28B x-forefront-antispam-report: SFV:NSPM; SFS:(10019020)(6009001)(7916002)(189002)(6602003)(199003)(1730700003)(2501003)(81156014)(106116001)(11100500001)(81166006)(77096005)(82746002)(2351001)(229853001)(105586002)(189998001)(8936002)(99286002)(106356001)(33656002)(3660700001)(87936001)(86362001)(8676002)(68736007)(83716003)(3280700002)(36756003)(450100001)(66066001)(7736002)(99936001)(92566002)(50986999)(10400500002)(2906002)(305945005)(5640700001)(101416001)(5002640100001)(586003)(102836003)(3846002)(6116002)(107886002)(6916009)(2900100001)(110136003)(122556002)(97736004)(5660300001)(54356999)(7846002)(104396002); DIR:OUT; SFP:1102; SCL:1; SRVR:DF4PR84MB0284; H:DF4PR84MB0284.NAMPRD84.PROD.OUTLOOK.COM; FPR:; SPF:None; PTR:InfoNoRecords; MX:1; A:1; LANG:en; received-spf: None (protection.outlook.com: hp.com does not designate permitted sender hosts) spamdiagnosticoutput: 1:99 spamdiagnosticmetadata: NSPM MIME-Version: 1.0 X-OriginatorOrg: hp.com X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-originalarrivaltime: 04 Oct 2016 21:19:30.9530 (UTC) X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-fromentityheader: Hosted X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-id: ca7981a2-785a-463d-b82a-3db87dfc3ce6 X-MS-Exchange-Transport-CrossTenantHeadersStamped: DF4PR84MB0284 Subject: [IPP] "trimming-when" member attribute - why no keyword corresponding to 'no-trimming'? X-BeenThere: ipp@pwg.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15 Precedence: list List-Id: Internet Printing Protocol Workgroup discussion list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="===============7011965363161370556==" Errors-To: ipp-bounces@pwg.org Sender: "ipp" --===============7011965363161370556== Content-Language: en-US Content-Type: multipart/signed; boundary="Apple-Mail=_AD03CF8E-84DD-4733-A78C-71ED814CA400"; protocol="application/pkcs7-signature"; micalg=sha1 --Apple-Mail=_AD03CF8E-84DD-4733-A78C-71ED814CA400 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Hi there, In Finishings 2.0 / 2.1, the "trimming-when" member attribute has 4 = keywords defined 'after-documents', 'after-job', 'after-sets', and = 'after-sheets'. But what keyword would the user provide if they don't = want the paper cut at all? Smith /** Smith Kennedy Wireless Architect - Client Software - IPG-PPS Standards - IEEE ISTO PWG / Bluetooth SIG / Wi-Fi Alliance / NFC = Forum / USB IF Chair, IEEE ISTO Printer Working Group HP Inc. */ --Apple-Mail=_AD03CF8E-84DD-4733-A78C-71ED814CA400 Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="smime.p7s" Content-Type: application/pkcs7-signature; name="smime.p7s" Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64 MIAGCSqGSIb3DQEHAqCAMIACAQExCzAJBgUrDgMCGgUAMIAGCSqGSIb3DQEHAQAAoIIOQDCCBmEw ggVJoAMCAQICEDtXE7awITX7XkZ1ymyyxOEwDQYJKoZIhvcNAQEFBQAwgcoxCzAJBgNVBAYTAlVT MRcwFQYDVQQKEw5WZXJpU2lnbiwgSW5jLjEfMB0GA1UECxMWVmVyaVNpZ24gVHJ1c3QgTmV0d29y azE6MDgGA1UECxMxKGMpIDE5OTkgVmVyaVNpZ24sIEluYy4gLSBGb3IgYXV0aG9yaXplZCB1c2Ug b25seTFFMEMGA1UEAxM8VmVyaVNpZ24gQ2xhc3MgMiBQdWJsaWMgUHJpbWFyeSBDZXJ0aWZpY2F0 aW9uIEF1dGhvcml0eSAtIEczMB4XDTA5MDkwMjAwMDAwMFoXDTE5MDkwMTIzNTk1OVowgfcxCzAJ BgNVBAYTAlVTMSAwHgYDVQQKExdIZXdsZXR0LVBhY2thcmQgQ29tcGFueTEfMB0GA1UECxMWVmVy 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with ESMTPS id 06EB62626 for ; Tue, 4 Oct 2016 21:37:25 +0000 (UTC) Received: from usa7109ht001.na.xerox.net ([13.41.230.31]) by USA7109MR002.ACS-INC.COM with ESMTP/TLS/AES128-SHA256; 04 Oct 2016 16:37:14 -0500 Received: from USA7109MB013.na.xerox.net ([169.254.5.43]) by USA7109HT001.na.xerox.net ([13.41.230.31]) with mapi id 14.03.0294.000; Tue, 4 Oct 2016 16:37:14 -0500 From: "Manchala, Daniel" To: "Kennedy, Smith (Wireless Architect)" , "ipp@pwg.org" Thread-Topic: "trimming-when" member attribute - why no keyword corresponding to 'no-trimming'? Thread-Index: AQHSHoT+zMlNg9EjG0qWeeChD5QuTqCY0ZYC Date: Tue, 4 Oct 2016 21:37:13 +0000 Message-ID: References: <951C2F76-DC72-45E5-8300-0402C12BA3C2@hp.com> In-Reply-To: <951C2F76-DC72-45E5-8300-0402C12BA3C2@hp.com> Accept-Language: en-US Content-Language: en-US X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: x-originating-ip: [13.41.230.88] MIME-Version: 1.0 Subject: Re: [IPP] "trimming-when" member attribute - why no keyword corresponding to 'no-trimming'? X-BeenThere: ipp@pwg.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15 Precedence: list List-Id: Internet Printing Protocol Workgroup discussion list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: ipp-bounces@pwg.org Sender: "ipp" A related question. Does 'trimming-type' include crease in addition to scoring, perforation, partial and full? Thanks, Daniel. ________________________________________ From: ipp [ipp-bounces@pwg.org] on behalf of Kennedy, Smith (Wireless Architect) [smith.kennedy@hp.com] Sent: Tuesday, October 04, 2016 2:19 PM To: ipp@pwg.org Subject: [IPP] "trimming-when" member attribute - why no keyword corresponding to 'no-trimming'? Hi there, In Finishings 2.0 / 2.1, the "trimming-when" member attribute has 4 keywords defined 'after-documents', 'after-job', 'after-sets', and 'after-sheets'. But what keyword would the user provide if they don't want the paper cut at all? Smith /** Smith Kennedy Wireless Architect - Client Software - IPG-PPS Standards - IEEE ISTO PWG / Bluetooth SIG / Wi-Fi Alliance / NFC Forum / USB IF Chair, IEEE ISTO Printer Working Group HP Inc. */ _______________________________________________ ipp mailing list ipp@pwg.org https://www.pwg.org/mailman/listinfo/ipp From ipp-bounces@pwg.org Tue Oct 4 14:48:24 2016 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ietfarch-ipp-archive@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: ietfarch-ipp-archive@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id DAEF812952F for ; Tue, 4 Oct 2016 14:48:24 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -4.896 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-4.896 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, HEADER_FROM_DIFFERENT_DOMAINS=0.001, RP_MATCHES_RCVD=-2.996, SPF_PASS=-0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id ZjADSaiXSCFC for ; Tue, 4 Oct 2016 14:48:23 -0700 (PDT) Received: from www.pwg.org (www.pwg.org [IPv6:2600:3c01::f03c:91ff:fe70:b03f]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8A3AC129529 for ; Tue, 4 Oct 2016 14:48:23 -0700 (PDT) Received: by www.pwg.org (Postfix, from userid 1002) id 7D58E477E; Tue, 4 Oct 2016 21:48:23 +0000 (UTC) Received: from www.pwg.org (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by www.pwg.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 51C79415F; Tue, 4 Oct 2016 21:48:20 +0000 (UTC) X-Original-To: ipp@pwg.org Delivered-To: ipp@pwg.org Received: by www.pwg.org (Postfix, from userid 48) id 52B59415F; Tue, 4 Oct 2016 21:48:18 +0000 (UTC) To: ipp@pwg.org X-PHP-Originating-Script: 1000:db-issue.php From: smith.kennedy@hp.com Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 Date: Tue, 4 Oct 2016 21:48:18 +0000 (UTC) Subject: [IPP] [PWG5100.13] Issue #50: Section 1.2 "Coloring" should be renamed to no longer use "Coloring" - perhaps "Filtering"? X-BeenThere: ipp@pwg.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15 Precedence: list List-Id: Internet Printing Protocol Workgroup discussion list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Reply-To: webmaster@pwg.org Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: ipp-bounces@pwg.org Sender: "ipp" [Issue Unconfirmed] Section 1.2 "Coloring" - we decided in the IPP WG during the development of the IPP Implementor's Guide v2 that the term "Coloring" was inappropriate, and that a different term would be better. In IPP Implementor's Guide v2 we used "filtering". Link: http://www.pwg.org/issues/50 _______________________________________________ ipp mailing list ipp@pwg.org https://www.pwg.org/mailman/listinfo/ipp From ipp-bounces@pwg.org Tue Oct 4 14:53:11 2016 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ietfarch-ipp-archive@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: ietfarch-ipp-archive@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id D6ABE129535 for ; Tue, 4 Oct 2016 14:53:11 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -4.896 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-4.896 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, HEADER_FROM_DIFFERENT_DOMAINS=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE=-0.0001, RP_MATCHES_RCVD=-2.996, SPF_PASS=-0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id NV9gpo07k8PR for ; Tue, 4 Oct 2016 14:53:10 -0700 (PDT) Received: from www.pwg.org (www.pwg.org [50.116.7.199]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 574AD12952F for ; Tue, 4 Oct 2016 14:53:10 -0700 (PDT) Received: by www.pwg.org (Postfix, from userid 1002) id 2E1494425; Tue, 4 Oct 2016 21:53:10 +0000 (UTC) Received: from www.pwg.org (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by www.pwg.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1AFFD415F; Tue, 4 Oct 2016 21:53:05 +0000 (UTC) X-Original-To: ipp@pwg.org Delivered-To: ipp@pwg.org Received: by www.pwg.org (Postfix, from userid 1002) id AC0F04160; Tue, 4 Oct 2016 21:53:03 +0000 (UTC) Received: from NAM01-SN1-obe.outbound.protection.outlook.com (mail-sn1nam01on0113.outbound.protection.outlook.com [104.47.32.113]) by www.pwg.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 2E13F24D3 for ; Tue, 4 Oct 2016 21:53:02 +0000 (UTC) Received: from DF4PR84MB0284.NAMPRD84.PROD.OUTLOOK.COM (10.162.193.22) by DF4PR84MB0283.NAMPRD84.PROD.OUTLOOK.COM (10.162.193.21) with Microsoft SMTP Server (version=TLS1_2, cipher=TLS_ECDHE_RSA_WITH_AES_256_CBC_SHA384_P384) id 15.1.649.16; Tue, 4 Oct 2016 21:53:00 +0000 Received: from DF4PR84MB0284.NAMPRD84.PROD.OUTLOOK.COM ([10.162.193.22]) by DF4PR84MB0284.NAMPRD84.PROD.OUTLOOK.COM ([10.162.193.22]) with mapi id 15.01.0649.021; Tue, 4 Oct 2016 21:53:00 +0000 From: "Kennedy, Smith (Wireless Architect)" To: "Manchala, Daniel" Thread-Topic: "trimming-when" member attribute - why no keyword corresponding to 'no-trimming'? Thread-Index: AQHSHoT/ogjXHu4pp0a/Mfevav4bQKCY0eaAgAAEZ4A= Date: Tue, 4 Oct 2016 21:53:00 +0000 Message-ID: <7D7458AD-EAC5-4710-AE44-3370A53C0A37@hp.com> References: <951C2F76-DC72-45E5-8300-0402C12BA3C2@hp.com> In-Reply-To: Accept-Language: en-US Content-Language: en-US X-MS-Has-Attach: yes X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: authentication-results: spf=none (sender IP is ) smtp.mailfrom=smith.kennedy@hp.com; x-ms-exchange-messagesentrepresentingtype: 1 x-originating-ip: [75.174.42.172] x-ms-office365-filtering-correlation-id: d66fd17e-5189-4cae-ad9d-08d3eca0cf3a x-microsoft-exchange-diagnostics: 1; DF4PR84MB0283; 6:qazLiyEpzPUfM2m/8uud/zyapb8RUbOzzzJ3yIj0hkMxuG7BtooRTc/Us/Z/yP2QV6Qwgv+N/3s1UHGuTfYQ9bqimN/Z6rbzYkE68+Y0fXvHxcNwsxRi0u9ROMR1cxYWPJ4kiiGjegNu/xJnXpzRgOqcuZFoEHykIF+9UM20BYxI22mhmH+3V/yDTqvBYKRjjz/ds0MBHGY/cFEYec2AyaZd6wwH1pwtG7rnmSah9ysrtXhk49xAj+jWLSy14Jj9zv5Sc7gooOfWeK5sWNADzJ9tC1JUegkCrveHSSLMhgTwufwR2fz5TPMWgDymzTKu; 5:jb0fSMu1NxLtSBBpnToUlPIQ5yEVcAa/Sy5FC+Aku92ds1cHIRFbdjQCkf6pcE103hjL+UVAXRxhqN70kll8SqCoRGZQrUYhMXG/ARr0diK54IX63g4WY14WHgPKXrAd3YYWWKPa5yHd6R7TFHQQKjnEIVXBupW8r/X8cZIBfeI=; 24:jeQ6nv3ugKW1Rt5/VLfckbvpix8E/IQHT18IYXbVgLq0MDSh8i6x7/mpXhXdtBhvnoWRqGv9M///jiETbfpElhTQtl8zg24guTgVC5LimGg=; 7:2w9cxMOTAoWpJyUkeiE4uDM8xNo/LJupUyNvkSyW055AeIU7zUBB+59/9LaDv99W5goD1SDRBpEf1J+gzU1vvzd8gv64LEEX1kj1Bm0EPmh6tR9AcTsx9TJv7kwFd5MKkLEidtimruP6cz45JYcRq0P/zjCwBvCUZ3GfYK9uox5O/Kc35Wuc8eevUnc+hSGBBxShBhUB6dik8+pPQ6kJWk2RYqPk+JJ2u2I06FzXAgpcUVOBBauP/FxibqQNsrJ9VzN+INcugNso9RpWNleHRBRHscAlx1JAxFfmr9xrcZ76m1uxmhk2ySZBRFTNR6P94BI/LbH0OUGne4guW/38qw== x-microsoft-antispam: UriScan:;BCL:0;PCL:0;RULEID:;SRVR:DF4PR84MB0283; x-microsoft-antispam-prvs: x-exchange-antispam-report-test: UriScan:(180371056739261)(1591387915157)(73583498263828); x-exchange-antispam-report-cfa-test: BCL:0; PCL:0; RULEID:(102415321)(6040176)(601004)(2401047)(8121501046)(5005006)(3002001)(10201501046); SRVR:DF4PR84MB0283; BCL:0; PCL:0; RULEID:; SRVR:DF4PR84MB0283; x-forefront-prvs: 00851CA28B x-forefront-antispam-report: SFV:NSPM; SFS:(10019020)(6009001)(7916002)(24454002)(377454003)(199003)(6602003)(189002)(6116002)(102836003)(7736002)(106116001)(106356001)(99286002)(7846002)(33656002)(76176999)(15975445007)(36756003)(305945005)(77096005)(3280700002)(54356999)(101416001)(3846002)(99936001)(4326007)(2900100001)(66066001)(586003)(2906002)(11100500001)(50986999)(105586002)(86362001)(5660300001)(19580405001)(19580395003)(83716003)(3660700001)(92566002)(6916009)(5002640100001)(110136003)(2950100002)(87936001)(82746002)(81166006)(97736004)(81156014)(122556002)(189998001)(8936002)(8676002)(10400500002)(68736007)(104396002); DIR:OUT; SFP:1102; SCL:1; SRVR:DF4PR84MB0283; H:DF4PR84MB0284.NAMPRD84.PROD.OUTLOOK.COM; FPR:; SPF:None; PTR:InfoNoRecords; A:1; MX:1; LANG:en; received-spf: None (protection.outlook.com: hp.com does not designate permitted sender hosts) spamdiagnosticoutput: 1:99 spamdiagnosticmetadata: NSPM MIME-Version: 1.0 X-OriginatorOrg: hp.com X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-originalarrivaltime: 04 Oct 2016 21:53:00.4172 (UTC) X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-fromentityheader: Hosted X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-id: ca7981a2-785a-463d-b82a-3db87dfc3ce6 X-MS-Exchange-Transport-CrossTenantHeadersStamped: DF4PR84MB0283 Cc: "ipp@pwg.org" Subject: Re: [IPP] "trimming-when" member attribute - why no keyword corresponding to 'no-trimming'? X-BeenThere: ipp@pwg.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15 Precedence: list List-Id: Internet Printing Protocol Workgroup discussion list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="===============3198908235204268384==" Errors-To: ipp-bounces@pwg.org Sender: "ipp" --===============3198908235204268384== Content-Language: en-US Content-Type: multipart/signed; boundary="Apple-Mail=_24DC8370-0839-4905-922A-02F5B949D3CB"; protocol="application/pkcs7-signature"; micalg=sha1 --Apple-Mail=_24DC8370-0839-4905-922A-02F5B949D3CB Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Hi Daniel, The IANA IPP registry = (http://www.iana.org/assignments/ipp-registrations/ipp-registrations.xml) = has the following keywords registered for "trimming-type": draw-line full partial perforate score tab What would you say is the nature of the difference between 'crease' and = 'score'? Smith > On Oct 4, 2016, at 3:37 PM, Manchala, Daniel = wrote: >=20 > A related question.=20 >=20 > Does 'trimming-type' include crease in addition to scoring, = perforation, partial and full? >=20 > Thanks, > Daniel. >=20 > ________________________________________ > From: ipp [ipp-bounces@pwg.org] on behalf of Kennedy, Smith (Wireless = Architect) [smith.kennedy@hp.com] > Sent: Tuesday, October 04, 2016 2:19 PM > To: ipp@pwg.org > Subject: [IPP] "trimming-when" member attribute - why no keyword = corresponding to 'no-trimming'? >=20 > Hi there, >=20 > In Finishings 2.0 / 2.1, the "trimming-when" member attribute has 4 = keywords defined 'after-documents', 'after-job', 'after-sets', and = 'after-sheets'. But what keyword would the user provide if they don't = want the paper cut at all? >=20 > Smith >=20 > /** > Smith Kennedy > Wireless Architect - Client Software - IPG-PPS > Standards - IEEE ISTO PWG / Bluetooth SIG / Wi-Fi Alliance / NFC = Forum / USB IF > Chair, IEEE ISTO Printer Working Group > HP Inc. > */ >=20 >=20 >=20 --Apple-Mail=_24DC8370-0839-4905-922A-02F5B949D3CB Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="smime.p7s" Content-Type: application/pkcs7-signature; name="smime.p7s" Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64 MIAGCSqGSIb3DQEHAqCAMIACAQExCzAJBgUrDgMCGgUAMIAGCSqGSIb3DQEHAQAAoIIOQDCCBmEw ggVJoAMCAQICEDtXE7awITX7XkZ1ymyyxOEwDQYJKoZIhvcNAQEFBQAwgcoxCzAJBgNVBAYTAlVT MRcwFQYDVQQKEw5WZXJpU2lnbiwgSW5jLjEfMB0GA1UECxMWVmVyaVNpZ24gVHJ1c3QgTmV0d29y azE6MDgGA1UECxMxKGMpIDE5OTkgVmVyaVNpZ24sIEluYy4gLSBGb3IgYXV0aG9yaXplZCB1c2Ug b25seTFFMEMGA1UEAxM8VmVyaVNpZ24gQ2xhc3MgMiBQdWJsaWMgUHJpbWFyeSBDZXJ0aWZpY2F0 aW9uIEF1dGhvcml0eSAtIEczMB4XDTA5MDkwMjAwMDAwMFoXDTE5MDkwMTIzNTk1OVowgfcxCzAJ 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X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-4.396 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, HEADER_FROM_DIFFERENT_DOMAINS=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE=-0.0001, RCVD_IN_SORBS_SPAM=0.5, RP_MATCHES_RCVD=-2.996, SPF_PASS=-0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 3B6U_YCJdUnx for ; Tue, 4 Oct 2016 15:04:18 -0700 (PDT) Received: from www.pwg.org (www.pwg.org [50.116.7.199]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5B386129539 for ; Tue, 4 Oct 2016 15:04:18 -0700 (PDT) Received: by www.pwg.org (Postfix, from userid 1002) id 044164425; Tue, 4 Oct 2016 22:04:18 +0000 (UTC) Received: from www.pwg.org (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by www.pwg.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3E047415F; Tue, 4 Oct 2016 22:04:11 +0000 (UTC) X-Original-To: ipp@pwg.org Delivered-To: ipp@pwg.org Received: by www.pwg.org (Postfix, from userid 1002) id 3F9EE4160; Tue, 4 Oct 2016 22:04:10 +0000 (UTC) Received: from USA7109MR008.ACS-INC.COM (usa7109mr008.acs-inc.com [13.28.230.19]) by www.pwg.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 01FFF24D3 for ; Tue, 4 Oct 2016 22:04:08 +0000 (UTC) Received: from usa7109ht002.na.xerox.net ([13.41.230.32]) by USA7109MR008.ACS-INC.COM with ESMTP/TLS/AES128-SHA256; 04 Oct 2016 17:03:48 -0500 Received: from USA7109MB013.na.xerox.net ([169.254.5.43]) by USA7109HT002.na.xerox.net ([13.41.230.32]) with mapi id 14.03.0294.000; Tue, 4 Oct 2016 17:03:48 -0500 From: "Manchala, Daniel" To: "Kennedy, Smith (Wireless Architect)" Thread-Topic: "trimming-when" member attribute - why no keyword corresponding to 'no-trimming'? Thread-Index: AQHSHoT+zMlNg9EjG0qWeeChD5QuTqCY0ZYCgABYigD//60IZg== Date: Tue, 4 Oct 2016 22:03:48 +0000 Message-ID: References: <951C2F76-DC72-45E5-8300-0402C12BA3C2@hp.com> , <7D7458AD-EAC5-4710-AE44-3370A53C0A37@hp.com> In-Reply-To: <7D7458AD-EAC5-4710-AE44-3370A53C0A37@hp.com> Accept-Language: en-US Content-Language: en-US X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: x-originating-ip: [13.41.230.88] MIME-Version: 1.0 Cc: "ipp@pwg.org" Subject: Re: [IPP] "trimming-when" member attribute - why no keyword corresponding to 'no-trimming'? X-BeenThere: ipp@pwg.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15 Precedence: list List-Id: Internet Printing Protocol Workgroup discussion list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: ipp-bounces@pwg.org Sender: "ipp" Smith, I think scoring is usually done by rolling a circular (semi blunt) object on paper - much like a pizza cutter, except it is not that sharp. Creasing is done by folding paper, and pressing it - much like placing an anvil over it. The effects are probably different - scoring results in cracking (peeling of toner) at the fold. But, todays finishers might do a better job of scoring and call it creasing; so may be they are defined to be the same. Daniel. ________________________________________ From: Kennedy, Smith (Wireless Architect) [smith.kennedy@hp.com] Sent: Tuesday, October 04, 2016 2:53 PM To: Manchala, Daniel Cc: ipp@pwg.org Subject: Re: "trimming-when" member attribute - why no keyword corresponding to 'no-trimming'? Hi Daniel, The IANA IPP registry (http://www.iana.org/assignments/ipp-registrations/ipp-registrations.xml) has the following keywords registered for "trimming-type": draw-line full partial perforate score tab What would you say is the nature of the difference between 'crease' and 'score'? Smith > On Oct 4, 2016, at 3:37 PM, Manchala, Daniel wrote: > > A related question. > > Does 'trimming-type' include crease in addition to scoring, perforation, partial and full? > > Thanks, > Daniel. > > ________________________________________ > From: ipp [ipp-bounces@pwg.org] on behalf of Kennedy, Smith (Wireless Architect) [smith.kennedy@hp.com] > Sent: Tuesday, October 04, 2016 2:19 PM > To: ipp@pwg.org > Subject: [IPP] "trimming-when" member attribute - why no keyword corresponding to 'no-trimming'? > > Hi there, > > In Finishings 2.0 / 2.1, the "trimming-when" member attribute has 4 keywords defined 'after-documents', 'after-job', 'after-sets', and 'after-sheets'. But what keyword would the user provide if they don't want the paper cut at all? > > Smith > > /** > Smith Kennedy > Wireless Architect - Client Software - IPG-PPS > Standards - IEEE ISTO PWG / Bluetooth SIG / Wi-Fi Alliance / NFC Forum / USB IF > Chair, IEEE ISTO Printer Working Group > HP Inc. > */ > > > _______________________________________________ ipp mailing list ipp@pwg.org https://www.pwg.org/mailman/listinfo/ipp From ipp-bounces@pwg.org Tue Oct 4 15:23:44 2016 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ietfarch-ipp-archive@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: ietfarch-ipp-archive@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9D625129545 for ; Tue, 4 Oct 2016 15:23:44 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -4.896 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-4.896 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, HEADER_FROM_DIFFERENT_DOMAINS=0.001, RP_MATCHES_RCVD=-2.996, SPF_PASS=-0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 3C5sp5UpgRU7 for ; Tue, 4 Oct 2016 15:23:42 -0700 (PDT) Received: from www.pwg.org (www.pwg.org [IPv6:2600:3c01::f03c:91ff:fe70:b03f]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3C1FB129542 for ; Tue, 4 Oct 2016 15:23:42 -0700 (PDT) Received: by www.pwg.org (Postfix, from userid 1002) id A83334412; Tue, 4 Oct 2016 22:23:41 +0000 (UTC) Received: from www.pwg.org (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by www.pwg.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6CD574160; Tue, 4 Oct 2016 22:23:36 +0000 (UTC) X-Original-To: ipp@pwg.org Delivered-To: ipp@pwg.org Received: by www.pwg.org (Postfix, from userid 1002) id 02F5D4407; Tue, 4 Oct 2016 22:23:35 +0000 (UTC) Received: from mailgrd17.cusa.canon.com (mailgrd17.cusa.canon.com [146.184.152.232]) by www.pwg.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id A1EFD415F for ; Tue, 4 Oct 2016 22:23:33 +0000 (UTC) Received: from RDEXCHMAIL02.sc.rd.canon.com (unknown [146.184.20.22]) by mailgrd17.cusa.canon.com with smtp (TLS: TLSv1/SSLv3,128bits,AES128-SHA) id 0d29_3012_76bdacc1_187a_4f66_9785_427586f342fe; Tue, 04 Oct 2016 18:23:20 -0400 Received: from RDEXCHMAIL01.sc.rd.canon.com ([fe80::15a8:cc66:e35:f508]) by RDEXCHMAIL02.sc.rd.canon.com ([169.254.1.207]) with mapi id 14.03.0279.002; Tue, 4 Oct 2016 15:23:18 -0700 From: "Yardumian, Rick" To: "Kennedy, Smith (Wireless Architect)" , "Manchala, Daniel" Thread-Topic: "trimming-when" member attribute - why no keyword corresponding to 'no-trimming'? Thread-Index: AQHSHoT+zMlNg9EjG0qWeeChD5QuTqCY0ZYCgAB6EQD//5J2gA== Date: Tue, 4 Oct 2016 22:23:18 +0000 Message-ID: References: <951C2F76-DC72-45E5-8300-0402C12BA3C2@hp.com> <7D7458AD-EAC5-4710-AE44-3370A53C0A37@hp.com> In-Reply-To: <7D7458AD-EAC5-4710-AE44-3370A53C0A37@hp.com> Accept-Language: en-US Content-Language: en-US X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: x-originating-ip: [146.184.26.66] MIME-Version: 1.0 Cc: "ipp@pwg.org" Subject: Re: [IPP] "trimming-when" member attribute - why no keyword corresponding to 'no-trimming'? X-BeenThere: ipp@pwg.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15 Precedence: list List-Id: Internet Printing Protocol Workgroup discussion list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: ipp-bounces@pwg.org Sender: "ipp" Hi Smith, In April 2016, Canon wanted to add "crease" as a trimming-type value but the PWG said the score value was the same as crease so Canon dropped the request. Best regards, Rick -----Original Message----- From: ipp [mailto:ipp-bounces@pwg.org] On Behalf Of Kennedy, Smith (Wireless Architect) Sent: Tuesday, October 04, 2016 2:53 PM To: Manchala, Daniel Cc: ipp@pwg.org Subject: Re: [IPP] "trimming-when" member attribute - why no keyword corresponding to 'no-trimming'? Hi Daniel, The IANA IPP registry (http://www.iana.org/assignments/ipp-registrations/ipp-registrations.xml) has the following keywords registered for "trimming-type": draw-line full partial perforate score tab What would you say is the nature of the difference between 'crease' and 'score'? Smith > On Oct 4, 2016, at 3:37 PM, Manchala, Daniel wrote: > > A related question. > > Does 'trimming-type' include crease in addition to scoring, perforation, partial and full? > > Thanks, > Daniel. > > ________________________________________ > From: ipp [ipp-bounces@pwg.org] on behalf of Kennedy, Smith (Wireless Architect) [smith.kennedy@hp.com] > Sent: Tuesday, October 04, 2016 2:19 PM > To: ipp@pwg.org > Subject: [IPP] "trimming-when" member attribute - why no keyword corresponding to 'no-trimming'? > > Hi there, > > In Finishings 2.0 / 2.1, the "trimming-when" member attribute has 4 keywords defined 'after-documents', 'after-job', 'after-sets', and 'after-sheets'. But what keyword would the user provide if they don't want the paper cut at all? > > Smith > > /** > Smith Kennedy > Wireless Architect - Client Software - IPG-PPS > Standards - IEEE ISTO PWG / Bluetooth SIG / Wi-Fi Alliance / NFC Forum / USB IF > Chair, IEEE ISTO Printer Working Group > HP Inc. > */ > > > _______________________________________________ ipp mailing list ipp@pwg.org https://www.pwg.org/mailman/listinfo/ipp From ipp-bounces@pwg.org Tue Oct 4 16:17:38 2016 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ietfarch-ipp-archive@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: ietfarch-ipp-archive@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4720F1294F6 for ; Tue, 4 Oct 2016 16:17:38 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -4.782 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-4.782 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_ADSP_CUSTOM_MED=0.001, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, FREEMAIL_FORGED_FROMDOMAIN=0.001, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, HEADER_FROM_DIFFERENT_DOMAINS=0.001, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, RP_MATCHES_RCVD=-2.996, SPF_PASS=-0.001, T_DKIM_INVALID=0.01] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=fail (2048-bit key) reason="fail (message has been altered)" header.d=gmail.com Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id GLY3s9W8i4ck for ; Tue, 4 Oct 2016 16:17:36 -0700 (PDT) Received: from www.pwg.org (www.pwg.org [IPv6:2600:3c01::f03c:91ff:fe70:b03f]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7192A129404 for ; Tue, 4 Oct 2016 16:17:36 -0700 (PDT) Received: by www.pwg.org (Postfix, from userid 1002) id DE6E94422; Tue, 4 Oct 2016 23:17:35 +0000 (UTC) Received: from www.pwg.org (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by www.pwg.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2C96F415F; Tue, 4 Oct 2016 23:17:31 +0000 (UTC) X-Original-To: ipp@pwg.org Delivered-To: ipp@pwg.org Received: by www.pwg.org (Postfix, from userid 1002) id 9050F4160; Tue, 4 Oct 2016 23:17:30 +0000 (UTC) Received: from mail-it0-x22e.google.com (mail-it0-x22e.google.com [IPv6:2607:f8b0:4001:c0b::22e]) by www.pwg.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 8D4BE2626 for ; Tue, 4 Oct 2016 23:17:28 +0000 (UTC) Received: by mail-it0-x22e.google.com with SMTP id 188so24671925iti.0 for ; Tue, 04 Oct 2016 16:17:28 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20120113; h=mime-version:from:date:message-id:subject:to; bh=iTv/Om9K3d662BdXmQxU1rJiaq82PmvCo952t1Z9zIc=; b=FE+WcV0NPKUPJLr+LG8wJVIknKLkA2dI9/nQWjAMW694eCtU0cuz6j5tg/hr88srTs QZZ9JOywdM1JNGmp6Qik0TOj9WB2pU86GTey3hBRJhH/oL0PqK5uy1dhbcoMCwVyXNVV XvcdGvf5/+WimZaFEUppcVlwlzHqr2ptjKHGE8hZ0bW2/u38rRiCFrI//c2lWlOsgo8R CpA8ZzRiE0kOu04ec184ExxJcdwf1/nWi3HolXatERqkpC/HdTp1qvzAzz0w74HBq07W aBEGLu47lkU4B3hnNtIsebpnVHAmkaolnfAOKn/LxUNujS7xyy5JSFZYsPcbgG+a14ls XU1g== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20130820; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:from:date:message-id:subject:to; bh=iTv/Om9K3d662BdXmQxU1rJiaq82PmvCo952t1Z9zIc=; b=fSPLQDmrx+4LFy2HknwJcj1vlZvHuTV2d/HIQvBJGrkhrqAEDgqcMqjvFNYkflcL/v dt4fR3QrUMdXze4bMYfBzpG87yDS/WugZLfxgAeWR/efYoGzCWvE/3kmj3uCNToM8boJ Y6OFGYLfKxIWU9vnhenZn4EUvID6HZlsNpoNxbfEI8Ymv7OpiiufN8cXqbtrsGc6JqUB 1rPSYV5MpJ23nom0DdhzyrIX630K1NTCvkh8PnnQ5bn8+O2lDSkCpSQLSslUp3FvDnwV UrRG4jwPS6htvtWQX9CY9rnRdxoeupqwXKbtxito+8hagVfk+0ho8bqKDF3JtqJmqORD qE1w== X-Gm-Message-State: AA6/9RlS2NtYzRrtZuqLyexrJCN5fzcMHjRPruQTAXsCM0oonT1z2qe7lmavLLHSP0QKmVn9QXaSj/Z9RzVG8A== X-Received: by 10.36.41.194 with SMTP id p185mr6772043itp.66.1475623047712; Tue, 04 Oct 2016 16:17:27 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 Received: by 10.107.147.6 with HTTP; Tue, 4 Oct 2016 16:17:07 -0700 (PDT) From: Ira McDonald Date: Tue, 4 Oct 2016 19:17:07 -0400 Message-ID: To: "ipp@pwg.org" , Ira McDonald Subject: [IPP] Posted IPP System Service (4 October 2016) X-BeenThere: ipp@pwg.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15 Precedence: list List-Id: Internet Printing Protocol Workgroup discussion list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="===============6959568789284533232==" Errors-To: ipp-bounces@pwg.org Sender: "ipp" --===============6959568789284533232== Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary=001a11440d3094d5de053e124304 --001a11440d3094d5de053e124304 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Hi, I have just posted another Interim draft of IPP System Service for review during the IPP WG call this week: http://ftp.pwg.org/pub/pwg/ipp/wd/wd-ippsystem10-20161004-rev.pdf - PDF with line numbers and redlines http://ftp.pwg.org/pub/pwg/ipp/wd/wd-ippsystem10-20161004-rev.docx - MS Word source with line numbers and redlines Summary: All pending edits from 19 September 2016 review. Cheers, - Ira ------------------------------- Change History: 4 October 2016 - Interim draft =E2=80=93 changes per IPP WG review on 19 September 2016 - global =E2=80=93 accepted all changes before section 6 (all reviewed by I= PP WG) - global =E2=80=93 removed =E2=80=9Cresource-printer-id=E2=80=9D and =E2=80= =9Cresource-printer-ids=E2=80=9D from sections 5, 6, and 7, thus removing interaction with =E2=80=9Cprinter-resou= rce-ids=E2=80=9D and rewrote Create-Printer and Create-Resource accordingly - revised sections 4.x to change =E2=80=9Care [long|short]-lived objects=E2= =80=9D to =E2=80=9Care typically [long|short]-lived objects=E2=80=9D - revised section 5.4 System Operations and Table 3 to add Allocate-Printer-Resources and Deallocate-Printer-Resources - revised section 5.7 Resource Status Attributes and Table 5 to delete =E2=80=9Cresource-printer-ids=E2=80=9D and note 5 - added section 6.1.1 Allocate-Printer-Resources and section 6.1.3 Deallocate-Printer-Resources to update Resources associated with a given Printer after Create-Printer - revised section 6.1.2 Create-Printer to clarify choices for associating Resources with a given Printer and refer to Resource upload defined in [PWG5100.18]. - revised section 6.2.2 Create-Resource to clarify choices for associating Resources with a given Printer and refer to Create-Resource-Subscription operation. - TODO =E2=80=93 add status-code text to section 6 preamble and to all oper= ations in sections 6.x - TODO =E2=80=93 add back explicit full parms for every operation in sectio= n 6 per PWG F2F review - TODO =E2=80=93 fix all the broken section 6.x references from the reorgan= ization of section 6 --001a11440d3094d5de053e124304 Content-Type: text/html; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Hi,

I hav= e just posted another Interim draft of IPP <= span>System = Service= for
review during the IPP WG call= this week:

=C2=A0 http://ftp.pwg.= org/pub/pwg/ipp/wd/wd-ippsystem10-20161004-rev.pdf
=C2=A0 - PDF with line numbers and redlines
=C2=A0
=C2=A0 http://ftp.pwg.org/pub/pwg/ipp/wd/wd-ippsystem10-20161004-rev.d= ocx
=C2=A0 - MS Word source with line numbers and redlines

Summary:=C2=A0 All= pending edits from 19 September 2016 review.

Cheers,
- Ira

-------------------------------
Change History:

4 October 2016

- Interim draft =E2=80=93 changes = per IPP WG review on 19 September 2016
- global =E2=80=93 accepted all c= hanges before section 6 (all reviewed by IPP WG)
- global =E2=80=93 remo= ved =E2=80=9Cresource-printer-id=E2=80=9D and =E2=80=9Cresource-printer-ids= =E2=80=9D from sections 5, 6, and 7, thus removing interaction with =E2=80= =9Cprinter-resource-ids=E2=80=9D and rewrote Create-Printer and Create-Reso= urce accordingly
- revised sections 4.x to change =E2=80=9Care [long|sho= rt]-lived objects=E2=80=9D to =E2=80=9Care typically [long|short]-lived obj= ects=E2=80=9D
- revised section 5.4 System Operations and Table 3 to add= Allocate-Printer-Resources and Deallocate-Printer-Resources
- revised s= ection 5.7 Resource Status Attributes and Table 5 to delete =E2=80=9Cresour= ce-printer-ids=E2=80=9D and note 5
- added section 6.1.1 Allocate-Printe= r-Resources and section 6.1.3 Deallocate-Printer-Resources to update Resour= ces associated with a given Printer after Create-Printer
- revised secti= on 6.1.2 Create-Printer to clarify choices for associating Resources with a= given Printer and refer to Resource upload defined in [PWG5100.18].
- r= evised section 6.2.2 Create-Resource to clarify choices for associating Res= ources with a given Printer and refer to Create-Resource-Subscription opera= tion.
- TODO =E2=80=93 a= dd status-code text to section 6 preamble and to all operations in sections= 6.x
- TODO =E2=80=93 add back explicit full parms for every operation i= n section 6 per PWG F2F review
- TODO =E2=80=93 fix all the broken secti= on 6.x references from the reorganization of section 6

--001a11440d3094d5de053e124304-- --===============6959568789284533232== Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline _______________________________________________ ipp mailing list ipp@pwg.org https://www.pwg.org/mailman/listinfo/ipp --===============6959568789284533232==-- From ipp-bounces@pwg.org Tue Oct 4 17:11:41 2016 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ietfarch-ipp-archive@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: ietfarch-ipp-archive@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9C8DE129413 for ; Tue, 4 Oct 2016 17:11:41 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -4.354 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-4.354 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_ADSP_CUSTOM_MED=0.001, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, FREEMAIL_FORGED_FROMDOMAIN=0.001, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, HEADER_FROM_DIFFERENT_DOMAINS=0.001, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, MIME_HTML_MOSTLY=0.428, RP_MATCHES_RCVD=-2.996, SPF_PASS=-0.001, T_DKIM_INVALID=0.01] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=fail (2048-bit key) reason="fail (message has been altered)" header.d=gmail.com Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id Bv7u1w921cvj for ; Tue, 4 Oct 2016 17:11:39 -0700 (PDT) Received: from www.pwg.org (www.pwg.org [IPv6:2600:3c01::f03c:91ff:fe70:b03f]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id C236C129407 for ; Tue, 4 Oct 2016 17:11:39 -0700 (PDT) Received: by www.pwg.org (Postfix, from userid 1002) id 735C24414; Wed, 5 Oct 2016 00:11:39 +0000 (UTC) Received: from www.pwg.org (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by www.pwg.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id E4EEE2626; Wed, 5 Oct 2016 00:11:30 +0000 (UTC) X-Original-To: ipp@pwg.org Delivered-To: ipp@pwg.org Received: by www.pwg.org (Postfix, from userid 1002) id 6B4C3415D; Wed, 5 Oct 2016 00:11:29 +0000 (UTC) Received: from mail-it0-x234.google.com (mail-it0-x234.google.com [IPv6:2607:f8b0:4001:c0b::234]) by www.pwg.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 9A88524D3 for ; Wed, 5 Oct 2016 00:11:26 +0000 (UTC) Received: by mail-it0-x234.google.com with SMTP id 188so78657927iti.1 for ; Tue, 04 Oct 2016 17:11:26 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20120113; h=mime-version:from:date:message-id:subject:to; bh=AsuJ1et3Q38odpcWLDjbop/LdAFt2StfrM3F9nRcll4=; b=grIe9gGes3s07gcN14SZu3o+geLUnbf1XhcHilX+ajoFottqSBsAo6v0z2pqI9viL9 +5mAgQzGxaZcyvcwnhuNjl5tiTVbiSoksgVTsPgce81R8zP6/DiKmscJ9e9lDqIjsuCq lNCrO+OtlMyYMn54MlYC8pBXIktZKTw1faKAXaoZ+NxIbG5r33V6uhxl9pXlrFU9JSfb 2gkvC9fV+s9cNY5fN9VrDRUGcM04v9qwxBPlctsoId9BKwdbvVe69eb3S46/FnJJiYAu 9xV/V3fnVIJIQaTt9YqwCQ2AvBM4hsBcaq2wjZ8MTH2j7I7xy4Wa9f89ew4uyyvhUSyb lpPA== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20130820; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:from:date:message-id:subject:to; bh=AsuJ1et3Q38odpcWLDjbop/LdAFt2StfrM3F9nRcll4=; b=gK2GHYU3hJ36jw9ige3qVr24mDaZimY43o6i3QUCnqApku6qplGLT3R7DdpIUIS1jg YvIPticMVWjZtLMxqWRHKMXZrIBIqiLu3mkD4t4Rl3UcOdh3whWl9bnBY0+W/A1mMiIV nlMMITpcRNlNmb2MMe6DUOB8PxXylZRmebYraiVfXhnlIpe6WTwTYXHD8wjf+VeTY4HR vl1LO+fcuaWXyQQ58LEJ1ezIhmGJ6xLFqJOzmrJMHr7xfjyi6negqQXMKTonLxQMP5lW K52ayY+yZn1DGD31r3KTZzKwyXWU3VFsbrsB2FglpMbzaz2LThSByDEwcCbXtT2LVyrE WxYQ== X-Gm-Message-State: AA6/9RnZ0Y0gpiE9/Int32Ws8ooon8/5tRgndA8v3UYXaE/cCxwbBywRndy5VBpkQRsC6uHfyxHOxXkBF19vLg== X-Received: by 10.36.22.67 with SMTP id a64mr25072057ita.66.1475626285629; Tue, 04 Oct 2016 17:11:25 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 Received: by 10.107.147.6 with HTTP; Tue, 4 Oct 2016 17:11:05 -0700 (PDT) From: Ira McDonald Date: Tue, 4 Oct 2016 20:11:05 -0400 Message-ID: To: "ipp@pwg.org" , Ira McDonald Subject: [IPP] IPP WG Agenda 1-3 US Eastern (5 October 2016) X-BeenThere: ipp@pwg.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15 Precedence: list List-Id: Internet Printing Protocol Workgroup discussion list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="===============4462890195012588191==" Errors-To: ipp-bounces@pwg.org Sender: "ipp" --===============4462890195012588191== Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary=001a114453be9387b9053e130476 --001a114453be9387b9053e130476 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 Hi, [Note: New Day/Time] Our next IPP WG call will be Wednesday 5 October 2016 at 10am-12pm US Pacific / 1pm-3pm US Eastern Call-in toll-free number (US/Canada): 1-866-469-3239 Call-in toll number (US/Canada): 1-650-429-3300 (Primary) Call-in toll number (US/Canada): 1-408-856-9570 (Backup) Attendee Access Code: *******# Attendee ID Code: # (empty) NOTE: Please DO NOT USE the audio bridge number listed by WebEx - instead use the regular PWG conference bridge listed above! ------------------------------------------------------- Meeting information ------------------------------------------------------- Topic: IPP WG Date: Wednesday, from 5 October 2016 to no end date Time: 1:00 pm, Eastern Daylight Time (New York, GMT-04:00) Meeting Number: 682 763 393 Meeting Password: Printing123 ------------------------------------------------------- To join the online meeting (Now from mobile devices!) ------------------------------------------------------- 1. Go to https://ieee-isto.webex.com/ieee-isto/e.php?MTID= m123b376f8d9bdc7d9ff0ff43ed7d1610 2. If requested, enter your name and email address. 3. If a password is required, enter the meeting password: Printing123 4. Click "Join". ------------------------------------------------------- For assistance ------------------------------------------------------- 1. Go to https://ieee-isto.webex.com/ieee-isto/mc 2. On the left navigation bar, click "Support". ------------------------------------------------------- Agenda: (1) PWG IP Policy, Minute Taker, and Agenda Review - Mike as minute taker? (2) Approve IPP minutes from previous meetings - http://ftp.pwg.org/pub/pwg/ipp/minutes/ippv2-concall-minutes-20160926.pdf -- IPP WG call on 09/26/16 (3) Status of various IPP documents (Ira/Mike/Smith) * IETF IPP/1.1 Updates (Mike/Ira) - http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-sweet-rfc2910bis-10.txt - http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-sweet-rfc2911bis-11.txt -- changes for new IETF Proposed Standards -- Alexey Melnikov (IETF ART AD) as AD sponsor on 06/02/16 -- RFC2910bis & RFC 2911bis - IETF Approved as Proposed Standards! -- waiting on RFC Editor AUTH-48 phase for several minor edits -- Schedule - IPP/1.1 RFCs published in Q4 2016 (4) Registration for "output-bin" value 'auto' (Mike) - http://www.pwg.org/archives/ipp/2016/018950.html -- proposed on mailing list (5) Why are only some dateTime attributes allowed to specify 'no-value'? (Smith/Mike) - http://www.pwg.org/archives/ipp/2016/018953.html -- discussed on mailing list -- may impact RFC2911bis in AUTH-48 phase? (6) Required RTC prevents System Service use by some Printers (Ira/Bill/Mike) - http://www.pwg.org/archives/ipp/2016/018956.html -- discussed on mailing list -- may impact RFC2911bis in AUTH-48 phase? (7) Proposed System Service operations for Printers w/ Resources (Ira/Bill/Pete) - http://www.pwg.org/archives/ipp/2016/018964.html -- discussed on mailing list -- [Allocate|Deallocate]-Printer-Resources -- see new IPP System Service draft from 10/04/16 (8) "trimming-when" - why no keyword corresponding to 'no-trimming'? (Smith/Daniel/Rick) - http://www.pwg.org/archives/ipp/2016/018972.html -- discussed on mailing list (9) [PWG5100.13] Issue #50: Section 1.2 "Coloring" should be renamed to no longer use "Coloring" - perhaps "Filtering"? (Smith) - http://www.pwg.org/archives/ipp/2016/018974.html (10) Review of IPP 3D Printing Extensions (Mike) - http://ftp.pwg.org/pub/pwg/ipp/wd/wd-ipp3d10-20160824-rev.pdf -- Prototype draft -- Reviewed by IPP WG on 09/19/16 and 09/26/16 -- Mike to provide additional prototyping feedback -- Schedule - PWG Last Call in Q4 2016 (11) Review of IPP Finishings 2.1 (Smith) - http://ftp.pwg.org/pub/pwg/ipp/wd/wd-ippfinishings21-20161004-rev.pdf -- Stable draft -- IPP WG Last Call on 08/22/16 to 09/06/16 -- Reviewed by IPP WG on 09/19/16 -- Schedule - PWG Call for Objections in Q4 2016 (12) Review of IPP System Service (Ira/Mike) - http://ftp.pwg.org/pub/pwg/ipp/wd/wd-ippsystem10-20161004-rev.pdf -- Interim draft -- Reviewed by IPP WG on 09/19/16 -- Stopped at beginning of section 6 operations -- Schedule - Prototype draft in Q4 2016 / Q1 2017 (13) Next steps - IPP WG call on Wed 19 October 2016 at 1-3pm US Eastern - IPP WG call on Wed 2 November 2016 at 1-3pm US Eastern Cheers, - Ira Ira McDonald (Musician / Software Architect) Co-Chair - TCG Trusted Mobility Solutions WG Chair - Linux Foundation Open Printing WG Secretary - IEEE-ISTO Printer Working Group Co-Chair - IEEE-ISTO PWG Internet Printing Protocol WG IETF Designated Expert - IPP & Printer MIB Blue Roof Music / High North Inc http://sites.google.com/site/blueroofmusic http://sites.google.com/site/highnorthinc mailto: blueroofmusic@gmail.com Jan-April: 579 Park Place Saline, MI 48176 734-944-0094 May-Dec: PO Box 221 Grand Marais, MI 49839 906-494-2434 --001a114453be9387b9053e130476 Content-Type: text/html; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Hi,

[Note:=C2= =A0 New Day/Time]

Our next IPP WG call will be Wednesda= y 5 October 2016 at
10am-12pm US Pacific / 1pm-3pm US Eastern

Call-in toll-free number (US/Canada): 1-866-469-3239
Call-in toll number (US/Canada): 1-650-429-3300 (Primary)
Call-in toll number (US/Canada): 1-408-856-9570 (Backup)

Attendee Access Code: *******#
Attendee ID Code: # (empty)

NOTE:=C2=A0 Please DO NOT U= SE the audio bridge number listed by WebEx
- instead use the regular PWG conference bridge listed above!

-------------------------------------------------------
Meeting information
-------------------------------------------------------
Topic: IPP= =C2=A0 WG
Date: Wednesday, from 5 October 2016 to no end date
Time: 1:00 pm, Eastern Daylight Time (New York, GMT-04:00)
Meeting Number: 682 763 393
Meeting Password: Printing123
-------------------------------------------------------
To join the online meeting (Now from mobile devices!)
-------------------------------------------------------
1. Go to https://ieee-isto.webex.co= m/ieee-isto/e.php?MTID=3Dm123b376f8d9bdc7d9ff0ff43ed7d1610
2. If requested, enter your name and email address.
3. If a password is required, enter the meeting password: Printing123
4. Click "Join".

-------------------------------------------------------
For assistance
-------------------------------------------------------
1. Go to https://ieee-isto.webex.com/ieee-isto/mc 2. On the left navigation bar, click "Support".
-------------------------------------------------------

<= span>Agenda:
(1) PWG IP Policy, Minute Taker, and Agenda= Revi= ew
- Mike as minute taker?

(2) Approve IPP minutes from previous meetings
- http://ftp.pwg.org/pub/pwg/ipp/minutes/= ippv2-concall-minutes-20160926.pdf
-- IPP WG call on 09/26/16

(3) Status of various IPP documents (Ira/Mike/Smith)
-- Alexey Melnikov (IETF ART= AD) as AD sponsor on 06/02/16
-- RFC2910bis & RFC 2911bis - IETF Approved as Propos= ed Standards!
-- waiting on RFC Editor AUTH-48 phase f= or several minor edits
-- Schedule - IPP/1.1 RFCs published in Q4 2016

(4) Registration for "output-bin" v= alue 'auto' (Mike)
- http://www.pwg.org/archives/ipp/20= 16/018950.html
-- proposed on mailing list

<= div>
(5) Why are only some dateTime attributes allowed to specify '= no-value'? (Smith/Mike)
-- discussed on mailing = list
-- may impact RFC2911bis in AUTH-48 phase?

=
(6) Required RTC prevents System Service use by some Printers (Ira/Bil= l/Mike)
- http://www.pwg.org/archives/ipp/2016/018956.html<= br>
-- discussed on mailing list
-- may impact RFC2911bis in A= UTH-48 phase?

(7) Proposed System Service operations for = Printers w/ Resources (Ira/Bill/Pete)
- http://www.pwg.org/archives/= ipp/2016/018964.html
-- discussed on mailing list
-- [Allocate|Deallocate]-Printer-Resources
-- see new IPP Sy= stem Service draft from 10/04/16

(8) "trimming-when" - why= no keyword corresponding to 'no-trimming'? (Smith/Daniel/Rick)
= - http://www.pwg.org/archives/ipp/2016/018972.html
-- discussed on mailing list

(9) [PWG5100.13] Issue #50: Section = 1.2 "Coloring" should be renamed to no longer use "Coloring&= quot; - perhaps "Filtering"? (Smith)
- http://www.pwg.org/a= rchives/ipp/2016/018974.html

(10) Rev= iew of IPP 3D P= rinting Extensions (Mike)
- http://ftp.pwg.org/pub/pwg/= ipp/wd/wd-= ipp3d10-20160824-rev.pdf
-- Prototype draft
= -- Reviewed by IPP WG on 09/19/16 and 09/26/16
=
-- Mike to provide additional prototyping feedback
-- Schedule - PWG Last Call in Q4 2016

(11) Rev= iew of IPP Fini= shings 2.1 (Smith)
- http://ftp.pwg.org/pub/pwg= /ipp/wd/wd-ippfinishings21-20161004-rev.pdf
-- Stable draf= t
-- IPP WG = Last Call on 08/22/16 to 09/06/16
-- Reviewed by IPP WG on 09/19/16
-- Schedule - PWG Call for Objections in Q4 20= 16

(12) Review of <= span>IPP System Service (Ira/= Mike)
- http://ftp.pwg.org/pub/pwg/ipp/wd/wd-i= ppsystem10-20161004-rev.pdf
-- Interim draft
-- Reviewed by IPP<= /span> WG on 09/19/16
-- Stopped at beginning of section 6 operations
-- Schedule = - Prototype draft in Q4 2016 / Q1 2017

(13) Next steps
- IPP WG call on Wed 19 October 2016 at 1-3pm US Eastern
- IPP WG call on Wed 2 Novemb= er 2016 at 1-3pm US Eastern

Cheers,
- Ira
<= br>
Ira McDonald (Musician / Software Architect)=
Co-Chair - TCG Trusted Mobility Solutions WG
Chair - Linux Foundatio= n Open Printing WG
Secretary - IEEE-ISTO Printer Working Group
Co-Cha= ir - IEEE-ISTO PWG Internet Printing Protocol WG
IETF Designated Expert = - IPP & Printer MIB
Blue Roof Music / High North Inc
http://sites.google.com/site/blueroofmusic
http://sites.google.com/site/highnorthinc=
mailto: bl= ueroofmusic@gmail.com
Jan-April: 579 Park Place=C2=A0 Saline, MI=C2= =A0 48176=C2=A0 734-944-0094
May-Dec: PO Box 221=C2=A0 Grand Marais, MI = 49839=C2=A0 906-494-2434

=
--001a114453be9387b9053e130476-- --===============4462890195012588191== Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline _______________________________________________ ipp mailing list ipp@pwg.org https://www.pwg.org/mailman/listinfo/ipp --===============4462890195012588191==-- From ipp-bounces@pwg.org Tue Oct 4 18:10:13 2016 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ietfarch-ipp-archive@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: ietfarch-ipp-archive@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id BEA35129421 for ; Tue, 4 Oct 2016 18:10:13 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -4.786 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-4.786 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, HEADER_FROM_DIFFERENT_DOMAINS=0.001, RP_MATCHES_RCVD=-2.996, SPF_PASS=-0.001, T_DKIM_INVALID=0.01] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=fail (2048-bit key) reason="fail (message has been altered)" header.d=apple.com Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id ZYvb4K2da8Lj for ; Tue, 4 Oct 2016 18:10:12 -0700 (PDT) Received: from www.pwg.org (www.pwg.org [IPv6:2600:3c01::f03c:91ff:fe70:b03f]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 83BCF129415 for ; Tue, 4 Oct 2016 18:10:12 -0700 (PDT) Received: by www.pwg.org (Postfix, from userid 1002) id B67A34780; Wed, 5 Oct 2016 01:10:08 +0000 (UTC) Received: from www.pwg.org (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by www.pwg.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8C0E62626; Wed, 5 Oct 2016 01:10:05 +0000 (UTC) X-Original-To: ipp@pwg.org Delivered-To: ipp@pwg.org Received: by www.pwg.org (Postfix, from userid 1002) id D08AB415D; Wed, 5 Oct 2016 01:10:04 +0000 (UTC) Received: from mail-in7.apple.com (mail-out7.apple.com [17.151.62.29]) by www.pwg.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 8CF8A2BC for ; Wed, 5 Oct 2016 01:10:04 +0000 (UTC) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; d=apple.com; s=mailout2048s; c=relaxed/simple; q=dns/txt; i=@apple.com; t=1475629804; h=From:Sender:Reply-To:Subject:Date:Message-id:To:Cc:MIME-version:Content-type: Content-transfer-encoding:Content-ID:Content-Description:Resent-Date:Resent-From: Resent-Sender:Resent-To:Resent-Cc:Resent-Message-ID:In-reply-to:References:List-Id: List-Help:List-Unsubscribe:List-Subscribe:List-Post:List-Owner:List-Archive; bh=8W4WPpmZELbF52EghLLeOEcFU08gaag8Cq5r/lhh1d8=; b=Ix0jkv+YaNEljp5qbPh8Tpn30theywBd1U1EoQbi66OEN0d/R4GxrGjS6fPuYKZf lFEds9zl3ZF3kKiOklshB4UgEO90Ur5ter5K3MlanJ1DAlvKn0wRgXz3Z/U0BOqL v1UrvTVfXFUcGyqK4G2y/D7c7AsgwrGIKPJNOB82RLd2NnXuL+W2HE5pX1cVuJsd QyynPUOV2QMilLivWo9Cswvm3Vm6vrSajeBKHaEqDczQ0Bz76c62oOnoC2P1Uq4U VPBFZ96SKx/FTk5Ds4+w5rmJwBTmg3zSPHQ/gDSMWTpDOyoTmI3dPyD1QPZ0RpEp qQM55Z6/ETEmQ8bnrCl6dA==; Received: from relay6.apple.com (relay6.apple.com [17.128.113.90]) by mail-in7.apple.com (Apple Secure Mail Relay) with SMTP id EB.8D.07050.CE254F75; Tue, 4 Oct 2016 18:10:04 -0700 (PDT) X-AuditID: 11973e16-e7d8d9a000001b8a-70-57f452ecb641 Received: from chive.apple.com (chive.apple.com [17.128.115.15]) by relay6.apple.com (Apple SCV relay) with SMTP id AE.1A.23613.BE254F75; Tue, 4 Oct 2016 18:10:04 -0700 (PDT) MIME-version: 1.0 Received: from [17.153.38.218] by chive.apple.com (Oracle Communications Messaging Server 8.0.1.1.0 64bit (built Jun 15 2016)) with ESMTPSA id <0OEJ00FJYV8Q2320@chive.apple.com>; Tue, 04 Oct 2016 18:10:03 -0700 (PDT) From: Michael Sweet In-reply-to: <951C2F76-DC72-45E5-8300-0402C12BA3C2@hp.com> Date: Tue, 04 Oct 2016 21:10:01 -0400 Message-id: <5B46ACCB-4D08-4C34-8107-42F80AF8E343@apple.com> References: <951C2F76-DC72-45E5-8300-0402C12BA3C2@hp.com> To: Smith Kennedy X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.3226) X-Brightmail-Tracker: H4sIAAAAAAAAA+NgFtrJLMWRmVeSWpSXmKPExsUi2FAYpfsm6Eu4wYQubotj+16yWLzq2sXs wOSxa9tOJo95i6czBTBFcdmkpOZklqUW6dslcGVcmXqBtWAZe8WFFeENjC9Zuxg5OSQETCRW dj5i7GLk4hAS2Msosby9kQUm0bP3LVRiI6NE28J7TCAJXgFBiR+T7wEVcXAwC8hLHDwvCxJm FtCS+P6olQWi/h6jxM/P68DqhQUkJI73L2SFsNMknlxfxA5iswmoSfye1AcW5xSwkng5dTGY zSKgKrFk4gEWiKHyEg13rrBA7LWR2PhvFViNkIClxO+b7WDzRQQ0JD5MaWYDuUdCQFZi9i8v kBskBDawSbx78ZxxAqPwLCRnz0I4exaSsxcwMq9iFMpNzMzRzcwz10ssKMhJ1UvOz93ECArr 6XZiOxgfrrI6xCjAwajEw/tg6+dwIdbEsuLK3EOM0hwsSuK8HB+AQgLpiSWp2ampBalF8UWl OanFhxiZODilGhhNJxd7r/SIPrBThCFa/MH8PeUcsszz5IT2WvqI7Z/rNvvYoj9mR9ed0Xut +LDscfHvqRnnvxx0k/llEiY05YXnt8LzFod8D5Xy1Ezv4FE4rTTpzgkntXs6jb2mt9d1Tumf /0mW9a59yoy5b1ti527tei3ntq064P/duec2bau07eGQWNWkIrJViaU4I9FQi7moOBEAjeHa E0wCAAA= X-Brightmail-Tracker: H4sIAAAAAAAAA+NgFvrPLMWRmVeSWpSXmKPExsUi2FDMr/sm6Eu4wdECi2P7XrJYvOraxezA 5LFr204mj3mLpzMFMEVx2aSk5mSWpRbp2yVwZVyZeoG1YBl7xYUV4Q2ML1m7GDk5JARMJHr2 vmWEsMUkLtxbz9bFyMUhJLCRUaJt4T0mkASvgKDEj8n3WLoYOTiYBeQlDp6XBQkzC2hJfH/U ygJRf49R4ufndWD1wgISEsf7F7JC2GkST64vYgex2QTUJH5P6gOLcwpYSbycuhjMZhFQlVgy 8QALxFB5iYY7V1gg9tpIbPy3CqxGSMBS4vfNdrD5IgIaEh+mNLOB3CMhICsx+5fXBEbBWUgu nYVw6Swkly5gZF7FKFCUmpNYaaaXWFCQk6qXnJ+7iREcnIVROxgbllsdYhTgYFTi4e3Y/Dlc iDWxrLgy9xCjBAezkghvQcCXcCHelMTKqtSi/Pii0pzU4kOMyUDnT2SWEk3OB0ZOXkm8oYmJ gYmxsZmxsbmJOWnCSuK8uy9/ChcSSE8sSc1OTS1ILYLZwsTBKdXAKH1mJU/t15y3b9bZ1M/6 e2Rl/aTLTzKqK1tZ+x2n6oje3f5nzypRLtuJZz6mN9yuYmVnfjYje13s95pACQmepuaFvu3L 3Y9dFdvQYXX56s03Ma1zmmfaVd99O2Fa+3b/119V/8YLXzA/9YdT3HTymaXJW+fIiijqpskd LDUyuHK181eHRsL0KCWW4oxEQy3mouJEAN5vMPmSAgAA Cc: "ipp@pwg.org" Subject: Re: [IPP] "trimming-when" member attribute - why no keyword corresponding to 'no-trimming'? X-BeenThere: ipp@pwg.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15 Precedence: list List-Id: Internet Printing Protocol Workgroup discussion list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: ipp-bounces@pwg.org Sender: "ipp" Smith, If you don't want trimming done, you omit the trimming collection. > On Oct 4, 2016, at 5:19 PM, Kennedy, Smith (Wireless Architect) wrote: > > Hi there, > > In Finishings 2.0 / 2.1, the "trimming-when" member attribute has 4 keywords defined 'after-documents', 'after-job', 'after-sets', and 'after-sheets'. But what keyword would the user provide if they don't want the paper cut at all? > > Smith > > /** > Smith Kennedy > Wireless Architect - Client Software - IPG-PPS > Standards - IEEE ISTO PWG / Bluetooth SIG / Wi-Fi Alliance / NFC Forum / USB IF > Chair, IEEE ISTO Printer Working Group > HP Inc. > */ > > > > _______________________________________________ > ipp mailing list > ipp@pwg.org > https://www.pwg.org/mailman/listinfo/ipp _________________________________________________________ Michael Sweet, Senior Printing System Engineer _______________________________________________ ipp mailing list ipp@pwg.org https://www.pwg.org/mailman/listinfo/ipp From ipp-bounces@pwg.org Tue Oct 4 20:31:38 2016 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ietfarch-ipp-archive@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: ietfarch-ipp-archive@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7A5151293E0 for ; Tue, 4 Oct 2016 20:31:38 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -4.896 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-4.896 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, HEADER_FROM_DIFFERENT_DOMAINS=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE=-0.0001, RP_MATCHES_RCVD=-2.996, SPF_PASS=-0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id nHwz74DoUmYd for ; Tue, 4 Oct 2016 20:31:36 -0700 (PDT) Received: from www.pwg.org (www.pwg.org [50.116.7.199]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id BF7A3128874 for ; Tue, 4 Oct 2016 20:31:36 -0700 (PDT) Received: by www.pwg.org (Postfix, from userid 1002) id 6017F4880; Wed, 5 Oct 2016 03:31:33 +0000 (UTC) Received: from www.pwg.org (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by www.pwg.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9ADF72626; Wed, 5 Oct 2016 03:31:29 +0000 (UTC) X-Original-To: ipp@pwg.org Delivered-To: ipp@pwg.org Received: by www.pwg.org (Postfix, from userid 1002) id A1A6A415D; Wed, 5 Oct 2016 03:31:27 +0000 (UTC) Received: from NAM01-SN1-obe.outbound.protection.outlook.com (mail-sn1nam01on0731.outbound.protection.outlook.com [IPv6:2a01:111:f400:fe40::731]) by www.pwg.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 28D2F2BC for ; Wed, 5 Oct 2016 03:31:27 +0000 (UTC) Received: from DF4PR84MB0284.NAMPRD84.PROD.OUTLOOK.COM (10.162.193.22) by DF4PR84MB0284.NAMPRD84.PROD.OUTLOOK.COM (10.162.193.22) with Microsoft SMTP Server (version=TLS1_2, cipher=TLS_ECDHE_RSA_WITH_AES_256_CBC_SHA384_P384) id 15.1.649.16; Wed, 5 Oct 2016 03:31:05 +0000 Received: from DF4PR84MB0284.NAMPRD84.PROD.OUTLOOK.COM ([10.162.193.22]) by DF4PR84MB0284.NAMPRD84.PROD.OUTLOOK.COM ([10.162.193.22]) with mapi id 15.01.0649.021; Wed, 5 Oct 2016 03:31:05 +0000 From: "Kennedy, Smith (Wireless Architect)" To: Michael Sweet Thread-Topic: [IPP] "trimming-when" member attribute - why no keyword corresponding to 'no-trimming'? Thread-Index: AQHSHoT/ogjXHu4pp0a/Mfevav4bQKCZDVqAgAAnaoA= Date: Wed, 5 Oct 2016 03:31:05 +0000 Message-ID: <641E786A-1D02-4F6D-93CB-8457CBC48A84@hp.com> References: <951C2F76-DC72-45E5-8300-0402C12BA3C2@hp.com> <5B46ACCB-4D08-4C34-8107-42F80AF8E343@apple.com> In-Reply-To: <5B46ACCB-4D08-4C34-8107-42F80AF8E343@apple.com> Accept-Language: en-US Content-Language: en-US X-MS-Has-Attach: yes X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: authentication-results: spf=none (sender IP is ) smtp.mailfrom=smith.kennedy@hp.com; x-ms-exchange-messagesentrepresentingtype: 1 x-originating-ip: [75.174.42.172] x-ms-office365-filtering-correlation-id: 3cdf6d44-b5d6-4895-2cf9-08d3ecd00a2a x-microsoft-exchange-diagnostics: 1; DF4PR84MB0284; 6:JcSlwnv/lIIwqpyxte2q0QRXACzFbaCIhyzhh3TwFDqtE1d+/vfeq5cdN90OQUGxRzqxKW0nRc26UnTsQdbj5uaYeOMZkOCIJNSaR7D4TOl2wcx+RYWZex2gggYvyBrKheiDv15dU5UM7JK6859n5SOVR7Vn/MdNQE9bbnVRG+SXbnKyAwn1jfas9HrjuMKkWXf4C/txjCu3OrZ8SCkUb2BS9mLb9gILaSFVETz+yrTA+nOmEL5rEZu4U1XCrHLR/l+APV9cxD2vJIxLm65+NDQ2h4SqOmE5kFGjoRwsEqxNQrWi4PTb8Jz4awXWiAKa; 5:cHbzzFfXBvcqBnuEwKzxS2EEyK9Dzt20R3yVLNyIaIOuXzusgLD3UtzNubqSjeQYrybaCsGzzKnrCaz4GXMIHYe64W0wHq2JVBaXJoIXkQdXHIHfshD6oTJDJ5gIgycWzVGgw2rs6vz/IKgsqCPzJG3WoQFu1JjEH600LC7TP28=; 24:rzq4fa4tyix2NlhgiK+uoMPxm94Z26NSCy0T2L1HmIvbl4UsMSDRzf8nL1+xjVEppvdmx0cu/XgNkaP9RIwN7JEMCSrdeIo08Iig9x/LPLQ=; 7:aRX4bJxfLQjWOaarK+soQdyKWveK4QVr+6Ac6X7qGI261oN0Ig1ZLcpHzVjshPHB9ncoEMVJOM4aMQjB7dGKVKmKMYaWmNVq4EVK1EbSbVZowr8JTDbvtE0FQ1bvXziaENF4I9y5FQfelBSBhI8e6mmHmj60cW8aB2gzZ+b1KJsgPicJ0Qcke7fY2uXVkwxFcCQeQ6p7lHEyukTXw6jqBvByj6Sms955OiFfbA85aR4x6QvOgqZgR6nmP4Za6/xabDEQVVvVJE05EuYFI2ryfnU4U7XOw/p2KZyDQoNdbvxPhtJoeWv1OQ1vTX2gyMy3cYbnkLjvdvmgALF8E8VgIg== x-microsoft-antispam: UriScan:;BCL:0;PCL:0;RULEID:;SRVR:DF4PR84MB0284; x-microsoft-antispam-prvs: x-exchange-antispam-report-test: UriScan:(31960201722614)(73583498263828); x-exchange-antispam-report-cfa-test: BCL:0; PCL:0; RULEID:(102415321)(6040176)(601004)(2401047)(8121501046)(5005006)(10201501046)(3002001); SRVR:DF4PR84MB0284; BCL:0; PCL:0; RULEID:; SRVR:DF4PR84MB0284; x-forefront-prvs: 008663486A x-forefront-antispam-report: SFV:NSPM; SFS:(10019020)(6009001)(7916002)(6602003)(199003)(377454003)(24454002)(189002)(101416001)(5002640100001)(76176999)(6116002)(3846002)(102836003)(586003)(99936001)(66066001)(7736002)(2906002)(92566002)(50986999)(10400500002)(305945005)(110136003)(97736004)(122556002)(5660300001)(8666005)(7846002)(4326007)(54356999)(6916009)(2950100002)(2900100001)(105586002)(15975445007)(106356001)(99286002)(189998001)(8936002)(106116001)(11100500001)(81166006)(81156014)(82746002)(77096005)(68736007)(83716003)(8676002)(19580395003)(36756003)(19580405001)(3280700002)(33656002)(3660700001)(86362001)(87936001)(7059030)(104396002); DIR:OUT; SFP:1102; SCL:1; SRVR:DF4PR84MB0284; H:DF4PR84MB0284.NAMPRD84.PROD.OUTLOOK.COM; FPR:; SPF:None; PTR:InfoNoRecords; A:1; MX:1; LANG:en; received-spf: None (protection.outlook.com: hp.com does not designate permitted sender hosts) spamdiagnosticoutput: 1:99 spamdiagnosticmetadata: NSPM MIME-Version: 1.0 X-OriginatorOrg: hp.com X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-originalarrivaltime: 05 Oct 2016 03:31:05.5509 (UTC) X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-fromentityheader: Hosted X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-id: ca7981a2-785a-463d-b82a-3db87dfc3ce6 X-MS-Exchange-Transport-CrossTenantHeadersStamped: DF4PR84MB0284 Cc: "ipp@pwg.org" Subject: Re: [IPP] "trimming-when" member attribute - why no keyword corresponding to 'no-trimming'? X-BeenThere: ipp@pwg.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15 Precedence: list List-Id: Internet Printing Protocol Workgroup discussion list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="===============8529424421311137623==" Errors-To: ipp-bounces@pwg.org Sender: "ipp" --===============8529424421311137623== Content-Language: en-US Content-Type: multipart/signed; boundary="Apple-Mail=_5053DE72-1A55-48F4-BA97-97F7EF5B0356"; protocol="application/pkcs7-signature"; micalg=sha1 --Apple-Mail=_5053DE72-1A55-48F4-BA97-97F7EF5B0356 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Hi Mike, That won't work if the printer has the following, right? (Taken from = ipptool output and slightly reformatted) finishings-col-default =3D { finishing-template=3Dafter-sheets trimming-type=3Dfull trimming-offset=3D500 trimming-when=3Dafter-sheets trimming-reference-edge=3Dbottom } I guess a Client could send "finishings" =3D 'none' and not include = "finishings-col". Is that how the Client is expected to disable trimming = in this case? Smith > On Oct 4, 2016, at 7:10 PM, Michael Sweet wrote: >=20 > Smith, >=20 > If you don't want trimming done, you omit the trimming collection. >=20 >> On Oct 4, 2016, at 5:19 PM, Kennedy, Smith (Wireless Architect) = wrote: >>=20 >> Hi there, >>=20 >> In Finishings 2.0 / 2.1, the "trimming-when" member attribute has 4 = keywords defined 'after-documents', 'after-job', 'after-sets', and = 'after-sheets'. But what keyword would the user provide if they don't = want the paper cut at all? >>=20 >> Smith >>=20 >> /** >> Smith Kennedy >> Wireless Architect - Client Software - IPG-PPS >> Standards - IEEE ISTO PWG / Bluetooth SIG / Wi-Fi Alliance / NFC = Forum / USB IF >> Chair, IEEE ISTO Printer Working Group >> HP Inc. >> */ >>=20 >>=20 >>=20 >> _______________________________________________ >> ipp mailing list >> ipp@pwg.org >> https://www.pwg.org/mailman/listinfo/ipp >=20 > _________________________________________________________ > Michael Sweet, Senior Printing System Engineer >=20 --Apple-Mail=_5053DE72-1A55-48F4-BA97-97F7EF5B0356 Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="smime.p7s" Content-Type: application/pkcs7-signature; name="smime.p7s" Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64 MIAGCSqGSIb3DQEHAqCAMIACAQExCzAJBgUrDgMCGgUAMIAGCSqGSIb3DQEHAQAAoIIOQDCCBmEw ggVJoAMCAQICEDtXE7awITX7XkZ1ymyyxOEwDQYJKoZIhvcNAQEFBQAwgcoxCzAJBgNVBAYTAlVT 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03:43:03 +0000 From: "Kennedy, Smith (Wireless Architect)" To: Ira McDonald Thread-Topic: [IPP] IPP WG Agenda 1-3 US Eastern (5 October 2016) Thread-Index: AQHSHp0whPXLqvDmLk+QZ1EKbL5wIaCZN+yA Date: Wed, 5 Oct 2016 03:43:03 +0000 Message-ID: <213CE484-ADE4-4F53-91B9-40BAB0A977BA@hp.com> References: In-Reply-To: Accept-Language: en-US Content-Language: en-US X-MS-Has-Attach: yes X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: authentication-results: spf=none (sender IP is ) smtp.mailfrom=smith.kennedy@hp.com; x-ms-exchange-messagesentrepresentingtype: 1 x-originating-ip: [75.174.42.172] x-ms-office365-filtering-correlation-id: cdecfb46-9073-414d-5f2f-08d3ecd1b63e x-microsoft-exchange-diagnostics: 1; DF4PR84MB0281; 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MIME-Version: 1.0 X-OriginatorOrg: hp.com X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-originalarrivaltime: 05 Oct 2016 03:43:03.8702 (UTC) X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-fromentityheader: Hosted X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-id: ca7981a2-785a-463d-b82a-3db87dfc3ce6 X-MS-Exchange-Transport-CrossTenantHeadersStamped: DF4PR84MB0281 Cc: "ipp@pwg.org" Subject: Re: [IPP] IPP WG Agenda 1-3 US Eastern (5 October 2016) X-BeenThere: ipp@pwg.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15 Precedence: list List-Id: Internet Printing Protocol Workgroup discussion list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="===============3719309641141860310==" Errors-To: ipp-bounces@pwg.org Sender: "ipp" --===============3719309641141860310== Content-Language: en-US Content-Type: multipart/signed; boundary="Apple-Mail=_44A88E8F-2C10-4715-A9D3-DE84A1FBF638"; protocol="application/pkcs7-signature"; micalg=sha1 --Apple-Mail=_44A88E8F-2C10-4715-A9D3-DE84A1FBF638 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="Apple-Mail=_1F568AA1-EFFF-4747-A888-AC42E75DC1A5" --Apple-Mail=_1F568AA1-EFFF-4747-A888-AC42E75DC1A5 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Greetings, With the schedule change, the WebEx URL for the IPP WG meetings I am now = seeing in WebEx is different from the one we have used in the past - = here is the new one: = https://ieee-isto.webex.com/ieee-isto/j.php?MTID=3Dm0359478143ca01e059a570= ada91f3573 = I'm guessing it was changed when I rescheduled it for its new time. Smith /** Smith Kennedy Wireless Architect - Client Software - IPG-PPS Standards - IEEE ISTO PWG / Bluetooth SIG / Wi-Fi Alliance / NFC = Forum / USB IF Chair, IEEE ISTO Printer Working Group HP Inc. */ > On Oct 4, 2016, at 6:11 PM, Ira McDonald = wrote: >=20 > Hi, >=20 > [Note: New Day/Time]=20 >=20 > Our next IPP WG call will be Wednesday 5 October 2016 at=20 > 10am-12pm US Pacific / 1pm-3pm US Eastern >=20 > Call-in toll-free number (US/Canada): 1-866-469-3239 = > Call-in toll number (US/Canada): 1-650-429-3300 = (Primary) > Call-in toll number (US/Canada): 1-408-856-9570 = (Backup) >=20 > Attendee Access Code: *******# > Attendee ID Code: # (empty) >=20 > NOTE: Please DO NOT USE the audio bridge number listed by WebEx > - instead use the regular PWG conference bridge listed above! >=20 > ------------------------------------------------------- > Meeting information > ------------------------------------------------------- > Topic: IPP WG > Date: Wednesday, from 5 October 2016 to no end date > Time: 1:00 pm, Eastern Daylight Time (New York, GMT-04:00) > Meeting Number: 682 763 393 > Meeting Password: Printing123 > ------------------------------------------------------- > To join the online meeting (Now from mobile devices!) > ------------------------------------------------------- > 1. Go to = https://ieee-isto.webex.com/ieee-isto/e.php?MTID=3Dm123b376f8d9bdc7d9ff0ff= 43ed7d1610 = > 2. If requested, enter your name and email address. > 3. If a password is required, enter the meeting password: Printing123 > 4. Click "Join". >=20 > ------------------------------------------------------- > For assistance > ------------------------------------------------------- > 1. Go to https://ieee-isto.webex.com/ieee-isto/mc = > 2. On the left navigation bar, click "Support". > ------------------------------------------------------- >=20 > Agenda: > (1) PWG IP Policy, Minute Taker, and Agenda Review > - Mike as minute taker? >=20 > (2) Approve IPP minutes from previous meetings > - = http://ftp.pwg.org/pub/pwg/ipp/minutes/ippv2-concall-minutes-20160926.pdf = > -- IPP WG call on 09/26/16 >=20 > (3) Status of various IPP documents (Ira/Mike/Smith) > * IETF IPP/1.1 Updates (Mike/Ira) > - http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-sweet-rfc2910bis-10.txt = > - http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-sweet-rfc2911bis-11.txt = = > -- changes for new IETF Proposed Standards > -- Alexey Melnikov (IETF ART AD) as AD sponsor on 06/02/16 > -- RFC2910bis & RFC 2911bis - IETF Approved as Proposed Standards! > -- waiting on RFC Editor AUTH-48 phase for several minor edits > -- Schedule - IPP/1.1 RFCs published in Q4 2016 >=20 > (4) Registration for "output-bin" value 'auto' (Mike) > - http://www.pwg.org/archives/ipp/2016/018950.html = > -- proposed on mailing list >=20 > (5) Why are only some dateTime attributes allowed to specify = 'no-value'? (Smith/Mike) > - http://www.pwg.org/archives/ipp/2016/018953.html = > -- discussed on mailing list > -- may impact RFC2911bis in AUTH-48 phase? >=20 > (6) Required RTC prevents System Service use by some Printers = (Ira/Bill/Mike) > - http://www.pwg.org/archives/ipp/2016/018956.html = > -- discussed on mailing list > -- may impact RFC2911bis in AUTH-48 phase? >=20 > (7) Proposed System Service operations for Printers w/ Resources = (Ira/Bill/Pete) > - http://www.pwg.org/archives/ipp/2016/018964.html = > -- discussed on mailing list > -- [Allocate|Deallocate]-Printer-Resources > -- see new IPP System Service draft from 10/04/16 >=20 > (8) "trimming-when" - why no keyword corresponding to 'no-trimming'? = (Smith/Daniel/Rick) > - http://www.pwg.org/archives/ipp/2016/018972.html = > -- discussed on mailing list >=20 > (9) [PWG5100.13] Issue #50: Section 1.2 "Coloring" should be renamed = to no longer use "Coloring" - perhaps "Filtering"? (Smith) > - http://www.pwg.org/archives/ipp/2016/018974.htm = l >=20 > (10) Review of IPP 3D Printing Extensions (Mike) > - http://ftp.pwg.org/pub/pwg/ipp/wd/wd-ipp3d10-20160824-rev.pdf = > -- Prototype draft > -- Reviewed by IPP WG on 09/19/16 and 09/26/16 > -- Mike to provide additional prototyping feedback > -- Schedule - PWG Last Call in Q4 2016 >=20 > (11) Review of IPP Finishings 2.1 (Smith) > - = http://ftp.pwg.org/pub/pwg/ipp/wd/wd-ippfinishings21-20161004-rev.pdf = > -- Stable draft > -- IPP WG Last Call on 08/22/16 to 09/06/16 > -- Reviewed by IPP WG on 09/19/16 > -- Schedule - PWG Call for Objections in Q4 2016 >=20 > (12) Review of IPP System Service (Ira/Mike) > - http://ftp.pwg.org/pub/pwg/ipp/wd/wd-ippsystem10-20161004-rev.pdf = > -- Interim draft > -- Reviewed by IPP WG on 09/19/16 > -- Stopped at beginning of section 6 operations > -- Schedule - Prototype draft in Q4 2016 / Q1 2017 >=20 > (13) Next steps > - IPP WG call on Wed 19 October 2016 at 1-3pm US Eastern > - IPP WG call on Wed 2 November 2016 at 1-3pm US Eastern >=20 > Cheers, > - Ira >=20 > Ira McDonald (Musician / Software Architect) > Co-Chair - TCG Trusted Mobility Solutions WG > Chair - Linux Foundation Open Printing WG > Secretary - IEEE-ISTO Printer Working Group > Co-Chair - IEEE-ISTO PWG Internet Printing Protocol WG > IETF Designated Expert - IPP & Printer MIB > Blue Roof Music / High North Inc > http://sites.google.com/site/blueroofmusic = > http://sites.google.com/site/highnorthinc = > mailto: blueroofmusic@gmail.com > Jan-April: 579 Park Place Saline, MI 48176 734-944-0094 = > May-Dec: PO Box 221 Grand Marais, MI 49839 906-494-2434 = >=20 > _______________________________________________ > ipp mailing list > ipp@pwg.org > https://www.pwg.org/mailman/listinfo/ipp --Apple-Mail=_1F568AA1-EFFF-4747-A888-AC42E75DC1A5 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Type: text/html; charset=us-ascii Greetings,

With the schedule change, the WebEx URL for the IPP WG = meetings I am now seeing in WebEx is different from the one we have used = in the past - here is the new one:

https://ieee-isto.webex.com/ieee-isto/j.php?MTID=3Dm0359478143c= a01e059a570ada91f3573

I'm guessing it was changed when I rescheduled it for its new = time.

Smith

/**
    Smith = Kennedy
    Wireless Architect - Client Software = - IPG-PPS
    Standards - IEEE ISTO PWG / = Bluetooth SIG / Wi-Fi Alliance / NFC Forum / USB IF
    Chair, IEEE ISTO Printer Working Group
    HP Inc.
*/



On Oct 4, 2016, at 6:11 PM, Ira McDonald <blueroofmusic@gmail.com> wrote:

Hi,

[Note:  New = Day/Time]

Our next = IPP WG call will be Wednesday 5 October = 2016 at
10am-12pm US Pacific / 1pm-3pm US Eastern

Call-in toll-free number (US/Canada): 1-866-469-3239
Call-in toll number (US/Canada): 1-650-429-3300 = (Primary)
Call-in toll number (US/Canada): 1-408-856-9570 = (Backup)

Attendee Access Code: *******#
Attendee ID Code: # (empty)

NOTE:  = Please DO NOT USE the audio bridge number listed by WebEx
- instead use the regular PWG conference bridge listed above!

------------------------------------------------------- Meeting information
-------------------------------------------------------Topic: IPP  WG
Date: Wednesday, from 5 October 2016 to no end date
Time: 1:00 pm, Eastern Daylight Time (New York, GMT-04:00)
Meeting Number: 682 763 393
Meeting Password: Printing123
------------------------------------------------------- To join the online meeting (Now from mobile devices!)
------------------------------------------------------- 1. Go to https://ieee-isto.webex.com/ieee-isto/e.php?MTID=3Dm123b376f8d9bdc7d9ff0ff43ed7d1610
2. If requested, enter your name and email address.
3. If a password is required, enter the meeting password: Printing123
4. Click "Join".

------------------------------------------------------- For assistance
------------------------------------------------------- 1. Go to https://ieee-isto.webex.com/ieee-isto/mc 2. On the left navigation bar, click "Support".
-------------------------------------------------------
Agenda:
(1) PWG IP Policy, Minute Taker, and Agenda Review
- Mike as minute taker?

(2) Approve IPP minutes from previous meetings
- http://ftp.pwg.org/pub/pwg/ipp/minutes/ippv2-concall-minutes-20160926.pdf
-- = IPP WG call on = 09/26/16

(3) Status of various IPP documents = (Ira/Mike/Smith)
* IETF IPP/1.1 Updates (Mike/Ira)
- http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-sweet-rfc2910bis-10.txt
- http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-sweet-rfc2911bis-11.txt
--= changes for new IETF Proposed Standards
-- Alexey Melnikov (IETF ART AD) as AD sponsor on 06/02/16
-- RFC2910bis & = RFC 2911bis - IETF Approved as Proposed Standards!
-- waiting on RFC Editor AUTH-48 phase = for several minor edits
-- Schedule = - IPP/1.1 RFCs = published in Q4 2016

(4) Registration for "output-bin" value = 'auto' (Mike)
- http://www.pwg.org/archives/ipp/2016/018950.html
-- = proposed on mailing list

(5) Why are only some dateTime attributes = allowed to specify 'no-value'? (Smith/Mike)
- http://www.pwg.org/archives/ipp/2016/018953.html
-- discussed on mailing list
-- may impact RFC2911bis in AUTH-48 phase?

(6) Required RTC prevents System = Service use by some Printers (Ira/Bill/Mike)
- http://www.pwg.org/archives/ipp/2016/018956.html
-- = discussed on mailing list
-- may impact RFC2911bis in = AUTH-48 phase?

(7) = Proposed System Service operations for Printers w/ Resources = (Ira/Bill/Pete)
- http://www.pwg.org/archives/ipp/2016/018964.html
-- discussed on mailing = list
-- = [Allocate|Deallocate]-Printer-Resources
-- see new IPP System Service draft from 10/04/16

(8) "trimming-when" - why no keyword = corresponding to 'no-trimming'? (Smith/Daniel/Rick)
- http://www.pwg.org/archives/ipp/2016/018972.html
-- = discussed on mailing list

(9) [PWG5100.13] = Issue #50: Section 1.2 "Coloring" should be renamed to no longer use = "Coloring" - perhaps "Filtering"? (Smith)
- http://www.pwg.org/archives/ipp/2016/018974.html

(10) Review of IPP 3D Printing = Extensions (Mike)
- http://ftp.pwg.org/pub/pwg/ipp/wd/wd-ipp3d10-20160824-rev.pdf
-- Prototype draft
-- Reviewed by IPP WG on = 09/19/16 and 09/26/16
-- Mike to = provide additional prototyping feedback
-- Schedule - PWG Last Call in = Q4 2016

(11) Review of IPP Finishings = 2.1 (Smith)
- http://ftp.pwg.org/pub/pwg/ipp/wd/wd-ippfinishings21-20161004-rev.pdf
-- Stable draft
-- IPP WG Last Call = on 08/22/16 to 09/06/16
-- Reviewed by IPP WG on = 09/19/16
-- Schedule - PWG Call for = Objections in Q4 2016

(12) Review of IPP System Service (Ira/Mike)
- http://ftp.pwg.org/pub/pwg/ipp/wd/wd-ippsystem10-20161004-rev.pdf
-- Interim draft
-- Reviewed by IPP WG on = 09/19/16
-- Stopped = at beginning of section 6 operations
-- Schedule - = Prototype draft in Q4 2016 / Q1 2017

(13) = Next steps
- IPP WG call on Wed 19 = October 2016 at 1-3pm US Eastern
- IPP WG call on = Wed 2 November 2016 at 1-3pm US Eastern

Cheers,
- Ira

Ira McDonald = (Musician / Software Architect)
Co-Chair - TCG Trusted = Mobility Solutions WG
Chair - Linux Foundation Open = Printing WG
Secretary - IEEE-ISTO Printer Working Group
Co-Chair - IEEE-ISTO PWG Internet Printing Protocol WG
IETF Designated Expert - IPP & Printer MIB
Blue Roof Music / High North Inc
http://sites.google.com/site/blueroofmusic
http://sites.google.com/site/highnorthinc
mailto: blueroofmusic@gmail.com
Jan-April: 579 Park = Place  Saline, MI  48176  734-944-0094
May-Dec: PO Box 221  Grand Marais, MI 49839  906-494-2434

_______________________________________________
ipp = mailing list
ipp@pwg.org
https://www.pwg.org/mailman/listinfo/ipp

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Oct 2016 05:40:28.3938 (UTC) X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-fromentityheader: Hosted X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-id: ca7981a2-785a-463d-b82a-3db87dfc3ce6 X-MS-Exchange-Transport-CrossTenantHeadersStamped: DF4PR84MB0282 Subject: Re: [IPP] IPP Finishings 2.1: New draft posted X-BeenThere: ipp@pwg.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15 Precedence: list List-Id: Internet Printing Protocol Workgroup discussion list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="===============7372711533498156430==" Errors-To: ipp-bounces@pwg.org Sender: "ipp" --===============7372711533498156430== Content-Language: en-US Content-Type: multipart/signed; boundary="Apple-Mail=_FBBD0C3E-6E4D-4170-8E92-DE0757E2D7AD"; protocol="application/pkcs7-signature"; micalg=sha1 --Apple-Mail=_FBBD0C3E-6E4D-4170-8E92-DE0757E2D7AD Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Greetings again, I have reposted it with one small change: > * make the resolution either use "short-edge-feed" or to change the = media=20 > source to 'tray-1' (usually a manual feed input source, at least on = HP > printers) where the user might be instructed via a prompt to = provide the > needed media size and feed orientation. Now the "job-resolvers-supported" example lists 'manual' as an alternate = "media-source". As it was before the end of the day, I didn't roll the = release date. Smith /** Smith Kennedy Wireless Architect - Client Software - IPG-PPS Standards - IEEE ISTO PWG / Bluetooth SIG / Wi-Fi Alliance / NFC = Forum / USB IF Chair, IEEE ISTO Printer Working Group HP Inc. */ > On Oct 4, 2016, at 12:33 PM, Kennedy, Smith (Wireless Architect) = wrote: >=20 > Greetings, >=20 > I have just posted another new draft of IPP Finishings 2.1: >=20 > http://ftp.pwg.org/pub/pwg/ipp/wd/wd-ippfinishings21-20161004.pdf > http://ftp.pwg.org/pub/pwg/ipp/wd/wd-ippfinishings21-20161004.docx > = http://ftp.pwg.org/pub/pwg/ipp/wd/wd-ippfinishings21-20161004-rev.pdf > = http://ftp.pwg.org/pub/pwg/ipp/wd/wd-ippfinishings21-20161004-rev.docx >=20 > Changes include: >=20 > * In section 5.3 , enhanced definition of "job-pages-per-set" to = clarify that > the value needs to be an exact multiple of the number of pages in all > Documents in the Job, which also clarifies the expectations of how = that > attribute value is set in the case of a multiple document Job. >=20 > * Modified the "job-constraints-supported" attribute example at the = end of > section 6.9: >=20 > * Removed mention of "media-source"=3D'tray-2' because the input = source doesn't > matter. >=20 > * Added a second value to "finishings" and "finishing-template" so = that the=20 > example illustrates that attributes in a constraint can have more = than one > value even when the attribute itself is defined to have only one = value. Also=20 > called this out with an additional sentence below the example. >=20 > * Moved open curly braces to the same line as the equal sign to = reduce number=20 > of lines used >=20 > * Modified the "job-resolvers-supported" attribute example at the end = of section=20 > 6.9: >=20 > * make the resolution either use "short-edge-feed" or to change the = media=20 > source to 'tray-1' (usually a manual feed input source, at least on = HP > printers) where the user might be instructed via a prompt to = provide the > needed media size and feed orientation. >=20 > * Moved open curly braces to the same line as the equal sign to = reduce number=20 > of lines used >=20 > * Removed mention of alternate stitching angles because they don't = resolve the=20 > problem >=20 > Cheers, >=20 > Smith >=20 > /** > Smith Kennedy > Wireless Architect - Client Software - IPG-PPS > Standards - IEEE ISTO PWG / Bluetooth SIG / Wi-Fi Alliance / NFC = Forum / USB IF > Chair, IEEE ISTO Printer Working Group > HP Inc. > */ >=20 >=20 >=20 > _______________________________________________ > ipp mailing list > ipp@pwg.org > https://www.pwg.org/mailman/listinfo/ipp --Apple-Mail=_FBBD0C3E-6E4D-4170-8E92-DE0757E2D7AD Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="smime.p7s" Content-Type: application/pkcs7-signature; name="smime.p7s" Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64 MIAGCSqGSIb3DQEHAqCAMIACAQExCzAJBgUrDgMCGgUAMIAGCSqGSIb3DQEHAQAAoIIOQDCCBmEw ggVJoAMCAQICEDtXE7awITX7XkZ1ymyyxOEwDQYJKoZIhvcNAQEFBQAwgcoxCzAJBgNVBAYTAlVT MRcwFQYDVQQKEw5WZXJpU2lnbiwgSW5jLjEfMB0GA1UECxMWVmVyaVNpZ24gVHJ1c3QgTmV0d29y azE6MDgGA1UECxMxKGMpIDE5OTkgVmVyaVNpZ24sIEluYy4gLSBGb3IgYXV0aG9yaXplZCB1c2Ug b25seTFFMEMGA1UEAxM8VmVyaVNpZ24gQ2xhc3MgMiBQdWJsaWMgUHJpbWFyeSBDZXJ0aWZpY2F0 aW9uIEF1dGhvcml0eSAtIEczMB4XDTA5MDkwMjAwMDAwMFoXDTE5MDkwMTIzNTk1OVowgfcxCzAJ BgNVBAYTAlVTMSAwHgYDVQQKExdIZXdsZXR0LVBhY2thcmQgQ29tcGFueTEfMB0GA1UECxMWVmVy aVNpZ24gVHJ1c3QgTmV0d29yazE7MDkGA1UECxMyVGVybXMgb2YgdXNlIGF0IGh0dHBzOi8vd3d3 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v0gcx3sKpuXf7KSypqwHTSRZVvTl8XrM+wyoSZj2NHhhjsaFybTqtg0Ys6xzHy1p fbjQzrQHSjfXYvM8Ya9YuA==; Received: from relay2.apple.com (relay2.apple.com [17.128.113.67]) by mail-in4.apple.com (Apple Secure Mail Relay) with SMTP id 3A.19.07001.D19D4F75; Wed, 5 Oct 2016 03:42:37 -0700 (PDT) X-AuditID: 11973e12-23e0e9a000001b59-1c-57f4d91da049 Received: from haralson.apple.com (haralson.apple.com [17.171.2.64]) by relay2.apple.com (Apple SCV relay) with SMTP id FC.C4.09148.D19D4F75; Wed, 5 Oct 2016 03:42:37 -0700 (PDT) MIME-version: 1.0 Received: from [10.0.1.95] (67-204-239-251.eastlink.ca [67.204.239.251]) by haralson.apple.com (Oracle Communications Messaging Server 8.0.1.1.0 64bit (built Jun 15 2016)) with ESMTPSA id <0OEK009RDLPEW000@haralson.apple.com>; Wed, 05 Oct 2016 03:41:39 -0700 (PDT) From: Michael Sweet X-Mailer: iPad Mail (14A403) In-reply-to: <641E786A-1D02-4F6D-93CB-8457CBC48A84@hp.com> Date: Wed, 05 Oct 2016 06:42:35 -0400 Message-id: <25F84A14-522B-4821-A39A-A2B0AB7D9CD6@apple.com> References: <951C2F76-DC72-45E5-8300-0402C12BA3C2@hp.com> <5B46ACCB-4D08-4C34-8107-42F80AF8E343@apple.com> <641E786A-1D02-4F6D-93CB-8457CBC48A84@hp.com> To: "Kennedy, Smith (Wireless Architect)" X-Brightmail-Tracker: H4sIAAAAAAAAA+NgFrrKLMWRmVeSWpSXmKPExsUi2FDorCt780u4wdtNphbH9r1ksXjVtYvZ gclj17adTB7zFk9nCmCK4rJJSc3JLEst0rdL4Mr4N+UsY8Fjq4rTj5+xNTDeM+li5OSQEDCR +LJpEnsXIxeHkMBeRomX71+ywyRm7TvBCpHYyijRumQ9M0iCV0BQ4sfkeywgNrNAmMSfxV1Q 3ROYJL7N6QLrFhaQkDjev5AVwk6TeHJ9EVicTUBN4vekPlaIDTISG54cZQSxOQWsJF7PWMYG YrMIqEpcP9nGDrFAXqLhzhUWiMU2EofOH2SBWDaHUeLCnVtgCREBB4nnSz6BJSQELrNJzOnr ZZvAKDQLybWzkFwLYWtJfH/UChTnAFty8LwsRFhT4tm9T1Al2hJP3l1gXcDItopRKDcxM0c3 M89EL7GgICdVLzk/dxMjKB6m2wntYDy1yuoQowAHoxIPb8fmz+FCrIllxZW5hxilOViUxHlZ PwCFBNITS1KzU1MLUovii0pzUosPMTJxcEo1MDLkL2eoj59W4f1Kfp/X5PV3JJY6dWqcTrc+ vdpNeofsAfV1SQyPsr4s4H+RYfLv0bUn14KS1+Txmggz3f5oU1zkvmqGrVtzqravYNc59o+y Fe4CBnbZocdV7qvO0fef7yjq+nC2X8q3Y1yhO98tZW4tscvez9TH/jjmkf7LBb/E3FokRHNO KbEUZyQaajEXFScCAHUBgxtoAgAA X-Brightmail-Tracker: H4sIAAAAAAAAA+NgFjrNIsWRmVeSWpSXmKPExsUiuJrJQVf25pdwg39rNC2O7XvJYvGqaxez A5PHrm07mTzmLZ7OFMAUxWWTkpqTWZZapG+XwJXxb8pZxoLHVhWnHz9ja2C8Z9LFyMkhIWAi MWvfCVYIW0ziwr31bF2MXBxCAlsZJVqXrGcGSfAKCEr8mHyPBcRmFgiT+LO4ix2iaAKTxLc5 IA4nh7CAhMTx/oWsEHaaxJPri8DibAJqEr8n9UFtkJHY8OQoI4jNKWAl8XrGMjYQm0VAVeL6 yTZ2iAXyEg13rrBALLaROHT+IAvEsjmMEhfu3AJLiAg4SDxf8ollAqPALCQHzkJyIIStJfH9 UStQnANs7sHzshBhTYln9z5BlWhLPHl3gXUBI9sqRoGi1JzESiO9xIKCnFS95PzcTYygsG4o dN7BeGyZ1SFGAQ5GJR7eB1s/hwuxJpYVV+YeYpTgYFYS4f17/Uu4EG9KYmVValF+fFFpTmrx IcaJjECfTWSWEk3OB0ZdXkm8oYmJgYmxsZmxsbmJOS2FlcR5d13+FC4kkJ5YkpqdmlqQWgRz FBMHp1QDY9PEozfyfsUecZn0as7z+q+P9Fom9n0sL4x//zZ/YtKHLLf9GQmfXibK2or8/KNs niWWsuV/UMZyj+lCCetyFl8+tH/aSbm0q5l+V3KmaVTwWG2w77geLeCVM8X+VaWnxrLPvl71 0ab333N84WDb0PXlSfrTCX7rpzp3Pd4j+UJg27SnW5KnT1JiKc5INNRiLipOBADbK9Nx3gIA AA== Cc: "ipp@pwg.org" Subject: Re: [IPP] "trimming-when" member attribute - why no keyword corresponding to 'no-trimming'? X-BeenThere: ipp@pwg.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15 Precedence: list List-Id: Internet Printing Protocol Workgroup discussion list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="===============1046783514444155288==" Errors-To: ipp-bounces@pwg.org Sender: "ipp" --===============1046783514444155288== Content-type: multipart/alternative; boundary="Boundary_(ID_QFRC+sSlQGee0wVfi8jHuw)" --Boundary_(ID_QFRC+sSlQGee0wVfi8jHuw) Content-type: text/plain; CHARSET=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Smith, Sent from my iPad > On Oct 4, 2016, at 11:31 PM, Kennedy, Smith (Wireless Architect) wrote: > > Hi Mike, > > That won't work if the printer has the following, right? (Taken from ipptool output and slightly reformatted) > > finishings-col-default = > { > finishing-template=after-sheets > trimming-type=full > trimming-offset=500 > trimming-when=after-sheets > trimming-reference-edge=bottom > } > > I guess a Client could send "finishings" = 'none' and not include "finishings-col". Is that how the Client is expected to disable trimming in this case? Yes, or pass 'no-value' or an empty collection in "finishings-col". > > Smith > > > >> On Oct 4, 2016, at 7:10 PM, Michael Sweet wrote: >> >> Smith, >> >> If you don't want trimming done, you omit the trimming collection. >> >>> On Oct 4, 2016, at 5:19 PM, Kennedy, Smith (Wireless Architect) wrote: >>> >>> Hi there, >>> >>> In Finishings 2.0 / 2.1, the "trimming-when" member attribute has 4 keywords defined 'after-documents', 'after-job', 'after-sets', and 'after-sheets'. But what keyword would the user provide if they don't want the paper cut at all? >>> >>> Smith >>> >>> /** >>> Smith Kennedy >>> Wireless Architect - Client Software - IPG-PPS >>> Standards - IEEE ISTO PWG / Bluetooth SIG / Wi-Fi Alliance / NFC Forum / USB IF >>> Chair, IEEE ISTO Printer Working Group >>> HP Inc. >>> */ >>> >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> ipp mailing list >>> ipp@pwg.org >>> https://www.pwg.org/mailman/listinfo/ipp >> >> _________________________________________________________ >> Michael Sweet, Senior Printing System Engineer >> > --Boundary_(ID_QFRC+sSlQGee0wVfi8jHuw) Content-type: text/html; CHARSET=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: quoted-printable
Smi= th,

Sent from my iPad

On Oct 4, 2016, at 11:31 PM, Ke= nnedy, Smith (Wireless Architect) <smith.kennedy@hp.com> wrote:

Hi Mike,

That won't work if the= printer has the following, right? (Taken from ipptool output and slightly r= eformatted)

finishings-col-default =3D
{
 finishing-template=3Dafter-sheets
 trimming-type=3Dfull
 trimming-offse= t=3D500
 trimming-when=3Dafter-sheets
=  trimming-reference-edge=3Dbottom
}

I guess a Client could send "finishings" =3D 'none' and not i= nclude "finishings-col". Is that how the Client is expected to disable trimm= ing in this case?

Yes, or pass 'no-value' o= r an empty collection in "finishings-col".


Smith=



On Oct 4, 2016, at 7:10 PM, Michael Sweet <msweet@apple.com> wrote:

Smith,
<= /span>
If you don't want tri= mming done, you omit the trimming collection.

<= blockquote type=3D"cite">On Oct 4, 2016, at 5:19 PM, Kennedy, Smith (W= ireless Architect) <smith.kennedy= @hp.com> wrote:

=
Hi there,

In Finishings 2.0 / 2.1, the "trimming-when" me= mber attribute has 4 keywords defined 'after-documents', 'after-job', 'after= -sets', and 'after-sheets'. But what keyword would the user provide if they d= on't want the paper cut at all?

Smith

/**
=
 Smith Kenne= dy
 Wireless Architect - Client Software - IPG-PPS
 Standards - IEEE ISTO PWG / Bluetooth SIG / Wi-Fi Al= liance / NFC Forum / USB IF
 Chair, IEEE ISTO Printer= Working Group
 HP Inc.
*/<= br>



________= _______________________________________
=
ipp mailing list
ipp@pwg.org
= https://www.pwg.o= rg/mailman/listinfo/ipp

_= ________________________________________________________
Michael Sweet, Senior Printing System En= gineer


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X-BeenThere: ipp@pwg.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15 Precedence: list List-Id: Internet Printing Protocol Workgroup discussion list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="===============3027472444032257911==" Errors-To: ipp-bounces@pwg.org Sender: "ipp" --===============3027472444032257911== Content-Language: en-US Content-Type: multipart/signed; boundary="Apple-Mail=_C9241299-97D4-4476-A9A2-AD0116EDAEC1"; protocol="application/pkcs7-signature"; micalg=sha1 --Apple-Mail=_C9241299-97D4-4476-A9A2-AD0116EDAEC1 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="Apple-Mail=_A7F4B0B9-0A0C-4D28-93C7-663B6C0B677E" --Apple-Mail=_A7F4B0B9-0A0C-4D28-93C7-663B6C0B677E Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Thanks, Mike! That answers my questions, and I don't think we need any = new keywords for "trimming-when". Smith > On Oct 5, 2016, at 4:42 AM, Michael Sweet wrote: >=20 > Smith, >=20 > Sent from my iPad >=20 > On Oct 4, 2016, at 11:31 PM, Kennedy, Smith (Wireless Architect) = > wrote: >=20 >> Hi Mike, >>=20 >> That won't work if the printer has the following, right? (Taken from = ipptool output and slightly reformatted) >>=20 >> finishings-col-default =3D >> { >> finishing-template=3Dafter-sheets >> trimming-type=3Dfull >> trimming-offset=3D500 >> trimming-when=3Dafter-sheets >> trimming-reference-edge=3Dbottom >> } >>=20 >> I guess a Client could send "finishings" =3D 'none' and not include = "finishings-col". Is that how the Client is expected to disable trimming = in this case? >=20 > Yes, or pass 'no-value' or an empty collection in "finishings-col". >=20 >>=20 >> Smith >>=20 >>=20 >>=20 >>> On Oct 4, 2016, at 7:10 PM, Michael Sweet > wrote: >>>=20 >>> Smith, >>>=20 >>> If you don't want trimming done, you omit the trimming collection. >>>=20 >>>> On Oct 4, 2016, at 5:19 PM, Kennedy, Smith (Wireless Architect) = > wrote: >>>>=20 >>>> Hi there, >>>>=20 >>>> In Finishings 2.0 / 2.1, the "trimming-when" member attribute has 4 = keywords defined 'after-documents', 'after-job', 'after-sets', and = 'after-sheets'. But what keyword would the user provide if they don't = want the paper cut at all? >>>>=20 >>>> Smith >>>>=20 >>>> /** >>>> Smith Kennedy >>>> Wireless Architect - Client Software - IPG-PPS >>>> Standards - IEEE ISTO PWG / Bluetooth SIG / Wi-Fi Alliance / NFC = Forum / USB IF >>>> Chair, IEEE ISTO Printer Working Group >>>> HP Inc. >>>> */ >>>>=20 >>>>=20 >>>>=20 >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> ipp mailing list >>>> ipp@pwg.org >>>> https://www.pwg.org/mailman/listinfo/ipp = >>>=20 >>> _________________________________________________________ >>> Michael Sweet, Senior Printing System Engineer >>>=20 >>=20 --Apple-Mail=_A7F4B0B9-0A0C-4D28-93C7-663B6C0B677E Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Type: text/html; charset=us-ascii Thanks, Mike! That answers my questions, and I don't think we = need any new keywords for "trimming-when".

Smith



On Oct 5, 2016, at 4:42 AM, Michael Sweet <msweet@apple.com> = wrote:

Smith,

Sent from my iPad

On Oct = 4, 2016, at 11:31 PM, Kennedy, Smith (Wireless Architect) <smith.kennedy@hp.com> wrote:

Hi Mike,

That won't work if the = printer has the following, right? (Taken from ipptool output and = slightly reformatted)

finishings-col-default =3D
{
=  finishing-template=3Dafter-sheets
 trimming-type=3Dfull
 trimming-offset=3D500
 trimming-when=3Dafter-sheets
 trimming-reference-edge=3Dbottom
}

I guess a Client could = send "finishings" =3D 'none' and not include "finishings-col". Is that = how the Client is expected to disable trimming in this case?

Yes, or pass 'no-value' or an empty collection in = "finishings-col".


Smith



On Oct 4, 2016, at 7:10 PM, Michael Sweet = <msweet@apple.com> wrote:

Smith,

If you don't want trimming done, you omit = the trimming collection.

On Oct 4, 2016, at 5:19 PM, = Kennedy, Smith (Wireless Architect) <smith.kennedy@hp.com> wrote:

Hi there,

In Finishings 2.0 / 2.1, the "trimming-when" member attribute = has 4 keywords defined 'after-documents', 'after-job', 'after-sets', and = 'after-sheets'. But what keyword would the user provide if they don't = want the paper cut at all?

Smith

/**
 Smith Kennedy
=  Wireless Architect - Client Software - IPG-PPS
=  Standards - IEEE ISTO PWG / Bluetooth SIG / Wi-Fi Alliance / NFC = Forum / USB IF
 Chair, IEEE ISTO Printer Working Group
=  HP Inc.
*/



_______________________________________________
ipp = mailing list
ipp@pwg.org
https://www.pwg.org/mailman/listinfo/ipp

_________________________________________________________
Michael Sweet, Senior Printing System Engineer



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mail-in6.apple.com (Apple Secure Mail Relay) with SMTP id F2.10.06862.19655F75; Wed, 5 Oct 2016 12:37:54 -0700 (PDT) X-AuditID: 11973e15-349ff70000001ace-bd-57f556917059 Received: from nwk-mmpp-sz08.apple.com (nwk-mmpp-sz08.apple.com [17.128.115.25]) by relay3.apple.com (Apple SCV relay) with SMTP id B6.F7.13773.19655F75; Wed, 5 Oct 2016 12:37:53 -0700 (PDT) MIME-version: 1.0 Received: from [17.153.80.134] (unknown [17.153.80.134]) by nwk-mmpp-sz08.apple.com (Oracle Communications Messaging Server 8.0.1.1.0 64bit (built Jun 15 2016)) with ESMTPSA id <0OEL009DFAJ30NA0@nwk-mmpp-sz08.apple.com> for ipp@pwg.org; Wed, 05 Oct 2016 12:37:53 -0700 (PDT) From: Michael Sweet Date: Wed, 05 Oct 2016 15:37:51 -0400 Message-id: <0F9AA128-5F7E-4332-9899-D8DB0C91666E@apple.com> To: ipp X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.3226) X-Brightmail-Tracker: H4sIAAAAAAAAA+NgFupiluLIzCtJLcpLzFFi42IRbCgM1p0U9jXc4OQHKYtj+16yODB6zFs8 nSmAMYrLJiU1J7MstUjfLoErY1bnTvaCY0wVHza3szQwTmHqYuTgkBAwkWheG9HFyMkhJLCX 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wfhnmdUhRgEORiUeXgONr+FCrIllxZW5hxglOJiVRHhtg4FCvCmJlVWpRfnxRaU5qcWHGJOB Tp7ILCWanA8M8LySeEMTEwMTY2MzY2NzE3PShJXEeXdf/hQuJJCeWJKanZpakFoEs4WJg1Oq gVH2v+1qJudeXdeC9WqP/czlPn/SWxaRIHrKlrE/TPOKpmgwn8auvQdyf37tVYlLn7xHvmpx QMrZ7dNmyzjK/TORmcg37+j+1+55f/5v/fRP6ueclakrg6MyPMMcT7/teOEjdfvNbL1k+Q0F 6o4Td4tYzqvUWDozKflt7lOGA7+bNBav2/xUzVmJpTgj0VCLuag4EQC2k1/QZgIAAA== Subject: [IPP] Minutes posted from today's IPP WG concall X-BeenThere: ipp@pwg.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15 Precedence: list List-Id: Internet Printing Protocol Workgroup discussion list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: ipp-bounces@pwg.org Sender: "ipp" All, I have posted the minutes from today's IPP WG conference call to: http://ftp.pwg.org/pub/pwg/ipp/minutes/ippv2-concall-minutes-20161005.pdf Our next conference call is on October 19, 2016 at 1pm ET. _________________________________________________________ Michael Sweet, Senior Printing System Engineer _______________________________________________ ipp mailing list ipp@pwg.org https://www.pwg.org/mailman/listinfo/ipp From ipp-bounces@pwg.org Wed Oct 5 12:58:59 2016 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ietfarch-ipp-archive@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: ietfarch-ipp-archive@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id CDD6E12985B for ; Wed, 5 Oct 2016 12:58:59 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -4.357 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-4.357 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, HEADER_FROM_DIFFERENT_DOMAINS=0.001, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, MIME_HTML_MOSTLY=0.428, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE=-0.0001, RP_MATCHES_RCVD=-2.996, SPF_PASS=-0.001, T_DKIM_INVALID=0.01] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=fail 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a=rsa-sha256; d=apple.com; s=mailout2048s; c=relaxed/simple; q=dns/txt; i=@apple.com; t=1475697529; h=From:Sender:Reply-To:Subject:Date:Message-id:To:Cc:MIME-version:Content-type: Content-Transfer-Encoding:Content-ID:Content-Description:Resent-Date:Resent-From: Resent-Sender:Resent-To:Resent-Cc:Resent-Message-ID:In-reply-to:References:List-Id: List-Help:List-Unsubscribe:List-Subscribe:List-Post:List-Owner:List-Archive; bh=dc9VCxXpGlPJW0dWOD3BVD4nWTCZtYTcUwH50WWizfU=; b=gF4dztrfrIdFOn/2gNWTetUZtYAeJstHvlo6fr9ufcfYsICelU5MykCp0xKvXV5X SNApoTfaBPn+Ny2WxUnD94u+ryNSeS1lKb/CHNIPYAbcvrlHniHfX99HMPZOELG8 JDSsCGLTXoAN3ENhaS54iv+3az9VysqaXZ5yx9tbJ30t7TYxVvZxt7diTPsFWwqH RRVJtQEOoNFvWhK8RTRwKVwNjNtDhm44E+QkzX0d/J2Jj6cxwqkeUwzWQtJaGgwl agk+3zPmR0/2061mNhvi5CTQeloi4Lzu2cyrGHjqwV+ntmQDVzsQFgRUbWHQDrKB aYXXP80c1IqtJ5URGwX31Q==; Received: from relay3.apple.com (relay3.apple.com [17.128.113.83]) by mail-in2.apple.com (Apple Secure Mail Relay) with SMTP id 78.3B.06856.97B55F75; Wed, 5 Oct 2016 12:58:49 -0700 (PDT) X-AuditID: 11973e11-ece309a000001ac8-aa-57f55b79ee89 Received: from nwk-mmpp-sz08.apple.com (nwk-mmpp-sz08.apple.com [17.128.115.25]) by relay3.apple.com (Apple SCV relay) with SMTP id F2.5B.13773.97B55F75; Wed, 5 Oct 2016 12:58:49 -0700 (PDT) MIME-version: 1.0 Received: from [17.153.80.134] (unknown [17.153.80.134]) by nwk-mmpp-sz08.apple.com (Oracle Communications Messaging Server 8.0.1.1.0 64bit (built Jun 15 2016)) with ESMTPSA id <0OEL00JG8BHYNX40@nwk-mmpp-sz08.apple.com>; Wed, 05 Oct 2016 12:58:49 -0700 (PDT) From: Michael Sweet In-reply-to: <816F64CE-AE18-4991-A733-E2CB6C65D49C@hp.com> Date: Wed, 05 Oct 2016 15:58:46 -0400 Message-id: <8D22A0C5-6382-4435-BC59-6AF09A289102@apple.com> References: <61EBB88E-EBB5-4D3E-A988-5E3498328782@hp.com> <69E64E55-1697-41ED-98BE-A5838D2B1B3F@apple.com> <816F64CE-AE18-4991-A733-E2CB6C65D49C@hp.com> To: "Kennedy, Smith (Wireless Architect)" X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.3226) X-Brightmail-Tracker: H4sIAAAAAAAAA+NgFrrILMWRmVeSWpSXmKPExsUi2FAYrFsZ/TXc4Pp/ZYtj+16yWLzq2sXs wOSxa9tOJo95i6czBTBFcdmkpOZklqUW6dslcGU8657AXnDmK1PF3O/dLA2MHw4ydTFyckgI mEh0LP/A1sXIxSEksJdR4u2qdYxdjBxgidffWSDiBxkl9u74zwbSwCsgKPFj8j0WkBpmgTCJ 9vWREDVdTBKnti1gAakRFpCQON6/kBWkRljAT2LnX7BdbAJqEr8n9bGC2JwCVhLLXp8As1kE VCUmnjvJCGIzC8hLNNy5wgKxykbi4+9pYL1CAnMYJe7P4QexRQQcJJ4v+cQCcaasxOxfXiAn SAisYZN4t+sH0wRGoVlILp2FcOkssA1aEt8ftUKF5SUOnpeFCGtKPLv3iR3C1pZ48u4C6wJG tlWMQrmJmTm6mXlGeokFBTmpesn5uZsYQXEw3U5wB+PxVVaHGAU4GJV4eA00voYLsSaWFVfm HmKU5mBREufl/vA5XEggPbEkNTs1tSC1KL6oNCe1+BAjEwenVAOjO3uSmIFmqBJvY7H7gSiL OgUzh7MeS6uWP/7NcWffB4HmgjevI9sUyp3d9faF8qrfn/Uu6IRQVLjQnU8WVgpsZwTYdPf3 aEZWnHgSf0Rh+511nIkpTLpuXnMFJr6y8lmW7u+13v5S3O3TXwy5XrddNu8LnsRUEBKksXPH mSeGLOeifuW9eq3EUpyRaKjFXFScCADfYnqUZAIAAA== X-Brightmail-Tracker: H4sIAAAAAAAAA+NgFrrALMWRmVeSWpSXmKPExsUi2FAsqVsZ/TXcYNknKYtj+16yWLzq2sXs wOSxa9tOJo95i6czBTBFcdmkpOZklqUW6dslcGU8657AXnDmK1PF3O/dLA2MHw4ydTFycEgI mEi8/s7SxcgJZIpJXLi3nq2LkYtDSOAgo8TeHf/ZQBK8AoISPybfYwGpZxYIk2hfHwlR08Uk cWrbArBmYQEJieP9C1lBaoQF/CR2/mUCCbMJqEn8ntTHCmJzClhJLHt9AsxmEVCVmHjuJCOI zSwgL9Fw5woLxCobiY+/p4H1CgnMYZS4P4cfxBYRcJB4vuQTC8TJshKzf3lNYBSYheS4WQjH zQIbqiXx/VErVFhe4uB5WYiwpsSze5/YIWxtiSfvLrAuYGRbxShQlJqTWGmsl1hQkJOql5yf u4kRHM6FwTsY/yyzOsQowMGoxMNroPE1XIg1say4MvcQowQHs5II79twoBBvSmJlVWpRfnxR aU5q8SFGaQ4WJXHe3Zc/hQsJpCeWpGanphakFsFkmTg4pRoYPX55esZk3vftYjlcJT1JytlW TuG3bKhD6MJ8wbk2LPedKuXLX/To8p6K3zbZf+WZqWpxPFo6N9V52m7xWU9mUQ3e3nKuUkj/ sGKynfeeOYZSste3Pbu6MD194pQdGzwfeM2Us9vftsd/XhTrrXtyfOGsBXskApvMFc1ZVjfG pf8+cFdQmFWJpTgj0VCLuag4EQB922DsYwIAAA== Cc: "ipp@pwg.org" Subject: Re: [IPP] New stable draft of IPP Finishings 2.1 available for review X-BeenThere: ipp@pwg.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15 Precedence: list List-Id: Internet Printing Protocol Workgroup discussion list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="===============1138056483595569194==" Errors-To: ipp-bounces@pwg.org Sender: "ipp" --===============1138056483595569194== Content-type: multipart/alternative; boundary="Boundary_(ID_n2oToPFK/XXrnc/kMdX0uA)" --Boundary_(ID_n2oToPFK/XXrnc/kMdX0uA) Content-type: text/plain; CHARSET=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Smith, > On Oct 4, 2016, at 1:32 PM, Kennedy, Smith (Wireless Architect) wrote: > ... > I started adding some text, and then it occurred to me that the value of "job-pages-per-set" has to be, or ought to be, an exact multiple of the total number of pages in the Job. I updated it thus: > The RECOMMENDED "job-pages-per-set" Job Template attribute specifies the number of input pages that constitute a set for finishing processes. The value of "job-pages-per-set" must be a multiple of the total number of pages of all Documents in the Job. For example, if a Client submits a 14 page PWG Raster Format [PWG5102.4] Document for printing that actually contains two copies of four duplex pages each, the Client could specify a "job-pages-per-set" Job Template attribute with a value of 7, a "sides" attribute with a value of 'two-sided-long-edge', and a "finishings" attribute with a value of 4 (staple) to have the Printer staple two Sets of four sheets. Figure 4 shows a graphical representation of this example. > > > That sentence I added makes clear how the pages taken from one or more Documents in a Job relate to the value found in this attribute, assuming there isn't some way that finishings could be set per-document in a Job. (Hoping that isn't possible...) > Actually, it is. "finishings" and "finishings-col" are both Job Template and Document Template attributes, and the "overrides" attribute also allows finishings overrides that apply to 1 or more documents (for things like mail merge use cases...) "job-pages-per-set" needs to be evenly divisible with either a) the total number of pages in all documents or b) the number of pages in each document (when "multiple-document-handling" is 'separate-documents-xxx'). _________________________________________________________ Michael Sweet, Senior Printing System Engineer --Boundary_(ID_n2oToPFK/XXrnc/kMdX0uA) Content-type: text/html; CHARSET=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: quoted-printable Smith,

On Oct 4, 2016, at 1:32 PM, = Kennedy, Smith (Wireless Architect) <smith.kennedy@hp.com> wrote:
...
I started adding some text, and then = it occurred to me that the value of "job-pages-per-set" has to be, or = ought to be, an exact multiple of the total number of pages in the Job. = I updated it thus:

The RECOMMENDED "job-pages-per-set" Job Template attribute specifies the number of input pages that constitute a set for finishing processes. =  The value of "job-pages-per-set" must be a multiple of the total number of pages of all Documents in the Job. For example, if a Client = submits a 14 page PWG Raster Format [PWG5102.4] Document for = printing that actually contains two copies of four duplex pages each, the Client could specify a "job-pages-per-set" Job Template attribute with a value of 7, a "sides" attribute with a value of 'two-sided-long-edge', and a "finishings" attribute with a value of 4 (staple) to have the Printer staple two Sets of four sheets. Figure 4 shows a = graphical representation of this example.

That sentence I = added makes clear how the pages taken from one or more Documents in a = Job relate to the value found in this attribute, assuming there isn't = some way that finishings could be set per-document in a Job. (Hoping = that isn't possible...)

Actually, it is. =  "finishings" and "finishings-col" are both Job Template and = Document Template attributes, and the "overrides" attribute also allows = finishings overrides that apply to 1 or more documents (for things like = mail merge use cases...)

"job-pages-per-set" needs to be evenly divisible with either = a) the total number of pages in all documents or b) the number of pages = in each document (when "multiple-document-handling" is = 'separate-documents-xxx').

_________________________________________________________
Michael Sweet, Senior Printing = System Engineer

= --Boundary_(ID_n2oToPFK/XXrnc/kMdX0uA)-- --===============1138056483595569194== Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline _______________________________________________ ipp mailing list ipp@pwg.org https://www.pwg.org/mailman/listinfo/ipp --===============1138056483595569194==-- From ipp-bounces@pwg.org Wed Oct 5 13:03:55 2016 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ietfarch-ipp-archive@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: ietfarch-ipp-archive@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 458181293F3 for ; Wed, 5 Oct 2016 13:03:55 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -4.782 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-4.782 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_ADSP_CUSTOM_MED=0.001, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, FREEMAIL_FORGED_FROMDOMAIN=0.001, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, HEADER_FROM_DIFFERENT_DOMAINS=0.001, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE=-0.0001, RP_MATCHES_RCVD=-2.996, SPF_PASS=-0.001, T_DKIM_INVALID=0.01] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=fail (2048-bit key) reason="fail (message has been altered)" header.d=gmail.com Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 0Tsob4qYgh4K for ; Wed, 5 Oct 2016 13:03:53 -0700 (PDT) Received: from www.pwg.org (www.pwg.org [50.116.7.199]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 422DE129468 for ; Wed, 5 Oct 2016 13:03:53 -0700 (PDT) Received: by www.pwg.org (Postfix, from userid 1002) id 189B0440F; Wed, 5 Oct 2016 20:03:53 +0000 (UTC) Received: from www.pwg.org (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by www.pwg.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0DBBC27B2; Wed, 5 Oct 2016 20:03:47 +0000 (UTC) X-Original-To: ipp@pwg.org Delivered-To: ipp@pwg.org Received: by www.pwg.org (Postfix, from userid 1002) id 5D658415D; Wed, 5 Oct 2016 20:03:45 +0000 (UTC) Received: from mail-it0-x22e.google.com (mail-it0-x22e.google.com [IPv6:2607:f8b0:4001:c0b::22e]) by www.pwg.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 20F9F24D3 for ; Wed, 5 Oct 2016 20:03:44 +0000 (UTC) Received: by mail-it0-x22e.google.com with SMTP id o21so16888337itb.0 for ; Wed, 05 Oct 2016 13:03:44 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20120113; h=mime-version:in-reply-to:references:from:date:message-id:subject:to; bh=qoTLdkh7spYCDYwG9Urj4yybR6ntskr6OYJ/GYJcmm8=; b=e1fj1wzbp1PIc3rQY4G8qg/o7N8NXEDQo1jZOZvrg05R/kuFrzHEIe1I1TqhgA9xSE rftfe1/+InRR2BixzMQEb32dmqKWEOzgOpLr1sT8mAgep+4bde5dQh5pqHonIR2PtQa1 LmxwMKPCYORw4Q5Fu+sBqmzKdbNHnZErySI9wI2An5udiy0Irsjhy8NLMmnguyjRehir 2dROzizQ5cXpkjmFIfo1+FZdV0gcR8Xx5W4Olqh5EttfovOLvl8EA1GdAo8zXCY5sUma 6DGQhvFUrkxCsVlwE9GCTmNR6J9oMxRks3b110Rnn/WjuAJ7VtZqrsKe9vXSTWyr+WHx 0hAw== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20130820; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:in-reply-to:references:from:date :message-id:subject:to; bh=qoTLdkh7spYCDYwG9Urj4yybR6ntskr6OYJ/GYJcmm8=; b=HORGZKrkCaZsQOYBXR6re2hIy32JnWm7fh5aRqaIOIuF/hgESPMP7m0Z/aKjWz/xQg BZIe79G3a02dXxZKgMZS/2UeU2qYBIX/CuhRtKPFXxbAWx5ALqM0WdDUV/Lo+4D/oIi7 82MjRGMBI6pTWAyQHJQoYZ7zx720WyAmlHii0aZWpKT0Die5ALtFOesI807kzHM5MYfz 2xs3EqD0uHilV05GO/boQpmcODJYIwv8yRb2J6QQu8lBsKDJVzlVwBlto/tC3EBcp9rJ hL3uQO7mtkCn/eMbakICEdUGMnC8ThZxLFlrLQ5HpKwUCGt5rgo3K+5Ggxrn9xGhGjQu VqRA== X-Gm-Message-State: AA6/9RloQXnWQIZZVwDGz7ub6i1I5PbbX5iWX3Ngs25QfezhwGFzkXVdhf+dpyQ7tp0Hzx1R7qVl4E0/aNY4VQ== X-Received: by 10.107.187.71 with SMTP id l68mr11998757iof.77.1475697823453; Wed, 05 Oct 2016 13:03:43 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 Received: by 10.107.147.6 with HTTP; Wed, 5 Oct 2016 13:03:23 -0700 (PDT) In-Reply-To: References: From: Ira McDonald Date: Wed, 5 Oct 2016 16:03:23 -0400 Message-ID: To: "ipp@pwg.org" , "Kennedy, Smith (Wireless Architect)" , Michael R Sweet , Till Kamppeter , Ira McDonald Subject: [IPP] Fwd: Fwd: First IPP Everywhere Self-Certified Printers !!! X-BeenThere: ipp@pwg.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15 Precedence: list List-Id: Internet Printing Protocol Workgroup discussion list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="===============0168233329727640904==" Errors-To: ipp-bounces@pwg.org Sender: "ipp" --===============0168233329727640904== Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary=94eb2c07605090182e053e23accc --94eb2c07605090182e053e23accc Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 Hi, Per our brief discussion during today's IPP WG call, please consider Till's comments and feature request (IEEE 1284 DeviceID values for certified printers). Please reply here on IPP mailing list and copy Till on your response. Cheers, - Ira Ira McDonald (Musician / Software Architect) Co-Chair - TCG Trusted Mobility Solutions WG Chair - Linux Foundation Open Printing WG Secretary - IEEE-ISTO Printer Working Group Co-Chair - IEEE-ISTO PWG Internet Printing Protocol WG IETF Designated Expert - IPP & Printer MIB Blue Roof Music / High North Inc http://sites.google.com/site/blueroofmusic http://sites.google.com/site/highnorthinc mailto: blueroofmusic@gmail.com Jan-April: 579 Park Place Saline, MI 48176 734-944-0094 May-Dec: PO Box 221 Grand Marais, MI 49839 906-494-2434 ---------- Forwarded message ---------- From: Till Kamppeter Date: Tue, Oct 4, 2016 at 9:11 PM Subject: Re: Fwd: First IPP Everywhere Self-Certified Printers !!! To: Ira McDonald , " printing-architecture@lists.linux-foundation.org" < printing-architecture@lists.linux-foundation.org>, Matthew Morikawa < Matthew.Morikawa@dda.kyocera.com> On 10/04/2016 01:45 PM, Ira McDonald wrote: > Hi, > > I'm very pleased to announce the HP has successfully self-certified > twenty (20) IPP Everywhere Printer models! > > Thank you very much for the info. And congrats to HP to certify the first ones. > The following new IPP Everywhere Printers have been submitted to the PWG > web site: > > - HP DesignJet T730 36-in Printer > - HP DesignJet T830 Multifunction Printer > - HP OfficeJet 8702 All-in-One Printer > - HP OfficeJet Pro 8710 All-in-One Printer > - HP OfficeJet Pro 8712 All-in-One Printer > - HP OfficeJet Pro 8714 All-in-One Printer > - HP OfficeJet Pro 8715 All-in-One Printer > - HP OfficeJet Pro 8716 All-in-One Printer > - HP OfficeJet Pro 8717 All-in-One Printer > - HP OfficeJet Pro 8718 All-in-One Printer > - HP OfficeJet Pro 8719 All-in-One Printer > - HP OfficeJet Pro 8720 All-in-One Printer > - HP OfficeJet Pro 8722 All-in-One Printer > - HP OfficeJet Pro 8723 All-in-One Printer > - HP OfficeJet Pro 8724 All-in-One Printer > - HP OfficeJet Pro 8725 All-in-One Printer > - HP OfficeJet Pro 8726 All-in-One Printer > - HP OfficeJet Pro 8727 All-in-One Printer > - HP OfficeJet Pro 8728 All-in-One Printer > > When I look through them, these are actually only 5 models: - HP DesignJet T730 36-in Printer - HP DesignJet T830 Multifunction Printer - HP OfficeJet 8702 All-in-One Printer - HP OfficeJet Pro 8710 All-in-One Printer Series - HP OfficeJet Pro 8720 All-in-One Printer Series When only the last digit of the number differs, these are only variants with regional adaptations. The printer itself is the same but the power supply can be 110 V or 220 V, the power cord can be with different plug and the printers front panel (what is printed on the printer's shell) can be in different languages. So I would like to see the IEEE-1284 device IDs for that printers, as for listing them on OpenPrinting.org, there should be one printer entry per device ID. I would then add a driver entry called "IPP Everywhere" and make it the recommended "driver" for these printers. I have also discovered a bug on http://www.pwg.org/dynamo/eveprinters.php The link of the HP OfficeJet 8702 All-in-One Printer leads to HP's page of the HP OfficeJet Pro 8710 All-in-One Printer series. Till --94eb2c07605090182e053e23accc Content-Type: text/html; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Hi,

Per our bri= ef discussion during today's IPP WG call, please consider
Till= 's comments and feature request (IEEE 1284 DeviceID values for
certified printers).=C2=A0=C2=A0 Please reply here on IPP mailing list and= copy
Till on your response.

Cheers,
- Ira
Ira McDonald (Musician / Software Architect)
Co-Chair - T= CG Trusted Mobility Solutions WG
Chair - Linux Foundation Open Printing = WG
Secretary - IEEE-ISTO Printer Working Group
Co-Chair - IEEE-ISTO P= WG Internet Printing Protocol WG
IETF Designated Expert - IPP & Prin= ter MIB
Blue Roof Music / High North Inc
http://sites.google.com/site/blueroofmusic
http://sites.google.com/site/highnorthinc
mailto: blueroofmusic@gmail.com<= br>Jan-April: 579 Park Place=C2=A0 Saline, MI=C2=A0 48176=C2=A0 734-944-009= 4
May-Dec: PO Box 221=C2=A0 Grand Marais, MI 49839=C2=A0 906-494-2434

---------- Forwarded message ----------
F= rom: Till Kamppeter <= ;till.kamppeter@gmail.com&g= t;
Date: Tue, Oct 4, 2016 at 9:11 PM
Subject: Re: Fwd: First I= PP Everywhere Self-Certified Printers !!!
To: Ira McDonald <blueroofmusic@gmail.com>, "= printin= g-architecture@lists.linux-foundation.org" <printing-architecture@list= s.linux-foundation.org>, Matthew Morikawa <Matthew.Morikawa@dda.kyocera.com>
<= br>
On 10/04/2016 01:45 PM, Ira McDonald wrote:
Hi,

I'm very pleased to announce the HP has successfully self-certified
twenty (20) IPP Everywhere Printer models!


 Thank you very much for the info.

And congrats to HP to certify the first ones.


The following new IPP Everywhere Printers have been submitted to the PWG web site:

=C2=A0 - HP DesignJet T730 36-in Printer
=C2=A0 - HP DesignJet T830 Multifunction Printer
=C2=A0 - HP OfficeJet 8702 All-in-One Printer
=C2=A0 - HP OfficeJet Pro 8710 All-in-One Printer
=C2=A0 - HP OfficeJet Pro 8712 All-in-One Printer
=C2=A0 - HP OfficeJet Pro 8714 All-in-One Printer
=C2=A0 - HP OfficeJet Pro 8715 All-in-One Printer
=C2=A0 - HP OfficeJet Pro 8716 All-in-One Printer
=C2=A0 - HP OfficeJet Pro 8717 All-in-One Printer
=C2=A0 - HP OfficeJet Pro 8718 All-in-One Printer
=C2=A0 - HP OfficeJet Pro 8719 All-in-One Printer
=C2=A0 - HP OfficeJet Pro 8720 All-in-One Printer
=C2=A0 - HP OfficeJet Pro 8722 All-in-One Printer
=C2=A0 - HP OfficeJet Pro 8723 All-in-One Printer
=C2=A0 - HP OfficeJet Pro 8724 All-in-One Printer
=C2=A0 - HP OfficeJet Pro 8725 All-in-One Printer
=C2=A0 - HP OfficeJet Pro 8726 All-in-One Printer
=C2=A0 - HP OfficeJet Pro 8727 All-in-One Printer
=C2=A0 - HP OfficeJet Pro 8728 All-in-One Printer


 When I look through them, these are actually only 5 models:

=C2=A0 =C2=A0- HP DesignJet T730 36-in Printer
=C2=A0 =C2=A0- HP DesignJet T830 Multifunction Printer
=C2=A0 =C2=A0- HP OfficeJet 8702 All-in-One Printer
 =C2=A0 =C2=A0- HP OfficeJet Pro 8710 All-in-One Printer Series
=C2=A0 =C2=A0- HP OfficeJet Pro 8720 All-in-One Printer Series

When only the last digit of the number differs, these are only variants wit= h regional adaptations. The printer itself is the same but the power supply= can be 110 V or 220 V, the power cord can be with different plug and the p= rinters front panel (what is printed on the printer's shell) can be in = different languages.

So I would like to see the IEEE-1284 device IDs for that printers, as for l= isting them on OpenPrinting.org, there should be one printer entry per devi= ce ID.

I would then add a driver entry called "IPP Everywhere" and make = it the recommended "driver" for these printers.

I have also discovered a bug on

http://www.pwg.org/dynamo/eveprinters.php

The link of the HP OfficeJet 8702 All-in-One Printer leads to HP's page= of the HP OfficeJet Pro 8710 All-in-One Printer series.

=C2=A0 =C2=A0Till



--94eb2c07605090182e053e23accc-- --===============0168233329727640904== Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline _______________________________________________ ipp mailing list ipp@pwg.org https://www.pwg.org/mailman/listinfo/ipp --===============0168233329727640904==-- From ipp-bounces@pwg.org Wed Oct 5 13:30:56 2016 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ietfarch-ipp-archive@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: ietfarch-ipp-archive@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id EE452129454 for ; Wed, 5 Oct 2016 13:30:55 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -4.895 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-4.895 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, HEADER_FROM_DIFFERENT_DOMAINS=0.001, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, RP_MATCHES_RCVD=-2.996, SPF_PASS=-0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id RfhyahR-ITRF for ; Wed, 5 Oct 2016 13:30:53 -0700 (PDT) Received: from www.pwg.org (www.pwg.org [IPv6:2600:3c01::f03c:91ff:fe70:b03f]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4E917129431 for ; Wed, 5 Oct 2016 13:30:53 -0700 (PDT) Received: by www.pwg.org (Postfix, from userid 1002) id DABD0440B; Wed, 5 Oct 2016 20:30:52 +0000 (UTC) Received: from www.pwg.org (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by www.pwg.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9D32327B2; Wed, 5 Oct 2016 20:30:43 +0000 (UTC) X-Original-To: ipp@pwg.org Delivered-To: ipp@pwg.org Received: by www.pwg.org (Postfix, from userid 1002) id 93AA2415E; Wed, 5 Oct 2016 20:30:42 +0000 (UTC) Received: from NAM02-SN1-obe.outbound.protection.outlook.com (mail-sn1nam02on0124.outbound.protection.outlook.com [104.47.36.124]) by www.pwg.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id E098824D3 for ; Wed, 5 Oct 2016 20:30:40 +0000 (UTC) Received: from DF4PR84MB0284.NAMPRD84.PROD.OUTLOOK.COM (10.162.193.22) by DF4PR84MB0283.NAMPRD84.PROD.OUTLOOK.COM (10.162.193.21) with Microsoft SMTP Server (version=TLS1_2, cipher=TLS_ECDHE_RSA_WITH_AES_256_CBC_SHA384_P384) id 15.1.649.16; Wed, 5 Oct 2016 20:30:39 +0000 Received: from DF4PR84MB0284.NAMPRD84.PROD.OUTLOOK.COM ([10.162.193.22]) by DF4PR84MB0284.NAMPRD84.PROD.OUTLOOK.COM ([10.162.193.22]) with mapi id 15.01.0649.024; Wed, 5 Oct 2016 20:30:39 +0000 From: "Kennedy, Smith (Wireless Architect)" To: Ira McDonald , Michael Sweet Thread-Topic: First IPP Everywhere Self-Certified Printers !!! Thread-Index: AQHSH0dVU00LFpLYcUyBH7onRfh5xw== Date: Wed, 5 Oct 2016 20:30:39 +0000 Message-ID: <1058A23C-A7A9-4088-A555-203B9AD81C5F@hp.com> References: In-Reply-To: Accept-Language: en-US Content-Language: en-US X-MS-Has-Attach: yes X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: authentication-results: spf=none (sender IP is ) smtp.mailfrom=smith.kennedy@hp.com; x-ms-exchange-messagesentrepresentingtype: 1 x-originating-ip: [15.65.252.14] x-ms-office365-filtering-correlation-id: 4d01d3ed-39fb-4b4c-b310-08d3ed5e7898 x-microsoft-exchange-diagnostics: 1; DF4PR84MB0283; 6:TA49Orro11BjJSaCdOkn3ZkW6WN/6a6GoapZzAvo9D6G4F/19Jaf2PWRp3fTXjiLQGRezLFWes2Q7MeSvr6/X4Wi5fccIOLtwnsQEk9B7fYAL4npOO1j2qkI89LwYwkcS+ik2sKqBuzCbyEVSijxLVXetSmVxcYn+jadaOZcjP47T+Fem6WsR+NcZCc1Ls9ybZRRgmxxVATaW+wSMTaFPnzJYEFiCfBa/8721db8mtIS/1AW72MqnAS4ldHTBpiRBvAIzeDTEk5B0qsaPvTWY2pIeGacbj3cSbxjgMxOa+g3fs/i8ubW2EdPce3uRwdT; 5:pt6x2i0XNJTdugkw96Jck/FaOL71d414sHVcE8V4xAMjLO9OF5OdLzrxrRti7OjcEufyhPqOTaj/ttbRRunHENx1pRNityGuvZ3TSnr8LMMQJP796NcBmj1iJvGPYsbb14NdVmAr3qRlmCf+nAa43SMJe5XdQJEbWjzPEqbhNQk=; 24:dmHhrdBv7w3ent5J7wAbNACA18bLI8sKLdixFCXOlc7GqbqFAQnXgUeJQa+Lyc1iIB/BopVZlX2bOtVQ5ht039QVfA92Oi/khF98UrBgFfs=; 7:ovuY6brTyhx7+oFTcECtgPjfcA18k491A3XyccQPkzUVcXjKU+Sykf0lf4I919s1lMgUomzsSqlvy6jQjaL6b9GamJUy8m5rD2KML/96bC/i0R9A+IA76IAuJKOEgK2mPpZ76JSMJdVcZXZ4j9krrnnmSlVCMkxLh1S3CgaCqciYOMy3xg9RBiYiKRx0yLatnDw734heseqiphXphsjWwXLwwIWuoNkjaxyYitoPuo73lNqOlT47nS5z+CmxXupLumCrWmgfpdlr2UuRWHVg03ZqFuSShGc3AdILY+5uXswPlkp22W6LnbUvWVqJjZJptnwTWj/VSCdQlHip2ghVOQ== x-microsoft-antispam: UriScan:;BCL:0;PCL:0;RULEID:;SRVR:DF4PR84MB0283; x-microsoft-antispam-prvs: x-exchange-antispam-report-test: UriScan:(160780156254741)(111039206520245)(211936372134217); x-exchange-antispam-report-cfa-test: BCL:0; PCL:0; RULEID:(102415321)(6040176)(601004)(2401047)(8121501046)(5005006)(3002001)(10201501046); SRVR:DF4PR84MB0283; BCL:0; PCL:0; RULEID:; SRVR:DF4PR84MB0283; x-forefront-prvs: 008663486A x-forefront-antispam-report: SFV:NSPM; SFS:(10019020)(7916002)(22974007)(24454002)(377454003)(189002)(199003)(45984002)(6602003)(19617315012)(66066001)(4326007)(99936001)(586003)(16601075003)(223973002)(6116002)(102836003)(3846002)(36756003)(105586002)(106116001)(3660700001)(106356001)(10400500002)(99286002)(101416001)(81156014)(50986999)(76176999)(54356999)(8676002)(122556002)(81166006)(2900100001)(7736002)(15975445007)(77096005)(8666005)(83716003)(11100500001)(3280700002)(87936001)(7846002)(19273905006)(19580405001)(7906003)(19580395003)(16236675004)(5880100001)(5660300001)(8936002)(92566002)(82746002)(33656002)(97736004)(68736007)(86362001)(16799955002)(5001770100001)(2906002)(189998001)(2950100002)(15188155005)(5002640100001)(7059030)(225543005)(16351025005)(104396002)(563064011); DIR:OUT; SFP:1102; SCL:1; SRVR:DF4PR84MB0283; H:DF4PR84MB0284.NAMPRD84.PROD.OUTLOOK.COM; FPR:; SPF:None; PTR:InfoNoRecords; MX:1; A:1; LANG:en; received-spf: None (protection.outlook.com: hp.com does not designate permitted sender hosts) spamdiagnosticoutput: 1:99 spamdiagnosticmetadata: NSPM MIME-Version: 1.0 X-OriginatorOrg: hp.com X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-originalarrivaltime: 05 Oct 2016 20:30:39.2871 (UTC) X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-fromentityheader: Hosted X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-id: ca7981a2-785a-463d-b82a-3db87dfc3ce6 X-MS-Exchange-Transport-CrossTenantHeadersStamped: DF4PR84MB0283 Cc: "ipp@pwg.org" , Till Kamppeter Subject: Re: [IPP] First IPP Everywhere Self-Certified Printers !!! X-BeenThere: ipp@pwg.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15 Precedence: list List-Id: Internet Printing Protocol Workgroup discussion list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="===============3911257539237799596==" Errors-To: ipp-bounces@pwg.org Sender: "ipp" --===============3911257539237799596== Content-Language: en-US Content-Type: multipart/signed; boundary="Apple-Mail=_209EA7DA-E40F-431C-A197-505E6560BC00"; protocol="application/pkcs7-signature"; micalg=sha1 --Apple-Mail=_209EA7DA-E40F-431C-A197-505E6560BC00 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="Apple-Mail=_F1BEE70D-6970-4162-A36A-45FBD30AD504" --Apple-Mail=_F1BEE70D-6970-4162-A36A-45FBD30AD504 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Hi Ira and Till, The submission web form and the site includes fields for both model name = and family name. Once the page has more printers, we could consider a = more sophisticated way of presenting them. For instance, the top level = list might only listing family names, and clicking on the link would = take you to a sub-page for that family / filter the view on that family = / reveal additional sub-rows that list the individual model strings. On that subject, Mike, is there any logic that checks the fields in the = web form against the content of the .plist files? I fixed the URL for the OfficeJet 8702. Smith /** Smith Kennedy Wireless Architect - Client Software - IPG-PPS Standards - IEEE ISTO PWG / Bluetooth SIG / Wi-Fi Alliance / NFC = Forum / USB IF Chair, IEEE ISTO Printer Working Group HP Inc. */ > On Oct 5, 2016, at 2:03 PM, Ira McDonald = wrote: >=20 > Hi, >=20 > Per our brief discussion during today's IPP WG call, please consider > Till's comments and feature request (IEEE 1284 DeviceID values for > certified printers). Please reply here on IPP mailing list and copy > Till on your response. >=20 > Cheers, > - Ira >=20 > Ira McDonald (Musician / Software Architect) > Co-Chair - TCG Trusted Mobility Solutions WG > Chair - Linux Foundation Open Printing WG > Secretary - IEEE-ISTO Printer Working Group > Co-Chair - IEEE-ISTO PWG Internet Printing Protocol WG > IETF Designated Expert - IPP & Printer MIB > Blue Roof Music / High North Inc > http://sites.google.com/site/blueroofmusic = > http://sites.google.com/site/highnorthinc = > mailto: blueroofmusic@gmail.com > Jan-April: 579 Park Place Saline, MI 48176 734-944-0094 > May-Dec: PO Box 221 Grand Marais, MI 49839 906-494-2434 >=20 >=20 > ---------- Forwarded message ---------- > From: Till Kamppeter > > Date: Tue, Oct 4, 2016 at 9:11 PM > Subject: Re: Fwd: First IPP Everywhere Self-Certified Printers !!! > To: Ira McDonald >, = "printing-architecture@lists.linux-foundation.org = " = >, Matthew = Morikawa > >=20 >=20 > On 10/04/2016 01:45 PM, Ira McDonald wrote: > Hi, >=20 > I'm very pleased to announce the HP has successfully self-certified > twenty (20) IPP Everywhere Printer models! >=20 >=20 > Thank you very much for the info. >=20 > And congrats to HP to certify the first ones. >=20 >=20 > The following new IPP Everywhere Printers have been submitted to the = PWG > web site: >=20 > - HP DesignJet T730 36-in Printer > - HP DesignJet T830 Multifunction Printer > - HP OfficeJet 8702 All-in-One Printer > - HP OfficeJet Pro 8710 All-in-One Printer > - HP OfficeJet Pro 8712 All-in-One Printer > - HP OfficeJet Pro 8714 All-in-One Printer > - HP OfficeJet Pro 8715 All-in-One Printer > - HP OfficeJet Pro 8716 All-in-One Printer > - HP OfficeJet Pro 8717 All-in-One Printer > - HP OfficeJet Pro 8718 All-in-One Printer > - HP OfficeJet Pro 8719 All-in-One Printer > - HP OfficeJet Pro 8720 All-in-One Printer > - HP OfficeJet Pro 8722 All-in-One Printer > - HP OfficeJet Pro 8723 All-in-One Printer > - HP OfficeJet Pro 8724 All-in-One Printer > - HP OfficeJet Pro 8725 All-in-One Printer > - HP OfficeJet Pro 8726 All-in-One Printer > - HP OfficeJet Pro 8727 All-in-One Printer > - HP OfficeJet Pro 8728 All-in-One Printer >=20 >=20 > When I look through them, these are actually only 5 models: >=20 > - HP DesignJet T730 36-in Printer > - HP DesignJet T830 Multifunction Printer > - HP OfficeJet 8702 All-in-One Printer > - HP OfficeJet Pro 8710 All-in-One Printer Series > - HP OfficeJet Pro 8720 All-in-One Printer Series >=20 > When only the last digit of the number differs, these are only = variants with regional adaptations. The printer itself is the same but = the power supply can be 110 V or 220 V, the power cord can be with = different plug and the printers front panel (what is printed on the = printer's shell) can be in different languages. >=20 > So I would like to see the IEEE-1284 device IDs for that printers, as = for listing them on OpenPrinting.org, there should be one printer entry = per device ID. >=20 > I would then add a driver entry called "IPP Everywhere" and make it = the recommended "driver" for these printers. >=20 > I have also discovered a bug on >=20 > http://www.pwg.org/dynamo/eveprinters.php = >=20 > The link of the HP OfficeJet 8702 All-in-One Printer leads to HP's = page of the HP OfficeJet Pro 8710 All-in-One Printer series. >=20 > Till >=20 >=20 >=20 --Apple-Mail=_F1BEE70D-6970-4162-A36A-45FBD30AD504 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Type: text/html; charset=us-ascii Hi Ira and Till,

The submission web form and the site = includes fields for both model name and family name. Once the page has = more printers, we could consider a more sophisticated way of presenting = them.  For instance, the top level list might only listing family = names, and clicking on the link would take you to a sub-page for that = family / filter the view on that family / reveal additional sub-rows = that list the individual model strings.

On that subject, Mike, is there any = logic that checks the fields in the web form against the content of the = .plist files?

I = fixed the URL for the OfficeJet 8702.

Smith

/**
    Smith = Kennedy
    Wireless Architect - Client Software = - IPG-PPS
    Standards - IEEE ISTO PWG / = Bluetooth SIG / Wi-Fi Alliance / NFC Forum / USB IF
    Chair, IEEE ISTO Printer Working Group
    HP Inc.
*/



On Oct 5, 2016, at 2:03 PM, Ira McDonald <blueroofmusic@gmail.com> wrote:

Hi,

Per our brief = discussion during today's IPP WG call, please consider
Till's comments and feature request (IEEE 1284 DeviceID = values for
certified printers).   Please = reply here on IPP mailing list and copy
Till on your = response.

Cheers,
-= Ira

Ira McDonald (Musician / Software = Architect)
Co-Chair - TCG Trusted Mobility Solutions WG
Chair - Linux Foundation Open Printing WG
Secretary - IEEE-ISTO Printer Working Group
Co-Chair - IEEE-ISTO PWG Internet Printing Protocol WG
IETF Designated Expert - IPP & Printer MIB
Blue Roof Music / High North Inc
http://sites.google.com/site/blueroofmusic
http://sites.google.com/site/highnorthinc
mailto: blueroofmusic@gmail.com
Jan-April: 579 Park Place  Saline, MI  48176  = 734-944-0094
May-Dec: PO Box 221  Grand Marais, MI = 49839  906-494-2434


---------- Forwarded message = ----------
From: Till = Kamppeter <till.kamppeter@gmail.com>
Date: = Tue, Oct 4, 2016 at 9:11 PM
Subject: Re: Fwd: First IPP = Everywhere Self-Certified Printers !!!
To: Ira McDonald = <blueroofmusic@gmail.com>, "printing-architecture@lists.linux-foundation.org" <printing-architecture@lists.linux-foundation.org>, = Matthew Morikawa <Matthew.Morikawa@dda.kyocera.com>


On 10/04/2016 01:45 PM, Ira = McDonald wrote:
Hi,

I'm very pleased to announce the HP has successfully self-certified
twenty (20) IPP Everywhere Printer models!


 Thank you very much for the info.

And congrats to HP to certify the first ones.


The following new IPP Everywhere Printers have been submitted to the = PWG
web site:

  - HP DesignJet T730 36-in Printer
  - HP DesignJet T830 Multifunction Printer
  - HP OfficeJet 8702 All-in-One Printer
  - HP OfficeJet Pro 8710 All-in-One Printer
  - HP OfficeJet Pro 8712 All-in-One Printer
  - HP OfficeJet Pro 8714 All-in-One Printer
  - HP OfficeJet Pro 8715 All-in-One Printer
  - HP OfficeJet Pro 8716 All-in-One Printer
  - HP OfficeJet Pro 8717 All-in-One Printer
  - HP OfficeJet Pro 8718 All-in-One Printer
  - HP OfficeJet Pro 8719 All-in-One Printer
  - HP OfficeJet Pro 8720 All-in-One Printer
  - HP OfficeJet Pro 8722 All-in-One Printer
  - HP OfficeJet Pro 8723 All-in-One Printer
  - HP OfficeJet Pro 8724 All-in-One Printer
  - HP OfficeJet Pro 8725 All-in-One Printer
  - HP OfficeJet Pro 8726 All-in-One Printer
  - HP OfficeJet Pro 8727 All-in-One Printer
  - HP OfficeJet Pro 8728 All-in-One Printer


 When I look through them, these are actually only 5 models:

   - HP DesignJet T730 36-in Printer
   - HP DesignJet T830 Multifunction Printer
   - HP OfficeJet 8702 All-in-One Printer
    - HP OfficeJet Pro 8710 All-in-One Printer Series
   - HP OfficeJet Pro 8720 All-in-One Printer Series

When only the last digit of the number differs, these are only variants = with regional adaptations. The printer itself is the same but the power = supply can be 110 V or 220 V, the power cord can be with different plug = and the printers front panel (what is printed on the printer's shell) = can be in different languages.

So I would like to see the IEEE-1284 device IDs for that printers, as = for listing them on OpenPrinting.org, there should be one printer entry per = device ID.

I would then add a driver entry called "IPP Everywhere" and make it the = recommended "driver" for these printers.

I have also discovered a bug on

http://www.pwg.org/dynamo/eveprinters.php

The link of the HP OfficeJet 8702 All-in-One Printer leads to HP's page = of the HP OfficeJet Pro 8710 All-in-One Printer series.

   Till




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--Apple-Mail=_209EA7DA-E40F-431C-A197-505E6560BC00-- --===============3911257539237799596== Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline _______________________________________________ ipp mailing list ipp@pwg.org https://www.pwg.org/mailman/listinfo/ipp --===============3911257539237799596==-- From ipp-bounces@pwg.org Wed Oct 5 14:00:52 2016 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ietfarch-ipp-archive@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: ietfarch-ipp-archive@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id A3F68129481 for ; Wed, 5 Oct 2016 14:00:52 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -4.895 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-4.895 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, HEADER_FROM_DIFFERENT_DOMAINS=0.001, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE=-0.0001, RP_MATCHES_RCVD=-2.996, SPF_PASS=-0.001] autolearn=ham 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DF4PR84MB0284.NAMPRD84.PROD.OUTLOOK.COM (10.162.193.22) by DF4PR84MB0284.NAMPRD84.PROD.OUTLOOK.COM (10.162.193.22) with Microsoft SMTP Server (version=TLS1_2, cipher=TLS_ECDHE_RSA_WITH_AES_256_CBC_SHA384_P384) id 15.1.649.16; Wed, 5 Oct 2016 21:00:38 +0000 Received: from DF4PR84MB0284.NAMPRD84.PROD.OUTLOOK.COM ([10.162.193.22]) by DF4PR84MB0284.NAMPRD84.PROD.OUTLOOK.COM ([10.162.193.22]) with mapi id 15.01.0649.024; Wed, 5 Oct 2016 21:00:37 +0000 From: "Kennedy, Smith (Wireless Architect)" To: Till Kamppeter Thread-Topic: [IPP] First IPP Everywhere Self-Certified Printers !!! Thread-Index: AQHSH0dWruq6H3zKjkWPtUV9efa5MKCaWH0A Date: Wed, 5 Oct 2016 21:00:37 +0000 Message-ID: References: <1058A23C-A7A9-4088-A555-203B9AD81C5F@hp.com> In-Reply-To: <1058A23C-A7A9-4088-A555-203B9AD81C5F@hp.com> Accept-Language: en-US Content-Language: en-US X-MS-Has-Attach: yes X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: authentication-results: spf=none (sender IP is ) smtp.mailfrom=smith.kennedy@hp.com; x-ms-exchange-messagesentrepresentingtype: 1 x-originating-ip: [15.65.252.14] x-ms-office365-filtering-correlation-id: deef80b5-d4e5-4181-4f70-08d3ed62a888 x-microsoft-exchange-diagnostics: 1; DF4PR84MB0284; 6:L9sH4Gvs6IRegwQjpBmPI8PnEf/icm/7vzQ+iUshXzAElQuIPUvK+vKTEzvlXUdNz4Ceo6t/cOyVyrsH+gz8J2p8wkzKL6OyTxO+ROepje9tcqAL5ELm9uwhPlklVyYMGFDB6RVj256/EazuiZsEv1AHwptgX55jurlxhpXbKhVAaHjL3r52iKM3xJsAOYS7lHXEglzsPL8DRWHx/Xe2ajYkOFiEpIVmv3z98tAgqY0sFeB6FdnDBYcg+3AEXiVMbKLJP7Zej9ZcFOm73Rbwpm7PYkNXzNEAipb3zAAk2YHvEnDTQqKvzAFgtWX4wC/Y; 5:Crj2WaAsmL7vgjymRO5pmzLtRHK4AuuI3Tcufdf+TynCai9WviY/e1IJIWIKT12HVu6PrErgJH6yrvq/0dLimM6tQRog9BBoYGcDjg1AGXR7deouUWhLl6Bij9ge/gvDHM+81evYstU34sa7rdzwm5PbY2u1AnsU+6w6yolhf4o=; 24:h9ySS1pailRw3/0Yi6P06aV4JnxnRV+zU2u1Q8vQZzHpeR4h2ciS+wYsX/jbD5JMkaKpGyAlG4DyD66a+MK408eJETqYblvwgu/eUDg7nYU=; 7:OhRfoH3HBmDWKJkDRNGC0ASMHkSV7od0yYdij0pevaCXQU01mIGYsqyJL6xYVAr+nrKGcRZZso1DLAdyiXY97eEBR9aGCUgUCDfwLikh42Gk6g25OcKIXIuUwWe3c/EEJcwtYGm+xaE8ucnmkKDA05owNoSzJDwUQV/LxYexQG2P0XSy1QcwoDkLWqAOIrCeZS7aK8l2JwpNwoRK5MS6Nak0eWjXF44tgm6BlbKr+oEIIPF3U9ztfSDuo7wGM08W46Yepzw5EUwY2kNEcrK0O/MbwH7lYap+P77eFMndaOdHotk5bsTdJxtdXIo2Zsst8zrQdmrHwvryxXcGjd9U7Q== x-microsoft-antispam: UriScan:;BCL:0;PCL:0;RULEID:;SRVR:DF4PR84MB0284; x-microsoft-antispam-prvs: x-exchange-antispam-report-test: UriScan:(160780156254741)(111039206520245)(211936372134217)(73583498263828); x-exchange-antispam-report-cfa-test: BCL:0; PCL:0; RULEID:(102415321)(6040176)(601004)(2401047)(8121501046)(5005006)(10201501046)(3002001); SRVR:DF4PR84MB0284; BCL:0; PCL:0; RULEID:; SRVR:DF4PR84MB0284; x-forefront-prvs: 008663486A x-forefront-antispam-report: SFV:NSPM; SFS:(10019020)(7916002)(199003)(24454002)(45984002)(22974007)(6602003)(189002)(377454003)(15188155005)(50986999)(3280700002)(76176999)(19273905006)(54356999)(10400500002)(19617315012)(66066001)(99936001)(33656002)(19580405001)(19580395003)(101416001)(92566002)(77096005)(16236675004)(15395725005)(122556002)(2900100001)(97736004)(189998001)(5880100001)(68736007)(15975445007)(223973002)(8676002)(3660700001)(16799955002)(105586002)(93886004)(106356001)(4326007)(81166006)(99286002)(106116001)(81156014)(7846002)(8666005)(110136003)(2906002)(102836003)(36756003)(8936002)(87936001)(6116002)(83716003)(7736002)(5002640100001)(82746002)(3846002)(586003)(5660300001)(2950100002)(7906003)(6916009)(86362001)(7059030)(225543005)(16351025005)(104396002)(563064011); DIR:OUT; SFP:1102; SCL:1; SRVR:DF4PR84MB0284; H:DF4PR84MB0284.NAMPRD84.PROD.OUTLOOK.COM; FPR:; SPF:None; PTR:InfoNoRecords; A:1; MX:1; LANG:en; received-spf: None (protection.outlook.com: hp.com does not designate permitted sender hosts) spamdiagnosticoutput: 1:99 spamdiagnosticmetadata: NSPM MIME-Version: 1.0 X-OriginatorOrg: hp.com X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-originalarrivaltime: 05 Oct 2016 21:00:37.7513 (UTC) X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-fromentityheader: Hosted X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-id: ca7981a2-785a-463d-b82a-3db87dfc3ce6 X-MS-Exchange-Transport-CrossTenantHeadersStamped: DF4PR84MB0284 Cc: "ipp@pwg.org" Subject: Re: [IPP] First IPP Everywhere Self-Certified Printers !!! X-BeenThere: ipp@pwg.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15 Precedence: list List-Id: Internet Printing Protocol Workgroup discussion list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="===============1483286779987754283==" Errors-To: ipp-bounces@pwg.org Sender: "ipp" --===============1483286779987754283== Content-Language: en-US Content-Type: multipart/signed; boundary="Apple-Mail=_1A623F9D-7F56-42D7-A9BC-F619202B9FBA"; protocol="application/pkcs7-signature"; micalg=sha1 --Apple-Mail=_1A623F9D-7F56-42D7-A9BC-F619202B9FBA Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="Apple-Mail=_52ABFA47-B876-470E-96E0-C6AD21F8BA6A" --Apple-Mail=_52ABFA47-B876-470E-96E0-C6AD21F8BA6A Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Oh, and I just noticed that the site will already filter the list based = on values in the (invisible) model family field. Smith > On Oct 5, 2016, at 2:30 PM, Kennedy, Smith (Wireless Architect) = wrote: >=20 > Hi Ira and Till, >=20 > The submission web form and the site includes fields for both model = name and family name. Once the page has more printers, we could consider = a more sophisticated way of presenting them. For instance, the top = level list might only listing family names, and clicking on the link = would take you to a sub-page for that family / filter the view on that = family / reveal additional sub-rows that list the individual model = strings. >=20 > On that subject, Mike, is there any logic that checks the fields in = the web form against the content of the .plist files? >=20 > I fixed the URL for the OfficeJet 8702. >=20 > Smith >=20 > /** > Smith Kennedy > Wireless Architect - Client Software - IPG-PPS > Standards - IEEE ISTO PWG / Bluetooth SIG / Wi-Fi Alliance / NFC = Forum / USB IF > Chair, IEEE ISTO Printer Working Group > HP Inc. > */ >=20 >=20 >=20 >> On Oct 5, 2016, at 2:03 PM, Ira McDonald > wrote: >>=20 >> Hi, >>=20 >> Per our brief discussion during today's IPP WG call, please consider >> Till's comments and feature request (IEEE 1284 DeviceID values for >> certified printers). Please reply here on IPP mailing list and copy >> Till on your response. >>=20 >> Cheers, >> - Ira >>=20 >> Ira McDonald (Musician / Software Architect) >> Co-Chair - TCG Trusted Mobility Solutions WG >> Chair - Linux Foundation Open Printing WG >> Secretary - IEEE-ISTO Printer Working Group >> Co-Chair - IEEE-ISTO PWG Internet Printing Protocol WG >> IETF Designated Expert - IPP & Printer MIB >> Blue Roof Music / High North Inc >> http://sites.google.com/site/blueroofmusic = >> http://sites.google.com/site/highnorthinc = >> mailto: blueroofmusic@gmail.com >> Jan-April: 579 Park Place Saline, MI 48176 734-944-0094 >> May-Dec: PO Box 221 Grand Marais, MI 49839 906-494-2434 >>=20 >>=20 >> ---------- Forwarded message ---------- >> From: Till Kamppeter > >> Date: Tue, Oct 4, 2016 at 9:11 PM >> Subject: Re: Fwd: First IPP Everywhere Self-Certified Printers !!! >> To: Ira McDonald >, = "printing-architecture@lists.linux-foundation.org = " = >, Matthew = Morikawa > >>=20 >>=20 >> On 10/04/2016 01:45 PM, Ira McDonald wrote: >> Hi, >>=20 >> I'm very pleased to announce the HP has successfully self-certified >> twenty (20) IPP Everywhere Printer models! >>=20 >>=20 >> Thank you very much for the info. >>=20 >> And congrats to HP to certify the first ones. >>=20 >>=20 >> The following new IPP Everywhere Printers have been submitted to the = PWG >> web site: >>=20 >> - HP DesignJet T730 36-in Printer >> - HP DesignJet T830 Multifunction Printer >> - HP OfficeJet 8702 All-in-One Printer >> - HP OfficeJet Pro 8710 All-in-One Printer >> - HP OfficeJet Pro 8712 All-in-One Printer >> - HP OfficeJet Pro 8714 All-in-One Printer >> - HP OfficeJet Pro 8715 All-in-One Printer >> - HP OfficeJet Pro 8716 All-in-One Printer >> - HP OfficeJet Pro 8717 All-in-One Printer >> - HP OfficeJet Pro 8718 All-in-One Printer >> - HP OfficeJet Pro 8719 All-in-One Printer >> - HP OfficeJet Pro 8720 All-in-One Printer >> - HP OfficeJet Pro 8722 All-in-One Printer >> - HP OfficeJet Pro 8723 All-in-One Printer >> - HP OfficeJet Pro 8724 All-in-One Printer >> - HP OfficeJet Pro 8725 All-in-One Printer >> - HP OfficeJet Pro 8726 All-in-One Printer >> - HP OfficeJet Pro 8727 All-in-One Printer >> - HP OfficeJet Pro 8728 All-in-One Printer >>=20 >>=20 >> When I look through them, these are actually only 5 models: >>=20 >> - HP DesignJet T730 36-in Printer >> - HP DesignJet T830 Multifunction Printer >> - HP OfficeJet 8702 All-in-One Printer >> - HP OfficeJet Pro 8710 All-in-One Printer Series >> - HP OfficeJet Pro 8720 All-in-One Printer Series >>=20 >> When only the last digit of the number differs, these are only = variants with regional adaptations. The printer itself is the same but = the power supply can be 110 V or 220 V, the power cord can be with = different plug and the printers front panel (what is printed on the = printer's shell) can be in different languages. >>=20 >> So I would like to see the IEEE-1284 device IDs for that printers, as = for listing them on OpenPrinting.org , there = should be one printer entry per device ID. >>=20 >> I would then add a driver entry called "IPP Everywhere" and make it = the recommended "driver" for these printers. >>=20 >> I have also discovered a bug on >>=20 >> http://www.pwg.org/dynamo/eveprinters.php = >>=20 >> The link of the HP OfficeJet 8702 All-in-One Printer leads to HP's = page of the HP OfficeJet Pro 8710 All-in-One Printer series. >>=20 >> Till >>=20 >>=20 >>=20 >=20 > _______________________________________________ > ipp mailing list > ipp@pwg.org > https://www.pwg.org/mailman/listinfo/ipp --Apple-Mail=_52ABFA47-B876-470E-96E0-C6AD21F8BA6A Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Type: text/html; charset=us-ascii Oh, and I just noticed that the site will already filter the = list based on values in the (invisible) model family field.

Smith



On Oct 5, 2016, at 2:30 PM, Kennedy, Smith (Wireless = Architect) <smith.kennedy@hp.com> wrote:

Hi Ira and = Till,

The submission web form and the site includes fields for both = model name and family name. Once the page has more printers, we could = consider a more sophisticated way of presenting them.  For = instance, the top level list might only listing family names, and = clicking on the link would take you to a sub-page for that family / = filter the view on that family / reveal additional sub-rows that list = the individual model strings.

On that subject, Mike, is there any = logic that checks the fields in the web form against the content of the = .plist files?

I = fixed the URL for the OfficeJet 8702.

Smith

/**
    Smith = Kennedy
    Wireless Architect - Client Software = - IPG-PPS
    Standards - IEEE ISTO PWG / = Bluetooth SIG / Wi-Fi Alliance / NFC Forum / USB IF
    Chair, IEEE ISTO Printer Working Group
    HP Inc.
*/



On Oct 5, 2016, at 2:03 PM, Ira McDonald <blueroofmusic@gmail.com> wrote:

Hi,

Per our brief = discussion during today's IPP WG call, please consider
Till's comments and feature request (IEEE 1284 DeviceID = values for
certified printers).   Please = reply here on IPP mailing list and copy
Till on your = response.

Cheers,
-= Ira

Ira McDonald (Musician / Software = Architect)
Co-Chair - TCG Trusted Mobility Solutions WG
Chair - Linux Foundation Open Printing WG
Secretary - IEEE-ISTO Printer Working Group
Co-Chair - IEEE-ISTO PWG Internet Printing Protocol WG
IETF Designated Expert - IPP & Printer MIB
Blue Roof Music / High North Inc
http://sites.google.com/site/blueroofmusic
http://sites.google.com/site/highnorthinc
mailto: blueroofmusic@gmail.com
Jan-April: 579 Park Place  Saline, MI  48176  = 734-944-0094
May-Dec: PO Box 221  Grand Marais, MI = 49839  906-494-2434


---------- Forwarded message = ----------
From: Till = Kamppeter <till.kamppeter@gmail.com>
Date: = Tue, Oct 4, 2016 at 9:11 PM
Subject: Re: Fwd: First IPP = Everywhere Self-Certified Printers !!!
To: Ira McDonald = <blueroofmusic@gmail.com>, "printing-architecture@lists.linux-foundation.org" <printing-architecture@lists.linux-foundation.org>, = Matthew Morikawa <Matthew.Morikawa@dda.kyocera.com>


On 10/04/2016 01:45 PM, Ira = McDonald wrote:
Hi,

I'm very pleased to announce the HP has successfully self-certified
twenty (20) IPP Everywhere Printer models!


 Thank you very much for the info.

And congrats to HP to certify the first ones.


The following new IPP Everywhere Printers have been submitted to the = PWG
web site:

  - HP DesignJet T730 36-in Printer
  - HP DesignJet T830 Multifunction Printer
  - HP OfficeJet 8702 All-in-One Printer
  - HP OfficeJet Pro 8710 All-in-One Printer
  - HP OfficeJet Pro 8712 All-in-One Printer
  - HP OfficeJet Pro 8714 All-in-One Printer
  - HP OfficeJet Pro 8715 All-in-One Printer
  - HP OfficeJet Pro 8716 All-in-One Printer
  - HP OfficeJet Pro 8717 All-in-One Printer
  - HP OfficeJet Pro 8718 All-in-One Printer
  - HP OfficeJet Pro 8719 All-in-One Printer
  - HP OfficeJet Pro 8720 All-in-One Printer
  - HP OfficeJet Pro 8722 All-in-One Printer
  - HP OfficeJet Pro 8723 All-in-One Printer
  - HP OfficeJet Pro 8724 All-in-One Printer
  - HP OfficeJet Pro 8725 All-in-One Printer
  - HP OfficeJet Pro 8726 All-in-One Printer
  - HP OfficeJet Pro 8727 All-in-One Printer
  - HP OfficeJet Pro 8728 All-in-One Printer


 When I look through them, these are actually only 5 models:

   - HP DesignJet T730 36-in Printer
   - HP DesignJet T830 Multifunction Printer
   - HP OfficeJet 8702 All-in-One Printer
    - HP OfficeJet Pro 8710 All-in-One Printer Series
   - HP OfficeJet Pro 8720 All-in-One Printer Series

When only the last digit of the number differs, these are only variants = with regional adaptations. The printer itself is the same but the power = supply can be 110 V or 220 V, the power cord can be with different plug = and the printers front panel (what is printed on the printer's shell) = can be in different languages.

So I would like to see the IEEE-1284 device IDs for that printers, as = for listing them on OpenPrinting.org, there should be one printer entry per = device ID.

I would then add a driver entry called "IPP Everywhere" and make it the = recommended "driver" for these printers.

I have also discovered a bug on

http://www.pwg.org/dynamo/eveprinters.php

The link of the HP OfficeJet 8702 All-in-One Printer leads to HP's page = of the HP OfficeJet Pro 8710 All-in-One Printer series.

   Till




_____________________________________________= __
ipp mailing list
ipp@pwg.org
https://www.pwg.org/mailman/listinfo/ipp

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[17.128.113.87]) by mail-in5.apple.com (Apple Secure Mail Relay) with SMTP id 6D.E5.07165.36856F75; Thu, 6 Oct 2016 06:57:55 -0700 (PDT) X-AuditID: 11973e13-41e679a000001bfd-ec-57f658630208 Received: from nwk-mmpp-sz10.apple.com (nwk-mmpp-sz10.apple.com [17.128.115.122]) by relay4.apple.com (Apple SCV relay) with SMTP id 48.21.20305.36856F75; Thu, 6 Oct 2016 06:57:55 -0700 (PDT) MIME-version: 1.0 Received: from [17.153.59.161] by nwk-mmpp-sz10.apple.com (Oracle Communications Messaging Server 8.0.1.1.0 64bit (built Jun 15 2016)) with ESMTPSA id <0OEM0040KPGHJN10@nwk-mmpp-sz10.apple.com>; Thu, 06 Oct 2016 06:57:55 -0700 (PDT) From: Michael Sweet In-reply-to: <1058A23C-A7A9-4088-A555-203B9AD81C5F@hp.com> Date: Thu, 06 Oct 2016 09:57:53 -0400 Message-id: References: <1058A23C-A7A9-4088-A555-203B9AD81C5F@hp.com> To: Smith Kennedy X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.3226) X-Brightmail-Tracker: H4sIAAAAAAAAA+NgFjrFLMWRmVeSWpSXmKPExsUi2FAYrpsc8S3coOGjisXrV0vZLY7te8li 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X-BeenThere: ipp@pwg.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15 Precedence: list List-Id: Internet Printing Protocol Workgroup discussion list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: ipp-bounces@pwg.org Sender: "ipp" Smith, > On Oct 5, 2016, at 4:30 PM, Kennedy, Smith (Wireless Architect) wrote: > > Hi Ira and Till, > > The submission web form and the site includes fields for both model name and family name. Once the page has more printers, we could consider a more sophisticated way of presenting them. For instance, the top level list might only listing family names, and clicking on the link would take you to a sub-page for that family / filter the view on that family / reveal additional sub-rows that list the individual model strings. > > On that subject, Mike, is there any logic that checks the fields in the web form against the content of the .plist files? No. I considered checking that at least one of the make/model strings matched the printer-make-and-model string, but because vendors are allowed to submit results for a whole product family (or submit new models within the product family using the same test results) I decided against it. _________________________________________________________ Michael Sweet, Senior Printing System Engineer _______________________________________________ ipp mailing list ipp@pwg.org https://www.pwg.org/mailman/listinfo/ipp From ipp-bounces@pwg.org Thu Oct 6 07:11:48 2016 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ietfarch-ipp-archive@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: ietfarch-ipp-archive@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 954B11296A3 for ; Thu, 6 Oct 2016 07:11:48 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -4.786 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-4.786 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, HEADER_FROM_DIFFERENT_DOMAINS=0.001, RP_MATCHES_RCVD=-2.996, SPF_PASS=-0.001, T_DKIM_INVALID=0.01] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); 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Thu, 6 Oct 2016 07:10:42 -0700 (PDT) MIME-version: 1.0 Received: from [17.153.59.161] by nwk-mmpp-sz10.apple.com (Oracle Communications Messaging Server 8.0.1.1.0 64bit (built Jun 15 2016)) with ESMTPSA id <0OEM00FYKQ1TAG20@nwk-mmpp-sz10.apple.com>; Thu, 06 Oct 2016 07:10:42 -0700 (PDT) From: Michael Sweet In-reply-to: Date: Thu, 06 Oct 2016 10:10:40 -0400 Message-id: References: To: Ira McDonald X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.3226) X-Brightmail-Tracker: H4sIAAAAAAAAA+NgFjrMLMWRmVeSWpSXmKPExsUi2FAYrpsc/S3c4BO3xetXS9ktju17yWLx qmsXs0Xj5t3sDiweO2fdZffYtW0nk8e8xdOZApijuGxSUnMyy1KL9O0SuDK+fEwpuMFbcfCX XgPjLO4uRk4OCQETiWOTj7B1MXJxCAnsZZTofbeDGSZxeOtNdhBbSOAQo8SqeYUgNq+AoMSP yfdYuhg5OJgF5CUOnpcFCTMLaEl8f9TKAlH+jlFi74oiEFtYQELieP9CVgjbVqJp/Xswm01A TeL3pD4wm1MgWGLTmR42EJtFQFXiw7QrzBDjiySutrpCbLWRmLbuHDvEmWcYJe4/n8wOUiMC tHfJc0UQU0JAVmL2Ly+QEgmBGWwS6x4+Yp3AKDwLydGzEI6eheToBYzMqxiFchMzc3Qz80z0 EgsKclL1kvNzNzGCQn26ndAOxlOrrA4xCnAwKvHwGoR8CxdiTSwrrsw9xCjNwaIkzsv64XO4 kEB6YklqdmpqQWpRfFFpTmrxIUYmDk6pBkZBy0Ot6YzGcRIWbufyVobPfKwxe36ezsdp7x+q 7U5yvhuvH8M5PeSjoq/35ufRp1au/dX1fH1Q2//fe//8Klgi+PfH/PS+oMyTjYYu9xYejlze dV3vu3JEeIr10X8urjUXmgJYr3NP3v/q9SkWlyaXzVkvFBTacheXbkhcarpDN8nh4R+uQ6xK LMUZiYZazEXFiQAT5+z3VgIAAA== X-Brightmail-Tracker: H4sIAAAAAAAAA+NgFjrMLMWRmVeSWpSXmKPExsUi2FBcpZsU/S3coGGNscXrV0vZLY7te8li 8aprF7NF4+bd7A4sHjtn3WX32LVtJ5PHvMXTmQKYo7hsUlJzMstSi/TtErgyvnxMKbjBW3Hw l14D4yzuLkZODgkBE4nDW2+yQ9hiEhfurWcDsYUEDjFKrJpXCGLzCghK/Jh8j6WLkYODWUBe 4uB5WZAws4CWxPdHrSwQ5e8YJfauKAKxhQUkJI73L2SFsG0lmta/B7PZBNQkfk/qA7M5BYIl Np3pAVvFIqAq8WHaFWaI8UUSV1tdIbbaSExbdw7oMi6g8WcYJe4/n8wOUiMCtHfJc0UQU0JA VmL2L68JjIKzkNw5C+HOWUjuXMDIvIpRoCg1J7HSRC+xoCAnVS85P3cTIzhoC8N3MP5bZnWI UYCDUYmH90bgt3Ah1sSy4spcYDhwMCuJ8G6MAArxpiRWVqUW5ccXleakFh9ilOZgURLn3X35 U7iQQHpiSWp2ampBahFMlomDU6qB0e1aWMj5h6Imwlormy2WLBUIt0lf6MLffvtiunJkx+Jz FV/M9/oyP9RhUVF/YmSxUvPPZ8ULp35P3v7aaP7rkG67adzpJzSnfS40fPREwfh/WobCJp0g 3dY7XI6xjVOq5jKk183c+IXl9Jfjj7fyX1Dr5/W3SPpeNznBrrCrr+3W8see7kbTlFiKMxIN tZiLihMBVw/4t1YCAAA= Cc: "ipp@pwg.org" , Till Kamppeter Subject: Re: [IPP] First IPP Everywhere Self-Certified Printers !!! X-BeenThere: ipp@pwg.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15 Precedence: list List-Id: Internet Printing Protocol Workgroup discussion list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: ipp-bounces@pwg.org Sender: "ipp" All, > On Oct 5, 2016, at 4:03 PM, Ira McDonald wrote: > > Hi, > > Per our brief discussion during today's IPP WG call, please consider > Till's comments and feature request (IEEE 1284 DeviceID values for > certified printers). Please reply here on IPP mailing list and copy > Till on your response. > ... > When only the last digit of the number differs, these are only variants with regional adaptations. The printer itself is the same but the power supply can be 110 V or 220 V, the power cord can be with different plug and the printers front panel (what is printed on the printer's shell) can be in different languages. > > So I would like to see the IEEE-1284 device IDs for that printers, as for listing them on OpenPrinting.org, there should be one printer entry per device ID. While we did decide to require printer-device-id for IPP Everywhere, it was done for interoperability with legacy operating systems and print spoolers that use printer drivers - there is nothing in there that says "this is an IPP Everywhere Printer". The closest you will get is to see "image/pwg-raster" or "PWGRaster" in the "CMD" field of the 1284 device ID, which indicates that the printer supports the required raster format for IPP Everywhere. Clients know a printer supports IPP Everywhere by the presence of the 'ipp-everywhere' string in the "ipp-features-supported" Printer Description attribute. So I don't see any point in adding the 1284 device ID to the IPP Everywhere printer database. You only need it to match with a non-IPP Everywhere printer driver instead of the generic driver. _________________________________________________________ Michael Sweet, Senior Printing System Engineer _______________________________________________ ipp mailing list ipp@pwg.org https://www.pwg.org/mailman/listinfo/ipp From ipp-bounces@pwg.org Mon Oct 10 14:00:03 2016 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ietfarch-ipp-archive@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: ietfarch-ipp-archive@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 34E59129774 for ; Mon, 10 Oct 2016 14:00:03 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.561 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.561 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, HEADER_FROM_DIFFERENT_DOMAINS=0.001, RCVD_IN_SBL_CSS=3.335, RP_MATCHES_RCVD=-2.996, SPF_PASS=-0.001] autolearn=no autolearn_force=no Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id ulPPKCeSElqZ for ; Mon, 10 Oct 2016 14:00:01 -0700 (PDT) Received: from www.pwg.org (www.pwg.org [IPv6:2600:3c01::f03c:91ff:fe70:b03f]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 92FCD12977F for ; Mon, 10 Oct 2016 14:00:01 -0700 (PDT) Received: by www.pwg.org (Postfix, from userid 1002) id A53E64424; Mon, 10 Oct 2016 20:59:59 +0000 (UTC) Received: from www.pwg.org (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by www.pwg.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2CA3C27B2; Mon, 10 Oct 2016 20:59:57 +0000 (UTC) X-Original-To: ipp@pwg.org Delivered-To: ipp@pwg.org Received: by www.pwg.org (Postfix, from userid 48) id 0D4FC27B2; Mon, 10 Oct 2016 20:59:56 +0000 (UTC) To: ipp@pwg.org X-PHP-Originating-Script: 1000:db-issue.php From: smith.kennedy@hp.com Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 Date: Mon, 10 Oct 2016 20:59:56 +0000 (UTC) Subject: [IPP] [PWG5100.13] Issue #51: Undefined reference to "[IANAPRT]" X-BeenThere: ipp@pwg.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15 Precedence: list List-Id: Internet Printing Protocol Workgroup discussion list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Reply-To: webmaster@pwg.org Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: ipp-bounces@pwg.org Sender: "ipp" [Issue Unconfirmed] In the ABNF for "printer-input-tray", "printer-output-tray" and "printer-supply", there are references to "[IANAPRT]". Unfortunately, the References section (Section 15) lacks any definition of this reference. Link: http://www.pwg.org/issues/51 _______________________________________________ ipp mailing list ipp@pwg.org https://www.pwg.org/mailman/listinfo/ipp From ipp-bounces@pwg.org Mon Oct 10 14:13:12 2016 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ietfarch-ipp-archive@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: ietfarch-ipp-archive@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0A5CC1293E8 for ; Mon, 10 Oct 2016 14:13:12 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.447 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.447 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_ADSP_CUSTOM_MED=0.001, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, FREEMAIL_FORGED_FROMDOMAIN=0.001, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, HEADER_FROM_DIFFERENT_DOMAINS=0.001, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, RCVD_IN_SBL_CSS=3.335, RP_MATCHES_RCVD=-2.996, SPF_PASS=-0.001, T_DKIM_INVALID=0.01] autolearn=no autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=fail (2048-bit key) reason="fail (body has been altered)" header.d=gmail.com Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id DKrvgeeeWrFU for ; 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Mon, 10 Oct 2016 14:13:00 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 Received: by 10.28.16.77 with HTTP; Mon, 10 Oct 2016 14:12:39 -0700 (PDT) In-Reply-To: References: From: Ira McDonald Date: Mon, 10 Oct 2016 17:12:39 -0400 Message-ID: To: webmaster@pwg.org, Ira McDonald Cc: "ipp@pwg.org" Subject: Re: [IPP] [PWG5100.13] Issue #51: Undefined reference to "[IANAPRT]" X-BeenThere: ipp@pwg.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15 Precedence: list List-Id: Internet Printing Protocol Workgroup discussion list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="===============5423109000847889830==" Errors-To: ipp-bounces@pwg.org Sender: "ipp" --===============5423109000847889830== Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary=001a11c3aa6c872eab053e8939ee --001a11c3aa6c872eab053e8939ee Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 Hi Smith, This reference should point to IANA Printer MIB at this durable URI: https://www.iana.org/assignments/ianaprinter-mib/ianaprinter-mib Cheers, - Ira Ira McDonald (Musician / Software Architect) Co-Chair - TCG Trusted Mobility Solutions WG Chair - Linux Foundation Open Printing WG Secretary - IEEE-ISTO Printer Working Group Co-Chair - IEEE-ISTO PWG Internet Printing Protocol WG IETF Designated Expert - IPP & Printer MIB Blue Roof Music / High North Inc http://sites.google.com/site/blueroofmusic http://sites.google.com/site/highnorthinc mailto: blueroofmusic@gmail.com Jan-April: 579 Park Place Saline, MI 48176 734-944-0094 May-Dec: PO Box 221 Grand Marais, MI 49839 906-494-2434 On Mon, Oct 10, 2016 at 4:59 PM, wrote: > [Issue Unconfirmed] > > In the ABNF for "printer-input-tray", "printer-output-tray" and > "printer-supply", there are references to "[IANAPRT]". Unfortunately, the > References section (Section 15) lacks any definition of this reference. > > Link: http://www.pwg.org/issues/51 > > _______________________________________________ > ipp mailing list > ipp@pwg.org > https://www.pwg.org/mailman/listinfo/ipp > --001a11c3aa6c872eab053e8939ee Content-Type: text/html; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Hi Smith,

This reference shoul= d point to IANA Printer MIB at this durable URI:

https://www.iana.= org/assignments/ianaprinter-mib/ianaprinter-mib

Cheers,
- Ira


Ira McDonald (Musician / Software Architect)=
Co-Chair - TCG Trusted Mobility Solutions WG
Chair - Linux Foundatio= n Open Printing WG
Secretary - IEEE-ISTO Printer Working Group
Co-Cha= ir - IEEE-ISTO PWG Internet Printing Protocol WG
IETF Designated Expert = - IPP & Printer MIB
Blue Roof Music / High North Inc
http://sites.google.com/site/blueroofmusic
http://sites.google.com/site/highnorthinc
mailto= : blueroofmusi= c@gmail.com
Jan-April: 579 Park Place=C2=A0 Saline, MI=C2=A0 48176= =C2=A0 734-944-0094
May-Dec: PO Box 221=C2=A0 Grand Marais, MI 49839=C2= =A0 906-494-2434


On Mon, Oct 10, 2016 at 4:59 PM, <smit= h.kennedy@hp.com> wrote:
[I= ssue Unconfirmed]

In the ABNF for "printer-input-tray", "printer-output-tray&q= uot; and
"printer-supply", there are references to "[IANAPRT]". = Unfortunately, the
References section (Section 15) lacks any definition of this reference.

Link: http://www.pwg.org/issues/51

_______________________________________________
ipp mailing list
ipp@pwg.org
https://www.pwg.org/mailman/listinfo/ipp

--001a11c3aa6c872eab053e8939ee-- --===============5423109000847889830== Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline _______________________________________________ ipp mailing list ipp@pwg.org https://www.pwg.org/mailman/listinfo/ipp --===============5423109000847889830==-- From ipp-bounces@pwg.org Mon Oct 10 22:36:48 2016 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ietfarch-ipp-archive@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: ietfarch-ipp-archive@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2A23B1295D6 for ; Mon, 10 Oct 2016 22:36:48 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -4.896 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-4.896 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, HEADER_FROM_DIFFERENT_DOMAINS=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE=-0.0001, RP_MATCHES_RCVD=-2.996, SPF_PASS=-0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id I6-x7-0-PdBf for ; Mon, 10 Oct 2016 22:36:45 -0700 (PDT) Received: from www.pwg.org (www.pwg.org [50.116.7.199]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id D5A8B12947C for ; Mon, 10 Oct 2016 22:36:45 -0700 (PDT) Received: by www.pwg.org (Postfix, from userid 1002) id 931B64417; Tue, 11 Oct 2016 05:36:44 +0000 (UTC) Received: from www.pwg.org (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by www.pwg.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id CD262415B; Tue, 11 Oct 2016 05:36:39 +0000 (UTC) X-Original-To: ipp@pwg.org Delivered-To: ipp@pwg.org Received: by www.pwg.org (Postfix, from userid 1002) id C89AE415E; Tue, 11 Oct 2016 05:36:38 +0000 (UTC) Received: from NAM02-CY1-obe.outbound.protection.outlook.com (mail-cys01nam02on0103.outbound.protection.outlook.com [104.47.37.103]) by www.pwg.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id DB8C62668 for ; Tue, 11 Oct 2016 05:36:36 +0000 (UTC) Received: from DF4PR84MB0284.NAMPRD84.PROD.OUTLOOK.COM (10.162.193.22) by DF4PR84MB0281.NAMPRD84.PROD.OUTLOOK.COM (10.162.193.19) with Microsoft SMTP Server (version=TLS1_2, cipher=TLS_ECDHE_RSA_WITH_AES_256_CBC_SHA384_P384) id 15.1.659.11; Tue, 11 Oct 2016 05:36:35 +0000 Received: from DF4PR84MB0284.NAMPRD84.PROD.OUTLOOK.COM ([10.162.193.22]) by DF4PR84MB0284.NAMPRD84.PROD.OUTLOOK.COM ([10.162.193.22]) with mapi id 15.01.0659.020; Tue, 11 Oct 2016 05:36:35 +0000 From: "Kennedy, Smith (Wireless Architect)" To: "ipp@pwg.org" Thread-Topic: [IPP] Why are some attributes that provide a dateTime data type allowed to specify 'no-value' while others are not? 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X-BeenThere: ipp@pwg.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15 Precedence: list List-Id: Internet Printing Protocol Workgroup discussion list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="===============3658104637053777679==" Errors-To: ipp-bounces@pwg.org Sender: "ipp" --===============3658104637053777679== Content-Language: en-US Content-Type: multipart/signed; boundary="Apple-Mail=_5105A790-13B6-4503-AEED-439CB560DF72"; protocol="application/pkcs7-signature"; micalg=sha1 --Apple-Mail=_5105A790-13B6-4503-AEED-439CB560DF72 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Just replying for the sake of posterity - this was discussed in the Oct. = 5 IPP WG meeting, where we decided that "printer-current-time" should be = able to hold a value of "unknown". See the minutes from that meeting for = details. Smith > On Oct 2, 2016, at 10:48 AM, Michael Sweet wrote: >=20 > Smith, >=20 >> On Oct 2, 2016, at 9:03 AM, Kennedy, Smith (Wireless Architect) = wrote: >>=20 >> Hi Mike, >>=20 >> If the Printer has no battery-maintained clock and doesn't have = something like NTP configured to allow it to determine the time once it = has powered up, it isn't clear to me how the Printer will set the value = of "date-time-at-creation" to something other than 'no-value'. >=20 > Probably the best thing is to omit the attribute if the RTC is not = configured when the job is created, or not accept new jobs until the = clock is set... But a strict interpretation of the spec would have the = Printer copying the 'no-value' from "printer-current-time" to the = "date-time-at-creation" attribute. >=20 >> RFC 2911 section 4.4.30 = (https://tools.ietf.org/html/rfc2911#section-4.4.30) says this: >>=20 >> 4.4.30 printer-current-time (dateTime) >>=20 >> This Printer attribute indicates the current date and time. This >> value is used to populate the Event Time Job Description = attributes: >> "date-time-at-creation", "date-time-at-processing", and "date-time- >> at-completed" (see Section 4.3.14). >>=20 >> The date and time is obtained on a "best efforts basis" and does = not >> have to be that precise in order to work in practice. A Printer >> implementation sets the value of this attribute by obtaining the = date >> and time via some implementation-dependent means, such as getting = the >> value from a network time server, initialization at time of >> manufacture, or setting by an administrator. See [IPP-IIG] for >> examples. If an implementation supports this attribute and the >> implementation knows that it has not yet been set, then the >> implementation MUST return the value of this attribute using the >> out-of-band =E2=80=99no-value=E2=80=99 meaning not configured. See = the beginning of >> section 4.1. >=20 > RFC 2566 (IPP/1.0) did not have the second paragraph... Under our = current guidance for 'no-value' and 'unknown' usage, this attribute = SHOULD report 'unknown' when the date and time is not yet configured = since, like "printer-geo-location", there is always a current date and = time - the value is merely unknown. >=20 > We should discuss whether to change this to 'unknown' when RFC2911bis = hits AUTH48 at our Wednesday conference call. >=20 > _________________________________________________________ > Michael Sweet, Senior Printing System Engineer >=20 --Apple-Mail=_5105A790-13B6-4503-AEED-439CB560DF72 Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="smime.p7s" Content-Type: application/pkcs7-signature; name="smime.p7s" Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64 MIAGCSqGSIb3DQEHAqCAMIACAQExCzAJBgUrDgMCGgUAMIAGCSqGSIb3DQEHAQAAoIIOQDCCBmEw ggVJoAMCAQICEDtXE7awITX7XkZ1ymyyxOEwDQYJKoZIhvcNAQEFBQAwgcoxCzAJBgNVBAYTAlVT MRcwFQYDVQQKEw5WZXJpU2lnbiwgSW5jLjEfMB0GA1UECxMWVmVyaVNpZ24gVHJ1c3QgTmV0d29y 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Self-Certified Printers !!! Thread-Index: AQHSH9uCiW3AdI0mh0i1+zlP78oaj6CixDoA Date: Tue, 11 Oct 2016 05:40:29 +0000 Message-ID: <6AEA86E0-D327-44C1-BFE0-86870BBB3364@hp.com> References: In-Reply-To: Accept-Language: en-US Content-Language: en-US X-MS-Has-Attach: yes X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: authentication-results: spf=none (sender IP is ) smtp.mailfrom=smith.kennedy@hp.com; x-ms-exchange-messagesentrepresentingtype: 1 x-originating-ip: [97.121.8.187] x-ms-office365-filtering-correlation-id: 0c2eb6d7-7796-45ec-0a15-08d3f1991c19 x-microsoft-exchange-diagnostics: 1; DF4PR84MB0283; 6:ZRO71MRvl3v9VevJKYecvKju7baNPGJERE8yxb7mM1UD2hyP64LkMPlEh0IRlGC7mfimpeSE104IGEk1MvyiQ8wYBtW1jBhw2Im9o0h9fo1Pqr/X/ne/VSYHPHkSEf7Kr96WixzAeqSDgmrunSjoDYD/1himTWJ3UtnKJ1rsIiB+zMsINl0qnBJwF45Qa+kT/LyuCoxzFdUV1OyaHFrA5+J/0Aj5orXlaLbi7P9aAcB5wj79kNt6tttLbC5rbESAFackz8syleN1MFe+leRK/c5K1m1iNHWvtoaL2Yod0Es0NkDo4ByAfR6awxjwuuhK; 5:MHsF9mVqkdQDHywaWWN1TWYtcLLeEiVy92HnwS9+QdCeSAXR//63ZTVRumWe3et+iFu969wH9gGDZPbOea3Zbmfzvzg7UrEb4MyZnDKxut0lirV14gIV+q5knLsuJxYZZa/ZbT6Rz59gv5QfkOVLHQ==; 24:Lb8nvkK9IzG9Ukk4HYGKTCu4WvCBE2oBRKhqHa4sE4OV6+JejLHcOgM+tQaMHBET81CvgiVL8VBiqdSXWmk+zBKbjs/EGpeIls88h3MczzU=; 7:H7lr8pTSRC/4RV0jflmDH8ItBH3fAVdN9XeTPiTKbjFlNC5NPEIPle918VSrYIm5b77/aa8U6MP5F0PrlorPGpikopfUGW5dte34kihPJDPXWtw3XVP0H09P3p45cirq/JyYZU0DypZe+v/UB9auuAPUynkP1zk5WojsPWOzPOaI5cH9t7Gb8Y//fTHUxPWnyGEaaBFTS+JyJ18s1XUdn5yZpIoNW/bGuIJHi+qmoPneNJOfqqArpPFYxOu24OKPx/NiWyR0l/W0FzHWNWNIAp1kujmLXYYTxrW/7mR4D67rnIH5p3/nJfBGfHLQPd1FrDNXJhmyWECEVnrY0cyTN77gYDtRxJquWpgFtbUhl3Q= x-microsoft-antispam: UriScan:;BCL:0;PCL:0;RULEID:;SRVR:DF4PR84MB0283; x-microsoft-antispam-prvs: x-exchange-antispam-report-test: UriScan:(31960201722614); x-exchange-antispam-report-cfa-test: BCL:0; PCL:0; RULEID:(102415321)(6040176)(601004)(2401047)(8121501046)(5005006)(3002001)(10201501046); SRVR:DF4PR84MB0283; BCL:0; PCL:0; RULEID:; SRVR:DF4PR84MB0283; x-forefront-prvs: 00922518D8 x-forefront-antispam-report: SFV:NSPM; SFS:(10019020)(6009001)(7916002)(377454003)(6602003)(189002)(199003)(24454002)(122556002)(101416001)(6916009)(3660700001)(92566002)(5660300001)(2950100002)(223973002)(54356999)(50986999)(33656002)(110136003)(19580405001)(19580395003)(86362001)(76176999)(2906002)(3280700002)(8936002)(10400500002)(8676002)(68736007)(189998001)(82746002)(93886004)(8666005)(4326007)(106356001)(2900100001)(106116001)(102836003)(97736004)(77096005)(99286002)(83716003)(305945005)(105586002)(11100500001)(7846002)(36756003)(66066001)(5002640100001)(3846002)(7736002)(6116002)(87936001)(99936001)(81166006)(586003)(81156014)(7059030)(225543005)(104396002); DIR:OUT; SFP:1102; SCL:1; SRVR:DF4PR84MB0283; H:DF4PR84MB0284.NAMPRD84.PROD.OUTLOOK.COM; FPR:; SPF:None; PTR:InfoNoRecords; MX:1; A:1; LANG:en; received-spf: None (protection.outlook.com: hp.com does not designate permitted sender hosts) spamdiagnosticoutput: 1:99 spamdiagnosticmetadata: NSPM MIME-Version: 1.0 X-OriginatorOrg: hp.com X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-originalarrivaltime: 11 Oct 2016 05:40:29.1053 (UTC) X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-fromentityheader: Hosted X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-id: ca7981a2-785a-463d-b82a-3db87dfc3ce6 X-MS-Exchange-Transport-CrossTenantHeadersStamped: DF4PR84MB0283 Cc: "ipp@pwg.org" , Till Kamppeter Subject: Re: [IPP] First IPP Everywhere Self-Certified Printers !!! X-BeenThere: ipp@pwg.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15 Precedence: list List-Id: Internet Printing Protocol Workgroup discussion list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="===============5754282237650887032==" Errors-To: ipp-bounces@pwg.org Sender: "ipp" --===============5754282237650887032== Content-Language: en-US Content-Type: multipart/signed; boundary="Apple-Mail=_BF4C7112-8455-43B2-8D33-C00E8DC73C6E"; protocol="application/pkcs7-signature"; micalg=sha1 --Apple-Mail=_BF4C7112-8455-43B2-8D33-C00E8DC73C6E Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Hi Mike, I agree that putting the 1284 Device ID should be unnecessary. An IPP = Everywhere driver should match the general case, not be whitelisted in = based on model info matching values in a white list.=20 Smith > On Oct 6, 2016, at 8:10 AM, Michael Sweet wrote: >=20 > All, >=20 >> On Oct 5, 2016, at 4:03 PM, Ira McDonald = wrote: >>=20 >> Hi, >>=20 >> Per our brief discussion during today's IPP WG call, please consider >> Till's comments and feature request (IEEE 1284 DeviceID values for >> certified printers). Please reply here on IPP mailing list and copy >> Till on your response. >> ... >> When only the last digit of the number differs, these are only = variants with regional adaptations. The printer itself is the same but = the power supply can be 110 V or 220 V, the power cord can be with = different plug and the printers front panel (what is printed on the = printer's shell) can be in different languages. >>=20 >> So I would like to see the IEEE-1284 device IDs for that printers, as = for listing them on OpenPrinting.org, there should be one printer entry = per device ID. >=20 > While we did decide to require printer-device-id for IPP Everywhere, = it was done for interoperability with legacy operating systems and print = spoolers that use printer drivers - there is nothing in there that says = "this is an IPP Everywhere Printer". The closest you will get is to see = "image/pwg-raster" or "PWGRaster" in the "CMD" field of the 1284 device = ID, which indicates that the printer supports the required raster format = for IPP Everywhere. Clients know a printer supports IPP Everywhere by = the presence of the 'ipp-everywhere' string in the = "ipp-features-supported" Printer Description attribute. >=20 > So I don't see any point in adding the 1284 device ID to the IPP = Everywhere printer database. You only need it to match with a non-IPP = Everywhere printer driver instead of the generic driver. >=20 > _________________________________________________________ > Michael Sweet, Senior Printing System Engineer >=20 --Apple-Mail=_BF4C7112-8455-43B2-8D33-C00E8DC73C6E Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="smime.p7s" Content-Type: application/pkcs7-signature; name="smime.p7s" Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64 MIAGCSqGSIb3DQEHAqCAMIACAQExCzAJBgUrDgMCGgUAMIAGCSqGSIb3DQEHAQAAoIIOQDCCBmEw ggVJoAMCAQICEDtXE7awITX7XkZ1ymyyxOEwDQYJKoZIhvcNAQEFBQAwgcoxCzAJBgNVBAYTAlVT MRcwFQYDVQQKEw5WZXJpU2lnbiwgSW5jLjEfMB0GA1UECxMWVmVyaVNpZ24gVHJ1c3QgTmV0d29y azE6MDgGA1UECxMxKGMpIDE5OTkgVmVyaVNpZ24sIEluYy4gLSBGb3IgYXV0aG9yaXplZCB1c2Ug b25seTFFMEMGA1UEAxM8VmVyaVNpZ24gQ2xhc3MgMiBQdWJsaWMgUHJpbWFyeSBDZXJ0aWZpY2F0 aW9uIEF1dGhvcml0eSAtIEczMB4XDTA5MDkwMjAwMDAwMFoXDTE5MDkwMTIzNTk1OVowgfcxCzAJ BgNVBAYTAlVTMSAwHgYDVQQKExdIZXdsZXR0LVBhY2thcmQgQ29tcGFueTEfMB0GA1UECxMWVmVy 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(Postfix, from userid 1002) id 18242415D; Wed, 12 Oct 2016 20:20:09 +0000 (UTC) Received: from mail-in4.apple.com (mail-out4.apple.com [17.151.62.26]) by www.pwg.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 3C85E2683 for ; Wed, 12 Oct 2016 20:20:06 +0000 (UTC) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; d=apple.com; s=mailout2048s; c=relaxed/simple; q=dns/txt; i=@apple.com; t=1476303605; h=From:Sender:Reply-To:Subject:Date:Message-id:To:Cc:MIME-version:Content-type: Content-transfer-encoding:Content-ID:Content-Description:Resent-Date:Resent-From: Resent-Sender:Resent-To:Resent-Cc:Resent-Message-ID:In-Reply-To:References:List-Id: List-Help:List-Unsubscribe:List-Subscribe:List-Post:List-Owner:List-Archive; bh=SOzUbz9giSnqEMDimfnoyRxUOPMdXYdSZeKTHru/qqw=; b=0FrCGin6G863v4iIGsYrFMUCHR7rrD8bui+RUCSPQuC2GBrzvgzXFTh2CMBzIlAr BlzPlR1Wyu1ReiIxHmpFPlSOED9SNti37TtYaJ84D0HtiWewzPm/xueFQQrubBuP LAg75PqRymYISNiYtfAMYnpZb8d9BgueM0/uDc1MQ7a1/mP2E3Ysht/ewKyDK5SX nZFok6KNGn8so53NlMCS3KoXGCklGsm6Lz7JN0RCO/QsxYqKOnd9D1CDs2RKdlSG 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H4sIAAAAAAAAA+NgFprDLMWRmVeSWpSXmKPExsUi2FDorPt11r9wg86/hhbH9r1ksVhw4z+7 A5PHvMXTmQIYo7hsUlJzMstSi/TtErgy2u7oFvxkq7jz9yNLA2MrWxcjJ4eEgInE6YW32bsY uTiEBPYyStw6d5wJJnFvQjMbROIQo8Sz7x+YQRK8AoISPybfY+li5OBgFpCXOHheFiTMLKAl 8f1RKwtEfQeTxMrVn1hBEsICEhLH+xeC2WwCahK/J/WB2SwCqhIzb09jh6jxltj74gYbxCA/ iUvd/8FqRAREJY79XAK110bidusPdpC9EgKyErN/eYHskhDoYJM48msy2wRGwVlIzpuFcN4s JOctYGRexSiUm5iZo5uZZ6KXWFCQk6qXnJ+7iREUnNPthHYwnlpldYhRgINRiYfXI+hfuBBr YllxZe4hRmkOFiVx3klpQCGB9MSS1OzU1ILUovii0pzU4kOMTBycUg2MRdu2llQbnQ/qOiTR Nc1K/fijJZVLtkxlD8/sExX4M690UdZOdr8zX2Jyurf/znzfpnnuaVLoop+TMySuR1ct/O7D /ytwC2th5pe2he/KXoWme1vY5T91/95ucEbpZemJb4WzIyY5T2tRV7dtytzTNfV0ZkIM86J5 vJIsQSdfrP2/zf6L5PsXSizFGYmGWsxFxYkAyX0sLi8CAAA= X-Brightmail-Tracker: H4sIAAAAAAAAA+NgFnrMLMWRmVeSWpSXmKPExsUi2FB8RvfrrH/hButua1oc2/eSxWLBjf/s Dkwe8xZPZwpgjOKySUnNySxLLdK3S+DKaLujW/CTreLO348sDYytbF2MnBwSAiYS9yY0Q9li EhfurQeyuTiEBA4xSjz7/oEZJMErICjxY/I9li5GDg5mAXmJg+dlQcLMAloS3x+1skDUdzBJ 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candidate versions of the IPP Everywhere Printer Self-Certification Tools 1.0 Update 1 to: http://ftp.pwg.org/pub/pwg/ipp/wd/sw-ippeveselfcert10-20161011-macos.dmg http://ftp.pwg.org/pub/pwg/ipp/wd/sw-ippeveselfcert10-20161011-rhel.tar.gz http://ftp.pwg.org/pub/pwg/ipp/wd/sw-ippeveselfcert10-20161011-ubuntu.tar.gz http://ftp.pwg.org/pub/pwg/ipp/wd/sw-ippeveselfcert10-20161011-windows.msi These updates resolve all known issues in the 1.0 tools released on November 10, 2015. Please test these tools and report any problems to the Github issues page at: https://github.com/istopwg/ippeveselfcert/issues If no issues are reported before October 28th, 2016 we will post these as the new 1.0 self-certification tools. Thank you! _________________________________________________________ Michael Sweet, Senior Printing System Engineer _______________________________________________ ipp mailing list ipp@pwg.org https://www.pwg.org/mailman/listinfo/ipp From ipp-bounces@pwg.org Thu Oct 13 13:06:44 2016 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ietfarch-ipp-archive@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: ietfarch-ipp-archive@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7897F1295DC for ; Thu, 13 Oct 2016 13:06:44 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -4.896 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-4.896 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, HEADER_FROM_DIFFERENT_DOMAINS=0.001, RP_MATCHES_RCVD=-2.996, SPF_PASS=-0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id Gg6XfPatGmTe for ; Thu, 13 Oct 2016 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Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Greetings, The macOS tools are actually a gzipped tarball, not a disk image file: = http://ftp.pwg.org/pub/pwg/ipp/wd/sw-ippeveselfcert10-20161011-macos.tar.g= z Smith /** Smith Kennedy Wireless Architect - Client Software - IPG-PPS Standards - IEEE ISTO PWG / Bluetooth SIG / Wi-Fi Alliance / NFC = Forum / USB IF Chair, IEEE ISTO Printer Working Group HP Inc. */ > On Oct 12, 2016, at 2:20 PM, Michael Sweet wrote: >=20 > All, >=20 > I have posted candidate versions of the IPP Everywhere Printer = Self-Certification Tools 1.0 Update 1 to: >=20 > = http://ftp.pwg.org/pub/pwg/ipp/wd/sw-ippeveselfcert10-20161011-macos.dmg > = http://ftp.pwg.org/pub/pwg/ipp/wd/sw-ippeveselfcert10-20161011-rhel.tar.gz= > = http://ftp.pwg.org/pub/pwg/ipp/wd/sw-ippeveselfcert10-20161011-ubuntu.tar.= gz > = http://ftp.pwg.org/pub/pwg/ipp/wd/sw-ippeveselfcert10-20161011-windows.msi= >=20 > These updates resolve all known issues in the 1.0 tools released on = November 10, 2015. >=20 > Please test these tools and report any problems to the Github issues = page at: >=20 > https://github.com/istopwg/ippeveselfcert/issues >=20 > If no issues are reported before October 28th, 2016 we will post these = as the new 1.0 self-certification tools.=20 >=20 > Thank you! >=20 > _________________________________________________________ > Michael Sweet, Senior Printing System Engineer >=20 > _______________________________________________ > ipp mailing list > ipp@pwg.org > https://www.pwg.org/mailman/listinfo/ipp --Apple-Mail=_49D9BD67-9CE1-4C62-B3DE-F2E26CD5CF00 Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="smime.p7s" Content-Type: application/pkcs7-signature; name="smime.p7s" Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64 MIAGCSqGSIb3DQEHAqCAMIACAQExCzAJBgUrDgMCGgUAMIAGCSqGSIb3DQEHAQAAoIIOQDCCBmEw ggVJoAMCAQICEDtXE7awITX7XkZ1ymyyxOEwDQYJKoZIhvcNAQEFBQAwgcoxCzAJBgNVBAYTAlVT 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MIME-version: 1.0 Received: from [17.153.26.65] (unknown [17.153.26.65]) by nwk-mmpp-sz12.apple.com (Oracle Communications Messaging Server 8.0.1.1.0 64bit (built Jun 15 2016)) with ESMTPSA id <0OF00016O5BNNH00@nwk-mmpp-sz12.apple.com>; Thu, 13 Oct 2016 13:09:25 -0700 (PDT) From: Michael Sweet In-reply-to: <65724190-FE37-4B6D-AEED-4970263BFECA@apple.com> Date: Thu, 13 Oct 2016 16:09:22 -0400 Message-id: References: <65724190-FE37-4B6D-AEED-4970263BFECA@apple.com> To: ipp X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.3226) X-Brightmail-Tracker: H4sIAAAAAAAAA+NgFjrDLMWRmVeSWpSXmKPExsUi2FDorPvt5f9wgz08Fsf2vWSxWHDjP7sD k8e8xdOZAhijuGxSUnMyy1KL9O0SuDJu9q5lLdiuVPH3UCN7A+MPuS5GTg4JAROJKaunsXcx cnEICexllDhy6SwzTOLJoZ9QiUOMEtc77rCDJHgFBCV+TL7HAmIzC4RJXD1yhxWiqINJ4sWk O2DdwgISEsf7F7JC2OES81oXgTWzCahJ/J7UBxbnFLCVONN1AMxmEVCVeLlwDzPEUD+JS93/ geIcQMtsJGb1aIKEhYDMdb97GUFsEQFRiWM/lzCDlEgIyErM/uUFcoKEwBE2iU03L7BMYBSa heTUWUhOhbC1JL4/agWKcwDZ8hIHz8tChDUlnt37xA5ha0s8eXeBdQEj2ypGodzEzBzdzDwj 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wqlPblT2N4ddc5S/71kzraHhXsuNn1ys++Y0Tj92//6ex4E5385YzQ9fEhv1p3tfs/LB91G3 Mu7/EtOO8Zl1ppbjtUO0dMXsJf/4VylcEfVmVWIpzkg01GIuKk4EAAncxeHWAgAA Cc: IPP Everywhere Self-Certification discussion list Subject: [IPP] [UPDATED] WGLC: IPP Everywhere Printer Self-Certification Tools 1.0 Update 1 X-BeenThere: ipp@pwg.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15 Precedence: list List-Id: Internet Printing Protocol Workgroup discussion list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="===============7832388264915562467==" Errors-To: ipp-bounces@pwg.org Sender: "ipp" --===============7832388264915562467== Content-type: multipart/alternative; boundary="Boundary_(ID_XXUwUMohEgjDl/HH3AycEA)" --Boundary_(ID_XXUwUMohEgjDl/HH3AycEA) Content-type: text/plain; CHARSET=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT All, I have posted updated candidate versions of the IPP Everywhere Printer Self-Certification Tools 1.0 Update 1 to: http://ftp.pwg.org/pub/pwg/ipp/wd/sw-ippeveselfcert10-20161013-macos.tar .gz http://ftp.pwg.org/pub/pwg/ipp/wd/sw-ippeveselfcert10-20161013-rhel.tar.gz http://ftp.pwg.org/pub/pwg/ipp/wd/sw-ippeveselfcert10-20161013-ubuntu.tar.gz http://ftp.pwg.org/pub/pwg/ipp/wd/sw-ippeveselfcert10-20161013-windows.msi These updates resolve all known issues in the 1.0 tools released on November 10, 2015, as well as additional issues with the dateTime attribute tests reported in Issue #13. Please test these tools and report any problems to the Github issues page at: https://github.com/istopwg/ippeveselfcert/issues If no issues are reported before October 28th, 2016 we will post these as the new 1.0 self-certification tools. Thank you! _________________________________________________________ Michael Sweet, Senior Printing System Engineer --Boundary_(ID_XXUwUMohEgjDl/HH3AycEA) Content-type: text/html; CHARSET=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: quoted-printable All,

I have posted updated = candidate versions of the IPP Everywhere Printer Self-Certification = Tools 1.0 Update 1 to:

http://ftp.pwg.org/pub/pwg/ipp/wd/sw-ippeveselfcert10-20161013-= macos.tar.gz
http://ftp.pwg.org/pub/pwg/ipp/wd/sw-ippeveselfcert10-20161013-= rhel.tar.gz
= http://ftp.pwg.org/pub/pwg/ipp/wd/sw-ippeveselfcert10-20161013-ubun= tu.tar.gz
= http://ftp.pwg.org/pub/pwg/ipp/wd/sw-ippeveselfcert10-20161013-wind= ows.msi

These updates resolve all known = issues in the 1.0 tools released on November 10, 2015, as well as = additional issues with the dateTime attribute tests reported in Issue = #13.

Please test these tools and report any = problems to the Github issues page at:

= https://github.com/istopwg/ippeveselfcert/issues

If no issues are reported before October 28th, 2016 we will = post these as the new 1.0 self-certification tools. 

Thank you!

_________________________________________________________
Michael Sweet, Senior Printing = System Engineer

= --Boundary_(ID_XXUwUMohEgjDl/HH3AycEA)-- --===============7832388264915562467== Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline _______________________________________________ ipp mailing list ipp@pwg.org https://www.pwg.org/mailman/listinfo/ipp --===============7832388264915562467==-- From ipp-bounces@pwg.org Thu Oct 13 15:18:50 2016 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ietfarch-ipp-archive@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: ietfarch-ipp-archive@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9F78F12968C for ; Thu, 13 Oct 2016 15:18:50 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -4.896 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-4.896 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, HEADER_FROM_DIFFERENT_DOMAINS=0.001, RP_MATCHES_RCVD=-2.996, SPF_PASS=-0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id R2qezbdTyoaH for ; Thu, 13 Oct 2016 15:18:48 -0700 (PDT) Received: from www.pwg.org (www.pwg.org [IPv6:2600:3c01::f03c:91ff:fe70:b03f]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 459FE129629 for ; Thu, 13 Oct 2016 15:18:48 -0700 (PDT) Received: by www.pwg.org (Postfix, from userid 1002) id 43D964407; Thu, 13 Oct 2016 22:18:46 +0000 (UTC) Received: from www.pwg.org (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by www.pwg.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id ABDE62685; Thu, 13 Oct 2016 22:18:41 +0000 (UTC) X-Original-To: ipp@pwg.org Delivered-To: ipp@pwg.org Received: by www.pwg.org (Postfix, from userid 1002) id 18FFD43FF; Thu, 13 Oct 2016 22:18:40 +0000 (UTC) Received: from NAM03-BY2-obe.outbound.protection.outlook.com (mail-by2nam03on0132.outbound.protection.outlook.com [104.47.42.132]) by www.pwg.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 92D6B267E for ; Thu, 13 Oct 2016 22:18:39 +0000 (UTC) Received: from DF4PR84MB0284.NAMPRD84.PROD.OUTLOOK.COM (10.162.193.22) by DF4PR84MB0281.NAMPRD84.PROD.OUTLOOK.COM (10.162.193.19) with Microsoft SMTP Server (version=TLS1_2, cipher=TLS_ECDHE_RSA_WITH_AES_256_CBC_SHA384_P384) id 15.1.659.11; Thu, 13 Oct 2016 22:18:38 +0000 Received: from DF4PR84MB0284.NAMPRD84.PROD.OUTLOOK.COM ([10.162.193.22]) by DF4PR84MB0284.NAMPRD84.PROD.OUTLOOK.COM ([10.162.193.22]) with mapi id 15.01.0659.020; Thu, 13 Oct 2016 22:18:37 +0000 From: "Kennedy, Smith (Wireless Architect)" To: "ipp@pwg.org" Thread-Topic: Finishings 2.1 and maximum sheets - is "printer-finisher" "maxsetsheets" enough? Thread-Index: AQHSJZ++vmwURikOuU+sFd+Kpe/w6g== Date: Thu, 13 Oct 2016 22:18:37 +0000 Message-ID: <82630E91-982B-45BA-8CD1-EA0BDAB6C292@hp.com> Accept-Language: en-US Content-Language: en-US X-MS-Has-Attach: yes X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: authentication-results: spf=none (sender IP is ) smtp.mailfrom=smith.kennedy@hp.com; x-ms-exchange-messagesentrepresentingtype: 1 x-originating-ip: [15.65.252.15] x-ms-office365-filtering-correlation-id: 4fe8d374-6963-4038-d8be-08d3f3b6e102 x-microsoft-exchange-diagnostics: 1; DF4PR84MB0281; 6:AmHxKyzXgPznP0ddPQzw4EErConSnDxwT8lZM4cvCynXYpVppTY1+MQ1sJ/1tP74wdbqebTLe8yPoHV3TAWJCG4faVUXBXudEqoeDuHd7Jg6RE7I2S41u6EOVqKo8aVlTyJdcFN+24D0zPCkY3Yavp7ybHst0s/svPB4NEtnz30pslyF7C2MVnp8PpCTrsPEa7Zj3T1Pv93G2f+c1ClMW6cqqQh0KNJYg9L0jEl86lyiILLpckgo+uwtu3RigFwnYfNEDT78oEyhio87IlEU/izoJeSEPSE/KijMX8kY0f1cRjGyIYWjCojCQmBkqhs5; 5:MKlvpKnG0KrriO7BqHecZQn4ZXTQOEHA+BAJbeGj82famIt3QujoYMNSv2vlrv4W8O9SHz/yp49snL6N+OypPtAf/CEK8VFhAb8dPa+E9wNM4yhy6bxUUBEXvEllrWG3p9apC5uFlpaaJJ1Z3glwzg==; 24:xaWFxgJMPE0iRjNZcOSAq2sev4G3+hQImpdDU+aCjpkNMrhLMWjbdxWfSFed51Ay1JpWJTUtAOxv8Y3PFg0AqrErV+8FXLR5HtyfUNKj9vE=; 7:OXMm8LRRcZYNfhvbmrkMfHmKCvUp9wS9ZHiS38xfCcMyg59IhpCgDE38KJcZhyhVZ3grXUmnSWluU/1QsHmC7Mal7kLD7ems2ODwbv36QZwCf/Ox5Gd2ixdW22M0kmIoyZuNJwpT8mIAdDfCGk0sfi0aBWYtOYwr0RS1SO0CWMLojbCo7w/DUB3IM/7mlMU+9m1Hn1yF17tCd+LJbtlXa39FpNB3FnPVWp4q7sImhzhs9QpHbR9OCCY5+q5Vu35r9+N6XzJMlpaMdqwLJDPUKFpMvlnpvwuMjC5tyj5B7KHPRJ0effPxChvR+CDV51T5sbdomjsYsqO7sKn4A68vr6zADw5iETxaPFck0yTvPBs= x-microsoft-antispam: UriScan:;BCL:0;PCL:0;RULEID:;SRVR:DF4PR84MB0281; x-microsoft-antispam-prvs: x-exchange-antispam-report-test: UriScan:; x-exchange-antispam-report-cfa-test: BCL:0; PCL:0; RULEID:(102415321)(6040176)(601004)(2401047)(5005006)(8121501046)(10201501046)(3002001); SRVR:DF4PR84MB0281; BCL:0; PCL:0; RULEID:; SRVR:DF4PR84MB0281; x-forefront-prvs: 0094E3478A x-forefront-antispam-report: SFV:NSPM; SFS:(10019020)(6009001)(7916002)(189002)(6602003)(199003)(305945005)(8936002)(7846002)(101416001)(86362001)(97736004)(54356999)(6916009)(3280700002)(3660700001)(66066001)(110136003)(5660300001)(50986999)(2501003)(2900100001)(99936001)(81156014)(102836003)(2906002)(81166006)(82746002)(6116002)(122556002)(189998001)(3846002)(10400500002)(5640700001)(106116001)(106356001)(77096005)(92566002)(83716003)(33656002)(450100001)(107886002)(8676002)(5002640100001)(68736007)(586003)(99286002)(2351001)(1730700003)(36756003)(7736002)(229853001)(87936001)(105586002)(21314002)(104396002); DIR:OUT; SFP:1102; SCL:1; SRVR:DF4PR84MB0281; H:DF4PR84MB0284.NAMPRD84.PROD.OUTLOOK.COM; FPR:; SPF:None; PTR:InfoNoRecords; MX:1; A:1; LANG:en; received-spf: None (protection.outlook.com: hp.com does not designate permitted sender hosts) spamdiagnosticoutput: 1:99 spamdiagnosticmetadata: NSPM MIME-Version: 1.0 X-OriginatorOrg: hp.com X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-originalarrivaltime: 13 Oct 2016 22:18:37.1957 (UTC) X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-fromentityheader: Hosted X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-id: ca7981a2-785a-463d-b82a-3db87dfc3ce6 X-MS-Exchange-Transport-CrossTenantHeadersStamped: DF4PR84MB0281 Subject: [IPP] Finishings 2.1 and maximum sheets - is "printer-finisher" "maxsetsheets" enough? X-BeenThere: ipp@pwg.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15 Precedence: list List-Id: Internet Printing Protocol Workgroup discussion list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="===============4908728800253772034==" Errors-To: ipp-bounces@pwg.org Sender: "ipp" --===============4908728800253772034== Content-Language: en-US Content-Type: multipart/signed; boundary="Apple-Mail=_6C6E5951-E1AB-478F-B8EA-2F45719C50EE"; protocol="application/pkcs7-signature"; micalg=sha1 --Apple-Mail=_6C6E5951-E1AB-478F-B8EA-2F45719C50EE Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Greetings, I have been updating the PWG's Finishings specification (PWG 5100.1) to = produce Finishings 2.1. One of the additions in this update is the = ability for the Printer to state the limits it has on the number of = sheets that can be finished. The original Finisher MIB (RFC 3806) has a = simple "maximumSheets" attribute that can be used to specify the maximum = for the finisher unit itself. We had originally thought that adding a = corresponding keyword to "printer-finisher" would be a sufficient = solution. But after a few discussions internally, it turns out the = maximum number of sheets can vary according to the particular finishing = operation itself, not simply according to the finisher accessory. As a = simple example, the maximum number of sheets a folder can handle may be = 5 sheets for the IPP "finishings" type 'fold-half' but may be only 3 = sheets for the IPP "finishings" type 'fold-letter' or 'fold-z'. Originally I had thought that adding a new "xxx-max-sheets" member = attribute to each of the sub-collections of finishings-col (e.g. = "baling-max-sheets", "folding-max-sheets", etc.) that allows the Printer = to indicate the maximum number of sheets supported for that operation. = That may be sufficient. But there is another issue that seems to be overlooked: not all media = types are the same thickness. And by simply providing a number of = sheets, we aren't considering the media thickness. Consider a situation = where you want to do a booklet printing operation, where the outside = cover is made from a different media type than the rest of the pages. = The number of sheets doesn't accurately help in this calculation. To solve the media thickness problem (and to add another layer of = complexity, unfortunately) another alternative solution would be to add = a new "xxx-max-thickness" member attribute to each of the = sub-collections of finishings-col (e.g. "baling-max-thickness", = "folding-max-thickness", etc.) that allows the Printer to indicate the = maximum set thickness supported for that operation. A Client would = consider the number of pages, the media types selected (by consulting = "media-col.media-thickness"), and the finishing operations, and would = accurately be able to decide whether the number of pages was too great, = etc. Now some vendors have constraints between certain finishing operations = and the media types, so that the thicknesses are predictable. But that = doesn't really help in actually calculating whether the Job as produced = by the Printer will meet the user's expectations. So we have 3 alternatives: 1. Keep the new "printer-finisher" keyword "maxsetsheets" 2. Eliminate "maxsetsheets" and implement "baling-max-sheets", = "folding-max-sheets", etc. 3. Eliminate "maxsetsheets" and implement "baling-max-thickness", = "folding-max-thickness", etc. 4. Encourage vendors to use constraints between media type and finishing = type to limit the range of thicknesses and ignore the thickness issue Which way(s) should we go with this? We want something that Clients can = and will implement, but we also want the limitations of the Printer to = be clearly articulated so that the Client implementation can help the = User make informed choices, either automatically or manually. Thoughts? Cheers, =20 Smith /** Smith Kennedy Wireless Architect - Client Software - IPG-PPS Standards - IEEE ISTO PWG / Bluetooth SIG / Wi-Fi Alliance / NFC = Forum / USB IF Chair, IEEE ISTO Printer Working Group HP Inc. */ --Apple-Mail=_6C6E5951-E1AB-478F-B8EA-2F45719C50EE Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="smime.p7s" Content-Type: application/pkcs7-signature; name="smime.p7s" Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64 MIAGCSqGSIb3DQEHAqCAMIACAQExCzAJBgUrDgMCGgUAMIAGCSqGSIb3DQEHAQAAoIIOQDCCBmEw ggVJoAMCAQICEDtXE7awITX7XkZ1ymyyxOEwDQYJKoZIhvcNAQEFBQAwgcoxCzAJBgNVBAYTAlVT MRcwFQYDVQQKEw5WZXJpU2lnbiwgSW5jLjEfMB0GA1UECxMWVmVyaVNpZ24gVHJ1c3QgTmV0d29y azE6MDgGA1UECxMxKGMpIDE5OTkgVmVyaVNpZ24sIEluYy4gLSBGb3IgYXV0aG9yaXplZCB1c2Ug b25seTFFMEMGA1UEAxM8VmVyaVNpZ24gQ2xhc3MgMiBQdWJsaWMgUHJpbWFyeSBDZXJ0aWZpY2F0 aW9uIEF1dGhvcml0eSAtIEczMB4XDTA5MDkwMjAwMDAwMFoXDTE5MDkwMTIzNTk1OVowgfcxCzAJ BgNVBAYTAlVTMSAwHgYDVQQKExdIZXdsZXR0LVBhY2thcmQgQ29tcGFueTEfMB0GA1UECxMWVmVy 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<334333D1-D6B0-496D-B899-66E86F781476@apple.com> References: <82630E91-982B-45BA-8CD1-EA0BDAB6C292@hp.com> To: "Kennedy, Smith (Wireless Architect)" X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.3226) X-Brightmail-Tracker: H4sIAAAAAAAAA+NgFrrELMWRmVeSWpSXmKPExsUi2FAYoRttzhhh8OufjcWxfS9ZLF517WJ2 YPLYtW0nk8e8xdOZApiiuGxSUnMyy1KL9O0SuDL+Lv3BXDAxpuL/9rusDYzH/boYOTkkBEwk Nv18ytjFyMUhJLCXUeJSz3JGmMTXSweZQWwhgUOMErO7UkFsXgFBiR+T77GA2MwCYRKvnk5m g2juYpK4Ov80WEJYQELieP9CVgg7VaL1di/YUDYBNYnfk/rA4pwCVhLH7rSyg9gsAqoS3z7P ZIcYKi/RcOcKC8QyG4mPyyHiQgKWEt3d38F6RQQcJJ4v+QRUwwF0qKzE7F9eIDdICCxgk2ja vYdlAqPQLCS3zkJyK4StJfH9UStQnANs3cHzshBhTYln9z6xQ9jaEk/eXWBdwMi2ilEoNzEz Rzczz0QvsaAgJ1UvOT93EyMoEqbbCe1gPLXK6hCjAAejEg/vjA8MEUKsiWXFlbmHGKU5WJTE ed3VGCOEBNITS1KzU1MLUovii0pzUosPMTJxcEo1MK5T2Za59mN/4O9a6X1LSlf/9wi4kHp6 nk7Z1I7fGVmrvPaGyU98osi+OXB1lqWDt6/7jLZShUVa7a7zdm6R6jG7OqPJ2zpnSvvuq5Xb PxlVLHx/6bl6lmdDyYXHUxRCao5m/1+iw2FV+n+J9SGN/gPtnUtd73n9dphVqWCwen7QO75b F51UlimxFGckGmoxFxUnAgCLJ3YIZQIAAA== X-Brightmail-Tracker: H4sIAAAAAAAAA+NgFrrILMWRmVeSWpSXmKPExsUi2FD8SjfanDHCoH+nqcWxfS9ZLF517WJ2 YPLYtW0nk8e8xdOZApiiuGxSUnMyy1KL9O0SuDL+Lv3BXDAxpuL/9rusDYzH/boYOTkkBEwk vl46yAxhi0lcuLeeDcQWEjjEKDG7KxXE5hUQlPgx+R4LiM0sECbx6ulkoBouoJouJomr80+D JYQFJCSO9y9khbBTJVpv9zKC2GwCahK/J/WBxTkFrCSO3WllB7FZBFQlvn2eyQ4xVF6i4c4V FohlNhIfl0PEhQQsJbq7v4P1igg4SDxf8gmohgPoUFmJ2b+8JjAKzEJy3iwk50HYWhLfH7UC xTnANhw8LwsR1pR4du8TO4StLfHk3QXWBYxsqxgFilJzEitN9RILCnJS9ZLzczcxggO6MGIH 4/9lVocYBTgYlXh4Z3xgiBBiTSwrrswFBhEHs5II7ywjxggh3pTEyqrUovz4otKc1OJDjNIc LErivLyN/8KFBNITS1KzU1MLUotgskwcnFINjPsmHvi+9OZ3odK+P91WTCdUX2pvLfYvE2r0 EZSdMc1cYUpkyZFt/qLsbiHlMkJ7OJwuVNe0Jkz9MdFWsOHRrsWPOXm+LfFMYOD7YK38+kG0 cElew6XLa3PuRkpFt09XTrF/ev2K4zTPb86lbZcclBtLt5rYK/dnWcQdvG9uUnbFn+N44Nxj SizFGYmGWsxFxYkAxKxHV2QCAAA= Cc: "ipp@pwg.org" Subject: Re: [IPP] Finishings 2.1 and maximum sheets - is "printer-finisher" "maxsetsheets" enough? X-BeenThere: ipp@pwg.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15 Precedence: list List-Id: Internet Printing Protocol Workgroup discussion list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="===============4638255192924234313==" Errors-To: ipp-bounces@pwg.org Sender: "ipp" --===============4638255192924234313== Content-type: multipart/alternative; boundary="Boundary_(ID_aVyN0rD+aVoPDqRvG8iYhA)" --Boundary_(ID_aVyN0rD+aVoPDqRvG8iYhA) Content-type: text/plain; CHARSET=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Smith, > On Oct 13, 2016, at 6:18 PM, Kennedy, Smith (Wireless Architect) wrote: > > Greetings, > > I have been updating the PWG's Finishings specification (PWG 5100.1) to produce Finishings 2.1. One of the additions in this update is the ability for the Printer to state the limits it has on the number of sheets that can be finished. The original Finisher MIB (RFC 3806) has a simple "maximumSheets" attribute that can be used to specify the maximum for the finisher unit itself. We had originally thought that adding a corresponding keyword to "printer-finisher" would be a sufficient solution. But after a few discussions internally, it turns out the maximum number of sheets can vary according to the particular finishing operation itself, not simply according to the finisher accessory. As a simple example, the maximum number of sheets a folder can handle may be 5 sheets for the IPP "finishings" type 'fold-half' but may be only 3 sheets for the IPP "finishings" type 'fold-letter' or 'fold-z'. Unfortunately, that isn't something that the Finisher MIB handles... :/ > Originally I had thought that adding a new "xxx-max-sheets" member attribute to each of the sub-collections of finishings-col (e.g. "baling-max-sheets", "folding-max-sheets", etc.) that allows the Printer to indicate the maximum number of sheets supported for that operation. That may be sufficient. > > But there is another issue that seems to be overlooked: not all media types are the same thickness. And by simply providing a number of sheets, we aren't considering the media thickness. Consider a situation where you want to do a booklet printing operation, where the outside cover is made from a different media type than the rest of the pages. The number of sheets doesn't accurately help in this calculation. As with many things in IPP, the values here are meant as a "best-effort" estimate for typical media for the printer, with the printer typically using a sensor to detect when a tray or finisher is actually full regardless of the number of sheets that have been placed there. > ... > So we have 3 alternatives: > > 1. Keep the new "printer-finisher" keyword "maxsetsheets" That would be consistent with the Finisher MIB. > 2. Eliminate "maxsetsheets" and implement "baling-max-sheets", "folding-max-sheets", etc. I don't like this as much because it conjoins an abstract finishing process to a physical finisher subunit limit. Since printer-finisher is where we are exposing the finisher subunits, that is where the limit should be reported. > 3. Eliminate "maxsetsheets" and implement "baling-max-thickness", "folding-max-thickness", etc. That way lies madness. Most printers don't implement media-thickness support, even LFPs that would have a genuine need for it. And what Client is going to pre-process the document and job ticket to determine the final set thickness for finishing? And what printer provides this information via other protocols (SNMP, etc.)? > 4. Encourage vendors to use constraints between media type and finishing type to limit the range of thicknesses and ignore the thickness issue I think if a vendor knows that certain media types can't be used with a finisher, then those should be exposed as constraints. But otherwise I think we just rely on the "best effort" principle. > Which way(s) should we go with this? We want something that Clients can and will implement, but we also want the limitations of the Printer to be clearly articulated so that the Client implementation can help the User make informed choices, either automatically or manually. I think the most useful information for the Client is to know the maximum number of sheets a finisher can handle for typical media, with specific constraints for media as needed. That handles the 99% use cases without requiring a significant amount of intelligence in the Client along with major changes in how Printers track and report finisher capacity. _________________________________________________________ Michael Sweet, Senior Printing System Engineer --Boundary_(ID_aVyN0rD+aVoPDqRvG8iYhA) Content-type: text/html; CHARSET=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: quoted-printable Smith,

On Oct 13, 2016, at 6:18 PM, = Kennedy, Smith (Wireless Architect) <smith.kennedy@hp.com> wrote:

Greetings,

I have been updating = the PWG's Finishings specification (PWG 5100.1) to produce Finishings = 2.1. One of the additions in this update is the ability for the Printer = to state the limits it has on the number of sheets that can be finished. = The original Finisher MIB (RFC 3806) has a simple "maximumSheets" = attribute that can be used to specify the maximum for the finisher unit = itself. We had originally thought that adding a corresponding keyword to = "printer-finisher" would be a sufficient solution. But after a few = discussions internally, it turns out the maximum number of sheets can = vary according to the particular finishing operation itself, not simply = according to the finisher accessory. As a simple example, the maximum = number of sheets a folder can handle may be 5 sheets for the IPP = "finishings" type 'fold-half' but may be only 3 sheets for the IPP = "finishings" type 'fold-letter' or 'fold-z'.

Unfortunately, that isn't something that the Finisher = MIB handles... :/

Originally I had thought that = adding a new "xxx-max-sheets" member attribute to each of the = sub-collections of finishings-col (e.g. "baling-max-sheets", = "folding-max-sheets", etc.) that allows the Printer to indicate the = maximum number of sheets supported for that operation. That may be = sufficient.

But there is another issue that = seems to be overlooked: not all media types are the same thickness. And = by simply providing a number of sheets, we aren't considering the media = thickness. Consider a situation where you want to do a booklet printing = operation, where the outside cover is made from a different media type = than the rest of the pages. The number of sheets doesn't accurately help = in this calculation.

As with many things in IPP, the values here are meant = as a "best-effort" estimate for typical media for the printer, with the = printer typically using a sensor to detect when a tray or finisher is = actually full regardless of the number of sheets that have been placed = there.

...
So we have 3 alternatives:

1. Keep the new "printer-finisher" keyword = "maxsetsheets"

That would be consistent with the Finisher = MIB.

2. Eliminate "maxsetsheets" and implement = "baling-max-sheets", "folding-max-sheets", etc.

I = don't like this as much because it conjoins an abstract finishing = process to a physical finisher subunit limit. Since printer-finisher is = where we are exposing the finisher subunits, that is where the limit = should be reported.

3. Eliminate = "maxsetsheets" and implement "baling-max-thickness", = "folding-max-thickness", etc.

That way = lies madness.  Most printers don't implement media-thickness = support, even LFPs that would have a genuine need for it.  And what = Client is going to pre-process the document and job ticket to determine = the final set thickness for finishing? And what printer provides this = information via other protocols (SNMP, etc.)?

4. Encourage vendors to use constraints = between media type and finishing type to limit the range of thicknesses = and ignore the thickness issue

I think if = a vendor knows that certain media types can't be used with a finisher, = then those should be exposed as constraints.  But otherwise I think = we just rely on the "best effort" principle.

Which way(s) should we go with this? We want = something that Clients can and will implement, but we also want the = limitations of the Printer to be clearly articulated so that the Client = implementation can help the User make informed choices, either = automatically or manually.
I think the most useful information for the = Client is to know the maximum number of sheets a finisher can handle for = typical media, with specific constraints for media as needed.  That = handles the 99% use cases without requiring a significant amount of = intelligence in the Client along with major changes in how Printers = track and report finisher capacity.

_________________________________________________________
Michael Sweet, Senior Printing = System Engineer

= --Boundary_(ID_aVyN0rD+aVoPDqRvG8iYhA)-- --===============4638255192924234313== Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline _______________________________________________ ipp mailing list ipp@pwg.org https://www.pwg.org/mailman/listinfo/ipp --===============4638255192924234313==-- From ipp-bounces@pwg.org Fri Oct 14 14:07:08 2016 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ietfarch-ipp-archive@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: ietfarch-ipp-archive@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 42B86129640 for ; Fri, 14 Oct 2016 14:07:08 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -4.895 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-4.895 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, HEADER_FROM_DIFFERENT_DOMAINS=0.001, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE=-0.0001, RP_MATCHES_RCVD=-2.996, SPF_PASS=-0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id tgXdEWCMuCu2 for ; Fri, 14 Oct 2016 14:07:05 -0700 (PDT) Received: from www.pwg.org (www.pwg.org [50.116.7.199]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id E177412963C for ; Fri, 14 Oct 2016 14:07:05 -0700 (PDT) Received: by www.pwg.org (Postfix, from userid 1002) id DF7174407; Fri, 14 Oct 2016 21:07:03 +0000 (UTC) Received: from www.pwg.org (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by www.pwg.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9D02927B2; Fri, 14 Oct 2016 21:06:57 +0000 (UTC) X-Original-To: ipp@pwg.org Delivered-To: ipp@pwg.org Received: by www.pwg.org (Postfix, from userid 1002) id A5A0C415B; Fri, 14 Oct 2016 21:06:56 +0000 (UTC) Received: from NAM02-SN1-obe.outbound.protection.outlook.com (mail-sn1nam02on0127.outbound.protection.outlook.com [104.47.36.127]) by www.pwg.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id B45D32685 for ; Fri, 14 Oct 2016 21:06:55 +0000 (UTC) Received: from DF4PR84MB0284.NAMPRD84.PROD.OUTLOOK.COM (10.162.193.22) by DF4PR84MB0281.NAMPRD84.PROD.OUTLOOK.COM (10.162.193.19) with Microsoft SMTP Server (version=TLS1_2, cipher=TLS_ECDHE_RSA_WITH_AES_256_CBC_SHA384_P384) id 15.1.659.11; Fri, 14 Oct 2016 21:06:54 +0000 Received: from DF4PR84MB0284.NAMPRD84.PROD.OUTLOOK.COM ([10.162.193.22]) by DF4PR84MB0284.NAMPRD84.PROD.OUTLOOK.COM ([10.162.193.22]) with mapi id 15.01.0659.025; Fri, 14 Oct 2016 21:06:54 +0000 From: "Kennedy, Smith (Wireless Architect)" To: Michael Sweet Thread-Topic: [IPP] Finishings 2.1 and maximum sheets - is "printer-finisher" "maxsetsheets" enough? Thread-Index: AQHSJZ++M8eF8BNF9kCzQS8QWyvISaCoXZEAgAAU9oA= Date: Fri, 14 Oct 2016 21:06:54 +0000 Message-ID: References: <82630E91-982B-45BA-8CD1-EA0BDAB6C292@hp.com> <334333D1-D6B0-496D-B899-66E86F781476@apple.com> In-Reply-To: <334333D1-D6B0-496D-B899-66E86F781476@apple.com> Accept-Language: en-US Content-Language: en-US X-MS-Has-Attach: yes X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: authentication-results: spf=none (sender IP is ) smtp.mailfrom=smith.kennedy@hp.com; x-ms-exchange-messagesentrepresentingtype: 1 x-originating-ip: [15.65.252.15] x-ms-office365-filtering-correlation-id: fc0d5493-febb-4943-9450-08d3f4760688 x-microsoft-exchange-diagnostics: 1; DF4PR84MB0281; 6:cAGOIKPLzjeq22Aucf+jwSS9UInZEIVE37gIfNCzt1pUly7dqfgv7qulxJk+6yCU7/CHxjSuF9Mh/ZQXBguk5k1UTMDaeSJSxaxf4+CKTsNKRGOQsFRto3za3ZI0KOge9fp1erm0q20mfAfdUmqDFNRhQfvGDEbOevUKpHt7XUuMnhbX1hhJ5HwLX7Ycr70csAV2NZVXwVCN5JODz06BH8q4P9P6rRl3CLZMgTkiVeRXaxi7kSAY2zpVkNye6sXkJ3lprI4XYjGkggFzi5CghtNu552J43krxa5lCRj4RGyvnwI62YXtc+te447wxAuL; 5:VugeJJQKhg+Xu8jdmdcUUZkgHDH3KqVjnH9cVTaw4FOgGhZAkr1khz0FDesIzXRW0bDzt5dNiW7ZNeKhsCKeMcpTGDz8OOqbqgYOQzDKeqbGx35VKEZQUKV4hO6NnIJXliOf6LNHjc2hWm7/LtgnTQ==; 24:kwuU4bejjcIiCwGqxC6r9H/0xGwK52EKoV5jVJ4nmweoihV8D2BRl1h6yI4DubKI+7Qj805ThsifAQAWPTc/BqY8j9r3K6HxB9QBtakA4aE=; 7:l9O8FM1+9dY0piA7Pje6MFeYTIiQ36J0F3xLE4jrUIiC1jZdjR+6a3BSORjd60Kc88lZNQZcrD2DG2shZLxD+7xYPENZPM4gEPMiMYAfmS7hJ5kWco/tEixAlygiP4qFD4YFQ+DMFQnIH8bhNO18lFOrUknQpZ2bckFCuG73iFdnpTwWiD2XeBjh9a8Zfyj4b0ZwuE61eWqF4rvp51nGHgcWmKClB4/f6+pleMH03tsqE15zkSRuUJiysvskOsxdvJOWNktuDUu/q/vcv0Qfh9Sq1MPZYr9Z0Z3BfPLX6XDNuBQiJuKon4Ovx5tp0HEQB3UgWO0/9hRYplJHKtSoB3RBOlQ6mzw4wDI37SdCb+o= x-microsoft-antispam: UriScan:;BCL:0;PCL:0;RULEID:;SRVR:DF4PR84MB0281; x-microsoft-antispam-prvs: x-exchange-antispam-report-test: UriScan:(31960201722614); x-exchange-antispam-report-cfa-test: BCL:0; PCL:0; RULEID:(102415321)(6040176)(601004)(2401047)(8121501046)(5005006)(3002001)(10201501046); SRVR:DF4PR84MB0281; BCL:0; PCL:0; RULEID:; SRVR:DF4PR84MB0281; x-forefront-prvs: 0095BCF226 x-forefront-antispam-report: SFV:NSPM; SFS:(10019020)(7916002)(199003)(6602003)(189002)(377454003)(24454002)(66066001)(8666005)(10400500002)(36756003)(106356001)(6116002)(99286002)(3846002)(102836003)(8676002)(33656002)(81156014)(7846002)(7736002)(81166006)(3660700001)(16236675004)(82746002)(83716003)(87936001)(8936002)(97736004)(3280700002)(586003)(122556002)(92566002)(2900100001)(110136003)(2950100002)(50986999)(6916009)(54356999)(99936001)(76176999)(77096005)(5002640100001)(68736007)(106116001)(105586002)(19580405001)(2906002)(5660300001)(4326007)(86362001)(189998001)(11100500001)(101416001)(19580395003)(7059030)(104396002); DIR:OUT; SFP:1102; SCL:1; SRVR:DF4PR84MB0281; H:DF4PR84MB0284.NAMPRD84.PROD.OUTLOOK.COM; FPR:; SPF:None; PTR:InfoNoRecords; A:1; MX:1; LANG:en; received-spf: None (protection.outlook.com: hp.com does not designate permitted sender hosts) spamdiagnosticoutput: 1:99 spamdiagnosticmetadata: NSPM MIME-Version: 1.0 X-OriginatorOrg: hp.com X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-originalarrivaltime: 14 Oct 2016 21:06:54.0682 (UTC) X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-fromentityheader: Hosted X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-id: ca7981a2-785a-463d-b82a-3db87dfc3ce6 X-MS-Exchange-Transport-CrossTenantHeadersStamped: DF4PR84MB0281 Cc: "ipp@pwg.org" Subject: Re: [IPP] Finishings 2.1 and maximum sheets - is "printer-finisher" "maxsetsheets" enough? X-BeenThere: ipp@pwg.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15 Precedence: list List-Id: Internet Printing Protocol Workgroup discussion list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="===============2038618445805042506==" Errors-To: ipp-bounces@pwg.org Sender: "ipp" --===============2038618445805042506== Content-Language: en-US Content-Type: multipart/signed; boundary="Apple-Mail=_69E6EBB9-8FF7-4F29-995E-6B378B78E292"; protocol="application/pkcs7-signature"; micalg=sha1 --Apple-Mail=_69E6EBB9-8FF7-4F29-995E-6B378B78E292 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="Apple-Mail=_5CAA1A45-42DC-4DAE-8621-4C06BB9E063C" --Apple-Mail=_5CAA1A45-42DC-4DAE-8621-4C06BB9E063C Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Thanks for your thoughtful responses, Mike!=20 I am fine with abandoning calculation of thicknesses - that seems like = it is way over-engineered for what we want to support, at least for now. = We will stick with measuring in terms of number of sheets. However,=20 >> 2. Eliminate "maxsetsheets" and implement "baling-max-sheets", = "folding-max-sheets", etc. >=20 > I don't like this as much because it conjoins an abstract finishing = process to a physical finisher subunit limit. Since printer-finisher is = where we are exposing the finisher subunits, that is where the limit = should be reported. I'm not quite sure I agree. Yes, we are describing a physical finisher = subunit limit. But different limits may pertain to different abstract = finishing process.=20 Let's discuss user experience / expectations: Jane has a 5 page document that she would like to print and be folded. = She chooses folding, and chooses "fold-half". The printer has expressed = that it has a maximum number of 5 sheets for 'fold-half', 3 for = 'fold-letter', and 2 for 'fold-accordion'. If she chooses 'fold-letter', = what would Jane expect to happen? A. Warning that there are too many pages for 'fold-letter' and offer to = do a 'fold-half' B. Allow Jane to submit the Job and have the Printer present an error C. Allow Jane to submit the Job and have the Printer simply not fold the = pages I think B and C are less than optimal. With A, if we use = "printer-finisher" and 'maxsetsheets' keyword, then there is only one = 'maxsetsheets' value possible for the finisher device. Do we set that to = 2 to be on the safe side to be sure to avoid B or C? Or do we express = the limit on the number of sheets based on the abstract finishing type, = using the "Option 2" like above?** We could get into some awkward weirdness where we have multiple "virtual = finisher devices" each of which can only do one of the finishing = operations. But that would be less than optimal. ** (We could probably simplify #2 by adding a new "max-sheets" member to = "finishings-col" that would only be allowed when it is in = "finishings-col-database" and "finishings-col-ready", rather than = creating "folding-max-sheets", etc.) Smith > On Oct 14, 2016, at 1:51 PM, Michael Sweet wrote: >=20 >> So we have 3 alternatives: >>=20 >> 1. Keep the new "printer-finisher" keyword "maxsetsheets" >=20 > That would be consistent with the Finisher MIB. >=20 >> 2. Eliminate "maxsetsheets" and implement "baling-max-sheets", = "folding-max-sheets", etc. >=20 > I don't like this as much because it conjoins an abstract finishing = process to a physical finisher subunit limit. Since printer-finisher is = where we are exposing the finisher subunits, that is where the limit = should be reported. >=20 >> 3. Eliminate "maxsetsheets" and implement "baling-max-thickness", = "folding-max-thickness", etc. >=20 > That way lies madness. Most printers don't implement media-thickness = support, even LFPs that would have a genuine need for it. And what = Client is going to pre-process the document and job ticket to determine = the final set thickness for finishing? And what printer provides this = information via other protocols (SNMP, etc.)? >=20 >> 4. Encourage vendors to use constraints between media type and = finishing type to limit the range of thicknesses and ignore the = thickness issue >=20 > I think if a vendor knows that certain media types can't be used with = a finisher, then those should be exposed as constraints. But otherwise = I think we just rely on the "best effort" principle. >=20 >> Which way(s) should we go with this? We want something that Clients = can and will implement, but we also want the limitations of the Printer = to be clearly articulated so that the Client implementation can help the = User make informed choices, either automatically or manually. >=20 > I think the most useful information for the Client is to know the = maximum number of sheets a finisher can handle for typical media, with = specific constraints for media as needed. That handles the 99% use = cases without requiring a significant amount of intelligence in the = Client along with major changes in how Printers track and report = finisher capacity. >=20 --Apple-Mail=_5CAA1A45-42DC-4DAE-8621-4C06BB9E063C Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Type: text/html; charset=us-ascii Thanks for your thoughtful responses, Mike! 

I am fine with = abandoning calculation of thicknesses - that seems like it is way = over-engineered for what we want to support, at least for now. We will = stick with measuring in terms of number of sheets.

However, 

2. Eliminate "maxsetsheets" and implement = "baling-max-sheets", "folding-max-sheets", = etc.

I don't like this as much because it conjoins an abstract = finishing process to a physical finisher subunit limit. Since = printer-finisher is where we are exposing the finisher subunits, that is = where the limit should be = reported.

I'm not = quite sure I agree. Yes, we are describing a physical finisher subunit = limit. But different limits may pertain to different abstract finishing = process. 

Let's discuss user experience / expectations:

Jane has a 5 page = document that she would like to print and be folded. She chooses = folding, and chooses "fold-half". The printer has expressed that it has = a maximum number of 5 sheets for 'fold-half', 3 for 'fold-letter', and 2 = for 'fold-accordion'. If she chooses 'fold-letter', what would Jane = expect to happen?

A. Warning that there are too many pages for 'fold-letter' = and offer to do a 'fold-half'
B. Allow Jane to = submit the Job and have the Printer present an error
C. Allow Jane to submit the Job and have the Printer simply = not fold the pages

I think B and C are less than optimal. With A, if we use = "printer-finisher" and 'maxsetsheets' keyword, then there is only one = 'maxsetsheets' value possible for the finisher device. Do we set that to = 2 to be on the safe side to be sure to avoid B or C? Or do we express = the limit on the number of sheets based on the abstract finishing type, = using the "Option 2" like above?**

We could get into some awkward = weirdness where we have multiple "virtual finisher devices" each of = which can only do one of the finishing operations. But that would be = less than optimal.


** (We could probably = simplify #2 by adding a new "max-sheets" member to "finishings-col" that = would only be allowed when it is in "finishings-col-database" and = "finishings-col-ready", rather than creating "folding-max-sheets", = etc.)


Smith

On Oct 14, 2016, at 1:51 PM, Michael Sweet <msweet@apple.com> = wrote:

So we have 3 alternatives:

1. Keep the new "printer-finisher" keyword "maxsetsheets"

That would be consistent = with the Finisher = MIB.



2. Eliminate "maxsetsheets" = and implement "baling-max-sheets", "folding-max-sheets", etc.

I don't like this as much because it = conjoins an abstract finishing process to a physical finisher subunit = limit. Since printer-finisher is where we are exposing the finisher = subunits, that is where the limit should be reported.

3. Eliminate = "maxsetsheets" and implement "baling-max-thickness", = "folding-max-thickness", etc.

That way lies madness.  Most = printers don't implement media-thickness support, even LFPs that would = have a genuine need for it.  And what Client is going to = pre-process the document and job ticket to determine the final set = thickness for finishing? And what printer provides this information via = other protocols (SNMP, etc.)?

4. Encourage vendors to use constraints = between media type and finishing type to limit the range of thicknesses = and ignore the thickness issue

I think if a vendor knows that certain = media types can't be used with a finisher, then those should be exposed = as constraints.  But otherwise I think we just rely on the "best = effort" principle.

Which way(s) should we go with this? We want something that = Clients can and will implement, but we also want the limitations of the = Printer to be clearly articulated so that the Client implementation can = help the User make informed choices, either automatically or = manually.

I think the most useful information for the = Client is to know the maximum number of sheets a finisher can handle for = typical media, with specific constraints for media as needed.  That = handles the 99% use cases without requiring a significant amount of = intelligence in the Client along with major changes in how Printers = track and report finisher capacity.


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(relay2.apple.com [17.128.113.67]) by mail-in7.apple.com (Apple Secure Mail Relay) with SMTP id 69.53.07050.C9942085; Sat, 15 Oct 2016 08:22:04 -0700 (PDT) X-AuditID: 11973e16-e7d8d9a000001b8a-50-5802499c782d Received: from nwk-mmpp-sz12.apple.com (nwk-mmpp-sz12.apple.com [17.128.115.204]) by relay2.apple.com (Apple SCV relay) with SMTP id B0.72.09148.C9942085; Sat, 15 Oct 2016 08:22:04 -0700 (PDT) MIME-version: 1.0 Received: from [17.153.39.81] by nwk-mmpp-sz12.apple.com (Oracle Communications Messaging Server 8.0.1.1.0 64bit (built Jun 15 2016)) with ESMTPSA id <0OF30035EHCQHS00@nwk-mmpp-sz12.apple.com>; Sat, 15 Oct 2016 08:22:04 -0700 (PDT) From: Michael Sweet In-reply-to: Date: Sat, 15 Oct 2016 11:22:02 -0400 Message-id: <24858EA5-225C-470A-ACB5-5BDDD1C1472E@apple.com> References: <82630E91-982B-45BA-8CD1-EA0BDAB6C292@hp.com> <334333D1-D6B0-496D-B899-66E86F781476@apple.com> To: Smith Kennedy X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.3226) X-Brightmail-Tracker: H4sIAAAAAAAAA+NgFtrFLMWRmVeSWpSXmKPExsUi2FDorDvHkynC4PwmZYtj+16yWLzq2sXs wOSxa9tOJo95i6czBTBFcdmkpOZklqUW6dslcGX8+PCBqaBBo+LNtn+MDYz3FLoYOTkkBEwk dkx5z9jFyMUhJLCXUaLnwU5WmMTxuafYIRKHGCWW3ngNluAVEJT4MfkeSxcjBwezgLzEwfOy IGFmAS2J749aWSDq3zJK3Pi6jh0kISwgIXG8fyErhJ0q0Xq7lxHEZhNQk/g9qY8VZA6ngJXE 2gWxIGEWAVWJXednsELMlJdouHOFBWKtjcSl6W+ZIObPYZR40nibDSQhIqAh8WFKMxvIHAkB WYnZv7xAaiQEJrBJ3H+xhXUCo/AsJGfPQjh7FpKzFzAyr2IUyk3MzNHNzDPXSywoyEnVS87P 3cQICuzpdmI7GB+usjrEKMDBqMTDO+MDQ4QQa2JZcWXuIUZpDhYlcd7CVMYIIYH0xJLU7NTU gtSi+KLSnNTiQ4xMHJxSDYw2p6p0kw4p5V4+2Vez5uUa+deZj2L3xS88uKey+GBvYVva0nqt Hs/dvI/t2ib+EmDRWbyphcFtqtOeqN3v1nG7aWz/tk8x92xu4DPupxbx76tnMj7psY4pizg6 tSBi3du5PAde7nJcb9pge2K75MXGXcxOyikHvlepKgcp3Nty4/oLDq6t778psRRnJBpqMRcV JwIAMCrYmE0CAAA= X-Brightmail-Tracker: H4sIAAAAAAAAA+NgFtrJLMWRmVeSWpSXmKPExsUi2FB8RneOJ1OEQf8caYtj+16yWLzq2sXs wOSxa9tOJo95i6czBTBFcdmkpOZklqUW6dslcGX8+PCBqaBBo+LNtn+MDYz3FLoYOTkkBEwk js89xQ5hi0lcuLeerYuRi0NI4BCjxNIbr1lBErwCghI/Jt9j6WLk4GAWkJc4eF4WJMwsoCXx /VErC0T9W0aJG1/XgQ0SFpCQON6/kBXCTpVovd3LCGKzCahJ/J7Uxwoyh1PASmLtgliQMIuA qsSu8zNYIWbKSzTcucICsdZG4tL0t0wQ8+cwSjxpvM0GkhAR0JD4MKWZDWSOhICsxOxfXhMY BWchuXQWwqWzkFy6gJF5FaNAUWpOYqWRXmJBQU6qXnJ+7iZGcIAWOu9gPLbM6hCjAAejEg/v jA8MEUKsiWXFlbnAoOBgVhLh1fJgihDiTUmsrEotyo8vKs1JLT7EKM3BoiTOy9v4L1xIID2x JDU7NbUgtQgmy8TBKdXAWPyws375TEfmgssNS5i/+mhPnuxh1jt1ttFCPu+e+aYnZdaEXF2U /sZw6iG2BUxbX5Q8T/7/wlIg8DDPm4ZgoRCDJcyWnhOF31XvmzDV7/ustx0Bm13UI5kvrWq7 YjqzvdxBcNeRrILCVvG3X/yvrb/n8u30hi92Xwz/NzufzrY/fHSbx5sUASWW4oxEQy3mouJE ALrZkhRMAgAA Cc: "ipp@pwg.org" Subject: Re: [IPP] Finishings 2.1 and maximum sheets - is "printer-finisher" "maxsetsheets" enough? X-BeenThere: ipp@pwg.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15 Precedence: list List-Id: Internet Printing Protocol Workgroup discussion list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: ipp-bounces@pwg.org Sender: "ipp" Smith, > On Oct 14, 2016, at 5:06 PM, Kennedy, Smith (Wireless Architect) wrote: >>> ... >>> 2. Eliminate "maxsetsheets" and implement "baling-max-sheets", "folding-max-sheets", etc. >> >> I don't like this as much because it conjoins an abstract finishing process to a physical finisher subunit limit. Since printer-finisher is where we are exposing the finisher subunits, that is where the limit should be reported. > > I'm not quite sure I agree. Yes, we are describing a physical finisher subunit limit. But different limits may pertain to different abstract finishing process. Perhaps - I guess the question is whether this is a practical issue that has affected users? For example, the booklet finishers I've used could fold a partial set and "stack" the folded output such that it didn't matter that the folding mechanism could only handle (for example) 10 sheets at a time. The only time it became an issue was when you wanted to staple (saddle stitch in the case of booklet printing) since the staple had to be done before the fold. > Let's discuss user experience / expectations: > > Jane has a 5 page document that she would like to print and be folded. She chooses folding, and chooses "fold-half". The printer has expressed that it has a maximum number of 5 sheets for 'fold-half', 3 for 'fold-letter', and 2 for 'fold-accordion'. If she chooses 'fold-letter', what would Jane expect to happen? > > A. Warning that there are too many pages for 'fold-letter' and offer to do a 'fold-half' > B. Allow Jane to submit the Job and have the Printer present an error > C. Allow Jane to submit the Job and have the Printer simply not fold the pages > > I think B and C are less than optimal. With A, if we use "printer-finisher" and 'maxsetsheets' keyword, then there is only one 'maxsetsheets' value possible for the finisher device. Do we set that to 2 to be on the safe side to be sure to avoid B or C? Or do we express the limit on the number of sheets based on the abstract finishing type, using the "Option 2" like above?** I agree that A is the best outcome, with B or C being the fallback for Clients that don't consult the member attribute in "finishings-col-{database,ready}". > We could get into some awkward weirdness where we have multiple "virtual finisher devices" each of which can only do one of the finishing operations. But that would be less than optimal. > > > ** (We could probably simplify #2 by adding a new "max-sheets" member to "finishings-col" that would only be allowed when it is in "finishings-col-database" and "finishings-col-ready", rather than creating "folding-max-sheets", etc.) I like this idea better rather than separate sub-member attributes in each finishing process collection. As for naming, how about "media-sheets-supported (rangeOfInteger(0:MAX))" to mirror the "job-media-sheets-supported" Printer Description attribute? > > > Smith > >> On Oct 14, 2016, at 1:51 PM, Michael Sweet wrote: >> >>> So we have 3 alternatives: >>> >>> 1. Keep the new "printer-finisher" keyword "maxsetsheets" >> >> That would be consistent with the Finisher MIB. > > >> >>> 2. Eliminate "maxsetsheets" and implement "baling-max-sheets", "folding-max-sheets", etc. >> >> I don't like this as much because it conjoins an abstract finishing process to a physical finisher subunit limit. Since printer-finisher is where we are exposing the finisher subunits, that is where the limit should be reported. >> >>> 3. Eliminate "maxsetsheets" and implement "baling-max-thickness", "folding-max-thickness", etc. >> >> That way lies madness. Most printers don't implement media-thickness support, even LFPs that would have a genuine need for it. And what Client is going to pre-process the document and job ticket to determine the final set thickness for finishing? And what printer provides this information via other protocols (SNMP, etc.)? >> >>> 4. Encourage vendors to use constraints between media type and finishing type to limit the range of thicknesses and ignore the thickness issue >> >> I think if a vendor knows that certain media types can't be used with a finisher, then those should be exposed as constraints. But otherwise I think we just rely on the "best effort" principle. >> >>> Which way(s) should we go with this? We want something that Clients can and will implement, but we also want the limitations of the Printer to be clearly articulated so that the Client implementation can help the User make informed choices, either automatically or manually. >> >> I think the most useful information for the Client is to know the maximum number of sheets a finisher can handle for typical media, with specific constraints for media as needed. That handles the 99% use cases without requiring a significant amount of intelligence in the Client along with major changes in how Printers track and report finisher capacity. >> > _________________________________________________________ Michael Sweet, Senior Printing System Engineer _______________________________________________ ipp mailing list ipp@pwg.org https://www.pwg.org/mailman/listinfo/ipp From ipp-bounces@pwg.org Sat Oct 15 08:58:14 2016 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ietfarch-ipp-archive@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: ietfarch-ipp-archive@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 92D2B129670 for ; Sat, 15 Oct 2016 08:58:14 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -4.782 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-4.782 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_ADSP_CUSTOM_MED=0.001, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, FREEMAIL_FORGED_FROMDOMAIN=0.001, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, HEADER_FROM_DIFFERENT_DOMAINS=0.001, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE=-0.0001, RP_MATCHES_RCVD=-2.996, SPF_PASS=-0.001, T_DKIM_INVALID=0.01] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=fail (2048-bit key) reason="fail (message has been altered)" header.d=gmail.com Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id SR-rIccfH0Wi for ; Sat, 15 Oct 2016 08:58:12 -0700 (PDT) Received: from www.pwg.org (www.pwg.org [50.116.7.199]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 78784126CD8 for ; Sat, 15 Oct 2016 08:58:12 -0700 (PDT) Received: by www.pwg.org (Postfix, from userid 1002) id 8D2C3440E; Sat, 15 Oct 2016 15:58:07 +0000 (UTC) Received: from www.pwg.org (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by www.pwg.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id C1E2C2695; Sat, 15 Oct 2016 15:57:58 +0000 (UTC) X-Original-To: ipp@pwg.org Delivered-To: ipp@pwg.org Received: by www.pwg.org (Postfix, from userid 1002) id 6D1AC415B; Sat, 15 Oct 2016 15:57:57 +0000 (UTC) Received: from mail-it0-x22a.google.com (mail-it0-x22a.google.com [IPv6:2607:f8b0:4001:c0b::22a]) by www.pwg.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 4D9842660 for ; Sat, 15 Oct 2016 15:57:56 +0000 (UTC) Received: by mail-it0-x22a.google.com with SMTP id 4so16496882itv.0 for ; Sat, 15 Oct 2016 08:57:56 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20120113; h=mime-version:in-reply-to:references:from:date:message-id:subject:to :cc; bh=z7dKayyJfi93ttAxWpb6zhZ5LlJmZGqea37xpoRiDiw=; b=zS5ohMinHnF1jS9TgzaW10WxPqEsUbj+UX4cj4RVaR4IjtnN4xVIjjl0MS8aTRGAEm 2b4ovMzbFg1c1QE5aUaoZbTBFaJ2AwV7GCntbW2NySk0dL1asJvgQRn23K2Ex2ladUTl xNOb0lhl8/n+jD5vKxsE6lgaRdkVY9Q0K2o8cFpZ/AYqDlOKUId/qdaQSWPueYf2u4jq 3145EU3787phUM656poBAuh36fUN2XbYphmVDJFpFgABqSOxFse+CkIkyrB7M8sgMsdZ 5auxBn5yKFvcjTZCzU/fJ3dK/LFtmK0A2x3isuRvFD6zyRqauGcrPpifKJiW87Z2I+Mg IO7A== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20130820; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:in-reply-to:references:from:date :message-id:subject:to:cc; bh=z7dKayyJfi93ttAxWpb6zhZ5LlJmZGqea37xpoRiDiw=; b=nNIh0Dr+Axkv5EbyWb3SePntK+twX87I9kRy000agFCXq5MQFDv69Dtxs5sjk+lDzM zvzJDPBwjC3qoz5/v5LBTK9Q+4lIF/EGnXD5iIcTxV0lbomWXcDCm9ag18pRW7vVGCpf qup7kNm/Ju4UsYASvTklEkUF/dHaZvBlBSYFX+m0oaBH4I+V9gf+a87lpHEViFOx4r6z sU0kuX5SehD2j2gBKDhUG9aFluIfyJ/RTS1TS9ceEnyMDBr0R2wY+QEsB1CWIfPheog9 lnMXMXpm0R0WaJAkXWMXtSn645/rHnBwgNKCj0vucFvQsOWFve2wyFs/rt9Fvp0YjFQb P83g== X-Gm-Message-State: AA6/9RmSwp0wgvbocnsvyxfUA+g5MCib9iyrvIGUh9QdmiaYrrZeBII2ip69lON7bAfDAO5/crBug3gJldRcHA== X-Received: by 10.36.41.194 with SMTP id p185mr2241254itp.66.1476547075539; Sat, 15 Oct 2016 08:57:55 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 Received: by 10.107.147.6 with HTTP; Sat, 15 Oct 2016 08:57:34 -0700 (PDT) In-Reply-To: <24858EA5-225C-470A-ACB5-5BDDD1C1472E@apple.com> References: <82630E91-982B-45BA-8CD1-EA0BDAB6C292@hp.com> <334333D1-D6B0-496D-B899-66E86F781476@apple.com> <24858EA5-225C-470A-ACB5-5BDDD1C1472E@apple.com> From: Ira McDonald Date: Sat, 15 Oct 2016 11:57:34 -0400 Message-ID: To: Michael Sweet , Ira McDonald Cc: "ipp@pwg.org" Subject: Re: [IPP] Finishings 2.1 and maximum sheets - is "printer-finisher" "maxsetsheets" enough? X-BeenThere: ipp@pwg.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15 Precedence: list List-Id: Internet Printing Protocol Workgroup discussion list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="===============0319219163779657377==" Errors-To: ipp-bounces@pwg.org Sender: "ipp" --===============0319219163779657377== Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary=001a11440d30ee88d5053ee96791 --001a11440d30ee88d5053ee96791 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 Hi, +1 to Mike's comments. And I like the symmetry of "media-sheets-supported" for "finishings-col" with "job-media-sheets-supported" for Printer. Cheers, - Ira Ira McDonald (Musician / Software Architect) Co-Chair - TCG Trusted Mobility Solutions WG Chair - Linux Foundation Open Printing WG Secretary - IEEE-ISTO Printer Working Group Co-Chair - IEEE-ISTO PWG Internet Printing Protocol WG IETF Designated Expert - IPP & Printer MIB Blue Roof Music / High North Inc http://sites.google.com/site/blueroofmusic http://sites.google.com/site/highnorthinc mailto: blueroofmusic@gmail.com Jan-April: 579 Park Place Saline, MI 48176 734-944-0094 May-Dec: PO Box 221 Grand Marais, MI 49839 906-494-2434 On Sat, Oct 15, 2016 at 11:22 AM, Michael Sweet wrote: > Smith, > > > On Oct 14, 2016, at 5:06 PM, Kennedy, Smith (Wireless Architect) < > smith.kennedy@hp.com> wrote: > >>> ... > >>> 2. Eliminate "maxsetsheets" and implement "baling-max-sheets", > "folding-max-sheets", etc. > >> > >> I don't like this as much because it conjoins an abstract finishing > process to a physical finisher subunit limit. Since printer-finisher is > where we are exposing the finisher subunits, that is where the limit should > be reported. > > > > I'm not quite sure I agree. Yes, we are describing a physical finisher > subunit limit. But different limits may pertain to different abstract > finishing process. > > Perhaps - I guess the question is whether this is a practical issue that > has affected users? For example, the booklet finishers I've used could > fold a partial set and "stack" the folded output such that it didn't matter > that the folding mechanism could only handle (for example) 10 sheets at a > time. The only time it became an issue was when you wanted to staple > (saddle stitch in the case of booklet printing) since the staple had to be > done before the fold. > > > Let's discuss user experience / expectations: > > > > Jane has a 5 page document that she would like to print and be folded. > She chooses folding, and chooses "fold-half". The printer has expressed > that it has a maximum number of 5 sheets for 'fold-half', 3 for > 'fold-letter', and 2 for 'fold-accordion'. If she chooses 'fold-letter', > what would Jane expect to happen? > > > > A. Warning that there are too many pages for 'fold-letter' and offer to > do a 'fold-half' > > B. Allow Jane to submit the Job and have the Printer present an error > > C. Allow Jane to submit the Job and have the Printer simply not fold the > pages > > > > I think B and C are less than optimal. With A, if we use > "printer-finisher" and 'maxsetsheets' keyword, then there is only one > 'maxsetsheets' value possible for the finisher device. Do we set that to 2 > to be on the safe side to be sure to avoid B or C? Or do we express the > limit on the number of sheets based on the abstract finishing type, using > the "Option 2" like above?** > > I agree that A is the best outcome, with B or C being the fallback for > Clients that don't consult the member attribute in > "finishings-col-{database,ready}". > > > We could get into some awkward weirdness where we have multiple "virtual > finisher devices" each of which can only do one of the finishing > operations. But that would be less than optimal. > > > > > > ** (We could probably simplify #2 by adding a new "max-sheets" member to > "finishings-col" that would only be allowed when it is in > "finishings-col-database" and "finishings-col-ready", rather than creating > "folding-max-sheets", etc.) > > I like this idea better rather than separate sub-member attributes in each > finishing process collection. > > As for naming, how about "media-sheets-supported (rangeOfInteger(0:MAX))" > to mirror the "job-media-sheets-supported" Printer Description attribute? > > > > > > > Smith > > > >> On Oct 14, 2016, at 1:51 PM, Michael Sweet wrote: > >> > >>> So we have 3 alternatives: > >>> > >>> 1. Keep the new "printer-finisher" keyword "maxsetsheets" > >> > >> That would be consistent with the Finisher MIB. > > > > > >> > >>> 2. Eliminate "maxsetsheets" and implement "baling-max-sheets", > "folding-max-sheets", etc. > >> > >> I don't like this as much because it conjoins an abstract finishing > process to a physical finisher subunit limit. Since printer-finisher is > where we are exposing the finisher subunits, that is where the limit should > be reported. > >> > >>> 3. Eliminate "maxsetsheets" and implement "baling-max-thickness", > "folding-max-thickness", etc. > >> > >> That way lies madness. Most printers don't implement media-thickness > support, even LFPs that would have a genuine need for it. And what Client > is going to pre-process the document and job ticket to determine the final > set thickness for finishing? And what printer provides this information via > other protocols (SNMP, etc.)? > >> > >>> 4. Encourage vendors to use constraints between media type and > finishing type to limit the range of thicknesses and ignore the thickness > issue > >> > >> I think if a vendor knows that certain media types can't be used with a > finisher, then those should be exposed as constraints. But otherwise I > think we just rely on the "best effort" principle. > >> > >>> Which way(s) should we go with this? We want something that Clients > can and will implement, but we also want the limitations of the Printer to > be clearly articulated so that the Client implementation can help the User > make informed choices, either automatically or manually. > >> > >> I think the most useful information for the Client is to know the > maximum number of sheets a finisher can handle for typical media, with > specific constraints for media as needed. That handles the 99% use cases > without requiring a significant amount of intelligence in the Client along > with major changes in how Printers track and report finisher capacity. > >> > > > > _________________________________________________________ > Michael Sweet, Senior Printing System Engineer > > _______________________________________________ > ipp mailing list > ipp@pwg.org > https://www.pwg.org/mailman/listinfo/ipp > --001a11440d30ee88d5053ee96791 Content-Type: text/html; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Hi,

+1 to Mike&= #39;s comments.

And I like the symmetry of "media-sheets-= supported" for
"finishings-col" with "job-med= ia-sheets-supported" for
Printer.

Cheers,
- Ira


Ira McDonald (Musician / Software Architect)
= Co-Chair - TCG Trusted Mobility Solutions WG
Chair - Linux Foundation Op= en Printing WG
Secretary - IEEE-ISTO Printer Working Group
Co-Chair -= IEEE-ISTO PWG Internet Printing Protocol WG
IETF Designated Expert - IP= P & Printer MIB
Blue Roof Music / High North Inc
http://sites.google.com/site/blueroofmusic
http://sites.google.com/site/highnorthinc
mailto: blueroofmusic@gm= ail.com
Jan-April: 579 Park Place=C2=A0 Saline, MI=C2=A0 48176=C2=A0= 734-944-0094
May-Dec: PO Box 221=C2=A0 Grand Marais, MI 49839=C2=A0 906= -494-2434


On Sat, Oct 15, 2016 at 11:22 AM, Michael Sw= eet <msweet@apple.com> wrote:
Smith,

> On Oct 14, 2016, at 5:06 PM, Kennedy, Smith (Wireless Architect) <<= a href=3D"mailto:smith.kennedy@hp.com">smith.kennedy@hp.com> wrote:<= br> >>> ...
>>> 2. Eliminate "maxsetsheets" and imp= lement "baling-max-sheets", "folding-max-sheets", etc.<= br> >>
>> I don't like this as much because it conjoins an abstract fini= shing process to a physical finisher subunit limit. Since printer-finisher = is where we are exposing the finisher subunits, that is where the limit sho= uld be reported.
>
> I'm not quite sure I agree. Yes, we are describing a physical fini= sher subunit limit. But different limits may pertain to different abstract = finishing process.

Perhaps - I guess the question is whether this is a practical issue = that has affected users?=C2=A0 For example, the booklet finishers I've = used could fold a partial set and "stack" the folded output such = that it didn't matter that the folding mechanism could only handle (for= example) 10 sheets at a time.=C2=A0 The only time it became an issue was w= hen you wanted to staple (saddle stitch in the case of booklet printing) si= nce the staple had to be done before the fold.

> Let's discuss user experience / expectations:
>
> Jane has a 5 page document that she would like to print and be folded.= She chooses folding, and chooses "fold-half". The printer has ex= pressed that it has a maximum number of 5 sheets for 'fold-half', 3= for 'fold-letter', and 2 for 'fold-accordion'. If she choo= ses 'fold-letter', what would Jane expect to happen?
>
> A. Warning that there are too many pages for 'fold-letter' and= offer to do a 'fold-half'
> B. Allow Jane to submit the Job and have the Printer present an error<= br> > C. Allow Jane to submit the Job and have the Printer simply not fold t= he pages
>
> I think B and C are less than optimal. With A, if we use "printer= -finisher" and 'maxsetsheets' keyword, then there is only one = 'maxsetsheets' value possible for the finisher device. Do we set th= at to 2 to be on the safe side to be sure to avoid B or C? Or do we express= the limit on the number of sheets based on the abstract finishing type, us= ing the "Option 2" like above?**

I agree that A is the best outcome, with B or C being the fallback f= or Clients that don't consult the member attribute in "finishings-= col-{database,ready}".

> We could get into some awkward weirdness where we have multiple "= virtual finisher devices" each of which can only do one of the finishi= ng operations. But that would be less than optimal.
>
>
> ** (We could probably simplify #2 by adding a new "max-sheets&quo= t; member to "finishings-col" that would only be allowed when it = is in "finishings-col-database" and "finishings-col-ready&qu= ot;, rather than creating "folding-max-sheets", etc.)

I like this idea better rather than separate sub-member attributes i= n each finishing process collection.

As for naming, how about "media-sheets-supported (rangeOfInteger(0:MAX= ))" to mirror the "job-media-sheets-supported" Printer Descr= iption attribute?

>
>
> Smith
>
>> On Oct 14, 2016, at 1:51 PM, Michael Sweet <msweet@apple.com> wrote:
>>
>>> So we have 3 alternatives:
>>>
>>> 1. Keep the new "printer-finisher" keyword "max= setsheets"
>>
>> That would be consistent with the Finisher MIB.
>
>
>>
>>> 2. Eliminate "maxsetsheets" and implement "bali= ng-max-sheets", "folding-max-sheets", etc.
>>
>> I don't like this as much because it conjoins an abstract fini= shing process to a physical finisher subunit limit. Since printer-finisher = is where we are exposing the finisher subunits, that is where the limit sho= uld be reported.
>>
>>> 3. Eliminate "maxsetsheets" and implement "bali= ng-max-thickness", "folding-max-thickness", etc.
>>
>> That way lies madness.=C2=A0 Most printers don't implement med= ia-thickness support, even LFPs that would have a genuine need for it.=C2= =A0 And what Client is going to pre-process the document and job ticket to = determine the final set thickness for finishing? And what printer provides = this information via other protocols (SNMP, etc.)?
>>
>>> 4. Encourage vendors to use constraints between media type and= finishing type to limit the range of thicknesses and ignore the thickness = issue
>>
>> I think if a vendor knows that certain media types can't be us= ed with a finisher, then those should be exposed as constraints.=C2=A0 But = otherwise I think we just rely on the "best effort" principle. >>
>>> Which way(s) should we go with this? We want something that Cl= ients can and will implement, but we also want the limitations of the Print= er to be clearly articulated so that the Client implementation can help the= User make informed choices, either automatically or manually.
>>
>> I think the most useful information for the Client is to know the = maximum number of sheets a finisher can handle for typical media, with spec= ific constraints for media as needed.=C2=A0 That handles the 99% use cases = without requiring a significant amount of intelligence in the Client along = with major changes in how Printers track and report finisher capacity.
>>
>

______________________________________________= ___________
Michael Sweet, Senior Printing System Engineer

_______________________________________________
ipp mailing list
ipp@pwg.org
https://www.pwg.org/mailman/listinfo/ipp

--001a11440d30ee88d5053ee96791-- --===============0319219163779657377== Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline _______________________________________________ ipp mailing list ipp@pwg.org https://www.pwg.org/mailman/listinfo/ipp --===============0319219163779657377==-- From ipp-bounces@pwg.org Sat Oct 15 20:51:49 2016 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ietfarch-ipp-archive@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: ietfarch-ipp-archive@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 658981293E4 for ; Sat, 15 Oct 2016 20:51:49 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.33 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.33 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, HEADER_FROM_DIFFERENT_DOMAINS=0.001, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, RP_MATCHES_RCVD=-0.431, SPF_PASS=-0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id BwQ4anGwzUF3 for ; Sat, 15 Oct 2016 20:51:46 -0700 (PDT) Received: from www.pwg.org (www.pwg.org [IPv6:2600:3c01::f03c:91ff:fe70:b03f]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id CBE251293D9 for ; Sat, 15 Oct 2016 20:51:46 -0700 (PDT) Received: by www.pwg.org (Postfix, from userid 1002) id 9AF514417; Sun, 16 Oct 2016 03:51:45 +0000 (UTC) Received: from www.pwg.org (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by www.pwg.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id B608F26B9; Sun, 16 Oct 2016 03:51:35 +0000 (UTC) X-Original-To: ipp@pwg.org Delivered-To: ipp@pwg.org Received: by www.pwg.org (Postfix, from userid 1002) id 5772827B2; Sun, 16 Oct 2016 03:51:34 +0000 (UTC) Received: from NAM03-BY2-obe.outbound.protection.outlook.com (mail-by2nam03on0097.outbound.protection.outlook.com [104.47.42.97]) by www.pwg.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 6EE4F268F for ; Sun, 16 Oct 2016 03:51:32 +0000 (UTC) Received: from DF4PR84MB0284.NAMPRD84.PROD.OUTLOOK.COM (10.162.193.22) by DF4PR84MB0284.NAMPRD84.PROD.OUTLOOK.COM (10.162.193.22) with Microsoft SMTP Server (version=TLS1_2, cipher=TLS_ECDHE_RSA_WITH_AES_256_CBC_SHA384_P384) id 15.1.659.11; Sun, 16 Oct 2016 03:51:29 +0000 Received: from DF4PR84MB0284.NAMPRD84.PROD.OUTLOOK.COM ([10.162.193.22]) by DF4PR84MB0284.NAMPRD84.PROD.OUTLOOK.COM ([10.162.193.22]) with mapi id 15.01.0659.025; Sun, 16 Oct 2016 03:51:29 +0000 From: "Kennedy, Smith (Wireless Architect)" To: Ira McDonald , Michael Sweet Thread-Topic: [IPP] Finishings 2.1 and maximum sheets - is "printer-finisher" "maxsetsheets" enough? Thread-Index: AQHSJZ++M8eF8BNF9kCzQS8QWyvISaCoXZEAgAAU9oCAATH7AIAACe0AgADHeIA= Date: Sun, 16 Oct 2016 03:51:29 +0000 Message-ID: References: <82630E91-982B-45BA-8CD1-EA0BDAB6C292@hp.com> <334333D1-D6B0-496D-B899-66E86F781476@apple.com> <24858EA5-225C-470A-ACB5-5BDDD1C1472E@apple.com> In-Reply-To: Accept-Language: en-US Content-Language: en-US X-MS-Has-Attach: yes X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: authentication-results: spf=none (sender IP is ) smtp.mailfrom=smith.kennedy@hp.com; x-ms-exchange-messagesentrepresentingtype: 1 x-originating-ip: [97.121.8.187] x-ms-office365-filtering-correlation-id: 68013fc5-38a2-4cb6-eb52-08d3f577b651 x-microsoft-exchange-diagnostics: 1; DF4PR84MB0284; 6:d+6271n6UUGaGQUSukiNd9RkGtyDWqpHADWAUjxQ/ZbbhYr5kw4Ig+BhUnQtrOl3MsnwPLVf/CR3gI1HJKCvxuOT+pdDlXiV3Dr/VRPmGguhqo5mRGzFyqOprrDpWr63uMIMlEjCa6yngxvI1PV0QaQK2sIEomExAXYTgSJlnSAYQDQhGAiIGdAjJZcWx2U6sHyA9T+5Sp+D7YGJjp5AeT36lWnkCzkLlIlVTw/NTksN0d+wSWt4I0/lPQcit4RD+q5G19zzClU0n6Co3hVMpk3z7Ru2txfr4gShZw2PdZBTMl3xdJGCibDKYGBOcbvh; 5:rz+MOrm1z/46Yw45TQTgBvJnD+YHSglaBrLSAwvm8SW/hYEDOEOpQxiwzacMl3Vtqp88IRnxODxFutFxjRkIUiGEUZoZixCnRkCzynzs8SSDPZIbrPRHMqYSzuFA7Q9jYYjMj+k6zvXuqSZpJ4cBLg82MeUVhBYLtU45Q0F1AAM=; 24:RWOFUQvWYRcyuQ6LOlF0EW/FFIkZz1YuiC1m0jFypvskM3rY84y5WvHVR/2DMUe+AWPYdKD+2VihXoFyDgvQeFXktRPc2cMNcRmqjEkhghE=; 7:ffOCYrpoh5Thyg9zIIpbgMl9aVxTbPUHYqpBOh6tmcdKoPTIOkSUyLmIApDNwpLjVxrG5Z1N4fIx9ZmnEOWFglSjQEZmMuqZihFqtGbSGinjNh6rgE13d9YRLJQyDo8BFbiPV8zVyKfzrZimeuUi5SWLGDfrAB7WzwUmDSghqEmZpO9iOwLdvXMQkQh8649qf0MLTqE9SLdiNTzsricslSfoPYRoa4Rp0G1qEbmE7PIN3G6WRryfMebz5aibxPBHFCFkCPW5x4sa6RGAYr+lw+Zt4pklWBdAAc7RYfqdClBQH6LRiiZ3t3UYcAZ3Zx6JyFdJL2EpQdvrdQh+P08hOh9/Sp0c/E9m7gaxL6t81XU= x-microsoft-antispam: UriScan:;BCL:0;PCL:0;RULEID:;SRVR:DF4PR84MB0284; x-microsoft-antispam-prvs: x-exchange-antispam-report-test: UriScan:(111039206520245)(211936372134217)(31960201722614)(73583498263828); x-exchange-antispam-report-cfa-test: BCL:0; PCL:0; RULEID:(102415321)(6040176)(601004)(2401047)(8121501046)(5005006)(10201501046)(3002001); SRVR:DF4PR84MB0284; BCL:0; PCL:0; RULEID:; SRVR:DF4PR84MB0284; x-forefront-prvs: 00979FCB3A x-forefront-antispam-report: SFV:NSPM; SFS:(10019020)(7916002)(189002)(377454003)(6602003)(199003)(24454002)(36756003)(2906002)(6116002)(87936001)(8666005)(66066001)(561944003)(11100500001)(81156014)(81166006)(33656002)(16236675004)(8676002)(3660700001)(101416001)(2950100002)(7846002)(10400500002)(189998001)(7736002)(97736004)(5001770100001)(5002640100001)(7906003)(86362001)(3280700002)(4326007)(8936002)(82746002)(106116001)(99286002)(19273905006)(83716003)(122556002)(19580395003)(586003)(19580405001)(19617315012)(50986999)(92566002)(77096005)(54356999)(93886004)(106356001)(99936001)(2900100001)(5660300001)(105586002)(3846002)(102836003)(15975445007)(76176999)(68736007)(7059030)(16351025005)(104396002)(563064011); DIR:OUT; SFP:1102; SCL:1; SRVR:DF4PR84MB0284; H:DF4PR84MB0284.NAMPRD84.PROD.OUTLOOK.COM; FPR:; SPF:None; PTR:InfoNoRecords; MX:1; A:1; LANG:en; received-spf: None (protection.outlook.com: hp.com does not designate permitted sender hosts) spamdiagnosticoutput: 1:99 spamdiagnosticmetadata: NSPM MIME-Version: 1.0 X-OriginatorOrg: hp.com X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-originalarrivaltime: 16 Oct 2016 03:51:29.6916 (UTC) X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-fromentityheader: Hosted X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-id: ca7981a2-785a-463d-b82a-3db87dfc3ce6 X-MS-Exchange-Transport-CrossTenantHeadersStamped: DF4PR84MB0284 Cc: "ipp@pwg.org" Subject: Re: [IPP] Finishings 2.1 and maximum sheets - is "printer-finisher" "maxsetsheets" enough? X-BeenThere: ipp@pwg.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15 Precedence: list List-Id: Internet Printing Protocol Workgroup discussion list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="===============4454400916651158307==" Errors-To: ipp-bounces@pwg.org Sender: "ipp" --===============4454400916651158307== Content-Language: en-US Content-Type: multipart/signed; boundary="Apple-Mail=_3DE01C4B-0803-4D63-BDE1-AA3307505F91"; protocol="application/pkcs7-signature"; micalg=sha1 --Apple-Mail=_3DE01C4B-0803-4D63-BDE1-AA3307505F91 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="Apple-Mail=_AEC5F51D-AE8E-4D18-BA9C-D05DB9A4F12F" --Apple-Mail=_AEC5F51D-AE8E-4D18-BA9C-D05DB9A4F12F Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii I also like Mike's proposal for naming. I will add = "media-sheets-supported(rangeOfInteger(0:MAX))" as a member attribute of = "finishings-col" and remove "maxsetsheets" from "printer-description" in = my next revision, which I hope to have out early this coming week. Smith > On Oct 15, 2016, at 9:57 AM, Ira McDonald = wrote: >=20 > Hi, >=20 > +1 to Mike's comments. >=20 > And I like the symmetry of "media-sheets-supported" for=20 > "finishings-col" with "job-media-sheets-supported" for > Printer. >=20 > Cheers, > - Ira >=20 >=20 > Ira McDonald (Musician / Software Architect) > Co-Chair - TCG Trusted Mobility Solutions WG > Chair - Linux Foundation Open Printing WG > Secretary - IEEE-ISTO Printer Working Group > Co-Chair - IEEE-ISTO PWG Internet Printing Protocol WG > IETF Designated Expert - IPP & Printer MIB > Blue Roof Music / High North Inc > http://sites.google.com/site/blueroofmusic = > http://sites.google.com/site/highnorthinc = > mailto: blueroofmusic@gmail.com > Jan-April: 579 Park Place Saline, MI 48176 734-944-0094 > May-Dec: PO Box 221 Grand Marais, MI 49839 906-494-2434 >=20 >=20 > On Sat, Oct 15, 2016 at 11:22 AM, Michael Sweet > wrote: > Smith, >=20 > > On Oct 14, 2016, at 5:06 PM, Kennedy, Smith (Wireless Architect) = > wrote: > >>> ... > >>> 2. Eliminate "maxsetsheets" and implement "baling-max-sheets", = "folding-max-sheets", etc. > >> > >> I don't like this as much because it conjoins an abstract finishing = process to a physical finisher subunit limit. Since printer-finisher is = where we are exposing the finisher subunits, that is where the limit = should be reported. > > > > I'm not quite sure I agree. Yes, we are describing a physical = finisher subunit limit. But different limits may pertain to different = abstract finishing process. >=20 > Perhaps - I guess the question is whether this is a practical issue = that has affected users? For example, the booklet finishers I've used = could fold a partial set and "stack" the folded output such that it = didn't matter that the folding mechanism could only handle (for example) = 10 sheets at a time. The only time it became an issue was when you = wanted to staple (saddle stitch in the case of booklet printing) since = the staple had to be done before the fold. >=20 > > Let's discuss user experience / expectations: > > > > Jane has a 5 page document that she would like to print and be = folded. She chooses folding, and chooses "fold-half". The printer has = expressed that it has a maximum number of 5 sheets for 'fold-half', 3 = for 'fold-letter', and 2 for 'fold-accordion'. If she chooses = 'fold-letter', what would Jane expect to happen? > > > > A. Warning that there are too many pages for 'fold-letter' and offer = to do a 'fold-half' > > B. Allow Jane to submit the Job and have the Printer present an = error > > C. Allow Jane to submit the Job and have the Printer simply not fold = the pages > > > > I think B and C are less than optimal. With A, if we use = "printer-finisher" and 'maxsetsheets' keyword, then there is only one = 'maxsetsheets' value possible for the finisher device. Do we set that to = 2 to be on the safe side to be sure to avoid B or C? Or do we express = the limit on the number of sheets based on the abstract finishing type, = using the "Option 2" like above?** >=20 > I agree that A is the best outcome, with B or C being the fallback for = Clients that don't consult the member attribute in = "finishings-col-{database,ready}". >=20 > > We could get into some awkward weirdness where we have multiple = "virtual finisher devices" each of which can only do one of the = finishing operations. But that would be less than optimal. > > > > > > ** (We could probably simplify #2 by adding a new "max-sheets" = member to "finishings-col" that would only be allowed when it is in = "finishings-col-database" and "finishings-col-ready", rather than = creating "folding-max-sheets", etc.) >=20 > I like this idea better rather than separate sub-member attributes in = each finishing process collection. >=20 > As for naming, how about "media-sheets-supported = (rangeOfInteger(0:MAX))" to mirror the "job-media-sheets-supported" = Printer Description attribute? >=20 > > > > > > Smith > > > >> On Oct 14, 2016, at 1:51 PM, Michael Sweet > wrote: > >> > >>> So we have 3 alternatives: > >>> > >>> 1. Keep the new "printer-finisher" keyword "maxsetsheets" > >> > >> That would be consistent with the Finisher MIB. > > > > > >> > >>> 2. Eliminate "maxsetsheets" and implement "baling-max-sheets", = "folding-max-sheets", etc. > >> > >> I don't like this as much because it conjoins an abstract finishing = process to a physical finisher subunit limit. Since printer-finisher is = where we are exposing the finisher subunits, that is where the limit = should be reported. > >> > >>> 3. Eliminate "maxsetsheets" and implement "baling-max-thickness", = "folding-max-thickness", etc. > >> > >> That way lies madness. Most printers don't implement = media-thickness support, even LFPs that would have a genuine need for = it. And what Client is going to pre-process the document and job ticket = to determine the final set thickness for finishing? And what printer = provides this information via other protocols (SNMP, etc.)? > >> > >>> 4. Encourage vendors to use constraints between media type and = finishing type to limit the range of thicknesses and ignore the = thickness issue > >> > >> I think if a vendor knows that certain media types can't be used = with a finisher, then those should be exposed as constraints. But = otherwise I think we just rely on the "best effort" principle. > >> > >>> Which way(s) should we go with this? We want something that = Clients can and will implement, but we also want the limitations of the = Printer to be clearly articulated so that the Client implementation can = help the User make informed choices, either automatically or manually. > >> > >> I think the most useful information for the Client is to know the = maximum number of sheets a finisher can handle for typical media, with = specific constraints for media as needed. That handles the 99% use = cases without requiring a significant amount of intelligence in the = Client along with major changes in how Printers track and report = finisher capacity. > >> > > >=20 > _________________________________________________________ > Michael Sweet, Senior Printing System Engineer >=20 > _______________________________________________ > ipp mailing list > ipp@pwg.org > https://www.pwg.org/mailman/listinfo/ipp = >=20 --Apple-Mail=_AEC5F51D-AE8E-4D18-BA9C-D05DB9A4F12F Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Type: text/html; charset=us-ascii I also like Mike's proposal for naming. I will add = "media-sheets-supported(rangeOfInteger(0:MAX))" as a member attribute of = "finishings-col" and remove "maxsetsheets" from "printer-description" in = my next revision, which I hope to have out early this coming week.

Smith



On Oct 15, 2016, at 9:57 AM, Ira McDonald <blueroofmusic@gmail.com> wrote:

Hi,

+1 to Mike's = comments.

And I like the symmetry of = "media-sheets-supported" for
"finishings-col" with = "job-media-sheets-supported" for
Printer.

Cheers,
- Ira


Ira McDonald (Musician / Software = Architect)
Co-Chair - TCG Trusted Mobility Solutions WG
Chair - Linux Foundation Open Printing WG
Secretary - IEEE-ISTO Printer Working Group
Co-Chair - IEEE-ISTO PWG Internet Printing Protocol WG
IETF Designated Expert - IPP & Printer MIB
Blue Roof Music / High North Inc
http://sites.google.com/site/blueroofmusic
http://sites.google.com/site/highnorthinc
mailto: blueroofmusic@gmail.com
Jan-April: 579 Park Place  Saline, MI  48176  = 734-944-0094
May-Dec: PO Box 221  Grand Marais, MI = 49839  906-494-2434


On Sat, Oct 15, 2016 at 11:22 = AM, Michael Sweet <msweet@apple.com> wrote:
Smith,

> On Oct 14, 2016, at 5:06 PM, Kennedy, Smith (Wireless Architect) = <smith.kennedy@hp.com> wrote:
>>> ...
>>> 2. Eliminate "maxsetsheets" and implement = "baling-max-sheets", "folding-max-sheets", etc.
>>
>> I don't like this as much because it conjoins an abstract = finishing process to a physical finisher subunit limit. Since = printer-finisher is where we are exposing the finisher subunits, that is = where the limit should be reported.
>
> I'm not quite sure I agree. Yes, we are describing a physical = finisher subunit limit. But different limits may pertain to different = abstract finishing process.

Perhaps - I guess the question is whether this is a practical = issue that has affected users?  For example, the booklet finishers = I've used could fold a partial set and "stack" the folded output such = that it didn't matter that the folding mechanism could only handle (for = example) 10 sheets at a time.  The only time it became an issue was = when you wanted to staple (saddle stitch in the case of booklet = printing) since the staple had to be done before the fold.

> Let's discuss user experience / expectations:
>
> Jane has a 5 page document that she would like to print and be = folded. She chooses folding, and chooses "fold-half". The printer has = expressed that it has a maximum number of 5 sheets for 'fold-half', 3 = for 'fold-letter', and 2 for 'fold-accordion'. If she chooses = 'fold-letter', what would Jane expect to happen?
>
> A. Warning that there are too many pages for 'fold-letter' and = offer to do a 'fold-half'
> B. Allow Jane to submit the Job and have the Printer present an = error
> C. Allow Jane to submit the Job and have the Printer simply not = fold the pages
>
> I think B and C are less than optimal. With A, if we use = "printer-finisher" and 'maxsetsheets' keyword, then there is only one = 'maxsetsheets' value possible for the finisher device. Do we set that to = 2 to be on the safe side to be sure to avoid B or C? Or do we express = the limit on the number of sheets based on the abstract finishing type, = using the "Option 2" like above?**

I agree that A is the best outcome, with B or C being the = fallback for Clients that don't consult the member attribute in = "finishings-col-{database,ready}".

> We could get into some awkward weirdness where we have multiple = "virtual finisher devices" each of which can only do one of the = finishing operations. But that would be less than optimal.
>
>
> ** (We could probably simplify #2 by adding a new "max-sheets" = member to "finishings-col" that would only be allowed when it is in = "finishings-col-database" and "finishings-col-ready", rather than = creating "folding-max-sheets", etc.)

I like this idea better rather than separate sub-member = attributes in each finishing process collection.

As for naming, how about "media-sheets-supported = (rangeOfInteger(0:MAX))" to mirror the "job-media-sheets-supported" = Printer Description attribute?

>
>
> Smith
>
>> On Oct 14, 2016, at 1:51 PM, Michael Sweet <msweet@apple.com> = wrote:
>>
>>> So we have 3 alternatives:
>>>
>>> 1. Keep the new "printer-finisher" keyword = "maxsetsheets"
>>
>> That would be consistent with the Finisher MIB.
>
>
>>
>>> 2. Eliminate "maxsetsheets" and implement = "baling-max-sheets", "folding-max-sheets", etc.
>>
>> I don't like this as much because it conjoins an abstract = finishing process to a physical finisher subunit limit. Since = printer-finisher is where we are exposing the finisher subunits, that is = where the limit should be reported.
>>
>>> 3. Eliminate "maxsetsheets" and implement = "baling-max-thickness", "folding-max-thickness", etc.
>>
>> That way lies madness.  Most printers don't implement = media-thickness support, even LFPs that would have a genuine need for = it.  And what Client is going to pre-process the document and job = ticket to determine the final set thickness for finishing? And what = printer provides this information via other protocols (SNMP, etc.)?
>>
>>> 4. Encourage vendors to use constraints between media type = and finishing type to limit the range of thicknesses and ignore the = thickness issue
>>
>> I think if a vendor knows that certain media types can't be = used with a finisher, then those should be exposed as constraints.  = But otherwise I think we just rely on the "best effort" principle.
>>
>>> Which way(s) should we go with this? We want something that = Clients can and will implement, but we also want the limitations of the = Printer to be clearly articulated so that the Client implementation can = help the User make informed choices, either automatically or = manually.
>>
>> I think the most useful information for the Client is to know = the maximum number of sheets a finisher can handle for typical media, = with specific constraints for media as needed.  That handles the = 99% use cases without requiring a significant amount of intelligence in = the Client along with major changes in how Printers track and report = finisher capacity.
>>
>

_________________________________________________________
Michael Sweet, Senior Printing System Engineer

_______________________________________________
ipp mailing list
ipp@pwg.org
https://www.pwg.org/mailman/listinfo/ipp


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DF4PR84MB0284.NAMPRD84.PROD.OUTLOOK.COM (10.162.193.22) by DF4PR84MB0284.NAMPRD84.PROD.OUTLOOK.COM (10.162.193.22) with Microsoft SMTP Server (version=TLS1_2, cipher=TLS_ECDHE_RSA_WITH_AES_256_CBC_SHA384_P384) id 15.1.659.11; Mon, 17 Oct 2016 19:56:59 +0000 Received: from DF4PR84MB0284.NAMPRD84.PROD.OUTLOOK.COM ([10.162.193.22]) by DF4PR84MB0284.NAMPRD84.PROD.OUTLOOK.COM ([10.162.193.22]) with mapi id 15.01.0659.025; Mon, 17 Oct 2016 19:56:58 +0000 From: "Kennedy, Smith (Wireless Architect)" To: PWG IPP WG Reflector Thread-Topic: Finishings 2.1 : mapping "finSupplyDescription" into IPP? Alternatives to consider Thread-Index: AQHSKLCedP6CI9tkc0+iMY4+q8vTYw== Date: Mon, 17 Oct 2016 19:56:58 +0000 Message-ID: Accept-Language: en-US Content-Language: en-US X-MS-Has-Attach: yes X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: authentication-results: spf=none (sender IP is ) smtp.mailfrom=smith.kennedy@hp.com; x-ms-exchange-messagesentrepresentingtype: 1 x-originating-ip: [15.65.252.11] x-ms-office365-filtering-correlation-id: ab1d407b-08f8-486f-e715-08d3f6c7c135 x-microsoft-exchange-diagnostics: 1; DF4PR84MB0284; 6:mhnHXmKaZ1cHDIYQ1vQpcJi53isLFNFVmfN1qLm5gsNhwuYGsmh55N0oPm2cQ3JE8hBdeQH4C8sYI0hKx9xMvwnCr0puKeNpRRiMH5JCjsSsIVjlRvSkscqG2lr8a7e2iLOlXUzWRSMvp5hD75chMOUTNXIpLav88WoIdnuKhOB2n5DzXT6myJ+xPxDUqKeHAm53Lsz/n2srZI50QdCsnKBQG5Qtx3+c+9e+jEO5kTExuH9dVOFzm98IWUoBzPmc5p0ooetHmlXHkXDc2pJYCEt5upYa+2a8wvVR+sz9O6FulTuq6b5lh5F/PdzOPnzN; 5:AeSqv3dwu+/mz9iG1eKunBGolCa30RyJoGdZY81gjFiynK0xZpwLeWeqhhZzcx4++lvXKNhL/neCDjN3Q3u9kFkSWXS8RnUYOzoqcheCrsKiP3kfSXJZIMbU2DCilTiEhUGoMGDcBOpAdGJdLn2Q8Q==; 24:oYRQlR87q20Of/Gssvgzf7ym5HxkOkTqe8LClstgSSvR+zm2bePvVcYlAaehq22zHVgjQw5z3SbSXSItMS6WQEuCKhWLZuXuC6kwgmidPhE=; 7:4rJVBgbGyEIB2/Z7WKdcvqzZTlXXQxHy28HAaUoSt3lPmEhaT8342jSOa09yLGB6LL8WIOT8X/AtXDSbCtHvPbC/2XJUFu0uPLu9ksMZY2lOSfksjpliVDmqV4fWEeFsh37bk0Auvc8DtzsZyjxZZupKtP71nLd7AGlpCW4qgmA0FgoMAm0ZR6HpB6tSfHSwrCud9HtExaoNv7GlXftNKPmNB+Fbm43mjeCq/8ZQNKWu13v/jxXuix9DF56SPpLtGMRxB2jskaiY9Wi5SonHySfh3TKj/suaZ86380SdLDCtqQimVOsMw721oSmJf2aBBg5OVI/DeGX74KUa4W4lnvrOZlDfeJQECx22ErewJ7Q= x-microsoft-antispam: UriScan:;BCL:0;PCL:0;RULEID:;SRVR:DF4PR84MB0284; x-microsoft-antispam-prvs: x-exchange-antispam-report-test: UriScan:; x-exchange-antispam-report-cfa-test: BCL:0; PCL:0; RULEID:(102415321)(6040176)(601004)(2401047)(8121501046)(5005006)(3002001)(10201501046); SRVR:DF4PR84MB0284; BCL:0; PCL:0; RULEID:; SRVR:DF4PR84MB0284; x-forefront-prvs: 0098BA6C6C x-forefront-antispam-report: SFV:NSPM; SFS:(10019020)(6009001)(7916002)(189002)(199003)(6602003)(2906002)(36756003)(6116002)(6916009)(66066001)(81166006)(33656002)(81156014)(3660700001)(8676002)(87936001)(7846002)(10400500002)(97736004)(189998001)(5002640100001)(7736002)(305945005)(107886002)(86362001)(3280700002)(8936002)(229853001)(106116001)(82746002)(99286002)(101416001)(83716003)(122556002)(106356001)(450100001)(92566002)(110136003)(77096005)(54356999)(586003)(99936001)(2900100001)(5660300001)(105586002)(3846002)(102836003)(68736007)(50986999)(104396002); DIR:OUT; SFP:1102; SCL:1; SRVR:DF4PR84MB0284; H:DF4PR84MB0284.NAMPRD84.PROD.OUTLOOK.COM; FPR:; SPF:None; PTR:InfoNoRecords; MX:1; A:1; LANG:en; received-spf: None (protection.outlook.com: hp.com does not designate permitted sender hosts) spamdiagnosticoutput: 1:99 spamdiagnosticmetadata: NSPM MIME-Version: 1.0 X-OriginatorOrg: hp.com X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-originalarrivaltime: 17 Oct 2016 19:56:58.7278 (UTC) X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-fromentityheader: Hosted X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-id: ca7981a2-785a-463d-b82a-3db87dfc3ce6 X-MS-Exchange-Transport-CrossTenantHeadersStamped: DF4PR84MB0284 Subject: [IPP] Finishings 2.1 : mapping "finSupplyDescription" into IPP? Alternatives to consider X-BeenThere: ipp@pwg.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15 Precedence: list List-Id: Internet Printing Protocol Workgroup discussion list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="===============7644132091176183880==" Errors-To: ipp-bounces@pwg.org Sender: "ipp" --===============7644132091176183880== Content-Language: en-US Content-Type: multipart/signed; boundary="Apple-Mail=_2854ADD7-1614-4582-BC96-C5A788EEEB1F"; protocol="application/pkcs7-signature"; micalg=sha1 --Apple-Mail=_2854ADD7-1614-4582-BC96-C5A788EEEB1F Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Hi there, As you may have noticed in the most recent draft of Finishing 2.1, Ira = and I added a new "printer-finisher-supplies" attribute to convey = information about finisher supplies, which was absent before. It is = structurally similar to "printer-finisher" but contains mappings from = "finSupplyTable" / "finSupplyEntry" rather than "finDeviceTable" / = "finDeviceEntry".=20 But one of the fields that we added in that first draft was a field for = "finSupplyDescription". This is inconsistent with how we support = "finDeviceDescription" in 5100.1 - that OID from RFC 3806 is conveyed in = IPP via a separate IPP attribute "printer-finisher-description 1setOf = text(MAX))". The difference seems to be that the key/value pairs in = "printer-finisher" are non-localized, whereas "finDeviceDescription" is = a localized string, so "printer-finisher-description" contains localized = strings. But this strikes me as odd - we have = "printer-strings-supported" now, which could contain localized strings = that don't have to be conveyed via IPP attribute values directly. So, how to support "finSupplyDescription"? There are 3 different ways I = can imagine: 1. Keep the mapping of "finSupplyDescription" in = "printer-finisher-supplies", and embed a localized string within the = value of "printer-finisher-supplies"? 2. Keep the mapping of "finSupplyDescription" in = "printer-finisher-supplies", but have the value be a key into a string = in the string catalog pointed to by "printer-strings-uri"? 3. Remove the mapping of "finSupplyDescription" from = "printer-finisher-supplies" and instead be consistent with = "printer-finisher" / "printer-finisher-description" by creating a new = "printer-finisher-supplies-description" attribute that is syntactically = nearly identical to "printer-finisher-description". In this next draft I will do #3 because I can copy / paste quite easily. = But I'm not confident that is the right choice. Thoughts? Smith /** Smith Kennedy Wireless Architect - Client Software - IPG-PPS Standards - IEEE ISTO PWG / Bluetooth SIG / Wi-Fi Alliance / NFC = Forum / USB IF Chair, IEEE ISTO Printer Working Group HP Inc. */ --Apple-Mail=_2854ADD7-1614-4582-BC96-C5A788EEEB1F Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="smime.p7s" Content-Type: application/pkcs7-signature; name="smime.p7s" Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64 MIAGCSqGSIb3DQEHAqCAMIACAQExCzAJBgUrDgMCGgUAMIAGCSqGSIb3DQEHAQAAoIIOQDCCBmEw ggVJoAMCAQICEDtXE7awITX7XkZ1ymyyxOEwDQYJKoZIhvcNAQEFBQAwgcoxCzAJBgNVBAYTAlVT MRcwFQYDVQQKEw5WZXJpU2lnbiwgSW5jLjEfMB0GA1UECxMWVmVyaVNpZ24gVHJ1c3QgTmV0d29y azE6MDgGA1UECxMxKGMpIDE5OTkgVmVyaVNpZ24sIEluYy4gLSBGb3IgYXV0aG9yaXplZCB1c2Ug b25seTFFMEMGA1UEAxM8VmVyaVNpZ24gQ2xhc3MgMiBQdWJsaWMgUHJpbWFyeSBDZXJ0aWZpY2F0 aW9uIEF1dGhvcml0eSAtIEczMB4XDTA5MDkwMjAwMDAwMFoXDTE5MDkwMTIzNTk1OVowgfcxCzAJ BgNVBAYTAlVTMSAwHgYDVQQKExdIZXdsZXR0LVBhY2thcmQgQ29tcGFueTEfMB0GA1UECxMWVmVy 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From: Ira McDonald Date: Mon, 17 Oct 2016 18:05:25 -0400 Message-ID: To: "Kennedy, Smith (Wireless Architect)" , Ira McDonald Cc: PWG IPP WG Reflector Subject: Re: [IPP] Finishings 2.1 : mapping "finSupplyDescription" into IPP? Alternatives to consider X-BeenThere: ipp@pwg.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15 Precedence: list List-Id: Internet Printing Protocol Workgroup discussion list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="===============7263200212741064224==" Errors-To: ipp-bounces@pwg.org Sender: "ipp" --===============7263200212741064224== Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary=001a1140f2761c5387053f16c759 --001a1140f2761c5387053f16c759 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 Hi Smith, This is NOT a choice. If you want the localized description, then it MUST be in a separate IPP attribute (like existing mappings for Alert, Input, Output, etc. from Printer/Finisher MIB). This is not just a style issue. This is a strict IPP requirement that a given attribute is either completely a localized IPP datatype (text) or is not localized (octetString). Prior art in MIB to IPP mapping had a good reason. Cheers, - Ira Ira McDonald (Musician / Software Architect) Co-Chair - TCG Trusted Mobility Solutions WG Chair - Linux Foundation Open Printing WG Secretary - IEEE-ISTO Printer Working Group Co-Chair - IEEE-ISTO PWG Internet Printing Protocol WG IETF Designated Expert - IPP & Printer MIB Blue Roof Music / High North Inc http://sites.google.com/site/blueroofmusic http://sites.google.com/site/highnorthinc mailto: blueroofmusic@gmail.com Jan-April: 579 Park Place Saline, MI 48176 734-944-0094 May-Dec: PO Box 221 Grand Marais, MI 49839 906-494-2434 On Mon, Oct 17, 2016 at 3:56 PM, Kennedy, Smith (Wireless Architect) < smith.kennedy@hp.com> wrote: > Hi there, > > As you may have noticed in the most recent draft of Finishing 2.1, Ira and > I added a new "printer-finisher-supplies" attribute to convey information > about finisher supplies, which was absent before. It is structurally > similar to "printer-finisher" but contains mappings from "finSupplyTable" / > "finSupplyEntry" rather than "finDeviceTable" / "finDeviceEntry". > > But one of the fields that we added in that first draft was a field for > "finSupplyDescription". This is inconsistent with how we support > "finDeviceDescription" in 5100.1 - that OID from RFC 3806 is conveyed in > IPP via a separate IPP attribute "printer-finisher-description 1setOf > text(MAX))". The difference seems to be that the key/value pairs in > "printer-finisher" are non-localized, whereas "finDeviceDescription" is a > localized string, so "printer-finisher-description" contains localized > strings. But this strikes me as odd - we have "printer-strings-supported" > now, which could contain localized strings that don't have to be conveyed > via IPP attribute values directly. > > So, how to support "finSupplyDescription"? There are 3 different ways I > can imagine: > > 1. Keep the mapping of "finSupplyDescription" in > "printer-finisher-supplies", and embed a localized string within the value > of "printer-finisher-supplies"? > > 2. Keep the mapping of "finSupplyDescription" in > "printer-finisher-supplies", but have the value be a key into a string in > the string catalog pointed to by "printer-strings-uri"? > > 3. Remove the mapping of "finSupplyDescription" from > "printer-finisher-supplies" and instead be consistent with > "printer-finisher" / "printer-finisher-description" by creating a new > "printer-finisher-supplies-description" attribute that is syntactically > nearly identical to "printer-finisher-description". > > In this next draft I will do #3 because I can copy / paste quite easily. > But I'm not confident that is the right choice. > > Thoughts? > > Smith > > /** > Smith Kennedy > Wireless Architect - Client Software - IPG-PPS > Standards - IEEE ISTO PWG / Bluetooth SIG / Wi-Fi Alliance / NFC Forum > / USB IF > Chair, IEEE ISTO Printer Working Group > HP Inc. > */ > > > > > _______________________________________________ > ipp mailing list > ipp@pwg.org > https://www.pwg.org/mailman/listinfo/ipp > > --001a1140f2761c5387053f16c759 Content-Type: text/html; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Hi Smith,


This is NOT a choice.= =C2=A0 If you want the localized description, then
it MUST be= in a separate IPP attribute (like existing mappings
for Aler= t, Input, Output, etc. from Printer/Finisher MIB).

This i= s not just a style issue.=C2=A0 This is a strict IPP requirement that
a given attribute is either completely a localized IPP datatype (t= ext)
or is not localized (octetString).

Prior art in = MIB to IPP mapping had a good reason.

Cheers,
- Ira


Ira McDonald (Musician / Software Architec= t)
Co-Chair - TCG Trusted Mobility Solutions WG
Chair - Linux Foundat= ion Open Printing WG
Secretary - IEEE-ISTO Printer Working Group
Co-C= hair - IEEE-ISTO PWG Internet Printing Protocol WG
IETF Designated Exper= t - IPP & Printer MIB
Blue Roof Music / High North Inc
http://sites.google.com/site/blueroofmusic
http://sites.google.com/site/highnorthinc
ma= ilto: blueroof= music@gmail.com
Jan-April: 579 Park Place=C2=A0 Saline, MI=C2=A0 481= 76=C2=A0 734-944-0094
May-Dec: PO Box 221=C2=A0 Grand Marais, MI 49839= =C2=A0 906-494-2434


On Mon, Oct 17, 2016 at 3:56 PM, Kennedy, Sm= ith (Wireless Architect) <smith.kennedy@hp.com> wrote:
Hi there,

As you may have noticed in the most recent draft of Finishing 2.1, Ira and = I added a new "printer-finisher-supplies" attribute to convey inf= ormation about finisher supplies, which was absent before. It is structural= ly similar to "printer-finisher" but contains mappings from "= ;finSupplyTable" / "finSupplyEntry" rather than "finDev= iceTable" / "finDeviceEntry".

But one of the fields that we added in that first draft was a field for &qu= ot;finSupplyDescription". This is inconsistent with how we support &qu= ot;finDeviceDescription" in 5100.1 - that OID from RFC 3806 is conveye= d in IPP via=C2=A0 a separate IPP attribute "printer-finisher-descript= ion 1setOf text(MAX))". The difference seems to be that the key/value = pairs in "printer-finisher" are non-localized, whereas "finD= eviceDescription" is a localized string, so "printer-finisher-des= cription" contains localized strings. But this strikes me as odd - we = have "printer-strings-supported" now, which could contain localiz= ed strings that don't have to be conveyed via IPP attribute values dire= ctly.

So, how to support "finSupplyDescription"? There are 3 different = ways I can imagine:

1. Keep the mapping of "finSupplyDescription" in "printer-fi= nisher-supplies", and embed a localized string within the value of &qu= ot;printer-finisher-supplies"?

2. Keep the mapping of "finSupplyDescription" in "printer-fi= nisher-supplies", but have the value be a key into a string in the str= ing catalog pointed to by "printer-strings-uri"?

3. Remove the mapping of "finSupplyDescription" from "printe= r-finisher-supplies" and instead be consistent with "printer-fini= sher" / "printer-finisher-description" by creating a new &qu= ot;printer-finisher-supplies-description" attribute that is synta= ctically nearly identical to "printer-finisher-description".=

In this next draft I will do #3 because I can copy / paste quite easily. Bu= t I'm not confident that is the right choice.

Thoughts?

Smith

/**
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 Smith Kennedy
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 Wireless Architect - Client Software - IPG-PPS
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 Standards - IEEE ISTO PWG / Bluetooth SIG / Wi-Fi Alliance / = NFC Forum / USB IF
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 Chair, IEEE ISTO Printer Working Group
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 HP Inc.
*/




_______________________________________________
ipp mailing list
ipp@pwg.org
https://www.pwg.org/mailman/listinfo/ipp


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Alternatives to consider Thread-Index: AQHSKLCegnGQYoZnjkaiJF1vw/VPYqCtM76AgAABgoA= Date: Mon, 17 Oct 2016 22:10:50 +0000 Message-ID: References: In-Reply-To: Accept-Language: en-US Content-Language: en-US X-MS-Has-Attach: yes X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: authentication-results: spf=none (sender IP is ) smtp.mailfrom=smith.kennedy@hp.com; x-ms-exchange-messagesentrepresentingtype: 1 x-originating-ip: [107.77.228.191] x-ms-office365-filtering-correlation-id: 288c4f25-2920-4b68-6dae-08d3f6da74a1 x-microsoft-exchange-diagnostics: 1; DF4PR84MB0281; 6:IEk2+wbDZHk+pjSsmFdSDp/18ykyVb7y9q3jbv0B06+mcjmg3ujyU0m0NWIISnx4wyXz5vxZ8bFAJ96iToCuaDGQi5vAh+smHv58yTxbG1TBDOhAnzoOFSmrhNVHKzuT1pReSL6YmjEp4YIj1MJ7QRTPCuqeDlmUu2Z4pT8EY3+G5UM/TaSONFdT2i6MNT/C5xFIccRGSmNiko5wrM0OdU28JIdxNxexEBh49BSG6B7Qy+YD5x/nQICN273itUL7sTyyLUuuWkO2SSnc2i7ociCckjJlP5JXR5WnNXCXtGQ1g0FhebFDojeZNeO9sf/4; 5:KAmkuysn6ncHUXlRpwM8r5Xnv9cwg5OExbAT/UbRH5gtYvBabhqmBzst69xJxSfpMakeDKnJrv9WtZOYty7QZgTNORLUOHy1vlLNI9fCTlu4Sg/CBX6g8akmIG3Ylo0J1YgxHyIie6O2imztWZSit1coDyFXdNOfurm+pN5/Wpc=; 24:eAGnFcdVaQ3znK9xzb36sDTP14Une1t/KdXu8ek/Wmhq4JDVNPMi2AEWMIA2+9kPDskBA1bQkxW6/HJiXqoqSNUnvdsSrxddCNdwoTyZQGo=; 7:YdXoJaDk/hM8rsCwTpe32TsZdYANPEllqXvl4INndWksGs5+EfA2/b09B3S77xr1FCdQ5UPZTMdAXQnGEHULmcJpzm4tuQOzfb1eL+ALXgmthduoXs5uX86+0GnFLZpcZniuZ0z2jqMUR4ZAtgFn2BfWFICct/hggJBe3UROmEvQv4XxDI2553pOOm7apA/5DlUXEw/Q389NlqP5jdxp3G0T/yRvotXv31y+fpvySCrgjRA9L+eObJA0l1ZWE/EDEY+uQ2j0b7VYrxVbFt0JLj8a8qohxMf1rtDlBJ1P/1UBiTD+OLDBEhL2XTeN75ePHbu9iGQ73j67mbRdMOKwH1CSXYCgzYbR/XR8CuRD33c= x-microsoft-antispam: UriScan:;BCL:0;PCL:0;RULEID:;SRVR:DF4PR84MB0281; x-microsoft-antispam-prvs: x-exchange-antispam-report-test: UriScan:(111039206520245)(211936372134217)(73583498263828); x-exchange-antispam-report-cfa-test: BCL:0; PCL:0; RULEID:(102415321)(6040176)(601004)(2401047)(5005006)(8121501046)(10201501046)(3002001); SRVR:DF4PR84MB0281; BCL:0; PCL:0; RULEID:; SRVR:DF4PR84MB0281; x-forefront-prvs: 0098BA6C6C x-forefront-antispam-report: SFV:NSPM; SFS:(10019020)(7916002)(199003)(6602003)(189002)(377454003)(24454002)(7906003)(10400500002)(36756003)(99286002)(6116002)(3846002)(102836003)(33656002)(7846002)(81156014)(7736002)(81166006)(8676002)(19273905006)(106356001)(66066001)(3660700001)(82746002)(83716003)(87936001)(8936002)(97736004)(3280700002)(586003)(77096005)(92566002)(2900100001)(1411001)(110136003)(50986999)(2950100002)(6916009)(54356999)(122556002)(19617315012)(5002640100001)(68736007)(105586002)(106116001)(76176999)(19580405001)(2906002)(5660300001)(4326007)(16236675004)(15975445007)(86362001)(99936001)(189998001)(101416001)(19580395003)(16351025005)(104396002)(563064011); DIR:OUT; SFP:1102; SCL:1; SRVR:DF4PR84MB0281; H:DF4PR84MB0284.NAMPRD84.PROD.OUTLOOK.COM; FPR:; SPF:None; PTR:InfoNoRecords; A:1; MX:1; LANG:en; received-spf: None (protection.outlook.com: hp.com does not designate permitted sender hosts) spamdiagnosticoutput: 1:99 spamdiagnosticmetadata: NSPM MIME-Version: 1.0 X-OriginatorOrg: hp.com X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-originalarrivaltime: 17 Oct 2016 22:10:50.7439 (UTC) X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-fromentityheader: Hosted X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-id: ca7981a2-785a-463d-b82a-3db87dfc3ce6 X-MS-Exchange-Transport-CrossTenantHeadersStamped: DF4PR84MB0281 Cc: PWG IPP WG Reflector Subject: Re: [IPP] Finishings 2.1 : mapping "finSupplyDescription" into IPP? Alternatives to consider X-BeenThere: ipp@pwg.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15 Precedence: list List-Id: Internet Printing Protocol Workgroup discussion list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="===============7532795957519978788==" Errors-To: ipp-bounces@pwg.org Sender: "ipp" --===============7532795957519978788== Content-Language: en-US Content-Type: multipart/signed; boundary="Apple-Mail=_4665A219-A81E-4CED-BA3B-3BFE5CD92CD4"; protocol="application/pkcs7-signature"; micalg=sha1 --Apple-Mail=_4665A219-A81E-4CED-BA3B-3BFE5CD92CD4 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="Apple-Mail=_FB4F73DA-DD24-4E5E-9F3E-CA93B1280D4C" --Apple-Mail=_FB4F73DA-DD24-4E5E-9F3E-CA93B1280D4C Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Thanks Ira!=20 I'll also add that to my list of stuff to be covered in the "PWG & IPP = Design Principles and Ethos" whitepaper (whenever we get to that...). Smith > On Oct 17, 2016, at 4:05 PM, Ira McDonald = wrote: >=20 > Hi Smith, >=20 >=20 > This is NOT a choice. If you want the localized description, then > it MUST be in a separate IPP attribute (like existing mappings > for Alert, Input, Output, etc. from Printer/Finisher MIB). >=20 > This is not just a style issue. This is a strict IPP requirement that > a given attribute is either completely a localized IPP datatype (text)=20= > or is not localized (octetString). >=20 > Prior art in MIB to IPP mapping had a good reason. >=20 > Cheers, > - Ira >=20 >=20 > Ira McDonald (Musician / Software Architect) > Co-Chair - TCG Trusted Mobility Solutions WG > Chair - Linux Foundation Open Printing WG > Secretary - IEEE-ISTO Printer Working Group > Co-Chair - IEEE-ISTO PWG Internet Printing Protocol WG > IETF Designated Expert - IPP & Printer MIB > Blue Roof Music / High North Inc > http://sites.google.com/site/blueroofmusic = > http://sites.google.com/site/highnorthinc = > mailto: blueroofmusic@gmail.com > Jan-April: 579 Park Place Saline, MI 48176 734-944-0094 > May-Dec: PO Box 221 Grand Marais, MI 49839 906-494-2434 >=20 >=20 > On Mon, Oct 17, 2016 at 3:56 PM, Kennedy, Smith (Wireless Architect) = > wrote: > Hi there, >=20 > As you may have noticed in the most recent draft of Finishing 2.1, Ira = and I added a new "printer-finisher-supplies" attribute to convey = information about finisher supplies, which was absent before. It is = structurally similar to "printer-finisher" but contains mappings from = "finSupplyTable" / "finSupplyEntry" rather than "finDeviceTable" / = "finDeviceEntry". >=20 > But one of the fields that we added in that first draft was a field = for "finSupplyDescription". This is inconsistent with how we support = "finDeviceDescription" in 5100.1 - that OID from RFC 3806 is conveyed in = IPP via a separate IPP attribute "printer-finisher-description 1setOf = text(MAX))". The difference seems to be that the key/value pairs in = "printer-finisher" are non-localized, whereas "finDeviceDescription" is = a localized string, so "printer-finisher-description" contains localized = strings. But this strikes me as odd - we have = "printer-strings-supported" now, which could contain localized strings = that don't have to be conveyed via IPP attribute values directly. >=20 > So, how to support "finSupplyDescription"? There are 3 different ways = I can imagine: >=20 > 1. Keep the mapping of "finSupplyDescription" in = "printer-finisher-supplies", and embed a localized string within the = value of "printer-finisher-supplies"? >=20 > 2. Keep the mapping of "finSupplyDescription" in = "printer-finisher-supplies", but have the value be a key into a string = in the string catalog pointed to by "printer-strings-uri"? >=20 > 3. Remove the mapping of "finSupplyDescription" from = "printer-finisher-supplies" and instead be consistent with = "printer-finisher" / "printer-finisher-description" by creating a new = "printer-finisher-supplies-description" attribute that is syntactically = nearly identical to "printer-finisher-description". >=20 > In this next draft I will do #3 because I can copy / paste quite = easily. But I'm not confident that is the right choice. >=20 > Thoughts? >=20 > Smith >=20 > /** > Smith Kennedy > Wireless Architect - Client Software - IPG-PPS > Standards - IEEE ISTO PWG / Bluetooth SIG / Wi-Fi Alliance / NFC = Forum / USB IF > Chair, IEEE ISTO Printer Working Group > HP Inc. > */ >=20 >=20 >=20 >=20 > _______________________________________________ > ipp mailing list > ipp@pwg.org > https://www.pwg.org/mailman/listinfo/ipp = >=20 >=20 --Apple-Mail=_FB4F73DA-DD24-4E5E-9F3E-CA93B1280D4C Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Type: text/html; charset=us-ascii Thanks Ira! 

I'll also add that to my list of stuff to be covered in the = "PWG & IPP Design Principles and Ethos" whitepaper (whenever we get = to that...).

Smith



On Oct 17, 2016, at 4:05 PM, Ira McDonald <blueroofmusic@gmail.com> wrote:

Hi Smith,


This is = NOT a choice.  If you want the localized description, then
it MUST be in a separate IPP attribute = (like existing mappings
for Alert, = Input, Output, etc. from Printer/Finisher MIB).

This is not just a style issue.  = This is a strict IPP requirement that
a given attribute is either completely a localized IPP = datatype (text)
or is not localized (octetString).

Prior art in MIB to IPP = mapping had a good reason.

Cheers,
- Ira


Ira McDonald (Musician / Software = Architect)
Co-Chair - TCG Trusted Mobility Solutions WG
Chair - Linux Foundation Open Printing WG
Secretary - IEEE-ISTO Printer Working Group
Co-Chair - IEEE-ISTO PWG Internet Printing Protocol WG
IETF Designated Expert - IPP & Printer MIB
Blue Roof Music / High North Inc
http://sites.google.com/site/blueroofmusic
http://sites.google.com/site/highnorthinc
mailto: blueroofmusic@gmail.com
Jan-April: 579 Park Place  Saline, MI  48176  = 734-944-0094
May-Dec: PO Box 221  Grand Marais, MI = 49839  906-494-2434


On Mon, Oct 17, 2016 at 3:56 = PM, Kennedy, Smith (Wireless Architect) <smith.kennedy@hp.com> wrote:
Hi there,
=
As you may have noticed in the most recent draft of Finishing 2.1, Ira = and I added a new "printer-finisher-supplies" attribute to convey = information about finisher supplies, which was absent before. It is = structurally similar to "printer-finisher" but contains mappings from = "finSupplyTable" / "finSupplyEntry" rather than "finDeviceTable" / = "finDeviceEntry".

But one of the fields that we added in that first draft was a field for = "finSupplyDescription". This is inconsistent with how we support = "finDeviceDescription" in 5100.1 - that OID from RFC 3806 is conveyed in = IPP via  a separate IPP attribute "printer-finisher-description = 1setOf text(MAX))". The difference seems to be that the key/value pairs = in "printer-finisher" are non-localized, whereas "finDeviceDescription" = is a localized string, so "printer-finisher-description" contains = localized strings. But this strikes me as odd - we have = "printer-strings-supported" now, which could contain localized strings = that don't have to be conveyed via IPP attribute values directly.

So, how to support "finSupplyDescription"? There are 3 different ways I = can imagine:

1. Keep the mapping of "finSupplyDescription" in = "printer-finisher-supplies", and embed a localized string within the = value of "printer-finisher-supplies"?

2. Keep the mapping of "finSupplyDescription" in = "printer-finisher-supplies", but have the value be a key into a string = in the string catalog pointed to by "printer-strings-uri"?

3. Remove the mapping of "finSupplyDescription" from = "printer-finisher-supplies" and instead be consistent with = "printer-finisher" / "printer-finisher-description" by creating a new = "printer-finisher-supplies-description" attribute that = is syntactically nearly identical to "printer-finisher-description".

In this next draft I will do #3 because I can copy / paste quite easily. = But I'm not confident that is the right choice.

Thoughts?

Smith

/**
    Smith Kennedy
    Wireless Architect - Client Software - IPG-PPS
    Standards - IEEE ISTO PWG / Bluetooth SIG / Wi-Fi Alliance = / NFC Forum / USB IF
    Chair, IEEE ISTO Printer Working Group
    HP Inc.
*/




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https://www.pwg.org/mailman/listinfo/ipp



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boundary=001a1145ecc6c65d71053f190e1c Subject: [IPP] Fwd: Live Webcast TODAY (17-18 October) NIST Lightweight Crypto Workshop X-BeenThere: ipp@pwg.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15 Precedence: list List-Id: Internet Printing Protocol Workgroup discussion list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: ipp-bounces@pwg.org Sender: "ipp" --001a1145ecc6c65d71053f190e1c Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary=001a1145ecc6c65d6c053f190e1a --001a1145ecc6c65d6c053f190e1a Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 Hi, For anyone with spare cycles tomorrow. Tuesday sessions run 9:00am to 4:15pm US EDT. See attached agenda. Monday sessions were very good (if you're interested in practical crypto and defenses against side-channel and physical attacks). Cheers, - Ira ---------- Forwarded message ---------- From: Ira McDonald Date: Mon, Oct 17, 2016 at 1:52 PM Subject: Live Webcast TODAY (17-18 October) NIST Lightweight Crypto Workshop To: MPWG , " tms_wg@trustedcomputinggroup.org" , "Anne Price, PR Works, Inc." , Ira McDonald < blueroofmusic@gmail.com> https://www.nist.gov/news-events/events/2016/10/lightweight-cryptography- workshop-2016 Main link doesn't work for me, but the alternative direct YouTube feed has excellent video and audio. Starting again momentarily. RECOMMENDED! Cheers, - Ira Ira McDonald (Musician / Software Architect) Co-Chair - TCG Trusted Mobility Solutions WG Chair - Linux Foundation Open Printing WG Secretary - IEEE-ISTO Printer Working Group Co-Chair - IEEE-ISTO PWG Internet Printing Protocol WG IETF Designated Expert - IPP & Printer MIB Blue Roof Music / High North Inc http://sites.google.com/site/blueroofmusic http://sites.google.com/site/highnorthinc mailto: blueroofmusic@gmail.com Jan-April: 579 Park Place Saline, MI 48176 734-944-0094 May-Dec: PO Box 221 Grand Marais, MI 49839 906-494-2434 --001a1145ecc6c65d6c053f190e1a Content-Type: text/html; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Hi,

For anyone with spare cycl= es tomorrow.=C2=A0

Tuesday sessions run 9:00am to 4:15pm US EDT.=C2= =A0 See attached agenda.

Monday sessions were very = good (if you're interested in practical crypto
and defenses ag= ainst side-channel and physical attacks).

<= div class=3D"gmail_signature" data-smartmail=3D"gmail_signature">
Cheers,
- Ira
=

---------- Forwarded message ----------
F= rom: Ira McDonald <<= a href=3D"mailto:blueroofmusic@gmail.com">blueroofmusic@gmail.com>
Date: Mon, Oct 17, 2016 at 1:52 PM
Subject: Live Webcast TODAY = (17-18 October) NIST Lightweight Crypto Workshop
To: MPWG <mobilewg@trustedcomputinggroup.= org>, "tms_= wg@trustedcomputinggroup.org" <tms_wg@trustedcomputinggroup.org>, "Anne Pr= ice, PR Works, Inc." <ann= e@prworksonline.com>, Ira McDonald <blueroofmusic@gmail.com>


<= div>
Main link doesn't work for me, but t= he alternative direct YouTube
feed has excellent video and audio.= =C2=A0 Starting again momentarily.

RECOMMENDED!
=
Cheers,
- Ira

<= div>
Ira McDonald (Musician / Software Architect)
Co-= Chair - TCG Trusted Mobility Solutions WG
Chair - Linux Foundation Open = Printing WG
Secretary - IEEE-ISTO Printer Working Group
Co-Chair - IE= EE-ISTO PWG Internet Printing Protocol WG
IETF Designated Expert - IPP &= amp; Printer MIB
Blue Roof Music / High North Inc
http://sites.google.com/site/blueroofmusic
http://sites.google.com/site/highnorthinc
m= ailto: blueroo= fmusic@gmail.com
Jan-April: 579 Park Place=C2=A0 Saline, MI=C2=A0 48= 176=C2=A0 734-944-0094
May-Dec: PO Box 221=C2=A0 Grand Marais, MI 49839= =C2=A0 906-494-2434

=

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lLaXxHhRr9+Ct5/owG5qMrtW5OkdcM9AlwpNfiabRdFzQbR1dYrmR8ycj1A5oOyw fYZe7Uoad0aiLTpx/EGr7g==; Received: from relay6.apple.com (relay6.apple.com [17.128.113.90]) by mail-in4.apple.com (Apple Secure Mail Relay) with SMTP id 76.99.07001.33D75085; Mon, 17 Oct 2016 18:38:59 -0700 (PDT) X-AuditID: 11973e12-23e0e9a000001b59-19-58057d330eb9 Received: from nwk-mmpp-sz13.apple.com (nwk-mmpp-sz13.apple.com [17.128.115.216]) by relay6.apple.com (Apple SCV relay) with SMTP id 14.D9.23613.23D75085; Mon, 17 Oct 2016 18:38:59 -0700 (PDT) MIME-version: 1.0 Received: from [17.153.62.241] by nwk-mmpp-sz13.apple.com (Oracle Communications Messaging Server 8.0.1.1.0 64bit (built Jun 15 2016)) with ESMTPSA id <0OF700L4CZ8XYHA0@nwk-mmpp-sz13.apple.com>; Mon, 17 Oct 2016 18:38:58 -0700 (PDT) From: Michael Sweet In-reply-to: Date: Mon, 17 Oct 2016 21:38:57 -0400 Message-id: <6B3B081D-4F3B-44BA-91EF-9E154183B61B@apple.com> References: To: Ira McDonald X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.3226) X-Brightmail-Tracker: H4sIAAAAAAAAA+NgFjrMLMWRmVeSWpSXmKPExsUi2FAYpWtcyxph8PAVt8XrV0vZLY7te8li 8aprF7MDs8fOWXfZPXZt28nkMW/xdKYA5igum5TUnMyy1CJ9uwSujKad/9gKTshVzDzxlq2B sUmyi5GTQ0LARKK16TFTFyMXh5DAXkaJX19bWWESK9btZIRIHGKU2HB6JxtIgldAUOLH5Hss XYwcHMwC8hIHz8uChJkFtCS+P2plgah/xyjR/20aE0hCWEBC4nj/QlYIO11i/8MXYHPYBNQk fk/qA4tzCgRLzPm4jh1kJouAqsT1jVYQM30kes6tYIJYayPxevYnqHsaGCVudr5mA6kXAVq8 5LkiiCkhICsx+5cXSImEwAE2iV9zvjJPYBSeheTqWQhXz0Jy9QJG5lWMQrmJmTm6mXkmeokF BTmpesn5uZsYQaE+3U5oB+OpVVaHGAU4GJV4eDdcYYkQYk0sK67MPcQozcGiJM67L4k1Qkgg PbEkNTs1tSC1KL6oNCe1+BAjEwenVAOjwR8Wg9jHNrzOXbomH3XOK6zsaOe2FrmjLBa9scnk pU3P0Qi5lQ+bT301/Tw7P/BHz/24irILqYvkXhtpLz5pb+csnM6lezVq6fv/xQ9VmE5NiHmx zys1QFnd75zTYe27q981iFZkGTLJRV1RTbn2THPNtXTj+cuunq9w1iq94Ou6/t2xjeuVWIoz Eg21mIuKEwFTJQMfVgIAAA== X-Brightmail-Tracker: H4sIAAAAAAAAA+NgFupikeLIzCtJLcpLzFFi42IRbCi+oWtcyxph0HqEyeL1q6XsFsf2vWSx eNW1i9mB2WPnrLvsHru27WTymLd4OlMAcxSXTUpqTmZZapG+XQJXRtPOf2wFJ+QqZp54y9bA 2CTZxcjJISFgIrFi3U5GCFtM4sK99WxdjFwcQgKHGCU2nN7JBpLgFRCU+DH5HksXIwcHs4C8 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Alternatives to consider X-BeenThere: ipp@pwg.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15 Precedence: list List-Id: Internet Printing Protocol Workgroup discussion list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: ipp-bounces@pwg.org Sender: "ipp" Smith, What Ira said... > On Oct 17, 2016, at 6:05 PM, Ira McDonald wrote: > > Hi Smith, > > > This is NOT a choice. If you want the localized description, then > it MUST be in a separate IPP attribute (like existing mappings > for Alert, Input, Output, etc. from Printer/Finisher MIB). > > This is not just a style issue. This is a strict IPP requirement that > a given attribute is either completely a localized IPP datatype (text) > or is not localized (octetString). > > Prior art in MIB to IPP mapping had a good reason. > > Cheers, > - Ira > > > Ira McDonald (Musician / Software Architect) > Co-Chair - TCG Trusted Mobility Solutions WG > Chair - Linux Foundation Open Printing WG > Secretary - IEEE-ISTO Printer Working Group > Co-Chair - IEEE-ISTO PWG Internet Printing Protocol WG > IETF Designated Expert - IPP & Printer MIB > Blue Roof Music / High North Inc > http://sites.google.com/site/blueroofmusic > http://sites.google.com/site/highnorthinc > mailto: blueroofmusic@gmail.com > Jan-April: 579 Park Place Saline, MI 48176 734-944-0094 > May-Dec: PO Box 221 Grand Marais, MI 49839 906-494-2434 > > > On Mon, Oct 17, 2016 at 3:56 PM, Kennedy, Smith (Wireless Architect) wrote: > Hi there, > > As you may have noticed in the most recent draft of Finishing 2.1, Ira and I added a new "printer-finisher-supplies" attribute to convey information about finisher supplies, which was absent before. It is structurally similar to "printer-finisher" but contains mappings from "finSupplyTable" / "finSupplyEntry" rather than "finDeviceTable" / "finDeviceEntry". > > But one of the fields that we added in that first draft was a field for "finSupplyDescription". This is inconsistent with how we support "finDeviceDescription" in 5100.1 - that OID from RFC 3806 is conveyed in IPP via a separate IPP attribute "printer-finisher-description 1setOf text(MAX))". The difference seems to be that the key/value pairs in "printer-finisher" are non-localized, whereas "finDeviceDescription" is a localized string, so "printer-finisher-description" contains localized strings. But this strikes me as odd - we have "printer-strings-supported" now, which could contain localized strings that don't have to be conveyed via IPP attribute values directly. > > So, how to support "finSupplyDescription"? There are 3 different ways I can imagine: > > 1. Keep the mapping of "finSupplyDescription" in "printer-finisher-supplies", and embed a localized string within the value of "printer-finisher-supplies"? > > 2. Keep the mapping of "finSupplyDescription" in "printer-finisher-supplies", but have the value be a key into a string in the string catalog pointed to by "printer-strings-uri"? > > 3. Remove the mapping of "finSupplyDescription" from "printer-finisher-supplies" and instead be consistent with "printer-finisher" / "printer-finisher-description" by creating a new "printer-finisher-supplies-description" attribute that is syntactically nearly identical to "printer-finisher-description". > > In this next draft I will do #3 because I can copy / paste quite easily. But I'm not confident that is the right choice. > > Thoughts? > > Smith > > /** > Smith Kennedy > Wireless Architect - Client Software - IPG-PPS > Standards - IEEE ISTO PWG / Bluetooth SIG / Wi-Fi Alliance / NFC Forum / USB IF > Chair, IEEE ISTO Printer Working Group > HP Inc. > */ > > > > > _______________________________________________ > ipp mailing list > ipp@pwg.org > https://www.pwg.org/mailman/listinfo/ipp > > > _______________________________________________ > ipp mailing list > ipp@pwg.org > https://www.pwg.org/mailman/listinfo/ipp _________________________________________________________ Michael Sweet, Senior Printing System Engineer _______________________________________________ ipp mailing list ipp@pwg.org https://www.pwg.org/mailman/listinfo/ipp From ipp-bounces@pwg.org Tue Oct 18 04:57:19 2016 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ietfarch-ipp-archive@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: ietfarch-ipp-archive@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7D221129610 for ; 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SPF:None; PTR:InfoNoRecords; A:1; MX:1; LANG:en; received-spf: None (protection.outlook.com: hp.com does not designate permitted sender hosts) spamdiagnosticoutput: 1:99 spamdiagnosticmetadata: NSPM MIME-Version: 1.0 X-OriginatorOrg: hp.com X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-originalarrivaltime: 18 Oct 2016 11:57:08.4468 (UTC) X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-fromentityheader: Hosted X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-id: ca7981a2-785a-463d-b82a-3db87dfc3ce6 X-MS-Exchange-Transport-CrossTenantHeadersStamped: DF4PR84MB0282 Subject: [IPP] New IPP Finishings 2.1 draft posted for review X-BeenThere: ipp@pwg.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15 Precedence: list List-Id: Internet Printing Protocol Workgroup discussion list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="===============3547630318337457355==" Errors-To: ipp-bounces@pwg.org Sender: "ipp" --===============3547630318337457355== Content-Language: en-US Content-Type: multipart/signed; boundary="Apple-Mail=_F5875C6D-7E6A-476D-9C12-7E5DBAC57FB3"; protocol="application/pkcs7-signature"; micalg=sha1 --Apple-Mail=_F5875C6D-7E6A-476D-9C12-7E5DBAC57FB3 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Greetings, I have posted an update to IPP Finishings 2.1 that includes all the = changes discussed to date: * Added a new "media-sheets-supported" member attribute to = "finishings-col" to specify the minimum and maximum number of sheets = supported by the finishing template described in the "finishings-col", = because this now allows it to be specified on a per- finishing-template = basis. * Updated definition of "printer-finisher-supplies" to have correct ABNF = and examples * Added a new "printer-finisher-supplies-description" attribute to = convey the localized string label for a "printer-finisher-supplies" = supply. * Add a non-normative reference to the PAPI specification. * Fixed the structure of several of the examples to use a PAPI syntactic = presentation, for consistency with other recent PWG specifications and = other examples within this specification * Added 'punch-multiple-top', 'punch-multiple-bottom', = 'punch-multiple-left', 'punch-multiple-right' to IANA registrations and = descriptions in section 5.1.4 The new draft is available here: http://ftp.pwg.org/pub/pwg/ipp/wd/wd-ippfinishings21-20161018.pdf http://ftp.pwg.org/pub/pwg/ipp/wd/wd-ippfinishings21-20161018.docx http://ftp.pwg.org/pub/pwg/ipp/wd/wd-ippfinishings21-20161018-rev.pdf = http://ftp.pwg.org/pub/pwg/ipp/wd/wd-ippfinishings21-20161018-rev.docx Please review at your soonest convenience so that we can establish a new = stable baseline and hopefully achieve Working Group Last Call (WGLC). Cheers, Smith /** Smith Kennedy Wireless Architect - Client Software - IPG-PPS Standards - IEEE ISTO PWG / Bluetooth SIG / Wi-Fi Alliance / NFC = Forum / USB IF Chair, IEEE ISTO Printer Working Group HP Inc. */ --Apple-Mail=_F5875C6D-7E6A-476D-9C12-7E5DBAC57FB3 Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="smime.p7s" Content-Type: application/pkcs7-signature; name="smime.p7s" Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64 MIAGCSqGSIb3DQEHAqCAMIACAQExCzAJBgUrDgMCGgUAMIAGCSqGSIb3DQEHAQAAoIIOQDCCBmEw ggVJoAMCAQICEDtXE7awITX7XkZ1ymyyxOEwDQYJKoZIhvcNAQEFBQAwgcoxCzAJBgNVBAYTAlVT MRcwFQYDVQQKEw5WZXJpU2lnbiwgSW5jLjEfMB0GA1UECxMWVmVyaVNpZ24gVHJ1c3QgTmV0d29y azE6MDgGA1UECxMxKGMpIDE5OTkgVmVyaVNpZ24sIEluYy4gLSBGb3IgYXV0aG9yaXplZCB1c2Ug b25seTFFMEMGA1UEAxM8VmVyaVNpZ24gQ2xhc3MgMiBQdWJsaWMgUHJpbWFyeSBDZXJ0aWZpY2F0 aW9uIEF1dGhvcml0eSAtIEczMB4XDTA5MDkwMjAwMDAwMFoXDTE5MDkwMTIzNTk1OVowgfcxCzAJ BgNVBAYTAlVTMSAwHgYDVQQKExdIZXdsZXR0LVBhY2thcmQgQ29tcGFueTEfMB0GA1UECxMWVmVy 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tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_ADSP_CUSTOM_MED=0.001, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, FREEMAIL_FORGED_FROMDOMAIN=0.001, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, HEADER_FROM_DIFFERENT_DOMAINS=0.001, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE=-0.0001, RP_MATCHES_RCVD=-0.431, SPF_PASS=-0.001, T_DKIM_INVALID=0.01] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=fail (2048-bit key) reason="fail (message has been altered)" header.d=gmail.com Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id qXkpI-rMaxsU for ; Tue, 18 Oct 2016 12:57:35 -0700 (PDT) Received: from www.pwg.org (www.pwg.org [50.116.7.199]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 18A44129490 for ; Tue, 18 Oct 2016 12:57:35 -0700 (PDT) Received: by www.pwg.org (Postfix, from userid 1002) id EDBB5440E; Tue, 18 Oct 2016 19:57:33 +0000 (UTC) Received: from www.pwg.org (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by www.pwg.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id EF9BC26B6; Tue, 18 Oct 2016 19:57:29 +0000 (UTC) X-Original-To: ipp@pwg.org Delivered-To: ipp@pwg.org Received: by www.pwg.org (Postfix, from userid 1002) id BDCBB26D1; Tue, 18 Oct 2016 19:57:28 +0000 (UTC) Received: from mail-io0-x229.google.com (mail-io0-x229.google.com [IPv6:2607:f8b0:4001:c06::229]) by www.pwg.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 42148268F for ; Tue, 18 Oct 2016 19:57:28 +0000 (UTC) Received: by mail-io0-x229.google.com with SMTP id r30so9710363ioi.1 for ; Tue, 18 Oct 2016 12:57:28 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20120113; h=mime-version:from:date:message-id:subject:to; bh=YQgemf8Roe6Y5cGXy5kgTiZLelj9hCREtvFts8KMadg=; b=t49JRgA7dVRLvHz0N3bCaUibYRb5MtQhhiiVVIlyIlXXu79idznk3ZulnqFLga8Awc J6EWKHAQJTPzjjUygrqEkdYuYPFNVFkr6rrlBs5Txeg0gDLWbUsWgYiDJu7CMtrRhpyg rtXwh0wZsWZEZHxhWa2PnzLKnQrcrd7kM0cUiMQOMbRSJCUvbeYWo7rY7+FuFGpreJS5 G341z5yOkYb3phts7cUZY/fwQgFYzAqpAqmpiKlZhVCYAY+FggB+5jaRmxcdzbYIGVjn 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-0400 Message-ID: To: "ipp@pwg.org" , Ira McDonald Subject: [IPP] Posted IPP System Service (18 October 2016) X-BeenThere: ipp@pwg.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15 Precedence: list List-Id: Internet Printing Protocol Workgroup discussion list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="===============7480997537172229895==" Errors-To: ipp-bounces@pwg.org Sender: "ipp" --===============7480997537172229895== Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary=001a1140ac6e1a2419053f291afd --001a1140ac6e1a2419053f291afd Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Hi, I have just posted another Interim draft of IPP System Service for review during the IPP WG call this week: http://ftp.pwg.org/pub/pwg/ipp/wd/wd-ippsystem10-20161018-rev.pdf - PDF with line numbers and redlines http://ftp.pwg.org/pub/pwg/ipp/wd/wd-ippsystem10-20161018-rev.docx - MS Word source with line numbers and redlines Summary: All pending edits from 5 October 2016 review. Cheers, - Ira ------------------------------- Change History: 18 October 2016 - Interim draft =E2=80=93 changes per IPP WG review on 5 October 2016 - global =E2=80=93 accepted all changes before section 6.1.6 Get-Printer-At= tributes (all reviewed by IPP WG) - revised section 5.6 Resource Description Attributes to replicate note taken from Create-Printer operation about how Printer-scope Resources are associated with Printers - revised section 6.1.5.1 Get-Printers Request to remove =E2=80=9Cprinter-u= ri=E2=80=9D (redundant with classic Get-Printer-Attributes) since this is a new request - revised section 6.1.5.1 Get-Printers Request to explicitly limit the values of =E2=80=9Crequested-attributes=E2=80=9D to those IPP Printer sourc= e attributes listed in the table in section 4 Definition of Attribute Types in the IETF LDAP Schema for Printer Services [RFC7612] (to limit new Get-Printers operation to first-order discovery of appropriate Printers) - revised section 16. Appendix A =E2=80=93 Rationale for Design Choices to = accept all changes (to reduce editor=E2=80=99s annoyance) --001a1140ac6e1a2419053f291afd Content-Type: text/html; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
=
Hi,

I hav= e just posted another Interim draft of IPP = System Service for
review during the IPP WG call this week:

=C2= =A0 http://ftp.pwg.org/pub/pwg/ipp/wd/wd-ippsystem10-2= 0161018-rev.pdf
=C2=A0 - PDF with line numbers and redlines
=C2=A0
=C2=A0 http://ftp.pwg.org/pub/pwg/ipp/wd/wd-ippsystem10-20161018-rev.d= ocx
=C2=A0 - MS Word source with line numbers and redlines

Summary:=C2=A0 All= pending edits from 5 October 2016 review.

Cheers,
- Ira

-------------------------------
Change History:

18 October 2016

- Interim draft =E2=80=93 cha= nges per IPP WG review on 5 October 2016
- global =E2=80=93 accepted all= changes before section 6.1.6 Get-Printer-Attributes (all reviewed by IPP W= G)
- revised section 5.6 Resource Description Attributes to replicate no= te taken from Create-Printer operation about how Printer-scope Resources ar= e associated with Printers
- revised section 6.1.5.1 Get-Printers Reque= st to remove =E2=80=9Cprinter-uri=E2=80=9D (redundant with classic Get-Prin= ter-Attributes) since this is a new request
- revised section 6.1.5.1 Ge= t-Printers Request to explicitly limit the values of =E2=80=9Crequested-att= ributes=E2=80=9D to those IPP Printer source attributes listed in the table= in section 4 Definition of Attribute Types in the IETF LDAP Schema for Pri= nter Services [RFC7612] (to limit new Get-Printers operation to first-order= discovery of appropriate Printers)
- revised section 16. Appendix A =E2= =80=93 Rationale for Design Choices to accept all changes (to reduce editor= =E2=80=99s annoyance)


--001a1140ac6e1a2419053f291afd-- --===============7480997537172229895== Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline _______________________________________________ ipp mailing list ipp@pwg.org https://www.pwg.org/mailman/listinfo/ipp --===============7480997537172229895==-- From ipp-bounces@pwg.org Tue Oct 18 13:29:47 2016 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ietfarch-ipp-archive@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: ietfarch-ipp-archive@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id F017D129863 for ; Tue, 18 Oct 2016 13:29:46 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.221 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.221 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, HEADER_FROM_DIFFERENT_DOMAINS=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE=-0.0001, RP_MATCHES_RCVD=-0.431, SPF_PASS=-0.001, T_DKIM_INVALID=0.01] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); 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Tue, 18 Oct 2016 13:29:38 -0700 (PDT) MIME-version: 1.0 Received: from [17.153.40.213] (unknown [17.153.40.213]) by nwk-mmpp-sz13.apple.com (Oracle Communications Messaging Server 8.0.1.1.0 64bit (built Jun 15 2016)) with ESMTPSA id <0OF900HZDFLCMR60@nwk-mmpp-sz13.apple.com> for ipp@pwg.org; Tue, 18 Oct 2016 13:29:38 -0700 (PDT) From: Michael Sweet Date: Tue, 18 Oct 2016 16:29:36 -0400 Message-id: <60752C17-E89D-45A7-8F4F-9AD912D60BAB@apple.com> To: ipp X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.3226) X-Brightmail-Tracker: H4sIAAAAAAAAA+NgFupiluLIzCtJLcpLzFFi42IRbCiM0jVuY4swaHOyOLbvJYsDo8e8xdOZ AhijuGxSUnMyy1KL9O0SuDJOHVvGWrBZomLu1TmsDYw3RboYOTkkBEwk5l/uYO5i5OIQEtjL KLF43zYWmMT+7mtMEIlDjBL3Jx5hAknwCghK/Jh8D6iIg4NZQF7i4HlZkDCzgJbE90etLBD1 s5gkVk9YxgaSEBaQkDjev5AVxGYTUJP4PakPzGYRUJV4+GESK0SNucT+E7sYQWbyCthIPHhh CRIWERCVOPZzCTNIWEJAVmL2Ly+Q8RICjWwSi178Yp3AKDALyUWzEC6aheSiBYzMqxiFchMz c3Qz80z0EgsKclL1kvNzNzGCAm+6ndAOxlOrrA4xCnAwKvHwelizRQixJpYVV+YeYpTmYFES 51WMAAoJpCeWpGanphakFsUXleakFh9iZOLglGpgnJexTjTqfITKVubFFWmXnHcFvrKTM0/4 ud71amvjf7fMVTnKc54W6DEUcvcIf02zfXFippZSs5/n9G+bnLf55sV+fHHIvH9uHaehzQZT CaEHlvw8E9pPqrR9lXqpkaTAoTBFgLFnUsA7zTWz3l39Y3NLSEzLlmO+m9aM2/LVIe4Wdtf3 aZcpsRRnJBpqMRcVJwIALnoDSx0CAAA= X-Brightmail-Tracker: H4sIAAAAAAAAA+NgFrrELMWRmVeSWpSXmKPExsUi2FB8Q9eojS3CoOWRicWxfS9ZHBg95i2e zhTAGMVlk5Kak1mWWqRvl8CVcerYMtaCzRIVc6/OYW1gvCnSxcjJISFgIrG/+xoThC0mceHe erYuRi4OIYFDjBL3Jx4BS/AKCEr8mHyPpYuRg4NZQF7i4HlZkDCzgJbE90etLBD1s5gkVk9Y xgaSEBaQkDjev5AVxGYTUJP4PakPzGYRUJV4+GESK0SNucT+E7sYQWbyCthIPHhhCRIWERCV OPZzCTNIWEJAVmL2L68JjHyzkBwxC+GIWUiOWMDIvIpRoCg1J7HSTC+xoCAnVS85P3cTIziE CqN2MDYstzrEKMDBqMTD62HNFiHEmlhWXJkL9CUHs5II78UaoBBvSmJlVWpRfnxRaU5q8SHG ZKCLJzJLiSbnA8M7ryTe0MTEwMTY2MzY2NzEnDRhJXHeiWmsEUIC6YklqdmpqQWpRTBbmDg4 pRoYi/6KLLlW8Ldxc1/2k6hTK7uX7fpgk9b5jOWn28/uRXvW1nr4nN21fNq6ZYr7Ug2Pna5c VfDogvah9W9sztg8vb7k27V5ay++XVzIUKsQZNmw79LFao5qnc/xGbunnrt2kTv0Vm7DL+Wa f8Zdn6YYuM3vTeDh7XI8dSRgdz33erGkqQZSNsknFyuxFGckGmoxFxUnAgCnIA0IZQIAAA== Subject: [IPP] IPP WG Agenda 1-3 US Eastern (19 October 2016) X-BeenThere: ipp@pwg.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15 Precedence: list List-Id: Internet Printing Protocol Workgroup discussion list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: ipp-bounces@pwg.org Sender: "ipp" Hi, [Note: New Day/Time] Our next IPP WG call will be Wednesday 19 October 2016 at 10am-12pm US Pacific / 1pm-3pm US Eastern Call-in toll-free number (US/Canada): 1-866-469-3239 Call-in toll number (US/Canada): 1-650-429-3300 (Primary) Call-in toll number (US/Canada): 1-408-856-9570 (Backup) Attendee Access Code: *******# Attendee ID Code: # (empty) NOTE: Please DO NOT USE the audio bridge number listed by WebEx - instead use the regular PWG conference bridge listed above! ------------------------------------------------------- Meeting information ------------------------------------------------------- Topic: IPP WG Date: Wednesday, from 5 October 2016 to no end date Time: 1:00 pm, Eastern Daylight Time (New York, GMT-04:00) Meeting Number: 682 763 393 Meeting Password: Printing123 ------------------------------------------------------- To join the online meeting (Now from mobile devices!) ------------------------------------------------------- 1. Go to https://ieee-isto.webex.com/ieee-isto/j.php?MTID=m0359478143ca01e059a570ada91f3573 2. If requested, enter your name and email address. 3. If a password is required, enter the meeting password: Printing123 4. Click "Join". ------------------------------------------------------- For assistance ------------------------------------------------------- 1. Go to https://ieee-isto.webex.com/ieee-isto/mc 2. On the left navigation bar, click "Support". ------------------------------------------------------- Agenda: (1) PWG IP Policy, Minute Taker, and Agenda Review - Mike as minute taker? (2) Approve IPP minutes from previous meetings - http://ftp.pwg.org/pub/pwg/ipp/minutes/ippv2-concall-minutes-20161005.pdf -- IPP WG call on 10/05/16 (3) Status of various IPP documents (Ira/Mike/Smith) * IETF IPP/1.1 Updates (Mike/Ira) - http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-sweet-rfc2910bis-10.txt - http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-sweet-rfc2911bis-11.txt -- changes for new IETF Proposed Standards -- Alexey Melnikov (IETF ART AD) as AD sponsor on 06/02/16 -- RFC2910bis & RFC 2911bis - IETF Approved as Proposed Standards! -- waiting on RFC Editor AUTH-48 phase for several minor edits -- Schedule - IPP/1.1 RFCs published in Q4 2016 (4) Review of IPP Finishings 2.1 (Smith) - http://ftp.pwg.org/pub/pwg/ipp/wd/wd-ippfinishings21-20161018-rev.pdf -- Stable draft -- IPP WG Last Call on 08/22/16 to 09/06/16 -- Reviewed by IPP WG on 09/19/16 -- Schedule - PWG Call for Objections in Q4 2016 (5) Review of IPP System Service (Ira/Mike) - http://ftp.pwg.org/pub/pwg/ipp/wd/wd-ippsystem10-20161018-rev.pdf -- Interim draft -- Reviewed by IPP WG on 10/05/16 -- Stopped at end of section 6.1.5.1 -- Schedule - Prototype draft in Q4 2016 / Q1 2017 (6) Next steps - IPP WG call on Wed 19 October 2016 at 1-3pm US Eastern - IPP WG "face-to-face" meetings on Monday 15 November 2016 at 1:30-5pm US Mountain and Tuesday 16 November 2016 at 1-4pm US Mountain _________________________________________________________ Michael Sweet, Senior Printing System Engineer _______________________________________________ ipp mailing list ipp@pwg.org https://www.pwg.org/mailman/listinfo/ipp From ipp-bounces@pwg.org Wed Oct 19 11:50:50 2016 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ietfarch-ipp-archive@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: ietfarch-ipp-archive@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id B49C01295DE for ; 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Received: from relay6.apple.com (relay6.apple.com [17.128.113.90]) by mail-in6.apple.com (Apple Secure Mail Relay) with SMTP id D3.89.06862.180C7085; Wed, 19 Oct 2016 11:50:41 -0700 (PDT) X-AuditID: 11973e15-945b79a000001ace-d2-5807c081130c Received: from nwk-mmpp-sz13.apple.com (nwk-mmpp-sz13.apple.com [17.128.115.216]) by relay6.apple.com (Apple SCV relay) with SMTP id E4.D2.23613.180C7085; Wed, 19 Oct 2016 11:50:41 -0700 (PDT) MIME-version: 1.0 Received: from [17.153.40.213] (unknown [17.153.40.213]) by nwk-mmpp-sz13.apple.com (Oracle Communications Messaging Server 8.0.1.1.0 64bit (built Jun 15 2016)) with ESMTPSA id <0OFB002L25OFF320@nwk-mmpp-sz13.apple.com> for ipp@pwg.org; Wed, 19 Oct 2016 11:50:41 -0700 (PDT) From: Michael Sweet Date: Wed, 19 Oct 2016 14:50:38 -0400 Message-id: <0708E610-B8C7-46C9-9CB0-1B918BB653DD@apple.com> To: ipp X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.3226) X-Brightmail-Tracker: H4sIAAAAAAAAA+NgFupiluLIzCtJLcpLzFFi42IRbCiM0m08wB5hsPyJssWxfS9ZHBg95i2e zhTAGMVlk5Kak1mWWqRvl8CV8e9dN2vBMaaK+39/sjcwTmHqYuTkkBAwkbj+6C0ziC0ksJdR 4vwxOZj43QfNQDVcQPFDjBJLN/0Fa+AVEJT4MfkeSxcjBwezgLzEwfOyIGFmAS2J749aWSDm zGKS2H7CE8QWFpCQON6/kBXEZhNQk/g9qQ/MZhFQlehe38QMUWMt8fr4P3aI8TYSm5tfsIHY IgKiEsd+LmEGWSUhICsx+5cXyDkSAn9ZJZ7c2Mw0gVFgFpKLZiFcNAvJRQsYmVcxCuUmZubo ZuaZ6SUWFOSk6iXn525iBAXedDvRHYxnVlkdYhTgYFTi4d1Qzh4hxJpYVlyZe4hRmoNFSZy3 ZgNbhJBAemJJanZqakFqUXxRaU5q8SFGJg5OqQbGBdovgkKOSc/iO75Gw8hM4uXT5Slvnx5c kv0xW4v54KUtXOb3PC7UPVC/xvX6bvz8OI8jz1TWLfyhw7vI54lc3YTuZQIPf2a/kXJlkWrd 1ShneXunuueqEK3DcyYn6Oodktpx//CTuvW750/edeLQzoSFPmIrn3y63ykw8/xzucN/svc9 nalyyEGJpTgj0VCLuag4EQBdklV4HQIAAA== X-Brightmail-Tracker: H4sIAAAAAAAAA+NgFrrELMWRmVeSWpSXmKPExsUi2FB8Q7fxAHuEwcSDshbH9r1kcWD0mLd4 OlMAYxSXTUpqTmZZapG+XQJXxr933awFx5gq7v/9yd7AOIWpi5GTQ0LAROLug2YoW0ziwr31 bF2MXBxCAocYJZZu+guW4BUQlPgx+R5LFyMHB7OAvMTB87IgYWYBLYnvj1pZQGwhgVlMEttP eILYwgISEsf7F7KC2GwCahK/J/WB2SwCqhLd65uYIWqsJV4f/8cOMd5GYnPzCzYQW0RAVOLY zyXMIKskBGQlZv/ymsDINwvJEbMQjpiF5IgFjMyrGAWKUnMSK830EgsKclL1kvNzNzGCQ6gw agdjw3KrQ4wCHIxKPLwcVewRQqyJZcWVuUBfcjArifBO2QAU4k1JrKxKLcqPLyrNSS0+xJgM dPJEZinR5HxgeOeVxBuamBiYGBubGRubm5iTJqwkzjsxjTVCSCA9sSQ1OzW1ILUIZgsTB6dU AyOLwZeqp+1T+QxP3j0i+uT2/k6lqMRjl5sD2uKPdbiFJHHbGVeFZ6soMuyLuzvppvi2TT/7 rqga7lX//HLt3k07J7O9Zhdn/Hz6XgxnzIMPk1sZz/Ps2FT6onx5avzF+67ZygkNx/bt9aq5 U1OwWmfv+YXbv3ofM7d3fibxm+1ZzsS/j1NCdv1WYinOSDTUYi4qTgQAIARlJ2UCAAA= Subject: [IPP] Minutes posted from today's IPP WG conference call X-BeenThere: ipp@pwg.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15 Precedence: list List-Id: Internet Printing Protocol Workgroup discussion list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: ipp-bounces@pwg.org Sender: "ipp" All, I have posted the minutes from today's IPP WG conference call to: http://ftp.pwg.org/pub/pwg/ipp/minutes/ippv2-concall-minutes-20161019.pdf Our next conference call is on November 2, 2016 at 1pm ET. _________________________________________________________ Michael Sweet, Senior Printing System Engineer _______________________________________________ ipp mailing list ipp@pwg.org https://www.pwg.org/mailman/listinfo/ipp From ipp-bounces@pwg.org Wed Oct 19 11:55:37 2016 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ietfarch-ipp-archive@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: ietfarch-ipp-archive@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4707712941E for ; Wed, 19 Oct 2016 11:55:37 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.217 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.217 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_ADSP_CUSTOM_MED=0.001, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, FREEMAIL_FORGED_FROMDOMAIN=0.001, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, HEADER_FROM_DIFFERENT_DOMAINS=0.001, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE=-0.0001, RP_MATCHES_RCVD=-0.431, SPF_PASS=-0.001, T_DKIM_INVALID=0.01] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); 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Wed, 19 Oct 2016 11:55:29 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 Received: by 10.107.147.6 with HTTP; Wed, 19 Oct 2016 11:55:08 -0700 (PDT) From: Ira McDonald Date: Wed, 19 Oct 2016 14:55:08 -0400 Message-ID: To: "ipp@pwg.org" , Ira McDonald Subject: [IPP] IETF Tools page w/ ABNF tools X-BeenThere: ipp@pwg.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15 Precedence: list List-Id: Internet Printing Protocol Workgroup discussion list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="===============6816472889006234321==" Errors-To: ipp-bounces@pwg.org Sender: "ipp" --===============6816472889006234321== Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary=001a1140f2764be7b3053f3c5afb --001a1140f2764be7b3053f3c5afb Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 https://tools.ietf.org/ Ira McDonald (Musician / Software Architect) Co-Chair - TCG Trusted Mobility Solutions WG Chair - Linux Foundation Open Printing WG Secretary - IEEE-ISTO Printer Working Group Co-Chair - IEEE-ISTO PWG Internet Printing Protocol WG IETF Designated Expert - IPP & Printer MIB Blue Roof Music / High North Inc http://sites.google.com/site/blueroofmusic http://sites.google.com/site/highnorthinc mailto: blueroofmusic@gmail.com Jan-April: 579 Park Place Saline, MI 48176 734-944-0094 May-Dec: PO Box 221 Grand Marais, MI 49839 906-494-2434 --001a1140f2764be7b3053f3c5afb Content-Type: text/html; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
https://tools.ietf.org= /

Ira McDonald (Musician / Software Architect)
= Co-Chair - TCG Trusted Mobility Solutions WG
Chair - Linux Foundation Op= en Printing WG
Secretary - IEEE-ISTO Printer Working Group
Co-Chair -= IEEE-ISTO PWG Internet Printing Protocol WG
IETF Designated Expert - IP= P & Printer MIB
Blue Roof Music / High North Inc
http://sites.google.com/site/blueroofmusic
http://sites.google.com/site/highnorthinc
mailto: blueroofmusic@gm= ail.com
Jan-April: 579 Park Place=C2=A0 Saline, MI=C2=A0 48176=C2=A0= 734-944-0094
May-Dec: PO Box 221=C2=A0 Grand Marais, MI 49839=C2=A0 906= -494-2434

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Tue, 25 Oct 2016 05:26:46 -0700 (PDT) Received: from www.pwg.org (www.pwg.org [IPv6:2600:3c01::f03c:91ff:fe70:b03f]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 616E1129631 for ; Tue, 25 Oct 2016 05:26:46 -0700 (PDT) Received: by www.pwg.org (Postfix, from userid 1002) id DEC034428; Tue, 25 Oct 2016 12:26:45 +0000 (UTC) Received: from www.pwg.org (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by www.pwg.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7682926D1; Tue, 25 Oct 2016 12:26:42 +0000 (UTC) X-Original-To: ipp@pwg.org Delivered-To: ipp@pwg.org Received: by www.pwg.org (Postfix, from userid 1002) id EF06726EA; Tue, 25 Oct 2016 12:26:40 +0000 (UTC) Received: from NAM02-CY1-obe.outbound.protection.outlook.com (mail-cys01nam02on0099.outbound.protection.outlook.com [104.47.37.99]) by www.pwg.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 87C7E2697 for ; Tue, 25 Oct 2016 12:26:40 +0000 (UTC) Received: from DF4PR84MB0284.NAMPRD84.PROD.OUTLOOK.COM (10.162.193.22) by DF4PR84MB0284.NAMPRD84.PROD.OUTLOOK.COM (10.162.193.22) with Microsoft SMTP Server (version=TLS1_2, cipher=TLS_ECDHE_RSA_WITH_AES_256_CBC_SHA384_P384) id 15.1.679.12; Tue, 25 Oct 2016 12:26:39 +0000 Received: from DF4PR84MB0284.NAMPRD84.PROD.OUTLOOK.COM ([10.162.193.22]) by DF4PR84MB0284.NAMPRD84.PROD.OUTLOOK.COM ([10.162.193.22]) with mapi id 15.01.0679.015; Tue, 25 Oct 2016 12:26:39 +0000 From: "Kennedy, Smith (Wireless Architect)" To: PWG IPP WG Reflector Thread-Topic: New draft of IPP Finishings 2.1 posted for review Thread-Index: AQHSLrsJLfikUwaAD02jXFQrut7OAw== Date: Tue, 25 Oct 2016 12:26:39 +0000 Message-ID: Accept-Language: en-US Content-Language: en-US X-MS-Has-Attach: yes X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: authentication-results: spf=none (sender IP is ) smtp.mailfrom=smith.kennedy@hp.com; x-ms-exchange-messagesentrepresentingtype: 1 x-originating-ip: [97.121.8.187] x-ms-office365-filtering-correlation-id: a1e922c9-f5b8-466d-bea5-08d3fcd22b95 x-microsoft-exchange-diagnostics: 1; DF4PR84MB0284; 6:Qi8pcV01kDeCOwuMvLjO7w6hgoHEWWh9j4XQjE/AiyePNuK5j4KdU2AeY7Ka8aQ4R2k69BhPj1v8XU1hq5z43zvrY1jiAiJkzrppAfddRHYeObXK8jPKL5d4gGWcBk6KfyurVAyG1dSo0sm1cGigZ3FcQen0UVdvYNcQcYlfKcpm4kGLCEinfltRbpBg8+AXHUyZc6WLHNWUZudig6UnU5wVkJ/EqGrCOL3kYf7xeBNlnBS8oLU65HC/0BN2QPhdyz5c3HAHriNCnfVj1qcg+fUBxEFrbRjQMbHAYqAd/EA8srJrqmMEArsOacCi3tBl; 5:JKFLhnJlwKHcYtIEbY1Z4+rYB8MS/ohfyKLeCNHTEwJCOJRbUp+JL3VVVDUnl+uQ4RXHynJ5R7p3yFCL2IGz/kSVdT1C3r1FuxrbHRcAmUlJtLTKgvM74b7NkWUmApvIes7HmtX0Wp8RH13oYm1AXw6CWQQS+q6E/HSpy6gKTgY=; 24:AU5/lha4IFls7/3fKeDFkoDHCDZ7Zw6qRpYoolDeTpJ9e6Q18Ph6qMxdDUBwopC7EXy341wIp8rhqjzjqoI3eqG+PLwFJWNXHnGDUYHOwfA=; 7:mhePnTNFsBekNJuZzDhBpIPbannkj1fw20qSx94ed3d2Efh0vYtxmGHGeNQOU+7E9h449d68Pt9wGxxA5GIbHKybHoQaVWukX+pmZPj4VC9grSeYqVMV80wCS1p+QRamdTKmq/MoHBTHwzBQhbYQ4sF/otZQ3v4F/sGb2pAgYCQU3W9jZvv5szjhYS9gkIAlofGS3yGnH81pLZ869LO8W6GpAEYNwhH/rhSf1zX3JLY9DudNxxRclAHhksQiXSL9jPG1b8ei5cqBt6LimkdHEecKWFUXGdtL+OefuyKMKCdfrxHoISSZtG/sNpSHHDz/nJrLyLZxqww7Mmnto8s9FC65UYF1oNJ3NAy2eJoWrwk= x-microsoft-antispam: UriScan:;BCL:0;PCL:0;RULEID:;SRVR:DF4PR84MB0284; x-microsoft-antispam-prvs: x-exchange-antispam-report-test: UriScan:; x-exchange-antispam-report-cfa-test: BCL:0; PCL:0; RULEID:(102415321)(6040176)(601004)(2401047)(8121501046)(5005006)(3002001)(10201501046); SRVR:DF4PR84MB0284; BCL:0; PCL:0; RULEID:; SRVR:DF4PR84MB0284; x-forefront-prvs: 01068D0A20 x-forefront-antispam-report: SFV:NSPM; SFS:(10019020)(6009001)(7916002)(199003)(6602003)(189002)(122556002)(83716003)(87936001)(2900100001)(107886002)(7736002)(450100001)(305945005)(189998001)(7846002)(36756003)(8676002)(81156014)(50986999)(92566002)(97736004)(99936001)(81166006)(15975445007)(33656002)(54356999)(3660700001)(77096005)(3280700002)(86362001)(19580395003)(11100500001)(5660300001)(3846002)(102836003)(6116002)(586003)(2906002)(105586002)(8936002)(101416001)(99286002)(82746002)(68736007)(106356001)(110136003)(229853001)(106116001)(10400500002)(6916009)(5002640100001)(66066001)(104396002); DIR:OUT; SFP:1102; SCL:1; SRVR:DF4PR84MB0284; H:DF4PR84MB0284.NAMPRD84.PROD.OUTLOOK.COM; FPR:; SPF:None; PTR:InfoNoRecords; A:1; MX:1; LANG:en; received-spf: None (protection.outlook.com: hp.com does not designate permitted sender hosts) spamdiagnosticoutput: 1:99 spamdiagnosticmetadata: NSPM MIME-Version: 1.0 X-OriginatorOrg: hp.com X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-originalarrivaltime: 25 Oct 2016 12:26:39.2946 (UTC) X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-fromentityheader: Hosted X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-id: ca7981a2-785a-463d-b82a-3db87dfc3ce6 X-MS-Exchange-Transport-CrossTenantHeadersStamped: DF4PR84MB0284 Subject: [IPP] New draft of IPP Finishings 2.1 posted for review X-BeenThere: ipp@pwg.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15 Precedence: list List-Id: Internet Printing Protocol Workgroup discussion list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="===============2911422335674646196==" Errors-To: ipp-bounces@pwg.org Sender: "ipp" --===============2911422335674646196== Content-Language: en-US Content-Type: multipart/signed; boundary="Apple-Mail=_3BB5374B-58DF-4FF9-B690-0199FCA4D97F"; protocol="application/pkcs7-signature"; micalg=sha1 --Apple-Mail=_3BB5374B-58DF-4FF9-B690-0199FCA4D97F Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Greetings, I have just posted a new draft of Finishings 2.1 for review. The = document contains fixes for all the editorial issues identified in the = last IPP WG conference call. As such, I believe this draft is stable = enough to be ready for another Working Group Last Call. The new revision = is available here: http://ftp.pwg.org/pub/pwg/ipp/wd/wd-ippfinishings21-20161025.pdf http://ftp.pwg.org/pub/pwg/ipp/wd/wd-ippfinishings21-20161025.docx http://ftp.pwg.org/pub/pwg/ipp/wd/wd-ippfinishings21-20161025-rev.pdf = http://ftp.pwg.org/pub/pwg/ipp/wd/wd-ippfinishings21-20161025-rev.docx Please post a reply or contact me directly with any concerns, Smith /** Smith Kennedy Wireless Architect - Client Software - IPG-PPS Standards - IEEE ISTO PWG / Bluetooth SIG / Wi-Fi Alliance / NFC = Forum / USB IF Chair, IEEE ISTO Printer Working Group HP Inc. */ --Apple-Mail=_3BB5374B-58DF-4FF9-B690-0199FCA4D97F Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="smime.p7s" Content-Type: application/pkcs7-signature; name="smime.p7s" Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64 MIAGCSqGSIb3DQEHAqCAMIACAQExCzAJBgUrDgMCGgUAMIAGCSqGSIb3DQEHAQAAoIIOQDCCBmEw ggVJoAMCAQICEDtXE7awITX7XkZ1ymyyxOEwDQYJKoZIhvcNAQEFBQAwgcoxCzAJBgNVBAYTAlVT 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Communications Messaging Server 8.0.1.1.0 64bit (built Jun 15 2016)) with ESMTPSA id <0OFX00CSV8U28O20@nwk-mmpp-sz07.apple.com> for ipp@pwg.org; Mon, 31 Oct 2016 10:06:04 -0700 (PDT) From: Michael Sweet Date: Mon, 31 Oct 2016 13:06:02 -0400 Message-id: <91C4CF57-4E23-4590-8BC8-9543E62419B3@apple.com> To: ipp X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.3251) X-Brightmail-Tracker: H4sIAAAAAAAAA+NgFupmluLIzCtJLcpLzFFi42IRbCiM0v1TKR5hMO+BisWxfS9ZHBg95i2e zhTAGMVlk5Kak1mWWqRvl8CVcbX9LlvBSqaK2y8mszcw/mPsYuTkkBAwkTi8bSWQzcUhJLCX UeLU1BksMIkd0++yQyQOMUosf7SEDSTBKyAo8WPyPaAiDg5mAXmJg+dlQcLMAloS3x+1skDU /2WU+Pm5jRkkISwgIXG8fyEriM0moCbxe1IfmM0ioCqx58kOdpA5wgIaEpuOVUCMt5HYfGY6 2A0iAqISx34uYYa4R1bi0/Of7BD2X1aJzbMzJjAKzEJy0SyEi2YhuWgBI/MqRqHcxMwc3cw8 c73EgoKcVL3k/NxNjKDQm24ntoPx4SqrQ4wCHIxKPLwbPMUjhFgTy4orcw8xSnOwKInzzk0F CgmkJ5akZqemFqQWxReV5qQWH2Jk4uCUamDUjt3BbP5qycx/XLO0gtia2HYYZ9QyC7i7bZ5a Fb5vVvOUWtG1/HFFJ3bNjTg2Y8fUpZ4TBeoaNfgn/D2Q8/3/hj+sdUL5+/RijLhj9F37dV+V 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X-BeenThere: ipp@pwg.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15 Precedence: list List-Id: Internet Printing Protocol Workgroup discussion list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: ipp-bounces@pwg.org Sender: "ipp" All, I have posted draft slides for the F2F meeting to: http://ftp.pwg.org/pub/pwg/ipp/slides/ipp-wg-agenda-november-16d2.pdf For review during this week's conference call... _________________________________________________________ Michael Sweet, Senior Printing System Engineer _______________________________________________ ipp mailing list ipp@pwg.org https://www.pwg.org/mailman/listinfo/ipp