From nobody Tue Nov 8 00:56:16 2016 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ledger@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: ledger@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 089C1129C89 for ; Tue, 8 Nov 2016 00:56:15 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -0.284 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-0.284 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAD_CREDIT=2.415, BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW=-0.7] autolearn=no autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (1024-bit key) header.d=hopebailie.com Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id Ze9SRIh6eaGU for ; Tue, 8 Nov 2016 00:56:12 -0800 (PST) Received: from mail-wm0-x232.google.com (mail-wm0-x232.google.com [IPv6:2a00:1450:400c:c09::232]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 9BA75129C7D for ; Tue, 8 Nov 2016 00:56:12 -0800 (PST) Received: by mail-wm0-x232.google.com with SMTP id f82so166505306wmf.1 for ; Tue, 08 Nov 2016 00:56:12 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=hopebailie.com; s=google; h=mime-version:from:date:message-id:subject:to; bh=Ya/7PE4Tf6UE8P0XjyiHJfxP1lNj0aR1u8MsLatApDI=; b=GHaI9h5v9YtyhBj7UlrzSDvNVek69s1R/Cdlg4KLg3zEkUthuZOvaRVDUsgKLyb9c5 5WCs2Bq/ZhX70MuiHRc+ArfuGWfGZr+BpMqP7eBuo+fJuSjcjOYP2ylTWY9H9RWlVGEX H0vRyS8dS3VO8oJ3B/z2zoIgL8y6Vv17rLJQs= X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20130820; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:from:date:message-id:subject:to; bh=Ya/7PE4Tf6UE8P0XjyiHJfxP1lNj0aR1u8MsLatApDI=; b=FCPGo3ZFzFGUbms9iGKlTOJ+82AL1lZIka8kYLqM6Pt5a2zZi/3/u/mpU4WR3fuil2 Yr1Siu/n+6WCTlWqqKwnhNyu2p72pjo5M4wONsLzYQ+bxp7UzeCN/vjBzcqg0Blzh+bX kMDm1tWalM2dO9j7ME30NT/7lmuSPbSPj7JEURl3a98GIkpk2n2ndbX+OD21vHXGZujv RxehU6AXNX8zsO4dSIYBlWNLNRxd89M9YJP8enkjNt2s+wtrjH9BlvbuL8FGqIs1Y7wv HZYQ8ydl/4QT4inCNL41e7C1vDTLSjM5bp/jkJYf5rVoNuFtF5Ia9hi75LaWwj5MFaId o9+w== X-Gm-Message-State: ABUngvdK+Qk0tzAxeXlk9gRoJQNqDFS6/yTgTq6mDeNDGJkLCuPcxbMizqDCclsTEcViHAlU5DWHQLwjS5CRUw== X-Received: by 10.28.55.213 with SMTP id e204mr10804464wma.92.1478595371116; Tue, 08 Nov 2016 00:56:11 -0800 (PST) MIME-Version: 1.0 Received: by 10.194.26.225 with HTTP; Tue, 8 Nov 2016 00:56:10 -0800 (PST) From: Adrian Hope-Bailie Date: Tue, 8 Nov 2016 10:56:10 +0200 Message-ID: To: Interledger Community Group , Interledger Mailing List - IETF Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary=001a11443abcdcc13a0540c64f3d Archived-At: Subject: [Ledger] Bootstrapping Interledger X-BeenThere: ledger@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.17 Precedence: list List-Id: "Discussion of interledger, originally a protocol stack for moving digital assets \(making payments\) between accounts operating on different payment networks or ledgers." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 08 Nov 2016 08:56:15 -0000 --001a11443abcdcc13a0540c64f3d Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 When the Internet was first emerging and large university and research networks were coming together on the back of the Internet Protocol the challenge for everyday users was how they could access this new network of networks without special permission or equipment. We face a similar challenge with ILP in that very few of the ledgers accessible to us support the one function that is critical to universal ILP payments; real-time conditional transfers. (I wrote a bit about conditional transfer here: https://medium.com/@ahopebailie/the-power-of-conditional-payments-2d1ea531250a ) So, just like the pioneers of the Internet we're improvising! "Dial-up" interledger enables us to bootstrap the Interledger using "virtual" ledgers between connectors that have established a bounded trusted relationship. In other words, if I run a small connector and I trust my friend Stefan who also runs a connector then we can transact without needing an ILP-enabled ledger between us. We establish a credit limit that we are both comfortable with and agree on a way to settle our positions as required (via Bitcoin, bank transfer or even cash). Consider what will happen if we build a community of people who are all establishing similar peering relationships and then introduce ILP-enabled ledgers to bridge any gaps between connectors that don't know one another. Very soon we'll have an entirely new payments network where payments flow like information does on the Internet today. We're calling this project the Interledger Bootstrap Project and I've started capturing some thoughts on the project wiki: https://github.com/ interledgerjs/ilp-kit/wiki In short: 1. Get the ilp-kit code and run a node 2. Find other nodes to peer with 3. Do ILP-enabled transactions 4. Win! The ilp-kit is still pre-release and likely to have some bugs and change a lot so if you're keen to be an early adopter and help test and contribute back to that project please do so. If you'd rather wait until the code stabilizes a bit then keep watching the list and we'll let you know when the first Beta is available. Please feel free to make contributions to the wiki. It would be great if this was a community effort! Adrian --001a11443abcdcc13a0540c64f3d Content-Type: text/html; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
When the Internet was f= irst emerging and large university and research networks were coming together on the back of the Internet Protocol the challenge for everyday users was how they=20 could access this new network of networks without special permission or=20 equipment.

We face a similar challenge with ILP in that= =20 very few of the ledgers accessible to us support the one function that=20 is critical to universal ILP payments; real-time conditional transfers. (I = wrote a bit about conditional transfer here: https://medium= .com/@ahopebailie/the-power-of-conditional-payments-2d1ea531250a)
So, just like the pioneers of the Internet we're improvising!

= "Dial-up" interledger enables us to bootstrap the=20 Interledger using "virtual" ledgers between connectors that have= =20 established a bounded trusted relationship.

In other words, if I=20 run a small connector and I trust my friend Stefan who also runs a=20 connector then we can transact without needing an ILP-enabled ledger=20 between us.

We establish a credit limit that we are both comfortable= =20 with and agree on a way to settle our positions as required (via=20 Bitcoin, bank transfer or even cash).

Consider what will happen if w= e build a=20 community of people who are all establishing similar peering=20 relationships and then introduce ILP-enabled ledgers to bridge any gaps=20 between connectors that don't know one another. Very soon we'll hav= e an=20 entirely new payments network where payments flow like information does=20 on the Internet today.

We're calling this project the Inte= rledger Bootstrap Project and I've started capturing some thoughts on t= he project wiki: https://github.com/interledgerjs/ilp-kit/wiki
In short:
1. Get the ilp-kit code and run a node
2. Find other nodes to peer with
3. Do ILP-enabled transactions=
4. Win!

The ilp-kit is still pre-release and li= kely to have some bugs and change a lot so if you're keen to be an earl= y adopter and help test and contribute back to that project please do so. I= f you'd rather wait until the code stabilizes a bit then keep watching = the list and we'll let you know when the first Beta is available.

Please feel free to make contributions to the wiki. It w= ould be great if this was a community effort!
<= div>

Adrian
=
--001a11443abcdcc13a0540c64f3d-- From pfrazee@gmail.com Tue Nov 8 09:40:41 2016 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ledger@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: ledger@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id A307E1296AF for ; Tue, 8 Nov 2016 09:40:41 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -0.284 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-0.284 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAD_CREDIT=2.415, BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW=-0.7, SPF_PASS=-0.001] autolearn=no autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=gmail.com Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id aRTQK1riVJDE for ; Tue, 8 Nov 2016 09:40:40 -0800 (PST) Received: from mail-yw0-x236.google.com (mail-yw0-x236.google.com [IPv6:2607:f8b0:4002:c05::236]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 1761B129665 for ; Tue, 8 Nov 2016 09:40:40 -0800 (PST) Received: by mail-yw0-x236.google.com with SMTP id r204so186957765ywb.0 for ; Tue, 08 Nov 2016 09:40:40 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20120113; h=mime-version:in-reply-to:references:from:date:message-id:subject:to :cc; bh=t6BwP/Qo/dOBPLKz/wJDcysAjM14v7a1VMsWCRu+xno=; b=al/R6tIBwVjNu3lX/Isc0q1SCbzASk7M6tJQtv6UsDt/hENBnNwcKBpsK6AgaVsRV+ tKG1uR/yAdMEHCHY5h3W0skMNxeFhf09cs3sR5nsdpjSJb0io13/CCJgekCIQDBwQt72 bvifX6BjeXLPYMo4yqM3dCNptNBi28Ce+sGWzgIoPCuaKrBBiYL2NdwAHsvu1PR4SPg1 yRCm2MjeMtz4eyMjWRAyV6TZ1wt0BL60XzbFHaXw5l0kUWAru872VF6UYyfd/jAKv/E4 IoRJsI+0bZ1j9n8YNRJ8YvePmfKfPoYKiNCcm74iZyqkcpNKteUgTmt87WeexNsocyXI XsCw== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20130820; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:in-reply-to:references:from:date :message-id:subject:to:cc; bh=t6BwP/Qo/dOBPLKz/wJDcysAjM14v7a1VMsWCRu+xno=; b=Dw2LbPU6MfeXQaIdezPRNda7CjEKDJsdIlI2h5jsQZCTu2xMo1oEJWNssxu8d3dFYD XmO7rnqSKWZZ4e3fED7IHgrxhFu98Ck32pN3KNB83jto92x1av0OKVR5wtUjBwGHDV3e dyV4/7Ezh97IBlEdbUU3pQaLym3CcnpuXlozvdGWHMtg+biIaDA1saLwX6c7OmJP325+ uHVIZkfxeyQuEcjxe5UOMVGmn20fV7fuzr1WiNtyZAp7BpQrGJYQxoHzXxc5dDky86/v eNmzq5F3WrKPYGf9RcWsb6xPBZVLdl6IE8Rc/qlQeW/QALAOfRA/qnfG0/gdNIs9o3x5 LfzA== X-Gm-Message-State: ABUngvehCyKd2STUUfUWrh7yTG0M4KMTUg2N8dwuIVmXx/mlc3kCt7BJNBbhYoLTM1SQesopF9H00wjOK+fD4Q== X-Received: by 10.202.97.9 with SMTP id v9mr8423333oib.53.1478626839346; Tue, 08 Nov 2016 09:40:39 -0800 (PST) MIME-Version: 1.0 Received: by 10.182.221.201 with HTTP; Tue, 8 Nov 2016 09:39:58 -0800 (PST) In-Reply-To: References: From: Paul Frazee Date: Tue, 8 Nov 2016 11:39:58 -0600 Message-ID: To: Adrian Hope-Bailie Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary=001a113d443883c5260540cda31e Archived-At: X-Mailman-Approved-At: Tue, 08 Nov 2016 10:02:26 -0800 Cc: Interledger Community Group , Interledger Mailing List - IETF Subject: Re: [Ledger] Bootstrapping Interledger X-BeenThere: ledger@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.17 Precedence: list List-Id: "Discussion of interledger, originally a protocol stack for moving digital assets \(making payments\) between accounts operating on different payment networks or ledgers." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 08 Nov 2016 17:58:53 -0000 --001a113d443883c5260540cda31e Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 I'd be willing to run a node without tx fees while we're in the learning phase. What kind of admin/maintenance do I need to be prepared for? The wiki is good, but a checklist for setup and ongoing maintenance would be helpful. I could also help organize an Austin-based meetup. On Tue, Nov 8, 2016 at 2:56 AM, Adrian Hope-Bailie wrote: > When the Internet was first emerging and large university and research > networks were coming together on the back of the Internet Protocol the > challenge for everyday users was how they could access this new network of > networks without special permission or equipment. > > We face a similar challenge with ILP in that very few of the ledgers > accessible to us support the one function that is critical to universal ILP > payments; real-time conditional transfers. (I wrote a bit about conditional > transfer here: https://medium.com/@ahopebailie/the-power-of- > conditional-payments-2d1ea531250a) > > So, just like the pioneers of the Internet we're improvising! > > "Dial-up" interledger enables us to bootstrap the Interledger using > "virtual" ledgers between connectors that have established a bounded > trusted relationship. > > In other words, if I run a small connector and I trust my friend Stefan > who also runs a connector then we can transact without needing an > ILP-enabled ledger between us. > > We establish a credit limit that we are both comfortable with and agree on > a way to settle our positions as required (via Bitcoin, bank transfer or > even cash). > > Consider what will happen if we build a community of people who are all > establishing similar peering relationships and then introduce ILP-enabled > ledgers to bridge any gaps between connectors that don't know one another. > Very soon we'll have an entirely new payments network where payments flow > like information does on the Internet today. > > We're calling this project the Interledger Bootstrap Project and I've > started capturing some thoughts on the project wiki: > https://github.com/interledgerjs/ilp-kit/wiki > > In short: > 1. Get the ilp-kit code and run a node > 2. Find other nodes to peer with > 3. Do ILP-enabled transactions > 4. Win! > > The ilp-kit is still pre-release and likely to have some bugs and change a > lot so if you're keen to be an early adopter and help test and contribute > back to that project please do so. If you'd rather wait until the code > stabilizes a bit then keep watching the list and we'll let you know when > the first Beta is available. > > Please feel free to make contributions to the wiki. It would be great if > this was a community effort! > > Adrian > --001a113d443883c5260540cda31e Content-Type: text/html; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
I'd be willing to run a node without tx fees while we&= #39;re in the learning phase. What kind of admin/maintenance do I need to b= e prepared for? The wiki is good, but a checklist for setup and ongoing mai= ntenance would be helpful.

I could also help organize an= Austin-based meetup.

On Tue, Nov 8, 2016 at 2:56 AM, Adrian Hope-Bailie <a= drian@hopebailie.com> wrote:
When the Internet was= first emerging and large university and research networks were coming together on the back of the Internet Protocol the challenge for everyday users was how they=20 could access this new network of networks without special permission or=20 equipment.

We face a similar challenge with ILP in that= =20 very few of the ledgers accessible to us support the one function that=20 is critical to universal ILP payments; real-time conditional transfers. (I = wrote a bit about conditional transfer here: https://medium.com/@ahopebailie/the-power-of-conditional-paym= ents-2d1ea531250a)

So, just like the pioneers of the Intern= et we're improvising!

"Dial-up" interledger enables us= to bootstrap the=20 Interledger using "virtual" ledgers between connectors that have= =20 established a bounded trusted relationship.

In other words, if I=20 run a small connector and I trust my friend Stefan who also runs a=20 connector then we can transact without needing an ILP-enabled ledger=20 between us.

We establish a credit limit that we are both comfortable= =20 with and agree on a way to settle our positions as required (via=20 Bitcoin, bank transfer or even cash).

Consider what will happen if w= e build a=20 community of people who are all establishing similar peering=20 relationships and then introduce ILP-enabled ledgers to bridge any gaps=20 between connectors that don't know one another. Very soon we'll hav= e an=20 entirely new payments network where payments flow like information does=20 on the Internet today.

We're calling this project the Inte= rledger Bootstrap Project and I've started capturing some thoughts on t= he project wiki: https://github.com/interledgerjs/ilp-kit/wiki
In short:
1. Get the ilp-kit code and run a node
2. Find other nodes to peer with
3. Do ILP-enabled transactions=
4. Win!

The ilp-kit is still pre-release and li= kely to have some bugs and change a lot so if you're keen to be an earl= y adopter and help test and contribute back to that project please do so. I= f you'd rather wait until the code stabilizes a bit then keep watching = the list and we'll let you know when the first Beta is available.

Please feel free to make contributions to the wiki. It w= ould be great if this was a community effort!

Adrian

--001a113d443883c5260540cda31e-- From nobody Tue Nov 8 10:30:34 2016 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ledger@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: ledger@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id D91FE129D24 for ; Tue, 8 Nov 2016 10:30:32 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -0.185 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-0.185 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAD_CREDIT=2.415, BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW=-0.7, SPF_PASS=-0.001] autolearn=no autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=ryanfugger-com.20150623.gappssmtp.com Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id ZSGFwiMegymT for ; Tue, 8 Nov 2016 10:30:31 -0800 (PST) Received: from mail-qk0-x22c.google.com (mail-qk0-x22c.google.com [IPv6:2607:f8b0:400d:c09::22c]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 8B247129D34 for ; Tue, 8 Nov 2016 10:30:30 -0800 (PST) Received: by mail-qk0-x22c.google.com with SMTP id q130so227825624qke.1 for ; Tue, 08 Nov 2016 10:30:30 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=ryanfugger-com.20150623.gappssmtp.com; s=20150623; h=mime-version:in-reply-to:references:from:date:message-id:subject:to :cc; bh=4Dik0vZ2sXwJjYdsuDI4zDdX8yYD8GM1DNooeBe54yo=; b=Oy4Ij/QhB7yB3UhWpBYfq88+TGEElbz1Z9AjZiL6uC0ZPe8bpv3oyDhrnHCz5q9phL fLDkv7umHhqfueJ1C/fBGVoCmEc+q6Yj5YpoHjGUZe9YYU/q7B1Y2q+ojqIZL8UUpXXN iWqDjzOlME4qrk4wAyKvT8/P36E3z2HHn8znTx6jIEYuAy+rxI7mnjv0yIgR0m4fTign x5kIV2opObPEKi+cUDecN+6CMQlsFLg+2I32Fc8hkdzA12gXA+iRp5WR+daf+vQU9rhS q03+kGkkXuPzpqYQFxjgbUGqZX0hy69w57T/F/tVvhpAHFWi0qYWCQGd7hM8b1vljaun vwgA== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20130820; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:in-reply-to:references:from:date :message-id:subject:to:cc; bh=4Dik0vZ2sXwJjYdsuDI4zDdX8yYD8GM1DNooeBe54yo=; b=kpdk2MV7/xN32F8UUB9PSOK9EVC7Ntme/DSj+CC1n7htD/Lzzl5wXUzZDXZl7Xzus1 ilvwCBu5HLlOpOK7EHpaG/gms1s/u0n4gI3tWHaN0yH4S5MyVyGTK640cA5sFW67h46J iEETwOiGQOf0Be3LHn41Ggvjk8hD9ExFRCpzs5eDQZgLRcEpuU5IlD97TFVyQGcPBTDI QDEXb20vLlnol6rJG1ZhLOJi9KbASEFTRP8lmzeujLwKqy3cVAgUwiVQmfC8vEkZmtfO 2bJg8zRjUO+Gs6dSpTsZP5ZgPJcZdK2GFtIvhohDZBnXKoi7S22QnM7UQb5zCSNx07lZ NXeg== X-Gm-Message-State: ABUngvecxVDd8OLUB0cvYjiSLK9pXRCFTuc75fkvZyUtuLvYHbQjhrNv73WTQT6rdoWdrpmQAxuWfRi73t+5og== X-Received: by 10.55.120.6 with SMTP id t6mr13899652qkc.83.1478629829753; Tue, 08 Nov 2016 10:30:29 -0800 (PST) MIME-Version: 1.0 Received: by 10.55.158.75 with HTTP; Tue, 8 Nov 2016 10:30:09 -0800 (PST) In-Reply-To: References: From: Ryan Fugger Date: Tue, 8 Nov 2016 10:30:09 -0800 Message-ID: To: Adrian Hope-Bailie Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary=94eb2c05ede0c1df900540ce5528 Archived-At: Cc: Interledger Community Group , Interledger Mailing List - IETF Subject: Re: [Ledger] Bootstrapping Interledger X-BeenThere: ledger@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.17 Precedence: list List-Id: "Discussion of interledger, originally a protocol stack for moving digital assets \(making payments\) between accounts operating on different payment networks or ledgers." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 08 Nov 2016 18:30:33 -0000 --94eb2c05ede0c1df900540ce5528 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 This is great Adrian. My plan was always to evolve Ripplepay.com into a decentralized system like this. If you or anyone is interested in upgrading or otherwise using that creeky old system to help support bootstrapping Interledger, I'd be happy to help out however I can. On Tue, Nov 8, 2016 at 12:56 AM, Adrian Hope-Bailie wrote: > When the Internet was first emerging and large university and research > networks were coming together on the back of the Internet Protocol the > challenge for everyday users was how they could access this new network of > networks without special permission or equipment. > > We face a similar challenge with ILP in that very few of the ledgers > accessible to us support the one function that is critical to universal ILP > payments; real-time conditional transfers. (I wrote a bit about conditional > transfer here: https://medium.com/@ahopebailie/the-power-of- > conditional-payments-2d1ea531250a) > > So, just like the pioneers of the Internet we're improvising! > > "Dial-up" interledger enables us to bootstrap the Interledger using > "virtual" ledgers between connectors that have established a bounded > trusted relationship. > > In other words, if I run a small connector and I trust my friend Stefan > who also runs a connector then we can transact without needing an > ILP-enabled ledger between us. > > We establish a credit limit that we are both comfortable with and agree on > a way to settle our positions as required (via Bitcoin, bank transfer or > even cash). > > Consider what will happen if we build a community of people who are all > establishing similar peering relationships and then introduce ILP-enabled > ledgers to bridge any gaps between connectors that don't know one another. > Very soon we'll have an entirely new payments network where payments flow > like information does on the Internet today. > > We're calling this project the Interledger Bootstrap Project and I've > started capturing some thoughts on the project wiki: > https://github.com/interledgerjs/ilp-kit/wiki > > In short: > 1. Get the ilp-kit code and run a node > 2. Find other nodes to peer with > 3. Do ILP-enabled transactions > 4. Win! > > The ilp-kit is still pre-release and likely to have some bugs and change a > lot so if you're keen to be an early adopter and help test and contribute > back to that project please do so. If you'd rather wait until the code > stabilizes a bit then keep watching the list and we'll let you know when > the first Beta is available. > > Please feel free to make contributions to the wiki. It would be great if > this was a community effort! > > Adrian > > _______________________________________________ > Ledger mailing list > Ledger@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ledger > > --94eb2c05ede0c1df900540ce5528 Content-Type: text/html; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
This is great Adrian.=C2=A0 My plan was always to evolve R= ipplepay.com into a decentralized system like this.=C2=A0 If you or anyone = is interested in upgrading or otherwise using that creeky old system to hel= p support bootstrapping Interledger, I'd be happy to help out however I= can.

On= Tue, Nov 8, 2016 at 12:56 AM, Adrian Hope-Bailie <adrian@hopebailie.c= om> wrote:
When the Internet was first emerging an= d large university and research networks were coming together on the back of the Internet Protocol the challenge for everyday users was how they=20 could access this new network of networks without special permission or=20 equipment.

We face a similar challenge with ILP in that= =20 very few of the ledgers accessible to us support the one function that=20 is critical to universal ILP payments; real-time conditional transfers. (I = wrote a bit about conditional transfer here: https://medium.com/@ahopebailie/the-power-of-conditional-paym= ents-2d1ea531250a)

So, just like the pioneers of the Intern= et we're improvising!

"Dial-up" interledger enables us= to bootstrap the=20 Interledger using "virtual" ledgers between connectors that have= =20 established a bounded trusted relationship.

In other words, if I=20 run a small connector and I trust my friend Stefan who also runs a=20 connector then we can transact without needing an ILP-enabled ledger=20 between us.

We establish a credit limit that we are both comfortable= =20 with and agree on a way to settle our positions as required (via=20 Bitcoin, bank transfer or even cash).

Consider what will happen if w= e build a=20 community of people who are all establishing similar peering=20 relationships and then introduce ILP-enabled ledgers to bridge any gaps=20 between connectors that don't know one another. Very soon we'll hav= e an=20 entirely new payments network where payments flow like information does=20 on the Internet today.

We're calling this project the Inte= rledger Bootstrap Project and I've started capturing some thoughts on t= he project wiki: https://github.com/interledgerjs/ilp-kit/wiki
In short:
1. Get the ilp-kit code and run a node
2. Find other nodes to peer with
3. Do ILP-enabled transactions=
4. Win!

The ilp-kit is still pre-release and li= kely to have some bugs and change a lot so if you're keen to be an earl= y adopter and help test and contribute back to that project please do so. I= f you'd rather wait until the code stabilizes a bit then keep watching = the list and we'll let you know when the first Beta is available.

Please feel free to make contributions to the wiki. It w= ould be great if this was a community effort!

Adrian

_______________________________________________
Ledger mailing list
Ledger@ietf.org
https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ledger

--94eb2c05ede0c1df900540ce5528-- From 7daniel77@gmail.com Tue Nov 8 10:47:55 2016 Return-Path: <7daniel77@gmail.com> X-Original-To: ledger@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: ledger@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3A532129AB5 for ; Tue, 8 Nov 2016 10:47:55 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -0.034 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-0.034 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAD_CREDIT=2.415, BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, FREEMAIL_ENVFROM_END_DIGIT=0.25, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW=-0.7, SPF_PASS=-0.001] autolearn=no autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=gmail.com Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id L_cvL-MMF7gB for ; Tue, 8 Nov 2016 10:47:53 -0800 (PST) Received: from mail-yw0-x22e.google.com (mail-yw0-x22e.google.com [IPv6:2607:f8b0:4002:c05::22e]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 2CE8B129D21 for ; Tue, 8 Nov 2016 10:47:53 -0800 (PST) Received: by mail-yw0-x22e.google.com with SMTP id r204so190010082ywb.0 for ; Tue, 08 Nov 2016 10:47:53 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20120113; h=mime-version:in-reply-to:references:from:date:message-id:subject:to :cc; bh=K7znVxcWMvZWzIMkt7kEqhihicq8EhMjORYHRqrobCM=; b=s74042dhVdLNNTMydRsluT0Hx5+KP16KCp1j5ONjhy4VzCO7cZpH8VtQKjnPmBVf17 NwB2Z1LAIA/ynToQr08qd4iHOSKxqsaAm/ovxVEJh3FXm3ohTMZ4wlX564r9PmuBPk9a mfIzR2zajUkHSKOIM1VznPl6LTS34JuoFGqaCNPb3F95ROn7CYRM/7XvAMb2x+gkzBgR Nl9F0qFlMOApW8RyCTc6Jo+dU0vAc5CA4SXTMxwIXts5LT8kNr5dNhhIkVEst9WOLfot 5ore4WzGxWMXxYANXfWy/FmVtF5bEH/55y0Yel9eI+73raR7CejHgAPRlBdGF+PxuIbi WhEA== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20130820; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:in-reply-to:references:from:date :message-id:subject:to:cc; bh=K7znVxcWMvZWzIMkt7kEqhihicq8EhMjORYHRqrobCM=; b=hcyg2/TCDQTXWy4sC2hfrKJnxHMcmYiacwb1S53+3JCkA4pv70d23zLujwUYvax1FG zPaDceWhtyyakxGgO2cs5dIdkuQFbwVFL/1JswgAC1ZrzAHrix+ouJk+IpfbfYPgeRVx Thnm1FaHCAdOgXUmPrw6T5Ks3am5tWbuOqmzwMt7LfbmparptRwdicjrt0tHlZZlZxH+ wB3gktCeycVAnHXrC2QHZpf72STlyYy/xlHGDEVL/hwCnQYdktWTdTWAu4zZbPGH06Re YDR+gJi2ZkDYkaUsYh+mjSszj0yye6K3EW1IdFLDYXkQHGfd8IFOgA8y7FUmsfPzvgww /9Lw== X-Gm-Message-State: ABUngvcdu/fiK3cAjFkzcCc37nfuUk3kHnq6oxK+wN2kZckEnvwpKI3v/KImwtsL+g8UD5GFsfqdm15BH7h7FQ== X-Received: by 10.202.224.134 with SMTP id x128mr1351276oig.117.1478630872409; Tue, 08 Nov 2016 10:47:52 -0800 (PST) MIME-Version: 1.0 Received: by 10.157.41.195 with HTTP; Tue, 8 Nov 2016 10:47:51 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.157.41.195 with HTTP; Tue, 8 Nov 2016 10:47:51 -0800 (PST) In-Reply-To: References: From: Daniel Bateman <7daniel77@gmail.com> Date: Tue, 8 Nov 2016 11:47:51 -0700 Message-ID: To: Ryan Fugger , Adrian Hope-Bailie Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary=001a113d3010e76be60540ce93a9 Archived-At: X-Mailman-Approved-At: Tue, 08 Nov 2016 10:50:45 -0800 Cc: Interledger Community Group , Interledger Mailing List - IETF Subject: Re: [Ledger] Bootstrapping Interledger X-BeenThere: ledger@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.17 Precedence: list List-Id: "Discussion of interledger, originally a protocol stack for moving digital assets \(making payments\) between accounts operating on different payment networks or ledgers." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 08 Nov 2016 18:49:23 -0000 --001a113d3010e76be60540ce93a9 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 Excellent, thank you Adrian. And thank you Ryan for your original vision for Ripple. Perhaps what is needed now is a step-by-step guide? "How to run an Interledger connector" Daniel On Nov 8, 2016 11:32 AM, "Ryan Fugger" wrote: > This is great Adrian. My plan was always to evolve Ripplepay.com into a > decentralized system like this. If you or anyone is interested in > upgrading or otherwise using that creeky old system to help support > bootstrapping Interledger, I'd be happy to help out however I can. > > On Tue, Nov 8, 2016 at 12:56 AM, Adrian Hope-Bailie > wrote: > >> When the Internet was first emerging and large university and research >> networks were coming together on the back of the Internet Protocol the >> challenge for everyday users was how they could access this new network of >> networks without special permission or equipment. >> >> We face a similar challenge with ILP in that very few of the ledgers >> accessible to us support the one function that is critical to universal ILP >> payments; real-time conditional transfers. (I wrote a bit about conditional >> transfer here: https://medium.com/@ahopebailie/the-power-of-conditional- >> payments-2d1ea531250a) >> >> So, just like the pioneers of the Internet we're improvising! >> >> "Dial-up" interledger enables us to bootstrap the Interledger using >> "virtual" ledgers between connectors that have established a bounded >> trusted relationship. >> >> In other words, if I run a small connector and I trust my friend Stefan >> who also runs a connector then we can transact without needing an >> ILP-enabled ledger between us. >> >> We establish a credit limit that we are both comfortable with and agree >> on a way to settle our positions as required (via Bitcoin, bank transfer or >> even cash). >> >> Consider what will happen if we build a community of people who are all >> establishing similar peering relationships and then introduce ILP-enabled >> ledgers to bridge any gaps between connectors that don't know one another. >> Very soon we'll have an entirely new payments network where payments flow >> like information does on the Internet today. >> >> We're calling this project the Interledger Bootstrap Project and I've >> started capturing some thoughts on the project wiki: >> https://github.com/interledgerjs/ilp-kit/wiki >> >> In short: >> 1. Get the ilp-kit code and run a node >> 2. Find other nodes to peer with >> 3. Do ILP-enabled transactions >> 4. Win! >> >> The ilp-kit is still pre-release and likely to have some bugs and change >> a lot so if you're keen to be an early adopter and help test and contribute >> back to that project please do so. If you'd rather wait until the code >> stabilizes a bit then keep watching the list and we'll let you know when >> the first Beta is available. >> >> Please feel free to make contributions to the wiki. It would be great if >> this was a community effort! >> >> Adrian >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Ledger mailing list >> Ledger@ietf.org >> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ledger >> >> > --001a113d3010e76be60540ce93a9 Content-Type: text/html; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

Excellent, thank you Adrian.

And thank you Ryan for your original vision for Ripple.

Perhaps what is needed now is a step-by-step guide? "Ho= w to run an Interledger connector"

Daniel

On Nov 8, 2016 11:32 AM, "Ryan Fugger"= <arv@ryanfugger.com> wrote= :
T= his is great Adrian.=C2=A0 My plan was always to evolve Ripplepay.com into = a decentralized system like this.=C2=A0 If you or anyone is interested in u= pgrading or otherwise using that creeky old system to help support bootstra= pping Interledger, I'd be happy to help out however I can.

On Tue, Nov 8, 2016 = at 12:56 AM, Adrian Hope-Bailie <adrian@hopebailie.com> = wrote:
When the Internet was first emerging and large university and research networks were coming together on the back of the Internet Protocol the challenge for everyday users was how they=20 could access this new network of networks without special permission or=20 equipment.

We face a similar challenge with ILP in that= =20 very few of the ledgers accessible to us support the one function that=20 is critical to universal ILP payments; real-time conditional transfers. (I = wrote a bit about conditional transfer here: https://medium.com/@ahopebailie/the-power-of-conditional-paym= ents-2d1ea531250a)

So, just like the pioneers of the Internet we= 're improvising!

"Dial-up" interledger enables us to b= ootstrap the=20 Interledger using "virtual" ledgers between connectors that have= =20 established a bounded trusted relationship.

In other words, if I=20 run a small connector and I trust my friend Stefan who also runs a=20 connector then we can transact without needing an ILP-enabled ledger=20 between us.

We establish a credit limit that we are both comfortable= =20 with and agree on a way to settle our positions as required (via=20 Bitcoin, bank transfer or even cash).

Consider what will happen if w= e build a=20 community of people who are all establishing similar peering=20 relationships and then introduce ILP-enabled ledgers to bridge any gaps=20 between connectors that don't know one another. Very soon we'll hav= e an=20 entirely new payments network where payments flow like information does=20 on the Internet today.

We're calling this project the Inte= rledger Bootstrap Project and I've started capturing some thoughts on t= he project wiki: https://github.com/interledgerjs/ilp-kit/wiki
In short:
1. Get the ilp-kit code and run a node
2. Find other nodes to peer with
3. Do ILP-enabled transactions=
4. Win!

The ilp-kit is still pre-release and li= kely to have some bugs and change a lot so if you're keen to be an earl= y adopter and help test and contribute back to that project please do so. I= f you'd rather wait until the code stabilizes a bit then keep watching = the list and we'll let you know when the first Beta is available.

Please feel free to make contributions to the wiki. It w= ould be great if this was a community effort!

Adrian
<= /div>

_______________________________________________
Ledger mailing list
Ledger@ietf.org https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ledger

--001a113d3010e76be60540ce93a9-- From nobody Wed Nov 9 09:51:28 2016 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ledger@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: ledger@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id CC32C12941C for ; Wed, 9 Nov 2016 09:51:26 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -0.284 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-0.284 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAD_CREDIT=2.415, BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW=-0.7, SPF_PASS=-0.001] autolearn=no autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=gmail.com Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id K0iRR1bCf498 for ; Wed, 9 Nov 2016 09:51:21 -0800 (PST) Received: from mail-it0-x22f.google.com (mail-it0-x22f.google.com [IPv6:2607:f8b0:4001:c0b::22f]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 0B3BF129573 for ; Wed, 9 Nov 2016 09:51:21 -0800 (PST) Received: by mail-it0-x22f.google.com with SMTP id q124so172625033itd.1 for ; Wed, 09 Nov 2016 09:51:21 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20120113; h=mime-version:in-reply-to:references:from:date:message-id:subject:to; bh=ycf0tUOMFZy56qWNVAT49Uv2Aw86CFauR4FxVdrraCM=; b=bRSpwRtuwFAwjpIuXRSCzrMl6+MIjAnTrH9DJKKjyVHjb6KMhqn0yNKK2v8mtEazq6 evJuhmrm4t+lUY6seaJ0bd6PmhN+KBiRfhsNbkN/e9KUNV1dsLPUFPLG701/ZKYIO4Jt M4S+8D2N4F0sFkf6mjWyOvSSqNl7d2JlZbvh1QrMYP6wYhF7BZ9v3NroxMP+nwJSxviP J/7TXhBV8Rvhr7946A/B3s4KOGpG4qwjpe3VcUopKViPoJe2uGfnvyLLZGKWReJP4JEi nZcibAHbEGHNvFFAXVG/c/IlLsBOgFq3ZWVYPYAWQxfkVj+SxtsUdu4BmQk01IJ3mwuM EeAw== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20130820; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:in-reply-to:references:from:date :message-id:subject:to; bh=ycf0tUOMFZy56qWNVAT49Uv2Aw86CFauR4FxVdrraCM=; b=bL8Ey1oPaC6aEn00yDZgUAS96RYhcWhrqgLATenPs1N3DDaq3IN2zO15P+E5Wl3jID YuXaOMOUkWypiVU1vEQZn9WmZR5CcNK6pizfFps54wJSlVxsQt2Rs4Vs10QMRdLN2JzF 8jTJ62ihdi2BKqX6fnY8uj+c7B+E/+KhVYt+bGk75NFtvTe9fhl7Py40xad/DVaTyXem pp+Q0wrCXqdpBW01d2ocTjXZmG/6/VzRm8CBKQUPGAbKn3h3nroSbuoM9oqq+7sdSS7W M7xK4x7cGDktlUL1lHAa6ZVEvX4QMJE4uu3Lt8KleOomTL6inBXMq0aOdSxKF2iQliVA AugA== X-Gm-Message-State: ABUngvehdlgDbBDtm7nrRtwGI0BefGDEsReU4isI3+H6I54JltoocNt5thTnzoZTPbPyHXdOdhrMRzJIbsjl2A== X-Received: by 10.107.56.9 with SMTP id f9mr1506844ioa.105.1478713880290; Wed, 09 Nov 2016 09:51:20 -0800 (PST) MIME-Version: 1.0 Received: by 10.50.96.194 with HTTP; Wed, 9 Nov 2016 09:50:59 -0800 (PST) In-Reply-To: References: From: Tom Haas Date: Wed, 9 Nov 2016 09:50:59 -0800 Message-ID: To: ledger@ietf.org, public-interledger@w3.org Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary=001a114ab9ca8f2bef0540e1e783 Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Ledger] Bootstrapping Interledger X-BeenThere: ledger@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.17 Precedence: list List-Id: "Discussion of interledger, originally a protocol stack for moving digital assets \(making payments\) between accounts operating on different payment networks or ledgers." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 09 Nov 2016 17:51:27 -0000 --001a114ab9ca8f2bef0540e1e783 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 This is great and I'm excited to see Interledger get off the ground. Congrats to Adrian and all of the ILP developers involved! Perhaps this is better as a separate thread, but what sort of regulations should those who run virtual ledgers be thinking about? At the moment, we're talking about small p2p networks. But if I want to run a Bitcoin exchange or Ripple gateway in the United States, there are a number of KYC/AML regulations, possibly bitlicenses, and other things I have to worry about (including banking, which is not trivial for those doing business in the cryptocurrency ecosystem). What of this applies to running a virtual ledger in a p2p network? As an individual without many resources, how do I deal with the potential legal and financial pitfalls of running a virtual ledger? Just want to get the conversation started. Best, Tom On Tue, Nov 8, 2016 at 10:47 AM, Daniel Bateman <7daniel77@gmail.com> wrote: > Excellent, thank you Adrian. > > And thank you Ryan for your original vision for Ripple. > > Perhaps what is needed now is a step-by-step guide? "How to run an > Interledger connector" > > Daniel > On Nov 8, 2016 11:32 AM, "Ryan Fugger" wrote: > >> This is great Adrian. My plan was always to evolve Ripplepay.com into a >> decentralized system like this. If you or anyone is interested in >> upgrading or otherwise using that creeky old system to help support >> bootstrapping Interledger, I'd be happy to help out however I can. >> >> On Tue, Nov 8, 2016 at 12:56 AM, Adrian Hope-Bailie < >> adrian@hopebailie.com> wrote: >> >>> When the Internet was first emerging and large university and research >>> networks were coming together on the back of the Internet Protocol the >>> challenge for everyday users was how they could access this new network of >>> networks without special permission or equipment. >>> >>> We face a similar challenge with ILP in that very few of the ledgers >>> accessible to us support the one function that is critical to universal ILP >>> payments; real-time conditional transfers. (I wrote a bit about conditional >>> transfer here: https://medium.com/@ahopebaili >>> e/the-power-of-conditional-payments-2d1ea531250a) >>> >>> So, just like the pioneers of the Internet we're improvising! >>> >>> "Dial-up" interledger enables us to bootstrap the Interledger using >>> "virtual" ledgers between connectors that have established a bounded >>> trusted relationship. >>> >>> In other words, if I run a small connector and I trust my friend Stefan >>> who also runs a connector then we can transact without needing an >>> ILP-enabled ledger between us. >>> >>> We establish a credit limit that we are both comfortable with and agree >>> on a way to settle our positions as required (via Bitcoin, bank transfer or >>> even cash). >>> >>> Consider what will happen if we build a community of people who are all >>> establishing similar peering relationships and then introduce ILP-enabled >>> ledgers to bridge any gaps between connectors that don't know one another. >>> Very soon we'll have an entirely new payments network where payments flow >>> like information does on the Internet today. >>> >>> We're calling this project the Interledger Bootstrap Project and I've >>> started capturing some thoughts on the project wiki: >>> https://github.com/interledgerjs/ilp-kit/wiki >>> >>> In short: >>> 1. Get the ilp-kit code and run a node >>> 2. Find other nodes to peer with >>> 3. Do ILP-enabled transactions >>> 4. Win! >>> >>> The ilp-kit is still pre-release and likely to have some bugs and change >>> a lot so if you're keen to be an early adopter and help test and contribute >>> back to that project please do so. If you'd rather wait until the code >>> stabilizes a bit then keep watching the list and we'll let you know when >>> the first Beta is available. >>> >>> Please feel free to make contributions to the wiki. It would be great if >>> this was a community effort! >>> >>> Adrian >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> Ledger mailing list >>> Ledger@ietf.org >>> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ledger >>> >>> >> --001a114ab9ca8f2bef0540e1e783 Content-Type: text/html; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
This is great and I'm excited to see Interledger get o= ff the ground. Congrats to Adrian and all of the ILP developers involved!
Perhaps this is better as a separate thread, but what sor= t of regulations should those who run virtual ledgers be thinking about? At= the moment, we're talking about small p2p networks. But if I want to r= un a Bitcoin exchange or Ripple gateway in the United States, there are a n= umber of KYC/AML regulations, possibly bitlicenses, and other things I have= to worry about (including banking, which is not trivial for those doing bu= siness in the cryptocurrency ecosystem). What of this applies to running a = virtual ledger in a p2p network?

As an individual = without many resources, how do I deal with the potential legal and financia= l pitfalls of running a virtual ledger? Just want to get the conversation s= tarted.

Best,

Tom



On Tue, Nov 8, 2016 at 10:47 AM, Daniel Bateman <7dani= el77@gmail.com> wrote:

Excellent, thank you Adrian.

And thank you Ryan for your original vision for Ripple.

Perhaps what is needed now is a step-by-step guide? "Ho= w to run an Interledger connector"

Daniel

On Nov 8, 2016 11:32 AM, "Ryan Fugger"= <arv@ryanfugger= .com> wrote:
=
This is great Adrian.=C2=A0 My plan was always to evolve R= ipplepay.com into a decentralized system like this.=C2=A0 If you or anyone = is interested in upgrading or otherwise using that creeky old system to hel= p support bootstrapping Interledger, I'd be happy to help out however I= can.

On= Tue, Nov 8, 2016 at 12:56 AM, Adrian Hope-Bailie <adrian@hopebailie.c= om> wrote:
When the Internet was first emerging an= d large university and research networks were coming together on the back of the Internet Protocol the challenge for everyday users was how they=20 could access this new network of networks without special permission or=20 equipment.

We face a similar challenge with ILP in that= =20 very few of the ledgers accessible to us support the one function that=20 is critical to universal ILP payments; real-time conditional transfers. (I = wrote a bit about conditional transfer here: https://medium.com/@ahopebailie/the-power-of-conditional-paym= ents-2d1ea531250a)

So, just like the pioneers of the Internet we= 're improvising!

"Dial-up" interledger enables us to b= ootstrap the=20 Interledger using "virtual" ledgers between connectors that have= =20 established a bounded trusted relationship.

In other words, if I=20 run a small connector and I trust my friend Stefan who also runs a=20 connector then we can transact without needing an ILP-enabled ledger=20 between us.

We establish a credit limit that we are both comfortable= =20 with and agree on a way to settle our positions as required (via=20 Bitcoin, bank transfer or even cash).

Consider what will happen if w= e build a=20 community of people who are all establishing similar peering=20 relationships and then introduce ILP-enabled ledgers to bridge any gaps=20 between connectors that don't know one another. Very soon we'll hav= e an=20 entirely new payments network where payments flow like information does=20 on the Internet today.

We're calling this project the Inte= rledger Bootstrap Project and I've started capturing some thoughts on t= he project wiki: https://github.com/interledgerjs/ilp-kit/wiki
In short:
1. Get the ilp-kit code and run a node
2. Find other nodes to peer with
3. Do ILP-enabled transactions=
4. Win!

The ilp-kit is still pre-release and li= kely to have some bugs and change a lot so if you're keen to be an earl= y adopter and help test and contribute back to that project please do so. I= f you'd rather wait until the code stabilizes a bit then keep watching = the list and we'll let you know when the first Beta is available.

Please feel free to make contributions to the wiki. It w= ould be great if this was a community effort!

Adrian

_______________________________________________
Ledger mailing list
Ledger@ietf.org https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ledger


--001a114ab9ca8f2bef0540e1e783-- From nobody Wed Nov 9 11:48:08 2016 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ledger@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: ledger@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id F1FB912945E for ; Wed, 9 Nov 2016 11:48:06 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -0.284 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-0.284 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAD_CREDIT=2.415, BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW=-0.7, SPF_PASS=-0.001] autolearn=no autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=gmail.com Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id t-8H4-C-mH0h for ; Wed, 9 Nov 2016 11:48:01 -0800 (PST) Received: from mail-it0-x22c.google.com (mail-it0-x22c.google.com [IPv6:2607:f8b0:4001:c0b::22c]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 0B554129441 for ; Wed, 9 Nov 2016 11:48:01 -0800 (PST) Received: by mail-it0-x22c.google.com with SMTP id q124so179798880itd.1 for ; Wed, 09 Nov 2016 11:48:01 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20120113; h=mime-version:in-reply-to:references:from:date:message-id:subject:to :cc; bh=VNR1+7PXXFW95KxHKh6DUCVG7IZsGABnUT/ysOCOkKE=; b=Z0EhWN+LxBYajuUJsnZfzJIo+5izpj7O04yheSI5JDOxrg8rAm+EWsAOv/1vdclwl+ 9+bXKyBiJtSKmhDvHhRfb8z7dKy1IT6OEg0SflL4H5gF1kYL03L0x0MqvpmfH20epN8l +M8rzTNwUWUQglEsQnykt607DSPstQQtfUYXLz4IEIUoshBQLv6mw9CxwL77OV6BfO6L rQevgPzmNyiWOK7biKPIFLB5RRVccJhHj8McGlyov6k83hbzBPCtK1Xo7d5HhLqQukPU 1L2Nubd2iIqspVNz0vHTeKxmkPskqaonV5lpweykvEhTG+am9gZgqxrjhhNtsMEsqRXl zR7Q== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20130820; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:in-reply-to:references:from:date :message-id:subject:to:cc; bh=VNR1+7PXXFW95KxHKh6DUCVG7IZsGABnUT/ysOCOkKE=; b=PD7hBz0lSUqUhEIcaESOtT1jbguTUwZFKR5m1iRbVt8/6dhWiwteU0tEWZUKPKSiZ3 fGOdK7nXllfqxRXiC+HR1nJsaLsUiqenwyIEaTSXUYWUz3GMf1RB53nmEB+n8IAO8wM3 A9NIQxrvFQu1fIM1s+ATIHMEKJplV8zLubQ+/kvcnTG6mfcjOGZtu7dPdxzkVoPbo6/S CZnwuxFR+Z71hYrBsDm4DjlWcVZ9D+nJX5p6PZYA6flI8rXBLmyuh6sT6HaihUHA6zT0 gOvmxwypw/qxiJHhQHItkLZZjoM6vnACT0PaFNYzW25ZlT2Fq+4s2rcavVhb5QNb8ptS skMQ== X-Gm-Message-State: ABUngvddPpnTVLNgnYpFWUO9JIBbpFJAvNeA2vti3UfyR4/ycpMhuGMdSa8YuLlS7LVPQviz6TLfKC60gCg2YA== X-Received: by 10.202.83.202 with SMTP id h193mr1042657oib.106.1478720877432; Wed, 09 Nov 2016 11:47:57 -0800 (PST) MIME-Version: 1.0 Received: by 10.182.221.201 with HTTP; Wed, 9 Nov 2016 11:47:17 -0800 (PST) In-Reply-To: References: From: Paul Frazee Date: Wed, 9 Nov 2016 13:47:17 -0600 Message-ID: To: Andrew Bransford Brown Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary=001a1147d7dc9f1a980540e38865 Archived-At: Cc: Tom Haas , Interledger Community Group , Interledger Mailing List - IETF Subject: Re: [Ledger] Bootstrapping Interledger X-BeenThere: ledger@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.17 Precedence: list List-Id: "Discussion of interledger, originally a protocol stack for moving digital assets \(making payments\) between accounts operating on different payment networks or ledgers." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 09 Nov 2016 19:48:07 -0000 --001a1147d7dc9f1a980540e38865 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 What about test nodes that exchange fake currencies only? Would that A) relax the regulatory requirements, B) be useful to ILP rollout? On Wed, Nov 9, 2016 at 1:42 PM, Andrew Bransford Brown wrote: > I'd suggest a State exchange to avoid SEC regulations while building the > market. Once you cross state lines, then pass the SEC regs. The Texas > Stock Market in San Antonio, for example. Some groundwork has been > completed. > > A simple protocol is required that will handle the contracts with > sufficient granularity. See the attached for what I term a "transaction > stack". It breaks the Offer and Terms, so Bid/Ask are contractually > identical. Faster and works for anything. > > Andrew B. Brown > (512) 947-8282 > http://KidsCourtyard.com > > > On Wed, Nov 9, 2016 at 12:50 PM, Tom Haas wrote: > >> This is great and I'm excited to see Interledger get off the ground. >> Congrats to Adrian and all of the ILP developers involved! >> >> Perhaps this is better as a separate thread, but what sort of regulations >> should those who run virtual ledgers be thinking about? At the moment, >> we're talking about small p2p networks. But if I want to run a Bitcoin >> exchange or Ripple gateway in the United States, there are a number of >> KYC/AML regulations, possibly bitlicenses, and other things I have to worry >> about (including banking, which is not trivial for those doing business in >> the cryptocurrency ecosystem). What of this applies to running a virtual >> ledger in a p2p network? >> >> As an individual without many resources, how do I deal with the potential >> legal and financial pitfalls of running a virtual ledger? Just want to get >> the conversation started. >> >> Best, >> >> Tom >> >> >> >> On Tue, Nov 8, 2016 at 10:47 AM, Daniel Bateman <7daniel77@gmail.com> >> wrote: >> >>> Excellent, thank you Adrian. >>> >>> And thank you Ryan for your original vision for Ripple. >>> >>> Perhaps what is needed now is a step-by-step guide? "How to run an >>> Interledger connector" >>> >>> Daniel >>> On Nov 8, 2016 11:32 AM, "Ryan Fugger" >> > wrote: >>> >>>> This is great Adrian. My plan was always to evolve Ripplepay.com into >>>> a decentralized system like this. If you or anyone is interested in >>>> upgrading or otherwise using that creeky old system to help support >>>> bootstrapping Interledger, I'd be happy to help out however I can. >>>> >>>> On Tue, Nov 8, 2016 at 12:56 AM, Adrian Hope-Bailie < >>>> adrian@hopebailie.com> wrote: >>>> >>>>> When the Internet was first emerging and large university and research >>>>> networks were coming together on the back of the Internet Protocol the >>>>> challenge for everyday users was how they could access this new network of >>>>> networks without special permission or equipment. >>>>> >>>>> We face a similar challenge with ILP in that very few of the ledgers >>>>> accessible to us support the one function that is critical to universal ILP >>>>> payments; real-time conditional transfers. (I wrote a bit about conditional >>>>> transfer here: https://medium.com/@ahopebaili >>>>> e/the-power-of-conditional-payments-2d1ea531250a) >>>>> >>>>> So, just like the pioneers of the Internet we're improvising! >>>>> >>>>> "Dial-up" interledger enables us to bootstrap the Interledger using >>>>> "virtual" ledgers between connectors that have established a bounded >>>>> trusted relationship. >>>>> >>>>> In other words, if I run a small connector and I trust my friend >>>>> Stefan who also runs a connector then we can transact without needing an >>>>> ILP-enabled ledger between us. >>>>> >>>>> We establish a credit limit that we are both comfortable with and >>>>> agree on a way to settle our positions as required (via Bitcoin, bank >>>>> transfer or even cash). >>>>> >>>>> Consider what will happen if we build a community of people who are >>>>> all establishing similar peering relationships and then introduce >>>>> ILP-enabled ledgers to bridge any gaps between connectors that don't know >>>>> one another. Very soon we'll have an entirely new payments network where >>>>> payments flow like information does on the Internet today. >>>>> >>>>> We're calling this project the Interledger Bootstrap Project and I've >>>>> started capturing some thoughts on the project wiki: >>>>> https://github.com/interledgerjs/ilp-kit/wiki >>>>> >>>>> In short: >>>>> 1. Get the ilp-kit code and run a node >>>>> 2. Find other nodes to peer with >>>>> 3. Do ILP-enabled transactions >>>>> 4. Win! >>>>> >>>>> The ilp-kit is still pre-release and likely to have some bugs and >>>>> change a lot so if you're keen to be an early adopter and help test and >>>>> contribute back to that project please do so. If you'd rather wait until >>>>> the code stabilizes a bit then keep watching the list and we'll let you >>>>> know when the first Beta is available. >>>>> >>>>> Please feel free to make contributions to the wiki. It would be great >>>>> if this was a community effort! >>>>> >>>>> Adrian >>>>> >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> Ledger mailing list >>>>> Ledger@ietf.org >>>>> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ledger >>>>> >>>>> >>>> >> > --001a1147d7dc9f1a980540e38865 Content-Type: text/html; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
What about test nodes that exchange fake currencies only? = Would that A) relax the regulatory requirements, B) be useful to ILP rollou= t?

On Wed, N= ov 9, 2016 at 1:42 PM, Andrew Bransford Brown <andrewbb@gmail.com>= wrote:
I'd s= uggest a State exchange to avoid SEC regulations while building the market.= =C2=A0 Once you cross state lines, then pass the SEC regs.=C2=A0 The Texas = Stock Market in San Antonio, for example.=C2=A0 Some groundwork has been co= mpleted.

A simple protocol is required that will handle = the contracts with sufficient granularity.=C2=A0 See the attached for what = I term a "transaction stack".=C2=A0 It breaks the Offer and Terms= , so Bid/Ask are contractually identical.=C2=A0 Faster and works for anythi= ng.

Andrew B. Brown
(512) 947-8282
<= a href=3D"http://KidsCourtyard.com" target=3D"_blank">http://KidsCourtyard.= com


On Wed, Nov 9, 2016 at 12:50 PM, Tom Haas <t= jhaas@gmail.com> wrote:
This is great and I'm excited to see Interledger get off = the ground. Congrats to Adrian and all of the ILP developers involved!
=
Perhaps this is better as a separate thread, but what sort o= f regulations should those who run virtual ledgers be thinking about? At th= e moment, we're talking about small p2p networks. But if I want to run = a Bitcoin exchange or Ripple gateway in the United States, there are a numb= er of KYC/AML regulations, possibly bitlicenses, and other things I have to= worry about (including banking, which is not trivial for those doing busin= ess in the cryptocurrency ecosystem). What of this applies to running a vir= tual ledger in a p2p network?

As an individual wit= hout many resources, how do I deal with the potential legal and financial p= itfalls of running a virtual ledger? Just want to get the conversation star= ted.

Best,

Tom
=


On Tue, Nov 8, 2016 at 10:47 AM, Daniel Bateman <7da= niel77@gmail.com> wrote:

Excellent, thank you Adrian.

And thank you Ryan for your original vision for Ripple.

Perhaps what is needed now is a step-by-step guide? "Ho= w to run an Interledger connector"

Daniel

On Nov 8, 2016 11:32 AM, "Ryan Fugger"= <arv@ryanfugger= ..com> wrote:
This is great Adrian.=C2=A0 My plan was always to evolve = Ripplepay.com into a decentralized system like this.=C2=A0 If you or anyone= is interested in upgrading or otherwise using that creeky old system to he= lp support bootstrapping Interledger, I'd be happy to help out however = I can.

O= n Tue, Nov 8, 2016 at 12:56 AM, Adrian Hope-Bailie <adrian@hopebailie.= com> wrote:
When the Internet was first emerging a= nd large university and research networks were coming together on the back of the Internet Protocol the challenge for everyday users was how they=20 could access this new network of networks without special permission or=20 equipment.

We face a similar challenge with ILP in that= =20 very few of the ledgers accessible to us support the one function that=20 is critical to universal ILP payments; real-time conditional transfers. (I = wrote a bit about conditional transfer here: https://medium.com/@ahopebailie/the-power-of-conditional-paym= ents-2d1ea531250a)

So, just like the pioneers of the Internet we= 're improvising!

"Dial-up" interledger enables us to b= ootstrap the=20 Interledger using "virtual" ledgers between connectors that have= =20 established a bounded trusted relationship.

In other words, if I=20 run a small connector and I trust my friend Stefan who also runs a=20 connector then we can transact without needing an ILP-enabled ledger=20 between us.

We establish a credit limit that we are both comfortable= =20 with and agree on a way to settle our positions as required (via=20 Bitcoin, bank transfer or even cash).

Consider what will happen if w= e build a=20 community of people who are all establishing similar peering=20 relationships and then introduce ILP-enabled ledgers to bridge any gaps=20 between connectors that don't know one another. Very soon we'll hav= e an=20 entirely new payments network where payments flow like information does=20 on the Internet today.

We're calling this project the Inte= rledger Bootstrap Project and I've started capturing some thoughts on t= he project wiki: https://github.com/interledgerjs/ilp-kit/wiki
In short:
1. Get the ilp-kit code and run a node
2. Find other nodes to peer with
3. Do ILP-enabled transactions=
4. Win!

The ilp-kit is still pre-release and li= kely to have some bugs and change a lot so if you're keen to be an earl= y adopter and help test and contribute back to that project please do so. I= f you'd rather wait until the code stabilizes a bit then keep watching = the list and we'll let you know when the first Beta is available.

Please feel free to make contributions to the wiki. It w= ould be great if this was a community effort!

<= /div>
Adrian
=

_______________________________________________
Ledger mailing list
Ledger@ietf.org https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ledger




--001a1147d7dc9f1a980540e38865-- From andrewbb@gmail.com Wed Nov 9 11:42:24 2016 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ledger@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: ledger@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id EC5341296EE for ; Wed, 9 Nov 2016 11:42:23 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -0.284 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-0.284 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAD_CREDIT=2.415, BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW=-0.7, SPF_PASS=-0.001] autolearn=no autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=gmail.com Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id g5d9IAlF_AMC for ; Wed, 9 Nov 2016 11:42:21 -0800 (PST) Received: from mail-vk0-x22b.google.com (mail-vk0-x22b.google.com [IPv6:2607:f8b0:400c:c05::22b]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 8A60E1296E8 for ; Wed, 9 Nov 2016 11:42:20 -0800 (PST) Received: by mail-vk0-x22b.google.com with SMTP id 137so137333933vkl.0 for ; Wed, 09 Nov 2016 11:42:20 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20120113; h=mime-version:in-reply-to:references:from:date:message-id:subject:to :cc; bh=ZiRJzw4AGdhxhkjALvabpA6W/L2CxdrPwqCRQ59WWQM=; b=ccdDJNVR2rxZ2w+LAXddAScjBJ8C0/PEzkpVtrns4Scha8R8aC5XrNw9pRsRvr/MJj 4AwSaCMeQnacw2LuUl/k1e7I51eCBrVGv/6WYPByP8RNbT59RE+13t1WF7dxKjZ98ME+ 7JHkti/6vVx8ER6NxpGSzjKkqQlvy7UYPAsu4U0rM8vJ0C9n4+GrJQTQOyELIjiZ7PGN Uw1zPJIVaivenW7uo4kRW7HUPjWplVFVZzM0X5X0aZ9gFe7J6jT35RKCQiIPxHgoC/2i 3YIvVBColRkX0raO8Tl797+0mbezOK5Q/DuommfVkXWQBHn+rnbQEEkxDuVlggpupnej pqtA== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20130820; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:in-reply-to:references:from:date :message-id:subject:to:cc; bh=ZiRJzw4AGdhxhkjALvabpA6W/L2CxdrPwqCRQ59WWQM=; b=SjDLTUvbt6MpR0Lvt1Eh8u6QsGGRfvnrTCtISDJNhSn/+ppANzMgRnDS4Rnw7IRvVe Lq+B3B4bbxv7MiCW7hpWiC1cv0sRizozXqkWN7oLe2q+HSI6rEbjJa9Q3KE7DReRsYOO mGfqQ9GkyhYHu4f1LTS/dtCXhXI3HDxSntrQLrqn9tS6eWJmcKy22iyxBZDc/WJXbu/D WBUvVAkz+38q2xZtkrZeh+kTfaKIfIaDlq66CkBnmLpHKPXwUWkLsmYS/S8fTYMrGhOp 6Og/EhTfR+EqqHWybK3W77zjezK6mB5WXxyB0Etw1QIRSLX2c/Ike/zm/mY1So0ufLFc liUg== X-Gm-Message-State: ABUngvd7xnOFXdzvuSXcOWoGwhaOCefp8Jk49h5VrHxzy1vFA10yvXdkEygdPLfZ1axmMW7TkffYJdvmCYAS6A== X-Received: by 10.31.199.195 with SMTP id x186mr840111vkf.128.1478720539603; Wed, 09 Nov 2016 11:42:19 -0800 (PST) MIME-Version: 1.0 Received: by 10.176.0.168 with HTTP; Wed, 9 Nov 2016 11:42:18 -0800 (PST) In-Reply-To: References: From: Andrew Bransford Brown Date: Wed, 9 Nov 2016 14:42:18 -0500 Message-ID: To: Tom Haas Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary=001a114850d47c54b80540e3749c Archived-At: X-Mailman-Approved-At: Wed, 09 Nov 2016 11:55:32 -0800 Cc: Interledger Community Group , ledger@ietf.org Subject: Re: [Ledger] Bootstrapping Interledger X-BeenThere: ledger@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.17 Precedence: list List-Id: "Discussion of interledger, originally a protocol stack for moving digital assets \(making payments\) between accounts operating on different payment networks or ledgers." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 09 Nov 2016 19:52:52 -0000 --001a114850d47c54b80540e3749c Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary=001a114850d47c54b20540e3749a --001a114850d47c54b20540e3749a Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 I'd suggest a State exchange to avoid SEC regulations while building the market. Once you cross state lines, then pass the SEC regs. The Texas Stock Market in San Antonio, for example. Some groundwork has been completed. A simple protocol is required that will handle the contracts with sufficient granularity. See the attached for what I term a "transaction stack". It breaks the Offer and Terms, so Bid/Ask are contractually identical. Faster and works for anything. Andrew B. Brown (512) 947-8282 http://KidsCourtyard.com On Wed, Nov 9, 2016 at 12:50 PM, Tom Haas wrote: > This is great and I'm excited to see Interledger get off the ground. > Congrats to Adrian and all of the ILP developers involved! > > Perhaps this is better as a separate thread, but what sort of regulations > should those who run virtual ledgers be thinking about? At the moment, > we're talking about small p2p networks. But if I want to run a Bitcoin > exchange or Ripple gateway in the United States, there are a number of > KYC/AML regulations, possibly bitlicenses, and other things I have to worry > about (including banking, which is not trivial for those doing business in > the cryptocurrency ecosystem). What of this applies to running a virtual > ledger in a p2p network? > > As an individual without many resources, how do I deal with the potential > legal and financial pitfalls of running a virtual ledger? Just want to get > the conversation started. > > Best, > > Tom > > > > On Tue, Nov 8, 2016 at 10:47 AM, Daniel Bateman <7daniel77@gmail.com> > wrote: > >> Excellent, thank you Adrian. >> >> And thank you Ryan for your original vision for Ripple. >> >> Perhaps what is needed now is a step-by-step guide? "How to run an >> Interledger connector" >> >> Daniel >> On Nov 8, 2016 11:32 AM, "Ryan Fugger" > > wrote: >> >>> This is great Adrian. My plan was always to evolve Ripplepay.com into a >>> decentralized system like this. If you or anyone is interested in >>> upgrading or otherwise using that creeky old system to help support >>> bootstrapping Interledger, I'd be happy to help out however I can. >>> >>> On Tue, Nov 8, 2016 at 12:56 AM, Adrian Hope-Bailie < >>> adrian@hopebailie.com> wrote: >>> >>>> When the Internet was first emerging and large university and research >>>> networks were coming together on the back of the Internet Protocol the >>>> challenge for everyday users was how they could access this new network of >>>> networks without special permission or equipment. >>>> >>>> We face a similar challenge with ILP in that very few of the ledgers >>>> accessible to us support the one function that is critical to universal ILP >>>> payments; real-time conditional transfers. (I wrote a bit about conditional >>>> transfer here: https://medium.com/@ahopebaili >>>> e/the-power-of-conditional-payments-2d1ea531250a) >>>> >>>> So, just like the pioneers of the Internet we're improvising! >>>> >>>> "Dial-up" interledger enables us to bootstrap the Interledger using >>>> "virtual" ledgers between connectors that have established a bounded >>>> trusted relationship. >>>> >>>> In other words, if I run a small connector and I trust my friend Stefan >>>> who also runs a connector then we can transact without needing an >>>> ILP-enabled ledger between us. >>>> >>>> We establish a credit limit that we are both comfortable with and agree >>>> on a way to settle our positions as required (via Bitcoin, bank transfer or >>>> even cash). >>>> >>>> Consider what will happen if we build a community of people who are all >>>> establishing similar peering relationships and then introduce ILP-enabled >>>> ledgers to bridge any gaps between connectors that don't know one another. >>>> Very soon we'll have an entirely new payments network where payments flow >>>> like information does on the Internet today. >>>> >>>> We're calling this project the Interledger Bootstrap Project and I've >>>> started capturing some thoughts on the project wiki: >>>> https://github.com/interledgerjs/ilp-kit/wiki >>>> >>>> In short: >>>> 1. Get the ilp-kit code and run a node >>>> 2. Find other nodes to peer with >>>> 3. Do ILP-enabled transactions >>>> 4. Win! >>>> >>>> The ilp-kit is still pre-release and likely to have some bugs and >>>> change a lot so if you're keen to be an early adopter and help test and >>>> contribute back to that project please do so. If you'd rather wait until >>>> the code stabilizes a bit then keep watching the list and we'll let you >>>> know when the first Beta is available. >>>> >>>> Please feel free to make contributions to the wiki. It would be great >>>> if this was a community effort! >>>> >>>> Adrian >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> Ledger mailing list >>>> Ledger@ietf.org >>>> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ledger >>>> >>>> >>> > --001a114850d47c54b20540e3749a Content-Type: text/html; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
I'd suggest a State exchange to avoid SEC regulations = while building the market.=C2=A0 Once you cross state lines, then pass the = SEC regs.=C2=A0 The Texas Stock Market in San Antonio, for example.=C2=A0 S= ome groundwork has been completed.

A simple protocol is = required that will handle the contracts with sufficient granularity.=C2=A0 = See the attached for what I term a "transaction stack".=C2=A0 It = breaks the Offer and Terms, so Bid/Ask are contractually identical.=C2=A0 F= aster and works for anything.

Andrew B. Brown
(512) 947-8282

<= /div>

On Wed, Nov 9, 2016 at 12:50 PM, Tom Haas <t= jhaas@gmail.com> wrote:
This is great and I'm excited to see Interledger get off = the ground. Congrats to Adrian and all of the ILP developers involved!
=
Perhaps this is better as a separate thread, but what sort o= f regulations should those who run virtual ledgers be thinking about? At th= e moment, we're talking about small p2p networks. But if I want to run = a Bitcoin exchange or Ripple gateway in the United States, there are a numb= er of KYC/AML regulations, possibly bitlicenses, and other things I have to= worry about (including banking, which is not trivial for those doing busin= ess in the cryptocurrency ecosystem). What of this applies to running a vir= tual ledger in a p2p network?

As an individual wit= hout many resources, how do I deal with the potential legal and financial p= itfalls of running a virtual ledger? Just want to get the conversation star= ted.

Best,

Tom
=


On Tue, Nov 8, 2016 at 10:47 AM, Daniel Bate= man <7daniel77@gmail.com> wrote:

Excellent, thank you Adrian= .

And thank you Ryan for your original vision for Ripple.

Perhaps what is needed now is a step-by-step guide? "Ho= w to run an Interledger connector"

Daniel

On Nov 8, 2016 11:32 AM, "Ryan Fugger"= <arv@ryanfugger= ..com> wrote:
This is great Adrian.=C2=A0 My plan was always to evolve = Ripplepay.com into a decentralized system like this.=C2=A0 If you or anyone= is interested in upgrading or otherwise using that creeky old system to he= lp support bootstrapping Interledger, I'd be happy to help out however = I can.

O= n Tue, Nov 8, 2016 at 12:56 AM, Adrian Hope-Bailie <adrian@hopebailie.= com> wrote:
When the Internet was first emerging a= nd large university and research networks were coming together on the back of the Internet Protocol the challenge for everyday users was how they=20 could access this new network of networks without special permission or=20 equipment.

We face a similar challenge with ILP in that= =20 very few of the ledgers accessible to us support the one function that=20 is critical to universal ILP payments; real-time conditional transfers. (I = wrote a bit about conditional transfer here: https://medium.com/@ahopebailie/the-power-of-conditional-paym= ents-2d1ea531250a)

So, just like the pioneers of the Internet we= 're improvising!

"Dial-up" interledger enables us to b= ootstrap the=20 Interledger using "virtual" ledgers between connectors that have= =20 established a bounded trusted relationship.

In other words, if I=20 run a small connector and I trust my friend Stefan who also runs a=20 connector then we can transact without needing an ILP-enabled ledger=20 between us.

We establish a credit limit that we are both comfortable= =20 with and agree on a way to settle our positions as required (via=20 Bitcoin, bank transfer or even cash).

Consider what will happen if w= e build a=20 community of people who are all establishing similar peering=20 relationships and then introduce ILP-enabled ledgers to bridge any gaps=20 between connectors that don't know one another. Very soon we'll hav= e an=20 entirely new payments network where payments flow like information does=20 on the Internet today.

We're calling this project the Inte= rledger Bootstrap Project and I've started capturing some thoughts on t= he project wiki: https://github.com/interledgerjs/ilp-kit/wiki
In short:
1. Get the ilp-kit code and run a node
2. Find other nodes to peer with
3. Do ILP-enabled transactions=
4. Win!

The ilp-kit is still pre-release and li= kely to have some bugs and change a lot so if you're keen to be an earl= y adopter and help test and contribute back to that project please do so. I= f you'd rather wait until the code stabilizes a bit then keep watching = the list and we'll let you know when the first Beta is available.

Please feel free to make contributions to the wiki. It w= ould be great if this was a community effort!

Adrian
<= /div>

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X-Gm-Message-State: ABUngvexBkhdmrCbk9ZCC1ScOZehI6im6kgWv1LaUV/4o7mv9ZEkuOcpnLivL/SnZTX8bKQn86xC1iqz18mPbA== X-Received: by 10.31.195.129 with SMTP id t123mr1010309vkf.166.1478721614170; Wed, 09 Nov 2016 12:00:14 -0800 (PST) MIME-Version: 1.0 Received: by 10.103.141.6 with HTTP; Wed, 9 Nov 2016 11:59:53 -0800 (PST) In-Reply-To: References: From: Tony Arcieri Date: Wed, 9 Nov 2016 11:59:53 -0800 Message-ID: To: Andrew Bransford Brown Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary=001a114edca088cf290540e3b4c8 Archived-At: Cc: Tom Haas , Interledger Community Group , ledger@ietf.org Subject: Re: [Ledger] Bootstrapping Interledger X-BeenThere: ledger@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.17 Precedence: list List-Id: "Discussion of interledger, originally a protocol stack for moving digital assets \(making payments\) between accounts operating on different payment networks or ledgers." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 09 Nov 2016 20:00:18 -0000 --001a114edca088cf290540e3b4c8 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 On Wed, Nov 9, 2016 at 11:42 AM, Andrew Bransford Brown wrote: > I'd suggest a State exchange to avoid SEC regulations while building the > market. Once you cross state lines, then pass the SEC regs. > It's a little more complicated than that. Individual states within the US have their own money transmitter laws, which often apply to money transfers within the state in addition to transfers between states or countries. Setting up a test network with a fake currency that has no actual value sounds ok, but if you are moving real money, even within a single state (state laws providing), you'll want to have a money transmitter license before you do so. For transmitting money between states, you'll need licenses for every state you plan on operating in. -- Tony Arcieri --001a114edca088cf290540e3b4c8 Content-Type: text/html; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
On W= ed, Nov 9, 2016 at 11:42 AM, Andrew Bransford Brown <<= a href=3D"mailto:andrewbb@gmail.com" target=3D"_blank">andrewbb@gmail.com> wrote:
I&#= 39;d suggest a State exchange to avoid SEC regulations while building the m= arket.=C2=A0 Once you cross state lines, then pass the SEC regs.

It's a little more complicated than that. I= ndividual states within the US have their own money transmitter laws, which= often apply to money transfers within the state in addition to transfers b= etween states or countries.

Setting up a test netw= ork with a fake currency that has no actual value sounds ok, but if you are= moving real money, even within a single state (state laws providing), you&= #39;ll want to have a money transmitter license before you do so. For trans= mitting money between states, you'll need licenses for every state you = plan on operating in.

--
Tony Arcieri
--001a114edca088cf290540e3b4c8-- From nobody Wed Nov 9 12:30:25 2016 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ledger@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: ledger@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 248CC1296AD for ; Wed, 9 Nov 2016 12:30:24 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.698 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.698 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, LOTS_OF_MONEY=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW=-0.7, SPF_PASS=-0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=gmail.com Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id B_sHKrYwj8We for ; Wed, 9 Nov 2016 12:30:22 -0800 (PST) Received: from mail-vk0-x232.google.com (mail-vk0-x232.google.com [IPv6:2607:f8b0:400c:c05::232]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 221CD1293DB for ; Wed, 9 Nov 2016 12:30:22 -0800 (PST) Received: by mail-vk0-x232.google.com with SMTP id x186so186024674vkd.1 for ; Wed, 09 Nov 2016 12:30:22 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20120113; h=mime-version:in-reply-to:references:from:date:message-id:subject:to :cc; bh=qFQPFniZcfbnPOwtZWGQNTMrrsU7zatdn5kDDYhi85A=; b=quc0r8XdKkQpdoRqMTMqdkgsfChGBrBAXv3uuDK50nl2jl1BLhWqR3PxookRvPKHOf TfLR6eCAOfdhHseZNTeE54tDwB3P7oEhnJAhpbQMkHHqOdy2betIDviMVaMJ84EDqPsQ 5F1AKz2sKcOvpzQ0loWL/yLPTC85UfIsE/jF3XMlr6oKfRi5+8jU3JJMF+X8OYkRM72K gaSw3c3HHGPk7Trw3TObHEZ1JpwZ677Zuh6j5+Am8/spsrLVTTxOdNonLE/argsS2Woi Zjf6pJIOpCkvsfrNApRMgSrtMLkmSPbscMLtKPxc2UrLDqhqUKzmvQkKCYU3Nvnyuiod oXzg== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20130820; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:in-reply-to:references:from:date :message-id:subject:to:cc; bh=qFQPFniZcfbnPOwtZWGQNTMrrsU7zatdn5kDDYhi85A=; b=ahLN1ga7cPteaMEc8xSkPwOavjxHpUYjQFsDI676DUaTcL4VzU95dQlOneDrYgipXC sByWJFKcwkhNNFbterq0v+vFyUB8GXT76iXSn3PGJEKovEu3qCdCnnr9Mf3RRiMOKqCB zJV1LRjgOCpGkMj2+FS+b544QuboMxTo13/wgHpATgSzEeyO7jsE+sGGs0NY29ZP0ZUm UniN/k38Ax94z71dXchGj8xGF6oiRUGq9p/mugmuRODc9vsqQwNaB9ufPt26yUhCI3WG 9WVU1wu4Bp1viWO1zMuHad9+4m0hqrQ0xNkJzefpPgmV7Uuhf9k+2hqaQkLylfa9r+Aw QMKA== X-Gm-Message-State: ABUngvc6NJRiKrp5KXLXFH8IAMFlDzwwcFrWBLS7uYq81Fr4cYGe8eE/QgQudRS7DycpERnifOpkjW/3TTqo9w== X-Received: by 10.31.78.134 with SMTP id c128mr913537vkb.25.1478723421160; Wed, 09 Nov 2016 12:30:21 -0800 (PST) MIME-Version: 1.0 Received: by 10.176.0.168 with HTTP; Wed, 9 Nov 2016 12:30:20 -0800 (PST) In-Reply-To: References: From: Andrew Bransford Brown Date: Wed, 9 Nov 2016 15:30:20 -0500 Message-ID: To: Tony Arcieri Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary=001a114845383d72050540e42071 Archived-At: Cc: Tom Haas , Interledger Community Group , ledger@ietf.org Subject: Re: [Ledger] Bootstrapping Interledger X-BeenThere: ledger@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.17 Precedence: list List-Id: "Discussion of interledger, originally a protocol stack for moving digital assets \(making payments\) between accounts operating on different payment networks or ledgers." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 09 Nov 2016 20:30:24 -0000 --001a114845383d72050540e42071 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary=001a114845383d71ff0540e4206f --001a114845383d71ff0540e4206f Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 If you focus on a stock market, the software will work for currencies as well. The code is identical. See my attachment. In Texas, a stock exchange license is $10,000. A currency exchange license is $5,000. There are net worth requirements and background checks, but it is as simple as applying for a license. Incorporate in Texas. Raise some capital for ownership. Apply for the licenses. It's that easy. Andrew B. Brown (512) 947-8282 http://KidsCourtyard.com On Wed, Nov 9, 2016 at 2:59 PM, Tony Arcieri wrote: > On Wed, Nov 9, 2016 at 11:42 AM, Andrew Bransford Brown < > andrewbb@gmail.com> wrote: > >> I'd suggest a State exchange to avoid SEC regulations while building the >> market. Once you cross state lines, then pass the SEC regs. >> > > It's a little more complicated than that. Individual states within the US > have their own money transmitter laws, which often apply to money transfers > within the state in addition to transfers between states or countries. > > Setting up a test network with a fake currency that has no actual value > sounds ok, but if you are moving real money, even within a single state > (state laws providing), you'll want to have a money transmitter license > before you do so. For transmitting money between states, you'll need > licenses for every state you plan on operating in. > > -- > Tony Arcieri > --001a114845383d71ff0540e4206f Content-Type: text/html; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
If you focus on a stock market, the software will work for= currencies as well.=C2=A0 The code is identical.=C2=A0 See my attachment.<= div>
In Texas, a stock exchange license is $10,000.=C2=A0 A c= urrency exchange license is $5,000.=C2=A0 There are net worth requirements = and background checks, but it is as simple as applying for a license.
=

Incorporate in Texas.
Raise some capital for = ownership.
Apply for the licenses.
It's that easy.<= /div>


=
Andrew B. Brown
(512) 947-828= 2

On Wed, Nov 9, 2016 at 2:59 PM, Tony Arcieri= <bascule@gmail.com> wrote:
On Wed, Nov 9, 2016 at 11:42 AM, Andrew Bransford Brown <a= ndrewbb@gmail.com> wrote:
<= div dir=3D"ltr">I'd suggest a State exchange to avoid SEC regulations w= hile building the market.=C2=A0 Once you cross state lines, then pass the S= EC regs.

It's a little mor= e complicated than that. Individual states within the US have their own mon= ey transmitter laws, which often apply to money transfers within the state = in addition to transfers between states or countries.

<= div>Setting up a test network with a fake currency that has no actual value= sounds ok, but if you are moving real money, even within a single state (s= tate laws providing), you'll want to have a money transmitter license b= efore you do so. For transmitting money between states, you'll need lic= enses for every state you plan on operating in.

-= -
Tony Arcieri

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10.194.115.6 with HTTP; Wed, 9 Nov 2016 13:00:07 -0800 (PST) From: Adrian Hope-Bailie Date: Wed, 9 Nov 2016 23:00:07 +0200 Message-ID: To: Tony Arcieri Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary=047d7bae4384b646f00540e48a7e Archived-At: Cc: Tom Haas , Interledger Community Group , Interledger Mailing List - IETF , Andrew Bransford Brown Subject: [Ledger] Regulatory Considerations running an ILP node (Re: Bootstrapping Interledger) X-BeenThere: ledger@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.17 Precedence: list List-Id: "Discussion of interledger, originally a protocol stack for moving digital assets \(making payments\) between accounts operating on different payment networks or ledgers." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 09 Nov 2016 21:00:11 -0000 --047d7bae4384b646f00540e48a7e Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 As I mention in the wiki, the goal is to test the capabilities of the protocol by bootstrapping a real network of ILP nodes (not create an unregulated payment network). I think it's important for this to be a network moving real value otherwise it's difficult to motivate people testing things built on top of the protocol to even consider ILP. We're only going to test this properly when there is some skin in the game, we just need to make sure nobody stands to lose more than they can afford to risk. As I have also said in the wiki, we have the advantage of a number highly valued crypto-currencies that offer us "permission-less innovation" and the opportunity to move real value without (in most cases) breaking any laws. If your particular situation prohibits you from running an ILP node for fiat currencies but you can transmit and exchange crypto legally then that's the way you can move real value. Obviously, every person that chooses to run an ILP node should evaluate their own situation and not do anything illegal. For some, that might mean sticking to fake money initially or developing a community currency system between small groups of peers. Most importantly though, we should continue to only move small amounts both because we don't want anyone to risk more than they can afford to lose in helping to bootstrap this project (which is still under heavy development) but also because we don't want to raise the ire of regulators when our immediate goal is to test the protocol not become an unregulated payment network. Finally, and this may be obvious, but I want to be clear, that by running a node and exchanging real value using this immature protocol, you are taking a risk. I (and I think I speak for everyone else involved in the project) take no responsibility for any losses anyone incurs, whether direct or indirect, in being a part of this. We are being pioneers and there are risks. Be responsible, only exchange small amounts and make sure you understand the applicable regulations for your specific case before you proceed. On 9 November 2016 at 21:59, Tony Arcieri wrote: > On Wed, Nov 9, 2016 at 11:42 AM, Andrew Bransford Brown < > andrewbb@gmail.com> wrote: > >> I'd suggest a State exchange to avoid SEC regulations while building the >> market. Once you cross state lines, then pass the SEC regs. >> > > It's a little more complicated than that. Individual states within the US > have their own money transmitter laws, which often apply to money transfers > within the state in addition to transfers between states or countries. > > Setting up a test network with a fake currency that has no actual value > sounds ok, but if you are moving real money, even within a single state > (state laws providing), you'll want to have a money transmitter license > before you do so. For transmitting money between states, you'll need > licenses for every state you plan on operating in. > > -- > Tony Arcieri > > _______________________________________________ > Ledger mailing list > Ledger@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ledger > > --047d7bae4384b646f00540e48a7e Content-Type: text/html; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
As I mention in the wiki, the goal is to test th= e capabilities of the protocol by bootstrapping a real network of ILP nodes= (not create an unregulated payment network).

I think it's= important for this to be a network moving real value otherwise it's di= fficult to motivate people testing things built on top of the protocol to e= ven consider ILP. We're only going to test this properly when there is = some skin in the game, we just need to make sure nobody stands to lose more= than they can afford to risk.

As I have also said in the wiki, we h= ave the advantage of a number highly valued crypto-currencies that offer us= "permission-less innovation" and the opportunity to move real va= lue without (in most cases) breaking any laws. If your particular situation= prohibits you from running an ILP node for fiat currencies but you can tra= nsmit and exchange crypto legally then that's the way you can move real= value.

Obviously, every person that chooses to run an ILP nod= e should evaluate their own situation and not do anything illegal. For some= , that might mean sticking to fake money initially or developing a communit= y currency system between small groups of peers.

Most impo= rtantly though, we should continue to only move small amounts both because = we don't want anyone to risk more than they can afford to lose in helpi= ng to bootstrap this project (which is still under heavy development) but a= lso because we don't want to raise the ire of regulators when our immed= iate goal is to test the protocol not become an unregulated payment network= .

Finally, and this may be obvious, but I want to be clear, th= at by running a node and exchanging real value using this immature protocol= , you are taking a risk. I (and I think I speak for everyone else involved = in the project) take no responsibility for any losses anyone incurs, whethe= r direct or indirect, in being a part of this. We are being pioneers and th= ere are risks.

Be responsible, only exchange small amount= s and make sure you understand the applicable regulations for your specific= case before you proceed.


On 9 November 2016 at 21:59= , Tony Arcieri <bascule@gmail.com> wrote:
On Wed, Nov 9, 2016 at 11:42 AM, Andrew Bransf= ord Brown <andrewbb@gmail.com> wrote:
I'd suggest a State exchange to avoid SE= C regulations while building the market.=C2=A0 Once you cross state lines, = then pass the SEC regs.

It'= ;s a little more complicated than that. Individual states within the US hav= e their own money transmitter laws, which often apply to money transfers wi= thin the state in addition to transfers between states or countries.
<= div>
Setting up a test network with a fake currency that has = no actual value sounds ok, but if you are moving real money, even within a = single state (state laws providing), you'll want to have a money transm= itter license before you do so. For transmitting money between states, you&= #39;ll need licenses for every state you plan on operating in.
<= div>
--
Tony Arcieri

_______________________________________________
Ledger mailing list
Ledger@ietf.org
https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ledger

--047d7bae4384b646f00540e48a7e-- From nobody Wed Nov 9 13:04:53 2016 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ledger@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: ledger@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id B79CE1298D3 for ; Wed, 9 Nov 2016 13:04:50 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -0.284 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-0.284 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAD_CREDIT=2.415, BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW=-0.7] autolearn=no autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (1024-bit key) header.d=hopebailie.com Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id MFtLy1Hw2LAM for ; Wed, 9 Nov 2016 13:04:48 -0800 (PST) Received: from mail-wm0-x22d.google.com (mail-wm0-x22d.google.com [IPv6:2a00:1450:400c:c09::22d]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 86F14129887 for ; Wed, 9 Nov 2016 13:04:45 -0800 (PST) Received: by mail-wm0-x22d.google.com with SMTP id f82so266947135wmf.1 for ; Wed, 09 Nov 2016 13:04:45 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=hopebailie.com; s=google; h=mime-version:in-reply-to:references:from:date:message-id:subject:to :cc; bh=uBjBmHGIn9FTvDi31zR7J6Gnns2gH2Frcap0fLdBo3k=; b=V+z4/nUqnQqfF6ac4V/iFjJirGMH2pB1IgFyFnOjOoj7ocXd+pGwsOj93qcvUJTUEo LtEELNkDx0t7XlsTeLgJw4kbbro4mPQXY1lcMgOz29RfJfOQnPcAcSu8UYg10xeMc2IY cJWBwZUgpO8SUis7Nw1BBFKAjRsW3X7JmRJlQ= X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20130820; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:in-reply-to:references:from:date :message-id:subject:to:cc; bh=uBjBmHGIn9FTvDi31zR7J6Gnns2gH2Frcap0fLdBo3k=; b=a4+pVapnFb9xtPZRQhcMV6t0LPbyg4YDF5BP2OKiy6TnctMR0Uy+cTIbGzf57h0uu3 LeE+1jyzVOu2drifgLPvLIbC4aHpRbgOj/mUvrfGPVYGASQDafRtVqQ+1DBl0lQnPDMB HoO85sdJIOtC/WQdL7Q5DPIBr1XKxL16uXM3Ue7zCCf1DXOLrZ2968lKqe+wlP9sA3dT RxIuaVBCwM5pP/VHrbKw7ZGfzsPrNY3rlVUwx3Gq7eCLWhTJ3PojNltOVcCAaqqDIh1v MJCcFMo2Gz/WsOqfB8vVQ1SnrRWEIFRpWk0RPCiBzkl0YrGe/R91C8whZncsgKmZ1rpr b3Xw== X-Gm-Message-State: ABUngveARatp5eV9MgiuCywNLQZZiCqw8l4U0HV+Z51s8NfISbWZ7Kij3YeX1PlhV68fs5xDARsmIVWpxpCGRw== X-Received: by 10.28.216.65 with SMTP id p62mr21842696wmg.92.1478725484067; Wed, 09 Nov 2016 13:04:44 -0800 (PST) MIME-Version: 1.0 Received: by 10.194.115.6 with HTTP; Wed, 9 Nov 2016 13:04:43 -0800 (PST) In-Reply-To: References: From: Adrian Hope-Bailie Date: Wed, 9 Nov 2016 23:04:43 +0200 Message-ID: To: Paul Frazee Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary=001a1147069432d7b20540e49bff Archived-At: Cc: Tom Haas , Interledger Community Group , Interledger Mailing List - IETF , Andrew Bransford Brown Subject: Re: [Ledger] Bootstrapping Interledger X-BeenThere: ledger@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.17 Precedence: list List-Id: "Discussion of interledger, originally a protocol stack for moving digital assets \(making payments\) between accounts operating on different payment networks or ledgers." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 09 Nov 2016 21:04:51 -0000 --001a1147069432d7b20540e49bff Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 If there is interest in running a parallel test net of purely fake currencies then I'd be keen to make that happen. As I said in a previous mail we do want to get a main net up and running moving real value, even if that is limited to crypto for the most part, so that we can generate an incentive for developers to build ILP into their solutions. On 9 November 2016 at 21:47, Paul Frazee wrote: > What about test nodes that exchange fake currencies only? Would that A) > relax the regulatory requirements, B) be useful to ILP rollout? > > On Wed, Nov 9, 2016 at 1:42 PM, Andrew Bransford Brown > wrote: > >> I'd suggest a State exchange to avoid SEC regulations while building the >> market. Once you cross state lines, then pass the SEC regs. The Texas >> Stock Market in San Antonio, for example. Some groundwork has been >> completed. >> >> A simple protocol is required that will handle the contracts with >> sufficient granularity. See the attached for what I term a "transaction >> stack". It breaks the Offer and Terms, so Bid/Ask are contractually >> identical. Faster and works for anything. >> >> Andrew B. Brown >> (512) 947-8282 >> http://KidsCourtyard.com >> >> >> On Wed, Nov 9, 2016 at 12:50 PM, Tom Haas wrote: >> >>> This is great and I'm excited to see Interledger get off the ground. >>> Congrats to Adrian and all of the ILP developers involved! >>> >>> Perhaps this is better as a separate thread, but what sort of >>> regulations should those who run virtual ledgers be thinking about? At the >>> moment, we're talking about small p2p networks. But if I want to run a >>> Bitcoin exchange or Ripple gateway in the United States, there are a number >>> of KYC/AML regulations, possibly bitlicenses, and other things I have to >>> worry about (including banking, which is not trivial for those doing >>> business in the cryptocurrency ecosystem). What of this applies to running >>> a virtual ledger in a p2p network? >>> >>> As an individual without many resources, how do I deal with the >>> potential legal and financial pitfalls of running a virtual ledger? Just >>> want to get the conversation started. >>> >>> Best, >>> >>> Tom >>> >>> >>> >>> On Tue, Nov 8, 2016 at 10:47 AM, Daniel Bateman <7daniel77@gmail.com> >>> wrote: >>> >>>> Excellent, thank you Adrian. >>>> >>>> And thank you Ryan for your original vision for Ripple. >>>> >>>> Perhaps what is needed now is a step-by-step guide? "How to run an >>>> Interledger connector" >>>> >>>> Daniel >>>> On Nov 8, 2016 11:32 AM, "Ryan Fugger" >>> > wrote: >>>> >>>>> This is great Adrian. My plan was always to evolve Ripplepay.com into >>>>> a decentralized system like this. If you or anyone is interested in >>>>> upgrading or otherwise using that creeky old system to help support >>>>> bootstrapping Interledger, I'd be happy to help out however I can. >>>>> >>>>> On Tue, Nov 8, 2016 at 12:56 AM, Adrian Hope-Bailie < >>>>> adrian@hopebailie.com> wrote: >>>>> >>>>>> When the Internet was first emerging and large university and >>>>>> research networks were coming together on the back of the Internet Protocol >>>>>> the challenge for everyday users was how they could access this new network >>>>>> of networks without special permission or equipment. >>>>>> >>>>>> We face a similar challenge with ILP in that very few of the ledgers >>>>>> accessible to us support the one function that is critical to universal ILP >>>>>> payments; real-time conditional transfers. (I wrote a bit about conditional >>>>>> transfer here: https://medium.com/@ahopebaili >>>>>> e/the-power-of-conditional-payments-2d1ea531250a) >>>>>> >>>>>> So, just like the pioneers of the Internet we're improvising! >>>>>> >>>>>> "Dial-up" interledger enables us to bootstrap the Interledger using >>>>>> "virtual" ledgers between connectors that have established a bounded >>>>>> trusted relationship. >>>>>> >>>>>> In other words, if I run a small connector and I trust my friend >>>>>> Stefan who also runs a connector then we can transact without needing an >>>>>> ILP-enabled ledger between us. >>>>>> >>>>>> We establish a credit limit that we are both comfortable with and >>>>>> agree on a way to settle our positions as required (via Bitcoin, bank >>>>>> transfer or even cash). >>>>>> >>>>>> Consider what will happen if we build a community of people who are >>>>>> all establishing similar peering relationships and then introduce >>>>>> ILP-enabled ledgers to bridge any gaps between connectors that don't know >>>>>> one another. Very soon we'll have an entirely new payments network where >>>>>> payments flow like information does on the Internet today. >>>>>> >>>>>> We're calling this project the Interledger Bootstrap Project and I've >>>>>> started capturing some thoughts on the project wiki: >>>>>> https://github.com/interledgerjs/ilp-kit/wiki >>>>>> >>>>>> In short: >>>>>> 1. Get the ilp-kit code and run a node >>>>>> 2. Find other nodes to peer with >>>>>> 3. Do ILP-enabled transactions >>>>>> 4. Win! >>>>>> >>>>>> The ilp-kit is still pre-release and likely to have some bugs and >>>>>> change a lot so if you're keen to be an early adopter and help test and >>>>>> contribute back to that project please do so. If you'd rather wait until >>>>>> the code stabilizes a bit then keep watching the list and we'll let you >>>>>> know when the first Beta is available. >>>>>> >>>>>> Please feel free to make contributions to the wiki. It would be great >>>>>> if this was a community effort! >>>>>> >>>>>> Adrian >>>>>> >>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>> Ledger mailing list >>>>>> Ledger@ietf.org >>>>>> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ledger >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>> >>> >> > > _______________________________________________ > Ledger mailing list > Ledger@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ledger > > --001a1147069432d7b20540e49bff Content-Type: text/html; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
If there is interest in running a parallel test net of pur= ely fake currencies then I'd be keen to make that happen.

As I = said in a previous mail we do want to get a main net up and running moving = real value, even if that is limited to crypto for the most part, so that we= can generate an incentive for developers to build ILP into their solutions= .

On 9 N= ovember 2016 at 21:47, Paul Frazee <pfrazee@gmail.com> wrote= :
What about test nodes = that exchange fake currencies only? Would that A) relax the regulatory requ= irements, B) be useful to ILP rollout?

On Wed, = Nov 9, 2016 at 1:42 PM, Andrew Bransford Brown <andrewbb@gmail.com>= ; wrote:
I'd = suggest a State exchange to avoid SEC regulations while building the market= .=C2=A0 Once you cross state lines, then pass the SEC regs.=C2=A0 The Texas= Stock Market in San Antonio, for example.=C2=A0 Some groundwork has been c= ompleted.

A simple protocol is required that will handle= the contracts with sufficient granularity.=C2=A0 See the attached for what= I term a "transaction stack".=C2=A0 It breaks the Offer and Term= s, so Bid/Ask are contractually identical.=C2=A0 Faster and works for anyth= ing.


On Wed, Nov 9, 2016 at 12:50 PM, Tom Haas <t= jhaas@gmail.com> wrote:
This is great and I'm excited to see Interledger get off = the ground. Congrats to Adrian and all of the ILP developers involved!
=
Perhaps this is better as a separate thread, but what sort o= f regulations should those who run virtual ledgers be thinking about? At th= e moment, we're talking about small p2p networks. But if I want to run = a Bitcoin exchange or Ripple gateway in the United States, there are a numb= er of KYC/AML regulations, possibly bitlicenses, and other things I have to= worry about (including banking, which is not trivial for those doing busin= ess in the cryptocurrency ecosystem). What of this applies to running a vir= tual ledger in a p2p network?

As an individual wit= hout many resources, how do I deal with the potential legal and financial p= itfalls of running a virtual ledger? Just want to get the conversation star= ted.

Best,

Tom
=


On Tue, Nov 8, 2016 at 10:47 AM, Daniel Bateman <7da= niel77@gmail.com> wrote:

Excellent, thank you Adrian.

And thank you Ryan for your original vision for Ripple.

Perhaps what is needed now is a step-by-step guide? "Ho= w to run an Interledger connector"

Daniel

On Nov 8, 2016 11:32 AM, "Ryan Fugger"= <arv@ryanfugger= ..com> wrote:
This is great Adrian.=C2=A0 My plan was always to evolve = Ripplepay.com into a decentralized system like this.=C2=A0 If you or anyone= is interested in upgrading or otherwise using that creeky old system to he= lp support bootstrapping Interledger, I'd be happy to help out however = I can.

O= n Tue, Nov 8, 2016 at 12:56 AM, Adrian Hope-Bailie <adrian@hopebailie.= com> wrote:
When the Internet was first emerging a= nd large university and research networks were coming together on the back of the Internet Protocol the challenge for everyday users was how they=20 could access this new network of networks without special permission or=20 equipment.

We face a similar challenge with ILP in that= =20 very few of the ledgers accessible to us support the one function that=20 is critical to universal ILP payments; real-time conditional transfers. (I = wrote a bit about conditional transfer here: https://medium.com/@ahopebailie/the-power-of-conditional-paym= ents-2d1ea531250a)

So, just like the pioneers of the Internet we= 're improvising!

"Dial-up" interledger enables us to b= ootstrap the=20 Interledger using "virtual" ledgers between connectors that have= =20 established a bounded trusted relationship.

In other words, if I=20 run a small connector and I trust my friend Stefan who also runs a=20 connector then we can transact without needing an ILP-enabled ledger=20 between us.

We establish a credit limit that we are both comfortable= =20 with and agree on a way to settle our positions as required (via=20 Bitcoin, bank transfer or even cash).

Consider what will happen if w= e build a=20 community of people who are all establishing similar peering=20 relationships and then introduce ILP-enabled ledgers to bridge any gaps=20 between connectors that don't know one another. Very soon we'll hav= e an=20 entirely new payments network where payments flow like information does=20 on the Internet today.

We're calling this project the Inte= rledger Bootstrap Project and I've started capturing some thoughts on t= he project wiki: https://github.com/interledgerjs/ilp-kit/wiki
In short:
1. Get the ilp-kit code and run a node
2. Find other nodes to peer with
3. Do ILP-enabled transactions=
4. Win!

The ilp-kit is still pre-release and li= kely to have some bugs and change a lot so if you're keen to be an earl= y adopter and help test and contribute back to that project please do so. I= f you'd rather wait until the code stabilizes a bit then keep watching = the list and we'll let you know when the first Beta is available.

Please feel free to make contributions to the wiki. It w= ould be great if this was a community effort!

Adrian

_______________________________________________
Ledger mailing list
Ledger@ietf.org https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ledger





_______________________________________________
Ledger mailing list
Ledger@ietf.org
https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ledger

--001a1147069432d7b20540e49bff-- From nobody Wed Nov 9 13:06:19 2016 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ledger@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: ledger@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id CF71812996B for ; Wed, 9 Nov 2016 13:06:17 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -0.284 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-0.284 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAD_CREDIT=2.415, BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW=-0.7] autolearn=no autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (1024-bit key) header.d=hopebailie.com Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id JmK0-qS1yNSp for ; Wed, 9 Nov 2016 13:06:16 -0800 (PST) Received: from mail-wm0-x232.google.com (mail-wm0-x232.google.com [IPv6:2a00:1450:400c:c09::232]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id D6059129966 for ; Wed, 9 Nov 2016 13:06:15 -0800 (PST) Received: by mail-wm0-x232.google.com with SMTP id g23so4377845wme.1 for ; Wed, 09 Nov 2016 13:06:15 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=hopebailie.com; s=google; h=mime-version:in-reply-to:references:from:date:message-id:subject:to :cc; bh=SAwW/IyG2lOkLMPM4oeboB0w99gynRopcidSiMfZhho=; b=RrpHCqB7ksNh8yQC1UU/TbAJoDWJZV5AIdSF2krhEseG83CH7SAc/PhLDo9/cia3ir sKLs5PceDHn3gM+5AU2dTYs+TnWBcf8a405mjxdCq4wHKL70AMArCCD+xiD+TwpbQVez k6XnCvCWBRr0fPnIxItxmFZsBvy7C2FI5htPU= X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20130820; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:in-reply-to:references:from:date :message-id:subject:to:cc; bh=SAwW/IyG2lOkLMPM4oeboB0w99gynRopcidSiMfZhho=; b=FqvhRZNsoPh+wKdzcv78YK0cFVZXyQ8xZX6HtM/LKa1lTO30/0SqotJlk9OSeOZtKZ kNm+9vf37g/Z1hNHXOlG0WdgeApOdWaZ0E0K9PwsxVGxPwm9YCnMsdpijFG6of11ls/q SbWeJ2Xu6qFNHgaJ1He88GghktAO3SZiP5Zu6yg9yrOkjDbs18XvULN/nqjvhB/Pkqux E9oJ9F308oJ1GMtV7MPQLcut+wxvOVBzOhW+RXfjc8I+aqK/zspIZSIul+6zlnnp4W0F 1fpreYZ7BVJSW5rxqZC7bSoHBjbQB2hbGFSCEsWzNJwkuIMA+Ofm0KWnAwsN18tVa5oD PjwA== X-Gm-Message-State: ABUngvfIcDVzrEXP0X6NGIlvPSf7ISv+eRx07nwGy5J9Uf1/+RLMaZPNWT3IYGZomtbxjhsc+jOCtFFsWlVXxQ== X-Received: by 10.28.12.65 with SMTP id 62mr2305317wmm.2.1478725574416; Wed, 09 Nov 2016 13:06:14 -0800 (PST) MIME-Version: 1.0 Received: by 10.194.115.6 with HTTP; Wed, 9 Nov 2016 13:06:13 -0800 (PST) In-Reply-To: References: From: Adrian Hope-Bailie Date: Wed, 9 Nov 2016 23:06:13 +0200 Message-ID: To: Daniel Bateman <7daniel77@gmail.com> Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary=001a1144375e957e450540e4a0ab Archived-At: Cc: Interledger Community Group , Interledger Mailing List - IETF , Ryan Fugger Subject: Re: [Ledger] Bootstrapping Interledger X-BeenThere: ledger@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.17 Precedence: list List-Id: "Discussion of interledger, originally a protocol stack for moving digital assets \(making payments\) between accounts operating on different payment networks or ledgers." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 09 Nov 2016 21:06:18 -0000 --001a1144375e957e450540e4a0ab Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 On 8 November 2016 at 20:47, Daniel Bateman <7daniel77@gmail.com> wrote: > Excellent, thank you Adrian. > > And thank you Ryan for your original vision for Ripple. > > Perhaps what is needed now is a step-by-step guide? "How to run an > Interledger connector" > In the works! But also a task I'd love to see the community take on. The code is currently being polished so if you run it and want to document the experience to help others please do. > Daniel > On Nov 8, 2016 11:32 AM, "Ryan Fugger" wrote: > >> This is great Adrian. My plan was always to evolve Ripplepay.com into a >> decentralized system like this. If you or anyone is interested in >> upgrading or otherwise using that creeky old system to help support >> bootstrapping Interledger, I'd be happy to help out however I can. >> >> On Tue, Nov 8, 2016 at 12:56 AM, Adrian Hope-Bailie < >> adrian@hopebailie.com> wrote: >> >>> When the Internet was first emerging and large university and research >>> networks were coming together on the back of the Internet Protocol the >>> challenge for everyday users was how they could access this new network of >>> networks without special permission or equipment. >>> >>> We face a similar challenge with ILP in that very few of the ledgers >>> accessible to us support the one function that is critical to universal ILP >>> payments; real-time conditional transfers. (I wrote a bit about conditional >>> transfer here: https://medium.com/@ahopebaili >>> e/the-power-of-conditional-payments-2d1ea531250a) >>> >>> So, just like the pioneers of the Internet we're improvising! >>> >>> "Dial-up" interledger enables us to bootstrap the Interledger using >>> "virtual" ledgers between connectors that have established a bounded >>> trusted relationship. >>> >>> In other words, if I run a small connector and I trust my friend Stefan >>> who also runs a connector then we can transact without needing an >>> ILP-enabled ledger between us. >>> >>> We establish a credit limit that we are both comfortable with and agree >>> on a way to settle our positions as required (via Bitcoin, bank transfer or >>> even cash). >>> >>> Consider what will happen if we build a community of people who are all >>> establishing similar peering relationships and then introduce ILP-enabled >>> ledgers to bridge any gaps between connectors that don't know one another. >>> Very soon we'll have an entirely new payments network where payments flow >>> like information does on the Internet today. >>> >>> We're calling this project the Interledger Bootstrap Project and I've >>> started capturing some thoughts on the project wiki: >>> https://github.com/interledgerjs/ilp-kit/wiki >>> >>> In short: >>> 1. Get the ilp-kit code and run a node >>> 2. Find other nodes to peer with >>> 3. Do ILP-enabled transactions >>> 4. Win! >>> >>> The ilp-kit is still pre-release and likely to have some bugs and change >>> a lot so if you're keen to be an early adopter and help test and contribute >>> back to that project please do so. If you'd rather wait until the code >>> stabilizes a bit then keep watching the list and we'll let you know when >>> the first Beta is available. >>> >>> Please feel free to make contributions to the wiki. It would be great if >>> this was a community effort! >>> >>> Adrian >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> Ledger mailing list >>> Ledger@ietf.org >>> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ledger >>> >>> >> --001a1144375e957e450540e4a0ab Content-Type: text/html; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable


On 8 November 2016 at 20:47, Daniel Bateman <7daniel77@gmail.com= > wrote:

Excelle= nt, thank you Adrian.

And thank you Ryan for your original vision for Ripple.

Perhaps what is needed now is a step-by-step guide? "Ho= w to run an Interledger connector"

In the works! = But also a task I'd love to see the community take on. The code is curr= ently being polished so if you run it and want to document the experience t= o help others please do.

Daniel

On Nov 8, 2016 11:32 AM, "Ryan Fugger"= <arv@ryanfugger= .com> wrote:
=
This is great Adrian.=C2=A0 My plan was always to evolve R= ipplepay.com into a decentralized system like this.=C2=A0 If you or anyone = is interested in upgrading or otherwise using that creeky old system to hel= p support bootstrapping Interledger, I'd be happy to help out however I= can.

On= Tue, Nov 8, 2016 at 12:56 AM, Adrian Hope-Bailie <adrian@hopebailie.c= om> wrote:
When the Internet was first emerging an= d large university and research networks were coming together on the back of the Internet Protocol the challenge for everyday users was how they=20 could access this new network of networks without special permission or=20 equipment.

We face a similar challenge with ILP in that= =20 very few of the ledgers accessible to us support the one function that=20 is critical to universal ILP payments; real-time conditional transfers. (I = wrote a bit about conditional transfer here: https://medium.com/@ahopebailie/the-power-of-conditional-paym= ents-2d1ea531250a)

So, just like the pioneers of the Internet we= 're improvising!

"Dial-up" interledger enables us to b= ootstrap the=20 Interledger using "virtual" ledgers between connectors that have= =20 established a bounded trusted relationship.

In other words, if I=20 run a small connector and I trust my friend Stefan who also runs a=20 connector then we can transact without needing an ILP-enabled ledger=20 between us.

We establish a credit limit that we are both comfortable= =20 with and agree on a way to settle our positions as required (via=20 Bitcoin, bank transfer or even cash).

Consider what will happen if w= e build a=20 community of people who are all establishing similar peering=20 relationships and then introduce ILP-enabled ledgers to bridge any gaps=20 between connectors that don't know one another. Very soon we'll hav= e an=20 entirely new payments network where payments flow like information does=20 on the Internet today.

We're calling this project the Inte= rledger Bootstrap Project and I've started capturing some thoughts on t= he project wiki: https://github.com/interledgerjs/ilp-kit/wiki
In short:
1. Get the ilp-kit code and run a node
2. Find other nodes to peer with
3. Do ILP-enabled transactions=
4. Win!

The ilp-kit is still pre-release and li= kely to have some bugs and change a lot so if you're keen to be an earl= y adopter and help test and contribute back to that project please do so. I= f you'd rather wait until the code stabilizes a bit then keep watching = the list and we'll let you know when the first Beta is available.

Please feel free to make contributions to the wiki. It w= ould be great if this was a community effort!

Adrian

_______________________________________________
Ledger mailing list
Ledger@ietf.org https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ledger


--001a1144375e957e450540e4a0ab-- From nobody Wed Nov 9 13:10:59 2016 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ledger@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: ledger@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 976E312996B for ; Wed, 9 Nov 2016 13:10:58 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -0.284 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-0.284 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAD_CREDIT=2.415, BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW=-0.7] autolearn=no autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (1024-bit key) header.d=hopebailie.com Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id dWmwujWY27BG for ; Wed, 9 Nov 2016 13:10:57 -0800 (PST) Received: from mail-wm0-x22e.google.com (mail-wm0-x22e.google.com [IPv6:2a00:1450:400c:c09::22e]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id D557D129952 for ; Wed, 9 Nov 2016 13:10:56 -0800 (PST) Received: by mail-wm0-x22e.google.com with SMTP id a197so331751519wmd.0 for ; Wed, 09 Nov 2016 13:10:56 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=hopebailie.com; s=google; h=mime-version:in-reply-to:references:from:date:message-id:subject:to :cc; bh=Cyi2YA+IVgx67yjsJhKdYQmszBaocJpca5ApTsvS7h0=; b=RLzBuM4cwDeMicBF1idNJJz7MJaFZWk76V44zHDsIma6AKNZ9ggJ84wHnLE687j2LP xCA6k+tt+5xAGhoMV3OXZLwxFPlnSn5h20hEG0I9Y9PX4+3rt9+Zb7nRIvRKQ8bUHdKL fLQGl96pow29B4XXWTpDaCFozUaQwhOo7Ldo0= X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20130820; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:in-reply-to:references:from:date :message-id:subject:to:cc; bh=Cyi2YA+IVgx67yjsJhKdYQmszBaocJpca5ApTsvS7h0=; b=QCGjaTq6pQYEH28psAhfGB5XiEh+PTsM1gtSr374kc/gi6xuuyPF1h1uT+ZCHafbXg 8MeOyWrsIhOQD6IGxi7PzMEGO2/Ms9gp4p0Xr0B3AGVsrLFKtGaODzpWmaky3LxAIXcu /2+5k4L1g9+pvB5xdc01uL9CMoFlh0FutKn/5R5NcB+PNTfFMbAugwZkiWDSz3MiL2So 2Ow36B1VYGz8sGtpgmDOkjeaRI1WM/9AxPFv/sDSD+Wk3PsmmZ19dM7w2XDh3bsNT/Io Uv7xaS1xOaIZAapSPPiTZMPVQcpi4kB4IxrlxyRFN6g41F/3zUmxa4FIlg+XCdgV1DGg qZJQ== X-Gm-Message-State: ABUngvejVKhwkWZJYoKXfEOFy2t/96dE4vfxYNxOQP3wpqJw+BJqwMDSNXnnHHVHzU6dl3f9YWS4KneDAxomwQ== X-Received: by 10.194.105.104 with SMTP id gl8mr1578071wjb.83.1478725855395; Wed, 09 Nov 2016 13:10:55 -0800 (PST) MIME-Version: 1.0 Received: by 10.194.115.6 with HTTP; Wed, 9 Nov 2016 13:10:54 -0800 (PST) In-Reply-To: References: From: Adrian Hope-Bailie Date: Wed, 9 Nov 2016 23:10:54 +0200 Message-ID: To: Ryan Fugger Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary=001a1130d28a54db0f0540e4b11d Archived-At: Cc: Interledger Community Group , Interledger Mailing List - IETF Subject: Re: [Ledger] Bootstrapping Interledger X-BeenThere: ledger@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.17 Precedence: list List-Id: "Discussion of interledger, originally a protocol stack for moving digital assets \(making payments\) between accounts operating on different payment networks or ledgers." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 09 Nov 2016 21:10:58 -0000 --001a1130d28a54db0f0540e4b11d Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 Hey Ryan, Thanks for the offer! What are your thoughts on how we'd do that? Is ripplepay.com still in active use? Is there a migration path we could devise for the existing network to ILP? Adrian On 8 November 2016 at 20:30, Ryan Fugger wrote: > This is great Adrian. My plan was always to evolve Ripplepay.com into a > decentralized system like this. If you or anyone is interested in > upgrading or otherwise using that creeky old system to help support > bootstrapping Interledger, I'd be happy to help out however I can. > > On Tue, Nov 8, 2016 at 12:56 AM, Adrian Hope-Bailie > wrote: > >> When the Internet was first emerging and large university and research >> networks were coming together on the back of the Internet Protocol the >> challenge for everyday users was how they could access this new network of >> networks without special permission or equipment. >> >> We face a similar challenge with ILP in that very few of the ledgers >> accessible to us support the one function that is critical to universal ILP >> payments; real-time conditional transfers. (I wrote a bit about conditional >> transfer here: https://medium.com/@ahopebailie/the-power-of-conditional- >> payments-2d1ea531250a) >> >> So, just like the pioneers of the Internet we're improvising! >> >> "Dial-up" interledger enables us to bootstrap the Interledger using >> "virtual" ledgers between connectors that have established a bounded >> trusted relationship. >> >> In other words, if I run a small connector and I trust my friend Stefan >> who also runs a connector then we can transact without needing an >> ILP-enabled ledger between us. >> >> We establish a credit limit that we are both comfortable with and agree >> on a way to settle our positions as required (via Bitcoin, bank transfer or >> even cash). >> >> Consider what will happen if we build a community of people who are all >> establishing similar peering relationships and then introduce ILP-enabled >> ledgers to bridge any gaps between connectors that don't know one another. >> Very soon we'll have an entirely new payments network where payments flow >> like information does on the Internet today. >> >> We're calling this project the Interledger Bootstrap Project and I've >> started capturing some thoughts on the project wiki: >> https://github.com/interledgerjs/ilp-kit/wiki >> >> In short: >> 1. Get the ilp-kit code and run a node >> 2. Find other nodes to peer with >> 3. Do ILP-enabled transactions >> 4. Win! >> >> The ilp-kit is still pre-release and likely to have some bugs and change >> a lot so if you're keen to be an early adopter and help test and contribute >> back to that project please do so. If you'd rather wait until the code >> stabilizes a bit then keep watching the list and we'll let you know when >> the first Beta is available. >> >> Please feel free to make contributions to the wiki. It would be great if >> this was a community effort! >> >> Adrian >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Ledger mailing list >> Ledger@ietf.org >> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ledger >> >> > --001a1130d28a54db0f0540e4b11d Content-Type: text/html; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Hey Ryan,

Thanks for the offer= !

What are your thoughts on how we'd do that? Is ripplepay.com still in active use? Is there a= migration path we could devise for the existing=C2=A0 network to ILP?
<= br>
Adrian

On 8 November 2016 at 20:30, Ryan Fugger <arv@ryanfugger.com&= gt; wrote:
This i= s great Adrian.=C2=A0 My plan was always to evolve Ripplepay.com into a dec= entralized system like this.=C2=A0 If you or anyone is interested in upgrad= ing or otherwise using that creeky old system to help support bootstrapping= Interledger, I'd be happy to help out however I can.

On= Tue, Nov 8, 2016 at 12:56 AM, Adrian Hope-Bailie <adrian@hopebailie.c= om> wrote:
When= the Internet was first emerging and large university and research networks were coming together on the back of the Internet Protocol the challenge for everyday users was how they=20 could access this new network of networks without special permission or=20 equipment.

We face a similar challenge with ILP in that= =20 very few of the ledgers accessible to us support the one function that=20 is critical to universal ILP payments; real-time conditional transfers. (I = wrote a bit about conditional transfer here: https://medium.com/@ahopebailie/the-power-of-conditional-paym= ents-2d1ea531250a)

So, just like the pioneers of the Internet we= 're improvising!

"Dial-up" interledger enables us to b= ootstrap the=20 Interledger using "virtual" ledgers between connectors that have= =20 established a bounded trusted relationship.

In other words, if I=20 run a small connector and I trust my friend Stefan who also runs a=20 connector then we can transact without needing an ILP-enabled ledger=20 between us.

We establish a credit limit that we are both comfortable= =20 with and agree on a way to settle our positions as required (via=20 Bitcoin, bank transfer or even cash).

Consider what will happen if w= e build a=20 community of people who are all establishing similar peering=20 relationships and then introduce ILP-enabled ledgers to bridge any gaps=20 between connectors that don't know one another. Very soon we'll hav= e an=20 entirely new payments network where payments flow like information does=20 on the Internet today.

We're calling this project the Inte= rledger Bootstrap Project and I've started capturing some thoughts on t= he project wiki: https://github.com/interledgerjs/ilp-kit/wiki
In short:
1. Get the ilp-kit code and run a node
2. Find other nodes to peer with
3. Do ILP-enabled transactions=
4. Win!

The ilp-kit is still pre-release and li= kely to have some bugs and change a lot so if you're keen to be an earl= y adopter and help test and contribute back to that project please do so. I= f you'd rather wait until the code stabilizes a bit then keep watching = the list and we'll let you know when the first Beta is available.

Please feel free to make contributions to the wiki. It w= ould be great if this was a community effort!

Adrian
=

_______________________________________________
Ledger mailing list
Ledger@ietf.org https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ledger


--001a1130d28a54db0f0540e4b11d-- From nobody Wed Nov 9 13:39:17 2016 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ledger@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: ledger@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6551512957A for ; Wed, 9 Nov 2016 13:39:15 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.999 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.999 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE=-0.0001, SPF_PASS=-0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=gmail.com Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id LHRJaDx2KH8e for ; Wed, 9 Nov 2016 13:39:13 -0800 (PST) Received: from mail-ua0-x22b.google.com (mail-ua0-x22b.google.com [IPv6:2607:f8b0:400c:c08::22b]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id E2E2612963B for ; Wed, 9 Nov 2016 13:39:12 -0800 (PST) Received: by mail-ua0-x22b.google.com with SMTP id 51so185216525uai.1 for ; Wed, 09 Nov 2016 13:39:12 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20120113; h=mime-version:in-reply-to:references:from:date:message-id:subject:to :cc; bh=dPN0ZjrYCtpnvd7efQYf8Q9fwQFNDYyitqjW2KOJ63M=; b=A1zeyuyer1SXTLB9vQTrZ5ZuHFtLUkkgHCkTxRRDMGeqSitTmlHHzGVO2+ybOgBfgI BmNSNgCnZd69wN4SMiCeIp5nHpcRlQ2PuqfL0aaStBdgmS6Hh6wVEvc4NGskDOntAx47 KYH0rjU76LRI+gx1LMmnq86Z8YUfUY0pNG8eTF5Bt5ufUd8z7NpvnIl31tG9DdYL3piE h0S2EQ8KoVNgww889w/AU9ia9jg4USG+tNaSR98xtE/fcLnxa6aXsU33OZXHxaNm7bVa i76JepTtsA8CfKEh2U7+GxXzu2L4BvF9HhBY+B2PfRptqCasbkKQ0DWOfhVOH+IkmGht gFzQ== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20130820; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:in-reply-to:references:from:date :message-id:subject:to:cc; bh=dPN0ZjrYCtpnvd7efQYf8Q9fwQFNDYyitqjW2KOJ63M=; b=ZSiabm20nbAJB8c2bHXTOIBOSpch8JaZiw414Q4hxwfsoy75G3rF/BlkhhrBY3fgm1 sUqckxgDwXxTyFU+hO18vAsjmGXfoZyRP/Qb3uXCtBaSh2B2h6zDdegFjsWH/83a2PBo cW6ioQ4d3br4SADnZqCRYNau37IXFy6u6CxENuy9fkS7//MOM38CSolpiPiybK6qDVc9 7Qw9SCMhgDK2G1EYOX5Od3uzPIj8B/C568lXBLosgh5OXB5/1qe0qWuEr9LSre8nrxhL 5OUeeDQOqJjawJDN2RBKqrmaXUVRbP86p62oRwuwzn/oA2P+LiNYrqpOyEoPsZuZFgFx /BkQ== X-Gm-Message-State: ABUngvcLOG3ruPkmDDTHR7++NYpVy8zzs6+rGQhBIXZAe0btpP4+kiI5Y0dSqbS4CXfMIG0nWmZbY8HTHJlHLQ== X-Received: by 10.176.6.231 with SMTP id g94mr1232354uag.91.1478727551959; Wed, 09 Nov 2016 13:39:11 -0800 (PST) MIME-Version: 1.0 Received: by 10.176.0.168 with HTTP; Wed, 9 Nov 2016 13:39:11 -0800 (PST) In-Reply-To: References: From: Andrew Bransford Brown Date: Wed, 9 Nov 2016 16:39:11 -0500 Message-ID: To: Adrian Hope-Bailie Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary=94eb2c123a18744c3f0540e51699 Archived-At: Cc: Tom Haas , Tony Arcieri , Interledger Community Group , Interledger Mailing List - IETF Subject: Re: [Ledger] Regulatory Considerations running an ILP node (Re: Bootstrapping Interledger) X-BeenThere: ledger@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.17 Precedence: list List-Id: "Discussion of interledger, originally a protocol stack for moving digital assets \(making payments\) between accounts operating on different payment networks or ledgers." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 09 Nov 2016 21:39:15 -0000 --94eb2c123a18744c3f0540e51699 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 My suggestion is that if you start getting into "credit units" of some kind, you're on the wrong track. I say this from an accounting and trading perspective. The value being traded exists somewhere at all times and its location and owner must be known at every step in the transaction. Andrew B. Brown (512) 947-8282 http://KidsCourtyard.com On Wed, Nov 9, 2016 at 4:00 PM, Adrian Hope-Bailie wrote: > As I mention in the wiki, the goal is to test the capabilities of the > protocol by bootstrapping a real network of ILP nodes (not create an > unregulated payment network). > > I think it's important for this to be a network moving real value > otherwise it's difficult to motivate people testing things built on top of > the protocol to even consider ILP. We're only going to test this properly > when there is some skin in the game, we just need to make sure nobody > stands to lose more than they can afford to risk. > > As I have also said in the wiki, we have the advantage of a number highly > valued crypto-currencies that offer us "permission-less innovation" and the > opportunity to move real value without (in most cases) breaking any laws. > If your particular situation prohibits you from running an ILP node for > fiat currencies but you can transmit and exchange crypto legally then > that's the way you can move real value. > > Obviously, every person that chooses to run an ILP node should evaluate > their own situation and not do anything illegal. For some, that might mean > sticking to fake money initially or developing a community currency system > between small groups of peers. > > Most importantly though, we should continue to only move small amounts > both because we don't want anyone to risk more than they can afford to lose > in helping to bootstrap this project (which is still under heavy > development) but also because we don't want to raise the ire of regulators > when our immediate goal is to test the protocol not become an unregulated > payment network. > > Finally, and this may be obvious, but I want to be clear, that by running > a node and exchanging real value using this immature protocol, you are > taking a risk. I (and I think I speak for everyone else involved in the > project) take no responsibility for any losses anyone incurs, whether > direct or indirect, in being a part of this. We are being pioneers and > there are risks. > > Be responsible, only exchange small amounts and make sure you understand > the applicable regulations for your specific case before you proceed. > > > On 9 November 2016 at 21:59, Tony Arcieri wrote: > >> On Wed, Nov 9, 2016 at 11:42 AM, Andrew Bransford Brown < >> andrewbb@gmail.com> wrote: >> >>> I'd suggest a State exchange to avoid SEC regulations while building the >>> market. Once you cross state lines, then pass the SEC regs. >>> >> >> It's a little more complicated than that. Individual states within the US >> have their own money transmitter laws, which often apply to money transfers >> within the state in addition to transfers between states or countries. >> >> Setting up a test network with a fake currency that has no actual value >> sounds ok, but if you are moving real money, even within a single state >> (state laws providing), you'll want to have a money transmitter license >> before you do so. For transmitting money between states, you'll need >> licenses for every state you plan on operating in. >> >> -- >> Tony Arcieri >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Ledger mailing list >> Ledger@ietf.org >> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ledger >> >> > --94eb2c123a18744c3f0540e51699 Content-Type: text/html; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
My suggestion is that if you start getting into "cred= it units" of some kind, you're on the wrong track.=C2=A0 I say thi= s from an accounting and trading perspective.

The value = being traded exists somewhere at all times and its location and owner must = be known at every step in the transaction.

Andrew B. Brown
(512) 947-8282


On Wed, Nov 9, 2016 at 4:00 PM, Adrian Hope-= Bailie <adrian@hopebailie.com> wrote:
As I mention in the wiki, the go= al is to test the capabilities of the protocol by bootstrapping a real netw= ork of ILP nodes (not create an unregulated payment network).

= I think it's important for this to be a network moving real value other= wise it's difficult to motivate people testing things built on top of t= he protocol to even consider ILP. We're only going to test this properl= y when there is some skin in the game, we just need to make sure nobody sta= nds to lose more than they can afford to risk.

As I have also said i= n the wiki, we have the advantage of a number highly valued crypto-currenci= es that offer us "permission-less innovation" and the opportunity= to move real value without (in most cases) breaking any laws. If your part= icular situation prohibits you from running an ILP node for fiat currencies= but you can transmit and exchange crypto legally then that's the way y= ou can move real value.

Obviously, every person that chooses t= o run an ILP node should evaluate their own situation and not do anything i= llegal. For some, that might mean sticking to fake money initially or devel= oping a community currency system between small groups of peers.

Most importantly though, we should continue to only move small amoun= ts both because we don't want anyone to risk more than they can afford = to lose in helping to bootstrap this project (which is still under heavy de= velopment) but also because we don't want to raise the ire of regulator= s when our immediate goal is to test the protocol not become an unregulated= payment network.

Finally, and this may be obvious, but I want= to be clear, that by running a node and exchanging real value using this i= mmature protocol, you are taking a risk. I (and I think I speak for everyon= e else involved in the project) take no responsibility for any losses anyon= e incurs, whether direct or indirect, in being a part of this. We are being= pioneers and there are risks.

Be responsible, only excha= nge small amounts and make sure you understand the applicable regulations f= or your specific case before you proceed.


On 9 Novemb= er 2016 at 21:59, Tony Arcieri <bascule@gmail.com> wrote:
On Wed, Nov 9, 2016 at 11:42 AM, Andrew B= ransford Brown <andrewbb@gmail.com> wrote:
I'd suggest a State exchange to avoi= d SEC regulations while building the market.=C2=A0 Once you cross state lin= es, then pass the SEC regs.

It= 's a little more complicated than that. Individual states within the US= have their own money transmitter laws, which often apply to money transfer= s within the state in addition to transfers between states or countries.

Setting up a test network with a fake currency that = has no actual value sounds ok, but if you are moving real money, even withi= n a single state (state laws providing), you'll want to have a money tr= ansmitter license before you do so. For transmitting money between states, = you'll need licenses for every state you plan on operating in.

--
Tony Arcieri

_______________________________________________
Ledger mailing list
Ledger@ietf.org https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ledger


--94eb2c123a18744c3f0540e51699-- From nobody Wed Nov 9 14:01:31 2016 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ledger@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: ledger@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 436BF1295D2 for ; Wed, 9 Nov 2016 14:01:30 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -0.185 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-0.185 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAD_CREDIT=2.415, BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW=-0.7, SPF_PASS=-0.001] autolearn=no autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=ryanfugger-com.20150623.gappssmtp.com Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id IlytPhvX2EiI for ; Wed, 9 Nov 2016 14:01:28 -0800 (PST) Received: from mail-qk0-x230.google.com (mail-qk0-x230.google.com [IPv6:2607:f8b0:400d:c09::230]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id B693D129487 for ; Wed, 9 Nov 2016 14:01:27 -0800 (PST) Received: by mail-qk0-x230.google.com with SMTP id q130so274069713qke.1 for ; Wed, 09 Nov 2016 14:01:27 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=ryanfugger-com.20150623.gappssmtp.com; s=20150623; h=mime-version:in-reply-to:references:from:date:message-id:subject:to :cc; bh=ySOqm6bw01Bpm1K0bdD1X+Y01b3EVCM+KVoPYzhw3W8=; b=zvAp8gQaJZoERDvrC+p3bbnAV+Ak6nDNXKBD0yKuQzktvyxo3g30bmFWV0/HPMFqfj hlgqMPmmnkasmVyEPyMma1Ub/XX/1vbs5RJdNFh5jGiJjUDPaGmUVJ9CDOUB9Z7NNpel e8wwqzyTwQEWS/qqEoUACm0MPLJr7xLO9DYMo6DFCQgjuQYUuuYoSSh0Sml0gqxPhYH/ mIbmOhLryvY83az5fh6gth6p7VkeHDdcImCHCVh7WPd8GQtiS3jJNCq/ms/C+75s79MK omXIGDUtJHtiex9OBBxuxtAmZ3FEZlETJrjCW0c552LPaKxeqz1fneVCObUUEc4t20oQ Ttmw== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20130820; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:in-reply-to:references:from:date :message-id:subject:to:cc; bh=ySOqm6bw01Bpm1K0bdD1X+Y01b3EVCM+KVoPYzhw3W8=; b=lUJA80YTsITlhaD0dX/agtWq6bLwim4F00ATqUs/Mgcq9mlFEPsAVhuISdPPvwPzI0 Z7r5dcqzWMN7mWujyUzBRKb7snLfkL075wq2kNrrEE0oZkSe/M+8NrI1IJU1C12oAspB BJPS1HAfV3xh4A9oUDvU4ZYUTqcYDF5K71sLWTUTYrpy+okuJ9AWKayXPrxFE7JlumSr 8jpxHXJ1C4hDXrnS/LYFxD3kxCJ0hanN8Aj5gTWd4gqCPNAIJhVZUkeXQ1utK0AKdVs+ bZDlYEN2YhCheEGILdEkZKvB0vkTpm/pWrKoxrAe7jVktv7HLXIPZ7Z8Eh7BjdCNDo81 91Ng== X-Gm-Message-State: ABUngvcKk1hyFJHUv4oag7wS7w645RB6Jfi62+waDQMtoBhFC0vGPZckJqQfkPa25DxhFkD4HLMn2KNSkwU7cw== X-Received: by 10.55.100.204 with SMTP id y195mr2465964qkb.23.1478728886840; Wed, 09 Nov 2016 14:01:26 -0800 (PST) MIME-Version: 1.0 Received: by 10.55.158.75 with HTTP; Wed, 9 Nov 2016 14:01:06 -0800 (PST) In-Reply-To: References: From: Ryan Fugger Date: Wed, 9 Nov 2016 14:01:06 -0800 Message-ID: To: Adrian Hope-Bailie Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary=94eb2c05c8740504050540e5663b Archived-At: Cc: Interledger Community Group , Interledger Mailing List - IETF Subject: Re: [Ledger] Bootstrapping Interledger X-BeenThere: ledger@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.17 Precedence: list List-Id: "Discussion of interledger, originally a protocol stack for moving digital assets \(making payments\) between accounts operating on different payment networks or ledgers." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 09 Nov 2016 22:01:30 -0000 --94eb2c05c8740504050540e5663b Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 On Wed, Nov 9, 2016 at 1:10 PM, Adrian Hope-Bailie wrote: > What are your thoughts on how we'd do that? Is ripplepay.com still in > active use? Is there a migration path we could devise for the existing > network to ILP? > There are some people using Ripplepay still, although it's not terribly active -- about 15-20 payments per month over the last few months. I'm sure some of the dormant users could be revived if there were new developments. If ILP was easy enough to set up, the fastest thing would be a tool and/or instructions on how to migrate their accounts over to ILP, assuming most or all of their connections would also be moving. If you wanted to offer hosted ILP access, then redeveloping the site to allow connections to external ILP servers might make sense. > On 8 November 2016 at 20:30, Ryan Fugger wrote: > >> This is great Adrian. My plan was always to evolve Ripplepay.com into a >> decentralized system like this. If you or anyone is interested in >> upgrading or otherwise using that creeky old system to help support >> bootstrapping Interledger, I'd be happy to help out however I can. >> >> On Tue, Nov 8, 2016 at 12:56 AM, Adrian Hope-Bailie < >> adrian@hopebailie.com> wrote: >> >>> When the Internet was first emerging and large university and research >>> networks were coming together on the back of the Internet Protocol the >>> challenge for everyday users was how they could access this new network of >>> networks without special permission or equipment. >>> >>> We face a similar challenge with ILP in that very few of the ledgers >>> accessible to us support the one function that is critical to universal ILP >>> payments; real-time conditional transfers. (I wrote a bit about conditional >>> transfer here: https://medium.com/@ahopebaili >>> e/the-power-of-conditional-payments-2d1ea531250a) >>> >>> So, just like the pioneers of the Internet we're improvising! >>> >>> "Dial-up" interledger enables us to bootstrap the Interledger using >>> "virtual" ledgers between connectors that have established a bounded >>> trusted relationship. >>> >>> In other words, if I run a small connector and I trust my friend Stefan >>> who also runs a connector then we can transact without needing an >>> ILP-enabled ledger between us. >>> >>> We establish a credit limit that we are both comfortable with and agree >>> on a way to settle our positions as required (via Bitcoin, bank transfer or >>> even cash). >>> >>> Consider what will happen if we build a community of people who are all >>> establishing similar peering relationships and then introduce ILP-enabled >>> ledgers to bridge any gaps between connectors that don't know one another. >>> Very soon we'll have an entirely new payments network where payments flow >>> like information does on the Internet today. >>> >>> We're calling this project the Interledger Bootstrap Project and I've >>> started capturing some thoughts on the project wiki: >>> https://github.com/interledgerjs/ilp-kit/wiki >>> >>> In short: >>> 1. Get the ilp-kit code and run a node >>> 2. Find other nodes to peer with >>> 3. Do ILP-enabled transactions >>> 4. Win! >>> >>> The ilp-kit is still pre-release and likely to have some bugs and change >>> a lot so if you're keen to be an early adopter and help test and contribute >>> back to that project please do so. If you'd rather wait until the code >>> stabilizes a bit then keep watching the list and we'll let you know when >>> the first Beta is available. >>> >>> Please feel free to make contributions to the wiki. It would be great if >>> this was a community effort! >>> >>> Adrian >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> Ledger mailing list >>> Ledger@ietf.org >>> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ledger >>> >>> >> > --94eb2c05c8740504050540e5663b Content-Type: text/html; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
On W= ed, Nov 9, 2016 at 1:10 PM, Adrian Hope-Bailie <adrian@hopebailie.com<= /a>> wrote:
What are your thoughts on how we'd do that? Is= ripplepay.com still= in active use? Is there a migration path we could devise for the existing= =C2=A0 network to ILP?

There are some people using Ripplepay still, alth= ough it's not terribly active -- about 15-20 payments per month over th= e last few months.=C2=A0 I'm sure some of the dormant users could be re= vived if there were new developments.

If ILP was easy eno= ugh to set up, the fastest thing would be a tool and/or instructions on how= to migrate their accounts over to ILP, assuming most or all of their conne= ctions would also be moving.=C2=A0 If you wanted to offer hosted ILP access= , then redeveloping the site to allow connections to external ILP servers m= ight make sense.
=C2=A0
=
On 8= November 2016 at 20:30, Ryan Fugger <arv@ryanfugger.com> w= rote:
This is great Adri= an.=C2=A0 My plan was always to evolve Ripplepay.com into a decentralized s= ystem like this.=C2=A0 If you or anyone is interested in upgrading or other= wise using that creeky old system to help support bootstrapping Interledger= , I'd be happy to help out however I can.

On Tue, Nov 8, 2016 at 12:56 AM, Adrian Hope-Bailie <adrian@hop= ebailie.com> wrote:
When the Internet was first emerging and large university and research networks were coming together on the back of the Internet Protocol the challenge for everyday users was how they=20 could access this new network of networks without special permission or=20 equipment.

We face a similar challenge with ILP in that= =20 very few of the ledgers accessible to us support the one function that=20 is critical to universal ILP payments; real-time conditional transfers. (I = wrote a bit about conditional transfer here: https://medium.com/@ahopebailie/the-power-of-conditional-paym= ents-2d1ea531250a)

So, just like the pioneers of the Internet we= 're improvising!

"Dial-up" interledger enables us to b= ootstrap the=20 Interledger using "virtual" ledgers between connectors that have= =20 established a bounded trusted relationship.

In other words, if I=20 run a small connector and I trust my friend Stefan who also runs a=20 connector then we can transact without needing an ILP-enabled ledger=20 between us.

We establish a credit limit that we are both comfortable= =20 with and agree on a way to settle our positions as required (via=20 Bitcoin, bank transfer or even cash).

Consider what will happen if w= e build a=20 community of people who are all establishing similar peering=20 relationships and then introduce ILP-enabled ledgers to bridge any gaps=20 between connectors that don't know one another. Very soon we'll hav= e an=20 entirely new payments network where payments flow like information does=20 on the Internet today.

We're calling this project the Inte= rledger Bootstrap Project and I've started capturing some thoughts on t= he project wiki: https://github.com/interledgerjs/ilp-kit/wiki
In short:
1. Get the ilp-kit code and run a node
2. Find other nodes to peer with
3. Do ILP-enabled transactions=
4. Win!

The ilp-kit is still pre-release and li= kely to have some bugs and change a lot so if you're keen to be an earl= y adopter and help test and contribute back to that project please do so. I= f you'd rather wait until the code stabilizes a bit then keep watching = the list and we'll let you know when the first Beta is available.

Please feel free to make contributions to the wiki. It w= ould be great if this was a community effort!
<= div>

Adrian

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--94eb2c05c8740504050540e5663b-- From nobody Wed Nov 9 14:08:14 2016 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ledger@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: ledger@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1A2831299C1 for ; Wed, 9 Nov 2016 14:08:13 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -0.284 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-0.284 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAD_CREDIT=2.415, BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW=-0.7] autolearn=no autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (1024-bit key) header.d=hopebailie.com Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id bcVdKTezkRdY for ; Wed, 9 Nov 2016 14:08:11 -0800 (PST) Received: from mail-wm0-x22e.google.com (mail-wm0-x22e.google.com [IPv6:2a00:1450:400c:c09::22e]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id A7EE61299D7 for ; Wed, 9 Nov 2016 14:08:10 -0800 (PST) Received: by mail-wm0-x22e.google.com with SMTP id g23so6929869wme.1 for ; Wed, 09 Nov 2016 14:08:10 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=hopebailie.com; s=google; h=mime-version:in-reply-to:references:from:date:message-id:subject:to :cc; bh=nfkSwGzot8KUrHbOUCIdDjU7nupSy2NHMkXwmKigUv0=; b=RR4FDoYwrW0V266m/gVk14qzIHCEGru4TIApKrzmzpZyWNT5wj3BkF1wA28DtzQRmI W702X/iVfirDXJOm0atXe885GbhAWHpvdjA73onGntJ5ORJ6gH/fyVKIsVA50kjN7s2l Aa0TbIkNThyjcYdnb3eI6ufz4V2HKKjtoUNfE= X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20130820; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:in-reply-to:references:from:date :message-id:subject:to:cc; bh=nfkSwGzot8KUrHbOUCIdDjU7nupSy2NHMkXwmKigUv0=; b=Gzcgn7zNIsVGVNFHuPPsLp+gbx1clkZ5L7lPcwEjQDvZhEQAHIBUbvjm9K3uiLbt80 FsBTYSMP0O7bWxAObPuT4sfT90XvumOk8YPoD/QywFB6r4YjXr9vnHjIIAkRtM499cCX nfbSoR7p9MRCC/jN31kRE4rro/0ku6kEOfx8k/T/B84zk8hgDYdtiJIq8v5TDfxHK/B9 XEAgIjGAWWtFfRJGBh4TOcJPWmnB38sbvSWc4Vzk102wPEzGEKUUKlOUQMFVJhI855xU qQw91Sg60eKde/mvx4ri+/CvUy/R6yIvYP1dTxvTsBTVQk2lcrpV7tB9yvjjOzM4SJJO GNBg== X-Gm-Message-State: ABUngvcDYxHcK/y7L2RntQqQaGO1uiSjuvakQamfPzigtlB4L/cbN/eLFotdmNlKEMSOXwikeO8voYZVjpE9lw== X-Received: by 10.194.105.104 with SMTP id gl8mr1758072wjb.83.1478729289171; Wed, 09 Nov 2016 14:08:09 -0800 (PST) MIME-Version: 1.0 Received: by 10.194.115.6 with HTTP; Wed, 9 Nov 2016 14:08:08 -0800 (PST) In-Reply-To: References: From: Adrian Hope-Bailie Date: Thu, 10 Nov 2016 00:08:08 +0200 Message-ID: To: Ryan Fugger Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary=001a1130d28a0015570540e57e21 Archived-At: Cc: Interledger Community Group , Interledger Mailing List - IETF Subject: Re: [Ledger] Bootstrapping Interledger X-BeenThere: ledger@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.17 Precedence: list List-Id: "Discussion of interledger, originally a protocol stack for moving digital assets \(making payments\) between accounts operating on different payment networks or ledgers." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 09 Nov 2016 22:08:13 -0000 --001a1130d28a0015570540e57e21 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 This sounds like a really cool idea! I think we should wait until the ilp-kit code is stable and a little more mature and then we can work on a migration path for existing ripplepay.com users who want to migrate. Ito hosted ILP I think the best way to do this is just make it easy for people to host themselves, even if they are not technical, through something like Heroku. Let's take this offline and work on a roadmap for this. We should probably aim for Q1 2017? On 10 November 2016 at 00:01, Ryan Fugger wrote: > On Wed, Nov 9, 2016 at 1:10 PM, Adrian Hope-Bailie > wrote: > >> What are your thoughts on how we'd do that? Is ripplepay.com still in >> active use? Is there a migration path we could devise for the existing >> network to ILP? >> > > There are some people using Ripplepay still, although it's not terribly > active -- about 15-20 payments per month over the last few months. I'm > sure some of the dormant users could be revived if there were new > developments. > > If ILP was easy enough to set up, the fastest thing would be a tool and/or > instructions on how to migrate their accounts over to ILP, assuming most or > all of their connections would also be moving. If you wanted to offer > hosted ILP access, then redeveloping the site to allow connections to > external ILP servers might make sense. > > >> On 8 November 2016 at 20:30, Ryan Fugger wrote: >> >>> This is great Adrian. My plan was always to evolve Ripplepay.com into a >>> decentralized system like this. If you or anyone is interested in >>> upgrading or otherwise using that creeky old system to help support >>> bootstrapping Interledger, I'd be happy to help out however I can. >>> >>> On Tue, Nov 8, 2016 at 12:56 AM, Adrian Hope-Bailie < >>> adrian@hopebailie.com> wrote: >>> >>>> When the Internet was first emerging and large university and research >>>> networks were coming together on the back of the Internet Protocol the >>>> challenge for everyday users was how they could access this new network of >>>> networks without special permission or equipment. >>>> >>>> We face a similar challenge with ILP in that very few of the ledgers >>>> accessible to us support the one function that is critical to universal ILP >>>> payments; real-time conditional transfers. (I wrote a bit about conditional >>>> transfer here: https://medium.com/@ahopebaili >>>> e/the-power-of-conditional-payments-2d1ea531250a) >>>> >>>> So, just like the pioneers of the Internet we're improvising! >>>> >>>> "Dial-up" interledger enables us to bootstrap the Interledger using >>>> "virtual" ledgers between connectors that have established a bounded >>>> trusted relationship. >>>> >>>> In other words, if I run a small connector and I trust my friend Stefan >>>> who also runs a connector then we can transact without needing an >>>> ILP-enabled ledger between us. >>>> >>>> We establish a credit limit that we are both comfortable with and agree >>>> on a way to settle our positions as required (via Bitcoin, bank transfer or >>>> even cash). >>>> >>>> Consider what will happen if we build a community of people who are all >>>> establishing similar peering relationships and then introduce ILP-enabled >>>> ledgers to bridge any gaps between connectors that don't know one another. >>>> Very soon we'll have an entirely new payments network where payments flow >>>> like information does on the Internet today. >>>> >>>> We're calling this project the Interledger Bootstrap Project and I've >>>> started capturing some thoughts on the project wiki: >>>> https://github.com/interledgerjs/ilp-kit/wiki >>>> >>>> In short: >>>> 1. Get the ilp-kit code and run a node >>>> 2. Find other nodes to peer with >>>> 3. Do ILP-enabled transactions >>>> 4. Win! >>>> >>>> The ilp-kit is still pre-release and likely to have some bugs and >>>> change a lot so if you're keen to be an early adopter and help test and >>>> contribute back to that project please do so. If you'd rather wait until >>>> the code stabilizes a bit then keep watching the list and we'll let you >>>> know when the first Beta is available. >>>> >>>> Please feel free to make contributions to the wiki. It would be great >>>> if this was a community effort! >>>> >>>> Adrian >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> Ledger mailing list >>>> Ledger@ietf.org >>>> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ledger >>>> >>>> >>> >> > --001a1130d28a0015570540e57e21 Content-Type: text/html; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
This sounds like a really cool idea!
I think we should wait until the ilp-kit code is stable and a little= more mature and then we can work on a migration path for existing ripplepay.com users who want to migrate.
<= br>
Ito hosted ILP I think the best way to do this is just make it eas= y for people to host themselves, even if they are not technical, through so= mething like Heroku.

Let's take this offline and work on a= roadmap for this. We should probably aim for Q1 2017?

On 10 November 2016 at 00:0= 1, Ryan Fugger <arv@ryanfugger.com> wrote:
On Wed, Nov 9, 2016 at 1:10 PM, Adrian Hope-= Bailie <adrian@hopebailie.com> wrote:
What are your t= houghts on how we'd do that? Is ripplepay.com still in active use? Is there a migration pat= h we could devise for the existing=C2=A0 network to ILP?

There are some people using Ripplepay still, although it'= s not terribly active -- about 15-20 payments per month over the last few m= onths.=C2=A0 I'm sure some of the dormant users could be revived if the= re were new developments.

If ILP was easy enough to set u= p, the fastest thing would be a tool and/or instructions on how to migrate = their accounts over to ILP, assuming most or all of their connections would= also be moving.=C2=A0 If you wanted to offer hosted ILP access, then redev= eloping the site to allow connections to external ILP servers might make se= nse.
=C2=A0
On 8 November 2016 at 20:30, Ryan Fugger <arv@ryanfugger.com> wrote:
This is great= Adrian.=C2=A0 My plan was always to evolve Ripplepay.com into a decentrali= zed system like this.=C2=A0 If you or anyone is interested in upgrading or = otherwise using that creeky old system to help support bootstrapping Interl= edger, I'd be happy to help out however I can.

On Tue, Nov 8, 2016 at 12:56 AM, Adrian H= ope-Bailie <adrian@hopebailie.com> wrote:
= When the Internet was first emerging and large university and research networks were coming together on the back of the Internet Protocol the challenge for everyday users was how they=20 could access this new network of networks without special permission or=20 equipment.

We face a similar challenge with ILP in that= =20 very few of the ledgers accessible to us support the one function that=20 is critical to universal ILP payments; real-time conditional transfers. (I = wrote a bit about conditional transfer here: https://medium.com/@ahopebailie/the-power-of-conditional-paym= ents-2d1ea531250a)

So, just like the pioneers of the Internet we= 're improvising!

"Dial-up" interledger enables us to b= ootstrap the=20 Interledger using "virtual" ledgers between connectors that have= =20 established a bounded trusted relationship.

In other words, if I=20 run a small connector and I trust my friend Stefan who also runs a=20 connector then we can transact without needing an ILP-enabled ledger=20 between us.

We establish a credit limit that we are both comfortable= =20 with and agree on a way to settle our positions as required (via=20 Bitcoin, bank transfer or even cash).

Consider what will happen if w= e build a=20 community of people who are all establishing similar peering=20 relationships and then introduce ILP-enabled ledgers to bridge any gaps=20 between connectors that don't know one another. Very soon we'll hav= e an=20 entirely new payments network where payments flow like information does=20 on the Internet today.

We're calling this project the Inte= rledger Bootstrap Project and I've started capturing some thoughts on t= he project wiki: https://github.com/interledgerjs/ilp-kit/wiki
In short:
1. Get the ilp-kit code and run a node
2. Find other nodes to peer with
3. Do ILP-enabled transactions=
4. Win!

The ilp-kit is still pre-release and li= kely to have some bugs and change a lot so if you're keen to be an earl= y adopter and help test and contribute back to that project please do so. I= f you'd rather wait until the code stabilizes a bit then keep watching = the list and we'll let you know when the first Beta is available.

Please feel free to make contributions to the wiki. It w= ould be great if this was a community effort!

Adrian

_______________________________________________
Ledger mailing list
Ledger@ietf.org https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ledger




--001a1130d28a0015570540e57e21-- From nobody Thu Nov 10 13:56:24 2016 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ledger@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: ledger@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id E9C9E129685 for ; Thu, 10 Nov 2016 13:56:22 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.999 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.999 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE=-0.0001, SPF_PASS=-0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=gmail.com Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id BRlltnzXapIZ for ; Thu, 10 Nov 2016 13:56:20 -0800 (PST) Received: from mail-ua0-x233.google.com (mail-ua0-x233.google.com [IPv6:2607:f8b0:400c:c08::233]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 74B9B1295CA for ; Thu, 10 Nov 2016 13:56:20 -0800 (PST) Received: by mail-ua0-x233.google.com with SMTP id 51so212927481uai.1 for ; Thu, 10 Nov 2016 13:56:20 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20120113; h=mime-version:in-reply-to:references:from:date:message-id:subject:to :cc; bh=MQQ/KRMqvSIS4u7pmr1wjBpA+pAUq+8A5jOUH4P47Ek=; b=GlMI3cNzcozlZG0KN0hTdSCHkQFGlFOnBA0ft7JXjQ9ZIbQYamZgYU+PgMOnPH3l0F 1oYBj5yvAUYhOmd3QniRR2S+HDx8OKSCn4RsVpxA2V4XluvU5I7xo5b65Piq7yBVLhC+ 8+c1QpPMNuliJxPfetxJPDAba4DeLmKfPXcIt7yZZ89tbLFJ56mKzyaDF/BODQDYm83o DyVsiA58nM1AjQGV4pGAgV6HTMCtdWhZblxhC8ns7VhAkwKaCYX8nMaCeWKnUH49pQo3 iIJWxmtZwYoXGA459uViLdIYjmGVgVGotKRrcHvz5tkKqoh005TM5sPyNJKdYG6pNXU0 HcgA== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20130820; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:in-reply-to:references:from:date :message-id:subject:to:cc; bh=MQQ/KRMqvSIS4u7pmr1wjBpA+pAUq+8A5jOUH4P47Ek=; b=R4fluaGpzd/WQQ0mUHsLv3ViUVAOURzJV8GZotO7V1TaFsV7rYxIIcnXpx4HI1CEbe RhMJyYHlXeP/zksa78hiWdRdiBi/ybPNSB1aVDxujShs4NWY/nv6562yoqPwZ6QCiVHD WySpBgS43Vcc1HXzlAAyIU7RAapw6WC1Kv2mMbnm/w3NZUBobrDdxEsTSPcvGkXIaGD5 eEetEv9eDgOpDqYRUnGd7NJvVM/iIvbXqZjwtSS3yCRm7+oYYn9DiNOMwHapZG2Yw3ts PY7ItUrXlnfOkR36Y7jrFIuUrUZKABOHd9RtN9zKr+jhzuhcVHcYr0DLvdPiv/hdFbSj TC2Q== X-Gm-Message-State: ABUngvf7cyJotm0xVZqBaxC6dliypqA7GFiOrkGZ8/xR3rTiotYHpW9Wz33/kAyVe4nfi1sCuSCYZuTiSCFqyQ== X-Received: by 10.176.85.199 with SMTP id w7mr4967466uaa.75.1478814979431; Thu, 10 Nov 2016 13:56:19 -0800 (PST) MIME-Version: 1.0 Received: by 10.176.0.168 with HTTP; Thu, 10 Nov 2016 13:56:19 -0800 (PST) In-Reply-To: References: From: Andrew Bransford Brown Date: Thu, 10 Nov 2016 16:56:19 -0500 Message-ID: To: Jacob Pratt Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary=f403045e343489a1330540f971ed Archived-At: Cc: Tom Haas , Tony Arcieri , Interledger Community Group , Interledger Mailing List - IETF , Adrian Hope-Bailie Subject: Re: [Ledger] Regulatory Considerations running an ILP node (Re: Bootstrapping Interledger) X-BeenThere: ledger@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.17 Precedence: list List-Id: "Discussion of interledger, originally a protocol stack for moving digital assets \(making payments\) between accounts operating on different payment networks or ledgers." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 10 Nov 2016 21:56:23 -0000 --f403045e343489a1330540f971ed Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 If it's designed right, you won't have any regulatory concerns. I offer $10 My terms 1 OSTK You offer $8 I offer $9 You agree I deliver $9 You deliver 1 OSTK End transaction. Time stamps on each "event". That has sufficient granularity to describe any transaction (currency, stock, bonds, grocery store transactions). It's a real-time system, and provides its own audit trail. Algorithms monitor for status. Andrew B. Brown (512) 947-8282 http://KidsCourtyard.com On Thu, Nov 10, 2016 at 3:43 PM, Jacob Pratt wrote: > Sorry, I'm a bit confused by this email. Will the testing for ILP be done > using actual currency or dummy currency? Initially you say dummy currency, > which is what I think would make more sense, but later you are speaking of > the risk and potential losses, which would only be affiliated with actual > currency. > > Jacob H. Pratt > > On Wed, Nov 9, 2016 at 4:39 PM, Andrew Bransford Brown > wrote: > >> My suggestion is that if you start getting into "credit units" of some >> kind, you're on the wrong track. I say this from an accounting and trading >> perspective. >> >> The value being traded exists somewhere at all times and its location and >> owner must be known at every step in the transaction. >> >> Andrew B. Brown >> (512) 947-8282 >> http://KidsCourtyard.com >> >> >> On Wed, Nov 9, 2016 at 4:00 PM, Adrian Hope-Bailie > > wrote: >> >>> As I mention in the wiki, the goal is to test the capabilities of the >>> protocol by bootstrapping a real network of ILP nodes (not create an >>> unregulated payment network). >>> >>> I think it's important for this to be a network moving real value >>> otherwise it's difficult to motivate people testing things built on top of >>> the protocol to even consider ILP. We're only going to test this properly >>> when there is some skin in the game, we just need to make sure nobody >>> stands to lose more than they can afford to risk. >>> >>> As I have also said in the wiki, we have the advantage of a number >>> highly valued crypto-currencies that offer us "permission-less innovation" >>> and the opportunity to move real value without (in most cases) breaking any >>> laws. If your particular situation prohibits you from running an ILP node >>> for fiat currencies but you can transmit and exchange crypto legally then >>> that's the way you can move real value. >>> >>> Obviously, every person that chooses to run an ILP node should evaluate >>> their own situation and not do anything illegal. For some, that might mean >>> sticking to fake money initially or developing a community currency system >>> between small groups of peers. >>> >>> Most importantly though, we should continue to only move small amounts >>> both because we don't want anyone to risk more than they can afford to lose >>> in helping to bootstrap this project (which is still under heavy >>> development) but also because we don't want to raise the ire of regulators >>> when our immediate goal is to test the protocol not become an unregulated >>> payment network. >>> >>> Finally, and this may be obvious, but I want to be clear, that by >>> running a node and exchanging real value using this immature protocol, you >>> are taking a risk. I (and I think I speak for everyone else involved in the >>> project) take no responsibility for any losses anyone incurs, whether >>> direct or indirect, in being a part of this. We are being pioneers and >>> there are risks. >>> >>> Be responsible, only exchange small amounts and make sure you understand >>> the applicable regulations for your specific case before you proceed. >>> >>> >>> On 9 November 2016 at 21:59, Tony Arcieri wrote: >>> >>>> On Wed, Nov 9, 2016 at 11:42 AM, Andrew Bransford Brown < >>>> andrewbb@gmail.com> wrote: >>>> >>>>> I'd suggest a State exchange to avoid SEC regulations while building >>>>> the market. Once you cross state lines, then pass the SEC regs. >>>>> >>>> >>>> It's a little more complicated than that. Individual states within the >>>> US have their own money transmitter laws, which often apply to money >>>> transfers within the state in addition to transfers between states or >>>> countries. >>>> >>>> Setting up a test network with a fake currency that has no actual value >>>> sounds ok, but if you are moving real money, even within a single state >>>> (state laws providing), you'll want to have a money transmitter license >>>> before you do so. For transmitting money between states, you'll need >>>> licenses for every state you plan on operating in. >>>> >>>> -- >>>> Tony Arcieri >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> Ledger mailing list >>>> Ledger@ietf.org >>>> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ledger >>>> >>>> >>> >> > --f403045e343489a1330540f971ed Content-Type: text/html; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
If it's designed right, you won't have any regulat= ory concerns.

I offer $10
My terms 1 OSTK
You offer $8
I offer $9
You agree
I del= iver $9
You deliver 1 OSTK
End transaction.
<= br>
Time stamps on each "event".=C2=A0 That has suffici= ent granularity to describe any transaction (currency, stock, bonds, grocer= y store transactions).=C2=A0 It's a real-time system, and provides its = own audit trail.=C2=A0 Algorithms monitor for status.

=
Andrew B. Brown
(512) 947-8282


On Thu, Nov 10, 2016 at 3:43 PM, Jacob Pratt= <jhprattdev@gmail.com> wrote:
Sorry, I'm a bit confused by this email. Will = the testing for ILP be done using actual currency or dummy currency? Initia= lly you say dummy currency, which is what I think would make more sense, bu= t later you are speaking of the risk and potential losses, which would only= be affiliated with actual currency.

Jacob H. Pratt

On Wed, Nov 9, 2016 at 4:39 PM, Andrew Brans= ford Brown <andrewbb@gmail.com> wrote:
My suggestion is that if you start getting i= nto "credit units" of some kind, you're on the wrong track.= =C2=A0 I say this from an accounting and trading perspective.

The value being traded exists somewhere at all times and its location= and owner must be known at every step in the transaction.

Andrew B. Brown
<= a href=3D"tel:%28512%29%20947-8282" value=3D"+15129478282" target=3D"_blank= ">(512) 947-8282


On Wed, Nov 9, 2016 at 4:00 PM, Adrian Hope-= Bailie <adrian@hopebailie.com> wrote:
As I mention in the wiki, the go= al is to test the capabilities of the protocol by bootstrapping a real netw= ork of ILP nodes (not create an unregulated payment network).

= I think it's important for this to be a network moving real value other= wise it's difficult to motivate people testing things built on top of t= he protocol to even consider ILP. We're only going to test this properl= y when there is some skin in the game, we just need to make sure nobody sta= nds to lose more than they can afford to risk.

As I have also said i= n the wiki, we have the advantage of a number highly valued crypto-currenci= es that offer us "permission-less innovation" and the opportunity= to move real value without (in most cases) breaking any laws. If your part= icular situation prohibits you from running an ILP node for fiat currencies= but you can transmit and exchange crypto legally then that's the way y= ou can move real value.

Obviously, every person that chooses t= o run an ILP node should evaluate their own situation and not do anything i= llegal. For some, that might mean sticking to fake money initially or devel= oping a community currency system between small groups of peers.

Most importantly though, we should continue to only move small amoun= ts both because we don't want anyone to risk more than they can afford = to lose in helping to bootstrap this project (which is still under heavy de= velopment) but also because we don't want to raise the ire of regulator= s when our immediate goal is to test the protocol not become an unregulated= payment network.

Finally, and this may be obvious, but I want= to be clear, that by running a node and exchanging real value using this i= mmature protocol, you are taking a risk. I (and I think I speak for everyon= e else involved in the project) take no responsibility for any losses anyon= e incurs, whether direct or indirect, in being a part of this. We are being= pioneers and there are risks.

Be responsible, only excha= nge small amounts and make sure you understand the applicable regulations f= or your specific case before you proceed.


On 9 Novemb= er 2016 at 21:59, Tony Arcieri <bascule@gmail.com> wrote:
On Wed, Nov 9, 2016 at 11:42 AM, Andrew B= ransford Brown <andrewbb@gmail.com> wrote:
I'd suggest a State exchange to avoi= d SEC regulations while building the market.=C2=A0 Once you cross state lin= es, then pass the SEC regs.

It= 's a little more complicated than that. Individual states within the US= have their own money transmitter laws, which often apply to money transfer= s within the state in addition to transfers between states or countries.

Setting up a test network with a fake currency that = has no actual value sounds ok, but if you are moving real money, even withi= n a single state (state laws providing), you'll want to have a money tr= ansmitter license before you do so. For transmitting money between states, = you'll need licenses for every state you plan on operating in.

--
Tony Arcieri

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--f403045e343489a1330540f971ed-- From jhprattdev@gmail.com Thu Nov 10 12:43:04 2016 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ledger@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: ledger@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id E1220129441 for ; Thu, 10 Nov 2016 12:43:04 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.699 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.699 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW=-0.7, SPF_PASS=-0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=gmail.com Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id SSHMfJjYNbZS for ; Thu, 10 Nov 2016 12:43:02 -0800 (PST) Received: from mail-yw0-x234.google.com (mail-yw0-x234.google.com [IPv6:2607:f8b0:4002:c05::234]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 8E8F91294CA for ; Thu, 10 Nov 2016 12:43:02 -0800 (PST) Received: by mail-yw0-x234.google.com with SMTP id r204so259588259ywb.0 for ; Thu, 10 Nov 2016 12:43:02 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20120113; h=mime-version:in-reply-to:references:from:date:message-id:subject:to :cc; bh=MIZPLflOmLADGlndmWBMhaiZFaVpnbJm1zXAmt88mhU=; b=ek+5T1KLAJIpNTQIJJk5N/EJS5wEuV4VolDSFJK2dcR34DxK9+rcRVETVi1KP2sstF ZFBDYlAUbgceytUijihgkfkfqP8HlsUm5T8D4VCUxXQkykLR/J14JpasI7eaMSouBIzL sx2Z2WyFPr8ndiJ1PYRl8KBB4YhvOSXpnrTfPP/EjgJr3tiU64EZoC2ETT9PwYAA460Y gH1uJmAiSgREXE4r/zgx8d+aK+aBhT0h2sh9Bl6YjoLJDQnbTJlIi5FEqRHEVYYCaiAL uDgxfQVASbt8f1BzQDLLmxcm3FlNEHssjpV5NEDsdBezYKu/otrtmfDV/UGnixK7mVz8 tPRQ== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20130820; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:in-reply-to:references:from:date :message-id:subject:to:cc; bh=MIZPLflOmLADGlndmWBMhaiZFaVpnbJm1zXAmt88mhU=; b=aLQe+HgO/ZNsXVqmPtf3gkz5zsVOjfGW1Pwq+bBA9pRQOiB+DAMuXCAaGfmfhO2il/ a8b/MwBrWY2DiWK7ck33VL2lttSR3jXKZdr+XoDjZYIIIEb+6dvZRdtTltVRlDwPIM/8 Uf5dGFAs0JkTx1yZ9UFvf9jq3H4Lf4+XjZ8Js2Bd+5IqUpmVI61iet9ixWn/sVmPLNGk v7l1l1ucji6WbpsteWpdAsXFfyrrw0BieJhHyMkaYnlMogkZVtxiiLHY8FFSdgq3qD98 Hw7SehH04LvgOUf2NGTw24guRDcYlOrpf1ehiOlLd4q8IxFLdNpawGzYwL5ClPB1lFr/ YazA== X-Gm-Message-State: ABUngvdBnOgNekMUO4jYKVT88Zlo22APuoGHlRxtSYP+lCj/PB/pU4A3npimInX0+qCB3GV0WUGMWv9N9TQxrQ== X-Received: by 10.157.15.154 with SMTP id d26mr2825505otd.85.1478810581798; Thu, 10 Nov 2016 12:43:01 -0800 (PST) MIME-Version: 1.0 Received: by 10.157.34.105 with HTTP; Thu, 10 Nov 2016 12:43:01 -0800 (PST) In-Reply-To: References: From: Jacob Pratt Date: Thu, 10 Nov 2016 15:43:01 -0500 Message-ID: To: Andrew Bransford Brown Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary=001a113cf2066b14b90540f86b6c Archived-At: X-Mailman-Approved-At: Fri, 11 Nov 2016 18:45:54 -0800 Cc: Tom Haas , Tony Arcieri , Interledger Community Group , Interledger Mailing List - IETF , Adrian Hope-Bailie Subject: Re: [Ledger] Regulatory Considerations running an ILP node (Re: Bootstrapping Interledger) X-BeenThere: ledger@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.17 Precedence: list List-Id: "Discussion of interledger, originally a protocol stack for moving digital assets \(making payments\) between accounts operating on different payment networks or ledgers." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 10 Nov 2016 20:51:40 -0000 --001a113cf2066b14b90540f86b6c Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 Sorry, I'm a bit confused by this email. Will the testing for ILP be done using actual currency or dummy currency? Initially you say dummy currency, which is what I think would make more sense, but later you are speaking of the risk and potential losses, which would only be affiliated with actual currency. Jacob H. Pratt On Wed, Nov 9, 2016 at 4:39 PM, Andrew Bransford Brown wrote: > My suggestion is that if you start getting into "credit units" of some > kind, you're on the wrong track. I say this from an accounting and trading > perspective. > > The value being traded exists somewhere at all times and its location and > owner must be known at every step in the transaction. > > Andrew B. Brown > (512) 947-8282 > http://KidsCourtyard.com > > > On Wed, Nov 9, 2016 at 4:00 PM, Adrian Hope-Bailie > wrote: > >> As I mention in the wiki, the goal is to test the capabilities of the >> protocol by bootstrapping a real network of ILP nodes (not create an >> unregulated payment network). >> >> I think it's important for this to be a network moving real value >> otherwise it's difficult to motivate people testing things built on top of >> the protocol to even consider ILP. We're only going to test this properly >> when there is some skin in the game, we just need to make sure nobody >> stands to lose more than they can afford to risk. >> >> As I have also said in the wiki, we have the advantage of a number highly >> valued crypto-currencies that offer us "permission-less innovation" and the >> opportunity to move real value without (in most cases) breaking any laws. >> If your particular situation prohibits you from running an ILP node for >> fiat currencies but you can transmit and exchange crypto legally then >> that's the way you can move real value. >> >> Obviously, every person that chooses to run an ILP node should evaluate >> their own situation and not do anything illegal. For some, that might mean >> sticking to fake money initially or developing a community currency system >> between small groups of peers. >> >> Most importantly though, we should continue to only move small amounts >> both because we don't want anyone to risk more than they can afford to lose >> in helping to bootstrap this project (which is still under heavy >> development) but also because we don't want to raise the ire of regulators >> when our immediate goal is to test the protocol not become an unregulated >> payment network. >> >> Finally, and this may be obvious, but I want to be clear, that by running >> a node and exchanging real value using this immature protocol, you are >> taking a risk. I (and I think I speak for everyone else involved in the >> project) take no responsibility for any losses anyone incurs, whether >> direct or indirect, in being a part of this. We are being pioneers and >> there are risks. >> >> Be responsible, only exchange small amounts and make sure you understand >> the applicable regulations for your specific case before you proceed. >> >> >> On 9 November 2016 at 21:59, Tony Arcieri wrote: >> >>> On Wed, Nov 9, 2016 at 11:42 AM, Andrew Bransford Brown < >>> andrewbb@gmail.com> wrote: >>> >>>> I'd suggest a State exchange to avoid SEC regulations while building >>>> the market. Once you cross state lines, then pass the SEC regs. >>>> >>> >>> It's a little more complicated than that. Individual states within the >>> US have their own money transmitter laws, which often apply to money >>> transfers within the state in addition to transfers between states or >>> countries. >>> >>> Setting up a test network with a fake currency that has no actual value >>> sounds ok, but if you are moving real money, even within a single state >>> (state laws providing), you'll want to have a money transmitter license >>> before you do so. For transmitting money between states, you'll need >>> licenses for every state you plan on operating in. >>> >>> -- >>> Tony Arcieri >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> Ledger mailing list >>> Ledger@ietf.org >>> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ledger >>> >>> >> > --001a113cf2066b14b90540f86b6c Content-Type: text/html; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Sorry, I'm a bit confused by this email. Will the test= ing for ILP be done using actual currency or dummy currency? Initially you = say dummy currency, which is what I think would make more sense, but later = you are speaking of the risk and potential losses, which would only be affi= liated with actual currency.

=
Jacob H. Pratt

On Wed, Nov 9, 2016 at 4:39 PM, Andrew Brans= ford Brown <andrewbb@gmail.com> wrote:
My suggestion is that if you start getting i= nto "credit units" of some kind, you're on the wrong track.= =C2=A0 I say this from an accounting and trading perspective.

The value being traded exists somewhere at all times and its location= and owner must be known at every step in the transaction.

<= div>
<= /div>

On Wed, Nov 9, 2016 at 4:00 PM, Adrian Hope-= Bailie <adrian@hopebailie.com> wrote:
As I mention in the wiki, the go= al is to test the capabilities of the protocol by bootstrapping a real netw= ork of ILP nodes (not create an unregulated payment network).

= I think it's important for this to be a network moving real value other= wise it's difficult to motivate people testing things built on top of t= he protocol to even consider ILP. We're only going to test this properl= y when there is some skin in the game, we just need to make sure nobody sta= nds to lose more than they can afford to risk.

As I have also said i= n the wiki, we have the advantage of a number highly valued crypto-currenci= es that offer us "permission-less innovation" and the opportunity= to move real value without (in most cases) breaking any laws. If your part= icular situation prohibits you from running an ILP node for fiat currencies= but you can transmit and exchange crypto legally then that's the way y= ou can move real value.

Obviously, every person that chooses t= o run an ILP node should evaluate their own situation and not do anything i= llegal. For some, that might mean sticking to fake money initially or devel= oping a community currency system between small groups of peers.

Most importantly though, we should continue to only move small amoun= ts both because we don't want anyone to risk more than they can afford = to lose in helping to bootstrap this project (which is still under heavy de= velopment) but also because we don't want to raise the ire of regulator= s when our immediate goal is to test the protocol not become an unregulated= payment network.

Finally, and this may be obvious, but I want= to be clear, that by running a node and exchanging real value using this i= mmature protocol, you are taking a risk. I (and I think I speak for everyon= e else involved in the project) take no responsibility for any losses anyon= e incurs, whether direct or indirect, in being a part of this. We are being= pioneers and there are risks.

Be responsible, only excha= nge small amounts and make sure you understand the applicable regulations f= or your specific case before you proceed.


On 9 Novemb= er 2016 at 21:59, Tony Arcieri <bascule@gmail.com> wrote:
On Wed, Nov 9, 2016 at 11:42 AM, Andrew B= ransford Brown <andrewbb@gmail.com> wrote:
I'd suggest a State exchange to avoi= d SEC regulations while building the market.=C2=A0 Once you cross state lin= es, then pass the SEC regs.

It= 's a little more complicated than that. Individual states within the US= have their own money transmitter laws, which often apply to money transfer= s within the state in addition to transfers between states or countries.

Setting up a test network with a fake currency that = has no actual value sounds ok, but if you are moving real money, even withi= n a single state (state laws providing), you'll want to have a money tr= ansmitter license before you do so. For transmitting money between states, = you'll need licenses for every state you plan on operating in.

--
Tony = Arcieri

_______________________________________________
Ledger mailing list
Ledger@ietf.org https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ledger



--001a113cf2066b14b90540f86b6c-- From nobody Sun Nov 13 13:16:42 2016 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ledger@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: ledger@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id C0EB31295A0 for ; Sun, 13 Nov 2016 13:16:40 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.699 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.699 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW=-0.7] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (1024-bit key) header.d=hopebailie.com Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id G88ONXQOKYoX for ; Sun, 13 Nov 2016 13:16:38 -0800 (PST) Received: from mail-wm0-x233.google.com (mail-wm0-x233.google.com [IPv6:2a00:1450:400c:c09::233]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 18EE212943F for ; Sun, 13 Nov 2016 13:16:38 -0800 (PST) Received: by mail-wm0-x233.google.com with SMTP id a197so67016348wmd.0 for ; Sun, 13 Nov 2016 13:16:37 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=hopebailie.com; s=google; h=mime-version:in-reply-to:references:from:date:message-id:subject:to :cc; bh=7hOzYcSeou/+tH2XnNVjYnDYTfBffmJnYKvoj9nwiY0=; b=HqAxIavYdjZ1bcvxp1aI3D4WGh8fBwyeHQ06nfiIXdkTh7weZJQ/QTywMymhjf0krm aE2cdo5PzFW/5foOawDeRv2KlH8Hp2zsGyuqckjksLPCdLoKyiI+ZWxF/5vJ2i9RRnhZ zUQJ/AyjC3/PEsNrbpCVVowoDWHUskJfQ3y2Q= X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20130820; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:in-reply-to:references:from:date :message-id:subject:to:cc; bh=7hOzYcSeou/+tH2XnNVjYnDYTfBffmJnYKvoj9nwiY0=; b=R+tBms+fmtqF1B+zxuDtLpWxxzHJUMWsKwGOKJL91GF3CgDyvaKSuvIFjsrmW9OVwJ c4E+jhMAR/ow9UMKocFjVVoqb4Jm3CcHjgrjwmU7/AwsucNx3KGRHKVVdcxUK/3iCURL hQGkRdeHMa8VbzgU7XO6eCmlUfoyJl1fhYA6AucQJci5T78lwbNLVcYsN1lV14KPTUI3 bcYxRmKm/Wlg+NEoHzMHOOQx+FOGMqdn/pzbUYwh7q0wsaQ6eRalee03GEoegdUUaauY zUvW4dTdex0DT49J7gy7Y/9Sg3hVIYgziMI2aWj6EGDJ6Jvsrp+acfoJp1ze0fFMF5XR fAaQ== X-Gm-Message-State: ABUngvcEO+nIgEBovQB9XO1HfmF/6/iXQojYoATYDV4bh6mUOUAY2EqR/fQaYCsA5m0xyEAm8bekBlzKLKKeAw== X-Received: by 10.194.148.134 with SMTP id ts6mr17050218wjb.220.1479071796356; Sun, 13 Nov 2016 13:16:36 -0800 (PST) MIME-Version: 1.0 Received: by 10.194.115.6 with HTTP; Sun, 13 Nov 2016 13:16:35 -0800 (PST) In-Reply-To: References: From: Adrian Hope-Bailie Date: Sun, 13 Nov 2016 23:16:35 +0200 Message-ID: To: Jacob Pratt Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary=089e0117664d0504ae0541353dc9 Archived-At: Cc: Tom Haas , Tony Arcieri , Interledger Community Group , Interledger Mailing List - IETF , Andrew Bransford Brown Subject: Re: [Ledger] Regulatory Considerations running an ILP node (Re: Bootstrapping Interledger) X-BeenThere: ledger@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.17 Precedence: list List-Id: "Discussion of interledger, originally a protocol stack for moving digital assets \(making payments\) between accounts operating on different payment networks or ledgers." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sun, 13 Nov 2016 21:16:41 -0000 --089e0117664d0504ae0541353dc9 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 We've been testing with dummy currency for quite a while already. The plan for the next phase is for anyone willing, to run an instance of ilp-kit (an Interledger node effectively) and set up relationships with other nodes to exchange "real" value. By that I mean, it's not made up money but we don't restrict it to fiat currency. In fact, we think the best thing to do initially is use crypto-currencies like Bitcoin, XRP, Ether etc. These currencies have value, so there is an incentive to use the network and also break it (which will help us ensure we can prevent that), but they are also not regulated in the same way as fiat so we have some wiggle room to test the network legally where we may be less free using USD or the like. I want to re-emphasize that the goal is testing the network so we should stick to very small amounts On 10 November 2016 at 22:43, Jacob Pratt wrote: > Sorry, I'm a bit confused by this email. Will the testing for ILP be done > using actual currency or dummy currency? Initially you say dummy currency, > which is what I think would make more sense, but later you are speaking of > the risk and potential losses, which would only be affiliated with actual > currency. > > Jacob H. Pratt > > On Wed, Nov 9, 2016 at 4:39 PM, Andrew Bransford Brown > wrote: > >> My suggestion is that if you start getting into "credit units" of some >> kind, you're on the wrong track. I say this from an accounting and trading >> perspective. >> >> The value being traded exists somewhere at all times and its location and >> owner must be known at every step in the transaction. >> >> Andrew B. Brown >> (512) 947-8282 >> http://KidsCourtyard.com >> >> >> On Wed, Nov 9, 2016 at 4:00 PM, Adrian Hope-Bailie > > wrote: >> >>> As I mention in the wiki, the goal is to test the capabilities of the >>> protocol by bootstrapping a real network of ILP nodes (not create an >>> unregulated payment network). >>> >>> I think it's important for this to be a network moving real value >>> otherwise it's difficult to motivate people testing things built on top of >>> the protocol to even consider ILP. We're only going to test this properly >>> when there is some skin in the game, we just need to make sure nobody >>> stands to lose more than they can afford to risk. >>> >>> As I have also said in the wiki, we have the advantage of a number >>> highly valued crypto-currencies that offer us "permission-less innovation" >>> and the opportunity to move real value without (in most cases) breaking any >>> laws. If your particular situation prohibits you from running an ILP node >>> for fiat currencies but you can transmit and exchange crypto legally then >>> that's the way you can move real value. >>> >>> Obviously, every person that chooses to run an ILP node should evaluate >>> their own situation and not do anything illegal. For some, that might mean >>> sticking to fake money initially or developing a community currency system >>> between small groups of peers. >>> >>> Most importantly though, we should continue to only move small amounts >>> both because we don't want anyone to risk more than they can afford to lose >>> in helping to bootstrap this project (which is still under heavy >>> development) but also because we don't want to raise the ire of regulators >>> when our immediate goal is to test the protocol not become an unregulated >>> payment network. >>> >>> Finally, and this may be obvious, but I want to be clear, that by >>> running a node and exchanging real value using this immature protocol, you >>> are taking a risk. I (and I think I speak for everyone else involved in the >>> project) take no responsibility for any losses anyone incurs, whether >>> direct or indirect, in being a part of this. We are being pioneers and >>> there are risks. >>> >>> Be responsible, only exchange small amounts and make sure you understand >>> the applicable regulations for your specific case before you proceed. >>> >>> >>> On 9 November 2016 at 21:59, Tony Arcieri wrote: >>> >>>> On Wed, Nov 9, 2016 at 11:42 AM, Andrew Bransford Brown < >>>> andrewbb@gmail.com> wrote: >>>> >>>>> I'd suggest a State exchange to avoid SEC regulations while building >>>>> the market. Once you cross state lines, then pass the SEC regs. >>>>> >>>> >>>> It's a little more complicated than that. Individual states within the >>>> US have their own money transmitter laws, which often apply to money >>>> transfers within the state in addition to transfers between states or >>>> countries. >>>> >>>> Setting up a test network with a fake currency that has no actual value >>>> sounds ok, but if you are moving real money, even within a single state >>>> (state laws providing), you'll want to have a money transmitter license >>>> before you do so. For transmitting money between states, you'll need >>>> licenses for every state you plan on operating in. >>>> >>>> -- >>>> Tony Arcieri >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> Ledger mailing list >>>> Ledger@ietf.org >>>> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ledger >>>> >>>> >>> >> > > _______________________________________________ > Ledger mailing list > Ledger@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ledger > > --089e0117664d0504ae0541353dc9 Content-Type: text/html; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
We've been testing with dummy curr= ency for quite a while already.

The plan for the next phase i= s for anyone willing, to run an instance of ilp-kit (an Interledger node ef= fectively) and set up relationships with other nodes to exchange "real= " value.

By that I mean, it's not made up money but w= e don't restrict it to fiat currency. In fact, we think the best thing = to do initially is use crypto-currencies like Bitcoin, XRP, Ether etc.
<= br>
These currencies have value, so there is an incentive to use the n= etwork and also break it (which will help us ensure we can prevent that), b= ut they are also not regulated in the same way as fiat so we have some wigg= le room to test the network legally where we may be less free using USD or = the like.

I want to re-emphasize that the goal is testing the = network so we should stick to very small amounts

On 10 November 2016 at 22:43, Jaco= b Pratt <jhprattdev@gmail.com> wrote:
Sorry, I'm a bit confused by this email= . Will the testing for ILP be done using actual currency or dummy currency?= Initially you say dummy currency, which is what I think would make more se= nse, but later you are speaking of the risk and potential losses, which wou= ld only be affiliated with actual currency.

Jacob H. Pratt

On Wed, Nov 9, 2016 at 4:39 PM, Andrew Brans= ford Brown <andrewbb@gmail.com> wrote:
My suggestion is that if you start getting i= nto "credit units" of some kind, you're on the wrong track.= =C2=A0 I say this from an accounting and trading perspective.

The value being traded exists somewhere at all times and its location= and owner must be known at every step in the transaction.

Andrew B. Brown
(512) 947-8282
<= a href=3D"http://KidsCourtyard.com" target=3D"_blank">http://KidsCourtyard.= com


On Wed, Nov 9, 2016 at 4:00 PM, Adrian Hope-= Bailie <adrian@hopebailie.com> wrote:
As I mention in the wiki, the go= al is to test the capabilities of the protocol by bootstrapping a real netw= ork of ILP nodes (not create an unregulated payment network).

= I think it's important for this to be a network moving real value other= wise it's difficult to motivate people testing things built on top of t= he protocol to even consider ILP. We're only going to test this properl= y when there is some skin in the game, we just need to make sure nobody sta= nds to lose more than they can afford to risk.

As I have also said i= n the wiki, we have the advantage of a number highly valued crypto-currenci= es that offer us "permission-less innovation" and the opportunity= to move real value without (in most cases) breaking any laws. If your part= icular situation prohibits you from running an ILP node for fiat currencies= but you can transmit and exchange crypto legally then that's the way y= ou can move real value.

Obviously, every person that chooses t= o run an ILP node should evaluate their own situation and not do anything i= llegal. For some, that might mean sticking to fake money initially or devel= oping a community currency system between small groups of peers.

Most importantly though, we should continue to only move small amoun= ts both because we don't want anyone to risk more than they can afford = to lose in helping to bootstrap this project (which is still under heavy de= velopment) but also because we don't want to raise the ire of regulator= s when our immediate goal is to test the protocol not become an unregulated= payment network.

Finally, and this may be obvious, but I want= to be clear, that by running a node and exchanging real value using this i= mmature protocol, you are taking a risk. I (and I think I speak for everyon= e else involved in the project) take no responsibility for any losses anyon= e incurs, whether direct or indirect, in being a part of this. We are being= pioneers and there are risks.

Be responsible, only excha= nge small amounts and make sure you understand the applicable regulations f= or your specific case before you proceed.


On 9 Novemb= er 2016 at 21:59, Tony Arcieri <bascule@gmail.com> wrote:
On Wed, Nov 9, 2016 at 11:42 AM, Andrew B= ransford Brown <andrewbb@gmail.com> wrote:
I'd suggest a State exchange to avoi= d SEC regulations while building the market.=C2=A0 Once you cross state lin= es, then pass the SEC regs.

It= 's a little more complicated than that. Individual states within the US= have their own money transmitter laws, which often apply to money transfer= s within the state in addition to transfers between states or countries.

Setting up a test network with a fake currency that = has no actual value sounds ok, but if you are moving real money, even withi= n a single state (state laws providing), you'll want to have a money tr= ansmitter license before you do so. For transmitting money between states, = you'll need licenses for every state you plan on operating in.

--
Tony Arcieri

_______________________________________________
Ledger mailing list
Ledger@ietf.org https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ledger




_______________________________________________
Ledger mailing list
Ledger@ietf.org
https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ledger

--089e0117664d0504ae0541353dc9-- From nobody Tue Nov 15 09:18:32 2016 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ledger@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: ledger@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id BC44C129574 for ; Tue, 15 Nov 2016 09:18:31 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -0.444 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-0.444 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, HTML_IMAGE_ONLY_20=1.546, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, T_REMOTE_IMAGE=0.01] autolearn=no autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (1024-bit key) header.d=ripple.com Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id o35Vv4wKoDCI for ; Tue, 15 Nov 2016 09:18:30 -0800 (PST) Received: from mail-qk0-x229.google.com (mail-qk0-x229.google.com [IPv6:2607:f8b0:400d:c09::229]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 87A7E1293F0 for ; Tue, 15 Nov 2016 09:18:30 -0800 (PST) Received: by mail-qk0-x229.google.com with SMTP id n21so143429758qka.3 for ; Tue, 15 Nov 2016 09:18:30 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=ripple.com; s=google; h=mime-version:from:date:message-id:subject:to; bh=GG5dnekUS2bbErt1x2+PAb7t1c4Lrbj5B4ez456L2Mw=; b=i7Kr+UOueVG9qtga8H2CKjTXvC2gp5QGuU9QnvBSSIWweR43FXAGYKwbtddor5ZtD7 24tBO4LH/8iYK3hTcA9K9BAVVgXOgkxtv/Ti4IqLR6rTvPnmsBBH/zFtwp9kR8BLVsAE vTUu9K0CZ4EN3UJ18DLkZYrBlDZLjnYWugGRo= X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20130820; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:from:date:message-id:subject:to; bh=GG5dnekUS2bbErt1x2+PAb7t1c4Lrbj5B4ez456L2Mw=; b=l0rTh96w72wgfkOgFSaNXFfU+jJuWikvyYzY0GoQqroaTlFqMkq0gquRDFTl5dsPZt fl/4lAAptdmzfgNbV7oVPpgRlq6rY2kpegFHZldMuCa6whxjkIGyUKmsf1yRbH5yITvd cuNK0l8j4M67UaMyFLUTLwUw7hGfVsSE2OZck6P8ERRNPgy5X/7mAf2Ho9LYOzcGLaz6 WRQvBSfn4SJg87T23Sn7j54iYqdQ12jmR1GiHD8B+NR2He+GBFM3UdLAaizlAViE7iQ7 ObUnd8ldUCA8iwBSLNLQXA7LsBDbOPJ+YOBHD5ZJwWMk5sxvmB/ZdoMPiZBIwoNWxK9t FgCA== X-Gm-Message-State: ABUngveBV2hCMKhJJV3KJkZW26kyp5V0o48O8RI7Du8YoY5aoroV5bvTHJ8Y0Z8yJ6B1gbN1TxHC5a0NAxzMeJSg X-Received: by 10.55.140.132 with SMTP id o126mr19050492qkd.227.1479230309584; Tue, 15 Nov 2016 09:18:29 -0800 (PST) MIME-Version: 1.0 Received: by 10.12.131.98 with HTTP; Tue, 15 Nov 2016 09:18:09 -0800 (PST) From: Evan Schwartz Date: Tue, 15 Nov 2016 18:18:09 +0100 Message-ID: To: Interledger Community Group , Interledger Mailing List - IETF Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary=001a11485250251a8405415a2512 Archived-At: Subject: [Ledger] AGENDA - Interledger Community Call - 16 November - 3pm GMT X-BeenThere: ledger@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.17 Precedence: list List-Id: "Discussion of interledger, originally a protocol stack for moving digital assets \(making payments\) between accounts operating on different payment networks or ledgers." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 15 Nov 2016 17:18:31 -0000 --001a11485250251a8405415a2512 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 Hi all, It's Interledger time again! *Agenda* for tomorrow's call: 1. Demo of the ilp-kit for bootstrapping ILP 2. Common Ledger API proposal discussion *Dial In Details* To join the meeting, go to: https://bluejeans.com/795795755 (Try your iPhone or Android phone) Just want to dial in? (http://bluejeans.com/numbers) Enter Meeting ID: 795795755 *Reminder that all calls are recorded.* -- Evan Schwartz Software Engineer Managing Director of Ripple Luxembourg --001a11485250251a8405415a2512 Content-Type: text/html; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Hi all,

It's Interledger time again= !

Agenda for tomorrow's call:
  1. Demo of the i= lp-kit=C2=A0for bootstrapping ILP
  2. Common Ledger API proposal discussion
    3. <= /ol>
    Dial In Details

    To j= oin the meeting, go to:
    https://bluejeans.com/795795755
    (Try your iPhone = or Android phone)

    Just want to dial in? (http://bluejeans.com/numbers)
    Enter = Meeting ID: 795795755

    Reminder t= hat all=C2=A0calls=C2=A0are recorded.


--
Evan Schwartz
Software Engineer
= Man= aging Director of Ripple Luxembourg

--001a11485250251a8405415a2512-- From nobody Wed Nov 16 08:27:46 2016 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ledger@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: ledger@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5ABF7129423 for ; Wed, 16 Nov 2016 08:27:45 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.7 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.7 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW=-0.7, SPF_PASS=-0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (1024-bit key) header.d=ripple.com Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id Zpa2lNAOTpqh for ; Wed, 16 Nov 2016 08:27:42 -0800 (PST) Received: from mail-qk0-x231.google.com (mail-qk0-x231.google.com [IPv6:2607:f8b0:400d:c09::231]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 0E7A61293F4 for ; Wed, 16 Nov 2016 08:27:42 -0800 (PST) Received: by mail-qk0-x231.google.com with SMTP id n21so181987233qka.3 for ; Wed, 16 Nov 2016 08:27:41 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=ripple.com; s=google; h=mime-version:in-reply-to:references:from:date:message-id:subject:to; bh=VSopYQmw3JxtDXFLr4Rzd8Qq7xGnVyYBft+8L/vPDkE=; b=ligr54FDIUeSbHBO5W/5HA5t2faad/y2ngYmVkZxRftZBLXer2Df5R1WAYCCSJMO/s CbyyV8eVOKBwFmz9lBMXsReyXlCN4XkS1LVtxUL7+mkLtgXodcH+dZoYCuL9zvAMX3Cm zp6A46usU7oD0M76//V+6Q1n8bUPgGgVK5iRE= X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20130820; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:in-reply-to:references:from:date :message-id:subject:to; bh=VSopYQmw3JxtDXFLr4Rzd8Qq7xGnVyYBft+8L/vPDkE=; b=cRAMjU/yBQKZXbdRue431gMoLTDTc/ihkzCKALPQ1YK/p2GqMZdKQBMa9bslK9oL+f cujFEp9GkwxMXzWXARWNyr8bF/l5Z3/kW9n4jyiQS7BdAcGSVL4KRs2QN8tn+MEWhOW7 SXQgXyIEuHHSbxks+FSX61PH7wiu2XFWcOLHByHxdlaqylSjGwwQZ+VZS6YDyVI+xBnL YQamRMHB07rCBetm/pJlpHwR/RX5uGpwhlBmsyfS7uAJdBTxxgrXnjwsVT4UiNBfkhTa 1T8nuZ579Qyv3pwRqdVdm4Tm2MHcftwjtJoAqi9t3ISsU2bERT1h6s+R/zu+p70lrDZL Bp5Q== X-Gm-Message-State: AKaTC00IioJE+zDyrQl/Xn4Y9dpyi4cAegvv5gflXI64rv/XGyXVi9GZ3boD8RcT074GwmlHmb2ee5uqNhJMdofC X-Received: by 10.55.93.71 with SMTP id r68mr4020433qkb.306.1479313661129; Wed, 16 Nov 2016 08:27:41 -0800 (PST) MIME-Version: 1.0 Received: by 10.12.131.98 with HTTP; Wed, 16 Nov 2016 08:27:20 -0800 (PST) In-Reply-To: References: From: Evan Schwartz Date: Wed, 16 Nov 2016 17:27:20 +0100 Message-ID: To: Interledger Community Group , Interledger Mailing List - IETF Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary=001a114d3e2a48a59e05416d8dd8 Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Ledger] AGENDA - Interledger Community Call - 16 November - 3pm GMT X-BeenThere: ledger@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.17 Precedence: list List-Id: "Discussion of interledger, originally a protocol stack for moving digital assets \(making payments\) between accounts operating on different payment networks or ledgers." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 16 Nov 2016 16:27:45 -0000 --001a114d3e2a48a59e05416d8dd8 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 I'm very sorry about the confusion today. It seems that we were thrown off by daylight savings time. We'll reschedule today's call for next week or the week after -- and we'll be sure to include calendar invites next time so we can be sure we're synced up on the time. On Tue, Nov 15, 2016 at 6:18 PM, Evan Schwartz wrote: > Hi all, > > It's Interledger time again! > > *Agenda* for tomorrow's call: > > 1. Demo of the ilp-kit for > bootstrapping ILP > 2. Common Ledger API proposal > discussion > > > *Dial In Details* > To join the meeting, go to: > https://bluejeans.com/795795755 > (Try your iPhone or Android phone) > > Just want to dial in? (http://bluejeans.com/numbers) > Enter Meeting ID: 795795755 > > *Reminder that all calls are recorded.* > > > -- > Evan Schwartz > Software Engineer > Managing Director of Ripple Luxembourg > > -- Evan Schwartz Software Engineer Managing Director of Ripple Luxembourg --001a114d3e2a48a59e05416d8dd8 Content-Type: text/html; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
I'm very sorry about the confusion today. It seems tha= t we were thrown off by daylight savings time.

We'll= reschedule today's call for next week or the week after -- and we'= ll be sure to include calendar invites next time so we can be sure we'r= e synced up on the time.

On Tue, Nov 15, 2016 at 6:18 PM, Evan Schwartz <evan@ripp= le.com> wrote:
Hi all,

It's Interledger time again!
=
Agenda for tomorrow's call:
  1. Dem= o of the ilp-kit=C2=A0for bootstrapping ILP
  2. Common Ledger API propo= sal discussion
Reminder that all=C2=A0calls=C2=A0are recorded.


--
Evan Schwartz
Software Engineer=
Managing Director of Ripple Luxembourg
<= /span>=
<= /div>



--
Evan Schwartz
Softwa= re Engineer
Managing Director of Ripple Luxembour= g
--001a114d3e2a48a59e05416d8dd8-- From nobody Wed Nov 16 11:41:06 2016 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ledger@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: ledger@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id BD9F2129649 for ; Wed, 16 Nov 2016 11:41:04 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.699 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.699 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW=-0.7] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (1024-bit key) header.d=hopebailie.com Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id PfilNLyFZoHh for ; Wed, 16 Nov 2016 11:41:01 -0800 (PST) Received: from mail-wm0-x22b.google.com (mail-wm0-x22b.google.com [IPv6:2a00:1450:400c:c09::22b]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id B4C3412962F for ; Wed, 16 Nov 2016 11:41:00 -0800 (PST) Received: by mail-wm0-x22b.google.com with SMTP id f82so96061894wmf.1 for ; Wed, 16 Nov 2016 11:41:00 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=hopebailie.com; s=google; h=mime-version:in-reply-to:references:from:date:message-id:subject:to :cc; bh=p7vgVc1pLxjd/LOLSmsICNV7Nn2hF/j+0yvNYA0/1SI=; b=KwhFwAggef/zDVIlUNiJYzhq/bfmki4crv+vmDaWVfGtKDx5SKVZ7/OcgP8dekGTQ1 gKlD9s9kF5AUueIJhot/anqFHCQrBBGBH1OczEbVxcJdacZO0s3BXKGcPNJLYzIsirkH v5iuxG5hcPrpF90sOELhkLbP7v+09jyEF/4YU= X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20130820; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:in-reply-to:references:from:date :message-id:subject:to:cc; bh=p7vgVc1pLxjd/LOLSmsICNV7Nn2hF/j+0yvNYA0/1SI=; b=IxRv9+g3p+uXeb/NlbwnXOLKyLaKogQzySoeFi7tzjVSeyxXzKmLDNSapx0Ib9gBDD K4+wfDsD+QPWKhaMnFLqhiwXgVq+9PI/hgHme3Z1LWc2rBmgaycluv4NElocuM3Ih2HS bLiKVLAoKvCQKk9o0IjWjcwY/FHVFytgp0FfH/VNGsV354kJCbxkttFwZagkV1UCgoAp qkyDFREH7jFVzlesxN/ffjMUxm0jhi/rNp6/tgIkLtuuyNBnQ5dkPCMsa9uv6LSNu7mX O6zSbk0I3JEy6s2QFaAx6gI1iiuhezv04pHgCVRRiGJnU9zcDn2q11sLbRLTMJ7HkKMb icSg== X-Gm-Message-State: ABUngvfWErI484cWQfmDY2iqE1fCN3X2UQLRWMD6OFj/QQDvrMSvlH2CuBGmhOY2K2qYZHSKZUbnsl71rSxvSA== X-Received: by 10.28.183.215 with SMTP id h206mr12271241wmf.60.1479325259250; Wed, 16 Nov 2016 11:40:59 -0800 (PST) MIME-Version: 1.0 Received: by 10.194.115.6 with HTTP; Wed, 16 Nov 2016 11:40:58 -0800 (PST) In-Reply-To: References: From: Adrian Hope-Bailie Date: Wed, 16 Nov 2016 21:40:58 +0200 Message-ID: To: Jacob Pratt Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary=001a1148d9e49619fa0541704013 Archived-At: Cc: Interledger Community Group , Evan Schwartz , Interledger Mailing List - IETF Subject: Re: [Ledger] AGENDA - Interledger Community Call - 16 November - 3pm GMT X-BeenThere: ledger@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.17 Precedence: list List-Id: "Discussion of interledger, originally a protocol stack for moving digital assets \(making payments\) between accounts operating on different payment networks or ledgers." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 16 Nov 2016 19:41:05 -0000 --001a1148d9e49619fa0541704013 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 Hi Jacob, The time is always 3pm UTC. Unfortunately W3C has a weird tradition of using Boston as it's baseline so meetings are set according to US Eastern (i.e. always at the same time for folks in Boston). Anyone that is used to the W3C way of doing things would have arrived an hour late for today's meeting (which happened to one host but not the other). Will find a way to do this better :) Adrian On 16 November 2016 at 20:30, Jacob Pratt wrote: > In addition to the calendar invites, can we have UTC times sent out? Then > there's no need to worry about DST. > > Jacob H. Pratt > > On Wed, Nov 16, 2016 at 11:27 AM, Evan Schwartz wrote: > >> I'm very sorry about the confusion today. It seems that we were thrown >> off by daylight savings time. >> >> We'll reschedule today's call for next week or the week after -- and >> we'll be sure to include calendar invites next time so we can be sure we're >> synced up on the time. >> >> On Tue, Nov 15, 2016 at 6:18 PM, Evan Schwartz wrote: >> >>> Hi all, >>> >>> It's Interledger time again! >>> >>> *Agenda* for tomorrow's call: >>> >>> 1. Demo of the ilp-kit for >>> bootstrapping ILP >>> 2. Common Ledger API proposal >>> discussion >>> >>> >>> *Dial In Details* >>> To join the meeting, go to: >>> https://bluejeans.com/795795755 >>> (Try your iPhone or Android phone) >>> >>> Just want to dial in? (http://bluejeans.com/numbers) >>> Enter Meeting ID: 795795755 >>> >>> *Reminder that all calls are recorded.* >>> >>> >>> -- >>> Evan Schwartz >>> Software Engineer >>> Managing Director of Ripple Luxembourg >>> >>> >> >> >> -- >> Evan Schwartz >> Software Engineer >> Managing Director of Ripple Luxembourg >> >> > --001a1148d9e49619fa0541704013 Content-Type: text/html; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Hi Jacob,

The time is always 3= pm UTC.

Unfortunately W3C has a weird tradition of using Boston as = it's baseline so meetings are set according to US Eastern (i.e. always = at the same time for folks in Boston). Anyone that is used to the W3C way o= f doing things would have arrived an hour late for today's meeting (whi= ch happened to one host but not the other).

Will find a way to= do this better :)

Adrian



On 16 November= 2016 at 20:30, Jacob Pratt <jhprattdev@gmail.com> wrote:=
In addition to the cale= ndar invites, can we have UTC times sent out? Then there's no need to w= orry about DST.

Jacob H. Pratt

On Wed, Nov 16, 2016 at 11:27 AM, Evan Schwa= rtz <evan@ripple.com> wrote:
I'm very sorry about the confusion today. It seems th= at we were thrown off by daylight savings time.

We'l= l reschedule today's call for next week or the week after -- and we'= ;ll be sure to include calendar invites next time so we can be sure we'= re synced up on the time.

=
On Tue, Nov 15, 2016 at 6:18 PM, Evan Schwartz <= span dir=3D"ltr"><e= van@ripple.com> wrote:
Hi all,

It's Interledger time again!

Agenda for tomorrow's call:
  • Demo of the ilp-kit=C2=A0for bootstrapping ILP
  • Common Ledger A= PI proposal discussion
    • Dial In Details

    To join the meeting, go to:
    https://bluejeans.com/7957957= 55
    (Try your iPhone or Android phone)

    Just want to dial = in? (http://blue= jeans.com/numbers)
    Enter Meeting ID: 795795755

    Reminder that all=C2=A0calls=C2= =A0are recorded.


    --
    Eva= n Schwartz
    Software Engineer
    Managing Director of R= ipple Luxembourg

    <= /div>



    --
    Evan Schwartz
    Software Engineer
    Managing Director of Ripple Luxembourg
    <= div><= br>


    --001a1148d9e49619fa0541704013-- From nobody Wed Nov 16 16:28:44 2016 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ledger@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: ledger@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 64F4A12940B for ; Wed, 16 Nov 2016 10:30:09 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.699 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.699 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW=-0.7, SPF_PASS=-0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=gmail.com Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id W_kL88pscNOm for ; Wed, 16 Nov 2016 10:30:07 -0800 (PST) Received: from mail-it0-x232.google.com (mail-it0-x232.google.com [IPv6:2607:f8b0:4001:c0b::232]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id A2C661294A7 for ; Wed, 16 Nov 2016 10:30:07 -0800 (PST) Received: by mail-it0-x232.google.com with SMTP id l8so81146964iti.1 for ; Wed, 16 Nov 2016 10:30:07 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20120113; h=mime-version:in-reply-to:references:from:date:message-id:subject:to :cc; bh=WXeCVl7VAGlJSpnZ3atRMoIW4dRpe9MW6AWcylkRLRE=; b=d4n5oPYhWG95o120oXY6zHj1x1N4zV9fB5myVJ6c7Tm5BeMldoGYwMAAl1+R69YTUc IavfztuhZxwlQRt9SNfqn0+OplrYh5I4EDG6pkT+Dwf6wZqgPFjVIcxDZvSCMUHJr/ZP Hwi/RJQg929bm5sdIqdzAMka+OtuNwCU11dGvQUdFp9mY0Q5yJO5/NjReUyDFvdBue5q CYc7UQ2RzGKuDsFQlANRKJ5YzidTSlcsNslk5cBgmlUt8QXeDlde2EAb+bmxfoEAHmKF A5g12Wf+BVPFgp5mZCuAk3gBsDbZI9ILvVWTj7CWvDRIf6nBOQQXxo7syRZcyLeDY2qC B4Cw== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20130820; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:in-reply-to:references:from:date :message-id:subject:to:cc; bh=WXeCVl7VAGlJSpnZ3atRMoIW4dRpe9MW6AWcylkRLRE=; b=crwKG0ikFNqNOtdQI9FpvLRtxE9SkksJXse4Qa4EamgcvODspIvTB2ArKOLiLwGR5U 9ECyka+khoONwc9+t287w5HaMBbG2W3gEGPN3/HVG1t4alvvU9UsQRIPZZ/5vY/wvX5l QpBYTU0gBwyo+wpAq2HjR0VJwdV/Gcy48oaVxe6apUbCnNJrs90/g0E4t2cOY3Jnhn4I 58MVOXPkTtsPDt2nUc9kPOwgFPPW+6n2WH/BxWgn4ghf5TUmwCAn5WuVaXDLfh4oIC06 Ddy8zcXgcTUAZDIgjF5+65hQgZPltikwlM6aLHxnXJ5RS/IIYmXBmh3wu6JEZP0U5xqN nLsQ== X-Gm-Message-State: ABUngvf1YHr9ON06UjdimM5yi7TpVHfsixdnC2PqfvjhkSJ9vDcBxo0LZAcz6CLkQoztLPEuc49iNip2I7puKg== X-Received: by 10.202.188.196 with SMTP id m187mr3123555oif.210.1479321005970; Wed, 16 Nov 2016 10:30:05 -0800 (PST) MIME-Version: 1.0 Received: by 10.157.34.65 with HTTP; Wed, 16 Nov 2016 10:30:05 -0800 (PST) In-Reply-To: References: From: Jacob Pratt Date: Wed, 16 Nov 2016 13:30:05 -0500 Message-ID: To: Evan Schwartz Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary=001a113dc8fc11db1205416f43e4 Archived-At: X-Mailman-Approved-At: Wed, 16 Nov 2016 16:28:43 -0800 Cc: Interledger Community Group , Interledger Mailing List - IETF Subject: Re: [Ledger] AGENDA - Interledger Community Call - 16 November - 3pm GMT X-BeenThere: ledger@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.17 Precedence: list List-Id: "Discussion of interledger, originally a protocol stack for moving digital assets \(making payments\) between accounts operating on different payment networks or ledgers." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 16 Nov 2016 18:30:09 -0000 --001a113dc8fc11db1205416f43e4 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 In addition to the calendar invites, can we have UTC times sent out? Then there's no need to worry about DST. Jacob H. Pratt On Wed, Nov 16, 2016 at 11:27 AM, Evan Schwartz wrote: > I'm very sorry about the confusion today. It seems that we were thrown off > by daylight savings time. > > We'll reschedule today's call for next week or the week after -- and we'll > be sure to include calendar invites next time so we can be sure we're > synced up on the time. > > On Tue, Nov 15, 2016 at 6:18 PM, Evan Schwartz wrote: > >> Hi all, >> >> It's Interledger time again! >> >> *Agenda* for tomorrow's call: >> >> 1. Demo of the ilp-kit for >> bootstrapping ILP >> 2. Common Ledger API proposal >> discussion >> >> >> *Dial In Details* >> To join the meeting, go to: >> https://bluejeans.com/795795755 >> (Try your iPhone or Android phone) >> >> Just want to dial in? (http://bluejeans.com/numbers) >> Enter Meeting ID: 795795755 >> >> *Reminder that all calls are recorded.* >> >> >> -- >> Evan Schwartz >> Software Engineer >> Managing Director of Ripple Luxembourg >> >> > > > -- > Evan Schwartz > Software Engineer > Managing Director of Ripple Luxembourg > > --001a113dc8fc11db1205416f43e4 Content-Type: text/html; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
    In addition to the calendar invites, can we have UTC times= sent out? Then there's no need to worry about DST.

    Jacob H. Pratt

    On Wed, Nov 16, 2016 at 11:27 AM, Evan Schwa= rtz <evan@ripple.com> wrote:
    I'm very sorry about the confusion today. It seems th= at we were thrown off by daylight savings time.

    We'l= l reschedule today's call for next week or the week after -- and we'= ;ll be sure to include calendar invites next time so we can be sure we'= re synced up on the time.

    On Tue, Nov 15,= 2016 at 6:18 PM, Evan Schwartz <evan@ripple.com> wrote:
    Hi all,

    It= 's Interledger time again!

    Agenda for t= omorrow's call:
    1. Demo of the ilp-kit=C2=A0for bootstra= pping ILP
    2. Common Ledger API proposal discussion
    <= div style=3D"font-size:12.8px">Dial In Details

    To join the me= eting, go to:
    https://bluejeans.com/795795755
    (Try your iPhone or Android= phone)

    Just want to dial in? (http://bluejeans.com/numbers)
    Enter Meeting ID= : 795795755

    Reminder that all=C2= =A0cal= ls=C2=A0are recorded.


    --
    Evan Schwartz
    Software Engineer
    Managing Director of Ripple Luxembourg

    =



    --
    Evan Schwartz
    Software Engineer
    Managing Direc= tor of Ripple Luxembourg


    --001a113dc8fc11db1205416f43e4-- From nobody Thu Nov 17 00:54:44 2016 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ledger@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: ledger@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3A2421294F0 for ; Thu, 17 Nov 2016 00:54:39 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.699 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.699 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW=-0.7] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (1024-bit key) header.d=hopebailie.com Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id UqNBMxlFUhuz for ; Thu, 17 Nov 2016 00:54:36 -0800 (PST) Received: from mail-wm0-x22e.google.com (mail-wm0-x22e.google.com [IPv6:2a00:1450:400c:c09::22e]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 7AC071294C6 for ; Thu, 17 Nov 2016 00:54:35 -0800 (PST) Received: by mail-wm0-x22e.google.com with SMTP id t79so130135230wmt.0 for ; Thu, 17 Nov 2016 00:54:35 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=hopebailie.com; s=google; h=mime-version:from:date:message-id:subject:to; bh=EUAM96jIiHpc+us2V66IenO9NdMYKmx71zY8fXxg/cg=; b=SsU92Xfio3JwWDcUURs4uXCS/mVh6PopR91LeKdngcn52OiCwfSoygQN+oiBbJV+CQ dAtkrm1XYB1SKrI7jhFPPJhSGw8N+Zzft6aDyonJ6QPePXiDZEeG1E25r7Dok1HGxZNq FdY+t03IApSo6kYt0GDT4ELNTTOEB1lp+1H7M= X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20130820; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:from:date:message-id:subject:to; bh=EUAM96jIiHpc+us2V66IenO9NdMYKmx71zY8fXxg/cg=; b=OlpfATX/Q7S1WwtOlIQ9buu2HnlNijl20mGM2FYzuiJn/F+VWNJyd97GzKtDIUmT+B WcFUfxZnP5MWUID9ZJJn/IpMIw1KqoJ5k12SPl6z50gadu8W1ZgYFJofyx8/7o3VGNj8 NxJaVi9KxYof7LTcaX64UsueNNU8Upq0SxwKgzovIqYAOx9LQn/F1sIwS9+PD4/WPIZR zZpqKjBReB6wa/JNwa3Jdx+CWBe6rF1X7EZUg0qlR0Fh8dV+N/EakCfPl8LBEZ5Eipwj WkwO0mS+jMYirxjikazAX4vaj3RVrVJmxhPY+df9/hRh/EKIPk2JgHwaJbNvJY50THi/ WQ1w== X-Gm-Message-State: ABUngvclkH/DtPaAl31HM/q9/UPx3CBTCCKZNLP8Tw/4KshF712oDOrN1iL8WWZOz145GU6eCefaS+czq6+tVw== X-Received: by 10.28.51.211 with SMTP id z202mr16208295wmz.125.1479372873786; Thu, 17 Nov 2016 00:54:33 -0800 (PST) MIME-Version: 1.0 Received: by 10.194.115.6 with HTTP; Thu, 17 Nov 2016 00:54:33 -0800 (PST) From: Adrian Hope-Bailie Date: Thu, 17 Nov 2016 10:54:33 +0200 Message-ID: To: Interledger Mailing List - IETF Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary=001a11444f26a1fac705417b5631 Archived-At: Subject: [Ledger] IETF 97 Seoul X-BeenThere: ledger@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.17 Precedence: list List-Id: "Discussion of interledger, originally a protocol stack for moving digital assets \(making payments\) between accounts operating on different payment networks or ledgers." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 17 Nov 2016 08:54:39 -0000 --001a11444f26a1fac705417b5631 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 If you're in Seoul and have a moment let's meet up! I just got my own personal Interledger node up and running last night at https://zar-ilp.hopebailie.com and I'd be happy to help you do the same so we can peer up and grow the network. If you want to get started yourself just go get https://github.com/interledgerjs/ilp-kit and follow the instructions (some more detailed ones will go up in the next day or two but I can help if you get stuck). --001a11444f26a1fac705417b5631 Content-Type: text/html; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
    If you're in Seoul and have a moment let'= ;s meet up!

    I just got my own personal Interledger node up and= running last night at https://z= ar-ilp.hopebailie.com and I'd be happy to help you do the same so w= e can peer up and grow the network.

    If you want to get started= yourself just go get = https://github.com/interledgerjs/ilp-kit and follow the instructions (s= ome more detailed ones will go up in the next day or two but I can help if = you get stuck).
    --001a11444f26a1fac705417b5631-- From nobody Fri Nov 25 08:11:00 2016 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ledger@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: ledger@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1ABE71293DB for ; Fri, 25 Nov 2016 08:10:58 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.699 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.699 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW=-0.7] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (1024-bit key) header.d=hopebailie.com Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id FZmzaOhuxPsV for ; Fri, 25 Nov 2016 08:10:56 -0800 (PST) Received: from mail-wm0-x22d.google.com (mail-wm0-x22d.google.com [IPv6:2a00:1450:400c:c09::22d]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 485CB127077 for ; Fri, 25 Nov 2016 08:10:56 -0800 (PST) Received: by mail-wm0-x22d.google.com with SMTP id a197so148003579wmd.0 for ; Fri, 25 Nov 2016 08:10:56 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=hopebailie.com; s=google; h=mime-version:from:date:message-id:subject:to; bh=pzXY5/xXEhmIMbelV7okFeEEWG1f/dMOmyxgsiTWjPA=; b=TDRac/974UZ7m0tylLn0ugkuRytXkamAtWewDh3dQoiXM2dz7l8qdBdfsten4NDukA K73hZf6qCXcGGc20Wm3kX2kbTzzjHqEjPpW0gT2O8PnjYuHFa0LQDCLEckyg/xvOJ/JR FtryZ5LWAfG21jiVDp0pYC0gPsVwMbAn52pOU= X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20130820; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:from:date:message-id:subject:to; bh=pzXY5/xXEhmIMbelV7okFeEEWG1f/dMOmyxgsiTWjPA=; b=EQc/Kmerx0ytDR/bQum8SQxiViLA67WNKutC4mqAY0rpBxtBM2QvzvNLDaqty9obyX PZk346pQEOB/mhgC8qyJHeAnpgyEKUJ90PLkewn2lGJR8LGFOMS0n2GsPfjHo892pU4H x2CLVIWeDOLWUvC2f21p3OQAmLRTONsXgCaLTzffTmPRPZCB/9Xw44noDmf29MAhgNF4 LHCr5LrVa5pKpQbSjWm4S1zgQeMloXHe9PKtWG3etBMbXPDxF0Q0RLCorkyXH3KR8I0g xp0iJrlq3daK/Pf5v4LMFgmif755uw0IvY8scn6SDF1sF7zJsis3X0sKyHcJ/mYRsEYK Ctyw== X-Gm-Message-State: AKaTC01LkRk5a+Mv5BzOb9HlpsWQQ0k/7pTU329SEJdIGxTs6n5v+W7Q5/xF13FdppIxuFdi1EskEP/3zf9NUg== X-Received: by 10.28.183.215 with SMTP id h206mr8716008wmf.60.1480090254801; Fri, 25 Nov 2016 08:10:54 -0800 (PST) MIME-Version: 1.0 Received: by 10.194.115.6 with HTTP; Fri, 25 Nov 2016 08:10:54 -0800 (PST) From: Adrian Hope-Bailie Date: Fri, 25 Nov 2016 18:10:54 +0200 Message-ID: To: Interledger Community Group , Interledger Mailing List - IETF Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary=001a1148d9e4df9d3b0542225dfa Archived-At: Subject: [Ledger] Next Week's Interledger Call - Bootstrapping the Interledger - ILP-Kit Demo X-BeenThere: ledger@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.17 Precedence: list List-Id: "Discussion of interledger, originally a protocol stack for moving digital assets \(making payments\) between accounts operating on different payment networks or ledgers." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 25 Nov 2016 16:10:59 -0000 --001a1148d9e4df9d3b0542225dfa Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 Hi all, On next week's call we're going to do a deep dive on ILP-Kit [1]. ILP-Kit is the project that combines many of the existing Interledger componenets into an easy to run complete Interledger network node. A number of early adopters [2] have already deployed the kit and are running nodes providing very valuable feedback to the project and giving us an early view of what an open payments network might look like. The agenda for the call is an overview of the ILP-Kit project and the various components followed by a demonstration of how to run your own instance and peer with other nodes. Following that we'll have some open discussion about what's been working and where we need to improve and take ILP-Kit next. Join us in our regular Wednesday slot to be part of bootstrapping the Interledger! *Dial In Details* To join the meeting, go to: https://bluejeans.com/795795755 (Try your iPhone or Android phone) Just want to dial in? (http://bluejeans.com/numbers) Enter Meeting ID: 795795755 *Reminder that all calls are recorded.* [1] - https://github.com/interledgerjs/ilp-kit [2] - https://github.com/interledgerjs/ilp-kit/wiki/Known-ILP-Nodes --001a1148d9e4df9d3b0542225dfa Content-Type: text/html; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
    Hi all,

    On next week= 's call we're going to do a deep dive on ILP-Kit [1]. ILP-Kit is th= e project that combines many of the existing Interledger componenets into a= n easy to run complete Interledger network node.

    A number of e= arly adopters [2] have already deployed the kit and are running nodes provi= ding very valuable feedback to the project and giving us an early view of w= hat an open payments network might look like.

    The agenda for t= he call is an overview of the ILP-Kit project and the various components fo= llowed by a demonstration of how to run your own instance and peer with oth= er nodes.

    Following that we'll have some open discussion a= bout what's been working and where we need to improve and take ILP-Kit = next.

    Join us in our regular Wednesday slot to = be part of bootstrapping the Interledger!
    --001a1148d9e4df9d3b0542225dfa-- From nobody Sun Nov 27 04:40:52 2016 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ledger@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: ledger@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id E8B8D1295BD for ; Sun, 27 Nov 2016 04:40:50 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -0.1 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-0.1 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_20=-0.001, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE=-0.0001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (1024-bit key) header.d=hopebailie.com Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id bkXFuMKMCh8e for ; Sun, 27 Nov 2016 04:40:49 -0800 (PST) Received: from mail-wj0-x22b.google.com (mail-wj0-x22b.google.com [IPv6:2a00:1450:400c:c01::22b]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 302311295B8 for ; Sun, 27 Nov 2016 04:40:49 -0800 (PST) Received: by mail-wj0-x22b.google.com with SMTP id qp4so93664162wjc.3 for ; Sun, 27 Nov 2016 04:40:49 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=hopebailie.com; s=google; h=mime-version:in-reply-to:references:from:date:message-id:subject:to; bh=gOuh/9p5YqtnMIsprnbpnCw0h/SlJG4Zrf1CUdw/FJs=; b=eVONn2mEelc/MvjqkznijYi5G+bg1Vf392xPutJkFVzvtDYf50wavpX+SkJHdqz1Hq Vnh2intAsFkn9tybx/Ir06SHey+ypEC4TELMvY5uubNw/SNGFx3tnX+/5UgxXH0RjIdD 71J6oFM16P60zWIE81HW122vc2XVeTzp05AII= X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20130820; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:in-reply-to:references:from:date :message-id:subject:to; bh=gOuh/9p5YqtnMIsprnbpnCw0h/SlJG4Zrf1CUdw/FJs=; b=B3vjj4LkvA92qUmhQcEB8SafgUhX+hDKTVna5sY/YZ97BC9vM9PyipTM716C+K1upn TFTcCyMUtNlTLMc2FyhEm7IhOhAKtr3+RdXc7/iTfgKWvTV6QramsG0crsy0JXB4AIqf mJLYHz5lWfFpbSeehYPd837EaeRl04OQvvTlPFQGhHHawmPqFoKMADPtj0uiJIG6bHkK Aq4ieiq/MJrIWLGbCeWeNif/FR38KEujGuZgHXuv/cS9wyx5FrTam8/wmOZmJ/FmFIib 01Vqqh0bwmG8pKA+3jsxT76fOJG3aLO6SyD+aOFL5ZvdWPbvZtNoEVuiACtX3AsUY7y4 0qwA== X-Gm-Message-State: AKaTC02IlfIYnVsgF7hN1s7r+wIXmQ0/rELA6oj7E9VqCzBlsgkf2PBD7fwZ+mcYiF/pYsIRGCTdtv5xl+YJew== X-Received: by 10.194.47.138 with SMTP id d10mr16618919wjn.83.1480250447583; Sun, 27 Nov 2016 04:40:47 -0800 (PST) MIME-Version: 1.0 Received: by 10.194.115.6 with HTTP; Sun, 27 Nov 2016 04:40:47 -0800 (PST) In-Reply-To: References: From: Adrian Hope-Bailie Date: Sun, 27 Nov 2016 14:40:47 +0200 Message-ID: To: Interledger Community Group , Interledger Mailing List - IETF Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary=047d7b86e7861b9584054247aa58 Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Ledger] Korean ILP Node X-BeenThere: ledger@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.17 Precedence: list List-Id: "Discussion of interledger, originally a protocol stack for moving digital assets \(making payments\) between accounts operating on different payment networks or ledgers." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sun, 27 Nov 2016 12:40:51 -0000 --047d7b86e7861b9584054247aa58 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 If you can contribute a translation please comment on the issue ( https://github.com/interledgerjs/ilp-kit/issues/88) with details of the language translation you can provide and we can get a team of translators together and work out a good way to do this that works for everyone. On 27 November 2016 at 14:26, Adrian Hope-Bailie wrote: > Logged: https://github.com/interledgerjs/ilp-kit/issues/88 > > On 27 November 2016 at 14:21, Adrian Hope-Bailie > wrote: > >> Hey Park, >> >> That is great, thank you! >> >> Would you be prepared to contribute your translation back to the project? >> We haven't had this high on our list of priorities yet but I'll log a >> ticket and let's see if we can move the UI to an architecture that easily >> supports different language files. >> >> Adrian >> >> >> >> On 27 November 2016 at 13:34, Park Minsung wrote: >> >>> Hi all, >>> >>> >>> I am running Korean version of ILP-kit >>> >>> >>> URL: https://interledger.kr >>> >>> Ledger Prefix: kr.krw.interledgerkorea. >>> >>> Owner's Connector Account: mspark >>> >>> >>> I translated the kit into Korean. >>> >>> >>> I hope this will be of help for Koreans. >>> >>> >>> Minsung >>> >> >> > --047d7b86e7861b9584054247aa58 Content-Type: text/html; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

    On 27 November 2016 at 14:26, Adrian Hope-Bailie = <adrian@hopeb= ailie.com> wrote:

    On 27 November 2016 at 14:21, = Adrian Hope-Bailie <adrian@hopebailie.com> wrote:
    Hey Park,
    That is great, thank you!

    Would you be prepared to con= tribute your translation back to the project? We haven't had this high = on our list of priorities yet but I'll log a ticket and let's see i= f we can move the UI to an architecture that easily supports different lang= uage files.

    <= font color=3D"#888888">Adrian



    On 27 November = 2016 at 13:34, Park Minsung <misnuge@hotmail.com> wrote:

    Hi all,


    I am running Korean version of ILP-kit


    URL:=C2=A0https://interledger.kr

    Ledger Prefix: kr.krw.interledgerkorea.

    Owner's Connector Account: mspark


    I translated the kit into Korean.=C2=A0


    I hope this will be of help for Koreans.


    Minsung




    --047d7b86e7861b9584054247aa58-- From nobody Mon Nov 28 09:07:55 2016 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ledger@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: ledger@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id E5B51129556 for ; Mon, 28 Nov 2016 09:07:54 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.999 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.999 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE=-0.0001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (1024-bit key) header.d=hopebailie.com Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id juB_HrNyUTzj for ; Mon, 28 Nov 2016 09:07:53 -0800 (PST) Received: from mail-wj0-x235.google.com (mail-wj0-x235.google.com [IPv6:2a00:1450:400c:c01::235]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id C9DE5129538 for ; Mon, 28 Nov 2016 09:07:52 -0800 (PST) Received: by mail-wj0-x235.google.com with SMTP id mp19so122170586wjc.1 for ; Mon, 28 Nov 2016 09:07:52 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=hopebailie.com; s=google; h=mime-version:from:date:message-id:subject:to; bh=VKdJnXNBehHiJ6ciW/iE3HpO0oYXcFPpiAHazHpmyqw=; b=Ppj+dcasS6lXVYgGHX5u0URF/xCZtPVIHjlJfB4D6tI8Fng+vbkfBNkr4nfXiVhJGn ezOoUGC2ji3L84kATMV2oKnIUAuO0sq5iJH2CexjbFWge73uyNBEYJ4kVGzFSpfOvYCp +QuexzHTOs8O5KV0E34OTt7I41kIVzN4I5j38= X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20130820; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:from:date:message-id:subject:to; bh=VKdJnXNBehHiJ6ciW/iE3HpO0oYXcFPpiAHazHpmyqw=; b=K5zrcdQ+xVJtGhx9916vJNEeOeTjmxyLCRzPjkCwcu4QYyAmG1sStkcb5mrR4ONKSd mJCrvVGch9ktrBjBh1sq/36Ct+Qbf1gGCu91glOuxP30sFQiL//qiAqSBwS64J/06RlY YfKzd7yTWBvOSdXo0/FGMaq1y1NbtXqg9UdCXOCZA8HkQ5U/w/4Fs8vnLfJ5+nZDFwWV Tb0DhXClVz9P3LRdART+CunbcUkVunb9Rv6owB08BB2DM4spAQK5Jxliau3x8nPi67c9 15AZtFE5+2ogWGxJpqK9y9JYb0MkQ2ObGOKxh7z76qm7iUM/uLUah89yZAPIrmjJvpiM s3Lw== X-Gm-Message-State: AKaTC00tLhpPZIdG6wbtqBquIjz41NKx6VqNGX+D3gSuPw3ofe5UCU1q+LUxth0NgTtvHQI6ERkDvhPZ2iCsJQ== X-Received: by 10.194.148.134 with SMTP id ts6mr19839957wjb.220.1480352871166; Mon, 28 Nov 2016 09:07:51 -0800 (PST) MIME-Version: 1.0 Received: by 10.194.115.6 with HTTP; Mon, 28 Nov 2016 09:07:50 -0800 (PST) From: Adrian Hope-Bailie Date: Mon, 28 Nov 2016 19:07:50 +0200 Message-ID: To: Interledger Community Group , Interledger Mailing List - IETF Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary=089e0117664d078a2505425f8312 Archived-At: Subject: [Ledger] Interledger Jobs X-BeenThere: ledger@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.17 Precedence: list List-Id: "Discussion of interledger, originally a protocol stack for moving digital assets \(making payments\) between accounts operating on different payment networks or ledgers." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 28 Nov 2016 17:07:55 -0000 --089e0117664d078a2505425f8312 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 There have been a few discussions about companies that are beginning to explore Interledger and are actively looking for people to work on this. Ripple is certainly among those and would like to list job advertisements in a place that is publicly accessible to all members of the Interledger community. I have logged an issue on the website repo to create a jobs page but won't proceed on this unless there is consensus from the group to do so and some commitment from other community members to add listings. https://github.com/interledger/interledger.github.io/issues/42 If you are interested in listing jobs on the Interledger website please comment on the issue and I will include you as a reviewer in the PR for the new page so you can add your listing before it goes live. Maintenance of the page will be done via PR and Dimi and I will review new listings and approve the PRs. --089e0117664d078a2505425f8312 Content-Type: text/html; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
    There have been a few discussions abou= t companies that are beginning to explore Interledger and are actively look= ing for people to work on this.

    Ripple is certainly among thos= e and would like to list job advertisements in a place that is publicly acc= essible to all members of the Interledger community.

    I have lo= gged an issue on the website repo to create a jobs page but won't proce= ed on this unless there is consensus from the group to do so and some commi= tment from other community members to add listings.

    https://github.c= om/interledger/interledger.github.io/issues/42

    If you are = interested in listing jobs on the Interledger website please comment on the= issue and I will include you as a reviewer in the PR for the new page so y= ou can add your listing before it goes live.

    Maintenance of th= e page will be done via PR and Dimi and I will review new listings and appr= ove the PRs.
    --089e0117664d078a2505425f8312-- From nobody Mon Nov 28 14:35:59 2016 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ledger@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: ledger@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id EF83012A062 for ; Mon, 28 Nov 2016 14:35:57 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.999 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.999 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE=-0.0001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (1024-bit key) header.d=hopebailie.com Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id asIWYLuBzIyL for ; Mon, 28 Nov 2016 14:35:55 -0800 (PST) Received: from mail-wj0-x234.google.com (mail-wj0-x234.google.com [IPv6:2a00:1450:400c:c01::234]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id BF61612A066 for ; Mon, 28 Nov 2016 14:35:52 -0800 (PST) Received: by mail-wj0-x234.google.com with SMTP id mp19so129525337wjc.1 for ; Mon, 28 Nov 2016 14:35:52 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=hopebailie.com; s=google; h=mime-version:from:date:message-id:subject:to; bh=5tFdfYLFe3EFR1w2sneYoogmX9wrwGBiYKEBf3PIqeg=; b=iJ2WaylEYaHsEM3pOo2YDlnKAp12F6dktJ064HW3ynIwoakG79+3aGI586xftWb9iD xw8F+yyJ73Z35KccMumDbu4nPKWNSjINtySWFxYu3xYQG4S1s18tbPWQ35tFwXAtxjXU efAoXIjPhj1ATlx7s48vKULGUxOXZsDRBRI8g= X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20130820; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:from:date:message-id:subject:to; bh=5tFdfYLFe3EFR1w2sneYoogmX9wrwGBiYKEBf3PIqeg=; b=GC3oZtT8zl+kS9Vwux29+yg/UmZQItND7AaZmB5JL1EYpHpG1KNZGzaeljE/qwhqCD QJgKda7HfTQcF8Y96ouSeCLur4hFzgQjNHNoUpG8hGujU5BxlZFaMBbkUucqk5FPfB34 +HohYDXNyiM706uCaHcVab2U3ir+hHuJgukgguDsAbdjqD1bMCB5KDGmm0kSll52hWW8 eGhN7gYjgOzh3WjiwRfIcYNXTt2fQbijhfcN5m6UvgZIO2tQ5Zmno7jIxDQzGoIK7nbo p+DZC1WtraafeXHkfvzRVN+fnngRhS40ldykXp5/pGSlEUhop7UtSx8zZKXSItNwCGhZ 51PA== X-Gm-Message-State: AKaTC02shz8FK9hWEkDQLR7zccGFzbkGd/atI7ywE2U4RNv0bHiTrfRDhUbRWWFzeOZs/fqed+LnJpnqp8jwWw== X-Received: by 10.194.148.134 with SMTP id ts6mr20794446wjb.220.1480372551303; Mon, 28 Nov 2016 14:35:51 -0800 (PST) MIME-Version: 1.0 Received: by 10.194.39.170 with HTTP; Mon, 28 Nov 2016 14:35:48 -0800 (PST) From: Adrian Hope-Bailie Date: Tue, 29 Nov 2016 00:35:48 +0200 Message-ID: To: Interledger Community Group , Interledger Mailing List - IETF Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary=089e0117664d0e807a0542641803 Archived-At: Subject: [Ledger] AGENDA - Interledger Community Call - Wed 30 Nov @ 3pm GMT X-BeenThere: ledger@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.17 Precedence: list List-Id: "Discussion of interledger, originally a protocol stack for moving digital assets \(making payments\) between accounts operating on different payment networks or ledgers." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 28 Nov 2016 22:35:58 -0000 --089e0117664d0e807a0542641803 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary=089e0117664d0e80750542641801 --089e0117664d0e80750542641801 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 This weeks call is focused on the ILP kit: https://github.com/interledgerjs/ilp-kit/wiki We'll be giving an overview of the package and it's components and how they tie together and interact followed by a detailed demo of how to set up your own instance of the ILP Kit. An .ics for the regular call is attached. It is a simple published event with no RSVP. You can safely delete any other event you have in your calendar and use this instead. Please let me know if there are issues with this file in your calendar system. *Dial In Details* To join the meeting, go to: https://bluejeans.com/795795755 (Try your iPhone or Android phone) Just want to dial in? (http://bluejeans.com/numbers) Enter Meeting ID: 795795755 *Reminder that all calls are recorded.* --089e0117664d0e80750542641801 Content-Type: text/html; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
    This weeks call is focused on the ILP kit: = https://github.co= m/interledgerjs/ilp-kit/wiki

    We'll be giving an overvi= ew of the package and it's components and how they tie together and int= eract followed by a detailed demo of how to set up your own instance of the= ILP Kit.

    An .ics for the regular call is attached. It is a si= mple published event with no RSVP. You can safely delete any other event yo= u have in your calendar and use this instead.

    Please let me kn= ow if there are issues with this file in your calendar system.

    Di= al In Details

    To join the meeting, go to:
    https://bluejeans.com/795795755
    (Try your iPhone or Android phone)

    Just want to dial in?= (http://bluejea= ns.com/numbers)
    Enter Meeting ID: 795795755

    Reminder that = all calls are recorded.

    --089e0117664d0e80750542641801-- --089e0117664d0e807a0542641803 Content-Type: text/calendar; charset=US-ASCII; name="interledger-community-calls.ics" Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="interledger-community-calls.ics" Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64 X-Attachment-Id: f_iw2njvw40 QkVHSU46VkNBTEVOREFSDQpWRVJTSU9OOjIuMA0KQ0FMU0NBTEU6R1JFR09SSUFODQpNRVRIT0Q6 UFVCTElTSA0KQkVHSU46VkVWRU5UClVJRDpiaXdlZWtseWNhbGxAaW50ZXJsZWRnZXIub3JnDQpE VFNUQVJUOjIwMTYxMTMwVDE1MDAwMFoNCkRURU5EOjIwMTYxMTMwVDE2MDAwMFoNClJSVUxFOkZS RVE9V0VFS0xZO0lOVEVSVkFMPTI7QllEQVk9V0UNCkRUU1RBTVA6MjAxNjExMjhUMTYwMjQ4Wg0K Q1JFQVRFRDoyMDE2MTEyOFQxMDI5MTZaDQpERVNDUklQVElPTjpUaGlzIGlzIHRoZSBiaS13ZWVr bHkgY2FsbCBvZiB0aGUgSW50ZXJsZWRnZXIgY29tbXVuaXR5LlxuXG5UaGUNCiAgYWdlbmRhIGlz IGRpc3RyaWJ1dGVkIHZpYSB0aGUgbWFpbGluZyBsaXN0cyBwcmlvciB0byBlYWNoIG1lZXRpbmcu XG5cbkZvciANCiBtb3JlIGluZm8gYW5kIHRvIGpvaW4gdGhlIG1haWxpbmcgbGlzdHMgdmlzaXQ6 IGh0dHBzOi8vaW50ZXJsZWRnZXIub3JnL2NvbW0NCiB1bml0eVxuXG5UbyBqb2luIG9yIHN0YXJ0 IHRoZSBtZWV0aW5nXCwgZ28gdG86XG5odHRwczovL2JsdWVqZWFucy5jb20vNzk1NzkNCiA1NzU1 XG4oQWxzbyB3b3JrcyBvbiBpUGhvbmUgb3IgQW5kcm9pZCBwaG9uZSlcblxuVG8gY29ubmVjdCBk aXJlY3RseSBmcm8NCiBtIGEgcm9vbSBzeXN0ZW0/XG4xKSBEaWFsOiAxOTkuNDguMTUyLjE1MiBv ciBiam4udmNcbjIpIEVudGVyIE1lZXRpbmcgSUQ6IDcNCiA5NTc5NTc1NSAtb3ItIHVzZSB0aGUg cGFpcmluZyBjb2RlXG5cbkRpYWwtaW4gbnVtYmVyczogaHR0cDovL2JsdWVqZWFucy5jb20NCiAv bnVtYmVycyAodXNlIE1lZXRpbmcgSUQ6IDc5NTc5NTc1NSkKTE9DQVRJT046aHR0cHM6Ly9ibHVl amVhbnMuY29tLzc5NTc5NTc1NQ0KVVJMOmh0dHBzOi8vYmx1ZWplYW5zLmNvbS83OTU3OTU3NTUN ClNFUVVFTkNFOjANClNUQVRVUzpDT05GSVJNRUQNClNVTU1BUlk6SW50ZXJsZWRnZXIgQ29tbXVu aXR5IENhbGwNClRSQU5TUDpPUEFRVUUNCkVORDpWRVZFTlQNCkVORDpWQ0FMRU5EQVIK --089e0117664d0e807a0542641803--