From tools-discuss-bounces@ietf.org Wed Oct 12 10:52:28 2005 Received: from localhost.localdomain ([127.0.0.1] helo=megatron.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1EPhy0-0005lx-Rb; Wed, 12 Oct 2005 10:52:28 -0400 Received: from odin.ietf.org ([132.151.1.176] helo=ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1EPhxy-0005kz-OD for tools-discuss@megatron.ietf.org; Wed, 12 Oct 2005 10:52:26 -0400 Received: from ietf-mx.ietf.org (ietf-mx [132.151.6.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id KAA25462 for ; Wed, 12 Oct 2005 10:52:23 -0400 (EDT) Received: from av7-2-sn3.vrr.skanova.net ([81.228.9.182]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1EPi8I-0004Xp-2B for tools-discuss@ietf.org; Wed, 12 Oct 2005 11:03:07 -0400 Received: by av7-2-sn3.vrr.skanova.net (Postfix, from userid 502) id DEFFC381D8; Wed, 12 Oct 2005 16:45:27 +0200 (CEST) Received: from smtp3-2-sn3.vrr.skanova.net (smtp3-2-sn3.vrr.skanova.net [81.228.9.102]) by av7-2-sn3.vrr.skanova.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id C349837E5A; Wed, 12 Oct 2005 16:45:27 +0200 (CEST) Received: from shiraz.levkowetz.com (81-224-201-50-no45.tbcn.telia.com [81.224.201.50]) by smtp3-2-sn3.vrr.skanova.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id AAA8337E4D; Wed, 12 Oct 2005 16:52:10 +0200 (CEST) Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]) by shiraz.levkowetz.com with esmtp (Exim 4.52) id 1EPhxi-000851-Ip; Wed, 12 Oct 2005 16:52:10 +0200 Message-ID: <434D2314.8020704@levkowetz.com> Date: Wed, 12 Oct 2005 16:52:04 +0200 From: Henrik Levkowetz User-Agent: Mozilla Thunderbird 1.0.7 (Macintosh/20050923) X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Otto Kreiter References: <434D190F.2020802@dante.org.uk> In-Reply-To: <434D190F.2020802@dante.org.uk> X-Enigmail-Version: 0.93.0.0 X-SA-Exim-Connect-IP: 127.0.0.1 X-SA-Exim-Mail-From: henrik@levkowetz.com X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No (on shiraz.levkowetz.com); SAEximRunCond expanded to false X-Spam-Score: 0.1 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 244a2fd369eaf00ce6820a760a3de2e8 Cc: tools-discuss@ietf.org Subject: [Tools-discuss] Re: tools.ietf.org/wg/ccamp broken X-BeenThere: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF Tools Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="===============1203771449==" Sender: tools-discuss-bounces@ietf.org Errors-To: tools-discuss-bounces@ietf.org This is an OpenPGP/MIME signed message (RFC 2440 and 3156) --===============1203771449== Content-Type: multipart/signed; micalg=pgp-sha1; protocol="application/pgp-signature"; boundary="------------enig037ECDF93898D235C464B827" This is an OpenPGP/MIME signed message (RFC 2440 and 3156) --------------enig037ECDF93898D235C464B827 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Hi Otto, Thanks for reporting this - I've fixed the symptom now, but still have to work out how the condition could come up, and fix the underlying issue. Hopefully later today. Regards, Henrik on 2005-10-12 16:09 Otto Kreiter said the following: > Dear Henrik and the IETF Tools development Team, > > Accessing the Ccamp wg link http://tools.ietf.org/wg/ccamp/ I've noticed > an error for the related documents: > > ----------------------------------------- > /usr/lib/python2.3/posixpath.py in > getmtime(filename='draft-vasseur-ccamp-automesh-01.txt') > 144 def getmtime(filename): > 145 """Return the last modification time of a file, reported by > os.stat().""" > 146 return os.stat(filename).st_mtime > 147 > 148 def getatime(filename): > global os = , os.stat = > , filename = > 'draft-vasseur-ccamp-automesh-01.txt', ).st_mtime undefined > > OSError: [Errno 2] No such file or directory: > 'draft-vasseur-ccamp-automesh-01.txt' > args = (2, 'No such file or directory') > errno = 2 > filename = 'draft-vasseur-ccamp-automesh-01.txt' > strerror = 'No such file or directory' > ------------------------------------------- > > It looks to me that only the Ccamp WG is affected. > > Best regards, > Otto > > --------------enig037ECDF93898D235C464B827 Content-Type: application/pgp-signature; name="signature.asc" Content-Description: OpenPGP digital signature Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="signature.asc" -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.4.1 (GNU/Linux) iD8DBQFDTSMaeVhrtTJkXCMRAsKTAKCCJq1yb99XrnHSCjkUTWoHX8cYRgCeNqd1 kknsGzYNeESzeJ4VGmnv8E0= =ZEjz -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --------------enig037ECDF93898D235C464B827-- --===============1203771449== Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline _______________________________________________ Tools-discuss mailing list Tools-discuss@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/tools-discuss --===============1203771449==-- From tools-discuss-bounces@ietf.org Wed Oct 12 15:19:26 2005 Received: from localhost.localdomain ([127.0.0.1] helo=megatron.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1EPm8M-0003Pn-Oq; Wed, 12 Oct 2005 15:19:26 -0400 Received: from odin.ietf.org ([132.151.1.176] helo=ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1EPm8L-0003PP-9c for tools-discuss@megatron.ietf.org; Wed, 12 Oct 2005 15:19:25 -0400 Received: from ietf-mx.ietf.org (ietf-mx [132.151.6.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id PAA13055 for ; Wed, 12 Oct 2005 15:19:22 -0400 (EDT) Received: from b.mail.sonic.net ([64.142.19.5]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1EPmIh-0004c8-3Z for tools-discuss@ietf.org; Wed, 12 Oct 2005 15:30:08 -0400 Received: from [168.61.10.151] (SJC-Office-DHCP-151.Mail-Abuse.ORG [168.61.10.151]) (authenticated bits=0) by b.mail.sonic.net (8.13.3/8.13.3) with ESMTP id j9CJJCfN002255 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=RC4-SHA bits=128 verify=NO) for ; Wed, 12 Oct 2005 12:19:12 -0700 Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v734) Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Message-Id: <115766C1-1EBE-4A78-A7C3-9344B0CC9192@mail-abuse.org> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; delsp=yes; format=flowed To: tools-discuss@ietf.org From: Douglas Otis Date: Wed, 12 Oct 2005 12:19:21 -0700 X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.734) X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 856eb5f76e7a34990d1d457d8e8e5b7f Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: [Tools-discuss] Workgroup tool, set of rfc documents (srd) X-BeenThere: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF Tools Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: tools-discuss-bounces@ietf.org Errors-To: tools-discuss-bounces@ietf.org To provide stable references and to formally incorporate and categorize RFC relationships within a specific endeavour, in a fashion similar to Bill Fenner's diagrams, a tool has been developed to permit the creation of an HTML page from simple xml inputs. While the errata should be conditionally displayed, this requires some type of feed-back from the RFC editor errata page, or perhaps a convention that applies an errata URI within the reference element target URI attribute, or an xml list of RFCs when errata is outstanding for the RFC. Normally the reference/format/@target is used to locate the draft, where the reference/@target is not used by RFCs. The page where this tool can be found is at http://www.sonic.net/~dougotis/newtrk/ The draft related to this tool is being discussed within the newtrk wg. -Doug _______________________________________________ Tools-discuss mailing list Tools-discuss@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/tools-discuss From tools-discuss-bounces@ietf.org Thu Oct 13 05:51:07 2005 Received: from localhost.localdomain ([127.0.0.1] helo=megatron.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1EPzju-0008GO-UG; Thu, 13 Oct 2005 05:51:06 -0400 Received: from odin.ietf.org ([132.151.1.176] helo=ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1EPzjt-0008CF-E9 for tools-discuss@megatron.ietf.org; Thu, 13 Oct 2005 05:51:05 -0400 Received: from ietf-mx.ietf.org (ietf-mx [132.151.6.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id FAA06214 for ; Thu, 13 Oct 2005 05:50:59 -0400 (EDT) Received: from mgw-ext04.nokia.com ([131.228.20.96]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1EPzuK-0005uG-Ny for tools-discuss@ietf.org; Thu, 13 Oct 2005 06:01:54 -0400 Received: from esebh108.NOE.Nokia.com (esebh108.ntc.nokia.com [172.21.143.145]) by mgw-ext04.nokia.com (Switch-3.1.7/Switch-3.1.7) with ESMTP id j9D9lr8f019111 for ; Thu, 13 Oct 2005 12:47:56 +0300 Received: from esebh002.NOE.Nokia.com ([172.21.138.77]) by esebh108.NOE.Nokia.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.1830); Thu, 13 Oct 2005 12:50:59 +0300 Received: from mgw-int2.ntc.nokia.com ([172.21.143.97]) by esebh002.NOE.Nokia.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(5.0.2195.6881); Thu, 13 Oct 2005 12:50:59 +0300 Received: from kusti.research.nokia.com (mgw.research.nokia.com [172.21.56.13]) by mgw-int2.ntc.nokia.com (Switch-2.2.8/Switch-2.2.8) with ESMTP id j9D9oxj02262 for ; Thu, 13 Oct 2005 12:50:59 +0300 (EET DST) Received: from [172.21.34.145] (hed034-145.research.nokia.com [172.21.34.145]) by kusti.research.nokia.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 608CC93B6A for ; Thu, 13 Oct 2005 12:50:59 +0300 (EEST) Message-ID: <434E2E03.7060101@nokia.com> Date: Thu, 13 Oct 2005 12:50:59 +0300 From: Jari Urpalainen User-Agent: Mozilla Thunderbird 1.0.7-1.1.fc4 (X11/20050929) X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: tools-discuss@ietf.org Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-OriginalArrivalTime: 13 Oct 2005 09:50:59.0433 (UTC) FILETIME=[9D555590:01C5CFDB] X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 68c8cc8a64a9d0402e43b8eee9fc4199 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: [Tools-discuss] w3c schema valdation web tool X-BeenThere: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF Tools Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: tools-discuss-bounces@ietf.org Errors-To: tools-discuss-bounces@ietf.org Hi all ! I have written a small apache module to handle w3c schema validation with the Xerces C++ library. The validation tool is available at . If there's any interest I could also opensource this module (although it may take some time...). Anyway, I'd appreciate any comments or improvement requests. So this tool could be added to the available authoring tools if there's any interest, br Jari ps. submitting this tool does not mean that I'd like the w3c schema language (there are better tools available imo). However, it is the prevailing standard. _______________________________________________ Tools-discuss mailing list Tools-discuss@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/tools-discuss From tools-discuss-bounces@ietf.org Thu Oct 13 10:53:43 2005 Received: from localhost.localdomain ([127.0.0.1] helo=megatron.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1EQ4Sl-0005ul-Dk; Thu, 13 Oct 2005 10:53:43 -0400 Received: from odin.ietf.org ([132.151.1.176] helo=ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1EQ4Sk-0005ug-NI for tools-discuss@megatron.ietf.org; Thu, 13 Oct 2005 10:53:42 -0400 Received: from ietf-mx.ietf.org (ietf-mx [132.151.6.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id KAA22194 for ; Thu, 13 Oct 2005 10:53:39 -0400 (EDT) Received: from av10-1-sn2.hy.skanova.net ([81.228.8.181]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1EQ4dG-0005td-Q2 for tools-discuss@ietf.org; Thu, 13 Oct 2005 11:04:36 -0400 Received: by av10-1-sn2.hy.skanova.net (Postfix, from userid 502) id 4FBE538208; Thu, 13 Oct 2005 16:53:22 +0200 (CEST) Received: from smtp4-1-sn2.hy.skanova.net (smtp4-1-sn2.hy.skanova.net [81.228.8.92]) by av10-1-sn2.hy.skanova.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0C92438203; Thu, 13 Oct 2005 16:53:22 +0200 (CEST) Received: from shiraz.levkowetz.com (81-224-201-50-no45.tbcn.telia.com [81.224.201.50]) by smtp4-1-sn2.hy.skanova.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id EB4CB37E46; Thu, 13 Oct 2005 16:53:21 +0200 (CEST) Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]) by shiraz.levkowetz.com with esmtp (Exim 4.52) id 1EQ4SP-00059d-Ro; Thu, 13 Oct 2005 16:53:21 +0200 Message-ID: <434E74E1.9090209@levkowetz.com> Date: Thu, 13 Oct 2005 16:53:21 +0200 From: Henrik Levkowetz User-Agent: Mozilla Thunderbird 1.0.7 (Macintosh/20050923) X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Jari Urpalainen Subject: Re: [Tools-discuss] w3c schema valdation web tool References: <434E2E03.7060101@nokia.com> In-Reply-To: <434E2E03.7060101@nokia.com> X-Enigmail-Version: 0.93.0.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-SA-Exim-Connect-IP: 127.0.0.1 X-SA-Exim-Mail-From: henrik@levkowetz.com X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No (on shiraz.levkowetz.com); SAEximRunCond expanded to false X-Spam-Score: 0.1 (/) X-Scan-Signature: ffa9dfbbe7cc58b3fa6b8ae3e57b0aa3 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Cc: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-BeenThere: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF Tools Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: tools-discuss-bounces@ietf.org Errors-To: tools-discuss-bounces@ietf.org Hi Jari, on 2005-10-13 11:50 Jari Urpalainen said the following: > Hi all ! > I have written a small apache module to handle w3c schema validation > with the Xerces C++ library. The validation tool is available at > . If there's any interest I could > also opensource this module (although it may take some time...). > Anyway, I'd appreciate any comments or improvement requests. So this > tool could be added to the available authoring tools if there's any > interest, > br Jari Looks like a nice tool. Should be added to the tools inventory on http://tools.ietf.org/ Would you be kind enough to look at the tools inventory pages there - e.g., http://tools.ietf.org/verif-tools, http://tools.ietf.org/author-tools, and suggest an entry for your tool. Regards, Henrik > ps. submitting this tool does not mean that I'd like the w3c schema > language (there are better tools available imo). However, it is the > prevailing standard. _______________________________________________ Tools-discuss mailing list Tools-discuss@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/tools-discuss From tools-discuss-bounces@ietf.org Thu Oct 13 10:57:24 2005 Received: from localhost.localdomain ([127.0.0.1] helo=megatron.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1EQ4WJ-0006qw-Uw; Thu, 13 Oct 2005 10:57:23 -0400 Received: from odin.ietf.org ([132.151.1.176] helo=ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1EQ4WI-0006pi-Tu for tools-discuss@megatron.ietf.org; Thu, 13 Oct 2005 10:57:23 -0400 Received: from ietf-mx.ietf.org (ietf-mx [132.151.6.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id KAA22330 for ; Thu, 13 Oct 2005 10:57:19 -0400 (EDT) Received: from av6-2-sn3.vrr.skanova.net ([81.228.9.180]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1EQ4gp-0005zO-6o for tools-discuss@ietf.org; Thu, 13 Oct 2005 11:08:16 -0400 Received: by av6-2-sn3.vrr.skanova.net (Postfix, from userid 502) id 139C538141; Thu, 13 Oct 2005 16:57:10 +0200 (CEST) Received: from smtp3-1-sn3.vrr.skanova.net (smtp3-1-sn3.vrr.skanova.net [81.228.9.101]) by av6-2-sn3.vrr.skanova.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id EEF5337FD9; Thu, 13 Oct 2005 16:57:09 +0200 (CEST) Received: from shiraz.levkowetz.com (81-224-201-50-no45.tbcn.telia.com [81.224.201.50]) by smtp3-1-sn3.vrr.skanova.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id DC7B937E4D; Thu, 13 Oct 2005 16:57:09 +0200 (CEST) Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]) by shiraz.levkowetz.com with esmtp (Exim 4.52) id 1EQ4W5-00077q-9d; Thu, 13 Oct 2005 16:57:09 +0200 Message-ID: <434E75C5.5030209@levkowetz.com> Date: Thu, 13 Oct 2005 16:57:09 +0200 From: Henrik Levkowetz User-Agent: Mozilla Thunderbird 1.0.7 (Macintosh/20050923) X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Douglas Otis Subject: Re: [Tools-discuss] Workgroup tool, set of rfc documents (srd) References: <115766C1-1EBE-4A78-A7C3-9344B0CC9192@mail-abuse.org> In-Reply-To: <115766C1-1EBE-4A78-A7C3-9344B0CC9192@mail-abuse.org> X-Enigmail-Version: 0.93.0.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-SA-Exim-Connect-IP: 127.0.0.1 X-SA-Exim-Mail-From: henrik@levkowetz.com X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No (on shiraz.levkowetz.com); SAEximRunCond expanded to false X-Spam-Score: 0.1 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 9466e0365fc95844abaf7c3f15a05c7d Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Cc: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-BeenThere: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF Tools Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: tools-discuss-bounces@ietf.org Errors-To: tools-discuss-bounces@ietf.org Hi Doug, on 2005-10-12 21:19 Douglas Otis said the following: > To provide stable references and to formally incorporate and > categorize RFC relationships within a specific endeavour, in a > fashion similar to Bill Fenner's diagrams, a tool has been developed > to permit the creation of an HTML page from simple xml inputs. While > the errata should be conditionally displayed, this requires some type > of feed-back from the RFC editor errata page, or perhaps a convention > that applies an errata URI within the reference element target URI > attribute, or an xml list of RFCs when errata is outstanding for the > RFC. Normally the reference/format/@target is used to locate the > draft, where the reference/@target is not used by RFCs. > > The page where this tool can be found is at > > http://www.sonic.net/~dougotis/newtrk/ > > The draft related to this tool is being discussed within the newtrk wg. Umm - I have to admit that I haven't been following newtrk closely, and don't immediately realize from the description and tool page exactly what the tool does and how I could use it. Could you indicate the name of the relevant draft, so I could read up on this? Regards, Henrik _______________________________________________ Tools-discuss mailing list Tools-discuss@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/tools-discuss From tools-discuss-bounces@ietf.org Thu Oct 13 11:00:35 2005 Received: from localhost.localdomain ([127.0.0.1] helo=megatron.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1EQ4ZP-0008Qa-G7; Thu, 13 Oct 2005 11:00:35 -0400 Received: from odin.ietf.org ([132.151.1.176] helo=ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1EQ4ZN-0008OS-JY for tools-discuss@megatron.ietf.org; Thu, 13 Oct 2005 11:00:33 -0400 Received: from ietf-mx.ietf.org (ietf-mx [132.151.6.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id LAA22459 for ; Thu, 13 Oct 2005 11:00:30 -0400 (EDT) Received: from m1.informatik.uni-bremen.de ([134.102.201.18] helo=informatik.uni-bremen.de ident=root) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1EQ4jt-00063c-9I for tools-discuss@ietf.org; Thu, 13 Oct 2005 11:11:27 -0400 Received: from [127.0.0.1] (m2.informatik.uni-bremen.de [IPv6:2001:638:708:30c9:209:3dff:fe00:343a]) by informatik.uni-bremen.de (8.13.4/8.13.2) with ESMTP id j9DF0Prd007872; Thu, 13 Oct 2005 17:00:26 +0200 (CEST) In-Reply-To: <434E74E1.9090209@levkowetz.com> References: <434E2E03.7060101@nokia.com> <434E74E1.9090209@levkowetz.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v734) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; delsp=yes; format=flowed Message-Id: Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: Carsten Bormann Subject: Re: [Tools-discuss] w3c schema valdation web tool Date: Thu, 13 Oct 2005 17:00:23 +0200 To: Jari Urpalainen X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.734) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 7a6398bf8aaeabc7a7bb696b6b0a2aad Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Cc: Carsten Bormann , Discussion Team Tools X-BeenThere: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF Tools Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: tools-discuss-bounces@ietf.org Errors-To: tools-discuss-bounces@ietf.org On Oct 13 2005, at 16:53 Uhr, Henrik Levkowetz wrote: >> submitting this tool does not mean that I'd like the w3c schema >> language (there are better tools available imo). However, it is the >> prevailing standard. At some point, we probably should agree to do IETF development of XML Schemas in Relax-NG (Compact). It is easy to generate W3C Schemas from RNC -- more food for the tools page. Gruesse, Carsten _______________________________________________ Tools-discuss mailing list Tools-discuss@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/tools-discuss From tools-discuss-bounces@ietf.org Thu Oct 13 11:04:48 2005 Received: from localhost.localdomain ([127.0.0.1] helo=megatron.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1EQ4dU-0001FA-7W; Thu, 13 Oct 2005 11:04:48 -0400 Received: from odin.ietf.org ([132.151.1.176] helo=ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1EPhG6-0000PE-S3 for tools-discuss@megatron.ietf.org; Wed, 12 Oct 2005 10:07:06 -0400 Received: from ietf-mx.ietf.org (ietf-mx [132.151.6.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id KAA22833 for ; Wed, 12 Oct 2005 10:07:04 -0400 (EDT) Received: from alpha.dante.org.uk ([193.63.211.19] helo=mail.dante.org.uk) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1EPhQO-0003BR-0C for tools-discuss@ietf.org; Wed, 12 Oct 2005 10:17:47 -0400 Received: from [127.0.0.1] (helo=localhost) by mail.dante.org.uk with esmtp (Exim 4.51) id 1EPhFW-0005Eh-AC; Wed, 12 Oct 2005 15:06:30 +0100 Received: from mail.dante.org.uk ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (alpha [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 19966-08; Wed, 12 Oct 2005 15:06:26 +0100 (BST) Received: from [193.63.211.101] (helo=[193.63.211.101]) by mail.dante.org.uk with esmtp (Exim 4.51) id 1EPhFR-0005Ec-Nr; Wed, 12 Oct 2005 15:06:25 +0100 Message-ID: <434D190F.2020802@dante.org.uk> Date: Wed, 12 Oct 2005 15:09:19 +0100 From: Otto Kreiter User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.1; en-US; rv:1.7.11) Gecko/20050728 X-Accept-Language: en-gb, en, en-us MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Henrik Levkowetz , tools-discuss@ietf.org X-Enigmail-Version: 0.92.1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at dante.org.uk X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Scan-Signature: e5ba305d0e64821bf3d8bc5d3bb07228 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailman-Approved-At: Thu, 13 Oct 2005 11:04:46 -0400 Cc: Subject: [Tools-discuss] tools.ietf.org/wg/ccamp broken X-BeenThere: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF Tools Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: tools-discuss-bounces@ietf.org Errors-To: tools-discuss-bounces@ietf.org Dear Henrik and the IETF Tools development Team, Accessing the Ccamp wg link http://tools.ietf.org/wg/ccamp/ I've noticed an error for the related documents: ----------------------------------------- /usr/lib/python2.3/posixpath.py in getmtime(filename='draft-vasseur-ccamp-automesh-01.txt') 144 def getmtime(filename): 145 """Return the last modification time of a file, reported by os.stat().""" 146 return os.stat(filename).st_mtime 147 148 def getatime(filename): global os = , os.stat = , filename = 'draft-vasseur-ccamp-automesh-01.txt', ).st_mtime undefined OSError: [Errno 2] No such file or directory: 'draft-vasseur-ccamp-automesh-01.txt' args = (2, 'No such file or directory') errno = 2 filename = 'draft-vasseur-ccamp-automesh-01.txt' strerror = 'No such file or directory' ------------------------------------------- It looks to me that only the Ccamp WG is affected. Best regards, Otto _______________________________________________ Tools-discuss mailing list Tools-discuss@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/tools-discuss From tools-discuss-bounces@ietf.org Thu Oct 13 12:45:17 2005 Received: from localhost.localdomain ([127.0.0.1] helo=megatron.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1EQ6Cj-0006tw-Jr; Thu, 13 Oct 2005 12:45:17 -0400 Received: from odin.ietf.org ([132.151.1.176] helo=ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1EQ6Ci-0006tr-M3 for tools-discuss@megatron.ietf.org; Thu, 13 Oct 2005 12:45:16 -0400 Received: from ietf-mx.ietf.org (ietf-mx [132.151.6.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id MAA28064 for ; Thu, 13 Oct 2005 12:45:11 -0400 (EDT) Received: from b.mail.sonic.net ([64.142.19.5]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1EQ6ND-0000SR-O5 for tools-discuss@ietf.org; Thu, 13 Oct 2005 12:56:10 -0400 Received: from [168.61.10.151] (SJC-Office-DHCP-151.Mail-Abuse.ORG [168.61.10.151]) (authenticated bits=0) by b.mail.sonic.net (8.13.3/8.13.3) with ESMTP id j9DGj3a6013095 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=RC4-SHA bits=128 verify=NO); Thu, 13 Oct 2005 09:45:03 -0700 In-Reply-To: <434E75C5.5030209@levkowetz.com> References: <115766C1-1EBE-4A78-A7C3-9344B0CC9192@mail-abuse.org> <434E75C5.5030209@levkowetz.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v734) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; delsp=yes; format=flowed Message-Id: <10F63A91-963D-4E75-990D-5AD32D546E08@mail-abuse.org> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: Douglas Otis Subject: Re: [Tools-discuss] Workgroup tool, set of rfc documents (srd) Date: Thu, 13 Oct 2005 09:45:13 -0700 To: Henrik Levkowetz X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.734) X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 538aad3a3c4f01d8b6a6477ca4248793 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Cc: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-BeenThere: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF Tools Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: tools-discuss-bounces@ietf.org Errors-To: tools-discuss-bounces@ietf.org On Oct 13, 2005, at 7:57 AM, Henrik Levkowetz wrote: > Hi Doug, > > on 2005-10-12 21:19 Douglas Otis said the following: >> >> The page where this tool can be found is at >> >> http://www.sonic.net/~dougotis/newtrk/ >> >> The draft related to this tool is being discussed within the >> newtrk wg. >> > > Umm - I have to admit that I haven't been following newtrk closely, > and > don't immediately realize from the description and tool page exactly > what the tool does and how I could use it. Could you indicate the > name > of the relevant draft, so I could read up on this? The link to the draft was the first on the web page. Here are some draft specific links: http://www.sonic.net/~dougotis/id/draft-otis-newtrk-rfc-set-02.html or http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-otis-newtrk-rfc-set-02.txt The concept behind this tool and related xml structure was to help organize RFC and provide stable references. The xslt file is primitive and was intended to provide only a basic example. As you can see the structure is simple enough to where a web page could act as an entry form for generating the xml version of the srd. The first draft was well received at the Newtrk WG meeting on the Friday in Paris. It has undergone two revisions since. This WG meeting was the last day to allow those concerned to attend. I thought to expose this to those familiar with tools in the hopes the xslt files might be embellished to provide nicer outputs, including a text version. If copyright is given to the Internet Society, I would be happy to include these in the next draft while crediting their authors. My advice would be to keep it simple. I raised an issue regarding the selective display of the errata link. There are several ways this could be solved. Perhaps following the next meeting, the IETF may accept SRDs on a trial basis and publishing them under srd and srd-wip. It is my view, an SRD should only appear under srd when approved by the IESG after being presented by an area director. -Doug _______________________________________________ Tools-discuss mailing list Tools-discuss@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/tools-discuss From tools-discuss-bounces@ietf.org Thu Oct 13 16:21:43 2005 Received: from localhost.localdomain ([127.0.0.1] helo=megatron.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1EQ9Rw-000321-Am; Thu, 13 Oct 2005 16:13:12 -0400 Received: from odin.ietf.org ([132.151.1.176] helo=ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1EQ9Rv-00031I-6e for tools-discuss@megatron.ietf.org; Thu, 13 Oct 2005 16:13:11 -0400 Received: from ietf-mx.ietf.org (ietf-mx [132.151.6.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id QAA13438 for ; Thu, 13 Oct 2005 16:13:07 -0400 (EDT) Received: from av11-2-sn2.hy.skanova.net ([81.228.8.184]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1EQ9cS-0007ef-Rn for tools-discuss@ietf.org; Thu, 13 Oct 2005 16:24:07 -0400 Received: by av11-2-sn2.hy.skanova.net (Postfix, from userid 502) id 390A0381E1; Thu, 13 Oct 2005 22:12:59 +0200 (CEST) Received: from smtp4-1-sn2.hy.skanova.net (smtp4-1-sn2.hy.skanova.net [81.228.8.92]) by av11-2-sn2.hy.skanova.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 27BE337FBF; Thu, 13 Oct 2005 22:12:59 +0200 (CEST) Received: from shiraz.levkowetz.com (81-224-201-50-no45.tbcn.telia.com [81.224.201.50]) by smtp4-1-sn2.hy.skanova.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 15EB037E43; Thu, 13 Oct 2005 22:12:58 +0200 (CEST) Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]) by shiraz.levkowetz.com with esmtp (Exim 4.52) id 1EQ9Ri-00078N-Pg; Thu, 13 Oct 2005 22:12:58 +0200 Message-ID: <434EBFC9.4020307@levkowetz.com> Date: Thu, 13 Oct 2005 22:12:57 +0200 From: Henrik Levkowetz User-Agent: Mozilla Thunderbird 1.0.7 (Macintosh/20050923) X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Carsten Bormann Subject: Re: [Tools-discuss] w3c schema valdation web tool References: <434E2E03.7060101@nokia.com> <434E74E1.9090209@levkowetz.com> In-Reply-To: X-Enigmail-Version: 0.93.0.0 X-SA-Exim-Connect-IP: 127.0.0.1 X-SA-Exim-Mail-From: henrik@levkowetz.com X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No (on shiraz.levkowetz.com); SAEximRunCond expanded to false X-Spam-Score: 0.1 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 7baded97d9887f7a0c7e8a33c2e3ea1b Cc: Discussion Team Tools X-BeenThere: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF Tools Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="===============1343863151==" Sender: tools-discuss-bounces@ietf.org Errors-To: tools-discuss-bounces@ietf.org This is an OpenPGP/MIME signed message (RFC 2440 and 3156) --===============1343863151== Content-Type: multipart/signed; micalg=pgp-sha1; protocol="application/pgp-signature"; boundary="------------enig123E77F5B94D2085A4E860F8" This is an OpenPGP/MIME signed message (RFC 2440 and 3156) --------------enig123E77F5B94D2085A4E860F8 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Hi Carsten, on 2005-10-13 17:00 Carsten Bormann said the following: > On Oct 13 2005, at 16:53 Uhr, Henrik Levkowetz wrote: > >>> submitting this tool does not mean that I'd like the w3c schema >>> language (there are better tools available imo). However, it is the >>> prevailing standard. > > At some point, we probably should agree to do IETF development of XML > Schemas in Relax-NG (Compact). > It is easy to generate W3C Schemas from RNC -- more food for the > tools page. With respect to using Relax-NG compact I totally agree - I might go so far as to say that it's the only tolerable schema specification format for XML I've come across. Henrik --------------enig123E77F5B94D2085A4E860F8 Content-Type: application/pgp-signature; name="signature.asc" Content-Description: OpenPGP digital signature Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="signature.asc" -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.4.1 (GNU/Linux) iD8DBQFDTr/KeVhrtTJkXCMRAqRLAJ949AEg/8o0s1S7xxl73YgXe5+t7wCgoxWH JIlWUHlwmjmuBHrW4HhcizI= =w57Z -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --------------enig123E77F5B94D2085A4E860F8-- --===============1343863151== Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline _______________________________________________ Tools-discuss mailing list Tools-discuss@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/tools-discuss --===============1343863151==-- From tools-discuss-bounces@ietf.org Thu Oct 13 23:55:34 2005 Received: from localhost.localdomain ([127.0.0.1] helo=megatron.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1EQGfO-00059H-49; Thu, 13 Oct 2005 23:55:34 -0400 Received: from odin.ietf.org ([132.151.1.176] helo=ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1EQGfM-000599-EJ for tools-discuss@megatron.ietf.org; Thu, 13 Oct 2005 23:55:32 -0400 Received: from ietf-mx.ietf.org (ietf-mx [132.151.6.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id XAA14225 for ; Thu, 13 Oct 2005 23:55:28 -0400 (EDT) Received: from exprod6og3.obsmtp.com ([64.18.1.123] helo=psmtp.com) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with smtp (Exim 4.43) id 1EQGpz-0005e2-EJ for tools-discuss@ietf.org; Fri, 14 Oct 2005 00:06:32 -0400 Received: from source ([192.150.11.134]) by exprod6ob3.obsmtp.com ([64.18.5.12]) with SMTP; Thu, 13 Oct 2005 20:55:24 PDT Received: from inner-relay-3.eur.adobe.com (inner-relay-3.adobe.com [192.150.20.198] (may be forged)) by outbound-smtp-1.corp.adobe.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id j9E3m4PV026015 for ; Thu, 13 Oct 2005 20:48:04 -0700 (PDT) Received: from calsj-dev (calsj-dev.corp.adobe.com [153.32.1.193]) by inner-relay-3.eur.adobe.com (8.12.10/8.12.9) with ESMTP id j9E3tLlI027402 for ; Thu, 13 Oct 2005 20:55:21 -0700 (PDT) Received: from calsj-dev (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mailsj-v1.corp.adobe.com (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 2.02 (built Oct 21 2004)) with ESMTP id <0IOC00M450881F@mailsj-v1.corp.adobe.com> for tools-discuss@ietf.org; Thu, 13 Oct 2005 20:55:20 -0700 (PDT) Received: from MasinterT43p ([10.7.241.29]) by mailsj-v1.corp.adobe.com (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 2.02 (built Oct 21 2004)) with ESMTP id <0IOC0047F08818@mailsj-v1.corp.adobe.com> for tools-discuss@ietf.org; Thu, 13 Oct 2005 20:55:20 -0700 (PDT) Date: Thu, 13 Oct 2005 20:55:36 -0700 From: Larry Masinter Subject: RE: [Tools-discuss] w3c schema valdation web tool In-reply-to: <434EBFC9.4020307@levkowetz.com> To: "'Henrik Levkowetz'" , "'Carsten Bormann'" Message-id: <001801c5d073$2283b300$1df1070a@corp.adobe.com> MIME-version: 1.0 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.2180 X-Mailer: Microsoft Office Outlook 11 Content-type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Thread-index: AcXQM/Td35KR3zfES6GQOQ1uLeArHQAPWAVw X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 856eb5f76e7a34990d1d457d8e8e5b7f Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7BIT Cc: 'Discussion Team Tools' X-BeenThere: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF Tools Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: tools-discuss-bounces@ietf.org Errors-To: tools-discuss-bounces@ietf.org > > At some point, we probably should agree to do IETF development of XML > > Schemas in Relax-NG (Compact). The debate about validation mechanisms frequently becomes a religious one. In particular, this was a hot topic in the development of RFC 3470, BCP 70, on "Guidelines for the use of XML in IETF protocols". Do you mean that you intend to try to get IETF consensus to update BCP 70 to recommend Relax-NG over other mechanisms for expressing XML validity? See the discussion around June 2002 in http://www.imc.org/ietf-xml-use/mail-archive/maillist.html Larry -- http://larry.masinter.net _______________________________________________ Tools-discuss mailing list Tools-discuss@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/tools-discuss From tools-discuss-bounces@ietf.org Fri Oct 14 02:18:54 2005 Received: from localhost.localdomain ([127.0.0.1] helo=megatron.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1EQIu6-0000L4-7I; Fri, 14 Oct 2005 02:18:54 -0400 Received: from odin.ietf.org ([132.151.1.176] helo=ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1EQIu4-0000KF-8M for tools-discuss@megatron.ietf.org; Fri, 14 Oct 2005 02:18:52 -0400 Received: from ietf-mx.ietf.org (ietf-mx [132.151.6.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id CAA19754 for ; Fri, 14 Oct 2005 02:18:45 -0400 (EDT) Received: from m1.informatik.uni-bremen.de ([134.102.201.18] helo=informatik.uni-bremen.de ident=root) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1EQJ0s-0000PB-Ap for tools-discuss@ietf.org; Fri, 14 Oct 2005 02:25:55 -0400 Received: from [127.0.0.1] (m2.informatik.uni-bremen.de [IPv6:2001:638:708:30c9:209:3dff:fe00:343a]) by informatik.uni-bremen.de (8.13.4/8.13.2) with ESMTP id j9E6E3Rp004724; Fri, 14 Oct 2005 08:14:04 +0200 (CEST) In-Reply-To: <001801c5d073$2283b300$1df1070a@corp.adobe.com> References: <001801c5d073$2283b300$1df1070a@corp.adobe.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v734) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; delsp=yes; format=flowed Message-Id: <807D04DC-230F-4540-A0F7-697590A04FA7@tzi.org> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: Carsten Bormann Subject: Re: [Tools-discuss] w3c schema valdation web tool Date: Fri, 14 Oct 2005 08:14:00 +0200 To: Larry Masinter X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.734) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Scan-Signature: e5ba305d0e64821bf3d8bc5d3bb07228 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Cc: Carsten Bormann , 'Henrik Levkowetz' , 'Discussion Team Tools' X-BeenThere: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF Tools Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: tools-discuss-bounces@ietf.org Errors-To: tools-discuss-bounces@ietf.org On Oct 14 2005, at 05:55 Uhr, Larry Masinter wrote: > Do you mean that you intend to try to get IETF consensus to update > BCP 70 > to recommend Relax-NG over other mechanisms for expressing XML > validity? Well, BCP 70 does the right thing and leaves the selection of the validation mechanism to the standardization process. (Clearly, depending on existing context, in some cases only W3C schemas might fit and occasionally there are even reasons to use DTDs.) Still, on the level of "best current practice", I wouldn't mind a stronger guideline of "default" development strategy: Develop in RNC, express in both RNC (for readability) and W3C Schema where the latter is required for some reason. Fortunately, section 4.10 already discourages dependence on the PSVI. Some time has passed since the 2002 discussions that led to BCP 70. XML-heavy WGs seem to group around RNC already (e.g., atompub). I'm more concerned with WGs where XML schemas are more ancillary; these are the ones that would benefit most from additional guidance. (This answer is just for clarification; we are leaving the domain of the tools group if we want to continue this discussion. None of this is in any way detracting from the usefulness of a W3C schema validation tool on the IETF tools page.) Gruesse, Carsten _______________________________________________ Tools-discuss mailing list Tools-discuss@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/tools-discuss From tools-discuss-bounces@ietf.org Fri Oct 14 02:30:58 2005 Received: from localhost.localdomain ([127.0.0.1] helo=megatron.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1EQJ5l-0003Hh-VQ; Fri, 14 Oct 2005 02:30:57 -0400 Received: from odin.ietf.org ([132.151.1.176] helo=ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1EQJ5k-0003Cy-4U for tools-discuss@megatron.ietf.org; Fri, 14 Oct 2005 02:30:56 -0400 Received: from ietf-mx.ietf.org (ietf-mx [132.151.6.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id CAA20505 for ; Fri, 14 Oct 2005 02:30:51 -0400 (EDT) Received: from mgw-ext02.nokia.com ([131.228.20.94]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1EQJGO-0000xW-Fp for tools-discuss@ietf.org; Fri, 14 Oct 2005 02:41:57 -0400 Received: from esebh106.NOE.Nokia.com (esebh106.ntc.nokia.com [172.21.138.213]) by mgw-ext02.nokia.com (Switch-3.1.7/Switch-3.1.7) with ESMTP id j9E6UhiX018441; Fri, 14 Oct 2005 09:30:49 +0300 Received: from esebh001.NOE.Nokia.com ([172.21.138.28]) by esebh106.NOE.Nokia.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.1830); Fri, 14 Oct 2005 09:30:49 +0300 Received: from mgw-int1.ntc.nokia.com ([172.21.143.96]) by esebh001.NOE.Nokia.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(5.0.2195.6881); Fri, 14 Oct 2005 09:30:49 +0300 Received: from kusti.research.nokia.com (mgw.research.nokia.com [172.21.56.13]) by mgw-int1.ntc.nokia.com (Switch-2.2.8/Switch-2.2.8) with ESMTP id j9E6UmL24071; Fri, 14 Oct 2005 09:30:48 +0300 (EET DST) Received: from [172.21.34.145] (hed034-145.research.nokia.com [172.21.34.145]) by kusti.research.nokia.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2BDFC93B6A; Fri, 14 Oct 2005 09:30:48 +0300 (EEST) Message-ID: <434F5098.8060108@nokia.com> Date: Fri, 14 Oct 2005 09:30:48 +0300 From: Jari Urpalainen User-Agent: Mozilla Thunderbird 1.0.7-1.1.fc4 (X11/20050929) X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: ext Henrik Levkowetz Subject: Re: [Tools-discuss] w3c schema valdation web tool References: <434E2E03.7060101@nokia.com> <434E74E1.9090209@levkowetz.com> In-Reply-To: <434E74E1.9090209@levkowetz.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-OriginalArrivalTime: 14 Oct 2005 06:30:49.0078 (UTC) FILETIME=[D1045960:01C5D088] X-Spam-Score: 0.1 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 50a516d93fd399dc60588708fd9a3002 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Cc: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-BeenThere: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF Tools Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: tools-discuss-bounces@ietf.org Errors-To: tools-discuss-bounces@ietf.org ext Henrik Levkowetz wrote: >Hi Jari, > >on 2005-10-13 11:50 Jari Urpalainen said the following: > > >>Hi all ! >>I have written a small apache module to handle w3c schema validation >>with the Xerces C++ library. The validation tool is available at >>. If there's any interest I could >>also opensource this module (although it may take some time...). >>Anyway, I'd appreciate any comments or improvement requests. So this >>tool could be added to the available authoring tools if there's any >>interest, >>br Jari >> >> > >Looks like a nice tool. Should be added to the tools inventory on >http://tools.ietf.org/ Would you be kind enough to look at the tools >inventory pages there - e.g., http://tools.ietf.org/verif-tools, >http://tools.ietf.org/author-tools, and suggest an entry for your >tool. > >Regards, > > Henrik > > > How about W3C Schema validation tool utilizing Xerces under http://tools.ietf.org/verif-tools >>ps. submitting this tool does not mean that I'd like the w3c schema >>language (there are better tools available imo). However, it is the >>prevailing standard. >> >> > > > And yes it would be really really nice if WGs adopted Relax NG (unfortunately there seems to be some ;) resistance, but let's keep trying...). And btw. I might add RNG validator as well as a convert tool from w3c schema to rng onto the web page, too. thanks, Jari _______________________________________________ Tools-discuss mailing list Tools-discuss@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/tools-discuss From tools-discuss-bounces@ietf.org Fri Oct 14 03:34:20 2005 Received: from localhost.localdomain ([127.0.0.1] helo=megatron.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1EQK56-0007pu-PH; Fri, 14 Oct 2005 03:34:20 -0400 Received: from odin.ietf.org ([132.151.1.176] helo=ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1EQK54-0007pf-Sr for tools-discuss@megatron.ietf.org; Fri, 14 Oct 2005 03:34:19 -0400 Received: from ietf-mx.ietf.org (ietf-mx [132.151.6.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id DAA23276 for ; Fri, 14 Oct 2005 03:34:13 -0400 (EDT) Received: from av7-1-sn3.vrr.skanova.net ([81.228.9.181]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1EQKFj-0002Yx-Un for tools-discuss@ietf.org; Fri, 14 Oct 2005 03:45:21 -0400 Received: by av7-1-sn3.vrr.skanova.net (Postfix, from userid 502) id B810238347; Fri, 14 Oct 2005 09:27:10 +0200 (CEST) Received: from smtp3-1-sn3.vrr.skanova.net (smtp3-1-sn3.vrr.skanova.net [81.228.9.101]) by av7-1-sn3.vrr.skanova.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9E84E382FA; Fri, 14 Oct 2005 09:27:10 +0200 (CEST) Received: from shiraz.levkowetz.com (81-224-201-50-no45.tbcn.telia.com [81.224.201.50]) by smtp3-1-sn3.vrr.skanova.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8008437E46; Fri, 14 Oct 2005 09:34:01 +0200 (CEST) Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]) by shiraz.levkowetz.com with esmtp (Exim 4.52) id 1EQK4m-00080u-Ra; Fri, 14 Oct 2005 09:34:00 +0200 Message-ID: <434F5F68.9080407@levkowetz.com> Date: Fri, 14 Oct 2005 09:34:00 +0200 From: Henrik Levkowetz User-Agent: Mozilla Thunderbird 1.0.7 (Macintosh/20050923) X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Jari Urpalainen Subject: Re: [Tools-discuss] w3c schema valdation web tool References: <434E2E03.7060101@nokia.com> <434E74E1.9090209@levkowetz.com> <434F5098.8060108@nokia.com> In-Reply-To: <434F5098.8060108@nokia.com> X-Enigmail-Version: 0.93.0.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-SA-Exim-Connect-IP: 127.0.0.1 X-SA-Exim-Mail-From: henrik@levkowetz.com X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No (on shiraz.levkowetz.com); SAEximRunCond expanded to false X-Spam-Score: 0.1 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 856eb5f76e7a34990d1d457d8e8e5b7f Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Cc: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-BeenThere: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF Tools Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: tools-discuss-bounces@ietf.org Errors-To: tools-discuss-bounces@ietf.org on 2005-10-14 08:30 Jari Urpalainen said the following: [...] > How about W3C Schema validation tool utilizing Xerces under > > http://tools.ietf.org/verif-tools Done! > And yes it would be really really nice if WGs adopted Relax NG > (unfortunately there seems to be some ;) resistance, but let's keep > trying...). And btw. I might add RNG validator as well as a convert tool > from w3c schema to rng onto the web page, too. Sounds good. Let me know if I need to update the tools page. Henrik _______________________________________________ Tools-discuss mailing list Tools-discuss@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/tools-discuss From tools-discuss-bounces@ietf.org Fri Oct 14 11:50:03 2005 Received: from localhost.localdomain ([127.0.0.1] helo=megatron.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1EQRop-0002pQ-0k; Fri, 14 Oct 2005 11:50:03 -0400 Received: from odin.ietf.org ([132.151.1.176] helo=ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1EQRon-0002p6-Ck for tools-discuss@megatron.ietf.org; Fri, 14 Oct 2005 11:50:01 -0400 Received: from ietf-mx.ietf.org (ietf-mx [132.151.6.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id LAA25346 for ; Fri, 14 Oct 2005 11:49:57 -0400 (EDT) Received: from exprod6og1.obsmtp.com ([64.18.1.121] helo=psmtp.com) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with smtp (Exim 4.43) id 1EQRzV-0001ZZ-Gf for tools-discuss@ietf.org; Fri, 14 Oct 2005 12:01:08 -0400 Received: from source ([192.150.20.142]) by exprod6ob1.obsmtp.com ([64.18.5.12]) with SMTP; Fri, 14 Oct 2005 08:49:51 PDT Received: from inner-relay-3.eur.adobe.com (inner-relay-3b [10.128.4.236]) by outbound-smtp-2.corp.adobe.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id j9EFu1UC016183 for ; Fri, 14 Oct 2005 08:56:01 -0700 (PDT) Received: from calsj-dev (calsj-dev.corp.adobe.com [153.32.1.193]) by inner-relay-3.eur.adobe.com (8.12.10/8.12.9) with ESMTP id j9EFnnlI026170 for ; Fri, 14 Oct 2005 08:49:49 -0700 (PDT) Received: from calsj-dev (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mailsj-v1.corp.adobe.com (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 2.02 (built Oct 21 2004)) with ESMTP id <0IOC00GVVXB0DK@mailsj-v1.corp.adobe.com> for tools-discuss@ietf.org; Fri, 14 Oct 2005 08:49:48 -0700 (PDT) Received: from MasinterT43p ([10.7.241.147]) by mailsj-v1.corp.adobe.com (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 2.02 (built Oct 21 2004)) with ESMTP id <0IOC00FFXXB0Q6@mailsj-v1.corp.adobe.com> for tools-discuss@ietf.org; Fri, 14 Oct 2005 08:49:48 -0700 (PDT) Date: Fri, 14 Oct 2005 08:50:02 -0700 From: Larry Masinter To: "'Discussion Team Tools'" Message-id: <000c01c5d0d6$f11178c0$93f1070a@corp.adobe.com> MIME-version: 1.0 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.2180 X-Mailer: Microsoft Office Outlook 11 Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Thread-index: AcXJSNP0rtpcUFZkQfGadeyD+1qbZgAU7d3QAc5x1oA= X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Scan-Signature: e1e48a527f609d1be2bc8d8a70eb76cb Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7BIT Subject: [Tools-discuss] FW: NIST's XML Schema and Instance Validation Web Services X-BeenThere: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF Tools Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: tools-discuss-bounces@ietf.org Errors-To: tools-discuss-bounces@ietf.org Here's a related idea... -----Original Message----- From: xmlschema-dev-request@w3.org On Behalf Of pgoyal@nist.gov Sent: Tuesday, October 04, 2005 1:15 PM To: puja.goyal@nist.gov Subject: NIST's XML Schema and Instance Validation Web Services The NIST Manufacturing Engineering Laboratory is pleased to announce the release of NIST's XML Schema and Instance Validation Web Services. These services can be used to remotely validate XML schema files against the W3C XML Schema standard (Schema Validation), and XML data files against their corresponding schemas (Instance Validation) using a number of XML parsing tools concurrently. Results are presented on a single page for easy comparison. As of now, three publicly developed XML parsers: Xerces, Jing, and MultiSchema Validator are available. In addition, Instance Validation provides access to two publicly available schemas: OASIS UBL schemas and Grants.gov schemas. Additional parsers and public schemas will be added in the future. For more information about these services, please see http://www.mel.nist.gov/msid/validation/ We are expanding the announcement of this release to a wider audience in order to gain additional feedback on usability, etc. Any feedback you could provide would be appreciated. Contact: Puja Goyal puja.goyal@nist.gov _______________________________________________ Tools-discuss mailing list Tools-discuss@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/tools-discuss From tools-discuss-bounces@ietf.org Fri Oct 14 19:06:59 2005 Received: from localhost.localdomain ([127.0.0.1] helo=megatron.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1EQYdf-0006QG-0v; Fri, 14 Oct 2005 19:06:59 -0400 Received: from odin.ietf.org ([132.151.1.176] helo=ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1EQYdd-0006NA-Er; Fri, 14 Oct 2005 19:06:57 -0400 Received: from ietf-mx.ietf.org (ietf-mx [132.151.6.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id TAA02691; Fri, 14 Oct 2005 19:06:52 -0400 (EDT) Received: from a.painless.aaisp.net.uk ([81.187.81.51] helo=smtp.aaisp.net.uk) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1EQYoL-0001Ri-EK; Fri, 14 Oct 2005 19:18:07 -0400 Received: from [81.187.254.247] (helo=[127.0.0.1]) by smtp.aaisp.net.uk with esmtps (TLSv1:AES256-SHA:256) (Exim 4.43) id 1EQYdA-0006KX-Mz; Sat, 15 Oct 2005 00:06:28 +0100 Message-ID: <43503A4F.60002@dial.pipex.com> Date: Sat, 15 Oct 2005 00:07:59 +0100 From: Elwyn Davies User-Agent: Mozilla Thunderbird 1.0.2 (Windows/20050317) X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: tools-discuss@ietf.org, gen-art@ietf.org Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 856eb5f76e7a34990d1d457d8e8e5b7f Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Cc: Subject: [Tools-discuss] Structured format for reviews/issues reports X-BeenThere: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF Tools Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: tools-discuss-bounces@ietf.org Errors-To: tools-discuss-bounces@ietf.org Hi. When the gen-art team (or anyone else) is writing reviews, much of the review is a sequence of issues. With the increased use of issue trackers it seems pretty stupid that somebody has to unpick a text email to separate a bunch of issues to stuff them into an issue tracker. So how about an xml schema for a review and individual issues (shouldn't be too complex) and a tool to split them insert them into a issue tracker, plus some suitable pretty printing to make them easy to read as a review. I am game to help if people think it is interesting. Regards, Elwyn _______________________________________________ Tools-discuss mailing list Tools-discuss@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/tools-discuss From tools-discuss-bounces@ietf.org Sat Oct 15 06:53:08 2005 Received: from localhost.localdomain ([127.0.0.1] helo=megatron.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1EQjf2-0003Sj-Q5; Sat, 15 Oct 2005 06:53:08 -0400 Received: from odin.ietf.org ([132.151.1.176] helo=ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1EQjf0-0003Rg-WC; Sat, 15 Oct 2005 06:53:07 -0400 Received: from ietf-mx.ietf.org (ietf-mx [132.151.6.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id GAA03080; Sat, 15 Oct 2005 06:53:01 -0400 (EDT) Received: from rtp-iport-1.cisco.com ([64.102.122.148]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1EQjpv-0000R1-CP; Sat, 15 Oct 2005 07:04:23 -0400 Received: from rtp-core-2.cisco.com ([64.102.124.13]) by rtp-iport-1.cisco.com with ESMTP; 15 Oct 2005 03:52:58 -0700 X-BrightmailFiltered: true X-Brightmail-Tracker: AAAAAA== X-IronPort-AV: i="3.97,216,1125903600"; d="scan'208"; a="13255148:sNHT21959112" Received: from xbh-rtp-201.amer.cisco.com (xbh-rtp-201.cisco.com [64.102.31.12]) by rtp-core-2.cisco.com (8.12.10/8.12.6) with ESMTP id j9FAqtEi024290; Sat, 15 Oct 2005 06:52:56 -0400 (EDT) Received: from xfe-rtp-202.amer.cisco.com ([64.102.31.21]) by xbh-rtp-201.amer.cisco.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.211); Sat, 15 Oct 2005 06:52:55 -0400 Received: from cisco.com ([10.86.240.62]) by xfe-rtp-202.amer.cisco.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.211); Sat, 15 Oct 2005 06:52:54 -0400 Date: Sat, 15 Oct 2005 06:52:08 -0400 From: Scott W Brim To: Elwyn Davies Message-ID: <20051015105206.GC4612@sbrim-wxp01> References: <43503A4F.60002@dial.pipex.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <43503A4F.60002@dial.pipex.com> User-Agent: Mutt/1.4.2.1i X-OriginalArrivalTime: 15 Oct 2005 10:52:54.0910 (UTC) FILETIME=[98C1A1E0:01C5D176] X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 7d33c50f3756db14428398e2bdedd581 Cc: gen-art@ietf.org, tools-discuss@ietf.org Subject: [Tools-discuss] Re: [Gen-art] Structured format for reviews/issues reports X-BeenThere: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF Tools Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: tools-discuss-bounces@ietf.org Errors-To: tools-discuss-bounces@ietf.org On Sat, Oct 15, 2005 12:07:59AM +0100, Elwyn Davies allegedly wrote: > Hi. > > When the gen-art team (or anyone else) is writing reviews, much of the > review is a sequence of issues. > > With the increased use of issue trackers it seems pretty stupid that > somebody has to unpick a text email to separate a bunch of issues to > stuff them into an issue tracker. > > So how about an xml schema for a review and individual issues (shouldn't > be too complex) and a tool to split them insert them into a issue > tracker, plus some suitable pretty printing to make them easy to read as > a review. > > I am game to help if people think it is interesting. > > Regards, > Elwyn No objection. Whatever the boss says. _______________________________________________ Tools-discuss mailing list Tools-discuss@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/tools-discuss From tools-discuss-bounces@ietf.org Sat Oct 15 08:08:58 2005 Received: from localhost.localdomain ([127.0.0.1] helo=megatron.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1EQkqQ-0007W5-JS; Sat, 15 Oct 2005 08:08:58 -0400 Received: from odin.ietf.org ([132.151.1.176] helo=ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1EQkqO-0007VU-GU; Sat, 15 Oct 2005 08:08:56 -0400 Received: from ietf-mx.ietf.org (ietf-mx [132.151.6.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id IAA06964; Sat, 15 Oct 2005 08:08:51 -0400 (EDT) Received: from eikenes.alvestrand.no ([158.38.152.233]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1EQl1I-0002N3-Hj; Sat, 15 Oct 2005 08:20:13 -0400 Received: from localhost (eikenes.alvestrand.no [127.0.0.1]) by eikenes.alvestrand.no (Postfix) with ESMTP id D34682596BE; Sat, 15 Oct 2005 14:08:14 +0200 (CEST) Received: from eikenes.alvestrand.no ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (eikenes.alvestrand.no [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 03777-02; Sat, 15 Oct 2005 14:08:11 +0200 (CEST) Received: from [192.168.1.160] (163.80-203-220.nextgentel.com [80.203.220.163]) by eikenes.alvestrand.no (Postfix) with ESMTP id 36BF02596BD; Sat, 15 Oct 2005 14:08:11 +0200 (CEST) Date: Sat, 15 Oct 2005 14:08:58 +0200 From: Harald Tveit Alvestrand To: Elwyn Davies , tools-discuss@ietf.org, gen-art@ietf.org Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <43503A4F.60002@dial.pipex.com> References: <43503A4F.60002@dial.pipex.com> X-Mailer: Mulberry/3.1.6 (Linux/x86) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Disposition: inline X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at alvestrand.no X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Scan-Signature: ffa9dfbbe7cc58b3fa6b8ae3e57b0aa3 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Cc: Subject: [Tools-discuss] Re: [Gen-art] Structured format for reviews/issues reports X-BeenThere: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF Tools Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: tools-discuss-bounces@ietf.org Errors-To: tools-discuss-bounces@ietf.org --On l=F8rdag, oktober 15, 2005 00:07:59 +0100 Elwyn Davies=20 wrote: > Hi. > > When the gen-art team (or anyone else) is writing reviews, much of the > review is a sequence of issues. > > With the increased use of issue trackers it seems pretty stupid that > somebody has to unpick a text email to separate a bunch of issues to > stuff them into an issue tracker. > > So how about an xml schema for a review and individual issues (shouldn't > be too complex) and a tool to split them insert them into a issue > tracker, plus some suitable pretty printing to make them easy to read as > a review. > > I am game to help if people think it is interesting. I'm interested. Anything that lets me type less for the same amount of information=20 transferred... _______________________________________________ Tools-discuss mailing list Tools-discuss@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/tools-discuss From tools-discuss-bounces@ietf.org Sat Oct 15 11:54:51 2005 Received: from localhost.localdomain ([127.0.0.1] helo=megatron.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1EQoN1-0001y8-NH; Sat, 15 Oct 2005 11:54:51 -0400 Received: from odin.ietf.org ([132.151.1.176] helo=ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1EQoMz-0001xT-EJ; Sat, 15 Oct 2005 11:54:49 -0400 Received: from ietf-mx.ietf.org (ietf-mx [132.151.6.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id LAA14737; Sat, 15 Oct 2005 11:54:44 -0400 (EDT) Received: from mail.shinkuro.com ([216.194.124.237] helo=execdsl.com) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1EQoXw-0006jf-IM; Sat, 15 Oct 2005 12:06:08 -0400 Received: from [71.254.23.91] (HELO JMHLap3.stevecrocker.com) by execdsl.com (CommuniGate Pro SMTP 4.2.7) with ESMTP id 12663381; Sat, 15 Oct 2005 09:54:05 -0600 Message-Id: <6.2.1.2.0.20051015115404.02fcf810@localhost> X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 6.2.1.2 Date: Sat, 15 Oct 2005 11:54:34 -0400 To: Scott W Brim , Elwyn Davies From: "Joel M. Halpern" In-Reply-To: <20051015105206.GC4612@sbrim-wxp01> References: <43503A4F.60002@dial.pipex.com> <20051015105206.GC4612@sbrim-wxp01> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 97adf591118a232206bdb5a27b217034 Cc: gen-art@ietf.org, tools-discuss@ietf.org Subject: [Tools-discuss] Re: [Gen-art] Structured format for reviews/issues reports X-BeenThere: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF Tools Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: tools-discuss-bounces@ietf.org Errors-To: tools-discuss-bounces@ietf.org I find the issue trackers hard to work with. I don't mind putting some tags in my review if that will help. Yours, Joel At 06:52 AM 10/15/2005, Scott W Brim wrote: >On Sat, Oct 15, 2005 12:07:59AM +0100, Elwyn Davies allegedly wrote: > > Hi. > > > > When the gen-art team (or anyone else) is writing reviews, much of the > > review is a sequence of issues. > > > > With the increased use of issue trackers it seems pretty stupid that > > somebody has to unpick a text email to separate a bunch of issues to > > stuff them into an issue tracker. > > > > So how about an xml schema for a review and individual issues (shouldn't > > be too complex) and a tool to split them insert them into a issue > > tracker, plus some suitable pretty printing to make them easy to read as > > a review. > > > > I am game to help if people think it is interesting. > > > > Regards, > > Elwyn > >No objection. Whatever the boss says. > >_______________________________________________ >Gen-art mailing list >Gen-art@ietf.org >https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/gen-art _______________________________________________ Tools-discuss mailing list Tools-discuss@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/tools-discuss From tools-discuss-bounces@ietf.org Sat Oct 15 13:32:00 2005 Received: from localhost.localdomain ([127.0.0.1] helo=megatron.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1EQpt2-0007Nw-PH; Sat, 15 Oct 2005 13:32:00 -0400 Received: from odin.ietf.org ([132.151.1.176] helo=ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1EQpt0-0007NZ-HD; Sat, 15 Oct 2005 13:31:58 -0400 Received: from ietf-mx.ietf.org (ietf-mx [132.151.6.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id NAA18726; Sat, 15 Oct 2005 13:31:53 -0400 (EDT) Received: from exprod6og4.obsmtp.com ([64.18.1.124] helo=psmtp.com) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with smtp (Exim 4.43) id 1EQq3x-0000Py-7W; Sat, 15 Oct 2005 13:43:18 -0400 Received: from source ([192.150.20.142]) by exprod6ob4.obsmtp.com ([64.18.5.12]) with SMTP; Sat, 15 Oct 2005 10:31:48 PDT Received: from inner-relay-3.eur.adobe.com (inner-relay-3b [10.128.4.236]) by outbound-smtp-2.corp.adobe.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id j9FHbwXP004244; Sat, 15 Oct 2005 10:37:58 -0700 (PDT) Received: from calsj-dev (calsj-dev.corp.adobe.com [153.32.1.193]) by inner-relay-3.eur.adobe.com (8.12.10/8.12.9) with ESMTP id j9FHVjlM027279; Sat, 15 Oct 2005 10:31:46 -0700 (PDT) Received: from calsj-dev (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mailsj-v1.corp.adobe.com (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 2.02 (built Oct 21 2004)) with ESMTP id <0IOE00HEAWOVW8@mailsj-v1.corp.adobe.com>; Sat, 15 Oct 2005 10:31:44 -0700 (PDT) Received: from MasinterT43p ([10.7.240.50]) by mailsj-v1.corp.adobe.com (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 2.02 (built Oct 21 2004)) with ESMTP id <0IOE00AZ3WOVLC@mailsj-v1.corp.adobe.com>; Sat, 15 Oct 2005 10:31:43 -0700 (PDT) Date: Sat, 15 Oct 2005 10:32:01 -0700 From: Larry Masinter Subject: RE: [Tools-discuss] Re: [Gen-art] Structured format for reviews/issuesreports In-reply-to: <20051015105206.GC4612@sbrim-wxp01> To: "'Scott W Brim'" , "'Elwyn Davies'" Message-id: <000001c5d1ae$5a5a28e0$32f0070a@corp.adobe.com> MIME-version: 1.0 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.2180 X-Mailer: Microsoft Office Outlook 11 Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Thread-index: AcXRdvQBAUwGjb4wRTa/e7B2CUaTJwANopug X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Scan-Signature: e1e48a527f609d1be2bc8d8a70eb76cb Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7BIT Cc: gen-art@ietf.org, tools-discuss@ietf.org X-BeenThere: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF Tools Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: tools-discuss-bounces@ietf.org Errors-To: tools-discuss-bounces@ietf.org Personally, I think that the separation of discussion points into "issues" is one of the important ways in which the chair of a working group moderates the discussion. I don't think it is "stupid" at all. I think we definitely could use some tools for managing an issue list and posting the status of issues, commenting on issues, etc., but I wouldn't want to take the authority of deciding what is or isn't a new issue, merging issues, or managing the issue list away from the working group chair. Larry > > When the gen-art team (or anyone else) is writing reviews, > much of the review is a sequence of issues. > > > > With the increased use of issue trackers it seems pretty stupid that > > somebody has to unpick a text email to separate a bunch of issues to > > stuff them into an issue tracker. > > > > So how about an xml schema for a review and individual issues (shouldn't > > be too complex) and a tool to split them insert them into a issue > > tracker, plus some suitable pretty printing to make them easy to read as > > a review. > > > > I am game to help if people think it is interesting. > > > > Regards, > > Elwyn > > No objection. Whatever the boss says. > > _______________________________________________ > Tools-discuss mailing list > Tools-discuss@ietf.org > https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/tools-discuss _______________________________________________ Tools-discuss mailing list Tools-discuss@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/tools-discuss From tools-discuss-bounces@ietf.org Sat Oct 15 13:45:25 2005 Received: from localhost.localdomain ([127.0.0.1] helo=megatron.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1EQq61-00037M-KJ; Sat, 15 Oct 2005 13:45:25 -0400 Received: from odin.ietf.org ([132.151.1.176] helo=ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1EQq5z-00036f-Rg; Sat, 15 Oct 2005 13:45:23 -0400 Received: from ietf-mx.ietf.org (ietf-mx [132.151.6.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id NAA19329; Sat, 15 Oct 2005 13:45:16 -0400 (EDT) Received: from a.painless.aaisp.net.uk ([81.187.81.51] helo=smtp.aaisp.net.uk) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1EQqGp-0000hG-Ah; Sat, 15 Oct 2005 13:56:41 -0400 Received: from [81.187.254.247] (helo=[127.0.0.1]) by smtp.aaisp.net.uk with esmtps (TLSv1:AES256-SHA:256) (Exim 4.43) id 1EQq5W-0002cY-DT; Sat, 15 Oct 2005 18:44:54 +0100 Message-ID: <43514070.2030107@dial.pipex.com> Date: Sat, 15 Oct 2005 18:46:24 +0100 From: Elwyn Davies User-Agent: Mozilla Thunderbird 1.0.2 (Windows/20050317) X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Larry Masinter Subject: Re: [Tools-discuss] Re: [Gen-art] Structured format for reviews/issuesreports References: <000001c5d1ae$5a5a28e0$32f0070a@corp.adobe.com> In-Reply-To: <000001c5d1ae$5a5a28e0$32f0070a@corp.adobe.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 4b800b1eab964a31702fa68f1ff0e955 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Cc: gen-art@ietf.org, tools-discuss@ietf.org X-BeenThere: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF Tools Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: tools-discuss-bounces@ietf.org Errors-To: tools-discuss-bounces@ietf.org I was envisaging that the moderator of the issues list would be able to feed the xml review doc to some tool that would present the points in the review as a list which the moderator could then allocate to an existing issue (hopefully an informed reviewer might have included an issue number if it was already in play), create a new issue for the item or reject it.Maybe create an automated response as well. Regards, Elwyn Larry Masinter wrote: >Personally, I think that the separation of discussion points >into "issues" is one of the important ways in which the chair >of a working group moderates the discussion. I don't think it >is "stupid" at all. > >I think we definitely could use some tools for managing an >issue list and posting the status of issues, commenting on >issues, etc., but I wouldn't want to take the authority of >deciding what is or isn't a new issue, merging issues, or >managing the issue list away from the working >group chair. > >Larry > > > > >>>When the gen-art team (or anyone else) is writing reviews, >>> >>> >>much of the review is a sequence of issues. >> >> >>>With the increased use of issue trackers it seems pretty stupid that >>>somebody has to unpick a text email to separate a bunch of issues to >>>stuff them into an issue tracker. >>> >>>So how about an xml schema for a review and individual issues (shouldn't >>> >>> > > > >>>be too complex) and a tool to split them insert them into a issue >>>tracker, plus some suitable pretty printing to make them easy to read as >>> >>> > > > >>>a review. >>> >>>I am game to help if people think it is interesting. >>> >>>Regards, >>>Elwyn >>> >>> >>No objection. Whatever the boss says. >> >>_______________________________________________ >>Tools-discuss mailing list >>Tools-discuss@ietf.org >>https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/tools-discuss >> >> > > > _______________________________________________ Tools-discuss mailing list Tools-discuss@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/tools-discuss From tools-discuss-bounces@ietf.org Sun Oct 16 18:38:06 2005 Received: from localhost.localdomain ([127.0.0.1] helo=megatron.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1ERH8o-0006Tw-HJ; Sun, 16 Oct 2005 18:38:06 -0400 Received: from odin.ietf.org ([132.151.1.176] helo=ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1ERH8m-0006Tf-Nu for tools-discuss@megatron.ietf.org; Sun, 16 Oct 2005 18:38:04 -0400 Received: from ietf-mx.ietf.org (ietf-mx [132.151.6.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id SAA28733 for ; Sun, 16 Oct 2005 18:37:57 -0400 (EDT) Received: from av10-1-sn2.hy.skanova.net ([81.228.8.181]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1ERHJy-0008L9-Jr for tools-discuss@ietf.org; Sun, 16 Oct 2005 18:49:40 -0400 Received: by av10-1-sn2.hy.skanova.net (Postfix, from userid 502) id E0EDD37F07; Mon, 17 Oct 2005 00:37:53 +0200 (CEST) Received: from smtp4-1-sn2.hy.skanova.net (smtp4-1-sn2.hy.skanova.net [81.228.8.92]) by av10-1-sn2.hy.skanova.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id A3B6537E88 for ; Mon, 17 Oct 2005 00:37:53 +0200 (CEST) Received: from shiraz.levkowetz.com (81-224-201-50-no45.tbcn.telia.com [81.224.201.50]) by smtp4-1-sn2.hy.skanova.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8ECC737E4B for ; Mon, 17 Oct 2005 00:37:53 +0200 (CEST) Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]) by shiraz.levkowetz.com with esmtp (Exim 4.54) id 1ERH8b-0002Kh-5X for tools-discuss@ietf.org; Mon, 17 Oct 2005 00:37:53 +0200 Message-ID: <4352D640.7070702@levkowetz.com> Date: Mon, 17 Oct 2005 00:37:52 +0200 From: Henrik Levkowetz User-Agent: Mozilla Thunderbird 1.0.7 (Macintosh/20050923) X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Tools Team Discussion X-Enigmail-Version: 0.93.0.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-SA-Exim-Connect-IP: 127.0.0.1 X-SA-Exim-Mail-From: henrik@levkowetz.com X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No (on shiraz.levkowetz.com); SAEximRunCond expanded to false X-Spam-Score: 0.1 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 14582b0692e7f70ce7111d04db3781c8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: [Tools-discuss] [Fwd: Re: Last call tools] X-BeenThere: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF Tools Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: tools-discuss-bounces@ietf.org Errors-To: tools-discuss-bounces@ietf.org I just sent the following to ietf@ietf.org, but I'd better send a copy to this list too, as it's definitely on-topic. Henrik > -------- Original Message -------- > Subject: Re: Last call tools > Date: Mon, 17 Oct 2005 00:35:32 +0200 > From: Henrik Levkowetz > To: Sam Hartman > CC: Brian E Carpenter , ietf@ietf.org > References: <198A730C2044DE4A96749D13E167AD376D5113@MOU1WNEXMB04.vcorp.ad.vrsn.com> <434FC783.8040505@zurich.ibm.com> > > Hi Sam, > > I have a design for an issue tracker adapted for IETF use lying > around, but haven't had time to implement it yet. I think it may > match the requirements you place on a solution in your note below. > > The idea is based on my experience when doing issue tracking for the > IASA BCP during December and January nearly a year ago. Some days > with intensive discussions I spent as much as 5 hours doing cut and > paste from mailing list to issue tracker (RT - a good and competent > issue tracker), and became convinced that there must be a better way. > > The idea is based on our way of working, and on the premise that > almost everything needed by an issue tracker is actually already > contained in an email message. (Subject - reporter - threading > by "In-Reply-To:" header or subject - date - report details...) > > The tool could be seen as an merge of a list archive and an issue > tracker. All issues should be posted to the list, matching the way > we work today. Adding a few particular keywords (based on Bernard > Aboba's well thought-out template for reporting issues to the EAP > list; http://www.drizzle.com/~aboba/EAP/eapissues.html) to a message > could trigger the automatic creation of an issue, or a document > editor, chair or AD could use the web interface to the list archive > to mark a message or a part of a message as an issue. > > Any follow-up messages to the initial message of an issue would be > added to that particular issue unless the chain was explicitly > broken by the document editor, chair or AD. > > Similarly, going back and flagging an earlier message as an issue > to be resolved would automatically bring along all of the follow-up > messages into the list of comments on that issue. > > Most (all) of the management of the issue tracker side of the > mailing list archive could be handled simply by following up on the > threads on the mailing list, supported by recognition of certain > keywords in the subject line or start of the body (E.g., > "Text needed:", "Text proposed:", "Issue resolved:"), but management > through a web interface would also be supported. Information about > status changes done through the web interface would be sent to the > list by the tool. > > For most issue trackers, this way of working would seem pretty > roundabout, which probably explains why there isn't such a tool > available (as far as I'm aware). But for our way of working, I think > it might be just the ticket. > > Comments on this idea would be most welcome, either here or on the > tools-discuss@ietf.org list. > > > Regards, > > Henrik > > > on 2005-10-16 22:50 Sam Hartman said the following: > >> I I think that I want multiple views/interfaces to the same data. >> >> I like email for participating in a last call discussion. I get to >> use my UI; there is a well defined functional interaction protocol >> (IMAP, SMTP) for exchanging the information and for allowing me to >> thread it, reply to it, handle it offline. I have a lot invested in >> being able to deal with email well because I get a lot of email. >> >> However email is very annoying for seeing if all the issues have been >> dealt with or seeing what the current consensus summary of an issue >> is. A webpage would be great for that. >> >> But if all I had for last call comments was a webpage I'd tend not to >> make as many comments or be as active in discussions. >> >> We certainly don't want somethnig as simple as the datatracker. For >> example, discusses are entered in the datatracker. But we do a >> horrible job of tracking the actual discussion that leads of to >> resolution of discusses. >> >> I agree we should have better tools. I would be very skeptical of a >> solution that forced everyone into one interaction model. _______________________________________________ Tools-discuss mailing list Tools-discuss@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/tools-discuss From tools-discuss-bounces@ietf.org Sun Oct 16 18:44:24 2005 Received: from localhost.localdomain ([127.0.0.1] helo=megatron.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1ERHEu-0000Nb-64; Sun, 16 Oct 2005 18:44:24 -0400 Received: from odin.ietf.org ([132.151.1.176] helo=ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1ERHEs-0000N3-TY for tools-discuss@megatron.ietf.org; Sun, 16 Oct 2005 18:44:22 -0400 Received: from ietf-mx.ietf.org (ietf-mx [132.151.6.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id SAA29275 for ; Sun, 16 Oct 2005 18:44:15 -0400 (EDT) Received: from av10-2-sn2.hy.skanova.net ([81.228.8.182]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1ERHQ5-00009E-4V for tools-discuss@ietf.org; Sun, 16 Oct 2005 18:55:58 -0400 Received: by av10-2-sn2.hy.skanova.net (Postfix, from userid 502) id 5B25C37EA1; Mon, 17 Oct 2005 00:44:12 +0200 (CEST) Received: from smtp4-2-sn2.hy.skanova.net (smtp4-2-sn2.hy.skanova.net [81.228.8.93]) by av10-2-sn2.hy.skanova.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0EB1637E5B; Mon, 17 Oct 2005 00:44:12 +0200 (CEST) Received: from shiraz.levkowetz.com (81-224-201-50-no45.tbcn.telia.com [81.224.201.50]) by smtp4-2-sn2.hy.skanova.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 01D0137E42; Mon, 17 Oct 2005 00:44:11 +0200 (CEST) Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]) by shiraz.levkowetz.com with esmtp (Exim 4.54) id 1ERHEh-0002bE-7i; Mon, 17 Oct 2005 00:44:11 +0200 Message-ID: <4352D7BA.1050908@levkowetz.com> Date: Mon, 17 Oct 2005 00:44:10 +0200 From: Henrik Levkowetz User-Agent: Mozilla Thunderbird 1.0.7 (Macintosh/20050923) X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Elwyn Davies Subject: Re: [Tools-discuss] Structured format for reviews/issues reports References: <43503A4F.60002@dial.pipex.com> In-Reply-To: <43503A4F.60002@dial.pipex.com> X-Enigmail-Version: 0.93.0.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-SA-Exim-Connect-IP: 127.0.0.1 X-SA-Exim-Mail-From: henrik@levkowetz.com X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No (on shiraz.levkowetz.com); SAEximRunCond expanded to false X-Spam-Score: 0.1 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 52e1467c2184c31006318542db5614d5 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Cc: gen-art@ietf.org, tools-discuss@ietf.org X-BeenThere: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF Tools Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: tools-discuss-bounces@ietf.org Errors-To: tools-discuss-bounces@ietf.org Hi Elwyn, I find your note below interesting in view of the thoughts I've had for some time about issue tracking for the IETF (see the note I just sent to ietf@ietf.org, with a copy to tools-discuss@ietf.org). The funny thing is that I never took the step of thinking about this from an XML viewpoint. More inline: on 2005-10-15 01:07 Elwyn Davies said the following: > Hi. > > When the gen-art team (or anyone else) is writing reviews, much of the > review is a sequence of issues. > > With the increased use of issue trackers it seems pretty stupid that > somebody has to unpick a text email to separate a bunch of issues to > stuff them into an issue tracker. Yes :-) > So how about an xml schema for a review and individual issues (shouldn't > be too complex) and a tool to split them insert them into a issue > tracker, plus some suitable pretty printing to make them easy to read as > a review. Sounds like a good idea to me. > I am game to help if people think it is interesting. Ok! I see there's a few follow-up messages - would be nice if we could get something like this underway. Henrik _______________________________________________ Tools-discuss mailing list Tools-discuss@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/tools-discuss From tools-discuss-bounces@ietf.org Sun Oct 16 21:58:13 2005 Received: from localhost.localdomain ([127.0.0.1] helo=megatron.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1ERKGT-00021M-1T; Sun, 16 Oct 2005 21:58:13 -0400 Received: from odin.ietf.org ([132.151.1.176] helo=ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1ERKGS-00021G-2c for tools-discuss@megatron.ietf.org; Sun, 16 Oct 2005 21:58:12 -0400 Received: from ietf-mx.ietf.org (ietf-mx [132.151.6.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id VAA07636 for ; Sun, 16 Oct 2005 21:58:05 -0400 (EDT) Received: from eikenes.alvestrand.no ([158.38.152.233]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1ERKRg-0004Df-1D for tools-discuss@ietf.org; Sun, 16 Oct 2005 22:09:49 -0400 Received: from localhost (eikenes.alvestrand.no [127.0.0.1]) by eikenes.alvestrand.no (Postfix) with ESMTP id 77B6A258079; Mon, 17 Oct 2005 03:57:29 +0200 (CEST) Received: from eikenes.alvestrand.no ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (eikenes.alvestrand.no [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 00691-04; Mon, 17 Oct 2005 03:57:24 +0200 (CEST) Received: from [192.168.1.160] (163.80-203-220.nextgentel.com [80.203.220.163]) by eikenes.alvestrand.no (Postfix) with ESMTP id 73FDB258077; Mon, 17 Oct 2005 03:57:24 +0200 (CEST) Date: Mon, 17 Oct 2005 03:58:17 +0200 From: Harald Tveit Alvestrand To: Henrik Levkowetz , Tools Team Discussion Subject: Re: [Tools-discuss] [Fwd: Re: Last call tools] Message-ID: <5477ADA8FA9E1F42340D8524@svartdal.hjemme.alvestrand.no> In-Reply-To: <4352D640.7070702@levkowetz.com> References: <4352D640.7070702@levkowetz.com> X-Mailer: Mulberry/3.1.6 (Linux/x86) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at alvestrand.no X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 52e1467c2184c31006318542db5614d5 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Cc: X-BeenThere: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF Tools Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: tools-discuss-bounces@ietf.org Errors-To: tools-discuss-bounces@ietf.org Always wondered how you managed to do so much with that BCP issue list, Henrik - thanks again! --On mandag, oktober 17, 2005 00:37:52 +0200 Henrik Levkowetz wrote: >> The idea is based on my experience when doing issue tracking for the >> IASA BCP during December and January nearly a year ago. Some days >> with intensive discussions I spent as much as 5 hours doing cut and >> paste from mailing list to issue tracker (RT - a good and competent >> issue tracker), and became convinced that there must be a better way. >> One of my frustrations with trying to do the same in USEFOR is that about 90% of *everything* is basically chaff - "me too", distractions, tangential discussions, quotes from other people's messages.... it's important that the tool keeps track of these automatically (if possible) - but it's as important (I think) that the tool makes it trivial to read these messsages *once* and then ignore them unless needed. Thus, I'd like to have tool functions that operate on the discussion tree to say things like: - Message irrelevant. Don't show in default view. - Thread not related to issue. Don't show in default view. - Thread "from here on down" is a new issue. Create new issue, and move thread to it (keeping a pointer) - Thread "from here on down" is a different issue. Move. I'd like the normal case of "review an issue 5 months later" to be looking at the 5 *relevant* messages, and not have to read through the 20 irrelevant ones over and over again. But that's a lot to ask in a first version.... _______________________________________________ Tools-discuss mailing list Tools-discuss@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/tools-discuss From tools-discuss-bounces@ietf.org Mon Oct 17 01:26:46 2005 Received: from localhost.localdomain ([127.0.0.1] helo=megatron.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1ERNWI-0004LD-B7; Mon, 17 Oct 2005 01:26:46 -0400 Received: from odin.ietf.org ([132.151.1.176] helo=ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1ERNWG-0004L8-UN for tools-discuss@megatron.ietf.org; Mon, 17 Oct 2005 01:26:44 -0400 Received: from ietf-mx.ietf.org (ietf-mx [132.151.6.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id BAA17171 for ; Mon, 17 Oct 2005 01:26:36 -0400 (EDT) Received: from av9-2-sn3.vrr.skanova.net ([81.228.9.186]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1ERNhW-0000iH-FS for tools-discuss@ietf.org; Mon, 17 Oct 2005 01:38:24 -0400 Received: by av9-2-sn3.vrr.skanova.net (Postfix, from userid 502) id 56FE838062; Mon, 17 Oct 2005 07:26:23 +0200 (CEST) Received: from smtp3-2-sn3.vrr.skanova.net (smtp3-2-sn3.vrr.skanova.net [81.228.9.102]) by av9-2-sn3.vrr.skanova.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3C0DA3804E; Mon, 17 Oct 2005 07:26:23 +0200 (CEST) Received: from shiraz.levkowetz.com (81-224-201-50-no45.tbcn.telia.com [81.224.201.50]) by smtp3-2-sn3.vrr.skanova.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2AA9D37E42; Mon, 17 Oct 2005 07:26:23 +0200 (CEST) Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]) by shiraz.levkowetz.com with esmtp (Exim 4.54) id 1ERNVv-0000Fx-0N; Mon, 17 Oct 2005 07:26:23 +0200 Message-ID: <435335F2.7090101@levkowetz.com> Date: Mon, 17 Oct 2005 07:26:10 +0200 From: Henrik Levkowetz User-Agent: Mozilla Thunderbird 1.0.7 (Macintosh/20050923) X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Harald Tveit Alvestrand Subject: Re: [Tools-discuss] [Fwd: Re: Last call tools] References: <4352D640.7070702@levkowetz.com> <5477ADA8FA9E1F42340D8524@svartdal.hjemme.alvestrand.no> In-Reply-To: <5477ADA8FA9E1F42340D8524@svartdal.hjemme.alvestrand.no> X-Enigmail-Version: 0.93.0.0 X-SA-Exim-Connect-IP: 127.0.0.1 X-SA-Exim-Mail-From: henrik@levkowetz.com X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No (on shiraz.levkowetz.com); SAEximRunCond expanded to false X-Spam-Score: 0.1 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 6cca30437e2d04f45110f2ff8dc1b1d5 Cc: Tools Team Discussion X-BeenThere: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF Tools Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="===============1048734892==" Sender: tools-discuss-bounces@ietf.org Errors-To: tools-discuss-bounces@ietf.org This is an OpenPGP/MIME signed message (RFC 2440 and 3156) --===============1048734892== Content-Type: multipart/signed; micalg=pgp-sha1; protocol="application/pgp-signature"; boundary="------------enigF876666A50598B2B15F94CDC" This is an OpenPGP/MIME signed message (RFC 2440 and 3156) --------------enigF876666A50598B2B15F94CDC Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Hi Harald, on 2005-10-17 03:58 Harald Tveit Alvestrand said the following: > Always wondered how you managed to do so much with that BCP issue list, > Henrik - thanks again! > --On mandag, oktober 17, 2005 00:37:52 +0200 Henrik Levkowetz > wrote: > >>> The idea is based on my experience when doing issue tracking for the >>> IASA BCP during December and January nearly a year ago. Some days >>> with intensive discussions I spent as much as 5 hours doing cut and >>> paste from mailing list to issue tracker (RT - a good and competent >>> issue tracker), and became convinced that there must be a better way. >>> > > One of my frustrations with trying to do the same in USEFOR is that about > 90% of *everything* is basically chaff - "me too", distractions, tangential > discussions, quotes from other people's messages.... it's important that > the tool keeps track of these automatically (if possible) - but it's as > important (I think) that the tool makes it trivial to read these messsages > *once* and then ignore them unless needed. Good point. I'd already planned to have the quote parts of messages nearly invisible in the default view. I see that some additional functionality will be needed, though. > Thus, I'd like to have tool functions that operate on the discussion tree > to say things like: > > - Message irrelevant. Don't show in default view. Right. > - Thread not related to issue. Don't show in default view. Right. > - Thread "from here on down" is a new issue. Create new issue, and move > thread to it (keeping a pointer) Right. A variation on the next one, but with a link. > - Thread "from here on down" is a different issue. Move. Right. This one I'd already planned for. > I'd like the normal case of "review an issue 5 months later" to be looking > at the 5 *relevant* messages, and not have to read through the 20 > irrelevant ones over and over again. Well, yes. Happily, with web deployed tools, it's easy to "Release Early, Release Often" :-) Henrik --------------enigF876666A50598B2B15F94CDC Content-Type: application/pgp-signature; name="signature.asc" Content-Description: OpenPGP digital signature Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="signature.asc" -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.4.1 (GNU/Linux) iD8DBQFDUzX+eVhrtTJkXCMRAvXcAJ9H8ITdAUEBojZw6uUJbrDd7XJlVQCgg1I5 E/ooq9tpQx2cZyDP0KGT7R8= =zDzD -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --------------enigF876666A50598B2B15F94CDC-- --===============1048734892== Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline _______________________________________________ Tools-discuss mailing list Tools-discuss@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/tools-discuss --===============1048734892==-- From tools-discuss-bounces@ietf.org Mon Oct 17 09:04:54 2005 Received: from localhost.localdomain ([127.0.0.1] helo=megatron.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1ERUfe-0001ga-36; Mon, 17 Oct 2005 09:04:54 -0400 Received: from odin.ietf.org ([132.151.1.176] helo=ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1ERUfd-0001gS-Eo; Mon, 17 Oct 2005 09:04:53 -0400 Received: from ietf-mx.ietf.org (ietf-mx [132.151.6.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id JAA11109; Mon, 17 Oct 2005 09:04:46 -0400 (EDT) Received: from mtagate2.de.ibm.com ([195.212.29.151]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1ERUqw-0005Pz-W8; Mon, 17 Oct 2005 09:16:36 -0400 Received: from d12nrmr1607.megacenter.de.ibm.com (d12nrmr1607.megacenter.de.ibm.com [9.149.167.49]) by mtagate2.de.ibm.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id j9HD4gNG140426; Mon, 17 Oct 2005 13:04:42 GMT Received: from d12av02.megacenter.de.ibm.com (d12av02.megacenter.de.ibm.com [9.149.165.228]) by d12nrmr1607.megacenter.de.ibm.com (8.12.10/NCO/VERS6.7) with ESMTP id j9HD4gOK076784; Mon, 17 Oct 2005 15:04:42 +0200 Received: from d12av02.megacenter.de.ibm.com (loopback [127.0.0.1]) by d12av02.megacenter.de.ibm.com (8.12.11/8.13.3) with ESMTP id j9HD4fNf003123; Mon, 17 Oct 2005 15:04:42 +0200 Received: from sihl.zurich.ibm.com (sihl.zurich.ibm.com [9.4.16.232]) by d12av02.megacenter.de.ibm.com (8.12.11/8.12.11) with ESMTP id j9HD4fbe003111; Mon, 17 Oct 2005 15:04:41 +0200 Received: from zurich.ibm.com (sig-9-146-218-213.de.ibm.com [9.146.218.213]) by sihl.zurich.ibm.com (AIX4.3/8.9.3p2/8.9.3) with ESMTP id PAA72674; Mon, 17 Oct 2005 15:04:40 +0200 Message-ID: <4353A167.600@zurich.ibm.com> Date: Mon, 17 Oct 2005 15:04:39 +0200 From: Brian E Carpenter Organization: IBM User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.1; en-US; rv:1.6) Gecko/20040113 X-Accept-Language: en, fr, de MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Elwyn Davies Subject: Re: [Tools-discuss] Re: [Gen-art] Structured format for reviews/issuesreports References: <000001c5d1ae$5a5a28e0$32f0070a@corp.adobe.com> <43514070.2030107@dial.pipex.com> In-Reply-To: <43514070.2030107@dial.pipex.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 1a1bf7677bfe77d8af1ebe0e91045c5b Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Cc: gen-art@ietf.org, Larry Masinter , tools-discuss@ietf.org X-BeenThere: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF Tools Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: tools-discuss-bounces@ietf.org Errors-To: tools-discuss-bounces@ietf.org This makes sense to me, but it needs to fit in a context: 1. Review assignments are dispatched to reviewers, currently by hand (by Mary Barnes), but that really ought to be automated. 2. Reviews should be systematically copied to the document shepherds (the AD and usually one of the WG chairs) and the authors, and these addresses need to be automatically collected. So whatever form or format is adopted for reviews, it needs to fit into a specific workflow: Document becomes ready for review (e.g. IETF LC or IESG Evaluation) Human or tool assigns it to a reviwer. Tool sends blank review form to reviewer. Reviewer fills in form. Tool sends completed review to shepherds, ADs, authors Tool allows shepherd to marshall issues into issue tracker or something like that Brian Elwyn Davies wrote: > I was envisaging that the moderator of the issues list would be able to > feed the xml review doc to some tool that would present the points in > the review as a list which the moderator could then allocate to an > existing issue (hopefully an informed reviewer might have included an > issue number if it was already in play), create a new issue for the item > or reject it.Maybe create an automated response as well. > > Regards, > Elwyn > Larry Masinter wrote: > >> Personally, I think that the separation of discussion points >> into "issues" is one of the important ways in which the chair >> of a working group moderates the discussion. I don't think it >> is "stupid" at all. >> >> I think we definitely could use some tools for managing an >> issue list and posting the status of issues, commenting on >> issues, etc., but I wouldn't want to take the authority of >> deciding what is or isn't a new issue, merging issues, or >> managing the issue list away from the working >> group chair. >> >> Larry >> >> >> >> >>>> When the gen-art team (or anyone else) is writing reviews, >>> >>> much of the review is a sequence of issues. >>> >>> >>>> With the increased use of issue trackers it seems pretty stupid that >>>> somebody has to unpick a text email to separate a bunch of issues to >>>> stuff them into an issue tracker. >>>> >>>> So how about an xml schema for a review and individual issues >>>> (shouldn't >>>> >> >> >> >> >>>> be too complex) and a tool to split them insert them into a issue >>>> tracker, plus some suitable pretty printing to make them easy to >>>> read as >>>> >> >> >> >> >>>> a review. >>>> >>>> I am game to help if people think it is interesting. >>>> >>>> Regards, >>>> Elwyn >>>> >>> >>> No objection. Whatever the boss says. >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> Tools-discuss mailing list >>> Tools-discuss@ietf.org >>> https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/tools-discuss >>> >> >> >> >> > > _______________________________________________ > Gen-art mailing list > Gen-art@ietf.org > https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/gen-art > _______________________________________________ Tools-discuss mailing list Tools-discuss@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/tools-discuss From tools-discuss-bounces@ietf.org Wed Oct 19 05:13:10 2005 Received: from localhost.localdomain ([127.0.0.1] helo=megatron.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1ESA0U-00010c-E0; Wed, 19 Oct 2005 05:13:10 -0400 Received: from odin.ietf.org ([132.151.1.176] helo=ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1ESA0S-00010U-Qb; Wed, 19 Oct 2005 05:13:08 -0400 Received: from ietf-mx.ietf.org (ietf-mx [132.151.6.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id FAA01437; Wed, 19 Oct 2005 05:13:00 -0400 (EDT) Received: from av6-1-sn3.vrr.skanova.net ([81.228.9.179]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1ESAC9-0004XH-Pd; Wed, 19 Oct 2005 05:25:15 -0400 Received: by av6-1-sn3.vrr.skanova.net (Postfix, from userid 502) id C37E037E6F; Wed, 19 Oct 2005 11:12:53 +0200 (CEST) Received: from smtp3-2-sn3.vrr.skanova.net (smtp3-2-sn3.vrr.skanova.net [81.228.9.102]) by av6-1-sn3.vrr.skanova.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id A7D4E37E51; Wed, 19 Oct 2005 11:12:53 +0200 (CEST) Received: from shiraz.levkowetz.com (81-224-201-50-no45.tbcn.telia.com [81.224.201.50]) by smtp3-2-sn3.vrr.skanova.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9118537E45; Wed, 19 Oct 2005 11:12:53 +0200 (CEST) Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]) by shiraz.levkowetz.com with esmtp (Exim 4.54) id 1ESA0D-00030A-2j; Wed, 19 Oct 2005 11:12:53 +0200 Message-ID: <43560E14.30501@levkowetz.com> Date: Wed, 19 Oct 2005 11:12:52 +0200 From: Henrik Levkowetz User-Agent: Mozilla Thunderbird 1.0.7 (Macintosh/20050923) X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: WG Chairs , Tools Team Discussion X-Enigmail-Version: 0.93.0.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-SA-Exim-Connect-IP: 127.0.0.1 X-SA-Exim-Mail-From: henrik@levkowetz.com X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No (on shiraz.levkowetz.com); SAEximRunCond expanded to false X-Spam-Score: 0.1 (/) X-Scan-Signature: cab78e1e39c4b328567edb48482b6a69 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Cc: Subject: [Tools-discuss] WG-pages v0.60 X-BeenThere: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF Tools Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: tools-discuss-bounces@ietf.org Errors-To: tools-discuss-bounces@ietf.org Hi, This is the formal release announcement of version 0.60 of the WG pages available under http://tools.ietf.org/wg/ The changes contained in this version have been put in place gradually since IETF-63, but an announcement seems appropriate to point out the changes and improvements which are now in place. From the changelog: wg-pages (0.60) * Added WG Agendas back to IETF-59 (earlier agendas are not easily available without manual handling). * Added WG Minutes back to IETF-50. Minutes which weren't natively in HTML format, but had some HTML added later, have been stripped to text format and run through fmt. * Agendas and minutes will now be automatically updated also during coming IETFs, requiring no manual intervention. * Added a list of 'related drafts' at the bottom of the WG drafts page, based on the drafts being named with -- in the name. * Added updating of closed WGs. Closed WGs will remain available with no change of URL, but will not be listed in the WG list on the left-hand side of the status pages. * Added pages for ietf and iab, under /group/iab and /group/ietf. * Added listing of published RFCs on the draft pages, with diff against the last draft version. * Added version indication on the WG status pages, with a link to tool information. Feedback on these features, and suggestions for new ones, are always welcome. Henrik _______________________________________________ Tools-discuss mailing list Tools-discuss@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/tools-discuss From tools-discuss-bounces@ietf.org Wed Oct 19 08:52:33 2005 Received: from localhost.localdomain ([127.0.0.1] helo=megatron.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1ESDQn-0003hs-HF; Wed, 19 Oct 2005 08:52:33 -0400 Received: from odin.ietf.org ([132.151.1.176] helo=ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1ESDQl-0003hn-Jz for tools-discuss@megatron.ietf.org; Wed, 19 Oct 2005 08:52:31 -0400 Received: from ietf-mx.ietf.org (ietf-mx [132.151.6.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id IAA13919 for ; Wed, 19 Oct 2005 08:52:21 -0400 (EDT) Received: from a.painless.aaisp.net.uk ([81.187.81.51] helo=smtp.aaisp.net.uk) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1ESDcO-0002OR-T0 for tools-discuss@ietf.org; Wed, 19 Oct 2005 09:04:39 -0400 Received: from [81.187.254.247] (helo=[127.0.0.1]) by smtp.aaisp.net.uk with esmtps (TLSv1:AES256-SHA:256) (Exim 4.43) id 1ESDQN-0003lZ-5p; Wed, 19 Oct 2005 13:52:07 +0100 Message-ID: <435641D2.7050608@dial.pipex.com> Date: Wed, 19 Oct 2005 13:53:38 +0100 From: Elwyn Davies User-Agent: Mozilla Thunderbird 1.0.2 (Windows/20050317) X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Henrik Levkowetz Subject: Re: [Tools-discuss] WG-pages v0.60 References: <43560E14.30501@levkowetz.com> In-Reply-To: <43560E14.30501@levkowetz.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Scan-Signature: fb6060cb60c0cea16e3f7219e40a0a81 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Cc: Tools Team Discussion X-BeenThere: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF Tools Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: tools-discuss-bounces@ietf.org Errors-To: tools-discuss-bounces@ietf.org Looks good :-) Particularly appreciate the mailing list archive search tool. Excellent idea. Couple of minor nits: - On the individual wg pages: The '|latest ver. published' column is a fraction narrow on Firefox. - The mailing list search tool is currently displaying a line for every message searched - presumably this is debugging which will get turned off eventually. - Mailing list search tool: Is it possible to eliminate matches from the 'Previous message/Next message' lines at the bottom of each mail? Searching for text that is in a message header gets you lots of spurious matches. Regards, Elwyn Henrik Levkowetz wrote: >Hi, > >This is the formal release announcement of version 0.60 of the WG pages >available under > > http://tools.ietf.org/wg/ > >The changes contained in this version have been put in place gradually >since IETF-63, but an announcement seems appropriate to point out the >changes and improvements which are now in place. From the changelog: > > >wg-pages (0.60) > > * Added WG Agendas back to IETF-59 (earlier agendas are not easily available > without manual handling). > > * Added WG Minutes back to IETF-50. Minutes which weren't natively in > HTML format, but had some HTML added later, have been stripped to text > format and run through fmt. > > * Agendas and minutes will now be automatically updated also during coming > IETFs, requiring no manual intervention. > > * Added a list of 'related drafts' at the bottom of the WG drafts page, > based on the drafts being named with -- in the name. > > * Added updating of closed WGs. Closed WGs will remain available with no > change of URL, but will not be listed in the WG list on the left-hand > side of the status pages. > > * Added pages for ietf and iab, under /group/iab and /group/ietf. > > * Added listing of published RFCs on the draft pages, with diff against > the last draft version. > > * Added version indication on the WG status pages, with a link to tool > information. > > >Feedback on these features, and suggestions for new ones, are always >welcome. > > > Henrik > >_______________________________________________ >Tools-discuss mailing list >Tools-discuss@ietf.org >https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/tools-discuss > > _______________________________________________ Tools-discuss mailing list Tools-discuss@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/tools-discuss From tools-discuss-bounces@ietf.org Wed Oct 19 09:17:33 2005 Received: from localhost.localdomain ([127.0.0.1] helo=megatron.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1ESDoz-0006ec-AI; Wed, 19 Oct 2005 09:17:33 -0400 Received: from odin.ietf.org ([132.151.1.176] helo=ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1ESDoy-0006dI-PW for tools-discuss@megatron.ietf.org; Wed, 19 Oct 2005 09:17:32 -0400 Received: from ietf-mx.ietf.org (ietf-mx [132.151.6.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id JAA15841 for ; Wed, 19 Oct 2005 09:17:23 -0400 (EDT) Received: from av6-2-sn3.vrr.skanova.net ([81.228.9.180]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1ESE0h-0003AW-Ql for tools-discuss@ietf.org; Wed, 19 Oct 2005 09:29:41 -0400 Received: by av6-2-sn3.vrr.skanova.net (Postfix, from userid 502) id 7EE1737F25; Wed, 19 Oct 2005 15:17:17 +0200 (CEST) Received: from smtp3-2-sn3.vrr.skanova.net (smtp3-2-sn3.vrr.skanova.net [81.228.9.102]) by av6-2-sn3.vrr.skanova.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 60DA737E6D; Wed, 19 Oct 2005 15:17:17 +0200 (CEST) Received: from shiraz.levkowetz.com (81-224-201-50-no45.tbcn.telia.com [81.224.201.50]) by smtp3-2-sn3.vrr.skanova.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4FBA937E4E; Wed, 19 Oct 2005 15:17:16 +0200 (CEST) Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]) by shiraz.levkowetz.com with esmtp (Exim 4.54) id 1ESDoi-0001BR-AZ; Wed, 19 Oct 2005 15:17:16 +0200 Message-ID: <4356475C.5010206@levkowetz.com> Date: Wed, 19 Oct 2005 15:17:16 +0200 From: Henrik Levkowetz User-Agent: Mozilla Thunderbird 1.0.7 (Macintosh/20050923) X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Elwyn Davies Subject: Re: [Tools-discuss] WG-pages v0.60 References: <43560E14.30501@levkowetz.com> <435641D2.7050608@dial.pipex.com> In-Reply-To: <435641D2.7050608@dial.pipex.com> X-Enigmail-Version: 0.93.0.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-SA-Exim-Connect-IP: 127.0.0.1 X-SA-Exim-Mail-From: henrik@levkowetz.com X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No (on shiraz.levkowetz.com); SAEximRunCond expanded to false X-Spam-Score: 0.1 (/) X-Scan-Signature: c1c65599517f9ac32519d043c37c5336 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Cc: Tools Team Discussion X-BeenThere: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF Tools Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: tools-discuss-bounces@ietf.org Errors-To: tools-discuss-bounces@ietf.org Hi Elwyn, on 2005-10-19 14:53 Elwyn Davies said the following: > Looks good :-) Good :-) > Particularly appreciate the mailing list archive search tool. Excellent > idea. Ah. But it's a quickie hack, using google. I'm not sure of how well that works, yet. > Couple of minor nits: > - On the individual wg pages: The '|latest ver. published' column is a > fraction narrow on Firefox. Ok. Please check http://www1.tools.ietf.org/wg/mip4 and see if that looks better? > - The mailing list search tool is currently displaying a line for every > message searched - presumably this is debugging which will get turned > off eventually. Mmmhm?? Now I wonder what you are seeing... This shouldn't happen - could you send me a link or copy? > - Mailing list search tool: Is it possible to eliminate matches from the > 'Previous message/Next message' lines at the bottom of each mail? > Searching for text that is in a message header gets you lots of spurious > matches. Not for now... I hope to eventually have a whole new mail archiving tool in place -- there has been some requests for features which the current archives doesn't have, and I want to provide an issue tracker which pulls issue text directly from mails (as mentioned a few days ago). At that time a better integration with the mailing lists, avoiding hits on prev / next text, could fairly easily be put in place using one of the available open source search and indexing engines - maybe Lucene. Regards, Henrik _______________________________________________ Tools-discuss mailing list Tools-discuss@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/tools-discuss From tools-discuss-bounces@ietf.org Wed Oct 19 10:57:40 2005 Received: from localhost.localdomain ([127.0.0.1] helo=megatron.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1ESFNs-0007JY-Ht; Wed, 19 Oct 2005 10:57:40 -0400 Received: from odin.ietf.org ([132.151.1.176] helo=ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1ESFNq-0007HT-Py for tools-discuss@megatron.ietf.org; Wed, 19 Oct 2005 10:57:38 -0400 Received: from ietf-mx.ietf.org (ietf-mx [132.151.6.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id KAA21713 for ; Wed, 19 Oct 2005 10:57:29 -0400 (EDT) Received: from b.painless.aaisp.net.uk ([81.187.81.52] helo=smtp.aaisp.net.uk) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1ESFZV-0005yW-2Y for tools-discuss@ietf.org; Wed, 19 Oct 2005 11:09:47 -0400 Received: from [81.187.254.247] (helo=[127.0.0.1]) by smtp.aaisp.net.uk with esmtps (TLSv1:AES256-SHA:256) (Exim 4.43) id 1ESFNV-0006Vp-4u; Wed, 19 Oct 2005 15:57:17 +0100 Message-ID: <43565F27.4020308@dial.pipex.com> Date: Wed, 19 Oct 2005 15:58:47 +0100 From: Elwyn Davies User-Agent: Mozilla Thunderbird 1.0.2 (Windows/20050317) X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Henrik Levkowetz Subject: Re: [Tools-discuss] WG-pages v0.60 References: <43560E14.30501@levkowetz.com> <435641D2.7050608@dial.pipex.com> <4356475C.5010206@levkowetz.com> In-Reply-To: <4356475C.5010206@levkowetz.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 21bf7a2f1643ae0bf20c1e010766eb78 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Cc: Tools Team Discussion X-BeenThere: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF Tools Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: tools-discuss-bounces@ietf.org Errors-To: tools-discuss-bounces@ietf.org Hi Henrik. Henrik Levkowetz wrote: >Hi Elwyn, > >on 2005-10-19 14:53 Elwyn Davies said the following: > > >>Looks good :-) >> >> > >Good :-) > > > >>Particularly appreciate the mailing list archive search tool. Excellent >>idea. >> >> > >Ah. But it's a quickie hack, using google. I'm not sure of how well that >works, yet. > > > >>Couple of minor nits: >>- On the individual wg pages: The '|latest ver. published' column is a >>fraction narrow on Firefox. >> >> > >Ok. Please check http://www1.tools.ietf.org/wg/mip4 and see if that looks >better? > > No significant difference.. It is the width of the header.. there is very little padding between Latest ver and Dated.. its only a tiny niggle. > > >>- The mailing list search tool is currently displaying a line for every >>message searched - presumably this is debugging which will get turned >>off eventually. >> >> > >Mmmhm?? Now I wonder what you are seeing... This shouldn't happen - could >you send me a link or copy? > > Try the v6ops mail search page http://ops.ietf.org/lists/v6ops/ and enter 'natpt-to'... Output starts... Setting Term to natpt-to Setting Prefix to lists/v6ops Setting Base path to v6ops.2002 ListBases-0 v6ops.2002 Setting listbase to v6ops.2002 Setting Base path to v6ops.2003 ListBases-1 v6ops.2002 v6ops.2003 Setting listbase to v6ops.2003 Setting Base path to v6ops.2004 ListBases-2 v6ops.2002 v6ops.2003 v6ops.2004 Setting listbase to v6ops.2004 Setting Base path to v6ops.2005 ListBases-3 v6ops.2002 v6ops.2003 v6ops.2004 v6ops.2005 Setting listbase to v6ops.2005 Setting BasePath to /usr/home/mhonarc/v6ops/ Setting Owner to randy@psg.com Setting OwnerName to randy@psg.com Setting ListAddress to http://ops.ietf.org/lists/v6ops Setting ListDescription to v6ops Setting TitleAlignment to right Setting HomePage to http://ops.ietf.org/index.html v6ops Search Results Searching v6ops.2002 Looking in file msg00095.html Looking in file msg00000.html Looking in file msg00001.html Looking in file msg00002.html Looking in file msg00003.html Looking in file msg00004.html <> Looking in file msg00639.html Looking in file msg00640.html Looking in file msg00641.html We found 55 posts matching /natpt-to/.Re: WG Last Call: draft-ietf-v6ops-natpt-to-exprmntl-00.txt * 13 mentions in the text, by fred@cisco.com Re: WG Last Call: draft-ietf-v6ops-natpt-to-exprmntl-00.txt Subject: Re: WG Last Call: draft-ietf-v6ops-natpt-to-exprmntl-00.txt ... etc Also: The next line is 'Iim-sig:...' and is a VERY long line! Iim-sig: v:"1.1"; h:"imail.cisco.com"; d:"cisco.com"; z:"home"; m:"krs"; t:"1115689210.552363"; x:"432200"; a:"rsa-sha1"; b:"nofws:377"; e:"Iw=="; n:"sQYarK2E51MdcTiUqeif3F7cWdxIfoCiXhdfb9vD5ee/j0jXL15gbFxF2p" "XIweAblu0N6XAgK7k+wrbr7bQDJaCDqOmzqpRUBjIRQAXQ7NzadpmR3pUL6wxaRUtW+c43sl9jC" "50Qg1sXHpPjt8Y+Y16ioyQAQAdSunM4YhevURc="; s:"jejZBjQoBHQ67sXOagpmSqL7pABagvCr8GAEN5xImQXhhD3uqf+QyEH0lXPD0dXhDoRxCZl5" "3beeS6OOAlwR5xS8vNGqmxvtDfW3Yk2BxusVTbVMfKN8tEy6SIzcUiwLECVAcp8lWfQVX8fURUS" "bCbvZ9aD00rv6gOE1xxnzfwA="; c:"From: Fred Baker "; c:"Subject: Re: WG Last Call: draft-ietf-v6ops-natpt-to-exprmntl-00.txt"; c:"Date: Mon, 9 May 2005 18:50:17 -0700" Finally 55 messages > > >>- Mailing list search tool: Is it possible to eliminate matches from the >>'Previous message/Next message' lines at the bottom of each mail? >>Searching for text that is in a message header gets you lots of spurious >>matches. >> >> > >Not for now... > > No matter: It is worthwhile even with a small amount of noise. >I hope to eventually have a whole new mail archiving tool in place -- >there has been some requests for features which the current archives >doesn't have, and I want to provide an issue tracker which pulls issue >text directly from mails (as mentioned a few days ago). > > Yes.. when the draft deadline has finished I'll put some effort into thinking about user reqs for this. Regards, Elwyn >At that time a better integration with the mailing lists, avoiding hits >on prev / next text, could fairly easily be put in place using one of >the available open source search and indexing engines - maybe Lucene. > > >Regards, > > Henrik > >_______________________________________________ >Tools-discuss mailing list >Tools-discuss@ietf.org >https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/tools-discuss > > _______________________________________________ Tools-discuss mailing list Tools-discuss@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/tools-discuss From tools-discuss-bounces@ietf.org Wed Oct 19 13:09:43 2005 Received: from localhost.localdomain ([127.0.0.1] helo=megatron.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1ESHRf-0005iF-IA; Wed, 19 Oct 2005 13:09:43 -0400 Received: from odin.ietf.org ([132.151.1.176] helo=ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1ESHRd-0005ft-PJ for tools-discuss@megatron.ietf.org; Wed, 19 Oct 2005 13:09:42 -0400 Received: from ietf-mx.ietf.org (ietf-mx [132.151.6.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id NAA29173 for ; Wed, 19 Oct 2005 13:09:32 -0400 (EDT) Received: from av6-1-sn3.vrr.skanova.net ([81.228.9.179]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1ESHdO-0001S5-Fu for tools-discuss@ietf.org; Wed, 19 Oct 2005 13:21:51 -0400 Received: by av6-1-sn3.vrr.skanova.net (Postfix, from userid 502) id 1CDF337ED1; Wed, 19 Oct 2005 19:09:31 +0200 (CEST) Received: from smtp3-1-sn3.vrr.skanova.net (smtp3-1-sn3.vrr.skanova.net [81.228.9.101]) by av6-1-sn3.vrr.skanova.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 026B237E48; Wed, 19 Oct 2005 19:09:31 +0200 (CEST) Received: from shiraz.levkowetz.com (81-224-201-50-no45.tbcn.telia.com [81.224.201.50]) by smtp3-1-sn3.vrr.skanova.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id E3A4537E47; Wed, 19 Oct 2005 19:09:30 +0200 (CEST) Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]) by shiraz.levkowetz.com with esmtp (Exim 4.54) id 1ESHRS-0006xn-AL; Wed, 19 Oct 2005 19:09:30 +0200 Message-ID: <43567DCA.1030104@levkowetz.com> Date: Wed, 19 Oct 2005 19:09:30 +0200 From: Henrik Levkowetz User-Agent: Mozilla Thunderbird 1.0.7 (Macintosh/20050923) X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Elwyn Davies Subject: Re: [Tools-discuss] WG-pages v0.60 References: <43560E14.30501@levkowetz.com> <435641D2.7050608@dial.pipex.com> <4356475C.5010206@levkowetz.com> <43565F27.4020308@dial.pipex.com> In-Reply-To: <43565F27.4020308@dial.pipex.com> X-Enigmail-Version: 0.93.0.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-SA-Exim-Connect-IP: 127.0.0.1 X-SA-Exim-Mail-From: henrik@levkowetz.com X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No (on shiraz.levkowetz.com); SAEximRunCond expanded to false X-Spam-Score: 0.1 (/) X-Scan-Signature: fb6060cb60c0cea16e3f7219e40a0a81 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Cc: Tools Team Discussion X-BeenThere: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF Tools Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: tools-discuss-bounces@ietf.org Errors-To: tools-discuss-bounces@ietf.org Hi Elwyn, on 2005-10-19 16:58 Elwyn Davies said the following: [...] >>Ok. Please check http://www1.tools.ietf.org/wg/mip4 and see if that looks >>better? >> >> > No significant difference.. It is the width of the header.. there is > very little padding between Latest ver and Dated.. its only a tiny niggle. Oh, I see. I fixed the spacing for the version numbers, but only added 2 pixels between the headers. I've changed the header wording to provide more space without making the column wider. Better now on http://www1.tools.ietf.org/wg/mip4 ? >> >> >>>- The mailing list search tool is currently displaying a line for every >>>message searched - presumably this is debugging which will get turned >>>off eventually. >>> >>> >> >>Mmmhm?? Now I wonder what you are seeing... This shouldn't happen - could >>you send me a link or copy? >> >> > > Try the v6ops mail search page http://ops.ietf.org/lists/v6ops/ and > enter 'natpt-to'... > Output starts... .. and so on... Right, now I understand. I can take neither credit nor blame for this; this is something provided by the ops people - I see randy's name at the bottom. I thought you were talking of the search field and button on the top of e.g. http://tools.ietf.org/wg/v6ops - maybe you'd like to try that and see what you think. I tried "natpt-to" and got about 37 relevant hits. >>>- Mailing list search tool: Is it possible to eliminate matches from the >>>'Previous message/Next message' lines at the bottom of each mail? >>>Searching for text that is in a message header gets you lots of spurious >>>matches. >>> >>> >> >>Not for now... >> >> > No matter: It is worthwhile even with a small amount of noise. Ok - but see what you think of the results from the search box I mention above. >>I hope to eventually have a whole new mail archiving tool in place -- >>there has been some requests for features which the current archives >>doesn't have, and I want to provide an issue tracker which pulls issue >>text directly from mails (as mentioned a few days ago). >> >> > Yes.. when the draft deadline has finished I'll put some effort into > thinking about user reqs for this. Oh, goody :-) That would be nice! Best, Henrik _______________________________________________ Tools-discuss mailing list Tools-discuss@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/tools-discuss From tools-discuss-bounces@ietf.org Thu Oct 20 11:22:33 2005 Received: from localhost.localdomain ([127.0.0.1] helo=megatron.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1EScFV-0004gP-DD; Thu, 20 Oct 2005 11:22:33 -0400 Received: from odin.ietf.org ([132.151.1.176] helo=ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1ESG4P-0000eD-GU for tools-discuss@megatron.ietf.org; Wed, 19 Oct 2005 11:41:37 -0400 Received: from ietf-mx.ietf.org (ietf-mx [132.151.6.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id LAA23739 for ; Wed, 19 Oct 2005 11:41:28 -0400 (EDT) Received: from tiere.net.avaya.com ([198.152.12.100]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1ESGG9-00078D-Hq for tools-discuss@ietf.org; Wed, 19 Oct 2005 11:53:46 -0400 Received: from tiere.net.avaya.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by tiere.net.avaya.com (Switch-3.1.2/Switch-3.1.0) with ESMTP id j9JFcmgg000485 for ; Wed, 19 Oct 2005 11:38:48 -0400 (EDT) Received: from ON0010AVEXU1.global.avaya.com (h135-20-128-12.avaya.com [135.20.128.12]) by tiere.net.avaya.com (Switch-3.1.2/Switch-3.1.0) with ESMTP id j9JFclgg000479 for ; Wed, 19 Oct 2005 11:38:48 -0400 (EDT) content-class: urn:content-classes:message MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft Exchange V6.0.6603.0 Date: Wed, 19 Oct 2005 11:41:33 -0400 Message-ID: Thread-Topic: Agenda page for techspec BOF appears to be blank Thread-Index: AcXUw/EOuWU94e54TD6vpu/ULoysEg== From: "Matthews, Philip \(Philip\)" To: X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 7bac9cb154eb5790ae3b2913587a40de Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Mailman-Approved-At: Thu, 20 Oct 2005 11:22:32 -0400 Subject: [Tools-discuss] Agenda page for techspec BOF appears to be blank X-BeenThere: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF Tools Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: tools-discuss-bounces@ietf.org Errors-To: tools-discuss-bounces@ietf.org [Sorry about spamming this list, but I couldn't find another address listed on the Tools page to report problems to.] The agenda webpage for the techspec BOF in Vancouver appears to be blank. http://tools.ietf.org/agenda/64/techspec.html - Philip _______________________________________________ Tools-discuss mailing list Tools-discuss@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/tools-discuss From tools-discuss-bounces@ietf.org Thu Oct 20 11:37:46 2005 Received: from localhost.localdomain ([127.0.0.1] helo=megatron.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1EScUE-0004CF-S2; Thu, 20 Oct 2005 11:37:46 -0400 Received: from odin.ietf.org ([132.151.1.176] helo=ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1EScUC-0004CA-Lk for tools-discuss@megatron.ietf.org; Thu, 20 Oct 2005 11:37:44 -0400 Received: from ietf-mx.ietf.org (ietf-mx [132.151.6.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id LAA24062 for ; Thu, 20 Oct 2005 11:37:35 -0400 (EDT) Received: from av6-2-sn3.vrr.skanova.net ([81.228.9.180]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1EScg9-00068p-MQ for tools-discuss@ietf.org; Thu, 20 Oct 2005 11:50:07 -0400 Received: by av6-2-sn3.vrr.skanova.net (Postfix, from userid 502) id 142283810B; Thu, 20 Oct 2005 17:37:23 +0200 (CEST) Received: from smtp3-1-sn3.vrr.skanova.net (smtp3-1-sn3.vrr.skanova.net [81.228.9.101]) by av6-2-sn3.vrr.skanova.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id ECC3137E93; Thu, 20 Oct 2005 17:37:22 +0200 (CEST) Received: from shiraz.levkowetz.com (81-224-201-50-no45.tbcn.telia.com [81.224.201.50]) by smtp3-1-sn3.vrr.skanova.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id D693037E49; Thu, 20 Oct 2005 17:37:22 +0200 (CEST) Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]) by shiraz.levkowetz.com with esmtp (Exim 4.54) id 1EScTp-0004O0-Lw; Thu, 20 Oct 2005 17:37:21 +0200 Message-ID: <4357B9B1.3080709@levkowetz.com> Date: Thu, 20 Oct 2005 17:37:21 +0200 From: Henrik Levkowetz User-Agent: Mozilla Thunderbird 1.0.7 (Macintosh/20050923) X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: "Matthews, Philip (Philip)" Subject: Re: [Tools-discuss] Agenda page for techspec BOF appears to be blank References: In-Reply-To: X-Enigmail-Version: 0.93.0.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-SA-Exim-Connect-IP: 127.0.0.1 X-SA-Exim-Mail-From: henrik@levkowetz.com X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No (on shiraz.levkowetz.com); SAEximRunCond expanded to false X-Spam-Score: 0.1 (/) X-Scan-Signature: d6b246023072368de71562c0ab503126 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Cc: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-BeenThere: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF Tools Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: tools-discuss-bounces@ietf.org Errors-To: tools-discuss-bounces@ietf.org Hi Philip, Thanks. Fixed now. I'm investigating what caused it. Thanks for reporting :-) Henrik on 2005-10-19 17:41 Matthews, Philip (Philip) said the following: > [Sorry about spamming this list, but I couldn't find > another address listed on the Tools page to report > problems to.] > > The agenda webpage for the techspec BOF in Vancouver > appears to be blank. > > http://tools.ietf.org/agenda/64/techspec.html _______________________________________________ Tools-discuss mailing list Tools-discuss@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/tools-discuss From tools-discuss-bounces@ietf.org Fri Oct 21 15:36:33 2005 Received: from localhost.localdomain ([127.0.0.1] helo=megatron.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1ET2gr-0005Dc-LY; Fri, 21 Oct 2005 15:36:33 -0400 Received: from odin.ietf.org ([132.151.1.176] helo=ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1ET2gq-0005DU-Bv; Fri, 21 Oct 2005 15:36:32 -0400 Received: from ietf-mx.ietf.org (ietf-mx [132.151.6.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id PAA28748; Fri, 21 Oct 2005 15:36:21 -0400 (EDT) Received: from figas.ekabal.com ([204.61.215.10]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1ET2t2-0003jy-NV; Fri, 21 Oct 2005 15:49:09 -0400 Received: from [131.161.248.88] (open-131-161-248-88.cliq.com [131.161.248.88]) (authenticated) by figas.ekabal.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id j9LJaGW21633; Fri, 21 Oct 2005 12:36:16 -0700 Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v623) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Message-Id: <83a5d576f1f8de5d9abc7856575186f8@ekabal.com> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: Rohan Mahy Date: Fri, 21 Oct 2005 12:36:11 -0700 To: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.623) X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 92df29fa99cf13e554b84c8374345c17 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Cc: Rohan Mahy , proto-team@ietf.org Subject: [Tools-discuss] suggestion for a WG chairs "gripe" tool X-BeenThere: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF Tools Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: tools-discuss-bounces@ietf.org Errors-To: tools-discuss-bounces@ietf.org Hi, As a working group chair of two busy working groups, I would really like to automate some of the periodic polling I do. To this end, I would love a utility (I'll call it id-gripe for now) that periodically reminds the chairs, authors, and reviewers that the process is waiting on him/her/them. Internally the SIP and SIPPING working groups have a list of WG internet drafts with current status and a "token" field to keep track of "who has the token" on a particular draft. The problem with our current system is that the chairs have to manually update the token when we get email from authors or ADs and when drafts are udpated. I would love to be able to set this in WG tools pages and have a "gripe" checkbox. When checked, the tool would send email to the person (authors, chairs, or AD usually) with the token reminding them what needs to be done to progress to the next stage. This would be linked to the status kept by the draft tracker. Here is a sample flow: 1. WG draft needs to close a few more open issues before WGLC. Chair checks gripe box and fills in the issues the author needs to fix. Gripe sends mail to the authors cc:ing chairs periodically until new ID submitted or grip unchecked 2. Author revises draft. Gripe sends mail to chairs with the original gripe and sets the token to the chairs. Chair checks that issues were addressed and starts WGLC. Sets token to WGLC and sets end date. 3. At end of WGLC, gripe sends mail to chairs. Chair realizes that the draft needs assigned review. assigns reviewers and sets token to Reviewers. Gripe reminds reviewers and chairs. 4. After reviewers send their comments (or chairs remove them), gripe sets the token back to the authors. 5. Author submits a new rev. Gripe sets token to the chairs. Chair verifies that edits incorporated changes. Chair sends publication request to AD and sets token to AD. Alternatively maybe the chair requests publication from the tool :-) so that we're sure the PROTO eval is filled in, etc. 6. AD sets doc status in tracker to AD Eval. Existing tracker gripes at AD. 7. AD changes tracker to *:Revised ID Needed. gripe sets token to the authors and gripes (cc:ing chairs) 8. Author submits new rev. grip sets token back to AD. 9. AD puts draft on the IESG agenda. 10. Comments and Discusses get griped to the authors and chairs automatically (*concept!*). token goes to chairs or authors. 11. Chairs submits proposed small RFC Editors Notes (from the web) to address IESG comments. gripe reminds the discussing ADs that there is a proposed fix. (Similar process if a new revised ID was needed, but the chairs/authors would need to point out where in the new ID the fixes are. 12. Last AD clears their DISCUSS. Draft is approved. Yeah! Announcement from PROTO gets sent automagically. Hope this gives a flavor of what I am looking for. thanks, -rohan _______________________________________________ Tools-discuss mailing list Tools-discuss@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/tools-discuss From tools-discuss-bounces@ietf.org Sat Oct 22 02:39:46 2005 Received: from localhost.localdomain ([127.0.0.1] helo=megatron.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1ETD2f-00048e-An; Sat, 22 Oct 2005 02:39:45 -0400 Received: from odin.ietf.org ([132.151.1.176] helo=ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1ETD2d-00045R-3r; Sat, 22 Oct 2005 02:39:43 -0400 Received: from ietf-mx.ietf.org (ietf-mx [132.151.6.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id CAA22158; Sat, 22 Oct 2005 02:39:32 -0400 (EDT) Received: from mtagate4.de.ibm.com ([195.212.29.153]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1ETDEs-0002GY-Aq; Sat, 22 Oct 2005 02:52:25 -0400 Received: from d12nrmr1607.megacenter.de.ibm.com (d12nrmr1607.megacenter.de.ibm.com [9.149.167.49]) by mtagate4.de.ibm.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id j9M6dQZB131472; Sat, 22 Oct 2005 06:39:26 GMT Received: from d12av02.megacenter.de.ibm.com (d12av02.megacenter.de.ibm.com [9.149.165.228]) by d12nrmr1607.megacenter.de.ibm.com (8.12.10/NCO/VERS6.7) with ESMTP id j9M6dQkT199292; Sat, 22 Oct 2005 08:39:26 +0200 Received: from d12av02.megacenter.de.ibm.com (loopback [127.0.0.1]) by d12av02.megacenter.de.ibm.com (8.12.11/8.13.3) with ESMTP id j9M6dPeu027877; Sat, 22 Oct 2005 08:39:26 +0200 Received: from sihl.zurich.ibm.com (sihl.zurich.ibm.com [9.4.16.232]) by d12av02.megacenter.de.ibm.com (8.12.11/8.12.11) with ESMTP id j9M6dP09027872; Sat, 22 Oct 2005 08:39:25 +0200 Received: from zurich.ibm.com (sig-9-145-129-62.de.ibm.com [9.145.129.62]) by sihl.zurich.ibm.com (AIX4.3/8.9.3p2/8.9.3) with ESMTP id IAA71862; Sat, 22 Oct 2005 08:39:23 +0200 Message-ID: <4359DE97.2050807@zurich.ibm.com> Date: Sat, 22 Oct 2005 08:39:19 +0200 From: Brian E Carpenter Organization: IBM User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.1; en-US; rv:1.6) Gecko/20040113 X-Accept-Language: en, fr, de MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Rohan Mahy Subject: Re: [Tools-discuss] suggestion for a WG chairs "gripe" tool References: <83a5d576f1f8de5d9abc7856575186f8@ekabal.com> In-Reply-To: <83a5d576f1f8de5d9abc7856575186f8@ekabal.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Scan-Signature: cf3becbbd6d1a45acbe2ffd4ab88bdc2 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Cc: tools-discuss@ietf.org, proto-team@ietf.org X-BeenThere: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF Tools Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: tools-discuss-bounces@ietf.org Errors-To: tools-discuss-bounces@ietf.org Two comments 1. This is really what I would like the tracker extensions for WG Chair access to provide, in general terms. But experience shows that automated messages have to be used with care -too many of them and busy people start ignoring them. 2. Very specifically > 12. Last AD clears their DISCUSS. Draft is approved. Yeah! > Announcement from PROTO gets sent automagically. Experience does show that the instruction to the Secretariat to publish the approval announcement and trigger the RFC Editor needs to be checked manually by the AD. That's to be 150% sure that the writeup is complete and correct. So I don't think this final step can be completely automagic. Brian Rohan Mahy wrote: > Hi, > > As a working group chair of two busy working groups, I would really > like to automate some of the periodic polling I do. To this end, I > would love a utility (I'll call it id-gripe for now) that periodically > reminds the chairs, authors, and reviewers that the process is waiting on > him/her/them. > > Internally the SIP and SIPPING working groups have a list of WG > internet drafts with current status and a "token" field to keep track > of "who has the token" on a particular draft. The problem with our > current system is that the chairs have to manually update the token > when we get email from authors or ADs and when drafts are udpated. I > would love to be able to set this in WG tools pages and have a "gripe" > checkbox. When checked, the tool would send email to the person > (authors, chairs, or AD usually) with the token reminding them what > needs to be done to progress to the next stage. This would be linked > to the status kept by the draft tracker. Here is a sample flow: > > 1. WG draft needs to close a few more open issues before WGLC. > Chair checks gripe box and fills in the issues the author needs to fix. > Gripe sends mail to the authors cc:ing chairs periodically until new ID > submitted or grip unchecked > > 2. Author revises draft. Gripe sends mail to chairs with the original > gripe and sets the token to the chairs. > Chair checks that issues were addressed and starts WGLC. Sets token to > WGLC and sets end date. > > 3. At end of WGLC, gripe sends mail to chairs. > Chair realizes that the draft needs assigned review. assigns reviewers > and sets token to Reviewers. > Gripe reminds reviewers and chairs. > > 4. After reviewers send their comments (or chairs remove them), gripe > sets the token back to the authors. > > 5. Author submits a new rev. > Gripe sets token to the chairs. Chair verifies that edits incorporated > changes. Chair sends publication request to AD and sets token to AD. > Alternatively maybe the chair requests publication from the tool :-) > so that we're sure the PROTO eval is filled in, etc. > > 6. AD sets doc status in tracker to AD Eval. Existing tracker gripes > at AD. > > 7. AD changes tracker to *:Revised ID Needed. gripe sets token to the > authors and gripes (cc:ing chairs) > > 8. Author submits new rev. grip sets token back to AD. > > 9. AD puts draft on the IESG agenda. > > 10. Comments and Discusses get griped to the authors and chairs > automatically (*concept!*). token goes to chairs or authors. > > 11. Chairs submits proposed small RFC Editors Notes (from the web) to > address IESG comments. gripe reminds the discussing ADs that there is > a proposed fix. (Similar process if a new revised ID was needed, but > the chairs/authors would need to point out where in the new ID the > fixes are. > > 12. Last AD clears their DISCUSS. Draft is approved. Yeah! > Announcement from PROTO gets sent automagically. > > Hope this gives a flavor of what I am looking for. > > thanks, > -rohan > > > _______________________________________________ > Tools-discuss mailing list > Tools-discuss@ietf.org > https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/tools-discuss > _______________________________________________ Tools-discuss mailing list Tools-discuss@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/tools-discuss From tools-discuss-bounces@ietf.org Sat Oct 22 10:52:37 2005 Received: from localhost.localdomain ([127.0.0.1] helo=megatron.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1ETKjd-0005SH-B5; Sat, 22 Oct 2005 10:52:37 -0400 Received: from odin.ietf.org ([132.151.1.176] helo=ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1ETKja-0005S6-IP; Sat, 22 Oct 2005 10:52:34 -0400 Received: from ietf-mx.ietf.org (ietf-mx [132.151.6.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id KAA14950; Sat, 22 Oct 2005 10:52:23 -0400 (EDT) Received: from purgatory.unfix.org ([213.136.24.43] ident=postfix) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1ETKvw-0001nX-D2; Sat, 22 Oct 2005 11:05:21 -0400 Received: from firenze.zurich.ibm.com (pat.zurich.ibm.com [195.176.20.45]) (using SSLv3 with cipher RC4-MD5 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by purgatory.unfix.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id E91CE7F54; Sat, 22 Oct 2005 16:52:16 +0200 (CEST) Subject: Re: [Tools-discuss] suggestion for a WG chairs "gripe" tool From: Jeroen Massar To: Rohan Mahy In-Reply-To: <83a5d576f1f8de5d9abc7856575186f8@ekabal.com> References: <83a5d576f1f8de5d9abc7856575186f8@ekabal.com> Organization: Unfix Date: Sat, 22 Oct 2005 16:52:12 +0200 Message-Id: <1129992733.13168.41.camel@firenze.zurich.ibm.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Evolution 2.2.3 X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Scan-Signature: cab78e1e39c4b328567edb48482b6a69 Cc: tools-discuss@ietf.org, proto-team@ietf.org X-BeenThere: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF Tools Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="===============0801463168==" Sender: tools-discuss-bounces@ietf.org Errors-To: tools-discuss-bounces@ietf.org --===============0801463168== Content-Type: multipart/signed; micalg=pgp-sha1; protocol="application/pgp-signature"; boundary="=-sINhu5ACywWyrIpKbj/x" --=-sINhu5ACywWyrIpKbj/x Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable On Fri, 2005-10-21 at 12:36 -0700, Rohan Mahy wrote: > I would love to be able to set this in WG tools pages and have a "gripe" > checkbox. When checked, the tool would send email to the person > (authors, chairs, or AD usually) with the token reminding them what > needs to be done to progress to the next stage. This would be linked > to the status kept by the draft tracker. Here is a sample flow: As per: http://www1.tools.ietf.org/wiki/ToolPriorityList there is item 6 on the list "notification", this will use events coming from the secretariat or other places to notify interrested parties of these events. This tool is currently being prototyped and hopefully Henrik will demo of a beta at the upcoming Vancouver meeting. There is some work to be done for it, but it is progressing quite well. This will thus do already most of what you requested in your detailed message. The tool at your end can then for example be fed with the events coming in from jabber/email and then in a various number of formats. Greets, Jeroen --=-sINhu5ACywWyrIpKbj/x Content-Type: application/pgp-signature; name=signature.asc Content-Description: This is a digitally signed message part -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.4.2 (GNU/Linux) Comment: Jeroen Massar / http://unfix.org/~jeroen/ iD8DBQBDWlIcKaooUjM+fCMRAufMAKCZqLH4slcjNzffhmlycKSCYYFWYACfUx6A 4OYYvJcPu7Q2QBDRnLlCh3c= =9LNI -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --=-sINhu5ACywWyrIpKbj/x-- --===============0801463168== Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline _______________________________________________ Tools-discuss mailing list Tools-discuss@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/tools-discuss --===============0801463168==-- From tools-discuss-bounces@ietf.org Wed Oct 26 23:00:43 2005 Received: from localhost.localdomain ([127.0.0.1] helo=megatron.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1EUy0R-0005Or-9B; Wed, 26 Oct 2005 23:00:43 -0400 Received: from odin.ietf.org ([132.151.1.176] helo=ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1EUy0O-0005OI-Ki; Wed, 26 Oct 2005 23:00:40 -0400 Received: from ietf-mx.ietf.org (ietf-mx [132.151.6.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id XAA17612; Wed, 26 Oct 2005 23:00:24 -0400 (EDT) Message-Id: <200510270300.XAA17612@ietf.org> Received: from psg.com ([147.28.0.62] ident=mailnull) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1EUyDf-0004LJ-Ci; Wed, 26 Oct 2005 23:14:24 -0400 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1] helo=psg.com) by psg.com with esmtp (Exim 4.52 (FreeBSD)) id 1EUy0L-0007NR-SS; Thu, 27 Oct 2005 03:00:37 +0000 To: Henrik Levkowetz Date: Wed, 26 Oct 2005 20:00:37 -0700 From: Allison Mankin X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 41c17b4b16d1eedaa8395c26e9a251c4 Cc: WG Chairs , Tools Team Discussion Subject: [Tools-discuss] Re: WG-pages v0.60 X-BeenThere: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF Tools Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: tools-discuss-bounces@ietf.org Errors-To: tools-discuss-bounces@ietf.org Henrik, Thanks to the Tools Team and you. I want to commend this release, and add a note to its to its features. You list adding the published RFCs to each working group page, but you didn't mention something really neat. Fetch the html-ized RFC and one finds that it contains a link to its errata! This is such a good idea, since of course the real worry is that errata won't be consulted by the RFC readers. I just stumbled on this in RFC 4114 through the ENUM WG page - tools.ietf.org/wg/enum Perhaps as the site plans evolve, we'll see an area with the wg RFCs all together in this form, to complement this. Allison > > Hi, > > This is the formal release announcement of version 0.60 of the WG pages > available under > > http://tools.ietf.org/wg/ > > The changes contained in this version have been put in place gradually > since IETF-63, but an announcement seems appropriate to point out the > changes and improvements which are now in place. From the changelog: > > > wg-pages (0.60) > > * Added WG Agendas back to IETF-59 (earlier agendas are not easily available > without manual handling). > > * Added WG Minutes back to IETF-50. Minutes which weren't natively in > HTML format, but had some HTML added later, have been stripped to text > format and run through fmt. > > * Agendas and minutes will now be automatically updated also during coming > IETFs, requiring no manual intervention. > > * Added a list of 'related drafts' at the bottom of the WG drafts page, > based on the drafts being named with -- in the name. > > * Added updating of closed WGs. Closed WGs will remain available with no > change of URL, but will not be listed in the WG list on the left-hand > side of the status pages. > > * Added pages for ietf and iab, under /group/iab and /group/ietf. > > * Added listing of published RFCs on the draft pages, with diff against > the last draft version. > > * Added version indication on the WG status pages, with a link to tool > information. > > > Feedback on these features, and suggestions for new ones, are always > welcome. > > > Henrik > _______________________________________________ Tools-discuss mailing list Tools-discuss@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/tools-discuss From tools-discuss-bounces@ietf.org Thu Oct 27 00:21:20 2005 Received: from localhost.localdomain ([127.0.0.1] helo=megatron.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1EUzGS-0003Gu-16; Thu, 27 Oct 2005 00:21:20 -0400 Received: from odin.ietf.org ([132.151.1.176] helo=ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1EUzGQ-0003Gj-QH; Thu, 27 Oct 2005 00:21:18 -0400 Received: from ietf-mx.ietf.org (ietf-mx [132.151.6.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id AAA21479; Thu, 27 Oct 2005 00:21:02 -0400 (EDT) Received: from av9-1-sn3.vrr.skanova.net ([81.228.9.185]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1EUzTh-0006iD-0h; Thu, 27 Oct 2005 00:35:03 -0400 Received: by av9-1-sn3.vrr.skanova.net (Postfix, from userid 502) id D56F337EBE; Thu, 27 Oct 2005 06:20:56 +0200 (CEST) Received: from smtp3-2-sn3.vrr.skanova.net (smtp3-2-sn3.vrr.skanova.net [81.228.9.102]) by av9-1-sn3.vrr.skanova.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id B717E37EBE; Thu, 27 Oct 2005 06:20:56 +0200 (CEST) Received: from shiraz.levkowetz.com (81-224-201-50-no45.tbcn.telia.com [81.224.201.50]) by smtp3-2-sn3.vrr.skanova.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9B4B837E43; Thu, 27 Oct 2005 06:20:56 +0200 (CEST) Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]) by shiraz.levkowetz.com with esmtp (Exim 4.54) id 1EUzG3-0002zf-Nt; Thu, 27 Oct 2005 06:20:55 +0200 Message-ID: <436055A7.5010706@levkowetz.com> Date: Thu, 27 Oct 2005 06:20:55 +0200 From: Henrik Levkowetz User-Agent: Mozilla Thunderbird 1.0.7 (Macintosh/20050923) X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Allison Mankin X-Enigmail-Version: 0.93.0.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-SA-Exim-Connect-IP: 127.0.0.1 X-SA-Exim-Mail-From: henrik@levkowetz.com X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No (on shiraz.levkowetz.com); SAEximRunCond expanded to false X-Spam-Score: 0.1 (/) X-Scan-Signature: e1b0e72ff1bbd457ceef31828f216a86 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Cc: WG Chairs , Tools Team Discussion Subject: [Tools-discuss] Re: WG-pages v0.60 X-BeenThere: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF Tools Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: tools-discuss-bounces@ietf.org Errors-To: tools-discuss-bounces@ietf.org Hi Allison, Thank you. Yes, there's an RFC index page planned, which links to this presentation of the RFCs. That RFC index page will have 2 or 3 different alternative formats, one being similar to the index page maintained by the RFC Editor, another being based on the compact index page put together by Simon Leinen (http://mirror.switch.ch/rfc/mini-index.html) -- he's already contributed the code, I just have to get it up there... One additional feature of these html-ized RFCs which you may not have come across yet is that in addition to showing a link to errata, it will also show if the RFC has been obsoleted or updated by a later one - another thing I've been missing when looking up RFCs. An example: Our dear 2026 has been updated by a number of RFCs, in addition to having errata, and if you follow the link to 3667, you'll see that it, in its turn, has been obsoleted by 3978: http://tools.ietf.org/tools/rfcmarkup/rfcmarkup.cgi?rfc=2026 I'll have the RFC indexes up pretty soon, but probably not before Vancouver - I'm scrambling to get some other stuff in place by then. Henrik on 2005-10-27 05:00 Allison Mankin said the following: > Henrik, > > Thanks to the Tools Team and you. > > I want to commend this release, and add a note to its > to its features. You list adding the published RFCs to > each working group page, but you didn't mention something > really neat. Fetch the html-ized RFC and one finds that > it contains a link to its errata! This is such a good idea, > since of course the real worry is that errata won't be > consulted by the RFC readers. > > I just stumbled on this in RFC 4114 through the ENUM WG > page - tools.ietf.org/wg/enum > > Perhaps as the site plans evolve, we'll see an > area with the wg RFCs all together in this form, to > complement this. > > Allison > > >> >> Hi, >> >> This is the formal release announcement of version 0.60 of the WG pages >> available under >> >> http://tools.ietf.org/wg/ >> >> The changes contained in this version have been put in place gradually >> since IETF-63, but an announcement seems appropriate to point out the >> changes and improvements which are now in place. From the changelog: >> >> >> wg-pages (0.60) >> >> * Added WG Agendas back to IETF-59 (earlier agendas are not easily available >> without manual handling). >> >> * Added WG Minutes back to IETF-50. Minutes which weren't natively in >> HTML format, but had some HTML added later, have been stripped to text >> format and run through fmt. >> >> * Agendas and minutes will now be automatically updated also during coming >> IETFs, requiring no manual intervention. >> >> * Added a list of 'related drafts' at the bottom of the WG drafts page, >> based on the drafts being named with -- in the name. >> >> * Added updating of closed WGs. Closed WGs will remain available with no >> change of URL, but will not be listed in the WG list on the left-hand >> side of the status pages. >> >> * Added pages for ietf and iab, under /group/iab and /group/ietf. >> >> * Added listing of published RFCs on the draft pages, with diff against >> the last draft version. >> >> * Added version indication on the WG status pages, with a link to tool >> information. >> >> >> Feedback on these features, and suggestions for new ones, are always >> welcome. >> >> >> Henrik >> > _______________________________________________ Tools-discuss mailing list Tools-discuss@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/tools-discuss From tools-discuss-bounces@ietf.org Thu Oct 27 02:15:53 2005 Received: from localhost.localdomain ([127.0.0.1] helo=megatron.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1EV13J-0001jB-Ia; Thu, 27 Oct 2005 02:15:53 -0400 Received: from odin.ietf.org ([132.151.1.176] helo=ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1EV13H-0001hE-7z for tools-discuss@megatron.ietf.org; Thu, 27 Oct 2005 02:15:51 -0400 Received: from ietf-mx.ietf.org (ietf-mx [132.151.6.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id CAA26726 for ; Thu, 27 Oct 2005 02:15:34 -0400 (EDT) Received: from 130.155.216.216.transedge.com ([216.216.155.130] helo=vbn.0053136.lodgenet.net) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1EV1GX-00022F-M2 for tools-discuss@ietf.org; Thu, 27 Oct 2005 02:29:36 -0400 Received: from [10.2.2.144] (helo=[10.2.2.144]) by vbn.0053136.lodgenet.net with esmtp (Exim 3.34 #1) id 1EV13C-0006kY-00 for tools-discuss@ietf.org; Thu, 27 Oct 2005 02:15:46 -0400 Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v734) Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Message-Id: <692CB266-A525-4894-9A4D-717D74479FCA@cisco.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; delsp=yes; format=flowed To: tools-discuss@ietf.org From: Fred Baker Date: Thu, 27 Oct 2005 02:15:45 -0400 X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.734) X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Scan-Signature: de4f315c9369b71d7dd5909b42224370 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: [Tools-discuss] A thought on I-Ds X-BeenThere: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF Tools Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: tools-discuss-bounces@ietf.org Errors-To: tools-discuss-bounces@ietf.org It seems to me that a huge part of what the secretariat does in ID posting is ensure that a stated boilerplate is there and *if* it is named draft-ietf-* that the WG has accepted the draft. XML2RFC is popular. What if - suppose that the secretariat externalized a web page that did essentially the tool on Marshall's xml.resource.org page, and had an option to say "post the draft". The tool starts from an XML form and produces the right boilerplate, obviating one check. The other check could be obviated by ensuring that its name is in a certain list. This would allow people to post drafts without taking up secretariat staff cycles. The existing process remains available for those that use other tools. I'm probably missing something. What? _______________________________________________ Tools-discuss mailing list Tools-discuss@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/tools-discuss From tools-discuss-bounces@ietf.org Thu Oct 27 02:23:49 2005 Received: from localhost.localdomain ([127.0.0.1] helo=megatron.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1EV1Az-0000d8-HM; Thu, 27 Oct 2005 02:23:49 -0400 Received: from odin.ietf.org ([132.151.1.176] helo=ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1EV1Ax-0000Zo-5C for tools-discuss@megatron.ietf.org; Thu, 27 Oct 2005 02:23:47 -0400 Received: from ietf-mx.ietf.org (ietf-mx [132.151.6.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id CAA27014 for ; Thu, 27 Oct 2005 02:23:30 -0400 (EDT) Received: from boreas.isi.edu ([128.9.160.161]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1EV1OF-0002IS-Jg for tools-discuss@ietf.org; Thu, 27 Oct 2005 02:37:33 -0400 Received: from [192.168.1.47] (pool-71-106-130-244.lsanca.dsl-w.verizon.net [71.106.130.244]) by boreas.isi.edu (8.11.6p2+0917/8.11.2) with ESMTP id j9R6McL15685; Wed, 26 Oct 2005 23:22:38 -0700 (PDT) Message-ID: <43607227.40104@isi.edu> Date: Wed, 26 Oct 2005 23:22:31 -0700 From: Joe Touch User-Agent: Thunderbird 1.4.1 (Windows/20051006) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Fred Baker Subject: Re: [Tools-discuss] A thought on I-Ds References: <692CB266-A525-4894-9A4D-717D74479FCA@cisco.com> In-Reply-To: <692CB266-A525-4894-9A4D-717D74479FCA@cisco.com> X-Enigmail-Version: 0.93.0.0 X-ISI-4-43-8-MailScanner: Found to be clean X-MailScanner-From: touch@isi.edu X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Scan-Signature: c1c65599517f9ac32519d043c37c5336 Cc: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-BeenThere: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF Tools Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="===============0349038130==" Sender: tools-discuss-bounces@ietf.org Errors-To: tools-discuss-bounces@ietf.org This is an OpenPGP/MIME signed message (RFC 2440 and 3156) --===============0349038130== Content-Type: multipart/signed; micalg=pgp-sha1; protocol="application/pgp-signature"; boundary="------------enigEB3FABE0C4C044FEF2DE30A6" This is an OpenPGP/MIME signed message (RFC 2440 and 3156) --------------enigEB3FABE0C4C044FEF2DE30A6 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Fred Baker wrote: > It seems to me that a huge part of what the secretariat does in ID > posting is ensure that a stated boilerplate is there and *if* it is > named draft-ietf-* that the WG has accepted the draft. XML2RFC is popul= ar. >=20 > What if - >=20 > suppose that the secretariat externalized a web page that did > essentially the tool on Marshall's xml.resource.org page, and had an > option to say "post the draft". The tool starts from an XML form and > produces the right boilerplate, obviating one check. The other check > could be obviated by ensuring that its name is in a certain list. This > would allow people to post drafts without taking up secretariat staff > cycles. The existing process remains available for those that use other= > tools. >=20 > I'm probably missing something. What? Not everybody uses XML. Joe --------------enigEB3FABE0C4C044FEF2DE30A6 Content-Type: application/pgp-signature; name="signature.asc" Content-Description: OpenPGP digital signature Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="signature.asc" -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.4.1 (MingW32) Comment: Using GnuPG with Mozilla - http://enigmail.mozdev.org iD8DBQFDYHInE5f5cImnZrsRAqOIAJ9IdPvAQepSPurQw+8gYVAIQdgK5ACgnYOC D90c9SRiSJdAagDVrtcmggo= =Zd9+ -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --------------enigEB3FABE0C4C044FEF2DE30A6-- --===============0349038130== Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline _______________________________________________ Tools-discuss mailing list Tools-discuss@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/tools-discuss --===============0349038130==-- From tools-discuss-bounces@ietf.org Thu Oct 27 02:47:56 2005 Received: from localhost.localdomain ([127.0.0.1] helo=megatron.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1EV1YK-000769-7f; Thu, 27 Oct 2005 02:47:56 -0400 Received: from odin.ietf.org ([132.151.1.176] helo=ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1EV1YI-00075Y-5U for tools-discuss@megatron.ietf.org; Thu, 27 Oct 2005 02:47:54 -0400 Received: from ietf-mx.ietf.org (ietf-mx [132.151.6.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id CAA28018 for ; Thu, 27 Oct 2005 02:47:39 -0400 (EDT) Received: from av6-2-sn3.vrr.skanova.net ([81.228.9.180]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1EV1la-0003Ak-Rv for tools-discuss@ietf.org; Thu, 27 Oct 2005 03:01:40 -0400 Received: by av6-2-sn3.vrr.skanova.net (Postfix, from userid 502) id 4D61937FCE; Thu, 27 Oct 2005 08:47:43 +0200 (CEST) Received: from smtp3-1-sn3.vrr.skanova.net (smtp3-1-sn3.vrr.skanova.net [81.228.9.101]) by av6-2-sn3.vrr.skanova.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 306ED37FBD; Thu, 27 Oct 2005 08:47:43 +0200 (CEST) Received: from shiraz.levkowetz.com (81-224-201-50-no45.tbcn.telia.com [81.224.201.50]) by smtp3-1-sn3.vrr.skanova.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 226D437E43; Thu, 27 Oct 2005 08:47:43 +0200 (CEST) Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]) by shiraz.levkowetz.com with esmtp (Exim 4.54) id 1EV1Y6-0001KO-Bv; Thu, 27 Oct 2005 08:47:42 +0200 Message-ID: <4360780E.4010500@levkowetz.com> Date: Thu, 27 Oct 2005 08:47:42 +0200 From: Henrik Levkowetz User-Agent: Mozilla Thunderbird 1.0.7 (Macintosh/20050923) X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Fred Baker Subject: Re: [Tools-discuss] A thought on I-Ds References: <692CB266-A525-4894-9A4D-717D74479FCA@cisco.com> In-Reply-To: <692CB266-A525-4894-9A4D-717D74479FCA@cisco.com> X-Enigmail-Version: 0.93.0.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-SA-Exim-Connect-IP: 127.0.0.1 X-SA-Exim-Mail-From: henrik@levkowetz.com X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No (on shiraz.levkowetz.com); SAEximRunCond expanded to false X-Spam-Score: 0.1 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 8abaac9e10c826e8252866cbe6766464 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Cc: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-BeenThere: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF Tools Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: tools-discuss-bounces@ietf.org Errors-To: tools-discuss-bounces@ietf.org Hi Fred, on 2005-10-27 08:15 Fred Baker said the following: > It seems to me that a huge part of what the secretariat does in ID > posting is ensure that a stated boilerplate is there and *if* it is > named draft-ietf-* that the WG has accepted the draft. XML2RFC is > popular. > > What if - > > suppose that the secretariat externalized a web page that did > essentially the tool on Marshall's xml.resource.org page, and had an > option to say "post the draft". The tool starts from an XML form and > produces the right boilerplate, obviating one check. The other check > could be obviated by ensuring that its name is in a certain list. > This would allow people to post drafts without taking up secretariat > staff cycles. The existing process remains available for those that > use other tools. > > I'm probably missing something. What? This is a subset of the proposed draft submission web-page functionality. The document below describes that and other aspect of the tool, has been approved by the IESG, and we're hoping that design and implementation can start soon: http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-ietf-tools-draft-submission-09.txt Regards, Henrik _______________________________________________ Tools-discuss mailing list Tools-discuss@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/tools-discuss From tools-discuss-bounces@ietf.org Thu Oct 27 03:13:15 2005 Received: from localhost.localdomain ([127.0.0.1] helo=megatron.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1EV1wp-0004HT-B8; Thu, 27 Oct 2005 03:13:15 -0400 Received: from odin.ietf.org ([132.151.1.176] helo=ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1EV1wn-0004Gs-QP for tools-discuss@megatron.ietf.org; Thu, 27 Oct 2005 03:13:13 -0400 Received: from ietf-mx.ietf.org (ietf-mx [132.151.6.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id DAA06798 for ; Thu, 27 Oct 2005 03:12:57 -0400 (EDT) Received: from netcore.fi ([193.94.160.1]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1EV2A1-0006gR-IW for tools-discuss@ietf.org; Thu, 27 Oct 2005 03:26:56 -0400 Received: from localhost (pekkas@localhost) by netcore.fi (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id j9R7Cji12963; Thu, 27 Oct 2005 10:12:45 +0300 Date: Thu, 27 Oct 2005 10:12:45 +0300 (EEST) From: Pekka Savola To: Joe Touch Subject: Re: [Tools-discuss] A thought on I-Ds In-Reply-To: <43607227.40104@isi.edu> Message-ID: References: <692CB266-A525-4894-9A4D-717D74479FCA@cisco.com> <43607227.40104@isi.edu> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 8abaac9e10c826e8252866cbe6766464 Cc: Fred Baker , tools-discuss@ietf.org X-BeenThere: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF Tools Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: tools-discuss-bounces@ietf.org Errors-To: tools-discuss-bounces@ietf.org On Wed, 26 Oct 2005, Joe Touch wrote: > Fred Baker wrote: >> It seems to me that a huge part of what the secretariat does in ID >> posting is ensure that a stated boilerplate is there and *if* it is >> named draft-ietf-* that the WG has accepted the draft. XML2RFC is popular. >> >> What if - >> >> suppose that the secretariat externalized a web page that did >> essentially the tool on Marshall's xml.resource.org page, and had an >> option to say "post the draft". The tool starts from an XML form and >> produces the right boilerplate, obviating one check. The other check >> could be obviated by ensuring that its name is in a certain list. This >> would allow people to post drafts without taking up secretariat staff >> cycles. The existing process remains available for those that use other >> tools. >> >> I'm probably missing something. What? > > Not everybody uses XML. And those could continue using secretariat's manual services. But as to Fred -- it's not quite as simple; draft-ietf-tools-draft-submission-09.txt (in rfc-ed queue) describes quite many requirements. I guess now we're just waiting for someone to Do Something(tm). -- Pekka Savola "You each name yourselves king, yet the Netcore Oy kingdom bleeds." Systems. Networks. Security. -- George R.R. Martin: A Clash of Kings _______________________________________________ Tools-discuss mailing list Tools-discuss@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/tools-discuss From tools-discuss-bounces@ietf.org Thu Oct 27 07:23:07 2005 Received: from localhost.localdomain ([127.0.0.1] helo=megatron.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1EV5qd-0001Zg-FA; Thu, 27 Oct 2005 07:23:07 -0400 Received: from odin.ietf.org ([132.151.1.176] helo=ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1EV5qb-0001Zb-1D for tools-discuss@megatron.ietf.org; Thu, 27 Oct 2005 07:23:05 -0400 Received: from ietf-mx.ietf.org (ietf-mx [132.151.6.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id HAA22193 for ; Thu, 27 Oct 2005 07:22:47 -0400 (EDT) Received: from main.gmane.org ([80.91.229.2] helo=ciao.gmane.org) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1EV63s-0006pP-Gw for tools-discuss@ietf.org; Thu, 27 Oct 2005 07:36:53 -0400 Received: from root by ciao.gmane.org with local (Exim 4.43) id 1EV5oU-0003Nk-6Q for tools-discuss@ietf.org; Thu, 27 Oct 2005 13:20:54 +0200 Received: from 212.82.251.11 ([212.82.251.11]) by main.gmane.org with esmtp (Gmexim 0.1 (Debian)) id 1AlnuQ-0007hv-00 for ; Thu, 27 Oct 2005 13:20:54 +0200 Received: from nobody by 212.82.251.11 with local (Gmexim 0.1 (Debian)) id 1AlnuQ-0007hv-00 for ; Thu, 27 Oct 2005 13:20:54 +0200 X-Injected-Via-Gmane: http://gmane.org/ To: tools-discuss@ietf.org From: Frank Ellermann Date: Thu, 27 Oct 2005 08:32:32 +0200 Organization: Lines: 27 Message-ID: <43607480.4827@xyzzy.claranet.de> References: <436055A7.5010706@levkowetz.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Complaints-To: usenet@sea.gmane.org X-Gmane-NNTP-Posting-Host: 212.82.251.11 X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0 (OS/2; U) X-Spam-Score: 0.9 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 0bc60ec82efc80c84b8d02f4b0e4de22 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: [Tools-discuss] Re: WG-pages v0.60 X-BeenThere: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF Tools Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: tools-discuss-bounces@ietf.org Errors-To: tools-discuss-bounces@ietf.org Henrik Levkowetz wrote: > http://tools.ietf.org/tools/rfcmarkup/rfcmarkup.cgi?rfc=2026 Very nice, how about adding a link to the plain text version ? That's what I missed when it broke at faqs.org, an option to get the text (for my local / offline collection). With the redirection http://purl.net/net/rfc/2026 I get the abstract, keywords, status, updates, errata, and a link to the text, but not the links _in_ the text. With your tool I get links _in_ the text, updates, errata, and the abstract. Tough, both views have something I like. As you see I now managed to subscribe via GMaNe. One idea... >>> Feedback on these features, and suggestions for new ones, >>> are always welcome. ...you could add a link to the jabber archives (and later a xmpp: URL) to the WG homepages. http://www.xmpp.org/ietf-logs is a directory of all (?) WGs. No idea why they keep empty logs (= the 6 KB entries). Bye, Frank _______________________________________________ Tools-discuss mailing list Tools-discuss@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/tools-discuss From tools-discuss-bounces@ietf.org Thu Oct 27 08:23:53 2005 Received: from localhost.localdomain ([127.0.0.1] helo=megatron.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1EV6nR-0002I8-45; Thu, 27 Oct 2005 08:23:53 -0400 Received: from odin.ietf.org ([132.151.1.176] helo=ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1EV6nO-0002GX-Vo for tools-discuss@megatron.ietf.org; Thu, 27 Oct 2005 08:23:51 -0400 Received: from ietf-mx.ietf.org (ietf-mx [132.151.6.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id IAA25680 for ; Thu, 27 Oct 2005 08:23:34 -0400 (EDT) Received: from av6-1-sn3.vrr.skanova.net ([81.228.9.179]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1EV70k-0000Gk-JQ for tools-discuss@ietf.org; Thu, 27 Oct 2005 08:37:39 -0400 Received: by av6-1-sn3.vrr.skanova.net (Postfix, from userid 502) id C241438084; Thu, 27 Oct 2005 14:23:35 +0200 (CEST) Received: from smtp3-1-sn3.vrr.skanova.net (smtp3-1-sn3.vrr.skanova.net [81.228.9.101]) by av6-1-sn3.vrr.skanova.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id A013A37EFA; Thu, 27 Oct 2005 14:23:35 +0200 (CEST) Received: from shiraz.levkowetz.com (81-224-201-50-no45.tbcn.telia.com [81.224.201.50]) by smtp3-1-sn3.vrr.skanova.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8E89E37E48; Thu, 27 Oct 2005 14:23:35 +0200 (CEST) Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]) by shiraz.levkowetz.com with esmtp (Exim 4.54) id 1EV6n9-00059K-Bp; Thu, 27 Oct 2005 14:23:35 +0200 Message-ID: <4360C6C7.3080403@levkowetz.com> Date: Thu, 27 Oct 2005 14:23:35 +0200 From: Henrik Levkowetz User-Agent: Mozilla Thunderbird 1.0.7 (Macintosh/20050923) X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Frank Ellermann Subject: Re: [Tools-discuss] Re: WG-pages v0.60 References: <436055A7.5010706@levkowetz.com> <43607480.4827@xyzzy.claranet.de> In-Reply-To: <43607480.4827@xyzzy.claranet.de> X-Enigmail-Version: 0.93.0.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-SA-Exim-Connect-IP: 127.0.0.1 X-SA-Exim-Mail-From: henrik@levkowetz.com X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No (on shiraz.levkowetz.com); SAEximRunCond expanded to false X-Spam-Score: 0.1 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 8b30eb7682a596edff707698f4a80f7d Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Cc: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-BeenThere: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF Tools Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: tools-discuss-bounces@ietf.org Errors-To: tools-discuss-bounces@ietf.org Hi Frank, on 2005-10-27 08:32 Frank Ellermann said the following: > Henrik Levkowetz wrote: > >> http://tools.ietf.org/tools/rfcmarkup/rfcmarkup.cgi?rfc=2026 > > Very nice, how about adding a link to the plain text version ? Sure. Won't promise it before Vancouver, though :-) > That's what I missed when it broke at faqs.org, an option to > get the text (for my local / offline collection). With the > redirection http://purl.net/net/rfc/2026 I get the abstract, > keywords, status, updates, errata, and a link to the text, but > not the links _in_ the text. > > With your tool I get links _in_ the text, updates, errata, and > the abstract. Tough, both views have something I like. > > As you see I now managed to subscribe via GMaNe. One idea... Ah, so that was you. I had my suspicions, but didn't know ,;-) >>>> Feedback on these features, and suggestions for new ones, >>>> are always welcome. > > ...you could add a link to the jabber archives (and later a > xmpp: URL) to the WG homepages. http://www.xmpp.org/ietf-logs > is a directory of all (?) WGs. No idea why they keep empty > logs (= the 6 KB entries). Good idea. To make it reasonably useful there really should be links directly to the non-empty logs, but that will have to wait. I'm adding a link to the jabber log directory, for now; that's easy. Henrik _______________________________________________ Tools-discuss mailing list Tools-discuss@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/tools-discuss From tools-discuss-bounces@ietf.org Thu Oct 27 08:33:40 2005 Received: from localhost.localdomain ([127.0.0.1] helo=megatron.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1EV6wu-0007uy-K3; Thu, 27 Oct 2005 08:33:40 -0400 Received: from odin.ietf.org ([132.151.1.176] helo=ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1EV6wt-0007ut-1M for tools-discuss@megatron.ietf.org; Thu, 27 Oct 2005 08:33:39 -0400 Received: from ietf-mx.ietf.org (ietf-mx [132.151.6.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id IAA26166 for ; Thu, 27 Oct 2005 08:33:22 -0400 (EDT) Received: from sj-iport-1-in.cisco.com ([171.71.176.70] helo=sj-iport-1.cisco.com) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1EV7AF-0000Vw-RU for tools-discuss@ietf.org; Thu, 27 Oct 2005 08:47:28 -0400 Received: from sj-core-2.cisco.com ([171.71.177.254]) by sj-iport-1.cisco.com with ESMTP; 27 Oct 2005 05:33:30 -0700 X-IronPort-AV: i="3.97,258,1125903600"; d="sig'?scan'208"; a="669762999:sNHT31292902" Received: from imail.cisco.com (imail.cisco.com [128.107.200.91]) by sj-core-2.cisco.com (8.12.10/8.12.6) with ESMTP id j9RCXRJh009620; Thu, 27 Oct 2005 05:33:27 -0700 (PDT) Received: from [10.255.65.166] (sjc-vpn6-319.cisco.com [10.21.121.63]) by imail.cisco.com (8.12.11/8.12.10) with ESMTP id j9RChMgT022163; Thu, 27 Oct 2005 05:43:22 -0700 In-Reply-To: <43607227.40104@isi.edu> References: <692CB266-A525-4894-9A4D-717D74479FCA@cisco.com> <43607227.40104@isi.edu> Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v734) Message-Id: <82C4EA02-30C3-45F8-B5EB-3264C270D60B@cisco.com> From: Fred Baker Subject: Re: [Tools-discuss] A thought on I-Ds Date: Thu, 27 Oct 2005 08:33:25 -0400 To: Joe Touch X-Pgp-Agent: GPGMail 1.1.1 (Tiger) X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.734) DKIM-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; l=791; t=1130417003; x=1130849203; c=nowsp; s=nebraska; h=Subject:From:Date:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding; d=cisco.com; i=fred@cisco.com; z=Subject:Re=3A=20[Tools-discuss]=20A=20thought=20on=20I-Ds| From:Fred=20Baker=20| Date:Thu,=2027=20Oct=202005=2008=3A33=3A25=20-0400| Content-Type:multipart/signed=3B=20protocol=3D=22application/pgp-signature=22=3B=20mi calg=3Dpgp-sha1=3B=20boundary=3D=22Apple-Mail-10--362132662=22| Content-Transfer-Encoding:7bit; b=YMZJH2H4cQPeDUr5sEr2P/nzsaAW5Ty6Ez4hW7mV7C7DutrTSo+3FaaX1JjCPU2J/CJt1djm OYkZ3X2FO7qFKqBhA7NC15Q0TfZX6lDinumP4R94Ug6rBAN2TXyOE3NnmBCwOfTEJV8fnOxnI3F kjiyD1q7w4g2O9RkUwvyvuQs= Authentication-Results: imail.cisco.com; header.From=fred@cisco.com; dkim=pass ( 30 extraneous bytes; message from cisco.com verified; ); X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 8abaac9e10c826e8252866cbe6766464 Cc: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-BeenThere: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF Tools Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="===============1677115327==" Sender: tools-discuss-bounces@ietf.org Errors-To: tools-discuss-bounces@ietf.org This is an OpenPGP/MIME signed message (RFC 2440 and 3156) --===============1677115327== Content-Type: multipart/signed; protocol="application/pgp-signature"; micalg=pgp-sha1; boundary="Apple-Mail-10--362132662" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit This is an OpenPGP/MIME signed message (RFC 2440 and 3156) --Apple-Mail-10--362132662 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; delsp=yes; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit I didn't say they did. I said that those that do could use such a tool and it would have certain predictable effects. I also said that the existing mechanism would presumably stay in place for the rest of us. On Oct 27, 2005, at 2:22 AM, Joe Touch wrote: > Not everybody uses XML. > --Apple-Mail-10--362132662 content-type: application/pgp-signature; x-mac-type=70674453; name=PGP.sig content-description: This is a digitally signed message part content-disposition: inline; filename=PGP.sig Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.4.1 (Darwin) iD8DBQFDYMkWbjEdbHIsm0MRAjz4AKCzqZPT3XCXkJiuXJemJ66vg5nZ5gCfSbZ9 nSitQ4GnW4fOW0lptY6C9ME= =PQJE -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --Apple-Mail-10--362132662-- --===============1677115327== Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline _______________________________________________ Tools-discuss mailing list Tools-discuss@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/tools-discuss --===============1677115327==-- From tools-discuss-bounces@ietf.org Fri Oct 28 01:58:22 2005 Received: from localhost.localdomain ([127.0.0.1] helo=megatron.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1EVNFu-0001oW-H0; Fri, 28 Oct 2005 01:58:22 -0400 Received: from odin.ietf.org ([132.151.1.176] helo=ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1EVNFs-0001nG-9c for tools-discuss@megatron.ietf.org; Fri, 28 Oct 2005 01:58:20 -0400 Received: from ietf-mx.ietf.org (ietf-mx [132.151.6.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id BAA22962 for ; Fri, 28 Oct 2005 01:58:02 -0400 (EDT) From: john.loughney@nokia.com Received: from mgw-ext04.nokia.com ([131.228.20.96]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1EVNPC-0001Oc-Dz for tools-discuss@ietf.org; Fri, 28 Oct 2005 02:07:59 -0400 Received: from esebh107.NOE.Nokia.com (esebh107.ntc.nokia.com [172.21.143.143]) by mgw-ext04.nokia.com (Switch-3.1.7/Switch-3.1.7) with ESMTP id j9S5oDxR002688 for ; Fri, 28 Oct 2005 08:50:13 +0300 Received: from esebh103.NOE.Nokia.com ([172.21.143.33]) by esebh107.NOE.Nokia.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.1830); Fri, 28 Oct 2005 08:53:56 +0300 Received: from esebe100.NOE.Nokia.com ([172.21.138.118]) by esebh103.NOE.Nokia.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.1830); Fri, 28 Oct 2005 08:53:55 +0300 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft Exchange V6.5.7233.31 Content-class: urn:content-classes:message MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Date: Fri, 28 Oct 2005 08:53:57 +0300 Message-ID: <1AA39B75171A7144A73216AED1D7478D013D4A16@esebe100.NOE.Nokia.com> Thread-Topic: Weblink back to www.ietf.org please Thread-Index: AcXbg/yPjU8S6dLfQgK1Ih9QkbpmBA== To: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 28 Oct 2005 05:53:55.0657 (UTC) FILETIME=[FB7F9B90:01C5DB83] X-Spam-Score: 0.3 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 7aefe408d50e9c7c47615841cb314bed Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Subject: [Tools-discuss] Weblink back to www.ietf.org please X-BeenThere: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF Tools Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: tools-discuss-bounces@ietf.org Errors-To: tools-discuss-bounces@ietf.org Hi, On tools.ietf.org, could you put a link somewhere to go back to www.ietf.org? thanks, John _______________________________________________ Tools-discuss mailing list Tools-discuss@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/tools-discuss From tools-discuss-bounces@ietf.org Fri Oct 28 03:51:13 2005 Received: from localhost.localdomain ([127.0.0.1] helo=megatron.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1EVP17-0005yI-4q; Fri, 28 Oct 2005 03:51:13 -0400 Received: from odin.ietf.org ([132.151.1.176] helo=ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1EVP15-0005pV-0g for tools-discuss@megatron.ietf.org; Fri, 28 Oct 2005 03:51:11 -0400 Received: from ietf-mx.ietf.org (ietf-mx [132.151.6.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id DAA29371 for ; Fri, 28 Oct 2005 03:50:52 -0400 (EDT) Received: from av7-1-sn3.vrr.skanova.net ([81.228.9.181]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1EVPEa-0005F9-IL for tools-discuss@ietf.org; Fri, 28 Oct 2005 04:05:09 -0400 Received: by av7-1-sn3.vrr.skanova.net (Postfix, from userid 502) id 7105038293; Fri, 28 Oct 2005 09:42:52 +0200 (CEST) Received: from smtp3-1-sn3.vrr.skanova.net (smtp3-1-sn3.vrr.skanova.net [81.228.9.101]) by av7-1-sn3.vrr.skanova.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 54A4737ECC; Fri, 28 Oct 2005 09:42:52 +0200 (CEST) Received: from shiraz.levkowetz.com (81-224-201-50-no45.tbcn.telia.com [81.224.201.50]) by smtp3-1-sn3.vrr.skanova.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 071A437E45; Fri, 28 Oct 2005 09:50:49 +0200 (CEST) Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]) by shiraz.levkowetz.com with esmtp (Exim 4.54) id 1EVP0i-0002uC-9k; Fri, 28 Oct 2005 09:50:48 +0200 Message-ID: <4361D857.4060704@levkowetz.com> Date: Fri, 28 Oct 2005 09:50:47 +0200 From: Henrik Levkowetz User-Agent: Mozilla Thunderbird 1.0.7 (Macintosh/20050923) X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: john.loughney@nokia.com Subject: Re: [Tools-discuss] Weblink back to www.ietf.org please References: <1AA39B75171A7144A73216AED1D7478D013D4A16@esebe100.NOE.Nokia.com> In-Reply-To: <1AA39B75171A7144A73216AED1D7478D013D4A16@esebe100.NOE.Nokia.com> X-Enigmail-Version: 0.93.0.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-SA-Exim-Connect-IP: 127.0.0.1 X-SA-Exim-Mail-From: henrik@levkowetz.com X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No (on shiraz.levkowetz.com); SAEximRunCond expanded to false X-Spam-Score: 0.1 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 1ac7cc0a4cd376402b85bc1961a86ac2 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Cc: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-BeenThere: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF Tools Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: tools-discuss-bounces@ietf.org Errors-To: tools-discuss-bounces@ietf.org Hi John, on 2005-10-28 07:53 john.loughney@nokia.com said the following: > On tools.ietf.org, could you put a link somewhere to go back to > www.ietf.org? Oh dear, oh dear. BIG omission. Fixed. Thanks. Henrik _______________________________________________ Tools-discuss mailing list Tools-discuss@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/tools-discuss From tools-discuss-bounces@ietf.org Sun Oct 30 17:57:19 2005 Received: from localhost.cnri.reston.va.us ([127.0.0.1] helo=megatron.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1EWM75-0006qS-Gl; Sun, 30 Oct 2005 17:57:19 -0500 Received: from odin.ietf.org ([132.151.1.176] helo=ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1EWM73-0006qJ-LV for tools-discuss@megatron.ietf.org; Sun, 30 Oct 2005 17:57:17 -0500 Received: from ietf-mx.ietf.org (ietf-mx [132.151.6.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id RAA23709 for ; Sun, 30 Oct 2005 17:56:57 -0500 (EST) Received: from main.gmane.org ([80.91.229.2] helo=ciao.gmane.org) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1EWML3-0004Rc-2G for tools-discuss@ietf.org; Sun, 30 Oct 2005 18:11:49 -0500 Received: from list by ciao.gmane.org with local (Exim 4.43) id 1EWM5r-0000Zm-GD for tools-discuss@ietf.org; Sun, 30 Oct 2005 23:56:04 +0100 Received: from c-134-89-100.hh.dial.de.ignite.net ([62.134.89.100]) by main.gmane.org with esmtp (Gmexim 0.1 (Debian)) id 1AlnuQ-0007hv-00 for ; Sun, 30 Oct 2005 23:56:03 +0100 Received: from nobody by c-134-89-100.hh.dial.de.ignite.net with local (Gmexim 0.1 (Debian)) id 1AlnuQ-0007hv-00 for ; Sun, 30 Oct 2005 23:56:03 +0100 X-Injected-Via-Gmane: http://gmane.org/ To: tools-discuss@ietf.org From: Frank Ellermann Date: Sun, 30 Oct 2005 23:53:13 +0100 Organization: Lines: 11 Message-ID: <43654ED9.6F9E@xyzzy.claranet.de> References: <436055A7.5010706@levkowetz.com> <43607480.4827@xyzzy.claranet.de> <4360C6C7.3080403@levkowetz.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Complaints-To: usenet@sea.gmane.org X-Gmane-NNTP-Posting-Host: c-134-89-100.hh.dial.de.ignite.net X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0 (OS/2; U) X-Spam-Score: 0.1 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 68c8cc8a64a9d0402e43b8eee9fc4199 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: [Tools-discuss] Re: WG-pages v0.60 X-BeenThere: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF Tools Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: tools-discuss-bounces@ietf.org Errors-To: tools-discuss-bounces@ietf.org Henrik Levkowetz wrote: > I'm adding a link to the jabber log directory, for now; > that's easy. Thanks - just for fun, see... http://news.spamcop.net/pipermail/spamcop-list/2005-October/105910.html ...for more credits ;-) Bye, Frank _______________________________________________ Tools-discuss mailing list Tools-discuss@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/tools-discuss From tools-discuss-bounces@ietf.org Mon Oct 31 13:25:03 2005 Received: from localhost.cnri.reston.va.us ([127.0.0.1] helo=megatron.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1EWeL9-0000qT-Ak; Mon, 31 Oct 2005 13:25:03 -0500 Received: from odin.ietf.org ([132.151.1.176] helo=ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1EWeL7-0000py-Dh for tools-discuss@megatron.ietf.org; Mon, 31 Oct 2005 13:25:01 -0500 Received: from ietf-mx.ietf.org (ietf-mx [132.151.6.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id NAA25749 for ; Mon, 31 Oct 2005 13:24:42 -0500 (EST) Received: from mtagate2.uk.ibm.com ([195.212.29.135]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1EWeZJ-0005XQ-IT for tools-discuss@ietf.org; Mon, 31 Oct 2005 13:39:44 -0500 Received: from d06nrmr1407.portsmouth.uk.ibm.com (d06nrmr1407.portsmouth.uk.ibm.com [9.149.38.185]) by mtagate2.uk.ibm.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id j9VIOncO065210 for ; Mon, 31 Oct 2005 18:24:49 GMT Received: from d06av01.portsmouth.uk.ibm.com (d06av01.portsmouth.uk.ibm.com [9.149.37.212]) by d06nrmr1407.portsmouth.uk.ibm.com (8.12.10/NCO/VERS6.7) with ESMTP id j9VIOnoU240196 for ; Mon, 31 Oct 2005 18:24:49 GMT Received: from d06av01.portsmouth.uk.ibm.com (loopback [127.0.0.1]) by d06av01.portsmouth.uk.ibm.com (8.12.11/8.13.3) with ESMTP id j9VIOn9T030780 for ; Mon, 31 Oct 2005 18:24:49 GMT Received: from sihl.zurich.ibm.com (sihl.zurich.ibm.com [9.4.16.232]) by d06av01.portsmouth.uk.ibm.com (8.12.11/8.12.11) with ESMTP id j9VIOnbk030777; Mon, 31 Oct 2005 18:24:49 GMT Received: from zurich.ibm.com (sig-9-146-218-19.de.ibm.com [9.146.218.19]) by sihl.zurich.ibm.com (AIX4.3/8.9.3p2/8.9.3) with ESMTP id TAA77006; Mon, 31 Oct 2005 19:24:47 +0100 Message-ID: <4366616A.8060308@zurich.ibm.com> Date: Mon, 31 Oct 2005 19:24:42 +0100 From: Brian E Carpenter Organization: IBM User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.1; en-US; rv:1.6) Gecko/20040113 X-Accept-Language: en, fr, de MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Fred Baker Subject: Re: [Tools-discuss] A thought on I-Ds References: <692CB266-A525-4894-9A4D-717D74479FCA@cisco.com> <43607227.40104@isi.edu> <82C4EA02-30C3-45F8-B5EB-3264C270D60B@cisco.com> In-Reply-To: <82C4EA02-30C3-45F8-B5EB-3264C270D60B@cisco.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 79899194edc4f33a41f49410777972f8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Cc: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-BeenThere: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF Tools Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: tools-discuss-bounces@ietf.org Errors-To: tools-discuss-bounces@ietf.org Fred Baker wrote: > I didn't say they did. I said that those that do could use such a tool > and it would have certain predictable effects. I also said that the > existing mechanism would presumably stay in place for the rest of us. > > On Oct 27, 2005, at 2:22 AM, Joe Touch wrote: > >> Not everybody uses XML. >> We have data suggesting that about 50% of people now use XML, so the effort that can be saved is significant. As far as the specified tool goes, getting this done is a resource issue at the secretariat and therefore in the IAD's orbit. But we will be discussing tool priorities with the future contractor in Vancouver. Brian _______________________________________________ Tools-discuss mailing list Tools-discuss@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/tools-discuss From tools-discuss-bounces@ietf.org Mon Oct 31 14:00:41 2005 Received: from localhost.cnri.reston.va.us ([127.0.0.1] helo=megatron.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1EWetd-0002Io-PB; Mon, 31 Oct 2005 14:00:41 -0500 Received: from odin.ietf.org ([132.151.1.176] helo=ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1EWetW-0002Hz-Rg for tools-discuss@megatron.ietf.org; Mon, 31 Oct 2005 14:00:34 -0500 Received: from ietf-mx.ietf.org (ietf-mx [132.151.6.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id OAA29314 for ; Mon, 31 Oct 2005 14:00:15 -0500 (EST) Received: from boreas.isi.edu ([128.9.160.161]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1EWf7k-0007lJ-EV for tools-discuss@ietf.org; Mon, 31 Oct 2005 14:15:17 -0500 Received: from [128.9.168.55] (upn.isi.edu [128.9.168.55]) by boreas.isi.edu (8.11.6p2+0917/8.11.2) with ESMTP id j9VIwgL14787; Mon, 31 Oct 2005 10:58:42 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: <43666967.4080802@isi.edu> Date: Mon, 31 Oct 2005 10:58:47 -0800 From: Joe Touch User-Agent: Mozilla Thunderbird 1.0.2 (Windows/20050317) X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Brian E Carpenter Subject: Re: [Tools-discuss] A thought on I-Ds References: <692CB266-A525-4894-9A4D-717D74479FCA@cisco.com> <43607227.40104@isi.edu> <82C4EA02-30C3-45F8-B5EB-3264C270D60B@cisco.com> <4366616A.8060308@zurich.ibm.com> In-Reply-To: <4366616A.8060308@zurich.ibm.com> X-Enigmail-Version: 0.91.0.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-ISI-4-43-8-MailScanner: Found to be clean X-MailScanner-From: touch@isi.edu X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Scan-Signature: b19722fc8d3865b147c75ae2495625f2 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Cc: Fred Baker , tools-discuss@ietf.org X-BeenThere: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF Tools Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: tools-discuss-bounces@ietf.org Errors-To: tools-discuss-bounces@ietf.org -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 Brian E Carpenter wrote: > Fred Baker wrote: > >> I didn't say they did. I said that those that do could use such a >> tool and it would have certain predictable effects. I also said that >> the existing mechanism would presumably stay in place for the rest of >> us. >> >> On Oct 27, 2005, at 2:22 AM, Joe Touch wrote: >> >>> Not everybody uses XML. >>> > > We have data suggesting that about 50% of people now use XML, so the > effort that can be saved is significant. Sure - others have pointed out that this is optional, which is all I was implying. Joe -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.2.4 (MingW32) Comment: Using GnuPG with Thunderbird - http://enigmail.mozdev.org iD8DBQFDZmlnE5f5cImnZrsRAldgAJkBQ96wJu/iVP8Ll/bMjjNpUq6YlACeJ7Rm s1c52r2MiTpD4FwbNpSL2Bc= =xvWY -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- _______________________________________________ Tools-discuss mailing list Tools-discuss@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/tools-discuss