From tools-discuss-bounces@ietf.org Tue Nov 01 00:35:23 2005 Received: from localhost.cnri.reston.va.us ([127.0.0.1] helo=megatron.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1EWonr-00007X-C5; Tue, 01 Nov 2005 00:35:23 -0500 Received: from odin.ietf.org ([132.151.1.176] helo=ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1EWonp-00007I-Gw for tools-discuss@megatron.ietf.org; Tue, 01 Nov 2005 00:35:21 -0500 Received: from ietf-mx.ietf.org (ietf-mx [132.151.6.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id AAA13174 for ; Tue, 1 Nov 2005 00:35:00 -0500 (EST) Received: from vapor.isi.edu ([128.9.64.64]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1EWp28-0008Gz-QZ for tools-discuss@ietf.org; Tue, 01 Nov 2005 00:50:10 -0500 Received: from [10.0.1.4] (static-71-246-51-26.lsanca.fios.verizon.net [71.246.51.26]) by vapor.isi.edu (8.11.6p2+0917/8.11.2) with ESMTP id jA15YNn11820; Mon, 31 Oct 2005 21:34:23 -0800 (PST) Date: Mon, 31 Oct 2005 21:34:22 -0800 From: Aaron Falk To: tools-discuss@ietf.org Message-ID: X-Mailer: Mulberry/4.0.4 (Mac OS X) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline X-ISI-4-43-8-MailScanner: Found to be clean X-MailScanner-From: falk@isi.edu X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 2870a44b67ee17965ce5ad0177e150f4 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Cc: Allison Mankin Subject: [Tools-discuss] techspec bof agenda has errors X-BeenThere: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF Tools Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: tools-discuss-bounces@ietf.org Errors-To: tools-discuss-bounces@ietf.org Specifically, on the draftname should be draft-mankin-pub-req. There may be other errors. --aaron _______________________________________________ Tools-discuss mailing list Tools-discuss@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/tools-discuss From tools-discuss-bounces@ietf.org Tue Nov 01 02:50:19 2005 Received: from localhost.cnri.reston.va.us ([127.0.0.1] helo=megatron.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1EWquR-0005Wd-5M; Tue, 01 Nov 2005 02:50:19 -0500 Received: from odin.ietf.org ([132.151.1.176] helo=ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1EWquP-0005WX-Hm for tools-discuss@megatron.ietf.org; Tue, 01 Nov 2005 02:50:17 -0500 Received: from ietf-mx.ietf.org (ietf-mx [132.151.6.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id CAA18883 for ; Tue, 1 Nov 2005 02:49:57 -0500 (EST) Received: from av8-1-sn3.vrr.skanova.net ([81.228.9.183]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1EWr8k-00072I-0v for tools-discuss@ietf.org; Tue, 01 Nov 2005 03:05:07 -0500 Received: by av8-1-sn3.vrr.skanova.net (Postfix, from userid 502) id 5946F37F9C; Tue, 1 Nov 2005 08:49:53 +0100 (CET) Received: from smtp3-1-sn3.vrr.skanova.net (smtp3-1-sn3.vrr.skanova.net [81.228.9.101]) by av8-1-sn3.vrr.skanova.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4C2AF37F89; Tue, 1 Nov 2005 08:49:53 +0100 (CET) Received: from shiraz.levkowetz.com (81-224-201-50-no45.tbcn.telia.com [81.224.201.50]) by smtp3-1-sn3.vrr.skanova.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 120A537E4B; Tue, 1 Nov 2005 08:49:52 +0100 (CET) Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]) by shiraz.levkowetz.com with esmtp (Exim 4.54) id 1EWqu0-0001t9-AF; Tue, 01 Nov 2005 08:49:52 +0100 Message-ID: <43671E20.1000005@levkowetz.com> Date: Tue, 01 Nov 2005 08:49:52 +0100 From: Henrik Levkowetz User-Agent: Mozilla Thunderbird 1.0.7 (Macintosh/20050923) X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Aaron Falk Subject: Re: [Tools-discuss] techspec bof agenda has errors References: In-Reply-To: X-Enigmail-Version: 0.93.0.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-SA-Exim-Connect-IP: 127.0.0.1 X-SA-Exim-Mail-From: henrik@levkowetz.com X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No (on shiraz.levkowetz.com); SAEximRunCond expanded to false X-Spam-Score: 0.1 (/) X-Scan-Signature: d6b246023072368de71562c0ab503126 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Cc: tools-discuss@ietf.org, Allison Mankin X-BeenThere: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF Tools Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: tools-discuss-bounces@ietf.org Errors-To: tools-discuss-bounces@ietf.org Hi Aaron, on 2005-11-01 06:34 Aaron Falk said the following: > Specifically, on the > draftname should be draft-mankin-pub-req. There may be other errors. That's interesting. I noticed that error on Oct. 9th, and notified Leslie. It was corrected on the 10th. Now I see that the old file has reappeared, some time last night, in the IETF repositories, been rsynced to tools.ietf.org, and caused a page update back to the old text. Then the correct version has again been put in place... but with the old date, so no update of the tools.ietf.org webpage has been triggered. Very tricky. Henrik _______________________________________________ Tools-discuss mailing list Tools-discuss@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/tools-discuss From tools-discuss-bounces@ietf.org Tue Nov 01 14:58:15 2005 Received: from localhost.cnri.reston.va.us ([127.0.0.1] helo=megatron.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1EX2Gt-0007Ay-QG; Tue, 01 Nov 2005 14:58:15 -0500 Received: from odin.ietf.org ([132.151.1.176] helo=ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1EX2Gr-0007At-9F for tools-discuss@megatron.ietf.org; Tue, 01 Nov 2005 14:58:13 -0500 Received: from ietf-mx.ietf.org (ietf-mx [132.151.6.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id OAA11134 for ; Tue, 1 Nov 2005 14:57:53 -0500 (EST) Received: from ns.cnri.reston.va.us ([132.151.1.1]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1EX2VJ-0000y8-9O for tools-discuss@ietf.org; Tue, 01 Nov 2005 15:13:09 -0500 Received: from cnri-7-72.cnri.reston.va.us ([132.151.7.72] helo=[10.27.4.43]) by ns.cnri.reston.va.us with esmtp (Exim 4.52) id 1EX2Gn-0007dp-Ur; Tue, 01 Nov 2005 14:58:10 -0500 Message-ID: <4367C8C3.2050104@foretec.com> Date: Tue, 01 Nov 2005 14:57:55 -0500 From: Michael Lee User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.1; en-US; rv:1.7.2) Gecko/20040804 Netscape/7.2 (ax) X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Henrik Levkowetz Subject: Re: Fwd: Re: [Tools-discuss] techspec bof agenda has errors References: <6.1.2.0.2.20051101095923.02bb06d0@furball.foretec.com> In-Reply-To: <6.1.2.0.2.20051101095923.02bb06d0@furball.foretec.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Scan-Signature: a8a20a483a84f747e56475e290ee868e Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Cc: Aaron Falk , tools-discuss@ietf.org, Allison Mankin X-BeenThere: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF Tools Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: tools-discuss-bounces@ietf.org Errors-To: tools-discuss-bounces@ietf.org Hi Henrik, Our file system show that the agenda file of techspec was uploaded on October 10th, and it didn't get replaced since then. I also see that the entire contents of the techspec agenda in your system (http://tools.ietf.org/agenda/64/techspec.html) is slightly different from the one from the Secretariat's server (http://www3.ietf.org/proceedings/05nov/agenda/techspec.txt). Even the file format is different (.html in yours and .txt in the Secretariat's.) Aren't your system rsyncing those files every five minutes or so? Is http://www3.ietf.org/proceedings/05nov/agenda is the only source that your system generates the agenda pages from? One thing I need to clear is that I cannot find any evidence from our system that the old techspec agenda file was placed in IETF repository some time last night. Thanks, Michael. Barbara B. Fuller wrote: > Hi Mike: > > Please check to see if the strange behavior reported by Henrik below > was caused by a problem in our systems. > > Thanks. > > Barbara > --------------------------------------------------------------- > >> Envelope-to: bfuller@foretec.com >> Date: Tue, 01 Nov 2005 08:49:52 +0100 >> From: Henrik Levkowetz >> User-Agent: Mozilla Thunderbird 1.0.7 (Macintosh/20050923) >> X-Accept-Language: en-us, en >> To: Aaron Falk >> Subject: Re: [Tools-discuss] techspec bof agenda has errors >> X-Enigmail-Version: 0.93.0.0 >> X-SA-Exim-Connect-IP: 127.0.0.1 >> X-SA-Exim-Mail-From: henrik@levkowetz.com >> X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No (on shiraz.levkowetz.com); >> SAEximRunCond expanded to false >> X-Spam-Score: 0.1 (/) >> X-Scan-Signature: d6b246023072368de71562c0ab503126 >> Cc: tools-discuss@ietf.org, Allison Mankin >> X-BeenThere: tools-discuss@ietf.org >> X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 >> List-Id: IETF Tools Discussion >> List-Unsubscribe: >> , >> >> List-Archive: >> List-Post: >> List-Help: >> List-Subscribe: , >> >> Sender: tools-discuss-bounces@ietf.org >> X-Spam-Score: 0.1 (/) >> X-Scan-Signature: 93238566e09e6e262849b4f805833007 >> >> Hi Aaron, >> >> on 2005-11-01 06:34 Aaron Falk said the following: >> > Specifically, on the >> > draftname should be draft-mankin-pub-req. There may be other errors. >> >> That's interesting. I noticed that error on Oct. 9th, and notified >> Leslie. It was corrected on the 10th. Now I see that the old file >> has reappeared, some time last night, in the IETF repositories, been >> rsynced to tools.ietf.org, and caused a page update back to the old >> text. Then the correct version has again been put in place... but with >> the old date, so no update of the tools.ietf.org webpage has been >> triggered. >> >> Very tricky. >> >> >> Henrik >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Tools-discuss mailing list >> Tools-discuss@ietf.org >> https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/tools-discuss > > > ------------------------------------------------ > Barbara B. Fuller > Acting Executive Director > Internet Engineering Task Force > > Natick, Massachusetts Office: > > Phone: +1-508-650-4020 > Fax: +1-508-650-4639 > > Reston, Virginia Office: > > Phone: +1-703-620-9053 > Fax: +1-703-620-9071 _______________________________________________ Tools-discuss mailing list Tools-discuss@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/tools-discuss From tools-discuss-bounces@ietf.org Tue Nov 01 16:50:17 2005 Received: from localhost.cnri.reston.va.us ([127.0.0.1] helo=megatron.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1EX41J-0002oJ-81; Tue, 01 Nov 2005 16:50:17 -0500 Received: from odin.ietf.org ([132.151.1.176] helo=ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1EX41G-0002mU-9x for tools-discuss@megatron.ietf.org; Tue, 01 Nov 2005 16:50:15 -0500 Received: from ietf-mx.ietf.org (ietf-mx [132.151.6.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id QAA18521 for ; Tue, 1 Nov 2005 16:49:53 -0500 (EST) Received: from av11-1-sn2.hy.skanova.net ([81.228.8.183]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1EX4Fg-0004xR-Hp for tools-discuss@ietf.org; Tue, 01 Nov 2005 17:05:11 -0500 Received: by av11-1-sn2.hy.skanova.net (Postfix, from userid 502) id 0D22237FFF; Tue, 1 Nov 2005 22:50:01 +0100 (CET) Received: from smtp4-1-sn2.hy.skanova.net (smtp4-1-sn2.hy.skanova.net [81.228.8.92]) by av11-1-sn2.hy.skanova.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id EAD1437F6C; Tue, 1 Nov 2005 22:50:00 +0100 (CET) Received: from shiraz.levkowetz.com (81-224-201-50-no45.tbcn.telia.com [81.224.201.50]) by smtp4-1-sn2.hy.skanova.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6A26837E42; Tue, 1 Nov 2005 22:50:00 +0100 (CET) Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]) by shiraz.levkowetz.com with esmtp (Exim 4.54) id 1EX411-0003r4-55; Tue, 01 Nov 2005 22:49:59 +0100 Message-ID: <4367E304.2060000@levkowetz.com> Date: Tue, 01 Nov 2005 22:49:56 +0100 From: Henrik Levkowetz User-Agent: Mozilla Thunderbird 1.0.7 (Macintosh/20050923) X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Michael Lee Subject: Re: Fwd: Re: [Tools-discuss] techspec bof agenda has errors References: <6.1.2.0.2.20051101095923.02bb06d0@furball.foretec.com> <4367C8C3.2050104@foretec.com> In-Reply-To: <4367C8C3.2050104@foretec.com> X-Enigmail-Version: 0.93.0.0 X-SA-Exim-Connect-IP: 127.0.0.1 X-SA-Exim-Mail-From: henrik@levkowetz.com X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No (on shiraz.levkowetz.com); SAEximRunCond expanded to false X-Spam-Score: 0.1 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 20f22c03b5c66958bff5ef54fcda6e48 Cc: Aaron Falk , tools-discuss@ietf.org, Allison Mankin X-BeenThere: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF Tools Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="===============0559678507==" Sender: tools-discuss-bounces@ietf.org Errors-To: tools-discuss-bounces@ietf.org This is an OpenPGP/MIME signed message (RFC 2440 and 3156) --===============0559678507== Content-Type: multipart/signed; micalg=pgp-sha1; protocol="application/pgp-signature"; boundary="------------enigC3712B238B3A6791AD534479" This is an OpenPGP/MIME signed message (RFC 2440 and 3156) --------------enigC3712B238B3A6791AD534479 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Hi Mike, Thanks for responding :-) on 2005-11-01 20:57 Michael Lee said the following: > Hi Henrik, > > Our file system show that the agenda file of techspec was uploaded on > October 10th, and it didn't get replaced since then. > I also see that the entire contents of the techspec agenda in your > system (http://tools.ietf.org/agenda/64/techspec.html) is slightly > different from the one from the Secretariat's server > (http://www3.ietf.org/proceedings/05nov/agenda/techspec.txt). Even the > file format is different (.html in yours and .txt in the Secretariat's.) Yes. The text format is html-ized to provide clickable links to all the drafts and URLs referred to in the agendas - it's much easier to keep up with the drafts being discussed in a meeting if you can just click on a link instead of copying the draft name and adding the internet-draft http address manually in your browser... > Aren't your system rsyncing those files every five minutes or so? Yes, that's right - well, not rsyncing, but using http. There's no rsync access provided for this, I think. > Is http://www3.ietf.org/proceedings/05nov/agenda is the only source that > your system generates the agenda pages from? I originally was getting agendas from http://www.ietf.org/ietf/05nov/, but then the agendas people were uploading wasn't transferred over there, so I started also getting what's available at http://www3.ietf.org/proceedings/05nov/agenda/. I'm not not getting the sources from anywhere else. > One thing I need to clear is that I cannot find any evidence from our > system that the old techspec agenda file was placed in IETF repository > some time last night. Right. I don't think that's what happened. It's more likely that there could be something odd with the 3 servers that www.ietf.org used to resolve to (when I checked a few weeks ago) / the 2 servers it is currently resolving to, and the mirroring solution used between them. Could it be that the mirroring is done with some mechanism which updates all the files, not only the ones which have changed, and doesn't do it by first transferring and then moving the files into place by changing names? Rsync gets this right (unless you explicitly tell it to do it by a different method), but a lot of other mirroring software might transfer files directly to a file with the final name; this could result in a wrong file date if somebody fetched that freshly transferred file before it had its date corrected to be the same as the original file's... Regards, Henrik > Thanks, > Michael. > > Barbara B. Fuller wrote: > >> Hi Mike: >> >> Please check to see if the strange behavior reported by Henrik below >> was caused by a problem in our systems. >> >> Thanks. >> >> Barbara >> --------------------------------------------------------------- >> >>> Envelope-to: bfuller@foretec.com >>> Date: Tue, 01 Nov 2005 08:49:52 +0100 >>> From: Henrik Levkowetz >>> User-Agent: Mozilla Thunderbird 1.0.7 (Macintosh/20050923) >>> X-Accept-Language: en-us, en >>> To: Aaron Falk >>> Subject: Re: [Tools-discuss] techspec bof agenda has errors >>> X-Enigmail-Version: 0.93.0.0 >>> X-SA-Exim-Connect-IP: 127.0.0.1 >>> X-SA-Exim-Mail-From: henrik@levkowetz.com >>> X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No (on shiraz.levkowetz.com); >>> SAEximRunCond expanded to false >>> X-Spam-Score: 0.1 (/) >>> X-Scan-Signature: d6b246023072368de71562c0ab503126 >>> Cc: tools-discuss@ietf.org, Allison Mankin >>> X-BeenThere: tools-discuss@ietf.org >>> X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 >>> List-Id: IETF Tools Discussion >>> List-Unsubscribe: >>> , >>> >>> List-Archive: >>> List-Post: >>> List-Help: >>> List-Subscribe: , >>> >>> Sender: tools-discuss-bounces@ietf.org >>> X-Spam-Score: 0.1 (/) >>> X-Scan-Signature: 93238566e09e6e262849b4f805833007 >>> >>> Hi Aaron, >>> >>> on 2005-11-01 06:34 Aaron Falk said the following: >>> > Specifically, on the >>> > draftname should be draft-mankin-pub-req. There may be other errors. >>> >>> That's interesting. I noticed that error on Oct. 9th, and notified >>> Leslie. It was corrected on the 10th. Now I see that the old file >>> has reappeared, some time last night, in the IETF repositories, been >>> rsynced to tools.ietf.org, and caused a page update back to the old >>> text. Then the correct version has again been put in place... but with >>> the old date, so no update of the tools.ietf.org webpage has been >>> triggered. >>> >>> Very tricky. >>> >>> >>> Henrik >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> Tools-discuss mailing list >>> Tools-discuss@ietf.org >>> https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/tools-discuss >> >> >> ------------------------------------------------ >> Barbara B. Fuller >> Acting Executive Director >> Internet Engineering Task Force >> >> Natick, Massachusetts Office: >> >> Phone: +1-508-650-4020 >> Fax: +1-508-650-4639 >> >> Reston, Virginia Office: >> >> Phone: +1-703-620-9053 >> Fax: +1-703-620-9071 > > --------------enigC3712B238B3A6791AD534479 Content-Type: application/pgp-signature; name="signature.asc" Content-Description: OpenPGP digital signature Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="signature.asc" -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.4.1 (GNU/Linux) iD8DBQFDZ+MGeVhrtTJkXCMRApo8AJ4vObDDzhA8Y0xRErdBXk8GURNC9wCggqr4 8hjG5ZxA1GfjRzQ38+8jX40= =OBKe -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --------------enigC3712B238B3A6791AD534479-- --===============0559678507== Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline _______________________________________________ Tools-discuss mailing list Tools-discuss@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/tools-discuss --===============0559678507==-- From tools-discuss-bounces@ietf.org Wed Nov 02 00:29:11 2005 Received: from localhost.cnri.reston.va.us ([127.0.0.1] helo=megatron.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1EXBBP-0005F4-Ak; Wed, 02 Nov 2005 00:29:11 -0500 Received: from odin.ietf.org ([132.151.1.176] helo=ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1EXBBL-0005Eu-7O for tools-discuss@megatron.ietf.org; Wed, 02 Nov 2005 00:29:09 -0500 Received: from ietf-mx.ietf.org (ietf-mx [132.151.6.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id AAA11788 for ; Wed, 2 Nov 2005 00:28:45 -0500 (EST) Received: from av9-2-sn3.vrr.skanova.net ([81.228.9.186]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1EXBPr-0006cA-14 for tools-discuss@ietf.org; Wed, 02 Nov 2005 00:44:08 -0500 Received: by av9-2-sn3.vrr.skanova.net (Postfix, from userid 502) id 24A6C38049; Wed, 2 Nov 2005 06:28:51 +0100 (CET) Received: from smtp3-2-sn3.vrr.skanova.net (smtp3-2-sn3.vrr.skanova.net [81.228.9.102]) by av9-2-sn3.vrr.skanova.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 03D1438049; Wed, 2 Nov 2005 06:28:51 +0100 (CET) Received: from shiraz.levkowetz.com (81-224-201-50-no45.tbcn.telia.com [81.224.201.50]) by smtp3-2-sn3.vrr.skanova.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 84D3037E43; Wed, 2 Nov 2005 06:28:50 +0100 (CET) Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]) by shiraz.levkowetz.com with esmtp (Exim 4.54) id 1EXBB4-0001yu-2C; Wed, 02 Nov 2005 06:28:50 +0100 Message-ID: <43684E90.30908@levkowetz.com> Date: Wed, 02 Nov 2005 06:28:48 +0100 From: Henrik Levkowetz User-Agent: Mozilla Thunderbird 1.0.7 (Macintosh/20050923) X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Tools Team Discussion X-Enigmail-Version: 0.93.0.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-SA-Exim-Connect-IP: 127.0.0.1 X-SA-Exim-Mail-From: henrik@levkowetz.com X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No (on shiraz.levkowetz.com); SAEximRunCond expanded to false X-Spam-Score: 0.1 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 798b2e660f1819ae38035ac1d8d5e3ab Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Cc: Brian E Carpenter Subject: [Tools-discuss] IPv6 access for tools.ietf.org X-BeenThere: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF Tools Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: tools-discuss-bounces@ietf.org Errors-To: tools-discuss-bounces@ietf.org Hi, I've had an IPv6 connection up to one of the tools servers for a few weeks now, through sixxs.net - thanks to Jeroen Massar, also now on the tools team, for facilitating that!. However, I only got around to setting up the IPv6 subnet and switching the web server over from Apache 1.3 to 2.0 (which is IPv6 enabled) during the weekend. As I've now checked the logs, and seen IPv6 accesses in the logs (from Switzerland, Japan, United States, Greece, Ireland and China) with successful page fetches and browsing, I think I can officially say that the tools web pages are available also over IPv6 :-) The second server should also be IPv6 enabled any day now, for redundancy also on IPv6. Regards, Henrik _______________________________________________ Tools-discuss mailing list Tools-discuss@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/tools-discuss From tools-discuss-bounces@ietf.org Thu Nov 03 11:30:49 2005 Received: from localhost.cnri.reston.va.us ([127.0.0.1] helo=megatron.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1EXhzF-0000lP-2q; Thu, 03 Nov 2005 11:30:49 -0500 Received: from odin.ietf.org ([132.151.1.176] helo=ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1EXhzD-0000jt-8W for tools-discuss@megatron.ietf.org; Thu, 03 Nov 2005 11:30:47 -0500 Received: from ietf-mx.ietf.org (ietf-mx [132.151.6.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id LAA10771 for ; Thu, 3 Nov 2005 11:30:25 -0500 (EST) Received: from main.gmane.org ([80.91.229.2] helo=ciao.gmane.org) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1EXiDx-0001kx-QL for tools-discuss@ietf.org; Thu, 03 Nov 2005 11:46:06 -0500 Received: from list by ciao.gmane.org with local (Exim 4.43) id 1EXhvM-0000YX-UH for tools-discuss@ietf.org; Thu, 03 Nov 2005 17:26:48 +0100 Received: from c-180-161-96.hh.dial.de.ignite.net ([62.180.161.96]) by main.gmane.org with esmtp (Gmexim 0.1 (Debian)) id 1AlnuQ-0007hv-00 for ; Thu, 03 Nov 2005 17:26:48 +0100 Received: from nobody by c-180-161-96.hh.dial.de.ignite.net with local (Gmexim 0.1 (Debian)) id 1AlnuQ-0007hv-00 for ; Thu, 03 Nov 2005 17:26:48 +0100 X-Injected-Via-Gmane: http://gmane.org/ To: tools-discuss@ietf.org From: Frank Ellermann Date: Thu, 03 Nov 2005 17:18:33 +0100 Organization: Lines: 20 Message-ID: <436A3859.65A1@xyzzy.claranet.de> References: <436055A7.5010706@levkowetz.com> <43607480.4827@xyzzy.claranet.de> <4360C6C7.3080403@levkowetz.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Complaints-To: usenet@sea.gmane.org X-Gmane-NNTP-Posting-Host: c-180-161-96.hh.dial.de.ignite.net X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0 (OS/2; U) X-Spam-Score: 0.1 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 7d33c50f3756db14428398e2bdedd581 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: [Tools-discuss] rfcmarkup (was: WG-pages v0.60) X-BeenThere: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF Tools Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: tools-discuss-bounces@ietf.org Errors-To: tools-discuss-bounces@ietf.org Henrik Levkowetz wrote: >>> http://tools.ietf.org/tools/rfcmarkup/rfcmarkup.cgi?rfc=2026 Maybe a stupid idea: I often need short URLs, and for that I create redirections like http://purl.net/xyzzy/-ietf/ltru - the last part then goes into a parameter of the real tracker URL. With rfcmarkup a guess= parameter could try to "do what I mean" - for a number try RfC, if it starts with draft- try draft, and otherwise bite. You could do lots of fun stuff behind the scenes, e.g. a cache for the most popular drafts and RfCs, and later a page showing the top 100 drafts and RfCs based on rfcmarkup cache hits. Please add this new Web service also on the "all tools" page. Bye, Frank _______________________________________________ Tools-discuss mailing list Tools-discuss@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/tools-discuss From tools-discuss-bounces@ietf.org Thu Nov 03 13:48:09 2005 Received: from localhost.cnri.reston.va.us ([127.0.0.1] helo=megatron.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1EXk89-0008LC-7K; Thu, 03 Nov 2005 13:48:09 -0500 Received: from odin.ietf.org ([132.151.1.176] helo=ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1EXk87-0008KI-A2 for tools-discuss@megatron.ietf.org; Thu, 03 Nov 2005 13:48:07 -0500 Received: from ietf-mx.ietf.org (ietf-mx [132.151.6.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id NAA19807 for ; Thu, 3 Nov 2005 13:47:44 -0500 (EST) Received: from av9-1-sn2.hy.skanova.net ([81.228.8.179]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1EXkMw-0000K1-Og for tools-discuss@ietf.org; Thu, 03 Nov 2005 14:03:28 -0500 Received: by av9-1-sn2.hy.skanova.net (Postfix, from userid 502) id 205B637E50; Thu, 3 Nov 2005 19:47:45 +0100 (CET) Received: from smtp4-2-sn2.hy.skanova.net (smtp4-2-sn2.hy.skanova.net [81.228.8.93]) by av9-1-sn2.hy.skanova.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0643737E49; Thu, 3 Nov 2005 19:47:45 +0100 (CET) Received: from shiraz.levkowetz.com (81-224-201-50-no45.tbcn.telia.com [81.224.201.50]) by smtp4-2-sn2.hy.skanova.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id EA4B337E44; Thu, 3 Nov 2005 19:47:44 +0100 (CET) Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]) by shiraz.levkowetz.com with esmtp (Exim 4.54) id 1EXk7j-0004hk-P3; Thu, 03 Nov 2005 19:47:43 +0100 Message-ID: <436A5B4F.9020600@levkowetz.com> Date: Thu, 03 Nov 2005 19:47:43 +0100 From: Henrik Levkowetz User-Agent: Mozilla Thunderbird 1.0.7 (Macintosh/20050923) X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Frank Ellermann Subject: Re: [Tools-discuss] rfcmarkup References: <436055A7.5010706@levkowetz.com> <43607480.4827@xyzzy.claranet.de> <4360C6C7.3080403@levkowetz.com> <436A3859.65A1@xyzzy.claranet.de> In-Reply-To: <436A3859.65A1@xyzzy.claranet.de> X-Enigmail-Version: 0.93.0.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-SA-Exim-Connect-IP: 127.0.0.1 X-SA-Exim-Mail-From: henrik@levkowetz.com X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No (on shiraz.levkowetz.com); SAEximRunCond expanded to false X-Spam-Score: 0.1 (/) X-Scan-Signature: e5ba305d0e64821bf3d8bc5d3bb07228 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Cc: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-BeenThere: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF Tools Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: tools-discuss-bounces@ietf.org Errors-To: tools-discuss-bounces@ietf.org Hi Frank, on 2005-11-03 17:18 Frank Ellermann said the following: > Henrik Levkowetz wrote: > >>>> http://tools.ietf.org/tools/rfcmarkup/rfcmarkup.cgi?rfc=2026 > > Maybe a stupid idea: I often need short URLs, and for that I > create redirections like http://purl.net/xyzzy/-ietf/ltru - the > last part then goes into a parameter of the real tracker URL. > > With rfcmarkup a guess= parameter could try to "do what I mean" > - for a number try RfC, if it starts with draft- try draft, and > otherwise bite. Sounds like a good idea. I'll add that in the next release. > You could do lots of fun stuff behind the scenes, e.g. a cache > for the most popular drafts and RfCs, and later a page showing > the top 100 drafts and RfCs based on rfcmarkup cache hits. Yes :-) > Please add this new Web service also on the "all tools" page. Done. Regards, Henrik _______________________________________________ Tools-discuss mailing list Tools-discuss@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/tools-discuss From tools-discuss-bounces@ietf.org Sat Nov 05 17:02:22 2005 Received: from localhost.cnri.reston.va.us ([127.0.0.1] helo=megatron.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1EYW7C-0002tw-AN; Sat, 05 Nov 2005 17:02:22 -0500 Received: from odin.ietf.org ([132.151.1.176] helo=ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1EYW7B-0002tr-2C for tools-discuss@megatron.ietf.org; Sat, 05 Nov 2005 17:02:21 -0500 Received: from ietf-mx.ietf.org (ietf-mx [132.151.6.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id RAA22675 for ; Sat, 5 Nov 2005 17:01:54 -0500 (EST) Received: from mtagate2.uk.ibm.com ([195.212.29.135]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1EYWMP-0004v6-9N for tools-discuss@ietf.org; Sat, 05 Nov 2005 17:18:06 -0500 Received: from d06nrmr1407.portsmouth.uk.ibm.com (d06nrmr1407.portsmouth.uk.ibm.com [9.149.38.185]) by mtagate2.uk.ibm.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id jA5M26cO073544 for ; Sat, 5 Nov 2005 22:02:06 GMT Received: from d06av03.portsmouth.uk.ibm.com (d06av03.portsmouth.uk.ibm.com [9.149.37.213]) by d06nrmr1407.portsmouth.uk.ibm.com (8.12.10/NCO/VERS6.7) with ESMTP id jA5M2640212372 for ; Sat, 5 Nov 2005 22:02:06 GMT Received: from d06av03.portsmouth.uk.ibm.com (loopback [127.0.0.1]) by d06av03.portsmouth.uk.ibm.com (8.12.11/8.13.3) with ESMTP id jA5M25D4003921 for ; Sat, 5 Nov 2005 22:02:06 GMT Received: from sihl.zurich.ibm.com (sihl.zurich.ibm.com [9.4.16.232]) by d06av03.portsmouth.uk.ibm.com (8.12.11/8.12.11) with ESMTP id jA5M25Cd003914 for ; Sat, 5 Nov 2005 22:02:05 GMT Received: from zurich.ibm.com (sig-9-146-216-209.de.ibm.com [9.146.216.209]) by sihl.zurich.ibm.com (AIX4.3/8.9.3p2/8.9.3) with ESMTP id XAA57520 for ; Sat, 5 Nov 2005 23:02:04 +0100 Message-ID: <436D2BD9.10902@zurich.ibm.com> Date: Sat, 05 Nov 2005 23:02:01 +0100 From: Brian E Carpenter Organization: IBM User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.1; en-US; rv:1.6) Gecko/20040113 X-Accept-Language: en, fr, de MIME-Version: 1.0 To: tools-discuss@ietf.org Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Scan-Signature: ffa9dfbbe7cc58b3fa6b8ae3e57b0aa3 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: [Tools-discuss] Page-per-draft X-BeenThere: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF Tools Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: tools-discuss-bounces@ietf.org Errors-To: tools-discuss-bounces@ietf.org I found myself sitting at breakfast last week with an IBM colleague who is active in the W3C and very occasionally needs to dabble in the IETF. He recently wanted to make some comments on an IETF draft. He told me it was a real pain, because even knowing the name of the draft he couldn't easily find out the real status of the draft and where comments should be sent. Now this isn't a problem for us because we know enough about the IETF process to track this down. It took him quite a while to even find the I-D tracker (er, not obvious on the home page) and to click through it to find the status. Even then it isn't obvious to an occasional user where to send comments. So, his suggestion is a home page per draft on which the metadata would be marshalled appropriately to give information like current status, and where to send comments (according to that status). The WG pages don't quite do it, because they assume you know the name of the relevant WG, and independent submissions aren't taken care of. This would be http://tools.ietf.org/id/ on steroids :-) Brian _______________________________________________ Tools-discuss mailing list Tools-discuss@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/tools-discuss From tools-discuss-bounces@ietf.org Sun Nov 06 21:40:44 2005 Received: from localhost.cnri.reston.va.us ([127.0.0.1] helo=megatron.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1EYww8-0003dY-Gm; Sun, 06 Nov 2005 21:40:44 -0500 Received: from odin.ietf.org ([132.151.1.176] helo=ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1EYww4-0003bU-UM for tools-discuss@megatron.ietf.org; Sun, 06 Nov 2005 21:40:43 -0500 Received: from ietf-mx.ietf.org (ietf-mx [132.151.6.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id VAA06603 for ; Sun, 6 Nov 2005 21:40:16 -0500 (EST) Received: from sj-iport-4.cisco.com ([171.68.10.86]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1EYxBa-0004E9-DD for tools-discuss@ietf.org; Sun, 06 Nov 2005 21:56:43 -0500 Received: from sj-core-1.cisco.com ([171.71.177.237]) by sj-iport-4.cisco.com with ESMTP; 06 Nov 2005 18:40:30 -0800 Received: from imail.cisco.com (imail.cisco.com [128.107.200.91]) by sj-core-1.cisco.com (8.12.10/8.12.6) with ESMTP id jA72eSNl003634; Sun, 6 Nov 2005 18:40:28 -0800 (PST) Received: from [209.52.107.183] (sjc-vpn6-556.cisco.com [10.21.122.44]) by imail.cisco.com (8.12.11/8.12.10) with ESMTP id jA72nhKl011363; Sun, 6 Nov 2005 18:49:43 -0800 In-Reply-To: <436D2BD9.10902@zurich.ibm.com> References: <436D2BD9.10902@zurich.ibm.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v746.2) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; delsp=yes; format=flowed Message-Id: <893F084C-5667-4ABE-A509-92D9E63C5FD3@cisco.com> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: Fred Baker Subject: Re: [Tools-discuss] Page-per-draft Date: Sun, 6 Nov 2005 18:40:25 -0800 To: Brian E Carpenter X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.746.2) DKIM-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; l=1569; t=1131331784; x=1131763984; c=nowsp; s=nebraska; h=Subject:From:Date:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding; d=cisco.com; i=fred@cisco.com; z=Subject:Re=3A=20[Tools-discuss]=20Page-per-draft| From:Fred=20Baker=20| Date:Sun,=206=20Nov=202005=2018=3A40=3A25=20-0800| Content-Type:text/plain=3B=20charset=3DUS-ASCII=3B=20delsp=3Dyes=3B=20format=3Dflowed| Content-Transfer-Encoding:7bit; b=j0+PyovdHDBACMYk3QMgTAHVIBX0LfDwNyP7ppRJ7xFrXnhVhZjvaLmG4UsIqgQ14KwzX8ZD bl/6/S4SU8S1n5PhCTzDgUqMp8H5DX3KfDnjS7z2a7YNuttUGk2zvxnuUlCfvTdLHoM4Z5iPFCF wbInl2wZru+L6/k9vgjvLYng= Authentication-Results: imail.cisco.com; header.From=fred@cisco.com; dkim=pass ( message from cisco.com verified; ); X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Scan-Signature: cab78e1e39c4b328567edb48482b6a69 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Cc: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-BeenThere: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF Tools Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: tools-discuss-bounces@ietf.org Errors-To: tools-discuss-bounces@ietf.org In my humble opinion, there should be something that tracks a draft from cradle to grave, and contains such info. What we have right now mostly tracks the IESG process; it has no hooks for the WG process, managing comments against drafts, etc. Realizing that "wanting" is a distance from "having", we probably want to pick a more diable target. But count me as generally supportive of this. On Nov 5, 2005, at 2:02 PM, Brian E Carpenter wrote: > I found myself sitting at breakfast last week with an > IBM colleague who is active in the W3C and very occasionally > needs to dabble in the IETF. He recently wanted to make some > comments on an IETF draft. He told me it was a real pain, > because even knowing the name of the draft he couldn't easily > find out the real status of the draft and where comments > should be sent. Now this isn't a problem for us because we know > enough about the IETF process to track this down. It took him > quite a while to even find the I-D tracker (er, not obvious > on the home page) and to click through it to find the status. > Even then it isn't obvious to an occasional user where to send > comments. > > So, his suggestion is a home page per draft on which the metadata > would be marshalled appropriately to give information like > current status, and where to send comments (according to that > status). > > The WG pages don't quite do it, because they assume you know > the name of the relevant WG, and independent submissions aren't > taken care of. > > This would be http://tools.ietf.org/id/ on steroids :-) > > Brian > > > _______________________________________________ > Tools-discuss mailing list > Tools-discuss@ietf.org > https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/tools-discuss -------------------------------------------------------------- "Don't worry about the world coming to an end today. It's already tomorrow in Australia." (Charles Schulz ) _______________________________________________ Tools-discuss mailing list Tools-discuss@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/tools-discuss From tools-discuss-bounces@ietf.org Mon Nov 07 10:58:26 2005 Received: from localhost.cnri.reston.va.us ([127.0.0.1] helo=megatron.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1EZ9O6-0008Vz-AF; Mon, 07 Nov 2005 10:58:26 -0500 Received: from odin.ietf.org ([132.151.1.176] helo=ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1EZ9O3-0008Vu-Bn for tools-discuss@megatron.ietf.org; Mon, 07 Nov 2005 10:58:25 -0500 Received: from ietf-mx.ietf.org (ietf-mx [132.151.6.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id KAA19009 for ; Mon, 7 Nov 2005 10:57:58 -0500 (EST) Received: from e4.ny.us.ibm.com ([32.97.182.144]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1EZ9df-00087K-Fs for tools-discuss@ietf.org; Mon, 07 Nov 2005 11:14:33 -0500 Received: from d01relay04.pok.ibm.com (d01relay04.pok.ibm.com [9.56.227.236]) by e4.ny.us.ibm.com (8.12.11/8.12.11) with ESMTP id jA7FwAET004562 for ; Mon, 7 Nov 2005 10:58:10 -0500 Received: from d01av02.pok.ibm.com (d01av02.pok.ibm.com [9.56.224.216]) by d01relay04.pok.ibm.com (8.12.10/NCO/VERS6.7) with ESMTP id jA7FwAqu109120 for ; Mon, 7 Nov 2005 10:58:10 -0500 Received: from d01av02.pok.ibm.com (loopback [127.0.0.1]) by d01av02.pok.ibm.com (8.12.11/8.13.3) with ESMTP id jA7FwAkQ025369 for ; Mon, 7 Nov 2005 10:58:10 -0500 Received: from cichlid.raleigh.ibm.com (sig-9-65-211-130.mts.ibm.com [9.65.211.130]) by d01av02.pok.ibm.com (8.12.11/8.12.11) with ESMTP id jA7Fw8Kt025230; Mon, 7 Nov 2005 10:58:09 -0500 Received: from cichlid.raleigh.ibm.com (localhost.localdomain [127.0.0.1]) by cichlid.raleigh.ibm.com (8.13.1/8.12.5) with ESMTP id jA7Fw7kJ032589; Mon, 7 Nov 2005 10:58:07 -0500 Message-Id: <200511071558.jA7Fw7kJ032589@cichlid.raleigh.ibm.com> To: Brian E Carpenter Subject: Re: [Tools-discuss] Page-per-draft In-Reply-To: Message from Brian E Carpenter of "Sat, 05 Nov 2005 23:02:01 +0100." <436D2BD9.10902@zurich.ibm.com> Date: Mon, 07 Nov 2005 07:58:07 -0800 From: Thomas Narten X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 79899194edc4f33a41f49410777972f8 Cc: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-BeenThere: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF Tools Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: tools-discuss-bounces@ietf.org Errors-To: tools-discuss-bounces@ietf.org > So, his suggestion is a home page per draft on which the metadata > would be marshalled appropriately to give information like > current status, and where to send comments (according to that > status). Good suggestion. But the details are tricky, because some of the meta data is not actually part of the draft today. I.e., where to send comments to. For non-WG documents, that info is sometimes in the document, but its not required and there is no standard for indicating that (that could be turned into meta data). > The WG pages don't quite do it, because they assume you know > the name of the relevant WG, and independent submissions aren't > taken care of. This tool would be a useful way also of indicating whether a document is even a WG document. That info is currently available, but one has to be an insider to know how to figure this out. Thomas _______________________________________________ Tools-discuss mailing list Tools-discuss@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/tools-discuss From tools-discuss-bounces@ietf.org Mon Nov 07 12:14:07 2005 Received: from localhost.cnri.reston.va.us ([127.0.0.1] helo=megatron.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1EZAZL-0006Up-PU; Mon, 07 Nov 2005 12:14:07 -0500 Received: from odin.ietf.org ([132.151.1.176] helo=ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1EZAZH-0006UU-9D for tools-discuss@megatron.ietf.org; Mon, 07 Nov 2005 12:14:05 -0500 Received: from ietf-mx.ietf.org (ietf-mx [132.151.6.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id MAA23217 for ; Mon, 7 Nov 2005 12:13:37 -0500 (EST) Received: from sj-iport-5.cisco.com ([171.68.10.87]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1EZAov-0001jS-Be for tools-discuss@ietf.org; Mon, 07 Nov 2005 12:30:13 -0500 Received: from sj-core-3.cisco.com ([171.68.223.137]) by sj-iport-5.cisco.com with ESMTP; 07 Nov 2005 09:13:53 -0800 X-IronPort-AV: i="3.97,301,1125903600"; d="scan'208"; a="227871510:sNHT25710024" Received: from imail.cisco.com (imail.cisco.com [128.107.200.91]) by sj-core-3.cisco.com (8.12.10/8.12.6) with ESMTP id jA7HDkQQ007894; Mon, 7 Nov 2005 09:13:47 -0800 (PST) Received: from [209.52.107.183] (sjc-vpn4-528.cisco.com [10.21.82.16]) by imail.cisco.com (8.12.11/8.12.10) with ESMTP id jA7HN483016166; Mon, 7 Nov 2005 09:23:04 -0800 In-Reply-To: <200511071558.jA7Fw7kJ032589@cichlid.raleigh.ibm.com> References: <200511071558.jA7Fw7kJ032589@cichlid.raleigh.ibm.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v746.2) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; delsp=yes; format=flowed Message-Id: <533CAF17-F23C-40AD-AED1-DDB21BD83A52@cisco.com> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: Fred Baker Subject: Re: [Tools-discuss] Page-per-draft Date: Mon, 7 Nov 2005 09:13:48 -0800 To: Thomas Narten X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.746.2) DKIM-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; l=1342; t=1131384184; x=1131816384; c=nowsp; s=nebraska; h=Subject:From:Date:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding; d=cisco.com; i=fred@cisco.com; z=Subject:Re=3A=20[Tools-discuss]=20Page-per-draft=20| From:Fred=20Baker=20| Date:Mon,=207=20Nov=202005=2009=3A13=3A48=20-0800| Content-Type:text/plain=3B=20charset=3DUS-ASCII=3B=20delsp=3Dyes=3B=20format=3Dflowed| Content-Transfer-Encoding:7bit; b=YEPQDdMa0TjJTTeAP72x0MjFfxGFiOVUgC4IfY3zCZB1d5veu7lnANochQhK6uV/mJB4Adx9 s4TzTMR7u8LxmwgUfZ46tkE0XJPXZae2WRT6fzWpdhvDsogdkqL4EwKqRI8sc6/ApLkZuOhL9Mv Y79qASqfuTEAA3/pys96Zykk= Authentication-Results: imail.cisco.com; header.From=fred@cisco.com; dkim=pass ( message from cisco.com verified; ); X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 9ed51c9d1356100bce94f1ae4ec616a9 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Cc: Brian E Carpenter , tools-discuss@ietf.org X-BeenThere: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF Tools Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: tools-discuss-bounces@ietf.org Errors-To: tools-discuss-bounces@ietf.org ok, so going off to a previous thread - if we had a web page that a user could use to submit a draft (such as perhaps running the XML2RFC tool for him), the necessary information could be requested on the web page: - email list for discussion/comment - date of initial submission - context (WG, individual, etc) - picture of the author's dog On Nov 7, 2005, at 7:58 AM, Thomas Narten wrote: >> So, his suggestion is a home page per draft on which the metadata >> would be marshalled appropriately to give information like >> current status, and where to send comments (according to that >> status). > > Good suggestion. But the details are tricky, because some of the meta > data is not actually part of the draft today. I.e., where to send > comments to. For non-WG documents, that info is sometimes in the > document, but its not required and there is no standard for indicating > that (that could be turned into meta data). > >> The WG pages don't quite do it, because they assume you know >> the name of the relevant WG, and independent submissions aren't >> taken care of. > > This tool would be a useful way also of indicating whether a document > is even a WG document. That info is currently available, but one has > to be an insider to know how to figure this out. > > Thomas > > _______________________________________________ > Tools-discuss mailing list > Tools-discuss@ietf.org > https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/tools-discuss -------------------------------------------------------------- "Don't worry about the world coming to an end today. It's already tomorrow in Australia." (Charles Schulz ) _______________________________________________ Tools-discuss mailing list Tools-discuss@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/tools-discuss From tools-discuss-bounces@ietf.org Mon Nov 07 12:35:01 2005 Received: from localhost.cnri.reston.va.us ([127.0.0.1] helo=megatron.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1EZAtZ-0003YR-GJ; Mon, 07 Nov 2005 12:35:01 -0500 Received: from odin.ietf.org ([132.151.1.176] helo=ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1EZAtW-0003Y8-36 for tools-discuss@megatron.ietf.org; Mon, 07 Nov 2005 12:35:00 -0500 Received: from ietf-mx.ietf.org (ietf-mx [132.151.6.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id MAA24278 for ; Mon, 7 Nov 2005 12:34:32 -0500 (EST) Received: from cabernet.verkstad.net ([192.36.157.99] helo=localhost.localdomain) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1EZB9A-0002Hl-6T for tools-discuss@ietf.org; Mon, 07 Nov 2005 12:51:08 -0500 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1] ident=henrik) by localhost.localdomain with esmtp (Exim 4.54) id 1EZAtL-0005gh-5s; Mon, 07 Nov 2005 18:34:47 +0100 Message-ID: <436F9033.5000704@levkowetz.com> Date: Mon, 07 Nov 2005 09:34:43 -0800 From: Henrik Levkowetz User-Agent: Mozilla Thunderbird 1.0.7 (Macintosh/20050923) X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Brian E Carpenter Subject: Re: [Tools-discuss] Page-per-draft References: <436D2BD9.10902@zurich.ibm.com> In-Reply-To: <436D2BD9.10902@zurich.ibm.com> X-Enigmail-Version: 0.93.0.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Spam-Score: 2.0 (++) X-Scan-Signature: d185fa790257f526fedfd5d01ed9c976 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Cc: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-BeenThere: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF Tools Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: tools-discuss-bounces@ietf.org Errors-To: tools-discuss-bounces@ietf.org on 2005-11-05 14:02 Brian E Carpenter said the following: > I found myself sitting at breakfast last week with an > IBM colleague who is active in the W3C and very occasionally > needs to dabble in the IETF. He recently wanted to make some > comments on an IETF draft. He told me it was a real pain, > because even knowing the name of the draft he couldn't easily > find out the real status of the draft and where comments > should be sent. Now this isn't a problem for us because we know > enough about the IETF process to track this down. It took him > quite a while to even find the I-D tracker (er, not obvious > on the home page) and to click through it to find the status. > Even then it isn't obvious to an occasional user where to send > comments. > > So, his suggestion is a home page per draft on which the metadata > would be marshalled appropriately to give information like > current status, and where to send comments (according to that > status). Good idea. As I now have sufficient space on the servers for this, I'll get it under way. > The WG pages don't quite do it, because they assume you know > the name of the relevant WG, and independent submissions aren't > taken care of. > > This would be http://tools.ietf.org/id/ on steroids :-) Right. I'll think about integrating it with that tool, or making it a separate thing - I have an idea about possible integration, but will have to test it and see if it works out right. [Fred] > In my humble opinion, there should be something that tracks a draft > from cradle to grave, and contains such info. What we have right now > mostly tracks the IESG process; it has no hooks for the WG process, > managing comments against drafts, etc. Realizing that "wanting" is a > distance from "having", we probably want to pick a more diable > target. But count me as generally supportive of this. Right. Putting in place a nice view / presentation of the current information would be a first target; being able to input additional information might be a new tool, or an extension of the tracker. (And any such additional information should also show up in the per-document view. [Thomas] > Good suggestion. But the details are tricky, because some of the meta > data is not actually part of the draft today. I.e., where to send > comments to. For non-WG documents, that info is sometimes in the > document, but its not required and there is no standard for indicating > that (that could be turned into meta data). Right. That is certainly a problem. One first approximation could be the WG list for WG documents, and the author email addresses for the non-WG documents. All this information is currently available; but if the document specifies a different list than the WG list for WG docs, or a list instead of individual author addresses, that won't be reflected in the presented meta-information. Once the draft submission tool is in place, that will provide a nice point to capture such meta-information. >>> The WG pages don't quite do it, because they assume you know >>> the name of the relevant WG, and independent submissions aren't >>> taken care of. > > > This tool would be a useful way also of indicating whether a document > is even a WG document. That info is currently available, but one has > to be an insider to know how to figure this out. Right! Good point. Henrik _______________________________________________ Tools-discuss mailing list Tools-discuss@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/tools-discuss From tools-discuss-bounces@ietf.org Mon Nov 07 17:21:41 2005 Received: from localhost.cnri.reston.va.us ([127.0.0.1] helo=megatron.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1EZFMz-0007hn-Du; Mon, 07 Nov 2005 17:21:41 -0500 Received: from odin.ietf.org ([132.151.1.176] helo=ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1EZFMx-0007gI-Kd for tools-discuss@megatron.ietf.org; Mon, 07 Nov 2005 17:21:39 -0500 Received: from ietf-mx.ietf.org (ietf-mx [132.151.6.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id RAA11784 for ; Mon, 7 Nov 2005 17:21:14 -0500 (EST) Received: from p130.piuha.net ([193.234.218.130]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1EZFcd-0002C6-AQ for tools-discuss@ietf.org; Mon, 07 Nov 2005 17:37:52 -0500 Received: from [127.0.0.1] (p130.piuha.net [193.234.218.130]) by p130.piuha.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 984FF89863 for ; Tue, 8 Nov 2005 00:21:21 +0200 (EET) Message-ID: <436FC4D2.3030307@piuha.net> Date: Mon, 07 Nov 2005 23:19:14 +0200 From: Jari Arkko User-Agent: Mozilla Thunderbird 1.0 (X11/20041206) X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: IETF TOOLS discussion Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 798b2e660f1819ae38035ac1d8d5e3ab Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: [Tools-discuss] drafts trivia X-BeenThere: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF Tools Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: tools-discuss-bounces@ietf.org Errors-To: tools-discuss-bounces@ietf.org I made a small tool couple of weeks ago to run some statistics on drafts and people who write them. This includes things like how many pages drafts have, statistics on version numbers, who are the authors who write most drafts, what company or country drafts come from etc. Mostly trivia, but it may have at least entertainment value. The data is available here: http://www.arkko.com/tools/stats/index.html Note that there hasn't been all that much testing and verification of the data produced by this. There could be errors. In fact, we know there are errors. This is largely based on heuristics about what author sections in drafts/RFCs look like, and an attempt to parse, e.g., country and e-mail domain information to figure out affiliation and location. --Jari _______________________________________________ Tools-discuss mailing list Tools-discuss@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/tools-discuss From tools-discuss-bounces@ietf.org Mon Nov 07 20:52:31 2005 Received: from localhost.cnri.reston.va.us ([127.0.0.1] helo=megatron.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1EZIf1-0002VE-3S; Mon, 07 Nov 2005 20:52:31 -0500 Received: from odin.ietf.org ([132.151.1.176] helo=ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1EZIf0-0002UA-2p for tools-discuss@megatron.ietf.org; Mon, 07 Nov 2005 20:52:30 -0500 Received: from ietf-mx.ietf.org (ietf-mx [132.151.6.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id UAA00393 for ; Mon, 7 Nov 2005 20:52:03 -0500 (EST) Received: from netcore.fi ([193.94.160.1]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1EZIug-0001s6-EC for tools-discuss@ietf.org; Mon, 07 Nov 2005 21:08:45 -0500 Received: from localhost (pekkas@localhost) by netcore.fi (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id jA81qHw07182 for ; Tue, 8 Nov 2005 03:52:17 +0200 Date: Tue, 8 Nov 2005 03:52:17 +0200 (EET) From: Pekka Savola To: tools-discuss@ietf.org Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Scan-Signature: d6b246023072368de71562c0ab503126 Subject: [Tools-discuss] Tracking IANA's tokens for RFC-ed docs? X-BeenThere: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF Tools Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: tools-discuss-bounces@ietf.org Errors-To: tools-discuss-bounces@ietf.org Hi, Recently I noticed that when some documents stay long (e.g., 6 months) in IANA state when they're in RFC-editor's queue, the reason may actually be that the token is at IAB's or IESG's court (e.g., because they want/need to discuss the assignment). There doesn't seem to be any public way to track this so there would be better transparency to who has the token (and how long). This would be a nice addition to Bill Fenner's analysis and data mining tools. Would it be possible (to get infrastructure in place) to track what IANA thinks the status of the pending assignment is? -- Pekka Savola "You each name yourselves king, yet the Netcore Oy kingdom bleeds." Systems. Networks. Security. -- George R.R. Martin: A Clash of Kings _______________________________________________ Tools-discuss mailing list Tools-discuss@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/tools-discuss From tools-discuss-bounces@ietf.org Tue Nov 08 10:37:10 2005 Received: from localhost.cnri.reston.va.us ([127.0.0.1] helo=megatron.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1EZVX4-0002E9-C2; Tue, 08 Nov 2005 10:37:10 -0500 Received: from odin.ietf.org ([132.151.1.176] helo=ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1EZVX0-0002Dw-9s for tools-discuss@megatron.ietf.org; Tue, 08 Nov 2005 10:37:08 -0500 Received: from ietf-mx.ietf.org (ietf-mx [132.151.6.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id KAA12123 for ; Tue, 8 Nov 2005 10:36:38 -0500 (EST) Received: from [192.20.225.112] (helo=mail-yellow.research.att.com) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1EZVmp-0006zu-8d for tools-discuss@ietf.org; Tue, 08 Nov 2005 10:53:28 -0500 Received: from bright.research.att.com (bright.research.att.com [135.207.20.189]) by mail-blue.research.att.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 019EC147AE4; Tue, 8 Nov 2005 10:36:56 -0500 (EST) Received: (from fenner@localhost) by bright.research.att.com (8.12.11/8.12.10/Submit) id jA8FarOf014987; Tue, 8 Nov 2005 07:36:53 -0800 From: Bill Fenner Message-Id: <200511081536.jA8FarOf014987@bright.research.att.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII To: Pekka Savola Subject: Re: [Tools-discuss] Tracking IANA's tokens for RFC-ed docs? Date: Tue, 8 Nov 2005 07:36:53 -0800 Versions: dmail (linux) 2.7/makemail 2.14 X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Scan-Signature: d17f825e43c9aed4fd65b7edddddec89 Cc: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-BeenThere: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF Tools Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: tools-discuss-bounces@ietf.org Errors-To: tools-discuss-bounces@ietf.org >Would it be possible (to get infrastructure in place) to track what >IANA thinks the status of the pending assignment is? I'm mirroring http://www.iana.org/draft-status/draft-queue-status-all.html daily, but haven't gotten around to mining anything out of it. Can you give me an example of a document that you'd like to track, to see if the information that you want is in my mirror? Bill _______________________________________________ Tools-discuss mailing list Tools-discuss@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/tools-discuss From tools-discuss-bounces@ietf.org Tue Nov 08 10:50:38 2005 Received: from localhost.cnri.reston.va.us ([127.0.0.1] helo=megatron.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1EZVk6-0007MH-HG; Tue, 08 Nov 2005 10:50:38 -0500 Received: from odin.ietf.org ([132.151.1.176] helo=ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1EZVk4-0007Lc-Q0 for tools-discuss@megatron.ietf.org; Tue, 08 Nov 2005 10:50:36 -0500 Received: from ietf-mx.ietf.org (ietf-mx [132.151.6.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id KAA13717 for ; Tue, 8 Nov 2005 10:50:09 -0500 (EST) Received: from netcore.fi ([193.94.160.1]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1EZVzt-0007in-ID for tools-discuss@ietf.org; Tue, 08 Nov 2005 11:06:59 -0500 Received: from localhost (pekkas@localhost) by netcore.fi (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id jA8FoMq23814; Tue, 8 Nov 2005 17:50:22 +0200 Date: Tue, 8 Nov 2005 17:50:22 +0200 (EET) From: Pekka Savola To: Bill Fenner Subject: Re: [Tools-discuss] Tracking IANA's tokens for RFC-ed docs? In-Reply-To: <200511081536.jA8FarOf014987@bright.research.att.com> Message-ID: References: <200511081536.jA8FarOf014987@bright.research.att.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Scan-Signature: ea4ac80f790299f943f0a53be7e1a21a Cc: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-BeenThere: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF Tools Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: tools-discuss-bounces@ietf.org Errors-To: tools-discuss-bounces@ietf.org On Tue, 8 Nov 2005, Bill Fenner wrote: >> Would it be possible (to get infrastructure in place) to track what >> IANA thinks the status of the pending assignment is? > > I'm mirroring http://www.iana.org/draft-status/draft-queue-status-all.html > daily, but haven't gotten around to mining anything out of it. > > Can you give me an example of a document that you'd like to track, > to see if the information that you want is in my mirror? While the definition of "Waiting on feedback from author(s)" on the site also includes the ADs, IESG, IAB, etc., the IANA doesn't seem to use it except for author's action. I'd look out for "Waiting on feedback from author(s)" and raise a red flag if the doc has been at that stage for e.g., over 30 days. To fix the more generic waiting problem, maybe we'll need to have IANA implement a new state "Waiting on feedback from IETF" (IAB, or something like that) to be able to track non-author timeouts. (The doc I'm interested in is draft-huitema-v6ops-teredo-xx. According to the IANA, it has been waiting for IETF guidance on the assignment for a very long time now - the doc has been at the current status for 5 months.) -- Pekka Savola "You each name yourselves king, yet the Netcore Oy kingdom bleeds." Systems. Networks. Security. -- George R.R. Martin: A Clash of Kings _______________________________________________ Tools-discuss mailing list Tools-discuss@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/tools-discuss From tools-discuss-bounces@ietf.org Wed Nov 09 10:06:59 2005 Received: from localhost.cnri.reston.va.us ([127.0.0.1] helo=megatron.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1EZrXP-0007gw-M7; Wed, 09 Nov 2005 10:06:59 -0500 Received: from odin.ietf.org ([132.151.1.176] helo=ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1EZrXN-0007fr-Sp for tools-discuss@megatron.ietf.org; Wed, 09 Nov 2005 10:06:57 -0500 Received: from ietf-mx.ietf.org (ietf-mx [132.151.6.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id KAA14572 for ; Wed, 9 Nov 2005 10:06:30 -0500 (EST) Received: from netcore.fi ([193.94.160.1]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1EZrnO-00070Y-TL for tools-discuss@ietf.org; Wed, 09 Nov 2005 10:23:32 -0500 Received: from localhost (pekkas@localhost) by netcore.fi (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id jA9F6jv27249; Wed, 9 Nov 2005 17:06:45 +0200 Date: Wed, 9 Nov 2005 17:06:45 +0200 (EET) From: Pekka Savola To: Bill Fenner Subject: Re: [Tools-discuss] Tracking IANA's tokens for RFC-ed docs? In-Reply-To: Message-ID: References: <200511081536.jA8FarOf014987@bright.research.att.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 798b2e660f1819ae38035ac1d8d5e3ab Cc: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-BeenThere: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF Tools Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: tools-discuss-bounces@ietf.org Errors-To: tools-discuss-bounces@ietf.org On Tue, 8 Nov 2005, Pekka Savola wrote: > I'd look out for "Waiting on feedback from author(s)" and raise a red flag if > the doc has been at that stage for e.g., over 30 days. Thinking more, may be a couple of more sanity checks such as, - if a document is in "No IANA actions for this document" but RFC-editor has it in "IANA" stage, there is a problem - if a document is in "RFC-editor" state but RFC-editor has it in "IANA" state, there is a problem. - over 45 (?) days in "Open" state (this should reflect the time it takes to normally get the IANA requests through) - over 60 (?) days in "On hold" state may be an indication of a problem (especially if RFC-editor has this in state "IANA"). -- Pekka Savola "You each name yourselves king, yet the Netcore Oy kingdom bleeds." Systems. Networks. Security. -- George R.R. Martin: A Clash of Kings _______________________________________________ Tools-discuss mailing list Tools-discuss@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/tools-discuss From tools-discuss-bounces@ietf.org Fri Nov 11 12:58:24 2005 Received: from localhost.cnri.reston.va.us ([127.0.0.1] helo=megatron.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1EadAN-0004OU-Ud; Fri, 11 Nov 2005 12:58:23 -0500 Received: from odin.ietf.org ([132.151.1.176] helo=ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1EactN-0006tF-Tu for tools-discuss@megatron.ietf.org; Fri, 11 Nov 2005 12:40:49 -0500 Received: from ietf-mx.ietf.org (ietf-mx [132.151.6.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id MAA22659 for ; Fri, 11 Nov 2005 12:40:20 -0500 (EST) Received: from pp111-192.bctel.ca ([209.52.111.192] helo=dcn236-44.dcn.davis.ca.us) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1Ead9p-00064S-OT for tools-discuss@ietf.org; Fri, 11 Nov 2005 12:57:50 -0500 Received: by dcn236-44.dcn.davis.ca.us (Postfix, from userid 274) id 36ABC11D606; Fri, 11 Nov 2005 09:40:51 -0800 (PST) From: Wes Hardaker To: tools-discuss@ietf.org Organization: Sparta Date: Fri, 11 Nov 2005 09:40:50 -0800 Message-ID: User-Agent: Gnus/5.110003 (No Gnus v0.3) XEmacs/21.4 (Jumbo Shrimp, linux) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Spam-Score: 2.6 (++) X-Scan-Signature: 30ac594df0e66ffa5a93eb4c48bcb014 X-Mailman-Approved-At: Fri, 11 Nov 2005 12:58:22 -0500 Subject: [Tools-discuss] new tool: rfcfind X-BeenThere: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF Tools Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: tools-discuss-bounces@ietf.org Errors-To: tools-discuss-bounces@ietf.org I wrote a tool a while back to search RFC files... Feel free to advertise it, modify it, rewrite it, tell me it's useless, whatever... http://www.hardakers.net/rfcfind/ -- Wes Hardaker Sparta, Inc. _______________________________________________ Tools-discuss mailing list Tools-discuss@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/tools-discuss From tools-discuss-bounces@ietf.org Thu Nov 17 08:41:16 2005 Received: from localhost.cnri.reston.va.us ([127.0.0.1] helo=megatron.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1Eck0q-0004RL-0B; Thu, 17 Nov 2005 08:41:16 -0500 Received: from odin.ietf.org ([132.151.1.176] helo=ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1Eck0o-0004RD-7S for tools-discuss@megatron.ietf.org; Thu, 17 Nov 2005 08:41:14 -0500 Received: from ietf-mx.ietf.org (ietf-mx [132.151.6.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id IAA24289 for ; Thu, 17 Nov 2005 08:40:39 -0500 (EST) Received: from mtagate1.uk.ibm.com ([195.212.29.134]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1EckIR-0002I7-8P for tools-discuss@ietf.org; Thu, 17 Nov 2005 08:59:28 -0500 Received: from d06nrmr1407.portsmouth.uk.ibm.com (d06nrmr1407.portsmouth.uk.ibm.com [9.149.38.185]) by mtagate1.uk.ibm.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id jAHDemD4128864 for ; Thu, 17 Nov 2005 13:40:48 GMT Received: from d06av03.portsmouth.uk.ibm.com (d06av03.portsmouth.uk.ibm.com [9.149.37.213]) by d06nrmr1407.portsmouth.uk.ibm.com (8.12.10/NCO/VERS6.7) with ESMTP id jAHDelOH217018 for ; Thu, 17 Nov 2005 13:40:47 GMT Received: from d06av03.portsmouth.uk.ibm.com (loopback [127.0.0.1]) by d06av03.portsmouth.uk.ibm.com (8.12.11/8.13.3) with ESMTP id jAHDelQT026593 for ; Thu, 17 Nov 2005 13:40:47 GMT Received: from sihl.zurich.ibm.com (sihl.zurich.ibm.com [9.4.16.232]) by d06av03.portsmouth.uk.ibm.com (8.12.11/8.12.11) with ESMTP id jAHDelQT026581 for ; Thu, 17 Nov 2005 13:40:47 GMT Received: from zurich.ibm.com (sig-9-145-133-166.de.ibm.com [9.145.133.166]) by sihl.zurich.ibm.com (AIX4.3/8.9.3p2/8.9.3) with ESMTP id OAA28578 for ; Thu, 17 Nov 2005 14:40:46 +0100 Message-ID: <437C885E.8080808@zurich.ibm.com> Date: Thu, 17 Nov 2005 14:40:46 +0100 From: Brian E Carpenter Organization: IBM User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.1; en-US; rv:1.6) Gecko/20040113 X-Accept-Language: en, fr, de MIME-Version: 1.0 To: tools-discuss@ietf.org References: In-Reply-To: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Spam-Score: 0.1 (/) X-Scan-Signature: cd26b070c2577ac175cd3a6d878c6248 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: [Tools-discuss] Re: I-D ACTION:draft-ietf-tools-draft-info-03.txt X-BeenThere: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF Tools Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: tools-discuss-bounces@ietf.org Errors-To: tools-discuss-bounces@ietf.org Hadn't had a chance to look at the earlier drafts, so these are basic comments. > 3. Scope ... > The interfaces required to locate a draft or correlate information > about multiple drafts are out of scope. That's a problem, because is this very fundamental to draft tracking. I believe these three items must be in scope: Replaces: Replaced by: Grouped with: All of these are currently supported by the I-D tracker. > 6.2.1. Status > 6.5. Draft events I don't see the point of separating these. I think it's necessary and sufficient that each status/state is timestamped with entry/exit timestamps (and BTW, a draft can enter the same state many times, so you could have AD Follow-up: in: 2005-10-25 21:50 out: 2005-10-26 00:51 in: 2005-10-26 21:52 out: 2005-11-14 21:53 in: 2005-11-17 00:49 for a draft currently in state AD Follow-up Also in > 6.2.1. Status ... > An active or expired draft can be in one or more states related to > IESG review activity. These states are not documented here, but > implementations must provide this information using the current state > list and state definitions maintained by IESG. States can have sub-states, so the model needs to be recursive. Not only the IESG generates states, so the framework should allow for states generated by the Author(s), Editor(s), WG Chair(s), WG Secretary, PROTO Shepherd, IESG Shepherd, Secretariat, RFC Editor, and IANA. These can't all be defined in advance but must be possible to add. Incidentally, all of the above actors may need to be associated with the draft, so the framework needs to allow for that too. Alex Rousskov > Appendix A. Comparison with current procedures ... > o Currently, IETF provides only the latest draft version. This > document requires providing all unexpired versions. This change > allows to maintain a change history useful for draft review and > discussion. The change does not seem to contradict written IETF > rules and principles. Actually that depends on how you choose to read the text of RFC 2026 section 2.2. Also, a meaningful history needs access to expired drafts. RFC 2026 requires us to remove expired drafts, so that *is* a rule. Some draft authors really care about this and in some cases have forced all the unofficial archives to remove superseded drafts. It's rare, but it can happen. So I would suggest rethinking this - let's be up front and ask the community to get rid of the rule that expired I-Ds are invisible, with an opt-out clause. Brian _______________________________________________ Tools-discuss mailing list Tools-discuss@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/tools-discuss From tools-discuss-bounces@ietf.org Thu Nov 17 13:38:16 2005 Received: from localhost.cnri.reston.va.us ([127.0.0.1] helo=megatron.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1EcoeG-0004hG-KV; Thu, 17 Nov 2005 13:38:16 -0500 Received: from odin.ietf.org ([132.151.1.176] helo=ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1EcoeF-0004hB-Ek for tools-discuss@megatron.ietf.org; Thu, 17 Nov 2005 13:38:15 -0500 Received: from ietf-mx.ietf.org (ietf-mx [132.151.6.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id NAA12873 for ; Thu, 17 Nov 2005 13:37:40 -0500 (EST) Received: from exprod6og5.obsmtp.com ([64.18.1.125] helo=psmtp.com) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with smtp (Exim 4.43) id 1Ecovt-0004Ll-8z for tools-discuss@ietf.org; Thu, 17 Nov 2005 13:56:32 -0500 Received: from source ([192.150.11.134]) by exprod6ob5.obsmtp.com ([64.18.5.12]) with SMTP; Thu, 17 Nov 2005 10:38:04 PST Received: from inner-relay-3.eur.adobe.com (inner-relay-3.adobe.com [192.150.20.198] (may be forged)) by outbound-smtp-1.corp.adobe.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id jAHIUSPV027420 for ; Thu, 17 Nov 2005 10:30:28 -0800 (PST) Received: from calsj-dev (calsj-dev.corp.adobe.com [153.32.1.193]) by inner-relay-3.eur.adobe.com (8.12.10/8.12.9) with ESMTP id jAHIburu024830 for ; Thu, 17 Nov 2005 10:38:02 -0800 (PST) Received: from calsj-dev (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mailsj-v1.corp.adobe.com (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 2.02 (built Oct 21 2004)) with ESMTP id <0IQ4005R23R8L2@mailsj-v1.corp.adobe.com> for tools-discuss@ietf.org; Thu, 17 Nov 2005 10:37:56 -0800 (PST) Received: from MasinterT43p ([10.7.240.21]) by mailsj-v1.corp.adobe.com (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 2.02 (built Oct 21 2004)) with ESMTP id <0IQ400BSJ3R8X0@mailsj-v1.corp.adobe.com> for tools-discuss@ietf.org; Thu, 17 Nov 2005 10:37:56 -0800 (PST) Date: Thu, 17 Nov 2005 10:38:41 -0800 From: Larry Masinter Subject: RE: [Tools-discuss] Re: I-D ACTION:draft-ietf-tools-draft-info-03.txt In-reply-to: <437C885E.8080808@zurich.ibm.com> To: tools-discuss@ietf.org Message-id: <004c01c5eba6$21dd31d0$1d1796c0@corp.adobe.com> MIME-version: 1.0 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.2180 X-Mailer: Microsoft Office Outlook 11 Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Thread-index: AcXrfME2gDt4N737RQ6ekcIpUZriTQAJ1xBQ X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Scan-Signature: de4f315c9369b71d7dd5909b42224370 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7BIT X-BeenThere: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF Tools Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: tools-discuss-bounces@ietf.org Errors-To: tools-discuss-bounces@ietf.org > .... So I would suggest rethinking this - let's be up front > and ask the community to get rid of the rule that expired I-Ds are > invisible, with an opt-out clause. Perhaps there is some middle ground, between "removing" and "keeping" that could be an option. For example, change it so that trying to access an expired I-D through the web will give you something with a note at the beginning explaining the draft is expired, whether it's been replaced, a pointer to the latest draft or replacement or RFC. After this information (which could always be available), then the text of the (older) draft could be either there or not, depending on IPR rights and opt-out choice. Larry _______________________________________________ Tools-discuss mailing list Tools-discuss@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/tools-discuss From tools-discuss-bounces@ietf.org Fri Nov 18 07:22:06 2005 Received: from localhost.cnri.reston.va.us ([127.0.0.1] helo=megatron.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1Ed5Fm-0006G9-Tp; Fri, 18 Nov 2005 07:22:06 -0500 Received: from odin.ietf.org ([132.151.1.176] helo=ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1Ed5Fk-0006FI-Fh for tools-discuss@megatron.ietf.org; Fri, 18 Nov 2005 07:22:04 -0500 Received: from ietf-mx.ietf.org (ietf-mx [132.151.6.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id HAA13527 for ; Fri, 18 Nov 2005 07:21:24 -0500 (EST) Received: from mtagate2.de.ibm.com ([195.212.29.151]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1Ed5XU-0005tl-Hs for tools-discuss@ietf.org; Fri, 18 Nov 2005 07:40:26 -0500 Received: from d12nrmr1607.megacenter.de.ibm.com (d12nrmr1607.megacenter.de.ibm.com [9.149.167.49]) by mtagate2.de.ibm.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id jAICLm12206866 for ; Fri, 18 Nov 2005 12:21:48 GMT Received: from d12av04.megacenter.de.ibm.com (d12av04.megacenter.de.ibm.com [9.149.165.229]) by d12nrmr1607.megacenter.de.ibm.com (8.12.10/NCO/VERS6.7) with ESMTP id jAICLmOT066630 for ; Fri, 18 Nov 2005 13:21:48 +0100 Received: from d12av04.megacenter.de.ibm.com (loopback [127.0.0.1]) by d12av04.megacenter.de.ibm.com (8.12.11/8.13.3) with ESMTP id jAICLm3i012109 for ; Fri, 18 Nov 2005 13:21:48 +0100 Received: from sihl.zurich.ibm.com (sihl.zurich.ibm.com [9.4.16.232]) by d12av04.megacenter.de.ibm.com (8.12.11/8.12.11) with ESMTP id jAICLlWN012106; Fri, 18 Nov 2005 13:21:48 +0100 Received: from zurich.ibm.com (sig-9-146-220-232.de.ibm.com [9.146.220.232]) by sihl.zurich.ibm.com (AIX4.3/8.9.3p2/8.9.3) with ESMTP id NAA80550; Fri, 18 Nov 2005 13:21:47 +0100 Message-ID: <437DC75A.4040006@zurich.ibm.com> Date: Fri, 18 Nov 2005 13:21:46 +0100 From: Brian E Carpenter Organization: IBM User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.1; en-US; rv:1.6) Gecko/20040113 X-Accept-Language: en, fr, de MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Larry Masinter Subject: Re: [Tools-discuss] Re: I-D ACTION:draft-ietf-tools-draft-info-03.txt References: <004c01c5eba6$21dd31d0$1d1796c0@corp.adobe.com> In-Reply-To: <004c01c5eba6$21dd31d0$1d1796c0@corp.adobe.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 7655788c23eb79e336f5f8ba8bce7906 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Cc: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-BeenThere: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF Tools Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: tools-discuss-bounces@ietf.org Errors-To: tools-discuss-bounces@ietf.org Larry Masinter wrote: >>.... So I would suggest rethinking this - let's be up front >>and ask the community to get rid of the rule that expired I-Ds are >>invisible, with an opt-out clause. > > > Perhaps there is some middle ground, between "removing" and "keeping" > that could be an option. > > For example, change it so that trying to access an expired I-D > through the web will give you something with a note at the beginning > explaining the draft is expired, whether it's been replaced, > a pointer to the latest draft or replacement or RFC. After this > information (which could always be available), then the text > of the (older) draft could be either there or not, depending on > IPR rights and opt-out choice. I like that. If I wasn't worried about Henrik's workload, I'd mention that at least part of this would look like an easy fix to http://tools.ietf.org/id/ Brian _______________________________________________ Tools-discuss mailing list Tools-discuss@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/tools-discuss From tools-discuss-bounces@ietf.org Fri Nov 18 09:43:40 2005 Received: from localhost.cnri.reston.va.us ([127.0.0.1] helo=megatron.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1Ed7Sm-0003EG-Mq; Fri, 18 Nov 2005 09:43:40 -0500 Received: from odin.ietf.org ([132.151.1.176] helo=ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1Ed7Sj-0002zS-MV for tools-discuss@megatron.ietf.org; Fri, 18 Nov 2005 09:43:40 -0500 Received: from ietf-mx.ietf.org (ietf-mx [132.151.6.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id JAA21438 for ; Fri, 18 Nov 2005 09:43:01 -0500 (EST) Received: from main.gmane.org ([80.91.229.2] helo=ciao.gmane.org) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1Ed7ka-0002Dh-PH for tools-discuss@ietf.org; Fri, 18 Nov 2005 10:02:05 -0500 Received: from list by ciao.gmane.org with local (Exim 4.43) id 1Ed7Od-0003Kz-KA for tools-discuss@ietf.org; Fri, 18 Nov 2005 15:39:23 +0100 Received: from c-134-89-41.hh.dial.de.ignite.net ([62.134.89.41]) by main.gmane.org with esmtp (Gmexim 0.1 (Debian)) id 1AlnuQ-0007hv-00 for ; Fri, 18 Nov 2005 15:39:23 +0100 Received: from nobody by c-134-89-41.hh.dial.de.ignite.net with local (Gmexim 0.1 (Debian)) id 1AlnuQ-0007hv-00 for ; Fri, 18 Nov 2005 15:39:23 +0100 X-Injected-Via-Gmane: http://gmane.org/ To: tools-discuss@ietf.org From: Frank Ellermann Date: Fri, 18 Nov 2005 15:32:43 +0100 Organization: Lines: 43 Message-ID: <437DE60B.517D@xyzzy.claranet.de> References: <004c01c5eba6$21dd31d0$1d1796c0@corp.adobe.com> <437DC75A.4040006@zurich.ibm.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Complaints-To: usenet@sea.gmane.org X-Gmane-NNTP-Posting-Host: c-134-89-41.hh.dial.de.ignite.net X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0 (OS/2; U) X-Spam-Score: 0.1 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 21c69d3cfc2dd19218717dbe1d974352 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: [Tools-discuss] Re: I-D ACTION:draft-ietf-tools-draft-info-03.txt X-BeenThere: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF Tools Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: tools-discuss-bounces@ietf.org Errors-To: tools-discuss-bounces@ietf.org Brian E Carpenter wrote: > at least part of this would look like an easy fix to > http://tools.ietf.org/id/ Nice tool, I didn't know it. At the moment it wants the file name draft-...-NN. It won't tell me if NN is really the latest version, I tried it with "procdoc": -00 up to -02 are all still available. For -03 I get an error with a link to -02. For a quick hack I could ask for -99 to get a link to the last available -02. But what I really want would be to arrive directly at the last available -02. For that the tool could support the file name without a version, draft-... instead of draft-...-99, to get into some "do what I mean" mode: http://tools.ietf.org/id/draft-carpenter-procdoc-roadmap And actually it does this already, my browser is only too stupid to interpret the relative URL in the 303: ~~~ cut ~~~ HTTP/1.1 303 See Other Date: Fri, 18 Nov 2005 14:24:05 GMT Server: Apache/2.0.54 (Debian GNU/Linux) mod_python/3.1.3 Python/2.3.5 PHP/4.4.0-4 mod_perl/2.0.1 Perl/v5.8.7 Docname: draft-carpenter-procdoc-roadmap Docbase: draft-carpenter-procdoc-roadmap Location: draft-carpenter-procdoc-roadmap-02.txt Connection: close Content-Type: text/html; charset=iso-8859-1 ~~~ end ~~~ With an absolute URL it should work, and probably a Content-Length: 0 is also important for old browsers getting an empty reply. Bye, Frank _______________________________________________ Tools-discuss mailing list Tools-discuss@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/tools-discuss From tools-discuss-bounces@ietf.org Fri Nov 18 13:16:44 2005 Received: from localhost.cnri.reston.va.us ([127.0.0.1] helo=megatron.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1EdAmy-0006j7-NA; Fri, 18 Nov 2005 13:16:44 -0500 Received: from odin.ietf.org ([132.151.1.176] helo=ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1EdAmx-0006a5-1u for tools-discuss@megatron.ietf.org; Fri, 18 Nov 2005 13:16:43 -0500 Received: from ietf-mx.ietf.org (ietf-mx [132.151.6.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id NAA02709 for ; Fri, 18 Nov 2005 13:16:08 -0500 (EST) Received: from av9-1-sn2.hy.skanova.net ([81.228.8.179]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1EdB4l-0008Co-3c for tools-discuss@ietf.org; Fri, 18 Nov 2005 13:35:09 -0500 Received: by av9-1-sn2.hy.skanova.net (Postfix, from userid 502) id 8D2A7386D2; Fri, 18 Nov 2005 19:16:13 +0100 (CET) Received: from smtp4-2-sn2.hy.skanova.net (smtp4-2-sn2.hy.skanova.net [81.228.8.93]) by av9-1-sn2.hy.skanova.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7F8DF383F5; Fri, 18 Nov 2005 19:16:13 +0100 (CET) Received: from shiraz.levkowetz.com (81-224-201-50-no45.tbcn.telia.com [81.224.201.50]) by smtp4-2-sn2.hy.skanova.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6FC7037E45; Fri, 18 Nov 2005 19:16:13 +0100 (CET) Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]) by shiraz.levkowetz.com with esmtp (Exim 4.54) id 1EdAmS-0005f0-NG; Fri, 18 Nov 2005 19:16:12 +0100 Message-ID: <437E1A6C.6090609@levkowetz.com> Date: Fri, 18 Nov 2005 19:16:12 +0100 From: Henrik Levkowetz User-Agent: Mozilla Thunderbird 1.0.7 (Macintosh/20050923) X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Frank Ellermann Subject: Re: [Tools-discuss] Re: I-D ACTION:draft-ietf-tools-draft-info-03.txt References: <004c01c5eba6$21dd31d0$1d1796c0@corp.adobe.com> <437DC75A.4040006@zurich.ibm.com> <437DE60B.517D@xyzzy.claranet.de> In-Reply-To: <437DE60B.517D@xyzzy.claranet.de> X-Enigmail-Version: 0.93.0.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-SA-Exim-Connect-IP: 127.0.0.1 X-SA-Exim-Mail-From: henrik@levkowetz.com X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No (on shiraz.levkowetz.com); SAEximRunCond expanded to false X-Spam-Score: 0.1 (/) X-Scan-Signature: b4a0a5f5992e2a4954405484e7717d8c Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Cc: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-BeenThere: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF Tools Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: tools-discuss-bounces@ietf.org Errors-To: tools-discuss-bounces@ietf.org Hi Frank, on 2005-11-18 15:32 Frank Ellermann said the following: > Brian E Carpenter wrote: > >> at least part of this would look like an easy fix to >> http://tools.ietf.org/id/ > > Nice tool, I didn't know it. At the moment it wants > the file name draft-...-NN. > > It won't tell me if NN is really the latest version, I > tried it with "procdoc": -00 up to -02 are all still > available. For -03 I get an error with a link to -02. > > For a quick hack I could ask for -99 to get a link to > the last available -02. But what I really want would > be to arrive directly at the last available -02. Omitting the -NN should give you the latest draft already. This is the third example you'll be shown if you go to simply http://tools.ietf.org/id/ . It works for me; if it doesn't work for you, something's broken; but I try to check all the examples every time I tweak the script a little bit. > For that the tool could support the file name without > a version, draft-... instead of draft-...-99, to get > into some "do what I mean" mode: > > http://tools.ietf.org/id/draft-carpenter-procdoc-roadmap > > And actually it does this already, Ahh - you found that :-) ... > my browser is only > too stupid to interpret the relative URL in the 303: ... but there's some trouble... > ~~~ cut ~~~ > HTTP/1.1 303 See Other > Date: Fri, 18 Nov 2005 14:24:05 GMT > Server: Apache/2.0.54 (Debian GNU/Linux) mod_python/3.1.3 Python/2.3.5 > PHP/4.4.0-4 mod_perl/2.0.1 Perl/v5.8.7 > Docname: draft-carpenter-procdoc-roadmap > Docbase: draft-carpenter-procdoc-roadmap > Location: draft-carpenter-procdoc-roadmap-02.txt > Connection: close > Content-Type: text/html; charset=iso-8859-1 > > ~~~ end ~~~ > > With an absolute URL it should work, and probably a > Content-Length: 0 is also important for old browsers > getting an empty reply. Oho. Ok. Absolute URL fixed. I added the Content-Length: 0 header too, but Apache has it's own ideas, and strips that out again. Sorry. Let me know if it works with the absolute URL. Henrik _______________________________________________ Tools-discuss mailing list Tools-discuss@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/tools-discuss From tools-discuss-bounces@ietf.org Fri Nov 18 13:33:32 2005 Received: from localhost.cnri.reston.va.us ([127.0.0.1] helo=megatron.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1EdB3E-0004HW-LV; Fri, 18 Nov 2005 13:33:32 -0500 Received: from odin.ietf.org ([132.151.1.176] helo=ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1EcnGP-0000qj-8h for tools-discuss@megatron.ietf.org; Thu, 17 Nov 2005 12:09:33 -0500 Received: from ietf-mx.ietf.org (ietf-mx [132.151.6.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id MAA07045 for ; Thu, 17 Nov 2005 12:08:59 -0500 (EST) Received: from p-mail2.rd.francetelecom.com ([195.101.245.16]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1EcnY4-0001Iz-6q for tools-discuss@ietf.org; Thu, 17 Nov 2005 12:27:49 -0500 Received: from ftrdmel10.rd.francetelecom.fr ([10.193.117.156]) by ftrdsmtp1.rd.francetelecom.fr with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.211); Thu, 17 Nov 2005 18:09:29 +0100 Received: from l-8613.rd.francetelecom.fr ([10.193.15.41]) by ftrdmel10.rd.francetelecom.fr with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.211); Thu, 17 Nov 2005 18:09:29 +0100 From: Thomas Morin To: tools-discuss@ietf.org Content-Type: text/plain Organization: France Telecom R&D Date: Thu, 17 Nov 2005 18:09:29 +0100 Message-Id: <1132247369.20783.37.camel@wintermute> Mime-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Evolution 2.4.1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-OriginalArrivalTime: 17 Nov 2005 17:09:29.0927 (UTC) FILETIME=[AC115D70:01C5EB99] X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 9466e0365fc95844abaf7c3f15a05c7d Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailman-Approved-At: Fri, 18 Nov 2005 13:33:31 -0500 Subject: [Tools-discuss] Comments on wg status pages X-BeenThere: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF Tools Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: tools-discuss-bounces@ietf.org Errors-To: tools-discuss-bounces@ietf.org Hi, I just wanted to say that I'm pretty impressed with the tools being built on tools.ietf.org. I want to thank you for this useful work. 1) About wg status pages, I have one comment : the nice upload feature that allows me to upload an XML version of my draft, doesn't seem to really work. The page I've got after the upload contains a link to the doc, but when I come back (later) on the draft page, that link is gone. Is this a bug ? 2) the HTMLized agendas have a drawback : they don't link to text versions of the draft (they link to htmlized versions). This is a pain when you want to download a bunch of drafts, before a meeting, to have them on your disk and no need for the network to be up, or for printing them with something else than your browser. I would dare to suggest the following : - make draft-name a link to the raw text file - put a (very) little "HTML" icon, linking to the htmlized version Alternatively, you could also chose to only link the raw text version. 3) It would be nice if wg status pages did also link to meeting proceedings. Cheers, -Thomas _______________________________________________ Tools-discuss mailing list Tools-discuss@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/tools-discuss From tools-discuss-bounces@ietf.org Fri Nov 18 13:49:07 2005 Received: from localhost.cnri.reston.va.us ([127.0.0.1] helo=megatron.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1EdBIJ-00044S-UT; Fri, 18 Nov 2005 13:49:07 -0500 Received: from odin.ietf.org ([132.151.1.176] helo=ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1EdBII-00044K-8r for tools-discuss@megatron.ietf.org; Fri, 18 Nov 2005 13:49:06 -0500 Received: from ietf-mx.ietf.org (ietf-mx [132.151.6.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id NAA04017 for ; Fri, 18 Nov 2005 13:48:31 -0500 (EST) Received: from av11-2-sn2.hy.skanova.net ([81.228.8.184]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1EdBaB-0000Pu-L6 for tools-discuss@ietf.org; Fri, 18 Nov 2005 14:07:36 -0500 Received: by av11-2-sn2.hy.skanova.net (Postfix, from userid 502) id 5D48537EC4; Fri, 18 Nov 2005 19:48:56 +0100 (CET) Received: from smtp4-1-sn2.hy.skanova.net (smtp4-1-sn2.hy.skanova.net [81.228.8.92]) by av11-2-sn2.hy.skanova.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 44D6637E94; Fri, 18 Nov 2005 19:48:56 +0100 (CET) Received: from shiraz.levkowetz.com (81-224-201-50-no45.tbcn.telia.com [81.224.201.50]) by smtp4-1-sn2.hy.skanova.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 363E837E42; Fri, 18 Nov 2005 19:48:56 +0100 (CET) Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]) by shiraz.levkowetz.com with esmtp (Exim 4.54) id 1EdBI4-0005Yl-C6; Fri, 18 Nov 2005 19:48:52 +0100 Message-ID: <437E2214.6070201@levkowetz.com> Date: Fri, 18 Nov 2005 19:48:52 +0100 From: Henrik Levkowetz User-Agent: Mozilla Thunderbird 1.0.7 (Macintosh/20050923) X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Thomas Morin Subject: Re: [Tools-discuss] Comments on wg status pages References: <1132247369.20783.37.camel@wintermute> In-Reply-To: <1132247369.20783.37.camel@wintermute> X-Enigmail-Version: 0.93.0.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-SA-Exim-Connect-IP: 127.0.0.1 X-SA-Exim-Mail-From: henrik@levkowetz.com X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No (on shiraz.levkowetz.com); SAEximRunCond expanded to false X-Spam-Score: 0.1 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 769a46790fb42fbb0b0cc700c82f7081 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Cc: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-BeenThere: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF Tools Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: tools-discuss-bounces@ietf.org Errors-To: tools-discuss-bounces@ietf.org Hi Thomas, on 2005-11-17 18:09 Thomas Morin said the following: > Hi, > > I just wanted to say that I'm pretty impressed with the tools being > built on tools.ietf.org. I want to thank you for this useful work. > > 1) About wg status pages, I have one comment : the nice upload feature > that allows me to upload an XML version of my draft, doesn't seem to > really work. The page I've got after the upload contains a link to the > doc, but when I come back (later) on the draft page, that link is gone. > Is this a bug ? Yes. The probable cause is that we now have two tools servers, and I've not arranged for two-way replication; quite to the contrary there's deletion of non-matching files on the secondary server. I'll have a look at this. > 2) the HTMLized agendas have a drawback : they don't link to text > versions of the draft (they link to htmlized versions). This is a pain > when you want to download a bunch of drafts, before a meeting, to have > them on your disk and no need for the network to be up, or for printing > them with something else than your browser. > I would dare to suggest the following : > - make draft-name a link to the raw text file > - put a (very) little "HTML" icon, linking to the htmlized version > Alternatively, you could also chose to only link the raw text version. There's already a plan to complement the html-ized drafts with a link to the raw text file, draft status information, etc. I think this would work for you? > 3) It would be nice if wg status pages did also link to meeting > proceedings. Umm - the meeting minutes are provided there already. How would you like to link to the proceedings? It's not trivial, as the proceedings don't follow a consistent URL pattern - they sit on different servers and use year/month naming instead of meeting number naming. If you'll explain what you don't find in the current pages, I'll see if I can work out a good way of providing it. (If the pain of providing proceedings links has to be taken, I'll put it on the list, but it _is_ a pain...) Henrik _______________________________________________ Tools-discuss mailing list Tools-discuss@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/tools-discuss From tools-discuss-bounces@ietf.org Fri Nov 18 14:05:36 2005 Received: from localhost.cnri.reston.va.us ([127.0.0.1] helo=megatron.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1EdBYG-0001dt-Mo; Fri, 18 Nov 2005 14:05:36 -0500 Received: from odin.ietf.org ([132.151.1.176] helo=ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1EdBYF-0001do-2Z for tools-discuss@megatron.ietf.org; Fri, 18 Nov 2005 14:05:35 -0500 Received: from ietf-mx.ietf.org (ietf-mx [132.151.6.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id OAA04768 for ; Fri, 18 Nov 2005 14:04:59 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail-red.research.att.com ([192.20.225.110] helo=mail-white.research.att.com) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1EdBq7-0000od-T2 for tools-discuss@ietf.org; Fri, 18 Nov 2005 14:24:05 -0500 Received: from bright.research.att.com (bright.research.att.com [135.207.20.189]) by mail-green.research.att.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id E4AAE861A; Fri, 18 Nov 2005 14:05:24 -0500 (EST) Received: (from fenner@localhost) by bright.research.att.com (8.12.11/8.12.10/Submit) id jAIJ5O8M023678; Fri, 18 Nov 2005 11:05:24 -0800 From: Bill Fenner Message-Id: <200511181905.jAIJ5O8M023678@bright.research.att.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII To: Henrik Levkowetz Subject: Re: [Tools-discuss] Re: I-D ACTION:draft-ietf-tools-draft-info-03.txt References: <004c01c5eba6$21dd31d0$1d1796c0@corp.adobe.com> <437DC75A.4040006@zurich.ibm.com> <437DE60B.517D@xyzzy.claranet.de> <437E1A6C.6090609@levkowetz.com> Date: Fri, 18 Nov 2005 11:05:24 -0800 Versions: dmail (linux) 2.7/makemail 2.14 X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 08e48e05374109708c00c6208b534009 Cc: Frank Ellermann , tools-discuss@ietf.org X-BeenThere: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF Tools Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: tools-discuss-bounces@ietf.org Errors-To: tools-discuss-bounces@ietf.org >Oho. Ok. Absolute URL fixed. A little-known fact is that Location: headers are not permitted to be relative. It's little-known because nearly every browser works when presented with a relative Location: header. Bill _______________________________________________ Tools-discuss mailing list Tools-discuss@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/tools-discuss From tools-discuss-bounces@ietf.org Fri Nov 18 14:39:13 2005 Received: from localhost.cnri.reston.va.us ([127.0.0.1] helo=megatron.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1EdC4n-0006bq-11; Fri, 18 Nov 2005 14:39:13 -0500 Received: from odin.ietf.org ([132.151.1.176] helo=ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1EdC4l-0006bh-OI for tools-discuss@megatron.ietf.org; Fri, 18 Nov 2005 14:39:11 -0500 Received: from ietf-mx.ietf.org (ietf-mx [132.151.6.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id OAA06284 for ; Fri, 18 Nov 2005 14:38:36 -0500 (EST) Received: from av10-2-sn2.hy.skanova.net ([81.228.8.182]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1EdCMd-0001av-LA for tools-discuss@ietf.org; Fri, 18 Nov 2005 14:57:42 -0500 Received: by av10-2-sn2.hy.skanova.net (Postfix, from userid 502) id 66CA238517; Fri, 18 Nov 2005 20:38:59 +0100 (CET) Received: from smtp4-2-sn2.hy.skanova.net (smtp4-2-sn2.hy.skanova.net [81.228.8.93]) by av10-2-sn2.hy.skanova.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 51D13384C6; Fri, 18 Nov 2005 20:38:59 +0100 (CET) Received: from shiraz.levkowetz.com (81-224-201-50-no45.tbcn.telia.com [81.224.201.50]) by smtp4-2-sn2.hy.skanova.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 39E6C37E46; Fri, 18 Nov 2005 20:38:59 +0100 (CET) Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]) by shiraz.levkowetz.com with esmtp (Exim 4.54) id 1EdC4Y-0001Th-I5; Fri, 18 Nov 2005 20:38:58 +0100 Message-ID: <437E2DD1.50004@levkowetz.com> Date: Fri, 18 Nov 2005 20:38:57 +0100 From: Henrik Levkowetz User-Agent: Mozilla Thunderbird 1.0.7 (Macintosh/20050923) X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Bill Fenner Subject: Re: [Tools-discuss] Re: I-D ACTION:draft-ietf-tools-draft-info-03.txt References: <004c01c5eba6$21dd31d0$1d1796c0@corp.adobe.com> <437DC75A.4040006@zurich.ibm.com> <437DE60B.517D@xyzzy.claranet.de> <437E1A6C.6090609@levkowetz.com> <200511181905.jAIJ5O8M023678@bright.research.att.com> In-Reply-To: <200511181905.jAIJ5O8M023678@bright.research.att.com> X-Enigmail-Version: 0.93.0.0 X-SA-Exim-Connect-IP: 127.0.0.1 X-SA-Exim-Mail-From: henrik@levkowetz.com X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No (on shiraz.levkowetz.com); SAEximRunCond expanded to false X-Spam-Score: 0.1 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 52e1467c2184c31006318542db5614d5 Cc: Frank Ellermann , tools-discuss@ietf.org X-BeenThere: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF Tools Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="===============0543173168==" Sender: tools-discuss-bounces@ietf.org Errors-To: tools-discuss-bounces@ietf.org This is an OpenPGP/MIME signed message (RFC 2440 and 3156) --===============0543173168== Content-Type: multipart/signed; micalg=pgp-sha1; protocol="application/pgp-signature"; boundary="------------enigADDC82B998CBEBC084047921" This is an OpenPGP/MIME signed message (RFC 2440 and 3156) --------------enigADDC82B998CBEBC084047921 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit > A little-known fact is that Location: headers are not permitted > to be relative. It's little-known because nearly every browser > works when presented with a relative Location: header. Hah. That also explains why the apache Redirect directive requires an absolute target URL, rather than a relative one - something I've found to be a slight pain when deploying the same page with multiple URLs, and then needing to move it... Thanks for the info :-) Henrik --------------enigADDC82B998CBEBC084047921 Content-Type: application/pgp-signature; name="signature.asc" Content-Description: OpenPGP digital signature Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="signature.asc" -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.4.2 (GNU/Linux) iD8DBQFDfi3SeVhrtTJkXCMRAs+qAKC123WvrX2hosba3GzhsgRPX1VV1QCgxepI OCEpqMzEjo2fnLI+lQ/aG5Q= =SPtK -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --------------enigADDC82B998CBEBC084047921-- --===============0543173168== Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline _______________________________________________ Tools-discuss mailing list Tools-discuss@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/tools-discuss --===============0543173168==-- From tools-discuss-bounces@ietf.org Sat Nov 19 13:24:24 2005 Received: from localhost.cnri.reston.va.us ([127.0.0.1] helo=megatron.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1EdXNw-0005UP-OG; Sat, 19 Nov 2005 13:24:24 -0500 Received: from odin.ietf.org ([132.151.1.176] helo=ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1EdXNt-0005UK-5S for tools-discuss@megatron.ietf.org; Sat, 19 Nov 2005 13:24:23 -0500 Received: from ietf-mx.ietf.org (ietf-mx [132.151.6.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id NAA10424 for ; Sat, 19 Nov 2005 13:23:45 -0500 (EST) Received: from main.gmane.org ([80.91.229.2] helo=ciao.gmane.org) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1EdXfu-0008TS-IP for tools-discuss@ietf.org; Sat, 19 Nov 2005 13:43:03 -0500 Received: from list by ciao.gmane.org with local (Exim 4.43) id 1EdXLv-0005W3-9i for tools-discuss@ietf.org; Sat, 19 Nov 2005 19:22:19 +0100 Received: from c-134-89-146.hh.dial.de.ignite.net ([62.134.89.146]) by main.gmane.org with esmtp (Gmexim 0.1 (Debian)) id 1AlnuQ-0007hv-00 for ; Sat, 19 Nov 2005 19:22:19 +0100 Received: from nobody by c-134-89-146.hh.dial.de.ignite.net with local (Gmexim 0.1 (Debian)) id 1AlnuQ-0007hv-00 for ; Sat, 19 Nov 2005 19:22:19 +0100 X-Injected-Via-Gmane: http://gmane.org/ To: tools-discuss@ietf.org From: Frank Ellermann Date: Sat, 19 Nov 2005 19:20:02 +0100 Organization: Lines: 22 Message-ID: <437F6CD2.478@xyzzy.claranet.de> References: <004c01c5eba6$21dd31d0$1d1796c0@corp.adobe.com> <437DC75A.4040006@zurich.ibm.com> <437DE60B.517D@xyzzy.claranet.de> <437E1A6C.6090609@levkowetz.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Complaints-To: usenet@sea.gmane.org X-Gmane-NNTP-Posting-Host: c-134-89-146.hh.dial.de.ignite.net X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0 (OS/2; U) X-Spam-Score: 0.1 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 7655788c23eb79e336f5f8ba8bce7906 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: [Tools-discuss] Re: I-D ACTION:draft-ietf-tools-draft-info-03.txt X-BeenThere: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF Tools Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: tools-discuss-bounces@ietf.org Errors-To: tools-discuss-bounces@ietf.org Henrik Levkowetz wrote: > Absolute URL fixed. I added the Content-Length: 0 header > too, but Apache has it's own ideas, and strips that out > again. Sorry. Testing again, I still get only "document contains no data", the absolute URL plus "Content-Length: 0" doesn't help, sigh. How about just sending the same or a similar non-empty content as for version -99 ? And / or if you can "see" that the query is HTTP/1.0 just try 302 as proposed in 2616: | Note: Many pre-HTTP/1.1 user agents do not understand the 303 | status. When interoperability with such clients is a concern, | the 302 status code may be used instead, since most user | agents react to a 302 response as described here for 303. For "Many" read "Some of my". Lynx gets it right (as always), but Netscape 3.x and 4.x fail. Bye, Frank _______________________________________________ Tools-discuss mailing list Tools-discuss@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/tools-discuss From tools-discuss-bounces@ietf.org Sat Nov 19 14:08:52 2005 Received: from localhost.cnri.reston.va.us ([127.0.0.1] helo=megatron.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1EdY4y-00066K-Gy; Sat, 19 Nov 2005 14:08:52 -0500 Received: from odin.ietf.org ([132.151.1.176] helo=ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1EdY4x-00064j-7n for tools-discuss@megatron.ietf.org; Sat, 19 Nov 2005 14:08:51 -0500 Received: from ietf-mx.ietf.org (ietf-mx [132.151.6.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id OAA12507 for ; Sat, 19 Nov 2005 14:08:15 -0500 (EST) Received: from av12-1-sn2.hy.skanova.net ([81.228.8.185]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1EdYN2-00012b-Jt for tools-discuss@ietf.org; Sat, 19 Nov 2005 14:27:33 -0500 Received: by av12-1-sn2.hy.skanova.net (Postfix, from userid 502) id B45D338103; Sat, 19 Nov 2005 20:08:31 +0100 (CET) Received: from smtp4-1-sn2.hy.skanova.net (smtp4-1-sn2.hy.skanova.net [81.228.8.92]) by av12-1-sn2.hy.skanova.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 89B1738097; Sat, 19 Nov 2005 20:08:31 +0100 (CET) Received: from shiraz.levkowetz.com (81-224-201-50-no45.tbcn.telia.com [81.224.201.50]) by smtp4-1-sn2.hy.skanova.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7B90B37E44; Sat, 19 Nov 2005 20:08:26 +0100 (CET) Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]) by shiraz.levkowetz.com with esmtp (Exim 4.54) id 1EdY4X-0004ss-KX; Sat, 19 Nov 2005 20:08:25 +0100 Message-ID: <437F7829.4050408@levkowetz.com> Date: Sat, 19 Nov 2005 20:08:25 +0100 From: Henrik Levkowetz User-Agent: Mozilla Thunderbird 1.0.7 (Macintosh/20050923) X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Frank Ellermann Subject: Re: [Tools-discuss] Re: I-D ACTION:draft-ietf-tools-draft-info-03.txt References: <004c01c5eba6$21dd31d0$1d1796c0@corp.adobe.com> <437DC75A.4040006@zurich.ibm.com> <437DE60B.517D@xyzzy.claranet.de> <437E1A6C.6090609@levkowetz.com> <437F6CD2.478@xyzzy.claranet.de> In-Reply-To: <437F6CD2.478@xyzzy.claranet.de> X-Enigmail-Version: 0.93.0.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-SA-Exim-Connect-IP: 127.0.0.1 X-SA-Exim-Mail-From: henrik@levkowetz.com X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No (on shiraz.levkowetz.com); SAEximRunCond expanded to false X-Spam-Score: 0.1 (/) X-Scan-Signature: bb8f917bb6b8da28fc948aeffb74aa17 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Cc: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-BeenThere: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF Tools Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: tools-discuss-bounces@ietf.org Errors-To: tools-discuss-bounces@ietf.org on 2005-11-19 19:20 Frank Ellermann said the following: > Henrik Levkowetz wrote: > >> Absolute URL fixed. I added the Content-Length: 0 header >> too, but Apache has it's own ideas, and strips that out >> again. Sorry. > > Testing again, I still get only "document contains no data", > the absolute URL plus "Content-Length: 0" doesn't help, sigh. > > How about just sending the same or a similar non-empty content > as for version -99 ? And / or if you can "see" that the query > is HTTP/1.0 just try 302 as proposed in 2616: Actually, since the output of the request shouldn't change for the same input, 302 might be a better response than 303 overall. > | Note: Many pre-HTTP/1.1 user agents do not understand the 303 > | status. When interoperability with such clients is a concern, > | the 302 status code may be used instead, since most user > | agents react to a 302 response as described here for 303. > > For "Many" read "Some of my". Lynx gets it right (as always), > but Netscape 3.x and 4.x fail. Ok, I've changed to 302, and also added a little snippet providing a hypertext link to the new location, as recommended. Please see if this works better. Regards, Henrik _______________________________________________ Tools-discuss mailing list Tools-discuss@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/tools-discuss From tools-discuss-bounces@ietf.org Sat Nov 19 17:50:35 2005 Received: from localhost.cnri.reston.va.us ([127.0.0.1] helo=megatron.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1EdbXX-0005pn-6d; Sat, 19 Nov 2005 17:50:35 -0500 Received: from odin.ietf.org ([132.151.1.176] helo=ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1EdbXV-0005pi-9U for tools-discuss@megatron.ietf.org; Sat, 19 Nov 2005 17:50:33 -0500 Received: from ietf-mx.ietf.org (ietf-mx [132.151.6.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id RAA19708 for ; Sat, 19 Nov 2005 17:49:53 -0500 (EST) Received: from main.gmane.org ([80.91.229.2] helo=ciao.gmane.org) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1Edbpb-0005IR-0C for tools-discuss@ietf.org; Sat, 19 Nov 2005 18:09:15 -0500 Received: from list by ciao.gmane.org with local (Exim 4.43) id 1EdbW8-00084u-IO for tools-discuss@ietf.org; Sat, 19 Nov 2005 23:49:08 +0100 Received: from c-134-89-146.hh.dial.de.ignite.net ([62.134.89.146]) by main.gmane.org with esmtp (Gmexim 0.1 (Debian)) id 1AlnuQ-0007hv-00 for ; Sat, 19 Nov 2005 23:49:08 +0100 Received: from nobody by c-134-89-146.hh.dial.de.ignite.net with local (Gmexim 0.1 (Debian)) id 1AlnuQ-0007hv-00 for ; Sat, 19 Nov 2005 23:49:08 +0100 X-Injected-Via-Gmane: http://gmane.org/ To: tools-discuss@ietf.org From: Frank Ellermann Date: Sat, 19 Nov 2005 23:41:44 +0100 Organization: Lines: 13 Message-ID: <437FAA28.8BD@xyzzy.claranet.de> References: <004c01c5eba6$21dd31d0$1d1796c0@corp.adobe.com> <437DC75A.4040006@zurich.ibm.com> <437DE60B.517D@xyzzy.claranet.de> <437E1A6C.6090609@levkowetz.com> <437F6CD2.478@xyzzy.claranet.de> <437F7829.4050408@levkowetz.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Complaints-To: usenet@sea.gmane.org X-Gmane-NNTP-Posting-Host: c-134-89-146.hh.dial.de.ignite.net X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0 (OS/2; U) X-Spam-Score: 0.1 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 1ac7cc0a4cd376402b85bc1961a86ac2 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: [Tools-discuss] Re: I-D ACTION:draft-ietf-tools-draft-info-03.txt X-BeenThere: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF Tools Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: tools-discuss-bounces@ietf.org Errors-To: tools-discuss-bounces@ietf.org Henrik Levkowetz wrote: >> Netscape 3.x and 4.x fail. > Ok, I've changed to 302 Some hours of test failures later, `rxhost tools.ietf.org` | 192.36.157.99 cabernet.verkstad.net | 81.224.201.50 81-224-201-50-no45.tbcn.telia.com Okay, that makes testing certainly interesting ;-) Yes, with one of these two servers it now apparently works. Bye, Frank _______________________________________________ Tools-discuss mailing list Tools-discuss@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/tools-discuss From tools-discuss-bounces@ietf.org Sat Nov 19 18:28:37 2005 Received: from localhost.cnri.reston.va.us ([127.0.0.1] helo=megatron.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1Edc8L-0004QO-Bj; Sat, 19 Nov 2005 18:28:37 -0500 Received: from odin.ietf.org ([132.151.1.176] helo=ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1Edc8K-0004Q7-CE for tools-discuss@megatron.ietf.org; Sat, 19 Nov 2005 18:28:36 -0500 Received: from ietf-mx.ietf.org (ietf-mx [132.151.6.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id SAA20689 for ; Sat, 19 Nov 2005 18:27:59 -0500 (EST) Received: from av11-1-sn2.hy.skanova.net ([81.228.8.183]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1EdcQS-0005tx-19 for tools-discuss@ietf.org; Sat, 19 Nov 2005 18:47:21 -0500 Received: by av11-1-sn2.hy.skanova.net (Postfix, from userid 502) id 053463905A; Sun, 20 Nov 2005 00:28:15 +0100 (CET) Received: from smtp4-2-sn2.hy.skanova.net (smtp4-2-sn2.hy.skanova.net [81.228.8.93]) by av11-1-sn2.hy.skanova.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id E157E39044; Sun, 20 Nov 2005 00:28:14 +0100 (CET) Received: from shiraz.levkowetz.com (81-224-201-50-no45.tbcn.telia.com [81.224.201.50]) by smtp4-2-sn2.hy.skanova.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id D3A9037E43; Sun, 20 Nov 2005 00:28:14 +0100 (CET) Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]) by shiraz.levkowetz.com with esmtp (Exim 4.54) id 1Edc7x-0001Lq-Tz; Sun, 20 Nov 2005 00:28:14 +0100 Message-ID: <437FB50D.3010401@levkowetz.com> Date: Sun, 20 Nov 2005 00:28:13 +0100 From: Henrik Levkowetz User-Agent: Mozilla Thunderbird 1.0.7 (Macintosh/20050923) X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Frank Ellermann Subject: Re: [Tools-discuss] Re: I-D ACTION:draft-ietf-tools-draft-info-03.txt References: <004c01c5eba6$21dd31d0$1d1796c0@corp.adobe.com> <437DC75A.4040006@zurich.ibm.com> <437DE60B.517D@xyzzy.claranet.de> <437E1A6C.6090609@levkowetz.com> <437F6CD2.478@xyzzy.claranet.de> <437F7829.4050408@levkowetz.com> <437FAA28.8BD@xyzzy.claranet.de> In-Reply-To: <437FAA28.8BD@xyzzy.claranet.de> X-Enigmail-Version: 0.93.0.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-SA-Exim-Connect-IP: 127.0.0.1 X-SA-Exim-Mail-From: henrik@levkowetz.com X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No (on shiraz.levkowetz.com); SAEximRunCond expanded to false X-Spam-Score: 0.1 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 52e1467c2184c31006318542db5614d5 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Cc: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-BeenThere: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF Tools Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: tools-discuss-bounces@ietf.org Errors-To: tools-discuss-bounces@ietf.org Hi Frank, on 2005-11-19 23:41 Frank Ellermann said the following: > Henrik Levkowetz wrote: > >>> Netscape 3.x and 4.x fail. >> Ok, I've changed to 302 > > Some hours of test failures later, `rxhost tools.ietf.org` > | 192.36.157.99 cabernet.verkstad.net > | 81.224.201.50 81-224-201-50-no45.tbcn.telia.com > > Okay, that makes testing certainly interesting ;-) Yes, with > one of these two servers it now apparently works. Bye, Frank Oh, dear. First time around, I remembered to push the changes out to the secondary server. This time, I forgot :-(((( I'm really sorry, Frank. One of the cron jobs would have taken care of it in about 3 hours, but I've pushed the scripts over to the secondary anyway, now. You can always test against the primary (where I try out changes) by explicitly going to http://www1.tools.ietf.org/ Anyway, it's good that it works now. My apologies for your wasted time. Henrik _______________________________________________ Tools-discuss mailing list Tools-discuss@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/tools-discuss From tools-discuss-bounces@ietf.org Sat Nov 19 19:10:38 2005 Received: from localhost.cnri.reston.va.us ([127.0.0.1] helo=megatron.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1Edcn0-000301-Eb; Sat, 19 Nov 2005 19:10:38 -0500 Received: from odin.ietf.org ([132.151.1.176] helo=ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1Edcmz-0002zw-Ga for tools-discuss@megatron.ietf.org; Sat, 19 Nov 2005 19:10:37 -0500 Received: from ietf-mx.ietf.org (ietf-mx [132.151.6.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id TAA21930 for ; Sat, 19 Nov 2005 19:10:01 -0500 (EST) Received: from main.gmane.org ([80.91.229.2] helo=ciao.gmane.org) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1Edd57-0006bL-Um for tools-discuss@ietf.org; Sat, 19 Nov 2005 19:29:22 -0500 Received: from list by ciao.gmane.org with local (Exim 4.43) id 1EdclE-0001vo-PY for tools-discuss@ietf.org; Sun, 20 Nov 2005 01:08:48 +0100 Received: from c-134-89-146.hh.dial.de.ignite.net ([62.134.89.146]) by main.gmane.org with esmtp (Gmexim 0.1 (Debian)) id 1AlnuQ-0007hv-00 for ; Sun, 20 Nov 2005 01:08:48 +0100 Received: from nobody by c-134-89-146.hh.dial.de.ignite.net with local (Gmexim 0.1 (Debian)) id 1AlnuQ-0007hv-00 for ; Sun, 20 Nov 2005 01:08:48 +0100 X-Injected-Via-Gmane: http://gmane.org/ To: tools-discuss@ietf.org From: Frank Ellermann Date: Sun, 20 Nov 2005 01:07:15 +0100 Organization: Lines: 9 Message-ID: <437FBE33.5597@xyzzy.claranet.de> References: <004c01c5eba6$21dd31d0$1d1796c0@corp.adobe.com> <437DC75A.4040006@zurich.ibm.com> <437DE60B.517D@xyzzy.claranet.de> <437E1A6C.6090609@levkowetz.com> <437F6CD2.478@xyzzy.claranet.de> <437F7829.4050408@levkowetz.com> <437FAA28.8BD@xyzzy.claranet.de> <437FB50D.3010401@levkowetz.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Complaints-To: usenet@sea.gmane.org X-Gmane-NNTP-Posting-Host: c-134-89-146.hh.dial.de.ignite.net X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0 (OS/2; U) X-Spam-Score: 0.1 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 7bac9cb154eb5790ae3b2913587a40de Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: [Tools-discuss] Re: I-D ACTION:draft-ietf-tools-draft-info-03.txt X-BeenThere: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF Tools Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: tools-discuss-bounces@ietf.org Errors-To: tools-discuss-bounces@ietf.org Henrik Levkowetz wrote: > I'm really sorry No problem - I learned a lot of things that won't cause a problem, and I didn't know that my browers apparently stick to whatever IP they got, unfortunately it was the "wrong" IP for this test ;-) www1.tools.ietf.org noted, bye, Frank _______________________________________________ Tools-discuss mailing list Tools-discuss@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/tools-discuss From tools-discuss-bounces@ietf.org Sun Nov 20 09:00:25 2005 Received: from localhost.cnri.reston.va.us ([127.0.0.1] helo=megatron.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1Edpk1-0008Dt-J9; Sun, 20 Nov 2005 09:00:25 -0500 Received: from odin.ietf.org ([132.151.1.176] helo=ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1Edpk0-0008Dk-BF for tools-discuss@megatron.ietf.org; Sun, 20 Nov 2005 09:00:24 -0500 Received: from ietf-mx.ietf.org (ietf-mx [132.151.6.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id IAA20759 for ; Sun, 20 Nov 2005 08:59:48 -0500 (EST) Received: from eikenes.alvestrand.no ([158.38.152.233]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1Edq2D-0001y5-Ih for tools-discuss@ietf.org; Sun, 20 Nov 2005 09:19:16 -0500 Received: from localhost (eikenes.alvestrand.no [127.0.0.1]) by eikenes.alvestrand.no (Postfix) with ESMTP id 86C192596C0; Sun, 20 Nov 2005 14:59:43 +0100 (CET) Received: from eikenes.alvestrand.no ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (eikenes.alvestrand.no [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 28451-04; Sun, 20 Nov 2005 14:59:38 +0100 (CET) Received: from [192.168.1.160] (163.80-203-220.nextgentel.com [80.203.220.163]) by eikenes.alvestrand.no (Postfix) with ESMTP id B0DBD2596BF; Sun, 20 Nov 2005 14:59:38 +0100 (CET) Date: Sun, 20 Nov 2005 15:01:44 +0100 From: Harald Tveit Alvestrand To: Jari Arkko , IETF TOOLS discussion Subject: Re: [Tools-discuss] drafts trivia Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <436FC4D2.3030307@piuha.net> References: <436FC4D2.3030307@piuha.net> X-Mailer: Mulberry/3.1.6 (Linux/x86) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at alvestrand.no X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 4d87d2aa806f79fed918a62e834505ca Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Cc: X-BeenThere: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF Tools Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: tools-discuss-bounces@ietf.org Errors-To: tools-discuss-bounces@ietf.org Great stuff, Jari! I particularly like this one: 57 drafts (2.53%) have authors from Australia. 7 drafts (0.31%) have authors from Africa. 1 drafts (0.04%) have authors from OTHER. 7 drafts (0.31%) have authors from South america. 1701 drafts (75.50%) have authors from North america. 482 drafts (21.39%) have authors from Asia. 1138 drafts (50.51%) have authors from Europe. Not only are we an international organization, a huge number of our drafts are multinational too... Harald --On mandag, november 07, 2005 23:19:14 +0200 Jari Arkko wrote: > > I made a small tool couple of weeks ago to run some > statistics on drafts and people who write them. > This includes things like how many pages drafts > have, statistics on version numbers, who are the > authors who write most drafts, what company > or country drafts come from etc. Mostly trivia, > but it may have at least entertainment > value. The data is available here: > > http://www.arkko.com/tools/stats/index.html > > Note that there hasn't been all that much testing and > verification of the data produced by this. There could > be errors. In fact, we know there are errors. This > is largely based on heuristics about what author > sections in drafts/RFCs look like, and an attempt to > parse, e.g., country and e-mail domain information > to figure out affiliation and location. > > --Jari > > > _______________________________________________ > Tools-discuss mailing list > Tools-discuss@ietf.org > https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/tools-discuss > _______________________________________________ Tools-discuss mailing list Tools-discuss@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/tools-discuss From tools-discuss-bounces@ietf.org Mon Nov 21 07:36:47 2005 Received: from localhost.cnri.reston.va.us ([127.0.0.1] helo=megatron.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1EeAud-0001ZR-8I; Mon, 21 Nov 2005 07:36:47 -0500 Received: from odin.ietf.org ([132.151.1.176] helo=ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1EeAub-0001ZM-At for tools-discuss@megatron.ietf.org; Mon, 21 Nov 2005 07:36:45 -0500 Received: from ietf-mx.ietf.org (ietf-mx [132.151.6.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id HAA25812 for ; Mon, 21 Nov 2005 07:36:06 -0500 (EST) Received: from p-mail1.rd.francetelecom.com ([195.101.245.15]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1EeBD2-00018o-Pf for tools-discuss@ietf.org; Mon, 21 Nov 2005 07:55:49 -0500 Received: from ftrdmel10.rd.francetelecom.fr ([10.193.117.156]) by ftrdsmtp1.rd.francetelecom.fr with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.211); Mon, 21 Nov 2005 13:36:33 +0100 Received: from l-8613.rd.francetelecom.fr ([10.193.15.91]) by ftrdmel10.rd.francetelecom.fr with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.211); Mon, 21 Nov 2005 13:36:33 +0100 Subject: Re: [Tools-discuss] Comments on wg status pages From: Thomas Morin To: Henrik Levkowetz In-Reply-To: <437E2214.6070201@levkowetz.com> References: <1132247369.20783.37.camel@wintermute> <437E2214.6070201@levkowetz.com> Content-Type: text/plain Organization: France Telecom R&D Date: Mon, 21 Nov 2005 13:36:38 +0100 Message-Id: <1132576598.8735.16.camel@wintermute> Mime-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Evolution 2.4.1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-OriginalArrivalTime: 21 Nov 2005 12:36:33.0499 (UTC) FILETIME=[349BC2B0:01C5EE98] X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 21c69d3cfc2dd19218717dbe1d974352 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Cc: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-BeenThere: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF Tools Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: tools-discuss-bounces@ietf.org Errors-To: tools-discuss-bounces@ietf.org Henrik Levkowetz: > > 2) the HTMLized agendas have a drawback : they don't link to text > > versions of the draft (they link to htmlized versions). This is a pain > > when you want to download a bunch of drafts, before a meeting, to have > > them on your disk and no need for the network to be up, or for printing > > them with something else than your browser. > > I would dare to suggest the following : > > - make draft-name a link to the raw text file > > - put a (very) little "HTML" icon, linking to the htmlized version > > Alternatively, you could also chose to only link the raw text version. > > There's already a plan to complement the html-ized drafts with a link > to the raw text file, draft status information, etc. I think this > would work for you? More or less, I'd say, since that doesn't really fit the right-click + "save as.." pattern, which is more efficient when you do it directly on the WG agenda. > > 3) It would be nice if wg status pages did also link to meeting > > proceedings. > > Umm - the meeting minutes are provided there already. How would you > like to link to the proceedings? It's not trivial, as the proceedings > don't follow a consistent URL pattern - they sit on different servers > and use year/month naming instead of meeting number naming. If you'll > explain what you don't find in the current pages, I'll see if I can > work out a good way of providing it. (If the pain of providing > proceedings links has to be taken, I'll put it on the list, but it > _is_ a pain...) I was thinking that using the datatracker proceedings pages might perhaps be done (https://datatracker.ietf.org/public/proceeding_interim.cgi?meeting_num=64). The missing thing is per-WG URLs, but maybe the tool team could have a way to have HTML anchors added to the datatracker pages (?). In any cases, I think the URL above could be usefuly provided as a general per-meeting link on the tools.ietf.org pages (if per-WG link is not feasible). Cheers, -Thomas _______________________________________________ Tools-discuss mailing list Tools-discuss@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/tools-discuss From tools-discuss-bounces@ietf.org Mon Nov 21 12:31:57 2005 Received: from localhost.cnri.reston.va.us ([127.0.0.1] helo=megatron.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1EeFWH-00038J-K4; Mon, 21 Nov 2005 12:31:57 -0500 Received: from odin.ietf.org ([132.151.1.176] helo=ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1EeFWF-000387-Rv for tools-discuss@megatron.ietf.org; Mon, 21 Nov 2005 12:31:56 -0500 Received: from ietf-mx.ietf.org (ietf-mx [132.151.6.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id MAA17243 for ; Mon, 21 Nov 2005 12:31:17 -0500 (EST) Received: from av7-2-sn3.vrr.skanova.net ([81.228.9.182]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1EeFoi-0001mf-6l for tools-discuss@ietf.org; Mon, 21 Nov 2005 12:51:02 -0500 Received: by av7-2-sn3.vrr.skanova.net (Postfix, from userid 502) id 0B90F37F24; Mon, 21 Nov 2005 18:21:41 +0100 (CET) Received: from smtp3-1-sn3.vrr.skanova.net (smtp3-1-sn3.vrr.skanova.net [81.228.9.101]) by av7-2-sn3.vrr.skanova.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id DB51237EDD; Mon, 21 Nov 2005 18:21:40 +0100 (CET) Received: from shiraz.levkowetz.com (81-224-201-50-no45.tbcn.telia.com [81.224.201.50]) by smtp3-1-sn3.vrr.skanova.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7132237E42; Mon, 21 Nov 2005 18:31:32 +0100 (CET) Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]) by shiraz.levkowetz.com with esmtp (Exim 4.54) id 1EeFVr-00078E-R6; Mon, 21 Nov 2005 18:31:31 +0100 Message-ID: <43820473.9030609@levkowetz.com> Date: Mon, 21 Nov 2005 18:31:31 +0100 From: Henrik Levkowetz User-Agent: Mozilla Thunderbird 1.0.7 (Macintosh/20050923) X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Thomas Morin Subject: Re: [Tools-discuss] Comments on wg status pages References: <1132247369.20783.37.camel@wintermute> <437E2214.6070201@levkowetz.com> <1132576598.8735.16.camel@wintermute> In-Reply-To: <1132576598.8735.16.camel@wintermute> X-Enigmail-Version: 0.93.0.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-SA-Exim-Connect-IP: 127.0.0.1 X-SA-Exim-Mail-From: henrik@levkowetz.com X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No (on shiraz.levkowetz.com); SAEximRunCond expanded to false X-Spam-Score: 0.1 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 02ec665d00de228c50c93ed6b5e4fc1a Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Cc: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-BeenThere: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF Tools Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: tools-discuss-bounces@ietf.org Errors-To: tools-discuss-bounces@ietf.org on 2005-11-21 13:36 Thomas Morin said the following: > Henrik Levkowetz: >> > 2) the HTMLized agendas have a drawback : they don't link to text >> > versions of the draft (they link to htmlized versions). This is a pain >> > when you want to download a bunch of drafts, before a meeting, to have >> > them on your disk and no need for the network to be up, or for printing >> > them with something else than your browser. >> > I would dare to suggest the following : >> > - make draft-name a link to the raw text file >> > - put a (very) little "HTML" icon, linking to the htmlized version >> > Alternatively, you could also chose to only link the raw text version. >> >> There's already a plan to complement the html-ized drafts with a link >> to the raw text file, draft status information, etc. I think this >> would work for you? > > More or less, I'd say, since that doesn't really fit the right-click + > "save as.." pattern, which is more efficient when you do it directly on > the WG agenda. Mmm, I see. But I don't really see why you can't right-click and save the html-ized version - the formatting is the same and the size overhead very small... I'm trying to understand the difference, and why raw text would be better in this case? >> > 3) It would be nice if wg status pages did also link to meeting >> > proceedings. >> >> Umm - the meeting minutes are provided there already. How would you >> like to link to the proceedings? It's not trivial, as the proceedings >> don't follow a consistent URL pattern - they sit on different servers >> and use year/month naming instead of meeting number naming. If you'll >> explain what you don't find in the current pages, I'll see if I can >> work out a good way of providing it. (If the pain of providing >> proceedings links has to be taken, I'll put it on the list, but it >> _is_ a pain...) > > I was thinking that using the datatracker proceedings pages might > perhaps be done > (https://datatracker.ietf.org/public/proceeding_interim.cgi?meeting_num=64). Oh, I see. Not really the proceedings, then, but the meeting materials page, in order to have the meeting slides during the meeting? > The missing thing is per-WG URLs, but maybe the tool team could have a > way to have HTML anchors added to the datatracker pages (?). > In any cases, I think the URL above could be usefuly provided as a > general per-meeting link on the tools.ietf.org pages (if per-WG link is > not feasible). Yes, a link to the meeting materials page could be put in. But I'd still like to understand what your ideal scene looks like - it now sounds as if the most bothersome case - link to the proceedings - wasn't really what you were after, so I'm trying to pin down the essence of what you'd want here... Henrik _______________________________________________ Tools-discuss mailing list Tools-discuss@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/tools-discuss From tools-discuss-bounces@ietf.org Tue Nov 22 03:26:25 2005 Received: from localhost.cnri.reston.va.us ([127.0.0.1] helo=megatron.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1EeTTt-0002Dh-6K; Tue, 22 Nov 2005 03:26:25 -0500 Received: from odin.ietf.org ([132.151.1.176] helo=ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1EeTTs-0002Dc-7A for tools-discuss@megatron.ietf.org; Tue, 22 Nov 2005 03:26:24 -0500 Received: from ietf-mx.ietf.org (ietf-mx [132.151.6.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id DAA16755 for ; Tue, 22 Nov 2005 03:25:44 -0500 (EST) Received: from p-mail1.rd.francetelecom.com ([195.101.245.15]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1EeTmU-0005zQ-Ik for tools-discuss@ietf.org; Tue, 22 Nov 2005 03:45:39 -0500 Received: from ftrdmel10.rd.francetelecom.fr ([10.193.117.156]) by ftrdsmtp1.rd.francetelecom.fr with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.211); Tue, 22 Nov 2005 09:26:08 +0100 Received: from l-8613.rd.francetelecom.fr ([10.193.15.140]) by ftrdmel10.rd.francetelecom.fr with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.211); Tue, 22 Nov 2005 09:26:08 +0100 Subject: Re: [Tools-discuss] Comments on wg status pages From: Thomas Morin To: Henrik Levkowetz In-Reply-To: <43820473.9030609@levkowetz.com> References: <1132247369.20783.37.camel@wintermute> <437E2214.6070201@levkowetz.com> <1132576598.8735.16.camel@wintermute> <43820473.9030609@levkowetz.com> Content-Type: text/plain Organization: France Telecom R&D Date: Tue, 22 Nov 2005 09:26:18 +0100 Message-Id: <1132647978.21997.12.camel@wintermute> Mime-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Evolution 2.4.1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-OriginalArrivalTime: 22 Nov 2005 08:26:08.0196 (UTC) FILETIME=[633E3840:01C5EF3E] X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 10d3e4e3c32e363f129e380e644649be Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Cc: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-BeenThere: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF Tools Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: tools-discuss-bounces@ietf.org Errors-To: tools-discuss-bounces@ietf.org Henrik Levkowetz: > > on 2005-11-21 13:36 Thomas Morin said the following: > > Henrik Levkowetz: > >> > 2) the HTMLized agendas have a drawback : they don't link to text > >> > versions of the draft (they link to htmlized versions). This is a pain > >> > when you want to download a bunch of drafts, before a meeting, to have > >> > them on your disk and no need for the network to be up, or for printing > >> > them with something else than your browser. > >> > I would dare to suggest the following : > >> > - make draft-name a link to the raw text file > >> > - put a (very) little "HTML" icon, linking to the htmlized version > >> > Alternatively, you could also chose to only link the raw text version. > >> > >> There's already a plan to complement the html-ized drafts with a link > >> to the raw text file, draft status information, etc. I think this > >> would work for you? > > > > More or less, I'd say, since that doesn't really fit the right-click + > > "save as.." pattern, which is more efficient when you do it directly on > > the WG agenda. > > Mmm, I see. But I don't really see why you can't right-click and save > the html-ized version - the formatting is the same and the size overhead > very small... I'm trying to understand the difference, and why raw text > would be better in this case? When reading the agenda, I'd like to right-click+save-as the drafts. It can't currently be done easily because, the filename proposed is "rfcmarkup.cgi" for all files. That is the first small issue. It could be an improvement to have the draft name be the suggested filename for save as (e.g. by playing with apache's mod_rewrite to have URLs appear like "../rfcmarkup.cgi/draft-foo-....txt.html"). But the second thing is that, for easy printing (like to read in the plane before the meeting:) it seems to me quite preferable to have the .txt as input to [your prefered pretty printing tool]. That's why I was suggesting two links: one to the raw txt file, one to the htmlized file. > >> > 3) It would be nice if wg status pages did also link to meeting > >> > proceedings. > >> > >> Umm - the meeting minutes are provided there already. How would you > >> like to link to the proceedings? It's not trivial, as the proceedings > >> don't follow a consistent URL pattern - they sit on different servers > >> and use year/month naming instead of meeting number naming. If you'll > >> explain what you don't find in the current pages, I'll see if I can > >> work out a good way of providing it. (If the pain of providing > >> proceedings links has to be taken, I'll put it on the list, but it > >> _is_ a pain...) > > > > I was thinking that using the datatracker proceedings pages might > > perhaps be done > > (https://datatracker.ietf.org/public/proceeding_interim.cgi?meeting_num=64). > > Oh, I see. Not really the proceedings, then, but the meeting materials > page, in order to have the meeting slides during the meeting? Yes, I think quick links to the meeting presentations (I thought they were called "proceedings") would be very useful (more for reference after the meeting, since they usually are not online before). > > The missing thing is per-WG URLs, but maybe the tool team could have a > > way to have HTML anchors added to the datatracker pages (?). > > In any cases, I think the URL above could be usefuly provided as a > > general per-meeting link on the tools.ietf.org pages (if per-WG link is > > not feasible). > > Yes, a link to the meeting materials page could be put in. But I'd still > like to understand what your ideal scene looks like - it now sounds as if > the most bothersome case - link to the proceedings - wasn't really what > you were after, so I'm trying to pin down the essence of what you'd want > here... Well, its indeed links to the meeting presentations that I'd like to have. These are linked both from "datatracker meeting materials" pages and from the "meeting proceedings" to the same (cumbersome) URLs ("../aug05/l3vpn-2.pdf"). But with anchors added to the "datatracker meeting materials" pages, it could become a reliable linking pattern like : https://datatracker.ietf.org/public/meeting_materials.cgi?meeting_num=64#l3vpn I hope my suggestions are clearer now. Thanks for your patience... :) -Thomas _______________________________________________ Tools-discuss mailing list Tools-discuss@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/tools-discuss From tools-discuss-bounces@ietf.org Tue Nov 22 05:09:21 2005 Received: from localhost.cnri.reston.va.us ([127.0.0.1] helo=megatron.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1EeV5U-0002CN-W0; Tue, 22 Nov 2005 05:09:21 -0500 Received: from odin.ietf.org ([132.151.1.176] helo=ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1EeV5U-0002Bw-5J for tools-discuss@megatron.ietf.org; Tue, 22 Nov 2005 05:09:20 -0500 Received: from ietf-mx.ietf.org (ietf-mx [132.151.6.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id FAA26334 for ; Tue, 22 Nov 2005 05:08:42 -0500 (EST) Received: from av9-1-sn3.vrr.skanova.net ([81.228.9.185]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1EeVO7-0001J0-EB for tools-discuss@ietf.org; Tue, 22 Nov 2005 05:28:35 -0500 Received: by av9-1-sn3.vrr.skanova.net (Postfix, from userid 502) id 3F07537F63; Tue, 22 Nov 2005 11:08:55 +0100 (CET) Received: from smtp3-1-sn3.vrr.skanova.net (smtp3-1-sn3.vrr.skanova.net [81.228.9.101]) by av9-1-sn3.vrr.skanova.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1C30037EAB; Tue, 22 Nov 2005 11:08:55 +0100 (CET) Received: from shiraz.levkowetz.com (81-224-201-50-no45.tbcn.telia.com [81.224.201.50]) by smtp3-1-sn3.vrr.skanova.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0857437E46; Tue, 22 Nov 2005 11:08:51 +0100 (CET) Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]) by shiraz.levkowetz.com with esmtp (Exim 4.54) id 1EeV50-0008V8-W0; Tue, 22 Nov 2005 11:08:51 +0100 Message-ID: <4382EE32.3080503@levkowetz.com> Date: Tue, 22 Nov 2005 11:08:50 +0100 From: Henrik Levkowetz User-Agent: Mozilla Thunderbird 1.0.7 (Macintosh/20050923) X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Thomas Morin Subject: Re: [Tools-discuss] Comments on wg status pages References: <1132247369.20783.37.camel@wintermute> <437E2214.6070201@levkowetz.com> <1132576598.8735.16.camel@wintermute> <43820473.9030609@levkowetz.com> <1132647978.21997.12.camel@wintermute> In-Reply-To: <1132647978.21997.12.camel@wintermute> X-Enigmail-Version: 0.93.0.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-SA-Exim-Connect-IP: 127.0.0.1 X-SA-Exim-Mail-From: henrik@levkowetz.com X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No (on shiraz.levkowetz.com); SAEximRunCond expanded to false X-Spam-Score: 0.1 (/) X-Scan-Signature: c3a18ef96977fc9bcc21a621cbf1174b Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Cc: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-BeenThere: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF Tools Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: tools-discuss-bounces@ietf.org Errors-To: tools-discuss-bounces@ietf.org Hi Thomas, on 2005-11-22 09:26 Thomas Morin said the following: > Henrik Levkowetz: [...] >> Mmm, I see. But I don't really see why you can't right-click and save >> the html-ized version - the formatting is the same and the size overhead >> very small... I'm trying to understand the difference, and why raw text >> would be better in this case? > > When reading the agenda, I'd like to right-click+save-as the drafts. > It can't currently be done easily because, the filename proposed is > "rfcmarkup.cgi" for all files. That is the first small issue. Ah! That certainly is an impediment! Ok, got that. > It could be an improvement to have the draft name be the suggested > filename for save as (e.g. by playing with apache's mod_rewrite to have > URLs appear like "../rfcmarkup.cgi/draft-foo-....txt.html"). > > But the second thing is that, for easy printing (like to read in the > plane before the meeting:) it seems to me quite preferable to have > the .txt as input to [your prefered pretty printing tool]. Ok, could you give me an example of one where the result differs? I'm mostly using a2ps myself, and I haven't noticed any trouble in this respect... > That's why I was suggesting two links: one to the raw txt file, one to > the htmlized file. Yes. My problem is of course that I need to understand why a certain proposal makes sense... [...] >> >> Oh, I see. Not really the proceedings, then, but the meeting materials >> page, in order to have the meeting slides during the meeting? > > Yes, I think quick links to the meeting presentations (I thought they > were called "proceedings") would be very useful (more for reference > after the meeting, since they usually are not online before). Right. (I think you will find that with the new upload system, meeting materials will increasingly be in place at least during the meetings, from the meeting materials page). >> > The missing thing is per-WG URLs, but maybe the tool team could have a >> > way to have HTML anchors added to the datatracker pages (?). >> > In any cases, I think the URL above could be usefuly provided as a >> > general per-meeting link on the tools.ietf.org pages (if per-WG link is >> > not feasible). >> >> Yes, a link to the meeting materials page could be put in. But I'd still >> like to understand what your ideal scene looks like - it now sounds as if >> the most bothersome case - link to the proceedings - wasn't really what >> you were after, so I'm trying to pin down the essence of what you'd want >> here... > > Well, its indeed links to the meeting presentations that I'd like to > have. These are linked both from "datatracker meeting materials" > pages and from the "meeting proceedings" to the same (cumbersome) > URLs ("../aug05/l3vpn-2.pdf"). But with anchors added to the > "datatracker meeting materials" pages, it could become a reliable > linking pattern like : > https://datatracker.ietf.org/public/meeting_materials.cgi?meeting_num=64#l3vpn> > I hope my suggestions are clearer now. Thanks for your patience... :) Ok, got it. My plan has actually been to place links to the individual presentations in the working groups agendas. To make this slightly more easy to work with, I've suggested that the secretariat change the current re-naming of slides, to retain the original names. But that aside, I thought I could do something like this manually edited example: http://www1.tools.ietf.org/wg/l3vpn/agenda/64 It seems to me that this might work for you. What I did not want to do was to dig into the actual proceedings (e.g., http://www3.ietf.org/proceedings/05aug/index.html) which seem to be hand-edited and vary in link names from year to year. Regards, Henrik _______________________________________________ Tools-discuss mailing list Tools-discuss@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/tools-discuss From tools-discuss-bounces@ietf.org Wed Nov 30 10:06:03 2005 Received: from localhost.cnri.reston.va.us ([127.0.0.1] helo=megatron.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1EhTX1-0003FU-5C; Wed, 30 Nov 2005 10:06:03 -0500 Received: from odin.ietf.org ([132.151.1.176] helo=ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1Efztr-000812-Ab for tools-discuss@megatron.ietf.org; Sat, 26 Nov 2005 08:15:31 -0500 Received: from ietf-mx.ietf.org (ietf-mx [132.151.6.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id IAA09247 for ; Sat, 26 Nov 2005 08:14:48 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail08.powweb.com ([66.152.97.41]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1Eg0DJ-0000oa-IM for tools-discuss@ietf.org; Sat, 26 Nov 2005 08:35:38 -0500 Received: from webmail.coasttocoastresearch.com (powweb03.powweb.com [66.152.97.135]) by mail08.powweb.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 94010A23BA for ; Sat, 26 Nov 2005 05:15:17 -0800 (PST) Content-Type: text/plain Content-Disposition: inline Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable MIME-Version: 1.0 From: "Lowell Thomas" To: tools-discuss@ietf.org Date: Sat, 26 Nov 2005 06:15:17 -0700 (PDT) Subject: Re: [Tools-discuss] ABNF tools X-Mailer: PowWeb Hosting Webmail version 3.0 Message-Id: <20051126131517.94010A23BA@mail08.powweb.com> X-Spam-Score: 0.7 (/) X-Scan-Signature: ea4ac80f790299f943f0a53be7e1a21a Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Mailman-Approved-At: Wed, 30 Nov 2005 10:06:01 -0500 X-BeenThere: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF Tools Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: tools-discuss-bounces@ietf.org Errors-To: tools-discuss-bounces@ietf.org on Tue, 28 Jun 2005 10:03:32 +0200 Henrik said the following:=0D >Hi Wayne,=0D >=0D > Nice tools - I've added them to the tools.ietf.org pages under=0D >Validation tools.=0D >=0D >Thanks!=0D >=0D > Henrik=0D =0D Henrik,=0D =0D Thanks for adding APG =96 an ABNF Parser Generator - to your verification t= ools page. I just wanted to let you and the readers of this group know abou= t the latest APG release, Version 3.1. It fixes a bug in the recursion anal= ysis and in the process I=92ve completely re-written the discussion and the= code for doing recursion analysis. In addition to the normal ABNF syntax c= hecking, it now reports on infinite, cyclic, left, right and nested recursi= ve rules as well as identifying empty string acceptors (I've seen some empt= y string acceptors pop up in RFCs where I'm sure the authors didn't intend = for them to be.)=0D =0D In addition to ABNF grammar checking, APG also generates a recursive-decent= parser for the grammar and the recursiveness of the rules is important to = know.=0D =0D Thanks,=0D Lowell Thomas=0D http://www.coasttocoastresearch.com/=0D _______________________________________________ Tools-discuss mailing list Tools-discuss@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/tools-discuss