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From: Chloe Martindale <chloemartindale@gmail.com>
Date: Mon, 1 Jun 2020 10:53:31 +0100
Message-ID: <CAL+7JtSb9qZ4Uueq4hDQvf3_cpGN3hS2_kT655aSACGbWivi5A@mail.gmail.com>
To: Yumi Sakemi <yumi.sakemi@lepidum.co.jp>
Cc: crypto-panel@irtf.org, "Stanislav V. Smyshlyaev" <smyshsv@gmail.com>, cfrg-chairs@ietf.org,  Tetsutaro Kobayashi <tetsutaro.kobayashi.dr@hco.ntt.co.jp>,  SAITO Tsunekazu <tsunekazu.saito.hg@hco.ntt.co.jp>
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Archived-At: <https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/crypto-panel/bEUXrbmmWhIeF0voo3njiC35vIc>
Subject: Re: [Crypto-panel] Request for review: draft-irtf-cfrg-pairing-friendly-curves-03
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Dear Yumi, dear all,

thank you for the update and for involving me in your thought process
regarding the curve choices. I understand and agree with your reasoning
(and approach) regarding including both BLS12-381 and BN462, however I
think I would make a different 'safer choice'.

My reason is this: if the attack is improved further (which you are
completely right, it may), it is very likely to have a bigger impact on
curves constructed via polynomial methods with embedding degree 8 (such as
BN462) than on any other curves for this security level, so it's not
unlikely that the security of BN462 would be pushed below 128 bits. A safer
choice in my view would be to take the Cocks-Pinch curve (not constructed
using polynomial methods) defined using a 544-bit prime implemented in
RELIC, from [GMT19]*. The TNFS attacks cannot be applied to Cocks-Pinch
curves (at least not without a fundamental new attack idea, since they rely
on the polynomial construction), so small improvements will not decrease
the security level at all, and this curve is actually still more efficient
than BN462 so there's nothing to lose there. I appreciate that such a
choice would mean also including some background on Cocks-Pinch and a
reference/short explanation of the fact that TNFS attacks don't apply to
these, which would be a major change to the original document, so I
appreciate it if you'd rather not do this, but just thought I'd suggest it
as I think it would increase the lifetime of your document.

*In your draft this is [GME19], but it should be [GMT19], and can now be
updated to the peer-reviewed version of course (this is the paper I pointed
out in my review).

All the best,
Chloe

On Fri, 29 May 2020 at 16:21, Yumi Sakemi <yumi.sakemi@lepidum.co.jp> wrote=
:

> Dear Chloe
>
> We appreciate a lot of constructive comments received at Expert Review.
>
> We are currently working on updating our draft.
> Last week, Nick created a repository for pairing-friendly curves on
> CFRG's official GitHub, so we plan to update our draft using the issue
> tracker.
> The updating for your comments will be made available to you on the
> following issue page.
>
> https://github.com/cfrg/draft-irtf-cfrg-pairing-friendly-curves/issues
>
> We will contact you again when all the comments have been updated.
> In that case, we would be glad if you could check them.
>
> In addition, before updating, there is a comment that we would like to
> inform you about the policy of update.
> The comment is about the recommended curve for 128-bit security level.
>
> First of all, thank you for teaching us a peer-reviewed paper for
> BLS12-381.
> The comment is about the recommended curve for 128-bit security level.
> Due to our lack of investigation, we made the wrong decision that
> BLS12-381 was not matched in our selection policy.
>
> Your comment pointed out that BLS12-381 is moved to the recommended
> curve and BN462 is moved to the Appendix.
> We understood the disadvantages of BN462 that you were concerned
> about, but we would like to recommend both BLS12-381 and BN462.
> The reason is as follows.
>
> CFRG aims to standardize cryptographic technology for future Internet use=
.
> We agree that BLS12-381 with a 126-bit security level is the best
> match as a curve of 128-bit security level "at this time" from the
> viewpoint of security and efficiency.
> On the other hand, the security of BLS12-381 is already less than
> 128bit, so from the viewpoint of future use, if the attack is improved
> even a little, it will not be suitable for a curve of 128-bit security
> level.
> Considering that the curve of 128-bit security level is often used at
> current.
> So, we would like to recommend both BLS12-381 and BN462 considering
> the future use and the safety side.
>
> However, as you pointed out, BN462 has the disadvantage of being too
> slow compared to BLS12-381.
> Then, the reader will be confused if there are two parameters of
> 128-bit security level, so we will add the basis for selection by
> adding the explanation of merits and demerits for each parameter.
> And, we will also add a description about the disadvantages of BN462
> regarding efficiency.
>
> If you have any problems with the updating policy, we would like you to
> comment.
>
> Best regards,
> Yumi
>
>
>
>
>
>
> 2020=E5=B9=B44=E6=9C=8827=E6=97=A5(=E6=9C=88) 21:58 Yumi Sakemi <yumi.sak=
emi@lepidum.co.jp>:
> >
> > Dear Chloe
> >
> > I appreciate your review.
> > I'm very glad to receive many constructive comments!
> > I will discuss about your comments with co-authors and revise our
> > draft to reflect your comments in our draft.
> > I think it will be a better draft by reflecting your comments.
> >
> > As co-author Tsunekazu e-mailed, we're  planning to submit version 04,
> > because we were independently working on updating of abstract,
> > introduction (sec. 1.3) and proofreading of English in parallel with
> > the expert review.
> > (Version 04 will not be reflected your comments.)
> >
> > Comments from Chloe will be reflected in the version 05.
> > We will submit version 05 in mid-May and we will report you when we
> > submit version 05.
> >
> > Dear Stanislav
> >
> > Thank you very much for proceeding to the Expert review.
> > We received a lot of constructive comments from Chloe, so I think it
> > is difficult to manage comments by email.
> > (Because there are over 100 comments from Chloe.)
> >
> > Therefore, I would like to use the issue management function of GitHub
> > so that it is easy to check the reflecting status of Chloe's comments.
> > So, I'd like to use the repository of pairing-friendly curves draft on
> > CFRG's GitHub
> > because BLS signature which is similar in terms of IRTF stream is also
> > registered on the GitHub.
> > Could you register the repository for the draft of pairing-friendly
> > curves on the following CFRG's GitHub?
> >
> > https://github.com/cfrg
> >
> > Best regards,
> > Yumi
> >
> > 2020=E5=B9=B44=E6=9C=8827=E6=97=A5(=E6=9C=88) 10:09 SAITO Tsunekazu <ts=
unekazu.saito.hg@hco.ntt.co.jp>:
> > >
> > > Dear Chloe, Stanislav,
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > This is Tsunekazu.
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > We plan to update the draft to version 04 soon.
> > >
> > > As the contents of the update, we changed the wording of Section 1.3
> and security consideration.
> > >
> > > Yumi will submit the 4th edition, so please wait a moment.
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > Best regards,
> > >
> > > Tsunekazu
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > From: Stanislav V. Smyshlyaev <smyshsv@gmail.com>
> > > Sent: Sunday, April 26, 2020 2:30 PM
> > > To: Chloe Martindale <chloemartindale@gmail.com>; SAITO Tsunekazu <
> tsunekazu.saito.hg@hco.ntt.co.jp>; Tetsutaro Kobayashi <
> tetsutaro.kobayashi.dr@hco.ntt.co.jp>; Yumi Sakemi <
> yumi.sakemi@lepidum.co.jp>
> > > Cc: cfrg-chairs@ietf.org; crypto-panel@irtf.org
> > > Subject: Re: [Crypto-panel] Request for review:
> draft-irtf-cfrg-pairing-friendly-curves-03
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > Dear Chloe,
> > >
> > > Many thanks for your review (such a great and a prompt one!).
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > Dear Yumi, Saito, Tetsutaro, do you plan to update your draft taking
> into account Chloe=E2=80=99s review?
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > Best regards,
> > >
> > > Stanislav
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > =D0=BF=D1=82, 24 =D0=B0=D0=BF=D1=80. 2020 =D0=B3. =D0=B2 19:49, Chloe=
 Martindale <
> chloemartindale@gmail.com>:
> > >
> > > Hi all,
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > review is attached.
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > All the best,
> > >
> > > Chloe
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > On Tue, 21 Apr 2020 at 18:05, Stanislav V. Smyshlyaev <
> smyshsv@gmail.com> wrote:
> > >
> > > Sure - it is
> > >
> > > https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-irtf-cfrg-pairing-friendly-curves-0=
3
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > Thank you again!
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > Regards,
> > >
> > > Stanislav
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > =D0=B2=D1=82, 21 =D0=B0=D0=BF=D1=80. 2020 =D0=B3. =D0=B2 19:10, Chloe=
 Martindale <
> chloemartindale@gmail.com>:
> > >
> > > Just to be sure, can you point me towards the most recent version of
> the draft please?
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > Thanks,
> > >
> > > Chloe
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > On Tue, 21 Apr 2020 at 13:17, Stanislav V. Smyshlyaev <
> smyshsv@gmail.com> wrote:
> > >
> > > Great, many thanks, Chloe!
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > Kind regards,
> > >
> > > Nick, Alexey, Stanislav
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > On Tue, 21 Apr 2020 at 15:16, Chloe Martindale <
> chloemartindale@gmail.com> wrote:
> > >
> > > I'll take a look this week.
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > All the best,
> > >
> > > Chloe
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > On Tue, 21 Apr 2020, 13:10 Stanislav V. Smyshlyaev, <smyshsv@gmail.co=
m>
> wrote:
> > >
> > > Dear Crypto Panel members,
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > The authors of the Pairing-Friendly Curves draft have addressed the
> concerns raised during the discussion and are ready to move to the next
> stage with the draft.
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > Alexey, Nick and I would like to ask Crypto Review Panel members abou=
t
> the review(s) of draft-irtf-cfrg-pairing-friendly-curves-03.
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > This memo introduces pairing-friendly curves used for constructing
> pairing-based cryptography. It describes recommended parameters for each
> security level and recent implementations of pairing-friendly curves.
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > Can we have any volunteers, please?..
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > Best regards,
> > >
> > > Stanislav (on behalf of chairs)
> > >
> > > _______________________________________________
> > > Crypto-panel mailing list
> > > Crypto-panel@irtf.org
> > > https://www.irtf.org/mailman/listinfo/crypto-panel
> >
> >
> >
> > --
> > Yumi Sakemi, Ph. D.
> > Lepidum Co. Ltd.
> > E-Mail: yumi.sakemi@lepidum.co.jp
>
>
>
> --
> Yumi Sakemi, Ph. D.
> Lepidum Co. Ltd.
>
> Tel: +81-3 6276 5103
> E-Mail: yumi.sakemi@lepidum.co.jp
>

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Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

<div dir=3D"ltr"><div>Dear Yumi, dear all,</div><div><br></div><div>thank y=
ou for the update and for involving me in your thought process regarding th=
e curve choices. I understand and agree with your reasoning (and approach) =
regarding including both BLS12-381 and BN462, however I think I would make =
a different &#39;safer choice&#39;. <br></div><div><br></div><div>My reason=
 is this: if the attack is improved further (which you are completely right=
, it may), it is very likely to have a bigger impact on curves constructed =
via polynomial methods with embedding degree 8 (such as BN462) than on any =
other curves for this security level, so it&#39;s not unlikely that the sec=
urity of BN462 would be pushed below 128 bits. A safer choice in my view wo=
uld be to take the Cocks-Pinch curve (not constructed using polynomial meth=
ods) defined using a 544-bit prime implemented in RELIC, from [GMT19]*. The=
 TNFS attacks cannot be applied to Cocks-Pinch curves (at least not without=
 a fundamental new attack idea, since they rely on the polynomial construct=
ion), so small improvements will not decrease the security level at all, an=
d this curve is actually still more efficient than BN462 so there&#39;s not=
hing to lose there. I appreciate that such a choice would mean also includi=
ng some background on Cocks-Pinch and a reference/short explanation of the =
fact that TNFS attacks don&#39;t apply to these, which would be a major cha=
nge to the original document, so I appreciate it if you&#39;d rather not do=
 this, but just thought I&#39;d suggest it as I think it would increase the=
 lifetime of your document.</div><div><br></div><div>*In your draft this is=
 [GME19], but it should be [GMT19], and can now be updated to the peer-revi=
ewed version of course (this is the paper I pointed out in my review).</div=
><div><br></div><div>All the best,</div><div>Chloe<br></div></div><br><div =
class=3D"gmail_quote"><div dir=3D"ltr" class=3D"gmail_attr">On Fri, 29 May =
2020 at 16:21, Yumi Sakemi &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:yumi.sakemi@lepidum.co.jp"=
>yumi.sakemi@lepidum.co.jp</a>&gt; wrote:<br></div><blockquote class=3D"gma=
il_quote" style=3D"margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-left:1px solid rgb(204,2=
04,204);padding-left:1ex">Dear Chloe<br>
<br>
We appreciate a lot of constructive comments received at Expert Review.<br>
<br>
We are currently working on updating our draft.<br>
Last week, Nick created a repository for pairing-friendly curves on<br>
CFRG&#39;s official GitHub, so we plan to update our draft using the issue<=
br>
tracker.<br>
The updating for your comments will be made available to you on the<br>
following issue page.<br>
<br>
<a href=3D"https://github.com/cfrg/draft-irtf-cfrg-pairing-friendly-curves/=
issues" rel=3D"noreferrer" target=3D"_blank">https://github.com/cfrg/draft-=
irtf-cfrg-pairing-friendly-curves/issues</a><br>
<br>
We will contact you again when all the comments have been updated.<br>
In that case, we would be glad if you could check them.<br>
<br>
In addition, before updating, there is a comment that we would like to<br>
inform you about the policy of update.<br>
The comment is about the recommended curve for 128-bit security level.<br>
<br>
First of all, thank you for teaching us a peer-reviewed paper for BLS12-381=
.<br>
The comment is about the recommended curve for 128-bit security level.<br>
Due to our lack of investigation, we made the wrong decision that<br>
BLS12-381 was not matched in our selection policy.<br>
<br>
Your comment pointed out that BLS12-381 is moved to the recommended<br>
curve and BN462 is moved to the Appendix.<br>
We understood the disadvantages of BN462 that you were concerned<br>
about, but we would like to recommend both BLS12-381 and BN462.<br>
The reason is as follows.<br>
<br>
CFRG aims to standardize cryptographic technology for future Internet use.<=
br>
We agree that BLS12-381 with a 126-bit security level is the best<br>
match as a curve of 128-bit security level &quot;at this time&quot; from th=
e<br>
viewpoint of security and efficiency.<br>
On the other hand, the security of BLS12-381 is already less than<br>
128bit, so from the viewpoint of future use, if the attack is improved<br>
even a little, it will not be suitable for a curve of 128-bit security<br>
level.<br>
Considering that the curve of 128-bit security level is often used at curre=
nt.<br>
So, we would like to recommend both BLS12-381 and BN462 considering<br>
the future use and the safety side.<br>
<br>
However, as you pointed out, BN462 has the disadvantage of being too<br>
slow compared to BLS12-381.<br>
Then, the reader will be confused if there are two parameters of<br>
128-bit security level, so we will add the basis for selection by<br>
adding the explanation of merits and demerits for each parameter.<br>
And, we will also add a description about the disadvantages of BN462<br>
regarding efficiency.<br>
<br>
If you have any problems with the updating policy, we would like you to com=
ment.<br>
<br>
Best regards,<br>
Yumi<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
2020=E5=B9=B44=E6=9C=8827=E6=97=A5(=E6=9C=88) 21:58 Yumi Sakemi &lt;<a href=
=3D"mailto:yumi.sakemi@lepidum.co.jp" target=3D"_blank">yumi.sakemi@lepidum=
.co.jp</a>&gt;:<br>
&gt;<br>
&gt; Dear Chloe<br>
&gt;<br>
&gt; I appreciate your review.<br>
&gt; I&#39;m very glad to receive many constructive comments!<br>
&gt; I will discuss about your comments with co-authors and revise our<br>
&gt; draft to reflect your comments in our draft.<br>
&gt; I think it will be a better draft by reflecting your comments.<br>
&gt;<br>
&gt; As co-author Tsunekazu e-mailed, we&#39;re=C2=A0 planning to submit ve=
rsion 04,<br>
&gt; because we were independently working on updating of abstract,<br>
&gt; introduction (sec. 1.3) and proofreading of English in parallel with<b=
r>
&gt; the expert review.<br>
&gt; (Version 04 will not be reflected your comments.)<br>
&gt;<br>
&gt; Comments from Chloe will be reflected in the version 05.<br>
&gt; We will submit version 05 in mid-May and we will report you when we<br=
>
&gt; submit version 05.<br>
&gt;<br>
&gt; Dear Stanislav<br>
&gt;<br>
&gt; Thank you very much for proceeding to the Expert review.<br>
&gt; We received a lot of constructive comments from Chloe, so I think it<b=
r>
&gt; is difficult to manage comments by email.<br>
&gt; (Because there are over 100 comments from Chloe.)<br>
&gt;<br>
&gt; Therefore, I would like to use the issue management function of GitHub=
<br>
&gt; so that it is easy to check the reflecting status of Chloe&#39;s comme=
nts.<br>
&gt; So, I&#39;d like to use the repository of pairing-friendly curves draf=
t on<br>
&gt; CFRG&#39;s GitHub<br>
&gt; because BLS signature which is similar in terms of IRTF stream is also=
<br>
&gt; registered on the GitHub.<br>
&gt; Could you register the repository for the draft of pairing-friendly<br=
>
&gt; curves on the following CFRG&#39;s GitHub?<br>
&gt;<br>
&gt; <a href=3D"https://github.com/cfrg" rel=3D"noreferrer" target=3D"_blan=
k">https://github.com/cfrg</a><br>
&gt;<br>
&gt; Best regards,<br>
&gt; Yumi<br>
&gt;<br>
&gt; 2020=E5=B9=B44=E6=9C=8827=E6=97=A5(=E6=9C=88) 10:09 SAITO Tsunekazu &l=
t;<a href=3D"mailto:tsunekazu.saito.hg@hco.ntt.co.jp" target=3D"_blank">tsu=
nekazu.saito.hg@hco.ntt.co.jp</a>&gt;:<br>
&gt; &gt;<br>
&gt; &gt; Dear Chloe, Stanislav,<br>
&gt; &gt;<br>
&gt; &gt;<br>
&gt; &gt;<br>
&gt; &gt; This is Tsunekazu.<br>
&gt; &gt;<br>
&gt; &gt;<br>
&gt; &gt;<br>
&gt; &gt; We plan to update the draft to version 04 soon.<br>
&gt; &gt;<br>
&gt; &gt; As the contents of the update, we changed the wording of Section =
1.3 and security consideration.<br>
&gt; &gt;<br>
&gt; &gt; Yumi will submit the 4th edition, so please wait a moment.<br>
&gt; &gt;<br>
&gt; &gt;<br>
&gt; &gt;<br>
&gt; &gt; Best regards,<br>
&gt; &gt;<br>
&gt; &gt; Tsunekazu<br>
&gt; &gt;<br>
&gt; &gt;<br>
&gt; &gt;<br>
&gt; &gt; From: Stanislav V. Smyshlyaev &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:smyshsv@gmail=
.com" target=3D"_blank">smyshsv@gmail.com</a>&gt;<br>
&gt; &gt; Sent: Sunday, April 26, 2020 2:30 PM<br>
&gt; &gt; To: Chloe Martindale &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:chloemartindale@gmail.=
com" target=3D"_blank">chloemartindale@gmail.com</a>&gt;; SAITO Tsunekazu &=
lt;<a href=3D"mailto:tsunekazu.saito.hg@hco.ntt.co.jp" target=3D"_blank">ts=
unekazu.saito.hg@hco.ntt.co.jp</a>&gt;; Tetsutaro Kobayashi &lt;<a href=3D"=
mailto:tetsutaro.kobayashi.dr@hco.ntt.co.jp" target=3D"_blank">tetsutaro.ko=
bayashi.dr@hco.ntt.co.jp</a>&gt;; Yumi Sakemi &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:yumi.sa=
kemi@lepidum.co.jp" target=3D"_blank">yumi.sakemi@lepidum.co.jp</a>&gt;<br>
&gt; &gt; Cc: <a href=3D"mailto:cfrg-chairs@ietf.org" target=3D"_blank">cfr=
g-chairs@ietf.org</a>; <a href=3D"mailto:crypto-panel@irtf.org" target=3D"_=
blank">crypto-panel@irtf.org</a><br>
&gt; &gt; Subject: Re: [Crypto-panel] Request for review: draft-irtf-cfrg-p=
airing-friendly-curves-03<br>
&gt; &gt;<br>
&gt; &gt;<br>
&gt; &gt;<br>
&gt; &gt; Dear Chloe,<br>
&gt; &gt;<br>
&gt; &gt; Many thanks for your review (such a great and a prompt one!).<br>
&gt; &gt;<br>
&gt; &gt;<br>
&gt; &gt;<br>
&gt; &gt; Dear Yumi, Saito, Tetsutaro, do you plan to update your draft tak=
ing into account Chloe=E2=80=99s review?<br>
&gt; &gt;<br>
&gt; &gt;<br>
&gt; &gt;<br>
&gt; &gt; Best regards,<br>
&gt; &gt;<br>
&gt; &gt; Stanislav<br>
&gt; &gt;<br>
&gt; &gt;<br>
&gt; &gt;<br>
&gt; &gt; =D0=BF=D1=82, 24 =D0=B0=D0=BF=D1=80. 2020 =D0=B3. =D0=B2 19:49, C=
hloe Martindale &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:chloemartindale@gmail.com" target=3D"=
_blank">chloemartindale@gmail.com</a>&gt;:<br>
&gt; &gt;<br>
&gt; &gt; Hi all,<br>
&gt; &gt;<br>
&gt; &gt;<br>
&gt; &gt;<br>
&gt; &gt; review is attached.<br>
&gt; &gt;<br>
&gt; &gt;<br>
&gt; &gt;<br>
&gt; &gt; All the best,<br>
&gt; &gt;<br>
&gt; &gt; Chloe<br>
&gt; &gt;<br>
&gt; &gt;<br>
&gt; &gt;<br>
&gt; &gt; On Tue, 21 Apr 2020 at 18:05, Stanislav V. Smyshlyaev &lt;<a href=
=3D"mailto:smyshsv@gmail.com" target=3D"_blank">smyshsv@gmail.com</a>&gt; w=
rote:<br>
&gt; &gt;<br>
&gt; &gt; Sure - it is<br>
&gt; &gt;<br>
&gt; &gt; <a href=3D"https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-irtf-cfrg-pairing-fr=
iendly-curves-03" rel=3D"noreferrer" target=3D"_blank">https://tools.ietf.o=
rg/html/draft-irtf-cfrg-pairing-friendly-curves-03</a><br>
&gt; &gt;<br>
&gt; &gt;<br>
&gt; &gt;<br>
&gt; &gt; Thank you again!<br>
&gt; &gt;<br>
&gt; &gt;<br>
&gt; &gt;<br>
&gt; &gt; Regards,<br>
&gt; &gt;<br>
&gt; &gt; Stanislav<br>
&gt; &gt;<br>
&gt; &gt;<br>
&gt; &gt;<br>
&gt; &gt; =D0=B2=D1=82, 21 =D0=B0=D0=BF=D1=80. 2020 =D0=B3. =D0=B2 19:10, C=
hloe Martindale &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:chloemartindale@gmail.com" target=3D"=
_blank">chloemartindale@gmail.com</a>&gt;:<br>
&gt; &gt;<br>
&gt; &gt; Just to be sure, can you point me towards the most recent version=
 of the draft please?<br>
&gt; &gt;<br>
&gt; &gt;<br>
&gt; &gt;<br>
&gt; &gt; Thanks,<br>
&gt; &gt;<br>
&gt; &gt; Chloe<br>
&gt; &gt;<br>
&gt; &gt;<br>
&gt; &gt;<br>
&gt; &gt; On Tue, 21 Apr 2020 at 13:17, Stanislav V. Smyshlyaev &lt;<a href=
=3D"mailto:smyshsv@gmail.com" target=3D"_blank">smyshsv@gmail.com</a>&gt; w=
rote:<br>
&gt; &gt;<br>
&gt; &gt; Great, many thanks, Chloe!<br>
&gt; &gt;<br>
&gt; &gt;<br>
&gt; &gt;<br>
&gt; &gt; Kind regards,<br>
&gt; &gt;<br>
&gt; &gt; Nick, Alexey, Stanislav<br>
&gt; &gt;<br>
&gt; &gt;<br>
&gt; &gt;<br>
&gt; &gt; On Tue, 21 Apr 2020 at 15:16, Chloe Martindale &lt;<a href=3D"mai=
lto:chloemartindale@gmail.com" target=3D"_blank">chloemartindale@gmail.com<=
/a>&gt; wrote:<br>
&gt; &gt;<br>
&gt; &gt; I&#39;ll take a look this week.<br>
&gt; &gt;<br>
&gt; &gt;<br>
&gt; &gt;<br>
&gt; &gt; All the best,<br>
&gt; &gt;<br>
&gt; &gt; Chloe<br>
&gt; &gt;<br>
&gt; &gt;<br>
&gt; &gt;<br>
&gt; &gt; On Tue, 21 Apr 2020, 13:10 Stanislav V. Smyshlyaev, &lt;<a href=
=3D"mailto:smyshsv@gmail.com" target=3D"_blank">smyshsv@gmail.com</a>&gt; w=
rote:<br>
&gt; &gt;<br>
&gt; &gt; Dear Crypto Panel members,<br>
&gt; &gt;<br>
&gt; &gt;<br>
&gt; &gt;<br>
&gt; &gt; The authors of the Pairing-Friendly Curves draft have addressed t=
he concerns raised during the discussion and are ready to move to the next =
stage with the draft.<br>
&gt; &gt;<br>
&gt; &gt;<br>
&gt; &gt;<br>
&gt; &gt; Alexey, Nick and I would like to ask Crypto Review Panel members =
about the review(s) of draft-irtf-cfrg-pairing-friendly-curves-03.<br>
&gt; &gt;<br>
&gt; &gt;<br>
&gt; &gt;<br>
&gt; &gt; This memo introduces pairing-friendly curves used for constructin=
g pairing-based cryptography. It describes recommended parameters for each =
security level and recent implementations of pairing-friendly curves.<br>
&gt; &gt;<br>
&gt; &gt;<br>
&gt; &gt;<br>
&gt; &gt;<br>
&gt; &gt;<br>
&gt; &gt; Can we have any volunteers, please?..<br>
&gt; &gt;<br>
&gt; &gt;<br>
&gt; &gt;<br>
&gt; &gt;<br>
&gt; &gt;<br>
&gt; &gt; Best regards,<br>
&gt; &gt;<br>
&gt; &gt; Stanislav (on behalf of chairs)<br>
&gt; &gt;<br>
&gt; &gt; _______________________________________________<br>
&gt; &gt; Crypto-panel mailing list<br>
&gt; &gt; <a href=3D"mailto:Crypto-panel@irtf.org" target=3D"_blank">Crypto=
-panel@irtf.org</a><br>
&gt; &gt; <a href=3D"https://www.irtf.org/mailman/listinfo/crypto-panel" re=
l=3D"noreferrer" target=3D"_blank">https://www.irtf.org/mailman/listinfo/cr=
ypto-panel</a><br>
&gt;<br>
&gt;<br>
&gt;<br>
&gt; --<br>
&gt; Yumi Sakemi, Ph. D.<br>
&gt; Lepidum Co. Ltd.<br>
&gt; E-Mail: <a href=3D"mailto:yumi.sakemi@lepidum.co.jp" target=3D"_blank"=
>yumi.sakemi@lepidum.co.jp</a><br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
-- <br>
Yumi Sakemi, Ph. D.<br>
Lepidum Co. Ltd.<br>
<br>
Tel: +81-3 6276 5103<br>
E-Mail: <a href=3D"mailto:yumi.sakemi@lepidum.co.jp" target=3D"_blank">yumi=
.sakemi@lepidum.co.jp</a><br>
</blockquote></div>

--00000000000028fcb005a702c5e7--


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Date: Fri, 5 Jun 2020 07:17:53 +0300
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Subject: [Crypto-panel] Request for review: draft-irtf-cfrg-hash-to-curve-08
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--00000000000076596c05a74e8972
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Dear Crypto Panel members,

Alexey, Nick and I would like to ask Crypto Review Panel members about the
review(s) of draft-irtf-cfrg-hash-to-curve-08.

The document specifies a number of algorithms for encoding or hashing an
arbitrary string to a point on an elliptic curve.


Can we have any volunteers, please?


Best regards,
Stanislav (on behalf of chairs)

--00000000000076596c05a74e8972
Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

<div dir=3D"ltr">Dear Crypto Panel members,=C2=A0<div><br></div><div>Alexey=
, Nick and I would like to ask Crypto Review Panel members about the review=
(s) of draft-irtf-cfrg-hash-to-curve-08.</div><div><br></div><div>The docum=
ent specifies a number of algorithms for encoding or hashing an arbitrary s=
tring to a point on an elliptic curve.=C2=A0<br></div><div><br></div><div><=
br></div><div>Can we have any volunteers, please?</div><div><br></div><div>=
<br></div><div>Best regards,</div><div>Stanislav (on behalf of chairs)</div=
></div>

--00000000000076596c05a74e8972--


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From: Thomas Pornin <thomas.pornin@nccgroup.com>
To: "Stanislav V. Smyshlyaev" <smyshsv@gmail.com>, "crypto-panel@irtf.org" <crypto-panel@irtf.org>
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Subject: Re: [Crypto-panel] EXTERNAL: Request for review: draft-irtf-cfrg-hash-to-curve-08
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In-Reply-To: <27FC2D65-658D-4E21-8484-E95927CCA1BF@nccgroup.com>
From: "Stanislav V. Smyshlyaev" <smyshsv@gmail.com>
Date: Fri, 5 Jun 2020 15:10:41 +0300
Message-ID: <CAMr0u6kfk2LzdT6=J8pEfHodbbeuEtT33Ggi9vCg9EoTjR4uhw@mail.gmail.com>
To: Thomas Pornin <thomas.pornin=40nccgroup.com@dmarc.ietf.org>
Cc: "crypto-panel@irtf.org" <crypto-panel@irtf.org>,  "draft-irtf-cfrg-hash-to-curve.authors@ietf.org" <draft-irtf-cfrg-hash-to-curve.authors@ietf.org>,  "cfrg-chairs@ietf.org" <cfrg-chairs@ietf.org>
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Archived-At: <https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/crypto-panel/KTzX6INaZanNUZyHjN8fOn05Uhw>
Subject: Re: [Crypto-panel] EXTERNAL: Request for review: draft-irtf-cfrg-hash-to-curve-08
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Great, many thanks, Thomas!

Stanislav (for Chairs)

On Fri, 5 Jun 2020 at 14:53, Thomas Pornin <thomas.pornin=
40nccgroup.com@dmarc.ietf.org> wrote:

> I can do that.
>
>
>
> Thomas
>
>
>
> *From: *Crypto-panel <crypto-panel-bounces@irtf.org> on behalf of
> "Stanislav V. Smyshlyaev" <smyshsv@gmail.com>
> *Date: *Friday, June 5, 2020 at 00:17
> *To: *"crypto-panel@irtf.org" <crypto-panel@irtf.org>
> *Cc: *"draft-irtf-cfrg-hash-to-curve.authors@ietf.org" <
> draft-irtf-cfrg-hash-to-curve.authors@ietf.org>, "cfrg-chairs@ietf.org" <
> cfrg-chairs@ietf.org>
> *Subject: *EXTERNAL: [Crypto-panel] Request for review:
> draft-irtf-cfrg-hash-to-curve-08
>
>
>
> Dear Crypto Panel members,
>
>
>
> Alexey, Nick and I would like to ask Crypto Review Panel members about the
> review(s) of draft-irtf-cfrg-hash-to-curve-08.
>
>
>
> The document specifies a number of algorithms for encoding or hashing an
> arbitrary string to a point on an elliptic curve.
>
>
>
>
>
> Can we have any volunteers, please?
>
>
>
>
>
> Best regards,
>
> Stanislav (on behalf of chairs)
> _______________________________________________
> Crypto-panel mailing list
> Crypto-panel@irtf.org
> https://www.irtf.org/mailman/listinfo/crypto-panel
>

--0000000000000036ec05a7552747
Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

<div dir=3D"ltr">Great, many thanks, Thomas!<div><br></div><div>Stanislav (=
for Chairs)</div></div><br><div class=3D"gmail_quote"><div dir=3D"ltr" clas=
s=3D"gmail_attr">On Fri, 5 Jun 2020 at 14:53, Thomas Pornin &lt;thomas.porn=
in=3D<a href=3D"mailto:40nccgroup.com@dmarc.ietf.org">40nccgroup.com@dmarc.=
ietf.org</a>&gt; wrote:<br></div><blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D=
"margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-left:1px solid rgb(204,204,204);padding-le=
ft:1ex">





<div lang=3D"EN-CA">
<div class=3D"gmail-m_-8740720290093552681WordSection1">
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US">I can do that.<u></u><u></u></s=
pan></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US">Thomas<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></span></p>
<div style=3D"border-right:none;border-bottom:none;border-left:none;border-=
top:1pt solid rgb(181,196,223);padding:3pt 0cm 0cm">
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><b><span style=3D"font-size:12pt;color:black">From: =
</span></b><span style=3D"font-size:12pt;color:black">Crypto-panel &lt;<a h=
ref=3D"mailto:crypto-panel-bounces@irtf.org" target=3D"_blank">crypto-panel=
-bounces@irtf.org</a>&gt; on behalf of &quot;Stanislav V. Smyshlyaev&quot; =
&lt;<a href=3D"mailto:smyshsv@gmail.com" target=3D"_blank">smyshsv@gmail.co=
m</a>&gt;<br>
<b>Date: </b>Friday, June 5, 2020 at 00:17<br>
<b>To: </b>&quot;<a href=3D"mailto:crypto-panel@irtf.org" target=3D"_blank"=
>crypto-panel@irtf.org</a>&quot; &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:crypto-panel@irtf.or=
g" target=3D"_blank">crypto-panel@irtf.org</a>&gt;<br>
<b>Cc: </b>&quot;<a href=3D"mailto:draft-irtf-cfrg-hash-to-curve.authors@ie=
tf.org" target=3D"_blank">draft-irtf-cfrg-hash-to-curve.authors@ietf.org</a=
>&quot; &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:draft-irtf-cfrg-hash-to-curve.authors@ietf.or=
g" target=3D"_blank">draft-irtf-cfrg-hash-to-curve.authors@ietf.org</a>&gt;=
, &quot;<a href=3D"mailto:cfrg-chairs@ietf.org" target=3D"_blank">cfrg-chai=
rs@ietf.org</a>&quot; &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:cfrg-chairs@ietf.org" target=3D=
"_blank">cfrg-chairs@ietf.org</a>&gt;<br>
<b>Subject: </b>EXTERNAL: [Crypto-panel] Request for review: draft-irtf-cfr=
g-hash-to-curve-08<u></u><u></u></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Dear Crypto Panel members,=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Alexey, Nick and I would like to ask Crypto Review P=
anel members about the review(s) of draft-irtf-cfrg-hash-to-curve-08.<u></u=
><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">The document specifies a number of algorithms for en=
coding or hashing an arbitrary string to a point on an elliptic curve.=C2=
=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Can we have any volunteers, please?<u></u><u></u></p=
>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Best regards,<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Stanislav (on behalf of chairs)<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>

_______________________________________________<br>
Crypto-panel mailing list<br>
<a href=3D"mailto:Crypto-panel@irtf.org" target=3D"_blank">Crypto-panel@irt=
f.org</a><br>
<a href=3D"https://www.irtf.org/mailman/listinfo/crypto-panel" rel=3D"noref=
errer" target=3D"_blank">https://www.irtf.org/mailman/listinfo/crypto-panel=
</a><br>
</blockquote></div>

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Date: Fri, 05 Jun 2020 07:47:48 -0700
From: "Christopher Wood" <caw@heapingbits.net>
To: "Stanislav V. Smyshlyaev" <smyshsv@gmail.com>, "Thomas Pornin" <thomas.pornin=40nccgroup.com@dmarc.ietf.org>
Cc: "crypto-panel@irtf.org" <crypto-panel@irtf.org>, "draft-irtf-cfrg-hash-to-curve.authors@ietf.org" <draft-irtf-cfrg-hash-to-curve.authors@ietf.org>,  "cfrg-chairs@ietf.org" <cfrg-chairs@ietf.org>
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Archived-At: <https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/crypto-panel/70XXsfXKKlhTYgbCXSZ055hEPQo>
Subject: Re: [Crypto-panel]  =?utf-8?q?EXTERNAL=3A_Request_for_review=3A_draft?= =?utf-8?q?-irtf-cfrg-hash-to-curve-08?=
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On Fri, Jun 5, 2020, at 5:10 AM, Stanislav V. Smyshlyaev wrote:
> Great, many thanks, Thomas!

+1 :-)

Best,
Chris

> Stanislav (for Chairs)
> 
> On Fri, 5 Jun 2020 at 14:53, Thomas Pornin 
> <thomas.pornin=40nccgroup.com@dmarc.ietf.org> wrote:
> > I can do that.____
> 
> > __ __
> 
> > Thomas____
> 
> > __ __
> 
> > *From: *Crypto-panel <crypto-panel-bounces@irtf.org> on behalf of "Stanislav V. Smyshlyaev" <smyshsv@gmail.com>
> > *Date: *Friday, June 5, 2020 at 00:17
> > *To: *"crypto-panel@irtf.org" <crypto-panel@irtf.org>
> > *Cc: *"draft-irtf-cfrg-hash-to-curve.authors@ietf.org" <draft-irtf-cfrg-hash-to-curve.authors@ietf.org>, "cfrg-chairs@ietf.org" <cfrg-chairs@ietf.org>
> > *Subject: *EXTERNAL: [Crypto-panel] Request for review: draft-irtf-cfrg-hash-to-curve-08____
> 
> > __ __
> 
> > Dear Crypto Panel members, ____
> 
> > __ __
> 
> > Alexey, Nick and I would like to ask Crypto Review Panel members about the review(s) of draft-irtf-cfrg-hash-to-curve-08.____
> 
> > __ __
> 
> > The document specifies a number of algorithms for encoding or hashing an arbitrary string to a point on an elliptic curve. ____
> 
> > __ __
> 
> > __ __
> 
> > Can we have any volunteers, please?____
> 
> > __ __
> 
> > __ __
> 
> > Best regards,____
> 
> > Stanislav (on behalf of chairs)____
> 
> >  _______________________________________________
> >  Crypto-panel mailing list
> > Crypto-panel@irtf.org
> > https://www.irtf.org/mailman/listinfo/crypto-panel


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From: Nick Sullivan <nick@cloudflare.com>
Date: Mon, 8 Jun 2020 14:53:45 -0700
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Subject: [Crypto-panel] Request for review: draft-irtf-cfrg-hpke-04
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Dear Crypto Panel members,

Alexey, Stanislav and I would like to ask Crypto Review Panel members for a
review of https://www.ietf.org/id/draft-irtf-cfrg-hpke-04.html. The
document specifies a set of mechanisms to do hybrid public key encryption.
It can be thought of as a generalization of ECIES for any KEM.

This document went through last call and didn't receive many comments, so a
thorough review from a crypto panel member would be helpful to move this
document forward.

Who would like to volunteer?

Best regards,
Nick (on behalf of chairs)

--0000000000002525b605a799a6ae
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<div dir=3D"ltr">Dear Crypto Panel members, <br><br>Alexey, Stanislav and I=
 would like to ask Crypto Review Panel members for a review of=C2=A0<a href=
=3D"https://www.ietf.org/id/draft-irtf-cfrg-hpke-04.html">https://www.ietf.=
org/id/draft-irtf-cfrg-hpke-04.html</a>. The document specifies a set of me=
chanisms to do hybrid public key encryption. It can be thought of as a gene=
ralization of ECIES for any KEM.<div><br></div><div>This document went thro=
ugh last call and didn&#39;t receive=C2=A0many comments, so a thorough revi=
ew from a crypto panel member would be=C2=A0helpful to move this document f=
orward.<br><div><br></div><div>Who would like to=C2=A0volunteer?<br><br></d=
iv><div>Best regards,</div><div>Nick (on behalf of chairs)</div></div></div=
>

--0000000000002525b605a799a6ae--


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Subject: Re: [Crypto-panel] Request for review: draft-irtf-cfrg-hpke-04
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From: Stephen Farrell <stephen.farrell@cs.tcd.ie>
To: Nick Sullivan <nick=40cloudflare.com@dmarc.ietf.org>,
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Subject: Re: [Crypto-panel] Request for review: draft-irtf-cfrg-hpke-04
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I've implemented an earlier version [1] and will be
coding up the final one. Happy to do it, or for that
to be considered disqualifying:-)

Cheers,
S.

[1] https://github.com/sftcd/happykey

On 08/06/2020 22:53, Nick Sullivan wrote:
> Dear Crypto Panel members,
>=20
> Alexey, Stanislav and I would like to ask Crypto Review Panel members f=
or a
> review of https://www.ietf.org/id/draft-irtf-cfrg-hpke-04.html. The
> document specifies a set of mechanisms to do hybrid public key encrypti=
on.
> It can be thought of as a generalization of ECIES for any KEM.
>=20
> This document went through last call and didn't receive many comments, =
so a
> thorough review from a crypto panel member would be helpful to move thi=
s
> document forward.
>=20
> Who would like to volunteer?
>=20
> Best regards,
> Nick (on behalf of chairs)
>=20
>=20
> _______________________________________________
> Crypto-panel mailing list
> Crypto-panel@irtf.org
> https://www.irtf.org/mailman/listinfo/crypto-panel
>=20

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-----END PGP PUBLIC KEY BLOCK-----

--------------FB49F5CDC80E63959B2389BC--

--7vMLCMq3Du1c7trv13oeiwmsXQvJdd8Re--

--fK3fMVcTsN0Wo5DC8KyyfL2IbqEOuj7Ch
Content-Type: application/pgp-signature; name="signature.asc"
Content-Description: OpenPGP digital signature
Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="signature.asc"

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE-----

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-----END PGP SIGNATURE-----

--fK3fMVcTsN0Wo5DC8KyyfL2IbqEOuj7Ch--


From nobody Tue Jun  9 04:02:49 2020
Return-Path: <yumi.sakemi@lepidum.co.jp>
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From: Yumi Sakemi <yumi.sakemi@lepidum.co.jp>
Date: Tue, 9 Jun 2020 20:02:30 +0900
Message-ID: <CAA4D8KbKQ83hREF14vPruYT4vTnzbcHY6jYK=A3F_bXhYrsKpA@mail.gmail.com>
To: Chloe Martindale <chloemartindale@gmail.com>
Cc: crypto-panel@irtf.org, cfrg-chairs@ietf.org,  Tetsutaro Kobayashi <tetsutaro.kobayashi.dr@hco.ntt.co.jp>,  SAITO Tsunekazu <tsunekazu.saito.hg@hco.ntt.co.jp>
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Archived-At: <https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/crypto-panel/b0lzLDziyTWcNYvt3QGLYCMXFmQ>
Subject: Re: [Crypto-panel] Request for review: draft-irtf-cfrg-pairing-friendly-curves-03
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Dear Chloe

Thank you for your e-mail.

We are very glad to reach a rough consensus with you.
We believe that our draft became very readable and higher quality by
reflecting your comments.
We appreciate your valuable and constructive comments.

We'd like to express our gratitude and include your name in Acknowledgement=
.
The version 05 that is reflected your comments will be submitted today
or tomorrow, then we will contact you again.

Best regards,
Yumi

2020=E5=B9=B46=E6=9C=881=E6=97=A5(=E6=9C=88) 18:53 Chloe Martindale <chloem=
artindale@gmail.com>:
>
> Dear Yumi, dear all,
>
> thank you for the update and for involving me in your thought process reg=
arding the curve choices. I understand and agree with your reasoning (and a=
pproach) regarding including both BLS12-381 and BN462, however I think I wo=
uld make a different 'safer choice'.
>
> My reason is this: if the attack is improved further (which you are compl=
etely right, it may), it is very likely to have a bigger impact on curves c=
onstructed via polynomial methods with embedding degree 8 (such as BN462) t=
han on any other curves for this security level, so it's not unlikely that =
the security of BN462 would be pushed below 128 bits. A safer choice in my =
view would be to take the Cocks-Pinch curve (not constructed using polynomi=
al methods) defined using a 544-bit prime implemented in RELIC, from [GMT19=
]*. The TNFS attacks cannot be applied to Cocks-Pinch curves (at least not =
without a fundamental new attack idea, since they rely on the polynomial co=
nstruction), so small improvements will not decrease the security level at =
all, and this curve is actually still more efficient than BN462 so there's =
nothing to lose there. I appreciate that such a choice would mean also incl=
uding some background on Cocks-Pinch and a reference/short explanation of t=
he fact that TNFS attacks don't apply to these, which would be a major chan=
ge to the original document, so I appreciate it if you'd rather not do this=
, but just thought I'd suggest it as I think it would increase the lifetime=
 of your document.
>
> *In your draft this is [GME19], but it should be [GMT19], and can now be =
updated to the peer-reviewed version of course (this is the paper I pointed=
 out in my review).
>
> All the best,
> Chloe
>
> On Fri, 29 May 2020 at 16:21, Yumi Sakemi <yumi.sakemi@lepidum.co.jp> wro=
te:
>>
>> Dear Chloe
>>
>> We appreciate a lot of constructive comments received at Expert Review.
>>
>> We are currently working on updating our draft.
>> Last week, Nick created a repository for pairing-friendly curves on
>> CFRG's official GitHub, so we plan to update our draft using the issue
>> tracker.
>> The updating for your comments will be made available to you on the
>> following issue page.
>>
>> https://github.com/cfrg/draft-irtf-cfrg-pairing-friendly-curves/issues
>>
>> We will contact you again when all the comments have been updated.
>> In that case, we would be glad if you could check them.
>>
>> In addition, before updating, there is a comment that we would like to
>> inform you about the policy of update.
>> The comment is about the recommended curve for 128-bit security level.
>>
>> First of all, thank you for teaching us a peer-reviewed paper for BLS12-=
381.
>> The comment is about the recommended curve for 128-bit security level.
>> Due to our lack of investigation, we made the wrong decision that
>> BLS12-381 was not matched in our selection policy.
>>
>> Your comment pointed out that BLS12-381 is moved to the recommended
>> curve and BN462 is moved to the Appendix.
>> We understood the disadvantages of BN462 that you were concerned
>> about, but we would like to recommend both BLS12-381 and BN462.
>> The reason is as follows.
>>
>> CFRG aims to standardize cryptographic technology for future Internet us=
e.
>> We agree that BLS12-381 with a 126-bit security level is the best
>> match as a curve of 128-bit security level "at this time" from the
>> viewpoint of security and efficiency.
>> On the other hand, the security of BLS12-381 is already less than
>> 128bit, so from the viewpoint of future use, if the attack is improved
>> even a little, it will not be suitable for a curve of 128-bit security
>> level.
>> Considering that the curve of 128-bit security level is often used at cu=
rrent.
>> So, we would like to recommend both BLS12-381 and BN462 considering
>> the future use and the safety side.
>>
>> However, as you pointed out, BN462 has the disadvantage of being too
>> slow compared to BLS12-381.
>> Then, the reader will be confused if there are two parameters of
>> 128-bit security level, so we will add the basis for selection by
>> adding the explanation of merits and demerits for each parameter.
>> And, we will also add a description about the disadvantages of BN462
>> regarding efficiency.
>>
>> If you have any problems with the updating policy, we would like you to =
comment.
>>
>> Best regards,
>> Yumi
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> 2020=E5=B9=B44=E6=9C=8827=E6=97=A5(=E6=9C=88) 21:58 Yumi Sakemi <yumi.sa=
kemi@lepidum.co.jp>:
>> >
>> > Dear Chloe
>> >
>> > I appreciate your review.
>> > I'm very glad to receive many constructive comments!
>> > I will discuss about your comments with co-authors and revise our
>> > draft to reflect your comments in our draft.
>> > I think it will be a better draft by reflecting your comments.
>> >
>> > As co-author Tsunekazu e-mailed, we're  planning to submit version 04,
>> > because we were independently working on updating of abstract,
>> > introduction (sec. 1.3) and proofreading of English in parallel with
>> > the expert review.
>> > (Version 04 will not be reflected your comments.)
>> >
>> > Comments from Chloe will be reflected in the version 05.
>> > We will submit version 05 in mid-May and we will report you when we
>> > submit version 05.
>> >
>> > Dear Stanislav
>> >
>> > Thank you very much for proceeding to the Expert review.
>> > We received a lot of constructive comments from Chloe, so I think it
>> > is difficult to manage comments by email.
>> > (Because there are over 100 comments from Chloe.)
>> >
>> > Therefore, I would like to use the issue management function of GitHub
>> > so that it is easy to check the reflecting status of Chloe's comments.
>> > So, I'd like to use the repository of pairing-friendly curves draft on
>> > CFRG's GitHub
>> > because BLS signature which is similar in terms of IRTF stream is also
>> > registered on the GitHub.
>> > Could you register the repository for the draft of pairing-friendly
>> > curves on the following CFRG's GitHub?
>> >
>> > https://github.com/cfrg
>> >
>> > Best regards,
>> > Yumi
>> >
>> > 2020=E5=B9=B44=E6=9C=8827=E6=97=A5(=E6=9C=88) 10:09 SAITO Tsunekazu <t=
sunekazu.saito.hg@hco.ntt.co.jp>:
>> > >
>> > > Dear Chloe, Stanislav,
>> > >
>> > >
>> > >
>> > > This is Tsunekazu.
>> > >
>> > >
>> > >
>> > > We plan to update the draft to version 04 soon.
>> > >
>> > > As the contents of the update, we changed the wording of Section 1.3=
 and security consideration.
>> > >
>> > > Yumi will submit the 4th edition, so please wait a moment.
>> > >
>> > >
>> > >
>> > > Best regards,
>> > >
>> > > Tsunekazu
>> > >
>> > >
>> > >
>> > > From: Stanislav V. Smyshlyaev <smyshsv@gmail.com>
>> > > Sent: Sunday, April 26, 2020 2:30 PM
>> > > To: Chloe Martindale <chloemartindale@gmail.com>; SAITO Tsunekazu <t=
sunekazu.saito.hg@hco.ntt.co.jp>; Tetsutaro Kobayashi <tetsutaro.kobayashi.=
dr@hco.ntt.co.jp>; Yumi Sakemi <yumi.sakemi@lepidum.co.jp>
>> > > Cc: cfrg-chairs@ietf.org; crypto-panel@irtf.org
>> > > Subject: Re: [Crypto-panel] Request for review: draft-irtf-cfrg-pair=
ing-friendly-curves-03
>> > >
>> > >
>> > >
>> > > Dear Chloe,
>> > >
>> > > Many thanks for your review (such a great and a prompt one!).
>> > >
>> > >
>> > >
>> > > Dear Yumi, Saito, Tetsutaro, do you plan to update your draft taking=
 into account Chloe=E2=80=99s review?
>> > >
>> > >
>> > >
>> > > Best regards,
>> > >
>> > > Stanislav
>> > >
>> > >
>> > >
>> > > =D0=BF=D1=82, 24 =D0=B0=D0=BF=D1=80. 2020 =D0=B3. =D0=B2 19:49, Chlo=
e Martindale <chloemartindale@gmail.com>:
>> > >
>> > > Hi all,
>> > >
>> > >
>> > >
>> > > review is attached.
>> > >
>> > >
>> > >
>> > > All the best,
>> > >
>> > > Chloe
>> > >
>> > >
>> > >
>> > > On Tue, 21 Apr 2020 at 18:05, Stanislav V. Smyshlyaev <smyshsv@gmail=
.com> wrote:
>> > >
>> > > Sure - it is
>> > >
>> > > https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-irtf-cfrg-pairing-friendly-curves-=
03
>> > >
>> > >
>> > >
>> > > Thank you again!
>> > >
>> > >
>> > >
>> > > Regards,
>> > >
>> > > Stanislav
>> > >
>> > >
>> > >
>> > > =D0=B2=D1=82, 21 =D0=B0=D0=BF=D1=80. 2020 =D0=B3. =D0=B2 19:10, Chlo=
e Martindale <chloemartindale@gmail.com>:
>> > >
>> > > Just to be sure, can you point me towards the most recent version of=
 the draft please?
>> > >
>> > >
>> > >
>> > > Thanks,
>> > >
>> > > Chloe
>> > >
>> > >
>> > >
>> > > On Tue, 21 Apr 2020 at 13:17, Stanislav V. Smyshlyaev <smyshsv@gmail=
.com> wrote:
>> > >
>> > > Great, many thanks, Chloe!
>> > >
>> > >
>> > >
>> > > Kind regards,
>> > >
>> > > Nick, Alexey, Stanislav
>> > >
>> > >
>> > >
>> > > On Tue, 21 Apr 2020 at 15:16, Chloe Martindale <chloemartindale@gmai=
l.com> wrote:
>> > >
>> > > I'll take a look this week.
>> > >
>> > >
>> > >
>> > > All the best,
>> > >
>> > > Chloe
>> > >
>> > >
>> > >
>> > > On Tue, 21 Apr 2020, 13:10 Stanislav V. Smyshlyaev, <smyshsv@gmail.c=
om> wrote:
>> > >
>> > > Dear Crypto Panel members,
>> > >
>> > >
>> > >
>> > > The authors of the Pairing-Friendly Curves draft have addressed the =
concerns raised during the discussion and are ready to move to the next sta=
ge with the draft.
>> > >
>> > >
>> > >
>> > > Alexey, Nick and I would like to ask Crypto Review Panel members abo=
ut the review(s) of draft-irtf-cfrg-pairing-friendly-curves-03.
>> > >
>> > >
>> > >
>> > > This memo introduces pairing-friendly curves used for constructing p=
airing-based cryptography. It describes recommended parameters for each sec=
urity level and recent implementations of pairing-friendly curves.
>> > >
>> > >
>> > >
>> > >
>> > >
>> > > Can we have any volunteers, please?..
>> > >
>> > >
>> > >
>> > >
>> > >
>> > > Best regards,
>> > >
>> > > Stanislav (on behalf of chairs)
>> > >
>> > > _______________________________________________
>> > > Crypto-panel mailing list
>> > > Crypto-panel@irtf.org
>> > > https://www.irtf.org/mailman/listinfo/crypto-panel
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > --
>> > Yumi Sakemi, Ph. D.
>> > Lepidum Co. Ltd.
>> > E-Mail: yumi.sakemi@lepidum.co.jp
>>
>>
>>
>> --
>> Yumi Sakemi, Ph. D.
>> Lepidum Co. Ltd.
>>
>> E-Mail: yumi.sakemi@lepidum.co.jp



--=20
Yumi Sakemi
Lepidum Co. Ltd.

E-Mail: yumi.sakemi@lepidum.co.jp


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From: Thomas Pornin <thomas.pornin@nccgroup.com>
To: "Stanislav V. Smyshlyaev" <smyshsv@gmail.com>
CC: "crypto-panel@irtf.org" <crypto-panel@irtf.org>, "draft-irtf-cfrg-hash-to-curve.authors@ietf.org" <draft-irtf-cfrg-hash-to-curve.authors@ietf.org>, "cfrg-chairs@ietf.org" <cfrg-chairs@ietf.org>
Thread-Topic: [Crypto-panel] EXTERNAL: Request for review: draft-irtf-cfrg-hash-to-curve-08
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Archived-At: <https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/crypto-panel/B4zejfpzyl70idp-AFpE4ZV1uB4>
Subject: Re: [Crypto-panel] EXTERNAL: Request for review: draft-irtf-cfrg-hash-to-curve-08
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From: Yumi Sakemi <yumi.sakemi@lepidum.co.jp>
Date: Wed, 10 Jun 2020 13:06:20 +0900
Message-ID: <CAA4D8KbqtshiJiNUfp7QDKCzXDm3dg5C5_-eZFaoAFLN+0P2qg@mail.gmail.com>
To: Chloe Martindale <chloemartindale@gmail.com>
Cc: crypto-panel@irtf.org, cfrg-chairs@ietf.org,  Tetsutaro Kobayashi <tetsutaro.kobayashi.dr@hco.ntt.co.jp>,  SAITO Tsunekazu <tsunekazu.saito.hg@hco.ntt.co.jp>
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Archived-At: <https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/crypto-panel/8Kkg3qzR4o-VpyagCGeEDacQi_A>
Subject: Re: [Crypto-panel] Request for review: draft-irtf-cfrg-pairing-friendly-curves-03
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Dear Alexey, Nick, Stanislav, and Chloe

We have submitted the latest version 05 of the draft "Pairing-Friendly Curv=
es".
https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-irtf-cfrg-pairing-friendly-curves/

We have categorized a lot of comments received in the Expert Review
into more than 40 issues, and reflected the results which we
considered all of issues to the latest version.
While we revised the draft, we received comments from other CFRG
members and the authors of the draft "BLS Signatures", and reflected
them to the latest version.

If you want to know the details of how to revise, you can check them
by closed issues on the official CFRG GitHub page.

https://github.com/cfrg/draft-irtf-cfrg-pairing-friendly-curves/issues?q=3D=
is%3Aissue+is%3Aclosed

Thanks to valuable and constructive comments from Chloe and CFRG
members, our draft became readable and higher quality.
We strongly believe that the draft is ready for RG Last Call.
If there are other necessary procedures for RGLC, could you tell us?

Best regards,
Yumi

2020=E5=B9=B46=E6=9C=889=E6=97=A5(=E7=81=AB) 20:02 Yumi Sakemi <yumi.sakemi=
@lepidum.co.jp>:
>
> Dear Chloe
>
> Thank you for your e-mail.
>
> We are very glad to reach a rough consensus with you.
> We believe that our draft became very readable and higher quality by
> reflecting your comments.
> We appreciate your valuable and constructive comments.
>
> We'd like to express our gratitude and include your name in Acknowledgeme=
nt.
> The version 05 that is reflected your comments will be submitted today
> or tomorrow, then we will contact you again.
>
> Best regards,
> Yumi
>
> 2020=E5=B9=B46=E6=9C=881=E6=97=A5(=E6=9C=88) 18:53 Chloe Martindale <chlo=
emartindale@gmail.com>:
> >
> > Dear Yumi, dear all,
> >
> > thank you for the update and for involving me in your thought process r=
egarding the curve choices. I understand and agree with your reasoning (and=
 approach) regarding including both BLS12-381 and BN462, however I think I =
would make a different 'safer choice'.
> >
> > My reason is this: if the attack is improved further (which you are com=
pletely right, it may), it is very likely to have a bigger impact on curves=
 constructed via polynomial methods with embedding degree 8 (such as BN462)=
 than on any other curves for this security level, so it's not unlikely tha=
t the security of BN462 would be pushed below 128 bits. A safer choice in m=
y view would be to take the Cocks-Pinch curve (not constructed using polyno=
mial methods) defined using a 544-bit prime implemented in RELIC, from [GMT=
19]*. The TNFS attacks cannot be applied to Cocks-Pinch curves (at least no=
t without a fundamental new attack idea, since they rely on the polynomial =
construction), so small improvements will not decrease the security level a=
t all, and this curve is actually still more efficient than BN462 so there'=
s nothing to lose there. I appreciate that such a choice would mean also in=
cluding some background on Cocks-Pinch and a reference/short explanation of=
 the fact that TNFS attacks don't apply to these, which would be a major ch=
ange to the original document, so I appreciate it if you'd rather not do th=
is, but just thought I'd suggest it as I think it would increase the lifeti=
me of your document.
> >
> > *In your draft this is [GME19], but it should be [GMT19], and can now b=
e updated to the peer-reviewed version of course (this is the paper I point=
ed out in my review).
> >
> > All the best,
> > Chloe
> >
> > On Fri, 29 May 2020 at 16:21, Yumi Sakemi <yumi.sakemi@lepidum.co.jp> w=
rote:
> >>
> >> Dear Chloe
> >>
> >> We appreciate a lot of constructive comments received at Expert Review=
.
> >>
> >> We are currently working on updating our draft.
> >> Last week, Nick created a repository for pairing-friendly curves on
> >> CFRG's official GitHub, so we plan to update our draft using the issue
> >> tracker.
> >> The updating for your comments will be made available to you on the
> >> following issue page.
> >>
> >> https://github.com/cfrg/draft-irtf-cfrg-pairing-friendly-curves/issues
> >>
> >> We will contact you again when all the comments have been updated.
> >> In that case, we would be glad if you could check them.
> >>
> >> In addition, before updating, there is a comment that we would like to
> >> inform you about the policy of update.
> >> The comment is about the recommended curve for 128-bit security level.
> >>
> >> First of all, thank you for teaching us a peer-reviewed paper for BLS1=
2-381.
> >> The comment is about the recommended curve for 128-bit security level.
> >> Due to our lack of investigation, we made the wrong decision that
> >> BLS12-381 was not matched in our selection policy.
> >>
> >> Your comment pointed out that BLS12-381 is moved to the recommended
> >> curve and BN462 is moved to the Appendix.
> >> We understood the disadvantages of BN462 that you were concerned
> >> about, but we would like to recommend both BLS12-381 and BN462.
> >> The reason is as follows.
> >>
> >> CFRG aims to standardize cryptographic technology for future Internet =
use.
> >> We agree that BLS12-381 with a 126-bit security level is the best
> >> match as a curve of 128-bit security level "at this time" from the
> >> viewpoint of security and efficiency.
> >> On the other hand, the security of BLS12-381 is already less than
> >> 128bit, so from the viewpoint of future use, if the attack is improved
> >> even a little, it will not be suitable for a curve of 128-bit security
> >> level.
> >> Considering that the curve of 128-bit security level is often used at =
current.
> >> So, we would like to recommend both BLS12-381 and BN462 considering
> >> the future use and the safety side.
> >>
> >> However, as you pointed out, BN462 has the disadvantage of being too
> >> slow compared to BLS12-381.
> >> Then, the reader will be confused if there are two parameters of
> >> 128-bit security level, so we will add the basis for selection by
> >> adding the explanation of merits and demerits for each parameter.
> >> And, we will also add a description about the disadvantages of BN462
> >> regarding efficiency.
> >>
> >> If you have any problems with the updating policy, we would like you t=
o comment.
> >>
> >> Best regards,
> >> Yumi
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> 2020=E5=B9=B44=E6=9C=8827=E6=97=A5(=E6=9C=88) 21:58 Yumi Sakemi <yumi.=
sakemi@lepidum.co.jp>:
> >> >
> >> > Dear Chloe
> >> >
> >> > I appreciate your review.
> >> > I'm very glad to receive many constructive comments!
> >> > I will discuss about your comments with co-authors and revise our
> >> > draft to reflect your comments in our draft.
> >> > I think it will be a better draft by reflecting your comments.
> >> >
> >> > As co-author Tsunekazu e-mailed, we're  planning to submit version 0=
4,
> >> > because we were independently working on updating of abstract,
> >> > introduction (sec. 1.3) and proofreading of English in parallel with
> >> > the expert review.
> >> > (Version 04 will not be reflected your comments.)
> >> >
> >> > Comments from Chloe will be reflected in the version 05.
> >> > We will submit version 05 in mid-May and we will report you when we
> >> > submit version 05.
> >> >
> >> > Dear Stanislav
> >> >
> >> > Thank you very much for proceeding to the Expert review.
> >> > We received a lot of constructive comments from Chloe, so I think it
> >> > is difficult to manage comments by email.
> >> > (Because there are over 100 comments from Chloe.)
> >> >
> >> > Therefore, I would like to use the issue management function of GitH=
ub
> >> > so that it is easy to check the reflecting status of Chloe's comment=
s.
> >> > So, I'd like to use the repository of pairing-friendly curves draft =
on
> >> > CFRG's GitHub
> >> > because BLS signature which is similar in terms of IRTF stream is al=
so
> >> > registered on the GitHub.
> >> > Could you register the repository for the draft of pairing-friendly
> >> > curves on the following CFRG's GitHub?
> >> >
> >> > https://github.com/cfrg
> >> >
> >> > Best regards,
> >> > Yumi
> >> >
> >> > 2020=E5=B9=B44=E6=9C=8827=E6=97=A5(=E6=9C=88) 10:09 SAITO Tsunekazu =
<tsunekazu.saito.hg@hco.ntt.co.jp>:
> >> > >
> >> > > Dear Chloe, Stanislav,
> >> > >
> >> > >
> >> > >
> >> > > This is Tsunekazu.
> >> > >
> >> > >
> >> > >
> >> > > We plan to update the draft to version 04 soon.
> >> > >
> >> > > As the contents of the update, we changed the wording of Section 1=
.3 and security consideration.
> >> > >
> >> > > Yumi will submit the 4th edition, so please wait a moment.
> >> > >
> >> > >
> >> > >
> >> > > Best regards,
> >> > >
> >> > > Tsunekazu
> >> > >
> >> > >
> >> > >
> >> > > From: Stanislav V. Smyshlyaev <smyshsv@gmail.com>
> >> > > Sent: Sunday, April 26, 2020 2:30 PM
> >> > > To: Chloe Martindale <chloemartindale@gmail.com>; SAITO Tsunekazu =
<tsunekazu.saito.hg@hco.ntt.co.jp>; Tetsutaro Kobayashi <tetsutaro.kobayash=
i.dr@hco.ntt.co.jp>; Yumi Sakemi <yumi.sakemi@lepidum.co.jp>
> >> > > Cc: cfrg-chairs@ietf.org; crypto-panel@irtf.org
> >> > > Subject: Re: [Crypto-panel] Request for review: draft-irtf-cfrg-pa=
iring-friendly-curves-03
> >> > >
> >> > >
> >> > >
> >> > > Dear Chloe,
> >> > >
> >> > > Many thanks for your review (such a great and a prompt one!).
> >> > >
> >> > >
> >> > >
> >> > > Dear Yumi, Saito, Tetsutaro, do you plan to update your draft taki=
ng into account Chloe=E2=80=99s review?
> >> > >
> >> > >
> >> > >
> >> > > Best regards,
> >> > >
> >> > > Stanislav
> >> > >
> >> > >
> >> > >
> >> > > =D0=BF=D1=82, 24 =D0=B0=D0=BF=D1=80. 2020 =D0=B3. =D0=B2 19:49, Ch=
loe Martindale <chloemartindale@gmail.com>:
> >> > >
> >> > > Hi all,
> >> > >
> >> > >
> >> > >
> >> > > review is attached.
> >> > >
> >> > >
> >> > >
> >> > > All the best,
> >> > >
> >> > > Chloe
> >> > >
> >> > >
> >> > >
> >> > > On Tue, 21 Apr 2020 at 18:05, Stanislav V. Smyshlyaev <smyshsv@gma=
il.com> wrote:
> >> > >
> >> > > Sure - it is
> >> > >
> >> > > https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-irtf-cfrg-pairing-friendly-curve=
s-03
> >> > >
> >> > >
> >> > >
> >> > > Thank you again!
> >> > >
> >> > >
> >> > >
> >> > > Regards,
> >> > >
> >> > > Stanislav
> >> > >
> >> > >
> >> > >
> >> > > =D0=B2=D1=82, 21 =D0=B0=D0=BF=D1=80. 2020 =D0=B3. =D0=B2 19:10, Ch=
loe Martindale <chloemartindale@gmail.com>:
> >> > >
> >> > > Just to be sure, can you point me towards the most recent version =
of the draft please?
> >> > >
> >> > >
> >> > >
> >> > > Thanks,
> >> > >
> >> > > Chloe
> >> > >
> >> > >
> >> > >
> >> > > On Tue, 21 Apr 2020 at 13:17, Stanislav V. Smyshlyaev <smyshsv@gma=
il.com> wrote:
> >> > >
> >> > > Great, many thanks, Chloe!
> >> > >
> >> > >
> >> > >
> >> > > Kind regards,
> >> > >
> >> > > Nick, Alexey, Stanislav
> >> > >
> >> > >
> >> > >
> >> > > On Tue, 21 Apr 2020 at 15:16, Chloe Martindale <chloemartindale@gm=
ail.com> wrote:
> >> > >
> >> > > I'll take a look this week.
> >> > >
> >> > >
> >> > >
> >> > > All the best,
> >> > >
> >> > > Chloe
> >> > >
> >> > >
> >> > >
> >> > > On Tue, 21 Apr 2020, 13:10 Stanislav V. Smyshlyaev, <smyshsv@gmail=
.com> wrote:
> >> > >
> >> > > Dear Crypto Panel members,
> >> > >
> >> > >
> >> > >
> >> > > The authors of the Pairing-Friendly Curves draft have addressed th=
e concerns raised during the discussion and are ready to move to the next s=
tage with the draft.
> >> > >
> >> > >
> >> > >
> >> > > Alexey, Nick and I would like to ask Crypto Review Panel members a=
bout the review(s) of draft-irtf-cfrg-pairing-friendly-curves-03.
> >> > >
> >> > >
> >> > >
> >> > > This memo introduces pairing-friendly curves used for constructing=
 pairing-based cryptography. It describes recommended parameters for each s=
ecurity level and recent implementations of pairing-friendly curves.
> >> > >
> >> > >
> >> > >
> >> > >
> >> > >
> >> > > Can we have any volunteers, please?..
> >> > >
> >> > >
> >> > >
> >> > >
> >> > >
> >> > > Best regards,
> >> > >
> >> > > Stanislav (on behalf of chairs)
> >> > >
> >> > > _______________________________________________
> >> > > Crypto-panel mailing list
> >> > > Crypto-panel@irtf.org
> >> > > https://www.irtf.org/mailman/listinfo/crypto-panel
> >> >
> >> >
> >> >
> >> > --
> >> > Yumi Sakemi, Ph. D.
> >> > Lepidum Co. Ltd.
> >> > E-Mail: yumi.sakemi@lepidum.co.jp
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> --
> >> Yumi Sakemi, Ph. D.
> >> Lepidum Co. Ltd.
> >>
> >> E-Mail: yumi.sakemi@lepidum.co.jp
>
>
>
> --
> Yumi Sakemi
> Lepidum Co. Ltd.
>
> E-Mail: yumi.sakemi@lepidum.co.jp



--=20
Yumi Sakemi, Ph. D.
Lepidum Co. Ltd.

E-Mail: yumi.sakemi@lepidum.co.jp


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Subject: Re: [Crypto-panel] EXTERNAL: Request for review: draft-irtf-cfrg-hash-to-curve-08
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Dear Thomas,

Thanks a lot for your review!

Kind regards,
Stanislav

=D1=81=D1=80, 10 =D0=B8=D1=8E=D0=BD=D1=8F 2020 =D0=B3. =D0=B2 01:42, Thomas=
 Pornin <thomas.pornin@nccgroup.com>:

> Here is my review.
>
> Hashing to Elliptic Curves
> draft-irtf-cfrg-hash-to-curve-08
>
> This draft is well-written. I have not verified that all pseudocode
> and all test vectors are correct, but I did not see anything obviously
> wrong. All proposed constructions make sense to me, from a cryptographic
> point of view.
> (I can reimplement stuff in Sage and check the results, but it will take
> me more time, and I don't have a lot of it at the moment.)
>
> A generic remark: there is not a word about intellectual property
> issues. I understand that this is a contentious issue, and that nobody
> wants to assert that any specific method is patent-free. But I would
> have expected a disclaimer somewhere. Otherwise, it feels weird that
> Icart's map is not used as a possible method, since, when p^m =3D 2 mod 3=
,
> it should be faster than the simplified SWU (it uses one inversion
> and one cube root, no extra is_square() or similar).
> (Also, I heard some rumours that simplified SWU is also patented,
> albeit with a less proactively enforced patent. The same rumours say
> that the original Shallue-van de Woestijne method is patent-free. These
> are only rumours.)
>
> Some other remarks, in appearance order:
>
> 2.1 (page 6): Maybe note that there are multiple choices for the
> representation of GF(p^m) as polynomials: any irreducible modulus M (of
> degree m) is fine (all finite fields with the same cardinal are
> isomorphic to each other), but no M is more canonical than any other.
> Choice of M is often driven by implementation performance (some M lead
> to faster code).
>
> 2.1 (page 6): "elements are those points with coordinates (x, y)
> satisfying the curve equation": some curves (in particular Weierstra=C3=
=9F
> and Montgomery curves) also include a special point-at-infinity which
> does not have coordinates (x, y).
>
> 2.2.2 (page 8): "Section 10 discusses further." -> This lacks a
> complement. Maybe: "See section 10 for further discussion."?
>
> 2.2.5 (page 9): Concatenation can be ambiguous, i.e.
>    "RO10" || x =3D=3D "RO1" || ("0" || x)
> The actual usage (in section 5.3) uses explicit length bytes, and
> also puts the tag _after_ the message, not before. It might be worth
> mentioning here that the "concatenation" operation must be an
> injective encoding of the tag and input x, with a forward reference
> to section 5.3 for details (especially 5.3.4).
>
> 3.1 (page 12): The text fluidly and implicitly equates character strings
> and byte strings. Java and C#/.NET developers might take issue with
> that. This might be worth an explicit sentence here; otherwise, some
> developer somewhere will use UTF-16 (and calling it "Unicode" in pure
> Microsoft fashion), others will add a terminating zero, or use
> big-endian, or add a BOM, or any combination thereof, and much confusion
> and interoperability sorrow will ensue.
>
> 4 (page 12): "SHOULD be constant time" -> "SHOULD be constant-time".
>
> Also, the traditional acception of "constant-time" covers more than
> independence of the execution time with regard to the input values:
>
>   - It really is independence with regard to all secret values, including
>     intermediate values and outputs, not just inputs.
>
>   - Constant-time code should not leave any trace that can be leveraged
>     with time-based measurements. For instance, in a flush+reload
>     attack, the victim's execution time is independent of the secret
>     values; the timing measurement is on a reload operation performed by
>     the attacker themselves, _after_ the victim has finished. Code which
>     is vulnerable to a flush+reload attack may still be "constant-time"
>     in the sense described by section 4, but would not be
>     "constant-time" in the usual sense.
>
> I think a more generic definition of "constant-time" is needed here. I
> suggest the following: "For security, implementations of these functions
> SHOULD be constant-time, i.e. none of the possible timing measurements
> that can be effected by an adversary should depend on secret values. In
> particular, execution time but also memory access patterns should be
> independent of any secret input, output or intermediate value."
>
> 4 (page 13): "there exist two roots of x in the field F whenever x is
> square." -> except when x =3D 0. Zero has a unique square root in F.
>
> 4 (page 13): "To implement inv0 in constant time, compute inv0(x) :=3D
> x^(q-2)" -> Depending on the field, there may be (much) faster ways, in
> particular in field extensions (e.g. in Curve9767, inversion cost is
> about 6M, while Fermat's Little Theorem would bring it to about 300M!).
> Even in prime fields, a constant-time extended binary GCD will typically
> have cost between 40M and 100M for inversion (but some specific care is
> required to ensure that inv0(0) =3D 0). However, it must be said that the
> exponentiation is a simple to implement in constant-time if
> constant-time multiplication is available (and it should, otherwise the
> whole thing is hopeless).
>
> 4 (page 13): It may be worth mentioning that I2OSP and OS2IP, as defined
> in PKCS#1 (aka RFC 8017), are big-endian. In particular, most of the
> curve25519/edwards25519 ecosystem tends to be little-endian, so that's a
> plausible source of mistakes.
>
> 5 (page 5): The draft uses "SHAKE-128" as the name of SHAKE with a
> 128-bit output, but the NIST specification (FIPS 202) defines "SHAKE128"
> without the dash. This impacts the use of the name in IDs (e.g. in
> section 8.10, page 43).
>
> 5.2 (page 17): Maybe note somewhere that implementation of "mod p" with
> constant-time code is not completely obvious. Using Euclidean division
> is not constant-time. Most constant-time implementations use Barrett
> reduction, although some use Montgomery instead.
>
> 5.2 (page 17): When mapping to a field GF(p^m) with a relatively small p
> (e.g. less 32 bits), then the proposed hash_to_field() is rather
> wasteful in hash output. For such fields, generating k+log2(p^m) bits
> and then repeatedly dividing that big integer by p will be faster,
> especially when working on embedded systems. On an ARM Cortex M0+, with
> field GF(9767^19), I can get a map_to_field() in about 20000 cycles,
> while each invocation of the SHAKE internal function costs 34000 cycles
> and the proposed method would require three invocations of that internal
> function to get enough bytes.
>
> 5.3.1 (page 18): I needed to verify, but "Damgaard" is indeed the
> correct ASCII-compatible alternative spelling of "Damg=C3=A5rd". Nice job=
!
>
> 5.3.1 (page 19): Definition of b_in_bytes uses ceil(), i.e. accounts for
> the possibility that H outputs something else than an integral number
> of bytes. But if that is the case, the "uniform_bytes" are not uniform!
> It would be better to make it an explicit requirement that the output
> length of H, in bits, MUST be a multiple of 8.
>
> 5.3.1 (page 19): r_in_bytes is said to be the "block size" of a hash
> function, but that notion has not been defined. Generally speaking, some
> hash functions do not have a well-defined "block size". You may fall
> back here on HMAC, since HMAC also needs a "block size"; for instance,
> FIPS 202 defines the block size of SHA3-256 to be 136 bytes.
>
> 5.3.4 (page 21): "prepended or appended" -> technically, "prepended" is
> an actual English word, but not with that meaning. It means something
> like "premeditate". I suggest: "an encoding of DST MUST be added either
> as a prefix or suffix to the input to each invocation of H (a suffix is
> the RECOMMENDED approach)."
>
> 6.6.1 (page 25): It may be worth mentioning that some of the computed
> values are actually constants, e.g. tv4 (step 5) or -4*g(Z)/(3*Z^2+4*A)
> (used in step 10) (this is applied in appendix D.1). In effect, the
> "expensive" operations in this algorithm that cannot be precomputed are
> 1 inv0(), 2 is_square(), and 1 sqrt(). This makes it apparent that the
> speed advantage of the simplified SWU map is that it saves 1 is_square()
> call, i.e. about 25% of the overall cost if inv0(), is_square() and
> sqrt() are implemented with modular exponentiations.
>
> 10 (page 45): for password hashing, discussion points to PBKDF2 and
> Scrypt. It might be worth mentioning Argon2, for which there is an
> in-progress draft:
>    https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-irtf-cfrg-argon2/
>
> 10 (page 45): "the nature of the leakage and the appropriate defense
> depends on the application." -> should be "depend" here.
>
> E.1 (page 75): It may be worth mentioning here that the random oracle
> mapping requires doing two map_to_curve() and adding the results
> together, and this is, in itself, enough to make projective coordinates
> useful. In particular, when using a Weierstra=C3=9F curve, you must take =
into
> account the (remote) possibility that the two points may be the same,
> therefore requiring a constant-time generic point addition routine;
> there are complete formulas for Weierstra=C3=9F curves in homogenous
> projective coordinates.
>
> G.5 (page 96): "Other optimizations of this type are possible in other
> even-order extension fields" -> You can also have similar optimizations
> in any extension field. In general, for an odd p and an arbitrary m > 1:
>
>       (p-1)/2 =3D ((p-1)/2)*(1+p+p^2+...+p^(m-1))
>
> Thus, if we call r =3D 1+p+p^2+...+p^(m-1), we have:
>
>       x^((p-1)/2) =3D (x^r)^((p-1)/2)
>
> This can be computed very efficiently because:
>
>   - x^r is an element of GF(p) (indeed, (x^r)^(p-1) =3D 1 for any x !=3D =
0,
>     and only elements of GF(p) are roots of the polynomial X^(p-1)-1 in
>     GF(p^m)[X]), so the final exponentiation by (p-1)/2 can be done with
>     only values in the small field GF(p).
>
>   - x^r can be computed in log(m) multiplications and log(m) applications
>     of the Frobenius operator:
>
>       t1 =3D x * x^p =3D x^(1+p)
>       t2 =3D t1 * t1^(p^2) =3D x^(1+p+p^2+p^3)
>       t3 =3D t2 * t2^(p^4) =3D x^(1+p+p^2+p^3+p^4+p^5+p^6+p^7)
>       ...
>
>     The Frobenius operator itself is typically as efficient, or even
>     faster, as a multiplication, since it is a linear transform over the
>     source polynomial (seen as a vector in a space of dimension m over
>     GF(p)). If GF(p^m) was defined modulo M =3D X^m-c for some constant c=
,
>     then the Frobenius operator is a simple per-coefficient
>     multiplication, i.e. a cost close to that of an addition in GF(p^m).
>
> The algorithm in appendix G.5 is a simple sub-case of this, when m =3D 2.
>
>
> Thomas
>
>
> -------------------------------------------------------------------------=
---------------------------
> From: Crypto-panel <crypto-panel-bounces@irtf.org> on behalf of
> "Stanislav V. Smyshlyaev" <smyshsv@gmail.com>
> Date: Friday, June 5, 2020 at 08:11
> To: Thomas Pornin <thomas.pornin=3D40nccgroup.com@dmarc.ietf.org>
> Cc: "crypto-panel@irtf.org" <crypto-panel@irtf.org>, "
> draft-irtf-cfrg-hash-to-curve.authors@ietf.org" <
> draft-irtf-cfrg-hash-to-curve.authors@ietf.org>, "cfrg-chairs@ietf.org" <
> cfrg-chairs@ietf.org>
> Subject: Re: [Crypto-panel] EXTERNAL: Request for review:
> draft-irtf-cfrg-hash-to-curve-08
>
> Great, many thanks, Thomas!
>
> Stanislav (for Chairs)
>
> On Fri, 5 Jun 2020 at 14:53, Thomas Pornin <thomas.pornin=3Dmailto:
> 40nccgroup.com@dmarc.ietf.org> wrote:
> I can do that.
>
> Thomas
>
> From: Crypto-panel <mailto:crypto-panel-bounces@irtf.org> on behalf of
> "Stanislav V. Smyshlyaev" <mailto:smyshsv@gmail.com>
> Date: Friday, June 5, 2020 at 00:17
> To: "mailto:crypto-panel@irtf.org" <mailto:crypto-panel@irtf.org>
> Cc: "mailto:draft-irtf-cfrg-hash-to-curve.authors@ietf.org" <mailto:
> draft-irtf-cfrg-hash-to-curve.authors@ietf.org>, "mailto:
> cfrg-chairs@ietf.org" <mailto:cfrg-chairs@ietf.org>
> Subject: EXTERNAL: [Crypto-panel] Request for review:
> draft-irtf-cfrg-hash-to-curve-08
>
> Dear Crypto Panel members,
>
> Alexey, Nick and I would like to ask Crypto Review Panel members about th=
e
> review(s) of draft-irtf-cfrg-hash-to-curve-08.
>
> The document specifies a number of algorithms for encoding or hashing an
> arbitrary string to a point on an elliptic curve.
>
>
> Can we have any volunteers, please?
>
>
> Best regards,
> Stanislav (on behalf of chairs)
> _______________________________________________
> Crypto-panel mailing list
> mailto:Crypto-panel@irtf.org
> https://www.irtf.org/mailman/listinfo/crypto-panel
>
>

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<div><div dir=3D"auto">Dear Thomas,</div></div><div dir=3D"auto"><br></div>=
<div dir=3D"auto">Thanks a lot for your review!</div><div dir=3D"auto"><br>=
</div><div dir=3D"auto">Kind regards,</div><div dir=3D"auto">Stanislav</div=
><div><br><div class=3D"gmail_quote"><div dir=3D"ltr" class=3D"gmail_attr">=
=D1=81=D1=80, 10 =D0=B8=D1=8E=D0=BD=D1=8F 2020 =D0=B3. =D0=B2 01:42, Thomas=
 Pornin &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:thomas.pornin@nccgroup.com">thomas.pornin@ncc=
group.com</a>&gt;:<br></div><blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"marg=
in:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">Here is my revie=
w.<br>
<br>
Hashing to Elliptic Curves<br>
draft-irtf-cfrg-hash-to-curve-08<br>
<br>
This draft is well-written. I have not verified that all pseudocode<br>
and all test vectors are correct, but I did not see anything obviously<br>
wrong. All proposed constructions make sense to me, from a cryptographic<br=
>
point of view.<br>
(I can reimplement stuff in Sage and check the results, but it will take<br=
>
me more time, and I don&#39;t have a lot of it at the moment.)<br>
<br>
A generic remark: there is not a word about intellectual property<br>
issues. I understand that this is a contentious issue, and that nobody<br>
wants to assert that any specific method is patent-free. But I would<br>
have expected a disclaimer somewhere. Otherwise, it feels weird that<br>
Icart&#39;s map is not used as a possible method, since, when p^m =3D 2 mod=
 3,<br>
it should be faster than the simplified SWU (it uses one inversion<br>
and one cube root, no extra is_square() or similar).<br>
(Also, I heard some rumours that simplified SWU is also patented,<br>
albeit with a less proactively enforced patent. The same rumours say<br>
that the original Shallue-van de Woestijne method is patent-free. These<br>
are only rumours.)<br>
<br>
Some other remarks, in appearance order:<br>
<br>
2.1 (page 6): Maybe note that there are multiple choices for the<br>
representation of GF(p^m) as polynomials: any irreducible modulus M (of<br>
degree m) is fine (all finite fields with the same cardinal are<br>
isomorphic to each other), but no M is more canonical than any other.<br>
Choice of M is often driven by implementation performance (some M lead<br>
to faster code).<br>
<br>
2.1 (page 6): &quot;elements are those points with coordinates (x, y)<br>
satisfying the curve equation&quot;: some curves (in particular Weierstra=
=C3=9F<br>
and Montgomery curves) also include a special point-at-infinity which<br>
does not have coordinates (x, y).<br>
<br>
2.2.2 (page 8): &quot;Section 10 discusses further.&quot; -&gt; This lacks =
a<br>
complement. Maybe: &quot;See section 10 for further discussion.&quot;?<br>
<br>
2.2.5 (page 9): Concatenation can be ambiguous, i.e.<br>
=C2=A0 =C2=A0&quot;RO10&quot; || x =3D=3D &quot;RO1&quot; || (&quot;0&quot;=
 || x)<br>
The actual usage (in section 5.3) uses explicit length bytes, and<br>
also puts the tag _after_ the message, not before. It might be worth<br>
mentioning here that the &quot;concatenation&quot; operation must be an<br>
injective encoding of the tag and input x, with a forward reference<br>
to section 5.3 for details (especially 5.3.4).<br>
<br>
3.1 (page 12): The text fluidly and implicitly equates character strings<br=
>
and byte strings. Java and C#/.NET developers might take issue with<br>
that. This might be worth an explicit sentence here; otherwise, some<br>
developer somewhere will use UTF-16 (and calling it &quot;Unicode&quot; in =
pure<br>
Microsoft fashion), others will add a terminating zero, or use<br>
big-endian, or add a BOM, or any combination thereof, and much confusion<br=
>
and interoperability sorrow will ensue.<br>
<br>
4 (page 12): &quot;SHOULD be constant time&quot; -&gt; &quot;SHOULD be cons=
tant-time&quot;.<br>
<br>
Also, the traditional acception of &quot;constant-time&quot; covers more th=
an<br>
independence of the execution time with regard to the input values:<br>
<br>
=C2=A0 - It really is independence with regard to all secret values, includ=
ing<br>
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 intermediate values and outputs, not just inputs.<br>
<br>
=C2=A0 - Constant-time code should not leave any trace that can be leverage=
d<br>
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 with time-based measurements. For instance, in a flush+reload=
<br>
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 attack, the victim&#39;s execution time is independent of the=
 secret<br>
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 values; the timing measurement is on a reload operation perfo=
rmed by<br>
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 the attacker themselves, _after_ the victim has finished. Cod=
e which<br>
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 is vulnerable to a flush+reload attack may still be &quot;con=
stant-time&quot;<br>
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 in the sense described by section 4, but would not be<br>
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 &quot;constant-time&quot; in the usual sense.<br>
<br>
I think a more generic definition of &quot;constant-time&quot; is needed he=
re. I<br>
suggest the following: &quot;For security, implementations of these functio=
ns<br>
SHOULD be constant-time, i.e. none of the possible timing measurements<br>
that can be effected by an adversary should depend on secret values. In<br>
particular, execution time but also memory access patterns should be<br>
independent of any secret input, output or intermediate value.&quot;<br>
<br>
4 (page 13): &quot;there exist two roots of x in the field F whenever x is<=
br>
square.&quot; -&gt; except when x =3D 0. Zero has a unique square root in F=
.<br>
<br>
4 (page 13): &quot;To implement inv0 in constant time, compute inv0(x) :=3D=
<br>
x^(q-2)&quot; -&gt; Depending on the field, there may be (much) faster ways=
, in<br>
particular in field extensions (e.g. in Curve9767, inversion cost is<br>
about 6M, while Fermat&#39;s Little Theorem would bring it to about 300M!).=
<br>
Even in prime fields, a constant-time extended binary GCD will typically<br=
>
have cost between 40M and 100M for inversion (but some specific care is<br>
required to ensure that inv0(0) =3D 0). However, it must be said that the<b=
r>
exponentiation is a simple to implement in constant-time if<br>
constant-time multiplication is available (and it should, otherwise the<br>
whole thing is hopeless).<br>
<br>
4 (page 13): It may be worth mentioning that I2OSP and OS2IP, as defined<br=
>
in PKCS#1 (aka RFC 8017), are big-endian. In particular, most of the<br>
curve25519/edwards25519 ecosystem tends to be little-endian, so that&#39;s =
a<br>
plausible source of mistakes.<br>
<br>
5 (page 5): The draft uses &quot;SHAKE-128&quot; as the name of SHAKE with =
a<br>
128-bit output, but the NIST specification (FIPS 202) defines &quot;SHAKE12=
8&quot;<br>
without the dash. This impacts the use of the name in IDs (e.g. in<br>
section 8.10, page 43).<br>
<br>
5.2 (page 17): Maybe note somewhere that implementation of &quot;mod p&quot=
; with<br>
constant-time code is not completely obvious. Using Euclidean division<br>
is not constant-time. Most constant-time implementations use Barrett<br>
reduction, although some use Montgomery instead.<br>
<br>
5.2 (page 17): When mapping to a field GF(p^m) with a relatively small p<br=
>
(e.g. less 32 bits), then the proposed hash_to_field() is rather<br>
wasteful in hash output. For such fields, generating k+log2(p^m) bits<br>
and then repeatedly dividing that big integer by p will be faster,<br>
especially when working on embedded systems. On an ARM Cortex M0+, with<br>
field GF(9767^19), I can get a map_to_field() in about 20000 cycles,<br>
while each invocation of the SHAKE internal function costs 34000 cycles<br>
and the proposed method would require three invocations of that internal<br=
>
function to get enough bytes.<br>
<br>
5.3.1 (page 18): I needed to verify, but &quot;Damgaard&quot; is indeed the=
<br>
correct ASCII-compatible alternative spelling of &quot;Damg=C3=A5rd&quot;. =
Nice job!<br>
<br>
5.3.1 (page 19): Definition of b_in_bytes uses ceil(), i.e. accounts for<br=
>
the possibility that H outputs something else than an integral number<br>
of bytes. But if that is the case, the &quot;uniform_bytes&quot; are not un=
iform!<br>
It would be better to make it an explicit requirement that the output<br>
length of H, in bits, MUST be a multiple of 8.<br>
<br>
5.3.1 (page 19): r_in_bytes is said to be the &quot;block size&quot; of a h=
ash<br>
function, but that notion has not been defined. Generally speaking, some<br=
>
hash functions do not have a well-defined &quot;block size&quot;. You may f=
all<br>
back here on HMAC, since HMAC also needs a &quot;block size&quot;; for inst=
ance,<br>
FIPS 202 defines the block size of SHA3-256 to be 136 bytes.<br>
<br>
5.3.4 (page 21): &quot;prepended or appended&quot; -&gt; technically, &quot=
;prepended&quot; is<br>
an actual English word, but not with that meaning. It means something<br>
like &quot;premeditate&quot;. I suggest: &quot;an encoding of DST MUST be a=
dded either<br>
as a prefix or suffix to the input to each invocation of H (a suffix is<br>
the RECOMMENDED approach).&quot;<br>
<br>
6.6.1 (page 25): It may be worth mentioning that some of the computed<br>
values are actually constants, e.g. tv4 (step 5) or -4*g(Z)/(3*Z^2+4*A)<br>
(used in step 10) (this is applied in appendix D.1). In effect, the<br>
&quot;expensive&quot; operations in this algorithm that cannot be precomput=
ed are<br>
1 inv0(), 2 is_square(), and 1 sqrt(). This makes it apparent that the<br>
speed advantage of the simplified SWU map is that it saves 1 is_square()<br=
>
call, i.e. about 25% of the overall cost if inv0(), is_square() and<br>
sqrt() are implemented with modular exponentiations.<br>
<br>
10 (page 45): for password hashing, discussion points to PBKDF2 and<br>
Scrypt. It might be worth mentioning Argon2, for which there is an<br>
in-progress draft:<br>
=C2=A0 =C2=A0<a href=3D"https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-irtf-cfrg-ar=
gon2/" rel=3D"noreferrer" target=3D"_blank">https://datatracker.ietf.org/do=
c/draft-irtf-cfrg-argon2/</a><br>
<br>
10 (page 45): &quot;the nature of the leakage and the appropriate defense<b=
r>
depends on the application.&quot; -&gt; should be &quot;depend&quot; here.<=
br>
<br>
E.1 (page 75): It may be worth mentioning here that the random oracle<br>
mapping requires doing two map_to_curve() and adding the results<br>
together, and this is, in itself, enough to make projective coordinates<br>
useful. In particular, when using a Weierstra=C3=9F curve, you must take in=
to<br>
account the (remote) possibility that the two points may be the same,<br>
therefore requiring a constant-time generic point addition routine;<br>
there are complete formulas for Weierstra=C3=9F curves in homogenous<br>
projective coordinates.<br>
<br>
G.5 (page 96): &quot;Other optimizations of this type are possible in other=
<br>
even-order extension fields&quot; -&gt; You can also have similar optimizat=
ions<br>
in any extension field. In general, for an odd p and an arbitrary m &gt; 1:=
<br>
<br>
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 (p-1)/2 =3D ((p-1)/2)*(1+p+p^2+...+p^(m-1))<br>
<br>
Thus, if we call r =3D 1+p+p^2+...+p^(m-1), we have:<br>
<br>
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 x^((p-1)/2) =3D (x^r)^((p-1)/2)<br>
<br>
This can be computed very efficiently because:<br>
<br>
=C2=A0 - x^r is an element of GF(p) (indeed, (x^r)^(p-1) =3D 1 for any x !=
=3D 0,<br>
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 and only elements of GF(p) are roots of the polynomial X^(p-1=
)-1 in<br>
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 GF(p^m)[X]), so the final exponentiation by (p-1)/2 can be do=
ne with<br>
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 only values in the small field GF(p).<br>
<br>
=C2=A0 - x^r can be computed in log(m) multiplications and log(m) applicati=
ons<br>
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 of the Frobenius operator:<br>
<br>
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 t1 =3D x * x^p =3D x^(1+p)<br>
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 t2 =3D t1 * t1^(p^2) =3D x^(1+p+p^2+p^3)<br>
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 t3 =3D t2 * t2^(p^4) =3D x^(1+p+p^2+p^3+p^4+p^5+p^6+p^=
7)<br>
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 ...<br>
<br>
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 The Frobenius operator itself is typically as efficient, or e=
ven<br>
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 faster, as a multiplication, since it is a linear transform o=
ver the<br>
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 source polynomial (seen as a vector in a space of dimension m=
 over<br>
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 GF(p)). If GF(p^m) was defined modulo M =3D X^m-c for some co=
nstant c,<br>
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 then the Frobenius operator is a simple per-coefficient<br>
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 multiplication, i.e. a cost close to that of an addition in G=
F(p^m).<br>
<br>
The algorithm in appendix G.5 is a simple sub-case of this, when m =3D 2.<b=
r>
<br>
<br>
Thomas<br>
<br>
---------------------------------------------------------------------------=
-------------------------<br>
From: Crypto-panel &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:crypto-panel-bounces@irtf.org" tar=
get=3D"_blank">crypto-panel-bounces@irtf.org</a>&gt; on behalf of &quot;Sta=
nislav V. Smyshlyaev&quot; &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:smyshsv@gmail.com" target=
=3D"_blank">smyshsv@gmail.com</a>&gt;<br>
Date: Friday, June 5, 2020 at 08:11<br>
To: Thomas Pornin &lt;thomas.pornin=3D<a href=3D"mailto:40nccgroup.com@dmar=
c.ietf.org" target=3D"_blank">40nccgroup.com@dmarc.ietf.org</a>&gt;<br>
Cc: &quot;<a href=3D"mailto:crypto-panel@irtf.org" target=3D"_blank">crypto=
-panel@irtf.org</a>&quot; &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:crypto-panel@irtf.org" targ=
et=3D"_blank">crypto-panel@irtf.org</a>&gt;, &quot;<a href=3D"mailto:draft-=
irtf-cfrg-hash-to-curve.authors@ietf.org" target=3D"_blank">draft-irtf-cfrg=
-hash-to-curve.authors@ietf.org</a>&quot; &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:draft-irtf-=
cfrg-hash-to-curve.authors@ietf.org" target=3D"_blank">draft-irtf-cfrg-hash=
-to-curve.authors@ietf.org</a>&gt;, &quot;<a href=3D"mailto:cfrg-chairs@iet=
f.org" target=3D"_blank">cfrg-chairs@ietf.org</a>&quot; &lt;<a href=3D"mail=
to:cfrg-chairs@ietf.org" target=3D"_blank">cfrg-chairs@ietf.org</a>&gt;<br>
Subject: Re: [Crypto-panel] EXTERNAL: Request for review: draft-irtf-cfrg-h=
ash-to-curve-08<br>
<br>
Great, many thanks, Thomas!<br>
<br>
Stanislav (for Chairs)<br>
<br>
On Fri, 5 Jun 2020 at 14:53, Thomas Pornin &lt;thomas.pornin=3Dmailto:<a hr=
ef=3D"mailto:40nccgroup.com@dmarc.ietf.org" target=3D"_blank">40nccgroup.co=
m@dmarc.ietf.org</a>&gt; wrote:<br>
I can do that.<br>
=C2=A0<br>
Thomas<br>
=C2=A0<br>
From: Crypto-panel &lt;mailto:<a href=3D"mailto:crypto-panel-bounces@irtf.o=
rg" target=3D"_blank">crypto-panel-bounces@irtf.org</a>&gt; on behalf of &q=
uot;Stanislav V. Smyshlyaev&quot; &lt;mailto:<a href=3D"mailto:smyshsv@gmai=
l.com" target=3D"_blank">smyshsv@gmail.com</a>&gt;<br>
Date: Friday, June 5, 2020 at 00:17<br>
To: &quot;mailto:<a href=3D"mailto:crypto-panel@irtf.org" target=3D"_blank"=
>crypto-panel@irtf.org</a>&quot; &lt;mailto:<a href=3D"mailto:crypto-panel@=
irtf.org" target=3D"_blank">crypto-panel@irtf.org</a>&gt;<br>
Cc: &quot;mailto:<a href=3D"mailto:draft-irtf-cfrg-hash-to-curve.authors@ie=
tf.org" target=3D"_blank">draft-irtf-cfrg-hash-to-curve.authors@ietf.org</a=
>&quot; &lt;mailto:<a href=3D"mailto:draft-irtf-cfrg-hash-to-curve.authors@=
ietf.org" target=3D"_blank">draft-irtf-cfrg-hash-to-curve.authors@ietf.org<=
/a>&gt;, &quot;mailto:<a href=3D"mailto:cfrg-chairs@ietf.org" target=3D"_bl=
ank">cfrg-chairs@ietf.org</a>&quot; &lt;mailto:<a href=3D"mailto:cfrg-chair=
s@ietf.org" target=3D"_blank">cfrg-chairs@ietf.org</a>&gt;<br>
Subject: EXTERNAL: [Crypto-panel] Request for review: draft-irtf-cfrg-hash-=
to-curve-08<br>
=C2=A0<br>
Dear Crypto Panel members,=C2=A0<br>
=C2=A0<br>
Alexey, Nick and I would like to ask Crypto Review Panel members about the =
review(s) of draft-irtf-cfrg-hash-to-curve-08.<br>
=C2=A0<br>
The document specifies a number of algorithms for encoding or hashing an ar=
bitrary string to a point on an elliptic curve.=C2=A0<br>
=C2=A0<br>
=C2=A0<br>
Can we have any volunteers, please?<br>
=C2=A0<br>
=C2=A0<br>
Best regards,<br>
Stanislav (on behalf of chairs)<br>
_______________________________________________<br>
Crypto-panel mailing list<br>
mailto:<a href=3D"mailto:Crypto-panel@irtf.org" target=3D"_blank">Crypto-pa=
nel@irtf.org</a><br>
<a href=3D"https://www.irtf.org/mailman/listinfo/crypto-panel" rel=3D"noref=
errer" target=3D"_blank">https://www.irtf.org/mailman/listinfo/crypto-panel=
</a><br>
<br>
</blockquote></div></div>

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Subject: [Crypto-panel] Fwd: [irsg] [Technical Errata Reported] RFC8391 (6024)
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Dear Crypto Review Panel members,

There is a need to validate the following errata:
https://www.rfc-editor.org/errata/eid6024

Any volunteers?

Regards,
CFRG chairs



---------- =D0=9F=D0=B5=D1=80=D0=B5=D1=81=D1=8B=D0=BB=D0=B0=D0=B5=D0=BC=D0=
=BE=D0=B5 =D1=81=D0=BE=D0=BE=D0=B1=D1=89=D0=B5=D0=BD=D0=B8=D0=B5 ---------
=D0=9E=D1=82: Colin Perkins <csp@csperkins.org>
=D0=94=D0=B0=D1=82=D0=B0: =D1=81=D0=B1, 6 =D0=B8=D1=8E=D0=BD=D1=8F 2020 =D0=
=B3. =D0=B2 16:03
=D0=A2=D0=B5=D0=BC=D0=B0: Fwd: [irsg] [Technical Errata Reported] RFC8391 (=
6024)
=D0=9A=D0=BE=D0=BC=D1=83: <cfrg-chairs@ietf.org>


Hi CFRG chairs,

Can you discuss, and review with the RG if necessary, and let me know  if
the following errata should be marked as verified.

Thanks,
Colin



Begin forwarded message:

*From: *RFC Errata System <rfc-editor@rfc-editor.org>
*Subject: **[irsg] [Technical Errata Reported] RFC8391 (6024)*
*Date: *18 March 2020 at 13:01:52 GMT
*To: *ietf@huelsing.net, dbutin@cdc.informatik.tu-darmstadt.de,
ietf@gazdag.de, ietf@joostrijneveld.nl, mohaisen@ieee.org, irsg@irtf.org
*Cc: *ietf@huelsing.net, rfc-editor@rfc-editor.org

The following errata report has been submitted for RFC8391,
"XMSS: eXtended Merkle Signature Scheme".

--------------------------------------
You may review the report below and at:
https://www.rfc-editor.org/errata/eid6024

--------------------------------------
Type: Technical
Reported by: Andreas H=C3=BClsing <ietf@huelsing.net>

Section: 5

Original Text
-------------
This section provides basic parameter sets that are assumed to cover most
relevant applications.  Parameter sets for two classical security levels
are defined.  Parameters with n =3D 32 provide a classical security level o=
f
256 bits.  Parameters with n =3D 64 provide a classical security level of 5=
12
bits.  Considering quantum-computer-aided attacks, these output sizes yield
post-quantum security of 128 and 256 bits, respectively.

Corrected Text
--------------
This section provides basic parameter sets that are assumed to cover most
relevant applications. Parameter sets for two classical security levels are
defined using the cryptographic functions SHA2 and SHAKE.  Parameters with
SHA2 and n =3D 32 provide a classical security level of 256 bits. Parameter=
s
with SHA2 and n =3D 64 provide a classical security level of 512 bits.
Considering quantum-computer-aided attacks, these parameters yield
post-quantum security of 128 and 256 bits, respectively. Parameters with
SHAKE and n =3D 32 provide a classical security level of 128 bits.
Parameters with SHAKE and n =3D 64 provide a classical security level of 25=
6
bits.  Considering quantum-computer-aided attacks, these parameters yield
post-quantum security of 86 and 170 bits, respectively.

Notes
-----
Traditionally, a hash function with n-bit outputs is assumed to have n-bit
security against classical preimage and second-preimage attacks, and
n/2-bit security against classical collision attacks. For adversaries with
access to a quantum computer, these bounds change to n/2 and n/3 bits when
only counting queries to the hash function. This also applies to SHA2 and
SHA3. In contrast, SHAKE follows a different reasoning. SHAKE with an
internal state of n bits and an output length of n bits achieves n/2 bit
security against classical preimage, second-preimage and collision attacks.
For quantum attacks security changes to n/3 bits. The reason is that SHAKE
allows for meet-in-the-middle preimage attacks that reduce to a collision
search on the internal state. The same applies for SHA3 but for SHA3 a
bigger internal state is used.

In consequence, SHAKE-128 cannot provide more security than NIST
post-quantum security level II (Any attack that breaks the relevant
security definition must require computational resources comparable to or
greater than those required for collision search on a 256-bit hash function
(e.g. SHA256 / SHA3-256)).

Instructions:
-------------
This erratum is currently posted as "Reported". If necessary, please
use "Reply All" to discuss whether it should be verified or
rejected. When a decision is reached, the verifying party
can log in to change the status and edit the report, if necessary.

--------------------------------------
RFC8391 (draft-irtf-cfrg-xmss-hash-based-signatures-12)
--------------------------------------
Title               : XMSS: eXtended Merkle Signature Scheme
Publication Date    : May 2018
Author(s)           : A. Huelsing, D. Butin, S. Gazdag, J. Rijneveld, A.
Mohaisen
Category            : INFORMATIONAL
Source              : Crypto Forum Research Group
Area                : N/A
Stream              : IRTF
Verifying Party     : IRSG

--000000000000ae343d05a7d2b044
Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

<div><div dir=3D"auto">Dear Crypto Review Panel members,</div></div><div di=
r=3D"auto"><br></div><div dir=3D"auto">There is a need to validate the foll=
owing errata:</div><div dir=3D"auto"><div><a href=3D"https://www.rfc-editor=
.org/errata/eid6024">https://www.rfc-editor.org/errata/eid6024</a></div><di=
v><br></div><div>Any volunteers?</div><div><br></div><div>Regards,</div><di=
v>CFRG chairs</div></div><div dir=3D"auto"><br></div><div dir=3D"auto"><br>=
</div><div><br><div class=3D"gmail_quote"><div dir=3D"ltr" class=3D"gmail_a=
ttr">---------- =D0=9F=D0=B5=D1=80=D0=B5=D1=81=D1=8B=D0=BB=D0=B0=D0=B5=D0=
=BC=D0=BE=D0=B5 =D1=81=D0=BE=D0=BE=D0=B1=D1=89=D0=B5=D0=BD=D0=B8=D0=B5 ----=
-----<br>=D0=9E=D1=82: <strong class=3D"gmail_sendername" dir=3D"auto">Coli=
n Perkins</strong> <span dir=3D"auto">&lt;<a href=3D"mailto:csp@csperkins.o=
rg">csp@csperkins.org</a>&gt;</span><br>=D0=94=D0=B0=D1=82=D0=B0: =D1=81=D0=
=B1, 6 =D0=B8=D1=8E=D0=BD=D1=8F 2020 =D0=B3. =D0=B2 16:03<br>=D0=A2=D0=B5=
=D0=BC=D0=B0: Fwd: [irsg] [Technical Errata Reported] RFC8391 (6024)<br>=D0=
=9A=D0=BE=D0=BC=D1=83:  &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:cfrg-chairs@ietf.org">cfrg-ch=
airs@ietf.org</a>&gt;<br></div><br><br><div style=3D"word-wrap:break-word;l=
ine-break:after-white-space"><div dir=3D"auto" style=3D"word-wrap:break-wor=
d;line-break:after-white-space">Hi CFRG chairs,<div><br></div><div>Can you =
discuss, and review with the RG if necessary, and let me know =C2=A0if the =
following errata should be marked as verified.</div><div><br></div><div>Tha=
nks,</div><div>Colin</div><div><br></div><div><br><div><br><blockquote type=
=3D"cite"><div>Begin forwarded message:</div><br><div style=3D"margin:0px">=
<span style=3D"font-family:-webkit-system-font,&quot;Helvetica Neue&quot;,H=
elvetica,sans-serif;color:rgb(0,0,0)"><b style=3D"font-family:-webkit-syste=
m-font,&quot;Helvetica Neue&quot;,Helvetica,sans-serif">From: </b></span><s=
pan style=3D"font-family:-webkit-system-font,&quot;Helvetica Neue&quot;,Hel=
vetica,sans-serif">RFC Errata System &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:rfc-editor@rfc-e=
ditor.org" target=3D"_blank" style=3D"font-family:-webkit-system-font,&quot=
;Helvetica Neue&quot;,Helvetica,sans-serif">rfc-editor@rfc-editor.org</a>&g=
t;<br></span></div><div style=3D"margin:0px"><span style=3D"font-family:-we=
bkit-system-font,&quot;Helvetica Neue&quot;,Helvetica,sans-serif;color:rgb(=
0,0,0)"><b style=3D"font-family:-webkit-system-font,&quot;Helvetica Neue&qu=
ot;,Helvetica,sans-serif">Subject: </b></span><span style=3D"font-family:-w=
ebkit-system-font,&quot;Helvetica Neue&quot;,Helvetica,sans-serif"><b style=
=3D"font-family:-webkit-system-font,&quot;Helvetica Neue&quot;,Helvetica,sa=
ns-serif">[irsg] [Technical Errata Reported] RFC8391 (6024)</b><br></span><=
/div><div style=3D"margin:0px"><span style=3D"font-family:-webkit-system-fo=
nt,&quot;Helvetica Neue&quot;,Helvetica,sans-serif;color:rgb(0,0,0)"><b sty=
le=3D"font-family:-webkit-system-font,&quot;Helvetica Neue&quot;,Helvetica,=
sans-serif">Date: </b></span><span style=3D"font-family:-webkit-system-font=
,&quot;Helvetica Neue&quot;,Helvetica,sans-serif">18 March 2020 at 13:01:52=
 GMT<br></span></div><div style=3D"margin:0px"><span style=3D"font-family:-=
webkit-system-font,&quot;Helvetica Neue&quot;,Helvetica,sans-serif;color:rg=
b(0,0,0)"><b style=3D"font-family:-webkit-system-font,&quot;Helvetica Neue&=
quot;,Helvetica,sans-serif">To: </b></span><span style=3D"font-family:-webk=
it-system-font,&quot;Helvetica Neue&quot;,Helvetica,sans-serif"><a href=3D"=
mailto:ietf@huelsing.net" target=3D"_blank" style=3D"font-family:-webkit-sy=
stem-font,&quot;Helvetica Neue&quot;,Helvetica,sans-serif">ietf@huelsing.ne=
t</a>, <a href=3D"mailto:dbutin@cdc.informatik.tu-darmstadt.de" target=3D"_=
blank" style=3D"font-family:-webkit-system-font,&quot;Helvetica Neue&quot;,=
Helvetica,sans-serif">dbutin@cdc.informatik.tu-darmstadt.de</a>, <a href=3D=
"mailto:ietf@gazdag.de" target=3D"_blank" style=3D"font-family:-webkit-syst=
em-font,&quot;Helvetica Neue&quot;,Helvetica,sans-serif">ietf@gazdag.de</a>=
,  <a href=3D"mailto:ietf@joostrijneveld.nl" target=3D"_blank" style=3D"fon=
t-family:-webkit-system-font,&quot;Helvetica Neue&quot;,Helvetica,sans-seri=
f">ietf@joostrijneveld.nl</a>, <a href=3D"mailto:mohaisen@ieee.org" target=
=3D"_blank" style=3D"font-family:-webkit-system-font,&quot;Helvetica Neue&q=
uot;,Helvetica,sans-serif">mohaisen@ieee.org</a>, <a href=3D"mailto:irsg@ir=
tf.org" target=3D"_blank" style=3D"font-family:-webkit-system-font,&quot;He=
lvetica Neue&quot;,Helvetica,sans-serif">irsg@irtf.org</a><br></span></div>=
<div style=3D"margin:0px"><span style=3D"font-family:-webkit-system-font,&q=
uot;Helvetica Neue&quot;,Helvetica,sans-serif;color:rgb(0,0,0)"><b style=3D=
"font-family:-webkit-system-font,&quot;Helvetica Neue&quot;,Helvetica,sans-=
serif">Cc: </b></span><span style=3D"font-family:-webkit-system-font,&quot;=
Helvetica Neue&quot;,Helvetica,sans-serif"><a href=3D"mailto:ietf@huelsing.=
net" target=3D"_blank" style=3D"font-family:-webkit-system-font,&quot;Helve=
tica Neue&quot;,Helvetica,sans-serif">ietf@huelsing.net</a>, <a href=3D"mai=
lto:rfc-editor@rfc-editor.org" target=3D"_blank" style=3D"font-family:-webk=
it-system-font,&quot;Helvetica Neue&quot;,Helvetica,sans-serif">rfc-editor@=
rfc-editor.org</a><br></span></div><br><div><div>The following errata repor=
t has been submitted for RFC8391,<br>&quot;XMSS: eXtended Merkle Signature =
Scheme&quot;.<br><br>--------------------------------------<br>You may revi=
ew the report below and at:<br><a href=3D"https://www.rfc-editor.org/errata=
/eid6024" target=3D"_blank">https://www.rfc-editor.org/errata/eid6024</a><b=
r><br>--------------------------------------<br>Type: Technical<br>Reported=
 by: Andreas H=C3=BClsing &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:ietf@huelsing.net" target=
=3D"_blank">ietf@huelsing.net</a>&gt;<br><br>Section: 5<br><br>Original Tex=
t<br>-------------<br>This section provides basic parameter sets that are a=
ssumed to cover most relevant applications.=C2=A0 Parameter sets for two cl=
assical security levels are defined.=C2=A0 Parameters with n =3D 32 provide=
 a classical security level of 256 bits.=C2=A0 Parameters with n =3D 64 pro=
vide a classical security level of 512 bits.=C2=A0 Considering quantum-comp=
uter-aided attacks, these output sizes yield post-quantum security of 128 a=
nd 256 bits, respectively.<br><br>Corrected Text<br>--------------<br>This =
section provides basic parameter sets that are assumed to cover most releva=
nt applications. Parameter sets for two classical security levels are defin=
ed using the cryptographic functions SHA2 and SHAKE.=C2=A0 Parameters with =
SHA2 and n =3D 32 provide a classical security level of 256 bits. Parameter=
s with SHA2 and n =3D 64 provide a classical security level of 512 bits.=C2=
=A0 Considering quantum-computer-aided attacks, these parameters yield post=
-quantum security of 128 and 256 bits, respectively. Parameters with SHAKE =
and n =3D 32 provide a classical security level of 128 bits.=C2=A0 Paramete=
rs with SHAKE and n =3D 64 provide a classical security level of 256 bits.=
=C2=A0 Considering quantum-computer-aided attacks, these parameters yield p=
ost-quantum security of 86 and 170 bits, respectively. <br><br>Notes<br>---=
--<br>Traditionally, a hash function with n-bit outputs is assumed to have =
n-bit security against classical preimage and second-preimage attacks, and =
n/2-bit security against classical collision attacks. For adversaries with =
access to a quantum computer, these bounds change to n/2 and n/3 bits when =
only counting queries to the hash function. This also applies to SHA2 and S=
HA3. In contrast, SHAKE follows a different reasoning. SHAKE with an intern=
al state of n bits and an output length of n bits achieves n/2 bit security=
 against classical preimage, second-preimage and collision attacks. For qua=
ntum attacks security changes to n/3 bits. The reason is that SHAKE allows =
for meet-in-the-middle preimage attacks that reduce to a collision search o=
n the internal state. The same applies for SHA3 but for SHA3 a bigger inter=
nal state is used.<br><br> In consequence, SHAKE-128 cannot provide more se=
curity than NIST post-quantum security level II (Any attack that breaks the=
 relevant security definition must require computational resources comparab=
le to or greater than those required for collision search on a 256-bit hash=
 function (e.g. SHA256 / SHA3-256)).<br><br>Instructions:<br>-------------<=
br>This erratum is currently posted as &quot;Reported&quot;. If necessary, =
please<br>use &quot;Reply All&quot; to discuss whether it should be verifie=
d or<br>rejected. When a decision is reached, the verifying party =C2=A0<br=
>can log in to change the status and edit the report, if necessary. <br><br=
>--------------------------------------<br>RFC8391 (draft-irtf-cfrg-xmss-ha=
sh-based-signatures-12)<br>--------------------------------------<br>Title =
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=
=A0=C2=A0: XMSS: eXtended Merkle Signature Scheme<br>Publication Date =C2=
=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0: May 2018<br>Author(s) =C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0: A. Huelsing, D. Butin, S. Gazdag, J. Rijneveld, A=
. Mohaisen<br>Category =C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=
=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0: INFORMATIONAL<br>Source =C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=
=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0: Crypto Forum Research Group<=
br>Area =C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0: N/A<br>Stream =C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=
=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0: IRTF<br>Verifying Party =C2=
=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0: IRSG<br></div></div></blockquote></div><div><br><br>

</div>

<br></div></div></div></div></div>

--000000000000ae343d05a7d2b044--


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From: "Scott Fluhrer (sfluhrer)" <sfluhrer@cisco.com>
To: "Stanislav V. Smyshlyaev" <smyshsv@gmail.com>, "crypto-panel@irtf.org" <crypto-panel@irtf.org>
CC: "cfrg-chairs@ietf.org" <cfrg-chairs@ietf.org>
Thread-Topic: [Crypto-panel] Fwd: [irsg] [Technical Errata Reported] RFC8391 (6024)
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Date: Thu, 11 Jun 2020 19:12:28 +0000
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Subject: Re: [Crypto-panel] Fwd: [irsg] [Technical Errata Reported] RFC8391 (6024)
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From: "Scott Fluhrer (sfluhrer)" <sfluhrer@cisco.com>
To: "Stanislav V. Smyshlyaev" <smyshsv@gmail.com>, "crypto-panel@irtf.org" <crypto-panel@irtf.org>
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Thread-Topic: [Crypto-panel] Fwd: [irsg] [Technical Errata Reported] RFC8391 (6024)
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Subject: Re: [Crypto-panel] Fwd: [irsg] [Technical Errata Reported] RFC8391 (6024)
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From: "Stanislav V. Smyshlyaev" <smyshsv@gmail.com>
Date: Thu, 11 Jun 2020 22:51:28 +0300
Message-ID: <CAMr0u6=is3iBbo=EhwSnfogPwWQ53trO1A731p5Q=i-wPUjFCg@mail.gmail.com>
To: "Scott Fluhrer (sfluhrer)" <sfluhrer@cisco.com>
Cc: "crypto-panel@irtf.org" <crypto-panel@irtf.org>, "cfrg-chairs@ietf.org" <cfrg-chairs@ietf.org>
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Archived-At: <https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/crypto-panel/C7U7yBhrR7eBg5uSLRuZIh7vfhw>
Subject: Re: [Crypto-panel] Fwd: [irsg] [Technical Errata Reported] RFC8391 (6024)
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Thank you, Scott!

Here is the correct link: https://www.rfc-editor.org/errata/eid6024

Regards,
Stanislav

On Thu, 11 Jun 2020 at 22:12, Scott Fluhrer (sfluhrer) <sfluhrer@cisco.com>
wrote:

> I volunteer; however I can=E2=80=99t read the link.  Did you send it corr=
ectly?
>
>
>
> Actually, the corrected text you include below looks decent (although the
> discussion of SHA3 may be a bit misleading =E2=80=93 SHA-3 has more than =
n/2 bits
> of security, which someone might assume from a quick reading of =E2=80=9C=
The same
> applies for SHA3=E2=80=A6=E2=80=9D).
>
>
>
> I=E2=80=99d want to see the full errata before I place my seal of approva=
l, of
> course.
>
>
>
> *From:* Crypto-panel <crypto-panel-bounces@irtf.org> * On Behalf Of *Stan=
islav
> V. Smyshlyaev
> *Sent:* Thursday, June 11, 2020 1:57 PM
> *To:* crypto-panel@irtf.org
> *Cc:* cfrg-chairs@ietf.org
> *Subject:* [Crypto-panel] Fwd: [irsg] [Technical Errata Reported] RFC8391
> (6024)
>
>
>
> Dear Crypto Review Panel members,
>
>
>
> There is a need to validate the following errata:
>
> https://www.rfc-editor.org/errata/eid6024
> <https://www.rfc-editor..org/errata/eid6024>
>
>
>
> Any volunteers?
>
>
>
> Regards,
>
> CFRG chairs
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> ---------- =D0=9F=D0=B5=D1=80=D0=B5=D1=81=D1=8B=D0=BB=D0=B0=D0=B5=D0=BC=
=D0=BE=D0=B5 =D1=81=D0=BE=D0=BE=D0=B1=D1=89=D0=B5=D0=BD=D0=B8=D0=B5 -------=
--
> =D0=9E=D1=82: *Colin Perkins* <csp@csperkins.org>
> =D0=94=D0=B0=D1=82=D0=B0: =D1=81=D0=B1, 6 =D0=B8=D1=8E=D0=BD=D1=8F 2020 =
=D0=B3. =D0=B2 16:03
> =D0=A2=D0=B5=D0=BC=D0=B0: Fwd: [irsg] [Technical Errata Reported] RFC8391=
 (6024)
> =D0=9A=D0=BE=D0=BC=D1=83: <cfrg-chairs@ietf.org>
>
>
>
> Hi CFRG chairs,
>
>
>
> Can you discuss, and review with the RG if necessary, and let me know  if
> the following errata should be marked as verified.
>
>
>
> Thanks,
>
> Colin
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> Begin forwarded message:
>
>
>
> *From: *RFC Errata System <rfc-editor@rfc-editor.org>
>
> *Subject: **[irsg] [Technical Errata Reported] RFC8391 (6024)*
>
> *Date: *18 March 2020 at 13:01:52 GMT
>
> *To: *ietf@huelsing.net, dbutin@cdc.informatik.tu-darmstadt.de,
> ietf@gazdag.de, ietf@joostrijneveld.nl, mohaisen@ieee.org, irsg@irtf.org
>
> *Cc: *ietf@huelsing.net, rfc-editor@rfc-editor.org
>
>
>
> The following errata report has been submitted for RFC8391,
> "XMSS: eXtended Merkle Signature Scheme".
>
> --------------------------------------
> You may review the report below and at:
> https://www.rfc-editor.org/errata/eid6024
>
> --------------------------------------
> Type: Technical
> Reported by: Andreas H=C3=BClsing <ietf@huelsing.net>
>
> Section: 5
>
> Original Text
> -------------
> This section provides basic parameter sets that are assumed to cover most
> relevant applications.  Parameter sets for two classical security levels
> are defined.  Parameters with n =3D 32 provide a classical security level=
 of
> 256 bits.  Parameters with n =3D 64 provide a classical security level of=
 512
> bits.  Considering quantum-computer-aided attacks, these output sizes yie=
ld
> post-quantum security of 128 and 256 bits, respectively.
>
> Corrected Text
> --------------
> This section provides basic parameter sets that are assumed to cover most
> relevant applications. Parameter sets for two classical security levels a=
re
> defined using the cryptographic functions SHA2 and SHAKE.  Parameters wit=
h
> SHA2 and n =3D 32 provide a classical security level of 256 bits. Paramet=
ers
> with SHA2 and n =3D 64 provide a classical security level of 512 bits.
> Considering quantum-computer-aided attacks, these parameters yield
> post-quantum security of 128 and 256 bits, respectively. Parameters with
> SHAKE and n =3D 32 provide a classical security level of 128 bits.
> Parameters with SHAKE and n =3D 64 provide a classical security level of =
256
> bits.  Considering quantum-computer-aided attacks, these parameters yield
> post-quantum security of 86 and 170 bits, respectively.
>
> Notes
> -----
> Traditionally, a hash function with n-bit outputs is assumed to have n-bi=
t
> security against classical preimage and second-preimage attacks, and
> n/2-bit security against classical collision attacks. For adversaries wit=
h
> access to a quantum computer, these bounds change to n/2 and n/3 bits whe=
n
> only counting queries to the hash function. This also applies to SHA2 and
> SHA3. In contrast, SHAKE follows a different reasoning. SHAKE with an
> internal state of n bits and an output length of n bits achieves n/2 bit
> security against classical preimage, second-preimage and collision attack=
s.
> For quantum attacks security changes to n/3 bits. The reason is that SHAK=
E
> allows for meet-in-the-middle preimage attacks that reduce to a collision
> search on the internal state. The same applies for SHA3 but for SHA3 a
> bigger internal state is used.
>
> In consequence, SHAKE-128 cannot provide more security than NIST
> post-quantum security level II (Any attack that breaks the relevant
> security definition must require computational resources comparable to or
> greater than those required for collision search on a 256-bit hash functi=
on
> (e.g. SHA256 / SHA3-256)).
>
> Instructions:
> -------------
> This erratum is currently posted as "Reported". If necessary, please
> use "Reply All" to discuss whether it should be verified or
> rejected. When a decision is reached, the verifying party
> can log in to change the status and edit the report, if necessary.
>
> --------------------------------------
> RFC8391 (draft-irtf-cfrg-xmss-hash-based-signatures-12)
> --------------------------------------
> Title               : XMSS: eXtended Merkle Signature Scheme
> Publication Date    : May 2018
> Author(s)           : A. Huelsing, D. Butin, S. Gazdag, J. Rijneveld, A..
> Mohaisen
> Category            : INFORMATIONAL
> Source              : Crypto Forum Research Group
> Area                : N/A
> Stream              : IRTF
> Verifying Party     : IRSG
>
>
>
>
>

--000000000000bb735005a7d4499a
Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

<div dir=3D"ltr">Thank you, Scott!<div><br></div><div>Here is the correct l=
ink:=C2=A0<a href=3D"https://www.rfc-editor.org/errata/eid6024">https://www=
.rfc-editor.org/errata/eid6024</a></div><div><br></div><div>Regards,</div><=
div>Stanislav</div></div><br><div class=3D"gmail_quote"><div dir=3D"ltr" cl=
ass=3D"gmail_attr">On Thu, 11 Jun 2020 at 22:12, Scott Fluhrer (sfluhrer) &=
lt;<a href=3D"mailto:sfluhrer@cisco.com">sfluhrer@cisco.com</a>&gt; wrote:<=
br></div><blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8e=
x;border-left:1px solid rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex">





<div lang=3D"EN-US">
<div class=3D"gmail-m_-7563682159735504764WordSection1">
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">I volunteer; however I can=E2=80=99t read the link.=
=C2=A0 Did you send it correctly?<u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Actually, the corrected text you include below looks=
 decent (although the discussion of SHA3 may be a bit misleading =E2=80=93 =
SHA-3 has more than n/2 bits of security, which someone might assume from a=
 quick reading of =E2=80=9CThe same applies for SHA3=E2=80=A6=E2=80=9D).<u>=
</u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">I=E2=80=99d want to see the full errata before I pla=
ce my seal of approval, of course.<u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
<div style=3D"border-top:none;border-right:none;border-bottom:none;border-l=
eft:1.5pt solid blue;padding:0in 0in 0in 4pt">
<div>
<div style=3D"border-right:none;border-bottom:none;border-left:none;border-=
top:1pt solid rgb(225,225,225);padding:3pt 0in 0in">
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><b>From:</b> Crypto-panel &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:cryp=
to-panel-bounces@irtf.org" target=3D"_blank">crypto-panel-bounces@irtf.org<=
/a>&gt; <b>
On Behalf Of </b>Stanislav V. Smyshlyaev<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Thursday, June 11, 2020 1:57 PM<br>
<b>To:</b> <a href=3D"mailto:crypto-panel@irtf.org" target=3D"_blank">crypt=
o-panel@irtf.org</a><br>
<b>Cc:</b> <a href=3D"mailto:cfrg-chairs@ietf.org" target=3D"_blank">cfrg-c=
hairs@ietf.org</a><br>
<b>Subject:</b> [Crypto-panel] Fwd: [irsg] [Technical Errata Reported] RFC8=
391 (6024)<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
</div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
<div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Dear Crypto Review Panel members,<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">There is a need to validate the following errata:<u>=
</u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><a href=3D"https://www.rfc-editor..org/errata/eid602=
4" target=3D"_blank">https://www.rfc-editor.org/errata/eid6024</a><u></u><u=
></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Any volunteers?<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Regards,<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">CFRG chairs<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
<div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">---------- =D0=9F=D0=B5=D1=80=D0=B5=D1=81=D1=8B=D0=
=BB=D0=B0=D0=B5=D0=BC=D0=BE=D0=B5 =D1=81=D0=BE=D0=BE=D0=B1=D1=89=D0=B5=D0=
=BD=D0=B8=D0=B5 ---------<br>
=D0=9E=D1=82: <strong><span style=3D"font-family:Calibri,sans-serif">Colin =
Perkins</span></strong> &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:csp@csperkins.org" target=3D"=
_blank">csp@csperkins.org</a>&gt;<br>
=D0=94=D0=B0=D1=82=D0=B0: =D1=81=D0=B1, 6 =D0=B8=D1=8E=D0=BD=D1=8F 2020 =D0=
=B3. =D0=B2 16:03<br>
=D0=A2=D0=B5=D0=BC=D0=B0: Fwd: [irsg] [Technical Errata Reported] RFC8391 (=
6024)<br>
=D0=9A=D0=BE=D0=BC=D1=83: &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:cfrg-chairs@ietf.org" targe=
t=3D"_blank">cfrg-chairs@ietf.org</a>&gt;<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-bottom:12pt"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p=
>
<div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Hi CFRG chairs,<u></u><u></u></p>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Can you discuss, and review with the RG if necessary=
, and let me know =C2=A0if the following errata should be marked as verifie=
d.<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Thanks,<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Colin<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><br>
<br>
<u></u><u></u></p>
<blockquote style=3D"margin-top:5pt;margin-bottom:5pt">
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Begin forwarded message:<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><b><span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Helvetica Neue&q=
uot;;color:black">From:
</span></b><span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Helvetica Neue&quot;">RFC Errat=
a System &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:rfc-editor@rfc-editor.org" target=3D"_blank"=
>rfc-editor@rfc-editor.org</a>&gt;</span><u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><b><span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Helvetica Neue&q=
uot;;color:black">Subject:
</span></b><b><span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Helvetica Neue&quot;">[irsg]=
 [Technical Errata Reported] RFC8391 (6024)</span></b><u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><b><span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Helvetica Neue&q=
uot;;color:black">Date:
</span></b><span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Helvetica Neue&quot;">18 March =
2020 at 13:01:52 GMT</span><u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><b><span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Helvetica Neue&q=
uot;;color:black">To:
</span></b><span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Helvetica Neue&quot;"><a href=
=3D"mailto:ietf@huelsing.net" target=3D"_blank">ietf@huelsing.net</a>,
<a href=3D"mailto:dbutin@cdc.informatik.tu-darmstadt.de" target=3D"_blank">=
dbutin@cdc.informatik.tu-darmstadt.de</a>,
<a href=3D"mailto:ietf@gazdag.de" target=3D"_blank">ietf@gazdag.de</a>, <a =
href=3D"mailto:ietf@joostrijneveld.nl" target=3D"_blank">
ietf@joostrijneveld.nl</a>, <a href=3D"mailto:mohaisen@ieee.org" target=3D"=
_blank">mohaisen@ieee.org</a>,
<a href=3D"mailto:irsg@irtf.org" target=3D"_blank">irsg@irtf.org</a></span>=
<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><b><span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Helvetica Neue&q=
uot;;color:black">Cc:
</span></b><span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Helvetica Neue&quot;"><a href=
=3D"mailto:ietf@huelsing.net" target=3D"_blank">ietf@huelsing.net</a>,
<a href=3D"mailto:rfc-editor@rfc-editor.org" target=3D"_blank">rfc-editor@r=
fc-editor.org</a></span><u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
<div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">The following errata report has been submitted for R=
FC8391,<br>
&quot;XMSS: eXtended Merkle Signature Scheme&quot;.<br>
<br>
--------------------------------------<br>
You may review the report below and at:<br>
<a href=3D"https://www.rfc-editor.org/errata/eid6024" target=3D"_blank">htt=
ps://www.rfc-editor.org/errata/eid6024</a><br>
<br>
--------------------------------------<br>
Type: Technical<br>
Reported by: Andreas H=C3=BClsing &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:ietf@huelsing.net" =
target=3D"_blank">ietf@huelsing.net</a>&gt;<br>
<br>
Section: 5<br>
<br>
Original Text<br>
-------------<br>
This section provides basic parameter sets that are assumed to cover most r=
elevant applications.=C2=A0 Parameter sets for two classical security level=
s are defined.=C2=A0 Parameters with n =3D 32 provide a classical security =
level of 256 bits.=C2=A0 Parameters with n =3D 64 provide
 a classical security level of 512 bits.=C2=A0 Considering quantum-computer=
-aided attacks, these output sizes yield post-quantum security of 128 and 2=
56 bits, respectively.<br>
<br>
Corrected Text<br>
--------------<br>
This section provides basic parameter sets that are assumed to cover most r=
elevant applications. Parameter sets for two classical security levels are =
defined using the cryptographic functions SHA2 and SHAKE.=C2=A0 Parameters =
with SHA2 and n =3D 32 provide a classical
 security level of 256 bits. Parameters with SHA2 and n =3D 64 provide a cl=
assical security level of 512 bits.=C2=A0 Considering quantum-computer-aide=
d attacks, these parameters yield post-quantum security of 128 and 256 bits=
, respectively. Parameters with SHAKE and
 n =3D 32 provide a classical security level of 128 bits.=C2=A0 Parameters =
with SHAKE and n =3D 64 provide a classical security level of 256 bits.=C2=
=A0 Considering quantum-computer-aided attacks, these parameters yield post=
-quantum security of 86 and 170 bits, respectively.
<br>
<br>
Notes<br>
-----<br>
Traditionally, a hash function with n-bit outputs is assumed to have n-bit =
security against classical preimage and second-preimage attacks, and n/2-bi=
t security against classical collision attacks. For adversaries with access=
 to a quantum computer, these bounds
 change to n/2 and n/3 bits when only counting queries to the hash function=
. This also applies to SHA2 and SHA3. In contrast, SHAKE follows a differen=
t reasoning. SHAKE with an internal state of n bits and an output length of=
 n bits achieves n/2 bit security
 against classical preimage, second-preimage and collision attacks. For qua=
ntum attacks security changes to n/3 bits. The reason is that SHAKE allows =
for meet-in-the-middle preimage attacks that reduce to a collision search o=
n the internal state. The same applies
 for SHA3 but for SHA3 a bigger internal state is used.<br>
<br>
In consequence, SHAKE-128 cannot provide more security than NIST post-quant=
um security level II (Any attack that breaks the relevant security definiti=
on must require computational resources comparable to or greater than those=
 required for collision search on
 a 256-bit hash function (e.g. SHA256 / SHA3-256)).<br>
<br>
Instructions:<br>
-------------<br>
This erratum is currently posted as &quot;Reported&quot;. If necessary, ple=
ase<br>
use &quot;Reply All&quot; to discuss whether it should be verified or<br>
rejected. When a decision is reached, the verifying party =C2=A0<br>
can log in to change the status and edit the report, if necessary. <br>
<br>
--------------------------------------<br>
RFC8391 (draft-irtf-cfrg-xmss-hash-based-signatures-12)<br>
--------------------------------------<br>
Title =C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=
=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0: XMSS: eXtended Merkle Signature Scheme<br>
Publication Date =C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0: May 2018<br>
Author(s) =C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0: A. =
Huelsing, D. Butin, S. Gazdag, J. Rijneveld, A.. Mohaisen<br>
Category =C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=
: INFORMATIONAL<br>
Source =C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=
=C2=A0=C2=A0: Crypto Forum Research Group<br>
Area =C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=
=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0: N/A<br>
Stream =C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=
=C2=A0=C2=A0: IRTF<br>
Verifying Party =C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0: IRSG<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
</div>
</blockquote>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-bottom:12pt"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p=
>
</div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>

</blockquote></div>

--000000000000bb735005a7d4499a--


From nobody Mon Jun 15 01:01:40 2020
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References: <20200318130152.57FD7F4071D@rfc-editor.org> <C7F982AB-F281-4AD2-BBB4-3C494CAED996@csperkins.org> <CAMr0u6=Qy-LRg7Ge5+TuaEivNAfSp_ncG9D2_nOQKOC=89RjtA@mail.gmail.com> <BN7PR11MB2641199090BA16B1DE9C1375C1800@BN7PR11MB2641.namprd11.prod.outlook.com>
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From: "Stanislav V. Smyshlyaev" <smyshsv@gmail.com>
Date: Mon, 15 Jun 2020 11:01:22 +0300
Message-ID: <CAMr0u6mg91h6DTWrmY7FmLnX3KP8LO+UEgvds9O9o_sD0M7syw@mail.gmail.com>
To: "Scott Fluhrer (sfluhrer)" <sfluhrer@cisco.com>
Cc: "crypto-panel@irtf.org" <crypto-panel@irtf.org>, "cfrg-chairs@ietf.org" <cfrg-chairs@ietf.org>
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Subject: Re: [Crypto-panel] Fwd: [irsg] [Technical Errata Reported] RFC8391 (6024)
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Many thanks, Scott!

Therefore, you will be happy if the proposed change is applied, with the
revised version of notes, dropping the sentences "The same applies for SHA3
... " and "(Any attack that breaks...", =E2=80=93 right?

Regards,
Stanislav


On Thu, 11 Jun 2020 at 22:48, Scott Fluhrer (sfluhrer) <sfluhrer@cisco.com>
wrote:

> The text looks correct, however I do have a few nits about the notes.  On=
e
> is the reference to SHA3, which on a quick read might be misleading; here
> is some alterative text:
>
>
>
> The reason is that SHAKE allows for meet-in-the-middle preimage attacks
> that reduce to a collision search on the internal state. *These internal
> collision attacks do not affect the security of SHA3, because of the larg=
er
> capacity used.*
>
>
>
> Alternatively, just drop the reference to SHA3, which isn=E2=80=99t relev=
ent to
> XMSS.
>
>
>
> The other nit is with the sentence that starts:
>
>
>
> Any attack that breaks the relevant security definition must require
> computational resources=E2=80=A6
>
>
>
> That sort of statement always has an implicit assumption of the form
> =E2=80=9Cunless someone has a cryptographical result against the SHA-3
> permutation=E2=80=9D; while we are used to that sort of assumption, a cau=
sal reader
> might not be.  I don=E2=80=99t see what that sentence brings to the table=
; I=E2=80=99d
> suggest dropping it.
>
>
>
> *From:* Crypto-panel <crypto-panel-bounces@irtf.org> * On Behalf Of *Stan=
islav
> V. Smyshlyaev
> *Sent:* Thursday, June 11, 2020 1:57 PM
> *To:* crypto-panel@irtf.org
> *Cc:* cfrg-chairs@ietf.org
> *Subject:* [Crypto-panel] Fwd: [irsg] [Technical Errata Reported] RFC8391
> (6024)
>
>
>
> Dear Crypto Review Panel members,
>
>
>
> There is a need to validate the following errata:
>
> https://www.rfc-editor.org/errata/eid6024
> <https://www.rfc-editor..org/errata/eid6024>
>
>
>
> Any volunteers?
>
>
>
> Regards,
>
> CFRG chairs
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> ---------- =D0=9F=D0=B5=D1=80=D0=B5=D1=81=D1=8B=D0=BB=D0=B0=D0=B5=D0=BC=
=D0=BE=D0=B5 =D1=81=D0=BE=D0=BE=D0=B1=D1=89=D0=B5=D0=BD=D0=B8=D0=B5 -------=
--
> =D0=9E=D1=82: *Colin Perkins* <csp@csperkins.org>
> =D0=94=D0=B0=D1=82=D0=B0: =D1=81=D0=B1, 6 =D0=B8=D1=8E=D0=BD=D1=8F 2020 =
=D0=B3. =D0=B2 16:03
> =D0=A2=D0=B5=D0=BC=D0=B0: Fwd: [irsg] [Technical Errata Reported] RFC8391=
 (6024)
> =D0=9A=D0=BE=D0=BC=D1=83: <cfrg-chairs@ietf.org>
>
>
>
> Hi CFRG chairs,
>
>
>
> Can you discuss, and review with the RG if necessary, and let me know  if
> the following errata should be marked as verified.
>
>
>
> Thanks,
>
> Colin
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> Begin forwarded message:
>
>
>
> *From: *RFC Errata System <rfc-editor@rfc-editor.org>
>
> *Subject: **[irsg] [Technical Errata Reported] RFC8391 (6024)*
>
> *Date: *18 March 2020 at 13:01:52 GMT
>
> *To: *ietf@huelsing.net, dbutin@cdc.informatik.tu-darmstadt.de,
> ietf@gazdag.de, ietf@joostrijneveld.nl, mohaisen@ieee.org, irsg@irtf.org
>
> *Cc: *ietf@huelsing.net, rfc-editor@rfc-editor.org
>
>
>
> The following errata report has been submitted for RFC8391,
> "XMSS: eXtended Merkle Signature Scheme".
>
> --------------------------------------
> You may review the report below and at:
> https://www.rfc-editor.org/errata/eid6024
>
> --------------------------------------
> Type: Technical
> Reported by: Andreas H=C3=BClsing <ietf@huelsing.net>
>
> Section: 5
>
> Original Text
> -------------
> This section provides basic parameter sets that are assumed to cover most
> relevant applications.  Parameter sets for two classical security levels
> are defined.  Parameters with n =3D 32 provide a classical security level=
 of
> 256 bits.  Parameters with n =3D 64 provide a classical security level of=
 512
> bits.  Considering quantum-computer-aided attacks, these output sizes yie=
ld
> post-quantum security of 128 and 256 bits, respectively.
>
> Corrected Text
> --------------
> This section provides basic parameter sets that are assumed to cover most
> relevant applications. Parameter sets for two classical security levels a=
re
> defined using the cryptographic functions SHA2 and SHAKE.  Parameters wit=
h
> SHA2 and n =3D 32 provide a classical security level of 256 bits. Paramet=
ers
> with SHA2 and n =3D 64 provide a classical security level of 512 bits.
> Considering quantum-computer-aided attacks, these parameters yield
> post-quantum security of 128 and 256 bits, respectively. Parameters with
> SHAKE and n =3D 32 provide a classical security level of 128 bits.
> Parameters with SHAKE and n =3D 64 provide a classical security level of =
256
> bits.  Considering quantum-computer-aided attacks, these parameters yield
> post-quantum security of 86 and 170 bits, respectively.
>
> Notes
> -----
> Traditionally, a hash function with n-bit outputs is assumed to have n-bi=
t
> security against classical preimage and second-preimage attacks, and
> n/2-bit security against classical collision attacks. For adversaries wit=
h
> access to a quantum computer, these bounds change to n/2 and n/3 bits whe=
n
> only counting queries to the hash function. This also applies to SHA2 and
> SHA3. In contrast, SHAKE follows a different reasoning. SHAKE with an
> internal state of n bits and an output length of n bits achieves n/2 bit
> security against classical preimage, second-preimage and collision attack=
s.
> For quantum attacks security changes to n/3 bits. The reason is that SHAK=
E
> allows for meet-in-the-middle preimage attacks that reduce to a collision
> search on the internal state. The same applies for SHA3 but for SHA3 a
> bigger internal state is used.
>
> In consequence, SHAKE-128 cannot provide more security than NIST
> post-quantum security level II (Any attack that breaks the relevant
> security definition must require computational resources comparable to or
> greater than those required for collision search on a 256-bit hash functi=
on
> (e.g. SHA256 / SHA3-256)).
>
> Instructions:
> -------------
> This erratum is currently posted as "Reported". If necessary, please
> use "Reply All" to discuss whether it should be verified or
> rejected. When a decision is reached, the verifying party
> can log in to change the status and edit the report, if necessary.
>
> --------------------------------------
> RFC8391 (draft-irtf-cfrg-xmss-hash-based-signatures-12)
> --------------------------------------
> Title               : XMSS: eXtended Merkle Signature Scheme
> Publication Date    : May 2018
> Author(s)           : A. Huelsing, D. Butin, S. Gazdag, J. Rijneveld, A..
> Mohaisen
> Category            : INFORMATIONAL
> Source              : Crypto Forum Research Group
> Area                : N/A
> Stream              : IRTF
> Verifying Party     : IRSG
>
>
>
>
>

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<div dir=3D"ltr">Many thanks, Scott!<div><br></div><div>Therefore, you will=
 be happy if the proposed change is applied, with the revised version of no=
tes, dropping the sentences &quot;The same applies for SHA3 ... &quot; and =
&quot;(Any attack that breaks...&quot;, =E2=80=93 right?</div><div><br></di=
v><div>Regards,</div><div>Stanislav</div><div><br></div></div><br><div clas=
s=3D"gmail_quote"><div dir=3D"ltr" class=3D"gmail_attr">On Thu, 11 Jun 2020=
 at 22:48, Scott Fluhrer (sfluhrer) &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:sfluhrer@cisco.co=
m">sfluhrer@cisco.com</a>&gt; wrote:<br></div><blockquote class=3D"gmail_qu=
ote" style=3D"margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-left:1px solid rgb(204,204,20=
4);padding-left:1ex">





<div lang=3D"EN-US">
<div class=3D"gmail-m_644860016223610469WordSection1">
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-GB">The text looks correct, however=
 I do have a few nits about the notes.=C2=A0 One is the reference to SHA3, =
which on a quick read might be misleading; here is some alterative text:<u>=
</u><u></u></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-GB"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;font-family:Arial,sa=
ns-serif;color:rgb(44,67,83);background:rgb(227,227,227)">The reason is tha=
t SHAKE allows for meet-in-the-middle preimage attacks that reduce to a col=
lision search on the internal state.
<b>These internal collision attacks do not affect the security of SHA3, bec=
ause of the larger capacity used.<u></u><u></u></b></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><b><span style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;font-family:Arial=
,sans-serif;color:rgb(44,67,83);background:rgb(227,227,227)"><u></u>=C2=A0<=
u></u></span></b></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-GB">Alternatively, just drop the re=
ference to SHA3, which isn=E2=80=99t relevent to XMSS.<u></u><u></u></span>=
</p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-GB"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-GB">The other nit is with the sente=
nce that starts:<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-GB"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;font-family:Arial,sa=
ns-serif;color:rgb(44,67,83);background:rgb(227,227,227)">Any attack that b=
reaks the relevant security definition must require computational resources=
=E2=80=A6</span><span lang=3D"EN-GB"><u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><b><span style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;font-family:Arial=
,sans-serif;color:rgb(44,67,83);background:rgb(227,227,227)"><u></u>=C2=A0<=
u></u></span></b></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-GB">That sort of statement always h=
as an implicit assumption of the form =E2=80=9Cunless someone has a cryptog=
raphical result against the SHA-3 permutation=E2=80=9D; while we are used t=
o that sort of assumption, a causal reader might not
 be.=C2=A0 I don=E2=80=99t see what that sentence brings to the table; I=E2=
=80=99d suggest dropping it.<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;font-family:Arial,sa=
ns-serif;color:rgb(44,67,83);background:rgb(227,227,227)"><u></u>=C2=A0<u><=
/u></span></p>
<div style=3D"border-top:none;border-right:none;border-bottom:none;border-l=
eft:1.5pt solid blue;padding:0in 0in 0in 4pt">
<div>
<div style=3D"border-right:none;border-bottom:none;border-left:none;border-=
top:1pt solid rgb(225,225,225);padding:3pt 0in 0in">
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><b>From:</b> Crypto-panel &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:cryp=
to-panel-bounces@irtf.org" target=3D"_blank">crypto-panel-bounces@irtf.org<=
/a>&gt; <b>
On Behalf Of </b>Stanislav V. Smyshlyaev<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Thursday, June 11, 2020 1:57 PM<br>
<b>To:</b> <a href=3D"mailto:crypto-panel@irtf.org" target=3D"_blank">crypt=
o-panel@irtf.org</a><br>
<b>Cc:</b> <a href=3D"mailto:cfrg-chairs@ietf.org" target=3D"_blank">cfrg-c=
hairs@ietf.org</a><br>
<b>Subject:</b> [Crypto-panel] Fwd: [irsg] [Technical Errata Reported] RFC8=
391 (6024)<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
</div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
<div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Dear Crypto Review Panel members,<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">There is a need to validate the following errata:<u>=
</u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><a href=3D"https://www.rfc-editor..org/errata/eid602=
4" target=3D"_blank">https://www.rfc-editor.org/errata/eid6024</a><u></u><u=
></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Any volunteers?<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Regards,<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">CFRG chairs<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
<div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">---------- =D0=9F=D0=B5=D1=80=D0=B5=D1=81=D1=8B=D0=
=BB=D0=B0=D0=B5=D0=BC=D0=BE=D0=B5 =D1=81=D0=BE=D0=BE=D0=B1=D1=89=D0=B5=D0=
=BD=D0=B8=D0=B5 ---------<br>
=D0=9E=D1=82: <strong><span style=3D"font-family:Calibri,sans-serif">Colin =
Perkins</span></strong> &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:csp@csperkins.org" target=3D"=
_blank">csp@csperkins.org</a>&gt;<br>
=D0=94=D0=B0=D1=82=D0=B0: =D1=81=D0=B1, 6 =D0=B8=D1=8E=D0=BD=D1=8F 2020 =D0=
=B3. =D0=B2 16:03<br>
=D0=A2=D0=B5=D0=BC=D0=B0: Fwd: [irsg] [Technical Errata Reported] RFC8391 (=
6024)<br>
=D0=9A=D0=BE=D0=BC=D1=83: &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:cfrg-chairs@ietf.org" targe=
t=3D"_blank">cfrg-chairs@ietf.org</a>&gt;<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-bottom:12pt"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p=
>
<div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Hi CFRG chairs,<u></u><u></u></p>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Can you discuss, and review with the RG if necessary=
, and let me know =C2=A0if the following errata should be marked as verifie=
d.<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Thanks,<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Colin<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><br>
<br>
<u></u><u></u></p>
<blockquote style=3D"margin-top:5pt;margin-bottom:5pt">
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Begin forwarded message:<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><b><span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Helvetica Neue&q=
uot;;color:black">From:
</span></b><span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Helvetica Neue&quot;">RFC Errat=
a System &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:rfc-editor@rfc-editor.org" target=3D"_blank"=
>rfc-editor@rfc-editor.org</a>&gt;</span><u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><b><span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Helvetica Neue&q=
uot;;color:black">Subject:
</span></b><b><span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Helvetica Neue&quot;">[irsg]=
 [Technical Errata Reported] RFC8391 (6024)</span></b><u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><b><span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Helvetica Neue&q=
uot;;color:black">Date:
</span></b><span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Helvetica Neue&quot;">18 March =
2020 at 13:01:52 GMT</span><u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><b><span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Helvetica Neue&q=
uot;;color:black">To:
</span></b><span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Helvetica Neue&quot;"><a href=
=3D"mailto:ietf@huelsing.net" target=3D"_blank">ietf@huelsing.net</a>,
<a href=3D"mailto:dbutin@cdc.informatik.tu-darmstadt.de" target=3D"_blank">=
dbutin@cdc.informatik.tu-darmstadt.de</a>,
<a href=3D"mailto:ietf@gazdag.de" target=3D"_blank">ietf@gazdag.de</a>, <a =
href=3D"mailto:ietf@joostrijneveld.nl" target=3D"_blank">
ietf@joostrijneveld.nl</a>, <a href=3D"mailto:mohaisen@ieee.org" target=3D"=
_blank">mohaisen@ieee.org</a>,
<a href=3D"mailto:irsg@irtf.org" target=3D"_blank">irsg@irtf.org</a></span>=
<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><b><span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Helvetica Neue&q=
uot;;color:black">Cc:
</span></b><span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Helvetica Neue&quot;"><a href=
=3D"mailto:ietf@huelsing.net" target=3D"_blank">ietf@huelsing.net</a>,
<a href=3D"mailto:rfc-editor@rfc-editor.org" target=3D"_blank">rfc-editor@r=
fc-editor.org</a></span><u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
<div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">The following errata report has been submitted for R=
FC8391,<br>
&quot;XMSS: eXtended Merkle Signature Scheme&quot;.<br>
<br>
--------------------------------------<br>
You may review the report below and at:<br>
<a href=3D"https://www.rfc-editor.org/errata/eid6024" target=3D"_blank">htt=
ps://www.rfc-editor.org/errata/eid6024</a><br>
<br>
--------------------------------------<br>
Type: Technical<br>
Reported by: Andreas H=C3=BClsing &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:ietf@huelsing.net" =
target=3D"_blank">ietf@huelsing.net</a>&gt;<br>
<br>
Section: 5<br>
<br>
Original Text<br>
-------------<br>
This section provides basic parameter sets that are assumed to cover most r=
elevant applications.=C2=A0 Parameter sets for two classical security level=
s are defined.=C2=A0 Parameters with n =3D 32 provide a classical security =
level of 256 bits.=C2=A0 Parameters with n =3D 64 provide
 a classical security level of 512 bits.=C2=A0 Considering quantum-computer=
-aided attacks, these output sizes yield post-quantum security of 128 and 2=
56 bits, respectively.<br>
<br>
Corrected Text<br>
--------------<br>
This section provides basic parameter sets that are assumed to cover most r=
elevant applications. Parameter sets for two classical security levels are =
defined using the cryptographic functions SHA2 and SHAKE.=C2=A0 Parameters =
with SHA2 and n =3D 32 provide a classical
 security level of 256 bits. Parameters with SHA2 and n =3D 64 provide a cl=
assical security level of 512 bits.=C2=A0 Considering quantum-computer-aide=
d attacks, these parameters yield post-quantum security of 128 and 256 bits=
, respectively. Parameters with SHAKE and
 n =3D 32 provide a classical security level of 128 bits.=C2=A0 Parameters =
with SHAKE and n =3D 64 provide a classical security level of 256 bits.=C2=
=A0 Considering quantum-computer-aided attacks, these parameters yield post=
-quantum security of 86 and 170 bits, respectively.
<br>
<br>
Notes<br>
-----<br>
Traditionally, a hash function with n-bit outputs is assumed to have n-bit =
security against classical preimage and second-preimage attacks, and n/2-bi=
t security against classical collision attacks. For adversaries with access=
 to a quantum computer, these bounds
 change to n/2 and n/3 bits when only counting queries to the hash function=
. This also applies to SHA2 and SHA3. In contrast, SHAKE follows a differen=
t reasoning. SHAKE with an internal state of n bits and an output length of=
 n bits achieves n/2 bit security
 against classical preimage, second-preimage and collision attacks. For qua=
ntum attacks security changes to n/3 bits. The reason is that SHAKE allows =
for meet-in-the-middle preimage attacks that reduce to a collision search o=
n the internal state. The same applies
 for SHA3 but for SHA3 a bigger internal state is used.<br>
<br>
In consequence, SHAKE-128 cannot provide more security than NIST post-quant=
um security level II (Any attack that breaks the relevant security definiti=
on must require computational resources comparable to or greater than those=
 required for collision search on
 a 256-bit hash function (e.g. SHA256 / SHA3-256)).<br>
<br>
Instructions:<br>
-------------<br>
This erratum is currently posted as &quot;Reported&quot;. If necessary, ple=
ase<br>
use &quot;Reply All&quot; to discuss whether it should be verified or<br>
rejected. When a decision is reached, the verifying party =C2=A0<br>
can log in to change the status and edit the report, if necessary. <br>
<br>
--------------------------------------<br>
RFC8391 (draft-irtf-cfrg-xmss-hash-based-signatures-12)<br>
--------------------------------------<br>
Title =C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=
=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0: XMSS: eXtended Merkle Signature Scheme<br>
Publication Date =C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0: May 2018<br>
Author(s) =C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0: A. =
Huelsing, D. Butin, S. Gazdag, J. Rijneveld, A.. Mohaisen<br>
Category =C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=
: INFORMATIONAL<br>
Source =C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=
=C2=A0=C2=A0: Crypto Forum Research Group<br>
Area =C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=
=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0: N/A<br>
Stream =C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=
=C2=A0=C2=A0: IRTF<br>
Verifying Party =C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0: IRSG<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
</div>
</blockquote>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-bottom:12pt"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p=
>
</div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>

</blockquote></div>

--000000000000cc04a805a81ad55e--


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From: "Scott Fluhrer (sfluhrer)" <sfluhrer@cisco.com>
To: "Stanislav V. Smyshlyaev" <smyshsv@gmail.com>
CC: "crypto-panel@irtf.org" <crypto-panel@irtf.org>, "cfrg-chairs@ietf.org" <cfrg-chairs@ietf.org>
Thread-Topic: [Crypto-panel] Fwd: [irsg] [Technical Errata Reported] RFC8391 (6024)
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Subject: Re: [Crypto-panel] Fwd: [irsg] [Technical Errata Reported] RFC8391 (6024)
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From: "Stanislav V. Smyshlyaev" <smyshsv@gmail.com>
Date: Mon, 15 Jun 2020 14:59:06 +0300
Message-ID: <CAMr0u6=Cdz6hi6KS7DPPzxGeLuV8aFAXTYffL6tmMgMR6DTV-A@mail.gmail.com>
To: "Scott Fluhrer (sfluhrer)" <sfluhrer@cisco.com>
Cc: "crypto-panel@irtf.org" <crypto-panel@irtf.org>, "cfrg-chairs@ietf.org" <cfrg-chairs@ietf.org>
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Archived-At: <https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/crypto-panel/JHx53GqHzM6c4d4999l7VXM9DB8>
Subject: Re: [Crypto-panel] Fwd: [irsg] [Technical Errata Reported] RFC8391 (6024)
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Agreed, thanks!

Regards,
Stanislav

On Mon, 15 Jun 2020 at 14:58, Scott Fluhrer (sfluhrer) <sfluhrer@cisco.com>
wrote:

> Actually, I=E2=80=99d be happy either way (as these are =E2=80=98nits=E2=
=80=99, not real
> problems).  Those changes would be my suggestion.
>
>
>
> *From:* Stanislav V. Smyshlyaev <smyshsv@gmail.com>
> *Sent:* Monday, June 15, 2020 4:01 AM
> *To:* Scott Fluhrer (sfluhrer) <sfluhrer@cisco.com>
> *Cc:* crypto-panel@irtf.org; cfrg-chairs@ietf.org
> *Subject:* Re: [Crypto-panel] Fwd: [irsg] [Technical Errata Reported]
> RFC8391 (6024)
>
>
>
> Many thanks, Scott!
>
>
>
> Therefore, you will be happy if the proposed change is applied, with the
> revised version of notes, dropping the sentences "The same applies for SH=
A3
> ... " and "(Any attack that breaks...", =E2=80=93 right?
>
>
>
> Regards,
>
> Stanislav
>
>
>
>
>
> On Thu, 11 Jun 2020 at 22:48, Scott Fluhrer (sfluhrer) <sfluhrer@cisco.co=
m>
> wrote:
>
> The text looks correct, however I do have a few nits about the notes.  On=
e
> is the reference to SHA3, which on a quick read might be misleading; here
> is some alterative text:
>
>
>
> The reason is that SHAKE allows for meet-in-the-middle preimage attacks
> that reduce to a collision search on the internal state. *These internal
> collision attacks do not affect the security of SHA3, because of the larg=
er
> capacity used.*
>
>
>
> Alternatively, just drop the reference to SHA3, which isn=E2=80=99t relev=
ent to
> XMSS.
>
>
>
> The other nit is with the sentence that starts:
>
>
>
> Any attack that breaks the relevant security definition must require
> computational resources=E2=80=A6
>
>
>
> That sort of statement always has an implicit assumption of the form
> =E2=80=9Cunless someone has a cryptographical result against the SHA-3
> permutation=E2=80=9D; while we are used to that sort of assumption, a cau=
sal reader
> might not be.  I don=E2=80=99t see what that sentence brings to the table=
; I=E2=80=99d
> suggest dropping it.
>
>
>
> *From:* Crypto-panel <crypto-panel-bounces@irtf.org> *On Behalf Of *Stani=
slav
> V. Smyshlyaev
> *Sent:* Thursday, June 11, 2020 1:57 PM
> *To:* crypto-panel@irtf.org
> *Cc:* cfrg-chairs@ietf.org
> *Subject:* [Crypto-panel] Fwd: [irsg] [Technical Errata Reported] RFC8391
> (6024)
>
>
>
> Dear Crypto Review Panel members,
>
>
>
> There is a need to validate the following errata:
>
> https://www.rfc-editor.org/errata/eid6024
> <https://www.rfc-editor..org/errata/eid6024>
>
>
>
> Any volunteers?
>
>
>
> Regards,
>
> CFRG chairs
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> ---------- =D0=9F=D0=B5=D1=80=D0=B5=D1=81=D1=8B=D0=BB=D0=B0=D0=B5=D0=BC=
=D0=BE=D0=B5 =D1=81=D0=BE=D0=BE=D0=B1=D1=89=D0=B5=D0=BD=D0=B8=D0=B5 -------=
--
> =D0=9E=D1=82: *Colin Perkins* <csp@csperkins.org>
> =D0=94=D0=B0=D1=82=D0=B0: =D1=81=D0=B1, 6 =D0=B8=D1=8E=D0=BD=D1=8F 2020 =
=D0=B3. =D0=B2 16:03
> =D0=A2=D0=B5=D0=BC=D0=B0: Fwd: [irsg] [Technical Errata Reported] RFC8391=
 (6024)
> =D0=9A=D0=BE=D0=BC=D1=83: <cfrg-chairs@ietf.org>
>
>
>
> Hi CFRG chairs,
>
>
>
> Can you discuss, and review with the RG if necessary, and let me know  if
> the following errata should be marked as verified.
>
>
>
> Thanks,
>
> Colin
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> Begin forwarded message:
>
>
>
> *From: *RFC Errata System <rfc-editor@rfc-editor.org>
>
> *Subject: **[irsg] [Technical Errata Reported] RFC8391 (6024)*
>
> *Date: *18 March 2020 at 13:01:52 GMT
>
> *To: *ietf@huelsing.net, dbutin@cdc.informatik.tu-darmstadt.de,
> ietf@gazdag.de, ietf@joostrijneveld.nl, mohaisen@ieee.org, irsg@irtf.org
>
> *Cc: *ietf@huelsing.net, rfc-editor@rfc-editor.org
>
>
>
> The following errata report has been submitted for RFC8391,
> "XMSS: eXtended Merkle Signature Scheme".
>
> --------------------------------------
> You may review the report below and at:
> https://www.rfc-editor.org/errata/eid6024
>
> --------------------------------------
> Type: Technical
> Reported by: Andreas H=C3=BClsing <ietf@huelsing.net>
>
> Section: 5
>
> Original Text
> -------------
> This section provides basic parameter sets that are assumed to cover most
> relevant applications.  Parameter sets for two classical security levels
> are defined.  Parameters with n =3D 32 provide a classical security level=
 of
> 256 bits.  Parameters with n =3D 64 provide a classical security level of=
 512
> bits.  Considering quantum-computer-aided attacks, these output sizes yie=
ld
> post-quantum security of 128 and 256 bits, respectively.
>
> Corrected Text
> --------------
> This section provides basic parameter sets that are assumed to cover most
> relevant applications. Parameter sets for two classical security levels a=
re
> defined using the cryptographic functions SHA2 and SHAKE.  Parameters wit=
h
> SHA2 and n =3D 32 provide a classical security level of 256 bits. Paramet=
ers
> with SHA2 and n =3D 64 provide a classical security level of 512 bits.
> Considering quantum-computer-aided attacks, these parameters yield
> post-quantum security of 128 and 256 bits, respectively. Parameters with
> SHAKE and n =3D 32 provide a classical security level of 128 bits.
> Parameters with SHAKE and n =3D 64 provide a classical security level of =
256
> bits.  Considering quantum-computer-aided attacks, these parameters yield
> post-quantum security of 86 and 170 bits, respectively.
>
> Notes
> -----
> Traditionally, a hash function with n-bit outputs is assumed to have n-bi=
t
> security against classical preimage and second-preimage attacks, and
> n/2-bit security against classical collision attacks. For adversaries wit=
h
> access to a quantum computer, these bounds change to n/2 and n/3 bits whe=
n
> only counting queries to the hash function. This also applies to SHA2 and
> SHA3. In contrast, SHAKE follows a different reasoning. SHAKE with an
> internal state of n bits and an output length of n bits achieves n/2 bit
> security against classical preimage, second-preimage and collision attack=
s.
> For quantum attacks security changes to n/3 bits. The reason is that SHAK=
E
> allows for meet-in-the-middle preimage attacks that reduce to a collision
> search on the internal state. The same applies for SHA3 but for SHA3 a
> bigger internal state is used.
>
> In consequence, SHAKE-128 cannot provide more security than NIST
> post-quantum security level II (Any attack that breaks the relevant
> security definition must require computational resources comparable to or
> greater than those required for collision search on a 256-bit hash functi=
on
> (e.g. SHA256 / SHA3-256)).
>
> Instructions:
> -------------
> This erratum is currently posted as "Reported". If necessary, please
> use "Reply All" to discuss whether it should be verified or
> rejected. When a decision is reached, the verifying party
> can log in to change the status and edit the report, if necessary.
>
> --------------------------------------
> RFC8391 (draft-irtf-cfrg-xmss-hash-based-signatures-12)
> --------------------------------------
> Title               : XMSS: eXtended Merkle Signature Scheme
> Publication Date    : May 2018
> Author(s)           : A. Huelsing, D. Butin, S. Gazdag, J. Rijneveld, A..
> Mohaisen
> Category            : INFORMATIONAL
> Source              : Crypto Forum Research Group
> Area                : N/A
> Stream              : IRTF
> Verifying Party     : IRSG
>
>
>
>
>
>

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Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

<div dir=3D"ltr">Agreed, thanks!<div><br></div><div>Regards,<br>Stanislav</=
div></div><br><div class=3D"gmail_quote"><div dir=3D"ltr" class=3D"gmail_at=
tr">On Mon, 15 Jun 2020 at 14:58, Scott Fluhrer (sfluhrer) &lt;<a href=3D"m=
ailto:sfluhrer@cisco.com">sfluhrer@cisco.com</a>&gt; wrote:<br></div><block=
quote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-left:1=
px solid rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex">





<div lang=3D"EN-US">
<div class=3D"gmail-m_4044845014779921058WordSection1">
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Actually, I=E2=80=99d be happy either way (as these =
are =E2=80=98nits=E2=80=99, not real problems).=C2=A0 Those changes would b=
e my suggestion.<span lang=3D"EN-GB"><u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
<div style=3D"border-top:none;border-right:none;border-bottom:none;border-l=
eft:1.5pt solid blue;padding:0in 0in 0in 4pt">
<div>
<div style=3D"border-right:none;border-bottom:none;border-left:none;border-=
top:1pt solid rgb(225,225,225);padding:3pt 0in 0in">
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><b>From:</b> Stanislav V. Smyshlyaev &lt;<a href=3D"=
mailto:smyshsv@gmail.com" target=3D"_blank">smyshsv@gmail.com</a>&gt; <br>
<b>Sent:</b> Monday, June 15, 2020 4:01 AM<br>
<b>To:</b> Scott Fluhrer (sfluhrer) &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:sfluhrer@cisco.co=
m" target=3D"_blank">sfluhrer@cisco.com</a>&gt;<br>
<b>Cc:</b> <a href=3D"mailto:crypto-panel@irtf.org" target=3D"_blank">crypt=
o-panel@irtf.org</a>; <a href=3D"mailto:cfrg-chairs@ietf.org" target=3D"_bl=
ank">cfrg-chairs@ietf.org</a><br>
<b>Subject:</b> Re: [Crypto-panel] Fwd: [irsg] [Technical Errata Reported] =
RFC8391 (6024)<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
</div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Many thanks, Scott!<u></u><u></u></p>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Therefore, you will be happy if the proposed change =
is applied, with the revised version of notes, dropping the sentences &quot=
;The same applies for SHA3 ... &quot; and &quot;(Any attack that breaks...&=
quot;, =E2=80=93 right?<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Regards,<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Stanislav<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
</div>
</div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
<div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">On Thu, 11 Jun 2020 at 22:48, Scott Fluhrer (sfluhre=
r) &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:sfluhrer@cisco.com" target=3D"_blank">sfluhrer@cis=
co.com</a>&gt; wrote:<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<blockquote style=3D"border-top:none;border-right:none;border-bottom:none;b=
order-left:1pt solid rgb(204,204,204);padding:0in 0in 0in 6pt;margin-left:4=
.8pt;margin-right:0in">
<div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-GB">The text looks correct, however=
 I do have a few nits about the notes.=C2=A0 One is the reference to SHA3, =
which on a quick read might be misleading; here is some alterative
 text:</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-GB">=C2=A0</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;font-family:Arial,sa=
ns-serif;color:rgb(44,67,83);background:rgb(227,227,227)">The reason is tha=
t SHAKE allows for meet-in-the-middle preimage attacks that reduce
 to a collision search on the internal state. <b>These internal collision a=
ttacks do not affect the security of SHA3, because of the larger capacity u=
sed.</b></span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><b><span style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;font-family:Arial=
,sans-serif;color:rgb(44,67,83);background:rgb(227,227,227)">=C2=A0</span><=
/b><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-GB">Alternatively, just drop the re=
ference to SHA3, which isn=E2=80=99t relevent to XMSS.</span><u></u><u></u>=
</p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-GB">=C2=A0</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-GB">The other nit is with the sente=
nce that starts:</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-GB">=C2=A0</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;font-family:Arial,sa=
ns-serif;color:rgb(44,67,83);background:rgb(227,227,227)">Any attack that b=
reaks the relevant security definition must require computational
 resources=E2=80=A6</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><b><span style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;font-family:Arial=
,sans-serif;color:rgb(44,67,83);background:rgb(227,227,227)">=C2=A0</span><=
/b><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-GB">That sort of statement always h=
as an implicit assumption of the form =E2=80=9Cunless someone has a cryptog=
raphical result against the SHA-3 permutation=E2=80=9D; while we are
 used to that sort of assumption, a causal reader might not be.=C2=A0 I don=
=E2=80=99t see what that sentence brings to the table; I=E2=80=99d suggest =
dropping it.</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;font-family:Arial,sa=
ns-serif;color:rgb(44,67,83);background:rgb(227,227,227)">=C2=A0</span><u><=
/u><u></u></p>
<div style=3D"border-top:none;border-right:none;border-bottom:none;border-l=
eft:1.5pt solid blue;padding:0in 0in 0in 4pt">
<div>
<div style=3D"border-right:none;border-bottom:none;border-left:none;border-=
top:1pt solid rgb(225,225,225);padding:3pt 0in 0in">
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><b>From:</b> Crypto-panel &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:cryp=
to-panel-bounces@irtf.org" target=3D"_blank">crypto-panel-bounces@irtf.org<=
/a>&gt;
<b>On Behalf Of </b>Stanislav V. Smyshlyaev<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Thursday, June 11, 2020 1:57 PM<br>
<b>To:</b> <a href=3D"mailto:crypto-panel@irtf.org" target=3D"_blank">crypt=
o-panel@irtf.org</a><br>
<b>Cc:</b> <a href=3D"mailto:cfrg-chairs@ietf.org" target=3D"_blank">cfrg-c=
hairs@ietf.org</a><br>
<b>Subject:</b> [Crypto-panel] Fwd: [irsg] [Technical Errata Reported] RFC8=
391 (6024)<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
</div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
<div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Dear Crypto Review Panel members,<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">There is a need to validate the following errata:<u>=
</u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><a href=3D"https://www.rfc-editor..org/errata/eid602=
4" target=3D"_blank">https://www.rfc-editor.org/errata/eid6024</a><u></u><u=
></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Any volunteers?<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Regards,<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">CFRG chairs<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
<div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">---------- =D0=9F=D0=B5=D1=80=D0=B5=D1=81=D1=8B=D0=
=BB=D0=B0=D0=B5=D0=BC=D0=BE=D0=B5 =D1=81=D0=BE=D0=BE=D0=B1=D1=89=D0=B5=D0=
=BD=D0=B8=D0=B5 ---------<br>
=D0=9E=D1=82: <strong><span style=3D"font-family:Calibri,sans-serif">Colin =
Perkins</span></strong> &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:csp@csperkins.org" target=3D"=
_blank">csp@csperkins.org</a>&gt;<br>
=D0=94=D0=B0=D1=82=D0=B0: =D1=81=D0=B1, 6 =D0=B8=D1=8E=D0=BD=D1=8F 2020 =D0=
=B3. =D0=B2 16:03<br>
=D0=A2=D0=B5=D0=BC=D0=B0: Fwd: [irsg] [Technical Errata Reported] RFC8391 (=
6024)<br>
=D0=9A=D0=BE=D0=BC=D1=83: &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:cfrg-chairs@ietf.org" targe=
t=3D"_blank">cfrg-chairs@ietf.org</a>&gt;<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-bottom:12pt">=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p=
>
<div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Hi CFRG chairs,<u></u><u></u></p>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Can you discuss, and review with the RG if necessary=
, and let me know =C2=A0if the following errata should be marked as verifie=
d.<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Thanks,<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Colin<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-bottom:12pt"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p=
>
<blockquote style=3D"margin-top:5pt;margin-bottom:5pt">
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Begin forwarded message:<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><b><span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Helvetica Neue&q=
uot;;color:black">From:
</span></b><span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Helvetica Neue&quot;">RFC Errat=
a System &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:rfc-editor@rfc-editor.org" target=3D"_blank"=
>rfc-editor@rfc-editor.org</a>&gt;</span><u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><b><span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Helvetica Neue&q=
uot;;color:black">Subject:
</span></b><b><span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Helvetica Neue&quot;">[irsg]=
 [Technical Errata Reported] RFC8391 (6024)</span></b><u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><b><span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Helvetica Neue&q=
uot;;color:black">Date:
</span></b><span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Helvetica Neue&quot;">18 March =
2020 at 13:01:52 GMT</span><u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><b><span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Helvetica Neue&q=
uot;;color:black">To:
</span></b><span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Helvetica Neue&quot;"><a href=
=3D"mailto:ietf@huelsing.net" target=3D"_blank">ietf@huelsing.net</a>,
<a href=3D"mailto:dbutin@cdc.informatik.tu-darmstadt.de" target=3D"_blank">=
dbutin@cdc.informatik.tu-darmstadt.de</a>,
<a href=3D"mailto:ietf@gazdag.de" target=3D"_blank">ietf@gazdag.de</a>, <a =
href=3D"mailto:ietf@joostrijneveld.nl" target=3D"_blank">
ietf@joostrijneveld.nl</a>, <a href=3D"mailto:mohaisen@ieee.org" target=3D"=
_blank">mohaisen@ieee.org</a>,
<a href=3D"mailto:irsg@irtf.org" target=3D"_blank">irsg@irtf.org</a></span>=
<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><b><span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Helvetica Neue&q=
uot;;color:black">Cc:
</span></b><span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Helvetica Neue&quot;"><a href=
=3D"mailto:ietf@huelsing.net" target=3D"_blank">ietf@huelsing.net</a>,
<a href=3D"mailto:rfc-editor@rfc-editor.org" target=3D"_blank">rfc-editor@r=
fc-editor.org</a></span><u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
<div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">The following errata report has been submitted for R=
FC8391,<br>
&quot;XMSS: eXtended Merkle Signature Scheme&quot;.<br>
<br>
--------------------------------------<br>
You may review the report below and at:<br>
<a href=3D"https://www.rfc-editor.org/errata/eid6024" target=3D"_blank">htt=
ps://www.rfc-editor.org/errata/eid6024</a><br>
<br>
--------------------------------------<br>
Type: Technical<br>
Reported by: Andreas H=C3=BClsing &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:ietf@huelsing.net" =
target=3D"_blank">ietf@huelsing.net</a>&gt;<br>
<br>
Section: 5<br>
<br>
Original Text<br>
-------------<br>
This section provides basic parameter sets that are assumed to cover most r=
elevant applications.=C2=A0 Parameter sets for two classical security level=
s are defined.=C2=A0 Parameters with n =3D 32 provide a classical security =
level of 256 bits.=C2=A0 Parameters with n =3D 64 provide
 a classical security level of 512 bits.=C2=A0 Considering quantum-computer=
-aided attacks, these output sizes yield post-quantum security of 128 and 2=
56 bits, respectively.<br>
<br>
Corrected Text<br>
--------------<br>
This section provides basic parameter sets that are assumed to cover most r=
elevant applications. Parameter sets for two classical security levels are =
defined using the cryptographic functions SHA2 and SHAKE.=C2=A0 Parameters =
with SHA2 and n =3D 32 provide a classical
 security level of 256 bits. Parameters with SHA2 and n =3D 64 provide a cl=
assical security level of 512 bits.=C2=A0 Considering quantum-computer-aide=
d attacks, these parameters yield post-quantum security of 128 and 256 bits=
, respectively. Parameters with SHAKE and
 n =3D 32 provide a classical security level of 128 bits.=C2=A0 Parameters =
with SHAKE and n =3D 64 provide a classical security level of 256 bits.=C2=
=A0 Considering quantum-computer-aided attacks, these parameters yield post=
-quantum security of 86 and 170 bits, respectively.
<br>
<br>
Notes<br>
-----<br>
Traditionally, a hash function with n-bit outputs is assumed to have n-bit =
security against classical preimage and second-preimage attacks, and n/2-bi=
t security against classical collision attacks. For adversaries with access=
 to a quantum computer, these bounds
 change to n/2 and n/3 bits when only counting queries to the hash function=
. This also applies to SHA2 and SHA3. In contrast, SHAKE follows a differen=
t reasoning. SHAKE with an internal state of n bits and an output length of=
 n bits achieves n/2 bit security
 against classical preimage, second-preimage and collision attacks. For qua=
ntum attacks security changes to n/3 bits. The reason is that SHAKE allows =
for meet-in-the-middle preimage attacks that reduce to a collision search o=
n the internal state. The same applies
 for SHA3 but for SHA3 a bigger internal state is used.<br>
<br>
In consequence, SHAKE-128 cannot provide more security than NIST post-quant=
um security level II (Any attack that breaks the relevant security definiti=
on must require computational resources comparable to or greater than those=
 required for collision search on
 a 256-bit hash function (e.g. SHA256 / SHA3-256)).<br>
<br>
Instructions:<br>
-------------<br>
This erratum is currently posted as &quot;Reported&quot;. If necessary, ple=
ase<br>
use &quot;Reply All&quot; to discuss whether it should be verified or<br>
rejected. When a decision is reached, the verifying party =C2=A0<br>
can log in to change the status and edit the report, if necessary. <br>
<br>
--------------------------------------<br>
RFC8391 (draft-irtf-cfrg-xmss-hash-based-signatures-12)<br>
--------------------------------------<br>
Title =C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=
=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0: XMSS: eXtended Merkle Signature Scheme<br>
Publication Date =C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0: May 2018<br>
Author(s) =C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0: A. =
Huelsing, D. Butin, S. Gazdag, J. Rijneveld, A.. Mohaisen<br>
Category =C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=
: INFORMATIONAL<br>
Source =C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=
=C2=A0=C2=A0: Crypto Forum Research Group<br>
Area =C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=
=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0: N/A<br>
Stream =C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=
=C2=A0=C2=A0: IRTF<br>
Verifying Party =C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0: IRSG<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
</div>
</blockquote>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-bottom:12pt">=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p=
>
</div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</blockquote>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>

</blockquote></div>

--00000000000002be6605a81e28fe--


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From: Chloe Martindale <chloemartindale@gmail.com>
Date: Mon, 15 Jun 2020 17:28:33 +0100
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To: Yumi Sakemi <yumi.sakemi@lepidum.co.jp>
Cc: crypto-panel@irtf.org, cfrg-chairs@ietf.org,  Tetsutaro Kobayashi <tetsutaro.kobayashi.dr@hco.ntt.co.jp>,  SAITO Tsunekazu <tsunekazu.saito.hg@hco.ntt.co.jp>
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Subject: Re: [Crypto-panel] Request for review: draft-irtf-cfrg-pairing-friendly-curves-03
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--000000000000ad5e4d05a821ebe3
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8"
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Dear Yumi, dear all,

thank you for carefully taking my comments into consideration. I am much
happier with the draft now! There are a few typos left, see below, and I
just had a couple of comments on the security discussion but these are
easily fixed. If you fix these small things in my opinion it's ready for RG
Last Call.



Abstract:
Pairing is a special map -> Pairings are special maps OR A pairing is a
special map

1.1
'Pairing is a special map' -> 'Pairings are special maps OR A pairing is a
special map'
'importance of pairing' -> 'importance of pairings'
'pairing is efficiently computable' -> 'pairings are efficiently
computable'.

1.2
pairins -> pairings

1.3
(NSF) -> (NFS)
Barbulescu et. al. -> Barbulescu and Duquesne. (Authors are alphabetical).

2.2
-'The optimal Ate pairing is considered to be the most efficient to compute
is the one that is most commonly used for practical implementation.' ->
'The optimal Ate pairing is considered to be the most efficient to compute
and is the one that is most commonly used for practical implementation.'
-Choose G_2 or G2 (probably G_2 is easier since there are many instances
also of G_1 and G_T)
-'There also exists cyclic subgroup' -> 'There also exists a cyclic
subgroup'

2.3
-'b is an element of multiplicative group of order p' -> 'b is a nonzero
element of F_p' OR 'b is an element of a multiplicative group (F_p)^* of
order p-1' OR 'b is an element of the multiplicative group of F_p'
-'embedded degree' -> 'embeddiing degree'

2.4
-'r-torsions' -> 'r-torsion'

2.5
-(paragraph 2): of degree d' -> of degree d

4.2
-This sentence has slightly weird grammar so I don't fully understand what
you want to say: 'Therefore, the curve of the 128-bit security level
   is often used at current, so this memo recommends both BLS12-381 and
   BN462 in consideration of the future use and the safety side.'
Do you mean:
'As curves of 128-bit security level are currently the most widely used, we
recommend both BLS12-381 and BN462 in this memo in order to have a more
efficient and a more prudent option respectively.'

4.2.1
-This comment is maybe a bit misleading:
'We have to note that, according to [BD18], the bit length of p for
   BLS12 to achieve 128-bit security is calculated as 461 bits and more,
   which BLS12_381 does not satisfy.'
The 461-bit figure in [BD18] is based on a rough estimate which varies a
lot between different examples (as is necessary when giving a broad
overview). The exact complexity of [BD18]'s attack depends on the specific
polynomial used to construct the family and can change the complexity of
the attack by up to about 12 bits. The proposed construction of BLS12_381
you refer to here has been specially chosen to minimize the impact of the
exTNFS attack. It would in my opinion be more precise to say:
'We have to note that the security level of this pairing is expected to be
126 rather than 128 bits [GMT19]'.

4.2.2
-This comment could be more clearly worded:
'We have to note that the BN462 becomes slower compared to BLS12_381,
   although the BN462 is suitable for the parameters of the 128-bit
   security level for the use of the future internet.'
How about instead:
'We have to note that BN462 is significantly slower than BLS12_381,
   but has 134-bit security level [GMT19],
   so may be more resistant to future small improvements to the exTNFS
attack.'

This would be a good place to also add a remark along the lines of:
'We note also that CP8_544 is more efficient than BN462, has 131-bit
security level,
and that due to its construction will not be affected by future small
improvements to the exTNFS attack. However, as this curve is not widely
used (it is only implemented in one library), we instead chose BN462 for
our 'safe' option.'

5.
-'BLS curves of embedding degree 12 require' -> 'BLS curves of embedding
degree typically require' (cf. my comment on 4.2.1)

All the best,
Chloe


On Wed, 10 Jun 2020 at 05:06, Yumi Sakemi <yumi.sakemi@lepidum.co.jp> wrote=
:

> Dear Alexey, Nick, Stanislav, and Chloe
>
> We have submitted the latest version 05 of the draft "Pairing-Friendly
> Curves".
> https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-irtf-cfrg-pairing-friendly-curves/
>
> We have categorized a lot of comments received in the Expert Review
> into more than 40 issues, and reflected the results which we
> considered all of issues to the latest version.
> While we revised the draft, we received comments from other CFRG
> members and the authors of the draft "BLS Signatures", and reflected
> them to the latest version.
>
> If you want to know the details of how to revise, you can check them
> by closed issues on the official CFRG GitHub page.
>
>
> https://github.com/cfrg/draft-irtf-cfrg-pairing-friendly-curves/issues?q=
=3Dis%3Aissue+is%3Aclosed
>
> Thanks to valuable and constructive comments from Chloe and CFRG
> members, our draft became readable and higher quality.
> We strongly believe that the draft is ready for RG Last Call.
> If there are other necessary procedures for RGLC, could you tell us?
>
> Best regards,
> Yumi
>
> 2020=E5=B9=B46=E6=9C=889=E6=97=A5(=E7=81=AB) 20:02 Yumi Sakemi <yumi.sake=
mi@lepidum.co.jp>:
> >
> > Dear Chloe
> >
> > Thank you for your e-mail.
> >
> > We are very glad to reach a rough consensus with you.
> > We believe that our draft became very readable and higher quality by
> > reflecting your comments.
> > We appreciate your valuable and constructive comments.
> >
> > We'd like to express our gratitude and include your name in
> Acknowledgement.
> > The version 05 that is reflected your comments will be submitted today
> > or tomorrow, then we will contact you again.
> >
> > Best regards,
> > Yumi
> >
> > 2020=E5=B9=B46=E6=9C=881=E6=97=A5(=E6=9C=88) 18:53 Chloe Martindale <ch=
loemartindale@gmail.com>:
> > >
> > > Dear Yumi, dear all,
> > >
> > > thank you for the update and for involving me in your thought process
> regarding the curve choices. I understand and agree with your reasoning
> (and approach) regarding including both BLS12-381 and BN462, however I
> think I would make a different 'safer choice'.
> > >
> > > My reason is this: if the attack is improved further (which you are
> completely right, it may), it is very likely to have a bigger impact on
> curves constructed via polynomial methods with embedding degree 8 (such a=
s
> BN462) than on any other curves for this security level, so it's not
> unlikely that the security of BN462 would be pushed below 128 bits. A saf=
er
> choice in my view would be to take the Cocks-Pinch curve (not constructed
> using polynomial methods) defined using a 544-bit prime implemented in
> RELIC, from [GMT19]*. The TNFS attacks cannot be applied to Cocks-Pinch
> curves (at least not without a fundamental new attack idea, since they re=
ly
> on the polynomial construction), so small improvements will not decrease
> the security level at all, and this curve is actually still more efficien=
t
> than BN462 so there's nothing to lose there. I appreciate that such a
> choice would mean also including some background on Cocks-Pinch and a
> reference/short explanation of the fact that TNFS attacks don't apply to
> these, which would be a major change to the original document, so I
> appreciate it if you'd rather not do this, but just thought I'd suggest i=
t
> as I think it would increase the lifetime of your document.
> > >
> > > *In your draft this is [GME19], but it should be [GMT19], and can now
> be updated to the peer-reviewed version of course (this is the paper I
> pointed out in my review).
> > >
> > > All the best,
> > > Chloe
> > >
> > > On Fri, 29 May 2020 at 16:21, Yumi Sakemi <yumi.sakemi@lepidum.co.jp>
> wrote:
> > >>
> > >> Dear Chloe
> > >>
> > >> We appreciate a lot of constructive comments received at Expert
> Review.
> > >>
> > >> We are currently working on updating our draft.
> > >> Last week, Nick created a repository for pairing-friendly curves on
> > >> CFRG's official GitHub, so we plan to update our draft using the iss=
ue
> > >> tracker.
> > >> The updating for your comments will be made available to you on the
> > >> following issue page.
> > >>
> > >>
> https://github.com/cfrg/draft-irtf-cfrg-pairing-friendly-curves/issues
> > >>
> > >> We will contact you again when all the comments have been updated.
> > >> In that case, we would be glad if you could check them.
> > >>
> > >> In addition, before updating, there is a comment that we would like =
to
> > >> inform you about the policy of update.
> > >> The comment is about the recommended curve for 128-bit security leve=
l.
> > >>
> > >> First of all, thank you for teaching us a peer-reviewed paper for
> BLS12-381.
> > >> The comment is about the recommended curve for 128-bit security leve=
l.
> > >> Due to our lack of investigation, we made the wrong decision that
> > >> BLS12-381 was not matched in our selection policy.
> > >>
> > >> Your comment pointed out that BLS12-381 is moved to the recommended
> > >> curve and BN462 is moved to the Appendix.
> > >> We understood the disadvantages of BN462 that you were concerned
> > >> about, but we would like to recommend both BLS12-381 and BN462.
> > >> The reason is as follows.
> > >>
> > >> CFRG aims to standardize cryptographic technology for future Interne=
t
> use.
> > >> We agree that BLS12-381 with a 126-bit security level is the best
> > >> match as a curve of 128-bit security level "at this time" from the
> > >> viewpoint of security and efficiency.
> > >> On the other hand, the security of BLS12-381 is already less than
> > >> 128bit, so from the viewpoint of future use, if the attack is improv=
ed
> > >> even a little, it will not be suitable for a curve of 128-bit securi=
ty
> > >> level.
> > >> Considering that the curve of 128-bit security level is often used a=
t
> current.
> > >> So, we would like to recommend both BLS12-381 and BN462 considering
> > >> the future use and the safety side.
> > >>
> > >> However, as you pointed out, BN462 has the disadvantage of being too
> > >> slow compared to BLS12-381.
> > >> Then, the reader will be confused if there are two parameters of
> > >> 128-bit security level, so we will add the basis for selection by
> > >> adding the explanation of merits and demerits for each parameter.
> > >> And, we will also add a description about the disadvantages of BN462
> > >> regarding efficiency.
> > >>
> > >> If you have any problems with the updating policy, we would like you
> to comment.
> > >>
> > >> Best regards,
> > >> Yumi
> > >>
> > >>
> > >>
> > >>
> > >>
> > >>
> > >> 2020=E5=B9=B44=E6=9C=8827=E6=97=A5(=E6=9C=88) 21:58 Yumi Sakemi <yum=
i.sakemi@lepidum.co.jp>:
> > >> >
> > >> > Dear Chloe
> > >> >
> > >> > I appreciate your review.
> > >> > I'm very glad to receive many constructive comments!
> > >> > I will discuss about your comments with co-authors and revise our
> > >> > draft to reflect your comments in our draft.
> > >> > I think it will be a better draft by reflecting your comments.
> > >> >
> > >> > As co-author Tsunekazu e-mailed, we're  planning to submit version
> 04,
> > >> > because we were independently working on updating of abstract,
> > >> > introduction (sec. 1.3) and proofreading of English in parallel wi=
th
> > >> > the expert review.
> > >> > (Version 04 will not be reflected your comments.)
> > >> >
> > >> > Comments from Chloe will be reflected in the version 05.
> > >> > We will submit version 05 in mid-May and we will report you when w=
e
> > >> > submit version 05.
> > >> >
> > >> > Dear Stanislav
> > >> >
> > >> > Thank you very much for proceeding to the Expert review.
> > >> > We received a lot of constructive comments from Chloe, so I think =
it
> > >> > is difficult to manage comments by email.
> > >> > (Because there are over 100 comments from Chloe.)
> > >> >
> > >> > Therefore, I would like to use the issue management function of
> GitHub
> > >> > so that it is easy to check the reflecting status of Chloe's
> comments.
> > >> > So, I'd like to use the repository of pairing-friendly curves draf=
t
> on
> > >> > CFRG's GitHub
> > >> > because BLS signature which is similar in terms of IRTF stream is
> also
> > >> > registered on the GitHub.
> > >> > Could you register the repository for the draft of pairing-friendl=
y
> > >> > curves on the following CFRG's GitHub?
> > >> >
> > >> > https://github.com/cfrg
> > >> >
> > >> > Best regards,
> > >> > Yumi
> > >> >
> > >> > 2020=E5=B9=B44=E6=9C=8827=E6=97=A5(=E6=9C=88) 10:09 SAITO Tsunekaz=
u <
> tsunekazu.saito.hg@hco.ntt.co.jp>:
> > >> > >
> > >> > > Dear Chloe, Stanislav,
> > >> > >
> > >> > >
> > >> > >
> > >> > > This is Tsunekazu.
> > >> > >
> > >> > >
> > >> > >
> > >> > > We plan to update the draft to version 04 soon.
> > >> > >
> > >> > > As the contents of the update, we changed the wording of Section
> 1.3 and security consideration.
> > >> > >
> > >> > > Yumi will submit the 4th edition, so please wait a moment.
> > >> > >
> > >> > >
> > >> > >
> > >> > > Best regards,
> > >> > >
> > >> > > Tsunekazu
> > >> > >
> > >> > >
> > >> > >
> > >> > > From: Stanislav V. Smyshlyaev <smyshsv@gmail.com>
> > >> > > Sent: Sunday, April 26, 2020 2:30 PM
> > >> > > To: Chloe Martindale <chloemartindale@gmail.com>; SAITO
> Tsunekazu <tsunekazu.saito.hg@hco.ntt.co.jp>; Tetsutaro Kobayashi <
> tetsutaro.kobayashi.dr@hco.ntt.co.jp>; Yumi Sakemi <
> yumi.sakemi@lepidum.co.jp>
> > >> > > Cc: cfrg-chairs@ietf.org; crypto-panel@irtf.org
> > >> > > Subject: Re: [Crypto-panel] Request for review:
> draft-irtf-cfrg-pairing-friendly-curves-03
> > >> > >
> > >> > >
> > >> > >
> > >> > > Dear Chloe,
> > >> > >
> > >> > > Many thanks for your review (such a great and a prompt one!).
> > >> > >
> > >> > >
> > >> > >
> > >> > > Dear Yumi, Saito, Tetsutaro, do you plan to update your draft
> taking into account Chloe=E2=80=99s review?
> > >> > >
> > >> > >
> > >> > >
> > >> > > Best regards,
> > >> > >
> > >> > > Stanislav
> > >> > >
> > >> > >
> > >> > >
> > >> > > =D0=BF=D1=82, 24 =D0=B0=D0=BF=D1=80. 2020 =D0=B3. =D0=B2 19:49, =
Chloe Martindale <
> chloemartindale@gmail.com>:
> > >> > >
> > >> > > Hi all,
> > >> > >
> > >> > >
> > >> > >
> > >> > > review is attached.
> > >> > >
> > >> > >
> > >> > >
> > >> > > All the best,
> > >> > >
> > >> > > Chloe
> > >> > >
> > >> > >
> > >> > >
> > >> > > On Tue, 21 Apr 2020 at 18:05, Stanislav V. Smyshlyaev <
> smyshsv@gmail.com> wrote:
> > >> > >
> > >> > > Sure - it is
> > >> > >
> > >> > >
> https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-irtf-cfrg-pairing-friendly-curves-03
> > >> > >
> > >> > >
> > >> > >
> > >> > > Thank you again!
> > >> > >
> > >> > >
> > >> > >
> > >> > > Regards,
> > >> > >
> > >> > > Stanislav
> > >> > >
> > >> > >
> > >> > >
> > >> > > =D0=B2=D1=82, 21 =D0=B0=D0=BF=D1=80. 2020 =D0=B3. =D0=B2 19:10, =
Chloe Martindale <
> chloemartindale@gmail.com>:
> > >> > >
> > >> > > Just to be sure, can you point me towards the most recent versio=
n
> of the draft please?
> > >> > >
> > >> > >
> > >> > >
> > >> > > Thanks,
> > >> > >
> > >> > > Chloe
> > >> > >
> > >> > >
> > >> > >
> > >> > > On Tue, 21 Apr 2020 at 13:17, Stanislav V. Smyshlyaev <
> smyshsv@gmail.com> wrote:
> > >> > >
> > >> > > Great, many thanks, Chloe!
> > >> > >
> > >> > >
> > >> > >
> > >> > > Kind regards,
> > >> > >
> > >> > > Nick, Alexey, Stanislav
> > >> > >
> > >> > >
> > >> > >
> > >> > > On Tue, 21 Apr 2020 at 15:16, Chloe Martindale <
> chloemartindale@gmail.com> wrote:
> > >> > >
> > >> > > I'll take a look this week.
> > >> > >
> > >> > >
> > >> > >
> > >> > > All the best,
> > >> > >
> > >> > > Chloe
> > >> > >
> > >> > >
> > >> > >
> > >> > > On Tue, 21 Apr 2020, 13:10 Stanislav V. Smyshlyaev, <
> smyshsv@gmail.com> wrote:
> > >> > >
> > >> > > Dear Crypto Panel members,
> > >> > >
> > >> > >
> > >> > >
> > >> > > The authors of the Pairing-Friendly Curves draft have addressed
> the concerns raised during the discussion and are ready to move to the ne=
xt
> stage with the draft.
> > >> > >
> > >> > >
> > >> > >
> > >> > > Alexey, Nick and I would like to ask Crypto Review Panel members
> about the review(s) of draft-irtf-cfrg-pairing-friendly-curves-03.
> > >> > >
> > >> > >
> > >> > >
> > >> > > This memo introduces pairing-friendly curves used for
> constructing pairing-based cryptography. It describes recommended
> parameters for each security level and recent implementations of
> pairing-friendly curves.
> > >> > >
> > >> > >
> > >> > >
> > >> > >
> > >> > >
> > >> > > Can we have any volunteers, please?..
> > >> > >
> > >> > >
> > >> > >
> > >> > >
> > >> > >
> > >> > > Best regards,
> > >> > >
> > >> > > Stanislav (on behalf of chairs)
> > >> > >
> > >> > > _______________________________________________
> > >> > > Crypto-panel mailing list
> > >> > > Crypto-panel@irtf.org
> > >> > > https://www.irtf.org/mailman/listinfo/crypto-panel
> > >> >
> > >> >
> > >> >
> > >> > --
> > >> > Yumi Sakemi, Ph. D.
> > >> > Lepidum Co. Ltd.
> > >> > E-Mail: yumi.sakemi@lepidum.co.jp
> > >>
> > >>
> > >>
> > >> --
> > >> Yumi Sakemi, Ph. D.
> > >> Lepidum Co. Ltd.
> > >>
> > >> E-Mail: yumi.sakemi@lepidum.co.jp
> >
> >
> >
> > --
> > Yumi Sakemi
> > Lepidum Co. Ltd.
> >
> > E-Mail: yumi.sakemi@lepidum.co.jp
>
>
>
> --
> Yumi Sakemi, Ph. D.
> Lepidum Co. Ltd.
>
> E-Mail: yumi.sakemi@lepidum.co.jp
>

--000000000000ad5e4d05a821ebe3
Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

<div dir=3D"ltr"><div>Dear Yumi, dear all,</div><div><br></div><div>thank y=
ou for carefully taking my comments into consideration. I am much happier w=
ith the draft now! There are a few typos left, see below, and I just had a =
couple of comments on the security discussion but these are easily fixed. I=
f you fix these small things in my opinion it&#39;s ready for RG Last Call.=
</div><div><br></div><div><br><br>Abstract:<br>Pairing is a special map -&g=
t; Pairings are special maps OR A pairing is a special map<br><br>1.1<br>&#=
39;Pairing is a special map&#39; -&gt; &#39;Pairings are special maps OR A =
pairing is a special map&#39;<br>&#39;importance of pairing&#39; -&gt; &#39=
;importance of pairings&#39;<br>&#39;pairing is efficiently computable&#39;=
 -&gt; &#39;pairings are efficiently computable&#39;. <br><br>1.2<br>pairin=
s -&gt; pairings<br><br>1.3<br>(NSF) -&gt; (NFS)<br>Barbulescu et. al. -&gt=
; Barbulescu and Duquesne. (Authors are alphabetical).<br><br>2.2<br>-&#39;=
The optimal Ate pairing is considered to be the most efficient to compute i=
s the one that is most commonly used for practical implementation.&#39; -&g=
t; &#39;The optimal Ate pairing is considered to be the most efficient to c=
ompute and is the one that is most commonly used for practical implementati=
on.&#39;<br>-Choose G_2 or G2 (probably G_2 is easier since there are many =
instances also of G_1 and G_T)<br>-&#39;There also exists cyclic subgroup&#=
39; -&gt; &#39;There also exists a cyclic subgroup&#39;<br><br>2.3<br>-&#39=
;b is an element of multiplicative group of order p&#39; -&gt; &#39;b is a =
nonzero element of F_p&#39; OR &#39;b is an element of a multiplicative gro=
up (F_p)^* of order p-1&#39; OR &#39;b is an element of the multiplicative =
group of F_p&#39;<br>-&#39;embedded degree&#39; -&gt; &#39;embeddiing degre=
e&#39;<br><br>2.4<br>-&#39;r-torsions&#39; -&gt; &#39;r-torsion&#39;<br><br=
>2.5<br>-(paragraph 2): of degree d&#39; -&gt; of degree d <br><br>4.2<br>-=
This sentence has slightly weird grammar so I don&#39;t fully understand wh=
at you want to say: &#39;Therefore, the curve of the 128-bit security level=
<br>=C2=A0 =C2=A0is often used at current, so this memo recommends both BLS=
12-381 and<br>=C2=A0 =C2=A0BN462 in consideration of the future use and the=
 safety side.&#39;<br>Do you mean:<br>&#39;As curves of 128-bit security le=
vel are currently the most widely used, we recommend both BLS12-381 and BN4=
62 in this memo in order to have a more efficient and a more prudent option=
 respectively.&#39;<br><br>4.2.1<br>-This comment is maybe a bit misleading=
:<br>&#39;We have to note that, according to [BD18], the bit length of p fo=
r<br>=C2=A0 =C2=A0BLS12 to achieve 128-bit security is calculated as 461 bi=
ts and more,<br>=C2=A0 =C2=A0which BLS12_381 does not satisfy.&#39;<br>The =
461-bit figure in [BD18] is based on a rough estimate which varies a lot be=
tween different examples (as is necessary when giving a broad overview). Th=
e exact complexity of [BD18]&#39;s attack depends on the specific polynomia=
l used to construct the family and can change the complexity of the attack =
by up to about 12 bits. The proposed construction of BLS12_381 you refer to=
 here has been specially chosen to minimize the impact of the exTNFS attack=
. It would in my opinion be more precise to say:<br></div><div>&#39;We have=
 to note that the security level of this pairing is expected to be 126 rath=
er than 128 bits [GMT19]&#39;.<br><br>4.2.2<br>-This comment could be more =
clearly worded:<br>&#39;We have to note that the BN462 becomes slower compa=
red to BLS12_381,<br>=C2=A0 =C2=A0although the BN462 is suitable for the pa=
rameters of the 128-bit<br>=C2=A0 =C2=A0security level for the use of the f=
uture internet.&#39;<br>How about instead:<br>&#39;We have to note that BN4=
62 is significantly slower than BLS12_381,<br>=C2=A0 =C2=A0but has 134-bit =
security level [GMT19], <br>=C2=A0 =C2=A0so may be more resistant to future=
 small improvements to the exTNFS attack.&#39;<br><br>This would be a good =
place to also add a remark along the lines of:<br>&#39;We note also that CP=
8_544 is more efficient than BN462, has 131-bit security level,<br>and that=
 due to its construction will not be affected by future small improvements =
to the exTNFS attack. However, as this curve is not widely used (it is only=
 implemented in one library), we instead chose BN462 for our &#39;safe&#39;=
 option.&#39;<br><br>5.<br>-&#39;BLS curves of embedding degree 12 require&=
#39; -&gt; &#39;BLS curves of embedding degree typically require&#39; (cf. =
my comment on 4.2.1)</div><div><br></div><div>All the best,</div><div>Chloe=
<br></div><div><br></div></div><br><div class=3D"gmail_quote"><div dir=3D"l=
tr" class=3D"gmail_attr">On Wed, 10 Jun 2020 at 05:06, Yumi Sakemi &lt;<a h=
ref=3D"mailto:yumi.sakemi@lepidum.co.jp">yumi.sakemi@lepidum.co.jp</a>&gt; =
wrote:<br></div><blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin:0px 0px 0=
px 0.8ex;border-left:1px solid rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex">Dear Alex=
ey, Nick, Stanislav, and Chloe<br>
<br>
We have submitted the latest version 05 of the draft &quot;Pairing-Friendly=
 Curves&quot;.<br>
<a href=3D"https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-irtf-cfrg-pairing-friendl=
y-curves/" rel=3D"noreferrer" target=3D"_blank">https://datatracker.ietf.or=
g/doc/draft-irtf-cfrg-pairing-friendly-curves/</a><br>
<br>
We have categorized a lot of comments received in the Expert Review<br>
into more than 40 issues, and reflected the results which we<br>
considered all of issues to the latest version.<br>
While we revised the draft, we received comments from other CFRG<br>
members and the authors of the draft &quot;BLS Signatures&quot;, and reflec=
ted<br>
them to the latest version.<br>
<br>
If you want to know the details of how to revise, you can check them<br>
by closed issues on the official CFRG GitHub page.<br>
<br>
<a href=3D"https://github.com/cfrg/draft-irtf-cfrg-pairing-friendly-curves/=
issues?q=3Dis%3Aissue+is%3Aclosed" rel=3D"noreferrer" target=3D"_blank">htt=
ps://github.com/cfrg/draft-irtf-cfrg-pairing-friendly-curves/issues?q=3Dis%=
3Aissue+is%3Aclosed</a><br>
<br>
Thanks to valuable and constructive comments from Chloe and CFRG<br>
members, our draft became readable and higher quality.<br>
We strongly believe that the draft is ready for RG Last Call.<br>
If there are other necessary procedures for RGLC, could you tell us?<br>
<br>
Best regards,<br>
Yumi<br>
<br>
2020=E5=B9=B46=E6=9C=889=E6=97=A5(=E7=81=AB) 20:02 Yumi Sakemi &lt;<a href=
=3D"mailto:yumi.sakemi@lepidum.co.jp" target=3D"_blank">yumi.sakemi@lepidum=
.co.jp</a>&gt;:<br>
&gt;<br>
&gt; Dear Chloe<br>
&gt;<br>
&gt; Thank you for your e-mail.<br>
&gt;<br>
&gt; We are very glad to reach a rough consensus with you.<br>
&gt; We believe that our draft became very readable and higher quality by<b=
r>
&gt; reflecting your comments.<br>
&gt; We appreciate your valuable and constructive comments.<br>
&gt;<br>
&gt; We&#39;d like to express our gratitude and include your name in Acknow=
ledgement.<br>
&gt; The version 05 that is reflected your comments will be submitted today=
<br>
&gt; or tomorrow, then we will contact you again.<br>
&gt;<br>
&gt; Best regards,<br>
&gt; Yumi<br>
&gt;<br>
&gt; 2020=E5=B9=B46=E6=9C=881=E6=97=A5(=E6=9C=88) 18:53 Chloe Martindale &l=
t;<a href=3D"mailto:chloemartindale@gmail.com" target=3D"_blank">chloemarti=
ndale@gmail.com</a>&gt;:<br>
&gt; &gt;<br>
&gt; &gt; Dear Yumi, dear all,<br>
&gt; &gt;<br>
&gt; &gt; thank you for the update and for involving me in your thought pro=
cess regarding the curve choices. I understand and agree with your reasonin=
g (and approach) regarding including both BLS12-381 and BN462, however I th=
ink I would make a different &#39;safer choice&#39;.<br>
&gt; &gt;<br>
&gt; &gt; My reason is this: if the attack is improved further (which you a=
re completely right, it may), it is very likely to have a bigger impact on =
curves constructed via polynomial methods with embedding degree 8 (such as =
BN462) than on any other curves for this security level, so it&#39;s not un=
likely that the security of BN462 would be pushed below 128 bits. A safer c=
hoice in my view would be to take the Cocks-Pinch curve (not constructed us=
ing polynomial methods) defined using a 544-bit prime implemented in RELIC,=
 from [GMT19]*. The TNFS attacks cannot be applied to Cocks-Pinch curves (a=
t least not without a fundamental new attack idea, since they rely on the p=
olynomial construction), so small improvements will not decrease the securi=
ty level at all, and this curve is actually still more efficient than BN462=
 so there&#39;s nothing to lose there. I appreciate that such a choice woul=
d mean also including some background on Cocks-Pinch and a reference/short =
explanation of the fact that TNFS attacks don&#39;t apply to these, which w=
ould be a major change to the original document, so I appreciate it if you&=
#39;d rather not do this, but just thought I&#39;d suggest it as I think it=
 would increase the lifetime of your document.<br>
&gt; &gt;<br>
&gt; &gt; *In your draft this is [GME19], but it should be [GMT19], and can=
 now be updated to the peer-reviewed version of course (this is the paper I=
 pointed out in my review).<br>
&gt; &gt;<br>
&gt; &gt; All the best,<br>
&gt; &gt; Chloe<br>
&gt; &gt;<br>
&gt; &gt; On Fri, 29 May 2020 at 16:21, Yumi Sakemi &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:y=
umi.sakemi@lepidum.co.jp" target=3D"_blank">yumi.sakemi@lepidum.co.jp</a>&g=
t; wrote:<br>
&gt; &gt;&gt;<br>
&gt; &gt;&gt; Dear Chloe<br>
&gt; &gt;&gt;<br>
&gt; &gt;&gt; We appreciate a lot of constructive comments received at Expe=
rt Review.<br>
&gt; &gt;&gt;<br>
&gt; &gt;&gt; We are currently working on updating our draft.<br>
&gt; &gt;&gt; Last week, Nick created a repository for pairing-friendly cur=
ves on<br>
&gt; &gt;&gt; CFRG&#39;s official GitHub, so we plan to update our draft us=
ing the issue<br>
&gt; &gt;&gt; tracker.<br>
&gt; &gt;&gt; The updating for your comments will be made available to you =
on the<br>
&gt; &gt;&gt; following issue page.<br>
&gt; &gt;&gt;<br>
&gt; &gt;&gt; <a href=3D"https://github.com/cfrg/draft-irtf-cfrg-pairing-fr=
iendly-curves/issues" rel=3D"noreferrer" target=3D"_blank">https://github.c=
om/cfrg/draft-irtf-cfrg-pairing-friendly-curves/issues</a><br>
&gt; &gt;&gt;<br>
&gt; &gt;&gt; We will contact you again when all the comments have been upd=
ated.<br>
&gt; &gt;&gt; In that case, we would be glad if you could check them.<br>
&gt; &gt;&gt;<br>
&gt; &gt;&gt; In addition, before updating, there is a comment that we woul=
d like to<br>
&gt; &gt;&gt; inform you about the policy of update.<br>
&gt; &gt;&gt; The comment is about the recommended curve for 128-bit securi=
ty level.<br>
&gt; &gt;&gt;<br>
&gt; &gt;&gt; First of all, thank you for teaching us a peer-reviewed paper=
 for BLS12-381.<br>
&gt; &gt;&gt; The comment is about the recommended curve for 128-bit securi=
ty level.<br>
&gt; &gt;&gt; Due to our lack of investigation, we made the wrong decision =
that<br>
&gt; &gt;&gt; BLS12-381 was not matched in our selection policy.<br>
&gt; &gt;&gt;<br>
&gt; &gt;&gt; Your comment pointed out that BLS12-381 is moved to the recom=
mended<br>
&gt; &gt;&gt; curve and BN462 is moved to the Appendix.<br>
&gt; &gt;&gt; We understood the disadvantages of BN462 that you were concer=
ned<br>
&gt; &gt;&gt; about, but we would like to recommend both BLS12-381 and BN46=
2.<br>
&gt; &gt;&gt; The reason is as follows.<br>
&gt; &gt;&gt;<br>
&gt; &gt;&gt; CFRG aims to standardize cryptographic technology for future =
Internet use.<br>
&gt; &gt;&gt; We agree that BLS12-381 with a 126-bit security level is the =
best<br>
&gt; &gt;&gt; match as a curve of 128-bit security level &quot;at this time=
&quot; from the<br>
&gt; &gt;&gt; viewpoint of security and efficiency.<br>
&gt; &gt;&gt; On the other hand, the security of BLS12-381 is already less =
than<br>
&gt; &gt;&gt; 128bit, so from the viewpoint of future use, if the attack is=
 improved<br>
&gt; &gt;&gt; even a little, it will not be suitable for a curve of 128-bit=
 security<br>
&gt; &gt;&gt; level.<br>
&gt; &gt;&gt; Considering that the curve of 128-bit security level is often=
 used at current.<br>
&gt; &gt;&gt; So, we would like to recommend both BLS12-381 and BN462 consi=
dering<br>
&gt; &gt;&gt; the future use and the safety side.<br>
&gt; &gt;&gt;<br>
&gt; &gt;&gt; However, as you pointed out, BN462 has the disadvantage of be=
ing too<br>
&gt; &gt;&gt; slow compared to BLS12-381.<br>
&gt; &gt;&gt; Then, the reader will be confused if there are two parameters=
 of<br>
&gt; &gt;&gt; 128-bit security level, so we will add the basis for selectio=
n by<br>
&gt; &gt;&gt; adding the explanation of merits and demerits for each parame=
ter.<br>
&gt; &gt;&gt; And, we will also add a description about the disadvantages o=
f BN462<br>
&gt; &gt;&gt; regarding efficiency.<br>
&gt; &gt;&gt;<br>
&gt; &gt;&gt; If you have any problems with the updating policy, we would l=
ike you to comment.<br>
&gt; &gt;&gt;<br>
&gt; &gt;&gt; Best regards,<br>
&gt; &gt;&gt; Yumi<br>
&gt; &gt;&gt;<br>
&gt; &gt;&gt;<br>
&gt; &gt;&gt;<br>
&gt; &gt;&gt;<br>
&gt; &gt;&gt;<br>
&gt; &gt;&gt;<br>
&gt; &gt;&gt; 2020=E5=B9=B44=E6=9C=8827=E6=97=A5(=E6=9C=88) 21:58 Yumi Sake=
mi &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:yumi.sakemi@lepidum.co.jp" target=3D"_blank">yumi.=
sakemi@lepidum.co.jp</a>&gt;:<br>
&gt; &gt;&gt; &gt;<br>
&gt; &gt;&gt; &gt; Dear Chloe<br>
&gt; &gt;&gt; &gt;<br>
&gt; &gt;&gt; &gt; I appreciate your review.<br>
&gt; &gt;&gt; &gt; I&#39;m very glad to receive many constructive comments!=
<br>
&gt; &gt;&gt; &gt; I will discuss about your comments with co-authors and r=
evise our<br>
&gt; &gt;&gt; &gt; draft to reflect your comments in our draft.<br>
&gt; &gt;&gt; &gt; I think it will be a better draft by reflecting your com=
ments.<br>
&gt; &gt;&gt; &gt;<br>
&gt; &gt;&gt; &gt; As co-author Tsunekazu e-mailed, we&#39;re=C2=A0 plannin=
g to submit version 04,<br>
&gt; &gt;&gt; &gt; because we were independently working on updating of abs=
tract,<br>
&gt; &gt;&gt; &gt; introduction (sec. 1.3) and proofreading of English in p=
arallel with<br>
&gt; &gt;&gt; &gt; the expert review.<br>
&gt; &gt;&gt; &gt; (Version 04 will not be reflected your comments.)<br>
&gt; &gt;&gt; &gt;<br>
&gt; &gt;&gt; &gt; Comments from Chloe will be reflected in the version 05.=
<br>
&gt; &gt;&gt; &gt; We will submit version 05 in mid-May and we will report =
you when we<br>
&gt; &gt;&gt; &gt; submit version 05.<br>
&gt; &gt;&gt; &gt;<br>
&gt; &gt;&gt; &gt; Dear Stanislav<br>
&gt; &gt;&gt; &gt;<br>
&gt; &gt;&gt; &gt; Thank you very much for proceeding to the Expert review.=
<br>
&gt; &gt;&gt; &gt; We received a lot of constructive comments from Chloe, s=
o I think it<br>
&gt; &gt;&gt; &gt; is difficult to manage comments by email.<br>
&gt; &gt;&gt; &gt; (Because there are over 100 comments from Chloe.)<br>
&gt; &gt;&gt; &gt;<br>
&gt; &gt;&gt; &gt; Therefore, I would like to use the issue management func=
tion of GitHub<br>
&gt; &gt;&gt; &gt; so that it is easy to check the reflecting status of Chl=
oe&#39;s comments.<br>
&gt; &gt;&gt; &gt; So, I&#39;d like to use the repository of pairing-friend=
ly curves draft on<br>
&gt; &gt;&gt; &gt; CFRG&#39;s GitHub<br>
&gt; &gt;&gt; &gt; because BLS signature which is similar in terms of IRTF =
stream is also<br>
&gt; &gt;&gt; &gt; registered on the GitHub.<br>
&gt; &gt;&gt; &gt; Could you register the repository for the draft of pairi=
ng-friendly<br>
&gt; &gt;&gt; &gt; curves on the following CFRG&#39;s GitHub?<br>
&gt; &gt;&gt; &gt;<br>
&gt; &gt;&gt; &gt; <a href=3D"https://github.com/cfrg" rel=3D"noreferrer" t=
arget=3D"_blank">https://github.com/cfrg</a><br>
&gt; &gt;&gt; &gt;<br>
&gt; &gt;&gt; &gt; Best regards,<br>
&gt; &gt;&gt; &gt; Yumi<br>
&gt; &gt;&gt; &gt;<br>
&gt; &gt;&gt; &gt; 2020=E5=B9=B44=E6=9C=8827=E6=97=A5(=E6=9C=88) 10:09 SAIT=
O Tsunekazu &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:tsunekazu.saito.hg@hco.ntt.co.jp" target=
=3D"_blank">tsunekazu.saito.hg@hco.ntt.co.jp</a>&gt;:<br>
&gt; &gt;&gt; &gt; &gt;<br>
&gt; &gt;&gt; &gt; &gt; Dear Chloe, Stanislav,<br>
&gt; &gt;&gt; &gt; &gt;<br>
&gt; &gt;&gt; &gt; &gt;<br>
&gt; &gt;&gt; &gt; &gt;<br>
&gt; &gt;&gt; &gt; &gt; This is Tsunekazu.<br>
&gt; &gt;&gt; &gt; &gt;<br>
&gt; &gt;&gt; &gt; &gt;<br>
&gt; &gt;&gt; &gt; &gt;<br>
&gt; &gt;&gt; &gt; &gt; We plan to update the draft to version 04 soon.<br>
&gt; &gt;&gt; &gt; &gt;<br>
&gt; &gt;&gt; &gt; &gt; As the contents of the update, we changed the wordi=
ng of Section 1.3 and security consideration.<br>
&gt; &gt;&gt; &gt; &gt;<br>
&gt; &gt;&gt; &gt; &gt; Yumi will submit the 4th edition, so please wait a =
moment.<br>
&gt; &gt;&gt; &gt; &gt;<br>
&gt; &gt;&gt; &gt; &gt;<br>
&gt; &gt;&gt; &gt; &gt;<br>
&gt; &gt;&gt; &gt; &gt; Best regards,<br>
&gt; &gt;&gt; &gt; &gt;<br>
&gt; &gt;&gt; &gt; &gt; Tsunekazu<br>
&gt; &gt;&gt; &gt; &gt;<br>
&gt; &gt;&gt; &gt; &gt;<br>
&gt; &gt;&gt; &gt; &gt;<br>
&gt; &gt;&gt; &gt; &gt; From: Stanislav V. Smyshlyaev &lt;<a href=3D"mailto=
:smyshsv@gmail.com" target=3D"_blank">smyshsv@gmail.com</a>&gt;<br>
&gt; &gt;&gt; &gt; &gt; Sent: Sunday, April 26, 2020 2:30 PM<br>
&gt; &gt;&gt; &gt; &gt; To: Chloe Martindale &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:chloemar=
tindale@gmail.com" target=3D"_blank">chloemartindale@gmail.com</a>&gt;; SAI=
TO Tsunekazu &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:tsunekazu.saito.hg@hco.ntt.co.jp" target=
=3D"_blank">tsunekazu.saito.hg@hco.ntt.co.jp</a>&gt;; Tetsutaro Kobayashi &=
lt;<a href=3D"mailto:tetsutaro.kobayashi.dr@hco.ntt.co.jp" target=3D"_blank=
">tetsutaro.kobayashi.dr@hco.ntt.co.jp</a>&gt;; Yumi Sakemi &lt;<a href=3D"=
mailto:yumi.sakemi@lepidum.co.jp" target=3D"_blank">yumi.sakemi@lepidum.co.=
jp</a>&gt;<br>
&gt; &gt;&gt; &gt; &gt; Cc: <a href=3D"mailto:cfrg-chairs@ietf.org" target=
=3D"_blank">cfrg-chairs@ietf.org</a>; <a href=3D"mailto:crypto-panel@irtf.o=
rg" target=3D"_blank">crypto-panel@irtf.org</a><br>
&gt; &gt;&gt; &gt; &gt; Subject: Re: [Crypto-panel] Request for review: dra=
ft-irtf-cfrg-pairing-friendly-curves-03<br>
&gt; &gt;&gt; &gt; &gt;<br>
&gt; &gt;&gt; &gt; &gt;<br>
&gt; &gt;&gt; &gt; &gt;<br>
&gt; &gt;&gt; &gt; &gt; Dear Chloe,<br>
&gt; &gt;&gt; &gt; &gt;<br>
&gt; &gt;&gt; &gt; &gt; Many thanks for your review (such a great and a pro=
mpt one!).<br>
&gt; &gt;&gt; &gt; &gt;<br>
&gt; &gt;&gt; &gt; &gt;<br>
&gt; &gt;&gt; &gt; &gt;<br>
&gt; &gt;&gt; &gt; &gt; Dear Yumi, Saito, Tetsutaro, do you plan to update =
your draft taking into account Chloe=E2=80=99s review?<br>
&gt; &gt;&gt; &gt; &gt;<br>
&gt; &gt;&gt; &gt; &gt;<br>
&gt; &gt;&gt; &gt; &gt;<br>
&gt; &gt;&gt; &gt; &gt; Best regards,<br>
&gt; &gt;&gt; &gt; &gt;<br>
&gt; &gt;&gt; &gt; &gt; Stanislav<br>
&gt; &gt;&gt; &gt; &gt;<br>
&gt; &gt;&gt; &gt; &gt;<br>
&gt; &gt;&gt; &gt; &gt;<br>
&gt; &gt;&gt; &gt; &gt; =D0=BF=D1=82, 24 =D0=B0=D0=BF=D1=80. 2020 =D0=B3. =
=D0=B2 19:49, Chloe Martindale &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:chloemartindale@gmail.=
com" target=3D"_blank">chloemartindale@gmail.com</a>&gt;:<br>
&gt; &gt;&gt; &gt; &gt;<br>
&gt; &gt;&gt; &gt; &gt; Hi all,<br>
&gt; &gt;&gt; &gt; &gt;<br>
&gt; &gt;&gt; &gt; &gt;<br>
&gt; &gt;&gt; &gt; &gt;<br>
&gt; &gt;&gt; &gt; &gt; review is attached.<br>
&gt; &gt;&gt; &gt; &gt;<br>
&gt; &gt;&gt; &gt; &gt;<br>
&gt; &gt;&gt; &gt; &gt;<br>
&gt; &gt;&gt; &gt; &gt; All the best,<br>
&gt; &gt;&gt; &gt; &gt;<br>
&gt; &gt;&gt; &gt; &gt; Chloe<br>
&gt; &gt;&gt; &gt; &gt;<br>
&gt; &gt;&gt; &gt; &gt;<br>
&gt; &gt;&gt; &gt; &gt;<br>
&gt; &gt;&gt; &gt; &gt; On Tue, 21 Apr 2020 at 18:05, Stanislav V. Smyshlya=
ev &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:smyshsv@gmail.com" target=3D"_blank">smyshsv@gmail=
.com</a>&gt; wrote:<br>
&gt; &gt;&gt; &gt; &gt;<br>
&gt; &gt;&gt; &gt; &gt; Sure - it is<br>
&gt; &gt;&gt; &gt; &gt;<br>
&gt; &gt;&gt; &gt; &gt; <a href=3D"https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-irtf-c=
frg-pairing-friendly-curves-03" rel=3D"noreferrer" target=3D"_blank">https:=
//tools.ietf.org/html/draft-irtf-cfrg-pairing-friendly-curves-03</a><br>
&gt; &gt;&gt; &gt; &gt;<br>
&gt; &gt;&gt; &gt; &gt;<br>
&gt; &gt;&gt; &gt; &gt;<br>
&gt; &gt;&gt; &gt; &gt; Thank you again!<br>
&gt; &gt;&gt; &gt; &gt;<br>
&gt; &gt;&gt; &gt; &gt;<br>
&gt; &gt;&gt; &gt; &gt;<br>
&gt; &gt;&gt; &gt; &gt; Regards,<br>
&gt; &gt;&gt; &gt; &gt;<br>
&gt; &gt;&gt; &gt; &gt; Stanislav<br>
&gt; &gt;&gt; &gt; &gt;<br>
&gt; &gt;&gt; &gt; &gt;<br>
&gt; &gt;&gt; &gt; &gt;<br>
&gt; &gt;&gt; &gt; &gt; =D0=B2=D1=82, 21 =D0=B0=D0=BF=D1=80. 2020 =D0=B3. =
=D0=B2 19:10, Chloe Martindale &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:chloemartindale@gmail.=
com" target=3D"_blank">chloemartindale@gmail.com</a>&gt;:<br>
&gt; &gt;&gt; &gt; &gt;<br>
&gt; &gt;&gt; &gt; &gt; Just to be sure, can you point me towards the most =
recent version of the draft please?<br>
&gt; &gt;&gt; &gt; &gt;<br>
&gt; &gt;&gt; &gt; &gt;<br>
&gt; &gt;&gt; &gt; &gt;<br>
&gt; &gt;&gt; &gt; &gt; Thanks,<br>
&gt; &gt;&gt; &gt; &gt;<br>
&gt; &gt;&gt; &gt; &gt; Chloe<br>
&gt; &gt;&gt; &gt; &gt;<br>
&gt; &gt;&gt; &gt; &gt;<br>
&gt; &gt;&gt; &gt; &gt;<br>
&gt; &gt;&gt; &gt; &gt; On Tue, 21 Apr 2020 at 13:17, Stanislav V. Smyshlya=
ev &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:smyshsv@gmail.com" target=3D"_blank">smyshsv@gmail=
.com</a>&gt; wrote:<br>
&gt; &gt;&gt; &gt; &gt;<br>
&gt; &gt;&gt; &gt; &gt; Great, many thanks, Chloe!<br>
&gt; &gt;&gt; &gt; &gt;<br>
&gt; &gt;&gt; &gt; &gt;<br>
&gt; &gt;&gt; &gt; &gt;<br>
&gt; &gt;&gt; &gt; &gt; Kind regards,<br>
&gt; &gt;&gt; &gt; &gt;<br>
&gt; &gt;&gt; &gt; &gt; Nick, Alexey, Stanislav<br>
&gt; &gt;&gt; &gt; &gt;<br>
&gt; &gt;&gt; &gt; &gt;<br>
&gt; &gt;&gt; &gt; &gt;<br>
&gt; &gt;&gt; &gt; &gt; On Tue, 21 Apr 2020 at 15:16, Chloe Martindale &lt;=
<a href=3D"mailto:chloemartindale@gmail.com" target=3D"_blank">chloemartind=
ale@gmail.com</a>&gt; wrote:<br>
&gt; &gt;&gt; &gt; &gt;<br>
&gt; &gt;&gt; &gt; &gt; I&#39;ll take a look this week.<br>
&gt; &gt;&gt; &gt; &gt;<br>
&gt; &gt;&gt; &gt; &gt;<br>
&gt; &gt;&gt; &gt; &gt;<br>
&gt; &gt;&gt; &gt; &gt; All the best,<br>
&gt; &gt;&gt; &gt; &gt;<br>
&gt; &gt;&gt; &gt; &gt; Chloe<br>
&gt; &gt;&gt; &gt; &gt;<br>
&gt; &gt;&gt; &gt; &gt;<br>
&gt; &gt;&gt; &gt; &gt;<br>
&gt; &gt;&gt; &gt; &gt; On Tue, 21 Apr 2020, 13:10 Stanislav V. Smyshlyaev,=
 &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:smyshsv@gmail.com" target=3D"_blank">smyshsv@gmail.c=
om</a>&gt; wrote:<br>
&gt; &gt;&gt; &gt; &gt;<br>
&gt; &gt;&gt; &gt; &gt; Dear Crypto Panel members,<br>
&gt; &gt;&gt; &gt; &gt;<br>
&gt; &gt;&gt; &gt; &gt;<br>
&gt; &gt;&gt; &gt; &gt;<br>
&gt; &gt;&gt; &gt; &gt; The authors of the Pairing-Friendly Curves draft ha=
ve addressed the concerns raised during the discussion and are ready to mov=
e to the next stage with the draft.<br>
&gt; &gt;&gt; &gt; &gt;<br>
&gt; &gt;&gt; &gt; &gt;<br>
&gt; &gt;&gt; &gt; &gt;<br>
&gt; &gt;&gt; &gt; &gt; Alexey, Nick and I would like to ask Crypto Review =
Panel members about the review(s) of draft-irtf-cfrg-pairing-friendly-curve=
s-03.<br>
&gt; &gt;&gt; &gt; &gt;<br>
&gt; &gt;&gt; &gt; &gt;<br>
&gt; &gt;&gt; &gt; &gt;<br>
&gt; &gt;&gt; &gt; &gt; This memo introduces pairing-friendly curves used f=
or constructing pairing-based cryptography. It describes recommended parame=
ters for each security level and recent implementations of pairing-friendly=
 curves.<br>
&gt; &gt;&gt; &gt; &gt;<br>
&gt; &gt;&gt; &gt; &gt;<br>
&gt; &gt;&gt; &gt; &gt;<br>
&gt; &gt;&gt; &gt; &gt;<br>
&gt; &gt;&gt; &gt; &gt;<br>
&gt; &gt;&gt; &gt; &gt; Can we have any volunteers, please?..<br>
&gt; &gt;&gt; &gt; &gt;<br>
&gt; &gt;&gt; &gt; &gt;<br>
&gt; &gt;&gt; &gt; &gt;<br>
&gt; &gt;&gt; &gt; &gt;<br>
&gt; &gt;&gt; &gt; &gt;<br>
&gt; &gt;&gt; &gt; &gt; Best regards,<br>
&gt; &gt;&gt; &gt; &gt;<br>
&gt; &gt;&gt; &gt; &gt; Stanislav (on behalf of chairs)<br>
&gt; &gt;&gt; &gt; &gt;<br>
&gt; &gt;&gt; &gt; &gt; _______________________________________________<br>
&gt; &gt;&gt; &gt; &gt; Crypto-panel mailing list<br>
&gt; &gt;&gt; &gt; &gt; <a href=3D"mailto:Crypto-panel@irtf.org" target=3D"=
_blank">Crypto-panel@irtf.org</a><br>
&gt; &gt;&gt; &gt; &gt; <a href=3D"https://www.irtf.org/mailman/listinfo/cr=
ypto-panel" rel=3D"noreferrer" target=3D"_blank">https://www.irtf.org/mailm=
an/listinfo/crypto-panel</a><br>
&gt; &gt;&gt; &gt;<br>
&gt; &gt;&gt; &gt;<br>
&gt; &gt;&gt; &gt;<br>
&gt; &gt;&gt; &gt; --<br>
&gt; &gt;&gt; &gt; Yumi Sakemi, Ph. D.<br>
&gt; &gt;&gt; &gt; Lepidum Co. Ltd.<br>
&gt; &gt;&gt; &gt; E-Mail: <a href=3D"mailto:yumi.sakemi@lepidum.co.jp" tar=
get=3D"_blank">yumi.sakemi@lepidum.co.jp</a><br>
&gt; &gt;&gt;<br>
&gt; &gt;&gt;<br>
&gt; &gt;&gt;<br>
&gt; &gt;&gt; --<br>
&gt; &gt;&gt; Yumi Sakemi, Ph. D.<br>
&gt; &gt;&gt; Lepidum Co. Ltd.<br>
&gt; &gt;&gt;<br>
&gt; &gt;&gt; E-Mail: <a href=3D"mailto:yumi.sakemi@lepidum.co.jp" target=
=3D"_blank">yumi.sakemi@lepidum.co.jp</a><br>
&gt;<br>
&gt;<br>
&gt;<br>
&gt; --<br>
&gt; Yumi Sakemi<br>
&gt; Lepidum Co. Ltd.<br>
&gt;<br>
&gt; E-Mail: <a href=3D"mailto:yumi.sakemi@lepidum.co.jp" target=3D"_blank"=
>yumi.sakemi@lepidum.co.jp</a><br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
-- <br>
Yumi Sakemi, Ph. D.<br>
Lepidum Co. Ltd.<br>
<br>
E-Mail: <a href=3D"mailto:yumi.sakemi@lepidum.co.jp" target=3D"_blank">yumi=
.sakemi@lepidum.co.jp</a><br>
</blockquote></div>

--000000000000ad5e4d05a821ebe3--


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From: Yumi Sakemi <yumi.sakemi@lepidum.co.jp>
Date: Tue, 16 Jun 2020 16:09:30 +0900
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To: Chloe Martindale <chloemartindale@gmail.com>
Cc: crypto-panel@irtf.org, cfrg-chairs@ietf.org,  Tetsutaro Kobayashi <tetsutaro.kobayashi.dr@hco.ntt.co.jp>,  SAITO Tsunekazu <tsunekazu.saito.hg@hco.ntt.co.jp>
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Subject: Re: [Crypto-panel] Request for review: draft-irtf-cfrg-pairing-friendly-curves-03
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Dear Chloe, Alexey, Nick, and Stanislav

We are very grateful to you for your useful comments.
We submitted the version 06 of the draft "Pairing-Friendly Curves".

We have categorized your comments into 7 issues and reflected the
content of all issues in the version 06.
These correspond to issues #49 to #55.
You can check how to modify on the following GitHub page.

https://github.com/cfrg/draft-irtf-cfrg-pairing-friendly-curves/issues?q=3D=
is%3Aissue+is%3Aclosed


Dear CFRG chairs

We believe that we were able to complete the remaining issues up to RG
Last Call, which we received from Chloe.
Could you please consider starting RG Last Call?

Best regards,
Yumi

2020=E5=B9=B46=E6=9C=8816=E6=97=A5(=E7=81=AB) 1:28 Chloe Martindale <chloem=
artindale@gmail.com>:
>
> Dear Yumi, dear all,
>
> thank you for carefully taking my comments into consideration. I am much =
happier with the draft now! There are a few typos left, see below, and I ju=
st had a couple of comments on the security discussion but these are easily=
 fixed. If you fix these small things in my opinion it's ready for RG Last =
Call.
>
>
>
> Abstract:
> Pairing is a special map -> Pairings are special maps OR A pairing is a s=
pecial map
>
> 1.1
> 'Pairing is a special map' -> 'Pairings are special maps OR A pairing is =
a special map'
> 'importance of pairing' -> 'importance of pairings'
> 'pairing is efficiently computable' -> 'pairings are efficiently computab=
le'.
>
> 1.2
> pairins -> pairings
>
> 1.3
> (NSF) -> (NFS)
> Barbulescu et. al. -> Barbulescu and Duquesne. (Authors are alphabetical)=
.
>
> 2.2
> -'The optimal Ate pairing is considered to be the most efficient to compu=
te is the one that is most commonly used for practical implementation.' -> =
'The optimal Ate pairing is considered to be the most efficient to compute =
and is the one that is most commonly used for practical implementation.'
> -Choose G_2 or G2 (probably G_2 is easier since there are many instances =
also of G_1 and G_T)
> -'There also exists cyclic subgroup' -> 'There also exists a cyclic subgr=
oup'
>
> 2.3
> -'b is an element of multiplicative group of order p' -> 'b is a nonzero =
element of F_p' OR 'b is an element of a multiplicative group (F_p)^* of or=
der p-1' OR 'b is an element of the multiplicative group of F_p'
> -'embedded degree' -> 'embeddiing degree'
>
> 2.4
> -'r-torsions' -> 'r-torsion'
>
> 2.5
> -(paragraph 2): of degree d' -> of degree d
>
> 4.2
> -This sentence has slightly weird grammar so I don't fully understand wha=
t you want to say: 'Therefore, the curve of the 128-bit security level
>    is often used at current, so this memo recommends both BLS12-381 and
>    BN462 in consideration of the future use and the safety side.'
> Do you mean:
> 'As curves of 128-bit security level are currently the most widely used, =
we recommend both BLS12-381 and BN462 in this memo in order to have a more =
efficient and a more prudent option respectively.'
>
> 4.2.1
> -This comment is maybe a bit misleading:
> 'We have to note that, according to [BD18], the bit length of p for
>    BLS12 to achieve 128-bit security is calculated as 461 bits and more,
>    which BLS12_381 does not satisfy.'
> The 461-bit figure in [BD18] is based on a rough estimate which varies a =
lot between different examples (as is necessary when giving a broad overvie=
w). The exact complexity of [BD18]'s attack depends on the specific polynom=
ial used to construct the family and can change the complexity of the attac=
k by up to about 12 bits. The proposed construction of BLS12_381 you refer =
to here has been specially chosen to minimize the impact of the exTNFS atta=
ck. It would in my opinion be more precise to say:
> 'We have to note that the security level of this pairing is expected to b=
e 126 rather than 128 bits [GMT19]'.
>
> 4.2.2
> -This comment could be more clearly worded:
> 'We have to note that the BN462 becomes slower compared to BLS12_381,
>    although the BN462 is suitable for the parameters of the 128-bit
>    security level for the use of the future internet.'
> How about instead:
> 'We have to note that BN462 is significantly slower than BLS12_381,
>    but has 134-bit security level [GMT19],
>    so may be more resistant to future small improvements to the exTNFS at=
tack.'
>
> This would be a good place to also add a remark along the lines of:
> 'We note also that CP8_544 is more efficient than BN462, has 131-bit secu=
rity level,
> and that due to its construction will not be affected by future small imp=
rovements to the exTNFS attack. However, as this curve is not widely used (=
it is only implemented in one library), we instead chose BN462 for our 'saf=
e' option.'
>
> 5.
> -'BLS curves of embedding degree 12 require' -> 'BLS curves of embedding =
degree typically require' (cf. my comment on 4.2.1)
>
> All the best,
> Chloe
>
>
> On Wed, 10 Jun 2020 at 05:06, Yumi Sakemi <yumi.sakemi@lepidum.co.jp> wro=
te:
>>
>> Dear Alexey, Nick, Stanislav, and Chloe
>>
>> We have submitted the latest version 05 of the draft "Pairing-Friendly C=
urves".
>> https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-irtf-cfrg-pairing-friendly-curves=
/
>>
>> We have categorized a lot of comments received in the Expert Review
>> into more than 40 issues, and reflected the results which we
>> considered all of issues to the latest version.
>> While we revised the draft, we received comments from other CFRG
>> members and the authors of the draft "BLS Signatures", and reflected
>> them to the latest version.
>>
>> If you want to know the details of how to revise, you can check them
>> by closed issues on the official CFRG GitHub page.
>>
>> https://github.com/cfrg/draft-irtf-cfrg-pairing-friendly-curves/issues?q=
=3Dis%3Aissue+is%3Aclosed
>>
>> Thanks to valuable and constructive comments from Chloe and CFRG
>> members, our draft became readable and higher quality.
>> We strongly believe that the draft is ready for RG Last Call.
>> If there are other necessary procedures for RGLC, could you tell us?
>>
>> Best regards,
>> Yumi
>>
>> 2020=E5=B9=B46=E6=9C=889=E6=97=A5(=E7=81=AB) 20:02 Yumi Sakemi <yumi.sak=
emi@lepidum.co.jp>:
>> >
>> > Dear Chloe
>> >
>> > Thank you for your e-mail.
>> >
>> > We are very glad to reach a rough consensus with you.
>> > We believe that our draft became very readable and higher quality by
>> > reflecting your comments.
>> > We appreciate your valuable and constructive comments.
>> >
>> > We'd like to express our gratitude and include your name in Acknowledg=
ement.
>> > The version 05 that is reflected your comments will be submitted today
>> > or tomorrow, then we will contact you again.
>> >
>> > Best regards,
>> > Yumi
>> >
>> > 2020=E5=B9=B46=E6=9C=881=E6=97=A5(=E6=9C=88) 18:53 Chloe Martindale <c=
hloemartindale@gmail.com>:
>> > >
>> > > Dear Yumi, dear all,
>> > >
>> > > thank you for the update and for involving me in your thought proces=
s regarding the curve choices. I understand and agree with your reasoning (=
and approach) regarding including both BLS12-381 and BN462, however I think=
 I would make a different 'safer choice'.
>> > >
>> > > My reason is this: if the attack is improved further (which you are =
completely right, it may), it is very likely to have a bigger impact on cur=
ves constructed via polynomial methods with embedding degree 8 (such as BN4=
62) than on any other curves for this security level, so it's not unlikely =
that the security of BN462 would be pushed below 128 bits. A safer choice i=
n my view would be to take the Cocks-Pinch curve (not constructed using pol=
ynomial methods) defined using a 544-bit prime implemented in RELIC, from [=
GMT19]*. The TNFS attacks cannot be applied to Cocks-Pinch curves (at least=
 not without a fundamental new attack idea, since they rely on the polynomi=
al construction), so small improvements will not decrease the security leve=
l at all, and this curve is actually still more efficient than BN462 so the=
re's nothing to lose there. I appreciate that such a choice would mean also=
 including some background on Cocks-Pinch and a reference/short explanation=
 of the fact that TNFS attacks don't apply to these, which would be a major=
 change to the original document, so I appreciate it if you'd rather not do=
 this, but just thought I'd suggest it as I think it would increase the lif=
etime of your document.
>> > >
>> > > *In your draft this is [GME19], but it should be [GMT19], and can no=
w be updated to the peer-reviewed version of course (this is the paper I po=
inted out in my review).
>> > >
>> > > All the best,
>> > > Chloe
>> > >
>> > > On Fri, 29 May 2020 at 16:21, Yumi Sakemi <yumi.sakemi@lepidum.co.jp=
> wrote:
>> > >>
>> > >> Dear Chloe
>> > >>
>> > >> We appreciate a lot of constructive comments received at Expert Rev=
iew.
>> > >>
>> > >> We are currently working on updating our draft.
>> > >> Last week, Nick created a repository for pairing-friendly curves on
>> > >> CFRG's official GitHub, so we plan to update our draft using the is=
sue
>> > >> tracker.
>> > >> The updating for your comments will be made available to you on the
>> > >> following issue page.
>> > >>
>> > >> https://github.com/cfrg/draft-irtf-cfrg-pairing-friendly-curves/iss=
ues
>> > >>
>> > >> We will contact you again when all the comments have been updated.
>> > >> In that case, we would be glad if you could check them.
>> > >>
>> > >> In addition, before updating, there is a comment that we would like=
 to
>> > >> inform you about the policy of update.
>> > >> The comment is about the recommended curve for 128-bit security lev=
el.
>> > >>
>> > >> First of all, thank you for teaching us a peer-reviewed paper for B=
LS12-381.
>> > >> The comment is about the recommended curve for 128-bit security lev=
el.
>> > >> Due to our lack of investigation, we made the wrong decision that
>> > >> BLS12-381 was not matched in our selection policy.
>> > >>
>> > >> Your comment pointed out that BLS12-381 is moved to the recommended
>> > >> curve and BN462 is moved to the Appendix.
>> > >> We understood the disadvantages of BN462 that you were concerned
>> > >> about, but we would like to recommend both BLS12-381 and BN462.
>> > >> The reason is as follows.
>> > >>
>> > >> CFRG aims to standardize cryptographic technology for future Intern=
et use.
>> > >> We agree that BLS12-381 with a 126-bit security level is the best
>> > >> match as a curve of 128-bit security level "at this time" from the
>> > >> viewpoint of security and efficiency.
>> > >> On the other hand, the security of BLS12-381 is already less than
>> > >> 128bit, so from the viewpoint of future use, if the attack is impro=
ved
>> > >> even a little, it will not be suitable for a curve of 128-bit secur=
ity
>> > >> level.
>> > >> Considering that the curve of 128-bit security level is often used =
at current.
>> > >> So, we would like to recommend both BLS12-381 and BN462 considering
>> > >> the future use and the safety side.
>> > >>
>> > >> However, as you pointed out, BN462 has the disadvantage of being to=
o
>> > >> slow compared to BLS12-381.
>> > >> Then, the reader will be confused if there are two parameters of
>> > >> 128-bit security level, so we will add the basis for selection by
>> > >> adding the explanation of merits and demerits for each parameter.
>> > >> And, we will also add a description about the disadvantages of BN46=
2
>> > >> regarding efficiency.
>> > >>
>> > >> If you have any problems with the updating policy, we would like yo=
u to comment.
>> > >>
>> > >> Best regards,
>> > >> Yumi
>> > >>
>> > >>
>> > >>
>> > >>
>> > >>
>> > >>
>> > >> 2020=E5=B9=B44=E6=9C=8827=E6=97=A5(=E6=9C=88) 21:58 Yumi Sakemi <yu=
mi.sakemi@lepidum.co.jp>:
>> > >> >
>> > >> > Dear Chloe
>> > >> >
>> > >> > I appreciate your review.
>> > >> > I'm very glad to receive many constructive comments!
>> > >> > I will discuss about your comments with co-authors and revise our
>> > >> > draft to reflect your comments in our draft.
>> > >> > I think it will be a better draft by reflecting your comments.
>> > >> >
>> > >> > As co-author Tsunekazu e-mailed, we're  planning to submit versio=
n 04,
>> > >> > because we were independently working on updating of abstract,
>> > >> > introduction (sec. 1.3) and proofreading of English in parallel w=
ith
>> > >> > the expert review.
>> > >> > (Version 04 will not be reflected your comments.)
>> > >> >
>> > >> > Comments from Chloe will be reflected in the version 05.
>> > >> > We will submit version 05 in mid-May and we will report you when =
we
>> > >> > submit version 05.
>> > >> >
>> > >> > Dear Stanislav
>> > >> >
>> > >> > Thank you very much for proceeding to the Expert review.
>> > >> > We received a lot of constructive comments from Chloe, so I think=
 it
>> > >> > is difficult to manage comments by email.
>> > >> > (Because there are over 100 comments from Chloe.)
>> > >> >
>> > >> > Therefore, I would like to use the issue management function of G=
itHub
>> > >> > so that it is easy to check the reflecting status of Chloe's comm=
ents.
>> > >> > So, I'd like to use the repository of pairing-friendly curves dra=
ft on
>> > >> > CFRG's GitHub
>> > >> > because BLS signature which is similar in terms of IRTF stream is=
 also
>> > >> > registered on the GitHub.
>> > >> > Could you register the repository for the draft of pairing-friend=
ly
>> > >> > curves on the following CFRG's GitHub?
>> > >> >
>> > >> > https://github.com/cfrg
>> > >> >
>> > >> > Best regards,
>> > >> > Yumi
>> > >> >
>> > >> > 2020=E5=B9=B44=E6=9C=8827=E6=97=A5(=E6=9C=88) 10:09 SAITO Tsuneka=
zu <tsunekazu.saito.hg@hco.ntt.co.jp>:
>> > >> > >
>> > >> > > Dear Chloe, Stanislav,
>> > >> > >
>> > >> > >
>> > >> > >
>> > >> > > This is Tsunekazu.
>> > >> > >
>> > >> > >
>> > >> > >
>> > >> > > We plan to update the draft to version 04 soon.
>> > >> > >
>> > >> > > As the contents of the update, we changed the wording of Sectio=
n 1.3 and security consideration.
>> > >> > >
>> > >> > > Yumi will submit the 4th edition, so please wait a moment.
>> > >> > >
>> > >> > >
>> > >> > >
>> > >> > > Best regards,
>> > >> > >
>> > >> > > Tsunekazu
>> > >> > >
>> > >> > >
>> > >> > >
>> > >> > > From: Stanislav V. Smyshlyaev <smyshsv@gmail.com>
>> > >> > > Sent: Sunday, April 26, 2020 2:30 PM
>> > >> > > To: Chloe Martindale <chloemartindale@gmail.com>; SAITO Tsuneka=
zu <tsunekazu.saito.hg@hco.ntt.co.jp>; Tetsutaro Kobayashi <tetsutaro.kobay=
ashi.dr@hco.ntt.co.jp>; Yumi Sakemi <yumi.sakemi@lepidum.co.jp>
>> > >> > > Cc: cfrg-chairs@ietf.org; crypto-panel@irtf.org
>> > >> > > Subject: Re: [Crypto-panel] Request for review: draft-irtf-cfrg=
-pairing-friendly-curves-03
>> > >> > >
>> > >> > >
>> > >> > >
>> > >> > > Dear Chloe,
>> > >> > >
>> > >> > > Many thanks for your review (such a great and a prompt one!).
>> > >> > >
>> > >> > >
>> > >> > >
>> > >> > > Dear Yumi, Saito, Tetsutaro, do you plan to update your draft t=
aking into account Chloe=E2=80=99s review?
>> > >> > >
>> > >> > >
>> > >> > >
>> > >> > > Best regards,
>> > >> > >
>> > >> > > Stanislav
>> > >> > >
>> > >> > >
>> > >> > >
>> > >> > > =D0=BF=D1=82, 24 =D0=B0=D0=BF=D1=80. 2020 =D0=B3. =D0=B2 19:49,=
 Chloe Martindale <chloemartindale@gmail.com>:
>> > >> > >
>> > >> > > Hi all,
>> > >> > >
>> > >> > >
>> > >> > >
>> > >> > > review is attached.
>> > >> > >
>> > >> > >
>> > >> > >
>> > >> > > All the best,
>> > >> > >
>> > >> > > Chloe
>> > >> > >
>> > >> > >
>> > >> > >
>> > >> > > On Tue, 21 Apr 2020 at 18:05, Stanislav V. Smyshlyaev <smyshsv@=
gmail.com> wrote:
>> > >> > >
>> > >> > > Sure - it is
>> > >> > >
>> > >> > > https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-irtf-cfrg-pairing-friendly-cu=
rves-03
>> > >> > >
>> > >> > >
>> > >> > >
>> > >> > > Thank you again!
>> > >> > >
>> > >> > >
>> > >> > >
>> > >> > > Regards,
>> > >> > >
>> > >> > > Stanislav
>> > >> > >
>> > >> > >
>> > >> > >
>> > >> > > =D0=B2=D1=82, 21 =D0=B0=D0=BF=D1=80. 2020 =D0=B3. =D0=B2 19:10,=
 Chloe Martindale <chloemartindale@gmail.com>:
>> > >> > >
>> > >> > > Just to be sure, can you point me towards the most recent versi=
on of the draft please?
>> > >> > >
>> > >> > >
>> > >> > >
>> > >> > > Thanks,
>> > >> > >
>> > >> > > Chloe
>> > >> > >
>> > >> > >
>> > >> > >
>> > >> > > On Tue, 21 Apr 2020 at 13:17, Stanislav V. Smyshlyaev <smyshsv@=
gmail.com> wrote:
>> > >> > >
>> > >> > > Great, many thanks, Chloe!
>> > >> > >
>> > >> > >
>> > >> > >
>> > >> > > Kind regards,
>> > >> > >
>> > >> > > Nick, Alexey, Stanislav
>> > >> > >
>> > >> > >
>> > >> > >
>> > >> > > On Tue, 21 Apr 2020 at 15:16, Chloe Martindale <chloemartindale=
@gmail.com> wrote:
>> > >> > >
>> > >> > > I'll take a look this week.
>> > >> > >
>> > >> > >
>> > >> > >
>> > >> > > All the best,
>> > >> > >
>> > >> > > Chloe
>> > >> > >
>> > >> > >
>> > >> > >
>> > >> > > On Tue, 21 Apr 2020, 13:10 Stanislav V. Smyshlyaev, <smyshsv@gm=
ail.com> wrote:
>> > >> > >
>> > >> > > Dear Crypto Panel members,
>> > >> > >
>> > >> > >
>> > >> > >
>> > >> > > The authors of the Pairing-Friendly Curves draft have addressed=
 the concerns raised during the discussion and are ready to move to the nex=
t stage with the draft.
>> > >> > >
>> > >> > >
>> > >> > >
>> > >> > > Alexey, Nick and I would like to ask Crypto Review Panel member=
s about the review(s) of draft-irtf-cfrg-pairing-friendly-curves-03.
>> > >> > >
>> > >> > >
>> > >> > >
>> > >> > > This memo introduces pairing-friendly curves used for construct=
ing pairing-based cryptography. It describes recommended parameters for eac=
h security level and recent implementations of pairing-friendly curves.
>> > >> > >
>> > >> > >
>> > >> > >
>> > >> > >
>> > >> > >
>> > >> > > Can we have any volunteers, please?..
>> > >> > >
>> > >> > >
>> > >> > >
>> > >> > >
>> > >> > >
>> > >> > > Best regards,
>> > >> > >
>> > >> > > Stanislav (on behalf of chairs)
>> > >> > >
>> > >> > > _______________________________________________
>> > >> > > Crypto-panel mailing list
>> > >> > > Crypto-panel@irtf.org
>> > >> > > https://www.irtf.org/mailman/listinfo/crypto-panel
>> > >> >
>> > >> >
>> > >> >
>> > >> > --
>> > >> > Yumi Sakemi, Ph. D.
>> > >> > Lepidum Co. Ltd.
>> > >> > E-Mail: yumi.sakemi@lepidum.co.jp
>> > >>
>> > >>
>> > >>
>> > >> --
>> > >> Yumi Sakemi, Ph. D.
>> > >> Lepidum Co. Ltd.
>> > >>
>> > >> E-Mail: yumi.sakemi@lepidum.co.jp
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > --
>> > Yumi Sakemi
>> > Lepidum Co. Ltd.
>> >
>> > E-Mail: yumi.sakemi@lepidum.co.jp
>>
>>
>>
>> --
>> Yumi Sakemi, Ph. D.
>> Lepidum Co. Ltd.
>>
>> E-Mail: yumi.sakemi@lepidum.co.jp



--=20
Yumi Sakemi, Ph. D.
Lepidum Co. Ltd.

E-Mail: yumi.sakemi@lepidum.co.jp


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From: Nick Sullivan <nick@cloudflare.com>
Date: Tue, 16 Jun 2020 15:56:53 -0700
Message-ID: <CAFDDyk-YcoTK9aQxGX0oEk7QYpfQaUcMG57YKidESyiRyS8-oQ@mail.gmail.com>
To: Stephen Farrell <stephen.farrell@cs.tcd.ie>
Cc: Nick Sullivan <nick=40cloudflare.com@dmarc.ietf.org>, crypto-panel@irtf.org, draft-irtf-cfrg-hpke@ietf.org, cfrg-chairs@ietf.org
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Archived-At: <https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/crypto-panel/9hW_Ha46jr8pmh4UFKfmWMBoKgM>
Subject: Re: [Crypto-panel] Request for review: draft-irtf-cfrg-hpke-04
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--0000000000009d215805a83b764b
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8"

Hi Stephen,

This works for us. We look forward to your review.

Nick (on behalf of the chairs)

On Mon, Jun 8, 2020 at 2:57 PM Stephen Farrell <stephen.farrell@cs.tcd.ie>
wrote:

>
> I've implemented an earlier version [1] and will be
> coding up the final one. Happy to do it, or for that
> to be considered disqualifying:-)
>
> Cheers,
> S.
>
> [1] https://github.com/sftcd/happykey
>
> On 08/06/2020 22:53, Nick Sullivan wrote:
> > Dear Crypto Panel members,
> >
> > Alexey, Stanislav and I would like to ask Crypto Review Panel members
> for a
> > review of https://www.ietf.org/id/draft-irtf-cfrg-hpke-04.html. The
> > document specifies a set of mechanisms to do hybrid public key
> encryption.
> > It can be thought of as a generalization of ECIES for any KEM.
> >
> > This document went through last call and didn't receive many comments,
> so a
> > thorough review from a crypto panel member would be helpful to move this
> > document forward.
> >
> > Who would like to volunteer?
> >
> > Best regards,
> > Nick (on behalf of chairs)
> >
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > Crypto-panel mailing list
> > Crypto-panel@irtf.org
> > https://www.irtf.org/mailman/listinfo/crypto-panel
> >
> _______________________________________________
> Crypto-panel mailing list
> Crypto-panel@irtf.org
> https://www.irtf.org/mailman/listinfo/crypto-panel
>

--0000000000009d215805a83b764b
Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

<div dir=3D"ltr">Hi Stephen,<div><br></div><div>This works for us. We look =
forward to your review.</div><div><br></div><div>Nick (on behalf of the cha=
irs)</div></div><br><div class=3D"gmail_quote"><div dir=3D"ltr" class=3D"gm=
ail_attr">On Mon, Jun 8, 2020 at 2:57 PM Stephen Farrell &lt;<a href=3D"mai=
lto:stephen.farrell@cs.tcd.ie">stephen.farrell@cs.tcd.ie</a>&gt; wrote:<br>=
</div><blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;b=
order-left:1px solid rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex"><br>
I&#39;ve implemented an earlier version [1] and will be<br>
coding up the final one. Happy to do it, or for that<br>
to be considered disqualifying:-)<br>
<br>
Cheers,<br>
S.<br>
<br>
[1] <a href=3D"https://github.com/sftcd/happykey" rel=3D"noreferrer" target=
=3D"_blank">https://github.com/sftcd/happykey</a><br>
<br>
On 08/06/2020 22:53, Nick Sullivan wrote:<br>
&gt; Dear Crypto Panel members,<br>
&gt; <br>
&gt; Alexey, Stanislav and I would like to ask Crypto Review Panel members =
for a<br>
&gt; review of <a href=3D"https://www.ietf.org/id/draft-irtf-cfrg-hpke-04.h=
tml" rel=3D"noreferrer" target=3D"_blank">https://www.ietf.org/id/draft-irt=
f-cfrg-hpke-04.html</a>. The<br>
&gt; document specifies a set of mechanisms to do hybrid public key encrypt=
ion.<br>
&gt; It can be thought of as a generalization of ECIES for any KEM.<br>
&gt; <br>
&gt; This document went through last call and didn&#39;t receive many comme=
nts, so a<br>
&gt; thorough review from a crypto panel member would be helpful to move th=
is<br>
&gt; document forward.<br>
&gt; <br>
&gt; Who would like to volunteer?<br>
&gt; <br>
&gt; Best regards,<br>
&gt; Nick (on behalf of chairs)<br>
&gt; <br>
&gt; <br>
&gt; _______________________________________________<br>
&gt; Crypto-panel mailing list<br>
&gt; <a href=3D"mailto:Crypto-panel@irtf.org" target=3D"_blank">Crypto-pane=
l@irtf.org</a><br>
&gt; <a href=3D"https://www.irtf.org/mailman/listinfo/crypto-panel" rel=3D"=
noreferrer" target=3D"_blank">https://www.irtf.org/mailman/listinfo/crypto-=
panel</a><br>
&gt; <br>
_______________________________________________<br>
Crypto-panel mailing list<br>
<a href=3D"mailto:Crypto-panel@irtf.org" target=3D"_blank">Crypto-panel@irt=
f.org</a><br>
<a href=3D"https://www.irtf.org/mailman/listinfo/crypto-panel" rel=3D"noref=
errer" target=3D"_blank">https://www.irtf.org/mailman/listinfo/crypto-panel=
</a><br>
</blockquote></div>

--0000000000009d215805a83b764b--


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From: Jean-Philippe Aumasson <jeanphilippe.aumasson@gmail.com>
Date: Wed, 17 Jun 2020 08:16:38 +0200
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To: Nick Sullivan <nick=40cloudflare.com@dmarc.ietf.org>
Cc: Stephen Farrell <stephen.farrell@cs.tcd.ie>, crypto-panel@irtf.org,  draft-irtf-cfrg-hpke@ietf.org, cfrg-chairs@ietf.org,  christopherwood07@gmail.com, Frederic Jacobs <me@fredericjacobs.com>
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Hi,

I wrote this review a few days ago after Chris and Fred contacted me:

https://gist.github.com/veorq/76196fde31390a8696eac7e062c7b2ea

Cheers,,

JP


On Wed, Jun 17, 2020 at 12:57 AM Nick Sullivan <nick=
40cloudflare.com@dmarc.ietf.org> wrote:

> Hi Stephen,
>
> This works for us. We look forward to your review.
>
> Nick (on behalf of the chairs)
>
> On Mon, Jun 8, 2020 at 2:57 PM Stephen Farrell <stephen.farrell@cs.tcd.ie>
> wrote:
>
>>
>> I've implemented an earlier version [1] and will be
>> coding up the final one. Happy to do it, or for that
>> to be considered disqualifying:-)
>>
>> Cheers,
>> S.
>>
>> [1] https://github.com/sftcd/happykey
>>
>> On 08/06/2020 22:53, Nick Sullivan wrote:
>> > Dear Crypto Panel members,
>> >
>> > Alexey, Stanislav and I would like to ask Crypto Review Panel members
>> for a
>> > review of https://www.ietf.org/id/draft-irtf-cfrg-hpke-04.html. The
>> > document specifies a set of mechanisms to do hybrid public key
>> encryption.
>> > It can be thought of as a generalization of ECIES for any KEM.
>> >
>> > This document went through last call and didn't receive many comments,
>> so a
>> > thorough review from a crypto panel member would be helpful to move this
>> > document forward.
>> >
>> > Who would like to volunteer?
>> >
>> > Best regards,
>> > Nick (on behalf of chairs)
>> >
>> >
>> > _______________________________________________
>> > Crypto-panel mailing list
>> > Crypto-panel@irtf.org
>> > https://www.irtf.org/mailman/listinfo/crypto-panel
>> >
>> _______________________________________________
>> Crypto-panel mailing list
>> Crypto-panel@irtf.org
>> https://www.irtf.org/mailman/listinfo/crypto-panel
>>
> _______________________________________________
> Crypto-panel mailing list
> Crypto-panel@irtf.org
> https://www.irtf.org/mailman/listinfo/crypto-panel
>

--000000000000f3491105a8419a4b
Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8"
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<div dir=3D"ltr"><div dir=3D"ltr"><div dir=3D"ltr">Hi,</div><div dir=3D"ltr=
"><br></div><div dir=3D"ltr"><div>I wrote this review a few days ago after =
Chris and Fred contacted me:</div><div></div><div><br></div><div><a href=3D=
"https://gist.github.com/veorq/76196fde31390a8696eac7e062c7b2ea">https://gi=
st.github.com/veorq/76196fde31390a8696eac7e062c7b2ea</a><br></div><div><br>=
</div><div>Cheers,,</div><div><br></div><div>JP</div><div><br></div></div><=
/div></div><br><div class=3D"gmail_quote"><div dir=3D"ltr" class=3D"gmail_a=
ttr">On Wed, Jun 17, 2020 at 12:57 AM Nick Sullivan &lt;nick=3D<a href=3D"m=
ailto:40cloudflare.com@dmarc.ietf.org">40cloudflare.com@dmarc.ietf.org</a>&=
gt; wrote:<br></div><blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin:0px 0=
px 0px 0.8ex;border-left:1px solid rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex"><div =
dir=3D"ltr">Hi Stephen,<div><br></div><div>This works for us. We look forwa=
rd to your review.</div><div><br></div><div>Nick (on behalf of the chairs)<=
/div></div><br><div class=3D"gmail_quote"><div dir=3D"ltr" class=3D"gmail_a=
ttr">On Mon, Jun 8, 2020 at 2:57 PM Stephen Farrell &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:s=
tephen.farrell@cs.tcd.ie" target=3D"_blank">stephen.farrell@cs.tcd.ie</a>&g=
t; wrote:<br></div><blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin:0px 0p=
x 0px 0.8ex;border-left:1px solid rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex"><br>
I&#39;ve implemented an earlier version [1] and will be<br>
coding up the final one. Happy to do it, or for that<br>
to be considered disqualifying:-)<br>
<br>
Cheers,<br>
S.<br>
<br>
[1] <a href=3D"https://github.com/sftcd/happykey" rel=3D"noreferrer" target=
=3D"_blank">https://github.com/sftcd/happykey</a><br>
<br>
On 08/06/2020 22:53, Nick Sullivan wrote:<br>
&gt; Dear Crypto Panel members,<br>
&gt; <br>
&gt; Alexey, Stanislav and I would like to ask Crypto Review Panel members =
for a<br>
&gt; review of <a href=3D"https://www.ietf.org/id/draft-irtf-cfrg-hpke-04.h=
tml" rel=3D"noreferrer" target=3D"_blank">https://www.ietf.org/id/draft-irt=
f-cfrg-hpke-04.html</a>. The<br>
&gt; document specifies a set of mechanisms to do hybrid public key encrypt=
ion.<br>
&gt; It can be thought of as a generalization of ECIES for any KEM.<br>
&gt; <br>
&gt; This document went through last call and didn&#39;t receive many comme=
nts, so a<br>
&gt; thorough review from a crypto panel member would be helpful to move th=
is<br>
&gt; document forward.<br>
&gt; <br>
&gt; Who would like to volunteer?<br>
&gt; <br>
&gt; Best regards,<br>
&gt; Nick (on behalf of chairs)<br>
&gt; <br>
&gt; <br>
&gt; _______________________________________________<br>
&gt; Crypto-panel mailing list<br>
&gt; <a href=3D"mailto:Crypto-panel@irtf.org" target=3D"_blank">Crypto-pane=
l@irtf.org</a><br>
&gt; <a href=3D"https://www.irtf.org/mailman/listinfo/crypto-panel" rel=3D"=
noreferrer" target=3D"_blank">https://www.irtf.org/mailman/listinfo/crypto-=
panel</a><br>
&gt; <br>
_______________________________________________<br>
Crypto-panel mailing list<br>
<a href=3D"mailto:Crypto-panel@irtf.org" target=3D"_blank">Crypto-panel@irt=
f.org</a><br>
<a href=3D"https://www.irtf.org/mailman/listinfo/crypto-panel" rel=3D"noref=
errer" target=3D"_blank">https://www.irtf.org/mailman/listinfo/crypto-panel=
</a><br>
</blockquote></div>
_______________________________________________<br>
Crypto-panel mailing list<br>
<a href=3D"mailto:Crypto-panel@irtf.org" target=3D"_blank">Crypto-panel@irt=
f.org</a><br>
<a href=3D"https://www.irtf.org/mailman/listinfo/crypto-panel" rel=3D"noref=
errer" target=3D"_blank">https://www.irtf.org/mailman/listinfo/crypto-panel=
</a><br>
</blockquote></div>

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From: Alexey Melnikov <alexey.melnikov@isode.com>
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Cc: draft-irtf-cfrg-vrf@ietf.org
References: <CAFDDyk96JKFWHOz3H_knO-twgNtJcg-_6uj3XHxdmdRHiaLccQ@mail.gmail.com> <cbb91213-2c48-5be2-c4db-7a648fc4f2b0@cs.tcd.ie>
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Subject: [Crypto-panel] Request for review: draft-irtf-cfrg-vrf-07
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Dear Crypto Panel members,

Nick, Stanislav and I would like to ask Crypto Review Panel members for 
a review of 
<https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-irtf-cfrg-vrf/?include_text=1> 
("Verifiable Random Functions").

Chairs are about to start RGLC on the document, so we would like to 
solicit some reviews before that.


One or two reviews would be appreciated.


Thank you,

Alexey (on behalf of chairs)


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From: Alexey Melnikov <alexey.melnikov@isode.com>
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Subject: [Crypto-panel] Request for review: draft-irtf-cfrg-kangarootwelve-02
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Dear Crypto Panel members,

Nick, Stanislav and I would like to ask Crypto Review Panel members for 
an extra review of 
<https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-irtf-cfrg-kangarootwelve/?include_text=1> 
("KangarooTwelve").


Jean-Philippe Aumasson has made an excellent review of -01. 
Jean-Philippe, can I ask you to double check that your comments were 
addressed in -02?



Thank you,

Alexey (on behalf of chairs)


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I can do it, but I won't be able to look at it until 2 weeks from now
because of deadlines - I hope that's not too late?

All the best,
Chloe

On Fri, 19 Jun 2020, 16:42 Alexey Melnikov, <alexey.melnikov@isode.com>
wrote:

> Dear Crypto Panel members,
>
> Nick, Stanislav and I would like to ask Crypto Review Panel members for
> a review of
> <https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-irtf-cfrg-vrf/?include_text=1>
> ("Verifiable Random Functions").
>
> Chairs are about to start RGLC on the document, so we would like to
> solicit some reviews before that.
>
>
> One or two reviews would be appreciated.
>
>
> Thank you,
>
> Alexey (on behalf of chairs)
>
> _______________________________________________
> Crypto-panel mailing list
> Crypto-panel@irtf.org
> https://www.irtf.org/mailman/listinfo/crypto-panel
>

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<div dir=3D"auto">I can do it, but I won&#39;t be able to look at it until =
2 weeks from now because of deadlines - I hope that&#39;s not too late?<div=
 dir=3D"auto"><br></div><div dir=3D"auto">All=C2=A0the best,</div><div dir=
=3D"auto">Chloe</div></div><br><div class=3D"gmail_quote"><div dir=3D"ltr" =
class=3D"gmail_attr">On Fri, 19 Jun 2020, 16:42 Alexey Melnikov, &lt;<a hre=
f=3D"mailto:alexey.melnikov@isode.com">alexey.melnikov@isode.com</a>&gt; wr=
ote:<br></div><blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin:0 0 0 .8ex;=
border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">Dear Crypto Panel members,<br>
<br>
Nick, Stanislav and I would like to ask Crypto Review Panel members for <br=
>
a review of <br>
&lt;<a href=3D"https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-irtf-cfrg-vrf/?includ=
e_text=3D1" rel=3D"noreferrer noreferrer" target=3D"_blank">https://datatra=
cker.ietf.org/doc/draft-irtf-cfrg-vrf/?include_text=3D1</a>&gt; <br>
(&quot;Verifiable Random Functions&quot;).<br>
<br>
Chairs are about to start RGLC on the document, so we would like to <br>
solicit some reviews before that.<br>
<br>
<br>
One or two reviews would be appreciated.<br>
<br>
<br>
Thank you,<br>
<br>
Alexey (on behalf of chairs)<br>
<br>
_______________________________________________<br>
Crypto-panel mailing list<br>
<a href=3D"mailto:Crypto-panel@irtf.org" target=3D"_blank" rel=3D"noreferre=
r">Crypto-panel@irtf.org</a><br>
<a href=3D"https://www.irtf.org/mailman/listinfo/crypto-panel" rel=3D"noref=
errer noreferrer" target=3D"_blank">https://www.irtf.org/mailman/listinfo/c=
rypto-panel</a><br>
</blockquote></div>

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