Subject: [dispatch] Discussion about draft-benecke-cfbl-address-header

From: Jan-Philipp Benecke <[email-masked]>
Date: Fri, 14 Jan 2022 20:23:53 +0100

Hey dispatch wg!

First of all, I would like to introduce myself briefly:
My name is Jan-Philipp Benecke, i work as a Deliverability & Software
Engineer at CleverReach GmbH & Co.KG.
We're a email marketing provider offering a software-as-a-service for
sending email campaigns and transactional mails.
This is my first IETF related work, so i'm a newbie when coming to this :)

I want to introduce you my email-related draft "Complaint Feedback Loop
Address Header" which can be found @
https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-benecke-cfbl-address-header/.
The intention of this draft is to have documented, standardized and
automated way to provide a so called complaint feedback loop address to
mailbox providers.
Currently, providing and maintaining such an address is a manual and
time-consuming process for both sides, email senders and mailbox providers.
This draft defines the required header, how the header needs to be
processed and signed by DKIM.

Now i want to kick off a discussion around the draft and collect
feedback. This draft has already been presented to the ISE, Adrian
advised me to introduce the draft to this wg for further review and
discussion.

There has been already a heavy discussion while writing within the
Certified Senders Alliance (https://certified-senders.eu/), which is an
association of mailbox providers and senders.
The conclusion of this discussion was that a larger majority is
interested in such an automated path.
For example, 1&1 Mail & Media, the company behind web.de/gmx.de/mail.com
(major mailbox provider in Germany), is very interested in this draft
and would be happy to have this.
The same feedback i already got from some email senders i'm in contact with.

I look forward to hear your feedback about this draft.

Best,
Jan-Philipp

---

From: "John Levine" <[email-masked]>
Date: 14 Jan 2022 18:43:46 -0500

Hi.  The ietf-smtp list is the right place to discuss mail extensions.
I'm sending replies there and will send some more substantive comments.

But before that, do you belong to M3AAWG? That's where the people who
you would want to implement this are. The one-click unsubscribe
originated in M3AAWG discussions, so by the time it got to the IETF,
we knew that mail providers would likely implement it. I can make
introductions if you'd like.

Regards,
John Levine, [email-masked], Primary Perpetrator of "The Internet for Dummies",
Please consider the environment before reading this e-mail. https://jl.ly

---

From: Jan-Philipp Benecke <[email-masked]>
Date: Sat, 15 Jan 2022 06:20:52 +0100

Hi John. Thanks for your feedback.
We're currently not belonging to the M3AAWG, we may working on this
later the year.

I would be more than happy if you could introduce this to the M3AAWG.

Best,
Jan-Philipp

---

From: "Bron Gondwana" <[email-masked]>
Date: Fri, 28 Jan 2022 11:41:34 +1100

Hi Jan-Philipp,

There will be others from that alliance at M3AAWG in San Francisco next month I'm fairly sure. It is the first in person meeting for a while, so I dunno.  There are definitely people from 1&1 who have attended in the past, for example.

I'm going to be attending M3AAWG, and am happy to chat with people.  I definitely do recommend M3AAWG to you as a good place to network with other senders and also mailbox providers.

You definitely should consider joining m3aawg before the mid-year meeting in London.  https://www.m3aawg.org/upcoming-meetingsv2 says:
55th General Meeting
June 13-16, 2022 London, England 
Park Plaza Riverbank London

Cheers,

Bron.

On Sat, Jan 15, 2022, at 06:23, Jan-Philipp Benecke wrote:
> _______________________________________________
> dispatch mailing list
> [email-masked]
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> 

--
  Bron Gondwana, CEO, Fastmail Pty Ltd
  [email-masked]

---

From: Jan-Philipp Benecke <[email-masked]>
Date: Mon, 31 Jan 2022 07:55:25 +0100

Hey Bron,

we're currently working on joining the M3AAWG.
I'm planing to shortly introduce this draft on the mid-year meeting.
I'm already in contact with a board member about this.

Best,
Jan-Philipp

Am 28.01.22 um 01:41 schrieb Bron Gondwana:
> Hi Jan-Philipp,
>
> There will be others from that alliance at M3AAWG in San Francisco 
> next month I'm fairly sure. It is the first in person meeting for a 
> while, so I dunno. There are definitely people from 1&1 who have 
> attended in the past, for example.
>
> I'm going to be attending M3AAWG, and am happy to chat with people.  I 
> definitely do recommend M3AAWG to you as a good place to network with 
> other senders and also mailbox providers.
>
> You definitely should consider joining m3aawg before the mid-year 
> meeting in London. https://www.m3aawg.org/upcoming-meetingsv2 says:
> 55th General Meeting