Received: from merkur.iu-bremen.de (merkur.iu-bremen.de [212.201.44.27]) by agitator.ibr.cs.tu-bs.de (8.12.3/8.12.3/Debian-6.6) with ESMTP id h8UBUA1v024673 for ; Tue, 30 Sep 2003 13:30:11 +0200 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by merkur.iu-bremen.de (Postfix) with ESMTP id C2169566B4; Tue, 30 Sep 2003 13:30:10 +0200 (CEST) Received: from james (unknown [212.201.46.151]) by merkur.iu-bremen.de (Postfix) with ESMTP id 17D16565F0; Tue, 30 Sep 2003 13:30:10 +0200 (CEST) Received: by james (Postfix, from userid 1000) id 05E6C81C8; Tue, 30 Sep 2003 13:30:09 +0200 (CEST) Date: Tue, 30 Sep 2003 13:30:09 +0200 From: Juergen Schoenwaelder To: brunner@ccrle.nec.de Cc: "Nmrg (E-mail)" Subject: Re: [nmrg] Re: CAPWAP work Message-ID: <20030930113009.GA1437@iu-bremen.de> Reply-To: j.schoenwaelder@iu-bremen.de Mail-Followup-To: brunner@ccrle.nec.de, "Nmrg (E-mail)" References: <6D745637A7E0F94DA070743C55CDA9BA01138CB2@NHROCMBX1.ets.enterasys.com> <3241.10.1.1.83.1064913633.squirrel@yamato.ccrle.nec.de> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <3241.10.1.1.83.1064913633.squirrel@yamato.ccrle.nec.de> User-Agent: Mutt/1.5.4i X-Virus-Scanned: by AMaViS 0.3.12pre8 X-IBRFilter-SpamReport: -32.8 () EMAIL_ATTRIBUTION,IN_REP_TO,QUOTED_EMAIL_TEXT,REFERENCES,REPLY_WITH_QUOTES,USER_AGENT_MUTT X-Scanned-By: MIMEDefang 2.24 (www . roaringpenguin . com / mimedefang) X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-32.5 required=5.0 tests=EMAIL_ATTRIBUTION,IN_REP_TO,QUOTED_EMAIL_TEXT,REFERENCES, REPLY_WITH_QUOTES,USER_AGENT_MUTT autolearn=ham version=2.53 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) Sender: nmrg-admin@ibr.cs.tu-bs.de Errors-To: nmrg-admin@ibr.cs.tu-bs.de X-BeenThere: nmrg@ibr.cs.tu-bs.de X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Network Management Research Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: On Tue, Sep 30, 2003 at 09:20:33AM -0000, brunner@ccrle.nec.de wrote: > > And you need to implement several stacks on the "light weight" Access > points. On the other hand, reusing DHCP would even help, since many > enterprise networks have it already deployed. > On the other hand, a pure access point is an IEEE 802 bridge and the APs I had access to so far all supported the BRIDGE-MIB. Of course, most of them also had proprietary (and sometimes rather ugly) MIB extensions since we still have no standard MIBs for configuring basic things such as IP interfaces or from where to download software images. And I have been told by some folks that they really like the newer Cisco APs because they run something that looks and feels like an IOS CLI. The same dilemma as usual. /js -- Juergen Schoenwaelder International University Bremen P.O. Box 750 561, 28725 Bremen, Germany Received: from tokyo.ccrle.nec.de (tokyo.netlab.nec.de [195.37.70.2]) by agitator.ibr.cs.tu-bs.de (8.12.3/8.12.3/Debian-6.6) with ESMTP id h8U9Kn1v015622 for ; Tue, 30 Sep 2003 11:20:50 +0200 Received: from venus.office (venus.office [10.1.1.11]) by tokyo.ccrle.nec.de (8.12.9-20030927/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h8U9KYIs093513; Tue, 30 Sep 2003 11:20:35 +0200 (CEST) Received: from yamato.ccrle.nec.de (jupiter.office [10.1.1.3]) by venus.office (Postfix on SuSE Linux eMail Server 3.0) with SMTP id B78ABCD23F; Tue, 30 Sep 2003 10:49:38 +0200 (CEST) Received: from 10.1.1.83 (SquirrelMail authenticated user brunner) by yamato.ccrle.nec.de with HTTP; Tue, 30 Sep 2003 09:20:33 -0000 (GMT) Message-ID: <3241.10.1.1.83.1064913633.squirrel@yamato.ccrle.nec.de> In-Reply-To: References: <6D745637A7E0F94DA070743C55CDA9BA01138CB2@NHROCMBX1.ets.enterasys.com> Date: Tue, 30 Sep 2003 09:20:33 -0000 (GMT) Subject: Re: [nmrg] Re: CAPWAP work From: brunner@ccrle.nec.de To: "Randy Bush" Cc: "Wes Hardaker" , "Harrington, David" , "Wijnen, Bert (Bert)" , "Marcus Brunner" , "Nmrg (E-mail)" User-Agent: SquirrelMail/1.4.0 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain;charset=iso-8859-1 X-Priority: 3 Importance: Normal X-Scanned-By: MIMEDefang 2.24 (www . roaringpenguin . com / mimedefang) X-Scanned-By: MIMEDefang 2.35 X-IBRFilter-SpamReport: -18.3 () IN_REP_TO,NO_REAL_NAME,PRIORITY_NO_NAME,QUOTED_EMAIL_TEXT,REFERENCES,REPLY_WITH_QUOTES,USER_AGENT X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-18.4 required=5.0 tests=IN_REP_TO,NO_REAL_NAME,PRIORITY_NO_NAME,QUOTED_EMAIL_TEXT, REFERENCES,REPLY_WITH_QUOTES,USER_AGENT autolearn=ham version=2.53 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) Sender: nmrg-admin@ibr.cs.tu-bs.de Errors-To: nmrg-admin@ibr.cs.tu-bs.de X-BeenThere: nmrg@ibr.cs.tu-bs.de X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Network Management Research Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: > o coverage - if only some of the task can be done with the > existing protocol, then the rest must be done with new. > beware of data integrity issues such as duplicated data > and conflicts in integrity synchronization models. And you need to implement several stacks on the "light weight" Access points. On the other hand, reusing DHCP would even help, since many enterprise networks have it already deployed. Marcus ----------------------------------------- This email was sent using SquirrelMail. "Webmail for nuts!" http://squirrelmail.org/ Received: from ran.psg.com (ip166.usw12.rb1.bel.nwlink.com [209.20.253.166]) by agitator.ibr.cs.tu-bs.de (8.12.3/8.12.3/Debian-6.6) with ESMTP id h8TG1O1w023895 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=NO) for ; Mon, 29 Sep 2003 18:01:28 +0200 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1] helo=ran.psg.com) by ran.psg.com with esmtp (Exim 4.22) id 1A40SV-000BhC-04; Mon, 29 Sep 2003 09:01:11 -0700 From: Randy Bush MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Date: Mon, 29 Sep 2003 09:01:10 -0700 To: Wes Hardaker Cc: "Harrington, David" , "Wijnen, Bert (Bert)" , "Marcus Brunner" , "Nmrg (E-mail)" Subject: Re: [nmrg] Re: CAPWAP work References: <6D745637A7E0F94DA070743C55CDA9BA01138CB2@NHROCMBX1.ets.enterasys.com> Message-Id: X-IBRFilter-SpamReport: -6.6 () REFERENCES X-Scanned-By: MIMEDefang 2.24 (www . roaringpenguin . com / mimedefang) X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-6.6 required=5.0 tests=REFERENCES autolearn=ham version=2.53 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) Sender: nmrg-admin@ibr.cs.tu-bs.de Errors-To: nmrg-admin@ibr.cs.tu-bs.de X-BeenThere: nmrg@ibr.cs.tu-bs.de X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Network Management Research Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: to me, the real issues of re-use are two o model fit, already discussed o coverage - if only some of the task can be done with the existing protocol, then the rest must be done with new. beware of data integrity issues such as duplicated data and conflicts in integrity synchronization models. randy Received: from wanderer.hardakers.net (adsl-66-127-127-227.dsl.scrm01.pacbell.net [66.127.127.227]) by agitator.ibr.cs.tu-bs.de (8.12.3/8.12.3/Debian-6.6) with ESMTP id h8TFt31v021881 for ; Mon, 29 Sep 2003 17:55:04 +0200 Received: by wanderer.hardakers.net (Postfix, from userid 274) id 82591574A6; Mon, 29 Sep 2003 08:54:57 -0700 (PDT) To: "Harrington, David" Cc: "Wijnen, Bert (Bert)" , "Marcus Brunner" , "Nmrg (E-mail)" References: <6D745637A7E0F94DA070743C55CDA9BA01138CB2@NHROCMBX1.ets.enterasys.com> From: Wes Hardaker Organization: Sparta Face: 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 Date: Mon, 29 Sep 2003 08:54:57 -0700 In-Reply-To: <6D745637A7E0F94DA070743C55CDA9BA01138CB2@NHROCMBX1.ets.enterasys.com> (David Harrington's message of "Mon, 29 Sep 2003 09:12:35 -0400") Message-ID: User-Agent: Gnus/5.1003 (Gnus v5.10.3) XEmacs/21.5 (brussels sprouts, linux) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-IBRFilter-SpamReport: -16.3 () IN_REP_TO,REFERENCES,USER_AGENT_GNUS_UA X-Scanned-By: MIMEDefang 2.24 (www . roaringpenguin . com / mimedefang) X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-16.2 required=5.0 tests=IN_REP_TO,REFERENCES,USER_AGENT_GNUS_UA autolearn=ham version=2.53 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) Subject: [nmrg] Re: CAPWAP work Sender: nmrg-admin@ibr.cs.tu-bs.de Errors-To: nmrg-admin@ibr.cs.tu-bs.de X-BeenThere: nmrg@ibr.cs.tu-bs.de X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Network Management Research Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: >>>>> On Mon, 29 Sep 2003 09:12:35 -0400, "Harrington, David" said: David> In MIDCOM, they developed the requirements and did a bake-off, David> which SNMPv3 won, but the SNMP MIB approach to modeling is so David> foreign to most users/developers of MIDCOM functionality, it David> seems to be causing problems moving forward. Well, the choice is either to reuse existing work or not to. When you reuse there is a learning curve (and in the case of SNMP from people unfamiliar with relational database concepts, it's a big curve). When you reinvent the wheel you make every implementation potentially spend more time and energy since they have no pre-existing tools to build upon. Either way its an uphill curve for someone. -- Wes Hardaker Sparta Received: from ctron-dnm.enterasys.com (ctron-dnm.enterasys.com [12.25.1.120]) by agitator.ibr.cs.tu-bs.de (8.12.3/8.12.3/Debian-6.6) with ESMTP id h8TEej1v030436 for ; Mon, 29 Sep 2003 16:40:45 +0200 Received: (from uucp@localhost) by ctron-dnm.enterasys.com (8.8.7/8.8.7) id KAA07344 for ; Mon, 29 Sep 2003 10:41:03 -0400 (EDT) Received: from nhrocavg2(134.141.79.124) by ctron-dnm.enterasys.com via smap (4.1) id xma007283; Mon, 29 Sep 03 10:40:07 -0400 Received: from NHROCCNC2.ets.enterasys.com ([134.141.79.122]) by NHROCAVG2 with InterScan Messaging Security Suite; Mon, 29 Sep 2003 10:39:44 -0400 Received: from nhrocmbx1 ([134.141.79.104]) by NHROCCNC2.ets.enterasys.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(5.0.2195.6713); Mon, 29 Sep 2003 10:39:44 -0400 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft Exchange V6.0.6375.0 Content-Class: urn:content-classes:message MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Subject: RE: [nmrg] CAPWAP work Date: Mon, 29 Sep 2003 10:39:43 -0400 Message-ID: <6D745637A7E0F94DA070743C55CDA9BA01138CC1@NHROCMBX1.ets.enterasys.com> Thread-Topic: [nmrg] CAPWAP work Thread-Index: AcOGj6AiczqwAbc6SQ6aZJ5kN84rhQAB9mfg From: "Harrington, David" To: "Wijnen, Bert (Bert)" , "Marcus Brunner" Cc: "Nmrg (E-mail)" X-OriginalArrivalTime: 29 Sep 2003 14:39:44.0253 (UTC) FILETIME=[85FB52D0:01C38697] X-IBRFilter-SpamReport: -3.9 () QUOTED_EMAIL_TEXT,QUOTE_TWICE_1 X-Scanned-By: MIMEDefang 2.24 (www . roaringpenguin . com / mimedefang) Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by agitator.ibr.cs.tu-bs.de id h8TEej1v030436 X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-3.2 required=5.0 tests=QUOTED_EMAIL_TEXT,QUOTE_TWICE_1,RCVD_IN_OSIRUSOFT_COM autolearn=ham version=2.53 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) Sender: nmrg-admin@ibr.cs.tu-bs.de Errors-To: nmrg-admin@ibr.cs.tu-bs.de X-BeenThere: nmrg@ibr.cs.tu-bs.de X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Network Management Research Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: I got what I wished for ... ;-) dbh > -----Original Message----- > From: Wijnen, Bert (Bert) [mailto:bwijnen@lucent.com] > Sent: Monday, September 29, 2003 9:42 AM > To: Harrington, David; Wijnen, Bert (Bert); Marcus Brunner > Cc: Nmrg (E-mail) > Subject: RE: [nmrg] CAPWAP work > > > Mmm... is this just my bad memory... for all I remember, you were one > of the people who worried a lot and pretty loudly at that? > > Thanks, > Bert > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: Harrington, David [mailto:dbh@enterasys.com] > > Sent: maandag 29 september 2003 15:13 > > To: Wijnen, Bert (Bert); Marcus Brunner > > Cc: Nmrg (E-mail) > > Subject: RE: [nmrg] CAPWAP work > > > > > > Hi Bert, > > > > Be careful what you wish for. > > > > Looking at existing protocols first can be problematic. The > MIDCOM WG > > has taken this approach, and they are making very little progress > > because there are factions favoring a new protocol and > > multiple factions > > favoring different existing protocols. > > > > It may or may not be appropriate to use an existing protocol > > to solve a > > particular problem if the way users think of the problem (the > > information model of the thing to be managed, if you will) is > > not really > > consistent with the modeling approach (the data model) of > the existing > > protocol. > > > > In MIDCOM, they developed the requirements and did a bake-off, which > > SNMPv3 won, but the SNMP MIB approach to modeling is so > > foreign to most > > users/developers of MIDCOM functionality, it seems to be causing > > problems moving forward. > > > > I haven't looked closely at LWAPP and other CAPWAP protocols, but I > > would be careful about trying to make any CAPWAP solution fit with > > existing protocols unless the protocol really follows a similar > > philosophy of how to do configuration. > > > > dbh > > > > > -----Original Message----- > > > From: Wijnen, Bert (Bert) [mailto:bwijnen@lucent.com] > > > Sent: Monday, September 29, 2003 7:09 AM > > > To: 'Marcus Brunner' > > > Cc: Nmrg (E-mail) > > > Subject: RE: [nmrg] CAPWAP work > > > > > > > > > Inline > > > > -----Original Message----- > > > > From: Marcus Brunner [mailto:brunner@ccrle.nec.de] > > > > Sent: maandag 29 september 2003 12:48 > > > > To: Wijnen, Bert (Bert) > > > > Cc: Nmrg (E-mail) > > > > Subject: Re: [nmrg] CAPWAP work > > > > > > > > > > > > Bert, > > > > > > > > As far as I remember, the nmrg has started pitching around > > > about various > > > > IETF politics and SNMP and so on. I don't remember having > > > seen substantial > > > > positions on CAPWAP. > > > > > > > Mmm... I sort of recall that there were specific worries > that CAPWAP > > > runs the risk to re-invent the wheel. > > > > > > > IMOH, CAPWAP has the right direction. Basically, > > > simplifying the control > > > > and management of WLAN access points (plug and play). > > > Unfortunately, the > > > > LWAPP proposal in discussion does everything on one newly > > > defined protocol > > > > without having well-known IETF protocols taken into account. > > > > > > > Aha... ok so that shows they have (potentially) not looked > > > (well enough) > > > at existing protocols. That we can deal with by making it > > explicit in > > > a WG charter-to-be that they MUST evaluate existing > protocols first. > > > > > > Thanks for the input. Any more comments from others? > > > Bert > > > > Marcus > > > > > > > -- > > > !! This message is brought to you via the `nmrg' mailing list. > > > !! Please do not reply to this message to unsubscribe. To > > > unsubscribe or adjust > > > !! your settings, send a mail message to > > > > > > !! or look at https://www.ibr.cs.tu-bs.de/mailman/listinfo/nmrg. > > > > > > Received: from hoemail1.firewall.lucent.com (hoemail1.lucent.com [192.11.226.161]) by agitator.ibr.cs.tu-bs.de (8.12.3/8.12.3/Debian-6.6) with ESMTP id h8TDgj1w012116 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=NO) for ; Mon, 29 Sep 2003 15:42:46 +0200 Received: from nl0006exch001h.wins.lucent.com (h135-85-76-62.lucent.com [135.85.76.62]) by hoemail1.firewall.lucent.com (Switch-2.2.8/Switch-2.2.0) with ESMTP id h8TDged02714 for ; Mon, 29 Sep 2003 08:42:40 -0500 (CDT) Received: by nl0006exch001h.nl.lucent.com with Internet Mail Service (5.5.2656.59) id ; Mon, 29 Sep 2003 15:42:39 +0200 Message-ID: <7D5D48D2CAA3D84C813F5B154F43B155028EC34A@nl0006exch001u.nl.lucent.com> From: "Wijnen, Bert (Bert)" To: "'Harrington, David'" , "Wijnen, Bert (Bert)" , Marcus Brunner Cc: "Nmrg (E-mail)" Subject: RE: [nmrg] CAPWAP work Date: Mon, 29 Sep 2003 15:42:28 +0200 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2656.59) Content-Type: text/plain X-IBRFilter-SpamReport: -3.3 () QUOTED_EMAIL_TEXT X-Scanned-By: MIMEDefang 2.24 (www . roaringpenguin . com / mimedefang) X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-2.6 required=5.0 tests=QUOTED_EMAIL_TEXT,RCVD_IN_OSIRUSOFT_COM autolearn=ham version=2.53 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) Sender: nmrg-admin@ibr.cs.tu-bs.de Errors-To: nmrg-admin@ibr.cs.tu-bs.de X-BeenThere: nmrg@ibr.cs.tu-bs.de X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Network Management Research Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Mmm... is this just my bad memory... for all I remember, you were one of the people who worried a lot and pretty loudly at that? Thanks, Bert > -----Original Message----- > From: Harrington, David [mailto:dbh@enterasys.com] > Sent: maandag 29 september 2003 15:13 > To: Wijnen, Bert (Bert); Marcus Brunner > Cc: Nmrg (E-mail) > Subject: RE: [nmrg] CAPWAP work > > > Hi Bert, > > Be careful what you wish for. > > Looking at existing protocols first can be problematic. The MIDCOM WG > has taken this approach, and they are making very little progress > because there are factions favoring a new protocol and > multiple factions > favoring different existing protocols. > > It may or may not be appropriate to use an existing protocol > to solve a > particular problem if the way users think of the problem (the > information model of the thing to be managed, if you will) is > not really > consistent with the modeling approach (the data model) of the existing > protocol. > > In MIDCOM, they developed the requirements and did a bake-off, which > SNMPv3 won, but the SNMP MIB approach to modeling is so > foreign to most > users/developers of MIDCOM functionality, it seems to be causing > problems moving forward. > > I haven't looked closely at LWAPP and other CAPWAP protocols, but I > would be careful about trying to make any CAPWAP solution fit with > existing protocols unless the protocol really follows a similar > philosophy of how to do configuration. > > dbh > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: Wijnen, Bert (Bert) [mailto:bwijnen@lucent.com] > > Sent: Monday, September 29, 2003 7:09 AM > > To: 'Marcus Brunner' > > Cc: Nmrg (E-mail) > > Subject: RE: [nmrg] CAPWAP work > > > > > > Inline > > > -----Original Message----- > > > From: Marcus Brunner [mailto:brunner@ccrle.nec.de] > > > Sent: maandag 29 september 2003 12:48 > > > To: Wijnen, Bert (Bert) > > > Cc: Nmrg (E-mail) > > > Subject: Re: [nmrg] CAPWAP work > > > > > > > > > Bert, > > > > > > As far as I remember, the nmrg has started pitching around > > about various > > > IETF politics and SNMP and so on. I don't remember having > > seen substantial > > > positions on CAPWAP. > > > > > Mmm... I sort of recall that there were specific worries that CAPWAP > > runs the risk to re-invent the wheel. > > > > > IMOH, CAPWAP has the right direction. Basically, > > simplifying the control > > > and management of WLAN access points (plug and play). > > Unfortunately, the > > > LWAPP proposal in discussion does everything on one newly > > defined protocol > > > without having well-known IETF protocols taken into account. > > > > > Aha... ok so that shows they have (potentially) not looked > > (well enough) > > at existing protocols. That we can deal with by making it > explicit in > > a WG charter-to-be that they MUST evaluate existing protocols first. > > > > Thanks for the input. Any more comments from others? > > Bert > > > Marcus > > > > > -- > > !! This message is brought to you via the `nmrg' mailing list. > > !! Please do not reply to this message to unsubscribe. To > > unsubscribe or adjust > > !! your settings, send a mail message to > > > > !! or look at https://www.ibr.cs.tu-bs.de/mailman/listinfo/nmrg. > > > Received: from ctron-dnm.enterasys.com (ctron-dnm.enterasys.com [12.25.1.120]) by agitator.ibr.cs.tu-bs.de (8.12.3/8.12.3/Debian-6.6) with ESMTP id h8TDFJ1v002933 for ; Mon, 29 Sep 2003 15:15:20 +0200 Received: (from uucp@localhost) by ctron-dnm.enterasys.com (8.8.7/8.8.7) id JAA28312 for ; Mon, 29 Sep 2003 09:15:41 -0400 (EDT) Received: from nhrocavg2(134.141.79.124) by ctron-dnm.enterasys.com via smap (4.1) id xma027520; Mon, 29 Sep 03 09:13:00 -0400 Received: from NHROCCNC2.ets.enterasys.com ([134.141.79.122]) by NHROCAVG2 with InterScan Messaging Security Suite; Mon, 29 Sep 2003 09:12:36 -0400 Received: from nhrocmbx1 ([134.141.79.104]) by NHROCCNC2.ets.enterasys.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(5.0.2195.6713); Mon, 29 Sep 2003 09:12:35 -0400 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft Exchange V6.0.6375.0 Content-Class: urn:content-classes:message MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Subject: RE: [nmrg] CAPWAP work Date: Mon, 29 Sep 2003 09:12:35 -0400 Message-ID: <6D745637A7E0F94DA070743C55CDA9BA01138CB2@NHROCMBX1.ets.enterasys.com> Thread-Topic: [nmrg] CAPWAP work Thread-Index: AcOGelefYDkgCJe6TVKghddANY92zQADwLRA From: "Harrington, David" To: "Wijnen, Bert (Bert)" , "Marcus Brunner" Cc: "Nmrg (E-mail)" X-OriginalArrivalTime: 29 Sep 2003 13:12:35.0972 (UTC) FILETIME=[59AEF440:01C3868B] X-IBRFilter-SpamReport: -3.3 () QUOTED_EMAIL_TEXT X-Scanned-By: MIMEDefang 2.24 (www . roaringpenguin . com / mimedefang) Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by agitator.ibr.cs.tu-bs.de id h8TDFJ1v002933 X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-3.2 required=5.0 tests=QUOTED_EMAIL_TEXT autolearn=ham version=2.53 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) Sender: nmrg-admin@ibr.cs.tu-bs.de Errors-To: nmrg-admin@ibr.cs.tu-bs.de X-BeenThere: nmrg@ibr.cs.tu-bs.de X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Network Management Research Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Hi Bert, Be careful what you wish for. Looking at existing protocols first can be problematic. The MIDCOM WG has taken this approach, and they are making very little progress because there are factions favoring a new protocol and multiple factions favoring different existing protocols. It may or may not be appropriate to use an existing protocol to solve a particular problem if the way users think of the problem (the information model of the thing to be managed, if you will) is not really consistent with the modeling approach (the data model) of the existing protocol. In MIDCOM, they developed the requirements and did a bake-off, which SNMPv3 won, but the SNMP MIB approach to modeling is so foreign to most users/developers of MIDCOM functionality, it seems to be causing problems moving forward. I haven't looked closely at LWAPP and other CAPWAP protocols, but I would be careful about trying to make any CAPWAP solution fit with existing protocols unless the protocol really follows a similar philosophy of how to do configuration. dbh > -----Original Message----- > From: Wijnen, Bert (Bert) [mailto:bwijnen@lucent.com] > Sent: Monday, September 29, 2003 7:09 AM > To: 'Marcus Brunner' > Cc: Nmrg (E-mail) > Subject: RE: [nmrg] CAPWAP work > > > Inline > > -----Original Message----- > > From: Marcus Brunner [mailto:brunner@ccrle.nec.de] > > Sent: maandag 29 september 2003 12:48 > > To: Wijnen, Bert (Bert) > > Cc: Nmrg (E-mail) > > Subject: Re: [nmrg] CAPWAP work > > > > > > Bert, > > > > As far as I remember, the nmrg has started pitching around > about various > > IETF politics and SNMP and so on. I don't remember having > seen substantial > > positions on CAPWAP. > > > Mmm... I sort of recall that there were specific worries that CAPWAP > runs the risk to re-invent the wheel. > > > IMOH, CAPWAP has the right direction. Basically, > simplifying the control > > and management of WLAN access points (plug and play). > Unfortunately, the > > LWAPP proposal in discussion does everything on one newly > defined protocol > > without having well-known IETF protocols taken into account. > > > Aha... ok so that shows they have (potentially) not looked > (well enough) > at existing protocols. That we can deal with by making it explicit in > a WG charter-to-be that they MUST evaluate existing protocols first. > > Thanks for the input. Any more comments from others? > Bert > > Marcus > > > -- > !! This message is brought to you via the `nmrg' mailing list. > !! Please do not reply to this message to unsubscribe. To > unsubscribe or adjust > !! your settings, send a mail message to > > !! or look at https://www.ibr.cs.tu-bs.de/mailman/listinfo/nmrg. > Received: from ihemail2.firewall.lucent.com (ihemail2.lucent.com [192.11.222.163]) by agitator.ibr.cs.tu-bs.de (8.12.3/8.12.3/Debian-6.6) with ESMTP id h8TB951w011913 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=NO) for ; Mon, 29 Sep 2003 13:09:06 +0200 Received: from nl0006exch001h.wins.lucent.com (h135-85-76-62.lucent.com [135.85.76.62]) by ihemail2.firewall.lucent.com (Switch-2.2.8/Switch-2.2.0) with ESMTP id h8TB91t12574 for ; Mon, 29 Sep 2003 06:09:02 -0500 (CDT) Received: by nl0006exch001h.nl.lucent.com with Internet Mail Service (5.5.2656.59) id ; Mon, 29 Sep 2003 13:09:00 +0200 Message-ID: <7D5D48D2CAA3D84C813F5B154F43B155028EC340@nl0006exch001u.nl.lucent.com> From: "Wijnen, Bert (Bert)" To: "'Marcus Brunner'" Cc: "Nmrg (E-mail)" Subject: RE: [nmrg] CAPWAP work Date: Mon, 29 Sep 2003 13:08:55 +0200 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2656.59) Content-Type: text/plain X-IBRFilter-SpamReport: -3.3 () QUOTED_EMAIL_TEXT X-Scanned-By: MIMEDefang 2.24 (www . roaringpenguin . com / mimedefang) X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-3.2 required=5.0 tests=QUOTED_EMAIL_TEXT autolearn=ham version=2.53 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) Sender: nmrg-admin@ibr.cs.tu-bs.de Errors-To: nmrg-admin@ibr.cs.tu-bs.de X-BeenThere: nmrg@ibr.cs.tu-bs.de X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Network Management Research Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Inline > -----Original Message----- > From: Marcus Brunner [mailto:brunner@ccrle.nec.de] > Sent: maandag 29 september 2003 12:48 > To: Wijnen, Bert (Bert) > Cc: Nmrg (E-mail) > Subject: Re: [nmrg] CAPWAP work > > > Bert, > > As far as I remember, the nmrg has started pitching around about various > IETF politics and SNMP and so on. I don't remember having seen substantial > positions on CAPWAP. > Mmm... I sort of recall that there were specific worries that CAPWAP runs the risk to re-invent the wheel. > IMOH, CAPWAP has the right direction. Basically, simplifying the control > and management of WLAN access points (plug and play). Unfortunately, the > LWAPP proposal in discussion does everything on one newly defined protocol > without having well-known IETF protocols taken into account. > Aha... ok so that shows they have (potentially) not looked (well enough) at existing protocols. That we can deal with by making it explicit in a WG charter-to-be that they MUST evaluate existing protocols first. Thanks for the input. Any more comments from others? Bert > Marcus > Received: from tokyo.ccrle.nec.de (tokyo.netlab.nec.de [195.37.70.2]) by agitator.ibr.cs.tu-bs.de (8.12.3/8.12.3/Debian-6.6) with ESMTP id h8TAli1v005323 for ; Mon, 29 Sep 2003 12:47:44 +0200 Received: from venus.office (venus.office [10.1.1.11]) by tokyo.ccrle.nec.de (8.12.9-20030927/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h8TAlgmW046215; Mon, 29 Sep 2003 12:47:42 +0200 (CEST) Received: from [10.1.1.130] (brunner.office [10.1.1.130]) by venus.office (Postfix on SuSE Linux eMail Server 3.0) with ESMTP id 3A834C2FFE; Mon, 29 Sep 2003 12:16:56 +0200 (CEST) Date: Mon, 29 Sep 2003 12:47:41 +0200 From: Marcus Brunner Reply-To: Marcus Brunner To: "Wijnen, Bert (Bert)" Cc: "Nmrg (E-mail)" Subject: Re: [nmrg] CAPWAP work Message-ID: <6057380.1064839661@[10.1.1.130]> In-Reply-To: <7D5D48D2CAA3D84C813F5B154F43B155028EC33A@nl0006exch001u.nl.lucent.com> References: <7D5D48D2CAA3D84C813F5B154F43B155028EC33A@nl0006exch001u.nl.luce nt.com> X-Mailer: Mulberry/3.0.2 (Win32) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline X-IBRFilter-SpamReport: -6.6 () IN_REP_TO,QUOTED_EMAIL_TEXT X-Scanned-By: MIMEDefang 2.24 (www . roaringpenguin . com / mimedefang) X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-6.5 required=5.0 tests=IN_REP_TO,QUOTED_EMAIL_TEXT autolearn=ham version=2.53 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) Sender: nmrg-admin@ibr.cs.tu-bs.de Errors-To: nmrg-admin@ibr.cs.tu-bs.de X-BeenThere: nmrg@ibr.cs.tu-bs.de X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Network Management Research Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Bert, As far as I remember, the nmrg has started pitching around about various IETF politics and SNMP and so on. I don't remember having seen substantial positions on CAPWAP. IMOH, CAPWAP has the right direction. Basically, simplifying the control and management of WLAN access points (plug and play). Unfortunately, the LWAPP proposal in discussion does everything on one newly defined protocol without having well-known IETF protocols taken into account. Marcus --On Montag, 29. September 2003 10:35 +0200 "Wijnen, Bert (Bert)" wrote: > I know that in Vienna we had some discussion about the > possible conflicts/overlap the CAPWAP work would have > with the way we have been (and are) doing NM work in > this space. Anyone care to write down a few paragraphs > what exactly the issues are as we see them? > > Thanks, > Bert > -- > !! This message is brought to you via the `nmrg' mailing list. > !! Please do not reply to this message to unsubscribe. To unsubscribe or > adjust !! your settings, send a mail message to > !! or look at > https://www.ibr.cs.tu-bs.de/mailman/listinfo/nmrg. -------------------------------------- Dr. Marcus Brunner Network Laboratories NEC Europe Ltd. E-Mail: brunner@ccrle.nec.de WWW: http://www.ccrle.nec.de/ Phone: +49 (0) 6221 905 11 29 Mobile: +49 (0) 163 275 17 43 personal home page: http://www.brubers.org/marcus Received: from ihemail2.firewall.lucent.com (ihemail2.lucent.com [192.11.222.163]) by agitator.ibr.cs.tu-bs.de (8.12.3/8.12.3/Debian-6.6) with ESMTP id h8T8Zb1w027716 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=NO) for ; Mon, 29 Sep 2003 10:35:38 +0200 Received: from nl0006exch001h.wins.lucent.com (h135-85-76-62.lucent.com [135.85.76.62]) by ihemail2.firewall.lucent.com (Switch-2.2.8/Switch-2.2.0) with ESMTP id h8T8ZXt22928 for ; Mon, 29 Sep 2003 03:35:34 -0500 (CDT) Received: by nl0006exch001h.nl.lucent.com with Internet Mail Service (5.5.2656.59) id ; Mon, 29 Sep 2003 10:35:32 +0200 Message-ID: <7D5D48D2CAA3D84C813F5B154F43B155028EC33A@nl0006exch001u.nl.lucent.com> From: "Wijnen, Bert (Bert)" To: "Nmrg (E-mail)" Date: Mon, 29 Sep 2003 10:35:30 +0200 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2656.59) Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" X-IBRFilter-SpamReport: 0 () X-Scanned-By: MIMEDefang 2.24 (www . roaringpenguin . com / mimedefang) X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none version=2.53 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) Subject: [nmrg] CAPWAP work Sender: nmrg-admin@ibr.cs.tu-bs.de Errors-To: nmrg-admin@ibr.cs.tu-bs.de X-BeenThere: nmrg@ibr.cs.tu-bs.de X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Network Management Research Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: I know that in Vienna we had some discussion about the possible conflicts/overlap the CAPWAP work would have with the way we have been (and are) doing NM work in this space. Anyone care to write down a few paragraphs what exactly the issues are as we see them? Thanks, Bert Received: from merkur.iu-bremen.de (merkur.iu-bremen.de [212.201.44.27]) by agitator.ibr.cs.tu-bs.de (8.12.3/8.12.3/Debian-6.6) with ESMTP id h8NFuP1v030690 for ; Tue, 23 Sep 2003 17:56:25 +0200 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by merkur.iu-bremen.de (Postfix) with ESMTP id 74718562CB; Tue, 23 Sep 2003 17:56:25 +0200 (CEST) Received: from james (unknown [212.201.46.151]) by merkur.iu-bremen.de (Postfix) with ESMTP id B966D56278; Tue, 23 Sep 2003 17:56:24 +0200 (CEST) Received: by james (Postfix, from userid 1000) id AE3F67E6C; Tue, 23 Sep 2003 17:56:24 +0200 (CEST) Date: Tue, 23 Sep 2003 17:56:24 +0200 From: Juergen Schoenwaelder To: nmrg@ibr.cs.tu-bs.de Message-ID: <20030923155624.GA1870@iu-bremen.de> Reply-To: j.schoenwaelder@iu-bremen.de Mail-Followup-To: nmrg@ibr.cs.tu-bs.de Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline User-Agent: Mutt/1.5.4i X-Virus-Scanned: by AMaViS 0.3.12pre8 X-IBRFilter-SpamReport: -6.4 () USER_AGENT_MUTT X-Scanned-By: MIMEDefang 2.24 (www . roaringpenguin . com / mimedefang) X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-5.8 required=5.0 tests=RCVD_IN_OSIRUSOFT_COM,USER_AGENT_MUTT autolearn=ham version=2.53 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) Subject: [nmrg] 14th NMRG meeting in Heidelberg Sender: nmrg-admin@ibr.cs.tu-bs.de Errors-To: nmrg-admin@ibr.cs.tu-bs.de X-BeenThere: nmrg@ibr.cs.tu-bs.de X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Network Management Research Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: I have installed a web page for the 14th NMRG meeting in Heidelberg on October 19th (Sunday before DSOM 2003). There are four topics we plan to discuss during the workshop. Every topic will be introduced by a short presentation followed by discussions. For the more details, please visit the following location: http://www.ibr.cs.tu-bs.de/projects/nmrg/meetings/2003/heidelberg/ Thanks to Aiko for helping me to shape the agenda and to those who suggested topics which we were not able to put on the agenda for this one day meeting. Looking forward to see (at least some of) you soon in Heidelberg. /js -- Juergen Schoenwaelder International University Bremen P.O. Box 750 561, 28725 Bremen, Germany Received: from merkur.iu-bremen.de (merkur.iu-bremen.de [212.201.44.27]) by agitator.ibr.cs.tu-bs.de (8.12.3/8.12.3/Debian-6.6) with ESMTP id h8NAHM1v016011 for ; Tue, 23 Sep 2003 12:17:23 +0200 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by merkur.iu-bremen.de (Postfix) with ESMTP id C816F55ED1; Tue, 23 Sep 2003 12:17:22 +0200 (CEST) Received: from james (unknown [212.201.46.151]) by merkur.iu-bremen.de (Postfix) with ESMTP id 16AF454F51; Tue, 23 Sep 2003 12:17:22 +0200 (CEST) Received: by james (Postfix, from userid 1000) id 0FBA47E6C; Tue, 23 Sep 2003 12:17:21 +0200 (CEST) Date: Tue, 23 Sep 2003 12:17:21 +0200 From: Juergen Schoenwaelder To: nmrg@ibr.cs.tu-bs.de Message-ID: <20030923101721.GA1206@iu-bremen.de> Reply-To: j.schoenwaelder@iu-bremen.de Mail-Followup-To: nmrg@ibr.cs.tu-bs.de Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline User-Agent: Mutt/1.5.4i X-Virus-Scanned: by AMaViS 0.3.12pre8 X-IBRFilter-SpamReport: -6.4 () USER_AGENT_MUTT X-Scanned-By: MIMEDefang 2.24 (www . roaringpenguin . com / mimedefang) X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-5.8 required=5.0 tests=RCVD_IN_OSIRUSOFT_COM,USER_AGENT_MUTT autolearn=ham version=2.53 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) Subject: [nmrg] sming last call Sender: nmrg-admin@ibr.cs.tu-bs.de Errors-To: nmrg-admin@ibr.cs.tu-bs.de X-BeenThere: nmrg@ibr.cs.tu-bs.de X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Network Management Research Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: This is the start of a two week last call on the following SMIng documents: draft-irtf-nmrg-sming-05.txt draft-irtf-nmrg-sming-modules-03.txt draft-irtf-nmrg-sming-snmp-03.txt If you have any issues, raise them now. Otherwise, these documents will be submitted to the RFC editor for publication as experimental RFCs. Note that the list of SMIng documents under last call does not include the COPS-PR mapping document since the authors of this document stopped to respond to email. So if you think the COPS-PR mapping should be published as well, please speak up and volunteer yourself to become the editor of that document. This last call ends on October 7th. /js -- Juergen Schoenwaelder International University Bremen P.O. Box 750 561, 28725 Bremen, Germany Received: from merkur.iu-bremen.de (merkur.iu-bremen.de [212.201.44.27]) by agitator.ibr.cs.tu-bs.de (8.12.3/8.12.3/Debian-6.6) with ESMTP id h8LJ2ZYo023531; Sun, 21 Sep 2003 21:02:35 +0200 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by merkur.iu-bremen.de (Postfix) with ESMTP id D7C9E56201; Sun, 21 Sep 2003 21:02:33 +0200 (CEST) Received: from james (unknown [212.201.47.15]) by merkur.iu-bremen.de (Postfix) with ESMTP id B915A561CE; Sun, 21 Sep 2003 21:02:32 +0200 (CEST) Received: by james (Postfix, from userid 1000) id 8F9C67E6B; Sun, 21 Sep 2003 21:02:31 +0200 (CEST) Date: Sun, 21 Sep 2003 21:02:31 +0200 From: Juergen Schoenwaelder To: Frank Strauss Cc: nmrg@ibr.cs.tu-bs.de Subject: Re: [nmrg] sming changes review Message-ID: <20030921190231.GA5108@iu-bremen.de> Reply-To: j.schoenwaelder@iu-bremen.de Mail-Followup-To: Frank Strauss , nmrg@ibr.cs.tu-bs.de References: <20030919130526.GA1564@iu-bremen.de> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: User-Agent: Mutt/1.5.4i X-Virus-Scanned: by AMaViS 0.3.12pre8 X-IBRFilter-SpamReport: -32.8 () EMAIL_ATTRIBUTION,IN_REP_TO,QUOTED_EMAIL_TEXT,REFERENCES,REPLY_WITH_QUOTES,USER_AGENT_MUTT X-Scanned-By: MIMEDefang 2.24 (www . roaringpenguin . com / mimedefang) X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-32.5 required=5.0 tests=EMAIL_ATTRIBUTION,IN_REP_TO,QUOTED_EMAIL_TEXT,REFERENCES, REPLY_WITH_QUOTES,USER_AGENT_MUTT autolearn=ham version=2.53 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) Sender: nmrg-admin@ibr.cs.tu-bs.de Errors-To: nmrg-admin@ibr.cs.tu-bs.de X-BeenThere: nmrg@ibr.cs.tu-bs.de X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Network Management Research Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: On Fri, Sep 19, 2003 at 04:03:01PM +0200, Frank Strauss wrote: > > Juergen> a) In the type mapping table in section 3, we may want to add > Juergen> the note (2) to the TimeTicks64 mapping or even better not > Juergen> list this mapping at all since a TimeTicks64 is just an > Juergen> Unsigned64 and thus mapped as any other type derived from > Juergen> Unsigned64. > > I would prefer to keep TimeTicks64 in the list because it is defined > in the core NMRG-SMING module as stated in the first paragraph of that > section. Otherwise, readers would probably miss this type in the table. > I've added the "(2)" note. fine with me > Juergen> e) In the acknowledgements, you list the people who were in > Juergen> Kleinheubach except Keith. Is this an omission or did he > Juergen> not want to be listed? Shall we check with him again? > > No, it was my mistake not to list Keith. I've added his name. ack > Juergen> z) I think we should drop the reference to the SMIng to COPS-PR > Juergen> mapping document from the SMIng documents for the time being. > > Ok, I've removed the reference to the COPS-PR mapping document from > the core document (it was only one that referenced it) and I've changed > two places in its text accordingly: [...] Sounds good. > Ok, the three updated documents are available on the NMRG web page > and have just been submitted to the Internet Drafts maintainers to > get posted. Note that the numbers are still -05, -03, -03, since > the former revisions have not yet been posted. Thanks Frank. /js -- Juergen Schoenwaelder International University Bremen P.O. Box 750 561, 28725 Bremen, Germany Received: from hansa.ibr.cs.tu-bs.de (hansa.ibr.cs.tu-bs.de [134.169.34.81]) by agitator.ibr.cs.tu-bs.de (8.12.3/8.12.3/Debian-6.6) with ESMTP id h8JE31Yp018610 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=NO); Fri, 19 Sep 2003 16:03:01 +0200 Received: from hansa.ibr.cs.tu-bs.de (strauss@localhost [127.0.0.1]) by hansa.ibr.cs.tu-bs.de (8.12.3/8.12.3/Debian-6.4) with ESMTP id h8JE31HV030840; Fri, 19 Sep 2003 16:03:01 +0200 Received: (from strauss@localhost) by hansa.ibr.cs.tu-bs.de (8.12.3/8.12.3/Debian-6.4) id h8JE31Xc030837; Fri, 19 Sep 2003 16:03:01 +0200 From: Frank Strauss To: j.schoenwaelder@iu-bremen.de Cc: nmrg@ibr.cs.tu-bs.de Subject: Re: [nmrg] sming changes review References: <20030919130526.GA1564@iu-bremen.de> Date: 19 Sep 2003 16:03:01 +0200 In-Reply-To: <20030919130526.GA1564@iu-bremen.de> Message-ID: Lines: 72 User-Agent: Gnus/5.09 (Gnus v5.9.0) Emacs/21.2 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-IBRFilter-SpamReport: -29.5 () EMAIL_ATTRIBUTION,IN_REP_TO,REFERENCES,REPLY_WITH_QUOTES,USER_AGENT_GNUS_UA X-Scanned-By: MIMEDefang 2.24 (www . roaringpenguin . com / mimedefang) X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-28.6 required=5.0 tests=EMAIL_ATTRIBUTION,IN_REP_TO,RCVD_IN_OSIRUSOFT_COM, REFERENCES,REPLY_WITH_QUOTES,USER_AGENT_GNUS_UA autolearn=ham version=2.53 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) Sender: nmrg-admin@ibr.cs.tu-bs.de Errors-To: nmrg-admin@ibr.cs.tu-bs.de X-BeenThere: nmrg@ibr.cs.tu-bs.de X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Network Management Research Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Hi! Juergen Schoenwaelder writes: Juergen> I finally managed to check the July changes of the SMIng specs. Things Juergen> really look pretty good, just a few nits mostly related to the SNMP Juergen> mapping document : I've fixed your proposed changes. Below are just the issues where I have additional comments... Juergen> a) In the type mapping table in section 3, we may want to add Juergen> the note (2) to the TimeTicks64 mapping or even better not Juergen> list this mapping at all since a TimeTicks64 is just an Juergen> Unsigned64 and thus mapped as any other type derived from Juergen> Unsigned64. I would prefer to keep TimeTicks64 in the list because it is defined in the core NMRG-SMING module as stated in the first paragraph of that section. Otherwise, readers would probably miss this type in the table. I've added the "(2)" note. Juergen> e) In the acknowledgements, you list the people who were in Juergen> Kleinheubach except Keith. Is this an omission or did he Juergen> not want to be listed? Shall we check with him again? No, it was my mistake not to list Keith. I've added his name. Juergen> z) I think we should drop the reference to the SMIng to COPS-PR Juergen> mapping document from the SMIng documents for the time being. Ok, I've removed the reference to the COPS-PR mapping document from the core document (it was only one that referenced it) and I've changed two places in its text accordingly: applications. Companion documents contain o core modules that supply common SMIng definitions [Modules], o an SMIng language extension to define SNMP specific mappings of SMIng definitions in a way compatible to SMIv2 MIBs [SNMP], and - o an SMIng language extension to define COPS-PR specific mappings of - SMIng definition in a way compatible to SPPI PIBs [COPS-PR]. + Additional language extensions may be added in the future, e.g. to + define COPS-PR specific mappings of SMIng definition in a way + compatible to SPPI PIBs. ... Some possible extension applications are: - o The formal mappings of SMIng definitions into the SNMP [SNMP] and - COPS-PR [COPS-PR] frameworks are defined as SMIng extensions. + o The formal mapping of SMIng definitions into the SNMP [SNMP] + framework is defined as an SMIng extension. Other mappings may + follow in the future. ... Juergen> Frank, it would be nice if you can make the edits and post Juergen> the result as new IDs. I will then start a three week last Juergen> call on the NMRG list where we accept final comments. I will Juergen> also ask (and this time for the very last time) whether there Juergen> is someone interested in updating the COPS-PR mapping. Ok, the three updated documents are available on the NMRG web page and have just been submitted to the Internet Drafts maintainers to get posted. Note that the numbers are still -05, -03, -03, since the former revisions have not yet been posted. -frank Received: from merkur.iu-bremen.de (merkur.iu-bremen.de [212.201.44.27]) by agitator.ibr.cs.tu-bs.de (8.12.3/8.12.3/Debian-6.6) with ESMTP id h8JD5SYo031988 for ; Fri, 19 Sep 2003 15:05:28 +0200 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by merkur.iu-bremen.de (Postfix) with ESMTP id 32C8656040; Fri, 19 Sep 2003 15:05:27 +0200 (CEST) Received: from james (unknown [212.201.47.15]) by merkur.iu-bremen.de (Postfix) with ESMTP id 88E4556035; Fri, 19 Sep 2003 15:05:26 +0200 (CEST) Received: by james (Postfix, from userid 1000) id 7BC198517; Fri, 19 Sep 2003 15:05:26 +0200 (CEST) Date: Fri, 19 Sep 2003 15:05:26 +0200 From: Juergen Schoenwaelder To: nmrg@ibr.cs.tu-bs.de Message-ID: <20030919130526.GA1564@iu-bremen.de> Reply-To: j.schoenwaelder@iu-bremen.de Mail-Followup-To: nmrg@ibr.cs.tu-bs.de Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline User-Agent: Mutt/1.5.4i X-Virus-Scanned: by AMaViS 0.3.12pre8 X-IBRFilter-SpamReport: -6.4 () USER_AGENT_MUTT X-Scanned-By: MIMEDefang 2.24 (www . roaringpenguin . com / mimedefang) X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-5.8 required=5.0 tests=RCVD_IN_OSIRUSOFT_COM,USER_AGENT_MUTT autolearn=ham version=2.53 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) Subject: [nmrg] sming changes review Sender: nmrg-admin@ibr.cs.tu-bs.de Errors-To: nmrg-admin@ibr.cs.tu-bs.de X-BeenThere: nmrg@ibr.cs.tu-bs.de X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Network Management Research Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: I finally managed to check the July changes of the SMIng specs. Things really look pretty good, just a few nits mostly related to the SNMP mapping document : a) In the type mapping table in section 3, we may want to add the note (2) to the TimeTicks64 mapping or even better not list this mapping at all since a TimeTicks64 is just an Unsigned64 and thus mapped as any other type derived from Unsigned64. b) In section 4.4.4.2, change "concatination" to "concatenation". c) In section 4.4.4.5, change "refereneces" to "references". d) In section 4.7.8, we might want to refer to RFC 3418 explicitly, that is change: The compliance statement contained in the SNMPv2-MIB, converted to SMIng: to The compliance statement contained in the SNMPv2-MIB [RFC3418], converted to SMIng: e) In the acknowledgements, you list the people who were in Kleinheubach except Keith. Is this an omission or did he not want to be listed? Shall we check with him again? z) I think we should drop the reference to the SMIng to COPS-PR mapping document from the SMIng documents for the time being. Frank, it would be nice if you can make the edits and post the result as new IDs. I will then start a three week last call on the NMRG list where we accept final comments. I will also ask (and this time for the very last time) whether there is someone interested in updating the COPS-PR mapping. /js -- Juergen Schoenwaelder International University Bremen P.O. Box 750 561, 28725 Bremen, Germany Received: from hansa.ibr.cs.tu-bs.de (hansa.ibr.cs.tu-bs.de [134.169.34.81]) by agitator.ibr.cs.tu-bs.de (8.12.3/8.12.3/Debian-6.6) with ESMTP id h8I9NUYp020403 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=NO); Thu, 18 Sep 2003 11:23:30 +0200 Received: from hansa.ibr.cs.tu-bs.de (schoenw@localhost [127.0.0.1]) by hansa.ibr.cs.tu-bs.de (8.12.3/8.12.3/Debian-6.4) with ESMTP id h8I9NUHV031019; Thu, 18 Sep 2003 11:23:30 +0200 Received: (from schoenw@localhost) by hansa.ibr.cs.tu-bs.de (8.12.3/8.12.3/Debian-6.4) id h8I9NUZJ031016; Thu, 18 Sep 2003 11:23:30 +0200 Date: Thu, 18 Sep 2003 11:23:30 +0200 Message-Id: <200309180923.h8I9NUZJ031016@hansa.ibr.cs.tu-bs.de> From: Juergen Schoenwaelder To: nmrg@ibr.cs.tu-bs.de X-IBRFilter-SpamReport: 0 () X-Scanned-By: MIMEDefang 2.24 (www . roaringpenguin . com / mimedefang) X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.6 required=5.0 tests=RCVD_IN_OSIRUSOFT_COM version=2.53 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) Subject: [nmrg] XML-based Management of Networks and Services Sender: nmrg-admin@ibr.cs.tu-bs.de Errors-To: nmrg-admin@ibr.cs.tu-bs.de X-BeenThere: nmrg@ibr.cs.tu-bs.de X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Network Management Research Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: CALL FOR PAPERS IEEE COMMUNICATIONS MAGAZINE XML-based Management of Networks and Services Background The increasing dependence of society on the availability and the correct operation of the Internet demands for continuous improvement of Internet management technologies. Traditionally, Internet management is based on the Simple Network Management Protocol (SNMP), which defines the management information exchange between managers and agents. Within agents, the management information is organized in Management Information Bases (MIBs) and described according to the rules of the Structure of Management Information (SMI). Although several versions of SNMP, MIBs and the SMI exist, the basic concepts did not change since the first versions appeared nearly 15 years ago. At that time bandwidth was scarce and processing power of devices was limited. Although many years of experience proved that existing Internet management technology is well suited to monitor network devices, it also became clear that SNMP technology is hardly used for configuration management and management of higher level services. These management tasks still rely on proprietary and ad-hoc technologies. Currently, there is a growing interest in using XML technologies for management purposes. XML has the advantage that it is widely accepted, which means that there are many tools available that potentially support the implementation of management functions. In addition, the promise of XML is to facilitate the easy integration of different applications; something that is particularly important for the cooperation of network and service management applications. Scope of Expected Contributions It is the intention to present the state of the art and recent developments in XML based management in a feature issue of IEEE Communications Magazine. Authors are therefore invited to submit complete unpublished papers, which are not under review for any other conference or journal, in the following areas: - Architectures for XML based management - Management based on Web Services (SOAP, WSDL, ...) - Management information and data modeling using XML Schema - Translation from traditional information and data models to XML schemas or DTDs - Protocols for XML based management - Interworking between XML and traditional management systems - Secure management using the XML security framework - Application of generic XML technologies (XPath, RDF, XQuery, ...) for management - Implementation experiences and case-studies - Standardization activities (IETF, DMTF, ...) Submission Prospective authors should submit their manuscripts through Manuscript Central by November 15th. Please see for the author's guidelines. The following is the timetable for this feature topic publication: Submission Deadline: November 15, 2003 Acceptance Notifications: February 15, 2004 Final Manuscripts Due: April 15, 2004 Journal Publication: July 01, 2004 Guest Editors Olivier Festor LORIA - INRIA Lorraine 54602 Villers-lès-Nancy France Aiko Pras University of Twente 7500 AE Enschede The Netherlands Jürgen Schönwälder International University Bremen 28759 Bremen Germany /js -- Juergen Schoenwaelder International University Bremen P.O. Box 750 561, 28725 Bremen, Germany Received: from merkur.iu-bremen.de (merkur.iu-bremen.de [212.201.44.27]) by agitator.ibr.cs.tu-bs.de (8.12.3/8.12.3/Debian-6.4) with ESMTP id h8HGG69f031725 for ; Wed, 17 Sep 2003 18:16:06 +0200 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by merkur.iu-bremen.de (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8C5E755EE2; Wed, 17 Sep 2003 18:16:06 +0200 (CEST) Received: from james (unknown [212.201.47.15]) by merkur.iu-bremen.de (Postfix) with ESMTP id DB7AF48E95; Wed, 17 Sep 2003 18:16:05 +0200 (CEST) Received: by james (Postfix, from userid 1000) id B71AD8516; Wed, 17 Sep 2003 18:16:05 +0200 (CEST) Date: Wed, 17 Sep 2003 18:16:05 +0200 From: Juergen Schoenwaelder To: maui@loria.fr Cc: nmrg@ibr.cs.tu-bs.de Message-ID: <20030917161605.GC1256@iu-bremen.de> Reply-To: j.schoenwaelder@iu-bremen.de Mail-Followup-To: maui@loria.fr, nmrg@ibr.cs.tu-bs.de Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline User-Agent: Mutt/1.5.4i X-Virus-Scanned: by AMaViS 0.3.12pre8 X-IBRFilter-SpamReport: -6.4 () USER_AGENT_MUTT X-Scanned-By: MIMEDefang 2.24 (www . roaringpenguin . com / mimedefang) X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-5.8 required=5.0 tests=RCVD_IN_OSIRUSOFT_COM,USER_AGENT_MUTT autolearn=ham version=2.53 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) Subject: [nmrg] 14th NMRG meeting Sunday before DSOM 2003 Sender: nmrg-admin@ibr.cs.tu-bs.de Errors-To: nmrg-admin@ibr.cs.tu-bs.de X-BeenThere: nmrg@ibr.cs.tu-bs.de X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Network Management Research Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: The Network Management Research Group (NMRG) of the IRTF is organizing a meeting on Sunday, October 19th in Heidelberg just before the DSOM 2003 event. The meeting will take the form of a workshop, where people can present work they are doing (not longer than 20 minutes) followed by intense discussions (up to an hour time). The meeting will start at 11:00 and end around 17:00. The plan is to have a maximum of four topics to discuss during the day. The meeting is organized by Aiko Pras and myself. Right now, we already have two topics selected that will be on the agenda: 1) The performance of Web Services, compared to traditional SNMP In this topic we will discuss a web services (SOAP/WSDL) implementation that offers similar functionality as SNMP's IF-MIB. For retrieving data from the system, the implementation uses the same code as NET-SNMP. The performance of this implematation (CPU, memory, bandwidth) is compared to NET-SNMP. (Note: this topic fits in MAUI's WP2) 2) Measuring network traffic This topic discusses the measurements Remco van de Meent has performed on some high speed access links of the dutch research net (SURnet), as well as the campus net of the University of Twente. An important goal of these measurements is to find simple dimensioning rules. (Note: this topic fits in MAUI's WP4) There are some other proposed topics. But before making a final decision, we would like to invite MAUI people to participate and contribute to this workshop. In particular, if you have interested ongoing work which you would like to discuss in the meeting (typically a good chance for PhD students to get valuable feedback), please get in contact with me by the beginning of next week. If you just want to participate and get actively involved in the discussion, please drop me a note so that we can plan accordingly. Looking forward to see some of you at the NMRG meeting in Heidelberg. /js -- Juergen Schoenwaelder International University Bremen P.O. Box 750 561, 28725 Bremen, Germany Received: from zcars0m9.nortelnetworks.com (zcars0m9.nortelnetworks.com [47.129.242.157]) by agitator.ibr.cs.tu-bs.de (8.12.3/8.12.3/Debian-6.4) with ESMTP id h8EJNuwa016835 for ; Sun, 14 Sep 2003 21:23:56 +0200 Received: from zcard309.ca.nortel.com (zcard309.ca.nortel.com [47.129.242.69]) by zcars0m9.nortelnetworks.com (Switch-2.2.6/Switch-2.2.0) with ESMTP id h8EJNsq16809 for ; Sun, 14 Sep 2003 15:23:54 -0400 (EDT) Received: by zcard309.ca.nortel.com with Internet Mail Service (5.5.2653.19) id ; Sun, 14 Sep 2003 15:23:54 -0400 Message-ID: <3549C09B853DD5119B540002A52CDD340888E2DD@zcard0ka.ca.nortel.com> From: "Sharon Chisholm" To: nmrg@ibr.cs.tu-bs.de Subject: RE: [nmrg] nmrg meeting in october Date: Sun, 14 Sep 2003 15:23:52 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2653.19) Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----_=_NextPart_001_01C37AF5.BB6F591E" X-IBRFilter-SpamReport: -1.5 () HTML_20_30,HTML_MESSAGE,MAILTO_LINK,ORIGINAL_MESSAGE X-Scanned-By: MIMEDefang 2.24 (www . roaringpenguin . com / mimedefang) X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-1.9 required=5.0 tests=HTML_20_30,HTML_MESSAGE,ORIGINAL_MESSAGE version=2.53 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) Sender: nmrg-admin@ibr.cs.tu-bs.de Errors-To: nmrg-admin@ibr.cs.tu-bs.de X-BeenThere: nmrg@ibr.cs.tu-bs.de X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Network Management Research Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: This message is in MIME format. Since your mail reader does not understand this format, some or all of this message may not be legible. ------_=_NextPart_001_01C37AF5.BB6F591E Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" hi I'd be interested in hearing more about the MAUI proposal. It sounds like it might align with one of my interests. Can you make presentations and papers available on the website? [By the way, if you moved this to the 25th, I might be able to stop by on my way to Geneva, pending additional travel approval, but I definitely can't make the 19th.] Sharon -----Original Message----- From: Juergen Schoenwaelder [mailto:j.schoenwaelder@iu-bremen.de] Sent: Thursday, September 04, 2003 7:55 AM To: nmrg@ibr.cs.tu-bs.de Subject: [nmrg] nmrg meeting in october It was suggested to hold an NMRG meeting next to DSOM 2003 in October in Heidelberg, Germany. DSOM is on October 20-22 (Monday-Wednesday) followed by the NOMS 2004 TPC meeting (Wednesday-Friday). So the proposal is actually to have a one day NMRG meeting on Sunday before DSOM starts, that is on October 19th. NEC has already offered to host such an NMRG meeting. Aiko proposed to use the meeting as a kind of a workshop where people can present ongoing research work and get feedback. Perhaps it would make sense to also invite people from the MAUI project proposal (which did not succeed in the EU) to participate in order to broaden the set of contributors. I like this idea (especially when Aiko organizes this) but I would like to have some feedback from you: a) Would you be interested and able to attend an NMRG meeting on October 19 in Heidelberg, Germany? b) Do you think a workshop style is a good idea? c) If not, any alternate suggestions? d) Do you think it is OK to bring in more people from the MAUI proposal (which was a European project proposal to basically align activities and to integrate competence in the network management area)? Please answer quickly since we need to get the logistics going. Note that the early registration for DSOM ends September 15th. /js -- Juergen Schoenwaelder International University Bremen P.O. Box 750 561, 28725 Bremen, Germany -- !! This message is brought to you via the `nmrg' mailing list. !! Please do not reply to this message to unsubscribe. To unsubscribe or adjust !! your settings, send a mail message to !! or look at https://www.ibr.cs.tu-bs.de/mailman/listinfo/nmrg. ------_=_NextPart_001_01C37AF5.BB6F591E Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable RE: [nmrg] nmrg meeting in october

hi

I'd be interested in hearing more about the MAUI = proposal. It sounds like it might align with one of my interests. Can = you make presentations and papers available on the website?

[By the way, if you moved this to the 25th, I might = be able to stop by on my way to Geneva, pending additional travel = approval, but I definitely can't make the 19th.]

Sharon

-----Original Message-----
From: Juergen Schoenwaelder [mailto:j.schoenwaelder@iu-b= remen.de]
Sent: Thursday, September 04, 2003 7:55 AM
To: nmrg@ibr.cs.tu-bs.de
Subject: [nmrg] nmrg meeting in october


It was suggested to hold an NMRG meeting next to DSOM = 2003 in October in
Heidelberg, Germany. DSOM is on October 20-22 = (Monday-Wednesday)
followed by the NOMS 2004 TPC meeting = (Wednesday-Friday). So the
proposal is actually to have a one day NMRG meeting = on Sunday before
DSOM starts, that is on October 19th. NEC has = already offered to host
such an NMRG meeting.

Aiko proposed to use the meeting as a kind of a = workshop where people
can present ongoing research work and get feedback. = Perhaps it would
make sense to also invite people from the MAUI = project proposal (which
did not succeed in the EU) to participate in order = to broaden the set
of contributors. I like this idea (especially when = Aiko organizes this)
but I would like to have some feedback from = you:

a) Would you be interested and able to attend an NMRG = meeting on October
   19 in Heidelberg, Germany?

b) Do you think a workshop style is a good = idea?

c) If not, any alternate suggestions?

d) Do you think it is OK to bring in more people from = the MAUI proposal
   (which was a European project proposal = to basically align activities
   and to integrate competence in the = network management area)?

Please answer quickly since we need to get the = logistics going. Note
that the early registration for DSOM ends September = 15th.

/js

--
Juergen Schoenwaelder   =             = International University Bremen
<http://www.eecs.iu-bremen.de/> =     P.O. Box 750 561, 28725 Bremen, Germany
--
!! This message is brought to you via the `nmrg' = mailing list.
!! Please do not reply to this message to = unsubscribe. To unsubscribe or adjust
!! your settings, send a mail message to = <nmrg-request@ibr.cs.tu-bs.de>
!! or look at https://www.ibr.cs.tu-bs.de/mailman/listinfo/nmrg.=

------_=_NextPart_001_01C37AF5.BB6F591E-- Received: from ihemail2.firewall.lucent.com (ihemail2.lucent.com [192.11.222.163]) by agitator.ibr.cs.tu-bs.de (8.12.3/8.12.3/Debian-6.4) with ESMTP id h8DAEwwa006031 for ; Sat, 13 Sep 2003 12:14:58 +0200 Received: from nl0006exch001h.wins.lucent.com (h135-85-76-62.lucent.com [135.85.76.62]) by ihemail2.firewall.lucent.com (Switch-2.2.0/Switch-2.2.0) with ESMTP id h8DAEsB22443 for ; Sat, 13 Sep 2003 05:14:55 -0500 (CDT) Received: by nl0006exch001h.nl.lucent.com with Internet Mail Service (5.5.2656.59) id ; Sat, 13 Sep 2003 12:14:54 +0200 Message-ID: <7D5D48D2CAA3D84C813F5B154F43B15502331542@nl0006exch001u.nl.lucent.com> From: "Wijnen, Bert (Bert)" To: j.schoenwaelder@iu-bremen.de, nmrg@ibr.cs.tu-bs.de Subject: RE: [nmrg] nmrg meeting in october Date: Sat, 13 Sep 2003 12:14:52 +0200 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2656.59) Content-Type: text/plain X-IBRFilter-SpamReport: 0 () X-Scanned-By: MIMEDefang 2.24 (www . roaringpenguin . com / mimedefang) X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.6 required=5.0 tests=RCVD_IN_OSIRUSOFT_COM version=2.53 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) Sender: nmrg-admin@ibr.cs.tu-bs.de Errors-To: nmrg-admin@ibr.cs.tu-bs.de X-BeenThere: nmrg@ibr.cs.tu-bs.de X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Network Management Research Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Correction... seems I need to be in Chicago for n IESG meeting that week. So it looks as if I will not be able to participate. Thanks, Bert > -----Original Message----- > From: Wijnen, Bert (Bert) [mailto:bwijnen@lucent.com] > Sent: donderdag 4 september 2003 21:27 > To: 'Harrington, David'; j.schoenwaelder@iu-bremen.de; > nmrg@ibr.cs.tu-bs.de > Subject: RE: [nmrg] nmrg meeting in october > > > Topics look good to me. > Not sure I can attend. I probably need to drive or fly in > in the morning on Sunday. Seems to be some 4 hours or so. > so could get there around 11am maybe > > Thanks, > Bert Received: from merkur.iu-bremen.de (merkur.iu-bremen.de [212.201.44.27]) by agitator.ibr.cs.tu-bs.de (8.12.3/8.12.3/Debian-6.4) with ESMTP id h8A7g7m9009100 for ; Wed, 10 Sep 2003 09:42:07 +0200 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by merkur.iu-bremen.de (Postfix) with ESMTP id 780825565F; Wed, 10 Sep 2003 09:42:07 +0200 (CEST) Received: from james (unknown [212.201.47.15]) by merkur.iu-bremen.de (Postfix) with ESMTP id C8363180A5; Wed, 10 Sep 2003 09:42:06 +0200 (CEST) Received: by james (Postfix, from userid 1000) id B3E8B8513; Wed, 10 Sep 2003 09:42:05 +0200 (CEST) Date: Wed, 10 Sep 2003 09:42:05 +0200 From: Juergen Schoenwaelder To: nmrg@ibr.cs.tu-bs.de Message-ID: <20030910074205.GC1151@iu-bremen.de> Reply-To: j.schoenwaelder@iu-bremen.de Mail-Followup-To: nmrg@ibr.cs.tu-bs.de Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline User-Agent: Mutt/1.5.4i X-Virus-Scanned: by AMaViS 0.3.12pre8 X-IBRFilter-SpamReport: -6.4 () USER_AGENT_MUTT X-Scanned-By: MIMEDefang 2.24 (www . roaringpenguin . com / mimedefang) X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-6.4 required=5.0 tests=USER_AGENT_MUTT autolearn=ham version=2.53 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) Subject: [nmrg] nmrg meeting in october before dsom Sender: nmrg-admin@ibr.cs.tu-bs.de Errors-To: nmrg-admin@ibr.cs.tu-bs.de X-BeenThere: nmrg@ibr.cs.tu-bs.de X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Network Management Research Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: First, thanks to all who have send email to me that they will or will not attend an NMRG meeting on Sunday before DSOM. However, there are a number of people who did not react and I would really like to get a yes/no indication since it is time to get the meeting planning going. /js -- Juergen Schoenwaelder International University Bremen P.O. Box 750 561, 28725 Bremen, Germany Received: from sj-iport-3.cisco.com (sj-iport-3-in.cisco.com [171.71.176.72]) by agitator.ibr.cs.tu-bs.de (8.12.3/8.12.3/Debian-6.4) with ESMTP id h85KXpo3009938 for ; Fri, 5 Sep 2003 22:33:52 +0200 Received: from cisco.com (171.71.177.237) by sj-iport-3.cisco.com with ESMTP; 05 Sep 2003 13:33:51 -0700 Received: from mira-sjc5-b.cisco.com (IDENT:mirapoint@mira-sjc5-b.cisco.com [171.71.163.14]) by sj-core-1.cisco.com (8.12.9/8.12.6) with ESMTP id h85KXjQ0005112; Fri, 5 Sep 2003 13:33:49 -0700 (PDT) Received: from CSCOAMERA18391 ([128.107.168.82]) by mira-sjc5-b.cisco.com (Mirapoint Messaging Server MOS 3.3.6-GR) with ESMTP id ALF43653; Fri, 5 Sep 2003 13:23:24 -0700 (PDT) From: "Andrea Westerinen" To: , Subject: RE: [nmrg] nmrg meeting in october Date: Fri, 5 Sep 2003 13:33:32 -0700 Message-ID: <001f01c373ec$fb6a7540$52a86b80@amer.cisco.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook, Build 10.0.4024 In-Reply-To: <20030904115441.GB1088@iu-bremen.de> Importance: Normal X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4927.1200 X-IBRFilter-SpamReport: -12.8 () IN_REP_TO,ORIGINAL_MESSAGE,SIGNATURE_LONG_DENSE X-Scanned-By: MIMEDefang 2.24 (www . roaringpenguin . com / mimedefang) X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-12.1 required=5.0 tests=IN_REP_TO,ORIGINAL_MESSAGE,RCVD_IN_OSIRUSOFT_COM, SIGNATURE_LONG_DENSE autolearn=ham version=2.53 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) Sender: nmrg-admin@ibr.cs.tu-bs.de Errors-To: nmrg-admin@ibr.cs.tu-bs.de X-BeenThere: nmrg@ibr.cs.tu-bs.de X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Network Management Research Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Juergen, I cannot make the meeting since we have limited travel budget right now. The workshop idea sounds very good. Andrea -----Original Message----- From: nmrg-admin@ibr.cs.tu-bs.de [mailto:nmrg-admin@ibr.cs.tu-bs.de] On Behalf Of Juergen Schoenwaelder Sent: Thursday, September 04, 2003 4:55 AM To: nmrg@ibr.cs.tu-bs.de Subject: [nmrg] nmrg meeting in october It was suggested to hold an NMRG meeting next to DSOM 2003 in October in Heidelberg, Germany. DSOM is on October 20-22 (Monday-Wednesday) followed by the NOMS 2004 TPC meeting (Wednesday-Friday). So the proposal is actually to have a one day NMRG meeting on Sunday before DSOM starts, that is on October 19th. NEC has already offered to host such an NMRG meeting. Aiko proposed to use the meeting as a kind of a workshop where people can present ongoing research work and get feedback. Perhaps it would make sense to also invite people from the MAUI project proposal (which did not succeed in the EU) to participate in order to broaden the set of contributors. I like this idea (especially when Aiko organizes this) but I would like to have some feedback from you: a) Would you be interested and able to attend an NMRG meeting on October 19 in Heidelberg, Germany? b) Do you think a workshop style is a good idea? c) If not, any alternate suggestions? d) Do you think it is OK to bring in more people from the MAUI proposal (which was a European project proposal to basically align activities and to integrate competence in the network management area)? Please answer quickly since we need to get the logistics going. Note that the early registration for DSOM ends September 15th. /js -- Juergen Schoenwaelder International University Bremen P.O. Box 750 561, 28725 Bremen, Germany -- !! This message is brought to you via the `nmrg' mailing list. !! Please do not reply to this message to unsubscribe. To unsubscribe or adjust !! your settings, send a mail message to !! or look at https://www.ibr.cs.tu-bs.de/mailman/listinfo/nmrg. Received: from cosium01.intelliden.net (cosium01.intelliden.net [12.41.186.248]) by agitator.ibr.cs.tu-bs.de (8.12.3/8.12.3/Debian-6.4) with ESMTP id h85Cajo3014519 for ; Fri, 5 Sep 2003 14:36:46 +0200 Received: by cosium01.intelliden.net with Internet Mail Service (5.5.2653.19) id ; Fri, 5 Sep 2003 06:36:43 -0600 Message-ID: From: John Strassner To: j.schoenwaelder@iu-bremen.de, nmrg@ibr.cs.tu-bs.de Subject: RE: [nmrg] nmrg meeting in october Date: Fri, 5 Sep 2003 06:36:40 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2653.19) Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----_=_NextPart_001_01C373AA.5B452AC0" X-IBRFilter-SpamReport: -2.3 () HTML_30_40,HTML_MESSAGE,MAILTO_LINK,QUOTED_EMAIL_TEXT X-Scanned-By: MIMEDefang 2.24 (www . roaringpenguin . com / mimedefang) X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-2.3 required=5.0 tests=HTML_30_40,HTML_MESSAGE,QUOTED_EMAIL_TEXT autolearn=ham version=2.53 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) Sender: nmrg-admin@ibr.cs.tu-bs.de Errors-To: nmrg-admin@ibr.cs.tu-bs.de X-BeenThere: nmrg@ibr.cs.tu-bs.de X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Network Management Research Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: This message is in MIME format. Since your mail reader does not understand this format, some or all of this message may not be legible. ------_=_NextPart_001_01C373AA.5B452AC0 Content-Type: text/plain Hi there, I doubt that I can get travel approved to attend DSOM. However, I do think that the workshop idea is a good one - we just need to be careful to limit speaking times. I think that it is fine to bring MAUI people. regards, John John C. Strassner Chief Strategy Officer Intelliden Inc. 90 South Cascade Avenue Colorado Springs, CO 80906 USA phone: +1.791.785.0648 fax: +1.719.785.0644 email: john.strassner@intelliden.com > -----Original Message----- > From: Juergen Schoenwaelder [mailto:j.schoenwaelder@iu-bremen.de] > Sent: Thursday, September 04, 2003 5:55 AM > To: nmrg@ibr.cs.tu-bs.de > Subject: [nmrg] nmrg meeting in october > > It was suggested to hold an NMRG meeting next to DSOM 2003 in > October in > Heidelberg, Germany. DSOM is on October 20-22 (Monday-Wednesday) > followed by the NOMS 2004 TPC meeting (Wednesday-Friday). So the > proposal is actually to have a one day NMRG meeting on Sunday > before > DSOM starts, that is on October 19th. NEC has already offered to > host > such an NMRG meeting. > > Aiko proposed to use the meeting as a kind of a workshop where > people > can present ongoing research work and get feedback. Perhaps it > would > make sense to also invite people from the MAUI project proposal > (which > did not succeed in the EU) to participate in order to broaden the > set > of contributors. I like this idea (especially when Aiko organizes > this) > but I would like to have some feedback from you: > > a) Would you be interested and able to attend an NMRG meeting on > October > 19 in Heidelberg, Germany? > > b) Do you think a workshop style is a good idea? > > c) If not, any alternate suggestions? > > d) Do you think it is OK to bring in more people from the MAUI > proposal > (which was a European project proposal to basically align > activities > and to integrate competence in the network management area)? > > Please answer quickly since we need to get the logistics going. > Note > that the early registration for DSOM ends September 15th. > > /js > > -- > Juergen Schoenwaelder International University Bremen > P.O. Box 750 561, 28725 > Bremen, Germany > -- > !! This message is brought to you via the `nmrg' mailing list. > !! Please do not reply to this message to unsubscribe. To > unsubscribe or adjust > !! your settings, send a mail message to bs.de> > !! or look at https://www.ibr.cs.tu-bs.de/mailman/listinfo/nmrg. ------_=_NextPart_001_01C373AA.5B452AC0 Content-Type: text/html Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable RE: [nmrg] nmrg meeting in october

Hi there,

I doubt that I can get travel approved to attend = DSOM. However, I do think that the workshop idea is a good one - we = just need to be careful to limit speaking times.

I think that it is fine to bring MAUI people.

regards,
John

John C. Strassner
Chief Strategy Officer
Intelliden Inc.
90 South Cascade Avenue
Colorado Springs, CO  80906  USA
phone:  +1.791.785.0648
  fax:     = +1.719.785.0644
email:    = john.strassner@intelliden.com


> -----Original Message-----
> From: Juergen Schoenwaelder [mailto:j.schoenwaelder@iu-b= remen.de]
> Sent: Thursday, September 04, 2003 5:55 = AM
> To: nmrg@ibr.cs.tu-bs.de
> Subject: [nmrg] nmrg meeting in october
>
> It was suggested to hold an NMRG meeting next = to DSOM 2003 in
> October in
> Heidelberg, Germany. DSOM is on October 20-22 = (Monday-Wednesday)
> followed by the NOMS 2004 TPC meeting = (Wednesday-Friday). So the
> proposal is actually to have a one day NMRG = meeting on Sunday
> before
> DSOM starts, that is on October 19th. NEC has = already offered to
> host
> such an NMRG meeting.
>
> Aiko proposed to use the meeting as a kind of a = workshop where
> people
> can present ongoing research work and get = feedback. Perhaps it
> would
> make sense to also invite people from the MAUI = project proposal
> (which
> did not succeed in the EU) to participate in = order to broaden the
> set
> of contributors. I like this idea (especially = when Aiko organizes
> this)
> but I would like to have some feedback from = you:
>
> a) Would you be interested and able to attend = an NMRG meeting on
> October
>    19 in Heidelberg, = Germany?
>
> b) Do you think a workshop style is a good = idea?
>
> c) If not, any alternate suggestions?
>
> d) Do you think it is OK to bring in more = people from the MAUI
> proposal
>    (which was a European project = proposal to basically align
> activities
>    and to integrate competence = in the network management area)?
>
> Please answer quickly since we need to get the = logistics going.
> Note
> that the early registration for DSOM ends = September 15th.
>
> /js
>
> --
> Juergen Schoenwaelder =             = International University Bremen
> <http://www.eecs.iu-bremen.de/>   = ;        P.O. Box 750 561, 28725
> Bremen, Germany
> --
> !! This message is brought to you via the = `nmrg' mailing list.
> !! Please do not reply to this message to = unsubscribe. To
> unsubscribe or adjust
> !! your settings, send a mail message to = <nmrg-request@ibr.cs.tu-
> bs.de>
> !! or look at https://www.ibr.cs.tu-bs.de/mailman/listinfo/nmrg.=

------_=_NextPart_001_01C373AA.5B452AC0-- Received: from traminer.ibr.cs.tu-bs.de (traminer.ipv6.ibr.cs.tu-bs.de [IPv6:3ffe:400:90:10:208:74ff:fe47:31b8]) by agitator.ibr.cs.tu-bs.de (8.12.3/8.12.3/Debian-6.4) with ESMTP id h858c2o4013071 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=OK) for ; Fri, 5 Sep 2003 10:38:03 +0200 Received: from traminer.ibr.cs.tu-bs.de (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by traminer.ibr.cs.tu-bs.de (8.12.3/8.12.3/Debian-6.4) with ESMTP id h858c1OY002451 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=NO) for ; Fri, 5 Sep 2003 10:38:01 +0200 Received: (from wellnitz@localhost) by traminer.ibr.cs.tu-bs.de (8.12.3/8.12.3/Debian-6.4) id h858c1ks002450 for nmrg@ibr.cs.tu-bs.de; Fri, 5 Sep 2003 10:38:01 +0200 Date: Fri, 5 Sep 2003 10:38:01 +0200 From: Oliver Wellnitz To: nmrg@ibr.cs.tu-bs.de Subject: Re: [nmrg] nmrg meeting in october Message-ID: <20030905083801.GA867@tecq.org> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <20030904115441.GB1088@iu-bremen.de> User-Agent: Mutt/1.3.28i X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-25.9 required=5.0 tests=EMAIL_ATTRIBUTION,IN_REP_TO,QUOTED_EMAIL_TEXT, REPLY_WITH_QUOTES,USER_AGENT_MUTT autolearn=ham version=2.53 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) Sender: nmrg-admin@ibr.cs.tu-bs.de Errors-To: nmrg-admin@ibr.cs.tu-bs.de X-BeenThere: nmrg@ibr.cs.tu-bs.de X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Network Management Research Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Juergen Schoenwaelder wrote: > a) Would you be interested and able to attend an NMRG meeting on October > 19 in Heidelberg, Germany? Frank asked me to come along and I think it's a good idea. So, I plan to attend. As we also have a 4 hour trip to Heidelberg, I second the 11am idea :) Oliver Received: from ibr.cs.tu-bs.de (dagoba.ibr.cs.tu-bs.de [134.169.34.107]) (authenticated bits=0) by agitator.ibr.cs.tu-bs.de (8.12.3/8.12.3/Debian-6.4) with ESMTP id h84JrKo4026707 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=RC4-MD5 bits=128 verify=NO); Thu, 4 Sep 2003 21:53:21 +0200 Message-ID: <3F57982D.5060702@ibr.cs.tu-bs.de> Date: Thu, 04 Sep 2003 21:53:17 +0200 From: =?ISO-8859-1?Q?Frank_Strau=DF?= Organization: IBR, TU Braunschweig, Germany User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Macintosh; U; PPC Mac OS X Mach-O; en-US; rv:1.5a) Gecko/20030708 Thunderbird/0.1a X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: j.schoenwaelder@iu-bremen.de CC: nmrg@ibr.cs.tu-bs.de Subject: Re: [nmrg] nmrg meeting in october References: <20030904115441.GB1088@iu-bremen.de> In-Reply-To: <20030904115441.GB1088@iu-bremen.de> X-Enigmail-Version: 0.80.0.0 X-Enigmail-Supports: pgp-inline, pgp-mime Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-IBRFilter-SpamReport: -32.2 () EMAIL_ATTRIBUTION,IN_REP_TO,QUOTED_EMAIL_TEXT,REFERENCES,REPLY_WITH_QUOTES,USER_AGENT_MOZILLA_UA X-Scanned-By: MIMEDefang 2.24 (www . roaringpenguin . com / mimedefang) X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-31.9 required=5.0 tests=EMAIL_ATTRIBUTION,IN_REP_TO,QUOTED_EMAIL_TEXT,REFERENCES, REPLY_WITH_QUOTES,USER_AGENT_MOZILLA_UA autolearn=ham version=2.53 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) Sender: nmrg-admin@ibr.cs.tu-bs.de Errors-To: nmrg-admin@ibr.cs.tu-bs.de X-BeenThere: nmrg@ibr.cs.tu-bs.de X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Network Management Research Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Juergen Schoenwaelder wrote: > It was suggested to hold an NMRG meeting next to DSOM 2003 in October in > Heidelberg, Germany. DSOM is on October 20-22 (Monday-Wednesday) > followed by the NOMS 2004 TPC meeting (Wednesday-Friday). So the > proposal is actually to have a one day NMRG meeting on Sunday before > DSOM starts, that is on October 19th. NEC has already offered to host > such an NMRG meeting. > > Aiko proposed to use the meeting as a kind of a workshop where people > can present ongoing research work and get feedback. Perhaps it would > make sense to also invite people from the MAUI project proposal (which > did not succeed in the EU) to participate in order to broaden the set > of contributors. I like this idea (especially when Aiko organizes this) > but I would like to have some feedback from you: > > a) Would you be interested and able to attend an NMRG meeting on October > 19 in Heidelberg, Germany? Yes (interested and able to attend). > b) Do you think a workshop style is a good idea? If there is research work to present, it should be presented before it gets discussed. :-) In this sense, I'd like a workshop style, but reading material to prepare in advance is also important. > c) If not, any alternate suggestions? > d) Do you think it is OK to bring in more people from the MAUI proposal > (which was a European project proposal to basically align activities > and to integrate competence in the network management area)? I think we should care just a little about the activities/people ratio, where the numerator is more important than the denominator. I.e., I care more about the topics than the participants. Received: from auemail1.firewall.lucent.com (auemail1.lucent.com [192.11.223.161]) by agitator.ibr.cs.tu-bs.de (8.12.3/8.12.3/Debian-6.4) with ESMTP id h84JRGo3016032 for ; Thu, 4 Sep 2003 21:27:17 +0200 Received: from nl0006exch001h.wins.lucent.com (h135-85-76-62.lucent.com [135.85.76.62]) by auemail1.firewall.lucent.com (Switch-2.2.0/Switch-2.2.0) with ESMTP id h84JRCU07815 for ; Thu, 4 Sep 2003 14:27:13 -0500 (CDT) Received: by nl0006exch001h.nl.lucent.com with Internet Mail Service (5.5.2656.59) id ; Thu, 4 Sep 2003 21:27:10 +0200 Message-ID: <7D5D48D2CAA3D84C813F5B154F43B155023314CF@nl0006exch001u.nl.lucent.com> From: "Wijnen, Bert (Bert)" To: "'Harrington, David'" , j.schoenwaelder@iu-bremen.de, nmrg@ibr.cs.tu-bs.de Subject: RE: [nmrg] nmrg meeting in october Date: Thu, 4 Sep 2003 21:27:02 +0200 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2656.59) Content-Type: text/plain X-IBRFilter-SpamReport: -3.3 () QUOTED_EMAIL_TEXT X-Scanned-By: MIMEDefang 2.24 (www . roaringpenguin . com / mimedefang) X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-2.6 required=5.0 tests=QUOTED_EMAIL_TEXT,RCVD_IN_OSIRUSOFT_COM autolearn=ham version=2.53 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) Sender: nmrg-admin@ibr.cs.tu-bs.de Errors-To: nmrg-admin@ibr.cs.tu-bs.de X-BeenThere: nmrg@ibr.cs.tu-bs.de X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Network Management Research Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Topics look good to me. Not sure I can attend. I probably need to drive or fly in in the morning on Sunday. Seems to be some 4 hours or so. so could get there around 11am maybe Thanks, Bert > -----Original Message----- > From: Harrington, David [mailto:dbh@enterasys.com] > Sent: donderdag 4 september 2003 15:10 > To: j.schoenwaelder@iu-bremen.de; nmrg@ibr.cs.tu-bs.de > Subject: RE: [nmrg] nmrg meeting in october > > > Hi, > > I would be unlikely to attend. I don't plan to attend DSOM. If you > scheduled it next to IETF I would attend. > > dbh > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: Juergen Schoenwaelder [mailto:j.schoenwaelder@iu-bremen.de] > > Sent: Thursday, September 04, 2003 7:55 AM > > To: nmrg@ibr.cs.tu-bs.de > > Subject: [nmrg] nmrg meeting in october > > > > > > It was suggested to hold an NMRG meeting next to DSOM 2003 in > > October in > > Heidelberg, Germany. DSOM is on October 20-22 (Monday-Wednesday) > > followed by the NOMS 2004 TPC meeting (Wednesday-Friday). So the > > proposal is actually to have a one day NMRG meeting on Sunday before > > DSOM starts, that is on October 19th. NEC has already > offered to host > > such an NMRG meeting. > > > > Aiko proposed to use the meeting as a kind of a workshop > where people > > can present ongoing research work and get feedback. Perhaps it would > > make sense to also invite people from the MAUI project > proposal (which > > did not succeed in the EU) to participate in order to > broaden the set > > of contributors. I like this idea (especially when Aiko > > organizes this) > > but I would like to have some feedback from you: > > > > a) Would you be interested and able to attend an NMRG meeting > > on October > > 19 in Heidelberg, Germany? > > > > b) Do you think a workshop style is a good idea? > > > > c) If not, any alternate suggestions? > > > > d) Do you think it is OK to bring in more people from the > > MAUI proposal > > (which was a European project proposal to basically align > > activities > > and to integrate competence in the network management area)? > > > > Please answer quickly since we need to get the logistics going. Note > > that the early registration for DSOM ends September 15th. > > > > /js > > > > -- > > Juergen Schoenwaelder International > University Bremen > > P.O. Box 750 561, > > 28725 Bremen, Germany > > -- > > !! This message is brought to you via the `nmrg' mailing list. > > !! Please do not reply to this message to unsubscribe. To > > unsubscribe or adjust > > !! your settings, send a mail message to > > > > !! or look at https://www.ibr.cs.tu-bs.de/mailman/listinfo/nmrg. > > > > -- > !! This message is brought to you via the `nmrg' mailing list. > !! Please do not reply to this message to unsubscribe. To > unsubscribe or adjust > !! your settings, send a mail message to > > !! or look at https://www.ibr.cs.tu-bs.de/mailman/listinfo/nmrg. > Received: from ctron-dnm.enterasys.com (ctron-dnm.enterasys.com [12.25.1.120]) by agitator.ibr.cs.tu-bs.de (8.12.3/8.12.3/Debian-6.4) with ESMTP id h84D9to3015220 for ; Thu, 4 Sep 2003 15:09:56 +0200 Received: (from uucp@localhost) by ctron-dnm.enterasys.com (8.8.7/8.8.7) id JAA04712 for ; Thu, 4 Sep 2003 09:10:02 -0400 (EDT) Received: from nhrocavg2(134.141.79.124) by ctron-dnm.enterasys.com via smap (4.1) id xma004657; Thu, 4 Sep 03 09:09:43 -0400 Received: from NHROCCNC2.ets.enterasys.com ([134.141.79.122]) by NHROCAVG2 with InterScan Messaging Security Suite; Thu, 04 Sep 2003 09:09:34 -0400 Received: from nhrocmbx1 ([134.141.79.104]) by NHROCCNC2.ets.enterasys.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(5.0.2195.6713); Thu, 4 Sep 2003 09:09:34 -0400 Content-Class: urn:content-classes:message MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft Exchange V6.0.6375.0 Subject: RE: [nmrg] nmrg meeting in october Date: Thu, 4 Sep 2003 09:09:34 -0400 Message-ID: <6D745637A7E0F94DA070743C55CDA9BAEA9843@NHROCMBX1.ets.enterasys.com> Thread-Topic: [nmrg] nmrg meeting in october Thread-Index: AcNy27S+TqyIp9L+Tm6pJ+1nvfPr9wACbUUQ From: "Harrington, David" To: , X-OriginalArrivalTime: 04 Sep 2003 13:09:34.0236 (UTC) FILETIME=[C9087DC0:01C372E5] X-IBRFilter-SpamReport: -3.3 () QUOTED_EMAIL_TEXT X-Scanned-By: MIMEDefang 2.24 (www . roaringpenguin . com / mimedefang) Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by agitator.ibr.cs.tu-bs.de id h84D9to3015220 X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-3.2 required=5.0 tests=QUOTED_EMAIL_TEXT autolearn=ham version=2.53 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) Sender: nmrg-admin@ibr.cs.tu-bs.de Errors-To: nmrg-admin@ibr.cs.tu-bs.de X-BeenThere: nmrg@ibr.cs.tu-bs.de X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Network Management Research Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Hi, I would be unlikely to attend. I don't plan to attend DSOM. If you scheduled it next to IETF I would attend. dbh > -----Original Message----- > From: Juergen Schoenwaelder [mailto:j.schoenwaelder@iu-bremen.de] > Sent: Thursday, September 04, 2003 7:55 AM > To: nmrg@ibr.cs.tu-bs.de > Subject: [nmrg] nmrg meeting in october > > > It was suggested to hold an NMRG meeting next to DSOM 2003 in > October in > Heidelberg, Germany. DSOM is on October 20-22 (Monday-Wednesday) > followed by the NOMS 2004 TPC meeting (Wednesday-Friday). So the > proposal is actually to have a one day NMRG meeting on Sunday before > DSOM starts, that is on October 19th. NEC has already offered to host > such an NMRG meeting. > > Aiko proposed to use the meeting as a kind of a workshop where people > can present ongoing research work and get feedback. Perhaps it would > make sense to also invite people from the MAUI project proposal (which > did not succeed in the EU) to participate in order to broaden the set > of contributors. I like this idea (especially when Aiko > organizes this) > but I would like to have some feedback from you: > > a) Would you be interested and able to attend an NMRG meeting > on October > 19 in Heidelberg, Germany? > > b) Do you think a workshop style is a good idea? > > c) If not, any alternate suggestions? > > d) Do you think it is OK to bring in more people from the > MAUI proposal > (which was a European project proposal to basically align > activities > and to integrate competence in the network management area)? > > Please answer quickly since we need to get the logistics going. Note > that the early registration for DSOM ends September 15th. > > /js > > -- > Juergen Schoenwaelder International University Bremen > P.O. Box 750 561, > 28725 Bremen, Germany > -- > !! This message is brought to you via the `nmrg' mailing list. > !! Please do not reply to this message to unsubscribe. To > unsubscribe or adjust > !! your settings, send a mail message to > > !! or look at https://www.ibr.cs.tu-bs.de/mailman/listinfo/nmrg. > Received: from merkur.iu-bremen.de (merkur.iu-bremen.de [212.201.44.27]) by agitator.ibr.cs.tu-bs.de (8.12.3/8.12.3/Debian-6.4) with ESMTP id h84Bsio3010546 for ; Thu, 4 Sep 2003 13:54:44 +0200 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by merkur.iu-bremen.de (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2094548DDD; Thu, 4 Sep 2003 13:54:43 +0200 (CEST) Received: from james (unknown [212.201.47.15]) by merkur.iu-bremen.de (Postfix) with ESMTP id CF89748AA6; Thu, 4 Sep 2003 13:54:41 +0200 (CEST) Received: by james (Postfix, from userid 1000) id C527D8513; Thu, 4 Sep 2003 13:54:41 +0200 (CEST) Date: Thu, 4 Sep 2003 13:54:41 +0200 From: Juergen Schoenwaelder To: nmrg@ibr.cs.tu-bs.de Message-ID: <20030904115441.GB1088@iu-bremen.de> Reply-To: j.schoenwaelder@iu-bremen.de Mail-Followup-To: nmrg@ibr.cs.tu-bs.de Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline User-Agent: Mutt/1.5.4i X-Virus-Scanned: by AMaViS 0.3.12pre8 X-IBRFilter-SpamReport: -6.4 () USER_AGENT_MUTT X-Scanned-By: MIMEDefang 2.24 (www . roaringpenguin . com / mimedefang) X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-6.4 required=5.0 tests=USER_AGENT_MUTT autolearn=ham version=2.53 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) Subject: [nmrg] nmrg meeting in october Sender: nmrg-admin@ibr.cs.tu-bs.de Errors-To: nmrg-admin@ibr.cs.tu-bs.de X-BeenThere: nmrg@ibr.cs.tu-bs.de X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Network Management Research Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: It was suggested to hold an NMRG meeting next to DSOM 2003 in October in Heidelberg, Germany. DSOM is on October 20-22 (Monday-Wednesday) followed by the NOMS 2004 TPC meeting (Wednesday-Friday). So the proposal is actually to have a one day NMRG meeting on Sunday before DSOM starts, that is on October 19th. NEC has already offered to host such an NMRG meeting. Aiko proposed to use the meeting as a kind of a workshop where people can present ongoing research work and get feedback. Perhaps it would make sense to also invite people from the MAUI project proposal (which did not succeed in the EU) to participate in order to broaden the set of contributors. I like this idea (especially when Aiko organizes this) but I would like to have some feedback from you: a) Would you be interested and able to attend an NMRG meeting on October 19 in Heidelberg, Germany? b) Do you think a workshop style is a good idea? c) If not, any alternate suggestions? d) Do you think it is OK to bring in more people from the MAUI proposal (which was a European project proposal to basically align activities and to integrate competence in the network management area)? Please answer quickly since we need to get the logistics going. Note that the early registration for DSOM ends September 15th. /js -- Juergen Schoenwaelder International University Bremen P.O. Box 750 561, 28725 Bremen, Germany