From tools-discuss-bounces@ietf.org Wed Jun 01 08:12:24 2005 Received: from localhost.localdomain ([127.0.0.1] helo=megatron.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1DdS5A-0003gL-BL; Wed, 01 Jun 2005 08:12:24 -0400 Received: from odin.ietf.org ([132.151.1.176] helo=ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1DdS58-0003g7-8z for tools-discuss@megatron.ietf.org; Wed, 01 Jun 2005 08:12:22 -0400 Received: from ietf-mx.ietf.org (ietf-mx.ietf.org [132.151.6.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id IAA10855 for ; Wed, 1 Jun 2005 08:12:18 -0400 (EDT) Received: from mtagate2.uk.ibm.com ([195.212.29.135]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.33) id 1DdSOv-00082i-Sa for tools-discuss@ietf.org; Wed, 01 Jun 2005 08:32:51 -0400 Received: from d06nrmr1407.portsmouth.uk.ibm.com (d06nrmr1407.portsmouth.uk.ibm.com [9.149.38.185]) by mtagate2.uk.ibm.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id j51CCBhW199948 for ; Wed, 1 Jun 2005 12:12:11 GMT Received: from d06av03.portsmouth.uk.ibm.com (d06av03.portsmouth.uk.ibm.com [9.149.37.213]) by d06nrmr1407.portsmouth.uk.ibm.com (8.12.10/NCO/VER6.6) with ESMTP id j51CCBEj283326 for ; Wed, 1 Jun 2005 13:12:11 +0100 Received: from d06av03.portsmouth.uk.ibm.com (loopback [127.0.0.1]) by d06av03.portsmouth.uk.ibm.com (8.12.11/8.13.3) with ESMTP id j51CCAQV023325 for ; Wed, 1 Jun 2005 13:12:10 +0100 Received: from sihl.zurich.ibm.com (sihl.zurich.ibm.com [9.4.16.232]) by d06av03.portsmouth.uk.ibm.com (8.12.11/8.12.11) with ESMTP id j51CCAeZ023317; Wed, 1 Jun 2005 13:12:10 +0100 Received: from zurich.ibm.com (sig-9-145-130-137.de.ibm.com [9.145.130.137]) by sihl.zurich.ibm.com (AIX4.3/8.9.3p2/8.9.3) with ESMTP id OAA66572; Wed, 1 Jun 2005 14:12:09 +0200 Message-ID: <429DA616.9090202@zurich.ibm.com> Date: Wed, 01 Jun 2005 14:12:06 +0200 From: Brian E Carpenter Organization: IBM User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.1; en-US; rv:1.6) Gecko/20040113 X-Accept-Language: en, fr, de MIME-Version: 1.0 To: tools-discuss@ietf.org Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="------------010308050607080201020209" X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 92df29fa99cf13e554b84c8374345c17 Cc: Ray Pelletier Subject: [Tools-discuss] IETF Dashboard? X-BeenThere: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF Tools Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: tools-discuss-bounces@ietf.org Errors-To: tools-discuss-bounces@ietf.org This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --------------010308050607080201020209 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Ray has made the comment that, for him, a very high priority is to have an overview of where the various processes are - kind of like the dashboard at the URL below. I agree; does this seem like something the tools team should look at? Brian -------- Original Message -------- Subject: VDOT Project Dashboard Date: Wed, 01 Jun 2005 06:15:59 -0400 From: Ray Pelletier To: Brian E Carpenter CC: Ray Pelletier , Ray http://dashboard.virginiadot.org/ A Dashboard example Allows one to drill down into data for transparency Useful for PMs, Supervisors, Public Useful tool for I-D Tracker, RFC Editor. Did you ever see Metaphor - a company bought by IBM decades ago? A Red, Yellow, Green system overlaying data and rules allowing poeple at all levels to manage by exception. Green - w/in normal limits (timeline/charter/Auth48) Yellow - just outside normal limits by rule, say, 10% late Red - late, requiring attention Kind of an aging of accounts w/ slice and dice by AD, WG, Authors, Editor, I-D ... etc Cradle to grave ray -- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - Brian E Carpenter IETF Chair Distinguished Engineer, Internet Standards & Technology, IBM --------------010308050607080201020209 Content-Type: text/x-vcard; name="rpelletier.vcf" Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="rpelletier.vcf" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit begin:vcard fn:Ray Pelletier n:Pelletier;Ray email;internet:rpelletier@patriot.net tel;work:703.777.8987 tel;fax:703.779.7463 version:2.1 end:vcard --------------010308050607080201020209 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline _______________________________________________ Tools-discuss mailing list Tools-discuss@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/tools-discuss --------------010308050607080201020209-- From tools-discuss-bounces@ietf.org Wed Jun 01 15:41:09 2005 Received: from localhost.localdomain ([127.0.0.1] helo=megatron.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1DdZ5R-0007AO-5m; Wed, 01 Jun 2005 15:41:09 -0400 Received: from odin.ietf.org ([132.151.1.176] helo=ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1DdZ5P-00079U-Tm for tools-discuss@megatron.ietf.org; Wed, 01 Jun 2005 15:41:08 -0400 Received: from ietf-mx.ietf.org (ietf-mx.ietf.org [132.151.6.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id PAA20308 for ; Wed, 1 Jun 2005 15:41:05 -0400 (EDT) Received: from av11-2-sn2.hy.skanova.net ([81.228.8.184]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.33) id 1DdZPG-0006So-HY for tools-discuss@ietf.org; Wed, 01 Jun 2005 16:01:41 -0400 Received: by av11-2-sn2.hy.skanova.net (Postfix, from userid 502) id 5040A38230; Wed, 1 Jun 2005 21:40:52 +0200 (CEST) Received: from smtp4-2-sn2.hy.skanova.net (smtp4-2-sn2.hy.skanova.net [81.228.8.93]) by av11-2-sn2.hy.skanova.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3FB9438213; Wed, 1 Jun 2005 21:40:52 +0200 (CEST) Received: from shiraz.levkowetz.com (81-224-201-50-no45.tbcn.telia.com [81.224.201.50]) by smtp4-2-sn2.hy.skanova.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id D5E1237E43; Wed, 1 Jun 2005 21:40:51 +0200 (CEST) Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]) by shiraz.levkowetz.com with esmtp (Exim 4.50) id 1DdZ59-0004K8-EN; Wed, 01 Jun 2005 21:40:51 +0200 Message-ID: <429E0F3F.2070403@levkowetz.com> Date: Wed, 01 Jun 2005 21:40:47 +0200 From: Henrik Levkowetz User-Agent: Mozilla Thunderbird 1.0.2 (Macintosh/20050317) X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Brian E Carpenter Subject: Re: [Tools-discuss] IETF Dashboard? References: <429DA616.9090202@zurich.ibm.com> In-Reply-To: <429DA616.9090202@zurich.ibm.com> X-Enigmail-Version: 0.89.5.0 X-Enigmail-Supports: pgp-inline, pgp-mime Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-SA-Exim-Connect-IP: 127.0.0.1 X-SA-Exim-Mail-From: henrik@levkowetz.com X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No (on shiraz.levkowetz.com); SAEximRunCond expanded to false X-Spam-Score: 0.1 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 73734d43604d52d23b3eba644a169745 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Cc: Ray Pelletier , tools-discuss@ietf.org X-BeenThere: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF Tools Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: tools-discuss-bounces@ietf.org Errors-To: tools-discuss-bounces@ietf.org Hi Brian, Ray, This seems related to (but not the same as) an idea I had of putting a timeline on each draft summary page (pages of the type found if you drill down under http://tools.ietf.org/wg/ ). The timeline would show when each new versions of a draft had appeared, and thereby the interval between them, with the interval having a colour changing gradually from green through yellow, orange to red, depending on the length of the interval between each update. This would give a clear colour indication of the rate of progress of individual drafts. I had not taken the next step of considering aggregating this for work-groups, but maybe that could also be done. But enough of that. Regarding the dashboard idea: To the extent we can set numbers on our processes, it would be interesting to implement something similar to the dashboard idea for the IETF - but since a lot of work done here is volunteer work, some parts of the processes may be sensitive to trying to enforce too much management by numbers. With this caveat, I think this is a good idea. I have not yet tried to assess where in our (the tools team's) line-up of tools this would fit in, in overall perceived importance. There's also the consideration that this does not seem to be a heavily IETF-specific administrative tool - meaning that it could be a good idea to explore the possible existence of tools already available that could be adapted to IETF use. During the next week I think I could find time to look around for existing open-source tools in this area, if you believe that would be meaningful. Henrik On 2005-06-01 14:12 Brian E Carpenter said the following: > Ray has made the comment that, for him, a very high priority > is to have an overview of where the various processes > are - kind of like the dashboard at the URL below. I agree; > does this seem like something the tools team should look at? > > Brian > > -------- Original Message -------- > Subject: VDOT Project Dashboard > Date: Wed, 01 Jun 2005 06:15:59 -0400 > From: Ray Pelletier > To: Brian E Carpenter > CC: Ray Pelletier , Ray > > http://dashboard.virginiadot.org/ > A Dashboard example > Allows one to drill down into data for transparency > Useful for PMs, Supervisors, Public > > Useful tool for I-D Tracker, RFC Editor. > > Did you ever see Metaphor - a company bought by IBM decades ago? > A Red, Yellow, Green system overlaying data and rules allowing poeple at > all levels to manage by exception. > > Green - w/in normal limits (timeline/charter/Auth48) > Yellow - just outside normal limits by rule, say, 10% late > Red - late, requiring attention > > Kind of an aging of accounts w/ slice and dice by AD, WG, Authors, > Editor, I-D ... etc > Cradle to grave > ray > > > > > > > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > > _______________________________________________ > Tools-discuss mailing list > Tools-discuss@ietf.org > https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/tools-discuss _______________________________________________ Tools-discuss mailing list Tools-discuss@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/tools-discuss From tools-discuss-bounces@ietf.org Thu Jun 02 08:12:13 2005 Received: from localhost.localdomain ([127.0.0.1] helo=megatron.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1DdoYX-0008K6-6U; Thu, 02 Jun 2005 08:12:13 -0400 Received: from odin.ietf.org ([132.151.1.176] helo=ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1DdoYV-0008K0-Rf for tools-discuss@megatron.ietf.org; Thu, 02 Jun 2005 08:12:11 -0400 Received: from ietf-mx.ietf.org (ietf-mx.ietf.org [132.151.6.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id IAA07980 for ; Thu, 2 Jun 2005 08:12:08 -0400 (EDT) Received: from mtagate4.uk.ibm.com ([195.212.29.137]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.33) id 1DdosU-0001GB-7r for tools-discuss@ietf.org; Thu, 02 Jun 2005 08:32:51 -0400 Received: from d06nrmr1407.portsmouth.uk.ibm.com (d06nrmr1407.portsmouth.uk.ibm.com [9.149.38.185]) by mtagate4.uk.ibm.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id j52CBxCD306462 for ; Thu, 2 Jun 2005 12:11:59 GMT Received: from d06av03.portsmouth.uk.ibm.com (d06av03.portsmouth.uk.ibm.com [9.149.37.213]) by d06nrmr1407.portsmouth.uk.ibm.com (8.12.10/NCO/VER6.6) with ESMTP id j52CBxeI273720 for ; Thu, 2 Jun 2005 13:11:59 +0100 Received: from d06av03.portsmouth.uk.ibm.com (loopback [127.0.0.1]) by d06av03.portsmouth.uk.ibm.com (8.12.11/8.13.3) with ESMTP id j52CBwEA007396 for ; Thu, 2 Jun 2005 13:11:58 +0100 Received: from sihl.zurich.ibm.com (sihl.zurich.ibm.com [9.4.16.232]) by d06av03.portsmouth.uk.ibm.com (8.12.11/8.12.11) with ESMTP id j52CBw5L007385 for ; Thu, 2 Jun 2005 13:11:58 +0100 Received: from zurich.ibm.com (sig-9-146-220-72.de.ibm.com [9.146.220.72]) by sihl.zurich.ibm.com (AIX4.3/8.9.3p2/8.9.3) with ESMTP id OAA70666 for ; Thu, 2 Jun 2005 14:11:57 +0200 Message-ID: <429EF78A.8080709@zurich.ibm.com> Date: Thu, 02 Jun 2005 14:11:54 +0200 From: Brian E Carpenter Organization: IBM User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.1; en-US; rv:1.6) Gecko/20040113 X-Accept-Language: en, fr, de MIME-Version: 1.0 To: tools-discuss@ietf.org Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Scan-Signature: cf4fa59384e76e63313391b70cd0dd25 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: [Tools-discuss] draft-ietf-tools-draft-submission-09.txt X-BeenThere: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF Tools Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: tools-discuss-bounces@ietf.org Errors-To: tools-discuss-bounces@ietf.org The final IESG discuss has been cleared and this draft is now approved for Informational RFC (the official announcement will follow). There was a compromise change to the paragraph about open source, following IESG comments. Thanks once again to Alex and all those who contributed. Now, that was the *easy* part. Since the IAD is now operational, the implementation phase is in his scope - and we need a clear decision about resources and priority for getting this done. Brian _______________________________________________ Tools-discuss mailing list Tools-discuss@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/tools-discuss From tools-discuss-bounces@ietf.org Wed Jun 08 12:21:51 2005 Received: from localhost.localdomain ([127.0.0.1] helo=megatron.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1Dg3JP-0007c4-3Y; Wed, 08 Jun 2005 12:21:51 -0400 Received: from odin.ietf.org ([132.151.1.176] helo=ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1Dg3JN-0007ba-N5; Wed, 08 Jun 2005 12:21:49 -0400 Received: from ietf-mx.ietf.org (ietf-mx.ietf.org [132.151.6.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id MAA14172; Wed, 8 Jun 2005 12:21:47 -0400 (EDT) Received: from mail-dark.research.att.com ([192.20.225.112] helo=mail-yellow.research.att.com) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.33) id 1Dg3ef-00007C-Lu; Wed, 08 Jun 2005 12:43:49 -0400 Received: from bright.research.att.com (bright.research.att.com [135.207.20.189]) by mail-green.research.att.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1E85BA7B83; Wed, 8 Jun 2005 12:21:40 -0400 (EDT) Received: (from fenner@localhost) by bright.research.att.com (8.12.11/8.12.10/Submit) id j58GLeNO029362; Wed, 8 Jun 2005 12:21:40 -0400 Message-Id: <200506081621.j58GLeNO029362@bright.research.att.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII To: tools-discuss@ietf.org Date: Wed, 8 Jun 2005 12:21:39 -0400 From: Bill Fenner Versions: dmail (linux) 2.6d/makemail 2.10 X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 10d3e4e3c32e363f129e380e644649be Subject: [Tools-discuss] FYI: Document Action: 'Requirements for an IETF Draft Submission Toolset' to Informational RFC X-BeenThere: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF Tools Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: tools-discuss-bounces@ietf.org Errors-To: tools-discuss-bounces@ietf.org ----- Begin forwarded message: From: The IESG Subject: Document Action: 'Requirements for an IETF Draft Submission Toolset' to Informational RFC Date: Thu, 02 Jun 2005 09:55:56 -0400 To: IETF-Announce Cc: Internet Architecture Board , RFC Editor The IESG has approved the following document: - 'Requirements for an IETF Draft Submission Toolset ' as an Informational RFC This document has been reviewed in the IETF but is not the product of an IETF Working Group. The IESG contact person is Brian Carpenter. Technical Summary This document specifies requirements for a toolset to support Internet-Draft submission, validation and posting. TOOLS Team Summary This is the result of discussion in the TOOLS team and significant public comment during IETF Last Call. The requirements and their priorities represent rough consensus among the participants. Technical Quality Brian Carpenter reviewed the specification. It has not been implemented but appears to be implementable. Note to RFC Editor In Section 6. Overall Toolset operation: OLD: The Toolset sources should be publicly available (R152/b) under a license certified by the Open Source Initiative [OSI] (R144/a), with an interface to report bugs and request enhancements (R145/b). These requirements are meant to enable the Toolset transfer from one management team to another and to allow for public review and contribution. To meaningfully satisfy these availability requirements, the Toolset has to implement the required functionality without relying on software with different availability conditions. NEW: It must be possible to transfer the Toolset from one management team to another, to incorporate work by volunteers, and to allow for public review of the developed code. To meet these goals, the Toolset source codes should be publicly available (R152/b) and there should be an interface to report bugs and request enhancements (R145/b). Development should be structured to avoid lock-in to proprietary platforms or backends. The tools team believes that developing the Toolset sources under one or more open source licenses following the Open Source Definition [OSD] would provide an effective way of meeting these requirements at reasonable cost. Care should be taken that the licenses selected allow code from different implementers to be mixed. Under Informative References: OLD: [OSI] "Open Source Licenses Approved by the Open Source Initiative", 2004. NEW: [OSD] "The Open Source Definition, version 1.9", Open Source Initiative, 2005, available at http://www.opensource.org/docs/definition.php _______________________________________________ IETF-Announce mailing list IETF-Announce@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ietf-announce ----- End forwarded message: _______________________________________________ Tools-discuss mailing list Tools-discuss@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/tools-discuss From tools-discuss-bounces@ietf.org Thu Jun 09 07:52:53 2005 Received: from localhost.localdomain ([127.0.0.1] helo=megatron.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1DgLaf-0000ux-0P; Thu, 09 Jun 2005 07:52:53 -0400 Received: from odin.ietf.org ([132.151.1.176] helo=ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1DgLac-0000us-S5 for tools-discuss@megatron.ietf.org; Thu, 09 Jun 2005 07:52:50 -0400 Received: from ietf-mx.ietf.org (ietf-mx [132.151.6.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id HAA17756 for ; Thu, 9 Jun 2005 07:52:49 -0400 (EDT) Received: from mtagate1.de.ibm.com ([195.212.29.150]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.33) id 1DgLw4-00064T-Ri for tools-discuss@ietf.org; Thu, 09 Jun 2005 08:15:01 -0400 Received: from d12nrmr1607.megacenter.de.ibm.com (d12nrmr1607.megacenter.de.ibm.com [9.149.167.49]) by mtagate1.de.ibm.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id j59BqbFu182970 for ; Thu, 9 Jun 2005 11:52:37 GMT Received: from d12av01.megacenter.de.ibm.com (d12av01.megacenter.de.ibm.com [9.149.165.212]) by d12nrmr1607.megacenter.de.ibm.com (8.12.10/NCO/VER6.6) with ESMTP id j59BqaGc183192 for ; Thu, 9 Jun 2005 13:52:36 +0200 Received: from d12av01.megacenter.de.ibm.com (loopback [127.0.0.1]) by d12av01.megacenter.de.ibm.com (8.12.11/8.13.3) with ESMTP id j59BqaYq025397 for ; Thu, 9 Jun 2005 13:52:36 +0200 Received: from sihl.zurich.ibm.com (sihl.zurich.ibm.com [9.4.16.232]) by d12av01.megacenter.de.ibm.com (8.12.11/8.12.11) with ESMTP id j59BqaAd025390; Thu, 9 Jun 2005 13:52:36 +0200 Received: from zurich.ibm.com (sig-9-145-132-161.de.ibm.com [9.145.132.161]) by sihl.zurich.ibm.com (AIX4.3/8.9.3p2/8.9.3) with ESMTP id NAA70752; Thu, 9 Jun 2005 13:52:35 +0200 Message-ID: <42A82D82.2010205@zurich.ibm.com> Date: Thu, 09 Jun 2005 13:52:34 +0200 From: Brian E Carpenter Organization: IBM User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.1; en-US; rv:1.6) Gecko/20040113 X-Accept-Language: en, fr, de MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Bill Fenner Subject: Re: [Tools-discuss] FYI: Document Action: 'Requirements for an IETF Draft Submission Toolset' to Informational RFC References: <200506081621.j58GLeNO029362@bright.research.att.com> In-Reply-To: <200506081621.j58GLeNO029362@bright.research.att.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 6e922792024732fb1bb6f346e63517e4 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Cc: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-BeenThere: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF Tools Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: tools-discuss-bounces@ietf.org Errors-To: tools-discuss-bounces@ietf.org I thought I already forwarded it here. Note that the new IAD will have the interesting task of making sure somebody implements it... Brian Bill Fenner wrote: > ----- Begin forwarded message: > > From: The IESG > Subject: Document Action: 'Requirements for an IETF Draft Submission > Toolset' to Informational RFC > Date: Thu, 02 Jun 2005 09:55:56 -0400 > To: IETF-Announce > Cc: Internet Architecture Board , RFC Editor > > > The IESG has approved the following document: > > - 'Requirements for an IETF Draft Submission Toolset ' > as an Informational RFC > > This document has been reviewed in the IETF but is not the product of an > IETF Working Group. > > The IESG contact person is Brian Carpenter. > > Technical Summary > > This document specifies requirements for a toolset to support Internet-Draft > submission, validation and posting. > > TOOLS Team Summary > > This is the result of discussion in the TOOLS team and significant public > comment during IETF Last Call. The requirements and their priorities > represent > rough consensus among the participants. > > Technical Quality > > Brian Carpenter reviewed the specification. It has not been implemented but > appears to be implementable. > > Note to RFC Editor > > In Section 6. Overall Toolset operation: > > OLD: > > The Toolset sources should be publicly available (R152/b) under a > license certified by the Open Source Initiative [OSI] (R144/a), with > an interface to report bugs and request enhancements (R145/b). These > requirements are meant to enable the Toolset transfer from one > management team to another and to allow for public review and > contribution. To meaningfully satisfy these availability > requirements, the Toolset has to implement the required functionality > without relying on software with different availability conditions. > > NEW: > > It must be possible to transfer the Toolset from one management > team to another, to incorporate work by volunteers, and to allow > for public review of the developed code. To meet these goals, the Toolset > source codes should be publicly available (R152/b) and there > should be an interface to report bugs and request enhancements (R145/b). > Development should be structured to avoid lock-in to proprietary > platforms or backends. The tools team believes that developing > the Toolset sources under one or more open source licenses > following the Open Source Definition [OSD] would provide an > effective way of meeting these requirements at reasonable > cost. Care should be taken that the licenses selected allow code > from different implementers to be mixed. > > Under Informative References: > > OLD: > > [OSI] "Open Source Licenses Approved by the Open Source > Initiative", 2004. > > NEW: > > [OSD] "The Open Source Definition, version 1.9", Open > Source Initiative, 2005, available at > http://www.opensource.org/docs/definition.php > > > _______________________________________________ > IETF-Announce mailing list > IETF-Announce@ietf.org > https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ietf-announce > > ----- End forwarded message: > > _______________________________________________ > Tools-discuss mailing list > Tools-discuss@ietf.org > https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/tools-discuss > _______________________________________________ Tools-discuss mailing list Tools-discuss@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/tools-discuss From tools-discuss-bounces@ietf.org Fri Jun 17 06:00:48 2005 Received: from localhost.localdomain ([127.0.0.1] helo=megatron.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1DjDea-0001Pj-R4; Fri, 17 Jun 2005 06:00:48 -0400 Received: from odin.ietf.org ([132.151.1.176] helo=ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1DjDeZ-0001Pb-5T for tools-discuss@megatron.ietf.org; Fri, 17 Jun 2005 06:00:47 -0400 Received: from ietf-mx.ietf.org (ietf-mx [132.151.6.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id GAA00821 for ; Fri, 17 Jun 2005 06:00:44 -0400 (EDT) Received: from av9-2-sn3.vrr.skanova.net ([81.228.9.186]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.33) id 1DjE1c-0006IT-Tg for tools-discuss@ietf.org; Fri, 17 Jun 2005 06:24:38 -0400 Received: by av9-2-sn3.vrr.skanova.net (Postfix, from userid 502) id 81A56382D0; Fri, 17 Jun 2005 12:00:29 +0200 (CEST) Received: from smtp3-2-sn3.vrr.skanova.net (smtp3-2-sn3.vrr.skanova.net [81.228.9.102]) by av9-2-sn3.vrr.skanova.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5ABAE382CD; Fri, 17 Jun 2005 12:00:29 +0200 (CEST) Received: from shiraz.levkowetz.com (81-224-201-50-no45.tbcn.telia.com [81.224.201.50]) by smtp3-2-sn3.vrr.skanova.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 410A437E47; Fri, 17 Jun 2005 12:00:29 +0200 (CEST) Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1] ident=henrik) by shiraz.levkowetz.com with esmtp (Exim 4.50) id 1DjDeG-0003rm-N8; Fri, 17 Jun 2005 12:00:28 +0200 Message-ID: <42B29F3B.4040107@levkowetz.com> Date: Fri, 17 Jun 2005 12:00:27 +0200 From: Henrik Levkowetz User-Agent: Mozilla Thunderbird 1.0.2 (Macintosh/20050317) X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Tools Discussion References: <200506161318.27560.blilly@erols.com> <200506161453.21289.blilly@erols.com> <42B1D559.5050402@levkowetz.com> <200506161900.15564.blilly@erols.com> In-Reply-To: <200506161900.15564.blilly@erols.com> X-Enigmail-Version: 0.89.5.0 X-Enigmail-Supports: pgp-inline, pgp-mime Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-SA-Exim-Connect-IP: 127.0.0.1 X-SA-Exim-Mail-From: henrik@levkowetz.com X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No (on shiraz.levkowetz.com); SAEximRunCond expanded to false X-Spam-Score: 0.1 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 2409bba43e9c8d580670fda8b695204a Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Cc: Bruce Lilly Subject: [Tools-discuss] Re: more idnits suggestions X-BeenThere: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF Tools Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: tools-discuss-bounces@ietf.org Errors-To: tools-discuss-bounces@ietf.org Hi, A new version of idnits is out (v1.73), with the following changes which were prompted by comments from Bruce Lilly: * Adapting to terminal width is now only done up to a maximum output width of 76, and a minimum of 16. * Some grammar corrections. * The column width setting, whether given by the --width switch, by setting COLUMNS in the environment, or by running in a narrow terminal window, now also applies to boilerplate text. However, boilerplate text is never output with a greater width than 73, which matches the RFC setting. * The line folding algorithm has been enhanced to not give up as easily. * All normal output is now folded to match the width setting - previously some output lines weren't. Debug output is not folded. * Additional accepted variations were added for the names of normative and informative reference sections. Regards, Henrik _______________________________________________ Tools-discuss mailing list Tools-discuss@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/tools-discuss From tools-discuss-bounces@ietf.org Sat Jun 25 15:14:50 2005 Received: from localhost.localdomain ([127.0.0.1] helo=megatron.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1DmG78-0000s5-6D; Sat, 25 Jun 2005 15:14:50 -0400 Received: from odin.ietf.org ([132.151.1.176] helo=ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1DmG76-0000s0-L9 for tools-discuss@megatron.ietf.org; Sat, 25 Jun 2005 15:14:48 -0400 Received: from ietf-mx.ietf.org (ietf-mx [132.151.6.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id PAA29541 for ; Sat, 25 Jun 2005 15:14:45 -0400 (EDT) Received: from ns.execdsl.net ([208.184.15.238] helo=EXECDSL.COM) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.33) id 1DmGVq-0006Nu-UL for tools-discuss@ietf.org; Sat, 25 Jun 2005 15:40:24 -0400 Received: from [69.170.1.53] (HELO JMHLap3.stevecrocker.com) by EXECDSL.COM (CommuniGate Pro SMTP 3.3) with ESMTP id 11104198 for tools-discuss@ietf.org; Sat, 25 Jun 2005 15:14:43 -0400 Message-Id: <6.2.1.2.0.20050625151436.02c9e8f0@localhost> X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 6.2.1.2 Date: Sat, 25 Jun 2005 15:14:41 -0400 To: tools-discuss@ietf.org From: "Joel M. Halpern" Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed X-Spam-Score: 0.1 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 68c8cc8a64a9d0402e43b8eee9fc4199 Subject: [Tools-discuss] ID-Nits enhancement X-BeenThere: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF Tools Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: tools-discuss-bounces@ietf.org Errors-To: tools-discuss-bounces@ietf.org I don't know if this is a practical enhancement. I find myself needing to check IDs for which I have a URL. I can download the draft onto my machine, and then use the IDNits webservice to upload and check the draft. It would seem simple for me to simply hand the tool a URL, and ask it to check the draft at that URL. Is this an enhancement that can be considered? Thank you, Joel M. Halpern _______________________________________________ Tools-discuss mailing list Tools-discuss@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/tools-discuss From tools-discuss-bounces@ietf.org Sat Jun 25 18:19:38 2005 Received: from localhost.localdomain ([127.0.0.1] helo=megatron.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1DmIzy-0006nO-Sh; Sat, 25 Jun 2005 18:19:38 -0400 Received: from odin.ietf.org ([132.151.1.176] helo=ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1DmIzy-0006nJ-0O for tools-discuss@megatron.ietf.org; Sat, 25 Jun 2005 18:19:38 -0400 Received: from ietf-mx.ietf.org (ietf-mx [132.151.6.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id SAA12536 for ; Sat, 25 Jun 2005 18:19:35 -0400 (EDT) Received: from av11-2-sn2.hy.skanova.net ([81.228.8.184]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.33) id 1DmJOl-0002Kb-Vj for tools-discuss@ietf.org; Sat, 25 Jun 2005 18:45:17 -0400 Received: by av11-2-sn2.hy.skanova.net (Postfix, from userid 502) id 5DB623821B; Sun, 26 Jun 2005 00:19:16 +0200 (CEST) Received: from smtp4-2-sn2.hy.skanova.net (smtp4-2-sn2.hy.skanova.net [81.228.8.93]) by av11-2-sn2.hy.skanova.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 303C037ECD; Sun, 26 Jun 2005 00:19:16 +0200 (CEST) Received: from shiraz.levkowetz.com (81-224-201-50-no45.tbcn.telia.com [81.224.201.50]) by smtp4-2-sn2.hy.skanova.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 23D8837E44; Sun, 26 Jun 2005 00:19:13 +0200 (CEST) Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1] ident=henrik) by shiraz.levkowetz.com with esmtp (Exim 4.50) id 1DmIzZ-0002qY-1O; Sun, 26 Jun 2005 00:19:13 +0200 Message-ID: <42BDD861.3060100@levkowetz.com> Date: Sun, 26 Jun 2005 00:19:13 +0200 From: Henrik Levkowetz User-Agent: Mozilla Thunderbird 1.0.2 (Macintosh/20050317) X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: "Joel M. Halpern" Subject: Re: [Tools-discuss] ID-Nits enhancement References: <6.2.1.2.0.20050625151436.02c9e8f0@localhost> In-Reply-To: <6.2.1.2.0.20050625151436.02c9e8f0@localhost> X-Enigmail-Version: 0.89.5.0 X-Enigmail-Supports: pgp-inline, pgp-mime Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-SA-Exim-Connect-IP: 127.0.0.1 X-SA-Exim-Mail-From: henrik@levkowetz.com X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No (on shiraz.levkowetz.com); SAEximRunCond expanded to false X-Spam-Score: 0.1 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 9182cfff02fae4f1b6e9349e01d62f32 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Cc: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-BeenThere: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF Tools Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: tools-discuss-bounces@ietf.org Errors-To: tools-discuss-bounces@ietf.org Hi Joel, On 2005-06-25 21:14 Joel M. Halpern said the following: > I don't know if this is a practical enhancement. > I find myself needing to check IDs for which I have a URL. > I can download the draft onto my machine, and then use the IDNits > webservice to upload and check the draft. > It would seem simple for me to simply hand the tool a URL, and ask it to > check the draft at that URL. I quite agree. I've updated the web-service to accept URLs as well as upload filenames: If you now enter a http or ftp URL in the filename field of http://tools.ietf.org/tools/idnits/idnits.pyht, the service will download the file and run the check. Additionally, you can now also invoke the service by composing an URL as: http://tools.ietf.org/tools/idnits/idnits.pyht?filename=, e.g. (using the latest ietf-announce document): http://tools.ietf.org/tools/idnits/idnits.pyht?filename=http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-rescorla-dtls-05.txt Hope that helps, Henrik _______________________________________________ Tools-discuss mailing list Tools-discuss@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/tools-discuss From tools-discuss-bounces@ietf.org Tue Jun 28 02:39:43 2005 Received: from localhost.localdomain ([127.0.0.1] helo=megatron.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1Dn9l1-0004DP-Cf; Tue, 28 Jun 2005 02:39:43 -0400 Received: from odin.ietf.org ([132.151.1.176] helo=ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1Dn9l0-0004DK-PK for tools-discuss@megatron.ietf.org; Tue, 28 Jun 2005 02:39:42 -0400 Received: from ietf-mx.ietf.org (ietf-mx [132.151.6.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id CAA04004 for ; Tue, 28 Jun 2005 02:39:41 -0400 (EDT) Received: from schlitt.net ([67.52.51.34] helo=backbone.schlitt.net) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.33) id 1DnAAI-00009r-Kc for tools-discuss@ietf.org; Tue, 28 Jun 2005 03:05:51 -0400 Received: from footbone.schlitt.net ([67.52.51.37] helo=schlitt.net) by backbone.schlitt.net with esmtp (Exim 4.51) id 1Dn9kk-00006S-0Z for tools-discuss@ietf.org; Tue, 28 Jun 2005 01:39:30 -0500 To: tools-discuss@ietf.org From: wayne Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Date: Tue, 28 Jun 2005 01:39:25 -0500 Message-ID: User-Agent: Gnus/5.1007 (Gnus v5.10.7) XEmacs/21.4 (Jumbo Shrimp, linux) MIME-Version: 1.0 Received-SPF: pass (backbone.schlitt.net: domain of schlitt.net designates 67.52.51.37 as permitted sender) client-ip=67.52.51.37; envelope-from=wayne@schlitt.net; helo=schlitt.net; X-SA-Exim-Connect-IP: 67.52.51.37 X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-SA-Exim-Mail-From: wayne@schlitt.net X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.0.4 (2005-06-05) on backbone.schlitt.net X-Spam-Status: No, score=-3.3 required=4.0 tests=AWL,BAYES_00 autolearn=ham version=3.0.4 X-SA-Exim-Version: 4.2 (built Thu, 03 Mar 2005 10:44:12 +0100) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes (on backbone.schlitt.net) X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 7baded97d9887f7a0c7e8a33c2e3ea1b Subject: [Tools-discuss] ABNF tools X-BeenThere: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF Tools Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: tools-discuss-bounces@ietf.org Errors-To: tools-discuss-bounces@ietf.org Hi. I've just recently stumbled across two tools that I think should be placed on the IETF tools webpage. They are: abnf - converter from ABNF to Regexp http://cvs.m17n.org/~akr/abnf/ APG - an ABNF Parser Generator http://www.coasttocoastresearch.com/ Today, I used the abnf to regex converter to take the ABNF for SPF records out of my I-D and then ran it against the SPF test suite that I've been working on. I found a couple of bugs in the ABNF and several bugs in the test suite. This is despite the fact that I had put a lot of work into both of the ABNF and the test suite and thought they were right. I think these tools are very important because they change the ABNF from being basicly pseudo-code into something that is functional. The ABNF checkers do a good job of making sure the ABNF syntax is correct, but they don't really help you ensure that the ABNF does what you really want it to do. By making the ABNF function and actually testing the ABNF found in RFCs, I think we significantly improve the accuracy of the ABNF. For example, the abnf->re convert has to give corrected ABNF for IPv6 addresses because the ABNF found in RFC2373 is wrong. (SPF uses IPv6 addresses, so this is important to me.) -wayne _______________________________________________ Tools-discuss mailing list Tools-discuss@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/tools-discuss From tools-discuss-bounces@ietf.org Tue Jun 28 04:03:48 2005 Received: from localhost.localdomain ([127.0.0.1] helo=megatron.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1DnB4O-0004ub-KU; Tue, 28 Jun 2005 04:03:48 -0400 Received: from odin.ietf.org ([132.151.1.176] helo=ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1DnB4M-0004uR-0z for tools-discuss@megatron.ietf.org; Tue, 28 Jun 2005 04:03:46 -0400 Received: from ietf-mx.ietf.org (ietf-mx [132.151.6.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id EAA11504 for ; Tue, 28 Jun 2005 04:03:44 -0400 (EDT) Received: from av7-1-sn3.vrr.skanova.net ([81.228.9.181]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.33) id 1DnBTe-0000rw-D2 for tools-discuss@ietf.org; Tue, 28 Jun 2005 04:29:55 -0400 Received: by av7-1-sn3.vrr.skanova.net (Postfix, from userid 502) id 3CF2A37E97; Tue, 28 Jun 2005 10:02:26 +0200 (CEST) Received: from smtp3-2-sn3.vrr.skanova.net (smtp3-2-sn3.vrr.skanova.net [81.228.9.102]) by av7-1-sn3.vrr.skanova.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id C72CF38317; Tue, 28 Jun 2005 10:02:25 +0200 (CEST) Received: from shiraz.levkowetz.com (81-224-201-50-no45.tbcn.telia.com [81.224.201.50]) by smtp3-2-sn3.vrr.skanova.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id A655F37E4B; Tue, 28 Jun 2005 10:03:34 +0200 (CEST) Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1] ident=henrik) by shiraz.levkowetz.com with esmtp (Exim 4.50) id 1DnB49-0002wZ-Kq; Tue, 28 Jun 2005 10:03:33 +0200 Message-ID: <42C10454.4080905@levkowetz.com> Date: Tue, 28 Jun 2005 10:03:32 +0200 From: Henrik Levkowetz User-Agent: Mozilla Thunderbird 1.0.2 (Macintosh/20050317) X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: wayne Subject: Re: [Tools-discuss] ABNF tools References: In-Reply-To: X-Enigmail-Version: 0.89.5.0 X-Enigmail-Supports: pgp-inline, pgp-mime Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-SA-Exim-Connect-IP: 127.0.0.1 X-SA-Exim-Mail-From: henrik@levkowetz.com X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No (on shiraz.levkowetz.com); SAEximRunCond expanded to false X-Spam-Score: 0.1 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 50a516d93fd399dc60588708fd9a3002 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Cc: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-BeenThere: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF Tools Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: tools-discuss-bounces@ietf.org Errors-To: tools-discuss-bounces@ietf.org Hi Wayne, Nice tools - I've added them to the tools.ietf.org pages under Validation tools. Thanks! Henrik On 2005-06-28 08:39 wayne said the following: > > Hi. > > I've just recently stumbled across two tools that I think should be > placed on the IETF tools webpage. > > They are: > > abnf - converter from ABNF to Regexp > http://cvs.m17n.org/~akr/abnf/ > > APG - an ABNF Parser Generator > http://www.coasttocoastresearch.com/ > > > Today, I used the abnf to regex converter to take the ABNF for SPF > records out of my I-D and then ran it against the SPF test suite that > I've been working on. I found a couple of bugs in the ABNF and > several bugs in the test suite. This is despite the fact that I had > put a lot of work into both of the ABNF and the test suite and thought > they were right. > > > I think these tools are very important because they change the ABNF > from being basicly pseudo-code into something that is functional. The > ABNF checkers do a good job of making sure the ABNF syntax is correct, > but they don't really help you ensure that the ABNF does what you > really want it to do. > > By making the ABNF function and actually testing the ABNF found in > RFCs, I think we significantly improve the accuracy of the ABNF. For > example, the abnf->re convert has to give corrected ABNF for IPv6 > addresses because the ABNF found in RFC2373 is wrong. (SPF uses IPv6 > addresses, so this is important to me.) > > > > -wayne > _______________________________________________ Tools-discuss mailing list Tools-discuss@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/tools-discuss