From mailman-bounces@ietf.org Sat Jan 1 08:08:16 2005 Received: from ietf-mx.ietf.org (ietf-mx.ietf.org [132.151.6.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id IAA17405 for ; Sat, 1 Jan 2005 08:08:16 -0500 (EST) Received: from megatron.ietf.org ([132.151.6.71]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.33) id 1CkjBD-0000cw-Po for tools-team-archive@ietf.org; Sat, 01 Jan 2005 08:20:27 -0500 Received: from localhost.localdomain ([127.0.0.1] helo=megatron.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1CkgRn-0003Bc-Qf for tools-team-archive@ietf.org; Sat, 01 Jan 2005 05:25:23 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: ietf.org mailing list memberships reminder From: mailman-owner@ietf.org To: tools-team-archive@ietf.org X-No-Archive: yes Message-ID: Date: Sat, 01 Jan 2005 05:10:36 -0500 Precedence: bulk X-BeenThere: mailman@lists.ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 List-Id: Mailman site list X-List-Administrivia: yes Sender: mailman-bounces@ietf.org Errors-To: mailman-bounces@ietf.org X-Spam-Score: 0.3 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 3e15cc4fdc61d7bce84032741d11c8e5 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit This is a reminder, sent out once a month, about your ietf.org mailing list memberships. 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Passwords for tools-team-archive@ietf.org: List Password // URL ---- -------- tools-team@ietf.org fuuwuh https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/options/tools-team/tools-team-archive%40ietf.org From tools-team-bounces@ietf.org Sat Jan 1 23:17:32 2005 Received: from ietf-mx.ietf.org (ietf-mx.ietf.org [132.151.6.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id XAA21350; Sat, 1 Jan 2005 23:17:32 -0500 (EST) Received: from megatron.ietf.org ([132.151.6.71]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.33) id 1CkxNG-0006Nm-P9; Sat, 01 Jan 2005 23:29:51 -0500 Received: from localhost.localdomain ([127.0.0.1] helo=megatron.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1CkxAb-00005c-5S; Sat, 01 Jan 2005 23:16:45 -0500 Received: from odin.ietf.org ([132.151.1.176] helo=ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1Ckx4E-0006Rp-3x; Sat, 01 Jan 2005 23:10:10 -0500 Received: from ietf-mx.ietf.org (ietf-mx.ietf.org [132.151.6.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id XAA21005; Sat, 1 Jan 2005 23:10:07 -0500 (EST) Received: from c-24-8-141-221.client.comcast.net ([24.8.141.221] helo=volx.rousskov.org) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.33) id 1CkxG5-0006Gk-Jh; Sat, 01 Jan 2005 23:22:26 -0500 Received: from localhost.rousskov.org (localhost.rousskov.org [127.0.0.1]) by volx.rousskov.org (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id j026785k000738; Sat, 1 Jan 2005 23:07:08 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from rousskov@measurement-factory.com) To: internet-drafts@ietf.org References: <20041221224347.D44914@measurement-factory.com> Message-ID: Date: Sat, 01 Jan 2005 23:07:07 -0700 From: "Alex Rousskov" Organization: The Measurement Factory Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary=----------HKh0Tonqr8FUdYnMzuFeBU MIME-Version: 1.0 In-Reply-To: <20041221224347.D44914@measurement-factory.com> User-Agent: Opera M2/7.54 (FreeBSD, build 751) X-Spam-Score: 2.6 (++) X-Scan-Signature: 958aa603499a3de6b2b87d68741ed60e Cc: IETF Tools , Henrik Levkowetz Subject: [Tools-team] Request To Publish: draft-ietf-tools-draft-info-00 X-BeenThere: tools-team@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: "The purpose of the TOOLS team is to provide IETF feedback and guidance during the development of software tools to support various parts of IETF activities." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: tools-team-bounces@ietf.org Errors-To: tools-team-bounces@ietf.org X-Spam-Score: 2.6 (++) X-Scan-Signature: 442d80051e0361a34f3560325c4a7092 ------------HKh0Tonqr8FUdYnMzuFeBU Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; delsp=yes; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Please post the attached draft-ietf-tools-draft-info-00.txt file as a Tools team Internet-Draft. Thank you, Alex. ------------HKh0Tonqr8FUdYnMzuFeBU Content-Disposition: attachment; filename=draft-ietf-tools-draft-info-00.txt Content-Type: text/plain; name=draft-ietf-tools-draft-info-00.txt Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Tools team A. Rousskov Internet-Draft The Measurement Factory Expires: July 2, 2005 January 1, 2005 Requirements for Providing Information on IETF Internet-Drafts draft-ietf-tools-draft-info-00 Status of this Memo This document is an Internet-Draft and is subject to all provisions of section 3 of RFC 3667. By submitting this Internet-Draft, each author represents that any applicable patent or other IPR claims of which he or she is aware have been or will be disclosed, and any of which he or she become aware will be disclosed, in accordance with RFC 3668. Internet-Drafts are working documents of the Internet Engineering Task Force (IETF), its areas, and its working groups. Note that other groups may also distribute working documents as Internet-Drafts. Internet-Drafts are draft documents valid for a maximum of six months and may be updated, replaced, or obsoleted by other documents at any time. It is inappropriate to use Internet-Drafts as reference material or to cite them other than as "work in progress." The list of current Internet-Drafts can be accessed at http://www.ietf.org/ietf/1id-abstracts.txt. The list of Internet-Draft Shadow Directories can be accessed at http://www.ietf.org/shadow.html. This Internet-Draft will expire on July 2, 2005. Copyright Notice Copyright (C) The Internet Society (2005). Abstract This document specifies what information IETF should provide about an IETF Internet-Draft. Information requirements cover submitted, posted, published, expired, and other personal or Working Group drafts. Rousskov Expires July 2, 2005 [Page 1] Internet-Draft Draft Information Requirements January 2005 Table of Contents 1. Introduction . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 3 2. State of this draft version . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 3 3. Scope . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 3 4. Notation and Terminology . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 3 5. Status quo . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 4 6. Requirements . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 4 6.1 Draft metadata . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 5 6.2 Available draft versions . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 5 6.3 Change history . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 5 6.4 Notification functionality . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 5 6.5 Version metadata . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 5 6.6 Version formats . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 5 7. Email interface . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 5 8. Implementation stages . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 5 9. Security Considerations . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 5 10. IANA Considerations . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 6 11. Compliance . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 6 A. Comparison with current procedures . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 6 B. Acknowledgments . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 6 C. Change log . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 6 Author's Address . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 6 Intellectual Property and Copyright Statements . . . . . . . . 7 Rousskov Expires July 2, 2005 [Page 2] Internet-Draft Draft Information Requirements January 2005 1. Introduction Public Internet-Drafts are primary means of structured communication within IETF. The information that IETF currently provides about any given draft is decentralized and often insufficient to facilitate on-going draft review and use by IETFers and 3rd parties. The IETF Tools team recommends creation of a single, authoritative, and comprehensive IETF source for draft information. This document specifies what information IETF should provide about a draft and, to a limited extent, how that information needs to be provided. Most, if not all, requirements in this document are inspired by existing sources of draft information, both on official IETF web sites and sites administered outside of IETF. 2. State of this draft version This draft version does not contain much meat and cannot represent Tools team consensus. Thus, this draft version is not meant for review. However, the Tools team is interested in (a) high-level comments about what information needs to be provided by IETF and (b) pointers to existing sites providing useful draft information. Please post your comments on tools-discuss@ietf.org mailing list or email them directly to the author. RFC Editor Note: Please remove this section for the final publication of the document. It has been inspired by draft-rousskov-newtrk-id-state and related NEWTRK WG discussions. 3. Scope The document scope is a single Internet-Draft, including multiple versions and formats of the same draft. Requirements cover submitted, posted, published, expired, and unknown personal or Working Group drafts. The interfaces required to locate a draft or correlate information about multiple drafts are out of scope. 4. Notation and Terminology The following terms are to be interpreted according to their definitions below. posted draft: A draft accepted into public IETF draft repository and, hence, publicly available on IETF web site. Posting of a draft does not imply any IETF or IESG review and endorsement. Rousskov Expires July 2, 2005 [Page 3] Internet-Draft Draft Information Requirements January 2005 draft version: A meant-to-be-public snapshot of an Internet-Draft with a meant-to-be-unique version number. Also known as "draft revision". draft format: Any draft source or presentation format, including original and preprocessed XML, original or generated plain text as well as PDF, PostScript, and HTML formats. primary draft format: The first available draft format from the following list: plain text, PDF, PostScript, or XML. WG draft: A draft which identifier (a.k.a. filename) is known and starts with "draft-ietf-". individual draft: A draft other than a WG draft. Normative requirements in this document are English phrases ending with an "(Rnnn/s)" mark, where "nnn" is a unique requirement number, and "s" is a single letter code ("a", "b", or "c") specifying the implementation stage for the requirement. Implementation stages are documented in Section 8. This document does not specify how the implementation must obtain necessary draft information and does not require specific information rendering techniques. However, implementation hints or examples are often useful. To avoid mixup with normative requirements, such hints and examples are marked with a "Hint:" prefix. Implementation hints do not carry any normative force, and a different implementation may be the best choice. 5. Status quo This section summarizes what information about a draft is usually available to IETFers at the time of writing. TBD 6. Requirements The following information should be available about a given draft: o draft status (similar to what ID tracker does now) o draft meta-data (XXX: expand) o available draft versions o change history (for drafts with multiple versions available) Rousskov Expires July 2, 2005 [Page 4] Internet-Draft Draft Information Requirements January 2005 o "notify me when this draft changes" functionality For each available draft version, the following information should be provided: o version meta-data (XXX: expand) o primary version format (always available) o all other available version formats (if any) 6.1 Draft metadata o authors information o WG name o email address for draft discussion and comments o "obsoletes X" or "renamed to Y" information All draft metadata must be available in format(s) suitable for human consumtion and in XML format. 6.2 Available draft versions 6.3 Change history 6.4 Notification functionality 6.5 Version metadata 6.6 Version formats 7. Email interface TBD 8. Implementation stages TBD. 9. Security Considerations TBD. Rousskov Expires July 2, 2005 [Page 5] Internet-Draft Draft Information Requirements January 2005 10. IANA Considerations None. 11. Compliance TBD. Appendix A. Comparison with current procedures This section summarizes major differences between information currently provided by IETF and what is being proposed, including violations of the current IETF rules. o Currently, IETF provides only the latest draft version. This document requires providing all unexpired versions. This change allows to maintain a change history useful for draft review and discussion. The change does not seem to contradict written IETF rules and principles. If an experiment with providing unexpired but obsolete versions does not cause significant problems, the IETF rules might be modified to also provide all draft versions for unexpired drafts and, later, all draft versions ever posted. Appendix B. Acknowledgments Special thanks to Marshall Rose for his xml2rfc tool. Appendix C. Change log RFC Editor Note: This section is to be removed during the final publication of the document. Internal WG revision control ID: $Id$ version 00 * Initial version. Author's Address Alex Rousskov The Measurement Factory EMail: rousskov@measurement-factory.com URI: http://www.measurement-factory.com/ Rousskov Expires July 2, 2005 [Page 6] Internet-Draft Draft Information Requirements January 2005 Intellectual Property Statement The IETF takes no position regarding the validity or scope of any Intellectual Property Rights or other rights that might be claimed to pertain to the implementation or use of the technology described in this document or the extent to which any license under such rights might or might not be available; nor does it represent that it has made any independent effort to identify any such rights. Information on the procedures with respect to rights in RFC documents can be found in BCP 78 and BCP 79. Copies of IPR disclosures made to the IETF Secretariat and any assurances of licenses to be made available, or the result of an attempt made to obtain a general license or permission for the use of such proprietary rights by implementers or users of this specification can be obtained from the IETF on-line IPR repository at http://www.ietf.org/ipr. The IETF invites any interested party to bring to its attention any copyrights, patents or patent applications, or other proprietary rights that may cover technology that may be required to implement this standard. Please address the information to the IETF at ietf-ipr@ietf.org. Disclaimer of Validity This document and the information contained herein are provided on an "AS IS" basis and THE CONTRIBUTOR, THE ORGANIZATION HE/SHE REPRESENTS OR IS SPONSORED BY (IF ANY), THE INTERNET SOCIETY AND THE INTERNET ENGINEERING TASK FORCE DISCLAIM ALL WARRANTIES, EXPRESS OR IMPLIED, INCLUDING BUT NOT LIMITED TO ANY WARRANTY THAT THE USE OF THE INFORMATION HEREIN WILL NOT INFRINGE ANY RIGHTS OR ANY IMPLIED WARRANTIES OF MERCHANTABILITY OR FITNESS FOR A PARTICULAR PURPOSE. Copyright Statement Copyright (C) The Internet Society (2005). This document is subject to the rights, licenses and restrictions contained in BCP 78, and except as set forth therein, the authors retain all their rights. Acknowledgment Funding for the RFC Editor function is currently provided by the Internet Society. Rousskov Expires July 2, 2005 [Page 7] ------------HKh0Tonqr8FUdYnMzuFeBU Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Disposition: inline Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit _______________________________________________ Tools-team mailing list Tools-team@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/tools-team ------------HKh0Tonqr8FUdYnMzuFeBU-- From tools-team-bounces@ietf.org Sun Jan 2 04:42:18 2005 Received: from ietf-mx.ietf.org (ietf-mx.ietf.org [132.151.6.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id EAA19718; Sun, 2 Jan 2005 04:42:18 -0500 (EST) Received: from megatron.ietf.org ([132.151.6.71]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.33) id 1Cl2Ra-0007II-Gc; Sun, 02 Jan 2005 04:54:39 -0500 Received: from localhost.localdomain ([127.0.0.1] helo=megatron.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1Cl2As-0002ZS-Ot; Sun, 02 Jan 2005 04:37:23 -0500 Received: from odin.ietf.org ([132.151.1.176] helo=ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1Cl27W-0001YM-2V; Sun, 02 Jan 2005 04:33:54 -0500 Received: from ietf-mx.ietf.org (ietf-mx.ietf.org [132.151.6.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id EAA19414; Sun, 2 Jan 2005 04:33:52 -0500 (EST) Received: from av7-2-sn4.m-sp.skanova.net ([81.228.10.109]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.33) id 1Cl2JR-0007B5-0w; Sun, 02 Jan 2005 04:46:13 -0500 Received: by av7-2-sn4.m-sp.skanova.net (Postfix, from userid 502) id CCE2A37EA0; Sun, 2 Jan 2005 10:33:12 +0100 (CET) Received: from smtp2-2-sn4.m-sp.skanova.net (smtp2-2-sn4.m-sp.skanova.net [81.228.10.182]) by av7-2-sn4.m-sp.skanova.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id BD90A37E42; Sun, 2 Jan 2005 10:33:12 +0100 (CET) Received: from shiraz.levkowetz.com (h195n1fls311o871.telia.com [213.64.174.195]) by smtp2-2-sn4.m-sp.skanova.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id A7D0B37E46; Sun, 2 Jan 2005 10:33:12 +0100 (CET) Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]) by shiraz.levkowetz.com with esmtp (Exim 4.34) id 1Cl26p-0006n5-NP; Sun, 02 Jan 2005 10:33:11 +0100 Message-ID: <41D7BFD6.8040607@levkowetz.com> Date: Sun, 02 Jan 2005 10:33:10 +0100 From: Henrik Levkowetz User-Agent: Mozilla Thunderbird 0.9 (Macintosh/20041103) X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Alex Rousskov Subject: Re: [Tools-team] Request To Publish: draft-ietf-tools-draft-info-00 References: <20041221224347.D44914@measurement-factory.com> In-Reply-To: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-SA-Exim-Connect-IP: 127.0.0.1 X-SA-Exim-Mail-From: henrik@levkowetz.com X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No (on shiraz.levkowetz.com); SAEximRunCond expanded to false X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 08170828343bcf1325e4a0fb4584481c Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Cc: IETF Tools , internet-drafts@ietf.org X-BeenThere: tools-team@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: "The purpose of the TOOLS team is to provide IETF feedback and guidance during the development of software tools to support various parts of IETF activities." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: tools-team-bounces@ietf.org Errors-To: tools-team-bounces@ietf.org X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 79899194edc4f33a41f49410777972f8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit This draft is approved for posting as a -00 draft for the tools team. Henrik Tools-team chair on 2005-01-02 7:07 am Alex Rousskov said the following: > Please post the attached draft-ietf-tools-draft-info-00.txt file > as a Tools team Internet-Draft. > > Thank you, > > Alex. _______________________________________________ Tools-team mailing list Tools-team@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/tools-team From tools-team-bounces@ietf.org Wed Jan 5 09:37:30 2005 Received: from ietf-mx.ietf.org (ietf-mx.ietf.org [132.151.6.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id JAA07993; Wed, 5 Jan 2005 09:37:30 -0500 (EST) Received: from megatron.ietf.org ([132.151.6.71]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.33) id 1CmCUY-00065T-Ci; Wed, 05 Jan 2005 09:50:33 -0500 Received: from localhost.localdomain ([127.0.0.1] helo=megatron.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1CmCCA-0003Hu-7K; Wed, 05 Jan 2005 09:31:30 -0500 Received: from odin.ietf.org ([132.151.1.176] helo=ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1CmCAD-0002fF-Ea for tools-team@megatron.ietf.org; Wed, 05 Jan 2005 09:29:29 -0500 Received: from ietf-mx.ietf.org (ietf-mx.ietf.org [132.151.6.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id JAA07550 for ; Wed, 5 Jan 2005 09:29:27 -0500 (EST) Received: from av5-2-sn3.vrr.skanova.net ([81.228.9.114]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.33) id 1CmCMl-0005vQ-D3 for tools-team@ietf.org; Wed, 05 Jan 2005 09:42:30 -0500 Received: by av5-2-sn3.vrr.skanova.net (Postfix, from userid 502) id 3D0B337E99; Wed, 5 Jan 2005 15:28:54 +0100 (CET) Received: from smtp1-1-sn3.vrr.skanova.net (smtp1-1-sn3.vrr.skanova.net [81.228.9.177]) by av5-2-sn3.vrr.skanova.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2BE9537E7E for ; Wed, 5 Jan 2005 15:28:54 +0100 (CET) Received: from shiraz.levkowetz.com (h195n1fls311o871.telia.com [213.64.174.195]) by smtp1-1-sn3.vrr.skanova.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1CE973800B for ; Wed, 5 Jan 2005 15:28:54 +0100 (CET) Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]) by shiraz.levkowetz.com with esmtp (Exim 4.34) id 1CmC9d-0003dz-Vj for tools-team@ietf.org; Wed, 05 Jan 2005 15:28:54 +0100 Message-ID: <41DBF9A6.6080108@levkowetz.com> Date: Wed, 05 Jan 2005 15:28:54 +0100 From: Henrik Levkowetz User-Agent: Mozilla Thunderbird 0.9 (Macintosh/20041103) X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: IETF TOOLS Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-SA-Exim-Connect-IP: 127.0.0.1 X-SA-Exim-Mail-From: henrik@levkowetz.com X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No (on shiraz.levkowetz.com); SAEximRunCond expanded to false X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 538aad3a3c4f01d8b6a6477ca4248793 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: [Tools-team] Agenda for the 5 January 2004 Telechat X-BeenThere: tools-team@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: "The purpose of the TOOLS team is to provide IETF feedback and guidance during the development of software tools to support various parts of IETF activities." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: tools-team-bounces@ietf.org Errors-To: tools-team-bounces@ietf.org X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Scan-Signature: f4c2cf0bccc868e4cc88dace71fb3f44 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Hi, Here is the proposed agenda for today's meeting. Note that the dial-in phone number has changed to +1-734-615-7474 --------------------------------------------------------- 1. Agenda bashing 2. Comments on minutes from last teleconference. 3. Status of I-D submission tool draft 4. Action item review. * Stas: Start looking at Notification Service Requirements. * Alex: Continue thinking about Draft Status Page Requirements. * Alex: Summarize draft-submission comments to the list, update draft to be ready for submission for publication. * Henrik: Submit draft-submission draft for publication when it's ready 5. Action items for next meeting 6. Any other business. 7. Next meeting: Teleconference Wednesday 12 Jan, 17:00 GMT (same local time as today). --------------------------------------------------------- Connection details: To join the call, dial +1-734-615-7474 and enter PIN 0151989. One can also join the call by dialling: sip:session_0151989@edial.internet2.edu on a SIP-enabled voice communications client. If the SIP client cannot dial URLs, you can have the conference system call you if you have the sip URL for your phone. Go to https://edial.internet2.edu/call/0151989 and type in the URL to your phone, and follow the directions. _______________________________________________ Tools-team mailing list Tools-team@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/tools-team From tools-team-bounces@ietf.org Wed Jan 5 12:33:06 2005 Received: from ietf-mx.ietf.org (ietf-mx.ietf.org [132.151.6.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id MAA24114; Wed, 5 Jan 2005 12:33:06 -0500 (EST) Received: from megatron.ietf.org ([132.151.6.71]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.33) id 1CmFEX-0004Kz-Py; Wed, 05 Jan 2005 12:46:12 -0500 Received: from localhost.localdomain ([127.0.0.1] helo=megatron.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1CmEyl-0003fT-L2; Wed, 05 Jan 2005 12:29:51 -0500 Received: from odin.ietf.org ([132.151.1.176] helo=ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1CmExO-0003My-E7 for tools-team@megatron.ietf.org; Wed, 05 Jan 2005 12:28:26 -0500 Received: from ietf-mx.ietf.org (ietf-mx.ietf.org [132.151.6.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id MAA23843 for ; Wed, 5 Jan 2005 12:28:23 -0500 (EST) Received: from av1-2-sn1.fre.skanova.net ([81.228.11.108]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.33) id 1CmF9v-0003z8-1D for tools-team@ietf.org; Wed, 05 Jan 2005 12:41:28 -0500 Received: by av1-2-sn1.fre.skanova.net (Postfix, from userid 502) id 03A8937F16; Wed, 5 Jan 2005 18:27:48 +0100 (CET) Received: from smtp3-1-sn1.fre.skanova.net (smtp3-1-sn1.fre.skanova.net [81.228.11.163]) by av1-2-sn1.fre.skanova.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id E9F9F37EB0 for ; Wed, 5 Jan 2005 18:27:48 +0100 (CET) Received: from shiraz.levkowetz.com (h195n1fls311o871.telia.com [213.64.174.195]) by smtp3-1-sn1.fre.skanova.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id D496537E46 for ; Wed, 5 Jan 2005 18:27:48 +0100 (CET) Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]) by shiraz.levkowetz.com with esmtp (Exim 4.34) id 1CmEwm-00009p-NK for tools-team@ietf.org; Wed, 05 Jan 2005 18:27:48 +0100 Message-ID: <41DC2395.3060907@levkowetz.com> Date: Wed, 05 Jan 2005 18:27:49 +0100 From: Henrik Levkowetz User-Agent: Mozilla Thunderbird 0.9 (Macintosh/20041103) X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: IETF TOOLS Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-SA-Exim-Connect-IP: 127.0.0.1 X-SA-Exim-Mail-From: henrik@levkowetz.com X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No (on shiraz.levkowetz.com); SAEximRunCond expanded to false X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 34d35111647d654d033d58d318c0d21a Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: [Tools-team] Minutes from the 5 January 2004 Telechat X-BeenThere: tools-team@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: "The purpose of the TOOLS team is to provide IETF feedback and guidance during the development of software tools to support various parts of IETF activities." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: tools-team-bounces@ietf.org Errors-To: tools-team-bounces@ietf.org X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Scan-Signature: e1b0e72ff1bbd457ceef31828f216a86 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Hi, Here are the minutes from today's meeting. --------------------------------------------------------- 0. Present: Bill, Alex, Donald, Henrik 1. Agenda bashing No changes 2. Comments on minutes from last teleconference. None 3. Status of I-D submission tool draft The hopefully final draft is out, and will be sent up for publication. 4. Action item review. * Stas: Start looking at Notification Service Requirements. - * Alex: Continue thinking about Draft Status Page Requirements. A draft is out, well done. * Alex: Summarize draft-submission comments to the list, update draft to be ready for submission for publication. A new & final draft is out. There was some discussion about meta-information on the xml2rfc list, which seems germane to our meta-information work. Bill and Alex both indicated that it didn't seem as if using the rfc2629 author schema would necessarily be a good fit for a general draft meta-information schema. Bill talked warmly about transforms, as long as we keep in mind that to transform from and to every defined schema we need M*M transforms for M schema, so we don't want to gratuitously use new ones if existing ones will do. * Henrik: Submit draft-submission draft for publication when it's ready - 5. Action items for next meeting * Stas: Start looking at Notification Service Requirements. * Alex: Continue thinking about Draft Status Page Requirements. * Henrik: Do writeup and submit draft-submission draft for publication. * Henrik: Propose a Relax NG specification of draft meta-information * Donald: Do writeup of expected input and output for a WG meeting scheduling tool, and start thinking about prototyping 6. Any other business. Nothing 7. Next meeting: Teleconference Wednesday 12 Jan, 17:00 GMT (same local time as today). --------------------------------------------------------- Connection details: To join the call, dial +1-734-615-7474 and enter PIN 0151989. One can also join the call by dialling: sip:session_0151989@edial.internet2.edu on a SIP-enabled voice communications client. If the SIP client cannot dial URLs, you can have the conference system call you if you have the sip URL for your phone. Go to https://edial.internet2.edu/call/0151989 and type in the URL to your phone, and follow the directions. _______________________________________________ Tools-team mailing list Tools-team@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/tools-team From tools-team-bounces@ietf.org Thu Jan 6 15:11:05 2005 Received: from ietf-mx.ietf.org (ietf-mx.ietf.org [132.151.6.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id PAA11907; Thu, 6 Jan 2005 15:11:05 -0500 (EST) Received: from megatron.ietf.org ([132.151.6.71]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.33) id 1CmeBC-0007Kx-Qp; Thu, 06 Jan 2005 15:24:24 -0500 Received: from localhost.localdomain ([127.0.0.1] helo=megatron.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1CmdnV-0006kx-Pu; Thu, 06 Jan 2005 14:59:53 -0500 Received: from odin.ietf.org ([132.151.1.176] helo=ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1Cmdlp-0005od-Fa for tools-team@megatron.ietf.org; Thu, 06 Jan 2005 14:58:09 -0500 Received: from ietf-mx.ietf.org (ietf-mx.ietf.org [132.151.6.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id OAA10557 for ; Thu, 6 Jan 2005 14:58:07 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail-dark.research.att.com ([192.20.225.112] helo=mail-yellow.research.att.com) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.33) id 1Cmdye-0006uw-Nk for tools-team@ietf.org; Thu, 06 Jan 2005 15:11:25 -0500 Received: from windsor.research.att.com (windsor.research.att.com [135.207.26.46]) by mail-blue.research.att.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 541F919749F for ; Thu, 6 Jan 2005 14:43:44 -0500 (EST) Received: (from fenner@localhost) by windsor.research.att.com (8.11.6+Sun/8.8.5) id j06Jvar02776; Thu, 6 Jan 2005 11:57:36 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: <200501061957.j06Jvar02776@windsor.research.att.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII To: tools-team@ietf.org Date: Thu, 6 Jan 2005 11:57:36 -0800 From: Bill Fenner Versions: dmail (solaris) 2.6d/makemail 2.10 X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 08170828343bcf1325e4a0fb4584481c Subject: [Tools-team] "lurker" mailing list archiver X-BeenThere: tools-team@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: "The purpose of the TOOLS team is to provide IETF feedback and guidance during the development of software tools to support various parts of IETF activities." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: tools-team-bounces@ietf.org Errors-To: tools-team-bounces@ietf.org X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 79899194edc4f33a41f49410777972f8 Has anyone played with "lurker"? I am finding it interesting; I installed it on rtg.ietf.org and imported the IETF and IDR list archives (spam and all). http://rtg.ietf.org/lurker/ The thread view seems pretty reasonable: http://rtg.ietf.org/lurker/thread/20050106.150932.66b208d7.en.html and searching is good too (you can use google-like prefixes for subject, mailing list, author, thread to limit the search). Bill _______________________________________________ Tools-team mailing list Tools-team@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/tools-team From tools-team-bounces@ietf.org Thu Jan 6 16:17:26 2005 Received: from ietf-mx.ietf.org (ietf-mx.ietf.org [132.151.6.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id QAA19696; Thu, 6 Jan 2005 16:17:25 -0500 (EST) Received: from megatron.ietf.org ([132.151.6.71]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.33) id 1CmfDO-0001e8-D5; Thu, 06 Jan 2005 16:30:45 -0500 Received: from localhost.localdomain ([127.0.0.1] helo=megatron.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1CmeYf-0000Ld-PL; Thu, 06 Jan 2005 15:48:37 -0500 Received: from odin.ietf.org ([132.151.1.176] helo=ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1CmeVA-0006ZD-P8 for tools-team@megatron.ietf.org; Thu, 06 Jan 2005 15:45:00 -0500 Received: from ietf-mx.ietf.org (ietf-mx.ietf.org [132.151.6.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id PAA14743 for ; Thu, 6 Jan 2005 15:44:58 -0500 (EST) Received: from av3-2-sn4.m-sp.skanova.net ([81.228.10.113]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.33) id 1Cmehz-0008Ao-H2 for tools-team@ietf.org; Thu, 06 Jan 2005 15:58:16 -0500 Received: by av3-2-sn4.m-sp.skanova.net (Postfix, from userid 502) id A78833804C; Thu, 6 Jan 2005 21:44:26 +0100 (CET) Received: from smtp2-2-sn4.m-sp.skanova.net (smtp2-2-sn4.m-sp.skanova.net [81.228.10.182]) by av3-2-sn4.m-sp.skanova.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 96FE337E69; Thu, 6 Jan 2005 21:44:26 +0100 (CET) Received: from shiraz.levkowetz.com (h195n1fls311o871.telia.com [213.64.174.195]) by smtp2-2-sn4.m-sp.skanova.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8922D37E5A; Thu, 6 Jan 2005 21:44:25 +0100 (CET) Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]) by shiraz.levkowetz.com with esmtp (Exim 4.34) id 1CmeUb-0001hM-Jt; Thu, 06 Jan 2005 21:44:25 +0100 Message-ID: <41DDA327.1030400@levkowetz.com> Date: Thu, 06 Jan 2005 21:44:23 +0100 From: Henrik Levkowetz User-Agent: Mozilla Thunderbird 0.9 (Macintosh/20041103) X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Bill Fenner Subject: Re: [Tools-team] "lurker" mailing list archiver References: <200501061957.j06Jvar02776@windsor.research.att.com> In-Reply-To: <200501061957.j06Jvar02776@windsor.research.att.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-SA-Exim-Connect-IP: 127.0.0.1 X-SA-Exim-Mail-From: henrik@levkowetz.com X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No (on shiraz.levkowetz.com); SAEximRunCond expanded to false X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 9182cfff02fae4f1b6e9349e01d62f32 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Cc: tools-team@ietf.org X-BeenThere: tools-team@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: "The purpose of the TOOLS team is to provide IETF feedback and guidance during the development of software tools to support various parts of IETF activities." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: tools-team-bounces@ietf.org Errors-To: tools-team-bounces@ietf.org X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Scan-Signature: ea4ac80f790299f943f0a53be7e1a21a Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Hi Bill, on 2005-01-06 8:57 pm Bill Fenner said the following: > Has anyone played with "lurker"? I am finding it interesting; > I installed it on rtg.ietf.org and imported the IETF and IDR list > archives (spam and all). I used lurker to archive the tools-team conversation before we got the mailing list set up, but haven't played with it since then. Some of it seemed good to me, while other parts seemed a bit more contrived. I think the big plus is the search facility, while for just reading a thread I found the pipermail archives (what comes with Mailman) easier. Henrik > http://rtg.ietf.org/lurker/ > > The thread view seems pretty reasonable: > > http://rtg.ietf.org/lurker/thread/20050106.150932.66b208d7.en.html > > and searching is good too (you can use google-like prefixes for > subject, mailing list, author, thread to limit the search). _______________________________________________ Tools-team mailing list Tools-team@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/tools-team From tools-team-bounces@ietf.org Wed Jan 12 11:32:18 2005 Received: from ietf-mx.ietf.org (ietf-mx.ietf.org [132.151.6.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id LAA26785; Wed, 12 Jan 2005 11:32:18 -0500 (EST) Received: from megatron.ietf.org ([132.151.6.71]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.33) id 1Coldy-0001Zl-Ic; Wed, 12 Jan 2005 11:46:51 -0500 Received: from localhost.localdomain ([127.0.0.1] helo=megatron.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1ColFm-0000Jk-H9; Wed, 12 Jan 2005 11:21:50 -0500 Received: from odin.ietf.org ([132.151.1.176] helo=ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1ColBF-0006b5-El for tools-team@megatron.ietf.org; Wed, 12 Jan 2005 11:17:09 -0500 Received: from ietf-mx.ietf.org (ietf-mx.ietf.org [132.151.6.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id LAA25396 for ; Wed, 12 Jan 2005 11:17:07 -0500 (EST) Received: from motgate8.mot.com ([129.188.136.8]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.33) id 1ColPI-000154-Af for tools-team@ietf.org; Wed, 12 Jan 2005 11:31:40 -0500 Received: from az33exr03.mot.com (az33exr03.mot.com [10.64.251.233]) by motgate8.mot.com (Motorola/Motgate8) with ESMTP id j0CGIwJD010728 for ; Wed, 12 Jan 2005 09:18:58 -0700 (MST) Received: from ma19exm01.e6.bcs.mot.com (ma19exm01.e6.bcs.mot.com [10.14.33.5]) by az33exr03.mot.com (Motorola/az33exr03) with ESMTP id j0CGGkNs009461 for ; Wed, 12 Jan 2005 10:16:46 -0600 Received: by ma19exm01.e6.bcs.mot.com with Internet Mail Service (5.5.2657.72) id ; Wed, 12 Jan 2005 11:17:04 -0500 Message-ID: <62173B970AE0A044AED8723C3BCF238105CD43B6@ma19exm01.e6.bcs.mot.com> From: Eastlake III Donald-LDE008 To: tools-team@ietf.org Date: Wed, 12 Jan 2005 11:16:58 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2657.72) Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="----_=_NextPart_000_01C4F8C1.B7C511BE" X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 90f8d7cac99eccf384c4cdc57475e98c Subject: [Tools-team] Meeting Room Scheduler Requirements X-BeenThere: tools-team@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: "The purpose of the TOOLS team is to provide IETF feedback and guidance during the development of software tools to support various parts of IETF activities." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: tools-team-bounces@ietf.org Errors-To: tools-team-bounces@ietf.org X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 09f2eafe5f7c426554d5f494540a89cd This message is in MIME format. Since your mail reader does not understand this format, some or all of this message may not be legible. ------_=_NextPart_000_01C4F8C1.B7C511BE Content-Type: text/plain Hi, Attached and below is what I came up with. Thanks, Donald ========================================================= Donald E. Eastlake III Donald.Eastlake@Motorola.com Motorola Laboratories +1-508-786-7554 (work) 111 Locke Drive +1-508-634-2066 (home) Marlboro, MA 01752 USA Meeting Room Scheduler - Requirements Donald Eastlake 3rd Inputs: Required: * Room slots available (times and size) * Room requests by chairs (duration and size) Theoretically Optional but Expected: * Non-conflict requests by o Area Directors (defaults to the WGs and BoFs that AD is responsible for) o Chairs Optional: * Manual assignments (used to meet special requirements) * Existing schedule (so changes can be minimized on iterations after first announced schedule) * Non-conflict requests by o Attendees (not currently collected but could be added to registration where attendees could list what they would like to attend to provide better schedules and better room size estimates) Outputs: * A schedule * A goodness metric so quality of schedule for different meetings can be compared and perhaps to provide push back that more room slots are needed Processing: * Assuming a function that yields a goodness score for a schedule, assign rooms in a heuristically fashion to optimize that score. The design of this function is an interesting question and requires weighting of the importance of the different inputs. A variety of functions and parameter values should be tried. Assumptions: * Massive single track events (plenary meetings and social) will be scheduled manually and not included in room slots available or room requests. Discussion: The above is pretty much from the point of view of automating the current manual process. There are alternative points of view such as more of a "bidding" model where ADs and Chairs (and perhaps later attendees) are each given an appropriate amount of some fake currency and they express how strong each of their scheduling desires is by how much of their currency they are willing to pay to get their way. This implies a relatively continuous on-line bidding system whose results are frozen at some point as opposed to the "batch" system described above. Next Step: Implement some sort of prototype, probably file driven rather than having a fancy user interface, and try it on the data for the upcoming Minneapolis meeting or perhaps an earlier meeting if the Secretariat has the data available. ------_=_NextPart_000_01C4F8C1.B7C511BE Content-Type: application/msword; name="Meeting Room Scheduler.doc" Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="Meeting Room Scheduler.doc" Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64 0M8R4KGxGuEAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAPgADAP7/CQAGAAAAAAAAAAAAAAABAAAALgAAAAAAAAAA EAAAMAAAAAEAAAD+////AAAAAC8AAAD///////////////////////////////////////////// //////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////// //////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////// //////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////// //////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////// //////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////// 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AAAABgAAAFRpdGxlAAMAAAABAAAA4AEAAAcAAAAAAAAAQAAAAAEAAAD0AAAAAAAAgPwAAAACAAAA BAEAAA== ------_=_NextPart_000_01C4F8C1.B7C511BE Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Disposition: inline Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit _______________________________________________ Tools-team mailing list Tools-team@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/tools-team ------_=_NextPart_000_01C4F8C1.B7C511BE-- From tools-team-bounces@ietf.org Wed Jan 12 11:44:54 2005 Received: from ietf-mx.ietf.org (ietf-mx.ietf.org [132.151.6.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id LAA27704; Wed, 12 Jan 2005 11:44:53 -0500 (EST) Received: from megatron.ietf.org ([132.151.6.71]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.33) id 1Colq8-0001sd-Ln; Wed, 12 Jan 2005 11:59:27 -0500 Received: from localhost.localdomain ([127.0.0.1] helo=megatron.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1Colb6-0006Og-ER; Wed, 12 Jan 2005 11:43:52 -0500 Received: from odin.ietf.org ([132.151.1.176] helo=ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1Cola0-0005w4-DM; Wed, 12 Jan 2005 11:42:44 -0500 Received: from ietf-mx.ietf.org (ietf-mx.ietf.org [132.151.6.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id LAA27495; Wed, 12 Jan 2005 11:42:37 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail-red.research.att.com ([192.20.225.110] helo=mail-white.research.att.com) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.33) id 1Colnw-0001ne-Hp; Wed, 12 Jan 2005 11:57:11 -0500 Received: from windsor.research.att.com (windsor.research.att.com [135.207.26.46]) by mail-blue.research.att.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7953B197354; Wed, 12 Jan 2005 11:27:46 -0500 (EST) Received: (from fenner@localhost) by windsor.research.att.com (8.11.6+Sun/8.8.5) id j0CGg4Q02274; Wed, 12 Jan 2005 08:42:04 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: <200501121642.j0CGg4Q02274@windsor.research.att.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII To: iesg@ietf.org, rtg-chairs@ietf.org, tools-team@ietf.org, rtg-dir@ietf.org, proto@ietf.org Date: Wed, 12 Jan 2005 08:42:03 -0800 From: Bill Fenner Versions: dmail (solaris) 2.6d/makemail 2.10 X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 79899194edc4f33a41f49410777972f8 Subject: [Tools-team] Bill's availability for the next few days & weeks X-BeenThere: tools-team@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: fenner@research.att.com List-Id: "The purpose of the TOOLS team is to provide IETF feedback and guidance during the development of software tools to support various parts of IETF activities." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: tools-team-bounces@ietf.org Errors-To: tools-team-bounces@ietf.org X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 9182cfff02fae4f1b6e9349e01d62f32 Dear friends, We are going to have a baby quite soon; I expect to be pretty much out of contact for January 12 - 17 (induction is scheduled for tonight), and then will be on paternity leave after that. During my leave I will still be spending time on IETF matters; I'm planning one day a week but since it's our first baby I have no idea what to expect and am playing everything by ear. If you need me while we're in the hospital over the next few days, send a short email to fenner@tmomail.net and I will try to respond. After that, I'll have access to my normal email but an irregular schedule, and the @tmomail.net address will not work. I will probably be checking billfenner@mac.com more often than my work/IETF email, so if there's something you need from me try me there. Thanks for your understanding during this exciting new time in my life! Bill _______________________________________________ Tools-team mailing list Tools-team@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/tools-team From tools-team-bounces@ietf.org Tue Jan 18 06:45:18 2005 Received: from ietf-mx.ietf.org (ietf-mx.ietf.org [132.151.6.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id GAA14703; Tue, 18 Jan 2005 06:45:17 -0500 (EST) Received: from megatron.ietf.org ([132.151.6.71]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.33) id 1Cqs2k-0005WD-RG; Tue, 18 Jan 2005 07:01:07 -0500 Received: from localhost.localdomain ([127.0.0.1] helo=megatron.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1CqriM-00088Z-TI; Tue, 18 Jan 2005 06:40:02 -0500 Received: from odin.ietf.org ([132.151.1.176] helo=ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1CqreL-0007hs-Dy for tools-team@megatron.ietf.org; Tue, 18 Jan 2005 06:35:53 -0500 Received: from ietf-mx.ietf.org (ietf-mx.ietf.org [132.151.6.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id GAA14215 for ; Tue, 18 Jan 2005 06:35:50 -0500 (EST) Received: from eikenes.alvestrand.no ([158.38.152.233]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.33) id 1Cqrta-0005JP-Qx for tools-team@ietf.org; Tue, 18 Jan 2005 06:51:39 -0500 Received: from localhost (localhost.localdomain [127.0.0.1]) by eikenes.alvestrand.no (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6A1E461BB5; Tue, 18 Jan 2005 12:35:21 +0100 (CET) Received: from eikenes.alvestrand.no ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (eikenes.alvestrand.no [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 32262-06; Tue, 18 Jan 2005 12:35:19 +0100 (CET) Received: from halvestr-w2k02.emea.cisco.com (localhost.localdomain [127.0.0.1]) by eikenes.alvestrand.no (Postfix) with ESMTP id 26FCC61B94; Tue, 18 Jan 2005 12:35:18 +0100 (CET) Date: Tue, 18 Jan 2005 12:25:34 +0100 From: Harald Tveit Alvestrand To: Eastlake III Donald-LDE008 , tools-team@ietf.org Subject: Re: [Tools-team] Meeting Room Scheduler Requirements Message-ID: <460BC19E41554ED26D1CBA73@B50854F0A9192E8EC6CDA126> In-Reply-To: <62173B970AE0A044AED8723C3BCF238105CD43B6@ma19exm01.e6.bcs.mot.com> References: <62173B970AE0A044AED8723C3BCF238105CD43B6@ma19exm01.e6.bcs.mot.c om> X-Mailer: Mulberry/3.1.5 (Win32) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at alvestrand.no X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 31247fb3be228bb596db9127becad0bc Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-BeenThere: tools-team@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: "The purpose of the TOOLS team is to provide IETF feedback and guidance during the development of software tools to support various parts of IETF activities." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: tools-team-bounces@ietf.org Errors-To: tools-team-bounces@ietf.org X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 10d3e4e3c32e363f129e380e644649be Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit one more class of input: requests for groupings "near" each other, "not on the same day" and "on these specific dates of the week". the last one, when legitimate, is usually caused by some other organization scheduling a meeting that partly overlaps the IETF week. Harald --On 12. januar 2005 11:16 -0500 Eastlake III Donald-LDE008 wrote: > Hi, > > Attached and below is what I came up with. > > Thanks, > Donald > ========================================================= > Donald E. Eastlake III Donald.Eastlake@Motorola.com > Motorola Laboratories +1-508-786-7554 (work) > 111 Locke Drive +1-508-634-2066 (home) > Marlboro, MA 01752 USA > > > Meeting Room Scheduler - Requirements > Donald Eastlake 3rd > > Inputs: > Required: > * Room slots available (times and size) > * Room requests by chairs (duration and size) > Theoretically Optional but Expected: > * Non-conflict requests by > o Area Directors (defaults to the WGs and BoFs that AD is responsible > for) o Chairs > Optional: > * Manual assignments (used to meet special requirements) > * Existing schedule (so changes can be minimized on iterations after > first announced schedule) * Non-conflict requests by > o Attendees (not currently collected but could be added to registration > where attendees could list what they would like to attend to provide > better schedules and better room size estimates) > > Outputs: > * A schedule > * A goodness metric so quality of schedule for different meetings can be > compared and perhaps to provide push back that more room slots are needed > > Processing: > * Assuming a function that yields a goodness score for a schedule, > assign rooms in a heuristically fashion to optimize that score. The > design of this function is an interesting question and requires weighting > of the importance of the different inputs. A variety of functions and > parameter values should be tried. > > Assumptions: > * Massive single track events (plenary meetings and social) will be > scheduled manually and not included in room slots available or room > requests. > > Discussion: > The above is pretty much from the point of view of automating the > current manual process. There are alternative points of view such as more > of a "bidding" model where ADs and Chairs (and perhaps later attendees) > are each given an appropriate amount of some fake currency and they > express how strong each of their scheduling desires is by how much of > their currency they are willing to pay to get their way. This implies a > relatively continuous on-line bidding system whose results are frozen at > some point as opposed to the "batch" system described above. > > Next Step: > Implement some sort of prototype, probably file driven rather than > having a fancy user interface, and try it on the data for the upcoming > Minneapolis meeting or perhaps an earlier meeting if the Secretariat has > the data available. > > _______________________________________________ Tools-team mailing list Tools-team@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/tools-team From tools-team-bounces@ietf.org Tue Jan 18 11:08:34 2005 Received: from ietf-mx.ietf.org (ietf-mx.ietf.org [132.151.6.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id LAA06265; Tue, 18 Jan 2005 11:08:34 -0500 (EST) Received: from megatron.ietf.org ([132.151.6.71]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.33) id 1Cqw9Y-0003nT-CW; Tue, 18 Jan 2005 11:24:25 -0500 Received: from localhost.localdomain ([127.0.0.1] helo=megatron.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1Cqvms-0001nP-Ud; Tue, 18 Jan 2005 11:00:59 -0500 Received: from odin.ietf.org ([132.151.1.176] helo=ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1Cqvfe-00088m-JV for tools-team@megatron.ietf.org; Tue, 18 Jan 2005 10:53:30 -0500 Received: from ietf-mx.ietf.org (ietf-mx.ietf.org [132.151.6.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id KAA04828 for ; Tue, 18 Jan 2005 10:53:27 -0500 (EST) Received: from motgate7.mot.com ([129.188.136.7]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.33) id 1Cqvuv-0003HK-7A for tools-team@ietf.org; Tue, 18 Jan 2005 11:09:18 -0500 Received: from az33exr01.mot.com (az33exr01.mot.com [10.64.251.231]) by motgate7.mot.com (Motorola/Motgate7) with ESMTP id j0IFiDKp001924 for ; Tue, 18 Jan 2005 08:44:13 -0700 (MST) Received: from ma19exm01.e6.bcs.mot.com (ma19exm01.e6.bcs.mot.com [10.14.33.5]) by az33exr01.mot.com (Motorola/az33exr01) with ESMTP id j0IFpvsR031204 for ; Tue, 18 Jan 2005 09:51:57 -0600 Received: by ma19exm01.e6.bcs.mot.com with Internet Mail Service (5.5.2657.72) id ; Tue, 18 Jan 2005 10:53:20 -0500 Message-ID: <62173B970AE0A044AED8723C3BCF238105CD43D5@ma19exm01.e6.bcs.mot.com> From: Eastlake III Donald-LDE008 To: "'Harald Tveit Alvestrand'" , tools-team@ietf.org Subject: RE: [Tools-team] Meeting Room Scheduler Requirements Date: Tue, 18 Jan 2005 10:53:17 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2657.72) Content-Type: text/plain X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 34d35111647d654d033d58d318c0d21a X-BeenThere: tools-team@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: "The purpose of the TOOLS team is to provide IETF feedback and guidance during the development of software tools to support various parts of IETF activities." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: tools-team-bounces@ietf.org Errors-To: tools-team-bounces@ietf.org X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Scan-Signature: e1b0e72ff1bbd457ceef31828f216a86 Thanks for the suggestions. Donald PS: I'm at the IEEE 802.11 Interim meeting in Monterey, California, right now and will not be on the tools call tomorrow since it conflicts with when I am actually chairing a meeting of the 802.11 Mesh Networking Task Group. -----Original Message----- From: Harald Tveit Alvestrand [mailto:harald@alvestrand.no] Sent: Tuesday, January 18, 2005 6:26 AM To: Eastlake III Donald-LDE008; tools-team@ietf.org Subject: Re: [Tools-team] Meeting Room Scheduler Requirements one more class of input: requests for groupings "near" each other, "not on the same day" and "on these specific dates of the week". the last one, when legitimate, is usually caused by some other organization scheduling a meeting that partly overlaps the IETF week. Harald --On 12. januar 2005 11:16 -0500 Eastlake III Donald-LDE008 wrote: > Hi, > > Attached and below is what I came up with. > > Thanks, > Donald > ========================================================= > Donald E. Eastlake III Donald.Eastlake@Motorola.com > Motorola Laboratories +1-508-786-7554 (work) > 111 Locke Drive +1-508-634-2066 (home) > Marlboro, MA 01752 USA > > > Meeting Room Scheduler - Requirements > Donald Eastlake 3rd > > Inputs: > Required: > * Room slots available (times and size) > * Room requests by chairs (duration and size) > Theoretically Optional but Expected: > * Non-conflict requests by > o Area Directors (defaults to the WGs and BoFs that AD is responsible > for) o Chairs > Optional: > * Manual assignments (used to meet special requirements) > * Existing schedule (so changes can be minimized on iterations after > first announced schedule) * Non-conflict requests by > o Attendees (not currently collected but could be added to registration > where attendees could list what they would like to attend to provide > better schedules and better room size estimates) > > Outputs: > * A schedule > * A goodness metric so quality of schedule for different meetings can be > compared and perhaps to provide push back that more room slots are needed > > Processing: > * Assuming a function that yields a goodness score for a schedule, > assign rooms in a heuristically fashion to optimize that score. The > design of this function is an interesting question and requires weighting > of the importance of the different inputs. A variety of functions and > parameter values should be tried. > > Assumptions: > * Massive single track events (plenary meetings and social) will be > scheduled manually and not included in room slots available or room > requests. > > Discussion: > The above is pretty much from the point of view of automating the > current manual process. There are alternative points of view such as more > of a "bidding" model where ADs and Chairs (and perhaps later attendees) > are each given an appropriate amount of some fake currency and they > express how strong each of their scheduling desires is by how much of > their currency they are willing to pay to get their way. This implies a > relatively continuous on-line bidding system whose results are frozen at > some point as opposed to the "batch" system described above. > > Next Step: > Implement some sort of prototype, probably file driven rather than > having a fancy user interface, and try it on the data for the upcoming > Minneapolis meeting or perhaps an earlier meeting if the Secretariat has > the data available. > > _______________________________________________ Tools-team mailing list Tools-team@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/tools-team From tools-team-bounces@ietf.org Wed Jan 19 08:06:56 2005 Received: from ietf-mx.ietf.org (ietf-mx.ietf.org [132.151.6.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id IAA10316; Wed, 19 Jan 2005 08:06:56 -0500 (EST) Received: from megatron.ietf.org ([132.151.6.71]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.33) id 1CrFnV-0001iD-3v; Wed, 19 Jan 2005 08:22:57 -0500 Received: from localhost.localdomain ([127.0.0.1] helo=megatron.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1CrFX7-0006GV-9D; Wed, 19 Jan 2005 08:06:01 -0500 Received: from odin.ietf.org ([132.151.1.176] helo=ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1CrFTZ-0005Cd-SD for tools-team@megatron.ietf.org; Wed, 19 Jan 2005 08:02:24 -0500 Received: from ietf-mx.ietf.org (ietf-mx.ietf.org [132.151.6.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id IAA09594 for ; Wed, 19 Jan 2005 08:02:20 -0500 (EST) Received: from penguin.ericsson.se ([193.180.251.47]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.33) id 1CrFiy-0001Vg-66 for tools-team@ietf.org; Wed, 19 Jan 2005 08:18:21 -0500 Received: from esealmw141.al.sw.ericsson.se ([153.88.254.120]) by penguin.ericsson.se (8.12.10/8.12.10/WIREfire-1.8b) with ESMTP id j0JD2Eh5022920 for ; Wed, 19 Jan 2005 14:02:14 +0100 (MET) Received: from esealnt613.al.sw.ericsson.se ([153.88.254.125]) by esealmw141.al.sw.ericsson.se with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.211); Wed, 19 Jan 2005 14:02:14 +0100 Received: from [147.214.181.88] (pinot-gris.ki.sw.ericsson.se [147.214.181.88]) by esealnt613.al.sw.ericsson.se with SMTP (Microsoft Exchange Internet Mail Service Version 5.5.2657.72) id ZAPGCQHJ; Wed, 19 Jan 2005 14:02:14 +0100 Message-ID: <41EE5A4D.2070102@ericsson.com> Date: Wed, 19 Jan 2005 14:02:05 +0100 X-Sybari-Trust: 9eefb61d 8bd604a9 e7288af9 00000138 From: Henrik Levkowetz User-Agent: Mozilla Thunderbird 0.9 (X11/20041124) X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: tools-team@ietf.org Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-15; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-OriginalArrivalTime: 19 Jan 2005 13:02:14.0565 (UTC) FILETIME=[18C04550:01C4FE27] X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 7aefe408d50e9c7c47615841cb314bed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: [Tools-team] No telechat today X-BeenThere: tools-team@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: henrik@levkowetz.com List-Id: "The purpose of the TOOLS team is to provide IETF feedback and guidance during the development of software tools to support various parts of IETF activities." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: tools-team-bounces@ietf.org Errors-To: tools-team-bounces@ietf.org X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 68c8cc8a64a9d0402e43b8eee9fc4199 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Hi, I've run into a conflict with the tools-team meeting today, so won't hold a telechat. Our regular programming will be resumed next week as usual. Henrik _______________________________________________ Tools-team mailing list Tools-team@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/tools-team From tools-team-bounces@ietf.org Thu Jan 20 11:44:17 2005 Received: from ietf-mx.ietf.org (ietf-mx.ietf.org [132.151.6.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id LAA13911; Thu, 20 Jan 2005 11:44:17 -0500 (EST) Received: from megatron.ietf.org ([132.151.6.71]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.33) id 1Crffe-0003Tc-I4; Thu, 20 Jan 2005 12:00:34 -0500 Received: from localhost.localdomain ([127.0.0.1] helo=megatron.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1CrfKE-0005g2-1f; Thu, 20 Jan 2005 11:38:26 -0500 Received: from odin.ietf.org ([132.151.1.176] helo=ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1CrfH9-0004j9-2G; Thu, 20 Jan 2005 11:35:15 -0500 Received: from ietf-mx.ietf.org (ietf-mx.ietf.org [132.151.6.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id LAA12988; Thu, 20 Jan 2005 11:35:12 -0500 (EST) Received: from megatron.ietf.org ([132.151.6.71]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.33) id 1CrfWr-0003AZ-A1; Thu, 20 Jan 2005 11:51:29 -0500 Received: from apache by megatron.ietf.org with local (Exim 4.32) id 1Crf9J-0002jT-1A; Thu, 20 Jan 2005 11:27:09 -0500 Content-Type: text/plain; Mime-Version: 1.0 To: Working Group Chairs From: IETF Secretariat Message-Id: Date: Thu, 20 Jan 2005 11:27:09 -0500 X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 7a6398bf8aaeabc7a7bb696b6b0a2aad Cc: tools-team@ietf.org, iesg@ietf.org Subject: [Tools-team] Enhancement to IETF IPR Disclosure Search Capability X-BeenThere: tools-team@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: "The purpose of the TOOLS team is to provide IETF feedback and guidance during the development of software tools to support various parts of IETF activities." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: tools-team-bounces@ietf.org Errors-To: tools-team-bounces@ietf.org X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 856eb5f76e7a34990d1d457d8e8e5b7f Dear IETF Working Group Chairs: The "Keyword Search" capability of the "IETF IPR Disclosure Page" (https://datatracker.ietf.org/public/ipr_disclosure.cgi) has been updated to allow for searches on "Words in IPR disclosure title." This new search capability may be useful in identifying pertinent IPR disclosures that are not related to a specific Internet-Draft or RFC, such as those related to a technology in general. If you require assistance in using the "IETF IPR Disclosure Page," or wish to report a bug, then please send a message to ietf-action@ietf.org. The IETF Secretariat _______________________________________________ Tools-team mailing list Tools-team@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/tools-team From tools-team-bounces@ietf.org Tue Jan 25 02:12:08 2005 Received: from ietf-mx.ietf.org (ietf-mx.ietf.org [132.151.6.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id CAA27445; Tue, 25 Jan 2005 02:12:08 -0500 (EST) Received: from megatron.ietf.org ([132.151.6.71]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.33) id 1CtL8d-0003z3-1F; Tue, 25 Jan 2005 02:29:23 -0500 Received: from localhost.localdomain ([127.0.0.1] helo=megatron.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1CtKrK-0005km-9J; Tue, 25 Jan 2005 02:11:30 -0500 Received: from odin.ietf.org ([132.151.1.176] helo=ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1CtKoL-0004nh-Jx; Tue, 25 Jan 2005 02:08:25 -0500 Received: from ietf-mx.ietf.org (ietf-mx.ietf.org [132.151.6.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id CAA24445; Tue, 25 Jan 2005 02:08:24 -0500 (EST) Received: from basie.internet2.edu ([207.75.164.22]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.33) id 1CtL4z-0003pa-8x; Tue, 25 Jan 2005 02:25:38 -0500 Received: from localhost (unknown [127.0.0.1]) by basie.internet2.edu (Postfix) with ESMTP id 888631CD5F1; Tue, 25 Jan 2005 02:08:20 -0500 (EST) Received: from basie.internet2.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (basie.internet2.edu [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 01416-04; Tue, 25 Jan 2005 02:08:20 -0500 (EST) Received: from localhost (unknown [127.0.0.1]) by basie.internet2.edu (Postfix) with ESMTP id 41F4E1CD51A; Tue, 25 Jan 2005 02:08:20 -0500 (EST) To: Internet-Drafts Administrator , Henrik Levkowetz From: stanislav shalunov Date: 25 Jan 2005 02:08:17 -0500 Message-ID: <86oefeouji.fsf@abel.internet2.edu> Lines: 37 User-Agent: Gnus/5.09 (Gnus v5.9.0) Emacs/21.3 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Virus-Scanned: by mail.internet2.edu virus scanner X-Spam-Score: 1.2 (+) X-Scan-Signature: 39bd8f8cbb76cae18b7e23f7cf6b2b9f Cc: IETF Tools Subject: [Tools-team] draft-ietf-tools-notification-00.txt X-BeenThere: tools-team@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: "The purpose of the TOOLS team is to provide IETF feedback and guidance during the development of software tools to support various parts of IETF activities." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: tools-team-bounces@ietf.org Errors-To: tools-team-bounces@ietf.org X-Spam-Score: 1.2 (+) X-Scan-Signature: a7d6aff76b15f3f56fcb94490e1052e4 -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Dear Internet-Drafts Administrator, Please publish http://www.internet2.edu/~shalunov/ietf-tools/draft-ietf-tools-notification-00.txt (SHA1 = f10497bfc7dd5dc12a779612c001eb9a117a636e) as an internet-draft. Henrik, Please approve publication of the initial version. Tools team, Could you see if this is very generally what we want. Let's discuss on the phone on Wednesday. Editorial comments are probably premature at this point, but suggestions on the general direction, etc., are very welcome. --Stanislav -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: PGPfreeware 5.0i for non-commercial use Charset: noconv iQCVAwUBQfXwRJRUn1EgN49xAQHcMQP/YfvR7SXFCo3YG3iyqlmaMeqwNabUTq01 wnm7ZBaiENcVGQSIAZ4hBv9BdndTRMoEO2n/QufF5n4d/bYC2SQA++NvJ87Niche FJNwrfrrh5mK9Ws3gVvesbR/sWySLxQylff1vQmyTC9DG2bv982W7TtJiqxhaVvN OhqrcgJoj5A= =AoC2 -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- -- Stanislav Shalunov http://www.internet2.edu/~shalunov/ Democracy is a form of government that substitutes election by the incompetent many for appointment by the corrupt few. -- G. B. Shaw _______________________________________________ Tools-team mailing list Tools-team@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/tools-team From tools-team-bounces@ietf.org Tue Jan 25 12:55:59 2005 Received: from ietf-mx.ietf.org (ietf-mx.ietf.org [132.151.6.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id MAA24165; Tue, 25 Jan 2005 12:55:59 -0500 (EST) Received: from megatron.ietf.org ([132.151.6.71]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.33) id 1CtVBo-0001yT-TH; Tue, 25 Jan 2005 13:13:21 -0500 Received: from localhost.localdomain ([127.0.0.1] helo=megatron.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1CtUuJ-0001gG-FJ; Tue, 25 Jan 2005 12:55:15 -0500 Received: from odin.ietf.org ([132.151.1.176] helo=ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1CtUs2-0001Kv-Az for tools-team@megatron.ietf.org; Tue, 25 Jan 2005 12:52:54 -0500 Received: from ietf-mx.ietf.org (ietf-mx.ietf.org [132.151.6.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id MAA23890 for ; Tue, 25 Jan 2005 12:52:51 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail-red.research.att.com ([192.20.225.110] helo=mail-white.research.att.com) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.33) id 1CtV8m-0001qV-7t for tools-team@ietf.org; Tue, 25 Jan 2005 13:10:13 -0500 Received: from bright.research.att.com (bright.research.att.com [135.207.20.189]) by mail-blue.research.att.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3F33F1974DD for ; Tue, 25 Jan 2005 12:37:04 -0500 (EST) Received: (from fenner@localhost) by bright.research.att.com (8.12.11/8.12.10/Submit) id j0PHqJJE003535; Tue, 25 Jan 2005 09:52:19 -0800 Message-Id: <200501251752.j0PHqJJE003535@bright.research.att.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII To: tools-team@ietf.org Subject: Re: [Tools-team] draft-ietf-tools-notification-00.txt Date: Tue, 25 Jan 2005 09:52:19 -0800 From: Bill Fenner Versions: dmail (linux) 2.6d/makemail 2.10 X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 30ac594df0e66ffa5a93eb4c48bcb014 X-BeenThere: tools-team@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: "The purpose of the TOOLS team is to provide IETF feedback and guidance during the development of software tools to support various parts of IETF activities." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: tools-team-bounces@ietf.org Errors-To: tools-team-bounces@ietf.org X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 1ac7cc0a4cd376402b85bc1961a86ac2 > However, the > current IETF policies do not appear to disallow the reuse of the file > name of an expired internet-draft for a new internet-draft. I don't know if the policies do, but the procedures do - as far as I'm aware, the secretariat's tool won't allow this reuse. Bill _______________________________________________ Tools-team mailing list Tools-team@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/tools-team From tools-team-bounces@ietf.org Tue Jan 25 14:20:04 2005 Received: from ietf-mx.ietf.org (ietf-mx.ietf.org [132.151.6.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id OAA29581; Tue, 25 Jan 2005 14:20:04 -0500 (EST) Received: from megatron.ietf.org ([132.151.6.71]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.33) id 1CtWVA-0004gw-4z; Tue, 25 Jan 2005 14:37:25 -0500 Received: from localhost.localdomain ([127.0.0.1] helo=megatron.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1CtWDF-0004tj-91; Tue, 25 Jan 2005 14:18:53 -0500 Received: from odin.ietf.org ([132.151.1.176] helo=ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1CtW7C-0003qY-OO for tools-team@megatron.ietf.org; Tue, 25 Jan 2005 14:12:38 -0500 Received: from ietf-mx.ietf.org (ietf-mx.ietf.org [132.151.6.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id OAA28996 for ; Tue, 25 Jan 2005 14:12:37 -0500 (EST) Received: from e33.co.us.ibm.com ([32.97.110.131]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.33) id 1CtWNx-0004Pl-2c for tools-team@ietf.org; Tue, 25 Jan 2005 14:29:58 -0500 Received: from westrelay02.boulder.ibm.com (westrelay02.boulder.ibm.com [9.17.195.11]) by e33.co.us.ibm.com (8.12.10/8.12.9) with ESMTP id j0PJC5CO651016 for ; Tue, 25 Jan 2005 14:12:05 -0500 Received: from d03av02.boulder.ibm.com (d03av02.boulder.ibm.com [9.17.195.168]) by westrelay02.boulder.ibm.com (8.12.10/NCO/VER6.6) with ESMTP id j0PJC4bk405356 for ; Tue, 25 Jan 2005 12:12:04 -0700 Received: from d03av02.boulder.ibm.com (loopback [127.0.0.1]) by d03av02.boulder.ibm.com (8.12.11/8.12.11) with ESMTP id j0PJC4or031351 for ; Tue, 25 Jan 2005 12:12:04 -0700 Received: from rotala.raleigh.ibm.com (rotala.raleigh.ibm.com [9.37.211.15]) by d03av02.boulder.ibm.com (8.12.11/8.12.11) with ESMTP id j0PJC4OY031319 for ; Tue, 25 Jan 2005 12:12:04 -0700 Received: from rotala.raleigh.ibm.com (localhost.localdomain [127.0.0.1]) by rotala.raleigh.ibm.com (8.12.8/8.12.5) with ESMTP id j0PJCUth020861 for ; Tue, 25 Jan 2005 14:12:30 -0500 Received: from rotala.raleigh.ibm.com (narten@localhost) by rotala.raleigh.ibm.com (8.12.8/8.12.8/Submit) with ESMTP id j0PJCTO9020857 for ; Tue, 25 Jan 2005 14:12:30 -0500 Message-Id: <200501251912.j0PJCTO9020857@rotala.raleigh.ibm.com> To: tools-team@ietf.org Date: Tue, 25 Jan 2005 14:12:29 -0500 From: Thomas Narten X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 52e1467c2184c31006318542db5614d5 Subject: [Tools-team] tool suggestion for MPLS IETF X-BeenThere: tools-team@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: "The purpose of the TOOLS team is to provide IETF feedback and guidance during the development of software tools to support various parts of IETF activities." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: tools-team-bounces@ietf.org Errors-To: tools-team-bounces@ietf.org X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Scan-Signature: e1e48a527f609d1be2bc8d8a70eb76cb Recalling a discussion from the last IETF, it sure would be nice if there was a single web page that listed all WG agendas, and the agendas were actually up-to-date. Problem statement: WG agendas should be collected on a single page, and be updatable in essentially real-time, even during the WG meetings; can't we just have a tool that does this? requirements (?) - viewable via browser of course, should be html to support links (e.g., to IDs, etc.). But .txt file works too. - single rsync/wget to get a snapshot of entire set of agendas (e.g., before getting onto plane) - chairs can update as often as they like (in real time), including moments before their WG meeting. - simple format/interface is fine -- each chair gets to update one file (i.e, their agenda). so, need the equivalent of allowing a restricted "scp" to update a page - run without secretariate help, so CNRI doesn't have be involved (they have enough to do around meeting times anyway, it seems. Plus, we want this to be done completely through software.) - might be useful to have a secondary tool that sends reminders to chairs of wgs that don't have agendas listed, at least to get at least an initial agenda posted... But that is detail... (might be more requirements...) Thoughts? What about running a prototype/experiment that attempts the above and then evaluate how it works? We do it ourselves, on our own (non-CNRI) web site, and ask WG-chairs to participate. Thomas _______________________________________________ Tools-team mailing list Tools-team@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/tools-team From tools-team-bounces@ietf.org Tue Jan 25 19:42:02 2005 Received: from ietf-mx.ietf.org (ietf-mx.ietf.org [132.151.6.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id TAA01138; Tue, 25 Jan 2005 19:42:02 -0500 (EST) Received: from megatron.ietf.org ([132.151.6.71]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.33) id 1CtbWp-0000mQ-Vb; Tue, 25 Jan 2005 19:59:28 -0500 Received: from localhost.localdomain ([127.0.0.1] helo=megatron.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1Ctb8c-0000j6-Op; Tue, 25 Jan 2005 19:34:26 -0500 Received: from odin.ietf.org ([132.151.1.176] helo=ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1Ctb53-00089e-Og for tools-team@megatron.ietf.org; Tue, 25 Jan 2005 19:30:45 -0500 Received: from ietf-mx.ietf.org (ietf-mx.ietf.org [132.151.6.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id TAA00340 for ; Tue, 25 Jan 2005 19:30:42 -0500 (EST) Received: from basie.internet2.edu ([207.75.164.22]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.33) id 1CtbLr-0000PW-7h for tools-team@ietf.org; Tue, 25 Jan 2005 19:48:08 -0500 Received: from localhost (unknown [127.0.0.1]) by basie.internet2.edu (Postfix) with ESMTP id 878E31CD7D4 for ; Tue, 25 Jan 2005 19:30:43 -0500 (EST) Received: from basie.internet2.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (basie.internet2.edu [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 26163-10 for ; Tue, 25 Jan 2005 19:30:43 -0500 (EST) Received: from localhost (unknown [127.0.0.1]) by basie.internet2.edu (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4C7FD1CD4FA for ; Tue, 25 Jan 2005 19:30:43 -0500 (EST) To: tools-team@ietf.org Subject: Re: [Tools-team] draft-ietf-tools-notification-00.txt References: <200501251752.j0PHqJJE003535@bright.research.att.com> From: stanislav shalunov Date: 25 Jan 2005 19:30:42 -0500 In-Reply-To: <200501251752.j0PHqJJE003535@bright.research.att.com> Message-ID: <86zmyxnia5.fsf@abel.internet2.edu> Lines: 23 User-Agent: Gnus/5.09 (Gnus v5.9.0) Emacs/21.3 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Virus-Scanned: by mail.internet2.edu virus scanner X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 7655788c23eb79e336f5f8ba8bce7906 X-BeenThere: tools-team@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: "The purpose of the TOOLS team is to provide IETF feedback and guidance during the development of software tools to support various parts of IETF activities." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: tools-team-bounces@ietf.org Errors-To: tools-team-bounces@ietf.org X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 0bc60ec82efc80c84b8d02f4b0e4de22 Bill Fenner writes: > > However, the > > current IETF policies do not appear to disallow the reuse of the file > > name of an expired internet-draft for a new internet-draft. > > I don't know if the policies do, but the procedures do - as far as > I'm aware, the secretariat's tool won't allow this reuse. Inserted this sentence in the end of the paragraph: Note that the tool currently used by the internet-drafts administrator will (advantageously) not allow such reuse. Alex, Does the submission tool enforce uniqueness of draft file names even after expiration? -- Stanislav Shalunov http://www.internet2.edu/~shalunov/ This message is designed to be viewed with 0.06479891g of NaCl. _______________________________________________ Tools-team mailing list Tools-team@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/tools-team From tools-team-bounces@ietf.org Wed Jan 26 04:05:14 2005 Received: from ietf-mx.ietf.org (ietf-mx.ietf.org [132.151.6.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id EAA02830; Wed, 26 Jan 2005 04:05:14 -0500 (EST) Received: from megatron.ietf.org ([132.151.6.71]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.33) id 1CtjNr-0006cD-IZ; Wed, 26 Jan 2005 04:22:43 -0500 Received: from localhost.localdomain ([127.0.0.1] helo=megatron.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1Ctj6N-0002YY-GY; Wed, 26 Jan 2005 04:04:39 -0500 Received: from odin.ietf.org ([132.151.1.176] helo=ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1Ctj5b-0002NX-LX for tools-team@megatron.ietf.org; Wed, 26 Jan 2005 04:03:51 -0500 Received: from ietf-mx.ietf.org (ietf-mx.ietf.org [132.151.6.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id EAA02756 for ; Wed, 26 Jan 2005 04:03:49 -0500 (EST) Received: from basie.internet2.edu ([207.75.164.22]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.33) id 1CtjMT-0006ZJ-Dg for tools-team@ietf.org; Wed, 26 Jan 2005 04:21:18 -0500 Received: from localhost (unknown [127.0.0.1]) by basie.internet2.edu (Postfix) with ESMTP id 58E131CD713 for ; Wed, 26 Jan 2005 04:03:49 -0500 (EST) Received: from basie.internet2.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (basie.internet2.edu [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 17085-01 for ; Wed, 26 Jan 2005 04:03:49 -0500 (EST) Received: from localhost (unknown [127.0.0.1]) by basie.internet2.edu (Postfix) with ESMTP id 14CFE1CD790 for ; Wed, 26 Jan 2005 04:03:49 -0500 (EST) To: IETF Tools References: <864qh4o9nn.fsf@abel.internet2.edu> From: stanislav shalunov Date: 26 Jan 2005 04:03:49 -0500 In-Reply-To: <864qh4o9nn.fsf@abel.internet2.edu> Message-ID: <86zmywmuiy.fsf@abel.internet2.edu> Lines: 20 User-Agent: Gnus/5.09 (Gnus v5.9.0) Emacs/21.3 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Virus-Scanned: by mail.internet2.edu virus scanner X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 79899194edc4f33a41f49410777972f8 Subject: [Tools-team] draft-ietf-tools-notification-01.txt X-BeenThere: tools-team@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: "The purpose of the TOOLS team is to provide IETF feedback and guidance during the development of software tools to support various parts of IETF activities." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: tools-team-bounces@ietf.org Errors-To: tools-team-bounces@ietf.org X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 9182cfff02fae4f1b6e9349e01d62f32 http://www.internet2.edu/~shalunov/ietf-tools/draft-ietf-tools-notification-01.txt has been submitted to the internet-drafts administrator. This version contains a few minor editorial changes and clarifications. I just wanted to have a fresh version out before the call tomorrow. If you've read the -00 version, reading -01 is not necessary. However, if you would like to make editorial comments (which would only make sense after we discuss the more general aspects during the call), starting from -01 probably makes more sense. Henrik, Can we set some time aside on the agenda tomorrow to talk about this draft? --Stas -- Stanislav Shalunov http://www.internet2.edu/~shalunov/ Just my 0.086g of Ag. _______________________________________________ Tools-team mailing list Tools-team@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/tools-team From tools-team-bounces@ietf.org Wed Jan 26 10:10:53 2005 Received: from ietf-mx.ietf.org (ietf-mx.ietf.org [132.151.6.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id KAA03978; Wed, 26 Jan 2005 10:10:53 -0500 (EST) Received: from megatron.ietf.org ([132.151.6.71]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.33) id 1Ctp5k-0000vd-TU; Wed, 26 Jan 2005 10:28:26 -0500 Received: from localhost.localdomain ([127.0.0.1] helo=megatron.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1Ctoer-0005q8-8h; Wed, 26 Jan 2005 10:00:37 -0500 Received: from odin.ietf.org ([132.151.1.176] helo=ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1CtoXo-0002jy-3H for tools-team@megatron.ietf.org; Wed, 26 Jan 2005 09:53:22 -0500 Received: from ietf-mx.ietf.org (ietf-mx.ietf.org [132.151.6.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id JAA01635 for ; Wed, 26 Jan 2005 09:53:17 -0500 (EST) Received: from penguin.ericsson.se ([193.180.251.47]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.33) id 1Ctoof-0000JW-1Q for tools-team@ietf.org; Wed, 26 Jan 2005 10:10:49 -0500 Received: from esealmw141.al.sw.ericsson.se ([153.88.254.120]) by penguin.ericsson.se (8.12.10/8.12.10/WIREfire-1.8b) with ESMTP id j0QErAh5000560 for ; Wed, 26 Jan 2005 15:53:12 +0100 (MET) Received: from esealnt613.al.sw.ericsson.se ([153.88.254.125]) by esealmw141.al.sw.ericsson.se with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.211); Wed, 26 Jan 2005 15:53:17 +0100 Received: from [147.214.181.88] (pinot-gris.ki.sw.ericsson.se [147.214.181.88]) by esealnt613.al.sw.ericsson.se with SMTP (Microsoft Exchange Internet Mail Service Version 5.5.2657.72) id DT1PQHNW; Wed, 26 Jan 2005 15:53:10 +0100 Message-ID: <41F7AED5.30007@ericsson.com> Date: Wed, 26 Jan 2005 15:53:09 +0100 X-Sybari-Trust: 728508e9 b8ec86c7 4f9ee24a 00000139 From: Henrik Levkowetz User-Agent: Debian Thunderbird 1.0 (X11/20050116) X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Tools team Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-15; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-OriginalArrivalTime: 26 Jan 2005 14:53:17.0210 (UTC) FILETIME=[C4E377A0:01C503B6] X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 769a46790fb42fbb0b0cc700c82f7081 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: [Tools-team] Agenda for 26 Jan telechat X-BeenThere: tools-team@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: henrik@levkowetz.com List-Id: "The purpose of the TOOLS team is to provide IETF feedback and guidance during the development of software tools to support various parts of IETF activities." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: tools-team-bounces@ietf.org Errors-To: tools-team-bounces@ietf.org X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 538aad3a3c4f01d8b6a6477ca4248793 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Here is the proposed agenda for today's meeting. --------------------------------------------------------- 1. Agenda bashing 2. Comments on minutes from last teleconference. 3. Comments on Thomas request for wg agenda web-page / tool 4. Action item review. * Stas: Start looking at Notification Service Requirements. * Alex: Continue thinking about Draft Status Page Requirements. * Henrik: Do writeup and submit draft-submission draft for publication. * Henrik: Propose a Relax NG specification of draft meta-information * Donald: Continued work on the WG meeting scheduling tool 5. Action items for next meeting 6. Any other business. 7. Next meeting: Teleconference Wednesday 2 Feb 17:00 GMT (same local time as today). --------------------------------------------------------- Connection details: To join the call, dial +1-734-615-7474 and enter PIN 0151989. One can also join the call by dialling: sip:session_0151989@edial.internet2.edu on a SIP-enabled voice communications client. If the SIP client cannot dial URLs, you can have the conference system call you if you have the sip URL for your phone. Go to https://edial.internet2.edu/call/0151989 and type in the URL to your phone, and follow the directions. _______________________________________________ Tools-team mailing list Tools-team@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/tools-team From tools-team-bounces@ietf.org Wed Jan 26 16:40:58 2005 Received: from ietf-mx.ietf.org (ietf-mx.ietf.org [132.151.6.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id QAA23275; Wed, 26 Jan 2005 16:40:58 -0500 (EST) Received: from megatron.ietf.org ([132.151.6.71]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.33) id 1CtvBK-0006DA-JD; Wed, 26 Jan 2005 16:58:34 -0500 Received: from localhost.localdomain ([127.0.0.1] helo=megatron.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1CtusC-00053Z-Mx; Wed, 26 Jan 2005 16:38:48 -0500 Received: from odin.ietf.org ([132.151.1.176] helo=ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1Ctuny-0002WP-8j for tools-team@megatron.ietf.org; Wed, 26 Jan 2005 16:34:26 -0500 Received: from ietf-mx.ietf.org (ietf-mx.ietf.org [132.151.6.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id QAA22776 for ; Wed, 26 Jan 2005 16:34:23 -0500 (EST) Received: from basie.internet2.edu ([207.75.164.22]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.33) id 1Ctv4w-00064f-Nb for tools-team@ietf.org; Wed, 26 Jan 2005 16:52:00 -0500 Received: from localhost (unknown [127.0.0.1]) by basie.internet2.edu (Postfix) with ESMTP id D4A1C1CD5E9; Wed, 26 Jan 2005 16:34:19 -0500 (EST) Received: from basie.internet2.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (basie.internet2.edu [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 17897-05; Wed, 26 Jan 2005 16:34:19 -0500 (EST) Received: from localhost (unknown [127.0.0.1]) by basie.internet2.edu (Postfix) with ESMTP id B58F71CD587; Wed, 26 Jan 2005 16:34:19 -0500 (EST) To: "Joel M. Halpern" References: <200501262030.PAA12106@ietf.org> <6.1.2.0.0.20050126161603.03a41408@localhost> From: stanislav shalunov Date: 26 Jan 2005 16:34:19 -0500 In-Reply-To: <6.1.2.0.0.20050126161603.03a41408@localhost> Message-ID: <86d5vrnack.fsf_-_@abel.internet2.edu> Lines: 50 User-Agent: Gnus/5.09 (Gnus v5.9.0) Emacs/21.3 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Virus-Scanned: by mail.internet2.edu virus scanner X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 0ddefe323dd869ab027dbfff7eff0465 Cc: IETF Tools Subject: [Tools-team] Re: draft-ietf-tools-notification-01.txt X-BeenThere: tools-team@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: "The purpose of the TOOLS team is to provide IETF feedback and guidance during the development of software tools to support various parts of IETF activities." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: tools-team-bounces@ietf.org Errors-To: tools-team-bounces@ietf.org X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 3e15cc4fdc61d7bce84032741d11c8e5 Joel, Thank you for your input! As part of this message, I am sending a quoted copy of your message to the tools-team mailing list, without your explicit permission. It seems that, since your message contains nothing of personal or controversial nature, this should be acceptable. If you really meant to keep your comments private, I apologize. "Joel M. Halpern" writes: > If I am reading this right, it neglects one important class of > transition which has an implication for the scheme. > Documents transition from being personal I-Ds to WG I-Ds. > This may be coupled with a name change. > If I am tracking a document, and its name changes, I would like to > still be getting notifications about the document. > > It may be that we will conclude that the tagging has to change when > the name changes, and that therefore we can not provide this aspect > of the service. We should at least state that limitation. It is my understanding that such a transition is always coupled with a file name change, sometimes coupled with a change of the title and, perhaps, the set of authors, and might well be coupled with textual changes. The draft currently has this on transition from personal to working group documents: Occasionally, personal drafts are republished as working group drafts. In this case, since heritage can be partial and ambiguous, the new working group draft MUST be treated by the notification service as a completely new document. Should I explain the limitation further in the text or should I address it? I really think there's a judgment call as to whether the document is ``the same'' in case of republishing. Computers are bad at judgment. I could add a special event type REPUBLISHED-AS-WG-I-D that would alert the subscriber that a new draft that's in some sense a continuation of the personal one is available. The generation of the event would still require some human intervention. Would this be good? Not enough? Too much? -- Stanislav Shalunov http://www.internet2.edu/~shalunov/ "Computer Science is no more about computers than astronomy is about telescopes." -- E. W. Dijkstra _______________________________________________ Tools-team mailing list Tools-team@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/tools-team From tools-team-bounces@ietf.org Wed Jan 26 16:55:51 2005 Received: from ietf-mx.ietf.org (ietf-mx.ietf.org [132.151.6.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id QAA24622; Wed, 26 Jan 2005 16:55:51 -0500 (EST) Received: from megatron.ietf.org ([132.151.6.71]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.33) id 1CtvPj-0006Wj-FV; Wed, 26 Jan 2005 17:13:27 -0500 Received: from localhost.localdomain ([127.0.0.1] helo=megatron.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1Ctv6V-0003Ak-Ue; Wed, 26 Jan 2005 16:53:35 -0500 Received: from odin.ietf.org ([132.151.1.176] helo=ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1Ctv1y-0001A7-Us for tools-team@megatron.ietf.org; Wed, 26 Jan 2005 16:48:55 -0500 Received: from ietf-mx.ietf.org (ietf-mx.ietf.org [132.151.6.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id QAA23840 for ; Wed, 26 Jan 2005 16:48:52 -0500 (EST) Received: from ns.execdsl.net ([208.184.15.238] helo=EXECDSL.COM) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.33) id 1CtvIx-0006N4-FR for tools-team@ietf.org; Wed, 26 Jan 2005 17:06:29 -0500 Received: from [64.254.114.114] (HELO JLaptop.stevecrocker.com) by EXECDSL.COM (CommuniGate Pro SMTP 3.3) with ESMTP id 8870670; Wed, 26 Jan 2005 16:48:45 -0500 Message-Id: <6.1.2.0.0.20050126164430.03a04ab0@localhost> X-Sender: joel@stevecrocker.com@localhost X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 6.1.2.0 Date: Wed, 26 Jan 2005 16:47:28 -0500 To: stanislav shalunov From: "Joel M. Halpern" In-Reply-To: <86d5vrnack.fsf_-_@abel.internet2.edu> References: <200501262030.PAA12106@ietf.org> <6.1.2.0.0.20050126161603.03a41408@localhost> <86d5vrnack.fsf_-_@abel.internet2.edu> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 41c17b4b16d1eedaa8395c26e9a251c4 Cc: IETF Tools Subject: [Tools-team] Re: draft-ietf-tools-notification-01.txt X-BeenThere: tools-team@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: "The purpose of the TOOLS team is to provide IETF feedback and guidance during the development of software tools to support various parts of IETF activities." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: tools-team-bounces@ietf.org Errors-To: tools-team-bounces@ietf.org X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 25620135586de10c627e3628c432b04a (No problem with the forwarding to the tools team. I should have sent my note there myself.) The fact is that the transition from personal to wg draft is much more common than than the text you quote indicates. My own guess is that the bulk of wg IDs begin life as personal drafts. If we are going to treat this transition as producing a completely new draft, we should make very clear that simply getting notifications about a personal draft will not tell the watcher about the transition, and that notifications will simply stop when the change occurs. (Unless one is also watching all drafts for the relevant working group.) This is probably the best we can do for now. Yours, Joel At 04:34 PM 1/26/2005, stanislav shalunov wrote: >Joel, > >Thank you for your input! > >As part of this message, I am sending a quoted copy of your message to >the tools-team mailing list, without your explicit permission. It >seems that, since your message contains nothing of personal or >controversial nature, this should be acceptable. If you really meant >to keep your comments private, I apologize. > >"Joel M. Halpern" writes: > > > If I am reading this right, it neglects one important class of > > transition which has an implication for the scheme. > > Documents transition from being personal I-Ds to WG I-Ds. > > This may be coupled with a name change. > > If I am tracking a document, and its name changes, I would like to > > still be getting notifications about the document. > > > > It may be that we will conclude that the tagging has to change when > > the name changes, and that therefore we can not provide this aspect > > of the service. We should at least state that limitation. > >It is my understanding that such a transition is always coupled with a >file name change, sometimes coupled with a change of the title and, >perhaps, the set of authors, and might well be coupled with textual >changes. > >The draft currently has this on transition from personal to working >group documents: > > Occasionally, personal drafts are republished as working group > drafts. In this case, since heritage can be partial and ambiguous, > the new working group draft MUST be treated by the notification > service as a completely new document. > >Should I explain the limitation further in the text or should I >address it? I really think there's a judgment call as to whether the >document is ``the same'' in case of republishing. Computers are bad >at judgment. I could add a special event type REPUBLISHED-AS-WG-I-D >that would alert the subscriber that a new draft that's in some sense >a continuation of the personal one is available. The generation of >the event would still require some human intervention. Would this be >good? Not enough? Too much? > >-- >Stanislav Shalunov http://www.internet2.edu/~shalunov/ > >"Computer Science is no more about computers than astronomy is about >telescopes." -- E. W. Dijkstra _______________________________________________ Tools-team mailing list Tools-team@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/tools-team From tools-team-bounces@ietf.org Wed Jan 26 17:17:55 2005 Received: from ietf-mx.ietf.org (ietf-mx.ietf.org [132.151.6.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id RAA27974; Wed, 26 Jan 2005 17:17:55 -0500 (EST) Received: from megatron.ietf.org ([132.151.6.71]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.33) id 1Ctvl4-00079U-Sl; Wed, 26 Jan 2005 17:35:32 -0500 Received: from localhost.localdomain ([127.0.0.1] helo=megatron.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1CtvNl-0008HN-49; Wed, 26 Jan 2005 17:11:25 -0500 Received: from odin.ietf.org ([132.151.1.176] helo=ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1CtvJ7-0007Hu-9O for tools-team@megatron.ietf.org; Wed, 26 Jan 2005 17:06:37 -0500 Received: from ietf-mx.ietf.org (ietf-mx.ietf.org [132.151.6.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id RAA25555 for ; Wed, 26 Jan 2005 17:06:34 -0500 (EST) Received: from basie.internet2.edu ([207.75.164.22]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.33) id 1Ctva7-0006mx-2x for tools-team@ietf.org; Wed, 26 Jan 2005 17:24:11 -0500 Received: from localhost (unknown [127.0.0.1]) by basie.internet2.edu (Postfix) with ESMTP id 043981CD5E9; Wed, 26 Jan 2005 17:06:36 -0500 (EST) Received: from basie.internet2.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (basie.internet2.edu [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 22826-04; Wed, 26 Jan 2005 17:06:35 -0500 (EST) Received: from localhost (unknown [127.0.0.1]) by basie.internet2.edu (Postfix) with ESMTP id DA3FB1CD587; Wed, 26 Jan 2005 17:06:35 -0500 (EST) To: "Joel M. Halpern" References: <200501262030.PAA12106@ietf.org> <6.1.2.0.0.20050126161603.03a41408@localhost> <86d5vrnack.fsf_-_@abel.internet2.edu> <6.1.2.0.0.20050126164430.03a04ab0@localhost> From: stanislav shalunov Date: 26 Jan 2005 17:06:36 -0500 In-Reply-To: <6.1.2.0.0.20050126164430.03a04ab0@localhost> Message-ID: <868y6fn8ur.fsf@abel.internet2.edu> Lines: 35 User-Agent: Gnus/5.09 (Gnus v5.9.0) Emacs/21.3 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Virus-Scanned: by mail.internet2.edu virus scanner X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Scan-Signature: bb8f917bb6b8da28fc948aeffb74aa17 Cc: IETF Tools Subject: [Tools-team] Re: draft-ietf-tools-notification-01.txt X-BeenThere: tools-team@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: "The purpose of the TOOLS team is to provide IETF feedback and guidance during the development of software tools to support various parts of IETF activities." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: tools-team-bounces@ietf.org Errors-To: tools-team-bounces@ietf.org X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 7baded97d9887f7a0c7e8a33c2e3ea1b "Joel M. Halpern" writes: > If we are going to treat this transition as producing a completely new > draft, we should make very clear that simply getting notifications about a > personal draft will not tell the watcher about the transition, and that > notifications will simply stop when the change occurs. (Unless one is also > watching all drafts for the relevant working group.) > > This is probably the best we can do for now. Well, we could insert provisions to do better in the future, with a special event type as I described in my previous message. Events of this type would probably not be generated in the first phase of implementation, and would probably require human intervention even in the future. (How else would the system guess that draft-ietf-XXX-YYY-00.txt is really a continuation of draft-ZZZ-YYY-17.txt?) I recognize that it'd be desirable to be able to follow the same document easily. That's why this draft is written. The problem is that currently, there's no good way to learn that republished drafts are actually ``the same.'' I'm inclined to include the new event type and describe what to do about it, but not discuss its generation. --Stanislav P.S. I changed the word ``occasionally'' to ``frequently'' in that paragraph. -- Stanislav Shalunov http://www.internet2.edu/~shalunov/ Antibiotics comprise 2% of cow feed in U.S. feedlots, by weight. _______________________________________________ Tools-team mailing list Tools-team@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/tools-team From tools-team-bounces@ietf.org Thu Jan 27 12:49:41 2005 Received: from ietf-mx.ietf.org (ietf-mx.ietf.org [132.151.6.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id MAA06240; Thu, 27 Jan 2005 12:49:41 -0500 (EST) Received: from megatron.ietf.org ([132.151.6.71]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.33) id 1CuE3F-0001sZ-1W; Thu, 27 Jan 2005 13:07:29 -0500 Received: from localhost.localdomain ([127.0.0.1] helo=megatron.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1CuDjr-00081K-F5; Thu, 27 Jan 2005 12:47:27 -0500 Received: from odin.ietf.org ([132.151.1.176] helo=ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1CuDgn-0006eT-4n for tools-team@megatron.ietf.org; Thu, 27 Jan 2005 12:44:17 -0500 Received: from ietf-mx.ietf.org (ietf-mx.ietf.org [132.151.6.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id MAA05691 for ; Thu, 27 Jan 2005 12:44:13 -0500 (EST) Received: from eikenes.alvestrand.no ([158.38.152.233]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.33) id 1CuDxx-0001k2-A6 for tools-team@ietf.org; Thu, 27 Jan 2005 13:02:01 -0500 Received: from localhost (localhost.localdomain [127.0.0.1]) by eikenes.alvestrand.no (Postfix) with ESMTP id 97DB161BD5; Thu, 27 Jan 2005 18:43:45 +0100 (CET) Received: from eikenes.alvestrand.no ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (eikenes.alvestrand.no [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 04999-02; Thu, 27 Jan 2005 18:43:43 +0100 (CET) Received: from halvestr-w2k02.emea.cisco.com (localhost.localdomain [127.0.0.1]) by eikenes.alvestrand.no (Postfix) with ESMTP id C9F3A621FB; Thu, 27 Jan 2005 18:43:42 +0100 (CET) Date: Thu, 27 Jan 2005 18:42:31 +0100 From: Harald Tveit Alvestrand To: Thomas Narten , tools-team@ietf.org Subject: Re: [Tools-team] tool suggestion for MPLS IETF Message-ID: <212D46EB1EDED5A90F021CD8@B50854F0A9192E8EC6CDA126> In-Reply-To: <200501251912.j0PJCTO9020857@rotala.raleigh.ibm.com> References: <200501251912.j0PJCTO9020857@rotala.raleigh.ibm.com> X-Mailer: Mulberry/3.1.5 (Win32) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at alvestrand.no X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 4d87d2aa806f79fed918a62e834505ca Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-BeenThere: tools-team@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: "The purpose of the TOOLS team is to provide IETF feedback and guidance during the development of software tools to support various parts of IETF activities." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: tools-team-bounces@ietf.org Errors-To: tools-team-bounces@ietf.org X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 5a9a1bd6c2d06a21d748b7d0070ddcb8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit if someone were to run a wiki initialized with the agenda, it seems that little more would be required..... --On 25. januar 2005 14:12 -0500 Thomas Narten wrote: > Recalling a discussion from the last IETF, it sure would be nice if > there was a single web page that listed all WG agendas, and the > agendas were actually up-to-date. > > Problem statement: > > WG agendas should be collected on a single page, and be updatable in > essentially real-time, even during the WG meetings; can't we just have > a tool that does this? > > requirements (?) > - viewable via browser of course, should be html to support links > (e.g., to IDs, etc.). But .txt file works too. > - single rsync/wget to get a snapshot of entire set of agendas > (e.g., before getting onto plane) > - chairs can update as often as they like (in real time), > including moments before their WG meeting. > - simple format/interface is fine -- each chair gets to update > one file (i.e, their agenda). so, need the equivalent of > allowing a restricted "scp" to update a page > - run without secretariate help, so CNRI doesn't have be involved > (they have enough to do around meeting times anyway, it > seems. Plus, we want this to be done completely through software.) > - might be useful to have a secondary tool that sends reminders to > chairs of wgs that don't have agendas listed, at least to get > at least an initial agenda posted... But that is detail... > > (might be more requirements...) > > Thoughts? > > What about running a prototype/experiment that attempts the above and > then evaluate how it works? We do it ourselves, on our own (non-CNRI) > web site, and ask WG-chairs to participate. > > Thomas > > _______________________________________________ > Tools-team mailing list > Tools-team@ietf.org > https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/tools-team > > _______________________________________________ Tools-team mailing list Tools-team@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/tools-team From tools-team-bounces@ietf.org Thu Jan 27 15:50:24 2005 Received: from ietf-mx.ietf.org (ietf-mx.ietf.org [132.151.6.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id PAA23204; Thu, 27 Jan 2005 15:50:23 -0500 (EST) Received: from megatron.ietf.org ([132.151.6.71]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.33) id 1CuGs7-0006S8-Cf; Thu, 27 Jan 2005 16:08:12 -0500 Received: from localhost.localdomain ([127.0.0.1] helo=megatron.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1CuGYx-0006HW-7L; Thu, 27 Jan 2005 15:48:23 -0500 Received: from odin.ietf.org ([132.151.1.176] helo=ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1CuGSO-0002rG-TP for tools-team@megatron.ietf.org; Thu, 27 Jan 2005 15:41:36 -0500 Received: from ietf-mx.ietf.org (ietf-mx.ietf.org [132.151.6.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id PAA22456 for ; Thu, 27 Jan 2005 15:41:34 -0500 (EST) Received: from av4-2-sn3.vrr.skanova.net ([81.228.9.112]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.33) id 1CuGja-00067H-Qu for tools-team@ietf.org; Thu, 27 Jan 2005 15:59:23 -0500 Received: by av4-2-sn3.vrr.skanova.net (Postfix, from userid 502) id 685C537E65; Thu, 27 Jan 2005 21:41:04 +0100 (CET) Received: from smtp1-1-sn3.vrr.skanova.net (smtp1-1-sn3.vrr.skanova.net [81.228.9.177]) by av4-2-sn3.vrr.skanova.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5610B37E42; Thu, 27 Jan 2005 21:41:04 +0100 (CET) Received: from shiraz.levkowetz.com (h195n1fls311o871.telia.com [213.64.174.195]) by smtp1-1-sn3.vrr.skanova.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id C7F0E38004; Thu, 27 Jan 2005 21:41:01 +0100 (CET) Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]) by shiraz.levkowetz.com with esmtp (Exim 4.34) id 1CuGRp-0006Yl-Hh; Thu, 27 Jan 2005 21:41:01 +0100 Message-ID: <41F951DD.5060003@levkowetz.com> Date: Thu, 27 Jan 2005 21:41:01 +0100 From: Henrik Levkowetz User-Agent: Mozilla Thunderbird 0.9 (Macintosh/20041103) X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: IETF TOOLS Subject: Re: [Tools-team] tool suggestion for MPLS IETF References: <200501251912.j0PJCTO9020857@rotala.raleigh.ibm.com> <212D46EB1EDED5A90F021CD8@B50854F0A9192E8EC6CDA126> In-Reply-To: <212D46EB1EDED5A90F021CD8@B50854F0A9192E8EC6CDA126> X-Enigmail-Version: 0.89.5.0 X-Enigmail-Supports: pgp-inline, pgp-mime X-SA-Exim-Connect-IP: 127.0.0.1 X-SA-Exim-Mail-From: henrik@levkowetz.com X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No (on shiraz.levkowetz.com); SAEximRunCond expanded to false X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 41c17b4b16d1eedaa8395c26e9a251c4 Cc: Thomas Narten X-BeenThere: tools-team@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: "The purpose of the TOOLS team is to provide IETF feedback and guidance during the development of software tools to support various parts of IETF activities." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="===============0083104027==" Sender: tools-team-bounces@ietf.org Errors-To: tools-team-bounces@ietf.org X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Scan-Signature: f66b12316365a3fe519e75911daf28a8 This is an OpenPGP/MIME signed message (RFC 2440 and 3156) --===============0083104027== Content-Type: multipart/signed; micalg=pgp-sha1; protocol="application/pgp-signature"; boundary="------------enigAEA9D1C8E329C7BAB084BB29" This is an OpenPGP/MIME signed message (RFC 2440 and 3156) --------------enigAEA9D1C8E329C7BAB084BB29 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit On 2005-01-27 6:42 pm Harald Tveit Alvestrand said the following: > if someone were to run a wiki initialized with the agenda, it seems that > little more would be required..... Hmm, yes - I'll think about combining my html mark-up script with wiki pages - that might give us close to all that Thomas mentions... Henrik > --On 25. januar 2005 14:12 -0500 Thomas Narten wrote: > >> Recalling a discussion from the last IETF, it sure would be nice if >> there was a single web page that listed all WG agendas, and the >> agendas were actually up-to-date. >> >> Problem statement: >> >> WG agendas should be collected on a single page, and be updatable in >> essentially real-time, even during the WG meetings; can't we just have >> a tool that does this? >> >> requirements (?) >> - viewable via browser of course, should be html to support links >> (e.g., to IDs, etc.). But .txt file works too. >> - single rsync/wget to get a snapshot of entire set of agendas >> (e.g., before getting onto plane) >> - chairs can update as often as they like (in real time), >> including moments before their WG meeting. >> - simple format/interface is fine -- each chair gets to update >> one file (i.e, their agenda). so, need the equivalent of >> allowing a restricted "scp" to update a page >> - run without secretariate help, so CNRI doesn't have be involved >> (they have enough to do around meeting times anyway, it >> seems. Plus, we want this to be done completely through software.) >> - might be useful to have a secondary tool that sends reminders to >> chairs of wgs that don't have agendas listed, at least to get >> at least an initial agenda posted... But that is detail... >> >> (might be more requirements...) >> >> Thoughts? >> >> What about running a prototype/experiment that attempts the above and >> then evaluate how it works? We do it ourselves, on our own (non-CNRI) >> web site, and ask WG-chairs to participate. >> >> Thomas >> --------------enigAEA9D1C8E329C7BAB084BB29 Content-Type: application/pgp-signature; name="signature.asc" Content-Description: OpenPGP digital signature Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="signature.asc" -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.2.4 (Darwin) iD8DBQFB+VHdeVhrtTJkXCMRAiniAJ4/hdlRBl1XE1h0rv4VodymbJUWRwCg3rzh b+Pk2VIMScG6cS1bnwAr7Fk= =fL1h -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --------------enigAEA9D1C8E329C7BAB084BB29-- --===============0083104027== Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit _______________________________________________ Tools-team mailing list Tools-team@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/tools-team --===============0083104027==-- From tools-team-bounces@ietf.org Fri Jan 28 07:11:05 2005 Received: from ietf-mx.ietf.org (ietf-mx.ietf.org [132.151.6.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id HAA22404; Fri, 28 Jan 2005 07:11:05 -0500 (EST) Received: from megatron.ietf.org ([132.151.6.71]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.33) id 1CuVFG-0002ru-Kj; Fri, 28 Jan 2005 07:29:02 -0500 Received: from localhost.localdomain ([127.0.0.1] helo=megatron.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1CuUx8-0002rx-8j; Fri, 28 Jan 2005 07:10:18 -0500 Received: from odin.ietf.org ([132.151.1.176] helo=ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1CuUtt-00025e-Mn for tools-team@megatron.ietf.org; Fri, 28 Jan 2005 07:06:57 -0500 Received: from ietf-mx.ietf.org (ietf-mx.ietf.org [132.151.6.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id HAA22177 for ; Fri, 28 Jan 2005 07:06:54 -0500 (EST) Received: from eikenes.alvestrand.no ([158.38.152.233]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.33) id 1CuVBD-0002mJ-M1 for tools-team@ietf.org; Fri, 28 Jan 2005 07:24:52 -0500 Received: from localhost (localhost.localdomain [127.0.0.1]) by eikenes.alvestrand.no (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4510D62259; Fri, 28 Jan 2005 13:06:26 +0100 (CET) Received: from eikenes.alvestrand.no ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (eikenes.alvestrand.no [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 02139-01; Fri, 28 Jan 2005 13:06:24 +0100 (CET) Received: from halvestr-w2k02.emea.cisco.com (localhost.localdomain [127.0.0.1]) by eikenes.alvestrand.no (Postfix) with ESMTP id 878AC6220C; Fri, 28 Jan 2005 13:06:22 +0100 (CET) Date: Fri, 28 Jan 2005 12:46:00 +0100 From: Harald Tveit Alvestrand To: "Joel M. Halpern" , stanislav shalunov Subject: Re: [Tools-team] Re: draft-ietf-tools-notification-01.txt Message-ID: <90FB1979BF337A8B82DAB68E@B50854F0A9192E8EC6CDA126> In-Reply-To: <6.1.2.0.0.20050126164430.03a04ab0@localhost> References: <200501262030.PAA12106@ietf.org> <6.1.2.0.0.20050126161603.03a41408@localhost> <86d5vrnack.fsf_-_@abel.internet2.edu> <6.1.2.0.0.20050126164430.03a04ab0@localhost> X-Mailer: Mulberry/3.1.5 (Win32) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at alvestrand.no X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 14582b0692e7f70ce7111d04db3781c8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Cc: IETF Tools X-BeenThere: tools-team@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: "The purpose of the TOOLS team is to provide IETF feedback and guidance during the development of software tools to support various parts of IETF activities." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: tools-team-bounces@ietf.org Errors-To: tools-team-bounces@ietf.org X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 6e922792024732fb1bb6f346e63517e4 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit note about existing practice: occasionally the secretariat gets a message (I'm not sure how they get it) that one draft obsoletes another, as marked in the file listing all the internet-drafts. In that case, a notification service could do either or both of: - give a "final" notification that the old draft has been obsoleted by the new one - automatically add all watchers of the old draft to the new one. --On 26. januar 2005 16:47 -0500 "Joel M. Halpern" wrote: > (No problem with the forwarding to the tools team. I should have sent my > note there myself.) > > The fact is that the transition from personal to wg draft is much more > common than than the text you quote indicates. My own guess is that the > bulk of wg IDs begin life as personal drafts. > > If we are going to treat this transition as producing a completely new > draft, we should make very clear that simply getting notifications about > a personal draft will not tell the watcher about the transition, and that > notifications will simply stop when the change occurs. (Unless one is > also watching all drafts for the relevant working group.) > > This is probably the best we can do for now. > Yours, > Joel > > At 04:34 PM 1/26/2005, stanislav shalunov wrote: >> Joel, >> >> Thank you for your input! >> >> As part of this message, I am sending a quoted copy of your message to >> the tools-team mailing list, without your explicit permission. It >> seems that, since your message contains nothing of personal or >> controversial nature, this should be acceptable. If you really meant >> to keep your comments private, I apologize. >> >> "Joel M. Halpern" writes: >> >> > If I am reading this right, it neglects one important class of >> > transition which has an implication for the scheme. >> > Documents transition from being personal I-Ds to WG I-Ds. >> > This may be coupled with a name change. >> > If I am tracking a document, and its name changes, I would like to >> > still be getting notifications about the document. >> > >> > It may be that we will conclude that the tagging has to change when >> > the name changes, and that therefore we can not provide this aspect >> > of the service. We should at least state that limitation. >> >> It is my understanding that such a transition is always coupled with a >> file name change, sometimes coupled with a change of the title and, >> perhaps, the set of authors, and might well be coupled with textual >> changes. >> >> The draft currently has this on transition from personal to working >> group documents: >> >> Occasionally, personal drafts are republished as working group >> drafts. In this case, since heritage can be partial and ambiguous, >> the new working group draft MUST be treated by the notification >> service as a completely new document. >> >> Should I explain the limitation further in the text or should I >> address it? I really think there's a judgment call as to whether the >> document is ``the same'' in case of republishing. Computers are bad >> at judgment. I could add a special event type REPUBLISHED-AS-WG-I-D >> that would alert the subscriber that a new draft that's in some sense >> a continuation of the personal one is available. The generation of >> the event would still require some human intervention. Would this be >> good? Not enough? Too much? >> >> -- >> Stanislav Shalunov http://www.internet2.edu/~shalunov/ >> >> "Computer Science is no more about computers than astronomy is about >> telescopes." -- E. W. Dijkstra > > > _______________________________________________ > Tools-team mailing list > Tools-team@ietf.org > https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/tools-team > > _______________________________________________ Tools-team mailing list Tools-team@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/tools-team From tools-team-bounces@ietf.org Fri Jan 28 09:26:12 2005 Received: from ietf-mx.ietf.org (ietf-mx.ietf.org [132.151.6.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id JAA03999; Fri, 28 Jan 2005 09:26:11 -0500 (EST) Received: from megatron.ietf.org ([132.151.6.71]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.33) id 1CuXM0-0006EL-4P; Fri, 28 Jan 2005 09:44:09 -0500 Received: from localhost.localdomain ([127.0.0.1] helo=megatron.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1CuX3j-0005fe-Sg; Fri, 28 Jan 2005 09:25:15 -0500 Received: from odin.ietf.org ([132.151.1.176] helo=ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1CuWvN-0003J6-7b for tools-team@megatron.ietf.org; Fri, 28 Jan 2005 09:16:37 -0500 Received: from ietf-mx.ietf.org (ietf-mx.ietf.org [132.151.6.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id JAA03350 for ; Fri, 28 Jan 2005 09:16:35 -0500 (EST) Received: from eagle.ericsson.se ([193.180.251.53]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.33) id 1CuXCh-0005yD-70 for tools-team@ietf.org; Fri, 28 Jan 2005 09:34:32 -0500 Received: from esealmw128.eemea.ericsson.se ([153.88.254.121]) by eagle.ericsson.se (8.12.10/8.12.10/WIREfire-1.8b) with ESMTP id j0SEGROC010007; Fri, 28 Jan 2005 15:16:32 +0100 Received: from esealmw128.eemea.ericsson.se ([153.88.254.176]) by esealmw128.eemea.ericsson.se with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.211); Fri, 28 Jan 2005 15:16:41 +0100 Received: from [147.214.181.88] ([147.214.181.88]) by esealmw128.eemea.ericsson.se with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.211); Fri, 28 Jan 2005 15:16:40 +0100 Message-ID: <41FA493F.9040904@ericsson.com> Date: Fri, 28 Jan 2005 15:16:31 +0100 From: Henrik Levkowetz User-Agent: Debian Thunderbird 1.0 (X11/20050116) X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: stanislav shalunov Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-15; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-OriginalArrivalTime: 28 Jan 2005 14:16:40.0859 (UTC) FILETIME=[FC9666B0:01C50543] X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 08e48e05374109708c00c6208b534009 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Cc: Tools team Subject: [Tools-team] Atom X-BeenThere: tools-team@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: henrik@levkowetz.com List-Id: "The purpose of the TOOLS team is to provide IETF feedback and guidance during the development of software tools to support various parts of IETF activities." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: tools-team-bounces@ietf.org Errors-To: tools-team-bounces@ietf.org X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 7a6398bf8aaeabc7a7bb696b6b0a2aad Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Hi Stas, I said I'd send you a link to where I keep a copy of the Atom drafts: http://ietf.levkowetz.com/drafts/atompub Henrik _______________________________________________ Tools-team mailing list Tools-team@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/tools-team From tools-team-bounces@ietf.org Mon Jan 31 14:03:53 2005 Received: from ietf-mx.ietf.org (ietf-mx.ietf.org [132.151.6.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id OAA07887; Mon, 31 Jan 2005 14:03:53 -0500 (EST) Received: from megatron.ietf.org ([132.151.6.71]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.33) id 1Cvh83-0003bw-1E; Mon, 31 Jan 2005 14:22:31 -0500 Received: from localhost.localdomain ([127.0.0.1] helo=megatron.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1CvggL-0006b2-N1; Mon, 31 Jan 2005 13:53:53 -0500 Received: from odin.ietf.org ([132.151.1.176] helo=ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1CvgcI-0005oA-F8; Mon, 31 Jan 2005 13:49:42 -0500 Received: from ietf-mx.ietf.org (ietf-mx.ietf.org [132.151.6.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id NAA06201; Mon, 31 Jan 2005 13:49:39 -0500 (EST) Received: from basie.internet2.edu ([207.75.164.22]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.33) id 1CvguF-0003G4-Fa; Mon, 31 Jan 2005 14:08:18 -0500 Received: from localhost (unknown [127.0.0.1]) by basie.internet2.edu (Postfix) with ESMTP id 862181CD4E7; Mon, 31 Jan 2005 13:49:33 -0500 (EST) Received: from basie.internet2.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (basie.internet2.edu [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 32244-04; Mon, 31 Jan 2005 13:49:33 -0500 (EST) Received: from localhost (unknown [127.0.0.1]) by basie.internet2.edu (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6277E1CD536; Mon, 31 Jan 2005 13:49:33 -0500 (EST) To: Internet-Drafts Administrator From: stanislav shalunov Date: 31 Jan 2005 13:49:35 -0500 Message-ID: <86mzupph6o.fsf@abel.internet2.edu> Lines: 15 User-Agent: Gnus/5.09 (Gnus v5.9.0) Emacs/21.3 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Virus-Scanned: by mail.internet2.edu virus scanner X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 08170828343bcf1325e4a0fb4584481c Cc: IETF Tools Subject: [Tools-team] draft-ietf-tools-notification-03.txt X-BeenThere: tools-team@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: "The purpose of the TOOLS team is to provide IETF feedback and guidance during the development of software tools to support various parts of IETF activities." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: tools-team-bounces@ietf.org Errors-To: tools-team-bounces@ietf.org X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 79899194edc4f33a41f49410777972f8 -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Please publish http://www.internet2.edu/~shalunov/ietf-tools/draft-ietf-tools-notification-03.txt (SHA1 = 1b15a627ad52e48ab5c46ee94fbbd759dcc97420) as an internet-draft. -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: PGPfreeware 5.0i for non-commercial use Charset: noconv iQCVAwUBQf59opRUn1EgN49xAQFeoAQAkMRWqSehDDuqztO7bJIgoH7Ljoukxhoi wlJQA+qkLKm3vE1QrZPj7F9Bm/8q9WM6OUOvW18IvzbrZXI5TLtiqFSAzfVRctz4 EaIECPtL3N6MyIU5lTvfet46VVZIMzKqV9G6PzFw58qlgmNCdPoZj3cfFjPXDF+s Xs5VrZWIAl8= =LCSM -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- _______________________________________________ Tools-team mailing list Tools-team@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/tools-team