From pkyzivat@cisco.com Sun May 1 14:58:12 2011 Return-Path: X-Original-To: xml2rfc@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: xml2rfc@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 54701E06CC for ; Sun, 1 May 2011 14:58:12 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -110.599 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-110.599 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-2.599, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_HI=-8, USER_IN_WHITELIST=-100] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.30]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id EZtAX2dSnHvO for ; Sun, 1 May 2011 14:58:11 -0700 (PDT) Received: from rtp-iport-2.cisco.com (rtp-iport-2.cisco.com [64.102.122.149]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 990C8E0664 for ; Sun, 1 May 2011 14:58:11 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/simple; d=cisco.com; i=pkyzivat@cisco.com; l=284; q=dns/txt; s=iport; t=1304287091; x=1305496691; h=message-id:date:from:mime-version:to:subject: content-transfer-encoding; bh=6o9AfK/weZuxrurKLtYU/0F28mCl3q536M1ZtH5Z2QE=; b=VsufQ6z3aiiheApI473Zf3d487hYSsxQWS17WiRToPF1N542H1AkdsoN vsyDCYwRjKfIoeSpSMON/90YnI7ESera/3YtpBoMQZxfWeTVL6zGEtPjT 4VI1zMQ9YJtaVH3Mg+F/JplAgvokuQzh1g7eVHfIgWcHeCnBlIwNTR6jI w=; X-IronPort-AV: E=Sophos;i="4.64,299,1301875200"; d="scan'208";a="232001019" Received: from rcdn-core-5.cisco.com ([173.37.93.156]) by rtp-iport-2.cisco.com with ESMTP; 01 May 2011 21:58:10 +0000 Received: from [10.86.253.168] ([10.86.253.168]) by rcdn-core-5.cisco.com (8.14.3/8.14.3) with ESMTP id p41LwAu3012094; Sun, 1 May 2011 21:58:10 GMT Message-ID: <4DBDD771.2030403@cisco.com> Date: Sun, 01 May 2011 17:58:09 -0400 From: Paul Kyzivat User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 6.1; en-US; rv:1.9.2.15) Gecko/20110303 Thunderbird/3.1.9 MIME-Version: 1.0 To: xml2rfc@ietf.org Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailman-Approved-At: Mon, 02 May 2011 06:41:45 -0700 Subject: [xml2rfc] xml2rfc isn't putting the filename into the document X-BeenThere: xml2rfc@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.12 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sun, 01 May 2011 21:58:12 -0000 Today when I run xml2rfc (from http://xml.resource.org), its not putting the filename into the subject line. Instead, its putting: CGItemp9380-2 there. Then of course the submission tool is complaining and forbidding me from submitting the revised doc. :-( Help! Paul From julian.reschke@gmx.de Mon May 2 06:50:28 2011 Return-Path: X-Original-To: xml2rfc@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: xml2rfc@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id C992FE06EA for ; Mon, 2 May 2011 06:50:28 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -105.331 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-105.331 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=-2.732, BAYES_00=-2.599, USER_IN_WHITELIST=-100] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.30]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 6JFqUZb2yrp4 for ; Mon, 2 May 2011 06:50:28 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mailout-de.gmx.net (mailout-de.gmx.net [213.165.64.23]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with SMTP id B3DC7E0688 for ; Mon, 2 May 2011 06:50:27 -0700 (PDT) Received: (qmail invoked by alias); 02 May 2011 13:50:25 -0000 Received: from mail.greenbytes.de (EHLO [192.168.1.148]) [217.91.35.233] by mail.gmx.net (mp017) with SMTP; 02 May 2011 15:50:25 +0200 X-Authenticated: #1915285 X-Provags-ID: V01U2FsdGVkX1+WTfN1tIOWWSwBo5DnHGkM4Lu4ydWd96REAaqbBA Pci8M+DAmia18h Message-ID: <4DBEB693.6000403@gmx.de> Date: Mon, 02 May 2011 15:50:11 +0200 From: Julian Reschke User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 6.1; en-US; rv:1.9.2.17) Gecko/20110414 Lightning/1.0b2 Thunderbird/3.1.10 MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Paul Kyzivat References: <4DBDD771.2030403@cisco.com> In-Reply-To: <4DBDD771.2030403@cisco.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Y-GMX-Trusted: 0 Cc: xml2rfc@ietf.org Subject: Re: [xml2rfc] xml2rfc isn't putting the filename into the document X-BeenThere: xml2rfc@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.12 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 02 May 2011 13:50:28 -0000 On 01.05.2011 23:58, Paul Kyzivat wrote: > Today when I run xml2rfc (from http://xml.resource.org), its not putting > the filename into the subject line. Instead, its putting: CGItemp9380-2 > there. > > Then of course the submission tool is complaining and forbidding me from > submitting the revised doc. :-( For me it works. Does your input document have a /rfc/@docName attribute? It should. Best regards, Julian From msk@cloudmark.com Mon May 2 10:43:05 2011 Return-Path: X-Original-To: xml2rfc@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: xml2rfc@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0C8C9E0722 for ; Mon, 2 May 2011 10:43:05 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -104.436 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-104.436 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=-1.838, BAYES_00=-2.599, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, USER_IN_WHITELIST=-100] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.30]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id ppQmaZ+nRvZu for ; Mon, 2 May 2011 10:43:04 -0700 (PDT) Received: from ht2-outbound.cloudmark.com (ht2-outbound.cloudmark.com [72.5.239.36]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2DEF9E06A3 for ; Mon, 2 May 2011 10:43:04 -0700 (PDT) Received: from EXCH-C2.corp.cloudmark.com ([172.22.1.74]) by spite.corp.cloudmark.com ([172.22.10.72]) with mapi; Mon, 2 May 2011 10:43:03 -0700 From: "Murray S. Kucherawy" To: "xml2rfc@ietf.org" Date: Mon, 2 May 2011 10:43:03 -0700 Thread-Topic: artwork type "abnf" doesn't seem to work Thread-Index: AcwI8GLgFMVGuFF9RSCtkRfZrDJ2ZA== Message-ID: Accept-Language: en-US Content-Language: en-US X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: acceptlanguage: en-US Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="_000_F5833273385BB34F99288B3648C4F06F134331A1BBEXCHC2corpclo_" MIME-Version: 1.0 Subject: [xml2rfc] artwork type "abnf" doesn't seem to work X-BeenThere: xml2rfc@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.12 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 02 May 2011 17:43:05 -0000 --_000_F5833273385BB34F99288B3648C4F06F134331A1BBEXCHC2corpclo_ Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable I have this in a source file:
[some stuff here]
xml2rfc-1.36 complains like so: xml2rfc: warning: content is not valid type=3D"abnf" near "[some stuff here= ]" at line-offset 0 within around input line 1528 Section 6.3 of http://xml.resource.org/authoring/README.html seems to sugge= st this should be legal. What's up here? -MSK --_000_F5833273385BB34F99288B3648C4F06F134331A1BBEXCHC2corpclo_ Content-Type: text/html; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

I have this in a= source file:

 

<figure>

<artwork type=3D'abnf'>

[some stuff here]<= /o:p>

</artwork>

</figure>

 

xml2rfc-1.36 complains = like so:

 

xml2rfc: warning: content is not valid type=3D"abnf"= near "[some stuff here]" at line-offset 0 within <artwork>= around input line 1528

 

Section 6.3 of http://xml.resource.org/authoring/README.html s= eems to suggest this should be legal.

 

What’s up here?

 

-MSK

= --_000_F5833273385BB34F99288B3648C4F06F134331A1BBEXCHC2corpclo_-- From julian.reschke@gmx.de Mon May 2 11:27:34 2011 Return-Path: X-Original-To: xml2rfc@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: xml2rfc@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0F357E0718 for ; Mon, 2 May 2011 11:27:34 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -104.956 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-104.956 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=-2.357, BAYES_00=-2.599, USER_IN_WHITELIST=-100] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.30]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id fCEMErISIhWF for ; Mon, 2 May 2011 11:27:33 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mailout-de.gmx.net (mailout-de.gmx.net [213.165.64.22]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with SMTP id A277BE0678 for ; Mon, 2 May 2011 11:27:31 -0700 (PDT) Received: (qmail invoked by alias); 02 May 2011 18:27:28 -0000 Received: from p508FC6B2.dip.t-dialin.net (EHLO [192.168.178.33]) [80.143.198.178] by mail.gmx.net (mp004) with SMTP; 02 May 2011 20:27:28 +0200 X-Authenticated: #1915285 X-Provags-ID: V01U2FsdGVkX18m8tQxr/AmvucRSopoUelqzxlM5Ws2kM2qhMd+my 2JHKh5vOjG1e9B Message-ID: <4DBEF781.3010203@gmx.de> Date: Mon, 02 May 2011 20:27:13 +0200 From: Julian Reschke User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 6.1; en-US; rv:1.9.2.17) Gecko/20110414 Lightning/1.0b2 Thunderbird/3.1.10 MIME-Version: 1.0 To: "Murray S. Kucherawy" References: In-Reply-To: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=windows-1252; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Y-GMX-Trusted: 0 Cc: "xml2rfc@ietf.org" Subject: Re: [xml2rfc] artwork type "abnf" doesn't seem to work X-BeenThere: xml2rfc@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.12 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 02 May 2011 18:27:34 -0000 On 02.05.2011 19:43, Murray S. Kucherawy wrote: > I have this in a source file: > >
> > > > [some stuff here] > > > >
> > xml2rfc-1.36 complains like so: > > xml2rfc: warning: content is not valid type="abnf" near "[some stuff > here]" at line-offset 0 within around input line 1528 > > Section 6.3 of http://xml.resource.org/authoring/README.html seems to > suggest this should be legal. > > What’s up here? type="abnf" is of course ok. What xml2rfc is complaining about is the actual ABNF. Example, please... Best regards, Julian From pkyzivat@cisco.com Mon May 2 13:26:56 2011 Return-Path: X-Original-To: xml2rfc@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: xml2rfc@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 42C97E0784 for ; Mon, 2 May 2011 13:26:56 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -110.499 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-110.499 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.100, BAYES_00=-2.599, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_HI=-8, USER_IN_WHITELIST=-100] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.30]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 8+2OMmq2Ad6p for ; Mon, 2 May 2011 13:26:54 -0700 (PDT) Received: from ams-iport-2.cisco.com (ams-iport-2.cisco.com [144.254.224.141]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6AEA2E0781 for ; Mon, 2 May 2011 13:26:54 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/simple; d=cisco.com; i=pkyzivat@cisco.com; l=742; q=dns/txt; s=iport; t=1304368014; x=1305577614; h=message-id:date:from:mime-version:to:cc:subject: references:in-reply-to:content-transfer-encoding; bh=2LEKdRHOljLYZBX2PhlQGYPW8V+S9f94XenNBRoPsaQ=; b=mOxfhTzY2mHPhzNre5aLe8/PkbcRh4RVjxZa9E2+MDYKukZyAuXJQGxk e2Vy+4TvBaILa9VeWkuwz+FPX+pppTlzRJyc6qZfIGx35yoVZzZ8tdfhS 7ZDkpHSpjisb7KZJocwkhYPEwxMfjGoeGcl66CgvmQA3EowHjfdPXMWEr 8=; X-IronPort-AV: E=Sophos;i="4.64,304,1301875200"; d="scan'208";a="28308992" Received: from ams-core-1.cisco.com ([144.254.72.81]) by ams-iport-2.cisco.com with ESMTP; 02 May 2011 20:26:53 +0000 Received: from [161.44.174.124] (dhcp-161-44-174-124.cisco.com [161.44.174.124]) by ams-core-1.cisco.com (8.14.3/8.14.3) with ESMTP id p42KQqSB002226; Mon, 2 May 2011 20:26:52 GMT Message-ID: <4DBF138C.9060606@cisco.com> Date: Mon, 02 May 2011 16:26:52 -0400 From: Paul Kyzivat User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 6.1; en-US; rv:1.9.2.17) Gecko/20110414 Thunderbird/3.1.10 MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Julian Reschke References: <4DBDD771.2030403@cisco.com> <4DBEB693.6000403@gmx.de> In-Reply-To: <4DBEB693.6000403@gmx.de> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Cc: xml2rfc@ietf.org Subject: Re: [xml2rfc] xml2rfc isn't putting the filename into the document X-BeenThere: xml2rfc@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.12 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 02 May 2011 20:26:56 -0000 On 5/2/2011 9:50 AM, Julian Reschke wrote: > On 01.05.2011 23:58, Paul Kyzivat wrote: >> Today when I run xml2rfc (from http://xml.resource.org), its not putting >> the filename into the subject line. Instead, its putting: CGItemp9380-2 >> there. >> >> Then of course the submission tool is complaining and forbidding me from >> submitting the revised doc. :-( > > For me it works. > > Does your input document have a /rfc/@docName attribute? It should. It didn't, and never needed it before. Exactly where does this go. I looked up the docs for the "unofficial successor", and find it as a parameter to . So I tried putting that in, but it made no difference. Confused, Paul > Best regards, Julian > From julian.reschke@gmx.de Mon May 2 13:36:16 2011 Return-Path: X-Original-To: xml2rfc@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: xml2rfc@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8E426E0766 for ; Mon, 2 May 2011 13:36:16 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -104.891 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-104.891 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=-2.292, BAYES_00=-2.599, USER_IN_WHITELIST=-100] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.30]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id eDdk3LQ98D3o for ; Mon, 2 May 2011 13:36:15 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mailout-de.gmx.net (mailout-de.gmx.net [213.165.64.23]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with SMTP id 1D9E3E069F for ; Mon, 2 May 2011 13:36:14 -0700 (PDT) Received: (qmail invoked by alias); 02 May 2011 20:36:12 -0000 Received: from p508FC6B2.dip.t-dialin.net (EHLO [192.168.178.33]) [80.143.198.178] by mail.gmx.net (mp005) with SMTP; 02 May 2011 22:36:12 +0200 X-Authenticated: #1915285 X-Provags-ID: V01U2FsdGVkX1/gHz1my5Xgjy8muEFHpU7nW7xYLrNFWCxCrQnDru OWpkavG4aYrwli Message-ID: <4DBF15AD.6050904@gmx.de> Date: Mon, 02 May 2011 22:35:57 +0200 From: Julian Reschke User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 6.1; en-US; rv:1.9.2.17) Gecko/20110414 Lightning/1.0b2 Thunderbird/3.1.10 MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Paul Kyzivat References: <4DBDD771.2030403@cisco.com> <4DBEB693.6000403@gmx.de> <4DBF138C.9060606@cisco.com> In-Reply-To: <4DBF138C.9060606@cisco.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Y-GMX-Trusted: 0 Cc: xml2rfc@ietf.org Subject: Re: [xml2rfc] xml2rfc isn't putting the filename into the document X-BeenThere: xml2rfc@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.12 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 02 May 2011 20:36:16 -0000 On 02.05.2011 22:26, Paul Kyzivat wrote: > > > On 5/2/2011 9:50 AM, Julian Reschke wrote: >> On 01.05.2011 23:58, Paul Kyzivat wrote: >>> Today when I run xml2rfc (from http://xml.resource.org), its not putting >>> the filename into the subject line. Instead, its putting: CGItemp9380-2 >>> there. >>> >>> Then of course the submission tool is complaining and forbidding me from >>> submitting the revised doc. :-( >> >> For me it works. >> >> Does your input document have a /rfc/@docName attribute? It should. > > It didn't, and never needed it before. Then you've been relying on the code being permissive. > Exactly where does this go. I looked up the docs for the "unofficial > successor", and find it as a parameter to . So I tried putting that > in, but it made no difference. I don't know; I didn't change anything. Just trying to help. Note that docName is defined in RFC2629 and is what needs to be used when creating an Internet Draft. I don't know what's going, but I might if you should me the source document. > > Confused, > Paul Best regards, Julian From brian.e.carpenter@gmail.com Mon May 2 15:35:16 2011 Return-Path: X-Original-To: xml2rfc@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: xml2rfc@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id F3070E07FD for ; Mon, 2 May 2011 15:35:16 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -103.478 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-103.478 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.121, BAYES_00=-2.599, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW=-1, USER_IN_WHITELIST=-100] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.30]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 3sCg-Yy44PyV for ; Mon, 2 May 2011 15:35:16 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail-pw0-f44.google.com (mail-pw0-f44.google.com [209.85.160.44]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2BACAE07DA for ; Mon, 2 May 2011 15:35:16 -0700 (PDT) Received: by pwi5 with SMTP id 5so3607714pwi.31 for ; Mon, 02 May 2011 15:35:16 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=gamma; h=domainkey-signature:message-id:date:from:organization:user-agent :mime-version:to:cc:subject:references:in-reply-to:content-type :content-transfer-encoding; bh=qPrPRS+PaMQDU6sRdzAvWRSIMGR5NeXfoWW5AJymz/E=; b=tVD2dm+BnSxGBzQOhyfuk5X3YPtkwA2bOb1QkRf84YZhTe99z0cFnJC9z0ThY/1aTt nuskdt0GFAj6JWhuBXMfrhn6SDiDjnSYu1/t61dMXymIVdjLFex+DdD+L2UIgjfjqmNi 3OwuLd0mUanB0zFgeKE570ngBBjjzxhPQpaPU= DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; c=nofws; d=gmail.com; s=gamma; h=message-id:date:from:organization:user-agent:mime-version:to:cc :subject:references:in-reply-to:content-type :content-transfer-encoding; b=ieW0vCOWVauvNqQxOIHjG+QKaagWLO+czaoLsoBxIJ8i3zPqkL2XnawRwWX2P0V9+H BQlbK08ZkypvRMEk7qb929F3HRfd1IqvC/VkZY5cmOtXv6ltO7k8juiVDv3c6pYI5DZf GPiPntWJzwBzBBybTlDAlPlrZUCABmEfSe//M= Received: by 10.143.86.3 with SMTP id o3mr3494316wfl.225.1304375715952; Mon, 02 May 2011 15:35:15 -0700 (PDT) Received: from [130.216.38.124] (stf-brian.sfac.auckland.ac.nz [130.216.38.124]) by mx.google.com with ESMTPS id w14sm7596411wfh.8.2011.05.02.15.35.13 (version=SSLv3 cipher=OTHER); Mon, 02 May 2011 15:35:15 -0700 (PDT) Message-ID: <4DBF319F.6040303@gmail.com> Date: Tue, 03 May 2011 10:35:11 +1200 From: Brian E Carpenter Organization: University of Auckland User-Agent: Thunderbird 2.0.0.6 (Windows/20070728) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Paul Kyzivat References: <4DBDD771.2030403@cisco.com> In-Reply-To: <4DBDD771.2030403@cisco.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Cc: xml2rfc@ietf.org Subject: Re: [xml2rfc] xml2rfc isn't putting the filename into the document X-BeenThere: xml2rfc@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.12 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 02 May 2011 22:35:17 -0000 Paul, Just to give you the pragmatic answer, you need something like I place it immediately before so that it's easy to find. You have to edit the version number each time. Regards Brian Carpenter On 2011-05-02 09:58, Paul Kyzivat wrote: > Today when I run xml2rfc (from http://xml.resource.org), its not putting > the filename into the subject line. Instead, its putting: CGItemp9380-2 > there. > > Then of course the submission tool is complaining and forbidding me from > submitting the revised doc. :-( > > Help! > Paul > > _______________________________________________ > xml2rfc mailing list > xml2rfc@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/xml2rfc > From gwz@net-zen.net Tue May 3 02:46:05 2011 Return-Path: X-Original-To: xml2rfc@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: xml2rfc@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id D6AB7E0719 for ; Tue, 3 May 2011 02:46:05 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -102.599 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-102.599 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-2.599, USER_IN_WHITELIST=-100] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.30]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id GnpLE8h36jD5 for ; Tue, 3 May 2011 02:46:05 -0700 (PDT) Received: from p3plsmtpa01-06.prod.phx3.secureserver.net (p3plsmtpa01-06.prod.phx3.secureserver.net [72.167.82.86]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with SMTP id 064CAE07BE for ; Tue, 3 May 2011 02:46:03 -0700 (PDT) Received: (qmail 10922 invoked from network); 3 May 2011 09:46:02 -0000 Received: from unknown (124.122.86.150) by p3plsmtpa01-06.prod.phx3.secureserver.net (72.167.82.86) with ESMTP; 03 May 2011 09:46:01 -0000 Message-ID: <4DBFCED4.3020802@net-zen.net> Date: Tue, 03 May 2011 16:45:56 +0700 From: Glen Zorn Organization: Network Zen User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 6.1; en-US; rv:1.9.2.17) Gecko/20110414 Thunderbird/3.1.10 MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Paul Kyzivat References: <4DBDD771.2030403@cisco.com> <4DBEB693.6000403@gmx.de> <4DBF138C.9060606@cisco.com> In-Reply-To: <4DBF138C.9060606@cisco.com> X-Enigmail-Version: 1.1.1 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="------------080205020105080001030000" Cc: xml2rfc@ietf.org Subject: Re: [xml2rfc] xml2rfc isn't putting the filename into the document X-BeenThere: xml2rfc@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.12 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 03 May 2011 09:46:05 -0000 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --------------080205020105080001030000 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit On 5/3/2011 3:26 AM, Paul Kyzivat wrote: > > > On 5/2/2011 9:50 AM, Julian Reschke wrote: >> On 01.05.2011 23:58, Paul Kyzivat wrote: >>> Today when I run xml2rfc (from http://xml.resource.org), its not putting >>> the filename into the subject line. Instead, its putting: CGItemp9380-2 >>> there. >>> >>> Then of course the submission tool is complaining and forbidding me from >>> submitting the revised doc. :-( >> >> For me it works. >> >> Does your input document have a /rfc/@docName attribute? It should. > > It didn't, and never needed it before. > > Exactly where does this go. I looked up the docs for the "unofficial > successor", and find it as a parameter to . So I tried putting that > in, but it made no difference. Example: Diameter Network Access Server Application > > Confused, > Paul > >> Best regards, Julian >> > _______________________________________________ > xml2rfc mailing list > xml2rfc@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/xml2rfc > > --------------080205020105080001030000 Content-Type: text/x-vcard; charset=utf-8; name="gwz.vcf" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="gwz.vcf" begin:vcard fn:Glen Zorn n:Zorn;Glen org:Network Zen adr:;;;Seattle;WA;;USA email;internet:gwz@net-zen.net tel;cell:+66 87 040 4617 note:PGP Key Fingerprint: DAD3 F5D3 ACE6 4195 9C5C 2EE1 6E17 B5F6 5953 B45F version:2.1 end:vcard --------------080205020105080001030000-- From thomas.morin@orange-ftgroup.com Tue May 10 07:54:13 2011 Return-Path: X-Original-To: xml2rfc@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: xml2rfc@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9B6A1E0768 for ; Tue, 10 May 2011 07:54:13 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -103.249 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-103.249 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-2.599, HELO_EQ_FR=0.35, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW=-1, USER_IN_WHITELIST=-100] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.30]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id D-z18IYf3U3x for ; Tue, 10 May 2011 07:54:12 -0700 (PDT) Received: from p-mail2.rd.francetelecom.com (p-mail2.rd.francetelecom.com [195.101.245.16]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5644EE0681 for ; Tue, 10 May 2011 07:54:11 -0700 (PDT) Received: from p-mail2.rd.francetelecom.com (localhost.localdomain [127.0.0.1]) by localhost (Postfix) with SMTP id A073E858010 for ; Tue, 10 May 2011 17:00:57 +0200 (CEST) Received: from ftrdsmtp1.rd.francetelecom.fr (unknown [10.192.128.46]) by p-mail2.rd.francetelecom.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9B2C585800E for ; Tue, 10 May 2011 17:00:57 +0200 (CEST) Received: from ftrdmel10.rd.francetelecom.fr ([10.192.128.44]) by ftrdsmtp1.rd.francetelecom.fr with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.4675); Tue, 10 May 2011 16:54:09 +0200 Received: from [10.193.71.121] ([10.193.71.121]) by ftrdmel10.rd.francetelecom.fr with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.4675); Tue, 10 May 2011 16:54:09 +0200 Message-ID: <4DC95190.5060906@orange-ftgroup.com> Date: Tue, 10 May 2011 16:54:08 +0200 From: Thomas Morin Organization: France Telecom Orange User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; U; ; ; ) Gecko/2010 Thunderbird/3.1.x MIME-Version: 1.0 To: xml2rfc@ietf.org References: <038501cc0785$6ca37c00$45ea7400$@huawei.com> In-Reply-To: <038501cc0785$6ca37c00$45ea7400$@huawei.com> X-TagToolbar-Keys: D20110510165408811 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-OriginalArrivalTime: 10 May 2011 14:54:09.0120 (UTC) FILETIME=[1DDC8E00:01CC0F22] Subject: [xml2rfc] Keeping some authors off the front page ? X-BeenThere: xml2rfc@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.12 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 10 May 2011 14:54:13 -0000 Hello folks, This is about an issue that has already been discussed While reviewing a draft I edit, the AD in charge pointed out the usual "too many authors on the front page" issue: > Would it be possible to consider moving everyone except for the editor > off the front page? [all authors] will still all be listed as authors at the end > of the document. After reading again the xml2rfc ML archives, in particular the thread in October 2008, the understanding I have is that: - some people would like to do this, but the toolchain does not allow this - it's been explained that the initial idea is that the "Authors' addresses" section should list only the people appearing on the front page - however, it does not seem there is a strict rule imposing this, and it seems there are drafts that list only editors on the front page and more people in the "Authors' addresses" section - the RFC Editor encourages a limitation of the number of authors (for both the front page and the "Authors' addresses" contact information section): this is motivated at http://www.rfc-editor.org/policy.html#policy.authlist - the AUTH48 process contact people listed on the front page and it is thus also encouraged to limit the number of authors on the front page - the resulting recommendation is to do only declare as authors the people who have to appear on the front page, and put others in an additional section It seems to me that restricting what the xml2rfc tool can do based on this recommendation is not satisfying at all: - it seems at the opposite of the path taken for other issues: the general thinking seems to be that the tool could be use for other purpose than IETF or RFCs, and should not enforce a policy upon users - it makes users of xml2rfc unable to do what users of other toolchains (a) can technically do, and (b) can submit to the IETF with good chances of success So, with the above in mind, why not add a "frontage" attribute to the "author" element, which would default to "yes", and if set to "no" would just result in the said author to not appear on the front page ... ? Moreover, implementing the recommended approach with xml2rfc is not great: - the section with the additional authors has to be written manually (cannot use authors elements, even though it can be appropriate to give contact information for them too) - it is not easy to have the same formatting for the two sections, especially across all types of output (TXT, HTML, ...) - this section cannot be put in a close location to the "Authors' addresses" section So, for people wanting to implement the recommended approach in a nicer way, could we introduce a special rfc/back/contributors, which could include text and "author" elements, and which would be rendered in the output right after the "Authors' addresses" section (after References) ? Thank you, -Thomas From julian.reschke@gmx.de Tue May 10 08:08:13 2011 Return-Path: X-Original-To: xml2rfc@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: xml2rfc@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id CA22CE07F3 for ; Tue, 10 May 2011 08:08:13 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -105.071 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-105.071 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=-2.472, BAYES_00=-2.599, USER_IN_WHITELIST=-100] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.30]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id EkeoG2H3QGDp for ; Tue, 10 May 2011 08:08:13 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mailout-de.gmx.net (mailout-de.gmx.net [213.165.64.23]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with SMTP id BA618E07E1 for ; Tue, 10 May 2011 08:08:11 -0700 (PDT) Received: (qmail invoked by alias); 10 May 2011 15:08:10 -0000 Received: from mail.greenbytes.de (EHLO [192.168.1.142]) [217.91.35.233] by mail.gmx.net (mp049) with SMTP; 10 May 2011 17:08:10 +0200 X-Authenticated: #1915285 X-Provags-ID: V01U2FsdGVkX18fv/kSAT4f71MVBbN0wBhG/N2WhbFBaKwkN+qvpo 2kzyoFembDIZ/p Message-ID: <4DC9547A.2090007@gmx.de> Date: Tue, 10 May 2011 17:06:34 +0200 From: Julian Reschke User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 6.1; en-US; rv:1.9.2.17) Gecko/20110414 Lightning/1.0b2 Thunderbird/3.1.10 MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Thomas Morin References: <038501cc0785$6ca37c00$45ea7400$@huawei.com> <4DC95190.5060906@orange-ftgroup.com> In-Reply-To: <4DC95190.5060906@orange-ftgroup.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Y-GMX-Trusted: 0 Cc: xml2rfc@ietf.org Subject: Re: [xml2rfc] Keeping some authors off the front page ? X-BeenThere: xml2rfc@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.12 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 10 May 2011 15:08:13 -0000 On 10.05.2011 16:54, Thomas Morin wrote: > Hello folks, > > This is about an issue that has already been discussed > ... Hi Thomas, you clearly have done your homework :-). This has been an issue for a long time. The main blocking issue IMHO was/is the lack of direction from the IETF and the RFC Editor. Maybe this will be fixed once we have a new RFC Editor. The issues that I see are: - the "only 5 authors" rule doesn't make sense if there are indeed more authors; yes, this complicates AUTH48, but such is life - we could add a "contributors" section, but it's not entirely clear how it would be different from an Acknowledgments section. So we really need to come to *stable* (*) consensus about the terms "editor", "author", and "contributor". Best regards, Julian (*) So we don't need to change the tools all the time... From thomas.morin@orange-ftgroup.com Tue May 10 08:35:47 2011 Return-Path: X-Original-To: xml2rfc@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: xml2rfc@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id EF7CDE06CC for ; Tue, 10 May 2011 08:35:47 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -103.249 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-103.249 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-2.599, HELO_EQ_FR=0.35, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW=-1, USER_IN_WHITELIST=-100] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.30]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id lqSoIqn9l77M for ; Tue, 10 May 2011 08:35:47 -0700 (PDT) Received: from p-mail1.rd.francetelecom.com (p-mail1.rd.francetelecom.com [195.101.245.15]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id CEBBEE0659 for ; Tue, 10 May 2011 08:35:46 -0700 (PDT) Received: from p-mail1.rd.francetelecom.com (localhost.localdomain [127.0.0.1]) by localhost (Postfix) with SMTP id E46D18B800E; Tue, 10 May 2011 17:36:22 +0200 (CEST) Received: from ftrdsmtp1.rd.francetelecom.fr (unknown [10.192.128.46]) by p-mail1.rd.francetelecom.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id DC96D8B800D; Tue, 10 May 2011 17:36:22 +0200 (CEST) Received: from ftrdmel10.rd.francetelecom.fr ([10.192.128.44]) by ftrdsmtp1.rd.francetelecom.fr with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.4675); Tue, 10 May 2011 17:35:45 +0200 Received: from [10.193.71.121] ([10.193.71.121]) by ftrdmel10.rd.francetelecom.fr with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.4675); Tue, 10 May 2011 17:35:44 +0200 Message-ID: <4DC95B50.9070006@orange-ftgroup.com> Date: Tue, 10 May 2011 17:35:44 +0200 From: Thomas Morin Organization: France Telecom Orange User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; U; ; ; ) Gecko/2010 Thunderbird/3.1.x MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Julian Reschke References: <038501cc0785$6ca37c00$45ea7400$@huawei.com> <4DC95190.5060906@orange-ftgroup.com> <4DC9547A.2090007@gmx.de> In-Reply-To: <4DC9547A.2090007@gmx.de> X-TagToolbar-Keys: D20110510173543826 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-OriginalArrivalTime: 10 May 2011 15:35:44.0511 (UTC) FILETIME=[ED3B00F0:01CC0F27] Cc: xml2rfc@ietf.org Subject: Re: [xml2rfc] Keeping some authors off the front page ? X-BeenThere: xml2rfc@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.12 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 10 May 2011 15:35:48 -0000 Hi Julian, Julian Reschke: > On 10.05.2011 16:54, Thomas Morin wrote: >> Hello folks, >> >> This is about an issue that has already been discussed >> ... > > > you clearly have done your homework :-). I hit the issue several times in the past, and I've been following the list... so I know its not trivial. I wrote this email because, after doing my homework, I got convinced that strongly coupling document structure, document rendering and process is going to be a dead end. > This has been an issue for a long time. The main blocking issue IMHO > was/is the lack of direction from the IETF and the RFC Editor. Maybe > this will be fixed once we have a new RFC Editor. I understand, but the point I'm trying to make is that until IETF/RFC Ed gives us better directions, the tool should be flexible. And in fact, for other uses (personal memo, etc.) the tool should be kept flexible, even after the RFC Ed eventually give better directions. Hence my insistance on having a frontline=yes/no attribute to the author element . > > The issues that I see are: > > - the "only 5 authors" rule doesn't make sense if there are indeed > more authors; yes, this complicates AUTH48, but such is life I agree, and the solution I would think reasonable is to change the process so that in the case where the RFC Editor thinks there are too many authors for smooth AUTH48, then it could ask authors to agree on a subset of them from which approval would be asked. How this set of "AUTH48 authors" is tracked could then become a purely technical matter: it could be tracked by tweaking "who is on the front page", but it could be handled through another channel independent of document content as well. > - we could add a "contributors" section, but it's not entirely clear > how it would be different from an Acknowledgments section. In practice, people seem to want to be able to distinguish between significant contributors involved from day one, and people who were useful but whose participation or support was restricted to a few specific points, but defining a strict rule to distinguish the two roles may not be doable... > So we really need to come to *stable* (*) consensus about the terms > "editor", "author", and "contributor". > (*) So we don't need to change the tools all the time... It might be *very* hard to find working precise definitions for these roles. Another path which I think might be more reasonable would be to design the toolchain independently of any attempt at a consensus on what these roles would be, and let this interpretation/policy/process stuff happen independently of the toolchain. If the name of the section containing the additional people is not constrained (e.g. a title attribute like a normal section), then you don't have to define what "contributor" means, and tool users can choose to name that section "Contributors", "Co-authors" or "Additional authors", or even "Usual suspects", and it just will be up to AD's, IESG, RFC Editor to eventually encourage or impose a different naming... -Thomas From julian.reschke@gmx.de Tue May 10 08:54:23 2011 Return-Path: X-Original-To: xml2rfc@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: xml2rfc@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 905B6E075C for ; Tue, 10 May 2011 08:54:23 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -105.014 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-105.014 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=-2.414, BAYES_00=-2.599, USER_IN_WHITELIST=-100] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.30]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 0WSltWP9JwGH for ; Tue, 10 May 2011 08:54:22 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mailout-de.gmx.net (mailout-de.gmx.net [213.165.64.22]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with SMTP id E7D0CE0774 for ; Tue, 10 May 2011 08:54:20 -0700 (PDT) Received: (qmail invoked by alias); 10 May 2011 15:47:38 -0000 Received: from mail.greenbytes.de (EHLO [192.168.1.142]) [217.91.35.233] by mail.gmx.net (mp032) with SMTP; 10 May 2011 17:47:38 +0200 X-Authenticated: #1915285 X-Provags-ID: V01U2FsdGVkX18wDlo4QcgweoFFBAs5cBDZCuawp3rHlQVo7J2Gv6 tXazz+lDeid9a/ Message-ID: <4DC95E16.7000407@gmx.de> Date: Tue, 10 May 2011 17:47:34 +0200 From: Julian Reschke User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 6.1; en-US; rv:1.9.2.17) Gecko/20110414 Lightning/1.0b2 Thunderbird/3.1.10 MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Thomas Morin References: <038501cc0785$6ca37c00$45ea7400$@huawei.com> <4DC95190.5060906@orange-ftgroup.com> <4DC9547A.2090007@gmx.de> <4DC95B50.9070006@orange-ftgroup.com> In-Reply-To: <4DC95B50.9070006@orange-ftgroup.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Y-GMX-Trusted: 0 Cc: xml2rfc@ietf.org Subject: Re: [xml2rfc] Keeping some authors off the front page ? X-BeenThere: xml2rfc@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.12 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 10 May 2011 15:54:23 -0000 On 10.05.2011 17:35, Thomas Morin wrote: > Hi Julian, > > Julian Reschke: >> On 10.05.2011 16:54, Thomas Morin wrote: >>> Hello folks, >>> >>> This is about an issue that has already been discussed >>> ... >> >> >> you clearly have done your homework :-). > > I hit the issue several times in the past, and I've been following the > list... so I know its not trivial. > > I wrote this email because, after doing my homework, I got convinced > that strongly coupling document structure, document rendering and > process is going to be a dead end. > > >> This has been an issue for a long time. The main blocking issue IMHO >> was/is the lack of direction from the IETF and the RFC Editor. Maybe >> this will be fixed once we have a new RFC Editor. > > I understand, but the point I'm trying to make is that until IETF/RFC Ed > gives us better directions, the tool should be flexible. > And in fact, for other uses (personal memo, etc.) the tool should be > kept flexible, even after the RFC Ed eventually give better directions. > > Hence my insistance on having a frontline=yes/no attribute to the author > element . Well, I'm usually happy to tune *my* xml2rfc processor (rfc2629.xslt). However, changing things in xml2rfc.tcl is really really hard, and that's why it's currently being rewritten. But of course designing the vocabulary should be separate from that (and happen here!). >> The issues that I see are: >> >> - the "only 5 authors" rule doesn't make sense if there are indeed >> more authors; yes, this complicates AUTH48, but such is life > > I agree, and the solution I would think reasonable is to change the > process so that in the case where the RFC Editor thinks there are too > many authors for smooth AUTH48, then it could ask authors to agree on a > subset of them from which approval would be asked. How this set of > "AUTH48 authors" is tracked could then become a purely technical matter: > it could be tracked by tweaking "who is on the front page", but it could > be handled through another channel independent of document content as well. Another issue is what to do with previous authors when a spec is being revised (like what we do in HTTPbis). Just because a few people volunteer to work on a revision doesn't change the fact the authorship of previous authors (unless all is rewritten from scratch). >> - we could add a "contributors" section, but it's not entirely clear >> how it would be different from an Acknowledgments section. > > In practice, people seem to want to be able to distinguish between > significant contributors involved from day one, and people who were > useful but whose participation or support was restricted to a few > specific points, but defining a strict rule to distinguish the two roles > may not be doable... > > >> So we really need to come to *stable* (*) consensus about the terms >> "editor", "author", and "contributor". >> (*) So we don't need to change the tools all the time... > > It might be *very* hard to find working precise definitions for these > roles. > > Another path which I think might be more reasonable would be to design > the toolchain independently of any attempt at a consensus on what these > roles would be, and let this interpretation/policy/process stuff happen > independently of the toolchain. If the name of the section containing > the additional people is not constrained (e.g. a title attribute like a > normal section), then you don't have to define what "contributor" means, > and tool users can choose to name that section "Contributors", > "Co-authors" or "Additional authors", or even "Usual suspects", and it > just will be up to AD's, IESG, RFC Editor to eventually encourage or > impose a different naming... Yes and no. At the end of the day, the XML markup should answer the question: "who is author of this document?". We can't just add more elements in the same place, when those people really are not authors. For historical documents, rfc2629.xslt contains an extension that provides some flexibility, but of course this doesn't help when you want to produce output with xml2rfc.tcl. See, for instance: http://greenbytes.de/tech/webdav/rfc2046.xml and http://greenbytes.de/tech/webdav/rfc2046.html Best regards, Julian From dhc2@dcrocker.net Tue May 10 08:55:07 2011 Return-Path: X-Original-To: xml2rfc@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: xml2rfc@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id DED9BE06D5 for ; Tue, 10 May 2011 08:55:07 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -6.603 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-6.603 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=-0.004, BAYES_00=-2.599, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-4] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.30]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 5kmC4MBhCHVA for ; Tue, 10 May 2011 08:55:07 -0700 (PDT) Received: from sbh17.songbird.com (sbh17.songbird.com [72.52.113.17]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3ADFAE06DB for ; Tue, 10 May 2011 08:55:06 -0700 (PDT) Received: from [192.168.1.3] (adsl-67-127-56-68.dsl.pltn13.pacbell.net [67.127.56.68]) (authenticated bits=0) by sbh17.songbird.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id p4AFt0qQ016544 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=NO) for ; Tue, 10 May 2011 08:55:05 -0700 Message-ID: <4DC95FD0.4000605@dcrocker.net> Date: Tue, 10 May 2011 08:54:56 -0700 From: Dave CROCKER Organization: Brandenburg InternetWorking User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 6.1; en-US; rv:1.9.2.17) Gecko/20110414 Thunderbird/3.1.10 MIME-Version: 1.0 To: xml2rfc@ietf.org References: <038501cc0785$6ca37c00$45ea7400$@huawei.com> <4DC95190.5060906@orange-ftgroup.com> <4DC9547A.2090007@gmx.de> In-Reply-To: <4DC9547A.2090007@gmx.de> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Greylist: Sender succeeded SMTP AUTH, not delayed by milter-greylist-4.0 (sbh17.songbird.com [72.52.113.17]); Tue, 10 May 2011 08:55:06 -0700 (PDT) Subject: Re: [xml2rfc] Keeping some authors off the front page ? X-BeenThere: xml2rfc@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.12 Precedence: list Reply-To: dcrocker@bbiw.net List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 10 May 2011 15:55:08 -0000 On 5/10/2011 8:06 AM, Julian Reschke wrote: > - we could add a "contributors" section, but it's not entirely clear how it > would be different from an Acknowledgments section. If this added section contained entries in the same style as 'authors', then it well might resolve the problem of having long lists of authors. That is, it could permit distinguishing among: * folks who produced the document * folks who added significantly to the content * folks who participated in discussion and it could provide contact information for the second set. But as you note, this really is something for the RFC Editor to decide officially. That said, xml2rfc could add the construct on its own, since there are no rules against something like the second bullet construct... d/ -- Dave Crocker Brandenburg InternetWorking bbiw.net From nico@cryptonector.com Tue May 10 09:23:18 2011 Return-Path: X-Original-To: xml2rfc@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: xml2rfc@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id D8C61E0785 for ; Tue, 10 May 2011 09:23:18 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -3.053 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-3.053 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=-1.076, BAYES_00=-2.599, FM_FORGED_GMAIL=0.622] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.30]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id I3362vnzAbid for ; Tue, 10 May 2011 09:23:17 -0700 (PDT) Received: from hapkido.dreamhost.com (hapkido.dreamhost.com [66.33.216.122]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 19B6FE0718 for ; Tue, 10 May 2011 09:23:17 -0700 (PDT) Received: from homiemail-a64.g.dreamhost.com (caiajhbdccac.dreamhost.com [208.97.132.202]) by hapkido.dreamhost.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id EE86717964D for ; Tue, 10 May 2011 09:23:16 -0700 (PDT) Received: from homiemail-a64.g.dreamhost.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by homiemail-a64.g.dreamhost.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id BC36E43807F for ; Tue, 10 May 2011 09:23:15 -0700 (PDT) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; c=nofws; d=cryptonector.com; h=mime-version :in-reply-to:references:date:message-id:subject:from:to:cc: content-type; q=dns; s=cryptonector.com; b=rrwI/xIYbRVZ8MPAULsp5 oazbucRSAk0yz+fi9nDBvmRUQe19wttYtwSS2grChJkEGDEBu8edyBFKxiInqriu GpX2FZglxfvNe+/9CpCO9BO7cBQ2bNva7o9ETs3HQ9wiVrjoczuoquBstEn4Zqv6 g4FuVzm5QgEV9QawSQlhZk= DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha1; c=relaxed; d=cryptonector.com; h= mime-version:in-reply-to:references:date:message-id:subject:from :to:cc:content-type; s=cryptonector.com; bh=Su6y++rZ5YozbV8uhujx JZVBxH0=; b=AM6TTaf9nlbVLtq5Isb50maZBhEnpzj+OyA6ZD52kM0o+pdnlpfI B96KDcpqV/nKf/MDIJYNtaEXmINzP6PoNXyPU3O4qCQHXSYDQXOOy42QqmoAvAxP /K9ez2Ay75imArU9FLP4gle4ESVTD6qkZ3gcIIlIIjAN1YL8Idq43C4= Received: from mail-vx0-f172.google.com (mail-vx0-f172.google.com [209.85.220.172]) (using TLSv1 with cipher RC4-SHA (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) (Authenticated sender: nico@cryptonector.com) by homiemail-a64.g.dreamhost.com (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 92A2C43807E for ; Tue, 10 May 2011 09:23:15 -0700 (PDT) Received: by vxg33 with SMTP id 33so1314053vxg.31 for ; Tue, 10 May 2011 09:23:14 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 Received: by 10.52.96.71 with SMTP id dq7mr1488569vdb.157.1305044594650; Tue, 10 May 2011 09:23:14 -0700 (PDT) Received: by 10.52.155.4 with HTTP; Tue, 10 May 2011 09:23:14 -0700 (PDT) In-Reply-To: <4DC95B50.9070006@orange-ftgroup.com> References: <038501cc0785$6ca37c00$45ea7400$@huawei.com> <4DC95190.5060906@orange-ftgroup.com> <4DC9547A.2090007@gmx.de> <4DC95B50.9070006@orange-ftgroup.com> Date: Tue, 10 May 2011 11:23:14 -0500 Message-ID: From: Nico Williams To: Thomas Morin Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 Cc: xml2rfc@ietf.org Subject: Re: [xml2rfc] Keeping some authors off the front page ? X-BeenThere: xml2rfc@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.12 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 10 May 2011 16:23:19 -0000 On Tue, May 10, 2011 at 10:35 AM, Thomas Morin wrote: >> - the "only 5 authors" rule doesn't make sense if there are indeed more >> authors; yes, this complicates AUTH48, but such is life > > I agree, and the solution I would think reasonable is to change the process > so that in the case where the RFC Editor thinks there are too many authors > for smooth AUTH48, then it could ask authors to agree on a subset of them > from which approval would be asked. How this set of "AUTH48 authors" is > tracked could then become a purely technical matter: it could be tracked by > tweaking "who is on the front page", but it could be handled through another > channel independent of document content as well. ETOOCOMPLICATED :) I think the RFC-Editor should send AUTH48 e-mail to the I-D authors list address (every I-D gets one), and the RFC-Editor should warn the authors of the need to negotiate a sub-set of representative authors. How the authors do that is up to them -- no mechanism need be offered. That said, there's a different unrelated issue: only so many authors can fit on the front page, and xml2rfc supports a private (non-IETF) mode. Therefore it could provide an option for listing "Joe Sixpack et. al." on the front page. It'd also be nice to have a guarantee that element order matches up with order int he author section, and, perhaps, a way to add text to the author section, so that one could list editors, core authors, and contributors without requiring metadata (though that would be nice too!). >> - we could add a "contributors" section, but it's not entirely clear how >> it would be different from an Acknowledgments section. > > In practice, people seem to want to be able to distinguish between > significant contributors involved from day one, and people who were useful > but whose participation or support was restricted to a few specific points, > but defining a strict rule to distinguish the two roles may not be doable... Why a whole new section when additional text in the Authors section will do? > Another path which I think might be more reasonable would be to design the > toolchain independently of any attempt at a consensus on what these roles > would be, and let this interpretation/policy/process stuff happen > independently of the toolchain. If the name of the section containing the > additional people is not constrained (e.g. a title attribute like a normal > section), then you don't have to define what "contributor" means, and tool > users can choose to name that section "Contributors", "Co-authors" or > "Additional authors", or even "Usual suspects", and it just will be up to > AD's, IESG, RFC Editor to eventually encourage or impose a different > naming... +1. Moreover, the options provided by the toolchain might influence any policy decisions. Nico -- From julian.reschke@gmx.de Tue May 10 09:32:30 2011 Return-Path: X-Original-To: xml2rfc@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: xml2rfc@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 48773E069C for ; Tue, 10 May 2011 09:32:30 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -104.959 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-104.959 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=-2.360, BAYES_00=-2.599, USER_IN_WHITELIST=-100] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.30]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id DnHeywbEbpyr for ; Tue, 10 May 2011 09:32:28 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mailout-de.gmx.net (mailout-de.gmx.net [213.165.64.23]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with SMTP id 29080E0811 for ; Tue, 10 May 2011 09:32:27 -0700 (PDT) Received: (qmail invoked by alias); 10 May 2011 16:32:25 -0000 Received: from mail.greenbytes.de (EHLO [192.168.1.142]) [217.91.35.233] by mail.gmx.net (mp043) with SMTP; 10 May 2011 18:32:25 +0200 X-Authenticated: #1915285 X-Provags-ID: V01U2FsdGVkX1/w2Ww/DHjwIZipqoCtntsSphMwxruOMGKBs93l95 lvbtOOREFZX/4a Message-ID: <4DC9688B.1010301@gmx.de> Date: Tue, 10 May 2011 18:32:11 +0200 From: Julian Reschke User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 6.1; en-US; rv:1.9.2.17) Gecko/20110414 Lightning/1.0b2 Thunderbird/3.1.10 MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Nico Williams References: <038501cc0785$6ca37c00$45ea7400$@huawei.com> <4DC95190.5060906@orange-ftgroup.com> <4DC9547A.2090007@gmx.de> <4DC95B50.9070006@orange-ftgroup.com> In-Reply-To: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Y-GMX-Trusted: 0 Cc: xml2rfc@ietf.org Subject: Re: [xml2rfc] Keeping some authors off the front page ? X-BeenThere: xml2rfc@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.12 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 10 May 2011 16:32:30 -0000 On 10.05.2011 18:23, Nico Williams wrote: > On Tue, May 10, 2011 at 10:35 AM, Thomas Morin > wrote: >>> - the "only 5 authors" rule doesn't make sense if there are indeed more >>> authors; yes, this complicates AUTH48, but such is life >> >> I agree, and the solution I would think reasonable is to change the process >> so that in the case where the RFC Editor thinks there are too many authors >> for smooth AUTH48, then it could ask authors to agree on a subset of them >> from which approval would be asked. How this set of "AUTH48 authors" is >> tracked could then become a purely technical matter: it could be tracked by >> tweaking "who is on the front page", but it could be handled through another >> channel independent of document content as well. > > ETOOCOMPLICATED :) I think the RFC-Editor should send AUTH48 e-mail > to the I-D authors list address (every I-D gets one), and the > RFC-Editor should warn the authors of the need to negotiate a sub-set > of representative authors. How the authors do that is up to them -- > no mechanism need be offered. > > That said, there's a different unrelated issue: only so many authors > can fit on the front page, and xml2rfc supports a private (non-IETF) > mode. Therefore it could provide an option for listing "Joe Sixpack > et. al." on the front page. It'd also be nice to have a guarantee > that element order matches up with order int he author > section, and, perhaps, a way to add text to the author section, so > that one could list editors, core authors, and contributors without > requiring metadata (though that would be nice too!). > .... Like that? ? > ... Best regards, Julian From nico@cryptonector.com Tue May 10 10:33:17 2011 Return-Path: X-Original-To: xml2rfc@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: xml2rfc@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id E9F44E08D1 for ; Tue, 10 May 2011 10:33:17 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -3.035 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-3.035 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=-1.058, BAYES_00=-2.599, FM_FORGED_GMAIL=0.622] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.30]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 9rb1PKsGBPOk for ; Tue, 10 May 2011 10:33:17 -0700 (PDT) Received: from homiemail-a24.g.dreamhost.com (caiajhbdcaid.dreamhost.com [208.97.132.83]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 10C29E08CA for ; Tue, 10 May 2011 10:33:17 -0700 (PDT) Received: from homiemail-a24.g.dreamhost.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by homiemail-a24.g.dreamhost.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5EAD82C806C for ; Tue, 10 May 2011 10:33:16 -0700 (PDT) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; c=nofws; d=cryptonector.com; h=mime-version :in-reply-to:references:date:message-id:subject:from:to:cc: content-type; q=dns; s=cryptonector.com; b=QmE+xo9zSRPw+6zxsBHOI 7T8NrMIkW/6XmFV1bVvG3bQXvKLvKwnW8rrd1EBtQCXiCzfJJq5cQZnGOsLB59kb JQTSJ4dDKY2mPKYQMryyBxE1G9cH3NoG48dd+Oehc5VsGGrwkQeRxbXjfZRVQ/Rg ClEWlytjaSqIYowfkU7z3o= DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha1; c=relaxed; d=cryptonector.com; h= mime-version:in-reply-to:references:date:message-id:subject:from :to:cc:content-type; s=cryptonector.com; bh=9AG3j4MwWXJsCc4l04B/ IZZK8nA=; b=fXia4qgVfEmINZP8TVx9RqtGe/XJW2CFLgXqixG6rlZ9jEfBX0j/ pmUcO7TKKznDQgPN169cugVVRXIxeqpakaMIjGXvE0YUsI1ro6z7VgVsyCKsNCRp bCWZAdM++w6Mjg6My+QilU0o7byOkKj++5fj5UHRnLAwM74f7nkp+M0= Received: from mail-vw0-f44.google.com (mail-vw0-f44.google.com [209.85.212.44]) (using TLSv1 with cipher RC4-SHA (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) (Authenticated sender: nico@cryptonector.com) by homiemail-a24.g.dreamhost.com (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 3626F2C806B for ; Tue, 10 May 2011 10:33:16 -0700 (PDT) Received: by vws12 with SMTP id 12so840033vws.31 for ; Tue, 10 May 2011 10:33:15 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 Received: by 10.52.175.199 with SMTP id cc7mr1435972vdc.197.1305048795496; Tue, 10 May 2011 10:33:15 -0700 (PDT) Received: by 10.52.155.4 with HTTP; Tue, 10 May 2011 10:33:15 -0700 (PDT) In-Reply-To: <4DC9688B.1010301@gmx.de> References: <038501cc0785$6ca37c00$45ea7400$@huawei.com> <4DC95190.5060906@orange-ftgroup.com> <4DC9547A.2090007@gmx.de> <4DC95B50.9070006@orange-ftgroup.com> <4DC9688B.1010301@gmx.de> Date: Tue, 10 May 2011 12:33:15 -0500 Message-ID: From: Nico Williams To: Julian Reschke Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 Cc: xml2rfc@ietf.org Subject: Re: [xml2rfc] Keeping some authors off the front page ? X-BeenThere: xml2rfc@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.12 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 10 May 2011 17:33:18 -0000 On Tue, May 10, 2011 at 11:32 AM, Julian Reschke wrote: > On 10.05.2011 18:23, Nico Williams wrote: >> .... > > Like that? ? Yes. That's there now? If so is the issue just whom to list on the front page? Can you add a directive to list only the first author follow by "et. al."? From julian.reschke@gmx.de Tue May 10 11:23:46 2011 Return-Path: X-Original-To: xml2rfc@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: xml2rfc@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 36CBFE07F3 for ; Tue, 10 May 2011 11:23:46 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -104.437 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-104.437 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=-1.838, BAYES_00=-2.599, USER_IN_WHITELIST=-100] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.30]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id xSdVaTwXfTCC for ; Tue, 10 May 2011 11:23:45 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mailout-de.gmx.net (mailout-de.gmx.net [213.165.64.22]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with SMTP id 1909EE0698 for ; Tue, 10 May 2011 11:23:42 -0700 (PDT) Received: (qmail invoked by alias); 10 May 2011 18:17:01 -0000 Received: from p508FCFB0.dip.t-dialin.net (EHLO [192.168.178.33]) [80.143.207.176] by mail.gmx.net (mp006) with SMTP; 10 May 2011 20:17:01 +0200 X-Authenticated: #1915285 X-Provags-ID: V01U2FsdGVkX192HAZZYL12LI+aOWszktfKGinB4SOwhGmqQZcUa0 qpgZHCZ8VcaEm6 Message-ID: <4DC98109.1010604@gmx.de> Date: Tue, 10 May 2011 20:16:41 +0200 From: Julian Reschke User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 6.1; en-US; rv:1.9.2.17) Gecko/20110414 Lightning/1.0b2 Thunderbird/3.1.10 MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Nico Williams References: <038501cc0785$6ca37c00$45ea7400$@huawei.com> <4DC95190.5060906@orange-ftgroup.com> <4DC9547A.2090007@gmx.de> <4DC95B50.9070006@orange-ftgroup.com> <4DC9688B.1010301@gmx.de> In-Reply-To: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Y-GMX-Trusted: 0 Cc: xml2rfc@ietf.org Subject: Re: [xml2rfc] Keeping some authors off the front page ? X-BeenThere: xml2rfc@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.12 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 10 May 2011 18:23:46 -0000 On 10.05.2011 19:33, Nico Williams wrote: > On Tue, May 10, 2011 at 11:32 AM, Julian Reschke wrote: >> On 10.05.2011 18:23, Nico Williams wrote: >>> .... >> >> Like that?? > > Yes. That's there now? If so is the issue just whom to list on the No. Just in rfc2629.xslt. > front page? Can you add a directive to list only the first author > follow by "et. al."? On the front page? Is this an accepted format? From dwing@cisco.com Tue May 10 17:46:27 2011 Return-Path: X-Original-To: xml2rfc@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: xml2rfc@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id BCDDAE06D1 for ; Tue, 10 May 2011 17:46:27 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -110.228 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-110.228 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.371, BAYES_00=-2.599, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_HI=-8, USER_IN_WHITELIST=-100] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.30]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id UhAQlL5DXdLh for ; Tue, 10 May 2011 17:46:27 -0700 (PDT) Received: from sj-iport-1.cisco.com (sj-iport-1.cisco.com [171.71.176.70]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 26488E0681 for ; Tue, 10 May 2011 17:46:27 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/simple; d=cisco.com; i=dwing@cisco.com; l=1621; q=dns/txt; s=iport; t=1305074787; x=1306284387; h=from:to:cc:references:in-reply-to:subject:date: message-id:mime-version:content-transfer-encoding; bh=Pvt1mxvSjIKXzBp6PkWLY+lcI/nM9UK9x61vp7tUgDc=; b=hiWEhFU1EJ1pnGByuAFdF24/oLEsTwp940BY9AmuV5YwJZeKR5Kjr7Ng vxM0CKfHY7Syi4yi1IFCbPyLIfhJc0NTvx95hCfcGptEXC4ftlJkBGCv/ JvU2oHHkgAvaHbZGI+VdzZLz63erM2/lyfxdRIinqtX+AvDj7sMEF/PxI g=; X-IronPort-Anti-Spam-Filtered: true X-IronPort-Anti-Spam-Result: AvEAAPbayU2rRDoH/2dsb2JhbACXW4FkjEx3iHCgUp4hhg8EhkKYLQ X-IronPort-AV: E=Sophos;i="4.64,349,1301875200"; d="scan'208";a="445353651" Received: from mtv-core-2.cisco.com ([171.68.58.7]) by sj-iport-1.cisco.com with ESMTP; 11 May 2011 00:46:26 +0000 Received: from dwingWS ([10.32.240.195]) by mtv-core-2.cisco.com (8.14.3/8.14.3) with ESMTP id p4B0kQnK030244; Wed, 11 May 2011 00:46:26 GMT From: "Dan Wing" To: "'Julian Reschke'" , "'Thomas Morin'" References: <038501cc0785$6ca37c00$45ea7400$@huawei.com> <4DC95190.5060906@orange-ftgroup.com> <4DC9547A.2090007@gmx.de> In-Reply-To: <4DC9547A.2090007@gmx.de> Date: Tue, 10 May 2011 17:46:25 -0700 Message-ID: <000701cc0f74$dbb7f1b0$9327d510$@com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: Microsoft Office Outlook 12.0 Thread-Index: AcwPJBtoDaPxznc3RSKKAWL0u5OitQAUEyIA Content-Language: en-us Cc: xml2rfc@ietf.org Subject: Re: [xml2rfc] Keeping some authors off the front page ? X-BeenThere: xml2rfc@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.12 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 11 May 2011 00:46:27 -0000 > -----Original Message----- > From: xml2rfc-bounces@ietf.org [mailto:xml2rfc-bounces@ietf.org] On > Behalf Of Julian Reschke > Sent: Tuesday, May 10, 2011 8:07 AM > To: Thomas Morin > Cc: xml2rfc@ietf.org > Subject: Re: [xml2rfc] Keeping some authors off the front page ? > > On 10.05.2011 16:54, Thomas Morin wrote: > > Hello folks, > > > > This is about an issue that has already been discussed > > ... > > Hi Thomas, > > you clearly have done your homework :-). > > This has been an issue for a long time. The main blocking issue IMHO > was/is the lack of direction from the IETF and the RFC Editor. Maybe > this will be fixed once we have a new RFC Editor. > > The issues that I see are: > > - the "only 5 authors" rule doesn't make sense if there are indeed more > authors; yes, this complicates AUTH48, but such is life > > - we could add a "contributors" section, but it's not entirely clear > how it would be different from an Acknowledgments section. > > So we really need to come to *stable* (*) consensus about the terms > "editor", "author", and "contributor". Is that really necessary? I mean, what breaks if we don't have that consensus first? As an extreme, let's say someone wants to put their non-technical boss (who can't type) as editor or author or contributor or in acknowledgements. What gets harmed? -d > Best regards, Julian > > (*) So we don't need to change the tools all the time... > > _______________________________________________ > xml2rfc mailing list > xml2rfc@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/xml2rfc From dwing@cisco.com Tue May 10 17:47:26 2011 Return-Path: X-Original-To: xml2rfc@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: xml2rfc@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id C469EE06DB for ; Tue, 10 May 2011 17:47:26 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -108.493 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-108.493 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=-1.394, BAYES_00=-2.599, FH_RELAY_NODNS=1.451, HELO_MISMATCH_COM=0.553, MIME_QP_LONG_LINE=1.396, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_HI=-8, RDNS_NONE=0.1, USER_IN_WHITELIST=-100] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.30]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id vrqhGGsT1HmS for ; Tue, 10 May 2011 17:47:25 -0700 (PDT) Received: from sj-iport-2.cisco.com (unknown [171.71.176.71]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 85030E06D1 for ; Tue, 10 May 2011 17:47:25 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/simple; d=cisco.com; i=dwing@cisco.com; l=9196; q=dns/txt; s=iport; t=1305074845; x=1306284445; h=from:to:references:in-reply-to:subject:date:message-id: mime-version; bh=4yTtl0KHi9GcSPATFcKR28wdf+mFcc2n8XmQauUgAK4=; b=KbPJMgrVoqcI2dyU7KIdPkWf7uUjEK2ZXJIzacQWvdP+1o6yV0tGzhiV THrWD4BZZ4Kvwe6bUr1ydTrVlAIERVTqE8hm+TO2k9HrfH07eFGmGHo8J f/zwSuD+ur7XPWhUpclBGjXGnnAudtXPdQLiA0H67T1IrYuhrik2sL4h1 8=; X-Files: xml2rfc_136.patch : 2138 X-IronPort-Anti-Spam-Filtered: true X-IronPort-Anti-Spam-Result: AvEAAK3byU2rRDoJ/2dsb2JhbACXW4Fki2ljd4hwoF6eIYYPBIZCmC0 X-IronPort-AV: E=Sophos;i="4.64,349,1301875200"; d="scan'208";a="354424829" Received: from mtv-core-4.cisco.com ([171.68.58.9]) by sj-iport-2.cisco.com with ESMTP; 11 May 2011 00:47:25 +0000 Received: from dwingWS ([10.32.240.195]) by mtv-core-4.cisco.com (8.14.3/8.14.3) with ESMTP id p4B0lOWs010470; Wed, 11 May 2011 00:47:24 GMT From: "Dan Wing" To: "'Thomas Morin'" , References: <038501cc0785$6ca37c00$45ea7400$@huawei.com> <4DC95190.5060906@orange-ftgroup.com> In-Reply-To: <4DC95190.5060906@orange-ftgroup.com> Date: Tue, 10 May 2011 17:47:23 -0700 Message-ID: <000801cc0f74$fe5fdca0$fb1f95e0$@com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0009_01CC0F3A.520104A0" X-Mailer: Microsoft Office Outlook 12.0 Thread-Index: AcwPIiYiY0lX5KmJToOzZaISay/7fQAUGLVw Content-Language: en-us Subject: Re: [xml2rfc] Keeping some authors off the front page ? X-BeenThere: xml2rfc@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.12 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 11 May 2011 00:47:26 -0000 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0009_01CC0F3A.520104A0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit > -----Original Message----- > From: xml2rfc-bounces@ietf.org [mailto:xml2rfc-bounces@ietf.org] On > Behalf Of Thomas Morin > Sent: Tuesday, May 10, 2011 7:54 AM > To: xml2rfc@ietf.org > Subject: [xml2rfc] Keeping some authors off the front page ? > > Hello folks, > > This is about an issue that has already been discussed > > While reviewing a draft I edit, the AD in charge pointed out the usual > "too many authors on the front page" issue: > > Would it be possible to consider moving everyone except for the > editor > > off the front page? [all authors] will still all be listed as authors > at the end > > of the document. > > After reading again the xml2rfc ML archives, in particular the thread > in > October 2008, the understanding I have is that: > - some people would like to do this, but the toolchain does not allow > this Below (and attached) is a patch for xml2rfc 1.36 which allows using role="notfirstpage" in an section. For example: This will keep that author off the first page, but the author still appears in the "Authors Addresses'" section, as today. > - it's been explained that the initial idea is that the "Authors' > addresses" section should list only the people appearing on the front > page > - however, it does not seem there is a strict rule imposing this, and > it > seems there are drafts that list only editors on the front page and > more people in the "Authors' addresses" section Some folks edit things manually, which is a pain. > - the RFC Editor encourages a limitation of the number of authors (for > both the front page and the "Authors' addresses" contact information > section): this is motivated at > http://www.rfc-editor.org/policy.html#policy.authlist > - the AUTH48 process contact people listed on the front page and it is > thus also encouraged to limit the number of authors on the front page > - the resulting recommendation is to do only declare as authors the > people who have to appear on the front page, and put others in an > additional section > > It seems to me that restricting what the xml2rfc tool can do based on > this recommendation is not satisfying at all: > - it seems at the opposite of the path taken for other issues: the > general thinking seems to be that the tool could be use for other > purpose than IETF or RFCs, and should not enforce a policy upon users > - it makes users of xml2rfc unable to do what users of other toolchains > (a) can technically do, and (b) can submit to the IETF with good > chances of success I expect the DRAFTNAME@tools.ietf.org alias is built using the addresses from the Authors Addresses' section, without regard to the first page. This may (not) be what is expected. > So, with the above in mind, why not add a "frontage" attribute to the > "author" element, which would default to "yes", and if set to "no" > would > just result in the said author to not appear on the front page ... ? > > Moreover, implementing the recommended approach with xml2rfc is not > great: > - the section with the additional authors has to be written manually > (cannot use authors elements, even though it can be appropriate to give > contact information for them too) > - it is not easy to have the same formatting for the two sections, > especially across all types of output (TXT, HTML, ...) > - this section cannot be put in a close location to the "Authors' > addresses" section > > So, for people wanting to implement the recommended approach in a nicer > way, could we introduce a special rfc/back/contributors, which could > include text and "author" elements, and which would be rendered in the > output right after the "Authors' addresses" section (after References) > ? IMHO, having which worked exactly like , and created a "Contributor['s|s'] Address[es]" section, would be lovely. -d > Thank you, > > -Thomas -d ----- diff -crB xml2rfc-1.36/rfc2629.dtd xml2rfc-1.36-dwing/rfc2629.dtd *** xml2rfc-1.36/rfc2629.dtd 2010-11-27 05:52:09.000000000 -0800 --- xml2rfc-1.36-dwing/rfc2629.dtd 2011-05-10 16:37:26.738645000 -0700 *************** *** 138,144 **** initials %ATEXT; #IMPLIED surname %ATEXT; #IMPLIED fullname %ATEXT; #IMPLIED ! role (editor) #IMPLIED> --- 138,144 ---- initials %ATEXT; #IMPLIED surname %ATEXT; #IMPLIED fullname %ATEXT; #IMPLIED ! role (editor|notfirstpage) #IMPLIED> diff -crB xml2rfc-1.36/xml2rfc.tcl xml2rfc-1.36-dwing/xml2rfc.tcl *** xml2rfc-1.36/xml2rfc.tcl 2011-03-26 09:11:39.000000000 -0700 --- xml2rfc-1.36-dwing/xml2rfc.tcl 2011-05-10 17:26:10.096645000 -0700 *************** *** 11,17 **** global prog prog_version prog_url prog_ack set prog "xml2rfc" ! set prog_version "v1.36" set prog_url "http://xml.resource.org/" set prog_ack \ "This document was produced --- 11,17 ---- global prog prog_version prog_url prog_ack set prog "xml2rfc" ! set prog_version "v1.36-dwing" set prog_url "http://xml.resource.org/" set prog_ack \ "This document was produced *************** *** 6839,6844 **** --- 6839,6845 ---- switch -- $av(role) { editor - "" {} + notfirstpage - "" {} default { unexpected error "invalid role attribute: $av(role)" *************** *** 6869,6875 **** append av(abbrev) ", Ed." } } ! set authors [linsert $authors 0 [list $av(abbrev) $ov(abbrev)]] } set lastO "" --- 6870,6878 ---- append av(abbrev) ", Ed." } } ! if {[string compare $av(role) notfirstpage]} { ! set authors [linsert $authors 0 [list $av(abbrev) $ov(abbrev )]] ! } } set lastO "" ------=_NextPart_000_0009_01CC0F3A.520104A0 Content-Type: application/octet-stream; name="xml2rfc_136.patch" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="xml2rfc_136.patch" diff -crB xml2rfc-1.36/rfc2629.dtd xml2rfc-1.36-dwing/rfc2629.dtd=0A= *** xml2rfc-1.36/rfc2629.dtd 2010-11-27 05:52:09.000000000 -0800=0A= --- xml2rfc-1.36-dwing/rfc2629.dtd 2011-05-10 16:37:26.738645000 -0700=0A= ***************=0A= *** 138,144 ****=0A= initials %ATEXT; #IMPLIED surname %ATEXT; #IMPLIED fullname %ATEXT; #IMPLIED ! role (editor) #IMPLIED> =20 --- 138,144 ----=0A= initials %ATEXT; #IMPLIED surname %ATEXT; #IMPLIED fullname %ATEXT; #IMPLIED ! role (editor|notfirstpage) #IMPLIED> =20 diff -crB xml2rfc-1.36/xml2rfc.tcl xml2rfc-1.36-dwing/xml2rfc.tcl=0A= *** xml2rfc-1.36/xml2rfc.tcl 2011-03-26 09:11:39.000000000 -0700=0A= --- xml2rfc-1.36-dwing/xml2rfc.tcl 2011-05-10 17:26:10.096645000 -0700=0A= ***************=0A= *** 11,17 ****=0A= =0A= global prog prog_version prog_url prog_ack=0A= set prog "xml2rfc"=0A= ! set prog_version "v1.36"=0A= set prog_url "http://xml.resource.org/"=0A= set prog_ack \=0A= "This document was produced=0A= --- 11,17 ----=0A= =0A= global prog prog_version prog_url prog_ack=0A= set prog "xml2rfc"=0A= ! set prog_version "v1.36-dwing"=0A= set prog_url "http://xml.resource.org/"=0A= set prog_ack \=0A= "This document was produced=0A= ***************=0A= *** 6839,6844 ****=0A= --- 6839,6845 ----=0A= =0A= switch -- $av(role) {=0A= editor - "" {}=0A= + notfirstpage - "" {}=0A= =0A= default {=0A= unexpected error "invalid role attribute: $av(role)"=0A= ***************=0A= *** 6869,6875 ****=0A= append av(abbrev) ", Ed."=0A= }=0A= }=0A= ! set authors [linsert $authors 0 [list $av(abbrev) $ov(abbrev)]]=0A= }=0A= =0A= set lastO ""=0A= --- 6870,6878 ----=0A= append av(abbrev) ", Ed."=0A= }=0A= }=0A= ! if {[string compare $av(role) notfirstpage]} {=0A= ! set authors [linsert $authors 0 [list $av(abbrev) $ov(abbrev)]]=0A= ! }=0A= }=0A= =0A= set lastO ""=0A= ------=_NextPart_000_0009_01CC0F3A.520104A0-- From dwing@cisco.com Tue May 10 18:10:15 2011 Return-Path: X-Original-To: xml2rfc@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: xml2rfc@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 79FD1E06B5 for ; Tue, 10 May 2011 18:10:15 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -108 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-108 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[RCVD_IN_DNSWL_HI=-8, USER_IN_WHITELIST=-100] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.30]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 002C8VLoMMqT for ; Tue, 10 May 2011 18:10:13 -0700 (PDT) Received: from sj-iport-1.cisco.com (sj-iport-1.cisco.com [171.71.176.70]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id DB8D4E06A2 for ; Tue, 10 May 2011 18:10:13 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/simple; d=cisco.com; i=dwing@cisco.com; l=2253; q=dns/txt; s=iport; t=1305076213; x=1306285813; h=from:to:cc:references:in-reply-to:subject:date: message-id:mime-version:content-transfer-encoding; bh=3g+CZOjkmFigm8YqsYOF4o54bXASTLDZk85DeLAfKIo=; b=YQrrxPhSmkloLLLvtUXVSvAmtSywaE+4JEZ+xc+aH5IaOyfBQCqueJj6 7/5Ym4u9z5Vflr+WbwgFUDBtEHH6cZmQk7PcEHPweUKm/QZig1rv8w1pm ZiFLMppXNxekkRCJOaVb/ghgtHPl5ULXcVeGIBkAJ8TZIxFTVEM4ij1+b A=; X-IronPort-Anti-Spam-Filtered: true X-IronPort-Anti-Spam-Result: AvEAALffyU2rRDoH/2dsb2JhbACXW4FkjEx3qUieIoYPBIZCmC0 X-IronPort-AV: E=Sophos;i="4.64,349,1301875200"; d="scan'208";a="445362231" Received: from mtv-core-2.cisco.com ([171.68.58.7]) by sj-iport-1.cisco.com with ESMTP; 11 May 2011 01:03:11 +0000 Received: from dwingWS ([10.32.240.195]) by mtv-core-2.cisco.com (8.14.3/8.14.3) with ESMTP id p4B13Apk010738; Wed, 11 May 2011 01:03:10 GMT From: "Dan Wing" To: "'Julian Reschke'" , "'Nico Williams'" References: <038501cc0785$6ca37c00$45ea7400$@huawei.com> <4DC95190.5060906@orange-ftgroup.com> <4DC9547A.2090007@gmx.de> <4DC95B50.9070006@orange-ftgroup.com> <4DC9688B.1010301@gmx.de> In-Reply-To: <4DC9688B.1010301@gmx.de> Date: Tue, 10 May 2011 18:03:10 -0700 Message-ID: <002401cc0f77$321d2f00$96578d00$@com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: Microsoft Office Outlook 12.0 Thread-Index: AcwPMAaSp99v9qbSTFKzxLmITYyh4AARuN2A Content-Language: en-us Cc: xml2rfc@ietf.org Subject: Re: [xml2rfc] Keeping some authors off the front page ? X-BeenThere: xml2rfc@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.12 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 11 May 2011 01:10:15 -0000 > -----Original Message----- > From: xml2rfc-bounces@ietf.org [mailto:xml2rfc-bounces@ietf.org] On > Behalf Of Julian Reschke > Sent: Tuesday, May 10, 2011 9:32 AM > To: Nico Williams > Cc: xml2rfc@ietf.org > Subject: Re: [xml2rfc] Keeping some authors off the front page ? > > On 10.05.2011 18:23, Nico Williams wrote: > > On Tue, May 10, 2011 at 10:35 AM, Thomas Morin > > wrote: > >>> - the "only 5 authors" rule doesn't make sense if there are indeed > more > >>> authors; yes, this complicates AUTH48, but such is life > >> > >> I agree, and the solution I would think reasonable is to change the > process > >> so that in the case where the RFC Editor thinks there are too many > authors > >> for smooth AUTH48, then it could ask authors to agree on a subset of > them > >> from which approval would be asked. How this set of "AUTH48 authors" > is > >> tracked could then become a purely technical matter: it could be > tracked by > >> tweaking "who is on the front page", but it could be handled through > another > >> channel independent of document content as well. > > > > ETOOCOMPLICATED :) I think the RFC-Editor should send AUTH48 e-mail > > to the I-D authors list address (every I-D gets one), and the > > RFC-Editor should warn the authors of the need to negotiate a sub-set > > of representative authors. How the authors do that is up to them -- > > no mechanism need be offered. > > > > That said, there's a different unrelated issue: only so many authors > > can fit on the front page, and xml2rfc supports a private (non-IETF) > > mode. Therefore it could provide an option for listing "Joe Sixpack > > et. al." on the front page. It'd also be nice to have a guarantee > > that element order matches up with order int he author > > section, and, perhaps, a way to add text to the author section, so > > that one could list editors, core authors, and contributors without > > requiring metadata (though that would be nice too!). > > .... > > Like that? > ? That didn't work out so well -- RFC2046 has no Section 8, but has two occurrences of Section 9. -d From julian.reschke@gmx.de Tue May 10 23:27:05 2011 Return-Path: X-Original-To: xml2rfc@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: xml2rfc@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id B3ACCE066A for ; Tue, 10 May 2011 23:27:05 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -102.599 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-102.599 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-2.599, USER_IN_WHITELIST=-100] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.30]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id QJFQ-VUp1opr for ; Tue, 10 May 2011 23:27:05 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mailout-de.gmx.net (mailout-de.gmx.net [213.165.64.22]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with SMTP id 78628E0665 for ; Tue, 10 May 2011 23:27:04 -0700 (PDT) Received: (qmail invoked by alias); 11 May 2011 06:27:02 -0000 Received: from p508FCB45.dip.t-dialin.net (EHLO [192.168.178.33]) [80.143.203.69] by mail.gmx.net (mp022) with SMTP; 11 May 2011 08:27:02 +0200 X-Authenticated: #1915285 X-Provags-ID: V01U2FsdGVkX1/LMRIFDRLLtX9QCMGuC2e7/MOJOLbd2ElFKcOvvQ pVCZjpvq1hnZQe Message-ID: <4DCA2C30.4070905@gmx.de> Date: Wed, 11 May 2011 08:26:56 +0200 From: Julian Reschke User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 6.1; en-US; rv:1.9.2.17) Gecko/20110414 Lightning/1.0b2 Thunderbird/3.1.10 MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Dan Wing References: <038501cc0785$6ca37c00$45ea7400$@huawei.com> <4DC95190.5060906@orange-ftgroup.com> <4DC9547A.2090007@gmx.de> <4DC95B50.9070006@orange-ftgroup.com> <4DC9688B.1010301@gmx.de> <002401cc0f77$321d2f00$96578d00$@com> In-Reply-To: <002401cc0f77$321d2f00$96578d00$@com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Y-GMX-Trusted: 0 Cc: xml2rfc@ietf.org Subject: Re: [xml2rfc] Keeping some authors off the front page ? X-BeenThere: xml2rfc@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.12 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 11 May 2011 06:27:05 -0000 On 11.05.2011 03:03, Dan Wing wrote: > ... >> Like that? >> ? > > That didn't work out so well -- RFC2046 has no Section 8, but has > two occurrences of Section 9. > ... Where? What? Me confused :-) From dwing@cisco.com Wed May 11 07:12:59 2011 Return-Path: X-Original-To: xml2rfc@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: xml2rfc@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id A2F33E0685 for ; Wed, 11 May 2011 07:12:59 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -109.3 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-109.3 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=1.300, BAYES_00=-2.599, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_HI=-8, USER_IN_WHITELIST=-100] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.30]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id OTuQ5gnCkEZu for ; Wed, 11 May 2011 07:12:58 -0700 (PDT) Received: from sj-iport-2.cisco.com (sj-iport-2.cisco.com [171.71.176.71]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id E03F0E0679 for ; Wed, 11 May 2011 07:12:41 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/simple; d=cisco.com; i=dwing@cisco.com; l=704; q=dns/txt; s=iport; t=1305123161; x=1306332761; h=from:to:cc:references:in-reply-to:subject:date: message-id:mime-version:content-transfer-encoding; bh=P+s7go4FovQDUeAewf6cCYdnt8vBPsoN3pyUZ87YtQ8=; b=ZaEwK2HdFZfrMgckW3IjpOIrHZ4dxyWZCFFZ2Y+k9z/8Tm/Hh/6/Ivbj n7D0gC5Y418qFpbEojNFgHKIZiGWLNTFrQAVL0QvmN+4fI0MAPTMSIXZS fPjraR7rvS6vPKhCw2CFqd0/MWEI/4relWJvVBZs6JgLZPz2Ol8zcbZL4 A=; X-IronPort-Anti-Spam-Filtered: true X-IronPort-Anti-Spam-Result: Ah8BAFeYyk2rRDoI/2dsb2JhbACXV4FkjEt3qgueIIYQBIZDmC4 X-IronPort-AV: E=Sophos;i="4.64,353,1301875200"; d="scan'208";a="354823126" Received: from mtv-core-3.cisco.com ([171.68.58.8]) by sj-iport-2.cisco.com with ESMTP; 11 May 2011 14:12:41 +0000 Received: from dwingWS ([10.32.240.195]) by mtv-core-3.cisco.com (8.14.3/8.14.3) with ESMTP id p4BECfFw020913; Wed, 11 May 2011 14:12:41 GMT From: "Dan Wing" To: "'Julian Reschke'" References: <038501cc0785$6ca37c00$45ea7400$@huawei.com> <4DC95190.5060906@orange-ftgroup.com> <4DC9547A.2090007@gmx.de> <4DC95B50.9070006@orange-ftgroup.com> <4DC9688B.1010301@gmx.de> <002401cc0f77$321d2f00$96578d00$@com> <4DCA2C30.4070905@gmx.de> In-Reply-To: <4DCA2C30.4070905@gmx.de> Date: Wed, 11 May 2011 07:12:42 -0700 Message-ID: <01d301cc0fe5$7e898190$7b9c84b0$@com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: Microsoft Office Outlook 12.0 Thread-Index: AcwPpHPf1f3MIgk/TNGbdd8dBIxMDgAQO/aw Content-Language: en-us Cc: xml2rfc@ietf.org Subject: Re: [xml2rfc] Keeping some authors off the front page ? X-BeenThere: xml2rfc@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.12 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 11 May 2011 14:12:59 -0000 > -----Original Message----- > From: Julian Reschke [mailto:julian.reschke@gmx.de] > Sent: Tuesday, May 10, 2011 11:27 PM > To: Dan Wing > Cc: 'Nico Williams'; xml2rfc@ietf.org > Subject: Re: [xml2rfc] Keeping some authors off the front page ? > > On 11.05.2011 03:03, Dan Wing wrote: > > ... > >> Like that? > >> ? > > > > That didn't work out so well -- RFC2046 has no Section 8, but has > > two occurrences of Section 9. > > ... > > Where? What? Me confused :-) # grep "^[0-9]\." rfc2046.txt (snip) 6. Experimental Media Type Values 7. Summary 9. Security Considerations 9. Authors' Addresses -d From julian.reschke@gmx.de Wed May 11 07:22:24 2011 Return-Path: X-Original-To: xml2rfc@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: xml2rfc@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 46926E0726 for ; Wed, 11 May 2011 07:22:24 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -102.599 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-102.599 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-2.599, USER_IN_WHITELIST=-100] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.30]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id GcvKKK0jeWnW for ; Wed, 11 May 2011 07:22:23 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mailout-de.gmx.net (mailout-de.gmx.net [213.165.64.23]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with SMTP id 33755E0703 for ; Wed, 11 May 2011 07:22:22 -0700 (PDT) Received: (qmail invoked by alias); 11 May 2011 14:22:20 -0000 Received: from mail.greenbytes.de (EHLO [192.168.1.142]) [217.91.35.233] by mail.gmx.net (mp061) with SMTP; 11 May 2011 16:22:20 +0200 X-Authenticated: #1915285 X-Provags-ID: V01U2FsdGVkX1+2JFkVK722bA9dLFfSEaU5NgaQwwiZT3wxdLgvwm zJjAAZ0Jo++6Fj Message-ID: <4DCA9B98.3080707@gmx.de> Date: Wed, 11 May 2011 16:22:16 +0200 From: Julian Reschke User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 6.1; en-US; rv:1.9.2.17) Gecko/20110414 Lightning/1.0b2 Thunderbird/3.1.10 MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Dan Wing References: <038501cc0785$6ca37c00$45ea7400$@huawei.com> <4DC95190.5060906@orange-ftgroup.com> <4DC9547A.2090007@gmx.de> <4DC95B50.9070006@orange-ftgroup.com> <4DC9688B.1010301@gmx.de> <002401cc0f77$321d2f00$96578d00$@com> <4DCA2C30.4070905@gmx.de> <01d301cc0fe5$7e898190$7b9c84b0$@com> In-Reply-To: <01d301cc0fe5$7e898190$7b9c84b0$@com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Y-GMX-Trusted: 0 Cc: xml2rfc@ietf.org Subject: Re: [xml2rfc] Keeping some authors off the front page ? X-BeenThere: xml2rfc@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.12 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 11 May 2011 14:22:24 -0000 On 11.05.2011 16:12, Dan Wing wrote: >> -----Original Message----- >> From: Julian Reschke [mailto:julian.reschke@gmx.de] >> Sent: Tuesday, May 10, 2011 11:27 PM >> To: Dan Wing >> Cc: 'Nico Williams'; xml2rfc@ietf.org >> Subject: Re: [xml2rfc] Keeping some authors off the front page ? >> >> On 11.05.2011 03:03, Dan Wing wrote: >>> ... >>>> Like that? >>>> ? >>> >>> That didn't work out so well -- RFC2046 has no Section 8, but has >>> two occurrences of Section 9. >>> ... >> >> Where? What? Me confused :-) > > # grep "^[0-9]\." rfc2046.txt > (snip) > 6. Experimental Media Type Values > 7. Summary > 9. Security Considerations > 9. Authors' Addresses > > -d Oh. That's a bizarre bug in the published RFC. I don't think we need tool support to generate something like that, no? From thomas.morin@orange-ftgroup.com Wed May 11 07:27:19 2011 Return-Path: X-Original-To: xml2rfc@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: xml2rfc@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id A9728E0685 for ; Wed, 11 May 2011 07:27:19 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -103.249 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-103.249 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-2.599, HELO_EQ_FR=0.35, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW=-1, USER_IN_WHITELIST=-100] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.30]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id IoUxM0bxn0qD for ; Wed, 11 May 2011 07:27:19 -0700 (PDT) Received: from p-mail1.rd.francetelecom.com (p-mail1.rd.francetelecom.com [195.101.245.15]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0DAAEE0679 for ; Wed, 11 May 2011 07:27:19 -0700 (PDT) Received: from p-mail1.rd.francetelecom.com (localhost.localdomain [127.0.0.1]) by localhost (Postfix) with SMTP id 524F08B8004; Wed, 11 May 2011 16:27:56 +0200 (CEST) Received: from ftrdsmtp1.rd.francetelecom.fr (unknown [10.192.128.46]) by p-mail1.rd.francetelecom.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4B00E8B8001; Wed, 11 May 2011 16:27:56 +0200 (CEST) Received: from ftrdmel10.rd.francetelecom.fr ([10.192.128.44]) by ftrdsmtp1.rd.francetelecom.fr with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.4675); Wed, 11 May 2011 16:27:18 +0200 Received: from [10.193.71.121] ([10.193.71.121]) by ftrdmel10.rd.francetelecom.fr with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.4675); Wed, 11 May 2011 16:27:17 +0200 Message-ID: <4DCA9CC6.8090904@orange-ftgroup.com> Date: Wed, 11 May 2011 16:27:18 +0200 From: Thomas Morin Organization: France Telecom Orange User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; U; ; ; ) Gecko/2010 Thunderbird/3.1.x MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Dan Wing References: <038501cc0785$6ca37c00$45ea7400$@huawei.com> <4DC95190.5060906@orange-ftgroup.com> <000801cc0f74$fe5fdca0$fb1f95e0$@com> In-Reply-To: <000801cc0f74$fe5fdca0$fb1f95e0$@com> X-TagToolbar-Keys: D20110511162718680 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-OriginalArrivalTime: 11 May 2011 14:27:17.0634 (UTC) FILETIME=[87C10E20:01CC0FE7] Cc: xml2rfc@ietf.org Subject: Re: [xml2rfc] Keeping some authors off the front page ? X-BeenThere: xml2rfc@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.12 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 11 May 2011 14:27:19 -0000 Hi Dan, Dan Wing: > > Below (and attached) is a patch for xml2rfc 1.36 which allows using > role="notfirstpage" > in an section. > > For example: > surname="Wing" role="notfirstpage"> > > This will keep that author off the first page, but the author > still appears in the "Authors Addresses'" section, as today. This patch gives exactly the wanted behavior and solves the problem for me. Thank you! -Thomas From dwing@cisco.com Wed May 11 07:54:52 2011 Return-Path: X-Original-To: xml2rfc@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: xml2rfc@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0FDE1E0736 for ; Wed, 11 May 2011 07:54:52 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -109.949 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-109.949 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.650, BAYES_00=-2.599, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_HI=-8, USER_IN_WHITELIST=-100] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.30]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id XBmUtEiFyQEI for ; Wed, 11 May 2011 07:54:51 -0700 (PDT) Received: from sj-iport-3.cisco.com (sj-iport-3.cisco.com [171.71.176.72]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3B87EE0679 for ; Wed, 11 May 2011 07:54:51 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/simple; d=cisco.com; i=dwing@cisco.com; l=1305; q=dns/txt; s=iport; t=1305125691; x=1306335291; h=from:to:cc:references:in-reply-to:subject:date: message-id:mime-version:content-transfer-encoding; bh=s/sOGzEiauPLwuo5vb4qxJCCIO7+v3gXZSk9vNMYK+0=; b=mxDoK7IWBYPP+LTLCn23VFNEjH29deoFs6iom3StsqUI3UpAFttyEKeb hhsBq/+M/fQB7T4lHKtT4XZ+xLU4ajh1CnSEVZfljfIRVRPlQUx6fNJ+j RR933BtnAlRaIiP17ko11t29gXckajKLP8FsimjocO0o/G7AhmEgFu/Ns 4=; X-IronPort-Anti-Spam-Filtered: true X-IronPort-Anti-Spam-Result: Ah8BADSiyk2rRDoG/2dsb2JhbACXWIFkjEt3qmCeIYYQBIZDmC4 X-IronPort-AV: E=Sophos;i="4.64,353,1301875200"; d="scan'208";a="313307617" Received: from mtv-core-1.cisco.com ([171.68.58.6]) by sj-iport-3.cisco.com with ESMTP; 11 May 2011 14:54:51 +0000 Received: from dwingWS ([10.32.240.195]) by mtv-core-1.cisco.com (8.14.3/8.14.3) with ESMTP id p4BEsoii007034; Wed, 11 May 2011 14:54:50 GMT From: "Dan Wing" To: "'Julian Reschke'" References: <038501cc0785$6ca37c00$45ea7400$@huawei.com> <4DC95190.5060906@orange-ftgroup.com> <4DC9547A.2090007@gmx.de> <4DC95B50.9070006@orange-ftgroup.com> <4DC9688B.1010301@gmx.de> <002401cc0f77$321d2f00$96578d00$@com> <4DCA2C30.4070905@gmx.de> <01d301cc0fe5$7e898190$7b9c84b0$@com> <4DCA9B98.3080707@gmx.de> In-Reply-To: <4DCA9B98.3080707@gmx.de> Date: Wed, 11 May 2011 07:54:52 -0700 Message-ID: <020b01cc0feb$624063e0$26c12ba0$@com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: Microsoft Office Outlook 12.0 Thread-Index: AcwP5tzohdJUQLNnQwyvo66U+86l+wABGelg Content-Language: en-us Cc: xml2rfc@ietf.org Subject: Re: [xml2rfc] Keeping some authors off the front page ? X-BeenThere: xml2rfc@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.12 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 11 May 2011 14:54:52 -0000 > -----Original Message----- > From: Julian Reschke [mailto:julian.reschke@gmx.de] > Sent: Wednesday, May 11, 2011 7:22 AM > To: Dan Wing > Cc: 'Nico Williams'; xml2rfc@ietf.org > Subject: Re: [xml2rfc] Keeping some authors off the front page ? > > On 11.05.2011 16:12, Dan Wing wrote: > >> -----Original Message----- > >> From: Julian Reschke [mailto:julian.reschke@gmx.de] > >> Sent: Tuesday, May 10, 2011 11:27 PM > >> To: Dan Wing > >> Cc: 'Nico Williams'; xml2rfc@ietf.org > >> Subject: Re: [xml2rfc] Keeping some authors off the front page ? > >> > >> On 11.05.2011 03:03, Dan Wing wrote: > >>> ... > >>>> Like that? > >>>> ? > >>> > >>> That didn't work out so well -- RFC2046 has no Section 8, but has > >>> two occurrences of Section 9. > >>> ... > >> > >> Where? What? Me confused :-) > > > > # grep "^[0-9]\." rfc2046.txt > > (snip) > > 6. Experimental Media Type Values > > 7. Summary > > 9. Security Considerations > > 9. Authors' Addresses > > > > -d > > Oh. That's a bizarre bug in the published RFC. I don't think we need > tool support to generate something like that, no? My point is that proper tool support would avoid similar bugs in published documents. -d From julian.reschke@gmx.de Wed May 11 08:04:58 2011 Return-Path: X-Original-To: xml2rfc@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: xml2rfc@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id CFEE9E0808 for ; Wed, 11 May 2011 08:04:58 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -102.599 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-102.599 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-2.599, USER_IN_WHITELIST=-100] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.30]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id McDk4SHjxoAE for ; Wed, 11 May 2011 08:04:58 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mailout-de.gmx.net (mailout-de.gmx.net [213.165.64.22]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with SMTP id 8FEBCE076F for ; Wed, 11 May 2011 08:04:56 -0700 (PDT) Received: (qmail invoked by alias); 11 May 2011 15:04:55 -0000 Received: from mail.greenbytes.de (EHLO [192.168.1.142]) [217.91.35.233] by mail.gmx.net (mp052) with SMTP; 11 May 2011 17:04:55 +0200 X-Authenticated: #1915285 X-Provags-ID: V01U2FsdGVkX1+hk2x4oh+h0/HR4Nqu9HjhSZx+s/EurANThwSr1k fjkd9m4y4RvdaS Message-ID: <4DCAA592.9020401@gmx.de> Date: Wed, 11 May 2011 17:04:51 +0200 From: Julian Reschke User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 6.1; en-US; rv:1.9.2.17) Gecko/20110414 Lightning/1.0b2 Thunderbird/3.1.10 MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Dan Wing References: <038501cc0785$6ca37c00$45ea7400$@huawei.com> <4DC95190.5060906@orange-ftgroup.com> <4DC9547A.2090007@gmx.de> <4DC95B50.9070006@orange-ftgroup.com> <4DC9688B.1010301@gmx.de> <002401cc0f77$321d2f00$96578d00$@com> <4DCA2C30.4070905@gmx.de> <01d301cc0fe5$7e898190$7b9c84b0$@com> <4DCA9B98.3080707@gmx.de> <020b01cc0feb$624063e0$26c12ba0$@com> In-Reply-To: <020b01cc0feb$624063e0$26c12ba0$@com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Y-GMX-Trusted: 0 Cc: xml2rfc@ietf.org Subject: Re: [xml2rfc] Keeping some authors off the front page ? X-BeenThere: xml2rfc@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.12 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 11 May 2011 15:04:58 -0000 On 11.05.2011 16:54, Dan Wing wrote: >> -----Original Message----- >> From: Julian Reschke [mailto:julian.reschke@gmx.de] >> Sent: Wednesday, May 11, 2011 7:22 AM >> To: Dan Wing >> Cc: 'Nico Williams'; xml2rfc@ietf.org >> Subject: Re: [xml2rfc] Keeping some authors off the front page ? >> >> On 11.05.2011 16:12, Dan Wing wrote: >>>> -----Original Message----- >>>> From: Julian Reschke [mailto:julian.reschke@gmx.de] >>>> Sent: Tuesday, May 10, 2011 11:27 PM >>>> To: Dan Wing >>>> Cc: 'Nico Williams'; xml2rfc@ietf.org >>>> Subject: Re: [xml2rfc] Keeping some authors off the front page ? >>>> >>>> On 11.05.2011 03:03, Dan Wing wrote: >>>>> ... >>>>>> Like that? >>>>>> ? >>>>> >>>>> That didn't work out so well -- RFC2046 has no Section 8, but has >>>>> two occurrences of Section 9. >>>>> ... >>>> >>>> Where? What? Me confused :-) >>> >>> # grep "^[0-9]\." rfc2046.txt >>> (snip) >>> 6. Experimental Media Type Values >>> 7. Summary >>> 9. Security Considerations >>> 9. Authors' Addresses >>> >>> -d >> >> Oh. That's a bizarre bug in the published RFC. I don't think we need >> tool support to generate something like that, no? > > My point is that proper tool support would avoid similar bugs > in published documents. Agreed, but it doesn't seem to have anything to do with the rfc2629.xslt example I was asking for feedback on. :-) From ahagens@amsl.com Tue May 17 14:55:56 2011 Return-Path: X-Original-To: xml2rfc@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: xml2rfc@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id DE4DFE068E for ; Tue, 17 May 2011 14:55:56 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -6.599 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-6.599 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-2.599, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-4] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.30]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id AYXL6D8S97gy for ; Tue, 17 May 2011 14:55:56 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail.amsl.com (mail.amsl.com [64.170.98.20]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 101CFE0674 for ; Tue, 17 May 2011 14:55:56 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by c1a.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0F34FE08C8 for ; Tue, 17 May 2011 14:55:56 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com Received: from c1a.amsl.com ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (c1a.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id BDkeEL67gKPd for ; Tue, 17 May 2011 14:55:55 -0700 (PDT) Received: from rfc2.home (pool-72-66-107-92.washdc.fios.verizon.net [72.66.107.92]) by c1a.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id C1021E08A7 for ; Tue, 17 May 2011 14:55:55 -0700 (PDT) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v1084) From: Alice Hagens In-Reply-To: <4DC95190.5060906@orange-ftgroup.com> Date: Tue, 17 May 2011 17:55:55 -0400 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Message-Id: <08C472AB-FF0C-4291-8F38-C95D029CBFFE@amsl.com> References: <038501cc0785$6ca37c00$45ea7400$@huawei.com> <4DC95190.5060906@orange-ftgroup.com> To: xml2rfc@ietf.org X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.1084) Subject: Re: [xml2rfc] Keeping some authors off the front page ? X-BeenThere: xml2rfc@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.12 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 17 May 2011 21:55:57 -0000 On May 10, 2011, at 11:35 AM, Thomas Morin wrote: > Another path which I think might be more reasonable would be to design = the toolchain independently of any attempt at a consensus on what these = roles would be, and let this interpretation/policy/process stuff happen = independently of the toolchain. We agree that the tool should be flexible -- allow authors to create = output as desired. For RFCs, the guidance at = http://www.rfc-editor.org/policy.html#policy.authlist will remain in = place, until a change is determined by a new RFC Series Editor. Thanks, Alice for the RFC Production Center From gwz@net-zen.net Tue May 17 21:07:31 2011 Return-Path: X-Original-To: xml2rfc@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: xml2rfc@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6B1E5E0713 for ; Tue, 17 May 2011 21:07:31 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -102.599 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-102.599 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-2.599, USER_IN_WHITELIST=-100] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.30]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id XiG4ZPhWEyH7 for ; Tue, 17 May 2011 21:07:30 -0700 (PDT) Received: from smtpauth14.prod.mesa1.secureserver.net (smtpauth14.prod.mesa1.secureserver.net [64.202.165.39]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with SMTP id 6A36FE0701 for ; Tue, 17 May 2011 21:07:30 -0700 (PDT) Received: (qmail 2675 invoked from network); 18 May 2011 04:07:29 -0000 Received: from unknown (124.120.203.20) by smtpauth14.prod.mesa1.secureserver.net (64.202.165.39) with ESMTP; 18 May 2011 04:07:28 -0000 Message-ID: <4DD345FC.8010104@net-zen.net> Date: Wed, 18 May 2011 11:07:24 +0700 From: Glen Zorn Organization: Network Zen User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 6.1; en-US; rv:1.9.2.17) Gecko/20110414 Thunderbird/3.1.10 MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Alice Hagens References: <038501cc0785$6ca37c00$45ea7400$@huawei.com> <4DC95190.5060906@orange-ftgroup.com> <08C472AB-FF0C-4291-8F38-C95D029CBFFE@amsl.com> In-Reply-To: <08C472AB-FF0C-4291-8F38-C95D029CBFFE@amsl.com> X-Enigmail-Version: 1.1.1 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="------------080306020105080401040707" Cc: xml2rfc@ietf.org Subject: Re: [xml2rfc] Keeping some authors off the front page ? X-BeenThere: xml2rfc@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.12 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 18 May 2011 04:07:31 -0000 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --------------080306020105080401040707 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit On 5/18/2011 4:55 AM, Alice Hagens wrote: > On May 10, 2011, at 11:35 AM, Thomas Morin wrote: >> Another path which I think might be more reasonable would be to design the toolchain independently of any attempt at a consensus on what these roles would be, and let this interpretation/policy/process stuff happen independently of the toolchain. > > We agree that the tool should be flexible -- allow authors to create output as desired. For RFCs, the guidance at http://www.rfc-editor.org/policy.html#policy.authlist will remain in place, until a change is determined by a new RFC Series Editor. I agree. The guidelines are just that, not commandments. > Thanks, > Alice > for the RFC Production Center > > _______________________________________________ > xml2rfc mailing list > xml2rfc@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/xml2rfc > > --------------080306020105080401040707 Content-Type: text/x-vcard; charset=utf-8; name="gwz.vcf" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="gwz.vcf" begin:vcard fn:Glen Zorn n:Zorn;Glen org:Network Zen adr:;;;Seattle;WA;;USA email;internet:gwz@net-zen.net tel;cell:+66 87 040 4617 note:PGP Key Fingerprint: DAD3 F5D3 ACE6 4195 9C5C 2EE1 6E17 B5F6 5953 B45F version:2.1 end:vcard --------------080306020105080401040707-- From julian.reschke@gmx.de Wed May 18 00:16:22 2011 Return-Path: X-Original-To: xml2rfc@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: xml2rfc@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7D839E06E5 for ; Wed, 18 May 2011 00:16:22 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -103.17 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-103.17 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=-0.571, BAYES_00=-2.599, USER_IN_WHITELIST=-100] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.30]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id kHW5zjzxybTF for ; Wed, 18 May 2011 00:16:20 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mailout-de.gmx.net (mailout-de.gmx.net [213.165.64.22]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with SMTP id AC672E06B9 for ; Wed, 18 May 2011 00:16:19 -0700 (PDT) Received: (qmail invoked by alias); 18 May 2011 07:16:18 -0000 Received: from p508F9B3C.dip.t-dialin.net (EHLO [192.168.178.36]) [80.143.155.60] by mail.gmx.net (mp038) with SMTP; 18 May 2011 09:16:18 +0200 X-Authenticated: #1915285 X-Provags-ID: V01U2FsdGVkX1+mVzAOiWimv/MLIuXaY8vSXJlreCID+Pxf+HNLFz 0zZUZnp6d1PoHd Message-ID: <4DD37241.1000301@gmx.de> Date: Wed, 18 May 2011 09:16:17 +0200 From: Julian Reschke User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 6.1; en-US; rv:1.9.2.17) Gecko/20110414 Lightning/1.0b2 Thunderbird/3.1.10 MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Alice Hagens References: <038501cc0785$6ca37c00$45ea7400$@huawei.com> <4DC95190.5060906@orange-ftgroup.com> <08C472AB-FF0C-4291-8F38-C95D029CBFFE@amsl.com> In-Reply-To: <08C472AB-FF0C-4291-8F38-C95D029CBFFE@amsl.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Y-GMX-Trusted: 0 Cc: xml2rfc@ietf.org Subject: Re: [xml2rfc] Keeping some authors off the front page ? X-BeenThere: xml2rfc@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.12 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 18 May 2011 07:16:22 -0000 On 2011-05-17 23:55, Alice Hagens wrote: > On May 10, 2011, at 11:35 AM, Thomas Morin wrote: >> Another path which I think might be more reasonable would be to design the toolchain independently of any attempt at a consensus on what these roles would be, and let this interpretation/policy/process stuff happen independently of the toolchain. > > We agree that the tool should be flexible -- allow authors to create output as desired. For RFCs, the guidance at http://www.rfc-editor.org/policy.html#policy.authlist will remain in place, until a change is determined by a new RFC Series Editor. > ... Note that this policy does not allow having a different set of people on the front page and in the back section. It *does* allow an additional "Contributors" section. Best regards, Julian From nico@cryptonector.com Wed May 18 00:34:31 2011 Return-Path: X-Original-To: xml2rfc@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: xml2rfc@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 656E8E0694 for ; Wed, 18 May 2011 00:34:31 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.283 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.283 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=-0.306, BAYES_00=-2.599, FM_FORGED_GMAIL=0.622] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.30]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id hSg2rPMDpTs2 for ; Wed, 18 May 2011 00:34:30 -0700 (PDT) Received: from homiemail-a28.g.dreamhost.com (caiajhbdcaib.dreamhost.com [208.97.132.81]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 952D1E06A5 for ; Wed, 18 May 2011 00:34:30 -0700 (PDT) Received: from homiemail-a28.g.dreamhost.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by homiemail-a28.g.dreamhost.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 12A731B4059 for ; Wed, 18 May 2011 00:34:30 -0700 (PDT) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; c=nofws; d=cryptonector.com; h=mime-version :in-reply-to:references:date:message-id:subject:from:to:cc: content-type; q=dns; s=cryptonector.com; b=uv/B3TA0Aak4OBlh6CvzI WWNqJrMlVogobMcq7fnA55EFCjRVETlZaAxb3zSsVUB9WSSx34JNQydo4gO7IH87 I9AYkp26q0izUtst5buP+IS/sRGsIha+6kpQ9jdMoPLkz0BkURg2uEwsoOAnzYQn rYnuEnpSl2Wckbwrql+B18= DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha1; c=relaxed; d=cryptonector.com; h= mime-version:in-reply-to:references:date:message-id:subject:from :to:cc:content-type; s=cryptonector.com; bh=68InMXkTxth9OJ9yDbxH EbV4PlA=; b=kvmueB/L9XaEHLN3VIWOZ3Sirsw0CtEpDcIpO11JMMTiUtjvpp9y lCdpnMCJt09e5XSeSIm0LZLOJAwbMvtLIbG02/dp6gPeLKYqqpqTubPOk6CyRBJ9 oX9Hnzh8fiju3NNdLSDi8YQfNeyP8O7Jet+gVR7cJEdWsecqalMkSkk= Received: from mail-vw0-f44.google.com (mail-vw0-f44.google.com [209.85.212.44]) (using TLSv1 with cipher RC4-SHA (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) (Authenticated sender: nico@cryptonector.com) by homiemail-a28.g.dreamhost.com (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id DA6461B4009 for ; Wed, 18 May 2011 00:34:29 -0700 (PDT) Received: by vws12 with SMTP id 12so1086514vws.31 for ; Wed, 18 May 2011 00:34:28 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 Received: by 10.52.94.170 with SMTP id dd10mr2242757vdb.159.1305704068882; Wed, 18 May 2011 00:34:28 -0700 (PDT) Received: by 10.52.110.228 with HTTP; Wed, 18 May 2011 00:34:28 -0700 (PDT) In-Reply-To: <4DD37241.1000301@gmx.de> References: <038501cc0785$6ca37c00$45ea7400$@huawei.com> <4DC95190.5060906@orange-ftgroup.com> <08C472AB-FF0C-4291-8F38-C95D029CBFFE@amsl.com> <4DD37241.1000301@gmx.de> Date: Wed, 18 May 2011 02:34:28 -0500 Message-ID: From: Nico Williams To: Julian Reschke Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 Cc: xml2rfc@ietf.org Subject: Re: [xml2rfc] Keeping some authors off the front page ? X-BeenThere: xml2rfc@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.12 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 18 May 2011 07:34:31 -0000 On Wed, May 18, 2011 at 2:16 AM, Julian Reschke wrote: > On 2011-05-17 23:55, Alice Hagens wrote: >> We agree that the tool should be flexible -- allow authors to create >> output as desired. For RFCs, the guidance at >> http://www.rfc-editor.org/policy.html#policy.authlist will remain in place, >> until a change is determined by a new RFC Series Editor. >> ... > > Note that this policy does not allow having a different set of people on the > front page and in the back section. It *does* allow an additional > "Contributors" section. I don't see where it requires that the set of authors on the front page be the same as in the Authors section. The second statement, however, is true, but it does not shed light on the issue at hand. The policy says only this about what must be in the Authors section: " o The Author's Address section at the end of the RFC must include the authors listed in the front page header. The purpose of this section is to (1) unambiguously define author/contributor identity (e.g., the John Smith who works for FooBar Systems) and to (2) provide contact information for future readers who have questions or comments. At the discretion of the author(s), contact addresses may also be included in the Contributors section for those contributors whose knowledge makes them useful future contacts for information about the RFC. " "The Author's Address section at the end of the RFC must include the authors listed in the front page header" does not imply that no authors may be listed in the Authors section that aren't also on the front page. At best you could say that the policy strongly hints that authors not on the front page should be listed in the Contributors section, but it doesn't _actually_ say that. There's a lot of "may"s (8), one "should", and one "must". As far as the tools go, this should mean that the tools should enforce only the one "must" (the should is not tool enforceable). As far as what actually happens, that's up to the RFC-Editor and a document's authors. Nico -- From thomas.morin@orange-ftgroup.com Wed May 18 00:35:43 2011 Return-Path: X-Original-To: xml2rfc@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: xml2rfc@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 21862E06BE for ; Wed, 18 May 2011 00:35:43 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -101.949 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-101.949 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.300, BAYES_00=-2.599, HELO_EQ_FR=0.35, USER_IN_WHITELIST=-100] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.30]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id WBm9r8w-d3Ba for ; Wed, 18 May 2011 00:35:40 -0700 (PDT) Received: from r-mail1.rd.francetelecom.com (r-mail1.rd.francetelecom.com [217.108.152.41]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 57D22E0694 for ; Wed, 18 May 2011 00:35:39 -0700 (PDT) Received: from r-mail1.rd.francetelecom.com (localhost.localdomain [127.0.0.1]) by localhost (Postfix) with SMTP id 9163A6D8006 for ; Wed, 18 May 2011 09:36:53 +0200 (CEST) Received: from ftrdsmtp2.rd.francetelecom.fr (unknown [10.192.128.47]) by r-mail1.rd.francetelecom.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 896AA6D8004 for ; Wed, 18 May 2011 09:36:53 +0200 (CEST) Received: from ftrdmel10.rd.francetelecom.fr ([10.192.128.44]) by ftrdsmtp2.rd.francetelecom.fr with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.4675); Wed, 18 May 2011 09:35:38 +0200 Received: from [10.193.71.121] ([10.193.71.121]) by ftrdmel10.rd.francetelecom.fr with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.4675); Wed, 18 May 2011 09:35:37 +0200 Message-ID: <4DD376CE.20203@orange-ftgroup.com> Date: Wed, 18 May 2011 09:35:42 +0200 From: Thomas Morin Organization: France Telecom Orange User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; U; ; ; ) Gecko/2010 Thunderbird/3.1.x MIME-Version: 1.0 To: xml2rfc@ietf.org References: <038501cc0785$6ca37c00$45ea7400$@huawei.com> <4DC95190.5060906@orange-ftgroup.com> <08C472AB-FF0C-4291-8F38-C95D029CBFFE@amsl.com> <4DD37241.1000301@gmx.de> In-Reply-To: <4DD37241.1000301@gmx.de> X-TagToolbar-Keys: D20110518093542785 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-OriginalArrivalTime: 18 May 2011 07:35:37.0699 (UTC) FILETIME=[2E565330:01CC152E] Subject: Re: [xml2rfc] Keeping some authors off the front page ? X-BeenThere: xml2rfc@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.12 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 18 May 2011 07:35:43 -0000 Hi Julian, Julian Reschke: > Alice Hagens: >> Thomas Morin: >>> Another path which I think might be more reasonable would be to >>> design the toolchain independently of any attempt at a consensus on >>> what these roles would be, and let this >>> interpretation/policy/process stuff happen independently of the >>> toolchain. >> >> We agree that the tool should be flexible -- allow authors to create >> output as desired. For RFCs, the guidance at >> http://www.rfc-editor.org/policy.html#policy.authlist will remain in >> place, until a change is determined by a new RFC Series Editor. >> ... > > Note that this policy does not allow having a different set of people > on the front page and in the back section. [...] What I read is "The Author's Address section at the end of the RFC must *include* the authors listed in the front page header." (emphasis mine), which does not preclude having more authors in the "Authors' Addresses" section, does it ? This interpretation seems to me as corresponding to what we sometimes see happen (e.g. cases where only editors are on front page, but every author in the "Authors' Addresses" section). -Thomas From julian.reschke@gmx.de Wed May 18 00:44:55 2011 Return-Path: X-Original-To: xml2rfc@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: xml2rfc@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id E76B3E069E for ; Wed, 18 May 2011 00:44:55 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -103.099 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-103.099 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=-0.500, BAYES_00=-2.599, USER_IN_WHITELIST=-100] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.30]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id niblUYUZxWco for ; Wed, 18 May 2011 00:44:55 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mailout-de.gmx.net (mailout-de.gmx.net [213.165.64.23]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with SMTP id EB659E0694 for ; Wed, 18 May 2011 00:44:54 -0700 (PDT) Received: (qmail invoked by alias); 18 May 2011 07:44:53 -0000 Received: from p508F9B3C.dip.t-dialin.net (EHLO [192.168.178.36]) [80.143.155.60] by mail.gmx.net (mp009) with SMTP; 18 May 2011 09:44:53 +0200 X-Authenticated: #1915285 X-Provags-ID: V01U2FsdGVkX1/9mT1GGJn9if2NhDMcfku0XP3aFxn45LAhkQb9pG u25dwcEHYEAAnm Message-ID: <4DD378F3.60001@gmx.de> Date: Wed, 18 May 2011 09:44:51 +0200 From: Julian Reschke User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 6.1; en-US; rv:1.9.2.17) Gecko/20110414 Lightning/1.0b2 Thunderbird/3.1.10 MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Nico Williams References: <038501cc0785$6ca37c00$45ea7400$@huawei.com> <4DC95190.5060906@orange-ftgroup.com> <08C472AB-FF0C-4291-8F38-C95D029CBFFE@amsl.com> <4DD37241.1000301@gmx.de> In-Reply-To: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Y-GMX-Trusted: 0 Cc: xml2rfc@ietf.org Subject: Re: [xml2rfc] Keeping some authors off the front page ? X-BeenThere: xml2rfc@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.12 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 18 May 2011 07:44:56 -0000 On 2011-05-18 09:34, Nico Williams wrote: > ... > "The Author's Address section at the end of the RFC must include the > authors listed in the front page header" does not imply that no > authors may be listed in the Authors section that aren't also on the > front page. At best you could say that the policy strongly hints that > authors not on the front page should be listed in the Contributors > section, but it doesn't _actually_ say that. > > There's a lot of "may"s (8), one "should", and one "must". As far as > the tools go, this should mean that the tools should enforce only the > one "must" (the should is not tool enforceable). As far as what > actually happens, that's up to the RFC-Editor and a document's > authors. > ... I agree that it's not clear as I thought. My understanding is that there are no multiple classes of authors; and that if the spec needs to mention more people, they should go into the "Acknowledgements" section. Alice, can this be clarified at this point? Alternatively, could you state how *you* read it, and whether the production center would accept texts where the front page only has a subset of the names mentioned in the back section? Best regards, Julian From gwz@net-zen.net Wed May 18 00:50:18 2011 Return-Path: X-Original-To: xml2rfc@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: xml2rfc@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 95D1EE06A5 for ; Wed, 18 May 2011 00:50:18 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -102.599 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-102.599 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.000, BAYES_00=-2.599, USER_IN_WHITELIST=-100] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.30]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id hmmbpfh2qVB3 for ; Wed, 18 May 2011 00:50:17 -0700 (PDT) Received: from p3plsmtpa01-09.prod.phx3.secureserver.net (p3plsmtpa01-09.prod.phx3.secureserver.net [72.167.82.89]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with SMTP id B65B2E069E for ; Wed, 18 May 2011 00:50:17 -0700 (PDT) Received: (qmail 7924 invoked from network); 18 May 2011 07:50:17 -0000 Received: from unknown (124.120.203.20) by p3plsmtpa01-09.prod.phx3.secureserver.net (72.167.82.89) with ESMTP; 18 May 2011 07:50:16 -0000 Message-ID: <4DD37A11.9010304@net-zen.net> Date: Wed, 18 May 2011 14:49:37 +0700 From: Glen Zorn Organization: Network Zen User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 6.1; en-US; rv:1.9.2.17) Gecko/20110414 Thunderbird/3.1.10 MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Julian Reschke References: <038501cc0785$6ca37c00$45ea7400$@huawei.com> <4DC95190.5060906@orange-ftgroup.com> <08C472AB-FF0C-4291-8F38-C95D029CBFFE@amsl.com> <4DD37241.1000301@gmx.de> In-Reply-To: <4DD37241.1000301@gmx.de> X-Enigmail-Version: 1.1.1 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="------------010602030303000807050705" Cc: xml2rfc@ietf.org Subject: Re: [xml2rfc] Keeping some authors off the front page ? X-BeenThere: xml2rfc@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.12 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 18 May 2011 07:50:18 -0000 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --------------010602030303000807050705 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit On 5/18/2011 2:16 PM, Julian Reschke wrote: > On 2011-05-17 23:55, Alice Hagens wrote: >> On May 10, 2011, at 11:35 AM, Thomas Morin wrote: >>> Another path which I think might be more reasonable would be to >>> design the toolchain independently of any attempt at a consensus on >>> what these roles would be, and let this interpretation/policy/process >>> stuff happen independently of the toolchain. >> >> We agree that the tool should be flexible -- allow authors to create >> output as desired. For RFCs, the guidance at >> http://www.rfc-editor.org/policy.html#policy.authlist will remain in >> place, until a change is determined by a new RFC Series Editor. >> ... > > Note that this policy does not allow having a different set of people on > the front page and in the back section. It *does* allow an additional > "Contributors" section. I think that that is fine. I also think that it important to remember what the genesis of this policy was: IIRC, the reason for its enactment was the carry-over of a tradition in the 3GPP* community to add names to a document just to show company support for a proposal, which might end up showing half a dozen people as "authors" of a draft, whether they had done any real work on it or not. Of course, that's not how things are done in the IETF and it seems that that lesson has been learned. I think it unfortunate that the approach to dealing with the issue was through policy rather than education but that's life. In any case, it might be nice to mention this in a tutorial (and maybe even establish some _guidelines_ for authorship of a draft) in order to avoid a recurrence of this problem in the future. ... --------------010602030303000807050705 Content-Type: text/x-vcard; charset=utf-8; name="gwz.vcf" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="gwz.vcf" begin:vcard fn:Glen Zorn n:Zorn;Glen org:Network Zen adr:;;;Seattle;WA;;USA email;internet:gwz@net-zen.net tel;cell:+66 87 040 4617 note:PGP Key Fingerprint: DAD3 F5D3 ACE6 4195 9C5C 2EE1 6E17 B5F6 5953 B45F version:2.1 end:vcard --------------010602030303000807050705-- From nico@cryptonector.com Wed May 18 00:53:59 2011 Return-Path: X-Original-To: xml2rfc@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: xml2rfc@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id AA684E07A8 for ; Wed, 18 May 2011 00:53:59 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.274 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.274 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=-0.297, BAYES_00=-2.599, FM_FORGED_GMAIL=0.622] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.30]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 7j1Wdm8jvgFo for ; Wed, 18 May 2011 00:53:59 -0700 (PDT) Received: from homiemail-a16.g.dreamhost.com (caiajhbdcaid.dreamhost.com [208.97.132.83]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 04B41E0735 for ; Wed, 18 May 2011 00:53:59 -0700 (PDT) Received: from homiemail-a16.g.dreamhost.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by homiemail-a16.g.dreamhost.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id C7E40508071 for ; Wed, 18 May 2011 00:53:58 -0700 (PDT) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; c=nofws; d=cryptonector.com; h=mime-version :in-reply-to:references:date:message-id:subject:from:to:cc: content-type; q=dns; s=cryptonector.com; b=Is+WjP1b8fZmjpB+yNseO yVXvKFblcWp6U7lysLwFFeLltWMQ5pA1Ho3zCgLkXI2zgd/KBnyXoMzMqD1RDZSd HWReW6n4RCNlQiZLc+XLDNYNJpX8BBH/P5D99I/5wEWqhBQz5FPuHaJU7CpuzCAg yD0RGkEKs1GehOmNToIDu4= DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha1; c=relaxed; d=cryptonector.com; h= mime-version:in-reply-to:references:date:message-id:subject:from :to:cc:content-type; s=cryptonector.com; bh=EyymSIG4YQ4LtVl/99x4 pCky9JM=; b=LxuDvBuPK//TA2yY4cPnlR7BpEbu7egxzBX5FO8nzNvOG1NhkTLH kkMNameXhL9Lyin68THw7EhP6yq2lF8nWCtjp9ILA0mNnthxQoNZR8BLp0SGgbEl YFsFRoPi6SC+r4j0Snj6WuHzI3LZJ8iMlPnAl+Scg/khX5qMuZ24DFk= Received: from mail-vw0-f44.google.com (mail-vw0-f44.google.com [209.85.212.44]) (using TLSv1 with cipher RC4-SHA (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) (Authenticated sender: nico@cryptonector.com) by homiemail-a16.g.dreamhost.com (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 99D74508063 for ; Wed, 18 May 2011 00:53:58 -0700 (PDT) Received: by vws12 with SMTP id 12so1096008vws.31 for ; Wed, 18 May 2011 00:53:58 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 Received: by 10.52.94.170 with SMTP id dd10mr2266236vdb.159.1305705238059; Wed, 18 May 2011 00:53:58 -0700 (PDT) Received: by 10.52.110.228 with HTTP; Wed, 18 May 2011 00:53:58 -0700 (PDT) In-Reply-To: <4DD378F3.60001@gmx.de> References: <038501cc0785$6ca37c00$45ea7400$@huawei.com> <4DC95190.5060906@orange-ftgroup.com> <08C472AB-FF0C-4291-8F38-C95D029CBFFE@amsl.com> <4DD37241.1000301@gmx.de> <4DD378F3.60001@gmx.de> Date: Wed, 18 May 2011 02:53:58 -0500 Message-ID: From: Nico Williams To: Julian Reschke Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 Cc: xml2rfc@ietf.org Subject: Re: [xml2rfc] Keeping some authors off the front page ? X-BeenThere: xml2rfc@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.12 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 18 May 2011 07:53:59 -0000 On Wed, May 18, 2011 at 2:44 AM, Julian Reschke wrote: > I agree that it's not clear as I thought. > > My understanding is that there are no multiple classes of authors; and that > if the spec needs to mention more people, they should go into the > "Acknowledgements" section. Not really. The policy is somewhat ambiguous, and probably so on purpose. Nowhere does it say what you say you think it does. As far as the tools go, the only rule that can be enforced by xml2rfc is that authors on the front page MUST be listed in the Author'sAddresses section. That's it. The rest is guidance that xml2rfc has no business trying to enforce (it's all "may"s anyways). Well, you could also warn when more than five authors appear on the front page, but that's not necessary. > Alice, can this be clarified at this point? Alternatively, could you state > how *you* read it, and whether the production center would accept texts > where the front page only has a subset of the names mentioned in the back > section? I don't object to Alice clarifying, but if we only take the traditional normative vs. informative language approach to analyzing this text we'll see that there's only one thing for the tools to enforce, and that's listed above. Nico -- From julian.reschke@gmx.de Wed May 18 01:27:55 2011 Return-Path: X-Original-To: xml2rfc@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: xml2rfc@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2CB77E07D7 for ; Wed, 18 May 2011 01:27:55 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -103.399 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-103.399 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=-0.800, BAYES_00=-2.599, USER_IN_WHITELIST=-100] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.30]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 8pdccZSKNFec for ; Wed, 18 May 2011 01:27:54 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mailout-de.gmx.net (mailout-de.gmx.net [213.165.64.22]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with SMTP id CE4E2E07A8 for ; Wed, 18 May 2011 01:27:53 -0700 (PDT) Received: (qmail invoked by alias); 18 May 2011 08:27:52 -0000 Received: from p508F9B3C.dip.t-dialin.net (EHLO [192.168.178.36]) [80.143.155.60] by mail.gmx.net (mp048) with SMTP; 18 May 2011 10:27:52 +0200 X-Authenticated: #1915285 X-Provags-ID: V01U2FsdGVkX1+x/L1Sh6yx/ORKhxh1HBlf5Fpkos4BMbliMBuZBA EzVbREs0Ic5TP9 Message-ID: <4DD38306.20204@gmx.de> Date: Wed, 18 May 2011 10:27:50 +0200 From: Julian Reschke User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 6.1; en-US; rv:1.9.2.17) Gecko/20110414 Lightning/1.0b2 Thunderbird/3.1.10 MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Nico Williams References: <038501cc0785$6ca37c00$45ea7400$@huawei.com> <4DC95190.5060906@orange-ftgroup.com> <08C472AB-FF0C-4291-8F38-C95D029CBFFE@amsl.com> <4DD37241.1000301@gmx.de> <4DD378F3.60001@gmx.de> In-Reply-To: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Y-GMX-Trusted: 0 Cc: xml2rfc@ietf.org Subject: Re: [xml2rfc] Keeping some authors off the front page ? X-BeenThere: xml2rfc@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.12 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 18 May 2011 08:27:55 -0000 On 2011-05-18 09:53, Nico Williams wrote: > ... > I don't object to Alice clarifying, but if we only take the > traditional normative vs. informative language approach to analyzing > this text we'll see that there's only one thing for the tools to > enforce, and that's listed above. > ... Well, I disagree, that's why I'm asking for clarification. In particular, I'm -1 on any changes to the xml2rfc DTD until we have a *clear* statement from the RFC Editor about what it means. Best regards, Julian From thomas.morin@orange-ftgroup.com Wed May 18 02:04:03 2011 Return-Path: X-Original-To: xml2rfc@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: xml2rfc@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id B0069E0714 for ; Wed, 18 May 2011 02:04:03 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -102.099 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-102.099 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.150, BAYES_00=-2.599, HELO_EQ_FR=0.35, USER_IN_WHITELIST=-100] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.30]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id QMb8I9+njRhZ for ; Wed, 18 May 2011 02:04:03 -0700 (PDT) Received: from r-mail2.rd.francetelecom.com (r-mail2.rd.francetelecom.com [217.108.152.42]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 33264E069E for ; Wed, 18 May 2011 02:04:02 -0700 (PDT) Received: from r-mail2.rd.francetelecom.com (localhost.localdomain [127.0.0.1]) by localhost (Postfix) with SMTP id D79DDFC400D for ; Wed, 18 May 2011 11:04:00 +0200 (CEST) Received: from ftrdsmtp2.rd.francetelecom.fr (unknown [10.192.128.47]) by r-mail2.rd.francetelecom.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id CF877FC4007 for ; Wed, 18 May 2011 11:04:00 +0200 (CEST) Received: from ftrdmel10.rd.francetelecom.fr ([10.192.128.44]) by ftrdsmtp2.rd.francetelecom.fr with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.4675); Wed, 18 May 2011 11:04:00 +0200 Received: from [10.193.71.121] ([10.193.71.121]) by ftrdmel10.rd.francetelecom.fr with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.4675); Wed, 18 May 2011 11:03:59 +0200 Message-ID: <4DD38B84.10809@orange-ftgroup.com> Date: Wed, 18 May 2011 11:04:04 +0200 From: Thomas Morin Organization: France Telecom Orange User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; U; ; ; ) Gecko/2010 Thunderbird/3.1.x MIME-Version: 1.0 To: xml2rfc@ietf.org References: <038501cc0785$6ca37c00$45ea7400$@huawei.com> <4DC95190.5060906@orange-ftgroup.com> <08C472AB-FF0C-4291-8F38-C95D029CBFFE@amsl.com> <4DD37241.1000301@gmx.de> <4DD378F3.60001@gmx.de> <4DD38306.20204@gmx.de> In-Reply-To: <4DD38306.20204@gmx.de> X-TagToolbar-Keys: D20110518110404578 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-OriginalArrivalTime: 18 May 2011 09:03:59.0572 (UTC) FILETIME=[867FF140:01CC153A] Subject: Re: [xml2rfc] Keeping some authors off the front page ? X-BeenThere: xml2rfc@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.12 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 18 May 2011 09:04:03 -0000 Hi Julian, Julian Reschke : > On 2011-05-18 09:53, Nico Williams wrote: >> ... >> I don't object to Alice clarifying, but if we only take the >> traditional normative vs. informative language approach to analyzing >> this text we'll see that there's only one thing for the tools to >> enforce, and that's listed above. >> ... > > Well, I disagree, that's why I'm asking for clarification. > > In particular, I'm -1 on any changes to the xml2rfc DTD until we have > a *clear* statement from the RFC Editor about what it means. But the DTD defines a document format that's not meant to be used only for RFCs, doesn't it ? -Thomas From julian.reschke@gmx.de Wed May 18 02:14:09 2011 Return-Path: X-Original-To: xml2rfc@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: xml2rfc@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7C447E0714 for ; Wed, 18 May 2011 02:14:09 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -103.326 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-103.326 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=-0.727, BAYES_00=-2.599, USER_IN_WHITELIST=-100] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.30]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id F4G2zy-mMMkt for ; Wed, 18 May 2011 02:14:02 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mailout-de.gmx.net (mailout-de.gmx.net [213.165.64.23]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with SMTP id 0D9F8E0671 for ; Wed, 18 May 2011 02:14:01 -0700 (PDT) Received: (qmail invoked by alias); 18 May 2011 09:13:58 -0000 Received: from p508F9B3C.dip.t-dialin.net (EHLO [192.168.178.36]) [80.143.155.60] by mail.gmx.net (mp007) with SMTP; 18 May 2011 11:13:58 +0200 X-Authenticated: #1915285 X-Provags-ID: V01U2FsdGVkX18+f+EcLZg+S9vE+WmW1AsMCRT+B1NL1strVdHMm2 Cm3JlSiokUWC+U Message-ID: <4DD38DD4.6030905@gmx.de> Date: Wed, 18 May 2011 11:13:56 +0200 From: Julian Reschke User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 6.1; en-US; rv:1.9.2.17) Gecko/20110414 Lightning/1.0b2 Thunderbird/3.1.10 MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Thomas Morin References: <038501cc0785$6ca37c00$45ea7400$@huawei.com> <4DC95190.5060906@orange-ftgroup.com> <08C472AB-FF0C-4291-8F38-C95D029CBFFE@amsl.com> <4DD37241.1000301@gmx.de> <4DD378F3.60001@gmx.de> <4DD38306.20204@gmx.de> <4DD38B84.10809@orange-ftgroup.com> In-Reply-To: <4DD38B84.10809@orange-ftgroup.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Y-GMX-Trusted: 0 Cc: xml2rfc@ietf.org Subject: Re: [xml2rfc] Keeping some authors off the front page ? X-BeenThere: xml2rfc@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.12 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 18 May 2011 09:14:09 -0000 On 2011-05-18 11:04, Thomas Morin wrote: > Hi Julian, > > Julian Reschke : >> On 2011-05-18 09:53, Nico Williams wrote: >>> ... >>> I don't object to Alice clarifying, but if we only take the >>> traditional normative vs. informative language approach to analyzing >>> this text we'll see that there's only one thing for the tools to >>> enforce, and that's listed above. >>> ... >> >> Well, I disagree, that's why I'm asking for clarification. >> >> In particular, I'm -1 on any changes to the xml2rfc DTD until we have >> a *clear* statement from the RFC Editor about what it means. > > But the DTD defines a document format that's not meant to be used only > for RFCs, doesn't it ? No, it's also for IDs. But what's the point to put things into an Internet Draft when you can't have the same thing in the published spec? Best regards, Julian From elwynd@dial.pipex.com Fri May 20 23:37:21 2011 Return-Path: X-Original-To: xml2rfc@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: xml2rfc@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3A7CFE073A for ; Fri, 20 May 2011 23:37:21 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -100.949 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-100.949 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=1.650, BAYES_00=-2.599, USER_IN_WHITELIST=-100] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.30]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id d8GsQQwcZ4bx for ; Fri, 20 May 2011 23:37:20 -0700 (PDT) Received: from auth.a.painless.aaisp.net.uk (c.5.0.d.2.7.e.f.f.f.8.4.0.3.2.0.0.3.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.b.8.0.1.0.0.2.ip6.arpa [IPv6:2001:8b0:0:30:230:48ff:fe72:d05c]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6E804E0690 for ; Fri, 20 May 2011 23:37:20 -0700 (PDT) Received: from 250.254.187.81.in-addr.arpa ([81.187.254.250]) by a.painless.aaisp.net.uk with esmtpsa (TLSv1:AES256-SHA:256) (Exim 4.72) (envelope-from ) id 1QNfoL-0008Lv-MD for xml2rfc@ietf.org; Sat, 21 May 2011 07:37:17 +0100 From: Elwyn Davies To: xml2rfc mailing list Content-Type: text/plain Date: Sat, 21 May 2011 07:40:52 +0100 Message-Id: <1305960052.22973.1601.camel@mightyatom.folly.org.uk> Mime-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Evolution 2.26.3 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: [xml2rfc] Nit in right justification algorithm X-BeenThere: xml2rfc@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.12 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sat, 21 May 2011 06:37:21 -0000 Hi. The author of a draft currently in AUTH48 has a very long organization name (Caltech is apparently touchy about being abbreviated) with the result that it splits over three lines in the header. The second/third line splits at a space, and the space is not discarded but remains at the right hand end of the line. This looks odd. Regards, Elwyn Example: xml2rfc source: Compressed Bundle Header Encoding (CBHE) Jet Propulsion Laboratory, California Institute of Technology text output: Internet Research Task Force (IRTF) S. Burleigh Request for Comments: 6260 Jet Propulsion Laboratory, Category: Experimental California Institute of ISSN: 2070-1721 Technology May 2011 Compressed Bundle Header Encoding (CBHE) From ahagens@amsl.com Tue May 24 14:52:42 2011 Return-Path: X-Original-To: xml2rfc@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: xml2rfc@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id D2D74E0791 for ; Tue, 24 May 2011 14:52:42 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -6.599 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-6.599 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-2.599, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-4] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.30]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 725i0DW7CiIm for ; Tue, 24 May 2011 14:52:42 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail.amsl.com (mail.amsl.com [64.170.98.20]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6FD54E073C for ; Tue, 24 May 2011 14:52:42 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by c1a.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6B07CE070F; Tue, 24 May 2011 14:52:42 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com Received: from c1a.amsl.com ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (c1a.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id AyZQ5MoTyAgS; Tue, 24 May 2011 14:52:42 -0700 (PDT) Received: from rfc2.home (pool-72-66-107-92.washdc.fios.verizon.net [72.66.107.92]) by c1a.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 13256E06D5; Tue, 24 May 2011 14:52:41 -0700 (PDT) From: Alice Hagens Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Date: Tue, 24 May 2011 17:52:40 -0400 Message-Id: To: xml2rfc@ietf.org Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v1084) X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.1084) Cc: RFC Editor Subject: Re: [xml2rfc] Keeping some authors off the front page ? X-BeenThere: xml2rfc@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.12 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 24 May 2011 21:52:42 -0000 Julian wrote: > Alice, can this be clarified at this point? Alternatively, could you = state how *you* read it, and whether the production center would accept = texts where the front page only has a subset of the names mentioned in = the back section? Per discussion with the Acting RSE, we recommend that documents have a = one-to-one mapping of names on the front page to names in the authors' = addresses; however, it not a MUST. In practice, we do not change = documents to have a one-to-one mapping. As mentioned, = http://www.rfc-editor.org/policy.html#policy.authlist will remain in = place until a change is determined by a new RFC Series Editor. Thomas correctly pointed out a case where some RFCs do not have a = one-to-one mapping: > (e.g. cases where only editors are on front page, but every author in = the "Authors' Addresses" section). To reiterate, we suggest that the tool be flexible -- allow authors to = create output as desired.=20 Thank you. Alice=20 for the RFC Production Center= From julian.reschke@gmx.de Wed May 25 00:10:27 2011 Return-Path: X-Original-To: xml2rfc@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: xml2rfc@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 81DB9E06BE for ; Wed, 25 May 2011 00:10:27 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -103.636 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-103.636 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=-1.037, BAYES_00=-2.599, USER_IN_WHITELIST=-100] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.30]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id evYRCz1xuTEu for ; Wed, 25 May 2011 00:10:27 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mailout-de.gmx.net (mailout-de.gmx.net [213.165.64.22]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with SMTP id 7FF1CE07BB for ; Wed, 25 May 2011 00:10:25 -0700 (PDT) Received: (qmail invoked by alias); 25 May 2011 07:10:20 -0000 Received: from p508FA34A.dip.t-dialin.net (EHLO [192.168.178.36]) [80.143.163.74] by mail.gmx.net (mp046) with SMTP; 25 May 2011 09:10:20 +0200 X-Authenticated: #1915285 X-Provags-ID: V01U2FsdGVkX1/MrToF69/MbUsTgyzF0MKDJgBofdCUFkm9XqfJSk vs3F3SqmntUc7n Message-ID: <4DDCAB52.8080103@gmx.de> Date: Wed, 25 May 2011 09:10:10 +0200 From: Julian Reschke User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 6.1; en-US; rv:1.9.2.17) Gecko/20110414 Lightning/1.0b2 Thunderbird/3.1.10 MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Alice Hagens References: In-Reply-To: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Y-GMX-Trusted: 0 Cc: xml2rfc@ietf.org, RFC Editor Subject: Re: [xml2rfc] Keeping some authors off the front page ? X-BeenThere: xml2rfc@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.12 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 25 May 2011 07:10:27 -0000 On 2011-05-24 23:52, Alice Hagens wrote: > Julian wrote: >> Alice, can this be clarified at this point? Alternatively, could you state how *you* read it, and whether the production center would accept texts where the front page only has a subset of the names mentioned in the back section? > > Per discussion with the Acting RSE, we recommend that documents have a one-to-one mapping of names on the front page to names in the authors' addresses; however, it not a MUST. In practice, we do not change documents to have a one-to-one mapping. As mentioned, http://www.rfc-editor.org/policy.html#policy.authlist will remain in place until a change is determined by a new RFC Series Editor. When this is the case, what's the set of authors added to the RFC database entry? > Thomas correctly pointed out a case where some RFCs do not have a one-to-one mapping: Which? >> (e.g. cases where only editors are on front page, but every author in the "Authors' Addresses" section). > > To reiterate, we suggest that the tool be flexible -- allow authors to create output as desired. > ... Best regards, Julian From julian.reschke@gmx.de Wed May 25 00:16:18 2011 Return-Path: X-Original-To: xml2rfc@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: xml2rfc@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4BB2F13000D for ; Wed, 25 May 2011 00:16:18 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -103.584 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-103.584 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=-0.985, BAYES_00=-2.599, USER_IN_WHITELIST=-100] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.30]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id jX0TxAAGRJvW for ; Wed, 25 May 2011 00:16:16 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mailout-de.gmx.net (mailout-de.gmx.net [213.165.64.23]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with SMTP id 590DCE069A for ; Wed, 25 May 2011 00:16:16 -0700 (PDT) Received: (qmail invoked by alias); 25 May 2011 07:16:14 -0000 Received: from p508FA34A.dip.t-dialin.net (EHLO [192.168.178.36]) [80.143.163.74] by mail.gmx.net (mp021) with SMTP; 25 May 2011 09:16:14 +0200 X-Authenticated: #1915285 X-Provags-ID: V01U2FsdGVkX1+rF75INdKrG68rXJ+342B4Jtz75AlcEFWaUIoqv4 /K9vC8JHDriCRg Message-ID: <4DDCACBC.6040708@gmx.de> Date: Wed, 25 May 2011 09:16:12 +0200 From: Julian Reschke User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 6.1; en-US; rv:1.9.2.17) Gecko/20110414 Lightning/1.0b2 Thunderbird/3.1.10 MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Elwyn Davies References: <1305960052.22973.1601.camel@mightyatom.folly.org.uk> In-Reply-To: <1305960052.22973.1601.camel@mightyatom.folly.org.uk> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Y-GMX-Trusted: 0 Cc: xml2rfc mailing list Subject: Re: [xml2rfc] Nit in right justification algorithm X-BeenThere: xml2rfc@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.12 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 25 May 2011 07:16:18 -0000 On 2011-05-21 08:40, Elwyn Davies wrote: > Hi. > > The author of a draft currently in AUTH48 has a very long organization > name (Caltech is apparently touchy about being abbreviated) with the > result that it splits over three lines in the header. The second/third > line splits at a space, and the space is not discarded but remains at > the right hand end of the line. This looks odd. > > Regards, > Elwyn > ... Could you enter a bug report at ? Best regards, Julian