From 6lowpan-bounces@ietf.org Wed Nov 02 20:18:18 2005 Received: from localhost.cnri.reston.va.us ([127.0.0.1] helo=megatron.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1EXTkA-0003YW-5z; Wed, 02 Nov 2005 20:18:18 -0500 Received: from odin.ietf.org ([132.151.1.176] helo=ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1EXTk8-0003Y3-KG for 6lowpan@megatron.ietf.org; Wed, 02 Nov 2005 20:18:16 -0500 Received: from grab.coslabs.com (grab.coslabs.com [199.233.92.34]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id UAA20290 for <6lowpan@lists.ietf.org>; Wed, 2 Nov 2005 20:17:53 -0500 (EST) Received: from dellx1.coslabs.com (dellx1.coslabs.com [199.233.92.20]) by grab.coslabs.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id jA31Hgs6014020 for <6lowpan@lists.ietf.org>; Wed, 2 Nov 2005 18:17:42 -0700 (MST) From: Geoff Mulligan To: 6lowpan <6lowpan@ietf.org> Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="=-I1QD6hTppne0Xo8JpgjU" Date: Wed, 02 Nov 2005 18:17:38 -0700 Message-Id: <1130980658.9336.54.camel@localhost.localdomain> Mime-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Evolution 2.2.1.1 Subject: [6lowpan] Agenda... X-BeenThere: 6lowpan@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: Working group discussion for IPv6 over LowPan networks <6lowpan.ietf.org> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 6lowpan-bounces@ietf.org Errors-To: 6lowpan-bounces@ietf.org --=-I1QD6hTppne0Xo8JpgjU Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Here is the current agenda... --=-I1QD6hTppne0Xo8JpgjU Content-Disposition: attachment; filename=6lowpan.txt Content-Type: text/plain; name=6lowpan.txt; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit IETF-64 6lowpan WG Agenda ============================= Time: Monday, November 07, 2005 1300-1500 Salon F Agenda bashing: 05 min Problem Statement: 15 min Format Document: 15 min Neighbor Discovery: 15 min On-Demand adhoc routing protocol for 6lowpan: 15 min Routing protocol comparison: 15 min 6lowpan Evaluation results: 15 min Security Considerations: 10 min Zigbee and Interoperability Considerations: 15 min Chair(s): Geoff Mulligan Carsten Bormann Internet Area Director(s): Mark Townsley Margaret Wasserman Internet Area Advisor: Margaret Wasserman Mailing Lists: General Discussion: 6lowpan@lists.ietf.org To Subscribe: 6lowpan-request@lists.ietf.org Archive: https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/6lowpan Description of Working Group: Background/Introduction: Note: Given that there is not much precedent for this type of activity at the IETF, the text that follows is of an introductory nature. Hence, its objective is to give a general idea of the application area and motivations for the work. In particular, this section is not to be construed as detailing work items for the working group. That is done in the following section entitled "Scope of the Working Group." Well-established fields such as control networks, and burgeoning ones such as "sensor" (or transducer) networks, are increasingly being based on wireless technologies. Most (but certainly not all) of these nodes are amongst the most constrained that have ever been networked wirelessly. Extreme low power (such that they will run potentially for years on batteries) and extreme low cost (total device cost in single digit dollars, and riding Moore's law to continuously reduce that price point) are seen as essential enablers towards their deployment in networks with the following characteristics: * Significantly more devices than current networks * Severely limited code and ram space (e.g., highly desirable to fit the required code--MAC, IP and anything else needed to execute the embedded application-- in, for example, 32K of flash memory, using 8-bit microprocessors) * Unobtrusive but very different user interface for configuration (e.g., using gestures or interactions involving the physical world) * Robustness and simplicity in routing or network fabric A chief component of these devices is wireless communication technology. In particular, the IEEE 802.15.4 standard is very promising for the lower (physical and link) layers. As for higher layer functions, there is considerable interest from non-IETF groups in using IP technology (the ZigBee alliance, for example, is currently studying what such a work item might entail). The working group is expected to coordinate and interact with such groups. The required work includes items in the following (incomplete) list: * IP adaptation/Packet Formats and interoperability * Addressing schemes and address management * Network management * Routing in dynamically adaptive topologies * Security, including set-up and maintenance * Application programming interface * Discovery (of devices, of services, etc) * Implementation considerations Whereas at least some of the above items are within the purview of the IETF, at this point it is not clear that all of them are. Accordingly, the 6LoWPAN working group will address a reduced, more focused set of objectives. Scope of 6lowpan: Produce "Problems Statement, Assumptions and Goals for IPv6 for LoWPANs" (draft-ietf-lowpan-goals-assumptions-xx.txt) to define the problem statement and goals of 6lowpan networks. Produce "Transmission of IPv6 Packets over IEEE 802.15.4 WPAN Networks" (draft-ietf-lowpan-ipv6-over-802.15.4-xx.txt) to define the basic packet formats and sub-IP adaptation layer for transmission of IPv6 packets over IEEE 802.15.4. This includes framing, adaptation, header compression and address generation. Furthermore, IEEE 802.15.4 devices are expected to be deployed in mesh topologies. As such, the working group may also work on an informational document to show how to apply an existing MANET protocol to LoWPANs (e.g., AODV, OLSR, DYMO, etc). The working group will reuse existing specifications whenever reasonable and possible. The working group will also serve as a venue for ongoing discussions on other topics related to the more complete list outlined above. Additional related milestones may be added in the future via a rechartering operation. Note: As may be obvious from its official name above, this particular working group will not work on IPv4 over IEEE 802.15.4 specifications. Given the limitations of the target devices, dual-stack deployments are not practical. Because of its higher potential for header compression, its support for the huge number of devices expected and of cleanly built-in features such as address autoconfiguration, IPv6 is the exclusive focus of the working group. Goals and Milestones: Mar 05 Working group last call on draft-ietf-lowpan-goals-assumptions-xx.txt Apr 05 Submit draft-ietf-lowpan-goals-assumptions-xx.txt to IESG for consideration of publication as Informational May 05 Working Group Last Call on draft-ietf-lowpan-ipv6-over-802.15.4-xx.txt Jul 05 Submit draft-ietf-lowpan-ipv6-over-802.15.4-xx.txt to IESG for consideration of publication as Proposed Standard --=-I1QD6hTppne0Xo8JpgjU Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline _______________________________________________ 6lowpan mailing list 6lowpan@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/6lowpan --=-I1QD6hTppne0Xo8JpgjU-- From 6lowpan-bounces@ietf.org Sun Nov 06 19:37:03 2005 Received: from localhost.cnri.reston.va.us ([127.0.0.1] helo=megatron.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1EYv0R-0002os-2u; Sun, 06 Nov 2005 19:37:03 -0500 Received: from odin.ietf.org ([132.151.1.176] helo=ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1EYv0P-0002om-AR for 6lowpan@megatron.ietf.org; Sun, 06 Nov 2005 19:37:01 -0500 Received: from ietf-mx.ietf.org (ietf-mx [132.151.6.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id TAA29893 for <6lowpan@ietf.org>; Sun, 6 Nov 2005 19:36:35 -0500 (EST) Received: from smtpout04-03.prod.mesa1.secureserver.net ([64.202.165.198]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with smtp (Exim 4.43) id 1EYvFr-0001Fz-Ic for 6lowpan@ietf.org; Sun, 06 Nov 2005 19:53:03 -0500 Received: (qmail 21678 invoked from network); 7 Nov 2005 00:36:47 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO webmail11.prod.mesa1.secureserver.net) (64.202.189.48) by smtpout04-03.prod.mesa1.secureserver.net with SMTP; 7 Nov 2005 00:36:47 -0000 Received: (qmail 19025 invoked by uid 99); 7 Nov 2005 00:36:47 -0000 Date: Sun, 06 Nov 2005 17:36:47 -0700 From: David Green To: 6lowpan@ietf.org Message-ID: <20051106173647.067cef142d1c5458c6eb81f0de3d4bea.c4b487210b.wbe@email.secureserver.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Spam-Score: 2.3 (++) X-Scan-Signature: cf4fa59384e76e63313391b70cd0dd25 Subject: [6lowpan] Comments on draft-ietf-6lowpan-format-01 Header Compression X-BeenThere: 6lowpan@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: Working group discussion for IPv6 over LowPan networks <6lowpan.ietf.org> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="===============1384275867==" Sender: 6lowpan-bounces@ietf.org Errors-To: 6lowpan-bounces@ietf.org --===============1384275867== Content-Type: TEXT/html; CHARSET=US-ASCII
draft-ietf-6lowpan-format-01.txt section 8:
 
"Given the very limited packet sizes, it is highly desirable to
      integrate layer 2 with layer 3 compression, something typically
      not done."
 
Actually link-layer assist is quite commonly done - see:

RFC 3242 - RObust Header Compression (ROHC): A Link-Layer Assisted Profile for IP/UDP/RTP
 
Also, I have a draft written on point-to-multipoint header compression that you may find useful for this section.
 
-David Green
--===============1384275867== Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline _______________________________________________ 6lowpan mailing list 6lowpan@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/6lowpan --===============1384275867==-- From 6lowpan-bounces@ietf.org Sun Nov 06 23:48:01 2005 Received: from localhost.cnri.reston.va.us ([127.0.0.1] helo=megatron.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1EYyvJ-0003C4-20; Sun, 06 Nov 2005 23:48:01 -0500 Received: from odin.ietf.org ([132.151.1.176] helo=ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1EYyvH-0003Bk-Cw for 6lowpan@megatron.ietf.org; Sun, 06 Nov 2005 23:47:59 -0500 Received: from ietf-mx.ietf.org (ietf-mx [132.151.6.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id XAA13281 for <6lowpan@ietf.org>; Sun, 6 Nov 2005 23:47:34 -0500 (EST) Received: from m1.informatik.uni-bremen.de ([134.102.201.18] helo=informatik.uni-bremen.de ident=root) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1EYzAn-0007S9-Sv for 6lowpan@ietf.org; Mon, 07 Nov 2005 00:04:03 -0500 Received: from [127.0.0.1] (m2.informatik.uni-bremen.de [IPv6:2001:638:708:30c9:209:3dff:fe00:343a]) by informatik.uni-bremen.de (8.13.4/8.13.2) with ESMTP id jA74lsdY014655; Mon, 7 Nov 2005 05:47:55 +0100 (CET) Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v746.2) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; delsp=yes; format=flowed Message-Id: <3F1C305D-B511-4DD3-BB04-55E300C350E2@tzi.org> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: Carsten Bormann Date: Sun, 6 Nov 2005 20:47:56 -0800 To: 6lowpan@ietf.org X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.746.2) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Scan-Signature: de4f315c9369b71d7dd5909b42224370 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Cc: Carsten Bormann Subject: [6lowpan] Updated agenda at http://6lowpan.tzi.org/6lowpan_20at_20IETF_2064 X-BeenThere: 6lowpan@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: Working group discussion for IPv6 over LowPan networks <6lowpan.ietf.org> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 6lowpan-bounces@ietf.org Errors-To: 6lowpan-bounces@ietf.org Lowpanners, I have put up an updated agenda on the 6lowpan wiki: http://6lowpan.tzi.org/6lowpan_20at_20IETF_2064 Speakers: Please make sure I have your presentation materials by 11:00 PST so I can upload them to the materials tracker site (https://onsite.ietf.org/public/meeting_materials.cgi?meeting_num=64) before the meeting starts. Thanks! Gruesse, Carsten _______________________________________________ 6lowpan mailing list 6lowpan@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/6lowpan From 6lowpan-bounces@ietf.org Mon Nov 07 04:18:09 2005 Received: from localhost.cnri.reston.va.us ([127.0.0.1] helo=megatron.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1EZ385-0001ed-Hj; Mon, 07 Nov 2005 04:17:29 -0500 Received: from odin.ietf.org ([132.151.1.176] helo=ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1EZ382-0001de-Jz for 6lowpan@megatron.ietf.org; Mon, 07 Nov 2005 04:17:26 -0500 Received: from ietf-mx.ietf.org (ietf-mx [132.151.6.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id EAA27761 for <6lowpan@ietf.org>; Mon, 7 Nov 2005 04:17:01 -0500 (EST) Received: from web81906.mail.mud.yahoo.com ([68.142.207.185]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with smtp (Exim 4.43) id 1EZ3NZ-0005zK-7H for 6lowpan@ietf.org; Mon, 07 Nov 2005 04:33:32 -0500 Received: (qmail 76206 invoked by uid 60001); 7 Nov 2005 09:17:11 -0000 DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=s1024; d=yahoo.com; h=Message-ID:Received:Date:From:Reply-To:Subject:To:In-Reply-To:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding; b=NphHk9uvvKTvHJ90aZLHNzrLZQXCdpJTl8Az6vD9/oN01fzC4JeqZGRugzJ8W774EsL1GhMZbe1/Umn8URVMCmBF74gA3I0gnjNy6SlyyewJ1BUrxE0HoiY5pfAybfFPNT2NC7OrZ4U8GlqD4a+GrzQUEo4rOnBTCKod+jG55RU= ; Message-ID: <20051107091711.76204.qmail@web81906.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Received: from [209.52.153.167] by web81906.mail.mud.yahoo.com via HTTP; Mon, 07 Nov 2005 01:17:11 PST Date: Mon, 7 Nov 2005 01:17:11 -0800 (PST) From: gabriel montenegro Subject: Re: [6lowpan] Comments on draft-ietf-6lowpan-format-01 Header Compression To: David Green , 6lowpan@ietf.org In-Reply-To: <20051106173647.067cef142d1c5458c6eb81f0de3d4bea.c4b487210b.wbe@email.secureserver.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Spam-Score: 0.5 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 97adf591118a232206bdb5a27b217034 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Cc: X-BeenThere: 6lowpan@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: itijibox-6lowpan@yahoo.com List-Id: Working group discussion for IPv6 over LowPan networks <6lowpan.ietf.org> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 6lowpan-bounces@ietf.org Errors-To: 6lowpan-bounces@ietf.org I wrote that based on a conversation a while back with Carsten (before he was chair) in which he said this was not typically done. Carsten, care to elaborate? As for the effect on the draft, we can just delete this text if there's any objection. It was just meant as background info and has no normative weight whatsoever. -gabriel --- David Green wrote: --------------------------------- draft-ietf-6lowpan-format-01.txt section 8: "Given the very limited packet sizes, it is highly desirableto integrate layer 2 with layer 3compression, something typically notdone." Actually link-layer assist is quite commonly done - see: RFC 3242 - RObust Header Compression (ROHC): A Link-LayerAssisted Profile for IP/UDP/RTP Also, I have a draft written on point-to-multipoint headercompression that you may find useful for this section. -David Green > _______________________________________________ > 6lowpan mailing list > 6lowpan@ietf.org > https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/6lowpan > _______________________________________________ 6lowpan mailing list 6lowpan@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/6lowpan From 6lowpan-bounces@ietf.org Mon Nov 07 21:08:24 2005 Received: from localhost.cnri.reston.va.us ([127.0.0.1] helo=megatron.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1EZIuO-0006pw-1V; Mon, 07 Nov 2005 21:08:24 -0500 Received: from odin.ietf.org ([132.151.1.176] helo=ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1EZIuM-0006pm-3T for 6lowpan@megatron.ietf.org; Mon, 07 Nov 2005 21:08:22 -0500 Received: from ietf-mx.ietf.org (ietf-mx [132.151.6.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id VAA01159 for <6lowpan@ietf.org>; Mon, 7 Nov 2005 21:07:55 -0500 (EST) Received: from m1.informatik.uni-bremen.de ([134.102.201.18] helo=informatik.uni-bremen.de ident=root) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1EZJA3-0002GO-Hb for 6lowpan@ietf.org; Mon, 07 Nov 2005 21:24:37 -0500 Received: from [127.0.0.1] (m2.informatik.uni-bremen.de [IPv6:2001:638:708:30c9:209:3dff:fe00:343a]) by informatik.uni-bremen.de (8.13.4/8.13.2) with ESMTP id jA828GKu012919; Tue, 8 Nov 2005 03:08:17 +0100 (CET) Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v746.2) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; delsp=yes; format=flowed Message-Id: <8C1D8E19-FFBA-4F5B-BA36-6C2C1EF9644A@tzi.org> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: Carsten Bormann Date: Mon, 7 Nov 2005 18:08:14 -0800 To: 6lowpan@ietf.org X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.746.2) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 52e1467c2184c31006318542db5614d5 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Cc: Carsten Bormann Subject: [6lowpan] Unofficial overflow meeting Tuesday morning 8 am, pending AD approval X-BeenThere: 6lowpan@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: Working group discussion for IPv6 over LowPan networks <6lowpan.ietf.org> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 6lowpan-bounces@ietf.org Errors-To: 6lowpan-bounces@ietf.org Lowpanners, today we had a bad case of agenda overflow. While we managed to cover all items that are immediately related to our chartered work, there is some interesting input on future work that we couldn't look at: Routing protocol comparison (Kim/Park, 15 min) draft-daniel-6lowpan-load-adhoc-routing draft-montenegro-6lowpan-dymo-low-routing 6lowpan Evaluation results (Kim/Park, 15 min) draft-daniel-6lowpan-load-adhoc-routing draft-daniel-6lowpan-hilow-hierarchical-routing draft-daniel-6lowpan-sslp draft-daniel-6lowpan-interoperability The slides are already at the meeting materials site, https:// onsite.ietf.org/public/meeting_materials.cgi?meeting_num=64, item "routing protocols comparison" (direct link is right now: http:// onsite.ietf.org/proceedings/05nov/slides/6lowpan-3.pdf). Pending AD approval (which I herewith request), a couple of lowpanners interested in this will meet Tuesday at 8 am sharp in room Cypress to look at this presentation. We have until 8:30, at which time we have to make room for the SASL WG meeting. Also, I would like to report that we had a quite productive hallway meeting on the security considerations section of the problem statement document, and Nandu is planning to submit an updated version to the mailing list Tuesday by 5pm. Some of us will meet in the lobby area at 8 am Wednesday to discuss this some more. Gruesse, Carsten _______________________________________________ 6lowpan mailing list 6lowpan@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/6lowpan From 6lowpan-bounces@ietf.org Wed Nov 09 12:36:54 2005 Received: from localhost.cnri.reston.va.us ([127.0.0.1] helo=megatron.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1EZtsU-0004Wa-Ei; Wed, 09 Nov 2005 12:36:54 -0500 Received: from odin.ietf.org ([132.151.1.176] helo=ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1EZtsS-0004WV-4F for 6lowpan@megatron.ietf.org; Wed, 09 Nov 2005 12:36:52 -0500 Received: from ietf-mx.ietf.org (ietf-mx [132.151.6.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id MAA24589 for <6lowpan@ietf.org>; Wed, 9 Nov 2005 12:36:25 -0500 (EST) Received: from m1.informatik.uni-bremen.de ([134.102.201.18] helo=informatik.uni-bremen.de ident=root) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1EZu8T-0003KH-4e for 6lowpan@ietf.org; Wed, 09 Nov 2005 12:53:27 -0500 Received: from [127.0.0.1] (m2.informatik.uni-bremen.de [IPv6:2001:638:708:30c9:209:3dff:fe00:343a]) by informatik.uni-bremen.de (8.13.4/8.13.2) with ESMTP id jA9HZxsu002516; Wed, 9 Nov 2005 18:36:01 +0100 (CET) In-Reply-To: <9D602ABCE51B0B488BF857A4787939B5065CD295@orsmsx410> References: <9D602ABCE51B0B488BF857A4787939B5065CD295@orsmsx410> Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v746.2) X-Priority: 1 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; delsp=yes; format=flowed Message-Id: <8AE22A3C-23B5-4AF6-B471-2690B03836E2@tzi.org> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: Carsten Bormann Date: Wed, 9 Nov 2005 09:35:57 -0800 To: 6lowpan@ietf.org X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.746.2) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new X-Spam-Score: 0.5 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 0fa76816851382eb71b0a882ccdc29ac Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Cc: samita.chakrabarti@sun.com, Carsten Bormann Subject: [6lowpan] Re: Security considerations section of problem statement X-BeenThere: 6lowpan@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: Working group discussion for IPv6 over LowPan networks <6lowpan.ietf.org> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 6lowpan-bounces@ietf.org Errors-To: 6lowpan-bounces@ietf.org Lowpanners, a small editing group met in the Westin Bayshore lobby this morning, discussing the security considerations section of the problem statement document. The most recent result of the editing is always at http://www.writely.com/View.aspx?docid=adt3cwpc9qgf Below is a current snapshot. Quick comments would be appreciated, as we really want to close this remaining issue on the problem statement document. (If you want to fix things directly on the Writely page, send me mail.) Gruesse, Carsten Security Considerations 6lowpan applications often require confidentiality and integrity protection. This can be provided at the application or transport level, at the network layer, and/or at the link layer, i.e. within the 6lowpan set of specifications. In all these cases, 6LoWPAN constraints will influence the choice of a particular protocol. Some of the more relevant constraints are small code size, low power operation, low complexity, and small bandwidth requirements. It is understandable that these constraints have associated tradeoffs. Thus a threat model for 6LoWPAN devices needs to be first developed in order to weight any risks against the cost of security and at the same time make meaningful assumptions and simplifications. Some examples for threats that would be considered are man in the middle attacks, denial of service attacks. A separate set of security considerations might apply to bootstrapping a 6lowpan device into the network, in particular initial key establishment processes. This is generally involved with other application level transactions and may rely on an application- specific trust model; thus it will not be part of 6LoWPAN. Some choices may be to use out of band communication techniques such as USB, infrared or NFC (Near Field Communication) for the initial key establishment. After the initial key establishment, subsequent key management protocols would fall under the purview of 6LoWPAN. In order to be able to select (or design) this next set of protocols, there needs to be a common model of the keying material created by the initial key establishment. There are a few cryptographic protocols to choose from. It is to be seen if the protocols available as part of IPsec meet the constraints of 6LoWPAN. One argument for using link layer security is that most IEEE 802.15.4 chips already have support for AES link layer security. AES is a block cipher operating on blocks of fixed length, i.e., 128 bits. To encrypt longer messages, several modes of operation may be used. The earliest modes described, such as ECB, CBC, OFB and CFB provide only confidentiality, and this does not ensure message integrity. Other modes have been designed which ensure both confidentiality and message integrity, such as CCM mode, EAX mode and OCB mode. 6LoWPAN could choose to operate in one of the modes of operation, but it is desirable to utilize as much of link level security as possible and build upon it. For network layer security, two models are applicable: end-to-end security, e.g. using IPsec transport mode, or security that is limited to the wireless portion of the network, e.g. using a security gateway and IPsec tunnel mode. The disadvantage of the latter is the larger header size, which is significant at the 6lowpan frame MTUs. To simplify 6lowpan implementations, it would be beneficial to identify a preferred set of ciphersuites that are appropriate given the 6lowpan constraints. _______________________________________________ 6lowpan mailing list 6lowpan@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/6lowpan From 6lowpan-bounces@ietf.org Wed Nov 09 14:08:31 2005 Received: from localhost.cnri.reston.va.us ([127.0.0.1] helo=megatron.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1EZvJ9-0005DN-9a; Wed, 09 Nov 2005 14:08:31 -0500 Received: from odin.ietf.org ([132.151.1.176] helo=ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1EZvJ7-0005C5-Q0 for 6lowpan@megatron.ietf.org; Wed, 09 Nov 2005 14:08:29 -0500 Received: from ietf-mx.ietf.org (ietf-mx [132.151.6.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id OAA01228 for <6lowpan@ietf.org>; Wed, 9 Nov 2005 14:08:00 -0500 (EST) Received: from brmea-mail-3.sun.com ([192.18.98.34]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1EZvZ6-0006Kn-Un for 6lowpan@ietf.org; Wed, 09 Nov 2005 14:25:04 -0500 Received: from jurassic.eng.sun.com ([129.146.68.130]) by brmea-mail-3.sun.com (8.12.10/8.12.9) with ESMTP id jA9J8M3F011456; Wed, 9 Nov 2005 12:08:23 -0700 (MST) Received: from eng.sun.com (vpn-129-150-29-245.SFBay.Sun.COM [129.150.29.245]) by jurassic.eng.sun.com (8.13.5+Sun/8.13.5) with ESMTP id jA9J8HKr704774; Wed, 9 Nov 2005 11:08:17 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: <4372491D.9040102@eng.sun.com> Date: Wed, 09 Nov 2005 11:08:13 -0800 From: Samita Chakrabarti User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.1; en-US; rv:1.4) Gecko/20030624 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Carsten Bormann Subject: Re: [6lowpan] Re: Security considerations section of problem statement References: <9D602ABCE51B0B488BF857A4787939B5065CD295@orsmsx410> <8AE22A3C-23B5-4AF6-B471-2690B03836E2@tzi.org> In-Reply-To: <8AE22A3C-23B5-4AF6-B471-2690B03836E2@tzi.org> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 9ed51c9d1356100bce94f1ae4ec616a9 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Cc: 6lowpan@ietf.org, samita.chakrabarti@sun.com X-BeenThere: 6lowpan@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: Working group discussion for IPv6 over LowPan networks <6lowpan.ietf.org> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 6lowpan-bounces@ietf.org Errors-To: 6lowpan-bounces@ietf.org > > For network layer security, two models are applicable: end-to-end > security, e.g. using IPsec transport mode, or security that is > limited to the wireless portion of the network, e.g. using a security > gateway and IPsec tunnel mode. The disadvantage of the latter is the > larger header size, which is significant at the 6lowpan frame MTUs. > To simplify I am not in favor of security gateway, but if we do, it will not necessarily increase the packet overhead of lowpan becuase I assume the security gateway will be at the edge of the lowpan network - right ? If we implement IPSec tunnel mode - in lowpan then there is a significant overhead which is not desirtable. Should we even consider IPSec tunnel mode within the 6lowpan network? Or does the above mean that the IPSec tunnel at the security gateway? In conjunction with IPSec, we also need to mention that 6lowpan will need to choose an appropriate key-management scheme applicable for 6lowpan characteristics. Sorry, I don't have a replacement text prepared to provide right away. Regards, -Samita > 6lowpan implementations, it would be beneficial to identify a > preferred set of ciphersuites that are appropriate given the 6lowpan > constraints. > > > > _______________________________________________ > 6lowpan mailing list > 6lowpan@ietf.org > https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/6lowpan _______________________________________________ 6lowpan mailing list 6lowpan@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/6lowpan From 6lowpan-bounces@ietf.org Wed Nov 09 17:02:41 2005 Received: from localhost.cnri.reston.va.us ([127.0.0.1] helo=megatron.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1EZy1h-0007Eq-CU; Wed, 09 Nov 2005 17:02:41 -0500 Received: from odin.ietf.org ([132.151.1.176] helo=ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1EZy1a-0007Ci-WB for 6lowpan@megatron.ietf.org; Wed, 09 Nov 2005 17:02:35 -0500 Received: from ietf-mx.ietf.org (ietf-mx [132.151.6.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id RAA13398 for <6lowpan@ietf.org>; Wed, 9 Nov 2005 17:02:06 -0500 (EST) Received: from m1.informatik.uni-bremen.de ([134.102.201.18] helo=informatik.uni-bremen.de ident=root) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1EZyHf-0003jb-Ih for 6lowpan@ietf.org; Wed, 09 Nov 2005 17:19:13 -0500 Received: from [127.0.0.1] (m2.informatik.uni-bremen.de [IPv6:2001:638:708:30c9:209:3dff:fe00:343a]) by informatik.uni-bremen.de (8.13.4/8.13.2) with ESMTP id jA9M2CNO014872; Wed, 9 Nov 2005 23:02:13 +0100 (CET) In-Reply-To: <4372491D.9040102@eng.sun.com> References: <9D602ABCE51B0B488BF857A4787939B5065CD295@orsmsx410> <8AE22A3C-23B5-4AF6-B471-2690B03836E2@tzi.org> <4372491D.9040102@eng.sun.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v746.2) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; delsp=yes; format=flowed Message-Id: <8C0398DC-3795-45D7-A554-99F1A75CBD17@tzi.org> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: Carsten Bormann Subject: Re: [6lowpan] Re: Security considerations section of problem statement Date: Wed, 9 Nov 2005 14:02:12 -0800 To: Samita Chakrabarti X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.746.2) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 50a516d93fd399dc60588708fd9a3002 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Cc: Carsten Bormann , 6lowpan@ietf.org, samita.chakrabarti@sun.com X-BeenThere: 6lowpan@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: Working group discussion for IPv6 over LowPan networks <6lowpan.ietf.org> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 6lowpan-bounces@ietf.org Errors-To: 6lowpan-bounces@ietf.org >> For network layer security, two models are applicable: end-to-end >> security, e.g. using IPsec transport mode, or security that is >> limited to the wireless portion of the network, e.g. using a >> security gateway and IPsec tunnel mode. The disadvantage of the >> latter is the larger header size, which is significant at the >> 6lowpan frame MTUs. To simplify > > > I am not in favor of security gateway, but if we do, it will not > necessarily increase the > packet overhead of lowpan becuase I assume the security gateway > will be at the edge > of the lowpan network - right ? The security gateway is at the edge and converts unsecured packets on the outside into secured packets on the inside by encapsulating them in ESP. This is called tunnel mode, so the whole packet is encapsulated, and we finally have two IP headers. The inner IP header, as it is protected (integrity protected and encrypted) is not subject to 6lowpan header compression, unless we invent a new scheme for compressing within ESP (but see also draft- ertekin-rqts-hcoipsec-01.txt). > If we implement IPSec tunnel mode - in lowpan then there is a > significant overhead which > is not desirtable. Should we even consider IPSec tunnel mode > within the 6lowpan network? Or does the above mean that the IPSec > tunnel at the security gateway? Well, it starts at the security gateway and ends at the 6lowpan device in order to secure the 6lowpan part of the path. In effect, we are making the life of the 6lowpan device harder in order to make the life of the extra-6lowpan system easier. Not a tradeoff I particularly like, which is why I prefer end-to-end security (transport mode). > In conjunction with IPSec, we also need to mention that 6lowpan > will need to choose an > appropriate key-management scheme applicable for 6lowpan > characteristics. Right. Bob proposed looking at IKEv2 and finding a suitable profile (subset) that is small enough implementable in 6lowpan devices. Gruesse, Carsten _______________________________________________ 6lowpan mailing list 6lowpan@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/6lowpan From 6lowpan-bounces@ietf.org Wed Nov 16 00:51:36 2005 Received: from localhost.cnri.reston.va.us ([127.0.0.1] helo=megatron.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1EcGCm-0007EO-1B; Wed, 16 Nov 2005 00:51:36 -0500 Received: from odin.ietf.org ([132.151.1.176] helo=ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1EcGCk-0007D9-5N for 6lowpan@megatron.ietf.org; Wed, 16 Nov 2005 00:51:34 -0500 Received: from grab.coslabs.com (grab.coslabs.com [199.233.92.34]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id AAA01662 for <6lowpan@lists.ietf.org>; Wed, 16 Nov 2005 00:51:00 -0500 (EST) Received: from dellx1.coslabs.com (dellx1.coslabs.com [199.233.92.20]) by grab.coslabs.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id jAG5p0s6020526 for <6lowpan@lists.ietf.org>; Tue, 15 Nov 2005 22:51:00 -0700 (MST) From: Geoff Mulligan To: 6lowpan <6lowpan@ietf.org> Content-Type: text/plain Date: Tue, 15 Nov 2005 22:51:02 -0700 Message-Id: <1132120263.9467.41.camel@localhost.localdomain> Mime-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Evolution 2.4.1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: [6lowpan] 6lowpan interim meeting X-BeenThere: 6lowpan@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: Working group discussion for IPv6 over LowPan networks <6lowpan.ietf.org> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 6lowpan-bounces@ietf.org Errors-To: 6lowpan-bounces@ietf.org At this last IETF a number of 6lowpan participants indicated that we should consider holding an interim meeting to spend some significant time and effort working out some of the details of the format document - the problem document should hopefully be somewhat finished before the end of this month. We have a couple of suggestions for when and where to hold the meeting: 1. In conjunction with the 802.* interim meeting in Hawaii - Jan 15 to 20. 2. Chicago either before sometime during the week of the 9th or after during the week of the 23rd. In order to hold a interim meeting we need to give something like 6 weeks notice and it need to be held like 6 week before the next ietf. January is the appropriate month. Now when and where. If we decide to hold it in or around Chicago, Invensys can sponsor the meeting site. Another option would be to volunteer Intel to sponsor it in the SF Bay area or Portland or Microsoft in Washington, though Chicago is probably most central. If we choose to coincide with IEEE in Hawaii, I can ask if we can get some meeting space in or near the IEEE meeting hotel. One other option is the during the IEEE Radio and Wireless Symposium Jan 17-19 in San Diego. Please let me know you thoughts on this ASAP. geoff _______________________________________________ 6lowpan mailing list 6lowpan@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/6lowpan From 6lowpan-bounces@ietf.org Wed Nov 16 01:48:18 2005 Received: from localhost.cnri.reston.va.us ([127.0.0.1] helo=megatron.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1EcH5e-0004rG-Dr; Wed, 16 Nov 2005 01:48:18 -0500 Received: from odin.ietf.org ([132.151.1.176] helo=ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1EcH5d-0004qV-7F for 6lowpan@megatron.ietf.org; Wed, 16 Nov 2005 01:48:17 -0500 Received: from ietf-mx.ietf.org (ietf-mx [132.151.6.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id BAA04009 for <6lowpan@ietf.org>; Wed, 16 Nov 2005 01:47:42 -0500 (EST) Received: from mailout1.samsung.com ([203.254.224.24]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1EcHMz-0005Pr-Mt for 6lowpan@ietf.org; Wed, 16 Nov 2005 02:06:15 -0500 Received: from ep_mmp1 (mailout1.samsung.com [203.254.224.24]) by mailout1.samsung.com (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 Patch 2 (built Jul 14 2004)) with ESMTP id <0IQ100D0LC822T@mailout1.samsung.com> for 6lowpan@ietf.org; Wed, 16 Nov 2005 15:48:02 +0900 (KST) Received: from natpt ([124.235.13.1]) by mmp1.samsung.com (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 Patch 2 (built Jul 14 2004)) with ESMTPA id <0IQ100IMBC80TS@mmp1.samsung.com> for 6lowpan@ietf.org; Wed, 16 Nov 2005 15:48:02 +0900 (KST) Date: Tue, 15 Nov 2005 22:50:13 -0800 From: Soohong Daniel Park Subject: Re: [6lowpan] 6lowpan interim meeting To: Geoff Mulligan , 6lowpan <6lowpan@ietf.org> Message-id: <00cc01c5ea7a$000deef0$a70710ac@natpt> MIME-version: 1.0 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1506 X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1506 Content-type: text/plain; charset=ks_c_5601-1987 Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-priority: Normal References: <1132120263.9467.41.camel@localhost.localdomain> X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 3e15cc4fdc61d7bce84032741d11c8e5 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7BIT Cc: X-BeenThere: 6lowpan@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: Working group discussion for IPv6 over LowPan networks <6lowpan.ietf.org> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 6lowpan-bounces@ietf.org Errors-To: 6lowpan-bounces@ietf.org Good to hear your announcement quickly. Thanks Geoff. I am leaning to Hawaii just before 802 interim. Regards, Daniel (Soohong Daniel Park) Mobile Platform Laboratory, SAMSUNG Electronics. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Geoff Mulligan" To: "6lowpan" <6lowpan@ietf.org> Sent: Tuesday, November 15, 2005 9:51 PM Subject: [6lowpan] 6lowpan interim meeting > At this last IETF a number of 6lowpan participants indicated that we > should consider holding an interim meeting to spend some significant > time and effort working out some of the details of the format document - > the problem document should hopefully be somewhat finished before the > end of this month. > > We have a couple of suggestions for when and where to hold the meeting: > 1. In conjunction with the 802.* interim meeting in Hawaii - Jan 15 > to 20. > 2. Chicago either before sometime during the week of the 9th or > after during the week of the 23rd. > > In order to hold a interim meeting we need to give something like 6 > weeks notice and it need to be held like 6 week before the next ietf. > January is the appropriate month. Now when and where. > > If we decide to hold it in or around Chicago, Invensys can sponsor the > meeting site. Another option would be to volunteer Intel to sponsor it > in the SF Bay area or Portland or Microsoft in Washington, though > Chicago is probably most central. > > If we choose to coincide with IEEE in Hawaii, I can ask if we can get > some meeting space in or near the IEEE meeting hotel. > > One other option is the during the IEEE Radio and Wireless Symposium Jan > 17-19 in San Diego. > > Please let me know you thoughts on this ASAP. > > geoff > > > > _______________________________________________ > 6lowpan mailing list > 6lowpan@ietf.org > https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/6lowpan > > _______________________________________________ 6lowpan mailing list 6lowpan@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/6lowpan From 6lowpan-bounces@ietf.org Wed Nov 16 05:26:59 2005 Received: from localhost.cnri.reston.va.us ([127.0.0.1] helo=megatron.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1EcKVH-00034W-8v; Wed, 16 Nov 2005 05:26:59 -0500 Received: from odin.ietf.org ([132.151.1.176] helo=ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1EcKVF-00032q-4e for 6lowpan@megatron.ietf.org; Wed, 16 Nov 2005 05:26:57 -0500 Received: from ietf-mx.ietf.org (ietf-mx [132.151.6.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id FAA15347 for <6lowpan@ietf.org>; Wed, 16 Nov 2005 05:26:23 -0500 (EST) Received: from mailx.danfoss.com ([193.162.34.6]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1EcKmd-0002oh-2e for 6lowpan@ietf.org; Wed, 16 Nov 2005 05:44:56 -0500 Received: from dkdn04mx62.dkdn04.danfoss.net ([10.6.2.62]) by mailx.danfoss.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(5.0.2195.6713); Wed, 16 Nov 2005 11:26:34 +0100 Received: from dkdn01mx21.danfoss.net ([10.12.129.21]) by 10.6.4.62 with InterScan Messaging Security Suite; Wed, 16 Nov 2005 11:26:34 +0100 Received: from DKDN01MX34.danfoss.net ([10.12.128.14]) by dkdn01mx21.danfoss.net with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.1830); Wed, 16 Nov 2005 11:26:34 +0100 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft Exchange V6.5 Content-class: urn:content-classes:message MIME-Version: 1.0 Subject: RE: [6lowpan] 6lowpan interim meeting Date: Wed, 16 Nov 2005 11:22:17 +0100 Message-ID: <49A38D2FE2C53946A57916AD6A1F00D71392D1@DKDN01MX34.danfoss.net> Thread-Topic: [6lowpan] 6lowpan interim meeting Thread-Index: AcXqcd/NNwyf+26lSoeuDtMlMSmi8gAJb8ns References: <1132120263.9467.41.camel@localhost.localdomain> From: "Schumacher Christian Peter Pii" To: "Geoff Mulligan" , "6lowpan" <6lowpan@ietf.org> X-OriginalArrivalTime: 16 Nov 2005 10:26:34.0237 (UTC) FILETIME=[37D212D0:01C5EA98] X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 29dc808194f5fb921c09d0040806d6eb Cc: X-BeenThere: 6lowpan@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: Working group discussion for IPv6 over LowPan networks <6lowpan.ietf.org> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="===============1873834642==" Sender: 6lowpan-bounces@ietf.org Errors-To: 6lowpan-bounces@ietf.org This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --===============1873834642== Content-class: urn:content-classes:message Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----_=_NextPart_001_01C5EA98.3799AC89" This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------_=_NextPart_001_01C5EA98.3799AC89 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Hi Geoff. I'd prefer Chicago for travel related reasons, but I'm open for both = destinations. Regards Christian -----Original Message----- From: 6lowpan-bounces@ietf.org on behalf of Geoff Mulligan Sent: Wed 11/16/2005 6:51 AM To: 6lowpan Subject: [6lowpan] 6lowpan interim meeting =20 At this last IETF a number of 6lowpan participants indicated that we should consider holding an interim meeting to spend some significant time and effort working out some of the details of the format document - the problem document should hopefully be somewhat finished before the end of this month. We have a couple of suggestions for when and where to hold the meeting: 1. In conjunction with the 802.* interim meeting in Hawaii - Jan 15 to 20. 2. Chicago either before sometime during the week of the 9th or after during the week of the 23rd. In order to hold a interim meeting we need to give something like 6 weeks notice and it need to be held like 6 week before the next ietf. January is the appropriate month. Now when and where. If we decide to hold it in or around Chicago, Invensys can sponsor the meeting site. Another option would be to volunteer Intel to sponsor it in the SF Bay area or Portland or Microsoft in Washington, though Chicago is probably most central. If we choose to coincide with IEEE in Hawaii, I can ask if we can get some meeting space in or near the IEEE meeting hotel. One other option is the during the IEEE Radio and Wireless Symposium Jan 17-19 in San Diego. Please let me know you thoughts on this ASAP. geoff _______________________________________________ 6lowpan mailing list 6lowpan@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/6lowpan ------_=_NextPart_001_01C5EA98.3799AC89 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable RE: [6lowpan] 6lowpan interim meeting

Hi Geoff.

I'd prefer Chicago for travel related reasons, but I'm open for both = destinations.

Regards
Christian


-----Original Message-----
From: 6lowpan-bounces@ietf.org on behalf of Geoff Mulligan
Sent: Wed 11/16/2005 6:51 AM
To: 6lowpan
Subject: [6lowpan] 6lowpan interim meeting

At this last IETF a number of 6lowpan participants indicated that we
should consider holding an interim meeting to spend some significant
time and effort working out some of the details of the format document = -
the problem document should hopefully be somewhat finished before = the
end of this month.

We have a couple of suggestions for when and where to hold the = meeting:
    1. In conjunction with the 802.* interim meeting in = Hawaii - Jan 15
to 20.
    2. Chicago either before sometime during the week of = the 9th or
after during the week of the 23rd.

In order to hold a interim meeting we need to give something like 6
weeks notice and it need to be held like 6 week before the next = ietf.
January is the appropriate month.  Now when and where.

If we decide to hold it in or around Chicago, Invensys can sponsor = the
meeting site.  Another option would be to volunteer Intel to = sponsor it
in the SF Bay area or Portland or Microsoft in Washington, though
Chicago is probably most central.

If we choose to coincide with IEEE in Hawaii, I can ask if we can = get
some meeting space in or near the IEEE meeting hotel.

One other option is the during the IEEE Radio and Wireless Symposium = Jan
17-19 in San Diego.

Please let me know you thoughts on this ASAP.

        geoff



_______________________________________________
6lowpan mailing list
6lowpan@ietf.org
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------_=_NextPart_001_01C5EA98.3799AC89-- --===============1873834642== Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline _______________________________________________ 6lowpan mailing list 6lowpan@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/6lowpan --===============1873834642==-- From 6lowpan-bounces@ietf.org Wed Nov 16 12:23:21 2005 Received: from localhost.cnri.reston.va.us ([127.0.0.1] helo=megatron.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1EcR0D-0003vU-Dw; Wed, 16 Nov 2005 12:23:21 -0500 Received: from odin.ietf.org ([132.151.1.176] helo=ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1EcR0C-0003vP-Lj for 6lowpan@megatron.ietf.org; Wed, 16 Nov 2005 12:23:20 -0500 Received: from ietf-mx.ietf.org (ietf-mx [132.151.6.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id MAA11422 for <6lowpan@ietf.org>; Wed, 16 Nov 2005 12:22:46 -0500 (EST) Received: from web81911.mail.mud.yahoo.com ([68.142.207.190]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with smtp (Exim 4.43) id 1EcRHf-000150-Ak for 6lowpan@ietf.org; Wed, 16 Nov 2005 12:41:24 -0500 Received: (qmail 99141 invoked by uid 60001); 16 Nov 2005 17:23:08 -0000 DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=s1024; d=yahoo.com; h=Message-ID:Received:Date:From:Reply-To:Subject:To:In-Reply-To:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding; b=QaPwJEjvXHkRYuHV/Q8fiFjMCJI0T1qCuAb8f8IWyKMwc9Pee3PALJ0kwJ/yzGmuXz7cFdAEEizNQvSI5jtc7sCJ+fbFmV5YE/M48uzxe5kyrlvuquFx5JaaFMHCtoVH8NKwkDCp+tvvkDBFbB2zAm5on9us/3fYNEwCng/HxIM= ; Message-ID: <20051116172308.99139.qmail@web81911.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Received: from [209.82.80.118] by web81911.mail.mud.yahoo.com via HTTP; Wed, 16 Nov 2005 09:23:08 PST Date: Wed, 16 Nov 2005 09:23:08 -0800 (PST) From: gabriel montenegro Subject: Re: [6lowpan] 6lowpan interim meeting To: Geoff Mulligan , 6lowpan <6lowpan@ietf.org> In-Reply-To: <1132120263.9467.41.camel@localhost.localdomain> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Spam-Score: 0.5 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 4adaf050708fb13be3316a9eee889caa Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Cc: X-BeenThere: 6lowpan@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: itijibox-6lowpan@yahoo.com List-Id: Working group discussion for IPv6 over LowPan networks <6lowpan.ietf.org> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 6lowpan-bounces@ietf.org Errors-To: 6lowpan-bounces@ietf.org I'd prefer the week of the 23rd. No real preference as to location, and yes, Redmond would be a possibility if folks don't find it too inconvenient. -gabriel --- Geoff Mulligan wrote: > At this last IETF a number of 6lowpan participants indicated that we > should consider holding an interim meeting to spend some significant > time and effort working out some of the details of the format document - > the problem document should hopefully be somewhat finished before the > end of this month. > > We have a couple of suggestions for when and where to hold the meeting: > 1. In conjunction with the 802.* interim meeting in Hawaii - Jan 15 > to 20. > 2. Chicago either before sometime during the week of the 9th or > after during the week of the 23rd. > > In order to hold a interim meeting we need to give something like 6 > weeks notice and it need to be held like 6 week before the next ietf. > January is the appropriate month. Now when and where. > > If we decide to hold it in or around Chicago, Invensys can sponsor the > meeting site. Another option would be to volunteer Intel to sponsor it > in the SF Bay area or Portland or Microsoft in Washington, though > Chicago is probably most central. > > If we choose to coincide with IEEE in Hawaii, I can ask if we can get > some meeting space in or near the IEEE meeting hotel. > > One other option is the during the IEEE Radio and Wireless Symposium Jan > 17-19 in San Diego. > > Please let me know you thoughts on this ASAP. > > geoff > > > > _______________________________________________ > 6lowpan mailing list > 6lowpan@ietf.org > https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/6lowpan > _______________________________________________ 6lowpan mailing list 6lowpan@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/6lowpan From 6lowpan-bounces@ietf.org Thu Nov 17 11:36:42 2005 Received: from localhost.cnri.reston.va.us ([127.0.0.1] helo=megatron.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1Ecmkc-0006IF-CS; Thu, 17 Nov 2005 11:36:42 -0500 Received: from odin.ietf.org ([132.151.1.176] helo=ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1Ecmka-0006I5-CA for 6lowpan@megatron.ietf.org; Thu, 17 Nov 2005 11:36:41 -0500 Received: from ietf-mx.ietf.org (ietf-mx [132.151.6.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id LAA05043 for <6lowpan@ietf.org>; Thu, 17 Nov 2005 11:36:06 -0500 (EST) Message-Id: <200511171636.LAA05043@ietf.org> Received: from maru.ajou.ac.kr ([202.30.0.18] helo=mail.ajou.ac.kr) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with smtp (Exim 4.43) id 1Ecn28-0000Bf-5Z for 6lowpan@ietf.org; Thu, 17 Nov 2005 11:54:56 -0500 Received: from seodang.ajou.ac.kr ([202.30.0.9]) by maru (Crinity Message Backbone-2.8) with SMTP ID 277; Fri, 18 Nov 2005 01:37:07 +0900 (KST) Received: from 202.30.31.245 ([202.30.31.245]) by seodang.ajou.ac.kr (Spambreaker ESMTP Server); Fri, 18 Nov 2005 01:36:06 +0900 (KST) From: Ki-Hyung Kim To: "'Geoff Mulligan'" , "'6lowpan'" <6lowpan@ietf.org> Subject: RE: [6lowpan] 6lowpan interim meeting Date: Fri, 18 Nov 2005 01:37:55 +0900 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: Microsoft Office Outlook, Build 11.0.5510 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.2180 Thread-Index: AcXqcfo2mUuR3hHRQSi6dPVj6kaHSwBIxHlA In-Reply-To: <1132120263.9467.41.camel@localhost.localdomain> X-Spam-Score: 0.9 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 0a7aa2e6e558383d84476dc338324fab Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Cc: X-BeenThere: 6lowpan@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: Working group discussion for IPv6 over LowPan networks <6lowpan.ietf.org> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 6lowpan-bounces@ietf.org Errors-To: 6lowpan-bounces@ietf.org Hi Geoff, I have no preference as to the location. -- Ki-Hyung Kim Associate Professor Division of Information and Computer Engineering, Ajou University, Suwon, Korea 442-749 Tel: +82-31-219-2433, Cel: +82-17-760-2551, Fax: +82-31-219-2433 http://ilab.ajou.ac.kr/kkim86/index.htm > -----Original Message----- > From: 6lowpan-bounces@ietf.org [mailto:6lowpan-bounces@ietf.org] On Behalf > Of Geoff Mulligan > Sent: Wednesday, November 16, 2005 2:51 PM > To: 6lowpan > Subject: [6lowpan] 6lowpan interim meeting > > > At this last IETF a number of 6lowpan participants indicated that we > should consider holding an interim meeting to spend some significant > time and effort working out some of the details of the format document - > the problem document should hopefully be somewhat finished before the > end of this month. > > We have a couple of suggestions for when and where to hold the meeting: > 1. In conjunction with the 802.* interim meeting in Hawaii - Jan 15 > to 20. > 2. Chicago either before sometime during the week of the 9th or > after during the week of the 23rd. > > In order to hold a interim meeting we need to give something like 6 > weeks notice and it need to be held like 6 week before the next ietf. > January is the appropriate month. Now when and where. > > If we decide to hold it in or around Chicago, Invensys can sponsor the > meeting site. Another option would be to volunteer Intel to sponsor it > in the SF Bay area or Portland or Microsoft in Washington, though > Chicago is probably most central. > > If we choose to coincide with IEEE in Hawaii, I can ask if we can get > some meeting space in or near the IEEE meeting hotel. > > One other option is the during the IEEE Radio and Wireless Symposium Jan > 17-19 in San Diego. > > Please let me know you thoughts on this ASAP. > > geoff > > > > _______________________________________________ > 6lowpan mailing list > 6lowpan@ietf.org > https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/6lowpan _______________________________________________ 6lowpan mailing list 6lowpan@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/6lowpan From 6lowpan-bounces@ietf.org Thu Nov 17 15:40:22 2005 Received: from localhost.cnri.reston.va.us ([127.0.0.1] helo=megatron.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1EcqYP-0002J5-VE; Thu, 17 Nov 2005 15:40:21 -0500 Received: from odin.ietf.org ([132.151.1.176] helo=ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1EcqYM-0002H3-20 for 6lowpan@megatron.ietf.org; Thu, 17 Nov 2005 15:40:20 -0500 Received: from ietf-mx.ietf.org (ietf-mx [132.151.6.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id PAA19357 for <6lowpan@ietf.org>; Thu, 17 Nov 2005 15:39:42 -0500 (EST) Received: from fmr20.intel.com ([134.134.136.19] helo=orsfmr005.jf.intel.com) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1Ecqq0-0008Gj-Re for 6lowpan@ietf.org; Thu, 17 Nov 2005 15:58:36 -0500 Received: from orsfmr100.jf.intel.com (orsfmr100.jf.intel.com [10.7.209.16]) by orsfmr005.jf.intel.com (8.12.10/8.12.10/d: major-outer.mc,v 1.1 2004/09/17 17:50:56 root Exp $) with ESMTP id jAHKduV6032515; Thu, 17 Nov 2005 20:39:56 GMT Received: from orsmsxvs041.jf.intel.com (orsmsxvs041.jf.intel.com [192.168.65.54]) by orsfmr100.jf.intel.com (8.12.10/8.12.10/d: major-inner.mc,v 1.2 2004/09/17 18:05:01 root Exp $) with SMTP id jAHKc9mp000568; Thu, 17 Nov 2005 20:39:56 GMT Received: from orsmsx332.amr.corp.intel.com ([192.168.65.60]) by orsmsxvs041.jf.intel.com (SAVSMTP 3.1.7.47) with SMTP id M2005111712395117427 ; Thu, 17 Nov 2005 12:39:51 -0800 Received: from orsmsx410.amr.corp.intel.com ([192.168.65.64]) by orsmsx332.amr.corp.intel.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.211); Thu, 17 Nov 2005 12:39:52 -0800 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft Exchange V6.5.7226.0 Content-class: urn:content-classes:message MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Subject: RE: [6lowpan] 6lowpan interim meeting Date: Thu, 17 Nov 2005 12:39:50 -0800 Message-ID: <9D602ABCE51B0B488BF857A4787939B506749F3D@orsmsx410> Thread-Topic: [6lowpan] 6lowpan interim meeting Thread-Index: AcXqceIUuBOrDRy6QK+DR3rlcNr7hgBN1oFw From: "Kushalnagar, Nandakishore" To: "Geoff Mulligan" , "6lowpan" <6lowpan@ietf.org> X-OriginalArrivalTime: 17 Nov 2005 20:39:52.0008 (UTC) FILETIME=[0F6A1480:01C5EBB7] X-Scanned-By: MIMEDefang 2.52 on 10.7.209.16 X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 4d87d2aa806f79fed918a62e834505ca Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Cc: X-BeenThere: 6lowpan@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: Working group discussion for IPv6 over LowPan networks <6lowpan.ietf.org> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 6lowpan-bounces@ietf.org Errors-To: 6lowpan-bounces@ietf.org Thanks Geoff. Any place is fine with me as well.=20 Is the goal to finalize and complete the two outstanding documents in the meeting? Regards, Nandu -----Original Message----- From: 6lowpan-bounces@ietf.org [mailto:6lowpan-bounces@ietf.org] On Behalf Of Geoff Mulligan Sent: Tuesday, November 15, 2005 9:51 PM To: 6lowpan Subject: [6lowpan] 6lowpan interim meeting At this last IETF a number of 6lowpan participants indicated that we should consider holding an interim meeting to spend some significant time and effort working out some of the details of the format document - the problem document should hopefully be somewhat finished before the end of this month. We have a couple of suggestions for when and where to hold the meeting: 1. In conjunction with the 802.* interim meeting in Hawaii - Jan 15 to 20. 2. Chicago either before sometime during the week of the 9th or after during the week of the 23rd. In order to hold a interim meeting we need to give something like 6 weeks notice and it need to be held like 6 week before the next ietf. January is the appropriate month. Now when and where. If we decide to hold it in or around Chicago, Invensys can sponsor the meeting site. Another option would be to volunteer Intel to sponsor it in the SF Bay area or Portland or Microsoft in Washington, though Chicago is probably most central. If we choose to coincide with IEEE in Hawaii, I can ask if we can get some meeting space in or near the IEEE meeting hotel. One other option is the during the IEEE Radio and Wireless Symposium Jan 17-19 in San Diego. Please let me know you thoughts on this ASAP. geoff _______________________________________________ 6lowpan mailing list 6lowpan@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/6lowpan _______________________________________________ 6lowpan mailing list 6lowpan@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/6lowpan From 6lowpan-bounces@ietf.org Thu Nov 17 17:58:58 2005 Received: from localhost.cnri.reston.va.us ([127.0.0.1] helo=megatron.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1EcsiY-0004o9-M1; Thu, 17 Nov 2005 17:58:58 -0500 Received: from odin.ietf.org ([132.151.1.176] helo=ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1EcsiX-0004jr-1l for 6lowpan@megatron.ietf.org; Thu, 17 Nov 2005 17:58:57 -0500 Received: from ietf-mx.ietf.org (ietf-mx [132.151.6.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id RAA02610 for <6lowpan@ietf.org>; Thu, 17 Nov 2005 17:58:20 -0500 (EST) Received: from brmea-mail-4.sun.com ([192.18.98.36]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1Ect0C-0006QL-2w for 6lowpan@ietf.org; Thu, 17 Nov 2005 18:17:14 -0500 Received: from jurassic.eng.sun.com ([129.146.226.31]) by brmea-mail-4.sun.com (8.12.10/8.12.9) with ESMTP id jAHMwpD7023754; Thu, 17 Nov 2005 15:58:51 -0700 (MST) Received: from eng.sun.com (vpn-129-150-35-134.Central.Sun.COM [129.150.35.134]) by jurassic.eng.sun.com (8.13.5+Sun/8.13.5) with ESMTP id jAHMwoou016843; Thu, 17 Nov 2005 14:58:50 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: <437D0B27.3090908@eng.sun.com> Date: Thu, 17 Nov 2005 14:58:47 -0800 From: Samita Chakrabarti User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.1; en-US; rv:1.4) Gecko/20030624 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: "Kushalnagar, Nandakishore" Subject: Re: [6lowpan] 6lowpan interim meeting References: <9D602ABCE51B0B488BF857A4787939B506749F3D@orsmsx410> In-Reply-To: <9D602ABCE51B0B488BF857A4787939B506749F3D@orsmsx410> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 6cca30437e2d04f45110f2ff8dc1b1d5 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Cc: 6lowpan <6lowpan@ietf.org> X-BeenThere: 6lowpan@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: Working group discussion for IPv6 over LowPan networks <6lowpan.ietf.org> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 6lowpan-bounces@ietf.org Errors-To: 6lowpan-bounces@ietf.org Hi Geoff, What is the primary agenda for the interim meeting? Are we expecting usual IETF goers to be present in the meeting? What would we try to accomplish out of this meeting? I assume the meeting will not be more than one-or two days. I'd prefer somewhere close by - Washington, Oregon, or even better if it is in the bay area. Thanks, -Samita Kushalnagar, Nandakishore wrote: >Thanks Geoff. Any place is fine with me as well. > >Is the goal to finalize and complete the two outstanding documents in >the meeting? > >Regards, >Nandu > >-----Original Message----- >From: 6lowpan-bounces@ietf.org [mailto:6lowpan-bounces@ietf.org] On >Behalf Of Geoff Mulligan >Sent: Tuesday, November 15, 2005 9:51 PM >To: 6lowpan >Subject: [6lowpan] 6lowpan interim meeting > >At this last IETF a number of 6lowpan participants indicated that we >should consider holding an interim meeting to spend some significant >time and effort working out some of the details of the format document - >the problem document should hopefully be somewhat finished before the >end of this month. > >We have a couple of suggestions for when and where to hold the meeting: > 1. In conjunction with the 802.* interim meeting in Hawaii - Jan 15 >to 20. > 2. Chicago either before sometime during the week of the 9th or >after during the week of the 23rd. > >In order to hold a interim meeting we need to give something like 6 >weeks notice and it need to be held like 6 week before the next ietf. >January is the appropriate month. Now when and where. > >If we decide to hold it in or around Chicago, Invensys can sponsor the >meeting site. Another option would be to volunteer Intel to sponsor it >in the SF Bay area or Portland or Microsoft in Washington, though >Chicago is probably most central. > >If we choose to coincide with IEEE in Hawaii, I can ask if we can get >some meeting space in or near the IEEE meeting hotel. > >One other option is the during the IEEE Radio and Wireless Symposium Jan >17-19 in San Diego. > >Please let me know you thoughts on this ASAP. > > geoff > > > >_______________________________________________ >6lowpan mailing list >6lowpan@ietf.org >https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/6lowpan > >_______________________________________________ >6lowpan mailing list >6lowpan@ietf.org >https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/6lowpan > > > _______________________________________________ 6lowpan mailing list 6lowpan@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/6lowpan