From nobody Mon Oct 2 06:19:30 2017 Return-Path: X-Original-To: bier@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: bier@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7998C1321DF; Mon, 2 Oct 2017 06:19:28 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -0.121 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-0.121 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_40=-0.001, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE=-0.0001, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_H3=-0.01, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_WL=-0.01, SPF_PASS=-0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (1024-bit key) header.d=juniper.net Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id Upra1zO1B4hk; Mon, 2 Oct 2017 06:19:25 -0700 (PDT) Received: from NAM03-BY2-obe.outbound.protection.outlook.com (mail-by2nam03on0090.outbound.protection.outlook.com [104.47.42.90]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 566E613462E; 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charset=utf-8; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit On 9/30/2017 5:17 AM, Xiejingrong wrote: > > Again, chap 3 describe "An MPLS label stack is then prepended to the > packet. This label stack [RFC3032] will contain one label, the > aforementioned BIER-MPLS label." > > I wonder, If the whole label stack only allow One label,  will the > ability/possibility to run over a MPLS transport-network lost ? > Once the BIER-MPLS label is pushed on, we have a packet with one label on the stack, and the BIER encapsulation is complete.  A BIER-encapsulated packet may of course be sent through an MPLS tunnel by pushing on additional labels. > I am confused, which level is BIER belong to in OSI 7-levels mode, > compared to the traditional layer 2.5 MPLS 'tunnel' ? Don't take the OSI 7-layer model too seriously. --------------D8F1C886FB862F7362295A1C Content-Type: text/html; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit On 9/30/2017 5:17 AM, Xiejingrong wrote:

Again, chap 3 describe "An MPLS label stack is then prepended to the packet. This label stack [RFC3032] will contain one label, the aforementioned BIER-MPLS label."

I wonder, If the whole label stack only allow One label,  will the ability/possibility to run over a MPLS transport-network lost ? 


Once the BIER-MPLS label is pushed on, we have a packet with one label on the stack, and the BIER encapsulation is complete.  A BIER-encapsulated packet may of course be sent through an MPLS tunnel by pushing on additional labels. 

I am confused, which level is BIER belong to in OSI 7-levels mode, compared to the traditional layer 2.5 MPLS 'tunnel' ?

Don't take the OSI 7-layer model too seriously.  

--------------D8F1C886FB862F7362295A1C-- From nobody Mon Oct 2 07:05:21 2017 Return-Path: X-Original-To: bier@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: bier@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id A112D1344B6; Mon, 2 Oct 2017 07:05:19 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -14.501 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-14.501 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_HI=-5, SPF_PASS=-0.001, USER_IN_DEF_DKIM_WL=-7.5] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (1024-bit key) header.d=cisco.com Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id Qk67JNmML6vE; Mon, 2 Oct 2017 07:05:18 -0700 (PDT) Received: from aer-iport-4.cisco.com (aer-iport-4.cisco.com [173.38.203.54]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher DHE-RSA-SEED-SHA (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 8EF9C134304; Mon, 2 Oct 2017 07:05:17 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/simple; d=cisco.com; i=@cisco.com; l=3166; q=dns/txt; s=iport; t=1506953117; x=1508162717; h=message-id:date:from:mime-version:to:subject:references: in-reply-to:content-transfer-encoding; bh=o7zO6xyKe/LTuAifRThlcgzFw18DXv2KB7qsJL7CtyU=; b=JyurV3f4GjjFrUSv/b7bPyW0UQEDUy+YnsCN4M7ePckz1T1mIAsxwPOm EQqiqKCmYdps33vopnuSLyoSnsMltY/8EXuJVpBfLhjL7kpJH1gnCJElW 1LELfP3fRRGVQi5Ft6aShmBIxFcK8VmjttQtiBrPJcFlaCh4VH0oRe2tt Y=; X-IronPort-Anti-Spam-Filtered: true X-IronPort-Anti-Spam-Result: =?us-ascii?q?A0BxAQCaRtJZ/xbLJq1bGQEBAQEBAQEBA?= =?us-ascii?q?QEBBwEBAQEBhS+EIIsTkGWYPgqFOwKFAxUBAgEBAQEBAQFrKIUYAQEBAQIBIxU?= =?us-ascii?q?vERELDgQGAgIFFgsCAgkDAgECATcOBgEMCAEBiiQIpQ+CFRKLOAEBAQEBAQEBA?= =?us-ascii?q?QEBAQEBAQEigQ6CH4NTgWqDKIgXgmEFoTKUZYIUhW+DWocslVSBOTUigQ4yIQg?= =?us-ascii?q?dFYVjHIFpPopHAQEB?= X-IronPort-AV: E=Sophos;i="5.42,469,1500940800"; d="scan'208";a="657975668" Received: from aer-iport-nat.cisco.com (HELO aer-core-3.cisco.com) ([173.38.203.22]) by aer-iport-4.cisco.com with ESMTP/TLS/DHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384; 02 Oct 2017 14:05:13 +0000 Received: from [10.147.24.18] ([10.147.24.18]) by aer-core-3.cisco.com (8.14.5/8.14.5) with ESMTP id v92E5CAj032103; Mon, 2 Oct 2017 14:05:13 GMT Message-ID: <59D2479B.8050107@cisco.com> Date: Mon, 02 Oct 2017 16:05:15 +0200 From: Peter Psenak User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Macintosh; Intel Mac OS X 10.11; rv:24.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/24.4.0 MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Alia Atlas , "bier@ietf.org" , OSPF List , draft-ietf-bier-ospf-bier-extensions@ietf.org References: In-Reply-To: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Bier] early AD review of draft-ietf-bier-ospf-bier-extensions-07 X-BeenThere: bier@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 Precedence: list List-Id: "\"Bit Indexed Explicit Replication discussion list\"" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 02 Oct 2017 14:05:20 -0000 Hi Alia, please see inline: On 27/09/17 00:12 , Alia Atlas wrote: > I have done an early AD review of > draft-ietf-bier-ospf-bier-extensions-07 in preparation for the > publication request. > > First, I would like to thank the many authors for their work on this > draft. Given that there are currently 7 authors listed, I'd recommend > appointing a few editors or otherwise reducing down to 5 or fewer. Of > course, I am also willing to consider extraordinary circumstances where > the shepherd can explain to me privately the deep technical contribution > made by each author. > > I do see a number of major issues. > > Major Issues: > > 1) RFC7684 is just for OSPFv2. How is the information carried for > OSPFv3? We need a mechanism that works for IPv6 also. BIER extension for OSPFv3 will be covered in a separate draft. It will be based on draft-ietf-ospf-ospfv3-lsa-extend draft. This is similar to what we did for SR and other extensions. > > 2) In Sec 2.1, the Length is defined as variable and the figure includes > additional sub-TLVs. Please clarify in the text what other sub-TLVs can > be carried & how the length is calculated (yes, same as always - but > clarity helps with interoperability). will change to "Variable, dependent on sub-TLVs" language as we did in SR draft. > > 3) Sec 2.2 "The size of the label range is determined by the number of Set > Identifiers (SI) (section 1 of [I-D.ietf-bier-architecture]) that > are used in the network. Each SI maps to a single label in the > label range. The first label is for SI=0, the second label is for > SI=1, etc.: > > This implies that there is no way to indicate only a label for SI=1 or a > range for SI=1 to 3. That seems unfortunate and assumes that the BFR-ids > are always allocated from SI=0 up. Is there a reason not to use some > of the reserved bits to indicate the starting SI value? I hope this has been clarified by Andrew and Tony already. > > 4) Sec 2.3: The Tree type is a 1 octet value - that doesn't appear to > have any IANA allocation or meaning clearly indicated - beyond the > parenthetical that 0=SPF. Please fix this. will add description for value 0. Will also add the need for new registry in "IANA Considerations" section. > > 5) Sec 2.5: This section could benefit greatly from a diagram - showing > the advertising router for a prefix, the ABR, and what is then flooded > for the BIER MPLS Sub-TLV for the new areas. can you please clarify what type of diagram do you have in mind? I tend to agree with Andrew that we have similar section in many other documents and we've never included any diagram really. Anyway, I don't have a problem adding it if it helps. > > Minor: > > 4) Sec 2.3: "Label Range Base: A 3 octet field, where the 20 rightmost > bits represent the first label in the label range." What about the top > 4 bits? Are they Must Be Zero (MBZ)? How about making that explicit? > Are they potential future flags?/ top for bits are ignored. I'll spell that out explicitly. thanks, Peter > > Thanks, > Alia From nobody Mon Oct 2 07:21:55 2017 Return-Path: X-Original-To: bier@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: bier@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id B9B37134654; Mon, 2 Oct 2017 07:21:47 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.998 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.998 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE=-0.0001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=gmail.com Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id HkXahFgjPeQ8; Mon, 2 Oct 2017 07:21:45 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail-wr0-x232.google.com (mail-wr0-x232.google.com [IPv6:2a00:1450:400c:c0c::232]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id D50A5134660; Mon, 2 Oct 2017 07:21:40 -0700 (PDT) Received: by mail-wr0-x232.google.com with SMTP id k62so4074470wrc.9; Mon, 02 Oct 2017 07:21:40 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20161025; h=mime-version:in-reply-to:references:from:date:message-id:subject:to :cc; bh=aFhG8ZLrZo4Fu28VW5XKpxlrVkvbcwlQWmwlz08NLio=; b=c9+wdwi03HnSRvx1Q/8944Zs5AR+CV3QUVvE1tg6tJR39+yMGQJANejVxWrekXmEd4 x7MxQlnr3YQGxqvuA+b0FTB3Do0d6GGLDVpntDKNXP31pZur7aPsiZkKQBFScdCsOyiM CMlMA/6686KFZ9EFiVQ+sX8kLKZAUDsYWPc6K+AteDWeQZRygtWDT6ryaZMPCxQkH4Zl +BhjX/7hgyX0GyfAsgmxTXhAyhgkJo6zzaMo+c9y4V9TjJRukgsX5Tw7MUS9fBstcI/u ARxECN3A9YeA9vcOnPF7lNC9X5tFu9S15dx0Ws1QTrcnd0knl47V9bf7fa0xRhmwUz8a 0abA== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:in-reply-to:references:from:date :message-id:subject:to:cc; bh=aFhG8ZLrZo4Fu28VW5XKpxlrVkvbcwlQWmwlz08NLio=; b=H/W1zaQrd920bvyfFuWInFYl7v194aniyWDaJukEOmDaLVaoqx2vESCaNqGSOCkteF HJuoPHcLDFUzfUAb+VtXmjdkhn6OdN+MPLqgTFC4+FdMf4+cRKT4LmGJZ0G9iyUKBud3 PZog+FckVkQBNsijmGjafLj0tggc3hFvrcSgsBNyXbLBuWeHWzuA90x4QQQrSvUyjhip Y8/cnCQafncsHFexVd2eJY0rp0qVjHNuUvv9jM9Ne71ijEbhqX9D/L7OJsoHPV62xPlx RkLOk/qYfsYtI8i0raG8t0NAsO7Alh3Xl/Tp1yoojtIc2r+oGXlJkqBYWeSIzaIk9eiz J3ww== X-Gm-Message-State: AMCzsaVGW9zJbCgsiW72Puuuicsx211kGR5k7WyCjQ9xPGso4I565LBb XErxrS5OWRnFqojMx1X4BXHJTO/BRkufWDMMzwC0Ww== X-Google-Smtp-Source: AOwi7QAiD10ldmtGJU+PpRfA+3b+FGTQ4kZdo56YhLUEeVhbhY1u/ZSTrpz59ULjRrTCYBOFMVijc7Wo4LYVIwShGlY= X-Received: by 10.223.196.199 with SMTP id o7mr500760wrf.119.1506954099214; Mon, 02 Oct 2017 07:21:39 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 Received: by 10.223.193.68 with HTTP; Mon, 2 Oct 2017 07:21:38 -0700 (PDT) In-Reply-To: <0E80CAB4-D769-4912-B432-99E48CC92143@juniper.net> References: <0E80CAB4-D769-4912-B432-99E48CC92143@juniper.net> From: Alia Atlas Date: Mon, 2 Oct 2017 10:21:38 -0400 Message-ID: To: Antoni Przygienda Cc: "bier@ietf.org" , "isis-wg@ietf.org" , "draft-ietf-bier-isis-extensions@ietf.org" Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="f403045fa464c6eba0055a911748" Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Bier] early AD review of draft-ietf-bier-isis-extensions-05 X-BeenThere: bier@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 Precedence: list List-Id: "\"Bit Indexed Explicit Replication discussion list\"" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 02 Oct 2017 14:21:48 -0000 --f403045fa464c6eba0055a911748 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Hi Tony, On Tue, Sep 26, 2017 at 11:10 PM, Antoni Przygienda wrote= : > > > 2) Sec 5.1: This section has concern about restricting the advertisement > of BIER information in IS-IS for scalability - but it doesn't discuss at > all when a router would stop advertising the BIER sub-TLVs. It feels lik= e > the section is hunting for a bit of a manageability or operational > considerations section. I'm not comfortable with the interoperability > issues posed by not indicating what triggers should cause advertisements = or > withdrawals. Receiving an advertisement from a BFER seems like a > reasonable trigger to me, since it indicates an active receiver for the > . > > > > Have to disagree to large extent: > > a) Section is basically saying =E2=80=9Cit=E2=80=99s outside the sco= pe of this doc > but here=E2=80=99s a couple of hints=E2=80=9D. We should probably say =E2= =80=9Cthose are all _ > *optional*_ extensions=E2=80=9D. We may be better off moving it into =E2= =80=9Coperational > considerations=E2=80=9D section, that=E2=80=99s true. > > b) Suggested trigger is possible one but smarter ones are possible, > e.g. a node may know it=E2=80=99s not on any BIER computed tree (SPF or o= ther) and > save memory by not advertising. All that are implementation techniques an= d > the draft is kind of overspecifying here a bit. > > c) I don=E2=80=99t see how any _*valid*_ trigger will cause interope= rability > problems with other possible triggers. > > > > In summary, let=E2=80=99s say =E2=80=9Cit=E2=80=99s all optional=E2=80=9D= and generate an =E2=80=9Coperational > considerations=E2=80=9D section with this text? > Sure - that's fine. > 3) Sec 5.5 contradicts the last paragraph in Sec 2.1.1.1 in > draft-ietf-bier-mpls-encapsulation-08 which says" Note that in practice, > labels only have to be assigned if they are > going to be used. If a particular BIER domain supports BSLs 256 and > 512, but some SD, say SD 1, only uses BSL 256, then it is not > necessary to assign labels that correspond to the combination of SD 1 > and BSL 512." > > > > > > Actually, I don=E2=80=99t think so. The encaps draft talks about BIER _*d= omain*_ > doing 256+512 while _*sub*_domain_1 does only 256. The ISIS draft talks > about the _*sub*_domain, i.e. in a subdomain everyone must advertise > enough labels for BSLs they support while in a _*domain*_ each _ > *subdomain*_ may do different things. Observe that we have the future > capability of converting BSLs in a subdomain and it may come handy later > (we can send smaller BMLs if we see lots zeroes or bunch things up togeth= er > if we see really small BSLs flying or support BSL migration in a > subdomain). For now we don=E2=80=99t have conversion and with that we may= blackhole > if people disagree on the BSLs they support in a subdomain. > Ok - I see the contradiction between the drafts. If ISIS and OSPFv2 both implement it as needing to allocate all the labels, then it's not a tragedy. It would be nice to clean up the wording in Sec 2.1.1.1 of draft-ietf-mpls-encapsulation-08 to clarify that this is just a potential optimization (or simply remove it). > 4) Sec 5.6: "A valid BFR-id MUST be unique within the flooding scope of > the BIER advertisments." This doesn't leave scope for expanding to > inter-area in the future because the issue is not the flooding scope but > rather the distribution. > > > > ? within the scope the BFR-ids must be unique per BFER says it all. I > think that=E2=80=99s consistent with any scope, inter-, intra- or planeta= ry reach =E2=80=A6 > ;-) > > Ah - sure BFR-ids unique per BFER is fine of course. The flooding scope is less than that. > 5) Sec 6.1: " The sub-TLV advertises a single combination followe= d > by > optional sub-sub-TLVs as described in the following sections." > > The figure and field descriptions do not include the MT-ID. There is > clearly the reserved octet intended for that?? > > > > Nope. ISIS MT is built very, very cleanly in this respect, i.e. the TLVs > are all already annotated and provide the MT scope. Hence it doesn=E2=80= =99t show > up anywhere here. Did I say ISIS is very, very clean when it comes to MT = ;-) > Now you see how long it's been since I looked at MT for IS-IS! Thanks for the correction. > 6) Sec 6.2: This section needs to clearly define the relationship > between the labels and the Set Index in the specified . It's als= o > unclear whether it is better to advertise all the labels ever needed or b= e > able to advertise only labels for a particular sequential number of SIs. > The restriction that only one sub-sub-TLV with the same BitStringLength > makes that impossible (but so does the lack of explicit starting SI). > > > > That goes far back. We agreed to use a set-0-based range covering all > BFR-ids. IGP TLVs are scarce resource and it makes for a much simpler > processing on computation. Labels are not _*that*_ scarce given how many > routers we cover by each label. I don=E2=80=99t think we=E2=80=99ll move= that. > Ok as far as advertising all labels - but please add text defining the relationship between labels and Set Index. 7) Sec 6.3: The values for the Length & Tree Type field need to be clearer > after the figure. Also, is Tree Type an IANA-managed field?? I don't se= e > it in the IANA considerations. Ca it be different between IS-IS and OSPF= ? > > > > Good catch, needs adding in IANA section. > > > > Another one: > > > > 6.4 is possibly underspecified. It should explicitly state that \cap_C > implies that the router can convert only between _*all*_ the BSLs that it > advertises (and not any arbitrary downstream BSL from it). > That would be helpful. It's quite unspecified as to what it does/can do or how it would be turned on. Thanks, Alia --f403045fa464c6eba0055a911748 Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Hi Tony,

On Tue, Sep 26, 2017 at 11:10 PM, Antoni Przygienda <prz@juniper.net= > wrote:

=C2=A0

2) Sec 5.1: This section = has concern about restricting the advertisement of BIER information in IS-I= S for scalability - but it doesn't discuss at all when a router would s= top advertising the BIER sub-TLVs.=C2=A0 It feels like the section is hunting for a bit of a manageability or operational co= nsiderations section.=C2=A0 I'm not comfortable with the interoperabili= ty issues posed by not indicating what triggers should cause advertisements= or withdrawals.=C2=A0 =C2=A0Receiving an advertisement from a BFER seems like a reasonable trigger to me, since it indicates an a= ctive receiver for the <MT, SD>.

=C2=A0

Have to disagree to large = extent:

a)=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 Section is basically = saying =E2=80=9Cit=E2=80=99s outside the scope of this doc but here=E2=80= =99s a couple of hints=E2=80=9D. We should probably say =E2=80=9Cthose are = all _optional_ extensions=E2=80=9D. We may be better off moving it i= nto =E2=80=9Coperational considerations=E2=80=9D section, that=E2=80=99s true.

b)=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 Suggested trigger is = possible one but smarter ones are possible, e.g. a node may know it=E2=80= =99s not on any BIER computed tree (SPF or other) and save memory by not ad= vertising. All that are implementation techniques and the draft is kind of overspecifying here a bit. <= /p>

c)=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 I don=E2=80=99t see h= ow any _valid_ trigger will cause interoperability problems with oth= er possible triggers.

=C2=A0

In summary, let=E2=80=99s = say =E2=80=9Cit=E2=80=99s all optional=E2=80=9D and generate an =E2=80=9Cop= erational considerations=E2=80=9D section with this text? =C2=A0

=

Sure - that's fine.= =C2=A0=C2=A0
=C2=A0

3) Sec 5.5 contradicts th= e last paragraph in Sec 2.1.1.1 in draft-ietf-bier-mpls-encapsulation-= 08 which says" Note that in practice, labels only have to be assigned = if they are
=C2=A0 =C2=A0going to be used.=C2=A0 If a particular BIER domain supports B= SLs 256 and
=C2=A0 =C2=A0512, but some SD, say SD 1, only uses BSL 256, then it is not<= br> =C2=A0 =C2=A0necessary to assign labels that correspond to the combination = of SD 1
=C2=A0 =C2=A0and BSL 512."

=C2=A0

=C2=A0

Actually, I don=E2=80=99t = think so. The encaps draft talks about BIER _domain_ doing 256+512 w= hile _sub_domain_1 does only 256. The ISIS draft talks about the _sub_domain, i.e. in a subdomain everyone must advertise enough labels for =C2=A0BSLs they support while in a _do= main_ each _subdomain_ may do different things. Observe that we = have the future capability of converting BSLs in a subdomain and it may com= e handy later (we can send smaller BMLs if we see lots zeroes or bunch things up together if we see really small B= SLs flying or support BSL migration in a subdomain). For now we don=E2=80= =99t have conversion and with that we may blackhole if people disagree on t= he BSLs they support in a subdomain.


Ok - I see the contradiction between the drafts.=C2= =A0 If ISIS and OSPFv2 both implement it as needing to allocate all the lab= els, then it's not a tragedy.=C2=A0 It would be nice to clean up the wo= rding in Sec 2.1.1.1 of draft-ietf-mpls-encapsulation-08 to clarify that th= is is just a potential optimization (or simply remove it).
=C2=A0=

4) Sec 5.6:=C2=A0"A = valid BFR-id MUST be unique within the flooding scope of the BIER advertism= ents."=C2=A0 This doesn't leave scope for expanding to inter-area = in the future because the issue is not the flooding scope but rather the distribution.

=C2=A0

? within the scope = the BFR-ids must be unique per BFER says it all. I think that=E2=80=99s con= sistent with any scope, inter-, intra- or planetary reach =E2=80=A6 ;-)<= /u>

<= /div>

Ah - sure BFR-ids unique per BF= ER is fine of course.=C2=A0 The flooding scope is less than that.=C2=A0
=C2=A0=C2=A0

5) Sec 6.1:=C2=A0" T= he sub-TLV advertises a single <MT,SD> combination followed by
=C2=A0 =C2=A0optional sub-sub-TLVs as described in the following sections.&= quot;

The figure and field desc= riptions do not include the MT-ID.=C2=A0 There is clearly the reserved octe= t intended for that??=C2=A0=C2=A0

=C2=A0

Nope. ISIS MT is built ver= y, very cleanly in this respect, i.e. the TLVs are all already annotated an= d provide the MT scope. Hence it doesn=E2=80=99t show up anywhere here. Did= I say ISIS is very, very clean when it comes to MT ;-)


Now= you see how long it's been since I looked at MT for IS-IS!=C2=A0 Thank= s for the correction.
=C2=A0
=

=C2=A06) Sec 6.2:=C2=A0 This section needs to= clearly define the relationship between the labels and the Set Index in th= e specified <MT, SD>.=C2=A0 It's also unclear whether it is bette= r to advertise all the labels ever needed or be able to advertise only labels for a particular sequential number of = SIs.=C2=A0 =C2=A0The restriction that only one sub-sub-TLV with the same Bi= tStringLength makes that impossible (but so does the lack of explicit start= ing SI).

=C2=A0

That goes far back. We agr= eed to use a set-0-based range covering all BFR-ids. IGP TLVs are scarce re= source and it makes for a much simpler processing on computation. Labels ar= e not _that_ scarce given how many routers we cover by each label.=C2=A0 I don=E2=80=99t think we=E2=80= =99ll move that.


Ok as far as advertising all labels - but please add text defining the r= elationship between labels and Set Index.=C2=A0

7) Sec 6.3: The values fo= r the Length & Tree Type field need to be clearer after the figure.=C2= =A0 Also, is Tree Type an IANA-managed field??=C2=A0 I don't see it in = the IANA considerations.=C2=A0 Ca it be different between IS-IS and OSPF?

=C2=A0

Good catch, needs adding i= n IANA section.

=C2=A0

Another one:

=C2=A0

6.4 is possibly underspeci= fied. It should explicitly state that \cap_C implies that the router can co= nvert only between _all_ the BSLs that it advertises (and not any ar= bitrary downstream BSL from it).

<= div>
That would be helpful.=C2=A0 It's quite unspecified = as to what it does/can do or how it would be turned on.

Thanks,=C2=A0
Alia

--f403045fa464c6eba0055a911748-- From nobody Mon Oct 2 07:41:26 2017 Return-Path: X-Original-To: bier@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: bier@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id E0DB71344DB; Mon, 2 Oct 2017 07:41:24 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.698 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.698 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW=-0.7, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=gmail.com Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id XbS4vmBGdVPc; Mon, 2 Oct 2017 07:41:22 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail-wm0-x235.google.com (mail-wm0-x235.google.com [IPv6:2a00:1450:400c:c09::235]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 9F3371344B6; Mon, 2 Oct 2017 07:41:22 -0700 (PDT) Received: by mail-wm0-x235.google.com with SMTP id e195so7329849wma.5; Mon, 02 Oct 2017 07:41:22 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20161025; h=mime-version:in-reply-to:references:from:date:message-id:subject:to :cc; bh=yeOQVztfMMa5/lyM2liUSUYWfe6qea9HzfM+PF+trac=; b=a0NLPuNX4f/HYJZPRbu82cM/OEvGvcBBnUcLHX45aZ+WBJWV8p6LKhNYpF7QPx+Hdt JYKCleS9lIY7arQi5LHKY6HvsB52lOVkxihteaOk4L+TLFVwJrOURfPlbWRpcHVp8LxZ NGSoZPDQs003p5UmSOEyjk7Ub5A3kFWPlgi7wcdYtAIJPIsp0uDXflKDjA9rcAcpKPzJ aY2R4n/hKLdHm7dVtRp/1LF91bLKlxtwPMC72HqeR+FLg+SqCmADyFa6/aQLRrcbc2rV t7hhEOhna1eOW+ApFRc7+KgKIr2oFU7j1UekX8RADFtDWjFKtaygTnVUnnSpO7gPtBF9 kFJw== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:in-reply-to:references:from:date :message-id:subject:to:cc; bh=yeOQVztfMMa5/lyM2liUSUYWfe6qea9HzfM+PF+trac=; b=YQxxv8py+H7d0gjMmT2qxibGAJqAllxhCfXOvH0IWJsr+q0BDxCnci5Cy72iGfAbzw 1UmSq+cUNRv3Je1QrRzIzBbvHh8uvTxiG+aYv+93X8FLmAkl5enWoLXHxg7XNg8L+xrP sxqzlkpfJWGcrxTmqgrG1WcXkCP5qPJtWT8A38jFJAQN+Bcp9jh06JeW7EzzY9tJ3N6L 0xdwX5uUG06osvvvCwflcEXsSXtCtuW5UcSRRaXbp9IEQoLz4dI8jRwKn39b3Day/2UU q4LM78bokRa+ROp340Id+vS5nG0U2leb8Q/9MJ4ll0sfIffTdaulZklsitbAOgLiVNCe y5dQ== X-Gm-Message-State: AMCzsaVc2oM3zWGW2wXfSzn+qPoCv9PPDSzVwZ5MVNizGkHo5sse/SV4 0KKaRRDpM9XtOl9DscFjwDMi6CO0zrd703ktusc= X-Google-Smtp-Source: AOwi7QCfpXRczCXwa8DBMt9OcKMFGKKYaKn9zCmokNlASXBWTztnFUsNnbUMIsdXZcVaYCwTaPFlOnJj+0/vYebL6yY= X-Received: by 10.28.228.213 with SMTP id b204mr10434993wmh.157.1506955280781; Mon, 02 Oct 2017 07:41:20 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 Received: by 10.223.193.68 with HTTP; Mon, 2 Oct 2017 07:41:20 -0700 (PDT) In-Reply-To: <59D2479B.8050107@cisco.com> References: <59D2479B.8050107@cisco.com> From: Alia Atlas Date: Mon, 2 Oct 2017 10:41:20 -0400 Message-ID: To: Peter Psenak Cc: "bier@ietf.org" , OSPF List , draft-ietf-bier-ospf-bier-extensions@ietf.org Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="001a114b0be234181a055a915ec5" Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Bier] early AD review of draft-ietf-bier-ospf-bier-extensions-07 X-BeenThere: bier@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 Precedence: list List-Id: "\"Bit Indexed Explicit Replication discussion list\"" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 02 Oct 2017 14:41:25 -0000 --001a114b0be234181a055a915ec5 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Hi Peter, On Mon, Oct 2, 2017 at 10:05 AM, Peter Psenak wrote: > Hi Alia, > > please see inline: > > > On 27/09/17 00:12 , Alia Atlas wrote: > >> I have done an early AD review of >> draft-ietf-bier-ospf-bier-extensions-07 in preparation for the >> publication request. >> >> First, I would like to thank the many authors for their work on this >> draft. Given that there are currently 7 authors listed, I'd recommend >> appointing a few editors or otherwise reducing down to 5 or fewer. Of >> course, I am also willing to consider extraordinary circumstances where >> the shepherd can explain to me privately the deep technical contribution >> made by each author. >> >> I do see a number of major issues. >> >> Major Issues: >> >> 1) RFC7684 is just for OSPFv2. How is the information carried for >> OSPFv3? We need a mechanism that works for IPv6 also. >> > > BIER extension for OSPFv3 will be covered in a separate draft. It will be > based on draft-ietf-ospf-ospfv3-lsa-extend draft. This is similar to what > we did for SR and other extensions. I understand that theory - but I think it is getting less tractable. How far along is that draft? I'll need to at least reference it and discuss the IPv6 support in the write-up. Once draft-ietf-ospfv3-lsa-extend is published as an RFC, I would really expect this to stop happening. I don't know if you noticed that draft-ietf-sunset4-ipv6-ietf-01 ("IETF: End Work on IPv4") is in IETF Last Call. Of course, it has lots of caveats and is getting a number of concerned comments - but the trend is obvious as is the deployment of IPv6 and the need for feature parity. > 2) In Sec 2.1, the Length is defined as variable and the figure includes >> additional sub-TLVs. Please clarify in the text what other sub-TLVs can >> be carried & how the length is calculated (yes, same as always - but >> clarity helps with interoperability). >> > > will change to "Variable, dependent on sub-TLVs" language as we did in SR > draft. Sounds good - Variable, 4 + length of sub-TLVs I think. I.e., be clear on the length contributed by this TLV as well as the included sub-TLVs. > 3) Sec 2.2 "The size of the label range is determined by the number of Set >> Identifiers (SI) (section 1 of [I-D.ietf-bier-architecture]) that >> are used in the network. Each SI maps to a single label in the >> label range. The first label is for SI=0, the second label is for >> SI=1, etc.: >> >> This implies that there is no way to indicate only a label for SI=1 or a >> range for SI=1 to 3. That seems unfortunate and assumes that the BFR-ids >> are always allocated from SI=0 up. Is there a reason not to use some >> of the reserved bits to indicate the starting SI value? >> > > I hope this has been clarified by Andrew and Tony already. Sure - I'm fine with what the WG wants here - and labels aren't too limited. My concern was about efficiency and future flexibility. > >> 4) Sec 2.3: The Tree type is a 1 octet value - that doesn't appear to >> have any IANA allocation or meaning clearly indicated - beyond the >> parenthetical that 0=SPF. Please fix this. >> > > will add description for value 0. Will also add the need for new registry > in "IANA Considerations" section. Cool - unless there's a reason, could it be a BIER-related registry that both the IS-IS work and OSPF work can refer to? > >> 5) Sec 2.5: This section could benefit greatly from a diagram - showing >> the advertising router for a prefix, the ABR, and what is then flooded >> for the BIER MPLS Sub-TLV for the new areas. >> > > can you please clarify what type of diagram do you have in mind? > A fairly simple one :-) where there are 3 areas - with the middle being the backbone. Have a BFER in each area. Describe what is advertised by each BFER and then by the ABR. > I tend to agree with Andrew that we have similar section in many other > documents and we've never included any diagram really. Anyway, I don't have > a problem adding it if it helps. Frankly, the language/phrasing was such that I had to stop and think about it for 5 minutes or so to be confident that I understood and agreed with what was there. That's generally my sign that added clarity could be useful - but it could just be me or a bad day. > >> Minor: >> >> 4) Sec 2.3: "Label Range Base: A 3 octet field, where the 20 rightmost >> bits represent the first label in the label range." What about the top >> 4 bits? Are they Must Be Zero (MBZ)? How about making that explicit? >> Are they potential future flags?/ >> > > top for bits are ignored. I'll spell that out explicitly. > Sounds good. I look forward to getting these from the WG. If I can put them into IETF Last Call by the end of the week, then we can have them on the Oct 26 telechat and hopefully approved before IETF 100. Regards, Alia > thanks, > Peter > > >> Thanks, >> Alia >> > > --001a114b0be234181a055a915ec5 Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Hi Peter,

On Mon, Oct 2, 2017 at 10:05 AM, Peter Psenak <ppsenak@cisco.= com> wrote:
Hi Alia,

please see inline:


On 27/09/17 00:12 , Alia Atlas wrote:
I have done an early AD review of
draft-ietf-bier-ospf-bier-extensions-07 in preparation for the
publication request.

First, I would like to thank the many authors for their work on this
draft. Given that there are currently 7 authors listed, I'd recommend appointing a few editors or otherwise reducing down to 5 or fewer. Of
course, I am also willing to consider extraordinary circumstances where
the shepherd can explain to me privately the deep technical contribution made by each author.

I do see a number of major issues.

Major Issues:

1)=C2=A0 RFC7684 is just for OSPFv2.=C2=A0 How is the information carried f= or
OSPFv3? We need a mechanism that works for IPv6 also.

 BIER extension for OSPFv3 will be covered in a separate draft. It will be b= ased on draft-ietf-ospf-ospfv3-lsa-extend draft. This is similar to wh= at we did for SR and other extensions.

I un= derstand that theory - but I think it is getting less tractable.=C2=A0 How = far along is that draft? I'll need to at least
reference it a= nd discuss the IPv6 support in the write-up.=C2=A0 Once draft-ietf-ospfv3-l= sa-extend is published as an RFC, I would really expect this to stop happen= ing.

I don't know if you noticed that=C2=A0dra= ft-ietf-sunset4-ipv6-ietf-01 ("IETF: End Work on IPv4") is in IET= F Last Call.
Of course, it has lots of caveats and is getting a n= umber of concerned comments - but the trend is obvious
as is the = deployment of IPv6 and the need for feature parity.
=C2=A0
2) In Sec 2.1, the Length is defined as variable and the figure includes additional sub-TLVs. Please clarify in the text what other sub-TLVs can
be carried & how the length is calculated (yes, same as always - but clarity helps with interoperability).

 will change to "Variable, dependent on sub-TLVs" language as we d= id in SR draft.

Sounds good - Variable, 4 += length of sub-TLVs=C2=A0 I think.=C2=A0 I.e., be clear on the length
=
contributed by this TLV as well as the included sub-TLVs.
= =C2=A0
3) Sec 2.2 "The size= of the label range is determined by the number of Set
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0Identifiers (SI) (section 1 of [I-D.ietf-bier-ar= chitecture]) that
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0are used in the network.=C2=A0 Each SI maps to a= single label in the
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0label range.=C2=A0 The first label is for SI=3D0= , the second label is for
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0SI=3D1, etc.:

This implies that there is no way to indicate only a label for SI=3D1 or a<= br> range for SI=3D1 to 3. That seems unfortunate and assumes that the BFR-ids<= br> are always allocated from SI=3D0 up.=C2=A0 =C2=A0Is there a reason not to u= se some
of the reserved bits to indicate the starting SI value?

 I hope this has been clarified by Andrew and Tony already.

Sure - I'm fine with what the WG wants here - and label= s aren't too limited. My concern
was about efficiency and fut= ure flexibility.
=C2=A0

4) Sec 2.3: The Tree type is a 1 octet value - that doesn't appear to have any IANA allocation or meaning clearly indicated - beyond the
parenthetical that 0=3DSPF.=C2=A0 Please fix this.

 will add description for value 0. Will also add the need for new registry i= n "IANA Considerations" section.

= Cool - unless there's a reason, could it be a BIER-related registry tha= t both the IS-IS work and OSPF work
can refer to?=C2=A0
=C2=A0

5) Sec 2.5: This section could benefit greatly from a diagram - showing
the advertising router for a prefix, the ABR, and what is then flooded
for the BIER MPLS Sub-TLV for the new areas.

 can you please clarify what type of diagram do you have in mind?

A fairly simple one :-) where there are 3 areas -= with the middle being the backbone.
Have a BFER in each area.=C2= =A0 Describe what is advertised by each BFER and then by
the ABR.=
=C2=A0=C2=A0
I tend to agree with Andrew that we have similar section in many other docu= ments and we've never included any diagram really. Anyway, I don't = have a problem adding it if it helps.

Frank= ly, the language/phrasing was such that I had to stop and think about it fo= r 5 minutes or so to be
confident that I understood and agreed wi= th what was there.=C2=A0 That's generally my sign that added clarity
could be useful - but it could just be me or a bad day.=C2=A0
=

=C2=A0

Minor:

4) Sec 2.3: "Label Range Base: A 3 octet field, where the 20 rightmost=
bits represent the first label in the label range."=C2=A0 What about t= he top
4 bits?=C2=A0 Are they Must Be Zero (MBZ)?=C2=A0 How about making that expl= icit?
Are they potential future flags?/

 top for bits are ignored. I'll spell that out explicitly.

Sounds good.

I look forward= to getting these from the WG.=C2=A0 If I can put them into IETF Last Call = by the end of the
week, then we can have them on the Oct 26 telec= hat and hopefully approved before IETF 100.

Regard= s,
Alia=C2=A0
=C2=A0
thanks,
Peter


Thanks,
Alia


--001a114b0be234181a055a915ec5-- From nobody Mon Oct 2 08:07:53 2017 Return-Path: X-Original-To: bier@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: bier@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8A5B1132076; Mon, 2 Oct 2017 08:07:45 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -14.5 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-14.5 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_HI=-5, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001, USER_IN_DEF_DKIM_WL=-7.5] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (1024-bit key) header.d=cisco.com Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id VNBVZDAfClwx; Mon, 2 Oct 2017 08:07:43 -0700 (PDT) Received: from aer-iport-1.cisco.com (aer-iport-1.cisco.com [173.38.203.51]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher DHE-RSA-SEED-SHA (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id F3B281345C1; Mon, 2 Oct 2017 08:07:37 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/simple; d=cisco.com; i=@cisco.com; l=6649; q=dns/txt; s=iport; t=1506956858; x=1508166458; h=message-id:date:from:mime-version:to:cc:subject: references:in-reply-to:content-transfer-encoding; bh=9ANN4PSt07Q1HdqBa/kQq+IitY9cnohxfDm656Uv5fw=; b=K8Ws2Cgm6BdB37G6qlsdFroFKepawoWig5oUqcxzDkU7v6evXs4uhsEW 5HZbJicO4qgKq4jH8f28F+Da4QOdYeQzcZ6386HIbCvbU6iM/yfOzbCO0 +w2O8C3Kzc5LmL/4SF9N6LgddEyFMBklqY/su5dIAq3KGyxnEcZSnmxlL s=; X-IronPort-Anti-Spam-Filtered: true X-IronPort-Anti-Spam-Result: =?us-ascii?q?A0COAAAFVdJZ/xbLJq1bGQEBAQEBAQEBA?= =?us-ascii?q?QEBBwEBAQEBgzCBfyeDeYofdJBlliyCEgqFOwKFABgBAgEBAQEBAQFrKIUYAQE?= =?us-ascii?q?BAQIBIxUvEQEQCw4EBgICBRYIAwICCQMCAQIBNAMOBg0BBQIBAYokCKVAghUSi?= =?us-ascii?q?y0BAQEBAQEBAQEBAQEBAQEBAQEBH4EOgh+DU4FpAYMohF2DOoJhBZhYiFqUZYI?= =?us-ascii?q?UhW+DWocslVSBOR84gQ4yIQgdFYVjHIFpPjaHToJDAQEB?= X-IronPort-AV: E=Sophos;i="5.42,469,1500940800"; d="scan'208";a="697702993" Received: from aer-iport-nat.cisco.com (HELO aer-core-4.cisco.com) ([173.38.203.22]) by aer-iport-1.cisco.com with ESMTP/TLS/DHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384; 02 Oct 2017 15:07:33 +0000 Received: from [10.147.24.18] ([10.147.24.18]) by aer-core-4.cisco.com (8.14.5/8.14.5) with ESMTP id v92F7WJB025742; Mon, 2 Oct 2017 15:07:33 GMT Message-ID: <59D25637.7010409@cisco.com> Date: Mon, 02 Oct 2017 17:07:35 +0200 From: Peter Psenak User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Macintosh; Intel Mac OS X 10.11; rv:24.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/24.4.0 MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Alia Atlas CC: "bier@ietf.org" , OSPF List , draft-ietf-bier-ospf-bier-extensions@ietf.org References: <59D2479B.8050107@cisco.com> In-Reply-To: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Bier] early AD review of draft-ietf-bier-ospf-bier-extensions-07 X-BeenThere: bier@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 Precedence: list List-Id: "\"Bit Indexed Explicit Replication discussion list\"" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 02 Oct 2017 15:07:46 -0000 Hi Alia, please see inline: On 02/10/17 16:41 , Alia Atlas wrote: > Hi Peter, > > On Mon, Oct 2, 2017 at 10:05 AM, Peter Psenak > wrote: > > Hi Alia, > > please see inline: > > > On 27/09/17 00:12 , Alia Atlas wrote: > > I have done an early AD review of > draft-ietf-bier-ospf-bier-extensions-07 in preparation for the > publication request. > > First, I would like to thank the many authors for their work on this > draft. Given that there are currently 7 authors listed, I'd > recommend > appointing a few editors or otherwise reducing down to 5 or > fewer. Of > course, I am also willing to consider extraordinary > circumstances where > the shepherd can explain to me privately the deep technical > contribution > made by each author. > > I do see a number of major issues. > > Major Issues: > > 1) RFC7684 is just for OSPFv2. How is the information carried for > OSPFv3? We need a mechanism that works for IPv6 also. > > > BIER extension for OSPFv3 will be covered in a separate draft. It > will be based on draft-ietf-ospf-ospfv3-lsa-extend draft. This is > similar to what we did for SR and other extensions. > > > I understand that theory - but I think it is getting less tractable. > How far along is that draft? I'll need to at least > reference it and discuss the IPv6 support in the write-up. Once > draft-ietf-ospfv3-lsa-extend is published as an RFC, I would really > expect this to stop happening. given that the encoding of the OSPFv3 is way different to OSPFv2 and the fact that the draft-ietf-ospfv3-lsa-extend is still a work in progress I would tend to keep the v2 and v3 extensions separate. When you say "discuss the IPv6 support in the write-up" do you mean to mention it in draft-ietf-bier-ospf-bier-extensions? If yes, why? This documents only specifies OSPFv2 extension. > > I don't know if you noticed that draft-ietf-sunset4-ipv6-ietf-01 ("IETF: > End Work on IPv4") is in IETF Last Call. > Of course, it has lots of caveats and is getting a number of concerned > comments - but the trend is obvious > as is the deployment of IPv6 and the need for feature parity. not that I disagree, but let's not get into that discussion here :) > > 2) In Sec 2.1, the Length is defined as variable and the figure > includes > additional sub-TLVs. Please clarify in the text what other > sub-TLVs can > be carried & how the length is calculated (yes, same as always - but > clarity helps with interoperability). > > > will change to "Variable, dependent on sub-TLVs" language as we did > in SR draft. > > > Sounds good - Variable, 4 + length of sub-TLVs I think. I.e., be clear > on the length > contributed by this TLV as well as the included sub-TLVs. not that I care too much, but I would like to keep the language same between documents. Unless you insist otherwise, keeping the "Variable, dependent on sub-TLVs" would make it consistent with other docs. > > 3) Sec 2.2 "The size of the label range is determined by the > number of Set > Identifiers (SI) (section 1 of > [I-D.ietf-bier-architecture]) that > are used in the network. Each SI maps to a single label > in the > label range. The first label is for SI=0, the second > label is for > SI=1, etc.: > > This implies that there is no way to indicate only a label for > SI=1 or a > range for SI=1 to 3. That seems unfortunate and assumes that the > BFR-ids > are always allocated from SI=0 up. Is there a reason not to > use some > of the reserved bits to indicate the starting SI value? > > > I hope this has been clarified by Andrew and Tony already. > > > Sure - I'm fine with what the WG wants here - and labels aren't too > limited. My concern > was about efficiency and future flexibility. > > > 4) Sec 2.3: The Tree type is a 1 octet value - that doesn't > appear to > have any IANA allocation or meaning clearly indicated - beyond the > parenthetical that 0=SPF. Please fix this. > > > will add description for value 0. Will also add the need for new > registry in "IANA Considerations" section. > > > Cool - unless there's a reason, could it be a BIER-related registry that > both the IS-IS work and OSPF work > can refer to? right, that make sense. In such case, it should be defined outside of IGP BIER drafts, shouldn't it? > > > 5) Sec 2.5: This section could benefit greatly from a diagram - > showing > the advertising router for a prefix, the ABR, and what is then > flooded > for the BIER MPLS Sub-TLV for the new areas. > > > can you please clarify what type of diagram do you have in mind? > > > A fairly simple one :-) where there are 3 areas - with the middle being > the backbone. > Have a BFER in each area. Describe what is advertised by each BFER and > then by > the ABR. > > I tend to agree with Andrew that we have similar section in many > other documents and we've never included any diagram really. Anyway, > I don't have a problem adding it if it helps. > > > Frankly, the language/phrasing was such that I had to stop and think > about it for 5 minutes or so to be > confident that I understood and agreed with what was there. That's > generally my sign that added clarity > could be useful - but it could just be me or a bad day. let me try. thanks, Peter > > > Minor: > > 4) Sec 2.3: "Label Range Base: A 3 octet field, where the 20 > rightmost > bits represent the first label in the label range." What about > the top > 4 bits? Are they Must Be Zero (MBZ)? How about making that > explicit? > Are they potential future flags?/ > > > top for bits are ignored. I'll spell that out explicitly. > > > Sounds good. > > I look forward to getting these from the WG. If I can put them into > IETF Last Call by the end of the > week, then we can have them on the Oct 26 telechat and hopefully > approved before IETF 100. > > Regards, > Alia > > thanks, > Peter > > > Thanks, > Alia > > > From nobody Mon Oct 2 08:34:10 2017 Return-Path: X-Original-To: bier@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: bier@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8FB82134691; Mon, 2 Oct 2017 08:34:03 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.698 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.698 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW=-0.7, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=gmail.com Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id johG63_CwPI4; Mon, 2 Oct 2017 08:34:00 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail-wm0-x233.google.com (mail-wm0-x233.google.com [IPv6:2a00:1450:400c:c09::233]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 6ADFF124F57; Mon, 2 Oct 2017 08:34:00 -0700 (PDT) Received: by mail-wm0-x233.google.com with SMTP id i82so9218543wmd.3; Mon, 02 Oct 2017 08:34:00 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20161025; h=mime-version:in-reply-to:references:from:date:message-id:subject:to :cc; bh=mWLHsoz9uCOP6LqgW7mOan1eQEWduzrnb2NTJSgCYKs=; b=j2HVVt6d3p2HntU/+3i5AcI7VKOKkeR1umJZJAUXLnT9aLWgEoMkQ6iiOnEb92mjez n70MN/CGqSiK/B4Y3Fgj7V422bg9g4vVE/lhAedaos4EUdGPf02ymOZnEnPrlRM3kyH7 vfCA2po2KGSFpdcaIjDZ5eiL/IPsvbJiqmWQgLdTb6IOztnjQhi8xSLnrza9cNXXuRUU SiMSKDG/u4bswpi6pqhQaM+YqfXKTKTT5jrdXsuQ0wfKSvjUPOs7J3fr8D5wWjEPx2s8 5WiZxmyo9HfVPAckNlk2oUbHt9UuXA/OMkvRSHnh0k+z3VRLF8Qsxyxf2AdvjwLi/iFy PJoQ== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:in-reply-to:references:from:date :message-id:subject:to:cc; bh=mWLHsoz9uCOP6LqgW7mOan1eQEWduzrnb2NTJSgCYKs=; b=gG5cC+XFgjs9Aaog6QifF7WOsL7uL+RxKJcnFZ8RSrK6uCHDusC81ck+cuGJZPJQWd vb3qydKY3R8D2LoCfoTh+8MjsmUpOQfhSYG04f+z7SDEf23Y1bR2LM0L1Yi0uEJXofDX tPhtVdSypteQXxymUWSBoOfn2NUOFRnJofrOh6886Q63A4WPBY2Jg33eszSPaLF/fMB3 8lGtFc1UojOB3VFrvdb3YQOHcTqmGriehh+mcznmh7mj9CA710bcXCk/3okZ1BsP8uhA umlMyDcPJGOkCt5DzvZ+4Y1LFIGhKdtKD2AtFuXCJSS0A1rGIIQWQuebET1gmCOJRNi+ YDMg== X-Gm-Message-State: AMCzsaXskEyXCD5Gp4EgP3Oz7QptGFOsOBPTuF61aW4PlXEcL23iNzRp RcEWCY12KSHHrRIaBvpmcy9hAYQxrwtHPAw0m/0= X-Google-Smtp-Source: AOwi7QCD24Rhr5j7jB4CVN8sMM6eI3Hk2FWCKLnrIUG+Ny5RZcM7sZqgDayo2F3ZKlWHuyZycNFezyiXssZt1o9sgLg= X-Received: by 10.28.232.75 with SMTP id f72mr8710486wmh.90.1506958438630; Mon, 02 Oct 2017 08:33:58 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 Received: by 10.223.193.68 with HTTP; Mon, 2 Oct 2017 08:33:58 -0700 (PDT) In-Reply-To: <59D25637.7010409@cisco.com> References: <59D2479B.8050107@cisco.com> <59D25637.7010409@cisco.com> From: Alia Atlas Date: Mon, 2 Oct 2017 11:33:58 -0400 Message-ID: To: Peter Psenak Cc: "bier@ietf.org" , OSPF List , draft-ietf-bier-ospf-bier-extensions@ietf.org Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="001a1147578a6d1376055a921a6a" Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Bier] early AD review of draft-ietf-bier-ospf-bier-extensions-07 X-BeenThere: bier@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 Precedence: list List-Id: "\"Bit Indexed Explicit Replication discussion list\"" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 02 Oct 2017 15:34:04 -0000 --001a1147578a6d1376055a921a6a Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" On Mon, Oct 2, 2017 at 11:07 AM, Peter Psenak wrote: > Hi Alia, > > please see inline: > > On 02/10/17 16:41 , Alia Atlas wrote: > >> Hi Peter, >> >> On Mon, Oct 2, 2017 at 10:05 AM, Peter Psenak > > wrote: >> >> Hi Alia, >> >> please see inline: >> >> >> On 27/09/17 00:12 , Alia Atlas wrote: >> >> I have done an early AD review of >> draft-ietf-bier-ospf-bier-extensions-07 in preparation for the >> publication request. >> >> First, I would like to thank the many authors for their work on >> this >> draft. Given that there are currently 7 authors listed, I'd >> recommend >> appointing a few editors or otherwise reducing down to 5 or >> fewer. Of >> course, I am also willing to consider extraordinary >> circumstances where >> the shepherd can explain to me privately the deep technical >> contribution >> made by each author. >> >> I do see a number of major issues. >> >> Major Issues: >> >> 1) RFC7684 is just for OSPFv2. How is the information carried >> for >> OSPFv3? We need a mechanism that works for IPv6 also. >> >> >> BIER extension for OSPFv3 will be covered in a separate draft. It >> will be based on draft-ietf-ospf-ospfv3-lsa-extend draft. This is >> similar to what we did for SR and other extensions. >> >> >> I understand that theory - but I think it is getting less tractable. >> How far along is that draft? I'll need to at least >> reference it and discuss the IPv6 support in the write-up. Once >> draft-ietf-ospfv3-lsa-extend is published as an RFC, I would really >> expect this to stop happening. >> > > given that the encoding of the OSPFv3 is way different to OSPFv2 and the > fact that the draft-ietf-ospfv3-lsa-extend is still a work in progress I > would tend to keep the v2 and v3 extensions separate. > Given the second, that's ok - but usually the difference in encoding isn't enough to require a different draft. Please do talk to Acee about this. He's collecting OSPFv3 LSA extensions to add to a separate draft when draft-ietf-osfpv3-lsa-extend progresses - and that draft is just waiting on the implementations (and there are finally 2 of them) so I expect it to move along soon. > When you say "discuss the IPv6 support in the write-up" do you mean to > mention it in draft-ietf-bier-ospf-bier-extensions? If yes, why? This > documents only specifies OSPFv2 extension. No - I mean in the shepherd's write-up - though an informative reference to an OSPFv3 draft or a common one would help. At the moment, there's NOTHING about IPv6 and that's going to make it harder to get IESG agreement on. > >> I don't know if you noticed that draft-ietf-sunset4-ipv6-ietf-01 ("IETF: >> End Work on IPv4") is in IETF Last Call. >> Of course, it has lots of caveats and is getting a number of concerned >> comments - but the trend is obvious >> as is the deployment of IPv6 and the need for feature parity. >> > > not that I disagree, but let's not get into that discussion here :) Just calling your attention to the current atmosphere :-) > 2) In Sec 2.1, the Length is defined as variable and the figure >> includes >> additional sub-TLVs. Please clarify in the text what other >> sub-TLVs can >> be carried & how the length is calculated (yes, same as always - >> but >> clarity helps with interoperability). >> >> >> will change to "Variable, dependent on sub-TLVs" language as we did >> in SR draft. >> >> >> Sounds good - Variable, 4 + length of sub-TLVs I think. I.e., be clear >> on the length >> contributed by this TLV as well as the included sub-TLVs. >> > > not that I care too much, but I would like to keep the language same > between documents. Unless you insist otherwise, keeping the "Variable, > dependent on sub-TLVs" would make it consistent with other docs. Well, I don't deeply care either (beyond bike-shed painting) - but there is content to the TLV so it has length to be included in the calculation. > 3) Sec 2.2 "The size of the label range is determined by the >> number of Set >> Identifiers (SI) (section 1 of >> [I-D.ietf-bier-architecture]) that >> are used in the network. Each SI maps to a single label >> in the >> label range. The first label is for SI=0, the second >> label is for >> SI=1, etc.: >> >> This implies that there is no way to indicate only a label for >> SI=1 or a >> range for SI=1 to 3. That seems unfortunate and assumes that the >> BFR-ids >> are always allocated from SI=0 up. Is there a reason not to >> use some >> of the reserved bits to indicate the starting SI value? >> >> >> I hope this has been clarified by Andrew and Tony already. >> >> >> Sure - I'm fine with what the WG wants here - and labels aren't too >> limited. My concern >> was about efficiency and future flexibility. >> >> >> 4) Sec 2.3: The Tree type is a 1 octet value - that doesn't >> appear to >> have any IANA allocation or meaning clearly indicated - beyond the >> parenthetical that 0=SPF. Please fix this. >> >> >> will add description for value 0. Will also add the need for new >> registry in "IANA Considerations" section. >> >> >> Cool - unless there's a reason, could it be a BIER-related registry that >> both the IS-IS work and OSPF work >> can refer to? >> > > right, that make sense. In such case, it should be defined outside of IGP > BIER drafts, shouldn't it? It's ok to have it here. This is a BIER WG draft and it isn't needed until this or the ISIS one. Either can work. It could be in the mpls-encap draft, but that's ready for IETF Last Call and it isn't used there - so it would need more explanation. > 5) Sec 2.5: This section could benefit greatly from a diagram - >> showing >> the advertising router for a prefix, the ABR, and what is then >> flooded >> for the BIER MPLS Sub-TLV for the new areas. >> >> >> can you please clarify what type of diagram do you have in mind? >> >> >> A fairly simple one :-) where there are 3 areas - with the middle being >> the backbone. >> Have a BFER in each area. Describe what is advertised by each BFER and >> then by >> the ABR. >> >> I tend to agree with Andrew that we have similar section in many >> other documents and we've never included any diagram really. Anyway, >> I don't have a problem adding it if it helps. >> >> >> Frankly, the language/phrasing was such that I had to stop and think >> about it for 5 minutes or so to be >> confident that I understood and agreed with what was there. That's >> generally my sign that added clarity >> could be useful - but it could just be me or a bad day. >> > > let me try. > Thanks, Alia > thanks, > Peter > > > > >> >> Minor: >> >> 4) Sec 2.3: "Label Range Base: A 3 octet field, where the 20 >> rightmost >> bits represent the first label in the label range." What about >> the top >> 4 bits? Are they Must Be Zero (MBZ)? How about making that >> explicit? >> Are they potential future flags?/ >> >> >> top for bits are ignored. I'll spell that out explicitly. >> >> >> Sounds good. >> >> I look forward to getting these from the WG. If I can put them into >> IETF Last Call by the end of the >> week, then we can have them on the Oct 26 telechat and hopefully >> approved before IETF 100. >> >> Regards, >> Alia >> >> thanks, >> Peter >> >> >> Thanks, >> Alia >> >> >> >> > --001a1147578a6d1376055a921a6a Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
On M= on, Oct 2, 2017 at 11:07 AM, Peter Psenak <ppsenak@cisco.com> wrote:
Hi Alia,

please see inline:

 On 02/10/17 16:41 , Alia Atlas wrote:
Hi Peter,

On Mon, Oct 2, 2017 at 10:05 AM, Peter Psenak <ppsenak@cisco.com
<mailto:ppsenak@c= isco.com>> wrote:

=C2=A0 =C2=A0 Hi Alia,

=C2=A0 =C2=A0 please see inline:


=C2=A0 =C2=A0 On 27/09/17 00:12 , Alia Atlas wrote:

=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 I have done an early AD review of
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 draft-ietf-bier-ospf-bier-extensions-07 in= preparation for the
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 publication request.

=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 First, I would like to thank the many authors f= or their work on this
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 draft. Given that there are currently 7 authors= listed, I'd
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 recommend
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 appointing a few editors or otherwise reducing = down to 5 or
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 fewer. Of
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 course, I am also willing to consider extraordi= nary
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 circumstances where
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 the shepherd can explain to me privately the de= ep technical
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 contribution
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 made by each author.

=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 I do see a number of major issues.

=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 Major Issues:

=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 1)=C2=A0 RFC7684 is just for OSPFv2.=C2=A0 How = is the information carried for
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 OSPFv3? We need a mechanism that works for IPv6= also.


=C2=A0 =C2=A0 BIER extension for OSPFv3 will be covered in a separate draft= . It
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 will be based on draft-ietf-ospf-ospfv3-lsa-extend draft= . This is
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 similar to what we did for SR and other extensions.


I understand that theory - but I think it is getting less tractable.
How far along is that draft? I'll need to at least
reference it and discuss the IPv6 support in the write-up.=C2=A0 Once
draft-ietf-ospfv3-lsa-extend is published as an RFC, I would really
expect this to stop happening.

given that the encoding of the OSPFv3 is way different to OSPFv2 and the fa= ct that the draft-ietf-ospfv3-lsa-extend is still a work in progress I woul= d tend to keep the v2 and v3 extensions separate.

=
Given the second, that's ok - but usually the difference in = encoding isn't enough to require a different draft.
Please do= talk to Acee about this. He's collecting OSPFv3 LSA extensions to add = to a separate draft when
draft-ietf-osfpv3-lsa-extend progresses = - and that draft is just waiting on the implementations (and there are
finally 2 of them) so I expect it to move along soon.=C2=A0
=
=C2=A0
When you say "discuss the IPv6 support in the write-up" do you me= an to mention it in draft-ietf-bier-ospf-bier-extensions? If yes, why?= This documents only specifies OSPFv2 extension.

No - I mean in the shepherd's write-up - though an informative re= ference to an OSPFv3 draft or a common one would help.=C2=A0 At the moment,= there's NOTHING about IPv6 and that's going to make it harder to g= et IESG agreement on.=C2=A0
=C2=A0

I don't know if you noticed that draft-ietf-sunset4-ipv6-ietf-01 (= "IETF:
End Work on IPv4") is in IETF Last Call.
Of course, it has lots of caveats and is getting a number of concerned
comments - but the trend is obvious
as is the deployment of IPv6 and the need for feature parity.

 not that I disagree, but let's not get into that discussion here :)

Just calling your attention to the current atm= osphere :-)=C2=A0
=C2=A0
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 2) In Sec 2.1, the Length is defined as variabl= e and the figure
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 includes
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 additional sub-TLVs. Please clarify in the text= what other
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 sub-TLVs can
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 be carried & how the length is calculated (= yes, same as always - but
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 clarity helps with interoperability).


=C2=A0 =C2=A0 will change to "Variable, dependent on sub-TLVs" la= nguage as we did
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 in SR draft.


Sounds good - Variable, 4 + length of sub-TLVs=C2=A0 I think.=C2=A0 I.e., b= e clear
on the length
contributed by this TLV as well as the included sub-TLVs.

not that I care too much, but I would like to keep the language same betwee= n documents. Unless you insist otherwise, keeping the "Variable, depen= dent on sub-TLVs" would make it consistent with other docs.

Well, I don't deeply care either (beyond bike-she= d painting) - but there is content to the TLV so it has length to be includ= ed in the calculation.
=C2=A0
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0= =C2=A0 3) Sec 2.2 "The size of the label range is determined by the =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 number of Set
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 Identifiers (SI) (s= ection 1 of
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 [I-D.ietf-bier-architecture]) that
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 are used in the net= work.=C2=A0 Each SI maps to a single label
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 in the
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 label range.=C2=A0 = The first label is for SI=3D0, the second
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 label is for
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 SI=3D1, etc.:

=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 This implies that there is no way to indicate o= nly a label for
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 SI=3D1 or a
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 range for SI=3D1 to 3. That seems unfortunate a= nd assumes that the
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 BFR-ids
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 are always allocated from SI=3D0 up.=C2=A0 =C2= =A0Is there a reason not to
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 use some
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 of the reserved bits to indicate the starting S= I value?


=C2=A0 =C2=A0 I hope this has been clarified by Andrew and Tony already.

Sure - I'm fine with what the WG wants here - and labels aren't too=
limited. My concern
was about efficiency and future flexibility.


=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 4) Sec 2.3: The Tree type is a 1 octet value - = that doesn't
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 appear to
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 have any IANA allocation or meaning clearly ind= icated - beyond the
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 parenthetical that 0=3DSPF.=C2=A0 Please fix th= is.


=C2=A0 =C2=A0 will add description for value 0. Will also add the need for = new
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 registry in "IANA Considerations" section.


Cool - unless there's a reason, could it be a BIER-related registry tha= t
both the IS-IS work and OSPF work
can refer to?

right, that make sense. In such case, it should be defined outside of IGP B= IER drafts, shouldn't it?

It's ok t= o have it here.=C2=A0 This is a BIER WG draft and it isn't needed until= this or the ISIS one.
Either can work.=C2=A0 It could be in the = mpls-encap draft, but that's ready for IETF Last Call and it isn't<= /div>
used there - so it would need more explanation.
=C2=A0<= /div>
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 5) Sec 2.5: This= section could benefit greatly from a diagram -
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 showing
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 the advertising router for a prefix, the ABR, a= nd what is then
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 flooded
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 for the BIER MPLS Sub-TLV for the new areas.

=C2=A0 =C2=A0 can you please clarify what type of diagram do you have in mi= nd?


A fairly simple one :-) where there are 3 areas - with the middle being
the backbone.
Have a BFER in each area.=C2=A0 Describe what is advertised by each BFER an= d
then by
the ABR.

=C2=A0 =C2=A0 I tend to agree with Andrew that we have similar section in m= any
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 other documents and we've never included any diagram real= ly. Anyway,
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 I don't have a problem adding it if it helps.


Frankly, the language/phrasing was such that I had to stop and think
about it for 5 minutes or so to be
confident that I understood and agreed with what was there.=C2=A0 That'= s
generally my sign that added clarity
could be useful - but it could just be me or a bad day.

 let me try.

Thanks,
Alia=C2= =A0
=C2=A0
thanks,
Peter





=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 Minor:

=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 4) Sec 2.3: "Label Range Base: A 3 octet f= ield, where the 20
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 rightmost
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 bits represent the first label in the label ran= ge."=C2=A0 What about
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 the top
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 4 bits?=C2=A0 Are they Must Be Zero (MBZ)?=C2= =A0 How about making that
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 explicit?
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 Are they potential future flags?/


=C2=A0 =C2=A0 top for bits are ignored. I'll spell that out explicitly.=


Sounds good.

I look forward to getting these from the WG.=C2=A0 If I can put them into IETF Last Call by the end of the
week, then we can have them on the Oct 26 telechat and hopefully
approved before IETF 100.

Regards,
Alia

=C2=A0 =C2=A0 thanks,
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 Peter


=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 Thanks,
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 Alia





--001a1147578a6d1376055a921a6a-- From nobody Mon Oct 2 09:51:32 2017 Return-Path: X-Original-To: bier@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: bier@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1D99D12421A; Mon, 2 Oct 2017 09:51:25 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.698 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.698 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW=-0.7, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=gmail.com Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 5g_6LJXHOQ3c; Mon, 2 Oct 2017 09:51:21 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail-wm0-x234.google.com (mail-wm0-x234.google.com [IPv6:2a00:1450:400c:c09::234]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 87F21132F65; Mon, 2 Oct 2017 09:51:20 -0700 (PDT) Received: by mail-wm0-x234.google.com with SMTP id b189so7919838wmd.4; Mon, 02 Oct 2017 09:51:20 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20161025; h=mime-version:in-reply-to:references:from:date:message-id:subject:to :cc; bh=rw71po97nNDGi+C0OlcOvalgPJZybg5+hZ985daUsA4=; b=Bfw8thaPXVQB3Bj0aMsSik41BW+qPkYlLYzXFVrbWbyeM222UC/POIhD8576Y3bIvo q9HmfFC/hS+NkFJGt+W2GnkyaK87dcRkdJwVELoV1cyL1fczHzpy6UpDsvk0ogOZ1+ns gIffCzNcPZEap7BG/mG62rJrsbJE0b45yiIkp8buCf2zbUoiGYLajr+JRpRk74lvq+0Z KXGYAqiJvi98BuASwwea0dS5pYLwCpgtR4MImUR5eWYiHG3BkGmZEQbjxSrPOdlYeEwh R2lC4yc98SvEOMtZ+GoZLE0scztb/azKc/ok4Iul7Mg2SFj1H6Po8V3uVEpnNQReXmJJ N3Bg== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:in-reply-to:references:from:date :message-id:subject:to:cc; bh=rw71po97nNDGi+C0OlcOvalgPJZybg5+hZ985daUsA4=; b=AYkXn3T2CoRZBjU+WIcmBqO0B+E0DVVHms5dvKQ6d+aUixzY5jevlI8ScgoH2Z92Q0 GdhWhUXw273CWKR76fG7814ch1AUtAWCjEJNWRxgtlSKaA6fyK/EZC8BgDt5pimLytx2 j6Zn2OnZJZ1fiCoF1t322ZwzdzUjsu/8TdzN0uzwS/ZgtfyI0VG5TgPItsq6XGFTMSIA dYDbrYTT5HZjXH8axtJVXMZVjRS+YTY3oKrCwGvKDbVpKNJ+d7Lnc44V4FJrsncQyLw+ /lgQKWOBgtytxo8vSfRucaMrSfE9A5vGt+WmrcFDuJfABNNeckPE+DyWO5GltyR1cEG2 Vq9w== X-Gm-Message-State: AHPjjUhIzM7E+WmKyVe4SpGZF5J8GdTCe4wpscq7xfEiBY++f1kkBOsi 2ciVfcfok/sg1jGY/nxdf1hEIH15K3eic0oqvdk= X-Google-Smtp-Source: AOwi7QB9II3+0vdqYvDJzQRu98FrhkaoLIKwEUYfllyvzaRSipF5pjOe/HWLaiIjT30KWbSSftW0puhJDZRp1jEboJo= X-Received: by 10.80.177.29 with SMTP id k29mr20748851edd.159.1506963078977; Mon, 02 Oct 2017 09:51:18 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 Received: by 10.80.140.187 with HTTP; Mon, 2 Oct 2017 09:50:38 -0700 (PDT) In-Reply-To: References: <0E80CAB4-D769-4912-B432-99E48CC92143@juniper.net> From: Tony Przygienda Date: Mon, 2 Oct 2017 09:50:38 -0700 Message-ID: To: Alia Atlas Cc: Antoni Przygienda , "bier@ietf.org" , "isis-wg@ietf.org" , "draft-ietf-bier-isis-extensions@ietf.org" Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="f403045c14f6031b67055a932fb6" Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Bier] [Isis-wg] early AD review of draft-ietf-bier-isis-extensions-05 X-BeenThere: bier@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 Precedence: list List-Id: "\"Bit Indexed Explicit Replication discussion list\"" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 02 Oct 2017 16:51:25 -0000 --f403045c14f6031b67055a932fb6 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable On Mon, Oct 2, 2017 at 7:21 AM, Alia Atlas wrote: > Hi Tony, > > On Tue, Sep 26, 2017 at 11:10 PM, Antoni Przygienda > wrote: > >> >> >> 2) Sec 5.1: This section has concern about restricting the advertisement >> of BIER information in IS-IS for scalability - but it doesn't discuss at >> all when a router would stop advertising the BIER sub-TLVs. It feels li= ke >> the section is hunting for a bit of a manageability or operational >> considerations section. I'm not comfortable with the interoperability >> issues posed by not indicating what triggers should cause advertisements= or >> withdrawals. Receiving an advertisement from a BFER seems like a >> reasonable trigger to me, since it indicates an active receiver for the >> . >> >> >> >> Have to disagree to large extent: >> >> a) Section is basically saying =E2=80=9Cit=E2=80=99s outside the sc= ope of this doc >> but here=E2=80=99s a couple of hints=E2=80=9D. We should probably say = =E2=80=9Cthose are all _ >> *optional*_ extensions=E2=80=9D. We may be better off moving it into >> =E2=80=9Coperational considerations=E2=80=9D section, that=E2=80=99s tru= e. >> >> b) Suggested trigger is possible one but smarter ones are possible, >> e.g. a node may know it=E2=80=99s not on any BIER computed tree (SPF or = other) and >> save memory by not advertising. All that are implementation techniques a= nd >> the draft is kind of overspecifying here a bit. >> >> c) I don=E2=80=99t see how any _*valid*_ trigger will cause >> interoperability problems with other possible triggers. >> >> >> >> In summary, let=E2=80=99s say =E2=80=9Cit=E2=80=99s all optional=E2=80= =9D and generate an =E2=80=9Coperational >> considerations=E2=80=9D section with this text? >> > > Sure - that's fine. > *ok, action item would be "move 5.1 into operational considerations and explain it's optional" * > > >> 3) Sec 5.5 contradicts the last paragraph in Sec 2.1.1.1 in >> draft-ietf-bier-mpls-encapsulation-08 which says" Note that in practice, >> labels only have to be assigned if they are >> going to be used. If a particular BIER domain supports BSLs 256 and >> 512, but some SD, say SD 1, only uses BSL 256, then it is not >> necessary to assign labels that correspond to the combination of SD 1 >> and BSL 512." >> >> >> >> >> >> Actually, I don=E2=80=99t think so. The encaps draft talks about BIER _*= domain*_ >> doing 256+512 while _*sub*_domain_1 does only 256. The ISIS draft talks >> about the _*sub*_domain, i.e. in a subdomain everyone must advertise >> enough labels for BSLs they support while in a _*domain*_ each _ >> *subdomain*_ may do different things. Observe that we have the future >> capability of converting BSLs in a subdomain and it may come handy later >> (we can send smaller BMLs if we see lots zeroes or bunch things up toget= her >> if we see really small BSLs flying or support BSL migration in a >> subdomain). For now we don=E2=80=99t have conversion and with that we ma= y blackhole >> if people disagree on the BSLs they support in a subdomain. >> > > Ok - I see the contradiction between the drafts. If ISIS and OSPFv2 both > implement it as needing to allocate all the labels, then it's not a > tragedy. It would be nice to clean up the wording in Sec 2.1.1.1 of > draft-ietf-mpls-encapsulation-08 to clarify that this is just a potential > optimization (or simply remove it). > *I read the 2.1.1.1 and honestly, it is pretty clear. We can remove it but I find it helpful as a "hint, hint, nudge, nudge" to implementors. It has no normative language. I don't see a way to improve it much and the alignment between OSPF and ISIS here is IMO not worth bothering with. It's optional operation technique* > > >> 4) Sec 5.6: "A valid BFR-id MUST be unique within the flooding scope of >> the BIER advertisments." This doesn't leave scope for expanding to >> inter-area in the future because the issue is not the flooding scope but >> rather the distribution. >> >> >> >> ? within the scope the BFR-ids must be unique per BFER says it all. I >> think that=E2=80=99s consistent with any scope, inter-, intra- or planet= ary reach =E2=80=A6 >> ;-) >> >> > Ah - sure BFR-ids unique per BFER is fine of course. The flooding scope > is less than that. > *Flooding scope in OSPF was AD (if we choose to advertise type-3s). In ISIS (which is being worked on) it's leaking so the leaking determines the scope. * > >> 6) Sec 6.2: This section needs to clearly define the relationship >> between the labels and the Set Index in the specified . It's al= so >> unclear whether it is better to advertise all the labels ever needed or = be >> able to advertise only labels for a particular sequential number of SIs. >> The restriction that only one sub-sub-TLV with the same BitStringLength >> makes that impossible (but so does the lack of explicit starting SI). >> >> >> >> That goes far back. We agreed to use a set-0-based range covering all >> BFR-ids. IGP TLVs are scarce resource and it makes for a much simpler >> processing on computation. Labels are not _*that*_ scarce given how many >> routers we cover by each label. I don=E2=80=99t think we=E2=80=99ll mov= e that. >> > > Ok as far as advertising all labels - but please add text defining the > relationship between labels and Set Index. > *I thinks OSPF is very clear: * *"The size of the label range is determined by the number of Set* * Identifiers (SI) (section 1 of [I-D.ietf-bier-architecture ]) that are used in the network. Each SI maps to a single label in the label range. The first label is for SI=3D0, the second label is for SI=3D1, etc."* *As action item I agree we should add equivalent section to ISIS. * > > 7) Sec 6.3: The values for the Length & Tree Type field need to be cleare= r >> after the figure. Also, is Tree Type an IANA-managed field?? I don't s= ee >> it in the IANA considerations. Ca it be different between IS-IS and OSP= F? >> >> >> >> Good catch, needs adding in IANA section. >> >> >> >> Another one: >> >> >> >> 6.4 is possibly underspecified. It should explicitly state that \cap_C >> implies that the router can convert only between _*all*_ the BSLs that >> it advertises (and not any arbitrary downstream BSL from it). >> > > That would be helpful. It's quite unspecified as to what it does/can do > or how it would be turned on. > > *We have two cases here:* *1) SPF types. We have to specify the TLV today so in the future new tree types will be deployable. Normally ISIS just ignores unknown TLVs but in this case it will have to understand that tree types are mismatched and remove itself from domain (or ignore routers with different tree types, same thing). I think the text is good there. * *2) With BML Conversion you're actually hitting on something. Old routers can ignore it (in case it comes in the future) so we can actually rip this section out completely. My bad. I don't go into details why new SPF with BML conversion will be fine even if old routers don't understand the BML capability and ignore it. * *Action item suggested for OSPF & ISIS. Remove the section on "*Optional BIER sub-domain BSL conversion sub-sub-TLV*"* --f403045c14f6031b67055a932fb6 Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable


On Mon, Oct 2, 2017 at 7:21 AM, Alia Atlas <akatlas@gmail.com><= /span> wrote:
Hi Tony,

On Tue, Se= p 26, 2017 at 11:10 PM, Antoni Przygienda <prz@juniper.net> wr= ote:

=C2=A0

2) Sec 5.1: This section= has concern about restricting the advertisement of BIER information in IS-= IS for scalability - but it doesn't discuss at all when a router would = stop advertising the BIER sub-TLVs.=C2=A0 It feels like the section is hunting for a bit of a manageability or operational co= nsiderations section.=C2=A0 I'm not comfortable with the interoperabili= ty issues posed by not indicating what triggers should cause advertisements= or withdrawals.=C2=A0 =C2=A0Receiving an advertisement from a BFER seems like a reasonable trigger to me, since it indicates an a= ctive receiver for the <MT, SD>.

=C2=A0

Have to disagree to large = extent:

a)=C2=A0=C2=A0= =C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 Section is basically = saying =E2=80=9Cit=E2=80=99s outside the scope of this doc but here=E2=80= =99s a couple of hints=E2=80=9D. We should probably say =E2=80=9Cthose are = all _optional_ extensions=E2=80=9D. We may be better off moving it i= nto =E2=80=9Coperational considerations=E2=80=9D section, that=E2=80=99s true.

b)=C2=A0=C2=A0= =C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 Suggested trigger is = possible one but smarter ones are possible, e.g. a node may know it=E2=80= =99s not on any BIER computed tree (SPF or other) and save memory by not ad= vertising. All that are implementation techniques and the draft is kind of overspecifying here a bit. <= /p>

c)=C2=A0=C2=A0= =C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 I don=E2=80=99t see h= ow any _valid_ trigger will cause interoperability problems with oth= er possible triggers.

=C2=A0

In summary, let=E2=80=99s = say =E2=80=9Cit=E2=80=99s all optional=E2=80=9D and generate an =E2=80=9Cop= erational considerations=E2=80=9D section with this text? =C2=A0

=

Sure - that's= fine.=C2=A0=C2=A0

= ok, action item would be "move 5.1 into operational considerations = and explain it's optional"=C2=A0
=C2=A0
=C2=A0

3) Sec 5.5 contradicts t= he last paragraph in Sec 2.1.1.1 in draft-ietf-bier-mpls-encapsulation= -08 which says" Note that in practice, labels only have to be assigned= if they are
=C2=A0 =C2=A0going to be used.=C2=A0 If a particular BIER domain supports B= SLs 256 and
=C2=A0 =C2=A0512, but some SD, say SD 1, only uses BSL 256, then it is not<= br> =C2=A0 =C2=A0necessary to assign labels that correspond to the combination = of SD 1
=C2=A0 =C2=A0and BSL 512."

=C2=A0

=C2=A0

Actually, I don=E2=80=99t = think so. The encaps draft talks about BIER _domain_ doing 256+512 w= hile _sub_domain_1 does only 256. The ISIS draft talks about the _sub_domain, i.e. in a subdomain everyone must advertise enough labels for =C2=A0BSLs they support while in a _do= main_ each _subdomain_ may do different things. Observe that we = have the future capability of converting BSLs in a subdomain and it may com= e handy later (we can send smaller BMLs if we see lots zeroes or bunch things up together if we see really small B= SLs flying or support BSL migration in a subdomain). For now we don=E2=80= =99t have conversion and with that we may blackhole if people disagree on t= he BSLs they support in a subdomain.


Ok - I see the contradiction between the draf= ts.=C2=A0 If ISIS and OSPFv2 both implement it as needing to allocate all t= he labels, then it's not a tragedy.=C2=A0 It would be nice to clean up = the wording in Sec 2.1.1.1 of draft-ietf-mpls-encapsulation-08 to clar= ify that this is just a potential optimization (or simply remove it).
=


I read the 2.1.1.1 and honestly, it is pretty clear. We can remove it but = I find it helpful as a "hint, hint, nudge, nudge" to implementors= . It has no normative language. I don't see a way to improve it much an= d the alignment between OSPF and ISIS here is IMO not worth bothering with.= It's optional operation technique
=C2=A0
=C2=A0

4) Sec 5.6:=C2=A0"A= valid BFR-id MUST be unique within the flooding scope of the BIER advertis= ments."=C2=A0 This doesn't leave scope for expanding to inter-area= in the future because the issue is not the flooding scope but rather the distribution.

=C2=A0

? within the scope = the BFR-ids must be unique per BFER says it all. I think that=E2=80=99s con= sistent with any scope, inter-, intra- or planetary reach =E2=80=A6 ;-)<= /u>

=

Ah - sure BFR-ids uniqu= e per BFER is fine of course.=C2=A0 The flooding scope is less than that.= =C2=A0

Flooding = scope in OSPF was AD (if we choose to advertise type-3s). In ISIS (which is= being worked on) it's leaking so the leaking determines the scope.=C2= =A0

=C2=A0=

=C2=A06) Sec 6.2:=C2=A0 This section needs to= clearly define the relationship between the labels and the Set Index in th= e specified <MT, SD>.=C2=A0 It's also unclear whether it is bette= r to advertise all the labels ever needed or be able to advertise only labels for a particular sequential number of = SIs.=C2=A0 =C2=A0The restriction that only one sub-sub-TLV with the same Bi= tStringLength makes that impossible (but so does the lack of explicit start= ing SI).

=C2=A0

That goes far back. We agr= eed to use a set-0-based range covering all BFR-ids. IGP TLVs are scarce re= source and it makes for a much simpler processing on computation. Labels ar= e not _that_ scarce given how many routers we cover by each label.=C2=A0 I don=E2=80=99t think we=E2=80= =99ll move that.


Ok as far as advertising all labels - but please add text definin= g the relationship between labels and Set Index.=C2=A0

I thinks OSPF is very clear:=C2=A0

"The size of the label range is determined = by the number of Set
      Identifiers (SI) (section 1 of [I-D.ietf-bier-architecture]) that
      are used in the network.  Each SI maps to a single label in the
      label range.  The first label is for SI=3D0, the second label is for
      SI=3D1, etc."

As act=
ion item I agree we should add equivalent section to ISIS.
= =C2=A0

7) Sec 6.3: The values f= or the Length & Tree Type field need to be clearer after the figure.=C2= =A0 Also, is Tree Type an IANA-managed field??=C2=A0 I don't see it in = the IANA considerations.=C2=A0 Ca it be different between IS-IS and OSPF?

=C2=A0

Good catch, needs adding i= n IANA section.

=C2=A0

Another one:

=C2=A0

6.4 is possibly underspeci= fied. It should explicitly state that \cap_C implies that the router can co= nvert only between _all_ the BSLs that it advertises (and not any ar= bitrary downstream BSL from it).

<= div>
That would be helpful.=C2=A0 It's quite unspe= cified as to what it does/can do or how it would be turned on.

We have two c= ases here:

1) SPF types. We have to = specify the TLV today so in the future new tree types will be deployable. N= ormally ISIS just ignores unknown TLVs but in this case it will have to und= erstand that tree types are mismatched and remove itself from domain (or ig= nore routers with different tree types, same thing). I think the text is go= od there.=C2=A0
2) With BML Conversion you're actually= hitting on something. Old routers can ignore it (in case it comes in the f= uture) so we can actually rip this section out completely. My bad. I don= 9;t go into details why new SPF with BML conversion will be fine even if ol= d routers don't understand the BML capability and ignore it.=C2=A0<= /div>

Action item suggested for OSPF & ISI= S. Remove the section on "Optional BIER sub-domain BSL conversion sub-sub-TLV= "
=C2=A0
--f403045c14f6031b67055a932fb6-- From nobody Mon Oct 2 11:26:53 2017 Return-Path: X-Original-To: bier@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: bier@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id D1C11134733; Mon, 2 Oct 2017 11:26:45 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -14.5 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-14.5 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_HI=-5, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001, USER_IN_DEF_DKIM_WL=-7.5] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (1024-bit key) header.d=cisco.com Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id spzE-ET4KXM3; Mon, 2 Oct 2017 11:26:43 -0700 (PDT) Received: from aer-iport-4.cisco.com (aer-iport-4.cisco.com [173.38.203.54]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher DHE-RSA-SEED-SHA (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 40BEE134742; Mon, 2 Oct 2017 11:26:15 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/simple; d=cisco.com; i=@cisco.com; l=9684; q=dns/txt; s=iport; t=1506968775; x=1508178375; h=message-id:date:from:mime-version:to:cc:subject: references:in-reply-to:content-transfer-encoding; bh=XKEuMlGPQcUl5BL67UUaKmvFA4Ro1r2H5dpWIH7qdsY=; b=Ml4luAhAZ7o50B/a/dajI0aaVQ1oTfcg6wS+WGn/6tzx1gcBmBrKmNFe MfmGWGLOh3Vcnlu2wOaE2G2t9aJ0TwQ5yurJEgU1RHPTzQkeMOFBihS1S 9LO+anUnROseNbrHnPMytRJtZT/PoydjxSYlGmmeAvF+LoNVSfwf3fwco Y=; X-IronPort-Anti-Spam-Filtered: true X-IronPort-Anti-Spam-Result: =?us-ascii?q?A0COAACzg9JZ/xbLJq1dGQEBAQEBAQEBA?= =?us-ascii?q?QEBBwEBAQEBhS8ng3mKH3SQZpYsghIKhTsChQAYAQIBAQEBAQEBayiFGAEBAQE?= =?us-ascii?q?CASMVLxEBEAsOBAYCAgUWCAMCAgkDAgECATQDDgYNAQUCAQGKJAilOoIVEosyA?= =?us-ascii?q?QEBAQEBAQEBAQEBAQEBAQEBAR+BDoIfg1OBaQGDKIRdgzqCYQWHRJlujx2FSII?= =?us-ascii?q?UhW+DWocslVSBOR84gQ4yIQgdFYVjHIFpPjaHToJDAQEB?= X-IronPort-AV: E=Sophos;i="5.42,470,1500940800"; d="scan'208";a="657979660" Received: from aer-iport-nat.cisco.com (HELO aer-core-4.cisco.com) ([173.38.203.22]) by aer-iport-4.cisco.com with ESMTP/TLS/DHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384; 02 Oct 2017 18:26:10 +0000 Received: from [10.60.140.51] (ams-ppsenak-nitro2.cisco.com [10.60.140.51]) by aer-core-4.cisco.com (8.14.5/8.14.5) with ESMTP id v92IQ94K000744; Mon, 2 Oct 2017 18:26:10 GMT Message-ID: <59D284C5.8040801@cisco.com> Date: Mon, 02 Oct 2017 20:26:13 +0200 From: Peter Psenak User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Macintosh; Intel Mac OS X 10.11; rv:24.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/24.4.0 MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Alia Atlas CC: "bier@ietf.org" , OSPF List , draft-ietf-bier-ospf-bier-extensions@ietf.org References: <59D2479B.8050107@cisco.com> <59D25637.7010409@cisco.com> In-Reply-To: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Bier] early AD review of draft-ietf-bier-ospf-bier-extensions-07 X-BeenThere: bier@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 Precedence: list List-Id: "\"Bit Indexed Explicit Replication discussion list\"" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 02 Oct 2017 18:26:46 -0000 Hi Alia, please see inline: On 02/10/17 17:33 , Alia Atlas wrote: > On Mon, Oct 2, 2017 at 11:07 AM, Peter Psenak > wrote: > > Hi Alia, > > please see inline: > > On 02/10/17 16:41 , Alia Atlas wrote: > > Hi Peter, > > On Mon, Oct 2, 2017 at 10:05 AM, Peter Psenak > >> wrote: > > Hi Alia, > > please see inline: > > > On 27/09/17 00:12 , Alia Atlas wrote: > > I have done an early AD review of > draft-ietf-bier-ospf-bier-extensions-07 in preparation > for the > publication request. > > First, I would like to thank the many authors for their > work on this > draft. Given that there are currently 7 authors listed, I'd > recommend > appointing a few editors or otherwise reducing down to 5 or > fewer. Of > course, I am also willing to consider extraordinary > circumstances where > the shepherd can explain to me privately the deep technical > contribution > made by each author. > > I do see a number of major issues. > > Major Issues: > > 1) RFC7684 is just for OSPFv2. How is the information > carried for > OSPFv3? We need a mechanism that works for IPv6 also. > > > BIER extension for OSPFv3 will be covered in a separate > draft. It > will be based on draft-ietf-ospf-ospfv3-lsa-extend draft. > This is > similar to what we did for SR and other extensions. > > > I understand that theory - but I think it is getting less tractable. > How far along is that draft? I'll need to at least > reference it and discuss the IPv6 support in the write-up. Once > draft-ietf-ospfv3-lsa-extend is published as an RFC, I would really > expect this to stop happening. > > > given that the encoding of the OSPFv3 is way different to OSPFv2 and > the fact that the draft-ietf-ospfv3-lsa-extend is still a work in > progress I would tend to keep the v2 and v3 extensions separate. > > > Given the second, that's ok - but usually the difference in encoding > isn't enough to require a different draft. > Please do talk to Acee about this. He's collecting OSPFv3 LSA extensions > to add to a separate draft when > draft-ietf-osfpv3-lsa-extend progresses - and that draft is just waiting > on the implementations (and there are > finally 2 of them) so I expect it to move along soon. > > When you say "discuss the IPv6 support in the write-up" do you mean > to mention it in draft-ietf-bier-ospf-bier-extensions? If yes, why? > This documents only specifies OSPFv2 extension. > > > No - I mean in the shepherd's write-up - though an informative reference > to an OSPFv3 draft or a common one would help. At the moment, there's > NOTHING about IPv6 and that's going to make it harder to get IESG > agreement on. would stating in this document that OSPFv3 BIER extension will be covered in a separate draft help? > > > I don't know if you noticed that draft-ietf-sunset4-ipv6-ietf-01 > ("IETF: > End Work on IPv4") is in IETF Last Call. > Of course, it has lots of caveats and is getting a number of > concerned > comments - but the trend is obvious > as is the deployment of IPv6 and the need for feature parity. > > > not that I disagree, but let's not get into that discussion here :) > > > Just calling your attention to the current atmosphere :-) > > 2) In Sec 2.1, the Length is defined as variable and > the figure > includes > additional sub-TLVs. Please clarify in the text what other > sub-TLVs can > be carried & how the length is calculated (yes, same as > always - but > clarity helps with interoperability). > > > will change to "Variable, dependent on sub-TLVs" language > as we did > in SR draft. > > > Sounds good - Variable, 4 + length of sub-TLVs I think. I.e., > be clear > on the length > contributed by this TLV as well as the included sub-TLVs. > > > not that I care too much, but I would like to keep the language same > between documents. Unless you insist otherwise, keeping the > "Variable, dependent on sub-TLVs" would make it consistent with > other docs. > > > Well, I don't deeply care either (beyond bike-shed painting) - but there > is content to the TLV so it has length to be included in the calculation. > > 3) Sec 2.2 "The size of the label range is determined > by the > number of Set > Identifiers (SI) (section 1 of > [I-D.ietf-bier-architecture]) that > are used in the network. Each SI maps to a > single label > in the > label range. The first label is for SI=0, the > second > label is for > SI=1, etc.: > > This implies that there is no way to indicate only a > label for > SI=1 or a > range for SI=1 to 3. That seems unfortunate and assumes > that the > BFR-ids > are always allocated from SI=0 up. Is there a reason > not to > use some > of the reserved bits to indicate the starting SI value? > > > I hope this has been clarified by Andrew and Tony already. > > > Sure - I'm fine with what the WG wants here - and labels aren't too > limited. My concern > was about efficiency and future flexibility. > > > 4) Sec 2.3: The Tree type is a 1 octet value - that doesn't > appear to > have any IANA allocation or meaning clearly indicated - > beyond the > parenthetical that 0=SPF. Please fix this. > > > will add description for value 0. Will also add the need > for new > registry in "IANA Considerations" section. > > > Cool - unless there's a reason, could it be a BIER-related > registry that > both the IS-IS work and OSPF work > can refer to? > > > right, that make sense. In such case, it should be defined outside > of IGP BIER drafts, shouldn't it? > > > It's ok to have it here. This is a BIER WG draft and it isn't needed > until this or the ISIS one. > Either can work. It could be in the mpls-encap draft, but that's ready > for IETF Last Call and it isn't > used there - so it would need more explanation. ok, I define it here. thanks, Peter > > 5) Sec 2.5: This section could benefit greatly from a > diagram - > showing > the advertising router for a prefix, the ABR, and what > is then > flooded > for the BIER MPLS Sub-TLV for the new areas. > > > can you please clarify what type of diagram do you have in > mind? > > > A fairly simple one :-) where there are 3 areas - with the > middle being > the backbone. > Have a BFER in each area. Describe what is advertised by each > BFER and > then by > the ABR. > > I tend to agree with Andrew that we have similar section in > many > other documents and we've never included any diagram > really. Anyway, > I don't have a problem adding it if it helps. > > > Frankly, the language/phrasing was such that I had to stop and think > about it for 5 minutes or so to be > confident that I understood and agreed with what was there. That's > generally my sign that added clarity > could be useful - but it could just be me or a bad day. > > > let me try. > > > Thanks, > Alia > > thanks, > Peter > > > > > > Minor: > > 4) Sec 2.3: "Label Range Base: A 3 octet field, where > the 20 > rightmost > bits represent the first label in the label range." > What about > the top > 4 bits? Are they Must Be Zero (MBZ)? How about making > that > explicit? > Are they potential future flags?/ > > > top for bits are ignored. I'll spell that out explicitly. > > > Sounds good. > > I look forward to getting these from the WG. If I can put them into > IETF Last Call by the end of the > week, then we can have them on the Oct 26 telechat and hopefully > approved before IETF 100. > > Regards, > Alia > > thanks, > Peter > > > Thanks, > Alia > > > > > From nobody Mon Oct 2 11:33:37 2017 Return-Path: X-Original-To: bier@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: bier@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 23232134792; Mon, 2 Oct 2017 11:33:36 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.698 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.698 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW=-0.7, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=gmail.com Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id uH45qVFINNkO; Mon, 2 Oct 2017 11:33:34 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail-wm0-x231.google.com (mail-wm0-x231.google.com [IPv6:2a00:1450:400c:c09::231]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 55635134794; Mon, 2 Oct 2017 11:32:08 -0700 (PDT) Received: by mail-wm0-x231.google.com with SMTP id i124so12339775wmf.3; Mon, 02 Oct 2017 11:32:08 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20161025; h=mime-version:in-reply-to:references:from:date:message-id:subject:to :cc; bh=TYwop853BoqNU64kStDUKGlUfGZdC1eXib1/ncwO3m4=; b=oiFFnumWP8oZxwBmzZrJ+djYAzfQMC7qf7ZWr74tmkCxQCpO0OD8VVPMtJK8AMv30s Qcm4s8YHkfmcrVRO6gkYunZcH8kMoKkvJlrsGLq0NKvmq6JG3LjCQq/l9bXjYsM7380u hW7MKsOOFLHXJRnqLyl8uJ8A9EMN5PsKZMLlUeZ8E7WIaT/9YQGnueHNLsuzIZFkTI2m IxHLnSPnTNotk+NCz5n6TJuasAAeaACUHCEBCcSsf2F7GmQsyYD7RyceP8u+dMZzZzG4 M3dIBQ0PQ3eTFBDuEPKe5zyPAHmCH98yZyh7S50Aoq5Fx/uaSDQN2Npn6oWEuyecILze 6clg== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:in-reply-to:references:from:date :message-id:subject:to:cc; bh=TYwop853BoqNU64kStDUKGlUfGZdC1eXib1/ncwO3m4=; b=eYQZJ+U21b0TmqVQyM3Rt2Q1ha5PVuNO8aA9Ua042McodTGyMG74bvvtPN3OGsTN93 NW6o+OUaWNzUazoqCYAlGY4AtsEhALL/5PA0P0b7rstSkd+GsvRq9SRSmDj8Gbgr7mvq hUPenhM4qwmsce1763dIBB83Nn5hIVd/OMuo1/sHFllmCOfvN5qv5B3dsQLMrdw8f/IF 4tz2TU4jehNj4DKFi2vJ7IDoZJdOCyHeRAUCiBaKhvInzD9LQ1JoTaEoiJMjiVhZoyiX NymXBSKpdi/m1yv06YKR3mtmcPpeTzWO8Y+gPDz+6yR4nAbvKJcYxz5khgb3sE4d2GBD 4Lcw== X-Gm-Message-State: AMCzsaUn+Gb/iGX6l8GUilTS8ME0XD0ZtlR6W26MpwKdAh6/PgbzKYf9 hGXGDHb8XEDXRCI3nB/zjspkll1GJxB3fra/cXQ= X-Google-Smtp-Source: AOwi7QAX1TVGDSOsQAzs5aktwH3oJyceeckpalnJ5zXbdTseDCMZ9eJTLP9izV7K6uicztIxeGGdVnAB6682lFGlHC8= X-Received: by 10.28.18.210 with SMTP id 201mr10070636wms.135.1506969126596; Mon, 02 Oct 2017 11:32:06 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 Received: by 10.223.193.68 with HTTP; Mon, 2 Oct 2017 11:32:06 -0700 (PDT) In-Reply-To: <59D284C5.8040801@cisco.com> References: <59D2479B.8050107@cisco.com> <59D25637.7010409@cisco.com> <59D284C5.8040801@cisco.com> From: Alia Atlas Date: Mon, 2 Oct 2017 14:32:06 -0400 Message-ID: To: Peter Psenak , Acee Lindem Cc: "bier@ietf.org" , OSPF List , draft-ietf-bier-ospf-bier-extensions@ietf.org Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="001a1145b02c7a74bd055a949702" Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Bier] early AD review of draft-ietf-bier-ospf-bier-extensions-07 X-BeenThere: bier@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 Precedence: list List-Id: "\"Bit Indexed Explicit Replication discussion list\"" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 02 Oct 2017 18:33:36 -0000 --001a1145b02c7a74bd055a949702 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" On Mon, Oct 2, 2017 at 2:26 PM, Peter Psenak wrote: > Hi Alia, > > please see inline: > > On 02/10/17 17:33 , Alia Atlas wrote: > >> On Mon, Oct 2, 2017 at 11:07 AM, Peter Psenak > > wrote: >> >> Hi Alia, >> >> please see inline: >> >> On 02/10/17 16:41 , Alia Atlas wrote: >> >> Hi Peter, >> >> On Mon, Oct 2, 2017 at 10:05 AM, Peter Psenak > >> >> wrote: >> >> Hi Alia, >> >> please see inline: >> >> >> On 27/09/17 00:12 , Alia Atlas wrote: >> >> I have done an early AD review of >> draft-ietf-bier-ospf-bier-extensions-07 in preparation >> for the >> publication request. >> >> First, I would like to thank the many authors for their >> work on this >> draft. Given that there are currently 7 authors listed, >> I'd >> recommend >> appointing a few editors or otherwise reducing down to 5 >> or >> fewer. Of >> course, I am also willing to consider extraordinary >> circumstances where >> the shepherd can explain to me privately the deep >> technical >> contribution >> made by each author. >> >> I do see a number of major issues. >> >> Major Issues: >> >> 1) RFC7684 is just for OSPFv2. How is the information >> carried for >> OSPFv3? We need a mechanism that works for IPv6 also. >> >> >> BIER extension for OSPFv3 will be covered in a separate >> draft. It >> will be based on draft-ietf-ospf-ospfv3-lsa-extend draft. >> This is >> similar to what we did for SR and other extensions. >> >> >> I understand that theory - but I think it is getting less >> tractable. >> How far along is that draft? I'll need to at least >> reference it and discuss the IPv6 support in the write-up. Once >> draft-ietf-ospfv3-lsa-extend is published as an RFC, I would >> really >> expect this to stop happening. >> >> >> given that the encoding of the OSPFv3 is way different to OSPFv2 and >> the fact that the draft-ietf-ospfv3-lsa-extend is still a work in >> progress I would tend to keep the v2 and v3 extensions separate. >> >> >> Given the second, that's ok - but usually the difference in encoding >> isn't enough to require a different draft. >> Please do talk to Acee about this. He's collecting OSPFv3 LSA extensions >> to add to a separate draft when >> draft-ietf-osfpv3-lsa-extend progresses - and that draft is just waiting >> on the implementations (and there are >> finally 2 of them) so I expect it to move along soon. >> >> When you say "discuss the IPv6 support in the write-up" do you mean >> to mention it in draft-ietf-bier-ospf-bier-extensions? If yes, why? >> This documents only specifies OSPFv2 extension. >> >> >> No - I mean in the shepherd's write-up - though an informative reference >> to an OSPFv3 draft or a common one would help. At the moment, there's >> NOTHING about IPv6 and that's going to make it harder to get IESG >> agreement on. >> > > would stating in this document that OSPFv3 BIER extension will be covered > in a separate draft help? It would need more than that. Let's see what Acee thinks is a reasonable approach. My tendency would be to reference the draft that is collecting OSPV3 Extended LSA TLVs - but I'm not sure if that draft is still merely conceptual. > I don't know if you noticed that draft-ietf-sunset4-ipv6-ietf-01 >> ("IETF: >> End Work on IPv4") is in IETF Last Call. >> Of course, it has lots of caveats and is getting a number of >> concerned >> comments - but the trend is obvious >> as is the deployment of IPv6 and the need for feature parity. >> >> >> not that I disagree, but let's not get into that discussion here :) >> >> >> Just calling your attention to the current atmosphere :-) >> >> 2) In Sec 2.1, the Length is defined as variable and >> the figure >> includes >> additional sub-TLVs. Please clarify in the text what >> other >> sub-TLVs can >> be carried & how the length is calculated (yes, same as >> always - but >> clarity helps with interoperability). >> >> >> will change to "Variable, dependent on sub-TLVs" language >> as we did >> in SR draft. >> >> >> Sounds good - Variable, 4 + length of sub-TLVs I think. I.e., >> be clear >> on the length >> contributed by this TLV as well as the included sub-TLVs. >> >> >> not that I care too much, but I would like to keep the language same >> between documents. Unless you insist otherwise, keeping the >> "Variable, dependent on sub-TLVs" would make it consistent with >> other docs. >> >> >> Well, I don't deeply care either (beyond bike-shed painting) - but there >> is content to the TLV so it has length to be included in the calculation. >> >> 3) Sec 2.2 "The size of the label range is determined >> by the >> number of Set >> Identifiers (SI) (section 1 of >> [I-D.ietf-bier-architecture]) that >> are used in the network. Each SI maps to a >> single label >> in the >> label range. The first label is for SI=0, the >> second >> label is for >> SI=1, etc.: >> >> This implies that there is no way to indicate only a >> label for >> SI=1 or a >> range for SI=1 to 3. That seems unfortunate and assumes >> that the >> BFR-ids >> are always allocated from SI=0 up. Is there a reason >> not to >> use some >> of the reserved bits to indicate the starting SI value? >> >> >> I hope this has been clarified by Andrew and Tony already. >> >> >> Sure - I'm fine with what the WG wants here - and labels aren't >> too >> limited. My concern >> was about efficiency and future flexibility. >> >> >> 4) Sec 2.3: The Tree type is a 1 octet value - that >> doesn't >> appear to >> have any IANA allocation or meaning clearly indicated - >> beyond the >> parenthetical that 0=SPF. Please fix this. >> >> >> will add description for value 0. Will also add the need >> for new >> registry in "IANA Considerations" section. >> >> >> Cool - unless there's a reason, could it be a BIER-related >> registry that >> both the IS-IS work and OSPF work >> can refer to? >> >> >> right, that make sense. In such case, it should be defined outside >> of IGP BIER drafts, shouldn't it? >> >> >> It's ok to have it here. This is a BIER WG draft and it isn't needed >> until this or the ISIS one. >> Either can work. It could be in the mpls-encap draft, but that's ready >> for IETF Last Call and it isn't >> used there - so it would need more explanation. >> > > ok, I define it here. > Sounds good. Thanks! Alia > > thanks, > Peter > > >> 5) Sec 2.5: This section could benefit greatly from a >> diagram - >> showing >> the advertising router for a prefix, the ABR, and what >> is then >> flooded >> for the BIER MPLS Sub-TLV for the new areas. >> >> >> can you please clarify what type of diagram do you have in >> mind? >> >> >> A fairly simple one :-) where there are 3 areas - with the >> middle being >> the backbone. >> Have a BFER in each area. Describe what is advertised by each >> BFER and >> then by >> the ABR. >> >> I tend to agree with Andrew that we have similar section in >> many >> other documents and we've never included any diagram >> really. Anyway, >> I don't have a problem adding it if it helps. >> >> >> Frankly, the language/phrasing was such that I had to stop and >> think >> about it for 5 minutes or so to be >> confident that I understood and agreed with what was there. >> That's >> generally my sign that added clarity >> could be useful - but it could just be me or a bad day. >> >> >> let me try. >> >> >> Thanks, >> Alia >> >> thanks, >> Peter >> >> >> >> >> >> Minor: >> >> 4) Sec 2.3: "Label Range Base: A 3 octet field, where >> the 20 >> rightmost >> bits represent the first label in the label range." >> What about >> the top >> 4 bits? Are they Must Be Zero (MBZ)? How about making >> that >> explicit? >> Are they potential future flags?/ >> >> >> top for bits are ignored. I'll spell that out explicitly. >> >> >> Sounds good. >> >> I look forward to getting these from the WG. If I can put them >> into >> IETF Last Call by the end of the >> week, then we can have them on the Oct 26 telechat and hopefully >> approved before IETF 100. >> >> Regards, >> Alia >> >> thanks, >> Peter >> >> >> Thanks, >> Alia >> >> >> >> >> >> > --001a1145b02c7a74bd055a949702 Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable


On Mon, Oct 2, 2017 at 2:26 PM, Peter Psenak <ppsenak@cisco.com>= ; wrote:
Hi Alia,=

please see inline:

 On 02/10/17 17:33 , Alia Atlas wrote:
On Mon, Oct 2, 2017 at 11:07 AM, Peter Psenak <ppsenak@cisco.com
 <mailto:ppsenak@c= isco.com>> wrote:

=C2=A0 =C2=A0 Hi Alia,

=C2=A0 =C2=A0 please see inline:

=C2=A0 =C2=A0 On 02/10/17 16:41 , Alia Atlas wrote:

=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 Hi Peter,

=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 On Mon, Oct 2, 2017 at 10:05 AM, Peter Psenak &= lt;ppsenak@cisco.com=
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 <mailto:ppsenak@cisco.com>
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 <mailto:ppsenak@cisco.com <mailto:ppsenak@cisco.com>>> wrote:
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0Hi Alia,

=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0please see inline:


=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0On 27/09/17 00:12 , Alia At= las wrote:

=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0I have done a= n early AD review of
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0draft-ietf-bi= er-ospf-bier-extensions-07 in preparation
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 for the
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0publication r= equest.

=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0First, I woul= d like to thank the many authors for their
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 work on this
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0draft. Given = that there are currently 7 authors listed, I'd
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0recommend
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0appointing a = few editors or otherwise reducing down to 5 or
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0fewer. Of
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0course, I am = also willing to consider extraordinary
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0circumstances= where
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0the shepherd = can explain to me privately the deep technical
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0contribution<= br> =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0made by each = author.

=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0I do see a nu= mber of major issues.

=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0Major Issues:=

=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A01)=C2=A0 RFC7= 684 is just for OSPFv2.=C2=A0 How is the information
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 carried for
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0OSPFv3? We ne= ed a mechanism that works for IPv6 also.


=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0BIER extension for OSPFv3 w= ill be covered in a separate
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 draft. It
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0will be based on draft-ietf= -ospf-ospfv3-lsa-extend draft.
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 This is
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0similar to what we did for = SR and other extensions.


=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 I understand that theory - but I think it is ge= tting less tractable.
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 How far along is that draft? I'll need to a= t least
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 reference it and discuss the IPv6 support in th= e write-up.=C2=A0 Once
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 draft-ietf-ospfv3-lsa-extend is published as an= RFC, I would really
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 expect this to stop happening.


=C2=A0 =C2=A0 given that the encoding of the OSPFv3 is way different to OSP= Fv2 and
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 the fact that the draft-ietf-ospfv3-lsa-extend is still a wor= k in
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 progress I would tend to keep the v2 and v3 extensions separa= te.


Given the second, that's ok - but usually the difference in encoding isn't enough to require a different draft.
Please do talk to Acee about this. He's collecting OSPFv3 LSA extension= s
to add to a separate draft when
draft-ietf-osfpv3-lsa-extend progresses - and that draft is just waiting on the implementations (and there are
finally 2 of them) so I expect it to move along soon.

=C2=A0 =C2=A0 When you say "discuss the IPv6 support in the write-up&q= uot; do you mean
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 to mention it in draft-ietf-bier-ospf-bier-extensions? I= f yes, why?
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 This documents only specifies OSPFv2 extension.


No - I mean in the shepherd's write-up - though an informative referenc= e
to an OSPFv3 draft or a common one would help.=C2=A0 At the moment, there&#= 39;s
NOTHING about IPv6 and that's going to make it harder to get IESG
agreement on.

would stating in this document that OSPFv3 BIER extension will be covered i= n a separate draft help?

It would need more= than that.=C2=A0 Let's see what Acee thinks is a reasonable approach.<= /div>
My tendency would be to reference the draft that is collecting OS= PV3 Extended LSA TLVs - but I'm not
sure if that draft is sti= ll merely conceptual.
=C2=A0
=
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 I don't know if you noticed that draft-ietf= -sunset4-ipv6-ietf-01
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 ("IETF:
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 End Work on IPv4") is in IETF Last Call. =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 Of course, it has lots of caveats and is gettin= g a number of
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 concerned
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 comments - but the trend is obvious
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 as is the deployment of IPv6 and the need for f= eature parity.


=C2=A0 =C2=A0 not that I disagree, but let's not get into that discussi= on here :)


Just calling your attention to the current atmosphere :-)

=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A02) In Sec 2.1= , the Length is defined as variable and
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 the figure
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0includes
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0additional su= b-TLVs. Please clarify in the text what other
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0sub-TLVs can<= br> =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0be carried &a= mp; how the length is calculated (yes, same as
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 always - but
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0clarity helps= with interoperability).


=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0will change to "Variab= le, dependent on sub-TLVs" language
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 as we did
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0in SR draft.


=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 Sounds good - Variable, 4 + length of sub-TLVs= =C2=A0 I think.=C2=A0 I.e.,
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 be clear
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 on the length
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 contributed by this TLV as well as the included= sub-TLVs.


=C2=A0 =C2=A0 not that I care too much, but I would like to keep the langua= ge same
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 between documents. Unless you insist otherwise, keeping the =C2=A0 =C2=A0 "Variable, dependent on sub-TLVs" would make it con= sistent with
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 other docs.


Well, I don't deeply care either (beyond bike-shed painting) - but ther= e
is content to the TLV so it has length to be included in the calculation.
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A03) Sec 2.2 &q= uot;The size of the label range is determined
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 by the
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0number of Set=
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2= =A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0Identifiers (SI) (section 1 of
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0[I-D.ietf-bie= r-architecture]) that
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2= =A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0are used in the network.=C2=A0 Each SI maps to a
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 single label
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0in the
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2= =A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0label range.=C2=A0 The first label is for SI=3D0, the
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 second
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0label is for<= br> =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2= =A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0SI=3D1, etc.:

=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0This implies = that there is no way to indicate only a
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 label for
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0SI=3D1 or a =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0range for SI= =3D1 to 3. That seems unfortunate and assumes
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 that the
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0BFR-ids
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0are always al= located from SI=3D0 up.=C2=A0 =C2=A0Is there a reason
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 not to
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0use some
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0of the reserv= ed bits to indicate the starting SI value?


=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0I hope this has been clarif= ied by Andrew and Tony already.


=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 Sure - I'm fine with what the WG wants here= - and labels aren't too
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 limited. My concern
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 was about efficiency and future flexibility.

=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A04) Sec 2.3: T= he Tree type is a 1 octet value - that doesn't
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0appear to
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0have any IANA= allocation or meaning clearly indicated -
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 beyond the
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0parenthetical= that 0=3DSPF.=C2=A0 Please fix this.


=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0will add description for va= lue 0. Will also add the need
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 for new
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0registry in "IANA Cons= iderations" section.


=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 Cool - unless there's a reason, could it be= a BIER-related
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 registry that
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 both the IS-IS work and OSPF work
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 can refer to?


=C2=A0 =C2=A0 right, that make sense. In such case, it should be defined ou= tside
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 of IGP BIER drafts, shouldn't it?


It's ok to have it here.=C2=A0 This is a BIER WG draft and it isn't= needed
until this or the ISIS one.
Either can work.=C2=A0 It could be in the mpls-encap draft, but that's = ready
for IETF Last Call and it isn't
used there - so it would need more explanation.

ok, I define it here.

Sounds good.=C2= =A0 Thanks!

Alia
=C2=A0

thanks,
Peter


=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A05) Sec 2.5: T= his section could benefit greatly from a
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 diagram -
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0showing
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0the advertisi= ng router for a prefix, the ABR, and what
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 is then
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0flooded
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0for the BIER = MPLS Sub-TLV for the new areas.


=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0can you please clarify what= type of diagram do you have in
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 mind?


=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 A fairly simple one :-) where there are 3 areas= - with the
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 middle being
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 the backbone.
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 Have a BFER in each area.=C2=A0 Describe what i= s advertised by each
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 BFER and
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 then by
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 the ABR.

=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0I tend to agree with Andrew= that we have similar section in
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 many
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0other documents and we'= ve never included any diagram
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 really. Anyway,
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0I don't have a problem = adding it if it helps.


=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 Frankly, the language/phrasing was such that I = had to stop and think
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 about it for 5 minutes or so to be
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 confident that I understood and agreed with wha= t was there.=C2=A0 That's
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 generally my sign that added clarity
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 could be useful - but it could just be me or a = bad day.


=C2=A0 =C2=A0 let me try.


Thanks,
Alia

=C2=A0 =C2=A0 thanks,
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 Peter





=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0Minor:

=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A04) Sec 2.3: &= quot;Label Range Base: A 3 octet field, where
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 the 20
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0rightmost
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0bits represen= t the first label in the label range."
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 What about
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0the top
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A04 bits?=C2=A0= Are they Must Be Zero (MBZ)?=C2=A0 How about making
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 that
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0explicit?
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0Are they pote= ntial future flags?/


=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0top for bits are ignored. I= 'll spell that out explicitly.


=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 Sounds good.

=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 I look forward to getting these from the WG.=C2= =A0 If I can put them into
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 IETF Last Call by the end of the
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 week, then we can have them on the Oct 26 telec= hat and hopefully
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 approved before IETF 100.

=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 Regards,
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 Alia

=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0thanks,
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0Peter


=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0Thanks,
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0Alia







--001a1145b02c7a74bd055a949702-- From nobody Mon Oct 2 13:22:30 2017 Return-Path: X-Original-To: bier@ietf.org Delivered-To: bier@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from ietfa.amsl.com (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id C67C7132F30; Mon, 2 Oct 2017 13:22:27 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: The IESG To: "IETF-Announce" X-Test-IDTracker: no X-IETF-IDTracker: 6.63.0 Auto-Submitted: auto-generated Precedence: bulk CC: draft-ietf-bier-mpls-encapsulation@ietf.org, bier@ietf.org, akatlas@gmail.com, Tony Przygienda , tonysietf@gmail.com, bier-chairs@ietf.org Reply-To: ietf@ietf.org Sender: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Message-ID: <150697574780.28788.4642470409096326142.idtracker@ietfa.amsl.com> Date: Mon, 02 Oct 2017 13:22:27 -0700 Archived-At: Subject: [Bier] Last Call: (Encapsulation for Bit Index Explicit Replication in MPLS and non-MPLS Networks) to Experimental RFC X-BeenThere: bier@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 List-Id: "\"Bit Indexed Explicit Replication discussion list\"" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 02 Oct 2017 20:22:28 -0000 The IESG has received a request from the Bit Indexed Explicit Replication WG (bier) to consider the following document: - 'Encapsulation for Bit Index Explicit Replication in MPLS and non-MPLS Networks' as Experimental RFC The IESG plans to make a decision in the next few weeks, and solicits final comments on this action. Please send substantive comments to the ietf@ietf.org mailing lists by 2017-10-16. Exceptionally, comments may be sent to iesg@ietf.org instead. In either case, please retain the beginning of the Subject line to allow automated sorting. Abstract Bit Index Explicit Replication (BIER) is an architecture that provides optimal multicast forwarding through a "multicast domain", without requiring intermediate routers to maintain any per-flow state or to engage in an explicit tree-building protocol. When a multicast data packet enters the domain, the ingress router determines the set of egress routers to which the packet needs to be sent. The ingress router then encapsulates the packet in a BIER header. The BIER header contains a bitstring in which each bit represents exactly one egress router in the domain; to forward the packet to a given set of egress routers, the bits corresponding to those routers are set in the BIER header. The details of the encapsulation depend on the type of network used to realize the multicast domain. This document specifies a BIER encapsulation that can be used in an MPLS network, or with slight differences, in a non-MPLS network. The file can be obtained via https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-bier-mpls-encapsulation/ IESG discussion can be tracked via https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-bier-mpls-encapsulation/ballot/ The following IPR Declarations may be related to this I-D: https://datatracker.ietf.org/ipr/2448/ https://datatracker.ietf.org/ipr/2985/ From nobody Mon Oct 2 13:23:42 2017 Return-Path: X-Original-To: bier@ietf.org Delivered-To: bier@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from ietfa.amsl.com (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1116313487E; Mon, 2 Oct 2017 13:23:35 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: The IESG To: "IETF-Announce" X-Test-IDTracker: no X-IETF-IDTracker: 6.63.0 Auto-Submitted: auto-generated Precedence: bulk Cc: Greg Shepherd , The IESG , gjshep@gmail.com, bier@ietf.org, draft-ietf-bier-architecture@ietf.org, akatlas@gmail.com, rfc-editor@rfc-editor.org, bier-chairs@ietf.org MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Message-ID: <150697581506.28700.8816955713785063250.idtracker@ietfa.amsl.com> Date: Mon, 02 Oct 2017 13:23:35 -0700 Archived-At: Subject: [Bier] Document Action: 'Multicast using Bit Index Explicit Replication' to Experimental RFC (draft-ietf-bier-architecture-08.txt) X-BeenThere: bier@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 List-Id: "\"Bit Indexed Explicit Replication discussion list\"" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 02 Oct 2017 20:23:35 -0000 The IESG has approved the following document: - 'Multicast using Bit Index Explicit Replication' (draft-ietf-bier-architecture-08.txt) as Experimental RFC This document is the product of the Bit Indexed Explicit Replication Working Group. The IESG contact persons are Alvaro Retana, Alia Atlas and Deborah Brungard. A URL of this Internet Draft is: https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-bier-architecture/ Technical Summary This document specifies a new architecture for the forwarding of multicast data packets. It provides optimal forwarding of multicast data packets through a "multicast domain". However, it does not require the use of a protocol for explicitly building multicast distribution trees, and it does not require intermediate nodes to maintain any per-flow state. This architecture is known as "Bit Index Explicit Replication" (BIER). Working Group Summary Working group showed solid consensus for this document. The relevant point of contention was only around the charter?s current direction for this work to be submitted on the Experimental track. Feedback from the AD indicated that there is a path to transition from Experimental to Standards track if there in consensus to do so in the future. When a multicast data packet enters the domain, the ingress router determines the set of egress routers to which the packet needs to be sent. Document Quality The vendors are being quite tight lipped about current implementations. Operator feedback indicates there are at least two implementations currently, with others in the works. There are currently five vendors collaborating on the work in the IETF. There is no MIB doctor or other expert review outside of the active working group members. Personnel Document Shepherd: Greg Shepherd gjshep@gmail.com Area Director: Alia Atlas akatlas@gmail.com From nobody Tue Oct 3 04:15:38 2017 Return-Path: X-Original-To: bier@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: bier@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 238D1134588 for ; Tue, 3 Oct 2017 04:15:37 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -4.219 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-4.219 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-2.3, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_H3=-0.01, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_WL=-0.01, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id DuAniCAH_N94 for ; Tue, 3 Oct 2017 04:15:35 -0700 (PDT) Received: from lhrrgout.huawei.com (lhrrgout.huawei.com [194.213.3.17]) (using TLSv1 with cipher RC4-SHA (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id D9827134306 for ; Tue, 3 Oct 2017 04:15:33 -0700 (PDT) Received: from 172.18.7.190 (EHLO LHREML714-CAH.china.huawei.com) ([172.18.7.190]) by lhrrg01-dlp.huawei.com (MOS 4.3.7-GA FastPath queued) with ESMTP id DWT25165; Tue, 03 Oct 2017 11:15:31 +0000 (GMT) Received: from BLREML407-HUB.china.huawei.com (10.20.4.45) by LHREML714-CAH.china.huawei.com (10.201.108.37) with Microsoft SMTP Server (TLS) id 14.3.301.0; Tue, 3 Oct 2017 12:15:29 +0100 Received: from BLREML503-MBX.china.huawei.com ([169.254.9.183]) by BLREML407-HUB.china.huawei.com ([10.20.4.45]) with mapi id 14.03.0361.001; Tue, 3 Oct 2017 16:45:21 +0530 From: Senthil Dhanaraj To: "gjshep@gmail.com" CC: "bier@ietf.org" Thread-Topic: [Bier] Last Call: Thread-Index: AQHTLLyHVEv6nUtauU+iLn6tYmxKKqLSFmkA Date: Tue, 3 Oct 2017 11:15:20 +0000 Message-ID: <9778B23E32FB2745BEA3BE037F185DC4A5B7A21A@BLREML503-MBX.china.huawei.com> References: 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(version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Tue, 3 Oct 2017 14:56:22 GMT Received: from xch-rtp-015.cisco.com (64.101.220.155) by XCH-RTP-014.cisco.com (64.101.220.154) with Microsoft SMTP Server (TLS) id 15.0.1320.4; Tue, 3 Oct 2017 10:56:21 -0400 Received: from xch-rtp-015.cisco.com ([64.101.220.155]) by XCH-RTP-015.cisco.com ([64.101.220.155]) with mapi id 15.00.1320.000; Tue, 3 Oct 2017 10:56:21 -0400 From: "Acee Lindem (acee)" To: Alia Atlas , "Peter Psenak (ppsenak)" CC: "bier@ietf.org" , OSPF List , "draft-ietf-bier-ospf-bier-extensions@ietf.org" Thread-Topic: early AD review of draft-ietf-bier-ospf-bier-extensions-07 Thread-Index: AQHTO6zLj9HnRW+I6UGWpv+ANma486LSOCEA Date: Tue, 3 Oct 2017 14:56:21 +0000 Message-ID: References: <59D2479B.8050107@cisco.com> <59D25637.7010409@cisco.com> <59D284C5.8040801@cisco.com> In-Reply-To: Accept-Language: en-US Content-Language: en-US X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: x-ms-exchange-messagesentrepresentingtype: 1 x-ms-exchange-transport-fromentityheader: Hosted x-originating-ip: [10.116.152.196] Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="_000_D5F91C87CAFC7aceeciscocom_" MIME-Version: 1.0 Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Bier] early AD review of draft-ietf-bier-ospf-bier-extensions-07 X-BeenThere: bier@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 Precedence: list List-Id: "\"Bit Indexed Explicit Replication discussion list\"" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 03 Oct 2017 14:59:08 -0000 --_000_D5F91C87CAFC7aceeciscocom_ Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64 SGkgQWxpYSwNCg0KSSBzcG9rZSB0byBQZXRlciBhbmQgSSB0aGluayB0aGUgT1NQRnYzIEJpZXIg RXh0ZW5zaW9ucyBzaG91bGQgZ28gaW50byBhIHNlcGFyYXRlIE9TUEZ2MyBkcmFmdC4gSGVyZXRv Zm9yZSwgYWxsIHRoZSB3b3JrIGhhcyBiZWVuIGRvbmUgaW4gdGhlIEJJRVIgd29ya2luZyBncm91 cCBhbmQgaXQgc2VlbXMgaXQgd291bGQgbWFrZSBzZW5zZSB0byBkbyBpdCBoZXJlIHJhdGhlciB0 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Subject: [Bier] I-D Action: draft-ietf-bier-ospf-bier-extensions-08.txt X-BeenThere: bier@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 List-Id: "\"Bit Indexed Explicit Replication discussion list\"" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 03 Oct 2017 15:01:29 -0000 A New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line Internet-Drafts directories. This draft is a work item of the Bit Indexed Explicit Replication WG of the IETF. Title : OSPF Extensions for BIER Authors : Peter Psenak Nagendra Kumar IJsbrand Wijnands Andrew Dolganow Tony Przygienda Jeffrey Zhang Sam Aldrin Filename : draft-ietf-bier-ospf-bier-extensions-08.txt Pages : 11 Date : 2017-10-03 Abstract: Bit Index Explicit Replication (BIER) is an architecture that provides multicast forwarding through a "BIER domain" without requiring intermediate routers to maintain multicast related per-flow state. Neither does BIER require an explicit tree-building protocol for its operation. A multicast data packet enters a BIER domain at a "Bit-Forwarding Ingress Router" (BFIR), and leaves the BIER domain at one or more "Bit-Forwarding Egress Routers" (BFERs). The BFIR router adds a BIER header to the packet. Such header contains a bit-string in which each bit represents exactly one BFER to forward the packet to. The set of BFERs to which the multicast packet needs to be forwarded is expressed by the according set of bits set in BIER packet header. This document describes the OSPF protocol extension required for BIER with MPLS encapsulation. The IETF datatracker status page for this draft is: https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-bier-ospf-bier-extensions/ There are also htmlized versions available at: https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-bier-ospf-bier-extensions-08 https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/html/draft-ietf-bier-ospf-bier-extensions-08 A diff from the previous version is available at: https://www.ietf.org/rfcdiff?url2=draft-ietf-bier-ospf-bier-extensions-08 Please note that it may take a couple of minutes from the time of submission until the htmlized version and diff are available at tools.ietf.org. Internet-Drafts are also available by anonymous FTP at: ftp://ftp.ietf.org/internet-drafts/ From nobody Tue Oct 3 08:04:06 2017 Return-Path: X-Original-To: bier@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: bier@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 17B78134DD4; Tue, 3 Oct 2017 08:04:05 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.998 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.998 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE=-0.0001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=gmail.com Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id bBydnmPl8mKT; Tue, 3 Oct 2017 08:04:02 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail-wr0-x230.google.com (mail-wr0-x230.google.com [IPv6:2a00:1450:400c:c0c::230]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id A2FC8134641; Tue, 3 Oct 2017 07:59:05 -0700 (PDT) Received: by mail-wr0-x230.google.com with SMTP id t76so6338087wrc.3; Tue, 03 Oct 2017 07:59:05 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20161025; h=mime-version:in-reply-to:references:from:date:message-id:subject:to :cc; bh=79XcMFqNB33pcqBAV260aNVVN9gP16bypEX6x8QixKo=; b=doed1FK4hHFOGzCROhydsQhnWBZKPCT3eTAvU/qQ6xbbFOPMNNwHyBUb3RhhfEgWbF Hmh2n8Lnr0GMwrp5i15/uj3cfn0Yd9WWMGQmuDHrnsVvb++pP6Xt3cpMGZ5iyIm2m5OD m8zGz3W5MpL8rFfnG/jwddkfdwvjHmNq7ZUMlC4Yyo5pgen4kuKud2MZg4AXU+oZSb9p CrUIu8mC9egcDO1y40FwSajPk5dIJHkrM6Zb87lP3Y/jww7Vzlrqsw1gS46PtEDabMAg mrbqJaVarrATAVJVKT1biWvE7ToKUJRFJqbvWZcyYaCkV6tAhHambUKxUBo5UX1APsin iprw== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:in-reply-to:references:from:date :message-id:subject:to:cc; bh=79XcMFqNB33pcqBAV260aNVVN9gP16bypEX6x8QixKo=; b=jPUiS/IkIO/Sg9hgy9t6XA9VNGKzlSy3X5dUzs7uon4gMgrdD+KW/i+bxG0PeK5qkt TNfPwQr7UhoLqxkQbaChuneBSPFLMc9XOM0/sNGVfplB3uJRZzi78h1TA62DxZeNq9Pv QXwWf42v1PL4Ez1QSfychUwHsrOTnT4D3ajAzn0/bOQKFNPT2TI0NdNc2ZrvmxJCHDQo C8db12hB2gEgBUjVvq6bUTqfS1z/DdMfHvUYI9vNaDozvB2udt2KE4uZVMsIIWdKPBnw 3gZ8zjTVtQzqNYzIr3hjktAEiLlPyM81kpYIq1CH2SZugP5WJxHdBhSTFzT821F5osKL zt7Q== X-Gm-Message-State: AMCzsaWKPIQRcYWqpITq+giBeWAmLExBdGROt5MIddTbY3fZ8hBPTEYN aAuLjgqkXWukzSyWQp6XcJPSUUu5tm5tUTarDe4= X-Google-Smtp-Source: AOwi7QCHvxdBlEDtHX3605ExYPn4quDc+ZX6rHC4uFapGxlSbLuw2OsOvSK9BT+sAimAOTpgcb9gMM9ABzG4tz/c3pc= X-Received: by 10.223.173.148 with SMTP id w20mr4899816wrc.253.1507042743830; Tue, 03 Oct 2017 07:59:03 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 Received: by 10.223.193.68 with HTTP; Tue, 3 Oct 2017 07:59:03 -0700 (PDT) In-Reply-To: References: <59D2479B.8050107@cisco.com> <59D25637.7010409@cisco.com> <59D284C5.8040801@cisco.com> From: Alia Atlas Date: Tue, 3 Oct 2017 10:59:03 -0400 Message-ID: To: "Acee Lindem (acee)" Cc: "Peter Psenak (ppsenak)" , "bier@ietf.org" , OSPF List , "draft-ietf-bier-ospf-bier-extensions@ietf.org" Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="f403045cf0fa684e13055aa5bb01" Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Bier] early AD review of draft-ietf-bier-ospf-bier-extensions-07 X-BeenThere: bier@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 Precedence: list List-Id: "\"Bit Indexed Explicit Replication discussion list\"" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 03 Oct 2017 15:04:05 -0000 --f403045cf0fa684e13055aa5bb01 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Hi Acee, On Tue, Oct 3, 2017 at 10:56 AM, Acee Lindem (acee) wrote: > Hi Alia, > > I spoke to Peter and I think the OSPFv3 Bier Extensions should go into a > separate OSPFv3 draft. Heretofore, all the work has been done in the BIER > working group and it seems it would make sense to do it here rather than > mix much into the overflow draft. As for the OSPF WG, the priority needs = to > be to publish the OSPFv3 Extended LSA draft. I=E2=80=99ll ask Abhay to st= art the WG > last call and concurrently post the implementation information. > Ok - that works for BIER. For OSPF, getting that draft done will help a great deal with enabling feature parity for IPv6. Thanks for all your work on it. Regards, Alia > Thanks, > Acee > > From: Alia Atlas > Date: Monday, October 2, 2017 at 2:32 PM > To: "Peter Psenak (ppsenak)" , Acee Lindem < > acee@cisco.com> > Cc: "bier@ietf.org" , OSPF WG List , " > draft-ietf-bier-ospf-bier-extensions@ietf.org" extensions@ietf.org> > Subject: Re: early AD review of draft-ietf-bier-ospf-bier-extensions-07 > > > > On Mon, Oct 2, 2017 at 2:26 PM, Peter Psenak wrote: > >> Hi Alia, >> >> please see inline: >> >> On 02/10/17 17:33 , Alia Atlas wrote: >> >>> On Mon, Oct 2, 2017 at 11:07 AM, Peter Psenak >> > wrote: >>> >>> Hi Alia, >>> >>> please see inline: >>> >>> On 02/10/17 16:41 , Alia Atlas wrote: >>> >>> Hi Peter, >>> >>> On Mon, Oct 2, 2017 at 10:05 AM, Peter Psenak >> >>> >> wrote: >>> >>> Hi Alia, >>> >>> please see inline: >>> >>> >>> On 27/09/17 00:12 , Alia Atlas wrote: >>> >>> I have done an early AD review of >>> draft-ietf-bier-ospf-bier-extensions-07 in preparation >>> for the >>> publication request. >>> >>> First, I would like to thank the many authors for thei= r >>> work on this >>> draft. Given that there are currently 7 authors listed= , >>> I'd >>> recommend >>> appointing a few editors or otherwise reducing down to >>> 5 or >>> fewer. Of >>> course, I am also willing to consider extraordinary >>> circumstances where >>> the shepherd can explain to me privately the deep >>> technical >>> contribution >>> made by each author. >>> >>> I do see a number of major issues. >>> >>> Major Issues: >>> >>> 1) RFC7684 is just for OSPFv2. How is the informatio= n >>> carried for >>> OSPFv3? We need a mechanism that works for IPv6 also. >>> >>> >>> BIER extension for OSPFv3 will be covered in a separate >>> draft. It >>> will be based on draft-ietf-ospf-ospfv3-lsa-extend draft. >>> This is >>> similar to what we did for SR and other extensions. >>> >>> >>> I understand that theory - but I think it is getting less >>> tractable. >>> How far along is that draft? I'll need to at least >>> reference it and discuss the IPv6 support in the write-up. Onc= e >>> draft-ietf-ospfv3-lsa-extend is published as an RFC, I would >>> really >>> expect this to stop happening. >>> >>> >>> given that the encoding of the OSPFv3 is way different to OSPFv2 an= d >>> the fact that the draft-ietf-ospfv3-lsa-extend is still a work in >>> progress I would tend to keep the v2 and v3 extensions separate. >>> >>> >>> Given the second, that's ok - but usually the difference in encoding >>> isn't enough to require a different draft. >>> Please do talk to Acee about this. He's collecting OSPFv3 LSA extension= s >>> to add to a separate draft when >>> draft-ietf-osfpv3-lsa-extend progresses - and that draft is just waitin= g >>> on the implementations (and there are >>> finally 2 of them) so I expect it to move along soon. >>> >>> When you say "discuss the IPv6 support in the write-up" do you mean >>> to mention it in draft-ietf-bier-ospf-bier-extensions? If yes, why? >>> This documents only specifies OSPFv2 extension. >>> >>> >>> No - I mean in the shepherd's write-up - though an informative referenc= e >>> to an OSPFv3 draft or a common one would help. At the moment, there's >>> NOTHING about IPv6 and that's going to make it harder to get IESG >>> agreement on. >>> >> >> would stating in this document that OSPFv3 BIER extension will be covere= d >> in a separate draft help? > > > It would need more than that. Let's see what Acee thinks is a reasonable > approach. > My tendency would be to reference the draft that is collecting OSPV3 > Extended LSA TLVs - but I'm not > sure if that draft is still merely conceptual. > > >> I don't know if you noticed that draft-ietf-sunset4-ipv6-ietf-01 >>> ("IETF: >>> End Work on IPv4") is in IETF Last Call. >>> Of course, it has lots of caveats and is getting a number of >>> concerned >>> comments - but the trend is obvious >>> as is the deployment of IPv6 and the need for feature parity. >>> >>> >>> not that I disagree, but let's not get into that discussion here :) >>> >>> >>> Just calling your attention to the current atmosphere :-) >>> >>> 2) In Sec 2.1, the Length is defined as variable and >>> the figure >>> includes >>> additional sub-TLVs. Please clarify in the text what >>> other >>> sub-TLVs can >>> be carried & how the length is calculated (yes, same a= s >>> always - but >>> clarity helps with interoperability). >>> >>> >>> will change to "Variable, dependent on sub-TLVs" language >>> as we did >>> in SR draft. >>> >>> >>> Sounds good - Variable, 4 + length of sub-TLVs I think. I.e., >>> be clear >>> on the length >>> contributed by this TLV as well as the included sub-TLVs. >>> >>> >>> not that I care too much, but I would like to keep the language sam= e >>> between documents. Unless you insist otherwise, keeping the >>> "Variable, dependent on sub-TLVs" would make it consistent with >>> other docs. >>> >>> >>> Well, I don't deeply care either (beyond bike-shed painting) - but ther= e >>> is content to the TLV so it has length to be included in the calculatio= n. >>> >>> 3) Sec 2.2 "The size of the label range is determined >>> by the >>> number of Set >>> Identifiers (SI) (section 1 of >>> [I-D.ietf-bier-architecture]) that >>> are used in the network. Each SI maps to a >>> single label >>> in the >>> label range. The first label is for SI=3D0, t= he >>> second >>> label is for >>> SI=3D1, etc.: >>> >>> This implies that there is no way to indicate only a >>> label for >>> SI=3D1 or a >>> range for SI=3D1 to 3. That seems unfortunate and assu= mes >>> that the >>> BFR-ids >>> are always allocated from SI=3D0 up. Is there a reas= on >>> not to >>> use some >>> of the reserved bits to indicate the starting SI value= ? >>> >>> >>> I hope this has been clarified by Andrew and Tony already. >>> >>> >>> Sure - I'm fine with what the WG wants here - and labels aren't >>> too >>> limited. My concern >>> was about efficiency and future flexibility. >>> >>> >>> 4) Sec 2.3: The Tree type is a 1 octet value - that >>> doesn't >>> appear to >>> have any IANA allocation or meaning clearly indicated = - >>> beyond the >>> parenthetical that 0=3DSPF. Please fix this. >>> >>> >>> will add description for value 0. Will also add the need >>> for new >>> registry in "IANA Considerations" section. >>> >>> >>> Cool - unless there's a reason, could it be a BIER-related >>> registry that >>> both the IS-IS work and OSPF work >>> can refer to? >>> >>> >>> right, that make sense. In such case, it should be defined outside >>> of IGP BIER drafts, shouldn't it? >>> >>> >>> It's ok to have it here. This is a BIER WG draft and it isn't needed >>> until this or the ISIS one. >>> Either can work. It could be in the mpls-encap draft, but that's ready >>> for IETF Last Call and it isn't >>> used there - so it would need more explanation. >>> >> >> ok, I define it here. >> > > Sounds good. Thanks! > > Alia > > >> >> thanks, >> Peter >> >> >>> 5) Sec 2.5: This section could benefit greatly from a >>> diagram - >>> showing >>> the advertising router for a prefix, the ABR, and what >>> is then >>> flooded >>> for the BIER MPLS Sub-TLV for the new areas. >>> >>> >>> can you please clarify what type of diagram do you have in >>> mind? >>> >>> >>> A fairly simple one :-) where there are 3 areas - with the >>> middle being >>> the backbone. >>> Have a BFER in each area. Describe what is advertised by each >>> BFER and >>> then by >>> the ABR. >>> >>> I tend to agree with Andrew that we have similar section i= n >>> many >>> other documents and we've never included any diagram >>> really. Anyway, >>> I don't have a problem adding it if it helps. >>> >>> >>> Frankly, the language/phrasing was such that I had to stop and >>> think >>> about it for 5 minutes or so to be >>> confident that I understood and agreed with what was there. >>> That's >>> generally my sign that added clarity >>> could be useful - but it could just be me or a bad day. >>> >>> >>> let me try. >>> >>> >>> Thanks, >>> Alia >>> >>> thanks, >>> Peter >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> Minor: >>> >>> 4) Sec 2.3: "Label Range Base: A 3 octet field, where >>> the 20 >>> rightmost >>> bits represent the first label in the label range." >>> What about >>> the top >>> 4 bits? Are they Must Be Zero (MBZ)? How about makin= g >>> that >>> explicit? >>> Are they potential future flags?/ >>> >>> >>> top for bits are ignored. I'll spell that out explicitly. >>> >>> >>> Sounds good. >>> >>> I look forward to getting these from the WG. If I can put them >>> into >>> IETF Last Call by the end of the >>> week, then we can have them on the Oct 26 telechat and hopefull= y >>> approved before IETF 100. >>> >>> Regards, >>> Alia >>> >>> thanks, >>> Peter >>> >>> >>> Thanks, >>> Alia >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >> > --f403045cf0fa684e13055aa5bb01 Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Hi Acee,

On Tue, Oct 3, 2017 at 10:56 AM, Acee Lindem (acee) <acee@cisco= .com> wrote:
Hi Alia,=C2=A0

I spoke to Peter and I think the OSPFv3 Bier Extensions should go into= a separate OSPFv3 draft. Heretofore, all the work has been done in the BIE= R working group and it seems it would make sense to do it here rather than = mix much into the overflow draft. As for the OSPF WG, the priority needs to be to publish the OSPFv3 Extende= d LSA draft. I=E2=80=99ll ask Abhay to start the WG last call and concurren= tly post the implementation information.=C2=A0

Ok - that works for BIER.=C2=A0 For OSPF, getting that draf= t done will help a great deal with enabling feature parity for IPv6.
<= div>
Thanks for all your work on it.

Regards,
Alia=C2=A0
=C2=A0
Thanks,
Acee=C2=A0

From: Alia Atlas <akatlas@gmail.com>
Date: Monday, October 2, 2017 at 2:= 32 PM
To: "Peter Psenak (ppsenak)&qu= ot; <ppsenak@cisc= o.com>, Acee Lindem <acee@cisco.com>
Cc: "bier@ietf.org" <bier@ietf.org>, OSPF WG List <ospf@ietf.org>, "= draft-ietf-bier-ospf-bier-extensions@ietf.org" <draft-ietf-bier-ospf-bier-extensions@ietf.org>
Subject: Re: early AD review of dra= ft-ietf-bier-ospf-bier-extensions-07



On Mon, Oct 2, 2017 at 2:26 PM, Peter Psenak <ppsenak@cisco.co= m> wrote:
Hi Alia,

please see inline:

On 02/10/17 17:33 , Alia Atlas wrote:
On Mon, Oct 2, 2017 at 11:07 AM, Peter Psenak <ppsenak@cisco.com
<mailto:ppsenak@cisco.com>> wrote:

=C2=A0 =C2=A0 Hi Alia,

=C2=A0 =C2=A0 please see inline:

=C2=A0 =C2=A0 On 02/10/17 16:41 , Alia Atlas wrote:

=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 Hi Peter,

=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 On Mon, Oct 2, 2017 at 10:05 AM, Peter Psenak &= lt;ppsenak@cisco.com=
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 <mailto:ppsenak@cisco.com>
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 <mail= to:ppsenak@cisco.com= <mailto:ppse= nak@cisco.com>>> wrote:

=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0Hi Alia,

=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0please see inline:


=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0On 27/09/17 00:12 , Alia At= las wrote:

=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0I have done a= n early AD review of
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0draft-ietf-bi= er-ospf-bier-extensions-07 in preparation
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 for the
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0publication r= equest.

=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0First, I woul= d like to thank the many authors for their
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 work on this
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0draft. Given = that there are currently 7 authors listed, I'd
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0recommend
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0appointing a = few editors or otherwise reducing down to 5 or
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0fewer. Of
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0course, I am = also willing to consider extraordinary
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0circumstances= where
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0the shepherd = can explain to me privately the deep technical
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0contribution<= br> =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0made by each = author.

=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0I do see a nu= mber of major issues.

=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0Major Issues:=

=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A01)=C2=A0 RFC7= 684 is just for OSPFv2.=C2=A0 How is the information
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 carried for
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0OSPFv3? We ne= ed a mechanism that works for IPv6 also.


=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0BIER extension for OSPFv3 w= ill be covered in a separate
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 draft. It
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0will be based on draft-ietf= -ospf-ospfv3-lsa-extend draft.
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 This is
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0similar to what we did for = SR and other extensions.


=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 I understand that theory - but I think it is ge= tting less tractable.
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 How far along is that draft? I'll need to a= t least
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 reference it and discuss the IPv6 support in th= e write-up.=C2=A0 Once
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 draft-ietf-ospfv3-lsa-extend is published as an= RFC, I would really
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 expect this to stop happening.


=C2=A0 =C2=A0 given that the encoding of the OSPFv3 is way different to OSP= Fv2 and
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 the fact that the draft-ietf-ospfv3-lsa-extend is still a wor= k in
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 progress I would tend to keep the v2 and v3 extensions separa= te.


Given the second, that's ok - but usually the difference in encoding isn't enough to require a different draft.
Please do talk to Acee about this. He's collecting OSPFv3 LSA extension= s
to add to a separate draft when
draft-ietf-osfpv3-lsa-extend progresses - and that draft is just waiting on the implementations (and there are
finally 2 of them) so I expect it to move along soon.

=C2=A0 =C2=A0 When you say "discuss the IPv6 support in the write-up&q= uot; do you mean
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 to mention it in draft-ietf-bier-ospf-bier-extensions? I= f yes, why?
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 This documents only specifies OSPFv2 extension.


No - I mean in the shepherd's write-up - though an informative referenc= e
to an OSPFv3 draft or a common one would help.=C2=A0 At the moment, there&#= 39;s
NOTHING about IPv6 and that's going to make it harder to get IESG
agreement on.

would stating in this document that OSPFv3 BIER extension will be covered i= n a separate draft help?

It would need more than that.=C2=A0 Let's see what Acee thinks is = a reasonable approach.
My tendency would be to reference the draft that is collecting OSPV3 E= xtended LSA TLVs - but I'm not
sure if that draft is still merely conceptual.
=C2=A0
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 I don't know if you noticed that draft-ietf= -sunset4-ipv6-ietf-01
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 ("IETF:
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 End Work on IPv4") is in IETF Last Call. =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 Of course, it has lots of caveats and is gettin= g a number of
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 concerned
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 comments - but the trend is obvious
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 as is the deployment of IPv6 and the need for f= eature parity.


=C2=A0 =C2=A0 not that I disagree, but let's not get into that discussi= on here :)


Just calling your attention to the current atmosphere :-)

=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A02) In Sec 2.1= , the Length is defined as variable and
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 the figure
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0includes
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0additional su= b-TLVs. Please clarify in the text what other
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0sub-TLVs can<= br> =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0be carried &a= mp; how the length is calculated (yes, same as
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 always - but
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0clarity helps= with interoperability).


=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0will change to "Variab= le, dependent on sub-TLVs" language
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 as we did
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0in SR draft.


=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 Sounds good - Variable, 4 + length of sub-TLVs= =C2=A0 I think.=C2=A0 I.e.,
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 be clear
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 on the length
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 contributed by this TLV as well as the included= sub-TLVs.


=C2=A0 =C2=A0 not that I care too much, but I would like to keep the langua= ge same
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 between documents. Unless you insist otherwise, keeping the =C2=A0 =C2=A0 "Variable, dependent on sub-TLVs" would make it con= sistent with
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 other docs.


Well, I don't deeply care either (beyond bike-shed painting) - but ther= e
is content to the TLV so it has length to be included in the calculation.
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A03) Sec 2.2 &q= uot;The size of the label range is determined
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 by the
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0number of Set=
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2= =A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0Identifiers (SI) (section 1 of
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0[I-D.ietf-bie= r-architecture]) that
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2= =A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0are used in the network.=C2=A0 Each SI maps to a
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 single label
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0in the
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2= =A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0label range.=C2=A0 The first label is for SI=3D0, the
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 second
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0label is for<= br> =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2= =A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0SI=3D1, etc.:

=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0This implies = that there is no way to indicate only a
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 label for
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0SI=3D1 or a =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0range for SI= =3D1 to 3. That seems unfortunate and assumes
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 that the
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0BFR-ids
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0are always al= located from SI=3D0 up.=C2=A0 =C2=A0Is there a reason
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 not to
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0use some
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0of the reserv= ed bits to indicate the starting SI value?


=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0I hope this has been clarif= ied by Andrew and Tony already.


=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 Sure - I'm fine with what the WG wants here= - and labels aren't too
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 limited. My concern
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 was about efficiency and future flexibility.

=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A04) Sec 2.3: T= he Tree type is a 1 octet value - that doesn't
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0appear to
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0have any IANA= allocation or meaning clearly indicated -
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 beyond the
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0parenthetical= that 0=3DSPF.=C2=A0 Please fix this.


=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0will add description for va= lue 0. Will also add the need
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 for new
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0registry in "IANA Cons= iderations" section.


=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 Cool - unless there's a reason, could it be= a BIER-related
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 registry that
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 both the IS-IS work and OSPF work
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 can refer to?


=C2=A0 =C2=A0 right, that make sense. In such case, it should be defined ou= tside
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 of IGP BIER drafts, shouldn't it?


It's ok to have it here.=C2=A0 This is a BIER WG draft and it isn't= needed
until this or the ISIS one.
Either can work.=C2=A0 It could be in the mpls-encap draft, but that's = ready
for IETF Last Call and it isn't
used there - so it would need more explanation.

ok, I define it here.

Sounds good.=C2=A0 Thanks!

Alia
=C2=A0

thanks,
Peter


=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A05) Sec 2.5: T= his section could benefit greatly from a
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 diagram -
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0showing
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0the advertisi= ng router for a prefix, the ABR, and what
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 is then
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0flooded
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0for the BIER = MPLS Sub-TLV for the new areas.


=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0can you please clarify what= type of diagram do you have in
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 mind?


=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 A fairly simple one :-) where there are 3 areas= - with the
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 middle being
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 the backbone.
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 Have a BFER in each area.=C2=A0 Describe what i= s advertised by each
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 BFER and
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 then by
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 the ABR.

=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0I tend to agree with Andrew= that we have similar section in
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 many
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0other documents and we'= ve never included any diagram
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 really. Anyway,
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0I don't have a problem = adding it if it helps.


=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 Frankly, the language/phrasing was such that I = had to stop and think
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 about it for 5 minutes or so to be
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 confident that I understood and agreed with wha= t was there.=C2=A0 That's
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 generally my sign that added clarity
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 could be useful - but it could just be me or a = bad day.


=C2=A0 =C2=A0 let me try.


Thanks,
Alia

=C2=A0 =C2=A0 thanks,
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 Peter





=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0Minor:

=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A04) Sec 2.3: &= quot;Label Range Base: A 3 octet field, where
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 the 20
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0rightmost
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0bits represen= t the first label in the label range."
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 What about
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0the top
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A04 bits?=C2=A0= Are they Must Be Zero (MBZ)?=C2=A0 How about making
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 that
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0explicit?
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0Are they pote= ntial future flags?/


=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0top for bits are ignored. I= 'll spell that out explicitly.


=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 Sounds good.

=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 I look forward to getting these from the WG.=C2= =A0 If I can put them into
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 IETF Last Call by the end of the
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 week, then we can have them on the Oct 26 telec= hat and hopefully
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 approved before IETF 100.

=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 Regards,
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 Alia

=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0thanks,
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0Peter


=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0Thanks,
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0Alia

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Tue, 3 Oct 2017 19:07:18 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: internet-drafts@ietf.org To: Cc: bier@ietf.org X-Test-IDTracker: no X-IETF-IDTracker: 6.63.0 Auto-Submitted: auto-generated Precedence: bulk Message-ID: <150708283808.24203.7700201709732882806@ietfa.amsl.com> Date: Tue, 03 Oct 2017 19:07:18 -0700 Archived-At: Subject: [Bier] I-D Action: draft-ietf-bier-pmmm-oam-03.txt X-BeenThere: bier@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 List-Id: "\"Bit Indexed Explicit Replication discussion list\"" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 04 Oct 2017 02:07:18 -0000 A New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line Internet-Drafts directories. This draft is a work item of the Bit Indexed Explicit Replication WG of the IETF. Title : Performance Measurement (PM) with Marking Method in Bit Index Explicit Replication (BIER) Layer Authors : Greg Mirsky Lianshu Zheng Mach Chen Giuseppe Fioccola Filename : draft-ietf-bier-pmmm-oam-03.txt Pages : 7 Date : 2017-10-03 Abstract: This document describes a hybrid performance measurement method for multicast service over Bit Index Explicit Replication (BIER) domain. The IETF datatracker status page for this draft is: https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-bier-pmmm-oam/ There are also htmlized versions available at: https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-bier-pmmm-oam-03 https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/html/draft-ietf-bier-pmmm-oam-03 A diff from the previous version is available at: https://www.ietf.org/rfcdiff?url2=draft-ietf-bier-pmmm-oam-03 Please note that it may take a couple of minutes from the time of submission until the htmlized version and diff are available at tools.ietf.org. Internet-Drafts are also available by anonymous FTP at: ftp://ftp.ietf.org/internet-drafts/ From nobody Wed Oct 4 11:45:33 2017 Return-Path: X-Original-To: bier@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: bier@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id D754B133075 for ; Wed, 4 Oct 2017 11:45:19 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.698 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.698 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW=-0.7, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=gmail.com Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id i3PewXahQFUw for ; Wed, 4 Oct 2017 11:45:17 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail-lf0-x234.google.com (mail-lf0-x234.google.com [IPv6:2a00:1450:4010:c07::234]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 23A1713446B for ; Wed, 4 Oct 2017 11:45:17 -0700 (PDT) Received: by mail-lf0-x234.google.com with SMTP id m142so10642230lfg.8 for ; Wed, 04 Oct 2017 11:45:17 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20161025; h=mime-version:in-reply-to:references:from:date:message-id:subject:to; bh=Q5kVFlfW2qm4Ovot+Y1hwtBjr7JSkRRJqkzqrGYsPtQ=; b=bcnSdZ5qo3GdBpzENpzBbfB5N28RvZZhLsJwURSbhAmOOsDXSbm7gU5DLY6X6r1KEt pBEg6aZkK3o3ikm1AAm/Ukii9cO9tMu58YOlECln/s7daHsFmtbgn6N7+V3lIO93g178 lpfOBIN/6Vi8cqNYI3A0x1S1jLYVewNUs6X/YMiBwaJ27AANlb46yDNk+fDw1sBkqI7C D+68yA3/AIHCo6OjXhRL/eR/GET/oEDIYtD0iQ9WgUzf+aB1bgs+MPcGA40sAI0QLbBk QQXvbn98pB4VxlHa+FAe5h9om20U1Phkdi1WbB3c5SiYg3OQJZFDpU9S8yIW03e3Y+HZ KBTQ== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:in-reply-to:references:from:date :message-id:subject:to; bh=Q5kVFlfW2qm4Ovot+Y1hwtBjr7JSkRRJqkzqrGYsPtQ=; b=QQJZvov00sxQxxMzqEjdo9DGSXpC3lAKU4UNzvtox2HFG3FEgM8xq7KePSEQu6SkDw swqFPeKJ1ag9oNHuzJ6pEPApTkItLvJOOBC8j6TGmWtw3WABcxJJd0JJEGVTD0FR+ySj bMFvlOp3u5iCmp2sVl/hPl9Sf56d2FHsgbwPk1QJsq3Kl0DS/HrzOZfmsBOSXCo1Vl/i 6BU/fs7mrNKXSUFH6QlYN/9Wqx2OrEkJLYGngqMnapqYBq9KbEt8K8xFiibkWfki0LfD LB0XFuFHSDZMD6FdVjEHQvBjxlsyRhIilLpSkfDQ7DJTyIZnc9o1l973VHHqA7h9xMzI OvHg== X-Gm-Message-State: AHPjjUiKlAXCmD5FtaNjbg7nKTz+7APgZfs0lSY3tWdlrE8PIo28zxtQ SNFZKuc+Hkl/dGnGSvw7yErAL8HrZfiGSt8lsuk= X-Google-Smtp-Source: AOwi7QAu5scnZifAuLIERev6Z2UgMLP2vn1/wHv40smtCWM+Fs3Fw1CPl7ogldT5ZOoTnt38qsbGq3z0o233tDtmcos= X-Received: by 10.25.205.149 with SMTP id d143mr6902811lfg.147.1507142715010; Wed, 04 Oct 2017 11:45:15 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 Received: by 10.46.3.10 with HTTP; Wed, 4 Oct 2017 11:45:14 -0700 (PDT) In-Reply-To: <150708283808.24203.7700201709732882806@ietfa.amsl.com> References: <150708283808.24203.7700201709732882806@ietfa.amsl.com> From: Greg Mirsky Date: Wed, 4 Oct 2017 11:45:14 -0700 Message-ID: To: bier@ietf.org Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="001a11412192277922055abd027b" Archived-At: Subject: [Bier] Fwd: I-D Action: draft-ietf-bier-pmmm-oam-03.txt X-BeenThere: bier@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 Precedence: list List-Id: "\"Bit Indexed Explicit Replication discussion list\"" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 04 Oct 2017 18:45:20 -0000 --001a11412192277922055abd027b Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Dear All, the update includes renaming of flags used by the alternate marking method to align with naming used in SFC and NVO3 centered documents. Appreciate your comments, questions and consideration of WG LC of this document. Regards, Greg ---------- Forwarded message ---------- From: Date: Tue, Oct 3, 2017 at 7:07 PM Subject: [Bier] I-D Action: draft-ietf-bier-pmmm-oam-03.txt To: i-d-announce@ietf.org Cc: bier@ietf.org A New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line Internet-Drafts directories. This draft is a work item of the Bit Indexed Explicit Replication WG of the IETF. Title : Performance Measurement (PM) with Marking Method in Bit Index Explicit Replication (BIER) Layer Authors : Greg Mirsky Lianshu Zheng Mach Chen Giuseppe Fioccola Filename : draft-ietf-bier-pmmm-oam-03.txt Pages : 7 Date : 2017-10-03 Abstract: This document describes a hybrid performance measurement method for multicast service over Bit Index Explicit Replication (BIER) domain. The IETF datatracker status page for this draft is: https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-bier-pmmm-oam/ There are also htmlized versions available at: https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-bier-pmmm-oam-03 https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/html/draft-ietf-bier-pmmm-oam-03 A diff from the previous version is available at: https://www.ietf.org/rfcdiff?url2=draft-ietf-bier-pmmm-oam-03 Please note that it may take a couple of minutes from the time of submission until the htmlized version and diff are available at tools.ietf.org. Internet-Drafts are also available by anonymous FTP at: ftp://ftp.ietf.org/internet-drafts/ _______________________________________________ BIER mailing list BIER@ietf.org https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/bier --001a11412192277922055abd027b Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Dear All,
the update includes renaming of flags used b= y the alternate marking method to align with naming used in SFC and NVO3 ce= ntered documents.

Appreciate your comments, questi= ons and consideration of WG LC of this document.

R= egards,
Greg

---------- = Forwarded message ----------
From: <internet-dr= afts@ietf.org>
Date: Tue, Oct 3, 2017 at 7:07 PM
Subjec= t: [Bier] I-D Action: draft-ietf-bier-pmmm-oam-03.txt
To: i-d-announce@ietf.org
Cc: bier@ietf.org



A New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line Internet-Drafts director= ies.
This draft is a work item of the Bit Indexed Explicit Replication WG of the= IETF.

=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 Title=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0:= Performance Measurement (PM) with Marking Method in Bit Index Explicit Rep= lication (BIER) Layer
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 Authors=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0: Greg= Mirsky
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2= =A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 Lianshu Zheng
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2= =A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 Mach Chen
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2= =A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 Giuseppe Fioccola
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 Filename=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 : draft-iet= f-bier-pmmm-oam-03.txt
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 Pages=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0:= 7
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 Date=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 := 2017-10-03

Abstract:
=C2=A0 =C2=A0This document describes a hybrid performance measurement metho= d for
=C2=A0 =C2=A0multicast service over Bit Index Explicit Replication (BIER) d= omain.


The IETF datatracker status page for this draft is:
https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/dra= ft-ietf-bier-pmmm-oam/

There are also htmlized versions available at:
https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-b= ier-pmmm-oam-03
https://datatracker.ietf.org/d= oc/html/draft-ietf-bier-pmmm-oam-03

A diff from the previous version is available at:
https://www.ietf.org/rfcdiff?url= 2=3Ddraft-ietf-bier-pmmm-oam-03


Please note that it may take a couple of minutes from the time of submissio= n
until the htmlized version and diff are available at tools.ietf.org.

Internet-Drafts are also available by anonymous FTP at:
ftp://ftp.ietf.org/internet-drafts/

_______________________________________________
BIER mailing list
BIER@ietf.org
https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/bier

--001a11412192277922055abd027b-- From nobody Mon Oct 16 07:22:10 2017 Return-Path: X-Original-To: bier@ietf.org Delivered-To: bier@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from ietfa.amsl.com (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0C2C21344EF; Mon, 16 Oct 2017 07:22:09 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: internet-drafts@ietf.org To: Cc: bier@ietf.org X-Test-IDTracker: no X-IETF-IDTracker: 6.63.1 Auto-Submitted: auto-generated Precedence: bulk Message-ID: <150816372902.450.8501460701584497821@ietfa.amsl.com> Date: Mon, 16 Oct 2017 07:22:09 -0700 Archived-At: Subject: [Bier] I-D Action: draft-ietf-bier-mvpn-08.txt X-BeenThere: bier@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 List-Id: "\"Bit Indexed Explicit Replication discussion list\"" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 16 Oct 2017 14:22:09 -0000 A New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line Internet-Drafts directories. This draft is a work item of the Bit Indexed Explicit Replication WG of the IETF. Title : Multicast VPN Using BIER Authors : Eric C. Rosen Mahesh Sivakumar Sam K Aldrin Andrew Dolganow Tony Przygienda Filename : draft-ietf-bier-mvpn-08.txt Pages : 17 Date : 2017-10-16 Abstract: The Multicast Virtual Private Network (MVPN) specifications require the use of multicast tunnels ("P-tunnels") that traverse a Service Provider's backbone network. The P-tunnels are used for carrying multicast traffic across the backbone. A variety of P-tunnel types are supported. Bit Index Explicit Replication (BIER) is a new architecture that provides optimal multicast forwarding through a "multicast domain", without requiring intermediate routers to maintain any per-flow state or to engage in an explicit tree-building protocol. This document specifies the protocol and procedures that allow MVPN to use BIER as the method of carrying multicast traffic over an SP backbone network. The IETF datatracker status page for this draft is: https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-bier-mvpn/ There are also htmlized versions available at: https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-bier-mvpn-08 https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/html/draft-ietf-bier-mvpn-08 A diff from the previous version is available at: https://www.ietf.org/rfcdiff?url2=draft-ietf-bier-mvpn-08 Please note that it may take a couple of minutes from the time of submission until the htmlized version and diff are available at tools.ietf.org. Internet-Drafts are also available by anonymous FTP at: ftp://ftp.ietf.org/internet-drafts/ From nobody Mon Oct 16 07:33:38 2017 Return-Path: X-Original-To: bier@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: bier@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4636D1344F0 for ; Mon, 16 Oct 2017 07:33:36 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.02 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.02 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE=-0.0001, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_H4=-0.01, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_WL=-0.01, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (1024-bit key) header.d=juniper.net Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id Ji4Ghny4O1LU for ; Mon, 16 Oct 2017 07:33:33 -0700 (PDT) Received: from NAM01-SN1-obe.outbound.protection.outlook.com (mail-sn1nam01on0119.outbound.protection.outlook.com [104.47.32.119]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id DDBF113301C for ; Mon, 16 Oct 2017 07:33:32 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=juniper.net; s=selector1; h=From:Date:Subject:Message-ID:Content-Type:MIME-Version; bh=hc4/nqHhjpjl767jWxdTbay+cvMDV8HU4++KSo4gCNs=; b=DbyYqWFTlyOqdE9OqVGTljVMutlfrFH88V8g0C5/Npx6Lt9rZd82odAhihg5exuz0A5RWMH/a1MrTTuDXrzrtMr5dCxXAymyQH7n2CdznKSJigrNSk4ezdy0majwToreCVR7FbMHjaM9yTEGZI9ClYrYeGECkj48VHB11lZiMEg= Authentication-Results: spf=none (sender IP is ) smtp.mailfrom=erosen@juniper.net; Received: from [172.29.36.187] (66.129.241.14) by CY1PR05MB2298.namprd05.prod.outlook.com (10.166.192.144) with Microsoft SMTP Server (version=TLS1_2, cipher=TLS_ECDHE_RSA_WITH_AES_256_CBC_SHA384_P256) id 15.20.77.5; Mon, 16 Oct 2017 14:33:29 +0000 To: BIER WG References: <150816372902.450.8501460701584497821@ietfa.amsl.com> From: Eric C Rosen Message-ID: <8e99f952-ede6-9b1b-cfc4-c99f04651883@juniper.net> Date: Mon, 16 Oct 2017 10:33:37 -0400 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows NT 10.0; WOW64; rv:52.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/52.4.0 MIME-Version: 1.0 In-Reply-To: <150816372902.450.8501460701584497821@ietfa.amsl.com> Content-Type: text/plain; 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On 10/16/2017 10:22 AM, internet-drafts@ietf.org wrote: > A New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line Internet-Drafts directories. > This draft is a work item of the Bit Indexed Explicit Replication WG of the IETF. > > Title : Multicast VPN Using BIER > Authors : Eric C. Rosen > Mahesh Sivakumar > Sam K Aldrin > Andrew Dolganow > Tony Przygienda > Filename : draft-ietf-bier-mvpn-08.txt > Pages : 17 > Date : 2017-10-16 > > Abstract: > The Multicast Virtual Private Network (MVPN) specifications require > the use of multicast tunnels ("P-tunnels") that traverse a Service > Provider's backbone network. The P-tunnels are used for carrying > multicast traffic across the backbone. A variety of P-tunnel types > are supported. Bit Index Explicit Replication (BIER) is a new > architecture that provides optimal multicast forwarding through a > "multicast domain", without requiring intermediate routers to > maintain any per-flow state or to engage in an explicit tree-building > protocol. This document specifies the protocol and procedures that > allow MVPN to use BIER as the method of carrying multicast traffic > over an SP backbone network. > > > The IETF datatracker status page for this draft is: > https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__datatracker.ietf.org_doc_draft-2Dietf-2Dbier-2Dmvpn_&d=DwICAg&c=HAkYuh63rsuhr6Scbfh0UjBXeMK-ndb3voDTXcWzoCI&r=-DXB84eU9m4cIlq2OOcCJCQQAwJXQQswyu3F0kG0VNo&m=UIdAvge0hy7XWFxrYqTx_ejwARoY1dBAeOK7EH1YtDQ&s=h1i4by06AJaD3yTK6qGQYKBnotx-BQPD1bgcZSDtufA&e= > > There are also htmlized versions available at: > https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__tools.ietf.org_html_draft-2Dietf-2Dbier-2Dmvpn-2D08&d=DwICAg&c=HAkYuh63rsuhr6Scbfh0UjBXeMK-ndb3voDTXcWzoCI&r=-DXB84eU9m4cIlq2OOcCJCQQAwJXQQswyu3F0kG0VNo&m=UIdAvge0hy7XWFxrYqTx_ejwARoY1dBAeOK7EH1YtDQ&s=oH61K4_CFB9MdBCkMyLzXJAxUmc2FPLkRiqZL-xgehs&e= > https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__datatracker.ietf.org_doc_html_draft-2Dietf-2Dbier-2Dmvpn-2D08&d=DwICAg&c=HAkYuh63rsuhr6Scbfh0UjBXeMK-ndb3voDTXcWzoCI&r=-DXB84eU9m4cIlq2OOcCJCQQAwJXQQswyu3F0kG0VNo&m=UIdAvge0hy7XWFxrYqTx_ejwARoY1dBAeOK7EH1YtDQ&s=B0JehisOW6HCQyvXuKq1uBJXnAadfvJ6CEXyX6oMPZ4&e= > > A diff from the previous version is available at: > https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__www.ietf.org_rfcdiff-3Furl2-3Ddraft-2Dietf-2Dbier-2Dmvpn-2D08&d=DwICAg&c=HAkYuh63rsuhr6Scbfh0UjBXeMK-ndb3voDTXcWzoCI&r=-DXB84eU9m4cIlq2OOcCJCQQAwJXQQswyu3F0kG0VNo&m=UIdAvge0hy7XWFxrYqTx_ejwARoY1dBAeOK7EH1YtDQ&s=FWw0Hp4e_hVKLx6Vcb1AfefLFaIkTohO8dnEwc2tH3g&e= > > > Please note that it may take a couple of minutes from the time of submission > until the htmlized version and diff are available at tools.ietf.org. > > Internet-Drafts are also available by anonymous FTP at: > https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=ftp-3A__ftp.ietf.org_internet-2Ddrafts_&d=DwICAg&c=HAkYuh63rsuhr6Scbfh0UjBXeMK-ndb3voDTXcWzoCI&r=-DXB84eU9m4cIlq2OOcCJCQQAwJXQQswyu3F0kG0VNo&m=UIdAvge0hy7XWFxrYqTx_ejwARoY1dBAeOK7EH1YtDQ&s=6tkJsY9LoNwC7PtJydxYu33E7b-WPut1cw-TOylEgP8&e= > > _______________________________________________ > BIER mailing list > BIER@ietf.org > https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__www.ietf.org_mailman_listinfo_bier&d=DwICAg&c=HAkYuh63rsuhr6Scbfh0UjBXeMK-ndb3voDTXcWzoCI&r=-DXB84eU9m4cIlq2OOcCJCQQAwJXQQswyu3F0kG0VNo&m=UIdAvge0hy7XWFxrYqTx_ejwARoY1dBAeOK7EH1YtDQ&s=X4k55zF54lnoigBlFCm209mCrAMgPy8SgHKfTot-QdY&e= From nobody Mon Oct 16 14:22:15 2017 Return-Path: X-Original-To: bier@ietf.org Delivered-To: bier@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from ietfa.amsl.com (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 66CB8132F2C; Mon, 16 Oct 2017 14:22:06 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: Peter Yee To: Cc: draft-ietf-bier-mpls-encapsulation.all@ietf.org, bier@ietf.org, ietf@ietf.org X-Test-IDTracker: no X-IETF-IDTracker: 6.63.1 Auto-Submitted: auto-generated Precedence: bulk Message-ID: <150818892635.438.2743077513006159051@ietfa.amsl.com> Date: Mon, 16 Oct 2017 14:22:06 -0700 Archived-At: Subject: [Bier] Genart telechat review of draft-ietf-bier-mpls-encapsulation-09 X-BeenThere: bier@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 List-Id: "\"Bit Indexed Explicit Replication discussion list\"" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 16 Oct 2017 21:22:06 -0000 Reviewer: Peter Yee Review result: Ready with Issues I am the assigned Gen-ART reviewer for this draft. The General Area Review Team (Gen-ART) reviews all IETF documents being processed by the IESG for the IETF Chair. Please wait for direction from your document shepherd or AD before posting a new version of the draft. For more information, please see the FAQ at . Document: draft-ietf-bier-mpls-encapsulation-09 Reviewer: Peter Yee Review Date: 2017-10-16 IETF LC End Date: 2017-10-16 IESG Telechat date: 2017-10-26 Summary: This well-written draft is an Experimental specification for how encapsulation is performed in the BIER architecture in order to optimally forward a packet through a multicast domain while not being burdensome to intermediate routers. This draft is ready with issues. Major issues: None. Minor issues: This Experimental draft specifies that entries to its BIER Next Protocol Identifiers registry are to be done according to the "Standards Action" policy of RFC 8126. It's not entirely clear to me whether RFC 8126's requirement that such entries be from Standards Track or BCP documents applies to the initial set of values. If it does, then there's an issue here between RFC 8126 and this draft's desired status. Nits/editorial comments: General: Replace "ethernet" with "Ethernet" throughout. Replace "ethertype" with "Ethertype" or "EtherType" throughout. (IEEE usage is varies between the two, unfortunately.) Specific: Page 3, second bullet item: change "is" to "are". Page 4, last paragraph: this paragraph is redundant to one it follows fairly closely in Section 1. Consider striking it, although it's not harmful. Page 5, Section 2.1.1.1, 1st paragraph, 3rd sentence: change "ISIS" to "IS-IS". Page 9, OAM definition, 1st paragraph, second sentence: delete a duplicated "the" in the sentence. Page 10, Section 2.1.3, 1st paragraph, 2nd sentence: delete a duplicated "in" from the sentence. From nobody Mon Oct 16 14:33:55 2017 Return-Path: X-Original-To: bier@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: bier@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 62F5A13247A; Mon, 16 Oct 2017 14:33:47 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.698 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.698 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW=-0.7, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=gmail.com Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id Z8rjwWuJJ_hp; Mon, 16 Oct 2017 14:33:41 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail-wm0-x231.google.com (mail-wm0-x231.google.com [IPv6:2a00:1450:400c:c09::231]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 7BC651331F6; Mon, 16 Oct 2017 14:33:41 -0700 (PDT) Received: by mail-wm0-x231.google.com with SMTP id 196so6706095wma.1; Mon, 16 Oct 2017 14:33:41 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20161025; h=mime-version:in-reply-to:references:from:date:message-id:subject:to :cc; bh=PWcG6h+J2EPSvUoGzKUdS22dKKxb7Pz7Yt5Zo/euOPU=; b=pxsaIISip2GyauQYLBZCOF6VIFlx17Zvag2vO7bmDDspUYDQgPYYGrFX0JSUDFejPB nggypt7nZy0UIFI8oOu28/RNKeGBQa6rN+EguKUmnLKBGIUL7aebsRQnN9CF+0F1Yt1C 1CTOS/Mg1USZ2I8hFPqqoiO6bRyvIjROCYrNEl+7hXP5ct/LqOvPJ7S4K8gY34+i0VzH 8xA6OEEnc6aEmdTxKYpVY8tOOfTnIxTd71OpMlMWmy+4GSCpus7yAfn5bhZGTNkphoX6 HwYW+MsmdsdcCcIdbTd7DQ46WAkezI0bDpuatAaQ41EttclohzqkPOpYPvQYqNWJMsyZ VCmA== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:in-reply-to:references:from:date :message-id:subject:to:cc; bh=PWcG6h+J2EPSvUoGzKUdS22dKKxb7Pz7Yt5Zo/euOPU=; b=DUQodz9uUT2/q8Natt5I0/e21Y0o8gWH9zVD8AkYK9xADI8bT2joCB8up0kJeoVFeb gSbITkimSD1nGRTNX8w9TP+sF962PUCiWKM1NaF9q0QPlB5Eb7C/4Rv/0DoHm8W/3lwh TgRbD3rxYbhMB4EqzWcTVLsCuImf32PBpbceJeB8bDcIE/cH+TZ7W03OER14FQpBqawB xVNb7CPvH5l1vKppq8TNDMsaMEbZzeoBswUHbRlxlwfIZKFMcrXWOs6dnLd79TE1VObI lcDrDM5db5s/QT5PDdbR4EILb9j+6KlmTdP9XSSCt0EE5HQDKTg+3dXqb74A2q+JZZIW ODEg== X-Gm-Message-State: AMCzsaW4BUlO246vVd18UOptSTBxU6CJ4LExO6C6kXSplZVN6un2q1SI mbgnQO4h4E2MUj/UnEfYWg15aGOTJguwDxyJnbo= X-Google-Smtp-Source: AOwi7QDiDvRvjqtZq0wSF3u8gQWMGimhNRYbcFodm6OsUFnOzTkHUknKAA5++o+GsdDUygGUtM80SW+aqp5BUWlmrxg= X-Received: by 10.80.149.169 with SMTP id w38mr14291901eda.191.1508189620087; Mon, 16 Oct 2017 14:33:40 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 Received: by 10.80.164.220 with HTTP; Mon, 16 Oct 2017 14:32:59 -0700 (PDT) In-Reply-To: <150818892635.438.2743077513006159051@ietfa.amsl.com> References: <150818892635.438.2743077513006159051@ietfa.amsl.com> From: Tony Przygienda Date: Mon, 16 Oct 2017 14:32:59 -0700 Message-ID: To: Peter Yee Cc: gen-art@ietf.org, draft-ietf-bier-mpls-encapsulation.all@ietf.org, "bier@ietf.org" , ietf@ietf.org, Alia Atlas Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="f403045c23fe8f2f91055bb0c21e" Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Bier] Genart telechat review of draft-ietf-bier-mpls-encapsulation-09 X-BeenThere: bier@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 Precedence: list List-Id: "\"Bit Indexed Explicit Replication discussion list\"" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 16 Oct 2017 21:33:47 -0000 --f403045c23fe8f2f91055bb0c21e Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Valid issue, probably for the AD to ponder on ;-) Maybe the following will serve us best here * 4.6 Specification Required + * 4.7 RFC Required + * 4.8 IETF Review which doesn't precondition Standards track but for all practical purposes does the full rigmarole otherwise ... thanks --- tony On Mon, Oct 16, 2017 at 2:22 PM, Peter Yee wrote: > Reviewer: Peter Yee > Review result: Ready with Issues > > I am the assigned Gen-ART reviewer for this draft. The General Area > Review Team (Gen-ART) reviews all IETF documents being processed > by the IESG for the IETF Chair. Please wait for direction from your > document shepherd or AD before posting a new version of the draft. > > For more information, please see the FAQ at > > . > > Document: draft-ietf-bier-mpls-encapsulation-09 > Reviewer: Peter Yee > Review Date: 2017-10-16 > IETF LC End Date: 2017-10-16 > IESG Telechat date: 2017-10-26 > > Summary: This well-written draft is an Experimental specification for how > encapsulation is performed in the BIER architecture in order to optimally > forward a packet through a multicast domain while not being burdensome to > intermediate routers. > > This draft is ready with issues. > > Major issues: None. > > Minor issues: This Experimental draft specifies that entries to its BIER > Next > Protocol Identifiers registry are to be done according to the "Standards > Action" policy of RFC 8126. It's not entirely clear to me whether RFC > 8126's > requirement that such entries be from Standards Track or BCP documents > applies > to the initial set of values. If it does, then there's an issue here > between > RFC 8126 and this draft's desired status. > > Nits/editorial comments: > > General: > > Replace "ethernet" with "Ethernet" throughout. > > Replace "ethertype" with "Ethertype" or "EtherType" throughout. (IEEE > usage is > varies between the two, unfortunately.) > > Specific: > > Page 3, second bullet item: change "is" to "are". > > Page 4, last paragraph: this paragraph is redundant to one it follows > fairly > closely in Section 1. Consider striking it, although it's not harmful. > > Page 5, Section 2.1.1.1, 1st paragraph, 3rd sentence: change "ISIS" to > "IS-IS". > > Page 9, OAM definition, 1st paragraph, second sentence: delete a duplicated > "the" in the sentence. > > Page 10, Section 2.1.3, 1st paragraph, 2nd sentence: delete a duplicated > "in" > from the sentence. > > --f403045c23fe8f2f91055bb0c21e Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

Valid issue, probably for the AD to ponder = on ;-)

=C2=A0Maybe the following will serve = us best here

* 4.6 Specific= ation Required +=C2=A0

* 4.= 7 RFC Required + =C2=A0

* 4= .8=C2=A0IETF Review

which doesn't precondition Standards track but for all pra= ctical purposes does the full rigmarole otherwise ...=C2=A0

<= br>

thanks

--- tony=C2=A0


On Mon, Oct= 16, 2017 at 2:22 PM, Peter Yee <peter@akayla.com> wrote:
=
Reviewer: Peter Yee
Review result: Ready with Issues

I am the assigned Gen-ART reviewer for this draft. The General Area
Review Team (Gen-ART) reviews all IETF documents being processed
by the IESG for the IETF Chair. Please wait for direction from your
document shepherd or AD before posting a new version of the draft.

For more information, please see the FAQ at

<https://trac.ietf.org/trac/gen/wiki/GenArtfaq<= /a>>.

Document: draft-ietf-bier-mpls-encapsulation-09
Reviewer: Peter Yee
Review Date: 2017-10-16
IETF LC End Date: 2017-10-16
IESG Telechat date: 2017-10-26

Summary:=C2=A0 This well-written draft is an Experimental specification for= how
encapsulation is performed in the BIER architecture in order to optimally forward a packet through a multicast domain while not being burdensome to intermediate routers.

This draft is ready with issues.

Major issues: None.

Minor issues: This Experimental draft specifies that entries to its BIER Ne= xt
Protocol Identifiers registry are to be done according to the "Standar= ds
Action" policy of RFC 8126.=C2=A0 It's not entirely clear to me wh= ether RFC 8126's
requirement that such entries be from Standards Track or BCP documents appl= ies
to the initial set of values.=C2=A0 If it does, then there's an issue h= ere between
RFC 8126 and this draft's desired status.

Nits/editorial comments:

General:

Replace "ethernet" with "Ethernet" throughout.

Replace "ethertype" with "Ethertype" or "EtherType= " throughout.=C2=A0 (IEEE usage is
varies between the two, unfortunately.)

Specific:

Page 3, second bullet item: change "is" to "are".

Page 4, last paragraph: this paragraph is redundant to one it follows fairl= y
closely in Section 1.=C2=A0 Consider striking it, although it's not har= mful.

Page 5, Section 2.1.1.1, 1st paragraph, 3rd sentence: change "ISIS&quo= t; to "IS-IS".

Page 9, OAM definition, 1st paragraph, second sentence: delete a duplicated=
"the" in the sentence.

Page 10, Section 2.1.3, 1st paragraph, 2nd sentence: delete a duplicated &q= uot;in"
from the sentence.


--f403045c23fe8f2f91055bb0c21e-- From nobody Mon Oct 16 17:01:45 2017 Return-Path: X-Original-To: bier@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: bier@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 17A05133039; Mon, 16 Oct 2017 17:01:37 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.998 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.998 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=gmail.com Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id K2mIyt5SW6bN; Mon, 16 Oct 2017 17:01:34 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail-wm0-x229.google.com (mail-wm0-x229.google.com [IPv6:2a00:1450:400c:c09::229]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 53899132F2C; Mon, 16 Oct 2017 17:01:34 -0700 (PDT) Received: by mail-wm0-x229.google.com with SMTP id l68so447818wmd.5; Mon, 16 Oct 2017 17:01:34 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20161025; h=mime-version:in-reply-to:references:from:date:message-id:subject:to :cc; bh=ASVIHaAzHr3Ln7w7SCRiM0bqPZ3c85sZtvLdWy5mtPY=; b=uZuoGi1306cJzWEav/W+ROYum9XSgUOuyXn1EW7hlc/Vh4XiO6VxpAqDh2bgFSzw4i xlv8wCDDOs8jU1bnZnFifAxxrUfzi8FjWiq460Ehb+O0cwVLW01Ea6Eb67752wBuo9ob Vu+sTBckfWKrIrJfyRhWTHO9d8FPAID+1HKny9jO7BdkdNKvQk3Eeqj04bBIVH22eHK3 hkHQ70vGyXaKz7SyrmXq0ojM69y9/oPY6oOa3pbzxsM9FY3URy0PA4XsgB0rx41tY76j dcrxIUO61pS6vtzOY5csUPINyUlVIF4EoOxQlh1Y9/o4x2S3T6hcL399keJI3K6aoy0U 0dew== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:in-reply-to:references:from:date :message-id:subject:to:cc; bh=ASVIHaAzHr3Ln7w7SCRiM0bqPZ3c85sZtvLdWy5mtPY=; b=hXKmt4CZrXT0VmHM+KYAAyHiTNuyI/d8FtVHhMCXxJpEcwd0XlrFDTmWgMjGpOl3MH 0z3HEeRf2mHWMcPlikHmWn86AjcL0vOmJZXWhkp95NoNEdT+f3oc5sVisnr2usbiHqt+ Qxiw0btdNay63ZS9s2FNfAdj5UFGYaavc529xYBm+qNHrLe2UWX2VLO7m2BW30zNo/RV FFgctliFZ+gWnMmPDAGBRj8lNGCKYOGRvncF75eG9tc95K/xqt8AJCH/M7cyFtifp1HD ftNWtYx0QuN3PzA4pEmd6Xdgaq3/DaWEcbckurTNBP2Flqc7Bb//Akf6npSOzTuKpe9n dEFA== X-Gm-Message-State: AMCzsaUXPssPupmDPTQu9la13J0Qv6boakG5A2GICDMN470iG0vXQBax VgVvkeGHGF0UqanBMMhL1cM92/r1Qjo6VUPnpEIxyw== X-Google-Smtp-Source: ABhQp+R6gYkayKDU7LNs7PUX37WtABCHxz404TUCjDDBs6IjqVtIDMAWJEX9aVN1jenGO0PeQRloCaq85skwvFKR/gI= X-Received: by 10.28.18.144 with SMTP id 138mr1863210wms.135.1508198492764; Mon, 16 Oct 2017 17:01:32 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 Received: by 10.223.183.202 with HTTP; Mon, 16 Oct 2017 17:01:32 -0700 (PDT) In-Reply-To: References: <150818892635.438.2743077513006159051@ietfa.amsl.com> From: Alia Atlas Date: Mon, 16 Oct 2017 20:01:32 -0400 Message-ID: To: Tony Przygienda Cc: Peter Yee , "gen-art@ietf.org" , draft-ietf-bier-mpls-encapsulation.all@ietf.org, "bier@ietf.org" , IETF Discussion Mailing List Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="001a114732dc698067055bb2d3ce" Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Bier] Genart telechat review of draft-ietf-bier-mpls-encapsulation-09 X-BeenThere: bier@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 Precedence: list List-Id: "\"Bit Indexed Explicit Replication discussion list\"" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 17 Oct 2017 00:01:37 -0000 --001a114732dc698067055bb2d3ce Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" I don't believe that a document has to be Standards Track to create a registry that will require Standards Track going forward. It is a bit unusual, but I don't see a process problem. Regards, Alia On Mon, Oct 16, 2017 at 5:32 PM, Tony Przygienda wrote: > Valid issue, probably for the AD to ponder on ;-) > > Maybe the following will serve us best here > > * 4.6 Specification Required + > > * 4.7 RFC Required + > > * 4.8 IETF Review > > which doesn't precondition Standards track but for all practical purposes > does the full rigmarole otherwise ... > > > thanks > > --- tony > > On Mon, Oct 16, 2017 at 2:22 PM, Peter Yee wrote: > >> Reviewer: Peter Yee >> Review result: Ready with Issues >> >> I am the assigned Gen-ART reviewer for this draft. The General Area >> Review Team (Gen-ART) reviews all IETF documents being processed >> by the IESG for the IETF Chair. Please wait for direction from your >> document shepherd or AD before posting a new version of the draft. >> >> For more information, please see the FAQ at >> >> . >> >> Document: draft-ietf-bier-mpls-encapsulation-09 >> Reviewer: Peter Yee >> Review Date: 2017-10-16 >> IETF LC End Date: 2017-10-16 >> IESG Telechat date: 2017-10-26 >> >> Summary: This well-written draft is an Experimental specification for how >> encapsulation is performed in the BIER architecture in order to optimally >> forward a packet through a multicast domain while not being burdensome to >> intermediate routers. >> >> This draft is ready with issues. >> >> Major issues: None. >> >> Minor issues: This Experimental draft specifies that entries to its BIER >> Next >> Protocol Identifiers registry are to be done according to the "Standards >> Action" policy of RFC 8126. It's not entirely clear to me whether RFC >> 8126's >> requirement that such entries be from Standards Track or BCP documents >> applies >> to the initial set of values. If it does, then there's an issue here >> between >> RFC 8126 and this draft's desired status. >> >> Nits/editorial comments: >> >> General: >> >> Replace "ethernet" with "Ethernet" throughout. >> >> Replace "ethertype" with "Ethertype" or "EtherType" throughout. (IEEE >> usage is >> varies between the two, unfortunately.) >> >> Specific: >> >> Page 3, second bullet item: change "is" to "are". >> >> Page 4, last paragraph: this paragraph is redundant to one it follows >> fairly >> closely in Section 1. Consider striking it, although it's not harmful. >> >> Page 5, Section 2.1.1.1, 1st paragraph, 3rd sentence: change "ISIS" to >> "IS-IS". >> >> Page 9, OAM definition, 1st paragraph, second sentence: delete a >> duplicated >> "the" in the sentence. >> >> Page 10, Section 2.1.3, 1st paragraph, 2nd sentence: delete a duplicated >> "in" >> from the sentence. >> >> > --001a114732dc698067055bb2d3ce Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
I don't believe that a document has to be Standards Tr= ack to create a registry that will require Standards Track going forward.It is a bit unusual, but I don't see a process problem.
Regards,
Alia


On Mon, Oct 16, 2017 at 5:32 PM, Tony Prz= ygienda <tonysietf@gmail.com> wrote:

Valid issue, probably= for the AD to ponder on ;-)

=C2=A0Maybe the= following will serve us best here

* 4.6 Specification Required +=C2=A0

* 4.7 RFC Req= uired + =C2=A0

* 4.8=C2=A0= IETF Review

which doesn't precondit= ion Standards track but for all practical purposes does the full rigmarole = otherwise ...=C2=A0


thanks

--- tony=C2=A0<= /span>


On Mon, Oct 16, 2017 at 2:22 PM,= Peter Yee <peter@akayla.com> wrote:
Reviewer: Peter Yee
Review result: Ready with Issues

I am the assigned Gen-ART reviewer for this draft. The General Area
Review Team (Gen-ART) reviews all IETF documents being processed
by the IESG for the IETF Chair. Please wait for direction from your
document shepherd or AD before posting a new version of the draft.

For more information, please see the FAQ at

<https://trac.ietf.org/trac/gen/wiki/GenArtfaq<= /a>>.

Document: draft-ietf-bier-mpls-encapsulation-09
Reviewer: Peter Yee
Review Date: 2017-10-16
IETF LC End Date: 2017-10-16
IESG Telechat date: 2017-10-26

Summary:=C2=A0 This well-written draft is an Experimental specification for= how
encapsulation is performed in the BIER architecture in order to optimally forward a packet through a multicast domain while not being burdensome to intermediate routers.

This draft is ready with issues.

Major issues: None.

Minor issues: This Experimental draft specifies that entries to its BIER Ne= xt
Protocol Identifiers registry are to be done according to the "Standar= ds
Action" policy of RFC 8126.=C2=A0 It's not entirely clear to me wh= ether RFC 8126's
requirement that such entries be from Standards Track or BCP documents appl= ies
to the initial set of values.=C2=A0 If it does, then there's an issue h= ere between
RFC 8126 and this draft's desired status.

Nits/editorial comments:

General:

Replace "ethernet" with "Ethernet" throughout.

Replace "ethertype" with "Ethertype" or "EtherType= " throughout.=C2=A0 (IEEE usage is
varies between the two, unfortunately.)

Specific:

Page 3, second bullet item: change "is" to "are".

Page 4, last paragraph: this paragraph is redundant to one it follows fairl= y
closely in Section 1.=C2=A0 Consider striking it, although it's not har= mful.

Page 5, Section 2.1.1.1, 1st paragraph, 3rd sentence: change "ISIS&quo= t; to "IS-IS".

Page 9, OAM definition, 1st paragraph, second sentence: delete a duplicated=
"the" in the sentence.

Page 10, Section 2.1.3, 1st paragraph, 2nd sentence: delete a duplicated &q= uot;in"
from the sentence.



--001a114732dc698067055bb2d3ce-- From nobody Tue Oct 17 06:27:10 2017 Return-Path: X-Original-To: bier@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: bier@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9EF6E132125; Tue, 17 Oct 2017 06:27:02 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -0.122 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-0.122 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_20=-0.001, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE=-0.0001, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_H4=-0.01, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_WL=-0.01, SPF_PASS=-0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (1024-bit key) header.d=juniper.net Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id iaPeG_cFWh7R; Tue, 17 Oct 2017 06:27:01 -0700 (PDT) Received: from NAM03-BY2-obe.outbound.protection.outlook.com (mail-by2nam03on0126.outbound.protection.outlook.com [104.47.42.126]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id F1FC413219C; Tue, 17 Oct 2017 06:26:59 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=juniper.net; s=selector1; h=From:Date:Subject:Message-ID:Content-Type:MIME-Version; bh=rnLqCVU2j2ZLkAmKmtJZyZWLM+fYfXRU1rVtbWRO+C0=; b=OY4ckZ9m9SleU64eHav1fiGDmI1CiqqBvAN4k4urBNuc8eIMD6yAy1cPAlrattmyM8ca17R2h0GNgAl8q++DkRBDSAVRwn6axxYbdx+nDpZETERW4ZNklfoy23zXGxEC3x/pXo1ZC0AwxqKB9XtC5MX4kkcitFyQAMMCkjCI4DQ= Authentication-Results: spf=none (sender IP is ) smtp.mailfrom=erosen@juniper.net; Received: from [172.29.36.187] (66.129.241.14) by BY2PR05MB2294.namprd05.prod.outlook.com (10.166.112.144) with Microsoft SMTP Server (version=TLS1_2, cipher=TLS_ECDHE_RSA_WITH_AES_256_CBC_SHA384_P256) id 15.20.156.2; Tue, 17 Oct 2017 13:26:57 +0000 To: Alia Atlas , Tony Przygienda Cc: Peter Yee , "gen-art@ietf.org" , draft-ietf-bier-mpls-encapsulation.all@ietf.org, "bier@ietf.org" , IETF Discussion Mailing List References: <150818892635.438.2743077513006159051@ietfa.amsl.com> From: Eric C Rosen Message-ID: <35595357-9c4d-eb48-468e-90842caad4a9@juniper.net> Date: Tue, 17 Oct 2017 09:27:04 -0400 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows NT 10.0; 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From nobody Tue Oct 17 08:02:01 2017 Return-Path: X-Original-To: bier@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: bier@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id DBC7C134211; Tue, 17 Oct 2017 08:01:59 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.999 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.999 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=gmail.com Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id JrPCz-utAZtg; Tue, 17 Oct 2017 08:01:53 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail-wr0-x229.google.com (mail-wr0-x229.google.com [IPv6:2a00:1450:400c:c0c::229]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 45902132D22; Tue, 17 Oct 2017 08:01:53 -0700 (PDT) Received: by mail-wr0-x229.google.com with SMTP id j14so2016656wre.8; Tue, 17 Oct 2017 08:01:53 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20161025; h=mime-version:in-reply-to:references:from:date:message-id:subject:to :cc; bh=nuaTUHM7AnjjBX5M/KYg6STCFTgwB8B/LXS/LwqAogo=; b=SVJj67s7PSdXZ43V0nqJhWYOAE7cL1ztIGTiep+0ZEvvGxZdn1Q6VPd8O9A7F0ucuF 6xZrw47z7DOLofM+ii6htJDdUQS1Zk9np9usbrhzCthb1psUYJs/JpXJwu6LuT2Rw//7 aG9/pSfJKe7GqvUJv53igNQwnoipK7El9n3nWi4wJpv+NGGbB6NymFJHdziFJ1jDvH9u WA/E0VUJaIOY75Q+1nqyjo8AGA37ML53BS91ipu4YvjNcgK/VOIBpvVOtW/m86jOF18S 9J9BGq+MytOS9IP87b1zqjEEkGEtxE8HmqwcdNpsng0MKhe1mPPSTk7OyOG49yPTyOku 9rVw== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:in-reply-to:references:from:date :message-id:subject:to:cc; bh=nuaTUHM7AnjjBX5M/KYg6STCFTgwB8B/LXS/LwqAogo=; b=NAlTGDQfBC90AzQVFcnWlWWLYxl48O9zii/nArmZ5kLGO0dZrCYSxREX+g6/Glkrah 6EIwdAGfPcoXlFqkA0znANCX+LQ5G2xGl2GYf/GAly7KRmRNUBQy1xqWR66t2j8SfrVX m2dgRh686jgzHr62gBRtQ2LniDxFml9Mwzr8ZJs7v0l6T01lMQ1TLcEBir0fXQXolT5j hXLdgRV8d/WGQnD/XWLIOCrxRSAoC3PaUVNZKiFv2xEX9WvNniRb6sHz37gc2Kxpc+ih Y64WwdBg1fct1WweGiZ5nzQbJAB1LlpeqzBiuBgwN7lyWOyi0m4/z0YyQ3ym0N2eCPG5 bxxA== X-Gm-Message-State: AMCzsaUOduAYATNdpHw39uNrT+MyZOaKOq5SwVxUH7ZR+244cNYURF5+ fq1rLxkWYQmAFy8fZkMPW8vWFxSwf9R3ec/ZspW38w== X-Google-Smtp-Source: ABhQp+QtRInwEIbWeIohW53baqQWEcVHq/emZj5ZKQsQo3h8VfPhmjtaomjg2vleZ4Bl/veYcIdap7NT84+wtMOOjLU= X-Received: by 10.223.187.1 with SMTP id r1mr3850918wrg.253.1508252511614; Tue, 17 Oct 2017 08:01:51 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 Received: by 10.223.183.202 with HTTP; Tue, 17 Oct 2017 08:01:50 -0700 (PDT) In-Reply-To: <35595357-9c4d-eb48-468e-90842caad4a9@juniper.net> References: <150818892635.438.2743077513006159051@ietfa.amsl.com> <35595357-9c4d-eb48-468e-90842caad4a9@juniper.net> From: Alia Atlas Date: Tue, 17 Oct 2017 11:01:50 -0400 Message-ID: To: Eric C Rosen Cc: Tony Przygienda , Peter Yee , "gen-art@ietf.org" , draft-ietf-bier-mpls-encapsulation.all@ietf.org, "bier@ietf.org" , IETF Discussion Mailing List Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="089e0820f7382fbb12055bbf674f" Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Bier] Genart telechat review of draft-ietf-bier-mpls-encapsulation-09 X-BeenThere: bier@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 Precedence: list List-Id: "\"Bit Indexed Explicit Replication discussion list\"" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 17 Oct 2017 15:02:00 -0000 --089e0820f7382fbb12055bbf674f Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" On Tue, Oct 17, 2017 at 9:27 AM, Eric C Rosen wrote: > On 10/16/2017 8:01 PM, Alia Atlas wrote: > >> I don't believe that a document has to be Standards Track to create a >> registry that will require Standards Track going forward. >> It is a bit unusual, but I don't see a process problem. >> >> > If our documents get converted to Standards Track, this won't be a > problem. But if they stay Experimental for an extended period of time, an > issue could arise the next time we need to allocate a codepoint. ("Since > you have no Standards Track documents, we can't allow you to register any > codepoints in registries with "Standards Action" policy.) So we might want > a registration policy that will allow codepoint allocations to be done in > Experimental track documents that are accepted by the WG. Maybe we should > change the registration policy to "IETF Review". That seems to be almost > the same as Standard Action, but does not require Standards Track > documents. And it is still eligible for Early Allocation. True enough. That could work as well. I don't see near-term updates to the Next Protocol registry as very likely, but I'd be fine with this approach. Regards, Alia --089e0820f7382fbb12055bbf674f Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
On T= ue, Oct 17, 2017 at 9:27 AM, Eric C Rosen <erosen@juniper.net> wrote:
On 10/16/2017= 8:01 PM, Alia Atlas wrote:
I don't believe that a document has to be Standards Track to create a r= egistry that will require Standards Track going forward.
It is a bit unusual, but I don't see a process problem.


 If our documents get converted to Standards Track, this won't be a prob= lem.=C2=A0 But if they stay Experimental for an extended period of time, an= issue could arise the next time we need to allocate a codepoint.=C2=A0=C2= =A0 ("Since you have no Standards Track documents, we can't allow = you to register any codepoints in registries with "Standards Action&qu= ot; policy.)=C2=A0 So we might want a registration policy that will allow c= odepoint allocations to be done in Experimental track documents that are ac= cepted by the WG.=C2=A0 Maybe we should change the registration policy to &= quot;IETF Review".=C2=A0 That seems to be almost the same as Standard = Action, but does not require Standards Track documents.=C2=A0 And it is sti= ll eligible for Early Allocation.

True enou= gh.=C2=A0 That could work as well.=C2=A0 I don't see near-term updates = to the Next Protocol registry as very likely, but I'd be fine with this= approach.

Regards,
Alia=C2=A0
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<150833396588.12414.3512358987933200152@ietfa.amsl.com> Date: Wed, 18 Oct 2017 06:39:25 -0700 Archived-At: Subject: [Bier] I-D Action: draft-ietf-bier-mpls-encapsulation-10.txt X-BeenThere: bier@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 List-Id: "\"Bit Indexed Explicit Replication discussion list\"" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 18 Oct 2017 13:39:26 -0000 A New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line Internet-Drafts directories. This draft is a work item of the Bit Indexed Explicit Replication WG of the IETF. Title : Encapsulation for Bit Index Explicit Replication in MPLS and non-MPLS Networks Authors : IJsbrand Wijnands Eric C. Rosen Andrew Dolganow Jeff Tantsura Sam K Aldrin Israel Meilik Filename : draft-ietf-bier-mpls-encapsulation-10.txt Pages : 21 Date : 2017-10-18 Abstract: Bit Index Explicit Replication (BIER) is an architecture that provides optimal multicast forwarding through a "multicast domain", without requiring intermediate routers to maintain any per-flow state or to engage in an explicit tree-building protocol. When a multicast data packet enters the domain, the ingress router determines the set of egress routers to which the packet needs to be sent. The ingress router then encapsulates the packet in a BIER header. The BIER header contains a bitstring in which each bit represents exactly one egress router in the domain; to forward the packet to a given set of egress routers, the bits corresponding to those routers are set in the BIER header. The details of the encapsulation depend on the type of network used to realize the multicast domain. This document specifies a BIER encapsulation that can be used in an MPLS network, or with slight differences, in a non-MPLS network. The IETF datatracker status page for this draft is: https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-bier-mpls-encapsulation/ There are also htmlized versions available at: https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-bier-mpls-encapsulation-10 https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/html/draft-ietf-bier-mpls-encapsulation-10 A diff from the previous version is available at: https://www.ietf.org/rfcdiff?url2=draft-ietf-bier-mpls-encapsulation-10 Please note that it may take a couple of minutes from the time of submission until the htmlized version and diff are available at tools.ietf.org. Internet-Drafts are also available by anonymous FTP at: ftp://ftp.ietf.org/internet-drafts/ From nobody Thu Oct 19 14:22:47 2017 Return-Path: X-Original-To: bier@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: bier@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9DE69132CE7 for ; Thu, 19 Oct 2017 14:22:45 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE=-0.0001, SPF_PASS=-0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=gmail.com Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id DwtwT9pf0YGG for ; Thu, 19 Oct 2017 14:22:44 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail-pf0-x234.google.com (mail-pf0-x234.google.com [IPv6:2607:f8b0:400e:c00::234]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 13206132A1A for ; Thu, 19 Oct 2017 14:22:44 -0700 (PDT) Received: by mail-pf0-x234.google.com with SMTP id n89so7815154pfk.11 for ; Thu, 19 Oct 2017 14:22:44 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20161025; h=user-agent:date:subject:from:to:message-id:thread-topic :mime-version:content-transfer-encoding; bh=tSQM2QW5HbxObcknfRyRBfpv0RNkAPlg87sKy1lZTDY=; b=Y/r0vSKkt2jNeqRFx5WRdnRnFQ3wMyJ4FFW2NfsKZu2Th5lKv8CGUNUUjsrlOCXdTI cFpdn3QZmZZ64HqDBabir4uldXZ6XxdlSd0PPW8YWo1PbKaOEIxVtqWDX4Lcnl/gPwlz P+CAxRDhngtx4lJrs9cuFtRiihUsjwyjUrpS1lJItY/pLDCA/eOAASWNlGkgbAjn4m2m GjAqBF48nQ2jcIas5k+pB3N1Ml9Ixzytdo2ltsXsEoZfv9mrohCo0w4+Khc7r83iueeN bKzsJxb1SvrgNVmWPTI9RRll2eMOy6x+4dabZW/PmnMgGoGrSC0UPsvk/M1vkJM6u4O1 isnw== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:user-agent:date:subject:from:to:message-id :thread-topic:mime-version:content-transfer-encoding; bh=tSQM2QW5HbxObcknfRyRBfpv0RNkAPlg87sKy1lZTDY=; b=aH5tLW6qoIQQ0mIPtp5MuNbhmIiSjHDr0Hp8vn5m2uUWtXDGY5UMVnKhQDEAlTT3dX f+QSf5dgvU8REvUrXK0J2C169FtwxMItG7Rp97NWH3QsMfU/5xhPFsvTxuogWEnItYsK qDW7VA8f7JxSNxtGAKYhkUmEpmzpleLlmkSpyTsPiz4f3COFBbfmY/u9Z/disMfMW16T kjsAqjc2p9TcG4hWVrQZOmiWDO14PNRkBGYybaez5NLL6FaOn7/1raNQjsJmJxjcYdCa NKWV9hdS7r8feEBnLuibAWX6CDf4k/wpnFFBi2zn9OGsoE4Obt2glvk+NkBUFfyLq9i0 IRBQ== X-Gm-Message-State: AMCzsaWC9BG48ZojDfzCjVp7uzbCVnzEkx60ZYWKKUg+ude1zfd8tSA1 c25L3Lozxb7xCuk9DtmgSke3Yw== X-Google-Smtp-Source: ABhQp+TShupf4YuE5+mBO+IqNeCuqORem5FIA0psOEvpeUHFSvE2aHNUkoyXzYpY8QOh4GsxzxcZfw== X-Received: by 10.84.234.197 with SMTP id i5mr2497249plt.316.1508448163372; Thu, 19 Oct 2017 14:22:43 -0700 (PDT) Received: from [192.168.1.2] ([76.126.247.72]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id p189sm24917845pfp.170.2017.10.19.14.22.42 for (version=TLS1_2 cipher=ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 bits=128/128); Thu, 19 Oct 2017 14:22:42 -0700 (PDT) User-Agent: Microsoft-MacOutlook/f.26.0.170902 Date: Thu, 19 Oct 2017 14:22:41 -0700 From: Jeff Tantsura To: Message-ID: Thread-Topic: adoption of BIER-TE-arch as WG draft Mime-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Bier] adoption of BIER-TE-arch as WG draft X-BeenThere: bier@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 Precedence: list List-Id: "\"Bit Indexed Explicit Replication discussion list\"" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 19 Oct 2017 21:22:45 -0000 Greg, Rather late, support. Thanks, Jeff Date: Tue, 1 Aug 2017 19:02:03 -0700 From: Greg Shepherd To: "bier@ietf.org" Subject: [Bier] Call for adoption: draft-eckert-bier-te-arch Message-ID: We had solid support in the room in Prague to adopt this work. So let's get a vote from the list. Please read and respond for or against adopting this as a WG document: https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-eckert-bier-te-arch/ https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-eckert-bier-te-frr/ Cheers, Greg _______________________________________________ BIER mailing list BIER@ietf.org https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/bier From nobody Fri Oct 20 02:20:25 2017 Return-Path: X-Original-To: bier@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: bier@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5EAE2124F57 for ; Fri, 20 Oct 2017 02:20:23 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -4.221 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-4.221 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-2.3, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_H3=-0.01, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_WL=-0.01, SPF_PASS=-0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id wESKFdR5rbuo for ; Fri, 20 Oct 2017 02:20:20 -0700 (PDT) Received: from lhrrgout.huawei.com (lhrrgout.huawei.com [194.213.3.17]) (using TLSv1 with cipher RC4-SHA (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id F0A161320D8 for ; Fri, 20 Oct 2017 02:20:19 -0700 (PDT) Received: from 172.18.7.190 (EHLO lhreml702-cah.china.huawei.com) ([172.18.7.190]) by lhrrg01-dlp.huawei.com (MOS 4.3.7-GA FastPath queued) with ESMTP id DYD00344; Fri, 20 Oct 2017 09:20:18 +0000 (GMT) Received: from NKGEML414-HUB.china.huawei.com (10.98.56.75) by lhreml702-cah.china.huawei.com (10.201.108.43) with Microsoft SMTP Server (TLS) id 14.3.361.1; Fri, 20 Oct 2017 10:20:17 +0100 Received: from NKGEML514-MBX.china.huawei.com ([fe80::40a8:f0d:c0f3:2ca5]) by nkgeml414-hub.china.huawei.com ([10.98.56.75]) with mapi id 14.03.0235.001; Fri, 20 Oct 2017 17:20:05 +0800 From: Xiejingrong To: "bier@ietf.org" Thread-Topic: [Bier] I-D Action: draft-ietf-bier-ospf-bier-extensions-08.txt Thread-Index: AdNJhHPts1TTbb4CT1+k6zvc/YnSyw== Date: Fri, 20 Oct 2017 09:20:04 +0000 Message-ID: <16253F7987E4F346823E305D08F9115A951BF570@nkgeml514-mbx.china.huawei.com> Accept-Language: zh-CN, en-US Content-Language: zh-CN X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: x-originating-ip: [10.111.217.214] Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable MIME-Version: 1.0 X-CFilter-Loop: Reflected X-Mirapoint-Virus-RAPID-Raw: score=unknown(0), refid=str=0001.0A020202.59E9BFD2.007D, ss=1, re=0.000, recu=0.000, reip=0.000, cl=1, cld=1, fgs=0, ip=0.0.0.0, so=2013-06-18 04:22:30, dmn=2013-03-21 17:37:32 X-Mirapoint-Loop-Id: 69e3adecdc6c24b5e1575bc6c2d314a2 Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Bier] I-D Action: draft-ietf-bier-ospf-bier-extensions-08.txt X-BeenThere: bier@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 Precedence: list List-Id: "\"Bit Indexed Explicit Replication discussion list\"" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 20 Oct 2017 09:20:23 -0000 HI, all: About draft-ietf-bier-ospf-bier-extensions-08.txt,=20 In chap 2.1, BIER Sub-TLV is defined as a sub-tlv of the Extended Prefix TL= V (defined in RFC7684). In chap 2.2, The BIER MPLS Encapsulation Sub-TLV is a Sub-TLV of the BIER S= ub-TLV. In chap 2.3, The BIER Tree Type Sub-TLV is a Sub-TLV of the BIER Sub-TLV. In chap 2.4, The BIER sub-domain BSL conversion Sub-TLV is a Sub-TLV of the= BIER Sub-TLV. =20 In chap 4, The document requests three new allocations from the OSPF Extend= ed Prefix sub-TLV registry as defined in [RFC7684]. Should the allocation for 3 Sub-TLVs of the BIER Sub-TLV be from some regis= try, other than the OSPF Extended Prefix sub-TLV registry? 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20 Oct 2017 11:57:59 +0000 Received: from XCH-RTP-012.cisco.com (xch-rtp-012.cisco.com [64.101.220.152]) by rcdn-core-7.cisco.com (8.14.5/8.14.5) with ESMTP id v9KBvxcm024731 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Fri, 20 Oct 2017 11:57:59 GMT Received: from xch-rtp-015.cisco.com (64.101.220.155) by XCH-RTP-012.cisco.com (64.101.220.152) with Microsoft SMTP Server (TLS) id 15.0.1320.4; Fri, 20 Oct 2017 07:57:58 -0400 Received: from xch-rtp-015.cisco.com ([64.101.220.155]) by XCH-RTP-015.cisco.com ([64.101.220.155]) with mapi id 15.00.1320.000; Fri, 20 Oct 2017 07:57:58 -0400 From: "Acee Lindem (acee)" To: Xiejingrong , "bier@ietf.org" CC: OSPF WG List Thread-Topic: [Bier] I-D Action: draft-ietf-bier-ospf-bier-extensions-08.txt Thread-Index: AdNJhHPts1TTbb4CT1+k6zvc/YnSywAFirAA Date: Fri, 20 Oct 2017 11:57:58 +0000 Message-ID: References: <16253F7987E4F346823E305D08F9115A951BF570@nkgeml514-mbx.china.huawei.com> In-Reply-To: <16253F7987E4F346823E305D08F9115A951BF570@nkgeml514-mbx.china.huawei.com> Accept-Language: en-US Content-Language: en-US X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: x-ms-exchange-messagesentrepresentingtype: 1 x-ms-exchange-transport-fromentityheader: Hosted x-originating-ip: [10.116.152.195] Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-ID: <645ABC393208F244A4E925031988718B@emea.cisco.com> Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64 MIME-Version: 1.0 Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Bier] I-D Action: draft-ietf-bier-ospf-bier-extensions-08.txt X-BeenThere: bier@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 Precedence: list List-Id: "\"Bit Indexed Explicit Replication discussion list\"" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 20 Oct 2017 11:58:02 -0000 SGkgWGllamluZywgKCtPU1BGIExpc3QpLA0KDQpPbiAxMC8yMC8xNywgNToyMCBBTSwgIkJJRVIg b24gYmVoYWxmIG9mIFhpZWppbmdyb25nIg0KPGJpZXItYm91bmNlc0BpZXRmLm9yZyBvbiBiZWhh bGYgb2YgeGllamluZ3JvbmdAaHVhd2VpLmNvbT4gd3JvdGU6DQoNCj5ISSwgYWxsOg0KPg0KPkFi b3V0IGRyYWZ0LWlldGYtYmllci1vc3BmLWJpZXItZXh0ZW5zaW9ucy0wOC50eHQsDQo+SW4gY2hh cCAyLjEsIEJJRVIgU3ViLVRMViBpcyBkZWZpbmVkIGFzIGEgc3ViLXRsdiBvZiB0aGUgRXh0ZW5k ZWQgUHJlZml4DQo+VExWIChkZWZpbmVkIGluIFJGQzc2ODQpLg0KPkluIGNoYXAgMi4yLCBUaGUg QklFUiBNUExTIEVuY2Fwc3VsYXRpb24gU3ViLVRMViBpcyBhIFN1Yi1UTFYgb2YgdGhlIEJJRVIN Cj5TdWItVExWLg0KPkluIGNoYXAgMi4zLCBUaGUgQklFUiBUcmVlIFR5cGUgU3ViLVRMViBpcyBh IFN1Yi1UTFYgb2YgdGhlIEJJRVIgU3ViLVRMVi4NCj5JbiBjaGFwIDIuNCwgVGhlIEJJRVIgc3Vi LWRvbWFpbiBCU0wgY29udmVyc2lvbiBTdWItVExWIGlzIGEgU3ViLVRMViBvZg0KPnRoZSBCSUVS IFN1Yi1UTFYuIA0KPkluIGNoYXAgNCwgVGhlIGRvY3VtZW50IHJlcXVlc3RzIHRocmVlIG5ldyBh bGxvY2F0aW9ucyBmcm9tIHRoZSBPU1BGDQo+RXh0ZW5kZWQgUHJlZml4IHN1Yi1UTFYgcmVnaXN0 cnkgYXMgZGVmaW5lZCBpbiBbUkZDNzY4NF0uDQo+DQo+U2hvdWxkIHRoZSBhbGxvY2F0aW9uIGZv ciAzIFN1Yi1UTFZzIG9mIHRoZSBCSUVSIFN1Yi1UTFYgYmUgZnJvbSBzb21lDQo+cmVnaXN0cnks IG90aGVyIHRoYW4gdGhlIE9TUEYgRXh0ZW5kZWQgUHJlZml4IHN1Yi1UTFYgcmVnaXN0cnk/DQoN Ck5vLiBXaXRoIDY0SyBTdWItVExWIHR5cGVzLCBpdCBpcyBub3QgbGlrZWx5IHRoYXQgd2Ugd2ls bCBydW4gb3V0IGFueSB0aW1lDQpzb29uIGFuZCBzb21lIG9mIHRoZSBTdWItVExWcyBhcHBseSB0 byBtdWx0aXBsZSBUTFZzLg0KDQpUaGFua3MsDQpBY2VlIA0KPl9fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19f X19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fDQo+QklFUiBtYWlsaW5nIGxpc3QNCj5CSUVSQGll dGYub3JnDQo+aHR0cHM6Ly93d3cuaWV0Zi5vcmcvbWFpbG1hbi9saXN0aW5mby9iaWVyDQoNCg== From nobody Fri Oct 20 17:31:49 2017 Return-Path: X-Original-To: bier@ietf.org Delivered-To: bier@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from ietfa.amsl.com (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6BCBB134593; Fri, 20 Oct 2017 17:24:31 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: "\"IETF Secretariat\"" To: , Cc: bier@ietf.org, akatlas@gmail.com X-Test-IDTracker: no X-IETF-IDTracker: 6.63.2 Auto-Submitted: auto-generated Precedence: bulk Message-ID: <150854547143.20809.5310752246686748022.idtracker@ietfa.amsl.com> Date: Fri, 20 Oct 2017 17:24:31 -0700 Archived-At: Subject: [Bier] bier - Requested session has been scheduled for IETF 100 X-BeenThere: bier@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 List-Id: "\"Bit Indexed Explicit Replication discussion list\"" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sat, 21 Oct 2017 00:24:31 -0000 Dear Tony Przygienda, The session(s) that you have requested have been scheduled. Below is the scheduled session information followed by the original request. bier Session 1 (2:00:00) Tuesday, Afternoon Session II 1550-1750 Room Name: Olivia size: 150 --------------------------------------------- Request Information: --------------------------------------------------------- Working Group Name: Bit Indexed Explicit Replication Area Name: Routing Area Session Requester: Tony Przygienda Number of Sessions: 1 Length of Session(s): 2 Hours Number of Attendees: 50 Conflicts to Avoid: First Priority: ospf isis idr pim rtgwg Second Priority: bess spring Third Priority: detnet homenet grow sfc People who must be present: Tony Przygienda Greg Shepherd Alia Atlas Resources Requested: Special Requests: avoid overlap with the DC routing BoF as first priority, please. As well, it would be great (as 2nd priority) if we can avoid Friday on the scheduling since I may have to leave on Fri already. tony --------------------------------------------------------- From nobody Sun Oct 22 00:04:35 2017 Return-Path: X-Original-To: bier@ietf.org Delivered-To: bier@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from ietfa.amsl.com (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id BCC86136935; Sun, 22 Oct 2017 00:04:34 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: internet-drafts@ietf.org To: Cc: bier@ietf.org X-Test-IDTracker: no X-IETF-IDTracker: 6.63.2 Auto-Submitted: auto-generated Precedence: bulk Message-ID: <150865587472.5274.3745244194926063950@ietfa.amsl.com> Date: Sun, 22 Oct 2017 00:04:34 -0700 Archived-At: Subject: [Bier] I-D Action: draft-ietf-bier-isis-extensions-06.txt X-BeenThere: bier@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 List-Id: "\"Bit Indexed Explicit Replication discussion list\"" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sun, 22 Oct 2017 07:04:35 -0000 A New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line Internet-Drafts directories. This draft is a work item of the Bit Indexed Explicit Replication WG of the IETF. Title : BIER support via ISIS Authors : Les Ginsberg Tony Przygienda Sam Aldrin Jeffrey (Zhaohui) Zhang Filename : draft-ietf-bier-isis-extensions-06.txt Pages : 11 Date : 2017-10-22 Abstract: Specification of an ISIS extension to support BIER domains and sub- domains. The IETF datatracker status page for this draft is: https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-bier-isis-extensions/ There are also htmlized versions available at: https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-bier-isis-extensions-06 https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/html/draft-ietf-bier-isis-extensions-06 A diff from the previous version is available at: https://www.ietf.org/rfcdiff?url2=draft-ietf-bier-isis-extensions-06 Please note that it may take a couple of minutes from the time of submission until the htmlized version and diff are available at tools.ietf.org. Internet-Drafts are also available by anonymous FTP at: ftp://ftp.ietf.org/internet-drafts/ From nobody Sun Oct 22 00:16:51 2017 Return-Path: X-Original-To: bier@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: bier@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id ABC45137054; Sun, 22 Oct 2017 00:16:43 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -12.619 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-12.619 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_HI=-5, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_H3=-0.01, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_WL=-0.01, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001, USER_IN_DEF_DKIM_WL=-7.5] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (1024-bit key) header.d=cisco.com Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id lqkmpOYcytnR; Sun, 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([173.36.7.11]) with mapi id 15.00.1320.000; Sun, 22 Oct 2017 02:16:38 -0500 From: "Les Ginsberg (ginsberg)" To: Alia Atlas , "bier@ietf.org" , "isis-wg@ietf.org" , "draft-ietf-bier-isis-extensions@ietf.org" Thread-Topic: early AD review of draft-ietf-bier-isis-extensions-05 Thread-Index: AQHTNxx+v5jDaHzT9U67nRv4Be9ON6LvmeHg Date: Sun, 22 Oct 2017 07:16:38 +0000 Message-ID: <897c30c09e00424a8fcced735162bf97@XCH-ALN-001.cisco.com> References: In-Reply-To: Accept-Language: en-US Content-Language: en-US X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: x-ms-exchange-transport-fromentityheader: Hosted x-originating-ip: [10.24.82.177] Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="_000_897c30c09e00424a8fcced735162bf97XCHALN001ciscocom_" MIME-Version: 1.0 Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Bier] early AD review of draft-ietf-bier-isis-extensions-05 X-BeenThere: bier@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 Precedence: list List-Id: "\"Bit Indexed Explicit Replication discussion list\"" List-Unsubscribe: , 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IGNsYXNzPSJNc29Ob3JtYWwiIHN0eWxlPSJtYXJnaW4tbGVmdDouNWluIj5BbGlhPG86cD48L286 cD48L3A+DQo8L2Rpdj4NCjwvZGl2Pg0KPC9kaXY+DQo8L2Rpdj4NCjwvYm9keT4NCjwvaHRtbD4N Cg== --_000_FC1A013B967C407586078552F9579719junipernet_-- From nobody Sun Oct 22 10:48:54 2017 Return-Path: X-Original-To: bier@ietf.org Delivered-To: bier@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from ietfa.amsl.com (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3EBAE13A24B; Sun, 22 Oct 2017 10:48:47 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: internet-drafts@ietf.org To: Cc: bier@ietf.org X-Test-IDTracker: no X-IETF-IDTracker: 6.63.2 Auto-Submitted: auto-generated Precedence: bulk Message-ID: <150869452721.5253.1140339694126231829@ietfa.amsl.com> Date: Sun, 22 Oct 2017 10:48:47 -0700 Archived-At: Subject: [Bier] I-D Action: draft-ietf-bier-ospf-bier-extensions-09.txt X-BeenThere: bier@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 List-Id: "\"Bit Indexed Explicit Replication discussion list\"" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sun, 22 Oct 2017 17:48:47 -0000 A New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line Internet-Drafts directories. This draft is a work item of the Bit Indexed Explicit Replication WG of the IETF. Title : OSPF Extensions for BIER Authors : Peter Psenak Nagendra Kumar IJsbrand Wijnands Andrew Dolganow Tony Przygienda Jeffrey Zhang Sam Aldrin Filename : draft-ietf-bier-ospf-bier-extensions-09.txt Pages : 10 Date : 2017-10-22 Abstract: Bit Index Explicit Replication (BIER) is an architecture that provides multicast forwarding through a "BIER domain" without requiring intermediate routers to maintain multicast related per-flow state. Neither does BIER require an explicit tree-building protocol for its operation. A multicast data packet enters a BIER domain at a "Bit-Forwarding Ingress Router" (BFIR), and leaves the BIER domain at one or more "Bit-Forwarding Egress Routers" (BFERs). The BFIR router adds a BIER header to the packet. Such header contains a bit-string in which each bit represents exactly one BFER to forward the packet to. The set of BFERs to which the multicast packet needs to be forwarded is expressed by the according set of bits set in BIER packet header. This document describes the OSPF protocol extension required for BIER with MPLS encapsulation. The IETF datatracker status page for this draft is: https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-bier-ospf-bier-extensions/ There are also htmlized versions available at: https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-bier-ospf-bier-extensions-09 https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/html/draft-ietf-bier-ospf-bier-extensions-09 A diff from the previous version is available at: https://www.ietf.org/rfcdiff?url2=draft-ietf-bier-ospf-bier-extensions-09 Please note that it may take a couple of minutes from the time of submission until the htmlized version and diff are available at tools.ietf.org. Internet-Drafts are also available by anonymous FTP at: ftp://ftp.ietf.org/internet-drafts/ From nobody Mon Oct 23 08:48:26 2017 Return-Path: X-Original-To: bier@ietf.org Delivered-To: bier@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from ietfa.amsl.com (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id B8336139432; Mon, 23 Oct 2017 08:48:23 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit From: =?utf-8?q?Mirja_K=C3=BChlewind?= To: "The IESG" Cc: draft-ietf-bier-mpls-encapsulation@ietf.org, Tony Przygienda , bier-chairs@ietf.org, tonysietf@gmail.com, bier@ietf.org X-Test-IDTracker: no X-IETF-IDTracker: 6.63.2 Auto-Submitted: auto-generated Precedence: bulk Message-ID: <150877370372.24661.8401833604271666087.idtracker@ietfa.amsl.com> Date: Mon, 23 Oct 2017 08:48:23 -0700 Archived-At: Subject: [Bier] =?utf-8?q?Mirja_K=C3=BChlewind=27s_Discuss_on_draft-ietf-b?= =?utf-8?q?ier-mpls-encapsulation-10=3A_=28with_DISCUSS_and_COMMENT=29?= X-BeenThere: bier@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 List-Id: "\"Bit Indexed Explicit Replication discussion list\"" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 23 Oct 2017 15:48:24 -0000 Mirja Kühlewind has entered the following ballot position for draft-ietf-bier-mpls-encapsulation-10: Discuss When responding, please keep the subject line intact and reply to all email addresses included in the To and CC lines. (Feel free to cut this introductory paragraph, however.) Please refer to https://www.ietf.org/iesg/statement/discuss-criteria.html for more information about IESG DISCUSS and COMMENT positions. The document, along with other ballot positions, can be found here: https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-bier-mpls-encapsulation/ ---------------------------------------------------------------------- DISCUSS: ---------------------------------------------------------------------- My understanding is that this document specifies a new encapsulation. As such it should also discuss path MTU discovery and fragmentation. Maybe a pointer to section 3 of rfc3032 is sufficient. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- COMMENT: ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Nit: Given that the BSL can only ever have 7 values, I'm wondering why 4 instead of 3 bits are used, but that's not important... From nobody Mon Oct 23 11:23:56 2017 Return-Path: X-Original-To: bier@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: bier@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3A6F4139A2F; Mon, 23 Oct 2017 11:23:50 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.699 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.699 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW=-0.7, SPF_PASS=-0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=gmail.com Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id uaJ8jVpGy8e4; Mon, 23 Oct 2017 11:23:48 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail-wm0-x233.google.com (mail-wm0-x233.google.com [IPv6:2a00:1450:400c:c09::233]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 053A1138AEE; Mon, 23 Oct 2017 11:23:48 -0700 (PDT) Received: by mail-wm0-x233.google.com with SMTP id u138so11242064wmu.5; Mon, 23 Oct 2017 11:23:47 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20161025; h=mime-version:in-reply-to:references:from:date:message-id:subject:to :cc; bh=/yAhDLuKe58PaS8/FWGmteyZg+8pHNFOI24Cquc7rgI=; b=Ge4IU0rl3PwMpOX4nTAmOfD/7bmrYbNlTVGJ8GVjTJClG2O0cOHR/iLZpdpbSQK+II F1Ng7htQfFrjFGQRKpDJUSNDX6FUImPW3MaI+gp0DBaqTMhAUEXwk8L+ekhK8ZjGrBsU ytPdxgruorZBHhJN3A/XsNDHBHpLRX1/1m+po37Fiz9grOdKXSej/8XhYvvqEfo36Cyt VN6Bf/RCfFaN6SjjXFPwtSEL5p6u1KPhioUMfAWQWRx/ijx9y1tyB93drDkYn0o6pTeM RXheUGBDTJI2E8uOSo/gjK6jKUlOBPxXN/THgQzNxULRnMwg3MkiF8THAqqLNgYg6obv TeoA== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:in-reply-to:references:from:date :message-id:subject:to:cc; bh=/yAhDLuKe58PaS8/FWGmteyZg+8pHNFOI24Cquc7rgI=; b=j+UdW3PQHLRQYCBfRpKfb8+z9VVuOrHqNcZSF1TlfH6fW+YMW4eAkld8ae6LjhEu2D LzGJy4swEXTpQdoROCYv/J7SW0bXlOxFuU/U6d7Ytfhhd8uTAHmTGOr5dQUH2GM+tAgB J7esM43udXmYoZxZDwVLdJE/5nbInF56LJd4TxB4iy4wh5cvWm+/HWdFPkEvlOYuGaKZ NQBUOYx/U6mXdUAIVWRPUDtHVopCpFdl9JSvHbkEVsNJPO33V6O3sbI4v3gDntbPF+tI uws8NNNp2VjNvM2EBsEjnHmN2+YT/OyyMJ8YutDBwUcQ3gyr0CSuV1feBFn/NuSs2GzD 30dQ== X-Gm-Message-State: AMCzsaV4EDrQvKb8Imyep6fC3UtnY7989IS8Crp+FwyxKaxERmwpN/br ywdDfWnWc7aT93XYLOVfls33Gc17j8zSBLfUPUlTBPbw X-Google-Smtp-Source: ABhQp+TZRxDSzi6h7pHFzoByCkrEnomNd3+EIfSrQhD2B0T1pdE+W1tDUUsxKtcA2dxDy3rkAIaYIhiXqcGIMarzZBY= X-Received: by 10.80.147.16 with SMTP id m16mr17436412eda.121.1508783026476; Mon, 23 Oct 2017 11:23:46 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 Received: by 10.80.164.220 with HTTP; Mon, 23 Oct 2017 11:23:06 -0700 (PDT) In-Reply-To: <150877370372.24661.8401833604271666087.idtracker@ietfa.amsl.com> References: <150877370372.24661.8401833604271666087.idtracker@ietfa.amsl.com> From: Tony Przygienda Date: Mon, 23 Oct 2017 11:23:06 -0700 Message-ID: To: =?UTF-8?Q?Mirja_K=C3=BChlewind?= Cc: The IESG , draft-ietf-bier-mpls-encapsulation@ietf.org, bier-chairs@ietf.org, "bier@ietf.org" Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="94eb2c1a5070561a26055c3aec76" Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Bier] =?utf-8?q?Mirja_K=C3=BChlewind=27s_Discuss_on_draft-ietf-?= =?utf-8?q?bier-mpls-encapsulation-10=3A_=28with_DISCUSS_and_COMMENT=29?= X-BeenThere: bier@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 Precedence: list List-Id: "\"Bit Indexed Explicit Replication discussion list\"" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 23 Oct 2017 18:23:50 -0000 --94eb2c1a5070561a26055c3aec76 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Mirja, in fact, a good observation. My take would be 1) Reference to 3032 is good. Limited to IP frames in BIER frames obviously 2) For non-IP frames BIER faces the same challenges as MPLS or SPRING or any other technology where the L2(.5) encaps is non-neglectible. Not better or worse for that manner. Issue started with PPoE ;-) and if one doesn't do MTU discovery and adjusts accordingly, not much beside OAM unreachables can be done for things like L2 frames. 3) Generally, https://tools.ietf.org/wg/bier/draft-ietf-bier-path-mtu-discovery/ is available and allows efficient multicast MTU discovery. I don't think a reference is needed in this draft since it's not really encapsulation related. 4) Morever, extensive PING document is available for out-of-band or in-band continuity check in https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-bier-ping-02 . Again, I don't think it needs referencing in this document As to BSL bits, more bits are always nice and we may have future versions of BIER encaps to go ... --- tony On Mon, Oct 23, 2017 at 8:48 AM, Mirja K=C3=BChlewind wrote: > Mirja K=C3=BChlewind has entered the following ballot position for > draft-ietf-bier-mpls-encapsulation-10: Discuss > > When responding, please keep the subject line intact and reply to all > email addresses included in the To and CC lines. (Feel free to cut this > introductory paragraph, however.) > > > Please refer to https://www.ietf.org/iesg/statement/discuss-criteria.html > for more information about IESG DISCUSS and COMMENT positions. > > > The document, along with other ballot positions, can be found here: > https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-bier-mpls-encapsulation/ > > > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------- > DISCUSS: > ---------------------------------------------------------------------- > > My understanding is that this document specifies a new encapsulation. As > such > it should also discuss path MTU discovery and fragmentation. Maybe a > pointer to > section 3 of rfc3032 is sufficient. > > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------- > COMMENT: > ---------------------------------------------------------------------- > > Nit: > Given that the BSL can only ever have 7 values, I'm wondering why 4 > instead of > 3 bits are used, but that's not important... > > > --94eb2c1a5070561a26055c3aec76 Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Mirja, in fact, a good observation. My take would be=C2=A0=

1) Reference to 3032 is good. Limited to IP frames in B= IER frames obviously=C2=A0
2) For non-IP frames BIER faces the sa= me challenges as MPLS or SPRING or any other technology where the L2(.5) en= caps is non-neglectible. Not better or worse for that manner. Issue started= with PPoE ;-) =C2=A0and if one doesn't do MTU discovery and adjusts ac= cordingly, not much beside OAM unreachables can be done for things like L2 = frames.=C2=A0
3) Generally,=C2=A0https://tools.ietf.org/wg/bi= er/draft-ietf-bier-path-mtu-discovery/=C2=A0is available and allows eff= icient multicast MTU discovery. I don't think a reference is needed in = this draft since it's not really encapsulation related.=C2=A0
4) Morever, extensive PING document is available for out-of-band or in-ban= d continuity check in https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-bier-ping-02=C2=A0. A= gain, I don't think it needs referencing in this document=C2=A0

As to BSL bits, more bits are always nice and we may have= future versions of BIER encaps to go ... =C2=A0

-= -- tony =C2=A0

On Mon, Oct 23, 2017 at 8:48 AM, Mirja K=C3=BChlewind <ietf@kue= hlewind.net> wrote:
Mirja K= =C3=BChlewind has entered the following ballot position for
draft-ietf-bier-mpls-encapsulation-10: Discuss

When responding, please keep the subject line intact and reply to all
email addresses included in the To and CC lines. (Feel free to cut this
introductory paragraph, however.)


Please refer to https://www.ietf.org/iesg/<= wbr>statement/discuss-criteria.html
for more information about IESG DISCUSS and COMMENT positions.


The document, along with other ballot positions, can be found here:
https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-bier-mpls-encapsulation/



-----------------------------------------------------------------= -----
DISCUSS:
-----------------------------------------------------------------= -----

My understanding is that this document specifies a new encapsulation. As su= ch
it should also discuss path MTU discovery and fragmentation. Maybe a pointe= r to
section 3 of rfc3032 is sufficient.


-----------------------------------------------------------------= -----
COMMENT:
-----------------------------------------------------------------= -----

Nit:
Given that the BSL can only ever have 7 values, I'm wondering why 4 ins= tead of
3 bits are used, but that's not important...



--94eb2c1a5070561a26055c3aec76-- From nobody Mon Oct 23 12:08:47 2017 Return-Path: X-Original-To: bier@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: bier@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 57AAE139605; Mon, 23 Oct 2017 12:08:41 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -4.801 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-4.801 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE=-0.0001, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_H2=-2.8, SPF_PASS=-0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (1024-bit key) header.d=juniper.net Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id yi-GPL45v3VQ; Mon, 23 Oct 2017 12:08:39 -0700 (PDT) Received: from NAM02-SN1-obe.outbound.protection.outlook.com (mail-sn1nam02on0115.outbound.protection.outlook.com [104.47.36.115]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 58FE41395F3; 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In a BIER domain, the MTU for the entire domain is expected to be known by all the BFRs.  (This may be known by provisioning, or by some other method outside the scope of this document.) 2. A BFIR also knows the size of the BIER header and the size of the outer encapsulation.  Hence it knows the largest size IP packet it can encapsulate.  Call this the BIER-MTU.  If a BFIR receives an IP packet that needs to be BIER-encapsulated, but is bigger than the BIER-MTU, the BFIR takes whatever action is appropriate when a multicast router receives a multicast data packet that is too big to be forwarded properly to all its next hops.  If the appropriate action includes IP fragmentation, then the IP fragments are BIER-encapsulated and forwarded in sequence. If the appropriate action involves advertising an MTU size back to the source of the IP packet, the MTU size advertised should be the BIER-MTU. By virtue of 1., we don't need to worry about the case where a BIER-encapsulated packet is received but is too big to forward. The purpose of 2. is to indicate that we are not specifying in this document any BIER-specific modifications to the MTU/PMTUD handling, and a BFIR treats "too large to handle" IP multicast datagrams however it usually handles them. I'm not sure the reference to Section 3 of RFC3032 is really appropriate, as that material is rather specific to the handling of MPLS unicast packets. From nobody Mon Oct 23 23:20:48 2017 Return-Path: X-Original-To: bier@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: bier@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 85A1013C061 for ; Mon, 23 Oct 2017 23:20:46 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.498 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.498 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_50=0.8, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-2.3, SPF_PASS=-0.001, UNPARSEABLE_RELAY=0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id E01vg75W9YCM for ; Mon, 23 Oct 2017 23:20:41 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mxhk.zte.com.cn (mxhk.zte.com.cn [63.217.80.70]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id CFBBA13B4DB for ; Mon, 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<150886922937.25135.5523935100069499137@ietfa.amsl.com> Date: Tue, 24 Oct 2017 11:20:29 -0700 Archived-At: Subject: [Bier] Genart telechat review of draft-ietf-bier-mpls-encapsulation-10 X-BeenThere: bier@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 List-Id: "\"Bit Indexed Explicit Replication discussion list\"" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 24 Oct 2017 18:20:29 -0000 Reviewer: Peter Yee Review result: Ready I am the assigned Gen-ART reviewer for this draft. The General Area Review Team (Gen-ART) reviews all IETF documents being processed by the IESG for the IETF Chair. Please wait for direction from your document shepherd or AD before posting a new version of the draft. For more information, please see the FAQ at . Document: draft-ietf-bier-mpls-encapsulation-10 Reviewer: Peter Yee Review Date: 2017-10-24 IETF LC End Date: 2017-10-16 IESG Telechat date: 2017-10-26 Summary: The -10 version addresses my comments on -09. Ready for publication. Major issues: Minor issues: Nits/editorial comments: From nobody Tue Oct 24 11:49:29 2017 Return-Path: X-Original-To: bier@ietf.org Delivered-To: bier@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from ietfa.amsl.com (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2BF0A137ED6; Tue, 24 Oct 2017 11:49:28 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: Spencer Dawkins To: "The IESG" Cc: draft-ietf-bier-mpls-encapsulation@ietf.org, Tony Przygienda , bier-chairs@ietf.org, tonysietf@gmail.com, bier@ietf.org X-Test-IDTracker: no X-IETF-IDTracker: 6.63.2 Auto-Submitted: auto-generated Precedence: bulk Message-ID: <150887096813.25231.7630942908504911025.idtracker@ietfa.amsl.com> Date: Tue, 24 Oct 2017 11:49:28 -0700 Archived-At: Subject: [Bier] Spencer Dawkins' No Objection on draft-ietf-bier-mpls-encapsulation-10: (with COMMENT) X-BeenThere: bier@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 List-Id: "\"Bit Indexed Explicit Replication discussion list\"" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 24 Oct 2017 18:49:28 -0000 Spencer Dawkins has entered the following ballot position for draft-ietf-bier-mpls-encapsulation-10: No Objection When responding, please keep the subject line intact and reply to all email addresses included in the To and CC lines. (Feel free to cut this introductory paragraph, however.) Please refer to https://www.ietf.org/iesg/statement/discuss-criteria.html for more information about IESG DISCUSS and COMMENT positions. The document, along with other ballot positions, can be found here: https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-bier-mpls-encapsulation/ ---------------------------------------------------------------------- COMMENT: ---------------------------------------------------------------------- I agree with Mirja's Discuss position, and with the proposed resolution. Thanks to the authors for that. From nobody Tue Oct 24 12:26:31 2017 Return-Path: X-Original-To: bier@ietf.org Delivered-To: bier@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from ietfa.amsl.com (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5C746138F9C; Tue, 24 Oct 2017 12:26:30 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: Warren Kumari To: "The IESG" Cc: draft-ietf-bier-mpls-encapsulation@ietf.org, Tony Przygienda , bier-chairs@ietf.org, tonysietf@gmail.com, bier@ietf.org X-Test-IDTracker: no X-IETF-IDTracker: 6.63.2 Auto-Submitted: auto-generated Precedence: bulk Message-ID: <150887319033.25139.9928235423768492264.idtracker@ietfa.amsl.com> Date: Tue, 24 Oct 2017 12:26:30 -0700 Archived-At: Subject: [Bier] Warren Kumari's Discuss on draft-ietf-bier-mpls-encapsulation-10: (with DISCUSS and COMMENT) X-BeenThere: bier@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 List-Id: "\"Bit Indexed Explicit Replication discussion list\"" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 24 Oct 2017 19:26:30 -0000 Warren Kumari has entered the following ballot position for draft-ietf-bier-mpls-encapsulation-10: Discuss When responding, please keep the subject line intact and reply to all email addresses included in the To and CC lines. (Feel free to cut this introductory paragraph, however.) Please refer to https://www.ietf.org/iesg/statement/discuss-criteria.html for more information about IESG DISCUSS and COMMENT positions. The document, along with other ballot positions, can be found here: https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-bier-mpls-encapsulation/ ---------------------------------------------------------------------- DISCUSS: ---------------------------------------------------------------------- I believe that there needs to be better guidance of what to do when the TTL expires (and want to thank Al (OpsDir) for noticing this): "Of course, if the incoming TTL is 1, the packet MUST be treated as a packet whose TTL has been exceeded. The packet MUST NOT be forwarded, but it MAY be passed to other layers for processing (e.g., to cause an ICMP message to be generated, and/or to invoke BIER-specific traceroute procedures, and/or to invoke other OAM procedures.)" I have read the response to the OpsDir review (https://www.ietf.org/mail-archive/web/ops-dir/current/msg02897.html) -- I fully agree that mandating a response to every packet would be bad, but I think that "it MAY be passed to other layers for processing" is too weak. I think SHOULD would be fine, or, even better, something about "SHOULD, with optional implementation specific rate-limiting" or something. The current text makes it sound like it's perfectly fine to just not bother implementing any sort of reporting / response handing after dropping the packet. I think that this should be an easy fix and not hold up the document (much or at all) ---------------------------------------------------------------------- COMMENT: ---------------------------------------------------------------------- I like the document (with Mirja's MTU issue resolution) - I went through trying to find nit's to improve it, but came up dry! 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IHRoaW5rIHRoYXQgdGhpcw0KICAgIHNob3VsZCBiZSBhbiBlYXN5IGZpeCBhbmQgbm90IGhvbGQg dXAgdGhlIGRvY3VtZW50IChtdWNoIG9yIGF0IGFsbCkNCiAgICANCiAgICANCiAgICAtLS0tLS0t LS0tLS0tLS0tLS0tLS0tLS0tLS0tLS0tLS0tLS0tLS0tLS0tLS0tLS0tLS0tLS0tLS0tLS0tLS0t LS0tLS0tDQogICAgQ09NTUVOVDoNCiAgICAtLS0tLS0tLS0tLS0tLS0tLS0tLS0tLS0tLS0tLS0t LS0tLS0tLS0tLS0tLS0tLS0tLS0tLS0tLS0tLS0tLS0tLS0tLS0tDQogICAgDQogICAgSSBsaWtl IHRoZSBkb2N1bWVudCAod2l0aCBNaXJqYSdzIE1UVSBpc3N1ZSByZXNvbHV0aW9uKSAtIEkgd2Vu dCB0aHJvdWdoIHRyeWluZw0KICAgIHRvIGZpbmQgbml0J3MgdG8gaW1wcm92ZSBpdCwgYnV0IGNh bWUgdXAgZHJ5IQ0KICAgIA0KICAgIA0KICAgIA0KDQo= From nobody Tue Oct 24 18:47:07 2017 Return-Path: X-Original-To: bier@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: bier@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id A23C2138BD8 for ; Tue, 24 Oct 2017 18:47:05 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -4.221 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-4.221 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-2.3, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_H3=-0.01, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_WL=-0.01, SPF_PASS=-0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 0N5RQLDiztwp for ; Tue, 24 Oct 2017 18:47:04 -0700 (PDT) Received: from lhrrgout.huawei.com (lhrrgout.huawei.com [194.213.3.17]) (using TLSv1 with cipher RC4-SHA (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id A1484139507 for ; Tue, 24 Oct 2017 18:47:03 -0700 (PDT) Received: from 172.18.7.190 (EHLO lhreml704-cah.china.huawei.com) ([172.18.7.190]) by lhrrg01-dlp.huawei.com (MOS 4.3.7-GA FastPath queued) with ESMTP id DYJ87620; Wed, 25 Oct 2017 01:47:02 +0000 (GMT) Received: from SJCEML703-CHM.china.huawei.com (10.208.112.39) by lhreml704-cah.china.huawei.com (10.201.108.45) with Microsoft SMTP Server (TLS) id 14.3.361.1; Wed, 25 Oct 2017 02:47:01 +0100 Received: from SJCEML521-MBS.china.huawei.com ([169.254.2.92]) by SJCEML703-CHM.china.huawei.com ([169.254.5.27]) with mapi id 14.03.0361.001; Tue, 24 Oct 2017 18:46:54 -0700 From: Uma Chunduri To: "bier@ietf.org" Thread-Topic: adoption of BIER-TE-arch as WG draft Thread-Index: AQHTSSBvHNPw5krwPEO8SbmOJRI3+6Lz0u8w Date: Wed, 25 Oct 2017 01:46:53 +0000 Message-ID: <25B4902B1192E84696414485F572685413515E37@sjceml521-mbs.china.huawei.com> References: In-Reply-To: Accept-Language: en-US Content-Language: en-US X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: x-originating-ip: [10.212.246.244] Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable MIME-Version: 1.0 X-CFilter-Loop: Reflected X-Mirapoint-Virus-RAPID-Raw: score=unknown(0), refid=str=0001.0A020203.59EFED16.0025, ss=1, re=0.000, recu=0.000, reip=0.000, cl=1, cld=1, fgs=0, ip=169.254.2.92, so=2013-06-18 04:22:30, dmn=2013-03-21 17:37:32 X-Mirapoint-Loop-Id: 1084ac1815d4df1b3d0ec664816112ef Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Bier] adoption of BIER-TE-arch as WG draft X-BeenThere: bier@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 Precedence: list List-Id: "\"Bit Indexed Explicit Replication discussion list\"" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 25 Oct 2017 01:47:06 -0000 Had multiple discussions with Toerless and Jeff in Private on this topic. Support this work (but I believe some additional work has to be done too -= so as to make this fully deployable). -- Uma C. Date: Tue, 1 Aug 2017 19:02:03 -0700 From: Greg Shepherd To: "bier@ietf.org" Subject: [Bier] Call for adoption: draft-eckert-bier-te-arch Message-ID: =20 =20 We had solid support in the room in Prague to adopt this work. So let's= get a vote from the list. Please read and respond for or against adopting t= his as a WG document: =20 https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-eckert-bier-te-arch/ https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-eckert-bier-te-frr/ =20 Cheers, Greg =20 _______________________________________________ BIER mailing list BIER@ietf.org https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/bier =20 _______________________________________________ BIER mailing list BIER@ietf.org https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/bier From nobody Wed Oct 25 00:08:18 2017 Return-Path: X-Original-To: bier@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: bier@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 70EC313A344 for ; Wed, 25 Oct 2017 00:08:17 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -0.8 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-0.8 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_20=-0.001, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW=-0.7, SPF_PASS=-0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=gmail.com Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id eu4YrAm76AY7 for ; Wed, 25 Oct 2017 00:08:16 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail-wm0-x233.google.com (mail-wm0-x233.google.com [IPv6:2a00:1450:400c:c09::233]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 1B3D7139436 for ; Wed, 25 Oct 2017 00:08:16 -0700 (PDT) Received: by mail-wm0-x233.google.com with SMTP id b9so14824123wmh.0 for ; Wed, 25 Oct 2017 00:08:16 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20161025; h=mime-version:from:date:message-id:subject:to; bh=dk1gKS+pPSVLllt+TOSE0Qqh+hTmNGRcytmsxNiby5Y=; b=K0RSkzjZL9FOUxpEkRJVmf8kTmPVpUCAZpHeWHx8rHiLC8WnIMieym+LYpe2JH26Nj ljWZY+B6RwRun3sWDwvZaJ5e2z8254PUegzWl7EtiCVBe5Ls/V2UEgPTgTG/GlL4U2M9 zjJYzSDEuRZ0l8qffnR6H2db7d/TT+EZ2E+t/Sr2NS3oPREBUONfCQhwmPzpfO4jvJ9X 8/6dyn7+FXQsPQcB+zEMwstFvOeINzgmftP6XSf9uwFgijEKo8PzMejkXItDE+CsKNx4 kFlcZWYqbvGmnGqEe1OAq1PkfmofSvOp895BpP/R0mVDRrhfsF4w6yb/HLmaLGinpEFe ODMw== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:from:date:message-id:subject:to; bh=dk1gKS+pPSVLllt+TOSE0Qqh+hTmNGRcytmsxNiby5Y=; b=uVmAywrTHBElLAwJPsGHJTmXQ7Pn8sbQJnoJXwBajrsmYysoJdP3QtbL4tz6aixnN0 R7apfnOErB+9ld4YEfjn5KleWS2OftgYhVXEe7xlP0GwJgUPo2xNdTdzl3qheUIDIEfg L/vY9+5pLVJUEhwEi97V6pnKnUEi2QqP9NgK7Xrg+WH7JlewHsWQHN8g4ho38WA4m4qb tvEy5cFQpcAJPMreJ6EXuB7/rO8iicAhBWDCIzRv+Bft2iy/GgUWmTQODRoy4gCFWiNg fK+uHqBxjNsJizbMtqSkbUn/aZ3hAr4JhFQYLGms2tQESqgnkcpolIjzQBlkOQFXMt2v id+Q== X-Gm-Message-State: AMCzsaWIRKWZqhtIdXhRaJ2nqaywBd1XVV8Z/0ROrQPfh8/eW73kUroa aKowTrGpd75p+LjquS7v9teJk2VUQiUa8jgV2LuaCw== X-Google-Smtp-Source: ABhQp+R89kWoNBrYZ0NN1akTwqRbJEUzMombJH2CBp+a+Z2sypX8pmIChzqblWVHAbS1dNuAhg1bpF09EEujTmB2KAY= X-Received: by 10.80.142.79 with SMTP id 15mr23058765edx.153.1508915294621; Wed, 25 Oct 2017 00:08:14 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 Received: by 10.80.164.220 with HTTP; Wed, 25 Oct 2017 00:07:34 -0700 (PDT) From: Tony Przygienda Date: Wed, 25 Oct 2017 00:07:34 -0700 Message-ID: To: "bier@ietf.org" Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="94eb2c199e5621d2b6055c59b8cb" Archived-At: Subject: [Bier] Call for BIER Agenda items for IETF 1000 ... X-BeenThere: bier@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 Precedence: list List-Id: "\"Bit Indexed Explicit Replication discussion list\"" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 25 Oct 2017 07:08:17 -0000 --94eb2c199e5621d2b6055c59b8cb Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Why stop @ 100, BIER is 10x ;-) Seriously though, please submit agenda for IETF 100 Singapore BIER session looking forward to see you all there ... --- tony --94eb2c199e5621d2b6055c59b8cb Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Why stop @ 100, BIER is 10x ;-)=C2=A0

S= eriously though, please submit agenda for IETF 100 Singapore BIER session= =C2=A0

looking forward to see you all there ...=C2= =A0

--- tony=C2=A0
--94eb2c199e5621d2b6055c59b8cb-- From nobody Wed Oct 25 07:34:10 2017 Return-Path: X-Original-To: bier@ietf.org Delivered-To: bier@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from ietfa.amsl.com (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2CC5C1388EE; Wed, 25 Oct 2017 07:34:03 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: internet-drafts@ietf.org To: Cc: bier@ietf.org X-Test-IDTracker: no X-IETF-IDTracker: 6.63.2 Auto-Submitted: auto-generated Precedence: bulk Message-ID: <150894204311.4721.15502973129389057770@ietfa.amsl.com> Date: Wed, 25 Oct 2017 07:34:03 -0700 Archived-At: Subject: [Bier] I-D Action: draft-ietf-bier-mpls-encapsulation-11.txt X-BeenThere: bier@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 List-Id: "\"Bit Indexed Explicit Replication discussion list\"" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 25 Oct 2017 14:34:03 -0000 A New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line Internet-Drafts directories. This draft is a work item of the Bit Indexed Explicit Replication WG of the IETF. Title : Encapsulation for Bit Index Explicit Replication in MPLS and non-MPLS Networks Authors : IJsbrand Wijnands Eric C. Rosen Andrew Dolganow Jeff Tantsura Sam K Aldrin Israel Meilik Filename : draft-ietf-bier-mpls-encapsulation-11.txt Pages : 21 Date : 2017-10-25 Abstract: Bit Index Explicit Replication (BIER) is an architecture that provides optimal multicast forwarding through a "multicast domain", without requiring intermediate routers to maintain any per-flow state or to engage in an explicit tree-building protocol. When a multicast data packet enters the domain, the ingress router determines the set of egress routers to which the packet needs to be sent. The ingress router then encapsulates the packet in a BIER header. The BIER header contains a bitstring in which each bit represents exactly one egress router in the domain; to forward the packet to a given set of egress routers, the bits corresponding to those routers are set in the BIER header. The details of the encapsulation depend on the type of network used to realize the multicast domain. This document specifies a BIER encapsulation that can be used in an MPLS network, or with slight differences, in a non-MPLS network. The IETF datatracker status page for this draft is: https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-bier-mpls-encapsulation/ There are also htmlized versions available at: https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-bier-mpls-encapsulation-11 https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/html/draft-ietf-bier-mpls-encapsulation-11 A diff from the previous version is available at: https://www.ietf.org/rfcdiff?url2=draft-ietf-bier-mpls-encapsulation-11 Please note that it may take a couple of minutes from the time of submission until the htmlized version and diff are available at tools.ietf.org. Internet-Drafts are also available by anonymous FTP at: ftp://ftp.ietf.org/internet-drafts/ From nobody Wed Oct 25 07:46:00 2017 Return-Path: X-Original-To: bier@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: bier@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id E63FE13BB74 for ; Wed, 25 Oct 2017 07:45:58 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.021 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.021 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE=-0.0001, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_H3=-0.01, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_WL=-0.01, SPF_PASS=-0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (1024-bit key) header.d=juniper.net Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 89CyUcClv7cJ for ; Wed, 25 Oct 2017 07:45:49 -0700 (PDT) Received: from NAM02-CY1-obe.outbound.protection.outlook.com (mail-cys01nam02on0101.outbound.protection.outlook.com [104.47.37.101]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 6713313B48C for ; 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The section on TTL processing in Section 2.1.1.2 has been revised to address (hopefully) Warren Kumari's DISCUSS regarding TTL processing. The TTL section has also been revised to clarify that: - a packet that arrives at a given BFR with incoming TTL of 1 may be both a valid packet for BFER processing and an expired packet for forwarding; - a packet with that arrives at a given BFR with an incoming TTL of 1 is only considered to be an expired packet for forwarding if it has a bit set in its BitString that identifies some other BFR. Much of the text on TTL in section 2.2.1.2 has been removed and replaced with a reference to the corresponding material in section 2.1.1.2. On 10/25/2017 10:34 AM, internet-drafts@ietf.org wrote: > A New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line Internet-Drafts directories. > This draft is a work item of the Bit Indexed Explicit Replication WG of the IETF. > > Title : Encapsulation for Bit Index Explicit Replication in MPLS and non-MPLS Networks > Authors : IJsbrand Wijnands > Eric C. Rosen > Andrew Dolganow > Jeff Tantsura > Sam K Aldrin > Israel Meilik > Filename : draft-ietf-bier-mpls-encapsulation-11.txt > Pages : 21 > Date : 2017-10-25 > > Abstract: > Bit Index Explicit Replication (BIER) is an architecture that > provides optimal multicast forwarding through a "multicast domain", > without requiring intermediate routers to maintain any per-flow state > or to engage in an explicit tree-building protocol. When a multicast > data packet enters the domain, the ingress router determines the set > of egress routers to which the packet needs to be sent. The ingress > router then encapsulates the packet in a BIER header. The BIER > header contains a bitstring in which each bit represents exactly one > egress router in the domain; to forward the packet to a given set of > egress routers, the bits corresponding to those routers are set in > the BIER header. The details of the encapsulation depend on the type > of network used to realize the multicast domain. This document > specifies a BIER encapsulation that can be used in an MPLS network, > or with slight differences, in a non-MPLS network. > > > The IETF datatracker status page for this draft is: > https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__datatracker.ietf.org_doc_draft-2Dietf-2Dbier-2Dmpls-2Dencapsulation_&d=DwICAg&c=HAkYuh63rsuhr6Scbfh0UjBXeMK-ndb3voDTXcWzoCI&r=-DXB84eU9m4cIlq2OOcCJCQQAwJXQQswyu3F0kG0VNo&m=d0DlDe0IWjPkm5oAMdZLEqOzHm2buBezUk5869zmv_Y&s=_5Tglz9u29oibVYIrVJVSRLuLu2noxv_7_PwB2E7ymY&e= > > There are also htmlized versions available at: > https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__tools.ietf.org_html_draft-2Dietf-2Dbier-2Dmpls-2Dencapsulation-2D11&d=DwICAg&c=HAkYuh63rsuhr6Scbfh0UjBXeMK-ndb3voDTXcWzoCI&r=-DXB84eU9m4cIlq2OOcCJCQQAwJXQQswyu3F0kG0VNo&m=d0DlDe0IWjPkm5oAMdZLEqOzHm2buBezUk5869zmv_Y&s=vROgjwwJnPDW1s0mzwYm6EvR3dDfxSrmCIYtGOEVbAw&e= > https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__datatracker.ietf.org_doc_html_draft-2Dietf-2Dbier-2Dmpls-2Dencapsulation-2D11&d=DwICAg&c=HAkYuh63rsuhr6Scbfh0UjBXeMK-ndb3voDTXcWzoCI&r=-DXB84eU9m4cIlq2OOcCJCQQAwJXQQswyu3F0kG0VNo&m=d0DlDe0IWjPkm5oAMdZLEqOzHm2buBezUk5869zmv_Y&s=6IDVFNUZE8FQ9me15e6k_Uq3fdTZ-CdV3Mq-qyeMCzo&e= > > A diff from the previous version is available at: > https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__www.ietf.org_rfcdiff-3Furl2-3Ddraft-2Dietf-2Dbier-2Dmpls-2Dencapsulation-2D11&d=DwICAg&c=HAkYuh63rsuhr6Scbfh0UjBXeMK-ndb3voDTXcWzoCI&r=-DXB84eU9m4cIlq2OOcCJCQQAwJXQQswyu3F0kG0VNo&m=d0DlDe0IWjPkm5oAMdZLEqOzHm2buBezUk5869zmv_Y&s=2XeAbbL5dvVGe2cJrBWxAf6Upt9zJFqZvLDOh8MiWnk&e= > > > Please note that it may take a couple of minutes from the time of submission > until the htmlized version and diff are available at tools.ietf.org. > > Internet-Drafts are also available by anonymous FTP at: > https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=ftp-3A__ftp.ietf.org_internet-2Ddrafts_&d=DwICAg&c=HAkYuh63rsuhr6Scbfh0UjBXeMK-ndb3voDTXcWzoCI&r=-DXB84eU9m4cIlq2OOcCJCQQAwJXQQswyu3F0kG0VNo&m=d0DlDe0IWjPkm5oAMdZLEqOzHm2buBezUk5869zmv_Y&s=WtGlwYiPYY5iOc5vCiniQaUZIiQsDTpa5LQako4Gomc&e= > > _______________________________________________ > I-D-Announce mailing list > I-D-Announce@ietf.org > https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__www.ietf.org_mailman_listinfo_i-2Dd-2Dannounce&d=DwICAg&c=HAkYuh63rsuhr6Scbfh0UjBXeMK-ndb3voDTXcWzoCI&r=-DXB84eU9m4cIlq2OOcCJCQQAwJXQQswyu3F0kG0VNo&m=d0DlDe0IWjPkm5oAMdZLEqOzHm2buBezUk5869zmv_Y&s=8Q18vOqTSpMAtmAyL5_KpBJoIoMtgT832jToTp-uUzA&e= > Internet-Draft directories: https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=http-3A__www.ietf.org_shadow.html&d=DwICAg&c=HAkYuh63rsuhr6Scbfh0UjBXeMK-ndb3voDTXcWzoCI&r=-DXB84eU9m4cIlq2OOcCJCQQAwJXQQswyu3F0kG0VNo&m=d0DlDe0IWjPkm5oAMdZLEqOzHm2buBezUk5869zmv_Y&s=UOCHMCnu7mpXfp488lL6PVRc0Es5W1TP45jHqQ2aHsM&e= > or https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=ftp-3A__ftp.ietf.org_ietf_1shadow-2Dsites.txt&d=DwICAg&c=HAkYuh63rsuhr6Scbfh0UjBXeMK-ndb3voDTXcWzoCI&r=-DXB84eU9m4cIlq2OOcCJCQQAwJXQQswyu3F0kG0VNo&m=d0DlDe0IWjPkm5oAMdZLEqOzHm2buBezUk5869zmv_Y&s=ybDOiVObxxq0uVkNC-ufBU7FB7dheIEpU35BpuLoYY0&e= From nobody Wed Oct 25 10:48:19 2017 Return-Path: X-Original-To: bier@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: bier@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id CFECF13F439 for ; 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Wed, 25 Oct 2017 10:48:15 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 Received: by 10.46.32.147 with HTTP; Wed, 25 Oct 2017 10:48:14 -0700 (PDT) In-Reply-To: References: From: Greg Mirsky Date: Wed, 25 Oct 2017 10:48:14 -0700 Message-ID: To: Tony Przygienda Cc: "bier@ietf.org" Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="94eb2c1a62bafb0f71055c62a834" Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Bier] Call for BIER Agenda items for IETF 1000 ... X-BeenThere: bier@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 Precedence: list List-Id: "\"Bit Indexed Explicit Replication discussion list\"" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 25 Oct 2017 17:48:19 -0000 --94eb2c1a62bafb0f71055c62a834 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Hi Tony, Greg, et. al, don't have updates to OAM drafts at this time. These drafts have been stable and authors believe are ready for WG LC: - draft-ietf-bier-oam-requirements; - draft-ietf-bier-path-mtu-discovery; - draft-ietf-bier-pmmm-oam. Comments, questions are always welcome and greatly appreciated. Regards, Greg On Wed, Oct 25, 2017 at 12:07 AM, Tony Przygienda wrote: > Why stop @ 100, BIER is 10x ;-) > > Seriously though, please submit agenda for IETF 100 Singapore BIER session > > looking forward to see you all there ... > > --- tony > > _______________________________________________ > BIER mailing list > BIER@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/bier > > --94eb2c1a62bafb0f71055c62a834 Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Hi Tony, Greg, et. al,
don't have updates to OAM d= rafts at this time. These drafts have been stable and authors believe are r= eady for WG LC:
  • draft-ietf-bier-oam-requirements;
  • draft-ietf-bier-path-mtu-discovery;
  • draft-ietf-bier-pmmm-o= am.
Comments, questions are always welcome and greatly ap= preciated.

Regards,
Greg

On Wed, Oct 25,= 2017 at 12:07 AM, Tony Przygienda <tonysietf@gmail.com> w= rote:
Why stop @ 100, BI= ER is 10x ;-)=C2=A0

Seriously though, please submit agen= da for IETF 100 Singapore BIER session=C2=A0

looki= ng forward to see you all there ...=C2=A0

--- tony=C2=A0
_______________________________________________
BIER mailing list
BIER@ietf.org
https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/bier


--94eb2c1a62bafb0f71055c62a834-- From nobody Wed Oct 25 11:34:22 2017 Return-Path: X-Original-To: bier@ietf.org Delivered-To: bier@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from ietfa.amsl.com (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 65F981389AC; Wed, 25 Oct 2017 11:34:15 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: Warren Kumari To: "The IESG" Cc: draft-ietf-bier-mpls-encapsulation@ietf.org, Tony Przygienda , bier-chairs@ietf.org, tonysietf@gmail.com, bier@ietf.org X-Test-IDTracker: no X-IETF-IDTracker: 6.63.2 Auto-Submitted: auto-generated Precedence: bulk Message-ID: <150895645537.4886.8826323757253136418.idtracker@ietfa.amsl.com> Date: Wed, 25 Oct 2017 11:34:15 -0700 Archived-At: Subject: [Bier] Warren Kumari's No Objection on draft-ietf-bier-mpls-encapsulation-11: (with COMMENT) X-BeenThere: bier@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 List-Id: "\"Bit Indexed Explicit Replication discussion list\"" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 25 Oct 2017 18:34:15 -0000 Warren Kumari has entered the following ballot position for draft-ietf-bier-mpls-encapsulation-11: No Objection When responding, please keep the subject line intact and reply to all email addresses included in the To and CC lines. (Feel free to cut this introductory paragraph, however.) Please refer to https://www.ietf.org/iesg/statement/discuss-criteria.html for more information about IESG DISCUSS and COMMENT positions. The document, along with other ballot positions, can be found here: https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-bier-mpls-encapsulation/ ---------------------------------------------------------------------- COMMENT: ---------------------------------------------------------------------- [ Edit: Thanks for addressing my DISCUSS - I think that the document is now even better ] I like the document (with Mirja's MTU issue resolution) - I went through trying to find nit's to improve it, but came up dry! -- Original discuss for posterity --- I believe that there needs to be better guidance of what to do when the TTL expires (and want to thank Al (OpsDir) for noticing this): "Of course, if the incoming TTL is 1, the packet MUST be treated as a packet whose TTL has been exceeded. The packet MUST NOT be forwarded, but it MAY be passed to other layers for processing (e.g., to cause an ICMP message to be generated, and/or to invoke BIER-specific traceroute procedures, and/or to invoke other OAM procedures.)" I have read the response to the OpsDir review (https://www.ietf.org/mail-archive/web/ops-dir/current/msg02897.html) -- I fully agree that mandating a response to every packet would be bad, but I think that "it MAY be passed to other layers for processing" is too weak. I think SHOULD would be fine, or, even better, something about "SHOULD, with optional implementation specific rate-limiting" or something. The current text makes it sound like it's perfectly fine to just not bother implementing any sort of reporting / response handing after dropping the packet. I think that this should be an easy fix and not hold up the document (much or at all) From nobody Wed Oct 25 14:58:02 2017 Return-Path: X-Original-To: bier@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: bier@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6FE1A13F479; Wed, 25 Oct 2017 14:58:01 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -4.199 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-4.199 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, HEADER_FROM_DIFFERENT_DOMAINS=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-2.3] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 1AtBNBWVc25A; Wed, 25 Oct 2017 14:57:59 -0700 (PDT) Received: from faui40.informatik.uni-erlangen.de (faui40.informatik.uni-erlangen.de [IPv6:2001:638:a000:4134::ffff:40]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher AECDH-AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 240601394F2; Wed, 25 Oct 2017 14:57:58 -0700 (PDT) Received: from faui40p.informatik.uni-erlangen.de (faui40p.informatik.uni-erlangen.de [IPv6:2001:638:a000:4134::ffff:77]) by faui40.informatik.uni-erlangen.de (Postfix) with ESMTP id DE9AC58C54C; Wed, 25 Oct 2017 23:57:54 +0200 (CEST) Received: by faui40p.informatik.uni-erlangen.de (Postfix, from userid 10463) id 9826BB0CFAA; Wed, 25 Oct 2017 23:57:54 +0200 (CEST) Date: Wed, 25 Oct 2017 23:57:54 +0200 From: Toerless Eckert To: Greg Shepherd Cc: "bier@ietf.org" , bier-chairs@ietf.org, akatlas@gmail.com Message-ID: <20171025215754.GA18857@faui40p.informatik.uni-erlangen.de> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline User-Agent: Mutt/1.5.21 (2010-09-15) Archived-At: Subject: [Bier] Greg/Tony: Re: Call for adoption: draft-eckert-bier-te-arch X-BeenThere: bier@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 Precedence: list List-Id: "\"Bit Indexed Explicit Replication discussion list\"" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 25 Oct 2017 21:58:01 -0000 Hi Greg/Tony I think i have seen now >=8 voices supporting adoption of BIER-TE, what's the next step ? Cheers Toerless On Tue, Aug 01, 2017 at 07:02:03PM -0700, Greg Shepherd wrote: > We had solid support in the room in Prague to adopt this work. So let's get > a vote from the list. Please read and respond for or against adopting this > as a WG document: > > https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-eckert-bier-te-arch/ > https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-eckert-bier-te-frr/ > > Cheers, > Greg > _______________________________________________ > BIER mailing list > BIER@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/bier From nobody Wed Oct 25 15:43:52 2017 Return-Path: X-Original-To: bier@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: bier@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id EE64413A41A; Wed, 25 Oct 2017 15:43:50 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.699 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.699 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW=-0.7, SPF_PASS=-0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=gmail.com Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id xjbZn_KnBMWb; Wed, 25 Oct 2017 15:43:49 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail-it0-x22c.google.com (mail-it0-x22c.google.com [IPv6:2607:f8b0:4001:c0b::22c]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 5A1F31396DD; Wed, 25 Oct 2017 15:43:49 -0700 (PDT) Received: by mail-it0-x22c.google.com with SMTP id n195so3028374itg.0; Wed, 25 Oct 2017 15:43:49 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20161025; h=mime-version:reply-to:in-reply-to:references:from:date:message-id :subject:to:cc; bh=94uzI//NAbzMIVA7RAUQlHtPDq6H5deYrK4ZRtVrASk=; b=Y+nizIOCDkQDUABUNIkyDqn6IjD7JqqPQ3UFORiVvSyHQkso40MBsM8+RPTlRUrlgK 7AqJ9UF8Q/shmXIxppTkI259b1oP2jRwQFF8ABoCb9RVovZIpONr3WxsFInSjqb77Qgw u4K16TmI/8DZgj8WFfyTZIa+8q50Yzq32xG/y+1seIDKkaeXkMgsvN7/iVOeHG+S/VOV vDQdZ0GUkqeLiRw/YuevM65pCj2r2olaxzNFApZAMahuVmS2ulAH2crmUAZyA8XK+8KV 5kc6fIzf8nsGE9scuzlf6Z3dV+LweFzZdAux8oQurhBRxuX9KJ1IJ1IP6McguvAnb451 kcJQ== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:reply-to:in-reply-to:references :from:date:message-id:subject:to:cc; bh=94uzI//NAbzMIVA7RAUQlHtPDq6H5deYrK4ZRtVrASk=; b=pQ3njGtGdMHpCTCoqpQVtVtfjo7JszOpgBT3YNqY8dGwUghQ3K65phWXk1NwN7w1lX ticK9tyW8Iyr9ycz+fI+UcJjBvuPOkviZRhahuvbGazA/KCu+DpVR+yPywEZxv2EeLv1 kobDxah8YlPWam1fE75lQx4fpEbu6mQBEhTFHYvt5v/hkiZeexmMznirTlwS93Xe/3H1 F/DoABzOUNL0uJ1/tMKA4P5HtF9bB6iM+enIT4ZXTVj5JvSkULL2GTTiSTVREYGJJl82 G76jpxsqv5FNGc2vc7VYmeOTAuMtGrABPN5Ej7pQXqtiClKc3EODoM+kk7t4ZioUgcdF 39Dg== X-Gm-Message-State: AMCzsaWGYU7SGaNyRQE+GmOu/v3/FwkkBI0eG+oKMfNCgnpFzVFca8kz dS2pKO+w4U36FbdXli9TjKTci6nNVoMyW5uzBYc= X-Google-Smtp-Source: ABhQp+QNxxk/GDFeojBbv39t9ww7GU3wsqpcfZ0bCp0EgyRhhCJwPFw548iYz+IhhzX1uR3sGFXGy4A2DkBZhdZBEOs= X-Received: by 10.36.4.67 with SMTP id 64mr4083366itb.94.1508971428672; Wed, 25 Oct 2017 15:43:48 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 Received: by 10.2.165.19 with HTTP; Wed, 25 Oct 2017 15:43:48 -0700 (PDT) Reply-To: gjshep@gmail.com In-Reply-To: <20171025215754.GA18857@faui40p.informatik.uni-erlangen.de> References: <20171025215754.GA18857@faui40p.informatik.uni-erlangen.de> From: Greg Shepherd Date: Wed, 25 Oct 2017 15:43:48 -0700 Message-ID: To: Toerless Eckert Cc: "bier@ietf.org" , bier-chairs@ietf.org Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="001a1140ad4efb7ac3055c66c9cd" Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Bier] Greg/Tony: Re: Call for adoption: draft-eckert-bier-te-arch X-BeenThere: bier@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 Precedence: list List-Id: "\"Bit Indexed Explicit Replication discussion list\"" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 25 Oct 2017 22:43:51 -0000 --001a1140ad4efb7ac3055c66c9cd Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Thanks. I'll announce. Greg On Wed, Oct 25, 2017 at 2:57 PM, Toerless Eckert wrote: > Hi Greg/Tony > > I think i have seen now >=8 voices supporting adoption of BIER-TE, > what's the next step ? > > Cheers > Toerless > > On Tue, Aug 01, 2017 at 07:02:03PM -0700, Greg Shepherd wrote: > > We had solid support in the room in Prague to adopt this work. So let's > get > > a vote from the list. Please read and respond for or against adopting > this > > as a WG document: > > > > https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-eckert-bier-te-arch/ > > https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-eckert-bier-te-frr/ > > > > Cheers, > > Greg > > > _______________________________________________ > > BIER mailing list > > BIER@ietf.org > > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/bier > > _______________________________________________ > BIER mailing list > BIER@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/bier > --001a1140ad4efb7ac3055c66c9cd Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Thanks. I'll announce.

Greg

On Wed, Oct 2= 5, 2017 at 2:57 PM, Toerless Eckert <tte@cs.fau.de> wrote:
Hi Greg/Tony

I think i have seen now >=3D8 voices supporting adoption of BIER-TE,
what's the next step ?

Cheers
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 Toerless

On Tue, Aug 01, 2017 at 07:02:03PM -0700, Greg Shepherd wrote:
> We had solid support in the room in Prague to adopt this work. So let&= #39;s get
> a vote from the list. Please read and respond for or against adopting = this
> as a WG document:
>
> https://datatracker.ietf.org/do= c/draft-eckert-bier-te-arch/
> https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc= /draft-eckert-bier-te-frr/
>
> Cheers,
> Greg

> _______________________________________________
> BIER mailing list
> BIER@ietf.org
> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/bier
_______________________________________________
BIER mailing list
BIER@ietf.org
https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/bier

--001a1140ad4efb7ac3055c66c9cd-- From nobody Wed Oct 25 15:47:48 2017 Return-Path: X-Original-To: bier@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: bier@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 496D113A41A for ; Wed, 25 Oct 2017 15:47:47 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.699 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.699 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW=-0.7, SPF_PASS=-0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=gmail.com Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id HAuKbKXU_HnI for ; Wed, 25 Oct 2017 15:47:45 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail-it0-x233.google.com (mail-it0-x233.google.com [IPv6:2607:f8b0:4001:c0b::233]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id C234C13A1C7 for ; Wed, 25 Oct 2017 15:47:45 -0700 (PDT) Received: by mail-it0-x233.google.com with SMTP id o135so2903490itb.0 for ; Wed, 25 Oct 2017 15:47:45 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20161025; h=mime-version:reply-to:in-reply-to:references:from:date:message-id :subject:to; bh=jknVzUP3T0bNBXR9mjjbtMAaS8gYylr/07XKOxaREsg=; b=gQ0O39UdKnRBv4zW72qbtqPHMzoA06v1/jjfFjBXVdvd25Y7gSoHt5SP1UanDr2rlz 2A8qwGsmmlZEIAuo3QB7MvfSX03Dk+Hb+BR+UF8FLlHy6v41jOdZ/1EMoNwFIyQxeHQH Erg7DI4pF7D9IjUwy44LYQ3VWEsI9mGVhPXd0A6Qy4k3F+dgaet2nbMxCk+rN3GKdG7J SvtfyNBm1NJx4NpCRx6tflbEnJbbnivNJHAXCYXImIiYUEkqiQrp8nPo0VfO02nM8hfd iLGT5gNPttysqtFAn0Fwh9Jn9FzkgIxs/65mV4qvPzNOFKWydoTlsRwlBTP3AlBzHIX+ bntg== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:reply-to:in-reply-to:references :from:date:message-id:subject:to; bh=jknVzUP3T0bNBXR9mjjbtMAaS8gYylr/07XKOxaREsg=; b=XCoJ5cT4ChZNh7vvj1vYGtnsnUznbjtliRGdZCU8ueXAb8GcyD48eeee22aEN/UG0a LfSxXRC7Cz6rl1XOrsXuf28KkFgpAehphA8kIWBvUxD1Os8W6FK47a56dNPR0iYB6Bhd 47Ubgg4FPH6TTRaXTuDrMslUKykWs4gYbbEXPS4gdhCWp4jdjIAbdVR6l2tgtq1NZnUe 9F52fH+kVkJ8Pc9uxSdzw4fHxxNUybuVj1xx3d7XXeysZSQJUY4qDwncv4Dsl9eFOluM rPSiM9thTGZ14cVaXlFEZ6636MdvM6k+v3UuqhhOtm7eavBLT/SDXWFN/0LXVr9y/T9A IsNg== X-Gm-Message-State: AMCzsaVO7AV7+n7OCToO26my151062rhrHWjQjz+UUdVXAkT+MoDxVFO qDL9bygT7K3xwSfS4uySRmSywWcHpwE3l6QnLT4= X-Google-Smtp-Source: ABhQp+RGwb8RTrvF8gimIlbsfqT3Bbv2mmqzZ6d+wbq0PaQ58G+AnDXspzcGS7/OeYOfSXrGkk6d5p59s31MOqlK7jQ= X-Received: by 10.36.39.203 with SMTP id g194mr3957544ita.91.1508971664834; Wed, 25 Oct 2017 15:47:44 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 Received: by 10.2.165.19 with HTTP; Wed, 25 Oct 2017 15:47:44 -0700 (PDT) Reply-To: gjshep@gmail.com In-Reply-To: References: From: Greg Shepherd Date: Wed, 25 Oct 2017 15:47:44 -0700 Message-ID: To: "bier@ietf.org" Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="001a1147c5a20f070f055c66d82b" Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Bier] Call for adoption: draft-eckert-bier-te-arch X-BeenThere: bier@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 Precedence: list List-Id: "\"Bit Indexed Explicit Replication discussion list\"" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 25 Oct 2017 22:47:47 -0000 --001a1147c5a20f070f055c66d82b Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Solid support from the list, w/ no dissent. Authors, please rename and the chairs will accept as WG items. Thanks, Greg On Tue, Aug 1, 2017 at 7:02 PM, Greg Shepherd wrote: > We had solid support in the room in Prague to adopt this work. So let's > get a vote from the list. Please read and respond for or against adopting > this as a WG document: > > https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-eckert-bier-te-arch/ > https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-eckert-bier-te-frr/ > > Cheers, > Greg > --001a1147c5a20f070f055c66d82b Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Solid support from the list, w/ no dissent.

=
Authors, please rename and the chairs will accept as WG items.

Thanks,
Greg

On Tue, Aug 1, 2017 at 7:02 PM, Greg She= pherd <gjshep@gmail.com> wrote:
We had solid support in the room in Prague to adopt t= his work. So let's get a vote from the list. Please read and respond fo= r or against adopting this as a WG document:


Cheers,
Greg

--001a1147c5a20f070f055c66d82b-- From nobody Wed Oct 25 17:50:14 2017 Return-Path: X-Original-To: bier@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: bier@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 83D5B138F47; Wed, 25 Oct 2017 17:50:07 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.72 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.72 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW=-0.7, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_H3=-0.01, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_WL=-0.01, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=cooperw.in header.b=B2PciIr0; dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=messagingengine.com header.b=Yn4ewT5V Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id HX0a2ECfLRqd; Wed, 25 Oct 2017 17:50:06 -0700 (PDT) Received: from out4-smtp.messagingengine.com (out4-smtp.messagingengine.com [66.111.4.28]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher AECDH-AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 1508513A214; Wed, 25 Oct 2017 17:50:06 -0700 (PDT) Received: from compute7.internal (compute7.nyi.internal [10.202.2.47]) by mailout.nyi.internal (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6E4C120881; Wed, 25 Oct 2017 20:50:05 -0400 (EDT) Received: from frontend1 ([10.202.2.160]) by compute7.internal (MEProxy); Wed, 25 Oct 2017 20:50:05 -0400 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=cooperw.in; h=cc :content-transfer-encoding:content-type:date:from:in-reply-to :message-id:mime-version:references:subject:to:x-me-sender :x-me-sender:x-sasl-enc; s=fm1; bh=2l4pZuXoq7/Y46xpRWnudtapHYO/O 9NbjW+dwl3ohzA=; b=B2PciIr0mPEV0wG5GLOmRAN1g6kZcspV9X41f68cu2B9U npLHlM/ZKFtxnFOrv8ICRVkOClxJuyzJ8OKPUhFg6SD3IJCjwapcoQc6PgzRQcF9 YDtbOBmKqdGTputy0njsYfN9nBxNkTUw3Mmr7ic42xx/SiqHc1f1au4/MCm65Qd8 nZ+3S6YzPT1oNpfT2RHy6TLxbqWlyubw+nu+vXS8QPD2XR+Juu2XaInCz5s13pjQ sXFusYXD9VIbSGSDtnDKkV/oWxTVDZkrbjAkeBy5RHOR9Ukc+PDT+XJ7G/eLRKJn jcd8A0aP9Fh6oyfYOE2pBftOya+84IKULHzDJgRPA== DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d= messagingengine.com; h=cc:content-transfer-encoding:content-type :date:from:in-reply-to:message-id:mime-version:references :subject:to:x-me-sender:x-me-sender:x-sasl-enc; s=fm1; bh=2l4pZu Xoq7/Y46xpRWnudtapHYO/O9NbjW+dwl3ohzA=; b=Yn4ewT5VJN2d7WqOxMQoc5 06CWkgUrRINDn9lZqEkWcG0XP7BBlaNvggievdME/CM6ffShNu8XEdcA2GzXufqP lNNI5pPCn3AGtl0NWsouFbtkF9ILSg3BK+2Lda4u2tum0qPdotYg9lNX+hhVdROv jUyRZhOVt24P22pUVHlUsbQGpsS21lfW1lSH0TCaan3iNAgoBClEJub6xVjopVrV 3s9ElDYFkj5vFSFfkIwBhj1TJEfVb/P6SNoLurpzGNxH3XTyA/gcyVSJHBHwqkwP k3UeNt45doO6ZITMNj9U1cc/JIFT93PUECS9FDcOrxIbu+EcikE3ECkkkZlxU6JQ == X-ME-Sender: Received: from [10.24.101.233] (unknown [128.107.241.191]) by mail.messagingengine.com (Postfix) with ESMTPA id 6D48C7F91E; Wed, 25 Oct 2017 20:50:04 -0400 (EDT) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Mime-Version: 1.0 (Mac OS X Mail 9.3 \(3124\)) From: Alissa Cooper In-Reply-To: <150886922937.25135.5523935100069499137@ietfa.amsl.com> Date: Wed, 25 Oct 2017 20:50:02 -0400 Cc: gen-art , draft-ietf-bier-mpls-encapsulation.all@ietf.org, bier@ietf.org Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Message-Id: References: <150886922937.25135.5523935100069499137@ietfa.amsl.com> To: Peter Yee X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.3124) Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Bier] [Gen-art] Genart telechat review of draft-ietf-bier-mpls-encapsulation-10 X-BeenThere: bier@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 Precedence: list List-Id: "\"Bit Indexed Explicit Replication discussion list\"" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 26 Oct 2017 00:50:07 -0000 Peter, thanks for your reviews. Authors, thanks for addressing Peter=E2=80= =99s comments. I entered a No Objection ballot. Alissa > On Oct 24, 2017, at 2:20 PM, Peter Yee wrote: >=20 > Reviewer: Peter Yee > Review result: Ready >=20 > I am the assigned Gen-ART reviewer for this draft. The General Area > Review Team (Gen-ART) reviews all IETF documents being processed > by the IESG for the IETF Chair. Please wait for direction from your > document shepherd or AD before posting a new version of the draft. >=20 > For more information, please see the FAQ at >=20 > . >=20 > Document: draft-ietf-bier-mpls-encapsulation-10 > Reviewer: Peter Yee > Review Date: 2017-10-24 > IETF LC End Date: 2017-10-16 > IESG Telechat date: 2017-10-26 >=20 > Summary: The -10 version addresses my comments on -09. Ready for = publication. >=20 > Major issues: >=20 > Minor issues: >=20 > Nits/editorial comments:=20 >=20 >=20 > _______________________________________________ > Gen-art mailing list > Gen-art@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/gen-art From nobody Wed Oct 25 18:43:25 2017 Return-Path: X-Original-To: bier@ietf.org Delivered-To: bier@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from ietfa.amsl.com (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 840731395F3; Wed, 25 Oct 2017 18:43:24 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: Ben Campbell To: "The IESG" Cc: draft-ietf-bier-mpls-encapsulation@ietf.org, Tony Przygienda , bier-chairs@ietf.org, tonysietf@gmail.com, bier@ietf.org X-Test-IDTracker: no X-IETF-IDTracker: 6.63.2 Auto-Submitted: auto-generated Precedence: bulk Message-ID: <150898220449.24244.4522876573082009361.idtracker@ietfa.amsl.com> Date: Wed, 25 Oct 2017 18:43:24 -0700 Archived-At: Subject: [Bier] Ben Campbell's No Objection on draft-ietf-bier-mpls-encapsulation-11: (with COMMENT) X-BeenThere: bier@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 List-Id: "\"Bit Indexed Explicit Replication discussion list\"" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 26 Oct 2017 01:43:24 -0000 Ben Campbell has entered the following ballot position for draft-ietf-bier-mpls-encapsulation-11: No Objection When responding, please keep the subject line intact and reply to all email addresses included in the To and CC lines. (Feel free to cut this introductory paragraph, however.) Please refer to https://www.ietf.org/iesg/statement/discuss-criteria.html for more information about IESG DISCUSS and COMMENT positions. The document, along with other ballot positions, can be found here: https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-bier-mpls-encapsulation/ ---------------------------------------------------------------------- COMMENT: ---------------------------------------------------------------------- - Please add some text describing the nature of the experiment, even if that is simply "to get more implementation and deployment experience". - 2.1.2, "Ver": " The value 0xF is reserved for experimental use; that value MUST NOT be assigned by any future IETF document or by IANA." Isn't the entire document experimental? It seems odd to define an experimental version code. From nobody Wed Oct 25 19:28:13 2017 Return-Path: X-Original-To: bier@ietf.org Delivered-To: bier@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from ietfa.amsl.com (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7A892138FA0; Wed, 25 Oct 2017 19:28:10 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: Kathleen Moriarty To: "The IESG" Cc: draft-ietf-bier-mpls-encapsulation@ietf.org, Tony Przygienda , bier-chairs@ietf.org, tonysietf@gmail.com, bier@ietf.org X-Test-IDTracker: no X-IETF-IDTracker: 6.63.2 Auto-Submitted: auto-generated Precedence: bulk Message-ID: <150898489045.24201.17613804705297606883.idtracker@ietfa.amsl.com> Date: Wed, 25 Oct 2017 19:28:10 -0700 Archived-At: Subject: [Bier] Kathleen Moriarty's Discuss on draft-ietf-bier-mpls-encapsulation-11: (with DISCUSS) X-BeenThere: bier@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 List-Id: "\"Bit Indexed Explicit Replication discussion list\"" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 26 Oct 2017 02:28:10 -0000 Kathleen Moriarty has entered the following ballot position for draft-ietf-bier-mpls-encapsulation-11: Discuss When responding, please keep the subject line intact and reply to all email addresses included in the To and CC lines. (Feel free to cut this introductory paragraph, however.) Please refer to https://www.ietf.org/iesg/statement/discuss-criteria.html for more information about IESG DISCUSS and COMMENT positions. The document, along with other ballot positions, can be found here: https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-bier-mpls-encapsulation/ ---------------------------------------------------------------------- DISCUSS: ---------------------------------------------------------------------- I share the concerns of the SecDir reviewer and would like to see more text in the Security Considerations that reflect the inherent trust model and also the lack of integrity protection for the BIER encapsulation. Having these items detailed explicitly is an important consideration for implementers. I do realize that this is the current state with MPLS, but it bears repeating for a new encapsulation. https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/secdir/w8qqQtzlEi00uToUGT0N8XVuHkI Thank you. From nobody Wed Oct 25 21:04:11 2017 Return-Path: X-Original-To: bier@ietf.org Delivered-To: bier@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from ietfa.amsl.com (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id C819713AF04; Wed, 25 Oct 2017 21:04:04 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: Adam Roach To: "The IESG" Cc: draft-ietf-bier-mpls-encapsulation@ietf.org, Tony Przygienda , bier-chairs@ietf.org, tonysietf@gmail.com, bier@ietf.org X-Test-IDTracker: no X-IETF-IDTracker: 6.63.2 Auto-Submitted: auto-generated Precedence: bulk Message-ID: <150899064477.24092.16252024525377104970.idtracker@ietfa.amsl.com> Date: Wed, 25 Oct 2017 21:04:04 -0700 Archived-At: Subject: [Bier] Adam Roach's No Objection on draft-ietf-bier-mpls-encapsulation-11: (with COMMENT) X-BeenThere: bier@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 List-Id: "\"Bit Indexed Explicit Replication discussion list\"" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 26 Oct 2017 04:04:05 -0000 Adam Roach has entered the following ballot position for draft-ietf-bier-mpls-encapsulation-11: No Objection When responding, please keep the subject line intact and reply to all email addresses included in the To and CC lines. (Feel free to cut this introductory paragraph, however.) Please refer to https://www.ietf.org/iesg/statement/discuss-criteria.html for more information about IESG DISCUSS and COMMENT positions. The document, along with other ballot positions, can be found here: https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-bier-mpls-encapsulation/ ---------------------------------------------------------------------- COMMENT: ---------------------------------------------------------------------- The definition of BSL indicates: Note: When parsing the BIER header, a BFR MUST infer the length of the BitString from the BIFT-id, and MUST NOT infer it from the value of this field. It then goes on to say: The value of this field MUST NOT be set to any value other than those listed above. A received packet containing another value in this field SHOULD be discarded, and an error logged. The expectation that the router is auditing the value of this field raises the question of whether the router should check if the length indicated by the BFR field is different than the BFR that corresponds to this packet's BIFT-id. My suggestion would be to make this consistent: either routers always ignore the value of this field (even if it is out of range), or routers verify not just that the value is valid, but that it is in fact accurate. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- I don't see any information in the ballot or the shepherd's write-up discussing the rationale for having more than five authors on this document. Has this been discussed with the authors, contributors, and working group already? From nobody Wed Oct 25 21:20:40 2017 Return-Path: X-Original-To: bier@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: bier@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 09A44138BE2; Wed, 25 Oct 2017 21:20:39 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.998 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.998 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE=-0.0001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=gmail.com Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id Ii36vbbKdsKG; Wed, 25 Oct 2017 21:20:37 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail-wr0-x22b.google.com (mail-wr0-x22b.google.com [IPv6:2a00:1450:400c:c0c::22b]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id D0C1F13A092; Wed, 25 Oct 2017 21:20:36 -0700 (PDT) Received: by mail-wr0-x22b.google.com with SMTP id o44so1861493wrf.11; Wed, 25 Oct 2017 21:20:36 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20161025; h=mime-version:in-reply-to:references:from:date:message-id:subject:to :cc; bh=OQJEQO/zcnw04f+/UO4FkNUC4YTVHFfG1ibDqBPydWk=; b=htb05ejGnlA1qQLmYiNIsqiBJSJbLvsagTA25K2xrix6WA7EcKKg2dH/BLEmlWtSpk uiPBV2TN28Rebiu8EZ24SEK1cWD42a1wtbGtj77hxz1tgzbUZaRXki3T5TUWADGKgJw0 aSbt91jHHWSx019oXuazc1xirUUWZ/Wp5hCGgOvc5Kg0x3F7hkOAtl+3msK8KlAJrKBN rOS48X7J0zHT78YCHyG2OQ4vX5ajvJDg9OA5WD0JEIdxZ+qo8NuEScwf/wBFBCNhm3ZZ 5LmwGJK2VqXHZa/Fk4ubA1yfLef/sLbZjVyMOzheLAOKItZrXI/QSUvhfjrT9iagWzjH w8bw== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:in-reply-to:references:from:date :message-id:subject:to:cc; bh=OQJEQO/zcnw04f+/UO4FkNUC4YTVHFfG1ibDqBPydWk=; b=l2Hq5LnqTmXqZzYKgIabYeonhz6pyhfk4NSgCAEeiPl8ajKxRvwEG6/A9DxSg8U86Q gYohaCqbVmTEYzFgx0DN1C5YB/2U49u/usPwnHJRvrQ2+LUiyzSjvc1qKyRD+5Ee8+V3 VjwoPkIA+AaewjowQh4QFJm+nlAfYfS8NouUTrTC5Kws9nQCXPXne3bBW8yS5i8KGvUf rxp4btp4OBPhYBe7jSvyVsaF9wgYYuKGq07QzarsrN0mRuwoOiLwPFgeM+FVS6hJ/B9k /o2KtqmBtJqlHvzfUAYvDqVE/y616oYbVsHEjNbAGZFasc4HkJtbmnEz+/B0I6hAARr9 sHlA== X-Gm-Message-State: AMCzsaU85xEXZFTTfVBS1XNSitDTQ1DDrggUOkQ4QBQWV6sW28kKC3im WQpQFhiN5B0U3vkzGmIyEeA8DkIWkIe2MjVCXjU= X-Google-Smtp-Source: ABhQp+TDdEp7Wjz3ZbWtE2Gheaxk8jgynalhVOCcC+BykPRGq3j99XDLGXhTGM7hWEM2wX838chFIVygYQB1UfVQbq4= X-Received: by 10.223.128.162 with SMTP id 31mr4188541wrl.258.1508991635197; Wed, 25 Oct 2017 21:20:35 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 Received: by 10.223.150.10 with HTTP; Wed, 25 Oct 2017 21:20:34 -0700 (PDT) In-Reply-To: References: <20171025215754.GA18857@faui40p.informatik.uni-erlangen.de> From: Alia Atlas Date: Thu, 26 Oct 2017 00:20:34 -0400 Message-ID: To: Greg Shepherd Cc: Toerless Eckert , "bier@ietf.org" , bier-chairs@ietf.org Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="94eb2c068e006296ca055c6b7e33" Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Bier] Greg/Tony: Re: Call for adoption: draft-eckert-bier-te-arch X-BeenThere: bier@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 Precedence: list List-Id: "\"Bit Indexed Explicit Replication discussion list\"" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 26 Oct 2017 04:20:39 -0000 --94eb2c068e006296ca055c6b7e33 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" We will have to circle back around to the charter - since the BIER-TE work is currently out-of-scope. I am find with it being adopted - given the understanding that BIER will need to be rechartered before it progresses. I am quite pleased with the excellent progress this WG has made since it was chartered and expect that many of the work items will be passed to me for publication well before I step down as AD at IETF 101 in March. I would like to have that finished as well as the necessary rechartering. Regards, Alia On Wed, Oct 25, 2017 at 6:43 PM, Greg Shepherd wrote: > Thanks. I'll announce. > > Greg > > On Wed, Oct 25, 2017 at 2:57 PM, Toerless Eckert wrote: > >> Hi Greg/Tony >> >> I think i have seen now >=8 voices supporting adoption of BIER-TE, >> what's the next step ? >> >> Cheers >> Toerless >> >> On Tue, Aug 01, 2017 at 07:02:03PM -0700, Greg Shepherd wrote: >> > We had solid support in the room in Prague to adopt this work. So let's >> get >> > a vote from the list. Please read and respond for or against adopting >> this >> > as a WG document: >> > >> > https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-eckert-bier-te-arch/ >> > https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-eckert-bier-te-frr/ >> > >> > Cheers, >> > Greg >> >> > _______________________________________________ >> > BIER mailing list >> > BIER@ietf.org >> > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/bier >> >> _______________________________________________ >> BIER mailing list >> BIER@ietf.org >> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/bier >> > > > _______________________________________________ > BIER mailing list > BIER@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/bier > > --94eb2c068e006296ca055c6b7e33 Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
We will have to circle back around to the charter - since = the BIER-TE work is currently out-of-scope.
I am find with it being ado= pted - given the understanding that BIER will need to be rechartered before=
it progresses.

I am quite pleased with = the excellent progress this WG has made since it was chartered and expect
that many of the work items will be passed to me for publication w= ell before I step down as AD at IETF 101
in March.=C2=A0 I would = like to have that finished as well as the necessary rechartering.

Regards,
Alia

On Wed, Oct 25, 2017 at 6:43 PM, Greg She= pherd <gjshep@gmail.com> wrote:
Thanks. I'll announce.

Greg

On Wed, = Oct 25, 2017 at 2:57 PM, Toerless Eckert <tte@cs.fau.de> wrote:<= br>
Hi Greg/Tony

I think i have seen now >=3D8 voices supporting adoption of BIER-TE,
what's the next step ?

Cheers
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 Toerless

On Tue, Aug 01, 2017 at 07:02:03PM -0700, Greg Shepherd wrote:
> We had solid support in the room in Prague to adopt this work. So let&= #39;s get
> a vote from the list. Please read and respond for or against adopting = this
> as a WG document:
>
> https://datatracker.ietf.org/do= c/draft-eckert-bier-te-arch/
> https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc= /draft-eckert-bier-te-frr/
>
> Cheers,
> Greg

> _______________________________________________
> BIER mailing list
> BIER@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/bier
_______________________________________________
BIER mailing list
BIER@ietf.org
https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/bier


_______________________________________________
BIER mailing list
BIER@ietf.org
https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/bier


--94eb2c068e006296ca055c6b7e33-- From nobody Fri Oct 27 10:12:17 2017 Return-Path: X-Original-To: bier@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: bier@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4C946138A38; Fri, 27 Oct 2017 10:12:11 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.021 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.021 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE=-0.0001, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_H3=-0.01, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_WL=-0.01, SPF_PASS=-0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (1024-bit key) header.d=juniper.net Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id GduuojtEQNFH; Fri, 27 Oct 2017 10:12:09 -0700 (PDT) Received: from NAM02-BL2-obe.outbound.protection.outlook.com (mail-bl2nam02on0124.outbound.protection.outlook.com [104.47.38.124]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 0C4F813F3C3; Fri, 27 Oct 2017 10:12:09 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=juniper.net; s=selector1; h=From:Date:Subject:Message-ID:Content-Type:MIME-Version; bh=pEQHTcpzPxtSySjam5e7QHASUm3BwdWuLT7zYrBrzzI=; b=ZMEJixj7iDcPUuegaoAl3CrIgdswvqhmIEu5MA1RjHhyNRcL0MMPkepwsAwM0EmqO2SvKCz2W9IVuv7mBlbPYN9ZOdFmUg683weIfF0AspRA0TXBeuoBXzSy+oy/i1z45shMxaoWnWzUOw7Pgo8dZAI6flU+sJyMGUyJ7Dnhu2U= Received: from [172.29.37.54] (66.129.241.12) by CY1PR05MB2297.namprd05.prod.outlook.com (10.166.192.143) with Microsoft SMTP Server (version=TLS1_2, cipher=TLS_ECDHE_RSA_WITH_AES_256_CBC_SHA384_P256) id 15.20.178.3; Fri, 27 Oct 2017 17:12:05 +0000 To: Kathleen Moriarty , The IESG Cc: draft-ietf-bier-mpls-encapsulation@ietf.org, Tony Przygienda , bier-chairs@ietf.org, bier@ietf.org References: <150898489045.24201.17613804705297606883.idtracker@ietfa.amsl.com> From: Eric C Rosen Message-ID: Date: Fri, 27 Oct 2017 13:12:05 -0400 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows NT 10.0; WOW64; rv:52.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/52.4.0 MIME-Version: 1.0 In-Reply-To: <150898489045.24201.17613804705297606883.idtracker@ietfa.amsl.com> Content-Type: text/plain; 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that falls within the    scope of whatever unicast routing protocols are being used.    BIER-encapsulated packets should generally not be accepted from    untrusted interfaces or tunnels.  For example, an operator may wish    to have a policy of accepting BIER-encapsulated packets only from    interfaces to trusted routers, and not from customer-facing    interfaces.    There may be applications that require a BFR to accept a BIER-    encapsulated packet from an interface to a system that is not    controlled by the network operator.  For instance, there may be an    application in which a Virtual Machine in a Data Center submits BIER-    encapsulated packets to a router.  In such a case, it is desirable to    verify that the packet is from a legitimate source, and that its    BitString denotes only systems to which that source is allowed to    send.  However, the BIER encapsulation itself does not provide a way    to verify that the source is legitimate, or that the source is really    the system denoted by the BFIR-id, or that the source is allowed to    set any particular set of bits in the BitString.    Insofar as this document relies upon IGP extensions, it inherits any    security considerations that apply to the IGP.    The security considerations of [BIER_ARCH] also apply. On 10/25/2017 10:28 PM, Kathleen Moriarty wrote: > Kathleen Moriarty has entered the following ballot position for > draft-ietf-bier-mpls-encapsulation-11: Discuss > > When responding, please keep the subject line intact and reply to all > email addresses included in the To and CC lines. (Feel free to cut this > introductory paragraph, however.) > > > Please refer to https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__www.ietf.org_iesg_statement_discuss-2Dcriteria.html&d=DwICaQ&c=HAkYuh63rsuhr6Scbfh0UjBXeMK-ndb3voDTXcWzoCI&r=-DXB84eU9m4cIlq2OOcCJCQQAwJXQQswyu3F0kG0VNo&m=f76c-ykCe8xC9AXPXrsuMm5HjZ-QAzYgxKtY_ihqMVo&s=OfYzxJSZV4RmKEHFryUgx2-0gTSjNW_0eG8nmtK-1OY&e= > for more information about IESG DISCUSS and COMMENT positions. > > > The document, along with other ballot positions, can be found here: > https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__datatracker.ietf.org_doc_draft-2Dietf-2Dbier-2Dmpls-2Dencapsulation_&d=DwICaQ&c=HAkYuh63rsuhr6Scbfh0UjBXeMK-ndb3voDTXcWzoCI&r=-DXB84eU9m4cIlq2OOcCJCQQAwJXQQswyu3F0kG0VNo&m=f76c-ykCe8xC9AXPXrsuMm5HjZ-QAzYgxKtY_ihqMVo&s=9IMDF-PfGbw9KB9ReDE4iAVHyv0ZiOT1Vy7q_7zocvM&e= > > > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------- > DISCUSS: > ---------------------------------------------------------------------- > > I share the concerns of the SecDir reviewer and would like to see more text in > the Security Considerations that reflect the inherent trust model and also the > lack of integrity protection for the BIER encapsulation. Having these items > detailed explicitly is an important consideration for implementers. I do > realize that this is the current state with MPLS, but it bears repeating for a > new encapsulation. > > https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__mailarchive.ietf.org_arch_msg_secdir_w8qqQtzlEi00uToUGT0N8XVuHkI&d=DwICaQ&c=HAkYuh63rsuhr6Scbfh0UjBXeMK-ndb3voDTXcWzoCI&r=-DXB84eU9m4cIlq2OOcCJCQQAwJXQQswyu3F0kG0VNo&m=f76c-ykCe8xC9AXPXrsuMm5HjZ-QAzYgxKtY_ihqMVo&s=szYawOrHFpLG9vyXf4ebNeTwfqA7UJJ8mhxiObDzaS0&e= > > Thank you. > > > > From nobody Fri Oct 27 11:07:23 2017 Return-Path: X-Original-To: bier@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: bier@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 057A213F3B8; Fri, 27 Oct 2017 11:07:22 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE=-0.0001, SPF_PASS=-0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=gmail.com Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id YCyycZCZHQMY; Fri, 27 Oct 2017 11:07:20 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail-pf0-x22c.google.com (mail-pf0-x22c.google.com [IPv6:2607:f8b0:400e:c00::22c]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 4A52F13F3AC; Fri, 27 Oct 2017 11:07:19 -0700 (PDT) Received: by mail-pf0-x22c.google.com with SMTP id b6so5479776pfh.7; Fri, 27 Oct 2017 11:07:19 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20161025; h=mime-version:in-reply-to:references:from:date:message-id:subject:to :cc:content-transfer-encoding; bh=f2W/R3c+rQa9q7kTV8LjDOJJ69tph78NSTHsTmbO+WY=; b=jbM7kOvYaO1EY1q1KB1xAfy/qt8YyI/8FPxCSo8JelPU2a8daLQczpgtbcU8yY/Rze assKRzA3nH+gskjujYgy5wICe3qaTX9320iUsT0BdbYncZlG8olAXYrvsU18sGfcuk2Z sWyTjpoNtx+BDiEQ1NiLrkKaHB8Tai2iXt/E8ZIdftWfRYBg4clT5KgGxxVGe2otveJ6 gFjIaTq31HGzYKBmxRx7xTcfBfaOvmdVT8W/SNBgRwGok51gajP86/rqHa/vu/40m4bF 6E2Xg9A8Bl6wphGomspXmilKEcayfbuBTR+tUvzbLnPBv7D2JTx0+tXHczUpieFA77XS 2dow== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:in-reply-to:references:from:date :message-id:subject:to:cc:content-transfer-encoding; bh=f2W/R3c+rQa9q7kTV8LjDOJJ69tph78NSTHsTmbO+WY=; b=giAKIOdwnGJum8ITteRT0Z+jXCcfGco3OzPnKkfuqKMwre4N0rAL0bs43aSTD4LyS+ 2FLJ5lGp8TIifKOjW0kL6fedaANdFTQ7f0CaAf5zUsKEehwKBD6/ex+KBX5w+UR0/uF4 ieEVxf3A6xgkjUNNilIIwKKnykkpCPdnssp+Ihb9KrDU1GZwZRg3uBKQzGaTl0/Uz77s SPSUl5Wx8nyepJBluNycKxqQVy7N0ADUXmFOnZHtyRVO6WE6JTjPRTg66ednd7K3FTgN mHZgmkbB1c3LpemJXzGhIHBO3v47TgmcAaPM1QPhvcjcNyLpNeIr3nRs8wUyQR0U8/s2 yIAA== X-Gm-Message-State: AMCzsaXLpJBkE6lBvqam6f2H/19O4RHosL58Ao4g0+daLuiOyFJaohyB QqKav/AorPY8Wx7XetfHk7YtJoV7RrsqRQoZ8dY= X-Google-Smtp-Source: ABhQp+QCCx7ZlCOAl7m8veet7TX/0trZAgKwVL20brazZnAHXpdtwxG9ymQyfruRmHMVtzuSdxkCkOpsClcQ1q0vn7Y= X-Received: by 10.98.214.76 with SMTP id r73mr1167306pfg.261.1509127638814; Fri, 27 Oct 2017 11:07:18 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 Received: by 10.100.186.194 with HTTP; Fri, 27 Oct 2017 11:06:38 -0700 (PDT) In-Reply-To: References: <150898489045.24201.17613804705297606883.idtracker@ietfa.amsl.com> From: Kathleen Moriarty Date: Fri, 27 Oct 2017 14:06:38 -0400 Message-ID: To: Eric C Rosen Cc: The IESG , draft-ietf-bier-mpls-encapsulation@ietf.org, Tony Przygienda , bier-chairs@ietf.org, bier@ietf.org Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Bier] Kathleen Moriarty's Discuss on draft-ietf-bier-mpls-encapsulation-11: (with DISCUSS) X-BeenThere: bier@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 Precedence: list List-Id: "\"Bit Indexed Explicit Replication discussion list\"" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 27 Oct 2017 18:07:22 -0000 Eric, Thank you very much, that is a big improvement. Once -12 is posted, I will clear. Best regards, Kathleen On Fri, Oct 27, 2017 at 1:12 PM, Eric C Rosen wrote: > Hi Kathleen, > > Please let me know if the revised Security Considerations section (below)= is > satisfactory. If so, I'll put it in revision 12. If not, I'll keep tryi= ng > ;-) > > Eric > > 6. Security Considerations > > Insofar as this document makes use of MPLS, it inherits any security > considerations that apply to the use of the MPLS data plane. > > If a BIER encapsulation header is modified in ways other than those > specified in [BIER_ARCH] and in this document, packets may be lost, > stolen, or otherwise misdelivered. Such modifications are likely to > go undetected, as the BIER encapsulation does not provide > cryptographic integrity protection. > > Layer 2 encryption can be used to ensure that a BIER-encapsulated > packet is not altered while in transit between adjacent BFRs. If a > BFR itself is compromised, there is no way to prevent the compromised > BFR from making illegitimate modifications to the BIER header, or to > prevent it from misforwarding or misdelivering the a BIER- > encapsulated packet. > > If the routing underlay (see Section 4.1 of [BIER_ARCH]) is based on > a unicast routing protocol, BIER assumes that the routers > participating in the unicast routing protocol have not been > compromised. BIER has no procedures to ensure that the unicast > routing adjacencies have not been compromised; that falls within the > scope of whatever unicast routing protocols are being used. > > BIER-encapsulated packets should generally not be accepted from > untrusted interfaces or tunnels. For example, an operator may wish > to have a policy of accepting BIER-encapsulated packets only from > interfaces to trusted routers, and not from customer-facing > interfaces. > > There may be applications that require a BFR to accept a BIER- > encapsulated packet from an interface to a system that is not > controlled by the network operator. For instance, there may be an > application in which a Virtual Machine in a Data Center submits BIER- > encapsulated packets to a router. In such a case, it is desirable to > verify that the packet is from a legitimate source, and that its > BitString denotes only systems to which that source is allowed to > send. However, the BIER encapsulation itself does not provide a way > to verify that the source is legitimate, or that the source is really > the system denoted by the BFIR-id, or that the source is allowed to > set any particular set of bits in the BitString. > > Insofar as this document relies upon IGP extensions, it inherits any > security considerations that apply to the IGP. > > The security considerations of [BIER_ARCH] also apply. > > > On 10/25/2017 10:28 PM, Kathleen Moriarty wrote: >> >> Kathleen Moriarty has entered the following ballot position for >> draft-ietf-bier-mpls-encapsulation-11: Discuss >> >> When responding, please keep the subject line intact and reply to all >> email addresses included in the To and CC lines. (Feel free to cut this >> introductory paragraph, however.) >> >> >> Please refer to >> https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=3Dhttps-3A__www.ietf.org_iesg= _statement_discuss-2Dcriteria.html&d=3DDwICaQ&c=3DHAkYuh63rsuhr6Scbfh0UjBXe= MK-ndb3voDTXcWzoCI&r=3D-DXB84eU9m4cIlq2OOcCJCQQAwJXQQswyu3F0kG0VNo&m=3Df76c= -ykCe8xC9AXPXrsuMm5HjZ-QAzYgxKtY_ihqMVo&s=3DOfYzxJSZV4RmKEHFryUgx2-0gTSjNW_= 0eG8nmtK-1OY&e=3D >> for more information about IESG DISCUSS and COMMENT positions. >> >> >> The document, along with other ballot positions, can be found here: >> >> https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=3Dhttps-3A__datatracker.ietf.= org_doc_draft-2Dietf-2Dbier-2Dmpls-2Dencapsulation_&d=3DDwICaQ&c=3DHAkYuh63= rsuhr6Scbfh0UjBXeMK-ndb3voDTXcWzoCI&r=3D-DXB84eU9m4cIlq2OOcCJCQQAwJXQQswyu3= F0kG0VNo&m=3Df76c-ykCe8xC9AXPXrsuMm5HjZ-QAzYgxKtY_ihqMVo&s=3D9IMDF-PfGbw9KB= 9ReDE4iAVHyv0ZiOT1Vy7q_7zocvM&e=3D >> >> >> >> ---------------------------------------------------------------------- >> DISCUSS: >> ---------------------------------------------------------------------- >> >> I share the concerns of the SecDir reviewer and would like to see more >> text in >> the Security Considerations that reflect the inherent trust model and al= so >> the >> lack of integrity protection for the BIER encapsulation. Having these >> items >> detailed explicitly is an important consideration for implementers. I d= o >> realize that this is the current state with MPLS, but it bears repeating >> for a >> new encapsulation. >> >> >> https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=3Dhttps-3A__mailarchive.ietf.= org_arch_msg_secdir_w8qqQtzlEi00uToUGT0N8XVuHkI&d=3DDwICaQ&c=3DHAkYuh63rsuh= r6Scbfh0UjBXeMK-ndb3voDTXcWzoCI&r=3D-DXB84eU9m4cIlq2OOcCJCQQAwJXQQswyu3F0kG= 0VNo&m=3Df76c-ykCe8xC9AXPXrsuMm5HjZ-QAzYgxKtY_ihqMVo&s=3DszYawOrHFpLG9vyXf4= ebNeTwfqA7UJJ8mhxiObDzaS0&e=3D >> >> Thank you. >> >> >> >> > --=20 Best regards, Kathleen From nobody Fri Oct 27 11:25:30 2017 Return-Path: X-Original-To: bier@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: bier@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 07D7713F3C7; Fri, 27 Oct 2017 11:25:22 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.699 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.699 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW=-0.7, SPF_PASS=-0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=gmail.com Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id r1VOsg2mxRP5; Fri, 27 Oct 2017 11:25:19 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail-wm0-x22e.google.com (mail-wm0-x22e.google.com [IPv6:2a00:1450:400c:c09::22e]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 6141A13F3C0; Fri, 27 Oct 2017 11:25:19 -0700 (PDT) Received: by mail-wm0-x22e.google.com with SMTP id t139so5442554wmt.1; Fri, 27 Oct 2017 11:25:19 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20161025; h=mime-version:in-reply-to:references:from:date:message-id:subject:to :cc; bh=1U7zhkMgfGWvSXko9r6E+vQA4RdKpXk9B0wiF4uTsIM=; b=LhAVJK5uCmstclqRXIndzviDZC4qrmfRdihiLN2XmaD+ZxltSUJN11xxmG58m6lcTW D8kLkCy4E2PDCJ1qhYN02QrZ1nvOe5SO4KMW9Li0O+1Tp8Z2qeOzMBaWj3+g7ygkAecT CJmdyMEQb3c3juenduUB9kJdvg1/mOCPfHYCfGvh1SXSSW4AFaKHVGHCQAoM99VA4NzA coHL8pl7kzQY0K1025qG7QLMoYDm2anEmD+aPZLbjnttLs9Jaz/KzkFBcR8ItURk4Xei h6rZJA+v3rFnErEqRKoG0tplf4NSEvAkjTYP7h5e9Qp6eU/ZW6CpLi35GLkdGVcmuegl 1GBw== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:in-reply-to:references:from:date :message-id:subject:to:cc; bh=1U7zhkMgfGWvSXko9r6E+vQA4RdKpXk9B0wiF4uTsIM=; b=pra2gTJ3UBK99TV/CEvWdLfGNaJeyCxPjpkn/IQEpCXX1IZZBFbPHhs2zK9Y1EjTdu F6feJR2ZJnun8zaLnl8fXpGqPv98Qkx1RNqHkiP+jdZpkUYUId58O/8+TQ3s+ahPa8cQ o5imzCae0Nf+cDe0+s9y8XK6To1VyecqbeAzWstIRtC+1Nr8HdP0LzFXdnorcH1UpeBb F9QoQ3Zl0XwtShTtMLd4hoTHux6Rqydh8MQQ9aeTJ+RtllG3jJOWqHrB9Pcexypp2eUe cc1fOiIj4YR7Dz/hO/0/28CVpZwBUOh9Y8PKTiwmRTYYnK6tFs/yLTakR4CNdCLo3aTs xi5g== X-Gm-Message-State: AMCzsaVqtxpxFLWVDxMlDJ8vekzAM9DVry3esMomMnfSJse1SeNcRK6H 72oyzKlfixTcbWfUH1yI5Np3XjII+uxgLsVlhxQ= X-Google-Smtp-Source: ABhQp+R/c9bBFkMDK7RVq+KE+ZnL/AygWcE4DNFOfZwoNm472/YDZ2OEYxs4jtFeoZeePS5G9v3ZD3M21XcXvbkqMHc= X-Received: by 10.28.113.196 with SMTP id d65mr1021776wmi.151.1509128717722; Fri, 27 Oct 2017 11:25:17 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 Received: by 10.223.150.10 with HTTP; Fri, 27 Oct 2017 11:25:16 -0700 (PDT) Received: by 10.223.150.10 with HTTP; Fri, 27 Oct 2017 11:25:16 -0700 (PDT) In-Reply-To: References: <150898489045.24201.17613804705297606883.idtracker@ietfa.amsl.com> From: Alia Atlas Date: Fri, 27 Oct 2017 14:25:16 -0400 Message-ID: To: Kathleen Moriarty Cc: Eric Rosen , draft-ietf-bier-mpls-encapsulation@ietf.org, bier-chairs@ietf.org, The IESG , bier@ietf.org Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="001a11466e6a23f124055c8b693d" Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Bier] Kathleen Moriarty's Discuss on draft-ietf-bier-mpls-encapsulation-11: (with DISCUSS) X-BeenThere: bier@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 Precedence: list List-Id: "\"Bit Indexed Explicit Replication discussion list\"" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 27 Oct 2017 18:25:22 -0000 --001a11466e6a23f124055c8b693d Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Thanks to you both. On Oct 27, 2017 2:07 PM, "Kathleen Moriarty" < kathleen.moriarty.ietf@gmail.com> wrote: > Eric, > > Thank you very much, that is a big improvement. Once -12 is posted, I > will clear. > > Best regards, > Kathleen > > On Fri, Oct 27, 2017 at 1:12 PM, Eric C Rosen wrote: > > Hi Kathleen, > > > > Please let me know if the revised Security Considerations section > (below) is > > satisfactory. If so, I'll put it in revision 12. If not, I'll keep > trying > > ;-) > > > > Eric > > > > 6. Security Considerations > > > > Insofar as this document makes use of MPLS, it inherits any security > > considerations that apply to the use of the MPLS data plane. > > > > If a BIER encapsulation header is modified in ways other than those > > specified in [BIER_ARCH] and in this document, packets may be lost, > > stolen, or otherwise misdelivered. Such modifications are likely to > > go undetected, as the BIER encapsulation does not provide > > cryptographic integrity protection. > > > > Layer 2 encryption can be used to ensure that a BIER-encapsulated > > packet is not altered while in transit between adjacent BFRs. If a > > BFR itself is compromised, there is no way to prevent the compromised > > BFR from making illegitimate modifications to the BIER header, or to > > prevent it from misforwarding or misdelivering the a BIER- > > encapsulated packet. > > > > If the routing underlay (see Section 4.1 of [BIER_ARCH]) is based on > > a unicast routing protocol, BIER assumes that the routers > > participating in the unicast routing protocol have not been > > compromised. BIER has no procedures to ensure that the unicast > > routing adjacencies have not been compromised; that falls within the > > scope of whatever unicast routing protocols are being used. > > > > BIER-encapsulated packets should generally not be accepted from > > untrusted interfaces or tunnels. For example, an operator may wish > > to have a policy of accepting BIER-encapsulated packets only from > > interfaces to trusted routers, and not from customer-facing > > interfaces. > > > > There may be applications that require a BFR to accept a BIER- > > encapsulated packet from an interface to a system that is not > > controlled by the network operator. For instance, there may be an > > application in which a Virtual Machine in a Data Center submits BIER- > > encapsulated packets to a router. In such a case, it is desirable to > > verify that the packet is from a legitimate source, and that its > > BitString denotes only systems to which that source is allowed to > > send. However, the BIER encapsulation itself does not provide a way > > to verify that the source is legitimate, or that the source is really > > the system denoted by the BFIR-id, or that the source is allowed to > > set any particular set of bits in the BitString. > > > > Insofar as this document relies upon IGP extensions, it inherits any > > security considerations that apply to the IGP. > > > > The security considerations of [BIER_ARCH] also apply. > > > > > > On 10/25/2017 10:28 PM, Kathleen Moriarty wrote: > >> > >> Kathleen Moriarty has entered the following ballot position for > >> draft-ietf-bier-mpls-encapsulation-11: Discuss > >> > >> When responding, please keep the subject line intact and reply to all > >> email addresses included in the To and CC lines. (Feel free to cut this > >> introductory paragraph, however.) > >> > >> > >> Please refer to > >> https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__www. > ietf.org_iesg_statement_discuss-2Dcriteria.html&d=DwICaQ&c= > HAkYuh63rsuhr6Scbfh0UjBXeMK-ndb3voDTXcWzoCI&r=- > DXB84eU9m4cIlq2OOcCJCQQAwJXQQswyu3F0kG0VNo&m=f76c-ykCe8xC9AXPXrsuMm5HjZ- > QAzYgxKtY_ihqMVo&s=OfYzxJSZV4RmKEHFryUgx2-0gTSjNW_0eG8nmtK-1OY&e= > >> for more information about IESG DISCUSS and COMMENT positions. > >> > >> > >> The document, along with other ballot positions, can be found here: > >> > >> https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__ > datatracker.ietf.org_doc_draft-2Dietf-2Dbier-2Dmpls- > 2Dencapsulation_&d=DwICaQ&c=HAkYuh63rsuhr6Scbfh0UjBXeMK- > ndb3voDTXcWzoCI&r=-DXB84eU9m4cIlq2OOcCJCQQAwJXQQswyu3F0kG0VNo&m=f76c- > ykCe8xC9AXPXrsuMm5HjZ-QAzYgxKtY_ihqMVo&s=9IMDF- > PfGbw9KB9ReDE4iAVHyv0ZiOT1Vy7q_7zocvM&e= > >> > >> > >> > >> ---------------------------------------------------------------------- > >> DISCUSS: > >> ---------------------------------------------------------------------- > >> > >> I share the concerns of the SecDir reviewer and would like to see more > >> text in > >> the Security Considerations that reflect the inherent trust model and > also > >> the > >> lack of integrity protection for the BIER encapsulation. Having these > >> items > >> detailed explicitly is an important consideration for implementers. I > do > >> realize that this is the current state with MPLS, but it bears repeating > >> for a > >> new encapsulation. > >> > >> > >> https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__ > mailarchive.ietf.org_arch_msg_secdir_w8qqQtzlEi00uToUGT0N8XVuHkI&d= > DwICaQ&c=HAkYuh63rsuhr6Scbfh0UjBXeMK-ndb3voDTXcWzoCI&r=- > DXB84eU9m4cIlq2OOcCJCQQAwJXQQswyu3F0kG0VNo&m=f76c-ykCe8xC9AXPXrsuMm5HjZ- > QAzYgxKtY_ihqMVo&s=szYawOrHFpLG9vyXf4ebNeTwfqA7UJJ8mhxiObDzaS0&e= > >> > >> Thank you. > >> > >> > >> > >> > > > > > > -- > > Best regards, > Kathleen > > _______________________________________________ > BIER mailing list > BIER@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/bier > --001a11466e6a23f124055c8b693d Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Thanks to you both.

<= div class=3D"gmail_quote">On Oct 27, 2017 2:07 PM, "Kathleen Moriarty&= quot; <kathleen.mori= arty.ietf@gmail.com> wrote:
Eric,

Thank you very much, that is a big improvement.=C2=A0 Once -12 is posted, I=
will clear.

Best regards,
Kathleen

On Fri, Oct 27, 2017 at 1:12 PM, Eric C Rosen <erosen@juniper.net> wrote:
> Hi Kathleen,
>
> Please let me know if the revised Security Considerations section (bel= ow) is
> satisfactory.=C2=A0 If so, I'll put it in revision 12.=C2=A0 If no= t, I'll keep trying
> ;-)
>
> Eric
>
> 6.=C2=A0 Security Considerations
>
>=C2=A0 =C2=A0 Insofar as this document makes use of MPLS, it inherits a= ny security
>=C2=A0 =C2=A0 considerations that apply to the use of the MPLS data pla= ne.
>
>=C2=A0 =C2=A0 If a BIER encapsulation header is modified in ways other = than those
>=C2=A0 =C2=A0 specified in [BIER_ARCH] and in this document, packets ma= y be lost,
>=C2=A0 =C2=A0 stolen, or otherwise misdelivered.=C2=A0 Such modificatio= ns are likely to
>=C2=A0 =C2=A0 go undetected, as the BIER encapsulation does not provide=
>=C2=A0 =C2=A0 cryptographic integrity protection.
>
>=C2=A0 =C2=A0 Layer 2 encryption can be used to ensure that a BIER-enca= psulated
>=C2=A0 =C2=A0 packet is not altered while in transit between adjacent B= FRs.=C2=A0 If a
>=C2=A0 =C2=A0 BFR itself is compromised, there is no way to prevent the= compromised
>=C2=A0 =C2=A0 BFR from making illegitimate modifications to the BIER he= ader, or to
>=C2=A0 =C2=A0 prevent it from misforwarding or misdelivering the a BIER= -
>=C2=A0 =C2=A0 encapsulated packet.
>
>=C2=A0 =C2=A0 If the routing underlay (see Section 4.1 of [BIER_ARCH]) = is based on
>=C2=A0 =C2=A0 a unicast routing protocol, BIER assumes that the routers=
>=C2=A0 =C2=A0 participating in the unicast routing protocol have not be= en
>=C2=A0 =C2=A0 compromised.=C2=A0 BIER has no procedures to ensure that = the unicast
>=C2=A0 =C2=A0 routing adjacencies have not been compromised; that falls= within the
>=C2=A0 =C2=A0 scope of whatever unicast routing protocols are being use= d.
>
>=C2=A0 =C2=A0 BIER-encapsulated packets should generally not be accepte= d from
>=C2=A0 =C2=A0 untrusted interfaces or tunnels.=C2=A0 For example, an op= erator may wish
>=C2=A0 =C2=A0 to have a policy of accepting BIER-encapsulated packets o= nly from
>=C2=A0 =C2=A0 interfaces to trusted routers, and not from customer-faci= ng
>=C2=A0 =C2=A0 interfaces.
>
>=C2=A0 =C2=A0 There may be applications that require a BFR to accept a = BIER-
>=C2=A0 =C2=A0 encapsulated packet from an interface to a system that is= not
>=C2=A0 =C2=A0 controlled by the network operator.=C2=A0 For instance, t= here may be an
>=C2=A0 =C2=A0 application in which a Virtual Machine in a Data Center s= ubmits BIER-
>=C2=A0 =C2=A0 encapsulated packets to a router.=C2=A0 In such a case, i= t is desirable to
>=C2=A0 =C2=A0 verify that the packet is from a legitimate source, and t= hat its
>=C2=A0 =C2=A0 BitString denotes only systems to which that source is al= lowed to
>=C2=A0 =C2=A0 send.=C2=A0 However, the BIER encapsulation itself does n= ot provide a way
>=C2=A0 =C2=A0 to verify that the source is legitimate, or that the sour= ce is really
>=C2=A0 =C2=A0 the system denoted by the BFIR-id, or that the source is = allowed to
>=C2=A0 =C2=A0 set any particular set of bits in the BitString.
>
>=C2=A0 =C2=A0 Insofar as this document relies upon IGP extensions, it i= nherits any
>=C2=A0 =C2=A0 security considerations that apply to the IGP.
>
>=C2=A0 =C2=A0 The security considerations of [BIER_ARCH] also apply. >
>
> On 10/25/2017 10:28 PM, Kathleen Moriarty wrote:
>>
>> Kathleen Moriarty has entered the following ballot position for >> draft-ietf-bier-mpls-encapsulation-11: Discuss
>>
>> When responding, please keep the subject line intact and reply to = all
>> email addresses included in the To and CC lines. (Feel free to cut= this
>> introductory paragraph, however.)
>>
>>
>> Please refer to
>> https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=3Dhtt= ps-3A__www.ietf.org_iesg_statement_discuss-2Dcriteria.html&d= =3DDwICaQ&c=3DHAkYuh63rsuhr6Scbfh0UjBXeMK-ndb3voDTXcWzoC= I&r=3D-DXB84eU9m4cIlq2OOcCJCQQAwJXQQswyu3F0kG0VNo&m=3Df76= c-ykCe8xC9AXPXrsuMm5HjZ-QAzYgxKtY_ihqMVo&s=3DOfYzxJSZV4R= mKEHFryUgx2-0gTSjNW_0eG8nmtK-1OY&e=3D
>> for more information about IESG DISCUSS and COMMENT positions.
>>
>>
>> The document, along with other ballot positions, can be found here= :
>>
>> https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=3Dhttps-3A__datatracker.ietf.org_doc_draft-2Dietf-= 2Dbier-2Dmpls-2Dencapsulation_&d=3DDwICaQ&c=3DHAkYuh63rsu= hr6Scbfh0UjBXeMK-ndb3voDTXcWzoCI&r=3D-DXB84eU9m4cIlq2OOcCJCQQ= AwJXQQswyu3F0kG0VNo&m=3Df76c-ykCe8xC9AXPXrsuMm5HjZ-QAzYg= xKtY_ihqMVo&s=3D9IMDF-PfGbw9KB9ReDE4iAVHyv0ZiOT1Vy7q_7zocvM&a= mp;e=3D
>>
>>
>>
>> ------------------------------------------------------------<= wbr>----------
>> DISCUSS:
>> ------------------------------------------------------------<= wbr>----------
>>
>> I share the concerns of the SecDir reviewer and would like to see = more
>> text in
>> the Security Considerations that reflect the inherent trust model = and also
>> the
>> lack of integrity protection for the BIER encapsulation.=C2=A0 Hav= ing these
>> items
>> detailed explicitly is an important consideration for implementers= .=C2=A0 I do
>> realize that this is the current state with MPLS, but it bears rep= eating
>> for a
>> new encapsulation.
>>
>>
>> https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v= 2/url?u=3Dhttps-3A__mailarchive.ietf.org_arch_msg_secdir_w8q= qQtzlEi00uToUGT0N8XVuHkI&d=3DDwICaQ&c=3DHAkYuh63rsuhr6Scb= fh0UjBXeMK-ndb3voDTXcWzoCI&r=3D-DXB84eU9m4cIlq2OOcCJCQQAwJXQQ= swyu3F0kG0VNo&m=3Df76c-ykCe8xC9AXPXrsuMm5HjZ-QAzYgxKtY_i= hqMVo&s=3DszYawOrHFpLG9vyXf4ebNeTwfqA7UJJ8mhxiObDzaS0&e= =3D
>>
>> Thank you.
>>
>>
>>
>>
>



--

Best regards,
Kathleen

_______________________________________________
BIER mailing list
BIER@ietf.org
https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/bier
--001a11466e6a23f124055c8b693d-- From nobody Fri Oct 27 12:07:24 2017 Return-Path: X-Original-To: bier@ietf.org Delivered-To: bier@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from ietfa.amsl.com (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id A5C5F139432; Fri, 27 Oct 2017 12:07:15 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: internet-drafts@ietf.org To: Cc: bier@ietf.org X-Test-IDTracker: no X-IETF-IDTracker: 6.63.2 Auto-Submitted: auto-generated Precedence: bulk Message-ID: <150913123562.22282.10758144495326501408@ietfa.amsl.com> Date: Fri, 27 Oct 2017 12:07:15 -0700 Archived-At: Subject: [Bier] I-D Action: draft-ietf-bier-mpls-encapsulation-12.txt X-BeenThere: bier@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 List-Id: "\"Bit Indexed Explicit Replication discussion list\"" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 27 Oct 2017 19:07:16 -0000 A New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line Internet-Drafts directories. This draft is a work item of the Bit Indexed Explicit Replication WG of the IETF. Title : Encapsulation for Bit Index Explicit Replication in MPLS and non-MPLS Networks Authors : IJsbrand Wijnands Eric C. Rosen Andrew Dolganow Jeff Tantsura Sam K Aldrin Israel Meilik Filename : draft-ietf-bier-mpls-encapsulation-12.txt Pages : 22 Date : 2017-10-27 Abstract: Bit Index Explicit Replication (BIER) is an architecture that provides optimal multicast forwarding through a "multicast domain", without requiring intermediate routers to maintain any per-flow state or to engage in an explicit tree-building protocol. When a multicast data packet enters the domain, the ingress router determines the set of egress routers to which the packet needs to be sent. The ingress router then encapsulates the packet in a BIER header. The BIER header contains a bitstring in which each bit represents exactly one egress router in the domain; to forward the packet to a given set of egress routers, the bits corresponding to those routers are set in the BIER header. The details of the encapsulation depend on the type of network used to realize the multicast domain. This document specifies a BIER encapsulation that can be used in an MPLS network, or with slight differences, in a non-MPLS network. The IETF datatracker status page for this draft is: https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-bier-mpls-encapsulation/ There are also htmlized versions available at: https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-bier-mpls-encapsulation-12 https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/html/draft-ietf-bier-mpls-encapsulation-12 A diff from the previous version is available at: https://www.ietf.org/rfcdiff?url2=draft-ietf-bier-mpls-encapsulation-12 Please note that it may take a couple of minutes from the time of submission until the htmlized version and diff are available at tools.ietf.org. Internet-Drafts are also available by anonymous FTP at: ftp://ftp.ietf.org/internet-drafts/ From nobody Fri Oct 27 20:02:31 2017 Return-Path: X-Original-To: bier@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: bier@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8523E13AF75 for ; Fri, 27 Oct 2017 20:02:30 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -4.219 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-4.219 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-2.3, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_H3=-0.01, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_WL=-0.01, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id WG76ZPjbWwqg for ; Fri, 27 Oct 2017 20:02:28 -0700 (PDT) Received: from lhrrgout.huawei.com (lhrrgout.huawei.com [194.213.3.17]) (using TLSv1 with cipher RC4-SHA (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 9D8EA13F658 for ; Fri, 27 Oct 2017 20:02:21 -0700 (PDT) Received: from 172.18.7.190 (EHLO LHREML714-CAH.china.huawei.com) ([172.18.7.190]) by lhrrg01-dlp.huawei.com (MOS 4.3.7-GA FastPath queued) with ESMTP id DYO16738; Sat, 28 Oct 2017 03:02:19 +0000 (GMT) Received: from NKGEML411-HUB.china.huawei.com (10.98.56.70) by LHREML714-CAH.china.huawei.com (10.201.108.37) with Microsoft SMTP Server (TLS) id 14.3.361.1; Sat, 28 Oct 2017 04:02:18 +0100 Received: from NKGEML514-MBS.china.huawei.com ([169.254.3.36]) by nkgeml411-hub.china.huawei.com ([10.98.56.70]) with mapi id 14.03.0235.001; Sat, 28 Oct 2017 11:02:10 +0800 From: Xiejingrong To: Tony Przygienda , "gjshep@gmail.com" , Liuyisong CC: "bier@ietf.org" Thread-Topic: Slots requests for IETF-100 Singapore BIER session //RE: [Bier] Call for BIER Agenda items for IETF 1000 ... Thread-Index: AdNPmOZi2XHPkd4wTpav31asSsXjdA== Date: Sat, 28 Oct 2017 03:02:08 +0000 Message-ID: <16253F7987E4F346823E305D08F9115A999D8800@nkgeml514-mbs.china.huawei.com> Accept-Language: zh-CN, en-US Content-Language: zh-CN X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: x-originating-ip: [10.111.217.214] Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="_000_16253F7987E4F346823E305D08F9115A999D8800nkgeml514mbschi_" MIME-Version: 1.0 X-CFilter-Loop: Reflected X-Mirapoint-Virus-RAPID-Raw: score=unknown(0), refid=str=0001.0A020202.59F3F33C.0009, ss=1, re=0.000, recu=0.000, reip=0.000, cl=1, cld=1, fgs=0, ip=169.254.3.36, so=2013-06-18 04:22:30, dmn=2013-03-21 17:37:32 X-Mirapoint-Loop-Id: a9334176e4f23e22882de5fd798e0b8d Archived-At: Subject: [Bier] Slots requests for IETF-100 Singapore BIER session //RE: Call for BIER Agenda items for IETF 1000 ... 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AQHTT8XO5I5X3EVmgEKpB43iZ45Fng== Date: Sat, 28 Oct 2017 08:21:51 +0000 Message-ID: <51E6A56BD6A85142B9D172C87FC3ABBB9C5D4AB7@nkgeml513-mbx.china.huawei.com> Accept-Language: zh-CN, en-US Content-Language: zh-CN X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: x-originating-ip: [10.134.153.152] Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-CFilter-Loop: Reflected X-Mirapoint-Virus-RAPID-Raw: score=unknown(0), refid=str=0001.0A020203.59F43E27.0011, ss=1, re=0.000, recu=0.000, reip=0.000, cl=1, cld=1, fgs=0, ip=169.254.1.105, so=2013-06-18 04:22:30, dmn=2013-03-21 17:37:32 X-Mirapoint-Loop-Id: 0799d8b02186df287bf1b6dbd46684ea Archived-At: Subject: [Bier] [bier] FW: New Version Notification for draft-huang-bier-te-encapsulation-extension-00.txt X-BeenThere: bier@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 Precedence: list List-Id: "\"Bit Indexed Explicit Replication discussion list\"" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sat, 28 Oct 2017 08:22:03 -0000 SGksDQoNCkknbSBhIGZyZXNobWFuIGluIHRoZSByb3V0aW5nIGFyZWEuIEkgdXNlZCB0byB3b3Jr IGluIHRoZSB2aWRlbyB0cmFuc3BvcnQgYXJlYSwgd2hpY2ggaXMgb25lIG9mIHRoZSB1c2UgY2Fz ZXMgZm9yIEJJRVIgcHJvdG9jb2wuIFNMQSBpcyBpbXBvcnRhbnQgZm9yIHZpZGVvIHRyYW5zcG9y dCwgZXNwZWNpYWxseSBpbiBzb21lIHByb2Zlc3Npb25hbCBtZWRpYSBuZXR3b3JrLiBTbyB0aGUg dHJhZmZpYyBlbmdpbmVlcmluZyBpcyBhIGJhc2ljIHJlcXVpcmVtZW50LiBDdXJyZW50IEJJRVIt VEUgaXMgYSBnb29kIHNvbHV0aW9uIHRvIHByb3ZpZGUgdHJhZmZpYyBlbmdpbmVlcmluZyBidXQg d2l0aCB0aGUgc2NhbGluZyBsaW1pdHMuIFdlIHN1Ym1pdHRlZCBhIG5ldyBkcmFmdCwgQklFUi1U RSBleHRlbnNpb24sIHRvIGV4dGVuZCB0aGF0LiBJdCdzIHZlcnkgcm91Z2guIFlvdXIgY29tbWVu dHMgYW5kIHN1Z2dlc3Rpb25zIGFyZSB3ZWxjb21lLg0KDQpCUiwNClJhY2hlbA0KDQotLS0tLU9y aWdpbmFsIE1lc3NhZ2UtLS0tLQ0KRnJvbTogaW50ZXJuZXQtZHJhZnRzQGlldGYub3JnIFttYWls dG86aW50ZXJuZXQtZHJhZnRzQGlldGYub3JnXSANClNlbnQ6IFNhdHVyZGF5LCBPY3RvYmVyIDI4 LCAyMDE3IDI6MzUgUE0NClRvOiB4aWFudTsgSHVhbmd5aWhvbmcgKFJhY2hlbCk7IFdlaW5haXdl 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ICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAN Cg0KDQpQbGVhc2Ugbm90ZSB0aGF0IGl0IG1heSB0YWtlIGEgY291cGxlIG9mIG1pbnV0ZXMgZnJv bSB0aGUgdGltZSBvZiBzdWJtaXNzaW9uIHVudGlsIHRoZSBodG1saXplZCB2ZXJzaW9uIGFuZCBk aWZmIGFyZSBhdmFpbGFibGUgYXQgdG9vbHMuaWV0Zi5vcmcuDQoNClRoZSBJRVRGIFNlY3JldGFy aWF0DQoNCg== From nobody Sat Oct 28 20:17:08 2017 Return-Path: X-Original-To: bier@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: bier@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id B768C13FDF2 for ; Sat, 28 Oct 2017 20:17:06 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.92 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.92 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE=-0.0001, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_H3=-0.01, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_WL=-0.01, SPF_PASS=-0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); 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C8eBC0rBBC3QB45dCkWQ2f+c2Zx+Ff/8FavgFVyxBOUgG73gFmywBEQ7D9/QNumQB3qRCb1wO+rw Dfhi6/8RDL2QH8GwBAVSDr3A1d9gEaOwBDDQf0UQbtvwDS/QAt0wAxT+EBSQCUaDC2QQCrHwCBBQ CKWACxBQAFgxCLFRCqZwCLFAB8gwAWfhDWLAFWgw16uABoCAAVfgDfcuARewDc9zAR2AASHgDZmt Dt5wFSFwAWYxCt6gszngDak+ChcgABhwDN5wO1pw8UxwDGjwHzPgDVRtAt7gNYBgCgvABGIwDv9h e00yFqdSo/ZRo4BJVIsC0QUZNBaqRwFdoHo4DyCdYBKxYCM+Txk+A/TzQBmxMA+MkvQyUQVKjxTz 0PRRTxU6oyGdIBNYsyphUFxUXx6lwPWusYsBAQA7 --=====_002_next=====-- --=====_001_next=====-- From nobody Sun Oct 29 22:39:05 2017 Return-Path: X-Original-To: bier@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: bier@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1C02213FCDF for ; Sun, 29 Oct 2017 22:39:04 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: 0 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=0 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_40=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Received: from mail.ietf.org 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linzer.ki.iif.hu (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 9B24A406339 for ; Mon, 30 Oct 2017 06:38:59 +0100 (CET) From: matecs To: bier@ietf.org Message-ID: <8523ba47-d5e4-e7e1-0cbb-723be43b6fee@niif.hu> Date: Mon, 30 Oct 2017 06:38:59 +0100 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; Linux x86_64; rv:52.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/52.4.0 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8; format=flowed Content-Language: en-US Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Archived-At: Subject: [Bier] clarification in https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-bier-architecture-08 X-BeenThere: bier@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 Precedence: list List-Id: "\"Bit Indexed Explicit Replication discussion list\"" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 30 Oct 2017 05:39:04 -0000 hi, i'm developing bier for freerouter.nop.hu, and during this process, i found that bitstring encoding is not fully clarified in the drafts. especially, the byte order of bitstring is not specified anywhere. so allow me to suggest a small addition to the arch draft to section 3, below the current two bullets, a third one: * BitString encoding is big endian (msb) on the wire. It means that if you have to send to BFR-id 1, then you have to set the lowest bit in the last byte in the BitString. thanks, csaba mate niif/hungarnet From nobody Mon Oct 30 06:53:39 2017 Return-Path: X-Original-To: bier@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: bier@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8AE5E13F9D8 for ; Mon, 30 Oct 2017 06:53:38 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -14.52 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-14.52 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_HI=-5, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_H3=-0.01, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_WL=-0.01, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001, USER_IN_DEF_DKIM_WL=-7.5] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (1024-bit key) header.d=cisco.com Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 4TnrGJIffgHa for ; 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d="scan'208";a="312262622" Received: from alln-core-1.cisco.com ([173.36.13.131]) by rcdn-iport-7.cisco.com with ESMTP/TLS/DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA; 30 Oct 2017 13:53:13 +0000 Received: from XCH-RTP-014.cisco.com (xch-rtp-014.cisco.com [64.101.220.154]) by alln-core-1.cisco.com (8.14.5/8.14.5) with ESMTP id v9UDrDRg002332 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Mon, 30 Oct 2017 13:53:13 GMT Received: from xch-rtp-015.cisco.com (64.101.220.155) by XCH-RTP-014.cisco.com (64.101.220.154) with Microsoft SMTP Server (TLS) id 15.0.1320.4; Mon, 30 Oct 2017 09:53:12 -0400 Received: from xch-rtp-015.cisco.com ([64.101.220.155]) by XCH-RTP-015.cisco.com ([64.101.220.155]) with mapi id 15.00.1320.000; Mon, 30 Oct 2017 09:53:12 -0400 From: "Acee Lindem (acee)" To: matecs , "bier@ietf.org" Thread-Topic: [Bier] clarification in https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-bier-architecture-08 Thread-Index: AQHTUUFoUp8MW9sUHUevceY/q/DKDaL8ajKA Date: Mon, 30 Oct 2017 13:53:12 +0000 Message-ID: References: <8523ba47-d5e4-e7e1-0cbb-723be43b6fee@niif.hu> In-Reply-To: <8523ba47-d5e4-e7e1-0cbb-723be43b6fee@niif.hu> Accept-Language: en-US Content-Language: en-US X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: x-ms-exchange-messagesentrepresentingtype: 1 x-ms-exchange-transport-fromentityheader: Hosted x-originating-ip: [10.116.152.196] Content-Type: text/plain; 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Mon, 30 Oct 2017 07:31:34 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 Received: by 10.223.150.10 with HTTP; Mon, 30 Oct 2017 07:31:33 -0700 (PDT) In-Reply-To: <8523ba47-d5e4-e7e1-0cbb-723be43b6fee@niif.hu> References: <8523ba47-d5e4-e7e1-0cbb-723be43b6fee@niif.hu> From: Alia Atlas Date: Mon, 30 Oct 2017 10:31:33 -0400 Message-ID: To: matecs Cc: "bier@ietf.org" Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="001a1147578acebe1b055cc47e49" Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Bier] clarification in https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-bier-architecture-08 X-BeenThere: bier@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 Precedence: list List-Id: "\"Bit Indexed Explicit Replication discussion list\"" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 30 Oct 2017 14:31:43 -0000 --001a1147578acebe1b055cc47e49 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Hi Csaba, Thanks for letting us know that you are developing bier for freerouter.nop.hu. I am expecting a number of other relevant drafts to be progressing out of the BIER WG soon - so this would be a really excellent time to read through and provide feedback. As Acee's email indicated, we always assume Network Byte Order. This particular draft is already to the RFC Editor for publication, but during Auth48 it may be possible to add a brief mention that it is in Network Byte Order. Regards, Alia On Mon, Oct 30, 2017 at 1:38 AM, matecs wrote: > hi, > i'm developing bier for freerouter.nop.hu, and during this process, > i found that bitstring encoding is not fully clarified in the drafts. > especially, the byte order of bitstring is not specified anywhere. > so allow me to suggest a small addition to the arch draft > to section 3, below the current two bullets, a third one: > > * BitString encoding is big endian (msb) on the wire. It means that > if you have to send to BFR-id 1, then you have to set the lowest > bit in the last byte in the BitString. > > thanks, > csaba mate > niif/hungarnet > > _______________________________________________ > BIER mailing list > BIER@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/bier > --001a1147578acebe1b055cc47e49 Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Hi Csaba,

Thanks for letting us know th= at you are developing bier for freerou= ter.nop.hu.
I am expecting a number of other relevant drafts = to be progressing out of the
BIER WG soon - so this would be a re= ally excellent time to read through and
provide feedback.

As Acee's email indicated, we always assume Network B= yte Order.=C2=A0 This particular
draft is already to the RFC Edit= or for publication, but during Auth48 it may be possible
to add a= brief mention that it is in Network Byte Order.

R= egards,
Alia

On Mon, Oct 30, 2017 at 1:38 AM, matecs = <matecs@niif.hu&= gt; wrote:
hi,
i'm developing bier for freerouter.nop.hu, and during this process,<= br> i found that bitstring encoding is not fully clarified in the drafts.
especially, the byte order of bitstring is not specified anywhere.
so allow me to suggest a small addition to the arch draft
to section 3, below the current two bullets, a third one:

* BitString encoding is big endian (msb) on the wire. It means that
=C2=A0 if you have to send to BFR-id 1, then you have to set the lowest
=C2=A0 bit in the last byte in the BitString.

thanks,
csaba mate
niif/hungarnet

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--001a1147578acebe1b055cc47e49-- From nobody Mon Oct 30 08:33:07 2017 Return-Path: X-Original-To: bier@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: bier@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id A455C1FF651 for ; Mon, 30 Oct 2017 08:33:06 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.698 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.698 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW=-0.7, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=gmail.com Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 68D3B3sWO2M3 for ; Mon, 30 Oct 2017 08:33:04 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail-wm0-x236.google.com (mail-wm0-x236.google.com [IPv6:2a00:1450:400c:c09::236]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 394FF13FA28 for ; Mon, 30 Oct 2017 08:27:14 -0700 (PDT) Received: by mail-wm0-x236.google.com with SMTP id t139so17252322wmt.1 for ; Mon, 30 Oct 2017 08:27:14 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20161025; h=mime-version:in-reply-to:references:from:date:message-id:subject:to :cc; bh=wXncKV2+zASXxKJyrsF9sAaGxPe43/YAmUROTnqETcY=; b=f/cfqPwk+hRGt8E3iS3xbk0TkIGRD7PSwdXqDmDbr7cln4/0EkJFunM03x7pKWgBJZ CTGgytpwCm1sMHQr/x0eSeAlzY3hoCMKA8jZlR9FUgxWaeVW3IZR2Bu/BN4VmLVSdpxl Xf2DAW+PyHCQ6K/Utjs81fYEER39G5bA+Kzmr6iWdWwNFsv5MBw/pMk81PF1gIbdSmLe ng6TD+GUPYOZDuk1MH09j2gPi0ldrfOoLn3sze9jea5xA/MmLinUNbRMPKk9wW/sLPCM XYdgU7HR2qswbdpaRPfoN+ssL+Xka3hpGRhLr13qxWevgZBdz3zCcb9y+LVWw8p9fdP7 oI4g== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:in-reply-to:references:from:date :message-id:subject:to:cc; bh=wXncKV2+zASXxKJyrsF9sAaGxPe43/YAmUROTnqETcY=; b=I+PnjDY3922vi7jyBUL5A0bP21NQ9C5UDsvUPKaBG5YT7Kp+FvOsTl2EG4Gin/KKiV UOM+LR1UWcO5TC1HNOxd50mXJsn06fQxJhgDq8ZNaCfMnbg7OwW0DhjIFLHFaEVDQp1G SL99Kn14G6qX7UhZlh58KA62p0qmiRfI4mhcddnHQYzmwhLyjUNcAOxl44PfnKSoVKu7 bGsE6RjCe22+ght1tatIw9hnko2yBUdycL5xwiRxYVSpwR5tvvMVSg+vya2sUKRbdIql 8p8Gx5ZC78bAMzdWybMt04xT/9Gl5kfPKObaxGt/D+VtIxW/2RPNQgU6KKJFbJS4TxkS mxyA== X-Gm-Message-State: AMCzsaXX5XhxcOL4mvD1oA+Rk2PVzkX23u31mlon1UqSrivVZLG+y+MM PnKpjET2S3C8p5FDE/Vzpuy9FWVjoeYOsJLd2nk= X-Google-Smtp-Source: ABhQp+TVJS0FNgiag3Tdj9EndHAf4WrIvuLWWZ5/K/80GwlNsZIFbsinxTWwtY4Vfky/M07Ep+PWxvkz+nWNyntVTYA= X-Received: by 10.80.206.84 with SMTP id k20mr12334569edj.145.1509377232420; Mon, 30 Oct 2017 08:27:12 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 Received: by 10.80.164.220 with HTTP; Mon, 30 Oct 2017 08:26:31 -0700 (PDT) In-Reply-To: References: <8523ba47-d5e4-e7e1-0cbb-723be43b6fee@niif.hu> From: Tony Przygienda Date: Mon, 30 Oct 2017 08:26:31 -0700 Message-ID: To: Alia Atlas Cc: matecs , "bier@ietf.org" Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="94eb2c1b2174c619ae055cc5451c" Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Bier] clarification in https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-bier-architecture-08 X-BeenThere: bier@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 Precedence: list List-Id: "\"Bit Indexed Explicit Replication discussion list\"" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 30 Oct 2017 15:33:07 -0000 --94eb2c1b2174c619ae055cc5451c Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" I suggest to add a mention/reference on AUTH48 since I got the question 2-3 times already from different parties. Network byte order is normally specified up to 32 and 64 bits (well, maybe 128 if one dealt with SIMD) but BIER takes it into a much longer space so it's not necessarily evident. --- tony On Mon, Oct 30, 2017 at 7:31 AM, Alia Atlas wrote: > Hi Csaba, > > Thanks for letting us know that you are developing bier for > freerouter.nop.hu. > I am expecting a number of other relevant drafts to be progressing out of > the > BIER WG soon - so this would be a really excellent time to read through and > provide feedback. > > As Acee's email indicated, we always assume Network Byte Order. This > particular > draft is already to the RFC Editor for publication, but during Auth48 it > may be possible > to add a brief mention that it is in Network Byte Order. > > Regards, > Alia > > On Mon, Oct 30, 2017 at 1:38 AM, matecs wrote: > >> hi, >> i'm developing bier for freerouter.nop.hu, and during this process, >> i found that bitstring encoding is not fully clarified in the drafts. >> especially, the byte order of bitstring is not specified anywhere. >> so allow me to suggest a small addition to the arch draft >> to section 3, below the current two bullets, a third one: >> >> * BitString encoding is big endian (msb) on the wire. It means that >> if you have to send to BFR-id 1, then you have to set the lowest >> bit in the last byte in the BitString. >> >> thanks, >> csaba mate >> niif/hungarnet >> >> _______________________________________________ >> BIER mailing list >> BIER@ietf.org >> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/bier >> > > > _______________________________________________ > BIER mailing list > BIER@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/bier > > --94eb2c1b2174c619ae055cc5451c Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
I suggest to add a mention/reference on AUTH48 since I got= the question 2-3 times already from different parties.=C2=A0

Network byte order is normally specified up to 32 and 64 bits (well, = maybe 128 if one dealt with SIMD) but BIER takes it into a much longer spac= e so it's not necessarily evident.=C2=A0

--- t= ony=C2=A0


On Mon, Oct 30, 2017 at 7:31 AM, Alia Atlas = <akatlas@gmail.co= m> wrote:
= Hi Csaba,

Thanks for letting us know that you are develo= ping bier for freero= uter.nop.hu.
I am expecting a number of other relevant drafts= to be progressing out of the
BIER WG soon - so this would be a r= eally excellent time to read through and
provide feedback.
<= div>
As Acee's email indicated, we always assume Network = Byte Order.=C2=A0 This particular
draft is already to the RFC Edi= tor for publication, but during Auth48 it may be possible
to add = a brief mention that it is in Network Byte Order.

= Regards,
Alia

On Mon, Oct 30, 2017 at 1:38 AM, matecs <matecs@nii= f.hu> wrote:
hi,
i'm developing bier for freerouter.nop.hu, and during this process,<= br> i found that bitstring encoding is not fully clarified in the drafts.
especially, the byte order of bitstring is not specified anywhere.
so allow me to suggest a small addition to the arch draft
to section 3, below the current two bullets, a third one:

* BitString encoding is big endian (msb) on the wire. It means that
=C2=A0 if you have to send to BFR-id 1, then you have to set the lowest
=C2=A0 bit in the last byte in the BitString.

thanks,
csaba mate
niif/hungarnet

_______________________________________________
BIER mailing list
BIER@ietf.org
https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/bier


_______________________________________________
BIER mailing list
BIER@ietf.org
https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/bier


--94eb2c1b2174c619ae055cc5451c-- From nobody Mon Oct 30 08:57:49 2017 Return-Path: X-Original-To: bier@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: bier@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id E132513FAAA for ; Mon, 30 Oct 2017 08:57:47 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.899 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.899 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id diSe86fTStUS for ; Mon, 30 Oct 2017 08:57:40 -0700 (PDT) Received: from linzer.ki.iif.hu (linzer.ki.iif.hu [IPv6:2001:738:0:600:216:3eff:fe02:b1]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher AECDH-AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id A7D3649AF for ; Mon, 30 Oct 2017 08:48:38 -0700 (PDT) Received: from bolha.lvs.iif.hu (bolha.lvs.iif.hu [193.225.14.181]) by linzer.ki.iif.hu (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3DF4640634A; Mon, 30 Oct 2017 16:48:37 +0100 (CET) X-Virus-Scanned: Debian amavisd-new at bolha.lvs.iif.hu Received: from linzer.ki.iif.hu ([IPv6:::ffff:193.224.163.7]) by bolha.lvs.iif.hu (bolha.lvs.iif.hu [::ffff:193.225.14.72]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id sB31DV3yc0X5; Mon, 30 Oct 2017 16:48:36 +0100 (CET) Received: from [IPv6:2001:db8:21:0:221a:6ff:fe6d:1304] (unknown [IPv6:2001:470:1f1a:308::dead:beef]) by linzer.ki.iif.hu (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 5333D406349; Mon, 30 Oct 2017 16:48:36 +0100 (CET) To: Tony Przygienda , Alia Atlas Cc: "bier@ietf.org" References: <8523ba47-d5e4-e7e1-0cbb-723be43b6fee@niif.hu> From: matecs Message-ID: <45ccec2f-c92a-4edc-2781-a0b677f8a80a@niif.hu> Date: Mon, 30 Oct 2017 16:48:35 +0100 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; Linux x86_64; rv:52.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/52.4.0 MIME-Version: 1.0 In-Reply-To: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8; format=flowed Content-Language: en-US Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Bier] clarification in https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-bier-architecture-08 X-BeenThere: bier@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 Precedence: list List-Id: "\"Bit Indexed Explicit Replication discussion list\"" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 30 Oct 2017 15:57:48 -0000 hi, https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-bier-mpls-encapsulation/ is not in the rfc-editor queue and also tells things about bitstring encoding in section 2.1.2. so if there is a will to clarify byte order, that draft probably easier to deal with... regards, cs On 10/30/2017 04:26 PM, Tony Przygienda wrote: > I suggest to add a mention/reference on AUTH48 since I got the question > 2-3 times already from different parties. > > Network byte order is normally specified up to 32 and 64 bits (well, > maybe 128 if one dealt with SIMD) but BIER takes it into a much longer > space so it's not necessarily evident. > > --- tony > > > On Mon, Oct 30, 2017 at 7:31 AM, Alia Atlas > wrote: > > Hi Csaba, > > Thanks for letting us know that you are developing bier for > freerouter.nop.hu . > I am expecting a number of other relevant drafts to be progressing > out of the > BIER WG soon - so this would be a really excellent time to read > through and > provide feedback. > > As Acee's email indicated, we always assume Network Byte Order. > This particular > draft is already to the RFC Editor for publication, but during > Auth48 it may be possible > to add a brief mention that it is in Network Byte Order. > > Regards, > Alia > > On Mon, Oct 30, 2017 at 1:38 AM, matecs > wrote: > > hi, > i'm developing bier for freerouter.nop.hu > , and during this process, > i found that bitstring encoding is not fully clarified in the > drafts. > especially, the byte order of bitstring is not specified anywhere. > so allow me to suggest a small addition to the arch draft > to section 3, below the current two bullets, a third one: > > * BitString encoding is big endian (msb) on the wire. It means that >   if you have to send to BFR-id 1, then you have to set the lowest >   bit in the last byte in the BitString. > > thanks, > csaba mate > niif/hungarnet > > _______________________________________________ > BIER mailing list > BIER@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/bier > > > > > _______________________________________________ > BIER mailing list > BIER@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/bier > > > From nobody Mon Oct 30 09:01:58 2017 Return-Path: X-Original-To: bier@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: bier@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id B87B14E92 for ; Mon, 30 Oct 2017 09:01:56 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.698 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.698 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, FREEMAIL_REPLY=1, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW=-0.7, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=no autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); 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a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:in-reply-to:references:from:date :message-id:subject:to:cc; bh=9fJFCivp11qflxfsF3opcR7mWcVFO/cSHFBErr8Tssk=; b=joj6RHv7lbMKR9wgYnlioQVgkajem0xbY8EaiFPtIMb24rxNynbcmjLEufoQhl0K2f Spm6/uLAx3bh+ed6EebluE6IFCRPfb+RMo/fKehpcgm0b7P3TwXXVakGvJAXxoEg1M/y 4Vy2Gh2BHSHAGoL9tecIhtnlKlKfLy14ENJGK6J+mBMWRceYbL4TLW+0Spwx50N/7GBN XWJfbT6f1r0PElPebdFW45utknJ07OqrfVOn2OiQ0Ws3wqlgPWDGke8KqaSfRxa9V3Qu FZ+wtELkVNWAgDdIdRCB5kuykYdvzckzpHkXVaOF5vDWzeYkB/tTbX/zbovNbEaFDLF+ q/3w== X-Gm-Message-State: AMCzsaVxhJX9+k/iZNR2QDk2O3OsprrAZ7k1oIJxii8ht+44bdtf7VLD coTLbq7K5lXpTmQXuNBieX7C/KS/YqA0L+Hl3DviwA== X-Google-Smtp-Source: ABhQp+QqUBcmPwT9kv1YoVQ1U0uO3HCOd0wbmDaFDnpxmjEI985ByMK7OXNmyOpBOlkghyhNWlsTR8rqO4CKPIaFkfI= X-Received: by 10.80.148.44 with SMTP id p41mr12289103eda.171.1509378691961; Mon, 30 Oct 2017 08:51:31 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 Received: by 10.80.164.220 with HTTP; Mon, 30 Oct 2017 08:50:51 -0700 (PDT) In-Reply-To: <45ccec2f-c92a-4edc-2781-a0b677f8a80a@niif.hu> References: <8523ba47-d5e4-e7e1-0cbb-723be43b6fee@niif.hu> <45ccec2f-c92a-4edc-2781-a0b677f8a80a@niif.hu> From: Tony Przygienda Date: Mon, 30 Oct 2017 08:50:51 -0700 Message-ID: To: matecs Cc: Alia Atlas , "bier@ietf.org" Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="f403045c2b04c417e9055cc59c72" Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Bier] clarification in https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-bier-architecture-08 X-BeenThere: bier@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 Precedence: list List-Id: "\"Bit Indexed Explicit Replication discussion list\"" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 30 Oct 2017 16:01:57 -0000 --f403045c2b04c417e9055cc59c72 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" There are multiple encapsulations in the queue, it is better to clear it @ architectural level given our architecture has a flavor of "practical design and implementation guidelines" which BTW, IMO is a very good thing indeed ;-) --- tony On Mon, Oct 30, 2017 at 8:48 AM, matecs wrote: > hi, > https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-bier-mpls-encapsulation/ > is not in the rfc-editor queue and also tells > things about bitstring encoding in section 2.1.2. > so if there is a will to clarify byte order, > that draft probably easier to deal with... > regards, > cs > > > On 10/30/2017 04:26 PM, Tony Przygienda wrote: > >> I suggest to add a mention/reference on AUTH48 since I got the question >> 2-3 times already from different parties. >> >> Network byte order is normally specified up to 32 and 64 bits (well, >> maybe 128 if one dealt with SIMD) but BIER takes it into a much longer >> space so it's not necessarily evident. >> >> --- tony >> >> >> On Mon, Oct 30, 2017 at 7:31 AM, Alia Atlas > akatlas@gmail.com>> wrote: >> >> Hi Csaba, >> >> Thanks for letting us know that you are developing bier for >> freerouter.nop.hu . >> I am expecting a number of other relevant drafts to be progressing >> out of the >> BIER WG soon - so this would be a really excellent time to read >> through and >> provide feedback. >> >> As Acee's email indicated, we always assume Network Byte Order. >> This particular >> draft is already to the RFC Editor for publication, but during >> Auth48 it may be possible >> to add a brief mention that it is in Network Byte Order. >> >> Regards, >> Alia >> >> On Mon, Oct 30, 2017 at 1:38 AM, matecs > > wrote: >> >> hi, >> i'm developing bier for freerouter.nop.hu >> , and during this process, >> i found that bitstring encoding is not fully clarified in the >> drafts. >> especially, the byte order of bitstring is not specified anywhere. >> so allow me to suggest a small addition to the arch draft >> to section 3, below the current two bullets, a third one: >> >> * BitString encoding is big endian (msb) on the wire. It means >> that >> if you have to send to BFR-id 1, then you have to set the >> lowest >> bit in the last byte in the BitString. >> >> thanks, >> csaba mate >> niif/hungarnet >> >> _______________________________________________ >> BIER mailing list >> BIER@ietf.org >> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/bier >> >> >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> BIER mailing list >> BIER@ietf.org >> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/bier >> >> >> >> --f403045c2b04c417e9055cc59c72 Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
There are multiple encapsulations in the queue, it is bett= er to clear it @ architectural level given our architecture has a flavor of= "practical design and implementation guidelines" which BTW, IMO = is a very good thing indeed ;-)=C2=A0

--- tony=C2=A0

On Mon, O= ct 30, 2017 at 8:48 AM, matecs <matecs@niif.hu> wrote:
hi,
https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-bier-mpls-encapsulation/
is not in the rfc-editor queue and also tells
things about bitstring encoding in section 2.1.2.
so if there is a will to clarify byte order,
that draft probably easier to deal with...
regards,
cs


On 10/30/2017 04:26 PM, Tony Przygienda wrote:
I suggest to add a mention/reference on AUTH48 since I got the question 2-3= times already from different parties.

Network byte order is normally specified up to 32 and 64 bits (well, maybe = 128 if one dealt with SIMD) but BIER takes it into a much longer space so i= t's not necessarily evident.

--- tony


 On Mon, Oct 30, 2017 at 7:31 AM, Alia Atlas <akatlas@gmail.com <mailto:akatlas@gmail.com>> wrot= e:

=C2=A0 =C2=A0 Hi Csaba,

=C2=A0 =C2=A0 Thanks for letting us know that you are developing bier for =C2=A0 =C2=A0 freerouter.nop.hu <http://freerouter.nop.hu>.
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 I am expecting a number of other relevant drafts to be progre= ssing
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 out of the
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 BIER WG soon - so this would be a really excellent time to re= ad
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 through and
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 provide feedback.

=C2=A0 =C2=A0 As Acee's email indicated, we always assume Network Byte = Order.=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0This particular
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 draft is already to the RFC Editor for publication, but durin= g
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 Auth48 it may be possible
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 to add a brief mention that it is in Network Byte Order.

=C2=A0 =C2=A0 Regards,
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 Alia

=C2=A0 =C2=A0 On Mon, Oct 30, 2017 at 1:38 AM, matecs <matecs@niif.hu
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 <mailto:matecs@niif.hu>> wrote:

=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 hi,
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 i'm developing bier for freerouter.nop.hu
 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 <http://freerouter.nop.hu>, and during= this process,
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 i found that bitstring encoding is not fully cl= arified in the
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 drafts.
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 especially, the byte order of bitstring is not = specified anywhere.
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 so allow me to suggest a small addition to the = arch draft
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 to section 3, below the current two bullets, a = third one:

=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 * BitString encoding is big endian (msb) on the= wire. It means that
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0=C2=A0 if you have to send to BFR-id 1, t= hen you have to set the lowest
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0=C2=A0 bit in the last byte in the BitStr= ing.

=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 thanks,
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 csaba mate
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 niif/hungarnet

=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 __________________________________________= _____
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 BIER mailing list
 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 BIER@ietf.org <mailto:BIER@ietf.org>
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 https://www.ietf.org/mailman/l= istinfo/bier
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 <https://www.ietf.org/mailm= an/listinfo/bier>



=C2=A0 =C2=A0 _______________________________________________
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 BIER mailing list
 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 BIER@ietf.= org <mailto:BIER@= ietf.org>
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/b= ier
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 <https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listin= fo/bier>



--f403045c2b04c417e9055cc59c72-- From nobody Mon Oct 30 09:33:03 2017 Return-Path: X-Original-To: bier@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: bier@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 568F66973 for ; Mon, 30 Oct 2017 09:33:01 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -4.198 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-4.198 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, HEADER_FROM_DIFFERENT_DOMAINS=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-2.3, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id difPwgw2NFnE for ; Mon, 30 Oct 2017 09:33:00 -0700 (PDT) Received: from faui40.informatik.uni-erlangen.de (faui40.informatik.uni-erlangen.de [IPv6:2001:638:a000:4134::ffff:40]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher AECDH-AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 18B60697C for ; Mon, 30 Oct 2017 09:22:56 -0700 (PDT) Received: from faui40p.informatik.uni-erlangen.de (faui40p.informatik.uni-erlangen.de [IPv6:2001:638:a000:4134::ffff:77]) by faui40.informatik.uni-erlangen.de (Postfix) with ESMTP id F0AF258C509; Mon, 30 Oct 2017 17:22:51 +0100 (CET) Received: by faui40p.informatik.uni-erlangen.de (Postfix, from userid 10463) id D3B34B0D023; Mon, 30 Oct 2017 17:22:51 +0100 (CET) Date: Mon, 30 Oct 2017 17:22:51 +0100 From: Toerless Eckert To: Greg Shepherd Cc: "bier@ietf.org" Message-ID: <20171030162251.GA27451@faui40p.informatik.uni-erlangen.de> References: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: User-Agent: Mutt/1.5.21 (2010-09-15) Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Bier] Call for adoption: draft-eckert-bier-te-arch X-BeenThere: bier@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 Precedence: list List-Id: "\"Bit Indexed Explicit Replication discussion list\"" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 30 Oct 2017 16:33:01 -0000 Thanks! Uploaded. Cheers Toerless On Wed, Oct 25, 2017 at 03:47:44PM -0700, Greg Shepherd wrote: > Solid support from the list, w/ no dissent. > > Authors, please rename and the chairs will accept as WG items. > > Thanks, > Greg > > On Tue, Aug 1, 2017 at 7:02 PM, Greg Shepherd wrote: > > > We had solid support in the room in Prague to adopt this work. So let's > > get a vote from the list. Please read and respond for or against adopting > > this as a WG document: > > > > https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-eckert-bier-te-arch/ > > https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-eckert-bier-te-frr/ > > > > Cheers, > > Greg > > > _______________________________________________ > BIER mailing list > BIER@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/bier From nobody Mon Oct 30 13:30:16 2017 Return-Path: X-Original-To: bier@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: bier@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id B398E13F5C8 for ; Mon, 30 Oct 2017 13:30:14 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -4.198 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-4.198 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, HEADER_FROM_DIFFERENT_DOMAINS=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-2.3, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id VjQMeR1FisgV for ; Mon, 30 Oct 2017 13:30:12 -0700 (PDT) Received: from faui40.informatik.uni-erlangen.de (faui40.informatik.uni-erlangen.de [IPv6:2001:638:a000:4134::ffff:40]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher AECDH-AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 8BCFE13F55F for ; Mon, 30 Oct 2017 13:30:12 -0700 (PDT) Received: from faui40p.informatik.uni-erlangen.de (faui40p.informatik.uni-erlangen.de [131.188.34.77]) by faui40.informatik.uni-erlangen.de (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9941358C4EA; Mon, 30 Oct 2017 21:30:08 +0100 (CET) Received: by faui40p.informatik.uni-erlangen.de (Postfix, from userid 10463) id 84312B0D027; Mon, 30 Oct 2017 21:30:08 +0100 (CET) Date: Mon, 30 Oct 2017 21:30:08 +0100 From: Toerless Eckert To: Greg Shepherd Cc: "bier@ietf.org" Message-ID: <20171030203008.GB1588@faui40p.informatik.uni-erlangen.de> References: <20171030162251.GA27451@faui40p.informatik.uni-erlangen.de> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <20171030162251.GA27451@faui40p.informatik.uni-erlangen.de> User-Agent: Mutt/1.5.21 (2010-09-15) Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Bier] Call for adoption: draft-eckert-bier-te-arch X-BeenThere: bier@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 Precedence: list List-Id: "\"Bit Indexed Explicit Replication discussion list\"" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 30 Oct 2017 20:30:15 -0000 Pls. approve upload on datatracker was what i did mena to say ;-P On Mon, Oct 30, 2017 at 05:22:51PM +0100, Toerless Eckert wrote: > Thanks! Uploaded. > > Cheers > Toerless > > On Wed, Oct 25, 2017 at 03:47:44PM -0700, Greg Shepherd wrote: > > Solid support from the list, w/ no dissent. > > > > Authors, please rename and the chairs will accept as WG items. > > > > Thanks, > > Greg > > > > On Tue, Aug 1, 2017 at 7:02 PM, Greg Shepherd wrote: > > > > > We had solid support in the room in Prague to adopt this work. So let's > > > get a vote from the list. Please read and respond for or against adopting > > > this as a WG document: > > > > > > https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-eckert-bier-te-arch/ > > > https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-eckert-bier-te-frr/ > > > > > > Cheers, > > > Greg > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > BIER mailing list > > BIER@ietf.org > > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/bier From nobody Mon Oct 30 13:43:57 2017 Return-Path: X-Original-To: bier@ietf.org Delivered-To: bier@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from ietfa.amsl.com (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0AB6E13FB59; Mon, 30 Oct 2017 13:43:50 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: Kathleen Moriarty To: "The IESG" Cc: draft-ietf-bier-mpls-encapsulation@ietf.org, Tony Przygienda , bier-chairs@ietf.org, tonysietf@gmail.com, bier@ietf.org X-Test-IDTracker: no X-IETF-IDTracker: 6.63.2 Auto-Submitted: auto-generated Precedence: bulk Message-ID: <150939623000.7890.8178802944322069238.idtracker@ietfa.amsl.com> Date: Mon, 30 Oct 2017 13:43:50 -0700 Archived-At: Subject: [Bier] Kathleen Moriarty's No Objection on draft-ietf-bier-mpls-encapsulation-12: (with COMMENT) X-BeenThere: bier@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 List-Id: "\"Bit Indexed Explicit Replication discussion list\"" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 30 Oct 2017 20:43:50 -0000 Kathleen Moriarty has entered the following ballot position for draft-ietf-bier-mpls-encapsulation-12: No Objection When responding, please keep the subject line intact and reply to all email addresses included in the To and CC lines. (Feel free to cut this introductory paragraph, however.) Please refer to https://www.ietf.org/iesg/statement/discuss-criteria.html for more information about IESG DISCUSS and COMMENT positions. The document, along with other ballot positions, can be found here: https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-bier-mpls-encapsulation/ ---------------------------------------------------------------------- COMMENT: ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Thanks for addressing my prior discuss. From nobody Mon Oct 30 14:08:13 2017 Return-Path: X-Original-To: bier@ietf.org Delivered-To: bier@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from ietfa.amsl.com (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 984CC13FB69; Mon, 30 Oct 2017 14:08:04 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: The IESG To: "IETF-Announce" X-Test-IDTracker: no X-IETF-IDTracker: 6.63.2 Auto-Submitted: auto-generated Precedence: bulk Cc: draft-ietf-bier-mpls-encapsulation@ietf.org, The IESG , bier@ietf.org, akatlas@gmail.com, rfc-editor@rfc-editor.org, Tony Przygienda , tonysietf@gmail.com, bier-chairs@ietf.org MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Message-ID: <150939768461.7919.17648502233753755986.idtracker@ietfa.amsl.com> Date: Mon, 30 Oct 2017 14:08:04 -0700 Archived-At: Subject: [Bier] Document Action: 'Encapsulation for Bit Index Explicit Replication in MPLS and non-MPLS Networks' to Experimental RFC (draft-ietf-bier-mpls-encapsulation-12.txt) X-BeenThere: bier@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 List-Id: "\"Bit Indexed Explicit Replication discussion list\"" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 30 Oct 2017 21:08:05 -0000 The IESG has approved the following document: - 'Encapsulation for Bit Index Explicit Replication in MPLS and non-MPLS Networks' (draft-ietf-bier-mpls-encapsulation-12.txt) as Experimental RFC This document is the product of the Bit Indexed Explicit Replication Working Group. The IESG contact persons are Alvaro Retana, Alia Atlas and Deborah Brungard. A URL of this Internet Draft is: https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-bier-mpls-encapsulation/ Technical Summary BIER represents a novel forwarding paradigm resulting in a replication-capable network underlay. The according header contains, amongst other information, a bitstring in which each bit represents exactly one egress router in the domain; to forward the packet to a given set of egress routers, the bits corresponding to those routers are set in the header. The details of the encapsulation depend on the type of network used to realize the multicast domain. This document specifies a BIER encapsulation that can be used in an MPLS network, or with slight differences, in a non-MPLS network as well. Working Group Summary This document was processed by the BIER WG and underwent extensive WG and MPLS WG last call review. Several other proposals for non-MPLS encapsulation have been extended but expired after this document covered the space in a more uniform way. The document underwent a well-attended face to face interim WG meeting. Ultimate WG consensus was solid and the document has been supported by representatives of all major vendors, multiple large customers and a large custom silicon vendor. Document Quality Document underwent extensive number of revisions and solid amount of convergence and discussion over a period of three years. One major vendor confirmed implementation. At least two other, major vendors seem to be in the process without explicit confirmation. Personnel Document Shepherd: Tony Przygienda (prz@juniper.net) Responsible Area Director: Alia Atlas (akatlas@gmail.com)