From nobody Tue May 6 13:22:45 2014 Return-Path: X-Original-To: calsify@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: calsify@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id DFA2B1A03DC for ; Tue, 6 May 2014 13:22:42 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: 1.05 X-Spam-Level: * X-Spam-Status: No, score=1.05 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_50=0.8, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, FREEMAIL_REPLY=1, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, RP_MATCHES_RCVD=-0.651, SPF_PASS=-0.001] autolearn=no Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id DTUPY_WaAaWj for ; Tue, 6 May 2014 13:22:42 -0700 (PDT) Received: from qmta10.westchester.pa.mail.comcast.net (qmta10.westchester.pa.mail.comcast.net [IPv6:2001:558:fe14:43:76:96:62:17]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id CB4111A03D3 for ; Tue, 6 May 2014 13:22:41 -0700 (PDT) Received: from omta13.westchester.pa.mail.comcast.net ([76.96.62.52]) by qmta10.westchester.pa.mail.comcast.net with comcast id ydN51n00517dt5G5AkNdsK; Tue, 06 May 2014 20:22:37 +0000 Received: from THARE ([156.75.186.169]) by omta13.westchester.pa.mail.comcast.net with comcast id ykNV1n00A3fj8VG3ZkNXnr; Tue, 06 May 2014 20:22:35 +0000 From: "Tim Hare" To: Date: Tue, 6 May 2014 16:21:56 -0400 Message-ID: <013001cf6968$d7a7fe20$86f7fa60$@net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0131_01CF6947.50965E20" X-Mailer: Microsoft Office Outlook 12.0 Thread-Index: Ac9paNNUnpd29dGVTlWtUFDUXNwhYQ== Content-Language: en-us DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=comcast.net; s=q20140121; t=1399407757; bh=A0CzE/yE+P1Kh4Sk/byt5vfMKhW1gRjPRLUDS0YgfPg=; h=Received:Received:From:To:Subject:Date:Message-ID:MIME-Version: Content-Type; b=XBDPbpolWZpNWp+Ns5XmL5KqoAP/QRCHFlvYrjFmassRCrF0sK4hq8WcN2Gc+n/Uc IT+3oFT7Co7B7tjzV99KPbJoVkE2VPgsA9cpeD3t/gJaIJZ9s8V58DtH0hR2aMag3p 1Mdd5x6WR1XY0bLv4oDdCCEBq/RjyyR57dRCe/37fDJK0A7D3WEAuC4wTMRtHkW+R2 DdQN96aSogC+8IEmtP2z/ZpZ1lzN/ussB5xM1w1oXkqySHFBs/QOGoRh7Kh12vxhgF lSMilNMfZl1wSCr5jev1bMFwyQ5SzNBKgkxQeHMrn555awzEn4nYK1UfsWVJKmKfDc ncWen8cU0wy1g== Archived-At: http://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/calsify/X5qgkz4b7xLbdXS_kBPDtzBWBdc Subject: [calsify] Question re: DESCRIPTION and FMTTYPE X-BeenThere: calsify@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 06 May 2014 20:22:43 -0000 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0131_01CF6947.50965E20 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit I am trying to build an .ics file which is standards compliant, using a non-calendaring tool which will write into a directory on my (mainframe) server. Ideally the description would contain HTML as it needs to contain some links. The target audience uses Outlook so I saved an Outlook appointment as an iCalendar file to see if there were any nuances I needed to worry about - and I discovered that the DESCRIPTION contains only '\n' and there is an X-ALT-DESC property containing the HTML: ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- ------------------------------------------------------------- X-ALT-DESC;FMTTYPE=text/html:\n\n\n\n\n\n\n\n\n

 \;

\n\n\n ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- ---------- Reading RFC 5545 I thought that DESCRIPTION;FMTTYPE=text/html: was possible - but perhaps I read it wrong? Or is this a Microsoft-specific thing to allow Outlook to render HTML within an appointment / meeting? Any insights would be appreciated. Thanks Tim Hare Hare Systems Support HareSystemsSupport@comcast.net ------=_NextPart_000_0131_01CF6947.50965E20 Content-Type: text/html; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

I am = trying to build an .ics file which is standards compliant, using  a = non-calendaring tool which will write into a directory on my (mainframe) = server.   Ideally the description would contain HTML as it = needs to contain some links. The target audience uses Outlook so I saved = an Outlook appointment as an iCalendar file to see if there were any = nuances I needed to worry about - and I discovered that the DESCRIPTION = contains only '\n' and there is an X-ALT-DESC  property containing = the HTML:

-------------------------------------------------------= -------------------------------------------------------------------------= ---------

X-ALT-DESC;FMTTYPE=3Dtext/html:<!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC = "-//W3C//DTD HTML 3.2//E

      = N">\n<HTML>\n<HEAD>\n<META = NAME=3D"Generator" CONTENT=3D"MS Exchange Server = ve

      rsion = 08.00.0681.000">\n<TITLE></TITLE>\n</HEAD>\n<= ;BODY>\n<!-- Converted f

      rom text/rtf format -->\n\n<P = DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-us"></SPAN><SPAN = LANG

      = =3D"en-us"></SPAN><SPAN = LANG=3D"en-us"><FONT = FACE=3D"Calibri"></FONT></SPAN><SPA

      N = LANG=3D"en-us"></SPAN><SPAN = LANG=3D"en-us"></SPAN><SPAN = LANG=3D"en-us">&nbsp\;

      = </SPAN></P>\n\n</BODY>\n</HTML>=

-------------------------------------------------------------------= -------------------

 

Reading RFC 5545 = I thought that DESCRIPTION;FMTTYPE=3Dtext/html:  was possible - but = perhaps I read it wrong? Or is this a Microsoft-specific thing to allow = Outlook to render HTML within an appointment / meeting?

 

Any insights = would be appreciated.

 

Thanks

Tim = Hare

Hare Systems = Support

HareSystemsSupport@comcast.net

 

 

 

 

 

------=_NextPart_000_0131_01CF6947.50965E20-- From nobody Tue May 6 14:28:27 2014 Return-Path: X-Original-To: calsify@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: calsify@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 97F481A0257 for ; Tue, 6 May 2014 14:28:25 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: 1.05 X-Spam-Level: * X-Spam-Status: No, score=1.05 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_50=0.8, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, FREEMAIL_REPLY=1, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, RP_MATCHES_RCVD=-0.651, SPF_PASS=-0.001] autolearn=no Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id qVB3Id0Qzdzt for ; Tue, 6 May 2014 14:28:24 -0700 (PDT) Received: from QMTA11.westchester.pa.mail.comcast.net (qmta11.westchester.pa.mail.comcast.net [IPv6:2001:558:fe14:44:76:96:59:211]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 25D541A047D for ; Tue, 6 May 2014 14:28:24 -0700 (PDT) Received: from omta18.westchester.pa.mail.comcast.net ([76.96.62.90]) by QMTA11.westchester.pa.mail.comcast.net with comcast id ykHZ1n0021wpRvQ5BlUL1A; Tue, 06 May 2014 21:28:20 +0000 Received: from THARE ([156.75.186.169]) by omta18.westchester.pa.mail.comcast.net with comcast id ylU81n00q3fj8VG3elUBAa; Tue, 06 May 2014 21:28:18 +0000 From: "Tim Hare" To: "'Tim Hare'" , References: <013001cf6968$d7a7fe20$86f7fa60$@net> In-Reply-To: <013001cf6968$d7a7fe20$86f7fa60$@net> Date: Tue, 6 May 2014 17:27:35 -0400 Message-ID: <013b01cf6972$051c6950$0f553bf0$@net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_013C_01CF6950.7E0AC950" X-Mailer: Microsoft Office Outlook 12.0 Thread-Index: Ac9paNNUnpd29dGVTlWtUFDUXNwhYQACP92Q Content-Language: en-us DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=comcast.net; s=q20140121; t=1399411700; bh=QVKbmZGvzCjOfAKq5GSNy1FsaYvR+/r68P2Lkx1D4rA=; h=Received:Received:From:To:Subject:Date:Message-ID:MIME-Version: Content-Type; b=sU/kx0d75Xy5FzwkfTM7PNe2B+gs9Sn0wjlW9zM1crWQIGp4zfsSm8uLEHdgssw/L OAa2MQt/5A9gvE8ohtL4o53nZkIaDVhrej+mQyctnnY1WIQkV7lwiYHB7jhlxfsjjk FyVRcQNwq2+cwqOjkjGfcRi2ss9DMUHauoOvvfLTt0EuHBKbSjgBYsR2L76gwG65lT krl6Jr16rLlNN13eELmA4WCJ6A6MgMV1hTOH1IFo17Je+fACRGMb4EQQGeLq6owKvt lq4B21wD0kO5jaevW5Do1FtLhcXSJH6gd1TjbQO9i0KgapuM2SNtuNKuj41eoculp/ NqOl6qC4Sq7tg== Archived-At: http://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/calsify/eZcN799afXQSSZ5Mp-Q4AauMhtM Subject: Re: [calsify] Question re: DESCRIPTION and FMTTYPE X-BeenThere: calsify@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 06 May 2014 21:28:25 -0000 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_013C_01CF6950.7E0AC950 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Hmmm it appears that there actually was no value in the DESCRIPTION field - but Outlook still creates all of this HTML. When I updated the description both properties were populated. From: calsify [mailto:calsify-bounces@ietf.org] On Behalf Of Tim Hare Sent: Tuesday, May 06, 2014 4:22 PM To: calsify@ietf.org Subject: [calsify] Question re: DESCRIPTION and FMTTYPE I am trying to build an .ics file which is standards compliant, using a non-calendaring tool which will write into a directory on my (mainframe) server. Ideally the description would contain HTML as it needs to contain some links. The target audience uses Outlook so I saved an Outlook appointment as an iCalendar file to see if there were any nuances I needed to worry about - and I discovered that the DESCRIPTION contains only '\n' and there is an X-ALT-DESC property containing the HTML: ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- ------------------------------------------------------------- X-ALT-DESC;FMTTYPE=text/html:\n\n\n\n\n\n\n\n\n

 \;

\n\n\n ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- ---------- Reading RFC 5545 I thought that DESCRIPTION;FMTTYPE=text/html: was possible - but perhaps I read it wrong? Or is this a Microsoft-specific thing to allow Outlook to render HTML within an appointment / meeting? Any insights would be appreciated. Thanks Tim Hare Hare Systems Support HareSystemsSupport@comcast.net ------=_NextPart_000_013C_01CF6950.7E0AC950 Content-Type: text/html; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

Hmmm it appears that there actually was no value = in the DESCRIPTION field - but Outlook still creates all of this = HTML.   When I updated the description both properties were = populated.

 

From:= = calsify [mailto:calsify-bounces@ietf.org] On Behalf Of Tim = Hare
Sent: Tuesday, May 06, 2014 4:22 PM
To: = calsify@ietf.org
Subject: [calsify] Question re: DESCRIPTION = and FMTTYPE

 

I am trying = to build an .ics file which is standards compliant, using  a = non-calendaring tool which will write into a directory on my (mainframe) = server.   Ideally the description would contain HTML as it = needs to contain some links. The target audience uses Outlook so I saved = an Outlook appointment as an iCalendar file to see if there were any = nuances I needed to worry about - and I discovered that the DESCRIPTION = contains only '\n' and there is an X-ALT-DESC  property containing = the HTML:

-------------------------------------------------------= -------------------------------------------------------------------------= ---------

X-ALT-DESC;FMTTYPE=3Dtext/html:<!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC = "-//W3C//DTD HTML 3.2//E

      = N">\n<HTML>\n<HEAD>\n<META = NAME=3D"Generator" CONTENT=3D"MS Exchange Server = ve

      rsion = 08.00.0681.000">\n<TITLE></TITLE>\n</HEAD>\n<= ;BODY>\n<!-- Converted f

      rom text/rtf format -->\n\n<P = DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-us"></SPAN><SPAN = LANG

      = =3D"en-us"></SPAN><SPAN = LANG=3D"en-us"><FONT = FACE=3D"Calibri"></FONT></SPAN><SPA

      N = LANG=3D"en-us"></SPAN><SPAN = LANG=3D"en-us"></SPAN><SPAN = LANG=3D"en-us">&nbsp\;

      = </SPAN></P>\n\n</BODY>\n</HTML>=

-------------------------------------------------------------------= -------------------

 

Reading RFC 5545 = I thought that DESCRIPTION;FMTTYPE=3Dtext/html:  was possible - but = perhaps I read it wrong? Or is this a Microsoft-specific thing to allow = Outlook to render HTML within an appointment / meeting?

 

Any insights = would be appreciated.

 

Thanks

Tim = Hare

Hare Systems = Support

HareSystemsSupport@comcast.net

 

 

 

 

 

------=_NextPart_000_013C_01CF6950.7E0AC950-- From nobody Tue May 6 14:45:32 2014 Return-Path: X-Original-To: calsify@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: calsify@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 86C561A049C for ; Tue, 6 May 2014 14:45:30 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: 1.05 X-Spam-Level: * X-Spam-Status: No, score=1.05 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_50=0.8, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, FREEMAIL_REPLY=1, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, RP_MATCHES_RCVD=-0.651, SPF_PASS=-0.001] autolearn=no Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id D9eO5w81jhVY for ; Tue, 6 May 2014 14:45:29 -0700 (PDT) Received: from qmta09.westchester.pa.mail.comcast.net (qmta09.westchester.pa.mail.comcast.net [IPv6:2001:558:fe14:43:76:96:62:96]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id EF2CA1A04A3 for ; Tue, 6 May 2014 14:45:28 -0700 (PDT) Received: from omta23.westchester.pa.mail.comcast.net ([76.96.62.74]) by qmta09.westchester.pa.mail.comcast.net with comcast id yk7r1n0021c6gX859llRux; Tue, 06 May 2014 21:45:25 +0000 Received: from THARE ([156.75.186.169]) by omta23.westchester.pa.mail.comcast.net with comcast id yljE1n00J3fj8VG3jljGoA; Tue, 06 May 2014 21:43:23 +0000 From: "Tim Hare" To: "'Tim Hare'" , References: <013001cf6968$d7a7fe20$86f7fa60$@net> <013b01cf6972$051c6950$0f553bf0$@net> In-Reply-To: <013b01cf6972$051c6950$0f553bf0$@net> Date: Tue, 6 May 2014 17:42:41 -0400 Message-ID: <014601cf6974$207f4c10$617de430$@net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0147_01CF6952.996DAC10" X-Mailer: Microsoft Office Outlook 12.0 Thread-Index: Ac9paNNUnpd29dGVTlWtUFDUXNwhYQACP92QAABfYDA= Content-Language: en-us DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=comcast.net; s=q20140121; t=1399412725; bh=7eKfpTfIFoWlG2dUu0OdPjGtFvGcVYOetvVKNNflJ6M=; h=Received:Received:From:To:Subject:Date:Message-ID:MIME-Version: Content-Type; b=RGxRxk+i+wrxZRj5z4rvV28GF7SoHl7CZCvO4yFQ53X4nZ30KyBcKCpPPVK5lvQSU PoaQSdRSE1MDXUZStZp6/yL9yFOlubtw+Qa0RtSQSxUyAzQPNHMWAJl1IfZKP4U6q7 H/6PEdwhxWXptn0DvbEcc3tuz07f/saQqbdlQ2PlRsY5+vXWVFM9rV0CHt2i7duKBa wkBCYAfWsKZVA9aYeaL5UKmnhEXU7VddHC6OYJjlPJmow9Y6rTjcbYUqKTOHr9DIfH 8+DoHs5Cjtj1ogc9eHvBHmZD812LUvPuaoJ8RuRtTV+k/Gq/bw0arQQB9V2w4mFHe+ ZfMWxIDRo247g== Archived-At: http://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/calsify/gF8e48SVBXi0t6zPshzslpI3yUQ Subject: Re: [calsify] Question re: DESCRIPTION and FMTTYPE X-BeenThere: calsify@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 06 May 2014 21:45:30 -0000 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0147_01CF6952.996DAC10 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit More info. In the DESCRIPTION the hyperlinks I inserted into just show as display text followed by - example: First Report \n While X-ALT-DESC: appears to have a full HTML 3.2 document and there is an anchor tag for each so it looks like First Report What is the correct way to put HTML into DESCRIPTION ? Do I have to use ALTREP and figure out how to put Content-Type into the file (note that I am not e-mailing it, I'm writing it in a directory for someone else to "find") Tim Hare Hare Systems Support HareSystemsSupport@comcast.net From: Tim Hare [mailto:TimHare@comcast.net] Sent: Tuesday, May 06, 2014 5:28 PM To: 'Tim Hare'; calsify@ietf.org Subject: RE: [calsify] Question re: DESCRIPTION and FMTTYPE Hmmm it appears that there actually was no value in the DESCRIPTION field - but Outlook still creates all of this HTML. When I updated the description both properties were populated. From: calsify [mailto:calsify-bounces@ietf.org] On Behalf Of Tim Hare Sent: Tuesday, May 06, 2014 4:22 PM To: calsify@ietf.org Subject: [calsify] Question re: DESCRIPTION and FMTTYPE I am trying to build an .ics file which is standards compliant, using a non-calendaring tool which will write into a directory on my (mainframe) server. Ideally the description would contain HTML as it needs to contain some links. The target audience uses Outlook so I saved an Outlook appointment as an iCalendar file to see if there were any nuances I needed to worry about - and I discovered that the DESCRIPTION contains only '\n' and there is an X-ALT-DESC property containing the HTML: ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- ------------------------------------------------------------- X-ALT-DESC;FMTTYPE=text/html:\n\n\n\n\n\n\n\n\n

 \;

\n\n\n ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- ---------- Reading RFC 5545 I thought that DESCRIPTION;FMTTYPE=text/html: was possible - but perhaps I read it wrong? Or is this a Microsoft-specific thing to allow Outlook to render HTML within an appointment / meeting? Any insights would be appreciated. Thanks Tim Hare Hare Systems Support HareSystemsSupport@comcast.net ------=_NextPart_000_0147_01CF6952.996DAC10 Content-Type: text/html; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

More info.  In the DESCRIPTION  the = hyperlinks I inserted into just show as display text followed by = <http://some_url_>  - example: 

 

First Report = <http://tlhost01t.dot.state.fl.us/dbatest/Report1_20140505.html> = \n

 

While X-ALT-DESC: = appears to have a full HTML 3.2 document and there is an anchor tag for = each so it looks like

 

<A href=3D" = http://tlhost01t.dot.state.fl.us/dbatest/Report1_20140505.html">F= irst Report</A>

 

What is the correct way = to put HTML into DESCRIPTION ?  Do I have to use ALTREP and figure = out how to put Content-Type into the file (note that I am not e-mailing = it, I'm writing it in a directory for someone else to = "find")

 

Tim = Hare

Hare Systems Support

HareSystemsSupport@comcast.net<= /p>

 

  =

From:= = Tim Hare [mailto:TimHare@comcast.net]
Sent: Tuesday, May 06, = 2014 5:28 PM
To: 'Tim Hare'; = calsify@ietf.org
Subject: RE: [calsify] Question re: = DESCRIPTION and FMTTYPE

 

Hmmm it appears that there actually was no value = in the DESCRIPTION field - but Outlook still creates all of this = HTML.   When I updated the description both properties were = populated.

 

From:= = calsify [mailto:calsify-bounces@ietf.org] On Behalf Of Tim = Hare
Sent: Tuesday, May 06, 2014 4:22 PM
To: = calsify@ietf.org
Subject: [calsify] Question re: DESCRIPTION = and FMTTYPE

 

I am trying = to build an .ics file which is standards compliant, using  a = non-calendaring tool which will write into a directory on my (mainframe) = server.   Ideally the description would contain HTML as it = needs to contain some links. The target audience uses Outlook so I saved = an Outlook appointment as an iCalendar file to see if there were any = nuances I needed to worry about - and I discovered that the DESCRIPTION = contains only '\n' and there is an X-ALT-DESC  property containing = the HTML:

-------------------------------------------------------= -------------------------------------------------------------------------= ---------

X-ALT-DESC;FMTTYPE=3Dtext/html:<!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC = "-//W3C//DTD HTML 3.2//E

      = N">\n<HTML>\n<HEAD>\n<META = NAME=3D"Generator" CONTENT=3D"MS Exchange Server = ve

      rsion = 08.00.0681.000">\n<TITLE></TITLE>\n</HEAD>\n<= ;BODY>\n<!-- Converted f

      rom text/rtf format -->\n\n<P = DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-us"></SPAN><SPAN = LANG

      = =3D"en-us"></SPAN><SPAN = LANG=3D"en-us"><FONT = FACE=3D"Calibri"></FONT></SPAN><SPA

      N = LANG=3D"en-us"></SPAN><SPAN = LANG=3D"en-us"></SPAN><SPAN = LANG=3D"en-us">&nbsp\;

      = </SPAN></P>\n\n</BODY>\n</HTML>=

-------------------------------------------------------------------= -------------------

 

Reading RFC 5545 = I thought that DESCRIPTION;FMTTYPE=3Dtext/html:  was possible - but = perhaps I read it wrong? Or is this a Microsoft-specific thing to allow = Outlook to render HTML within an appointment / meeting?

 

Any insights = would be appreciated.

 

Thanks

Tim = Hare

Hare Systems = Support

HareSystemsSupport@comcast.net

 

 

 

 

 

------=_NextPart_000_0147_01CF6952.996DAC10-- From nobody Wed May 7 01:25:05 2014 Return-Path: X-Original-To: calsify@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: calsify@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id DFF051A068B for ; Wed, 7 May 2014 01:25:04 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: 0.448 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=0.448 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_50=0.8, GB_I_INVITATION=-2, MANGLED_FROM=2.3, RP_MATCHES_RCVD=-0.651, SPF_HELO_PASS=-0.001] autolearn=ham Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id m1UUs_kAvxwe for ; Wed, 7 May 2014 01:25:03 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mailhub.opengroupware.org (mailhub.opengroupware.org [213.211.192.144]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6B2771A068A for ; Wed, 7 May 2014 01:25:02 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (localhost.localdomain [127.0.0.1]) by mailhub.opengroupware.org (OPENGROUPWARE.ORG MAILHUB) with ESMTP id 6C3E8228291; Wed, 7 May 2014 10:24:57 +0200 (CEST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at opengroupware.org Received: from mailhub.opengroupware.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (mailhub.opengroupware.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id pbpEvWPsPy1G; Wed, 7 May 2014 10:24:55 +0200 (CEST) Received: from [192.168.88.127] (tmo-096-29.customers.d1-online.com [80.187.96.29]) (using TLSv1 with cipher AES128-SHA (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by mailhub.opengroupware.org (OPENGROUPWARE.ORG MAILHUB) with ESMTPSA id 39740228121; Wed, 7 May 2014 10:24:55 +0200 (CEST) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=windows-1252 Mime-Version: 1.0 (Mac OS X Mail 7.2 \(1874\)) From: Helge Hess In-Reply-To: <013001cf6968$d7a7fe20$86f7fa60$@net> Date: Wed, 7 May 2014 10:24:53 +0200 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Message-Id: References: <013001cf6968$d7a7fe20$86f7fa60$@net> To: Tim Hare X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.1874) Archived-At: http://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/calsify/g--TniUGrYUtWE6IpW5lLnq5SAw Cc: calsify@ietf.org Subject: Re: [calsify] Question re: DESCRIPTION and FMTTYPE X-BeenThere: calsify@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 07 May 2014 08:25:05 -0000 Hi Tim, first: I would be surprised if Outlook does RFC 5545 for iCalendar or = will any time soon, it doesn=92t even do vCard 3.0 ... > Reading RFC 5545 I thought that DESCRIPTION;FMTTYPE=3Dtext/html: was = possible interesting question - this is new in RFC 5545. Adding other-param and = thereby iana-param to DESCRIPTION now seems to allow FMTTYPE on = DESCRIPTION. https://tools.ietf.org/html/rfc5545#section-3.8.1.5 Hence the X-ALT-DESC workaround of Outlook to be able to directly embed = HTML descriptions in RFC 2445 =85 RFC 2445 didn=92t have FMTTYPE on = DESCRIPTION (https://tools.ietf.org/html/rfc2445#section-4.8.1.5). I highly doubt that Outlook (or any other client) is going to resolve = http or file URIs in the ALTREP parameter. I guess ALTREP was a way for = Outlook and Notes to exchange rich comments as part of invitations sent = via multipart MIME emails (with ALTREP pointing to CID URIs as described = in the RFC). You said the 'target audience uses Outlook=92: How do you plan to = deliver the iCalendar to the audience? By email, a subscribed calendars, = iCloud? If it=92s by email, crafting a multipart email might work for = you. As a small side note, Outlook itself stores up to three versions of the = textfield internally (1) and keeps them in sync. (Depending on the = store) RTF is the primary one, HTML an option to this, and it usually = also stores a plaintext rendering alongside the rich formats. Which is = why I=92m surprised it doesn=92t render the DESCRIPTION for you. = Probably a bug in the Outlook exporter code. = (http://msdn.microsoft.com/en-us/library/office/cc839574(v=3Doffice.15).as= px is a good starting point if you are interested in this). Summary: I think you are right, this is the proper RFC 5545 way to do = what you want to do: DESCRIPTION:Hello World DESCRIPTION;FMTTYPE=3Dtext/html:

Hello World

But it is not yet going to produce the desired result in any of the = major clients. hh (1) Right now few (none?) CalDAV clients support HTML descriptions. (2) For any message type but notes - funny enough those can do RTF on = Macs but only plaintext in Outlook, completely the reverse to = contacts/calendars :-) On May 6, 2014, at 10:21 PM, Tim Hare wrote: > I am trying to build an .ics file which is standards compliant, using = a non-calendaring tool which will write into a directory on my = (mainframe) server. Ideally the description would contain HTML as it = needs to contain some links. The target audience uses Outlook so I saved = an Outlook appointment as an iCalendar file to see if there were any = nuances I needed to worry about - and I discovered that the DESCRIPTION = contains only '\n' and there is an X-ALT-DESC property containing the = HTML: > = --------------------------------------------------------------------------= --------------------------------------------------------------- > X-ALT-DESC;FMTTYPE=3Dtext/html: N">\n\n\n rsion 08.00.0681.000">\n\n\n\n\n\n

=3D"en-us"> N LANG=3D"en-us"> \; >

\n\n\n > = --------------------------------------------------------------------------= ------------ > =20 > Reading RFC 5545 I thought that DESCRIPTION;FMTTYPE=3Dtext/html: was = possible - but perhaps I read it wrong? Or is this a Microsoft-specific = thing to allow Outlook to render HTML within an appointment / meeting? > =20 > Any insights would be appreciated. > =20 > Thanks > Tim Hare > Hare Systems Support > HareSystemsSupport@comcast.net > =20 > =20 > =20 > =20 > =20 > _______________________________________________ > calsify mailing list > calsify@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/calsify From nobody Wed May 7 05:38:28 2014 Return-Path: X-Original-To: calsify@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: calsify@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7BCCC1A02A9 for ; Wed, 7 May 2014 05:38:26 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.351 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.351 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, GB_I_INVITATION=-2, MANGLED_FROM=2.3, RP_MATCHES_RCVD=-0.651, SPF_PASS=-0.001] autolearn=ham Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 7DXLwM1p8u5p for ; Wed, 7 May 2014 05:38:24 -0700 (PDT) Received: from qmta13.westchester.pa.mail.comcast.net (qmta13.westchester.pa.mail.comcast.net [IPv6:2001:558:fe14:44:76:96:59:243]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6CD8D1A0227 for ; Wed, 7 May 2014 05:38:24 -0700 (PDT) Received: from omta20.westchester.pa.mail.comcast.net ([76.96.62.71]) by qmta13.westchester.pa.mail.comcast.net with comcast id yyri1n0011YDfWL5D0eLLq; Wed, 07 May 2014 12:38:20 +0000 Received: from THARE ([68.84.18.160]) by omta20.westchester.pa.mail.comcast.net with comcast id z0eK1n00T3TD7j03g0eKtT; Wed, 07 May 2014 12:38:20 +0000 From: "Tim Hare" To: "'Helge Hess'" References: <013001cf6968$d7a7fe20$86f7fa60$@net> In-Reply-To: Date: Wed, 7 May 2014 08:37:43 -0400 Message-ID: <001a01cf69f1$248b56a0$6da203e0$@net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: Microsoft Office Outlook 12.0 Thread-Index: Ac9pzddl0NugzZguRDuB9M7CpDubnQAIajlQ Content-Language: en-us DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=comcast.net; s=q20140121; t=1399466300; bh=OlpnIj12DVeZ+ERHJ9+V4r1FdnBBkDt6oOJbF4MUl5U=; h=Received:Received:From:To:Subject:Date:Message-ID:MIME-Version: Content-Type; b=oSYLMFGXf7EIAB3lrdVBNAVr329hnhzK6XE0T7PVEGBb9s4n0Ts+YUr9Isav7DvYm nvzodh36W3e1mFpwsUzw5j/+9oZGpFADzid7fSRa7hlEmVLiFkMwf+mu1/J4Ut+fzm 2kSe1k8ap1HIvMsxDUkBezJKJqXoKnlm0Kszm0lw3kezAuvtGLrzkW1T6xeVhdyfj8 YIX/mO/TPIJsEiqjL/jp+mhVZmb6Qp8yC3FXubUdvhgVSa3+Aah72ArS/LhObUXnVx bqBJX1kmofLNsb7qYAbywrTlBMSY4zXGhelz50GEFwc7kDG2kLOqfzaaWMhMlGpP2D 3C/S/kapM6u2g== Archived-At: http://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/calsify/zgY3HfxTm02GnBW-cLg76DLAb18 Cc: calsify@ietf.org Subject: Re: [calsify] Question re: DESCRIPTION and FMTTYPE X-BeenThere: calsify@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 07 May 2014 12:38:26 -0000 I will read your MSDN reference, thanks for the tip. I am "delivering" this calendar by writing the .ics file . The file will exist on the mainframe, which runs an internal web server, making it accessible to those who want it (similar to a ball team's published schedule). There's no user interaction, really - I am trying to use the .ics file to organize references to reports which are produced daily, taking advantage of the client's UI to provide a calendar interface that the users are already familiar with. Tim -----Original Message----- From: Helge Hess [mailto:helge.hess@opengroupware.org] Sent: Wednesday, May 07, 2014 4:25 AM To: Tim Hare Cc: calsify@ietf.org Subject: Re: [calsify] Question re: DESCRIPTION and FMTTYPE Hi Tim, first: I would be surprised if Outlook does RFC 5545 for iCalendar or will any time soon, it doesn't even do vCard 3.0 ... > Reading RFC 5545 I thought that DESCRIPTION;FMTTYPE=text/html: was possible interesting question - this is new in RFC 5545. Adding other-param and thereby iana-param to DESCRIPTION now seems to allow FMTTYPE on DESCRIPTION. https://tools.ietf.org/html/rfc5545#section-3.8.1.5 Hence the X-ALT-DESC workaround of Outlook to be able to directly embed HTML descriptions in RFC 2445 . RFC 2445 didn't have FMTTYPE on DESCRIPTION (https://tools.ietf.org/html/rfc2445#section-4.8.1.5). I highly doubt that Outlook (or any other client) is going to resolve http or file URIs in the ALTREP parameter. I guess ALTREP was a way for Outlook and Notes to exchange rich comments as part of invitations sent via multipart MIME emails (with ALTREP pointing to CID URIs as described in the RFC). You said the 'target audience uses Outlook': How do you plan to deliver the iCalendar to the audience? By email, a subscribed calendars, iCloud? If it's by email, crafting a multipart email might work for you. As a small side note, Outlook itself stores up to three versions of the textfield internally (1) and keeps them in sync. (Depending on the store) RTF is the primary one, HTML an option to this, and it usually also stores a plaintext rendering alongside the rich formats. Which is why I'm surprised it doesn't render the DESCRIPTION for you. Probably a bug in the Outlook exporter code. (http://msdn.microsoft.com/en-us/library/office/cc839574(v=office.15).aspx is a good starting point if you are interested in this). Summary: I think you are right, this is the proper RFC 5545 way to do what you want to do: DESCRIPTION:Hello World DESCRIPTION;FMTTYPE=text/html:

Hello World

But it is not yet going to produce the desired result in any of the major clients. hh (1) Right now few (none?) CalDAV clients support HTML descriptions. (2) For any message type but notes - funny enough those can do RTF on Macs but only plaintext in Outlook, completely the reverse to contacts/calendars :-) On May 6, 2014, at 10:21 PM, Tim Hare wrote: > I am trying to build an .ics file which is standards compliant, using a non-calendaring tool which will write into a directory on my (mainframe) server. Ideally the description would contain HTML as it needs to contain some links. The target audience uses Outlook so I saved an Outlook appointment as an iCalendar file to see if there were any nuances I needed to worry about - and I discovered that the DESCRIPTION contains only '\n' and there is an X-ALT-DESC property containing the HTML: > ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- ------------------------------------------------------------- > X-ALT-DESC;FMTTYPE=text/html: N">\n\n\n\n\n\n\n\n\n

="en-us"> N LANG="en-us"> \; >

\n\n\n > ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- ---------- > > Reading RFC 5545 I thought that DESCRIPTION;FMTTYPE=text/html: was possible - but perhaps I read it wrong? Or is this a Microsoft-specific thing to allow Outlook to render HTML within an appointment / meeting? > > Any insights would be appreciated. > > Thanks > Tim Hare > Hare Systems Support > HareSystemsSupport@comcast.net > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > calsify mailing list > calsify@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/calsify From nobody Wed May 7 07:18:36 2014 Return-Path: X-Original-To: calsify@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: calsify@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id E7B041A0305 for ; Wed, 7 May 2014 07:18:35 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.551 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.551 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, RP_MATCHES_RCVD=-0.651] autolearn=ham Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id c__LOtM5W8yL for ; Wed, 7 May 2014 07:18:33 -0700 (PDT) Received: from daboo.name (daboo.name [173.13.55.49]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 890001A02C5 for ; Wed, 7 May 2014 07:18:33 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by daboo.name (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3F191657A958; Wed, 7 May 2014 10:18:29 -0400 (EDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at example.com Received: from daboo.name ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (daboo.name [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 3y9NupE4_R7O; Wed, 7 May 2014 10:18:28 -0400 (EDT) Received: from caldav.corp.apple.com (unknown [17.45.162.46]) by daboo.name (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 7B9FF657A945; Wed, 7 May 2014 10:18:27 -0400 (EDT) Date: Wed, 07 May 2014 10:18:23 -0400 From: Cyrus Daboo To: Helge Hess , Tim Hare Message-ID: <3DC3DEE3471CD231C4731BBD@caldav.corp.apple.com> In-Reply-To: References: <013001cf6968$d7a7fe20$86f7fa60$@net> X-Mailer: Mulberry/4.1.0b1 (Mac OS X) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline; size=640 Archived-At: http://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/calsify/qSja6gqamhv6G5CUZrezVG3GX80 Cc: calsify@ietf.org Subject: Re: [calsify] Question re: DESCRIPTION and FMTTYPE X-BeenThere: calsify@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 07 May 2014 14:18:36 -0000 Hi Helge, --On May 7, 2014 at 10:24:53 AM +0200 Helge Hess wrote: > (1) Right now few (none?) CalDAV clients support HTML descriptions. > (2) For any message type but notes - funny enough those can do RTF on > Macs but only plaintext in Outlook, completely the reverse to > contacts/calendars :-) > CalConnect has been working on trying to come up with a standards based approach to this: . The proposed STYLED-DESCRIPTION property covers the case of rich text for the description. Comments on that spec are welcome... -- Cyrus Daboo From nobody Wed May 7 07:53:30 2014 Return-Path: X-Original-To: calsify@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: calsify@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id D88AC1A0331 for ; Wed, 7 May 2014 07:53:27 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.552 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.552 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, RP_MATCHES_RCVD=-0.651, SPF_HELO_PASS=-0.001] autolearn=ham Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 0opL7o1sEyHQ for ; Wed, 7 May 2014 07:53:25 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mailhub.opengroupware.org (mailhub.opengroupware.org [213.211.192.144]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 735E51A0329 for ; Wed, 7 May 2014 07:53:25 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (localhost.localdomain [127.0.0.1]) by mailhub.opengroupware.org (OPENGROUPWARE.ORG MAILHUB) with ESMTP id 38F9A228291 for ; Wed, 7 May 2014 16:53:21 +0200 (CEST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at opengroupware.org Received: from mailhub.opengroupware.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (mailhub.opengroupware.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id Ndw6hmoKeOZK for ; Wed, 7 May 2014 16:53:18 +0200 (CEST) Received: from [192.168.3.113] (gw-asg.core.mdlink.net [213.211.195.110]) (using TLSv1 with cipher AES128-SHA (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by mailhub.opengroupware.org (OPENGROUPWARE.ORG MAILHUB) with ESMTPSA id DE5C9228121 for ; Wed, 7 May 2014 16:53:17 +0200 (CEST) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Mime-Version: 1.0 (Mac OS X Mail 7.2 \(1874\)) From: Helge Hess In-Reply-To: <3DC3DEE3471CD231C4731BBD@caldav.corp.apple.com> Date: Wed, 7 May 2014 16:53:16 +0200 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Message-Id: References: <013001cf6968$d7a7fe20$86f7fa60$@net> <3DC3DEE3471CD231C4731BBD@caldav.corp.apple.com> To: calsify@ietf.org X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.1874) Archived-At: http://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/calsify/Jp9oVUujRs-fwvN0t-Z2mwkrB6E Subject: Re: [calsify] Question re: DESCRIPTION and FMTTYPE X-BeenThere: calsify@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 07 May 2014 14:53:28 -0000 On May 7, 2014, at 4:18 PM, Cyrus Daboo wrote: > --On May 7, 2014 at 10:24:53 AM +0200 Helge Hess = wrote: >> (1) Right now few (none?) CalDAV clients support HTML descriptions. >> (2) For any message type but notes - funny enough those can do RTF on >> Macs but only plaintext in Outlook, completely the reverse to >> contacts/calendars :-) >=20 > CalConnect has been working on trying to come up with a standards = based approach to this: = . >=20 > The proposed STYLED-DESCRIPTION property covers the case of rich text = for the description. Comments on that spec are welcome... Right, I'll come back to you on this in the CalConnect list. I missed before that RFC 5545 now allows for FMTTYPE on DESCRIPTION (an = unfortunate mistake?). Maybe for this forum, should = draft-douglass-calendar-extension-04 revert that (add a SHOULD or MUST = NOT?) and have a small section explaining on why DESCRIPTION+FMTTYPE = should not be used (backwards compat, representation-syncing, etc). hh From nobody Wed May 28 10:33:55 2014 Return-Path: X-Original-To: calsify@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: calsify@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6A8E21A042D for ; Wed, 28 May 2014 10:33:53 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -0.651 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-0.651 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_40=-0.001, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, RP_MATCHES_RCVD=-0.651] autolearn=ham Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 0pR-O2re5uF9 for ; Wed, 28 May 2014 10:33:51 -0700 (PDT) Received: from smtp.andrew.cmu.edu (SMTP.ANDREW.CMU.EDU [128.2.105.202]) (using TLSv1 with cipher DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 9C33E1A0417 for ; Wed, 28 May 2014 10:33:51 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost.localdomain (cpe-76-180-151-43.buffalo.res.rr.com [76.180.151.43]) (user=murch mech=PLAIN (0 bits)) by smtp.andrew.cmu.edu (8.14.7/8.14.8) with ESMTP id s4SHXkTG015323 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=NOT); Wed, 28 May 2014 13:33:46 -0400 Message-ID: <53861DFA.2000702@andrew.cmu.edu> Date: Wed, 28 May 2014 13:33:46 -0400 From: Ken Murchison Organization: Carnegie Mellon University User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; Linux x86_64; rv:24.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/24.2.0 MIME-Version: 1.0 To: calscale-adhoc-l@lists.calconnect.org, calsify@ietf.org Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="------------070501070509040603010705" X-PMX-Version: 6.0.3.2322014, Antispam-Engine: 2.7.2.2107409, Antispam-Data: 2014.5.28.172718 X-SMTP-Spam-Clean: 28% ( SXL_IP_DYNAMIC 3, HTML_FONT_INVISIBLE 0.1, HTML_NO_HTTP 0.1, BODYTEXTH_SIZE_10000_LESS 0, BODYTEXTP_SIZE_3000_LESS 0, BODY_SIZE_2000_2999 0, BODY_SIZE_5000_LESS 0, BODY_SIZE_7000_LESS 0, DATE_TZ_NA 0, FROM_EDU_TLD 0, NO_URI_FOUND 0, RDNS_GENERIC_POOLED 0, RDNS_POOLED 0, RDNS_RESIDENTIAL 0, RDNS_SUSP 0, RDNS_SUSP_GENERIC 0, RDNS_SUSP_SPECIFIC 0, __BAT_BOUNDARY 0, __CT 0, __CTYPE_HAS_BOUNDARY 0, __CTYPE_MULTIPART 0, __CTYPE_MULTIPART_ALT 0, __FORWARDED_MSG 0, __HAS_FROM 0, __HAS_HTML 0, __HAS_MSGID 0, __MIME_HTML 0, __MIME_VERSION 0, __MOZILLA_MSGID 0, __MOZILLA_USER_AGENT 0, __RDNS_POOLED_1 0, __SANE_MSGID 0, __TAG_EXISTS_HTML 0, __TO_MALFORMED_2 0, __TO_NO_NAME 0, __USER_AGENT 0) X-SMTP-Spam-Score: 28% X-Scanned-By: MIMEDefang 2.74 on 128.2.105.202 Archived-At: http://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/calsify/h1HegTTvLPxgmQIzn-0pQG8o2ew Subject: [calsify] Hebrew month numbering (again) X-BeenThere: calsify@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 28 May 2014 17:33:53 -0000 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --------------070501070509040603010705 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Marten's RSCALE implementation questions triggered something that I noticed about Hebrew month numbering but forgot to mention earlier. Most of the resources that I found online about Hebrew/Jewish calendars has month 1 = Nisan and month 12 = Adar. However ICU does the following, which is what the example in the draft assumes: > Month numbering is interesting. Traditionally, the month of Nisan was > numbered 1, and Adar was 12 (thus Adar I and II were 12 and 13). > However, this puts the month of Tishri, which begins with the new year > (Rosh HaShanah), as month 7. A more modern numbering has Tishri as > month 1 (to coincide with the new year) which leads to different > schemes for numbering Adar and the subsequent months (see discussion > below on what ICU does). Is this another ICU-ism that we should remove from the draft? Or is the "modern" numbering what is the accepted standard in the "real" world? -- Kenneth Murchison Principal Systems Software Engineer Carnegie Mellon University --------------070501070509040603010705 Content-Type: text/html; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Marten's RSCALE implementation questions triggered something that I noticed about Hebrew month numbering but forgot to mention earlier.  Most of the resources that I found online about Hebrew/Jewish calendars has month 1 = Nisan and month 12 = Adar.  However ICU does the following, which is what the example in the draft assumes:

Month numbering is interesting. Traditionally, the month of Nisan was numbered 1, and Adar was 12 (thus Adar I and II were 12 and 13). However, this puts the month of Tishri, which begins with the new year (Rosh HaShanah), as month 7. A more modern numbering has Tishri as month 1 (to coincide with the new year) which leads to different schemes for numbering Adar and the subsequent months (see discussion below on what ICU does).

Is this another ICU-ism that we should remove from the draft?  Or is the "modern" numbering what is the accepted standard in the "real" world?
-- 
Kenneth Murchison
Principal Systems Software Engineer
Carnegie Mellon University
--------------070501070509040603010705-- From nobody Thu May 29 07:13:55 2014 Return-Path: X-Original-To: calsify@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: calsify@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 32AC31A0997 for ; Thu, 29 May 2014 07:13:53 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.029 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.029 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, FM_FORGED_GMAIL=0.622, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, RP_MATCHES_RCVD=-0.651, SPF_PASS=-0.001] autolearn=ham Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id qoZ5pntSTkpt for ; Thu, 29 May 2014 07:13:50 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail-qg0-x22d.google.com (mail-qg0-x22d.google.com [IPv6:2607:f8b0:400d:c04::22d]) (using TLSv1 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-RC4-SHA (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id A9B891A097D for ; Thu, 29 May 2014 07:13:50 -0700 (PDT) Received: by mail-qg0-f45.google.com with SMTP id z60so1090888qgd.18 for ; Thu, 29 May 2014 07:13:46 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=google.com; s=20120113; h=mime-version:references:from:date:message-id:subject:to :content-type; bh=w4IA4pmrT9mINt7eAPXda0XtgeC69EalkIrhlvCwg+k=; b=N5Kx9vU8uzhGFwxElmS32bEdYILMTeyX37ZxphZZHwlU9SViSD2hUzY0k4FX8WyrcQ vF0gbWRYqj3Z5hVxJOqZR0OgxghE+E5Rb2sf4zvueR36SAunGIyKM16bro0XaLHvP40b UqJzymkk4m33sX1NbgpYgzoY+iGwuJ2aQ1a9P2QGZAgbSGG28rDUuzHABHl8xS/Anh4w TrtaRyW/3j+WRHa0WuayheFduojLIBlywFo7gf6R+JSJWug5wuFhdVN5hInkP17PYm3z MQHVl2JHcZwVkSRyIf/z9CM0EFpXSnUZ7DgXCns591QbwggmGQRN0OQVYpt+OSOoU9z0 kxzQ== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20130820; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:references:from:date:message-id :subject:to:content-type; bh=w4IA4pmrT9mINt7eAPXda0XtgeC69EalkIrhlvCwg+k=; b=SK4zu6mxhkEmfxD41j4tf+rExexA6Q65bXHgQU3upkfsAxOuO90umhKMQ4inac+K57 OpjCFgI8tcRvqOAwHD2gjmopH3M1LIdzAlgOzVZ3rZSvzaZo5xLknRpsuYkUeO+I7/nD wzfy1l38WNqCcSiwilmzqa77ZjadChNHbItI4wl7VCBdLMDaMBqGFAzCZtTgUtgQrSTJ 6eQyER2EXN9MyKvnj/Lg3VTs4qb6hlBP288JTXvzECQ1UmdT6xHcEBEzYgWfu+VyWb1W bUQLp184GIgq5Tyiy5/bGi9zb4TchM3KFCiuT1AgopP+imCfhEFcqwaoGBSG6KFB4ksm 6lAg== X-Gm-Message-State: ALoCoQnYV7c+cAo4qjJI5M8pHshegMomswt9b5PAnI1nxDpFebLfEdN7tyur/9dJ5/Eo2G26h+D6 X-Received: by 10.140.46.53 with SMTP id j50mr9621986qga.27.1401372826246; Thu, 29 May 2014 07:13:46 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 References: <53861DFA.2000702@andrew.cmu.edu> From: Gregory Yakushev Date: Thu, 29 May 2014 14:13:45 +0000 Message-ID: To: Ken Murchison , calscale-adhoc-l@lists.calconnect.org, calsify@ietf.org Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary=001a113a7e5c81d47204fa8a8963 Archived-At: http://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/calsify/Bx4bjze5tgU6SFa9svykeoyu0tM Subject: [calsify] Hebrew month numbering (again) X-BeenThere: calsify@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 29 May 2014 14:13:53 -0000 --001a113a7e5c81d47204fa8a8963 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 I am not sure RRULEs will handle a situation where year starts at arbitrary month. This may present some quirky logic in combination with BYYEARDAY and YEARLY rules. On Wed May 28 2014 at 7:33:53 PM, Ken Murchison wrote: > Marten's RSCALE implementation questions triggered something that I > noticed about Hebrew month numbering but forgot to mention earlier. Most > of the resources that I found online about Hebrew/Jewish calendars has > month 1 = Nisan and month 12 = Adar. However ICU does the following, which > is what the example in the draft assumes: > > Month numbering is interesting. Traditionally, the month of Nisan was > numbered 1, and Adar was 12 (thus Adar I and II were 12 and 13). However, > this puts the month of Tishri, which begins with the new year (Rosh > HaShanah), as month 7. A more modern numbering has Tishri as month 1 (to > coincide with the new year) which leads to different schemes for numbering > Adar and the subsequent months (see discussion below on what ICU does). > > > Is this another ICU-ism that we should remove from the draft? Or is the > "modern" numbering what is the accepted standard in the "real" world? > > -- > Kenneth Murchison > Principal Systems Software Engineer > Carnegie Mellon University > > _______________________________________________ > calsify mailing list > calsify@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/calsify > --001a113a7e5c81d47204fa8a8963 Content-Type: text/html; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable I am not sure RRULEs will handle a situation where year starts at arbitrary= month. This may present some quirky logic in combination with BYYEARDAY an= d YEARLY rules.

On Wed May 28 2014 at 7:33:53 PM, Ken Murchison= <murch@andrew.cmu.edu> w= rote:
=20 =20 =20
Marten's RSCALE implementation questions triggered something that I noticed about Hebrew month numbering but forgot to mention earlier.=C2= =A0 Most of the resources that I found online about Hebrew/Jewish calendars has month 1 =3D Nisan and month 12 =3D Adar.=C2=A0 However IC= U does the following, which is what the example in the draft assumes:

Month numbering is interesting. Traditionally, the month of Nisan was numbered 1, and Adar was 12 (thus Adar I and II were 12 and 13). However, this puts the month of Tishri, which begins with the new year (Rosh HaShanah), as month 7. A more modern numbering has Tishri as month 1 (to coincide with the new year) which leads to different schemes for numbering Adar and the subsequent months (see discussion below on what ICU does).

Is this another ICU-ism that we should remove from the draft?=C2=A0 Or = is the "modern" numbering what is the accepted standard in the &= quot;real" world?
--=20
Kenneth Murchison
Principal Systems Software Engineer
Carnegie Mellon University
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calsify mailing list
calsify@ietf.org<= br> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/calsify
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