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From: Phillip Hallam-baker <hallam@gmail.com>
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Cc: "clouds@ietf.org" <clouds@ietf.org>, "ietf@ietf.org" <ietf@ietf.org>, David Chadwick <d.w.chadwick@kent.ac.uk>
Subject: Re: [clouds] Announcing Clouds bar BoF during IETF-77 (March, 2010, Anaheim, CA)
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Grid is a specific term that describes a community of use as well as a  
technology

The cloud is a marketting term that means 'magic happens here' and I  
mean that without insulting intent it is a foggy sort of concept,  
litterally,and there I mean litterally litterally


Grid is a style of loosely coupled mimd computing. A grid worth the  
name can distribute a task across hundreds of nodes it is general  
purpose parallel processing

Cloud computing is outsourced services. That could be general purpose  
as in amazon elastic compute cloud or could be very speciffic like  
gmail or twitted


Sent from my iPhone

On Feb 22, 2010, at 1:08 PM, Dave CROCKER <dhc2@dcrocker.net> wrote:

>
>
> On 2/22/2010 12:59 PM, Melinda Shore wrote:
>> On Feb 22, 2010, at 11:52 AM, Brian E Carpenter wrote:
>>> My thought exactly. The distinction between cloud computing and  
>>> open grid
>>> computing is very small (or possibly zero)
>>
>> With all due respect, Brian, it's really not. With cloud
>> computing you're typically dealing with multitenanting issues
>> and a bunch of other layer 8-9 stuff that tends (of necessity)
>> to be reflected down the stack, and I think I can see an
>> argument for cloud computing belonging in the RAI space,
>> or at least having substantial overlap.
>
>
> Having recently gone through the exercise of trying to understand  
> what these different terms actually meant, I discovered that the  
> underlying problem is that you are both right, as are a variety of  
> other people who have other views...
>
> As already noted, the term 'cloud' is now used in many different  
> ways, including as a synonym for 'network' and for 'Internet', even  
> amongst technical folk. (Really.)
>
> There are some people who have very specific and nuanced technical  
> definitions, including distinguishing cloud from grid.  But no set  
> of definitions seems to have a broad base of support.
>
> For defining 'cloud', one group I'm participating in decided it was  
> happy with the NIST language:
>
>   <http://csrc.nist.gov/groups/SNS/cloud-computing/cloud-def-v15.doc>
>
> d/
>
> -- 
>
>  Dave Crocker
>  Brandenburg InternetWorking
>  bbiw.net
> _______________________________________________
> Ietf mailing list
> Ietf@ietf.org
> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ietf

From vumip1@gmail.com  Thu Mar  4 20:53:55 2010
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From: Bhumip Khasnabish <vumip1@gmail.com>
To: clouds@ietf.org
Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary=0016e6d64b184bdd40048106808c
Subject: [clouds] Fwd: Doodle: Link for poll "IETF-77-Clouds-barBoF" mtg time slot(s)
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--0016e6d64b184bdd40048106808c
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Hello,

We are trying to schedule a time slot for Clouds bar BoF during IETF-77 in
March 2010.

With permission/approval from one of the APP AD, we can use any one (or
more) of the following slots.

11:30-13:00 on WEDNESDAY, March 24, 2010

19:40-21:30 on WEDNESDAY, March 24, 2010

11:30-13:00 on THURSDAY, March 25, 2010

13:00-15:00 on THURSDAY, March 25, 2010
I have initiated a poll "IETF-77-Clouds-barBoF" at Doodle. The link to the
poll is:

http://www.doodle.com/q9fexcsfyi9tuvfw

I am sharingh this link with you so that you can cast your vote.

Best Regards.

Bhumip


Bhumip Khasnabish (Mobile:+001-781-752-8003, bhumip@acm.org)

=A9 2010 Bhumip Khasnabish. Do not view, print, forward, and save the conte=
nt
of this email if you are not the intended recipient of the communiqu=E9.

--0016e6d64b184bdd40048106808c
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<div>Hello,</div>
<div>=A0</div>
<div>We are trying to schedule a time slot for Clouds bar BoF during IETF-7=
7 in March 2010.=A0<br><span lang=3D"EN">
<p>With permission/approval from one of the APP AD, we can use any one (or =
more) of the following slots.</p>
<p>11:30-13:00 <font size=3D"2" face=3D"Courier New"><font size=3D"2" face=
=3D"Courier New">on WEDNESDAY, March 24, 2010 </font></font></p>
<p>19:40-21:30 on WEDNESDAY, March 24, 2010 </p>
<p>11:30-13:00 <font size=3D"2" face=3D"Courier New"><font size=3D"2" face=
=3D"Courier New">on THURSDAY, March 25, 2010</font></font></p>
<p>13:00-15:00 on THURSDAY, March 25, 2010</p></span>I have initiated a pol=
l &quot;IETF-77-Clouds-barBoF&quot; at Doodle. The link to the poll is:<br>=
<br><a href=3D"http://www.doodle.com/q9fexcsfyi9tuvfw" target=3D"_blank">ht=
tp://www.doodle.com/q9fexcsfyi9tuvfw</a><br>
<br>I am sharingh this link with you so that you can cast your vote.=A0=A0<=
br>
<p>Best Regards.<br></p>
<p>Bhumip</p>
<p><br>Bhumip Khasnabish (Mobile:+001-781-752-8003, <a href=3D"mailto:bhumi=
p@acm.org" target=3D"_blank">bhumip@acm.org</a>)<br><br>=A9 2010 Bhumip Kha=
snabish. Do not view, print, forward, and save the content of this email if=
 you are not the intended recipient of the communiqu=E9.<br>
</p></div>

--0016e6d64b184bdd40048106808c--

From vumip1@gmail.com  Mon Mar  8 11:41:25 2010
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From: Bhumip Khasnabish <vumip1@gmail.com>
To: clouds@ietf.org
Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary=0016e6da7db80741ee04814f4088
Subject: [clouds] Request to respond ASAP to Clouds bar BoF (IETF-77 in March 2010) time slot survey
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--0016e6da7db80741ee04814f4088
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Hello,

As you know, we are trying to schedule a time slot for Clouds bar BoF during
IETF-77 in March 2010.
With permission/approval from one of the APP AD, we can use any one (or
more) of the following slots.

11:30-13:00 on WEDNESDAY, March 24, 2010
19:40-21:30 on WEDNESDAY, March 24, 2010
11:30-13:00 on THURSDAY, March 25, 2010
13:00-15:00 on THURSDAY, March 25, 2010
I have initiated a poll "IETF-77-Clouds-barBoF" at Doodle. The link to the
poll is:

http://www.doodle.com/q9fexcsfyi9tuvfw

I am sharing this link with you so that you can cast your vote ASAP (by
Friday, March 12, 2010, please).

Best Regards.

Bhumip

--0016e6da7db80741ee04814f4088
Content-Type: text/html; charset=ISO-8859-1
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<div>Hello,<br>=A0<br>As you know, we are trying to schedule a time slot fo=
r Clouds bar BoF during IETF-77 in March 2010. <br>With permission/approval=
 from one of the APP AD, we can use any one (or more) of the following slot=
s.</div>

<div><br>11:30-13:00 on WEDNESDAY, March 24, 2010 <br>19:40-21:30 on WEDNES=
DAY, March 24, 2010 <br>11:30-13:00 on THURSDAY, March 25, 2010<br>13:00-15=
:00 on THURSDAY, March 25, 2010<br></div>
<div>I have initiated a poll &quot;IETF-77-Clouds-barBoF&quot; at Doodle. T=
he link to the poll is:</div>
<p><a href=3D"http://www.doodle.com/q9fexcsfyi9tuvfw">http://www.doodle.com=
/q9fexcsfyi9tuvfw</a></p>
<p>I am sharing this link with you so that you can cast your vote ASAP (by =
Friday, March 12, 2010, please).=A0</p>
<p>Best Regards.</p>
<p>Bhumip</p>

--0016e6da7db80741ee04814f4088--

From zongning@huawei.com  Sun Mar 14 23:23:44 2010
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Date: Mon, 15 Mar 2010 14:20:42 +0800
From: Ning Zong <zongning@huawei.com>
To: clouds@ietf.org
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Subject: [clouds] Any documents or slides available?
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Hi, Folks,

I am wondering if there are any documents or slides to be discussed in the
forthcoming Clouds bar BoF, e.g. Problem Statement, Survey available and can
be posted to the list for early discussion?
Thanks!

BR,
Ning Zong


From mmorrow@cisco.com  Thu Mar 18 01:09:53 2010
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Message-ID: <a065968d1003181340j34d8dd2ctb84603b8703a6c69@mail.gmail.com>
From: Bhumip Khasnabish <vumip1@gmail.com>
To: clouds@ietf.org
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Subject: [clouds] IETF-77 Clouds bar BoF at 11:30 AM on Thursday, 3/25/2010
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--0016e6d99b8358897f0482193d72
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Dear All.

Based on your responses in Doodle survey (
http://www.doodle.com/q9fexcsfyi9tuvfw?adminKey=3Dsymbd6w4) it appears that
most convenient time for the Clouds bar BoF during IETF-77 will be 11:30 AM
(to ~ 1 PM) on Thursday, March 25, 2010.

So please mark that time in your calendar for Clouds bars BoF.

As mentioned in the earlier announcements related to this bar BoF, we plan
to discuss applications/services and their provisioning/maintenance over
cloud-based system. Of particular interest are development of a reference
framework, identifying/developing protocol/profile for discovering
resources, and discussing mechanisms for allocating these resources for
provisioning/maintaining the desired level of monitoring/reporting of
security and service quality (including resiliency).

 Kindly look at the email exchanges at the following URL for further
background information:
http://www.ietf.org/mail-archive/web/clouds/current/maillist.html .

I'll send the information about meeting location (room number) very soon.

Many thanks, and look forward to see you in the mtg.

Best.

Bhumip Khasnabish (vumip1@gmail.com)

Clouds bar BoF Convener

--0016e6d99b8358897f0482193d72
Content-Type: text/html; charset=ISO-8859-1
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<p style=3D"MARGIN: 0in 0in 10pt" class=3D"MsoNormal"><font size=3D"3" face=
=3D"Calibri">Dear All.</font></p>
<p style=3D"MARGIN: 0in 0in 10pt" class=3D"MsoNormal"><font size=3D"3" face=
=3D"Calibri">Based on your responses in Doodle survey (</font><a href=3D"ht=
tp://www.doodle.com/q9fexcsfyi9tuvfw?adminKey=3D3Dsymbd6w4" target=3D"_blan=
k"><font color=3D"#0000ff" size=3D"3" face=3D"Calibri">http://www.doodle.co=
m/q9fexcsfyi9tuvfw?adminKey=3D3Dsymbd6w4</font></a><font size=3D"3" face=3D=
"Calibri">) it appears that most convenient time for the Clouds bar BoF dur=
ing IETF-77 will be 11:30 AM (to ~ 1 PM) on Thursday, March 25, 2010.</font=
></p>

<p style=3D"MARGIN: 0in 0in 10pt" class=3D"MsoNormal"><font size=3D"3" face=
=3D"Calibri">So please mark that time in your calendar for Clouds bars BoF.=
</font></p>
<p style=3D"LINE-HEIGHT: normal; MARGIN: 0in 0in 10pt" class=3D"MsoNormal">=
<font face=3D"Calibri"><span style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 12pt">As mentioned in the =
earlier announcements related to this bar BoF, we plan to discuss applicati=
ons/services and their provisioning/maintenance over cloud-based system. Of=
 particular interest are development of a reference framework, identifying/=
developing protocol/profile for discovering resources, and discussing mecha=
nisms for allocating these resources for provisioning/maintaining the desir=
ed level of monitoring/reporting of security and service quality (including=
 resiliency).</span><span style=3D"FONT-FAMILY: &#39;Times New Roman&#39;,&=
#39;serif&#39;; FONT-SIZE: 12pt"></span></font></p>

<p style=3D"MARGIN: 0in 0in 10pt" class=3D"MsoNormal"><font size=3D"3"><fon=
t face=3D"Calibri"><span>=A0</span>Kindly look at the email exchanges at th=
e following URL for further background information: </font></font><a href=
=3D"http://www.ietf.org/mail-archive/web/clouds/current/maillist.html" targ=
et=3D"_blank"><font size=3D"3" face=3D"Calibri">http://www.ietf.org/mail-ar=
chive/web/clouds/current/maillist.html</font></a><font size=3D"3" face=3D"C=
alibri"> .</font></p>

<p style=3D"MARGIN: 0in 0in 10pt" class=3D"MsoNormal"><font size=3D"3" face=
=3D"Calibri">I&#39;ll send the information about meeting location (room num=
ber) very soon.</font></p>
<p style=3D"MARGIN: 0in 0in 10pt" class=3D"MsoNormal"><font size=3D"3" face=
=3D"Calibri">Many thanks, and look forward to see you in the mtg.</font></p=
>
<p style=3D"MARGIN: 0in 0in 10pt" class=3D"MsoNormal"><font size=3D"3" face=
=3D"Calibri">Best.</font></p>
<p style=3D"MARGIN: 0in 0in 10pt" class=3D"MsoNormal"><font size=3D"3" face=
=3D"Calibri">Bhumip Khasnabish (<a href=3D"mailto:vumip1@gmail.com" target=
=3D"_blank">vumip1@gmail.com</a>)</font></p>
<p style=3D"MARGIN: 0in 0in 10pt" class=3D"MsoNormal"><font size=3D"3" face=
=3D"Calibri">Clouds bar BoF Convener</font></p>

--0016e6d99b8358897f0482193d72--

From vumip1@gmail.com  Sat Mar 20 11:12:25 2010
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Date: Sat, 20 Mar 2010 14:12:29 -0400
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From: Bhumip Khasnabish <vumip1@gmail.com>
To: clouds@ietf.org
Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary=0016367fa72238a74b04823f68c1
Cc: ietf@ietf.org
Subject: Re: [clouds] IETF-77 Clouds bar BoF at 11:30 AM on Thursday, 3/25/2010
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--0016367fa72238a74b04823f68c1
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Dear All,

I just got the room assignment for *Clouds bar BoF (Thursday, March 25, 2010
at 11:30 AM).
*
We'll meet in *Pacific B room (Ballroom level, 2nd floor) of Hilton Anaheim.
*
Hilton is working on bringing a sandwich/lunch-box trolley in the Pacific B
room at ~ 11 am on 3/25/10.

Many thanks, and look forward to see you in the mtg.

Best.

Bhumip Khasnabish (vumip1@gmail.com)
Clouds bar BoF Convener


On Thu, Mar 18, 2010 at 4:40 PM, Bhumip Khasnabish <vumip1@gmail.com> wrote:

> Dear All.
>
> Based on your responses in Doodle survey (
> http://www.doodle.com/q9fexcsfyi9tuvfw?adminKey=3Dsymbd6w4) it appears
> that most convenient time for the Clouds bar BoF during IETF-77 will be
> 11:30 AM (to ~ 1 PM) on Thursday, March 25, 2010.
>
> So please mark that time in your calendar for Clouds bars BoF.
>
> As mentioned in the earlier announcements related to this bar BoF, we plan
> to discuss applications/services and their provisioning/maintenance over
> cloud-based system. Of particular interest are development of a reference
> framework, identifying/developing protocol/profile for discovering
> resources, and discussing mechanisms for allocating these resources for
> provisioning/maintaining the desired level of monitoring/reporting of
> security and service quality (including resiliency).
>
>  Kindly look at the email exchanges at the following URL for further
> background information:
> http://www.ietf.org/mail-archive/web/clouds/current/maillist.html .
>
> I'll send the information about meeting location (room number) very soon.
>
> Many thanks, and look forward to see you in the mtg.
>
> Best.
>
> Bhumip Khasnabish (vumip1@gmail.com)
>
> Clouds bar BoF Convener
>

--0016367fa72238a74b04823f68c1
Content-Type: text/html; charset=ISO-8859-1
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

<div><font face=3D"Arial">Dear All,<br>=A0<br>I just got the room assignmen=
t for <strong><u>Clouds bar BoF (Thursday, March 25, 2010 at 11:30 AM).=A0<=
br></u></strong>=A0<br>We&#39;ll meet in <strong><u>Pacific B room (Ballroo=
m level, 2nd floor) of Hilton Anaheim.<br>
</u></strong>=A0<br>Hilton is working on bringing a sandwich/lunch-box trol=
ley in the Pacific B room at ~ 11 am on 3/25/10.</font></div><font face=3D"=
Arial">
<div><br>Many thanks, and look forward to see you in the mtg.<br></div>
<div>=A0</div>
<div>Best.<br></div>
<div>=A0</div>
<div>Bhumip Khasnabish (<a href=3D"mailto:vumip1@gmail.com" target=3D"_blan=
k">vumip1@gmail.com</a>)<br></div>
<div>Clouds bar BoF Convener </div></font>
<div>
<p style=3D"MARGIN: 0in 0in 10pt" class=3D"MsoNormal"><font size=3D"3" face=
=3D"Calibri"></font></p>
<p style=3D"MARGIN: 0in 0in 10pt" class=3D"MsoNormal"><font size=3D"3" face=
=3D"Calibri"></font>=A0</p></div>
<div class=3D"gmail_quote">On Thu, Mar 18, 2010 at 4:40 PM, Bhumip Khasnabi=
sh <span dir=3D"ltr">&lt;<a href=3D"mailto:vumip1@gmail.com" target=3D"_bla=
nk">vumip1@gmail.com</a>&gt;</span> wrote:<br>
<blockquote style=3D"BORDER-LEFT: #ccc 1px solid; MARGIN: 0px 0px 0px 0.8ex=
; PADDING-LEFT: 1ex" class=3D"gmail_quote">
<p style=3D"MARGIN: 0in 0in 10pt" class=3D"MsoNormal"><font size=3D"3" face=
=3D"Calibri">Dear All.</font></p>
<p style=3D"MARGIN: 0in 0in 10pt" class=3D"MsoNormal"><font size=3D"3" face=
=3D"Calibri">Based on your responses in Doodle survey (</font><a href=3D"ht=
tp://www.doodle.com/q9fexcsfyi9tuvfw?adminKey=3D3Dsymbd6w4" target=3D"_blan=
k"><font color=3D"#0000ff" size=3D"3" face=3D"Calibri">http://www.doodle.co=
m/q9fexcsfyi9tuvfw?adminKey=3D3Dsymbd6w4</font></a><font size=3D"3" face=3D=
"Calibri">) it appears that most convenient time for the Clouds bar BoF dur=
ing IETF-77 will be 11:30 AM (to ~ 1 PM) on Thursday, March 25, 2010.</font=
></p>

<p style=3D"MARGIN: 0in 0in 10pt" class=3D"MsoNormal"><font size=3D"3" face=
=3D"Calibri">So please mark that time in your calendar for Clouds bars BoF.=
</font></p>
<p style=3D"LINE-HEIGHT: normal; MARGIN: 0in 0in 10pt" class=3D"MsoNormal">=
<font face=3D"Calibri"><span style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 12pt">As mentioned in the =
earlier announcements related to this bar BoF, we plan to discuss applicati=
ons/services and their provisioning/maintenance over cloud-based system. Of=
 particular interest are development of a reference framework, identifying/=
developing protocol/profile for discovering resources, and discussing mecha=
nisms for allocating these resources for provisioning/maintaining the desir=
ed level of monitoring/reporting of security and service quality (including=
 resiliency).</span><span style=3D"FONT-FAMILY: &#39;Times New Roman&#39;, =
&#39;serif&#39;; FONT-SIZE: 12pt"></span></font></p>

<p style=3D"MARGIN: 0in 0in 10pt" class=3D"MsoNormal"><font size=3D"3"><fon=
t face=3D"Calibri"><span>=A0</span>Kindly look at the email exchanges at th=
e following URL for further background information: </font></font><a href=
=3D"http://www.ietf.org/mail-archive/web/clouds/current/maillist.html" targ=
et=3D"_blank"><font size=3D"3" face=3D"Calibri">http://www.ietf.org/mail-ar=
chive/web/clouds/current/maillist.html</font></a><font size=3D"3" face=3D"C=
alibri"> .</font></p>

<p style=3D"MARGIN: 0in 0in 10pt" class=3D"MsoNormal"><font size=3D"3" face=
=3D"Calibri">I&#39;ll send the information about meeting location (room num=
ber) very soon.</font></p>
<p style=3D"MARGIN: 0in 0in 10pt" class=3D"MsoNormal"><font size=3D"3" face=
=3D"Calibri">Many thanks, and look forward to see you in the mtg.</font></p=
>
<p style=3D"MARGIN: 0in 0in 10pt" class=3D"MsoNormal"><font size=3D"3" face=
=3D"Calibri">Best.</font></p>
<p style=3D"MARGIN: 0in 0in 10pt" class=3D"MsoNormal"><font size=3D"3" face=
=3D"Calibri">Bhumip Khasnabish (<a href=3D"mailto:vumip1@gmail.com" target=
=3D"_blank">vumip1@gmail.com</a>)</font></p>
<p style=3D"MARGIN: 0in 0in 10pt" class=3D"MsoNormal"><font size=3D"3" face=
=3D"Calibri">Clouds bar BoF Convener</font></p></blockquote></div><br><br c=
lear=3D"all">=A0<br>

--0016367fa72238a74b04823f68c1--

From vumip1@gmail.com  Thu Mar 25 00:33:43 2010
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From: Bhumip Khasnabish <vumip1@gmail.com>
To: clouds@ietf.org
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Subject: [clouds] Reminder, Clouds bar BoF, 11:30 AM on Thu., 3/25/10 in Pacific B Room 	(Hilton Anaheim)
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Dear All,

Looking forward to your participation in the Clouds bar BoF.

Kindly note that although we tried to work with Hilton to bring in box
lunch, it did not work out as planned.

So, please bring your own food to the mtg room. There is a food- court on
1st  floor of Hilton,
and you can bring it from there.
Thank you.

Bhumip Khasnabish (Mobile:+001-781-752-8003)

--0016e6db2d6db899f904829b1150
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<p>Dear All,<br>=A0<br>Looking forward to your participation in the Clouds =
bar BoF.<br>=A0<br>Kindly note that although we tried to work with Hilton t=
o bring in box lunch, it did not work out as planned.<br>=A0<br>So, please =
bring your own food to the mtg room. There is a food- court on 1st=A0 floor=
 of Hilton,<br>
and you can bring it from there.</p>
<div>Thank you.</div>
<div>=A0</div>
<div>Bhumip Khasnabish (Mobile:+001-781-752-8003)</div>
<p>=A0</p>

--0016e6db2d6db899f904829b1150--

From Joe.Hildebrand@webex.com  Thu Mar 25 11:42:19 2010
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Date: Thu, 25 Mar 2010 11:41:10 -0700
From: Joe Hildebrand <joe.hildebrand@webex.com>
To: Bhumip Khasnabish <vumip1@gmail.com>, <clouds@ietf.org>
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Thread-Topic: [clouds] Reminder, Clouds bar BoF, 11:30 AM on Thu.,3/25/10 in Pacific B Room  (Hilton Anaheim)
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Subject: Re: [clouds] Reminder, Clouds bar BoF, 11:30 AM on Thu., 3/25/10 in Pacific B Room  (Hilton Anaheim)
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On 3/25/10 12:33 AM, "Bhumip Khasnabish" <vumip1@gmail.com> wrote:

> Dear All,
> =A0
> Looking forward to your participation in the Clouds bar BoF.
> =A0
> Kindly note that although we tried to work with Hilton to bring in box lu=
nch,
> it did not work out as planned.
> =A0
> So, please bring your own food to the mtg room. There is a food- court on=
 1st=A0
> floor of Hilton,
> and you can bring it from there.
>=20
> Thank you.
> =A0
> Bhumip Khasnabish (Mobile:+001-781-752-8003)
> =A0
> _______________________________________________
> clouds mailing list
> clouds@ietf.org
> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/clouds

--=20
Joe Hildebrand