Subject: RE: [dix] Proposed Charter for DIX Working Group

From: "Hallam-Baker, Phillip" <[email-masked]>
Date: Mon, 16 Jan 2006 18:05:21 -0800

> From: Dick Hardt [mailto:[email-masked]] 

> Phillip, that resonates in why I got involved in kicking off DIX.
> 
> I agree that deployment is the more difficult problem. Partly 
> because it is NOT technical.

The internet has a billion users, that's a lot of mass, think of
changing it as the problem of turning an oil supertanker.

We have in the past made the mistake of assuming that such changes can
be led by a single major vendor, since then we have discovered that it
is hard for even consortiums of vendors to act.

> For deployment to happen, not only does it need to be simple 
> and solve a real problem. There is the proverbial Chicken and 
> Egg issue, which in this case is user and site. No site wants 
> to deploy until there are users that have the functionality, 
> and the users are not motivated until there are sites that 
> accept the functionality.
> 
> Fortunately, IETF only has to solve the technical issues, 
> albeit in a manner that has low barriers to adoption.

Don't go the the IETF to solve a technical problem. It is always much
easier to solve a technical problem is a room with ten good people and a
whiteboard than on the Internet with everyone with an opinion and a
keyboard chiming in.

The point of IETF process is to establish the critical mass and the
broad consensus required to make a deployment successful. It is a
process of achieving buy-in.

The first third of my book on Internet crime is all about the problem of
how to effect change and how to deploy. Its all about design for
deployment.

What I think we need to identify first is a killer application. We need
to identify a pain point that affects a tightly defined, highly
motivated community that is likely to deploy new infrastructure quickly.

Then we have to design the solution so that the infrastructure built out
by our early adopter community can evolve organically into the broader
solution.

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From: Dick Hardt <[email-masked]>
Date: Mon, 16 Jan 2006 18:14:09 -0800

> whiteboard than on the Internet with everyone with an opinion and a

Agreed. I've been involved in lots of open source projects.  
Fortunately there, code talks.

> process of achieving buy-in.

Lots of people have pain in this area. I have been talking to them.  
The lack of consensus on which direction to take, and lack of a  
simple, complete solution to their pain is holding them back.

I see the IETF process as a way of building consensus on the  
technical solution.

> how to effect change and how to deploy. Its all about design for

Agreed. As I said, low barrier to adoption.

> motivated community that is likely to deploy new infrastructure  

We think that blog spam is a good pain. Blogosphere is innovating  
rapidly. False positives are not life threatening.

> by our early adopter community can evolve organically into the broader

All in favor of a layered approach. Easy to deploy is key. Ability to  
extend is critical.