Subject: RE: Re[2]: [dix] Re: Gathering requirements for in-browser OpenIDsupport

From: "Recordon, David" <[email-masked]>
Date: Thu, 19 Oct 2006 11:30:13 -0700

Andy,
I think it is incredibly useful in showing the technology needed to help
protect users with systems like this.  I'd love to see it as part of the
Heraldry project, you are already a committer, assuming you'd be willing
to contribute it.
 
--David

________________________________

From: [email-masked] [mailto:[email-masked]] On
Behalf Of [email-masked]
Sent: Wednesday, October 18, 2006 11:44 PM
To: Digital Identity Exchange
Cc: Digital Identity Exchange; [email-masked]; [email-masked]
Subject: Re: Re[2]: [dix] Re: Gathering requirements for in-browser
OpenIDsupport

I'd be interested to hear if people think the ph-off plugin is useful or
not.... If not why not? 

If people think it's useful then I will happily extend it and make it
more usable and I will put it into whatever open source project would
like to house it. 

I built it as a proof of concept that it _could_ be done... Now the
question of _should_ it be done :-) 

http://chile.ootao.com/phoff/ 

Andy Dale
ooTao, Inc.

Phone: 877-213-7935
Fax: 877-213-7935

i-name: =Andy.Dale
http://xri.net/=andy.dale

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Chris Drake <[email-masked]> 

10/18/2006 07:20 PM 
Please respond to
Digital Identity Exchange <[email-masked]>

To
Scott Kveton <[email-masked]> 
cc
[email-masked], [email-masked], Mike Glover <[email-masked]>,
Digital Identity Exchange <[email-masked]> 
Subject
Re[2]: [dix] Re: Gathering requirements for in-browser OpenID support

Hi Scott,

All solutions for client-based MITM and phishing prevention can easily
be built on top of OpenID 2.0 if we adopt the OpenIDHTTPAuth proposal.

We can then leave these people to build their tools and protection
howsoever they like, safe in the knowledge that when it's *done*,
there will be a range of new plugins that will immediately work with
all OpenID 2.0 enabled sites - and best of all - it does not have to
hold up the OpenID 2.0 development in the meantime.

The only thing we need to give to these tools is a way to get the
login process started - that is - OpenIDHTTPAuth: the downloaded
plugin needs to be able to get an entry point for the OpenID CGI code
on the web site.

-----------

Here is a copy of my vote to include the above proposal, which
contains more info abut it too:

Hi,

Why's this proposal "depreciated" ?
( http://www.lifewiki.net/openid/OpenIDProposals )

I'm casting my vote here:

+1 to [PROPOSAL] bare response / bare request

Besides the listed uses, it also allows IdPs to layer privacy and
delegation easily on top of OpenID, as well as permitting cool future
features (like letting a user change something at their IdP, and have
that change be "pushed out" to all relevant RPs).

This is a small and simple to implement "hook" which I believe will be
the dominating bit of OpenID protocol use in future.

Alternatively - if we can standardize a way for the OpenIDHTTPAuth
proposed extension to discover the RP's OpenID "entry point" [so as to
reliably eliminate the "optional" first step proposed here
http://www.lifewiki.net/openid/OpenIDHTTPAuth ] - this is a good
working alterative way to accommodate the "bare response" part that we
need.

So...

+1 to OpenIDHTTPAuth - on the proviso RP's publish an endpoint URL
                      that's somehow available to scripts, plugins,
                      software agents that encounter OpenID login
                      pages.

                      Suggestion: (for OpenID-enabled login pages):-

 <link rel="openid.httpauth" href="http://my.rp.com/openid/blah.cgi">

-----------

Kind Regards,
Chris Drake

Thursday, October 19, 2006, 6:07:08 AM:

>> It is vulnerable to a man in the middle attack - the RP, instead of
>> redirecting to the IdP redirects to itself or some other site in
>> cahoots, then proxies the conversation between the user and the IdP
>> thereby compromising the users (global) credentials as they pass
through.

SK> Right, we've known about this for quite some time unfortunately
there hasn't
SK> be a particularly easy solution to it and I classify this as one of
those
SK> "The Internet Sucks" problems.  I'm not saying we shouldn't/couldn't
do
SK> anything about it I just think the right solution that mixes
SK> ease-of-implementation and user need hasn't been found yet.

>> There really needs to be user-agent support to avoid that - either
>> something CardSpace like, or browser plugin that only ever presents a
>> pre-authenticated user.

SK> I think we're headed in this direction.  However, we have to crawl
before we
SK> can walk.  At least solving a big chunk of the use cases, getting
some
SK> momentum behind the platform and solving a specific problem for
users
SK> *today* is better than trying to build the perfect tool.  We can
talk and
SK> talk on these lists but we really don't know how users are going to
use this
SK> stuff (or abuse it for that matter) until its out there and working
in the
SK> wild.

SK> I can't emphasize more the fact that with every passing day that we
don't
SK> have OpenID v2.0 out the door, we're losing momentum from fixing
specific
SK> user problems that are solved in the existing specification.

SK> - Scott

SK> _______________________________________________
SK> general mailing list
SK> [email-masked]
SK> http://openid.net/mailman/listinfo/general

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