From pierrick.seite@orange.com Thu Mar 1 05:03:58 2012 Return-Path: X-Original-To: dmm@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: dmm@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id EE6A321F8828; Thu, 1 Mar 2012 05:03:57 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -6.226 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-6.226 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.023, BAYES_00=-2.599, HELO_EQ_FR=0.35, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-4] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([12.22.58.30]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id SH9uvqVBvlcW; Thu, 1 Mar 2012 05:03:57 -0800 (PST) Received: from r-mail1.rd.francetelecom.com (r-mail1.rd.francetelecom.com [217.108.152.41]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2444921F881B; Thu, 1 Mar 2012 05:03:57 -0800 (PST) Received: from r-mail1.rd.francetelecom.com (localhost.localdomain [127.0.0.1]) by localhost (Postfix) with SMTP id 67190A44168; Thu, 1 Mar 2012 14:05:24 +0100 (CET) Received: from ftrdsmtp2.rd.francetelecom.fr (unknown [10.192.128.47]) by r-mail1.rd.francetelecom.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5C15CA44165; Thu, 1 Mar 2012 14:05:24 +0100 (CET) Received: from ftrdmel0.rd.francetelecom.fr ([10.192.128.56]) by ftrdsmtp2.rd.francetelecom.fr with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.4675); Thu, 1 Mar 2012 14:03:55 +0100 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft Exchange V6.5 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable x-cr-hashedpuzzle: CBLL CYme DXV6 DboR GrSe IrqF IvZD K6Ez MVcY M5vv ODhM RTwX Rvs2 TBmz TePe XJVr; 2; ZABtAG0AQABpAGUAdABmAC4AbwByAGcAOwBtAGUAeAB0AEAAaQBlAHQAZgAuAG8AcgBnAA==; Sosha1_v1; 7; {8FB264EA-68E3-4D64-8739-2E4B1CDE6540}; cABpAGUAcgByAGkAYwBrAC4AcwBlAGkAdABlAEAAbwByAGEAbgBnAGUALgBjAG8AbQA=; Thu, 01 Mar 2012 13:03:49 GMT; RABNAE0AIABkAGUAbQBvAA== x-cr-puzzleid: {8FB264EA-68E3-4D64-8739-2E4B1CDE6540} Content-class: urn:content-classes:message Date: Thu, 1 Mar 2012 14:03:49 +0100 Message-ID: <843DA8228A1BA74CA31FB4E111A5C46202383F89@ftrdmel0.rd.francetelecom.fr> In-Reply-To: <494B8B97-093D-4886-88D7-F1A2EF065BB4@gmail.com> X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: Thread-Topic: DMM demo Thread-Index: Acz1NFAo5bNWj+6mR6mWaoP4mYptMACd0gDw References: <494B8B97-093D-4886-88D7-F1A2EF065BB4@gmail.com> From: To: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 01 Mar 2012 13:03:55.0303 (UTC) FILETIME=[C1FE2B70:01CCF7AB] Cc: dmm@ietf.org Subject: [dmm] DMM demo X-BeenThere: dmm@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.12 Precedence: list List-Id: Distributed Mobility Management List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 01 Mar 2012 13:03:58 -0000 Hello all, =20 We will take the opportunity of the IETF#83 to show a demonstration of distributed mobility management (DMM), based on the following draft: http://www.ietf.org/id/draft-seite-dmm-dma-00.txt=20 We will make the demo after DMM meeting (03/29), during lunch time. I'll communicate the exact location as soon as I'm able to. BR, Pierrick From telemaco.melia@alcatel-lucent.com Fri Mar 2 01:08:31 2012 Return-Path: X-Original-To: dmm@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: dmm@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id A840E21F8A21; Fri, 2 Mar 2012 01:08:31 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -10.249 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-10.249 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-2.599, HELO_EQ_FR=0.35, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_HI=-8] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([12.22.58.30]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id tUEfWbJLg3qN; Fri, 2 Mar 2012 01:08:30 -0800 (PST) Received: from smail6.alcatel.fr (smail6.alcatel.fr [64.208.49.42]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 84AA821F8A20; Fri, 2 Mar 2012 01:08:30 -0800 (PST) Received: from FRMRSSXCHHUB02.dc-m.alcatel-lucent.com (FRMRSSXCHHUB02.dc-m.alcatel-lucent.com [135.120.45.62]) by smail6.alcatel.fr (8.14.3/8.14.3/ICT) with ESMTP id q2297hEl011140 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=RC4-MD5 bits=128 verify=NOT); Fri, 2 Mar 2012 10:08:28 +0100 Received: from FRMRSSXCHMBSE1.dc-m.alcatel-lucent.com ([135.120.45.110]) by FRMRSSXCHHUB02.dc-m.alcatel-lucent.com ([135.120.45.62]) with mapi; Fri, 2 Mar 2012 10:08:25 +0100 From: "MELIA, TELEMACO (TELEMACO)" To: jouni korhonen , "mext@ietf.org" Date: Fri, 2 Mar 2012 10:08:17 +0100 Thread-Topic: [MEXT] Agenda call for DMM meeting in IETF#83 Thread-Index: Acz1NFQTg2mqXtwzQlSSM1fTbSOt7ADHzP8Q Message-ID: <3D6C64F2D792B540BAAEBCEF6509363B0EFB18A386@FRMRSSXCHMBSE1.dc-m.alcatel-lucent.com> References: <494B8B97-093D-4886-88D7-F1A2EF065BB4@gmail.com> In-Reply-To: <494B8B97-093D-4886-88D7-F1A2EF065BB4@gmail.com> Accept-Language: en-US Content-Language: en-US X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: acceptlanguage: en-US Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Scanned-By: MIMEDefang 2.69 on 155.132.188.84 Cc: mext chair , "dmm@ietf.org" Subject: Re: [dmm] [MEXT] Agenda call for DMM meeting in IETF#83 X-BeenThere: dmm@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.12 Precedence: list List-Id: Distributed Mobility Management List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 02 Mar 2012 09:08:31 -0000 Hi Jouni, We request 20 minutes slot to present the updated version of the ID "http:/= /tools.ietf.org/html/draft-bernardos-dmm-pmip-00". Thanks to let us know. telemaco -----Original Message----- From: mext-bounces@ietf.org [mailto:mext-bounces@ietf.org] On Behalf Of jou= ni korhonen Sent: lundi 27 f=E9vrier 2012 10:44 To: mext@ietf.org Cc: mext chair; dmm@ietf.org Subject: [MEXT] Agenda call for DMM meeting in IETF#83 Folks, Our WG meeting has been scheduled to Thursday morning session I, which means we have full 2.5h time. If you want to have a presentation slot, send a request to the chairs with abstract, your I-D name, time needed and why you think the presentation is needed. - Jouni & Julien _______________________________________________ MEXT mailing list MEXT@ietf.org https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/mext From pierrick.seite@orange.com Fri Mar 2 01:43:58 2012 Return-Path: X-Original-To: dmm@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: dmm@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 18F1921F8C08; Fri, 2 Mar 2012 01:43:58 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -6.228 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-6.228 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.021, BAYES_00=-2.599, HELO_EQ_FR=0.35, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-4] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([12.22.58.30]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id ZxBszTsTrqRM; Fri, 2 Mar 2012 01:43:57 -0800 (PST) Received: from r-mail1.rd.francetelecom.com (r-mail1.rd.francetelecom.com [217.108.152.41]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1AF1F21F8C07; Fri, 2 Mar 2012 01:43:56 -0800 (PST) Received: from r-mail1.rd.francetelecom.com (localhost.localdomain [127.0.0.1]) by localhost (Postfix) with SMTP id AF295A440A6; Fri, 2 Mar 2012 10:45:23 +0100 (CET) Received: from ftrdsmtp2.rd.francetelecom.fr (unknown [10.192.128.47]) by r-mail1.rd.francetelecom.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 88B3CA440A0; Fri, 2 Mar 2012 10:45:23 +0100 (CET) Received: from ftrdmel0.rd.francetelecom.fr ([10.192.128.56]) by ftrdsmtp2.rd.francetelecom.fr with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.4675); Fri, 2 Mar 2012 10:43:53 +0100 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft Exchange V6.5 Content-class: urn:content-classes:message MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="----_=_NextPart_001_01CCF858.FABAA9D8" Date: Fri, 2 Mar 2012 10:43:52 +0100 Message-ID: <843DA8228A1BA74CA31FB4E111A5C4620238414D@ftrdmel0.rd.francetelecom.fr> In-Reply-To: X-MS-Has-Attach: yes X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: Thread-Topic: [MEXT] DMM demo Thread-Index: AQHM962wzuyFJP26a0qnrZseqq3x4pZV74wwgADCeDA= References: <494B8B97-093D-4886-88D7-F1A2EF065BB4@gmail.com> <843DA8228A1BA74CA31FB4E111A5C46202383F89@ftrdmel0.rd.francetelecom.fr> From: To: , X-OriginalArrivalTime: 02 Mar 2012 09:43:53.0959 (UTC) FILETIME=[FB0C2770:01CCF858] Cc: dmm@ietf.org Subject: Re: [dmm] [MEXT] DMM demo X-BeenThere: dmm@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.12 Precedence: list List-Id: Distributed Mobility Management List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 02 Mar 2012 09:43:58 -0000 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------_=_NextPart_001_01CCF858.FABAA9D8 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Hi Bruno, Thanks for your interest. The demo illustrates a PMIPv6 based = distributed mobility on a Wifi network, with 2 or 3 wifi APs. We show IP = continuity on a video streaming. The network architecture is as per = draft-seite-dmm-dma where access routers implement both MAG and LMA = functions (see attached slides for more details); i.e. PMIP runs only = between AR. Dynamic mobility is also shown: PMIP signaling comes into = play only when the MN performs handover otherwise, standard IP routing = applies. Regarding implementation, Network elements and streaming server = are Linux virtual machines, all on a single laptop.=20 I hope to see you at the demo :-) Pierrick > -----Message d'origine----- > De=A0: ext-bruno.faria@nokia.com [mailto:ext-bruno.faria@nokia.com] > Envoy=E9=A0: jeudi 1 mars 2012 22:10 > =C0=A0: SEITE Pierrick RD-RESA-REN; mext@ietf.org > Cc=A0: dmm@ietf.org > Objet=A0: RE: DMM demo >=20 > Hello Pierrick, >=20 > That seems to be very interesting. > Can you point out some information about that implementation? >=20 > Rgds, >=20 > - Bruno >=20 > >-----Original Message----- > >From: mext-bounces@ietf.org [mailto:mext-bounces@ietf.org] On Behalf > Of > >ext pierrick.seite@orange.com > >Sent: quinta-feira, 1 de mar=E7o de 2012 09:04 > >To: mext@ietf.org > >Cc: dmm@ietf.org > >Subject: [MEXT] DMM demo > > > > > >Hello all, > > > > > >We will take the opportunity of the IETF#83 to show a demonstration = of > >distributed mobility management (DMM), based on the following draft: > > > >http://www.ietf.org/id/draft-seite-dmm-dma-00.txt > > > >We will make the demo after DMM meeting (03/29), during lunch time. > I'll > >communicate the exact location as soon as I'm able to. > > > >BR, > >Pierrick > >_______________________________________________ > >MEXT mailing list > >MEXT@ietf.org > >https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/mext ------_=_NextPart_001_01CCF858.FABAA9D8 Content-Type: application/octet-stream; name="DMA-DMM.pdf" Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64 Content-Description: DMA-DMM.pdf Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="DMA-DMM.pdf" JVBERi0xLjQKJcfsj6IKNSAwIG9iago8PC9MZW5ndGggNiAwIFIvRmlsdGVyIC9GbGF0ZURlY29k ZT4+CnN0cmVhbQp4nO1XyVIbMRC96yt0nKHKg/Ylt6QgqaQ4BDJVHCAHMGZJMTZmCeRD8r9pyZ5R y54BQqgcUsEYJFnqfv1et6Y9p6zigrLwagfjhsyJEJ5qZisvBG3izCym9JIIZdem7d5Lck72N+iU cBpe12eZJaUZo4bBn+sJOd0gu4RVjCnGuBEBgPVehoFi3gOavQ+Pfw7W58RVMvxE6Hg8bui7mmzu WSp95Q2tTwkDRCP4hf9cVUJRzlTFNad1Qw6KLyULxwX3xbgc8UozrosJLCqlhBfFNA2P0vC6HIVj 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ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9D1F421F89F1; Thu, 1 Mar 2012 13:09:45 -0800 (PST) Received: from vaebh101.NOE.Nokia.com (in-mx.nokia.com [10.160.244.22]) by mgw-da01.nokia.com (Switch-3.4.4/Switch-3.4.4) with ESMTP id q21L9c3D021718; Thu, 1 Mar 2012 23:09:39 +0200 Received: from smtp.mgd.nokia.com ([65.54.30.21]) by vaebh101.NOE.Nokia.com over TLS secured channel with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.4675); Thu, 1 Mar 2012 23:09:38 +0200 Received: from 008-AM1MPN1-032.mgdnok.nokia.com ([169.254.2.170]) by 008-AM1MMR1-012.mgdnok.nokia.com ([65.54.30.21]) with mapi id 14.01.0355.003; Thu, 1 Mar 2012 22:09:37 +0100 From: To: , Thread-Topic: DMM demo Thread-Index: AQHM962wzuyFJP26a0qnrZseqq3x4pZV74ww Date: Thu, 1 Mar 2012 21:09:37 +0000 Message-ID: References: <494B8B97-093D-4886-88D7-F1A2EF065BB4@gmail.com> <843DA8228A1BA74CA31FB4E111A5C46202383F89@ftrdmel0.rd.francetelecom.fr> In-Reply-To: <843DA8228A1BA74CA31FB4E111A5C46202383F89@ftrdmel0.rd.francetelecom.fr> Accept-Language: pt-BR, en-US Content-Language: en-US X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: x-headerinfofordlp: None x-titus-version: 3.3.8.1 x-tituslabs-classifications-30: TLPropertyRoot=Nokia;Confidentiality=Nokia Internal Use Only;Project=None; x-tituslabs-classificationhash-30: VgNFIFU9Hx+/nZJb9Kg7IvcbrO/k4rSZfDwI+OTgg013aNMmpel+OIJZdoudAoNPCldI7vMd4sdiNKbnQLfXNAKXrQRNKFEUKcgP4VQ/ZWG2B7pygkBrsyGsvBJ2cxaHfIWryzo0LLnmvKOS7mXrnVB7nglfdeUUEujcjfy92H1X8mRLgbPtyrBH2cU9xe+CJ8azsZFqQ7/iR3fhSBijFg== x-originating-ip: [186.215.93.195] Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable MIME-Version: 1.0 X-OriginalArrivalTime: 01 Mar 2012 21:09:38.0444 (UTC) FILETIME=[9CA894C0:01CCF7EF] X-Nokia-AV: Clean X-Mailman-Approved-At: Fri, 02 Mar 2012 04:35:29 -0800 Cc: dmm@ietf.org Subject: Re: [dmm] DMM demo X-BeenThere: dmm@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.12 Precedence: list List-Id: Distributed Mobility Management List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 01 Mar 2012 21:09:56 -0000 Hello Pierrick, That seems to be very interesting. Can you point out some information about that implementation? Rgds, - Bruno >-----Original Message----- >From: mext-bounces@ietf.org [mailto:mext-bounces@ietf.org] On Behalf Of >ext pierrick.seite@orange.com >Sent: quinta-feira, 1 de mar=E7o de 2012 09:04 >To: mext@ietf.org >Cc: dmm@ietf.org >Subject: [MEXT] DMM demo > > >Hello all, > > >We will take the opportunity of the IETF#83 to show a demonstration of >distributed mobility management (DMM), based on the following draft: > >http://www.ietf.org/id/draft-seite-dmm-dma-00.txt > >We will make the demo after DMM meeting (03/29), during lunch time. I'll >communicate the exact location as soon as I'm able to. > >BR, >Pierrick >_______________________________________________ >MEXT mailing list >MEXT@ietf.org >https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/mext From sarikaya2012@gmail.com Fri Mar 2 09:39:30 2012 Return-Path: X-Original-To: dmm@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: dmm@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 963B421F847E; Fri, 2 Mar 2012 09:39:29 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -3.556 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-3.556 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.043, BAYES_00=-2.599, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW=-1] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([12.22.58.30]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 4M8ePjrKG5gi; Fri, 2 Mar 2012 09:39:28 -0800 (PST) Received: from mail-yx0-f172.google.com (mail-yx0-f172.google.com [209.85.213.172]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7D92B21F845A; Fri, 2 Mar 2012 09:39:28 -0800 (PST) Received: by yenm5 with SMTP id m5so1012741yen.31 for ; Fri, 02 Mar 2012 09:39:28 -0800 (PST) Received-SPF: pass (google.com: domain of sarikaya2012@gmail.com designates 10.236.173.132 as permitted sender) client-ip=10.236.173.132; Authentication-Results: mr.google.com; spf=pass (google.com: domain of sarikaya2012@gmail.com designates 10.236.173.132 as permitted sender) smtp.mail=sarikaya2012@gmail.com; dkim=pass header.i=sarikaya2012@gmail.com Received: from mr.google.com ([10.236.173.132]) by 10.236.173.132 with SMTP id v4mr14864445yhl.78.1330709968052 (num_hops = 1); Fri, 02 Mar 2012 09:39:28 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20120113; h=mime-version:reply-to:in-reply-to:references:date:message-id :subject:from:to:cc:content-type; bh=EBynxYE35K/N8rNCVkMH1xyJVCkjev6N990Yqhf+XZ8=; b=agC7jyx5sdkKvdVP6X7xncJPQv+1P6k+9gKx978WKu9xNLE0jHJ95ThHDhHep2XVeA hynPDmF8UrviU3jky22gWk1hT7kqcvRmAleMTYG70GJAK650ZgYfChS7vup05VUtAzFF yEQemqYBYUmXZ862Ueex7tLRgInpFNhoVYvEFZkvYH2a+P8p19bAiTUNP9IAQUK36iPG Q6UlooPZnsoNUmRqNK8KO4k1JhbpMipz/+bud2RHXaynExhs6CXDJWvu2Cl1gsXMELi7 vI0JTUkVMnatVEjw4HP/8Icxq+VbRme7I2Fm5a7vlHZAoKlozTAa7poI9+Gih/9uI408 voFA== MIME-Version: 1.0 Received: by 10.236.173.132 with SMTP id v4mr11750561yhl.78.1330709967955; Fri, 02 Mar 2012 09:39:27 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.236.9.73 with HTTP; Fri, 2 Mar 2012 09:39:27 -0800 (PST) In-Reply-To: <494B8B97-093D-4886-88D7-F1A2EF065BB4@gmail.com> References: <494B8B97-093D-4886-88D7-F1A2EF065BB4@gmail.com> Date: Fri, 2 Mar 2012 11:39:27 -0600 Message-ID: From: Behcet Sarikaya To: jouni korhonen Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Cc: mext chair , dmm@ietf.org, mext@ietf.org Subject: Re: [dmm] Agenda call for DMM meeting in IETF#83 X-BeenThere: dmm@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.12 Precedence: list Reply-To: sarikaya@ieee.org List-Id: Distributed Mobility Management List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 02 Mar 2012 17:39:30 -0000 Hi Jouni, I would like to present my draft on Distributed Mobile IPv6, at http://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-sarikaya-dmm-dmipv6-00 Regards, Behcet On Mon, Feb 27, 2012 at 3:43 AM, jouni korhonen wrote: > Folks, > > Our WG meeting has been scheduled to Thursday morning session I, which > means we have full 2.5h time. If you want to have a presentation slot, > send a request to the chairs with abstract, your I-D name, time needed > and why you think the presentation is needed. > > - Jouni & Julien > _______________________________________________ > dmm mailing list > dmm@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dmm From rkuntz@us.toyota-itc.com Fri Mar 2 10:17:33 2012 Return-Path: X-Original-To: dmm@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: dmm@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2493C21E8036 for ; Fri, 2 Mar 2012 10:17:33 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -6.599 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-6.599 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-2.599, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-4] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([12.22.58.30]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id IcmZsn6Ff9P2 for ; Fri, 2 Mar 2012 10:17:32 -0800 (PST) Received: from na3sys009aog124.obsmtp.com (na3sys009aog124.obsmtp.com [74.125.149.151]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with SMTP id 0BBC721E8033 for ; Fri, 2 Mar 2012 10:17:31 -0800 (PST) Received: from mail-pw0-f53.google.com ([209.85.160.53]) (using TLSv1) by na3sys009aob124.postini.com ([74.125.148.12]) with SMTP ID DSNKT1EOu2dDyCv9kr/17qsdsFevg3Zxfuxx@postini.com; Fri, 02 Mar 2012 10:17:32 PST Received: by mail-pw0-f53.google.com with SMTP id jt11so2860423pbb.40 for ; Fri, 02 Mar 2012 10:17:31 -0800 (PST) Received-SPF: pass (google.com: domain of rkuntz@us.toyota-itc.com designates 10.68.229.5 as permitted sender) client-ip=10.68.229.5; Authentication-Results: mr.google.com; spf=pass (google.com: domain of rkuntz@us.toyota-itc.com designates 10.68.229.5 as permitted sender) smtp.mail=rkuntz@us.toyota-itc.com Received: from mr.google.com ([10.68.229.5]) by 10.68.229.5 with SMTP id sm5mr19038995pbc.82.1330712251329 (num_hops = 1); Fri, 02 Mar 2012 10:17:31 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.68.229.5 with SMTP id sm5mr15860747pbc.82.1330712251157; Fri, 02 Mar 2012 10:17:31 -0800 (PST) Received: from obayashi-t43.paloalto.toyota-itc.com ([206.132.173.18]) by mx.google.com with ESMTPS id g9sm5608292pba.6.2012.03.02.10.17.29 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=OTHER); Fri, 02 Mar 2012 10:17:30 -0800 (PST) Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v1257) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 From: Romain KUNTZ In-Reply-To: <843DA8228A1BA74CA31FB4E111A5C4620238414D@ftrdmel0.rd.francetelecom.fr> Date: Fri, 2 Mar 2012 10:17:30 -0800 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Message-Id: <24781946-D433-4A8C-9116-2543C6E183EC@us.toyota-itc.com> References: <494B8B97-093D-4886-88D7-F1A2EF065BB4@gmail.com> <843DA8228A1BA74CA31FB4E111A5C46202383F89@ftrdmel0.rd.francetelecom.fr> <843DA8228A1BA74CA31FB4E111A5C4620238414D@ftrdmel0.rd.francetelecom.fr> To: X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.1257) X-Gm-Message-State: ALoCoQnRmrEF+xi6YZzJS2bl++CKSPDJT9qbMa0bJMGn8ruEhkeRTmgIJX1uC4bfnU7eJoQoq1cF Cc: dmm@ietf.org, mext@ietf.org Subject: Re: [dmm] [MEXT] DMM demo X-BeenThere: dmm@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.12 Precedence: list List-Id: Distributed Mobility Management List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 02 Mar 2012 18:17:33 -0000 Hello Pierrick, Just for my information, is your implementation based on UMIP = (http://www.umip.org)? Thanks, Romain On Mar 2, 2012, at 1:43, = wrote: > Hi Bruno, >=20 > Thanks for your interest. The demo illustrates a PMIPv6 based = distributed mobility on a Wifi network, with 2 or 3 wifi APs. We show IP = continuity on a video streaming. The network architecture is as per = draft-seite-dmm-dma where access routers implement both MAG and LMA = functions (see attached slides for more details); i.e. PMIP runs only = between AR. Dynamic mobility is also shown: PMIP signaling comes into = play only when the MN performs handover otherwise, standard IP routing = applies. Regarding implementation, Network elements and streaming server = are Linux virtual machines, all on a single laptop.=20 >=20 > I hope to see you at the demo :-) > Pierrick >=20 >> -----Message d'origine----- >> De : ext-bruno.faria@nokia.com [mailto:ext-bruno.faria@nokia.com] >> Envoy=E9 : jeudi 1 mars 2012 22:10 >> =C0 : SEITE Pierrick RD-RESA-REN; mext@ietf.org >> Cc : dmm@ietf.org >> Objet : RE: DMM demo >>=20 >> Hello Pierrick, >>=20 >> That seems to be very interesting. >> Can you point out some information about that implementation? >>=20 >> Rgds, >>=20 >> - Bruno >>=20 >>> -----Original Message----- >>> From: mext-bounces@ietf.org [mailto:mext-bounces@ietf.org] On Behalf >> Of >>> ext pierrick.seite@orange.com >>> Sent: quinta-feira, 1 de mar=E7o de 2012 09:04 >>> To: mext@ietf.org >>> Cc: dmm@ietf.org >>> Subject: [MEXT] DMM demo >>>=20 >>>=20 >>> Hello all, >>>=20 >>>=20 >>> We will take the opportunity of the IETF#83 to show a demonstration = of >>> distributed mobility management (DMM), based on the following draft: >>>=20 >>> http://www.ietf.org/id/draft-seite-dmm-dma-00.txt >>>=20 >>> We will make the demo after DMM meeting (03/29), during lunch time. >> I'll >>> communicate the exact location as soon as I'm able to. >>>=20 >>> BR, >>> Pierrick >>> _______________________________________________ >>> MEXT mailing list >>> MEXT@ietf.org >>> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/mext > _______________________________________________ > dmm mailing list > dmm@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dmm From julien.ietf@gmail.com Fri Mar 2 13:59:36 2012 Return-Path: X-Original-To: dmm@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: dmm@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5204C21E8019; Fri, 2 Mar 2012 13:59:36 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -3.599 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-3.599 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-2.599, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW=-1] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([12.22.58.30]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id fnHVPayO4B0z; Fri, 2 Mar 2012 13:59:35 -0800 (PST) Received: from mail-yx0-f172.google.com (mail-yx0-f172.google.com [209.85.213.172]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id B78D221E8013; Fri, 2 Mar 2012 13:59:35 -0800 (PST) Received: by yenm5 with SMTP id m5so1153889yen.31 for ; Fri, 02 Mar 2012 13:59:35 -0800 (PST) Received-SPF: pass (google.com: domain of julien.ietf@gmail.com designates 10.236.191.105 as permitted sender) client-ip=10.236.191.105; Authentication-Results: mr.google.com; spf=pass (google.com: domain of julien.ietf@gmail.com designates 10.236.191.105 as permitted sender) smtp.mail=julien.ietf@gmail.com; dkim=pass header.i=julien.ietf@gmail.com Received: from mr.google.com ([10.236.191.105]) by 10.236.191.105 with SMTP id f69mr16545828yhn.23.1330725575404 (num_hops = 1); Fri, 02 Mar 2012 13:59:35 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20120113; h=mime-version:date:message-id:subject:from:to:cc:content-type; bh=h0bck2bPtM/2hXO65vWkel2oFqqJ6QyMXgPYnLR43Zs=; b=VuS94mKoaApv6JJKC6pc0JqsRELWOwPg0xEa5Y4Q7QyvpnVnEHnhwdedgLAajg5IUK YgOddoyi98kZQGE4xWx+oH92Yn7O7/GxxjjnT3kOEJd/03Cv99OSaHAQLfaQCCxP2kys cHjWSVbxJQYqR9D7HW4HwvSUoL5yqwjFRN2xIZcsUYxWtuMS3PU5to5oocO+LGepjYp/ skrf7H/POYyoSRN05kHpQbKNP5vN8mMyQ60p0nlaWUyfoo5Jw9AOYs6bYhTKW5AZmZoq 4kZDXrWsgvGmRqVJG/8LZ7RfKdweO+nEafSn4PI/9cpX+xvU/JW0yjUy+pf103IA7L5e aUEQ== MIME-Version: 1.0 Received: by 10.236.191.105 with SMTP id f69mr13115158yhn.23.1330725575255; Fri, 02 Mar 2012 13:59:35 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.147.122.19 with HTTP; Fri, 2 Mar 2012 13:59:35 -0800 (PST) Date: Fri, 2 Mar 2012 13:59:35 -0800 Message-ID: From: Julien Laganier To: mext@ietf.org, dmm@ietf.org Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Subject: [dmm] DMM WG mailing list moving from mext@ietf.org to dmm@ietf.org X-BeenThere: dmm@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.12 Precedence: list List-Id: Distributed Mobility Management List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 02 Mar 2012 21:59:36 -0000 Folks, Effective immediately the DMM WG mailing list has been moved from the mext@ietf.org list to the dmm@ietf.org. This changed had been requested by a number of folks and the chairs believed it would be more consistent to implement it. We have also mass-subscribed all the mext@ietf.org subscribers to dmm@ietf.org to make the change as seamless as possible. Please take some time to verify that your subscription to dmm@ietf.org is effective. >From now on, please post messages to dmm@ietf.org. The old mext@ietf.org mailing list will be closed and the message archive will remain available online. Thank you. -- julien & jouni From h.anthony.chan@huawei.com Fri Mar 2 22:49:58 2012 Return-Path: X-Original-To: dmm@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: dmm@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id BCF5021E8046; Fri, 2 Mar 2012 22:49:58 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -6.599 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-6.599 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-2.599, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-4] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([12.22.58.30]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id KHQ6xLZEq0Dy; Fri, 2 Mar 2012 22:49:58 -0800 (PST) Received: from szxga01-in.huawei.com (szxga01-in.huawei.com [119.145.14.64]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id B679621E803B; Fri, 2 Mar 2012 22:49:57 -0800 (PST) Received: from huawei.com (szxga05-in [172.24.2.49]) by szxga05-in.huawei.com (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 2.14 (built Aug 8 2006)) with ESMTP id <0M0A00GKTQYYVG@szxga05-in.huawei.com>; Sat, 03 Mar 2012 14:49:46 +0800 (CST) Received: from szxrg01-dlp.huawei.com ([172.24.2.119]) by szxga05-in.huawei.com (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 2.14 (built Aug 8 2006)) with ESMTP id <0M0A006IQQYYRU@szxga05-in.huawei.com>; Sat, 03 Mar 2012 14:49:46 +0800 (CST) Received: from szxeml212-edg.china.huawei.com ([172.24.2.119]) by szxrg01-dlp.huawei.com (MOS 4.1.9-GA) with ESMTP id AHF16862; Sat, 03 Mar 2012 14:49:42 +0800 Received: from SZXEML433-HUB.china.huawei.com (10.72.61.61) by szxeml212-edg.china.huawei.com (172.24.2.181) with Microsoft SMTP Server (TLS) id 14.1.323.3; Sat, 03 Mar 2012 14:49:29 +0800 Received: from SZXEML505-MBX.china.huawei.com ([169.254.1.179]) by szxeml433-hub.china.huawei.com ([10.72.61.61]) with mapi id 14.01.0323.003; Sat, 03 Mar 2012 14:49:39 +0800 Date: Sat, 03 Mar 2012 06:49:39 +0000 From: h chan In-reply-to: <494B8B97-093D-4886-88D7-F1A2EF065BB4@gmail.com> X-Originating-IP: [10.47.138.232] To: jouni korhonen , "mext@ietf.org" Message-id: <6E31144C030982429702B11D6746B98C1D57B432@SZXEML505-MBX.china.huawei.com> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-language: en-US Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Accept-Language: en-US, zh-CN Thread-topic: [dmm] Agenda call for DMM meeting in IETF#83 Thread-index: AQHM9TR1R6bYVI7MA0exrTRe93fSTZZYI1Gg X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: X-CFilter-Loop: Reflected References: <494B8B97-093D-4886-88D7-F1A2EF065BB4@gmail.com> Cc: mext chair , "dmm@ietf.org" Subject: Re: [DMM] [dmm] Agenda call for DMM meeting in IETF#83 X-BeenThere: dmm@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.12 Precedence: list List-Id: Distributed Mobility Management Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sat, 03 Mar 2012 06:49:58 -0000 Jouni and Julien, I have re-submitted the problem statement document which contains a draft of requirements into the following new draft: Requirements of distributed mobility management draft-chan-dmm-requirements-00 It is an attempt to draft the dmm requirements to address the problems described in the proposed problem statement. Please allocate 10 minutes to discuss. ----------------------------------------------- I have also submitted the following new draft: An architecture of distributed mobility management using mip and pmip draft-chan-dmm-architecture-00 It suggests a generic framework to construct/describe some different designs of dmm using mip and pmip . Part of the content is taken from the previous draft: Distributed Local Mobility Anchors draft-chan-netext-distributed-lma-03 in 2010 but has not been presented. It is now rewritten into an architectural description document with other new materials in this new draft. Please allocate 20 minutes to present. H Anthony Chan -----Original Message----- From: dmm-bounces@ietf.org [mailto:dmm-bounces@ietf.org] On Behalf Of jouni korhonen Sent: Monday, February 27, 2012 3:44 AM To: mext@ietf.org Cc: mext chair; dmm@ietf.org Subject: [dmm] Agenda call for DMM meeting in IETF#83 Folks, Our WG meeting has been scheduled to Thursday morning session I, which means we have full 2.5h time. If you want to have a presentation slot, send a request to the chairs with abstract, your I-D name, time needed and why you think the presentation is needed. - Jouni & Julien _______________________________________________ dmm mailing list dmm@ietf.org https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dmm From luo.wen@zte.com.cn Sun Mar 4 22:41:30 2012 Return-Path: X-Original-To: dmm@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: dmm@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id DEC8E11E8083; Sun, 4 Mar 2012 22:41:30 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -90.376 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-90.376 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_40=-0.185, CHARSET_FARAWAY_HEADER=3.2, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, MIME_8BIT_HEADER=0.3, MIME_BASE64_TEXT=1.753, MIME_CHARSET_FARAWAY=2.45, RCVD_DOUBLE_IP_LOOSE=0.76, SARE_SUB_ENC_GB2312=1.345, USER_IN_WHITELIST=-100] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([12.22.58.30]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 7l7Kq0BrRNyL; 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Mon, 5 Mar 2012 10:21:44 +0100 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft Exchange V6.5 Content-class: urn:content-classes:message MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Date: Mon, 5 Mar 2012 10:21:42 +0100 Message-ID: <843DA8228A1BA74CA31FB4E111A5C462023843A7@ftrdmel0.rd.francetelecom.fr> In-Reply-To: <24781946-D433-4A8C-9116-2543C6E183EC@us.toyota-itc.com> X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: Thread-Topic: [dmm] [MEXT] DMM demo Thread-Index: Acz4oL0WeamNK4thQNCy5mWiA5qoqwCDaNMw References: <494B8B97-093D-4886-88D7-F1A2EF065BB4@gmail.com> <843DA8228A1BA74CA31FB4E111A5C46202383F89@ftrdmel0.rd.francetelecom.fr> <843DA8228A1BA74CA31FB4E111A5C4620238414D@ftrdmel0.rd.francetelecom.fr> <24781946-D433-4A8C-9116-2543C6E183EC@us.toyota-itc.com> From: To: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 05 Mar 2012 09:21:44.0797 (UTC) FILETIME=[620B60D0:01CCFAB1] Cc: dmm@ietf.org, mext@ietf.org Subject: Re: [DMM] [dmm] [MEXT] DMM demo X-BeenThere: dmm@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.12 Precedence: list List-Id: Distributed Mobility Management Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 05 Mar 2012 09:21:46 -0000 Hi Romain, This implementation is not based on UMIP, this is a home-made mobility = protocol. BR, Pierrick > -----Message d'origine----- > De=A0: Romain KUNTZ [mailto:rkuntz@us.toyota-itc.com] > Envoy=E9=A0: vendredi 2 mars 2012 19:18 > =C0=A0: SEITE Pierrick RD-RESA-REN > Cc=A0: ext-bruno.faria@nokia.com; mext@ietf.org; dmm@ietf.org > Objet=A0: Re: [dmm] [MEXT] DMM demo >=20 > Hello Pierrick, >=20 > Just for my information, is your implementation based on UMIP > (http://www.umip.org)? >=20 > Thanks, > Romain >=20 > On Mar 2, 2012, at 1:43, > wrote: >=20 > > Hi Bruno, > > > > Thanks for your interest. The demo illustrates a PMIPv6 based > distributed mobility on a Wifi network, with 2 or 3 wifi APs. We show > IP continuity on a video streaming. The network architecture is as per > draft-seite-dmm-dma where access routers implement both MAG and LMA > functions (see attached slides for more details); i.e. PMIP runs only > between AR. Dynamic mobility is also shown: PMIP signaling comes into > play only when the MN performs handover otherwise, standard IP routing > applies. Regarding implementation, Network elements and streaming > server are Linux virtual machines, all on a single laptop. > > > > I hope to see you at the demo :-) > > Pierrick > > > >> -----Message d'origine----- > >> De : ext-bruno.faria@nokia.com [mailto:ext-bruno.faria@nokia.com] > >> Envoy=E9 : jeudi 1 mars 2012 22:10 > >> =C0 : SEITE Pierrick RD-RESA-REN; mext@ietf.org > >> Cc : dmm@ietf.org > >> Objet : RE: DMM demo > >> > >> Hello Pierrick, > >> > >> That seems to be very interesting. > >> Can you point out some information about that implementation? > >> > >> Rgds, > >> > >> - Bruno > >> > >>> -----Original Message----- > >>> From: mext-bounces@ietf.org [mailto:mext-bounces@ietf.org] On > Behalf > >> Of > >>> ext pierrick.seite@orange.com > >>> Sent: quinta-feira, 1 de mar=E7o de 2012 09:04 > >>> To: mext@ietf.org > >>> Cc: dmm@ietf.org > >>> Subject: [MEXT] DMM demo > >>> > >>> > >>> Hello all, > >>> > >>> > >>> We will take the opportunity of the IETF#83 to show a = demonstration > of > >>> distributed mobility management (DMM), based on the following > draft: > >>> > >>> http://www.ietf.org/id/draft-seite-dmm-dma-00.txt > >>> > >>> We will make the demo after DMM meeting (03/29), during lunch = time. > >> I'll > >>> communicate the exact location as soon as I'm able to. > >>> > >>> BR, > >>> Pierrick > >>> _______________________________________________ > >>> MEXT mailing list > >>> MEXT@ietf.org > >>> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/mext > > _______________________________________________ > > dmm mailing list > > dmm@ietf.org > > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dmm From maxpassion@gmail.com Mon Mar 5 03:06:32 2012 Return-Path: X-Original-To: dmm@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: dmm@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id B41F521F8711; Mon, 5 Mar 2012 03:06:32 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -3.4 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-3.4 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.199, BAYES_00=-2.599, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW=-1] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([12.22.58.30]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id jy+sms7SJRrB; Mon, 5 Mar 2012 03:06:32 -0800 (PST) Received: from mail-iy0-f172.google.com (mail-iy0-f172.google.com [209.85.210.172]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id DF5B021F8700; Mon, 5 Mar 2012 03:06:31 -0800 (PST) Received: by iazz13 with SMTP id z13so6329198iaz.31 for ; Mon, 05 Mar 2012 03:06:31 -0800 (PST) Received-SPF: pass (google.com: domain of maxpassion@gmail.com designates 10.50.179.98 as permitted sender) client-ip=10.50.179.98; Authentication-Results: mr.google.com; spf=pass (google.com: domain of maxpassion@gmail.com designates 10.50.179.98 as permitted sender) smtp.mail=maxpassion@gmail.com; dkim=pass header.i=maxpassion@gmail.com Received: from mr.google.com ([10.50.179.98]) by 10.50.179.98 with SMTP id df2mr6181061igc.32.1330945591669 (num_hops = 1); Mon, 05 Mar 2012 03:06:31 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20120113; h=mime-version:in-reply-to:references:date:message-id:subject:from:to :cc:content-type; bh=w5lQXoyZB1GPz/HCHdftn9bkfcw7tqH1kep24nO2HjQ=; b=0HWpGkM55YQFt6tuz80Go7QWnK5Ck9H1X9Pd4cR77gAaFvOlbLiUdHKLVjnQ8huQxW kdYP51rh+nWxvypiKbRLUffExwMSsmQkkb9YUA1+PfxeBJhDm0qO8fv7K8altosgv5/V wID/NCowGO1drMkWh2PPyU+pgVIBUYojdIwyiHR7t46zV6Qc21i9LqQbqn1UfBqmzpPc /snrjKD1GvskEuNUL053YQVW1DjrulJLlBJ1Q29CcNdU8wKIJ7FlZw0SWuroYyHs9ysd 3fNQKuWjXecm1fGPMtK+FApUUNUdBedpbl5k8rI6nZOhqqzO16nxoY3XTw58t82NkoDI lvzg== MIME-Version: 1.0 Received: by 10.50.179.98 with SMTP id df2mr5137330igc.32.1330945591615; Mon, 05 Mar 2012 03:06:31 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.42.161.74 with HTTP; Mon, 5 Mar 2012 03:06:31 -0800 (PST) In-Reply-To: <494B8B97-093D-4886-88D7-F1A2EF065BB4@gmail.com> References: <494B8B97-093D-4886-88D7-F1A2EF065BB4@gmail.com> Date: Mon, 5 Mar 2012 19:06:31 +0800 Message-ID: From: liu dapeng To: jouni korhonen Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Cc: mext chair , dmm@ietf.org, mext@ietf.org Subject: Re: [DMM] [dmm] Agenda call for DMM meeting in IETF#83 X-BeenThere: dmm@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.12 Precedence: list List-Id: Distributed Mobility Management Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 05 Mar 2012 11:06:32 -0000 Hello Jouni, I have several drafts want to present: draft-liu-dmm-dynamic-anchor-discussion-00.txt draft-liu-dmm-address-selection-00 draft-liu-dmm-mobility-api-00 draft-perkins-dmm-matrix-03 15 minutes should be OK. thanks! Regards, -Dapeng Liu 2012/2/27, jouni korhonen : > Folks, > > Our WG meeting has been scheduled to Thursday morning session I, which > means we have full 2.5h time. If you want to have a presentation slot, > send a request to the chairs with abstract, your I-D name, time needed > and why you think the presentation is needed. > > - Jouni & Julien > _______________________________________________ > dmm mailing list > dmm@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dmm > -- ------ Best Regards, Dapeng Liu From cjbc@it.uc3m.es Mon Mar 5 09:39:55 2012 Return-Path: X-Original-To: dmm@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: dmm@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8079721F8844 for ; Mon, 5 Mar 2012 09:39:55 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -5.699 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-5.699 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-2.599, J_CHICKENPOX_21=0.6, MIME_8BIT_HEADER=0.3, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-4] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([12.22.58.30]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id AXdMucco9PSH for ; Mon, 5 Mar 2012 09:39:54 -0800 (PST) Received: from smtp02.uc3m.es (smtp02.uc3m.es [163.117.176.132]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8513D21F8835 for ; Mon, 5 Mar 2012 09:39:54 -0800 (PST) X-uc3m-safe: yes Received: from [163.117.139.72] (acorde.it.uc3m.es [163.117.139.72]) (using TLSv1 with cipher AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by smtp02.uc3m.es (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3E63B6BA041 for ; Mon, 5 Mar 2012 18:39:52 +0100 (CET) Message-ID: <1330969192.3680.35.camel@acorde.it.uc3m.es> From: Carlos =?ISO-8859-1?Q?Jes=FAs?= Bernardos Cano To: dmm@ietf.org Date: Mon, 05 Mar 2012 18:39:52 +0100 Organization: Universidad Carlos III de Madrid Content-Type: multipart/signed; micalg="pgp-sha1"; protocol="application/pgp-signature"; boundary="=-B7xGuOzTfgo9rDaGE5N3" X-Mailer: Evolution 3.2.2-1 Mime-Version: 1.0 X-TM-AS-Product-Ver: IMSS-7.0.0.3116-6.8.0.1017-18756.000 Subject: [DMM] New DMM draft: draft-bernardos-dmm-distributed-anchoring-00.txt X-BeenThere: dmm@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.12 Precedence: list Reply-To: cjbc@it.uc3m.es List-Id: Distributed Mobility Management Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 05 Mar 2012 17:39:55 -0000 --=-B7xGuOzTfgo9rDaGE5N3 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="ISO-8859-15" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Dear all, We've just submitted a new I-D on the DMM space. The draft describes a network-based DMM approach extending PMIPv6, and focusing on the required extensions to effectively support simultaneously anchoring several flows at different distributed anchors. As usual, comments would be warmly welcomed! More info below: Title : PMIPv6-based distributed anchoring Author(s) : Carlos J. Bernardos Juan Carlos Zuniga Filename : draft-bernardos-dmm-distributed-anchoring-00.txt Pages : 23 Date : 2012-03-05 Distributed Mobility Management solutions allow for setting up networks so that traffic is distributed in an optimal way and does not rely on centralized deployed anchors to provide IP mobility support. There are many different approaches to address Distributed Mobility Management, as for example extending network-based mobility protocols (like Proxy Mobile IPv6), or client-based mobility protocols (as Mobile IPv6), among others. This document follows the former approach, and proposes a solution based on Proxy Mobile IPv6 in which mobility sessions are anchored at the last IP hop router (called distributed gateway). The distributed gateway is an enhanced access router which is also able to operate as local mobility anchor or mobility access gateway, on a per prefix basis. The draft focuses on the required extensions to effectively support simultaneously anchoring several flows at different distributed gateways. This draft introduces the concept of distributed logical interface (at the distributed gateway), which is a software construct that allows to easily hide the change of anchor from the mobile node. Additionally, the draft describes how to provide session continuity in inter-domain scenarios in which dynamic tunneling or signaling between distributed gateways from different operators is not allowed. A URL for this Internet-Draft is: http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-bernardos-dmm-distributed-anchori= ng-00.txt Thanks, Carlos --=20 Carlos Jes=FAs Bernardos Cano http://www.netcom.it.uc3m.es/ GPG FP: D29B 0A6A 639A A561 93CA 4D55 35DC BA4D D170 4F67 --=-B7xGuOzTfgo9rDaGE5N3 Content-Type: application/pgp-signature; name="signature.asc" Content-Description: This is a digitally signed message part Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.4.11 (GNU/Linux) iEYEABECAAYFAk9U+mgACgkQNdy6TdFwT2fwFwCgsxWnldy2WTCokDcYeZTlPlfz 1KkAnAi4FNnqYEY6TSD1Uv2xxtNB0Isk =7XOo -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --=-B7xGuOzTfgo9rDaGE5N3-- From Basavaraj.Patil@nokia.com Mon Mar 5 11:28:01 2012 Return-Path: X-Original-To: dmm@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: dmm@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id BDA7E21F8931 for ; Mon, 5 Mar 2012 11:28:01 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -104.978 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-104.978 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=1.621, BAYES_00=-2.599, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-4, USER_IN_WHITELIST=-100] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([12.22.58.30]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id q-VRMVPxCKCu for ; Mon, 5 Mar 2012 11:28:01 -0800 (PST) Received: from mgw-sa02.nokia.com (smtp.nokia.com [147.243.1.48]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id C714C21F8930 for ; Mon, 5 Mar 2012 11:27:54 -0800 (PST) Received: from vaebh102.NOE.Nokia.com (in-mx.nokia.com [10.160.244.23]) by mgw-sa02.nokia.com (Switch-3.4.4/Switch-3.4.4) with ESMTP id q25JRrFS031440 for ; Mon, 5 Mar 2012 21:27:53 +0200 Received: from smtp.mgd.nokia.com ([65.54.30.20]) by vaebh102.NOE.Nokia.com over TLS secured channel with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.4675); Mon, 5 Mar 2012 21:27:53 +0200 Received: from 008-AM1MPN1-073.mgdnok.nokia.com ([169.254.3.150]) by 008-AM1MMR1-011.mgdnok.nokia.com ([65.54.30.20]) with mapi id 14.01.0355.003; Mon, 5 Mar 2012 20:27:52 +0100 From: To: Thread-Topic: New Version Notification for draft-patil-dmm-issues-and-approaches2dmm-00.txt Thread-Index: AQHM+wYP1WX/mw6vJEaproFE99ew5A== Date: Mon, 5 Mar 2012 19:27:52 +0000 Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <20120305192649.8275.39953.idtracker@ietfa.amsl.com> Accept-Language: en-US Content-Language: en-US X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: user-agent: Microsoft-MacOutlook/14.14.0.111121 x-originating-ip: [172.19.59.18] Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-ID: Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable MIME-Version: 1.0 X-OriginalArrivalTime: 05 Mar 2012 19:27:53.0575 (UTC) FILETIME=[0F867F70:01CCFB06] X-Nokia-AV: Clean Subject: [DMM] FW: New Version Notification for draft-patil-dmm-issues-and-approaches2dmm-00.txt X-BeenThere: dmm@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.12 Precedence: list List-Id: Distributed Mobility Management Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 05 Mar 2012 19:28:01 -0000 >A new version of I-D, draft-patil-dmm-issues-and-approaches2dmm-00.txt >has been successfully submitted by Basavaraj Patil and posted to the IETF >repository. > >Filename: draft-patil-dmm-issues-and-approaches2dmm >Revision: 00 >Title: Approaches to Distributed mobility management using Mobile IPv6 >and its extensions >Creation date: 2012-03-05 >WG ID: Individual Submission >Number of pages: 13 > >Abstract: > Mobility solutions at the IP layer have been specified in the IETF > for IPv4 and IPv6. These solutions include host and network based > mobility. All of the mobility protocols enable IP session continuity > by providing the mobile host with an IP address or prefix that > remains constant even as the host moves and attaches to different > access networks and points of attachment. Mobile hosts are anchored > at a gateway via a tunnel and the address/prefix provided to the host > via the gateway remains unchanged across mobility events. All IP > sessions initiated or terminated at a mobile host are anchored via > the gateway. A gateway centric approach such as Mobile IP, raises > certain concerns in terms of cost and efficiency. A mobility model > wherein the network entities enabling mobility are distributed is a > way of alleviating the concerns of a gateway centric approach. This > document considers ways to alleviate anchored mobility issues with > approaches that could be considered in a deployment. > > =20 > =20 From Peter.McCann@huawei.com Tue Mar 6 06:39:07 2012 Return-Path: X-Original-To: dmm@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: dmm@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id B944F21F8934 for ; Tue, 6 Mar 2012 06:39:07 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.599 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.599 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-2.599] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([12.22.58.30]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id OUYiI6aupueN for ; Tue, 6 Mar 2012 06:39:07 -0800 (PST) Received: from dfwrgout.huawei.com (dfwrgout.huawei.com [206.16.17.72]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1A0C521F8892 for ; Tue, 6 Mar 2012 06:39:07 -0800 (PST) Received: from 172.18.9.243 (EHLO dfweml201-edg.china.huawei.com) ([172.18.9.243]) by dfwrg01-dlp.huawei.com (MOS 4.2.3-GA FastPath) with ESMTP id AED60068; Tue, 06 Mar 2012 09:39:05 -0500 (EST) Received: from DFWEML407-HUB.china.huawei.com (10.193.5.132) by dfweml201-edg.china.huawei.com (172.18.9.107) with Microsoft SMTP Server (TLS) id 14.1.323.3; Tue, 6 Mar 2012 06:36:52 -0800 Received: from DFWEML504-MBX.china.huawei.com ([10.124.31.30]) by dfweml407-hub.china.huawei.com ([10.193.5.132]) with mapi id 14.01.0323.003; Tue, 6 Mar 2012 22:36:56 +0800 From: Peter McCann To: "dmm@ietf.org" Thread-Topic: draft-mccann-dmm-flatarch-00.txt Thread-Index: Acz7ppM5+XaI77SoQaqa8Y3fzGKc1w== Date: Tue, 6 Mar 2012 14:36:54 +0000 Message-ID: <5963DDF1F751474D8DEEFDCDBEE43AE716447C77@dfweml504-mbx> Accept-Language: en-US, zh-CN Content-Language: en-US X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: x-originating-ip: [10.193.125.95] Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable MIME-Version: 1.0 X-CFilter-Loop: Reflected Subject: [DMM] draft-mccann-dmm-flatarch-00.txt X-BeenThere: dmm@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.12 Precedence: list List-Id: Distributed Mobility Management Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 06 Mar 2012 14:39:07 -0000 Hi, all, On Friday I submitted a new draft that outlines what I think is a novel approach to mobility management in a totally flat network. The draft can be found here: http://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-mccann-dmm-flatarch-00 Abstract Today's mobility management schemes make use of a hierarchy of tunnels from a relatively fixed anchor point, through one or more intermediate nodes, to reach the MN's current point of attachment. These schemes suffer from poor performance, scalability, and failure modes due to the centralization and statefulness of the anchor point(s). The dmm (Distributed Mobility Management) working group is currently chartered to investigate alternative solutions that will provide greater performance, scalability, and robustness through the distribution of mobility anchors. This document is an input to the dmm discussion. It outlines a problem statement for the existing mobility management techniques and goes on to propose (high-level) solutions to two of the most vexing problems: MN authentication and mobility management in a fully distributed, flat (non-hierarchical) access network. These two aspects are often treated separately in a layered architecture, but we argue there are important advantages to considering how these two functions can work in tandem to provide a simple and robust framework for the design of a wireless Internet Service Provider network. I'd like some time to present this draft during the meeting in Paris, hopefully 15 minutes. -- Peter J. McCann Huawei Technologies (USA) Peter.McCann@Huawei.com +1 908 541 3563 Rm. C-0105, 400 Crossings Blvd. (2nd floor), Bridgewater, NJ 08807-2863 U= SA From sarikaya2012@gmail.com Tue Mar 6 10:01:18 2012 Return-Path: X-Original-To: dmm@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: dmm@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3EA2E11E8076; Tue, 6 Mar 2012 10:01:18 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -3.559 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-3.559 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.040, BAYES_00=-2.599, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW=-1] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([12.22.58.30]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id T-b4eBqsruVS; Tue, 6 Mar 2012 10:01:17 -0800 (PST) Received: from mail-yx0-f172.google.com (mail-yx0-f172.google.com [209.85.213.172]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 01C0711E8075; Tue, 6 Mar 2012 10:01:16 -0800 (PST) Received: by yenm5 with SMTP id m5so2694071yen.31 for ; Tue, 06 Mar 2012 10:01:16 -0800 (PST) Received-SPF: pass (google.com: domain of sarikaya2012@gmail.com designates 10.100.212.4 as permitted sender) client-ip=10.100.212.4; Authentication-Results: mr.google.com; spf=pass (google.com: domain of sarikaya2012@gmail.com designates 10.100.212.4 as permitted sender) smtp.mail=sarikaya2012@gmail.com; dkim=pass header.i=sarikaya2012@gmail.com Received: from mr.google.com ([10.100.212.4]) by 10.100.212.4 with SMTP id k4mr11017503ang.35.1331056876689 (num_hops = 1); Tue, 06 Mar 2012 10:01:16 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20120113; h=mime-version:reply-to:date:message-id:subject:from:to:cc :content-type; bh=/UOmZnrLLoalj4P7TkM81us1dI7BTG9DibDqj7dwleo=; b=N23e7FlM+0pxBKCFUljMoaCfXKhy3jLtlm9qgcfRMVzyTaXNNh20rdBTp1sjB6rlpD KIqPm7UdFvyTITgDLOXAA3aokzjMbXl6AhBKXJjxpJ7ukeoxHo3PDXAkd3GRCzyrKVF2 SQiOLryUQSjtpAgjaOAuLtZJQA3Pzn+kocmi15pmhQ2cXxrfplNWN2D66dBeUlf87qMD Uisaj44WDI1xsE7kn8kTPn9xY9IqrlPNwvMrqpQRRRUHpiHByr/63woGjYwFwuebdryd UY17fFFwe/zc+WlazfqG+8uCDgLj9Cr2iI+cgu/vKA5ADsAGAERREBZ6ao4UmPWQDjdG 3iLQ== MIME-Version: 1.0 Received: by 10.100.212.4 with SMTP id k4mr8727102ang.35.1331056876570; Tue, 06 Mar 2012 10:01:16 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.236.9.73 with HTTP; Tue, 6 Mar 2012 10:01:16 -0800 (PST) Date: Tue, 6 Mar 2012 12:01:16 -0600 Message-ID: From: Behcet Sarikaya To: dmm@ietf.org, netext@ietf.org, mip4@ietf.org, multimob@ietf.org Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Subject: [DMM] FMC Bar BoF at IETF 83 X-BeenThere: dmm@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.12 Precedence: list Reply-To: sarikaya@ieee.org List-Id: Distributed Mobility Management Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 06 Mar 2012 18:01:18 -0000 This is to announce that we have requested a slot for a Bar BoF in Paris on Fixed Mobile Convergence as follows: Tuesday March 28 at 19:30 There has been (business) announcements in the internet like beyond stating that FMC is currently still a hot topic (and finally a MUST facing decreasing revenue challenges) for many network and service operators - reflected in the manufacturing industry for infrastructure equipment as well as user terminals - and creating requirements on the interworking between fixed and mobile networks which - from an Intarea point of view - focus on - User Equipment identification and authentication, - Femto Access Point management, - user device type identification and - mobility considerations e.g. as support within fixed networks and differentiation on different session flows from terminal/user perspective. see also http://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-xue-intarea-fmc-ps-00 In the Bar BOF we want to discuss these issues and eventually others. If you have a presentation to make, drop us a note. Behcet & Dirk From Peter.McCann@huawei.com Tue Mar 6 12:57:59 2012 Return-Path: X-Original-To: dmm@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: dmm@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3A93E21E80A3 for ; Tue, 6 Mar 2012 12:57:59 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.599 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.599 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-2.599] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([12.22.58.30]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id wWdojEwVUe2a for ; Tue, 6 Mar 2012 12:57:58 -0800 (PST) Received: from dfwrgout.huawei.com (dfwrgout.huawei.com [206.16.17.72]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7DFE521E8024 for ; Tue, 6 Mar 2012 12:57:58 -0800 (PST) Received: from 172.18.9.243 (EHLO dfweml201-edg.china.huawei.com) ([172.18.9.243]) by dfwrg02-dlp.huawei.com (MOS 4.2.3-GA FastPath) with ESMTP id ADV77056; Tue, 06 Mar 2012 15:57:58 -0500 (EST) Received: from DFWEML403-HUB.china.huawei.com (10.193.5.151) by dfweml201-edg.china.huawei.com (172.18.9.107) with Microsoft SMTP Server (TLS) id 14.1.323.3; Tue, 6 Mar 2012 12:55:34 -0800 Received: from DFWEML504-MBX.china.huawei.com ([10.124.31.30]) by dfweml403-hub.china.huawei.com ([10.193.5.151]) with mapi id 14.01.0323.003; Tue, 6 Mar 2012 12:55:38 -0800 From: Peter McCann To: "cjbc@it.uc3m.es" , "JuanCarlos.Zuniga@InterDigital.com" Thread-Topic: Review of draft-bernardos-dmm-distributed-anchoring-00 Thread-Index: Acz723tn3ojL6DPBTKCm/gMVBH+bvQ== Date: Tue, 6 Mar 2012 20:55:38 +0000 Message-ID: <5963DDF1F751474D8DEEFDCDBEE43AE716447E15@dfweml504-mbx> Accept-Language: en-US, zh-CN Content-Language: en-US X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: x-originating-ip: [10.193.125.95] Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable MIME-Version: 1.0 X-CFilter-Loop: Reflected Cc: "dmm@ietf.org" Subject: [DMM] Review of draft-bernardos-dmm-distributed-anchoring-00 X-BeenThere: dmm@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.12 Precedence: list List-Id: Distributed Mobility Management Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 06 Mar 2012 20:57:59 -0000 Hi, Carlos, Juan-Carlos, I have read draft-bernardos-dmm-distributed-anchoring-00, and I have a few comments. First, I want to bring up something that I think is common to several of the DMM proposals, and that is sub-optimal use of the backhaul resources. It seems that when you use an AR as an anchor point, and move to a new AR, the traffic for that session has to traverse the backhaul 3 times in each direction, like this: ----- | Rtr | / ^ -----\ 1 / / 2 \ 3 v / v ---- ---- | AR | | AR | ---- ---- Although it may seem at odds with the goal of "distributing" mobility to use the crossover router as the point of traffic redirection, it would make for much more optimal use of the backhaul resources. I believe it is poss= ible to route the traffic more optimally with a standard off-the-shelf router at the crossover point (using mechanisms detailed in draft-mccann-dmm-flatarch= -00). Second, I like the idea of moving the prefix assigned to the MN from one AR to another. However, why do we need to keep the AR's MAC address the same? IPv6 should handle the failover of a first-hop router from one instance to = another with no problems. You see the same prefix advertised from a different MAC = address; what's the big deal? You can just keep using the prefix as you did before,= addressing packets to the new access router. Third, I don't like the idea of having to ship so much state around the net= work through the HSS. In your draft you talk about (out-of-scope) mechanisms to= get the prefix and the anchor gateway address to the new D-GW. There is also t= he complication of knowing which prior prefixes the MN wants to keep at its new attachment = point. It seems to me that we should avoid the behavior that a new prefix is alway= s assigned at each new point of attachment; rather, we should force the MN to take som= e sort of affirmative action to acquire an address/prefix for its use, such as DHCP-P= D. This would be done occasionally, not on every handover, and the MN could registe= r its intent to keep an address through e.g., dynamic DNS update. Then the new D-GW cou= ld lookup the DNS name of the MN at the time it attaches, see the list of addresses t= hat are currently assigned, and take steps to attract the packets for those prefixe= s. This could be a tunnel or it could be a BGP UPDATE as outlined in draft-mccann-d= mm-flatarch-00. Finally, I don't quite understand the "Local Prefixes" concept presented in= the draft. I understand how LIPA is supposed to work, but I don't understand why you n= eed to treat such prefixes differently from any other prefix on the D-GW1 link. You are= tunneling all the traffic back to the D-GW1 AR, correct? Wouldn't the traffic just n= aturally follow the proper path through to the D-GW1 and from there to the local CN? Personally, I think it might be better to use client-based Mobile IP for an= y scenario where the current AR cannot attract the packets for a given prefix, such as= when the MN moves out of the domain of one operator. That situation is very similar= to the LIPA case and could be solved with a single mechanism. Looking forward to continued discussion, -Pete -- Peter J. McCann Huawei Technologies (USA) Peter.McCann@Huawei.com +1 908 541 3563 Rm. C-0105, 400 Crossings Blvd. (2nd floor), Bridgewater, NJ 08807-2863 U= SA From Peter.McCann@huawei.com Tue Mar 6 13:49:10 2012 Return-Path: X-Original-To: dmm@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: dmm@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 698FE21E8013 for ; Tue, 6 Mar 2012 13:49:10 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.599 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.599 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-2.599] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([12.22.58.30]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id GOVVYJv3GBVH for ; Tue, 6 Mar 2012 13:49:09 -0800 (PST) Received: from dfwrgout.huawei.com (dfwrgout.huawei.com [206.16.17.72]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id BA67E21F8464 for ; Tue, 6 Mar 2012 13:49:09 -0800 (PST) Received: from 172.18.9.243 (EHLO dfweml202-edg.china.huawei.com) ([172.18.9.243]) by dfwrg01-dlp.huawei.com (MOS 4.2.3-GA FastPath) with ESMTP id AED86942; Tue, 06 Mar 2012 16:49:09 -0500 (EST) Received: from DFWEML403-HUB.china.huawei.com (10.193.5.151) by dfweml202-edg.china.huawei.com (172.18.9.108) with Microsoft SMTP Server (TLS) id 14.1.323.3; Tue, 6 Mar 2012 13:48:22 -0800 Received: from DFWEML504-MBX.china.huawei.com ([10.124.31.30]) by dfweml403-hub.china.huawei.com ([10.193.5.151]) with mapi id 14.01.0323.003; Tue, 6 Mar 2012 13:48:17 -0800 From: Peter McCann To: "basavaraj.patil@nokia.com" , "carlw@mcsr-labs.org" , "jouni.nospam@gmail.com" Thread-Topic: Comments on draft-patil-dmm-issues-and-approaches2dmm-00 Thread-Index: Acz74tbaKHHVfQwFSOaADK0zCMsIqw== Date: Tue, 6 Mar 2012 21:48:17 +0000 Message-ID: <5963DDF1F751474D8DEEFDCDBEE43AE716447E36@dfweml504-mbx> Accept-Language: en-US, zh-CN Content-Language: en-US X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: x-originating-ip: [10.193.125.95] Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable MIME-Version: 1.0 X-CFilter-Loop: Reflected Cc: "dmm@ietf.org" Subject: [DMM] Comments on draft-patil-dmm-issues-and-approaches2dmm-00 X-BeenThere: dmm@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.12 Precedence: list List-Id: Distributed Mobility Management Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 06 Mar 2012 21:49:10 -0000 Hi, Raj, Carl, and Jouni, I have some comments on draft-patil-dmm-issues-and-approaches2dmm-00. I agree with most of Section 4, "Issues with current mobility models". How= ever, I'd like to point out that existing networks are not just centralized in th= e manner you point out, they also tend to have a hierarchical structure, e.g., the=20 S-GW/P-GW split in 3GPP EPC. Therefore, the issue you outline in Section 4= .3 ("Inefficient Routing and signaling overhead") is not quite true of the 3GP= P EPC, which can handle many mobility events in a localized manner similar to HMIP. The first paragraph of Section 7 talks about source address selection, and = the need to modify applications so that they request the kind of address that t= hey want. I tend to think that applications will remain unmodified for some ti= me to come; however, most applications fit into the paradigm of opening short-= lived connections to a server and could be accommodated with some sort of automat= ic handling in the MN's IP stack. I found the last paragraph of Section 7 quite interesting. I too think tha= t there is an important piece missing that you call "seamless mobility anchor reloc= ation". I think that the use of an interior routing protocol is spot on. In fact, = if you read draft-mccann-dmm-flatarch-00, I propose just that. I think we can use= such an anchor relocation protocol to make each access router in an autonomous s= ystem (or smaller region of an autonomous system) a temporary anchor for a given = prefix. In my draft I propose running I-BGP on each AR and sending BGP UPDATES into= the network upon localized mobility events. Such a protocol can also be used a= s a substitute for the proxy ND technique that is currently specified to "grab"= the MN's packets at the HA. By using a routing protocol, the HA can reach acro= ss several routing hops so it doesn't necessarily need to be on the home link = (which can be the first AR to which the MN attached). I think this would also ena= ble us to unify the authentication protocols used at the AR with the authenticatio= n protocol used at the HA. The ARs are just like HAs that don't have to tunnel the da= ta anywhere because the MN is locally connected. Does it make sense to you? -- Peter J. McCann Huawei Technologies (USA) Peter.McCann@Huawei.com +1 908 541 3563 Rm. C-0105, 400 Crossings Blvd. (2nd floor), Bridgewater, NJ 08807-2863 U= SA From Basavaraj.Patil@nokia.com Tue Mar 6 14:05:23 2012 Return-Path: X-Original-To: dmm@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: dmm@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 660BE21E8013 for ; Tue, 6 Mar 2012 14:05:23 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -105.014 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-105.014 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=1.585, BAYES_00=-2.599, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-4, USER_IN_WHITELIST=-100] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([12.22.58.30]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id ZUUlg88Hiv7B for ; Tue, 6 Mar 2012 14:05:19 -0800 (PST) Received: from mgw-sa01.nokia.com (smtp.nokia.com [147.243.1.47]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3BD8821F8624 for ; Tue, 6 Mar 2012 14:05:18 -0800 (PST) Received: from vaebh101.NOE.Nokia.com (vaebh101.europe.nokia.com [10.160.244.22]) by mgw-sa01.nokia.com (Switch-3.4.4/Switch-3.4.4) with ESMTP id q26M5EDK018123; Wed, 7 Mar 2012 00:05:14 +0200 Received: from smtp.mgd.nokia.com ([65.54.30.61]) by vaebh101.NOE.Nokia.com over TLS secured channel with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.4675); Wed, 7 Mar 2012 00:05:14 +0200 Received: from 008-AM1MPN1-073.mgdnok.nokia.com ([169.254.3.150]) by 008-AM1MMR1-006.mgdnok.nokia.com ([65.54.30.61]) with mapi id 14.01.0355.003; Tue, 6 Mar 2012 23:05:13 +0100 From: To: , , Thread-Topic: Comments on draft-patil-dmm-issues-and-approaches2dmm-00 Thread-Index: Acz74tbaKHHVfQwFSOaADK0zCMsIq///j1+A Date: Tue, 6 Mar 2012 22:05:12 +0000 Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <5963DDF1F751474D8DEEFDCDBEE43AE716447E36@dfweml504-mbx> Accept-Language: en-US Content-Language: en-US X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: user-agent: Microsoft-MacOutlook/14.14.0.111121 x-originating-ip: [172.19.59.40] Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-ID: Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable MIME-Version: 1.0 X-OriginalArrivalTime: 06 Mar 2012 22:05:14.0246 (UTC) FILETIME=[35045260:01CCFBE5] X-Nokia-AV: Clean Cc: dmm@ietf.org Subject: Re: [DMM] Comments on draft-patil-dmm-issues-and-approaches2dmm-00 X-BeenThere: dmm@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.12 Precedence: list List-Id: Distributed Mobility Management Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 06 Mar 2012 22:05:23 -0000 Hi Pete, Thanks for your review and comments. Let me come back to you with responses in the next day or two. -Raj On 3/6/12 3:48 PM, "ext Peter McCann" wrote: >Hi, Raj, Carl, and Jouni, > >I have some comments on draft-patil-dmm-issues-and-approaches2dmm-00. > >I agree with most of Section 4, "Issues with current mobility models". >However, >I'd like to point out that existing networks are not just centralized in >the manner >you point out, they also tend to have a hierarchical structure, e.g., the >S-GW/P-GW split in 3GPP EPC. Therefore, the issue you outline in Section >4.3 >("Inefficient Routing and signaling overhead") is not quite true of the >3GPP >EPC, which can handle many mobility events in a localized manner similar >to >HMIP. > >The first paragraph of Section 7 talks about source address selection, >and the >need to modify applications so that they request the kind of address that >they >want. I tend to think that applications will remain unmodified for some >time >to come; however, most applications fit into the paradigm of opening >short-lived >connections to a server and could be accommodated with some sort of >automatic >handling in the MN's IP stack. > >I found the last paragraph of Section 7 quite interesting. I too think >that there >is an important piece missing that you call "seamless mobility anchor >relocation". >I think that the use of an interior routing protocol is spot on. In >fact, if you >read draft-mccann-dmm-flatarch-00, I propose just that. I think we can >use such >an anchor relocation protocol to make each access router in an autonomous >system >(or smaller region of an autonomous system) a temporary anchor for a >given prefix. >In my draft I propose running I-BGP on each AR and sending BGP UPDATES >into the >network upon localized mobility events. Such a protocol can also be used >as a >substitute for the proxy ND technique that is currently specified to >"grab" the >MN's packets at the HA. By using a routing protocol, the HA can reach >across >several routing hops so it doesn't necessarily need to be on the home >link (which >can be the first AR to which the MN attached). I think this would also >enable us >to unify the authentication protocols used at the AR with the >authentication protocol >used at the HA. The ARs are just like HAs that don't have to tunnel the >data anywhere >because the MN is locally connected. > >Does it make sense to you? > >-- >Peter J. McCann >Huawei Technologies (USA) >Peter.McCann@Huawei.com >+1 908 541 3563 >Rm. C-0105, 400 Crossings Blvd. (2nd floor), Bridgewater, NJ 08807-2863 >USA > > From jouni.nospam@gmail.com Tue Mar 6 22:57:23 2012 Return-Path: X-Original-To: dmm@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: dmm@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id C213721E8013 for ; Tue, 6 Mar 2012 22:57:23 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.959 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.959 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.021, BAYES_00=-2.599, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW=-1, RCVD_IN_SORBS_WEB=0.619] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([12.22.58.30]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id IfuVT+nq4v3I for ; Tue, 6 Mar 2012 22:57:23 -0800 (PST) Received: from mail-pw0-f44.google.com (mail-pw0-f44.google.com [209.85.160.44]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 427B621E8019 for ; Tue, 6 Mar 2012 22:57:23 -0800 (PST) Received: by pbbrq13 with SMTP id rq13so260735pbb.31 for ; Tue, 06 Mar 2012 22:57:23 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20120113; h=subject:mime-version:content-type:from:in-reply-to:date:cc :content-transfer-encoding:message-id:references:to:x-mailer; bh=7loDyNKhTjAbjxVjPyAlJo77GuHXgqToE4iXXSb+qVs=; b=dJ8omzcq6byHUT/XJ4NyIz+xJqmsjMmHm5w2+RsnTo7MqJfcw59U/D5OrXxqvwlygc h5HANUCOjsm8erfbOVYyPWgWwPH2L5zjXcBV+ZAsh8mb0ImEkN6PCptHSxQ1RLznpwj4 +RB5+pbPWD7CEC1aWqgWfOGRKS8E1QPsEwrpImIcRgRQ6d6Ouu/mSyV11CqUbjqI4FTz 1iLSdJkvZNdvQEEYzvQUY3cdeuuRcBKc4EqSbupM/ZLVoSPAIKXU7apCmPFIRvyDgqAl eWIl9ru35O3LIzh/rzdzWANqramsUjWJPK3xalywo6ULcu30TVtbTUONs0skWJHEk8v2 w9nA== Received: by 10.68.129.100 with SMTP id nv4mr2081317pbb.109.1331103442920; Tue, 06 Mar 2012 22:57:22 -0800 (PST) Received: from [10.255.143.108] ([192.100.123.77]) by mx.google.com with ESMTPS id p9sm288650pbb.9.2012.03.06.22.57.20 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=OTHER); Tue, 06 Mar 2012 22:57:22 -0800 (PST) Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v1084) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii From: jouni korhonen In-Reply-To: <5963DDF1F751474D8DEEFDCDBEE43AE716447E36@dfweml504-mbx> Date: Wed, 7 Mar 2012 08:57:15 +0200 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Message-Id: <5F8BEB41-DB21-4B37-966D-0392A91BD1D1@gmail.com> References: <5963DDF1F751474D8DEEFDCDBEE43AE716447E36@dfweml504-mbx> To: Peter McCann X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.1084) Cc: "dmm@ietf.org" Subject: Re: [DMM] Comments on draft-patil-dmm-issues-and-approaches2dmm-00 X-BeenThere: dmm@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.12 Precedence: list List-Id: Distributed Mobility Management Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 07 Mar 2012 06:57:23 -0000 Pete, Thanks for the review. Some thoughts inline. On Mar 6, 2012, at 11:48 PM, Peter McCann wrote: > Hi, Raj, Carl, and Jouni, >=20 > I have some comments on draft-patil-dmm-issues-and-approaches2dmm-00. >=20 > I agree with most of Section 4, "Issues with current mobility models". = However, > I'd like to point out that existing networks are not just centralized = in the manner > you point out, they also tend to have a hierarchical structure, e.g., = the=20 > S-GW/P-GW split in 3GPP EPC. Therefore, the issue you outline in = Section 4.3 It is quite common to run combined nodes.=20 > ("Inefficient Routing and signaling overhead") is not quite true of = the 3GPP > EPC, which can handle many mobility events in a localized manner = similar to > HMIP. Could you clarify which functionality in EPC you refer to from IP point = of view? >=20 > The first paragraph of Section 7 talks about source address selection, = and the > need to modify applications so that they request the kind of address = that they > want. I tend to think that applications will remain unmodified for = some time > to come; however, most applications fit into the paradigm of opening = short-lived > connections to a server and could be accommodated with some sort of = automatic > handling in the MN's IP stack. I tend to think that developers who care and see some benefit for their applications would update. Completely automated solution within the = stack would be nice but that also entails larger MN update and would also need some additional (out of band) policy information to guide address = selection. >=20 > I found the last paragraph of Section 7 quite interesting. I too = think that there > is an important piece missing that you call "seamless mobility anchor = relocation". > I think that the use of an interior routing protocol is spot on. In = fact, if you > read draft-mccann-dmm-flatarch-00, I propose just that. I think we = can use such > an anchor relocation protocol to make each access router in an = autonomous system > (or smaller region of an autonomous system) a temporary anchor for a = given prefix. > In my draft I propose running I-BGP on each AR and sending BGP UPDATES = into the > network upon localized mobility events. Such a protocol can also be = used as a I yet need to read your draft properly.. but in general trying to solve mobility issues with routing protocols is just moving the problems out of your hands to others. You easily end up with uncomfortable amount of host routes and your network being constantly in a "converging" state.. > substitute for the proxy ND technique that is currently specified to = "grab" the > MN's packets at the HA. By using a routing protocol, the HA can reach = across > several routing hops so it doesn't necessarily need to be on the home = link (which > can be the first AR to which the MN attached). I think this would = also enable us > to unify the authentication protocols used at the AR with the = authentication protocol > used at the HA. The ARs are just like HAs that don't have to tunnel = the data anywhere > because the MN is locally connected. There are virtues for exploring the routing protocol "enslavement" for=20= additional mobility management. Geo-redundancy would, for example, = benefit from it. - Jouni >=20 > Does it make sense to you? >=20 > -- > Peter J. McCann > Huawei Technologies (USA) > Peter.McCann@Huawei.com > +1 908 541 3563 > Rm. C-0105, 400 Crossings Blvd. (2nd floor), Bridgewater, NJ = 08807-2863 USA >=20 >=20 From jiin16@gmail.com Wed Mar 7 00:27:13 2012 Return-Path: X-Original-To: dmm@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: dmm@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id AE7F721F84EB for ; Wed, 7 Mar 2012 00:27:13 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -3.599 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-3.599 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-2.599, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW=-1] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([12.22.58.30]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id VhPhKpXpo1a6 for ; Wed, 7 Mar 2012 00:27:13 -0800 (PST) Received: from mail-pw0-f44.google.com (mail-pw0-f44.google.com [209.85.160.44]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0F59E21F84EA for ; Wed, 7 Mar 2012 00:27:13 -0800 (PST) Received: by pbbrq13 with SMTP id rq13so326771pbb.31 for ; Wed, 07 Mar 2012 00:27:12 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20120113; h=from:to:subject:date:message-id:mime-version:content-type :content-transfer-encoding:x-mailer:thread-index:content-language; bh=ILI9PDMaxKx2GV6Un/ogmkvLwvVnAxkAlLXnvkMvow8=; b=0M0CVV1JxkXAuoAuBxQUGgVfibsH/vcmdE4PQrbo40IQUSZijdGogmHvAPXF09U8rC NsSP2CJ5SrsK3w0ft92kpQdxikDPgKCkm6hGXbde6KbZMbP/7N1RYr0YZ1EJiLMGG3di q1vf73bFTRXY7JOfrGDOdiQqHxGTg7sElJl9/HqW91RR7+/FK0n01sks3Sbl3n5udNYQ f9MMbFP4mymSyGnLXDGDpEj83FYyGBXCV5mdmbUPKc16S5w4DActwikvuEGSF8r1NSas NqA4pPQELXugtUkJGqsDxbGm75SLRr3QW8LnE8Th62uXpkePV7etSejgLipNe6XXHEU8 8S1Q== Received: by 10.68.201.73 with SMTP id jy9mr2560618pbc.35.1331108832773; Wed, 07 Mar 2012 00:27:12 -0800 (PST) Received: from neobooriPC ([155.230.105.157]) by mx.google.com with ESMTPS id vy2sm390671pbb.48.2012.03.07.00.27.10 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=OTHER); Wed, 07 Mar 2012 00:27:12 -0800 (PST) From: "Ji-In Kim" To: Date: Wed, 7 Mar 2012 17:27:01 +0900 Message-ID: <00bf01ccfc3c$143d22d0$3cb76870$@gmail.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook 14.0 Thread-Index: Acz8PAjfGZcsJDyYSGS55HAg6R6J4g== Content-Language: ko Subject: [DMM] New Version Notification for draft-jikim-dmm-pmip-00.txt X-BeenThere: dmm@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.12 Precedence: list List-Id: Distributed Mobility Management Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 07 Mar 2012 08:27:13 -0000 Hi, all, On Monday I submitted a renamed draft that had presented during the meeting in Taipei. The draft can be found here: http://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-jikim-dmm-pmip/ there is more information about the draft as below: A new version of I-D, draft-jikim-dmm-pmip-00.txt has been successfully submitted by Ji In Kim and posted to the IETF repository. Filename: draft-jikim-dmm-pmip Revision: 00 Title: Use of Proxy Mobile IPv6 for Distributed Mobility Management Creation date: 2012-03-05 WG ID: Individual Submission Number of pages: 14 Abstract: This document discusses how to use the Proxy Mobile IPv6 (PMIP) protocol for distributed mobility management. Specifically, we describe the two schemes of distributed mobility management: Signal- driven PMIP (S-PMIP) and Signal-driven Distributed PMIP (SD-PMIP). Best Regards, Ji-In Kim ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Ph.D student, Communications Protocols Lab, Kyungpook National University. 1370 Sankyuk-dong, Buk-gu, Daegu, Korea. E-mail: jiin16@gmail.com Tel: 82-53-940-8608 C.P: 82-10-9371-1324 From elena.demaria@telecomitalia.it Wed Mar 7 01:59:16 2012 Return-Path: X-Original-To: dmm@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: dmm@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3674521F879F for ; Wed, 7 Mar 2012 01:59:16 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.719 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.719 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-2.599, HELO_EQ_IT=0.635, HOST_EQ_IT=1.245, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW=-1] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([12.22.58.30]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id Vt7tyBV--9xS for ; Wed, 7 Mar 2012 01:59:15 -0800 (PST) Received: from GRFEDG701BA020.telecomitalia.it (grfedg701ba020.telecomitalia.it [156.54.233.200]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0BE2721F8792 for ; Wed, 7 Mar 2012 01:59:14 -0800 (PST) Received: from GRFHUB702BA020.griffon.local (10.188.101.112) by GRFEDG701BA020.telecomitalia.it (10.188.45.100) with Microsoft SMTP Server (TLS) id 8.2.254.0; Wed, 7 Mar 2012 10:59:10 +0100 Received: from GRFMBX702BA020.griffon.local ([10.188.101.12]) by GRFHUB702BA020.griffon.local ([10.188.101.112]) with mapi; Wed, 7 Mar 2012 10:59:10 +0100 From: Demaria Elena To: "dmm@ietf.org" Date: Wed, 7 Mar 2012 10:59:07 +0100 Thread-Topic: New IETF draft submitted Thread-Index: Acz4YTV+3ZThzRokRSuSJwteK/q3dgD5mjwg Message-ID: <36A93B31228D3B49B691AD31652BCAE9A597EBEAEA@GRFMBX702BA020.griffon.local> References: In-Reply-To: Accept-Language: en-US, it-IT Content-Language: it-IT X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: acceptlanguage: en-US, it-IT x-ti-disclaimer: Disclaimer1 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable MIME-Version: 1.0 Subject: [DMM] R: New IETF draft submitted X-BeenThere: dmm@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.12 Precedence: list List-Id: Distributed Mobility Management Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 07 Mar 2012 09:59:16 -0000 Hi all, this is to inform you that we have submitted a new draft related to DMM top= ic. http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-demaria-dmm-dimensioning-consider= ations-00.txt One of the main questions posed during recent discussions on distributed mobility architectures is if the distributed architecture can have advantages in terms of costs with respect to a centralized one. This draft describes a general method to calculate the costs of the centralized and distributed scenarios. Even if a simplified model has been used, some information can be earned. Each operator can use this model and his own costs to discover the optimal architecture based on traffic observed in the network. Comments welcome. Elena -----Messaggio originale----- Da: i-d-announce-bounces@ietf.org [mailto:i-d-announce-bounces@ietf.org] Pe= r conto di internet-drafts@ietf.org Inviato: venerd=EC 2 marzo 2012 11:38 A: i-d-announce@ietf.org Oggetto: I-D Action: draft-demaria-dmm-dimensioning-considerations-00.txt A New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line Internet-Drafts director= ies. Title : Dimensioning considerations for distributed mobil= ity architecture Author(s) : Elena Demaria Loris Marchetti Filename : draft-demaria-dmm-dimensioning-considerations-00.= txt Pages : 10 Date : 2012-03-02 One of the main questions posed during recent discussions on distributed mobility architectures is if the distributed architecture can have advantages in terms of costs with respect to a centralized one. This draft describes a general method to calculate the costs of the centralized and distributed scenarios. Even if a simplified model has been used, some information can be earned. Each operator can use this model and his own costs to discover the optimal architecture based on traffic observed in the network. A URL for this Internet-Draft is: http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-demaria-dmm-dimensioning-consider= ations-00.txt Internet-Drafts are also available by anonymous FTP at: ftp://ftp.ietf.org/internet-drafts/ This Internet-Draft can be retrieved at: ftp://ftp.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-demaria-dmm-dimensioning-considera= tions-00.txt _______________________________________________ I-D-Announce mailing list I-D-Announce@ietf.org https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/i-d-announce Internet-Draft directories: http://www.ietf.org/shadow.html or ftp://ftp.ie= tf.org/ietf/1shadow-sites.txt Questo messaggio e i suoi allegati sono indirizzati esclusivamente alle per= sone indicate. La diffusione, copia o qualsiasi altra azione derivante dall= a conoscenza di queste informazioni sono rigorosamente vietate. Qualora abb= iate ricevuto questo documento per errore siete cortesemente pregati di dar= ne immediata comunicazione al mittente e di provvedere alla sua distruzione= , Grazie. This e-mail and any attachments is confidential and may contain privileged = information intended for the addressee(s) only. Dissemination, copying, pri= nting or use by anybody else is unauthorised. If you are not the intended r= ecipient, please delete this message and any attachments and advise the sen= der by return e-mail, Thanks. From Peter.McCann@huawei.com Wed Mar 7 06:58:22 2012 Return-Path: X-Original-To: dmm@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: dmm@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2E22321F876E for ; Wed, 7 Mar 2012 06:58:22 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.599 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.599 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.000, BAYES_00=-2.599] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([12.22.58.30]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id b6cdt2ivhtb8 for ; Wed, 7 Mar 2012 06:58:21 -0800 (PST) Received: from dfwrgout.huawei.com (dfwrgout.huawei.com [206.16.17.72]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5919E21F873A for ; Wed, 7 Mar 2012 06:58:21 -0800 (PST) Received: from 172.18.9.243 (EHLO dfweml202-edg.china.huawei.com) ([172.18.9.243]) by dfwrg01-dlp.huawei.com (MOS 4.2.3-GA FastPath) with ESMTP id AEE41339; Wed, 07 Mar 2012 09:58:20 -0500 (EST) Received: from DFWEML407-HUB.china.huawei.com (10.193.5.132) by dfweml202-edg.china.huawei.com (172.18.9.108) with Microsoft SMTP Server (TLS) id 14.1.323.3; Wed, 7 Mar 2012 06:55:44 -0800 Received: from DFWEML504-MBX.china.huawei.com ([10.124.31.30]) by dfweml407-hub.china.huawei.com ([10.193.5.132]) with mapi id 14.01.0323.003; Wed, 7 Mar 2012 22:55:39 +0800 From: Peter McCann To: jouni korhonen Thread-Topic: Comments on draft-patil-dmm-issues-and-approaches2dmm-00 Thread-Index: Acz74tbaKHHVfQwFSOaADK0zCMsIqwACaJGAACEb3gA= Date: Wed, 7 Mar 2012 14:55:38 +0000 Message-ID: <5963DDF1F751474D8DEEFDCDBEE43AE716447F97@dfweml504-mbx> References: <5963DDF1F751474D8DEEFDCDBEE43AE716447E36@dfweml504-mbx> <5F8BEB41-DB21-4B37-966D-0392A91BD1D1@gmail.com> In-Reply-To: <5F8BEB41-DB21-4B37-966D-0392A91BD1D1@gmail.com> Accept-Language: en-US, zh-CN Content-Language: en-US X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: x-originating-ip: [10.193.125.95] Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable MIME-Version: 1.0 X-CFilter-Loop: Reflected Cc: "dmm@ietf.org" Subject: Re: [DMM] Comments on draft-patil-dmm-issues-and-approaches2dmm-00 X-BeenThere: dmm@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.12 Precedence: list List-Id: Distributed Mobility Management Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 07 Mar 2012 14:58:22 -0000 Hi, Jouni, jouni korhonen wrote: > Pete, >=20 > Thanks for the review. Some thoughts inline. >=20 > On Mar 6, 2012, at 11:48 PM, Peter McCann wrote: >=20 >> Hi, Raj, Carl, and Jouni, >>=20 >> I have some comments on draft-patil-dmm-issues-and-approaches2dmm-00. >>=20 >> I agree with most of Section 4, "Issues with current mobility models".=20 >> However, I'd like to point out that existing networks are not just >> centralized in the manner you point out, they also tend to have a >> hierarchical structure, e.g., the S-GW/P-GW split in 3GPP EPC.=20 >> Therefore, the issue you outline in > Section 4.3 >=20 > It is quite common to run combined nodes. Sure, in that case the combined S-GW/P-GW is a centralized anchor point and the excess signaling you point out in Section 4.3 would indeed be a problem. >> ("Inefficient Routing and signaling overhead") is not quite true of the >> 3GPP EPC, which can handle many mobility events in a localized manner >> similar to HMIP. >=20 > Could you clarify which functionality in EPC you refer to from IP point > of view? I mean the ability to update a local S-GW with each eNB change, which avoids the extra signaling to the P-GW. It is architecturally similar to HMIP (really, PMIP + HMIP). >> The first paragraph of Section 7 talks about source address selection, >> and the need to modify applications so that they request the kind of >> address that they want. I tend to think that applications will remain >> unmodified for some time to come; however, most applications fit into >> the paradigm of opening short-lived connections to a server and could >> be accommodated with some sort of automatic handling in the MN's IP >> stack. >=20 > I tend to think that developers who care and see some benefit for their > applications would update. Completely automated solution within the > stack would be nice but that also entails larger MN update and would > also need some additional (out of band) policy information to guide > address selection. It should certainly be possible for both models to co-exist. If an applica= tion specifies an address, that's great, but if it doesn't, maybe it should just get a fixed privately scoped address that is then NATted out to whatever public address the MN happens to have at the time the connection gets made. =20 >> I found the last paragraph of Section 7 quite interesting. I too think >> that there is an important piece missing that you call "seamless >> mobility anchor relocation". I think that the use of an interior >> routing protocol is spot on. In fact, if you read >> draft-mccann-dmm-flatarch-00, I propose just that. I think we can use >> such an anchor relocation protocol to make each access router in an >> autonomous system (or smaller region of an autonomous system) a >> temporary anchor for a given prefix. In my draft I propose running >> I-BGP on each AR and sending BGP UPDATES into the network upon >> localized mobility events. Such a protocol can also be > used as a >=20 > I yet need to read your draft properly.. but in general trying to solve > mobility issues with routing protocols is just moving the problems out > of your hands to others. You easily end up with uncomfortable amount of > host routes and your network being constantly in a "converging" state.. We need to do some simulation/implementation experiments to see if this is a problem. Hopefully I'll have more to say on that soon. But, intuitiv= ely, the UPDATE just has to propagate one hop to the crossover router to be effe= ctive. We don't need the whole network to be converged for packets to take the rig= ht path toward the currently serving AR. >> substitute for the proxy ND technique that is currently specified to >> "grab" the MN's packets at the HA. By using a routing protocol, the HA >> can reach across several routing hops so it doesn't necessarily need to >> be on the home link (which can be the first AR to which the MN >> attached). I think this would also enable us to unify the >> authentication protocols used at the AR with the authentication >> protocol used at the HA. The ARs are just like HAs that don't have to >> tunnel the data anywhere because the MN is locally connected. >=20 > There are virtues for exploring the routing protocol "enslavement" for > additional mobility management. Geo-redundancy would, for example, > benefit from it. You would get all the benefits of distribution and fault-tolerance from the routing protocol itself. IP routing already has these features built-i= n. It is the establishment of tunnel state in a single box that makes the netw= ork fragile. -Pete From cjbc@it.uc3m.es Wed Mar 7 10:00:52 2012 Return-Path: X-Original-To: dmm@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: dmm@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7DE4921E8084 for ; Wed, 7 Mar 2012 10:00:52 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -5.699 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-5.699 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=-0.000, BAYES_00=-2.599, J_CHICKENPOX_21=0.6, MIME_8BIT_HEADER=0.3, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-4] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([12.22.58.30]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id yzDo2397jAGf for ; Wed, 7 Mar 2012 10:00:51 -0800 (PST) Received: from smtp02.uc3m.es (smtp02.uc3m.es [163.117.176.132]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3DEBB21E8017 for ; Wed, 7 Mar 2012 10:00:51 -0800 (PST) X-uc3m-safe: yes Received: from [163.117.139.72] (acorde.it.uc3m.es [163.117.139.72]) (using TLSv1 with cipher AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by smtp02.uc3m.es (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8C809704A14; Wed, 7 Mar 2012 19:00:49 +0100 (CET) Message-ID: <1331143249.5000.43.camel@acorde.it.uc3m.es> From: Carlos =?ISO-8859-1?Q?Jes=FAs?= Bernardos Cano To: Peter McCann Date: Wed, 07 Mar 2012 19:00:49 +0100 In-Reply-To: <5963DDF1F751474D8DEEFDCDBEE43AE716447E15@dfweml504-mbx> References: <5963DDF1F751474D8DEEFDCDBEE43AE716447E15@dfweml504-mbx> Organization: Universidad Carlos III de Madrid Content-Type: multipart/signed; micalg="pgp-sha1"; protocol="application/pgp-signature"; boundary="=-PrdKlOGIaTOawL77QCxc" X-Mailer: Evolution 3.2.2-1 Mime-Version: 1.0 X-TM-AS-Product-Ver: IMSS-7.0.0.3116-6.8.0.1017-18760.000 Cc: "dmm@ietf.org" Subject: Re: [DMM] Review of draft-bernardos-dmm-distributed-anchoring-00 X-BeenThere: dmm@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.12 Precedence: list Reply-To: cjbc@it.uc3m.es List-Id: Distributed Mobility Management Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 07 Mar 2012 18:00:52 -0000 --=-PrdKlOGIaTOawL77QCxc Content-Type: text/plain; charset="ISO-8859-15" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Hi Pete, Thanks for the comments. Please see some comments inline below. On Tue, 2012-03-06 at 20:55 +0000, Peter McCann wrote: > Hi, Carlos, Juan-Carlos, >=20 > I have read draft-bernardos-dmm-distributed-anchoring-00, and I have a fe= w > comments. >=20 > First, I want to bring up something that I think is common to several of > the DMM proposals, and that is sub-optimal use of the backhaul resources. > It seems that when you use an AR as an anchor point, and move to a new AR= , > the traffic for that session has to traverse the backhaul 3 times in each > direction, like this: >=20 >=20 > ----- > | Rtr | > / ^ -----\ > 1 / / 2 \ 3 > v / v > ---- ---- > | AR | | AR | > ---- ---- >=20 > Although it may seem at odds with the goal of "distributing" mobility to > use the crossover router as the point of traffic redirection, it would ma= ke > for much more optimal use of the backhaul resources. I believe it is po= ssible > to route the traffic more optimally with a standard off-the-shelf router = at > the crossover point (using mechanisms detailed in draft-mccann-dmm-flatar= ch-00). In our draft we don't make any assumption about the backhaul and access architecture. ARs might be also directly connected (in which case no Rtr would be traversed) if a network deployment allows that. In any case, the traffic redirection is supposed to happen for relatively short periods of time (otherwise the DMM advantages might vanish and it's just better to go for a centralized approach). >=20 >=20 > Second, I like the idea of moving the prefix assigned to the MN from one = AR > to another. However, why do we need to keep the AR's MAC address the sam= e? > IPv6 should handle the failover of a first-hop router from one instance t= o another > with no problems. You see the same prefix advertised from a different MA= C address; > what's the big deal? You can just keep using the prefix as you did befor= e, addressing > packets to the new access router. >=20 This is basically inherited from PMIPv6 basic operation, in which the MN keeps "seeing" always the same router (i.e. same IPv6 link-local address and MAC address) while moving within the PMIPv6 domain. This is so to improve performance (there are no stale entries on the neigh cache) and also to avoid triggering any movement detection mechanism on the MN (changing the default router might be treated as such). We basically follow the same approach. Besides, by using a logical interface per anchoring router, it becomes easier to handle the prefix advertisement on the network side. >=20 > Third, I don't like the idea of having to ship so much state around the n= etwork > through the HSS. In your draft you talk about (out-of-scope) mechanisms = to get > the prefix and the anchor gateway address to the new D-GW. There is also= the complication > of knowing which prior prefixes the MN wants to keep at its new attachmen= t point. > It seems to me that we should avoid the behavior that a new prefix is alw= ays assigned > at each new point of attachment; rather, we should force the MN to take s= ome sort of > affirmative action to acquire an address/prefix for its use, such as DHCP= -PD. This > would be done occasionally, not on every handover, and the MN could regis= ter its intent > to keep an address through e.g., dynamic DNS update. Then the new D-GW c= ould lookup > the DNS name of the MN at the time it attaches, see the list of addresses= that are > currently assigned, and take steps to attract the packets for those prefi= xes. This > could be a tunnel or it could be a BGP UPDATE as outlined in draft-mccann= -dmm-flatarch-00. I haven't had time to check your draft yet. Apologies for that, I'll do it shortly. In any case, our draft does not specify how the info about the active prefixes is obtained, and from where the require state is retrieved. A centralized entity (such as the HSS, or a centralized LMA) is just an example. Our draft also includes some PMIPv6 protocol extensions to obtain that info from the previous router visited by the MN (we call that D-GW), if the current router knows it. So basically the defined mechanisms are not incompatible, IMHO, with the ones you mentioned above. >=20 >=20 > Finally, I don't quite understand the "Local Prefixes" concept presented = in the draft. > I understand how LIPA is supposed to work, but I don't understand why you= need to treat > such prefixes differently from any other prefix on the D-GW1 link. You a= re tunneling > all the traffic back to the D-GW1 AR, correct? Wouldn't the traffic just= naturally > follow the proper path through to the D-GW1 and from there to the local C= N? We are considering here prefixes that because of security or other reasons are not normally reachable from the Internet, but only from nodes directly attached to D-GW1 (e.g., in an enterprise network). For that case, it might be useful to keep being able to reach those while being attached to a different D-GW. This is the LIPA use case considered by 3GPP. >=20 > Personally, I think it might be better to use client-based Mobile IP for = any scenario > where the current AR cannot attract the packets for a given prefix, such = as when the > MN moves out of the domain of one operator. That situation is very simil= ar to the LIPA > case and could be solved with a single mechanism. Client-based DMM is a topic that deserves additional attention. In our draft we have started to look at a network-based solution, but we can discuss the implications of a client-based solution as well. >=20 > Looking forward to continued discussion, So do we. Thanks for the good comments. Carlos >=20 > -Pete >=20 > -- > Peter J. McCann > Huawei Technologies (USA) > Peter.McCann@Huawei.com > +1 908 541 3563 > Rm. C-0105, 400 Crossings Blvd. (2nd floor), Bridgewater, NJ 08807-2863 = USA >=20 >=20 --=20 Carlos Jes=FAs Bernardos Cano http://www.netcom.it.uc3m.es/ GPG FP: D29B 0A6A 639A A561 93CA 4D55 35DC BA4D D170 4F67 --=-PrdKlOGIaTOawL77QCxc Content-Type: application/pgp-signature; name="signature.asc" Content-Description: This is a digitally signed message part Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.4.11 (GNU/Linux) iEYEABECAAYFAk9XolEACgkQNdy6TdFwT2fVlgCfTXOrctOj/hY7C0yZdsI/ge/W BlcAoKNoCyRG7wfZvH7ur58O3oS4SmIP =e9bj -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --=-PrdKlOGIaTOawL77QCxc-- From Peter.McCann@huawei.com Wed Mar 7 11:00:44 2012 Return-Path: X-Original-To: dmm@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: dmm@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3692411E8076 for ; Wed, 7 Mar 2012 11:00:44 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.599 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.599 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-2.599] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([12.22.58.30]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id Es-ZHz-lMeFQ for ; Wed, 7 Mar 2012 11:00:43 -0800 (PST) Received: from dfwrgout.huawei.com (dfwrgout.huawei.com [206.16.17.72]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 235EA11E8072 for ; Wed, 7 Mar 2012 11:00:43 -0800 (PST) Received: from 172.18.9.243 (EHLO dfweml202-edg.china.huawei.com) ([172.18.9.243]) by dfwrg02-dlp.huawei.com (MOS 4.2.3-GA FastPath) with ESMTP id ADW48432; Wed, 07 Mar 2012 14:00:42 -0500 (EST) Received: from DFWEML408-HUB.china.huawei.com (10.193.5.134) by dfweml202-edg.china.huawei.com (172.18.9.108) with Microsoft SMTP Server (TLS) id 14.1.323.3; Wed, 7 Mar 2012 10:59:01 -0800 Received: from DFWEML504-MBX.china.huawei.com ([10.124.31.30]) by dfweml408-hub.china.huawei.com ([10.193.5.134]) with mapi id 14.01.0323.003; Wed, 7 Mar 2012 10:58:59 -0800 From: Peter McCann To: "cjbc@it.uc3m.es" Thread-Topic: Review of draft-bernardos-dmm-distributed-anchoring-00 Thread-Index: Acz723tn3ojL6DPBTKCm/gMVBH+bvQAbbC6AABJI2VA= Date: Wed, 7 Mar 2012 18:58:59 +0000 Message-ID: <5963DDF1F751474D8DEEFDCDBEE43AE716447FFE@dfweml504-mbx> References: <5963DDF1F751474D8DEEFDCDBEE43AE716447E15@dfweml504-mbx> <1331143249.5000.43.camel@acorde.it.uc3m.es> In-Reply-To: <1331143249.5000.43.camel@acorde.it.uc3m.es> Accept-Language: en-US, zh-CN Content-Language: en-US X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: x-originating-ip: [10.193.125.95] Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable MIME-Version: 1.0 X-CFilter-Loop: Reflected Cc: "dmm@ietf.org" Subject: Re: [DMM] Review of draft-bernardos-dmm-distributed-anchoring-00 X-BeenThere: dmm@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.12 Precedence: list List-Id: Distributed Mobility Management Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 07 Mar 2012 19:00:44 -0000 Hi, Carlos, Just a couple of response points below... Carlos Jes=FAs Bernardos Cano wrote: > Hi Pete, >=20 > Thanks for the comments. Please see some comments inline below. >=20 > On Tue, 2012-03-06 at 20:55 +0000, Peter McCann wrote: >> Hi, Carlos, Juan-Carlos, >>=20 >> I have read draft-bernardos-dmm-distributed-anchoring-00, and I have a >> few comments. >>=20 >> First, I want to bring up something that I think is common to several >> of the DMM proposals, and that is sub-optimal use of the backhaul >> resources. It seems that when you use an AR as an anchor point, and >> move to a new AR, the traffic for that session has to traverse the >> backhaul 3 times in each direction, like this: >>=20 >>=20 >> ----- >> | Rtr | >> / ^ -----\ >> 1 / / 2 \ 3 >> v / v >> ---- ----=20 >> | AR | | AR |=20 >> ---- ---- >> Although it may seem at odds with the goal of "distributing" mobility >> to use the crossover router as the point of traffic redirection, it >> would make for much more optimal use of the backhaul resources. I >> believe it is possible to route the traffic more optimally with a >> standard off-the-shelf router at the crossover point (using mechanisms >> detailed in draft-mccann-dmm- > flatarch-00). >=20 > In our draft we don't make any assumption about the backhaul and access > architecture. ARs might be also directly connected (in which case no Rtr > would be traversed) if a network deployment allows that. In any case, > the traffic redirection is supposed to happen for relatively short > periods of time (otherwise the DMM advantages might vanish and it's just > better to go for a centralized approach). I suppose I have a different view of how long one might keep an address that has been assigned by a first access router. There might be quite a bit of overhead involved with getting an address assigned, and you=20 might want to delay getting a new address until, say, every 4th AR that you encounter. While I think it might be reasonable in some environments for neighboring ARs to have a direct IP hop between them, I think it is less likely that the 4th neighbor over will have a direct connection. And even direct neighbors I think are likely to be connected in a star topology via expensive and slow backhaul links to a router one layer up in the aggregation hierarchy. >> Second, I like the idea of moving the prefix assigned to the MN from >> one AR to another. However, why do we need to keep the AR's MAC >> address the same? IPv6 should handle the failover of a first-hop router >> from one instance to another with no problems. You see the same prefix >> advertised from a different MAC address; what's the big deal? You can >> just keep using the prefix as you did before, addressing packets to the >> new access router. >>=20 >=20 > This is basically inherited from PMIPv6 basic operation, in which the MN > keeps "seeing" always the same router (i.e. same IPv6 link-local address > and MAC address) while moving within the PMIPv6 domain. This is so to > improve performance (there are no stale entries on the neigh cache) and > also to avoid triggering any movement detection mechanism on the MN > (changing the default router might be treated as such). We basically > follow the same approach. Besides, by using a logical interface per > anchoring router, it becomes easier to handle the prefix advertisement > on the network side. At some layer of the stack the MN will know that it changed ARs. I don't see any particular reason why we have to hide the movement from the=20 MAC layer. Besides, most wide-area cellular technologies will use=20 P2P links and won't have MAC addresses visible to the upper layers=20 directly. >> Third, I don't like the idea of having to ship so much state around the >> network through the HSS. In your draft you talk about (out-of-scope) >> mechanisms to get the prefix and the anchor gateway address to the new >> D-GW. There is also the complication of knowing which prior prefixes >> the MN wants to keep at its new attachment point. It seems to me that >> we should avoid the behavior that a new prefix is always assigned at >> each new point of attachment; rather, we should force the MN to take >> some sort of affirmative action to acquire an address/prefix for its >> use, such as DHCP-PD. This would be done occasionally, not on every >> handover, and the MN could register its intent to keep an address >> through e.g., dynamic DNS update. Then the new D- GW could lookup the >> DNS name of the MN at the time it attaches, see the list of addresses >> that are currently assigned, and take steps to attract the packets for >> those prefixes. This could be a tunnel or it could be a BGP UPDATE as >> outlined in draft- > mccann-dmm-flatarch-00. >=20 > I haven't had time to check your draft yet. Apologies for that, I'll do > it shortly.=20 Great, would be glad to have your comments. > In any case, our draft does not specify how the info about > the active prefixes is obtained, and from where the require state is > retrieved. A centralized entity (such as the HSS, or a centralized LMA) > is just an example. Our draft also includes some PMIPv6 protocol > extensions to obtain that info from the previous router visited by the > MN (we call that D-GW), if the current router knows it. So basically the > defined mechanisms are not incompatible, IMHO, with the ones you > mentioned above. Sure. I guess it is necessary to get the old prefix that was assigned somehow; it just seems that the additional effort to map this to an anchori= ng D-GW might be too much. >> Finally, I don't quite understand the "Local Prefixes" concept >> presented in the draft. I understand how LIPA is supposed to work, but >> I don't understand why you need to treat such prefixes differently from >> any other prefix on the D-GW1 link. You are tunneling all the traffic >> back to the D-GW1 AR, correct? Wouldn't the traffic just naturally >> follow the proper path through to the D-GW1 and from there to the >> local CN? >=20 > We are considering here prefixes that because of security or other > reasons are not normally reachable from the Internet, but only from > nodes directly attached to D-GW1 (e.g., in an enterprise network). For > that case, it might be useful to keep being able to reach those while > being attached to a different D-GW. This is the LIPA use case considered > by 3GPP. I understand the motivation, but wouldn't this use case be solved because of the fact you have a tunnel from the old D-GW to the new D-GW? Why=20 does the new D-GW need to know that a particular prefix was local to the previous D-GW? Aren't you proposing to always use reverse tunneling back to the old D-GW for those packets that use the old logical interface? >> Personally, I think it might be better to use client-based Mobile IP >> for any scenario where the current AR cannot attract the packets for a >> given prefix, such as when the MN moves out of the domain of one >> operator. That situation is very similar to the LIPA case and could be >> solved with a single mechanism. >=20 > Client-based DMM is a topic that deserves additional attention. In our > draft we have started to look at a network-based solution, but we can > discuss the implications of a client-based solution as well. I think the network based solution is a good match for the frequent, localized mobility within a given autonomous system. However, once you cross a boundary outside of which the network can't re-route your traffic, client MIP seems to be required. >> Looking forward to continued discussion, >=20 > So do we. Thanks for the good comments. >=20 > Carlos -Pete From Basavaraj.Patil@nokia.com Wed Mar 7 14:52:13 2012 Return-Path: X-Original-To: dmm@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: dmm@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id CA8B611E809D for ; Wed, 7 Mar 2012 14:52:13 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -104.924 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-104.924 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=1.360, BAYES_00=-2.599, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-4, SARE_MILLIONSOF=0.315, USER_IN_WHITELIST=-100] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([12.22.58.30]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id E+p3pdIHUGZF for ; Wed, 7 Mar 2012 14:52:13 -0800 (PST) Received: from mgw-da02.nokia.com (smtp.nokia.com [147.243.128.26]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id EB7DE11E808F for ; Wed, 7 Mar 2012 14:52:12 -0800 (PST) Received: from vaebh106.NOE.Nokia.com (vaebh106.europe.nokia.com [10.160.244.32]) by mgw-da02.nokia.com (Switch-3.4.4/Switch-3.4.4) with ESMTP id q27Mq6xM028055; Thu, 8 Mar 2012 00:52:08 +0200 Received: from smtp.mgd.nokia.com ([65.54.30.56]) by vaebh106.NOE.Nokia.com over TLS secured channel with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.4675); Thu, 8 Mar 2012 00:52:06 +0200 Received: from 008-AM1MPN1-073.mgdnok.nokia.com ([169.254.3.150]) by 008-AM1MMR1-001.mgdnok.nokia.com ([65.54.30.56]) with mapi id 14.01.0355.003; Wed, 7 Mar 2012 23:52:06 +0100 From: To: , Thread-Topic: [DMM] draft-mccann-dmm-flatarch-00.txt Thread-Index: Acz7ppM5+XaI77SoQaqa8Y3fzGKc1wA06z0A Date: Wed, 7 Mar 2012 22:52:06 +0000 Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <5963DDF1F751474D8DEEFDCDBEE43AE716447C77@dfweml504-mbx> Accept-Language: en-US Content-Language: en-US X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: user-agent: Microsoft-MacOutlook/14.14.0.111121 x-originating-ip: [172.19.59.134] Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-ID: <9FC3B75AB374E248AC3C09D9E6C7DAB9@mgd.nokia.com> Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable MIME-Version: 1.0 X-OriginalArrivalTime: 07 Mar 2012 22:52:06.0591 (UTC) FILETIME=[EBB7DCF0:01CCFCB4] X-Nokia-AV: Clean Subject: Re: [DMM] draft-mccann-dmm-flatarch-00.txt X-BeenThere: dmm@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.12 Precedence: list List-Id: Distributed Mobility Management Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 07 Mar 2012 22:52:13 -0000 Hi Pete, Interesting proposal and approach to mobility. A few comments below: 1. The I-D mentions that the scope of an address space is within that of an autonomous system. Do you see this autonomous system as one that encompasses an operators entire network? I am just trying to get an understanding of how big this autonomous system is. Given that an operator could be serving millions of mobile nodes, how large can this single contiguous autonomous system be? 2. Is the eNB/BS the AR in the proposal (fig 2 for example)? 3. If the eNB/BS is the AR, do you foresee concerns with the amount of updates resulting from MNs moving between eNBs/BS'? 4. You state that legacy/hierarchical mobility based solutions "suffer from poor performance, scalability and failure point(s)". I think that the current networks have proven to be capable of supporting fairly large numbers of users/MNs. So I don't see scalability being an issue. And similarly I don't know what is the benchmark against which you are comparing performance either. Whether this architecture can scale further to support billions of devices is of course an unknown and could be an issue. 5. The I-D states: "In particular, we note that many MNs will not require a fixed IP address for the entire duration of their packet data session, as they will most likely be acting as clients and initiating short-lived connections to servers." This seems to be contradicting the solution which results in the address being registered in DNS and the reverse lookup by the target eNB/BS whenever there is a handover. Would it not be preferable to have a short-lived address as well as one that continues to exist beyond handovers? 6. Fig 2 shows an architecture wherein the eNB/BS itself is the 1st hop AR. Given the shrinking cell sizes (to increase capacity) the likelihood of Handovers even at pedestrian speeds goes up. Why not allow for a level of indirection? That would reduce the amount of signaling and reduce route updates. 7. Authentication upon attachment to re-attachment to a BS every time could become quite expensive even with advanced CPUs. I don't know how efficient the proposal to use the new breed of auth algorithms are on battery for example. 8. The I-D states: "Then the mobile node updates its home DNS server to point from its hostname to the new address." If an MN is moving at 70mph and doing handovers every few seconds/mins, does this approach work? Given the RTT for the DNS update? 9. The handovers and the route updates that happen within an autonomous system and/or across it are not entirely clear. Hope to see your presentation and explanation at IETF83. 10. The idea of integrating authentication with mobility is good and should enable faster handoffs. The concept is interesting and I was wondering if you have any simulations or results from such. -Raj On 3/6/12 8:36 AM, "ext Peter McCann" wrote: >Hi, all, > >On Friday I submitted a new draft that outlines what I think is a novel >approach to mobility management in a totally flat network. The draft >can be found here: > >http://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-mccann-dmm-flatarch-00 > >Abstract > > Today's mobility management schemes make use of a hierarchy of > tunnels from a relatively fixed anchor point, through one or more > intermediate nodes, to reach the MN's current point of attachment. > These schemes suffer from poor performance, scalability, and failure > modes due to the centralization and statefulness of the anchor > point(s). The dmm (Distributed Mobility Management) working group is > currently chartered to investigate alternative solutions that will > provide greater performance, scalability, and robustness through the > distribution of mobility anchors. This document is an input to the > dmm discussion. It outlines a problem statement for the existing > mobility management techniques and goes on to propose (high-level) > solutions to two of the most vexing problems: MN authentication and > mobility management in a fully distributed, flat (non-hierarchical) > access network. These two aspects are often treated separately in a > layered architecture, but we argue there are important advantages to > considering how these two functions can work in tandem to provide a > simple and robust framework for the design of a wireless Internet > Service Provider network. > > >I'd like some time to present this draft during the meeting in Paris, >hopefully 15 minutes. > >-- >Peter J. McCann >Huawei Technologies (USA) >Peter.McCann@Huawei.com >+1 908 541 3563 >Rm. C-0105, 400 Crossings Blvd. (2nd floor), Bridgewater, NJ 08807-2863 >USA > > >_______________________________________________ >dmm mailing list >dmm@ietf.org >https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dmm From jouni.nospam@gmail.com Thu Mar 8 00:54:14 2012 Return-Path: X-Original-To: dmm@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: dmm@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 05C6021F8655 for ; Thu, 8 Mar 2012 00:54:14 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.96 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.96 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.020, BAYES_00=-2.599, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW=-1, RCVD_IN_SORBS_WEB=0.619] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([12.22.58.30]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id iVMQfQhJJ0ac for ; Thu, 8 Mar 2012 00:54:13 -0800 (PST) Received: from mail-pw0-f44.google.com (mail-pw0-f44.google.com [209.85.160.44]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4D1A021F8653 for ; Thu, 8 Mar 2012 00:54:13 -0800 (PST) Received: by pbbrq13 with SMTP id rq13so1430420pbb.31 for ; Thu, 08 Mar 2012 00:54:13 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20120113; h=subject:mime-version:content-type:from:in-reply-to:date:cc :content-transfer-encoding:message-id:references:to:x-mailer; bh=EcFw7M+yPlP0xJE0PVBxcSEje+l5+R8tgJEFurTYNRQ=; b=SoIgMdAayD11tuVWUoPfQoqXyCr6tIfVNeDots6qBhr0aBa+u5nSQKuGUKNU0GM0eJ XgkN7jgPNj4SjKQEc6xmvaFzf5x12anMI+xmkc17XvxEuwTwk1holE6g/v6Nk8ENyk5+ sYbvkTWXBU+CoIggrlegIWaeO2iUsptc22wBDFkx1ERTskV/L61PdWIOaK2cHaa06qed bGYRoOZ8zfvzG/ux2yrCi9WLA0TjvDuCNNK5rbwqw7U9Iy13q0QiWIVRte87O048dm2d Ni9tg5Ovq3DEE0N5MiK/sCQhmehmbkT4IGqWXQ8/p0tRiQVoQnW9mBC666vBh6spSxkP GduQ== Received: by 10.68.227.193 with SMTP id sc1mr8224664pbc.52.1331196853007; Thu, 08 Mar 2012 00:54:13 -0800 (PST) Received: from [10.255.131.45] ([192.100.123.77]) by mx.google.com with ESMTPS id n3sm2272896pbe.47.2012.03.08.00.54.10 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=OTHER); Thu, 08 Mar 2012 00:54:12 -0800 (PST) Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v1084) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii From: jouni korhonen In-Reply-To: <5963DDF1F751474D8DEEFDCDBEE43AE716447F97@dfweml504-mbx> Date: Thu, 8 Mar 2012 10:54:06 +0200 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Message-Id: <904A4168-0C92-41E9-AE0E-7B79F296835A@gmail.com> References: <5963DDF1F751474D8DEEFDCDBEE43AE716447E36@dfweml504-mbx> <5F8BEB41-DB21-4B37-966D-0392A91BD1D1@gmail.com> <5963DDF1F751474D8DEEFDCDBEE43AE716447F97@dfweml504-mbx> To: Peter McCann X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.1084) Cc: "dmm@ietf.org" Subject: Re: [DMM] Comments on draft-patil-dmm-issues-and-approaches2dmm-00 X-BeenThere: dmm@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.12 Precedence: list List-Id: Distributed Mobility Management Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 08 Mar 2012 08:54:14 -0000 Pete, On Mar 7, 2012, at 4:55 PM, Peter McCann wrote: > Hi, Jouni, >=20 > jouni korhonen wrote: >> Pete, >>=20 >> Thanks for the review. Some thoughts inline. >>=20 >> On Mar 6, 2012, at 11:48 PM, Peter McCann wrote: >>=20 >>> Hi, Raj, Carl, and Jouni, >>>=20 >>> I have some comments on = draft-patil-dmm-issues-and-approaches2dmm-00. >>>=20 >>> I agree with most of Section 4, "Issues with current mobility = models".=20 >>> However, I'd like to point out that existing networks are not just >>> centralized in the manner you point out, they also tend to have a >>> hierarchical structure, e.g., the S-GW/P-GW split in 3GPP EPC.=20 >>> Therefore, the issue you outline in >> Section 4.3 >>=20 >> It is quite common to run combined nodes. >=20 > Sure, in that case the combined S-GW/P-GW is a centralized anchor > point and the excess signaling you point out in Section 4.3 would > indeed be a problem. Actually, signaling due a handover (SGW/SGSN relocation or even L2 = handover) in PGW/GGSN is not the biggest issue.. It is the bearer management in = general, which is not a problem for IETF to tackle. However, designing a system = that is conservative on signaling is a good general guideline. And that is the = reason we emphasize that. So not let us get too stuck with EPC, rather learn = from it. >>> ("Inefficient Routing and signaling overhead") is not quite true of = the >>> 3GPP EPC, which can handle many mobility events in a localized = manner >>> similar to HMIP. >>=20 >> Could you clarify which functionality in EPC you refer to from IP = point >> of view? >=20 > I mean the ability to update a local S-GW with each eNB change, which > avoids the extra signaling to the P-GW. It is architecturally similar > to HMIP (really, PMIP + HMIP). Comparing against HMIP is not that straight forward. In HMIP you have IP exit points at AR, MAP and HA, also local mobility at the IP level under MAP and L2 mobility under AR. With EPC, you have one exist point at your gateway and L2 mobility under SGW. >>> The first paragraph of Section 7 talks about source address = selection, >>> and the need to modify applications so that they request the kind of >>> address that they want. I tend to think that applications will = remain >>> unmodified for some time to come; however, most applications fit = into >>> the paradigm of opening short-lived connections to a server and = could >>> be accommodated with some sort of automatic handling in the MN's IP >>> stack. >>=20 >> I tend to think that developers who care and see some benefit for = their >> applications would update. Completely automated solution within the >> stack would be nice but that also entails larger MN update and would >> also need some additional (out of band) policy information to guide >> address selection. >=20 > It should certainly be possible for both models to co-exist. If an = application > specifies an address, that's great, but if it doesn't, maybe it should = just > get a fixed privately scoped address that is then NATted out to = whatever > public address the MN happens to have at the time the connection gets = made. >=20 >>> I found the last paragraph of Section 7 quite interesting. I too = think >>> that there is an important piece missing that you call "seamless >>> mobility anchor relocation". I think that the use of an interior >>> routing protocol is spot on. In fact, if you read >>> draft-mccann-dmm-flatarch-00, I propose just that. I think we can = use >>> such an anchor relocation protocol to make each access router in an >>> autonomous system (or smaller region of an autonomous system) a >>> temporary anchor for a given prefix. In my draft I propose running >>> I-BGP on each AR and sending BGP UPDATES into the network upon >>> localized mobility events. Such a protocol can also be >> used as a >>=20 >> I yet need to read your draft properly.. but in general trying to = solve >> mobility issues with routing protocols is just moving the problems = out >> of your hands to others. You easily end up with uncomfortable amount = of >> host routes and your network being constantly in a "converging" = state.. >=20 > We need to do some simulation/implementation experiments to see if = this > is a problem. Hopefully I'll have more to say on that soon. But, = intuitively, That would be excellent. > the UPDATE just has to propagate one hop to the crossover router to be = effective. > We don't need the whole network to be converged for packets to take = the right > path toward the currently serving AR. You need to be careful on the deployment architecture you introduce stuff like this. I am just being conservative ;) Once the constraints and assumptions are better known it is easier to evaluate the solution. >>> substitute for the proxy ND technique that is currently specified to >>> "grab" the MN's packets at the HA. By using a routing protocol, the = HA >>> can reach across several routing hops so it doesn't necessarily need = to >>> be on the home link (which can be the first AR to which the MN >>> attached). I think this would also enable us to unify the >>> authentication protocols used at the AR with the authentication >>> protocol used at the HA. The ARs are just like HAs that don't have = to >>> tunnel the data anywhere because the MN is locally connected. >>=20 >> There are virtues for exploring the routing protocol "enslavement" = for >> additional mobility management. Geo-redundancy would, for example, >> benefit from it. >=20 > You would get all the benefits of distribution and fault-tolerance = from > the routing protocol itself. IP routing already has these features = built-in. > It is the establishment of tunnel state in a single box that makes the = network > fragile. - Jouni >=20 > -Pete >=20 From jouni.nospam@gmail.com Thu Mar 8 01:02:21 2012 Return-Path: X-Original-To: dmm@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: dmm@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5D14C21F864D for ; Thu, 8 Mar 2012 01:02:21 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.961 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.961 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.019, BAYES_00=-2.599, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW=-1, RCVD_IN_SORBS_WEB=0.619] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([12.22.58.30]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id IadIyI23iqJB for ; Thu, 8 Mar 2012 01:02:21 -0800 (PST) Received: from mail-pz0-f44.google.com (mail-pz0-f44.google.com [209.85.210.44]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 55AA621F8648 for ; Thu, 8 Mar 2012 01:02:14 -0800 (PST) Received: by dakl33 with SMTP id l33so291558dak.31 for ; Thu, 08 Mar 2012 01:02:14 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20120113; h=from:content-type:content-transfer-encoding:subject:date:message-id :cc:to:mime-version:x-mailer; bh=hblJS+QhQ8x1nMpsHSFv6m1dVfOoFbmVSSKtauoY9wA=; b=l1bp5rwnmYPr7OUDB46Sjl/LJPKuI2LDp+I7nh3vDJ+sCP0tA9vMw4hjpWuJ3YioqY jifkL6B40d96e0WOHtBkhV7vSK1F+DZjztBxUMrK9btHcMLuqkjMAiFvxU0obl6pyDqB MyrD7OXzLtxsusD3zFRpkg0YlfFkl4qYKZQe5v8tlmNcNCK862jl65UmSNIFT4jPzLiC oxC8mSnL+k8JJJb+kwqHcP3iqJmyZxhbtO5Xr5wqUQxUsQmh624WkzLM5HKsCJ/DyZhp EBWVTT42OTpNMOyPEf9lH0FKOOb+Bo1e/gyniixsUREWnuMKzLo9tNXpHcTj/0SN69yL Hv+A== Received: by 10.68.202.135 with SMTP id ki7mr8147223pbc.158.1331197333978; Thu, 08 Mar 2012 01:02:13 -0800 (PST) Received: from [10.255.131.45] ([192.100.123.77]) by mx.google.com with ESMTPS id s7sm2292067pbb.25.2012.03.08.01.02.11 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=OTHER); Thu, 08 Mar 2012 01:02:13 -0800 (PST) From: jouni korhonen Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Date: Thu, 8 Mar 2012 11:02:07 +0200 Message-Id: To: dmm@ietf.org Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v1084) X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.1084) Cc: dmm-chairs@tools.ietf.org Subject: [DMM] Paris meeting logistics X-BeenThere: dmm@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.12 Precedence: list List-Id: Distributed Mobility Management Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 08 Mar 2012 09:02:21 -0000 Folks, The number of presentation requests has been overwhelming, so be = prepared that chairs either drop some, suggest grouping similar presentation or brutally cut down the time for each slot. More on this will follow = later. In order to make the meeting start smoothly and in a timely manner we = solicit for note takers and a jabber scribe already now. If you feel like = volunteering just drop a mail to chairs. We might even think trading extra = presentation time for note takers, assuming they also have a presentation to give ;-) - Jouni & Julien =20= From Peter.McCann@huawei.com Thu Mar 8 06:35:49 2012 Return-Path: X-Original-To: dmm@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: dmm@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id BD2B721F86CF for ; Thu, 8 Mar 2012 06:35:49 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.442 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.442 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=-0.157, BAYES_00=-2.599, SARE_MILLIONSOF=0.315] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([12.22.58.30]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 1cMRDYiQQCjt for ; Thu, 8 Mar 2012 06:35:48 -0800 (PST) Received: from dfwrgout.huawei.com (dfwrgout.huawei.com [206.16.17.72]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5C1C321F86C3 for ; Thu, 8 Mar 2012 06:35:48 -0800 (PST) Received: from 172.18.9.243 (EHLO dfweml201-edg.china.huawei.com) ([172.18.9.243]) by dfwrg01-dlp.huawei.com (MOS 4.2.3-GA FastPath) with ESMTP id AEF17728; Thu, 08 Mar 2012 09:35:48 -0500 (EST) Received: from DFWEML406-HUB.china.huawei.com (10.193.5.131) by dfweml201-edg.china.huawei.com (172.18.9.107) with Microsoft SMTP Server (TLS) id 14.1.323.3; Thu, 8 Mar 2012 06:33:26 -0800 Received: from DFWEML504-MBX.china.huawei.com ([10.124.31.30]) by dfweml406-hub.china.huawei.com ([10.193.5.131]) with mapi id 14.01.0323.003; Thu, 8 Mar 2012 22:33:29 +0800 From: Peter McCann To: "Basavaraj.Patil@nokia.com" , "dmm@ietf.org" Thread-Topic: [DMM] draft-mccann-dmm-flatarch-00.txt Thread-Index: Acz7ppM5+XaI77SoQaqa8Y3fzGKc1wA06z0AAC7WHBA= Date: Thu, 8 Mar 2012 14:33:27 +0000 Message-ID: <5963DDF1F751474D8DEEFDCDBEE43AE7164481C0@dfweml504-mbx> References: <5963DDF1F751474D8DEEFDCDBEE43AE716447C77@dfweml504-mbx> In-Reply-To: Accept-Language: en-US, zh-CN Content-Language: en-US X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: x-originating-ip: [10.193.125.95] Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable MIME-Version: 1.0 X-CFilter-Loop: Reflected Subject: Re: [DMM] draft-mccann-dmm-flatarch-00.txt X-BeenThere: dmm@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.12 Precedence: list List-Id: Distributed Mobility Management Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 08 Mar 2012 14:35:49 -0000 Hi, Raj, Basavaraj.Patil@nokia.com wrote: >=20 > Hi Pete, >=20 > Interesting proposal and approach to mobility. A few comments below: >=20 > 1. The I-D mentions that the scope of an address space is within that of > an autonomous system. Do you see this autonomous system as one that > encompasses an operators entire network? I am just trying to get an > understanding of how big this autonomous system is. Given that an > operator could be serving millions of mobile nodes, how large can this > single contiguous autonomous system be? Strictly speaking, an autonomous system is the scope within which the same AS number is used and within which I-BGP runs. However, the scope in which an address can remain assigned to an MN would in reality be a subset of the AS, to be determined based on an engineering trade-off between the amount of BGP UPDATES, their scope, and the size of the routing tables you are able to maintain on the one hand, and the overhead of getting a new IP address assigned on the other. > 2. Is the eNB/BS the AR in the proposal (fig 2 for example)? Yes, that would be the idea. > 3. If the eNB/BS is the AR, do you foresee concerns with the amount of > updates resulting from MNs moving between eNBs/BS'? The UPDATEs only need to propagate up to the route reflector(s) if you are moving within a cluster. In that case, I don't think the update is any more overhead than the tunnel migration that is done today under an S-GW. If you are moving between clusters, then yes, the update has to propagate further. Again, you need to make an engineering tradeoff in terms of how far the UPDATEs are allowed to propagate vs. the overhead of getting a new address. > 4. You state that legacy/hierarchical mobility based solutions "suffer > from poor performance, scalability and failure point(s)". I think that > the current networks have proven to be capable of supporting fairly > large numbers of users/MNs. So I don't see scalability being an issue. The current solutions tend to lead to P-GWs/GGSNs with millions of sessions homed on them. While it is possible to build such animals with massive investments in fault tolerant hardware, a more scalable approach would be to distribute the state maintained into many smaller, cheaper boxes. > And similarly I don't know what is the benchmark against which you are > comparing performance either.=20 The main performance drawback is the sub-optimal routing back to the anchor point. > Whether this architecture can scale > further to support billions of devices is of course an unknown and could > be an issue. Indeed. > 5. The I-D states: "In particular, we note that many MNs will > not require a fixed IP address for the entire duration of their > packet data session, as they will most likely be acting as clients > and initiating short-lived connections to servers." > This seems to be contradicting the solution which results in the address > being registered in DNS and the reverse lookup by the target eNB/BS > whenever there is a handover. Would it not be preferable to have a > short-lived address as well as one that continues to exist beyond > handovers? The text you quote says "many"; it does not say "all". Indeed, I think we need to support both kinds of MNs. The point is a softer one, in that we need to do our engineering for the most common case and worry less about the tail ends of the distribution. That's how we get good performance from the solution. Those MNs that need a fixed address should be supported= , it's just that the longer you keep the address, and the more mobility event= s that you have during such a session, the more overhead and routing table bl= oat you get. Nodes that periodically re-request a new, local address and depre= cate their old address are good citizens that help to reduce this overhead and routing table size. The paragraph just says there are likely to be many nodes that are capable of this behavior, so it is likely we can keep the routing table updates/sizes to a manageable level. > 6. Fig 2 shows an architecture wherein the eNB/BS itself is the 1st hop > AR. Given the shrinking cell sizes (to increase capacity) the likelihood > of Handovers even at pedestrian speeds goes up. Why not allow for a > level of indirection? That would reduce the amount of signaling and > reduce route updates. If by "level of indirection" you mean a tunnel from the old AR to the new AR, that leads to some of the same drawbacks of the hierarchical architectu= re. Packets would need to traverse the backhaul 3 times to reach the MN and the old AR would become a single point of failure for that session. > 7. Authentication upon attachment to re-attachment to a BS every time > could become quite expensive even with advanced CPUs. I don't know how > efficient the proposal to use the new breed of auth algorithms are on > battery for example. This needs to be studied. Caching the LTSS for frequently visited BSs will be a big help here. =20 > 8. The I-D states: "Then the mobile node updates its home DNS server to > point from its hostname to the new address." >=20 > If an MN is moving at 70mph and doing handovers every few seconds/mins, > does this approach work? Given the RTT for the DNS update? You wouldn't do this on every handover, only when you get a new IP address/= prefix allocated. That's the beauty of decoupling address assignment from mobilit= y management. > 9. The handovers and the route updates that happen within an autonomous > system and/or across it are not entirely clear. Hope to see your > presentation and explanation at IETF83. Sorry if the text isn't clear. It assumes a fairly intimate understanding of how to configure I-BGP. Hopefully my presentation slides will give you a better picture of how it is supposed to work. =20 > 10. The idea of integrating authentication with mobility is good and > should enable faster handoffs. The integration is at two points: 1) using link authentication with the AR to trigger network-based routing u= pdates; 2) using MIP authentication with the HA to trigger the same network-based r= outing updates I hope we can work on standardizing both of these authentication steps to use the same credentials and operate with minimal round-trips. =20 > The concept is interesting and I was wondering if you have any > simulations or results from such. Unfortunately not yet. We are working on it. Will keep you updated. > -Raj >=20 > On 3/6/12 8:36 AM, "ext Peter McCann" wrote: >=20 >> Hi, all, >>=20 >> On Friday I submitted a new draft that outlines what I think is a novel >> approach to mobility management in a totally flat network. The draft >> can be found here: >>=20 >> http://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-mccann-dmm-flatarch-00 >>=20 >> Abstract >>=20 >> Today's mobility management schemes make use of a hierarchy of >> tunnels from a relatively fixed anchor point, through one or more >> intermediate nodes, to reach the MN's current point of attachment. >> These schemes suffer from poor performance, scalability, and failure >> modes due to the centralization and statefulness of the anchor >> point(s). The dmm (Distributed Mobility Management) working group is >> currently chartered to investigate alternative solutions that will >> provide greater performance, scalability, and robustness through the >> distribution of mobility anchors. This document is an input to the >> dmm discussion. It outlines a problem statement for the existing >> mobility management techniques and goes on to propose (high-level) >> solutions to two of the most vexing problems: MN authentication and >> mobility management in a fully distributed, flat (non-hierarchical) >> access network. These two aspects are often treated separately in a >> layered architecture, but we argue there are important advantages to >> considering how these two functions can work in tandem to provide a >> simple and robust framework for the design of a wireless Internet >> Service Provider network. >>=20 >> I'd like some time to present this draft during the meeting in Paris, >> hopefully 15 minutes. From Peter.McCann@huawei.com Thu Mar 8 06:40:23 2012 Return-Path: X-Original-To: dmm@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: dmm@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9D52A21F8646 for ; Thu, 8 Mar 2012 06:40:23 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.577 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.577 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.023, BAYES_00=-2.599] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([12.22.58.30]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id MpMEmJnRMdPD for ; Thu, 8 Mar 2012 06:40:23 -0800 (PST) Received: from dfwrgout.huawei.com (dfwrgout.huawei.com [206.16.17.72]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id DF7A221F8628 for ; Thu, 8 Mar 2012 06:40:22 -0800 (PST) Received: from 172.18.9.243 (EHLO dfweml202-edg.china.huawei.com) ([172.18.9.243]) by dfwrg02-dlp.huawei.com (MOS 4.2.3-GA FastPath) with ESMTP id ADX08690; Thu, 08 Mar 2012 09:40:22 -0500 (EST) Received: from DFWEML408-HUB.china.huawei.com (10.193.5.134) by dfweml202-edg.china.huawei.com (172.18.9.108) with Microsoft SMTP Server (TLS) id 14.1.323.3; Thu, 8 Mar 2012 06:37:31 -0800 Received: from DFWEML504-MBX.china.huawei.com ([10.124.31.30]) by dfweml408-hub.china.huawei.com ([10.193.5.134]) with mapi id 14.01.0323.003; Thu, 8 Mar 2012 06:37:28 -0800 From: Peter McCann To: jouni korhonen Thread-Topic: Comments on draft-patil-dmm-issues-and-approaches2dmm-00 Thread-Index: Acz74tbaKHHVfQwFSOaADK0zCMsIqwACaJGAACEb3gAAFUN1AAAcpkGQ Date: Thu, 8 Mar 2012 14:37:27 +0000 Message-ID: <5963DDF1F751474D8DEEFDCDBEE43AE7164481CE@dfweml504-mbx> References: <5963DDF1F751474D8DEEFDCDBEE43AE716447E36@dfweml504-mbx> <5F8BEB41-DB21-4B37-966D-0392A91BD1D1@gmail.com> <5963DDF1F751474D8DEEFDCDBEE43AE716447F97@dfweml504-mbx> <904A4168-0C92-41E9-AE0E-7B79F296835A@gmail.com> In-Reply-To: <904A4168-0C92-41E9-AE0E-7B79F296835A@gmail.com> Accept-Language: en-US, zh-CN Content-Language: en-US X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: x-originating-ip: [10.193.125.95] Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable MIME-Version: 1.0 X-CFilter-Loop: Reflected Cc: "dmm@ietf.org" Subject: Re: [DMM] Comments on draft-patil-dmm-issues-and-approaches2dmm-00 X-BeenThere: dmm@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.12 Precedence: list List-Id: Distributed Mobility Management Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 08 Mar 2012 14:40:23 -0000 Hi, Jouni, jouni korhonen wrote: > Pete, >=20 > On Mar 7, 2012, at 4:55 PM, Peter McCann wrote: >=20 >> Hi, Jouni, >>=20 >> jouni korhonen wrote: >>> Pete, >>>=20 >>> Thanks for the review. Some thoughts inline. >>>=20 >>> On Mar 6, 2012, at 11:48 PM, Peter McCann wrote: >>>=20 >>>> Hi, Raj, Carl, and Jouni, >>>>=20 >>>> I have some comments on draft-patil-dmm-issues-and-approaches2dmm- 00. >>>>=20 >>>> I agree with most of Section 4, "Issues with current mobility >>>> models". However, I'd like to point out that existing networks are >>>> not just centralized in the manner you point out, they also tend to >>>> have a hierarchical structure, e.g., the S-GW/P-GW split in 3GPP EPC. >>>> Therefore, the issue you outline in >>> Section 4.3 >>>=20 >>> It is quite common to run combined nodes. >>=20 >> Sure, in that case the combined S-GW/P-GW is a centralized anchor >> point and the excess signaling you point out in Section 4.3 would >> indeed be a problem. >=20 > Actually, signaling due a handover (SGW/SGSN relocation or even L2 > handover) in PGW/GGSN is not the biggest issue.. It is the bearer > management in general, which is not a problem for IETF to tackle. > However, designing a system that is conservative on signaling is a good > general guideline. And that is the reason we emphasize that. So not let > us get too stuck with EPC, rather learn from it. I agree. >>>> ("Inefficient Routing and signaling overhead") is not quite true of >>>> the 3GPP EPC, which can handle many mobility events in a localized >>>> manner similar to HMIP. >>>=20 >>> Could you clarify which functionality in EPC you refer to from IP >>> point of view? >>=20 >> I mean the ability to update a local S-GW with each eNB change, which >> avoids the extra signaling to the P-GW. It is architecturally similar >> to HMIP (really, PMIP + HMIP). >=20 > Comparing against HMIP is not that straight forward. In HMIP you have > IP exit points at AR, MAP and HA, also local mobility at the IP level > under MAP and L2 mobility under AR. With EPC, you have one exist point > at your gateway and L2 mobility under SGW. If you combine HMIP with PMIP (as I think some would propose) it starts to look very similar to the L2 mobility provided by GPRS. >> We need to do some simulation/implementation experiments to see if this >> is a problem. Hopefully I'll have more to say on that soon. But, > intuitively, >=20 > That would be excellent. >=20 >> the UPDATE just has to propagate one hop to the crossover router to be >> effective. We don't need the whole network to be converged for packets >> to take the right path toward the currently serving AR. >=20 > You need to be careful on the deployment architecture you introduce > stuff like this. I am just being conservative ;) Once the constraints > and assumptions are better known it is easier to evaluate the solution. Yes we need to do a simulation and play with the parameters to find out engineering guidelines for how to dimension the network. But, I think that= 's generally true of any solution. -Pete From Basavaraj.Patil@nokia.com Thu Mar 8 08:14:05 2012 Return-Path: X-Original-To: dmm@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: dmm@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0BA9D21F85B7 for ; Thu, 8 Mar 2012 08:14:05 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -104.935 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-104.935 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=1.664, BAYES_00=-2.599, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-4, USER_IN_WHITELIST=-100] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([12.22.58.30]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id uKi2WeLWctEQ for ; Thu, 8 Mar 2012 08:14:04 -0800 (PST) Received: from mgw-da01.nokia.com (smtp.nokia.com [147.243.128.24]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 06CE521F85AA for ; Thu, 8 Mar 2012 08:14:03 -0800 (PST) Received: from vaebh106.NOE.Nokia.com (in-mx.nokia.com [10.160.244.32]) by mgw-da01.nokia.com (Switch-3.4.4/Switch-3.4.4) with ESMTP id q28GE1Vm020501; Thu, 8 Mar 2012 18:14:01 +0200 Received: from smtp.mgd.nokia.com ([65.54.30.58]) by vaebh106.NOE.Nokia.com over TLS secured channel with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.4675); Thu, 8 Mar 2012 18:14:00 +0200 Received: from 008-AM1MPN1-073.mgdnok.nokia.com ([169.254.3.150]) by 008-AM1MMR1-003.mgdnok.nokia.com ([65.54.30.58]) with mapi id 14.01.0355.003; Thu, 8 Mar 2012 17:14:00 +0100 From: To: , Thread-Topic: [DMM] R: New IETF draft submitted Thread-Index: Acz4YTV+3ZThzRokRSuSJwteK/q3dgD5mjwgADEMDAA= Date: Thu, 8 Mar 2012 16:14:00 +0000 Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <36A93B31228D3B49B691AD31652BCAE9A597EBEAEA@GRFMBX702BA020.griffon.local> Accept-Language: en-US Content-Language: en-US X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: user-agent: Microsoft-MacOutlook/14.14.0.111121 x-originating-ip: [72.64.105.193] Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-ID: <518675C3A3CFC8439467E18D8B3AAE02@mgd.nokia.com> Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable MIME-Version: 1.0 X-OriginalArrivalTime: 08 Mar 2012 16:14:00.0668 (UTC) FILETIME=[790301C0:01CCFD46] X-Nokia-AV: Clean Subject: Re: [DMM] R: New IETF draft submitted X-BeenThere: dmm@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.12 Precedence: list List-Id: Distributed Mobility Management Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 08 Mar 2012 16:14:05 -0000 Hi Elena, Thanks for the I-D which is an attempt to provide the basis for computing the cost benefits of a hierarchical Vs distributed mobility architecture. A few questions: 1. I am not sure I understand Fig 3 which is portraying the distributed model. You have multiple PGWs in this architecture as opposed to Fig 2. How does that make the architecture distributed? 2. The major cost obviously lies in backhauling traffic from the eNB/BS' to the PGW. Does your model account for this? Additionally the cost varies depending on whether the SGW and PGW are in different countries, between operator boundaries etc. Not sure if you consider these variables as well. 3. In the figures, does the backbone refer to the network consisting of the SGW, MME, eNB/BS'? 4. Have you mapped the equations with real-world traffic costs in the TI network to see how close they are? I do think that a formal way to derive the cost benefits of centralized vs distributed mobility architectures is very useful and this is a good start. -Raj On 3/7/12 3:59 AM, "ext Demaria Elena" wrote: >Hi all, >this is to inform you that we have submitted a new draft related to DMM >topic. >http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-demaria-dmm-dimensioning-conside >rations-00.txt > One of the main questions posed during recent discussions on > distributed mobility architectures is if the distributed architecture > can have advantages in terms of costs with respect to a centralized > one. > > This draft describes a general method to calculate the costs of the > centralized and distributed scenarios. Even if a simplified model > has been used, some information can be earned. Each operator can use > this model and his own costs to discover the optimal architecture > based on traffic observed in the network. > >Comments welcome. > >Elena > > > >-----Messaggio originale----- >Da: i-d-announce-bounces@ietf.org [mailto:i-d-announce-bounces@ietf.org] >Per conto di internet-drafts@ietf.org >Inviato: venerd=EC 2 marzo 2012 11:38 >A: i-d-announce@ietf.org >Oggetto: I-D Action: draft-demaria-dmm-dimensioning-considerations-00.txt > > >A New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line Internet-Drafts >directories. > > Title : Dimensioning considerations for distributed >mobility architecture > Author(s) : Elena Demaria > Loris Marchetti > Filename : >draft-demaria-dmm-dimensioning-considerations-00.txt > Pages : 10 > Date : 2012-03-02 > > One of the main questions posed during recent discussions on > distributed mobility architectures is if the distributed architecture > can have advantages in terms of costs with respect to a centralized > one. > > This draft describes a general method to calculate the costs of the > centralized and distributed scenarios. Even if a simplified model > has been used, some information can be earned. Each operator can use > this model and his own costs to discover the optimal architecture > based on traffic observed in the network. > > >A URL for this Internet-Draft is: >http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-demaria-dmm-dimensioning-conside >rations-00.txt > >Internet-Drafts are also available by anonymous FTP at: >ftp://ftp.ietf.org/internet-drafts/ > >This Internet-Draft can be retrieved at: >ftp://ftp.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-demaria-dmm-dimensioning-consider >ations-00.txt > >_______________________________________________ >I-D-Announce mailing list >I-D-Announce@ietf.org >https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/i-d-announce >Internet-Draft directories: http://www.ietf.org/shadow.html or >ftp://ftp.ietf.org/ietf/1shadow-sites.txt > >Questo messaggio e i suoi allegati sono indirizzati esclusivamente alle >persone indicate. La diffusione, copia o qualsiasi altra azione derivante >dalla conoscenza di queste informazioni sono rigorosamente vietate. >Qualora abbiate ricevuto questo documento per errore siete cortesemente >pregati di darne immediata comunicazione al mittente e di provvedere alla >sua distruzione, Grazie. > >This e-mail and any attachments is confidential and may contain >privileged information intended for the addressee(s) only. Dissemination, >copying, printing or use by anybody else is unauthorised. If you are not >the intended recipient, please delete this message and any attachments >and advise the sender by return e-mail, Thanks. > >_______________________________________________ >dmm mailing list >dmm@ietf.org >https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dmm From sarikaya2012@gmail.com Thu Mar 8 09:10:13 2012 Return-Path: X-Original-To: dmm@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: dmm@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 480D421F8446 for ; Thu, 8 Mar 2012 09:10:13 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -3.56 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-3.56 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.039, BAYES_00=-2.599, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW=-1] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([12.22.58.30]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id AjDsWPciM5-N for ; Thu, 8 Mar 2012 09:10:11 -0800 (PST) Received: from mail-iy0-f172.google.com (mail-iy0-f172.google.com [209.85.210.172]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 78C7421F8438 for ; Thu, 8 Mar 2012 09:10:11 -0800 (PST) Received: by iazz13 with SMTP id z13so1087369iaz.31 for ; Thu, 08 Mar 2012 09:10:11 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20120113; h=mime-version:reply-to:in-reply-to:references:date:message-id :subject:from:to:cc:content-type; bh=bomt+x0z5AC/9qd6XCVX35r2H1KpX0PyCPH2ZUZh5jY=; b=lWcLy2U+MzwDnD0+W6Lx0PSLy8aV/emBLwXAEf1yFXjU0uRz+1OMpmYAAQ6m5mHhaG hJuZ5jzyZkP9Jt6hrVfyDfJ/4IXzGd7kRChBImgA/vv5pkgkU8fMJ9oIpoJ86TXzTZzt tRYXOA+zGTZRDEz7lecvFJyCOCDuSlI06eXd6QzdtUcsjboj68xgBmbci+BCPg3Dyc5K uM3uC5CkXCdO1QKiFhcFeWG/zLnmqA+TpuFGioHmvn/yok8QH0HxrYdLlWgfTBzL4n+D P+B3CDmShUM1mhPTNTlZRueeJ10fnIHhf9/pnMqIG6pnQiIVS1fJsQtNlsVN0zRGu6m3 MI+A== MIME-Version: 1.0 Received: by 10.50.192.196 with SMTP id hi4mr7760849igc.55.1331226611083; Thu, 08 Mar 2012 09:10:11 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.231.179.71 with HTTP; Thu, 8 Mar 2012 09:10:11 -0800 (PST) In-Reply-To: References: Date: Thu, 8 Mar 2012 11:10:11 -0600 Message-ID: From: Behcet Sarikaya To: jouni korhonen Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Cc: dmm@ietf.org, dmm-chairs@tools.ietf.org Subject: Re: [DMM] Paris meeting logistics X-BeenThere: dmm@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.12 Precedence: list Reply-To: sarikaya@ieee.org List-Id: Distributed Mobility Management Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 08 Mar 2012 17:10:13 -0000 I can be the jabber scribe. Regards, Behcet On Thu, Mar 8, 2012 at 3:02 AM, jouni korhonen wrote: > Folks, > > The number of presentation requests has been overwhelming, so be prepared > that chairs either drop some, suggest grouping similar presentation or > brutally cut down the time for each slot. More on this will follow later. > > In order to make the meeting start smoothly and in a timely manner we solicit > for note takers and a jabber scribe already now. If you feel like volunteering > just drop a mail to chairs. We might even think trading extra presentation > time for note takers, assuming they also have a presentation to give ;-) > > - Jouni & Julien > > _______________________________________________ > dmm mailing list > dmm@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dmm From jouni.nospam@gmail.com Thu Mar 8 13:25:15 2012 Return-Path: X-Original-To: dmm@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: dmm@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id B2FEF21E8066 for ; Thu, 8 Mar 2012 13:25:15 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -3.561 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-3.561 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.038, BAYES_00=-2.599, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW=-1] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([12.22.58.30]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 1TwxZVeo01cC for ; Thu, 8 Mar 2012 13:25:15 -0800 (PST) Received: from mail-we0-f172.google.com (mail-we0-f172.google.com [74.125.82.172]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id D5BD621E8046 for ; Thu, 8 Mar 2012 13:25:11 -0800 (PST) Received: by werb10 with SMTP id b10so819326wer.31 for ; Thu, 08 Mar 2012 13:25:11 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20120113; h=subject:mime-version:content-type:from:in-reply-to:date:cc :content-transfer-encoding:message-id:references:to:x-mailer; bh=IN0i111/jy6syteboeHdAHPpvhmfdg68/dH6MEtGOs4=; b=0OJM/ILCe5A/2lasmPwPC6zOJsMMU61r4nPBeZwiSbaqR9A5ljTG3vMELCh1BBRPxX B5drZ5P4tpTaOQe3xid20jVx8X4rZ/HHIUcokl1fX3fVTVuuDNJAnQDHa2p7G+DSLHGN 0abc1/v3q/5DMRNORqT1IYtPQLB8BZfdUchKOD/29o7VG+ycS5hw/Y1HcoRuAAoKWv6R hq5sLXyVrohFdvBU70V8Pmr7nBRG+ly/a2eKuYcVxoz6NKRbpH5AEpJF1kW+IVzMJbOM H73zueOkjGPA7/1zUKO97N3E9voCJH1X3Slp7rd5JqS0VhIwTfdXI1VLCTRlPrTi6mFW b31g== Received: by 10.180.92.34 with SMTP id cj2mr16080597wib.20.1331241910993; Thu, 08 Mar 2012 13:25:10 -0800 (PST) Received: from [188.117.15.110] ([188.117.15.110]) by mx.google.com with ESMTPS id j3sm14331450wiw.1.2012.03.08.13.25.09 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=OTHER); Thu, 08 Mar 2012 13:25:10 -0800 (PST) Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v1257) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 From: Jouni In-Reply-To: Date: Thu, 8 Mar 2012 23:25:09 +0200 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Message-Id: <7E108517-B062-426C-95EC-73838A497EEB@gmail.com> References: To: sarikaya@ieee.org X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.1257) Cc: dmm@ietf.org, dmm-chairs@tools.ietf.org Subject: Re: [DMM] Paris meeting logistics X-BeenThere: dmm@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.12 Precedence: list List-Id: Distributed Mobility Management Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 08 Mar 2012 21:25:15 -0000 Thanks Behcet! - Jouni On Mar 8, 2012, at 7:10 PM, Behcet Sarikaya wrote: > I can be the jabber scribe. >=20 > Regards, >=20 > Behcet >=20 > On Thu, Mar 8, 2012 at 3:02 AM, jouni korhonen = wrote: >> Folks, >>=20 >> The number of presentation requests has been overwhelming, so be = prepared >> that chairs either drop some, suggest grouping similar presentation = or >> brutally cut down the time for each slot. More on this will follow = later. >>=20 >> In order to make the meeting start smoothly and in a timely manner we = solicit >> for note takers and a jabber scribe already now. If you feel like = volunteering >> just drop a mail to chairs. We might even think trading extra = presentation >> time for note takers, assuming they also have a presentation to give = ;-) >>=20 >> - Jouni & Julien >>=20 >> _______________________________________________ >> dmm mailing list >> dmm@ietf.org >> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dmm From elena.demaria@telecomitalia.it Fri Mar 9 01:41:19 2012 Return-Path: X-Original-To: dmm@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: dmm@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id D3EBC21F8609 for ; Fri, 9 Mar 2012 01:41:19 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.719 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.719 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-2.599, HELO_EQ_IT=0.635, HOST_EQ_IT=1.245, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW=-1] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([12.22.58.30]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id AptZO5yGb9lj for ; Fri, 9 Mar 2012 01:41:19 -0800 (PST) Received: from GRFEDG701BA020.telecomitalia.it (grfedg701ba020.telecomitalia.it [156.54.233.200]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8A29E21F857D for ; Fri, 9 Mar 2012 01:41:18 -0800 (PST) Received: from GRFHUB703BA020.griffon.local (10.188.101.113) by GRFEDG701BA020.telecomitalia.it (10.188.45.100) with Microsoft SMTP Server (TLS) id 8.2.254.0; Fri, 9 Mar 2012 10:41:09 +0100 Received: from GRFMBX702BA020.griffon.local ([10.188.101.12]) by GRFHUB703BA020.griffon.local ([10.188.101.113]) with mapi; Fri, 9 Mar 2012 10:41:09 +0100 From: Demaria Elena To: "Basavaraj.Patil@nokia.com" , "dmm@ietf.org" Date: Fri, 9 Mar 2012 10:41:07 +0100 Thread-Topic: [DMM] R: New IETF draft submitted Thread-Index: Acz4YTV+3ZThzRokRSuSJwteK/q3dgD5mjwgADEMDAAAMrcisA== Message-ID: <36A93B31228D3B49B691AD31652BCAE9A597FE4F1D@GRFMBX702BA020.griffon.local> References: <36A93B31228D3B49B691AD31652BCAE9A597EBEAEA@GRFMBX702BA020.griffon.local> In-Reply-To: Accept-Language: en-US, it-IT Content-Language: it-IT X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: acceptlanguage: en-US, it-IT x-ti-disclaimer: Disclaimer1 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable MIME-Version: 1.0 Subject: [DMM] R: R: New IETF draft submitted X-BeenThere: dmm@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.12 Precedence: list List-Id: Distributed Mobility Management Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 09 Mar 2012 09:41:20 -0000 Hi Raj, thanks for your review. Comments inline. -----Messaggio originale----- Da: Basavaraj.Patil@nokia.com [mailto:Basavaraj.Patil@nokia.com] Inviato: gioved=EC 8 marzo 2012 17:14 A: Demaria Elena; dmm@ietf.org Oggetto: Re: [DMM] R: New IETF draft submitted Hi Elena, Thanks for the I-D which is an attempt to provide the basis for computing t= he cost benefits of a hierarchical Vs distributed mobility architecture. A few questions: 1. I am not sure I understand Fig 3 which is portraying the distributed mod= el. You have multiple PGWs in this architecture as opposed to Fig 2. How does that make the architecture distributed? [ED] There are different possible level of distribution. In this first (sim= plified) model we considered an operator with only one point of exchange wi= th the big Internet. The question is: would it be convenient for the operator to distribute the = GWs in all PoPs or just to maintain a single GW in the PoP hosting the inte= rnet point of exchange? The answer is: it depends on the amount of local and Internet traffic. We based this initial model looking at current mobility architectures. One = of the scopes for further work is to extend the study to see what happens i= f the GW is co-located with the eNB, so considering a more strict DMM appro= ach to mobility. 2. The major cost obviously lies in backhauling traffic from the eNB/BS' to the PGW. Does your model account for this? Additionally the cost varies = depending on whether the SGW and PGW are in different countries, between op= erator boundaries etc. Not sure if you consider these variables as well. [ED] The costs considered were only from one PoP to another since what vari= es is the position of GWs and the backhauling from the eNBs doesn't change. We didn't consider roaming case yet. 3. In the figures, does the backbone refer to the network consisting of the= SGW, MME, eNB/BS'? [ED] No, the backbone refers to the inter-PoP network. Moreover, for the ti= me being, we only considered user plane traffic, not signaling. 4. Have you mapped the equations with real-world traffic costs in the TI ne= twork to see how close they are? [ED] Even if the cost model and the equations are still preliminary and ver= y simplified the answer is yes. Elena I do think that a formal way to derive the cost benefits of centralized vs = distributed mobility architectures is very useful and this is a good start. -Raj On 3/7/12 3:59 AM, "ext Demaria Elena" wrote: >Hi all, >this is to inform you that we have submitted a new draft related to DMM >topic. >http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-demaria-dmm-dimensioning-cons >ide >rations-00.txt > One of the main questions posed during recent discussions on > distributed mobility architectures is if the distributed architecture > can have advantages in terms of costs with respect to a centralized > one. > > This draft describes a general method to calculate the costs of the > centralized and distributed scenarios. Even if a simplified model > has been used, some information can be earned. Each operator can use > this model and his own costs to discover the optimal architecture > based on traffic observed in the network. > >Comments welcome. > >Elena > > > >-----Messaggio originale----- >Da: i-d-announce-bounces@ietf.org >[mailto:i-d-announce-bounces@ietf.org] >Per conto di internet-drafts@ietf.org >Inviato: venerd=EC 2 marzo 2012 11:38 >A: i-d-announce@ietf.org >Oggetto: I-D Action: >draft-demaria-dmm-dimensioning-considerations-00.txt > > >A New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line Internet-Drafts >directories. > > Title : Dimensioning considerations for distributed >mobility architecture > Author(s) : Elena Demaria > Loris Marchetti > Filename : >draft-demaria-dmm-dimensioning-considerations-00.txt > Pages : 10 > Date : 2012-03-02 > > One of the main questions posed during recent discussions on > distributed mobility architectures is if the distributed architecture > can have advantages in terms of costs with respect to a centralized > one. > > This draft describes a general method to calculate the costs of the > centralized and distributed scenarios. Even if a simplified model > has been used, some information can be earned. Each operator can use > this model and his own costs to discover the optimal architecture > based on traffic observed in the network. > > >A URL for this Internet-Draft is: >http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-demaria-dmm-dimensioning-cons >ide >rations-00.txt > >Internet-Drafts are also available by anonymous FTP at: >ftp://ftp.ietf.org/internet-drafts/ > >This Internet-Draft can be retrieved at: >ftp://ftp.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-demaria-dmm-dimensioning-consi >der >ations-00.txt > >_______________________________________________ >I-D-Announce mailing list >I-D-Announce@ietf.org >https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/i-d-announce >Internet-Draft directories: http://www.ietf.org/shadow.html or >ftp://ftp.ietf.org/ietf/1shadow-sites.txt > >Questo messaggio e i suoi allegati sono indirizzati esclusivamente alle >persone indicate. La diffusione, copia o qualsiasi altra azione >derivante dalla conoscenza di queste informazioni sono rigorosamente vieta= te. >Qualora abbiate ricevuto questo documento per errore siete cortesemente >pregati di darne immediata comunicazione al mittente e di provvedere >alla sua distruzione, Grazie. > >This e-mail and any attachments is confidential and may contain >privileged information intended for the addressee(s) only. >Dissemination, copying, printing or use by anybody else is >unauthorised. If you are not the intended recipient, please delete this >message and any attachments and advise the sender by return e-mail, Thanks= . > >_______________________________________________ >dmm mailing list >dmm@ietf.org >https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dmm Questo messaggio e i suoi allegati sono indirizzati esclusivamente alle per= sone indicate. La diffusione, copia o qualsiasi altra azione derivante dall= a conoscenza di queste informazioni sono rigorosamente vietate. Qualora abb= iate ricevuto questo documento per errore siete cortesemente pregati di dar= ne immediata comunicazione al mittente e di provvedere alla sua distruzione= , Grazie. This e-mail and any attachments is confidential and may contain privileged = information intended for the addressee(s) only. Dissemination, copying, pri= nting or use by anybody else is unauthorised. If you are not the intended r= ecipient, please delete this message and any attachments and advise the sen= der by return e-mail, Thanks. From Marco.Liebsch@neclab.eu Fri Mar 9 03:51:34 2012 Return-Path: X-Original-To: dmm@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: dmm@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id D99B021F861F for ; Fri, 9 Mar 2012 03:51:34 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.299 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.299 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=-0.300, BAYES_00=-2.599, J_CHICKENPOX_21=0.6] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([12.22.58.30]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id fm4pzm2bsx2A for ; Fri, 9 Mar 2012 03:51:34 -0800 (PST) Received: from mailer1.neclab.eu (mailer1.neclab.eu [195.37.70.40]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id D1D6021F85F1 for ; Fri, 9 Mar 2012 03:51:33 -0800 (PST) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mailer1.neclab.eu (Postfix) with ESMTP id 41A261007E0; Fri, 9 Mar 2012 12:51:25 +0100 (CET) X-Virus-Scanned: Amavisd on Debian GNU/Linux (netlab.nec.de) Received: from mailer1.neclab.eu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (atlas-a.office.hd [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id ylOUFGYZkCIk; Fri, 9 Mar 2012 12:51:25 +0100 (CET) Received: from METHONE.office.hd (unknown [192.168.24.54]) by mailer1.neclab.eu (Postfix) with ESMTP id 201211007DF; Fri, 9 Mar 2012 12:51:15 +0100 (CET) Received: from DAPHNIS.office.hd ([169.254.2.41]) by METHONE.office.hd ([192.168.24.54]) with mapi id 14.01.0323.003; Fri, 9 Mar 2012 12:51:01 +0100 From: Marco Liebsch To: "cjbc@it.uc3m.es" , "dmm@ietf.org" Thread-Topic: [DMM] New DMM draft: draft-bernardos-dmm-distributed-anchoring-00.txt Thread-Index: AQHM+vcGQsVpCP7eyUu6ReLSEkTTmpZh2bLg Date: Fri, 9 Mar 2012 11:51:01 +0000 Message-ID: <69756203DDDDE64E987BC4F70B71A26D24D723F8@DAPHNIS.office.hd> References: <1330969192.3680.35.camel@acorde.it.uc3m.es> In-Reply-To: <1330969192.3680.35.camel@acorde.it.uc3m.es> Accept-Language: de-DE, en-US Content-Language: en-US X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: x-originating-ip: [10.1.6.1] Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable MIME-Version: 1.0 Subject: Re: [DMM] New DMM draft: draft-bernardos-dmm-distributed-anchoring-00.txt X-BeenThere: dmm@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.12 Precedence: list List-Id: Distributed Mobility Management Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 09 Mar 2012 11:51:35 -0000 Hi Carlos, I have a few clarifying questions to your new draft. The draft proposes the distributed logical interface. I don't really get the advantage of virtuali= zing the previous LMA on the MN's current LMA if packets are routed through the previous LMA anyway. Why not using the current LMA to serve simply as MAG for forwarded traffic (which remains anchored at previous LMA) and using the new LMA to anchor the new address/prefix?=20 The draft writes that the idea hides the change of the anchor from the mobile node. The DGW2IF on the new LMA does not pretend to be LMA1, or? I don't see how the anchor change is kept transparent to the MN. I somehow agree also to Pete's opinion that solving the packet routing afte= r anchor relocation above the anchors is a good option. It simply allows more optimal routes. Now I am deviating a bit, but into the direction of an important question: That's directly related to the question of how persistent we need to be about IP address continuity. Now, some proposals consider termination of an IP address prefix, which is anchored at a previously used anchor poin= t, as soon as the IP session, which uses that address, terminates. New session= s can use the address being anchored at the new mobility anchor. My opinion i= s that we need to find a good choice about the lifetime of such an anchored I= P address, as it may also be registered with other services, e.g. IMS, messag= ing, etc, and would require an updated registration after a change in the registered = address. And even if such lifetime is short, we may not accept suboptimal routing pa= ths via the previous anchor after anchor relocation. What do you think? Thanks, marco > -----Original Message----- > From: dmm-bounces@ietf.org [mailto:dmm-bounces@ietf.org] On Behalf Of > Carlos Jes=FAs Bernardos Cano > Sent: Montag, 5. M=E4rz 2012 18:40 > To: dmm@ietf.org > Subject: [DMM] New DMM draft: draft-bernardos-dmm-distributed- > anchoring-00.txt >=20 > Dear all, >=20 > We've just submitted a new I-D on the DMM space. The draft describes a > network-based DMM approach extending PMIPv6, and focusing on the > required extensions to effectively support simultaneously anchoring sever= al > flows at different distributed anchors. >=20 > As usual, comments would be warmly welcomed! >=20 > More info below: >=20 > Title : PMIPv6-based distributed anchoring > Author(s) : Carlos J. Bernardos > Juan Carlos Zuniga > Filename : > draft-bernardos-dmm-distributed-anchoring-00.txt > Pages : 23 > Date : 2012-03-05 >=20 > Distributed Mobility Management solutions allow for setting up > networks so that traffic is distributed in an optimal way and does > not rely on centralized deployed anchors to provide IP mobility > support. >=20 > There are many different approaches to address Distributed Mobility > Management, as for example extending network-based mobility protocols > (like Proxy Mobile IPv6), or client-based mobility protocols (as > Mobile IPv6), among others. This document follows the former > approach, and proposes a solution based on Proxy Mobile IPv6 in which > mobility sessions are anchored at the last IP hop router (called > distributed gateway). The distributed gateway is an enhanced access > router which is also able to operate as local mobility anchor or > mobility access gateway, on a per prefix basis. The draft focuses on > the required extensions to effectively support simultaneously > anchoring several flows at different distributed gateways. >=20 > This draft introduces the concept of distributed logical interface > (at the distributed gateway), which is a software construct that > allows to easily hide the change of anchor from the mobile node. > Additionally, the draft describes how to provide session continuity > in inter-domain scenarios in which dynamic tunneling or signaling > between distributed gateways from different operators is not allowed. >=20 >=20 > A URL for this Internet-Draft is: > http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-bernardos-dmm-distributed- > anchoring-00.txt >=20 > Thanks, >=20 > Carlos >=20 > -- > Carlos Jes=FAs Bernardos Cano http://www.netcom.it.uc3m.es/ GPG FP: D29B > 0A6A 639A A561 93CA 4D55 35DC BA4D D170 4F67 From internet-drafts@ietf.org Mon Mar 12 11:47:04 2012 Return-Path: X-Original-To: dmm@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: dmm@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0888C21F89CF; Mon, 12 Mar 2012 11:47:04 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -102.581 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-102.581 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.018, BAYES_00=-2.599, USER_IN_WHITELIST=-100] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([12.22.58.30]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id IblpqDD8NWUI; Mon, 12 Mar 2012 11:47:02 -0700 (PDT) Received: from ietfa.amsl.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id A0E6321F89C8; Mon, 12 Mar 2012 11:47:02 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable From: internet-drafts@ietf.org To: i-d-announce@ietf.org X-Test-IDTracker: no X-IETF-IDTracker: 4.00 Message-ID: <20120312184702.13046.36006.idtracker@ietfa.amsl.com> Date: Mon, 12 Mar 2012 11:47:02 -0700 Cc: dmm@ietf.org Subject: [DMM] I-D Action: draft-ietf-mext-mip6-tls-04.txt X-BeenThere: dmm@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.12 Precedence: list List-Id: Distributed Mobility Management Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 12 Mar 2012 18:47:04 -0000 A New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line Internet-Drafts director= ies. This draft is a work item of the Mobility EXTensions for IPv6 Working = Group of the IETF. Title : Transport Layer Security-based Mobile IPv6 Security Fram= ework for Mobile Node to Home Agent Communication Author(s) : Jouni Korhonen Basavaraj Patil Hannes Tschofenig Dirk Kroeselberg Filename : draft-ietf-mext-mip6-tls-04.txt Pages : 38 Date : 2012-03-12 Mobile IPv6 signaling between a mobile node and its home agent is secured using IPsec. The security association between a mobile node and the home agent is established using IKEv1 or IKEv2. The security model specified for Mobile IPv6, which relies on IKE/IPsec, requires interaction between the Mobile IPv6 protocol component and the IKE/ IPsec module of the IP stack. This document proposes an alternate security framework for Mobile IPv6 and Dual-Stack Mobile IPv6, which relies on Transport Layer Security for establishing keying material and other bootstrapping parameters required to protect Mobile IPv6 signaling and data traffic between the mobile node and home agent. A URL for this Internet-Draft is: http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-ietf-mext-mip6-tls-04.txt Internet-Drafts are also available by anonymous FTP at: ftp://ftp.ietf.org/internet-drafts/ This Internet-Draft can be retrieved at: ftp://ftp.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-ietf-mext-mip6-tls-04.txt From luo.wen@zte.com.cn Mon Mar 12 23:43:49 2012 Return-Path: X-Original-To: dmm@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: dmm@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id E107921F8845 for ; Mon, 12 Mar 2012 23:43:49 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -96.107 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-96.107 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=5.731, BAYES_00=-2.599, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, RCVD_DOUBLE_IP_LOOSE=0.76, USER_IN_WHITELIST=-100] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([12.22.58.30]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 0q62Etf7zbxf for ; Mon, 12 Mar 2012 23:43:49 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mx5.zte.com.cn (mx6.zte.com.cn [95.130.199.165]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id D2B1211E8079 for ; Mon, 12 Mar 2012 23:43:48 -0700 (PDT) Received: from [10.30.17.99] by mx5.zte.com.cn with surfront esmtp id 122801057192640; Tue, 13 Mar 2012 14:10:45 +0800 (CST) Received: from [10.30.3.21] by [192.168.168.15] with StormMail ESMTP id 65905.2475308407; Tue, 13 Mar 2012 14:43:36 +0800 (CST) Received: from notes_smtp.zte.com.cn ([10.30.1.239]) by mse02.zte.com.cn with ESMTP id q2D6hOss055995; Tue, 13 Mar 2012 14:43:24 +0800 (GMT-8) (envelope-from luo.wen@zte.com.cn) To: cjbc@it.uc3m.es MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Lotus Notes Release 6.5.4 March 27, 2005 Message-ID: From: luo.wen@zte.com.cn Date: Tue, 13 Mar 2012 14:43:23 +0800 X-MIMETrack: Serialize by Router on notes_smtp/zte_ltd(Release 8.5.1FP4|July 25, 2010) at 2012-03-13 14:43:27, Serialize complete at 2012-03-13 14:43:27 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="=_alternative 0024EF3B482579C0_=" X-MAIL: mse02.zte.com.cn q2D6hOss055995 Cc: "dmm@ietf.org" Subject: [DMM] review of draft-bernardos-dmm-distributed-anchoring-00 X-BeenThere: dmm@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.12 Precedence: list List-Id: Distributed Mobility Management Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 13 Mar 2012 06:43:50 -0000 This is a multipart message in MIME format. --=_alternative 0024EF3B482579C0_= Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Hi Carlos I have reviewed your draft, and I have two questions to your draft as following: First, let's consider this scenario. Initially, MN is attached to D-GW1 and has a session#1 (anchored at D-GW1). When moving to D-GW2, MN starts another session#2 (session#1 keeps on going). As per your draft, D-GW2 should simulate mndgw1 and mndgw2 and establish a tunnel with D-GW1 for this MN. MN continues to move to D-GW3. Then D-GW3 should simulate mndgw1, mndgw2 and mndgw3 and maintains two forwarding tunnels between itself and D-GW1, D-GW2 for the MN. And MN could continue to move again and again..... PMIP requires only one MAG and only one PMIP tunnel for one MN. But it seems that, your draft requires, for one MN, multiple MAGs (i.e. those mndgw1, mndgw2 and mndgw3) and multiple tunnels for one MN. If MN keeps on moving, the situation will become worse. I mean, maybe dozens of MAGs and tunnels are needed for this MN. In this case, performance of your D-GW will be a big issue. Of course, you can limited the HNPes one MN can maintain (e.g. 3 HNPes per MN, then only 3 D-GWs could be involved at most), but to me, it is very hard to determine the threshold to satisfy every single MN. Otherwise, network should have a mechanism for terminating IP addresses to release some D-GWs. But how to determine an IP address (HNP) is not used by a MN is also a challenge. Second, in figure 2 of your draft, D-GW2 simulates two logic GWs (i.e. mn1dgw1 and mn1dgw2), and MN is attached to both two logic GWs. Does this indicate MN should maintain tow separated logic link with mn1dgw1 and mn1dgw2 respectively? If it does, then how can you ensure that MN will establish an additional logic link with mn1dgw2 when MN moves from D-GW1 to D-GW2? What do you think? BR Luowen --=_alternative 0024EF3B482579C0_= Content-Type: text/html; charset="US-ASCII"

Hi Carlos

I have reviewed your draft, and I have two questions to your draft as following:

First, let's consider this scenario. Initially, MN is attached to D-GW1 and has a session#1 (anchored at D-GW1). When moving to D-GW2, MN starts another session#2 (session#1 keeps on going). As per your draft, D-GW2 should simulate mndgw1 and mndgw2 and establish a tunnel with D-GW1 for this MN. MN continues to move to D-GW3. Then D-GW3 should simulate mndgw1, mndgw2 and mndgw3 and maintains two forwarding tunnels between itself and D-GW1, D-GW2 for the MN. And MN could continue to move again and again.....
PMIP requires only one MAG and only one PMIP tunnel for one MN. But it seems that, your draft requires, for one MN, multiple MAGs (i.e. those mndgw1, mndgw2 and mndgw3) and multiple tunnels for one MN. If MN keeps on moving, the situation will become worse. I mean, maybe dozens of MAGs and tunnels are needed for this MN. In this case, performance of your D-GW will be a big issue. Of course, you can limited the HNPes one MN can maintain (e.g. 3 HNPes per MN, then only 3 D-GWs could be involved at most), but to me, it is very hard to determine the threshold to satisfy every single MN.  Otherwise, network should have a mechanism for terminating IP addresses to release some D-GWs. But how to determine an IP address (HNP) is not used by a MN is also a challenge.

Second, in figure 2 of your draft, D-GW2 simulates two logic GWs (i.e. mn1dgw1 and mn1dgw2), and MN is attached to both two logic GWs. Does this indicate MN should maintain tow separated logic link with mn1dgw1 and mn1dgw2 respectively? If it does, then how can you ensure that MN will establish an additional logic link with mn1dgw2 when MN moves from D-GW1 to D-GW2?

What do you think?

BR
Luowen
--=_alternative 0024EF3B482579C0_=-- From Marco.Liebsch@neclab.eu Tue Mar 13 06:29:18 2012 Return-Path: X-Original-To: dmm@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: dmm@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id D8D5021F8741 for ; Tue, 13 Mar 2012 06:29:18 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.539 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.539 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.060, BAYES_00=-2.599] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([12.22.58.30]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id CU5kC1lgzcwX for ; Tue, 13 Mar 2012 06:29:18 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mailer1.neclab.eu (mailer1.neclab.eu [195.37.70.40]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4627E21F873E for ; Tue, 13 Mar 2012 06:29:18 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mailer1.neclab.eu (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9972F10088C for ; Tue, 13 Mar 2012 14:29:34 +0100 (CET) X-Virus-Scanned: Amavisd on Debian GNU/Linux (netlab.nec.de) Received: from mailer1.neclab.eu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (atlas-a.office.hd [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id a6hwjPQYRs8b for ; Tue, 13 Mar 2012 14:29:34 +0100 (CET) Received: from ENCELADUS.office.hd (unknown [192.168.24.52]) by mailer1.neclab.eu (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7D2FD10087B for ; Tue, 13 Mar 2012 14:29:29 +0100 (CET) Received: from DAPHNIS.office.hd ([169.254.2.41]) by ENCELADUS.office.hd ([192.168.24.52]) with mapi id 14.01.0323.003; Tue, 13 Mar 2012 14:29:12 +0100 From: Marco Liebsch To: "dmm@ietf.org" Thread-Topic: New Version Notification for draft-liebsch-mext-dmm-nat-phl-01.txt Thread-Index: AQHNAKojliOaQKkmUUqkrz0rBkX+m5ZoNyAQ Date: Tue, 13 Mar 2012 13:29:12 +0000 Message-ID: <69756203DDDDE64E987BC4F70B71A26D24D7489D@DAPHNIS.office.hd> References: <20120312234453.28494.5272.idtracker@ietfa.amsl.com> In-Reply-To: <20120312234453.28494.5272.idtracker@ietfa.amsl.com> Accept-Language: de-DE, en-US Content-Language: en-US X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: x-originating-ip: [10.1.6.1] Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64 MIME-Version: 1.0 Subject: [DMM] New Version Notification for draft-liebsch-mext-dmm-nat-phl-01.txt X-BeenThere: dmm@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.12 Precedence: list List-Id: Distributed Mobility Management Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 13 Mar 2012 13:29:19 -0000 UGxlYXNlIGZpbmQgYW4gdXBkYXRlIG9mIG91ciBkcmFmdCBhYm91dCBzb2x2aW5nIERNTSBpbiB0 aGUgcm91dGluZyBwbGFuZSBhYm92ZQ0KbW9iaWxpdHkgYW5jaG9yIGxldmVsIGluIHRoZSBJRVRG J3MgZHJhZnRzIHJlcG9zaXRvcnkuIFRoYW5rcyBmb3IgYWxsIGNvbW1lbnRzIHdlDQpyZWNlaXZl ZCBzbyBmYXIgZHVyaW5nIGFuZCBhZnRlciBsYXN0IElFVEYgbWVldGluZy4NCg0KTWFyY28NCg0K DQotLS0tLU9yaWdpbmFsIE1lc3NhZ2UtLS0tLQ0KRnJvbTogaW50ZXJuZXQtZHJhZnRzQGlldGYu b3JnIFttYWlsdG86aW50ZXJuZXQtZHJhZnRzQGlldGYub3JnXSANClNlbnQ6IERpZW5zdGFnLCAx My4gTcOkcnogMjAxMiAwMDo0NQ0KVG86IGxpZWJzY2hAbmVjbGFiLmV1DQpTdWJqZWN0OiBOZXcg VmVyc2lvbiBOb3RpZmljYXRpb24gZm9yIGRyYWZ0LWxpZWJzY2gtbWV4dC1kbW0tbmF0LXBobC0w MS50eHQNCg0KQSBuZXcgdmVyc2lvbiBvZiBJLUQsIGRyYWZ0LWxpZWJzY2gtbWV4dC1kbW0tbmF0 LXBobC0wMS50eHQgaGFzIGJlZW4gc3VjY2Vzc2Z1bGx5IHN1Ym1pdHRlZCBieSBNYXJjbyBMaWVi c2NoIGFuZCBwb3N0ZWQgdG8gdGhlIElFVEYgcmVwb3NpdG9yeS4NCg0KRmlsZW5hbWU6CSBkcmFm dC1saWVic2NoLW1leHQtZG1tLW5hdC1waGwNClJldmlzaW9uOgkgMDENClRpdGxlOgkJIFBlci1I b3N0IExvY2F0b3JzIGZvciBEaXN0cmlidXRlZCBNb2JpbGl0eSBNYW5hZ2VtZW50DQpDcmVhdGlv biBkYXRlOgkgMjAxMi0wMy0xMw0KV0cgSUQ6CQkgSW5kaXZpZHVhbCBTdWJtaXNzaW9uDQpOdW1i ZXIgb2YgcGFnZXM6IDE4DQoNCkFic3RyYWN0Og0KICAgTW9iaWxlIG9wZXJhdG9ycyBjb25zaWRl ciB0aGUgZGlzdHJpYnV0aW9uIG9mIG1vYmlsaXR5IGFuY2hvcnMgdG8NCiAgIGVuYWJsZSBvZmZs b2FkaW5nIHNvbWUgdHJhZmZpYyBmcm9tIHRoZWlyIGNvcmUgbmV0d29yay4gIEluIHNjb3BlIG9m DQogICBhIHNvbHV0aW9uIGZvciBEaXN0cmlidXRlZCBNb2JpbGl0eSBNYW5hZ2VtZW50IGlzIHRo ZSBtYWludGVuYW5jZSBvZg0KICAgSVAgc2Vzc2lvbnMgYW5kIElQIGFkZHJlc3MgY29udGludWl0 eSB3aGVuIG1vYmlsZSBub2RlcyBnZXQgYSBuZXcNCiAgIG1vYmlsaXR5IGFuY2hvciBhc3NpZ25l ZCBkdXJpbmcgaGFuZG92ZXIuICBUaGlzIGRvY3VtZW50IHByb3Bvc2VzIHRoZQ0KICAgdXNlIG9m IGlkZW50aWZpZXItbG9jYXRvciBzcGxpdCBjb25jZXB0cyB0byBhY2hpZXZlIG9wdGltYWwgcm91 dGluZw0KICAgb2YgZGF0YSBwYWNrZXRzIHRvIGEgbW9iaWxlIG5vZGUmIzM5O3MgY3VycmVudCBt b2JpbGl0eSBhbmNob3IuICBUaGUgdXNlDQogICBvZiBwZXItaG9zdCBsb2NhdG9yIElQIGFkZHJl c3NlcyBhbGxvd3MgdHJhbnNsYXRpb24gb2YgYWRkcmVzc2VzDQogICB3aXRoaW4gdGhlIG1vYmls ZSBvcGVyYXRvciBuZXR3b3JrIHRvIHJvdXRlIHBhY2tldHMgdG8gdGhlIG1vYmlsZQ0KICAgbm9k ZSYjMzk7cyBjdXJyZW50IG1vYmlsaXR5IGFuY2hvciwgd2hpbGUgYWRkcmVzcyB0cmFuc2xhdGlv biBpcyBrZXB0DQogICB0cmFuc3BhcmVudCB0byB0aGUgY29tbXVuaWNhdGlvbiBlbmRwb2ludHMu DQoNCiAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAg ICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICANCg0KDQpUaGUgSUVURiBTZWNyZXRhcmlhdA0K From jouni.nospam@gmail.com Tue Mar 13 17:27:32 2012 Return-Path: X-Original-To: dmm@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: dmm@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6451321E8075 for ; Tue, 13 Mar 2012 17:27:32 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -3.568 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-3.568 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.031, BAYES_00=-2.599, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW=-1] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([12.22.58.30]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id j2sL55t4M5yt for ; Tue, 13 Mar 2012 17:27:32 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail-lb0-f172.google.com (mail-lb0-f172.google.com [209.85.217.172]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9748521E8013 for ; Tue, 13 Mar 2012 17:27:31 -0700 (PDT) Received: by lbol12 with SMTP id l12so631213lbo.31 for ; Tue, 13 Mar 2012 17:27:30 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20120113; h=from:content-type:content-transfer-encoding:subject:date:message-id :cc:to:mime-version:x-mailer; bh=AGHmhHVXKXwHieSEYtzBbxAAiZeBt7H0TWFH6qT+h58=; b=IGJJTenue41IZdjRFDeVlQe8d2/qHnf+hRdR0WEded61ykH1UxHLX/fHwP1WDX/xgt fJ0zXsgFYdZfEuIP/QJNJIsQfnoYfEI6SROrqOny0Ui9nhSvbM0qYwHW3RaICs36+KHQ q+6F4Qt4Z1mT1T2DttWwbSojCn9MKgMn0WWdBkjrS4Vz0uEmyjadMuizMy1iYaqNui9z kiaWmMU8oIfpmfMwY775ic8G1letl7N6EptQBe+B6P9IsstvWtzXQNTVLOUYWBDh1Txy saFthxzXxTwmHa1/0hHhZrCZWtC0mkXXZ+n+QyC8Y5Us/fLtyf3o7rMDVCQoyx9fqA5R Mk9w== Received: by 10.152.147.1 with SMTP id tg1mr435766lab.22.1331684850584; Tue, 13 Mar 2012 17:27:30 -0700 (PDT) Received: from [188.117.15.110] ([188.117.15.110]) by mx.google.com with ESMTPS id b3sm2430676lby.7.2012.03.13.17.27.28 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=OTHER); Tue, 13 Mar 2012 17:27:29 -0700 (PDT) From: Jouni Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Date: Wed, 14 Mar 2012 02:27:26 +0200 Message-Id: To: dmm@ietf.org Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v1257) X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.1257) Cc: dmm-chairs@tools.ietf.org Subject: [DMM] Draft agenda uploaded X-BeenThere: dmm@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.12 Precedence: list List-Id: Distributed Mobility Management Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 14 Mar 2012 00:27:32 -0000 Folks, The draft agenda is now available: http://www.ietf.org/proceedings/83/agenda/agenda-83-dmm.txt Note that we got quite a few requests for presentations (17) and air time will be on issue. So, this is what we do: the agenda is split into topics and drafts are grouped under those. We'd expect a single joint presentation from each topic slot. That can be a concatenation of separate presentations with multiple presenters or something more processed such as combining & comparing related/similar solutions. The latter approach is preferred(!) and the named presenters are strongly encouraged to lead the work in coming weeks and glue together a presentation in a cooperative spirit. Time allocations for each topic are still a subject to change. - Jouni & Julien From sarikaya2012@gmail.com Wed Mar 14 10:32:00 2012 Return-Path: X-Original-To: dmm@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: dmm@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7B23C21E8024; Wed, 14 Mar 2012 10:32:00 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -3.561 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-3.561 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.038, BAYES_00=-2.599, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW=-1] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([12.22.58.30]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id Cv8NqWwIYFmc; Wed, 14 Mar 2012 10:31:58 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail-ey0-f172.google.com (mail-ey0-f172.google.com [209.85.215.172]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id B3C5721F876F; Wed, 14 Mar 2012 10:31:57 -0700 (PDT) Received: by eaaq11 with SMTP id q11so1225066eaa.31 for ; Wed, 14 Mar 2012 10:31:56 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20120113; h=mime-version:reply-to:date:message-id:subject:from:to:cc :content-type; bh=HN2j7MaT2UlhlkYtMZWKHrnueNcLQKQ9zKss7lre2so=; b=NgH+gXNtD/Cg45cNUrn6ivsWAORjHvPIDdXpequ7PMreQwNLssGAFZK2nTwvtXgURo JT1lm7G40itiG213prFJ4qVsEwcnYnWCIbCHNx5m/+2tDp0JIocR+X2i3eXKzfOv79eZ ++Uk5BsOzu4WpraYOlNSzQ2gS0UqQ0SJQ16tjpJ7elc9nOn7yFXYBzpfQXAtjrvW0zkJ PTL+av72T6VxTBygp9aHfm7J6i4lUkYUgDkxUmkvY524KNot2t8dm75eawCAShUxVRBH GYASltmRnqGCSUhfL4b07NLidPLBsJo9ST7LknQE5OyJV8ZKxuVKp5I7AB+ll7MoLMiB Y5PQ== MIME-Version: 1.0 Received: by 10.50.193.131 with SMTP id ho3mr12922385igc.55.1331746315934; Wed, 14 Mar 2012 10:31:55 -0700 (PDT) Received: by 10.231.179.71 with HTTP; Wed, 14 Mar 2012 10:31:55 -0700 (PDT) Date: Wed, 14 Mar 2012 12:31:55 -0500 Message-ID: From: Behcet Sarikaya To: Internet Area , dmm@ietf.org, netext@ietf.org, mip4@ietf.org, multimob@ietf.org Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Subject: [DMM] FMC Bar Bof Date Correction X-BeenThere: dmm@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.12 Precedence: list Reply-To: sarikaya@ieee.org List-Id: Distributed Mobility Management Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 14 Mar 2012 17:32:00 -0000 Hi all, Our previous mail on March 6 announcing FMC Bar Bof had by mistake the date as March 28. Tuesday March 27 at 19:30 or 7:30pm is the correct one. We are going to send another mail once this is confirmed by IETF. Sorry for the confusion and thanks to Wassim, Med, Sophie for waking us up :-). Behcet ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------ Hi all, FMC Problem Statement draft draft-xue-intarea-fmc-ps-00.txt has been submitted as below. We also requested a slot for holding FMC Bar Bof tentatively on Tuesday, March 28 at 19:30. If you have a presentation to make please drop a note to us. Regards, Behcet & Dirk From alexandru.petrescu@gmail.com Thu Mar 15 02:01:57 2012 Return-Path: X-Original-To: dmm@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: dmm@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 346CD21F865A for ; Thu, 15 Mar 2012 02:01:57 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -6.795 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-6.795 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=-0.546, BAYES_00=-2.599, HELO_EQ_FR=0.35, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-4] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([12.22.58.30]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id sVyfghLN+G95 for ; Thu, 15 Mar 2012 02:01:56 -0700 (PDT) Received: from sainfoin-out.extra.cea.fr (sainfoin-out.extra.cea.fr [132.167.192.144]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 58FE821F863B for ; Thu, 15 Mar 2012 02:01:56 -0700 (PDT) Received: from pisaure.intra.cea.fr (pisaure.intra.cea.fr [132.166.88.21]) by sainfoin.extra.cea.fr (8.14.2/8.14.2/CEAnet-Internet-out-2.3) with ESMTP id q2F91tMP020099 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=NOT) for ; Thu, 15 Mar 2012 10:01:55 +0100 Received: from muguet2.intra.cea.fr (muguet2.intra.cea.fr [132.166.192.7]) by pisaure.intra.cea.fr (8.14.4/8.14.4) with ESMTP id q2F91tEF016825 for ; Thu, 15 Mar 2012 10:01:55 +0100 (envelope-from alexandru.petrescu@gmail.com) Received: from [127.0.0.1] (is010446-4.intra.cea.fr [10.8.33.116]) by muguet2.intra.cea.fr (8.13.8/8.13.8/CEAnet-Intranet-out-1.2) with ESMTP id q2F91sSS023662 for ; Thu, 15 Mar 2012 10:01:55 +0100 Message-ID: <4F61B002.7000208@gmail.com> Date: Thu, 15 Mar 2012 10:01:54 +0100 From: Alexandru Petrescu User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows NT 6.1; rv:11.0) Gecko/20120312 Thunderbird/11.0 MIME-Version: 1.0 To: dmm@ietf.org Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: [DMM] New ITS email list for discussing IPv6 and vehicular communications X-BeenThere: dmm@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.12 Precedence: list List-Id: Distributed Mobility Management Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 15 Mar 2012 09:01:57 -0000 Dear participants in DMM WG, A new email list ITS Intelligent Transportation Systems has been set up at IETF. It is intended for discussions of IP and vehicular communications. https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/its Let us discuss IPv6 and vehicular on the ITS email list. Let us meet in Paris about this as well. Alex From Peter.McCann@huawei.com Thu Mar 15 09:02:03 2012 Return-Path: X-Original-To: dmm@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: dmm@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id D74AC21F8759 for ; Thu, 15 Mar 2012 09:02:03 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.309 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.309 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.290, BAYES_00=-2.599] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([12.22.58.30]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 4Kkdj+TMMww5 for ; Thu, 15 Mar 2012 09:02:03 -0700 (PDT) Received: from dfwrgout.huawei.com (dfwrgout.huawei.com [206.16.17.72]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id E4F5A21F874F for ; Thu, 15 Mar 2012 09:02:02 -0700 (PDT) Received: from 172.18.9.243 (EHLO dfweml202-edg.china.huawei.com) ([172.18.9.243]) by dfwrg01-dlp.huawei.com (MOS 4.2.3-GA FastPath) with ESMTP id AEK57825; Thu, 15 Mar 2012 12:02:02 -0400 (EDT) Received: from DFWEML403-HUB.china.huawei.com (10.193.5.151) by dfweml202-edg.china.huawei.com (172.18.9.108) with Microsoft SMTP Server (TLS) id 14.1.323.3; Thu, 15 Mar 2012 08:59:52 -0700 Received: from DFWEML504-MBX.china.huawei.com ([10.124.31.30]) by dfweml403-hub.china.huawei.com ([10.193.5.151]) with mapi id 14.01.0323.003; Thu, 15 Mar 2012 08:59:47 -0700 From: Peter McCann To: "dmm@ietf.org" Thread-Topic: IPR disclosure: Huawei Technologies Co., Ltd's Statement about IPR related to draft-mccann-dmm-flatarch-00 Thread-Index: Ac0CxKQ0q6/1YRvSRHWzHVPcLF7ynw== Date: Thu, 15 Mar 2012 15:59:46 +0000 Message-ID: <5963DDF1F751474D8DEEFDCDBEE43AE716448F9E@dfweml504-mbx> Accept-Language: en-US, zh-CN Content-Language: en-US X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: x-originating-ip: [10.193.125.136] Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable MIME-Version: 1.0 X-CFilter-Loop: Reflected Subject: [DMM] IPR disclosure: Huawei Technologies Co., Ltd's Statement about IPR related to draft-mccann-dmm-flatarch-00 X-BeenThere: dmm@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.12 Precedence: list List-Id: Distributed Mobility Management Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 15 Mar 2012 16:02:04 -0000 I'd like to make sure everyone is aware of this IPR disclosure: https://datatracker.ietf.org/ipr/1714/ -- Peter J. McCann Huawei Technologies (USA) Peter.McCann@Huawei.com +1 908 541 3563 Rm. C-0105, 400 Crossings Blvd. (2nd floor), Bridgewater, NJ 08807-2863 U= SA From maxpassion@gmail.com Fri Mar 16 00:11:04 2012 Return-Path: X-Original-To: dmm@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: dmm@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7416F21F870B for ; Fri, 16 Mar 2012 00:11:04 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -3.407 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-3.407 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.193, BAYES_00=-2.599, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW=-1] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([12.22.58.30]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id Wv-mGhYgiYlZ for ; Fri, 16 Mar 2012 00:11:03 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail-iy0-f172.google.com (mail-iy0-f172.google.com [209.85.210.172]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9D01E21F870A for ; Fri, 16 Mar 2012 00:11:03 -0700 (PDT) Received: by iazz13 with SMTP id z13so5838358iaz.31 for ; Fri, 16 Mar 2012 00:11:03 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20120113; h=mime-version:in-reply-to:references:date:message-id:subject:from:to :cc:content-type; bh=TnrO9MOLwuY1kEMqduczkyuG+7oywspS64JeP3HIPsg=; b=i8CfoGAe3IXO7SyyyikMpJNua2Mnm9JpTn5p2IE7X3o9eO2QiqdOyFLf66+EE0laW/ kryYN9wIWXJPADbrAVpXPt2Wv2CnMEqb6EMArRGQtBYrSVpp51mQBv045vRAk6s8/5Tu 3gDyRWleVjdkCwJlkIhmOXVf6qs+PS1ghtJpSnwtNYFzc9oA4v1ZUJu0t7uAbNBZLTSU OTpqUNDffFXsvo1nfsgxDfTGwvl4WRSGw4C8q7U2jsMlxB8MNIDQIciFYcZuSW7jBK3p s9dmXzuUjjjeQ96+JCdkqOvKn37W3Ox1TCqN1J+mEhekNq2+eb5V38TG6Lu1eYk+StIj TvoA== MIME-Version: 1.0 Received: by 10.42.108.202 with SMTP id i10mr800308icp.39.1331881863273; Fri, 16 Mar 2012 00:11:03 -0700 (PDT) Received: by 10.42.196.200 with HTTP; Fri, 16 Mar 2012 00:11:03 -0700 (PDT) In-Reply-To: <5963DDF1F751474D8DEEFDCDBEE43AE716447C77@dfweml504-mbx> References: <5963DDF1F751474D8DEEFDCDBEE43AE716447C77@dfweml504-mbx> Date: Fri, 16 Mar 2012 15:11:03 +0800 Message-ID: From: liu dapeng To: Peter McCann Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Cc: "dmm@ietf.org" Subject: Re: [DMM] draft-mccann-dmm-flatarch-00.txt X-BeenThere: dmm@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.12 Precedence: list List-Id: Distributed Mobility Management Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 16 Mar 2012 07:11:04 -0000 Hi Peter, As we discussed offline earlier, I have a similar proposal which is also rely on IBGP to update the routing system and thence allow the MN keep its address unchanged even after handover. I have not submit the draft for this upcoming meeting. The difference is that my proposal does not relay on DNS. Since the AR needs to do reverse lookup every time a MN attaches to it, it may result in performance issue. Another point is for the inital state, the prefixes could be aggregated at the reflector and confine the routing update whin the domain but after a period of time, many MNs would roam in the domain and the prefixes would be diffcult to aggregate. To solve this one option is to design a upper level router above all the domain reflectors and by carefully address planning, to make all the MN's prefix belong to that router. The idea could be extended to not only depends on IBGP. more general speaking, it allows mobility management interacting with routing system and will result in several different alternative designs. Besides authentication, there are many other aspects need to explore, e.g: address management, billing system etc.. Regards, Dapeng Liu 2012/3/6, Peter McCann : > Hi, all, > > On Friday I submitted a new draft that outlines what I think is a novel > approach to mobility management in a totally flat network. The draft > can be found here: > > http://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-mccann-dmm-flatarch-00 > > Abstract > > Today's mobility management schemes make use of a hierarchy of > tunnels from a relatively fixed anchor point, through one or more > intermediate nodes, to reach the MN's current point of attachment. > These schemes suffer from poor performance, scalability, and failure > modes due to the centralization and statefulness of the anchor > point(s). The dmm (Distributed Mobility Management) working group is > currently chartered to investigate alternative solutions that will > provide greater performance, scalability, and robustness through the > distribution of mobility anchors. This document is an input to the > dmm discussion. It outlines a problem statement for the existing > mobility management techniques and goes on to propose (high-level) > solutions to two of the most vexing problems: MN authentication and > mobility management in a fully distributed, flat (non-hierarchical) > access network. These two aspects are often treated separately in a > layered architecture, but we argue there are important advantages to > considering how these two functions can work in tandem to provide a > simple and robust framework for the design of a wireless Internet > Service Provider network. > > > I'd like some time to present this draft during the meeting in Paris, > hopefully 15 minutes. > > -- > Peter J. McCann > Huawei Technologies (USA) > Peter.McCann@Huawei.com > +1 908 541 3563 > Rm. C-0105, 400 Crossings Blvd. (2nd floor), Bridgewater, NJ 08807-2863 > USA > > > _______________________________________________ > dmm mailing list > dmm@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dmm > -- ------ Best Regards, Dapeng Liu From maxpassion@gmail.com Fri Mar 16 00:18:53 2012 Return-Path: X-Original-To: dmm@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: dmm@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6712121F852C; Fri, 16 Mar 2012 00:18:53 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -3.418 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-3.418 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.181, BAYES_00=-2.599, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW=-1] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([12.22.58.30]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id IMeHe6nI6Q4D; Fri, 16 Mar 2012 00:18:52 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail-iy0-f172.google.com (mail-iy0-f172.google.com [209.85.210.172]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id BEE2421F8528; Fri, 16 Mar 2012 00:18:52 -0700 (PDT) Received: by iazz13 with SMTP id z13so5848531iaz.31 for ; Fri, 16 Mar 2012 00:18:52 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20120113; h=mime-version:in-reply-to:references:date:message-id:subject:from:to :cc:content-type:content-transfer-encoding; bh=kYFCUCVlwXuIisutbkydjzyySbPIkDnvJMeGml42ioo=; b=sH8FZnP7gnH3NNSHpTmGYZ46nn9HtiCUAb4h7VzZvGEFZasGzh52CiQ1W1x92CNo0f r8KVya9TdMUY0w4YLHFEYpZWEMtusVJuCMT3KxMI+b5pIVlDD/CRzdkxdvxqzqz54su2 zVp2LM1LPlh4AXF2MeX8kDN2e3x7vT0l6C2ndc1wcklPQDwhqWAWbtwfgWP/HQeATtW8 7LuI1gJaAjqB1TxTElB3z7yIZbd2pp2UTSv8VvVYeSpGmX6T4TPNDWcNEPPdW09YZqDY 0JaMd9UenYCiST6/H7E8jfUrVUlL34LGWbvfSdXuJsSyFzDpJZ23ukg2gndlR6ZQ3tVc 6pgw== MIME-Version: 1.0 Received: by 10.50.222.196 with SMTP id qo4mr11821073igc.59.1331882332464; Fri, 16 Mar 2012 00:18:52 -0700 (PDT) Received: by 10.42.196.200 with HTTP; Fri, 16 Mar 2012 00:18:52 -0700 (PDT) In-Reply-To: <843DA8228A1BA74CA31FB4E111A5C4620238414D@ftrdmel0.rd.francetelecom.fr> References: <494B8B97-093D-4886-88D7-F1A2EF065BB4@gmail.com> <843DA8228A1BA74CA31FB4E111A5C46202383F89@ftrdmel0.rd.francetelecom.fr> <843DA8228A1BA74CA31FB4E111A5C4620238414D@ftrdmel0.rd.francetelecom.fr> Date: Fri, 16 Mar 2012 15:18:52 +0800 Message-ID: From: liu dapeng To: pierrick.seite@orange.com Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Cc: dmm@ietf.org, mext@ietf.org Subject: Re: [DMM] [dmm] [MEXT] DMM demo X-BeenThere: dmm@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.12 Precedence: list List-Id: Distributed Mobility Management Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 16 Mar 2012 07:18:53 -0000 Hello Pierrick, Is there any modification of the application that used in the DEMO? Thanks. regards, Dapeng Liu 2012/3/2, pierrick.seite@orange.com : > Hi Bruno, > > Thanks for your interest. The demo illustrates a PMIPv6 based distributed > mobility on a Wifi network, with 2 or 3 wifi APs. We show IP continuity o= n a > video streaming. The network architecture is as per draft-seite-dmm-dma > where access routers implement both MAG and LMA functions (see attached > slides for more details); i.e. PMIP runs only between AR. Dynamic mobilit= y > is also shown: PMIP signaling comes into play only when the MN performs > handover otherwise, standard IP routing applies. Regarding implementation= , > Network elements and streaming server are Linux virtual machines, all on = a > single laptop. > > I hope to see you at the demo :-) > Pierrick > >> -----Message d'origine----- >> De : ext-bruno.faria@nokia.com [mailto:ext-bruno.faria@nokia.com] >> Envoy=E9 : jeudi 1 mars 2012 22:10 >> =C0 : SEITE Pierrick RD-RESA-REN; mext@ietf.org >> Cc : dmm@ietf.org >> Objet : RE: DMM demo >> >> Hello Pierrick, >> >> That seems to be very interesting. >> Can you point out some information about that implementation? >> >> Rgds, >> >> - Bruno >> >> >-----Original Message----- >> >From: mext-bounces@ietf.org [mailto:mext-bounces@ietf.org] On Behalf >> Of >> >ext pierrick.seite@orange.com >> >Sent: quinta-feira, 1 de mar=E7o de 2012 09:04 >> >To: mext@ietf.org >> >Cc: dmm@ietf.org >> >Subject: [MEXT] DMM demo >> > >> > >> >Hello all, >> > >> > >> >We will take the opportunity of the IETF#83 to show a demonstration of >> >distributed mobility management (DMM), based on the following draft: >> > >> >http://www.ietf.org/id/draft-seite-dmm-dma-00.txt >> > >> >We will make the demo after DMM meeting (03/29), during lunch time. >> I'll >> >communicate the exact location as soon as I'm able to. >> > >> >BR, >> >Pierrick >> >_______________________________________________ >> >MEXT mailing list >> >MEXT@ietf.org >> >https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/mext > --=20 ------ Best Regards, Dapeng Liu From cjbc@it.uc3m.es Fri Mar 16 01:46:12 2012 Return-Path: X-Original-To: dmm@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: dmm@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0942421F86F5 for ; Fri, 16 Mar 2012 01:46:12 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -5.682 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-5.682 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.017, BAYES_00=-2.599, J_CHICKENPOX_21=0.6, MIME_8BIT_HEADER=0.3, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-4] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([12.22.58.30]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id ZStZWtF8Tcct for ; Fri, 16 Mar 2012 01:46:10 -0700 (PDT) Received: from smtp01.uc3m.es (smtp01.uc3m.es [163.117.176.131]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4B57821F86F1 for ; Fri, 16 Mar 2012 01:46:09 -0700 (PDT) X-uc3m-safe: yes Received: from [163.117.139.72] (acorde.it.uc3m.es [163.117.139.72]) (using TLSv1 with cipher AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by smtp01.uc3m.es (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5828BC2781D; Fri, 16 Mar 2012 09:46:08 +0100 (CET) Message-ID: <1331887567.4259.155.camel@acorde.it.uc3m.es> From: Carlos =?ISO-8859-1?Q?Jes=FAs?= Bernardos Cano To: Peter McCann Date: Fri, 16 Mar 2012 09:46:07 +0100 In-Reply-To: <5963DDF1F751474D8DEEFDCDBEE43AE716447FFE@dfweml504-mbx> References: <5963DDF1F751474D8DEEFDCDBEE43AE716447E15@dfweml504-mbx> <1331143249.5000.43.camel@acorde.it.uc3m.es> <5963DDF1F751474D8DEEFDCDBEE43AE716447FFE@dfweml504-mbx> Organization: Universidad Carlos III de Madrid Content-Type: multipart/signed; micalg="pgp-sha1"; protocol="application/pgp-signature"; boundary="=-AzKYYBt7ZoQRg5TTak+r" X-Mailer: Evolution 3.2.2-1 Mime-Version: 1.0 X-TM-AS-Product-Ver: IMSS-7.0.0.3116-6.8.0.1017-18776.003 Cc: "dmm@ietf.org" Subject: Re: [DMM] Review of draft-bernardos-dmm-distributed-anchoring-00 X-BeenThere: dmm@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.12 Precedence: list Reply-To: cjbc@it.uc3m.es List-Id: Distributed Mobility Management Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 16 Mar 2012 08:46:12 -0000 --=-AzKYYBt7ZoQRg5TTak+r Content-Type: text/plain; charset="ISO-8859-15" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Hi Pete, Sorry for the late reply. Please see inline below. On Wed, 2012-03-07 at 18:58 +0000, Peter McCann wrote: > Hi, Carlos, >=20 > Just a couple of response points below... >=20 > Carlos Jes=FAs Bernardos Cano wrote: > > Hi Pete, > >=20 > > Thanks for the comments. Please see some comments inline below. > >=20 > > On Tue, 2012-03-06 at 20:55 +0000, Peter McCann wrote: > >> Hi, Carlos, Juan-Carlos, > >>=20 > >> I have read draft-bernardos-dmm-distributed-anchoring-00, and I have a > >> few comments. > >>=20 > >> First, I want to bring up something that I think is common to several > >> of the DMM proposals, and that is sub-optimal use of the backhaul > >> resources. It seems that when you use an AR as an anchor point, and > >> move to a new AR, the traffic for that session has to traverse the > >> backhaul 3 times in each direction, like this: > >>=20 > >>=20 > >> ----- > >> | Rtr | > >> / ^ -----\ > >> 1 / / 2 \ 3 > >> v / v > >> ---- ----=20 > >> | AR | | AR |=20 > >> ---- ---- > >> Although it may seem at odds with the goal of "distributing" mobility > >> to use the crossover router as the point of traffic redirection, it > >> would make for much more optimal use of the backhaul resources. I > >> believe it is possible to route the traffic more optimally with a > >> standard off-the-shelf router at the crossover point (using mechanisms > >> detailed in draft-mccann-dmm- > > flatarch-00). > >=20 > > In our draft we don't make any assumption about the backhaul and access > > architecture. ARs might be also directly connected (in which case no Rt= r > > would be traversed) if a network deployment allows that. In any case, > > the traffic redirection is supposed to happen for relatively short > > periods of time (otherwise the DMM advantages might vanish and it's jus= t > > better to go for a centralized approach). >=20 > I suppose I have a different view of how long one might keep an address > that has been assigned by a first access router. There might be quite > a bit of overhead involved with getting an address assigned, and you=20 > might want to delay getting a new address until, say, every 4th AR > that you encounter. While I think it might be reasonable in some > environments for neighboring ARs to have a direct IP hop between them, > I think it is less likely that the 4th neighbor over will have a direct > connection. And even direct neighbors I think are likely to be connected > in a star topology via expensive and slow backhaul links to a router > one layer up in the aggregation hierarchy. I guess this very much depends on the operator's architecture and the mobility pattern of the MN. >=20 > >> Second, I like the idea of moving the prefix assigned to the MN from > >> one AR to another. However, why do we need to keep the AR's MAC > >> address the same? IPv6 should handle the failover of a first-hop route= r > >> from one instance to another with no problems. You see the same prefi= x > >> advertised from a different MAC address; what's the big deal? You can > >> just keep using the prefix as you did before, addressing packets to th= e > >> new access router. > >>=20 > >=20 > > This is basically inherited from PMIPv6 basic operation, in which the M= N > > keeps "seeing" always the same router (i.e. same IPv6 link-local addres= s > > and MAC address) while moving within the PMIPv6 domain. This is so to > > improve performance (there are no stale entries on the neigh cache) and > > also to avoid triggering any movement detection mechanism on the MN > > (changing the default router might be treated as such). We basically > > follow the same approach. Besides, by using a logical interface per > > anchoring router, it becomes easier to handle the prefix advertisement > > on the network side. >=20 > At some layer of the stack the MN will know that it changed ARs. I don't > see any particular reason why we have to hide the movement from the=20 > MAC layer. Besides, most wide-area cellular technologies will use=20 The change is not hidden from the MAC layer, but from the IP layer. > P2P links and won't have MAC addresses visible to the upper layers=20 > directly. Well, in this case the L2 change is "by default" hidden from the IP stack (if the new MAG shares the IP address from the old one). >=20 > >> Third, I don't like the idea of having to ship so much state around th= e > >> network through the HSS. In your draft you talk about (out-of-scope) > >> mechanisms to get the prefix and the anchor gateway address to the new > >> D-GW. There is also the complication of knowing which prior prefixes > >> the MN wants to keep at its new attachment point. It seems to me that > >> we should avoid the behavior that a new prefix is always assigned at > >> each new point of attachment; rather, we should force the MN to take > >> some sort of affirmative action to acquire an address/prefix for its > >> use, such as DHCP-PD. This would be done occasionally, not on every > >> handover, and the MN could register its intent to keep an address > >> through e.g., dynamic DNS update. Then the new D- GW could lookup the > >> DNS name of the MN at the time it attaches, see the list of addresses > >> that are currently assigned, and take steps to attract the packets for > >> those prefixes. This could be a tunnel or it could be a BGP UPDATE as > >> outlined in draft- > > mccann-dmm-flatarch-00. > >=20 > > I haven't had time to check your draft yet. Apologies for that, I'll do > > it shortly.=20 >=20 > Great, would be glad to have your comments. >=20 > > In any case, our draft does not specify how the info about > > the active prefixes is obtained, and from where the require state is > > retrieved. A centralized entity (such as the HSS, or a centralized LMA) > > is just an example. Our draft also includes some PMIPv6 protocol > > extensions to obtain that info from the previous router visited by the > > MN (we call that D-GW), if the current router knows it. So basically th= e > > defined mechanisms are not incompatible, IMHO, with the ones you > > mentioned above. >=20 > Sure. I guess it is necessary to get the old prefix that was assigned > somehow; it just seems that the additional effort to map this to an ancho= ring > D-GW might be too much. Not sure I follow what you said here... >=20 > >> Finally, I don't quite understand the "Local Prefixes" concept > >> presented in the draft. I understand how LIPA is supposed to work, but > >> I don't understand why you need to treat such prefixes differently fro= m > >> any other prefix on the D-GW1 link. You are tunneling all the traffic > >> back to the D-GW1 AR, correct? Wouldn't the traffic just naturally > >> follow the proper path through to the D-GW1 and from there to the > >> local CN? > >=20 > > We are considering here prefixes that because of security or other > > reasons are not normally reachable from the Internet, but only from > > nodes directly attached to D-GW1 (e.g., in an enterprise network). For > > that case, it might be useful to keep being able to reach those while > > being attached to a different D-GW. This is the LIPA use case considere= d > > by 3GPP. >=20 > I understand the motivation, but wouldn't this use case be solved because > of the fact you have a tunnel from the old D-GW to the new D-GW? Why=20 > does the new D-GW need to know that a particular prefix was local to the > previous D-GW? Aren't you proposing to always use reverse tunneling back > to the old D-GW for those packets that use the old logical interface? The tunnel is only used while you have ongoing sessions active. But you might want to still being able to start new sessions to that local prefix via the D-GW connected to it (because it is the only way to get connectivity to it). >=20 > >> Personally, I think it might be better to use client-based Mobile IP > >> for any scenario where the current AR cannot attract the packets for a > >> given prefix, such as when the MN moves out of the domain of one > >> operator. That situation is very similar to the LIPA case and could b= e > >> solved with a single mechanism. > >=20 > > Client-based DMM is a topic that deserves additional attention. In our > > draft we have started to look at a network-based solution, but we can > > discuss the implications of a client-based solution as well. >=20 > I think the network based solution is a good match for the frequent, > localized mobility within a given autonomous system. However, once you > cross a boundary outside of which the network can't re-route your traffic= , > client MIP seems to be required. For that case, seems to me that both PMIP and CMIP-based solutions could be appropriate, but it depends on the specific assumptions. I guess we would need to look further into the details. Thanks, Carlos >=20 > >> Looking forward to continued discussion, > >=20 > > So do we. Thanks for the good comments. > >=20 > > Carlos >=20 > -Pete >=20 --=20 Carlos Jes=FAs Bernardos Cano http://www.netcom.it.uc3m.es/ GPG FP: D29B 0A6A 639A A561 93CA 4D55 35DC BA4D D170 4F67 --=-AzKYYBt7ZoQRg5TTak+r Content-Type: application/pgp-signature; name="signature.asc" Content-Description: This is a digitally signed message part Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.4.11 (GNU/Linux) iEYEABECAAYFAk9i/dAACgkQNdy6TdFwT2cjTACgi0G+hEbtgIp+9vcCDHwRU+JD B6oAmwZ6fzFcDvl8bf+AVRD9JoWzjQUZ =Rjil -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --=-AzKYYBt7ZoQRg5TTak+r-- From cjbc@it.uc3m.es Fri Mar 16 01:49:51 2012 Return-Path: X-Original-To: dmm@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: dmm@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id B0E1321F84EC for ; Fri, 16 Mar 2012 01:49:51 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -5.684 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-5.684 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.015, BAYES_00=-2.599, J_CHICKENPOX_21=0.6, MIME_8BIT_HEADER=0.3, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-4] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([12.22.58.30]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id dn-0Q2YYy50S for ; Fri, 16 Mar 2012 01:49:50 -0700 (PDT) Received: from smtp01.uc3m.es (smtp01.uc3m.es [163.117.176.131]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0368921F85E3 for ; Fri, 16 Mar 2012 01:49:45 -0700 (PDT) X-uc3m-safe: yes Received: from [163.117.139.72] (acorde.it.uc3m.es [163.117.139.72]) (using TLSv1 with cipher AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by smtp01.uc3m.es (Postfix) with ESMTP id E5486C28133; Fri, 16 Mar 2012 09:49:44 +0100 (CET) Message-ID: <1331887784.4259.158.camel@acorde.it.uc3m.es> From: Carlos =?ISO-8859-1?Q?Jes=FAs?= Bernardos Cano To: luo.wen@zte.com.cn Date: Fri, 16 Mar 2012 09:49:44 +0100 In-Reply-To: References: Organization: Universidad Carlos III de Madrid Content-Type: multipart/signed; micalg="pgp-sha1"; protocol="application/pgp-signature"; boundary="=-pf3x64LOC4VVgjfFVWvN" X-Mailer: Evolution 3.2.2-1 Mime-Version: 1.0 X-TM-AS-Product-Ver: IMSS-7.0.0.3116-6.8.0.1017-18776.003 Cc: "dmm@ietf.org" Subject: Re: [DMM] review of draft-bernardos-dmm-distributed-anchoring-00 X-BeenThere: dmm@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.12 Precedence: list Reply-To: cjbc@it.uc3m.es List-Id: Distributed Mobility Management Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 16 Mar 2012 08:49:51 -0000 --=-pf3x64LOC4VVgjfFVWvN Content-Type: text/plain; charset="ISO-8859-15" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Hi Luowen, First of all, apologies for my late reply. Please, see inline below. On Tue, 2012-03-13 at 14:43 +0800, luo.wen@zte.com.cn wrote: >=20 > Hi Carlos=20 >=20 > I have reviewed your draft, and I have two questions to your draft as > following:=20 Thanks for reading it. >=20 > First, let's consider this scenario. Initially, MN is attached to > D-GW1 and has a session#1 (anchored at D-GW1). When moving to D-GW2, > MN starts another session#2 (session#1 keeps on going). As per your > draft, D-GW2 should simulate mndgw1 and mndgw2 and establish a tunnel > with D-GW1 for this MN. MN continues to move to D-GW3. Then D-GW3 > should simulate mndgw1, mndgw2 and mndgw3 and maintains two forwarding > tunnels between itself and D-GW1, D-GW2 for the MN. And MN could > continue to move again and again.....=20 > PMIP requires only one MAG and only one PMIP tunnel for one MN. But it > seems that, your draft requires, for one MN, multiple MAGs (i.e. those > mndgw1, mndgw2 and mndgw3) and multiple tunnels for one MN. If MN The solution requires multiple logical interfaces to be created on the D-GW, but the tunnels between them could be re-used. > keeps on moving, the situation will become worse. I mean, maybe > dozens of MAGs and tunnels are needed for this MN. In this case, > performance of your D-GW will be a big issue. Of course, you can Creation and maintenance of logical interfaces is a very low resource consuming task. If per-MN-per-anchor tunnel creation is a problem, they can be shared among several MNs. Besides, in realistic deployments, the chances that an MN has active anchored prefixes in more than 2-3 D-GWs will be very low. Most likely, address continuity will be only provided for one prefix anchored at a different D-GW. > limited the HNPes one MN can maintain (e.g. 3 HNPes per MN, then only > 3 D-GWs could be involved at most), but to me, it is very hard to > determine the threshold to satisfy every single MN. Otherwise, > network should have a mechanism for terminating IP addresses to > release some D-GWs. But how to determine an IP address (HNP) is not > used by a MN is also a challenge.=20 There are several mechanisms that can be used to determine that an IP address is no longer active. Some of them involve active participation from the MN itself (which is the entity that actually knows it). >=20 > Second, in figure 2 of your draft, D-GW2 simulates two logic GWs (i.e. > mn1dgw1 and mn1dgw2), and MN is attached to both two logic GWs. Does > this indicate MN should maintain tow separated logic link with mn1dgw1 > and mn1dgw2 respectively? If it does, then how can you ensure that MN > will establish an additional logic link with mn1dgw2 when MN moves > from D-GW1 to D-GW2?=20 No, no logical links are required. From the point of view of the MN, it is just as it is attached to a link where two routers are also attached. When MN move to D-GW3, it is as a new router got attached to the link (no configuration step required by the MN). Thanks, Carlos >=20 > What do you think?=20 >=20 > BR=20 > Luowen --=20 Carlos Jes=FAs Bernardos Cano http://www.netcom.it.uc3m.es/ GPG FP: D29B 0A6A 639A A561 93CA 4D55 35DC BA4D D170 4F67 --=-pf3x64LOC4VVgjfFVWvN Content-Type: application/pgp-signature; name="signature.asc" Content-Description: This is a digitally signed message part Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.4.11 (GNU/Linux) iEYEABECAAYFAk9i/qgACgkQNdy6TdFwT2fuPACghp6s6G3VIBqN+NVgNMt5n8NF TjMAn1/WkXv/F5FXLGQrvI83U3XE+a4o =fm8J -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --=-pf3x64LOC4VVgjfFVWvN-- From cjbc@it.uc3m.es Fri Mar 16 01:50:46 2012 Return-Path: X-Original-To: dmm@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: dmm@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5A80521F85CE for ; Fri, 16 Mar 2012 01:50:46 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -5.685 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-5.685 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.014, BAYES_00=-2.599, J_CHICKENPOX_21=0.6, MIME_8BIT_HEADER=0.3, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-4] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([12.22.58.30]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id F3-+yuWrz5BN for ; Fri, 16 Mar 2012 01:50:45 -0700 (PDT) Received: from smtp02.uc3m.es (smtp02.uc3m.es [163.117.176.132]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1A00421F8604 for ; Fri, 16 Mar 2012 01:50:44 -0700 (PDT) X-uc3m-safe: yes Received: from [163.117.139.72] (acorde.it.uc3m.es [163.117.139.72]) (using TLSv1 with cipher AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by smtp02.uc3m.es (Postfix) with ESMTP id C8935703EE7; Fri, 16 Mar 2012 09:50:43 +0100 (CET) Message-ID: <1331887843.4259.160.camel@acorde.it.uc3m.es> From: Carlos =?ISO-8859-1?Q?Jes=FAs?= Bernardos Cano To: Marco Liebsch Date: Fri, 16 Mar 2012 09:50:43 +0100 In-Reply-To: <69756203DDDDE64E987BC4F70B71A26D24D723F8@DAPHNIS.office.hd> References: <1330969192.3680.35.camel@acorde.it.uc3m.es> <69756203DDDDE64E987BC4F70B71A26D24D723F8@DAPHNIS.office.hd> Organization: Universidad Carlos III de Madrid Content-Type: multipart/signed; micalg="pgp-sha1"; protocol="application/pgp-signature"; boundary="=-g7nAiUNn0Yxw42AjjZNI" X-Mailer: Evolution 3.2.2-1 Mime-Version: 1.0 X-TM-AS-Product-Ver: IMSS-7.0.0.3116-6.8.0.1017-18776.003 Cc: "dmm@ietf.org" Subject: Re: [DMM] New DMM draft: draft-bernardos-dmm-distributed-anchoring-00.txt X-BeenThere: dmm@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.12 Precedence: list Reply-To: cjbc@it.uc3m.es List-Id: Distributed Mobility Management Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 16 Mar 2012 08:50:46 -0000 --=-g7nAiUNn0Yxw42AjjZNI Content-Type: text/plain; charset="ISO-8859-15" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Hi Marco, Apologies for the late reply. Thanks for reading the draft. Please see some answers to your questions/comments inline below. On Fri, 2012-03-09 at 11:51 +0000, Marco Liebsch wrote: > Hi Carlos, >=20 > I have a few clarifying questions to your new draft. The draft proposes t= he > distributed logical interface. I don't really get the advantage of virtua= lizing > the previous LMA on the MN's current LMA if packets are routed through > the previous LMA anyway. Why not using the current LMA to serve simply > as MAG for forwarded traffic (which remains anchored at previous LMA) > and using the new LMA to anchor the new address/prefix?=20 What you just mention is exactly what the draft does. Additionally, the logical interface simplifies the interface between the MN and the access router that behaves as LMA/MAG. It does so because by interacting with the MN as different "logical" routers (one per anchoring LMA), you can make full use of the ND based features (e.g., RFC4191) in a very easy way. >=20 > The draft writes that the idea hides the change of the anchor from the > mobile node. The DGW2IF on the new LMA does not pretend to be LMA1, or? > I don't see how the anchor change is kept transparent to the MN. The point is that from the point of view of the MN, it always "sees" as directly connected (1-hop away) each of the anchor LMAs. Every time the MN moves and attaches to a new access router, the only thing it notices is that a new ("logical") router appears on the link, advertising a new prefix (and, in most use cases, the others start advertising the prefixes with lifetime=3D0 to deprecate them). >=20 > I somehow agree also to Pete's opinion that solving the packet routing af= ter > anchor relocation above the anchors is a good option. It simply allows mo= re > optimal routes. I have to read his draft, but unless you have control on the routing infrastructure (and this is not always possible, and it takes time to converge), I don't see many other options to ensure address continuity. >=20 > Now I am deviating a bit, but into the direction of an important question= : > That's directly related to the question of how persistent we need to be > about IP address continuity. Now, some proposals consider termination > of an IP address prefix, which is anchored at a previously used anchor po= int, > as soon as the IP session, which uses that address, terminates. New sessi= ons > can use the address being anchored at the new mobility anchor. My opinion= is > that we need to find a good choice about the lifetime of such an anchored= IP > address, as it may also be registered with other services, e.g. IMS, mess= aging, etc, > and would require an updated registration after a change in the registere= d address. > And even if such lifetime is short, we may not accept suboptimal routing = paths > via the previous anchor after anchor relocation. Session lifetime and prefix anchoring termination is a tricky and important issue. As I see it, DMM is compatible with a "classical" centralized approach (at least for the solutions that are basically extending currently standardized IP mobility protocols to operate in a more "distributed" way). For those applications that are known in advance to require very long address lifetime (compared to the anchoring mobility rate), I'd say that those sessions it might make sense to keep them centrally anchored (or to enable applications to be able to survive to an IP address change). Thanks, Carlos >=20 > What do you think? >=20 > Thanks, > marco >=20 >=20 >=20 > > -----Original Message----- > > From: dmm-bounces@ietf.org [mailto:dmm-bounces@ietf.org] On Behalf Of > > Carlos Jes=FAs Bernardos Cano > > Sent: Montag, 5. M=E4rz 2012 18:40 > > To: dmm@ietf.org > > Subject: [DMM] New DMM draft: draft-bernardos-dmm-distributed- > > anchoring-00.txt > >=20 > > Dear all, > >=20 > > We've just submitted a new I-D on the DMM space. The draft describes a > > network-based DMM approach extending PMIPv6, and focusing on the > > required extensions to effectively support simultaneously anchoring sev= eral > > flows at different distributed anchors. > >=20 > > As usual, comments would be warmly welcomed! > >=20 > > More info below: > >=20 > > Title : PMIPv6-based distributed anchoring > > Author(s) : Carlos J. Bernardos > > Juan Carlos Zuniga > > Filename : > > draft-bernardos-dmm-distributed-anchoring-00.txt > > Pages : 23 > > Date : 2012-03-05 > >=20 > > Distributed Mobility Management solutions allow for setting up > > networks so that traffic is distributed in an optimal way and does > > not rely on centralized deployed anchors to provide IP mobility > > support. > >=20 > > There are many different approaches to address Distributed Mobility > > Management, as for example extending network-based mobility protocol= s > > (like Proxy Mobile IPv6), or client-based mobility protocols (as > > Mobile IPv6), among others. This document follows the former > > approach, and proposes a solution based on Proxy Mobile IPv6 in whic= h > > mobility sessions are anchored at the last IP hop router (called > > distributed gateway). The distributed gateway is an enhanced access > > router which is also able to operate as local mobility anchor or > > mobility access gateway, on a per prefix basis. The draft focuses o= n > > the required extensions to effectively support simultaneously > > anchoring several flows at different distributed gateways. > >=20 > > This draft introduces the concept of distributed logical interface > > (at the distributed gateway), which is a software construct that > > allows to easily hide the change of anchor from the mobile node. > > Additionally, the draft describes how to provide session continuity > > in inter-domain scenarios in which dynamic tunneling or signaling > > between distributed gateways from different operators is not allowed= . > >=20 > >=20 > > A URL for this Internet-Draft is: > > http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-bernardos-dmm-distributed- > > anchoring-00.txt > >=20 > > Thanks, > >=20 > > Carlos > >=20 > > -- > > Carlos Jes=FAs Bernardos Cano http://www.netcom.it.uc3m.es/ GPG FP: D2= 9B > > 0A6A 639A A561 93CA 4D55 35DC BA4D D170 4F67 --=20 Carlos Jes=FAs Bernardos Cano http://www.netcom.it.uc3m.es/ GPG FP: D29B 0A6A 639A A561 93CA 4D55 35DC BA4D D170 4F67 --=-g7nAiUNn0Yxw42AjjZNI Content-Type: application/pgp-signature; name="signature.asc" Content-Description: This is a digitally signed message part Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.4.11 (GNU/Linux) iEYEABECAAYFAk9i/uMACgkQNdy6TdFwT2ePoACgiIhaZlccMTPB3GREi1youv2W g/AAn2dlN0G2YyriGeUWkeGDD/MZ5cgw =xHgX -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --=-g7nAiUNn0Yxw42AjjZNI-- From cjbc@it.uc3m.es Fri Mar 16 01:56:07 2012 Return-Path: X-Original-To: dmm@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: dmm@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id C44CC21F868C for ; Fri, 16 Mar 2012 01:56:07 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -5.686 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-5.686 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.013, BAYES_00=-2.599, J_CHICKENPOX_21=0.6, MIME_8BIT_HEADER=0.3, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-4] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([12.22.58.30]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id meP-kjlhoFMa for ; Fri, 16 Mar 2012 01:56:07 -0700 (PDT) Received: from smtp03.uc3m.es (smtp03.uc3m.es [163.117.176.133]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id D439821F85D1 for ; Fri, 16 Mar 2012 01:55:59 -0700 (PDT) X-uc3m-safe: yes Received: from [163.117.139.72] (acorde.it.uc3m.es [163.117.139.72]) (using TLSv1 with cipher AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by smtp03.uc3m.es (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8FB5C9C6926 for ; Fri, 16 Mar 2012 09:55:57 +0100 (CET) Message-ID: <1331888157.4259.165.camel@acorde.it.uc3m.es> From: Carlos =?ISO-8859-1?Q?Jes=FAs?= Bernardos Cano To: "dmm@ietf.org" Date: Fri, 16 Mar 2012 09:55:57 +0100 Organization: Universidad Carlos III de Madrid Content-Type: multipart/signed; micalg="pgp-sha1"; protocol="application/pgp-signature"; boundary="=-1Ex+h455Sy8MOyeFKiye" X-Mailer: Evolution 3.2.2-1 Mime-Version: 1.0 X-TM-AS-Product-Ver: IMSS-7.0.0.3116-6.8.0.1017-18776.003 Subject: [DMM] Network-based DMM demo at IETF 83 X-BeenThere: dmm@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.12 Precedence: list Reply-To: cjbc@it.uc3m.es List-Id: Distributed Mobility Management Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 16 Mar 2012 08:56:07 -0000 --=-1Ex+h455Sy8MOyeFKiye Content-Type: text/plain; charset="ISO-8859-15" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Dear all, We will also want to take the opportunity of our first official DMM meeting at IETF 83 to show a demonstration of a real-life implementation of DMM solution, based on the following two drafts: http://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-bernardos-dmm-pmip http://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-bernardos-dmm-distributed-anchoring We will try to make the demo after DMM session (we need to check with the DMM WG chairs, the ADs and the Secretariat). We'll announce the full details in proper time. Kind Regards, Carlos et al. --=20 Carlos Jes=FAs Bernardos Cano http://www.netcom.it.uc3m.es/ GPG FP: D29B 0A6A 639A A561 93CA 4D55 35DC BA4D D170 4F67 --=-1Ex+h455Sy8MOyeFKiye Content-Type: application/pgp-signature; name="signature.asc" Content-Description: This is a digitally signed message part Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.4.11 (GNU/Linux) iEYEABECAAYFAk9jAB0ACgkQNdy6TdFwT2dyggCgtQV5jasX8NrT9BYpH10luICe 77wAnjyJ8MnFDpru++hskeYHqozlwJ1Y =WGLN -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --=-1Ex+h455Sy8MOyeFKiye-- From maxpassion@gmail.com Fri Mar 16 02:45:26 2012 Return-Path: X-Original-To: dmm@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: dmm@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3B3F321F85D0 for ; Fri, 16 Mar 2012 02:45:26 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -3.428 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-3.428 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.171, BAYES_00=-2.599, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW=-1] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([12.22.58.30]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id iJvj-BnYf14x for ; Fri, 16 Mar 2012 02:45:25 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail-iy0-f172.google.com (mail-iy0-f172.google.com [209.85.210.172]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9BA7021F85CE for ; Fri, 16 Mar 2012 02:45:25 -0700 (PDT) Received: by iazz13 with SMTP id z13so6056637iaz.31 for ; Fri, 16 Mar 2012 02:45:25 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20120113; h=mime-version:in-reply-to:references:date:message-id:subject:from:to :cc:content-type; bh=f9qtY/ww5nA2w3/EYTrRBTyKKCFXnuh8WFcDfbdfHfo=; b=bz1W9hXHi2iNTNRRYxToE/592inDVLkdpAgyWhnlh8iueg8Enk8OM+JNYfmJKk7p+4 7eXvvbmidoJLqydmtiPhcgSE/CqgjSGyPGRpQdfBDhgovZkr/u3TXySMdeIwLq862FjT zCgjHmhErECoA/NgV09Fh2pOIuK3k2R9XnIk4W5ucMDwXjW4oLcz1gT7z0xnX/QDrUGW FZACdxbcTH4THN5JXFgms6YP0wXXMLeNB3L4roExV9teAptehqo4Yj9glGk/iQnBM/p5 Y5gSxss8ugaKjb7Nmq5ysIizwSbRFepu+Sw4octx+bG4/GtLJeOmrrqf9xXhCdOSF3/T vFnw== MIME-Version: 1.0 Received: by 10.50.194.163 with SMTP id hx3mr19579204igc.49.1331891125346; Fri, 16 Mar 2012 02:45:25 -0700 (PDT) Received: by 10.42.196.200 with HTTP; Fri, 16 Mar 2012 02:45:25 -0700 (PDT) In-Reply-To: <5963DDF1F751474D8DEEFDCDBEE43AE716447C77@dfweml504-mbx> References: <5963DDF1F751474D8DEEFDCDBEE43AE716447C77@dfweml504-mbx> Date: Fri, 16 Mar 2012 17:45:25 +0800 Message-ID: From: liu dapeng To: Peter McCann Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Cc: "dmm@ietf.org" Subject: Re: [DMM] draft-mccann-dmm-flatarch-00.txt X-BeenThere: dmm@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.12 Precedence: list List-Id: Distributed Mobility Management Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 16 Mar 2012 09:45:26 -0000 Hello Peter, One additional comment for section3: seems that it is a key exchange procedure instead of a authentication procedure? -Dapeng Liu 2012/3/6, Peter McCann : > Hi, all, > > On Friday I submitted a new draft that outlines what I think is a novel > approach to mobility management in a totally flat network. The draft > can be found here: > > http://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-mccann-dmm-flatarch-00 > > Abstract > > Today's mobility management schemes make use of a hierarchy of > tunnels from a relatively fixed anchor point, through one or more > intermediate nodes, to reach the MN's current point of attachment. > These schemes suffer from poor performance, scalability, and failure > modes due to the centralization and statefulness of the anchor > point(s). The dmm (Distributed Mobility Management) working group is > currently chartered to investigate alternative solutions that will > provide greater performance, scalability, and robustness through the > distribution of mobility anchors. This document is an input to the > dmm discussion. It outlines a problem statement for the existing > mobility management techniques and goes on to propose (high-level) > solutions to two of the most vexing problems: MN authentication and > mobility management in a fully distributed, flat (non-hierarchical) > access network. These two aspects are often treated separately in a > layered architecture, but we argue there are important advantages to > considering how these two functions can work in tandem to provide a > simple and robust framework for the design of a wireless Internet > Service Provider network. > > > I'd like some time to present this draft during the meeting in Paris, > hopefully 15 minutes. > > -- > Peter J. McCann > Huawei Technologies (USA) > Peter.McCann@Huawei.com > +1 908 541 3563 > Rm. C-0105, 400 Crossings Blvd. (2nd floor), Bridgewater, NJ 08807-2863 > USA > > > _______________________________________________ > dmm mailing list > dmm@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dmm > -- ------ Best Regards, Dapeng Liu From pierrick.seite@orange.com Fri Mar 16 02:50:37 2012 Return-Path: X-Original-To: dmm@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: dmm@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8A49B21F8678; Fri, 16 Mar 2012 02:50:37 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -6.232 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-6.232 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.017, BAYES_00=-2.599, HELO_EQ_FR=0.35, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-4] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([12.22.58.30]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id KVQOSHexOBYF; Fri, 16 Mar 2012 02:50:37 -0700 (PDT) Received: from r-mail1.rd.francetelecom.com (r-mail1.rd.francetelecom.com [217.108.152.41]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9B24221F86B8; Fri, 16 Mar 2012 02:50:36 -0700 (PDT) Received: from r-mail1.rd.francetelecom.com (localhost.localdomain [127.0.0.1]) by localhost (Postfix) with SMTP id AF54BA44156; Fri, 16 Mar 2012 10:52:05 +0100 (CET) Received: from ftrdsmtp1.rd.francetelecom.fr (unknown [10.192.128.46]) by r-mail1.rd.francetelecom.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id A3B04A4414C; Fri, 16 Mar 2012 10:52:05 +0100 (CET) Received: from ftrdmel0.rd.francetelecom.fr ([10.192.128.56]) by ftrdsmtp1.rd.francetelecom.fr with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.4675); Fri, 16 Mar 2012 10:50:34 +0100 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft Exchange V6.5 Content-class: urn:content-classes:message MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Date: Fri, 16 Mar 2012 10:50:33 +0100 Message-ID: <843DA8228A1BA74CA31FB4E111A5C46202403A58@ftrdmel0.rd.francetelecom.fr> In-Reply-To: X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: Thread-Topic: [dmm] [MEXT] DMM demo Thread-Index: Ac0DRR1k/vSnAFMIRdGbqOS2IY3sxwAFLJkQ References: <494B8B97-093D-4886-88D7-F1A2EF065BB4@gmail.com><843DA8228A1BA74CA31FB4E111A5C46202383F89@ftrdmel0.rd.francetelecom.fr><843DA8228A1BA74CA31FB4E111A5C4620238414D@ftrdmel0.rd.francetelecom.fr> From: To: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 16 Mar 2012 09:50:34.0966 (UTC) FILETIME=[3BD97760:01CD035A] Cc: dmm@ietf.org, mext@ietf.org Subject: Re: [DMM] [dmm] [MEXT] DMM demo X-BeenThere: dmm@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.12 Precedence: list List-Id: Distributed Mobility Management Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 16 Mar 2012 09:50:37 -0000 Hi Dapeng, No, there is no modification of the streaming application, it's based on = VLC. Pierrick > -----Message d'origine----- > De=A0: liu dapeng [mailto:maxpassion@gmail.com] > Envoy=E9=A0: vendredi 16 mars 2012 08:19 > =C0=A0: SEITE Pierrick RD-RESA-REN > Cc=A0: ext-bruno.faria@nokia.com; mext@ietf.org; dmm@ietf.org > Objet=A0: Re: [dmm] [MEXT] DMM demo >=20 > Hello Pierrick, >=20 > Is there any modification of the application that used in the DEMO? >=20 > Thanks. >=20 > regards, > Dapeng Liu >=20 > 2012/3/2, pierrick.seite@orange.com : > > Hi Bruno, > > > > Thanks for your interest. The demo illustrates a PMIPv6 based > distributed > > mobility on a Wifi network, with 2 or 3 wifi APs. We show IP > continuity on a > > video streaming. The network architecture is as per draft-seite-dmm- > dma > > where access routers implement both MAG and LMA functions (see > attached > > slides for more details); i.e. PMIP runs only between AR. Dynamic > mobility > > is also shown: PMIP signaling comes into play only when the MN > performs > > handover otherwise, standard IP routing applies. Regarding > implementation, > > Network elements and streaming server are Linux virtual machines, = all > on a > > single laptop. > > > > I hope to see you at the demo :-) > > Pierrick > > > >> -----Message d'origine----- > >> De : ext-bruno.faria@nokia.com [mailto:ext-bruno.faria@nokia.com] > >> Envoy=E9 : jeudi 1 mars 2012 22:10 > >> =C0 : SEITE Pierrick RD-RESA-REN; mext@ietf.org > >> Cc : dmm@ietf.org > >> Objet : RE: DMM demo > >> > >> Hello Pierrick, > >> > >> That seems to be very interesting. > >> Can you point out some information about that implementation? > >> > >> Rgds, > >> > >> - Bruno > >> > >> >-----Original Message----- > >> >From: mext-bounces@ietf.org [mailto:mext-bounces@ietf.org] On > Behalf > >> Of > >> >ext pierrick.seite@orange.com > >> >Sent: quinta-feira, 1 de mar=E7o de 2012 09:04 > >> >To: mext@ietf.org > >> >Cc: dmm@ietf.org > >> >Subject: [MEXT] DMM demo > >> > > >> > > >> >Hello all, > >> > > >> > > >> >We will take the opportunity of the IETF#83 to show a = demonstration > of > >> >distributed mobility management (DMM), based on the following > draft: > >> > > >> >http://www.ietf.org/id/draft-seite-dmm-dma-00.txt > >> > > >> >We will make the demo after DMM meeting (03/29), during lunch = time. > >> I'll > >> >communicate the exact location as soon as I'm able to. > >> > > >> >BR, > >> >Pierrick > >> >_______________________________________________ > >> >MEXT mailing list > >> >MEXT@ietf.org > >> >https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/mext > > >=20 >=20 > -- >=20 > ------ > Best Regards, > Dapeng Liu From Marco.Liebsch@neclab.eu Fri Mar 16 03:01:08 2012 Return-Path: X-Original-To: dmm@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: dmm@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7A4D021F85C2 for ; Fri, 16 Mar 2012 03:01:08 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.256 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.256 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=-0.257, BAYES_00=-2.599, J_CHICKENPOX_21=0.6] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([12.22.58.30]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 8zbYa8bl1d8z for ; Fri, 16 Mar 2012 03:01:07 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mailer1.neclab.eu (mailer1.neclab.eu [195.37.70.40]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2EE0F21F866B for ; Fri, 16 Mar 2012 03:01:07 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mailer1.neclab.eu (Postfix) with ESMTP id 90C5C10094F; Fri, 16 Mar 2012 11:01:51 +0100 (CET) X-Virus-Scanned: Amavisd on Debian GNU/Linux (netlab.nec.de) Received: from mailer1.neclab.eu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (atlas-a.office.hd [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id Zf07KBdzz1um; Fri, 16 Mar 2012 11:01:51 +0100 (CET) Received: from ENCELADUS.office.hd (unknown [192.168.24.52]) by mailer1.neclab.eu (Postfix) with ESMTP id 75E3210094C; Fri, 16 Mar 2012 11:01:41 +0100 (CET) Received: from Polydeuces.office.hd ([169.254.3.36]) by ENCELADUS.office.hd ([192.168.24.52]) with mapi id 14.01.0323.003; Fri, 16 Mar 2012 11:00:55 +0100 From: Marco Liebsch To: "cjbc@it.uc3m.es" Thread-Topic: [DMM] New DMM draft: draft-bernardos-dmm-distributed-anchoring-00.txt Thread-Index: AQHNA1Xgg2lHGTIoXUatioze9Mi+zJZsq8Sw Date: Fri, 16 Mar 2012 10:00:54 +0000 Message-ID: <69756203DDDDE64E987BC4F70B71A26D24D83744@Polydeuces.office.hd> References: <1330969192.3680.35.camel@acorde.it.uc3m.es> <69756203DDDDE64E987BC4F70B71A26D24D723F8@DAPHNIS.office.hd> <1331887843.4259.160.camel@acorde.it.uc3m.es> In-Reply-To: <1331887843.4259.160.camel@acorde.it.uc3m.es> Accept-Language: de-DE, en-US Content-Language: en-US X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: x-originating-ip: [10.1.6.1] Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable MIME-Version: 1.0 Cc: "dmm@ietf.org" Subject: Re: [DMM] New DMM draft: draft-bernardos-dmm-distributed-anchoring-00.txt X-BeenThere: dmm@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.12 Precedence: list List-Id: Distributed Mobility Management Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 16 Mar 2012 10:01:08 -0000 Carlos, thanks for your feedback. Please see inline. > -----Original Message----- > From: Carlos Jes=FAs Bernardos Cano [mailto:cjbc@it.uc3m.es] > Sent: Freitag, 16. M=E4rz 2012 09:51 > To: Marco Liebsch > Cc: dmm@ietf.org > Subject: RE: [DMM] New DMM draft: draft-bernardos-dmm-distributed- > anchoring-00.txt >=20 > Hi Marco, >=20 > Apologies for the late reply. Thanks for reading the draft. Please see so= me > answers to your questions/comments inline below. >=20 > On Fri, 2012-03-09 at 11:51 +0000, Marco Liebsch wrote: > > Hi Carlos, > > > > I have a few clarifying questions to your new draft. The draft > > proposes the distributed logical interface. I don't really get the > > advantage of virtualizing the previous LMA on the MN's current LMA if > > packets are routed through the previous LMA anyway. Why not using the > > current LMA to serve simply as MAG for forwarded traffic (which > > remains anchored at previous LMA) and using the new LMA to anchor the > new address/prefix? >=20 > What you just mention is exactly what the draft does. Additionally, the l= ogical > interface simplifies the interface between the MN and the access router t= hat > behaves as LMA/MAG. It does so because by interacting with the MN as > different "logical" routers (one per anchoring LMA), you can make full us= e of > the ND based features (e.g., RFC4191) in a very easy way. >=20 > > > > The draft writes that the idea hides the change of the anchor from the > > mobile node. The DGW2IF on the new LMA does not pretend to be LMA1, > or? > > I don't see how the anchor change is kept transparent to the MN. >=20 > The point is that from the point of view of the MN, it always "sees" as d= irectly > connected (1-hop away) each of the anchor LMAs. Every time the MN moves > and attaches to a new access router, the only thing it notices is that a = new > ("logical") router appears on the link, advertising a new prefix (and, in= most > use cases, the others start advertising the prefixes with lifetime=3D0 to > deprecate them). The LMA function should be transparent to the MN anyway, so it does not matter whether the LMA, which serves as anchor, is on the previous AR or on the current one. Invalidating the previous HNP and validating the new HNP can be done independently of whether the responsible LMA instance is co-loc= ated with the local AR or the previous AR. But I must admit that I probably have= to check that part of your draft again. >=20 > > > > I somehow agree also to Pete's opinion that solving the packet routing > > after anchor relocation above the anchors is a good option. It simply > > allows more optimal routes. >=20 > I have to read his draft, but unless you have control on the routing > infrastructure (and this is not always possible, and it takes time to con= verge), > I don't see many other options to ensure address continuity. I don't expect this to take long time, as the routing states are not to be = enforced in all routers, at least not in our proposal. Intention is to keep the rou= ting plane as it is and update states only is one dedicated router per data session, which tran= slates the MN's IP address into a routable one to ensure that remaining routers in the= network forward the downlink packet to the MN's current anchor point. The previous = anchor point is released from any forwarding tasks. Further advantage is that rout= es are potentially more optimal compared to forwarding from a previous anchor. Which does not mean that both approaches cannot co-exist. A DMM solution could rely on forwarding while the state in the routing plane is establishe= d. >=20 > > > > Now I am deviating a bit, but into the direction of an important questi= on: > > That's directly related to the question of how persistent we need to > > be about IP address continuity. Now, some proposals consider > > termination of an IP address prefix, which is anchored at a previously > > used anchor point, as soon as the IP session, which uses that address, > > terminates. New sessions can use the address being anchored at the new > > mobility anchor. My opinion is that we need to find a good choice > > about the lifetime of such an anchored IP address, as it may also be > > registered with other services, e.g. IMS, messaging, etc, and would req= uire > an updated registration after a change in the registered address. > > And even if such lifetime is short, we may not accept suboptimal > > routing paths via the previous anchor after anchor relocation. >=20 > Session lifetime and prefix anchoring termination is a tricky and importa= nt > issue. As I see it, DMM is compatible with a "classical" > centralized approach (at least for the solutions that are basically exten= ding > currently standardized IP mobility protocols to operate in a more > "distributed" way). For those applications that are known in advance to > require very long address lifetime (compared to the anchoring mobility ra= te), > I'd say that those sessions it might make sense to keep them centrally > anchored (or to enable applications to be able to survive to an IP addres= s > change). So you think that the UE should receive multiple IP addresses and treat the= m differently according to the associated topological anchor point? Hmm, yes,= possible. What about real time streaming and other IP data sessions, which could have= a longer lifetime, they should be anchored than at a central point as well, r= ight? If the MN had such intelligence and information, it could treat the HNPs di= fferently, true. marco >=20 > Thanks, >=20 > Carlos >=20 > > > > What do you think? > > > > Thanks, > > marco > > > > > > > > > -----Original Message----- > > > From: dmm-bounces@ietf.org [mailto:dmm-bounces@ietf.org] On > Behalf > > > Of Carlos Jes=FAs Bernardos Cano > > > Sent: Montag, 5. M=E4rz 2012 18:40 > > > To: dmm@ietf.org > > > Subject: [DMM] New DMM draft: draft-bernardos-dmm-distributed- > > > anchoring-00.txt > > > > > > Dear all, > > > > > > We've just submitted a new I-D on the DMM space. The draft describes > > > a network-based DMM approach extending PMIPv6, and focusing on the > > > required extensions to effectively support simultaneously anchoring > > > several flows at different distributed anchors. > > > > > > As usual, comments would be warmly welcomed! > > > > > > More info below: > > > > > > Title : PMIPv6-based distributed anchoring > > > Author(s) : Carlos J. Bernardos > > > Juan Carlos Zuniga > > > Filename : > > > draft-bernardos-dmm-distributed-anchoring-00.txt > > > Pages : 23 > > > Date : 2012-03-05 > > > > > > Distributed Mobility Management solutions allow for setting up > > > networks so that traffic is distributed in an optimal way and does > > > not rely on centralized deployed anchors to provide IP mobility > > > support. > > > > > > There are many different approaches to address Distributed Mobilit= y > > > Management, as for example extending network-based mobility > protocols > > > (like Proxy Mobile IPv6), or client-based mobility protocols (as > > > Mobile IPv6), among others. This document follows the former > > > approach, and proposes a solution based on Proxy Mobile IPv6 in wh= ich > > > mobility sessions are anchored at the last IP hop router (called > > > distributed gateway). The distributed gateway is an enhanced acce= ss > > > router which is also able to operate as local mobility anchor or > > > mobility access gateway, on a per prefix basis. The draft focuses= on > > > the required extensions to effectively support simultaneously > > > anchoring several flows at different distributed gateways. > > > > > > This draft introduces the concept of distributed logical interface > > > (at the distributed gateway), which is a software construct that > > > allows to easily hide the change of anchor from the mobile node. > > > Additionally, the draft describes how to provide session continuit= y > > > in inter-domain scenarios in which dynamic tunneling or signaling > > > between distributed gateways from different operators is not allow= ed. > > > > > > > > > A URL for this Internet-Draft is: > > > http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-bernardos-dmm-distributed- > > > anchoring-00.txt > > > > > > Thanks, > > > > > > Carlos > > > > > > -- > > > Carlos Jes=FAs Bernardos Cano http://www.netcom.it.uc3m.es/ GPG FP: > > > D29B 0A6A 639A A561 93CA 4D55 35DC BA4D D170 4F67 >=20 > -- > Carlos Jes=FAs Bernardos Cano http://www.netcom.it.uc3m.es/ GPG FP: D29B > 0A6A 639A A561 93CA 4D55 35DC BA4D D170 4F67 From Peter.McCann@huawei.com Fri Mar 16 07:28:08 2012 Return-Path: X-Original-To: dmm@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: dmm@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5C8CA21F86C1 for ; Fri, 16 Mar 2012 07:28:08 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.338 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.338 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.261, BAYES_00=-2.599] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([12.22.58.30]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id vJc9kYY9V8Td for ; Fri, 16 Mar 2012 07:28:07 -0700 (PDT) Received: from dfwrgout.huawei.com (dfwrgout.huawei.com [206.16.17.72]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8BA0B21F86B2 for ; Fri, 16 Mar 2012 07:28:07 -0700 (PDT) Received: from 172.18.9.243 (EHLO dfweml202-edg.china.huawei.com) ([172.18.9.243]) by dfwrg02-dlp.huawei.com (MOS 4.2.3-GA FastPath) with ESMTP id AED25951; Fri, 16 Mar 2012 10:28:07 -0400 (EDT) Received: from DFWEML405-HUB.china.huawei.com (10.193.5.102) by dfweml202-edg.china.huawei.com (172.18.9.108) with Microsoft SMTP Server (TLS) id 14.1.323.3; Fri, 16 Mar 2012 07:25:26 -0700 Received: from DFWEML504-MBX.china.huawei.com ([10.124.31.30]) by dfweml405-hub.china.huawei.com ([10.193.5.102]) with mapi id 14.01.0323.003; Fri, 16 Mar 2012 07:25:22 -0700 From: Peter McCann To: liu dapeng Thread-Topic: [DMM] draft-mccann-dmm-flatarch-00.txt Thread-Index: Acz7ppM5+XaI77SoQaqa8Y3fzGKc1wHWlEmAAB+2WrA= Date: Fri, 16 Mar 2012 14:25:21 +0000 Message-ID: <5963DDF1F751474D8DEEFDCDBEE43AE716449206@dfweml504-mbx> References: <5963DDF1F751474D8DEEFDCDBEE43AE716447C77@dfweml504-mbx> In-Reply-To: Accept-Language: en-US, zh-CN Content-Language: en-US X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: x-originating-ip: [10.193.125.144] Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable MIME-Version: 1.0 X-CFilter-Loop: Reflected Cc: "dmm@ietf.org" Subject: Re: [DMM] draft-mccann-dmm-flatarch-00.txt X-BeenThere: dmm@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.12 Precedence: list List-Id: Distributed Mobility Management Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 16 Mar 2012 14:28:08 -0000 Hi, Dapeng, liu dapeng wrote: > Hi Peter, >=20 > As we discussed offline earlier, I have a similar proposal which is > also rely on IBGP to update the routing system and thence allow the MN > keep its address unchanged even after handover. I have not submit the > draft for this upcoming meeting. >=20 > The difference is that my proposal does not relay on DNS. Since the AR > needs to do reverse lookup every time a MN attaches to it, it may > result in performance issue. There needs to be some way for the new AR to discover the prefixes associated with the MN. DNS seems to be a relatively easy and light-weight way of doing that. > Another point is for the inital state, the prefixes could be > aggregated at the reflector and confine the routing update whin the > domain but after a period of time, many MNs would roam in the domain > and the prefixes would be diffcult to aggregate. To solve this one > option is to design a upper level router above all the domain > reflectors and by carefully address planning, to make all the MN's > prefix belong to that router. You can have multiple layers of route reflectors. The UPDATE can be confined to the appropriate scope. > The idea could be extended to not only depends on IBGP. more general > speaking, it allows mobility management interacting with routing > system and will result in several different alternative designs. Agreed, but BGP seems to offer the policy flexibility (with LOCAL_PREF) that we need to ensure that the latest UPDATE is used by all the routers. > Besides authentication, there are many other aspects need to explore, > e.g: address management, billing system etc.. In general I am striving for an architecture that is free of RADIUS and Diameter. Granted, I have only addressed the first A in AAA, but I think there are good solutions for the other two As that won't=20 require round-trips to the home network. -Pete > Regards, > Dapeng Liu >=20 > 2012/3/6, Peter McCann : >> Hi, all, >>=20 >> On Friday I submitted a new draft that outlines what I think is a >> novel approach to mobility management in a totally flat network. >> The draft can be found here: >>=20 >> http://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-mccann-dmm-flatarch-00 >>=20 >> Abstract >>=20 >> Today's mobility management schemes make use of a hierarchy of >> tunnels from a relatively fixed anchor point, through one or more >> intermediate nodes, to reach the MN's current point of attachment. >> These schemes suffer from poor performance, scalability, and failure >> modes due to the centralization and statefulness of the anchor >> point(s). The dmm (Distributed Mobility Management) working >> group > is >> currently chartered to investigate alternative solutions that will >> provide greater performance, scalability, and robustness through the >> distribution of mobility anchors. This document is an input to the >> dmm discussion. It outlines a problem statement for the existing >> mobility management techniques and goes on to propose (high-level) >> solutions to two of the most vexing problems: MN authentication and >> mobility management in a fully distributed, flat (non- hierarchical) >> access network. These two aspects are often treated separately >> in > a >> layered architecture, but we argue there are important advantages to >> considering how these two functions can work in tandem to provide a >> simple and robust framework for the design of a wireless Internet >> Service Provider network. >>=20 >> I'd like some time to present this draft during the meeting in >> Paris, hopefully 15 minutes. >>=20 >> -- >> Peter J. McCann >> Huawei Technologies (USA) >> Peter.McCann@Huawei.com >> +1 908 541 3563 >> Rm. C-0105, 400 Crossings Blvd. (2nd floor), Bridgewater, NJ >> 08807-2863 USA From Peter.McCann@huawei.com Fri Mar 16 07:28:47 2012 Return-Path: X-Original-To: dmm@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: dmm@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9D4E321F85EA for ; Fri, 16 Mar 2012 07:28:47 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.362 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.362 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.237, BAYES_00=-2.599] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([12.22.58.30]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id Z6FbFvYqjS6g for ; Fri, 16 Mar 2012 07:28:47 -0700 (PDT) Received: from dfwrgout.huawei.com (dfwrgout.huawei.com [206.16.17.72]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 064E721F85E7 for ; Fri, 16 Mar 2012 07:28:46 -0700 (PDT) Received: from 172.18.9.243 (EHLO dfweml201-edg.china.huawei.com) ([172.18.9.243]) by dfwrg01-dlp.huawei.com (MOS 4.2.3-GA FastPath) with ESMTP id AEL29275; Fri, 16 Mar 2012 10:28:46 -0400 (EDT) Received: from DFWEML403-HUB.china.huawei.com (10.193.5.151) by dfweml201-edg.china.huawei.com (172.18.9.107) with Microsoft SMTP Server (TLS) id 14.1.323.3; Fri, 16 Mar 2012 07:25:59 -0700 Received: from DFWEML504-MBX.china.huawei.com ([10.124.31.30]) by dfweml403-hub.china.huawei.com ([10.193.5.151]) with mapi id 14.01.0323.003; Fri, 16 Mar 2012 07:26:04 -0700 From: Peter McCann To: liu dapeng Thread-Topic: [DMM] draft-mccann-dmm-flatarch-00.txt Thread-Index: Acz7ppM5+XaI77SoQaqa8Y3fzGKc1wH7Zw+AAATjY8A= Date: Fri, 16 Mar 2012 14:26:03 +0000 Message-ID: <5963DDF1F751474D8DEEFDCDBEE43AE716449212@dfweml504-mbx> References: <5963DDF1F751474D8DEEFDCDBEE43AE716447C77@dfweml504-mbx> In-Reply-To: Accept-Language: en-US, zh-CN Content-Language: en-US X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: x-originating-ip: [10.193.125.144] Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable MIME-Version: 1.0 X-CFilter-Loop: Reflected Cc: "dmm@ietf.org" Subject: Re: [DMM] draft-mccann-dmm-flatarch-00.txt X-BeenThere: dmm@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.12 Precedence: list List-Id: Distributed Mobility Management Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 16 Mar 2012 14:28:47 -0000 Hi, Dapeng, liu dapeng wrote: > Hello Peter, >=20 > One additional comment for section3: seems that it is a key exchange > procedure instead of a authentication procedure? It is both an authentication and a key exchange protocol. Either one is useless without the other. -Pete > -Dapeng Liu >=20 > 2012/3/6, Peter McCann : >> Hi, all, >>=20 >> On Friday I submitted a new draft that outlines what I think is a >> novel approach to mobility management in a totally flat network. >> The draft can be found here: >>=20 >> http://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-mccann-dmm-flatarch-00 >>=20 >> Abstract >>=20 >> Today's mobility management schemes make use of a hierarchy of >> tunnels from a relatively fixed anchor point, through one or more >> intermediate nodes, to reach the MN's current point of attachment. >> These schemes suffer from poor performance, scalability, and failure >> modes due to the centralization and statefulness of the anchor >> point(s). The dmm (Distributed Mobility Management) working >> group > is >> currently chartered to investigate alternative solutions that will >> provide greater performance, scalability, and robustness through the >> distribution of mobility anchors. This document is an input to the >> dmm discussion. It outlines a problem statement for the existing >> mobility management techniques and goes on to propose (high-level) >> solutions to two of the most vexing problems: MN authentication and >> mobility management in a fully distributed, flat (non- hierarchical) >> access network. These two aspects are often treated separately >> in > a >> layered architecture, but we argue there are important advantages to >> considering how these two functions can work in tandem to provide a >> simple and robust framework for the design of a wireless Internet >> Service Provider network. >>=20 >> I'd like some time to present this draft during the meeting in >> Paris, hopefully 15 minutes. >>=20 >> -- >> Peter J. McCann >> Huawei Technologies (USA) >> Peter.McCann@Huawei.com >> +1 908 541 3563 >> Rm. C-0105, 400 Crossings Blvd. (2nd floor), Bridgewater, NJ >> 08807-2863 USA >>=20 >>=20 >> _______________________________________________ >> dmm mailing list >> dmm@ietf.org >> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dmm >>=20 >=20 > From Peter.McCann@huawei.com Fri Mar 16 07:41:01 2012 Return-Path: X-Original-To: dmm@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: dmm@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 761DD21F8755 for ; Fri, 16 Mar 2012 07:41:01 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.382 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.382 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.217, BAYES_00=-2.599] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([12.22.58.30]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id hX0zBSx9Xl5m for ; Fri, 16 Mar 2012 07:41:00 -0700 (PDT) Received: from dfwrgout.huawei.com (dfwrgout.huawei.com [206.16.17.72]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5562E21F8736 for ; Fri, 16 Mar 2012 07:41:00 -0700 (PDT) Received: from 172.18.9.243 (EHLO dfweml201-edg.china.huawei.com) ([172.18.9.243]) by dfwrg01-dlp.huawei.com (MOS 4.2.3-GA FastPath) with ESMTP id AEL30112; Fri, 16 Mar 2012 10:41:00 -0400 (EDT) Received: from DFWEML407-HUB.china.huawei.com (10.193.5.132) by dfweml201-edg.china.huawei.com (172.18.9.107) with Microsoft SMTP Server (TLS) id 14.1.323.3; Fri, 16 Mar 2012 07:38:28 -0700 Received: from DFWEML504-MBX.china.huawei.com ([10.124.31.30]) by dfweml407-hub.china.huawei.com ([10.193.5.132]) with mapi id 14.01.0323.003; Fri, 16 Mar 2012 22:38:30 +0800 From: Peter McCann To: "cjbc@it.uc3m.es" Thread-Topic: Review of draft-bernardos-dmm-distributed-anchoring-00 Thread-Index: Acz723tn3ojL6DPBTKCm/gMVBH+bvQAbbC6AABJI2VABnvctgAAcun1Q Date: Fri, 16 Mar 2012 14:38:29 +0000 Message-ID: <5963DDF1F751474D8DEEFDCDBEE43AE716449242@dfweml504-mbx> References: <5963DDF1F751474D8DEEFDCDBEE43AE716447E15@dfweml504-mbx> <1331143249.5000.43.camel@acorde.it.uc3m.es> <5963DDF1F751474D8DEEFDCDBEE43AE716447FFE@dfweml504-mbx> <1331887567.4259.155.camel@acorde.it.uc3m.es> In-Reply-To: <1331887567.4259.155.camel@acorde.it.uc3m.es> Accept-Language: en-US, zh-CN Content-Language: en-US X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: x-originating-ip: [10.193.125.144] Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable MIME-Version: 1.0 X-CFilter-Loop: Reflected Cc: "dmm@ietf.org" Subject: Re: [DMM] Review of draft-bernardos-dmm-distributed-anchoring-00 X-BeenThere: dmm@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.12 Precedence: list List-Id: Distributed Mobility Management Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 16 Mar 2012 14:41:01 -0000 Hi, Carlos, Carlos Jes=FAs Bernardos Cano wrote: > Hi Pete, >=20 > Sorry for the late reply. Please see inline below. >=20 > On Wed, 2012-03-07 at 18:58 +0000, Peter McCann wrote: >> Hi, Carlos, >>=20 >> Just a couple of response points below... >>=20 >> Carlos Jes=FAs Bernardos Cano wrote: >>> Hi Pete, >>>=20 >>> Thanks for the comments. Please see some comments inline below. >>>=20 >>> On Tue, 2012-03-06 at 20:55 +0000, Peter McCann wrote: >>>> Hi, Carlos, Juan-Carlos, >>>>=20 >>>> I have read draft-bernardos-dmm-distributed-anchoring-00, and I=20 >>>> have a few comments. >>>>=20 >>>> First, I want to bring up something that I think is common to=20 >>>> several of the DMM proposals, and that is sub-optimal use of the=20 >>>> backhaul resources. It seems that when you use an AR as an anchor=20 >>>> point, and move to a new AR, the traffic for that session has to=20 >>>> traverse the backhaul 3 times in each direction, like this: >>>>=20 >>>>=20 >>>> ----- >>>> | Rtr | >>>> / ^ -----\ >>>> 1 / / 2 \ 3 >>>> v / v >>>> ---- ----=20 >>>> | AR | | AR |=20 >>>> ---- ---- >>>> Although it may seem at odds with the goal of "distributing"=20 >>>> mobility to use the crossover router as the point of traffic=20 >>>> redirection, it would make for much more optimal use of the=20 >>>> backhaul resources. I believe it is possible to route the traffic=20 >>>> more optimally with a standard off-the-shelf router at the=20 >>>> crossover point (using mechanisms detailed in draft-mccann-dmm- >>> flatarch-00). >>>=20 >>> In our draft we don't make any assumption about the backhaul and=20 >>> access architecture. ARs might be also directly connected (in which=20 >>> case no Rtr would be traversed) if a network deployment allows that. >>> In any case, the traffic redirection is supposed to happen for=20 >>> relatively short periods of time (otherwise the DMM advantages might=20 >>> vanish and it's just better to go for a centralized approach). >>=20 >> I suppose I have a different view of how long one might keep an=20 >> address that has been assigned by a first access router. There might=20 >> be quite a bit of overhead involved with getting an address assigned,=20 >> and you might want to delay getting a new address until, say, every=20 >> 4th AR that you encounter. While I think it might be reasonable in=20 >> some environments for neighboring ARs to have a direct IP hop between=20 >> them, I think it is less likely that the 4th neighbor over will have=20 >> a direct connection. And even direct neighbors I think are likely to=20 >> be connected in a star topology via expensive and slow backhaul links=20 >> to a router one layer up in the aggregation hierarchy. >=20 > I guess this very much depends on the operator's architecture and the=20 > mobility pattern of the MN. Indeed it does, but I do not think we should require the MN to get=20 a new IP address upon every attachment to an AR. Address allocation should be decoupled from mobility management. >>>> Second, I like the idea of moving the prefix assigned to the MN=20 >>>> from one AR to another. However, why do we need to keep the AR's=20 >>>> MAC address the same? IPv6 should handle the failover of a=20 >>>> first-hop router from one instance to another with no problems. You=20 >>>> see the same prefix advertised from a different MAC address; what's=20 >>>> the big deal? You can just keep using the prefix as you did=20 >>>> before, addressing packets to the new access router. >>>>=20 >>>=20 >>> This is basically inherited from PMIPv6 basic operation, in which=20 >>> the MN keeps "seeing" always the same router (i.e. same IPv6=20 >>> link-local address and MAC address) while moving within the PMIPv6=20 >>> domain. This is so to improve performance (there are no stale=20 >>> entries on the neigh cache) and also to avoid triggering any=20 >>> movement detection mechanism on the MN (changing the default router=20 >>> might be treated as such). We basically follow the same approach. >>> Besides, by using a logical interface per anchoring router, it=20 >>> becomes easier to handle the prefix advertisement on the network > side. >>=20 >> At some layer of the stack the MN will know that it changed ARs. I=20 >> don't see any particular reason why we have to hide the movement from=20 >> the MAC layer. Besides, most wide-area cellular technologies will >> use >=20 > The change is not hidden from the MAC layer, but from the IP layer. Ok, I guess the MAC layer sees the link change below it even though the MAC address of the AR is preserved. >> P2P links and won't have MAC addresses visible to the upper layers=20 >> directly. >=20 > Well, in this case the L2 change is "by default" hidden from the IP=20 > stack (if the new MAG shares the IP address from the old one). Right, I guess I am wondering why we can't just see the new router with a new IP address still advertising the old prefix. IPv6 stacks should be able to handle this. >>>> Third, I don't like the idea of having to ship so much state around=20 >>>> the network through the HSS. In your draft you talk about >>>> (out-of-scope) mechanisms to get the prefix and the anchor gateway=20 >>>> address to the new D-GW. There is also the complication of knowing=20 >>>> which prior prefixes the MN wants to keep at its new attachment=20 >>>> point. It seems to me that we should avoid the behavior that a new=20 >>>> prefix is always assigned at each new point of attachment; rather,=20 >>>> we should force the MN to take some sort of affirmative action to=20 >>>> acquire an address/prefix for its use, such as DHCP-PD. This would=20 >>>> be done occasionally, not on every handover, and the MN could=20 >>>> register its intent to keep an address through e.g., dynamic DNS=20 >>>> update. Then the new D- GW could lookup the DNS name of the MN at=20 >>>> the time it attaches, see the list of addresses that are currently=20 >>>> assigned, and take steps to attract the packets for those prefixes.=20 >>>> This could be a tunnel or it could be a BGP UPDATE as outlined in=20 >>>> draft-mccann-dmm-flatarch-00. >>>=20 >>> I haven't had time to check your draft yet. Apologies for that, I'll=20 >>> do it shortly. >>=20 >> Great, would be glad to have your comments. >>=20 >>> In any case, our draft does not specify how the info about the=20 >>> active prefixes is obtained, and from where the require state is=20 >>> retrieved. A centralized entity (such as the HSS, or a centralized >>> LMA) is just an example. Our draft also includes some PMIPv6=20 >>> protocol extensions to obtain that info from the previous router=20 >>> visited by the MN (we call that D-GW), if the current router knows=20 >>> it. So basically the defined mechanisms are not incompatible, IMHO,=20 >>> with the ones you mentioned above. >>=20 >> Sure. I guess it is necessary to get the old prefix that was=20 >> assigned somehow; it just seems that the additional effort to map=20 >> this to an anchoring D-GW might be too much. >=20 > Not sure I follow what you said here... You need to find the anchoring D-GW in order to establish a tunnel to it and find out its MAC address. Assuming you found the assigned prefix, it is an extra step to map this to an anchor D-GW. Certain other proposals don't need to actually find the D-GW (for example,=20 they can just send a BGP UPDATE to a route reflector). >>>> Finally, I don't quite understand the "Local Prefixes" concept=20 >>>> presented in the draft. I understand how LIPA is supposed to work,=20 >>>> but I don't understand why you need to treat such prefixes=20 >>>> differently from any other prefix on the D-GW1 link. You are=20 >>>> tunneling all the traffic back to the D-GW1 AR, correct? >>>> Wouldn't the traffic just naturally follow the proper path through=20 >>>> to the >>>> D-GW1 and from there to the local CN? >>>=20 >>> We are considering here prefixes that because of security or other=20 >>> reasons are not normally reachable from the Internet, but only from=20 >>> nodes directly attached to D-GW1 (e.g., in an enterprise network). >>> For that case, it might be useful to keep being able to reach those=20 >>> while being attached to a different D-GW. This is the LIPA use case=20 >>> considered by 3GPP. >>=20 >> I understand the motivation, but wouldn't this use case be solved=20 >> because of the fact you have a tunnel from the old D-GW to the new=20 >> D-GW? Why does the new D-GW need to know that a particular prefix=20 >> was local to the previous D-GW? Aren't you proposing to always use=20 >> reverse tunneling back to the old D-GW for those packets that use the >> old logical interface? >=20 > The tunnel is only used while you have ongoing sessions active. But=20 > you might want to still being able to start new sessions to that local=20 > prefix via the D-GW connected to it (because it is the only way to get=20 > connectivity to it). Sure, but wouldn't you always do this for sessions that use the old prefix (whether they were established before or after the handover)? Regardless of whether the prefix was "Local" or not? >>>> Personally, I think it might be better to use client-based Mobile=20 >>>> IP for any scenario where the current AR cannot attract the packets=20 >>>> for a given prefix, such as when the MN moves out of the domain of=20 >>>> one operator. That situation is very similar to the LIPA case and=20 >>>> could be solved with a single mechanism. >>>=20 >>> Client-based DMM is a topic that deserves additional attention. In=20 >>> our draft we have started to look at a network-based solution, but=20 >>> we can discuss the implications of a client-based solution as well. >>=20 >> I think the network based solution is a good match for the frequent,=20 >> localized mobility within a given autonomous system. However, once=20 >> you cross a boundary outside of which the network can't re-route your=20 >> traffic, client MIP seems to be required. >=20 > For that case, seems to me that both PMIP and CMIP-based solutions=20 > could be appropriate, but it depends on the specific assumptions. I=20 > guess we would need to look further into the details. Ok. -Pete >=20 > Thanks, >=20 > Carlos >=20 >>=20 >>>> Looking forward to continued discussion, >>>=20 >>> So do we. Thanks for the good comments. >>>=20 >>> Carlos >>=20 >> -Pete >>=20 > From sarikaya2012@gmail.com Fri Mar 16 09:06:16 2012 Return-Path: X-Original-To: dmm@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: dmm@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 099A421F877F for ; Fri, 16 Mar 2012 09:06:16 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -3.599 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-3.599 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-2.599, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW=-1] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([12.22.58.30]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id ms0vsq2F2mN0 for ; Fri, 16 Mar 2012 09:06:15 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail-ee0-f44.google.com (mail-ee0-f44.google.com [74.125.83.44]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0F02121F85AC for ; Fri, 16 Mar 2012 09:06:14 -0700 (PDT) Received: by eeke51 with SMTP id e51so2417635eek.31 for ; Fri, 16 Mar 2012 09:06:14 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20120113; h=mime-version:reply-to:in-reply-to:references:date:message-id :subject:from:to:cc:content-type:content-transfer-encoding; bh=ZL0ERNa5ccktYNbJis4aCRzpvzNrktYp51SCUQv6gUw=; b=O1I4nUjaSD7eVCWsuO7g3QbA7ihgNWYULr/1bnkxJwYgB2LonRaJ0z+LRZ0/NuWrlP bbPjOhFRiGjQhDRQHs2i/8sDJhbZhBNv6d1xf5bCTswmHn/2i4JZQrFZUpSSlpSMFJq8 7rKm0kwdIYvKDkiO6HgnCYeXvQDkXgn1b5zapj7AleHNxVEdScFXDe8RMSH1cmn+L7sB LYUjnayZgTzVX7VkXqB8+P5UKJ2WiN0tUMvzlDl0WFYVeMz122ztWz8qT1f9xoCH6AwY vBr/iFDry0d9TlHxpJWZqGF87J4fr6IOO06GE9zX8BU07oW0U2WG0ClWAQ1WFSq19vRX zs0Q== MIME-Version: 1.0 Received: by 10.50.203.99 with SMTP id kp3mr13258108igc.16.1331913973468; Fri, 16 Mar 2012 09:06:13 -0700 (PDT) Received: by 10.231.179.71 with HTTP; Fri, 16 Mar 2012 09:06:13 -0700 (PDT) In-Reply-To: <1331887784.4259.158.camel@acorde.it.uc3m.es> References: <1331887784.4259.158.camel@acorde.it.uc3m.es> Date: Fri, 16 Mar 2012 11:06:13 -0500 Message-ID: From: Behcet Sarikaya To: cjbc@it.uc3m.es Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Cc: "dmm@ietf.org" Subject: Re: [DMM] review of draft-bernardos-dmm-distributed-anchoring-00 X-BeenThere: dmm@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.12 Precedence: list Reply-To: sarikaya@ieee.org List-Id: Distributed Mobility Management Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 16 Mar 2012 16:06:16 -0000 Hi Carlos, You say in various places in your draft that your protocol is PMIPv6-based. I wonder how it could be? Please see below. On Fri, Mar 16, 2012 at 3:49 AM, Carlos Jes=FAs Bernardos Cano wrote: > Hi Luowen, > > First of all, apologies for my late reply. > > Please, see inline below. > > On Tue, 2012-03-13 at 14:43 +0800, luo.wen@zte.com.cn wrote: >> >> Hi Carlos >> >> I have reviewed your draft, and I have two questions to your draft as >> following: > > Thanks for reading it. >> >> First, let's consider this scenario. Initially, MN is attached to >> D-GW1 and has a session#1 (anchored at D-GW1). When moving to D-GW2, >> MN starts another session#2 (session#1 keeps on going). As per your >> draft, D-GW2 should simulate mndgw1 and mndgw2 and establish a tunnel >> with D-GW1 for this MN. MN continues to move to D-GW3. Then D-GW3 >> should simulate mndgw1, mndgw2 and mndgw3 and maintains two forwarding >> tunnels between itself and D-GW1, D-GW2 for the MN. And MN could >> continue to move again and again..... >> PMIP requires only one MAG and only one PMIP tunnel for one MN. But it >> seems that, your draft requires, for one MN, multiple MAGs (i.e. those >> mndgw1, mndgw2 and mndgw3) and multiple tunnels for one MN. If MN > > The solution requires multiple logical interfaces to be created on the > D-GW, but the tunnels between them could be re-used. > >> =A0keeps on moving, the situation will become worse. I mean, maybe >> dozens of MAGs and tunnels are needed for this MN. In this case, >> performance of your D-GW will be a big issue. Of course, you can > > Creation and maintenance of logical interfaces is a very low resource > consuming task. If per-MN-per-anchor tunnel creation is a problem, they > can be shared among several MNs. > > Besides, in realistic deployments, the chances that an MN has active > anchored prefixes in more than 2-3 D-GWs will be very low. Most likely, > address continuity will be only provided for one prefix anchored at a > different D-GW. > RFC 5213 in Section 7.1 says: Once the address configuration is complete, the mobile node can continue to use this address configuration as long as it is attached to the network that is in the scope of that Proxy Mobile IPv6 domain. I wonder if MN moved out of PMIPv6 domain in your case? >> =A0limited the HNPes one MN can maintain (e.g. 3 HNPes per MN, then only >> 3 D-GWs could be involved at most), but to me, it is very hard to >> determine the threshold to satisfy every single MN. =A0Otherwise, >> network should have a mechanism for terminating IP addresses to >> release some D-GWs. But how to determine an IP address (HNP) is not >> used by a MN is also a challenge. > > There are several mechanisms that can be used to determine that an IP > address is no longer active. Some of them involve active participation > from the MN itself (which is the entity that actually knows it). >> >> Second, in figure 2 of your draft, D-GW2 simulates two logic GWs (i.e. >> mn1dgw1 and mn1dgw2), and MN is attached to both two logic GWs. Does >> this indicate MN should maintain tow separated logic link with mn1dgw1 >> and mn1dgw2 respectively? If it does, then how can you ensure that MN >> will establish an additional logic link with mn1dgw2 when MN moves >> from D-GW1 to D-GW2? > > No, no logical links are required. From the point of view of the MN, it > is just as it is attached to a link where two routers are also attached. > When MN move to D-GW3, it is as a new router got attached to the link > (no configuration step required by the MN). > Regards, Behcet From cjbc@it.uc3m.es Sun Mar 18 12:59:07 2012 Return-Path: X-Original-To: dmm@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: dmm@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id BA9FA21F84B2 for ; Sun, 18 Mar 2012 12:59:07 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -5.699 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-5.699 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=-0.000, BAYES_00=-2.599, J_CHICKENPOX_21=0.6, MIME_8BIT_HEADER=0.3, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-4] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([12.22.58.30]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id xID0UIBMjN87 for ; Sun, 18 Mar 2012 12:59:06 -0700 (PDT) Received: from smtp03.uc3m.es (smtp03.uc3m.es [163.117.176.133]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id D546C21F84A6 for ; Sun, 18 Mar 2012 12:59:05 -0700 (PDT) X-uc3m-safe: yes Received: from [192.168.1.3] (82.158.121.177.dyn.user.ono.com [82.158.121.177]) (using TLSv1 with cipher AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by smtp03.uc3m.es (Postfix) with ESMTP id 83EA1872A3D; Sun, 18 Mar 2012 20:59:03 +0100 (CET) Message-ID: <1332100728.27721.0.camel@acorde.it.uc3m.es> From: Carlos =?ISO-8859-1?Q?Jes=FAs?= Bernardos Cano To: Marco Liebsch Date: Sun, 18 Mar 2012 20:58:48 +0100 In-Reply-To: <69756203DDDDE64E987BC4F70B71A26D24D83744@Polydeuces.office.hd> References: <1330969192.3680.35.camel@acorde.it.uc3m.es> <69756203DDDDE64E987BC4F70B71A26D24D723F8@DAPHNIS.office.hd> <1331887843.4259.160.camel@acorde.it.uc3m.es> <69756203DDDDE64E987BC4F70B71A26D24D83744@Polydeuces.office.hd> Organization: Universidad Carlos III de Madrid Content-Type: multipart/signed; micalg="pgp-sha1"; protocol="application/pgp-signature"; boundary="=-DeCuVtyaIBgLVEQ/ZK1H" X-Mailer: Evolution 3.2.2-1 Mime-Version: 1.0 X-TM-AS-Product-Ver: IMSS-7.0.0.3116-6.8.0.1017-18782.000 Cc: "dmm@ietf.org" Subject: Re: [DMM] New DMM draft: draft-bernardos-dmm-distributed-anchoring-00.txt X-BeenThere: dmm@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.12 Precedence: list Reply-To: cjbc@it.uc3m.es List-Id: Distributed Mobility Management Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sun, 18 Mar 2012 19:59:07 -0000 --=-DeCuVtyaIBgLVEQ/ZK1H Content-Type: text/plain; charset="ISO-8859-15" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Hi Marco, Thanks for your comment. Please see inline below. On Fri, 2012-03-16 at 10:00 +0000, Marco Liebsch wrote: > Carlos, > thanks for your feedback. Please see inline. >=20 > > -----Original Message----- > > From: Carlos Jes=FAs Bernardos Cano [mailto:cjbc@it.uc3m.es] > > Sent: Freitag, 16. M=E4rz 2012 09:51 > > To: Marco Liebsch > > Cc: dmm@ietf.org > > Subject: RE: [DMM] New DMM draft: draft-bernardos-dmm-distributed- > > anchoring-00.txt > >=20 > > Hi Marco, > >=20 > > Apologies for the late reply. Thanks for reading the draft. Please see = some > > answers to your questions/comments inline below. > >=20 > > On Fri, 2012-03-09 at 11:51 +0000, Marco Liebsch wrote: > > > Hi Carlos, > > > > > > I have a few clarifying questions to your new draft. The draft > > > proposes the distributed logical interface. I don't really get the > > > advantage of virtualizing the previous LMA on the MN's current LMA if > > > packets are routed through the previous LMA anyway. Why not using the > > > current LMA to serve simply as MAG for forwarded traffic (which > > > remains anchored at previous LMA) and using the new LMA to anchor the > > new address/prefix? > >=20 > > What you just mention is exactly what the draft does. Additionally, the= logical > > interface simplifies the interface between the MN and the access router= that > > behaves as LMA/MAG. It does so because by interacting with the MN as > > different "logical" routers (one per anchoring LMA), you can make full = use of > > the ND based features (e.g., RFC4191) in a very easy way. > >=20 > > > > > > The draft writes that the idea hides the change of the anchor from th= e > > > mobile node. The DGW2IF on the new LMA does not pretend to be LMA1, > > or? > > > I don't see how the anchor change is kept transparent to the MN. > >=20 > > The point is that from the point of view of the MN, it always "sees" as= directly > > connected (1-hop away) each of the anchor LMAs. Every time the MN moves > > and attaches to a new access router, the only thing it notices is that = a new > > ("logical") router appears on the link, advertising a new prefix (and, = in most > > use cases, the others start advertising the prefixes with lifetime=3D0 = to > > deprecate them). >=20 > The LMA function should be transparent to the MN anyway, so it does not > matter whether the LMA, which serves as anchor, is on the previous AR or = on > the current one. Invalidating the previous HNP and validating the new HNP > can be done independently of whether the responsible LMA instance is co-l= ocated > with the local AR or the previous AR. But I must admit that I probably ha= ve to > check that part of your draft again. If it just invalidating the prefix, this can be done, true. But the point is that the DLIF concept enables to do more that just invalidating a prefix. Besides, it makes easier to implement this prefix deprecation. >=20 >=20 > >=20 > > > > > > I somehow agree also to Pete's opinion that solving the packet routin= g > > > after anchor relocation above the anchors is a good option. It simply > > > allows more optimal routes. > >=20 > > I have to read his draft, but unless you have control on the routing > > infrastructure (and this is not always possible, and it takes time to c= onverge), > > I don't see many other options to ensure address continuity. >=20 > I don't expect this to take long time, as the routing states are not to b= e enforced > in all routers, at least not in our proposal. Intention is to keep the r= outing plane as it is > and update states only is one dedicated router per data session, which tr= anslates the > MN's IP address into a routable one to ensure that remaining routers in t= he network > forward the downlink packet to the MN's current anchor point. The previou= s anchor > point is released from any forwarding tasks. Further advantage is that ro= utes are > potentially more optimal compared to forwarding from a previous anchor. > Which does not mean that both approaches cannot co-exist. A DMM solution > could rely on forwarding while the state in the routing plane is establis= hed. I have to admit I haven't checked your proposal yet. What you mention seems like a NAT-based approach, is it true? and if there is a dedicated router, isn't it a centralized entity? if the point is that that entity is closer to the MN (not deep in the operator's core), then I see that as a kind-of hierarchical-alike solution. >=20 >=20 > >=20 > > > > > > Now I am deviating a bit, but into the direction of an important ques= tion: > > > That's directly related to the question of how persistent we need to > > > be about IP address continuity. Now, some proposals consider > > > termination of an IP address prefix, which is anchored at a previousl= y > > > used anchor point, as soon as the IP session, which uses that address= , > > > terminates. New sessions can use the address being anchored at the ne= w > > > mobility anchor. My opinion is that we need to find a good choice > > > about the lifetime of such an anchored IP address, as it may also be > > > registered with other services, e.g. IMS, messaging, etc, and would r= equire > > an updated registration after a change in the registered address. > > > And even if such lifetime is short, we may not accept suboptimal > > > routing paths via the previous anchor after anchor relocation. > >=20 > > Session lifetime and prefix anchoring termination is a tricky and impor= tant > > issue. As I see it, DMM is compatible with a "classical" > > centralized approach (at least for the solutions that are basically ext= ending > > currently standardized IP mobility protocols to operate in a more > > "distributed" way). For those applications that are known in advance to > > require very long address lifetime (compared to the anchoring mobility = rate), > > I'd say that those sessions it might make sense to keep them centrally > > anchored (or to enable applications to be able to survive to an IP addr= ess > > change). >=20 > So you think that the UE should receive multiple IP addresses and treat t= hem > differently according to the associated topological anchor point? Hmm, ye= s, possible. > What about real time streaming and other IP data sessions, which could ha= ve a > longer lifetime, they should be anchored than at a central point as well,= right? > If the MN had such intelligence and information, it could treat the HNPs = differently, true. I think thank kind of approaches make sense. Carlos >=20 > marco >=20 >=20 > >=20 > > Thanks, > >=20 > > Carlos > >=20 > > > > > > What do you think? > > > > > > Thanks, > > > marco > > > > > > > > > > > > > -----Original Message----- > > > > From: dmm-bounces@ietf.org [mailto:dmm-bounces@ietf.org] On > > Behalf > > > > Of Carlos Jes=FAs Bernardos Cano > > > > Sent: Montag, 5. M=E4rz 2012 18:40 > > > > To: dmm@ietf.org > > > > Subject: [DMM] New DMM draft: draft-bernardos-dmm-distributed- > > > > anchoring-00.txt > > > > > > > > Dear all, > > > > > > > > We've just submitted a new I-D on the DMM space. The draft describe= s > > > > a network-based DMM approach extending PMIPv6, and focusing on the > > > > required extensions to effectively support simultaneously anchoring > > > > several flows at different distributed anchors. > > > > > > > > As usual, comments would be warmly welcomed! > > > > > > > > More info below: > > > > > > > > Title : PMIPv6-based distributed anchoring > > > > Author(s) : Carlos J. Bernardos > > > > Juan Carlos Zuniga > > > > Filename : > > > > draft-bernardos-dmm-distributed-anchoring-00.txt > > > > Pages : 23 > > > > Date : 2012-03-05 > > > > > > > > Distributed Mobility Management solutions allow for setting up > > > > networks so that traffic is distributed in an optimal way and do= es > > > > not rely on centralized deployed anchors to provide IP mobility > > > > support. > > > > > > > > There are many different approaches to address Distributed Mobil= ity > > > > Management, as for example extending network-based mobility > > protocols > > > > (like Proxy Mobile IPv6), or client-based mobility protocols (as > > > > Mobile IPv6), among others. This document follows the former > > > > approach, and proposes a solution based on Proxy Mobile IPv6 in = which > > > > mobility sessions are anchored at the last IP hop router (called > > > > distributed gateway). The distributed gateway is an enhanced ac= cess > > > > router which is also able to operate as local mobility anchor or > > > > mobility access gateway, on a per prefix basis. The draft focus= es on > > > > the required extensions to effectively support simultaneously > > > > anchoring several flows at different distributed gateways. > > > > > > > > This draft introduces the concept of distributed logical interfa= ce > > > > (at the distributed gateway), which is a software construct that > > > > allows to easily hide the change of anchor from the mobile node. > > > > Additionally, the draft describes how to provide session continu= ity > > > > in inter-domain scenarios in which dynamic tunneling or signalin= g > > > > between distributed gateways from different operators is not all= owed. > > > > > > > > > > > > A URL for this Internet-Draft is: > > > > http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-bernardos-dmm-distributed= - > > > > anchoring-00.txt > > > > > > > > Thanks, > > > > > > > > Carlos > > > > > > > > -- > > > > Carlos Jes=FAs Bernardos Cano http://www.netcom.it.uc3m.es/ GPG FP= : > > > > D29B 0A6A 639A A561 93CA 4D55 35DC BA4D D170 4F67 > >=20 > > -- > > Carlos Jes=FAs Bernardos Cano http://www.netcom.it.uc3m.es/ GPG FP: D2= 9B > > 0A6A 639A A561 93CA 4D55 35DC BA4D D170 4F67 >=20 --=20 Carlos Jes=FAs Bernardos Cano http://www.netcom.it.uc3m.es/ GPG FP: D29B 0A6A 639A A561 93CA 4D55 35DC BA4D D170 4F67 --=-DeCuVtyaIBgLVEQ/ZK1H Content-Type: application/pgp-signature; name="signature.asc" Content-Description: This is a digitally signed message part Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.4.11 (GNU/Linux) iEYEABECAAYFAk9mPnkACgkQNdy6TdFwT2fVtgCg4/wbO5roGmXjaDyMNhXMy+Ij IbYAn3SU7+pHpthiyorQbNvBO+qpcten =uv4j -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --=-DeCuVtyaIBgLVEQ/ZK1H-- From cjbc@it.uc3m.es Sun Mar 18 12:59:12 2012 Return-Path: X-Original-To: dmm@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: dmm@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9DD3C21F84F1 for ; Sun, 18 Mar 2012 12:59:12 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -5.699 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-5.699 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-2.599, J_CHICKENPOX_21=0.6, MIME_8BIT_HEADER=0.3, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-4] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([12.22.58.30]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id q95Egz8EUMio for ; Sun, 18 Mar 2012 12:59:11 -0700 (PDT) Received: from smtp01.uc3m.es (smtp01.uc3m.es [163.117.176.131]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8D35221F84E4 for ; Sun, 18 Mar 2012 12:59:11 -0700 (PDT) X-uc3m-safe: yes Received: from [192.168.1.3] (82.158.121.177.dyn.user.ono.com [82.158.121.177]) (using TLSv1 with cipher AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by smtp01.uc3m.es (Postfix) with ESMTP id BF6FEC08A25; Sun, 18 Mar 2012 20:59:09 +0100 (CET) Message-ID: <1332100749.27721.1.camel@acorde.it.uc3m.es> From: Carlos =?ISO-8859-1?Q?Jes=FAs?= Bernardos Cano To: sarikaya@ieee.org Date: Sun, 18 Mar 2012 20:59:09 +0100 In-Reply-To: References: <1331887784.4259.158.camel@acorde.it.uc3m.es> Organization: Universidad Carlos III de Madrid Content-Type: multipart/signed; micalg="pgp-sha1"; protocol="application/pgp-signature"; boundary="=-yp5DlcxDQlE+RVRQUk6y" X-Mailer: Evolution 3.2.2-1 Mime-Version: 1.0 X-TM-AS-Product-Ver: IMSS-7.0.0.3116-6.8.0.1017-18782.000 Cc: "dmm@ietf.org" Subject: Re: [DMM] review of draft-bernardos-dmm-distributed-anchoring-00 X-BeenThere: dmm@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.12 Precedence: list Reply-To: cjbc@it.uc3m.es List-Id: Distributed Mobility Management Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sun, 18 Mar 2012 19:59:12 -0000 --=-yp5DlcxDQlE+RVRQUk6y Content-Type: text/plain; charset="ISO-8859-15" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Hi Behcet, On Fri, 2012-03-16 at 11:06 -0500, Behcet Sarikaya wrote: > Hi Carlos, >=20 > You say in various places in your draft that your protocol is PMIPv6-base= d. > I wonder how it could be? More accurately, we could say that the solution is network-based. PMIPv6 is just one network-based protocol and the solution is specified in the draft for PMIPv6. Not sure what your doubt comes from... >=20 > Please see below. Please see my comment inline below. >=20 > On Fri, Mar 16, 2012 at 3:49 AM, Carlos Jes=FAs Bernardos Cano > wrote: > > Hi Luowen, > > > > First of all, apologies for my late reply. > > > > Please, see inline below. > > > > On Tue, 2012-03-13 at 14:43 +0800, luo.wen@zte.com.cn wrote: > >> > >> Hi Carlos > >> > >> I have reviewed your draft, and I have two questions to your draft as > >> following: > > > > Thanks for reading it. > >> > >> First, let's consider this scenario. Initially, MN is attached to > >> D-GW1 and has a session#1 (anchored at D-GW1). When moving to D-GW2, > >> MN starts another session#2 (session#1 keeps on going). As per your > >> draft, D-GW2 should simulate mndgw1 and mndgw2 and establish a tunnel > >> with D-GW1 for this MN. MN continues to move to D-GW3. Then D-GW3 > >> should simulate mndgw1, mndgw2 and mndgw3 and maintains two forwarding > >> tunnels between itself and D-GW1, D-GW2 for the MN. And MN could > >> continue to move again and again..... > >> PMIP requires only one MAG and only one PMIP tunnel for one MN. But it > >> seems that, your draft requires, for one MN, multiple MAGs (i.e. those > >> mndgw1, mndgw2 and mndgw3) and multiple tunnels for one MN. If MN > > > > The solution requires multiple logical interfaces to be created on the > > D-GW, but the tunnels between them could be re-used. > > > >> keeps on moving, the situation will become worse. I mean, maybe > >> dozens of MAGs and tunnels are needed for this MN. In this case, > >> performance of your D-GW will be a big issue. Of course, you can > > > > Creation and maintenance of logical interfaces is a very low resource > > consuming task. If per-MN-per-anchor tunnel creation is a problem, they > > can be shared among several MNs. > > > > Besides, in realistic deployments, the chances that an MN has active > > anchored prefixes in more than 2-3 D-GWs will be very low. Most likely, > > address continuity will be only provided for one prefix anchored at a > > different D-GW. > > >=20 > RFC 5213 in Section 7.1 says: > Once the address configuration is complete, the mobile node can > continue to use this address configuration as long as it is attached > to the network that is in the scope of that Proxy Mobile IPv6 domain. >=20 > I wonder if MN moved out of PMIPv6 domain in your case? No, it has not. One of the common assumptions for DMM is that the MN does not need address continuity for the whole duration the MN is attached to the domain. The idea is to enforce new communications to make use of the address anchored closer to where the MN is attached to, and to deprecate addresses anchored elsewhere (so they are not needed once active communications using them are done). Thanks, Carlos >=20 > >> limited the HNPes one MN can maintain (e.g. 3 HNPes per MN, then only > >> 3 D-GWs could be involved at most), but to me, it is very hard to > >> determine the threshold to satisfy every single MN. Otherwise, > >> network should have a mechanism for terminating IP addresses to > >> release some D-GWs. But how to determine an IP address (HNP) is not > >> used by a MN is also a challenge. > > > > There are several mechanisms that can be used to determine that an IP > > address is no longer active. Some of them involve active participation > > from the MN itself (which is the entity that actually knows it). > >> > >> Second, in figure 2 of your draft, D-GW2 simulates two logic GWs (i.e. > >> mn1dgw1 and mn1dgw2), and MN is attached to both two logic GWs. Does > >> this indicate MN should maintain tow separated logic link with mn1dgw1 > >> and mn1dgw2 respectively? If it does, then how can you ensure that MN > >> will establish an additional logic link with mn1dgw2 when MN moves > >> from D-GW1 to D-GW2? > > > > No, no logical links are required. From the point of view of the MN, it > > is just as it is attached to a link where two routers are also attached= . > > When MN move to D-GW3, it is as a new router got attached to the link > > (no configuration step required by the MN). > > >=20 > Regards, >=20 > Behcet --=20 Carlos Jes=FAs Bernardos Cano http://www.netcom.it.uc3m.es/ GPG FP: D29B 0A6A 639A A561 93CA 4D55 35DC BA4D D170 4F67 --=-yp5DlcxDQlE+RVRQUk6y Content-Type: application/pgp-signature; name="signature.asc" Content-Description: This is a digitally signed message part Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.4.11 (GNU/Linux) iEYEABECAAYFAk9mPo0ACgkQNdy6TdFwT2elyQCgloooICqagMKE9fQANw204oCi ySoAnAwa7bQ8Uqw52qzKytEz+iGZf5CN =NCk+ -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --=-yp5DlcxDQlE+RVRQUk6y-- From cjbc@it.uc3m.es Sun Mar 18 12:59:25 2012 Return-Path: X-Original-To: dmm@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: dmm@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id BC64921F856A for ; Sun, 18 Mar 2012 12:59:25 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -5.699 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-5.699 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-2.599, J_CHICKENPOX_21=0.6, MIME_8BIT_HEADER=0.3, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-4] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([12.22.58.30]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id J6MMpYLuPVhL for ; Sun, 18 Mar 2012 12:59:24 -0700 (PDT) Received: from smtp02.uc3m.es (smtp02.uc3m.es [163.117.176.132]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0E2B721F852B for ; Sun, 18 Mar 2012 12:59:24 -0700 (PDT) X-uc3m-safe: yes Received: from [192.168.1.3] (82.158.121.177.dyn.user.ono.com [82.158.121.177]) (using TLSv1 with cipher AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by smtp02.uc3m.es (Postfix) with ESMTP id C4EA076146A; Sun, 18 Mar 2012 20:59:21 +0100 (CET) Message-ID: <1332100761.27721.2.camel@acorde.it.uc3m.es> From: Carlos =?ISO-8859-1?Q?Jes=FAs?= Bernardos Cano To: Peter McCann Date: Sun, 18 Mar 2012 20:59:21 +0100 In-Reply-To: <5963DDF1F751474D8DEEFDCDBEE43AE716449242@dfweml504-mbx> References: <5963DDF1F751474D8DEEFDCDBEE43AE716447E15@dfweml504-mbx> <1331143249.5000.43.camel@acorde.it.uc3m.es> <5963DDF1F751474D8DEEFDCDBEE43AE716447FFE@dfweml504-mbx> <1331887567.4259.155.camel@acorde.it.uc3m.es> <5963DDF1F751474D8DEEFDCDBEE43AE716449242@dfweml504-mbx> Organization: Universidad Carlos III de Madrid Content-Type: multipart/signed; micalg="pgp-sha1"; protocol="application/pgp-signature"; boundary="=-XLB6485gtaAyAwCj+fDi" X-Mailer: Evolution 3.2.2-1 Mime-Version: 1.0 X-TM-AS-Product-Ver: IMSS-7.0.0.3116-6.8.0.1017-18782.000 Cc: "dmm@ietf.org" Subject: Re: [DMM] Review of draft-bernardos-dmm-distributed-anchoring-00 X-BeenThere: dmm@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.12 Precedence: list Reply-To: cjbc@it.uc3m.es List-Id: Distributed Mobility Management Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sun, 18 Mar 2012 19:59:25 -0000 --=-XLB6485gtaAyAwCj+fDi Content-Type: text/plain; charset="ISO-8859-15" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Hi Pete, Comments inline below... On Fri, 2012-03-16 at 14:38 +0000, Peter McCann wrote: > Hi, Carlos, >=20 > Carlos Jes=FAs Bernardos Cano wrote: > > Hi Pete, > >=20 > > Sorry for the late reply. Please see inline below. > >=20 > > On Wed, 2012-03-07 at 18:58 +0000, Peter McCann wrote: > >> Hi, Carlos, > >>=20 > >> Just a couple of response points below... > >>=20 > >> Carlos Jes=FAs Bernardos Cano wrote: > >>> Hi Pete, > >>>=20 > >>> Thanks for the comments. Please see some comments inline below. > >>>=20 > >>> On Tue, 2012-03-06 at 20:55 +0000, Peter McCann wrote: > >>>> Hi, Carlos, Juan-Carlos, > >>>>=20 > >>>> I have read draft-bernardos-dmm-distributed-anchoring-00, and I=20 > >>>> have a few comments. > >>>>=20 > >>>> First, I want to bring up something that I think is common to=20 > >>>> several of the DMM proposals, and that is sub-optimal use of the=20 > >>>> backhaul resources. It seems that when you use an AR as an anchor= =20 > >>>> point, and move to a new AR, the traffic for that session has to=20 > >>>> traverse the backhaul 3 times in each direction, like this: > >>>>=20 > >>>>=20 > >>>> ----- > >>>> | Rtr | > >>>> / ^ -----\ > >>>> 1 / / 2 \ 3 > >>>> v / v > >>>> ---- ----=20 > >>>> | AR | | AR |=20 > >>>> ---- ---- > >>>> Although it may seem at odds with the goal of "distributing"=20 > >>>> mobility to use the crossover router as the point of traffic=20 > >>>> redirection, it would make for much more optimal use of the=20 > >>>> backhaul resources. I believe it is possible to route the traffic= =20 > >>>> more optimally with a standard off-the-shelf router at the=20 > >>>> crossover point (using mechanisms detailed in draft-mccann-dmm- > >>> flatarch-00). > >>>=20 > >>> In our draft we don't make any assumption about the backhaul and=20 > >>> access architecture. ARs might be also directly connected (in which= =20 > >>> case no Rtr would be traversed) if a network deployment allows that. > >>> In any case, the traffic redirection is supposed to happen for=20 > >>> relatively short periods of time (otherwise the DMM advantages might= =20 > >>> vanish and it's just better to go for a centralized approach). > >>=20 > >> I suppose I have a different view of how long one might keep an=20 > >> address that has been assigned by a first access router. There might= =20 > >> be quite a bit of overhead involved with getting an address assigned,= =20 > >> and you might want to delay getting a new address until, say, every= =20 > >> 4th AR that you encounter. While I think it might be reasonable in= =20 > >> some environments for neighboring ARs to have a direct IP hop between= =20 > >> them, I think it is less likely that the 4th neighbor over will have= =20 > >> a direct connection. And even direct neighbors I think are likely to= =20 > >> be connected in a star topology via expensive and slow backhaul links= =20 > >> to a router one layer up in the aggregation hierarchy. > >=20 > > I guess this very much depends on the operator's architecture and the= =20 > > mobility pattern of the MN. >=20 > Indeed it does, but I do not think we should require the MN to get=20 > a new IP address upon every attachment to an AR. Address allocation > should be decoupled from mobility management. Well, we are talking about IP mobility management, that comes exactly because the MN changes its attachment point at L3. This usually implies a change of IP address, unless you instruct the L3 routing infrastructure to follow the MN location (e.g., PMIPv6 is one way of doing that, but having the entity anchoring the address -- the LMA -- keep a tunnel with the entity the MN is attached to; routing would be another way). >=20 > >>>> Second, I like the idea of moving the prefix assigned to the MN=20 > >>>> from one AR to another. However, why do we need to keep the AR's= =20 > >>>> MAC address the same? IPv6 should handle the failover of a=20 > >>>> first-hop router from one instance to another with no problems. You= =20 > >>>> see the same prefix advertised from a different MAC address; what's= =20 > >>>> the big deal? You can just keep using the prefix as you did=20 > >>>> before, addressing packets to the new access router. > >>>>=20 > >>>=20 > >>> This is basically inherited from PMIPv6 basic operation, in which=20 > >>> the MN keeps "seeing" always the same router (i.e. same IPv6=20 > >>> link-local address and MAC address) while moving within the PMIPv6= =20 > >>> domain. This is so to improve performance (there are no stale=20 > >>> entries on the neigh cache) and also to avoid triggering any=20 > >>> movement detection mechanism on the MN (changing the default router= =20 > >>> might be treated as such). We basically follow the same approach. > >>> Besides, by using a logical interface per anchoring router, it=20 > >>> becomes easier to handle the prefix advertisement on the network > > side. > >>=20 > >> At some layer of the stack the MN will know that it changed ARs. I= =20 > >> don't see any particular reason why we have to hide the movement from= =20 > >> the MAC layer. Besides, most wide-area cellular technologies will > >> use > >=20 > > The change is not hidden from the MAC layer, but from the IP layer. >=20 > Ok, I guess the MAC layer sees the link change below it even though > the MAC address of the AR is preserved. >=20 > >> P2P links and won't have MAC addresses visible to the upper layers=20 > >> directly. > >=20 > > Well, in this case the L2 change is "by default" hidden from the IP=20 > > stack (if the new MAG shares the IP address from the old one). >=20 > Right, I guess I am wondering why we can't just see the new router > with a new IP address still advertising the old prefix. IPv6 stacks > should be able to handle this. This is usually understood as L3 mobility by IPv6 stacks (it will trigger movement detection if the MN is MIPv6-enabled). One of the goals of PMIPv6 is to hide that. >=20 > >>>> Third, I don't like the idea of having to ship so much state around= =20 > >>>> the network through the HSS. In your draft you talk about > >>>> (out-of-scope) mechanisms to get the prefix and the anchor gateway= =20 > >>>> address to the new D-GW. There is also the complication of knowing= =20 > >>>> which prior prefixes the MN wants to keep at its new attachment=20 > >>>> point. It seems to me that we should avoid the behavior that a new= =20 > >>>> prefix is always assigned at each new point of attachment; rather,= =20 > >>>> we should force the MN to take some sort of affirmative action to= =20 > >>>> acquire an address/prefix for its use, such as DHCP-PD. This would= =20 > >>>> be done occasionally, not on every handover, and the MN could=20 > >>>> register its intent to keep an address through e.g., dynamic DNS=20 > >>>> update. Then the new D- GW could lookup the DNS name of the MN at= =20 > >>>> the time it attaches, see the list of addresses that are currently= =20 > >>>> assigned, and take steps to attract the packets for those prefixes.= =20 > >>>> This could be a tunnel or it could be a BGP UPDATE as outlined in= =20 > >>>> draft-mccann-dmm-flatarch-00. > >>>=20 > >>> I haven't had time to check your draft yet. Apologies for that, I'll= =20 > >>> do it shortly. > >>=20 > >> Great, would be glad to have your comments. > >>=20 > >>> In any case, our draft does not specify how the info about the=20 > >>> active prefixes is obtained, and from where the require state is=20 > >>> retrieved. A centralized entity (such as the HSS, or a centralized > >>> LMA) is just an example. Our draft also includes some PMIPv6=20 > >>> protocol extensions to obtain that info from the previous router=20 > >>> visited by the MN (we call that D-GW), if the current router knows= =20 > >>> it. So basically the defined mechanisms are not incompatible, IMHO,= =20 > >>> with the ones you mentioned above. > >>=20 > >> Sure. I guess it is necessary to get the old prefix that was=20 > >> assigned somehow; it just seems that the additional effort to map=20 > >> this to an anchoring D-GW might be too much. > >=20 > > Not sure I follow what you said here... >=20 > You need to find the anchoring D-GW in order to establish a tunnel > to it and find out its MAC address. Assuming you found the assigned > prefix, it is an extra step to map this to an anchor D-GW. Certain > other proposals don't need to actually find the D-GW (for example,=20 > they can just send a BGP UPDATE to a route reflector). OK, if you are considering routing-based approaches, this is a completely different thing. IMO, the problem then is the converge and reaction time of the solution. >=20 > >>>> Finally, I don't quite understand the "Local Prefixes" concept=20 > >>>> presented in the draft. I understand how LIPA is supposed to work,= =20 > >>>> but I don't understand why you need to treat such prefixes=20 > >>>> differently from any other prefix on the D-GW1 link. You are=20 > >>>> tunneling all the traffic back to the D-GW1 AR, correct? > >>>> Wouldn't the traffic just naturally follow the proper path through= =20 > >>>> to the > >>>> D-GW1 and from there to the local CN? > >>>=20 > >>> We are considering here prefixes that because of security or other= =20 > >>> reasons are not normally reachable from the Internet, but only from= =20 > >>> nodes directly attached to D-GW1 (e.g., in an enterprise network). > >>> For that case, it might be useful to keep being able to reach those= =20 > >>> while being attached to a different D-GW. This is the LIPA use case= =20 > >>> considered by 3GPP. > >>=20 > >> I understand the motivation, but wouldn't this use case be solved=20 > >> because of the fact you have a tunnel from the old D-GW to the new=20 > >> D-GW? Why does the new D-GW need to know that a particular prefix=20 > >> was local to the previous D-GW? Aren't you proposing to always use= =20 > >> reverse tunneling back to the old D-GW for those packets that use the > >> old logical interface? > >=20 > > The tunnel is only used while you have ongoing sessions active. But=20 > > you might want to still being able to start new sessions to that local= =20 > > prefix via the D-GW connected to it (because it is the only way to get= =20 > > connectivity to it). >=20 > Sure, but wouldn't you always do this for sessions that use the old > prefix (whether they were established before or after the handover)? > Regardless of whether the prefix was "Local" or not? No, if you can reach a certain network using any IP source address, you will always prefer to use the source address that is anchored closer to your current location. Thanks, Carlos >=20 > >>>> Personally, I think it might be better to use client-based Mobile= =20 > >>>> IP for any scenario where the current AR cannot attract the packets= =20 > >>>> for a given prefix, such as when the MN moves out of the domain of= =20 > >>>> one operator. That situation is very similar to the LIPA case and= =20 > >>>> could be solved with a single mechanism. > >>>=20 > >>> Client-based DMM is a topic that deserves additional attention. In= =20 > >>> our draft we have started to look at a network-based solution, but= =20 > >>> we can discuss the implications of a client-based solution as well. > >>=20 > >> I think the network based solution is a good match for the frequent,= =20 > >> localized mobility within a given autonomous system. However, once= =20 > >> you cross a boundary outside of which the network can't re-route your= =20 > >> traffic, client MIP seems to be required. > >=20 > > For that case, seems to me that both PMIP and CMIP-based solutions=20 > > could be appropriate, but it depends on the specific assumptions. I=20 > > guess we would need to look further into the details. >=20 > Ok. >=20 > -Pete >=20 > >=20 > > Thanks, > >=20 > > Carlos > >=20 > >>=20 > >>>> Looking forward to continued discussion, > >>>=20 > >>> So do we. Thanks for the good comments. > >>>=20 > >>> Carlos > >>=20 > >> -Pete > >>=20 > > >=20 >=20 >=20 --=20 Carlos Jes=FAs Bernardos Cano http://www.netcom.it.uc3m.es/ GPG FP: D29B 0A6A 639A A561 93CA 4D55 35DC BA4D D170 4F67 --=-XLB6485gtaAyAwCj+fDi Content-Type: application/pgp-signature; name="signature.asc" Content-Description: This is a digitally signed message part Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.4.11 (GNU/Linux) iEYEABECAAYFAk9mPpkACgkQNdy6TdFwT2eRgACgwlaOFgdaGYaYBPCWoEqH5dNk L4gAnRRiqsNK+c4KwKoMIVuquk4CdGxm =qgr7 -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --=-XLB6485gtaAyAwCj+fDi-- From jouni.nospam@gmail.com Sun Mar 18 13:47:15 2012 Return-Path: X-Original-To: dmm@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: dmm@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 19F2F21F854E for ; Sun, 18 Mar 2012 13:47:15 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -3.42 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-3.42 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=-0.121, BAYES_00=-2.599, MIME_8BIT_HEADER=0.3, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW=-1] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([12.22.58.30]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id dSWpdJ24S6L6 for ; Sun, 18 Mar 2012 13:47:14 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail-lpp01m010-f44.google.com (mail-lpp01m010-f44.google.com [209.85.215.44]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 41EA421F8537 for ; Sun, 18 Mar 2012 13:47:14 -0700 (PDT) Received: by lagj5 with SMTP id j5so5090412lag.31 for ; Sun, 18 Mar 2012 13:47:13 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20120113; h=subject:mime-version:content-type:from:in-reply-to:date:cc :content-transfer-encoding:message-id:references:to:x-mailer; bh=F2ytkge9LEFHyvTmuyVxDOIWgaJikqU6qMRFf3O2ArI=; b=H8uDUlnmn/iywVj5phWBwC/lI4BLi3IIOpFS+TfWvbNeN69FUlhUjxrkZysBXZWe7B sAUnZBYcK3+Za5YrFoAOQVkKvj2JrvO0IMCRyJDAhueiPKROg0S/aKbT0U/anmRs2u+Z TTOq2AmJ5IZiqaGwVOrvziBDEecgs4hTH1ZtPnPm+qrWGnFw4GxIvJDUtuLxZVaC93ie 8ufUFh6fOXgd4OOFvxWcrCNCYsFg1p61FnA2/7yIx16vsC73dWgvBjHHaKo1ydCiD4l2 mrpKUmLkpRhdj67Xw6KejUXyzGFojvfWo3wn7ByuF9FS+VLSv8z9Tgi6ctgrEVR6NNHf VJEg== Received: by 10.152.123.229 with SMTP id md5mr7422349lab.34.1332103633237; Sun, 18 Mar 2012 13:47:13 -0700 (PDT) Received: from [188.117.15.106] ([188.117.15.106]) by mx.google.com with ESMTPS id ox7sm15544736lbb.17.2012.03.18.13.47.10 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=OTHER); Sun, 18 Mar 2012 13:47:11 -0700 (PDT) Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v1084) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii From: jouni korhonen In-Reply-To: <1332100728.27721.0.camel@acorde.it.uc3m.es> Date: Sun, 18 Mar 2012 22:47:08 +0200 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Message-Id: <27D50528-E258-49D8-9724-ABF5866DAF9E@gmail.com> References: <1330969192.3680.35.camel@acorde.it.uc3m.es> <69756203DDDDE64E987BC4F70B71A26D24D723F8@DAPHNIS.office.hd> <1331887843.4259.160.camel@acorde.it.uc3m.es> <69756203DDDDE64E987BC4F70B71A26D24D83744@Polydeuces.office.hd> <1332100728.27721.0.camel@acorde.it.uc3m.es> To: =?iso-8859-1?Q?Carlos_Jes=FAs_Bernardos_Cano?= , Marco Liebsch X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.1084) Cc: dmm@ietf.org Subject: Re: [DMM] New DMM draft: draft-bernardos-dmm-distributed-anchoring-00.txt X-BeenThere: dmm@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.12 Precedence: list List-Id: Distributed Mobility Management Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sun, 18 Mar 2012 20:47:15 -0000 >>=20 >> So you think that the UE should receive multiple IP addresses and = treat them >> differently according to the associated topological anchor point? = Hmm, yes, possible. >> What about real time streaming and other IP data sessions, which = could have a >> longer lifetime, they should be anchored than at a central point as = well, right? >> If the MN had such intelligence and information, it could treat the = HNPs differently, true. >=20 > I think thank kind of approaches make sense. There are a couple proposals on table that go into this direction. We = put those under "addressing enhancements" slot. Basically piggybacking anchoring = properties of a prefix along with address configuration. - Jouni >=20 > Carlos >=20 >>=20 >> marco From luo.wen@zte.com.cn Mon Mar 19 00:44:23 2012 Return-Path: X-Original-To: dmm@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: dmm@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 91A2F21F84DC; Mon, 19 Mar 2012 00:44:23 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -96.25 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-96.25 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.143, BAYES_00=-2.599, CHARSET_FARAWAY_HEADER=3.2, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, J_CHICKENPOX_21=0.6, MIME_8BIT_HEADER=0.3, RCVD_DOUBLE_IP_LOOSE=0.76, SARE_SUB_ENC_GB2312=1.345, USER_IN_WHITELIST=-100] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([12.22.58.30]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id iFAYnEA35uK0; Mon, 19 Mar 2012 00:44:22 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mx5.zte.com.cn (mx6.zte.com.cn 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Y29tLml0LnVjM20uZXMvDQpHUEcgRlA6IEQyOUI8YnI+DQomZ3Q7IDBBNkEgNjM5QSBBNTYxIDkz Q0EgJm5ic3A7NEQ1NSAzNURDIEJBNEQgRDE3MCA0RjY3PGJyPg0KPGJyPg0KX19fX19fX19fX19f X19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX188YnI+DQpkbW0gbWFpbGluZyBsaXN0 PGJyPg0KZG1tQGlldGYub3JnPGJyPg0KaHR0cHM6Ly93d3cuaWV0Zi5vcmcvbWFpbG1hbi9saXN0 aW5mby9kbW08YnI+DQo8YnI+DQo8L3R0PjwvZm9udD4NCjxicj4NCg== --=_alternative 002A7DE0482579C6_=-- From Marco.Liebsch@neclab.eu Mon Mar 19 01:58:50 2012 Return-Path: X-Original-To: dmm@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: dmm@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 812E021F84AE for ; Mon, 19 Mar 2012 01:58:48 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.224 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.224 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=-0.225, BAYES_00=-2.599, J_CHICKENPOX_21=0.6] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([12.22.58.30]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id YGLup+L6DNYh for ; Mon, 19 Mar 2012 01:58:46 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mailer1.neclab.eu (mailer1.neclab.eu [195.37.70.40]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2417D21F8499 for ; Mon, 19 Mar 2012 01:58:46 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mailer1.neclab.eu (Postfix) with ESMTP id A0163100825; Mon, 19 Mar 2012 10:00:00 +0100 (CET) X-Virus-Scanned: Amavisd on Debian GNU/Linux (netlab.nec.de) Received: from mailer1.neclab.eu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (atlas-a.office.hd [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id nO2manhgpgzg; Mon, 19 Mar 2012 10:00:00 +0100 (CET) Received: from METHONE.office.hd (unknown [192.168.24.54]) by mailer1.neclab.eu (Postfix) with ESMTP id 84860100820; Mon, 19 Mar 2012 09:59:50 +0100 (CET) Received: from Polydeuces.office.hd ([169.254.3.36]) by METHONE.office.hd ([192.168.24.54]) with mapi id 14.01.0323.003; Mon, 19 Mar 2012 09:58:35 +0100 From: Marco Liebsch To: "cjbc@it.uc3m.es" Thread-Topic: [DMM] New DMM draft: draft-bernardos-dmm-distributed-anchoring-00.txt Thread-Index: AQHNA1Xgg2lHGTIoXUatioze9Mi+zJZsq8SwgAO/3QCAAOT0UA== Date: Mon, 19 Mar 2012 08:58:34 +0000 Message-ID: <69756203DDDDE64E987BC4F70B71A26D24D84CFF@Polydeuces.office.hd> References: <1330969192.3680.35.camel@acorde.it.uc3m.es> <69756203DDDDE64E987BC4F70B71A26D24D723F8@DAPHNIS.office.hd> <1331887843.4259.160.camel@acorde.it.uc3m.es> <69756203DDDDE64E987BC4F70B71A26D24D83744@Polydeuces.office.hd> <1332100728.27721.0.camel@acorde.it.uc3m.es> In-Reply-To: <1332100728.27721.0.camel@acorde.it.uc3m.es> Accept-Language: de-DE, en-US Content-Language: en-US X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: x-originating-ip: [10.1.6.1] Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable MIME-Version: 1.0 Cc: "dmm@ietf.org" Subject: Re: [DMM] New DMM draft: draft-bernardos-dmm-distributed-anchoring-00.txt X-BeenThere: dmm@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.12 Precedence: list List-Id: Distributed Mobility Management Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 19 Mar 2012 08:58:50 -0000 Carlos, please see inline. > -----Original Message----- > From: Carlos Jes=FAs Bernardos Cano [mailto:cjbc@it.uc3m.es] > Sent: Sonntag, 18. M=E4rz 2012 20:59 > To: Marco Liebsch > Cc: dmm@ietf.org > Subject: RE: [DMM] New DMM draft: draft-bernardos-dmm-distributed- > anchoring-00.txt >=20 > Hi Marco, >=20 > Thanks for your comment. Please see inline below. >=20 > On Fri, 2012-03-16 at 10:00 +0000, Marco Liebsch wrote: > > Carlos, > > thanks for your feedback. Please see inline. > > > > > -----Original Message----- > > > From: Carlos Jes=FAs Bernardos Cano [mailto:cjbc@it.uc3m.es] > > > Sent: Freitag, 16. M=E4rz 2012 09:51 > > > To: Marco Liebsch > > > Cc: dmm@ietf.org > > > Subject: RE: [DMM] New DMM draft: draft-bernardos-dmm-distributed- > > > anchoring-00.txt > > > > > > Hi Marco, > > > > > > Apologies for the late reply. Thanks for reading the draft. Please > > > see some answers to your questions/comments inline below. > > > > > > On Fri, 2012-03-09 at 11:51 +0000, Marco Liebsch wrote: > > > > Hi Carlos, > > > > > > > > I have a few clarifying questions to your new draft. The draft > > > > proposes the distributed logical interface. I don't really get the > > > > advantage of virtualizing the previous LMA on the MN's current LMA > > > > if packets are routed through the previous LMA anyway. Why not > > > > using the current LMA to serve simply as MAG for forwarded traffic > > > > (which remains anchored at previous LMA) and using the new LMA to > > > > anchor the > > > new address/prefix? > > > > > > What you just mention is exactly what the draft does. Additionally, > > > the logical interface simplifies the interface between the MN and > > > the access router that behaves as LMA/MAG. It does so because by > > > interacting with the MN as different "logical" routers (one per > > > anchoring LMA), you can make full use of the ND based features (e.g., > RFC4191) in a very easy way. > > > > > > > > > > > The draft writes that the idea hides the change of the anchor from > > > > the mobile node. The DGW2IF on the new LMA does not pretend to be > > > > LMA1, > > > or? > > > > I don't see how the anchor change is kept transparent to the MN. > > > > > > The point is that from the point of view of the MN, it always "sees" > > > as directly connected (1-hop away) each of the anchor LMAs. Every > > > time the MN moves and attaches to a new access router, the only > > > thing it notices is that a new > > > ("logical") router appears on the link, advertising a new prefix > > > (and, in most use cases, the others start advertising the prefixes > > > with lifetime=3D0 to deprecate them). > > > > The LMA function should be transparent to the MN anyway, so it does > > not matter whether the LMA, which serves as anchor, is on the previous > > AR or on the current one. Invalidating the previous HNP and validating > > the new HNP can be done independently of whether the responsible LMA > > instance is co-located with the local AR or the previous AR. But I > > must admit that I probably have to check that part of your draft again. >=20 > If it just invalidating the prefix, this can be done, true. But the point= is that > the DLIF concept enables to do more that just invalidating a prefix. Besi= des, it > makes easier to implement this prefix deprecation. Ok, I'll check the description to better understand the DLIF function. >=20 > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I somehow agree also to Pete's opinion that solving the packet > > > > routing after anchor relocation above the anchors is a good > > > > option. It simply allows more optimal routes. > > > > > > I have to read his draft, but unless you have control on the routing > > > infrastructure (and this is not always possible, and it takes time > > > to converge), I don't see many other options to ensure address > continuity. > > > > I don't expect this to take long time, as the routing states are not > > to be enforced in all routers, at least not in our proposal. > > Intention is to keep the routing plane as it is and update states only > > is one dedicated router per data session, which translates the MN's IP > > address into a routable one to ensure that remaining routers in the > > network forward the downlink packet to the MN's current anchor point. > > The previous anchor point is released from any forwarding tasks. Furthe= r > advantage is that routes are potentially more optimal compared to > forwarding from a previous anchor. > > Which does not mean that both approaches cannot co-exist. A DMM > > solution could rely on forwarding while the state in the routing plane = is > established. >=20 > I have to admit I haven't checked your proposal yet. No problem ;-) > What you mention > seems like a NAT-based approach, is it true? We propose NAT to save per-packet overhead and use the prefix/IP address being assigned and anchored at the new anchor as locator, which intrinsical= ly has identifier information. So, reverse NAT on the new anchor is easily pos= sible. But that's not the key of the approach, as NAT can be easily replaced by IP= tunnels. The key approach is to solve DMM in the routing plane above anchors while u= sing the existing routing plane. > and if there is a dedicated > router, isn't it a centralized entity? It's exactly the opposite. No additional hierarchy level for mobility. Forw= arding is being done by standard routers which build the routing plane in the core, metro a= nd aggregation network. They can setup a transient per-host state after the MN's anchor ha= s been relocated and perform a longest prefix match. These routers are distributed throughou= t the routing plane. After NAT or encapsulation, remaining routers on the path to the MN's curre= nt anchor perform routing according to their existing entries, as the used IP address= represents a routable address and locator, which is anchored at the MN#s current mobil= ity anchor.=20 >if the point is that that entity is closer to > the MN (not deep in the operator's core), then I see that as a kind-of > hierarchical-alike solution. Mobility anchors are distributed and located closer to the MN. No additiona= l hierarchy level is introduced, as there is no additional anchor above the distributed= mobility anchors. marco >=20 > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Now I am deviating a bit, but into the direction of an important > question: > > > > That's directly related to the question of how persistent we need > > > > to be about IP address continuity. Now, some proposals consider > > > > termination of an IP address prefix, which is anchored at a > > > > previously used anchor point, as soon as the IP session, which > > > > uses that address, terminates. New sessions can use the address > > > > being anchored at the new mobility anchor. My opinion is that we > > > > need to find a good choice about the lifetime of such an anchored > > > > IP address, as it may also be registered with other services, e.g. > > > > IMS, messaging, etc, and would require > > > an updated registration after a change in the registered address. > > > > And even if such lifetime is short, we may not accept suboptimal > > > > routing paths via the previous anchor after anchor relocation. > > > > > > Session lifetime and prefix anchoring termination is a tricky and > > > important issue. As I see it, DMM is compatible with a "classical" > > > centralized approach (at least for the solutions that are basically > > > extending currently standardized IP mobility protocols to operate in > > > a more "distributed" way). For those applications that are known in > > > advance to require very long address lifetime (compared to the > > > anchoring mobility rate), I'd say that those sessions it might make > > > sense to keep them centrally anchored (or to enable applications to > > > be able to survive to an IP address change). > > > > So you think that the UE should receive multiple IP addresses and > > treat them differently according to the associated topological anchor p= oint? > Hmm, yes, possible. > > What about real time streaming and other IP data sessions, which could > > have a longer lifetime, they should be anchored than at a central point= as > well, right? > > If the MN had such intelligence and information, it could treat the HNP= s > differently, true. >=20 > I think thank kind of approaches make sense. >=20 > Carlos >=20 > > > > marco > > > > > > > > > > Thanks, > > > > > > Carlos > > > > > > > > > > > What do you think? > > > > > > > > Thanks, > > > > marco > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > -----Original Message----- > > > > > From: dmm-bounces@ietf.org [mailto:dmm-bounces@ietf.org] On > > > Behalf > > > > > Of Carlos Jes=FAs Bernardos Cano > > > > > Sent: Montag, 5. M=E4rz 2012 18:40 > > > > > To: dmm@ietf.org > > > > > Subject: [DMM] New DMM draft: draft-bernardos-dmm-distributed- > > > > > anchoring-00.txt > > > > > > > > > > Dear all, > > > > > > > > > > We've just submitted a new I-D on the DMM space. The draft > > > > > describes a network-based DMM approach extending PMIPv6, and > > > > > focusing on the required extensions to effectively support > > > > > simultaneously anchoring several flows at different distributed > anchors. > > > > > > > > > > As usual, comments would be warmly welcomed! > > > > > > > > > > More info below: > > > > > > > > > > Title : PMIPv6-based distributed anchoring > > > > > Author(s) : Carlos J. Bernardos > > > > > Juan Carlos Zuniga > > > > > Filename : > > > > > draft-bernardos-dmm-distributed-anchoring-00.txt > > > > > Pages : 23 > > > > > Date : 2012-03-05 > > > > > > > > > > Distributed Mobility Management solutions allow for setting up > > > > > networks so that traffic is distributed in an optimal way and = does > > > > > not rely on centralized deployed anchors to provide IP mobilit= y > > > > > support. > > > > > > > > > > There are many different approaches to address Distributed > Mobility > > > > > Management, as for example extending network-based mobility > > > protocols > > > > > (like Proxy Mobile IPv6), or client-based mobility protocols (= as > > > > > Mobile IPv6), among others. This document follows the former > > > > > approach, and proposes a solution based on Proxy Mobile IPv6 i= n > which > > > > > mobility sessions are anchored at the last IP hop router (call= ed > > > > > distributed gateway). The distributed gateway is an enhanced > access > > > > > router which is also able to operate as local mobility anchor = or > > > > > mobility access gateway, on a per prefix basis. The draft foc= uses on > > > > > the required extensions to effectively support simultaneously > > > > > anchoring several flows at different distributed gateways. > > > > > > > > > > This draft introduces the concept of distributed logical inter= face > > > > > (at the distributed gateway), which is a software construct th= at > > > > > allows to easily hide the change of anchor from the mobile nod= e. > > > > > Additionally, the draft describes how to provide session conti= nuity > > > > > in inter-domain scenarios in which dynamic tunneling or signal= ing > > > > > between distributed gateways from different operators is not > allowed. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > A URL for this Internet-Draft is: > > > > > http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-bernardos-dmm-distribu > > > > > ted- > > > > > anchoring-00.txt > > > > > > > > > > Thanks, > > > > > > > > > > Carlos > > > > > > > > > > -- > > > > > Carlos Jes=FAs Bernardos Cano http://www.netcom.it.uc3m.es/ GPG > FP: > > > > > D29B 0A6A 639A A561 93CA 4D55 35DC BA4D D170 4F67 > > > > > > -- > > > Carlos Jes=FAs Bernardos Cano http://www.netcom.it.uc3m.es/ GPG FP: > > > D29B 0A6A 639A A561 93CA 4D55 35DC BA4D D170 4F67 > > >=20 > -- > Carlos Jes=FAs Bernardos Cano http://www.netcom.it.uc3m.es/ GPG FP: D29B > 0A6A 639A A561 93CA 4D55 35DC BA4D D170 4F67 From pierrick.seite@orange.com Mon Mar 19 03:17:23 2012 Return-Path: X-Original-To: dmm@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: dmm@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 47DC121F864D for ; Mon, 19 Mar 2012 03:17:23 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -6.233 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-6.233 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.016, BAYES_00=-2.599, HELO_EQ_FR=0.35, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-4] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([12.22.58.30]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id SZvs+B5v0tQi for ; Mon, 19 Mar 2012 03:17:21 -0700 (PDT) Received: from r-mail2.rd.francetelecom.com (r-mail2.rd.francetelecom.com [217.108.152.42]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7707921F864B for ; Mon, 19 Mar 2012 03:17:21 -0700 (PDT) Received: from r-mail2.rd.francetelecom.com (localhost.localdomain [127.0.0.1]) by localhost (Postfix) with SMTP id 6A51A5D894C; Mon, 19 Mar 2012 11:17:20 +0100 (CET) Received: from ftrdsmtp1.rd.francetelecom.fr (unknown [10.192.128.46]) by r-mail2.rd.francetelecom.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 515E45D8948; Mon, 19 Mar 2012 11:17:20 +0100 (CET) Received: from ftrdmel0.rd.francetelecom.fr ([10.192.128.56]) by ftrdsmtp1.rd.francetelecom.fr with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.4675); Mon, 19 Mar 2012 11:17:00 +0100 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft Exchange V6.5 Content-class: urn:content-classes:message MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Date: Mon, 19 Mar 2012 11:16:56 +0100 Message-ID: <843DA8228A1BA74CA31FB4E111A5C46202403CB3@ftrdmel0.rd.francetelecom.fr> In-Reply-To: <27D50528-E258-49D8-9724-ABF5866DAF9E@gmail.com> X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: Thread-Topic: [DMM] New DMM draft:draft-bernardos-dmm-distributed-anchoring-00.txt Thread-Index: Ac0FSFIVc2WTB0yoQhiFiV0tHBwFnwAbhPhw References: <1330969192.3680.35.camel@acorde.it.uc3m.es><69756203DDDDE64E987BC4F70B71A26D24D723F8@DAPHNIS.office.hd><1331887843.4259.160.camel@acorde.it.uc3m.es><69756203DDDDE64E987BC4F70B71A26D24D83744@Polydeuces.office.hd><1332100728.27721.0.camel@acorde.it.uc3m.es> <27D50528-E258-49D8-9724-ABF5866DAF9E@gmail.com> From: To: , , X-OriginalArrivalTime: 19 Mar 2012 10:17:00.0179 (UTC) FILETIME=[6BF30630:01CD05B9] Cc: dmm@ietf.org Subject: Re: [DMM] New DMM draft:draft-bernardos-dmm-distributed-anchoring-00.txt X-BeenThere: dmm@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.12 Precedence: list List-Id: Distributed Mobility Management Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 19 Mar 2012 10:17:23 -0000 I think it is worth to work on solution providing more information on = the type of address. IMHO, it is a requirement for the UE to play with = more than one IP address and select the more appropriate source address = according the topological anchor point. DMM is clearly one use-case but, = this feature is also required for offload purpose in current centralized = network based mobility. The ongoing proposals for RA extensions, that = allow to distinguish anchored from local prefix, are interesting. Now, = the UE shall have the intelligence to make the source address selection = according to prefix properties; at least extensions to RFC3484 may be = defined but more sophisticated selection behavior may be required, = typically, policies based selection, e.g. offload policies. Pierrick > -----Message d'origine----- > De=A0: dmm-bounces@ietf.org [mailto:dmm-bounces@ietf.org] De la part = de > jouni korhonen > Envoy=E9=A0: dimanche 18 mars 2012 21:47 > =C0=A0: Carlos Jes=FAs Bernardos Cano; Marco Liebsch > Cc=A0: dmm@ietf.org > Objet=A0: Re: [DMM] New DMM draft:draft-bernardos-dmm-distributed- > anchoring-00.txt >=20 >=20 > >> > >> So you think that the UE should receive multiple IP addresses and > treat them > >> differently according to the associated topological anchor point? > Hmm, yes, possible. > >> What about real time streaming and other IP data sessions, which > could have a > >> longer lifetime, they should be anchored than at a central point as > well, right? > >> If the MN had such intelligence and information, it could treat the > HNPs differently, true. > > > > I think thank kind of approaches make sense. >=20 > There are a couple proposals on table that go into this direction. We > put those > under "addressing enhancements" slot. Basically piggybacking anchoring > properties > of a prefix along with address configuration. >=20 > - Jouni >=20 >=20 >=20 > > > > Carlos > > > >> > >> marco >=20 > _______________________________________________ > dmm mailing list > dmm@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dmm From Marco.Liebsch@neclab.eu Mon Mar 19 03:53:46 2012 Return-Path: X-Original-To: dmm@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: dmm@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 67FDF21F84DC for ; Mon, 19 Mar 2012 03:53:46 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.499 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.499 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.100, BAYES_00=-2.599] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([12.22.58.30]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id LH3HlHjQh7Td for ; Mon, 19 Mar 2012 03:53:45 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mailer1.neclab.eu (mailer1.neclab.eu [195.37.70.40]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 628D921F8483 for ; Mon, 19 Mar 2012 03:53:45 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mailer1.neclab.eu (Postfix) with ESMTP id 834211009A5; Mon, 19 Mar 2012 11:55:00 +0100 (CET) X-Virus-Scanned: Amavisd on Debian GNU/Linux (netlab.nec.de) Received: from mailer1.neclab.eu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (atlas-a.office.hd [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id ne9B0IrAchwE; Mon, 19 Mar 2012 11:55:00 +0100 (CET) Received: from METHONE.office.hd (unknown [192.168.24.54]) by mailer1.neclab.eu (Postfix) with ESMTP id 610091008AE; Mon, 19 Mar 2012 11:54:40 +0100 (CET) Received: from Polydeuces.office.hd ([169.254.3.36]) by METHONE.office.hd ([192.168.24.54]) with mapi id 14.01.0323.003; Mon, 19 Mar 2012 11:53:24 +0100 From: Marco Liebsch To: "pierrick.seite@orange.com" , "jouni.nospam@gmail.com" , "cjbc@it.uc3m.es" Thread-Topic: [DMM] New DMM draft:draft-bernardos-dmm-distributed-anchoring-00.txt Thread-Index: AQHNBbp7WIS8j/77ckmTSaGpTNzPopZxaw9A Date: Mon, 19 Mar 2012 10:53:23 +0000 Message-ID: <69756203DDDDE64E987BC4F70B71A26D24D84D96@Polydeuces.office.hd> References: <1330969192.3680.35.camel@acorde.it.uc3m.es><69756203DDDDE64E987BC4F70B71A26D24D723F8@DAPHNIS.office.hd><1331887843.4259.160.camel@acorde.it.uc3m.es><69756203DDDDE64E987BC4F70B71A26D24D83744@Polydeuces.office.hd><1332100728.27721.0.camel@acorde.it.uc3m.es> <27D50528-E258-49D8-9724-ABF5866DAF9E@gmail.com> <843DA8228A1BA74CA31FB4E111A5C46202403CB3@ftrdmel0.rd.francetelecom.fr> In-Reply-To: <843DA8228A1BA74CA31FB4E111A5C46202403CB3@ftrdmel0.rd.francetelecom.fr> Accept-Language: de-DE, en-US Content-Language: en-US X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: x-originating-ip: [10.1.6.1] Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable MIME-Version: 1.0 Cc: "dmm@ietf.org" Subject: Re: [DMM] New DMM draft:draft-bernardos-dmm-distributed-anchoring-00.txt X-BeenThere: dmm@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.12 Precedence: list List-Id: Distributed Mobility Management Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 19 Mar 2012 10:53:46 -0000 Hi Pierrick, I agree that this is an interesting approach from research point of view. T= he question is how practical this is. Intelligence on the MN is ok, but to take a decis= ion about which IP address to use, the MN needs information. If information is solely a bin= ding between the prefix and the level of the associated anchor in a hierarchy of anchors, then the MN may select a prefix/address according to the expected IP session duratio= n to avoid a change in the topological anchor of the used IP address. Taking such deci= sion requires also some information about the topology, which I doubt operators will reveal. I= mportant here is the location of the anchor and the location of the used serving poi= nt. Latter could be a public Internet service, hence knowledge of the operator's IX peering = points may be relevant. If the serving point is operator CDN-like, typically the MN is= served by transparent caching, hence, the location of the cache is not known to th= e MN. A different and pragmatic approach is to select the closest anchor point to= serve any IP session of the UE and to provide a good solution to handle routing after anchor rel= ocation plus renewal of the MN's IP address from time to time. IMO, such approach enable= s short routing paths between any source and the MN while offloading traffic from t= he core network as its best. marco > -----Original Message----- > From: pierrick.seite@orange.com [mailto:pierrick.seite@orange.com] > Sent: Montag, 19. M=E4rz 2012 11:17 > To: jouni.nospam@gmail.com; cjbc@it.uc3m.es; Marco Liebsch > Cc: dmm@ietf.org > Subject: RE: [DMM] New DMM draft:draft-bernardos-dmm-distributed- > anchoring-00.txt >=20 > I think it is worth to work on solution providing more information on the= type > of address. IMHO, it is a requirement for the UE to play with more than o= ne > IP address and select the more appropriate source address according the > topological anchor point. DMM is clearly one use-case but, this feature i= s also > required for offload purpose in current centralized network based mobilit= y. > The ongoing proposals for RA extensions, that allow to distinguish anchor= ed > from local prefix, are interesting. Now, the UE shall have the intelligen= ce to > make the source address selection according to prefix properties; at leas= t > extensions to RFC3484 may be defined but more sophisticated selection > behavior may be required, typically, policies based selection, e.g. offlo= ad > policies. >=20 > Pierrick >=20 > > -----Message d'origine----- > > De=A0: dmm-bounces@ietf.org [mailto:dmm-bounces@ietf.org] De la part de > > jouni korhonen Envoy=E9=A0: dimanche 18 mars 2012 21:47 =C0=A0: Carlos = Jes=FAs > > Bernardos Cano; Marco Liebsch Cc=A0: dmm@ietf.org Objet=A0: Re: [DMM] N= ew > > DMM draft:draft-bernardos-dmm-distributed- > > anchoring-00.txt > > > > > > >> > > >> So you think that the UE should receive multiple IP addresses and > > treat them > > >> differently according to the associated topological anchor point? > > Hmm, yes, possible. > > >> What about real time streaming and other IP data sessions, which > > could have a > > >> longer lifetime, they should be anchored than at a central point as > > well, right? > > >> If the MN had such intelligence and information, it could treat the > > HNPs differently, true. > > > > > > I think thank kind of approaches make sense. > > > > There are a couple proposals on table that go into this direction. We > > put those under "addressing enhancements" slot. Basically piggybacking > > anchoring properties of a prefix along with address configuration. > > > > - Jouni > > > > > > > > > > > > Carlos > > > > > >> > > >> marco > > > > _______________________________________________ > > dmm mailing list > > dmm@ietf.org > > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dmm From jouni.nospam@gmail.com Mon Mar 19 03:59:31 2012 Return-Path: X-Original-To: dmm@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: dmm@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id EF6F421F8606 for ; Mon, 19 Mar 2012 03:59:30 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.983 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.983 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=-0.963, BAYES_00=-2.599, RCVD_IN_BL_SPAMCOP_NET=1.96, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW=-1, RCVD_IN_SORBS_WEB=0.619] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([12.22.58.30]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id XIUCwJDVpn5o for ; Mon, 19 Mar 2012 03:59:30 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail-pb0-f44.google.com (mail-pb0-f44.google.com [209.85.160.44]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7633221F852B for ; Mon, 19 Mar 2012 03:59:30 -0700 (PDT) Received: by pbbrq13 with SMTP id rq13so1150279pbb.31 for ; Mon, 19 Mar 2012 03:59:30 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20120113; h=subject:mime-version:content-type:from:in-reply-to:date:cc :content-transfer-encoding:message-id:references:to:x-mailer; bh=ENjinIXA9XRerUGvuCek76xOu3yKpTRNrFfFAJqJdEI=; b=V4HB0PcNhP4YTa8q92Oy1ejfyHg1HjfhHUoZnJymD5NsdYlHWVJjiJtK2+ZtShzoBF IBrJVG/P6Ebz5Rc5LcoICLPIm0Hm/Mjf8ImjIEa0q1sSbgSe3CCLgXqvZO6fTX/L8Z85 0KbDrO4qGOXjddwo22951kWGB6vo5sV1L9nwSmutrdv/dOmK80Ui3AW486MjTSNCMqxL 0C2sGbx01JVWxCf0pIzxVD2Tw+l0aDe2ixNuapciKHwdLqS9HPtzHVQVPWWOYY/UX/nF Kg2A+TN3bqcbIq42llB65fiZzKf9yOx5HunUVvxTcA6KOoANhoM5hDtJeSvjEezvDbdF m7ww== Received: by 10.68.236.132 with SMTP id uu4mr22086370pbc.166.1332154770280; Mon, 19 Mar 2012 03:59:30 -0700 (PDT) Received: from [10.255.128.139] ([192.100.123.77]) by mx.google.com with ESMTPS id k2sm11111419pba.28.2012.03.19.03.59.27 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=OTHER); Mon, 19 Mar 2012 03:59:29 -0700 (PDT) Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v1084) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 From: jouni korhonen In-Reply-To: <843DA8228A1BA74CA31FB4E111A5C46202403CB3@ftrdmel0.rd.francetelecom.fr> Date: Mon, 19 Mar 2012 12:59:22 +0200 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Message-Id: <1EE2ECEB-407F-43A6-AA41-E2D500418647@gmail.com> References: <1330969192.3680.35.camel@acorde.it.uc3m.es><69756203DDDDE64E987BC4F70B71A26D24D723F8@DAPHNIS.office.hd><1331887843.4259.160.camel@acorde.it.uc3m.es><69756203DDDDE64E987BC4F70B71A26D24D83744@Polydeuces.office.hd><1332100728.27721.0.camel@acorde.it.uc3m.es> <27D50528-E258-49D8-9724-ABF5866DAF9E@gmail.com> <843DA8228A1BA74CA31FB4E111A5C46202403CB3@ftrdmel0.rd.francetelecom.fr> To: X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.1084) Cc: dmm@ietf.org Subject: Re: [DMM] New DMM draft:draft-bernardos-dmm-distributed-anchoring-00.txt X-BeenThere: dmm@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.12 Precedence: list List-Id: Distributed Mobility Management Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 19 Mar 2012 10:59:31 -0000 Pierrick, On Mar 19, 2012, at 12:16 PM, = wrote: > I think it is worth to work on solution providing more information on = the type of address. IMHO, it is a requirement for the UE to play with = more than one IP address and select the more appropriate source address = according the topological anchor point. DMM is clearly one use-case but, = this feature is also required for offload purpose in current centralized = network based mobility. The ongoing proposals for RA extensions, that = allow to distinguish anchored from local prefix, are interesting. Now, = the UE shall have the intelligence to make the source address selection = according to prefix To me offloading and DMM go hand in hand, since how the current charter = is described emphasizes the use of CoAs (could be the "local prefix"). = With some care, solutions developed in DMM space apply to both. At least = this is what I want to see to happen. > properties; at least extensions to RFC3484 may be defined but more = sophisticated selection behavior may be required, typically, policies = based selection, e.g. offload policies. For example, draft-korhonen-dmm-prefix-properties discuss briefly how to = hook into RFC3484bis (and even to RFC3484). The text superseding source = address selection Rule 8: Rule 8 may be superseded if the implementation has other means of choosing among source addresses. For example, if the implementation somehow knows which source address will result in the "best" communications performance. is especially a good fit here. - Jouni >=20 > Pierrick >=20 >> -----Message d'origine----- >> De : dmm-bounces@ietf.org [mailto:dmm-bounces@ietf.org] De la part de >> jouni korhonen >> Envoy=E9 : dimanche 18 mars 2012 21:47 >> =C0 : Carlos Jes=FAs Bernardos Cano; Marco Liebsch >> Cc : dmm@ietf.org >> Objet : Re: [DMM] New DMM draft:draft-bernardos-dmm-distributed- >> anchoring-00.txt >>=20 >>=20 >>>>=20 >>>> So you think that the UE should receive multiple IP addresses and >> treat them >>>> differently according to the associated topological anchor point? >> Hmm, yes, possible. >>>> What about real time streaming and other IP data sessions, which >> could have a >>>> longer lifetime, they should be anchored than at a central point as >> well, right? >>>> If the MN had such intelligence and information, it could treat the >> HNPs differently, true. >>>=20 >>> I think thank kind of approaches make sense. >>=20 >> There are a couple proposals on table that go into this direction. We >> put those >> under "addressing enhancements" slot. Basically piggybacking = anchoring >> properties >> of a prefix along with address configuration. >>=20 >> - Jouni >>=20 >>=20 >>=20 >>>=20 >>> Carlos >>>=20 >>>>=20 >>>> marco >>=20 >> _______________________________________________ >> dmm mailing list >> dmm@ietf.org >> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dmm From pierrick.seite@orange.com Mon Mar 19 05:06:34 2012 Return-Path: X-Original-To: dmm@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: dmm@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id C2AF921F8663 for ; Mon, 19 Mar 2012 05:06:34 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -6.211 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-6.211 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.038, BAYES_00=-2.599, HELO_EQ_FR=0.35, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-4] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([12.22.58.30]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id oIwPRBXD-eGe for ; Mon, 19 Mar 2012 05:06:33 -0700 (PDT) Received: from p-mail1.rd.francetelecom.com (p-mail1.rd.francetelecom.com [195.101.245.15]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 791E121F864D for ; Mon, 19 Mar 2012 05:06:33 -0700 (PDT) Received: from p-mail1.rd.francetelecom.com (localhost.localdomain [127.0.0.1]) by localhost (Postfix) with SMTP id A39D04110D3; Mon, 19 Mar 2012 13:06:31 +0100 (CET) Received: from ftrdsmtp2.rd.francetelecom.fr (unknown [10.192.128.47]) by p-mail1.rd.francetelecom.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 986104110D0; Mon, 19 Mar 2012 13:06:31 +0100 (CET) Received: from ftrdmel0.rd.francetelecom.fr ([10.192.128.56]) by ftrdsmtp2.rd.francetelecom.fr with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.4675); Mon, 19 Mar 2012 13:06:31 +0100 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft Exchange V6.5 Content-class: urn:content-classes:message MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Date: Mon, 19 Mar 2012 13:06:30 +0100 Message-ID: <843DA8228A1BA74CA31FB4E111A5C46202403D2C@ftrdmel0.rd.francetelecom.fr> In-Reply-To: <1EE2ECEB-407F-43A6-AA41-E2D500418647@gmail.com> X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: Thread-Topic: [DMM] New DMM draft:draft-bernardos-dmm-distributed-anchoring-00.txt Thread-Index: Ac0Fv3CsSw6ArdGgT2yk1BLd9kLYugACQoeg References: <1330969192.3680.35.camel@acorde.it.uc3m.es><69756203DDDDE64E987BC4F70B71A26D24D723F8@DAPHNIS.office.hd><1331887843.4259.160.camel@acorde.it.uc3m.es><69756203DDDDE64E987BC4F70B71A26D24D83744@Polydeuces.office.hd><1332100728.27721.0.camel@acorde.it.uc3m.es> <27D50528-E258-49D8-9724-ABF5866DAF9E@gmail.com> <843DA8228A1BA74CA31FB4E111A5C46202403CB3@ftrdmel0.rd.francetelecom.fr> <1EE2ECEB-407F-43A6-AA41-E2D500418647@gmail.com> From: To: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 19 Mar 2012 12:06:31.0430 (UTC) FILETIME=[B8B85A60:01CD05C8] Cc: dmm@ietf.org Subject: Re: [DMM] New DMM draft:draft-bernardos-dmm-distributed-anchoring-00.txt X-BeenThere: dmm@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.12 Precedence: list List-Id: Distributed Mobility Management Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 19 Mar 2012 12:06:34 -0000 > -----Message d'origine----- > De=A0: jouni korhonen [mailto:jouni.nospam@gmail.com] > Envoy=E9=A0: lundi 19 mars 2012 11:59 > =C0=A0: SEITE Pierrick RD-RESA-REN > Cc=A0: cjbc@it.uc3m.es; Marco.Liebsch@neclab.eu; dmm@ietf.org > Objet=A0: Re: [DMM] New DMM draft:draft-bernardos-dmm-distributed- > anchoring-00.txt >=20 >=20 > Pierrick, >=20 > On Mar 19, 2012, at 12:16 PM, > wrote: >=20 > > I think it is worth to work on solution providing more information = on > the type of address. IMHO, it is a requirement for the UE to play with > more than one IP address and select the more appropriate source = address > according the topological anchor point. DMM is clearly one use-case > but, this feature is also required for offload purpose in current > centralized network based mobility. The ongoing proposals for RA > extensions, that allow to distinguish anchored from local prefix, are > interesting. Now, the UE shall have the intelligence to make the = source > address selection according to prefix >=20 > To me offloading and DMM go hand in hand, since how the current = charter > is described emphasizes the use of CoAs (could be the "local prefix"). > With some care, solutions developed in DMM space apply to both. At > least this is what I want to see to happen. >=20 I couldn't agree more.=20 Pierrick > > properties; at least extensions to RFC3484 may be defined but more > sophisticated selection behavior may be required, typically, policies > based selection, e.g. offload policies. >=20 > For example, draft-korhonen-dmm-prefix-properties discuss briefly how > to hook into RFC3484bis (and even to RFC3484). The text superseding > source address selection Rule 8: >=20 > Rule 8 may be superseded if the implementation has other means of > choosing among source addresses. For example, if the = implementation > somehow knows which source address will result in the "best" > communications performance. >=20 > is especially a good fit here. >=20 > - Jouni >=20 > > > > Pierrick > > > >> -----Message d'origine----- > >> De : dmm-bounces@ietf.org [mailto:dmm-bounces@ietf.org] De la part > de > >> jouni korhonen > >> Envoy=E9 : dimanche 18 mars 2012 21:47 > >> =C0 : Carlos Jes=FAs Bernardos Cano; Marco Liebsch > >> Cc : dmm@ietf.org > >> Objet : Re: [DMM] New DMM draft:draft-bernardos-dmm-distributed- > >> anchoring-00.txt > >> > >> > >>>> > >>>> So you think that the UE should receive multiple IP addresses and > >> treat them > >>>> differently according to the associated topological anchor point? > >> Hmm, yes, possible. > >>>> What about real time streaming and other IP data sessions, which > >> could have a > >>>> longer lifetime, they should be anchored than at a central point > as > >> well, right? > >>>> If the MN had such intelligence and information, it could treat > the > >> HNPs differently, true. > >>> > >>> I think thank kind of approaches make sense. > >> > >> There are a couple proposals on table that go into this direction. > We > >> put those > >> under "addressing enhancements" slot. Basically piggybacking > anchoring > >> properties > >> of a prefix along with address configuration. > >> > >> - Jouni > >> > >> > >> > >>> > >>> Carlos > >>> > >>>> > >>>> marco > >> > >> _______________________________________________ > >> dmm mailing list > >> dmm@ietf.org > >> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dmm From pierrick.seite@orange.com Mon Mar 19 05:47:05 2012 Return-Path: X-Original-To: dmm@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: dmm@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id EE63621F85A0 for ; Mon, 19 Mar 2012 05:47:04 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -6.216 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-6.216 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.033, BAYES_00=-2.599, HELO_EQ_FR=0.35, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-4] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([12.22.58.30]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 851+fjI15WGT for ; Mon, 19 Mar 2012 05:47:04 -0700 (PDT) Received: from p-mail2.rd.francetelecom.com (p-mail2.rd.francetelecom.com [195.101.245.16]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id BB84821F8585 for ; Mon, 19 Mar 2012 05:47:03 -0700 (PDT) Received: from p-mail2.rd.francetelecom.com (localhost.localdomain [127.0.0.1]) by localhost (Postfix) with SMTP id 489D1E302A6; Mon, 19 Mar 2012 13:23:45 +0100 (CET) Received: from ftrdsmtp2.rd.francetelecom.fr (unknown [10.192.128.47]) by p-mail2.rd.francetelecom.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3FC9DE30290; Mon, 19 Mar 2012 13:23:45 +0100 (CET) Received: from ftrdmel0.rd.francetelecom.fr ([10.192.128.56]) by ftrdsmtp2.rd.francetelecom.fr with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.4675); Mon, 19 Mar 2012 13:22:23 +0100 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft Exchange V6.5 Content-class: urn:content-classes:message MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Date: Mon, 19 Mar 2012 13:22:21 +0100 Message-ID: <843DA8228A1BA74CA31FB4E111A5C46202403D3A@ftrdmel0.rd.francetelecom.fr> In-Reply-To: <69756203DDDDE64E987BC4F70B71A26D24D84D96@Polydeuces.office.hd> X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: Thread-Topic: [DMM] New DMM draft:draft-bernardos-dmm-distributed-anchoring-00.txt Thread-Index: AQHNBbp7WIS8j/77ckmTSaGpTNzPopZxaw9AgAAa+/A= References: <1330969192.3680.35.camel@acorde.it.uc3m.es><69756203DDDDE64E987BC4F70B71A26D24D723F8@DAPHNIS.office.hd><1331887843.4259.160.camel@acorde.it.uc3m.es><69756203DDDDE64E987BC4F70B71A26D24D83744@Polydeuces.office.hd><1332100728.27721.0.camel@acorde.it.uc3m.es> <27D50528-E258-49D8-9724-ABF5866DAF9E@gmail.com> <843DA8228A1BA74CA31FB4E111A5C46202403CB3@ftrdmel0.rd.francetelecom.fr> <69756203DDDDE64E987BC4F70B71A26D24D84D96@Polydeuces.office.hd> From: To: , , X-OriginalArrivalTime: 19 Mar 2012 12:22:23.0339 (UTC) FILETIME=[F01A23B0:01CD05CA] Cc: dmm@ietf.org Subject: Re: [DMM] New DMM draft:draft-bernardos-dmm-distributed-anchoring-00.txt X-BeenThere: dmm@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.12 Precedence: list List-Id: Distributed Mobility Management Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 19 Mar 2012 12:47:05 -0000 > -----Message d'origine----- > De=A0: Marco Liebsch [mailto:Marco.Liebsch@neclab.eu] > Envoy=E9=A0: lundi 19 mars 2012 11:53 > =C0=A0: SEITE Pierrick RD-RESA-REN; jouni.nospam@gmail.com; = cjbc@it.uc3m.es > Cc=A0: dmm@ietf.org > Objet=A0: RE: [DMM] New DMM draft:draft-bernardos-dmm-distributed- > anchoring-00.txt >=20 > Hi Pierrick, >=20 > I agree that this is an interesting approach from research point of > view. The question > is how practical this is. Intelligence on the MN is ok, but to take a > decision about which > IP address to use, the MN needs information. If information is solely = a > binding between the prefix > and the level of the associated anchor in a hierarchy of anchors, then > the > MN may select a prefix/address according to the expected IP session > duration to avoid > a change in the topological anchor of the used IP address. Taking such > decision requires also > some information about the topology, which I doubt operators will > reveal.=20 I confirm :-) Important > here is the location of the anchor and the location of the used = serving > point.=20 Latter could > be a public Internet service, hence knowledge of the operator's IX > peering points may > be relevant. If the serving point is operator CDN-like, typically the > MN is served > by transparent caching, hence, the location of the cache is not known > to the MN. >=20 You're right but, actually, we may not need a so smart selection. I was = not talking about a so sophisticated selection; actually, IMHO, the = requirement, is just that the UE can distinguish anchored prefix/address = to be used by the application which need mobility support. Today, with = network based mobility management, there is no way for the UE to know = the type of address. > A different and pragmatic approach is to select the closest anchor > point to serve any IP session > of the UE and to provide a good solution to handle routing after = anchor > relocation plus > renewal of the MN's IP address from time to time. IMO, such approach > enables short > routing paths between any source and the MN while offloading traffic > from the core > network as its best. >=20 I agree, IMO, this is basic requirement of DMM; but I do not see this = approach as different, it is complementary. BR, Pierrick > marco >=20 >=20 >=20 >=20 > > -----Original Message----- > > From: pierrick.seite@orange.com [mailto:pierrick.seite@orange.com] > > Sent: Montag, 19. M=E4rz 2012 11:17 > > To: jouni.nospam@gmail.com; cjbc@it.uc3m.es; Marco Liebsch > > Cc: dmm@ietf.org > > Subject: RE: [DMM] New DMM draft:draft-bernardos-dmm-distributed- > > anchoring-00.txt > > > > I think it is worth to work on solution providing more information = on > the type > > of address. IMHO, it is a requirement for the UE to play with more > than one > > IP address and select the more appropriate source address according > the > > topological anchor point. DMM is clearly one use-case but, this > feature is also > > required for offload purpose in current centralized network based > mobility. > > The ongoing proposals for RA extensions, that allow to distinguish > anchored > > from local prefix, are interesting. Now, the UE shall have the > intelligence to > > make the source address selection according to prefix properties; at > least > > extensions to RFC3484 may be defined but more sophisticated = selection > > behavior may be required, typically, policies based selection, e.g. > offload > > policies. > > > > Pierrick > > > > > -----Message d'origine----- > > > De=A0: dmm-bounces@ietf.org [mailto:dmm-bounces@ietf.org] De la = part > de > > > jouni korhonen Envoy=E9=A0: dimanche 18 mars 2012 21:47 =C0=A0: = Carlos > Jes=FAs > > > Bernardos Cano; Marco Liebsch Cc=A0: dmm@ietf.org Objet=A0: Re: = [DMM] > New > > > DMM draft:draft-bernardos-dmm-distributed- > > > anchoring-00.txt > > > > > > > > > >> > > > >> So you think that the UE should receive multiple IP addresses > and > > > treat them > > > >> differently according to the associated topological anchor > point? > > > Hmm, yes, possible. > > > >> What about real time streaming and other IP data sessions, = which > > > could have a > > > >> longer lifetime, they should be anchored than at a central = point > as > > > well, right? > > > >> If the MN had such intelligence and information, it could treat > the > > > HNPs differently, true. > > > > > > > > I think thank kind of approaches make sense. > > > > > > There are a couple proposals on table that go into this direction. > We > > > put those under "addressing enhancements" slot. Basically > piggybacking > > > anchoring properties of a prefix along with address configuration. > > > > > > - Jouni > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Carlos > > > > > > > >> > > > >> marco > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > > dmm mailing list > > > dmm@ietf.org > > > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dmm From sarikaya2012@gmail.com Mon Mar 19 09:13:19 2012 Return-Path: X-Original-To: dmm@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: dmm@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5D7F021F8887 for ; Mon, 19 Mar 2012 09:13:19 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -3.563 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-3.563 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.036, BAYES_00=-2.599, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW=-1] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([12.22.58.30]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id ccvySlPxoNOi for ; Mon, 19 Mar 2012 09:13:18 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail-gy0-f172.google.com (mail-gy0-f172.google.com [209.85.160.172]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8AB0021F8869 for ; Mon, 19 Mar 2012 09:13:18 -0700 (PDT) Received: by ghbg16 with SMTP id g16so6349135ghb.31 for ; Mon, 19 Mar 2012 09:13:18 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20120113; h=mime-version:reply-to:in-reply-to:references:date:message-id :subject:from:to:cc:content-type:content-transfer-encoding; bh=HOdZjKJwwtzd/+JH2w3C++ZpQRN/sj3afTjUulM2JaQ=; b=vGcF743QV079LD/8eWEVMhxXL4mQi8vd7GoWVZWuMDK6/pq7mGKLKy5gj9ae9IVNSt +jxC7vYUT2jMvahx40H6gsZOikFsAJ/utkkuIersbuIs4VNQwQcyLll/w6oGu4Jl4Ibo YMV47aiGdFH49tcJ5SsbhFxC5FQyD0WOHlmcf0LyXYqWX4j87EL7wS8vqLrphyiHImab 7TGJMl9EpcVqKr9q49oHvY9TlzcG0UEf0flguu31HNOLV3/59mNRMNrv+keQ8G/7dzIi /qCu6ub+HgIjdT6Z5tDTmbgmqssNZ05Z902hQAhPmI9L5d6u7+kdYlspU5Nn23xtVvnw +ODQ== MIME-Version: 1.0 Received: by 10.50.47.135 with SMTP id d7mr6305790ign.66.1332173597772; Mon, 19 Mar 2012 09:13:17 -0700 (PDT) Received: by 10.231.179.71 with HTTP; Mon, 19 Mar 2012 09:13:17 -0700 (PDT) In-Reply-To: <1332100749.27721.1.camel@acorde.it.uc3m.es> References: <1331887784.4259.158.camel@acorde.it.uc3m.es> <1332100749.27721.1.camel@acorde.it.uc3m.es> Date: Mon, 19 Mar 2012 11:13:17 -0500 Message-ID: From: Behcet Sarikaya To: cjbc@it.uc3m.es Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Cc: "dmm@ietf.org" Subject: Re: [DMM] review of draft-bernardos-dmm-distributed-anchoring-00 X-BeenThere: dmm@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.12 Precedence: list Reply-To: sarikaya@ieee.org List-Id: Distributed Mobility Management Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 19 Mar 2012 16:13:19 -0000 Hi Carlos, On Sun, Mar 18, 2012 at 2:59 PM, Carlos Jes=FAs Bernardos Cano wrote: > Hi Behcet, > > On Fri, 2012-03-16 at 11:06 -0500, Behcet Sarikaya wrote: >> Hi Carlos, >> >> You say in various places in your draft that your protocol is PMIPv6-bas= ed. >> I wonder how it could be? > > More accurately, we could say that the solution is network-based. PMIPv6 > is just one network-based protocol and the solution is specified in the > draft for PMIPv6. Not sure what your doubt comes from... > If it is network based then I don't understand why MN has a lot to do in your protocol as Wen has pointed out? >> RFC 5213 in Section 7.1 says: >> Once the address configuration is complete, the mobile node can >> =A0 =A0continue to use this address configuration as long as it is attac= hed >> =A0 =A0to the network that is in the scope of that Proxy Mobile IPv6 dom= ain. >> >> I wonder if MN moved out of PMIPv6 domain in your case? > > No, it has not. One of the common assumptions for DMM is that the MN > does not need address continuity for the whole duration the MN is > attached to the domain. The idea is to enforce new communications to > make use of the address anchored closer to where the MN is attached to, > and to deprecate addresses anchored elsewhere (so they are not needed > once active communications using them are done). > I guess what you understand from DMM is to put LMA functionality into MAG and lump the two together into one. That's why MN needs to get an address in the new MAG/LMA. And all other requirements coming out of this huge change in PMIPv6. However, if you look into IETF work, in such cases MN needs to use MIPv6 as in http://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-netlmm-mip-interactions-0= 7 Regards, Behcet From luo.wen@zte.com.cn Mon Mar 19 23:33:50 2012 Return-Path: X-Original-To: dmm@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: dmm@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4799D21E803B for ; Mon, 19 Mar 2012 23:33:50 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -96.298 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-96.298 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.095, BAYES_00=-2.599, CHARSET_FARAWAY_HEADER=3.2, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, J_CHICKENPOX_21=0.6, MIME_8BIT_HEADER=0.3, RCVD_DOUBLE_IP_LOOSE=0.76, SARE_SUB_ENC_GB2312=1.345, USER_IN_WHITELIST=-100] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([12.22.58.30]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id isC3ndGNg5kh for ; Mon, 19 Mar 2012 23:33:49 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mx5.zte.com.cn (mx6.zte.com.cn [95.130.199.165]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 54A5F21E800E for ; Mon, 19 Mar 2012 23:33:48 -0700 (PDT) Received: from [10.30.17.100] by mx5.zte.com.cn with surfront esmtp id 122801057192640; Tue, 20 Mar 2012 13:58:57 +0800 (CST) Received: from [10.30.3.20] by [192.168.168.16] with StormMail ESMTP id 62139.2475308407; Tue, 20 Mar 2012 14:33:31 +0800 (CST) Received: from notes_smtp.zte.com.cn ([10.30.1.239]) by mse01.zte.com.cn with ESMTP id q2K6XU3n012118; Tue, 20 Mar 2012 14:33:30 +0800 (GMT-8) (envelope-from luo.wen@zte.com.cn) In-Reply-To: <1331887784.4259.158.camel@acorde.it.uc3m.es> To: cjbc@it.uc3m.es MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Lotus Notes Release 6.5.4 March 27, 2005 Message-ID: From: luo.wen@zte.com.cn Date: Tue, 20 Mar 2012 14:33:27 +0800 X-MIMETrack: Serialize by Router on notes_smtp/zte_ltd(Release 8.5.1FP4|July 25, 2010) at 2012-03-20 14:33:31 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="=_mixed 002406DF482579C7_=" X-MAIL: 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name="signature.asc" Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="signature.asc" Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64 LS0tLS1CRUdJTiBQR1AgU0lHTkFUVVJFLS0tLS0NClZlcnNpb246IEdudVBHIHYxLjQuMTEgKEdO VS9MaW51eCkNCg0KaUVZRUFCRUNBQVlGQWs5aS9xZ0FDZ2tRTmR5NlRkRndUMmZ1UEFDZ2hwNnM2 RzNWSUJxTitOVmdOTXQ1bjhORg0KVGpNQW4xL1drWHYvRjVGWExHUXJ2STgzVTNYRSthNG8NCj1m bThKDQotLS0tLUVORCBQR1AgU0lHTkFUVVJFLS0tLS0NCg== --=_mixed 002406DF482579C7_=-- From jouni.nospam@gmail.com Wed Mar 21 08:20:43 2012 Return-Path: X-Original-To: dmm@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: dmm@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id F1F8821F874F for ; Wed, 21 Mar 2012 08:20:43 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -3.563 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-3.563 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.036, BAYES_00=-2.599, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW=-1] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([12.22.58.30]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com 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Received: by 10.112.104.136 with SMTP id ge8mr1490074lbb.63.1332343241937; Wed, 21 Mar 2012 08:20:41 -0700 (PDT) Received: from [188.117.15.106] ([188.117.15.106]) by mx.google.com with ESMTPS id pj20sm1972426lab.13.2012.03.21.08.20.39 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=OTHER); Wed, 21 Mar 2012 08:20:40 -0700 (PDT) Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v1084) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii From: jouni korhonen In-Reply-To: Date: Wed, 21 Mar 2012 17:20:36 +0200 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Message-Id: References: To: dmm@ietf.org X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.1084) Cc: dmm-chairs@tools.ietf.org Subject: Re: [DMM] Draft agenda uploaded X-BeenThere: dmm@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.12 Precedence: list List-Id: Distributed Mobility Management Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 21 Mar 2012 15:20:44 -0000 Folks, Since the agenda is as packed as it is, the chairs want to see the draft presentations for each agenda slot by the end of Monday (26th). Also there is going to be a slight agenda rearrangement moving draft-liu-dmm-dynamic-anchor-discussion to 09:10 slot. - Jouni & Julien On Mar 14, 2012, at 2:27 AM, Jouni wrote: > Folks, > > The draft agenda is now available: > http://www.ietf.org/proceedings/83/agenda/agenda-83-dmm.txt > > Note that we got quite a few requests for presentations (17) and air > time will be on issue. So, this is what we do: the agenda is split > into topics and drafts are grouped under those. We'd expect a single > joint presentation from each topic slot. That can be a concatenation > of separate presentations with multiple presenters or something more > processed such as combining & comparing related/similar solutions. > The latter approach is preferred(!) and the named presenters are > strongly encouraged to lead the work in coming weeks and glue together > a presentation in a cooperative spirit. Time allocations for each > topic are still a subject to change. > > - Jouni & Julien From jouni.nospam@gmail.com Wed Mar 21 14:01:40 2012 Return-Path: X-Original-To: dmm@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: dmm@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id DA77521E8116 for ; Wed, 21 Mar 2012 14:01:40 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -3.565 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-3.565 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.034, BAYES_00=-2.599, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW=-1] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([12.22.58.30]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id FD5-T2OtKxCk for ; Wed, 21 Mar 2012 14:01:40 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail-lpp01m010-f44.google.com (mail-lpp01m010-f44.google.com [209.85.215.44]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 20C7921E80F5 for ; Wed, 21 Mar 2012 14:01:38 -0700 (PDT) Received: by lagj5 with SMTP id j5so1273638lag.31 for ; Wed, 21 Mar 2012 14:01:38 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20120113; h=from:content-type:content-transfer-encoding:subject:date:references :to:message-id:mime-version:x-mailer; bh=PqZxfFHUvhWnQ7AuMdVnMtAJmlmDeHx0F/rjZU74QCU=; b=eT4zROgj3V0E7p0m8KoecGJx/g8UNlGwpnET+Cia3tuulOC00zCjxUbRY3EIiU0ovr iICyQNgcYYkyTDV66oUw3Ej2ZR4ovvqdJyaewQjRpo6iyuWLV/j+ct/xGjdIiLCDDtu4 Fp0uMXXzYUS5I8X76IbGjOQYGYHhJ9aNAE4ROSoCp60c/khktScF8MCzdo/5lhB5GgU9 ASP32y9oPlJknlIbsg7l6o2jCtkH5+PySsCkIsxpf3DDW5vNCUzlz9ZUpxKEYwZlgMXe k+pO1GZ285sUq/G6Whcn24Lxr4fZjUsxhLPwttukyBrqv64OAWxgeLhZxw1vH2eSCeKe ao4w== Received: by 10.112.104.37 with SMTP id gb5mr1902645lbb.97.1332363698022; Wed, 21 Mar 2012 14:01:38 -0700 (PDT) Received: from [188.117.15.106] ([188.117.15.106]) by mx.google.com with ESMTPS id pb13sm2719047lab.16.2012.03.21.14.01.35 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=OTHER); Wed, 21 Mar 2012 14:01:36 -0700 (PDT) From: jouni korhonen Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Date: Wed, 21 Mar 2012 23:01:33 +0200 References: <20120321161038.2152.28678.idtracker@ietfa.amsl.com> To: dmm@ietf.org Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v1084) X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.1084) Subject: [DMM] IPR Disclosure: Nokia Siemens Networks Oy's Statement about IPR related to draft-korhonen-dmm-local-prefix-00 X-BeenThere: dmm@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.12 Precedence: list List-Id: Distributed Mobility Management Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 21 Mar 2012 21:01:41 -0000 I'd like to make sure everyone is aware of this IPR disclosure: https://datatracker.ietf.org/ipr/1728/ - Jouni From JuanCarlos.Zuniga@InterDigital.com Wed Mar 21 14:14:50 2012 Return-Path: X-Original-To: dmm@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: dmm@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id EF8DE21F875E for ; Wed, 21 Mar 2012 14:14:50 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.708 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.708 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.891, BAYES_00=-2.599] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([12.22.58.30]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id JLZGxQg74FNi for ; Wed, 21 Mar 2012 14:14:50 -0700 (PDT) Received: from idcout.InterDigital.com (smtp-out1.interdigital.com [64.208.228.135]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5B2CB21F8762 for ; Wed, 21 Mar 2012 14:14:50 -0700 (PDT) Received: from SAM.InterDigital.com ([10.30.2.11]) by idcout.InterDigital.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.4675); Wed, 21 Mar 2012 17:14:49 -0400 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft Exchange V6.5 Content-class: urn:content-classes:message MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64 Date: Wed, 21 Mar 2012 17:14:48 -0400 Message-ID: X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: Thread-Topic: IPR Disclosure: InterDigital Patent Holdings, Inc.'s Statement about IPR related todraft-bernardos-dmm-distributed-anchoring-00 Thread-Index: Ac0Gu83g0TG92At4QYKLzEeZKIqq/wA6sBAQ From: "Zuniga, Juan Carlos" To: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 21 Mar 2012 21:14:49.0560 (UTC) FILETIME=[A65C1D80:01CD07A7] Subject: [DMM] IPR Disclosure: InterDigital Patent Holdings, Inc.'s Statement about IPR related todraft-bernardos-dmm-distributed-anchoring-00 X-BeenThere: dmm@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.12 Precedence: list List-Id: Distributed Mobility Management Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 21 Mar 2012 21:14:51 -0000 SSBhbHNvIHdhbnQgdG8gbWFrZSBzdXJlIGV2ZXJ5b25lIGlzIGF3YXJlIG9mIHRoZSBmb2xsb3dp bmcgSVBSIGRpc2Nsb3N1cmU6DQoNCmh0dHBzOi8vZGF0YXRyYWNrZXIuaWV0Zi5vcmcvaXByLzE3 MjQvDQoNCkpjDQoNCg== From sgundave@cisco.com Wed Mar 21 15:59:50 2012 Return-Path: X-Original-To: dmm@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: dmm@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1597421F8562 for ; 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charset="US-ASCII" Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-OriginalArrivalTime: 21 Mar 2012 22:59:35.0932 (UTC) FILETIME=[49545BC0:01CD07B6] Cc: dmm@ietf.org Subject: Re: [DMM] New DMM draft:draft-bernardos-dmm-distributed-anchoring-00.txt X-BeenThere: dmm@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.12 Precedence: list List-Id: Distributed Mobility Management Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 21 Mar 2012 22:59:50 -0000 Hi Pierrick, Catching up on DMM threads, have been sleeping for a while, some comments woke me up :) I agree with you. IMO, to achieve DMM we need: 1.) Localized Gateway Selection. The ability for the network to assign a anchor point closer to the UE location. Ex: Geo-location, RNC ID ... Most already got in Rel-10. 2.) Once the session is created and the UE moves to a new location. There should be a new gateway assignment. The network should continue to advertise both the prefixes, but the advertised prefixes should have the proper color to distinguish between those prefixes. 3.) Network should set up tunneling for the old prefixes, to the prev anchor. It should deprecate the older prefixes. 4.) UE should use enhanced SAS schemes to use the new prefix for the new flows. 5.) Over time, once the old flow die, the tunnel to the prev home is gone and the UE has optimized traffic flows. This introduces simple changes into the mobility architecture and most semantics are already there in one form, or the other. The missing aspect is the type of Address and how we enable the UE to leverage that aspect and make Source Address selection and also for the network to manage those prefixes in a proper way. To that affect, I agree this is one important requirement. -- Regards Sri On 3/19/12 3:16 AM, "pierrick.seite@orange.com" wrote: > I think it is worth to work on solution providing more information on the type > of address. IMHO, it is a requirement for the UE to play with more than one IP > address and select the more appropriate source address according the > topological anchor point. DMM is clearly one use-case but, this feature is > also required for offload purpose in current centralized network based > mobility. The ongoing proposals for RA extensions, that allow to distinguish > anchored from local prefix, are interesting. Now, the UE shall have the > intelligence to make the source address selection according to prefix > properties; at least extensions to RFC3484 may be defined but more > sophisticated selection behavior may be required, typically, policies based > selection, e.g. offload policies. > > Pierrick From sgundave@cisco.com Wed Mar 21 16:07:20 2012 Return-Path: X-Original-To: dmm@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: dmm@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 91F1121E801A; Wed, 21 Mar 2012 16:07:20 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -6.647 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-6.647 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=-0.945, BAYES_00=-2.599, CHARSET_FARAWAY_HEADER=3.2, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, MIME_8BIT_HEADER=0.3, MIME_QP_LONG_LINE=1.396, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_HI=-8] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([12.22.58.30]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id wNgeBv805tmU; Wed, 21 Mar 2012 16:07:19 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mtv-iport-4.cisco.com (mtv-iport-4.cisco.com [173.36.130.15]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id C0FE821F8653; Wed, 21 Mar 2012 16:07:19 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/simple; d=cisco.com; i=sgundave@cisco.com; l=5401; q=dns/txt; s=iport; t=1332371239; x=1333580839; h=date:subject:from:to:cc:message-id:in-reply-to: mime-version; bh=ySDWPysExoNBlX4uWkIsowmU/28jF7e264xbJR9aYNQ=; b=iby6K9zgKfEU6CGBpdwhruUjxBp69MySYzE9dQI9f5IthomIZNXcKaRG 8WyeJA2UTpZVJuyjcR1LfqFfNQow+LDoHmKtFGPTOwmPgKyu5V6nolN+2 qsW+WeO1A5SAULDTVRek7v5ovX9JH921LftJtqJH9Wt9uYBjuQfGk4Awh w=; X-IronPort-Anti-Spam-Filtered: true X-IronPort-Anti-Spam-Result: AgAFAMBeak+rRDoI/2dsb2JhbABEgkazT3qBB4IJAQEBAwESASo8EgEIgRILAQEEAQ0FIodjBAGZCJ5+kGIEiFaNCY4/gWiDBw X-IronPort-AV: E=Sophos;i="4.73,626,1325462400"; d="scan'208,217";a="37052200" Received: from mtv-core-3.cisco.com ([171.68.58.8]) by mtv-iport-4.cisco.com with ESMTP; 21 Mar 2012 23:07:11 +0000 Received: from xbh-sjc-231.amer.cisco.com (xbh-sjc-231.cisco.com [128.107.191.100]) by mtv-core-3.cisco.com (8.14.3/8.14.3) with ESMTP id q2LN7ANX014974; Wed, 21 Mar 2012 23:07:10 GMT Received: from xmb-sjc-214.amer.cisco.com ([171.70.151.145]) by xbh-sjc-231.amer.cisco.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.4675); Wed, 21 Mar 2012 16:07:10 -0700 Received: from 10.32.246.211 ([10.32.246.211]) by xmb-sjc-214.amer.cisco.com ([171.70.151.145]) with Microsoft Exchange Server HTTP-DAV ; Wed, 21 Mar 2012 23:07:10 +0000 User-Agent: Microsoft-Entourage/12.32.0.111121 Date: Wed, 21 Mar 2012 16:07:03 -0700 From: Sri Gundavelli To: , Marco Liebsch , "cjbc@it.uc3m.es" Message-ID: Thread-Topic: [DMM] =?Big5?B?tarOYA==?=: Re: New DMM draft: draft-bernardos-dmm-distributed-anchoring-00.txt Thread-Index: Ac0Ht1PNjoJ8VYSi9EGkV1bU7pC5IQ== In-Reply-To: Mime-version: 1.0 Content-type: multipart/alternative; boundary="B_3415190826_31480302" X-OriginalArrivalTime: 21 Mar 2012 23:07:10.0739 (UTC) FILETIME=[586A6630:01CD07B7] Cc: "dmm@ietf.org" , dmm-bounces@ietf.org Subject: Re: [DMM] =?Big5?B?tarOYA==?=: Re: New DMM draft: draft-bernardos-dmm-distributed-anchoring-00.txt X-BeenThere: dmm@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.12 Precedence: list List-Id: Distributed Mobility Management Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 21 Mar 2012 23:07:20 -0000 > This message is in MIME format. Since your mail reader does not understand this format, some or all of this message may not be legible. --B_3415190826_31480302 Content-type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit Hi Luowen, Address selection is not the property of a MIP client. An host can obtain IP addresses from different prefixes, each prefix has certain properties, exactly as what IPv6 already has, link-local, global .. Now there additional properties, local prefix/home network/CoA/HoA which are mobility specific. So, this has nothing to do with PMIP or CMIP client, but rather about coloring of prefixes and about evolving source address selection rules. Regards Sri On 3/19/12 12:44 AM, "luo.wen@zte.com.cn" wrote: > > Hi Carlos and Marco, > > As Marco said > > *********************************************************************** > So you think that the UE should receive multiple IP addresses and treat them > differently according to the associated topological anchor point? Hmm, yes, > possible. > What about real time streaming and other IP data sessions, which could have a > longer lifetime, they should be anchored than at a central point as well, > right? > If the MN had such intelligence and information, it could treat the HNPs > differently, true. > ****************************************************************************** > * > > > I also think it is possible to let UE treat those multiple IP addresses > differently. Some modification may be needed to let mobile node to have such > intelligence. > But the question is, one of principles of PMIP is not to touch mobile node. > And you know, MIP already supports distinguishing between HoA and CoA in > mobile node. > Since we will touch mobile node anyway, why don't we use MIP directly? > > BR > Luowen --B_3415190826_31480302 Content-type: text/html; charset="US-ASCII" Content-transfer-encoding: quoted-printable Re: [DMM] ??: Re:  New DMM draft: draft-bernardos-dmm-distribut= ed-anchoring-00.txt Hi Luowen,

Address selection is not the property of a MIP client. An host can obtain I= P addresses from different prefixes, each prefix has certain properties, exa= ctly as what IPv6 already has, link-local, global .. Now there additional pr= operties, local prefix/home network/CoA/HoA which are mobility specific. So,= this has nothing to do with PMIP or CMIP client, but rather about coloring = of prefixes and about evolving source address selection rules.



Regards
Sri



On 3/19/12 12:44 AM, "luo.wen@zte.com.cn<= /a>" <luo.wen@zte.com.cn> wrote:=

<= SPAN STYLE=3D'font-size:11pt'>
Hi Carlos and Marco,

As Marco said

*************************************************= **********************
So you think that the UE should receive multiple = IP addresses and treat them
differently according to the associated topological anchor point? Hmm, yes,= possible.
What about real time streaming and other IP data sessions, which could have= a
longer lifetime, they should be anchored than at a central point as well, r= ight?
If the MN had such intelligence and information, it could treat the HNPs di= fferently, true.
*************************************************= ******************************


I also think it is possible to let UE treat those multiple IP addresses dif= ferently. Some modification may be needed to let mobile node to have such in= telligence.
But the question is, one of principles of PMIP is not to touch mobile node.= And you know, MIP already supports distinguishing between HoA and CoA in mo= bile node.
Since we will touch mobile node anyway, why don't we use MIP directly?

BR
Luowen
--B_3415190826_31480302-- From cjbc@it.uc3m.es Wed Mar 21 16:11:52 2012 Return-Path: X-Original-To: dmm@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: dmm@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4191721E8026 for ; Wed, 21 Mar 2012 16:11:52 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -5.699 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-5.699 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=-0.000, BAYES_00=-2.599, J_CHICKENPOX_21=0.6, MIME_8BIT_HEADER=0.3, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-4] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([12.22.58.30]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id hveDTgBwzgnq for ; Wed, 21 Mar 2012 16:11:51 -0700 (PDT) Received: from smtp01.uc3m.es (smtp01.uc3m.es [163.117.176.131]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 48B7E21E8049 for ; Wed, 21 Mar 2012 16:11:50 -0700 (PDT) X-uc3m-safe: yes Received: from [192.168.1.3] (82.158.121.177.dyn.user.ono.com [82.158.121.177]) (using TLSv1 with cipher AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by smtp01.uc3m.es (Postfix) with ESMTP id B7639C2903C; Thu, 22 Mar 2012 00:11:48 +0100 (CET) Message-ID: <1332371508.4088.20.camel@acorde.it.uc3m.es> From: Carlos =?ISO-8859-1?Q?Jes=FAs?= Bernardos Cano To: sarikaya@ieee.org Date: Thu, 22 Mar 2012 00:11:48 +0100 In-Reply-To: References: <1331887784.4259.158.camel@acorde.it.uc3m.es> <1332100749.27721.1.camel@acorde.it.uc3m.es> Organization: Universidad Carlos III de Madrid Content-Type: multipart/signed; micalg="pgp-sha1"; protocol="application/pgp-signature"; boundary="=-zPFbA+NYL+AfvQwKof4E" X-Mailer: Evolution 3.2.2-1 Mime-Version: 1.0 X-TM-AS-Product-Ver: IMSS-7.0.0.3116-6.8.0.1017-18788.002 Cc: "dmm@ietf.org" Subject: Re: [DMM] review of draft-bernardos-dmm-distributed-anchoring-00 X-BeenThere: dmm@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.12 Precedence: list Reply-To: cjbc@it.uc3m.es List-Id: Distributed Mobility Management Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 21 Mar 2012 23:11:52 -0000 --=-zPFbA+NYL+AfvQwKof4E Content-Type: text/plain; charset="ISO-8859-15" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Hi Behcet, On Mon, 2012-03-19 at 11:13 -0500, Behcet Sarikaya wrote: > Hi Carlos, >=20 > On Sun, Mar 18, 2012 at 2:59 PM, Carlos Jes=FAs Bernardos Cano > wrote: > > Hi Behcet, > > > > On Fri, 2012-03-16 at 11:06 -0500, Behcet Sarikaya wrote: > >> Hi Carlos, > >> > >> You say in various places in your draft that your protocol is PMIPv6-b= ased. > >> I wonder how it could be? > > > > More accurately, we could say that the solution is network-based. PMIPv= 6 > > is just one network-based protocol and the solution is specified in the > > draft for PMIPv6. Not sure what your doubt comes from... > > >=20 > If it is network based then I don't understand why MN has a lot to do > in your protocol as Wen has pointed out? AS stated in the draft, the solution is completely network-nased. The MN is a legacy IPv6 node, has nothing to do in our protocol. >=20 >=20 > >> RFC 5213 in Section 7.1 says: > >> Once the address configuration is complete, the mobile node can > >> continue to use this address configuration as long as it is attache= d > >> to the network that is in the scope of that Proxy Mobile IPv6 domai= n. > >> > >> I wonder if MN moved out of PMIPv6 domain in your case? > > > > No, it has not. One of the common assumptions for DMM is that the MN > > does not need address continuity for the whole duration the MN is > > attached to the domain. The idea is to enforce new communications to > > make use of the address anchored closer to where the MN is attached to, > > and to deprecate addresses anchored elsewhere (so they are not needed > > once active communications using them are done). > > >=20 > I guess what you understand from DMM is to put LMA functionality into > MAG and lump the two together into one. That's why MN needs to get an > address in the new MAG/LMA. And all other requirements coming out of > this huge change in PMIPv6. >=20 > However, if you look into IETF work, in such cases MN needs to use > MIPv6 as in http://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-netlmm-mip-interactions= -07 I think I'm not following your rationale to jump from our draft to the MN needing to use MIPv6. Thanks, Carlos >=20 >=20 > Regards, >=20 > Behcet --=20 Carlos Jes=FAs Bernardos Cano http://www.netcom.it.uc3m.es/ GPG FP: D29B 0A6A 639A A561 93CA 4D55 35DC BA4D D170 4F67 --=-zPFbA+NYL+AfvQwKof4E Content-Type: application/pgp-signature; name="signature.asc" Content-Description: This is a digitally signed message part Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.4.12 (GNU/Linux) iEYEABECAAYFAk9qYDQACgkQNdy6TdFwT2dauQCgyALcSdMNTvtBw4GTAhkHa2ok IN8AoJ8T9Mw+feCFsH+R1+Yq7+LeIyBU =ToB8 -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --=-zPFbA+NYL+AfvQwKof4E-- From luo.wen@zte.com.cn Wed Mar 21 18:30:07 2012 Return-Path: X-Original-To: dmm@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: dmm@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id A1A1C21E8011; Wed, 21 Mar 2012 18:30:07 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -92.79 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-92.79 tagged_above=-999 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In-Reply-To: To: Sri Gundavelli MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Lotus Notes Release 6.5.4 March 27, 2005 Message-ID: From: luo.wen@zte.com.cn Date: Thu, 22 Mar 2012 09:29:46 +0800 X-MIMETrack: Serialize by Router on notes_smtp/zte_ltd(Release 8.5.1FP4|July 25, 2010) at 2012-03-22 09:29:55, Serialize complete at 2012-03-22 09:29:55 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="=_alternative 00083A2F482579C9_=" X-MAIL: mse01.zte.com.cn q2M1Ts0R011340 Cc: "dmm@ietf.org" , dmm-bounces@ietf.org Subject: [DMM] =?gb2312?b?tPC4tDogUmU6ICC08Li0OiBSZTogIE5ldyBETU0gZHJhZnQ6?= =?gb2312?b?IGRyYWZ0LWJlcm5hcmRvcy1kbW0tZGlzdHJpYnV0ZWQtYW5jaG9yaW5nLTAw?= =?gb2312?b?LnR4dA==?= X-BeenThere: dmm@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.12 Precedence: list List-Id: Distributed Mobility Management Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 22 Mar 2012 01:30:07 -0000 This is a multipart message in MIME format. --=_alternative 00083A2F482579C9_= 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h=subject:mime-version:content-type:from:in-reply-to:date:cc :content-transfer-encoding:message-id:references:to:x-mailer; bh=PJB6FBheUvl0M+f+NX1eKCSaxeUa7EYhWBuWjkbSP40=; b=nxwo/LeIeVyNGFH3fTZTM9fOnji+Qln3Ml9fTqC3klISClK3w+vBCtS/uZ9vgOwRVB sFDAbBkiCzJwoMDXQMsaH3p7POm85CFgpOdH/pDlivvNKl3iJinBrhuHlU/YaYMzYS7f ZUEm98/GmyqByxAUbzXl5iunteWfwjucn35zTFONohUnv1jXySzlrbQq/NNyKJAcYZY0 JtStKK8qxRyqK0o1hqNn9y7pute+Dl/TC0VSkuQhXlvVNgN211dkDc3ycQm2oMJaxqUN 8EnXEe8QbQkPhWPKDdQwpfhxltuTNDXSY2DxmoePoNxUBnIeMCyPVJtmgspViQfH/o1y nJPg== Received: by 10.112.37.134 with SMTP id y6mr2302582lbj.102.1332397231645; Wed, 21 Mar 2012 23:20:31 -0700 (PDT) Received: from [188.117.15.106] ([188.117.15.106]) by mx.google.com with ESMTPS id je9sm3912248lab.9.2012.03.21.23.20.29 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=OTHER); Wed, 21 Mar 2012 23:20:30 -0700 (PDT) Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v1084) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii From: jouni korhonen In-Reply-To: Date: Thu, 22 Mar 2012 08:20:27 +0200 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Message-Id: References: To: Sri Gundavelli X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.1084) Cc: dmm@ietf.org Subject: Re: [DMM] New DMM draft:draft-bernardos-dmm-distributed-anchoring-00.txt X-BeenThere: dmm@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.12 Precedence: list List-Id: Distributed Mobility Management Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 22 Mar 2012 06:20:33 -0000 Sri, On Mar 22, 2012, at 12:59 AM, Sri Gundavelli wrote: > Hi Pierrick, >=20 > Catching up on DMM threads, have been sleeping for a while, some = comments > woke me up :) >=20 >=20 > I agree with you. IMO, to achieve DMM we need: >=20 > 1.) Localized Gateway Selection. The ability for the network to assign = a > anchor point closer to the UE location. Ex: Geo-location, RNC ID ... = Most > already got in Rel-10. >=20 > 2.) Once the session is created and the UE moves to a new location. = There > should be a new gateway assignment. The network should continue to Assuming most of the applications/communication would be happy with addresses that come and go within a limited but not too small area.. say a L2 segment that contains multiple access points. How important it is then to reassign the "wide area mobility providing" anchor for the remaining flows? I would also keep the minimizing tunneling setup and amount of tunnel state in the network as one design criteria. > advertise both the prefixes, but the advertised prefixes should have = the > proper color to distinguish between those prefixes. Agree. > 3.) Network should set up tunneling for the old prefixes, to the prev > anchor. It should deprecate the older prefixes. See above about tunnels. These tunnels are essentially per prefix (or even per address?) and a MN might soon be dragging quite few of those along when it moves. I am a bit worried that the excess tunneling is what we easily end up with.. > 4.) UE should use enhanced SAS schemes to use the new prefix for the = new > flows. If you manage to deprecate an old prefix in 3) then new prefixes in 4) = are preferred automatically.. assuming the end host does existing RFC3484 to any decent level. > 5.) Over time, once the old flow die, the tunnel to the prev home is = gone > and the UE has optimized traffic flows. >=20 > This introduces simple changes into the mobility architecture and most > semantics are already there in one form, or the other. The missing = aspect is > the type of Address and how we enable the UE to leverage that aspect = and > make Source Address selection and also for the network to manage those > prefixes in a proper way. To that affect, I agree this is one = important > requirement. - Jouni >=20 >=20 >=20 > --=20 > Regards > Sri >=20 >=20 >=20 >=20 >=20 > On 3/19/12 3:16 AM, "pierrick.seite@orange.com" = > wrote: >=20 >> I think it is worth to work on solution providing more information on = the type >> of address. IMHO, it is a requirement for the UE to play with more = than one IP >> address and select the more appropriate source address according the >> topological anchor point. DMM is clearly one use-case but, this = feature is >> also required for offload purpose in current centralized network = based >> mobility. The ongoing proposals for RA extensions, that allow to = distinguish >> anchored from local prefix, are interesting. Now, the UE shall have = the >> intelligence to make the source address selection according to prefix >> properties; at least extensions to RFC3484 may be defined but more >> sophisticated selection behavior may be required, typically, policies = based >> selection, e.g. offload policies. >>=20 >> Pierrick >=20 From sarikaya2012@gmail.com Thu Mar 22 09:50:16 2012 Return-Path: X-Original-To: dmm@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: dmm@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1CEB421F85D7 for ; Thu, 22 Mar 2012 09:50:16 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -3.565 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-3.565 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.034, BAYES_00=-2.599, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW=-1] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([12.22.58.30]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id KS26kW1kIvCE for ; Thu, 22 Mar 2012 09:50:13 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail-yw0-f44.google.com (mail-yw0-f44.google.com [209.85.213.44]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id A444F21F8602 for ; Thu, 22 Mar 2012 09:50:13 -0700 (PDT) Received: by yhkk25 with SMTP id k25so2143907yhk.31 for ; Thu, 22 Mar 2012 09:50:13 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20120113; h=mime-version:reply-to:in-reply-to:references:date:message-id :subject:from:to:cc:content-type:content-transfer-encoding; bh=WYxW8PAF1rXmaDl6mAAP3TAAkVdp3crZt8fHVqkxV04=; b=JMXRoVXOp1va0sMi0WXQbwZXsR2anr7VmsCz5RM8/NUblCUKHthJhPRpRqZawrXlif nGd/pOeKV3zlNJP11UrNYWsSv5CbREknMxQTD3/GMAPvIUhFE33ZaDW59ivzpgGryABW ow+N0bUirhpuK7IuZoS6gSZu/Xp3uWJhaS+qvEecg3o0RofxUj4eiFNKyV+vYySfHeAQ fePfh+atGwnNLtgatO4cUonE/MASE1ahmxPv+pQO/WEtI6D28n1/YXE90OQa5/ffTjpO FukhYtkggwTs5pBwJrpNi1uLZbbp8NGeK2rbLVE0uHDPFr1f4YgA4fs4Aj+TdfS9JmFS 1Jfw== MIME-Version: 1.0 Received: by 10.50.189.129 with SMTP id gi1mr2508298igc.16.1332435013070; Thu, 22 Mar 2012 09:50:13 -0700 (PDT) Received: by 10.231.179.71 with HTTP; Thu, 22 Mar 2012 09:50:12 -0700 (PDT) In-Reply-To: <1332371508.4088.20.camel@acorde.it.uc3m.es> References: <1331887784.4259.158.camel@acorde.it.uc3m.es> <1332100749.27721.1.camel@acorde.it.uc3m.es> <1332371508.4088.20.camel@acorde.it.uc3m.es> Date: Thu, 22 Mar 2012 11:50:12 -0500 Message-ID: From: Behcet Sarikaya To: cjbc@it.uc3m.es Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Cc: "dmm@ietf.org" Subject: Re: [DMM] review of draft-bernardos-dmm-distributed-anchoring-00 X-BeenThere: dmm@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.12 Precedence: list Reply-To: sarikaya@ieee.org List-Id: Distributed Mobility Management Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 22 Mar 2012 16:50:16 -0000 Hi Carlos, On Wed, Mar 21, 2012 at 6:11 PM, Carlos Jes=FAs Bernardos Cano wrote: > Hi Behcet, > > On Mon, 2012-03-19 at 11:13 -0500, Behcet Sarikaya wrote: >> Hi Carlos, >> >> On Sun, Mar 18, 2012 at 2:59 PM, Carlos Jes=FAs Bernardos Cano >> wrote: >> > Hi Behcet, >> > >> > On Fri, 2012-03-16 at 11:06 -0500, Behcet Sarikaya wrote: >> >> Hi Carlos, >> >> >> >> You say in various places in your draft that your protocol is PMIPv6-= based. >> >> I wonder how it could be? >> > >> > More accurately, we could say that the solution is network-based. PMIP= v6 >> > is just one network-based protocol and the solution is specified in th= e >> > draft for PMIPv6. Not sure what your doubt comes from... >> > >> >> If it is network based then I don't understand why MN has a lot to do >> in your protocol as Wen has pointed out? > > AS stated in the draft, the solution is completely network-nased. The MN > is a legacy IPv6 node, has nothing to do in our protocol. > >> >> >> >> RFC 5213 in Section 7.1 says: >> >> Once the address configuration is complete, the mobile node can >> >> =A0 =A0continue to use this address configuration as long as it is at= tached >> >> =A0 =A0to the network that is in the scope of that Proxy Mobile IPv6 = domain. >> >> >> >> I wonder if MN moved out of PMIPv6 domain in your case? >> > >> > No, it has not. One of the common assumptions for DMM is that the MN >> > does not need address continuity for the whole duration the MN is >> > attached to the domain. The idea is to enforce new communications to >> > make use of the address anchored closer to where the MN is attached to= , >> > and to deprecate addresses anchored elsewhere (so they are not needed >> > once active communications using them are done). >> > >> >> I guess what you understand from DMM is to put LMA functionality into >> MAG and lump the two together into one. That's why MN needs to get an >> address in the new MAG/LMA. And all other requirements coming out of >> this huge change in PMIPv6. >> >> However, if you look into IETF work, in such cases MN needs to use >> MIPv6 as in http://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-netlmm-mip-interaction= s-07 > > I think I'm not following your rationale to jump from our draft to the > MN needing to use MIPv6. In your new draft draft-bernardos-dmm-distributed-anchoring-00, you already admit that D-GW is a MAG and LMA combined. Actually it is also very much like HA in draft-sarikaya-dmm-dmipv6-00. Because of the MN in Fig.1 configures PrefA (this one is normal PMIPv6) and then again configures PrefB (and keeps using PrefA) which is where the trick is. PMIPv6 is network-based and this is achieved with having two distinct entities of MAG and LMA. Then you don't need much from MN in such an architecture with such assumptions. However if you change these basic assumptions and have D-GW and make it a single entity mobility protocol then you can not claim it is network-based any more because it simply is not. I think that there are similar concerns on draft-seite-dmm-dma-00 and draft-liebsch-mext-dmm-nat-phl (I have not checked this one yet). What is interesting is that with D-GW becoming like HA, all these protocols become very similar to the distributed MIPv6 protocol. Regards, Behcet From JuanCarlos.Zuniga@InterDigital.com Thu Mar 22 12:21:32 2012 Return-Path: X-Original-To: dmm@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: dmm@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9807021E801F for ; Thu, 22 Mar 2012 12:21:31 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.797 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.797 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.802, BAYES_00=-2.599] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([12.22.58.30]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id ixFmSE-XUs64 for ; Thu, 22 Mar 2012 12:21:30 -0700 (PDT) Received: from idcout.InterDigital.com (smtp-out1.interdigital.com [64.208.228.135]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2AC3521E801B for ; Thu, 22 Mar 2012 12:21:30 -0700 (PDT) Received: from SAM.InterDigital.com ([10.30.2.11]) by idcout.InterDigital.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.4675); Thu, 22 Mar 2012 15:21:29 -0400 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft Exchange V6.5 Content-class: urn:content-classes:message MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Date: Thu, 22 Mar 2012 15:21:28 -0400 Message-ID: In-reply-to: X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: Thread-Topic: [DMM] review of draft-bernardos-dmm-distributed-anchoring-00 Thread-Index: Ac0IS+KqR+JtS73xSxuA41InKh1xdQAFIlcg References: <1331887784.4259.158.camel@acorde.it.uc3m.es><1332100749.27721.1.camel@acorde.it.uc3m.es><1332371508.4088.20.camel@acorde.it.uc3m.es> From: "Zuniga, Juan Carlos" To: , X-OriginalArrivalTime: 22 Mar 2012 19:21:29.0755 (UTC) FILETIME=[FBC5F6B0:01CD0860] Cc: dmm@ietf.org Subject: Re: [DMM] review of draft-bernardos-dmm-distributed-anchoring-00 X-BeenThere: dmm@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.12 Precedence: list List-Id: Distributed Mobility Management Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 22 Mar 2012 19:21:32 -0000 Hi Behcet, > -----Original Message----- > From: dmm-bounces@ietf.org [mailto:dmm-bounces@ietf.org] On Behalf Of > Behcet Sarikaya > Sent: Thursday, March 22, 2012 12:50 PM > To: cjbc@it.uc3m.es > Cc: dmm@ietf.org > Subject: Re: [DMM] review of = draft-bernardos-dmm-distributed-anchoring- > 00 >=20 > Hi Carlos, >=20 > On Wed, Mar 21, 2012 at 6:11 PM, Carlos Jes=FAs Bernardos Cano > wrote: > > Hi Behcet, > > > > On Mon, 2012-03-19 at 11:13 -0500, Behcet Sarikaya wrote: > >> Hi Carlos, > >> > >> On Sun, Mar 18, 2012 at 2:59 PM, Carlos Jes=FAs Bernardos Cano > >> wrote: > >> > Hi Behcet, > >> > > >> > On Fri, 2012-03-16 at 11:06 -0500, Behcet Sarikaya wrote: > >> >> Hi Carlos, > >> >> > >> >> You say in various places in your draft that your protocol is > PMIPv6-based. > >> >> I wonder how it could be? > >> > > >> > More accurately, we could say that the solution is network-based. > PMIPv6 > >> > is just one network-based protocol and the solution is specified > in the > >> > draft for PMIPv6. Not sure what your doubt comes from... > >> > > >> > >> If it is network based then I don't understand why MN has a lot to > do > >> in your protocol as Wen has pointed out? > > > > AS stated in the draft, the solution is completely network-nased. = The > MN > > is a legacy IPv6 node, has nothing to do in our protocol. > > > >> > >> > >> >> RFC 5213 in Section 7.1 says: > >> >> Once the address configuration is complete, the mobile node can > >> >> =A0 =A0continue to use this address configuration as long as it = is > attached > >> >> =A0 =A0to the network that is in the scope of that Proxy Mobile = IPv6 > domain. > >> >> > >> >> I wonder if MN moved out of PMIPv6 domain in your case? > >> > > >> > No, it has not. One of the common assumptions for DMM is that the > MN > >> > does not need address continuity for the whole duration the MN is > >> > attached to the domain. The idea is to enforce new communications > to > >> > make use of the address anchored closer to where the MN is > attached to, > >> > and to deprecate addresses anchored elsewhere (so they are not > needed > >> > once active communications using them are done). > >> > > >> > >> I guess what you understand from DMM is to put LMA functionality > into > >> MAG and lump the two together into one. That's why MN needs to get > an > >> address in the new MAG/LMA. And all other requirements coming out = of > >> this huge change in PMIPv6. > >> > >> However, if you look into IETF work, in such cases MN needs to use > >> MIPv6 as in http://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-netlmm-mip- > interactions-07 > > > > I think I'm not following your rationale to jump from our draft to > the > > MN needing to use MIPv6. >=20 > In your new draft draft-bernardos-dmm-distributed-anchoring-00, you > already admit that D-GW is a MAG and LMA combined. Actually it is also > very much like HA in draft-sarikaya-dmm-dmipv6-00. >=20 > Because of the MN in Fig.1 configures PrefA (this one is normal = PMIPv6) > and >=20 > then again configures PrefB (and keeps using PrefA) which is where > the trick is. >=20 > PMIPv6 is network-based and this is achieved with having two distinct > entities of MAG and LMA. Then you don't need much from MN in such an > architecture with such assumptions. [JCZ] Agree >=20 > However if you change these basic assumptions and have D-GW and make > it a single entity mobility protocol then you can not claim it is > network-based any more because it simply is not. >=20 [JCZ] I think that Carlos refers to the fact that the changes are on the = network side and we have not introduced any MN functionality. Hence, = this is a network-based approach. > I think that there are similar concerns on draft-seite-dmm-dma-00 and > draft-liebsch-mext-dmm-nat-phl (I have not checked this one yet). >=20 > What is interesting is that with D-GW becoming like HA, all these > protocols become very similar to the distributed MIPv6 protocol. [JCZ] Again, we are not introducing MN changes in the draft, so I don't = think it maps to a client-MIP approach. Regards, Juan-Carlos >=20 > Regards, >=20 > Behcet > _______________________________________________ > dmm mailing list > dmm@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dmm From sarikaya2012@gmail.com Thu Mar 22 12:39:29 2012 Return-Path: X-Original-To: dmm@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: dmm@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9817821F85C6 for ; Thu, 22 Mar 2012 12:39:29 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -3.566 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-3.566 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.033, BAYES_00=-2.599, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW=-1] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([12.22.58.30]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id K2qaX6mQu7UB for ; Thu, 22 Mar 2012 12:39:28 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail-yx0-f172.google.com (mail-yx0-f172.google.com [209.85.213.172]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4865121F85B1 for ; Thu, 22 Mar 2012 12:39:28 -0700 (PDT) Received: by yenm5 with SMTP id m5so2362381yen.31 for ; Thu, 22 Mar 2012 12:39:27 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20120113; h=mime-version:reply-to:in-reply-to:references:date:message-id :subject:from:to:cc:content-type:content-transfer-encoding; bh=HwyGxoztx9Vi7WTFEjjzRziUsshH0k1pykyk/gGLtjg=; b=vcFnmbNh1RH5QujzI78GiDqtMcpscpSgfLdYvZd5N2J5cjKRYrScD1vcgOrUms79I4 itgPkfAtR9NN7BKuPoMXVBwEEOG/QvRawmn/lO+zOTS6WxWLBL4cni0hd6mVKt3IDRUP IAuu2lK4M/I15t6OXSNxU0CSYPwAajRnvnR/mM+8izGmETErAoJeUmgZncXvaxqddmh/ QKEZXMb3jZLcVsxmuJAEi8Ki4vkmRPChY1aYLMerVw/19qeN3YAZtvEjz/cVxgwELs7u oSnqVGpg/TzI+ZGX51u5yXrB4oF/p/sTWn3DJn4QJChmEduqE/XHb2g4p3owx9No/oNM aiYg== MIME-Version: 1.0 Received: by 10.50.222.131 with SMTP id qm3mr9085igc.66.1332445167539; Thu, 22 Mar 2012 12:39:27 -0700 (PDT) Received: by 10.231.179.71 with HTTP; Thu, 22 Mar 2012 12:39:27 -0700 (PDT) In-Reply-To: References: <1331887784.4259.158.camel@acorde.it.uc3m.es> <1332100749.27721.1.camel@acorde.it.uc3m.es> <1332371508.4088.20.camel@acorde.it.uc3m.es> Date: Thu, 22 Mar 2012 14:39:27 -0500 Message-ID: From: Behcet Sarikaya To: "Zuniga, Juan Carlos" Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Cc: dmm@ietf.org Subject: Re: [DMM] review of draft-bernardos-dmm-distributed-anchoring-00 X-BeenThere: dmm@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.12 Precedence: list Reply-To: sarikaya@ieee.org List-Id: Distributed Mobility Management Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 22 Mar 2012 19:39:29 -0000 Hi JC, >> In your new draft draft-bernardos-dmm-distributed-anchoring-00, you >> already admit that D-GW is a MAG and LMA combined. Actually it is also >> very much like HA in draft-sarikaya-dmm-dmipv6-00. >> >> Because of the MN in Fig.1 configures PrefA (this one is normal PMIPv6) >> and >> >> =A0then again configures PrefB (and keeps using PrefA) which is where >> the trick is. >> >> PMIPv6 is network-based and this is achieved with having two distinct >> entities of MAG and LMA. Then you don't need much from MN in such an >> architecture with such assumptions. > > [JCZ] Agree So you agree with this but .. > >> >> However if you change these basic assumptions and have D-GW and make >> it a single entity mobility protocol then you can not claim it is >> network-based any more because it simply is not. >> > > [JCZ] I think that Carlos refers to the fact that the changes are on the = network side and we have not introduced any MN functionality. Hence, this i= s a network-based approach. > >> I think that there are similar concerns on draft-seite-dmm-dma-00 and >> draft-liebsch-mext-dmm-nat-phl (I have not checked this one yet). >> >> What is interesting is that with D-GW becoming like HA, all these >> protocols become very similar to the distributed MIPv6 protocol. > > [JCZ] Again, we are not introducing MN changes in the draft, so I don't t= hink it maps to a client-MIP approach. > I challenge you to remove all MN related text (I think Wen pointed out almost all of them) from the draft and say that considerations in Section 7 of RFC 5213 apply. How about that? Behcet From JuanCarlos.Zuniga@InterDigital.com Thu Mar 22 12:57:45 2012 Return-Path: X-Original-To: dmm@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: dmm@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4AA6E21F85E6 for ; Thu, 22 Mar 2012 12:57:45 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.87 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.87 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.729, BAYES_00=-2.599] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([12.22.58.30]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 6TThbkkCnrTm for ; Thu, 22 Mar 2012 12:57:44 -0700 (PDT) Received: from idcout.InterDigital.com (smtp-out1.interdigital.com [64.208.228.135]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8F09621F85B6 for ; Thu, 22 Mar 2012 12:57:44 -0700 (PDT) Received: from SAM.InterDigital.com ([10.30.2.11]) by idcout.InterDigital.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.4675); Thu, 22 Mar 2012 15:57:43 -0400 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft Exchange V6.5 Content-class: urn:content-classes:message MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Date: Thu, 22 Mar 2012 15:57:42 -0400 Message-ID: In-reply-to: X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: Thread-Topic: [DMM] review of draft-bernardos-dmm-distributed-anchoring-00 Thread-Index: Ac0IY4CLAj/Lz6R2Sma04mfwHCPFLAAAU7Yg References: <1331887784.4259.158.camel@acorde.it.uc3m.es><1332100749.27721.1.camel@acorde.it.uc3m.es><1332371508.4088.20.camel@acorde.it.uc3m.es> From: "Zuniga, Juan Carlos" To: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 22 Mar 2012 19:57:43.0741 (UTC) FILETIME=[0B91E6D0:01CD0866] Cc: dmm@ietf.org Subject: Re: [DMM] review of draft-bernardos-dmm-distributed-anchoring-00 X-BeenThere: dmm@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.12 Precedence: list List-Id: Distributed Mobility Management Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 22 Mar 2012 19:57:45 -0000 Hi Behcet, > -----Original Message----- > From: Behcet Sarikaya [mailto:sarikaya2012@gmail.com] > Sent: Thursday, March 22, 2012 3:39 PM > To: Zuniga, Juan Carlos > Cc: cjbc@it.uc3m.es; dmm@ietf.org > Subject: Re: [DMM] review of = draft-bernardos-dmm-distributed-anchoring- > 00 >=20 > Hi JC, >=20 >=20 > >> In your new draft draft-bernardos-dmm-distributed-anchoring-00, you > >> already admit that D-GW is a MAG and LMA combined. Actually it is > also > >> very much like HA in draft-sarikaya-dmm-dmipv6-00. > >> > >> Because of the MN in Fig.1 configures PrefA (this one is normal > PMIPv6) > >> and > >> > >> =A0then again configures PrefB (and keeps using PrefA) which is = where > >> the trick is. > >> > >> PMIPv6 is network-based and this is achieved with having two > distinct > >> entities of MAG and LMA. Then you don't need much from MN in such = an > >> architecture with such assumptions. > > > > [JCZ] Agree >=20 > So you agree with this but .. >=20 > > > >> > >> However if you change these basic assumptions and have D-GW and = make > >> it a single entity mobility protocol then you can not claim it is > >> network-based any more because it simply is not. > >> > > > > [JCZ] I think that Carlos refers to the fact that the changes are on > the network side and we have not introduced any MN functionality. > Hence, this is a network-based approach. > > > >> I think that there are similar concerns on draft-seite-dmm-dma-00 > and > >> draft-liebsch-mext-dmm-nat-phl (I have not checked this one yet). > >> > >> What is interesting is that with D-GW becoming like HA, all these > >> protocols become very similar to the distributed MIPv6 protocol. > > > > [JCZ] Again, we are not introducing MN changes in the draft, so I > don't think it maps to a client-MIP approach. > > >=20 > I challenge you to remove all MN related text (I think Wen pointed out > almost all of them) from the draft and say that considerations in > Section 7 of RFC 5213 apply. >=20 > How about that? [JCZ] RFC 5213 does have non-normative MN-related text in multiple = sections (beyond section 7), which is needed to understand the PMIPv6 = concept. The same applies to our draft, which builds on top of RFC 5213 = and the NETEXT extensions. I believe it would be redundant to repeat the = same considerations. >=20 > Behcet From sarikaya2012@gmail.com Thu Mar 22 13:15:15 2012 Return-Path: X-Original-To: dmm@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: dmm@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id AF32821F8568 for ; Thu, 22 Mar 2012 13:15:15 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -3.567 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-3.567 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.032, BAYES_00=-2.599, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW=-1] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([12.22.58.30]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id IZckW4SDvHCu for ; Thu, 22 Mar 2012 13:15:15 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail-gy0-f172.google.com (mail-gy0-f172.google.com [209.85.160.172]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2A38C21F8486 for ; Thu, 22 Mar 2012 13:15:15 -0700 (PDT) Received: by ghbg16 with SMTP id g16so2408992ghb.31 for ; Thu, 22 Mar 2012 13:15:14 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20120113; h=mime-version:reply-to:in-reply-to:references:date:message-id :subject:from:to:cc:content-type; bh=jlFVgZ1mVpeuiavM2nB4JAWxIF29DI972FFrrTGyNeI=; b=MX+DSHKC+htD1yYj2UvBUr/P9oS9MjAj5GX/5FLlWxeCop23T0U1gc5nCqGi5k4oKn VYaREhxua0Iv8wUIv2MsEfrBdgQ/6dAca4L24J7AMBNSNFPF+35omFDRAWvdvqW3De0R OjE35PeizBNdCDqNc/ypoGg9nvhbCGcUuxCrJOXUXuG2ylJjoGruBO3f5SMHj7r39c7G TfoH/Wi4IX1WvPoM0TPAEtLSI+GZ7DTemtitpi3ZJcDAs2B1jIR19maTand+Kz/1PR7i 08FlN70r5tYb4c91Koef2AVzdVyoJ8CvIJYLjM8TtSYZ4h3yzjmWSe08SRLy2puRMgwe ZmDw== MIME-Version: 1.0 Received: by 10.50.189.129 with SMTP id gi1mr179063igc.16.1332447314662; Thu, 22 Mar 2012 13:15:14 -0700 (PDT) Received: by 10.231.179.71 with HTTP; Thu, 22 Mar 2012 13:15:14 -0700 (PDT) In-Reply-To: References: <1331887784.4259.158.camel@acorde.it.uc3m.es> <1332100749.27721.1.camel@acorde.it.uc3m.es> <1332371508.4088.20.camel@acorde.it.uc3m.es> Date: Thu, 22 Mar 2012 15:15:14 -0500 Message-ID: From: Behcet Sarikaya To: "Zuniga, Juan Carlos" Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Cc: dmm@ietf.org Subject: Re: [DMM] review of draft-bernardos-dmm-distributed-anchoring-00 X-BeenThere: dmm@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.12 Precedence: list Reply-To: sarikaya@ieee.org List-Id: Distributed Mobility Management Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 22 Mar 2012 20:15:15 -0000 Hi JC, >> I challenge you to remove all MN related text (I think Wen pointed out >> almost all of them) from the draft and say that considerations in >> Section 7 of RFC 5213 apply. >> >> How about that? > > [JCZ] RFC 5213 does have non-normative MN-related text in multiple sections (beyond section 7), Yes, like section 6.2, 6.5, 6.6, 6.13 and 8.6. > which is needed to understand the PMIPv6 concept. The same applies to our draft, which builds on top of RFC 5213 and the NETEXT extensions. I believe it would be redundant to repeat the same considerations. > I am OK if you can say that say that considerations in Section 7, 6.2, 6.5, 6.6, 6.13 and 8.6.of RFC 5213 apply. That would settle things. For example you are gonna have to remove configures Pref B and others. Regards, Behcet From sarikaya2012@gmail.com Fri Mar 23 08:55:36 2012 Return-Path: X-Original-To: dmm@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: dmm@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id CB8AF21F8597; Fri, 23 Mar 2012 08:55:36 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -3.568 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-3.568 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.031, BAYES_00=-2.599, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW=-1] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([12.22.58.30]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id npiY2egdMBc1; Fri, 23 Mar 2012 08:55:32 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail-iy0-f172.google.com (mail-iy0-f172.google.com [209.85.210.172]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1E0E621F857A; Fri, 23 Mar 2012 08:55:32 -0700 (PDT) Received: by iazz13 with SMTP id z13so5679491iaz.31 for ; Fri, 23 Mar 2012 08:55:31 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20120113; h=mime-version:reply-to:date:message-id:subject:from:to:cc :content-type; bh=y3PclEIu+XdLv3VPjFNOHZs0r8+OsImn+z/SUtUDkkk=; b=XH5ViN806RBefSL8L5PQ8PCtSglJEuQl0NHbJ05XcBGVWqc8mGNT8IpYuAUsVP1Gbf 5dvjV86/n9TJQf8iL7PIwYqVDprwRIIZUlR7pNEZB1Bu6rZvtdaL1ZXw1bb118aPD2qk XR98i/FeeLcC+caOm41cDCLC/f0s92PiJ9lxDoo1/NOMs8AnvYmLAl9tsEz2fV5ssWgE /CnWX1ySzquhrTEh+70ikPYy7enOht3K6KwLR+FFWlB8ySEg8saH72JxEMV+jfN+Zk4W qnhJmlsi5Da+WJGDYW6JqbiNbP9nBT3cLj3fHNw3Dy8yznbKVqYnJf6RfodndN4dazXP AUlw== MIME-Version: 1.0 Received: by 10.50.189.129 with SMTP id gi1mr2551299igc.16.1332518131809; Fri, 23 Mar 2012 08:55:31 -0700 (PDT) Received: by 10.231.179.71 with HTTP; Fri, 23 Mar 2012 08:55:31 -0700 (PDT) Date: Fri, 23 Mar 2012 10:55:31 -0500 Message-ID: From: Behcet Sarikaya To: Internet Area Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Cc: netext@ietf.org, mip4@ietf.org, multimob@ietf.org, dmm@ietf.org Subject: [DMM] FMC Side Meeting Announcement X-BeenThere: dmm@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.12 Precedence: list Reply-To: sarikaya@ieee.org List-Id: Distributed Mobility Management Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 23 Mar 2012 15:55:36 -0000 Side meeting on Fixed Mobile Convergence will take place on Thursday March 29, 2012 from 18:10 to 20:00 at room 212-213. The agenda and materials are posted at: http://www-etud.iro.umontreal.ca/~sarikaya/fmc/fmc.html Come and join us in this meeting. Behcet & Dirk From karagian@cs.utwente.nl Sun Mar 25 05:38:53 2012 Return-Path: X-Original-To: dmm@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: dmm@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id BE9C321F847B for ; Sun, 25 Mar 2012 05:38:53 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: 0.241 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=0.241 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=-0.745, BAYES_05=-1.11, HELO_EQ_NL=0.55, HOST_EQ_NL=1.545, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([12.22.58.30]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id HZkNhf3RigL0 for ; Sun, 25 Mar 2012 05:38:53 -0700 (PDT) Received: from EXEDGE01.ad.utwente.nl (exedge01.ad.utwente.nl [130.89.5.48]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id E30AA21F847A for ; Sun, 25 Mar 2012 05:38:52 -0700 (PDT) Received: from EXHUB01.ad.utwente.nl (130.89.4.228) by EXEDGE01.ad.utwente.nl (130.89.5.48) with Microsoft SMTP Server (TLS) id 14.1.339.1; Sun, 25 Mar 2012 14:38:53 +0200 Received: from EXMBX04.ad.utwente.nl ([169.254.4.113]) by EXHUB01.ad.utwente.nl ([130.89.4.228]) with mapi id 14.01.0339.001; Sun, 25 Mar 2012 14:38:51 +0200 From: To: Thread-Topic: cross-operator DMM support? Thread-Index: Ac0KhDuFgBYZX63MQcqdpzMNtPseAA== Date: Sun, 25 Mar 2012 12:38:51 +0000 Message-ID: Accept-Language: nl-NL, en-US Content-Language: nl-NL X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: x-originating-ip: [83.202.83.1] Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="_000_FF1A9612A94D5C4A81ED7DE1039AB80F26C25CB1EXMBX04adutwent_" MIME-Version: 1.0 Subject: [DMM] cross-operator DMM support? X-BeenThere: dmm@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.12 Precedence: list List-Id: Distributed Mobility Management Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sun, 25 Mar 2012 12:38:53 -0000 --_000_FF1A9612A94D5C4A81ED7DE1039AB80F26C25CB1EXMBX04adutwent_ Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Hi all, I was reading the charter of DMM, and I could not find any information on t= he following issue: Is the DMM WG also considering the support of cross-operator DMM solutions,= which include distributed storage and distributed user and mobility inform= ation as well as cross-operated mobility management? Best regards, Georgios --_000_FF1A9612A94D5C4A81ED7DE1039AB80F26C25CB1EXMBX04adutwent_ Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

Hi all,

 

I was reading the charter of DMM, and I could not fi= nd any information on the following issue:

 

Is the DMM WG also considering the support of cross-= operator DMM solutions, which include distributed storage and distributed user and mobility information as well as cross-ope= rated mobility management?

 

Best regards,

Georgios

--_000_FF1A9612A94D5C4A81ED7DE1039AB80F26C25CB1EXMBX04adutwent_-- From sarikaya2012@gmail.com Sun Mar 25 13:41:09 2012 Return-Path: X-Original-To: dmm@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: dmm@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9BBCE21E801B; Sun, 25 Mar 2012 13:41:09 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -3.569 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-3.569 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.030, BAYES_00=-2.599, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW=-1] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([12.22.58.30]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id gD7Ca-8Az6OK; Sun, 25 Mar 2012 13:41:09 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail-iy0-f172.google.com (mail-iy0-f172.google.com [209.85.210.172]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id A91E321E801A; Sun, 25 Mar 2012 13:41:08 -0700 (PDT) Received: by iazz13 with SMTP id z13so8527345iaz.31 for ; Sun, 25 Mar 2012 13:41:08 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20120113; h=mime-version:reply-to:date:message-id:subject:from:to:cc :content-type; bh=rm5Ri9JI8gtkv5QlDwhU9Y8LU4mFzLqS4ANJdv+qAF4=; b=ZHSaz6+K0+qNKZJ6spN0cPIL5q+Ghg+Wf4N19NKGD+G+eDYA5c0dj/qTyk6VY+VuhJ LZg/sbCQVOO9au0Au6tmmRjbi4Gm8CTZzOo1G0Rxuh87OYvDzJXKScdUQmjZ2AjLlA/z umk49ryUg0jEbtm17kpKrDYH7TaHJZYvPrcn1XK4s5VWnnOQKSrj3kla/lIhjjJ9dC/8 RhHZ0RdvcRuegH+Cok+IGlKxikBMMugC3i39VPB1j106MCZOivpeJW8ul2cFH2yfDnYf O1Z9/XLJGWCmb9EzlAg7cQoM8898XvxkWr9wON5Co24R2xRrEKjTXAsk49NEBpoa+667 6I0w== MIME-Version: 1.0 Received: by 10.50.203.99 with SMTP id kp3mr3951191igc.16.1332708068305; Sun, 25 Mar 2012 13:41:08 -0700 (PDT) Received: by 10.231.179.71 with HTTP; Sun, 25 Mar 2012 13:41:08 -0700 (PDT) Date: Sun, 25 Mar 2012 15:41:08 -0500 Message-ID: From: Behcet Sarikaya To: Internet Area Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Cc: netext@ietf.org, mip4@ietf.org, multimob@ietf.org, dmm@ietf.org Subject: [DMM] FMC Final Date & Time: Tuesday X-BeenThere: dmm@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.12 Precedence: list Reply-To: sarikaya@ieee.org List-Id: Distributed Mobility Management Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sun, 25 Mar 2012 20:41:09 -0000 IETF could not find us an appropriate room so as a result we will hold FMC meeting at the original time. Details are below: Tuesday March 27 at 19:30 or 7:30 Meet at Hotel Concorde Lobby Take a look at the materials at the link given below. On Fri, Mar 23, 2012 at 10:55 AM, Behcet Sarikaya wrote: > Side meeting on Fixed Mobile Convergence will take place on Thursday > March 29, 2012 > from 18:10 to 20:00 at room 212-213. > > The agenda and materials are posted at: > http://www-etud.iro.umontreal.ca/~sarikaya/fmc/fmc.html > > Come and join us in this meeting. Behcet & Dirk From yanshen8785@163.com Sun Mar 25 18:59:02 2012 Return-Path: X-Original-To: dmm@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: dmm@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 259B121E8019 for ; Sun, 25 Mar 2012 18:59:02 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: 2.79 X-Spam-Level: ** X-Spam-Status: No, score=2.79 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_50=0.001, CN_BODY_35=0.339, MIME_CHARSET_FARAWAY=2.45] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([12.22.58.30]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id I4etBJ54rjNH for ; Sun, 25 Mar 2012 18:59:01 -0700 (PDT) Received: from m50-133.163.com (m50-133.163.com [123.125.50.133]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9B57721E8018 for ; Sun, 25 Mar 2012 18:58:59 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=163.com; s=s110527; h=Received:From:To:Subject:Date:Message-ID: MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding:Thread-Index: Content-Language; bh=/I4cwOBebtbnCHpcuWHIEKNpH74ZFqcvBgY4kFKgWjo =; b=K/1r0WOM8Ej5XJNPT+pnMEKeXlPD48aamROvPVRd+f9Qun2GuXf9MSFMBoQ VXFVQnPWY9tq72Rt1U9tIkWDlfZL3MgrNqNMMXhUIWBP7DvOXOQi2n8Fe+cmzDtf hvbw4h7mPTtb3c2bSv+eAhq7M4gD9p8DqrRN4kJ6qdKGsk2I= Received: from YanShenPC (unknown [210.25.132.186]) by smtp3 (Coremail) with SMTP id DdGowEAJ2mVVzW9P+IbAFw--.1075S2; Mon, 26 Mar 2012 09:58:51 +0800 (CST) From: "Yan Shen" To: Date: Mon, 26 Mar 2012 09:58:41 +0800 Message-ID: <001301cd0af3$fc471520$f4d53f60$@163.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="gb2312" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook 14.0 Thread-Index: Ac0K88CXq3cYjy1+Tvm21NGYlhQv1w== Content-Language: zh-cn X-CM-TRANSID: DdGowEAJ2mVVzW9P+IbAFw--.1075S2 X-Coremail-Antispam: 1Uf129KBjvJXoWrur15uw4xZw1kAw4rGFyrCrg_yoW8JF1kpr Z7K34rAa4rXFn7Xr4Iyr12qw1Fva42yFW7t3Z0k3y5Za45Ja9rKa4Skw4Fv34UZrs3KFW7 XFWUuw4UXw4FqrJanT9S1TB71UUUUUUqnTZGkaVYY2UrUUUUjbIjqfuFe4nvWSU5nxnvy2 9KBjDUYxBIdaVFxhVjvjDU0xZFpf9x07jP_-kUUUUU= X-CM-SenderInfo: p1dq2xlhqylmqv6rljoofrz/1tbiPhd9KE9oo5Hi1QAAse Subject: [DMM] for help X-BeenThere: dmm@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.12 Precedence: list List-Id: Distributed Mobility Management Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 26 Mar 2012 01:59:02 -0000 Dear Admin, I have submit my Email(yanshen8785@163.com) to the mail list of dmm but = I can only receive this following email several times without any = discussion emails.=20 Would you please help me to check what happen with my mail add? thanks -----=D3=CA=BC=FE=D4=AD=BC=FE----- =B7=A2=BC=FE=C8=CB: dmm-bounces@ietf.org [mailto:dmm-bounces@ietf.org] = =B4=FA=B1=ED dmm-request@ietf.org =B7=A2=CB=CD=CA=B1=BC=E4: 2012=C4=EA3=D4=C226=C8=D5 3:00 =CA=D5=BC=FE=C8=CB: dmm@ietf.org =D6=F7=CC=E2: dmm Digest, Vol 13, Issue 28 If you have received this digest without all the individual message attachments you will need to update your digest options in your list subscription. To do so, go to=20 https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dmm Click the 'Unsubscribe or edit options' button, log in, and set "Get = MIME or Plain Text Digests?" to MIME. You can set this option globally for all = the list digests you receive at this point. Send dmm mailing list submissions to dmm@ietf.org To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dmm or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to dmm-request@ietf.org You can reach the person managing the list at dmm-owner@ietf.org When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific than "Re: Contents of dmm digest..." From pierrick.seite@orange.com Tue Mar 27 00:41:08 2012 Return-Path: X-Original-To: dmm@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: dmm@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2349821F87A5 for ; Tue, 27 Mar 2012 00:41:08 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -5.474 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-5.474 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=-0.714, BAYES_05=-1.11, HELO_EQ_FR=0.35, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-4] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([12.22.58.30]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id S3khS47NirQL for ; Tue, 27 Mar 2012 00:41:07 -0700 (PDT) Received: from p-mail1.rd.francetelecom.com (p-mail1.rd.francetelecom.com [195.101.245.15]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 86B7721F87A1 for ; Tue, 27 Mar 2012 00:41:07 -0700 (PDT) Received: from p-mail1.rd.francetelecom.com (localhost.localdomain [127.0.0.1]) by localhost (Postfix) with SMTP id 5E7E27E4003 for ; Tue, 27 Mar 2012 09:41:06 +0200 (CEST) Received: from ftrdsmtp2.rd.francetelecom.fr (unknown [10.192.128.47]) by p-mail1.rd.francetelecom.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 57B4F7E4001 for ; Tue, 27 Mar 2012 09:41:06 +0200 (CEST) Received: from ftrdmel0.rd.francetelecom.fr ([10.192.128.56]) by ftrdsmtp2.rd.francetelecom.fr with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.4675); Tue, 27 Mar 2012 09:41:06 +0200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft Exchange V6.5 Content-class: urn:content-classes:message MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Date: Tue, 27 Mar 2012 09:41:04 +0200 Message-ID: <843DA8228A1BA74CA31FB4E111A5C46202448010@ftrdmel0.rd.francetelecom.fr> X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: Thread-Topic: DMM demo Thread-Index: Ac0L7Pb1qh30D8sqTiGdiw/TWoy26Q== From: To: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 27 Mar 2012 07:41:06.0684 (UTC) FILETIME=[F822F3C0:01CD0BEC] Subject: [DMM] DMM demo X-BeenThere: dmm@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.12 Precedence: list List-Id: Distributed Mobility Management Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 27 Mar 2012 07:41:08 -0000 Hi, We'll make our DMM demo after the DMM meeting, around 11:30, in the same meeting room. BR, Pierrick From cjbc@it.uc3m.es Tue Mar 27 08:35:09 2012 Return-Path: X-Original-To: dmm@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: dmm@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4BF1221E81FD; Tue, 27 Mar 2012 08:35:09 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -5.311 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-5.311 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.389, BAYES_00=-2.599, J_CHICKENPOX_21=0.6, MIME_8BIT_HEADER=0.3, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-4] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([12.22.58.30]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id t4+4MaL9j4dI; Tue, 27 Mar 2012 08:35:08 -0700 (PDT) Received: from smtp02.uc3m.es (smtp02.uc3m.es [163.117.176.132]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2EE6421E81F5; Tue, 27 Mar 2012 08:35:00 -0700 (PDT) X-uc3m-safe: yes Received: from [130.129.83.185] (dhcp-53b9.meeting.ietf.org [130.129.83.185]) (using TLSv1 with cipher AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by smtp02.uc3m.es (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2950E75A3BC; Tue, 27 Mar 2012 17:34:56 +0200 (CEST) Message-ID: <1332862493.5725.146.camel@acorde.it.uc3m.es> From: Carlos =?ISO-8859-1?Q?Jes=FAs?= Bernardos Cano To: dmm@ietf.org, netext@ietf.org Date: Tue, 27 Mar 2012 17:34:53 +0200 Organization: Universidad Carlos III de Madrid Content-Type: multipart/signed; micalg="pgp-sha1"; protocol="application/pgp-signature"; boundary="=-iuAzEUYlIORnzoDwq0/v" X-Mailer: Evolution 3.2.2-1 Mime-Version: 1.0 X-TM-AS-Product-Ver: IMSS-7.0.0.3116-6.8.0.1017-18802.000 Cc: Telemaco Melia Subject: [DMM] Network-based DMM demo (Thu 15:30 room 251) X-BeenThere: dmm@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.12 Precedence: list Reply-To: cjbc@it.uc3m.es List-Id: Distributed Mobility Management Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 27 Mar 2012 15:35:09 -0000 --=-iuAzEUYlIORnzoDwq0/v Content-Type: text/plain; charset="ISO-8859-15" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Hi all, We'd like to announce that our network-based DMM demo will take place on Thursday at 15:30 in room 251. The demo will show a Linux-based prototype based on [1] and [2] running on a live setup. The setup is composed of three "anchor routers", a "centralized LMA" for control plane, a couple of correspondent nodes (a netbook and an IPv6 camera) and a legacy IPv6 mobile node (a netbook). Looking forward to seeing you there and getting your feedback. Thanks, Carlos, Telemaco and Juan Carlos [1] http://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-bernardos-dmm-pmip-01 [2] http://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-bernardos-dmm-distributed-anchoring-00 --=20 Carlos Jes=FAs Bernardos Cano http://www.netcom.it.uc3m.es/ GPG FP: D29B 0A6A 639A A561 93CA 4D55 35DC BA4D D170 4F67 --=-iuAzEUYlIORnzoDwq0/v Content-Type: application/pgp-signature; name="signature.asc" Content-Description: This is a digitally signed message part Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.4.12 (GNU/Linux) iEYEABECAAYFAk9x3h0ACgkQNdy6TdFwT2c0RwCgiROija/bDtjmdupZdbHZpO+a wTAAn1JgCe7c8OjI1iUsfOhHN5h2CoCI =O6Ui -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --=-iuAzEUYlIORnzoDwq0/v-- From cjbc@it.uc3m.es Wed Mar 28 02:02:04 2012 Return-Path: X-Original-To: dmm@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: dmm@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 60D2A21F89CD; Wed, 28 Mar 2012 02:02:04 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -5.494 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-5.494 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.053, BAYES_00=-2.599, J_CHICKENPOX_21=0.6, MIME_8BIT_HEADER=0.3, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-4, SARE_SUB_ENC_UTF8=0.152] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([12.22.58.30]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id P-bmN7W+ByBg; Wed, 28 Mar 2012 02:02:03 -0700 (PDT) Received: from smtp02.uc3m.es (smtp02.uc3m.es [163.117.176.132]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id E626221F89C5; Wed, 28 Mar 2012 02:02:02 -0700 (PDT) X-uc3m-safe: yes Received: from [130.129.20.208] (dhcp-14d0.meeting.ietf.org [130.129.20.208]) (using TLSv1 with cipher AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by smtp02.uc3m.es (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2FBCF75AD37; Wed, 28 Mar 2012 11:02:01 +0200 (CEST) Message-ID: <1332925320.5725.203.camel@acorde.it.uc3m.es> From: Carlos =?ISO-8859-1?Q?Jes=FAs?= Bernardos Cano To: Dapeng Liu Date: Wed, 28 Mar 2012 11:02:00 +0200 In-Reply-To: <00a001cd0cb8$160fea70$422fbf50$@chinamobile.com> References: <1332862493.5725.146.camel@acorde.it.uc3m.es> <00a001cd0cb8$160fea70$422fbf50$@chinamobile.com> Organization: Universidad Carlos III de Madrid Content-Type: multipart/signed; micalg="pgp-sha1"; protocol="application/pgp-signature"; boundary="=-Isqnbqkt9QjTqKG99O7O" X-Mailer: Evolution 3.2.2-1 Mime-Version: 1.0 X-TM-AS-Product-Ver: IMSS-7.0.0.3116-6.8.0.1017-18802.006 Cc: netext@ietf.org, dmm@ietf.org, 'Telemaco Melia' Subject: Re: [DMM] =?utf-8?b?562U5aSNOiAgTmV0d29yay1iYXNlZCBETU0gZGVtbyAoVGh1?= =?utf-8?q?_15=3A30_room_251=29?= X-BeenThere: dmm@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.12 Precedence: list Reply-To: cjbc@it.uc3m.es List-Id: Distributed Mobility Management Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 28 Mar 2012 09:02:04 -0000 --=-Isqnbqkt9QjTqKG99O7O Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Hi Dapeng, On Wed, 2012-03-28 at 15:54 +0800, Dapeng Liu wrote: > Hello Carlos, >=20 > Sounds interesting, may I ask how many virtual routers is running on the > anchor router? Thanks. I'm not sure I got your question right. If you are asking how many "virtual machines" we are running in our demo, then the answer is none, we are using different physical boxes for each entity. If you are asking how many distributed logical interfaces are configured on each anchor router, this depends on the mobility pattern of the MN, but since we have one MN and three anchor routers, each of them can have at most three. Thanks, Carlos >=20 > Regards, > -Dapeng Liu > -----=E9=82=AE=E4=BB=B6=E5=8E=9F=E4=BB=B6----- > =E5=8F=91=E4=BB=B6=E4=BA=BA: dmm-bounces@ietf.org [mailto:dmm-bounces@iet= f.org] =E4=BB=A3=E8=A1=A8 Carlos Jes=C3=BA > s Bernardos Cano > =E5=8F=91=E9=80=81=E6=97=B6=E9=97=B4: 2012=E5=B9=B43=E6=9C=8827=E6=97=A5 = 23:35 > =E6=94=B6=E4=BB=B6=E4=BA=BA: dmm@ietf.org; netext@ietf.org > =E6=8A=84=E9=80=81: Telemaco Melia > =E4=B8=BB=E9=A2=98: [DMM] Network-based DMM demo (Thu 15:30 room 251) >=20 > Hi all, >=20 > We'd like to announce that our network-based DMM demo will take place on > Thursday at 15:30 in room 251. >=20 > The demo will show a Linux-based prototype based on [1] and [2] running o= n a > live setup. >=20 > The setup is composed of three "anchor routers", a "centralized LMA" for > control plane, a couple of correspondent nodes (a netbook and an IPv6 > camera) and a legacy IPv6 mobile node (a netbook). >=20 > Looking forward to seeing you there and getting your feedback. >=20 > Thanks, >=20 > Carlos, Telemaco and Juan Carlos >=20 > [1] http://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-bernardos-dmm-pmip-01 > [2] > http://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-bernardos-dmm-distributed-anchoring-00 > -- > Carlos Jes=C3=BAs Bernardos Cano http://www.netcom.it.uc3m.es/ GPG FP: D= 29B > 0A6A 639A A561 93CA 4D55 35DC BA4D D170 4F67 >=20 --=20 Carlos Jes=C3=BAs Bernardos Cano http://www.netcom.it.uc3m.es/ GPG FP: D29B 0A6A 639A A561 93CA 4D55 35DC BA4D D170 4F67 --=-Isqnbqkt9QjTqKG99O7O Content-Type: application/pgp-signature; name="signature.asc" Content-Description: This is a digitally signed message part Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.4.12 (GNU/Linux) iEYEABECAAYFAk9y04gACgkQNdy6TdFwT2dizACfXb38xT+Xo7HGL+w4CNH1eGGl 4VAAoNTrYMHpBVNLpphuhJbxsDwaaQWv =iFtE -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --=-Isqnbqkt9QjTqKG99O7O-- From rute.sofia@ulusofona.pt Wed Mar 28 03:09:47 2012 Return-Path: X-Original-To: dmm@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: dmm@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 33E7B21F899B for ; Wed, 28 Mar 2012 03:09:47 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -3.598 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-3.598 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-2.599, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW=-1] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([12.22.58.30]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id BQ9zf6Nqnndv for ; Wed, 28 Mar 2012 03:09:46 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail-bk0-f44.google.com (mail-bk0-f44.google.com [209.85.214.44]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id DE45C21F8962 for ; Wed, 28 Mar 2012 03:09:45 -0700 (PDT) Received: by bkuw5 with SMTP id w5so800369bku.31 for ; Wed, 28 Mar 2012 03:09:45 -0700 (PDT) X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=google.com; s=20120113; h=message-id:date:from:reply-to:organization:user-agent:mime-version :to:subject:references:in-reply-to:content-type:x-gm-message-state; bh=2KYzlcd/5CbGq+iiRyaSZUID62kIPFTYyPvWUezWmwg=; b=UT93byhGw8o1PE3DD75KVCCfTETyct5KnRTwyq0O5o+ccueSGSvhfpg2DPFWvqbmJk hfpg+cpziVHC8R+AeyCDs8Z0US2th23Kl4O6v2D69ru4FQhElDBREAghaNJzEQrI13rR eH6l654xBU4WRVIqRrWTjSf/mNPQlrOANTRNR+F4qDUO8Q1YSpNjoFcmIvpfIJxEPMBb xlg8WvQAEvWJ6QW3/97D6FT8yYJWZGeBHhnc4+qREuxj9f/0b51tqdFUnVm3vJfdljcb y97UUCVi7lvx8sTNQoPqpCE3Dg6MdfCbiJQ3kxCel8/3yvWx7R/IOgPQTevoRMSFPIhz EajA== Received: by 10.204.152.88 with SMTP id f24mr11193722bkw.121.1332929384863; Wed, 28 Mar 2012 03:09:44 -0700 (PDT) Received: from linux-phf7.site (sitigate.ulusofona.pt. [193.137.75.158]) by mx.google.com with ESMTPS id p19sm5405434bka.1.2012.03.28.03.09.43 (version=SSLv3 cipher=OTHER); Wed, 28 Mar 2012 03:09:43 -0700 (PDT) Message-ID: <4F72E2F1.3030902@ulusofona.pt> Date: Wed, 28 Mar 2012 11:07:45 +0100 From: Rute Sofia Organization: SITI/ULHT/COFAC User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; Linux i686; rv:6.0) Gecko/20110812 Thunderbird/6.0 MIME-Version: 1.0 To: dmm@ietf.org References: <1332862493.5725.146.camel@acorde.it.uc3m.es> In-Reply-To: <1332862493.5725.146.camel@acorde.it.uc3m.es> Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="------------020706020509020607040401" X-Gm-Message-State: ALoCoQm44xR02KnoBQvS74PeViL56kVswJaBIiNDtbkPwyxpFoYALydZx6HRZ6QKBMm07pnREFAK Subject: Re: [DMM] Network-based DMM demo (Thu 15:30 room 251) X-BeenThere: dmm@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.12 Precedence: list Reply-To: rute.sofia@ulusofona.pt List-Id: Distributed Mobility Management Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 28 Mar 2012 10:09:47 -0000 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --------------020706020509020607040401 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Hello Carlos, I cannot attend the meeting but would like to know if it is possible to have access to the software, as you mention it is open-source. BR, Rute Sofia On 03/27/2012 04:34 PM, Carlos Jesús Bernardos Cano wrote: > Hi all, > > We'd like to announce that our network-based DMM demo will take place on > Thursday at 15:30 in room 251. > > The demo will show a Linux-based prototype based on [1] and [2] running > on a live setup. > > The setup is composed of three "anchor routers", a "centralized LMA" for > control plane, a couple of correspondent nodes (a netbook and an IPv6 > camera) and a legacy IPv6 mobile node (a netbook). > > Looking forward to seeing you there and getting your feedback. > > Thanks, > > Carlos, Telemaco and Juan Carlos > > [1] http://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-bernardos-dmm-pmip-01 > [2] > http://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-bernardos-dmm-distributed-anchoring-00 > > > _______________________________________________ > dmm mailing list > dmm@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dmm -- Rute Sofia, PhD (rute.sofia@ulusofona.pt) Scientific Director for Technology Research Unit in Informatics Systems and Technologies (SITI) Coordinator of the Internet Architecture and Networking Lab (IAN Lab) University Lusofona, Portugal rute.sofia@ulusofona.pt http://siti.ulusofona.pt Tel.: 217 515 500 Fax: 21 757 7006 ....................................................... --------------020706020509020607040401 Content-Type: text/html; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Hello Carlos,

I cannot attend the meeting but would like to know if it is possible to have access to the software, as you mention it is open-source.

BR,
Rute Sofia

On 03/27/2012 04:34 PM, Carlos Jesús Bernardos Cano wrote: 
Hi all,

We'd like to announce that our network-based DMM demo will take place on
Thursday at 15:30 in room 251.

The demo will show a Linux-based prototype based on [1] and [2] running
on a live setup.

The setup is composed of three "anchor routers", a "centralized LMA" for
control plane, a couple of correspondent nodes (a netbook and an IPv6
camera) and a legacy IPv6 mobile node (a netbook).

Looking forward to seeing you there and getting your feedback.

Thanks,

Carlos, Telemaco and Juan Carlos

[1] http://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-bernardos-dmm-pmip-01
[2]
http://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-bernardos-dmm-distributed-anchoring-00



_______________________________________________
dmm mailing list
dmm@ietf.org
https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dmm



-- 
Rute Sofia, PhD (rute.sofia@ulusofona.pt)
Scientific Director for Technology
Research Unit in Informatics Systems and Technologies (SITI)
Coordinator of the Internet Architecture and Networking Lab (IAN Lab)
University Lusofona, Portugal
rute.sofia@ulusofona.pt

http://siti.ulusofona.pt
Tel.: 217 515 500 Fax: 21 757 7006
.......................................................
--------------020706020509020607040401-- From internet-drafts@ietf.org Wed Mar 28 03:40:05 2012 Return-Path: X-Original-To: dmm@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: dmm@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2236821F89BB; Wed, 28 Mar 2012 03:40:05 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -102.561 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-102.561 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.038, BAYES_00=-2.599, USER_IN_WHITELIST=-100] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([12.22.58.30]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id WMqs2M8zpL5U; Wed, 28 Mar 2012 03:40:04 -0700 (PDT) Received: from ietfa.amsl.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1325D21F89B6; Wed, 28 Mar 2012 03:40:04 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable From: internet-drafts@ietf.org To: i-d-announce@ietf.org X-Test-IDTracker: no X-IETF-IDTracker: 4.00 Message-ID: <20120328104004.5885.17040.idtracker@ietfa.amsl.com> Date: Wed, 28 Mar 2012 03:40:04 -0700 Cc: dmm@ietf.org Subject: [DMM] I-D Action: draft-ietf-mext-mip6-tls-05.txt X-BeenThere: dmm@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.12 Precedence: list List-Id: Distributed Mobility Management Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 28 Mar 2012 10:40:05 -0000 A New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line Internet-Drafts director= ies. This draft is a work item of the Mobility EXTensions for IPv6 Working = Group of the IETF. Title : Transport Layer Security-based Mobile IPv6 Security Fram= ework for Mobile Node to Home Agent Communication Author(s) : Jouni Korhonen Basavaraj Patil Hannes Tschofenig Dirk Kroeselberg Filename : draft-ietf-mext-mip6-tls-05.txt Pages : 38 Date : 2012-03-28 Mobile IPv6 signaling between a mobile node and its home agent is secured using IPsec. The security association between a mobile node and the home agent is established using IKEv1 or IKEv2. The security model specified for Mobile IPv6, which relies on IKE/IPsec, requires interaction between the Mobile IPv6 protocol component and the IKE/ IPsec module of the IP stack. This document proposes an alternate security framework for Mobile IPv6 and Dual-Stack Mobile IPv6, which relies on Transport Layer Security for establishing keying material and other bootstrapping parameters required to protect Mobile IPv6 signaling and data traffic between the mobile node and home agent. A URL for this Internet-Draft is: http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-ietf-mext-mip6-tls-05.txt Internet-Drafts are also available by anonymous FTP at: ftp://ftp.ietf.org/internet-drafts/ This Internet-Draft can be retrieved at: ftp://ftp.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-ietf-mext-mip6-tls-05.txt From iesg-secretary@ietf.org Wed Mar 28 04:59:32 2012 Return-Path: X-Original-To: dmm@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: dmm@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8CD8C21F8839; Wed, 28 Mar 2012 04:59:30 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -102.576 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-102.576 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.023, BAYES_00=-2.599, USER_IN_WHITELIST=-100] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([12.22.58.30]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 2s6+cEN26ktr; Wed, 28 Mar 2012 04:59:26 -0700 (PDT) Received: from ietfa.amsl.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3B4FC21F8818; Wed, 28 Mar 2012 04:59:25 -0700 (PDT) Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: The IESG To: IETF-Announce X-Test-IDTracker: no X-IETF-IDTracker: 4.00 Message-ID: <20120328115925.30383.81223.idtracker@ietfa.amsl.com> Date: Wed, 28 Mar 2012 04:59:25 -0700 Cc: mext chair , mext mailing list , RFC Editor Subject: [DMM] Document Action: 'Transport Layer Security-based Mobile IPv6 Security Framework for Mobile Node to Home Agent Communication' to Experimental RFC (draft-ietf-mext-mip6-tls-05.txt) X-BeenThere: dmm@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.12 Precedence: list List-Id: Distributed Mobility Management Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 28 Mar 2012 11:59:32 -0000 The IESG has approved the following document: - 'Transport Layer Security-based Mobile IPv6 Security Framework for Mobile Node to Home Agent Communication' (draft-ietf-mext-mip6-tls-05.txt) as an Experimental RFC This document is the product of the Mobility EXTensions for IPv6 Working Group. The IESG contact persons are Jari Arkko and Ralph Droms. A URL of this Internet Draft is: http://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-mext-mip6-tls/ Technical Summary Mobile IPv6 signaling between a mobile node and its home agent is secured using IPsec. The security association between a mobile node and the home agent is established using IKEv1 or IKEv2. The security model specified for Mobile IPv6, which relies on IKE/IPsec, requires interaction between the Mobile IPv6 protocol component and the IKE/ IPsec module of the IP stack. This document proposes an alternate security framework for Mobile IPv6 and Dual-Stack Mobile IPv6, which relies on Transport Layer Security for establishing keying material and other bootstrapping parameters required to protect Mobile IPv6 signaling and data traffic between the mobile node and home agent. Working Group Summary This document has been discussed in the WG over 2+ years and there is general consensus on adopting the proposed solution on an experimental basis. The I-D does not deprecate the IPsec based security mechanism which is the default. Instead it proposes an alternative scheme which enables ease of deployment. Document Quality There is at least one known implementation of the protocol. This implementation has been done on the Nokia N900 device as well as Ubuntu and Debian linux platforms. The implementation has been shown at previous IETF meetings. All reviewers who have helped improve the document have been acknowledged in the I-D. Personnel The responsible Area Director is Jari Arkko. There is no Document Shepherd. From cjbc@it.uc3m.es Wed Mar 28 05:05:31 2012 Return-Path: X-Original-To: dmm@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: dmm@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id D290521E808D for ; Wed, 28 Mar 2012 05:05:31 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -5.507 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-5.507 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.040, BAYES_00=-2.599, J_CHICKENPOX_21=0.6, MIME_8BIT_HEADER=0.3, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-4, SARE_SUB_ENC_UTF8=0.152] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([12.22.58.30]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id DizZZv+1PHu3 for ; Wed, 28 Mar 2012 05:05:30 -0700 (PDT) Received: from smtp02.uc3m.es (smtp02.uc3m.es [163.117.176.132]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3E79D21E8097 for ; Wed, 28 Mar 2012 05:05:29 -0700 (PDT) X-uc3m-safe: yes Received: from [130.129.20.208] (dhcp-14d0.meeting.ietf.org [130.129.20.208]) (using TLSv1 with cipher AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by smtp02.uc3m.es (Postfix) with ESMTP id ECD0C70E199; Wed, 28 Mar 2012 14:05:28 +0200 (CEST) Message-ID: <1332936328.5725.229.camel@acorde.it.uc3m.es> From: Carlos =?ISO-8859-1?Q?Jes=FAs?= Bernardos Cano To: Dapeng Liu Date: Wed, 28 Mar 2012 14:05:28 +0200 In-Reply-To: <007801cd0cc3$3b021280$b1063780$@chinamobile.com> References: <1332862493.5725.146.camel@acorde.it.uc3m.es> <00a001cd0cb8$160fea70$422fbf50$@chinamobile.com> <1332925320.5725.203.camel@acorde.it.uc3m.es> <007801cd0cc3$3b021280$b1063780$@chinamobile.com> Organization: Universidad Carlos III de Madrid Content-Type: multipart/signed; micalg="pgp-sha1"; protocol="application/pgp-signature"; boundary="=-opqWzLa+HB3hjjpqpFSj" X-Mailer: Evolution 3.2.2-1 Mime-Version: 1.0 X-TM-AS-Product-Ver: IMSS-7.0.0.3116-6.8.0.1017-18802.007 Cc: dmm@ietf.org Subject: Re: [DMM] =?utf-8?b?562U5aSNOiAg562U5aSNOiBOZXR3b3JrLWJhc2VkIERNTSBk?= =?utf-8?q?emo_=28Thu_15=3A30_room_251=29?= X-BeenThere: dmm@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.12 Precedence: list Reply-To: cjbc@it.uc3m.es List-Id: Distributed Mobility Management Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 28 Mar 2012 12:05:32 -0000 --=-opqWzLa+HB3hjjpqpFSj Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Hi Dapeng, (removing netext from the destination, so we avoid cross posting, apologies for the previous messages). Please, see below... On Wed, 2012-03-28 at 17:14 +0800, Dapeng Liu wrote: > Hi Carlos, >=20 > -----=E9=82=AE=E4=BB=B6=E5=8E=9F=E4=BB=B6----- > =E5=8F=91=E4=BB=B6=E4=BA=BA: dmm-bounces@ietf.org [mailto:dmm-bounces@iet= f.org] =E4=BB=A3=E8=A1=A8 Carlos Jes=C3=BAs Bernardos Cano > =E5=8F=91=E9=80=81=E6=97=B6=E9=97=B4: 2012=E5=B9=B43=E6=9C=8828=E6=97=A5 = 17:02 > =E6=94=B6=E4=BB=B6=E4=BA=BA: Dapeng Liu > =E6=8A=84=E9=80=81: netext@ietf.org; dmm@ietf.org; 'Telemaco Melia' > =E4=B8=BB=E9=A2=98: Re: [DMM] =E7=AD=94=E5=A4=8D: Network-based DMM demo = (Thu 15:30 room 251) >=20 > Hi Dapeng, >=20 > On Wed, 2012-03-28 at 15:54 +0800, Dapeng Liu wrote: > > Hello Carlos, > >=20 > > Sounds interesting, may I ask how many virtual routers is running on= =20 > > the anchor router? >=20 > Thanks. >=20 > I'm not sure I got your question right. If you are asking how many "virtu= al machines" we are running in our demo, then the answer is none, we are us= ing different physical boxes for each entity. > If you are asking how many distributed logical interfaces are configured = on each anchor router, this depends on the mobility pattern of the MN, but = since we have one MN and three anchor routers, each of them can have at mos= t three. >=20 > [Dapeng] > Yeah, I am referring the 'distributed logical interfaces'. How about > the scalability? since it depends on the mobility pattern of MN.. >=20 Creation and maintenance of logical interfaces is a very low resource consuming task. Besides, in realistic deployments, the chances that an MN has active anchored prefixes in more than 2-3 D-GWs will be very low. Most likely, address continuity will be only provided for one prefix anchored at a different D-GW. Thanks, Carlos > Regards, > -Dapeng Liu >=20 >=20 > Thanks, >=20 > Carlos >=20 > >=20 > > Regards, > > -Dapeng Liu > > -----=E9=82=AE=E4=BB=B6=E5=8E=9F=E4=BB=B6----- > > =E5=8F=91=E4=BB=B6=E4=BA=BA: dmm-bounces@ietf.org [mailto:dmm-bounces@i= etf.org] =E4=BB=A3=E8=A1=A8 Carlos Jes=C3=BA=20 > > s Bernardos Cano > > =E5=8F=91=E9=80=81=E6=97=B6=E9=97=B4: 2012=E5=B9=B43=E6=9C=8827=E6=97= =A5 23:35 > > =E6=94=B6=E4=BB=B6=E4=BA=BA: dmm@ietf.org; netext@ietf.org > > =E6=8A=84=E9=80=81: Telemaco Melia > > =E4=B8=BB=E9=A2=98: [DMM] Network-based DMM demo (Thu 15:30 room 251) > >=20 > > Hi all, > >=20 > > We'd like to announce that our network-based DMM demo will take place= =20 > > on Thursday at 15:30 in room 251. > >=20 > > The demo will show a Linux-based prototype based on [1] and [2]=20 > > running on a live setup. > >=20 > > The setup is composed of three "anchor routers", a "centralized LMA"= =20 > > for control plane, a couple of correspondent nodes (a netbook and an= =20 > > IPv6 > > camera) and a legacy IPv6 mobile node (a netbook). > >=20 > > Looking forward to seeing you there and getting your feedback. > >=20 > > Thanks, > >=20 > > Carlos, Telemaco and Juan Carlos > >=20 > > [1] http://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-bernardos-dmm-pmip-01 > > [2] > > http://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-bernardos-dmm-distributed-anchoring-0 > > 0 > > -- > > Carlos Jes=C3=BAs Bernardos Cano http://www.netcom.it.uc3m.es/ GPG FP:= =20 > > D29B 0A6A 639A A561 93CA 4D55 35DC BA4D D170 4F67 > >=20 >=20 > -- > Carlos Jes=C3=BAs Bernardos Cano http://www.netcom.it.uc3m.es/ GPG FP: D= 29B 0A6A 639A A561 93CA 4D55 35DC BA4D D170 4F67 >=20 --=20 Carlos Jes=C3=BAs Bernardos Cano http://www.netcom.it.uc3m.es/ GPG FP: D29B 0A6A 639A A561 93CA 4D55 35DC BA4D D170 4F67 --=-opqWzLa+HB3hjjpqpFSj Content-Type: application/pgp-signature; name="signature.asc" Content-Description: This is a digitally signed message part Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.4.12 (GNU/Linux) iEYEABECAAYFAk9y/ogACgkQNdy6TdFwT2drXgCgylUMTEhez/7Wh7kwe8s3l7JP 8TwAn3aPEAPVvXn7TYKMAfpB0BKuBI0a =WvtD -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --=-opqWzLa+HB3hjjpqpFSj-- From cjbc@it.uc3m.es Wed Mar 28 05:29:03 2012 Return-Path: X-Original-To: dmm@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: dmm@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4B91321E8195 for ; Wed, 28 Mar 2012 05:29:03 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -5.591 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-5.591 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.108, BAYES_00=-2.599, J_CHICKENPOX_21=0.6, MIME_8BIT_HEADER=0.3, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-4] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([12.22.58.30]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id CDPTAhjLKOIA for ; Wed, 28 Mar 2012 05:29:02 -0700 (PDT) Received: from smtp03.uc3m.es (smtp03.uc3m.es [163.117.176.133]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8103B21E8182 for ; Wed, 28 Mar 2012 05:29:02 -0700 (PDT) X-uc3m-safe: yes Received: from [130.129.20.208] (dhcp-14d0.meeting.ietf.org [130.129.20.208]) (using TLSv1 with cipher AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by smtp03.uc3m.es (Postfix) with ESMTP id 53D0E84492C; Wed, 28 Mar 2012 14:29:01 +0200 (CEST) Message-ID: <1332937740.5725.235.camel@acorde.it.uc3m.es> From: Carlos =?ISO-8859-1?Q?Jes=FAs?= Bernardos Cano To: rute.sofia@ulusofona.pt Date: Wed, 28 Mar 2012 14:29:00 +0200 In-Reply-To: <4F72E2F1.3030902@ulusofona.pt> References: <1332862493.5725.146.camel@acorde.it.uc3m.es> <4F72E2F1.3030902@ulusofona.pt> Organization: Universidad Carlos III de Madrid Content-Type: multipart/signed; micalg="pgp-sha1"; protocol="application/pgp-signature"; boundary="=-6gheUKw4djVWIgj4nrWa" X-Mailer: Evolution 3.2.2-1 Mime-Version: 1.0 X-TM-AS-Product-Ver: IMSS-7.0.0.3116-6.8.0.1017-18802.007 Cc: dmm@ietf.org Subject: Re: [DMM] Network-based DMM demo (Thu 15:30 room 251) X-BeenThere: dmm@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.12 Precedence: list Reply-To: cjbc@it.uc3m.es List-Id: Distributed Mobility Management Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 28 Mar 2012 12:29:03 -0000 --=-6gheUKw4djVWIgj4nrWa Content-Type: text/plain; charset="ISO-8859-15" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Hi Rute, On Wed, 2012-03-28 at 11:07 +0100, Rute Sofia wrote: > Hello Carlos, >=20 > I cannot attend the meeting but would like to know if it is possible to= =20 > have access to the software, as you mention it is open-source. This is under discussion. We'll announce to the list. Thanks, Carlos >=20 > BR, > Rute Sofia >=20 > On 03/27/2012 04:34 PM, Carlos Jes=FAs Bernardos Cano wrote: > > Hi all, > > > > We'd like to announce that our network-based DMM demo will take place o= n > > Thursday at 15:30 in room 251. > > > > The demo will show a Linux-based prototype based on [1] and [2] running > > on a live setup. > > > > The setup is composed of three "anchor routers", a "centralized LMA" fo= r > > control plane, a couple of correspondent nodes (a netbook and an IPv6 > > camera) and a legacy IPv6 mobile node (a netbook). > > > > Looking forward to seeing you there and getting your feedback. > > > > Thanks, > > > > Carlos, Telemaco and Juan Carlos > > > > [1] http://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-bernardos-dmm-pmip-01 > > [2] > > http://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-bernardos-dmm-distributed-anchoring-00 > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > dmm mailing list > > dmm@ietf.org > > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dmm >=20 >=20 > _______________________________________________ > dmm mailing list > dmm@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dmm --=20 Carlos Jes=FAs Bernardos Cano http://www.netcom.it.uc3m.es/ GPG FP: D29B 0A6A 639A A561 93CA 4D55 35DC BA4D D170 4F67 --=-6gheUKw4djVWIgj4nrWa Content-Type: application/pgp-signature; name="signature.asc" Content-Description: This is a digitally signed message part Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.4.12 (GNU/Linux) iEYEABECAAYFAk9zBAwACgkQNdy6TdFwT2ezigCeILwj+k2F896rhIPaivAK7LZo mccAoIZkPJ8i13YZZUUpvUnG+vRZIlWZ =coNY -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --=-6gheUKw4djVWIgj4nrWa-- From cjbc@it.uc3m.es Thu Mar 29 02:17:52 2012 Return-Path: X-Original-To: dmm@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: dmm@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id C25FB21F8868 for ; Thu, 29 Mar 2012 02:17:52 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -5.609 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-5.609 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.090, BAYES_00=-2.599, J_CHICKENPOX_21=0.6, MIME_8BIT_HEADER=0.3, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-4] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([12.22.58.30]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 7DaSZ8etxpbQ for ; Thu, 29 Mar 2012 02:17:51 -0700 (PDT) Received: from smtp03.uc3m.es (smtp03.uc3m.es [163.117.176.133]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2E97A21F8773 for ; Thu, 29 Mar 2012 02:17:50 -0700 (PDT) X-uc3m-safe: yes Received: from [130.129.20.208] (dhcp-14d0.meeting.ietf.org [130.129.20.208]) (using TLSv1 with cipher AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by smtp03.uc3m.es (Postfix) with ESMTP id BD9A39CB678; Thu, 29 Mar 2012 11:17:46 +0200 (CEST) Message-ID: <1333012666.5725.251.camel@acorde.it.uc3m.es> From: Carlos =?ISO-8859-1?Q?Jes=FAs?= Bernardos Cano To: dmm@ietf.org Date: Thu, 29 Mar 2012 11:17:46 +0200 Organization: Universidad Carlos III de Madrid Content-Type: multipart/signed; micalg="pgp-sha1"; protocol="application/pgp-signature"; boundary="=-jM60XjyxQZAxEekhtvEh" X-Mailer: Evolution 3.2.2-1 Mime-Version: 1.0 X-TM-AS-Product-Ver: IMSS-7.0.0.3116-6.8.0.1017-18804.006 Subject: [DMM] Network-based DMM demo (Thu 15:30 room 251) X-BeenThere: dmm@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.12 Precedence: list Reply-To: cjbc@it.uc3m.es List-Id: Distributed Mobility Management Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 29 Mar 2012 09:17:53 -0000 --=-jM60XjyxQZAxEekhtvEh Content-Type: text/plain; charset="ISO-8859-15" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable This is a friendly reminder of our demo today at 15:30 in room 251.=20 We can continue some of the discussions started today during the DMM session. Hope to see you there, Carlos, Telemaco and Juan Carlos --- Hi all, We'd like to announce that our network-based DMM demo will take place on Thursday at 15:30 in room 251. The demo will show a Linux-based prototype based on [1] and [2] running on a live setup. The setup is composed of three "anchor routers", a "centralized LMA" for control plane, a couple of correspondent nodes (a netbook and an IPv6 camera) and a legacy IPv6 mobile node (a netbook). Looking forward to seeing you there and getting your feedback. Thanks, Carlos, Telemaco and Juan Carlos [1] http://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-bernardos-dmm-pmip-01 [2] http://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-bernardos-dmm-distributed-anchoring-00 --=20 Carlos Jes=FAs Bernardos Cano http://www.netcom.it.uc3m.es/ GPG FP: D29B 0A6A 639A A561 93CA 4D55 35DC BA4D D170 4F67 --=-jM60XjyxQZAxEekhtvEh Content-Type: application/pgp-signature; name="signature.asc" Content-Description: This is a digitally signed message part Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.4.12 (GNU/Linux) iEYEABECAAYFAk90KLoACgkQNdy6TdFwT2eLpQCfT+ifA+9yFhCkoaGHO/9x92r1 ovsAoNyD9BqDypbsjZN46R4uIAon20Vt =3RUJ -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --=-jM60XjyxQZAxEekhtvEh-- From liudapeng@chinamobile.com Wed Mar 28 02:14:54 2012 Return-Path: X-Original-To: dmm@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: dmm@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id C14DA21E8082; Wed, 28 Mar 2012 02:14:54 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: 2.17 X-Spam-Level: ** X-Spam-Status: No, score=2.17 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=1.495, BAYES_00=-2.599, J_CHICKENPOX_21=0.6, MIME_8BIT_HEADER=0.3, RELAY_IS_221=2.222, SARE_SUB_ENC_UTF8=0.152] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([12.22.58.30]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id tz2Alh0k1mde; Wed, 28 Mar 2012 02:14:54 -0700 (PDT) Received: from imss.chinamobile.com (imss.chinamobile.com [221.130.253.135]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id B910B21E805A; Wed, 28 Mar 2012 02:14:53 -0700 (PDT) Received: from imss.chinamobile.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by localhost.chinamobile.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6684CE5CD; Wed, 28 Mar 2012 17:14:52 +0800 (CST) Received: from mail.chinamobile.com (unknown [10.1.28.22]) by imss.chinamobile.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4279AE5C6; Wed, 28 Mar 2012 17:14:52 +0800 (CST) Received: from MaxPassionPC ([10.1.5.3]) by mail.chinamobile.com (Lotus Domino Release 6.5.6) with ESMTP id 2012032817145055-17853 ; Wed, 28 Mar 2012 17:14:50 +0800 From: "Dapeng Liu" To: References: <1332862493.5725.146.camel@acorde.it.uc3m.es> <00a001cd0cb8$160fea70$422fbf50$@chinamobile.com> <1332925320.5725.203.camel@acorde.it.uc3m.es> In-Reply-To: <1332925320.5725.203.camel@acorde.it.uc3m.es> Date: Wed, 28 Mar 2012 17:14:46 +0800 Message-ID: <007801cd0cc3$3b021280$b1063780$@chinamobile.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook 14.0 Thread-Index: AQJQkK46nyNBZ96T4q0wptmyEOjlGwFEnoe5AiV0sE+VXRKFUA== X-MIMETrack: Itemize by SMTP Server on jtgsml01/servers/cmcc(Release 6.5.6|March 06, 2007) at 2012-03-28 17:14:51, Serialize by Router on jtgsml01/servers/cmcc(Release 6.5.6|March 06, 2007) at 2012-03-28 17:14:51, Serialize complete at 2012-03-28 17:14:51 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Language: zh-cn X-TM-AS-Product-Ver: IMSS-7.0.0.8231-6.8.0.1017-18802.005 X-TM-AS-Result: No--23.255-7.0-31-10 X-imss-scan-details: No--23.255-7.0-31-10;No--23.255-7.0-31-10 X-TM-AS-User-Approved-Sender: No;No X-TM-AS-User-Blocked-Sender: No;No X-Mailman-Approved-At: Thu, 29 Mar 2012 08:50:34 -0700 Cc: netext@ietf.org, dmm@ietf.org, 'Telemaco Melia' Subject: [DMM] =?utf-8?b?562U5aSNOiAg562U5aSNOiAgTmV0d29yay1iYXNlZCBETU0g?= =?utf-8?q?demo_=28Thu_15=3A30_room_251=29?= X-BeenThere: dmm@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.12 Precedence: list List-Id: Distributed Mobility Management Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 28 Mar 2012 09:14:54 -0000 Hi Carlos, -----=E9=82=AE=E4=BB=B6=E5=8E=9F=E4=BB=B6----- =E5=8F=91=E4=BB=B6=E4=BA=BA: dmm-bounces@ietf.org = [mailto:dmm-bounces@ietf.org] =E4=BB=A3=E8=A1=A8 Carlos Jes=C3=BAs = Bernardos Cano =E5=8F=91=E9=80=81=E6=97=B6=E9=97=B4: 2012=E5=B9=B43=E6=9C=8828=E6=97=A5 = 17:02 =E6=94=B6=E4=BB=B6=E4=BA=BA: Dapeng Liu =E6=8A=84=E9=80=81: netext@ietf.org; dmm@ietf.org; 'Telemaco Melia' =E4=B8=BB=E9=A2=98: Re: [DMM] =E7=AD=94=E5=A4=8D: Network-based DMM demo = (Thu 15:30 room 251) Hi Dapeng, On Wed, 2012-03-28 at 15:54 +0800, Dapeng Liu wrote: > Hello Carlos, >=20 > Sounds interesting, may I ask how many virtual routers is running on=20 > the anchor router? Thanks. I'm not sure I got your question right. If you are asking how many = "virtual machines" we are running in our demo, then the answer is none, = we are using different physical boxes for each entity. If you are asking how many distributed logical interfaces are configured = on each anchor router, this depends on the mobility pattern of the MN, = but since we have one MN and three anchor routers, each of them can have = at most three. [Dapeng] Yeah, I am referring the 'distributed logical interfaces'. How about the = scalability? since it depends on the mobility pattern of MN.. Regards, -Dapeng Liu Thanks, Carlos >=20 > Regards, > -Dapeng Liu > -----=E9=82=AE=E4=BB=B6=E5=8E=9F=E4=BB=B6----- > =E5=8F=91=E4=BB=B6=E4=BA=BA: dmm-bounces@ietf.org = [mailto:dmm-bounces@ietf.org] =E4=BB=A3=E8=A1=A8 Carlos Jes=C3=BA=20 > s Bernardos Cano > =E5=8F=91=E9=80=81=E6=97=B6=E9=97=B4: = 2012=E5=B9=B43=E6=9C=8827=E6=97=A5 23:35 > =E6=94=B6=E4=BB=B6=E4=BA=BA: dmm@ietf.org; netext@ietf.org > =E6=8A=84=E9=80=81: Telemaco Melia > =E4=B8=BB=E9=A2=98: [DMM] Network-based DMM demo (Thu 15:30 room 251) >=20 > Hi all, >=20 > We'd like to announce that our network-based DMM demo will take place=20 > on Thursday at 15:30 in room 251. >=20 > The demo will show a Linux-based prototype based on [1] and [2]=20 > running on a live setup. >=20 > The setup is composed of three "anchor routers", a "centralized LMA"=20 > for control plane, a couple of correspondent nodes (a netbook and an=20 > IPv6 > camera) and a legacy IPv6 mobile node (a netbook). >=20 > Looking forward to seeing you there and getting your feedback. >=20 > Thanks, >=20 > Carlos, Telemaco and Juan Carlos >=20 > [1] http://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-bernardos-dmm-pmip-01 > [2] > http://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-bernardos-dmm-distributed-anchoring-0 > 0 > -- > Carlos Jes=C3=BAs Bernardos Cano http://www.netcom.it.uc3m.es/ GPG = FP:=20 > D29B 0A6A 639A A561 93CA 4D55 35DC BA4D D170 4F67 >=20 -- Carlos Jes=C3=BAs Bernardos Cano http://www.netcom.it.uc3m.es/ GPG FP: = D29B 0A6A 639A A561 93CA 4D55 35DC BA4D D170 4F67