From nobody Wed Sep 9 09:45:30 2020 Return-Path: X-Original-To: emailcore@ietf.org Delivered-To: emailcore@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from ietfa.amsl.com (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6F2503A0AB6; Wed, 9 Sep 2020 09:45:28 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: IETF Meeting Session Request Tool To: Cc: emailcore@ietf.org, barryleiba@computer.org, emailcore-chairs@ietf.org, alexey.melnikov@isode.com X-Test-IDTracker: no X-IETF-IDTracker: 7.16.0 Auto-Submitted: auto-generated Precedence: bulk Message-ID: <159966992838.16739.313463890933501282@ietfa.amsl.com> Date: Wed, 09 Sep 2020 09:45:28 -0700 Archived-At: Subject: [Emailcore] emailcore - New Meeting Session Request for IETF 109 X-BeenThere: emailcore@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 List-Id: EMAILCORE proposed working group list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 09 Sep 2020 16:45:28 -0000 A new meeting session request has just been submitted by Alexey Melnikov, a Chair of the emailcore working group. --------------------------------------------------------- Working Group Name: Revision of core Email specifications Area Name: Applications and Real-Time Area Session Requester: Alexey Melnikov Number of Sessions: 1 Length of Session(s): 1 Hour Number of Attendees: 50 Conflicts to Avoid: Chair Conflict: extra jmap dmarc uta Technology Overlap: calext dispatch secdispatch Key Participant Conflict: gendispatch wpack People who must be present: Pete Resnick Barry Leiba Alexey Melnikov Seth Blank Resources Requested: Special Requests: --------------------------------------------------------- From nobody Wed Sep 9 09:49:51 2020 Return-Path: X-Original-To: emailcore@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: emailcore@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 021833A0A87 for ; Wed, 9 Sep 2020 09:49:50 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -3.047 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-3.047 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, NICE_REPLY_A=-0.948, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (1024-bit key) header.d=isode.com Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id d4b2a46KLuke for ; Wed, 9 Sep 2020 09:49:49 -0700 (PDT) Received: from waldorf.isode.com (waldorf.isode.com [62.232.206.188]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0ABAD3A0AA6 for ; Wed, 9 Sep 2020 09:49:48 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; t=1599670188; d=isode.com; s=june2016; i=@isode.com; bh=p92zoAYg3DgkMyQLlS2OO9ee5lQ+7bWBihPTmFTc7qw=; h=From:Sender:Reply-To:Subject:Date:Message-ID:To:Cc:MIME-Version: In-Reply-To:References:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding: Content-ID:Content-Description; b=Mh72HA1td93ItYVcxohRrElr0ekofeLDll1eHE6hCwOdwjjxFcLI1EK1CtctF859Dl0L/d ltLY4goAeQCfQQaVW5NvHO64aiGNyBDPihhovb52lTcBKk3VwA4l3Sa1w8BXxnZ+KBpomZ GShE4UF9qiHzquNPr3WaWw8BMdU/wNw=; Received: from [172.27.248.4] (connect.isode.net [172.20.0.72]) by waldorf.isode.com (submission channel) via TCP with ESMTPSA id ; Wed, 9 Sep 2020 17:49:47 +0100 To: emailcore@ietf.org Cc: barryleiba@computer.org References: <159966992838.16739.313463890933501282@ietfa.amsl.com> From: Alexey Melnikov Message-ID: <7b41ac7d-adfc-092f-e96a-59fce3a36744@isode.com> Date: Wed, 9 Sep 2020 17:49:33 +0100 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows NT 6.1; WOW64; rv:68.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/68.10.0 In-Reply-To: <159966992838.16739.313463890933501282@ietfa.amsl.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Language: en-GB Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Emailcore] emailcore - New Meeting Session Request for IETF 109 X-BeenThere: emailcore@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: EMAILCORE proposed working group list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 09 Sep 2020 16:49:50 -0000 On 09/09/2020 17:45, IETF Meeting Session Request Tool wrote: > People who must be present: > Pete Resnick > Barry Leiba > Alexey Melnikov > Seth Blank Don't read too much into the above, I just copied data from the last time (when Pete was temporarily asked to co-chair) and I haven't paid enough attention when I pushed the submit button. From nobody Wed Sep 9 16:40:53 2020 Return-Path: X-Original-To: emailcore@ietf.org Delivered-To: emailcore@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from ietfa.amsl.com (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id D18E93A080F; Wed, 9 Sep 2020 16:40:50 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: Benjamin Kaduk via Datatracker To: "The IESG" Cc: emailcore-chairs@ietf.org, emailcore@ietf.org X-Test-IDTracker: no X-IETF-IDTracker: 7.16.0 Auto-Submitted: auto-generated Precedence: bulk Reply-To: Benjamin Kaduk Message-ID: <159969485078.17799.7040151828357723908@ietfa.amsl.com> Date: Wed, 09 Sep 2020 16:40:50 -0700 Archived-At: Subject: [Emailcore] Benjamin Kaduk's No Objection on charter-ietf-emailcore-00-00: (with COMMENT) X-BeenThere: emailcore@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 List-Id: EMAILCORE proposed working group list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 09 Sep 2020 23:40:51 -0000 Benjamin Kaduk has entered the following ballot position for charter-ietf-emailcore-00-00: No Objection When responding, please keep the subject line intact and reply to all email addresses included in the To and CC lines. (Feel free to cut this introductory paragraph, however.) The document, along with other ballot positions, can be found here: https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/charter-ietf-emailcore/ ---------------------------------------------------------------------- COMMENT: ---------------------------------------------------------------------- As Roman notes, it would be good to have formal milestones in place. Also, I presume that the applicability statement will include recommendations for transport security for email; it might be worth mentioning that explicitly to forestall questions about SMTP (in)security. From nobody Wed Sep 9 23:53:06 2020 Return-Path: X-Original-To: emailcore@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: emailcore@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 95D293A0FC4; Wed, 9 Sep 2020 23:53:05 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.897 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.897 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_NONE=0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id CvsbfNK8sJ0X; Wed, 9 Sep 2020 23:53:04 -0700 (PDT) Received: from bsa2.jck.com (bsa2.jck.com [70.88.254.51]) (using TLSv1 with cipher DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id B8F163A0FC1; Wed, 9 Sep 2020 23:53:00 -0700 (PDT) Received: from [198.252.137.10] (helo=PSB) by bsa2.jck.com with esmtp (Exim 4.82 (FreeBSD)) (envelope-from ) id 1kGGS2-000DuZ-C2; Thu, 10 Sep 2020 02:52:58 -0400 Date: Thu, 10 Sep 2020 02:52:52 -0400 From: John C Klensin To: Benjamin Kaduk , The IESG cc: emailcore-chairs@ietf.org, emailcore@ietf.org Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <159969485078.17799.7040151828357723908@ietfa.amsl.com> References: <159969485078.17799.7040151828357723908@ietfa.amsl.com> X-Mailer: Mulberry/4.0.8 (Win32) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline X-SA-Exim-Connect-IP: 198.252.137.10 X-SA-Exim-Mail-From: john-ietf@jck.com X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No (on bsa2.jck.com); SAEximRunCond expanded to false Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Emailcore] Benjamin Kaduk's No Objection on charter-ietf-emailcore-00-00: (with COMMENT) X-BeenThere: emailcore@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: EMAILCORE proposed working group list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 10 Sep 2020 06:53:06 -0000 Ben, Since no one else has responded, you comment seems relevant, and there has been no traffic on the emailcore mailing list since IETF 108 other than a meeting request announcement and no review on that list of the charter the IETF is reviewing.... but speaking strictly as an interested individual and giving my own opinion. When discussions of producing revisions of 5321 and 5322 started (informally, IIR, close to a year ago), it became clear that opening those documents would lead to a rash of requests (and probably flame wars) about things the should be stuff into them, including some things that were either immature or controversial. There has also been rough consensus, repeated in the WG efforts that produced 2821/2822 and 5321/5322, to avoid doing a complete rewrite of 5321 (it and 2821 were ugly merges of several predecessor documents, not just 821) because doing so would be very likely to introduce hard-to-catch errors. As document editor the last two times around, I fear that adding anything else of substance would make things worse. The applicability statement idea, which is at least partially my fault, was a very pragmatic mechanism to provide a way to allow 5321bis and 5322bis to progress without trying to incorporate those other bits of practice, recommendations, and supplemental protocols. In other words, there is a commitment for the WG to address several issues including [in]security but not how to address them or even whether text is appropriate. Those are WG tasks if the WG is created. FWIW, there is already an incomplete starting point list of such topics in an appendix to draft-klensin-rfc5321bis-03 and transport layer security is on it and I just tightened it a bit more for the working copy for the next version. So, yes, it is on the issues list and won't get lost. regards, john --On Wednesday, September 9, 2020 16:40 -0700 Benjamin Kaduk via Datatracker wrote: > Benjamin Kaduk has entered the following ballot position for > charter-ietf-emailcore-00-00: No Objection >... > > The document, along with other ballot positions, can be found > here: https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/charter-ietf-emailcore/ > > > > -------------------------------------------------------------- > -------- COMMENT: > -------------------------------------------------------------- > -------- > > As Roman notes, it would be good to have formal milestones in > place. > > Also, I presume that the applicability statement will include > recommendations for transport security for email; it might be > worth mentioning that explicitly to forestall questions about > SMTP (in)security. From nobody Thu Sep 10 04:50:11 2020 Return-Path: X-Original-To: emailcore@ietf.org Delivered-To: emailcore@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from ietfa.amsl.com (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id BFBD33A0930; Thu, 10 Sep 2020 04:50:05 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: Robert Wilton via Datatracker To: "The IESG" Cc: emailcore-chairs@ietf.org, emailcore@ietf.org X-Test-IDTracker: no X-IETF-IDTracker: 7.16.0 Auto-Submitted: auto-generated Precedence: bulk Reply-To: Robert Wilton Message-ID: <159973860577.24805.15900652418728069539@ietfa.amsl.com> Date: Thu, 10 Sep 2020 04:50:05 -0700 Archived-At: Subject: [Emailcore] Robert Wilton's No Objection on charter-ietf-emailcore-00-00 X-BeenThere: emailcore@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 List-Id: EMAILCORE proposed working group list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 10 Sep 2020 11:50:06 -0000 Robert Wilton has entered the following ballot position for charter-ietf-emailcore-00-00: No Objection When responding, please keep the subject line intact and reply to all email addresses included in the To and CC lines. (Feel free to cut this introductory paragraph, however.) The document, along with other ballot positions, can be found here: https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/charter-ietf-emailcore/ There are no remarks associated with this position. From nobody Fri Sep 11 09:41:23 2020 Return-Path: X-Original-To: emailcore@ietf.org Delivered-To: emailcore@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from ietfa.amsl.com (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id B58FE3A1404; Fri, 11 Sep 2020 09:41:17 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit From: The IESG To: "IETF-Announce" X-Test-IDTracker: no X-IETF-IDTracker: 7.16.0 Auto-Submitted: auto-generated Precedence: bulk Cc: emailcore@ietf.org Reply-To: iesg@ietf.org MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Message-ID: <159984247765.22475.10857078679222584176@ietfa.amsl.com> Date: Fri, 11 Sep 2020 09:41:17 -0700 Archived-At: Subject: [Emailcore] WG Review: Revision of core Email specifications (emailcore) X-BeenThere: emailcore@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 List-Id: EMAILCORE proposed working group list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 11 Sep 2020 16:41:18 -0000 A new IETF WG has been proposed in the Applications and Real-Time Area. The IESG has not made any determination yet. The following draft charter was submitted, and is provided for informational purposes only. Please send your comments to the IESG mailing list (iesg@ietf.org) by 2020-09-21. Revision of core Email specifications (emailcore) ----------------------------------------------------------------------- Current status: Proposed WG Chairs: Alexey Melnikov Seth Blank Assigned Area Director: Barry Leiba Applications and Real-Time Area Directors: Barry Leiba Murray Kucherawy Mailing list: Address: emailcore@ietf.org To subscribe: https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/emailcore Archive: ​https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/browse/emailcore/ Group page: https://datatracker.ietf.org/group/emailcore/ Charter: https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/charter-ietf-emailcore/ The base documents defining Internet messaging — colloquially, email -- are RFC 5321 (protocol) and RFC 5322 (format). These are revisions and consolidations of prior documents and were last published in 2008. They currently sit at Draft Standard status, a status that no longer exists according to the current IETF procedure. Since then some errata have accumulated (both submitted to IETF and reported directly to editors), as have comments made about these documents not necessarily describing best email practices. There is now sufficient critical mass to undertake a limited review and revision of these documents for the purpose of advancing them to Internet Standard status. This working group will conduct a limited review and revision to the base email specifications, and will publish new versions of these documents at Internet Standard status, per RFC 6410. The limited review is restricted to corrections and clarifications only, with a strong emphasis on keeping these minimal and avoiding broader changes to terminology or document organization. In addition to processing existing, verified errata and errata marked as "held for document update", the WG may address newly-offered errata. However, no new protocol extensions or amendments will be considered for inclusion into 5321bis and 5322bis documents, unless they are already published as IETF Stream RFCs and are at sufficient maturity level to move to Internet Standard. The working group will also work on an Applicability Statement in parallel with 5321bis and 5322bis, to capture relationships to other documented and widely deployed work (such as recommended extensions) and current email practices, including transport security and other issues from the UTA working group's output. 5321bis and 5322bis will be submitted for publication before this document is finalized, and the "bis" documents will have priority for the working group's attention until they are finished. Upon completion of these three milestones, and assuming there is still the momentum to do so, the working group may undertake similar review and revision of other email specifications. Such future work will require rechartering. Milestones: TBD From nobody Wed Sep 23 04:14:36 2020 Return-Path: X-Original-To: emailcore@ietf.org Delivered-To: emailcore@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from ietfa.amsl.com (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2D3EE3A0F8F; Wed, 23 Sep 2020 04:14:34 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: Robert Wilton via Datatracker To: "The IESG" Cc: emailcore-chairs@ietf.org, emailcore@ietf.org X-Test-IDTracker: no X-IETF-IDTracker: 7.17.0 Auto-Submitted: auto-generated Precedence: bulk Reply-To: Robert Wilton Message-ID: <160085967368.26339.16874982557665748383@ietfa.amsl.com> Date: Wed, 23 Sep 2020 04:14:34 -0700 Archived-At: Subject: [Emailcore] Robert Wilton's No Objection on charter-ietf-emailcore-00-01: (with COMMENT) X-BeenThere: emailcore@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 List-Id: EMAILCORE proposed working group list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 23 Sep 2020 11:14:34 -0000 Robert Wilton has entered the following ballot position for charter-ietf-emailcore-00-01: No Objection When responding, please keep the subject line intact and reply to all email addresses included in the To and CC lines. (Feel free to cut this introductory paragraph, however.) The document, along with other ballot positions, can be found here: https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/charter-ietf-emailcore/ ---------------------------------------------------------------------- COMMENT: ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Is this an appropriate time to add the formal milestones, or should that be done later? From nobody Wed Sep 23 04:22:28 2020 Return-Path: X-Original-To: emailcore@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: emailcore@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6C7AA3A0F96; Wed, 23 Sep 2020 04:22:26 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.402 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.402 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, FREEMAIL_FORGED_FROMDOMAIN=0.248, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, HEADER_FROM_DIFFERENT_DOMAINS=0.249, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_BLOCKED=0.001, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_H2=-0.001, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001] autolearn=no autolearn_force=no Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id l75AyP_dNJmi; Wed, 23 Sep 2020 04:22:25 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail-vs1-f48.google.com (mail-vs1-f48.google.com [209.85.217.48]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 592F73A0F98; Wed, 23 Sep 2020 04:22:25 -0700 (PDT) Received: by mail-vs1-f48.google.com with SMTP id x203so12180794vsc.11; Wed, 23 Sep 2020 04:22:25 -0700 (PDT) X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date :message-id:subject:to:cc; bh=LAdPI85aVemvKPE12O3bcsy3VG7pm158n6nb0gHVTYg=; b=O82hShASGcGdvJbGXqKnwd4djh2iRszO0f5Utl7ddUElH8HlbIHvhc6IbM5fidNpei W0Q7TMeNDt8PzfeZMsUr9d4UEacQX42M+qDuLsdMgjRwJJ4pxkE0sPoajoHse5rmYDUx coyGxwwfX6CEBXdJ+Aqk3OKj2gWlqdDDM1rWZNVeGZW8A2AFEdLmFlr91N16MW2XpNm6 R3NVy1SsTO5/PZZjPVltHcLXxioILUEfTPOnut78G8CoJN5hN3lC50xTaox+H/IW2ckh njW0fiXjHr3Ol6ry25CByQAlAUBBdCyxr8VJ9bd9kZz95/zmH8PTpaAIZnqivRYIE6Qn zhMA== X-Gm-Message-State: AOAM533p+DxOihJ+lPUt5rF3uQ8TIAR0gbuiYAgU2rFIvluDDia/0mns EVLvoSJbKuVhyzE47eJ98w/Y4qTj5hu85CrWPfnQUS1g X-Google-Smtp-Source: ABdhPJwJtfQWFt9lXQExhKxZGVvl6lfzdbVZQU3/dD+mufLIzaGGqd11UPEqYx5vmyjATiwRf+J0aMm19QwbzYB3gmo= X-Received: by 2002:a67:f9d6:: with SMTP id c22mr6246853vsq.49.1600860143947; Wed, 23 Sep 2020 04:22:23 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 References: <160085967368.26339.16874982557665748383@ietfa.amsl.com> In-Reply-To: <160085967368.26339.16874982557665748383@ietfa.amsl.com> From: Barry Leiba Date: Wed, 23 Sep 2020 07:22:12 -0400 Message-ID: To: emailcore-chairs@ietf.org Cc: The IESG , Robert Wilton , emailcore@ietf.org Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Emailcore] Robert Wilton's No Objection on charter-ietf-emailcore-00-01: (with COMMENT) X-BeenThere: emailcore@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: EMAILCORE proposed working group list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 23 Sep 2020 11:22:26 -0000 > Is this an appropriate time to add the formal milestones, or should that be done later? Indeed: Chairs, please get me milestone dates for the two -bis documents. Barry From nobody Fri Sep 25 12:04:38 2020 Return-Path: X-Original-To: emailcore@ietf.org Delivered-To: emailcore@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from ietfa.amsl.com (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9E0193A076F; Fri, 25 Sep 2020 12:04:33 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit From: The IESG To: "IETF-Announce" X-Test-IDTracker: no X-IETF-IDTracker: 7.17.0 Auto-Submitted: auto-generated Precedence: bulk Cc: emailcore@ietf.org, emailcore-chairs@ietf.org, The IESG MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Message-ID: <160106067362.31843.12718197210149080734@ietfa.amsl.com> Date: Fri, 25 Sep 2020 12:04:33 -0700 Archived-At: Subject: [Emailcore] WG Action: Formed Revision of core Email specifications (emailcore) X-BeenThere: emailcore@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 List-Id: EMAILCORE proposed working group list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 25 Sep 2020 19:04:36 -0000 A new IETF WG has been formed in the Applications and Real-Time Area. For additional information, please contact the Area Directors or the WG Chairs. Revision of core Email specifications (emailcore) ----------------------------------------------------------------------- Current status: Proposed WG Chairs: Alexey Melnikov Seth Blank Assigned Area Director: Barry Leiba Applications and Real-Time Area Directors: Barry Leiba Murray Kucherawy Mailing list: Address: emailcore@ietf.org To subscribe: https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/emailcore Archive: ​https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/browse/emailcore/ Group page: https://datatracker.ietf.org/group/emailcore/ Charter: https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/charter-ietf-emailcore/ The base documents defining Internet messaging — colloquially, email -- are RFC 5321 (protocol) and RFC 5322 (format). These are revisions and consolidations of prior documents and were last published in 2008. They currently sit at Draft Standard status, a status that no longer exists according to the current IETF procedure. Since then some errata have accumulated (both submitted to IETF and reported directly to editors), as have comments made about these documents not necessarily describing best email practices. There is now sufficient critical mass to undertake a limited review and revision of these documents for the purpose of advancing them to Internet Standard status. This working group will conduct a limited review and revision to the base email specifications, and will publish new versions of these documents at Internet Standard status, per RFC 6410. The limited review is restricted to corrections and clarifications only, with a strong emphasis on keeping these minimal and avoiding broader changes to terminology or document organization. In addition to processing existing, verified errata and errata marked as "held for document update", the WG may address newly-offered errata. However, no new protocol extensions or amendments will be considered for inclusion into 5321bis and 5322bis documents, unless they are already published as IETF Stream RFCs and are at sufficient maturity level to move to Internet Standard. The working group will also work on an Applicability Statement in parallel with 5321bis and 5322bis, to capture relationships to other documented and widely deployed work (recommended extensions, transport security and other issues from the UTA working group's output, and such) and current email practices. 5321bis and 5322bis will be submitted for publication before this document is finalized, and the "bis" documents will have priority for the working group's attention until they are finished. Upon completion of these three milestones, and assuming there is still the momentum to do so, the working group may undertake similar review and revision of other email specifications. Such future work will require rechartering. From nobody Sun Sep 27 06:41:28 2020 Return-Path: X-Original-To: emailcore@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: emailcore@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id CB4733A08AE for ; Sun, 27 Sep 2020 06:41:25 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.112 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.112 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, NICE_REPLY_A=-0.213, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_BLOCKED=0.001, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id QS70O9lULYni for ; Sun, 27 Sep 2020 06:41:24 -0700 (PDT) Received: from denver.dinauz.org (denver.dinauz.org [37.59.56.11]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher AECDH-AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 047DB3A0538 for ; Sun, 27 Sep 2020 06:41:23 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (localhost.localdomain [127.0.0.1]) by denver.dinauz.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id A234160583 for ; Sun, 27 Sep 2020 15:41:20 +0200 (CEST) Received: from denver.dinauz.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (denver.dinauz.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id TEaH52EHV_ak for ; Sun, 27 Sep 2020 15:41:20 +0200 (CEST) Received: from macbook-pro-de-julien-1.home (lfbn-idf3-1-527-171.w86-252.abo.wanadoo.fr [86.252.110.171]) by denver.dinauz.org (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 7E4DA60581 for ; Sun, 27 Sep 2020 15:41:20 +0200 (CEST) To: emailcore@ietf.org References: <160106067362.31843.12718197210149080734@ietfa.amsl.com> From: =?UTF-8?Q?Julien_=c3=89LIE?= Organization: TrigoFACILE -- http://www.trigofacile.com/ Message-ID: <17207efb-78fb-acba-8cb6-8a2a4f1abdfc@trigofacile.com> Date: Sun, 27 Sep 2020 15:40:03 +0200 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Macintosh; Intel Mac OS X 10.15; rv:68.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/68.12.0 MIME-Version: 1.0 In-Reply-To: <160106067362.31843.12718197210149080734@ietfa.amsl.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8; format=flowed Content-Language: fr Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Emailcore] WG Action: Formed Revision of core Email specifications (emailcore) X-BeenThere: emailcore@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: EMAILCORE proposed working group list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sun, 27 Sep 2020 13:41:26 -0000 Hi all, > The base documents defining Internet messaging — colloquially, email -- > are RFC 5321 (protocol) and RFC 5322 (format). > > This working group will conduct a limited review and revision to the base > email specifications, and will publish new versions of these documents at > Internet Standard status, per RFC 6410. Great move! > Upon completion of these three milestones, and assuming there is still > the momentum to do so, the working group may undertake similar review and > revision of other email specifications. Such future work will require > rechartering. Could MIME RFCs 2045 and 2047, used for e-mails, be similarly revised to become Internet Standards? This way, we shall afterwards begin to move NNTP and Netnews article format RFCs to the Internet Standard maturity level! (a dozen RFCs, starting with RFC 3977 and 5536). -- Julien ÉLIE « J'aime les calculs faux car ils donnent des résultats plus justes. » (Jean Arp) From nobody Sun Sep 27 08:41:16 2020 Return-Path: X-Original-To: emailcore@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: emailcore@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3BB073A0FCC; Sun, 27 Sep 2020 08:41:11 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.897 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.897 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_NONE=0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id xa7KOs-ta6pA; Sun, 27 Sep 2020 08:41:09 -0700 (PDT) Received: from bsa2.jck.com (bsa2.jck.com [70.88.254.51]) (using TLSv1 with cipher DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 844D83A044A; Sun, 27 Sep 2020 08:41:09 -0700 (PDT) Received: from [198.252.137.10] (helo=PSB) by bsa2.jck.com with esmtp (Exim 4.82 (FreeBSD)) (envelope-from ) id 1kMYnU-000MIv-BU; Sun, 27 Sep 2020 11:41:08 -0400 Date: Sun, 27 Sep 2020 11:41:02 -0400 From: John C Klensin To: emailcore@ietf.org cc: ietf-smtp@ietf.org Message-ID: X-Mailer: Mulberry/4.0.8 (Win32) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline X-SA-Exim-Connect-IP: 198.252.137.10 X-SA-Exim-Mail-From: john-ietf@jck.com X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No (on bsa2.jck.com); SAEximRunCond expanded to false Archived-At: Subject: [Emailcore] Document updates and interactions with the ietf-smtp mailing list X-BeenThere: emailcore@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: EMAILCORE proposed working group list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sun, 27 Sep 2020 15:41:11 -0000 (ietf-smtp@ietf.org is copied for convenience in this note -- please do not include it in any replies.) Hi. Now that we have a WG and a separate mailing list... (1) The last several hours have included a discussion on ietf-smtp about domain validation and possible modifications to SMTP that would presumably go into 5321bis. If we are going to have a separate mailing list for this WG, threads that propose 5321 (or 5322) modifications should be on the emailcore list and, if we are going to avoid very confused editors and others, the emailcore list exclusively. I suggest that co-chairs either take on responsibility for enforcing that principle or that they find someone to do so. (2) draft-klensin-email-core-as-00 will expire this week. Unless someone (presumably including the co-chairs) provides a convincing argument for me to do otherwise, I do not intend to post an updated version of that document. I would be willing to post a version with a draft-ietf-emailcore... name, but that means that someone needs to initiate the process of designating it as a WG draft. And, as I have said several times before, I don't intend to be editor of that document as it evolves with WG discussion, so I hope the co-chairs have a volunteer to whom I can send the XML and notes and a plan. (3) Similarly, I do not expect there to be a draft-klensin-rfc5321bis-04, so, if and when people want to see an updated version of draft-klensin-rfc5321bis-03, there should be some action to authorize posting of what would presumably be draft-ietf-emailcore-rfc5321bis-00. best, john From nobody Mon Sep 28 03:04:11 2020 Return-Path: X-Original-To: emailcore@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: emailcore@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 842B43A0B37 for ; Mon, 28 Sep 2020 03:04:09 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.31 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.31 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, NICE_REPLY_A=-0.213, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_H3=0.001, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_WL=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); 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Mon, 28 Sep 2020 06:04:04 -0400 (EDT) To: =?UTF-8?Q?Julien_=c3=89LIE?= , emailcore@ietf.org References: <160106067362.31843.12718197210149080734@ietfa.amsl.com> <17207efb-78fb-acba-8cb6-8a2a4f1abdfc@trigofacile.com> From: Alexey Melnikov Message-ID: <263b6493-2f8d-1b31-dc94-4777338b46e3@fastmail.fm> Date: Mon, 28 Sep 2020 11:02:44 +0100 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows NT 6.1; WOW64; rv:68.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/68.12.0 MIME-Version: 1.0 In-Reply-To: <17207efb-78fb-acba-8cb6-8a2a4f1abdfc@trigofacile.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Content-Language: en-GB Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Emailcore] WG Action: Formed Revision of core Email specifications (emailcore) X-BeenThere: emailcore@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: EMAILCORE proposed working group list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 28 Sep 2020 10:04:10 -0000 Hi Julien, On 27/09/2020 14:40, Julien ÉLIE wrote: > Hi all, > >> The base documents defining Internet messaging — colloquially, email -- >> are RFC 5321 (protocol) and RFC 5322 (format). >> >> This working group will conduct a limited review and revision to the >> base >> email specifications, and will publish new versions of these >> documents at >> Internet Standard status, per RFC 6410. > > Great move! > >> Upon completion of these three milestones, and assuming there is still >> the momentum to do so, the working group may undertake similar review >> and >> revision of other email specifications.  Such future work will require >> rechartering. > > Could MIME RFCs 2045 and 2047, used for e-mails, be similarly revised > to become Internet Standards? > > This way, we shall afterwards begin to move NNTP and Netnews article > format RFCs to the Internet Standard maturity level!  (a dozen RFCs, > starting with RFC 3977 and 5536). Once we are done with the current set of 3 documents, MIME RFCs will likely be at the top of the list of documents to revise. But in the meantime, we should concentrate energy on 5321bis and 5522bis. Best Regards, Alexey From nobody Mon Sep 28 10:57:05 2020 Return-Path: X-Original-To: emailcore@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: emailcore@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3C98F3A1320 for ; Mon, 28 Sep 2020 10:57:04 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.098 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.098 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_H3=0.001, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_WL=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (1152-bit key) header.d=tana.it Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 5GwkpsUdHhbN for ; Mon, 28 Sep 2020 10:57:02 -0700 (PDT) Received: from wmail.tana.it (wmail.tana.it [62.94.243.226]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id C66DD3A131E for ; Mon, 28 Sep 2020 10:57:01 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=tana.it; s=delta; t=1601315817; bh=+Xis87xRkOY4dtuvsXFY3tGDMF+h4z/nO/yrGhfjJj0=; l=1230; h=To:Cc:References:From:Date:In-Reply-To; b=BmboeTqNnKLpHeGZALv1ZHmi+mClfpQ8LCT6o4L24iC5FR6JoXMX9gNcMIFTnVEhG gIEQUEMX/9wpDpRA8uVIwfoeTyEsAbcGqKMdiH/r1/nBs6n8dUQw7hROr5TFsKh9qO WTSIF31ttkfZdaWKVVqJKMO21oAwmOLeL083b0LRA9kukjkd34FHAnpHBExDl Authentication-Results: tana.it; auth=pass (details omitted) Received: from [172.25.197.111] (pcale.tana [172.25.197.111]) (AUTH: CRAM-MD5 uXDGrn@SYT0/k, TLS: TLS1.3, 128bits, ECDHE_RSA_AES_128_GCM_SHA256) by wmail.tana.it with ESMTPSA id 00000000005DC08B.000000005F7223E9.00006995; Mon, 28 Sep 2020 19:56:57 +0200 To: John C Klensin , Sam Varshavchik Cc: Emailcore , Keith Moore References: <6DE405E366F059EA697D51D5@PSB> From: Alessandro Vesely Message-ID: <939e5277-01f3-7fa3-d0ae-1cb1dd5925cd@tana.it> Date: Mon, 28 Sep 2020 19:56:57 +0200 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; Linux x86_64; rv:68.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/68.12.0 MIME-Version: 1.0 In-Reply-To: <6DE405E366F059EA697D51D5@PSB> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Language: en-US Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Archived-At: Subject: [Emailcore] EHLO domain validation requirement in RFC 5321 X-BeenThere: emailcore@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: EMAILCORE proposed working group list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 28 Sep 2020 17:57:04 -0000 On Sun 27/Sep/2020 17:23:50 +0200 John C Klensin wrote: > > Also, a substantive note: people decided (fwiw, over my > objections) to create a separate email list for the emailcore > effort. With the very recent formal creation of that WG, I'm > not going to track proposed changes for the potential 5321bis > posted to this list (and hope that the WG Chairs will soon take > that responsibility off my hands). So, if someone would like to > see changes, take them there. Here: The wording in Section 4.1.4 needs to be changed so as to distinguish submission[*] from server to server relaying. As for the latter, there seems to be consensus on "SHOULD NOT": On Sun, 27 Sep 2020 22:00:07 -0400 Keith Moore wrote: > On 9/27/20 9:51 PM, Sam Varshavchik wrote: >> >> To me, "SHOULD NOT" is a better match for "should not be encouraged". The >> current phrasing, "MUST NOT", prohibits it. > > I might agree with that, though I would also like to see some elaboration as to > why it's a Bad Idea in the long run, rather than just SHOULD NOT. Explanations are worth as advice for both client expectations and server filtering. Best Ale -- [*] Appendix G.6.1 and CREF13 of the dangling draft. From nobody Mon Sep 28 11:57:15 2020 Return-Path: X-Original-To: emailcore@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: emailcore@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id EBCC53A1362 for ; Mon, 28 Sep 2020 11:57:13 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.31 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.31 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, NICE_REPLY_A=-0.213, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_NONE=0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=neutral reason="invalid (unsupported algorithm ed25519-sha256)" header.d=wizmail.org header.b=UIRMCmBs; dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=wizmail.org header.b=okECB3f6 Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id H_QqP8cyVQRm for ; 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auth=pass (PLAIN) smtp.auth=jgh@wizmail.org Received: from vgate18.wizint.net ([2a00:1940:107::1:2f:0] helo=lap.dom.ain) by wizmail.org (Exim 4.94.106) (TLS1.3) tls TLS_AES_128_GCM_SHA256 with esmtpsa id 1kMyKg-007Dgx-8N for emailcore@ietf.org (return-path ); Mon, 28 Sep 2020 18:57:06 +0000 To: emailcore@ietf.org References: <6DE405E366F059EA697D51D5@PSB> <939e5277-01f3-7fa3-d0ae-1cb1dd5925cd@tana.it> From: Jeremy Harris Autocrypt: addr=jgh@wizmail.org; prefer-encrypt=mutual; keydata= mQENBFWABsQBCADTFfb9EHGGiDel/iFzU0ag1RuoHfL/09z1y7iQlLynOAQTRRNwCWezmqpD p6zDFOf1Ldp0EdEQtUXva5g2lm3o56o+mnXrEQr11uZIcsfGIck7yV/y/17I7ApgXMPg/mcj ifOTM9C7+Ptghf3jUhj4ErYMFQLelBGEZZifnnAoHLOEAH70DENCI08PfYRRG6lZDB09nPW7 vVG8RbRUWjQyxQUWwXuq4gQohSFDqF4NE8zDHE/DgPJ/yFy+wFr2ab90DsE7vOYb42y95keK tTBp98/Y7/2xbzi8EYrXC+291dwZELMHnYLF5sO/fDcrDdwrde2cbZ+wtpJwtSYPNvVxABEB AAG0JkplcmVteSBIYXJyaXMgKG5vbmUpIDxqZ2hAd2l6bWFpbC5vcmc+iQFOBBMBCAA4FiEE qYbzpr1jd9hzCVjevOWMjOQfMt8FAl4WMuMCGwMFCwkIBwIGFQoJCAsCBBYCAwECHgECF4AA CgkQvOWMjOQfMt946ggAvqDr2jvVnGIN2Njnjl2iiKyw4dYdFzNhZgjTaryiV90BftUDxRsB uTVFUC6XU+B13MEgSK0zRDyI5NpEH+JTW539gWlmz2k2WTTmoBsm/js1ELoAjGr/i32SByqm 0fo3JPctn/lc7oTo0muGYvB5xWhTHRlcT9zGTRUb/6ucabVLiJUrcGhS1OqDGq7nvYQpFZdf Dj7hyyrCKrq6YUPRvoq3aWw/o6aPUN8gmJj+h4pB5dMbbNKm7umz4O3RHWceO9JCGYxfC4uh 0k85bgIVb4wtaljBW90YZRU/5zIjD6r2b6rluY55rLulsyT7xAqe14eE1AlRB1og/s4rUtRf 8LkBDQRVgAbEAQgA6YSx2ik6EbkfxO0x3qwYgow2rcAmhEzijk2Ns0QUKWkN9qfxdlyBi0vA nNu/oK2UikOmV9GTeOzvgBchRxfAx/dCF2RaSUd0W/M4F0/I5y19PAzN9XhAmR50cxYRpTpq ulgFJagdxigj1AmNnOHk0V8qFy7Xk8a1wmKI+Ocv2Jr5Wa5aJwTYzwQMh4jvyzc/le32bTbD ezf1xq5y23HTXzXfkg9RDZmyyfEb8spsYLk8gf5GvSXYxxyKEBCei9eugd4YXwh6bfIgtBj2 ZLYvSDJdDaCdNvYyZtyatahHHhAZ+R+UDBp+hauuIl8E7DtUzDVMKVsfKY71e8FSMYyPGQAR AQABiQEfBBgBAgAJBQJVgAbEAhsMAAoJELzljIzkHzLfTegH/Aktgk6zEBXYZBhLQV5i+Inw /FBxZAUQRpjPGS9n1lAU2V0/Jq3UTDiurXD5ylmgr1ryq9JJ7fe9I/w8gIBZh/IYDot8nLYo BXnFQ444pQHgiTKt/LNbWCmIiw2wXR1rXZAPbh2cKt5X3d0MXBBDt0GpkBfnTu4fIADl5Rvq aPOx5vhNMM+LMCAfPkt+yc68fbrtC0hQ3yQkyvkyChmuVJ/C8T8cqvVp5zQ4e9syuwYkYnZP 7ONCnDaHfNzTOB5/7Gxn8i2vLEtBdzBNEvqHEjDorv2RxzosKS2DW8Eye7LWcRrK4Llnk/T/ mpsWwP2JSveS3nbLcLzflnB2e3fvgK65AQ0EXiRPygEIAMP9Z2LRciWF8OoKUbcnA50W0U60 zTBvb7IMm0Rfaeb+s5vk0bX6Hel8i7dxmQvy0yUBrQq/9NYa90MOcm54b9oETtKHcoe63U3i iZc62ERe5dRIr9EG1DAN3SW5fRc5H234mskCdl06ftOJCsXLL1enbunWF8WYQpn8hzsoQqzs klloqd24z8c/+3C5cPjI26hyGFR0W5Q1T8xBMqxgc5W0smyyqDdDs/H1VXrxfQdculDXkM3B EUkeZMsyT7Q8jr8qHv13T1dPCyObP4wXkaOSEtOcBAeF2B1TUVUEhqPzXbG6+oZWgVUKWB8o oHReboJUCkQC8jAIZrr9xpgCMPMAEQEAAYkBPAQYAQgAJhYhBKmG86a9Y3fYcwlY3rzljIzk HzLfBQJeJE/KAhsMBQkB4TOAAAoJELzljIzkHzLfjg4IAM2GxIUaXLfO22z2JWS3byFvfRNS eXLZx2cDokn8AGpzTY+k5mcCkOQVUUz9MuxM50VnrRuBaeH++LfzSghKRWLx2PdJlKzThyFi y23NagSwx4i/R2J8xiPtajZm5SS3slEg1pt3NhgDkkrTQUTHYcf4F0O3YgdoqGKR7m10jqXz gzwQE65Pb0QUX5clxy55oV1pXoq1qjELIYVH9aS8bpI0RE86axHwpOvG4cQrMWZ0tg1txwZ/ DSstczlx7/Ptxfdd+A0x27UhS7ijUuqXx/z8Vh7U/oj/lsVERXyxuUgojD5kkagRLURuYBef CxJ/k6RTKs8juRsbVGfJMmNdfyK4OAReJFQPEgorBgEEAZdVAQUBAQdAPr/8EgFM8AkB/CZz +BGJIezPAdpTYFLvRhsem2GoBicDAQgHiQE8BBgBCAAmFiEEqYbzpr1jd9hzCVjevOWMjOQf Mt8FAl4kVA8CGwwFCQPCZwAACgkQvOWMjOQfMt99PAgApNBPoJog4UKuiP4YP4vvntA4etz8 z7WzVU4uI2ep7++qEaZOafHlSaUILaGag4CSh7KmxrTUjtoJNeX2qx5AQ4pdlNIjMy/V/Z+z 8gJ5vQ3tXglN4P7S6ud6mYKzpGHCvNF2CdzSRa2DRizCy6+sHOrDiH5V7veKE+9LjF+aB9lw PYLeF6Dh4idnxIa3aVwQjAAn3NBYAuhymnqgLgWcrPNaiSP6VIrsu4aCCoeIuc7bCFks6hrR x805g1J6uxixrMu2bW+AbPpRObi5B0pTJhDaLBW1xQgOiwYIAdyu0H2YNMrCBsA0w40UWEIz xrAkJFP/CS+qkjMI47FKq1EzbQ== Message-ID: <0f13f954-ab6b-e60b-8f12-6a9492d3a325@wizmail.org> Date: Mon, 28 Sep 2020 19:57:04 +0100 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; Linux x86_64; rv:68.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/68.11.0 MIME-Version: 1.0 In-Reply-To: <939e5277-01f3-7fa3-d0ae-1cb1dd5925cd@tana.it> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Language: en-GB Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Pcms-Received-Sender: vgate18.wizint.net ([2a00:1940:107::1:2f:0] helo=lap.dom.ain) with esmtpsa Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Emailcore] EHLO domain validation requirement in RFC 5321 X-BeenThere: emailcore@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: EMAILCORE proposed working group list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 28 Sep 2020 18:57:14 -0000 On 28/09/2020 18:56, Alessandro Vesely wrote: > The wording in Section 4.1.4 needs to be changed so as to distinguish > submission[*] from server to server relaying.  As for the latter, there > seems to be consensus on "SHOULD NOT": Side issue: should the standard point out that a local MTA transmitting to a "smarthost MTA" counts, at least in some senses, as submission? I think it does, in so far as there should be authentication done on such clients (possibly as limited as "local subnet IP"). I'm ambivalent on suggesting 587/465 vs. 25 for it. -- Cheers, Jeremy From nobody Mon Sep 28 13:49:04 2020 Return-Path: X-Original-To: emailcore@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: emailcore@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id BA48C3A13EC for ; Mon, 28 Sep 2020 13:49:02 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.851 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.851 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, HEADER_FROM_DIFFERENT_DOMAINS=0.249, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=iecc.com header.b=WKGYAYIr; dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=taugh.com header.b=mun2nAhj Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id IHHln4cpMr9M for ; Mon, 28 Sep 2020 13:49:01 -0700 (PDT) Received: from gal.iecc.com (gal.iecc.com [IPv6:2001:470:1f07:1126:0:43:6f73:7461]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 18E313A13EB for ; Mon, 28 Sep 2020 13:49:00 -0700 (PDT) Received: (qmail 6906 invoked from network); 28 Sep 2020 20:48:58 -0000 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=simple; d=iecc.com; h=date:message-id:from:to:cc:subject:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding; s=1af8.5f724c3a.k2009; bh=zGsB568Rvqu1i3hk4sJpOkERoIC9iJWWtarR9FneKLQ=; b=WKGYAYIrZ0Ruq2CHvjIBeVwjhp5FZq+wHaM9aHWEDTOrLwci20W2KOamQF3Z+VtI86k1tYlkGq3gORo1EYktvyrIAnvly40kyKMJNRfmdBQTSDcnFEaNrHh9DbE5okP5YAoX48j3ukOh095M/1iixfYno0S0iA1xJA68X00LRQ28MXuF7sVUJSbpLS1T70xzG2/2iMSkLNT2fOtZYPs+CWtVTEA+3Uou4QDpzk8l23yqqwrYBiKaArct/5NDl9x8/lehJm0UJVJD1g7j0qH2hhV8g+bESGtoEo2IPJPa61uYWlMoH07Dp85kUfUJPTrEJ6NVhKirgWpgjuHXPoZP6A== DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=simple; d=taugh.com; h=date:message-id:from:to:cc:subject:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding; s=1af8.5f724c3a.k2009; bh=zGsB568Rvqu1i3hk4sJpOkERoIC9iJWWtarR9FneKLQ=; b=mun2nAhjuOriXC60B/AXAZF0tfS0gKaZWQWB+KeDX9UvBH/t13X6X5MNrXFknZsfk5I+12Pw0TG+eVQO+5Q+jc//kKp3mzamTeT2CkIw76rpHl3R/2Hp+F35kUIGQ3Hpibs4d2+cWvn46ktUlF7FKyvYmu+KKifWEQS56KNGglAIWy2c2Np8fMPVrIkGKrJ0NIztyTllsyC87w2j3Oy07K6OT0LAzcbYlp4+xdPSxzEWhPMi6R+Zl/7GTPlBeTbYVfaVgOpDKCWlgcEuW/qUaN4ixqHlurozpNN3moK+F3D4oSGRpjKNiVSQX2RzkphzVEEOIeWAVNsUqtScI4Nd9w== Received: from ary.qy ([IPv6:2001:470:1f07:1126::78:696d:6170]) by imap.iecc.com ([IPv6:2001:470:1f07:1126::78:696d:6170]) with ESMTPS (TLS1.2 ECDHE-RSA AES-256-GCM AEAD) via TCP6; 28 Sep 2020 20:48:57 -0000 Received: by ary.qy (Postfix, from userid 501) id A46B222A27E5; Mon, 28 Sep 2020 16:48:57 -0400 (EDT) Date: 28 Sep 2020 16:48:57 -0400 Message-Id: <20200928204857.A46B222A27E5@ary.qy> From: "John Levine" To: emailcore@ietf.org Cc: jgh@wizmail.org In-Reply-To: <0f13f954-ab6b-e60b-8f12-6a9492d3a325@wizmail.org> Organization: Taughannock Networks X-Headerized: yes Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-transfer-encoding: 8bit Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Emailcore] EHLO domain validation requirement in RFC 5321 X-BeenThere: emailcore@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: EMAILCORE proposed working group list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 28 Sep 2020 20:49:03 -0000 In article <0f13f954-ab6b-e60b-8f12-6a9492d3a325@wizmail.org> you write: >On 28/09/2020 18:56, Alessandro Vesely wrote: >> The wording in Section 4.1.4 needs to be changed so as to distinguish >> submission[*] from server to server relaying.  As for the latter, there >> seems to be consensus on "SHOULD NOT": > >Side issue: should the standard point out that a local MTA transmitting >to a "smarthost MTA" counts, at least in some senses, as submission? Take a look at RFC 6409 which I don't think we're planning to update. Its section 3 describes the differences between submission and SMTP relay. If the client is authenticated somehow (SMTP AUTH or known local IP range) that sure sounds like submission to me. There's also other criteria, submission usually cleans up the message and adds missing headers, and allows relay to non-local addresses. From nobody Wed Sep 30 07:12:05 2020 Return-Path: X-Original-To: emailcore@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: emailcore@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1E3923A0964; Wed, 30 Sep 2020 07:11:46 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.31 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.31 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, NICE_REPLY_A=-0.213, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_H3=0.001, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_WL=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=fastmail.fm header.b=BblAQ6m5; dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=messagingengine.com header.b=VFT67Oqo Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id b8T3ln6wlo8G; Wed, 30 Sep 2020 07:11:44 -0700 (PDT) Received: from out5-smtp.messagingengine.com (out5-smtp.messagingengine.com [66.111.4.29]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher AECDH-AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id A4FD33A09EC; Wed, 30 Sep 2020 07:11:44 -0700 (PDT) Received: from compute7.internal (compute7.nyi.internal [10.202.2.47]) by mailout.nyi.internal (Postfix) with ESMTP id E5C755C0069; Wed, 30 Sep 2020 10:11:43 -0400 (EDT) Received: from mailfrontend1 ([10.202.2.162]) by compute7.internal (MEProxy); Wed, 30 Sep 2020 10:11:43 -0400 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=fastmail.fm; h= subject:to:cc:references:from:message-id:date:mime-version :in-reply-to:content-type:content-transfer-encoding; s=fm1; bh=m Tdh6uRsYD/P5zWLnb2DPutx5ff67tgCBc3PNQqBOEc=; b=BblAQ6m51RIakCKAf YvcyHE7scHR5E79MOEYizy2CR8SJaqhPoKYE+ePkPvwV1E601rqosMSOfpTZwVaC GB8OB9OWq5My8iWLNHodwvc3e0sQRiPVNWdS1Wro6sEmDBeR1GgbxTuVvrjfWqVh 2UkmAzcJw1QB2SkEqF5OngjaAwWPEZZk8eh/3xJxVHYy9jR+54hoXyB9M3ltpb/J IzSFJlpvRcE9JT7nD0ehzI8NK0ErGkHoDCxHiBI0ox2eNRcSR43bBm0667VTCd+0 WEefbiNt/i1cNY+WB3VMWFiHQUHI40WrMG6cBXnTpC/nRz2uixkDXFEpYKNeCsUB 9CP+A== DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d= messagingengine.com; h=cc:content-transfer-encoding:content-type :date:from:in-reply-to:message-id:mime-version:references :subject:to:x-me-proxy:x-me-proxy:x-me-sender:x-me-sender :x-sasl-enc; s=fm3; bh=mTdh6uRsYD/P5zWLnb2DPutx5ff67tgCBc3PNQqBO Ec=; b=VFT67OqoGtpe0gy38IEFgTpV0icdESUqPN101+bhFvgV6H0GQuQ5THJ4B xQZyEwOzN8wRWv6XIXp99il/+RSQ0oG8y5N3dTSDgw9OIxnsS/KYsXIUEiI2hRx8 Rdy6Zt3em36aHD9XVNYe4D10b+DVwp4cDELDmx8cPfDGooBacg4TXW1DIJ/s8dJx TJyq+LaeFjiuGP9rXEr0uPVjjwkdcAEYS/MxEt58F3W4U/B/vtDaYvOkDAuOmFlK wVKDGiuKxdBmMprE9jFitkbd5ZzkLJciPcayb9xoMT0XIobmgmASu+90p3Nc1O2N p1JNjAVNR3ugsGuSqnSQanljNnQzw== X-ME-Sender: X-ME-Proxy-Cause: gggruggvucftvghtrhhoucdtuddrgedujedrfedvgdejtdcutefuodetggdotefrodftvf curfhrohhfihhlvgemucfhrghsthforghilhdpqfgfvfdpuffrtefokffrpgfnqfghnecu uegrihhlohhuthemuceftddtnecunecujfgurhepuffvfhfhkffffgggjggtgfesthejre dttdefjeenucfhrhhomheptehlvgigvgihucfovghlnhhikhhovhcuoegrrghmvghlnhhi khhovhesfhgrshhtmhgrihhlrdhfmheqnecuggftrfgrthhtvghrnhepleduffevudevie duteffjeffvefgtdffteduteelheejveffhfeigeekjedtteffnecukfhppeehrdekuddr uddttddrkeeknecuvehluhhsthgvrhfuihiivgeptdenucfrrghrrghmpehmrghilhhfrh homheprggrmhgvlhhnihhkohhvsehfrghsthhmrghilhdrfhhm X-ME-Proxy: Received: from [192.168.1.222] (host5-81-100-88.range5-81.btcentralplus.com [5.81.100.88]) by mail.messagingengine.com (Postfix) with ESMTPA id 997603280066; Wed, 30 Sep 2020 10:11:42 -0400 (EDT) To: John C Klensin , emailcore@ietf.org Cc: ietf-smtp@ietf.org References: From: Alexey Melnikov Message-ID: <2785867d-b5cf-523f-f99e-5e1faa285c7a@fastmail.fm> Date: Wed, 30 Sep 2020 15:10:16 +0100 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows NT 6.1; WOW64; rv:68.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/68.12.0 MIME-Version: 1.0 In-Reply-To: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Language: en-GB Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Emailcore] Document updates and interactions with the ietf-smtp mailing list X-BeenThere: emailcore@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: EMAILCORE proposed working group list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 30 Sep 2020 14:11:46 -0000 Hi John, On 27/09/2020 16:41, John C Klensin wrote: > (ietf-smtp@ietf.org is copied for convenience in this note -- > please do not include it in any replies.) > > Hi. > > Now that we have a WG and a separate mailing list... > > (1) The last several hours have included a discussion on > ietf-smtp about domain validation and possible modifications to > SMTP that would presumably go into 5321bis. If we are going to > have a separate mailing list for this WG, threads that propose > 5321 (or 5322) modifications should be on the emailcore list > and, if we are going to avoid very confused editors and others, > the emailcore list exclusively. I concur. I encourage people to use emailcore@ietf.org for further discussions. > I suggest that co-chairs either > take on responsibility for enforcing that principle or that they > find someone to do so. > > (2) draft-klensin-email-core-as-00 will expire this week. > Unless someone (presumably including the co-chairs) provides a > convincing argument for me to do otherwise, I do not intend to > post an updated version of that document. I would be willing to > post a version with a draft-ietf-emailcore... name, but that > means that someone needs to initiate the process of designating > it as a WG draft. And, as I have said several times before, I > don't intend to be editor of that document as it evolves with WG > discussion, so I hope the co-chairs have a volunteer to whom I > can send the XML and notes and a plan. Ack. > (3) Similarly, I do not expect there to be a > draft-klensin-rfc5321bis-04, so, if and when people want to see > an updated version of draft-klensin-rfc5321bis-03, there should > be some action to authorize posting of what would presumably be > draft-ietf-emailcore-rfc5321bis-00. Chairs will start adoption calls within a couple of weeks. Best Regards, Alexey From nobody Wed Sep 30 21:22:53 2020 Return-Path: X-Original-To: emailcore@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: emailcore@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 179713A09FA for ; Wed, 30 Sep 2020 21:22:51 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.098 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.098 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=valimail.com Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 5BbnpIOH6sZP for ; Wed, 30 Sep 2020 21:22:49 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail-wm1-x333.google.com (mail-wm1-x333.google.com [IPv6:2a00:1450:4864:20::333]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 1238B3A09F9 for ; Wed, 30 Sep 2020 21:22:49 -0700 (PDT) Received: by mail-wm1-x333.google.com with SMTP id s13so1479278wmh.4 for ; Wed, 30 Sep 2020 21:22:48 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=valimail.com; s=google2048; h=mime-version:from:date:message-id:subject:to; bh=WCywE6MncIAsFKnxB9gN+irRhOQsTyp9QqWp91kWfL0=; b=C8vFT6sQMFUHCYMe8t0LTpFB/4qSuYLaaEQZbNPU2dWk0BiH4ARG+OdzT5fwBFWLtD qiK0OsPPXgbuvuzNVIHlcEfzM/FVK+Zx6xCarrHBaW8cchk9fazIwoyVfrCAC3KO3yux LTgQQYs6+ln3/w+q8NiNwe3n5N75wm0FohcEA/F6+hGOYVsxzYz1zpIrNRoeD8us2KN+ v8oZg64vl6vpfrmL/+LY6FBRmU9GrfTbFakZjKf3q4p0ghGr+qvudAV1jKLOGPpVR7SV BGHNhS9PSswkmropovU71ed9klklJC0rvrtDVOXcMgI8Bb40krJ+LI87nOJETIGRaMwh Rf6w== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:from:date:message-id:subject:to; bh=WCywE6MncIAsFKnxB9gN+irRhOQsTyp9QqWp91kWfL0=; b=nIpr9h6QXwMbjdxOh187fW8hrLyAl3AUB11ZLinWMA5/2yABOF64pgTzT6LJlsuDDU cIaYbItDoBN5zSI2NTYSYO8u5VTcvEZ70PGdQzP4Z64rS5J7j6yvqQWGPYo4gLRWxtiN qwIAnkoGOAsVlCNttuTthFxeulevcIqvlTfA/eR/Ijrmtzg3ZHXkSqjewTr56e1d3rxD uscJL28IO09Sf+/03zwd30EeuN8ZAk4kvpmR7J/wGrpiljOUWaV0ZV/zKkp1cHoGx/MN HHpa25GufnqIncYmFJLq1vM7DKmjOtkOxqc9Ps/Sh5fqQVgop6uEX0ELf4fzy9idsQhW RaOA== X-Gm-Message-State: AOAM532pphd1WHz2aLZr8mizFtcuNzZYctTE+trhDN3QsQsq1HK+T6oC 97scA/TqF2fZ05SqiTY+5qqUzgXivX0goRug6utvSa+2SYyVUg== X-Google-Smtp-Source: ABdhPJwwh5YY9Shfi3xD1vj063ZjWRjh2apB+llYYZMb2ROton2nqv4x1WX8PUvYmNJM8KmRQ9hFc0DDFdFlst2ifAw= X-Received: by 2002:a1c:7d4d:: with SMTP id y74mr6194197wmc.73.1601526166763; Wed, 30 Sep 2020 21:22:46 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 From: Seth Blank Date: Wed, 30 Sep 2020 21:22:35 -0700 Message-ID: To: emailcore@ietf.org Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="00000000000044d54b05b0945ea3" Archived-At: Subject: [Emailcore] Kicking off EMAILCORE work: recap, documents and editors X-BeenThere: emailcore@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: EMAILCORE proposed working group list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 01 Oct 2020 04:22:51 -0000 --00000000000044d54b05b0945ea3 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" This working group was officially chartered late last week, and that charter can be found here: https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/charter-ietf-emailcore/ We held a BOF at IETF108 that reviewed the scope of the EMAILCORE work and charter bashed. If anyone would like to review: - Agenda: https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/agenda-108-emailcore/ - Slides: https://www.ietf.org/proceedings/108/slides/slides-108-emailcore-chairs-slides-02 - Minutes: https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/minutes-108-emailcore/ The chairs have asked John and Pete to re-submit their latest individual drafts as draft-ietf-emailcore-* on 10/6 unless any objections are raised and explained by that date. We then intend to aggressively drive these documents to completion. Consistent with the requirements of Internet Standard, substantive changes to 5321 or 5322 will require strong and obvious consensus. The chairs want the group's expectation to be clear that out of scope, unproductive, or threads that will obviously not reach consensus in a timely manner will be shut down quickly in order to progress this work to completion. Finally, an editor is needed for the applicability statement. The chairs are looking for volunteers, please reach out to us at emailcore-chairs@ietf.org. Thanks everyone, we're looking forward to completing this work productively and quickly, Seth and Alexey, as Chairs -- *Seth Blank* | VP, Standards and New Technologies *e:* seth@valimail.com *p:* 415.273.8818 This email and all data transmitted with it contains confidential and/or proprietary information intended solely for the use of individual(s) authorized to receive it. If you are not an intended and authorized recipient you are hereby notified of any use, disclosure, copying or distribution of the information included in this transmission is prohibited and may be unlawful. Please immediately notify the sender by replying to this email and then delete it from your system. --00000000000044d54b05b0945ea3 Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
This working group was officially chartered late last week= , and that charter can be found here: https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/charter-ie= tf-emailcore/

We held a BOF at IETF108 that reviewed= the scope of the EMAILCORE work and charter bashed. If anyone would like t= o review:
- Minutes:=C2=A0https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/minutes-108-emailcore/
=

The chairs have asked John and Pete to re-submit their l= atest individual drafts as draft-ietf-emailcore-* on 10/6 unless any object= ions are raised and explained by that date.

We the= n intend to aggressively drive these documents to completion. Consistent wi= th the requirements of Internet Standard, substantive changes to 5321 or 53= 22 will require strong and obvious consensus. The chairs want the group'= ;s expectation to be clear that out of scope, unproductive,=C2=A0or threads= that will obviously not reach consensus in a timely manner will be shut do= wn quickly in order to progress this work to completion.

Finally, an editor is needed for the applicability statement. The ch= airs are looking for volunteers, please reach out to us at=C2=A0emailcore-chairs@ietf.org.

Thanks everyone, we're looking forward to completi= ng this work productively and quickly,

Seth and Al= exey, as Chairs

--

Seth Blanke: seth@valimail.com
p: 415.273.8818
=


This e= mail and all data transmitted with it contains confidential and/or propriet= ary information intended solely for the use of individual(s) authorized to = receive it. If you are not an intended and authorized recipient you are her= eby notified of any use, disclosure, copying or distribution of the informa= tion included in this transmission is prohibited and may be unlawful. Pleas= e immediately notify the sender by replying to this email and then delete i= t from your system.

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