From nobody Tue Jul 18 02:02:48 2017 Return-Path: X-Original-To: fud@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: fud@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id C539612009C for ; Tue, 18 Jul 2017 02:02:46 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.921 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.921 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE=-0.0001, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_H4=-0.01, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_WL=-0.01, SPF_HELO_PASS=-0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (1024-bit key) header.d=armh.onmicrosoft.com Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 8Mi57Hx6-jdy for ; Tue, 18 Jul 2017 02:02:44 -0700 (PDT) Received: from EUR01-VE1-obe.outbound.protection.outlook.com (mail-ve1eur01on0078.outbound.protection.outlook.com [104.47.1.78]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 380F31317A1 for ; 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FPR:; SPF:None; MLV:ovrnspm; PTR:InfoNoRecords; LANG:en; spamdiagnosticoutput: 1:99 spamdiagnosticmetadata: NSPM Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="_000_VI1PR0801MB27170D8000D92D0939FFDD3EFAA10VI1PR0801MB2717_" MIME-Version: 1.0 X-OriginatorOrg: arm.com X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-originalarrivaltime: 18 Jul 2017 09:02:40.8921 (UTC) X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-fromentityheader: Hosted X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-id: f34e5979-57d9-4aaa-ad4d-b122a662184d X-MS-Exchange-Transport-CrossTenantHeadersStamped: VI1PR0801MB2718 Archived-At: Subject: [Fud] First drafts about the firmware update description X-BeenThere: fud@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 Precedence: list List-Id: FUD - Firmware Updating Description List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 18 Jul 2017 09:02:47 -0000 --_000_VI1PR0801MB27170D8000D92D0939FFDD3EFAA10VI1PR0801MB2717_ Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Hi all, It took a little bit of time to put a write-up about the work we have been = doing at ARM in the area of firmware updates together. We finally managed t= o submit the IETF drafts. There are two documents: 1) The first document describes the high-level architecture of a firmw= are update service for IoT devices, see https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-moran-fud-architecture-00 2) The second document focuses on specifying the firmware update descr= iption. We call this the "manifest". https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-moran-fud-manifest-00 We would like to have the IETF community to work on a standard for a manife= st. Silicon partners and those developing IoT operating systems have develo= ped their own formats and we hope they can also share what they have been d= oing. Feedback on the documents is appreciated! Ciao Hannes IMPORTANT NOTICE: The contents of this email and any attachments are confid= ential and may also be privileged. If you are not the intended recipient, p= lease notify the sender immediately and do not disclose the contents to any= other person, use it for any purpose, or store or copy the information in = any medium. Thank you. --_000_VI1PR0801MB27170D8000D92D0939FFDD3EFAA10VI1PR0801MB2717_ Content-Type: text/html; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

Hi all,

 

It took a little bit of time to put a write-up about= the work we have been doing at ARM in the area of firmware updates togethe= r. We finally managed to submit the IETF drafts.

 

There are two documents:

 

1)      The first document describes the high-level archite= cture of a firmware update service for IoT devices, see

https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-moran-fud-architec= ture-00

 

2)      The second document focuses on specifying the firmw= are update description. We call this the “manifest”.

https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-moran-fud-manifest= -00

 

We would like to have the IETF community to work on = a standard for a manifest. Silicon partners and those developing IoT operat= ing systems have developed their own formats and we hope they can also shar= e what they have been doing.

 

Feedback on the documents is appreciated!

 

Ciao

Hannes

 

IMPORTANT NOTICE: The contents of this email and any attachments are confid= ential and may also be privileged. If you are not the intended recipient, p= lease notify the sender immediately and do not disclose the contents to any= other person, use it for any purpose, or store or copy the information in any medium. Thank you. --_000_VI1PR0801MB27170D8000D92D0939FFDD3EFAA10VI1PR0801MB2717_-- From nobody Tue Jul 18 04:11:24 2017 Return-Path: X-Original-To: fud@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: fud@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id B54971317A9 for ; Tue, 18 Jul 2017 04:11:22 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -6.9 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-6.9 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_HI=-5, RP_MATCHES_RCVD=-0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id Aze70nEfaZmZ for ; Tue, 18 Jul 2017 04:11:20 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail2-relais-roc.national.inria.fr (mail2-relais-roc.national.inria.fr [192.134.164.83]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 112021317C3 for ; Tue, 18 Jul 2017 04:11:16 -0700 (PDT) X-IronPort-AV: E=Sophos;i="5.40,377,1496095200"; d="scan'208,217";a="283856087" Received: from ip5f5af22e.dynamic.kabel-deutschland.de (HELO snake.fritz.box.mail) ([95.90.242.46]) by mail2-relais-roc.national.inria.fr with ESMTP/TLS/AES256-GCM-SHA384; 18 Jul 2017 13:11:15 +0200 Date: Tue, 18 Jul 2017 13:11:14 +0200 From: Francisco Javier Acosta Padilla To: Hannes Tschofenig , "=?utf-8?Q?fud=40ietf.org?=" Message-ID: In-Reply-To: References: X-Mailer: Airmail (419) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="596decd2_3e7a072a_204" Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Fud] First drafts about the firmware update description X-BeenThere: fud@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 Precedence: list List-Id: FUD - Firmware Updating Description List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 18 Jul 2017 11:11:23 -0000 --596decd2_3e7a072a_204 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Disposition: inline Hi Hannes=21 Thanks a lot for the submission. I=E2=80=99m looking at the documents, for now I only have grammar and syn= tax feedback (small nitpicks), but I=E2=80=99ll try to give more feedback= on the contents. However, how and/or where can we submit the feedback=3F= Best, --=C2=A0 =46rancisco Javier Acosta Padilla Research Engineer at INRIA Saclay IN=46INE Team On 18 July 2017 at 11:02:53, Hannes Tschofenig (hannes.tschofenig=40arm.c= om) wrote: Hi all, =C2=A0 It took a little bit of time to put a write-up about the work we have bee= n doing at ARM in the area of firmware updates together. We finally manag= ed to submit the IET=46 drafts. =C2=A0 There are two documents: =C2=A0 1)=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 The first document describes the high-le= vel architecture of a firmware update service for IoT devices, see https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-moran-fud-architecture-00 =C2=A0 2)=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 The second document focuses on specifyin= g the firmware update description. We call this the =E2=80=9Cmanifest=E2=80= =9D. https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-moran-fud-manifest-00 =C2=A0 We would like to have the IET=46 community to work on a standard for a ma= nifest. Silicon partners and those developing IoT operating systems have = developed their own formats and we hope they can also share what they hav= e been doing. =C2=A0 =46eedback on the documents is appreciated=21 =C2=A0 Ciao Hannes =C2=A0 IMPORTANT NOTICE: The contents of this email and any attachments are conf= idential and may also be privileged. If you are not the intended recipien= t, please notify the sender immediately and do not disclose the contents = to any other person, use it for any purpose, or store or copy the informa= tion in any medium. Thank you. =5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F= =5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F= =5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F =20 =46ud mailing list =20 =46ud=40ietf.org =20 https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/fud =20 --596decd2_3e7a072a_204 Content-Type: text/html; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Disposition: inline

Hi all,

 

I have been asked by a few IETF participants whether= we should get together this week to talk about firmware updates for IoT de= vices (as a follow-up of what we did at the Chicago IETF meeting).

 

I am proposing to meet Thu= rsday, 9:30am in the Istanbul room (at the L level). I have res= erved the room till 12:00.

 

Ciao

Hannes

 

IMPORTANT NOTICE: The contents of this email and any attachments are confid= ential and may also be privileged. If you are not the intended recipient, p= lease notify the sender immediately and do not disclose the contents to any= other person, use it for any purpose, or store or copy the information in any medium. Thank you. --_000_VI1PR0801MB2717EBEB0B4401C2E8C795D4FAA10VI1PR0801MB2717_-- From nobody Tue Jul 18 08:30:38 2017 Return-Path: X-Original-To: fud@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: fud@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 423B2131AA9 for ; Tue, 18 Jul 2017 08:30:36 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.699 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.699 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, FREEMAIL_FORGED_FROMDOMAIN=0.199, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, HEADER_FROM_DIFFERENT_DOMAINS=0.001, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE=-0.0001, SPF_PASS=-0.001] autolearn=no autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=gmail.com Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id ILlRmT-m7zvK for ; Tue, 18 Jul 2017 08:30:34 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail-ua0-x22f.google.com (mail-ua0-x22f.google.com [IPv6:2607:f8b0:400c:c08::22f]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 35F11131B26 for ; Tue, 18 Jul 2017 08:30:34 -0700 (PDT) Received: by mail-ua0-x22f.google.com with SMTP id z22so27357868uah.1 for ; Tue, 18 Jul 2017 08:30:34 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20161025; h=mime-version:sender:in-reply-to:references:from:date:message-id :subject:to; bh=+OupY3jLV0rjcJCU48fNYOFwtOAXrpAdEyBdtIL5fik=; b=aSl/458FTuOk+ZsuEK+Xk30XyQ0WMU/cT5LnUUso5u7sfJbsgrMf/BAMvBYgEgvBlQ CdOv0pfnPLKT5+9dBVZs37+RGCRNAr4dbdbdsPPwfoGV6cro9aSO+MVsUJQXLqOAQ+Hw O0yma7DBxUnAWaSmtNTmUJkGJp5yUEmT3wfsmjH4bjBZN5DaLU0EBFMaaOMge1lZf3bX YyBIwUKkNbHG5qimbp1WEZdkgGHE2nXFpGaF62oR6WgDybG4mTQHZ3CN0aBrNqXQgLrV T6Ba8iFp4sZiQXKAzW8ZdcpS/0s/sJysh/uBEfg+GNvnWXb0zpOrYv3cVpE6vqbHdbkw CWEA== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:sender:in-reply-to:references:from :date:message-id:subject:to; bh=+OupY3jLV0rjcJCU48fNYOFwtOAXrpAdEyBdtIL5fik=; b=UoBD9PpPw8iKTGHiT4Fxgw1k5t/lXbQmD9Zot5GTrh6GGfemAOCCiGtdiM2uvVUVKq 0/RzzxKHD0s/aDkyW7/QDKoe3BbCAqYBwH6/ViVh44F8Su1jXx9KSR9/snlbgkJ7l/xl 0szYmBEFthBGCqysFcaCycqECT+LKQTBtQn9gCUHvY1GNaV9flnEjDs9STS2zhSS4O7s A+FEM5UcpE50Hj18E7tjIKjgplQ+ib7tSaADWG2Rv2pLssm15d4lzZ+BmPTZBzpWly9V rqsDOZtiRj37ISh8ebJIiCPpG7c0d7aAaG8iW8MCBK9w/rNmS0BogtApytwtCGxaVQKO 0dkA== X-Gm-Message-State: AIVw111aXhd8mL9soCdiQyMHZM1RuDaRhPDwnvSnD/d2hu2aTD7kaw9L oSnwExcL0RsDdn20ETfgI4SCNOoRtg== X-Received: by 10.31.178.88 with SMTP id b85mr1109811vkf.4.1500391832230; Tue, 18 Jul 2017 08:30:32 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 Sender: emmanuel.baccelli@gmail.com Received: by 10.176.76.211 with HTTP; Tue, 18 Jul 2017 08:30:11 -0700 (PDT) In-Reply-To: References: From: Emmanuel Baccelli Date: Tue, 18 Jul 2017 17:30:11 +0200 X-Google-Sender-Auth: 6BAURRVjUtOWpkGU_Zey-04z8bA Message-ID: To: fud@ietf.org Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="001a1143fa262f265e0554993221" Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Fud] FUD Side Meeting @ Prague IETF X-BeenThere: fud@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 Precedence: list List-Id: FUD - Firmware Updating Description List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 18 Jul 2017 15:30:36 -0000 --001a1143fa262f265e0554993221 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Hi Hannes, thanks for the initiative. I could join at that time. Best, Emmanuel On Tue, Jul 18, 2017 at 5:26 PM, Hannes Tschofenig < Hannes.Tschofenig@arm.com> wrote: > Hi all, > > > > I have been asked by a few IETF participants whether we should get > together this week to talk about firmware updates for IoT devices (as a > follow-up of what we did at the Chicago IETF meeting). > > > > I am proposing to meet Thursday, 9:30am in the Istanbul room (at the L > level). I have reserved the room till 12:00. > > > > Ciao > > Hannes > > > IMPORTANT NOTICE: The contents of this email and any attachments are > confidential and may also be privileged. If you are not the intended > recipient, please notify the sender immediately and do not disclose the > contents to any other person, use it for any purpose, or store or copy the > information in any medium. Thank you. > > _______________________________________________ > Fud mailing list > Fud@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/fud > > --001a1143fa262f265e0554993221 Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Hi Hannes,
thanks for the initiative. I could join at = that time.
Best,
Emmanuel

On Tue, Jul 18, 2017 at 5:26 PM, Ha= nnes Tschofenig <Hannes.Tschofenig@arm.com> wrote:

Hi all,

=C2=A0

I have been asked by a few IETF participants whether= we should get together this week to talk about firmware updates for IoT de= vices (as a follow-up of what we did at the Chicago IETF meeting).

=C2=A0

I am proposing to meet Thu= rsday, 9:30am in the Istanbul room (at the L level). I have res= erved the room till 12:00.

=C2=A0

Ciao

Hannes

=C2=A0

IMPORTANT NOTICE: The contents of this email and any attachments are confid= ential and may also be privileged. If you are not the intended recipient, p= lease notify the sender immediately and do not disclose the contents to any= other person, use it for any purpose, or store or copy the information in any medium. Thank you.

_______________________________________________
Fud mailing list
Fud@ietf.org
https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/fud


--001a1143fa262f265e0554993221-- From nobody Tue Jul 18 13:47:53 2017 Return-Path: X-Original-To: fud@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: fud@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8F837131899 for ; Tue, 18 Jul 2017 13:47:51 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -4.2 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-4.2 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-2.3] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id rdbzeHP67mZt for ; Tue, 18 Jul 2017 13:47:49 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mailhost.informatik.uni-bremen.de (mailhost.informatik.uni-bremen.de [IPv6:2001:638:708:30c9::12]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 373DE131A64 for ; Tue, 18 Jul 2017 13:47:49 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at informatik.uni-bremen.de Received: from submithost.informatik.uni-bremen.de (submithost.informatik.uni-bremen.de [IPv6:2001:638:708:30c9::b]) by mailhost.informatik.uni-bremen.de (8.14.5/8.14.5) with ESMTP id v6IKlhPb017091; Tue, 18 Jul 2017 22:47:43 +0200 (CEST) Received: from surfer-172-30-2-218-hotspot.internet-for-guests.com (107.223.broadband2.iol.cz [83.208.223.107]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by submithost.informatik.uni-bremen.de (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 3xBsg26kcwz3Zxw; Tue, 18 Jul 2017 22:47:42 +0200 (CEST) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Mime-Version: 1.0 (Mac OS X Mail 10.3 \(3273\)) From: Carsten Bormann In-Reply-To: Date: Tue, 18 Jul 2017 22:47:35 +0200 Cc: "fud@ietf.org" X-Mao-Original-Outgoing-Id: 522103655.343792-3ca3085c5b4a8ecc2ed7026b8631daf1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Message-Id: <7C8270AE-B90A-48D8-8EBD-21E3229FEA3B@tzi.org> References: To: Hannes Tschofenig X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.3273) Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Fud] FUD Side Meeting @ Prague IETF X-BeenThere: fud@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 Precedence: list List-Id: FUD - Firmware Updating Description List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 18 Jul 2017 20:47:51 -0000 This is the same time that YOT (Yang of Things) happens in Tyrolka. But maybe all the people who won=E2=80=99t fit into that room can go to = Istanbul :-) Gr=C3=BC=C3=9Fe, Carsten > On Jul 18, 2017, at 17:26, Hannes Tschofenig = wrote: >=20 > Hi all,=20 > =20 > I have been asked by a few IETF participants whether we should get = together this week to talk about firmware updates for IoT devices (as a = follow-up of what we did at the Chicago IETF meeting). > =20 > I am proposing to meet Thursday, 9:30am in the Istanbul room (at the L = level). I have reserved the room till 12:00. > =20 > Ciao > Hannes > =20 > IMPORTANT NOTICE: The contents of this email and any attachments are = confidential and may also be privileged. If you are not the intended = recipient, please notify the sender immediately and do not disclose the = contents to any other person, use it for any purpose, or store or copy = the information in any medium. Thank you. = _______________________________________________ > Fud mailing list > Fud@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/fud From nobody Wed Jul 19 00:57:16 2017 Return-Path: X-Original-To: fud@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: fud@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4C76C131C08 for ; Wed, 19 Jul 2017 00:57:07 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.921 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.921 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE=-0.0001, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_H4=-0.01, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_WL=-0.01, SPF_HELO_PASS=-0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (1024-bit key) header.d=armh.onmicrosoft.com Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id C_Mwqt-V0Rje for ; 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Wed, 19 Jul 2017 07:56:48 +0000 From: Hannes Tschofenig To: Carsten Bormann CC: "fud@ietf.org" Thread-Topic: [Fud] FUD Side Meeting @ Prague IETF Thread-Index: AdL/2XWXyTHPquvtRz2BTV1/fA5nsQALZ/yAABdXI+A= Date: Wed, 19 Jul 2017 07:56:48 +0000 Message-ID: References: <7C8270AE-B90A-48D8-8EBD-21E3229FEA3B@tzi.org> In-Reply-To: <7C8270AE-B90A-48D8-8EBD-21E3229FEA3B@tzi.org> Accept-Language: en-US Content-Language: en-US X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: authentication-results: tzi.org; dkim=none (message not signed) header.d=none;tzi.org; dmarc=none action=none header.from=arm.com; x-originating-ip: [2001:67c:370:128:acb5:4815:527c:9664] x-ms-publictraffictype: Email x-microsoft-exchange-diagnostics: 1; AM4PR0801MB2708; 7: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 x-ms-office365-filtering-correlation-id: a353d57b-7925-48af-fcfc-08d4ce7bb573 x-ms-office365-filtering-ht: Tenant x-microsoft-antispam: UriScan:; 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charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-OriginatorOrg: arm.com X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-originalarrivaltime: 19 Jul 2017 07:56:48.5458 (UTC) X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-fromentityheader: Hosted X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-id: f34e5979-57d9-4aaa-ad4d-b122a662184d X-MS-Exchange-Transport-CrossTenantHeadersStamped: AM4PR0801MB2708 Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Fud] FUD Side Meeting @ Prague IETF X-BeenThere: fud@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 Precedence: list List-Id: FUD - Firmware Updating Description List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 19 Jul 2017 07:57:07 -0000 SXQgaXMgZGlmZmljdWx0IHRvIGZpbmQgYSB0aW1lc2xvdCB0aGF0IGRvZXMgaGFzIG5vIGNvbmZs aWN0IGF0IGFuIElFVEYgbWVldGluZywgYXMgeW91IGtub3cuDQpJIGd1ZXNzIEkgd2lsbCBoYXZl IHRvIGNhdGNoIHVwIG9uIHRoZSBZYW5nIG9mIFRoaW5ncyBhZnRlcndhcmRzLg0KDQpDaWFvDQpI YW5uZXMNCg0KDQotLS0tLU9yaWdpbmFsIE1lc3NhZ2UtLS0tLQ0KRnJvbTogQ2Fyc3RlbiBCb3Jt YW5uIFttYWlsdG86Y2Fib0B0emkub3JnXQ0KU2VudDogMTggSnVseSAyMDE3IDIyOjQ4DQpUbzog SGFubmVzIFRzY2hvZmVuaWcNCkNjOiBmdWRAaWV0Zi5vcmcNClN1YmplY3Q6IFJlOiBbRnVkXSBG VUQgU2lkZSBNZWV0aW5nIEAgUHJhZ3VlIElFVEYNCg0KVGhpcyBpcyB0aGUgc2FtZSB0aW1lIHRo YXQgWU9UIChZYW5nIG9mIFRoaW5ncykgaGFwcGVucyBpbiBUeXJvbGthLg0KQnV0IG1heWJlIGFs bCB0aGUgcGVvcGxlIHdobyB3b27igJl0IGZpdCBpbnRvIHRoYXQgcm9vbSBjYW4gZ28gdG8gSXN0 YW5idWwgOi0pDQoNCkdyw7zDn2UsIENhcnN0ZW4NCg0KDQo+IE9uIEp1bCAxOCwgMjAxNywgYXQg MTc6MjYsIEhhbm5lcyBUc2Nob2ZlbmlnIDxIYW5uZXMuVHNjaG9mZW5pZ0Bhcm0uY29tPiB3cm90 ZToNCj4NCj4gSGkgYWxsLA0KPg0KPiBJIGhhdmUgYmVlbiBhc2tlZCBieSBhIGZldyBJRVRGIHBh cnRpY2lwYW50cyB3aGV0aGVyIHdlIHNob3VsZCBnZXQgdG9nZXRoZXIgdGhpcyB3ZWVrIHRvIHRh bGsgYWJvdXQgZmlybXdhcmUgdXBkYXRlcyBmb3IgSW9UIGRldmljZXMgKGFzIGEgZm9sbG93LXVw IG9mIHdoYXQgd2UgZGlkIGF0IHRoZSBDaGljYWdvIElFVEYgbWVldGluZykuDQo+DQo+IEkgYW0g cHJvcG9zaW5nIHRvIG1lZXQgVGh1cnNkYXksIDk6MzBhbSBpbiB0aGUgSXN0YW5idWwgcm9vbSAo YXQgdGhlIEwgbGV2ZWwpLiBJIGhhdmUgcmVzZXJ2ZWQgdGhlIHJvb20gdGlsbCAxMjowMC4NCj4N Cj4gQ2lhbw0KPiBIYW5uZXMNCj4NCj4gSU1QT1JUQU5UIE5PVElDRTogVGhlIGNvbnRlbnRzIG9m IHRoaXMgZW1haWwgYW5kIGFueSBhdHRhY2htZW50cyBhcmUgY29uZmlkZW50aWFsIGFuZCBtYXkg YWxzbyBiZSBwcml2aWxlZ2VkLiBJZiB5b3UgYXJlIG5vdCB0aGUgaW50ZW5kZWQgcmVjaXBpZW50 LCBwbGVhc2Ugbm90aWZ5IHRoZSBzZW5kZXIgaW1tZWRpYXRlbHkgYW5kIGRvIG5vdCBkaXNjbG9z ZSB0aGUgY29udGVudHMgdG8gYW55IG90aGVyIHBlcnNvbiwgdXNlIGl0IGZvciBhbnkgcHVycG9z ZSwgb3Igc3RvcmUgb3IgY29weSB0aGUgaW5mb3JtYXRpb24gaW4gYW55IG1lZGl1bS4gVGhhbmsg eW91LiBfX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fXw0KPiBG dWQgbWFpbGluZyBsaXN0DQo+IEZ1ZEBpZXRmLm9yZw0KPiBodHRwczovL3d3dy5pZXRmLm9yZy9t YWlsbWFuL2xpc3RpbmZvL2Z1ZA0KDQpJTVBPUlRBTlQgTk9USUNFOiBUaGUgY29udGVudHMgb2Yg dGhpcyBlbWFpbCBhbmQgYW55IGF0dGFjaG1lbnRzIGFyZSBjb25maWRlbnRpYWwgYW5kIG1heSBh bHNvIGJlIHByaXZpbGVnZWQuIElmIHlvdSBhcmUgbm90IHRoZSBpbnRlbmRlZCByZWNpcGllbnQs IHBsZWFzZSBub3RpZnkgdGhlIHNlbmRlciBpbW1lZGlhdGVseSBhbmQgZG8gbm90IGRpc2Nsb3Nl IHRoZSBjb250ZW50cyB0byBhbnkgb3RoZXIgcGVyc29uLCB1c2UgaXQgZm9yIGFueSBwdXJwb3Nl LCBvciBzdG9yZSBvciBjb3B5IHRoZSBpbmZvcm1hdGlvbiBpbiBhbnkgbWVkaXVtLiBUaGFuayB5 b3UuDQo= From nobody Wed Jul 19 02:03:07 2017 Return-Path: X-Original-To: fud@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: fud@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 41370131A5F for ; 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Wed, 19 Jul 2017 02:03:01 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 Received: by 10.37.45.101 with HTTP; Wed, 19 Jul 2017 02:03:01 -0700 (PDT) In-Reply-To: References: <7C8270AE-B90A-48D8-8EBD-21E3229FEA3B@tzi.org> From: Spencer Dawkins at IETF Date: Wed, 19 Jul 2017 11:03:01 +0200 Message-ID: To: Hannes Tschofenig Cc: Carsten Bormann , "fud@ietf.org" Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="001a114fc0fe2ea4ed0554a7e649" Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Fud] FUD Side Meeting @ Prague IETF X-BeenThere: fud@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 Precedence: list List-Id: FUD - Firmware Updating Description List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 19 Jul 2017 09:03:05 -0000 --001a114fc0fe2ea4ed0554a7e649 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Hi, Hannes, On Wed, Jul 19, 2017 at 9:56 AM, Hannes Tschofenig < Hannes.Tschofenig@arm.com> wrote: > It is difficult to find a timeslot that does has no conflict at an IETF > meeting, as you know. > Tell me about it. I won't be in either FUD or YoT, and I'm still double-booked! Best wishes, and please do send a summary of your conversation to the list, for those of us with prior commitments. Spencer > I guess I will have to catch up on the Yang of Things afterwards. > > Ciao > Hannes > > > -----Original Message----- > From: Carsten Bormann [mailto:cabo@tzi.org] > Sent: 18 July 2017 22:48 > To: Hannes Tschofenig > Cc: fud@ietf.org > Subject: Re: [Fud] FUD Side Meeting @ Prague IETF > > This is the same time that YOT (Yang of Things) happens in Tyrolka. > But maybe all the people who won=E2=80=99t fit into that room can go to I= stanbul > :-) > > Gr=C3=BC=C3=9Fe, Carsten > > > > On Jul 18, 2017, at 17:26, Hannes Tschofenig > wrote: > > > > Hi all, > > > > I have been asked by a few IETF participants whether we should get > together this week to talk about firmware updates for IoT devices (as a > follow-up of what we did at the Chicago IETF meeting). > > > > I am proposing to meet Thursday, 9:30am in the Istanbul room (at the L > level). I have reserved the room till 12:00. > > > > Ciao > > Hannes > > > > IMPORTANT NOTICE: The contents of this email and any attachments are > confidential and may also be privileged. If you are not the intended > recipient, please notify the sender immediately and do not disclose the > contents to any other person, use it for any purpose, or store or copy th= e > information in any medium. Thank you. ______________________________ > _________________ > > Fud mailing list > > Fud@ietf.org > > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/fud > > IMPORTANT NOTICE: The contents of this email and any attachments are > confidential and may also be privileged. If you are not the intended > recipient, please notify the sender immediately and do not disclose the > contents to any other person, use it for any purpose, or store or copy th= e > information in any medium. Thank you. > _______________________________________________ > Fud mailing list > Fud@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/fud > --001a114fc0fe2ea4ed0554a7e649 Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Hi, Hannes,

On Wed, Jul 19, 2017 at 9:56 AM, Hannes Tschofenig <Han= nes.Tschofenig@arm.com> wrote:
It is difficult to find a timeslot that does has no conflict at an IETF= meeting, as you know.

Tell me about it= . I won't be in either FUD or YoT, and I'm still double-booked!=C2= =A0

Best wishes, and please do send a summary of y= our conversation to the list, for those of us with prior commitments.
=

Spencer
=C2=A0
I guess I will have to catch up on the Yang of Things afterwards.

Ciao
Hannes


-----Original Message-----
From: Carsten Bormann [mailto:cabo@tzi.org<= /a>]
Sent: 18 July 2017 22:48
To: Hannes Tschofenig
Cc: fud@ietf.org
Subject: Re: [Fud] FUD Side Meeting @ Prague IETF

This is the same time that YOT (Yang of Things) happens in Tyrolka.
But maybe all the people who won=E2=80=99t fit into that room can go to Ist= anbul :-)

Gr=C3=BC=C3=9Fe, Carsten


> On Jul 18, 2017, at 17:26, Hannes Tschofenig <Hannes.Tschofenig@arm.com> wrote:
>
> Hi all,
>
> I have been asked by a few IETF participants whether we should get tog= ether this week to talk about firmware updates for IoT devices (as a follow= -up of what we did at the Chicago IETF meeting).
>
> I am proposing to meet Thursday, 9:30am in the Istanbul room (at the L= level). I have reserved the room till 12:00.
>
> Ciao
> Hannes
>
> IMPORTANT NOTICE: The contents of this email and any attachments are c= onfidential and may also be privileged. If you are not the intended recipie= nt, please notify the sender immediately and do not disclose the contents t= o any other person, use it for any purpose, or store or copy the informatio= n in any medium. Thank you. __________________________________________= _____
> Fud mailing list
> Fud@ietf.org
> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/fud

IMPORTANT NOTICE: The contents of this email and any attachments are confid= ential and may also be privileged. If you are not the intended recipient, p= lease notify the sender immediately and do not disclose the contents to any= other person, use it for any purpose, or store or copy the information in = any medium. Thank you.
_______________________________________________
Fud mailing list
Fud@ietf.org
https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/fud

--001a114fc0fe2ea4ed0554a7e649-- From nobody Wed Jul 19 02:13:57 2017 Return-Path: X-Original-To: fud@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: fud@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id ED186131C4D for ; Wed, 19 Jul 2017 02:13:55 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -6.9 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-6.9 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_HI=-5, RP_MATCHES_RCVD=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id pd2bGpCo1xTE for ; Wed, 19 Jul 2017 02:13:50 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mailext.sit.fraunhofer.de (mailext.sit.fraunhofer.de [141.12.72.89]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 61025131C4A for ; Wed, 19 Jul 2017 02:13:50 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail.sit.fraunhofer.de (mail.sit.fraunhofer.de [141.12.84.171]) by mailext.sit.fraunhofer.de (8.14.4/8.14.4/Debian-4.1ubuntu1) with ESMTP id v6J9Dlp9012517 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 bits=256 verify=NOT) for ; Wed, 19 Jul 2017 11:13:48 +0200 Received: from [31.133.128.168] (31.133.128.168) by mail.sit.fraunhofer.de (141.12.84.171) with Microsoft SMTP Server (TLS) id 14.3.361.1; Wed, 19 Jul 2017 11:13:42 +0200 To: References: From: Henk Birkholz Message-ID: <7081cb17-2e39-1351-ae39-bcc31378b8b1@sit.fraunhofer.de> Date: Wed, 19 Jul 2017 11:13:40 +0200 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; Linux x86_64; rv:52.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/52.1.1 MIME-Version: 1.0 In-Reply-To: Content-Type: text/plain; charset="windows-1252"; format=flowed Content-Language: en-US Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Originating-IP: [31.133.128.168] Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Fud] FUD Side Meeting @ Prague IETF X-BeenThere: fud@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 Precedence: list List-Id: FUD - Firmware Updating Description List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 19 Jul 2017 09:13:56 -0000 Hello FUD'ler, again I am sorry that I cannot join, but I am in a session where I have 3 presentation at that time. If you actually deciding to meeting at this session slot, I would like to ask you to have a extensive look at: > https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-sacm-coswid-02#page-14 "CoSWID Attributes for Firmware " There is a resource description type for firmware that can even include the corresponding firmware and act as a transport container. It - of course - includes the complete expressiveness of ISO-19770-2:2015 and is therefore inter-operable in regard to the corresponding metadata that overlaps with "normal software" and can be processed by any system that already understands the semantics of ISO SWID documents. Viele Grüße, Henk On 07/18/2017 05:26 PM, Hannes Tschofenig wrote: > Hi all, > > I have been asked by a few IETF participants whether we should get > together this week to talk about firmware updates for IoT devices (as a > follow-up of what we did at the Chicago IETF meeting). > > I am proposing to meet Thursday, 9:30am in the Istanbul room (at the L > level). I have reserved the room till 12:00. > > Ciao > > Hannes > > IMPORTANT NOTICE: The contents of this email and any attachments are > confidential and may also be privileged. If you are not the intended > recipient, please notify the sender immediately and do not disclose the > contents to any other person, use it for any purpose, or store or copy > the information in any medium. Thank you. > > > _______________________________________________ > Fud mailing list > Fud@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/fud > From nobody Wed Jul 19 11:33:51 2017 Return-Path: X-Original-To: fud@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: fud@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id CDA94131B3E for ; Wed, 19 Jul 2017 11:33:49 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.699 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.699 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, FREEMAIL_FORGED_FROMDOMAIN=0.199, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, HEADER_FROM_DIFFERENT_DOMAINS=0.001, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE=-0.0001, SPF_PASS=-0.001] autolearn=no autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=gmail.com Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id gCafLjb5MPv7 for ; Wed, 19 Jul 2017 11:33:48 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail-ua0-x231.google.com (mail-ua0-x231.google.com [IPv6:2607:f8b0:400c:c08::231]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 1A1C9131A62 for ; Wed, 19 Jul 2017 11:33:48 -0700 (PDT) Received: by mail-ua0-x231.google.com with SMTP id 80so6206291uas.0 for ; Wed, 19 Jul 2017 11:33:48 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20161025; h=mime-version:sender:from:date:message-id:subject:to; bh=orHqRaw2mLGb6Ut46RuXeuxwFEtnhjwezrp1m6wCz8Y=; b=uVnkLxqOHAgaKQzqC3lZBhySUIpp+OZVZcCpA1QgzINir7VTajSp1X3sQuEVHuJyoc hXRXxRpkmQ//ZPUL9tnVF0oFJIQ9eCUPNaQYw6QgidJVt2bmv+o5dMHafTX2JnGNRC/3 KJ6CYTUqtY1rrOKuUqBFE3rDqHbaUOCAXwSQgMgBoHc9bU/jtDFv7Lc+v9M/4GLv9Nci I8qTDN3ncBeq4+n4Sv+EjsCjovhddOvcIY6BKSDQ4q2gY7qXDhGybOHyXs28RRWvd5Zk jd8FXPc1tjPMZF7QoAM4F3amJ/BsFSSQ64tq4dYnactEpR+gvKwkawZRJxyi6vTe4J5D 29uw== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:sender:from:date:message-id:subject :to; bh=orHqRaw2mLGb6Ut46RuXeuxwFEtnhjwezrp1m6wCz8Y=; b=Zosuor7DiVyLJXYKoZG/hweIg55fGr1ZXXl8Ax27jIbsUMJ0KL2Yr8hsuUVQOtHBUY d7e4z4yd4r67FGJiljsDmn6jeRf57ITPzoGAt12KmoOWy1ryoeGTwmw4fL1a7CFNffa+ bxeoWrBH2+22ITdMmFSdx4G0JSZCihfT69g4ZsIdnfrIpZdAoe1IHcMbCVi0RTlk6A8/ rGAtHVKyG3dvDv2WQAYqSiXkOQOQNNjCoaTLIidpHNS/rAFbU9ey94ab8HngN3JOtgJQ POQkMW4Khys8inYOBxnJNcm0LHvEt4q2UTCHmqcjIJK8HhlGa9JKJ1ge36g++znoItIa Cz0w== X-Gm-Message-State: AIVw112FSXhftNi8Aykh/RgwfXtuLcM836NjPK93x2XZL81lZt3YBOc2 +BF5O+lusl64NeQQnuUA8Gc/Ub5CLbnB X-Received: by 10.159.60.111 with SMTP id w47mr592148uah.207.1500489227060; Wed, 19 Jul 2017 11:33:47 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 Sender: emmanuel.baccelli@gmail.com Received: by 10.176.76.211 with HTTP; Wed, 19 Jul 2017 11:33:26 -0700 (PDT) From: Emmanuel Baccelli Date: Wed, 19 Jul 2017 20:33:26 +0200 X-Google-Sender-Auth: RybPJC8cefF2SdotSGeGGA50-Xo Message-ID: To: fud@ietf.org Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="f403043649d45e4caa0554afdfdf" Archived-At: Subject: [Fud] (quick) review of draft-moran-fud-architecture-00 X-BeenThere: fud@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 Precedence: list List-Id: FUD - Firmware Updating Description List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 19 Jul 2017 18:33:50 -0000 --f403043649d45e4caa0554afdfdf Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Hi everyone, thanks for the draft. to prepare tomorrow's meeting, I read the drafts as fast as I could ( I hope note too fast ;) It reads well already, and it is actually pretty close to what we are doing in RIOT. See below some comments, questions and suggestions. ===== General comments: ===== 1. In the proposed architecture some trust is required in the storage element, which is assumed to correctly: - serve the latest manifest/firmware (if the device pulls) - pushe/signal newer manifests to the device (if the author pushes) 2. What is specific to firmware in the document so far? It seems to me that this could apply to any software module on an IoT device, not necessarily a firmware. For instance it could be "application" logic (We have use cases where we are updating some software, but not the firmware). Why not generalize somehow the terminology to something more generic like "software update" or something similar? ===== Some more detailed comments: ===== # in Section 3: why/how/what small bootloader? why/how friendly to broadcast => no TLS, Object security but: are we really going to broadcast a (relatively large) firmware? # in Section 3.4: "the device is required to provide a minimum of two storage locations for firmware and one bootable location for firmware." Is reliability possible only with this approach? This seems out of scope of the generic architecture. # in Section 3.5: How about rephrasing like: "The approach must not require a large bootloader" # in Section 3.6 Here I think the draft should reference examples of what "existing firmware formats" are alluded to. In my opinion, this section could be removed for two reasons: 1. because the metadata is anyways separate from the actual firmware, 2. the software might not be firmware, but just a software module (as per my comment above) # in Section 3.7 I would suggest to have this document focus primarily on single MCU devices. Ideally: extensions to cover multi-firmware devices would either be in a later part of the document or in a separate document. At this point in the document it is obscure what the distinctions are between: Author, Store, Apply, Approve, Qualify # in Section 4: How about being more assertive here, such as: The firmware image MAY be encrypted and MUST be integrity protected AS WELL AS AUTHENTICATED/AUTHORIZED. The meta-data MUST integrity protected and AUTHENTICATED. # in Section 5: - When should the device apply the update? out of scope? - How should the device apply the update? out of scope? - What kind of firmware binary is it? is this different from the question "should it apply the firmware"? - Where should the update be obtained? if we are not making the assumption that metadata and firmware are stored in difference places, is this redundant? - Where should the firmware be stored? out of scope? # in Section 6: "information about when the firmware update has to be applied". I guess the default should be "as soon as possible". However, in cases when the time is no synchronized, I'm wondering how the device could interpret this "when" indication. # in Section 7: Typically the author will produce/transfer a new firmware and its (manifest) metadata in one go. In practice, firmware and manifest might even be bundled in a single file (?). Hence I would suggest to invert the order of the steps "Upload Firmware" and "Create Manifest". --f403043649d45e4caa0554afdfdf Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Hi everyone,

thanks for the draft.=C2= =A0

to prepare tomorrow's meeting, I read = the drafts as fast as I could ( I hope note too fast ;)

It reads well already, and it is actually pretty close to what
we are doing in RIOT.

See below some comm= ents, questions and suggestions.

=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D
General comments:
=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D

1. In the proposed architecture some trust is required in the storage el= ement, which is assumed to correctly:
- serve the latest manifest= /firmware (if the device pulls)
- pushe/signal newer manifests to= the device (if the author pushes)

2. What is spec= ific to firmware in the document so far?
It seems to me that this= could apply to any software module on an IoT device, not necessarily a fir= mware.
For instance it could be "application" logic (We= have use cases where we are updating some software, but not the firmware).=
Why not generalize somehow the terminology to something more gen= eric like "software update" or something similar?

<= /div>

=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D
Some more detailed comme= nts:
=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D

# in Section 3:=C2= =A0
why/how/what small bootloader?

why/h= ow friendly to broadcast =3D> no TLS, Object security
but: are= we really going to broadcast a (relatively large) firmware?

=

# in Section 3.4:

"= the device is required to provide a minimum of two storage locations for
firmware and one bootable location for firmware."
Is reliability possible only with this approach?
Thi= s seems out of scope of the generic architecture.

=
# in Section 3.5:
How about rephrasing like:
=
"The approach must not require a large bootloader"


# in Section 3.6
Here I think the = draft should reference examples of what "existing firmware formats&quo= t; are alluded to.
In my opinion, this section could be removed f= or two reasons:
1. because the metadata is anyways separate from = the actual firmware,
2. the software might not be firmware, but j= ust a software module (as per my comment above)

# in Section 3.7
I would suggest to have this docume= nt focus primarily on single MCU devices.
Ideally: extensions to = cover multi-firmware devices would either be in a later part of the documen= t or in a separate document.

At this point in the = document it is obscure what the distinctions are between:
Author,= Store, Apply, Approve, Qualify

# in Section 4:
How about being more assertive here, such as:

<= div>The firmware image MAY be encrypted and MUST be integrity protected AS = WELL AS AUTHENTICATED/AUTHORIZED.
The meta-data MUST integrity pr= otected and AUTHENTICATED.


# in Sec= tion 5:

=C2=A0 =C2=A0- =C2=A0When should the devic= e apply the update?
=C2=A0 =C2=A0out of scope?
=C2=A0 = =C2=A0
=C2=A0 =C2=A0- =C2=A0How should the device apply the updat= e?
=C2=A0 =C2=A0out of scope?
=C2=A0 =C2=A0
= =C2=A0 =C2=A0- =C2=A0What kind of firmware binary is it?
=C2=A0 = =C2=A0is this different from the question "should it apply the firmwar= e"?
=C2=A0 =C2=A0
=C2=A0 =C2=A0- =C2=A0Where shoul= d the update be obtained?
=C2=A0 =C2=A0if we are not making the a= ssumption that metadata and firmware are stored in difference places, is th= is redundant?
=C2=A0 =C2=A0
=C2=A0 =C2=A0- =C2=A0Where = should the firmware be stored?
=C2=A0 =C2=A0out of scope?
=C2=A0 =C2=A0
=C2=A0 =C2=A0
# in Section 6:
"information about when the firmware update has to be applied".=
I guess the default should be "as soon as possible".
However, in cases when the time is no synchronized, I'm wonder= ing how the device
could interpret this "when" indicati= on.



# in Section 7:<= /div>

Typically the author will produce/transfer a new f= irmware and its (manifest) metadata in one go.
In practice, firmw= are and manifest might even be bundled in a single file (?).
Henc= e I would suggest to invert the order of the steps "Upload Firmware&qu= ot; =C2=A0and "Create Manifest".



--f403043649d45e4caa0554afdfdf-- From nobody Wed Jul 19 11:37:16 2017 Return-Path: X-Original-To: fud@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: fud@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 18C9812EAB0 for ; Wed, 19 Jul 2017 11:37:15 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.698 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.698 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, FREEMAIL_FORGED_FROMDOMAIN=0.199, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, HEADER_FROM_DIFFERENT_DOMAINS=0.001, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE=-0.0001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=no autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=gmail.com Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id K3fQ2Vbsejeg for ; Wed, 19 Jul 2017 11:37:13 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail-ua0-x22a.google.com (mail-ua0-x22a.google.com [IPv6:2607:f8b0:400c:c08::22a]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 40F7412711E for ; Wed, 19 Jul 2017 11:37:13 -0700 (PDT) Received: by mail-ua0-x22a.google.com with SMTP id f9so6190874uaf.4 for ; Wed, 19 Jul 2017 11:37:13 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20161025; h=mime-version:sender:from:date:message-id:subject:to; bh=cF7qi5TggVqLn6KlJiscloE7Y+4qtihcmiQ4ReEgU5A=; b=Vw9y9qx8vYMXKySp5YUKgJRsqH1UN8gGmI+q1tQVfaQHqOcJRYUbS5GFq8Z8RVgs8v /pqoi0rORcH5MMOioBK5nSm9TcHNIySWVCo8vLQ5zPO2uM+tGug9/1fL0m3LQw5UvHuH K/MaCwnH6RCy3K5lZv0mBZYfGqJtPbo4hraU7XrZcSUxJM/IUDYYeSLSrqNJa1GnBCTq NZVianMeeWwFJRM963eOGfSOYnZuqyT2WIWRSyAeYQhleVyMXCR6Mzv8fAm3SbkdUm1G SNXWjeY0RrSUf2wLpdUZprITiGd3Bl01TCZNOsPbzHzsn5NrxI4Qhp//xeUqUjZUL7By 3sQA== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:sender:from:date:message-id:subject :to; bh=cF7qi5TggVqLn6KlJiscloE7Y+4qtihcmiQ4ReEgU5A=; b=IOnw/ha0Q/2F2ipw/BDOxybRU5awsvmGIhZuPotOuoVVkSXn4OF7SU7A2uDCQgXXRB Jzx5kfRjtjCA3goAhYNA13mWPl2fAM7FoSJFcPvac9KoDX5Y+aiL5MwuVDJyqWsno993 zLj0s18sT5WfN7SfbfKCslxlsWJOuTLr4QgmcnVk8aM9pt67ce6GPzFnDnkBpdHsDgf4 FS5R/1ORipNinsJblQVQMYclDFkeLMK/OSPCSEAUAgOKiehUGCwSkpfnsHXByjqzxM8T wxslDyLI0R7S6mWh73QTj6cvYesQVbMQqBfcsem5WrNF+HKA74bwSb7c7CYVlcCrGW1J XRXQ== X-Gm-Message-State: AIVw112DlTTCYCjGtTRtQR+gfpAOyjMXCdRFGXIUS8dLC49QlcOeu70Q nxTaJjmTQ8AQ6CP6Kr3rXRqmBDcaAyjL X-Received: by 10.176.94.131 with SMTP id y3mr539633uag.21.1500489432120; Wed, 19 Jul 2017 11:37:12 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 Sender: emmanuel.baccelli@gmail.com Received: by 10.176.76.211 with HTTP; Wed, 19 Jul 2017 11:36:51 -0700 (PDT) From: Emmanuel Baccelli Date: Wed, 19 Jul 2017 20:36:51 +0200 X-Google-Sender-Auth: hLnnaRACmQ2GtJeRw1lp9T8zZu0 Message-ID: To: fud@ietf.org Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="f403043c51c097438c0554afeb25" Archived-At: Subject: [Fud] initial comments on draft-moran-fud-manifest-00 X-BeenThere: fud@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 Precedence: list List-Id: FUD - Firmware Updating Description List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 19 Jul 2017 18:37:15 -0000 --f403043c51c097438c0554afeb25 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Hi again, another quick review heading towards tomorrow. Do you have an open source implementation of this somewhere, running on IoT devices? If so, could you point us to this code, and tell us which devices you tested this on? See below some comments, questions and suggestions. ===== General comments: ===== Let's make sure that a minimalistic version of the manifest format is applicable easily to low-end IoT devices: - class 1 devices (RFC7228) with a single MCU, - very low bandwidth network connection, - may not have an "interoperable" notion of absolute time, - ... As additional reference points, let's also look out the (work-in-progress) metadata format of RIOT images [1], and of MCUBoot images [2] which In particular, the whole metadata of a RIOT image fits in less than 200 bytes. A nice goal could thus be that we aim to fit a minimal (but compliant) format of the manifest within 256bytes. [1] RIOT Image Metadata (work in progress) https://github.com/RIOT-OS/RIOT/wiki/%5BWIP%5D-Draft-RIOT-Image-Metadata [2] MCUBoot Image Metadata (work in progress) https://github.com/runtimeco/mcuboot/blob/master/doc/design.txt ===== Some more detailed comments: ===== # In section 3.1 timestamp: If we want to cover the cases when the device has no notion of "now", (i.e. is not time-synchronized with the author/server/storage) the device will only be able to interpret this field as some kind of sequence number. This does not bringing much more information compared to the version number field. In particular, I'm wondering why the timestamp actually protects from downgrade attacks: I suppose we trust that newer software will have newer version numbers. Is it to cover the case when the version number "wraps around"? # In section 3.2 I would suggest we add the format type "script". We have use cases where modules might be scripts. nonce: I'm not sure the case of "producing manifests too quickly" with the same time-stamp is realistic. Even if it was, since a nonce is random, the nonce would not help to decide which firmware is newer. However, we could assume that the version number would be lexicographically greater in the newest firmware. Hence, I am unsure what is the function of the nonce. storageIdentifier: as per my comments to the architecture draft, I suggest we focus first on the case where there is only one MCU. Should this field be optional? # In section 3.3 "Apply an update only to devices that match the vendorId, classId, deviceId attributes" is this condition not necessary in all cases? Conditions on absolute time: see my above comments on absolute time, and time synchronization requirements that might not be met in low-end IoT devices. # In section 3.4 Here again I propose to focus on single MCU cases first. # In section 3.5.2 make it optional? # In section 4. Do you have an estimate as how many bytes this is over the air for the manifest? --f403043c51c097438c0554afeb25 Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Hi again,

another quick review heading = towards tomorrow.

Do you have an open source = implementation of this somewhere,
running on IoT devices?
If so, could you point us to this code, and tell us which devices you te= sted this on?

See below some comments, questions a= nd suggestions.

=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D
General = comments:
=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D

Let's make= sure that a minimalistic version of the manifest format is applicable
easily to low-end IoT devices:
=C2=A0- class 1 devices (RFC= 7228) with a single MCU,=C2=A0
=C2=A0- very low bandwidth network= connection,
=C2=A0- may not have an "interoperable" no= tion of absolute time,
=C2=A0- ...

As ad= ditional reference points, let's also look out the (work-in-progress) m= etadata format
of RIOT images [1], and of MCUBoot images [2] whic= h
In particular, the whole metadata of a RIOT image fits in less = than 200 bytes.
A nice goal could thus be that we aim to fit a mi= nimal (but compliant) format
of the manifest within 256bytes.


[2] MCUBoot Image Metadata (work in progress) h= ttps://github.com/runtimeco/mcuboot/blob/master/doc/design.txt

=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D
Some more detailed comments:
=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D

# In section 3.1
=
timestamp:=C2=A0
If we want to cover the cases whe= n the device has no notion of "now",
(i.e. is not time-= synchronized with the author/server/storage)
the device will only= be able to interpret this field as some kind of=C2=A0
sequence n= umber. This does not bringing much more information compared to the version= number field.
In particular, I'm wondering why the timestamp= actually protects from downgrade attacks:
I suppose we trust tha= t newer software will have newer version numbers.
Is it to cover = the case when the version number "wraps around"?


# In section 3.2

I would s= uggest we add the format type "script".=C2=A0
We have u= se cases where modules might be scripts.

nonce:
I'm not sure the case of "producing manifests too quickly&= quot; with the same time-stamp
is realistic.=C2=A0
Even= if it was, since a nonce is random, the nonce would not help to decide whi= ch
firmware is newer.
However, we could assume that the= version number would be lexicographically greater
in the newest = firmware.
Hence, I am unsure what is the function of the nonce.

storageIdentifier:
as per my comments to = the architecture draft, I suggest we focus first on the case
wher= e there is only one MCU.
Should this field be optional?



# In section 3.3
"Apply an update only to devices that match the vendorId,= classId, deviceId attributes"
is this condition not necessa= ry in all cases?

Conditions on absolute time:
see my above comments on absolute time, and time synchronization requ= irements that might
not be met in low-end IoT devices.
=
# In section 3.4

Here again I propo= se to focus on single MCU cases first.

# In sectio= n 3.5.2

make it optional?

# In section 4.

Do you have an estimate as how ma= ny bytes this is over the air for the manifest?
--f403043c51c097438c0554afeb25-- From tk47@nyu.edu Wed Jul 19 11:39:45 2017 Return-Path: X-Original-To: fud@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: fud@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5EC73131B3E for ; Wed, 19 Jul 2017 11:39:45 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.899 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.899 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=nyu-edu.20150623.gappssmtp.com Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id GuypnKIiqfG2 for ; Wed, 19 Jul 2017 11:39:41 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail-io0-x230.google.com (mail-io0-x230.google.com [IPv6:2607:f8b0:4001:c06::230]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 60E4A131BAC for ; Wed, 19 Jul 2017 11:39:37 -0700 (PDT) Received: by mail-io0-x230.google.com with SMTP id 5so3753699iow.0 for ; Wed, 19 Jul 2017 11:39:37 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=nyu-edu.20150623.gappssmtp.com; s=20150623; h=mime-version:in-reply-to:references:from:date:message-id:subject:to :cc; bh=hfMUGt7TxKTPuJAE1Vd99h/FJd4TBZwaJqh6zVrY6A0=; b=VkzTY6FvKx2wE6grj3GE7J+VTLBHEMzLQTkctojXGYYUGF7NL1EtqJXPZcdMFF9pcj Pro0e0EOgdjlDe6bcARvRIPuiYpaNAaxRbyXow7FWlygci3ALpFuRLX8tuVVE7+ft1cV GREIK9ITkqgKyzUWwXolOJ49nEIFW/CL1kmih2dmKNLncoJ2XAi4V9HsCr9DUodbnqkV 1c0SwUg96eqgNdVVs42+Z9AIl2woCYQtmlosaIlUh6d4JN28ZU/BjRgX5FcGWeM0UAIU Cc4O5JNHSykso+tyN5nh01PyxSKKVqPnoTQNwtVXT3AqSfAm2HLlFM2e+GDaJonl6kix U1hA== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:in-reply-to:references:from:date :message-id:subject:to:cc; bh=hfMUGt7TxKTPuJAE1Vd99h/FJd4TBZwaJqh6zVrY6A0=; b=O2s3x9dmPdU3AlbAy0CfGiPCfLGPSaTbARRhWNoPk0JTfEEWCA9ECtVyBed/oiO1MS UN4R+4reN+Ol9daiKv/hTnz3NLs51+29KTn15JUoxtwnHE7akKSY7opwOjvRi4FUQK7L mjgouCz4vdLSazVu/atk83xnVEwPJ+yQDcOY7n2qspD6uww3YsldQkGROce02E/304vu dScLBoy3snvyRJWVVse8cWPKR5G6WZCVxWdUB5KZjv+9Ms9j8ntyAZbjsRYQZTN5DURn 2BsWuwkwb1amTMuqgJbuCHr5BevKLLgt0V/HIGydz5kKcD/PRwg9cpaiHzZ6liXFpsCo Oa9Q== X-Gm-Message-State: AIVw113AwsR4+pcamfx8q8mMtv1tRit1YCOPMdXsSjQPFG7fKEFY1ku1 zPhZ+wJpxy/QZh1gtE5G0IZMGxA4w1JfbKOf8g== X-Received: by 10.107.46.230 with SMTP id u99mr1203377iou.52.1500489576606; Wed, 19 Jul 2017 11:39:36 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 Received: by 10.79.34.39 with HTTP; Wed, 19 Jul 2017 11:38:56 -0700 (PDT) In-Reply-To: <7081cb17-2e39-1351-ae39-bcc31378b8b1@sit.fraunhofer.de> References: <7081cb17-2e39-1351-ae39-bcc31378b8b1@sit.fraunhofer.de> From: Trishank Karthik Kuppusamy Date: Wed, 19 Jul 2017 14:38:56 -0400 Message-ID: To: Henk Birkholz Cc: fud@ietf.org, Justin Cappos , Shikhar Sakhuja , Ariella C Feuchtwanger Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="001a11c16a9633ff470554aff4fb" Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Fud] FUD Side Meeting @ Prague IETF X-BeenThere: fud@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 Precedence: list List-Id: FUD - Firmware Updating Description List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 19 Jul 2017 18:41:00 -0000 --001a11c16a9633ff470554aff4fb Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Hello everyone, We're from The Update Framework (TUF) project [ https://theupdateframework.github.io/], where we are concerned with attackers who compromise the software repository used to host and distribute software updates, and thus distribute and install malware onto millions of devices at once. Would it be possible for us to join this meeting remotely? We are in the EST time zone. Thanks in advance! Regards, Trishank On Wed, Jul 19, 2017 at 5:13 AM, Henk Birkholz < henk.birkholz@sit.fraunhofer.de> wrote: > Hello FUD'ler, > > again I am sorry that I cannot join, but I am in a session where I have 3 > presentation at that time. > > If you actually deciding to meeting at this session slot, I would like to > ask you to have a extensive look at: > > https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-sacm-coswid-02#page-14 >> > > "CoSWID Attributes for Firmware " > > There is a resource description type for firmware that can even include > the corresponding firmware and act as a transport container. It - of cour= se > - includes the complete expressiveness of ISO-19770-2:2015 and is > therefore inter-operable in regard to the corresponding metadata that > overlaps with "normal software" and can be processed by any system that > already understands the semantics of ISO SWID documents. > > Viele Gr=C3=BC=C3=9Fe, > > Henk > > > On 07/18/2017 05:26 PM, Hannes Tschofenig wrote: > >> Hi all, >> >> I have been asked by a few IETF participants whether we should get >> together this week to talk about firmware updates for IoT devices (as a >> follow-up of what we did at the Chicago IETF meeting). >> >> I am proposing to meet Thursday, 9:30am in the Istanbul room (at the L >> level). I have reserved the room till 12:00. >> >> Ciao >> >> Hannes >> >> IMPORTANT NOTICE: The contents of this email and any attachments are >> confidential and may also be privileged. If you are not the intended >> recipient, please notify the sender immediately and do not disclose the >> contents to any other person, use it for any purpose, or store or copy t= he >> information in any medium. Thank you. >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Fud mailing list >> Fud@ietf.org >> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/fud >> >> > _______________________________________________ > Fud mailing list > Fud@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/fud > --001a11c16a9633ff470554aff4fb Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Hello everyone,

We're from The Upda= te Framework (TUF) project [https://theupdateframework.github.io/], where we are concerned with = attackers who compromise the software repository used to host and distribut= e software updates, and thus distribute and install malware onto millions o= f devices at once.

Would it be possible for us to = join this meeting remotely? We are in the EST time zone. Thanks in advance!=

Regards,
Trishank

On Wed, Jul 19, 2017 at 5:1= 3 AM, Henk Birkholz <henk.birkholz@sit.fraunhofer.de>= wrote:
Hello FUD'ler,

again I am sorry that I cannot join, but I am in a session where I have 3 p= resentation at that time.

If you actually deciding to meeting at this session slot, I would like to a= sk you to have a extensive look at:

https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-= ietf-sacm-coswid-02#page-14

"CoSWID Attributes for Firmware "

There is a resource description type for firmware that can even include the= corresponding firmware and act as a transport container. It - of course -= =C2=A0 includes the complete expressiveness of ISO-19770-2:2015 and is ther= efore inter-operable in regard to the corresponding metadata that overlaps = with "normal software" and can be processed by any system that al= ready understands the semantics of ISO SWID documents.

Viele Gr=C3=BC=C3=9Fe,

Henk


On 07/18/2017 05:26 PM, Hannes Tschofenig wrote:
Hi all,

I have been asked by a few IETF participants whether we should get together= this week to talk about firmware updates for IoT devices (as a follow-up o= f what we did at the Chicago IETF meeting).

I am proposing to meet Thursday, 9:30am in the Istanbul room (at the L leve= l). I have reserved the room till 12:00.

Ciao

Hannes

IMPORTANT NOTICE: The contents of this email and any attachments are confid= ential and may also be privileged. If you are not the intended recipient, p= lease notify the sender immediately and do not disclose the contents to any= other person, use it for any purpose, or store or copy the information in = any medium. Thank you.


_______________________________________________
Fud mailing list
Fud@ietf.org
https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/fud


_______________________________________________
Fud mailing list
Fud@ietf.org
https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/fud

--001a11c16a9633ff470554aff4fb-- From nobody Thu Jul 20 00:42:56 2017 Return-Path: X-Original-To: fud@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: fud@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 32A62126557 for ; Thu, 20 Jul 2017 00:42:55 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.021 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.021 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE=-0.0001, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_H3=-0.01, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_WL=-0.01, SPF_HELO_PASS=-0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (1024-bit key) header.d=isoc.org Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id WHLw9q9Ye2V8 for ; Thu, 20 Jul 2017 00:42:53 -0700 (PDT) Received: from NAM02-CY1-obe.outbound.protection.outlook.com (mail-cys01nam02on0060.outbound.protection.outlook.com [104.47.37.60]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id C7689126B72 for ; 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boundary="_000_MWHPR06MB3181B6174EBC153A92C7D897CEA70MWHPR06MB3181namp_" MIME-Version: 1.0 X-OriginatorOrg: isoc.org X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-originalarrivaltime: 20 Jul 2017 07:42:51.8967 (UTC) X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-fromentityheader: Hosted X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-id: 89f84dfb-7285-4810-bc4d-8b9b5794554f X-MS-Exchange-Transport-CrossTenantHeadersStamped: MWHPR06MB3184 Archived-At: Subject: [Fud] (US NTIA) Multistakeholder Process; Internet of Things (IoT) Security Upgradability and Patching X-BeenThere: fud@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 Precedence: list List-Id: FUD - Firmware Updating Description List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 20 Jul 2017 07:42:55 -0000 --_000_MWHPR06MB3181B6174EBC153A92C7D897CEA70MWHPR06MB3181namp_ Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable For anyone interested, in case you were not aware: https://www.ntia.doc.gov/other-publication/2016/multistakeholder-process-io= t-security They are very open to participation from anyone interested, including out= side the US. I am happy to make an introduction to the fellow leading this= effort - Allan Friedman (Director of Cybersecurity Initiatives, NTIA Offi= ce of Policy Analysis and Development), but feel free to reach out on your= own to get involved or to learn more. Their past meetings are archived and notes are posted. Steve -- Steve Olshansky Internet Technology Program Manager Internet Society www.internetsociety.org --_000_MWHPR06MB3181B6174EBC153A92C7D897CEA70MWHPR06MB3181namp_ Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

For anyone interested, in case you were not aware:
https://www.ntia.doc.gov/other-publication/2016/multistakeholder-process-io= t-security

They  are very open to participation from anyone interested, including=   outside the US. I am happy to make an introduction to the fellow lea= ding  this effort - Allan Friedman (Director of Cybersecurity Initiati= ves,  NTIA Office of Policy Analysis and Development), but feel free to reach  out on your own to get involved or to learn m= ore.

Their past meetings are archived and notes are posted.
     Steve


--

Steve Olshansky
Internet Technology Program Manager
Internet Society
www.internetsociety.org

--_000_MWHPR06MB3181B6174EBC153A92C7D897CEA70MWHPR06MB3181namp_-- From nobody Thu Jul 20 05:41:26 2017 Return-Path: X-Original-To: fud@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: fud@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 111DD1317D5 for ; Thu, 20 Jul 2017 05:41:25 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.699 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.699 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, FREEMAIL_FORGED_FROMDOMAIN=0.199, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, HEADER_FROM_DIFFERENT_DOMAINS=0.001, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE=-0.0001, SPF_PASS=-0.001] autolearn=no autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=gmail.com Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id z7FYyEua3cc4 for ; Thu, 20 Jul 2017 05:41:24 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail-ua0-x22c.google.com (mail-ua0-x22c.google.com [IPv6:2607:f8b0:400c:c08::22c]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 0032D131771 for ; Thu, 20 Jul 2017 05:41:23 -0700 (PDT) Received: by mail-ua0-x22c.google.com with SMTP id 80so21980816uas.0 for ; Thu, 20 Jul 2017 05:41:23 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20161025; h=mime-version:sender:from:date:message-id:subject:to; bh=Eeywr+q6jnNHCx4DnJqRHCxz62iPjy3dW3MUMFINLVo=; b=nRILeqQO0UE3tAx9DuGP81JFutoDSQzeenKubpHjsbvmdYUbE7LtXetBBlCzxkLBVi XbP8HhEoS3GQGnipYoATXQWotTpDaKc8dESn8HdjSNk7QAqasvfyI95bGPimKo//5j10 HXYNkpznFGXqg68Szn4vwRvVntfAV86QT7GlWoUz6jxajqCUcZHjH6Lak5qe0o2diYOT Gtm26oLdt4FTkGIW4VdumT6xcB2tnoFxrkdNMPY35msqyYdOn7oXxrYVLx/zOXacljDn 8xF5DJnhQ9sWrB0cTlZuQG6sthFmyJ0uqoApX3LVwhCsn2kSJ7fGnaK0S2shTy/LhEdZ Y6Lw== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:sender:from:date:message-id:subject :to; bh=Eeywr+q6jnNHCx4DnJqRHCxz62iPjy3dW3MUMFINLVo=; b=gM9fNuXz0/Z6h0BS5qRSQL15kIg4+OC9PJ9yQXGcp3lhTNLxp0CXZXkI9gGeUwJtrF qHvccq61AfBk416cfG9iwQL0BVxqWpS3dLoTq9cbQ6VjBVzPg85MikV6nZnyvCc2A3rN HF+UUK3ifXPTeTaVszGw/y5vvLAsvs8UCsGcnGof+35/R+dFzF/2r069fVzd8NFlvUZo jrihUpVt4kZhxjl8SWs7ofV1GaT79U0Rzau6KRNBb0JhiPSEX4yZmTQ8jWuN6KnGdnka h5AJPudQOYadfBBjS000rYZh0Fd3Wo3yYUxvYiii/vPRSDgtqxEgeQbEvHsS3nLiC+Ih AQsg== X-Gm-Message-State: AIVw112bUqkZ2J8T+ZJVV9Z4uWUnxUYdbxgGKWj6qgtIybm8cJ9ywF3A tb+pp1fFfrEoj6b9Aco41n5WGNA4jQ== X-Received: by 10.31.86.70 with SMTP id k67mr1929406vkb.112.1500554483029; Thu, 20 Jul 2017 05:41:23 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 Sender: emmanuel.baccelli@gmail.com Received: by 10.176.76.211 with HTTP; Thu, 20 Jul 2017 05:41:02 -0700 (PDT) From: Emmanuel Baccelli Date: Thu, 20 Jul 2017 14:41:02 +0200 X-Google-Sender-Auth: vKS-RdeR-lxayttYSNAuHHfaQjQ Message-ID: To: fud@ietf.org, Hannes Tschofenig Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="001a114e23cced5a020554bf105b" Archived-At: Subject: [Fud] broadcast update X-BeenThere: fud@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 Precedence: list List-Id: FUD - Firmware Updating Description List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 20 Jul 2017 12:41:25 -0000 --001a114e23cced5a020554bf105b Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Hi Hannes, you mentioned a demo about that over LoRa (if I recall correctly) this morning. Can you send us a pointer to that stuff? Thanks Emmanuel --001a114e23cced5a020554bf105b Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8"
Hi Hannes,

you mentioned a demo about that over LoRa (if I recall correctly) this morning.
Can you send us a pointer to that stuff?

Thanks

Emmanuel
--001a114e23cced5a020554bf105b-- From nobody Thu Jul 20 05:51:09 2017 Return-Path: X-Original-To: fud@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: fud@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9B22612EB99 for ; Thu, 20 Jul 2017 05:51:08 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -4.901 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-4.901 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW=-0.7, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_H2=-2.8, RCVD_IN_SORBS_SPAM=0.5, RP_MATCHES_RCVD=-0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id DFqpqib5nurV for ; Thu, 20 Jul 2017 05:51:01 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mout.gmx.net (mout.gmx.net [212.227.17.22]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 081841317A7 for ; Thu, 20 Jul 2017 05:51:00 -0700 (PDT) Received: from [192.168.91.199] ([31.133.137.21]) by mail.gmx.com (mrgmx102 [212.227.17.168]) with ESMTPSA (Nemesis) id 0Meduu-1dETGq00UK-00OIrg; Thu, 20 Jul 2017 14:50:56 +0200 To: Emmanuel Baccelli , fud@ietf.org, Hannes Tschofenig References: From: Hannes Tschofenig Openpgp: id=071A97A9ECBADCA8E31E678554D9CEEF4D776BC9 Message-ID: <752a3d82-6ffa-c792-cc26-a0dc747cdb46@gmx.net> Date: Thu, 20 Jul 2017 14:50:55 +0200 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; Linux x86_64; rv:52.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/52.2.1 MIME-Version: 1.0 In-Reply-To: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Language: en-US Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Provags-ID: V03:K0:oZky6tBipj6QS25nYmZjg9xpPyr9kDd9kY+0HKt9TJ2CYZ1ERI9 BodGZXqD7WLbgpMRcmsrwvtyfujxMgGNNu+fijayXU2RPLT3qJ51KdGevgCMLu8gzxho3TX 7uEmrlCkFZjWLRF85kNZhWbFN1SZC+IBOPvNBKNLj8ujyQdl/mZrloZgkxH314QNg81NCpf QViKzhFeYLcMDgXQyPZFw== X-UI-Out-Filterresults: notjunk:1;V01:K0:HOWUwgnvWgg=:q2NkW9IJo0ll2d6BVzAA9P MUh4RLP8D+0B6CzHtci0GHPb6SN2yb8Vj7tCf4PvPfu6cZlgsawCKmMH5Pb1mk4w+1Ozk+Z1n dKYL3+uXbVtQ0gKJLZpZ4dLPHxiZbgjBdSlKd8QyEIqLZXLnd4U54q5jiATMNB46qSW0lo0y9 Uq2fwJWne074RdISb3mn0tSM4N5Vi1I9uCglkCzsjEOA2nB3dSbi4LelFdATQUuZykH282X0t r+oTOcAYNK1yXJMSVCM2jySGjcBSYLCwe/gn6aZ6zaSFvCYRL+5esCjeGw2cIC97eZvvREoNn HOGweEa90aO+MxK4SsrIAxN3mx11tVOIwCXkbc+tOMULB0rrcXhdlOo3kF1seW1OpeCBSVRAb 2VKt5B/dWwQVZoq7nCdaIAcWs8h6qZ509/wMueKgnKAW8wJoOKWEQWjadDo6UTd7WLSS8NwHt y0sF1GU8VzF3qHp+9gyV3TiyKfcCki++wpMOaVFTluFVg2a24lm0Dn8beqZRp/krkV0iu5uwt cW4JGzqtL0ME4E6LwKIEcg9TMhvUdWe50AsNvo+7qlCGSKWkj4HOsg8tizZWSaCte2+24h4GJ /tkwNy9Ad6dlHmLMfM/sStRIDMchQ7ukcjo/3exfeXb8yE/nBp9dlXXtFsBZa95VjLgkK6gUO buDdus+/sOIv9hNiuMAYZVaYhjCOyVyXW8GuK42qoB3sTiAEbv7NKIzlLAUtuJW79IO/o34xz Py/6AmThAXvfZ+IQ0DveI3OWlZVxD7ODI78kOe8QkuH5zKK90479rY5ukQ7infBL4zpjUbtc7 vXeWpcdNAaC2XkrpA/UMwILJViqYpxh8igf2CBogIvl3GCV7o0= Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Fud] broadcast update X-BeenThere: fud@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 Precedence: list List-Id: FUD - Firmware Updating Description List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 20 Jul 2017 12:51:09 -0000 I mentioned firmware updates on LoRa networks, which is described at https://developer.mbed.org/blog/entry/firmware-updates-over-lpwan-lora/ Ciao Hannes On 07/20/2017 02:41 PM, Emmanuel Baccelli wrote: > Hi Hannes, > > you mentioned a demo about that over LoRa (if I recall correctly) this > morning. > Can you send us a pointer to that stuff? > > Thanks > > Emmanuel > > > _______________________________________________ > Fud mailing list > Fud@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/fud > From nobody Thu Jul 20 05:55:00 2017 Return-Path: X-Original-To: fud@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: fud@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 20FEF12EB99 for ; Thu, 20 Jul 2017 05:54:59 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -4.901 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-4.901 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW=-0.7, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_H2=-2.8, RCVD_IN_SORBS_SPAM=0.5, RP_MATCHES_RCVD=-0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id XKCnvxzEPUom for ; Thu, 20 Jul 2017 05:54:57 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mout.gmx.net (mout.gmx.net [212.227.17.21]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id D551A126E3A for ; Thu, 20 Jul 2017 05:54:56 -0700 (PDT) Received: from [192.168.91.199] ([31.133.137.21]) by mail.gmx.com (mrgmx101 [212.227.17.168]) with ESMTPSA (Nemesis) id 0LkTSx-1eAFwv2j3j-00cQlM; Thu, 20 Jul 2017 14:54:50 +0200 To: Trishank Karthik Kuppusamy , Henk Birkholz Cc: Shikhar Sakhuja , Justin Cappos , fud@ietf.org, Ariella C Feuchtwanger References: <7081cb17-2e39-1351-ae39-bcc31378b8b1@sit.fraunhofer.de> From: Hannes Tschofenig Openpgp: id=071A97A9ECBADCA8E31E678554D9CEEF4D776BC9 Message-ID: Date: Thu, 20 Jul 2017 14:54:49 +0200 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; Linux x86_64; rv:52.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/52.2.1 MIME-Version: 1.0 In-Reply-To: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Language: en-US Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Provags-ID: V03:K0:bEmAy+6oQ2nWl+4YGmUk67wDL0l3X8A4+xwrGFcso2xEn0ulrHD 8D9vYAJpumxMkTrh2MK+A7pVhoBqPAOnxMNFeg64hT1wXCLXlJOqfAY/BpxD0NvQjI2LkgU pjy+eXPtHzFZ3SFqhcQDBbFIuVHn6mjKjlAMqcnRfVeOR/MhWInVw4o/BPbK9KJVx+FrxH5 zzHAnFt99pCKWm3XTuuSw== X-UI-Out-Filterresults: notjunk:1;V01:K0:RyLur+4OkFE=:nHvaoKkCcMbpMDwXlKHVnP XVqt3wP5fIM8CqjoS0OFY+mNN1SXowBruZb9dF49/JVxPLKVQFPK/9tgIr0Lkzd9xZoko1Z+y G5SVp64MBxAMEybkf/6SIWrWnepURbTiyvNPIcSrvUGGD/VqLZtszLJyVAijW5S+pdOuLE4U3 QfK1MfC2dJvcMj5H4wq0HruKN4Vz4GYwr+njG0X+ftH2Sydtawr6k3NfSAbIIEx8oIFwWdVVN VSnmD7wrGzH76aypU9uSbgtyWkG1ofUzlHuNGu0yEA/iR37EP1nj6uKEZ7yk/5rjN9IXya5Wx tiZvYuHebrLPFvQGgCSmDG7lfV3K1UyoAyULO0JX0ELu74+C+CU2JaKORMW+BUP+ZyEWbkg38 AlVr1Ke1wpOlb9L+RXSUoYJYxq/uNZ7gEktbph3PIuGtNZlVJvlBzi2SPyZT4Saeuv79zwTup 0aUCOqsqu4GWy92b0O8d8H//cUp+l3Gf21cEB18ZQQdNnTLZFFfL6dgVPR+oA7w+NSqpmvDw3 rDlY5GNDEYW32LGKGnmWVFh1rX2r+vHHUE1JC2AgQF+SaLyL54vR/n8fsrq3y861Bc5VPVDAT a5Gd20o/RDZCXaanUFjEXNNcXniwGywlf+HrZfv7k3FcrgzecxVoqNvYZhGfW39bd+aQe8usY OhgdO++rkvz18vKayhOZa1QCmoBGfVcVGx9wrDTRm3vrK4DY35M2let41Ui6e6rjvBPdZzi/R 7vSOsjbFAKUAtaqUkcdYm/SCfBpu0mi719ft7QIELAlXBJ8zuUnupDqLhQ1EZ4j0cB16QhOAU G3d/K8GDQAxrh5ATA5YyWCXicbVtQnUq8d17ZS3dhjrX6FmOQc= Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Fud] FUD Side Meeting @ Prague IETF X-BeenThere: fud@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 Precedence: list List-Id: FUD - Firmware Updating Description List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 20 Jul 2017 12:54:59 -0000 Hi Trishank, thanks for sharing the pointer to your work with this group. I will read through asap. Regarding this specific meeting: it was just an informal chat among interested parties attending the IETF meeting. So, we had no remote participation capabilities but I will share a few notes with the group. The plan is to have an official session at the next IETF meeting where we will be able to offer remote participation capabilities. Ciao Hannes On 07/19/2017 08:38 PM, Trishank Karthik Kuppusamy wrote: > Hello everyone, > > We're from The Update Framework (TUF) project > [https://theupdateframework.github.io/], where we are concerned with > attackers who compromise the software repository used to host and > distribute software updates, and thus distribute and install malware > onto millions of devices at once. > > Would it be possible for us to join this meeting remotely? We are in the > EST time zone. Thanks in advance! > > Regards, > Trishank > > On Wed, Jul 19, 2017 at 5:13 AM, Henk Birkholz > > wrote: > > Hello FUD'ler, > > again I am sorry that I cannot join, but I am in a session where I > have 3 presentation at that time. > > If you actually deciding to meeting at this session slot, I would > like to ask you to have a extensive look at: > > https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-sacm-coswid-02#page-14 > > > > "CoSWID Attributes for Firmware " > > There is a resource description type for firmware that can even > include the corresponding firmware and act as a transport container. > It - of course - includes the complete expressiveness of > ISO-19770-2:2015 and is therefore inter-operable in regard to the > corresponding metadata that overlaps with "normal software" and can > be processed by any system that already understands the semantics of > ISO SWID documents. > > Viele Grüße, > > Henk > > > On 07/18/2017 05:26 PM, Hannes Tschofenig wrote: > > Hi all, > > I have been asked by a few IETF participants whether we should > get together this week to talk about firmware updates for IoT > devices (as a follow-up of what we did at the Chicago IETF meeting). > > I am proposing to meet Thursday, 9:30am in the Istanbul room (at > the L level). I have reserved the room till 12:00. > > Ciao > > Hannes > > IMPORTANT NOTICE: The contents of this email and any attachments > are confidential and may also be privileged. If you are not the > intended recipient, please notify the sender immediately and do > not disclose the contents to any other person, use it for any > purpose, or store or copy the information in any medium. Thank you. > > > _______________________________________________ > Fud mailing list > Fud@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/fud > > > > _______________________________________________ > Fud mailing list > Fud@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/fud > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > Fud mailing list > Fud@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/fud > From nobody Thu Jul 20 07:26:47 2017 Return-Path: X-Original-To: fud@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: fud@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3AD02131761 for ; Thu, 20 Jul 2017 07:26:45 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE=-0.0001, SPF_PASS=-0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=gmail.com Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id QNgrwPfyP_Ki for ; Thu, 20 Jul 2017 07:26:44 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail-pf0-x22e.google.com (mail-pf0-x22e.google.com [IPv6:2607:f8b0:400e:c00::22e]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id E0E6313188F for ; Thu, 20 Jul 2017 07:26:43 -0700 (PDT) Received: by mail-pf0-x22e.google.com with SMTP id q85so12976248pfq.1 for ; Thu, 20 Jul 2017 07:26:43 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20161025; h=mime-version:from:date:message-id:subject:to; bh=uMfkRniXIhK+Dkx2hVHghCtqBOqC6sLNvPZRITM574U=; b=EfLLqoJ1p2GyR90y4/llXKrbFg+R54mCnkSeTJ1Nv5NNSCWqa8Yza2Njzw17VMjBqS NOO/8Gn1agJ8jNzrVyozpjPQTqwdFoDrjc0HKwqO7+OLLLaksRrr1vA9SQzx0QO6Lhh4 B/vgRz6J/eonxY01abj/OPba+td8ri046FraVs2Fxwh3+UWgzY3+5A2go7Ha7eX8eRwS uFmvj5zRfCealv+pxOh7jmZc4mzPg+jjDT0LPnWM8KR3aalv2uMV8m1j/Vc3oyPBW3gl ue4ORvkzx+3tJujgAB7P2tWjOZwcOni+OaPLdrqJWi3YwhzCLf0qh44p8jq6O7bRjnOE 36OA== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:from:date:message-id:subject:to; bh=uMfkRniXIhK+Dkx2hVHghCtqBOqC6sLNvPZRITM574U=; b=Ka+I+a0MzdkvBjVIz/dv1905UlaEG8dpoQyTAJuRx6lmgMZlfJaFWvZlGoRw+sFbIk oM/9Mfx/ZktUSm3AN+tondupeCDQEbM9wPWmlQtTw3UzEdU/WvKAkAw7vsmpZH3Vbcxj W1CwXkKLgzRMJKU1WI/3KX8gumoW6M10fiePyw5q15SNS8xl2QrJL09x+oFOgHJF1vVv W86ZLbyhxaGwEVamybrw06F4UClKb3zXl9dSdqF0bNDYYIvJey95TLdlbF1bF6b8QzMx rm1wkXySoVT059tDQtvM7qzXVvDvwb5ODbxOhnNEf+rPKsuITw+9KvgI6oDWKwkSuPBw 2n+w== X-Gm-Message-State: AIVw112Wvx+GgwSa4wekQWrnfVFwOgBRw4+FvMWxV1L0KLWsN+EmCmtp P2x8TW0Kcd3lIJ+g/TKhlkFvsq41eA== X-Received: by 10.98.18.69 with SMTP id a66mr4155559pfj.33.1500560803382; Thu, 20 Jul 2017 07:26:43 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 Received: by 10.100.180.193 with HTTP; Thu, 20 Jul 2017 07:26:02 -0700 (PDT) From: Kathleen Moriarty Date: Thu, 20 Jul 2017 10:26:02 -0400 Message-ID: To: fud@ietf.org Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Archived-At: Subject: [Fud] Chairs X-BeenThere: fud@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 Precedence: list List-Id: FUD - Firmware Updating Description List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 20 Jul 2017 14:26:45 -0000 Hello, Without fear, uncertainty. or doubt, Russ Housley and David Waltermire have agreed to chair the Firmware UpDate (FUD) effort and shepherd it toward a working group. Thank you both for your efforts to assist the proponents drive this important work forward. If the work is scoped well, the problem statement is clear with a well defined charter, and agreed upon set of work, it is possible to move directly to a working group. If a BoF is needed, we'll try for that at the next meeting in November. It is also possible to hold a virtual BoF if that is desired as well. Time slips quickly, so active efforts to drive this work is necessary to have a successful BoF in November (or to exceed that goal). Thank you all in advance. -- Best regards, Kathleen From nobody Thu Jul 20 08:11:26 2017 Return-Path: X-Original-To: fud@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: fud@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 59716131CFC for ; Thu, 20 Jul 2017 08:11:24 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.621 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.621 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW=-0.7, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_H3=-0.01, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_WL=-0.01, RP_MATCHES_RCVD=-0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id PX0GgtbVHlhB for ; Thu, 20 Jul 2017 08:11:22 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mout.gmx.net (mout.gmx.net [212.227.17.20]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id F0C84131CD1 for ; Thu, 20 Jul 2017 08:11:21 -0700 (PDT) Received: from [192.168.91.200] ([31.133.137.21]) by mail.gmx.com (mrgmx103 [212.227.17.168]) with ESMTPSA (Nemesis) id 0LeNGL-1dxhAL07ht-00qBb8 for ; Thu, 20 Jul 2017 17:11:20 +0200 From: Hannes Tschofenig Openpgp: id=071A97A9ECBADCA8E31E678554D9CEEF4D776BC9 To: fud@ietf.org Message-ID: Date: Thu, 20 Jul 2017 17:11:19 +0200 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; Linux x86_64; rv:52.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/52.2.1 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Language: en-US Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Provags-ID: V03:K0:BPsH4+pLGoDv1rvk/SUYfU6HPG7Oy4fJB/ZZlo1PMI26eVuYrUz 1SyeRhe1vYSvMTl8NPoAU0yi9aB98GsGb0g0CgsCtE728vOcVFL0/giHDhmfM1ABv62XCCO N3l/KtgAweRYUJEBUUU3rGYkyKPuVzx7fLo0Ql02DMQaUeaVrDKOUPrxW6WzIrFnYh93YNS zaD5Kw17Ltd8+DiGk5EbQ== X-UI-Out-Filterresults: notjunk:1;V01:K0:CJeoRPNN1hw=:6evbJpVM3ZoumI2mON7JzI 3qM8Unn06TYOgvocDRbdhZCwFRbaXbLj0BOXvZkMWDVPzKRvnd4g+mfVcKLQyNVaFtoMxaa7R 762oA0DfP6WFl+PbqvNooReXpiJh6XfgpcfBzvlWsYbC4bQZVO3ohDTHm2yMnoge5zbGBPQaA Rdc4EKJuVWSxbhPE6SJaK2HBUMyiM6VXJA3ftKJhXPnGwkOtzFh6WJEeTVzGaEuc6UEpb+Uoc 3fmSSAHcokKXzkyBLemRoQkA4lbeH75IE3JStzvoJrNaUieOILhzj/rptCjKzh9ipN7FTVrcU Emzd5SVMKjUIcRtJKS3lN3wA0DqqRC1awe3sDpznAXluSuvCCOQiP55ycCDowpLVaTNmJvADB SqG9gi1nX+XvLScl1h1u8jcUpUZQCjY8lClVQJ50Ej0O5xljQDc6HkzNTc6aa3nE+hiwCzP41 i7lkYT00cPQh3Ejs3BhPn+6mygPx9RRqqB2yK9pH0CXFjqtKS9tOclO11eeMy8H9ujj547pQ5 lueHq2yE0aEqdkRq0EMhE1+0LdJsGQVeR0wcOsbOnpnaT24GA4MqWMu7XqvfhMzo1chMixatu X/EogwLQ0DC3ErYXxyu57UxgB5hdu0gX5bADVSQ/ttOkRmrd1pS6uLQ0ZI74lIoXC4Yjd4X0G rgwb6aplCj/lPKX9N4J2uZ8MUiYO8VBjqQ7azZLh8i+Xt6YFYqVEPQ4R8VRQHOJmrSvgSqFTj N/jIRWVYp3aFLmkYdiA4NwyyltXMBQbooA97T7tiaNWn1rNQGe5wATqwDpvFr7hGQ847t1FoP +IQm5I8jc300B5cHID4aNKt1YAmvwd16avBu4JDqQluYkNhXw8= Archived-At: Subject: [Fud] My notes X-BeenThere: fud@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 Precedence: list List-Id: FUD - Firmware Updating Description List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 20 Jul 2017 15:11:24 -0000 A small group attended the informal FUD meeting today and I started with an explanation of what we had been doing with firmware updates at ARM by going through the two documents I recently submitted. The manifest format is inspired by RFC 4108, uses asymmetric crypto only, and an ASN.1-based encoding. (Not in the scope of the standardization effort in FUD is the actual delivery mechanism but we have been using LwM2M.) We spoke about the difference between a software update mechanism and firmware updates and Emmanuel (working on the RIOT OS) mentioned that they have use cases where IoT devices run an embedded version of JavaScript and need to also get code/scripts in addition to the firmware and he wants to have that use case covered as well. In this context the issue of the class of IoT devices we are targeting and Emmanuel argued that we should aim for class #1 devices (based on RFC 7228). This means ~ 10 KiB RAM and ~ 100 KiB flash. There have been doubts whether this is possible. Henk posted a link to the mailing list pointing to the firmware manifest description based on RFC 4108. Here is the document: https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-sacm-coswid-02#appendix-B So, we looked at the SACM COSWID work and were wondering about the need to also support alternative encoding formats for the manifest (in addition to an ASN.1 format), such as CBOR. Erik Nordmark asked for a more detailed threat description and we talked about the threat where an attacker blocks access to the update server. This lead to a discussion about what we should cover in the architecture document even if it is outside the scope of the standardization effort of the manifest format itself. Russ suggested to also take hash-based signatures into account (see https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-housley-cms-mts-hash-sig-07 and https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-mcgrew-hash-sigs-07), as it was already suggested at the IOTSU workshop. There was an agreement among the participants that we should explore this option. Russ argued that the performance is for verifier is good. The signature size is rather large in comparison to an ECDSA signature but given that the firmware image size it may not matter much. Steve mentioned ongoing activities by NTIA about firmware/software updates that are relevant to this effort, namely "Multistakeholder Process; Internet of Things (IoT) Security Upgradability and Patching" https://www.ntia.doc.gov/other-publication/2016/multistakeholder-process-iot-security We talked a bit about the use case where a device consists of multiple microcontrollers that all need to be updated and how the individual components are identified and how this use case is captured within the manifest. The 'dependencies' attribute was used in the draft-moran-fud-manifest-00. Finally, we spoke about the next steps, namely (1) reaching out to various IoT OS developers and middleware providers. We need more implementers of this technology in the group. Emanuel promised to send a message to the folks from the Contiki OS and the MCUBoot project (see https://github.com/runtimeco/mcuboot). I will reach out to the guys from the IAB IOTSU workshop and to ARM partners. (2) starting to draft a charter text with the focus of standarding a manifest and to capture the overall architecture. The plan is to charter a working group before the next IETF meeting. From nobody Thu Jul 20 08:23:14 2017 Return-Path: X-Original-To: fud@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: fud@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 04108131C43 for ; Thu, 20 Jul 2017 08:23:13 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.901 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.901 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE=-0.0001, SPF_HELO_PASS=-0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (1024-bit key) header.d=nistgov.onmicrosoft.com Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 3NQdkjqSYUne for ; Thu, 20 Jul 2017 08:23:10 -0700 (PDT) Received: from gcc01-dm2-obe.outbound.protection.outlook.com (mail-dm2gcc01on0133.outbound.protection.outlook.com [23.103.201.133]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 20C0C131CE6 for ; Thu, 20 Jul 2017 08:23:10 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=nistgov.onmicrosoft.com; s=selector1-nist-gov; h=From:Date:Subject:Message-ID:Content-Type:MIME-Version; bh=LmSh4S46Up6WPXExaP4//HiqaVKWPVlbztT+N8bnwUY=; b=YKanAUe/rE6TpPGGGU1pTXCphbe60ypnlFfL9glzUj2//y1cTsjXY89JXv3jN9W4WWx9QU0tSGl5BZWSNkumrfs24BybBGZUcYlIkd56S/RWu5XiH3AbvN37OtuBmZmfV/pyVM6s6HalmWVRhqGhv3yMlRBYqaC//iXAny/NqHA= Received: from MWHPR09MB1440.namprd09.prod.outlook.com (10.173.50.14) by MWHPR09MB1438.namprd09.prod.outlook.com (10.173.50.12) with Microsoft SMTP Server (version=TLS1_2, cipher=TLS_ECDHE_RSA_WITH_AES_128_CBC_SHA256_P256) id 15.1.1261.13; Thu, 20 Jul 2017 15:23:08 +0000 Received: from MWHPR09MB1440.namprd09.prod.outlook.com ([10.173.50.14]) by MWHPR09MB1440.namprd09.prod.outlook.com ([10.173.50.14]) with mapi id 15.01.1261.024; Thu, 20 Jul 2017 15:23:08 +0000 From: "Waltermire, David A. (Fed)" To: Hannes Tschofenig , "fud@ietf.org" Thread-Topic: [Fud] My notes Thread-Index: AQHTAWp8EkyFkNMNIU2E7nW5X9HxBaJc1SdF Date: Thu, 20 Jul 2017 15:23:08 +0000 Message-ID: References: In-Reply-To: Accept-Language: en-US Content-Language: en-US X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: authentication-results: gmx.net; dkim=none (message not signed) header.d=none;gmx.net; dmarc=none action=none header.from=nist.gov; x-originating-ip: [2001:67c:370:128:b5a6:c156:31d7:2673] x-ms-publictraffictype: Email x-microsoft-exchange-diagnostics: 1; MWHPR09MB1438; 7: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 x-ms-office365-filtering-correlation-id: b6c13b40-4152-4298-cb4a-08d4cf8339f5 x-ms-office365-filtering-ht: Tenant x-microsoft-antispam: UriScan:; BCL:0; PCL:0; RULEID:(300000500095)(300135000095)(300000501095)(300135300095)(22001)(300000502095)(300135100095)(2017030254075)(300000503095)(300135400095)(48565401081)(2017052603031)(201703131423075)(201703031133081)(300000504095)(300135200095)(300000505095)(300135600095)(300000506095)(300135500095); SRVR:MWHPR09MB1438; x-ms-traffictypediagnostic: MWHPR09MB1438: x-exchange-antispam-report-test: UriScan:(278178393323532)(158342451672863)(133145235818549)(166708455590820)(26388249023172)(236129657087228)(192374486261705)(248736688235697)(167848164394848); x-microsoft-antispam-prvs: x-exchange-antispam-report-cfa-test: BCL:0; PCL:0; RULEID:(100000700101)(100105000095)(100000701101)(100105300095)(100000702101)(100105100095)(6040450)(601004)(2401047)(8121501046)(5005006)(2017060910075)(3002001)(10201501046)(93006095)(93001095)(100000703101)(100105400095)(6055026)(6041248)(20161123560025)(20161123562025)(20161123555025)(201703131423075)(201702281528075)(201703061421075)(201703061406153)(20161123558100)(20161123564025)(6072148)(100000704101)(100105200095)(100000705101)(100105500095); SRVR:MWHPR09MB1438; BCL:0; PCL:0; RULEID:(100000800101)(100110000095)(100000801101)(100110300095)(100000802101)(100110100095)(100000803101)(100110400095)(100000804101)(100110200095)(100000805101)(100110500095); SRVR:MWHPR09MB1438; x-forefront-prvs: 0374433C81 x-forefront-antispam-report: SFV:NSPM; SFS:(10019020)(39840400002)(39850400002)(39400400002)(39860400002)(39410400002)(39450400003)(377454003)(76176999)(50986999)(99286003)(55016002)(9686003)(236005)(6506006)(86362001)(38730400002)(2950100002)(74316002)(3280700002)(2906002)(6436002)(53546010)(77096006)(33656002)(5660300001)(606006)(6246003)(54356999)(8676002)(7736002)(54896002)(478600001)(229853002)(2501003)(81166006)(3660700001)(6116002)(25786009)(2900100001)(53936002)(14454004)(966005)(7696004)(8936002)(6306002)(189998001)(102836003); DIR:OUT; SFP:1102; SCL:1; SRVR:MWHPR09MB1438; H:MWHPR09MB1440.namprd09.prod.outlook.com; FPR:; SPF:None; MLV:sfv; LANG:en; spamdiagnosticoutput: 1:99 spamdiagnosticmetadata: NSPM Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="_000_MWHPR09MB1440667DAD8CBE9AC9DDCC45F0A70MWHPR09MB1440namp_" MIME-Version: 1.0 X-OriginatorOrg: nist.gov X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-originalarrivaltime: 20 Jul 2017 15:23:08.4126 (UTC) X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-fromentityheader: Hosted X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-id: 2ab5d82f-d8fa-4797-a93e-054655c61dec X-MS-Exchange-Transport-CrossTenantHeadersStamped: MWHPR09MB1438 Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Fud] My notes X-BeenThere: fud@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 Precedence: list List-Id: FUD - Firmware Updating Description List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 20 Jul 2017 15:23:13 -0000 --_000_MWHPR09MB1440667DAD8CBE9AC9DDCC45F0A70MWHPR09MB1440namp_ Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Thanks Hannes! Dave ________________________________ From: Fud on behalf of Hannes Tschofenig Sent: Thursday, July 20, 2017 11:11:19 AM To: fud@ietf.org Subject: [Fud] My notes A small group attended the informal FUD meeting today and I started with an explanation of what we had been doing with firmware updates at ARM by going through the two documents I recently submitted. The manifest format is inspired by RFC 4108, uses asymmetric crypto only, and an ASN.1-based encoding. (Not in the scope of the standardization effort in FUD is the actual delivery mechanism but we have been using LwM2M.) We spoke about the difference between a software update mechanism and firmware updates and Emmanuel (working on the RIOT OS) mentioned that they have use cases where IoT devices run an embedded version of JavaScript and need to also get code/scripts in addition to the firmware and he wants to have that use case covered as well. In this context the issue of the class of IoT devices we are targeting and Emmanuel argued that we should aim for class #1 devices (based on RFC 7228). This means ~ 10 KiB RAM and ~ 100 KiB flash. There have been doubts whether this is possible. Henk posted a link to the mailing list pointing to the firmware manifest description based on RFC 4108. Here is the document: https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-sacm-coswid-02#appendix-B So, we looked at the SACM COSWID work and were wondering about the need to also support alternative encoding formats for the manifest (in addition to an ASN.1 format), such as CBOR. Erik Nordmark asked for a more detailed threat description and we talked about the threat where an attacker blocks access to the update server. This lead to a discussion about what we should cover in the architecture document even if it is outside the scope of the standardization effort of the manifest format itself. Russ suggested to also take hash-based signatures into account (see https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-housley-cms-mts-hash-sig-07 and https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-mcgrew-hash-sigs-07), as it was already suggested at the IOTSU workshop. There was an agreement among the participants that we should explore this option. Russ argued that the performance is for verifier is good. The signature size is rather large in comparison to an ECDSA signature but given that the firmware image size it may not matter much. Steve mentioned ongoing activities by NTIA about firmware/software updates that are relevant to this effort, namely "Multistakeholder Process; Internet of Things (IoT) Security Upgradability and Patching" https://www.ntia.doc.gov/other-publication/2016/multistakeholder-process-io= t-security We talked a bit about the use case where a device consists of multiple microcontrollers that all need to be updated and how the individual components are identified and how this use case is captured within the manifest. The 'dependencies' attribute was used in the draft-moran-fud-manifest-00. Finally, we spoke about the next steps, namely (1) reaching out to various IoT OS developers and middleware providers. We need more implementers of this technology in the group. Emanuel promised to send a message to the folks from the Contiki OS and the MCUBoot project (see https://github.com/runtimeco/mcuboot). I will reach out to the guys from the IAB IOTSU workshop and to ARM partners. (2) starting to draft a charter text with the focus of standarding a manifest and to capture the overall architecture. The plan is to charter a working group before the next IETF meeting. _______________________________________________ Fud mailing list Fud@ietf.org https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/fud --_000_MWHPR09MB1440667DAD8CBE9AC9DDCC45F0A70MWHPR09MB1440namp_ Content-Type: text/html; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

Thanks Hannes!


Dave

From: Fud <fud-bounces= @ietf.org> on behalf of Hannes Tschofenig <hannes.tschofenig@gmx.net&= gt;
Sent: Thursday, July 20, 2017 11:11:19 AM
To: fud@ietf.org
Subject: [Fud] My notes
 
A small group attended the informal FUD meeting to= day and I started with
an explanation of what we had been doing with firmware updates at ARM by going through the two documents I recently submitted. The manifest
format is inspired by RFC 4108, uses asymmetric crypto only, and an
ASN.1-based encoding. (Not in the scope of the standardization effort in FUD is the actual delivery mechanism but we have been using LwM2M.)

We spoke about the difference between a software update mechanism and
firmware updates and Emmanuel (working on the RIOT OS) mentioned that
they have use cases where IoT devices run an embedded version of
JavaScript and need to also get code/scripts in addition to the firmware and he wants to have that use case covered as well.

In this context the issue of the class of IoT devices we are targeting
and Emmanuel argued that we should aim for class #1 devices (based on
RFC 7228). This means ~ 10 KiB RAM and ~ 100 KiB flash. There have been
doubts whether this is possible.

Henk posted a link to the mailing list pointing to the firmware manifest description based on RFC 4108. Here is the document:
https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-sacm-coswid-02#appendix-B
So, we looked at the SACM COSWID work and were wondering about the need
to also support alternative encoding formats for the manifest (in
addition to an ASN.1 format), such as CBOR.

Erik Nordmark asked for a more detailed threat description and we talked about the threat where an attacker blocks access to the update server.
This lead to a discussion about what we should cover in the architecture document even if it is outside the scope of the standardization effort
of the manifest format itself.

Russ suggested to also take hash-based signatures into account (see
h= ttps://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-housley-cms-mts-hash-sig-07 and
https://t= ools.ietf.org/html/draft-mcgrew-hash-sigs-07), as it was
already suggested at the IOTSU workshop. There was an agreement among
the participants that we should explore this option. Russ argued that
the performance is for verifier is good. The signature size is rather
large in comparison to an ECDSA signature but given that the firmware
image size it may not matter much.

Steve mentioned ongoing activities by NTIA about firmware/software
updates that are relevant to this effort, namely "Multistakeholder
Process; Internet of Things (IoT) Security Upgradability and Patching"=
https://www.ntia.doc.gov/other-publication/2016/mult= istakeholder-process-iot-security

We talked a bit about the use case where a device consists of multiple
microcontrollers that all need to be updated and how the individual
components are identified and how this use case is captured within the
manifest. The 'dependencies' attribute was used in the
draft-moran-fud-manifest-00.

Finally, we spoke about the next steps, namely

(1) reaching out to various IoT OS developers and middleware providers.
We need more implementers of this technology in the group. Emanuel
promised to send a message to the folks from the Contiki OS and the
MCUBoot project (see https= ://github.com/runtimeco/mcuboot). I will reach
out to the guys from the IAB IOTSU workshop and to ARM partners.

(2) starting to draft a charter text with the focus of standarding a
manifest and to capture the overall architecture.

The plan is to charter a working group before the next IETF meeting.


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 --_000_MWHPR09MB1440667DAD8CBE9AC9DDCC45F0A70MWHPR09MB1440namp_-- From nobody Fri Jul 21 14:53:03 2017 Return-Path: X-Original-To: fud@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: fud@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id CFCF21201F2 for ; Fri, 21 Jul 2017 14:53:02 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.621 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.621 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW=-0.7, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_H3=-0.01, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_WL=-0.01, RP_MATCHES_RCVD=-0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id KgDp7vfywWdt for ; Fri, 21 Jul 2017 14:53:01 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mout.gmx.net (mout.gmx.net [212.227.17.20]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id ED69C124B0A for ; Fri, 21 Jul 2017 14:53:00 -0700 (PDT) Received: from [192.168.91.200] ([80.92.121.224]) by mail.gmx.com (mrgmx102 [212.227.17.168]) with ESMTPSA (Nemesis) id 0MEtba-1dN4zI3FCk-00G3iE for ; Fri, 21 Jul 2017 23:52:58 +0200 To: fud@ietf.org From: Hannes Tschofenig Openpgp: id=071A97A9ECBADCA8E31E678554D9CEEF4D776BC9 Message-ID: <8f8528da-d1eb-08c7-b3fe-b1f4febed595@gmx.net> Date: Fri, 21 Jul 2017 23:52:40 +0200 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; Linux x86_64; rv:52.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/52.2.1 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Language: en-US Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Provags-ID: V03:K0:00x4nnI0uOiI9DlNLt2ExYEnoqCN8h5BadoN/h1LDr9FmT1iFso RQEf0QeMLYvn4UASG/hpXnig0ZrD0ktPFfSjeGu2JQTD1c1DW3QpjzMIwur6Ii2yRtnHXZZ sSii5/z1zUsba1IG/6zOqDVVRs4gaxrF7uspysf3r56+F1U4Kglry18rGtzSJCZPS+1TKXn U/KVubW0Wv1wRgR1hvKcg== X-UI-Out-Filterresults: notjunk:1;V01:K0:GoYiBjFXnrk=:90mEgt4nc04JfI8SAF+MQ6 0h6arULtbhAOuFsDBVhoS2iDivGsS9nVJMvj8aEygwNg+eWGpZkKoYr174IfZC3Yf5R32/wwS 7jnFlfTxjWlbNvGeeWQBIBxlpXU/WyOw2JzuYydK+WSxj+psWGKkeDx970Gs15UhAfLcJL0Oz XUHxS37brvFRSSZY0jbQYC0tQD99VSmoKEeNtEIGIyF93dJVH8nx/nwJwr+kEW2CW+QHfUVR+ jQDOf9coM5BNSEh5gvULEJXCyRwqaZfrNgxbsRR+VV85WPxDD8ZdkzWw1B8vaY6iSFBzogvaX MY6QFuAs3XE0lAFxcELU1hL6ir6+Ax+v5ByS7lDyqVf5q/9Sn+b/Oix4mcTbb/eQ6SahcXRZZ HqKcriI8m4KWlnABPj3PBs1JV2DSXyFg4O/fWSLdfMyvILtJvBGKkZ6MMcrDxHxcxJmY51T9E U9126Tz11gUsBUHHF/+wxklCNXzoTgjMjsjNVH+OLhGAIrtxi7Awm3kbKgLPLpClRtch1CIMJ pwXBo4iIooBxXNiMZ069VxbtTkKP9nSZaFbIEg6dfZWD+k13sjhug5Q2qienf7XK+G68Hg6rm RNKhN6X8FZrCqAq3w2ikfRtSiKsu7utWW2dpOsjT59iHtMrREBBHQkK0r3tm8iL1cajvkRN1D CwriLZtaxXzWMScu+0MwWz6jHGcM/FExIPlv7GH5KY8dZSdM5599+fjzLDM005UgryYS0thef 0U23/opr6uwxlC+P1jGl6vK3diJio6sr7PwF0Q1npuYoeY+dAjPgKWB8fKBdG5Pb+5C/U7ary 3eQF3bX3Nel2d8yM4YnwfFzoYMITMnVXuAdruty9043JqCS1Mc= Archived-At: Subject: [Fud] Charter Text X-BeenThere: fud@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 Precedence: list List-Id: FUD - Firmware Updating Description List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 21 Jul 2017 21:53:03 -0000 Here is a strawman proposal for a charter text. Suggestions welcome! ---- Firmware Updating Description (FUD) Vulnerabilities with Internet of Things (IoT) devices have raised the need for a secure firmware update mechanism that is also suitable for constrained devices. Security experts, researchers and regulators recommend that all IoT devices are equipped with such a mechanism. While there are many proprietary firmware update mechanisms in use today there is a lack of an modern interoperable approach of securely updating IoT devices. A firmware update solution consists of several components, including a mechanism to transport firmware images to IoT devices and a manifest that provides meta-data about the firmware image as well as cryptographic information for protecting the firmware image in an end-to-end fashion. With RFC 4018 the IETF standardized a manifest format that uses the Cryptographic Message Syntax (CMS) to protect firmware packages. Since the publication of RFC 4108 more than 10 years have passed and more experience with IoT deployments have lead to additional functionality requiring the work done with RFC 4108 to be revisited. The purpose of this group is to standardize a version 2 of RFC 4108 that reflects best current practices. This group will not define any transport mechanism. In 2016 the Internet Architecture Board organized a workshop on 'Internet of Things (IoT) Software Update (IOTSU)', which took place at Trinity College Dublin, Ireland on the 13th and 14th of June, 2016. The main goal of the workshop was to foster a discussion on requirements, challenges and solutions for bringing software and firmware updates to IoT devices. This workshop also made clear that there are challenges with lack of regulatory requirements, and misaligned incentives. It is nevertheless seen as important to standardize the building blocks that help interested parties to implement and deploy a solid firmware update mechanism. In particular this group aims to publish two documents, namely * an IoT firmware update architecture that includes a description of the involved entities, security threats and assumptions, and * the manifest format itself. This group does not aim to standardize a generic software update mechanism used by rich operating systems, like Linux, but instead focuses on software development practices in the embedded industry. This group will aim to develop a close relationship with silicon vendors and OEMs that develop IoT operating systems. Milestones Dec 2017 Submit "Architecture" document as WG item. Dec 2017 Submit "Manifest Format" specification as WG item. Jul 2018 Submit "Architecture" to the IESG for publication as an Informational RFC. Nov 2018 Submit "Manifest Format" to the IESG for publication as a Proposed Standard. Additional calendar items: Mar 2018 Release initial version of the manifest creation tools as open source. Apr 2018 Release first version of manifest test tool suite as open source. Jun 2018 Release first IoT OS implementation of firmware update mechanisms as open source. From nobody Sat Jul 22 00:57:58 2017 Return-Path: X-Original-To: fud@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: fud@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id A310F131C4F for ; Sat, 22 Jul 2017 00:57:56 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.699 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.699 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, FREEMAIL_FORGED_FROMDOMAIN=0.199, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, HEADER_FROM_DIFFERENT_DOMAINS=0.001, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE=-0.0001, SPF_PASS=-0.001] autolearn=no autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=gmail.com Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id oDSfessxDyGh for ; Sat, 22 Jul 2017 00:57:55 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail-ua0-x22d.google.com (mail-ua0-x22d.google.com [IPv6:2607:f8b0:400c:c08::22d]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id CC89912714F for ; Sat, 22 Jul 2017 00:57:54 -0700 (PDT) Received: by mail-ua0-x22d.google.com with SMTP id 80so56737253uas.0 for ; Sat, 22 Jul 2017 00:57:54 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20161025; h=mime-version:sender:in-reply-to:references:from:date:message-id :subject:to:cc; bh=a1wskhaSIbRjMbLMrqMnoiQ41lpHQ0ItRueyXDewPFY=; b=HKsp3rhgoCGY9LwsupGAGCko5OBsbZCq+pXy2WsUxAAG5M60DEX+uimga4JFx9bcrk gxwHQ7PIa/lMs7bv1/U6RBllobL1X6MOXCHAdGqaOgDIGjoysbb34iHK2oL1Orm1i+An 6Ks1f1z4aHzKJPMp+x41W26p+wpL3k7lzlfO7VDgV5Lq0a71GZtesF6fks9hej/0uNt6 ecgTTTIqyD8LfW/W3yN5rqgW1r9FLQWszkfQVjXoLB31EqhxVnLpp4VtL1+MEXNbJuHu idjDYWxHDnQYpkhsqkjkfGclh+jwoFqfIOlyfeeabVMXmVYbzBJgsZMsFAHkBSCfsn3H +33A== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:sender:in-reply-to:references:from :date:message-id:subject:to:cc; bh=a1wskhaSIbRjMbLMrqMnoiQ41lpHQ0ItRueyXDewPFY=; b=MqbTD6E0IDiRCehCo9zUZx6DS5V7yg8XtS2cvvH8F56luDFxkCSD8/UvVE2DABLf40 XM/lOxfbYbi89GHNaWxMDLUQmi+ha1YIXuzvsVKLr+aQEhns6YFhmmcCfOsHAihE7ROg uHgAlsY/VbJvfykFQESeYnDMxSJRpVym3cLaDyn9mp6ZBf9Fd0rNQtAhoF2YuU9/96Qj Z6RcUXdnyzKHs1EB5pz2gD6MrZqsREab1qya8DAf/cxNDfUVvzdcyAzabAvbws7CADuu RYkar2zRUGw89hhyu9hbpmTbX8vnR1hzInwcLck0cmxIdDiVxjmrNmLGRgAowNZNPh2g I1hA== X-Gm-Message-State: AIVw110NIhmik+1hO8J/l+B1lFArGgFushCIrfaNf8KNIbSTRNe3AsXw Z/4z9MFMdVydfu91XFWVvkhy2BRk/w== X-Received: by 10.159.37.37 with SMTP id 34mr2811637uaz.5.1500710273848; Sat, 22 Jul 2017 00:57:53 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 Sender: emmanuel.baccelli@gmail.com Received: by 10.176.76.211 with HTTP; Sat, 22 Jul 2017 00:57:33 -0700 (PDT) In-Reply-To: <8f8528da-d1eb-08c7-b3fe-b1f4febed595@gmx.net> References: <8f8528da-d1eb-08c7-b3fe-b1f4febed595@gmx.net> From: Emmanuel Baccelli Date: Sat, 22 Jul 2017 09:57:33 +0200 X-Google-Sender-Auth: h07wLfHuEsF-T70ggvehBz25Bhs Message-ID: To: fud@ietf.org Cc: Hannes Tschofenig Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="94eb2c122e54c899ef0554e3564f" Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Fud] Charter Text X-BeenThere: fud@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 Precedence: list List-Id: FUD - Firmware Updating Description List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sat, 22 Jul 2017 07:57:56 -0000 --94eb2c122e54c899ef0554e3564f Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Hi Hannes, thanks a lot for the strawman! Reads well in my opinion. At high level, I have the following comments & suggestions: - we have the case of software updates, not only firmware updates, so I'd rather we talk about the more general case of software updates. Is there a strong reason against this? - many people think IoT= RaspberryPi, so I think we should be very very clear that we are also targeting constrained devices as defined in RFC7228. In particular, I'm convinced we can (and should) explicitly include Class 1 devices as also being a target for such software updates. - FUD is quite an unfortunate acronym. Here's an alternative name proposal for the working group: how about SUIT (Software Updates for Internet of Things). (there is a heavy similarity between the above comments and the ones I put forward during the f2f meeting in Prague, as well as with the comments I posted on the manifest+arch drafts you submitted this week ;) Cheers, Emmanuel On Fri, Jul 21, 2017 at 11:52 PM, Hannes Tschofenig < hannes.tschofenig@gmx.net> wrote: > Here is a strawman proposal for a charter text. Suggestions welcome! > > ---- > > Firmware Updating Description (FUD) > > Vulnerabilities with Internet of Things (IoT) devices have raised the > need for a secure firmware update mechanism that is also suitable for > constrained devices. Security experts, researchers and regulators > recommend that all IoT devices are equipped with such a mechanism. While > there are many proprietary firmware update mechanisms in use today there > is a lack of an modern interoperable approach of securely updating IoT > devices. > > A firmware update solution consists of several components, including a > mechanism to transport firmware images to IoT devices and a manifest > that provides meta-data about the firmware image as well as > cryptographic information for protecting the firmware image in an > end-to-end fashion. With RFC 4018 the IETF standardized a manifest > format that uses the Cryptographic Message Syntax (CMS) to protect > firmware packages. > > Since the publication of RFC 4108 more than 10 years have passed and > more experience with IoT deployments have lead to additional > functionality requiring the work done with RFC 4108 to be revisited. The > purpose of this group is to standardize a version 2 of RFC 4108 that > reflects best current practices. This group will not define any > transport mechanism. > > In 2016 the Internet Architecture Board organized a workshop on > 'Internet of Things (IoT) Software Update (IOTSU)', which took place at > Trinity College Dublin, Ireland on the 13th and 14th of June, 2016. The > main goal of the workshop was to foster a discussion on requirements, > challenges and solutions for bringing software and firmware updates to > IoT devices. This workshop also made clear that there are challenges > with lack of regulatory requirements, and misaligned incentives. It is > nevertheless seen as important to standardize the building blocks that > help interested parties to implement and deploy a solid firmware update > mechanism. > > In particular this group aims to publish two documents, namely > * an IoT firmware update architecture that includes a description of > the involved entities, security threats and assumptions, and > * the manifest format itself. > > This group does not aim to standardize a generic software update > mechanism used by rich operating systems, like Linux, but instead > focuses on software development practices in the embedded industry. > > This group will aim to develop a close relationship with silicon vendors > and OEMs that develop IoT operating systems. > > Milestones > > Dec 2017 Submit "Architecture" document as WG item. > > Dec 2017 Submit "Manifest Format" specification as WG item. > > Jul 2018 Submit "Architecture" to the IESG for publication as an > Informational RFC. > > Nov 2018 Submit "Manifest Format" to the IESG for publication as a > Proposed Standard. > > > Additional calendar items: > > Mar 2018 Release initial version of the manifest creation tools as > open source. > > Apr 2018 Release first version of manifest test tool suite as open > source. > > Jun 2018 Release first IoT OS implementation of firmware update > mechanisms as open source. > > _______________________________________________ > Fud mailing list > Fud@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/fud > --94eb2c122e54c899ef0554e3564f Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Hi Hannes,

thanks a lot for the strawma= n! Reads well in my opinion.=C2=A0

At high level, = I have the following comments & suggestions:

-= we have the case of software updates, not only firmware updates, so I'= d rather we talk about the more general case of software updates. Is there = a strong reason against this?

- many people think = IoT=3D RaspberryPi, so I think we should be very very clear that we are als= o targeting constrained devices as defined in RFC7228.
In particu= lar, I'm convinced we can (and should) explicitly include Class 1 devic= es as also being a target for such software updates.

- FUD is quite an unfortunate acronym. Here's an alternative name pr= oposal for the working group: how about SUIT (Software Updates for Internet= of Things).

(there is a heavy similarity between = the above comments and the ones I put forward during the f2f meeting in Pra= gue, as well as with the comments I posted on the manifest+arch drafts you = submitted this week ;)

Cheers,

<= /div>
Emmanuel



On Fri, Jul 21, 2017 at 11:52 PM, Hann= es Tschofenig <hannes.tschofenig@gmx.net> wrote:
=
Here is a strawman proposal for a charter te= xt. Suggestions welcome!

----

Firmware Updating Description (FUD)

Vulnerabilities with Internet of Things (IoT) devices have raised the
need for a secure firmware update mechanism that is also suitable for
constrained devices. Security experts, researchers and regulators
recommend that all IoT devices are equipped with such a mechanism. While there are many proprietary firmware update mechanisms in use today there is a lack of an modern interoperable approach of securely updating IoT
devices.

A firmware update solution consists of several components, including a
mechanism to transport firmware images to IoT devices and a manifest
that provides meta-data about the firmware image as well as
cryptographic information for protecting the firmware image in an
end-to-end fashion. With RFC 4018 the IETF standardized a manifest
format that uses the Cryptographic Message Syntax (CMS) to protect
firmware packages.

Since the publication of RFC 4108 more than 10 years have passed and
more experience with IoT deployments have lead to additional
functionality requiring the work done with RFC 4108 to be revisited. The purpose of this group is to standardize a version 2 of RFC 4108 that
reflects best current practices. This group will not define any
transport mechanism.

In 2016 the Internet Architecture Board organized a workshop on
'Internet of Things (IoT) Software Update (IOTSU)', which took plac= e at
Trinity College Dublin, Ireland on the 13th and 14th of June, 2016. The
main goal of the workshop was to foster a discussion on requirements,
challenges and solutions for bringing software and firmware updates to
IoT devices. This workshop also made clear that there are challenges
with lack of regulatory requirements, and misaligned incentives. It is
nevertheless seen as important to standardize the building blocks that
help interested parties to implement and deploy a solid firmware update
mechanism.

In particular this group aims to publish two documents, namely
=C2=A0* an IoT firmware update architecture that includes a description of<= br> the involved entities, security threats and assumptions, and
=C2=A0* the manifest format itself.

This group does not aim to standardize a generic software update
mechanism used by rich operating systems, like Linux, but instead
focuses on software development practices in the embedded industry.

This group will aim to develop a close relationship with silicon vendors and OEMs that develop IoT operating systems.

Milestones

Dec 2017=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0Submit "Architecture" document as WG = item.

Dec 2017=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0Submit "Manifest Format" specificatio= n as WG item.

Jul 2018=C2=A0 =C2=A0 Submit "Architecture" to the IESG for publi= cation as an
Informational RFC.

Nov 2018=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0Submit "Manifest Format" to the IESG = for publication as a
Proposed Standard.


Additional calendar items:

Mar 2018=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0Release initial version of the manifest creatio= n tools as
open source.

Apr 2018=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0Release first version of manifest test tool sui= te as open
source.

Jun 2018=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0Release first IoT OS implementation of firmware= update
mechanisms as open source.

_______________________________________________
Fud mailing list
Fud@ietf.org
https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/fud

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