From nobody Mon Apr 4 11:36:45 2016 Return-Path: X-Original-To: hrpc@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: hrpc@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id D000412D0A8 for ; Mon, 4 Apr 2016 11:36:44 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.12 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.12 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, SPF_NEUTRAL=0.779, WEIRD_PORT=0.001] autolearn=no autolearn_force=no Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id ZaZNz9yP-5j4 for ; Mon, 4 Apr 2016 11:36:43 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail.article19.io (vps784.greenhost.nl [213.108.108.114]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher AECDH-AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 9D3E312D61E for ; Mon, 4 Apr 2016 11:29:22 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail.article19.io (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.article19.io (Postfix) with ESMTPS id DD374C01850 for ; Mon, 4 Apr 2016 18:29:20 +0000 (UTC) Received: from mail.article19.io (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.article19.io (Postfix) with ESMTPS id CEA9C3FBFF4 for ; Mon, 4 Apr 2016 18:29:20 +0000 (UTC) Received: from [31.133.178.111] (dhcp-b26f.meeting.ietf.org [31.133.178.111]) by mail.article19.io (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id F11FC310F9D for ; Mon, 4 Apr 2016 18:29:19 +0000 (UTC) From: Niels ten Oever X-Enigmail-Draft-Status: N1110 To: "hrpc@irtf.org" Message-ID: <5702B27C.1060206@article19.org> Date: Mon, 4 Apr 2016 20:29:16 +0200 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; Linux x86_64; rv:38.0) Gecko/20100101 Icedove/38.7.0 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/signed; micalg=pgp-sha256; protocol="application/pgp-signature"; boundary="2IOxwP3fPTQhOaiKvoHphR9UfNJ84iAAo" Archived-At: Subject: [hrpc] Reminder HRPC RG meeting today X-BeenThere: hrpc@irtf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.17 Precedence: list List-Id: "niels@article19.org" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 04 Apr 2016 18:36:45 -0000 This is an OpenPGP/MIME signed message (RFC 4880 and 3156) --2IOxwP3fPTQhOaiKvoHphR9UfNJ84iAAo Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable at 17:40 Buenos Aires time: https://www.timeanddate.com/worldclock/fixedtime.html?msg=3DHuman+Rights+= Protocol+Considerations+Reseach+Group+at+IRTF&iso=3D20160404T1740&p1=3D51= &ah=3D2 Agenda https://tools.ietf.org/agenda/95/agenda-95-hrpc.html Meetecho http://www.meetecho.com/ietf95/hrpc Jabber xmpp:hrpc@jabber.ietf.org?join Minutes and notes http://etherpad.tools.ietf.org:9000/p/notes-ietf-95-hrpc Audio stream http://ietf95streaming.dnsalias.net/ietf/ietf951.m3u Slides https://www.ietf.org/proceedings/95/slides/slides-95-hrpc-0.pdf Intro website https://hrpc.io Mailinglist https://www.irtf.org/mailman/listinfo/hrpc Github https://github.com/nllz/IRTF-HRPC --=20 Niels ten Oever Head of Digital Article 19 www.article19.org PGP fingerprint 8D9F C567 BEE4 A431 56C4 678B 08B5 A0F2 636D 68E9 --2IOxwP3fPTQhOaiKvoHphR9UfNJ84iAAo Content-Type: application/pgp-signature; name="signature.asc" Content-Description: OpenPGP digital signature Content-Disposition: attachment; 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Mon, 4 Apr 2016 12:52:08 -0700 (PDT) Received: from smtprelay.hostedemail.com (smtprelay0240.hostedemail.com [216.40.44.240]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher AECDH-AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 61FC612D852 for ; Mon, 4 Apr 2016 12:52:08 -0700 (PDT) Received: from filter.hostedemail.com (unknown [216.40.38.60]) by smtprelay08.hostedemail.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3F52929DD79 for ; Mon, 4 Apr 2016 19:52:07 +0000 (UTC) X-Session-Marker: 6176726940646F7269612E6F7267 X-Spam-Summary: 50, 0, 0, , d41d8cd98f00b204, avri@acm.org, :, RULES_HIT:41:355:379:599:854:967:973:988:989:1042:1187:1260:1261:1277:1311:1313:1314:1345:1359:1381:1437:1515:1516:1518:1534:1541:1593:1594:1683:1711:1730:1747:1777:1792:2198:2199:2393:2525:2560:2563:2682:2685:2859:2890:2891:2897:2902:2933:2937:2939:2942:2945:2947:2951:2954:3022:3138:3139:3140:3141:3142:3354:3865:3866:3867:3868:3870:3871:3872:3874:3934:3936:3938:3941:3944:3947:3950:3953:3956:3959:4042:4184:4250:5007:6117:6119:7652:7875:7903:8985:9025:10004:10226:10234:10400:10848:11232:11658:11914:12043:12109:12114:12517:12519:12663:13069:13071:13161:13229:13311:13357:14096:14097:14180:14181:14721:21060:21080:21212:21366:30001:30022:30054, 0, RBL:none, CacheIP:none, Bayesian:0.5, 0.5, 0.5, Netcheck:none, DomainCache:0, MSF:not bulk, SPF:fp, MSBL:0, DNSBL:none, Custom_rules:0:0:0, LFtime:2, LUA_SUMMARY:none X-HE-Tag: dolls89_4c94b98e78d59 X-Filterd-Recvd-Size: 2720 Received: from [127.0.0.1] (dhcp-9be8.meeting.ietf.org [31.133.155.232]) (Authenticated sender: avri@doria.org) by omf01.hostedemail.com (Postfix) with ESMTPA for ; Mon, 4 Apr 2016 19:52:06 +0000 (UTC) References: <20160317131136.17432.10088.idtracker@ietfa.amsl.com> <56EAAE6D.2000404@article19.org> To: hrpc@irtf.org From: avri doria Message-ID: <5702C5E1.5040602@acm.org> Date: Mon, 4 Apr 2016 16:52:01 -0300 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows NT 6.3; WOW64; rv:38.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/38.6.0 MIME-Version: 1.0 In-Reply-To: <56EAAE6D.2000404@article19.org> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=windows-1252 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Antivirus: avast! (VPS 160404-0, 04/04/2016), Outbound message X-Antivirus-Status: Clean Archived-At: Subject: Re: [hrpc] New Version Notification for draft-tenoever-hrpc-research-00.txt X-BeenThere: hrpc@irtf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.17 Precedence: list Reply-To: avri@acm.org List-Id: "niels@article19.org" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 04 Apr 2016 19:52:10 -0000 Hi, I did a read through but have not had a chance to write up the comments in a legible manner. These are some general comments - the discussion centers around general behaviors and there is very little discussion of protocol element. - Many of the effects seem more related to IP issues (e.g. visible SRC & DST) than to elements of the specific protocol itself. In a sense they seem to be larger architectural issues (also a part of the RG's work) as opposed to protocol issues. But they are not broken out that way. Might be worth differentiating between the architectural issues and the protocol issues. - Much on the comment of the protocols is more about how people can misuse the protocols and not abut protocol elements that enable bad or good behavior. - also, so much of the discussion seems to circle around implementation and not the protocols themselves. - I think the discussion needs to take some of the work that is going into protecting these protocols into account (e.g. HTTP -> HTTPS). The draft did this for P2P but not for many of other discussions. - much of the discussion focuses on privacy elements, which are already covered and not on other aspects of FoE and FoA. Ie. something is a problem because the lack of privacy affects the FoE or FoA. This is good point, but is it specific to the protocols? - I think the consideration questions at the end are good questions, but I am not sure I see how they all come from the issues discussion in many cases. Might be good to link questions to specifics discussed earlier in the draft. Sorry to be so last minute and somewhat less than fully coherent about these. avri --- This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software. https://www.avast.com/antivirus From nobody Fri Apr 8 06:40:31 2016 Return-Path: X-Original-To: hrpc@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: hrpc@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 33ABA12D14B for ; Fri, 8 Apr 2016 06:40:29 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.121 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.121 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, SPF_NEUTRAL=0.779] autolearn=no autolearn_force=no Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id OQIljpw4MGtH for ; Fri, 8 Apr 2016 06:40:26 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail.article19.io (vps784.greenhost.nl [213.108.108.114]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher AECDH-AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id AA2EC12D0FF for ; Fri, 8 Apr 2016 06:40:26 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail.article19.io (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.article19.io (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 098322DB6E9 for ; Fri, 8 Apr 2016 13:40:25 +0000 (UTC) Received: from mail.article19.io (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.article19.io (Postfix) with ESMTPS id EE6FD37363D for ; Fri, 8 Apr 2016 13:40:24 +0000 (UTC) Received: from [31.133.177.224] (dhcp-b1e0.meeting.ietf.org [31.133.177.224]) by mail.article19.io (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 5C7FE373627 for ; Fri, 8 Apr 2016 13:40:24 +0000 (UTC) References: To: "hrpc@irtf.org" From: Niels ten Oever X-Forwarded-Message-Id: Message-ID: <5707B4C3.60205@article19.org> Date: Fri, 8 Apr 2016 15:40:19 +0200 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; Linux x86_64; rv:38.0) Gecko/20100101 Icedove/38.7.0 MIME-Version: 1.0 In-Reply-To: Content-Type: multipart/signed; micalg=pgp-sha256; protocol="application/pgp-signature"; boundary="jIa6b72bqDpkSr6Olc9kBFKNciPq6QW5v" Archived-At: Subject: [hrpc] CFP: ACM, IRTF & ISOC Applied Networking Research Workshop 2016 X-BeenThere: hrpc@irtf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.17 Precedence: list List-Id: "niels@article19.org" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 08 Apr 2016 13:40:30 -0000 This is an OpenPGP/MIME signed message (RFC 4880 and 3156) --jIa6b72bqDpkSr6Olc9kBFKNciPq6QW5v Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable ACM, IRTF & ISOC Applied Networking Research Workshop 2016 Berlin, Germany Saturday, July 16, 2016 https://irtf.org/anrw/2016/ *** CALL FOR PAPERS *** The inaugural ACM, IRTF & ISOC Applied Networking Research Workshop 2016 (ANRW=E2=80=9916) is an academic workshop that provides a forum for researchers, vendors, network operators, and the Internet standards community to present and discuss emerging results in applied networking research. It is sponsored by ACM SIGCOMM, the Internet Research Task Force (IRTF) and the Internet Society (ISOC). Researchers should consider submitting early/emerging results that illustrate the scientific and engineering principles underlying the Internet architecture, protocols and applications; that demonstrate new capabilities, features, or extensions to the Internet protocol layers; that enhance our understanding of how Internet protocols work in real-world deployments or realistic test-beds; or that improve Internet security and privacy, scalability, performance, and robustness. The ANRW=E2=80=9916 particularly encourages the submission of results tha= t could form the basis for future engineering work in the IETF, that could change operational Internet practices, that can help better specify Internet protocols, or that could influence further research and experimentation in the IRTF. *** TOPICS OF INTEREST *** Topics of interest include, but are not limited to, applied work in the following areas: * Evolution of the Internet architecture and deployment of new Internetworking paradigms * Naming, addressing, and routing for the future Internet * Development and deployment of new and improved transport protocols * Congestion control for heterogeneous networks and novel applications * Improvements to the security and privacy of Internet protocols * Studies that characterize Internet security, privacy or censorship * Measuring and understanding the behaviour and transparency of the Internet * Internetworking and semantic interoperability for resource-constrained devices * New approaches to network management, operations, and control * Better ways of specifying protocols, including usable techniques for protocol verification * Enabling global access to the Internet * Improving the energy efficiency of the Internet * Protocols and APIs for new Internet applications * New approaches to decentralized mobility management * Application of network programmability to the Internet *** SUBMISSION TYPES *** The ANRW accepts two types of submissions: full papers and short papers. * Full papers Full paper submissions should be complete academic papers on the topics above and may contain up to six pages of technical content, including figures, tables, any appendices, etc., optionally followed by a single additional page for references and acknowledgements only. Accepted full papers will be presented and discussed in depth at the workshop, and will be published in the ACM Digital Library. * Short papers Short paper submissions are suitable for short position papers, for starting a discussion on new technical ideas, to present very early results, or to present other topics of interest to the community (software and tools, research initiatives or collaborative projects, major new funding vessels, etc.). They may contain up to two pages of content including figures, tables, any appendices, etc., optionally followed by a single additional page for references and acknowledgements only. Accepted short papers will be briefly presented during the workshop, and will be published in the ACM Digital Library. Authors of accepted short papers may also bring a poster presenting its content to the workshop, for display and more in-depth discussion with interested participants during the breaks. *** IMPORTANT DATES *** Submission deadline: May 16, 2016 Notification deadline: June 17, 2016 Camera-ready deadline: June 24, 2016 *** ORGANISING COMMITTEE *** Programme chairs: * Lars Eggert (NetApp) * Colin Perkins (University of Glasgow) Technical Programme Committee: * Aaron Falk (Akamai) * Gorry Fairhurst (University of Aberdeen) * Stephen Farrell (Trinity College Dublin) * Jana Iyengar (Google) * Dirk Kutscher (NEC Laboratories Europe) * Mirja K=C3=BChlewind (ETH Z=C3=BCrich) * Al Morton (AT&T) * J=C3=B6rg Ott (Technische Universit=C3=A4t M=C3=BCnchen) * Arjuna Sathiaseelan (University of Cambridge) * Brian Trammell (ETH Z=C3=BCrich) * Lixia Zhang (UCLA) -+- --jIa6b72bqDpkSr6Olc9kBFKNciPq6QW5v Content-Type: application/pgp-signature; name="signature.asc" Content-Description: OpenPGP digital signature Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="signature.asc" -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v2 iQEcBAEBCAAGBQJXB7TDAAoJEAi1oPJjbWjpZjMH/A+imE4Y2tp6c9MjG/lhu+t4 Yz7fSHD/UTKzc5j6zrmPbO73tB4RbY2QvgV26F//csIEbkPIfomn7CHibrNULgVS PSSz4ws/MdzF3n0VxSlUqIdQK1WwpWie5SP80XLx4ampuItTu0XS3eU8XbZFxrNR ZzxykvpykmLjrq6sHByH2Tz/b4xknGmJLPPVCRjNKao/53+82YhCr+zji6b0vC7i RMAKasmKabZP+OPQ+9oZh9KjNnkkDgW2qw9YJPjlheWRfvvfgomxiWdp0ZB76Xm/ 93hnv/0ohwG0ELDMa6ae3g3QHR7zifFmnfH/m6tbZl+KK4CzXmyCbwuOWiBSEv8= =1vmh -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --jIa6b72bqDpkSr6Olc9kBFKNciPq6QW5v-- From nobody Mon Apr 11 07:18:30 2016 Return-Path: X-Original-To: hrpc@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: hrpc@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id A9F2812EF35 for ; Mon, 11 Apr 2016 07:18:24 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -4.2 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-4.2 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-2.3] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 6BgaEN-EThCh for ; Mon, 11 Apr 2016 07:18:20 -0700 (PDT) Received: from iramx2.ira.uni-karlsruhe.de (iramx2.ira.uni-karlsruhe.de [141.3.10.81]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 94F9E12EF24 for ; Mon, 11 Apr 2016 07:18:19 -0700 (PDT) Received: from i72vorta.tm.uni-karlsruhe.de ([141.3.71.26] helo=i72vorta.tm.kit.edu) by iramx2.ira.uni-karlsruhe.de with esmtp port 25 iface 141.3.10.81 id 1apcfQ-0008Qt-KV for ; Mon, 11 Apr 2016 16:18:16 +0200 Received: from [IPv6:::1] (ip6-localhost [IPv6:::1]) by i72vorta.tm.kit.edu (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 82234B0004E for ; Mon, 11 Apr 2016 16:18:16 +0200 (CEST) To: hrpc@irtf.org From: "Bless, Roland (TM)" X-Enigmail-Draft-Status: N1110 Organization: Institute of Telematics, Karlsruhe Institute of Technology Message-ID: <570BB228.9090806@kit.edu> Date: Mon, 11 Apr 2016 16:18:16 +0200 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; Linux x86_64; rv:38.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/38.6.0 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-ATIS-AV: ClamAV (iramx2.ira.uni-karlsruhe.de) X-ATIS-Timestamp: iramx2.ira.uni-karlsruhe.de 1460384296. Archived-At: Subject: [hrpc] CFP: Workshop on Value-sensitive Design of Internet-based Services: Towards an Integration of Technology and Values X-BeenThere: hrpc@irtf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.17 Precedence: list List-Id: "niels@article19.org" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 11 Apr 2016 14:18:26 -0000 Hi, this might be of interest for the community here. Call for Papers --------------- Workshop on Value-sensitive Design of Internet-based Services: Towards an Integration of Technology and Values 29. September 2016, Klagenfurt, Austria Internet-based services are increasingly important for our society. We consume them on a daily basis for many different purposes, comprising chat applications, social networks, shopping and the like. With the Internet of Things and advanced applications such as smart cities and smart home we are expecting huge potentials for a more sustainable society at large, covering the economical, ecological and the social dimension. However, the provisioning of Internet-based services currently comes with conflicting interests between the different stakeholder groups of providers, consumers and governance actors. A prominent example of such a conflict is using consumer data as the “currency” for the consumption of Internet-based services, e.g. delivered via mobile Apps. Resulting conflicts between consumers and providers occur on a continuous basis, as personal data is delivered to the provider and, thus, compromises the privacy of the consumer. However, mostly the consumer is left without any choice and, in this sense self-determination of the individual consumer is limited. Governance actors have a different view which is heavily motivated through societal values, such as human rights and constitutional law or regulations and policy instruments. They can also help finding a balance in the case of interest conflicts between providers and consumers. The workshop follows an interdisciplinary approach and specifically focuses on research dealing with the different interests among stakeholders in the context of designing and delivering Internet-based services Topics of interest: - Transparency of Internet-based services - Internet of People - Business / economic value orientation in Internet-based services - Privacy in a future Internet-based world - Quality of experience - Business Models of Internet-based services - Customer-Co-Design - Identity management and access control - Responsible innovation - Value-sensitive design - User interaction with Internet-based services - Values in network architectures and protocols - Net neutrality - Liability (legal) issues Important Dates: Submission deadline (German or English): 6. May 2016 Notification of acceptance: 30. May 2016 Submission of final paper: 28. June 2016 Workshop Organizers: Hannes Hartenstein, Karlsruhe Institute of Technology (KIT) Alexander Maedche, Karlsruhe Institute of Technology (KIT) Martina Zitterbart, Karlsruhe Institute of Technology (KIT) Program Committee: Michael Beigl, KIT Roland Bless, KIT Jan vom Brocke, Universität Lichtenstein Peter Buxmann, TU Darmstadt Jan Marco Leimeister, Universität Kassel und Universität St. Gallen Martin Gaedke, TU Chemnitz Kurt Geihs, Universität Kassel Tobias Hossfeld, Universität Duisburg-Essen Frank Pallas, TU Berlin Oliver Raabe, KIT Peter Reichl, Universität Wien Burkhard Stiller, Universität Zürich Thorsten Strufe, TU Dresden Author Guidelines: The proceedings will be published at Lecture Notes in Informatics (LNI). The general guidelines can be found at: https://www.gi.de/index.php?id=171 . We accept the following types of submissions: Technical paper: max. 12 pages Short paper: max. 4 pages Please note that we will only accept submissions with at least one author being registered for INFORMATIK 2016 by June, 28 2016! This is a general policy for INFORMATIK 2016. Please submit your paper as pdf-file to zitterbart@kit.edu You can find information about the workshop at http://www.informatik2016.de/1186.html and at http://telematics.tm.kit.edu/ValueSensitiveDesign.php From nobody Mon Apr 11 19:32:48 2016 Return-Path: X-Original-To: hrpc@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: hrpc@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9939812DE2B for ; Mon, 11 Apr 2016 19:32:47 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.121 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.121 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, SPF_NEUTRAL=0.779] autolearn=no autolearn_force=no Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id zGgZ2U_z919T for ; Mon, 11 Apr 2016 19:32:45 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail.article19.io (vps784.greenhost.nl [213.108.108.114]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher AECDH-AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 7CAD112DE0B for ; Mon, 11 Apr 2016 19:32:45 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail.article19.io (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.article19.io (Postfix) with ESMTPS id B3FCC373621 for ; Tue, 12 Apr 2016 02:32:43 +0000 (UTC) Received: from mail.article19.io (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.article19.io (Postfix) with ESMTPS id A31AA373620 for ; Tue, 12 Apr 2016 02:32:43 +0000 (UTC) Received: from [192.168.1.71] (sd5112335.adsl.online.nl [213.17.35.53]) by mail.article19.io (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 96661C002D for ; Tue, 12 Apr 2016 02:32:43 +0000 (UTC) To: hrpc@irtf.org References: <20160317131136.17432.10088.idtracker@ietfa.amsl.com> <56EAAE6D.2000404@article19.org> <5702C5E1.5040602@acm.org> From: Niels ten Oever Message-ID: <570C5E4B.7060009@article19.org> Date: Tue, 12 Apr 2016 04:32:43 +0200 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; Linux x86_64; rv:38.0) Gecko/20100101 Icedove/38.7.0 MIME-Version: 1.0 In-Reply-To: <5702C5E1.5040602@acm.org> Content-Type: multipart/signed; micalg=pgp-sha256; protocol="application/pgp-signature"; boundary="KRJrtkKSh9poH9vtN3CCfVr5j4egtqTBW" Archived-At: Subject: Re: [hrpc] New Version Notification for draft-tenoever-hrpc-research-00.txt X-BeenThere: hrpc@irtf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.17 Precedence: list List-Id: "niels@article19.org" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 12 Apr 2016 02:32:47 -0000 This is an OpenPGP/MIME signed message (RFC 4880 and 3156) --KRJrtkKSh9poH9vtN3CCfVr5j4egtqTBW Content-Type: text/plain; charset=windows-1252 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Thanks a lot for this Avri, very good points. Corinne and I will do a complete review on the draft based on these comments and address them point by point. This might also be a good point for others who have structural or less structural problems with the draft [0] to let us know so we can address a lot of comments at once. We aim to have a revised version in three to four weeks. Cheers, Niels [0] https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-tenoever-hrpc-research-00 Niels ten Oever Head of Digital Article 19 www.article19.org PGP fingerprint 8D9F C567 BEE4 A431 56C4 678B 08B5 A0F2 636D 68E9 On 04/04/2016 09:52 PM, avri doria wrote: > Hi, >=20 > I did a read through but have not had a chance to write up the comments= > in a legible manner. >=20 > These are some general comments >=20 > - the discussion centers around general behaviors and there is very > little discussion of protocol element. >=20 > - Many of the effects seem more related to IP issues (e.g. visible SRC = & > DST) than to elements of the specific protocol itself. In a sense they= > seem to be larger architectural issues (also a part of the RG's work) a= s > opposed to protocol issues. But they are not broken out that way.=20 > Might be worth differentiating between the architectural issues and the= > protocol issues. >=20 > - Much on the comment of the protocols is more about how people can > misuse the protocols and not abut protocol elements that enable bad or > good behavior.=20 >=20 > - also, so much of the discussion seems to circle around implementation= > and not the protocols themselves. >=20 > - I think the discussion needs to take some of the work that is going > into protecting these protocols into account (e.g. HTTP -> HTTPS). The > draft did this for P2P but not for many of other discussions. >=20 > - much of the discussion focuses on privacy elements, which are already= > covered and not on other aspects of FoE and FoA. Ie. something is a > problem because the lack of privacy affects the FoE or FoA. This is=20 > good point, but is it specific to the protocols?=20 >=20 > - I think the consideration questions at the end are good questions, bu= t > I am not sure I see how they all come from the issues discussion in man= y > cases. Might be good to link questions to specifics discussed earlier > in the draft. >=20 > Sorry to be so last minute and somewhat less than fully coherent about > these. >=20 > avri >=20 > --- > This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software. > https://www.avast.com/antivirus >=20 > _______________________________________________ > hrpc mailing list > hrpc@irtf.org > https://www.irtf.org/mailman/listinfo/hrpc >=20 --KRJrtkKSh9poH9vtN3CCfVr5j4egtqTBW Content-Type: application/pgp-signature; name="signature.asc" Content-Description: OpenPGP digital signature Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="signature.asc" -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v2 iQEcBAEBCAAGBQJXDF5LAAoJEAi1oPJjbWjpx60H/1XMeFPolhqlK8/4Edgwyz0h 8gzWeOqTRKO4iYhkxubmAOye7YNSshX6tEBD1GgFRnhMYAiwSJtI10+TBXNHqJTa SACKMXSald7vPdLZqfir5bgMpnbxsrLL8JDBSgsGdM3YVdc5eWMBMv8BkQwQPNZU LKcH/Z8LpawcgnlklgtfkauK6Em6mEbKOcauFxBVcSpvLkA4HPoYR1sl4w4pdx8D CbvvucZUKEuZeDXqzFcUlwhXmLxMOJ0pMuMLLktA6j2lC5aMb4oh1TqbCvyNJN3i 4CuNWy3VQl4OyC7Zgovy2yJORqpBWtPKopMkIL0KjbNqTXstAXQAuJ16U+rimR0= =T6Ow -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --KRJrtkKSh9poH9vtN3CCfVr5j4egtqTBW-- From nobody Mon Apr 18 06:20:15 2016 Return-Path: X-Original-To: hrpc@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: hrpc@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8551D12D5B6 for ; Mon, 18 Apr 2016 06:20:13 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.698 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.698 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW=-0.7, SPF_PASS=-0.001, WEIRD_PORT=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=gmail.com Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id jjinIoRxtI8P for ; Mon, 18 Apr 2016 06:20:12 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail-wm0-x232.google.com (mail-wm0-x232.google.com [IPv6:2a00:1450:400c:c09::232]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id ADFC312D567 for ; Mon, 18 Apr 2016 06:20:11 -0700 (PDT) Received: by mail-wm0-x232.google.com with SMTP id u206so123787925wme.1 for ; Mon, 18 Apr 2016 06:20:11 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20120113; h=mime-version:in-reply-to:references:date:message-id:subject:from:to :cc; bh=0QRBihVuZS01x7FoDZpPd4oDEs7OyD0yQuzzM0agm/c=; b=J8xz9N71hS6rxvmKTWonRrZewlDglste89xeTz2D8CgtTb2fwJzNY3is20OEMA4p4n oPKf1OzcSDnKhZv13yyWUVfriYQiAEtf1KqL4gHjR/Ka/GQtnCNVLXJhSm+PYHY+JW7g eGhaVksE6gEnQVLeOcHkQOQZjLgMFscMB1PgL4oD3D3LBwZE16saUDZvw+ujegL0pkrU OaBRJ8RKSV/WW2NmIP1KWddeRcc+oToVS1dE3PF+Re+VNwmOFWurVuZ1aZQrQQg59KrJ HXOjQolSbYOWDtHViSesWF1guMWd60NP1tnNJroZpdB2Dnw0jGfpGiBm5BczEoSaJD+Z XJcA== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20130820; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:in-reply-to:references:date :message-id:subject:from:to:cc; bh=0QRBihVuZS01x7FoDZpPd4oDEs7OyD0yQuzzM0agm/c=; b=BAajg9RTItiwJTy4oL5qSwqxrtp2NCMfRrplZl3dBWhRfOtcX//N/QAj6RkzWBiZni JhgBrUChiXlWPFwneHOFlq1bTrrgJXp/u5k/WCLJeymMs1dVh1uisqnyXn3pJVo8sn87 0QSQtgz1xOPjyBNa+f9Z32Cbe2DbvcGTas9yx6YA6D4imY8bm3FiGpCPc73KUSBVsaQZ ArjcPIDii7Q4FjaM+90KyR9eYg4i1UwKv0ckN/tsEohdOc+s0H58a+G6lq3163vzv/4R pI9uSUn+PpqYJuDBFVdTIvahk+5ZpCJOtV2RHVlwLRtQmGf5VI2bnyWIze2btWmK1bIY dEzQ== X-Gm-Message-State: AOPr4FVHMuarA6xcaphzlHM9gnBMcyKwOqmWGgZAnJvtJ11J27aofsiO3Zgf7SUUmm9Ex5VhFbG3GoQOS69cYQ== MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Received: by 10.194.61.19 with SMTP id l19mr3723346wjr.4.1460985610141; Mon, 18 Apr 2016 06:20:10 -0700 (PDT) Received: by 10.194.190.71 with HTTP; Mon, 18 Apr 2016 06:20:10 -0700 (PDT) In-Reply-To: <5702B27C.1060206@article19.org> References: <5702B27C.1060206@article19.org> Date: Mon, 18 Apr 2016 14:20:10 +0100 Message-ID: From: Corinne Cath To: Niels ten Oever Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary=047d7ba97bfe508e4d0530c238e3 Archived-At: Cc: "hrpc@irtf.org" Subject: Re: [hrpc] Reminder HRPC RG meeting today X-BeenThere: hrpc@irtf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.17 Precedence: list List-Id: "niels@article19.org" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 18 Apr 2016 13:20:13 -0000 --047d7ba97bfe508e4d0530c238e3 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 Dear all, We hope you have all recovered from what was an exciting IETF95 meeting in Buenos Aires. We were very happy with all the comments and edits to our drafts that we received. Over the next weeks we will be working through them and presenting you with an updated doc. In the meantime - here is the latest blog post about the IETF95 meeting: https://hrpc.io/ietf-95-meets-in-buenos-aires-a-week-of-firsts/ Best, Corinne On Mon, Apr 4, 2016 at 7:29 PM, Niels ten Oever wrote: > at 17:40 Buenos Aires time: > > https://www.timeanddate.com/worldclock/fixedtime.html?msg=Human+Rights+Protocol+Considerations+Reseach+Group+at+IRTF&iso=20160404T1740&p1=51&ah=2 > > Agenda > https://tools.ietf.org/agenda/95/agenda-95-hrpc.html > > Meetecho > http://www.meetecho.com/ietf95/hrpc > > Jabber > xmpp:hrpc@jabber.ietf.org?join > > Minutes and notes > http://etherpad.tools.ietf.org:9000/p/notes-ietf-95-hrpc > > Audio stream > http://ietf95streaming.dnsalias.net/ietf/ietf951.m3u > > Slides > https://www.ietf.org/proceedings/95/slides/slides-95-hrpc-0.pdf > > Intro website > https://hrpc.io > > Mailinglist > https://www.irtf.org/mailman/listinfo/hrpc > > Github > https://github.com/nllz/IRTF-HRPC > > -- > Niels ten Oever > Head of Digital > > Article 19 > www.article19.org > > PGP fingerprint 8D9F C567 BEE4 A431 56C4 > 678B 08B5 A0F2 636D 68E9 > > > _______________________________________________ > hrpc mailing list > hrpc@irtf.org > https://www.irtf.org/mailman/listinfo/hrpc > > -- 'The management of normality is hard work' --047d7ba97bfe508e4d0530c238e3 Content-Type: text/html; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Dear all,

We hope you have all recovered from what was an excitin= g IETF95 meeting in Buenos Aires.

We were very happy with all the commen= ts and edits to our drafts that we received.

Over the next weeks we will= be working through them and presenting you with an updated doc.

In the = meantime - here is the latest blog post about the IETF95 meeting:

h= ttps://hrpc.io/ietf-95-meets-in-buenos-aires-a-week-of-firsts/

<= /div>
Best,=

Corinne

On Mon, Apr 4, 2016 at 7:29 PM, Niels ten Oever <niels@artic= le19.org> wrote:
at 17:40= Buenos Aires time:
https://ww= w.timeanddate.com/worldclock/fixedtime.html?msg=3DHuman+Rights+Protocol+Con= siderations+Reseach+Group+at+IRTF&iso=3D20160404T1740&p1=3D51&a= h=3D2

Agenda
https://tools.ietf.org/agenda/95/agenda-95-hrpc.= html

Meetecho
http://www.meetecho.com/ietf95/hrpc

Jabber
xmpp:hrpc@jabber.ietf.org?join

Minutes and notes
http://etherpad.tools.ietf.org:9000/p/notes-= ietf-95-hrpc

Audio stream
http://ietf95streaming.dnsalias.net/ietf/ietf951= .m3u

Slides
https://www.ietf.org/proceedings/95/s= lides/slides-95-hrpc-0.pdf

Intro website
https://hr= pc.io

Mailinglist
https://www.irtf.org/mailman/listinfo/hrpc

Github
https://github.com/nllz/IRTF-HRPC

--
Niels ten Oever
Head of Digital

Article 19
w= ww.article19.org

PGP fingerprint=C2=A0 =C2=A0 8D9F C567 BEE4 A431 56C4
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0678B 0= 8B5 A0F2 636D 68E9


_______________________________________________
hrpc mailing list
hrpc@irtf.org
https://www.irtf.org/mailman/listinfo/hrpc




--


'The management of normality is hard work'
<= br>
--047d7ba97bfe508e4d0530c238e3-- From nobody Thu Apr 21 01:46:21 2016 Return-Path: X-Original-To: hrpc@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: hrpc@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4F45112D911 for ; Thu, 21 Apr 2016 01:46:20 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.522 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.522 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, FUZZY_CREDIT=1.678, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-2.3] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id OczsWma8LVNO for ; Thu, 21 Apr 2016 01:46:14 -0700 (PDT) Received: from iramx2.ira.uni-karlsruhe.de (iramx2.ira.uni-karlsruhe.de [141.3.10.81]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 95B9512D85B for ; Thu, 21 Apr 2016 01:46:13 -0700 (PDT) Received: from i72vorta.tm.uni-karlsruhe.de ([141.3.71.26] helo=i72vorta.tm.kit.edu) by iramx2.ira.uni-karlsruhe.de with esmtp port 25 iface 141.3.10.81 id 1atAFU-00073K-5g; Thu, 21 Apr 2016 10:46:08 +0200 Received: from [IPv6:::1] (ip6-localhost [IPv6:::1]) by i72vorta.tm.kit.edu (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 1974FB00259; Thu, 21 Apr 2016 10:46:08 +0200 (CEST) To: Corinne Cath , Niels ten Oever References: <5702B27C.1060206@article19.org> From: "Bless, Roland (TM)" X-Enigmail-Draft-Status: N1110 Organization: Institute of Telematics, Karlsruhe Institute of Technology Message-ID: <57189350.1090909@kit.edu> Date: Thu, 21 Apr 2016 10:46:08 +0200 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; Linux x86_64; rv:38.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/38.6.0 MIME-Version: 1.0 In-Reply-To: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=windows-1252 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-ATIS-AV: ClamAV (iramx2.ira.uni-karlsruhe.de) X-ATIS-Timestamp: iramx2.ira.uni-karlsruhe.de 1461228368. Archived-At: Cc: "hrpc@irtf.org" , "Orwat, Carsten \(ITAS\)" Subject: Re: [hrpc] Reminder HRPC RG meeting today X-BeenThere: hrpc@irtf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.17 Precedence: list List-Id: "niels@article19.org" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 21 Apr 2016 08:46:20 -0000 Hi Corinne and all, Am 18.04.2016 um 15:20 schrieb Corinne Cath: > We hope you have all recovered from what was an exciting IETF95 meeting > in Buenos Aires. > > We were very happy with all the comments and edits to our drafts that we > received. > > Over the next weeks we will be working through them and presenting you > with an updated doc. As I have already commented at the mic, I'll try to send you further comments after reviewing the whole document. Right now I'll limit my comments to what I mentioned in the meeting: the way the current text in draft-tenoever-hrpc-research-00 is written one gets the impression that we have a counterposition to the hrpc approach, which isn't true. "Our position is that hard-coding human rights into protocols in addition to being undesirable is also impossible, because each situation is dependent on its context. It is however important to make consicious design decisions that take into account the human rights protocol considerations guidelines developed below. This will ensure that the impact protocols can have on human rights is clear and explicit, both for developers and for users. In addition, it ensures that the impact of specific protocol on human rights is carefully considered and that concrete design decisions are documented in the protocol." Our main point was that one has to carefully analyze impact of protocol design choices on human rights (and possibly other values) (*). So IMHO we have got a similar approach starting with the second cited sentence. For the first statement: "hard-coding human rights into protocols in addition to being undesirable is also impossible, because each situation is dependent on its context." I expressed my concerns with this statement in the meeting: in general, protocols may always affect human rights or derived values to some extent. So even if one tries to not explicitly "hard-code" (or enforce) human rights into protocols, design choices may implicitly have an impact on them. Excluding "hard-coding" human rights into protocols (or saying it is generally undesirable) is probably also not advisable. For example if you design protocols like APIP or Hornet to increase privacy and freedom of speech and assembly, is that already hard-coding human rights? Our main point was that one needs to carefully think about advantages and disadvantages of technical solutions with respect to their effects on human rights. Sometimes less technically embedded solutions are better in practice, because the system stays more flexible and avoids misbehavior in unforeseen contexts. But the IETF is currently working on improving privacy in protocols and IMHO this is desirable from a human rights perspective. However, one needs to be clear about other potential impacts of such approaches as well. Therefore, I think it will be part of the research if we come up later with an insight that one should actually refrain from explicitly embedding human rights into protocols, but right now such a conclusion is premature IMHO. Regards, Roland (*) I'll send a pointer to our ACM CCR editorial note on "Values and Networks Steps Toward Exploring their Relationships" as soon as it is available. From nobody Thu Apr 21 01:57:31 2016 Return-Path: X-Original-To: hrpc@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: hrpc@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4ADF112DBAB for ; Thu, 21 Apr 2016 01:57:30 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.021 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.021 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, FUZZY_CREDIT=1.678, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW=-0.7, SPF_PASS=-0.001] autolearn=no autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=gmail.com Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id HjFFCwRxxM4w for ; Thu, 21 Apr 2016 01:57:28 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail-wm0-x233.google.com (mail-wm0-x233.google.com [IPv6:2a00:1450:400c:c09::233]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id D5DCB12009C for ; Thu, 21 Apr 2016 01:50:01 -0700 (PDT) Received: by mail-wm0-x233.google.com with SMTP id e201so78275963wme.0 for ; Thu, 21 Apr 2016 01:50:01 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20120113; h=mime-version:in-reply-to:references:date:message-id:subject:from:to :cc; bh=I+/R1z7LHYpe/n+O+sToj0oyINzu+YEg68Ii9W2rIg4=; b=GPtsBo8vzJjsyjHPA4YMAtdEcinfh8TrkAKp577+qoE2WS6JR+wAHkrpyOO2ScewTh IMPn8roqGA90HBIxbm3l90MG5uxgLR0twaOUcEOhZM+HLSt9d/mLFBTnwUWJuW9qvsNl X+MfXsJ1Kic+5x4UBGkCPF6WPAXEe+fKc067lINRhSWwHaEe1WPkNFtjmv8BjmeZ41Pf 7WfujKd9W9JoU1sAC4KXdhDOzYtBxlaHzQz7fv3pTLNsYeiKQ9idYlh/YHvfO7st+cSP WUbCQltPJwO4PvxGUACNgULDbE2A6hTWrW++of735J/2nLdmZKS47KkEG6biJFGxLnn0 Z8Ow== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20130820; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:in-reply-to:references:date :message-id:subject:from:to:cc; bh=I+/R1z7LHYpe/n+O+sToj0oyINzu+YEg68Ii9W2rIg4=; b=JMRME1R6tXryvbs5WW2kwN2UFDl+PH4c5Nw/Ea1tLyhs7tnW2yCp1uRaQIuImoMA47 qRCmPFbA90LrujmJywgssS4HeY8ck338L1keoMljk/8lBx6Y+ifNAvdwhH11vh0nBlMD ygV5giFiHWdnzzUEL3W5SayLNe2JVPQ+7vmVviUe1phwXxTuhZhRmf/HFOXtQDqiwRhv x4hxFaMFg8uQKdWEmpcJrXdFzJ/hLYxJImk8sqiWyeDe0QeO0eRHIaFudSUcT3vsWt9A rZtsxMRW7F4fZEAeem3NiU9I6Z0oPzpSKQ5FYomj/zTZ4nJDdUeZPhwMjobw2d0O9kYH W5lw== X-Gm-Message-State: AOPr4FV1NeRiqfgH/0keQYDYx6Uw2tmW7MLSuAH8lZFNEyQSOsDPGU3F1hTO52dWKy0A8JxnYT1DDBS12F3jwA== MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Received: by 10.28.234.137 with SMTP id g9mr34418252wmi.78.1461228600208; Thu, 21 Apr 2016 01:50:00 -0700 (PDT) Received: by 10.194.190.71 with HTTP; Thu, 21 Apr 2016 01:50:00 -0700 (PDT) In-Reply-To: <57189350.1090909@kit.edu> References: <5702B27C.1060206@article19.org> <57189350.1090909@kit.edu> Date: Thu, 21 Apr 2016 09:50:00 +0100 Message-ID: From: Corinne Cath To: "Bless, Roland (TM)" Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary=001a114701baa6b5730530facbf0 Archived-At: Cc: Niels ten Oever , "hrpc@irtf.org" , "Orwat, Carsten \(ITAS\)" Subject: Re: [hrpc] Reminder HRPC RG meeting today X-BeenThere: hrpc@irtf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.17 Precedence: list List-Id: "niels@article19.org" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 21 Apr 2016 08:57:30 -0000 --001a114701baa6b5730530facbf0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Dear Roland, Thank you for this response! We are currently working on reviewing the draft and taking in the comments we received at IETF95 and on the list. I will make sure that the comments you made in this email will be accurately reflected in the new draft, and we look forward to any additional comments you might have on the draft as a whole. Best, Corinne On Thu, Apr 21, 2016 at 9:46 AM, Bless, Roland (TM) wrote: > Hi Corinne and all, > > Am 18.04.2016 um 15:20 schrieb Corinne Cath: > > We hope you have all recovered from what was an exciting IETF95 meeting > > in Buenos Aires. > > > > We were very happy with all the comments and edits to our drafts that w= e > > received. > > > > Over the next weeks we will be working through them and presenting you > > with an updated doc. > > As I have already commented at the mic, I'll try to send you further > comments after reviewing the whole document. Right now I'll > limit my comments to what I mentioned in the meeting: the way the > current text in draft-tenoever-hrpc-research-00 is written > one gets the impression that we have a counterposition to > the hrpc approach, which isn't true. > > "Our position is that hard-coding human > rights into protocols in addition to being undesirable is also > impossible, because each situation is dependent on its context. It > is however important to make consicious design decisions that take > into account the human rights protocol considerations guidelines > developed below. This will ensure that the impact protocols can have > on human rights is clear and explicit, both for developers and for > users. In addition, it ensures that the impact of specific protocol > on human rights is carefully considered and that concrete design > decisions are documented in the protocol." > > Our main point was that one has to carefully analyze impact of protocol > design choices on human rights (and possibly other values) (*). > So IMHO we have got a similar approach starting with the second cited > sentence. For the first statement: > "hard-coding human rights into protocols in addition to being > undesirable is also impossible, because each situation is dependent on > its context." > I expressed my concerns with this statement in the meeting: > in general, protocols may always affect human rights or derived values > to some extent. So even if one tries to not explicitly "hard-code" (or > enforce) human rights into protocols, design choices may implicitly > have an impact on them. > > Excluding "hard-coding" human rights into protocols (or saying it is > generally undesirable) is probably also not advisable. For example if > you design protocols like APIP or Hornet to increase privacy and freedom > of speech and assembly, is that already hard-coding human rights? Our > main point was that one needs to carefully think about advantages and > disadvantages of technical solutions with respect to their effects on > human rights. > Sometimes less technically embedded solutions are better in practice, > because the system stays more flexible and avoids misbehavior in > unforeseen contexts. But the IETF is currently working on improving > privacy in protocols and IMHO this is desirable from a human rights > perspective. However, one needs to be clear about other potential > impacts of such approaches as well. Therefore, I think it will be > part of the research if we come up later with an insight that > one should actually refrain from explicitly embedding human rights > into protocols, but right now such a conclusion is premature IMHO. > > Regards, > Roland > > (*) I'll send a pointer to our ACM CCR editorial note on "Values and > Networks =E2=80=93 Steps Toward Exploring their Relationships" as soon as= it is > available. > --=20 'The management of normality is hard work' --001a114701baa6b5730530facbf0 Content-Type: text/html; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Dear Roland,

Thank you for this response! We are currently workin= g on reviewing the draft and taking in the comments we received at IETF95 a= nd on the list.

I will make sure that the comments you made in this= email will be accurately reflected in the new draft, and we look forward t= o any additional comments you might have on the draft as a whole.

Best,<= br>
Corinne

On Thu, Apr 21, 2016 at 9:46 AM, Bless, Roland (TM) <roland.b= less@kit.edu> wrote:
Hi Cor= inne and all,

Am 18.04.2016 um 15:20 schrieb Corinne Cath:
> We hope you have all recovered from what was an exciting IETF95 meetin= g
> in Buenos Aires.
>
> We were very happy with all the comments and edits to our drafts that = we
> received.
>
> Over the next weeks we will be working through them and presenting you=
> with an updated doc.

As I have already commented at the mic, I'll try to send you fur= ther
comments after reviewing the whole document. Right now I'll
limit my comments to what I mentioned in the meeting: the way the
current text in draft-tenoever-hrpc-research-00 is written
one gets the impression that we have a counterposition to
the hrpc approach, which isn't true.

=C2=A0 "Our position is that hard-coding human
=C2=A0 =C2=A0rights into protocols in addition to being undesirable is also=
=C2=A0 =C2=A0impossible, because each situation is dependent on its context= .=C2=A0 It
=C2=A0 =C2=A0is however important to make consicious design decisions that = take
=C2=A0 =C2=A0into account the human rights protocol considerations guidelin= es
=C2=A0 =C2=A0developed below.=C2=A0 This will ensure that the impact protoc= ols can have
=C2=A0 =C2=A0on human rights is clear and explicit, both for developers and= for
=C2=A0 =C2=A0users.=C2=A0 In addition, it ensures that the impact of specif= ic protocol
=C2=A0 =C2=A0on human rights is carefully considered and that concrete desi= gn
=C2=A0 =C2=A0decisions are documented in the protocol."

Our main point was that one has to carefully analyze impact of protocol
design choices on human rights (and possibly other values) (*).
So IMHO we have got a similar approach starting with the second cited
sentence. For the first statement:
"hard-coding human rights into protocols in addition to being
undesirable is also impossible, because each situation is dependent on
its context."
I expressed my concerns with this statement in the meeting:
in general, protocols may always affect human rights or derived values
to some extent. So even if one tries to not explicitly "hard-code"= ; (or
enforce) human rights into protocols, design choices may implicitly
have an impact on them.

Excluding "hard-coding" human rights into protocols (or saying it= is
generally undesirable) is probably also not advisable. For example if
you design protocols like APIP or Hornet to increase privacy and freedom of speech and assembly, is that already hard-coding human rights? Our
main point was that one needs to carefully think about advantages and
disadvantages of technical solutions with respect to their effects on
human rights.
Sometimes less technically embedded solutions are better in practice,
because the system stays more flexible and avoids misbehavior in
unforeseen contexts. But the IETF is currently working on improving
privacy in protocols and IMHO this is desirable from a human rights
perspective. However, one needs to be clear about other potential
impacts of such approaches as well. Therefore, I think it will be
part of the research if we come up later with an insight that
one should actually refrain from explicitly embedding human rights
into protocols, but right now such a conclusion is premature IMHO.

Regards,
=C2=A0Roland

(*) I'll send a pointer to our ACM CCR editorial note on "Values a= nd
Networks =E2=80=93 Steps Toward Exploring their Relationships" as soon= as it is
available.



--


'The management of normality is hard work'

<= /div>
--001a114701baa6b5730530facbf0-- From nobody Mon Apr 25 04:23:44 2016 Return-Path: X-Original-To: hrpc@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: hrpc@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8704712D16A for ; Mon, 25 Apr 2016 04:23:43 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -4.2 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-4.2 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-2.3] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id E_m1MVvQmp8s for ; Mon, 25 Apr 2016 04:23:38 -0700 (PDT) Received: from iramx2.ira.uni-karlsruhe.de (iramx2.ira.uni-karlsruhe.de [141.3.10.81]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 740D412D10B for ; Mon, 25 Apr 2016 04:23:37 -0700 (PDT) Received: from i72vorta.tm.uni-karlsruhe.de ([141.3.71.26] helo=i72vorta.tm.kit.edu) by iramx2.ira.uni-karlsruhe.de with esmtp port 25 iface 141.3.10.81 id 1auec3-0008NI-25 for ; Mon, 25 Apr 2016 13:23:35 +0200 Received: from [IPv6:::1] (ip6-localhost [IPv6:::1]) by i72vorta.tm.kit.edu (Postfix) with ESMTPS id B0049B0050A for ; Mon, 25 Apr 2016 13:23:34 +0200 (CEST) To: "hrpc@irtf.org" From: "Bless, Roland (TM)" Organization: Institute of Telematics, Karlsruhe Institute of Technology Message-ID: <571DFE36.1090704@kit.edu> Date: Mon, 25 Apr 2016 13:23:34 +0200 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; Linux x86_64; rv:38.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/38.6.0 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-ATIS-AV: ClamAV (iramx2.ira.uni-karlsruhe.de) X-ATIS-Timestamp: iramx2.ira.uni-karlsruhe.de 1461583415. Archived-At: Subject: [hrpc] =?utf-8?q?Values_and_Networks_=E2=80=93_Steps_Toward_Explo?= =?utf-8?q?ring_their_Relationships?= X-BeenThere: hrpc@irtf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.17 Precedence: list List-Id: "niels@article19.org" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 25 Apr 2016 11:23:43 -0000 Hi, as already announced, here is the pointer to the above article (freely available): http://www.sigcomm.org/ccr/papers/2016/April/0000000.0000003 The editor wrote: > The second editorial, “Towards Considering Relationships between Values > and Networks” looks at the interactions between human rights and the > technology that we develop. It reminds us that when we decide to carry > out research on a given topic, our research results may have a broader > impact than simply a series of papers published in conference > proceedings, journals or online libraries. Some of our work can > influence, in one direction or another, the evolution of our society and > some of our design choices may have a huge impact in the long term. I > encourage you to read this editorial and then take some time to think > about your ongoing work and the impact that it could have on values such > as human rights. PDF: http://www.sigcomm.org/sites/default/files/ccr/papers/2016/April/0000000-0000003.pdf Feedback appreciated :-) Regards, Roland From nobody Tue Apr 26 01:15:52 2016 Return-Path: X-Original-To: hrpc@irtf.org Delivered-To: hrpc@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from ietfa.amsl.com (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id E9AF212D0FB; Tue, 26 Apr 2016 01:15:50 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: "\"IETF Meeting Session Request Tool\"" To: X-Test-IDTracker: no X-IETF-IDTracker: 6.19.0 Auto-Submitted: auto-generated Precedence: bulk Message-ID: <20160426081550.28995.99264.idtracker@ietfa.amsl.com> Date: Tue, 26 Apr 2016 01:15:50 -0700 Archived-At: Cc: hrpc-chairs@ietf.org, niels@article19.org, hrpc@irtf.org, irtf-chair@irtf.org Subject: [hrpc] hrpc - New Meeting Session Request for IETF 96 X-BeenThere: hrpc@irtf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.17 List-Id: "niels@article19.org" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 26 Apr 2016 08:15:51 -0000 A new meeting session request has just been submitted by Niels ten Oever, a Chair of the hrpc working group. --------------------------------------------------------- Working Group Name: Human Rights Protocol Considerations Area Name: IRTF Session Requester: Niels Oever Number of Sessions: 1 Length of Session(s): 2 Hours Number of Attendees: 90 Conflicts to Avoid: First Priority: irtfopen Second Priority: saag Third Priority: dprive Special Requests: --------------------------------------------------------- From nobody Fri Apr 29 05:56:15 2016 Return-Path: X-Original-To: hrpc@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: hrpc@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 644F712D664 for ; Fri, 29 Apr 2016 05:56:10 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.121 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.121 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, SPF_NEUTRAL=0.779] autolearn=no autolearn_force=no Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id TH3SIx4SYES0 for ; Fri, 29 Apr 2016 05:56:08 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail.article19.io (vps784.greenhost.nl [213.108.108.114]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher AECDH-AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 3BFED12D5F3 for ; Fri, 29 Apr 2016 05:56:07 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail.article19.io (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.article19.io (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 0368739F342 for ; Fri, 29 Apr 2016 12:56:06 +0000 (UTC) Received: from mail.article19.io (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.article19.io (Postfix) with ESMTPS id E94DF39F348 for ; Fri, 29 Apr 2016 12:56:05 +0000 (UTC) Received: from [192.168.1.71] (sd5112335.adsl.online.nl [213.17.35.53]) by mail.article19.io (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id DBABF39F342 for ; Fri, 29 Apr 2016 12:56:05 +0000 (UTC) References: To: "hrpc@irtf.org" From: Niels ten Oever X-Forwarded-Message-Id: Message-ID: <572359E5.5060104@article19.org> Date: Fri, 29 Apr 2016 14:56:05 +0200 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; Linux x86_64; rv:38.0) Gecko/20100101 Icedove/38.7.0 MIME-Version: 1.0 In-Reply-To: Content-Type: multipart/signed; micalg=pgp-sha256; protocol="application/pgp-signature"; boundary="mSTUPGRsBFgJwRBL0N8rejxWQ6IhiBtpd" Archived-At: Subject: [hrpc] Ethics in Networked Systems X-BeenThere: hrpc@irtf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.17 Precedence: list List-Id: "niels@article19.org" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 29 Apr 2016 12:56:11 -0000 This is an OpenPGP/MIME signed message (RFC 4880 and 3156) --mSTUPGRsBFgJwRBL0N8rejxWQ6IhiBtpd Content-Type: text/plain; charset=windows-1252 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Hi all, This seems of high relevance to our draft as well as hrpc in general: http://networkedsystemsethics.net/ Best, Niels --mSTUPGRsBFgJwRBL0N8rejxWQ6IhiBtpd Content-Type: application/pgp-signature; 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dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=gmail.com Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id G2b16IBFc2bE for ; Fri, 29 Apr 2016 07:02:11 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail-wm0-x236.google.com (mail-wm0-x236.google.com [IPv6:2a00:1450:400c:c09::236]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 9D0EC12D691 for ; Fri, 29 Apr 2016 07:02:08 -0700 (PDT) Received: by mail-wm0-x236.google.com with SMTP id g17so38019199wme.1 for ; Fri, 29 Apr 2016 07:02:08 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20120113; h=mime-version:in-reply-to:references:date:message-id:subject:from:to :cc; bh=92aXOVW7xyThJ0QbIsWMVLYylAdUXgdTJLzOGvxf/Zs=; b=azfW33VLSxNhW1WUxqkvHMATZyZ0Xip3ivLRXKC0PaiOR0VloN+qtERfupIKhwoBFP Js90qZdQ0EB5ynNhsSssNSvqP7D6+632GhD2rh6jSJQZEomYrItxfmjl37Cina+dxZrQ oKzwY6Oeeh7QDK8+AhbK4tH/2l62kbaMjR0IT+QMefl0Ad91NwT/1dAQhGJh3gqk9UTn JgpaguXUAWnEblBSBBTOGSpMA6Uy4k/TKRXiTwOcmmNUueqt7LeXdkMNX4HZhvYm06H9 tr8jbITbqcBKKMVAq0FX/QAVBwhAezvQmGJmMki9RJ3HsaRsQtWEw/9p3WMPMSjOfIN0 RHcw== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20130820; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:in-reply-to:references:date :message-id:subject:from:to:cc; bh=92aXOVW7xyThJ0QbIsWMVLYylAdUXgdTJLzOGvxf/Zs=; b=kTQR4lG+b//Toq0JzD4xyzFYYwe09VwTIBffsavV8EpSLewQB5/j0tcMquD+kVe34A fypQ6HdkZ4uC1XEdsa+eF+Qd+gZq2zN+r2VdY2pmEw6iAeHhgKdID2l1CpMQqj15zVJr PduCINTmBUDLhSN61s3QBcg8ogfPzHTBJnbFHJiZj/aLlSWWwkbyk3T9CfN++q9yFo9+ ZYLI7nw7iSJpAmkajzm1N8bXnxxdA2cSgY/84Kxg9S2C7HZbQf43qbUuHeiH/yMcjLlV cLk1yHnv/F9IMzui1FJO4MPJrExA3c8RCaeEeBTt33w2vuLuoHQYCWCOewkouVgmskdm MrwQ== X-Gm-Message-State: AOPr4FVVVL2vcvAmiu4WfOfYNuZblI+1LfBJnXe7VdUJV8oorTMN+ubrEsKVRk8sWYCziRazg2lsRuivHcQ7cA== MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Received: by 10.28.210.73 with SMTP id j70mr4586687wmg.48.1461938527205; Fri, 29 Apr 2016 07:02:07 -0700 (PDT) Received: by 10.194.190.71 with HTTP; Fri, 29 Apr 2016 07:02:07 -0700 (PDT) In-Reply-To: <572359E5.5060104@article19.org> References: <572359E5.5060104@article19.org> Date: Fri, 29 Apr 2016 15:02:07 +0100 Message-ID: From: Corinne Cath To: Niels ten Oever Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary=001a1147191499090e0531a016c2 Archived-At: Cc: "hrpc@irtf.org" Subject: Re: [hrpc] Ethics in Networked Systems X-BeenThere: hrpc@irtf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.17 Precedence: list List-Id: "niels@article19.org" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 29 Apr 2016 14:02:16 -0000 --001a1147191499090e0531a016c2 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 Dear all, This is a great resource indeed. It was put together by Bendert Zevenbergen, as an OTF project. I worked with Ben on this project at Oxford and one of the things we did was organize a workshop at Green Templeton College. On the basis of which we wrote this article: http://papers.ssrn.com/sol3/papers.cfm?abstract_id=2666934 which might be of interest. Feel free to drop Ben or me an email if you have any further questions. Best, Corinne On Fri, Apr 29, 2016 at 1:56 PM, Niels ten Oever wrote: > Hi all, > > This seems of high relevance to our draft as well as hrpc in general: > > http://networkedsystemsethics.net/ > > Best, > > Niels > > > > _______________________________________________ > hrpc mailing list > hrpc@irtf.org > https://www.irtf.org/mailman/listinfo/hrpc > > -- 'The management of normality is hard work' --001a1147191499090e0531a016c2 Content-Type: text/html; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Dear all,

This is a great resource indeed. It was put t= ogether by Bendert Zevenbergen, as an OTF project. I worked with Ben on thi= s project at Oxford and one=20 of the things we did was organize a workshop at Green Templeton College. On the basis of which we wrote this article: http://papers= .ssrn.com/sol3/papers.cfm?abstract_id=3D2666934 which might be of inter= est.

Feel free to drop Ben or me an email if you have any further questi= ons.

Best,

Corinne

On Fri, Apr 29, 2016 at 1:56 PM, Niels= ten Oever <niels@article19.org> wrote:
Hi all,

This seems of high relevance to our draft as well as hrpc in general:

http://networkedsystemsethics.net/

Best,

Niels



_______________________________________________
hrpc mailing list
hrpc@irtf.org
https://www.irtf.org/mailman/listinfo/hrpc




--


'The management of normality is hard work'
<= br>
--001a1147191499090e0531a016c2-- From nobody Sat Apr 30 03:44:51 2016 Return-Path: X-Original-To: hrpc@irtf.org Delivered-To: hrpc@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from ietfa.amsl.com (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 00A36128874; Sat, 30 Apr 2016 03:44:50 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: "\"IETF Meeting Session Request Tool\"" To: X-Test-IDTracker: no X-IETF-IDTracker: 6.19.0 Auto-Submitted: auto-generated Precedence: bulk Message-ID: <20160430104449.31046.79091.idtracker@ietfa.amsl.com> Date: Sat, 30 Apr 2016 03:44:49 -0700 Archived-At: Cc: hrpc-chairs@ietf.org, niels@article19.org, hrpc@irtf.org, irtf-chair@irtf.org Subject: [hrpc] hrpc - Update to a Meeting Session Request for IETF 96 X-BeenThere: hrpc@irtf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.17 List-Id: "niels@article19.org" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sat, 30 Apr 2016 10:44:50 -0000 An update to a meeting session request has just been submitted by Niels ten Oever, a Chair of the hrpc working group. --------------------------------------------------------- Working Group Name: Human Rights Protocol Considerations Area Name: IRTF Session Requester: Niels Oever Number of Sessions: 1 Length of Session(s): 2 Hours Number of Attendees: 90 Conflicts to Avoid: First Priority: irtfopen Second Priority: saag Third Priority: dprive Special Requests: Strong preference for Tuesday or Thursday --------------------------------------------------------- From nobody Sat Apr 30 19:55:22 2016 Return-Path: X-Original-To: hrpc@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: hrpc@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id F0BCA12D127 for ; Sat, 30 Apr 2016 19:55:20 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.602 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.602 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW=-0.7, SPF_HELO_PASS=-0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id zr2-KLGlhSuo for ; Sat, 30 Apr 2016 19:55:19 -0700 (PDT) Received: from TheWorld.com (pcls5.std.com [192.74.137.145]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id D7F7412B045 for ; Sat, 30 Apr 2016 19:55:18 -0700 (PDT) Received: from pcls8.std.com (pcls8.std.com [192.74.137.148]) by TheWorld.com (8.14.5/8.14.5) with ESMTP id u412srok029772; Sat, 30 Apr 2016 22:54:55 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Message-ID: <22309.28369.268613.643672@pcls8.std.com> Date: Sat, 30 Apr 2016 22:49:53 -0400 From: bzs@theworld.com To: Niels ten Oever In-Reply-To: <572359E5.5060104@article19.org> References: <572359E5.5060104@article19.org> X-Mailer: VM 8.2.0b under 24.3.1 (x86_64-suse-linux-gnu) Archived-At: Cc: "hrpc@irtf.org" Subject: Re: [hrpc] Ethics in Networked Systems X-BeenThere: hrpc@irtf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.17 Precedence: list List-Id: "niels@article19.org" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sun, 01 May 2016 02:55:21 -0000 On April 29, 2016 at 14:56 niels@article19.org (Niels ten Oever) wrote: > Hi all, > > This seems of high relevance to our draft as well as hrpc in general: > > http://networkedsystemsethics.net/ It's good. Section B is probably most relevant. There are some difficult to reconcile contradictions. For example, does one need to collect new data or can existing datasets be used (for research) vs, elsewhere, why can't this dataset be deleted at the end of the project (data retention issues)? But nonetheless a very good breakdown of issues. -- -Barry Shein Software Tool & Die | bzs@TheWorld.com | http://www.TheWorld.com Purveyors to the Trade | Voice: +1 617-STD-WRLD | 800-THE-WRLD The World: Since 1989 | A Public Information Utility | *oo*