From henk@ripe.net Tue Feb 1 02:00:34 2011 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ippm@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ippm@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id D47AB3A6B9E for ; Tue, 1 Feb 2011 02:00:34 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -102.603 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-102.603 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=-0.004, BAYES_00=-2.599, USER_IN_WHITELIST=-100] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id Ou-hMvbQxMBz for ; Tue, 1 Feb 2011 02:00:34 -0800 (PST) Received: from postlady.ripe.net (postlady.ipv6.ripe.net [IPv6:2001:610:240:11::c100:1341]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7804C3A6C0A for ; Tue, 1 Feb 2011 02:00:33 -0800 (PST) Received: from dodo.ripe.net ([193.0.23.4]) by postlady.ripe.net with esmtps (TLSv1:AES256-SHA:256) (Exim 4.72) (envelope-from ) id 1PkD5O-0005PQ-3E for ippm@ietf.org; Tue, 01 Feb 2011 11:03:47 +0100 Received: from [193.0.21.124] (helo=geir.local) by dodo.ripe.net with esmtp (Exim 4.72) (envelope-from ) id 1PkD5N-0001om-Ud for ippm@ietf.org; Tue, 01 Feb 2011 11:03:46 +0100 Message-ID: <4D47DA81.9020404@ripe.net> Date: Tue, 01 Feb 2011 11:03:45 +0100 From: Henk Uijterwaal Organization: RIPE NCC User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Macintosh; U; Intel Mac OS X 10.6; en-GB; rv:1.9.2.13) Gecko/20101207 Lightning/1.0b2 Thunderbird/3.1.7 MIME-Version: 1.0 To: IETF IPPM WG X-Enigmail-Version: 1.1.1 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-RIPE-Spam-Level: -- X-RIPE-Spam-Report: Spam Total Points: -2.9 points pts rule name description ---- ---------------------- ------------------------------------ -1.0 ALL_TRUSTED Passed through trusted hosts only via SMTP -0.0 T_RP_MATCHES_RCVD Envelope sender domain matches handover relay domain -1.9 BAYES_00 BODY: Bayes spam probability is 0 to 1% [score: 0.0000] X-RIPE-Signature: e0cdef1f45f89a40ad608d255b27e7d5c0e7488dad5227d84b28e7c18310b0b3 Subject: [ippm] draft-morton-ippm-rt-loss as a WG document X-BeenThere: ippm@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF IP Performance Metrics Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 01 Feb 2011 10:00:34 -0000 IPPM group, In Beijing, Al asked if draft-morton-ippm-rt-loss should become a WG document. I promised to raise this question on the list, forgot and Al reminded me. Anyway, Should draft-morton-ippm-rt-loss become a WG document or not. If you have any thoughts about this, please comment by Feb 14. An url for the document is: http://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-morton-ippm-rt-loss/ Henk ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ Henk Uijterwaal Email: henk.uijterwaal(at)ripe.net RIPE Network Coordination Centre http://www.xs4all.nl/~henku P.O.Box 10096 Singel 258 Phone: +31.20.5354414 1001 EB Amsterdam 1016 AB Amsterdam Fax: +31.20.5354445 The Netherlands The Netherlands Mobile: +31.6.55861746 ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ I confirm today what I denied yesterday. Anonymous Politician. From Ruediger.Geib@telekom.de Tue Feb 1 02:17:14 2011 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ippm@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ippm@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0F5103A6BB7 for ; Tue, 1 Feb 2011 02:17:14 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -3.249 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-3.249 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-2.599, HELO_EQ_DE=0.35, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW=-1] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id r-ts4xBoLmqo for ; Tue, 1 Feb 2011 02:17:13 -0800 (PST) Received: from tcmail83.telekom.de (tcmail83.telekom.de [62.225.183.131]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id B638A3A6BAA for ; Tue, 1 Feb 2011 02:17:12 -0800 (PST) Received: from he110890.emea1.cds.t-internal.com ([10.134.92.131]) by tcmail81.telekom.de with ESMTP/TLS/AES128-SHA; 01 Feb 2011 11:20:22 +0100 Received: from HE111648.emea1.cds.t-internal.com ([169.254.5.69]) by he110890 ([10.134.92.131]) with mapi; Tue, 1 Feb 2011 11:20:22 +0100 From: To: Date: Tue, 1 Feb 2011 11:20:21 +0100 Thread-Topic: [ippm] draft-morton-ippm-rt-loss as a WG document Thread-Index: AcvB94NDVK2EnajWSMiJ2sj56c0MPwAAZYhQ Message-ID: <580BEA5E3B99744AB1F5BFF5E9A3C67DFACC48D3@HE111648.emea1.cds.t-internal.com> References: <4D47DA81.9020404@ripe.net> In-Reply-To: <4D47DA81.9020404@ripe.net> Accept-Language: en-US, de-DE Content-Language: de-DE X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: acceptlanguage: en-US, de-DE Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable MIME-Version: 1.0 Cc: ippm@ietf.org Subject: Re: [ippm] draft-morton-ippm-rt-loss as a WG document X-BeenThere: ippm@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF IP Performance Metrics Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 01 Feb 2011 10:17:14 -0000 Henk, while I'm not having a requirement to create such metric, I think AL's rati= onal makes some sense. So I support draft-morton-ippm-rt-loss to become a WG document. Regards, Ruediger -----Original Message----- From: ippm-bounces@ietf.org [mailto:ippm-bounces@ietf.org] On Behalf Of Hen= k Uijterwaal Sent: Tuesday, February 01, 2011 11:04 AM To: IETF IPPM WG Subject: [ippm] draft-morton-ippm-rt-loss as a WG document IPPM group, In Beijing, Al asked if draft-morton-ippm-rt-loss should become a WG document. I promised to raise this question on the list, forgot and Al reminded me. Anyway, Should draft-morton-ippm-rt-loss become a WG document or not. If you have any thoughts about this, please comment by Feb 14. An url for the document is: http://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-morton-ippm-rt-loss/ Henk ---------------------------------------------------------------------------= --- Henk Uijterwaal Email: henk.uijterwaal(at)ripe.ne= t RIPE Network Coordination Centre http://www.xs4all.nl/~henku P.O.Box 10096 Singel 258 Phone: +31.20.5354414 1001 EB Amsterdam 1016 AB Amsterdam Fax: +31.20.5354445 The Netherlands The Netherlands Mobile: +31.6.55861746 ---------------------------------------------------------------------------= --- I confirm today what I denied yesterday. Anonymous Politician. _______________________________________________ ippm mailing list ippm@ietf.org https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ippm From vinayakh@gmail.com Tue Feb 1 02:39:56 2011 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ippm@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ippm@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9E73A3A6CBD for ; Tue, 1 Feb 2011 02:39:56 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -3.199 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-3.199 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.400, BAYES_00=-2.599, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW=-1] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id DQmsOXWD4LtU for ; Tue, 1 Feb 2011 02:39:55 -0800 (PST) Received: from mail-qw0-f44.google.com (mail-qw0-f44.google.com [209.85.216.44]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 486FF3A6CC4 for ; Tue, 1 Feb 2011 02:39:54 -0800 (PST) Received: by qwi2 with SMTP id 2so6924249qwi.31 for ; Tue, 01 Feb 2011 02:43:11 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=gamma; h=domainkey-signature:mime-version:in-reply-to:references:date :message-id:subject:from:to:cc:content-type :content-transfer-encoding; bh=Sj1nTUiRYE8aqe6hTU9WrnNNilMEphxff7Y1o3ujgfo=; b=FDvxMr5LCqWZA1KlbxKbKGmRuucRaRDSWWI/Kkadz2sv+8M24X9x5a11zdnhPPtUKT J4Rw485UQ3tXFkrzFO/qvn+ygb6maNzwzfS9nZgltQD1/J0bAGgBwy4yj0v3DuDs9a8y ZCfK4inESP472pEYwkJEN+bbq7bQN3ReATqWE= DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; c=nofws; d=gmail.com; s=gamma; h=mime-version:in-reply-to:references:date:message-id:subject:from:to :cc:content-type:content-transfer-encoding; b=pHsWAEvnHqz3m2sNDYiGM3UAdUCI3Ef1cqAINYhjWJeQyHYZJPir6SpZtHUBveaYCd T+8iH+Otn7xznHLBJuzyVElVFWApLy29lc23CKTkX+gBrC0tQmKi03CVXVnbXhXB1mlw NBW6ihPhxwYVqNhaVn9txoTJe/3khFs5QS58I= MIME-Version: 1.0 Received: by 10.224.6.71 with SMTP id 7mr6098101qay.351.1296556989294; Tue, 01 Feb 2011 02:43:09 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.220.186.194 with HTTP; Tue, 1 Feb 2011 02:43:09 -0800 (PST) In-Reply-To: <580BEA5E3B99744AB1F5BFF5E9A3C67DFACC48D3@HE111648.emea1.cds.t-internal.com> References: <4D47DA81.9020404@ripe.net> <580BEA5E3B99744AB1F5BFF5E9A3C67DFACC48D3@HE111648.emea1.cds.t-internal.com> Date: Tue, 1 Feb 2011 16:13:09 +0530 Message-ID: From: Vinayak Hegde To: Ruediger.Geib@telekom.de Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Cc: henk@ripe.net, ippm@ietf.org Subject: Re: [ippm] draft-morton-ippm-rt-loss as a WG document X-BeenThere: ippm@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF IP Performance Metrics Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 01 Feb 2011 10:39:56 -0000 I think such a metric would be useful due to asymmetry of paths. Another reason is the fact that even there is (bulk) data transfer in one direction, there is a transfer of control packets in the other direction (eg FTP,HTTP). It makes sense to adopt this as a WG document. Regards Vinayak On Tue, Feb 1, 2011 at 3:50 PM, wrote: > Henk, > > while I'm not having a requirement to create such metric, I think AL's ra= tional > makes some sense. So I support draft-morton-ippm-rt-loss to become a WG > document. > > Regards, > > Ruediger > > -----Original Message----- > From: ippm-bounces@ietf.org [mailto:ippm-bounces@ietf.org] On Behalf Of H= enk Uijterwaal > Sent: Tuesday, February 01, 2011 11:04 AM > To: IETF IPPM WG > Subject: [ippm] draft-morton-ippm-rt-loss as a WG document > > IPPM group, > > In Beijing, Al asked if draft-morton-ippm-rt-loss should become a WG > document. =A0I promised to raise this question on the list, forgot and > Al reminded me. =A0Anyway, > > Should draft-morton-ippm-rt-loss become a WG document or not. =A0If you > have any thoughts about this, please comment by Feb 14. > > An url for the document is: > =A0 http://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-morton-ippm-rt-loss/ > > Henk > > -------------------------------------------------------------------------= ----- > Henk Uijterwaal =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 Email= : henk.uijterwaal(at)ripe.net > RIPE Network Coordination Centre =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0http://www.xs4all.nl/= ~henku > P.O.Box 10096 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0Singel 258 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 Phone: +31.20= .5354414 > 1001 EB Amsterdam =A0 =A0 =A01016 AB Amsterdam =A0Fax: +31.20.5354445 > The Netherlands =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0The Netherlands =A0 =A0Mobile: +31.6.55861= 746 > -------------------------------------------------------------------------= ----- > > I confirm today what I denied yesterday. =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0Anonymous= Politician. > _______________________________________________ > ippm mailing list > ippm@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ippm > _______________________________________________ > ippm mailing list > ippm@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ippm > From Barry.Constantine@jdsu.com Tue Feb 1 04:04:42 2011 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ippm@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ippm@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9167A3A68F3 for ; Tue, 1 Feb 2011 04:04:42 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -6.598 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-6.598 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.001, BAYES_00=-2.599, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-4] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id S8lydFLoAh9A for ; Tue, 1 Feb 2011 04:04:38 -0800 (PST) Received: from exprod7og107.obsmtp.com (exprod7og107.obsmtp.com [64.18.2.167]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with SMTP id 0B3DF3A68ED for ; Tue, 1 Feb 2011 04:04:36 -0800 (PST) Received: from source ([209.36.247.248]) (using TLSv1) by exprod7ob107.postini.com ([64.18.6.12]) with SMTP ID DSNKTUf3mNBbLg8hLb0aLpxCJPJZjaK458VN@postini.com; Tue, 01 Feb 2011 04:07:55 PST Received: from milexhtca1.ds.jdsu.net (192.168.10.158) by mx6.jdsu.com (192.168.10.248) with Microsoft SMTP Server (TLS) id 8.2.255.0; Tue, 1 Feb 2011 04:04:53 -0800 Received: from MILEXCH1.ds.jdsu.net ([fe80::6444:f010:6d40:bdb]) by milexhtca1.ds.jdsu.net ([::1]) with mapi; Tue, 1 Feb 2011 04:05:24 -0800 From: Barry Constantine To: Henk Uijterwaal , IETF IPPM WG Date: Tue, 1 Feb 2011 04:05:22 -0800 Thread-Topic: [ippm] draft-morton-ippm-rt-loss as a WG document Thread-Index: AcvB92DNlEgXADJZQeKuWy70XiYMWgAEKCaw Message-ID: <94DEE80C63F7D34F9DC9FE69E39436BE398C6C4632@MILEXCH1.ds.jdsu.net> References: <4D47DA81.9020404@ripe.net> In-Reply-To: <4D47DA81.9020404@ripe.net> Accept-Language: en-US Content-Language: en-US X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: acceptlanguage: en-US Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable MIME-Version: 1.0 Subject: Re: [ippm] draft-morton-ippm-rt-loss as a WG document X-BeenThere: ippm@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF IP Performance Metrics Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 01 Feb 2011 12:04:42 -0000 Hello, I expressed support for this when it was first proposed by Al and continue = to see value in this work as a WG document. Thanks, Barry -----Original Message----- From: ippm-bounces@ietf.org [mailto:ippm-bounces@ietf.org] On Behalf Of Hen= k Uijterwaal Sent: Tuesday, February 01, 2011 5:04 AM To: IETF IPPM WG Subject: [ippm] draft-morton-ippm-rt-loss as a WG document IPPM group, In Beijing, Al asked if draft-morton-ippm-rt-loss should become a WG document. I promised to raise this question on the list, forgot and Al reminded me. Anyway, Should draft-morton-ippm-rt-loss become a WG document or not. If you have any thoughts about this, please comment by Feb 14. An url for the document is: http://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-morton-ippm-rt-loss/ Henk ---------------------------------------------------------------------------= --- Henk Uijterwaal Email: henk.uijterwaal(at)ripe.ne= t RIPE Network Coordination Centre http://www.xs4all.nl/~henku P.O.Box 10096 Singel 258 Phone: +31.20.5354414 1001 EB Amsterdam 1016 AB Amsterdam Fax: +31.20.5354445 The Netherlands The Netherlands Mobile: +31.6.55861746 ---------------------------------------------------------------------------= --- I confirm today what I denied yesterday. Anonymous Politician. _______________________________________________ ippm mailing list ippm@ietf.org https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ippm From yaakov_s@rad.com Thu Feb 10 01:18:51 2011 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ippm@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ippm@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3DB403A69F3 for ; Thu, 10 Feb 2011 01:18:51 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -100.999 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-100.999 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=1.600, BAYES_00=-2.599, USER_IN_WHITELIST=-100] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 6VYF9gCop5Zo for ; Thu, 10 Feb 2011 01:18:50 -0800 (PST) Received: from antivir1.rad.co.il (antivir1.rad.co.il [62.0.23.193]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id DDC613A69F7 for ; Thu, 10 Feb 2011 01:18:48 -0800 (PST) Received: from exrad5.ad.rad.co.il ([192.114.24.28]) by antivir1.rad.co.il with ESMTP; 10 Feb 2011 11:18:55 +0200 Received: from EXUS4-DRP.ad.rad.co.il (192.114.24.119) by EXRAD5.ad.rad.co.il (192.114.24.28) with Microsoft SMTP Server (TLS) id 14.1.218.12; Thu, 10 Feb 2011 11:18:44 +0200 Received: from EXRAD5.ad.rad.co.il ([fe80::ec3e:feb5:8bef:e3ba]) by exus4-drp.ad.rad.co.il ([fe80::5d6f:c2cb:2468:ee2%16]) with mapi id 14.01.0270.001; Thu, 10 Feb 2011 11:18:43 +0200 From: Yaakov Stein To: Henk Uijterwaal Thread-Topic: [ippm] draft-morton-ippm-rt-loss as a WG document Thread-Index: AQHLwfdlWq9qTgpJkEuy+E+B+1RcJJP6dgEA Date: Thu, 10 Feb 2011 09:18:43 +0000 Message-ID: <07F7D7DED63154409F13298786A2ADC903D05601@EXRAD5.ad.rad.co.il> References: <4D47DA81.9020404@ripe.net> In-Reply-To: <4D47DA81.9020404@ripe.net> Accept-Language: en-US Content-Language: en-US X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: x-originating-ip: [207.232.33.112] Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable MIME-Version: 1.0 Cc: IETF IPPM WG Subject: Re: [ippm] draft-morton-ippm-rt-loss as a WG document X-BeenThere: ippm@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF IP Performance Metrics Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 10 Feb 2011 09:18:51 -0000 I think that it is much more informative to measure packet loss independently in each direction, something we can do with existing tools. I never understood what RT packet loss means=20 (a packet can be lost on the way back after reflection, but if one was lost on the way out there was nothing to be echoed). However, the concept seems to have been covered in other contexts and it makes sense to cover it here for completeness. So, my stance is "no objection". Y(J)S -----Original Message----- From: ippm-bounces@ietf.org [mailto:ippm-bounces@ietf.org] On Behalf Of Hen= k Uijterwaal Sent: Tuesday, February 01, 2011 12:04 To: IETF IPPM WG Subject: [ippm] draft-morton-ippm-rt-loss as a WG document IPPM group, In Beijing, Al asked if draft-morton-ippm-rt-loss should become a WG document. I promised to raise this question on the list, forgot and Al reminded me. Anyway, Should draft-morton-ippm-rt-loss become a WG document or not. If you have any thoughts about this, please comment by Feb 14. An url for the document is: http://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-morton-ippm-rt-loss/ Henk ---------------------------------------------------------------------------= --- Henk Uijterwaal Email: henk.uijterwaal(at)ripe.ne= t RIPE Network Coordination Centre http://www.xs4all.nl/~henku P.O.Box 10096 Singel 258 Phone: +31.20.5354414 1001 EB Amsterdam 1016 AB Amsterdam Fax: +31.20.5354445 The Netherlands The Netherlands Mobile: +31.6.55861746 ---------------------------------------------------------------------------= --- I confirm today what I denied yesterday. Anonymous Politician. _______________________________________________ ippm mailing list ippm@ietf.org https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ippm From iesg-secretary@ietf.org Fri Feb 11 13:35:42 2011 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ippm@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ippm@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id E874C3A6833; Fri, 11 Feb 2011 13:35:42 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -102.599 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-102.599 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.000, BAYES_00=-2.599, USER_IN_WHITELIST=-100] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id Qpdn5WPRONXv; Fri, 11 Feb 2011 13:35:41 -0800 (PST) Received: from [127.0.0.1] (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2CDFA3A6A1A; Fri, 11 Feb 2011 13:35:41 -0800 (PST) Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: The IESG To: IETF-Announce X-Test-IDTracker: no X-IETF-IDTracker: 3.12 Message-ID: <20110211213541.31694.47538.idtracker@localhost> Date: Fri, 11 Feb 2011 13:35:41 -0800 Cc: Internet Architecture Board , ippm chair , ippm mailing list , RFC Editor Subject: [ippm] Document Action: 'RFC 4148 and the IPPM Metrics Registry are Obsolete' to Informational RFC (draft-morton-ippm-rfc4148-obsolete-03.txt) X-BeenThere: ippm@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF IP Performance Metrics Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 11 Feb 2011 21:35:43 -0000 The IESG has approved the following document: - 'RFC 4148 and the IPPM Metrics Registry are Obsolete' (draft-morton-ippm-rfc4148-obsolete-03.txt) as an Informational RFC This document is the product of the IP Performance Metrics Working Group. The IESG contact person is Lars Eggert. A URL of this Internet Draft is: http://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-morton-ippm-rfc4148-obsolete/ Technical Summary This memo recommends that RFC 4148, the IP Performance Metrics (IPPM) Registry be reclassified as Historic, and the IANA IPPM Metrics Registry itself be withdrawn from use. The current registry structure has been found to be insufficiently detailed to uniquely identify IPPM metrics. Despite apparent efforts to find current or even future users, no one has responded to the third quarter of 2010 call for interest in the RFC 4148 registry. Working Group Summary This is a strange draft in a sense that it does not contain any technical content, it only asks IANA to stop updating a registry. Technically, it is therefore very simple and does not need lots of reviews. The issue itself, do we need a registry for IPPM metrics, has been under discussion for about 6 months. During those 6 months, the WG could not identify anybody actually using the registry or interested in upgrading it to something more useful. Further evidence that the registry is not used, is given in the document. It should also be noted that obsoleting this registry will not break anything. IANA practice is to keep the files related to an obsoleted registry at their current location, if somebody is actively using these files, they will still be there with their current content. An obvious questions is why the WG cares about an unused registry. The problem is that even though the registry is not used, it needs to be maintained. Maintaining it requires considerable effort from both document authors for new metrics (in particular when they are not familiar with the concept of a registry) and the IANA. We want to avoid that. Document Quality Good. Personnel Document shepherd is Henk Uijterwaal (henk@ripe.net). Lars Eggert (lars.eggert@nokia.com) reviewed the document for the IESG. From Internet-Drafts@ietf.org Tue Feb 15 14:15:04 2011 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ippm@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ippm@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6AAF53A6AFF; Tue, 15 Feb 2011 14:15:04 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -102.567 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-102.567 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.032, BAYES_00=-2.599, USER_IN_WHITELIST=-100] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 2e-emIHMDG5Z; Tue, 15 Feb 2011 14:15:03 -0800 (PST) Received: from [127.0.0.1] (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1C92C3A6DA8; Tue, 15 Feb 2011 14:15:03 -0800 (PST) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: Multipart/Mixed; Boundary="NextPart" From: Internet-Drafts@ietf.org To: i-d-announce@ietf.org X-Test-IDTracker: no X-IETF-IDTracker: 3.12 Message-ID: <20110215221503.3133.46766.idtracker@localhost> Date: Tue, 15 Feb 2011 14:15:03 -0800 Cc: ippm@ietf.org Subject: [ippm] I-D Action:draft-ietf-ippm-rt-loss-00.txt X-BeenThere: ippm@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF IP Performance Metrics Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 15 Feb 2011 22:15:04 -0000 --NextPart A New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line Internet-Drafts directories. This draft is a work item of the IP Performance Metrics Working Group of the IETF. Title : Round-trip Loss Metrics Author(s) : A. Morton Filename : draft-ietf-ippm-rt-loss-00.txt Pages : 12 Date : 2011-02-15 Many user applications (and the transport protocols that make them possible) require two-way communications. To assess this capability, and to achieve test system simplicity, round-trip loss measurements are frequently conducted in practice. The Two-Way Active Measurement Protocol specified in RFC 5357 establishes a round-trip loss measurement capability for the Internet. However, there is currently no metric specified according to the RFC 2330 framework. This memo adds round-trip loss to the set of IP Performance Metrics (IPPM). A URL for this Internet-Draft is: http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-ietf-ippm-rt-loss-00.txt Internet-Drafts are also available by anonymous FTP at: ftp://ftp.ietf.org/internet-drafts/ Below is the data which will enable a MIME compliant mail reader implementation to automatically retrieve the ASCII version of the Internet-Draft. --NextPart Content-Type: Message/External-body; name="draft-ietf-ippm-rt-loss-00.txt"; site="ftp.ietf.org"; access-type="anon-ftp"; directory="internet-drafts" Content-Type: text/plain Content-ID: <2011-02-15140744.I-D@ietf.org> --NextPart-- From Renata.Teixeira@lip6.fr Tue Feb 15 19:12:08 2011 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ippm@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ippm@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id E8ABA3A6C7E for ; Tue, 15 Feb 2011 19:12:08 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.39 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.39 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_20=-0.74, GB_I_LETTER=-2, HELO_EQ_FR=0.35] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id JnSshfc8UUSQ for ; Tue, 15 Feb 2011 19:12:08 -0800 (PST) Received: from isis.lip6.fr (isis.lip6.fr [132.227.60.2]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3454F3A6B8E for ; Tue, 15 Feb 2011 19:12:08 -0800 (PST) Received: from tibre.lip6.fr (tibre.lip6.fr [132.227.74.2]) by isis.lip6.fr (8.14.4/lip6) with ESMTP id p1G3CQQ8027701 for ; Wed, 16 Feb 2011 04:12:26 +0100 (CET) X-pt: isis.lip6.fr Received: from localhost (asim.lip6.fr [132.227.86.2]) by tibre.lip6.fr (8.14.4/8.13.3) with ESMTP id p1G3B8tD001938 for ; Wed, 16 Feb 2011 04:11:11 +0100 (MET) Received: from 61.87.208.web-pass.com (61.87.208.web-pass.com [208.87.61.189]) by webmail.lip6.fr (Horde Framework) with HTTP; Wed, 16 Feb 2011 04:11:08 +0100 Message-ID: <20110216041108.89516zma8ytb7484@webmail.lip6.fr> Date: Wed, 16 Feb 2011 04:11:08 +0100 From: Renata.Teixeira@lip6.fr To: ippm@ietf.org MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; DelSp="Yes"; format="flowed" Content-Disposition: inline Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit User-Agent: Internet Messaging Program (IMP) H3 (4.3.4) X-Greylist: Sender IP whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-4.2.6 (isis.lip6.fr [132.227.60.2]); Wed, 16 Feb 2011 04:12:26 +0100 (CET) X-Scanned-By: MIMEDefang 2.71 on 132.227.60.2 X-Mailman-Approved-At: Tue, 15 Feb 2011 19:26:04 -0800 Subject: [ippm] CFP: ACM Internet Measurement Conference 2011 X-BeenThere: ippm@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF IP Performance Metrics Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 16 Feb 2011 03:12:09 -0000 --------------------------------------------------------------------- Call for Papers Internet Measurement Conference 2011 Sponsored by ACM SIGCOMM and ACM SIGMETRICS and in cooperation with USENIX November 2-4, 2011 Berlin, Germany http://conferences.sigcomm.org/imc/2011 --------------------------------------------------------------------- The eleventh Internet Measurement Conference is a three day event focusing on all aspects of measurement-based research pertaining to today's Internet. Building on the success of past IMCs, we invite submissions of papers that contribute to our understanding of all aspects related to the Internet through the collection, analysis, or visualization of all types of network-related measurements. Examples of relevant topics are: * Internet traffic and topology measurement * Internet-oriented wireless, and mobility measurement * Internet performance measurements * Inter-domain and intra-domain routing * Measurement-based network management such as traffic engineering * Network applications such as multimedia streaming, gaming and on-line social networks * Measurement of sensing applications, including home networking and green networking * Measurements of content distribution, peer-to-peer, overlay, and social networks * Internet data-specific issues, including anonymization, querying, and storage * Measurement-based inference of network properties and structures * Design of and experiences with new monitoring systems * Algorithms for network measurements, including sampling and statistical inference methods * Network anomaly detection and troubleshooting * Software tools for analyzing and visualizing high-volume Internet- related datasets * Measurement related to network security and privacy * Measurement-based assessment of simulation/testbeds * Measurement-based modeling and workload generation * Reappraisal of previous measurement findings * Measurement related to data centers and the cloud * Measurement of technological and socio-economic aspects of networking * Relevant end-host and end-user measurements Papers that do not in some fashion relate to measuring aspects of the Internet or Internet-like systems are out of scope. Moreover, papers describing original ideas and novel validation methods will be given preference over submissions that report on incremental improvements of the existing state-of-the-art. Authors can contact the Program Co-Chairs for clarification if they are unsure whether their paper is in scope. Ethical standards for measurement must be considered by all IMC authors. In particular, authors must be aware of and conform to acceptable use policies for individual domains that are probed or monitored, data privacy and anonymity for all personally identifiable information, and etiquette for using shared measurement data (see Allman and Paxson, IMC '07). If applicable, authors are also urged to notify parties of security flaws in their products or services in advance of publication. Adherence to ethical standards for measurement will be a criteria for all submissions and violations---including ambiguous situations not well described---will be grounds for rejection. Submission Guidelines --------------------- There are two forms of submissions: 1. Full papers (up to 14 two-column pages) describing original research, with succinctness appropriate to the topics and themes they discuss. 2. Short papers (up to 6 two-column pages for text and figures + 1 page for references) conveying work that is less mature but shows promise, articulating a high-level vision, describing challenging future directions, critiquing current measurement wisdom or offering results that do not merit a full submission. Short papers will be subject to a 7-page limit in the Proceedings (with the last page for references only). Note: Previous IMCs have utilized a "reject to short" notion whereby full paper submissions have been accepted as short papers. IMC 2011 will not be using this procedure. Any submission longer than allowed by the above short guidelines will be considered a full paper. Note: Authors are encouraged to think carefully about whether to submit a full or short paper. In the past there have been many instances whereby a full submission has been found to be lacking enough technical contribution for a full paper, but for which the PC finds an interesting portion of the paper that would have been a very nice contribution as a short paper. Submissions must be in electronic form, as PDF documents. The submission must conform to the page limits stated above, and with text written in at least a 10-point font (Fonts used in Figures etc should be no smaller than 9 pt) satisfying the requirements specified below. * use double column format * the size of each column should be at most 9.25" by 3.33" * the space between columns should be at least 0.33" * use 10pt font * use up to 55 lines of text per column The http://conferences.sigcomm.org/imc/2009/sig-alternate-10pt.cls style file should satisfy these requirements. Please use -t letter when converting the .dvi file to pdf. All manuscripts must be in English and do not need to be anonymized. Submissions that do not comply with these requirements will not be read. All full papers and short papers accepted for presentation will be published in the Conference Proceedings produced by ACM. A few accepted papers may be forwarded for fast-track submission to the IEEE/ACM Transactions on Networking. To encourage broader data sharing in the community, the conference will present a best paper award for the top paper that makes its data sets publically available by the time of camera ready submission. For example, wireless-network data sets may be published through CRAWDAD. Authors that would like their paper to be considered for this award should add a footnote on the first page of their submission (and indicate this by selecting the appropriate button on the paper registration/submission page). A limited number of travel grants may be available to students who are unable to secure funding from their advisors. Important Dates --------------- * May 6, 2011, mid-night EDT: Registration of title and 250-word abstract * May 13, 2011, mid-night EDT: Hard submission deadline * July 22, 2011: Notification * November 2-4, 2011: Conference held in Berlin, Germany Program Co-Chairs ----------------- Patrick Thiran, EPFL Walter Willinger, AT&T Labs-Research Program Committee ----------------- Katerina Argyraki (EPFL, Switzerland) Martin Arlitt (HP Labs and University of Calgary, Canada) Suman Banerjee (University of Wisconsin, USA) Bobby Bhattacharjee (University of Maryland, USA) Fabian Bustamante (Northwestern University, USA) Augustin Chaintreau (Columbia University, USA) Xenofontas Dimitropoulos (ETH Zurich, Switzerland) Lixin Gao (University of Massachusetts, USA) Alexandre Gerber (AT&T Labs-Research, USA) Srikanth Kandula (Microsoft Research, USA) Thomas Karagiannis (Mirosoft Research, UK) Sachin Katti (Stanford University, USA) Ramana Kompella (Purdue University, USA) Christian Kreibich (ICSI, USA) Nikolaos Laoutaris (Telefonica Research, Spain) Olaf Maennel (Loughborough University, UK) Ratul Mahajan (Microsoft Research, USA) Z. Morley Mao (University of Michigan, USA) Hung X. Nguyen (University of Adelaide, Australia) Antonio Nucci (Narus, USA) Konstantina (Dina) Papagiannaki (Intel Labs, USA) Lili Qiu (University of Texas, USA) Reza Rejaie (University of Oregon, USA) Pablo Rodriguez (Telefonica Research, Spain) Matthew Roughan (University of Adelaide, Australia) Vyas Sekar (Intel Labs, USA) Rob Sherwood (Deutsche Telekom Labs, USA) Georgios Smaragdakis (TU Berlin and Deutsche Telekom Labs, Germany) Joel Sommers (Colgate University, USA) Neil Spring (University of Maryland, USA) Renata Teixeira (CNRS and UPMC Sorbonne Universites, France) Steve Uhlig (TU Berlin and Deutsche Telekom Labs, Germany) David Wetherall (University of Washington, USA) Lixia Zhang (UCLA, USA) Sponsors -------- Gold: Akamai Silver: HP and Technicolor From henk@ripe.net Wed Feb 16 00:18:43 2011 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ippm@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ippm@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6A9283A6B5F for ; Wed, 16 Feb 2011 00:18:43 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -102.549 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-102.549 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.050, BAYES_00=-2.599, USER_IN_WHITELIST=-100] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id sQ-4++Eg1F0L for ; Wed, 16 Feb 2011 00:18:42 -0800 (PST) Received: from postgirl.ripe.net (postgirl.ipv6.ripe.net [IPv6:2001:610:240:11::c100:1342]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 062C83A6DD8 for ; Wed, 16 Feb 2011 00:18:42 -0800 (PST) Received: from ayeaye.ripe.net ([193.0.23.5]) by postgirl.ripe.net with esmtps (TLSv1:AES256-SHA:256) (Exim 4.72) (envelope-from ) id 1PpcbL-0008Ja-JX for ippm@ietf.org; Wed, 16 Feb 2011 09:19:09 +0100 Received: from [193.0.21.124] (helo=guest133.guestnet.ripe.net) by ayeaye.ripe.net with esmtp (Exim 4.72) (envelope-from ) id 1PpcbL-0007om-Gn for ippm@ietf.org; Wed, 16 Feb 2011 09:19:07 +0100 Message-ID: <4D5B887B.4050000@ripe.net> Date: Wed, 16 Feb 2011 09:19:07 +0100 From: Henk Uijterwaal Organization: RIPE NCC User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Macintosh; U; Intel Mac OS X 10.6; en-GB; rv:1.9.2.13) Gecko/20101207 Lightning/1.0b2 Thunderbird/3.1.7 MIME-Version: 1.0 To: ippm@ietf.org References: <20110215221503.3133.46766.idtracker@localhost> In-Reply-To: <20110215221503.3133.46766.idtracker@localhost> X-Enigmail-Version: 1.1.1 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-RIPE-Spam-Level: -- X-RIPE-Spam-Report: Spam Total Points: -2.9 points pts rule name description ---- ---------------------- ------------------------------------ -1.0 ALL_TRUSTED Passed through trusted hosts only via SMTP -0.0 T_RP_MATCHES_RCVD Envelope sender domain matches handover relay domain -1.9 BAYES_00 BODY: Bayes spam probability is 0 to 1% [score: 0.0000] X-RIPE-Signature: e0cdef1f45f89a40ad608d255b27e7d5de4defca79faa460d81803e249c2a494 Subject: Re: [ippm] I-D Action:draft-ietf-ippm-rt-loss-00.txt X-BeenThere: ippm@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF IP Performance Metrics Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 16 Feb 2011 08:18:43 -0000 IPPM Group, As you can infer from this mail, this draft has been approved as a WG document. Sorry for not announcing that earlier, buffer overflow on my side. Henk On 15/02/2011 23:15, Internet-Drafts@ietf.org wrote: > A New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line Internet-Drafts directories. > This draft is a work item of the IP Performance Metrics Working Group of the IETF. > > > Title : Round-trip Loss Metrics > Author(s) : A. Morton > Filename : draft-ietf-ippm-rt-loss-00.txt > Pages : 12 > Date : 2011-02-15 > > Many user applications (and the transport protocols that make them > possible) require two-way communications. To assess this capability, > and to achieve test system simplicity, round-trip loss measurements > are frequently conducted in practice. The Two-Way Active Measurement > Protocol specified in RFC 5357 establishes a round-trip loss > measurement capability for the Internet. However, there is currently > no metric specified according to the RFC 2330 framework. > > This memo adds round-trip loss to the set of IP Performance Metrics > (IPPM). > > A URL for this Internet-Draft is: > http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-ietf-ippm-rt-loss-00.txt > > Internet-Drafts are also available by anonymous FTP at: > ftp://ftp.ietf.org/internet-drafts/ > > Below is the data which will enable a MIME compliant mail reader > implementation to automatically retrieve the ASCII version of the > Internet-Draft. > > > > _______________________________________________ > ippm mailing list > ippm@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ippm -- ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ Henk Uijterwaal Email: henk.uijterwaal(at)ripe.net RIPE Network Coordination Centre http://www.xs4all.nl/~henku P.O.Box 10096 Singel 258 Phone: +31.20.5354414 1001 EB Amsterdam 1016 AB Amsterdam Fax: +31.20.5354445 The Netherlands The Netherlands Mobile: +31.6.55861746 ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ I confirm today what I denied yesterday. Anonymous Politician. From henk@ripe.net Mon Feb 21 01:52:22 2011 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ippm@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ippm@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id E027B3A6F84 for ; Mon, 21 Feb 2011 01:52:22 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -102.574 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-102.574 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.025, BAYES_00=-2.599, USER_IN_WHITELIST=-100] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 1UoFR-nGKlTx for ; Mon, 21 Feb 2011 01:52:21 -0800 (PST) Received: from postlady.ripe.net (postlady.ipv6.ripe.net [IPv6:2001:610:240:11::c100:1341]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 460653A6E93 for ; Mon, 21 Feb 2011 01:52:21 -0800 (PST) Received: from ayeaye.ripe.net ([193.0.23.5]) by postlady.ripe.net with esmtps (TLSv1:AES256-SHA:256) (Exim 4.72) (envelope-from ) id 1PrSRv-0001Cw-6x for ippm@ietf.org; Mon, 21 Feb 2011 10:53:00 +0100 Received: from [193.0.21.124] (helo=guest133.guestnet.ripe.net) by ayeaye.ripe.net with esmtp (Exim 4.72) (envelope-from ) id 1PrSRu-0006d9-Tz for ippm@ietf.org; Mon, 21 Feb 2011 10:52:59 +0100 Message-ID: <4D6235FA.7040704@ripe.net> Date: Mon, 21 Feb 2011 10:52:58 +0100 From: Henk Uijterwaal Organization: RIPE NCC User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Macintosh; U; Intel Mac OS X 10.6; en-GB; rv:1.9.2.13) Gecko/20101207 Lightning/1.0b2 Thunderbird/3.1.7 MIME-Version: 1.0 To: IETF IPPM WG References: <4D46A6BB.4040301@ripe.net> In-Reply-To: <4D46A6BB.4040301@ripe.net> X-Enigmail-Version: 1.1.1 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-RIPE-Spam-Level: -- X-RIPE-Spam-Report: Spam Total Points: -2.9 points pts rule name description ---- ---------------------- ------------------------------------ -1.0 ALL_TRUSTED Passed through trusted hosts only via SMTP -0.0 T_RP_MATCHES_RCVD Envelope sender domain matches handover relay domain -1.9 BAYES_00 BODY: Bayes spam probability is 0 to 1% [score: 0.0000] X-RIPE-Signature: e0cdef1f45f89a40ad608d255b27e7d5b346e8aa671947e45b88fdcb27b31dbd Subject: Re: [ippm] WG meeting in Prague/IETF80 X-BeenThere: ippm@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF IP Performance Metrics Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 21 Feb 2011 09:52:23 -0000 IPPM group, We'll have a meeting in Prague, please send agenda requests to the chairs. So far, there are 2 requests (from Steve and Al), more topics are welcome. Henk -- ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ Henk Uijterwaal Email: henk.uijterwaal(at)ripe.net RIPE Network Coordination Centre http://www.xs4all.nl/~henku P.O.Box 10096 Singel 258 Phone: +31.20.5354414 1001 EB Amsterdam 1016 AB Amsterdam Fax: +31.20.5354445 The Netherlands The Netherlands Mobile: +31.6.55861746 ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ I confirm today what I denied yesterday. Anonymous Politician. From Internet-Drafts@ietf.org Wed Feb 23 11:30:04 2011 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ippm@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ippm@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id D87A43A67F9; Wed, 23 Feb 2011 11:30:04 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -102.564 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-102.564 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.035, BAYES_00=-2.599, USER_IN_WHITELIST=-100] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id eiH9+tEDJv07; Wed, 23 Feb 2011 11:30:03 -0800 (PST) Received: from [127.0.0.1] (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id AD53B3A6A2A; Wed, 23 Feb 2011 11:30:02 -0800 (PST) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: Multipart/Mixed; Boundary="NextPart" From: Internet-Drafts@ietf.org To: i-d-announce@ietf.org X-Test-IDTracker: no X-IETF-IDTracker: 3.12 Message-ID: <20110223193002.28577.86591.idtracker@localhost> Date: Wed, 23 Feb 2011 11:30:02 -0800 Cc: ippm@ietf.org Subject: [ippm] I-D Action:draft-ietf-ippm-tcp-throughput-tm-12.txt X-BeenThere: ippm@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF IP Performance Metrics Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 23 Feb 2011 19:30:05 -0000 --NextPart A New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line Internet-Drafts directories. This draft is a work item of the IP Performance Metrics Working Group of the IETF. Title : Framework for TCP Throughput Testing Author(s) : B. Constantine, et al. Filename : draft-ietf-ippm-tcp-throughput-tm-12.txt Pages : 23 Date : 2011-02-23 This framework describes a practical methodology for measuring end- to-end TCP Throughput in a managed IP network. The goal is to provide a better indication in regards to user experience. In this framework, TCP and IP parameters are specified and should be configured as recommended. A URL for this Internet-Draft is: http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-ietf-ippm-tcp-throughput-tm-12.txt Internet-Drafts are also available by anonymous FTP at: ftp://ftp.ietf.org/internet-drafts/ Below is the data which will enable a MIME compliant mail reader implementation to automatically retrieve the ASCII version of the Internet-Draft. --NextPart Content-Type: Message/External-body; name="draft-ietf-ippm-tcp-throughput-tm-12.txt"; site="ftp.ietf.org"; access-type="anon-ftp"; directory="internet-drafts" Content-Type: text/plain Content-ID: <2011-02-23111941.I-D@ietf.org> --NextPart-- From Barry.Constantine@jdsu.com Wed Feb 23 11:32:40 2011 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ippm@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ippm@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0BACF3A695F for ; Wed, 23 Feb 2011 11:32:40 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -6.598 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-6.598 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-2.599, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-4] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id Fucd2xiPU96Q for ; Wed, 23 Feb 2011 11:32:36 -0800 (PST) Received: from exprod7og108.obsmtp.com (exprod7og108.obsmtp.com [64.18.2.169]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with SMTP id B33E63A6940 for ; Wed, 23 Feb 2011 11:32:34 -0800 (PST) Received: from source ([209.36.247.247]) (using TLSv1) by exprod7ob108.postini.com ([64.18.6.12]) with SMTP ID DSNKTWVhAMv/KQh1YPKT0ivXONXqXwlllN5z@postini.com; Wed, 23 Feb 2011 11:33:22 PST Received: from milexhtca1.ds.jdsu.net (192.168.10.158) by mx5.jdsu.com (192.168.10.247) with Microsoft SMTP Server (TLS) id 8.2.255.0; Wed, 23 Feb 2011 11:29:42 -0800 Received: from MILEXCH1.ds.jdsu.net ([fe80::6444:f010:6d40:bdb]) by milexhtca1.ds.jdsu.net ([::1]) with mapi; Wed, 23 Feb 2011 11:29:42 -0800 From: Barry Constantine To: IETF IPPM WG Date: Wed, 23 Feb 2011 11:27:46 -0800 Thread-Topic: draft-ietf-ippm-tcp-throughput-tm-12 Thread-Index: AcvTj8Au3v/Fd6YoSSO0w27s8ad31g== Message-ID: <94DEE80C63F7D34F9DC9FE69E39436BE398CC77C4F@MILEXCH1.ds.jdsu.net> Accept-Language: en-US Content-Language: en-US X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: acceptlanguage: en-US Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="_000_94DEE80C63F7D34F9DC9FE69E39436BE398CC77C4FMILEXCH1dsjds_" MIME-Version: 1.0 Subject: [ippm] draft-ietf-ippm-tcp-throughput-tm-12 X-BeenThere: ippm@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF IP Performance Metrics Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 23 Feb 2011 19:32:40 -0000 --_000_94DEE80C63F7D34F9DC9FE69E39436BE398CC77C4FMILEXCH1dsjds_ Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Hello IPPM, Draft 12 has been posted and the following revisions have been incorporated= as requested by Lars: 1. Reduced the size of Section 3. 2. Added explanations in Section 3.3.1 about the importance to have Se= nd Buffer and TCP RWND larger than BDP. 3. Completely removed the Traffic Management Tests section. 4. Removed MSS as a variable. 5. Moved up TCP Equilibrium's definition from section 2 to Section 1. 6. Added a specific section for the methodology and that is the new Se= ction 3. 7. Re-arranged content and placed metrics in separate Section 4 (new s= ection). 8. Re-arranged content to add a specific section for the testing itsel= f and that is the new Section 5. Many thanks again to Lars for his excellent review and suggestions. Thanks, Barry --_000_94DEE80C63F7D34F9DC9FE69E39436BE398CC77C4FMILEXCH1dsjds_ Content-Type: text/html; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

Hello IPPM,

 

Draft 12 has been posted and the following revisions hav= e been incorporated as requested by Lars:

 

1.      Reduced the size of Section 3.

2.      Added explanations in Section 3.3.1 about the importance to have Send Buffer and = TCP RWND larger than BDP.  

3.      Completely removed the Traffic Management Tests section.

4.      Removed MSS as a variable.

5.      Moved up TCP Equilibrium’s definition from section 2 to Section 1.

6.      Added a specific section for the methodology and that is the new Section 3.<= /o:p>

7.      Re-arranged content and placed metrics in separate Section 4 (new section).<= /span>

8.      Re-arranged content to add a specific section for the testing itself and that is the ne= w Section 5.

 

Many thanks again to Lars for his excellent review and s= uggestions.

 

Thanks,

Barry

--_000_94DEE80C63F7D34F9DC9FE69E39436BE398CC77C4FMILEXCH1dsjds_-- From henk@ripe.net Thu Feb 24 01:06:03 2011 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ippm@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ippm@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 59F393A693F for ; Thu, 24 Feb 2011 01:06:03 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -102.581 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-102.581 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.018, BAYES_00=-2.599, USER_IN_WHITELIST=-100] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id xh4uuZMBMB5d for ; Thu, 24 Feb 2011 01:06:02 -0800 (PST) Received: from postgirl.ripe.net (postgirl.ipv6.ripe.net [IPv6:2001:610:240:11::c100:1342]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id E358A3A67E3 for ; Thu, 24 Feb 2011 01:06:01 -0800 (PST) Received: from ayeaye.ripe.net ([193.0.23.5]) by postgirl.ripe.net with esmtps (TLSv1:AES256-SHA:256) (Exim 4.72) (envelope-from ) id 1PsX9t-0003D2-5v for ippm@ietf.org; Thu, 24 Feb 2011 10:06:50 +0100 Received: from [193.0.21.124] (helo=guest133.guestnet.ripe.net) by ayeaye.ripe.net with esmtp (Exim 4.72) (envelope-from ) id 1PsX9s-0003c8-VA for ippm@ietf.org; Thu, 24 Feb 2011 10:06:49 +0100 Message-ID: <4D661FA8.5040401@ripe.net> Date: Thu, 24 Feb 2011 10:06:48 +0100 From: Henk Uijterwaal Organization: RIPE NCC User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Macintosh; U; Intel Mac OS X 10.6; en-GB; rv:1.9.2.13) Gecko/20101207 Lightning/1.0b2 Thunderbird/3.1.7 MIME-Version: 1.0 To: ippm@ietf.org References: <94DEE80C63F7D34F9DC9FE69E39436BE398CC77C4F@MILEXCH1.ds.jdsu.net> In-Reply-To: <94DEE80C63F7D34F9DC9FE69E39436BE398CC77C4F@MILEXCH1.ds.jdsu.net> X-Enigmail-Version: 1.1.1 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=windows-1252 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-RIPE-Spam-Level: -- X-RIPE-Spam-Report: Spam Total Points: -2.9 points pts rule name description ---- ---------------------- ------------------------------------ -1.0 ALL_TRUSTED Passed through trusted hosts only via SMTP -0.0 T_RP_MATCHES_RCVD Envelope sender domain matches handover relay domain -1.9 BAYES_00 BODY: Bayes spam probability is 0 to 1% [score: 0.0000] X-RIPE-Signature: e0cdef1f45f89a40ad608d255b27e7d5fab71df4a94d8948844ca2a28e5f7c9e Subject: Re: [ippm] draft-ietf-ippm-tcp-throughput-tm-12 X-BeenThere: ippm@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF IP Performance Metrics Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 24 Feb 2011 09:06:03 -0000 IPPM Group, This draft has gone to several revisions after it was submitted to the IESG in October and the content has improved as result. If you are interestsed in the topic, please review the current draft and post any issues to the list. Henk > Draft 12 has been posted and the following revisions have been incorporated as > requested by Lars: > > > > 1. Reduced the size of Section 3. > > 2. Added explanations in Section 3.3.1 about the importance to have Send > Buffer and TCP RWND larger than BDP. > > 3. Completely removed the Traffic Management Tests section. > > 4. Removed MSS as a variable. > > 5. Moved up TCP Equilibrium’s definition from section 2 to Section 1. > > 6. Added a specific section for the methodology and that is the new Section 3. > > 7. Re-arranged content and placed metrics in separate Section 4 (new section). > > 8. Re-arranged content to add a specific section for the testing itself and > that is the new Section 5. > > > > Many thanks again to Lars for his excellent review and suggestions. > > > > Thanks, > > Barry > > > > _______________________________________________ > ippm mailing list > ippm@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ippm -- ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ Henk Uijterwaal Email: henk.uijterwaal(at)ripe.net RIPE Network Coordination Centre http://www.xs4all.nl/~henku P.O.Box 10096 Singel 258 Phone: +31.20.5354414 1001 EB Amsterdam 1016 AB Amsterdam Fax: +31.20.5354445 The Netherlands The Netherlands Mobile: +31.6.55861746 ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ I confirm today what I denied yesterday. Anonymous Politician. From henk@ripe.net Fri Feb 25 00:09:24 2011 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ippm@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ippm@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id F0A4B3A6936 for ; Fri, 25 Feb 2011 00:09:24 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -102.582 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-102.582 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.017, BAYES_00=-2.599, USER_IN_WHITELIST=-100] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id uHmzbkmwIT7Q for ; Fri, 25 Feb 2011 00:09:24 -0800 (PST) Received: from postlady.ripe.net (postlady.ipv6.ripe.net [IPv6:2001:610:240:11::c100:1341]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9FB4B3A681C for ; Fri, 25 Feb 2011 00:09:23 -0800 (PST) Received: from dodo.ripe.net ([193.0.23.4]) by postlady.ripe.net with esmtps (TLSv1:AES256-SHA:256) (Exim 4.72) (envelope-from ) id 1Psskd-0001fH-GL for ippm@ietf.org; Fri, 25 Feb 2011 09:10:12 +0100 Received: from [193.0.21.124] (helo=guest133.guestnet.ripe.net) by dodo.ripe.net with esmtp (Exim 4.72) (envelope-from ) id 1Psskd-0003dr-Ce for ippm@ietf.org; Fri, 25 Feb 2011 09:10:11 +0100 Message-ID: <4D6763E3.5030306@ripe.net> Date: Fri, 25 Feb 2011 09:10:11 +0100 From: Henk Uijterwaal Organization: RIPE NCC User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Macintosh; U; Intel Mac OS X 10.6; en-GB; rv:1.9.2.13) Gecko/20101207 Lightning/1.0b2 Thunderbird/3.1.7 MIME-Version: 1.0 To: IETF IPPM WG X-Enigmail-Version: 1.1.1 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-RIPE-Spam-Level: -- X-RIPE-Spam-Report: Spam Total Points: -2.9 points pts rule name description ---- ---------------------- ------------------------------------ -1.0 ALL_TRUSTED Passed through trusted hosts only via SMTP -0.0 T_RP_MATCHES_RCVD Envelope sender domain matches handover relay domain -1.9 BAYES_00 BODY: Bayes spam probability is 0 to 1% [score: 0.0000] X-RIPE-Signature: e0cdef1f45f89a40ad608d255b27e7d5a9934568fb66fab6a2bf572790d62903 Subject: [ippm] Meeting in Prague X-BeenThere: ippm@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF IP Performance Metrics Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 25 Feb 2011 08:09:25 -0000 IPPM group, Our meeting in Prague will be on Thursday afternoon @ 17.40. As usual in the IETF, late agenda changes are possible and people should plan their travel accordingly. Henk -- ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ Henk Uijterwaal Email: henk.uijterwaal(at)ripe.net RIPE Network Coordination Centre http://www.xs4all.nl/~henku P.O.Box 10096 Singel 258 Phone: +31.20.5354414 1001 EB Amsterdam 1016 AB Amsterdam Fax: +31.20.5354445 The Netherlands The Netherlands Mobile: +31.6.55861746 ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ I confirm today what I denied yesterday. Anonymous Politician. From henk@ripe.net Fri Feb 25 01:37:47 2011 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ippm@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ippm@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6FF2A3A67E7; Fri, 25 Feb 2011 01:37:47 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -102.583 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-102.583 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.016, BAYES_00=-2.599, USER_IN_WHITELIST=-100] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id br-1Bg-Xf7Fz; Fri, 25 Feb 2011 01:37:42 -0800 (PST) Received: from postlady.ripe.net (postlady.ipv6.ripe.net [IPv6:2001:610:240:11::c100:1341]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id E88FB3A6947; Fri, 25 Feb 2011 01:37:41 -0800 (PST) Received: from dodo.ripe.net ([193.0.23.4]) by postlady.ripe.net with esmtps (TLSv1:AES256-SHA:256) (Exim 4.72) (envelope-from ) id 1Psu84-000387-IL; Fri, 25 Feb 2011 10:38:30 +0100 Received: from [193.0.21.124] (helo=guest133.guestnet.ripe.net) by dodo.ripe.net with esmtp (Exim 4.72) (envelope-from ) id 1Psu84-0001tX-4O; Fri, 25 Feb 2011 10:38:28 +0100 Message-ID: <4D677893.2050200@ripe.net> Date: Fri, 25 Feb 2011 10:38:27 +0100 From: Henk Uijterwaal Organization: RIPE NCC User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Macintosh; U; Intel Mac OS X 10.6; en-GB; rv:1.9.2.13) Gecko/20101207 Lightning/1.0b2 Thunderbird/3.1.7 MIME-Version: 1.0 To: IETF IPPM WG References: <4C7CBBFD.1030402@ripe.net> In-Reply-To: <4C7CBBFD.1030402@ripe.net> X-Enigmail-Version: 1.1.1 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-RIPE-Spam-Level: -- X-RIPE-Spam-Report: Spam Total Points: -2.9 points pts rule name description ---- ---------------------- ------------------------------------ -1.0 ALL_TRUSTED Passed through trusted hosts only via SMTP -0.0 T_RP_MATCHES_RCVD Envelope sender domain matches handover relay domain -1.9 BAYES_00 BODY: Bayes spam probability is 0 to 1% [score: 0.0000] X-RIPE-Signature: e0cdef1f45f89a40ad608d255b27e7d57ff7894f30da3286ec7367e0edd6838f Cc: tcpm@ietf.org Subject: [ippm] WGLC for draft-ietf-ippm-tcp-throughput-tm-06.txt X-BeenThere: ippm@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF IP Performance Metrics Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 25 Feb 2011 09:37:47 -0000 IPPM WG, This is a Working Group Last Call for the draft: TCP Throughput Testing Methodology draft-ietf-ippm-tcp-throughput-tm-12.txt The -07 version of this document has been submitted to IESG last October. Since then, there have been several reviews and a lot of text has been changed. Before proceeding, we think it is good that the WG looks at this document again. The TCPM WG is cc'd as some members of this group have been involved in the reviews. Please review the draft and raise any issues by Monday, March 28, 2011, 8:00 UTC. An URL for the draft is: http://www.ietf.org/id/draft-ietf-ippm-tcp-throughput-tm-12.txt (The date is intentional, if there are issues that require face-2-face discussion, we can do this in Prague). Matt & Henk -- ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ Henk Uijterwaal Email: henk.uijterwaal(at)ripe.net RIPE Network Coordination Centre http://www.xs4all.nl/~henku P.O.Box 10096 Singel 258 Phone: +31.20.5354414 1001 EB Amsterdam 1016 AB Amsterdam Fax: +31.20.5354445 The Netherlands The Netherlands Mobile: +31.6.55861746 ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ I confirm today what I denied yesterday. Anonymous Politician.