Subject: Re: CALL FOR CONSENSUS (was RE: [lemonade] on MTI conversions)

From: "Burger, Eric" <[email-masked]>
Date: Wed, 12 Apr 2006 06:48:07 -0400

Would character set conversions exercise parameters, as well?

 -----Original Message-----
From: 	Dave Cridland [mailto:[email-masked]]
Sent:	Tue Apr 11 18:23:21 2006
To:	Burger, Eric
Cc:	Enhancements to Internet email to support diverse service enivronments
Subject:	Re: CALL FOR CONSENSUS (was RE: [lemonade] on MTI conversions)

On Tue Apr 11 16:29:47 2006, Burger, Eric wrote:
> The "squared" problem is that unlike VPIM, where everyone was 
> building a
> voice messaging system, LEMONADE is addressing disparate markets.  
> What
> is interesting to the voice messaging folks, namely codec 
> transcoding,
> is of little interest to mobile folks, namely compressing/adapting 
> (read
> "downgrading") static content.  Moreover, compressing static 
> content is
> not of interest to the unified messaging folks.
> 
> 
I'm not entirely sure that's true. Mobile folk have limited sound 
codecs available, as Randy points out, and desktop folk on 
constrained bandwidth might want to use different codecs for content 
preview.

> Thus we looked for a transcoding operation that (1) would exercise 
> the
> transcoding mechanism, including the myriad transcoding parameters 
> and
> (2) would be generally useful to most or all of the target markets 
> for
> LEMONADE.  The solution we came up with is HTML to text.  This
> transformation is generally useful for the unified messaging and 
> mobile
> markets.  It is not quite as useful for the voice messaging folks, 
> but
> it is simple enough to implement that it should not be a burden.
> 
> 
I'm far from convinced that HTML to text is actually as useful as 
people apparently think it is. The only messages I find that don't 
come with a useful multipart/alternative are spam, anyway. (Perhaps 
I'm lucky). This looks to me like finding a transformation for the 
sake of it.

As an alternative, might I suggest character set transformations for 
text/plain? Server support for character sets can be - and often are 
- much wider than client support, especially for some of the more 
obscure character sets, such as TIS620 (Thai, still not shipped in 
Java, apparently) as an example. We could pick a selection of 
character sets as sources, and transform them to UTF-8.

In practise, I'd imagine most implementations would end up using 
iconv or similar, and therefore support a much wider set than the MTI 
set.

(The transformation I'd most want to use would be JFIF quality and 
resolution changes, however, which are much more interesting.)

> SPEAK NOW OR FOREVER HOLD YOUR PEACE: If you DISAGREE with this
> position, respond to the list by 29 April 2006 with:
> 	(1) Your Objection

text/html -> text/plain is mostly pointless.

> 	(2) Justification for the Objection

HTML has good support, and the majority of HTML messages have 
text/plain alternates which are as the author's system intended.

> 	(3) Concrete proposal that meets the constraints.
> 
> 
Character set conversion for text/plain parts from various character 
sets (iso-8859-*, various others) to UTF-8. This is very simple to 
implement on most (all?) platforms if we choose the source character 
sets carefully, and should be useful on most targets platforms.

Dave.
-- 
           You see things; and you say "Why?"
   But I dream things that never were; and I say "Why not?"
    - George Bernard Shaw
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---

From: Dave Cridland <[email-masked]>
Date: Wed, 12 Apr 2006 14:26:04 +0100

> Would character set conversions exercise parameters, as well?
It would only exercise parameters, in fact.

Dave.

---

From: "Stephane H. Maes" <[email-masked]>
Date: Wed, 12 Apr 2006 08:33:32 -0700

Noty the ones from STI I think

Stephane 

_____
Stephane H. Maes, PhD,
Director of Architecture, Mobile, Voice, and Communications Platforms, Oracle.
Ph: +1-203-300-7786 (mobile/SMS); Fax / Office UM: +1-650-607-6296
e-mail: [email-masked]
IM: shmaes (AIM/Y!/skype) or [email-masked] (MSN Messenger) or [email-masked] (Google)

-----Original Message-----
From: Dave Cridland [mailto:[email-masked]] 
Sent: Wednesday, April 12, 2006 6:26 AM
To: Burger, Eric
Cc: Enhancements to Internet email to support diverse service enivronments
Subject: Re: CALL FOR CONSENSUS (was RE: [lemonade] on MTI conversions)

Dave.