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For people who might not be following Message Organization BOF - this is 
now approved as a new Working Group.


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A new IETF working group has been formed in the Applications Area.  For
additional information, please contact the Area Directors or the WG
Chairs.

Message ORGanization (morg)
------------------------------------------
Last Modified: 2008-12-11

Current Status: Proposed Working Group

Chair(s):
Randall Gellens [randy@qualcomm.com]
Timo Sirainen [tss@iki.fi]

Applications Area Directors:
Chris Newman [chris.newman@sun.com]
Lisa Dusseault [lisa@osafoundation.org]

Application Area Advisor:
Chris Newman [chris.newman@sun.com]

Mailing Lists:
General Discussion: morg@ietf.org
To Subscribe: https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/morg
Archive: http://www.ietf.org/mail-archive/web/morg/current/maillist.html

Description:

The IETF Message Organization extensions Working Group will work on IMAP
extensions that improve clients' ability to find messages or groups of
messages in an IMAP mailstore. As a secondary goal, the WG will design
its extensions so as to minimize client/server round trips and bandwidth
overhead.

In particular the Working Group is chartered to finalize and publish the
following IMAP extensions as proposed standards:

(a) A SORT extension specifying new sort criteria for header fields
containing email addresses. This extension will be based on
draft-karp-morg-sortdisplay-00.txt.

(b) A SEARCH extension specifying new search criteria for header fields
containing email addresses.

(c) A LIST extension for returning STATUS information in LIST responses.
This extension will be based on
draft-melnikov-imapext-status-in-list-00.txt.

(d) An extension that formalizes a way to return message counters by
message context using STATUS and SEARCH commands.

(e) An extension that specifies Internet-search-engine-like searching.
Such searches would be more flexible (and less formally defined) than
substring-based searches, and may return their results in a significant
order. They may include "relevance" scores or similar information that
could be useful to the user.

(f) New collation algorithms such as "ignore whitespace" and "numeric,
ignoring punctuation". The WG group will determine which collations are
needed, taking into consideration the needs of the protocols that use
the collation framework.

(g) An extension that allows searching for messages within a message
thread. This extension will be based on
draft-gulbrandsen-imap-inthread-03.txt.

(h) An extension that allows searching of multiple mailboxes at the same
time (based on draft-melnikov-imapext-multimailbox-search-03.txt), or of
multiple mailbox views. The WG will determine which approach (mailboxes
or views) is more suitable as part of its work.

Additional documents may be added this list, but only via a charter
revision. There must also be demonstrable willingness in the IMAP
development community to actually implement a given extension before it
can be added to this charter.

Revising or replacing the base IMAP4rev1 specification (RFC 3501) is out
of the scope of this WG. This WG will ensure that all extensions it
proposes take into account any existing problems in the base
specification of IMAP, and do not make them worse nor make the problems
harder to address in the future.
====



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From lemonade-bounces@ietf.org  Fri Jan 16 04:13:56 2009
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From: Arnt Gulbrandsen <arnt@oryx.com>
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FWIW.

A friend who uses IMAP on his phone _all_ the time says that with his 
provider, he doesn't get TCP connection outages or IP address changes. 
If he loses coverage, there's 100% packet loss for a while, but the TCP 
connections aren't torn down and he gets the same IP address again 
after the outage. He's happy with the way IMAP works.

I'm happy that at least one telco has engineered its network to make 
existing software work well.

The provider is Deutsche Telekom's mobile subsidiary, whatever it's 
called right now.

Arnt
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From lemonade-bounces@ietf.org  Fri Jan 16 04:26:23 2009
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To: Arnt Gulbrandsen <arnt@oryx.com>
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Subject: Re: [lemonade] IMAP resume
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On Fri Jan 16 12:13:53 2009, Arnt Gulbrandsen wrote:
> FWIW.
> 
> A friend who uses IMAP on his phone _all_ the time says that with  
> his provider, he doesn't get TCP connection outages or IP address  
> changes. If he loses coverage, there's 100% packet loss for a  
> while, but the TCP connections aren't torn down and he gets the  
> same IP address again after the outage. He's happy with the way  
> IMAP works.
> 
> I'm happy that at least one telco has engineered its network to  
> make existing software work well.

I'm able to similarly hold an IMAP or XMPP connection through the  
(4-mile long) Severn tunnel using Orange's UK network, which  
certainly involves a tower-change.

Also, dormant connections don't appear to get severed.

It could be that I'm just not noticing the horror, or things might  
finally be improving.

Dave.
-- 
Dave Cridland - mailto:dave@cridland.net - xmpp:dwd@dave.cridland.net
  - acap://acap.dave.cridland.net/byowner/user/dwd/bookmarks/
  - http://dave.cridland.net/
Infotrope Polymer - ACAP, IMAP, ESMTP, and Lemonade
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Dave Cridland writes:
> things might  finally be improving.

On that note, happy new year to everyone!

Arnt
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From lemonade-bounces@ietf.org  Fri Jan 16 06:57:25 2009
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Subject: Re: [lemonade] IMAP resume
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> On Fri Jan 16 12:13:53 2009, Arnt Gulbrandsen wrote:
> > FWIW.
> >
> > A friend who uses IMAP on his phone _all_ the time says that with
> > his provider, he doesn't get TCP connection outages or IP address
> > changes. If he loses coverage, there's 100% packet loss for a
> > while, but the TCP connections aren't torn down and he gets the
> > same IP address again after the outage. He's happy with the way
> > IMAP works.
> >
> > I'm happy that at least one telco has engineered its network to
> > make existing software work well.

> I'm able to similarly hold an IMAP or XMPP connection through the
> (4-mile long) Severn tunnel using Orange's UK network, which
> certainly involves a tower-change.

FWIW, I recently switched data service providers and I immediately noticed
similar effects: Used to be when I lost my connection and got it back I'd
always have a different IP address. With the new service this no longer occurs.

> Also, dormant connections don't appear to get severed.

This, OTOH, is still a problem sometimes. And sometimes not - I can't quite
figure it out.

> It could be that I'm just not noticing the horror, or things might
> finally be improving.

Maybe. But keep in mind that the plural of anecdote is not data.

				Ned
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Subject: Re: [lemonade] Fwd: New Version Notification for
	draft-ncook-urlauth-accessid-00
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Although this is not a Work Group document, WG documents depend on it.  
Any comments at all, or at least a few OK +1's?

Thanks.

On Dec 8, 2008, at 4:04 PM, Neil Cook wrote:

> Folks,
>
> I've created a draft to allow new IMAP URL <access> identifiers and  
> <access> identifier prefixes to be created.
>
> Please take a look, as the new streaming draft depends on this draft.
>
> Neil
>
> Begin forwarded message:
>
>> From: IETF I-D Submission Tool <idsubmission@ietf.org>
>> Date: 8 December 2008 18:39:40 GMT
>> To: neil.cook@noware.co.uk
>> Subject: New Version Notification for draft-ncook-urlauth-accessid-00
>>
>>
>> A new version of I-D, draft-ncook-urlauth-accessid-00.txt has been  
>> successfuly submitted by Neil Cook and posted to the IETF repository.
>>
>> Filename:	 draft-ncook-urlauth-accessid
>> Revision:	 00
>> Title:		 Internet Message Access Protocol (IMAP) - URL Access  
>> Identifier Extension
>> Creation_date:	 2008-12-08
>> WG ID:		 Independent Submission
>> Number_of_pages: 9
>>
>> Abstract:
>> The existing IMAP URL specification (RFC5092) lists several <access>
>> identifiers and <access> identifier prefixes, that can be used to
>> restrict access to URLAUTH-generated URLs.  However, these
>> identifiers do not provide facilities for new services such as
>> streaming.  This document proposes a set of new <access> identifiers
>> as well as an IANA mechanism to register new <access> identifiers for
>> future applications.
>>
>>
>>
>> The IETF Secretariat.
>>
>
> _______________________________________________
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+1.

On Sun Jan 18 2009 13:39:09 GMT-0800 (PST), Eric Burger
<eburger@standardstrack.com> wrote:

> Although this is not a Work Group document, WG documents depend on it.
> Any comments at all, or at least a few OK +1's?
> 
> Thanks.
> 
> On Dec 8, 2008, at 4:04 PM, Neil Cook wrote:
> 
>> Folks,
>>
>> I've created a draft to allow new IMAP URL <access> identifiers and
>> <access> identifier prefixes to be created.
>>
>> Please take a look, as the new streaming draft depends on this draft.
>>
>> Neil
>>
>> Begin forwarded message:
>>
>>> From: IETF I-D Submission Tool <idsubmission@ietf.org>
>>> Date: 8 December 2008 18:39:40 GMT
>>> To: neil.cook@noware.co.uk
>>> Subject: New Version Notification for draft-ncook-urlauth-accessid-00
>>>
>>>
>>> A new version of I-D, draft-ncook-urlauth-accessid-00.txt has been
>>> successfuly submitted by Neil Cook and posted to the IETF repository.
>>>
>>> Filename:     draft-ncook-urlauth-accessid
>>> Revision:     00
>>> Title:         Internet Message Access Protocol (IMAP) - URL Access
>>> Identifier Extension
>>> Creation_date:     2008-12-08
>>> WG ID:         Independent Submission
>>> Number_of_pages: 9
>>>
>>> Abstract:
>>> The existing IMAP URL specification (RFC5092) lists several <access>
>>> identifiers and <access> identifier prefixes, that can be used to
>>> restrict access to URLAUTH-generated URLs.  However, these
>>> identifiers do not provide facilities for new services such as
>>> streaming.  This document proposes a set of new <access> identifiers
>>> as well as an IANA mechanism to register new <access> identifiers for
>>> future applications.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> The IETF Secretariat.
>>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> lemonade mailing list
>> lemonade@ietf.org
>> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/lemonade
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> 
> 
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
> 
> _______________________________________________
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-- 
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Eric Burger writes:
> Although this is not a Work Group document, WG documents depend on it. 
> Any comments at all, or at least a few OK +1's?

OK.

One comment: Section 3.3 says "the requirements are the same as ..." but 
then goes on to repeat them all. I'd prefer to leave out the repeated 
text, just so no unintentional differences sneak in.

Arnt
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Arnt,

well I'm updating the doc at the moment, and I'm going to be including  
IANA definitions for the existing access identifiers anyway (as when  
establishing a new registry, you need all the existing definitions to  
be defined), so I think for clarity it might help to have the  
requirements/definitions as well - this doc will formally update the  
IMAPURL RFC.

Neil

On 19 Jan 2009, at 15:02, Arnt Gulbrandsen wrote:

> Eric Burger writes:
>> Although this is not a Work Group document, WG documents depend on  
>> it. Any comments at all, or at least a few OK +1's?
>
> OK.
>
> One comment: Section 3.3 says "the requirements are the same as ..."  
> but then goes on to repeat them all. I'd prefer to leave out the  
> repeated text, just so no unintentional differences sneak in.
>
> Arnt
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Neil Cook writes:
> well I'm updating the doc at the moment, and I'm going to be including 
>  IANA definitions for the existing access identifiers anyway (as when 
>  establishing a new registry, you need all the existing definitions 
> to  be defined), so I think for clarity it might help to have the  
> requirements/definitions as well - this doc will formally update the  
> IMAPURL RFC.

In that case, maybe you ought to say something like "these rules are 
meant to be a straightforward extension of the ones in the IMAPURL RFC, 
but if there's anydifference, these rules apply, not the older ones 
from IMAPURL"

Arnt
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Sounds fine, will do something along those lines,

Neil

On 19 Jan 2009, at 15:29, Arnt Gulbrandsen wrote:

> Neil Cook writes:
>> well I'm updating the doc at the moment, and I'm going to be  
>> including  IANA definitions for the existing access identifiers  
>> anyway (as when  establishing a new registry, you need all the  
>> existing definitions to  be defined), so I think for clarity it  
>> might help to have the  requirements/definitions as well - this doc  
>> will formally update the  IMAPURL RFC.
>
> In that case, maybe you ought to say something like "these rules are  
> meant to be a straightforward extension of the ones in the IMAPURL  
> RFC, but if there's anydifference, these rules apply, not the older  
> ones from IMAPURL"
>
> Arnt

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new version of the access id registration draft, with IANA entries for  
the existing IMAP URL <access> identifiers/prefixes defined in RFC 5092.

Neil

Begin forwarded message:

> From: IETF I-D Submission Tool <idsubmission@ietf.org>
> Date: 21 January 2009 15:45:09 GMT
> To: neil.cook@noware.co.uk
> Subject: New Version Notification for draft-ncook-urlauth-accessid-01
>
>
> A new version of I-D, draft-ncook-urlauth-accessid-01.txt has been  
> successfuly submitted by Neil Cook and posted to the IETF repository.
>
> Filename:	 draft-ncook-urlauth-accessid
> Revision:	 01
> Title:		 Internet Message Access Protocol (IMAP) - URL Access  
> Identifier Extension
> Creation_date:	 2009-01-21
> WG ID:		 Independent Submission
> Number_of_pages: 10
>
> Abstract:
> The existing IMAP URL specification (RFC 5092) lists several <access>
> identifiers and <access> identifier prefixes, that can be used to
> restrict access to URLAUTH-generated URLs.  However, these
> identifiers do not provide facilities for new services such as
> streaming.  This document proposes a set of new <access> identifiers
> as well as an IANA mechanism to register new <access> identifiers for
> future applications.
>
> This document updates RFC 5092.
>
>
>
> The IETF Secretariat.
>

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A New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line Internet-Drafts directories.
This draft is a work item of the Enhancements to Internet email to Support Diverse Service Environments Working Group of the IETF.


	Title           : Streaming Internet Messaging Attachments
	Author(s)       : N. Cook
	Filename        : draft-ietf-lemonade-streaming-09.txt
	Pages           : 32
	Date            : 2009-01-21

This document describes a method for streaming multimedia attachments
received by a resource constrained and/or mobile device from an IMAP
server.  It allows such clients, which often have limits in storage
space and bandwidth, to play video and audio e-mail content.

The document describes a profile for making use of the URLAUTH
authorized IMAP URLs (RFC 5092), the Network Announcement SIP Media
Service (RFC 4240), and the Media Server Control Markup Language (RFC
5022).

A URL for this Internet-Draft is:
http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-ietf-lemonade-streaming-09.txt

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draft-ncook-urlauth-accessid is not a Work Group document. However,  
streaming is, and it depends on accessid.  So, consider this a WGLC on  
accessid, even if unofficial.

Thanks.
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From lemonade-bounces@ietf.org  Mon Jan 26 02:39:03 2009
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Subject: Re: [lemonade] Pseudo-WGLC: urlauth-accessid
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Eric Burger wrote:

> draft-ncook-urlauth-accessid is not a Work Group document. However,  
> streaming is, and it depends on accessid.  So, consider this a WGLC 
> on  accessid, even if unofficial. 

The recent version looks good, it addresses most (if not all) of my 
comments.
Some minor tweaks I would suggest are:

In Section 6 (IANA Considerations), insert a new sentence at the 
beginning, something like:

   IANA is requested to create a new registry for IMAP URLAUTH access 
identifiers and prefixes.

In the second paragraph of this section: typo in "IANA".

In the Contact field of all registrations I would add email address of 
the Lemonade mailing list. (Neil, are you sure you want to answer 
questions about registrations?)

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From lemonade-bounces@ietf.org  Mon Jan 26 03:11:45 2009
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Agree with all of these,

Neil

On 26 Jan 2009, at 10:38, Alexey Melnikov wrote:

> Eric Burger wrote:
>
>> draft-ncook-urlauth-accessid is not a Work Group document.  
>> However,  streaming is, and it depends on accessid.  So, consider  
>> this a WGLC on  accessid, even if unofficial.
>
> The recent version looks good, it addresses most (if not all) of my  
> comments.
> Some minor tweaks I would suggest are:
>
> In Section 6 (IANA Considerations), insert a new sentence at the  
> beginning, something like:
>
>  IANA is requested to create a new registry for IMAP URLAUTH access  
> identifiers and prefixes.
>
> In the second paragraph of this section: typo in "IANA".
>
> In the Contact field of all registrations I would add email address  
> of the Lemonade mailing list. (Neil, are you sure you want to answer  
> questions about registrations?)
>
> _______________________________________________
> lemonade mailing list
> lemonade@ietf.org
> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/lemonade
> Supplemental Web Site:
> http://www.standardstrack.com/ietf/lemonade

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