From exim@www1.ietf.org Thu Feb 5 12:59:31 2004 Received: from optimus.ietf.org (optimus.ietf.org [132.151.1.19]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id MAA26054 for ; Thu, 5 Feb 2004 12:59:31 -0500 (EST) Received: from localhost.localdomain ([127.0.0.1] helo=www1.ietf.org) by optimus.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.20) id 1AonmK-0002Ug-5d for mobopts-archive@odin.ietf.org; Thu, 05 Feb 2004 12:59:04 -0500 Received: (from exim@localhost) by www1.ietf.org (8.12.8/8.12.8/Submit) id i15Hx4r7009582 for mobopts-archive@odin.ietf.org; Thu, 5 Feb 2004 12:59:04 -0500 Received: from odin.ietf.org ([132.151.1.176] helo=ietf.org) by optimus.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.20) id 1AonmK-0002UT-0K for mobopts-web-archive@optimus.ietf.org; Thu, 05 Feb 2004 12:59:04 -0500 Received: from ietf-mx (ietf-mx.ietf.org [132.151.6.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id MAA26027 for ; Thu, 5 Feb 2004 12:59:00 -0500 (EST) Received: from ietf-mx ([132.151.6.1]) by ietf-mx with esmtp (Exim 4.12) id 1AonmI-0002K4-00 for mobopts-web-archive@irtf.org; Thu, 05 Feb 2004 12:59:02 -0500 Received: from exim by ietf-mx with spam-scanned (Exim 4.12) id 1AonlJ-0002Eu-00 for mobopts-web-archive@irtf.org; Thu, 05 Feb 2004 12:58:02 -0500 Received: from optimus.ietf.org ([132.151.1.19]) by ietf-mx with esmtp (Exim 4.12) id 1AonkK-00027M-00 for mobopts-web-archive@irtf.org; Thu, 05 Feb 2004 12:57:00 -0500 Received: from localhost.localdomain ([127.0.0.1] helo=www1.ietf.org) by optimus.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.20) id 1AonkK-0002KK-W4; Thu, 05 Feb 2004 12:57:00 -0500 Received: from odin.ietf.org ([132.151.1.176] helo=ietf.org) by optimus.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.20) id 1AonjR-0002JI-Pq for mobopts@optimus.ietf.org; Thu, 05 Feb 2004 12:56:05 -0500 Received: from ietf-mx (ietf-mx.ietf.org [132.151.6.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id MAA25909 for ; Thu, 5 Feb 2004 12:56:02 -0500 (EST) Received: from ietf-mx ([132.151.6.1]) by ietf-mx with esmtp (Exim 4.12) id 1AonjQ-00024z-00 for mobopts@irtf.org; Thu, 05 Feb 2004 12:56:04 -0500 Received: from exim by ietf-mx with spam-scanned (Exim 4.12) id 1AoniW-0001zu-00 for mobopts@irtf.org; Thu, 05 Feb 2004 12:55:08 -0500 Received: from key1.docomolabs-usa.com ([216.98.102.225] helo=fridge.docomolabs-usa.com ident=fwuser) by ietf-mx with esmtp (Exim 4.12) id 1Aonha-0001tq-00; Thu, 05 Feb 2004 12:54:10 -0500 Message-ID: <025e01c3ec11$1cee6310$936015ac@dclkempt40> From: "James Kempf" To: "Seok J. Koh" , "gabriel montenegro" , Cc: References: <40215BCA.1050001@sun.com> <001901c3eb7b$8068ea50$0f70fe81@LocalHost> Date: Thu, 5 Feb 2004 09:54:33 -0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="Windows-1252" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: [Mobopts] Re: [Mipshop] update and thoughts on Korea agenda Sender: mobopts-admin@ietf.org Errors-To: mobopts-admin@ietf.org X-BeenThere: mobopts@irtf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.12 Precedence: bulk List-Unsubscribe: , List-Id: IP Mobility Optimizations List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.60 (1.212-2003-09-23-exp) on ietf-mx.ietf.org X-Spam-Status: No, hits=1.2 required=5.0 tests=AWL,OPT_HEADER autolearn=no version=2.60 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit I believe that the MIPSHOP WG should finish its charter and disband. There is no dishonor in completing the job that we set out to accomplish and moving on, in fact, I believe the IESG would view it as a very positive accomplishment. In my opinion, most of the open questions involved in engineering a modular, well designed suite of protocols to support local link handover in IP require some intensive thought and architectural discussion, then a round of implementation and experiment to determine which of several proposals work best, because there will inevitably be several proposals, and in the few remaining cases where MIPSHOP might do work, there already are. Accomplishing this kind of experimental/research work in an atmosphere of scientific and engineering objectivity is impossible in IETF, as the history of the development of local link handover support has shown. The whole point of forming the MOBOPTS RG was to provide a venue where this kind of work could be done. When we have agreement in MOBOPTS that the research questions are answered, we can re-introduce the protocols into IETF and then have a much better chance of achieving concensus, because we will have answered the big research questions first. As for proposals to introduce other topics, such as location privacy, I believe if people want to do work on these in IETF, then a BOF should be organized. In fact (since I am interested in location privacy myself), I'd be happy to help organize a BOF if people want. In summary, I think the IETF mobility community should take any further work on local link handover for IP to MOBOPTS, and work hard to make MOBOPTS a success. It was specifically formed to tackle further development of local link handover for IP. jak ----- Original Message ----- From: "Seok J. Koh" To: "gabriel montenegro" ; Sent: Wednesday, February 04, 2004 4:03 PM Subject: Re: [Mipshop] update and thoughts on Korea agenda > One of the promising items for discussion in the meeting is > the next step of the MIPSHOP WG. > > We have now been completing a few urgent jobs including FMIPv6 & HMIPv6. > I think, for the fulfillment of MIPSHOP work goal, we need to address and > review a couple of additional items before wrapping up the WG, > which may be selected among the individual I-Ds so far discussed > on the mobileip or mipshop mailing lists. > > It does not mean to touch the advanced or innovative approaches like "L3 mobility". > Those may be addressed in the IRTF. I mean some more additional items > closely related to the FMIPv6 and/or HMIPv6. > I think the FMIP-over-802.11 is one of them, which was already agreed in the group, and > the F-HMIPv6 is also another candidate for that. > > How about asking the people about the candidate additional items for MIPSHOP WG. > And discuss the next step of MIPSHOP and then select appropriate items for further work, if agreed. > > This meeting is just the 3rd meeting of MIPSHOP officially. > I do not think the lifespan of the MIPSHOP will be so short :-) > > Seok > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "gabriel montenegro" > To: > Sent: Thursday, February 05, 2004 5:53 AM > Subject: [Mipshop] update and thoughts on Korea agenda > > > > Today I submitted the latest version of LMM to the IESG for > > consideration as informational rfc. > > > > I'm also wondering of whether we should meet in Korea, and if so, what > > the agenda might be. > > Any suggestions? HMIPv6 and FMIPv6 have also undergone WG last call and > > should be going > > soon to the IESG. I'm not sure there will be yet much feedback (or even > > if the corresponding > > IETF last call will have started). Pete McCann is preparing the next > > version of the FMIP-over-802.11 > > draft, perhaps there will be something to discuss there. Pete? > > > > I have asked for a 1 hour slot in Korea, but would like to solicit the > > opinions of the WG on this > > matter. > > > > thanks, > > > > -gabriel > > > > > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > Mipshop mailing list > > Mipshop@ietf.org > > https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/mipshop > > > > _______________________________________________ > Mipshop mailing list > Mipshop@ietf.org > https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/mipshop > _______________________________________________ Mobopts mailing list Mobopts@irtf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/mobopts From exim@www1.ietf.org Thu Feb 5 13:49:47 2004 Received: from optimus.ietf.org (optimus.ietf.org [132.151.1.19]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id NAA28433 for ; Thu, 5 Feb 2004 13:49:47 -0500 (EST) Received: from localhost.localdomain ([127.0.0.1] helo=www1.ietf.org) by optimus.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.20) id 1AooYx-0006tp-1X for mobopts-archive@odin.ietf.org; Thu, 05 Feb 2004 13:49:19 -0500 Received: (from exim@localhost) by www1.ietf.org (8.12.8/8.12.8/Submit) id i15InJHV026515 for mobopts-archive@odin.ietf.org; Thu, 5 Feb 2004 13:49:19 -0500 Received: from odin.ietf.org ([132.151.1.176] helo=ietf.org) by optimus.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.20) id 1AooYw-0006ta-R7 for mobopts-web-archive@optimus.ietf.org; Thu, 05 Feb 2004 13:49:18 -0500 Received: from ietf-mx (ietf-mx.ietf.org [132.151.6.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id NAA28407 for ; Thu, 5 Feb 2004 13:49:16 -0500 (EST) Received: from ietf-mx ([132.151.6.1]) by ietf-mx with esmtp (Exim 4.12) id 1AooYu-0000Ez-00 for mobopts-web-archive@irtf.org; Thu, 05 Feb 2004 13:49:16 -0500 Received: from exim by ietf-mx with spam-scanned (Exim 4.12) id 1AooXy-00008Y-00 for mobopts-web-archive@irtf.org; Thu, 05 Feb 2004 13:48:18 -0500 Received: from optimus.ietf.org ([132.151.1.19]) by ietf-mx with esmtp (Exim 4.12) id 1AooXg-00001y-00 for mobopts-web-archive@irtf.org; Thu, 05 Feb 2004 13:48:00 -0500 Received: from localhost.localdomain ([127.0.0.1] helo=www1.ietf.org) by optimus.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.20) id 1AooXh-0006L5-Vk; Thu, 05 Feb 2004 13:48:01 -0500 Received: from odin.ietf.org ([132.151.1.176] helo=ietf.org) by optimus.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.20) id 1AooWs-0006JQ-2i for mobopts@optimus.ietf.org; Thu, 05 Feb 2004 13:47:10 -0500 Received: from ietf-mx (ietf-mx.ietf.org [132.151.6.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id NAA28269 for ; Thu, 5 Feb 2004 13:47:08 -0500 (EST) Received: from ietf-mx ([132.151.6.1]) by ietf-mx with esmtp (Exim 4.12) id 1AooWp-0007nj-00 for mobopts@irtf.org; Thu, 05 Feb 2004 13:47:07 -0500 Received: from exim by ietf-mx with spam-scanned (Exim 4.12) id 1AooVy-0007iD-00 for mobopts@irtf.org; Thu, 05 Feb 2004 13:46:15 -0500 Received: from key1.docomolabs-usa.com ([216.98.102.225] helo=fridge.docomolabs-usa.com ident=fwuser) by ietf-mx with esmtp (Exim 4.12) id 1AooVD-0007cS-00; Thu, 05 Feb 2004 13:45:28 -0500 Message-ID: <02e401c3ec18$47d27150$936015ac@dclkempt40> From: "James Kempf" To: "Jean-Michel COMBES" , "Seok J. Koh" , "gabriel montenegro" , Cc: References: Date: Thu, 5 Feb 2004 10:45:50 -0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="Windows-1252" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: [Mobopts] Re: [Mipshop] update and thoughts on Korea agenda Sender: mobopts-admin@ietf.org Errors-To: mobopts-admin@ietf.org X-BeenThere: mobopts@irtf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.12 Precedence: bulk List-Unsubscribe: , List-Id: IP Mobility Optimizations List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.60 (1.212-2003-09-23-exp) on ietf-mx.ietf.org X-Spam-Status: No, hits=1.3 required=5.0 tests=AWL,OPT_HEADER autolearn=no version=2.60 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit > What do you mean by 'location privacy'? > - Revision of RFC 3041 (but it's an IPv6 WG's goal) ? > - RFC 3041-bis mobility based ? > - other ? > No idea. Location privacy was brought up as a possible topic in Minneapolis. Presumably, a BOF would discuss this in more detail. jak _______________________________________________ Mobopts mailing list Mobopts@irtf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/mobopts From exim@www1.ietf.org Thu Feb 5 15:03:56 2004 Received: from optimus.ietf.org (optimus.ietf.org [132.151.1.19]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id PAA01947 for ; Thu, 5 Feb 2004 15:03:56 -0500 (EST) Received: from localhost.localdomain ([127.0.0.1] helo=www1.ietf.org) by optimus.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.20) id 1Aopii-0006Ac-17 for mobopts-archive@odin.ietf.org; Thu, 05 Feb 2004 15:03:29 -0500 Received: (from exim@localhost) by www1.ietf.org (8.12.8/8.12.8/Submit) id i15K3S7v023717 for mobopts-archive@odin.ietf.org; Thu, 5 Feb 2004 15:03:28 -0500 Received: from odin.ietf.org ([132.151.1.176] helo=ietf.org) by optimus.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.20) id 1Aopih-0006A1-Py for mobopts-web-archive@optimus.ietf.org; Thu, 05 Feb 2004 15:03:27 -0500 Received: from ietf-mx (ietf-mx.ietf.org [132.151.6.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id PAA01882 for ; Thu, 5 Feb 2004 15:03:24 -0500 (EST) Received: from ietf-mx ([132.151.6.1]) by ietf-mx with esmtp (Exim 4.12) id 1Aopie-00003l-00 for mobopts-web-archive@irtf.org; Thu, 05 Feb 2004 15:03:25 -0500 Received: from exim by ietf-mx with spam-scanned (Exim 4.12) id 1Aophj-0007kY-00 for mobopts-web-archive@irtf.org; Thu, 05 Feb 2004 15:02:27 -0500 Received: from optimus.ietf.org ([132.151.1.19]) by ietf-mx with esmtp (Exim 4.12) id 1AophH-0007dM-00 for mobopts-web-archive@irtf.org; Thu, 05 Feb 2004 15:01:59 -0500 Received: from localhost.localdomain ([127.0.0.1] helo=www1.ietf.org) by optimus.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.20) id 1AophK-0004li-0J; Thu, 05 Feb 2004 15:02:02 -0500 Received: from odin.ietf.org ([132.151.1.176] helo=ietf.org) by optimus.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.20) id 1Aopgc-00044k-CA for mobopts@optimus.ietf.org; Thu, 05 Feb 2004 15:01:18 -0500 Received: from ietf-mx (ietf-mx.ietf.org [132.151.6.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id PAA01791 for ; Thu, 5 Feb 2004 15:01:15 -0500 (EST) Received: from ietf-mx ([132.151.6.1]) by ietf-mx with esmtp (Exim 4.12) id 1AopgZ-0007bu-00 for mobopts@irtf.org; Thu, 05 Feb 2004 15:01:15 -0500 Received: from exim by ietf-mx with spam-scanned (Exim 4.12) id 1Aopfh-0007WC-00 for mobopts@irtf.org; Thu, 05 Feb 2004 15:00:21 -0500 Received: from darkstar.iprg.nokia.com ([205.226.5.69]) by ietf-mx with esmtp (Exim 4.12) id 1Aopeu-0007JQ-00; Thu, 05 Feb 2004 14:59:32 -0500 Received: (from root@localhost) by darkstar.iprg.nokia.com (8.11.0/8.11.0-DARKSTAR) id i15Jwo925371; Thu, 5 Feb 2004 11:58:50 -0800 X-mProtect: <200402051958> Nokia Silicon Valley Messaging Protection Received: from rajeev.iprg.nokia.com (205.226.2.90, claiming to be "iprg.nokia.com") by darkstar.iprg.nokia.com smtpdraBGcO; Thu, 05 Feb 2004 11:58:47 PST Message-ID: <4022A06C.9746CF5C@iprg.nokia.com> Date: Thu, 05 Feb 2004 11:58:36 -0800 From: Rajeev Koodli Organization: Nokia Research Center X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.7 [en] (X11; I; FreeBSD 3.4-RELEASE i386) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: James Kempf CC: "Seok J. Koh" , gabriel montenegro , mipshop@ietf.org, mobopts@irtf.org Subject: Re: [Mobopts] Re: [Mipshop] update and thoughts on Korea agenda References: <40215BCA.1050001@sun.com> <001901c3eb7b$8068ea50$0f70fe81@LocalHost> <025e01c3ec11$1cee6310$936015ac@dclkempt40> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: mobopts-admin@ietf.org Errors-To: mobopts-admin@ietf.org X-BeenThere: mobopts@irtf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.12 Precedence: bulk List-Unsubscribe: , List-Id: IP Mobility Optimizations List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.60 (1.212-2003-09-23-exp) on ietf-mx.ietf.org X-Spam-Status: No, hits=1.7 required=5.0 tests=AWL,OPT_HEADER autolearn=no version=2.60 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit > > In summary, I think the IETF mobility community should take any further work > on local link handover for IP to MOBOPTS, and work hard to make MOBOPTS a > success. It was specifically formed to tackle further development of local > link handover for IP. > I agree that further enhancements to handover need better understanding. I hope we can make use of Mobopts to foster this interest. I think the work there will be able to spawn new standardization in IETF. -Rajeev > > jak > _______________________________________________ Mobopts mailing list Mobopts@irtf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/mobopts From exim@www1.ietf.org Fri Feb 6 11:16:15 2004 Received: from optimus.ietf.org (optimus.ietf.org [132.151.1.19]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id LAA02928 for ; Fri, 6 Feb 2004 11:16:15 -0500 (EST) Received: from localhost.localdomain ([127.0.0.1] helo=www1.ietf.org) by optimus.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.20) id 1Ap8dv-0006To-EE for mobopts-archive@odin.ietf.org; Fri, 06 Feb 2004 11:15:47 -0500 Received: (from exim@localhost) by www1.ietf.org (8.12.8/8.12.8/Submit) id i16GFlpD024902 for mobopts-archive@odin.ietf.org; Fri, 6 Feb 2004 11:15:47 -0500 Received: from odin.ietf.org ([132.151.1.176] helo=ietf.org) by optimus.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.20) id 1Ap8dv-0006TZ-8x for mobopts-web-archive@optimus.ietf.org; Fri, 06 Feb 2004 11:15:47 -0500 Received: from ietf-mx (ietf-mx.ietf.org [132.151.6.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id LAA02905 for ; Fri, 6 Feb 2004 11:15:44 -0500 (EST) Received: from ietf-mx ([132.151.6.1]) by ietf-mx with esmtp (Exim 4.12) id 1Ap8du-0007Rz-00 for mobopts-web-archive@irtf.org; Fri, 06 Feb 2004 11:15:46 -0500 Received: from exim by ietf-mx with spam-scanned (Exim 4.12) id 1Ap8d0-0007Ox-00 for mobopts-web-archive@irtf.org; Fri, 06 Feb 2004 11:14:51 -0500 Received: from optimus.ietf.org ([132.151.1.19]) by ietf-mx with esmtp (Exim 4.12) id 1Ap8cD-0007Lt-00 for mobopts-web-archive@irtf.org; Fri, 06 Feb 2004 11:14:01 -0500 Received: from localhost.localdomain ([127.0.0.1] helo=www1.ietf.org) by optimus.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.20) id 1Ap8cD-0006Lz-Av; Fri, 06 Feb 2004 11:14:01 -0500 Received: from odin.ietf.org ([132.151.1.176] helo=ietf.org) by optimus.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.20) id 1Ap8cB-0006Lg-Tn for mobopts@optimus.ietf.org; Fri, 06 Feb 2004 11:14:00 -0500 Received: from ietf-mx (ietf-mx.ietf.org [132.151.6.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id LAA02827 for ; Fri, 6 Feb 2004 11:13:57 -0500 (EST) Received: from ietf-mx ([132.151.6.1]) by ietf-mx with esmtp (Exim 4.12) id 1Ap8cB-0007LX-00 for mobopts@irtf.org; Fri, 06 Feb 2004 11:13:59 -0500 Received: from exim by ietf-mx with spam-scanned (Exim 4.12) id 1Ap8bF-0007HX-00 for mobopts@irtf.org; Fri, 06 Feb 2004 11:13:02 -0500 Received: from key1.docomolabs-usa.com ([216.98.102.225] helo=fridge.docomolabs-usa.com ident=fwuser) by ietf-mx with esmtp (Exim 4.12) id 1Ap8at-0007DE-00; Fri, 06 Feb 2004 11:12:39 -0500 Message-ID: <000f01c3eccc$1bbe84a0$936015ac@dclkempt40> From: "James Kempf" To: "Seok J. Koh" , "gabriel montenegro" , Cc: References: <40215BCA.1050001@sun.com> <001901c3eb7b$8068ea50$0f70fe81@LocalHost> <025e01c3ec11$1cee6310$936015ac@dclkempt40> <00f501c3ec48$9a15db70$0f70fe81@LocalHost> Date: Fri, 6 Feb 2004 08:13:03 -0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="Windows-1252" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: [Mobopts] Re: [Mipshop] update and thoughts on Korea agenda Sender: mobopts-admin@ietf.org Errors-To: mobopts-admin@ietf.org X-BeenThere: mobopts@irtf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.12 Precedence: bulk List-Unsubscribe: , List-Id: IP Mobility Optimizations List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.60 (1.212-2003-09-23-exp) on ietf-mx.ietf.org X-Spam-Status: No, hits=1.3 required=5.0 tests=AWL,OPT_HEADER autolearn=no version=2.60 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit > There seems to be somewhat different views between us on MIPSHOP WG and MOBOPTS RG. > Basically, I think, the MOBOPTS RG will touch the advanced and substantial issues > on Mobility Optimization, which may include the re-consideration of FMIP and HMIP > with the different views and approaches from the works made so far. > > What I'm saying as additional items for further consideration in the MIPSHOP > is the works that are just based on the current FMIPv6 and HMIPv6, > for examples, how we could use the FMIPv6 and/or HMIPv6. > I think the FMIP-over-WLAN issue is in that category, and > the F-HMIPv6 will be in the same line with the FMIP-over-WLAN. > Both are for addressing how to use the existing FMIP and HMIP, > not changing or advancing them, I believe. > HMIP and FMIP are on track to become Experimental drafts. As such, any further work on them should be considered experimental, and therefore material for the RG. The purpose of the RG is to continue work on these protocols and others involved in local subnet IP handover (I'm thinking here of Seamoby CARD and CTP, which are also Experimental and were also recently sent to the IESG) until the problem of local subnet IP handover is well enough understood that it can be taken back to the IETF for standardization. This might include some redesign or enhancement of the protocols, and I believe it should include collecting data and analyzing the behavior of the protocols under a variety of different link and prototype network deployment conditions. The reason I think this is necessary is because local link handover is something new to IETF, unlike, for example, congestion control which is very well understood and has been a topic of investigation in IETF for many years. I believe that the discussion in the MIP and Seamoby groups about these protocols was lacking in basic understanding about the physics of local link handover and that this lack of understanding led to basic disagreements about the architecture and design of the protocols that made i t hard to reach concensus about what would be the best design (and I'm including myself in the people who were not well informed). If we can come to the same kind of concensus about the basic architecture and design of local link handover that the Transport guys have about congestion control, it will make coming to concensus in IETF about the details of the protocol standards much simpler. I don't see the RG doing advanced research on mobility that is beyond the bounds of understanding local subnet IP handover necessary for coming up with a standard, in fact, the charter for the RG specifically rules it out. jak _______________________________________________ Mobopts mailing list Mobopts@irtf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/mobopts From exim@www1.ietf.org Mon Feb 9 19:54:11 2004 Received: from optimus.ietf.org (optimus.ietf.org [132.151.1.19]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id TAA07209 for ; Mon, 9 Feb 2004 19:54:11 -0500 (EST) Received: from localhost.localdomain ([127.0.0.1] helo=www1.ietf.org) by optimus.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.20) id 1AqM9m-0007rl-TJ for mobopts-archive@odin.ietf.org; Mon, 09 Feb 2004 19:53:43 -0500 Received: (from exim@localhost) by www1.ietf.org (8.12.8/8.12.8/Submit) id i1A0rglV030233 for mobopts-archive@odin.ietf.org; Mon, 9 Feb 2004 19:53:42 -0500 Received: from odin.ietf.org ([132.151.1.176] helo=ietf.org) by optimus.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.20) id 1AqM9m-0007rY-Oo for mobopts-web-archive@optimus.ietf.org; Mon, 09 Feb 2004 19:53:42 -0500 Received: from ietf-mx (ietf-mx.ietf.org [132.151.6.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id TAA07188 for ; Mon, 9 Feb 2004 19:53:40 -0500 (EST) Received: from ietf-mx ([132.151.6.1]) by ietf-mx with esmtp (Exim 4.12) id 1AqM9k-0004EH-00 for mobopts-web-archive@irtf.org; Mon, 09 Feb 2004 19:53:41 -0500 Received: from exim by ietf-mx with spam-scanned (Exim 4.12) id 1AqM8v-00046j-00 for mobopts-web-archive@irtf.org; Mon, 09 Feb 2004 19:52:50 -0500 Received: from optimus.ietf.org ([132.151.1.19]) by ietf-mx with esmtp (Exim 4.12) id 1AqM8C-0003z9-00 for mobopts-web-archive@irtf.org; Mon, 09 Feb 2004 19:52:04 -0500 Received: from localhost.localdomain ([127.0.0.1] helo=www1.ietf.org) by optimus.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.20) id 1AqM8A-0007aA-Ju; Mon, 09 Feb 2004 19:52:02 -0500 Received: from odin.ietf.org ([132.151.1.176] helo=ietf.org) by optimus.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.20) id 1AqM7v-0007Z1-Rg for mobopts@optimus.ietf.org; Mon, 09 Feb 2004 19:51:47 -0500 Received: from ietf-mx (ietf-mx.ietf.org [132.151.6.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id TAA07019 for ; Mon, 9 Feb 2004 19:51:45 -0500 (EST) Received: from ietf-mx ([132.151.6.1]) by ietf-mx with esmtp (Exim 4.12) id 1AqM7t-0003xV-00 for mobopts@irtf.org; Mon, 09 Feb 2004 19:51:45 -0500 Received: from exim by ietf-mx with spam-scanned (Exim 4.12) id 1AqM6x-0003pR-00 for mobopts@irtf.org; Mon, 09 Feb 2004 19:50:48 -0500 Received: from dsl-2.241.240.220.dsl.comindico.com.au ([220.240.241.2] helo=anchovy.zoic.org) by ietf-mx with esmtp (Exim 4.12) id 1AqM5v-0003hP-00 for mobopts@irtf.org; Mon, 09 Feb 2004 19:49:44 -0500 Received: by anchovy.zoic.org (Postfix, from userid 1000) id 4D9E670F628; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 11:49:41 +1100 (EST) Date: Tue, 10 Feb 2004 11:49:41 +1100 From: "Nick 'Sharkey' Moore" To: mobopts@irtf.org Message-ID: <20040210004940.GA7012@zoic.org> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline User-Agent: Mutt/1.3.28i X-URL: http://zoic.org/sharkey/ Subject: [Mobopts] "Edge Handovers" Sender: mobopts-admin@ietf.org Errors-To: mobopts-admin@ietf.org X-BeenThere: mobopts@irtf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.12 Precedence: bulk List-Unsubscribe: , List-Id: IP Mobility Optimizations List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.60 (1.212-2003-09-23-exp) on ietf-mx.ietf.org X-Spam-Status: No, hits=1.8 required=5.0 tests=AWL,OPT_HEADER autolearn=no version=2.60 G'day Mobopts-folk ... We've been playing with ways to manage handovers on the edge network, is this the kind of thing which is on charter for this group? Would people be interested in discussing further at Seoul? I wasn't sure of the official procedure for submitting documents to IRTF, so I just put it up as an individual submission, . If it's not there yet, try under . Abstract: | Edge Handovers (EH) is an interoperable enhancement to Mobile IPv6 to | reduce handover latency for movement within an edge network, and to | reduce handover signalling outside the edge network. | | EH does this by tunnelling traffic within the edge network. | Multiple handovers per Home Agent are also allowed, and EH also | considers the situation where a MN anticipates that it is about to move | but does not know where it is about to move to. enjoy, Nick -- Nick Moore, Resarch Fellow | Monash University CTIE | Australian Telecommunications CRC | _______________________________________________ Mobopts mailing list Mobopts@irtf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/mobopts From exim@www1.ietf.org Tue Feb 10 08:50:22 2004 Received: from optimus.ietf.org (optimus.ietf.org [132.151.1.19]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id IAA18495 for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 08:50:22 -0500 (EST) Received: from localhost.localdomain ([127.0.0.1] helo=www1.ietf.org) by optimus.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.20) id 1AqYGw-0004Qx-B0 for mobopts-archive@odin.ietf.org; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 08:49:54 -0500 Received: (from exim@localhost) by www1.ietf.org (8.12.8/8.12.8/Submit) id i1ADnsbt017037 for mobopts-archive@odin.ietf.org; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 08:49:54 -0500 Received: from odin.ietf.org ([132.151.1.176] helo=ietf.org) by optimus.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.20) id 1AqYGw-0004Qi-6E for mobopts-web-archive@optimus.ietf.org; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 08:49:54 -0500 Received: from ietf-mx (ietf-mx.ietf.org [132.151.6.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id IAA18486 for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 08:49:52 -0500 (EST) Received: from ietf-mx ([132.151.6.1]) by ietf-mx with esmtp (Exim 4.12) id 1AqYGu-0001vX-00 for mobopts-web-archive@irtf.org; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 08:49:52 -0500 Received: from exim by ietf-mx with spam-scanned (Exim 4.12) id 1AqYFw-0001qj-00 for mobopts-web-archive@irtf.org; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 08:48:53 -0500 Received: from optimus.ietf.org ([132.151.1.19]) by ietf-mx with esmtp (Exim 4.12) id 1AqYFH-0001mD-00 for mobopts-web-archive@irtf.org; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 08:48:11 -0500 Received: from localhost.localdomain ([127.0.0.1] helo=www1.ietf.org) by optimus.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.20) id 1AqYFI-0004AB-Ih; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 08:48:12 -0500 Received: from odin.ietf.org ([132.151.1.176] helo=ietf.org) by optimus.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.20) id 1AqYEw-000494-Mx for mobopts@optimus.ietf.org; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 08:47:52 -0500 Received: from ietf-mx (ietf-mx.ietf.org [132.151.6.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id IAA18405 for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 08:47:48 -0500 (EST) Received: from ietf-mx ([132.151.6.1]) by ietf-mx with esmtp (Exim 4.12) id 1AqYEv-0001lJ-00 for mobopts@irtf.org; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 08:47:49 -0500 Received: from exim by ietf-mx with spam-scanned (Exim 4.12) id 1AqYDw-0001g5-00 for mobopts@irtf.org; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 08:46:49 -0500 Received: from junkmail.cs.umd.edu ([128.8.128.69]) by ietf-mx with esmtp (Exim 4.12) id 1AqYD3-0001X5-00 for mobopts@irtf.org; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 08:45:53 -0500 Received: from ramen.cs.umd.edu (ramen.cs.umd.edu [128.8.129.77]) by junkmail.cs.umd.edu (8.12.10/8.12.5) with ESMTP id i1ADjNnB002928; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 08:45:23 -0500 (EST) Received: from [IPv6:::1] (ramen.cs.umd.edu [128.8.129.77]) by ramen.cs.umd.edu (8.12.10/8.12.5) with ESMTP id i1ADjNUh023030; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 08:45:23 -0500 (EST) In-Reply-To: <20040210004940.GA7012@zoic.org> References: <20040210004940.GA7012@zoic.org> Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v612) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Message-Id: <5F923380-5BCF-11D8-AD75-000A95DC2176@cs.umd.edu> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Cc: mobopts@irtf.org From: William Arbaugh Subject: Re: [Mobopts] "Edge Handovers" Date: Tue, 10 Feb 2004 08:45:22 -0500 To: "Nick 'Sharkey' Moore" X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.612) Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: mobopts-admin@ietf.org Errors-To: mobopts-admin@ietf.org X-BeenThere: mobopts@irtf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.12 Precedence: bulk List-Unsubscribe: , List-Id: IP Mobility Optimizations List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.60 (1.212-2003-09-23-exp) on ietf-mx.ietf.org X-Spam-Status: No, hits=1.4 required=5.0 tests=AWL,OPT_HEADER autolearn=no version=2.60 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit I think this is something that would be interesting to hear about. Do you have simulation or implementation results? While it is nice to hear ideas, we'd really prefer to see them backed up with results. On Feb 9, 2004, at 7:49 PM, Nick 'Sharkey' Moore wrote: > G'day Mobopts-folk ... > > We've been playing with ways to manage handovers on the > edge network, is this the kind of thing which is on charter for > this group? Would people be interested in discussing further > at Seoul? > > I wasn't sure of the official procedure for submitting > documents to IRTF, so I just put it up as an individual submission, > . If it's not there > yet, try under . > > Abstract: > > | Edge Handovers (EH) is an interoperable enhancement to Mobile IPv6 to > | reduce handover latency for movement within an edge network, and to > | reduce handover signalling outside the edge network. > | > | EH does this by tunnelling traffic within the edge network. > | Multiple handovers per Home Agent are also allowed, and EH also > | considers the situation where a MN anticipates that it is about to > move > | but does not know where it is about to move to. > > enjoy, > Nick > -- > Nick Moore, Resarch Fellow | > Monash University CTIE | > > Australian Telecommunications CRC | > > > _______________________________________________ > Mobopts mailing list > Mobopts@irtf.org > https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/mobopts _______________________________________________ Mobopts mailing list Mobopts@irtf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/mobopts From exim@www1.ietf.org Wed Feb 11 01:03:55 2004 Received: from optimus.ietf.org (optimus.ietf.org [132.151.1.19]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id BAA21208 for ; Wed, 11 Feb 2004 01:03:54 -0500 (EST) Received: from localhost.localdomain ([127.0.0.1] helo=www1.ietf.org) by optimus.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.20) id 1AqnT3-0007Dj-QJ for mobopts-archive@odin.ietf.org; Wed, 11 Feb 2004 01:03:25 -0500 Received: (from exim@localhost) by www1.ietf.org (8.12.8/8.12.8/Submit) id i1B63PS7027755 for mobopts-archive@odin.ietf.org; Wed, 11 Feb 2004 01:03:25 -0500 Received: from odin.ietf.org ([132.151.1.176] helo=ietf.org) by optimus.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.20) id 1AqnT3-0007Da-LU for mobopts-web-archive@optimus.ietf.org; Wed, 11 Feb 2004 01:03:25 -0500 Received: from ietf-mx (ietf-mx.ietf.org [132.151.6.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id BAA21177 for ; Wed, 11 Feb 2004 01:03:24 -0500 (EST) Received: from ietf-mx ([132.151.6.1]) by ietf-mx with esmtp (Exim 4.12) id 1AqnT0-0000zw-00 for mobopts-web-archive@irtf.org; Wed, 11 Feb 2004 01:03:22 -0500 Received: from exim by ietf-mx with spam-scanned (Exim 4.12) id 1AqnS6-0000uZ-00 for mobopts-web-archive@irtf.org; Wed, 11 Feb 2004 01:02:27 -0500 Received: from optimus.ietf.org ([132.151.1.19]) by ietf-mx with esmtp (Exim 4.12) id 1AqnRh-0000pW-00 for mobopts-web-archive@irtf.org; Wed, 11 Feb 2004 01:02:01 -0500 Received: from localhost.localdomain ([127.0.0.1] helo=www1.ietf.org) by optimus.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.20) id 1AqnRh-00078X-Mo; Wed, 11 Feb 2004 01:02:01 -0500 Received: from odin.ietf.org ([132.151.1.176] helo=ietf.org) by optimus.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.20) id 1AqnR6-000783-1S for mobopts@optimus.ietf.org; Wed, 11 Feb 2004 01:01:24 -0500 Received: from ietf-mx (ietf-mx.ietf.org [132.151.6.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id BAA21124 for ; Wed, 11 Feb 2004 01:01:22 -0500 (EST) Received: from ietf-mx ([132.151.6.1]) by ietf-mx with esmtp (Exim 4.12) id 1AqnR3-0000oQ-00 for mobopts@irtf.org; Wed, 11 Feb 2004 01:01:21 -0500 Received: from exim by ietf-mx with spam-scanned (Exim 4.12) id 1AqnQ9-0000k2-00 for mobopts@irtf.org; Wed, 11 Feb 2004 01:00:26 -0500 Received: from dsl-2.241.240.220.dsl.comindico.com.au ([220.240.241.2] helo=anchovy.zoic.org) by ietf-mx with esmtp (Exim 4.12) id 1AqnPb-0000fF-00 for mobopts@irtf.org; Wed, 11 Feb 2004 00:59:51 -0500 Received: by anchovy.zoic.org (Postfix, from userid 1000) id 3A48B727EE7; Wed, 11 Feb 2004 16:59:37 +1100 (EST) Date: Wed, 11 Feb 2004 16:59:37 +1100 From: "Nick 'Sharkey' Moore" To: mobopts@irtf.org Subject: Re: [Mobopts] "Edge Handovers" Message-ID: <20040211055936.GA16875@zoic.org> Mail-Followup-To: mobopts@irtf.org References: <20040210004940.GA7012@zoic.org> <5F923380-5BCF-11D8-AD75-000A95DC2176@cs.umd.edu> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <5F923380-5BCF-11D8-AD75-000A95DC2176@cs.umd.edu> User-Agent: Mutt/1.3.28i X-URL: http://zoic.org/sharkey/ Sender: mobopts-admin@ietf.org Errors-To: mobopts-admin@ietf.org X-BeenThere: mobopts@irtf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.12 Precedence: bulk List-Unsubscribe: , List-Id: IP Mobility Optimizations List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.60 (1.212-2003-09-23-exp) on ietf-mx.ietf.org X-Spam-Status: No, hits=2.1 required=5.0 tests=AWL,OPT_HEADER autolearn=no version=2.60 On 2004-02-10, William Arbaugh wrote: > > I think this is something that would be interesting to hear about. Do > you have simulation or implementation results? G'day William, We'll be extending our implementation of HMIPv6 for Linux to support the HMIP-like version of EH and doing some testing. We're also working on simulation of various protocols and suggested modifications with OMNeT++. > While it is nice to hear ideas, we'd really prefer to see them backed > up with results. Agreed, thought I'd 'release early' and let other IRTF folks know what we're working on ... in terms of results, you might be interested in our testing results for non-predictive handovers which we mention in: -----Nick _______________________________________________ Mobopts mailing list Mobopts@irtf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/mobopts From exim@www1.ietf.org Wed Feb 11 03:23:00 2004 Received: from optimus.ietf.org (optimus.ietf.org [132.151.1.19]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id DAA21664 for ; Wed, 11 Feb 2004 03:23:00 -0500 (EST) Received: from localhost.localdomain ([127.0.0.1] helo=www1.ietf.org) by optimus.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.20) id 1Aqpde-0007B6-Pn for mobopts-archive@odin.ietf.org; Wed, 11 Feb 2004 03:22:31 -0500 Received: (from exim@localhost) by www1.ietf.org (8.12.8/8.12.8/Submit) id i1B8MUMX027532 for mobopts-archive@odin.ietf.org; Wed, 11 Feb 2004 03:22:30 -0500 Received: from odin.ietf.org ([132.151.1.176] helo=ietf.org) by optimus.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.20) id 1Aqpde-00079t-8m for mobopts-web-archive@optimus.ietf.org; Wed, 11 Feb 2004 03:22:30 -0500 Received: from ietf-mx (ietf-mx.ietf.org [132.151.6.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id DAA21659 for ; Wed, 11 Feb 2004 03:22:28 -0500 (EST) Received: from ietf-mx ([132.151.6.1]) by ietf-mx with esmtp (Exim 4.12) id 1Aqpdc-0005jY-00 for mobopts-web-archive@irtf.org; Wed, 11 Feb 2004 03:22:28 -0500 Received: from exim by ietf-mx with spam-scanned (Exim 4.12) id 1Aqpcg-0005eK-00 for mobopts-web-archive@irtf.org; Wed, 11 Feb 2004 03:21:31 -0500 Received: from optimus.ietf.org ([132.151.1.19]) by ietf-mx with esmtp (Exim 4.12) id 1AqpcE-0005ZE-00 for mobopts-web-archive@irtf.org; Wed, 11 Feb 2004 03:21:02 -0500 Received: from localhost.localdomain ([127.0.0.1] helo=www1.ietf.org) by optimus.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.20) id 1AqpcD-00073i-7N; Wed, 11 Feb 2004 03:21:01 -0500 Received: from odin.ietf.org ([132.151.1.176] helo=ietf.org) by optimus.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.20) id 1Aqpbm-00072O-5f for mobopts@optimus.ietf.org; Wed, 11 Feb 2004 03:20:34 -0500 Received: from ietf-mx (ietf-mx.ietf.org [132.151.6.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id DAA21616 for ; Wed, 11 Feb 2004 03:20:32 -0500 (EST) Received: from ietf-mx ([132.151.6.1]) by ietf-mx with esmtp (Exim 4.12) id 1Aqpbj-0005YI-00 for mobopts@irtf.org; Wed, 11 Feb 2004 03:20:32 -0500 Received: from exim by ietf-mx with spam-scanned (Exim 4.12) id 1Aqpaj-0005TJ-00 for mobopts@irtf.org; Wed, 11 Feb 2004 03:19:30 -0500 Received: from iramx2.ira.uni-karlsruhe.de ([141.3.10.81]) by ietf-mx with esmtp (Exim 4.12) id 1AqpZy-0005OK-00 for mobopts@irtf.org; Wed, 11 Feb 2004 03:18:42 -0500 Received: from i72chvogt.tm.uni-karlsruhe.de ([141.3.71.83] helo=i72ChVogt) by iramx2.ira.uni-karlsruhe.de with smtp (Exim 3.30 #10 (Debian)) id 1AqpZt-00003j-00; Wed, 11 Feb 2004 09:18:37 +0100 Message-ID: <001e01c3f077$a2735df0$5347038d@tm.unikarlsruhe.de> From: "Christian Vogt" To: "Nick 'Sharkey' Moore" Cc: References: <20040210004940.GA7012@zoic.org> <5F923380-5BCF-11D8-AD75-000A95DC2176@cs.umd.edu> <20040211055936.GA16875@zoic.org> Subject: Re: [Mobopts] "Edge Handovers" Date: Wed, 11 Feb 2004 09:18:29 +0100 Organization: University of Karlsruhe (TH), Institute of Telematics MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64 Sender: mobopts-admin@ietf.org Errors-To: mobopts-admin@ietf.org X-BeenThere: mobopts@irtf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.12 Precedence: bulk List-Unsubscribe: , List-Id: IP Mobility Optimizations List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.60 (1.212-2003-09-23-exp) on ietf-mx.ietf.org X-Spam-Status: No, hits=3.6 required=5.0 tests=AWL,MIME_BASE64_LATIN, MIME_BASE64_TEXT,OPT_HEADER autolearn=no version=2.60 Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64 Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64 SGkgTmljaywNCg0KSSBsaWtlIEVkZ2UgSGFuZG92ZXJzIGJlY2F1c2Ugb2YgdGhlIGZsZXhpYmls aXR5IHdpdGggd2hpY2ggTU5zIGNhbiBjaG9vc2UgdGhlaXIgY29tbXVuaWNhdGlvbnMgYW5jaG9y IHBvaW50ICh3aGljaCBpbiB0aGlzIGNhc2UgaXMgdGhlaXIgQkFSKS4NCg0KU3RpbGwsIGFwYXJ0 IGZyb20gdGhlIGJ1ZmZlcmluZyBzZXJ2aWNlIHRoYXQgYSBNTiBtYXkgcmVxdWVzdCBmcm9tIGl0 cyBCQVIsIEVkZ2UgSGFuZG92ZXJzIGFwcGVhciB0byBiZSBlcXVpdmFsZW50IHRvIHRoZSBmb2xs b3dpbmcgSE1JUHY2IHNldHRpbmc6DQoNCigxKSBVc2UgSE1JUHY2DQooMikgUHV0IE1BUCBmdW5j dGlvbmFsaXR5IGludG8gZWFjaCBBUiANCiAgICAoaS5lLiwgZWFjaCBNQVAgZG9tYWluIGlzIGEg c2luZ2xlIHN1Ym5ldCkNCigzKSBBbGxvdyBlYWNoIE1BUCB0byBmb3J3YXJkIHBhY2tldHMgdG8g TENvQXMgZnJvbSBvdGhlciBNQVAncyBkb21haW5zDQogICAgKHNlZSBzZWN0aW9uIDggb2YgZHJh ZnQtaWV0Zi1taXBzaG9wLWhtaXB2Ni0wMC50eHQpDQoNCkkgbWlnaHQgYmUgbWlzc2luZyBzb21l dGhpbmcuIEp1c3QgbGV0IG1lIGtub3cuDQoNCkJlc3QgcmVnYXJkcywNCg0KDQotIENocmlzDQoN Cg0KfA0KfCBDaHJpc3RpYW4gVm9ndA0KfCBJbnN0aXR1dGUgb2YgVGVsZW1hdGljcywgVW5pdmVy c2l0eSBvZiBLYXJsc3J1aGUgKFRIKQ0KfCB3d3cudG0udWthLmRlL35jaHZvZ3QvDQp8DQoNCg0K LS0tLS0gT3JpZ2luYWwgTWVzc2FnZSAtLS0tLSANCkZyb206ICJDaHJpc3RpYW4gVm9ndCIgPGNo dm9ndEB0bS51a2EuZGU+DQpUbzogIkNocmlzdGlhbiBWb2d0IiA8Y2h2b2d0QHRtLnVrYS5kZT4N ClNlbnQ6IFdlZG5lc2RheSwgRmVicnVhcnkgMTEsIDIwMDQgOToxNSBBTQ0KDQoNCj4gRydkYXkg TW9ib3B0cy1mb2xrIC4uLg0KPiANCj4gV2UndmUgYmVlbiBwbGF5aW5nIHdpdGggd2F5cyB0byBt YW5hZ2UgaGFuZG92ZXJzIG9uIHRoZQ0KPiBlZGdlIG5ldHdvcmssIGlzIHRoaXMgdGhlIGtpbmQg b2YgdGhpbmcgd2hpY2ggaXMgb24gY2hhcnRlciBmb3INCj4gdGhpcyBncm91cD8gIFdvdWxkIHBl b3BsZSBiZSBpbnRlcmVzdGVkIGluIGRpc2N1c3NpbmcgZnVydGhlcg0KPiBhdCBTZW91bD8NCj4g DQo+IEkgd2Fzbid0IHN1cmUgb2YgdGhlIG9mZmljaWFsIHByb2NlZHVyZSBmb3Igc3VibWl0dGlu Zw0KPiBkb2N1bWVudHMgdG8gSVJURiwgc28gSSBqdXN0IHB1dCBpdCB1cCBhcyBhbiBpbmRpdmlk dWFsIHN1Ym1pc3Npb24sDQo+IDxkcmFmdC1tb29yZS1tb2JvcHRzLWVkZ2UtaGFuZG92ZXJzLTAw LnR4dD4uICBJZiBpdCdzIG5vdCB0aGVyZQ0KPiB5ZXQsIHRyeSB1bmRlciA8aHR0cDovL2JsdWVz a3kuem9pYy5vcmcvc2hhcmtleS8+Lg0KPiANCj4gQWJzdHJhY3Q6IA0KPiANCj4gfCBFZGdlIEhh bmRvdmVycyAoRUgpIGlzIGFuIGludGVyb3BlcmFibGUgZW5oYW5jZW1lbnQgdG8gTW9iaWxlIElQ djYgdG8NCj4gfCByZWR1Y2UgaGFuZG92ZXIgbGF0ZW5jeSBmb3IgbW92ZW1lbnQgd2l0aGluIGFu IGVkZ2UgbmV0d29yaywgYW5kIHRvDQo+IHwgcmVkdWNlIGhhbmRvdmVyIHNpZ25hbGxpbmcgb3V0 c2lkZSB0aGUgZWRnZSBuZXR3b3JrLg0KPiB8IA0KPiB8IEVIIGRvZXMgdGhpcyBieSB0dW5uZWxs aW5nIHRyYWZmaWMgd2l0aGluIHRoZSBlZGdlIG5ldHdvcmsuDQo+IHwgTXVsdGlwbGUgaGFuZG92 ZXJzIHBlciBIb21lIEFnZW50IGFyZSBhbHNvIGFsbG93ZWQsIGFuZCBFSCBhbHNvDQo+IHwgY29u c2lkZXJzIHRoZSBzaXR1YXRpb24gd2hlcmUgYSBNTiBhbnRpY2lwYXRlcyB0aGF0IGl0IGlzIGFi b3V0IHRvIG1vdmUNCj4gfCBidXQgZG9lcyBub3Qga25vdyB3aGVyZSBpdCBpcyBhYm91dCB0byBt b3ZlIHRvLg0KPiANCj4gZW5qb3ksDQo+IE5pY2sNCj4gLS0gDQo+IE5pY2sgTW9vcmUsIFJlc2Fy Y2ggRmVsbG93ICAgICAgICB8IDxuaWNrLm1vb3JlQGVuZy5tb25hc2guZWR1LmF1Pg0KPiBNb25h c2ggVW5pdmVyc2l0eSBDVElFICAgICAgICAgICB8IDxodHRwOi8vd3d3LmN0aWUubW9uYXNoLmVk dS5hdS9pcHY2Lz4NCj4gQXVzdHJhbGlhbiBUZWxlY29tbXVuaWNhdGlvbnMgQ1JDIHwgPGh0dHA6 Ly93d3cudGVsZWNvbW11bmljYXRpb25zLmNyYy5vcmcuYXUvPg0KDQo= _______________________________________________ Mobopts mailing list Mobopts@irtf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/mobopts From exim@www1.ietf.org Wed Feb 11 04:30:10 2004 Received: from optimus.ietf.org (optimus.ietf.org [132.151.1.19]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id EAA24070 for ; 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Wed, 11 Feb 2004 04:28:36 -0500 Received: from optimus.ietf.org ([132.151.1.19]) by ietf-mx with esmtp (Exim 4.12) id 1Aqqf3-0004Iw-00 for mobopts-web-archive@irtf.org; Wed, 11 Feb 2004 04:28:01 -0500 Received: from localhost.localdomain ([127.0.0.1] helo=www1.ietf.org) by optimus.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.20) id 1Aqqf3-0003UT-BS; Wed, 11 Feb 2004 04:28:01 -0500 Received: from odin.ietf.org ([132.151.1.176] helo=ietf.org) by optimus.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.20) id 1Aqqee-0003TH-C0 for mobopts@optimus.ietf.org; Wed, 11 Feb 2004 04:27:36 -0500 Received: from ietf-mx (ietf-mx.ietf.org [132.151.6.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id EAA23836 for ; Wed, 11 Feb 2004 04:27:34 -0500 (EST) Received: from ietf-mx ([132.151.6.1]) by ietf-mx with esmtp (Exim 4.12) id 1Aqqeb-0004Hv-00 for mobopts@irtf.org; Wed, 11 Feb 2004 04:27:33 -0500 Received: from exim by ietf-mx with spam-scanned (Exim 4.12) id 1Aqqde-0004Ca-00 for mobopts@irtf.org; Wed, 11 Feb 2004 04:26:35 -0500 Received: from dsl-2.241.240.220.dsl.comindico.com.au ([220.240.241.2] helo=anchovy.zoic.org) by ietf-mx with esmtp (Exim 4.12) id 1AqqdR-000477-00 for mobopts@irtf.org; Wed, 11 Feb 2004 04:26:21 -0500 Received: by anchovy.zoic.org (Postfix, from userid 1000) id ADE7B727EF5; Wed, 11 Feb 2004 20:26:18 +1100 (EST) Date: Wed, 11 Feb 2004 20:26:18 +1100 From: "Nick 'Sharkey' Moore" To: mobopts@irtf.org Cc: Christian Vogt Subject: Re: [Mobopts] "Edge Handovers" Message-ID: <20040211092617.GB18626@zoic.org> Mail-Followup-To: mobopts@irtf.org, Christian Vogt References: <20040210004940.GA7012@zoic.org> <5F923380-5BCF-11D8-AD75-000A95DC2176@cs.umd.edu> <20040211055936.GA16875@zoic.org> <001e01c3f077$a2735df0$5347038d@tm.unikarlsruhe.de> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <001e01c3f077$a2735df0$5347038d@tm.unikarlsruhe.de> User-Agent: Mutt/1.3.28i X-URL: http://zoic.org/sharkey/ Sender: mobopts-admin@ietf.org Errors-To: mobopts-admin@ietf.org X-BeenThere: mobopts@irtf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.12 Precedence: bulk List-Unsubscribe: , List-Id: IP Mobility Optimizations List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.60 (1.212-2003-09-23-exp) on ietf-mx.ietf.org X-Spam-Status: No, hits=2.2 required=5.0 tests=AWL,OPT_HEADER autolearn=no version=2.60 On 2004-02-11, Christian Vogt wrote: > Hi Nick, > > I like Edge Handovers because of the flexibility with which > MNs can choose their communications anchor point (which in > this case is their BAR). Thanks. > Still, apart from the buffering service that a MN may request > from its BAR, Edge Handovers appear to be equivalent to the > following HMIPv6 setting: Yep. Pretty much. The possibility of placing MAPs at the edge is even explicitly mentioned in HMIPv6 section 10.2: | Network operators may choose a flat architecture in some cases where | a Mobile IPv6 handover may be considered a rare event. In these | scenarios operators may choose to include the MAP function in ARs | only. but note that HMIPv6 has considered it only where 'handover may be considered a rare event'. EH extends the HMIP MAP-to-MAP handover behaviour to allow the MN to defer its formation of a new RCoA indefinitely[1]. This means it can: * allow multiple handovers per BU-to-the-HA. * defer the configuration of the new RCoA (and any DAD or security signalling which may need to be done) to after the time critical phase of the handover. ... thus making it suitable where handover is not a rare event. EH-00 uses a lot of HMIP components to avoid reinventing the wheel, thus simplifying implementation and testing, and avoiding incompatibility problems. Some of the techniques (especially the buffering) could be easily fed back into HMIP. For a view of EH without HMIP , see the 'Alternative Version' (section 7) ... Thanks for your feedback! cheers, -----Nick [1] Well, until the bound RCoA binding expires or the MN runs out of EH coverage, anyway. See the heuristics (section 5) and assume N = several :-). -- Nick Moore, Resarch Fellow | Monash University CTIE | Australian Telecommunications CRC | _______________________________________________ Mobopts mailing list Mobopts@irtf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/mobopts From exim@www1.ietf.org Wed Feb 11 08:04:11 2004 Received: from optimus.ietf.org (optimus.ietf.org [132.151.1.19]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id IAA29639 for ; Wed, 11 Feb 2004 08:04:11 -0500 (EST) Received: from localhost.localdomain ([127.0.0.1] helo=www1.ietf.org) by optimus.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.20) id 1Aqu1m-0007dE-20 for mobopts-archive@odin.ietf.org; Wed, 11 Feb 2004 08:03:42 -0500 Received: (from exim@localhost) by www1.ietf.org (8.12.8/8.12.8/Submit) id i1BD3gdq029332 for mobopts-archive@odin.ietf.org; Wed, 11 Feb 2004 08:03:42 -0500 Received: from odin.ietf.org ([132.151.1.176] helo=ietf.org) by optimus.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.20) id 1Aqu1l-0007d1-TF for mobopts-web-archive@optimus.ietf.org; Wed, 11 Feb 2004 08:03:41 -0500 Received: from ietf-mx (ietf-mx.ietf.org [132.151.6.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id IAA29624 for ; Wed, 11 Feb 2004 08:03:40 -0500 (EST) Received: from ietf-mx ([132.151.6.1]) by ietf-mx with esmtp (Exim 4.12) id 1Aqu1l-0000zs-00 for mobopts-web-archive@irtf.org; Wed, 11 Feb 2004 08:03:41 -0500 Received: from exim by ietf-mx with spam-scanned (Exim 4.12) id 1Aqu0o-0000um-00 for mobopts-web-archive@irtf.org; Wed, 11 Feb 2004 08:02:43 -0500 Received: from optimus.ietf.org ([132.151.1.19]) by ietf-mx with esmtp (Exim 4.12) id 1Aqu09-0000pT-00 for mobopts-web-archive@irtf.org; Wed, 11 Feb 2004 08:02:01 -0500 Received: from localhost.localdomain ([127.0.0.1] helo=www1.ietf.org) by optimus.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.20) id 1Aqu0A-0007XR-2z; Wed, 11 Feb 2004 08:02:02 -0500 Received: from odin.ietf.org ([132.151.1.176] helo=ietf.org) by optimus.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.20) id 1Aqtzo-0007Wm-Vt for mobopts@optimus.ietf.org; Wed, 11 Feb 2004 08:01:41 -0500 Received: from ietf-mx (ietf-mx.ietf.org [132.151.6.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id IAA29577 for ; Wed, 11 Feb 2004 08:01:39 -0500 (EST) Received: from ietf-mx ([132.151.6.1]) by ietf-mx with esmtp (Exim 4.12) id 1Aqtzo-0000om-00 for mobopts@irtf.org; Wed, 11 Feb 2004 08:01:40 -0500 Received: from exim by ietf-mx with spam-scanned (Exim 4.12) id 1Aqtyp-0000jU-00 for mobopts@irtf.org; Wed, 11 Feb 2004 08:00:40 -0500 Received: from iramx2.ira.uni-karlsruhe.de ([141.3.10.81]) by ietf-mx with esmtp (Exim 4.12) id 1AqtyM-0000eO-00 for mobopts@irtf.org; Wed, 11 Feb 2004 08:00:11 -0500 Received: from i72chvogt.tm.uni-karlsruhe.de ([141.3.71.83] helo=i72ChVogt) by iramx2.ira.uni-karlsruhe.de with smtp (Exim 3.30 #10 (Debian)) id 1AqtyH-0006rh-00; Wed, 11 Feb 2004 14:00:05 +0100 Message-ID: <009f01c3f09e$f511cf70$5347038d@tm.unikarlsruhe.de> From: "Christian Vogt" To: "Nick 'Sharkey' Moore" Cc: References: <20040210004940.GA7012@zoic.org> <5F923380-5BCF-11D8-AD75-000A95DC2176@cs.umd.edu> <20040211055936.GA16875@zoic.org> <001e01c3f077$a2735df0$5347038d@tm.unikarlsruhe.de> <20040211092617.GB18626@zoic.org> Subject: Re: [Mobopts] "Edge Handovers" Date: Wed, 11 Feb 2004 13:59:58 +0100 Organization: University of Karlsruhe (TH), Institute of Telematics MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64 Sender: mobopts-admin@ietf.org Errors-To: mobopts-admin@ietf.org X-BeenThere: mobopts@irtf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.12 Precedence: bulk List-Unsubscribe: , List-Id: IP Mobility Optimizations List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.60 (1.212-2003-09-23-exp) on ietf-mx.ietf.org X-Spam-Status: No, hits=3.8 required=5.0 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dW50aWwgdGhlIGJvdW5kIFJDb0EgYmluZGluZyBleHBpcmVzIG9yIHRoZSBNTiBydW5zIG91dA0K PiBvZiBFSCBjb3ZlcmFnZSwgYW55d2F5LiAgU2VlIHRoZSBoZXVyaXN0aWNzIChzZWN0aW9uIDUp IGFuZCBhc3N1bWUNCj4gTiA9IHNldmVyYWwgOi0pLg0KPiANCj4gLS0gDQo+IE5pY2sgTW9vcmUs IFJlc2FyY2ggRmVsbG93ICAgICAgICB8IDxuaWNrLm1vb3JlQGVuZy5tb25hc2guZWR1LmF1Pg0K PiBNb25hc2ggVW5pdmVyc2l0eSBDVElFICAgICAgICAgICB8IDxodHRwOi8vd3d3LmN0aWUubW9u YXNoLmVkdS5hdS9pcHY2Lz4NCj4gQXVzdHJhbGlhbiBUZWxlY29tbXVuaWNhdGlvbnMgQ1JDIHwg PGh0dHA6Ly93d3cudGVsZWNvbW11bmljYXRpb25zLmNyYy5vcmcuYXUvPg0KDQo= _______________________________________________ Mobopts mailing list Mobopts@irtf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/mobopts From exim@www1.ietf.org Wed Feb 11 16:11:48 2004 Received: from optimus.ietf.org (optimus.ietf.org [132.151.1.19]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id QAA24369 for ; Wed, 11 Feb 2004 16:11:48 -0500 (EST) Received: from localhost.localdomain ([127.0.0.1] helo=www1.ietf.org) by optimus.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.20) id 1Ar1dg-0006hh-86 for mobopts-archive@odin.ietf.org; Wed, 11 Feb 2004 16:11:20 -0500 Received: (from exim@localhost) by www1.ietf.org (8.12.8/8.12.8/Submit) id i1BLBKAr025765 for mobopts-archive@odin.ietf.org; Wed, 11 Feb 2004 16:11:20 -0500 Received: from odin.ietf.org ([132.151.1.176] helo=ietf.org) by optimus.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.20) id 1Ar1dg-0006hU-3k for mobopts-web-archive@optimus.ietf.org; Wed, 11 Feb 2004 16:11:20 -0500 Received: from ietf-mx (ietf-mx.ietf.org [132.151.6.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id QAA24305 for ; Wed, 11 Feb 2004 16:11:17 -0500 (EST) Received: from ietf-mx ([132.151.6.1]) by ietf-mx with esmtp (Exim 4.12) id 1Ar1de-0006UK-00 for mobopts-web-archive@irtf.org; Wed, 11 Feb 2004 16:11:18 -0500 Received: from exim by ietf-mx with spam-scanned (Exim 4.12) id 1Ar1c1-00066u-00 for mobopts-web-archive@irtf.org; Wed, 11 Feb 2004 16:09:37 -0500 Received: from optimus.ietf.org ([132.151.1.19]) by ietf-mx with esmtp (Exim 4.12) id 1Ar1aT-0005lE-00 for mobopts-web-archive@irtf.org; Wed, 11 Feb 2004 16:08:01 -0500 Received: from localhost.localdomain ([127.0.0.1] helo=www1.ietf.org) by optimus.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.20) id 1Ar1aU-0006PM-5L; Wed, 11 Feb 2004 16:08:02 -0500 Received: from odin.ietf.org ([132.151.1.176] helo=ietf.org) by optimus.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.20) id 1Ar1Zu-0006Is-Cm for mobopts@optimus.ietf.org; Wed, 11 Feb 2004 16:07:26 -0500 Received: from ietf-mx (ietf-mx.ietf.org [132.151.6.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id QAA23927 for ; Wed, 11 Feb 2004 16:07:24 -0500 (EST) Received: from ietf-mx ([132.151.6.1]) by ietf-mx with esmtp (Exim 4.12) id 1Ar1Zs-0005c8-00 for mobopts@irtf.org; Wed, 11 Feb 2004 16:07:24 -0500 Received: from exim by ietf-mx with spam-scanned (Exim 4.12) id 1Ar1Yd-0005SC-00 for mobopts@irtf.org; Wed, 11 Feb 2004 16:06:08 -0500 Received: from dsl-2.241.240.220.dsl.comindico.com.au ([220.240.241.2] helo=anchovy.zoic.org) by ietf-mx with esmtp (Exim 4.12) id 1Ar1YA-0005KI-00 for mobopts@irtf.org; Wed, 11 Feb 2004 16:05:39 -0500 Received: by anchovy.zoic.org (Postfix, from userid 1000) id EB0677031C6; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 08:05:02 +1100 (EST) Date: Thu, 12 Feb 2004 08:05:02 +1100 From: "Nick 'Sharkey' Moore" To: mobopts@irtf.org Subject: Re: [Mobopts] "Edge Handovers" Message-ID: <20040211210502.GA23460@zoic.org> Mail-Followup-To: mobopts@irtf.org References: <20040210004940.GA7012@zoic.org> <5F923380-5BCF-11D8-AD75-000A95DC2176@cs.umd.edu> <20040211055936.GA16875@zoic.org> <001e01c3f077$a2735df0$5347038d@tm.unikarlsruhe.de> <20040211092617.GB18626@zoic.org> <009f01c3f09e$f511cf70$5347038d@tm.unikarlsruhe.de> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <009f01c3f09e$f511cf70$5347038d@tm.unikarlsruhe.de> User-Agent: Mutt/1.3.28i X-URL: http://zoic.org/sharkey/ Sender: mobopts-admin@ietf.org Errors-To: mobopts-admin@ietf.org X-BeenThere: mobopts@irtf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.12 Precedence: bulk List-Unsubscribe: , List-Id: IP Mobility Optimizations List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.60 (1.212-2003-09-23-exp) on ietf-mx.ietf.org X-Spam-Status: No, hits=2.2 required=5.0 tests=AWL,OPT_HEADER autolearn=no version=2.60 On 2004-02-11, Christian Vogt wrote: > Hi Nick! Hi MobOpts folks! > > > EH-00 uses a lot of HMIP components to avoid reinventing the > > wheel. [...] Some of the techniques (especially the > > buffering) could be easily fed back into HMIP.[...] > > The buffering feature is probably a security concern of Edge > Handovers which is *not* covered by HMIPv6: A malicious MN may > illegitimately occupy buffer space at an Access Router. Good point. I'll add it to 'Security Concerns'. I don't think it's a biggie though, because the AR can choose to just start discarding packets. > However, since Edge Handovers - as well as HMIPv6 - are likely > to be employed in domains with a single administration, you may > assume some kind of a security association between the domain > and the MNs. I don't think this is true: I think a likely scenario for both is a 'Campus Area Network' or larger, where you really can't trust the customers, beyond what you can learn in AAA. I think there's an assumed trust between EH-ARs -- the NAR has to (perhaps briefly) carry traffic to/from the BAR despite having no association with the MN (yet). That should presumably be in 'Security Concerns' too. > We recently submitted a new Internet-Draft, > draft-vogt-mip6-early-binding-updates-00.txt, I had a flick through it, will read it properly later. It seems like we're working on similar things anyway :-)! > There has been some discussion about Early Binding Updates on > the mip6 mailing list. As Early Binding Updates is a handover > optimization, the proposal also fits into the MobOpts charter. Which reminds me: what _is_ the right place these days? -----Nick -- Nick Moore, Resarch Fellow | Monash University CTIE | Australian Telecommunications CRC | _______________________________________________ Mobopts mailing list Mobopts@irtf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/mobopts From exim@www1.ietf.org Wed Feb 11 20:15:23 2004 Received: from optimus.ietf.org (optimus.ietf.org [132.151.1.19]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id UAA16651 for ; Wed, 11 Feb 2004 20:15:23 -0500 (EST) Received: from localhost.localdomain ([127.0.0.1] helo=www1.ietf.org) by optimus.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.20) id 1Ar5RO-0003Fo-Cn for mobopts-archive@odin.ietf.org; Wed, 11 Feb 2004 20:14:54 -0500 Received: (from exim@localhost) by www1.ietf.org (8.12.8/8.12.8/Submit) id i1C1EseW012502 for mobopts-archive@odin.ietf.org; Wed, 11 Feb 2004 20:14:54 -0500 Received: from odin.ietf.org ([132.151.1.176] helo=ietf.org) by optimus.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.20) id 1Ar5RO-0003FZ-1p for mobopts-web-archive@optimus.ietf.org; Wed, 11 Feb 2004 20:14:54 -0500 Received: from ietf-mx (ietf-mx.ietf.org [132.151.6.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id UAA16623 for ; Wed, 11 Feb 2004 20:14:52 -0500 (EST) Received: from ietf-mx ([132.151.6.1]) by ietf-mx with esmtp (Exim 4.12) id 1Ar5RM-0002Z4-00 for mobopts-web-archive@irtf.org; Wed, 11 Feb 2004 20:14:52 -0500 Received: from exim by ietf-mx with spam-scanned (Exim 4.12) id 1Ar5QS-0002S2-00 for mobopts-web-archive@irtf.org; Wed, 11 Feb 2004 20:13:57 -0500 Received: from optimus.ietf.org ([132.151.1.19]) by ietf-mx with esmtp (Exim 4.12) id 1Ar5PZ-0002La-00 for mobopts-web-archive@irtf.org; Wed, 11 Feb 2004 20:13:01 -0500 Received: from localhost.localdomain ([127.0.0.1] helo=www1.ietf.org) by optimus.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.20) id 1Ar5PZ-00039I-He; Wed, 11 Feb 2004 20:13:01 -0500 Received: from odin.ietf.org ([132.151.1.176] helo=ietf.org) by optimus.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.20) id 1Ar5PQ-00038E-Ae for mobopts@optimus.ietf.org; Wed, 11 Feb 2004 20:12:52 -0500 Received: from ietf-mx (ietf-mx.ietf.org [132.151.6.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id UAA16488 for ; Wed, 11 Feb 2004 20:12:50 -0500 (EST) Received: from ietf-mx ([132.151.6.1]) by ietf-mx with esmtp (Exim 4.12) id 1Ar5PO-0002Jy-00 for mobopts@irtf.org; Wed, 11 Feb 2004 20:12:50 -0500 Received: from exim by ietf-mx with spam-scanned (Exim 4.12) id 1Ar5OM-0002DE-00 for mobopts@irtf.org; Wed, 11 Feb 2004 20:11:47 -0500 Received: from hermes.rz.fhtw-berlin.de ([141.45.5.100]) by ietf-mx with esmtp (Exim 4.12) id 1Ar5NZ-00027S-00 for mobopts@irtf.org; Wed, 11 Feb 2004 20:10:57 -0500 Received: from fhtw-berlin.de (ip00004.in.fhtw-berlin.de [141.45.240.4]) (authenticated bits=0) by hermes.rz.fhtw-berlin.de (8.12.11/8.12.2) with ESMTP id i1C1AuYq015202 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=NOT) for ; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 02:10:57 +0100 (MET) Message-ID: <402AD299.7030600@fhtw-berlin.de> Date: Thu, 12 Feb 2004 02:10:49 +0100 From: Thomas Schmidt User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.1; en-US; rv:1.6b) Gecko/20031205 Thunderbird/0.4 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: mobopts@irtf.org Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: [Mobopts] Multicast Handover & HMIPv6 Sender: mobopts-admin@ietf.org Errors-To: mobopts-admin@ietf.org X-BeenThere: mobopts@irtf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.12 Precedence: bulk List-Unsubscribe: , List-Id: IP Mobility Optimizations List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.60 (1.212-2003-09-23-exp) on ietf-mx.ietf.org X-Spam-Status: No, hits=1.9 required=5.0 tests=AWL,OPT_HEADER autolearn=no version=2.60 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Hi, we are experimenting with mobility options in real-time multicast communication. the question of performing multicast handover in real-time, in particular ... We did some background analysis and simulation of mobility schemes: see http://www.rz.fhtw-berlin.de/projekte/ipv6/mipv6.html and ICN04-Paper in particular. So we also submitted the draft (see http://www.rz.fhtw-berlin.de/projekte/ipv6/draft-schmidt-waehlisch-mhmipv6-01.txt if it is not published yet): Abstract: This document introduces handover mechanisms for IPv6 mobile multicast listeners and mobile multicast senders. It therefore restates some fundamentals of mobile multicast signaling. Operations are based on a Mobile IPv6 environment with local mobility anchor points. These local anchor points are conformal with a Hierarchical Mobile IPv6 proxy infrastructure. Handover latencies in the proposed scheme remain bound to link switching delays with respect to these local proxy points. The mechanisms described in this document do not rely on assumptions of any specific multicast routing protocol in use. The M-HMIPv6 protocol operations utilize the existing HMIPv6 and MIPv6 messages, without defining any new control messages. Will this be kind of a topic in Seoul? Kind regards, thomas & matthias _______________________________________________ Mobopts mailing list Mobopts@irtf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/mobopts From exim@www1.ietf.org Thu Feb 12 13:08:58 2004 Received: from optimus.ietf.org (optimus.ietf.org [132.151.1.19]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id NAA05104 for ; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 13:08:58 -0500 (EST) Received: from localhost.localdomain ([127.0.0.1] helo=www1.ietf.org) by optimus.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.20) id 1ArLGJ-00035Y-N0 for mobopts-archive@odin.ietf.org; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 13:08:31 -0500 Received: (from exim@localhost) by www1.ietf.org (8.12.8/8.12.8/Submit) id i1CI8V9E011866 for mobopts-archive@odin.ietf.org; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 13:08:31 -0500 Received: from odin.ietf.org ([132.151.1.176] helo=ietf.org) by optimus.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.20) id 1ArLGJ-00035J-HZ for mobopts-web-archive@optimus.ietf.org; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 13:08:31 -0500 Received: from ietf-mx (ietf-mx.ietf.org [132.151.6.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id NAA05073 for ; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 13:08:28 -0500 (EST) Received: from ietf-mx ([132.151.6.1]) by ietf-mx with esmtp (Exim 4.12) id 1ArLGF-0001Fa-00 for mobopts-web-archive@irtf.org; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 13:08:27 -0500 Received: from exim by ietf-mx with spam-scanned (Exim 4.12) id 1ArLFO-00019W-00 for mobopts-web-archive@irtf.org; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 13:07:35 -0500 Received: from optimus.ietf.org ([132.151.1.19]) by ietf-mx with esmtp (Exim 4.12) id 1ArLEq-00013I-00 for mobopts-web-archive@irtf.org; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 13:07:00 -0500 Received: from localhost.localdomain ([127.0.0.1] helo=www1.ietf.org) by optimus.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.20) id 1ArLEr-0002fA-58; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 13:07:01 -0500 Received: from odin.ietf.org ([132.151.1.176] helo=ietf.org) by optimus.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.20) id 1ArLEA-0002XU-Lv for mobopts@optimus.ietf.org; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 13:06:25 -0500 Received: from ietf-mx (ietf-mx.ietf.org [132.151.6.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id NAA04903 for ; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 13:06:15 -0500 (EST) Received: from ietf-mx ([132.151.6.1]) by ietf-mx with esmtp (Exim 4.12) id 1ArLE6-00010Z-00 for mobopts@irtf.org; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 13:06:14 -0500 Received: from exim by ietf-mx with spam-scanned (Exim 4.12) id 1ArLD9-0000ul-00 for mobopts@irtf.org; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 13:05:15 -0500 Received: from darkstar.iprg.nokia.com ([205.226.5.69]) by ietf-mx with esmtp (Exim 4.12) id 1ArLCD-0000kZ-00 for mobopts@irtf.org; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 13:04:17 -0500 Received: (from root@localhost) by darkstar.iprg.nokia.com (8.11.0/8.11.0-DARKSTAR) id i1CI3ej16789; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 10:03:40 -0800 X-mProtect: <200402121803> Nokia Silicon Valley Messaging Protection Received: from rajeev.iprg.nokia.com (205.226.2.90, claiming to be "iprg.nokia.com") by darkstar.iprg.nokia.com smtpdh9ANt2; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 10:03:35 PST Message-ID: <402BBFED.1C31B098@iprg.nokia.com> Date: Thu, 12 Feb 2004 10:03:25 -0800 From: Rajeev Koodli Organization: Nokia Research Center X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.7 [en] (X11; I; FreeBSD 3.4-RELEASE i386) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: "Nick 'Sharkey' Moore" CC: mobopts@irtf.org Subject: Re: [Mobopts] "Edge Handovers" References: <20040210004940.GA7012@zoic.org> <5F923380-5BCF-11D8-AD75-000A95DC2176@cs.umd.edu> <20040211055936.GA16875@zoic.org> <001e01c3f077$a2735df0$5347038d@tm.unikarlsruhe.de> <20040211092617.GB18626@zoic.org> <009f01c3f09e$f511cf70$5347038d@tm.unika Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: mobopts-admin@ietf.org Errors-To: mobopts-admin@ietf.org X-BeenThere: mobopts@irtf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.12 Precedence: bulk List-Unsubscribe: , List-Id: IP Mobility Optimizations List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.60 (1.212-2003-09-23-exp) on ietf-mx.ietf.org X-Spam-Status: No, hits=1.7 required=5.0 tests=AWL,OPT_HEADER autolearn=no version=2.60 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit > Folks, > > > There has been some discussion about Early Binding Updates on > > the mip6 mailing list. As Early Binding Updates is a handover > > optimization, the proposal also fits into the MobOpts charter. > > Which reminds me: what _is_ the right place these days? > For Mobopts, we would like proposals that are experimental works which could shed light on interesting problems. The result of the discussion should lead to standardization in IETF and possibly IEEE. In other words, treat Mobopts as an opprtunity to discuss your new findings and figure out what needs to be standardized. It is crucial to substantiate your findings before we can arrive at _why_ something needs to be standardized. -Rajeev > > -----Nick > -- > Nick Moore, Resarch Fellow | > Monash University CTIE | > Australian Telecommunications CRC | > > _______________________________________________ > Mobopts mailing list > Mobopts@irtf.org > https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/mobopts _______________________________________________ Mobopts mailing list Mobopts@irtf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/mobopts From exim@www1.ietf.org Thu Feb 12 13:15:07 2004 Received: from optimus.ietf.org (optimus.ietf.org [132.151.1.19]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id NAA05348 for ; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 13:15:07 -0500 (EST) Received: from localhost.localdomain ([127.0.0.1] helo=www1.ietf.org) by optimus.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.20) id 1ArLMG-0004bK-2k for mobopts-archive@odin.ietf.org; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 13:14:40 -0500 Received: (from exim@localhost) by www1.ietf.org (8.12.8/8.12.8/Submit) id i1CIEeKg017672 for mobopts-archive@odin.ietf.org; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 13:14:40 -0500 Received: from odin.ietf.org ([132.151.1.176] helo=ietf.org) by optimus.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.20) id 1ArLMF-0004ab-S6 for mobopts-web-archive@optimus.ietf.org; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 13:14:39 -0500 Received: from ietf-mx (ietf-mx.ietf.org [132.151.6.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id NAA05343 for ; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 13:14:36 -0500 (EST) Received: from ietf-mx ([132.151.6.1]) by ietf-mx with esmtp (Exim 4.12) id 1ArLMC-00026e-00 for mobopts-web-archive@irtf.org; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 13:14:36 -0500 Received: from exim by ietf-mx with spam-scanned (Exim 4.12) id 1ArLLU-000204-00 for mobopts-web-archive@irtf.org; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 13:13:53 -0500 Received: from optimus.ietf.org ([132.151.1.19]) by ietf-mx with esmtp (Exim 4.12) id 1ArLKb-0001rX-00 for mobopts-web-archive@irtf.org; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 13:12:57 -0500 Received: from localhost.localdomain ([127.0.0.1] helo=www1.ietf.org) by optimus.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.20) id 1ArLKe-000464-Mh; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 13:13:00 -0500 Received: from odin.ietf.org ([132.151.1.176] helo=ietf.org) by optimus.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.20) id 1ArLJz-00040m-LR for mobopts@optimus.ietf.org; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 13:12:19 -0500 Received: from ietf-mx (ietf-mx.ietf.org [132.151.6.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id NAA05230 for ; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 13:12:16 -0500 (EST) Received: from ietf-mx ([132.151.6.1]) by ietf-mx with esmtp (Exim 4.12) id 1ArLJv-0001lz-00 for mobopts@irtf.org; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 13:12:15 -0500 Received: from exim by ietf-mx with spam-scanned (Exim 4.12) id 1ArLIy-0001dV-00 for mobopts@irtf.org; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 13:11:16 -0500 Received: from darkstar.iprg.nokia.com ([205.226.5.69]) by ietf-mx with esmtp (Exim 4.12) id 1ArLI1-0001Qh-00 for mobopts@irtf.org; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 13:10:17 -0500 Received: (from root@localhost) by darkstar.iprg.nokia.com (8.11.0/8.11.0-DARKSTAR) id i1CI9gJ28133; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 10:09:42 -0800 X-mProtect: <200402121809> Nokia Silicon Valley Messaging Protection Received: from rajeev.iprg.nokia.com (205.226.2.90, claiming to be "iprg.nokia.com") by darkstar.iprg.nokia.com smtpdEZJbaz; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 10:09:40 PST Message-ID: <402BC159.79501FA0@iprg.nokia.com> Date: Thu, 12 Feb 2004 10:09:29 -0800 From: Rajeev Koodli Organization: Nokia Research Center X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.7 [en] (X11; I; FreeBSD 3.4-RELEASE i386) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Thomas Schmidt CC: mobopts@irtf.org Subject: Re: [Mobopts] Multicast Handover & HMIPv6 References: <402AD299.7030600@fhtw-berlin.de> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: mobopts-admin@ietf.org Errors-To: mobopts-admin@ietf.org X-BeenThere: mobopts@irtf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.12 Precedence: bulk List-Unsubscribe: , List-Id: IP Mobility Optimizations List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.60 (1.212-2003-09-23-exp) on ietf-mx.ietf.org X-Spam-Status: No, hits=1.8 required=5.0 tests=AWL,OPT_HEADER autolearn=no version=2.60 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Hi, the topic is interesting! And, I believe that you have some experimental data as well. So, yes we could discuss it in Seoul. Regards, -Rajeev Thomas Schmidt wrote: > Hi, > > we are experimenting with mobility options in real-time multicast > communication. the question of performing multicast handover in > real-time, in particular ... > > We did some background analysis and simulation of mobility schemes: see > http://www.rz.fhtw-berlin.de/projekte/ipv6/mipv6.html and ICN04-Paper in > particular. > > So we also submitted the draft > (see > http://www.rz.fhtw-berlin.de/projekte/ipv6/draft-schmidt-waehlisch-mhmipv6-01.txt > > if it is not published yet): > > Abstract: > > This document introduces handover mechanisms for IPv6 mobile > multicast listeners and mobile multicast senders. It therefore > restates some fundamentals of mobile multicast signaling. > Operations are based on a Mobile IPv6 environment with local mobility > anchor points. These local anchor points are conformal with a > Hierarchical Mobile IPv6 proxy infrastructure. Handover latencies in > the proposed scheme remain bound to link switching delays with > respect to these local proxy points. > The mechanisms described in this document do not rely on assumptions > of any specific multicast routing protocol in use. The M-HMIPv6 > protocol operations utilize the existing HMIPv6 and MIPv6 messages, > without defining any new control messages. > > Will this be kind of a topic in Seoul? > > Kind regards, > > thomas & matthias > > _______________________________________________ > Mobopts mailing list > Mobopts@irtf.org > https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/mobopts _______________________________________________ Mobopts mailing list Mobopts@irtf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/mobopts From exim@www1.ietf.org Thu Feb 12 13:22:51 2004 Received: from optimus.ietf.org (optimus.ietf.org [132.151.1.19]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id NAA05688 for ; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 13:22:50 -0500 (EST) Received: from localhost.localdomain ([127.0.0.1] helo=www1.ietf.org) by optimus.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.20) id 1ArLTk-0005a2-6D for mobopts-archive@odin.ietf.org; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 13:22:24 -0500 Received: (from exim@localhost) by www1.ietf.org (8.12.8/8.12.8/Submit) id i1CIMOiZ021444 for mobopts-archive@odin.ietf.org; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 13:22:24 -0500 Received: from odin.ietf.org ([132.151.1.176] helo=ietf.org) by optimus.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.20) id 1ArLTk-0005Zn-1G for mobopts-web-archive@optimus.ietf.org; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 13:22:24 -0500 Received: from ietf-mx (ietf-mx.ietf.org [132.151.6.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id NAA05664 for ; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 13:22:20 -0500 (EST) Received: from ietf-mx ([132.151.6.1]) by ietf-mx with esmtp (Exim 4.12) id 1ArLTg-0002rk-00 for mobopts-web-archive@irtf.org; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 13:22:20 -0500 Received: from exim by ietf-mx with spam-scanned (Exim 4.12) id 1ArLSl-0002nA-00 for mobopts-web-archive@irtf.org; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 13:21:24 -0500 Received: from optimus.ietf.org ([132.151.1.19]) by ietf-mx with esmtp (Exim 4.12) id 1ArLSM-0002iV-00 for mobopts-web-archive@irtf.org; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 13:20:58 -0500 Received: from localhost.localdomain ([127.0.0.1] helo=www1.ietf.org) by optimus.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.20) id 1ArLSP-0005Vw-8v; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 13:21:01 -0500 Received: from odin.ietf.org ([132.151.1.176] helo=ietf.org) by optimus.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.20) id 1ArLRp-0005VG-8N for mobopts@optimus.ietf.org; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 13:20:25 -0500 Received: from ietf-mx (ietf-mx.ietf.org [132.151.6.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id NAA05601 for ; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 13:20:21 -0500 (EST) Received: from ietf-mx ([132.151.6.1]) by ietf-mx with esmtp (Exim 4.12) id 1ArLRl-0002gv-00 for mobopts@irtf.org; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 13:20:21 -0500 Received: from exim by ietf-mx with spam-scanned (Exim 4.12) id 1ArLQm-0002bC-00 for mobopts@irtf.org; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 13:19:20 -0500 Received: from darkstar.iprg.nokia.com ([205.226.5.69]) by ietf-mx with esmtp (Exim 4.12) id 1ArLQ1-0002Qy-00 for mobopts@irtf.org; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 13:18:33 -0500 Received: (from root@localhost) by darkstar.iprg.nokia.com (8.11.0/8.11.0-DARKSTAR) id i1CII4R11612 for ; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 10:18:04 -0800 X-mProtect: <200402121818> Nokia Silicon Valley Messaging Protection Received: from rajeev.iprg.nokia.com (205.226.2.90, claiming to be "iprg.nokia.com") by darkstar.iprg.nokia.com smtpdi5ON70; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 10:18:02 PST Message-ID: <402BC350.117D8490@iprg.nokia.com> Date: Thu, 12 Feb 2004 10:17:52 -0800 From: Rajeev Koodli Organization: Nokia Research Center X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.7 [en] (X11; I; FreeBSD 3.4-RELEASE i386) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: mobopts@irtf.org Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: [Mobopts] Slot requests Sender: mobopts-admin@ietf.org Errors-To: mobopts-admin@ietf.org X-BeenThere: mobopts@irtf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.12 Precedence: bulk List-Unsubscribe: , List-Id: IP Mobility Optimizations List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.60 (1.212-2003-09-23-exp) on ietf-mx.ietf.org X-Spam-Status: No, hits=1.8 required=5.0 tests=AWL,OPT_HEADER autolearn=no version=2.60 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Folks, please indicate if you would like to present at Seoul. With your request, please include a relevant document and time you need for your presentation. Have a look at the "proposals for discussion" e-mail sent couple of weeks ago. And, send your presentations to us by Monday, March 1. -Rajeev (for chairs) _______________________________________________ Mobopts mailing list Mobopts@irtf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/mobopts From exim@www1.ietf.org Thu Feb 12 16:10:27 2004 Received: from optimus.ietf.org (optimus.ietf.org [132.151.1.19]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id QAA15996 for ; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 16:10:27 -0500 (EST) Received: from localhost.localdomain ([127.0.0.1] helo=www1.ietf.org) by optimus.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.20) id 1ArO5u-0006cr-Rt for mobopts-archive@odin.ietf.org; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 16:09:59 -0500 Received: (from exim@localhost) by www1.ietf.org (8.12.8/8.12.8/Submit) id i1CL9wl1025465 for mobopts-archive@odin.ietf.org; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 16:09:58 -0500 Received: from odin.ietf.org ([132.151.1.176] helo=ietf.org) by optimus.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.20) id 1ArO5u-0006ce-MB for mobopts-web-archive@optimus.ietf.org; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 16:09:58 -0500 Received: from ietf-mx (ietf-mx.ietf.org [132.151.6.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id QAA15922 for ; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 16:09:56 -0500 (EST) Received: from ietf-mx ([132.151.6.1]) by ietf-mx with esmtp (Exim 4.12) id 1ArO5r-0004o4-00 for mobopts-web-archive@irtf.org; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 16:09:55 -0500 Received: from exim by ietf-mx with spam-scanned (Exim 4.12) id 1ArO4n-0004dF-00 for mobopts-web-archive@irtf.org; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 16:08:49 -0500 Received: from optimus.ietf.org ([132.151.1.19]) by ietf-mx with esmtp (Exim 4.12) id 1ArO3y-0004UT-00 for mobopts-web-archive@irtf.org; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 16:07:58 -0500 Received: from localhost.localdomain ([127.0.0.1] helo=www1.ietf.org) by optimus.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.20) id 1ArO41-00062v-B4; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 16:08:01 -0500 Received: from odin.ietf.org ([132.151.1.176] helo=ietf.org) by optimus.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.20) id 1ArO3P-0005sU-VK for mobopts@optimus.ietf.org; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 16:07:24 -0500 Received: from ietf-mx (ietf-mx.ietf.org [132.151.6.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id QAA15672 for ; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 16:07:22 -0500 (EST) Received: from ietf-mx ([132.151.6.1]) by ietf-mx with esmtp (Exim 4.12) id 1ArO3M-0004QY-00 for mobopts@irtf.org; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 16:07:20 -0500 Received: from exim by ietf-mx with spam-scanned (Exim 4.12) id 1ArO2P-0004J1-00 for mobopts@irtf.org; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 16:06:22 -0500 Received: from junkmail.cs.umd.edu ([128.8.128.69]) by ietf-mx with esmtp (Exim 4.12) id 1ArO1Z-00047k-00 for mobopts@irtf.org; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 16:05:29 -0500 Received: from ramen.cs.umd.edu (ramen.cs.umd.edu [128.8.129.77]) by junkmail.cs.umd.edu (8.12.10/8.12.5) with ESMTP id i1CL4unB016900; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 16:04:56 -0500 (EST) Received: from [IPv6:::1] (ramen.cs.umd.edu [128.8.129.77]) by ramen.cs.umd.edu (8.12.10/8.12.5) with ESMTP id i1CL4sUh010211; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 16:04:54 -0500 (EST) In-Reply-To: <402BBFED.1C31B098@iprg.nokia.com> References: <20040210004940.GA7012@zoic.org> <5F923380-5BCF-11D8-AD75-000A95DC2176@cs.umd.edu> <20040211055936.GA16875@zoic.org> <001e01c3f077$a2735df0$5347038d@tm.unikarlsruhe.de> <20040211092617.GB18626@zoic.org> <009f01c3f09e$f511cf70$5347038d@tm.unika <402BBFED.1C31B098@iprg.nokia.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v612) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Message-Id: <1A9FFCAB-5D9F-11D8-BC4E-000A95DC2176@cs.umd.edu> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Cc: "Nick 'Sharkey' Moore" , mobopts@irtf.org From: William Arbaugh Subject: Re: [Mobopts] "Edge Handovers" Date: Thu, 12 Feb 2004 16:04:53 -0500 To: Rajeev Koodli X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.612) Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: mobopts-admin@ietf.org Errors-To: mobopts-admin@ietf.org X-BeenThere: mobopts@irtf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.12 Precedence: bulk List-Unsubscribe: , List-Id: IP Mobility Optimizations List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.60 (1.212-2003-09-23-exp) on ietf-mx.ietf.org X-Spam-Status: No, hits=1.7 required=5.0 tests=AWL,OPT_HEADER autolearn=no version=2.60 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Let me add to what Rajeev said by saying it also helps (but not required) if you can point to people or a group of people that need the technology. On Feb 12, 2004, at 1:03 PM, Rajeev Koodli wrote: >> > > Folks, > >> >>> There has been some discussion about Early Binding Updates on >>> the mip6 mailing list. As Early Binding Updates is a handover >>> optimization, the proposal also fits into the MobOpts charter. >> >> Which reminds me: what _is_ the right place these days? >> > > For Mobopts, we would like proposals that are experimental works > which could shed light on interesting problems. The result of the > discussion should lead to standardization in IETF and possibly IEEE. > In other words, treat Mobopts as an opprtunity to discuss your new > findings and figure out what needs to be standardized. It is crucial to > substantiate your findings before we can arrive at _why_ something > needs to be standardized. > > > -Rajeev > > >> >> -----Nick >> -- >> Nick Moore, Resarch Fellow | >> Monash University CTIE | >> >> Australian Telecommunications CRC | >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Mobopts mailing list >> Mobopts@irtf.org >> https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/mobopts > > > _______________________________________________ > Mobopts mailing list > Mobopts@irtf.org > https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/mobopts _______________________________________________ Mobopts mailing list Mobopts@irtf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/mobopts From exim@www1.ietf.org Thu Feb 12 20:59:12 2004 Received: from optimus.ietf.org (optimus.ietf.org [132.151.1.19]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id UAA01985 for ; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 20:59:12 -0500 (EST) Received: from localhost.localdomain ([127.0.0.1] helo=www1.ietf.org) by optimus.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.20) id 1ArSbL-0003If-MV for mobopts-archive@odin.ietf.org; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 20:58:44 -0500 Received: (from exim@localhost) by www1.ietf.org (8.12.8/8.12.8/Submit) id i1D1wh3X012679 for mobopts-archive@odin.ietf.org; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 20:58:43 -0500 Received: from odin.ietf.org ([132.151.1.176] helo=ietf.org) by optimus.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.20) id 1ArSbL-0003IP-Fq for mobopts-web-archive@optimus.ietf.org; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 20:58:43 -0500 Received: from ietf-mx (ietf-mx.ietf.org [132.151.6.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id UAA01981 for ; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 20:58:41 -0500 (EST) Received: from ietf-mx ([132.151.6.1]) by ietf-mx with esmtp (Exim 4.12) id 1ArSbH-0003kr-00 for mobopts-web-archive@irtf.org; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 20:58:39 -0500 Received: from exim by ietf-mx with spam-scanned (Exim 4.12) id 1ArSaa-0003eH-00 for mobopts-web-archive@irtf.org; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 20:57:57 -0500 Received: from optimus.ietf.org ([132.151.1.19]) by ietf-mx with esmtp (Exim 4.12) id 1ArSZe-0003VV-00 for mobopts-web-archive@irtf.org; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 20:56:58 -0500 Received: from localhost.localdomain ([127.0.0.1] helo=www1.ietf.org) by optimus.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.20) id 1ArSZh-00036i-JA; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 20:57:01 -0500 Received: from odin.ietf.org ([132.151.1.176] helo=ietf.org) by optimus.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.20) id 1ArSZL-00033T-OX for mobopts@optimus.ietf.org; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 20:56:40 -0500 Received: from ietf-mx (ietf-mx.ietf.org [132.151.6.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id UAA01773 for ; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 20:56:37 -0500 (EST) Received: from ietf-mx ([132.151.6.1]) by ietf-mx with esmtp (Exim 4.12) id 1ArSZH-0003Rq-00 for mobopts@irtf.org; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 20:56:35 -0500 Received: from exim by ietf-mx with spam-scanned (Exim 4.12) id 1ArSYJ-0003MA-00 for mobopts@irtf.org; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 20:55:35 -0500 Received: from dsl-2.241.240.220.dsl.comindico.com.au ([220.240.241.2] helo=anchovy.zoic.org) by ietf-mx with esmtp (Exim 4.12) id 1ArSXR-0003H6-00 for mobopts@irtf.org; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 20:54:42 -0500 Received: by anchovy.zoic.org (Postfix, from userid 1000) id 0D32C7051EF; Fri, 13 Feb 2004 12:54:34 +1100 (EST) Date: Fri, 13 Feb 2004 12:54:33 +1100 From: "Nick 'Sharkey' Moore" To: mobopts@irtf.org Cc: Greg.Daley@eng.monash.edu.au, richardn@cs.waikato.ac.nz Subject: Re: [Mobopts] "Edge Handovers" Message-ID: <20040213015433.GB1317@zoic.org> Mail-Followup-To: mobopts@irtf.org, Greg.Daley@eng.monash.edu.au, richardn@cs.waikato.ac.nz References: <20040210004940.GA7012@zoic.org> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <20040210004940.GA7012@zoic.org> User-Agent: Mutt/1.3.28i X-URL: http://zoic.org/sharkey/ Sender: mobopts-admin@ietf.org Errors-To: mobopts-admin@ietf.org X-BeenThere: mobopts@irtf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.12 Precedence: bulk List-Unsubscribe: , List-Id: IP Mobility Optimizations List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.60 (1.212-2003-09-23-exp) on ietf-mx.ietf.org X-Spam-Status: No, hits=2.2 required=5.0 tests=AWL,OPT_HEADER autolearn=no version=2.60 On 2004-02-10, Nick 'Sharkey' Moore wrote: > > | Edge Handovers (EH) is an interoperable enhancement to Mobile IPv6 to > | reduce handover latency for movement within an edge network, and to > | reduce handover signalling outside the edge network. Greg Daley points out that I first heard of the Buffering idea used in section 4.2 from Richard Nelson, who used to work with us but is now at Waikato Uni. He's since developed the idea in a slightly different direction but I should have acknowledged his contribution anyway: it'll be in -01. (PS: G'day Richard! Draft is by me, JinHyeock Choi of Samsung and Brett Pentland, by the way ... let me know how you'd like to be acknowledged.) -----Nick _______________________________________________ Mobopts mailing list Mobopts@irtf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/mobopts From exim@www1.ietf.org Mon Feb 23 02:13:36 2004 Received: from optimus.ietf.org (optimus.ietf.org [132.151.1.19]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id CAA10241 for ; Mon, 23 Feb 2004 02:13:36 -0500 (EST) Received: from localhost.localdomain ([127.0.0.1] helo=www1.ietf.org) by optimus.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.20) id 1AvAH6-0000j9-GZ for mobopts-archive@odin.ietf.org; Mon, 23 Feb 2004 02:13:09 -0500 Received: (from exim@localhost) by www1.ietf.org (8.12.8/8.12.8/Submit) id i1N7D8Wi002750 for mobopts-archive@odin.ietf.org; Mon, 23 Feb 2004 02:13:08 -0500 Received: from odin.ietf.org ([132.151.1.176] helo=ietf.org) by optimus.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.20) id 1AvAH3-0000i8-8k for mobopts-web-archive@optimus.ietf.org; Mon, 23 Feb 2004 02:13:05 -0500 Received: from ietf-mx (ietf-mx.ietf.org [132.151.6.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id CAA10170 for ; Mon, 23 Feb 2004 02:13:02 -0500 (EST) Received: from ietf-mx ([132.151.6.1]) by ietf-mx with esmtp (Exim 4.12) id 1AvAGz-0007mE-00 for mobopts-web-archive@irtf.org; Mon, 23 Feb 2004 02:13:01 -0500 Received: from exim by ietf-mx with spam-scanned (Exim 4.12) id 1AvAG3-0007hy-00 for mobopts-web-archive@irtf.org; Mon, 23 Feb 2004 02:12:04 -0500 Received: from optimus.ietf.org ([132.151.1.19]) by ietf-mx with esmtp (Exim 4.12) id 1AvAF5-0007eY-00 for mobopts-web-archive@irtf.org; Mon, 23 Feb 2004 02:11:03 -0500 Received: from localhost.localdomain ([127.0.0.1] helo=www1.ietf.org) by optimus.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.20) id 1AvAF7-0008Rb-RU; Mon, 23 Feb 2004 02:11:05 -0500 Received: from odin.ietf.org ([132.151.1.176] helo=ietf.org) by optimus.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.20) id 1AvAEI-0008AL-TZ for mobopts@optimus.ietf.org; Mon, 23 Feb 2004 02:10:14 -0500 Received: from ietf-mx (ietf-mx.ietf.org [132.151.6.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id CAA09036 for ; Mon, 23 Feb 2004 02:10:11 -0500 (EST) Received: from ietf-mx ([132.151.6.1]) by ietf-mx with esmtp (Exim 4.12) id 1AvAEF-0007b7-00 for mobopts@irtf.org; Mon, 23 Feb 2004 02:10:11 -0500 Received: from exim by ietf-mx with spam-scanned (Exim 4.12) id 1AvADM-0007Ws-00 for mobopts@irtf.org; Mon, 23 Feb 2004 02:09:17 -0500 Received: from tama5.ecl.ntt.co.jp ([129.60.39.102]) by ietf-mx with esmtp (Exim 4.12) id 1AvACd-0007Rb-00 for mobopts@irtf.org; Mon, 23 Feb 2004 02:08:31 -0500 Received: from vcs3.rdh.ecl.ntt.co.jp (vcs3.rdh.ecl.ntt.co.jp [129.60.39.110]) by tama5.ecl.ntt.co.jp (8.12.11/8.12.11) with ESMTP id i1N78R2b005749 for ; Mon, 23 Feb 2004 16:08:28 +0900 (JST) Received: from mfs3.rdh.ecl.ntt.co.jp (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by vcs3.rdh.ecl.ntt.co.jp (8.12.11/8.12.11) with ESMTP id i1N78R1K015365 for ; Mon, 23 Feb 2004 16:08:27 +0900 (JST) Received: from mfs3.rdh.ecl.ntt.co.jp (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mfs3.rdh.ecl.ntt.co.jp (8.12.11/8.12.11) with ESMTP id i1N78QaU004709 for ; Mon, 23 Feb 2004 16:08:26 +0900 (JST) Received: from nttmail3.ecl.ntt.co.jp ([129.60.39.100]) by mfs3.rdh.ecl.ntt.co.jp (8.12.11/8.12.11) with ESMTP id i1N78QxP004703 for ; Mon, 23 Feb 2004 16:08:26 +0900 (JST) Received: from eclscan3.m.ecl.ntt.co.jp (eclscan3.m.ecl.ntt.co.jp [129.60.5.69]) by nttmail3.ecl.ntt.co.jp (8.12.11/8.12.11) with ESMTP id i1N78QtX019923 for ; Mon, 23 Feb 2004 16:08:26 +0900 (JST) Received: from imd.m.ecl.ntt.co.jp (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by eclscan3.m.ecl.ntt.co.jp (8.9.3p2/3.7W) with ESMTP id QAA05805 for ; Mon, 23 Feb 2004 16:08:25 +0900 (JST) Received: from imd.m.ecl.ntt.co.jp by imd.m.ecl.ntt.co.jp (8.9.3p2/3.7W) with SMTP id QAA01483 for ; Mon, 23 Feb 2004 16:08:25 +0900 (JST) Message-Id: <200402230708.QAA01483@imd.m.ecl.ntt.co.jp> Date: Mon, 23 Feb 2004 16:08:39 +0900 From: ogawa X-Mailer: EdMax Ver2.85.3F MIME-Version: 1.0 To: mobopts@irtf.org Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: [Mobopts] consecutive FMIP-handovers Sender: mobopts-admin@ietf.org Errors-To: mobopts-admin@ietf.org X-BeenThere: mobopts@irtf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.12 Precedence: bulk List-Unsubscribe: , List-Id: IP Mobility Optimizations List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.60 (1.212-2003-09-23-exp) on ietf-mx.ietf.org X-Spam-Status: No, hits=1.6 required=5.0 tests=AWL,OPT_HEADER autolearn=no version=2.60 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Hi Mobopts folks, Concerning with circumstances where handover happens consecutively, to reduce the number of messages (BU/ BA) between MNs and HA is one of the major issues. Variable solutions would be exist, but I think there might be simpler one based on plain FMIPv6. Main point of this idea is simply separating a router terminating FBU from a router terminating RtSolPr during consecutive FMIP-handovers. Most of all messages and processing are same as plain FMIPv6. An example of sequence is shown in fig. A below. MN A-R PAP NAR | | | | | RtSolPr | | |---------------------->| | | | | | | PrRtAdv | | |<----------------------| | | | | | | FBU | HI | |---------->|---------------------->| | | | | | FBACK | HACK | |<----------|<----------------------| | | | | | | FNA | | |---------------------------------->| | | | | | | NAACK | | |<----------------------------------| fig. A A MN uses a particular router as an anchor-router (A-R) during consecutive handovers. The A-R may be an access router that the MN attached first time or may be other router between the access router and the MN's HA. As a handover is initiated, the MN sends RtSolPr to PAR and get NAR's IP address, and it sends FBU to the A-R instead of PAR. (In some case, the A-R and the PAR are same) The A-R acts as a PAR of plain FMIPv6 and sends HI to the NAR and get HACK from the NAR, and starts sending IP in IP packet to NCoA. The MN dose not send BU to its HA until it changes its A-R. One problem of this method is how the MN gets the IP address of first A-R. This is common to plain FMIP and HMIP, and the results of them might be applied. Second problem of this method is how the MN gets the next A-R. I suppose one solution is adding new option to PrRtAdv informing the MN the IP address of next A-R. I would appreciate it if I hear your comment on this idea. Best regards, -Takeshi _______________________________________________ Mobopts mailing list Mobopts@irtf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/mobopts From exim@www1.ietf.org Mon Feb 23 08:44:57 2004 Received: from optimus.ietf.org (optimus.ietf.org [132.151.1.19]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id IAA25085 for ; Mon, 23 Feb 2004 08:44:56 -0500 (EST) Received: from localhost.localdomain ([127.0.0.1] helo=www1.ietf.org) by optimus.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.20) id 1AvGNo-0000om-MH for mobopts-archive@odin.ietf.org; Mon, 23 Feb 2004 08:44:29 -0500 Received: (from exim@localhost) by www1.ietf.org (8.12.8/8.12.8/Submit) id i1NDiSW8003140 for mobopts-archive@odin.ietf.org; Mon, 23 Feb 2004 08:44:28 -0500 Received: from odin.ietf.org ([132.151.1.176] helo=ietf.org) by optimus.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.20) id 1AvGNo-0000oU-I6 for mobopts-web-archive@optimus.ietf.org; Mon, 23 Feb 2004 08:44:28 -0500 Received: from ietf-mx (ietf-mx.ietf.org [132.151.6.1]) by ietf.org 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References: <200402230708.QAA01483@imd.m.ecl.ntt.co.jp> Subject: Re: [Mobopts] consecutive FMIP-handovers Date: Mon, 23 Feb 2004 14:40:32 +0100 Organization: Institute of Telematics, University of Karlsruhe (TH) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64 Sender: mobopts-admin@ietf.org Errors-To: mobopts-admin@ietf.org X-BeenThere: mobopts@irtf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.12 Precedence: bulk List-Unsubscribe: , List-Id: IP Mobility Optimizations List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.60 (1.212-2003-09-23-exp) on ietf-mx.ietf.org X-Spam-Status: No, hits=3.8 required=5.0 tests=AWL,MIME_BASE64_LATIN, MIME_BASE64_TEXT,OPT_HEADER autolearn=no version=2.60 Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 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exim@www1.ietf.org Mon Feb 23 20:19:05 2004 Received: from optimus.ietf.org (optimus.ietf.org [132.151.1.19]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id UAA06544 for ; Mon, 23 Feb 2004 20:19:05 -0500 (EST) Received: from localhost.localdomain ([127.0.0.1] helo=www1.ietf.org) by optimus.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.20) id 1AvRDZ-0008Bh-SV for mobopts-archive@odin.ietf.org; Mon, 23 Feb 2004 20:18:37 -0500 Received: (from exim@localhost) by www1.ietf.org (8.12.8/8.12.8/Submit) id i1O1IbS2031473 for mobopts-archive@odin.ietf.org; Mon, 23 Feb 2004 20:18:37 -0500 Received: from odin.ietf.org ([132.151.1.176] helo=ietf.org) by optimus.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.20) id 1AvRDZ-0008BY-HX for mobopts-web-archive@optimus.ietf.org; Mon, 23 Feb 2004 20:18:37 -0500 Received: from ietf-mx (ietf-mx.ietf.org [132.151.6.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id UAA06522 for ; Mon, 23 Feb 2004 20:18:35 -0500 (EST) Received: from ietf-mx ([132.151.6.1]) by ietf-mx with esmtp (Exim 4.12) id 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mobopts@irtf.org; Mon, 23 Feb 2004 20:16:31 -0500 Received: from exim by ietf-mx with spam-scanned (Exim 4.12) id 1AvRAY-0003f8-00 for mobopts@irtf.org; Mon, 23 Feb 2004 20:15:31 -0500 Received: from darkstar.iprg.nokia.com ([205.226.5.69]) by ietf-mx with esmtp (Exim 4.12) id 1AvR9a-0003X7-00 for mobopts@irtf.org; Mon, 23 Feb 2004 20:14:30 -0500 Received: (from root@localhost) by darkstar.iprg.nokia.com (8.11.0/8.11.0-DARKSTAR) id i1O1E0I26576 for ; Mon, 23 Feb 2004 17:14:00 -0800 X-mProtect: <200402240114> Nokia Silicon Valley Messaging Protection Received: from rajeev.iprg.nokia.com (205.226.2.90, claiming to be "iprg.nokia.com") by darkstar.iprg.nokia.com smtpdcg1Oee; Mon, 23 Feb 2004 17:13:58 PST Message-ID: <403AA54C.4266F20B@iprg.nokia.com> Date: Mon, 23 Feb 2004 17:13:48 -0800 From: Rajeev Koodli Organization: Nokia Research Center X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.7 [en] (X11; I; FreeBSD 3.4-RELEASE i386) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: mobopts@irtf.org Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: [Mobopts] [Fwd: Agenda for Mobopts] Sender: mobopts-admin@ietf.org Errors-To: mobopts-admin@ietf.org X-BeenThere: mobopts@irtf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.12 Precedence: bulk List-Unsubscribe: , List-Id: IP Mobility Optimizations List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.60 (1.212-2003-09-23-exp) on ietf-mx.ietf.org X-Spam-Status: No, hits=1.5 required=5.0 tests=AWL,OPT_HEADER autolearn=no version=2.60 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Hello folks, here is the agenda. We still have room for another presentation for about 10 minutes. See you next week. Regards, -Rajeev - Intro, blue sheets, 5 mins (chairs) - L2 Triggers, Dave Johnston 15 mins - Edge handover, Nick Sharkey Moore 15 mins draft-moore-mobopts-edge-handovers-00.txt - Vertical handovers, Eric Njedjou, 15 mins draft-daniel-mip6-optimized-vertical-handover-00.txt - Security association for FMIPv6, Takeshi Ogawa, 15 mins draft-ogawa-security-association-fmipv6-00.txt - Handover architecture, Jim Kempf, 15 mins - EAP handover optimization, Bill Arbaugh, 15 mins - Fast handover and context transfer experimental results, Rajeev Koodli, 15 mins _______________________________________________ Mobopts mailing list Mobopts@irtf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/mobopts From exim@www1.ietf.org Tue Feb 24 04:41:24 2004 Received: from optimus.ietf.org (optimus.ietf.org [132.151.1.19]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id EAA09311 for ; Tue, 24 Feb 2004 04:41:24 -0500 (EST) Received: from localhost.localdomain ([127.0.0.1] helo=www1.ietf.org) by optimus.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.20) id 1AvZ3f-0006c2-C6 for mobopts-archive@odin.ietf.org; Tue, 24 Feb 2004 04:40:56 -0500 Received: (from exim@localhost) by www1.ietf.org (8.12.8/8.12.8/Submit) id i1O9etUr025414 for mobopts-archive@odin.ietf.org; Tue, 24 Feb 2004 04:40:55 -0500 Received: from odin.ietf.org ([132.151.1.176] helo=ietf.org) by optimus.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.20) id 1AvZ3f-0006bp-2Q for mobopts-web-archive@optimus.ietf.org; Tue, 24 Feb 2004 04:40:55 -0500 Received: from ietf-mx (ietf-mx.ietf.org [132.151.6.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id EAA09286 for ; Tue, 24 Feb 2004 04:40:52 -0500 (EST) Received: from ietf-mx ([132.151.6.1]) by ietf-mx with esmtp (Exim 4.12) id 1AvZ3c-0007ab-00 for mobopts-web-archive@irtf.org; Tue, 24 Feb 2004 04:40:52 -0500 Received: from exim by ietf-mx with spam-scanned (Exim 4.12) id 1AvZ2i-0007Vc-00 for mobopts-web-archive@irtf.org; Tue, 24 Feb 2004 04:39:57 -0500 Received: from optimus.ietf.org ([132.151.1.19]) by ietf-mx with esmtp (Exim 4.12) id 1AvZ1q-0007RZ-00 for mobopts-web-archive@irtf.org; Tue, 24 Feb 2004 04:39:02 -0500 Received: from localhost.localdomain ([127.0.0.1] helo=www1.ietf.org) by optimus.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.20) id 1AvZ1q-0006Uf-4b; Tue, 24 Feb 2004 04:39:02 -0500 Received: from odin.ietf.org ([132.151.1.176] helo=ietf.org) by optimus.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.20) id 1AvZ1e-0006Ta-QQ for mobopts@optimus.ietf.org; Tue, 24 Feb 2004 04:38:51 -0500 Received: from ietf-mx (ietf-mx.ietf.org [132.151.6.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id EAA09213 for ; Tue, 24 Feb 2004 04:38:48 -0500 (EST) Received: from ietf-mx ([132.151.6.1]) by ietf-mx with esmtp (Exim 4.12) id 1AvZ1b-0007Pb-00 for mobopts@irtf.org; Tue, 24 Feb 2004 04:38:47 -0500 Received: from exim by ietf-mx with spam-scanned (Exim 4.12) id 1AvZ0h-0007LJ-00 for mobopts@irtf.org; Tue, 24 Feb 2004 04:37:52 -0500 Received: from tama5.ecl.ntt.co.jp ([129.60.39.102]) by ietf-mx with esmtp (Exim 4.12) id 1AvYzp-0007GK-00 for mobopts@irtf.org; Tue, 24 Feb 2004 04:36:58 -0500 Received: from vcs3.rdh.ecl.ntt.co.jp (vcs3.rdh.ecl.ntt.co.jp [129.60.39.110]) by tama5.ecl.ntt.co.jp (8.12.11/8.12.11) with ESMTP id i1O9areL029755; Tue, 24 Feb 2004 18:36:54 +0900 (JST) Received: from mfs3.rdh.ecl.ntt.co.jp (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by vcs3.rdh.ecl.ntt.co.jp (8.12.11/8.12.11) with ESMTP id i1O9arLs012676; Tue, 24 Feb 2004 18:36:53 +0900 (JST) Received: from mfs3.rdh.ecl.ntt.co.jp (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mfs3.rdh.ecl.ntt.co.jp (8.12.11/8.12.11) with ESMTP id i1O9aqNh009825; Tue, 24 Feb 2004 18:36:52 +0900 (JST) Received: from nttmail3.ecl.ntt.co.jp ([129.60.39.100]) by mfs3.rdh.ecl.ntt.co.jp (8.12.11/8.12.11) with ESMTP id i1O9aqr6009819; Tue, 24 Feb 2004 18:36:52 +0900 (JST) Received: from eclscan3.m.ecl.ntt.co.jp (eclscan3.m.ecl.ntt.co.jp [129.60.5.69]) by nttmail3.ecl.ntt.co.jp (8.12.11/8.12.11) with ESMTP id i1O9apTv006456; Tue, 24 Feb 2004 18:36:51 +0900 (JST) Received: from imd.m.ecl.ntt.co.jp (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by eclscan3.m.ecl.ntt.co.jp (8.9.3p2/3.7W) with ESMTP id SAA28268; Tue, 24 Feb 2004 18:36:51 +0900 (JST) Received: from imd.m.ecl.ntt.co.jp by imd.m.ecl.ntt.co.jp (8.9.3p2/3.7W) with SMTP id SAA24398; Tue, 24 Feb 2004 18:36:50 +0900 (JST) Message-Id: <200402240936.SAA24398@imd.m.ecl.ntt.co.jp> Date: Tue, 24 Feb 2004 18:37:03 +0900 From: ogawa X-Mailer: EdMax Ver2.85.3F MIME-Version: 1.0 To: "Christian Vogt" Cc: Subject: Re: [Mobopts] consecutive FMIP-handovers Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In-Reply-To: <007901c3fa12$9bda82d0$5347038d@tm.unikarlsruhe.de> References: <007901c3fa12$9bda82d0$5347038d@tm.unikarlsruhe.de> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: mobopts-admin@ietf.org Errors-To: mobopts-admin@ietf.org X-BeenThere: mobopts@irtf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.12 Precedence: bulk List-Unsubscribe: , List-Id: IP Mobility Optimizations List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.60 (1.212-2003-09-23-exp) on ietf-mx.ietf.org X-Spam-Status: No, hits=1.9 required=5.0 tests=AWL,OPT_HEADER autolearn=no version=2.60 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Hi Christian, Mobopts folks, Thank you for your comment. I had missed the appendix (FMIP and HMIPv6), I'm sorry. The appendix A in [1] shows two scenarios. (Appendix A, paragraph 5) The first one involves placing MAPs in place of the ARs, and second one involves placing MAPs in place of the aggregation routers. In the first scenario, the round trip time of FBU/FBACK is longer than the time in the second scenario, but if the aggregation router is placed near the ARs, the round trip time of FBU/FBACK might not make serious problem. And, the number of messages (BU/BA) between MNs and HA will be reduced in both scenario. I suppose the first scenario is adequate if the aggregation router is placed near the ARs, and it would be easy to implement MAPs (placed only in place of the ARs) and MNs in first scenario based on FMIP function. I suppose H-FMIP and edge-handover have similar target. How about to compare these protocols? Did anybody already? I'm sorry if I missed it again. Best regards, - Takeshi "Christian Vogt" wrote: > Hi Ogawa: > > Did you take a look at HMIPv6? > > If I am not mistaken, then your approach is very similar to how the HMIPv6 folks try to combine HMIPv6 with FMIPv6. (See appendix A of [1].) In other words, the MAP used in HMIPv6 is equivalent to your proposed anchor router. Let me know if I am missing something. > > Note that a MAP may also serve as an access router. (Section 2, paragraph 3, in [1].) > > > Second problem of this method is how the MN gets the next > > A-R. I suppose one solution is adding new option to PrRtAdv > > informing the MN the IP address of next A-R. > > HMIPv6 uses an option to the Router Advertisements, called a MAP option, for this purpose. > > Best regards, > > > - Christian > > > [1] http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-ietf-mipshop-hmipv6-01.txt > > > | > | Christian Vogt > | Institute of Telematics, University of Karlsruhe (TH) > | www.tm.uka.de/~chvogt/ > | > > > > ogawa wrote: > > Hi Mobopts folks, > > > > Concerning with circumstances where handover happens > > consecutively, to reduce the number of messages (BU/ BA) > > between MNs and HA is one of the major issues. > > > > Variable solutions would be exist, but I think there might be > > simpler one based on plain FMIPv6. > > > > > > Main point of this idea is simply separating a router > > terminating FBU from a router terminating RtSolPr during > > consecutive FMIP-handovers. > > Most of all messages and processing are same as plain FMIPv6. > > > > An example of sequence is shown in fig. A below. > > > > > > MN A-R PAP NAR > > | | | | > > | RtSolPr | | > > |---------------------->| | > > | | | | > > | PrRtAdv | | > > |<----------------------| | > > | | | | > > | FBU | HI | > > |---------->|---------------------->| > > | | | | > > | FBACK | HACK | > > |<----------|<----------------------| > > | | | | > > | | FNA | | > > |---------------------------------->| > > | | | | > > | | NAACK | | > > |<----------------------------------| > > > > > > fig. A > > > > > > > > > > A MN uses a particular router as an anchor-router (A-R) > > during consecutive handovers. > > > > The A-R may be an access router that the MN attached first > > time or may be other router between the access router and > > the MN's HA. > > As a handover is initiated, the MN sends RtSolPr to PAR and > > get NAR's IP address, and it sends FBU to the A-R instead of > > PAR. (In some case, the A-R and the PAR are same) > > The A-R acts as a PAR of plain FMIPv6 and sends HI to the > > NAR and get HACK from the NAR, and starts sending IP in IP > > packet to NCoA. > > The MN dose not send BU to its HA until it changes its A-R. > > > > One problem of this method is how the MN gets the IP address > > of first A-R. This is common to plain FMIP and HMIP, and the > > results of them might be applied. > > > > Second problem of this method is how the MN gets the next > > A-R. I suppose one solution is adding new option to PrRtAdv > > informing the MN the IP address of next A-R. > > > > > > I would appreciate it if I hear your comment on this idea. > > > > > > Best regards, > > -Takeshi _______________________________________________ Mobopts mailing list Mobopts@irtf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/mobopts From exim@www1.ietf.org Tue Feb 24 05:31:33 2004 Received: from optimus.ietf.org (optimus.ietf.org [132.151.1.19]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id FAA11595 for ; Tue, 24 Feb 2004 05:31:32 -0500 (EST) Received: from localhost.localdomain ([127.0.0.1] helo=www1.ietf.org) by optimus.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.20) id 1AvZqD-00023P-Ij for mobopts-archive@odin.ietf.org; Tue, 24 Feb 2004 05:31:05 -0500 Received: (from exim@localhost) by www1.ietf.org (8.12.8/8.12.8/Submit) id i1OAV5Ds007894 for mobopts-archive@odin.ietf.org; Tue, 24 Feb 2004 05:31:05 -0500 Received: from odin.ietf.org ([132.151.1.176] helo=ietf.org) by optimus.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.20) id 1AvZqD-00023F-6F for mobopts-web-archive@optimus.ietf.org; Tue, 24 Feb 2004 05:31:05 -0500 Received: from ietf-mx (ietf-mx.ietf.org [132.151.6.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id FAA11533 for ; Tue, 24 Feb 2004 05:31:02 -0500 (EST) Received: from ietf-mx ([132.151.6.1]) by ietf-mx with esmtp (Exim 4.12) id 1AvZq9-0004Au-00 for mobopts-web-archive@irtf.org; Tue, 24 Feb 2004 05:31:01 -0500 Received: from exim by ietf-mx with spam-scanned (Exim 4.12) id 1AvZp7-00043b-00 for mobopts-web-archive@irtf.org; Tue, 24 Feb 2004 05:29:58 -0500 Received: from optimus.ietf.org ([132.151.1.19]) by ietf-mx with esmtp (Exim 4.12) id 1AvZoB-0003yi-00 for mobopts-web-archive@irtf.org; Tue, 24 Feb 2004 05:28:59 -0500 Received: from localhost.localdomain ([127.0.0.1] helo=www1.ietf.org) by optimus.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.20) id 1AvZoE-0001jA-3g; Tue, 24 Feb 2004 05:29:02 -0500 Received: from odin.ietf.org ([132.151.1.176] helo=ietf.org) by optimus.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.20) id 1AvZoA-0001ii-Bc for mobopts@optimus.ietf.org; Tue, 24 Feb 2004 05:28:58 -0500 Received: from ietf-mx (ietf-mx.ietf.org [132.151.6.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id FAA11460 for ; Tue, 24 Feb 2004 05:28:55 -0500 (EST) Received: from ietf-mx ([132.151.6.1]) by ietf-mx with esmtp (Exim 4.12) id 1AvZo6-0003xn-00 for mobopts@irtf.org; Tue, 24 Feb 2004 05:28:55 -0500 Received: from exim by ietf-mx with spam-scanned (Exim 4.12) id 1AvZn9-0003sh-00 for mobopts@irtf.org; Tue, 24 Feb 2004 05:27:56 -0500 Received: from tama5.ecl.ntt.co.jp ([129.60.39.102]) by ietf-mx with esmtp (Exim 4.12) id 1AvZmG-0003o8-00 for mobopts@irtf.org; Tue, 24 Feb 2004 05:27:01 -0500 Received: from vcs3.rdh.ecl.ntt.co.jp (vcs3.rdh.ecl.ntt.co.jp [129.60.39.110]) by tama5.ecl.ntt.co.jp (8.12.11/8.12.11) with ESMTP id i1OAQxk9026454 for ; Tue, 24 Feb 2004 19:27:00 +0900 (JST) Received: from mfs3.rdh.ecl.ntt.co.jp (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by vcs3.rdh.ecl.ntt.co.jp (8.12.11/8.12.11) with ESMTP id i1OAQxLV005242 for ; Tue, 24 Feb 2004 19:26:59 +0900 (JST) Received: from mfs3.rdh.ecl.ntt.co.jp (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mfs3.rdh.ecl.ntt.co.jp (8.12.11/8.12.11) with ESMTP id i1OAQw48025329 for ; Tue, 24 Feb 2004 19:26:58 +0900 (JST) Received: from nttmail3.ecl.ntt.co.jp ([129.60.39.100]) by mfs3.rdh.ecl.ntt.co.jp (8.12.11/8.12.11) with ESMTP id i1OAQwt0025323 for ; Tue, 24 Feb 2004 19:26:58 +0900 (JST) Received: from eclscan3.m.ecl.ntt.co.jp (eclscan3.m.ecl.ntt.co.jp [129.60.5.69]) by nttmail3.ecl.ntt.co.jp (8.12.11/8.12.11) with ESMTP id i1OAQv9Q004928 for ; Tue, 24 Feb 2004 19:26:57 +0900 (JST) Received: from imd.m.ecl.ntt.co.jp (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by eclscan3.m.ecl.ntt.co.jp (8.9.3p2/3.7W) with ESMTP id TAA03077 for ; Tue, 24 Feb 2004 19:26:57 +0900 (JST) Received: from imd.m.ecl.ntt.co.jp by imd.m.ecl.ntt.co.jp (8.9.3p2/3.7W) with SMTP id TAA28585 for ; Tue, 24 Feb 2004 19:26:57 +0900 (JST) Message-Id: <200402241026.TAA28585@imd.m.ecl.ntt.co.jp> Date: Tue, 24 Feb 2004 19:27:09 +0900 From: ogawa X-Mailer: EdMax Ver2.85.3F MIME-Version: 1.0 To: mobopts@irtf.org Subject: Re: [Mobopts] [Fwd: Agenda for Mobopts] Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In-Reply-To: <403AA54C.4266F20B@iprg.nokia.com> References: <403AA54C.4266F20B@iprg.nokia.com> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: mobopts-admin@ietf.org Errors-To: mobopts-admin@ietf.org X-BeenThere: mobopts@irtf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.12 Precedence: bulk List-Unsubscribe: , List-Id: IP Mobility Optimizations List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.60 (1.212-2003-09-23-exp) on ietf-mx.ietf.org X-Spam-Status: No, hits=2.1 required=5.0 tests=AWL,OPT_HEADER autolearn=no version=2.60 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Hello folks, At the meeting, I'm going to introduce a new SA establishment method for FMIP (draft-ogawa-security- association-fmipv6-00.txt), and the result of our experiment on it. In this method, the first time an MN attaches itself to an access network, it employs IKE to negotiate with the AR and define a set of ISAKMP SA and IPsec SA parameters (static profile) for FMIP messages. When a handover is initiated, the AR transfers the SA parameters to the NAR by utilizing the new FMIP messages introduced in this draft. As a result, the MN and NAR do not have to negotiate SAs during the handover. The new FMIP message format is based on the IKE and ISAKMP packet formats, so it can be used to transfer various SA parameters according to the security policies of the MN and the network; this also makes it easy to keep the format current with changes and enhancements to IKE and ISAKMP. Furthermore, the message format is designed to carry extra static profiles for the MN. I am going to submit this draft after Mar. 1st. I would very appreciate it if I hear your advice at the meeting. Best regards, -Takeshi Rajeev Koodli wrote: > > Hello folks, > > here is the agenda. We still have room for another presentation for > about 10 minutes. See you next week. > > Regards, > > -Rajeev > > > > - Intro, blue sheets, 5 mins (chairs) > > - L2 Triggers, Dave Johnston 15 mins > > - Edge handover, Nick Sharkey Moore 15 mins > draft-moore-mobopts-edge-handovers-00.txt > > - Vertical handovers, Eric Njedjou, 15 mins > draft-daniel-mip6-optimized-vertical-handover-00.txt > > - Security association for FMIPv6, Takeshi Ogawa, 15 mins > draft-ogawa-security-association-fmipv6-00.txt > > - Handover architecture, Jim Kempf, 15 mins > > - EAP handover optimization, Bill Arbaugh, 15 mins > > - Fast handover and context transfer experimental > results, Rajeev Koodli, 15 mins > > _______________________________________________ > Mobopts mailing list > Mobopts@irtf.org > https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/mobopts _______________________________________________ Mobopts mailing list Mobopts@irtf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/mobopts From exim@www1.ietf.org Wed Feb 25 02:31:34 2004 Received: from optimus.ietf.org (optimus.ietf.org [132.151.1.19]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id CAA29820 for ; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 02:31:34 -0500 (EST) Received: from localhost.localdomain ([127.0.0.1] helo=www1.ietf.org) by optimus.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.20) id 1AvtVZ-0003jc-SO for mobopts-archive@odin.ietf.org; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 02:31:06 -0500 Received: (from exim@localhost) by www1.ietf.org (8.12.8/8.12.8/Submit) id i1P7V5QO014351 for mobopts-archive@odin.ietf.org; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 02:31:05 -0500 Received: from odin.ietf.org ([132.151.1.176] helo=ietf.org) by optimus.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.20) id 1AvtVX-0003jI-OT for mobopts-web-archive@optimus.ietf.org; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 02:31:03 -0500 Received: from ietf-mx (ietf-mx.ietf.org [132.151.6.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id CAA29341 for ; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 02:31:00 -0500 (EST) Received: from ietf-mx ([132.151.6.1]) by ietf-mx with esmtp (Exim 4.12) id 1AvtVU-0001Mv-00 for mobopts-web-archive@irtf.org; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 02:31:00 -0500 Received: from exim by ietf-mx with spam-scanned (Exim 4.12) id 1AvtUE-00014e-00 for mobopts-web-archive@irtf.org; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 02:29:42 -0500 Received: from optimus.ietf.org ([132.151.1.19]) by ietf-mx with esmtp (Exim 4.12) id 1AvtTX-0000zg-00 for mobopts-web-archive@irtf.org; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 02:28:59 -0500 Received: from localhost.localdomain ([127.0.0.1] helo=www1.ietf.org) by optimus.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.20) id 1AvtTZ-0003JX-Q3; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 02:29:01 -0500 Received: from odin.ietf.org ([132.151.1.176] helo=ietf.org) by optimus.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.20) id 1AvtTE-0003Fu-FP for mobopts@optimus.ietf.org; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 02:28:40 -0500 Received: from ietf-mx (ietf-mx.ietf.org [132.151.6.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id CAA27433 for ; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 02:28:37 -0500 (EST) Received: from ietf-mx ([132.151.6.1]) by ietf-mx with esmtp (Exim 4.12) id 1AvtTA-0000yE-00 for mobopts@irtf.org; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 02:28:36 -0500 Received: from exim by ietf-mx with spam-scanned (Exim 4.12) id 1AvtSb-0000tO-00 for mobopts@irtf.org; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 02:28:02 -0500 Received: from key1.docomolabs-usa.com ([216.98.102.225] helo=fridge.docomolabs-usa.com ident=fwuser) by ietf-mx with esmtp (Exim 4.12) id 1AvtRa-0000nv-00 for mobopts@irtf.org; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 02:26:58 -0500 Message-ID: <010001c3fb70$d3df94e0$1e6115ac@dclkempt40> From: "James Kempf" To: "ogawa" , References: <403AA54C.4266F20B@iprg.nokia.com> <200402241026.TAA28585@imd.m.ecl.ntt.co.jp> Subject: Re: [Mobopts] [Fwd: Agenda for Mobopts] Date: Tue, 24 Feb 2004 23:27:29 -0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: mobopts-admin@ietf.org Errors-To: mobopts-admin@ietf.org X-BeenThere: mobopts@irtf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.12 Precedence: bulk List-Unsubscribe: , List-Id: IP Mobility Optimizations List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.60 (1.212-2003-09-23-exp) on ietf-mx.ietf.org X-Spam-Status: No, hits=1.3 required=5.0 tests=AWL,OPT_HEADER autolearn=no version=2.60 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit So why not use Seamoby CTP for this? jak ----- Original Message ----- From: "ogawa" To: Sent: Tuesday, February 24, 2004 2:27 AM Subject: Re: [Mobopts] [Fwd: Agenda for Mobopts] > Hello folks, > > > At the meeting, I'm going to introduce a new SA > establishment method for FMIP (draft-ogawa-security- > association-fmipv6-00.txt), and the result of our > experiment on it. > > In this method, the first time an MN attaches itself to an > access network, it employs IKE to negotiate with the AR and > define a set of ISAKMP SA and IPsec SA parameters (static > profile) for FMIP messages. When a handover is initiated, > the AR transfers the SA parameters to the NAR by utilizing > the new FMIP messages introduced in this draft. As a result, > the MN and NAR do not have to negotiate SAs during the > handover. > The new FMIP message format is based on the IKE and ISAKMP > packet formats, so it can be used to transfer various SA > parameters according to the security policies of the MN and > the network; this also makes it easy to keep the format > current with changes and enhancements to IKE and ISAKMP. > Furthermore, the message format is designed to carry extra > static profiles for the MN. > > I am going to submit this draft after Mar. 1st. > > I would very appreciate it if I hear your advice at the > meeting. > > Best regards, > -Takeshi > > > > Rajeev Koodli wrote: > > > > > Hello folks, > > > > here is the agenda. We still have room for another presentation for > > about 10 minutes. See you next week. > > > > Regards, > > > > -Rajeev > > > > > > > > - Intro, blue sheets, 5 mins (chairs) > > > > - L2 Triggers, Dave Johnston 15 mins > > > > - Edge handover, Nick Sharkey Moore 15 mins > > draft-moore-mobopts-edge-handovers-00.txt > > > > - Vertical handovers, Eric Njedjou, 15 mins > > draft-daniel-mip6-optimized-vertical-handover-00.txt > > > > - Security association for FMIPv6, Takeshi Ogawa, 15 mins > > draft-ogawa-security-association-fmipv6-00.txt > > > > - Handover architecture, Jim Kempf, 15 mins > > > > - EAP handover optimization, Bill Arbaugh, 15 mins > > > > - Fast handover and context transfer experimental > > results, Rajeev Koodli, 15 mins > > > > _______________________________________________ > > Mobopts mailing list > > Mobopts@irtf.org > > https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/mobopts > > > > _______________________________________________ > Mobopts mailing list > Mobopts@irtf.org > https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/mobopts > _______________________________________________ Mobopts mailing list Mobopts@irtf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/mobopts From exim@www1.ietf.org Wed Feb 25 20:03:53 2004 Received: from optimus.ietf.org (optimus.ietf.org [132.151.1.19]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id UAA27593 for ; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 20:03:53 -0500 (EST) Received: from localhost.localdomain ([127.0.0.1] helo=www1.ietf.org) by optimus.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.20) id 1Aw9vv-0005A0-Vc for mobopts-archive@odin.ietf.org; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 20:03:24 -0500 Received: (from exim@localhost) by www1.ietf.org (8.12.8/8.12.8/Submit) id i1Q13N24019836 for mobopts-archive@odin.ietf.org; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 20:03:23 -0500 Received: from odin.ietf.org ([132.151.1.176] helo=ietf.org) by optimus.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.20) id 1Aw9vv-00059r-Q6 for mobopts-web-archive@optimus.ietf.org; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 20:03:23 -0500 Received: from ietf-mx (ietf-mx.ietf.org [132.151.6.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id UAA27590 for ; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 20:03:21 -0500 (EST) Received: from ietf-mx ([132.151.6.1]) by ietf-mx with esmtp (Exim 4.12) id 1Aw9vt-0006bO-00 for mobopts-web-archive@irtf.org; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 20:03:21 -0500 Received: from exim by ietf-mx with spam-scanned (Exim 4.12) id 1Aw9ux-0006Vg-00 for mobopts-web-archive@irtf.org; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 20:02:24 -0500 Received: from optimus.ietf.org ([132.151.1.19]) by ietf-mx with esmtp (Exim 4.12) id 1Aw9ua-0006PP-00 for mobopts-web-archive@irtf.org; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 20:02:00 -0500 Received: from localhost.localdomain ([127.0.0.1] helo=www1.ietf.org) by optimus.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.20) id 1Aw9ub-00056Y-EG; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 20:02:01 -0500 Received: from odin.ietf.org ([132.151.1.176] helo=ietf.org) by optimus.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.20) id 1Aw9ti-000517-4x for mobopts@optimus.ietf.org; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 20:01:06 -0500 Received: from ietf-mx (ietf-mx.ietf.org [132.151.6.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id UAA27501 for ; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 20:01:04 -0500 (EST) Received: from ietf-mx ([132.151.6.1]) by ietf-mx with esmtp (Exim 4.12) id 1Aw9tg-0006Lx-00 for mobopts@irtf.org; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 20:01:04 -0500 Received: from exim by ietf-mx with spam-scanned (Exim 4.12) id 1Aw9sh-0006Eu-00 for mobopts@irtf.org; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 20:00:04 -0500 Received: from tama5.ecl.ntt.co.jp ([129.60.39.102]) by ietf-mx with esmtp (Exim 4.12) id 1Aw9ri-00065B-00 for mobopts@irtf.org; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 19:59:03 -0500 Received: from vcs3.rdh.ecl.ntt.co.jp (vcs3.rdh.ecl.ntt.co.jp [129.60.39.110]) by tama5.ecl.ntt.co.jp (8.12.11/8.12.11) with ESMTP id i1Q0whsH001317; Thu, 26 Feb 2004 09:58:45 +0900 (JST) Received: from mfs3.rdh.ecl.ntt.co.jp (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by vcs3.rdh.ecl.ntt.co.jp (8.12.11/8.12.11) with ESMTP id i1Q0whlF011998; Thu, 26 Feb 2004 09:58:43 +0900 (JST) Received: from mfs3.rdh.ecl.ntt.co.jp (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mfs3.rdh.ecl.ntt.co.jp (8.12.11/8.12.11) with ESMTP id i1Q0wgXd022768; Thu, 26 Feb 2004 09:58:43 +0900 (JST) Received: from nttmail3.ecl.ntt.co.jp ([129.60.39.100]) by mfs3.rdh.ecl.ntt.co.jp (8.12.11/8.12.11) with ESMTP id i1Q0wgbA022764; Thu, 26 Feb 2004 09:58:42 +0900 (JST) Received: from eclscan3.m.ecl.ntt.co.jp (eclscan3.m.ecl.ntt.co.jp [129.60.5.69]) by nttmail3.ecl.ntt.co.jp (8.12.11/8.12.11) with ESMTP id i1Q0weUU002406; Thu, 26 Feb 2004 09:58:41 +0900 (JST) Received: from imd.m.ecl.ntt.co.jp (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by eclscan3.m.ecl.ntt.co.jp (8.9.3p2/3.7W) with ESMTP id JAA24060; Thu, 26 Feb 2004 09:58:39 +0900 (JST) Received: from imd.m.ecl.ntt.co.jp by imd.m.ecl.ntt.co.jp (8.9.3p2/3.7W) with SMTP id JAA21269; Thu, 26 Feb 2004 09:58:39 +0900 (JST) Message-Id: <200402260058.JAA21269@imd.m.ecl.ntt.co.jp> Date: Thu, 26 Feb 2004 09:58:48 +0900 From: ogawa X-Mailer: EdMax Ver2.85.3F MIME-Version: 1.0 To: "James Kempf" Cc: Subject: Re: [Mobopts] [Fwd: Agenda for Mobopts] Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In-Reply-To: <010001c3fb70$d3df94e0$1e6115ac@dclkempt40> References: <010001c3fb70$d3df94e0$1e6115ac@dclkempt40> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: mobopts-admin@ietf.org Errors-To: mobopts-admin@ietf.org X-BeenThere: mobopts@irtf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.12 Precedence: bulk List-Unsubscribe: , List-Id: IP Mobility Optimizations List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.60 (1.212-2003-09-23-exp) on ietf-mx.ietf.org X-Spam-Status: No, hits=2.1 required=5.0 tests=AWL,OPT_HEADER autolearn=no version=2.60 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Hi James, Thank you for your question. I think FMIP protocol is necessary for seamless handovers. But, if we combine plain FMIP and plain CTP, messages between MNs and ARs might be redundant; furthermore, we must manage IPsec Keyes for FMIP messages and, Keys for Authorization token of CTP messages. With our proposed method, only two messages between ARs are added to plain FMIP protocols and contexts necessary for seamless handovers are transferred by them, and key management is simpler, I suppose. Best regards, -Takeshi "James Kempf" wrote: > So why not use Seamoby CTP for this? > > jak > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "ogawa" > To: > Sent: Tuesday, February 24, 2004 2:27 AM > Subject: Re: [Mobopts] [Fwd: Agenda for Mobopts] > > > > Hello folks, > > > > > > At the meeting, I'm going to introduce a new SA > > establishment method for FMIP (draft-ogawa-security- > > association-fmipv6-00.txt), and the result of our > > experiment on it. > > > > In this method, the first time an MN attaches itself to an > > access network, it employs IKE to negotiate with the AR and > > define a set of ISAKMP SA and IPsec SA parameters (static > > profile) for FMIP messages. When a handover is initiated, > > the AR transfers the SA parameters to the NAR by utilizing > > the new FMIP messages introduced in this draft. As a result, > > the MN and NAR do not have to negotiate SAs during the > > handover. > > The new FMIP message format is based on the IKE and ISAKMP > > packet formats, so it can be used to transfer various SA > > parameters according to the security policies of the MN and > > the network; this also makes it easy to keep the format > > current with changes and enhancements to IKE and ISAKMP. > > Furthermore, the message format is designed to carry extra > > static profiles for the MN. > > > > I am going to submit this draft after Mar. 1st. > > > > I would very appreciate it if I hear your advice at the > > meeting. > > > > Best regards, > > -Takeshi > > > > > > > > Rajeev Koodli wrote: > > > > > > > > Hello folks, > > > > > > here is the agenda. We still have room for another presentation for > > > about 10 minutes. See you next week. > > > > > > Regards, > > > > > > -Rajeev > > > > > > > > > > > > - Intro, blue sheets, 5 mins (chairs) > > > > > > - L2 Triggers, Dave Johnston 15 mins > > > > > > - Edge handover, Nick Sharkey Moore 15 mins > > > draft-moore-mobopts-edge-handovers-00.txt > > > > > > - Vertical handovers, Eric Njedjou, 15 mins > > > draft-daniel-mip6-optimized-vertical-handover-00.txt > > > > > > - Security association for FMIPv6, Takeshi Ogawa, 15 mins > > > draft-ogawa-security-association-fmipv6-00.txt > > > > > > - Handover architecture, Jim Kempf, 15 mins > > > > > > - EAP handover optimization, Bill Arbaugh, 15 mins > > > > > > - Fast handover and context transfer experimental > > > results, Rajeev Koodli, 15 mins > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > > Mobopts mailing list > > > Mobopts@irtf.org > > > https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/mobopts > > > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > Mobopts mailing list > > Mobopts@irtf.org > > https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/mobopts > > _______________________________________________ Mobopts mailing list Mobopts@irtf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/mobopts From exim@www1.ietf.org Wed Feb 25 21:07:43 2004 Received: from optimus.ietf.org (optimus.ietf.org [132.151.1.19]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id VAA29886 for ; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 21:07:43 -0500 (EST) Received: from localhost.localdomain ([127.0.0.1] helo=www1.ietf.org) by optimus.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.20) id 1AwAvj-0002TK-EW for mobopts-archive@odin.ietf.org; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 21:07:15 -0500 Received: (from exim@localhost) by www1.ietf.org (8.12.8/8.12.8/Submit) id i1Q27FAE009499 for mobopts-archive@odin.ietf.org; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 21:07:15 -0500 Received: from odin.ietf.org ([132.151.1.176] helo=ietf.org) by optimus.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.20) id 1AwAvi-0002T0-Pn for mobopts-web-archive@optimus.ietf.org; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 21:07:14 -0500 Received: from ietf-mx (ietf-mx.ietf.org [132.151.6.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id VAA29881 for ; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 21:07:12 -0500 (EST) Received: from ietf-mx ([132.151.6.1]) by ietf-mx with esmtp (Exim 4.12) id 1AwAvg-0004MA-00 for mobopts-web-archive@irtf.org; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 21:07:12 -0500 Received: from exim by ietf-mx with spam-scanned (Exim 4.12) id 1AwAuo-0004He-00 for mobopts-web-archive@irtf.org; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 21:06:19 -0500 Received: from optimus.ietf.org ([132.151.1.19]) by ietf-mx with esmtp (Exim 4.12) id 1AwAuW-0004Ce-00 for mobopts-web-archive@irtf.org; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 21:06:00 -0500 Received: from localhost.localdomain ([127.0.0.1] helo=www1.ietf.org) by optimus.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.20) id 1AwAuX-0002Hw-Of; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 21:06:01 -0500 Received: from odin.ietf.org ([132.151.1.176] helo=ietf.org) by optimus.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.20) id 1AwAti-0002EK-80 for mobopts@optimus.ietf.org; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 21:05:10 -0500 Received: from ietf-mx (ietf-mx.ietf.org [132.151.6.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id VAA29813 for ; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 21:05:07 -0500 (EST) Received: from ietf-mx ([132.151.6.1]) by ietf-mx with esmtp (Exim 4.12) id 1AwAtf-00049q-00 for mobopts@irtf.org; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 21:05:07 -0500 Received: from exim by ietf-mx with spam-scanned (Exim 4.12) id 1AwAsm-00045S-00 for mobopts@irtf.org; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 21:04:12 -0500 Received: from key1.docomolabs-usa.com ([216.98.102.225] helo=fridge.docomolabs-usa.com ident=fwuser) by ietf-mx with esmtp (Exim 4.12) id 1AwAsT-00041H-00 for mobopts@irtf.org; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 21:03:54 -0500 Message-ID: <04d501c3fc0c$d8e99660$1e6115ac@dclkempt40> From: "James Kempf" To: "ogawa" Cc: References: <010001c3fb70$d3df94e0$1e6115ac@dclkempt40> <200402260058.JAA21269@imd.m.ecl.ntt.co.jp> Subject: Re: [Mobopts] [Fwd: Agenda for Mobopts] Date: Wed, 25 Feb 2004 18:03:39 -0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: mobopts-admin@ietf.org Errors-To: mobopts-admin@ietf.org X-BeenThere: mobopts@irtf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.12 Precedence: bulk List-Unsubscribe: , List-Id: IP Mobility Optimizations List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.60 (1.212-2003-09-23-exp) on ietf-mx.ietf.org X-Spam-Status: No, hits=1.3 required=5.0 tests=AWL,OPT_HEADER autolearn=no version=2.60 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Right, that is one issue with CTP and why we need a unified handover protocol that covers all the functions with a minimum amount of signaling but is customizable for particular link types, like Neighbor Discovery is customizable for serial/NBMA/Ethernet-type links. Which is going to be the topic of my short talk. There's another issue with transferring IPsec SA context, though. Typically the security types get very uncomfortable with this, because it now means that there are two entities who know the DH established secret shared key - the PAR and NAR. If the context is transferred further, then it makes the security even more subject to compromise. So, at best, context transfer for IPsec SA context probably should only be used for exactly as long as it takes the MN to do another DH key exchange on the NAR. The MOBIKE WG is talking about how to move IPsec SAs, though I believe they are only considering the case when one end of the SA moves. The case of moving the SA between ARs is really concerned with both ends moving, since the MN will be obtaining a new CoA as well. If I have time, I will try to read your draft. jak ----- Original Message ----- From: "ogawa" To: "James Kempf" Cc: Sent: Wednesday, February 25, 2004 4:58 PM Subject: Re: [Mobopts] [Fwd: Agenda for Mobopts] > Hi James, > > Thank you for your question. > > I think FMIP protocol is necessary for seamless handovers. > But, if we combine plain FMIP and plain CTP, messages > between MNs and ARs might be redundant; furthermore, we must > manage IPsec Keyes for FMIP messages and, Keys for > Authorization token of CTP messages. > > With our proposed method, only two messages between ARs are > added to plain FMIP protocols and contexts necessary for > seamless handovers are transferred by them, and key > management is simpler, I suppose. > > > Best regards, > -Takeshi > > > "James Kempf" wrote: > > > So why not use Seamoby CTP for this? > > > > jak > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > From: "ogawa" > > To: > > Sent: Tuesday, February 24, 2004 2:27 AM > > Subject: Re: [Mobopts] [Fwd: Agenda for Mobopts] > > > > > > > Hello folks, > > > > > > > > > At the meeting, I'm going to introduce a new SA > > > establishment method for FMIP (draft-ogawa-security- > > > association-fmipv6-00.txt), and the result of our > > > experiment on it. > > > > > > In this method, the first time an MN attaches itself to an > > > access network, it employs IKE to negotiate with the AR and > > > define a set of ISAKMP SA and IPsec SA parameters (static > > > profile) for FMIP messages. When a handover is initiated, > > > the AR transfers the SA parameters to the NAR by utilizing > > > the new FMIP messages introduced in this draft. As a result, > > > the MN and NAR do not have to negotiate SAs during the > > > handover. > > > The new FMIP message format is based on the IKE and ISAKMP > > > packet formats, so it can be used to transfer various SA > > > parameters according to the security policies of the MN and > > > the network; this also makes it easy to keep the format > > > current with changes and enhancements to IKE and ISAKMP. > > > Furthermore, the message format is designed to carry extra > > > static profiles for the MN. > > > > > > I am going to submit this draft after Mar. 1st. > > > > > > I would very appreciate it if I hear your advice at the > > > meeting. > > > > > > Best regards, > > > -Takeshi > > > > > > > > > > > > Rajeev Koodli wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > Hello folks, > > > > > > > > here is the agenda. We still have room for another presentation for > > > > about 10 minutes. See you next week. > > > > > > > > Regards, > > > > > > > > -Rajeev > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > - Intro, blue sheets, 5 mins (chairs) > > > > > > > > - L2 Triggers, Dave Johnston 15 mins > > > > > > > > - Edge handover, Nick Sharkey Moore 15 mins > > > > draft-moore-mobopts-edge-handovers-00.txt > > > > > > > > - Vertical handovers, Eric Njedjou, 15 mins > > > > draft-daniel-mip6-optimized-vertical-handover-00.txt > > > > > > > > - Security association for FMIPv6, Takeshi Ogawa, 15 mins > > > > draft-ogawa-security-association-fmipv6-00.txt > > > > > > > > - Handover architecture, Jim Kempf, 15 mins > > > > > > > > - EAP handover optimization, Bill Arbaugh, 15 mins > > > > > > > > - Fast handover and context transfer experimental > > > > results, Rajeev Koodli, 15 mins > > > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > > > Mobopts mailing list > > > > Mobopts@irtf.org > > > > https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/mobopts > > > > > > > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > > Mobopts mailing list > > > Mobopts@irtf.org > > > https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/mobopts > > > > > > _______________________________________________ Mobopts mailing list Mobopts@irtf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/mobopts From exim@www1.ietf.org Thu Feb 26 03:21:11 2004 Received: from optimus.ietf.org (optimus.ietf.org [132.151.1.19]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id DAA26497 for ; Thu, 26 Feb 2004 03:21:11 -0500 (EST) Received: from localhost.localdomain ([127.0.0.1] helo=www1.ietf.org) by optimus.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.20) id 1AwGl7-0006Js-Qb for mobopts-archive@odin.ietf.org; Thu, 26 Feb 2004 03:20:42 -0500 Received: (from exim@localhost) by www1.ietf.org (8.12.8/8.12.8/Submit) id i1Q8KfiZ024279 for mobopts-archive@odin.ietf.org; Thu, 26 Feb 2004 03:20:41 -0500 Received: from odin.ietf.org ([132.151.1.176] helo=ietf.org) by optimus.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.20) id 1AwGl6-0006JS-5y for mobopts-web-archive@optimus.ietf.org; Thu, 26 Feb 2004 03:20:40 -0500 Received: from ietf-mx (ietf-mx.ietf.org [132.151.6.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id DAA26494 for ; Thu, 26 Feb 2004 03:20:38 -0500 (EST) Received: from ietf-mx ([132.151.6.1]) by ietf-mx with esmtp (Exim 4.12) id 1AwGl3-0006ey-00 for mobopts-web-archive@irtf.org; Thu, 26 Feb 2004 03:20:37 -0500 Received: from exim by ietf-mx with spam-scanned (Exim 4.12) id 1AwGk3-0006ZT-00 for mobopts-web-archive@irtf.org; 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Thu, 26 Feb 2004 03:16:47 -0500 Received: from vcs3.rdh.ecl.ntt.co.jp (vcs3.rdh.ecl.ntt.co.jp [129.60.39.110]) by tama5.ecl.ntt.co.jp (8.12.11/8.12.11) with ESMTP id i1Q8GZZf011747; Thu, 26 Feb 2004 17:16:35 +0900 (JST) Received: from mfs3.rdh.ecl.ntt.co.jp (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by vcs3.rdh.ecl.ntt.co.jp (8.12.11/8.12.11) with ESMTP id i1Q8GYNo003545; Thu, 26 Feb 2004 17:16:34 +0900 (JST) Received: from mfs3.rdh.ecl.ntt.co.jp (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mfs3.rdh.ecl.ntt.co.jp (8.12.11/8.12.11) with ESMTP id i1Q8GXWV004308; Thu, 26 Feb 2004 17:16:34 +0900 (JST) Received: from nttmail3.ecl.ntt.co.jp ([129.60.39.100]) by mfs3.rdh.ecl.ntt.co.jp (8.12.11/8.12.11) with ESMTP id i1Q8GX5G004304; Thu, 26 Feb 2004 17:16:33 +0900 (JST) Received: from eclscan3.m.ecl.ntt.co.jp (eclscan3.m.ecl.ntt.co.jp [129.60.5.69]) by nttmail3.ecl.ntt.co.jp (8.12.11/8.12.11) with ESMTP id i1Q8GXwa025946; Thu, 26 Feb 2004 17:16:33 +0900 (JST) Received: from imd.m.ecl.ntt.co.jp (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by eclscan3.m.ecl.ntt.co.jp (8.9.3p2/3.7W) with ESMTP id RAA11134; Thu, 26 Feb 2004 17:16:32 +0900 (JST) Received: from imd.m.ecl.ntt.co.jp by imd.m.ecl.ntt.co.jp (8.9.3p2/3.7W) with SMTP id RAA02712; Thu, 26 Feb 2004 17:16:32 +0900 (JST) Message-Id: <200402260816.RAA02712@imd.m.ecl.ntt.co.jp> Date: Thu, 26 Feb 2004 17:16:40 +0900 From: ogawa X-Mailer: EdMax Ver2.85.3F MIME-Version: 1.0 To: "James Kempf" Cc: Subject: Re: [Mobopts] [Fwd: Agenda for Mobopts] Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-2022-JP Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In-Reply-To: <04d501c3fc0c$d8e99660$1e6115ac@dclkempt40> References: <04d501c3fc0c$d8e99660$1e6115ac@dclkempt40> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: mobopts-admin@ietf.org Errors-To: mobopts-admin@ietf.org X-BeenThere: mobopts@irtf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.12 Precedence: bulk List-Unsubscribe: , List-Id: IP Mobility Optimizations List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.60 (1.212-2003-09-23-exp) on ietf-mx.ietf.org X-Spam-Status: No, hits=2.2 required=5.0 tests=AWL,OPT_HEADER autolearn=no version=2.60 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Hi James, Mobopts folks, Thank you for your comment. I'm very interested in MOBIKE WG, and going to attend the meeting too, if I can. Here is my draft. I submitted our draft to IETF administrator, but it was rejected because it was after "cutoff date". I am going to re-submit it after Mar. 1st. I would appreciate it if I hear your advice. Thaks in advance. Best regards, -Takeshi "James Kempf" wrote: > Right, that is one issue with CTP and why we need a unified handover > protocol that covers all the functions with a minimum amount of signaling > but is customizable for particular link types, like Neighbor Discovery is > customizable for serial/NBMA/Ethernet-type links. Which is going to be the > topic of my short talk. > > There's another issue with transferring IPsec SA context, though. Typically > the security types get very uncomfortable with this, because it now means > that there are two entities who know the DH established secret shared key - > the PAR and NAR. If the context is transferred further, then it makes the > security even more subject to compromise. So, at best, context transfer for > IPsec SA context probably should only be used for exactly as long as it > takes the MN to do another DH key exchange on the NAR. > > The MOBIKE WG is talking about how to move IPsec SAs, though I believe they > are only considering the case when one end of the SA moves. The case of > moving the SA between ARs is really concerned with both ends moving, since > the MN will be obtaining a new CoA as well. > > If I have time, I will try to read your draft. > > jak MOBOPTS Research Group Internet Draft T. Ogawa H. Ohnishi H. Yoshitake Document: draft-ogawa-security-association- NTT Corporation fmipv6-00.txt Expires: August 21, 2004 February 20, 2004 Security Association for FMIP Messages Status of this Memo This document is an Internet-Draft and is in full conformance with all provisions of Section 10 of RFC2026 [RFC2026]. Internet-Drafts are working documents of the Internet Engineering Task Force (IETF), its areas, and its working groups. Note that other groups may also distribute working documents as Internet-Drafts. Internet-Drafts are draft documents valid for a maximum of six months and may be updated, replaced, or obsoleted by other documents at any time. It is inappropriate to use Internet-Drafts as reference material or to cite them other than as "work in progress." The list of current Internet-Drafts can be accessed at http://www.ietf.org/ietf/1id-abstracts.txt The list of Internet-Draft Shadow Directories can be accessed at http://www.ietf.org/shadow.html. Abstract Fast Handovers for Mobile IP (FMIP) v6 [FMIP] is a key technology for IP mobility service networks. With FMIP, a Previous Access Router (PAR) redirects a mobile node (MN) traffic to a New Care-of Address (NCoA) during a handover in order to reduce handover latency and packet loss. To prevent service stealing or redirection of traffic to a dubious node, FMIP messages must be authenticated by IPsec. The question of how to establish IPsec security associations (SAs) for FMIP messages between MNs and Access Routers (ARs), however, has not yet been addressed in the current FMIP v6 effort. This draft introduces a new SA establishment method for FMIP between MNs and ARs. In this method, the first time an MN attaches itself to an access network, it employs IKE to negotiate with the AR and define a set of ISAKMP SA and IPsec SA parameters (static profile) for FMIP Ogawa, et. al. Expires - August 2004 [Page 1] Security Association for FMIP Messages February 2004 messages. When a handover is initiated, the AR transfers the SA parameters to the NAR by utilizing the new FMIP messages introduced in this draft. As a result, the MN and NAR do not have to negotiate SAs during the handover. The new FMIP message format is based on the [IKE] and [ISAKMP] packet formats, so it can be used to transfer various SA parameters according to the security policies of the MN and the network; this also makes it easy to keep the format current with changes and enhancements to [IKE] and [ISAKMP]. Furthermore, the message format is designed to carry extra static profiles for the MN. Conventions used in this document The key words "MUST", "MUST NOT", "REQUIRED", "SHALL", "SHALL NOT", "SHOULD", "SHOULD NOT", "RECOMMENDED", "MAY", and "OPTIONAL" in this document are to be interpreted as described in RFC2119 [RFC2119]. Table of Contents 1. Introduction...................................................2 2. Terminology....................................................4 3. Protocol Overview..............................................5 4. IPsec and IKE requirements.....................................7 5. Protocol Details...............................................7 5.1 Access authentication and IKE..............................7 5.2 RtSolPr, CT, CTACK, and PrRtAdv............................7 5.3 FBU, HI, HACK, and FBACK...................................8 5.4 Re-keying..................................................9 6. Message format.................................................9 6.1 CT message.................................................9 6.2 Context Data block........................................10 6.3 CTACK.....................................................11 6.4 Context Data..............................................12 7. Configurable Parameters.......................................15 8. Security Considerations.......................................15 References.......................................................15 Author's Addresses...............................................16 1. Introduction There is increasing demand for a ubiquitous, next-generation IP service, where IP communication will be possible anytime, anywhere, and with anybody. In a ubiquitous network, IP addresses will be assigned to various devices (nodes) which are able to move seamlessly throughout the network. Ogawa, et. al. Expires - August 2004 [Page 2] Security Association for FMIP Messages February 2004 To achieve mobility at the IP layer, the Internet Engineering Task Force (IETF) has been developing Mobile IPv6 (MIPv6) technology [MIPv6], which allows nodes to maintain connectivity while moving. Unfortunately, the handover latency and packet loss during handover according to standard MIPv6 procedures are often unacceptable for real-time traffic, such as Voice over IP (VoIP) and throughput- sensitive applications. To reduce the handover latency and packet loss, Fast Handovers for Mobile IP (FMIP) v6 [FMIP] is being studied within the IETF. With FMIP, a Previous Access Router (PAR) redirects a mobile node$BCT(B (MN$BCT(B) traffic to a New Care-of Address (NCoA) during a handover. To prevent service stealing or redirection of traffic to a dubious node, FMIP messages must be authenticated by IPsec. The question of how to establish IPsec security associations (SAs) for FMIP messages between MNs and Access Routers (ARs), however, has not yet been addressed in the current FMIP v6 effort. The longer an individual SA is in use, the greater the risk of a key being stolen. Therefore, an IPsec SA should usually be negotiated by using IKE when communication starts, and when its lifetime ends, a new SA should be re-keyed. In the case of FMIP, however, the AR with which an MN communicates changes when it moves. If it has to negotiate an SA with a new AR (NAR) for each handover, handovers will take longer, and the quality of communication between the MN and its correspondent node (CN) could deteriorate. There are two alternatives that require no negotiation between the MN and NAR to establish SAs when the MN moves. - Distribution Method The first time an MN attaches to the access network, it negotiates a set of SA parameters for FMIP messages with the network, which then distributes the parameters to all ARs before the handover. - Transfer Method The first time an MN attaches to the access network, it negotiates a set of SA parameters for FMIP messages with an AR, and the AR transfers the SA parameters to potential NARs when a handover is initiated. In a large-scale network, such as a public network, the number of messages distributed via the Distribution Method will be huge, so we propose that the Transfer Method should be used instead. In the remainder of this document, a new SA establishment method for FMIP messages, based on the Transfer Method, is described. This method includes three main features. Ogawa, et. al. Expires - August 2004 [Page 3] Security Association for FMIP Messages February 2004 o IKE is used to establish SAs the first time an MN attaches to the access network, and to re-key the SAs when the lifetimes of the initial SAs expire. It is assumed that the proposed SA attributes depend on the MNs but are independent of the ARs, and that the SA attributes supported by an AR are commonly supported by other ARs. o The PAR sends a set of SA parameters to the NAR as it receives RtSolPr message, instead of FBU message, because an FNA may be sent to the NAR before the PAR receives the FBU in a "reactive" fast handover. o The message format introduced in this document is based on [CT], [IKE] and [ISAKMP]. This enables the PAR to transfer various SA parameters according to the security policies of the MN and the network, as well as making it easy to stay current with [IKE] and [ISAKMP] when they are enhanced or changed. Furthermore, the message format is designed to carry extra static profiles for the MN. 2. Terminology The following terminology and abbreviations are used in this document, based on [FMIP]. Mobile Node (MN) A Mobile IPv6 host. Access Point (AP) A layer-2 device connected to a subnet offering wireless connectivity to an MN. Access Router (AR) An MN's default router. Previous Access Router (PAR) An MN's default router prior to a handover. New Access Router (NAR) An MN's anticipated default router subsequent to a handover. Previous CoA (PCoA) An MN's Care-of Address valid in its PAR. The MN may reuse this address while attached to the NAR, until it finishes its Mobile IP operations. New CoA (NCoA) An MN's Care of Address valid in an NAR. Handover (HO) The process of terminating existing connectivity and Ogawa, et. al. Expires - August 2004 [Page 4] Security Association for FMIP Messages February 2004 establishing new IP connectivity. Router Solicitation for Proxy (RtSolPr) A message from an MN to its PAR requesting information for a potential handover. Proxy Router Advertisement (PrRtAdv) A message from a PAR indicating that an MN may undergo a handover. Fast Binding Update (FBU) A message from an MN instructing its PAR to redirect its traffic (towards its NAR). Fast Binding Acknowledgment (FBACK) A message from a PAR in response to an FBU. Fast Neighbor Advertisement (FNA) A message from an MN to an NAR to announce attachment and confirm the use of an NCoA when the MN has not received an FBACK. Handover Initiate (HI) A message from a PAR to an NAR to initiate handover. Handover Acknowledge (HACK) A message from an NAR to a PAR in response to an HI. The following terminology and abbreviations are introduced and used in this document. Context Transfer (CT) message A message from a PAR to an NAR, containing SA parameters generated by IKE phase 1 and phase 2. It may contain a further static profile for the MN. Context Transfer Acknowledgment (CTACK) A message from an NAR to a PAR in response to a CT. 3. Protocol Overview In this method, the transfer of SA parameters between ARs is achieved by utilizing new FMIP messages, instead of other, existing protocols. The reason is that if an existing protocol, such as context transfer [CT], were combined with FMIP, some functions would be duplicated, while some essential functions would not be defined. For example, in the context transfer protocol, an MN sends a CTAR [CT] message to a PAR or NAR to activate the protocol. This can be replaced by using existing FMIP messages. Furthermore, the SA establishment method for CTAR has not been specified. Ogawa, et. al. Expires - August 2004 [Page 5] Security Association for FMIP Messages February 2004 Figure 1 shows a sequence example for the proposed method. MN PAR NAR |<==========access authentication======>| | (beyond the scope of this document) | | | | | | | |<======IKE ph1====>| | |<======IKE ph2====>| | | | | (MN detects HO trigger) | | | | |-----RtSolPr------>|---(*)CT---------->| |<----PrRtAdv-------| | | |<-(*)CTACK---------| | | | |-----FBU---------->|------HI---------->| |<-----FBACK--------|<----HACK----------| | | | | | | ====attach to NAR====== | | | |---------------FNA-------------------->| |<--------------NAACK-------------------| | | | (*): new FMIP message Figure 1: Sequence example for the proposed method. The first time an MN attaches itself to the access network, it processes access authentication with the network, by a method such as 802.1x or a Protocol for carrying Authentication for Network Access (PANA), or other method. These protocols are out of the scope of this document. Then, the MN starts [IKE] phase 1 to negotiate an ISAKMP SA between itself and a PAR, and it processes [IKE] phase2 to negotiate an IPsec SA with the PAR. The new messages, CT and CTACK, are then introduced. When a PAR receives an RtSolPr message, it MUST send a CT to the NAR(s) corresponding to the RtSolPr. If the PrRtAdv contains multiple IP addresses for NARs, the PAR MUST send CTs to those NARs. The CT message contains the SA parameters generated in IKE phase 1 and phase 2. For example, it includes an encryption algorithm, hush algorithm, authentication method, generated keys, SA lifetime, SPIs, etc. If a pre-shared key is used in IKE phase 1, it may also be Ogawa, et. al. Expires - August 2004 [Page 6] Security Association for FMIP Messages February 2004 transferred. The data to be transferred are described in section 4 of this draft. Furthermore, the CT message may contain extra static profiles for the MN. The NAR(s) send CTACK messages in response to CT messages, and it/they build an SA database from the CT messages. When the soft-timer for the SA lifetime expires, the initiator, which is usually the MN, starts re-keying according to the IKE protocol. In addition, if the handover trigger occurs during re-keying between the MN and the PAR, the MN SHOULD stop the re-keying process and start the handover process (i.e, send RtSolPr), then restart re- keying with the NAR after receiving an NAACK from the NAR. 4. IPsec and IKE requirements The following requirements apply to both ARs and MNs: o Automatic key management via IKE [5] MUST be supported. Only IKEv1 is discussed in this document. o ESP encapsulation of FBUs, FBACKs, FNAs, and NAACKs between MNs and ARs MUST be supported and MUST be used. o ESP encapsulation of RtSolPr and PrRtAdv between MNs and ARs MUST be supported and SHOULD be used. 5. Protocol Details All descriptions here make use of Figure 1 as a reference. 5.1 Access authentication and IKE After the first time an MN attaches to the access network, it MUST start the IKE process with an AR belonging to the same subnet and establish ISAKMP and IPsec SAs for FMIP messages. The question of how to find the first PAR is beyond the scope of this document. 5.2 RtSolPr, CT, CTACK, and PrRtAdv After discovering a nearby access point, the MN produces an RtSolPr message containing new attachment point(s), and it SHOULD apply ESP in transport mode to the message and send it to the PAR. When the PAR receives the RtsolPr message, it produces a PrRtAdv message, and it SHOULD apply ESP in transport mode to the message and send it to the MN. If the new attachment point(s) are known and the PAR has information about them, it MUST send a CT message to them (one or more NARs). The CT message contains the SA parameters negotiated by IKE, including the encryption algorithm, hush algorithm, authentication method, generated keys, SA lifetime, SPIs, etc. Ogawa, et. al. Expires - August 2004 [Page 7] Security Association for FMIP Messages February 2004 The same SPI value MUST be used continually after the handover. One peer of the SA, the AR, changes, so the value of the SPI in an SA between an MN and an AR MUST be unique for each AR. The value of the SPI may be determined from a unique identifier of the MN. In contrast, the other peer of the SA, the MN, does not change, so it is good if the value of the SPI in an SA between an AR and an MN is unique to the MN. When the NAR receives the CT message, it MUST prepare ISAKMP and IPsec SAs between itself and the MN by using the available NCoA. The available NCoA may be the one in the CT message, or it may be an alternative NCoA defined by the NAR. The NAR MUST also maintain the SAs for CT_life_time seconds. The CT_life_time MUST be longer than the available period of information in the PrRtAdv. Note that the available period of the PrRtAdv is not currently defined in [FMIP]. In addition, if the NAR receives or sends a packet via the SA, it ignores the CT_life_time. In response to the CT, the NAR MUST produce a CTACK message containing the available NCoA. It also MUST apply ESP in transport mode to the message and send it to the PAR. If the NAR can not receive the CT successfully, the CTACK indicates "CT failed". When the PAR receives a CTACK indicating that the CT was received successfully, it MUST prepare SAs between itself and the MN by using the available NCoA according to the information transferred in the CT message, and it MUST maintain the SAs for CT_life_time seconds. These SAs are necessary in order to receive an FBU from the new link. The CT_life_time MUST be longer than the available period of information in the PrRtAdv. Moreover, if the PAR receives or sends a packet via the SA, it MUST ignore the CT_life_time. If the PAR does not receive a CTACK, it SHOULD re-send the CT message up to CT_RETRIES times by using a short retransmission timer with a value no less than twice the round-trip time (RTT) between the source and destination, or a value of 100 ms if the RTT is not known. When the MN receives the PrRtAdv, it MUST prepare ISAKMP and IPsec SAs between itself and the NAR by using the NCoA. 5.3 FBU, HI, HACK, and FBACK Sometime after the PrRtAdv message is received, the MN produces an FBU message, and it MUST apply ESP in transport mode to the message and send it to the PAR. If it does not send an FBU to the PAR while the information in the PrRtAdv is available, it MUST re-send the RtSolPr to get updated information and ensure that the PAR and NAR maintain the corresponding SAs. Ogawa, et. al. Expires - August 2004 [Page 8] Security Association for FMIP Messages February 2004 When either the PAR receives an FBU, or the HI retry timer expires, the PAR provides one of the following responses: 1. If the PAR has not yet received a CTACK from an NAR corresponding to the FBU yet, it MUST not send an HI message to the NAR. 2. If the PAR has received a CTACK indicating that the NAR corresponding to an FBU did not receive the CT successfully, it sends an FBACK containing the new status code, 127 "CT failed", as a response to the FBU. 3. Otherwise, the PART MUST send an HI to the NAR. The NAR then sends a HACK message as a response to the HI. If the CT was not received successfully, the NAR MUST send an HI containing the new status code, 127 "CT failed". As a response to the FBU, the NAR produces an FBACK message, and it MUST apply ESP in transport mode to the message and send it to the MN. If the HACK contains the new status code, 127, then the status code of the FBACK is also 127. After the binding lifetime expires, the PAR clears the SAs used for FMIP messages between itself and the MN. If the FBACK contains an alternative NCoA, the MN MUST change the IP address for the SAs between itself and the NAR. When the MN receives the FBACK, or when it retries sending the FBU FBU_RETRIES[FMIP] times but does not receive an FBACK until the FBU retry timer expires, it SHOULD clear the SAs used for FMIP messages between the PCoA and the PAR. After attaching to a new link, the MN produces an FNA message. It MUST apply ESP in transport mode to the message and send it to the NAR. As a response to the FNA, the NAR produces an NAACK message, and it MUST apply ESP in transport mode to the message and send it to the MN. If the NAACK contains an alternative NCoA, the MN MUST change the IP address for the SAs between itself and the NAR. 5.4 Re-keying When the soft-timer for the SA lifetime expires, the initiator, usually the MN, starts re-keying according to the IKE protocol. In addition, if the handover trigger occurs during re-keying, the initiator stops the re-keying process and starts the handover process (i.e, sends an RtSolPr), and then restarts the re-keying after receiving an NAACK from the NAR. 6. Message format 6.1 CT message The CT message is based on the PCTD message in [CT]. Ogawa, et. al. Expires - August 2004 [Page 9] Security Association for FMIP Messages February 2004 It is sent from the PAR to the NAR and includes Context Data blocks. 0 1 2 3 0 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 0 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 0 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 0 1 +-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+ | Type | Length | V |A| Reserved | +-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+ | Reserved | +-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+ | Mobile Node's Previous Care-of Address | +-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+ | Mobile Node's New Care-of Address | +-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+ | Reserved | Reserved | +-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+ | Reserved | +-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+ | First Context Data Block | +-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+ | Next Context Data Block | +-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+ | ........ | +-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+ Type 4 'V' flag 00 'A' bit Reserved. Length The message length in octets. Reserved Reserved for future use. Must be set to zero by the PAR. MN's Prev CoA An IPv6 address as defined in [RFC 2373]. MN's New CoA An IPv6 address as defined in [RFC 2373]. 6.2 Context Data block The Context Data block is based on the "Context Data Block" in [CT]. It is sent from the PAR to the NAR and includes Context Data. Ogawa, et. al. Expires - August 2004 [Page 10] Security Association for FMIP Messages February 2004 0 1 2 3 0 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 0 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 0 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 0 1 +-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+ | Cxt-Type | Length |P| Feature Profile Type (FPT) | +-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+ | | + Context Data + | | +-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+ Cxt-Type A single octet. Depends on the Context Data. Length The message length in octets. 'P' bit Reserved (0). FPT A 16-bit integer, giving the feature profile type contained in the data field. Depends on the Context Data. Context Data Context type-dependent data, whose length is defined by the Length field. If the data is not 64-bit aligned, the Context Data field is padded with zeros. 6.3 CTACK The CTACK message is based on the CTDR message in [CT]. 0 1 2 3 0 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 0 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 0 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 0 1 +-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+ | Type | Length | V |S| Reserved | +-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+ | Mobile Node's Previous IP Address | +-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+ | FPT | Status Code | Reserved | +-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+ | ....... | +-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+ Type 5 Length The message length in octets. 'V' flag 00 Ogawa, et. al. Expires - August 2004 [Page 11] Security Association for FMIP Messages February 2004 'S' bit When set to one, this bit indicates that all the feature contexts sent in the CT were received successfully. Reserved Reserved for future use. Must be set to zero by the MN. MN's Prev IP Address Field An IPv6 Address as defined in [RFC 2373]. Status Code A context-specific return value, present when 'S' is not set to one. FPT A 16-bit integer, listing the FPT that is being acknowledged. Status Code 0 = not successfully transferred 1 = successfully transferred 6.4 Context Data (1) IKE Ph1 Context Data The IKE Ph1 Context Data format is based on the ISAKMP message format. The ISAKMP header, SA payload, proposal payload, and transform payload MUST exist in IKE Ph1 Context Data. In addition, the new payload, MN-ID payload, and Ph1 Key payload MUST also exist in IKE Ph1 Context Data. The Cxt-Type and FPT of IKE Ph1 Context Data are TBD. o ISAKMP header See [ISAKMP] section 3.1. o SA payload See [ISAKMP] section 3.4. o Proposal payload See [ISAKMP] section 3.5. o Transform payload See [ISAKMP] section 3.6. o ID payload See [ISAKMP] section 3.8. In this case, this payload contains information about the PAR. o MN-ID payload (new) This payload contains information about the MN. Payload Type = 129. The other parameters are the same as for the ID payload. Ogawa, et. al. Expires - August 2004 [Page 12] Security Association for FMIP Messages February 2004 o Ph1 Key payload (new) Payload Type = 130. This payload contains various keys used or generated in IKE Ph1. The Key Payload fields are defined as follows: o Next Payload (1 octet) - An identifier for the payload type of the next payload in the message. If the current payload is the last in the message, then this field will be 0. o RESERVED (1 octet) - Unused, set to 0. o Payload Length (2 octets) - The length in octets of the current payload, including the generic payload header. o Key type Pre-shared key 1 SKEYID_d 2 SKEYID_d 3 SKEYID_d 4 ISAKMP SA past time 5 1 2 3 0 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 0 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 0 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 0 1 +-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+ | Next Payload | RESERVED | Payload Length | +-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+ | Key Type | Length | Reserved | +-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+ | Key Information | ~ ~ | | +-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+ | Key Type | Length | Reserved | +-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+ | Key Information | ~ ~ | | +-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+ (2) IKE Ph2 Context Data format The IKE Ph2 Context Data format is based on the ISAKMP message format. The ISAKMP header, SA payload, proposal payload, and transform payload MUST be present in the IKE Ph2 Context Data. The new payload, MN-ID payload, and Ph2 Key payload MUST also be present in the IKE Ph2 Context Data. The Cxt-Type and FPT of IKE Ph2 Context Data are TBD. Ogawa, et. al. Expires - August 2004 [Page 13] Security Association for FMIP Messages February 2004 o ISAKMP header See [ISAKMP] section 3.1. o SA payload See [ISAKMP] section 3.4. o Proposal payload See [ISAKMP] section 3.5. o Transform payload See [ISAKMP] section 3.6 and [IPsec DOI] section 4.5. o ID payload See [ISAKMP] section 3.8. In this case, this payload contains information about the PAR. o MN-ID payload (new) This payload contains information about the MN. Payload Type = 129. The other parameters are the same as for the ID payload. o Ph2 Key payload (new) Payload Type = 131. This payload contains various keys used or generated in IKE Ph2. The Ph2 Key Payload fields are defined as follows: o Next Payload (1 octet) - An identifier for the payload type of the next payload in the message. If the current payload is the last in the message, then this field will be 0. o RESERVED (1 octet) - Unused, set to 0. o Payload Length (2 octets) - The length in octets of the current payload, including the generic payload header. o Key type Authentication key 1 Encryption key 2 IPsec past time 3 Ogawa, et. al. Expires - August 2004 [Page 14] Security Association for FMIP Messages February 2004 1 2 3 0 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 0 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 0 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 0 1 +-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+ | Next Payload | RESERVED | Payload Length | +-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+ | Key Type | Length | Reserved | +-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+ | Key Information | ~ ~ | | +-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+ | Key Type | Length | Reserved | +-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+ | Key Information | ~ ~ | | +-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+ 7. Configurable Parameters Parameter Name Default Value Definition ------------------- ---------------------- ------- CT_life_time TBD Section 4 CT_RETRIES 4 Section 4 8. Security Considerations This draft introduces a new SA establishment method for FMIP between MNs and ARs. SAs for FMIP messages, CT, CTAR, HI and HACK between ARs are beyond the scope of this document. However SAs must exist between the ARs as mentioned in [FMIP]. IKE protocol may be used for them. References [RFC2026] Bradner, S., "The Internet Standards Process -- Revision 3", BCP 9, RFC 2026, October 1996. [RFC2119] Bradner, S., "Key words for use in RFCs to Indicate Requirement Levels", BCP 14, RFC 2119, March 1997 [MIPv6] Johnson, D., Perkins, C., and Arkko, J., "Mobility Support in IPv6", draft-ietf-mobileip-ipv6-24.txt, June 30, 2003. [FMIP] Koodli, R., Editor, "Fast Handovers for Mobile IPv6", draft- ietf-mipshop-fast-mipv6-01.txt, January 30, 2004. Ogawa, et. al. Expires - August 2004 [Page 15] Security Association for FMIP Messages February 2004 [CT] Loughney, J., et al., "Context Transfer Protocol", draft-ietf- seamoby-ctp-05.txt, October 25, 2003. [ARCH] Kent, S., and Atkinson, R., "Security Architecture for the Internet Protocol", RFC 2401, November 1998. [IKE] Harkins, D., and Carrel, D., "The Internet Key Exchange (IKE)", RFC 2409, November 1998. [ISAKMP] Maughan, D., Schertler, M., Schneider, M., and Turner, J., "Internet Security Association and Key Management Protocol (ISAKMP)", RFC 2408, November 1998. Author's Addresses Takeshi Ogawa Hiroyuki Ohnishi Hideto Yoshitake NTT Network Systems Laboratories, NTT Corporation 9-11 Midori-Cho 3-Chome Musashino-Shi, Tokyo 180-8585, Japan Phone: +81 422 59 4053 Email: ogawa.takeshi@lab.ntt.co.jp hiroyuki.ohnishi@lab.ntt.co.jp yoshitake.hideto@lab.ntt.co.jp Ogawa, et. al. Expires - August 2004 [Page 16] _______________________________________________ Mobopts mailing list Mobopts@irtf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/mobopts From exim@www1.ietf.org Thu Feb 26 04:26:58 2004 Received: from optimus.ietf.org (optimus.ietf.org [132.151.1.19]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id EAA00549 for ; Thu, 26 Feb 2004 04:26:58 -0500 (EST) Received: from localhost.localdomain ([127.0.0.1] helo=www1.ietf.org) by optimus.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.20) id 1AwHmo-0004I2-9N for mobopts-archive@odin.ietf.org; Thu, 26 Feb 2004 04:26:30 -0500 Received: (from exim@localhost) by www1.ietf.org (8.12.8/8.12.8/Submit) id i1Q9QUPo016464 for mobopts-archive@odin.ietf.org; Thu, 26 Feb 2004 04:26:30 -0500 Received: from odin.ietf.org ([132.151.1.176] helo=ietf.org) by optimus.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.20) id 1AwHmm-0004HQ-20 for mobopts-web-archive@optimus.ietf.org; Thu, 26 Feb 2004 04:26:28 -0500 Received: from ietf-mx (ietf-mx.ietf.org [132.151.6.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id EAA00533 for ; 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Thu, 26 Feb 2004 06:20:10 -0500 Received: by anchovy.zoic.org (Postfix, from userid 1000) id 86E4C700B9C; Thu, 26 Feb 2004 22:20:04 +1100 (EST) Date: Thu, 26 Feb 2004 22:10:39 +1100 From: "Nick 'Sharkey' Moore" To: Christian Vogt Subject: Re: [Mobopts] consecutive FMIP-handovers Message-ID: <20040226111039.GB19372@zoic.org> References: <200402230708.QAA01483@imd.m.ecl.ntt.co.jp> <007901c3fa12$9bda82d0$5347038d@tm.unikarlsruhe.de> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <007901c3fa12$9bda82d0$5347038d@tm.unikarlsruhe.de> User-Agent: Mutt/1.3.28i X-URL: http://zoic.org/sharkey/ Resent-Date: Thu, 26 Feb 2004 22:20:04 +1100 Resent-To: mobopts@irtf.org Resent-Message-Id: <20040226112004.86E4C700B9C@anchovy.zoic.org> Sender: mobopts-admin@ietf.org Errors-To: mobopts-admin@ietf.org X-BeenThere: mobopts@irtf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.12 Precedence: bulk List-Unsubscribe: , List-Id: IP Mobility Optimizations List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.60 (1.212-2003-09-23-exp) on ietf-mx.ietf.org X-Spam-Status: No, hits=1.6 required=5.0 tests=AWL,OPT_HEADER autolearn=no version=2.60 On 2004-02-23, Christian Vogt wrote: > > Did you take a look at HMIPv6? > > If I am not mistaken, then your approach is very similar to > how the HMIPv6 folks try to combine HMIPv6 with FMIPv6. > (See appendix A of [1].) ... and not far different from draft-moore-mobopts-edge-handovers-00's "Alternative Version", either. That being said, EH is awfully close to HMIP and FMIP anyway ... Still, it can't be a totally silly idea if we are all working on it! -----Nick _______________________________________________ Mobopts mailing list Mobopts@irtf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/mobopts From exim@www1.ietf.org Thu Feb 26 14:09:20 2004 Received: from optimus.ietf.org (optimus.ietf.org [132.151.1.19]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id OAA03135 for ; Thu, 26 Feb 2004 14:09:20 -0500 (EST) Received: from localhost.localdomain ([127.0.0.1] helo=www1.ietf.org) by optimus.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.20) id 1AwQsP-000220-DD for mobopts-archive@odin.ietf.org; Thu, 26 Feb 2004 14:08:53 -0500 Received: (from exim@localhost) by www1.ietf.org (8.12.8/8.12.8/Submit) id i1QJ8rh8007805 for mobopts-archive@odin.ietf.org; Thu, 26 Feb 2004 14:08:53 -0500 Received: from odin.ietf.org ([132.151.1.176] helo=ietf.org) by optimus.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.20) id 1AwQsP-00021o-6L for mobopts-web-archive@optimus.ietf.org; Thu, 26 Feb 2004 14:08:53 -0500 Received: from ietf-mx (ietf-mx.ietf.org [132.151.6.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id OAA03112 for ; Thu, 26 Feb 2004 14:08:50 -0500 (EST) Received: from ietf-mx ([132.151.6.1]) by ietf-mx with esmtp (Exim 4.12) id 1AwQsM-0000KE-00 for mobopts-web-archive@irtf.org; Thu, 26 Feb 2004 14:08:50 -0500 Received: from exim by ietf-mx with spam-scanned (Exim 4.12) id 1AwQrM-0000EW-00 for mobopts-web-archive@irtf.org; Thu, 26 Feb 2004 14:07:48 -0500 Received: from optimus.ietf.org ([132.151.1.19]) by ietf-mx with esmtp (Exim 4.12) id 1AwQqb-00008r-00 for mobopts-web-archive@irtf.org; Thu, 26 Feb 2004 14:07:01 -0500 Received: from localhost.localdomain ([127.0.0.1] helo=www1.ietf.org) by optimus.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.20) id 1AwQqc-0001fH-Di; Thu, 26 Feb 2004 14:07:02 -0500 Received: from odin.ietf.org ([132.151.1.176] helo=ietf.org) by optimus.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.20) id 1AwQqS-0001eP-2o for mobopts@optimus.ietf.org; Thu, 26 Feb 2004 14:06:52 -0500 Received: from ietf-mx (ietf-mx.ietf.org [132.151.6.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id OAA03080 for ; Thu, 26 Feb 2004 14:06:49 -0500 (EST) Received: from ietf-mx ([132.151.6.1]) by ietf-mx with esmtp (Exim 4.12) id 1AwQqP-00007C-00 for mobopts@irtf.org; Thu, 26 Feb 2004 14:06:49 -0500 Received: from exim by ietf-mx with spam-scanned (Exim 4.12) id 1AwQpT-00001s-00 for mobopts@irtf.org; Thu, 26 Feb 2004 14:05:51 -0500 Received: from darkstar.iprg.nokia.com ([205.226.5.69]) by ietf-mx with esmtp (Exim 4.12) id 1AwQop-0007i7-00 for mobopts@irtf.org; Thu, 26 Feb 2004 14:05:11 -0500 Received: (from root@localhost) by darkstar.iprg.nokia.com (8.11.0/8.11.0-DARKSTAR) id i1QJ4cJ10289 for ; Thu, 26 Feb 2004 11:04:38 -0800 X-mProtect: <200402261904> Nokia Silicon Valley Messaging Protection Received: from rajeev.iprg.nokia.com (205.226.2.90, claiming to be "iprg.nokia.com") by darkstar.iprg.nokia.com smtpdwlYvzh; Thu, 26 Feb 2004 11:04:35 PST Message-ID: <403E433A.E137A2CC@iprg.nokia.com> Date: Thu, 26 Feb 2004 11:04:26 -0800 From: Rajeev Koodli Organization: Nokia Research Center X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.7 [en] (X11; I; FreeBSD 3.4-RELEASE i386) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: mobopts@irtf.org Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: [Mobopts] Agenda for Mobopts: Revised Sender: mobopts-admin@ietf.org Errors-To: mobopts-admin@ietf.org X-BeenThere: mobopts@irtf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.12 Precedence: bulk List-Unsubscribe: , List-Id: IP Mobility Optimizations List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.60 (1.212-2003-09-23-exp) on ietf-mx.ietf.org X-Spam-Status: No, hits=1.5 required=5.0 tests=AWL,OPT_HEADER autolearn=no version=2.60 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Hello folks, here is the revised agenda. Note that almost all the presentations are now 10 minutes long. Presenters: please include 3 - 4 minutes of Q&A in your time. So, I would suggest you to focus on problem definition (why is this a good problem) and key concept(s). We will not have time to go into lot of details, unfortunately. However, we could go out for a meal where folks could discuss informally; would there be interest in this ? See you next week. Regards, -Rajeev - Intro, blue sheets, 5 mins (chairs) - L2 Triggers, Dave Johnston 15 mins - Edge handover, Nick Sharkey Moore 10 mins draft-moore-mobopts-edge-handovers-00.txt - Vertical handovers, Eric Njedjou, 10 mins draft-daniel-mip6-optimized-vertical-handover-00.txt - Security association for FMIPv6, Takeshi Ogawa, 10 mins draft-ogawa-security-association-fmipv6-00.txt - Inter-domain and intra-domain handoff experiences with real-time traffic, Mani Mahalingam, 10 minutes - A fast address allocation scheme for fmipv6, Youn-Hee Han, 10 mins draft-han-mipshop-ncoaconf-fmipv6-00.txt - Fast Handover implementation experiences, Sun Peng, 10 mins. - Early Binding Updates for Mobile IPv6, Christian Vogt, 10 mins draft-vogt-mip6-early-binding-updates-00.txt - Handover architecture, Jim Kempf, 10 mins - EAP handover optimization, Bill Arbaugh, 10 mins - Fast handover and context transfer experimental results, Rajeev Koodli, 10 mins _______________________________________________ Mobopts mailing list Mobopts@irtf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/mobopts _______________________________________________ Mobopts mailing list Mobopts@irtf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/mobopts From exim@www1.ietf.org Thu Feb 26 17:58:18 2004 Received: from optimus.ietf.org (optimus.ietf.org [132.151.1.19]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id RAA14947 for ; Thu, 26 Feb 2004 17:58:18 -0500 (EST) Received: from localhost.localdomain ([127.0.0.1] helo=www1.ietf.org) by optimus.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.20) id 1AwUS0-0004rU-C5 for mobopts-archive@odin.ietf.org; Thu, 26 Feb 2004 17:57:52 -0500 Received: (from exim@localhost) by www1.ietf.org (8.12.8/8.12.8/Submit) id i1QMvqPU018682 for mobopts-archive@odin.ietf.org; Thu, 26 Feb 2004 17:57:52 -0500 Received: from odin.ietf.org ([132.151.1.176] helo=ietf.org) by optimus.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.20) id 1AwUS0-0004rF-4U for mobopts-web-archive@optimus.ietf.org; Thu, 26 Feb 2004 17:57:52 -0500 Received: from ietf-mx (ietf-mx.ietf.org [132.151.6.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id RAA14911 for ; Thu, 26 Feb 2004 17:57:47 -0500 (EST) Received: from ietf-mx ([132.151.6.1]) by ietf-mx with esmtp (Exim 4.12) id 1AwURx-0002Fc-00 for mobopts-web-archive@irtf.org; Thu, 26 Feb 2004 17:57:49 -0500 Received: from exim by ietf-mx with spam-scanned (Exim 4.12) id 1AwUR0-000293-00 for mobopts-web-archive@irtf.org; Thu, 26 Feb 2004 17:56:51 -0500 Received: from optimus.ietf.org ([132.151.1.19]) by ietf-mx with esmtp (Exim 4.12) id 1AwUQC-000234-00 for mobopts-web-archive@irtf.org; Thu, 26 Feb 2004 17:56:00 -0500 Received: from localhost.localdomain ([127.0.0.1] helo=www1.ietf.org) by optimus.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.20) id 1AwUQD-0004Ts-VM; Thu, 26 Feb 2004 17:56:01 -0500 Received: from odin.ietf.org ([132.151.1.176] helo=ietf.org) by optimus.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.20) id 1AwUQ2-0004TP-FA for mobopts@optimus.ietf.org; Thu, 26 Feb 2004 17:55:50 -0500 Received: from ietf-mx (ietf-mx.ietf.org [132.151.6.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id RAA14788 for ; Thu, 26 Feb 2004 17:55:46 -0500 (EST) Received: from ietf-mx ([132.151.6.1]) by ietf-mx with esmtp (Exim 4.12) id 1AwUPz-00021J-00 for mobopts@irtf.org; Thu, 26 Feb 2004 17:55:47 -0500 Received: from exim by ietf-mx with spam-scanned (Exim 4.12) id 1AwUP1-0001vN-00 for mobopts@irtf.org; Thu, 26 Feb 2004 17:54:48 -0500 Received: from dsl-2.241.240.220.dsl.comindico.com.au ([220.240.241.2] helo=anchovy.zoic.org) by ietf-mx with esmtp (Exim 4.12) id 1AwUO5-0001q7-00 for mobopts@irtf.org; Thu, 26 Feb 2004 17:53:49 -0500 Received: by anchovy.zoic.org (Postfix, from userid 1000) id D461171B7FA; Fri, 27 Feb 2004 09:53:45 +1100 (EST) Date: Fri, 27 Feb 2004 09:53:45 +1100 From: "Nick 'Sharkey' Moore" To: mobopts@irtf.org Cc: Rajeev Koodli Subject: Re: [Mobopts] Agenda for Mobopts: Revised Message-ID: <20040226225345.GA24484@zoic.org> Mail-Followup-To: mobopts@irtf.org, Rajeev Koodli References: <403E433A.E137A2CC@iprg.nokia.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <403E433A.E137A2CC@iprg.nokia.com> User-Agent: Mutt/1.3.28i X-URL: http://zoic.org/sharkey/ Sender: mobopts-admin@ietf.org Errors-To: mobopts-admin@ietf.org X-BeenThere: mobopts@irtf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.12 Precedence: bulk List-Unsubscribe: , List-Id: IP Mobility Optimizations List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.60 (1.212-2003-09-23-exp) on ietf-mx.ietf.org X-Spam-Status: No, hits=1.6 required=5.0 tests=AWL,OPT_HEADER autolearn=no version=2.60 On 2004-02-26, Rajeev Koodli wrote: > > We will not have time to go into lot of details, unfortunately. > However, we could go out for a meal where folks could discuss > informally; would there be interest in this ? I think that's an excellent idea. Preferably after the WG or we'll all be talked out by then. I'll cast the first stone: Wednesday dinner? That'd give us a couple of hours of afternoon to digest each other's presentations before we get started on food. Failing that, Thursday Lunch? -----Nick _______________________________________________ Mobopts mailing list Mobopts@irtf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/mobopts From exim@www1.ietf.org Thu Feb 26 18:30:18 2004 Received: from optimus.ietf.org (optimus.ietf.org [132.151.1.19]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id SAA17038 for ; Thu, 26 Feb 2004 18:30:18 -0500 (EST) Received: from localhost.localdomain ([127.0.0.1] helo=www1.ietf.org) by optimus.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.20) id 1AwUwy-0004RX-44 for mobopts-archive@odin.ietf.org; Thu, 26 Feb 2004 18:29:52 -0500 Received: (from exim@localhost) by www1.ietf.org (8.12.8/8.12.8/Submit) id i1QNTqZC017068 for mobopts-archive@odin.ietf.org; Thu, 26 Feb 2004 18:29:52 -0500 Received: from odin.ietf.org ([132.151.1.176] helo=ietf.org) by optimus.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.20) id 1AwUwx-0004RD-0X for mobopts-web-archive@optimus.ietf.org; Thu, 26 Feb 2004 18:29:51 -0500 Received: from ietf-mx (ietf-mx.ietf.org [132.151.6.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id SAA17022 for ; Thu, 26 Feb 2004 18:29:46 -0500 (EST) Received: from ietf-mx ([132.151.6.1]) by ietf-mx with esmtp (Exim 4.12) id 1AwUwu-0005Ao-00 for mobopts-web-archive@irtf.org; Thu, 26 Feb 2004 18:29:48 -0500 Received: from exim by ietf-mx with spam-scanned (Exim 4.12) id 1AwUvz-00056G-00 for mobopts-web-archive@irtf.org; Thu, 26 Feb 2004 18:28:51 -0500 Received: from optimus.ietf.org ([132.151.1.19]) by ietf-mx with esmtp (Exim 4.12) id 1AwUv9-000523-00 for mobopts-web-archive@irtf.org; Thu, 26 Feb 2004 18:27:59 -0500 Received: from localhost.localdomain ([127.0.0.1] helo=www1.ietf.org) by optimus.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.20) id 1AwUvB-0004Lr-7z; Thu, 26 Feb 2004 18:28:01 -0500 Received: from odin.ietf.org ([132.151.1.176] helo=ietf.org) by optimus.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.20) id 1AwUuE-0004Iy-PH for mobopts@optimus.ietf.org; Thu, 26 Feb 2004 18:27:02 -0500 Received: from ietf-mx (ietf-mx.ietf.org [132.151.6.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id SAA16949 for ; Thu, 26 Feb 2004 18:26:58 -0500 (EST) Received: from ietf-mx ([132.151.6.1]) by ietf-mx with esmtp (Exim 4.12) id 1AwUuB-0004wd-00 for mobopts@irtf.org; Thu, 26 Feb 2004 18:26:59 -0500 Received: from exim by ietf-mx with spam-scanned (Exim 4.12) id 1AwUtD-0004r0-00 for mobopts@irtf.org; Thu, 26 Feb 2004 18:26:00 -0500 Received: from key1.docomolabs-usa.com ([216.98.102.225] helo=fridge.docomolabs-usa.com ident=fwuser) by ietf-mx with esmtp (Exim 4.12) id 1AwUsQ-0004lL-00 for mobopts@irtf.org; Thu, 26 Feb 2004 18:25:10 -0500 Message-ID: <078301c3fcbf$d47f4710$1e6115ac@dclkempt40> From: "James Kempf" To: "Nick 'Sharkey' Moore" , Cc: "Rajeev Koodli" References: <403E433A.E137A2CC@iprg.nokia.com> <20040226225345.GA24484@zoic.org> Subject: Re: [Mobopts] Agenda for Mobopts: Revised Date: Thu, 26 Feb 2004 15:25:28 -0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: mobopts-admin@ietf.org Errors-To: mobopts-admin@ietf.org X-BeenThere: mobopts@irtf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.12 Precedence: bulk List-Unsubscribe: , List-Id: IP Mobility Optimizations List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.60 (1.212-2003-09-23-exp) on ietf-mx.ietf.org X-Spam-Status: No, hits=1.3 required=5.0 tests=AWL,OPT_HEADER autolearn=no version=2.60 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Either work for me. jak ----- Original Message ----- From: "Nick 'Sharkey' Moore" To: Cc: "Rajeev Koodli" Sent: Thursday, February 26, 2004 2:53 PM Subject: Re: [Mobopts] Agenda for Mobopts: Revised > On 2004-02-26, Rajeev Koodli wrote: > > > > We will not have time to go into lot of details, unfortunately. > > However, we could go out for a meal where folks could discuss > > informally; would there be interest in this ? > > I think that's an excellent idea. Preferably after the WG or > we'll all be talked out by then. > > I'll cast the first stone: Wednesday dinner? That'd give us > a couple of hours of afternoon to digest each other's presentations > before we get started on food. > > Failing that, Thursday Lunch? > > -----Nick > > _______________________________________________ > Mobopts mailing list > Mobopts@irtf.org > https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/mobopts > _______________________________________________ Mobopts mailing list Mobopts@irtf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/mobopts From exim@www1.ietf.org Thu Feb 26 23:26:29 2004 Received: from optimus.ietf.org (optimus.ietf.org [132.151.1.19]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id XAA27995 for ; Thu, 26 Feb 2004 23:26:29 -0500 (EST) Received: from localhost.localdomain ([127.0.0.1] helo=www1.ietf.org) by optimus.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.20) id 1AwZZZ-0005jm-Ay for mobopts-archive@odin.ietf.org; Thu, 26 Feb 2004 23:26:02 -0500 Received: (from exim@localhost) by www1.ietf.org (8.12.8/8.12.8/Submit) id i1R4Q0hx022034 for mobopts-archive@odin.ietf.org; Thu, 26 Feb 2004 23:26:00 -0500 Received: from odin.ietf.org ([132.151.1.176] helo=ietf.org) by optimus.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.20) id 1AwZZX-0005jB-VU for mobopts-web-archive@optimus.ietf.org; Thu, 26 Feb 2004 23:26:00 -0500 Received: from ietf-mx (ietf-mx.ietf.org [132.151.6.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id XAA27970 for ; Thu, 26 Feb 2004 23:25:56 -0500 (EST) Received: from ietf-mx ([132.151.6.1]) by ietf-mx with esmtp (Exim 4.12) id 1AwZZW-0003UL-00 for mobopts-web-archive@irtf.org; Thu, 26 Feb 2004 23:25:58 -0500 Received: from exim by ietf-mx with spam-scanned (Exim 4.12) id 1AwZYZ-0003O0-00 for mobopts-web-archive@irtf.org; Thu, 26 Feb 2004 23:25:00 -0500 Received: from optimus.ietf.org ([132.151.1.19]) by ietf-mx with esmtp (Exim 4.12) id 1AwZXc-0003IU-00 for mobopts-web-archive@irtf.org; Thu, 26 Feb 2004 23:24:00 -0500 Received: from localhost.localdomain ([127.0.0.1] helo=www1.ietf.org) by optimus.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.20) id 1AwZXd-0005d7-2o; Thu, 26 Feb 2004 23:24:01 -0500 Received: from odin.ietf.org ([132.151.1.176] helo=ietf.org) by optimus.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.20) id 1AwZWg-0005bQ-Ao for mobopts@optimus.ietf.org; Thu, 26 Feb 2004 23:23:02 -0500 Received: from ietf-mx (ietf-mx.ietf.org [132.151.6.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id XAA27889 for ; Thu, 26 Feb 2004 23:22:59 -0500 (EST) Received: from ietf-mx ([132.151.6.1]) by ietf-mx with esmtp (Exim 4.12) id 1AwZWe-0003D4-00 for mobopts@irtf.org; Thu, 26 Feb 2004 23:23:00 -0500 Received: from exim by ietf-mx with spam-scanned (Exim 4.12) id 1AwZVf-00037y-00 for mobopts@irtf.org; Thu, 26 Feb 2004 23:22:00 -0500 Received: from tama5.ecl.ntt.co.jp ([129.60.39.102]) by ietf-mx with esmtp (Exim 4.12) id 1AwZUt-00032V-00 for mobopts@irtf.org; Thu, 26 Feb 2004 23:21:12 -0500 Received: from vcs3.rdh.ecl.ntt.co.jp (vcs3.rdh.ecl.ntt.co.jp [129.60.39.110]) by tama5.ecl.ntt.co.jp (8.12.11/8.12.11) with ESMTP id i1R4Kovv010272; Fri, 27 Feb 2004 13:20:50 +0900 (JST) Received: from mfs3.rdh.ecl.ntt.co.jp (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by vcs3.rdh.ecl.ntt.co.jp (8.12.11/8.12.11) with ESMTP id i1R4Ko14023974; Fri, 27 Feb 2004 13:20:50 +0900 (JST) Received: from mfs3.rdh.ecl.ntt.co.jp (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mfs3.rdh.ecl.ntt.co.jp (8.12.11/8.12.11) with ESMTP id i1R4KnwD008998; Fri, 27 Feb 2004 13:20:49 +0900 (JST) Received: from nttmail3.ecl.ntt.co.jp ([129.60.39.100]) by mfs3.rdh.ecl.ntt.co.jp (8.12.11/8.12.11) with ESMTP id i1R4Knes008986; Fri, 27 Feb 2004 13:20:49 +0900 (JST) Received: from eclscan3.m.ecl.ntt.co.jp (eclscan3.m.ecl.ntt.co.jp [129.60.5.69]) by nttmail3.ecl.ntt.co.jp (8.12.11/8.12.11) with ESMTP id i1R4Kmjl027439; Fri, 27 Feb 2004 13:20:48 +0900 (JST) Received: from imd.m.ecl.ntt.co.jp (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by eclscan3.m.ecl.ntt.co.jp (8.9.3p2/3.7W) with ESMTP id NAA09106; Fri, 27 Feb 2004 13:20:48 +0900 (JST) Received: from imd.m.ecl.ntt.co.jp by imd.m.ecl.ntt.co.jp (8.9.3p2/3.7W) with SMTP id NAA20462; Fri, 27 Feb 2004 13:20:47 +0900 (JST) Message-Id: <200402270420.NAA20462@imd.m.ecl.ntt.co.jp> Date: Fri, 27 Feb 2004 13:20:55 +0900 From: ogawa X-Mailer: EdMax Ver2.85.3F MIME-Version: 1.0 To: "James Kempf" Cc: "Nick 'Sharkey' Moore" , , "Rajeev Koodli" Subject: Re: [Mobopts] Agenda for Mobopts: Revised Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In-Reply-To: <078301c3fcbf$d47f4710$1e6115ac@dclkempt40> References: <078301c3fcbf$d47f4710$1e6115ac@dclkempt40> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: mobopts-admin@ietf.org Errors-To: mobopts-admin@ietf.org X-BeenThere: mobopts@irtf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.12 Precedence: bulk List-Unsubscribe: , List-Id: IP Mobility Optimizations List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.60 (1.212-2003-09-23-exp) on ietf-mx.ietf.org X-Spam-Status: No, hits=2.2 required=5.0 tests=AWL,OPT_HEADER autolearn=no version=2.60 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Hi folks, Either works for me too. We are glad to meet you in Seoul. "James Kempf" wrote: > Either work for me. > > jak > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Nick 'Sharkey' Moore" > To: > Cc: "Rajeev Koodli" > Sent: Thursday, February 26, 2004 2:53 PM > Subject: Re: [Mobopts] Agenda for Mobopts: Revised > > > > On 2004-02-26, Rajeev Koodli wrote: > > > > > > We will not have time to go into lot of details, unfortunately. > > > However, we could go out for a meal where folks could discuss > > > informally; would there be interest in this ? > > > > I think that's an excellent idea. Preferably after the WG or > > we'll all be talked out by then. > > > > I'll cast the first stone: Wednesday dinner? That'd give us > > a couple of hours of afternoon to digest each other's presentations > > before we get started on food. > > > > Failing that, Thursday Lunch? > > > > -----Nick > > > > _______________________________________________ > > Mobopts mailing list > > Mobopts@irtf.org > > https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/mobopts > > > > _______________________________________________ > Mobopts mailing list > Mobopts@irtf.org > https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/mobopts _______________________________________________ Mobopts mailing list Mobopts@irtf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/mobopts From exim@www1.ietf.org Fri Feb 27 02:29:39 2004 Received: from optimus.ietf.org (optimus.ietf.org [132.151.1.19]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id CAA18262 for ; Fri, 27 Feb 2004 02:29:39 -0500 (EST) Received: from localhost.localdomain ([127.0.0.1] helo=www1.ietf.org) by optimus.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.20) id 1AwcQo-0001DA-B4 for mobopts-archive@odin.ietf.org; Fri, 27 Feb 2004 02:29:11 -0500 Received: (from exim@localhost) by www1.ietf.org (8.12.8/8.12.8/Submit) id i1R7TAGD004641 for mobopts-archive@odin.ietf.org; Fri, 27 Feb 2004 02:29:10 -0500 Received: from odin.ietf.org ([132.151.1.176] helo=ietf.org) by optimus.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.20) id 1AwcQm-0001Ck-7s for mobopts-web-archive@optimus.ietf.org; Fri, 27 Feb 2004 02:29:08 -0500 Received: from ietf-mx (ietf-mx.ietf.org [132.151.6.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id CAA18206 for ; Fri, 27 Feb 2004 02:29:05 -0500 (EST) Received: from ietf-mx ([132.151.6.1]) by ietf-mx with esmtp (Exim 4.12) id 1AwcQi-0006CE-00 for mobopts-web-archive@irtf.org; Fri, 27 Feb 2004 02:29:04 -0500 Received: from exim by ietf-mx with spam-scanned (Exim 4.12) id 1AwcPk-000665-00 for mobopts-web-archive@irtf.org; Fri, 27 Feb 2004 02:28:04 -0500 Received: from optimus.ietf.org ([132.151.1.19]) by ietf-mx with esmtp (Exim 4.12) id 1AwcOk-0005yc-00 for mobopts-web-archive@irtf.org; Fri, 27 Feb 2004 02:27:02 -0500 Received: from localhost.localdomain ([127.0.0.1] helo=www1.ietf.org) by optimus.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.20) id 1AwcOk-0000hx-NP; Fri, 27 Feb 2004 02:27:02 -0500 Received: from odin.ietf.org ([132.151.1.176] helo=ietf.org) by optimus.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.20) id 1AwcNv-0000Ux-GW for mobopts@optimus.ietf.org; Fri, 27 Feb 2004 02:26:11 -0500 Received: from ietf-mx (ietf-mx.ietf.org [132.151.6.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id CAA17843 for ; Fri, 27 Feb 2004 02:26:08 -0500 (EST) Received: from ietf-mx ([132.151.6.1]) by ietf-mx with esmtp (Exim 4.12) id 1AwcNr-0005rs-00 for mobopts@irtf.org; Fri, 27 Feb 2004 02:26:07 -0500 Received: from exim by ietf-mx with spam-scanned (Exim 4.12) id 1AwcMs-0005kJ-00 for mobopts@irtf.org; Fri, 27 Feb 2004 02:25:06 -0500 Received: from rodin.i2r.a-star.edu.sg ([192.122.139.27] helo=i2r.a-star.edu.sg) by ietf-mx with esmtp (Exim 4.12) id 1AwcLt-0005cg-00 for mobopts@irtf.org; Fri, 27 Feb 2004 02:24:06 -0500 Received: from newmailhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by i2r.a-star.edu.sg (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1R7NFF1007420 for ; Fri, 27 Feb 2004 15:23:16 +0800 (SGT) Received: from amasesp ([192.168.137.236]) by mailhost.lit.org.sg (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 Patch 1 (built Aug 19 2002)) with SMTP id <0HTQ006KAF73ZR@mailhost.lit.org.sg> for mobopts@irtf.org; Fri, 27 Feb 2004 15:23:27 +0800 (SGT) Date: Fri, 27 Feb 2004 15:21:40 +0800 From: Sun Peng Subject: Re: [Mobopts] Agenda for Mobopts: Revised To: ogawa , James Kempf Cc: "Nick 'Sharkey' Moore" , mobopts@irtf.org, Rajeev Koodli Message-id: <03d501c3fd02$58531e30$c344a8ba@amasesp> MIME-version: 1.0 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 Content-type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-priority: Normal References: <078301c3fcbf$d47f4710$1e6115ac@dclkempt40> <200402270420.NAA20462@imd.m.ecl.ntt.co.jp> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7BIT Sender: mobopts-admin@ietf.org Errors-To: mobopts-admin@ietf.org X-BeenThere: mobopts@irtf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.12 Precedence: bulk List-Unsubscribe: , List-Id: IP Mobility Optimizations List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.60 (1.212-2003-09-23-exp) on ietf-mx.ietf.org X-Spam-Status: No, hits=1.8 required=5.0 tests=AWL,OPT_HEADER autolearn=no version=2.60 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7BIT Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7BIT Hi, If that is open to all, I will be happy to join your discussion. If you guys only want a private discussion, it's fine. :) Please let me know if I can join. -Peng ----- Original Message ----- From: "ogawa" To: "James Kempf" Cc: "Nick 'Sharkey' Moore" ; ; "Rajeev Koodli" Sent: Friday, February 27, 2004 12:20 Subject: Re: [Mobopts] Agenda for Mobopts: Revised > Hi folks, > > Either works for me too. > We are glad to meet you in Seoul. > > > "James Kempf" wrote: > > > Either work for me. > > > > > jak > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > From: "Nick 'Sharkey' Moore" > > To: > > Cc: "Rajeev Koodli" > > Sent: Thursday, February 26, 2004 2:53 PM > > Subject: Re: [Mobopts] Agenda for Mobopts: Revised > > > > > > > On 2004-02-26, Rajeev Koodli wrote: > > > > > > > > We will not have time to go into lot of details, unfortunately. > > > > However, we could go out for a meal where folks could discuss > > > > informally; would there be interest in this ? > > > > > > I think that's an excellent idea. Preferably after the WG or > > > we'll all be talked out by then. > > > > > > I'll cast the first stone: Wednesday dinner? That'd give us > > > a couple of hours of afternoon to digest each other's presentations > > > before we get started on food. > > > > > > Failing that, Thursday Lunch? > > > > > > -----Nick > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > > Mobopts mailing list > > > Mobopts@irtf.org > > > https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/mobopts > > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > Mobopts mailing list > > Mobopts@irtf.org > > https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/mobopts > > > > _______________________________________________ > Mobopts mailing list > Mobopts@irtf.org > https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/mobopts > _______________________________________________ Mobopts mailing list Mobopts@irtf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/mobopts From exim@www1.ietf.org Fri Feb 27 06:56:07 2004 Received: from optimus.ietf.org (optimus.ietf.org [132.151.1.19]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id GAA26942 for ; Fri, 27 Feb 2004 06:56:07 -0500 (EST) Received: from localhost.localdomain ([127.0.0.1] helo=www1.ietf.org) by optimus.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.20) id 1Awgaj-00030c-8O for mobopts-archive@odin.ietf.org; Fri, 27 Feb 2004 06:55:41 -0500 Received: (from exim@localhost) by www1.ietf.org (8.12.8/8.12.8/Submit) id i1RBtfMB011560 for mobopts-archive@odin.ietf.org; Fri, 27 Feb 2004 06:55:41 -0500 Received: from odin.ietf.org ([132.151.1.176] helo=ietf.org) by optimus.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.20) id 1Awgaj-00030N-2W for mobopts-web-archive@optimus.ietf.org; Fri, 27 Feb 2004 06:55:41 -0500 Received: from ietf-mx (ietf-mx.ietf.org [132.151.6.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id GAA26840 for ; Fri, 27 Feb 2004 06:55:36 -0500 (EST) Received: from ietf-mx ([132.151.6.1]) by ietf-mx with esmtp (Exim 4.12) id 1Awgae-00029d-00 for mobopts-web-archive@irtf.org; Fri, 27 Feb 2004 06:55:37 -0500 Received: from exim by ietf-mx with spam-scanned (Exim 4.12) id 1AwgZn-0001yR-00 for mobopts-web-archive@irtf.org; Fri, 27 Feb 2004 06:54:44 -0500 Received: from [65.246.255.50] (helo=mx2.foretec.com) by ietf-mx with esmtp (Exim 4.12) id 1AwgYx-0001pU-01 for mobopts-web-archive@irtf.org; Fri, 27 Feb 2004 06:53:51 -0500 Received: from optimus.ietf.org ([132.151.1.19]) by mx2.foretec.com with esmtp (Exim 4.24) id 1AwgPQ-0002YS-PV for mobopts-web-archive@irtf.org; Fri, 27 Feb 2004 06:44:00 -0500 Received: from localhost.localdomain ([127.0.0.1] helo=www1.ietf.org) by optimus.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.20) id 1AwgPQ-0002ig-A1; Fri, 27 Feb 2004 06:44:00 -0500 Received: from odin.ietf.org ([132.151.1.176] helo=ietf.org) by optimus.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.20) id 1AwgOh-0002fL-Ew for mobopts@optimus.ietf.org; Fri, 27 Feb 2004 06:43:15 -0500 Received: from ietf-mx (ietf-mx.ietf.org [132.151.6.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id GAA26598 for ; Fri, 27 Feb 2004 06:43:10 -0500 (EST) Received: from ietf-mx ([132.151.6.1]) by ietf-mx with esmtp (Exim 4.12) id 1AwgOd-00015I-00 for mobopts@irtf.org; Fri, 27 Feb 2004 06:43:11 -0500 Received: from exim by ietf-mx with spam-scanned (Exim 4.12) id 1AwgNf-000118-00 for mobopts@irtf.org; Fri, 27 Feb 2004 06:42:12 -0500 Received: from dsl-2.241.240.220.dsl.comindico.com.au ([220.240.241.2] helo=anchovy.zoic.org) by ietf-mx with esmtp (Exim 4.12) id 1AwgNI-0000xB-00 for mobopts@irtf.org; Fri, 27 Feb 2004 06:41:49 -0500 Received: by anchovy.zoic.org (Postfix, from userid 1000) id A280B7010EE; Fri, 27 Feb 2004 22:41:40 +1100 (EST) Date: Fri, 27 Feb 2004 22:41:40 +1100 From: "Nick 'Sharkey' Moore" To: mobopts@irtf.org Cc: Sun Peng Subject: Re: [Mobopts] Agenda for Mobopts: Revised Message-ID: <20040227114139.GA29462@zoic.org> Mail-Followup-To: mobopts@irtf.org, Sun Peng References: <078301c3fcbf$d47f4710$1e6115ac@dclkempt40> <200402270420.NAA20462@imd.m.ecl.ntt.co.jp> <03d501c3fd02$58531e30$c344a8ba@amasesp> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <03d501c3fd02$58531e30$c344a8ba@amasesp> User-Agent: Mutt/1.3.28i X-URL: http://zoic.org/sharkey/ Sender: mobopts-admin@ietf.org Errors-To: mobopts-admin@ietf.org X-BeenThere: mobopts@irtf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.12 Precedence: bulk List-Unsubscribe: , List-Id: IP Mobility Optimizations List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.60 (1.212-2003-09-23-exp) on ietf-mx.ietf.org X-Spam-Status: No, hits=1.5 required=5.0 tests=AWL,OPT_HEADER autolearn=no version=2.60 On 2004-02-27, Sun Peng wrote: > > If that is open to all, I will be happy to join your discussion. If > you guys only want a private discussion, it's fine. :) Please let me know > if I can join. All welcome! It'll be a good chance for all us MobOpts folk to meet each other ... and maybe find a way to combine our efforts. -----Nick (relatively new to this too) _______________________________________________ Mobopts mailing list Mobopts@irtf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/mobopts From exim@www1.ietf.org Fri Feb 27 13:28:06 2004 Received: from optimus.ietf.org (optimus.ietf.org [132.151.1.19]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id NAA17126 for ; Fri, 27 Feb 2004 13:28:06 -0500 (EST) Received: from localhost.localdomain ([127.0.0.1] helo=www1.ietf.org) by optimus.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.20) id 1Awmi1-00037F-HI for mobopts-archive@odin.ietf.org; Fri, 27 Feb 2004 13:27:38 -0500 Received: (from exim@localhost) by www1.ietf.org (8.12.8/8.12.8/Submit) id i1RIRbZW011973 for mobopts-archive@odin.ietf.org; Fri, 27 Feb 2004 13:27:37 -0500 Received: from odin.ietf.org ([132.151.1.176] helo=ietf.org) by optimus.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.20) id 1Awmi1-000372-96 for mobopts-web-archive@optimus.ietf.org; Fri, 27 Feb 2004 13:27:37 -0500 Received: from ietf-mx (ietf-mx.ietf.org [132.151.6.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id NAA17094 for ; Fri, 27 Feb 2004 13:27:35 -0500 (EST) Received: from ietf-mx ([132.151.6.1]) by ietf-mx with esmtp (Exim 4.12) id 1Awmhz-0002dc-00 for mobopts-web-archive@irtf.org; Fri, 27 Feb 2004 13:27:35 -0500 Received: from exim by ietf-mx with spam-scanned (Exim 4.12) id 1Awmgx-0002YW-00 for mobopts-web-archive@irtf.org; Fri, 27 Feb 2004 13:26:32 -0500 Received: from optimus.ietf.org ([132.151.1.19]) by ietf-mx with esmtp (Exim 4.12) id 1AwmgS-0002Te-00 for mobopts-web-archive@irtf.org; Fri, 27 Feb 2004 13:26:00 -0500 Received: from localhost.localdomain ([127.0.0.1] helo=www1.ietf.org) by optimus.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.20) id 1AwmgU-00034G-0g; Fri, 27 Feb 2004 13:26:02 -0500 Received: from odin.ietf.org ([132.151.1.176] helo=ietf.org) by optimus.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.20) id 1Awmfy-00033a-7u for mobopts@optimus.ietf.org; Fri, 27 Feb 2004 13:25:30 -0500 Received: from ietf-mx (ietf-mx.ietf.org [132.151.6.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id NAA17061 for ; Fri, 27 Feb 2004 13:25:27 -0500 (EST) Received: from ietf-mx ([132.151.6.1]) by ietf-mx with esmtp (Exim 4.12) id 1Awmfw-0002Sw-00 for mobopts@irtf.org; Fri, 27 Feb 2004 13:25:28 -0500 Received: from exim by ietf-mx with spam-scanned (Exim 4.12) id 1Awmf3-0002OP-00 for mobopts@irtf.org; Fri, 27 Feb 2004 13:24:33 -0500 Received: from darkstar.iprg.nokia.com ([205.226.5.69]) by ietf-mx with esmtp (Exim 4.12) id 1Awmep-0002JH-00 for mobopts@irtf.org; Fri, 27 Feb 2004 13:24:20 -0500 Received: (from root@localhost) by darkstar.iprg.nokia.com (8.11.0/8.11.0-DARKSTAR) id i1RINUs00663; Fri, 27 Feb 2004 10:23:30 -0800 X-mProtect: <200402271823> Nokia Silicon Valley Messaging Protection Received: from rajeev.iprg.nokia.com (205.226.2.90, claiming to be "iprg.nokia.com") by darkstar.iprg.nokia.com smtpdRRkKgP; Fri, 27 Feb 2004 10:23:28 PST Message-ID: <403F8B16.7AAB9D1C@iprg.nokia.com> Date: Fri, 27 Feb 2004 10:23:18 -0800 From: Rajeev Koodli Organization: Nokia Research Center X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.7 [en] (X11; I; FreeBSD 3.4-RELEASE i386) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Sun Peng CC: ogawa , James Kempf , "Nick 'Sharkey' Moore" , mobopts@irtf.org Subject: Re: [Mobopts] Agenda for Mobopts: Revised References: <078301c3fcbf$d47f4710$1e6115ac@dclkempt40> <200402270420.NAA20462@imd.m.ecl.ntt.co.jp> <03d501c3fd02$58531e30$c344a8ba@amasesp> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: mobopts-admin@ietf.org Errors-To: mobopts-admin@ietf.org X-BeenThere: mobopts@irtf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.12 Precedence: bulk List-Unsubscribe: , List-Id: IP Mobility Optimizations List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.60 (1.212-2003-09-23-exp) on ietf-mx.ietf.org X-Spam-Status: No, hits=1.5 required=5.0 tests=AWL,OPT_HEADER autolearn=no version=2.60 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit It's open for anyone with an admitted interest in IP Mobility! Let's shoot for dinner on Wednesday, meet near the registration desk. Regards, -Rajeev Sun Peng wrote: > Hi, > > If that is open to all, I will be happy to join your discussion. If > you guys only want a private discussion, it's fine. :) Please let me know > if I can join. > > -Peng > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "ogawa" > To: "James Kempf" > Cc: "Nick 'Sharkey' Moore" ; ; "Rajeev > Koodli" > Sent: Friday, February 27, 2004 12:20 > Subject: Re: [Mobopts] Agenda for Mobopts: Revised > > > Hi folks, > > > > Either works for me too. > > We are glad to meet you in Seoul. > > > > > > "James Kempf" wrote: > > > > > Either work for me. > > > > > > > > jak > > > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > > From: "Nick 'Sharkey' Moore" > > > To: > > > Cc: "Rajeev Koodli" > > > Sent: Thursday, February 26, 2004 2:53 PM > > > Subject: Re: [Mobopts] Agenda for Mobopts: Revised > > > > > > > > > > On 2004-02-26, Rajeev Koodli wrote: > > > > > > > > > > We will not have time to go into lot of details, unfortunately. > > > > > However, we could go out for a meal where folks could discuss > > > > > informally; would there be interest in this ? > > > > > > > > I think that's an excellent idea. Preferably after the WG or > > > > we'll all be talked out by then. > > > > > > > > I'll cast the first stone: Wednesday dinner? That'd give us > > > > a couple of hours of afternoon to digest each other's presentations > > > > before we get started on food. > > > > > > > > Failing that, Thursday Lunch? > > > > > > > > -----Nick > > > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > > > Mobopts mailing list > > > > Mobopts@irtf.org > > > > https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/mobopts > > > > > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > > Mobopts mailing list > > > Mobopts@irtf.org > > > https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/mobopts > > > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > Mobopts mailing list > > Mobopts@irtf.org > > https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/mobopts > > _______________________________________________ Mobopts mailing list Mobopts@irtf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/mobopts