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today at The Riverside=2E United= , who have their eye onTies announced in UEFA Champions League
beautif= ul goal to tie the game once again and send it inPresident Fulgencio Bati= sta staged a coup d'tat to ------=_NextPart_7176_1C72_01C8681A.BB78BE70-- From owner-netconf@ops.ietf.org Wed Feb 6 02:43:59 2008 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ietfarch-netconf-archive@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ietfarch-netconf-archive@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 863C13A6C48 for ; Wed, 6 Feb 2008 02:43:59 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -4.158 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-4.158 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=2.441, BAYES_00=-2.599, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-4] Received: from core3.amsl.com ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (mail.ietf.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id w7Ebn2WbYiCK for ; Wed, 6 Feb 2008 02:43:58 -0800 (PST) Received: from psg.com (psg.com [147.28.0.62]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id A70BD3A6BB6 for ; Wed, 6 Feb 2008 02:43:58 -0800 (PST) Received: from majordom by psg.com with local (Exim 4.68 (FreeBSD)) (envelope-from ) id 1JMhYp-000Ca3-0a for netconf-data@psg.com; Wed, 06 Feb 2008 10:31:23 +0000 Received: from [198.152.12.100] (helo=nj300815-nj-outbound.avaya.com) by psg.com with esmtps (TLSv1:RC4-SHA:128) (Exim 4.68 (FreeBSD)) (envelope-from ) id 1JMhYi-000CZ2-Sf for netconf@ops.ietf.org; Wed, 06 Feb 2008 10:31:21 +0000 X-IronPort-AV: E=Sophos;i="4.25,312,1199682000"; d="scan'208";a="97937025" Received: from unknown (HELO nj300815-nj-erheast.avaya.com) ([198.152.6.5]) by nj300815-nj-outbound.avaya.com with ESMTP; 06 Feb 2008 05:31:10 -0500 X-IronPort-AV: E=Sophos;i="4.25,312,1199682000"; d="scan'208";a="151614006" Received: from unknown (HELO 307622ANEX5.global.avaya.com) ([135.64.140.16]) by nj300815-nj-erheast-out.avaya.com with ESMTP; 06 Feb 2008 05:31:09 -0500 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft Exchange V6.5 Content-class: urn:content-classes:message MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Subject: FW: [PEPPERMINT] potenntial charter for PEPPERMINT Date: Wed, 6 Feb 2008 11:30:50 +0100 Message-ID: X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: Thread-Topic: [PEPPERMINT] potenntial charter for PEPPERMINT Thread-Index: AchnnEUEgG2zYim4ThiA9K48R5nVLQBDvhmA From: "Romascanu, Dan (Dan)" To: , , Sender: owner-netconf@ops.ietf.org Precedence: bulk =20 Comments are welcome.=20 Dan =20 -----Original Message----- From: peppermint-bounces@ietf.org [mailto:peppermint-bounces@ietf.org] On Behalf Of Richard Shockey Sent: Wednesday, February 06, 2008 2:06 AM To: PEPPERMINT@ietf.org Subject: [PEPPERMINT] potenntial charter for PEPPERMINT Folks ..we had a successful BOF in Vancouver in order to progress the work towards a full charter by the IETF it is necessary to reach consensus on a charter. I have a proposal for a charter here below. I welcome comments public private etc. PROPOSED CHARTER FOR PEPPERMINT The IETF has been working on various aspects of Multi-Media Interconnection among administrative domains.=20 ENUM is specifically chartered to develop protocols that involve the translation of E.164 numbers to URI's.=20 =20 SPEERMINT has been chartered to develop best current practices among real-time application service providers and how such services interconnect across administrative boundaries. These forms of interconnection will require various forms of data to be exchanged among administrative domains outside the normal scope of establishing various SIP sessions.=20 The IETF has, in the past done, significant work on data exchanges among various network elements. PROVREG and NETCFG being the most prominent recent examples. Data exchanges to facilitate Multi-Media Interconnection are typically between various Client User Agents and Registries containing mappings of phone numbers to URI's, policies surrounding admission to points of network interconnection and various types of trunking data. In addition there is a specific need for redistribution of Registry data to various types of network databases. =20 The proposed PEPPERMINT working group will build upon the knowledge and expertise of the PROVREG, ENUM and SPEERMINT working groups. The goal of the WG is to find a provisioning solution for interconnection to be ultimately used by SPEERMINT. The working group may also reuse elements of RFC 4114 if possible. The final work product(s) from this working group will be based upon XML. =20 Additionally, bias will be given to using, HTTP/REST, HTTP/XML-RPC, or HTTP/SOAP. The working group will draw upon expert advice and ongoing consultation from the ENUM, SPEERMINT and PROVREG working groups. PROPOSED GOALS AND MILESTONES Requirements for Interconnection data exchanges. July 08=20 Provisioning of Interconnection data registries. Sep 08 Provisioning of Interconnection data caches. Dec 08=20 Richard Shockey Director, Member of the Technical Staff NeuStar 46000 Center Oak Plaza - Sterling, VA 20166 PSTN Office +1 571.434.5651 PSTN Mobile: +1 703.593.2683 _______________________________________________ PEPPERMINT mailing list PEPPERMINT@ietf.org http://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/peppermint -- to unsubscribe send a message to netconf-request@ops.ietf.org with the word 'unsubscribe' in a single line as the message text body. archive: From owner-netconf@ops.ietf.org Wed Feb 6 07:43:06 2008 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ietfarch-netconf-archive@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ietfarch-netconf-archive@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0CEFA3A6E7F for ; Wed, 6 Feb 2008 07:43:06 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -3.397 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-3.397 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=3.202, BAYES_00=-2.599, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-4] Received: from core3.amsl.com ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (mail.ietf.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id D3fbBczLt6Hq for ; Wed, 6 Feb 2008 07:43:00 -0800 (PST) Received: from psg.com (psg.com [147.28.0.62]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id B2BF33A6C06 for ; Wed, 6 Feb 2008 07:41:42 -0800 (PST) Received: from majordom by psg.com with local (Exim 4.68 (FreeBSD)) (envelope-from ) id 1JMmCe-0005QW-6u for netconf-data@psg.com; Wed, 06 Feb 2008 15:28:48 +0000 Received: from [204.9.221.19] (helo=exchange.tm.thingmagic.com) by psg.com with esmtps (TLSv1:RC4-MD5:128) (Exim 4.68 (FreeBSD)) (envelope-from ) id 1JMmCb-0005Q9-6C for netconf@ops.ietf.org; Wed, 06 Feb 2008 15:28:46 +0000 Received: from [10.36.0.26] (76.24.195.210) by exchange.tm.thingmagic.com (10.0.0.9) with Microsoft SMTP Server (TLS) id 8.1.240.5; Wed, 6 Feb 2008 10:28:43 -0500 In-Reply-To: References: MIME-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v753) Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII"; delsp=yes; format=flowed Message-ID: CC: "ops-dir@ietf.org" , "ops-area@ietf.org" , "netconf@ops.ietf.org" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: Margaret Wasserman Subject: Re: [PEPPERMINT] potenntial charter for PEPPERMINT Date: Wed, 6 Feb 2008 10:28:44 -0500 To: "Romascanu, Dan (Dan)" X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.753) Sender: owner-netconf@ops.ietf.org Precedence: bulk By "NETCFG", does Richard mean NETCONF? I would prefer to see the line removed that states that "bias will be given" to particular solutions. I think it is okay to charter a group with restrictions on the solution space, such as "will be based on XML" if there is consensus to do so, but I'm not sure what it would mean to charter a group and require that they be "biased" towards certain solutions. If there isn't consensus that the solution must be based on one of the technologies listed, I think that line should be removed and the choice of technology should be a group consensus decision. Margaret On Feb 6, 2008, at 5:30 AM, Romascanu, Dan (Dan) wrote: > > Comments are welcome. > > Dan > > > > > -----Original Message----- > From: peppermint-bounces@ietf.org [mailto:peppermint-bounces@ietf.org] > On Behalf Of Richard Shockey > Sent: Wednesday, February 06, 2008 2:06 AM > To: PEPPERMINT@ietf.org > Subject: [PEPPERMINT] potenntial charter for PEPPERMINT > > > Folks ..we had a successful BOF in Vancouver in order to progress the > work towards a full charter by the IETF it is necessary to reach > consensus on a charter. > > I have a proposal for a charter here below. I welcome comments public > private etc. > > > PROPOSED CHARTER FOR PEPPERMINT > > The IETF has been working on various aspects of Multi-Media > Interconnection among administrative domains. > > ENUM is specifically chartered to develop protocols that involve the > translation of E.164 numbers to URI's. > > SPEERMINT has been chartered to develop best current practices among > real-time application service providers and how such services > interconnect across administrative boundaries. > > These forms of interconnection will require various forms of data > to be > exchanged among administrative domains outside the normal scope of > establishing various SIP sessions. > > The IETF has, in the past done, significant work on data exchanges > among > various network elements. PROVREG and NETCFG being the most prominent > recent examples. > > Data exchanges to facilitate Multi-Media Interconnection are typically > between various Client User Agents and Registries containing > mappings of > phone numbers to URI's, policies surrounding admission to points of > network interconnection and various types of trunking data. In > addition > there is a specific need for redistribution of Registry data to > various > types of network databases. > > The proposed PEPPERMINT working group will build upon the knowledge > and > expertise of the PROVREG, ENUM and SPEERMINT working groups. The > goal of > the WG is to find a provisioning solution for interconnection to be > ultimately used by SPEERMINT. The working group may also reuse > elements > of RFC 4114 if possible. > > The final work product(s) from this working group will be based upon > XML. > > Additionally, bias will be given to using, HTTP/REST, HTTP/XML-RPC, or > HTTP/SOAP. > > The working group will draw upon expert advice and ongoing > consultation > from the ENUM, SPEERMINT and PROVREG working groups. > > > PROPOSED GOALS AND MILESTONES > > > Requirements for Interconnection data exchanges. July 08 > > Provisioning of Interconnection data registries. Sep 08 > > Provisioning of Interconnection data caches. Dec 08 > > > Richard Shockey > Director, Member of the Technical Staff > NeuStar > 46000 Center Oak Plaza - Sterling, VA 20166 PSTN Office +1 > 571.434.5651 > PSTN Mobile: +1 703.593.2683 > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > PEPPERMINT mailing list > PEPPERMINT@ietf.org > http://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/peppermint > > -- > to unsubscribe send a message to netconf-request@ops.ietf.org with > the word 'unsubscribe' in a single line as the message text body. > archive: -- to unsubscribe send a message to netconf-request@ops.ietf.org with the word 'unsubscribe' in a single line as the message text body. archive: From owner-netconf@ops.ietf.org Wed Feb 6 08:30:37 2008 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ietfarch-netconf-archive@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ietfarch-netconf-archive@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id AE5323A6EB6 for ; Wed, 6 Feb 2008 08:30:37 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -3.252 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-3.252 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=2.347, BAYES_00=-2.599, HTML_MESSAGE=1, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-4] Received: from core3.amsl.com ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (mail.ietf.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id V8uQ-TVSe5g0 for ; Wed, 6 Feb 2008 08:30:36 -0800 (PST) Received: from psg.com (psg.com [147.28.0.62]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id BA1FC3A6E4D for ; Wed, 6 Feb 2008 08:30:35 -0800 (PST) Received: from majordom by psg.com with local (Exim 4.68 (FreeBSD)) (envelope-from ) id 1JMmvU-000CaZ-3F for netconf-data@psg.com; Wed, 06 Feb 2008 16:15:08 +0000 Received: from [217.146.182.15] (helo=web27810.mail.ukl.yahoo.com) by psg.com with smtp (Exim 4.68 (FreeBSD)) (envelope-from ) id 1JMmvM-000CZB-8G for netconf@ops.ietf.org; Wed, 06 Feb 2008 16:15:06 +0000 Received: (qmail 62843 invoked by uid 60001); 6 Feb 2008 16:14:58 -0000 DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=s1024; d=yahoo.de; h=Received:X-Mailer:Date:From:Subject:To:Cc:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Message-ID; b=P/JrabpJXMv0ojxmBwRbGJ2BOPddIKH3DmPwdMETk/98VZJtE8OGvkuc6G3/HRvG9538PhWYulcJFDCS0bj+YbLITfBFP9nMYLwap1TvW88+cnr8ILMQQK4oiWEHeXM+1Z+22/OnAAVBPVqi2y4P0b34kKxIxVNRqZFvyhkzm+c=; Received: from [217.115.75.229] by web27810.mail.ukl.yahoo.com via HTTP; Wed, 06 Feb 2008 16:14:57 GMT X-Mailer: YahooMailRC/818.31 YahooMailWebService/0.7.162 Date: Wed, 6 Feb 2008 16:14:57 +0000 (GMT) From: Mehmet Ersue Subject: Re: [PEPPERMINT] potenntial charter for PEPPERMINT To: ops-dir@ietf.org, ops-area@ietf.org, peppermint@ietf.org Cc: NETCONF , bertietf@bwijnen.net MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="0-196080041-1202314497=:62822" Message-ID: <174616.62822.qm@web27810.mail.ukl.yahoo.com> Sender: owner-netconf@ops.ietf.org Precedence: bulk --0-196080041-1202314497=:62822 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable =0AHi All,=0A=0AI fully agree with Margaret that the choice of the technolo= gy needs =0Ato be a group consensus.=0A=0ASince IETF and IESG are always in= terested to use already existing =0Aprotocols if they are suitable to do th= e job I'm pretty much interested to =0Ahear the concrete arguments why the = gateway configuration cannot be =0Adone with NETCONF over SOAP.=0A=0ANETCON= F is a suitable protocol for network element configuration and =0Aconfigura= tion data exchange. NETCONF is also reliable and supports =0Anotification a= nd transaction mechanisms. BTW: NETCONF over SOAP =0Ais not heavy-weight.= =0A=0A=0ANETCONF is already available as a standard and has been implemente= d =0Amany times. Already different companies are using it in their products= .=0A=0AYou don't get all these functionalities for free. It takes usually m= any years =0Aof hard work to develop the standard documents and get them st= able based =0Aon implementations.=0A=0AThis is the reason why IESG is usual= ly keen of using already existing IETF =0Atechnologies instead of starting = another overlapping work which takes years=0Ato finalize.=0A=0ASo, please t= ell me, what are the hard-reasons for not using an existing =0Atechnology?= =0A=0ACheers, =0AMehmet Ersue=0A =0A=0A> -----Original Message-----=0A> Fro= m: owner-netconf@ops.ietf.org =0A> [mailto:owner-netconf@ops.ietf.org] On B= ehalf Of ext Margaret =0A> Wasserman=0A> Sent: Wednesday, February 06, 2008= 4:29 PM=0A> To: Romascanu, Dan (Dan)=0A> Cc: ops-dir@ietf.org; ops-area@ie= tf.org; netconf@ops.ietf.org=0A> Subject: Re: [PEPPERMINT] potenntial chart= er for PEPPERMINT=0A> =0A> =0A> By "NETCFG", does Richard mean NETCONF?=0A>= =0A> I would prefer to see the line removed that states that "bias =0A> wi= ll be =0A> given" to particular solutions. I think it is okay to charter = a =0A> group with restrictions on the solution space, such as "will =0A> b= e based =0A> on XML" if there is consensus to do so, but I'm not sure what= it =0A> would mean to charter a group and require that they be "biased" = =0A> towards certain solutions. If there isn't consensus that the =0A> so= lution must be based on one of the technologies listed, I think =0A> that = line should be removed and the choice of technology should be a =0A> group= consensus decision.=0A> =0A> Margaret=0A> =0A> =0A> =0A> On Feb 6, 2008, a= t 5:30 AM, Romascanu, Dan (Dan) wrote:=0A> =0A> >=0A> > Comments are welcom= e.=0A> >=0A> > Dan=0A> >=0A> >=0A> >=0A> >=0A> > -----Original Message-----= =0A> > From: peppermint-bounces@ietf.org =0A> [mailto:peppermint-bounces@ie= tf.org]=0A> > On Behalf Of Richard Shockey=0A> > Sent: Wednesday, February = 06, 2008 2:06 AM=0A> > To: PEPPERMINT@ietf.org=0A> > Subject: [PEPPERMINT] = potenntial charter for PEPPERMINT=0A> >=0A> >=0A> > Folks ..we had a succes= sful BOF in Vancouver in order to =0A> progress the=0A> > work towards a fu= ll charter by the IETF it is necessary to reach=0A> > consensus on a charte= r.=0A> >=0A> > I have a proposal for a charter here below. I welcome =0A> c= omments public=0A> > private etc.=0A> >=0A> >=0A> > PROPOSED CHARTER FOR PE= PPERMINT=0A> >=0A> > The IETF has been working on various aspects of Multi-= Media=0A> > Interconnection among administrative domains.=0A> >=0A> > ENUM = is specifically chartered to develop protocols that involve the=0A> > trans= lation of E.164 numbers to URI's.=0A> >=0A> > SPEERMINT has been chartered = to develop best current practices among=0A> > real-time application service= providers and how such services=0A> > interconnect across administrative b= oundaries.=0A> >=0A> > These forms of interconnection will require various = forms of data =0A> > to be=0A> > exchanged among administrative domains ou= tside the normal scope of=0A> > establishing various SIP sessions.=0A> >=0A= > > The IETF has, in the past done, significant work on data exchanges =0A= > > among=0A> > various network elements. PROVREG and NETCFG being the most= =0A> prominent=0A> > recent examples.=0A> >=0A> > Data exchanges to facili= tate Multi-Media Interconnection =0A> are typically=0A> > between various C= lient User Agents and Registries containing =0A> > mappings of=0A> > phone= numbers to URI's, policies surrounding admission to points of=0A> > networ= k interconnection and various types of trunking data. In =0A> > addition= =0A> > there is a specific need for redistribution of Registry data to =0A= > > various=0A> > types of network databases.=0A> >=0A> > The proposed PEPP= ERMINT working group will build upon the =0A> knowledge =0A> > and=0A> > e= xpertise of the PROVREG, ENUM and SPEERMINT working groups. The =0A> > goa= l of=0A> > the WG is to find a provisioning solution for interconnection to= be=0A> > ultimately used by SPEERMINT. The working group may also reuse = =0A> > elements=0A> > of RFC 4114 if possible.=0A> >=0A> > The final work p= roduct(s) from this working group will be based upon=0A> > XML.=0A> >=0A> >= Additionally, bias will be given to using, HTTP/REST, =0A> HTTP/XML-RPC, o= r=0A> > HTTP/SOAP.=0A> >=0A> > The working group will draw upon expert advi= ce and ongoing =0A> > consultation=0A> > from the ENUM, SPEERMINT and PROV= REG working groups.=0A> >=0A> >=0A> > PROPOSED GOALS AND MILESTONES=0A> >= =0A> >=0A> > Requirements for Interconnection data exchanges. July 08= =0A> >=0A> > Provisioning of Interconnection data registries. Sep 08= =0A> >=0A> > Provisioning of Interconnection data caches. Dec 08= =0A> >=0A> >=0A> > Richard Shockey=0A> > Director, Member of the Technical = Staff=0A> > NeuStar=0A> > 46000 Center Oak Plaza - Sterling, VA 20166 PSTN = Office +1 =0A> > 571.434.5651=0A> > PSTN Mobile: +1 703.593.2683 =0A> > =0A> >= =0A> >=0A> >=0A> >=0A> > _______________________________________________=0A= > > PEPPERMINT mailing list=0A> > PEPPERMINT@ietf.org=0A> > http://www.ietf= .org/mailman/listinfo/peppermint=0A> >=0A> > --=0A> > to unsubscribe send a= message to netconf-request@ops.ietf.org with=0A> > the word 'unsubscribe' = in a single line as the message text body.=0A> > archive: =0A> =0A> =0A> --=0A> to unsubscribe send a message to n= etconf-request@ops.ietf.org with=0A> the word 'unsubscribe' in a single lin= e as the message text body.=0A> archive: =0A> =0A=0A=0A=0A=0A Lesen Sie Ihre E-Mails jetzt einfach von unterw= egs.=0Awww.yahoo.de/go --0-196080041-1202314497=:62822 Content-Type: text/html; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

Hi All,

I fully agree with Margaret that the choice of t= he technology needs
to be a group consensus.

Since IETF and IESG= are always interested to use already existing
protocols if they are su= itable to do the job I'm pretty much interested to
hear the concrete ar= guments why the gateway configuration cannot be
done with NETCONF over = SOAP.

NETCONF is a suitable protocol for network element configurati= on and
configuration data exchange. NETCONF is also reliable and suppor= ts
notification and transaction mechanisms. BTW: NETCONF over SOAP
= is not heavy-weight.

=0ANETCONF is already available as a standard a= nd has been implemented
many times. Already different companies are usi= ng it in their products.

You don't get all these functionalities for= free. It takes usually many years
of hard work to develop the standard= documents and get them stable based
on implementations.

This is= the reason why IESG is usually keen of using already existing IETF
tec= hnologies instead of starting another overlapping work which takes yearsto finalize.

So, please tell me, what are the hard-reasons for not = using an existing
technology?

Cheers,
Mehmet Ersue
 =

> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-netconf@ops.iet= f.org
> [mailto:owner-netconf@ops.ietf.org] On Behalf Of ext Margare= t
> Wasserman
> Sent: Wednesday, February 06, 2008 4:29 PM
= > To: Romascanu, Dan (Dan)
> Cc: ops-dir@ietf.org; ops-area@ietf.o= rg; netconf@ops.ietf.org
> Subject: Re: [PEPPERMINT] potenntial charter = for PEPPERMINT
>
>
> By "NETCFG", does Richard mean NET= CONF?
>
> I would prefer to see the line removed that states t= hat "bias
> will be 
> given" to particular solutions.&n= bsp; I think it is okay to charter a 
> group with restrictions= on the solution space, such as "will
> be based 
> on X= ML" if there is consensus to do so, but I'm not sure what it 
>= would mean to charter a group and require that they be "biased" 
= > towards certain solutions.  If there isn't consensus that the&nbs= p;
> solution must be based on one of the technologies listed, I thi= nk 
> that line should be removed and the choice of technology = should be a 
> group consensus decision.
>
> Marga= ret
>
>
>
> On Feb 6, 2008, at 5:30 AM, Romascanu, Dan (Dan) wrote:
>
> >
> > Comments ar= e welcome.
> >
> > Dan
> >
> >
> = >
> >
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From= : peppermint-bounces@ietf.org
> [mailto:peppermint-bounces@ietf.org]=
> > On Behalf Of Richard Shockey
> > Sent: Wednesday, Fe= bruary 06, 2008 2:06 AM
> > To: PEPPERMINT@ietf.org
> > S= ubject: [PEPPERMINT] potenntial charter for PEPPERMINT
> >
>= >
> > Folks ..we had a successful BOF in Vancouver in order to=
> progress the
> > work towards a full charter by the IETF= it is necessary to reach
> > consensus on a charter.
> >=
> > I have a proposal for a charter here below. I welcome
>= ; comments public
> > private etc.
> >
> >
&g= t; > PROPOSED CHARTER FOR PEPPERMINT
> >
> > The IETF has been working on various aspects of Multi-Media
> > I= nterconnection among administrative domains.
> >
> > ENUM= is specifically chartered to develop protocols that involve the
> &g= t; translation of E.164 numbers to URI's.
> >
> > SPEERMI= NT has been chartered to develop best current practices among
> > = real-time application service providers and how such services
> > = interconnect across administrative boundaries.
> >
> > Th= ese forms of interconnection will require various forms of data 
&= gt; > to be
> > exchanged among administrative domains outside = the normal scope of
> > establishing various SIP sessions.
>= >
> > The IETF has, in the past done, significant work on data= exchanges 
> > among
> > various network elements.= PROVREG and NETCFG being the most
> prominent
> > recent examples.
> >
> > Data exchanges to facilitate Mu= lti-Media Interconnection
> are typically
> > between vario= us Client User Agents and Registries containing 
> > mapping= s of
> > phone numbers to URI's, policies surrounding admission to= points of
> > network interconnection and various types of trunki= ng data.  In 
> > addition
> > there is a spec= ific need for redistribution of Registry data to 
> > variou= s
> > types of network databases.
> >
> > The pr= oposed PEPPERMINT working group will build upon the
> knowledge = ;
> > and
> > expertise of the PROVREG, ENUM and SPEERMI= NT working groups. The 
> > goal of
> > the WG is t= o find a provisioning solution for interconnection to be
> > ultim= ately used by SPEERMINT. The working group may also reuse 
> > elements
> > of RFC 4114 if possible.
> ><= br>> > The final work product(s) from this working group will be base= d upon
> > XML.
> >
> > Additionally, bias will = be given to using, HTTP/REST,
> HTTP/XML-RPC, or
> > HTTP/S= OAP.
> >
> > The working group will draw upon expert advi= ce and ongoing 
> > consultation
> > from the ENUM,= SPEERMINT and PROVREG working groups.
> >
> >
> &g= t; PROPOSED GOALS AND MILESTONES
> >
> >
> > Req= uirements for Interconnection data exchanges.     =   July 08
> >
> > Provisioning of Interconnection da= ta registries.       Sep 08
> >
&= gt; > Provisioning of Interconnection data caches.   &nbs= p;       Dec 08
> >
> >
> > Richard Shockey
> > Director, Member of the Tec= hnical Staff
> > NeuStar
> > 46000 Center Oak Plaza - Ste= rling, VA 20166 PSTN Office +1 
> > 571.434.5651
> >= ; PSTN Mobile: +1 703.593.2683 <mailto:richard(at)shockey.us>
>= > <mailto:richard.shockey(at)neustar.biz>
> >
> &g= t;
> >
> >
> > _________________________________= ______________
> > PEPPERMINT mailing list
> > PEPPERMINT= @ietf.org
> > http://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/pepper= mint
> >
> > --
> > to unsubscribe se= nd a message to netconf-request@ops.ietf.org with
> > the word 'un= subscribe' in a single line as the message text body.
> > ar= chive: <http://ops.ietf.org/lists/netc= onf/>
>
>
> --
> to unsubscribe sen= d a message to netconf-request@ops.ietf.org with
> the word 'unsubscr= ibe' in a single line as the message text body.
> archive: <= http://ops= .ietf.org/lists/netconf/>
>

=0A =
=0A =0ALese= n Sie Ihre E-Mails jetzt einfach von unterwegs.. --0-196080041-1202314497=:62822-- -- to unsubscribe send a message to netconf-request@ops.ietf.org with the word 'unsubscribe' in a single line as the message text body. archive: From owner-netconf@ops.ietf.org Wed Feb 6 13:21:59 2008 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ietfarch-netconf-archive@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ietfarch-netconf-archive@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 90DCF3A6E39 for ; Wed, 6 Feb 2008 13:21:59 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -4.163 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-4.163 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=2.436, BAYES_00=-2.599, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-4] Received: from core3.amsl.com ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (mail.ietf.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id nziKa7evgmcs for ; Wed, 6 Feb 2008 13:21:58 -0800 (PST) Received: from psg.com (psg.com [147.28.0.62]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6E0543A6DF6 for ; Wed, 6 Feb 2008 13:20:55 -0800 (PST) Received: from majordom by psg.com with local (Exim 4.68 (FreeBSD)) (envelope-from ) id 1JMrL0-0002Qy-NI for netconf-data@psg.com; Wed, 06 Feb 2008 20:57:46 +0000 Received: from [76.96.62.80] (helo=QMTA08.westchester.pa.mail.comcast.net) by psg.com with esmtp (Exim 4.68 (FreeBSD)) (envelope-from ) id 1JMnog-000KgL-6K for netconf@ops.ietf.org; Wed, 06 Feb 2008 17:12:11 +0000 Received: from OMTA05.westchester.pa.mail.comcast.net ([76.96.62.43]) by QMTA08.westchester.pa.mail.comcast.net with comcast id mGJk1Y0020vyq2s5805q00; Wed, 06 Feb 2008 17:12:03 +0000 Received: from Harrington73653 ([24.128.66.199]) by OMTA05.westchester.pa.mail.comcast.net with comcast id mHC21Y00N4HwxpC3R00000; Wed, 06 Feb 2008 17:12:08 +0000 X-Authority-Analysis: v=1.0 c=1 a=RvT98sDzUqoA:10 a=48vgC7mUAAAA:8 a=FCdg5C2ZMgz1w-ttZMMA:9 a=Qc0xSEunEc0YlsReHtsA:7 a=EyCJ_V9qyqIQq8_S9HlZlwOk7BUA:4 a=si9q_4b84H0A:10 a=hPjdaMEvmhQA:10 a=lZB815dzVvQA:10 a=shQN7GnF_WUA:10 a=ivbTfD_dPm4A:10 a=50e4U0PicR4A:10 From: "David Harrington" To: "'Margaret Wasserman'" , "'Romascanu, Dan \(Dan\)'" Cc: , , References: Subject: RE: [OPS-DIR] [PEPPERMINT] potenntial charter for PEPPERMINT Date: Wed, 6 Feb 2008 12:12:06 -0500 Message-ID: <01c001c868e3$67075da0$0600a8c0@china.huawei.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: Microsoft Office Outlook 11 Thread-Index: Acho1QRUxvBOizCBRfOkfDjVD1glogAB/QhA In-Reply-To: X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.3138 Sender: owner-netconf@ops.ietf.org Precedence: bulk Hi, A Google search shows NETCFG to be an open-source GUI-based application for configuring networks. I would be very concerned if the charter calls for a solution "biased" toward a vendor-specific offering, even if the vendor uses open-source and the MIT license, since we are supposed to develop vendor-neutral standards, and biased != neutral. If the intention was to reference NETCONF, then I have a concern that the expressed bias is to favor a non-mandatory-to-implement "transport" for NETCONF. I agree that the line expressing a bias for certain solutions should be removed. I would not object to a line expressing a constraint for solutions that leverage existing IETF standards for certain aspects, such as security. But I'm not sure I know what is to be delivered well enough to know how existing standards could be leveraged. Overall, I find the charter wording to be too ambiguous to adequately describe the scope of the work to be done. "find a provisioning solution for interconnection" does not seem sufficiently focused to identify the expected deliverables. Is this WG chartered to produce a protocol, some data models, functionality to manage caches? I'm just not really sure what is being proposed as deliverables, and would be hard pressed to know when the WG drifted off-topic or completed their work. I think the charter wording and scope needs to be tightened significantly to make this engineering-ready. David Harrington dbharrington@comcast.net ietfdbh@comcast.net dharrington@huawei.com > -----Original Message----- > From: ops-dir-bounces@ietf.org > [mailto:ops-dir-bounces@ietf.org] On Behalf Of Margaret Wasserman > Sent: Wednesday, February 06, 2008 10:29 AM > To: Romascanu, Dan (Dan) > Cc: ops-dir@ietf.org; netconf@ops.ietf.org; ops-area@ietf.org > Subject: Re: [OPS-DIR] [PEPPERMINT] potenntial charter for PEPPERMINT > > > By "NETCFG", does Richard mean NETCONF? > > I would prefer to see the line removed that states that "bias > will be > given" to particular solutions. I think it is okay to charter a > group with restrictions on the solution space, such as "will > be based > on XML" if there is consensus to do so, but I'm not sure what it > would mean to charter a group and require that they be "biased" > towards certain solutions. If there isn't consensus that the > solution must be based on one of the technologies listed, I think > that line should be removed and the choice of technology should be a > group consensus decision. > > Margaret > > > > On Feb 6, 2008, at 5:30 AM, Romascanu, Dan (Dan) wrote: > > > > > Comments are welcome. > > > > Dan > > > > > > > > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: peppermint-bounces@ietf.org > [mailto:peppermint-bounces@ietf.org] > > On Behalf Of Richard Shockey > > Sent: Wednesday, February 06, 2008 2:06 AM > > To: PEPPERMINT@ietf.org > > Subject: [PEPPERMINT] potenntial charter for PEPPERMINT > > > > > > Folks ..we had a successful BOF in Vancouver in order to > progress the > > work towards a full charter by the IETF it is necessary to reach > > consensus on a charter. > > > > I have a proposal for a charter here below. I welcome > comments public > > private etc. > > > > > > PROPOSED CHARTER FOR PEPPERMINT > > > > The IETF has been working on various aspects of Multi-Media > > Interconnection among administrative domains. > > > > ENUM is specifically chartered to develop protocols that involve the > > translation of E.164 numbers to URI's. > > > > SPEERMINT has been chartered to develop best current practices among > > real-time application service providers and how such services > > interconnect across administrative boundaries. > > > > These forms of interconnection will require various forms of data > > to be > > exchanged among administrative domains outside the normal scope of > > establishing various SIP sessions. > > > > The IETF has, in the past done, significant work on data exchanges > > among > > various network elements. PROVREG and NETCFG being the most > prominent > > recent examples. > > > > Data exchanges to facilitate Multi-Media Interconnection > are typically > > between various Client User Agents and Registries containing > > mappings of > > phone numbers to URI's, policies surrounding admission to points of > > network interconnection and various types of trunking data. In > > addition > > there is a specific need for redistribution of Registry data to > > various > > types of network databases. > > > > The proposed PEPPERMINT working group will build upon the > knowledge > > and > > expertise of the PROVREG, ENUM and SPEERMINT working groups. The > > goal of > > the WG is to find a provisioning solution for interconnection to be > > ultimately used by SPEERMINT. The working group may also reuse > > elements > > of RFC 4114 if possible. > > > > The final work product(s) from this working group will be based upon > > XML. > > > > Additionally, bias will be given to using, HTTP/REST, > HTTP/XML-RPC, or > > HTTP/SOAP. > > > > The working group will draw upon expert advice and ongoing > > consultation > > from the ENUM, SPEERMINT and PROVREG working groups. > > > > > > PROPOSED GOALS AND MILESTONES > > > > > > Requirements for Interconnection data exchanges. July 08 > > > > Provisioning of Interconnection data registries. Sep 08 > > > > Provisioning of Interconnection data caches. Dec 08 > > > > > > Richard Shockey > > Director, Member of the Technical Staff > > NeuStar > > 46000 Center Oak Plaza - Sterling, VA 20166 PSTN Office +1 > > 571.434.5651 > > PSTN Mobile: +1 703.593.2683 > > > > > > > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > PEPPERMINT mailing list > > PEPPERMINT@ietf.org > > http://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/peppermint > > > > -- > > to unsubscribe send a message to netconf-request@ops.ietf.org with > > the word 'unsubscribe' in a single line as the message text body. > > archive: > > _______________________________________________ > OPS-DIR mailing list > OPS-DIR@ietf.org > http://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ops-dir > -- to unsubscribe send a message to netconf-request@ops.ietf.org with the word 'unsubscribe' in a single line as the message text body. archive: From owner-netconf@ops.ietf.org Fri Feb 8 07:09:45 2008 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ietfarch-netconf-archive@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ietfarch-netconf-archive@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0CD1928C2F0 for ; Fri, 8 Feb 2008 07:09:45 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -3.442 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-3.442 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=3.157, BAYES_00=-2.599, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-4] Received: from core3.amsl.com ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (mail.ietf.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 9lFAt7JOy8Wp for ; Fri, 8 Feb 2008 07:09:44 -0800 (PST) Received: from psg.com (psg.com [147.28.0.62]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1CC7A28C2F6 for ; Fri, 8 Feb 2008 07:09:44 -0800 (PST) Received: from majordom by psg.com with local (Exim 4.68 (FreeBSD)) (envelope-from ) id 1JNUf8-0001vN-OX for netconf-data@psg.com; Fri, 08 Feb 2008 14:57:10 +0000 Received: from [62.250.3.110] (helo=relay.versatel.net) by psg.com with smtp (Exim 4.68 (FreeBSD)) (envelope-from ) id 1JNUf6-0001ui-0y for netconf@ops.ietf.org; Fri, 08 Feb 2008 14:57:09 +0000 Received: (qmail 9302 invoked from network); 8 Feb 2008 14:57:04 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO bwMedion) (87.215.199.34) by relay.versatel.net with SMTP; 8 Feb 2008 14:57:04 -0000 From: "Bert Wijnen" To: "Suresh Krishnan" , "General Area Review Team" , "Sharon Chisholm" , "Hector Trevino" , "Romascanu, Dan \(Dan\)" Cc: "Netconf" Subject: RE: Gen-ART review of draft-ietf-netconf-notification-11.txt Date: Fri, 8 Feb 2008 15:57:06 +0100 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.6604 (9.0.2911.0) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.3198 In-Reply-To: <47AB8729.209@ericsson.com> Importance: Normal Sender: owner-netconf@ops.ietf.org Precedence: bulk I have copied the WG mailing list, so they are aware of the comments. Thanks for your review and comments Suresh. I will study them, but I do expect that Sharon and/or Hector come up first with answers to your questions. Bert Wijnen document shepherd. > -----Oorspronkelijk bericht----- > Van: Suresh Krishnan [mailto:suresh.krishnan@ericsson.com] > Verzonden: donderdag 7 februari 2008 23:33 > Aan: General Area Review Team; Sharon Chisholm; Hector Trevino; > Romascanu, Dan (Dan); netconf-chairs@tools.ietf.org > Onderwerp: Gen-ART review of draft-ietf-netconf-notification-11.txt > > > I am the assigned Gen-ART reviewer for > draft-ietf-netconf-notification-11.txt > > > For background on Gen-ART, please see the FAQ at > . > > Please resolve these comments along with any other Last Call comments > you may receive. > > Summary: This draft is well written and is almost ready for publication, > but I have a couple of issues. > > > Meta issues > =========== > > * Aggregation: Is there a way by which the client can specify the > granularity with which it receives the notifications. i.e. Can the > client request merging of multiple internal events into a single > notification message? The following text in Section 3.2 > > "At some point after the NETCONF server receives the internal event > from a stream, it is converted to an appropriate XML encoding ..." > > make me think that this should be possible. Is this in the scope of this > spec? > > * Modification: How can a client modify a subscription? Section 6.5 > talks about how it cannot be done, but there is no mention of whether > this is even possible to do. If not this must be clearly specified. > > Minor > ===== > > * Section 2.1.1 > > What happens if a stopTime is specified and a startTime is not? Does the > replay begin starting now or is the request rejected? This needs to be > clarified. > > * Section 3.2.1 > > The term "Event Stream Definition" is used in Section 3.2 before it is > defined here. Is it possible to move this somewhere further up. > > > Editorial > ========= > > * Introduction > > The text starting with "[NETCONF] can be conceptually..." and the > following diagram are copied verbatim from RFC4741, which is listed as a > normative reference. Is it necessary to keep it here? > > > Cheers > Suresh > > > -- to unsubscribe send a message to netconf-request@ops.ietf.org with the word 'unsubscribe' in a single line as the message text body. archive: From owner-netconf@ops.ietf.org Sun Feb 10 11:50:22 2008 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ietfarch-netconf-archive@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ietfarch-netconf-archive@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id C9FD83A6813 for ; Sun, 10 Feb 2008 11:50:22 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -6.599 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-6.599 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-2.599, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-4] Received: from core3.amsl.com ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (mail.ietf.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id bCWpOKdOPGr7 for ; Sun, 10 Feb 2008 11:50:22 -0800 (PST) Received: from psg.com (psg.com [147.28.0.62]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0F1C13A6807 for ; Sun, 10 Feb 2008 11:50:22 -0800 (PST) Received: from majordom by psg.com with local (Exim 4.68 (FreeBSD)) (envelope-from ) id 1JOHyv-000IWL-27 for netconf-data@psg.com; Sun, 10 Feb 2008 19:36:53 +0000 Received: from [47.129.242.56] (helo=zcars04e.nortel.com) by psg.com with esmtps (TLSv1:DES-CBC3-SHA:168) (Exim 4.68 (FreeBSD)) (envelope-from ) id 1JOHyr-000IVU-95 for netconf@ops.ietf.org; Sun, 10 Feb 2008 19:36:51 +0000 Received: from zcarhxm2.corp.nortel.com (zcarhxm2.corp.nortel.com [47.129.230.99]) by zcars04e.nortel.com (Switch-2.2.0/Switch-2.2.0) with ESMTP id m1AJWb705984; Sun, 10 Feb 2008 19:32:37 GMT X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft Exchange V6.5 Content-class: urn:content-classes:message MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Subject: RE: Gen-ART review of draft-ietf-netconf-notification-11.txt Date: Sun, 10 Feb 2008 14:36:36 -0500 Message-ID: <713043CE8B8E1348AF3C546DBE02C1B412FE1C54@zcarhxm2.corp.nortel.com> In-Reply-To: X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: Thread-Topic: Gen-ART review of draft-ietf-netconf-notification-11.txt Thread-Index: AchqYuIvAgqlJFFUTpyoP8YK7PF3ogBragyA References: <47AB8729.209@ericsson.com> From: "Sharon Chisholm" To: "Bert Wijnen" , "Suresh Krishnan" , "General Area Review Team" , "Hector Trevino" , "Romascanu, Dan (Dan)" Cc: "Netconf" Sender: owner-netconf@ops.ietf.org Precedence: bulk Hi Yes, thanks Suresh for the review. Comments inline: >=20 > Summary: This draft is well written and is almost ready for=20 > publication, but I have a couple of issues. >=20 >=20 > Meta issues > =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D >=20 > * Aggregation: Is there a way by which the client can specify the=20 > granularity with which it receives the notifications. i.e. Can the=20 > client request merging of multiple internal events into a single=20 > notification message? The following text in Section 3.2 >=20 > "At some point after the NETCONF server receives the internal event > from a stream, it is converted to an appropriate XML encoding ..." >=20 > make me think that this should be possible. Is this in the scope of=20 > this spec? This behaviour is out of scope of the document. The specification does not promote or preclude it.=20 >=20 > * Modification: How can a client modify a subscription? Section 6.5=20 > talks about how it cannot be done, but there is no mention of whether=20 > this is even possible to do. If not this must be clearly specified. Subscriptions cannot be modified. I propose adding a sentence to section 1.3 as follows: "Note that a subscription cannot be modified once created." >=20 > Minor > =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D >=20 > * Section 2.1.1 >=20 > What happens if a stopTime is specified and a startTime is not? Does=20 > the replay begin starting now or is the request rejected? This needs=20 > to be clarified. This results in an error. I think this is implicit with the current text in section 2.1.1. "Must be used with and be later than ."=20 I'm not sure further clarification is required. >=20 > * Section 3.2.1 >=20 > The term "Event Stream Definition" is used in Section 3.2 before it is > defined here. Is it possible to move this somewhere further up. The term 'Stream' is defined in section 1.1 so I think we are OK. >=20 >=20 > Editorial > =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D >=20 > * Introduction >=20 > The text starting with "[NETCONF] can be conceptually..." and the=20 > following diagram are copied verbatim from RFC4741, which is listed as > a normative reference. Is it necessary to keep it here? Actually, we have modified this picture to include Notifications, including a bypass of the RPC layer. This is new content. Sharon -- to unsubscribe send a message to netconf-request@ops.ietf.org with the word 'unsubscribe' in a single line as the message text body. archive: From owner-netconf@ops.ietf.org Sun Feb 10 15:02:33 2008 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ietfarch-netconf-archive@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ietfarch-netconf-archive@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7A38C3A6854 for ; Sun, 10 Feb 2008 15:02:33 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -6.599 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-6.599 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.000, BAYES_00=-2.599, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-4] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id HO4OIoww-zxr for ; Sun, 10 Feb 2008 15:02:32 -0800 (PST) Received: from psg.com (psg.com [147.28.0.62]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3B9873A68FE for ; Sun, 10 Feb 2008 15:02:32 -0800 (PST) Received: from majordom by psg.com with local (Exim 4.68 (FreeBSD)) (envelope-from ) id 1JOL3n-000KNT-6X for netconf-data@psg.com; Sun, 10 Feb 2008 22:54:07 +0000 Received: from [47.140.192.56] (helo=zrtps0kp.nortel.com) by psg.com with esmtps (TLSv1:DES-CBC3-SHA:168) (Exim 4.68 (FreeBSD)) (envelope-from ) id 1JOL3j-000KMs-Ey for netconf@ops.ietf.org; Sun, 10 Feb 2008 22:54:05 +0000 Received: from zcarhxm2.corp.nortel.com (zcarhxm2.corp.nortel.com [47.129.230.99]) by zrtps0kp.nortel.com (Switch-2.2.6/Switch-2.2.0) with ESMTP id m1AMs0a17781 for ; Sun, 10 Feb 2008 22:54:00 GMT X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft Exchange V6.5 Content-class: urn:content-classes:message MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Subject: Response to IESG last call comments on NETCONF Notifications Date: Sun, 10 Feb 2008 17:53:42 -0500 Message-ID: <713043CE8B8E1348AF3C546DBE02C1B412FE1C90@zcarhxm2.corp.nortel.com> X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: Thread-Topic: Response to IESG last call comments on NETCONF Notifications Thread-Index: AchsN8iIMiWuCVZASPqV44xSAcQvxw== From: "Sharon Chisholm" To: "Netconf" Sender: owner-netconf@ops.ietf.org Precedence: bulk Hi I sent a separate response to the gen-art review, but for completeness here I will include the issue for which I have proposed a change to the document. Please let me know if I've missed any issues.=20 I'm not sure whether we should make these changes to the document or create a series of editing instructions to RFC editor. I await guidance from the chairs. 1. >=20 > * Modification: How can a client modify a subscription? Section 6.5=20 > talks about how it cannot be done, but there is no mention of whether=20 > this is even possible to do. If not this must be clearly specified. Subscriptions cannot be modified. I propose adding a sentence to section 1.3 as follows: "Note that a subscription cannot be modified once created." 2. sect 2.2.1 I assume that is of type dateTime!!?? Would be good to state so. In section 2.2.1, in the description of eventTime, add the following text: "This parameter is of type dateTime." 3. on page 14 I see: Should "netmod" be changed into "netconf" !!?? Actually, I wonder if the line should be instead? Same question on page 15. Mmm... I see it in the Schema on page 17/18 as well. So maybe it is OK. Or is this an accidental inheritance from NETMOD efforts? Is there a good reason to make it netmod and not netconf? This is intentional. We are defining the protocol and the content in different parts of the namespace. 4.=20 - Page 29/30 The above fictional notification definition could result in the following is a sample notification list, which is used in the examples in this section. On 2nd line s/is a// >> Ok. 5.=20 - IN IANA Considerations, I guess that instead of Following the format in RFC 3688, IANA has made the following registration. We should have stated: Following the format in RFC 3688, IANA is requested to make the following registration. Oh well... that is what we intended to write ;-) Add the following text -- Editor note to IANA/RFC-Editor: we request that you make these -- assignments, in which case it is top be documented as below 6.=20 - I wonder how/why [XML Schema] Fallside, D. and P. Walmsley, "XML Schema Part 0: Primer Second Edition", W3C XML Schema, October 2004. would/could be a normative reference. It is a "primer", so some sort of education/tutorial on XML Schema, no? I doubt that that should be normative. But I think the issue is that the reference is not so well described. I think they mean to point to: http://www.w3.org/TR/xmlschema-0/ Which states: XML Schema Part 0: Primer Second Edition W3C Recommendation 28 October 2004 So then it is a W3C recommendation, and then it may make sense as normative ref. I think I would make the reference as follows: [XML Schema] Fallside, D. and P. Walmsley, "XML Schema Part 0: Primer Second Edition", W3C Recommendation, 28 October 2004 That seems to be the same reference. How about [XML Schema] Thompson, H., Beech, D., Maloney, M., Mendelsohn, N., "XML Schema Part 1: Structures Second Edition", W3C Recommendation, 28 October 2004 7.=20 - I guess we should instruct the RFC-Editor to remove Appendix A (Change log) right before publication as RFC. Ok. 8.=20 A minor quirk - I see a missing solidus in 3.2.5.1 " " Right. That should be 9. and an uncertainty - the I-D does not register the XML Schema defined in sections 4 and 3.4, just their targetNamespace; is this intentional? Section 4 defines:=20 "urn:ietf:params:xml:ns:netconf:notification:1.0" Section 3,4 defines: "urn:ietf:params:xml:ns:netmod:notification" Section 3.4 references: =09 http://www.iana.org/assignments/xml-registry/schema/notification.xsd And I guess we technically don't register this last one and it should be added to the list. Reformatting this section was suggested but I'm not sure whether we should make that change at this time. 10. Also in IANA considerations, it might be clearer if the registration of the capability urn refers to the named registry created by RFC4741 s.10.3; obvious to those up to their ears in netconf, perhaps less so to those with an IANA-wide remit. We can divide the list into two and indicate that those which are for capabilities (notification, interleave) also align to the registry from RFC4741 s.10.3. Sharon Chisholm Nortel=20 Ottawa, Ontario Canada -- to unsubscribe send a message to netconf-request@ops.ietf.org with the word 'unsubscribe' in a single line as the message text body. archive: From owner-netconf@ops.ietf.org Mon Feb 11 02:45:29 2008 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ietfarch-netconf-archive@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ietfarch-netconf-archive@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id C84603A6ACD for ; Mon, 11 Feb 2008 02:45:29 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -3.635 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-3.635 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=2.964, BAYES_00=-2.599, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-4] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id CIE18z94V+CU for ; Mon, 11 Feb 2008 02:45:28 -0800 (PST) Received: from psg.com (psg.com [147.28.0.62]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id A98583A6895 for ; Mon, 11 Feb 2008 02:45:28 -0800 (PST) Received: from majordom by psg.com with local (Exim 4.68 (FreeBSD)) (envelope-from ) id 1JOW1s-000G8R-LG for netconf-data@psg.com; Mon, 11 Feb 2008 10:36:52 +0000 Received: from [62.250.3.110] (helo=relay.versatel.net) by psg.com with smtp (Exim 4.68 (FreeBSD)) (envelope-from ) id 1JOW1p-000G84-KW for netconf@ops.ietf.org; Mon, 11 Feb 2008 10:36:51 +0000 Received: (qmail 6681 invoked from network); 11 Feb 2008 10:36:46 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO bwMedion) (87.215.199.34) by relay.versatel.net with SMTP; 11 Feb 2008 10:36:46 -0000 From: "Bert Wijnen" To: "Suresh Krishnan" , "General Area Review Team" Cc: "Netconf" , "Sharon Chisholm" , "Hector Trevino" Subject: RE: Gen-ART review of draft-ietf-netconf-notification-11.txt Date: Mon, 11 Feb 2008 11:36:46 +0100 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.6604 (9.0.2911.0) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.3198 In-Reply-To: <713043CE8B8E1348AF3C546DBE02C1B412FE1C54@zcarhxm2.corp.nortel.com> Importance: Normal Sender: owner-netconf@ops.ietf.org Precedence: bulk Suresh, is this answer acceptable? Bert Wijnen document shepherd > -----Oorspronkelijk bericht----- > Van: owner-netconf@ops.ietf.org > [mailto:owner-netconf@ops.ietf.org]Namens Sharon Chisholm > Verzonden: zondag 10 februari 2008 20:37 > Aan: Bert Wijnen; Suresh Krishnan; General Area Review Team; Hector > Trevino; Romascanu, Dan (Dan) > CC: Netconf > Onderwerp: RE: Gen-ART review of draft-ietf-netconf-notification-11.txt > > > Hi > > Yes, thanks Suresh for the review. Comments inline: > > > > > Summary: This draft is well written and is almost ready for > > publication, but I have a couple of issues. > > > > > > Meta issues > > =========== > > > > * Aggregation: Is there a way by which the client can specify the > > granularity with which it receives the notifications. i.e. Can the > > client request merging of multiple internal events into a single > > notification message? The following text in Section 3.2 > > > > "At some point after the NETCONF server receives the internal event > > from a stream, it is converted to an appropriate XML encoding ..." > > > > make me think that this should be possible. Is this in the scope of > > this spec? > > This behaviour is out of scope of the document. The specification does > not promote or preclude it. > > > > > * Modification: How can a client modify a subscription? Section 6.5 > > talks about how it cannot be done, but there is no mention of whether > > this is even possible to do. If not this must be clearly specified. > > Subscriptions cannot be modified. I propose adding a sentence to section > 1.3 as follows: > > "Note that a subscription cannot be modified once created." > > > > > Minor > > ===== > > > > * Section 2.1.1 > > > > What happens if a stopTime is specified and a startTime is not? Does > > the replay begin starting now or is the request rejected? This needs > > to be clarified. > > This results in an error. I think this is implicit with the current text > in section 2.1.1. > > "Must be used with and be later than ." > > I'm not sure further clarification is required. > > > > > * Section 3.2.1 > > > > The term "Event Stream Definition" is used in Section 3.2 before it is > > > defined here. Is it possible to move this somewhere further up. > > The term 'Stream' is defined in section 1.1 so I think we are OK. > > > > > > > Editorial > > ========= > > > > * Introduction > > > > The text starting with "[NETCONF] can be conceptually..." and the > > following diagram are copied verbatim from RFC4741, which is listed as > > > a normative reference. Is it necessary to keep it here? > > Actually, we have modified this picture to include Notifications, > including a bypass of the RPC layer. This is new content. > > Sharon > > -- > to unsubscribe send a message to netconf-request@ops.ietf.org with > the word 'unsubscribe' in a single line as the message text body. > archive: > -- to unsubscribe send a message to netconf-request@ops.ietf.org with the word 'unsubscribe' in a single line as the message text body. archive: From owner-netconf@ops.ietf.org Mon Feb 11 12:15:23 2008 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ietfarch-netconf-archive@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ietfarch-netconf-archive@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id C02D328C3B2 for ; Mon, 11 Feb 2008 12:15:23 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -5.46 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-5.46 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=1.139, BAYES_00=-2.599, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-4] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id eNEFEiQMkxnQ for ; Mon, 11 Feb 2008 12:15:22 -0800 (PST) Received: from psg.com (psg.com [147.28.0.62]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id EB49128C29A for ; Mon, 11 Feb 2008 12:15:18 -0800 (PST) Received: from majordom by psg.com with local (Exim 4.68 (FreeBSD)) (envelope-from ) id 1JOexY-0008KT-Rf for netconf-data@psg.com; Mon, 11 Feb 2008 20:09:00 +0000 Received: from [198.24.6.9] (helo=imr1.ericy.com) by psg.com with esmtps (TLSv1:AES256-SHA:256) (Exim 4.68 (FreeBSD)) (envelope-from ) id 1JObao-0007P1-U9 for netconf@ops.ietf.org; Mon, 11 Feb 2008 16:33:25 +0000 Received: from eusrcmw751.eamcs.ericsson.se (eusrcmw751.exu.ericsson.se [138.85.77.51]) by imr1.ericy.com (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id m1BGX8EB026092; Mon, 11 Feb 2008 10:33:08 -0600 Received: from eusrcmw751.eamcs.ericsson.se ([138.85.77.56]) by eusrcmw751.eamcs.ericsson.se with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.1830); Mon, 11 Feb 2008 10:33:07 -0600 Received: from [142.133.10.140] ([142.133.10.140]) by eusrcmw751.eamcs.ericsson.se with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.1830); Mon, 11 Feb 2008 10:33:07 -0600 Message-ID: <47B07942.2070205@ericsson.com> Date: Mon, 11 Feb 2008 11:35:14 -0500 From: Suresh Krishnan User-Agent: Thunderbird 2.0.0.6 (X11/20071022) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Sharon Chisholm CC: Bert Wijnen , General Area Review Team , Hector Trevino , "Romascanu, Dan (Dan)" , Netconf Subject: Re: Gen-ART review of draft-ietf-netconf-notification-11.txt References: <47AB8729.209@ericsson.com> <713043CE8B8E1348AF3C546DBE02C1B412FE1C54@zcarhxm2.corp.nortel.com> In-Reply-To: <713043CE8B8E1348AF3C546DBE02C1B412FE1C54@zcarhxm2.corp.nortel.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-OriginalArrivalTime: 11 Feb 2008 16:33:07.0691 (UTC) FILETIME=[C86E93B0:01C86CCB] Sender: owner-netconf@ops.ietf.org Precedence: bulk Hi Sharon, Thanks for the quick response. Please find comments inline. Sharon Chisholm wrote: >> Meta issues >> =========== >> >> * Aggregation: Is there a way by which the client can specify the >> ... > This behaviour is out of scope of the document. The specification does > not promote or preclude it. OK. > >> * Modification: How can a client modify a subscription? Section 6.5 >> talks about how it cannot be done, but there is no mention of whether >> this is even possible to do. If not this must be clearly specified. > > Subscriptions cannot be modified. I propose adding a sentence to section > 1.3 as follows: > > "Note that a subscription cannot be modified once created." This text sounds fine. > >> Minor >> ===== >> >> * Section 2.1.1 >> >> What happens if a stopTime is specified and a startTime is not? Does >> the replay begin starting now or is the request rejected? This needs >> to be clarified. > > This results in an error. I think this is implicit with the current text > in section 2.1.1. > > "Must be used with and be later than ." > > I'm not sure further clarification is required. Then why do we have the following error case explicitly listed? " If a is requested which is earlier then the specified , the following error is returned: Tag: bad-element Error-type: protocol Severity: error Error-info: : stopTime Description: An element value is not correct; e.g., wrong type, out of range, pattern mismatch." > >> * Section 3.2.1 >> >> The term "Event Stream Definition" is used in Section 3.2 before it is > >> defined here. Is it possible to move this somewhere further up. > > The term 'Stream' is defined in section 1.1 so I think we are OK. The following text occurs in Section 3.2 "The central component inspects each event notification and matches the event notification against the set of stream definitions." At this point I was not aware what a "stream definition" meant and how/where it was defined. Personally I would like to push the "Event Stream Definition" or a subset of it to Section 1.1 but I do not have a strong position on this. > >> >> Editorial >> ========= >> >> * Introduction >> >> The text starting with "[NETCONF] can be conceptually..." and the >> following diagram are copied verbatim from RFC4741, which is listed as > >> a normative reference. Is it necessary to keep it here? > > Actually, we have modified this picture to include Notifications, > including a bypass of the RPC layer. This is new content. OK. I missed that change. Thanks Suresh -- to unsubscribe send a message to netconf-request@ops.ietf.org with the word 'unsubscribe' in a single line as the message text body. archive: From owner-netconf@ops.ietf.org Mon Feb 11 14:51:01 2008 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ietfarch-netconf-archive@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ietfarch-netconf-archive@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id E6BD428C8A1 for ; Mon, 11 Feb 2008 14:51:01 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -4.509 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-4.509 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=2.090, BAYES_00=-2.599, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-4] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 8-xkj1sBwVqM for ; Mon, 11 Feb 2008 14:51:01 -0800 (PST) Received: from psg.com (psg.com [147.28.0.62]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id DBF6428C799 for ; Mon, 11 Feb 2008 14:51:00 -0800 (PST) Received: from majordom by psg.com with local (Exim 4.68 (FreeBSD)) (envelope-from ) id 1JOhKU-000230-Ca for netconf-data@psg.com; Mon, 11 Feb 2008 22:40:50 +0000 Received: from [69.147.64.94] (helo=smtp121.sbc.mail.sp1.yahoo.com) by psg.com with smtp (Exim 4.68 (FreeBSD)) (envelope-from ) id 1JOhKR-00021Z-R9 for netconf@ops.ietf.org; Mon, 11 Feb 2008 22:40:49 +0000 Received: (qmail 5574 invoked from network); 11 Feb 2008 22:40:46 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO ?192.168.0.10?) (andybierman@att.net@67.127.97.39 with plain) by smtp121.sbc.mail.sp1.yahoo.com with SMTP; 11 Feb 2008 22:40:46 -0000 X-YMail-OSG: hieK2ZYVM1lnAuYBKgM3QTuK64U0E_W7Y.CQutB1rFRTuzZKXGVYoHnFjhuggieItzknLx0MqPIvbEq5Un_T.nWL X-Yahoo-Newman-Property: ymail-3 Message-ID: <47B0CF68.4010800@andybierman.com> Date: Mon, 11 Feb 2008 14:42:48 -0800 From: Andy Bierman User-Agent: Thunderbird 2.0.0.9 (Windows/20071031) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: "Netconf (E-mail)" Subject: DCMI? Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-netconf@ops.ietf.org Precedence: bulk Hi, Anybody know about this? http://dublincore.org/ Is it relevant to CANMOD? Maybe they can send somebody to tell us why we should start over and use DCMI ;-) I really like the WEB site layout though. Andy -- to unsubscribe send a message to netconf-request@ops.ietf.org with the word 'unsubscribe' in a single line as the message text body. archive: From owner-netconf@ops.ietf.org Tue Feb 12 09:41:55 2008 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ietfarch-netconf-archive@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ietfarch-netconf-archive@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 72A2728CCFE for ; Tue, 12 Feb 2008 09:41:55 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -3.367 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-3.367 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=3.232, BAYES_00=-2.599, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-4] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id Iyj2RduFiRA7 for ; Tue, 12 Feb 2008 09:41:48 -0800 (PST) Received: from psg.com (psg.com [147.28.0.62]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6854B28CDC0 for ; Tue, 12 Feb 2008 09:40:18 -0800 (PST) Received: from majordom by psg.com with local (Exim 4.68 (FreeBSD)) (envelope-from ) id 1JOyzL-0007NK-VH for netconf-data@psg.com; Tue, 12 Feb 2008 17:32:11 +0000 Received: from [62.250.3.110] (helo=relay.versatel.net) by psg.com with smtp (Exim 4.68 (FreeBSD)) (envelope-from ) id 1JOyzI-0007MG-9W for netconf@ops.ietf.org; Tue, 12 Feb 2008 17:32:10 +0000 Received: (qmail 90929 invoked from network); 12 Feb 2008 17:32:02 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO bwMedion) (87.215.199.34) by relay.versatel.net with SMTP; 12 Feb 2008 17:32:02 -0000 From: "Bert Wijnen - IETF" To: "Netconf" Subject: FW: PLS correct our NETCONF charter page Date: Tue, 12 Feb 2008 18:32:04 +0100 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.6604 (9.0.2911.0) Importance: Normal X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.3198 Sender: owner-netconf@ops.ietf.org Precedence: bulk FYI. Bert Wijnen -----Oorspronkelijk bericht----- Van: Bert Wijnen - IETF [mailto:bertietf@bwijnen.net] Verzonden: dinsdag 12 februari 2008 18:29 Aan: ietf-action@ietf.org CC: Mehmet Ersue (NSN - DE/Muenich); Dan Romascanu Onderwerp: PLS correct our NETCONF charter page It seems the page has reverted back to the page of 9 Jan 2008. But Dan Romascanu did send you an update on 28 Jan 2008. That is the text that needs to be posted. If needed, we can resend. Bert Wijnen co-chair NETCONF WG -- to unsubscribe send a message to netconf-request@ops.ietf.org with the word 'unsubscribe' in a single line as the message text body. archive: From owner-netconf@ops.ietf.org Thu Feb 14 11:10:16 2008 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ietfarch-netconf-archive@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ietfarch-netconf-archive@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 154DE3A6833 for ; Thu, 14 Feb 2008 11:10:16 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -3.716 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-3.716 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=2.883, BAYES_00=-2.599, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-4] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id zv5jkix3Ubi1 for ; Thu, 14 Feb 2008 11:10:15 -0800 (PST) Received: from psg.com (psg.com [147.28.0.62]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id F16253A67B7 for ; Thu, 14 Feb 2008 11:10:08 -0800 (PST) Received: from majordom by psg.com with local (Exim 4.68 (FreeBSD)) (envelope-from ) id 1JPjF4-000F2a-NO for netconf-data@psg.com; Thu, 14 Feb 2008 18:55:30 +0000 Received: from [69.147.64.88] (helo=smtp115.sbc.mail.sp1.yahoo.com) by psg.com with smtp (Exim 4.68 (FreeBSD)) (envelope-from ) id 1JPjF2-000F2A-7H for netconf@ops.ietf.org; Thu, 14 Feb 2008 18:55:29 +0000 Received: (qmail 67953 invoked from network); 14 Feb 2008 18:55:27 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO ?192.168.0.10?) (andybierman@att.net@68.120.85.9 with plain) by smtp115.sbc.mail.sp1.yahoo.com with SMTP; 14 Feb 2008 18:55:27 -0000 X-YMail-OSG: CUSqFwUVM1ndxsSQQAzopx0ZWXi1_NBEvQMx9.e.pKGFTjBM X-Yahoo-Newman-Property: ymail-3 Message-ID: <47B48E9E.70608@andybierman.com> Date: Thu, 14 Feb 2008 10:55:26 -0800 From: Andy Bierman User-Agent: Thunderbird 2.0.0.9 (Windows/20071031) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: "Netconf (E-mail)" , Bert Wijnen - IETF , Sharon Chisholm Subject: bug in notification-11 XSD Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-netconf@ops.ietf.org Precedence: bulk Hi, I just noticed that the targetNamespace is wrong in the first XSD in this draft. It is missing the ':1.0' suffix that is present in the 'ncEvent' URI. (Not that this reaffirms my belief that XSD is a mistake factory ;-) Andy -- to unsubscribe send a message to netconf-request@ops.ietf.org with the word 'unsubscribe' in a single line as the message text body. archive: From owner-netconf@ops.ietf.org Thu Feb 14 11:24:26 2008 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ietfarch-netconf-archive@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ietfarch-netconf-archive@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4DD1A3A684E for ; Thu, 14 Feb 2008 11:24:26 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -3.812 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-3.812 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=2.787, BAYES_00=-2.599, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-4] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id thKK-hqseils for ; Thu, 14 Feb 2008 11:24:21 -0800 (PST) Received: from psg.com (psg.com [147.28.0.62]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 776CA28CFD3 for ; Thu, 14 Feb 2008 11:23:58 -0800 (PST) Received: from majordom by psg.com with local (Exim 4.68 (FreeBSD)) (envelope-from ) id 1JPjZe-000H7y-Ff for netconf-data@psg.com; Thu, 14 Feb 2008 19:16:46 +0000 Received: from [68.142.198.201] (helo=smtp102.sbc.mail.mud.yahoo.com) by psg.com with smtp (Exim 4.68 (FreeBSD)) (envelope-from ) id 1JPjZU-000H7G-Vr for netconf@ops.ietf.org; Thu, 14 Feb 2008 19:16:41 +0000 Received: (qmail 96883 invoked from network); 14 Feb 2008 19:16:35 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO ?192.168.0.10?) (andybierman@att.net@68.120.85.9 with plain) by smtp102.sbc.mail.mud.yahoo.com with SMTP; 14 Feb 2008 19:16:35 -0000 X-YMail-OSG: KKb2fUgVM1k0s1Hxbq14VfMBYSF_AhaBpmpQmh6QEymOFzDB X-Yahoo-Newman-Property: ymail-3 Message-ID: <47B49392.10601@andybierman.com> Date: Thu, 14 Feb 2008 11:16:34 -0800 From: Andy Bierman User-Agent: Thunderbird 2.0.0.9 (Windows/20071031) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: "Netconf (E-mail)" , Bert Wijnen - IETF , Sharon Chisholm Subject: Re: bug in notification-11 XSD References: <47B48E9E.70608@andybierman.com> In-Reply-To: <47B48E9E.70608@andybierman.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-netconf@ops.ietf.org Precedence: bulk Andy Bierman wrote: > Hi, > > I just noticed that the targetNamespace is wrong in > the first XSD in this draft. It is missing the ':1.0' suffix > that is present in the 'ncEvent' URI. > > (Not that this reaffirms my belief that XSD is a mistake factory ;-) > oops -- I was looking at ncEvent but I should have been looking at manageEvent. The XSD is okay but I think the WG should pick a URI style (with or without version numbers) and stick with it. > Andy Andy -- to unsubscribe send a message to netconf-request@ops.ietf.org with the word 'unsubscribe' in a single line as the message text body. archive: From owner-netconf@ops.ietf.org Thu Feb 14 21:03:39 2008 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ietfarch-netconf-archive@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ietfarch-netconf-archive@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 86A5F3A6A01 for ; Thu, 14 Feb 2008 21:03:39 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -105.599 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-105.599 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-2.599, HTML_MESSAGE=1, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-4, USER_IN_WHITELIST=-100] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id NdTcGJEAvgrS for ; Thu, 14 Feb 2008 21:03:31 -0800 (PST) Received: from psg.com (psg.com [147.28.0.62]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 57B693A69F1 for ; Thu, 14 Feb 2008 21:03:30 -0800 (PST) Received: from majordom by psg.com with local (Exim 4.68 (FreeBSD)) (envelope-from ) id 1JPsbd-000Gbq-Tx for netconf-data@psg.com; Fri, 15 Feb 2008 04:55:25 +0000 Received: from [131.107.1.27] (helo=mail.exchange.microsoft.com) by psg.com with esmtps (TLSv1:RC4-MD5:128) (Exim 4.68 (FreeBSD)) (envelope-from ) id 1JPsbW-000GZQ-2y for netconf@ops.ietf.org; Fri, 15 Feb 2008 04:55:21 +0000 Received: from df-bhd-02.exchange.corp.microsoft.com (157.54.71.155) by DF-GWY-07.exchange.corp.microsoft.com (157.54.63.164) with Microsoft SMTP Server (TLS) id 8.1.240.5; Thu, 14 Feb 2008 11:23:15 -0800 Received: from DF-GRTDANE-MSG.exchange.corp.microsoft.com ([157.54.62.8]) by df-bhd-02.exchange.corp.microsoft.com ([157.54.71.155]) with mapi; Thu, 14 Feb 2008 11:23:15 -0800 From: Charlie Kaufman To: "netconf@ops.ietf.org" Date: Thu, 14 Feb 2008 11:23:00 -0800 Subject: FW: review/comments of/on draft-ietf-netconf-tls-00.txt Thread-Topic: review/comments of/on draft-ietf-netconf-tls-00.txt Thread-Index: AchupsYB4JNtiSdGQZiP/hrbAb2BZAAMXIOQABlw1RA= Message-ID: <30C65F3A3407B943826897E025135BE60117A3E28A9C@DF-GRTDANE-MSG.exchange.corp.microsoft.com> Accept-Language: en-US Content-Language: en-US X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: acceptlanguage: en-US Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="_000_30C65F3A3407B943826897E025135BE60117A3E28A9CDFGRTDANEMS_" MIME-Version: 1.0 Sender: owner-netconf@ops.ietf.org Precedence: bulk --_000_30C65F3A3407B943826897E025135BE60117A3E28A9CDFGRTDANEMS_ Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable I was reminded that I should copy this list with my additional comments bel= ow. I hope the formatting makes it through. --Charlie From: Charlie Kaufman Sent: Wednesday, February 13, 2008 11:22 PM To: Badra Cc: bertietf@bwijnen.net; Mohamad Badra Subject: RE: review/comments of/on draft-ietf-netconf-tls-00.txt Responses in brown prefixed [charliek:] ... Charlie From: Badra [mailto:mbadra@gmail.com] Sent: Wednesday, February 13, 2008 5:13 PM To: Charlie Kaufman Cc: bertietf@bwijnen.net; Mohamad Badra Subject: Re: review/comments of/on draft-ietf-netconf-tls-00.txt Dear Charlie, Thank you very much for your comments. Comments in-line: Netconf requires that its transport provide mutual authentication of client= and server, so cipher suites that are anonymous or which only authenticate= the server to the client MUST NOT be used with Netconf. This document spec= ifies how to use TLS with endpoint authentication in TLS can be based on ei= ther preshared keys [RFC4279] or public key certificates [RFC4246]. Some ci= pher suites (e.g. TLS_RSA_PSK_WITH_AES_128_CBC_SHA) use both. Section 3.1.1= describes how the client authenticates the server if public key certificat= es are provided by the server, section 3.1.2 describes how the server authe= nticates the client if public key certificates are provided by the client, = and section 3.2 describes how the client and server mutually authenticate o= ne another using a password. It is a perfect text for me. Just a samll comment, should I say something here about Kerberos or it is n= ot required? [charliek:] I don't think it's necessary unless you want to specify how you= could use Netconf over TLS with Kerberos authentication. I suspect you don= 't want to deal with it. [Thinking about it, I think it would be better to renumber section 3.1.1 as= section 3.1, section 3.1.2 as 3.2, and section 3.2 as 3.3.] Yes The title of section 3.2 is slightly misleading, since authentication based= on a password is actually mutual authentication. It might be better to sho= rten the title to "Password-Based Authentication". OK Section 4 requires implementation of three different crypto suites. Is that= actually what you intended? I would think that either TLS_DHE_PSK_WITH_AES= _128_CBC_SHA or TLS_RSA_PSK_WITH_AES_128_CBC_SHA would be the common case (= I don't know which... do you?) and use of the other two would be rare. In fact, I integrated the point 6 of your mail available at https://ops.iet= f.org/lists/netconf/netconf.2008/msg00067.html [charliek:] Oops... sorry. I was thinking that those three would be the mos= t common, but if one of those three is more common than the others, having = a single mandatory suite would be best of all. - Section 9 of TLS V1.2 (http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-ietf-tls= -rfc4346-bis-09.txt) says that TLS_RSA_WITH_AES_128_CBC_SHA is mandatory. - Section 9 of RFC4346 says that TLS_RSA_WITH_3DES_EDE_CBC_SHA is the manda= tory cipher suite. So I think it is better to don't recommend any certificate-based ciphersuit= e You might want to make one of both of those mandatory and the others option= al. You should probably say that any suite providing mutual authentication = is optional. But as section 3 already mentions that "cipher suites that are anonymous or= which only authenticate the server to the client MUST NOT be used with Net= conf". So I don't see think that we should repeat it here. [charliek:] I was trying to make a different point. You already said that c= ipher suites that are anonymous or which only authenticate the server to th= e client MUST NOT be used, but what you could say is that any cipher suite = that provides mutual authentication MAY be used. 3DES is widely used, and EDH provide PFS, so I would prefere TLS_DHE_PSK_WI= TH_AES_128_CBC_SHA. What about: 4. Cipher Suite Requirements A compliant implementation of this document MUST implement the cipher suite= TLS_DHE_PSK_WITH_AES_128_CBC_SHA. [charliek:] How about: [charliek:] A compliant implementation of the protocol specified in this do= cument MUST implement the cipher suite TLS_DHE_PSK_WITH_AES_128_CBC_SHA and= MAY implement any TLS cipher suite the provides mutual authentication. [charliek:] [Note: I don't feel strongly about any of this; it just seems l= ike this is what you mean. My only worry about my wording is that it may ra= ise the question of Kerberos again.] Many thanks Best regards, Badra From: Badra [mailto:mbadra@gmail.com] Sent: Wednesday, February 13, 2008 2:37 PM To: Charlie Kaufman; bertietf@bwijnen.net Subject: Re: review/comments of/on draft-ietf-netconf-tls-00.txt Dear Charlie and Bert, I would like to submit a new version of Netconf over TLS document before th= e cutoff. I updated it by including all the comments posted at the mailing = list. I attached the new version and a diff between the 00 and 01 versions. Please feel free to give me your comments, especially regarding the passwor= d authentication. Best regards, Badra -- Badra --_000_30C65F3A3407B943826897E025135BE60117A3E28A9CDFGRTDANEMS_ Content-Type: text/html; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

I was reminded that I should copy this list with my addition= al comments below. I hope the formatting makes it through.

 

          =       --Charlie

 

From: Charlie Kaufm= an
Sent: Wednesday, February 13, 2008 11:22 PM
To: Badra
Cc: bertietf@bwijnen.net; Mohamad Badra
Subject: RE: review/comments of/on draft-ietf-netconf-tls-00.txt

 

Responses in brown prefixed [charliek:]  … Charlie

 

From: Badra [mailto:mbadra@gmail.com]
Sent: Wednesday, February 13, 2008 5:13 PM
To: Charlie Kaufman
Cc: bertietf@bwijnen.net; Mohamad Badra
Subject: Re: review/comments of/on draft-ietf-netconf-tls-00.txt

 

Dear Charlie,

 

Thank you very much for= your comments. Comments in-line:

Netconf requires that its transport provide mutual authentication of client and server, so cipher sui= tes that are anonymous or which only authenticate the server to the client MUST= NOT be used with Netconf. This document specifies how to use TLS with endpoint authentication in TLS can be based on either preshared keys [RFC4279] or pu= blic key certificates [RFC4246]. Some cipher suites (e.g. TLS_RSA_PSK_WITH_AES_128_CBC_SHA) use both. Section 3.1.1 describes how the client authenticates the server if public key certificates are provided by = the server, section 3.1.2 describes how the server authenticates the client if public key certificates are provided by the client, and section 3.2 describ= es how the client and server mutually authenticate one another using a passwor= d.

 

 

It is a perfect text for me.

Just a samll comment, should I say something here abou= t Kerberos or it is not required?

[charliek:] I don’t think it’s necessary unless you want to specify how you could use Netconf o= ver TLS with Kerberos authentication. I suspect you don’t want to deal wi= th it.

 <= /p>

[Thinking about it, I thi= nk it would be better to renumber section 3.1.1 as section 3.1, section 3.1.2 as = 3.2, and section 3.2 as 3.3.]

 <= /p>

Yes

The title of section 3.2 = is slightly misleading, since authentication based on a password is actually mutual authentication. It might be better to shorten the title to "Password-Based Authentication".

 <= /p>

OK

Section 4 requires implementation of three different crypto suites. Is that actually what you intended? I would think that either TLS_DHE_PSK_WITH_AES_128_CBC_SHA or TLS_RSA_PSK_WITH_AES_128_CBC_SHA would be the common case (I don't know which… do you?) and use of the other two would be rare.  

In fact, I integrated the point 6 of your mail availab= le at http= s://ops.ietf.org/lists/netconf/netconf.2008/msg00067.html

 

[charliek:] Oops… sorry. I was thinking that those three would be the most common, but if one of those thr= ee is more common than the others, having a single mandatory suite would be be= st of all.

 

- Section 9 of RFC4346 says that TLS_RSA_WITH_3DES_EDE_CBC_SHA is the mandatory cipher suite.

 

So I think it is better to don't recommend any certificate-based ciphersuite

 

You might want to make o= ne of both of those mandatory and the others optional. You should probably say th= at any suite providing mutual authentication is optional.

 

But as section 3 already mentions that "cipher su= ites that are anonymous or which only authenticate the server to the client MUST= NOT be used with Netconf". So I don't see think that we should repeat it h= ere.

 =

[charliek:] I was trying to make a different point. You already said that cipher suites that are anonymous or which only authenticate the server to the client MUST NOT be used, but what= you could say is that any cipher suite that provides mutual authentication MAY = be used.

 

3DES is widely used, and EDH provide PFS, so I would p= refere TLS_DHE_PSK_WITH_AES_128_CBC_SHA.


What about:

4. Cipher Suite Requirements

A compliant implementation of this document MUST implement the cipher suite TLS_DHE_PSK_WITH_AES_128_CBC_SHA.

 

[charliek:] How about:

 

[charliek:] A compliant implementatio= n of the protocol specified in this document MUST implement the cipher suite TLS= _DHE_PSK_WITH_AES_128_CBC_SHA and MAY implement any TLS cipher suite the provides mutual authentication.<= o:p>

 

[charliek:] [Note: I don’t feel strongly about any of this; it just seems like this is what you mean. My on= ly worry about my wording is that it may raise the question of Kerberos again.= ]


Many thanks
Best regards,

Badra

 

 

 <= /p>

 <= /p>

From: Badra [mailto:mbadra@gmail.com]
Sent: Wednesday, February 13, 2008 2:37 PM
To: Charlie Kaufman; bertietf@bwijnen.net


Subject: Re: review/comments of/on draft-ietf-netconf-tls-00.txt

 

Dear Charlie and Bert,

 

I would like to submit a new version of Netconf over TLS document before= the cutoff. I updated it by including all the comments posted at the mailing li= st.

I attached the new version and a diff between the 00 and 01 versions.

 

Please feel free to give me your comments, especially regarding the pass= word authentication.

Best regards,

Badra




--
Badra

--_000_30C65F3A3407B943826897E025135BE60117A3E28A9CDFGRTDANEMS_-- -- to unsubscribe send a message to netconf-request@ops.ietf.org with the word 'unsubscribe' in a single line as the message text body. archive: From owner-netconf@ops.ietf.org Fri Feb 15 02:20:08 2008 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ietfarch-netconf-archive@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ietfarch-netconf-archive@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 77DBA28D008 for ; Fri, 15 Feb 2008 02:20:08 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -4.599 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-4.599 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=2.000, BAYES_00=-2.599, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-4] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 1jDZ-Uh9B9Pi for ; Fri, 15 Feb 2008 02:20:01 -0800 (PST) Received: from psg.com (psg.com [147.28.0.62]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 952593A69BD for ; Fri, 15 Feb 2008 02:19:57 -0800 (PST) Received: from majordom by psg.com with local (Exim 4.68 (FreeBSD)) (envelope-from ) id 1JPxcI-000NIH-UB for netconf-data@psg.com; Fri, 15 Feb 2008 10:16:26 +0000 Received: from [2001:1890:1112:1::20] (helo=mail.ietf.org) by psg.com with esmtp (Exim 4.68 (FreeBSD)) (envelope-from ) id 1JPxcF-000NHi-M8 for netconf@ops.ietf.org; Fri, 15 Feb 2008 10:16:25 +0000 Received: by core3.amsl.com (Postfix, from userid 0) id 77C3D3A6975; Fri, 15 Feb 2008 02:15:01 -0800 (PST) Content-Type: Multipart/Mixed; Boundary="NextPart" Mime-Version: 1.0 To: i-d-announce@ietf.org Cc: netconf@ops.ietf.org From: Internet-Drafts@ietf.org Subject: I-D Action:draft-ietf-netconf-tls-01.txt Message-Id: <20080215101501.77C3D3A6975@core3.amsl.com> Date: Fri, 15 Feb 2008 02:15:01 -0800 (PST) Sender: owner-netconf@ops.ietf.org Precedence: bulk --NextPart A New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line Internet-Drafts directories. This draft is a work item of the Network Configuration Working Group of the IETF. Title : NETCONF over Transport Layer Security (TLS) Author(s) : M. Badra Filename : draft-ietf-netconf-tls-01.txt Pages : 9 Date : 2008-02-15 The Network Configuration Protocol (NETCONF) provides mechanisms to install, manipulate, and delete the configuration of network devices. This document describes how to use the Transport Layer Protocol (TLS) to secure NETCONF exchanges. A URL for this Internet-Draft is: http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-ietf-netconf-tls-01.txt To remove yourself from the I-D Announcement list, send a message to i-d-announce-request@ietf.org with the word unsubscribe in the body of the message. You can also visit https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/I-D-announce to change your subscription settings. Internet-Drafts are also available by anonymous FTP. Login with the username "anonymous" and a password of your e-mail address. After logging in, type "cd internet-drafts" and then "get draft-ietf-netconf-tls-01.txt". A list of Internet-Drafts directories can be found in http://www.ietf.org/shadow.html or ftp://ftp.ietf.org/ietf/1shadow-sites.txt Internet-Drafts can also be obtained by e-mail. Send a message to: mailserv@ietf.org. In the body type: "FILE /internet-drafts/draft-ietf-netconf-tls-01.txt". NOTE: The mail server at ietf.org can return the document in MIME-encoded form by using the "mpack" utility. To use this feature, insert the command "ENCODING mime" before the "FILE" command. To decode the response(s), you will need "munpack" or a MIME-compliant mail reader. Different MIME-compliant mail readers exhibit different behavior, especially when dealing with "multipart" MIME messages (i.e. documents which have been split up into multiple messages), so check your local documentation on how to manipulate these messages. Below is the data which will enable a MIME compliant mail reader implementation to automatically retrieve the ASCII version of the Internet-Draft. --NextPart Content-Type: Multipart/Alternative; Boundary="OtherAccess" --OtherAccess Content-Type: Message/External-body; access-type="mail-server"; server="mailserv@ietf.org" Content-Type: text/plain Content-ID: <2008-02-15020409.I-D@ietf.org> ENCODING mime FILE /internet-drafts/draft-ietf-netconf-tls-01.txt --OtherAccess Content-Type: Message/External-body; name="draft-ietf-netconf-tls-01.txt"; site="ftp.ietf.org"; access-type="anon-ftp"; directory="internet-drafts" Content-Type: text/plain Content-ID: <2008-02-15020409.I-D\@ietf.org> --OtherAccess-- --NextPart-- -- to unsubscribe send a message to netconf-request@ops.ietf.org with the word 'unsubscribe' in a single line as the message text body. archive: From owner-netconf@ops.ietf.org Fri Feb 15 02:20:08 2008 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ietfarch-netconf-archive@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ietfarch-netconf-archive@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9852D3A6A49 for ; Fri, 15 Feb 2008 02:20:08 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -4.249 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-4.249 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=2.000, BAYES_00=-2.599, HELO_EQ_FR=0.35, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-4] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 1xym-PEy9H-9 for ; Fri, 15 Feb 2008 02:20:07 -0800 (PST) Received: from psg.com (psg.com [147.28.0.62]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 885213A6A4E for ; Fri, 15 Feb 2008 02:20:07 -0800 (PST) Received: from majordom by psg.com with local (Exim 4.68 (FreeBSD)) (envelope-from ) id 1JPxYv-000Mwt-DH for netconf-data@psg.com; Fri, 15 Feb 2008 10:12:57 +0000 Received: from [193.55.95.1] (helo=sp.isima.fr) by psg.com with esmtp (Exim 4.68 (FreeBSD)) (envelope-from ) id 1JPxYs-000MwT-8l for netconf@ops.ietf.org; Fri, 15 Feb 2008 10:12:56 +0000 Received: from [127.0.0.1] (pc158.isima.fr [193.55.95.158]) by sp.isima.fr (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id m1FB9CvZ684132; Fri, 15 Feb 2008 11:09:13 GMT Message-ID: <47B5655C.4000207@isima.fr> Date: Fri, 15 Feb 2008 11:11:40 +0100 From: Mohamad Badra User-Agent: Thunderbird 1.5.0.14 (Windows/20071210) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Charlie Kaufman CC: "netconf@ops.ietf.org" Subject: Re: FW: review/comments of/on draft-ietf-netconf-tls-00.txt References: <30C65F3A3407B943826897E025135BE60117A3E28A9C@DF-GRTDANE-MSG.exchange.corp.microsoft.com> In-Reply-To: <30C65F3A3407B943826897E025135BE60117A3E28A9C@DF-GRTDANE-MSG.exchange.corp.microsoft.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=windows-1252; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Greylist: Sender IP whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-3.0 (sp.isima.fr [193.55.95.1]); Fri, 15 Feb 2008 11:09:13 +0000 (WET) Sender: owner-netconf@ops.ietf.org Precedence: bulk Thank you Charlie. I submitted a new version of the document that addresses the raised comments. Please don't hesitate to submit your comments. Many thanks! Best regards, Badra Charlie Kaufman a écrit : > I was reminded that I should copy this list with my additional comments > below. I hope the formatting makes it through. > > > > --Charlie > > > > *From:* Charlie Kaufman > *Sent:* Wednesday, February 13, 2008 11:22 PM > *To:* Badra > *Cc:* bertietf@bwijnen.net; Mohamad Badra > *Subject:* RE: review/comments of/on draft-ietf-netconf-tls-00.txt > > > > Responses in brown*/ /*prefixed */[charliek:] /* … Charlie > > > > *From:* Badra [mailto:mbadra@gmail.com] > *Sent:* Wednesday, February 13, 2008 5:13 PM > *To:* Charlie Kaufman > *Cc:* bertietf@bwijnen.net; Mohamad Badra > *Subject:* Re: review/comments of/on draft-ietf-netconf-tls-00.txt > > > > Dear Charlie, > > > > Thank you very much for your comments. Comments in-line: > > Netconf requires that its transport provide mutual authentication of > client and server, so cipher suites that are anonymous or which only > authenticate the server to the client MUST NOT be used with Netconf. > This document specifies how to use TLS with endpoint authentication > in TLS can be based on either preshared keys [RFC4279] or public key > certificates [RFC4246]. Some cipher suites (e.g. > TLS_RSA_PSK_WITH_AES_128_CBC_SHA) use both. Section 3.1.1 describes > how the client authenticates the server if public key certificates > are provided by the server, section 3.1.2 describes how the server > authenticates the client if public key certificates are provided by > the client, and section 3.2 describes how the client and server > mutually authenticate one another using a password. > > > > > > It is a perfect text for me. > > Just a samll comment, should I say something here about Kerberos or it > is not required? > > */[charliek:] /*I don’t think it’s necessary unless you want to specify > how you could use Netconf over TLS with Kerberos authentication. I > suspect you don’t want to deal with it. > > > > [Thinking about it, I think it would be better to renumber section > 3.1.1 as section 3.1, section 3.1.2 as 3.2, and section 3.2 as 3.3.] > > > > Yes > > The title of section 3.2 is slightly misleading, since > authentication based on a password is actually mutual > authentication. It might be better to shorten the title to > "Password-Based Authentication". > > > > OK > > Section 4 requires implementation of three different crypto suites. > Is that actually what you intended? I would think that either > TLS_DHE_PSK_WITH_AES_128_CBC_SHA or TLS_RSA_PSK_WITH_AES_128_CBC_SHA > would be the common case (I don't know which… do you?) and use of > the other two would be rare. > > In fact, I integrated the point 6 of your mail available at > https://ops.ietf.org/lists/netconf/netconf.2008/msg00067.html > > > > */[charliek:] /*Oops… sorry. I was thinking that those three would be > the most common, but if one of those three is more common than the > others, having a single mandatory suite would be best of all. > > > > - Section 9 of TLS V1.2 > (http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-ietf-tls-rfc4346-bis-09.txt) > says that TLS_RSA_WITH_AES_128_CBC_SHA is mandatory. > > - Section 9 of RFC4346 says that TLS_RSA_WITH_3DES_EDE_CBC_SHA is the > mandatory cipher suite. > > > > So I think it is better to don't recommend any certificate-based ciphersuite > > > > You might want to make one of both of those mandatory and the others > optional. You should probably say that any suite providing mutual > authentication is optional. > > > > But as section 3 already mentions that "cipher suites that are anonymous > or which only authenticate the server to the client MUST NOT be used > with Netconf". So I don't see think that we should repeat it here. > > > > */[charliek:] /*I was trying to make a different point. You already said > that cipher suites that are anonymous or which only authenticate the > server to the client MUST NOT be used, but what you could say is that > any cipher suite that provides mutual authentication MAY be used. > > > > 3DES is widely used, and EDH provide PFS, so I would prefere > TLS_DHE_PSK_WITH_AES_128_CBC_SHA. > > > What about: > > 4. Cipher Suite Requirements > > A compliant implementation of this document MUST implement the cipher > suite TLS_DHE_PSK_WITH_AES_128_CBC_SHA. > > > > */[charliek:] /*How about: > > > > */[charliek:] /*A compliant implementation of the protocol specified in > this document MUST implement the cipher suite > TLS_DHE_PSK_WITH_AES_128_CBC_SHA and MAY implement any TLS cipher suite > the provides mutual authentication. > > > > */[charliek:] /*[Note: I don’t feel strongly about any of this; it just > seems like this is what you mean. My only worry about my wording is that > it may raise the question of Kerberos again.] > > > Many thanks > Best regards, > > Badra > > > > > > > > > > *From:* Badra [mailto:mbadra@gmail.com ] > *Sent:* Wednesday, February 13, 2008 2:37 PM > *To:* Charlie Kaufman; bertietf@bwijnen.net > > > > *Subject:* Re: review/comments of/on draft-ietf-netconf-tls-00.txt > > > > Dear Charlie and Bert, > > > > I would like to submit a new version of Netconf over TLS document > before the cutoff. I updated it by including all the comments posted > at the mailing list. > > I attached the new version and a diff between the 00 and 01 versions. > > > > Please feel free to give me your comments, especially regarding the > password authentication. > > Best regards, > > Badra > > > > > -- > Badra -- to unsubscribe send a message to netconf-request@ops.ietf.org with the word 'unsubscribe' in a single line as the message text body. archive: From owner-netconf@ops.ietf.org Fri Feb 15 02:55:55 2008 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ietfarch-netconf-archive@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ietfarch-netconf-archive@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4885F3A69BD for ; Fri, 15 Feb 2008 02:55:55 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.258 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.258 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=1.927, BAYES_40=-0.185, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-4] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id ME4jjlyI9y+e for ; Fri, 15 Feb 2008 02:55:54 -0800 (PST) Received: from psg.com (psg.com [147.28.0.62]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9959C3A699B for ; Fri, 15 Feb 2008 02:55:54 -0800 (PST) Received: from majordom by psg.com with local (Exim 4.68 (FreeBSD)) (envelope-from ) id 1JPy7D-00015H-7k for netconf-data@psg.com; Fri, 15 Feb 2008 10:48:23 +0000 Received: from [62.250.3.110] (helo=relay.versatel.net) by psg.com with smtp (Exim 4.68 (FreeBSD)) (envelope-from ) id 1JPy7A-00014u-KK for netconf@ops.ietf.org; Fri, 15 Feb 2008 10:48:22 +0000 Received: (qmail 7579 invoked from network); 15 Feb 2008 10:48:19 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO bwMedion) (87.215.199.34) by relay.versatel.net with SMTP; 15 Feb 2008 10:48:19 -0000 From: "Bert Wijnen - IETF" To: "Mohamad Badra" Cc: Subject: new revision: draft-ietf-netconf-tls-01.txt Date: Fri, 15 Feb 2008 11:48:22 +0100 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="Windows-1252" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.6604 (9.0.2911.0) Importance: Normal In-Reply-To: <47B5655C.4000207@isima.fr> X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.3198 Sender: owner-netconf@ops.ietf.org Precedence: bulk Thanks Badra. My initial comments have been addressed. All WG Members, pls review this new revision and comment prefereably well BEFORE we have our meeting at IETF71. Bert Wijnen > -----Oorspronkelijk bericht----- > Van: owner-netconf@ops.ietf.org > [mailto:owner-netconf@ops.ietf.org]Namens Mohamad Badra > Verzonden: vrijdag 15 februari 2008 11:12 > Aan: Charlie Kaufman > CC: netconf@ops.ietf.org > Onderwerp: Re: FW: review/comments of/on draft-ietf-netconf-tls-00.txt > > > Thank you Charlie. > > I submitted a new version of the document that addresses the raised > comments. Please don't hesitate to submit your comments. Many thanks! > > Best regards, > Badra -- to unsubscribe send a message to netconf-request@ops.ietf.org with the word 'unsubscribe' in a single line as the message text body. archive: From owner-netconf@ops.ietf.org Sat Feb 16 15:28:32 2008 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ietfarch-netconf-archive@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ietfarch-netconf-archive@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 93DA53A6B57 for ; Sat, 16 Feb 2008 15:28:32 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -5.675 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-5.675 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.924, BAYES_00=-2.599, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-4] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id oqgGVtiFf4wk for ; Sat, 16 Feb 2008 15:28:31 -0800 (PST) Received: from psg.com (psg.com [147.28.0.62]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 59BA43A6B3F for ; Sat, 16 Feb 2008 15:28:31 -0800 (PST) Received: from majordom by psg.com with local (Exim 4.68 (FreeBSD)) (envelope-from ) id 1JQWKn-000Dgv-EI for netconf-data@psg.com; Sat, 16 Feb 2008 23:20:41 +0000 Received: from [47.129.242.57] (helo=zcars04f.nortel.com) by psg.com with esmtps (TLSv1:DES-CBC3-SHA:168) (Exim 4.68 (FreeBSD)) (envelope-from ) id 1JQWKk-000Dgc-Nm for netconf@ops.ietf.org; Sat, 16 Feb 2008 23:20:40 +0000 Received: from zcarhxm2.corp.nortel.com (zcarhxm2.corp.nortel.com [47.129.230.99]) by zcars04f.nortel.com (Switch-2.2.6/Switch-2.2.0) with ESMTP id m1GNKEQ28171; Sat, 16 Feb 2008 23:20:15 GMT X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft Exchange V6.5 Content-class: urn:content-classes:message MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Subject: RE: Gen-ART review of draft-ietf-netconf-notification-11.txt Date: Sat, 16 Feb 2008 18:20:01 -0500 Message-ID: <713043CE8B8E1348AF3C546DBE02C1B4131B797F@zcarhxm2.corp.nortel.com> In-Reply-To: <47B07942.2070205@ericsson.com> X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: Thread-Topic: Gen-ART review of draft-ietf-netconf-notification-11.txt Thread-Index: Achs61+E1Uf9h7ROSqOP/iBKIFj+XgEBnC5A References: <47AB8729.209@ericsson.com> <713043CE8B8E1348AF3C546DBE02C1B412FE1C54@zcarhxm2.corp.nortel.com> <47B07942.2070205@ericsson.com> From: "Sharon Chisholm" To: "Suresh Krishnan" Cc: "Bert Wijnen" , "General Area Review Team" , "Hector Trevino" , "Romascanu, Dan (Dan)" , "Netconf" Sender: owner-netconf@ops.ietf.org Precedence: bulk hi =20 >=20 >> Minor >> =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D >> >> * Section 2.1.1 >> >> What happens if a stopTime is specified and a startTime is not? Does=20 >> the replay begin starting now or is the request rejected? This needs=20 >> to be clarified. >=20 > This results in an error. I think this is implicit with the current=20 > text in section 2.1.1. >=20 > "Must be used with and be later than ."=20 >=20 > I'm not sure further clarification is required. Then why do we have the following error case explicitly listed? " If a is requested which is earlier then the specified , the following error is returned: Tag: bad-element Error-type: protocol Severity: error Error-info: : stopTime Description: An element value is not correct; e.g., wrong type, out of range, pattern mismatch." The text in section 2.1.1 says that stopTime must be later then startTime and there is an error message defined later when this isn't the case. I'm not sure what the issue is. Can you clarify? >=20 >> * Section 3.2.1 >> >> The term "Event Stream Definition" is used in Section 3.2 before it=20 >> is >=20 >> defined here. Is it possible to move this somewhere further up. >=20 > The term 'Stream' is defined in section 1.1 so I think we are OK. The following text occurs in Section 3.2 "The central component inspects each event notification and matches the event notification against the set of stream definitions." At this point I was not aware what a "stream definition" meant and how/where it was defined. Personally I would like to push the "Event Stream Definition" or a subset of it to Section 1.1 but I do not have a strong position on this. My personal view is that since it is defined in the definition section I think we are ok. Thanks, Sharon -- to unsubscribe send a message to netconf-request@ops.ietf.org with the word 'unsubscribe' in a single line as the message text body. archive: From owner-netconf@ops.ietf.org Sun Feb 17 16:54:08 2008 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ietfarch-netconf-archive@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ietfarch-netconf-archive@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 79EC73A6BBF for ; Sun, 17 Feb 2008 16:54:08 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -4.707 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-4.707 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=-0.212, BAYES_00=-2.599, FH_RELAY_NODNS=1.451, HELO_MISMATCH_COM=0.553, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-4, RDNS_NONE=0.1] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id eQaKUnvDj7c9 for ; Sun, 17 Feb 2008 16:54:06 -0800 (PST) Received: from psg.com (psg.com [IPv6:2001:418:1::62]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 70E373A6A73 for ; Sun, 17 Feb 2008 16:54:06 -0800 (PST) Received: from majordom by psg.com with local (Exim 4.68 (FreeBSD)) (envelope-from ) id 1JQXj7-0001YX-48 for netconf-data@psg.com; Sun, 17 Feb 2008 00:49:53 +0000 Received: from [47.129.242.56] (helo=zcars04e.nortel.com) by psg.com with esmtps (TLSv1:DES-CBC3-SHA:168) (Exim 4.68 (FreeBSD)) (envelope-from ) id 1JQXj4-0001Xw-CX for netconf@ops.ietf.org; Sun, 17 Feb 2008 00:49:51 +0000 Received: from zcarhxm2.corp.nortel.com (zcarhxm2.corp.nortel.com [47.129.230.99]) by zcars04e.nortel.com (Switch-2.2.0/Switch-2.2.0) with ESMTP id m1H0jgU18073 for ; Sun, 17 Feb 2008 00:45:42 GMT X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft Exchange V6.5 Content-class: urn:content-classes:message MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Subject: RE: Notification Pre-release of -12 (take 1) Date: Sat, 16 Feb 2008 19:49:45 -0500 Message-ID: <713043CE8B8E1348AF3C546DBE02C1B4131B7985@zcarhxm2.corp.nortel.com> In-Reply-To: <713043CE8B8E1348AF3C546DBE02C1B4131B7981@zcarhxm2.corp.nortel.com> X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: Thread-Topic: Notification Pre-release of -12 (take 1) Thread-Index: Achw+KR9yZ68Bfp7TZO/fZa6MUronQABjIJw References: <713043CE8B8E1348AF3C546DBE02C1B4131B7981@zcarhxm2.corp.nortel.com> From: "Sharon Chisholm" To: "Netconf" Sender: owner-netconf@ops.ietf.org Precedence: bulk Hi Forgot the change log. I've added it as follows. A.5. Version -12 1. Add to section 1.3 the clarification "Note that a subscription cannot be modified once created." 2. In section 2.2.1, in the description of eventTime, added the following text: "This parameter is of type dateTime." 3. Fixed several typos. 4. Added the following text to the IANA considerations section: "-- Editor note to IANA/RFC-Editor: we request that you make these assignments, in which case it is top be documented as below" " 5. Replaced/Updated XML Schema reference to be " [XML Schema] Thompson, H., Beech, D., Maloney, M., Mendelsohn, N., "XML Schema Part 1: Structures Second Edition", W3C Recommendation, 28 October 2004 " 6. Add instructions to RFC editor to remove change log before publication 7. Added IANA registration item for http://www.iana.org/assignments/ xml-registry/schema/notification.xsd 8. Clarified in the IANA considerations section that the capability URIs were complaint to RFC4741 section 10.3 Sharon=20 -----Original Message----- From: owner-netconf@ops.ietf.org [mailto:owner-netconf@ops.ietf.org] On Behalf Of Chisholm, Sharon (CAR:ZZ00) Sent: Saturday, February 16, 2008 7:04 PM To: Netconf Subject: Notification Pre-release of -12 (take 1) Hi Attached is a pre-release of -12 of the Notification ID with change bars to -11. It is aimed at resolving IESG last call comments. Please review and ensure we are satisfied with the changes. Thanks, Sharon Chisholm Nortel Ottawa, Ontario Canada -- to unsubscribe send a message to netconf-request@ops.ietf.org with the word 'unsubscribe' in a single line as the message text body. archive: From owner-netconf@ops.ietf.org Sun Feb 17 16:54:13 2008 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ietfarch-netconf-archive@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ietfarch-netconf-archive@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id CBD6C3A6A73 for ; Sun, 17 Feb 2008 16:54:13 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -3.173 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-3.173 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=-1.711, BAYES_50=0.001, FH_RELAY_NODNS=1.451, FM_ASCII_ART_SPACINGc=0.833, GB_I_LETTER=-2, HELO_MISMATCH_COM=0.553, HTML_MESSAGE=1, J_CHICKENPOX_34=0.6, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-4, RDNS_NONE=0.1] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 9sPQ2pyFG0O3 for ; Sun, 17 Feb 2008 16:54:09 -0800 (PST) Received: from psg.com (psg.com [IPv6:2001:418:1::62]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 67F263A6B9D for ; Sun, 17 Feb 2008 16:54:08 -0800 (PST) Received: from majordom by psg.com with local (Exim 4.68 (FreeBSD)) (envelope-from ) id 1JQX1G-000Kj3-9q for netconf-data@psg.com; Sun, 17 Feb 2008 00:04:34 +0000 Received: from [47.129.242.57] (helo=zcars04f.nortel.com) by psg.com with esmtp (Exim 4.68 (FreeBSD)) (envelope-from ) id 1JQX18-000KiS-KH for netconf@ops.ietf.org; Sun, 17 Feb 2008 00:04:30 +0000 Received: from zcarhxm2.corp.nortel.com (zcarhxm2.corp.nortel.com [47.129.230.99]) by zcars04f.nortel.com (Switch-2.2.6/Switch-2.2.0) with ESMTP id m1H04ND29655 for ; Sun, 17 Feb 2008 00:04:23 GMT X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft Exchange V6.5 Content-class: urn:content-classes:message MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="----_=_NextPart_001_01C870F8.A6C6D3C1" Subject: Notification Pre-release of -12 (take 1) Date: Sat, 16 Feb 2008 19:04:19 -0500 Message-ID: <713043CE8B8E1348AF3C546DBE02C1B4131B7981@zcarhxm2.corp.nortel.com> X-MS-Has-Attach: yes X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: Thread-Topic: Notification Pre-release of -12 (take 1) Thread-Index: Achw+KR9yZ68Bfp7TZO/fZa6MUronQ== From: "Sharon Chisholm" To: "Netconf" Sender: owner-netconf@ops.ietf.org Precedence: bulk This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------_=_NextPart_001_01C870F8.A6C6D3C1 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Hi Attached is a pre-release of -12 of the Notification ID with change bars to -11. It is aimed at resolving IESG last call comments. Please review and ensure we are satisfied with the changes. 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RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-4, RDNS_NONE=0.1] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 1ALHbYfQ3obR for ; Mon, 18 Feb 2008 09:07:13 -0800 (PST) Received: from psg.com (psg.com [IPv6:2001:418:1::62]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9BC8B3A6CDB for ; Mon, 18 Feb 2008 09:07:13 -0800 (PST) Received: from majordom by psg.com with local (Exim 4.68 (FreeBSD)) (envelope-from ) id 1JR9Kv-000OBr-Hv for netconf-data@psg.com; Mon, 18 Feb 2008 16:59:25 +0000 Received: from [171.71.176.117] (helo=sj-iport-6.cisco.com) by psg.com with esmtp (Exim 4.68 (FreeBSD)) (envelope-from ) id 1JR9Ks-000OBM-Gb for netconf@ops.ietf.org; Mon, 18 Feb 2008 16:59:24 +0000 Received: from sj-dkim-3.cisco.com ([171.71.179.195]) by sj-iport-6.cisco.com with ESMTP; 18 Feb 2008 08:59:22 -0800 Received: from sj-core-1.cisco.com (sj-core-1.cisco.com [171.71.177.237]) by sj-dkim-3.cisco.com (8.12.11/8.12.11) with ESMTP id m1IGxMxb022027; Mon, 18 Feb 2008 08:59:22 -0800 Received: from xbh-sjc-231.amer.cisco.com (xbh-sjc-231.cisco.com [128.107.191.100]) by sj-core-1.cisco.com (8.12.10/8.12.6) with ESMTP id m1IGwnKG022545; Mon, 18 Feb 2008 16:59:19 GMT Received: from xmb-sjc-223.amer.cisco.com ([128.107.191.124]) by xbh-sjc-231.amer.cisco.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.1830); Mon, 18 Feb 2008 08:59:16 -0800 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft Exchange V6.5 Content-class: urn:content-classes:message MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Subject: RE: Gen-ART review of draft-ietf-netconf-notification-11.txt Date: Mon, 18 Feb 2008 08:59:15 -0800 Message-ID: <6E21698722408147BEA594E073E2B0AB056A7FC8@xmb-sjc-223.amer.cisco.com> In-Reply-To: <47B9100E.2050504@ericsson.com> X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: Thread-Topic: Gen-ART review of draft-ietf-netconf-notification-11.txt Thread-Index: Achx6vHQkGmn6zIMTU2/4GTyeAK/WAAYy92A References: <47AB8729.209@ericsson.com> <713043CE8B8E1348AF3C546DBE02C1B412FE1C54@zcarhxm2.corp.nortel.com> <47B07942.2070205@ericsson.com> <713043CE8B8E1348AF3C546DBE02C1B4131B797F@zcarhxm2.corp.nortel.com> <47B9100E.2050504@ericsson.com> From: "Hector Trevino (htrevino)" To: "Suresh Krishnan" , "Sharon Chisholm" Cc: "Bert Wijnen" , "General Area Review Team" , "Romascanu, Dan (Dan)" , "Netconf" X-OriginalArrivalTime: 18 Feb 2008 16:59:16.0153 (UTC) FILETIME=[98332290:01C8724F] DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; q=dns/txt; l=5034; t=1203353962; x=1204217962; c=relaxed/simple; s=sjdkim3002; h=Content-Type:From:Subject:Content-Transfer-Encoding:MIME-Version; d=cisco.com; i=htrevino@cisco.com; z=From:=20=22Hector=20Trevino=20(htrevino)=22=20 |Subject:=20RE=3A=20Gen-ART=20review=20of=20draft-ietf-netc onf-notification-11.txt |Sender:=20; bh=RAVVkUQu67Yb8Bt/Q7jyRy0yInPlDndAXXQR6AEIbk4=; b=e/Q6ycEB4e+O/4FoeMkk4o9sQRVH6odmSxTqpMti76Fg35u3X9BH3+/oSI iFWzKRwSG2amOtqs/k3FwtF1HNkxGPpvhC2rxbztttnR06WCw0GyLz6MjB5Y rbtk/s0cOO; Authentication-Results: sj-dkim-3; header.From=htrevino@cisco.com; dkim=pass ( sig from cisco.com/sjdkim3002 verified; ); Sender: owner-netconf@ops.ietf.org Precedence: bulk Hi Suresh, Your comment from below: I enquired what would happen if stopTime would be specified without a startTime. You mentioned it was implicit in this sentence ""Must be used with and be later than .". My question is why the other half of the sentence "later that " explicitly handled as an error case while the "must be used with" not explicitly handled. Response: The definitions in the document included below. Start time is a mandatory parameter for replay. Stop time is an optional parameter for replay. If Start Time is not present then Stop time should not be present, if it is, then it is an error. Maybe the Start Time and Stop Time descriptions do not explicitely state this but I think the Negative response text does. Does this satisfy you comment? The Negative Response says: If a is specified in a request without having specified a , the following error is returned: Tag: missing-element Error-type: protocol Severity: error Error-info: : startTime Description: An expected element is missing. Start Time: A parameter, , used to trigger the replay feature and indicate that the replay should start at the time specified. If is not present, this is not a replay subscription. It is not valid to specify start times that are later than the current time. If the specified is earlier than the log can support, the replay will begin with the earliest available notification. This parameter is of type dateTime. Stop Time: An optional parameter, , used with the optional replay feature to indicate the newest notifications of interest. If stop time is not present, the notifications will continue until the subscription is terminated. Must be used with and be later than . Values of in the future are valid. This parameter is of type dateTime. =20 -----Original Message----- From: Suresh Krishnan [mailto:suresh.krishnan@ericsson.com]=20 Sent: Sunday, February 17, 2008 9:57 PM To: Sharon Chisholm Cc: Bert Wijnen; General Area Review Team; Hector Trevino (htrevino); Romascanu, Dan (Dan); Netconf Subject: Re: Gen-ART review of draft-ietf-netconf-notification-11.txt Hi Sharon, Please find comments inline. Sharon Chisholm wrote: > hi > =20 > >>> Minor >>> =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D >>> >>> * Section 2.1.1 >>> >>> What happens if a stopTime is specified and a startTime is not? Does >>> the replay begin starting now or is the request rejected? This needs >>> to be clarified. >> This results in an error. I think this is implicit with the current=20 >> text in section 2.1.1. >> >> "Must be used with and be later than ."=20 >> >> I'm not sure further clarification is required. >=20 > Then why do we have the following error case explicitly listed? >=20 > " If a is requested which is earlier then the specified > , the following error is returned: >=20 > Tag: bad-element >=20 > Error-type: protocol >=20 > Severity: error >=20 > Error-info: : stopTime >=20 > Description: An element value is not correct; e.g., wrong=20 > type, > out of range, pattern mismatch." >=20 > >=20 > The text in section 2.1.1 says that stopTime must be later then=20 > startTime and there is an error message defined later when this isn't=20 > the case. I'm not sure what the issue is. Can you clarify? I enquired what would happen if stopTime would be specified without a startTime. You mentioned it was implicit in this sentence ""Must be used with and be later than .". My question is why the other half of the sentence "later that " explicitly handled as an error case while the "must be used with" not explicitly handled. >=20 > >>> * Section 3.2.1 >>> >>> The term "Event Stream Definition" is used in Section 3.2 before it=20 >>> is defined here. Is it possible to move this somewhere further up. >> The term 'Stream' is defined in section 1.1 so I think we are OK. >=20 > The following text occurs in Section 3.2 >=20 > "The central component inspects each event notification and matches > the event notification against the set of stream definitions." >=20 > At this point I was not aware what a "stream definition" meant and=20 > how/where it was defined. Personally I would like to push the "Event=20 > Stream Definition" or a subset of it to Section 1.1 but I do not have=20 > a strong position on this. > >=20 > My personal view is that since it is defined in the definition section > I think we are ok. OK. I am fine with this. Thanks Suresh -- to unsubscribe send a message to netconf-request@ops.ietf.org with the word 'unsubscribe' in a single line as the message text body. archive: From owner-netconf@ops.ietf.org Mon Feb 18 10:44:39 2008 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ietfarch-netconf-archive@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ietfarch-netconf-archive@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id D012A3A681E for ; Mon, 18 Feb 2008 10:44:39 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -4.341 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-4.341 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=-0.279, BAYES_00=-2.599, FH_RELAY_NODNS=1.451, FM_ASCII_ART_SPACINGc=0.833, GB_I_LETTER=-2, HELO_MISMATCH_COM=0.553, HTML_MESSAGE=1, J_CHICKENPOX_34=0.6, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-4, RDNS_NONE=0.1] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id PXI9c-EFPomA for ; Mon, 18 Feb 2008 10:44:35 -0800 (PST) Received: from psg.com (psg.com [IPv6:2001:418:1::62]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 26A5A28C3AB for ; Mon, 18 Feb 2008 10:44:34 -0800 (PST) Received: from majordom by psg.com with local (Exim 4.68 (FreeBSD)) (envelope-from ) id 1JRAmz-000CEW-Pi for netconf-data@psg.com; Mon, 18 Feb 2008 18:32:29 +0000 Received: from [47.129.242.56] (helo=zcars04e.nortel.com) by psg.com with esmtps (TLSv1:DES-CBC3-SHA:168) (Exim 4.68 (FreeBSD)) (envelope-from ) id 1JRAmr-000CDH-TJ for netconf@ops.ietf.org; Mon, 18 Feb 2008 18:32:25 +0000 Received: from zcarhxm2.corp.nortel.com (zcarhxm2.corp.nortel.com [47.129.230.99]) by zcars04e.nortel.com (Switch-2.2.0/Switch-2.2.0) with ESMTP id m1IISCW08202 for ; Mon, 18 Feb 2008 18:28:13 GMT X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft Exchange V6.5 Content-class: urn:content-classes:message MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="----_=_NextPart_001_01C8725C.8D6FA312" Subject: Notification Pre-release of -12 (take 2) Date: Mon, 18 Feb 2008 13:31:57 -0500 Message-ID: <713043CE8B8E1348AF3C546DBE02C1B4131B7DBA@zcarhxm2.corp.nortel.com> X-MS-Has-Attach: yes X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: Thread-Topic: Notification Pre-release of -12 (take 2) Thread-Index: AchyXIruv84oUoANSRCkUvLCfex6Jw== From: "Sharon Chisholm" To: "Netconf" Sender: owner-netconf@ops.ietf.org Precedence: bulk This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------_=_NextPart_001_01C8725C.8D6FA312 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Hi Based on some feedback from Bert, I have modified the IANA considerations section a bit. See attached. 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cmF0aXZlIFN1cHBvcnQgQWN0aXZpdHkgKElBU0EpLgo8L3ByZT4KPC9ib2R5PjwvaHRtbD4K ------_=_NextPart_001_01C8725C.8D6FA312-- -- to unsubscribe send a message to netconf-request@ops.ietf.org with the word 'unsubscribe' in a single line as the message text body. archive: From owner-netconf@ops.ietf.org Tue Feb 19 00:45:37 2008 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ietfarch-netconf-archive@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ietfarch-netconf-archive@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6D0B93A6A43 for ; Tue, 19 Feb 2008 00:45:37 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -5.247 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-5.247 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=-0.752, BAYES_00=-2.599, FH_RELAY_NODNS=1.451, HELO_MISMATCH_COM=0.553, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-4, RDNS_NONE=0.1] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id CYNU3a7Z+3wh for ; Tue, 19 Feb 2008 00:45:36 -0800 (PST) Received: from psg.com (psg.com [IPv6:2001:418:1::62]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id E0CFA3A69E1 for ; Tue, 19 Feb 2008 00:45:35 -0800 (PST) Received: from majordom by psg.com with local (Exim 4.68 (FreeBSD)) (envelope-from ) id 1JRNyF-000Btr-SY for netconf-data@psg.com; Tue, 19 Feb 2008 08:36:59 +0000 Received: from [144.254.224.140] (helo=ams-iport-1.cisco.com) by psg.com with esmtp (Exim 4.68 (FreeBSD)) (envelope-from ) id 1JRNyB-000Bsu-53 for netconf@ops.ietf.org; Tue, 19 Feb 2008 08:36:57 +0000 Received: from ams-dkim-2.cisco.com ([144.254.224.139]) by ams-iport-1.cisco.com with ESMTP; 19 Feb 2008 09:36:53 +0100 Received: from ams-core-1.cisco.com (ams-core-1.cisco.com [144.254.224.150]) by ams-dkim-2.cisco.com (8.12.11/8.12.11) with ESMTP id m1J8arGu008924; Tue, 19 Feb 2008 09:36:53 +0100 Received: from adsl-247-6-fixip.tiscali.ch (ams3-vpn-dhcp91.cisco.com [10.61.64.91]) by ams-core-1.cisco.com (8.12.10/8.12.6) with ESMTP id m1J8aWp6006127; Tue, 19 Feb 2008 08:36:36 GMT Message-ID: <47BA9510.5020900@cisco.com> Date: Tue, 19 Feb 2008 09:36:32 +0100 From: Eliot Lear User-Agent: Thunderbird 2.0.0.9 (Macintosh/20071031) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Bert Wijnen - IETF CC: Mohamad Badra , netconf@ops.ietf.org, "Nelson, David" , Kaushik Narayan Subject: Re: new revision: draft-ietf-netconf-tls-01.txt References: In-Reply-To: X-Enigmail-Version: 0.95.6 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=windows-1252; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; q=dns/txt; l=3095; t=1203410213; x=1204274213; c=relaxed/simple; s=amsdkim2001; h=Content-Type:From:Subject:Content-Transfer-Encoding:MIME-Version; d=cisco.com; i=lear@cisco.com; z=From:=20Eliot=20Lear=20 |Subject:=20Re=3A=20new=20revision=3A=20draft-ietf-netconf- tls-01.txt |Sender:=20; bh=ZuWJbK3UWrN7j4N+JRpH2ry76L7T2nVDvNcuu5OJKBM=; b=Tcx65xlCfv3QjFf9Nt7VAD3F7WnENia7ilqQ70wpheeLCrxSvciBkGy6sT nsGj1BJ5o9y1LWxGMyGT8JjQRzaouDWWdsPNsPZMdlwsC8DEpn1IU1M2c3qe wkb/CQNxNh; Authentication-Results: ams-dkim-2; header.From=lear@cisco.com; dkim=pass ( sig from cisco.com/amsdkim2001 verified; ); Sender: owner-netconf@ops.ietf.org Precedence: bulk Hi Bert & Mohamad, I am not a radius expert, but I think you might have a radius problem. It would seem that either the identity & identity_hint discussed in the draft cannot be unique to a host OR the radius server must perform the transformations with appropriate identity & identity_hint passed along with the string presented by the client. Keeping in mind that OTPs should be supported, it seems likely that the radius server would have to do the support. I see that RFC 4590 might be related work. It could be possible to propose a radius extension along similar lines. However, I am by no means a radius expert. Kaushik is, and David Nelson is, so I've CC'd them. While the extension itself might be out of scope for NETCONF and in fact might be more generally useful, not having such an extension leads us towards an SNMPv3 problem and a future ISMS analog. I don't think you have to gate this draft on that work, but the mandate that you hash the password is what causes the problem. SASL solves this with PLAIN, but some people complain that it is not bound well to TLS. Also, here are a few additional comments: In that Section 3.3 Note 1, if you're going to say something is NOT secure, you should bound that statement and preferably provide a reference. In that same section, Note 2, and I realize this may be my poor reading of RFC 4279, I do not see how the form of the PSK resultant (ASCII or HEX) is specified. Above that point, the following statement requires further elaboration and the term "random" does not sit well on its own. > It is RECOMMENDED that implementations > that allow the administrator to manually configure the password also > provide functionality for generating a new random password, taking > [RFC4086] into account. While it's good that you cited RFC 4086, I doubt that Don Eastlake would use the term "random", but perhaps "pseudo random". All of this having been said, I believe you're a bit off the beaten path, and you could probably cut this text in its entirety. HTH... Eliot Bert Wijnen - IETF wrote: > Thanks Badra. My initial comments have been addressed. > > All WG Members, pls review this new revision and comment > prefereably well BEFORE we have our meeting at IETF71. > > Bert Wijnen > > >> -----Oorspronkelijk bericht----- >> Van: owner-netconf@ops.ietf.org >> [mailto:owner-netconf@ops.ietf.org]Namens Mohamad Badra >> Verzonden: vrijdag 15 februari 2008 11:12 >> Aan: Charlie Kaufman >> CC: netconf@ops.ietf.org >> Onderwerp: Re: FW: review/comments of/on draft-ietf-netconf-tls-00.txt >> >> >> Thank you Charlie. >> >> I submitted a new version of the document that addresses the raised >> comments. Please don't hesitate to submit your comments. Many thanks! >> >> Best regards, >> Badra >> > > > -- > to unsubscribe send a message to netconf-request@ops.ietf.org with > the word 'unsubscribe' in a single line as the message text body. > archive: > > -- to unsubscribe send a message to netconf-request@ops.ietf.org with the word 'unsubscribe' in a single line as the message text body. archive: From owner-netconf@ops.ietf.org Tue Feb 19 03:24:29 2008 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ietfarch-netconf-archive@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ietfarch-netconf-archive@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 85FB43A6895 for ; Tue, 19 Feb 2008 03:24:29 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.674 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.674 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=-0.976, BAYES_00=-2.599, FH_RELAY_NODNS=1.451, HELO_EQ_FR=0.35, RDNS_NONE=0.1] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id nn77PhqHmNbk for ; Tue, 19 Feb 2008 03:24:28 -0800 (PST) Received: from psg.com (psg.com [IPv6:2001:418:1::62]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 73B363A6A4C for ; Tue, 19 Feb 2008 03:24:28 -0800 (PST) Received: from majordom by psg.com with local (Exim 4.68 (FreeBSD)) (envelope-from ) id 1JRQQc-0002j4-KL for netconf-data@psg.com; Tue, 19 Feb 2008 11:14:26 +0000 Received: from [193.55.95.1] (helo=sp.isima.fr) by psg.com with esmtp (Exim 4.68 (FreeBSD)) (envelope-from ) id 1JRQQX-0002iF-Ov for netconf@ops.ietf.org; Tue, 19 Feb 2008 11:14:24 +0000 Received: from [127.0.0.1] (pc158.isima.fr [193.55.95.158]) by sp.isima.fr (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id m1JCBAYX450712; Tue, 19 Feb 2008 12:11:10 GMT Message-ID: <47BAB9E3.8020207@isima.fr> Date: Tue, 19 Feb 2008 12:13:39 +0100 From: Mohamad Badra User-Agent: Thunderbird 1.5.0.14 (Windows/20071210) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Eliot Lear CC: Bert Wijnen - IETF , netconf@ops.ietf.org, "Nelson, David" , Kaushik Narayan Subject: Re: new revision: draft-ietf-netconf-tls-01.txt References: <47BA9510.5020900@cisco.com> In-Reply-To: <47BA9510.5020900@cisco.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=windows-1252; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Greylist: Sender IP whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-3.0 (sp.isima.fr [193.55.95.1]); Tue, 19 Feb 2008 12:11:10 +0000 (WET) Sender: owner-netconf@ops.ietf.org Precedence: bulk Hi Eliot, Thank you for the comments. Responses and comments in-line.. Eliot Lear a écrit : > Hi Bert & Mohamad, > > I am not a radius expert, but I think you might have a radius problem. > It would seem that either the identity & identity_hint discussed in the > draft cannot be unique to a host OR the radius server must perform the > transformations with appropriate identity & identity_hint passed along > with the string presented by the client. Keeping in mind that OTPs > should be supported, it seems likely that the radius server would have > to do the support. > > I see that RFC 4590 might be related work. It could be possible to > propose a radius extension along similar lines. However, I am by no > means a radius expert. Kaushik is, and David Nelson is, so I've CC'd > them. While the extension itself might be out of scope for NETCONF and > in fact might be more generally useful, not having such an extension > leads us towards an SNMPv3 problem and a future ISMS analog. I don't > think you have to gate this draft on that work, but the mandate that you > hash the password is what causes the problem. SASL solves this with > PLAIN, but some people complain that it is not bound well to TLS. I am not a RADIUS expert too, and any reply from Kaushik Narayan, David Nelson and others is welcome. I agree on the fact that the document doesn't make use of all existing password databases features. It only gives a way to generate a PSK from a password for NETCONF operating over TLS. While NETCONF relies on the transport layer for the user authentication, we are forced to provide a profile for using password within TLS "without" modifying TLS (note that there are some expired IDs that propose using OTP and passwords within TLS, e.g., draft-linn-otp-tls). Regarding the transformations, I guess the exact encoding with RADIUS is implementation dependent. But I think RADIUS recommends UTF-8, (doesn't it?). If then it will be OK for the document when relying on RFC4279 (the PSK identity, identity hint, and password are converted to a character string, and then encoded to octets using UTF-8). Regarding OTP and the other passwaord mechanisms, I can identify the following three options to move forward with the password authentication: 1. keep the proposed profile to derive a PSK from a password and store the PSK with the identity and the hint in the database. 2. use TLS for establishing a secure session with the server authentication and then implement a "RADIUS client" on the client (AVP attributes inside the established TLS session). 3. specify NETCONF over EAP (encapsulation) over TLS. 4. others? Personally, I am for the 1st option. > > Also, here are a few additional comments: > > > In that Section 3.3 Note 1, if you're going to say something is NOT > secure, you should bound that statement and preferably provide a reference. OK, I will insert RFC 4306 as reference. > In that same section, Note 2, and I realize this may be my poor reading > of RFC 4279, I do not see how the form of the PSK resultant (ASCII or > HEX) is specified. RFC4279 section 5.1 gives the form of that. If this is not clear in the draft, what about inserting the following at the beginning of note 2: "The PSK identity, identity hint, and password MUST be first converted to a character string, and then encoded to octets using UTF-8 [UTF8]." > > Above that point, the following statement requires further elaboration > and the term "random" does not sit well on its own. > >> It is RECOMMENDED that implementations >> that allow the administrator to manually configure the password also >> provide functionality for generating a new random password, taking >> [RFC4086] into account. > While it's good that you cited RFC 4086, I doubt that Don Eastlake would > use the term "random", but perhaps "pseudo random". All of this having > been said, I believe you're a bit off the beaten path, and you could > probably cut this text in its entirety. I would prefer to keep RFC4086 as a reference and remove the 'random'. > HTH... > > Eliot Many thanks! Best regards, -- Mohamad Badra CNRS - LIMOS Laboratory -- to unsubscribe send a message to netconf-request@ops.ietf.org with the word 'unsubscribe' in a single line as the message text body. archive: From owner-netconf@ops.ietf.org Tue Feb 19 04:34:35 2008 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ietfarch-netconf-archive@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ietfarch-netconf-archive@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id DA1A628C562 for ; Tue, 19 Feb 2008 04:34:35 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -4.538 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-4.538 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=-0.043, BAYES_00=-2.599, FH_RELAY_NODNS=1.451, HELO_MISMATCH_COM=0.553, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-4, RDNS_NONE=0.1] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 5stBPSCcDkc4 for ; Tue, 19 Feb 2008 04:34:34 -0800 (PST) Received: from psg.com (psg.com [IPv6:2001:418:1::62]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4E06128C5A0 for ; Tue, 19 Feb 2008 04:34:26 -0800 (PST) Received: from majordom by psg.com with local (Exim 4.68 (FreeBSD)) (envelope-from ) id 1JRRVh-000AHB-Dw for netconf-data@psg.com; Tue, 19 Feb 2008 12:23:45 +0000 Received: from [47.129.242.56] (helo=zcars04e.nortel.com) by psg.com with esmtps (TLSv1:DES-CBC3-SHA:168) (Exim 4.68 (FreeBSD)) (envelope-from ) id 1JRRVd-000AGT-1p for netconf@ops.ietf.org; Tue, 19 Feb 2008 12:23:43 +0000 Received: from zcarhxm2.corp.nortel.com (zcarhxm2.corp.nortel.com [47.129.230.99]) by zcars04e.nortel.com (Switch-2.2.0/Switch-2.2.0) with ESMTP id m1JCJVC17781 for ; Tue, 19 Feb 2008 12:19:31 GMT X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft Exchange V6.5 Content-class: urn:content-classes:message MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Subject: RE: Notification Pre-release of -12 (take 2) Date: Tue, 19 Feb 2008 07:23:35 -0500 Message-ID: <713043CE8B8E1348AF3C546DBE02C1B4131B814A@zcarhxm2.corp.nortel.com> In-Reply-To: <713043CE8B8E1348AF3C546DBE02C1B4131B7DBA@zcarhxm2.corp.nortel.com> X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: Thread-Topic: Notification Pre-release of -12 (take 2) Thread-Index: AchyXIruv84oUoANSRCkUvLCfex6JwAlZLfA References: <713043CE8B8E1348AF3C546DBE02C1B4131B7DBA@zcarhxm2.corp.nortel.com> From: "Sharon Chisholm" To: "Netconf" Sender: owner-netconf@ops.ietf.org Precedence: bulk Hi It would seem that gen-art is now happy. If there are no further comments on how we resolved the IESG last call comments, I will go ahead and submit this update later today. Thanks, Sharon=20 -----Original Message----- From: owner-netconf@ops.ietf.org [mailto:owner-netconf@ops.ietf.org] On Behalf Of Chisholm, Sharon (CAR:ZZ00) Sent: Monday, February 18, 2008 1:32 PM To: Netconf Subject: Notification Pre-release of -12 (take 2) Hi Based on some feedback from Bert, I have modified the IANA considerations section a bit. See attached. Sharon Chisholm Nortel Ottawa, Ontario Canada -- to unsubscribe send a message to netconf-request@ops.ietf.org with the word 'unsubscribe' in a single line as the message text body. archive: From owner-netconf@ops.ietf.org Wed Feb 20 06:53:45 2008 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ietfarch-netconf-archive@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ietfarch-netconf-archive@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id C9E853A6A84 for ; Wed, 20 Feb 2008 06:53:45 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: 0.758 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=0.758 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=-1.405, BAYES_50=0.001, FH_RELAY_NODNS=1.451, HELO_MISMATCH_NET=0.611, RDNS_NONE=0.1] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id jGZrikw6+JAW for ; Wed, 20 Feb 2008 06:53:45 -0800 (PST) Received: from psg.com (psg.com [IPv6:2001:418:1::62]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id DBFAD28C155 for ; Wed, 20 Feb 2008 06:53:44 -0800 (PST) Received: from majordom by psg.com with local (Exim 4.68 (FreeBSD)) (envelope-from ) id 1JRqBb-0004aq-Vt for netconf-data@psg.com; Wed, 20 Feb 2008 14:44:39 +0000 Received: from [62.250.3.110] (helo=relay.versatel.net) by psg.com with smtp (Exim 4.68 (FreeBSD)) (envelope-from ) id 1JRqBV-0004Ze-L9 for netconf@ops.ietf.org; Wed, 20 Feb 2008 14:44:35 +0000 Received: (qmail 68123 invoked from network); 20 Feb 2008 14:44:30 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO bwMedion) (87.215.199.34) by relay.versatel.net with SMTP; 20 Feb 2008 14:44:30 -0000 From: "Bert Wijnen - IETF" To: "Sharon Chisholm" , "Hector Trevino \(htrevino\)" , "Andy Bierman" Cc: "Netconf \(E-mail\)" Subject: RE: bug in notification-11 XSD Date: Wed, 20 Feb 2008 15:44:30 +0100 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.6604 (9.0.2911.0) Importance: Normal In-Reply-To: <47B49392.10601@andybierman.com> X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.3198 Sender: owner-netconf@ops.ietf.org Precedence: bulk Sharon (or Hector), I have not seen you react to this at all. What is the story here? Andy, is this about these 2 lines on pages 17/18 xmlns:manageEvent="urn:ietf:params:xml:ns:netmod:notification" targetNamespace="urn:ietf:params:xml:ns:netmod:notification" and the corresponding line in IANA considerations: URI: urn:ietf:params:xml:ns:netmod:notification I'd like to understand from the authors what their reason is to not be consistent as Andy suggests. If that gets changed, then I suspect that the otehr occurences in the rpc messages need to be changed too, no? Bert Wijnen > -----Oorspronkelijk bericht----- > Van: owner-netconf@ops.ietf.org > [mailto:owner-netconf@ops.ietf.org]Namens Andy Bierman > Verzonden: donderdag 14 februari 2008 20:17 > Aan: Netconf (E-mail); Bert Wijnen - IETF; Sharon Chisholm > Onderwerp: Re: bug in notification-11 XSD > > > Andy Bierman wrote: > > Hi, > > > > I just noticed that the targetNamespace is wrong in > > the first XSD in this draft. It is missing the ':1.0' suffix > > that is present in the 'ncEvent' URI. > > > > (Not that this reaffirms my belief that XSD is a mistake factory ;-) > > > > oops -- I was looking at ncEvent but I should have been looking > at manageEvent. The XSD is okay but I think the WG should pick > a URI style (with or without version numbers) and stick with it. > > > > Andy > > Andy > > -- > to unsubscribe send a message to netconf-request@ops.ietf.org with > the word 'unsubscribe' in a single line as the message text body. > archive: > -- to unsubscribe send a message to netconf-request@ops.ietf.org with the word 'unsubscribe' in a single line as the message text body. archive: From owner-netconf@ops.ietf.org Wed Feb 20 07:02:52 2008 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ietfarch-netconf-archive@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ietfarch-netconf-archive@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1B94528C16F for ; Wed, 20 Feb 2008 07:02:52 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -4.535 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-4.535 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=-0.040, BAYES_00=-2.599, FH_RELAY_NODNS=1.451, HELO_MISMATCH_COM=0.553, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-4, RDNS_NONE=0.1] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 8lPBpIjlCyxT for ; Wed, 20 Feb 2008 07:02:51 -0800 (PST) Received: from psg.com (psg.com [IPv6:2001:418:1::62]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id BEC2028C83B for ; Wed, 20 Feb 2008 07:02:33 -0800 (PST) Received: from majordom by psg.com with local (Exim 4.68 (FreeBSD)) (envelope-from ) id 1JRqIn-0005n8-4R for netconf-data@psg.com; Wed, 20 Feb 2008 14:52:05 +0000 Received: from [47.129.242.57] (helo=zcars04f.nortel.com) by psg.com with esmtps (TLSv1:DES-CBC3-SHA:168) (Exim 4.68 (FreeBSD)) (envelope-from ) id 1JRqIc-0005lh-Qf for netconf@ops.ietf.org; Wed, 20 Feb 2008 14:52:00 +0000 Received: from zcarhxm2.corp.nortel.com (zcarhxm2.corp.nortel.com [47.129.230.99]) by zcars04f.nortel.com (Switch-2.2.6/Switch-2.2.0) with ESMTP id m1KEpoB23950; Wed, 20 Feb 2008 14:51:50 GMT X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft Exchange V6.5 Content-class: urn:content-classes:message MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Subject: RE: bug in notification-11 XSD Date: Wed, 20 Feb 2008 09:50:33 -0500 Message-ID: <713043CE8B8E1348AF3C546DBE02C1B413282CE9@zcarhxm2.corp.nortel.com> In-Reply-To: X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: Thread-Topic: bug in notification-11 XSD Thread-Index: Achzzx/6Tv0Mwa/6S7Owc8V+KatJTAAAKTBA References: <47B49392.10601@andybierman.com> From: "Sharon Chisholm" To: "Bert Wijnen - IETF" , "Hector Trevino (htrevino)" , "Andy Bierman" Cc: "Netconf (E-mail)" Sender: owner-netconf@ops.ietf.org Precedence: bulk Hi I believe this was discussed previously. Version numbers are included for protocol definitions, not for the content definitions. Sharon=20 -----Original Message----- From: Bert Wijnen - IETF [mailto:bertietf@bwijnen.net]=20 Sent: Wednesday, February 20, 2008 9:45 AM To: Chisholm, Sharon (CAR:ZZ00); Hector Trevino (htrevino); Andy Bierman Cc: Netconf (E-mail) Subject: RE: bug in notification-11 XSD Sharon (or Hector), I have not seen you react to this at all. What is the story here?=20 Andy, is this about these 2 lines on pages 17/18 xmlns:manageEvent=3D"urn:ietf:params:xml:ns:netmod:notification" targetNamespace=3D"urn:ietf:params:xml:ns:netmod:notification" and the corresponding line in IANA considerations: URI: urn:ietf:params:xml:ns:netmod:notification I'd like to understand from the authors what their reason is to not be consistent as Andy suggests. If that gets changed, then I suspect that the otehr occurences in the rpc messages need to be changed too, no? Bert Wijnen=20 > -----Oorspronkelijk bericht----- > Van: owner-netconf@ops.ietf.org > [mailto:owner-netconf@ops.ietf.org]Namens Andy Bierman > Verzonden: donderdag 14 februari 2008 20:17 > Aan: Netconf (E-mail); Bert Wijnen - IETF; Sharon Chisholm > Onderwerp: Re: bug in notification-11 XSD >=20 >=20 > Andy Bierman wrote: > > Hi, > >=20 > > I just noticed that the targetNamespace is wrong in the first XSD in > > this draft. It is missing the ':1.0' suffix that is present in the=20 > > 'ncEvent' URI. > >=20 > > (Not that this reaffirms my belief that XSD is a mistake factory ;-) > >=20 >=20 > oops -- I was looking at ncEvent but I should have been looking at=20 > manageEvent. The XSD is okay but I think the WG should pick a URI=20 > style (with or without version numbers) and stick with it. >=20 >=20 > > Andy >=20 > Andy >=20 > -- > to unsubscribe send a message to netconf-request@ops.ietf.org with the > word 'unsubscribe' in a single line as the message text body. > archive: >=20 -- to unsubscribe send a message to netconf-request@ops.ietf.org with the word 'unsubscribe' in a single line as the message text body. archive: From owner-netconf@ops.ietf.org Wed Feb 20 07:16:13 2008 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ietfarch-netconf-archive@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ietfarch-netconf-archive@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0411028C1E5 for ; Wed, 20 Feb 2008 07:16:13 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -3.651 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-3.651 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.844, BAYES_00=-2.599, FH_RELAY_NODNS=1.451, HELO_MISMATCH_COM=0.553, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-4, RDNS_NONE=0.1] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id t9rYFkgaZR9k for ; Wed, 20 Feb 2008 07:16:11 -0800 (PST) Received: from psg.com (psg.com [IPv6:2001:418:1::62]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id B199428C1AB for ; Wed, 20 Feb 2008 07:16:11 -0800 (PST) Received: from majordom by psg.com with local (Exim 4.68 (FreeBSD)) (envelope-from ) id 1JRqZ3-000AP4-MT for netconf-data@psg.com; Wed, 20 Feb 2008 15:08:53 +0000 Received: from [64.18.2.171] (helo=exprod7og109.obsmtp.com) by psg.com with smtps (TLSv1:AES256-SHA:256) (Exim 4.68 (FreeBSD)) (envelope-from ) id 1JRqYy-000A9Q-98 for netconf@ops.ietf.org; Wed, 20 Feb 2008 15:08:52 +0000 Received: from source ([66.129.224.36]) by exprod7ob109.postini.com ([64.18.6.12]) with SMTP; Wed, 20 Feb 2008 07:05:14 PST Received: from magenta.juniper.net ([172.17.27.123]) by emailsmtp55.jnpr.net with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.1830); Wed, 20 Feb 2008 07:07:57 -0800 Received: from idle.juniper.net (idleski.juniper.net [172.25.4.26]) by magenta.juniper.net (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id m1KF7Mq73094; Wed, 20 Feb 2008 07:07:22 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from phil@idle.juniper.net) Received: from idle.juniper.net (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by idle.juniper.net (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id m1KF6m7R031102; Wed, 20 Feb 2008 15:06:53 GMT (envelope-from phil@idle.juniper.net) Message-Id: <200802201506.m1KF6m7R031102@idle.juniper.net> To: "Sharon Chisholm" cc: "Bert Wijnen - IETF" , "Hector Trevino (htrevino)" , "Andy Bierman" , "Netconf (E-mail)" Subject: Re: bug in notification-11 XSD In-reply-to: <713043CE8B8E1348AF3C546DBE02C1B413282CE9@zcarhxm2.corp.nortel.com> Date: Wed, 20 Feb 2008 10:06:48 -0500 From: Phil Shafer X-OriginalArrivalTime: 20 Feb 2008 15:07:57.0154 (UTC) FILETIME=[60084420:01C873D2] Sender: owner-netconf@ops.ietf.org Precedence: bulk "Sharon Chisholm" writes: >I believe this was discussed previously. Version numbers are included >for protocol definitions, not for the content definitions. Can you repeat the theory behind this? Why are they good for one and not good for the other? Does content never change? Thanks, Phil -- to unsubscribe send a message to netconf-request@ops.ietf.org with the word 'unsubscribe' in a single line as the message text body. archive: From owner-netconf@ops.ietf.org Wed Feb 20 07:27:51 2008 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ietfarch-netconf-archive@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ietfarch-netconf-archive@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0E09028C220 for ; Wed, 20 Feb 2008 07:27:51 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.368 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.368 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=-0.873, BAYES_00=-2.599, FH_RELAY_NODNS=1.451, HELO_MISMATCH_COM=0.553, RDNS_NONE=0.1] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id HExcdtUOtczn for ; Wed, 20 Feb 2008 07:27:50 -0800 (PST) Received: from psg.com (psg.com [IPv6:2001:418:1::62]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3336D28C1E3 for ; Wed, 20 Feb 2008 07:27:50 -0800 (PST) Received: from majordom by psg.com with local (Exim 4.68 (FreeBSD)) (envelope-from ) id 1JRqkK-000Cae-Us for netconf-data@psg.com; Wed, 20 Feb 2008 15:20:32 +0000 Received: from [68.142.229.97] (helo=smtp108.sbc.mail.re2.yahoo.com) by psg.com with smtp (Exim 4.68 (FreeBSD)) (envelope-from ) id 1JRqkH-000CZn-KH for netconf@ops.ietf.org; Wed, 20 Feb 2008 15:20:31 +0000 Received: (qmail 28202 invoked from network); 20 Feb 2008 15:20:28 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO ?192.168.0.10?) (andybierman@att.net@67.127.174.48 with plain) by smtp108.sbc.mail.re2.yahoo.com with SMTP; 20 Feb 2008 15:20:28 -0000 X-Yahoo-Newman-Property: ymail-3 Message-ID: <47BC450B.5010906@andybierman.com> Date: Wed, 20 Feb 2008 07:19:39 -0800 From: Andy Bierman User-Agent: Thunderbird 2.0.0.9 (Windows/20071031) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Phil Shafer CC: Sharon Chisholm , Bert Wijnen - IETF , "Hector Trevino (htrevino)" , "Netconf (E-mail)" Subject: Re: bug in notification-11 XSD References: <200802201506.m1KF6m7R031102@idle.juniper.net> In-Reply-To: <200802201506.m1KF6m7R031102@idle.juniper.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-netconf@ops.ietf.org Precedence: bulk Phil Shafer wrote: > "Sharon Chisholm" writes: >> I believe this was discussed previously. Version numbers are included >> for protocol definitions, not for the content definitions. > > Can you repeat the theory behind this? Why are they good > for one and not good for the other? Does content never > change? > The theory is that change control rules will be in place for content, so backward compatibility will be provided. I agree with you that backward compatibility applies just as much to protocol features as content. > Thanks, > Phil > > > Andy -- to unsubscribe send a message to netconf-request@ops.ietf.org with the word 'unsubscribe' in a single line as the message text body. archive: From owner-netconf@ops.ietf.org Wed Feb 20 07:34:11 2008 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ietfarch-netconf-archive@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ietfarch-netconf-archive@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 716A63A6A97 for ; Wed, 20 Feb 2008 07:34:11 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: 0.93 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=0.93 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=-1.533, BAYES_00=-2.599, FH_RELAY_NODNS=1.451, HELO_MISMATCH_NET=0.611, J_CHICKENPOX_73=0.6, MANGLED_STOP=2.3, RDNS_NONE=0.1] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 5tZFZ9y+TTMj for ; Wed, 20 Feb 2008 07:34:10 -0800 (PST) Received: from psg.com (psg.com [IPv6:2001:418:1::62]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 668633A6A90 for ; Wed, 20 Feb 2008 07:34:10 -0800 (PST) Received: from majordom by psg.com with local (Exim 4.68 (FreeBSD)) (envelope-from ) id 1JRqqw-000DZg-Vs for netconf-data@psg.com; Wed, 20 Feb 2008 15:27:22 +0000 Received: from [62.250.3.110] (helo=relay.versatel.net) by psg.com with smtp (Exim 4.68 (FreeBSD)) (envelope-from ) id 1JRqqp-000DYk-Pb for netconf@ops.ietf.org; Wed, 20 Feb 2008 15:27:17 +0000 Received: (qmail 9960 invoked from network); 20 Feb 2008 15:27:14 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO bwMedion) (87.215.199.34) by relay.versatel.net with SMTP; 20 Feb 2008 15:27:14 -0000 From: "Bert Wijnen - IETF" To: "Sharon Chisholm" , "Hector Trevino \(htrevino\)" Cc: "Netconf" Subject: Notification Pre-release of -12 (take 2) Date: Wed, 20 Feb 2008 16:27:14 +0100 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.6604 (9.0.2911.0) Importance: Normal In-Reply-To: X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.3198 Sender: owner-netconf@ops.ietf.org Precedence: bulk Can you also explain why in section 4 I cannot find the string notification.xsd ??? Why is it that such needs to be learned by looking at the IANA considerations section? I admit that for the netconf.xsd (appendix B of RFC4741) the situation is the same (or maybe even worse, because the string netconf.xsd does not occur in RFC4741 at all; only schema:netconf exists, but only in the IANA considerations section, nowhere else.) I find it a bit strange if this is the way to find out where an an XSD of a specific name is defined. I also note that I do not find the string schema:notification in the ntotications draft.... I guess I am just totally lost/confused ... sure it shows how bad my XML/XSD skills are. Sorry for that. Bert Wijnen > -----Oorspronkelijk bericht----- > Van: Bert Wijnen - IETF [mailto:bertietf@bwijnen.net] > Verzonden: woensdag 20 februari 2008 15:46 > Aan: Sharon Chisholm; Hector Trevino (htrevino) > CC: Mehmet Ersue (NSN - DE/Muenich); Dan Romascanu > Onderwerp: RE: Notification Pre-release of -12 (take 2) > > > OK, here are my nits: > > - sect 2.2.1 page 10 > > eventTime > > The time the event was generated by the event source.This > parameter is of type dateTime. > > Put a space (or maybe 2) in front of "This" > > - Section 8, page 37 > > -- Editor note to IANA/RFC-Editor: we request that you make these > assignments, in which case it is top be documented as below > > s/top be/to be/ > > - Section 8 > > I do not understand why we would not use the same format for > capabilities as in sect 10.3 of RFC4741. That makes it so much > more consistent. So instead of: > > URI: urn:ietf:params:netconf:capability:notification:1.0 > > URI: urn:ietf:params:netconf:capability:interleave:1.0 > > I would do: > > +--------------------+----------------------------------------------+ > | Index | Capability Identifier | > +--------------------+----------------------------------------------+ > | :notification | urn:ietf:params:netconf:capability: | > | | notification:1.0 | > | | | > | :interleave | urn:ietf:params:netconf:capability: | > | | interleave:1.0 | > +--------------------+----------------------------------------------+ > > It seems like you more or less completely ignored my comment that I > posted to the netconf list on 24th of January. I have attached that > posting to this email. > Pls check and review and let me know what you think about that. > > Pls also see my other email w.r.t. Andy Biermans comment "BUG in > notificatio-11 XSD" > I am doing more review > > Bert Wijnen > > > -----Oorspronkelijk bericht----- > > Van: Sharon Chisholm [mailto:schishol@nortel.com] > > Verzonden: dinsdag 19 februari 2008 22:20 > > Aan: Bert Wijnen - IETF > > Onderwerp: RE: Notification Pre-release of -12 (take 2) > > > > > > Hi > > > > Attached. I generally don't make this one available to the list since it > > might get confused with the real -12. > > > > Sharon > > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: Bert Wijnen - IETF [mailto:bertietf@bwijnen.net] > > Sent: Tuesday, February 19, 2008 4:16 PM > > To: Chisholm, Sharon (CAR:ZZ00) > > Subject: RE: Notification Pre-release of -12 (take 2) > > > > Could you send me also the plain text (withoput the change-vars or > > changes. > > Just the draft as you would submit it? > > > > Bert Wijnen > > > > > -----Oorspronkelijk bericht----- > > > Van: owner-netconf@ops.ietf.org > > > [mailto:owner-netconf@ops.ietf.org]Namens Sharon Chisholm > > > Verzonden: maandag 18 februari 2008 19:32 > > > Aan: Netconf > > > Onderwerp: Notification Pre-release of -12 (take 2) > > > > > > > > > Hi > > > > > > Based on some feedback from Bert, I have modified the IANA > > > considerations section a bit. See attached. > > > > > > Sharon Chisholm > > > Nortel > > > Ottawa, Ontario > > > Canada > > > > > > -- to unsubscribe send a message to netconf-request@ops.ietf.org with the word 'unsubscribe' in a single line as the message text body. archive: From owner-netconf@ops.ietf.org Wed Feb 20 08:22:48 2008 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ietfarch-netconf-archive@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ietfarch-netconf-archive@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 016F53A69C7 for ; Wed, 20 Feb 2008 08:22:48 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -3.488 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-3.488 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=1.007, BAYES_00=-2.599, FH_RELAY_NODNS=1.451, HELO_MISMATCH_COM=0.553, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-4, RDNS_NONE=0.1] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 7eur1LuvJA0c for ; Wed, 20 Feb 2008 08:22:47 -0800 (PST) Received: from psg.com (psg.com [IPv6:2001:418:1::62]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id E148F28C1BE for ; Wed, 20 Feb 2008 08:22:46 -0800 (PST) Received: from majordom by psg.com with local (Exim 4.68 (FreeBSD)) (envelope-from ) id 1JRrTI-000JVo-3r for netconf-data@psg.com; Wed, 20 Feb 2008 16:07:00 +0000 Received: from [171.71.176.117] (helo=sj-iport-6.cisco.com) by psg.com with esmtp (Exim 4.68 (FreeBSD)) (envelope-from ) id 1JRrTE-000JVM-Lz for netconf@ops.ietf.org; Wed, 20 Feb 2008 16:06:58 +0000 Received: from sj-dkim-3.cisco.com ([171.71.179.195]) by sj-iport-6.cisco.com with ESMTP; 20 Feb 2008 08:06:56 -0800 Received: from sj-core-4.cisco.com (sj-core-4.cisco.com [171.68.223.138]) by sj-dkim-3.cisco.com (8.12.11/8.12.11) with ESMTP id m1KG6u4c013507; Wed, 20 Feb 2008 08:06:56 -0800 Received: from xbh-sjc-221.amer.cisco.com (xbh-sjc-221.cisco.com [128.107.191.63]) by sj-core-4.cisco.com (8.12.10/8.12.6) with ESMTP id m1KG6DRB005082; Wed, 20 Feb 2008 16:06:55 GMT Received: from xmb-sjc-223.amer.cisco.com ([128.107.191.124]) by xbh-sjc-221.amer.cisco.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.1830); Wed, 20 Feb 2008 08:06:50 -0800 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft Exchange V6.5 Content-class: urn:content-classes:message MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Subject: RE: bug in notification-11 XSD Date: Wed, 20 Feb 2008 08:06:45 -0800 Message-ID: <6E21698722408147BEA594E073E2B0AB056A8B14@xmb-sjc-223.amer.cisco.com> In-Reply-To: <713043CE8B8E1348AF3C546DBE02C1B413282CE9@zcarhxm2.corp.nortel.com> X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: Thread-Topic: bug in notification-11 XSD Thread-Index: Achzzx/6Tv0Mwa/6S7Owc8V+KatJTAAAKTBAAAKATqA= References: <47B49392.10601@andybierman.com> <713043CE8B8E1348AF3C546DBE02C1B413282CE9@zcarhxm2.corp.nortel.com> From: "Hector Trevino (htrevino)" To: "Sharon Chisholm" , "Bert Wijnen - IETF" , "Andy Bierman" Cc: "Netconf (E-mail)" X-OriginalArrivalTime: 20 Feb 2008 16:06:50.0884 (UTC) FILETIME=[9A4CAC40:01C873DA] DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; q=dns/txt; l=2597; t=1203523616; x=1204387616; c=relaxed/simple; s=sjdkim3002; h=Content-Type:From:Subject:Content-Transfer-Encoding:MIME-Version; d=cisco.com; i=htrevino@cisco.com; z=From:=20=22Hector=20Trevino=20(htrevino)=22=20 |Subject:=20RE=3A=20bug=20in=20notification-11=20XSD |Sender:=20; bh=PeZDLPryzjU+Xym33XEbYQy+HHdtXTbnA5A2lKycSn0=; b=YZywGNNaIESjzGmlwHlaj8NXYg+98JRFHHckRhDFVDefU2WSkpp9qE9q97 xhxowLD0DQzusVbbDpYTBah17nXvq1BBAepyaFSA0nZLq+G5MyL+g4Om1+oD bMQAhI3YCO; Authentication-Results: sj-dkim-3; header.From=htrevino@cisco.com; dkim=pass ( sig from cisco.com/sjdkim3002 verified; ); Sender: owner-netconf@ops.ietf.org Precedence: bulk Hi, I don't recall why the version numbers are not in but I went back to check and they used to be present in the earlier releases of the doc. I agree they should be included if nothing else for style purposes.=20 Hector =20 -----Original Message----- From: Sharon Chisholm [mailto:schishol@nortel.com]=20 Sent: Wednesday, February 20, 2008 7:51 AM To: Bert Wijnen - IETF; Hector Trevino (htrevino); Andy Bierman Cc: Netconf (E-mail) Subject: RE: bug in notification-11 XSD Hi I believe this was discussed previously. Version numbers are included for protocol definitions, not for the content definitions. Sharon=20 -----Original Message----- From: Bert Wijnen - IETF [mailto:bertietf@bwijnen.net] Sent: Wednesday, February 20, 2008 9:45 AM To: Chisholm, Sharon (CAR:ZZ00); Hector Trevino (htrevino); Andy Bierman Cc: Netconf (E-mail) Subject: RE: bug in notification-11 XSD Sharon (or Hector), I have not seen you react to this at all. What is the story here?=20 Andy, is this about these 2 lines on pages 17/18 xmlns:manageEvent=3D"urn:ietf:params:xml:ns:netmod:notification" targetNamespace=3D"urn:ietf:params:xml:ns:netmod:notification" and the corresponding line in IANA considerations: URI: urn:ietf:params:xml:ns:netmod:notification I'd like to understand from the authors what their reason is to not be consistent as Andy suggests. If that gets changed, then I suspect that the otehr occurences in the rpc messages need to be changed too, no? Bert Wijnen=20 > -----Oorspronkelijk bericht----- > Van: owner-netconf@ops.ietf.org > [mailto:owner-netconf@ops.ietf.org]Namens Andy Bierman > Verzonden: donderdag 14 februari 2008 20:17 > Aan: Netconf (E-mail); Bert Wijnen - IETF; Sharon Chisholm > Onderwerp: Re: bug in notification-11 XSD >=20 >=20 > Andy Bierman wrote: > > Hi, > >=20 > > I just noticed that the targetNamespace is wrong in the first XSD in > > this draft. It is missing the ':1.0' suffix that is present in the=20 > > 'ncEvent' URI. > >=20 > > (Not that this reaffirms my belief that XSD is a mistake factory ;-) > >=20 >=20 > oops -- I was looking at ncEvent but I should have been looking at=20 > manageEvent. The XSD is okay but I think the WG should pick a URI=20 > style (with or without version numbers) and stick with it. >=20 >=20 > > Andy >=20 > Andy >=20 > -- > to unsubscribe send a message to netconf-request@ops.ietf.org with the > word 'unsubscribe' in a single line as the message text body. > archive: >=20 -- to unsubscribe send a message to netconf-request@ops.ietf.org with the word 'unsubscribe' in a single line as the message text body. archive: From owner-netconf@ops.ietf.org Wed Feb 20 08:53:06 2008 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ietfarch-netconf-archive@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ietfarch-netconf-archive@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id C5FC528C21B for ; Wed, 20 Feb 2008 08:53:06 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -0.347 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-0.347 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=-0.852, BAYES_00=-2.599, FH_RELAY_NODNS=1.451, HELO_MISMATCH_COM=0.553, HTML_MESSAGE=1, RDNS_NONE=0.1] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 9+z38DIMInSv for ; Wed, 20 Feb 2008 08:53:05 -0800 (PST) Received: from psg.com (psg.com [IPv6:2001:418:1::62]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8F5703A6A4F for ; Wed, 20 Feb 2008 08:53:05 -0800 (PST) Received: from majordom by psg.com with local (Exim 4.68 (FreeBSD)) (envelope-from ) id 1JRs5J-000OKL-Pn for netconf-data@psg.com; Wed, 20 Feb 2008 16:46:17 +0000 Received: from [217.146.182.12] (helo=web27807.mail.ukl.yahoo.com) by psg.com with smtp (Exim 4.68 (FreeBSD)) (envelope-from ) id 1JRs5F-000OJi-DH for netconf@ops.ietf.org; Wed, 20 Feb 2008 16:46:15 +0000 Received: (qmail 67115 invoked by uid 60001); 20 Feb 2008 16:46:11 -0000 DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=s1024; d=yahoo.de; h=X-YMail-OSG:Received:X-Mailer:Date:From:Subject:To:Cc:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Message-ID; b=DrmW82qPum7+Dyu5pIu5eNO5Z0BydVlCeNUF/6nJQEseaqwB6gLe/BpDNukecxDra2iufzLRcgDwz7Bm+bwRbq+IniEMuocapO7GgmWZFbAZf9VA9H7DzDmPxFu4P9oha3tqGprKaqKVGCBWhtEjwoZ7KF193JNbHVQxadoLCvU=; X-YMail-OSG: san3LFEVM1m_VOTuN6QfjrBRSourFKVjMUAlHCQjWi_oVu3dnYFDRzEu.vTKWA0VtwW6wlLVEcYjLvlyO5TG9nJhFGmxF7jF.OMpCAjYApVxMpKMJxXeO7Ut3d8- Received: from [217.115.75.232] by web27807.mail.ukl.yahoo.com via HTTP; Wed, 20 Feb 2008 16:46:11 GMT X-Mailer: YahooMailRC/818.31 YahooMailWebService/0.7.162 Date: Wed, 20 Feb 2008 16:46:11 +0000 (GMT) From: Mehmet Ersue Subject: Draft Agenda for the IETF #71 NETCONF Session To: NETCONF Cc: Bert Wijnen , Dan Romascanu MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="0-787003841-1203525971=:65662" Message-ID: <408163.65662.qm@web27807.mail.ukl.yahoo.com> Sender: owner-netconf@ops.ietf.org Precedence: bulk --0-787003841-1203525971=:65662 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable =0ADear NETCONF WG,=0A=0Abelow is the draft agenda for the NETCONF WG sessi= on at the IETF =0A#71. Please send us your comments concerning the agenda.= =0A=0AOur main focus in the session will be on open issue discussion.=0AHow= ever, until now there was not much discussion in the list except =0Athe TLS= draft.=0A=0AWe know that the draft authors have been busy with DML-related= =0Adiscussion and other drafts but please take it seriously and force =0At= he discussion on the documents in the mailllist to filter the issues=0Aand = to structure the discussion in the session slot.=0A=0APlease let us know wh= ether you have a concrete topic for the open =0Amic session.=0AWe need to o= rganize the scribes and minute takers before the meeting. =0AVolunteers wil= l be appreciated.=0A=0APS: In case you couldn't find the entry for NETCONF = in the draft =0Aagenda: this is fixed and the Netconf session is planned fo= r Monday =0A1740-1950.=0A=0ABert & Mehmet=0A=0A____________________________= _________________=0A=0ANETCONF WG=0AIETF 71, Philadelphia, PA, USA=0A=0AMON= DAY, March 10, 2008 1740-1950=0A=0A Scribes (needs to be organized before = the session),=0A Agenda bashing (2 minutes)=0A=0A Use of mailing lists,= =0A WG status review (10 minutes)=0A=0A Current charter items:=0A=0A = 1. NETCONF over TLS (20 minutes)=0A=0A draft-ietf-netconf-tls-01.= txt=0A=0A 2. Fine-grained locking (20 minutes)=0A=0A draft-iet= f-netconf-partial-lock-00.txt=0A=0A 3. Netconf monitoring (20 minutes)= =0A=0A draft-ietf-netconf-monitoring-00.txt=0A=0A 4. Schema ad= vertisement (20 minutes)=0A=0A (new draft is a prerequisite for the= time-slot)=0A draft-scott-netconf-schema-query-00.txt (Expired)=0A= draft-okita-netconf-advertisement-00.txt =0A =0A Discussion= on ongoing implementations (10 minutes)=0A =0A Who is implem= enting what?=0A Should we plan an interop-event for testing of=0A = RFC 4141-4144 to get them to DS? =0A=0A AOB=0A =0A Open mike = =0A Any hot topics to discuss?=0A=0A=0A=0A=0A=0A=0A=0A=0A=0A=0A=0A=0A= Lesen Sie Ihre E-Mails jetzt einfach von unterwegs.=0Awww.yahoo.de/go --0-787003841-1203525971=:65662 Content-Type: text/html; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

Dear NETCONF WG,

below is the draft agenda for the NETCO= NF WG session at the IETF
#71. Please send us your comments concerning = the agenda.

Our main focus in the session will be on open issue disc= ussion.
However, until now there was not much discussion in the list exc= ept
the TLS draft.

We know that the draft authors have been busy= with DML-related
discussion and other drafts but please take it seriou= sly and force
the discussion on the documents in the mailllist to filte= r the issues
and to structure the discussion in the session slot.
Please let us know whether you have a concrete topic for the open
mic = session.
We need to organize the scribes and minute takers before the me= eting.
Volunteers will be appreciated.

PS: In case you couldn't find the entry for NETCONF in the draft
agenda: this is fixed= and the Netconf session is planned for Monday
1740-1950.

Bert &= amp; Mehmet

_____________________________________________

NET= CONF WG
IETF 71, Philadelphia, PA, USA

MONDAY, March 10, 2008 174= 0-1950

  Scribes (needs to be organized before the session),  Agenda bashing (2 minutes)

  Use of mailing lists,
&= nbsp; WG status review (10 minutes)

  Current charter items:
      1. NETCONF over TLS (20 minutes)
          draft-ietf-netconf-= tls-01.txt

      2. Fine-grained locking (2= 0 minutes)

         draft-ie= tf-netconf-partial-lock-00.txt

      3. Net= conf monitoring (20 minutes)

         draft-iet= f-netconf-monitoring-00.txt

      4. Schema= advertisement (20 minutes)

      &nbs= p;  (new draft is a prerequisite for the time-slot)
  &nb= sp;      draft-scott-netconf-schema-query-00.txt (= Expired)
         draft-okita-ne= tconf-advertisement-00.txt
      
&nb= sp; Discussion on ongoing implementations (10 minutes)
   = ;    
        Wh= o is implementing what?
        Shoul= d we plan an interop-event for testing of
     =    RFC 4141-4144 to get them to DS?

  AOB
 &= nbsp;   
  Open mike
       Any hot topics to discuss?








=0A
Lesen Si= e Ihre E-Mails jetzt einfach von unterwegs mit =0A =0AYahoo! Go. =0A --0-787003841-1203525971=:65662-- -- to unsubscribe send a message to netconf-request@ops.ietf.org with the word 'unsubscribe' in a single line as the message text body. archive: From owner-netconf@ops.ietf.org Wed Feb 20 08:54:17 2008 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ietfarch-netconf-archive@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ietfarch-netconf-archive@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8D6AD28C21B for ; Wed, 20 Feb 2008 08:54:17 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: 0.448 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=0.448 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=-1.546, BAYES_05=-1.11, FH_RELAY_NODNS=1.451, HELO_MISMATCH_COM=0.553, HTML_MESSAGE=1, RDNS_NONE=0.1] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id FUblImvX-stV for ; Wed, 20 Feb 2008 08:54:16 -0800 (PST) Received: from psg.com (psg.com [IPv6:2001:418:1::62]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id EA47828C1ED for ; Wed, 20 Feb 2008 08:54:15 -0800 (PST) Received: from majordom by psg.com with local (Exim 4.68 (FreeBSD)) (envelope-from ) id 1JRs7f-000Og7-87 for netconf-data@psg.com; Wed, 20 Feb 2008 16:48:43 +0000 Received: from [217.146.182.17] (helo=web27812.mail.ukl.yahoo.com) by psg.com with smtp (Exim 4.68 (FreeBSD)) (envelope-from ) id 1JRs7J-000Od3-N3 for netconf@ops.ietf.org; Wed, 20 Feb 2008 16:48:24 +0000 Received: (qmail 5908 invoked by uid 60001); 20 Feb 2008 16:48:20 -0000 DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=s1024; d=yahoo.de; h=X-YMail-OSG:Received:X-Mailer:Date:From:Subject:To:Cc:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Message-ID; b=5mUhqv+rHFXJZ/pZY+MeQfMd6UPokDd+KCOCLHTin0ydjblIqWwpKfiZMG/mALzBdEuGtCNCt3yakDW7fQJLosG3T8pTx69ZlBxAXjPWBTu1XYCUY0t/t5ppCWFydykNu4x8xBznLUzhOJ0MIA7JXkRRbsQoA+EwkqRk3ckr2UU=; X-YMail-OSG: IIscMsIVM1mW73cM2YvhxZoS3pH9vlpGu9KmqaXFMvGYyO_bcSBhXneDFAw9YN43692nsLgtgweQ6OPUzkY9j5k6o2EckvcomdqHgFsY47uDEIcZZSXAlvH_V5M- Received: from [217.115.75.232] by web27812.mail.ukl.yahoo.com via HTTP; Wed, 20 Feb 2008 16:48:19 GMT X-Mailer: YahooMailRC/818.31 YahooMailWebService/0.7.162 Date: Wed, 20 Feb 2008 16:48:19 +0000 (GMT) From: Mehmet Ersue Subject: Status of Schema advertisement drafts WAS: FW: Status of netconf-schema-query To: markscot@nortel.com, hideki.okita.pf@hitachi.com Cc: Sharon , Bert Wijnen , NETCONF MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="0-516760339-1203526099=:5392" Message-ID: <963005.5392.qm@web27812.mail.ukl.yahoo.com> Sender: owner-netconf@ops.ietf.org Precedence: bulk --0-516760339-1203526099=:5392 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable =0ADear Mark, Hideki, Sharon, =0A=0Awe sent you a request on the issue in t= he subject mid of January (see =0Athe mail below) and asked whether you wan= t to: =0A=0Aa) submit one WG netconf-monitoring draft that incorporates the= best =0A ideas from the 3 of your drafts including the schema advertise= ment, or =0Ab) prepare a separate schema-advertisment related document. =0A= =0ADid you already have a discussion on how you want to proceed with =0At= he Schema advertisement drafts? =0A=0AWe have provisionally included a time= slot for this in the draft agenda =0A(see parallel mail). =0ABut the prere= quisite for the discussion on the topic in the WG session is =0Ayour agreem= ent on how you want to proceed and the submission of a =0Anew draft before = the IETF #71 meeting (we are going to be gracious if =0Ait's a joint -00 dr= aft). One possibility we discussed is also to merge with =0Athe monitoring = draft. =0A=0ASo please get together and force the agreement for further pro= ceeding. =0AWe would like to encourage you to submit a joint draft before t= he IETF #71 =0Ameeting to be able to discuss it in the session and to get i= t one step further. =0AIf something is not clear or not easy to decide plea= se involve the WG =0Aco-chairs or discuss on the WG maillist. =0A=0ARegards= , =0ABert & Mehmet =0A=0A> -----Original Message-----=0A> From: owner-netco= nf@ops.ietf.org =0A> [mailto:owner-netconf@ops.ietf.org] On Behalf Of ext B= ert =0A> Wijnen - IETF=0A> Sent: Tuesday, January 15, 2008 4:56 PM=0A> To: = markscot@nortel.com; hideki.okita.pf@hitachi.com=0A> Cc: Sharon Chisholm; n= etconf@ops.ietf.org=0A> Subject: FW: Status of netconf-schema-query=0A> =0A= > Mark, Hideki, Sharon,=0A> =0A> From the last IETF71 Netconf Minutes, we s= ee that our AD (Dan) has=0A> recommended that the authors of=0A> =0A> = draft-okita-netconf-advertisement-00.txt=0A> and=0A> draft-scott-= netconf-schema-query-00.txt=0A> would get together and try to come up wi= th a common proposal.=0A> =0A> Both documents were read by about the same a= mount of people (10-11)=0A> and when asked who would like adopt each of the= documents, they=0A> both got some 5-7 or so supporters. So it is best to s= ee if we=0A> can merge the best from the two.=0A> =0A> So, can the two of y= ou (with your co-authors/co-editors) work together=0A> to create a new (or = merge your existing) document(s) that we can=0A> put on the WG agenda for t= he upcoming IETF. The goal should be=0A> to try and address the WG charter = item that says:=0A> =0A> 3. Schema advertisement: Currently the NETCO= NF protocol =0A> is able to=0A> advertise which protocol features= are supported on =0A> a particular=0A> netconf-capable device. H= owever, there is currently =0A> no way to=0A> discover=0A> which = XML Schema are supported on the device. The =0A> NETCONF working=0A> = group will produce a standards-track RFC with =0A> mechanisms making=0A= > this=0A> discovery possible.=0A> =0A> Note that the charter als= o says:=0A> =0A> This item may be merged with "NETCONF monitoring" into = a =0A> single document.=0A> =0A> That is why we also copied Sharon.=0A> =0A= > We as WG chairs would like to know what the 3 of you want to do:=0A> a) s= ubmit one WG netconf-monitoring draft that incorporates the best=0A> ide= as from the 3 of your drafts including the schema =0A> advertisement, or=0A= > b) submit monitoring document based on existing monitoring=0A> documen= t and do a separate schema-advertisment related document.=0A> =0A> In any c= ase, we would like the documents to be submitted asap/timely,=0A> so that t= hey meet the -00 cutof date of 11 feb 2008. This so that we=0A> have ample = time to study and review and so that we can have a fruitful=0A> discussion = at IETF71.=0A> =0A> Bert and Mehmet=0A> =0A> =0A=0A=0A=0A=0A=0A=0A=0A=0A=0A= =0A=0A=0A=0A Lesen Sie Ihre E-Mails auf dem Handy.=0Awww.yahoo.de/go --0-516760339-1203526099=:5392 Content-Type: text/html; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

Dear Mark, Hideki, Sharon,

we sent you a request on the= issue in the subject mid of January (see
the mail below) and asked whe= ther you want to:

a) submit one WG netconf-monitoring draft that in= corporates the best
    ideas from the 3 of your drafts = including the schema advertisement, or
b) prepare a separate schema-adv= ertisment related document.
 
Did you already have a discussio= n on how you want to proceed with
the Schema advertisement drafts?
=
We have provisionally included a time slot for this in the draft agenda=
(see parallel mail).
But the prerequisite for the discussion on th= e topic in the WG session is
your agreement on how you want to proceed = and the submission of a
new draft before the IETF #71 meeting (we are going to be gracious if
it's a joint -00 draft). One possibility w= e discussed is also to merge with
the monitoring draft.

So plea= se get together and force the agreement for further proceeding.
We woul= d like to encourage you to submit a joint draft before the IETF #71
mee= ting to be able to discuss it in the session and to get it one step further= .
If something is not clear or not easy to decide please involve the WG=
co-chairs or discuss on the WG maillist.

Regards,
Bert &am= p; Mehmet

> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-netco= nf@ops.ietf.org
> [mailto:owner-netconf@ops.ietf.org] On Behalf Of e= xt Bert
> Wijnen - IETF
> Sent: Tuesday, January 15, 2008 4:56= PM
> To: markscot@nortel.com; hideki.okita.pf@hitachi.com
> Cc= : Sharon Chisholm; netconf@ops.ietf.org
> Subject: FW: Status of netc= onf-schema-query
>
> Mark, Hideki, Sharon,
>
> From the last IETF71 Netconf Minutes, we see that our AD (Dan) ha= s
> recommended that the authors of
>
>   = ;    draft-okita-netconf-advertisement-00.txt
> &= nbsp;  and
>       draft-scott-net= conf-schema-query-00.txt
>    would get together and t= ry to come up with a common proposal.
>
> Both documents were = read by about the same amount of people (10-11)
> and when asked who = would like adopt each of the documents, they
> both got some 5-7 or s= o supporters. So it is best to see if we
> can merge the best from th= e two.
>
> So, can the two of you (with your co-authors/co-edi= tors) work together
> to create a new (or merge your existing) docume= nt(s) that we can
> put on the WG agenda for the upcoming IETF. The g= oal should be
> to try and address the WG charter item that says:
>
>       3. Schema adver= tisement: Currently the NETCONF protocol
> is able to
> &= nbsp;         advertise which proto= col features are supported on
> a particular
>  &nbs= p;        netconf-capable device. Howeve= r, there is currently
> no way to
> discover
> &nbs= p;         which XML Schema are sup= ported on the device. The
> NETCONF working
>   = ;        group will produce a standards-= track RFC with
> mechanisms making
> this
>  &= nbsp;        discovery possible.
>=
> Note that the charter also says:
>
>  &nbs= p; This item may be merged with "NETCONF monitoring" into a
> single document.
>
> That is why we also copied Sharon.
&g= t;
> We as WG chairs would like to know what the 3 of you want to do= :
> a) submit one WG netconf-monitoring draft that incorporates the b= est
>    ideas from the 3 of your drafts including the= schema
> advertisement, or
> b) submit monitoring document ba= sed on existing monitoring
>    document and do a sepa= rate schema-advertisment related document.
>
> In any case, we= would like the documents to be submitted asap/timely,
> so that they= meet the -00 cutof date of 11 feb 2008. This so that we
> have ample= time to study and review and so that we can have a fruitful
> discus= sion at IETF71.
>
> Bert and Mehmet
>
>

<= br>







=0A=0A=0A=0A
Heute schon einen Blick in die Zukunft von E-Mails wagen? Versuchen Si= e=C2=B4s mit dem =0Aneuen Yahoo! Mail. = =0A --0-516760339-1203526099=:5392-- -- to unsubscribe send a message to netconf-request@ops.ietf.org with the word 'unsubscribe' in a single line as the message text body. archive: From owner-netconf@ops.ietf.org Wed Feb 20 09:49:13 2008 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ietfarch-netconf-archive@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ietfarch-netconf-archive@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4B6D328C171 for ; Wed, 20 Feb 2008 09:49:13 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.325 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.325 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=-0.888, BAYES_00=-2.599, FH_RELAY_NODNS=1.451, HELO_MISMATCH_NET=0.611, RDNS_NONE=0.1] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 61Abgxk12I5h for ; Wed, 20 Feb 2008 09:49:12 -0800 (PST) Received: from psg.com (psg.com [IPv6:2001:418:1::62]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5000428C211 for ; Wed, 20 Feb 2008 09:49:12 -0800 (PST) Received: from majordom by psg.com with local (Exim 4.68 (FreeBSD)) (envelope-from ) id 1JRswt-0005s0-MF for netconf-data@psg.com; Wed, 20 Feb 2008 17:41:39 +0000 Received: from [76.96.30.17] (helo=QMTA10.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net) by psg.com with esmtp (Exim 4.68 (FreeBSD)) (envelope-from ) id 1JRScA-000He6-I3 for netconf@ops.ietf.org; Tue, 19 Feb 2008 13:34:31 +0000 Received: from OMTA12.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net ([76.96.30.44]) by QMTA10.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net with comcast id rQSN1Y0020x6nqcAA04d00; Tue, 19 Feb 2008 13:33:45 +0000 Received: from NEWTON603 ([24.61.11.96]) by OMTA12.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net with comcast id rRaT1Y00L24Kx1C8Y00000; Tue, 19 Feb 2008 13:34:30 +0000 X-Authority-Analysis: v=1.0 c=1 a=48vgC7mUAAAA:8 a=PIv5tKTiEDGbMewyGNEA:9 a=8of0C2l7Pw4vewVlmDMA:7 a=NRqv2CJRw_5MWuBahrL4_xMvWRsA:4 a=JfD0Fch1gWkA:10 a=XF7b4UCPwd8A:10 From: "David B. Nelson" To: "'Eliot Lear'" Cc: "'Mohamad Badra'" , , "'Kaushik Narayan'" , "'Bert Wijnen - IETF'" References: <47BA9510.5020900@cisco.com> Subject: RE: new revision: draft-ietf-netconf-tls-01.txt Date: Tue, 19 Feb 2008 08:34:34 -0500 Message-ID: <052301c872fc$2b9550b0$011716ac@NEWTON603> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: Microsoft Office Outlook 11 Thread-Index: Achy1lLgrEQsBwh3SyeDkuv/g1UgYAAJZm2A X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.3198 In-Reply-To: <47BA9510.5020900@cisco.com> Sender: owner-netconf@ops.ietf.org Precedence: bulk Thanks for forwarding this, Eliot. I'll take a few days to read the draft and then send you my thoughts. Regards, Dave Nelson > -----Original Message----- > From: Eliot Lear [mailto:lear@cisco.com] > Sent: Tuesday, February 19, 2008 3:37 AM > To: Bert Wijnen - IETF > Cc: Mohamad Badra; netconf@ops.ietf.org; Nelson, David; Kaushik Narayan > Subject: Re: new revision: draft-ietf-netconf-tls-01.txt > > Hi Bert & Mohamad, > > I am not a radius expert, but I think you might have a radius problem. > It would seem that either the identity & identity_hint discussed in the > draft cannot be unique to a host OR the radius server must perform the > transformations with appropriate identity & identity_hint passed along > with the string presented by the client. Keeping in mind that OTPs > should be supported, it seems likely that the radius server would have > to do the support. > > I see that RFC 4590 might be related work. It could be possible to > propose a radius extension along similar lines. However, I am by no > means a radius expert. Kaushik is, and David Nelson is, so I've CC'd > them. While the extension itself might be out of scope for NETCONF and > in fact might be more generally useful, not having such an extension > leads us towards an SNMPv3 problem and a future ISMS analog. I don't > think you have to gate this draft on that work, but the mandate that you > hash the password is what causes the problem. SASL solves this with > PLAIN, but some people complain that it is not bound well to TLS. > > Also, here are a few additional comments: > > > In that Section 3.3 Note 1, if you're going to say something is NOT > secure, you should bound that statement and preferably provide a > reference. > > In that same section, Note 2, and I realize this may be my poor reading > of RFC 4279, I do not see how the form of the PSK resultant (ASCII or > HEX) is specified. > > Above that point, the following statement requires further elaboration > and the term "random" does not sit well on its own. > > > It is RECOMMENDED that implementations > > that allow the administrator to manually configure the password also > > provide functionality for generating a new random password, taking > > [RFC4086] into account. > While it's good that you cited RFC 4086, I doubt that Don Eastlake would > use the term "random", but perhaps "pseudo random". All of this having > been said, I believe you're a bit off the beaten path, and you could > probably cut this text in its entirety. > > HTH... > > Eliot > > Bert Wijnen - IETF wrote: > > Thanks Badra. My initial comments have been addressed. > > > > All WG Members, pls review this new revision and comment > > prefereably well BEFORE we have our meeting at IETF71. > > > > Bert Wijnen > > > > > >> -----Oorspronkelijk bericht----- > >> Van: owner-netconf@ops.ietf.org > >> [mailto:owner-netconf@ops.ietf.org]Namens Mohamad Badra > >> Verzonden: vrijdag 15 februari 2008 11:12 > >> Aan: Charlie Kaufman > >> CC: netconf@ops.ietf.org > >> Onderwerp: Re: FW: review/comments of/on draft-ietf-netconf-tls-00.txt > >> > >> > >> Thank you Charlie. > >> > >> I submitted a new version of the document that addresses the raised > >> comments. Please don't hesitate to submit your comments. Many thanks! > >> > >> Best regards, > >> Badra > >> > > > > > > -- > > to unsubscribe send a message to netconf-request@ops.ietf.org with > > the word 'unsubscribe' in a single line as the message text body. > > archive: > > > > > -- to unsubscribe send a message to netconf-request@ops.ietf.org with the word 'unsubscribe' in a single line as the message text body. archive: From owner-netconf@ops.ietf.org Wed Feb 20 09:55:16 2008 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ietfarch-netconf-archive@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ietfarch-netconf-archive@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6639928C848 for ; Wed, 20 Feb 2008 09:55:16 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -3.743 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-3.743 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.752, BAYES_00=-2.599, FH_RELAY_NODNS=1.451, HELO_MISMATCH_COM=0.553, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-4, RDNS_NONE=0.1] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id n-yMSVTCmlwg for ; Wed, 20 Feb 2008 09:55:14 -0800 (PST) Received: from psg.com (psg.com [IPv6:2001:418:1::62]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id A08C728C9B4 for ; Wed, 20 Feb 2008 09:52:47 -0800 (PST) Received: from majordom by psg.com with local (Exim 4.68 (FreeBSD)) (envelope-from ) id 1JRswk-0005rC-Un for netconf-data@psg.com; Wed, 20 Feb 2008 17:41:30 +0000 Received: from [198.24.6.3] (helo=imr2.ericy.com) by psg.com with esmtps (TLSv1:AES256-SHA:256) (Exim 4.68 (FreeBSD)) (envelope-from ) id 1JRE6m-000AFJ-DN for netconf@ops.ietf.org; Mon, 18 Feb 2008 22:05:09 +0000 Received: from eusrcmw750.eamcs.ericsson.se (eusrcmw750.exu.ericsson.se [138.85.77.50]) by imr2.ericy.com (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id m1IM1iBe028280; Mon, 18 Feb 2008 16:01:45 -0600 Received: from eusrcmw750.eamcs.ericsson.se ([138.85.77.53]) by eusrcmw750.eamcs.ericsson.se with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.1830); Mon, 18 Feb 2008 16:01:38 -0600 Received: from [142.133.10.140] ([142.133.10.140]) by eusrcmw750.eamcs.ericsson.se with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.1830); Mon, 18 Feb 2008 16:01:38 -0600 Message-ID: <47BA00C5.6040705@ericsson.com> Date: Mon, 18 Feb 2008 17:03:49 -0500 From: Suresh Krishnan User-Agent: Thunderbird 2.0.0.6 (X11/20071022) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: "Hector Trevino (htrevino)" CC: Sharon Chisholm , Bert Wijnen , General Area Review Team , "Romascanu, Dan (Dan)" , Netconf Subject: Re: Gen-ART review of draft-ietf-netconf-notification-11.txt References: <47AB8729.209@ericsson.com> <713043CE8B8E1348AF3C546DBE02C1B412FE1C54@zcarhxm2.corp.nortel.com> <47B07942.2070205@ericsson.com> <713043CE8B8E1348AF3C546DBE02C1B4131B797F@zcarhxm2.corp.nortel.com> <47B9100E.2050504@ericsson.com> <6E21698722408147BEA594E073E2B0AB056A7FC8@xmb-sjc-223.amer.cisco.com> In-Reply-To: <6E21698722408147BEA594E073E2B0AB056A7FC8@xmb-sjc-223.amer.cisco.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-OriginalArrivalTime: 18 Feb 2008 22:01:38.0163 (UTC) FILETIME=[D5AE2C30:01C87279] Sender: owner-netconf@ops.ietf.org Precedence: bulk Hi Hector and Sharon, Hector Trevino (htrevino) wrote: > The definitions in the document included below. Start time is a > mandatory parameter for replay. Stop time is an optional parameter for > replay. If Start Time is not present then Stop time should not be > present, if it is, then it is an error. Maybe the Start Time and Stop > Time descriptions do not explicitely state this but I think the Negative > response text does. Does this satisfy you comment? Yes, it does. I did not read this error message correctly the first time around. I expected the message to say something like this Error-info: : stopTime Description: An expected element is missing. instead of the current text. I am fine with leaving the text as is. Thanks Suresh -- to unsubscribe send a message to netconf-request@ops.ietf.org with the word 'unsubscribe' in a single line as the message text body. archive: From owner-netconf@ops.ietf.org Wed Feb 20 09:55:18 2008 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ietfarch-netconf-archive@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ietfarch-netconf-archive@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4C72128C848 for ; Wed, 20 Feb 2008 09:55:18 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -3.763 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-3.763 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.732, BAYES_00=-2.599, FH_RELAY_NODNS=1.451, HELO_MISMATCH_COM=0.553, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-4, RDNS_NONE=0.1] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id YdpuGh6v7j6n for ; Wed, 20 Feb 2008 09:55:17 -0800 (PST) Received: from psg.com (psg.com [IPv6:2001:418:1::62]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id EB6F228C70E for ; Wed, 20 Feb 2008 09:53:41 -0800 (PST) Received: from majordom by psg.com with local (Exim 4.68 (FreeBSD)) (envelope-from ) id 1JRswc-0005qN-EK for netconf-data@psg.com; Wed, 20 Feb 2008 17:41:22 +0000 Received: from [198.24.6.9] (helo=imr1.ericy.com) by psg.com with esmtps (TLSv1:AES256-SHA:256) (Exim 4.68 (FreeBSD)) (envelope-from ) id 1JQy5R-0008bL-QF for netconf@ops.ietf.org; Mon, 18 Feb 2008 04:58:43 +0000 Received: from eusrcmw750.eamcs.ericsson.se (eusrcmw750.exu.ericsson.se [138.85.77.50]) by imr1.ericy.com (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id m1I4sZjN005317; Sun, 17 Feb 2008 22:54:35 -0600 Received: from eusrcmw750.eamcs.ericsson.se ([138.85.77.53]) by eusrcmw750.eamcs.ericsson.se with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.1830); Sun, 17 Feb 2008 22:54:35 -0600 Received: from [142.133.10.140] ([142.133.10.140]) by eusrcmw750.eamcs.ericsson.se with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.1830); Sun, 17 Feb 2008 22:54:35 -0600 Message-ID: <47B9100E.2050504@ericsson.com> Date: Sun, 17 Feb 2008 23:56:46 -0500 From: Suresh Krishnan User-Agent: Thunderbird 2.0.0.6 (X11/20071022) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Sharon Chisholm CC: Bert Wijnen , General Area Review Team , Hector Trevino , "Romascanu, Dan (Dan)" , Netconf Subject: Re: Gen-ART review of draft-ietf-netconf-notification-11.txt References: <47AB8729.209@ericsson.com> <713043CE8B8E1348AF3C546DBE02C1B412FE1C54@zcarhxm2.corp.nortel.com> <47B07942.2070205@ericsson.com> <713043CE8B8E1348AF3C546DBE02C1B4131B797F@zcarhxm2.corp.nortel.com> In-Reply-To: <713043CE8B8E1348AF3C546DBE02C1B4131B797F@zcarhxm2.corp.nortel.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-OriginalArrivalTime: 18 Feb 2008 04:54:35.0209 (UTC) FILETIME=[5B899B90:01C871EA] Sender: owner-netconf@ops.ietf.org Precedence: bulk Hi Sharon, Please find comments inline. Sharon Chisholm wrote: > hi > > >>> Minor >>> ===== >>> >>> * Section 2.1.1 >>> >>> What happens if a stopTime is specified and a startTime is not? Does >>> the replay begin starting now or is the request rejected? This needs >>> to be clarified. >> This results in an error. I think this is implicit with the current >> text in section 2.1.1. >> >> "Must be used with and be later than ." >> >> I'm not sure further clarification is required. > > Then why do we have the following error case explicitly listed? > > " If a is requested which is earlier then the specified > , the following error is returned: > > Tag: bad-element > > Error-type: protocol > > Severity: error > > Error-info: : stopTime > > Description: An element value is not correct; e.g., wrong > type, > out of range, pattern mismatch." > > > > The text in section 2.1.1 says that stopTime must be later then > startTime and there is an error message defined later when this isn't > the case. I'm not sure what the issue is. Can you clarify? I enquired what would happen if stopTime would be specified without a startTime. You mentioned it was implicit in this sentence ""Must be used with and be later than .". My question is why the other half of the sentence "later that " explicitly handled as an error case while the "must be used with" not explicitly handled. > > >>> * Section 3.2.1 >>> >>> The term "Event Stream Definition" is used in Section 3.2 before it >>> is >>> defined here. Is it possible to move this somewhere further up. >> The term 'Stream' is defined in section 1.1 so I think we are OK. > > The following text occurs in Section 3.2 > > "The central component inspects each event notification and matches > the event notification against the set of stream definitions." > > At this point I was not aware what a "stream definition" meant and > how/where it was defined. Personally I would like to push the "Event > Stream Definition" or a subset of it to Section 1.1 but I do not have a > strong position on this. > > > My personal view is that since it is defined in the definition section I > think we are ok. OK. I am fine with this. Thanks Suresh -- to unsubscribe send a message to netconf-request@ops.ietf.org with the word 'unsubscribe' in a single line as the message text body. archive: From owner-netconf@ops.ietf.org Wed Feb 20 09:55:20 2008 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ietfarch-netconf-archive@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ietfarch-netconf-archive@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8343D28C956 for ; Wed, 20 Feb 2008 09:55:20 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -4.495 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-4.495 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-2.599, FH_RELAY_NODNS=1.451, HELO_MISMATCH_COM=0.553, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-4, RDNS_NONE=0.1] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id ZfE1PeB7XfKo for ; Wed, 20 Feb 2008 09:55:17 -0800 (PST) Received: from psg.com (psg.com [IPv6:2001:418:1::62]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8BD9128C9C9 for ; Wed, 20 Feb 2008 09:53:52 -0800 (PST) Received: from majordom by psg.com with local (Exim 4.68 (FreeBSD)) (envelope-from ) id 1JRsxB-0005wA-Q1 for netconf-data@psg.com; Wed, 20 Feb 2008 17:41:57 +0000 Received: from [171.71.176.71] (helo=sj-iport-2.cisco.com) by psg.com with esmtp (Exim 4.68 (FreeBSD)) (envelope-from ) id 1JRWTo-000KAa-Ak for netconf@ops.ietf.org; Tue, 19 Feb 2008 17:42:14 +0000 Received: from sj-dkim-3.cisco.com ([171.71.179.195]) by sj-iport-2.cisco.com with ESMTP; 19 Feb 2008 09:42:07 -0800 Received: from sj-core-1.cisco.com (sj-core-1.cisco.com [171.71.177.237]) by sj-dkim-3.cisco.com (8.12.11/8.12.11) with ESMTP id m1JHg7AD030168; Tue, 19 Feb 2008 09:42:07 -0800 Received: from xbh-sjc-221.amer.cisco.com (xbh-sjc-221.cisco.com [128.107.191.63]) by sj-core-1.cisco.com (8.12.10/8.12.6) with ESMTP id m1JHfdJs019944; Tue, 19 Feb 2008 17:41:52 GMT Received: from xmb-sjc-22d.amer.cisco.com ([128.107.191.68]) by xbh-sjc-221.amer.cisco.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.1830); Tue, 19 Feb 2008 09:41:38 -0800 Received: from 10.21.115.50 ([10.21.115.50]) by xmb-sjc-22d.amer.cisco.com ([128.107.191.68]) with Microsoft Exchange Server HTTP-DAV ; Tue, 19 Feb 2008 17:41:38 +0000 User-Agent: Microsoft-Entourage/11.3.6.070618 Date: Tue, 19 Feb 2008 09:41:37 -0800 Subject: Re: new revision: draft-ietf-netconf-tls-01.txt From: Kaushik Narayan To: Eliot Lear , Bert Wijnen - IETF CC: Mohamad Badra , , "Nelson, David" Message-ID: Thread-Topic: new revision: draft-ietf-netconf-tls-01.txt Thread-Index: AchzHq0T691T/N8REdyhegAX8tamGQ== In-Reply-To: <47BA9510.5020900@cisco.com> Mime-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-OriginalArrivalTime: 19 Feb 2008 17:41:38.0896 (UTC) FILETIME=[AE34AD00:01C8731E] DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; q=dns/txt; l=3337; t=1203442927; x=1204306927; c=relaxed/simple; s=sjdkim3002; h=Content-Type:From:Subject:Content-Transfer-Encoding:MIME-Version; d=cisco.com; i=kaushik@cisco.com; z=From:=20Kaushik=20Narayan=20 |Subject:=20Re=3A=20new=20revision=3A=20draft-ietf-netconf- tls-01.txt |Sender:=20; bh=jud83LFKCOYD89fTVPFabfMaOR+qMAORF9SE7L9wELM=; b=m/YM0dnIZ3CO9tVjWnCz4n0v/FHFKp6mmsFUVpL6vGkStU73INq/4dzyaZ ZNknp1gNhhLY4R01hGF0yNQuXHL/qvlmLj1zbUUKBX3pvakxNqkY8SqJwZhD 3tHYJgOqcu; Authentication-Results: sj-dkim-3; header.From=kaushik@cisco.com; dkim=pass ( sig from cisco.com/sjdkim3002 verified; ); Sender: owner-netconf@ops.ietf.org Precedence: bulk Will get back with my thoughts after having read the draft. On 2/19/08 12:36 AM, "Eliot Lear" wrote: > Hi Bert & Mohamad, > > I am not a radius expert, but I think you might have a radius problem. > It would seem that either the identity & identity_hint discussed in the > draft cannot be unique to a host OR the radius server must perform the > transformations with appropriate identity & identity_hint passed along > with the string presented by the client. Keeping in mind that OTPs > should be supported, it seems likely that the radius server would have > to do the support. > > I see that RFC 4590 might be related work. It could be possible to > propose a radius extension along similar lines. However, I am by no > means a radius expert. Kaushik is, and David Nelson is, so I've CC'd > them. While the extension itself might be out of scope for NETCONF and > in fact might be more generally useful, not having such an extension > leads us towards an SNMPv3 problem and a future ISMS analog. I don't > think you have to gate this draft on that work, but the mandate that you > hash the password is what causes the problem. SASL solves this with > PLAIN, but some people complain that it is not bound well to TLS. > > Also, here are a few additional comments: > > > In that Section 3.3 Note 1, if you're going to say something is NOT > secure, you should bound that statement and preferably provide a reference. > > In that same section, Note 2, and I realize this may be my poor reading > of RFC 4279, I do not see how the form of the PSK resultant (ASCII or > HEX) is specified. > > Above that point, the following statement requires further elaboration > and the term "random" does not sit well on its own. > >> It is RECOMMENDED that implementations >> that allow the administrator to manually configure the password also >> provide functionality for generating a new random password, taking >> [RFC4086] into account. > While it's good that you cited RFC 4086, I doubt that Don Eastlake would > use the term "random", but perhaps "pseudo random". All of this having > been said, I believe you're a bit off the beaten path, and you could > probably cut this text in its entirety. > > HTH... > > Eliot > > Bert Wijnen - IETF wrote: >> Thanks Badra. My initial comments have been addressed. >> >> All WG Members, pls review this new revision and comment >> prefereably well BEFORE we have our meeting at IETF71. >> >> Bert Wijnen >> >> >>> -----Oorspronkelijk bericht----- >>> Van: owner-netconf@ops.ietf.org >>> [mailto:owner-netconf@ops.ietf.org]Namens Mohamad Badra >>> Verzonden: vrijdag 15 februari 2008 11:12 >>> Aan: Charlie Kaufman >>> CC: netconf@ops.ietf.org >>> Onderwerp: Re: FW: review/comments of/on draft-ietf-netconf-tls-00.txt >>> >>> >>> Thank you Charlie. >>> >>> I submitted a new version of the document that addresses the raised >>> comments. Please don't hesitate to submit your comments. Many thanks! >>> >>> Best regards, >>> Badra >>> >> >> >> -- >> to unsubscribe send a message to netconf-request@ops.ietf.org with >> the word 'unsubscribe' in a single line as the message text body. >> archive: >> >> > -- to unsubscribe send a message to netconf-request@ops.ietf.org with the word 'unsubscribe' in a single line as the message text body. archive: From owner-netconf@ops.ietf.org Wed Feb 20 12:20:16 2008 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ietfarch-netconf-archive@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ietfarch-netconf-archive@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3068528C9D6 for ; Wed, 20 Feb 2008 12:20:16 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -0.434 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-0.434 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.061, BAYES_00=-2.599, FH_RELAY_NODNS=1.451, HELO_MISMATCH_COM=0.553, RDNS_NONE=0.1] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id WisfgDHYsWJ5 for ; Wed, 20 Feb 2008 12:20:15 -0800 (PST) Received: from psg.com (psg.com [IPv6:2001:418:1::62]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7271D28CA52 for ; Wed, 20 Feb 2008 12:20:05 -0800 (PST) Received: from majordom by psg.com with local (Exim 4.68 (FreeBSD)) (envelope-from ) id 1JRvKE-0000P9-0d for netconf-data@psg.com; Wed, 20 Feb 2008 20:13:54 +0000 Received: from [213.180.94.162] (helo=mail.tail-f.com) by psg.com with esmtp (Exim 4.68 (FreeBSD)) (envelope-from ) id 1JRvI8-0000D0-6Q for netconf@ops.ietf.org; Wed, 20 Feb 2008 20:13:15 +0000 Received: from localhost (c213-100-166-13.swipnet.se [213.100.166.13]) by mail.tail-f.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id BF8551B80C5; Wed, 20 Feb 2008 21:11:40 +0100 (CET) Date: Wed, 20 Feb 2008 21:11:29 +0100 (CET) Message-Id: <20080220.211129.258641883.mbj@tail-f.com> To: m_ersue@yahoo.de Cc: markscot@nortel.com, hideki.okita.pf@hitachi.com, schishol@nortel.com, bertietf@bwijnen.net, netconf@ops.ietf.org Subject: Re: Status of Schema advertisement drafts WAS: FW: Status of netconf-schema-query From: Martin Bjorklund In-Reply-To: <963005.5392.qm@web27812.mail.ukl.yahoo.com> References: <963005.5392.qm@web27812.mail.ukl.yahoo.com> X-Mailer: Mew version 5.2.52 on Emacs 22.1 / Mule 5.0 (SAKAKI) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: Text/Plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-netconf@ops.ietf.org Precedence: bulk Hi, AFAICT, the method defined in draft-okita-netconf-advertisement-00.txt works for NETCONF over SOAP, but not for the other transports (SSH and BEEP). The methods listed in draft-scott-netconf-schema-query-00 works for any transport. I would prefer a generic transport agnostic method for this problem. I proposed one solution in http://ops.ietf.org/lists/netconf/netconf.2007/msg00698.html. I would be happy to work with Mark Scott on a schema discovery document. /martin -- to unsubscribe send a message to netconf-request@ops.ietf.org with the word 'unsubscribe' in a single line as the message text body. archive: From owner-netconf@ops.ietf.org Wed Feb 20 12:23:52 2008 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ietfarch-netconf-archive@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ietfarch-netconf-archive@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9F02B28C9A0 for ; Wed, 20 Feb 2008 12:23:52 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -4.495 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-4.495 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-2.599, FH_RELAY_NODNS=1.451, HELO_MISMATCH_COM=0.553, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-4, RDNS_NONE=0.1] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id Bltc3GeuvwpV for ; Wed, 20 Feb 2008 12:23:49 -0800 (PST) Received: from psg.com (psg.com [IPv6:2001:418:1::62]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8AEE228CA1F for ; Wed, 20 Feb 2008 12:23:03 -0800 (PST) Received: from majordom by psg.com with local (Exim 4.68 (FreeBSD)) (envelope-from ) id 1JRvJk-0000JO-NL for netconf-data@psg.com; Wed, 20 Feb 2008 20:13:24 +0000 Received: from [171.71.176.72] (helo=sj-iport-3.cisco.com) by psg.com with esmtps (TLSv1:RC4-SHA:128) (Exim 4.68 (FreeBSD)) (envelope-from ) id 1JRuyT-000Nbl-2I for netconf@ops.ietf.org; Wed, 20 Feb 2008 19:51:31 +0000 Received: from sj-dkim-1.cisco.com ([171.71.179.21]) by sj-iport-3.cisco.com with ESMTP; 20 Feb 2008 11:51:24 -0800 Received: from sj-core-3.cisco.com (sj-core-3.cisco.com [171.68.223.137]) by sj-dkim-1.cisco.com (8.12.11/8.12.11) with ESMTP id m1KJpOak014565; Wed, 20 Feb 2008 11:51:24 -0800 Received: from xbh-sjc-211.amer.cisco.com (xbh-sjc-211.cisco.com [171.70.151.144]) by sj-core-3.cisco.com (8.12.10/8.12.6) with ESMTP id m1KJovNw015159; Wed, 20 Feb 2008 19:51:17 GMT Received: from xmb-sjc-22d.amer.cisco.com ([128.107.191.68]) by xbh-sjc-211.amer.cisco.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.1830); Wed, 20 Feb 2008 11:51:09 -0800 Received: from 10.21.116.165 ([10.21.116.165]) by xmb-sjc-22d.amer.cisco.com ([128.107.191.68]) with Microsoft Exchange Server HTTP-DAV ; Wed, 20 Feb 2008 19:51:08 +0000 User-Agent: Microsoft-Entourage/11.3.6.070618 Date: Wed, 20 Feb 2008 11:51:07 -0800 Subject: Re: new revision: draft-ietf-netconf-tls-01.txt From: Kaushik Narayan To: Eliot Lear , Bert Wijnen - IETF CC: Mohamad Badra , , "Nelson, David" Message-ID: Thread-Topic: new revision: draft-ietf-netconf-tls-01.txt Thread-Index: Achz+e7FLZI8d9/tEdyOogAX8tamGQ== In-Reply-To: <47BA9510.5020900@cisco.com> Mime-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-OriginalArrivalTime: 20 Feb 2008 19:51:09.0499 (UTC) FILETIME=[F04258B0:01C873F9] DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; q=dns/txt; l=4424; t=1203537084; x=1204401084; c=relaxed/simple; s=sjdkim1004; h=Content-Type:From:Subject:Content-Transfer-Encoding:MIME-Version; d=cisco.com; i=kaushik@cisco.com; z=From:=20Kaushik=20Narayan=20 |Subject:=20Re=3A=20new=20revision=3A=20draft-ietf-netconf- tls-01.txt |Sender:=20; bh=Rkzpvwy7mzinvFkrVU20xKyN15nAdACGXxc3uynJ9Hs=; b=oqoavd/sDBRN9GnbPuT8Twxuhpz0nvNavEk2cfPFrYKtpXRWV0aG9b/MVQ 98TM5xGjVqi/n7agwsMA+mCbR2scyPJciMZg23k0YD/+toV0LQVUueshtzvr 4S34FM4fDYjblKzuUelf7Jo4i2WAFkOtPqn7az7l3InxWVGWx4Grk=; Authentication-Results: sj-dkim-1; header.From=kaushik@cisco.com; dkim=pass ( sig from cisco.com/sjdkim1004 verified; ); Sender: owner-netconf@ops.ietf.org Precedence: bulk Hi Eliot, Mohamad, The password authentication mechanism defined in section 3.3 would be problematic to support if the authentication needs to be done by a RADIUS server for a couple of reasons 1. I am not a TLS expert but I presume that the TLS server would need to possess the PSK; I don't think it would be appropriate for a RADIUS server to provide a RADIUS client with keys derived (PSK) from the user's password without authenticating the user. 2. In many cases the user's password might not even be available with the RADIUS server, they might be stored in LDAP (there may be ways to acquire the password using a LDAP getuserpassword instead of a bind) or token servers (OTP). Given that password based mechanisms with passwords stored in a central database (RADIUS, LDAP, OTP) would probably be the most widely used mechanisms for NetConf & the security issues in deriving the PSK from a password that you have pointed out in the draft; I am wondering why you wouldn't consider using SASL or alternatively perform user authentication once the TLS tunnel has been established (similar to HTTP). Regards, kaushik On 2/19/08 12:36 AM, "Eliot Lear" wrote: > Hi Bert & Mohamad, > > I am not a radius expert, but I think you might have a radius problem. > It would seem that either the identity & identity_hint discussed in the > draft cannot be unique to a host OR the radius server must perform the > transformations with appropriate identity & identity_hint passed along > with the string presented by the client. Keeping in mind that OTPs > should be supported, it seems likely that the radius server would have > to do the support. > > I see that RFC 4590 might be related work. It could be possible to > propose a radius extension along similar lines. However, I am by no > means a radius expert. Kaushik is, and David Nelson is, so I've CC'd > them. While the extension itself might be out of scope for NETCONF and > in fact might be more generally useful, not having such an extension > leads us towards an SNMPv3 problem and a future ISMS analog. I don't > think you have to gate this draft on that work, but the mandate that you > hash the password is what causes the problem. SASL solves this with > PLAIN, but some people complain that it is not bound well to TLS. > > Also, here are a few additional comments: > > > In that Section 3.3 Note 1, if you're going to say something is NOT > secure, you should bound that statement and preferably provide a reference. > > In that same section, Note 2, and I realize this may be my poor reading > of RFC 4279, I do not see how the form of the PSK resultant (ASCII or > HEX) is specified. > > Above that point, the following statement requires further elaboration > and the term "random" does not sit well on its own. > >> It is RECOMMENDED that implementations >> that allow the administrator to manually configure the password also >> provide functionality for generating a new random password, taking >> [RFC4086] into account. > While it's good that you cited RFC 4086, I doubt that Don Eastlake would > use the term "random", but perhaps "pseudo random". All of this having > been said, I believe you're a bit off the beaten path, and you could > probably cut this text in its entirety. > > HTH... > > Eliot > > Bert Wijnen - IETF wrote: >> Thanks Badra. My initial comments have been addressed. >> >> All WG Members, pls review this new revision and comment >> prefereably well BEFORE we have our meeting at IETF71. >> >> Bert Wijnen >> >> >>> -----Oorspronkelijk bericht----- >>> Van: owner-netconf@ops.ietf.org >>> [mailto:owner-netconf@ops.ietf.org]Namens Mohamad Badra >>> Verzonden: vrijdag 15 februari 2008 11:12 >>> Aan: Charlie Kaufman >>> CC: netconf@ops.ietf.org >>> Onderwerp: Re: FW: review/comments of/on draft-ietf-netconf-tls-00.txt >>> >>> >>> Thank you Charlie. >>> >>> I submitted a new version of the document that addresses the raised >>> comments. Please don't hesitate to submit your comments. Many thanks! >>> >>> Best regards, >>> Badra >>> >> >> >> -- >> to unsubscribe send a message to netconf-request@ops.ietf.org with >> the word 'unsubscribe' in a single line as the message text body. >> archive: >> >> > -- to unsubscribe send a message to netconf-request@ops.ietf.org with the word 'unsubscribe' in a single line as the message text body. archive: From owner-netconf@ops.ietf.org Thu Feb 21 04:38:50 2008 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ietfarch-netconf-archive@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ietfarch-netconf-archive@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 716EE28C540 for ; Thu, 21 Feb 2008 04:38:50 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.585 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.585 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=-0.887, BAYES_00=-2.599, FH_RELAY_NODNS=1.451, HELO_EQ_FR=0.35, RDNS_NONE=0.1] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id JJ5kHGiHEeik for ; Thu, 21 Feb 2008 04:38:49 -0800 (PST) Received: from psg.com (psg.com [IPv6:2001:418:1::62]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5902428C65C for ; Thu, 21 Feb 2008 04:38:49 -0800 (PST) Received: from majordom by psg.com with local (Exim 4.68 (FreeBSD)) (envelope-from ) id 1JSAX5-000OBC-Gk for netconf-data@psg.com; Thu, 21 Feb 2008 12:28:11 +0000 Received: from [193.55.95.1] (helo=sp.isima.fr) by psg.com with esmtp (Exim 4.68 (FreeBSD)) (envelope-from ) id 1JSAX1-000OAp-UY for netconf@ops.ietf.org; Thu, 21 Feb 2008 12:28:09 +0000 Received: from [127.0.0.1] (pc158.isima.fr [193.55.95.158]) by sp.isima.fr (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id m1LDOrOT1024018; Thu, 21 Feb 2008 13:24:53 GMT Message-ID: <47BD6E2A.8010009@isima.fr> Date: Thu, 21 Feb 2008 13:27:22 +0100 From: Mohamad Badra User-Agent: Thunderbird 1.5.0.14 (Windows/20071210) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Kaushik Narayan CC: Eliot Lear , Bert Wijnen - IETF , netconf@ops.ietf.org, "Nelson, David" Subject: Re: new revision: draft-ietf-netconf-tls-01.txt References: In-Reply-To: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Greylist: Sender IP whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-3.0 (sp.isima.fr [193.55.95.1]); Thu, 21 Feb 2008 13:24:53 +0000 (WET) Sender: owner-netconf@ops.ietf.org Precedence: bulk Dear Kaushik, Thank you for your review and for your comments. First of all, I would like to clarify a point on the document as it is written by today: it is based on using a PSK derived from a password, on using a certificate, or on both of them. Consequently, its main objective isn't to enable any password exchange type inside TLS for the user authentication. This authentication is done using ant TLS ciphersuite that is able to ensure mutual authentication. Regarding your 2nd point, I think that RADIUS or LDAP can be used within the document by simply collect the PSK and its identity as en entry in the database, or by collect the password with the PSK and its identity at the TLS server and leave this server reacts as a proxy. Regarding your 1st point, it is possible for the server to authenticate the user using SASL or EAP. But IMO, SASL or EAP over TLS should provide crypto-binding and I don't think we have that today. However, if the WG think that using PSK derived from a password isn't sufficient and that an abstraction layer (SASL, EAP, etc.) is required to enable using OTP and other password types, so please let me know, like that we can insert such a layer between NETCONF and TLS. Best regards, Badra Kaushik Narayan a écrit : > Hi Eliot, Mohamad, > > The password authentication mechanism defined in section 3.3 would be > problematic to support if the authentication needs to be done by a RADIUS > server for a couple of reasons > > 1. I am not a TLS expert but I presume that the TLS server would need to > possess the PSK; I don't think it would be appropriate for a RADIUS server > to provide a RADIUS client with keys derived (PSK) from the user's password > without authenticating the user. > > 2. In many cases the user's password might not even be available with the > RADIUS server, they might be stored in LDAP (there may be ways to acquire > the password using a LDAP getuserpassword instead of a bind) or token > servers (OTP). > > Given that password based mechanisms with passwords stored in a central > database (RADIUS, LDAP, OTP) would probably be the most widely used > mechanisms for NetConf & the security issues in deriving the PSK from a > password that you have pointed out in the draft; I am wondering why you > wouldn't consider using SASL or alternatively perform user authentication > once the TLS tunnel has been established (similar to HTTP). > > Regards, > kaushik > > On 2/19/08 12:36 AM, "Eliot Lear" wrote: > >> Hi Bert & Mohamad, >> >> I am not a radius expert, but I think you might have a radius problem. >> It would seem that either the identity & identity_hint discussed in the >> draft cannot be unique to a host OR the radius server must perform the >> transformations with appropriate identity & identity_hint passed along >> with the string presented by the client. Keeping in mind that OTPs >> should be supported, it seems likely that the radius server would have >> to do the support. >> >> I see that RFC 4590 might be related work. It could be possible to >> propose a radius extension along similar lines. However, I am by no >> means a radius expert. Kaushik is, and David Nelson is, so I've CC'd >> them. While the extension itself might be out of scope for NETCONF and >> in fact might be more generally useful, not having such an extension >> leads us towards an SNMPv3 problem and a future ISMS analog. I don't >> think you have to gate this draft on that work, but the mandate that you >> hash the password is what causes the problem. SASL solves this with >> PLAIN, but some people complain that it is not bound well to TLS. >> >> Also, here are a few additional comments: >> >> >> In that Section 3.3 Note 1, if you're going to say something is NOT >> secure, you should bound that statement and preferably provide a reference. >> >> In that same section, Note 2, and I realize this may be my poor reading >> of RFC 4279, I do not see how the form of the PSK resultant (ASCII or >> HEX) is specified. >> >> Above that point, the following statement requires further elaboration >> and the term "random" does not sit well on its own. >> >>> It is RECOMMENDED that implementations >>> that allow the administrator to manually configure the password also >>> provide functionality for generating a new random password, taking >>> [RFC4086] into account. >> While it's good that you cited RFC 4086, I doubt that Don Eastlake would >> use the term "random", but perhaps "pseudo random". All of this having >> been said, I believe you're a bit off the beaten path, and you could >> probably cut this text in its entirety. >> >> HTH... >> >> Eliot >> >> Bert Wijnen - IETF wrote: >>> Thanks Badra. My initial comments have been addressed. >>> >>> All WG Members, pls review this new revision and comment >>> prefereably well BEFORE we have our meeting at IETF71. >>> >>> Bert Wijnen >>> >>> >>>> -----Oorspronkelijk bericht----- >>>> Van: owner-netconf@ops.ietf.org >>>> [mailto:owner-netconf@ops.ietf.org]Namens Mohamad Badra >>>> Verzonden: vrijdag 15 februari 2008 11:12 >>>> Aan: Charlie Kaufman >>>> CC: netconf@ops.ietf.org >>>> Onderwerp: Re: FW: review/comments of/on draft-ietf-netconf-tls-00.txt >>>> >>>> >>>> Thank you Charlie. >>>> >>>> I submitted a new version of the document that addresses the raised >>>> comments. Please don't hesitate to submit your comments. Many thanks! >>>> >>>> Best regards, >>>> Badra -- to unsubscribe send a message to netconf-request@ops.ietf.org with the word 'unsubscribe' in a single line as the message text body. archive: From owner-netconf@ops.ietf.org Sun Feb 24 14:32:47 2008 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ietfarch-netconf-archive@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ietfarch-netconf-archive@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6645828C1FE for ; Sun, 24 Feb 2008 14:32:47 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -4.1 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-4.1 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.395, BAYES_00=-2.599, FH_RELAY_NODNS=1.451, HELO_MISMATCH_COM=0.553, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-4, RDNS_NONE=0.1] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 1i6iSakh+rcN for ; Sun, 24 Feb 2008 14:32:45 -0800 (PST) Received: from psg.com (psg.com [IPv6:2001:418:1::62]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4492928C1A3 for ; Sun, 24 Feb 2008 14:31:55 -0800 (PST) Received: from majordom by psg.com with local (Exim 4.68 (FreeBSD)) (envelope-from ) id 1JTPFa-000PBv-1x for netconf-data@psg.com; Sun, 24 Feb 2008 22:23:14 +0000 Received: from [47.140.192.55] (helo=zrtps0kn.nortel.com) by psg.com with esmtps (TLSv1:DES-CBC3-SHA:168) (Exim 4.68 (FreeBSD)) (envelope-from ) id 1JTPFX-000PBa-5e for netconf@ops.ietf.org; Sun, 24 Feb 2008 22:23:12 +0000 Received: from zcarhxm2.corp.nortel.com (zcarhxm2.corp.nortel.com [47.129.230.99]) by zrtps0kn.nortel.com (Switch-2.2.6/Switch-2.2.0) with ESMTP id m1OMN1m02501; Sun, 24 Feb 2008 22:23:01 GMT X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft Exchange V6.5 Content-class: urn:content-classes:message MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Subject: RE: Gen-ART review of draft-ietf-netconf-notification-11.txt Date: Sun, 24 Feb 2008 17:22:58 -0500 Message-ID: <713043CE8B8E1348AF3C546DBE02C1B41336AFE0@zcarhxm2.corp.nortel.com> In-Reply-To: <47B9100E.2050504@ericsson.com> X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: Thread-Topic: Gen-ART review of draft-ietf-netconf-notification-11.txt Thread-Index: Achz6kro3LiEBUzVTlmZ3rcYpR4wJgDSRtbw References: <47AB8729.209@ericsson.com> <713043CE8B8E1348AF3C546DBE02C1B412FE1C54@zcarhxm2.corp.nortel.com> <47B07942.2070205@ericsson.com> <713043CE8B8E1348AF3C546DBE02C1B4131B797F@zcarhxm2.corp.nortel.com> <47B9100E.2050504@ericsson.com> From: "Sharon Chisholm" To: "Suresh Krishnan" Cc: "Bert Wijnen" , "General Area Review Team" , "Hector Trevino" , "Romascanu, Dan (Dan)" , "Netconf" Sender: owner-netconf@ops.ietf.org Precedence: bulk Hi Ah. That makes more sense. I think that same error can be used in both cases and I will clarify the text of the message to indicate that it gets sent in both cases. Thanks, Sharon -----Original Message----- From: owner-netconf@ops.ietf.org [mailto:owner-netconf@ops.ietf.org] On Behalf Of Suresh Krishnan Sent: Sunday, February 17, 2008 11:57 PM To: Chisholm, Sharon (CAR:ZZ00) Cc: Bert Wijnen; General Area Review Team; Hector Trevino; Romascanu, Dan (Dan); Netconf Subject: Re: Gen-ART review of draft-ietf-netconf-notification-11.txt Hi Sharon, Please find comments inline. Sharon Chisholm wrote: > hi > =20 > >>> Minor >>> =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D >>> >>> * Section 2.1.1 >>> >>> What happens if a stopTime is specified and a startTime is not? Does >>> the replay begin starting now or is the request rejected? This needs >>> to be clarified. >> This results in an error. I think this is implicit with the current=20 >> text in section 2.1.1. >> >> "Must be used with and be later than ."=20 >> >> I'm not sure further clarification is required. >=20 > Then why do we have the following error case explicitly listed? >=20 > " If a is requested which is earlier then the specified > , the following error is returned: >=20 > Tag: bad-element >=20 > Error-type: protocol >=20 > Severity: error >=20 > Error-info: : stopTime >=20 > Description: An element value is not correct; e.g., wrong=20 > type, > out of range, pattern mismatch." >=20 > >=20 > The text in section 2.1.1 says that stopTime must be later then=20 > startTime and there is an error message defined later when this isn't=20 > the case. I'm not sure what the issue is. Can you clarify? I enquired what would happen if stopTime would be specified without a startTime. You mentioned it was implicit in this sentence ""Must be used with and be later than .". My question is why the other half of the sentence "later that " explicitly handled as an error case while the "must be used with" not explicitly handled. >=20 > >>> * Section 3.2.1 >>> >>> The term "Event Stream Definition" is used in Section 3.2 before it=20 >>> is defined here. Is it possible to move this somewhere further up. >> The term 'Stream' is defined in section 1.1 so I think we are OK. >=20 > The following text occurs in Section 3.2 >=20 > "The central component inspects each event notification and matches > the event notification against the set of stream definitions." >=20 > At this point I was not aware what a "stream definition" meant and=20 > how/where it was defined. Personally I would like to push the "Event=20 > Stream Definition" or a subset of it to Section 1.1 but I do not have=20 > a strong position on this. > >=20 > My personal view is that since it is defined in the definition section > I think we are ok. OK. I am fine with this. Thanks Suresh -- to unsubscribe send a message to netconf-request@ops.ietf.org with the word 'unsubscribe' in a single line as the message text body. archive: -- to unsubscribe send a message to netconf-request@ops.ietf.org with the word 'unsubscribe' in a single line as the message text body. archive: From owner-netconf@ops.ietf.org Sun Feb 24 15:20:24 2008 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ietfarch-netconf-archive@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ietfarch-netconf-archive@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5EC343A6BE9 for ; Sun, 24 Feb 2008 15:20:24 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -4.049 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-4.049 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.446, BAYES_00=-2.599, FH_RELAY_NODNS=1.451, HELO_MISMATCH_COM=0.553, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-4, RDNS_NONE=0.1] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id l+Zp8a7aKJwX for ; Sun, 24 Feb 2008 15:20:23 -0800 (PST) Received: from psg.com (psg.com [IPv6:2001:418:1::62]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 563823A68A0 for ; Sun, 24 Feb 2008 15:20:23 -0800 (PST) Received: from majordom by psg.com with local (Exim 4.68 (FreeBSD)) (envelope-from ) id 1JTQ1M-0005I2-Tv for netconf-data@psg.com; Sun, 24 Feb 2008 23:12:36 +0000 Received: from [47.129.242.57] (helo=zcars04f.nortel.com) by psg.com with esmtps (TLSv1:DES-CBC3-SHA:168) (Exim 4.68 (FreeBSD)) (envelope-from ) id 1JTQ1J-0005HY-He for netconf@ops.ietf.org; Sun, 24 Feb 2008 23:12:35 +0000 Received: from zcarhxm2.corp.nortel.com (zcarhxm2.corp.nortel.com [47.129.230.99]) by zcars04f.nortel.com (Switch-2.2.6/Switch-2.2.0) with ESMTP id m1ONCJo06192; Sun, 24 Feb 2008 23:12:19 GMT X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft Exchange V6.5 Content-class: urn:content-classes:message MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Subject: RE: Gen-ART review of draft-ietf-netconf-notification-11.txt Date: Sun, 24 Feb 2008 18:12:18 -0500 Message-ID: <713043CE8B8E1348AF3C546DBE02C1B41336AFF1@zcarhxm2.corp.nortel.com> X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: Thread-Topic: Gen-ART review of draft-ietf-netconf-notification-11.txt Thread-Index: Achz6kro3LiEBUzVTlmZ3rcYpR4wJgDSRtbwAAG4LAA= References: <47AB8729.209@ericsson.com> <713043CE8B8E1348AF3C546DBE02C1B412FE1C54@zcarhxm2.corp.nortel.com> <47B07942.2070205@ericsson.com> <713043CE8B8E1348AF3C546DBE02C1B4131B797F@zcarhxm2.corp.nortel.com> <47B9100E.2050504@ericsson.com> From: "Sharon Chisholm" To: "Suresh Krishnan" Cc: "Bert Wijnen" , "General Area Review Team" , "Hector Trevino" , "Romascanu, Dan (Dan)" , "Netconf" Sender: owner-netconf@ops.ietf.org Precedence: bulk Hi Actually, we already do have an error message for that: If a is specified in a request without having specified a , the following error is returned: Tag: missing-element Error-type: protocol Severity: error Error-info: : startTime Description: An expected element is missing. Sharon=20 -----Original Message----- From: Chisholm, Sharon (CAR:ZZ00)=20 Sent: Sunday, February 24, 2008 5:23 PM To: 'Suresh Krishnan' Cc: Bert Wijnen; General Area Review Team; Hector Trevino; Romascanu, Dan (Dan); Netconf Subject: RE: Gen-ART review of draft-ietf-netconf-notification-11.txt Hi Ah. That makes more sense. I think that same error can be used in both cases and I will clarify the text of the message to indicate that it gets sent in both cases. Thanks, Sharon -----Original Message----- From: owner-netconf@ops.ietf.org [mailto:owner-netconf@ops.ietf.org] On Behalf Of Suresh Krishnan Sent: Sunday, February 17, 2008 11:57 PM To: Chisholm, Sharon (CAR:ZZ00) Cc: Bert Wijnen; General Area Review Team; Hector Trevino; Romascanu, Dan (Dan); Netconf Subject: Re: Gen-ART review of draft-ietf-netconf-notification-11.txt Hi Sharon, Please find comments inline. Sharon Chisholm wrote: > hi > =20 > >>> Minor >>> =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D >>> >>> * Section 2.1.1 >>> >>> What happens if a stopTime is specified and a startTime is not? Does >>> the replay begin starting now or is the request rejected? This needs >>> to be clarified. >> This results in an error. I think this is implicit with the current=20 >> text in section 2.1.1. >> >> "Must be used with and be later than ."=20 >> >> I'm not sure further clarification is required. >=20 > Then why do we have the following error case explicitly listed? >=20 > " If a is requested which is earlier then the specified > , the following error is returned: >=20 > Tag: bad-element >=20 > Error-type: protocol >=20 > Severity: error >=20 > Error-info: : stopTime >=20 > Description: An element value is not correct; e.g., wrong=20 > type, > out of range, pattern mismatch." >=20 > >=20 > The text in section 2.1.1 says that stopTime must be later then=20 > startTime and there is an error message defined later when this isn't=20 > the case. I'm not sure what the issue is. Can you clarify? I enquired what would happen if stopTime would be specified without a startTime. You mentioned it was implicit in this sentence ""Must be used with and be later than .". My question is why the other half of the sentence "later that " explicitly handled as an error case while the "must be used with" not explicitly handled. >=20 > >>> * Section 3.2.1 >>> >>> The term "Event Stream Definition" is used in Section 3.2 before it=20 >>> is defined here. Is it possible to move this somewhere further up. >> The term 'Stream' is defined in section 1.1 so I think we are OK. >=20 > The following text occurs in Section 3.2 >=20 > "The central component inspects each event notification and matches > the event notification against the set of stream definitions." >=20 > At this point I was not aware what a "stream definition" meant and=20 > how/where it was defined. Personally I would like to push the "Event=20 > Stream Definition" or a subset of it to Section 1.1 but I do not have=20 > a strong position on this. > >=20 > My personal view is that since it is defined in the definition section > I think we are ok. OK. I am fine with this. Thanks Suresh -- to unsubscribe send a message to netconf-request@ops.ietf.org with the word 'unsubscribe' in a single line as the message text body. archive: -- to unsubscribe send a message to netconf-request@ops.ietf.org with the word 'unsubscribe' in a single line as the message text body. archive: From owner-netconf@ops.ietf.org Sun Feb 24 16:02:17 2008 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ietfarch-netconf-archive@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ietfarch-netconf-archive@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6D0003A6872 for ; Sun, 24 Feb 2008 16:02:17 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.615 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.615 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=-1.020, BAYES_00=-2.599, FH_RELAY_NODNS=1.451, HELO_MISMATCH_COM=0.553, J_CHICKENPOX_73=0.6, MANGLED_STOP=2.3, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-4, RDNS_NONE=0.1] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id OPfY3kggpkUz for ; Sun, 24 Feb 2008 16:02:16 -0800 (PST) Received: from psg.com (psg.com [IPv6:2001:418:1::62]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 46B1228C157 for ; Sun, 24 Feb 2008 16:02:16 -0800 (PST) Received: from majordom by psg.com with local (Exim 4.68 (FreeBSD)) (envelope-from ) id 1JTQhl-000A13-SL for netconf-data@psg.com; Sun, 24 Feb 2008 23:56:25 +0000 Received: from [47.140.192.55] (helo=zrtps0kn.nortel.com) by psg.com with esmtps (TLSv1:DES-CBC3-SHA:168) (Exim 4.68 (FreeBSD)) (envelope-from ) id 1JTQhi-000A0a-QN for netconf@ops.ietf.org; Sun, 24 Feb 2008 23:56:24 +0000 Received: from zcarhxm2.corp.nortel.com (zcarhxm2.corp.nortel.com [47.129.230.99]) by zrtps0kn.nortel.com (Switch-2.2.6/Switch-2.2.0) with ESMTP id m1ONuAm07587; Sun, 24 Feb 2008 23:56:11 GMT X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft Exchange V6.5 Content-class: urn:content-classes:message MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Subject: RE: Notification Pre-release of -12 (take 2) Date: Sun, 24 Feb 2008 18:56:09 -0500 Message-ID: <713043CE8B8E1348AF3C546DBE02C1B41336AFFE@zcarhxm2.corp.nortel.com> In-Reply-To: X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: Thread-Topic: Notification Pre-release of -12 (take 2) Thread-Index: Achz1RS/0YsXQIEvSSi786EXfY7DFwDa32uw References: From: "Sharon Chisholm" To: "Bert Wijnen - IETF" , "Hector Trevino (htrevino)" Cc: "Netconf" Sender: owner-netconf@ops.ietf.org Precedence: bulk Hi The netconf.xsd stuff is just the schemaLocation value. I don't think we really need to talk about it. It is defined in the Schema in section 3.4. Sharon=20 -----Original Message----- From: Bert Wijnen - IETF [mailto:bertietf@bwijnen.net]=20 Sent: Wednesday, February 20, 2008 10:27 AM To: Chisholm, Sharon (CAR:ZZ00); Hector Trevino (htrevino) Cc: Netconf Subject: Notification Pre-release of -12 (take 2) Can you also explain why in section 4 I cannot find the string notification.xsd ??? Why is it that such needs to be learned by looking at the IANA considerations section? I admit that for the netconf.xsd (appendix B of RFC4741) the situation is the same (or maybe even worse, because the string netconf.xsd does not occur in RFC4741 at all; only schema:netconf exists, but only in the IANA considerations section, nowhere else.) I find it a bit strange if this is the way to find out where an an XSD of a specific name is defined. I also note that I do not find the string schema:notification in the ntotications draft.... I guess I am just totally lost/confused ... sure it shows how bad my XML/XSD skills are. Sorry for that. Bert Wijnen > -----Oorspronkelijk bericht----- > Van: Bert Wijnen - IETF [mailto:bertietf@bwijnen.net] > Verzonden: woensdag 20 februari 2008 15:46 > Aan: Sharon Chisholm; Hector Trevino (htrevino) > CC: Mehmet Ersue (NSN - DE/Muenich); Dan Romascanu > Onderwerp: RE: Notification Pre-release of -12 (take 2) > > > OK, here are my nits: > > - sect 2.2.1 page 10 > > eventTime > > The time the event was generated by the event source.This > parameter is of type dateTime. > > Put a space (or maybe 2) in front of "This" > > - Section 8, page 37 > > -- Editor note to IANA/RFC-Editor: we request that you make these > assignments, in which case it is top be documented as below > > s/top be/to be/ > > - Section 8 > > I do not understand why we would not use the same format for > capabilities as in sect 10.3 of RFC4741. That makes it so much > more consistent. So instead of: > > URI: urn:ietf:params:netconf:capability:notification:1.0 > > URI: urn:ietf:params:netconf:capability:interleave:1.0 > > I would do: > > +--------------------+----------------------------------------------+ > | Index | Capability Identifier | > +--------------------+----------------------------------------------+ > | :notification | urn:ietf:params:netconf:capability: | > | | notification:1.0 | > | | | > | :interleave | urn:ietf:params:netconf:capability: | > | | interleave:1.0 | > =20 > +--------------------+----------------------------------------------+ > > It seems like you more or less completely ignored my comment that I > posted to the netconf list on 24th of January. I have attached that > posting to this email. > Pls check and review and let me know what you think about that. > > Pls also see my other email w.r.t. Andy Biermans comment "BUG in > notificatio-11 XSD" > I am doing more review > > Bert Wijnen > > > -----Oorspronkelijk bericht----- > > Van: Sharon Chisholm [mailto:schishol@nortel.com] > > Verzonden: dinsdag 19 februari 2008 22:20 > > Aan: Bert Wijnen - IETF > > Onderwerp: RE: Notification Pre-release of -12 (take 2) > > > > > > Hi > > > > Attached. I generally don't make this one available to the list=20 > > since it might get confused with the real -12. > > > > Sharon > > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: Bert Wijnen - IETF [mailto:bertietf@bwijnen.net] > > Sent: Tuesday, February 19, 2008 4:16 PM > > To: Chisholm, Sharon (CAR:ZZ00) > > Subject: RE: Notification Pre-release of -12 (take 2) > > > > Could you send me also the plain text (withoput the change-vars or=20 > > changes. > > Just the draft as you would submit it? > > > > Bert Wijnen > > > > > -----Oorspronkelijk bericht----- > > > Van: owner-netconf@ops.ietf.org > > > [mailto:owner-netconf@ops.ietf.org]Namens Sharon Chisholm > > > Verzonden: maandag 18 februari 2008 19:32 > > > Aan: Netconf > > > Onderwerp: Notification Pre-release of -12 (take 2) > > > > > > > > > Hi > > > > > > Based on some feedback from Bert, I have modified the IANA=20 > > > considerations section a bit. See attached. > > > > > > Sharon Chisholm > > > Nortel > > > Ottawa, Ontario > > > Canada > > > > > > -- to unsubscribe send a message to netconf-request@ops.ietf.org with the word 'unsubscribe' in a single line as the message text body. archive: From owner-netconf@ops.ietf.org Sun Feb 24 16:52:26 2008 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ietfarch-netconf-archive@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ietfarch-netconf-archive@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id C14523A6A5D for ; Sun, 24 Feb 2008 16:52:26 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -3.514 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-3.514 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=-0.052, BAYES_00=-2.599, FH_RELAY_NODNS=1.451, FM_ASCII_ART_SPACINGc=0.833, GB_I_LETTER=-2, HELO_MISMATCH_COM=0.553, HTML_MESSAGE=1, J_CHICKENPOX_34=0.6, J_CHICKENPOX_73=0.6, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-4, RDNS_NONE=0.1] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 6a8yTx97YOIh for ; Sun, 24 Feb 2008 16:52:22 -0800 (PST) Received: from psg.com (psg.com [IPv6:2001:418:1::62]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 10C1028C259 for ; Sun, 24 Feb 2008 16:52:21 -0800 (PST) Received: from majordom by psg.com with local (Exim 4.68 (FreeBSD)) (envelope-from ) id 1JTRTP-000Ifv-Od for netconf-data@psg.com; Mon, 25 Feb 2008 00:45:39 +0000 Received: from [47.140.192.56] (helo=zrtps0kp.nortel.com) by psg.com with esmtps (TLSv1:DES-CBC3-SHA:168) (Exim 4.68 (FreeBSD)) (envelope-from ) id 1JTRTI-000If9-1s for netconf@ops.ietf.org; Mon, 25 Feb 2008 00:45:35 +0000 Received: from zcarhxm2.corp.nortel.com (zcarhxm2.corp.nortel.com [47.129.230.99]) by zrtps0kp.nortel.com (Switch-2.2.6/Switch-2.2.0) with ESMTP id m1P0jSi27400 for ; Mon, 25 Feb 2008 00:45:28 GMT X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft Exchange V6.5 Content-class: urn:content-classes:message MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="----_=_NextPart_001_01C87747.B74E4F0A" Subject: Notification Pre-release of -12 (take 3) Date: Sun, 24 Feb 2008 19:45:24 -0500 Message-ID: <713043CE8B8E1348AF3C546DBE02C1B41336B017@zcarhxm2.corp.nortel.com> X-MS-Has-Attach: yes X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: Thread-Topic: Notification Pre-release of -12 (take 3) Thread-Index: Ach3R7UpyHQ0G8jQSxmt2sqZi8hEgA== From: "Sharon Chisholm" To: "Netconf" Sender: owner-netconf@ops.ietf.org Precedence: bulk This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------_=_NextPart_001_01C87747.B74E4F0A Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Hi Attached is another pre-release of -12. Please let me know if there are any further changes required. I would ideally like to post this before the draft cut-off tomorrow. 1. Replaced the capability strings in the IANA considerations section with the table Bert suggested. 2. Did not make any changes as a result of the discussion with Suresh on error messages since I think I have found the error message he is looking for already in the document. 3. Did not make any changes a result of Bert's questions about netconf.xsd since I think we are good. 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word 'unsubscribe' in a single line as the message text body. archive: From owner-netconf@ops.ietf.org Sun Feb 24 16:53:05 2008 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ietfarch-netconf-archive@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ietfarch-netconf-archive@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id E990928C10B for ; Sun, 24 Feb 2008 16:53:05 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: 1.696 X-Spam-Level: * X-Spam-Status: No, score=1.696 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-2.599, FH_RELAY_NODNS=1.451, HELO_EQ_JP=1.244, MIME_ASCII0=1.5, RDNS_NONE=0.1] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id GgoTNdKnuh4F for ; Sun, 24 Feb 2008 16:53:04 -0800 (PST) Received: from psg.com (psg.com [IPv6:2001:418:1::62]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 83B663A6A37 for ; Sun, 24 Feb 2008 16:53:04 -0800 (PST) Received: from 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gmml28.itg.hitachi.co.jp (AIX5.2/8.11.6p2/8.11.0) id m1P0jgv11255990; Mon, 25 Feb 2008 09:45:42 +0900 Date: Mon, 25 Feb 2008 09:45:41 +0900 (JST) Message-Id: <20080225.094541.244264975.hideki.okita.pf@hitachi.com> To: m_ersue@yahoo.de Cc: markscot@nortel.com, schishol@nortel.com, bertietf@bwijnen.net, netconf@ops.ietf.org Subject: Re: Status of Schema advertisement drafts WAS: FW: Status of netconf-schema-query From: OKITA Hideki In-Reply-To: <963005.5392.qm@web27812.mail.ukl.yahoo.com> References: <963005.5392.qm@web27812.mail.ukl.yahoo.com> Organization: Central Research Lab., Hitachi Ltd., Japan X-Mailer: Mew version 5.2 on Emacs 22.0.90 / Mule 5.0 (SAKAKI) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: Text/Plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64 Sender: owner-netconf@ops.ietf.org Precedence: bulk RGVhciBNZWhtZXQgYW5kIEJlcnQsDQoNCg0KU29ycnkgZm9yIGxhdGUgcmVwbHkuDQpXZSBkbyBu b3QgaGF2ZSBhZ2dyZWVtZW50IGZvciB0aGUgc2NoZW1hLWFkdmVydGlzZW1lbnQgZHJhZnQgeWV0 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required=5 tests=[AWL=0.750, BAYES_00=-2.599, FH_RELAY_NODNS=1.451, HELO_EQ_JP=1.244, RDNS_NONE=0.1] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id QMR8ct20Fvrb for ; Sun, 24 Feb 2008 17:54:07 -0800 (PST) Received: from psg.com (psg.com [IPv6:2001:418:1::62]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 10D383A6888 for ; Sun, 24 Feb 2008 17:54:07 -0800 (PST) Received: from majordom by psg.com with local (Exim 4.68 (FreeBSD)) (envelope-from ) id 1JTSQm-0008W3-Bv for netconf-data@psg.com; Mon, 25 Feb 2008 01:47:00 +0000 Received: from [133.145.228.42] (helo=mail7.hitachi.co.jp) by psg.com with esmtp (Exim 4.68 (FreeBSD)) (envelope-from ) id 1JTSQi-0008VR-S6 for netconf@ops.ietf.org; Mon, 25 Feb 2008 01:46:58 +0000 Received: from mlsv18.hitachi.co.jp (unknown [133.144.234.166]) by mail7.hitachi.co.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id C7DCC37AC5 for ; Mon, 25 Feb 2008 10:46:55 +0900 (JST) Received: from mfilter-s2.hitachi.co.jp by mlsv18.hitachi.co.jp (8.13.1/8.13.1) id m1P1ktem007831; Mon, 25 Feb 2008 10:46:55 +0900 Received: from vshuts2.hitachi.co.jp (unverified) by mfilter-s2.hitachi.co.jp (Content Technologies SMTPRS 4.3.17) with ESMTP id ; Mon, 25 Feb 2008 10:46:54 +0900 Received: from vshuts2.hitachi.co.jp (unknown [127.0.0.1]) by vshuts2.hitachi.co.jp (Symantec Mail Security) with ESMTP id 1A11E173461; Mon, 25 Feb 2008 10:46:08 +0900 (JST) X-AuditID: 0ac90647-add84ba000000ddd-2e-47c21ddfc5d5 Received: from gmml28.itg.hitachi.co.jp (unknown [158.213.165.131]) by vshuts2.hitachi.co.jp (Symantec Mail Security) with ESMTP id E94371236E5; Mon, 25 Feb 2008 10:46:07 +0900 (JST) Received: from localhost by gmml28.itg.hitachi.co.jp (AIX5.2/8.11.6p2/8.11.0) id m1P1ksv4198506; Mon, 25 Feb 2008 10:46:54 +0900 Date: Mon, 25 Feb 2008 10:46:52 +0900 (JST) Message-Id: <20080225.104652.107711395.hideki.okita.pf@hitachi.com> To: mbj@tail-f.com Cc: m_ersue@yahoo.de, markscot@nortel.com, schishol@nortel.com, bertietf@bwijnen.net, netconf@ops.ietf.org Subject: Re: Status of Schema advertisement drafts WAS: FW: Status of netconf-schema-query From: OKITA Hideki In-Reply-To: <20080220.211129.258641883.mbj@tail-f.com> References: <963005.5392.qm@web27812.mail.ukl.yahoo.com> <20080220.211129.258641883.mbj@tail-f.com> Organization: Central Research Lab., Hitachi Ltd., Japan X-Mailer: Mew version 5.2 on Emacs 22.0.90 / Mule 5.0 (SAKAKI) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Brightmail-Tracker: AAAAAA== Sender: owner-netconf@ops.ietf.org Precedence: bulk Martin, Thank you for your comment. > I would prefer a generic transport agnostic method for this problem. How about to use each transport for each mapping? I can aggree with you if we limit the usecase into post-deployment phase which has active NETCONF sessions. However, in pre-deployment phase like NMS development, all development environment does not have ability to talk NETCONF sessions. Most of environment that we presume support HTTP to take service advertisement information written in WSDL. IMO, transport selection is not a main issue. The main issue is how to describe/summarize schema information. > I proposed one solution in > http://ops.ietf.org/lists/netconf/netconf.2007/msg00698.html. In this mail you proposed "a mechanism to retrieve the actual schema over NETCONF." I prefer this approach. WSDL approach also realizes this. It can contain actual schema definitions in element. Example WSDL structure: (Schema Definitions) ... IMO, Using WSDL to describe/summarize schema information is a transport agnostic and well standardized method. It works for any transport. Regards, Hideki Okita From: Martin Bjorklund Subject: Re: Status of Schema advertisement drafts WAS: FW: Status of netconf-schema-query Date: Wed, 20 Feb 2008 21:11:29 +0100 (CET) > Hi, > > AFAICT, the method defined in draft-okita-netconf-advertisement-00.txt > works for NETCONF over SOAP, but not for the other transports (SSH and > BEEP). The methods listed in draft-scott-netconf-schema-query-00 > works for any transport. I would prefer a generic transport agnostic > method for this problem. > > I proposed one solution in > http://ops.ietf.org/lists/netconf/netconf.2007/msg00698.html. I would > be happy to work with Mark Scott on a schema discovery document. -- to unsubscribe send a message to netconf-request@ops.ietf.org with the word 'unsubscribe' in a single line as the message text body. archive: From owner-netconf@ops.ietf.org Mon Feb 25 03:18:24 2008 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ietfarch-netconf-archive@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ietfarch-netconf-archive@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 17AD73A6C0F for ; Mon, 25 Feb 2008 03:18:24 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.511 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.511 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=-0.813, BAYES_00=-2.599, FH_RELAY_NODNS=1.451, HELO_EQ_FR=0.35, RDNS_NONE=0.1] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id NpITglTVW82d for ; Mon, 25 Feb 2008 03:18:23 -0800 (PST) Received: from psg.com (psg.com [IPv6:2001:418:1::62]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id E71363A69BD for ; Mon, 25 Feb 2008 03:18:22 -0800 (PST) Received: from majordom by psg.com with local (Exim 4.68 (FreeBSD)) (envelope-from ) id 1JTb58-000CVR-7k for netconf-data@psg.com; Mon, 25 Feb 2008 11:01:14 +0000 Received: from [193.55.95.1] (helo=sp.isima.fr) by psg.com with esmtp (Exim 4.68 (FreeBSD)) (envelope-from ) id 1JTb2T-000CEO-Jg for netconf@ops.ietf.org; Mon, 25 Feb 2008 10:59:19 +0000 Received: from [127.0.0.1] (pc158.isima.fr [193.55.95.158]) by sp.isima.fr (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id m1PBt5A6549060; Mon, 25 Feb 2008 11:55:08 GMT Message-ID: <47C29F1F.1050801@isima.fr> Date: Mon, 25 Feb 2008 11:57:35 +0100 From: Mohamad Badra User-Agent: Thunderbird 1.5.0.14 (Windows/20071210) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: "David B. Nelson" CC: "'Eliot Lear'" , "'Bert Wijnen - IETF'" , "'Kaushik Narayan'" , "'Netconf (E-mail)'" Subject: Re: new revision: draft-ietf-netconf-tls-01.txt References: <47BA9510.5020900@cisco.com> <47BAB9E3.8020207@isima.fr> <47BC3928.4000400@cisco.com> <095901c87490$0fdea020$011716ac@NEWTON603> In-Reply-To: <095901c87490$0fdea020$011716ac@NEWTON603> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Greylist: Sender IP whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-3.0 (sp.isima.fr [193.55.95.1]); Mon, 25 Feb 2008 11:55:08 +0000 (WET) Sender: owner-netconf@ops.ietf.org Precedence: bulk Dear David, Eliot, and all, Thank you very much for your comments and feedbacks. I totally agree that the intended use case for TLS PSK is "closed environments". I also agree that NETCONF over TLS should enable the use of existing AAA infrastructures. I am working on that! I think there are at least two possible ways to send the user's credentials through the TLS session to the agent. 1- Using an abstraction layer (e.g., SASL PLAIN as Eliot/David/Kaushik proposed in their last mails) and a NETCONF capability. But I would like to know from Eliot (and others), how then the manager will distinguish between the case of TLS mutual authentication (no need for the user's credentials) and the case when only the agent is authenticated with TLS and hence the user's credentials are required. 2- Sending the user's credentials during the TLS establishment when the manager isn't authenticated by a certificate or a TLS-PSK. (Not specified yet! but available at http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-badra-tls-password-ext-01.txt). Comments and help are wellcome! Best regards, Badra David B. Nelson a écrit : > I'm obviously jumping into the middle of what appears to be an ongoing > discussion of the NETCONF over TLS work. > > Let me say that in the ISMS work, in which SNMP Transport Models and > Transport Security Models are defined, the goal was to leverage existing AAA > infrastructures. One deployment barrier to SNMPv3 is that the configuration > of PSKs on each managed entity makes administration difficult. If the user > base for NETCONF is anything like the user base for SNMP, you may eventually > see the same objection. > > Quoting from Section 1, Introduction, of RFC 4279: > > Second, pre-shared keys may be more convenient from a key > management point of view. For instance, in closed environments > where the connections are mostly configured manually in advance, > it may be easier to configure a PSK than to use certificates. > Another case is when the parties already have a mechanism for > setting up a shared secret key, and that mechanism could be used > to "bootstrap" a key for authenticating a TLS connection. > > The intended use case for TLS PKS authentication is "closed environments" > where manual configuration of PSKs is reasonable. This is similar to the > model for SNMP / USM. > > In the ISMS work, we have made allusions to the fact that having a > centralized AAA database behind SNMP authentication has the benefit of > allowing that database of user identity to be common among multiple > purposes, including NETCONF. In enterprises, the AAA database may in fact > be a corporate "single sign-on" solution. I think the potential for > leveraging existing AAA infrastructures for use with NETCONF is something > that users will eventually require. > > In order to effectively use RADIUS or other AAA for authentication (and > possibly for authorization), two properties need to apply: > > (1) The only PSK (shared credential) that needs to be configured on the > managed entity is the shared secret used between the AAA client and the AAA > server. > > (2) The form of user identity (e.g. username and password) that is required > of the user to access the managed entity is one that can be used within the > existing AAA authentication methods. > > In order to accomplish (2) you can either restrict the form of credentials > to the existing set for the AAA protocol, or you can extend the existing > set. > > While the current PSK authentication proposal for NETCONF over TLS is > technically sound, it is similar in its scaling properties to the USM > authentication mechanism for SNMPv3. I think it therefore inherits the same > deployment constraints. I believe this is what Eliot was talking about when > he says "...not having such an extension leads us towards an SNMPv3 problem > and a future ISMS analog". > > So, what are the existing RADIUS authentication mechanisms? > > (1) Username and Password (e.g. PAP) > (2) Username, Challenge and Digest (e.g. CHAP or MS-CHAP) > (3) EAP (supposedly restricted to the network access use case) > (4) HTTP Digest > >>> While NETCONF relies >>> on the transport layer for the user authentication, we are forced to >>> provide a profile for using password within TLS "without" modifying >>> TLS (note that there are some expired IDs that propose using OTP and >>> passwords within TLS, e.g., draft-linn-otp-tls). > > This is indeed a limitation. In the ISMS work for SNMP, we chose SSH as a > transport, rather than TLS, partly because network operators were already > routinely using SSH. Additionally, SSH integrates with Username and > Password authentication (among other methods). > >>> Regarding the transformations, I guess the exact encoding with RADIUS >>> is implementation dependent. But I think RADIUS recommends UTF-8, >>> (doesn't it?). > > That's simply a mechanism for supporting I18N for human readable strings > that are used in RADIUS. > >>> If then it will be OK for the document when relying on >>> RFC4279 (the PSK identity, identity hint, and password are converted >>> to a character string, and then encoded to octets using UTF-8). > > Well, you're still looking at adding a new authentication method, or at > least defining a new profile for adapted use of an existing one, to support > this form of credentials. I haven't looked at the details; this may not be > too onerous, from a protocol definition perspective. > > The attractiveness of leveraging existing AAA infrastructure, however, is to > leverage *existing* AAA infrastructure, rather that requiring deployment of > an enhanced version. This leads to the strategy of re-using one of the > existing authentication methods, rather than inventing a new one. > > Regards, > > Dave Nelson -- to unsubscribe send a message to netconf-request@ops.ietf.org with the word 'unsubscribe' in a single line as the message text body. archive: From owner-netconf@ops.ietf.org Mon Feb 25 03:24:06 2008 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ietfarch-netconf-archive@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ietfarch-netconf-archive@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 18FE23A69BD for ; Mon, 25 Feb 2008 03:24:06 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.619 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.619 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.079, BAYES_00=-2.599, FH_RELAY_NODNS=1.451, HELO_EQ_SE=0.35, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW=-1, RDNS_NONE=0.1] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id qbUCrkjlDiZ4 for ; Mon, 25 Feb 2008 03:24:05 -0800 (PST) Received: from psg.com (psg.com [IPv6:2001:418:1::62]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3C0B33A67A7 for ; Mon, 25 Feb 2008 03:24:05 -0800 (PST) Received: from majordom by psg.com with local (Exim 4.68 (FreeBSD)) (envelope-from ) id 1JTbFj-000EDE-DT for netconf-data@psg.com; Mon, 25 Feb 2008 11:12:11 +0000 Received: from [193.180.251.62] (helo=mailgw4.ericsson.se) by psg.com with esmtps (TLSv1:AES256-SHA:256) (Exim 4.68 (FreeBSD)) (envelope-from ) id 1JTbFd-000ECj-PZ for netconf@ops.ietf.org; Mon, 25 Feb 2008 11:12:07 +0000 Received: from mailgw4.ericsson.se (unknown [127.0.0.1]) by mailgw4.ericsson.se (Symantec Mail Security) with ESMTP id B42FA217B5 for ; Mon, 25 Feb 2008 12:11:20 +0100 (CET) X-AuditID: c1b4fb3e-a89fbbb000000b15-2c-47c2a258cb8b Received: from esealmw126.eemea.ericsson.se (unknown [153.88.254.123]) by mailgw4.ericsson.se (Symantec Mail Security) with ESMTP id A44EF21783 for ; Mon, 25 Feb 2008 12:11:20 +0100 (CET) Received: from esealmw126.eemea.ericsson.se ([153.88.254.174]) by esealmw126.eemea.ericsson.se with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.1830); Mon, 25 Feb 2008 12:11:02 +0100 Received: from [159.107.197.224] ([159.107.197.224]) by esealmw126.eemea.ericsson.se with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.1830); Mon, 25 Feb 2008 12:11:02 +0100 Message-ID: <47C2A246.5010104@ericsson.com> Date: Mon, 25 Feb 2008 12:11:02 +0100 From: Balazs Lengyel User-Agent: Thunderbird 2.0.0.4 (X11/20070604) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: "Netconf (E-mail)" Subject: Netconf Schema query Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-OriginalArrivalTime: 25 Feb 2008 11:11:02.0123 (UTC) FILETIME=[1B476BB0:01C8779F] X-Brightmail-Tracker: AAAAAA== Sender: owner-netconf@ops.ietf.org Precedence: bulk Hello Scott, Okita, Chairs Is there any progress with the schema query draft? Do you see any chance that you can come up with a common draft. Or is this the time to CHOSE one or both of the drafts to go ahead? Balazs -- to unsubscribe send a message to netconf-request@ops.ietf.org with the word 'unsubscribe' in a single line as the message text body. archive: From owner-netconf@ops.ietf.org Mon Feb 25 03:27:45 2008 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ietfarch-netconf-archive@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ietfarch-netconf-archive@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7BBA83A6A40 for ; Mon, 25 Feb 2008 03:27:45 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.62 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.62 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.078, BAYES_00=-2.599, FH_RELAY_NODNS=1.451, HELO_EQ_SE=0.35, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW=-1, RDNS_NONE=0.1] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 4Uo1FjVo70Do for ; Mon, 25 Feb 2008 03:27:41 -0800 (PST) Received: from psg.com (psg.com [IPv6:2001:418:1::62]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 467423A6C2E for ; Mon, 25 Feb 2008 03:27:21 -0800 (PST) Received: from majordom by psg.com with local (Exim 4.68 (FreeBSD)) (envelope-from ) id 1JTbDu-000Dxf-Rk for netconf-data@psg.com; Mon, 25 Feb 2008 11:10:18 +0000 Received: from [193.180.251.62] (helo=mailgw4.ericsson.se) by psg.com with esmtps (TLSv1:AES256-SHA:256) (Exim 4.68 (FreeBSD)) (envelope-from ) id 1JTbDr-000DxH-Ny for netconf@ops.ietf.org; Mon, 25 Feb 2008 11:10:17 +0000 Received: from mailgw4.ericsson.se (unknown [127.0.0.1]) by mailgw4.ericsson.se (Symantec Mail Security) with ESMTP id B437321779; Mon, 25 Feb 2008 12:07:26 +0100 (CET) X-AuditID: c1b4fb3e-a79f9bb000000b15-b6-47c2a16e0deb Received: from esealmw126.eemea.ericsson.se (unknown [153.88.254.123]) by mailgw4.ericsson.se (Symantec Mail Security) with ESMTP id 96AA721777; Mon, 25 Feb 2008 12:07:26 +0100 (CET) Received: from esealmw126.eemea.ericsson.se ([153.88.254.174]) by esealmw126.eemea.ericsson.se with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.1830); Mon, 25 Feb 2008 12:07:25 +0100 Received: from [159.107.197.224] ([159.107.197.224]) by esealmw126.eemea.ericsson.se with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.1830); Mon, 25 Feb 2008 12:07:25 +0100 Message-ID: <47C2A16D.7070700@ericsson.com> Date: Mon, 25 Feb 2008 12:07:25 +0100 From: Balazs Lengyel User-Agent: Thunderbird 2.0.0.4 (X11/20070604) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: OKITA Hideki CC: mbj@tail-f.com, m_ersue@yahoo.de, markscot@nortel.com, schishol@nortel.com, bertietf@bwijnen.net, netconf@ops.ietf.org Subject: Re: Status of Schema advertisement drafts WAS: FW: Status of netconf-schema-query References: <963005.5392.qm@web27812.mail.ukl.yahoo.com> <20080220.211129.258641883.mbj@tail-f.com> <20080225.104652.107711395.hideki.okita.pf@hitachi.com> In-Reply-To: <20080225.104652.107711395.hideki.okita.pf@hitachi.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-OriginalArrivalTime: 25 Feb 2008 11:07:25.0724 (UTC) FILETIME=[9A4B8DC0:01C8779E] X-Brightmail-Tracker: AAAAAA== Sender: owner-netconf@ops.ietf.org Precedence: bulk Hello Okita, How will your solution support people that do not use SOAP or SSH? I feel it does not. I think saying that if you want to query the schemas you MUST support SOAP is not something I would like. Martin's solution does not require any new NETCONF infrastructure. regards Balazs OKITA Hideki wrote: > Martin, > > > Thank you for your comment. > > >> I would prefer a generic transport agnostic method for this problem. > > How about to use each transport for each mapping? > > I can aggree with you if we limit the usecase into post-deployment phase > which has active NETCONF sessions. However, in pre-deployment phase like > NMS development, all development environment does not have ability to > talk NETCONF sessions. Most of environment that we presume support HTTP to > take service advertisement information written in WSDL. > > IMO, transport selection is not a main issue. > The main issue is how to describe/summarize schema information. > > >> I proposed one solution in >> http://ops.ietf.org/lists/netconf/netconf.2007/msg00698.html. > > In this mail you proposed "a mechanism to retrieve the actual schema > over NETCONF." I prefer this approach. WSDL approach also realizes this. > It can contain actual schema definitions in element. > > Example WSDL structure: > > xmlns:wsdl="http://schemas.xmlsoap.org/wsdl/" > xmlns:xsd="http://www.w3.org/2001/XMLSchema"> > > > > (Schema Definitions) > > > > ... > > > IMO, Using WSDL to describe/summarize schema information is > a transport agnostic and well standardized method. > It works for any transport. > > > Regards, > > Hideki Okita > > > > > From: Martin Bjorklund > Subject: Re: Status of Schema advertisement drafts WAS: FW: Status of netconf-schema-query > Date: Wed, 20 Feb 2008 21:11:29 +0100 (CET) > >> Hi, >> >> AFAICT, the method defined in draft-okita-netconf-advertisement-00.txt >> works for NETCONF over SOAP, but not for the other transports (SSH and >> BEEP). The methods listed in draft-scott-netconf-schema-query-00 >> works for any transport. I would prefer a generic transport agnostic >> method for this problem. >> >> I proposed one solution in >> http://ops.ietf.org/lists/netconf/netconf.2007/msg00698.html. I would >> be happy to work with Mark Scott on a schema discovery document. > > -- > to unsubscribe send a message to netconf-request@ops.ietf.org with > the word 'unsubscribe' in a single line as the message text body. > archive: -- Balazs Lengyel Ericsson Hungary Ltd. TSP System Manager ECN: 831 7320 Fax: +36 1 4377792 Tel: +36-1-437-7320 email: Balazs.Lengyel@ericsson.com -- to unsubscribe send a message to netconf-request@ops.ietf.org with the word 'unsubscribe' in a single line as the message text body. archive: From owner-netconf@ops.ietf.org Mon Feb 25 07:45:36 2008 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ietfarch-netconf-archive@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ietfarch-netconf-archive@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5F50628C6B5 for ; Mon, 25 Feb 2008 07:45:36 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: 0.571 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=0.571 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.375, BAYES_00=-2.599, FH_RELAY_NODNS=1.451, HELO_EQ_JP=1.244, RDNS_NONE=0.1] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id I4ChZfJvJqLH for ; Mon, 25 Feb 2008 07:45:35 -0800 (PST) Received: from psg.com (psg.com [IPv6:2001:418:1::62]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 16F2B28C640 for ; Mon, 25 Feb 2008 07:45:33 -0800 (PST) Received: from majordom by psg.com with local (Exim 4.68 (FreeBSD)) (envelope-from ) id 1JTfFd-0004aW-Jq for netconf-data@psg.com; Mon, 25 Feb 2008 15:28:21 +0000 Received: from [133.145.228.5] (helo=mail4.hitachi.co.jp) by psg.com with esmtp (Exim 4.68 (FreeBSD)) (envelope-from ) id 1JTfFa-0004Zd-5e for netconf@ops.ietf.org; Mon, 25 Feb 2008 15:28:20 +0000 Received: from mlsv9.hitachi.co.jp (unknown [133.144.234.166]) by mail4.hitachi.co.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8543233CC6 for ; Tue, 26 Feb 2008 00:28:16 +0900 (JST) Received: from MFILTER-S4.hitachi.co.jp by mlsv9.hitachi.co.jp (8.13.1/8.13.1) id m1PFSGn7000353; Tue, 26 Feb 2008 00:28:16 +0900 Received: from vshuts1.hitachi.co.jp (unverified) by MFILTER-S4.hitachi.co.jp (Content Technologies SMTPRS 4.3.17) with SMTP id ; Tue, 26 Feb 2008 00:28:15 +0900 Received: from gmml28.itg.hitachi.co.jp ([158.213.165.131]) by vshuts1.hitachi.co.jp with SMTP id M2008022600281515693; Tue, 26 Feb 2008 00:28:15 +0900 Received: from localhost by gmml28.itg.hitachi.co.jp (AIX5.2/8.11.6p2/8.11.0) id m1PFSFv13299922; Tue, 26 Feb 2008 00:28:15 +0900 Date: Tue, 26 Feb 2008 00:28:14 +0900 (JST) Message-Id: <20080226.002814.195485559.hideki.okita.pf@hitachi.com> To: balazs.lengyel@ericsson.com Cc: mbj@tail-f.com, m_ersue@yahoo.de, markscot@nortel.com, schishol@nortel.com, bertietf@bwijnen.net, netconf@ops.ietf.org Subject: Re: Status of Schema advertisement drafts WAS: FW: Status of netconf-schema-query From: OKITA Hideki In-Reply-To: <47C2A16D.7070700@ericsson.com> References: <20080220.211129.258641883.mbj@tail-f.com> <20080225.104652.107711395.hideki.okita.pf@hitachi.com> <47C2A16D.7070700@ericsson.com> Organization: Central Research Lab., Hitachi Ltd., Japan X-Mailer: Mew version 5.2 on Emacs 22.0.90 / Mule 5.0 (SAKAKI) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-netconf@ops.ietf.org Precedence: bulk Balazs, > How will your solution support people that do not use SOAP or SSH? Are you saying about BEEP people? I cannot deeply talk about BEEP. However, I believe they could transfer schema information described/summarized in a WSDL document on a BEEP channel. > I feel it does not. I think saying that if you want to query the schemas > you MUST support SOAP is not something I would like. > Martin's solution does not require any new NETCONF infrastructure. Althoulgh as the start of discussion I proposed HTTP to transfer a WSDL file , you are free to adopt your favorite transport that can transfer a WSDL file. Of course, I prefer HTTP. I talked mainly how to describe/summarize supported schema information in a XML document. It does not constrain your transport choice. Regards, Hideki Okita From: Balazs Lengyel Subject: Re: Status of Schema advertisement drafts WAS: FW: Status of netconf-schema-query Date: Mon, 25 Feb 2008 12:07:25 +0100 > Hello Okita, > How will your solution support people that do not use SOAP or SSH? > > I feel it does not. I think saying that if you want to query the schemas > you MUST support SOAP is not something I would like. > > Martin's solution does not require any new NETCONF infrastructure. > regards Balazs > > OKITA Hideki wrote: > > Martin, > > > > > > Thank you for your comment. > > > > > >> I would prefer a generic transport agnostic method for this problem. > > > > How about to use each transport for each mapping? > > > > I can aggree with you if we limit the usecase into post-deployment phase > > which has active NETCONF sessions. However, in pre-deployment phase like > > NMS development, all development environment does not have ability to > > talk NETCONF sessions. Most of environment that we presume support HTTP to > > take service advertisement information written in WSDL. > > > > IMO, transport selection is not a main issue. > > The main issue is how to describe/summarize schema information. > > > > > >> I proposed one solution in > >> http://ops.ietf.org/lists/netconf/netconf.2007/msg00698.html. > > > > In this mail you proposed "a mechanism to retrieve the actual schema > > over NETCONF." I prefer this approach. WSDL approach also realizes this. > > It can contain actual schema definitions in element. > > > > Example WSDL structure: > > > > > xmlns:wsdl="http://schemas.xmlsoap.org/wsdl/" > > xmlns:xsd="http://www.w3.org/2001/XMLSchema"> > > > > > > > > (Schema Definitions) > > > > > > > > ... > > > > > > IMO, Using WSDL to describe/summarize schema information is > > a transport agnostic and well standardized method. > > It works for any transport. > > > > > > Regards, > > > > Hideki Okita > > > > > > > > > > From: Martin Bjorklund > > Subject: Re: Status of Schema advertisement drafts WAS: FW: Status of netconf-schema-query > > Date: Wed, 20 Feb 2008 21:11:29 +0100 (CET) > > > >> Hi, > >> > >> AFAICT, the method defined in draft-okita-netconf-advertisement-00.txt > >> works for NETCONF over SOAP, but not for the other transports (SSH and > >> BEEP). The methods listed in draft-scott-netconf-schema-query-00 > >> works for any transport. I would prefer a generic transport agnostic > >> method for this problem. > >> > >> I proposed one solution in > >> http://ops.ietf.org/lists/netconf/netconf.2007/msg00698.html. I would > >> be happy to work with Mark Scott on a schema discovery document. -- to unsubscribe send a message to netconf-request@ops.ietf.org with the word 'unsubscribe' in a single line as the message text body. archive: From owner-netconf@ops.ietf.org Mon Feb 25 08:03:46 2008 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ietfarch-netconf-archive@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ietfarch-netconf-archive@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 96FB928C633 for ; Mon, 25 Feb 2008 08:03:46 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -3.492 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-3.492 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=1.003, BAYES_00=-2.599, FH_RELAY_NODNS=1.451, HELO_MISMATCH_COM=0.553, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-4, RDNS_NONE=0.1] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 9L97SwanUakk for ; Mon, 25 Feb 2008 08:03:45 -0800 (PST) Received: from psg.com (psg.com [IPv6:2001:418:1::62]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 730B928C76E for ; Mon, 25 Feb 2008 07:59:22 -0800 (PST) Received: from majordom by psg.com with local (Exim 4.68 (FreeBSD)) (envelope-from ) id 1JTfX8-0006rW-Nc for netconf-data@psg.com; Mon, 25 Feb 2008 15:46:26 +0000 Received: from [64.18.2.159] (helo=exprod7og103.obsmtp.com) by psg.com with smtps (TLSv1:AES256-SHA:256) (Exim 4.68 (FreeBSD)) (envelope-from ) id 1JTfX5-0006qM-Az for netconf@ops.ietf.org; Mon, 25 Feb 2008 15:46:25 +0000 Received: from source ([66.129.224.36]) by exprod7ob103.postini.com ([64.18.6.12]) with SMTP; Mon, 25 Feb 2008 07:45:05 PST Received: from magenta.juniper.net ([172.17.27.123]) by emailsmtp56.jnpr.net with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.3959); Mon, 25 Feb 2008 07:46:06 -0800 Received: from idle.juniper.net (idleski.juniper.net [172.25.4.26]) by magenta.juniper.net (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id m1PFk5q27305; Mon, 25 Feb 2008 07:46:05 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from phil@idle.juniper.net) Received: from idle.juniper.net (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by idle.juniper.net (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id m1PFjQEq069621; Mon, 25 Feb 2008 15:45:27 GMT (envelope-from phil@idle.juniper.net) Message-Id: <200802251545.m1PFjQEq069621@idle.juniper.net> To: OKITA Hideki cc: balazs.lengyel@ericsson.com, mbj@tail-f.com, m_ersue@yahoo.de, markscot@nortel.com, schishol@nortel.com, bertietf@bwijnen.net, netconf@ops.ietf.org Subject: Re: Status of Schema advertisement drafts WAS: FW: Status of netconf-schema-query In-reply-to: <20080226.002814.195485559.hideki.okita.pf@hitachi.com> Date: Mon, 25 Feb 2008 10:45:26 -0500 From: Phil Shafer X-OriginalArrivalTime: 25 Feb 2008 15:46:06.0471 (UTC) FILETIME=[88A31170:01C877C5] Sender: owner-netconf@ops.ietf.org Precedence: bulk OKITA Hideki writes: >Althoulgh as the start of discussion I proposed HTTP to transfer a WSDL file , >you are free to adopt your favorite transport that can transfer a WSDL file. >Of course, I prefer HTTP. Are you seeing this as a mechanism that isn't fully supported by NETCONF proper, so you'll need to explicitly add transport bindings for each current transport? And emerging transports (like TLS) will need to add language for this mechanism? I don't see this working well. We're better off placing this transfer mechanism inside NETCONF and allowing it to work over any current or future transport. Thanks, Phil -- to unsubscribe send a message to netconf-request@ops.ietf.org with the word 'unsubscribe' in a single line as the message text body. archive: From owner-netconf@ops.ietf.org Mon Feb 25 12:53:18 2008 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ietfarch-netconf-archive@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ietfarch-netconf-archive@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id D58E528C578 for ; Mon, 25 Feb 2008 12:53:18 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.586 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.586 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.014, BAYES_00=-2.599, NO_RELAYS=-0.001] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id JXDjqcEjhIx4 for ; Mon, 25 Feb 2008 12:53:14 -0800 (PST) Received: from psg.com (psg.com [IPv6:2001:418:1::62]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 67E7828C994 for ; Mon, 25 Feb 2008 12:42:42 -0800 (PST) Received: from majordom by psg.com with local (Exim 4.68 (FreeBSD)) (envelope-from ) id 1JTk2I-0000qM-5a for netconf-data@psg.com; Mon, 25 Feb 2008 20:34:54 +0000 Received: from [2001:1890:1112:1::20] (helo=mail.ietf.org) by psg.com with esmtp (Exim 4.68 (FreeBSD)) (envelope-from ) id 1JTk2E-0000pt-RM for netconf@ops.ietf.org; Mon, 25 Feb 2008 20:34:52 +0000 Received: by core3.amsl.com (Postfix, from userid 0) id 1E8823A6DF8; Mon, 25 Feb 2008 12:30:01 -0800 (PST) Content-Type: Multipart/Mixed; Boundary="NextPart" Mime-Version: 1.0 To: i-d-announce@ietf.org Cc: netconf@ops.ietf.org From: Internet-Drafts@ietf.org Subject: I-D Action:draft-ietf-netconf-notification-12.txt Message-Id: <20080225203002.1E8823A6DF8@core3.amsl.com> Date: Mon, 25 Feb 2008 12:30:02 -0800 (PST) Sender: owner-netconf@ops.ietf.org Precedence: bulk --NextPart A New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line Internet-Drafts directories. This draft is a work item of the Network Configuration Working Group of the IETF. Title : NETCONF Event Notifications Author(s) : S. Chisholm, H. Trevino Filename : draft-ietf-netconf-notification-12.txt Pages : 47 Date : 2008-02-25 This document defines mechanisms that provide an asynchronous message notification delivery service for the NETCONF protocol. This is an optional capability built on top of the base NETCONF definition. This document defines the capabilities and operations necessary to support this service. A URL for this Internet-Draft is: http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-ietf-netconf-notification-12.txt To remove yourself from the I-D Announcement list, send a message to i-d-announce-request@ietf.org with the word unsubscribe in the body of the message. You can also visit https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/I-D-announce to change your subscription settings. Internet-Drafts are also available by anonymous FTP. Login with the username "anonymous" and a password of your e-mail address. After logging in, type "cd internet-drafts" and then "get draft-ietf-netconf-notification-12.txt". A list of Internet-Drafts directories can be found in http://www.ietf.org/shadow.html or ftp://ftp.ietf.org/ietf/1shadow-sites.txt Internet-Drafts can also be obtained by e-mail. Send a message to: mailserv@ietf.org. In the body type: "FILE /internet-drafts/draft-ietf-netconf-notification-12.txt". NOTE: The mail server at ietf.org can return the document in MIME-encoded form by using the "mpack" utility. To use this feature, insert the command "ENCODING mime" before the "FILE" command. To decode the response(s), you will need "munpack" or a MIME-compliant mail reader. Different MIME-compliant mail readers exhibit different behavior, especially when dealing with "multipart" MIME messages (i.e. documents which have been split up into multiple messages), so check your local documentation on how to manipulate these messages. Below is the data which will enable a MIME compliant mail reader implementation to automatically retrieve the ASCII version of the Internet-Draft. --NextPart Content-Type: Multipart/Alternative; Boundary="OtherAccess" --OtherAccess Content-Type: Message/External-body; access-type="mail-server"; server="mailserv@ietf.org" Content-Type: text/plain Content-ID: <2008-02-25122407.I-D@ietf.org> ENCODING mime FILE /internet-drafts/draft-ietf-netconf-notification-12.txt --OtherAccess Content-Type: Message/External-body; name="draft-ietf-netconf-notification-12.txt"; site="ftp.ietf.org"; access-type="anon-ftp"; directory="internet-drafts" Content-Type: text/plain Content-ID: <2008-02-25122407.I-D\@ietf.org> --OtherAccess-- --NextPart-- -- to unsubscribe send a message to netconf-request@ops.ietf.org with the word 'unsubscribe' in a single line as the message text body. archive: From owner-netconf@ops.ietf.org Mon Feb 25 13:20:24 2008 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ietfarch-netconf-archive@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ietfarch-netconf-archive@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6E9933A6DA6 for ; Mon, 25 Feb 2008 13:20:24 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.587 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.587 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.013, BAYES_00=-2.599, NO_RELAYS=-0.001] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id uXr4dPpMZVhj for ; Mon, 25 Feb 2008 13:20:23 -0800 (PST) Received: from psg.com (psg.com [IPv6:2001:418:1::62]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0F6E83A6F11 for ; Mon, 25 Feb 2008 13:12:53 -0800 (PST) Received: from majordom by psg.com with local (Exim 4.68 (FreeBSD)) (envelope-from ) id 1JTkX3-0005aL-E8 for netconf-data@psg.com; Mon, 25 Feb 2008 21:06:41 +0000 Received: from [2001:1890:1112:1::20] (helo=mail.ietf.org) by psg.com with esmtp (Exim 4.68 (FreeBSD)) (envelope-from ) id 1JTkWw-0005Yh-UN for netconf@ops.ietf.org; Mon, 25 Feb 2008 21:06:37 +0000 Received: by core3.amsl.com (Postfix, from userid 0) id E5C5828CB63; Mon, 25 Feb 2008 13:00:01 -0800 (PST) Content-Type: Multipart/Mixed; Boundary="NextPart" Mime-Version: 1.0 To: i-d-announce@ietf.org Cc: netconf@ops.ietf.org From: Internet-Drafts@ietf.org Subject: I-D Action:draft-ietf-netconf-partial-lock-01.txt Message-Id: <20080225210001.E5C5828CB63@core3.amsl.com> Date: Mon, 25 Feb 2008 13:00:01 -0800 (PST) Sender: owner-netconf@ops.ietf.org Precedence: bulk --NextPart A New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line Internet-Drafts directories. This draft is a work item of the Network Configuration Working Group of the IETF. Title : Partial Lock RPC for NETCONF Author(s) : B. Lengyel, M. Bjorklund Filename : draft-ietf-netconf-partial-lock-01.txt Pages : 18 Date : 2008-02-25 The NETCONF protocol defines the lock and unlock RPCs that lock entire configuration datastores. In some situations, a way to lock only parts of a configuration datastore is required. This document defines a capability-based extension to the NETCONF protocol for locking portions of a configuration datastore. A URL for this Internet-Draft is: http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-ietf-netconf-partial-lock-01.txt To remove yourself from the I-D Announcement list, send a message to i-d-announce-request@ietf.org with the word unsubscribe in the body of the message. You can also visit https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/I-D-announce to change your subscription settings. Internet-Drafts are also available by anonymous FTP. Login with the username "anonymous" and a password of your e-mail address. After logging in, type "cd internet-drafts" and then "get draft-ietf-netconf-partial-lock-01.txt". A list of Internet-Drafts directories can be found in http://www.ietf.org/shadow.html or ftp://ftp.ietf.org/ietf/1shadow-sites.txt Internet-Drafts can also be obtained by e-mail. Send a message to: mailserv@ietf.org. In the body type: "FILE /internet-drafts/draft-ietf-netconf-partial-lock-01.txt". NOTE: The mail server at ietf.org can return the document in MIME-encoded form by using the "mpack" utility. To use this feature, insert the command "ENCODING mime" before the "FILE" command. To decode the response(s), you will need "munpack" or a MIME-compliant mail reader. Different MIME-compliant mail readers exhibit different behavior, especially when dealing with "multipart" MIME messages (i.e. documents which have been split up into multiple messages), so check your local documentation on how to manipulate these messages. Below is the data which will enable a MIME compliant mail reader implementation to automatically retrieve the ASCII version of the Internet-Draft. --NextPart Content-Type: Multipart/Alternative; Boundary="OtherAccess" --OtherAccess Content-Type: Message/External-body; access-type="mail-server"; server="mailserv@ietf.org" Content-Type: text/plain Content-ID: <2008-02-25125306.I-D@ietf.org> ENCODING mime FILE /internet-drafts/draft-ietf-netconf-partial-lock-01.txt --OtherAccess Content-Type: Message/External-body; name="draft-ietf-netconf-partial-lock-01.txt"; site="ftp.ietf.org"; access-type="anon-ftp"; directory="internet-drafts" Content-Type: text/plain Content-ID: <2008-02-25125306.I-D\@ietf.org> --OtherAccess-- --NextPart-- -- to unsubscribe send a message to netconf-request@ops.ietf.org with the word 'unsubscribe' in a single line as the message text body. archive: From owner-netconf@ops.ietf.org Mon Feb 25 13:42:00 2008 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ietfarch-netconf-archive@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ietfarch-netconf-archive@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id B091928C91B for ; Mon, 25 Feb 2008 13:42:00 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.593 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.593 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.105, BAYES_00=-2.599, FH_RELAY_NODNS=1.451, HELO_EQ_SE=0.35, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW=-1, RDNS_NONE=0.1] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id UxSSVjCr1YfX for ; Mon, 25 Feb 2008 13:41:59 -0800 (PST) Received: from psg.com (psg.com [IPv6:2001:418:1::62]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id A9B3128CC7D for ; Mon, 25 Feb 2008 13:30:33 -0800 (PST) Received: from majordom by psg.com with local (Exim 4.68 (FreeBSD)) (envelope-from ) id 1JTkn9-0007Wq-O1 for netconf-data@psg.com; Mon, 25 Feb 2008 21:23:19 +0000 Received: from [193.180.251.60] (helo=mailgw3.ericsson.se) by psg.com with esmtps (TLSv1:AES256-SHA:256) (Exim 4.68 (FreeBSD)) (envelope-from ) id 1JTkn6-0007W8-Ki for netconf@ops.ietf.org; Mon, 25 Feb 2008 21:23:18 +0000 Received: from mailgw3.ericsson.se (unknown [127.0.0.1]) by mailgw3.ericsson.se (Symantec Mail Security) with ESMTP id D1A2120986 for ; Mon, 25 Feb 2008 22:23:14 +0100 (CET) X-AuditID: c1b4fb3c-b00bfbb000007e19-73-47c331c22632 Received: from esealmw129.eemea.ericsson.se (unknown [153.88.254.124]) by mailgw3.ericsson.se (Symantec Mail Security) with ESMTP id BC07E20062 for ; Mon, 25 Feb 2008 22:23:14 +0100 (CET) Received: from esealmw127.eemea.ericsson.se ([153.88.254.171]) by esealmw129.eemea.ericsson.se with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.1830); Mon, 25 Feb 2008 22:23:14 +0100 Received: from [127.0.0.1] ([159.107.197.237]) by esealmw127.eemea.ericsson.se with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.1830); Mon, 25 Feb 2008 22:23:13 +0100 Message-ID: <47C331C1.7090805@ericsson.com> Date: Mon, 25 Feb 2008 22:23:13 +0100 From: Balazs Lengyel Reply-To: balazs.lengyel@ericsson.com User-Agent: Thunderbird 2.0.0.4 (X11/20070604) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: "Netconf (E-mail)" Subject: [Fwd: I-D Action:draft-ietf-netconf-partial-lock-01.txt] Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-OriginalArrivalTime: 25 Feb 2008 21:23:14.0195 (UTC) FILETIME=[A14CCE30:01C877F4] X-Brightmail-Tracker: AAAAAA== Sender: owner-netconf@ops.ietf.org Precedence: bulk fyi -------- Original Message -------- Subject: I-D Action:draft-ietf-netconf-partial-lock-01.txt Date: Mon, 25 Feb 2008 13:00:01 -0800 (PST) From: Internet-Drafts@ietf.org To: i-d-announce@ietf.org CC: netconf@ops.ietf.org A New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line Internet-Drafts directories. This draft is a work item of the Network Configuration Working Group of the IETF. Title : Partial Lock RPC for NETCONF Author(s) : B. Lengyel, M. Bjorklund Filename : draft-ietf-netconf-partial-lock-01.txt Pages : 18 Date : 2008-02-25 The NETCONF protocol defines the lock and unlock RPCs that lock entire configuration datastores. In some situations, a way to lock only parts of a configuration datastore is required. This document defines a capability-based extension to the NETCONF protocol for locking portions of a configuration datastore. A URL for this Internet-Draft is: http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-ietf-netconf-partial-lock-01.txt To remove yourself from the I-D Announcement list, send a message to i-d-announce-request@ietf.org with the word unsubscribe in the body of the message. You can also visit https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/I-D-announce to change your subscription settings. Internet-Drafts are also available by anonymous FTP. Login with the username "anonymous" and a password of your e-mail address. After logging in, type "cd internet-drafts" and then "get draft-ietf-netconf-partial-lock-01.txt". A list of Internet-Drafts directories can be found in http://www.ietf.org/shadow.html or ftp://ftp.ietf.org/ietf/1shadow-sites.txt Internet-Drafts can also be obtained by e-mail. Send a message to: mailserv@ietf.org. In the body type: "FILE /internet-drafts/draft-ietf-netconf-partial-lock-01.txt". NOTE: The mail server at ietf.org can return the document in MIME-encoded form by using the "mpack" utility. To use this feature, insert the command "ENCODING mime" before the "FILE" command. To decode the response(s), you will need "munpack" or a MIME-compliant mail reader. Different MIME-compliant mail readers exhibit different behavior, especially when dealing with "multipart" MIME messages (i.e. documents which have been split up into multiple messages), so check your local documentation on how to manipulate these messages. Below is the data which will enable a MIME compliant mail reader implementation to automatically retrieve the ASCII version of the Internet-Draft. -- Balazs Lengyel Ericsson Hungary Ltd. TSP System Manager ECN: 831 7320 Fax: +36 1 4377792 Tel: +36-1-437-7320 email: Balazs.Lengyel@ericsson.com -- to unsubscribe send a message to netconf-request@ops.ietf.org with the word 'unsubscribe' in a single line as the message text body. archive: From owner-netconf@ops.ietf.org Tue Feb 26 02:28:11 2008 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ietfarch-netconf-archive@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ietfarch-netconf-archive@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 290AA28C1D5 for ; Tue, 26 Feb 2008 02:28:11 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: 0.248 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=0.248 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=-0.804, BAYES_05=-1.11, FH_RELAY_NODNS=1.451, HELO_MISMATCH_NET=0.611, RDNS_NONE=0.1] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 9UjslxC8pF15 for ; Tue, 26 Feb 2008 02:28:10 -0800 (PST) Received: from psg.com (psg.com [IPv6:2001:418:1::62]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4B5F828C445 for ; Tue, 26 Feb 2008 02:27:33 -0800 (PST) Received: from majordom by psg.com with local (Exim 4.68 (FreeBSD)) (envelope-from ) id 1JTwms-0007xc-Dr for netconf-data@psg.com; Tue, 26 Feb 2008 10:11:50 +0000 Received: from [62.250.3.110] (helo=relay.versatel.net) by psg.com with smtp (Exim 4.68 (FreeBSD)) (envelope-from ) id 1JTwmD-0007sz-9q for netconf@ops.ietf.org; Tue, 26 Feb 2008 10:11:35 +0000 Received: (qmail 45851 invoked from network); 26 Feb 2008 10:11:05 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO bwMedion) (87.215.199.34) by relay.versatel.net with SMTP; 26 Feb 2008 10:11:05 -0000 From: "Bert Wijnen - IETF" To: "IETF Agenda" Cc: "Romascanu, Dan \(Dan\)" , "Mehmet Ersue \(NSN - DE/Muenich\)" , "Netconf" Subject: New agenda (posted/Updated as of 2008-02-25 22:09:35 (ET) ) is MISSING NETCONF!!!! Date: Tue, 26 Feb 2008 11:11:08 +0100 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.6604 (9.0.2911.0) Importance: Normal In-Reply-To: <20080226091601.GA1532@elstar.local> X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.3198 Sender: owner-netconf@ops.ietf.org Precedence: bulk Marcia, we have been promised/told a few times that we would not have to worry about the missing NETCONF session in the Monday 1740-1950 slot. However, in the new agenda, I still do NOT see NETCONF at all. This is not good. Our WG members may think that there may be no meeting (although we DID tell them we would have a session in that monday last timeslot). But there may be other people interested in NETCONF who are not on our WG mailing list and so they have no clue at all right now. This is NOT GOOD. What's up??????? Pls fix ASAP. Bert Wijnen -- to unsubscribe send a message to netconf-request@ops.ietf.org with the word 'unsubscribe' in a single line as the message text body. archive: From owner-netconf@ops.ietf.org Tue Feb 26 05:27:34 2008 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ietfarch-netconf-archive@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ietfarch-netconf-archive@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 90CDC28C2C8 for ; Tue, 26 Feb 2008 05:27:34 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -0.508 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-0.508 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=-0.071, BAYES_00=-2.599, FH_RELAY_NODNS=1.451, HELO_MISMATCH_NET=0.611, RDNS_NONE=0.1] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id DpgpcjZml-Z6 for ; Tue, 26 Feb 2008 05:27:33 -0800 (PST) Received: from psg.com (psg.com [IPv6:2001:418:1::62]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id CD51528C458 for ; Tue, 26 Feb 2008 05:27:03 -0800 (PST) Received: from majordom by psg.com with local (Exim 4.68 (FreeBSD)) (envelope-from ) id 1JTzaY-0008Y9-Hn for netconf-data@psg.com; Tue, 26 Feb 2008 13:11:18 +0000 Received: from [62.250.3.110] (helo=relay.versatel.net) by psg.com with smtp (Exim 4.68 (FreeBSD)) (envelope-from ) id 1JTzZF-0008PU-Jd for netconf@ops.ietf.org; Tue, 26 Feb 2008 13:10:22 +0000 Received: (qmail 32196 invoked from network); 26 Feb 2008 13:09:54 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO bwMedion) (87.215.199.34) by relay.versatel.net with SMTP; 26 Feb 2008 13:09:54 -0000 From: "Bert Wijnen - IETF" To: "Netconf" Subject: FW: [rt.amsl.com #2508] New agenda (posted/Updated as of 2008-02-25 22:09:35 (ET) ) is MISSING NETCONF!!!! Date: Tue, 26 Feb 2008 14:09:57 +0100 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.6604 (9.0.2911.0) Importance: Normal X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.3198 Sender: owner-netconf@ops.ietf.org Precedence: bulk FYI Bert Wijnen=20 -----Oorspronkelijk bericht----- Van: Marcia Beaulieu via RT [mailto:agenda@ietf.org] Verzonden: dinsdag 26 februari 2008 14:06 Aan: bertietf@bwijnen.net Onderwerp: [rt.amsl.com #2508] New agenda (posted/Updated as of 2008-02-25 22:09:35 (ET) ) is MISSING NETCONF!!!!=20 Bert, NETCONF is scheduled in that slot. We are having an issue with the tool and had hoped to have it fixed by now, it seems to be a programming glitch. I have tried a few things to try and make it visible but it has not worked. Our programmer and I are scheduled to work on this today. Sorry for the inconvenience this has caused. Marcia On Tue Feb 26 02:11:17 2008, bertietf@bwijnen.net wrote: > Marcia, we have been promised/told a few times that we would=20 > not have to worry about the missing NETCONF session in the=20 > Monday 1740-1950 slot.=20 >=20 > However, in the new agenda, I still do NOT see NETCONF at all. > This is not good. Our WG members may think that there may be > no meeting (although we DID tell them we would have a session=20 > in that monday last timeslot). But there may be other people=20 > interested in NETCONF who are not on our WG mailing list and > so they have no clue at all right now. This is NOT GOOD. >=20 > What's up??????? Pls fix ASAP. >=20 > Bert Wijnen=20 >=20 -- to unsubscribe send a message to netconf-request@ops.ietf.org with the word 'unsubscribe' in a single line as the message text body. archive: From owner-netconf@ops.ietf.org Tue Feb 26 09:06:41 2008 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ietfarch-netconf-archive@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ietfarch-netconf-archive@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 668943A6BAD for ; Tue, 26 Feb 2008 09:06:41 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -0.802 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-0.802 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=-1.396, BAYES_00=-2.599, FH_RELAY_NODNS=1.451, HELO_EQ_FR=0.35, MISSING_HEADERS=1.292, RDNS_NONE=0.1] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id yQ-2yHqzwzf0 for ; Tue, 26 Feb 2008 09:06:40 -0800 (PST) Received: from psg.com (psg.com [IPv6:2001:418:1::62]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3459C3A6CBC for ; Tue, 26 Feb 2008 09:06:38 -0800 (PST) Received: from majordom by psg.com with local (Exim 4.68 (FreeBSD)) (envelope-from ) id 1JU2vq-000DNX-LB for netconf-data@psg.com; Tue, 26 Feb 2008 16:45:30 +0000 Received: from [193.55.95.1] (helo=sp.isima.fr) by psg.com with esmtp (Exim 4.68 (FreeBSD)) (envelope-from ) id 1JU2vK-000DHU-IH for netconf@ops.ietf.org; Tue, 26 Feb 2008 16:45:12 +0000 Received: from [127.0.0.1] (pc158.isima.fr [193.55.95.158]) by sp.isima.fr (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id m1QHW07w417930; Tue, 26 Feb 2008 17:32:00 GMT Message-ID: <47C43F96.3010102@isima.fr> Date: Tue, 26 Feb 2008 17:34:30 +0100 From: Mohamad Badra User-Agent: Thunderbird 1.5.0.14 (Windows/20071210) MIME-Version: 1.0 CC: "'Bert Wijnen - IETF'" , mehmet.ersue@nsn.com, charliek@microsoft.com, hannes.tschofenig@nsn.com, "'Netconf (E-mail)'" Subject: Perspectives for enabling Third Party Authentication with "NETCONF over TLS" References: <47BA9510.5020900@cisco.com> <47BAB9E3.8020207@isima.fr> <47BC3928.4000400@cisco.com> <095901c87490$0fdea020$011716ac@NEWTON603> <47C29F1F.1050801@isima.fr> In-Reply-To: <47C29F1F.1050801@isima.fr> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Greylist: Sender IP whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-3.0 (sp.isima.fr [193.55.95.1]); Tue, 26 Feb 2008 17:32:00 +0000 (WET) Sender: owner-netconf@ops.ietf.org Precedence: bulk Dear all, I think we front the issue of defining correctly a common mechanism to enable using an authentication function for the manager via third parties. There are many ways to move forward with third party authentication. Below three of them, sorry for this long mail. Any advice is wellcome... 1- : ------------------- In the past (June 2007), we discussed on the mailing list of the authentication function via third parties, and I proposed using alike a JUNOS capability: . The rules (sent by Phil Shafer https://ops.ietf.org/lists/netconf/netconf.2007/msg00244.html) to handle this were pretty simple: - The RPC could only be performed if the TLS doesn't provide mutual authentication (the manager isn't authenticated), - No other RPCs could be performed if the manager isn't authenticated. In the case of TLS without manager authentication, we must leave the RPC as the only valid RPC (e.g., anything else is an error.) This proposal received one objection from Andy Bierman https://ops.ietf.org/lists/netconf/netconf.2007/msg00252.html 2- A TLS Extension or an Abstraction layer: ------------------------------------------- Consequently, I edited the document to enable mutual authentication at the TLS layer without considering the use case of third party (AAA for example). But some comments and recommendation posted to the mailing list said that it is "absolutely" required to enable third party authentication. I would like to have the WG reactions before the meeting in order to work on: 2.a- extending TLS (if you have some minutes, please look at http://tools.ietf.org/id/draft-badra-tls-password-ext-01.txt). In this document, alike SASL PLAIN is proposed within TLS. IMO, this requires an action to be taken by the TLS WG. Or 2.b- on using an abstraction layer over TLS such as SASL (with a framing protocol that NETCONF sits above is required). Dave Nilson proposed the following message transition diagram and explained: When a connection request is initiated by the manager to the managed entity (agent), e.g. via NETCONF, the manager sends the user's credential to the agent, which calls into the local AAA client, which in turn contacts the AAA server (over the network). The user's credentials are validated at the AAA server, which in turn responds to the AAA client with an accept or reject message (over the network). But he has the following question: Do you think this kind of AAA-integration will work in what you are trying to accomplish with NETCONF over TLS? I CCed Charlie and Hannes for more eventual help. Manager Agent--PAM--AAA Client AAA Server | | | | |--------------------->| | | | TLS session estab. | | | | | | | |--------------------->| | | | User credentials | | | | |----------->| | | | User cred. | | | | | | | | |------------------------>| | | | Access Request | | | | | | | |<------------------------| | | | Access Accept | | | | | | |<-----------| | | | User is OK | | | | | | |<-------------------->| | | | NETCONF Exchanges | | | 3-Update BEEP: -------------- I don't know if people want to update BEEP. If then I think it is better to update BEEP with the TLS mutual authentication as described in the document "NETCONF over TLS". But here we should keep a TCP port for BEEP, and a second port which is required to use TLS alone (mutual authentication by TLS itself) and to distinguish between them. Best regards, Badra -- to unsubscribe send a message to netconf-request@ops.ietf.org with the word 'unsubscribe' in a single line as the message text body. archive: From owner-netconf@ops.ietf.org Tue Feb 26 09:28:21 2008 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ietfarch-netconf-archive@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ietfarch-netconf-archive@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id DD9C128C4BE for ; Tue, 26 Feb 2008 09:28:21 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: 0.7 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=0.7 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=-1.278, BAYES_40=-0.185, FH_RELAY_NODNS=1.451, HELO_MISMATCH_NET=0.611, RDNS_NONE=0.1] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id RwKkmNH2ppYF for ; Tue, 26 Feb 2008 09:28:21 -0800 (PST) Received: from psg.com (psg.com [IPv6:2001:418:1::62]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7A1D728C565 for ; Tue, 26 Feb 2008 09:28:14 -0800 (PST) Received: from majordom by psg.com with local (Exim 4.68 (FreeBSD)) (envelope-from ) id 1JU3W8-000KQu-3C for netconf-data@psg.com; Tue, 26 Feb 2008 17:23:00 +0000 Received: from [62.250.3.110] (helo=relay.versatel.net) by psg.com with smtp (Exim 4.68 (FreeBSD)) (envelope-from ) id 1JU3Vv-000KOt-Ix for netconf@ops.ietf.org; Tue, 26 Feb 2008 17:22:53 +0000 Received: (qmail 81413 invoked from network); 26 Feb 2008 17:22:46 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO bwMedion) (87.215.199.34) by relay.versatel.net with SMTP; 26 Feb 2008 17:22:46 -0000 From: "Bert Wijnen - IETF" To: "Netconf" Subject: FYI: NETCONF is now on the official IETF71 agenda Date: Tue, 26 Feb 2008 18:22:49 +0100 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.6604 (9.0.2911.0) Importance: Normal X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.3198 Sender: owner-netconf@ops.ietf.org Precedence: bulk That is the agenda as updated as of 2008-02-26 08:36:26 (ET) See https://datatracker.ietf.org/meeting/71/agenda.html We're still schedule for the Monday 1740-1950 slot. Bert Wijnen -- to unsubscribe send a message to netconf-request@ops.ietf.org with the word 'unsubscribe' in a single line as the message text body. archive: From owner-netconf@ops.ietf.org Tue Feb 26 12:38:32 2008 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ietfarch-netconf-archive@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ietfarch-netconf-archive@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7D53528C7A3 for ; Tue, 26 Feb 2008 12:38:32 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -0.048 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-0.048 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=-0.798, BAYES_00=-2.599, FH_RELAY_NODNS=1.451, HELO_EQ_DE=0.35, HELO_MISMATCH_DE=1.448, RDNS_NONE=0.1] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id dLL7dBxAJ85F for ; Tue, 26 Feb 2008 12:38:31 -0800 (PST) Received: from psg.com (psg.com [IPv6:2001:418:1::62]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2F52E28C349 for ; Tue, 26 Feb 2008 12:38:26 -0800 (PST) Received: from majordom by psg.com with local (Exim 4.68 (FreeBSD)) (envelope-from ) id 1JU6Qn-000Kn5-Bn for netconf-data@psg.com; Tue, 26 Feb 2008 20:29:41 +0000 Received: from [212.201.44.23] (helo=hermes.jacobs-university.de) by psg.com with esmtp (Exim 4.68 (FreeBSD)) (envelope-from ) id 1JU6Qk-000KmO-1p for netconf@ops.ietf.org; Tue, 26 Feb 2008 20:29:39 +0000 Received: from localhost (demetrius.jacobs-university.de [212.201.44.32]) by hermes.jacobs-university.de (Postfix) with ESMTP id 901998A5BD; Tue, 26 Feb 2008 21:29:36 +0100 (CET) Received: from hermes.jacobs-university.de ([212.201.44.23]) by localhost (demetrius.jacobs-university.de [212.201.44.32]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 02384-03-23; Tue, 26 Feb 2008 21:29:31 +0100 (CET) Received: from elstar.local (elstar.iuhb02.iu-bremen.de [10.50.231.133]) by hermes.jacobs-university.de (Postfix) with ESMTP id 26AC08AE2C; Tue, 26 Feb 2008 20:41:49 +0100 (CET) Received: by elstar.local (Postfix, from userid 501) id D11914D154D; Tue, 26 Feb 2008 20:41:48 +0100 (CET) Date: Tue, 26 Feb 2008 20:41:48 +0100 From: Juergen Schoenwaelder To: Mohamad Badra Cc: 'Bert Wijnen - IETF' , mehmet.ersue@nsn.com, charliek@microsoft.com, hannes.tschofenig@nsn.com, "'Netconf (E-mail)'" Subject: Re: Perspectives for enabling Third Party Authentication with "NETCONF over TLS" Message-ID: <20080226194148.GA3644@elstar.local> Reply-To: j.schoenwaelder@jacobs-university.de Mail-Followup-To: Mohamad Badra , 'Bert Wijnen - IETF' , mehmet.ersue@nsn.com, charliek@microsoft.com, hannes.tschofenig@nsn.com, "'Netconf (E-mail)'" References: <47BA9510.5020900@cisco.com> <47BAB9E3.8020207@isima.fr> <47BC3928.4000400@cisco.com> <095901c87490$0fdea020$011716ac@NEWTON603> <47C29F1F.1050801@isima.fr> <47C43F96.3010102@isima.fr> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <47C43F96.3010102@isima.fr> User-Agent: Mutt/1.5.17 (2007-11-01) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new 2.3.3 (20050822) at jacobs-university.de Sender: owner-netconf@ops.ietf.org Precedence: bulk On Tue, Feb 26, 2008 at 05:34:30PM +0100, Mohamad Badra wrote: > I think we front the issue of defining correctly a common mechanism to > enable using an authentication function for the manager via third parties. > > There are many ways to move forward with third party authentication. Below > three of them, sorry for this long mail. Any advice is wellcome... [...] I only see two options here: a) Extending NETCONF with an authentication mechanism that can hook into SASL (which would be something for NETCONF to work on) b) Getting TLS enhanced that it can do client authentication with passwords and such things natively (which is clearly not NETCONFs business) I guess the answer will be given by the security folks. I believe we need to seek security area advise here. /js PS: My understanding is that BEEP does hook into SASL so I don't think BEEP is an issue here. -- Juergen Schoenwaelder Jacobs University Bremen gGmbH Phone: +49 421 200 3587 Campus Ring 1, 28759 Bremen, Germany Fax: +49 421 200 3103 -- to unsubscribe send a message to netconf-request@ops.ietf.org with the word 'unsubscribe' in a single line as the message text body. archive: From owner-netconf@ops.ietf.org Tue Feb 26 13:22:16 2008 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ietfarch-netconf-archive@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ietfarch-netconf-archive@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5E0F73A6CCB for ; Tue, 26 Feb 2008 13:22:16 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.587 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.587 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.013, BAYES_00=-2.599, NO_RELAYS=-0.001] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id jB48j-CLF+F1 for ; Tue, 26 Feb 2008 13:22:15 -0800 (PST) Received: from psg.com (psg.com [IPv6:2001:418:1::62]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7E3243A6C4A for ; Tue, 26 Feb 2008 13:22:15 -0800 (PST) Received: from majordom by psg.com with local (Exim 4.68 (FreeBSD)) (envelope-from ) id 1JU78k-00015c-Jq for netconf-data@psg.com; Tue, 26 Feb 2008 21:15:06 +0000 Received: from [2001:1890:1112:1::20] (helo=mail.ietf.org) by psg.com with esmtp (Exim 4.68 (FreeBSD)) (envelope-from ) id 1JU78h-000152-Kr for netconf@ops.ietf.org; Tue, 26 Feb 2008 21:15:05 +0000 Received: by core3.amsl.com (Postfix, from userid 0) id 14F993A6C6D; Tue, 26 Feb 2008 13:15:01 -0800 (PST) Content-Type: text/plain Mime-Version: 1.0 To: i-d-announce@ietf.org Cc: netconf@ops.ietf.org From: Internet-Drafts@ietf.org Subject: I-D ACTION:draft-ietf-netconf-monitoring-01.txt Message-Id: <20080226211502.14F993A6C6D@core3.amsl.com> Date: Tue, 26 Feb 2008 13:15:02 -0800 (PST) Sender: owner-netconf@ops.ietf.org Precedence: bulk A New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line Internet-Drafts directories. This draft is a work item of the Network Configuration Working Group of the IETF. Title : NETCONF Monitoring Schema Author(s) : M. Scott, S. Chisholm Filename : draft-ietf-netconf-monitoring-01.txt Pages : 21 Date : 2008-2-26 Today no standard method is defined to monitor the NETCONF protocol, including items such as sessions and subscription information. As NETCONF adds these and increasing capabilities which can impact configuration management, monitoring becomes increasingly important. This document defines NETCONF content via XML Schema to be used to monitor the Netconf protocol. It includes information about Netconf sessions, locks, and subscriptions and is intended to facilitate management of a NETCONF server. In addition this memo defines a mechanism to be able to discover all possible data models (XML Schemas) from a NETCONF server. This mechanism provides explicit references to supported schema versions and can be performed dynamically throughout a session, unlike capabilities exchange which is performed during session setup only. A URL for this Internet-Draft is: http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-ietf-netconf-monitoring-01.txt To remove yourself from the I-D Announcement list, send a message to i-d-announce-request@ietf.org with the word unsubscribe in the body of the message. You can also visit https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/I-D-announce to change your subscription settings. Internet-Drafts are also available by anonymous FTP. Login with the username "anonymous" and a password of your e-mail address. After logging in, type "cd internet-drafts" and then "get draft-ietf-netconf-monitoring-01.txt". A list of Internet-Drafts directories can be found in http://www.ietf.org/shadow.html or ftp://ftp.ietf.org/ietf/1shadow-sites.txt -- to unsubscribe send a message to netconf-request@ops.ietf.org with the word 'unsubscribe' in a single line as the message text body. archive: From owner-netconf@ops.ietf.org Wed Feb 27 02:38:55 2008 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ietfarch-netconf-archive@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ietfarch-netconf-archive@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1DBE43A6DFC for ; Wed, 27 Feb 2008 02:38:55 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -0.583 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-0.583 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=-0.688, BAYES_00=-2.599, FH_RELAY_NODNS=1.451, HELO_MISMATCH_COM=0.553, J_CHICKENPOX_73=0.6, RDNS_NONE=0.1] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id fuDm2nYUwnly for ; Wed, 27 Feb 2008 02:38:49 -0800 (PST) Received: from psg.com (psg.com [IPv6:2001:418:1::62]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id A26E83A6DF3 for ; Wed, 27 Feb 2008 02:38:47 -0800 (PST) Received: from majordom by psg.com with local (Exim 4.68 (FreeBSD)) (envelope-from ) id 1JUJWa-0003Gx-JN for netconf-data@psg.com; Wed, 27 Feb 2008 10:28:32 +0000 Received: from [212.74.114.37] (helo=mk-outboundfilter-1.mail.uk.tiscali.com) by psg.com with esmtp (Exim 4.68 (FreeBSD)) (envelope-from ) id 1JUJWW-0003Em-IP for netconf@ops.ietf.org; Wed, 27 Feb 2008 10:28:31 +0000 X-Trace: 49642113/mk-outboundfilter-1.mail.uk.tiscali.com/PIPEX/$ACCEPTED/pipex-customers/62.188.143.27 X-SBRS: None X-RemoteIP: 62.188.143.27 X-IP-MAIL-FROM: cfinss@dial.pipex.com X-IP-BHB: Once X-IronPort-Anti-Spam-Filtered: true X-IronPort-Anti-Spam-Result: Ao8CAIzKxEc+vI8b/2dsb2JhbACtYQQ X-IP-Direction: IN Received: from 1cust27.tnt14.lnd4.gbr.da.uu.net (HELO allison) ([62.188.143.27]) by smtp.pipex.tiscali.co.uk with SMTP; 27 Feb 2008 10:28:22 +0000 Message-ID: <008901c87922$bf2e7140$0601a8c0@allison> Reply-To: "tom.petch" From: "tom.petch" To: "Sharon Chisholm" , "Netconf" References: <713043CE8B8E1348AF3C546DBE02C1B41336B017@zcarhxm2.corp.nortel.com> Subject: Re: Notification Pre-release of -12 (take 3) Date: Wed, 27 Feb 2008 10:23:22 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Sender: owner-netconf@ops.ietf.org Precedence: bulk ----- Original Message ----- From: "Sharon Chisholm" To: "Netconf" Sent: Monday, February 25, 2008 1:45 AM Subject: Notification Pre-release of -12 (take 3) Hi Attached is another pre-release of -12. Please let me know if there are any further changes required. I would ideally like to post this before the draft cut-off tomorrow. 1. Replaced the capability strings in the IANA considerations section with the table Bert suggested. 2. Did not make any changes as a result of the discussion with Suresh on error messages since I think I have found the error message he is looking for already in the document. 3. Did not make any changes a result of Bert's questions about netconf.xsd since I think we are good. I will be 'interested' to follow the progress of the URI for the schema. I did raise the question of what URI to use for a schema - http:, urn:, what authority - at the start of the year on the apps discuss mailing list (the list that keeps changing its name). Chris Newman replied "As Applications Area Director, I'm not aware of anyone ever asking for that. I'm holding a discuss position on: draft-narten-iana-considerations-rfc2434bis-08 because the present text forbids use of IANA URLs and I consider that an unacceptable new restriction for IANA considerations. Current IETF practice discourages use of IANA URLs in IETF specifications. However, we have one case, RFC 4790, where stable iana.org http URLs are provided to registry elements and that was done with IANA's permission. In that case, the registry was created to be useful to both the IETF and the W3C. The stable http URLs make the W3C happier so it was worth doing that way. I would support a similar approach for iana.org http XML namespaces if someone spent the time to write up the rules and get IANA's consent. Using an ietf.org http URIs for XML namespaces is a bad idea. The IETF has deliberately kept the registry function for our standards separate and I consider that a feature. Also, ietf.org is operated by the Secretariat function so using that domain for registrations would require additional (and more expensive) coordination than iana.org. It _might_ be feasible to set up a redirect from ietf.org to iana.org for XML namespaces, but I worry that's just one additional level of complexity where things could break (especially if we transition the secretariat function between vendors periodically as we're in the process of doing now). To summarize the options: 1. URNs for XML namespaces -- present IETF common practice 2. non-IETF http URLs for XML namespaces -- acceptable 3. iana.org http URLs for XML namespaces -- nobody has tried this, seems feasible to me. 4. ietf.org http URLs for XML namespaces -- nobody has tried this. I think it's a bad idea. - Chris " and last week a new I-D duly appeared http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-duerst-iana-namespace-00.txt whose progress I shall also follow with interest. Tom Petch Sharon Chisholm Nortel Ottawa, Ontario Canada -- to unsubscribe send a message to netconf-request@ops.ietf.org with the word 'unsubscribe' in a single line as the message text body. archive: From owner-netconf@ops.ietf.org Wed Feb 27 13:29:00 2008 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ietfarch-netconf-archive@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ietfarch-netconf-archive@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 874893A6B93 for ; Wed, 27 Feb 2008 13:29:00 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -0.922 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-0.922 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=-0.424, BAYES_00=-2.599, FH_RELAY_NODNS=1.451, HELO_EQ_SE=0.35, J_CHICKENPOX_26=0.6, J_CHICKENPOX_37=0.6, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW=-1, RDNS_NONE=0.1] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id ve86IyQY9KV5 for ; Wed, 27 Feb 2008 13:28:54 -0800 (PST) Received: from psg.com (psg.com [IPv6:2001:418:1::62]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9556E28C2B1 for ; Wed, 27 Feb 2008 13:28:36 -0800 (PST) Received: from majordom by psg.com with local (Exim 4.68 (FreeBSD)) (envelope-from ) id 1JUTfD-0006et-Pg for netconf-data@psg.com; Wed, 27 Feb 2008 21:18:07 +0000 Received: from [193.180.251.60] (helo=mailgw3.ericsson.se) by psg.com with esmtps (TLSv1:AES256-SHA:256) (Exim 4.68 (FreeBSD)) (envelope-from ) id 1JUTf7-0006dw-EQ for netconf@ops.ietf.org; Wed, 27 Feb 2008 21:18:03 +0000 Received: from mailgw3.ericsson.se (unknown [127.0.0.1]) by mailgw3.ericsson.se (Symantec Mail Security) with ESMTP id EF3C3216F9 for ; Wed, 27 Feb 2008 17:10:17 +0100 (CET) X-AuditID: c1b4fb3c-b00bfbb000007e19-e3-47c58b69555c Received: from esealmw128.eemea.ericsson.se (unknown [153.88.254.121]) by mailgw3.ericsson.se (Symantec Mail Security) with ESMTP id D4A25211A0 for ; Wed, 27 Feb 2008 17:10:17 +0100 (CET) Received: from esealmw126.eemea.ericsson.se ([153.88.254.170]) by esealmw128.eemea.ericsson.se with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.1830); Wed, 27 Feb 2008 17:10:17 +0100 Received: from [159.107.197.224] ([159.107.197.224]) by esealmw126.eemea.ericsson.se with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.1830); Wed, 27 Feb 2008 17:10:17 +0100 Message-ID: <47C58B68.7030904@ericsson.com> Date: Wed, 27 Feb 2008 17:10:16 +0100 From: Balazs Lengyel User-Agent: Thunderbird 2.0.0.4 (X11/20070604) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: "Netconf (E-mail)" Subject: Comments on monitoring-01 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="------------060203080500070005010605" X-OriginalArrivalTime: 27 Feb 2008 16:10:17.0136 (UTC) FILETIME=[3E207B00:01C8795B] X-Brightmail-Tracker: AAAAAA== Sender: owner-netconf@ops.ietf.org Precedence: bulk This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --------------060203080500070005010605 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Hello Mark, Sharon, Martin, It is very welcome that the schema discovery is integrated into the previous draft, but I feel many of my previous comments were not considered. I propose to add the attached YANG schema as an informative (non-normative) appendix. If you include it I promise to keep it up to date. General) Netconf related performance counters are needed. E.g. - number of sessions - number of current sessions - number of messages, per operation type - number of faults (authentication, XML, etc.) The data model is described in XML schema which is just one possibility. At the moment it is missing real references for session and stream. I think a Yang model shall be added at least as a non-normative appendix (see attachment). Anyway we should clarify the content of the data model now, and hopefully by the next (next after next, next after next after next :-( ) IETF we will know more about the modeling methodology. Chapter 1) Do we need this? I propose to remove it. Ch 1.1) Remove the last sentence for operation. Ch.2) Why is the capabilities not EXACTLY the same as the set exchanged during session setup? lockStatus should be extended with partial locking information Ch 3.1) You mention the operation then in the example you use a ??? The example about fetching a schema inline seems to describe just some other unexplained method to fetch information about a schema. < used sometimes instead of > Ch 4) The schema is not well formed as a quote is missing Netconf state should not be the root level element, rather we should have something like netconf/netconfState. NetconfSessionInfo is sometimes but not everywhere renamed ManagementSessionInfo In types LockStatus, NetconfSubscriptionInfo real references to the sessionId would be good. This should be described at least in the documentation clause. How is it possible to have zero ConfigurationDatastoreInfo or capability elements? How do we represent CLI/GUI/etc. sessions? If we are speaking about locking the session can be an internal process like backup or restart. Description for sourceIdentifier is missing from the schema. Generally should the schema be understandable in itself? In this case it is not enough to put descriptions in the RFC (some accompanying text0, they must appear in the schema as well. As we propose to make the schema downloadable it should be understandable in itself. Partial locking shall be included in the schema. The sessionId must be always present for the lock. A real reference (keyRef) to the session object would be even better. stream should have a type of ncEvent:streamNameType. A real reference to the stream in the Notification Management Schema would be even better. (keyRef) Remove namedProfile What does lastModified mean for subscriptions? AFAIK subscriptions can not be modified. Should it be removed? The transportType, sessionType should be an an extensible enumeration. E.g. put at least commonly used string into the description. It is still better then a free form string. srcIdentifier: say something more specific about it's content e.g. a union of ipv4Address, ipv6Address, xs:string regards Balazs --------------060203080500070005010605 Content-Type: text/plain; name="netconf-state.yang" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline; filename="netconf-state.yang" module netconf-state { namespace "urn:ietf:params:xml:ns:netconf:state:1.0"; prefix "ns"; import yang-types { prefix yang; } import inet-types { prefix inet; } organization "IETF"; description "NetConf Monitoring Schema. All elements in this Schema are read-only."; revision "2008-02-27" { description "Updated to match draft-ietf-netconf-monitoring-01 Some proposed improvement included"; } revision "2008-02-01" { description "Updated to match draft-bjorklund-netconf-yang-01"; } revision "2007-11-12" { description "Updated to match draft-scott-netconf-monitoring-00.txt"; } revision "2007-07-22" { description "Initial revision."; } typedef SessionId { type uint32 { range "1..4294967295"; } reference "rfc4741"; } typedef ConfigName { type enumeration { enum "running"; enum "candidate"; enum "startup"; } reference "rfc4741"; } grouping transportType { // should be used, but the draft currently uses a simple string choice transportType { mandatory true; leaf "console" {type empty;} leaf "tcp" {type empty;} leaf "ssh" {type empty;} leaf "ssl" {type empty;} } } grouping sessionType { // should be used, but the draft currently uses a simple string choice sessionType { mandatory true; leaf "cli" {type empty;} leaf "netconf" {type empty;} leaf "webui" {type empty;} } } typedef srcIdentifier { description "Information about source of the session. IPv4Address, IPv6Address, DNS name or any other form is allowed"; type union { type inet:ipv4-address; type inet:ipv6-address; type inet:domain-name; type string ; } } container netconfState { config false; container capabilities { description "List of NETCONF capabilities supported by this device."; leaf-list capability { type yang:uri; min-elements 1; } } container sessions { description "List of NETCONF sessions currently active on this device."; list session { key sessionId; leaf sessionId { type SessionId; } leaf username { type string; } leaf transport { type string; } leaf protocol { type string; } leaf sourceIdentifier { type srcIdentifier; } leaf loginTime { type yang:date-and-time; } } } container configurations { description "List of NETCONF configuration datastores (e.g. running, startup, candidate) supported on this device and related information."; list config { key name; leaf name { type ConfigName; } container lockStatus { description "An indication of whether a resource is locked or unlocked. If locked, additional information about the locking such as user an time stamp is provided."; leaf lock-state { type enumeration { enum "locked"; enum "unlocked"; } } leaf lockedBySession { type SessionId; description "The session ID of the session that has locked this resource."; } leaf lockedTime { type yang:date-and-time; description "The date and time of when the resource was locked. If the resource is currently unlocked, this element will not be present."; } } } container subscriptions { description "List of NETCONF notification subscriptions active on this device and related information."; list subscription { key session-id; description "Information about Netconf Notification Subscriptions."; leaf session-id { type SessionId; description "The session id associated with this subscription."; } leaf stream { type string; description "The stream associated with this subscription."; } anyxml filter { description "The filters associated with this subscription."; } leaf messagesSent { type yang:zero-based-counter32; description "A count of event notifications sent along this connection since the subscription was created."; } } } } } } --------------060203080500070005010605-- -- to unsubscribe send a message to netconf-request@ops.ietf.org with the word 'unsubscribe' in a single line as the message text body. archive: From owner-netconf@ops.ietf.org Wed Feb 27 15:38:18 2008 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ietfarch-netconf-archive@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ietfarch-netconf-archive@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3A57728C7D3 for ; Wed, 27 Feb 2008 15:38:18 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: 0.715 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=0.715 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=-1.262, BAYES_40=-0.185, FH_RELAY_NODNS=1.451, HELO_MISMATCH_NET=0.611, RDNS_NONE=0.1] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id Y6DNrn15DqHu for ; Wed, 27 Feb 2008 15:38:17 -0800 (PST) Received: from psg.com (psg.com [IPv6:2001:418:1::62]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 408743A6AFA for ; Wed, 27 Feb 2008 15:37:18 -0800 (PST) Received: from majordom by psg.com with local (Exim 4.68 (FreeBSD)) (envelope-from ) id 1JUVkd-000OIm-SH for netconf-data@psg.com; Wed, 27 Feb 2008 23:31:51 +0000 Received: from [62.250.3.110] (helo=relay.versatel.net) by psg.com with smtp (Exim 4.68 (FreeBSD)) (envelope-from ) id 1JUVkY-000OHd-6H for netconf@ops.ietf.org; Wed, 27 Feb 2008 23:31:50 +0000 Received: (qmail 91746 invoked from network); 27 Feb 2008 23:31:42 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO bwMedion) (87.215.199.34) by relay.versatel.net with SMTP; 27 Feb 2008 23:31:42 -0000 From: "Bert Wijnen - IETF" To: "Dan Romascanu" Cc: "Sharon Chisholm" , "Hector Trevino \(htrevino\)" , "Netconf" Subject: draft-ietf-netconf-notification-12.txt is OK for IESG agenda Date: Thu, 28 Feb 2008 00:31:43 +0100 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.6604 (9.0.2911.0) Importance: Normal X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.3198 Sender: owner-netconf@ops.ietf.org Precedence: bulk Dan, pls put this document on the IESG agenda. I think it is "good enough" and the srious issues have been resolved. The only things that I want you to make sure is - registratation of: URI: urn:ietf:params:xml:ns:netmod:notification I still wonder if it would not be better to register URI: urn:ietf:params:xml:ns:netmod:notification:1.0 Sharon claims it was discussed and that thecurrent doc contains the consensus. I cannot find that consensus (maybe I did not look hard enough). I must also say that there is not a lot of people who seem to bother. - Pls make sure that XML experts take a look at the XML and XSD fragments in the document. I don't feel that I have enough authority/skills in this space to tell you that they are solid and bug-free. Hope this helps, Bert Wijnen document shepherd and WG co-chair -- to unsubscribe send a message to netconf-request@ops.ietf.org with the word 'unsubscribe' in a single line as the message text body. archive: From owner-netconf@ops.ietf.org Thu Feb 28 01:54:19 2008 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ietfarch-netconf-archive@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ietfarch-netconf-archive@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id D7AA528C521 for ; Thu, 28 Feb 2008 01:54:19 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.353 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.353 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=1.084, BAYES_00=-2.599, FH_RELAY_NODNS=1.451, HELO_MISMATCH_NET=0.611, HTML_MESSAGE=1, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-4, RDNS_NONE=0.1] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id iCXhuMGmhWZK for ; Thu, 28 Feb 2008 01:54:19 -0800 (PST) Received: from psg.com (psg.com [IPv6:2001:418:1::62]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9A20428C519 for ; Thu, 28 Feb 2008 01:54:18 -0800 (PST) Received: from majordom by psg.com with local (Exim 4.68 (FreeBSD)) (envelope-from ) id 1JUfGC-0003H7-Ok for netconf-data@psg.com; Thu, 28 Feb 2008 09:41:04 +0000 Received: from [217.115.75.233] (helo=demumfd001.nsn-inter.net) by psg.com with esmtps (TLSv1:AES256-SHA:256) (Exim 4.68 (FreeBSD)) (envelope-from ) id 1JUfG9-0003Ga-I6 for netconf@ops.ietf.org; Thu, 28 Feb 2008 09:41:03 +0000 Received: from demuprx017.emea.nsn-intra.net ([10.150.129.56]) by demumfd001.nsn-inter.net (8.12.11.20060308/8.12.11) with ESMTP id m1S9euIN016492 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=NO); Thu, 28 Feb 2008 10:40:56 +0100 Received: from demuexc023.nsn-intra.net (webmail.nsn-intra.net [10.150.128.36]) by demuprx017.emea.nsn-intra.net (8.12.11.20060308/8.12.11) with ESMTP id m1S9eqw7006957; Thu, 28 Feb 2008 10:40:56 +0100 Received: from DEMUEXC005.nsn-intra.net ([10.150.128.17]) by demuexc023.nsn-intra.net with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.3959); Thu, 28 Feb 2008 10:40:52 +0100 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft Exchange V6.5 Content-class: urn:content-classes:message MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----_=_NextPart_001_01C879EE.01B9FFA1" Subject: Agenda for NETCONF WG session at IETF #71 Date: Thu, 28 Feb 2008 10:40:51 +0100 Message-ID: X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: Thread-Topic: Agenda for NETCONF WG session at IETF #71 Thread-Index: Ach57gEuw6AQNNRaSNi7tZf5zkwv0A== From: "Ersue, Mehmet (NSN - DE/Muenich)" To: Cc: "ext Bert Wijnen - IETF" , "ext Romascanu, Dan (Dan)" X-OriginalArrivalTime: 28 Feb 2008 09:40:52.0346 (UTC) FILETIME=[020A35A0:01C879EE] Sender: owner-netconf@ops.ietf.org Precedence: bulk This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------_=_NextPart_001_01C879EE.01B9FFA1 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Dear NETCONF WG, below is an update for the agenda of the NETCONF WG session=20 at the IETF #71.=20 Our main focus in the session will be on open issue discussion. Please let us know before hand about your implementation. Please let us also know whether you have a concrete topic for=20 the open mic session. We still need volunteers as scribe and minute taker. As you=20 know the session will not start before we have them ;-).=20 Bert & Mehmet _____________________________________________ NETCONF WG IETF 71, Philadelphia, PA, USA MONDAY, March 10, 2008 1740-1950 Scribes (needs to be organized before the session), Agenda bashing (2 minutes) Use of mailing lists, WG status review (10 minutes) Current charter items: 1. NETCONF over TLS (20 minutes) draft-ietf-netconf-tls-01.txt 2. Fine-grained locking (20 minutes) draft-ietf-netconf-partial-lock-00.txt 3. Netconf monitoring (20 minutes) draft-ietf-netconf-monitoring-00.txt Discussion on ongoing implementations (10 minutes) Who is implementing what? Should we plan an interop-event for testing of RFC 4141-4144 to get them to DS?=20 AOB Open mike=20 One hot topic is e.g. the NETCONF-related requirements on DML.=20 Any other hot topics to discuss?=20 Note (this is not part of the agenda):=20 We are not going to discuss solutions in open mic slot.=20 This is just because we have some time and want to give=20 you the opportunity to sort out the NETCONF-related=20 requirements as a preparation for the Canmod BoF.=20 ------_=_NextPart_001_01C879EE.01B9FFA1 Content-Type: text/html; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Agenda for NETCONF WG session at IETF #71

Dear NETCONF = WG,

below is an update = for the agenda of the NETCONF WG session
at the IETF #71. =

Our main focus in = the session will be on open issue discussion.
Please let us know = before hand about your implementation.
Please let us also = know whether you have a concrete topic for
the open mic = session.

We still need = volunteers as scribe and minute taker. As you
know the session = will not start before we have them ;-).

Bert & = Mehmet

_____________________________________________

NETCONF = WG
IETF 71, = Philadelphia, PA, USA

MONDAY, March 10, = 2008 1740-1950

  Scribes = (needs to be organized before the session),
  Agenda = bashing (2 minutes)

  Use of = mailing lists,
  WG status = review (10 minutes)

  Current = charter items:

    = 1. NETCONF over TLS (20 minutes)

       = draft-ietf-netconf-tls-01.txt

    = 2. Fine-grained locking (20 minutes)

       = draft-ietf-netconf-partial-lock-00.txt

    = 3. Netconf monitoring (20 minutes)

       = draft-ietf-netconf-monitoring-00.txt

  Discussion = on ongoing implementations (10 minutes)

      Who is implementing = what?
      Should we plan an = interop-event for testing of
      RFC 4141-4144 to get = them to DS?

  = AOB

  Open mike =

      One hot topic is e.g. = the NETCONF-related requirements on DML.
      Any other hot topics to = discuss?

Note (this is not = part of the agenda):
We are not going = to discuss solutions in open mic slot.
This is just = because we have some time and want to give
you the = opportunity to sort out the NETCONF-related
requirements as a = preparation for the Canmod BoF. =


------_=_NextPart_001_01C879EE.01B9FFA1-- -- to unsubscribe send a message to netconf-request@ops.ietf.org with the word 'unsubscribe' in a single line as the message text body. archive: From owner-netconf@ops.ietf.org Thu Feb 28 04:41:46 2008 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ietfarch-netconf-archive@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ietfarch-netconf-archive@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id A49E03A6DEA for ; Thu, 28 Feb 2008 04:41:46 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.452 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.452 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.985, BAYES_00=-2.599, FH_RELAY_NODNS=1.451, HELO_MISMATCH_NET=0.611, HTML_MESSAGE=1, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-4, RDNS_NONE=0.1] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id lB3XPOTn9Bp2 for ; Thu, 28 Feb 2008 04:41:44 -0800 (PST) Received: from psg.com (psg.com [IPv6:2001:418:1::62]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 98E5F3A6A80 for ; Thu, 28 Feb 2008 04:41:44 -0800 (PST) Received: from majordom by psg.com with local (Exim 4.68 (FreeBSD)) (envelope-from ) id 1JUhwn-0005eI-6N for netconf-data@psg.com; Thu, 28 Feb 2008 12:33:13 +0000 Received: from [217.115.75.233] (helo=demumfd001.nsn-inter.net) by psg.com with esmtps (TLSv1:AES256-SHA:256) (Exim 4.68 (FreeBSD)) (envelope-from ) id 1JUhwP-0005Y4-LB for netconf@ops.ietf.org; Thu, 28 Feb 2008 12:32:55 +0000 Received: from demuprx017.emea.nsn-intra.net ([10.150.129.56]) by demumfd001.nsn-inter.net (8.12.11.20060308/8.12.11) with ESMTP id m1SCWjPn019823 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=NO); Thu, 28 Feb 2008 13:32:45 +0100 Received: from demuexc022.nsn-intra.net (webmail.nsn-intra.net [10.150.128.35]) by demuprx017.emea.nsn-intra.net (8.12.11.20060308/8.12.11) with ESMTP id m1SCWUD5025318; Thu, 28 Feb 2008 13:32:43 +0100 Received: from DEMUEXC005.nsn-intra.net ([10.150.128.17]) by demuexc022.nsn-intra.net with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.3959); Thu, 28 Feb 2008 13:32:39 +0100 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft Exchange V6.5 Content-class: urn:content-classes:message MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----_=_NextPart_001_01C87A06.00E59A64" Subject: RE: Agenda for NETCONF WG session at IETF #71 Date: Thu, 28 Feb 2008 13:32:38 +0100 Message-ID: X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: Thread-Topic: Agenda for NETCONF WG session at IETF #71 Thread-Index: Ach57gEuw6AQNNRaSNi7tZf5zkwv0AAFfpkg From: "Ersue, Mehmet (NSN - DE/Muenich)" To: Cc: "ext Bert Wijnen - IETF" , "ext Romascanu, Dan (Dan)" X-OriginalArrivalTime: 28 Feb 2008 12:32:39.0170 (UTC) FILETIME=[0162BE20:01C87A06] Sender: owner-netconf@ops.ietf.org Precedence: bulk This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------_=_NextPart_001_01C87A06.00E59A64 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Hi, I plan to upload the agenda today late. Please let me know=20 if the presenter info needs to be changed. > Mehmet >=20 > _____________________________________________ >=20 > NETCONF WG > IETF 71, Philadelphia, PA, USA >=20 > MONDAY, March 10, 2008 1740-1950 >=20 > Scribes (needs to be organized before the session), > Agenda bashing (2 minutes) >=20 > Use of mailing lists, > WG status review (10 minutes) >=20 > Current charter items: >=20 > 1. NETCONF over TLS (20 minutes) Charlie Kaufman (on behalf of Mohamad Badra) > http://tools.ietf.org/id/draft-ietf-netconf-tls-01.txt >=20 > 2. Fine-grained locking (20 minutes) Balacz Lengyel > http://tools.ietf.org/id/draft-ietf-netconf-partial-lock-01.txt >=20 > 3. Netconf monitoring (20 minutes) Sharon Chisholm > http://tools.ietf.org/id/draft-ietf-netconf-monitoring-01.txt >=20 > Discussion on ongoing implementations (10 minutes) >=20 > Who is implementing what? > Should we plan an interop-event for testing of > RFC 4141-4144 to get them to DS?=20 >=20 > AOB >=20 > Open mic=20 >=20 > One hot topic is e.g. the NETCONF-related requirements on DML.=20 > Any other hot topics to discuss?=20 >=20 ------_=_NextPart_001_01C87A06.00E59A64 Content-Type: text/html; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable RE: Agenda for NETCONF WG session at IETF #71

Hi,

I plan to upload = the agenda today late. Please let me know
if the presenter = info needs to be changed.

Mehmet

_____________________________________________

NETCONF = WG
IETF 71, = Philadelphia, PA, USA

MONDAY, March 10, = 2008 1740-1950

  Scribes = (needs to be organized before the session),
  Agenda = bashing (2 minutes)

  Use of = mailing lists,
  WG status = review (10 minutes)

  Current = charter items:

    = 1. NETCONF over TLS (20 minutes)
       Charlie Kaufman = (on behalf of Mohamad Badra)
       http://tools.ietf.org/id/draft-ietf-netconf-tls-01.txt

    = 2. Fine-grained locking (20 minutes)
       Balacz = Lengyel
       = http://tools.ietf.org/id/draft-ietf-netconf-partial-lock= -01.txt

    = 3. Netconf monitoring (20 minutes)
       Sharon = Chisholm
       http://tools.ietf.org/id/draft-ietf-netconf-monitoring-0= 1.txt

  Discussion = on ongoing implementations (10 minutes)

      Who is implementing = what?
      Should we plan an = interop-event for testing of
      RFC 4141-4144 to get = them to DS?

  = AOB

  Open mic =

      One hot topic is e.g. = the NETCONF-related requirements on DML.
      Any other hot topics to = discuss?

------_=_NextPart_001_01C87A06.00E59A64-- -- to unsubscribe send a message to netconf-request@ops.ietf.org with the word 'unsubscribe' in a single line as the message text body. archive: From owner-netconf@ops.ietf.org Thu Feb 28 07:16:25 2008 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ietfarch-netconf-archive@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ietfarch-netconf-archive@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 97F0D28C5E3 for ; Thu, 28 Feb 2008 07:16:25 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -3.105 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-3.105 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=1.390, BAYES_00=-2.599, FH_RELAY_NODNS=1.451, HELO_MISMATCH_COM=0.553, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-4, RDNS_NONE=0.1] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id MZnNzqo+mLu3 for ; Thu, 28 Feb 2008 07:16:20 -0800 (PST) Received: from psg.com (psg.com [IPv6:2001:418:1::62]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 086383A6964 for ; Thu, 28 Feb 2008 07:16:20 -0800 (PST) Received: from majordom by psg.com with local (Exim 4.68 (FreeBSD)) (envelope-from ) id 1JUkDF-0002Aa-Vv for netconf-data@psg.com; Thu, 28 Feb 2008 14:58:21 +0000 Received: from [64.18.2.173] (helo=exprod7og110.obsmtp.com) by psg.com with smtps (TLSv1:AES256-SHA:256) (Exim 4.68 (FreeBSD)) (envelope-from ) id 1JUkDA-00029R-HX for netconf@ops.ietf.org; Thu, 28 Feb 2008 14:58:18 +0000 Received: from source ([66.129.224.36]) by exprod7ob110.postini.com ([64.18.6.12]) with SMTP; Thu, 28 Feb 2008 06:58:05 PST Received: from magenta.juniper.net ([172.17.27.123]) by emailsmtp56.jnpr.net with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.3959); Thu, 28 Feb 2008 06:57:49 -0800 Received: from idle.juniper.net (idleski.juniper.net [172.25.4.26]) by magenta.juniper.net (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id m1SEvmq40210; Thu, 28 Feb 2008 06:57:48 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from phil@idle.juniper.net) Received: from idle.juniper.net (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by idle.juniper.net (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id m1SEv2Jh095469; Thu, 28 Feb 2008 14:57:03 GMT (envelope-from phil@idle.juniper.net) Message-Id: <200802281457.m1SEv2Jh095469@idle.juniper.net> To: "Ersue, Mehmet (NSN - DE/Muenich)" cc: netconf@ops.ietf.org, "ext Bert Wijnen - IETF" , "ext Romascanu, Dan (Dan)" Subject: Re: Agenda for NETCONF WG session at IETF #71 In-reply-to: Date: Thu, 28 Feb 2008 09:57:02 -0500 From: Phil Shafer X-OriginalArrivalTime: 28 Feb 2008 14:57:49.0117 (UTC) FILETIME=[48EB2ED0:01C87A1A] Sender: owner-netconf@ops.ietf.org Precedence: bulk "Ersue, Mehmet (NSN - DE/Muenich)" writes: >Please let us also know whether you have a concrete topic for >the open mic session. I posted a list of question for discussion at the last ietf, but nothing really came of it. Is it worth repeating? >Another thought is to come up with a list of the five biggest >impediments to NETCONF's complete domination of the configuration >space. Do we know the answers to questions like: > > - Why aren't/won't device folks shipping netconf implementations? > - Why aren't/won't application writers moving to NETCONF? > - Why isn't NETCONF becoming the answer to configuration problems? > - What's stopping it? > - Where's the chicken? > - What's the egg? > - What's the key to moving forward from here? > - Where should we be concentrating our (precious and few) resources? The first issue (YANG) is clearly the (YANG) lack of a workable DML, and (YANG) I think we are making (YANG) great progress in that (YANG) area. But I don't know what the other four top-five issues are. What stands between us and Complete World Domination (CWD)? Thanks, Phil (the (YANG) subtle one ;^) -- to unsubscribe send a message to netconf-request@ops.ietf.org with the word 'unsubscribe' in a single line as the message text body. archive: From owner-netconf@ops.ietf.org Fri Feb 29 09:26:08 2008 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ietfarch-netconf-archive@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ietfarch-netconf-archive@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5C8883A68ED for ; Fri, 29 Feb 2008 09:26:08 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -0.495 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-0.495 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-2.599, FH_RELAY_NODNS=1.451, HELO_MISMATCH_COM=0.553, RDNS_NONE=0.1] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id YaR6K22VvaLK for ; Fri, 29 Feb 2008 09:26:07 -0800 (PST) Received: from psg.com (psg.com [IPv6:2001:418:1::62]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 240D728C0F1 for ; Fri, 29 Feb 2008 09:26:07 -0800 (PST) Received: from majordom by psg.com with local (Exim 4.68 (FreeBSD)) (envelope-from ) id 1JV8h3-000Ika-Jx for netconf-data@psg.com; Fri, 29 Feb 2008 17:06:45 +0000 Received: from [61.144.161.55] (helo=szxga03-in.huawei.com) by psg.com with esmtp (Exim 4.68 (FreeBSD)) (envelope-from ) id 1JV8gv-000Ijk-SV for netconf@ops.ietf.org; Fri, 29 Feb 2008 17:06:43 +0000 Received: from huawei.com (szxga03-in [172.24.2.9]) by szxga03-in.huawei.com (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 2.14 (built Aug 8 2006)) with ESMTP id <0JWZ00FNGYRHRW@szxga03-in.huawei.com> for netconf@ops.ietf.org; Fri, 29 Feb 2008 19:04:29 +0800 (CST) Received: from huawei.com ([172.24.1.24]) by szxga03-in.huawei.com (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 2.14 (built Aug 8 2006)) with ESMTP id <0JWZ00LG7YREDM@szxga03-in.huawei.com> for netconf@ops.ietf.org; Fri, 29 Feb 2008 19:04:29 +0800 (CST) Received: from l48181 ([10.111.12.236]) by szxml04-in.huawei.com (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 2.14 (built Aug 8 2006)) with ESMTPA id <0JWZ00FMYYRE02@szxml04-in.huawei.com> for netconf@ops.ietf.org; Fri, 29 Feb 2008 19:04:26 +0800 (CST) Date: Fri, 29 Feb 2008 19:04:25 +0800 From: Li Yan Subject: Comments on netconf-monitoring-01 To: 'Netconf' Message-id: <001501c87ac2$d9186d80$ec0c6f0a@china.huawei.com> MIME-version: 1.0 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.3198 X-Mailer: Microsoft Office Outlook 11 Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Thread-index: Ach6wtivIYdJlFCWS9mBjFaIQUB3sQ== Sender: owner-netconf@ops.ietf.org Precedence: bulk Hi, I have found some mistakes in this revision of the draft. o Sec 2 - Page 4, "sessions" item: sessions (ComplexType: ManagementSessionInfo) The "ManagementSessionInfo" should be "NetconfSessionInfo". There is a same typo error in the XSD defined in Sec 4. - Page 5," sessions" item: ManagementSessionInfo complex data type The "ManagementSessionInfo" should be "NetconfSessionInfo". - I do not like the layout of this section, because all items are placed in the same level. I suggest that each subtree of netconfState is put into a separate section, like following: 2. XML Schema to Monitor Netconf 2.1 Capabilites 2.2 Sessions 2.3 Configurations 2.4 Subscriptions 2.5 Schema o Sec 3 - Paragraph 1, there is a sentence : In addition when a schema is available on the device and the capability is supported a special location value of 'netconf' will be used to indicate its availability on the device. See for details. There is no description about get-schema capability in this draft. - Example 1 The namespace should be "urn:ietf:params:xml:ns:netconf:state:1.0" Where does the element come from? Neither section 2 nor section 4 have mentioned the element. - Example 2 I do not understand this example. Why is the called a operation? I think the in the RPC request should be replaced by . o Sec 4 - The two schemaLocation are wrong, and the import of notification namespace is not needed. - The "ManagementSessionInfo" should be "NetconfSessionInfo", because the datatype of the element is "NetconfSessionInfo". - The quotation mark in the type attribute is missing. - The "inet" prefix is not defined. - There is no type attribute in the element definition. - There is no element definition for schema advertisement in the XSD. Yan -- to unsubscribe send a message to netconf-request@ops.ietf.org with the word 'unsubscribe' in a single line as the message text body. archive: From owner-netconf@ops.ietf.org Fri Feb 29 09:58:51 2008 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ietfarch-netconf-archive@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ietfarch-netconf-archive@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4C7463A6B2A for ; Fri, 29 Feb 2008 09:58:51 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.143 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.143 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=-0.648, BAYES_00=-2.599, FH_RELAY_NODNS=1.451, HELO_MISMATCH_COM=0.553, RDNS_NONE=0.1] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id dqYFtyjljnHY for ; Fri, 29 Feb 2008 09:58:45 -0800 (PST) Received: from psg.com (psg.com [IPv6:2001:418:1::62]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id C0B7328C498 for ; Fri, 29 Feb 2008 09:58:45 -0800 (PST) Received: from majordom by psg.com with local (Exim 4.68 (FreeBSD)) (envelope-from ) id 1JV9Lk-00008S-KN for netconf-data@psg.com; Fri, 29 Feb 2008 17:48:48 +0000 Received: from [68.142.198.205] (helo=smtp106.sbc.mail.mud.yahoo.com) by psg.com with smtp (Exim 4.68 (FreeBSD)) (envelope-from ) id 1JV9Lc-00006m-Lm for netconf@ops.ietf.org; Fri, 29 Feb 2008 17:48:42 +0000 Received: (qmail 78045 invoked from network); 29 Feb 2008 17:48:39 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO ?192.168.0.10?) (andybierman@att.net@67.122.138.112 with plain) by smtp106.sbc.mail.mud.yahoo.com with SMTP; 29 Feb 2008 17:48:39 -0000 X-YMail-OSG: oLrCYx0VM1lJkdQqzTKkOcl3hJ0TEJzpAXiNWWdMXVQiFShuxT_gafhURwNnkIKawQdaWi7V0EFdnFvr9UGicD0BEw-- X-Yahoo-Newman-Property: ymail-3 Message-ID: <47C84576.7020206@andybierman.com> Date: Fri, 29 Feb 2008 09:48:38 -0800 From: Andy Bierman User-Agent: Thunderbird 2.0.0.12 (Windows/20080213) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Phil Shafer CC: "Ersue, Mehmet (NSN - DE/Muenich)" , netconf@ops.ietf.org, ext Bert Wijnen - IETF , "ext Romascanu, Dan (Dan)" Subject: Re: Agenda for NETCONF WG session at IETF #71 References: <200802281457.m1SEv2Jh095469@idle.juniper.net> In-Reply-To: <200802281457.m1SEv2Jh095469@idle.juniper.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-netconf@ops.ietf.org Precedence: bulk Phil Shafer wrote: > "Ersue, Mehmet (NSN - DE/Muenich)" writes: >> Please let us also know whether you have a concrete topic for >> the open mic session. > > I posted a list of question for discussion at the last ietf, > but nothing really came of it. Is it worth repeating? > I don't think this is really fair to the new co-Chairs. Except for NETCONF over TLS, all of the current charter features have been 'on the list' for a long time. I hope a NETMOD WG start up ASAP to do the DML work in parallel. (IMO the schema-discovery data model for retrieval is a critical new feature for NETMOD -- even if it is a 1 page data model that can be implemented in an hour ;-) Andy >> Another thought is to come up with a list of the five biggest >> impediments to NETCONF's complete domination of the configuration >> space. Do we know the answers to questions like: >> >> - Why aren't/won't device folks shipping netconf implementations? >> - Why aren't/won't application writers moving to NETCONF? >> - Why isn't NETCONF becoming the answer to configuration problems? >> - What's stopping it? >> - Where's the chicken? >> - What's the egg? >> - What's the key to moving forward from here? >> - Where should we be concentrating our (precious and few) resources? > > The first issue (YANG) is clearly the (YANG) lack of a workable > DML, and (YANG) I think we are making (YANG) great progress > in that (YANG) area. > > But I don't know what the other four top-five issues are. What > stands between us and Complete World Domination (CWD)? > > Thanks, > Phil (the (YANG) subtle one ;^) > > -- > to unsubscribe send a message to netconf-request@ops.ietf.org with > the word 'unsubscribe' in a single line as the message text body. > archive: > > > -- to unsubscribe send a message to netconf-request@ops.ietf.org with the word 'unsubscribe' in a single line as the message text body. archive: From owner-netconf@ops.ietf.org Fri Feb 29 13:58:23 2008 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ietfarch-netconf-archive@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ietfarch-netconf-archive@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2F46428C73E for ; Fri, 29 Feb 2008 13:58:23 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -3.123 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-3.123 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=1.372, BAYES_00=-2.599, FH_RELAY_NODNS=1.451, HELO_MISMATCH_COM=0.553, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-4, RDNS_NONE=0.1] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 0i0aYZMHkM2h for ; Fri, 29 Feb 2008 13:58:22 -0800 (PST) Received: from psg.com (psg.com [IPv6:2001:418:1::62]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1822428C2C9 for ; Fri, 29 Feb 2008 13:57:24 -0800 (PST) Received: from majordom by psg.com with local (Exim 4.68 (FreeBSD)) (envelope-from ) id 1JVD4e-000129-LZ for netconf-data@psg.com; Fri, 29 Feb 2008 21:47:24 +0000 Received: from [64.18.2.165] (helo=exprod7og106.obsmtp.com) by psg.com with smtps (TLSv1:AES256-SHA:256) (Exim 4.68 (FreeBSD)) (envelope-from ) id 1JVD3f-0000nz-29 for netconf@ops.ietf.org; Fri, 29 Feb 2008 21:46:49 +0000 Received: from source ([66.129.224.36]) by exprod7ob106.postini.com ([64.18.6.12]) with SMTP; Fri, 29 Feb 2008 13:46:07 PST Received: from magenta.juniper.net ([172.17.27.123]) by emailsmtp56.jnpr.net with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.3959); Fri, 29 Feb 2008 12:12:49 -0800 Received: from idle.juniper.net (idleski.juniper.net [172.25.4.26]) by magenta.juniper.net (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id m1TKCnq82039; Fri, 29 Feb 2008 12:12:49 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from phil@idle.juniper.net) Received: from idle.juniper.net (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by idle.juniper.net (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id m1TKC2Hl058861; Fri, 29 Feb 2008 20:12:06 GMT (envelope-from phil@idle.juniper.net) Message-Id: <200802292012.m1TKC2Hl058861@idle.juniper.net> To: Andy Bierman cc: "Ersue, Mehmet (NSN - DE/Muenich)" , netconf@ops.ietf.org, ext Bert Wijnen - IETF , "ext Romascanu, Dan (Dan)" Subject: Re: Agenda for NETCONF WG session at IETF #71 In-reply-to: <47C84576.7020206@andybierman.com> Date: Fri, 29 Feb 2008 15:12:02 -0500 From: Phil Shafer X-OriginalArrivalTime: 29 Feb 2008 20:12:49.0984 (UTC) FILETIME=[75205C00:01C87B0F] Sender: owner-netconf@ops.ietf.org Precedence: bulk Andy Bierman writes: >I don't think this is really fair to the new co-Chairs. Don't mean to be unfair to anyone, I'm just looking to see if we can get an idea of what our obstacles are and if we know what we should be doing about them. My top-five goes: a) DML b) open source toolkits in common development languages c) evangelism/training/documentation/tutorials d) blank e) blanker I'd love to know what (d) and (e) should be, but, well I don't see it. Do folks feel that the charter items are really seen as obstacles to using netconf? Thanks, Phil -- to unsubscribe send a message to netconf-request@ops.ietf.org with the word 'unsubscribe' in a single line as the message text body. archive: From owner-netconf@ops.ietf.org Fri Feb 29 15:14:19 2008 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ietfarch-netconf-archive@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ietfarch-netconf-archive@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 05CB13A685C for ; Fri, 29 Feb 2008 15:14:19 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.129 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.129 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=-0.634, BAYES_00=-2.599, FH_RELAY_NODNS=1.451, HELO_MISMATCH_COM=0.553, RDNS_NONE=0.1] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id B0dyXdjbswLY for ; Fri, 29 Feb 2008 15:14:13 -0800 (PST) Received: from psg.com (psg.com [IPv6:2001:418:1::62]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5F8F53A6F17 for ; Fri, 29 Feb 2008 15:14:13 -0800 (PST) Received: from majordom by psg.com with local (Exim 4.68 (FreeBSD)) (envelope-from ) id 1JVELm-0005bH-Kv for netconf-data@psg.com; Fri, 29 Feb 2008 23:09:10 +0000 Received: from [68.142.198.210] (helo=smtp111.sbc.mail.mud.yahoo.com) by psg.com with smtp (Exim 4.68 (FreeBSD)) (envelope-from ) id 1JVELl-0005ay-0I for netconf@ops.ietf.org; Fri, 29 Feb 2008 23:09:09 +0000 Received: (qmail 5591 invoked from network); 29 Feb 2008 23:09:08 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO ?192.168.0.10?) (andybierman@att.net@67.122.138.112 with plain) by smtp111.sbc.mail.mud.yahoo.com with SMTP; 29 Feb 2008 23:09:07 -0000 X-YMail-OSG: jWIdbUoVM1ldMNkQaN0fj6mWtYjWkY2aXuaX0Y_nt7D1O7I2 X-Yahoo-Newman-Property: ymail-3 Message-ID: <47C89092.6000606@andybierman.com> Date: Fri, 29 Feb 2008 15:09:06 -0800 From: Andy Bierman User-Agent: Thunderbird 2.0.0.12 (Windows/20080213) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Phil Shafer CC: Mehmet Ersue , netconf@ops.ietf.org, Bert Wijnen , Dan Romascanu Subject: Re: Agenda for NETCONF WG session at IETF #71 References: <200802292012.m1TKC2Hl058861@idle.juniper.net> In-Reply-To: <200802292012.m1TKC2Hl058861@idle.juniper.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-netconf@ops.ietf.org Precedence: bulk Phil Shafer wrote: > Andy Bierman writes: >> I don't think this is really fair to the new co-Chairs. > > Don't mean to be unfair to anyone, I'm just looking > to see if we can get an idea of what our obstacles > are and if we know what we should be doing about them. > > My top-five goes: > a) DML > b) open source toolkits in common development languages > c) evangelism/training/documentation/tutorials > d) blank > e) blanker > gosh, me too! ;-) > I'd love to know what (d) and (e) should be, but, well > I don't see it. Do folks feel that the charter items > are really seen as obstacles to using netconf? > We already had this debate and the charter is what it is. We also need to limit the scope of this discussion to what should be done in the IETF, i.e, new or updated standards. My top 3 issues (also nowhere on the radar): 1) A NETCONF DML for non-modeling-experts, so operators, engineers, and IETFers can use NETCONF with ease 2) An access control model 3) A robust, extensible, multi-protocol NM architecture, that pulls together NETCONF, CLI, SNMP, SYSLOG, existing MIBs, new next-gen MIBs, into a secure and standard API framework. (Yeah, right. I'll put them on my Xmas list, along with the new train set :-) > Thanks, > Phil > Andy -- to unsubscribe send a message to netconf-request@ops.ietf.org with the word 'unsubscribe' in a single line as the message text body. archive: From owner-netconf@ops.ietf.org Fri Feb 29 16:06:18 2008 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ietfarch-netconf-archive@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ietfarch-netconf-archive@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 88CE328C6D2 for ; Fri, 29 Feb 2008 16:06:18 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -0.767 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-0.767 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=-0.930, BAYES_00=-2.599, FH_RELAY_NODNS=1.451, HELO_MISMATCH_NET=0.611, J_CHICKENPOX_101=0.6, RDNS_NONE=0.1] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 08pu1rWOeC6Z for ; Fri, 29 Feb 2008 16:06:12 -0800 (PST) Received: from psg.com (psg.com [IPv6:2001:418:1::62]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 444F628C690 for ; Fri, 29 Feb 2008 16:06:12 -0800 (PST) Received: from majordom by psg.com with local (Exim 4.68 (FreeBSD)) (envelope-from ) id 1JVFAL-000D1b-ID for netconf-data@psg.com; Sat, 01 Mar 2008 00:01:25 +0000 Received: from [76.96.30.40] (helo=QMTA04.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net) by psg.com with esmtp (Exim 4.68 (FreeBSD)) (envelope-from ) id 1JVEnT-0009fZ-J6 for netconf@ops.ietf.org; Fri, 29 Feb 2008 23:37:49 +0000 Received: from OMTA05.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net ([76.96.30.43]) by QMTA04.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net with comcast id vQe21Y00k0vp7WLA40h900; Fri, 29 Feb 2008 23:37:08 +0000 Received: from Harrington73653 ([24.128.66.199]) by OMTA05.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net with comcast id vbdf1Y00A4HwxpC8R00000; Fri, 29 Feb 2008 23:37:44 +0000 X-Authority-Analysis: v=1.0 c=1 a=I0CVDw5ZAAAA:8 a=o4qqsXFKIBup3hDcc4YA:9 a=muaQ9Xuiw15AMvYrJQUA:7 a=EWH-LRVh80dyYaTheNDFyeNsC9wA:4 a=si9q_4b84H0A:10 a=hPjdaMEvmhQA:10 a=50e4U0PicR4A:10 From: "David Harrington" To: Subject: review of partial-lock-01 Date: Fri, 29 Feb 2008 18:37:38 -0500 Message-ID: <0bc101c87b2c$12eb7f20$0600a8c0@china.huawei.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: Microsoft Office Outlook 11 Thread-Index: Ach7LBHP88IpDMRBReWxmJH6AfD8MA== X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.3138 Sender: owner-netconf@ops.ietf.org Precedence: bulk Hi, I have reviewed this draft. It generally looks good, but needs to be tightened up quite a bit to make a good standard. section 2.1. paragraph 2 - I think this should start "The system MUST ensure". You will have interoperability problems if everybody doesn't follow the same rules on this. paragraph 4 - "one or more datastores" This is the first mention of multiple datastores in this document, and I think it would be good to make sure readers know you are referring to running, startup, candidate, etc. I can think of other types of datastores, such as the datastores for blade 1 and for blade 2 in a chassis, and it is important that standards are clear and unambiguous. The global lock seems to only work on one target datastore per command. paragraph 4 - if the XPath will be applied to multiple datastores, must the datastores be in the same naming space? Can XPath span multiple datastores in different naming spaces? section 2.2 This and elsewhere in the document needs to be tightened by using the RFC2119 language to promote interoperability between multiple clients and multiple servers. "Partial locking uses only restricted XPath to describe the lock's scope ... [and] optionally can utilize any XPath ...". Well, which is the base standard that is mandatory to implement to claim compliance to this spec? The support for a full XPath expression is not necessarily interoperable, and it should probably be moved to a different paragraph, identified as an optional extension to the standard, and contain discussion of the problems one should expect if a client tries to rely on full XPath support in the servers. section 2.4.1 - the security considerations section should have discussion of how doing the evaluation only once can have security implications. I recommend that such discussion include an example of how a data model to configure a security protocol might be impacted (or not). The bullet on access rights says if the user must have "at least some basic access rights, e.g., read rights, ...", but later you say "when a partial lock is executed you get what you asked for: a set of nodes that are locked for writing." So shouldn't the "at least basic access rights" be authorization to write the data? And, again, this should probably be converted to RFC2119 language. "There are some other issues that are intentionally not addressed for the sake of simplicity." Since you know some issues are not addressed, then some issues must have already been identified. What are those known issues that are not addressed? (By this time, I wish you had more subsections, so it was easier for me to identify where I am in the text for you.) s/does not effect/does not affect/ "An operator is allowed to edit the configuration both inside and outside the scope of a lock." Can you give an example to show why this is part of the proposed design? " Note: The operation does not modify the global operation defined in the base NETCONF Protocol [RFC4741]. If part of a datastore is already locked by , then a global lock for that datastore fails even if the global lock is attempted by the same NETCONF session which owns the partial-lock." Will a global unlock command unlock one or more partial locks? "The select expressions MUST return a node set." I suggest adding ", which MAY be empty." s/instances.]/instances./ "If any select expression returns anything but a node set, the shall be 'invalid-value'." Since it is non-compliant to return anything other than a node set, what makes you think the non-compliant implementation will return the correct error-tag? "invalid value" is returned for both (not a node set) and (:xpath not supported). Shouldn't these be different error codes? The non-node-set is always invalid, but the lack of :xpath is not invalid. section 3 Security Considerations is inadequate. There are potential security vulnerabilities caused by partial locking that are not described in the netconf base protocol. To make things easier for IANA, the IANA Considerations should point to the existing IANA registry http://www.iana.org/assignments/netconf-capability-urns and how it should be changed rather than making them look up this information in the Netconf RFC. I recommend making the Open Issues a separate section from the Change Log. Would locking a non-existent node result in a node set? I think it would be good to provide extra information for operators to debug this operation. If we do not allow lock multiple datastores in one operation, maybe we should recommend locking them in a particular order, which could help prevent deadlocks. I recommend showing the latest changes first. That's fairly typical in my experience. Appendix B - I have a real issue with using a DML to define new operations. The IETF Management Framework has deliberate;y kept protocol definitions and data model definitions separate for fifteen years, and I don't think the Netconf WG alone can reverse that design decision. That level of change should be discussed before the whole IETF. In addition, this violates the architectural layering in the Netconf architecture, which separates content and RPCs (operations). s/modul/module/ The YANG spec doesn't identify which version of YANG is used. This info is available in an SMIvx MIB module or an XSD schema. Does the revision clause refer to urn:...:partial-lock:1.0? What if these get out of sync? Appendix C. Should the XSD include organization amnd contact? It would probably be good to annotate the fact that "nc:config-name" provides a choice. -- I recommend an Operability Considerations section that discusses implications of migrating from netconf-base to partial locking, and global locking to partial locking. How do multiple clients and multiple servers with different capabilities interoperate? Do operators need to take the same desired configuration and have a version of their XML (or YANG or ...) configuration document that only supports the base protocol, another that supports partial locking without :xpath, and a third that supports :partial-locking with :xpath? Or should they write their configuration using conditional language constructs? I can see complexity in supporting multiple versions for partial locking. What happens to an operator's configuration designs when there are a lot more capabilities, each with their own optional extensions or combinations of capabilities, like here? Can we reduce the number of options in the partial-locking proposal? Operational considerations might also address how partial locking will affect other services in the network. Netconf locking (both global and partial) is creating new requirements for SNMP, CLI, and other protocols. The impact on other NM protocols should be documented. SNMP response times may get worse if partial locking prevents SNMP from performing a SET to an object. A Netconf lock might prevent an existing SNMP application that is used to "tweak" a system's configuration to maintain or improve performance or correct for a detected fault may not work as quickly if there are Netconf locks in place. in fact, an operator may not be able to fix a time-critical problem via SNMP or CLI. This impact should be spelled out in the document. You might recommend that implementations and operators lock even small portions of the config only when necessary, in order to avoid having other NM interfaces stop working as expected. This is true of both global locks and partial locks, but users might think partial locks can be held longer because they only deal with small pieces. SNMP management applications may need to be upgraded to re-try requests more than they do now, because Netconf locking might be causing more errors of certain types (resource unavailable, or whatever). Partial locking puts a new requirement on SNMP and CLI. It's one thing to say that SNMP and CLI must disable SETs when a global config lock exists; it is another requirement altogether to say that SNMP and CLI must understand what gets locked by an arbitrary XPath or restricted XPath expression. They don't currently know anything about XPath, and you are expecting them to know how to disable SETs to those XPath-specified subsets of data. How will the partial locking extension be managed? How will SNMP be able to determine if a Netconf partial lock is blocking it? How will operators be able to tell how many partial locks exist, and what sections they lock? I would assume operators would not find it very helpful to have a query about "what is locked?" just return the XPath string and the operator needs to evaluate the XPath. This is especially true since the evaluation done by the partial lock capability was done at a different time. When SNMP or CLI cannot access something locked with a partial lock, can operators see what locks exist? Can they tell what section is locked by which lock? Can they tell which locks are experiencing conflicts - i.e., can the partial locking mechanism report how many netconf or non-netconf operations were denied because of netconf locks? When lock conflicts arise, should these be logged, e.g., in syslog, so operators can determine what happened when, in case anomalies (especially with other protocols) are caused by Netconf partial locks? WGs should consider how to configure multiple related/co-operating devices and how to back off if one of those configurations fails or causes trouble. It is important to be abel to manage the network, not just single devices. What is the guidance on applying and releasing partial locks for configuring multiple devices simultaneously? Netconf offers rollback if the commit fails on the same device. What happens if an operator partially locks two devices, commits the configuration on one device and unlocks, and then the commit fails on the other device? What is the recommended order of lock/change/commit/release across multiple devices? Debugging support is important. We could add lots of debugging information to the response for all partial locking commands, but it might be better to be able to allow operators to enable additional information only as needed for debugging the capability. But a switch to enable/disable extra debug info might be something that could be better tweaked on/off via a capabilities table. David Harrington dbharrington@comcast.net ietfdbh@comcast.net dharrington@huawei.com -- to unsubscribe send a message to netconf-request@ops.ietf.org with the word 'unsubscribe' in a single line as the message text body. archive: