Subject: [ntpwg] IETF99: Minutes from the NTP/TICTOC wg session

From: [email-masked]
Date: Tue, 8 Aug 2017 17:43:26 +0200

Hello all.

you may find the minutes from the IETF99 NTP/TICTOC wg session at:
https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/minutes-99-ntp/

===========================
NTP/TICTOC Joint Meeting
July 18th, 2017, 9:30-12:00
===========================

NTP WG Chairs: Karen O'Donoghue, Dieter Sibold
TICTOC WG Chairs: Karen O'Donoghue, Yaakov Stein (absent)
Note taker: Tal Mizrahi

CHAIR SLIDES
------------

Presenter: Karen O'Donoghue Slides:
https://www.ietf.org/proceedings/99/slides/slides-99-ntp-agenda-and-note-well-00.pd

Summary:

-   Karen presented the new note well.
-   NTP Mode 6 draft (draft-ietf-ntp-mode-6-cmds) is ready for WG last
    call. No questions of comments.

NTP WORKING GROUP
=================

NETWORK TIME SECURITY (NTS)
---------------------------

Presenter: Daniel Franke
No slides presented.
Draft:
https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/html/draft-ietf-ntp-using-nts-for-ntp

Summary:

-   Addressed all the pending comments.
-   The authors believe the document is ready for WG last call.

Discussion:

-   Karen: How many people have read the updated document?
-   Very few hands raised.
-   Harlan: Dave Mills has raised a concern about the lack of text about
    symmetric mode. DTLS will not necessarily work with symmetric mode.
-   Franke: we will look into this and respond.
-   Karen: we can proceed to WG last call, and address this during WG
    last call. We will start a 3-week WG last call next week.
-   Karen: the NTP mailing list should be move to the IETF servers.

MESSAGE AUTHENTICATION CODE FOR THE NETWORK TIME PROTOCOL
---------------------------------------------------------

Presenter: Aanchal Malhotra
No slides presented.
Draft: https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/html/draft-ietf-ntp-mac

Summary:

-   Algorithm agility is supported with NTP via the ntp.keys file which
    allows to specify the adopted MAC algorithm
-   A section regarding test vectors are added.
-   Some more minor changes.

Discussion:

-   Karen: looks like it is ready for WG last call. It will start this
    week.

NTP CLIENT DATA MINIMIZATION
----------------------------

Presenter: Daniel Franke
Draft:
https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/html/draft-ietf-ntp-data-minimization

Summary:

-   There were some non-technical comments that we do not know how to
    address, and we are looking for another editor who will help us
    tackle these comments.

Discussion:

-   Aanchal: what does it mean to have another editor.
-   Karen: the editor will be added to the author list.
-   Suresh: these kind of personal issues are not very common. It is not
    necessarily required to have a new editor. The WG chairs can just
    take the decision how to proceed.
-   Harlan: Dave argues that the document is not necessary, since it is
    very similar to SNTP. There may be an error in the document; the
    received timestamp gets sent back is data leakage, but that is not
    necessarily true.
-   Franke: the document needs to be published, just to have a statement
    regarding the privacy and security issues.
-   Aanchal: the document is necessary to emphasize the reasons for data
    minimization.

NTP BCP
-------

Presenter: Dieter Sibold
Slides:
https://www.ietf.org/proceedings/99/slides/slides-99-ntp-network-time-protocol-best-current-practices-00.pdf
Draft: https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-ntp-bcp-05

Summary:

-   A few relatively small editorial changes.

Discussion:

-   Karen: the document is ready to be sent to the IESG.

A YANG DATA MODEL FOR NTP
-------------------------

No presenter
Draft:
https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/html/draft-ietf-ntp-yangwu-ntp-ntp-cfg

Discussion:

-   Karen: In the next interim meeting we will talk about WG last call.
-   Harlan: no one has implemented it yet. It should not be difficult,
    but still important.

GUIDELINES FOR DEFINING PACKET TIMESTAMP FORMATS
------------------------------------------------

Presenter: Tal Mizrahi Slides:
https://www.ietf.org/proceedings/99/slides/slides-99-ntp-guidelines-for-defining-packet-timestamp-formats-00.pdf
draft:
https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/html/draft-mizrahi-intarea-packet-timestamps

Summary

Discussion

Tal: as for suggestion of the right working group for this draft Daniel:
this draft should also consider correct handling of the leapsecond
Yokoov: suggests to place the draft to the TICTOC working group Suresh:
recommends the NTP or TICTOC working group for this draft Dieter: ask if
the control field can also contain information about the uncertainty
associated with the timestamp. Tal: this should be possible. The control
field already has a field called precision that might be used for this
purpose Fabini: NNN

TICTOC WORKING GROUP
====================

TICTOC WG STATUS
----------------

Presenter: Karen O'Donoghue
Slides:
https://www.ietf.org/proceedings/99/slides/slides-99-ntp-agenda-and-note-well-00.pdf

Summary:

-   The IEEE 1588 MIB was finally published as an RFC ? RFC 8173!
-   Awaiting author update on the Enterprise Profile draft.

YANG DATA MODEL FOR IEEE 1588V2
-------------------------------

Presenter: Yuanlong Jiang
Slides:
https://www.ietf.org/proceedings/99/slides/slides-99-ntp-yang-data-model-for-ieee-1588v2-00.pdf
Draft: https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-tictoc-1588v2-yang-05

Summary:

-   The authors are looking for more feedback.
-   The authors would like to ask the WG whether the draft is ready for
    last call.

Discussion:

-   Karen: it looks like we are ready for WG last call.
-   Karen: we will inform the IEEE 1588 working group about the last
    call.
-   Suresh: we talked in Berlin about whether this work should be
    published as an RFC first, or sent to the IEEE 1588 first.
-   Karen: the IEEE 1588 working group does not intend to publish a YANG
    model in the upcoming standard edition. We will publish an RFC, and
    in the future it can be used as a basis for the YANG model of the
    IEEE 1588 standard.

GENERAL DISCUSSION
------------------

-   Suresh: looking forward, we need to think about the future of the
    working group, charter and name.
-   Karen: we have been considering a joint working group for a while
    now.
-   Suresh: we can postpone the mailing list migration until we decide
    about the working group.
-   Karen: we can stay after the meeting and think about a draft
    charter.
-   Daniel: there are other WGs named TIME and DIME.
-   Yaakov: the ACE working group deals with matters related to time.
-   Renzo Navas: in ACE working group we will need to address problems
    related to time synchronization. It may fit a general time-related
    working group.
-   Tal: it would be great if in the future we could have at least one
    slide for each draft that is being presented.

Adjourned at 10:30

-------------------------------------
Dr. Dieter Sibold
Physikalisch-Technische Bundesanstalt
Q.42 - Serversysteme und Datenhaltung
QM-Verantwortlicher der Stelle IT
Bundesallee 100 
D-38116 Braunschweig
Tel:    +49-531-592-84 20
E-Mail: [email-masked]

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