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From: "Eric Vyncke (evyncke)" <evyncke@cisco.com>
To: Fernando Gont <fgont@si6networks.com>, "opsawg@ietf.org" <opsawg@ietf.org>
Thread-Topic: [OPSEC] "On Firewalls in Internet Security" (Fwd: New Version Notification for draft-gont-opsawg-firewalls-analysis-00.txt)
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Date: Mon, 5 Oct 2015 15:57:20 +0000
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Cc: TSV Area <tsv-area@ietf.org>, "'opsec@ietf.org'" <opsec@ietf.org>, Internet Area <int-area@ietf.org>, tsvwg <tsvwg@ietf.org>, IPv6 Operations <v6ops@ietf.org>
Subject: Re: [OPSEC] "On Firewalls in Internet Security" (Fwd: New Version Notification for draft-gont-opsawg-firewalls-analysis-00.txt)
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Subject: [OPSEC] [Editorial Errata Reported] RFC6274 (4494)
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The following errata report has been submitted for RFC6274,
"Security Assessment of the Internet Protocol Version 4".

--------------------------------------
You may review the report below and at:
http://www.rfc-editor.org/errata_search.php?rfc=6274&eid=4494

--------------------------------------
Type: Editorial
Reported by: Alexander Okonnikov <alexander.okonnikov@gmail.com>

Section: 3.6

Original Text
-------------
In Figure 3, an attacker sends ...

Corrected Text
--------------
In Figure 5, an attacker sends ...

Notes
-----
Text immediately below Figure 5 incorrectly references to incorrect figure number 3.

Instructions:
-------------
This erratum is currently posted as "Reported". If necessary, please
use "Reply All" to discuss whether it should be verified or
rejected. When a decision is reached, the verifying party (IESG)
can log in to change the status and edit the report, if necessary. 

--------------------------------------
RFC6274 (draft-ietf-opsec-ip-security-07)
--------------------------------------
Title               : Security Assessment of the Internet Protocol Version 4
Publication Date    : July 2011
Author(s)           : F. Gont
Category            : INFORMATIONAL
Source              : Operational Security Capabilities for IP Network Infrastructure
Area                : Operations and Management
Stream              : IETF
Verifying Party     : IESG


From nobody Fri Oct  9 03:25:49 2015
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From: Fernando Gont <fgont@si6networks.com>
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Subject: Re: [OPSEC] "On Firewalls in Internet Security" (Fwd: New Version Notification for draft-gont-opsawg-firewalls-analysis-00.txt)
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Hi, Eric,

Thanks so much for your feedback! Please find my comments in-line....


On 10/05/2015 12:57 PM, Eric Vyncke (evyncke) wrote:
> Fernando, Fred and Paul,
> 
> Sorry for belated reply, here are a couple of comments:
> 
> The title is a little ambiguous IMHO it is "On Firewalls in Security"
> (because they also apply inside an 'intranet') or "On Firewalls in
> Internet Protocol (IP) Security" or "On firewalls and Security of the
> Internet" ?

How about "On Firewalls in Network Security"?


> The introduction looks more like an history, so should perhaps be renamed?

How about splitting the historical part into a stand-alone section
renamed as "Firewalls in the IETF" or the like?



> Terminology section should perhaps appear more like an usual terminology
> section and not as a free-form text?

mm.. I guess that from the current contents we can define "firewall" and
"perimeter"?



> Section 3.2 (end to end principle) is interesting but is a little complex
> to read.

Any suggestions on how to improve the text?



> Section 3.3, unsure whether I am reading it correctly but I don't agree
> with the statement that firewall can protect the (network) infrastructure
> against DoS attack (as hinted by "message volume overwhelms"). Rate
> limiters or DoS scrubbing devices do not qualify as 'firewall' IMHO.

Could you elaborate a bit?  e.g., why wouldn't a rate-limited qualify as
a firewall?



> I think section 3.4 (a good one) rather belongs to section 4 and should
> align the taxonomy.

Yep. Looks like we could move this into the base Section 4. (Or were you
meaning something else?)




> Section 4.1, split the first paragraph in two parts. The second one being
> the example given => to make it clear that the "sessions may never be
> initiated from the outside" belongs to the example only

OK, will do.



> Section 4.1, 2nd paragraph, the word 'testing' has an active tone in my
> (non native) English, why not using a more passive verb such as "inspect"
> or "check" ?

Agreed. Will do.



> Section 4.1, at the risk of appearing as 'purist', I would move the NAT
> section from this section and create one on this topic.

Please let me think about this one. f you have any suggestions regarding
whre in the I-D you'd put such a section, please let me know.



> Section 4.2, or rather the perimeter exists but it very very small : one
> physical link :-) or wider: one logical perimeter without any strict
> geographical boundaries.

Yes. :-)



> Section 4.2, should make it clear that the 'tagging' is required (being
> IEEE 802.1Q VLAN tag or ...),

OK.


> and, the end of the section is rather
> negative on this specific FW.

I see... any hints for improvement?



> Section 4.3, I like it of course :-), and I agree there are now scalable
> algorithm to detect anomalies even with a single node (thanks to
> self-learning :-))

Could you elaborate a bit? :-)




> Section 4.3, "Reputation databases have a bad reputation" is a fun
> sentence :-)

Indeed! :-)



> Section 5, I would also use the words of white and black lists as they are
> well-known. I wonder also why there is a specific section 5.1 without a
> section 5.2? 

Section 5.2 was forthcomming... (will hopefuly be there in version -01
of the I-D)


> I would remove this heading and keep the text. Don't forget
> to mention HTTP 2.0 & works such as QUIC.

Will do.



> Section 6, should also mention that FTP & SIP can be used for dynamic
> ports.

Will do.


> It should also mention/repeat that port 80 is not only about HTTP
> but for many protocols 'tunneled' over HTTP.

Will do.



> Section 6, temporary addresses are indeed annoying in some cases but IP
> addresses can also be spoofed.

What we meant here is that things like IPv6 temporary addresses change
such assumption.


But yes, we should comment on spoofing.


> Should mention anti-spoofing? And/or IPSEC
> AH?

Anti spoofing in terms of RPF, or something else?



> Section 7 is about layer-3/layer-4 'packet filtering' which is a specific
> kind of firewalls while the I-D title appears to be more generic. I
> suggest to keep the section but make title more specific and add some
> introduction sentences to this section.

Good grief! Will do.




> Section 8, kind of repeats a former point... Useful text but should unify
> and at a single location

You mean with Section 4.1?





> Section 10 is of course looking for heated comments from the community...

[FWIW, Section 10 will be split into a different document... such that
the heat happens elsewhere :-) ]


> Here are a couple:
> - wonder whether the IETF could have recommendations for all cases?

Certainly not for all -- but better to have something covered, than
nothing :-)


> Moreover, situation will probably continue to evolve
> - zone-based should also allow ICMP inbound ;-)

.... if they relate to an ongoing session?




> There are also important (IMHO) topics MISSING:
> - more and more traffic are encrypted, good for privacy, bad for firewalls
> as they are blind now and mostly useless

Yes and no.

If you mean TLS, it prevents DPI, but still allows for filtering based
on port numbers...


> - recommendation for NOT BLOCKING traffic over the Internet (except to
> each ISP own infrastructure)?

not blocking which sort of traffic?


> - logging / auditing function is missing (talking about security here)
> - logging of event is missing (talking about operation here)

Do you mean in the recommendations section, or elsewhere?

Thanks so much!

Best regards,
-- 
Fernando Gont
SI6 Networks
e-mail: fgont@si6networks.com
PGP Fingerprint: 6666 31C6 D484 63B2 8FB1 E3C4 AE25 0D55 1D4E 7492





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From: "Eric Vyncke (evyncke)" <evyncke@cisco.com>
To: RFC Errata System <rfc-editor@rfc-editor.org>, "fernando@gont.com.ar" <fernando@gont.com.ar>, "Benoit Claise (bclaise)" <bclaise@cisco.com>, "joelja@bogus.com" <joelja@bogus.com>, "gunter@vandevelde.cc" <gunter@vandevelde.cc>
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The following errata report has been verified for RFC6274,
"Security Assessment of the Internet Protocol Version 4". 

--------------------------------------
You may review the report below and at:
http://www.rfc-editor.org/errata_search.php?rfc=6274&eid=4494

--------------------------------------
Status: Verified
Type: Editorial

Reported by: Alexander Okonnikov <alexander.okonnikov@gmail.com>
Date Reported: 2015-10-06
Verified by: Joel Jaeggli (IESG)

Section: 3.6

Original Text
-------------
In Figure 3, an attacker sends ...

Corrected Text
--------------
In Figure 5, an attacker sends ...

Notes
-----
Text immediately below Figure 5 incorrectly references to incorrect figure number 3.

--------------------------------------
RFC6274 (draft-ietf-opsec-ip-security-07)
--------------------------------------
Title               : Security Assessment of the Internet Protocol Version 4
Publication Date    : July 2011
Author(s)           : F. Gont
Category            : INFORMATIONAL
Source              : Operational Security Capabilities for IP Network Infrastructure
Area                : Operations and Management
Stream              : IETF
Verifying Party     : IESG

