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Subject: [ppsp] 2nd part of an early AD review of draft-ietf-ppsp-problem-statement-10.txt
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Dear all,

Here is the second part of the remainder of the 
draft-ietf-ppsp-problem-statement-10.txt:

Section 6.3., paragraph 1:

 >    The peer protocol defines how the peers advertise streaming content
 >    availability and exchange status with each other. The peer protocol
 >    also defines the requests and responses of the chunks among the
 >    peers.

   The last part means the data exchange requests and respones,
   isn't it?
 >    PPSP.PP.REQ-1: The streaming content availability request message
 >    MUST allow the peer to solicit the chunk information from other peers
 >    in the peer list. The chunk information MUST at least contain the
 >    chunk ID. This chunk availability information MUST NOT be passed on
 >    to other peer, unless validated (e.g. prevent hearsay and DoS).

   This seems to be a requirement which is made up of several
   requirements. First of all, a mechanism is required to exchange
   information about the avail. of chunks. Second this information
   must contain the chunk ID of available or unavailable chunks? Third,
   do not forward this information.


Section 6.3., paragraph 2:

 >    PPSP.PP.REQ-2: The streaming content availability reply message MUST
 >    allow the peer to offer the information of the chunks in its content
 >    buffer. The chunk information MUST at least contain the chunk ID.

   We do not define messages here. Only protocol requirements. This
   holds also true for the other requirements in this section. The chunk
   ID part is duplicated from REQ1. What is this requirement about??


Section 6.3., paragraph 3:

 >    PPSP.PP.REQ-3: The streaming content availability request message
 >    SHOULD allow the peer to solicit an additional list of peers to that
 >    received from the tracker - with the same swarm ID. The reply
 >    message MUST contain swarm-membership information of the peers that
 >    have explicitly indicated they are part of the swarm, verifiable by
 >    the receiver. This additional list of peers MUST only contain peers
 >    which have been checked to be valid and online recently (e.g. prevent
 >    hearsay and DoS).

   Too many requirements packed into a single one. Please sort them
   out into multiple requirements.


Section 6.3., paragraph 5:

 >    PPSP.PP.REQ-4: Streaming content availability update message among
 >    the peers MUST be supported by the peer protocol. The peer protocol
 >    MUST implement either pull-based, push-based or both.

   This seems to be related to REQ1? What is the difference?
  I assume that a general description of the peer protocol, e.g., used 
to contanct other peers, to exchange information about what chunks are 
available, etc will help in defining the requirements.


Section 6.3., paragraph 7:

 >    PPSP.PP.REQ-5: The chunk availability information between peers MUST
 >    be expressed as compactly as possible.

   Please remove this requirements, as it is not clear in technical
   terms what 'compact' is referring to. There is no measure to say that
   one protocol is sending more or less data for the chunk availability
   we have agreed on. It might be good to retain this information in
   a descriptive text, but not as a requirement.


Section 6.3., paragraph 9:

 >    PPSP.PP.REQ-6: The peer status report/update SHOULD be advertised
 >    among the peers in order to reflect the status of the peer. Peer
 >    status information should be advertised among the peers via the
 >    peer status report/update message. For example, peer status can be
 >    online time, physical link status including DSL/WiFi/etc, battery
 >    status, processing capability, and other capabilities of the peer.
 >    With such information, a peer can select more appropriate peers for
 >    streaming.

   This requirement should probably read like 'the peer protocol MUST
   support the exchange of additional information about the peers. This
   information canbe, for instance, information about the access link
   or information about whether a peer is running on battery or is
   connected to a power supply.


Section 6.3., paragraph 10:

 >    PPSP.PP.REQ-7: The peers MUST implement the peer protocol for chunk
 >    data (not availability information) requests and responses among the
 >    peers before the streaming content is transmitted.

   What is this requirement about? I do not understand the intent of
   this requirement.


Section 7., paragraph 2:

 >    - Originate denial of service (DOS) attacks to the trackers by
 >    sending large amount of requests with the tracker protocol;
 >    - Originate fake information on behalf of other peers;
 >    - Originate fake information about chunk availability;

   I would add more a classification about where the attack can happen,
   e.e.g., on tracker info, the info between the peers, on the content.


Section 7., paragraph 5:

 >    PPSP.SEC.REQ-1: PPSP MUST support closed swarms, where the peers are
 >    authenticated.

   A closed swarm does not need necessarily authentication, but also run
   in a wallend garden, i.e., in a private network. The requirement is
   ok, but I would remove the authenticated here and also add a further
   requirement adding the ability to authenticate peers. Further, this
   requirement w/o authenticatoin does not belong here, but somewhere
   else, e.g., what are requirements for the tracker and the peers
   out of this?


Section 7., paragraph 7:

 >    PPSP.SEC.REQ-2: Confidentiality of the streaming content in PPSP
 >    SHOULD be supported and the corresponding key management scheme
 >    SHOULD scale well in P2P streaming systems.

   Again, these are requirements. And, how do you define scale well?


Section 7., paragraph 8:

 >    PPSP.SEC.REQ-3: PPSP MUST provide an option in order to encrypt the
 >    data exchange among the PPSP entities.

   What is 'an option' in this case? You mean more the 'ability'
   isn't it?An option is reading more like a protocol option.


Section 7., paragraph 9:

 >    PPSP.SEC.REQ-4: PPSP MUST have mechanisms in order to limit potential
 >    damage caused by malfunctioning and badly behaving peers in the P2P
 >    streaming system.

   It will very hard, up to impossible, to proof this requirement.


Section 7., paragraph 10:

 >    Such an attack will degrade the quality of the rendered media at the
 >    receiver. For example, in a P2P live streaming system a polluter can
 >    introduce corrupted chunks. Each receiver integrates into its
 >    playback stream the polluted chunks it receives from its neighbors.
 >    Since the peers forwards chunks to other peers, the polluted content
 >    can potentially spread through the P2P streaming network.

   Please specifiy a protocol requirement to mitigate this type
   of attack.


Section 7., paragraph 11:

 >    PPSP.SEC.REQ-5: PPSP SHOULD support identifying badly behaving peers,
 >    and exclude or reject them from the P2P streaming system.

   What does this mean? Logging, for instance, or list with bad peers?


Section 7., paragraph 12:

 >    PPSP.SEC.REQ-6: PPSP MUST prevent peers from DoS attacks which will
 >    exhaust the available resources of the P2P streaming system.

   I have trouble to see how this can be implemented in a protocol? If
   a per wants to start a DoS attack, it can do it. However, the peer
   protocol and the tracker protocols shouldn't make life easy for
   such peers.


Section 7., paragraph 14:

 >    PPSP.SEC.REQ-7: PPSP SHOULD be robust, i.e., when centralized tracker
 >    fails, the P2P streaming system SHOULD still work by supporting
 >    distributed trackers.

   This is not a security requirement, but it is a requirement for
   the protocol design.


Section 7., paragraph 15:

 >    PPSP.SEC.REQ-8: Existing P2P security mechanisms SHOULD be re-used as
 >    much as possible in PPSP, to avoid developing new security mechanisms.

   Not a protocol requirement, but more a design guideline.


Section 7., paragraph 16:

 >    PPSP.SEC.REQ-9: Integrity of the streaming content in PPSP MUST be
 >    supported to provide a peer with the possibility to identify
 >    unauthentic media content (undesirable modified by other entities
 >    rather than its genuine source). The corresponding checksum
 >    distribution and verification scheme SHOULD scale well in P2P
 >    streaming system and be robust against distrustful trackers/peers.

   The descriptive text out of REQ-4 fits perfectly and it is one
   attack vector. Remove REQ-4 keep REQ-9 and add extra requirements
   that state what the other protocol requirements are to get rid off
   other bad peers.


Section 7., paragraph 17:

 >    The PPSP protocol specifications will document the expected threats
 >    (and how they will be mitigated by each protocol) and also
 >    considerations on threats and mitigations when combining both
 >    protocols in an application. This will include privacy of the users
 >    and protection of the content distribution. Protection of the content
 >    by Digital Rights Management (DRM) is outside the scope of the PPSP.

   What is the difference between 'protection of the content
   distribution' and DRM?

  Martin

-- 
IETF Transport Area Director

martin.stiemerling@neclab.eu

NEC Laboratories Europe - Network Research Division NEC Europe Limited
Registered Office: NEC House, 1 Victoria Road, London W3 6BL
Registered in England 283

From Martin.Stiemerling@neclab.eu  Tue Oct  2 00:22:47 2012
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Hi,

I have been through some of the old DISCUSS and COMMENT from the last 
IESG evaluation of draft-ietf-ppsp-problem-statement-07.txt.

Here are the ballots with the positions:
https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-ppsp-problem-statement/ballot/

For instance, a very light one to be fixed, but I cannot find how this 
is addressed in the -10 version:

- Stephen Farrell:
Section 5 really needs to say what sections 5.x are.  They could
be use-cases the WG is going to tackle, or maybe the WG will decide
later, or whatever is the case. Without that, its hard to know why
sections 5.x are present.

The DISCUSS positions are probably addressed, but I do strongly 
recommend to double-check all comments.

   Martin

-- 
martin.stiemerling@neclab.eu

NEC Laboratories Europe - Network Research Division NEC Europe Limited
Registered Office: NEC House, 1 Victoria Road, London W3 6BL
Registered in England 283

From Martin.Stiemerling@neclab.eu  Tue Oct  2 00:22:47 2012
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Hi,

I have been through some of the old DISCUSS and COMMENT from the last 
IESG evaluation of draft-ietf-ppsp-problem-statement-07.txt.

Here are the ballots with the positions:
https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-ppsp-problem-statement/ballot/

For instance, a very light one to be fixed, but I cannot find how this 
is addressed in the -10 version:

- Stephen Farrell:
Section 5 really needs to say what sections 5.x are.  They could
be use-cases the WG is going to tackle, or maybe the WG will decide
later, or whatever is the case. Without that, its hard to know why
sections 5.x are present.

The DISCUSS positions are probably addressed, but I do strongly 
recommend to double-check all comments.

   Martin

-- 
martin.stiemerling@neclab.eu

NEC Laboratories Europe - Network Research Division NEC Europe Limited
Registered Office: NEC House, 1 Victoria Road, London W3 6BL
Registered in England 283

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Hi, Martin,

Sorry for the late reply due to public holidays in China. Please see below =
brief answers.

Thanks.

> -----Original Message-----
> From: ppsp-bounces@ietf.org [mailto:ppsp-bounces@ietf.org] On Behalf Of
> Martin Stiemerling
> Sent: Monday, October 01, 2012 11:19 PM
> To: ppsp@ietf.org
> Subject: [ppsp] 2nd part of an early AD review of
> draft-ietf-ppsp-problem-statement-10.txt
>=20
> Dear all,
>=20
> Here is the second part of the remainder of the
> draft-ietf-ppsp-problem-statement-10.txt:
>=20
> Section 6.3., paragraph 1:
>=20
>  >    The peer protocol defines how the peers advertise streaming content
>  >    availability and exchange status with each other. The peer protocol
>  >    also defines the requests and responses of the chunks among the
>  >    peers.
>=20
>    The last part means the data exchange requests and respones,
>    isn't it?

[Ning] Yes.

>  >    PPSP.PP.REQ-1: The streaming content availability request message
>  >    MUST allow the peer to solicit the chunk information from other pee=
rs
>  >    in the peer list. The chunk information MUST at least contain the
>  >    chunk ID. This chunk availability information MUST NOT be passed on
>  >    to other peer, unless validated (e.g. prevent hearsay and DoS).
>=20
>    This seems to be a requirement which is made up of several
>    requirements. First of all, a mechanism is required to exchange
>    information about the avail. of chunks. Second this information
>    must contain the chunk ID of available or unavailable chunks? Third,
>    do not forward this information.
>=20

[Ning] We mean chunk ID of available chunks. I will separate them to multip=
le Req. items.

>=20
> Section 6.3., paragraph 2:
>=20
>  >    PPSP.PP.REQ-2: The streaming content availability reply message MUS=
T
>  >    allow the peer to offer the information of the chunks in its conten=
t
>  >    buffer. The chunk information MUST at least contain the chunk ID.
>=20
>    We do not define messages here. Only protocol requirements. This
>    holds also true for the other requirements in this section. The chunk
>    ID part is duplicated from REQ1. What is this requirement about??
>=20

[Ning] Because we thought that the content avail. request & response are tw=
o basic parts of peer protocol, we list requirements (on request & response=
) in separate items. I am also fine with merging them.

>=20
> Section 6.3., paragraph 3:
>=20
>  >    PPSP.PP.REQ-3: The streaming content availability request message
>  >    SHOULD allow the peer to solicit an additional list of peers to tha=
t
>  >    received from the tracker - with the same swarm ID. The reply
>  >    message MUST contain swarm-membership information of the peers
> that
>  >    have explicitly indicated they are part of the swarm, verifiable by
>  >    the receiver. This additional list of peers MUST only contain peers
>  >    which have been checked to be valid and online recently (e.g. preve=
nt
>  >    hearsay and DoS).
>=20
>    Too many requirements packed into a single one. Please sort them
>    out into multiple requirements.
>=20

[Ning] OK.

>=20
> Section 6.3., paragraph 5:
>=20
>  >    PPSP.PP.REQ-4: Streaming content availability update message among
>  >    the peers MUST be supported by the peer protocol. The peer protocol
>  >    MUST implement either pull-based, push-based or both.
>=20
>    This seems to be related to REQ1? What is the difference?
>   I assume that a general description of the peer protocol, e.g., used
> to contanct other peers, to exchange information about what chunks are
> available, etc will help in defining the requirements.
>=20

[Ning] The difference is that here we mean the content availability UPDATE =
(e.g. new chunks available since last request), not the whole content avail=
ability info.

>=20
> Section 6.3., paragraph 7:
>=20
>  >    PPSP.PP.REQ-5: The chunk availability information between peers MUS=
T
>  >    be expressed as compactly as possible.
>=20
>    Please remove this requirements, as it is not clear in technical
>    terms what 'compact' is referring to. There is no measure to say that
>    one protocol is sending more or less data for the chunk availability
>    we have agreed on. It might be good to retain this information in
>    a descriptive text, but not as a requirement.
>=20

[Ning] OK. I will move this to description text.

>=20
> Section 6.3., paragraph 9:
>=20
>  >    PPSP.PP.REQ-6: The peer status report/update SHOULD be advertised
>  >    among the peers in order to reflect the status of the peer. Peer
>  >    status information should be advertised among the peers via the
>  >    peer status report/update message. For example, peer status can be
>  >    online time, physical link status including DSL/WiFi/etc, battery
>  >    status, processing capability, and other capabilities of the peer.
>  >    With such information, a peer can select more appropriate peers for
>  >    streaming.
>=20
>    This requirement should probably read like 'the peer protocol MUST
>    support the exchange of additional information about the peers. This
>    information canbe, for instance, information about the access link
>    or information about whether a peer is running on battery or is
>    connected to a power supply.
>=20

[Ning] Good suggestion, thanks.

>=20
> Section 6.3., paragraph 10:
>=20
>  >    PPSP.PP.REQ-7: The peers MUST implement the peer protocol for chunk
>  >    data (not availability information) requests and responses among th=
e
>  >    peers before the streaming content is transmitted.
>=20
>    What is this requirement about? I do not understand the intent of
>    this requirement.
>=20

[Ning] The intention is to include more signaling messages (e.g. requesting=
 certain chunks, and necessary negotiation for data transmission) into the =
scope of peer protocol.

>=20
> Section 7., paragraph 2:
>=20
>  >    - Originate denial of service (DOS) attacks to the trackers by
>  >    sending large amount of requests with the tracker protocol;
>  >    - Originate fake information on behalf of other peers;
>  >    - Originate fake information about chunk availability;
>=20
>    I would add more a classification about where the attack can happen,
>    e.e.g., on tracker info, the info between the peers, on the content.
>=20

[Ning] Good suggestion, thanks.

>=20
> Section 7., paragraph 5:
>=20
>  >    PPSP.SEC.REQ-1: PPSP MUST support closed swarms, where the peers
> are
>  >    authenticated.
>=20
>    A closed swarm does not need necessarily authentication, but also run
>    in a wallend garden, i.e., in a private network. The requirement is
>    ok, but I would remove the authenticated here and also add a further
>    requirement adding the ability to authenticate peers. Further, this
>    requirement w/o authenticatoin does not belong here, but somewhere
>    else, e.g., what are requirements for the tracker and the peers
>    out of this?
>=20

[Ning] I would prefer to keep authenticated peer and add private network ca=
se. Adding authentication requirement to tracker protocol is a good suggest=
ion to me.

>=20
> Section 7., paragraph 7:
>=20
>  >    PPSP.SEC.REQ-2: Confidentiality of the streaming content in PPSP
>  >    SHOULD be supported and the corresponding key management scheme
>  >    SHOULD scale well in P2P streaming systems.
>=20
>    Again, these are requirements. And, how do you define scale well?
>=20

[Ning] I think one example of "scale well" is to define key/token based on =
peer group level, rather than content level.

>=20
> Section 7., paragraph 8:
>=20
>  >    PPSP.SEC.REQ-3: PPSP MUST provide an option in order to encrypt the
>  >    data exchange among the PPSP entities.
>=20
>    What is 'an option' in this case? You mean more the 'ability'
>    isn't it?An option is reading more like a protocol option.
>=20

[Ning] Yes, I mean "ability".

>=20
> Section 7., paragraph 9:
>=20
>  >    PPSP.SEC.REQ-4: PPSP MUST have mechanisms in order to limit
> potential
>  >    damage caused by malfunctioning and badly behaving peers in the P2P
>  >    streaming system.
>=20
>    It will very hard, up to impossible, to proof this requirement.
>=20
>=20
> Section 7., paragraph 10:
>=20
>  >    Such an attack will degrade the quality of the rendered media at th=
e
>  >    receiver. For example, in a P2P live streaming system a polluter ca=
n
>  >    introduce corrupted chunks. Each receiver integrates into its
>  >    playback stream the polluted chunks it receives from its neighbors.
>  >    Since the peers forwards chunks to other peers, the polluted conten=
t
>  >    can potentially spread through the P2P streaming network.
>=20
>    Please specifiy a protocol requirement to mitigate this type
>    of attack.
>=20

[Ning] As suggested, I will remove Req-4 and elaborate more on Req-10.

>=20
> Section 7., paragraph 11:
>=20
>  >    PPSP.SEC.REQ-5: PPSP SHOULD support identifying badly behaving
> peers,
>  >    and exclude or reject them from the P2P streaming system.
>=20
>    What does this mean? Logging, for instance, or list with bad peers?
>=20

[Ning] Logging the peer behavior is one example. Anyway this is design guid=
eline for PPSP system.

>=20
> Section 7., paragraph 12:
>=20
>  >    PPSP.SEC.REQ-6: PPSP MUST prevent peers from DoS attacks which will
>  >    exhaust the available resources of the P2P streaming system.
>=20
>    I have trouble to see how this can be implemented in a protocol? If
>    a per wants to start a DoS attack, it can do it. However, the peer
>    protocol and the tracker protocols shouldn't make life easy for
>    such peers.
>=20

[Ning] I think this item actually belongs to more general item like REQ-5.

>=20
> Section 7., paragraph 14:
>=20
>  >    PPSP.SEC.REQ-7: PPSP SHOULD be robust, i.e., when centralized track=
er
>  >    fails, the P2P streaming system SHOULD still work by supporting
>  >    distributed trackers.
>=20
>    This is not a security requirement, but it is a requirement for
>    the protocol design.
>=20

[Ning] Good suggestion, thanks. I will move this to tracker part.

>=20
> Section 7., paragraph 15:
>=20
>  >    PPSP.SEC.REQ-8: Existing P2P security mechanisms SHOULD be re-used
> as
>  >    much as possible in PPSP, to avoid developing new security mechanis=
ms.
>=20
>    Not a protocol requirement, but more a design guideline.
>=20

[Ning] Yes, and I think most of Req. items in the section are PPSP system d=
esign guideline. Can I clarify this at the beginning of this section?

>=20
> Section 7., paragraph 16:
>=20
>  >    PPSP.SEC.REQ-9: Integrity of the streaming content in PPSP MUST be
>  >    supported to provide a peer with the possibility to identify
>  >    unauthentic media content (undesirable modified by other entities
>  >    rather than its genuine source). The corresponding checksum
>  >    distribution and verification scheme SHOULD scale well in P2P
>  >    streaming system and be robust against distrustful trackers/peers.
>=20
>    The descriptive text out of REQ-4 fits perfectly and it is one
>    attack vector. Remove REQ-4 keep REQ-9 and add extra requirements
>    that state what the other protocol requirements are to get rid off
>    other bad peers.
>=20

[Ning] Good suggestion, thanks.

>=20
> Section 7., paragraph 17:
>=20
>  >    The PPSP protocol specifications will document the expected threats
>  >    (and how they will be mitigated by each protocol) and also
>  >    considerations on threats and mitigations when combining both
>  >    protocols in an application. This will include privacy of the users
>  >    and protection of the content distribution. Protection of the conte=
nt
>  >    by Digital Rights Management (DRM) is outside the scope of the PPSP=
.
>=20
>    What is the difference between 'protection of the content
>    distribution' and DRM?
>=20

[Ning] I think the protection here means mechanism done by peers themselves=
 like adding check sum, other than general methods done by parties not in P=
PSP system.

>   Martin
>=20
> --
> IETF Transport Area Director
>=20
> martin.stiemerling@neclab.eu
>=20
> NEC Laboratories Europe - Network Research Division NEC Europe Limited
> Registered Office: NEC House, 1 Victoria Road, London W3 6BL
> Registered in England 283
> _______________________________________________
> ppsp mailing list
> ppsp@ietf.org
> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ppsp

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<DIV>Hi Martin,</DIV>
<DIV>&nbsp;&nbsp; Thanks for the suggestion. As the co-authors, we wish to=
=20
address ALL the IESG concerns in the updated draft or replies to the=20
ADs.&nbsp;Actually I replied to Stephen=A3=A8cc to the IESG) to explain th=
e purpose=20
of the use cases section(This section is not for the to-do list for the WG=
, but=20
for the explanatory effect to show how PPSP could be used in practice). Bu=
t I=20
didn't add this in the draft text. This may lead to some confusion when yo=
u look=20
into the AD reviews and check the text.</DIV>
<DIV>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; I think double-check the AD comments is a good=20
suggestion and I'll add some "replies words" to the draft if necessary mor=
e than=20
just replying in the email. </DIV>
<DIV>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV>BR</DIV>
<DIV>Yunfei</DIV>
<DIV>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; </DIV>
<HR style=3D"WIDTH: 210px; HEIGHT: 1px" align=3Dleft color=3D#b5c4df SIZE=
=3D1>

<DIV><SPAN>zhangyunfei</SPAN></DIV>
<DIV>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV=20
style=3D"BORDER-BOTTOM: medium none; BORDER-LEFT: medium none; PADDING-BOT=
TOM: 0cm; PADDING-LEFT: 0cm; PADDING-RIGHT: 0cm; BORDER-TOP: #b5c4df 1pt s=
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style=3D"PADDING-BOTTOM: 8px; PADDING-LEFT: 8px; PADDING-RIGHT: 8px; BACKG=
ROUND: #efefef; COLOR: #000000; FONT-SIZE: 12px; PADDING-TOP: 8px">
<DIV><B>From:</B>&nbsp;<A href=3D"mailto:martin.stiemerling@neclab.eu">Mar=
tin=20
Stiemerling</A></DIV>
<DIV><B>Date:</B>&nbsp;2012-10-02&nbsp;15:22</DIV>
<DIV><B>To:</B>&nbsp;<A href=3D"mailto:ppsp@ietf.org">ppsp</A></DIV>
<DIV><B>Subject:</B>&nbsp;[ppsp] Open issues out of last IESG evaluation f=
or=20
draft-ietf-ppsp-problem-statement-10.txt</DIV></DIV></DIV>
<DIV>
<DIV>Hi,</DIV>
<DIV>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV>I&nbsp;have&nbsp;been&nbsp;through&nbsp;some&nbsp;of&nbsp;the&nbsp;ol=
d&nbsp;DISCUSS&nbsp;and&nbsp;COMMENT&nbsp;from&nbsp;the&nbsp;last&nbsp;</D=
IV>
<DIV>IESG&nbsp;evaluation&nbsp;of&nbsp;draft-ietf-ppsp-problem-statement-0=
7.txt.</DIV>
<DIV>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV>Here&nbsp;are&nbsp;the&nbsp;ballots&nbsp;with&nbsp;the&nbsp;positions=
:</DIV>
<DIV>https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-ppsp-problem-statement/ba=
llot/</DIV>
<DIV>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV>For&nbsp;instance,&nbsp;a&nbsp;very&nbsp;light&nbsp;one&nbsp;to&nbsp;=
be&nbsp;fixed,&nbsp;but&nbsp;I&nbsp;cannot&nbsp;find&nbsp;how&nbsp;this&nb=
sp;</DIV>
<DIV>is&nbsp;addressed&nbsp;in&nbsp;the&nbsp;-10&nbsp;version:</DIV>
<DIV>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV>-&nbsp;Stephen&nbsp;Farrell:</DIV>
<DIV>Section&nbsp;5&nbsp;really&nbsp;needs&nbsp;to&nbsp;say&nbsp;what&nbsp=
;sections&nbsp;5.x&nbsp;are.&nbsp;&nbsp;They&nbsp;could</DIV>
<DIV>be&nbsp;use-cases&nbsp;the&nbsp;WG&nbsp;is&nbsp;going&nbsp;to&nbsp;ta=
ckle,&nbsp;or&nbsp;maybe&nbsp;the&nbsp;WG&nbsp;will&nbsp;decide</DIV>
<DIV>later,&nbsp;or&nbsp;whatever&nbsp;is&nbsp;the&nbsp;case.&nbsp;Without=
&nbsp;that,&nbsp;its&nbsp;hard&nbsp;to&nbsp;know&nbsp;why</DIV>
<DIV>sections&nbsp;5.x&nbsp;are&nbsp;present.</DIV>
<DIV>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV>The&nbsp;DISCUSS&nbsp;positions&nbsp;are&nbsp;probably&nbsp;addressed=
,&nbsp;but&nbsp;I&nbsp;do&nbsp;strongly&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV>recommend&nbsp;to&nbsp;double-check&nbsp;all&nbsp;comments.</DIV>
<DIV>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;Martin</DIV>
<DIV>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV>--&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV>martin.stiemerling@neclab.eu</DIV>
<DIV>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV>NEC&nbsp;Laboratories&nbsp;Europe&nbsp;-&nbsp;Network&nbsp;Research&n=
bsp;Division&nbsp;NEC&nbsp;Europe&nbsp;Limited</DIV>
<DIV>Registered&nbsp;Office:&nbsp;NEC&nbsp;House,&nbsp;1&nbsp;Victoria&nbs=
p;Road,&nbsp;London&nbsp;W3&nbsp;6BL</DIV>
<DIV>Registered&nbsp;in&nbsp;England&nbsp;283</DIV>
<DIV>_______________________________________________</DIV>
<DIV>ppsp&nbsp;mailing&nbsp;list</DIV>
<DIV>ppsp@ietf.org</DIV>
<DIV>https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ppsp</DIV></DIV></BODY></HTML>

------=_001_NextPart816222527245_=------


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Thread-Topic: [ppsp] Open issues out of last IESG evaluation for draft-ietf-ppsp-problem-statement-10.txt
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family:&quot;Calibri&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:#1F497D">Yes, I als=
o think it is good idea to double-check and make sure all the discuss and c=
omments are addressed in new revision.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
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</o:p></span></p>
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0cm 0cm">
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin:0cm;margin-bottom:.0001pt"><b><span =
lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-family:&quot;Tahoma&quot;,&qu=
ot;sans-serif&quot;">From:</span></b><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-siz=
e:10.0pt;font-family:&quot;Tahoma&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;"> ppsp-bounc=
es@ietf.org
 [mailto:ppsp-bounces@ietf.org] <b>On Behalf Of </b>zhangyunfei<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Monday, October 08, 2012 10:25 AM<br>
<b>To:</b> Martin Stiemerling; ppsp<br>
<b>Subject:</b> Re: [ppsp] Open issues out of last IESG evaluation for draf=
t-ietf-ppsp-problem-statement-10.txt<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
</div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin:0cm;margin-bottom:.0001pt"><span lan=
g=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;font-family:&quot;=CE=A2=C8=ED=D1=C5=
=BA=DA&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:navy">Hi Martin,<o:p></o:p></span=
></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin:0cm;margin-bottom:.0001pt"><span lan=
g=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;font-family:&quot;=CE=A2=C8=ED=D1=C5=
=BA=DA&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:navy">&nbsp;&nbsp; Thanks for the=
 suggestion. As the co-authors, we wish to address ALL the IESG concerns in=
 the updated draft
 or replies to the ADs.&nbsp;Actually I replied to Stephen</span><span styl=
e=3D"font-size:10.5pt;font-family:&quot;=CE=A2=C8=ED=D1=C5=BA=DA&quot;,&quo=
t;sans-serif&quot;;color:navy">=A3=A8<span lang=3D"EN-US">cc to the IESG) t=
o explain the purpose of the use cases section(This section is not for the =
to-do list
 for the WG, but for the explanatory effect to show how PPSP could be used =
in practice). But I didn't add this in the draft text. This may lead to som=
e confusion when you look into the AD reviews and check the text.<o:p></o:p=
></span></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin:0cm;margin-bottom:.0001pt"><span lan=
g=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;font-family:&quot;=CE=A2=C8=ED=D1=C5=
=BA=DA&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:navy">&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; I think =
double-check the AD comments is a good suggestion and I'll add some &quot;r=
eplies words&quot; to the draft
 if necessary more than just replying in the email. <o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin:0cm;margin-bottom:.0001pt"><span lan=
g=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;font-family:&quot;=CE=A2=C8=ED=D1=C5=
=BA=DA&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:navy">&nbsp;<o:p></o:p></span></p=
>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin:0cm;margin-bottom:.0001pt"><span lan=
g=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;font-family:&quot;=CE=A2=C8=ED=D1=C5=
=BA=DA&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:navy">BR<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin:0cm;margin-bottom:.0001pt"><span lan=
g=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;font-family:&quot;=CE=A2=C8=ED=D1=C5=
=BA=DA&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:navy">Yunfei<o:p></o:p></span></p=
>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin:0cm;margin-bottom:.0001pt"><span lan=
g=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;font-family:&quot;=CE=A2=C8=ED=D1=C5=
=BA=DA&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:navy">&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;
<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin:0cm;margin-bottom:.0001pt"><span l=
ang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;font-family:&quot;=CE=A2=C8=ED=D1=
=C5=BA=DA&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:navy">
<hr size=3D"1" width=3D"210" style=3D"width:157.5pt" noshade=3D"" style=3D"=
color:#B5C4DF" align=3D"left">
</span></div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin:0cm;margin-bottom:.0001pt"><span lan=
g=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;font-family:&quot;=CE=A2=C8=ED=D1=C5=
=BA=DA&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:navy">zhangyunfei<o:p></o:p></spa=
n></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin:0cm;margin-bottom:.0001pt"><span lan=
g=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;font-family:&quot;=CE=A2=C8=ED=D1=C5=
=BA=DA&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:navy">&nbsp;<o:p></o:p></span></p=
>
</div>
<div style=3D"border:none;border-top:solid #B5C4DF 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0cm =
0cm 0cm">
<div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin:0cm;margin-bottom:.0001pt;background=
:#EFEFEF">
<b><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size:9.0pt;font-family:&quot;=CE=A2=
=C8=ED=D1=C5=BA=DA&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:black">From:</span></=
b><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size:9.0pt;font-family:&quot;=CE=A2=C8=
=ED=D1=C5=BA=DA&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:black">&nbsp;<a href=3D"=
mailto:martin.stiemerling@neclab.eu">Martin Stiemerling</a><o:p></o:p></spa=
n></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin:0cm;margin-bottom:.0001pt;background=
:#EFEFEF">
<b><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size:9.0pt;font-family:&quot;=CE=A2=
=C8=ED=D1=C5=BA=DA&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:black">Date:</span></=
b><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size:9.0pt;font-family:&quot;=CE=A2=C8=
=ED=D1=C5=BA=DA&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:black">&nbsp;2012-10-02&=
nbsp;15:22<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin:0cm;margin-bottom:.0001pt;background=
:#EFEFEF">
<b><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size:9.0pt;font-family:&quot;=CE=A2=
=C8=ED=D1=C5=BA=DA&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:black">To:</span></b>=
<span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size:9.0pt;font-family:&quot;=CE=A2=C8=
=ED=D1=C5=BA=DA&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:black">&nbsp;<a href=3D"=
mailto:ppsp@ietf.org">ppsp</a><o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin:0cm;margin-bottom:.0001pt;background=
:#EFEFEF">
<b><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size:9.0pt;font-family:&quot;=CE=A2=
=C8=ED=D1=C5=BA=DA&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:black">Subject:</span=
></b><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size:9.0pt;font-family:&quot;=CE=A2=
=C8=ED=D1=C5=BA=DA&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:black">&nbsp;[ppsp] O=
pen issues out of last IESG evaluation for draft-ietf-ppsp-problem-statemen=
t-10.txt<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
</div>
</div>
<div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin:0cm;margin-bottom:.0001pt"><span lan=
g=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;font-family:&quot;=CE=A2=C8=ED=D1=C5=
=BA=DA&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:navy">Hi,<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin:0cm;margin-bottom:.0001pt"><span lan=
g=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;font-family:&quot;=CE=A2=C8=ED=D1=C5=
=BA=DA&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:navy">&nbsp;<o:p></o:p></span></p=
>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin:0cm;margin-bottom:.0001pt"><span lan=
g=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;font-family:&quot;=CE=A2=C8=ED=D1=C5=
=BA=DA&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:navy">I&nbsp;have&nbsp;been&nbsp;=
through&nbsp;some&nbsp;of&nbsp;the&nbsp;old&nbsp;DISCUSS&nbsp;and&nbsp;COMM=
ENT&nbsp;from&nbsp;the&nbsp;last&nbsp;<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin:0cm;margin-bottom:.0001pt"><span lan=
g=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;font-family:&quot;=CE=A2=C8=ED=D1=C5=
=BA=DA&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:navy">IESG&nbsp;evaluation&nbsp;o=
f&nbsp;draft-ietf-ppsp-problem-statement-07.txt.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin:0cm;margin-bottom:.0001pt"><span lan=
g=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;font-family:&quot;=CE=A2=C8=ED=D1=C5=
=BA=DA&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:navy">&nbsp;<o:p></o:p></span></p=
>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin:0cm;margin-bottom:.0001pt"><span lan=
g=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;font-family:&quot;=CE=A2=C8=ED=D1=C5=
=BA=DA&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:navy">Here&nbsp;are&nbsp;the&nbsp=
;ballots&nbsp;with&nbsp;the&nbsp;positions:<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin:0cm;margin-bottom:.0001pt"><span lan=
g=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;font-family:&quot;=CE=A2=C8=ED=D1=C5=
=BA=DA&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:navy">https://datatracker.ietf.or=
g/doc/draft-ietf-ppsp-problem-statement/ballot/<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin:0cm;margin-bottom:.0001pt"><span lan=
g=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;font-family:&quot;=CE=A2=C8=ED=D1=C5=
=BA=DA&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:navy">&nbsp;<o:p></o:p></span></p=
>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin:0cm;margin-bottom:.0001pt"><span lan=
g=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;font-family:&quot;=CE=A2=C8=ED=D1=C5=
=BA=DA&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:navy">For&nbsp;instance,&nbsp;a&n=
bsp;very&nbsp;light&nbsp;one&nbsp;to&nbsp;be&nbsp;fixed,&nbsp;but&nbsp;I&nb=
sp;cannot&nbsp;find&nbsp;how&nbsp;this&nbsp;<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin:0cm;margin-bottom:.0001pt"><span lan=
g=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;font-family:&quot;=CE=A2=C8=ED=D1=C5=
=BA=DA&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:navy">is&nbsp;addressed&nbsp;in&n=
bsp;the&nbsp;-10&nbsp;version:<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin:0cm;margin-bottom:.0001pt"><span lan=
g=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;font-family:&quot;=CE=A2=C8=ED=D1=C5=
=BA=DA&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:navy">&nbsp;<o:p></o:p></span></p=
>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin:0cm;margin-bottom:.0001pt"><span lan=
g=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;font-family:&quot;=CE=A2=C8=ED=D1=C5=
=BA=DA&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:navy">-&nbsp;Stephen&nbsp;Farrell=
:<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin:0cm;margin-bottom:.0001pt"><span lan=
g=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;font-family:&quot;=CE=A2=C8=ED=D1=C5=
=BA=DA&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:navy">Section&nbsp;5&nbsp;really&=
nbsp;needs&nbsp;to&nbsp;say&nbsp;what&nbsp;sections&nbsp;5.x&nbsp;are.&nbsp=
;&nbsp;They&nbsp;could<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin:0cm;margin-bottom:.0001pt"><span lan=
g=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;font-family:&quot;=CE=A2=C8=ED=D1=C5=
=BA=DA&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:navy">be&nbsp;use-cases&nbsp;the&=
nbsp;WG&nbsp;is&nbsp;going&nbsp;to&nbsp;tackle,&nbsp;or&nbsp;maybe&nbsp;the=
&nbsp;WG&nbsp;will&nbsp;decide<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin:0cm;margin-bottom:.0001pt"><span lan=
g=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;font-family:&quot;=CE=A2=C8=ED=D1=C5=
=BA=DA&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:navy">later,&nbsp;or&nbsp;whateve=
r&nbsp;is&nbsp;the&nbsp;case.&nbsp;Without&nbsp;that,&nbsp;its&nbsp;hard&nb=
sp;to&nbsp;know&nbsp;why<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin:0cm;margin-bottom:.0001pt"><span lan=
g=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;font-family:&quot;=CE=A2=C8=ED=D1=C5=
=BA=DA&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:navy">sections&nbsp;5.x&nbsp;are&=
nbsp;present.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin:0cm;margin-bottom:.0001pt"><span lan=
g=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;font-family:&quot;=CE=A2=C8=ED=D1=C5=
=BA=DA&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:navy">&nbsp;<o:p></o:p></span></p=
>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin:0cm;margin-bottom:.0001pt"><span lan=
g=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;font-family:&quot;=CE=A2=C8=ED=D1=C5=
=BA=DA&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:navy">The&nbsp;DISCUSS&nbsp;posit=
ions&nbsp;are&nbsp;probably&nbsp;addressed,&nbsp;but&nbsp;I&nbsp;do&nbsp;st=
rongly&nbsp;<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin:0cm;margin-bottom:.0001pt"><span lan=
g=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;font-family:&quot;=CE=A2=C8=ED=D1=C5=
=BA=DA&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:navy">recommend&nbsp;to&nbsp;doub=
le-check&nbsp;all&nbsp;comments.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin:0cm;margin-bottom:.0001pt"><span lan=
g=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;font-family:&quot;=CE=A2=C8=ED=D1=C5=
=BA=DA&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:navy">&nbsp;<o:p></o:p></span></p=
>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin:0cm;margin-bottom:.0001pt"><span lan=
g=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;font-family:&quot;=CE=A2=C8=ED=D1=C5=
=BA=DA&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:navy">&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;Martin<o:=
p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin:0cm;margin-bottom:.0001pt"><span lan=
g=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;font-family:&quot;=CE=A2=C8=ED=D1=C5=
=BA=DA&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:navy">&nbsp;<o:p></o:p></span></p=
>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin:0cm;margin-bottom:.0001pt"><span lan=
g=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;font-family:&quot;=CE=A2=C8=ED=D1=C5=
=BA=DA&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:navy">--&nbsp;<o:p></o:p></span><=
/p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin:0cm;margin-bottom:.0001pt"><span lan=
g=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;font-family:&quot;=CE=A2=C8=ED=D1=C5=
=BA=DA&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:navy">martin.stiemerling@neclab.e=
u<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin:0cm;margin-bottom:.0001pt"><span lan=
g=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;font-family:&quot;=CE=A2=C8=ED=D1=C5=
=BA=DA&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:navy">&nbsp;<o:p></o:p></span></p=
>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin:0cm;margin-bottom:.0001pt"><span lan=
g=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;font-family:&quot;=CE=A2=C8=ED=D1=C5=
=BA=DA&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:navy">NEC&nbsp;Laboratories&nbsp;=
Europe&nbsp;-&nbsp;Network&nbsp;Research&nbsp;Division&nbsp;NEC&nbsp;Europe=
&nbsp;Limited<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin:0cm;margin-bottom:.0001pt"><span lan=
g=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;font-family:&quot;=CE=A2=C8=ED=D1=C5=
=BA=DA&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:navy">Registered&nbsp;Office:&nbs=
p;NEC&nbsp;House,&nbsp;1&nbsp;Victoria&nbsp;Road,&nbsp;London&nbsp;W3&nbsp;=
6BL<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin:0cm;margin-bottom:.0001pt"><span lan=
g=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;font-family:&quot;=CE=A2=C8=ED=D1=C5=
=BA=DA&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:navy">Registered&nbsp;in&nbsp;Eng=
land&nbsp;283<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin:0cm;margin-bottom:.0001pt"><span lan=
g=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;font-family:&quot;=CE=A2=C8=ED=D1=C5=
=BA=DA&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:navy">___________________________=
____________________<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin:0cm;margin-bottom:.0001pt"><span lan=
g=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;font-family:&quot;=CE=A2=C8=ED=D1=C5=
=BA=DA&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:navy">ppsp&nbsp;mailing&nbsp;list=
<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin:0cm;margin-bottom:.0001pt"><span lan=
g=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;font-family:&quot;=CE=A2=C8=ED=D1=C5=
=BA=DA&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:navy">ppsp@ietf.org<o:p></o:p></s=
pan></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin:0cm;margin-bottom:.0001pt"><span lan=
g=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;font-family:&quot;=CE=A2=C8=ED=D1=C5=
=BA=DA&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:navy">https://www.ietf.org/mailma=
n/listinfo/ppsp<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
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Date: Tue, 16 Oct 2012 10:02:46 +0800
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<DIV>Hi all,</DIV>
<DIV>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; The IETF85 agenda has been published (<A=20
href=3D"https://datatracker.ietf.org/meeting/85/agenda.txt">https://datatr=
acker.ietf.org/meeting/85/agenda.txt</A>)=20
. The ppsp session is currently planned on the morning in MONDAY, November=
 5,=20
2012 at Room 209. </DIV>
<DIV>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; Please let stefano and me know if you have p=
lan to=20
present in the meeting by Oct 23. Please note that the session time is sub=
ject=20
to change before the IETF.</DIV>
<DIV>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; Thanks.</DIV>
<DIV>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV>BR</DIV>
<DIV>Stefano and Yunfei<BR></DIV>
<DIV>&nbsp;</DIV>
<HR style=3D"WIDTH: 210px; HEIGHT: 1px" align=3Dleft color=3D#b5c4df SIZE=
=3D1>

<DIV><SPAN>zhangyunfei</SPAN></DIV></BODY></HTML>

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From: Johan Pouwelse <peer2peer@gmail.com>
To: zhangyunfei <zhangyunfei@chinamobile.com>, stefano previdi <sprevidi@cisco.com>, ppsp@ietf.org
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Dear Stefano and Yunfei,
We would like to request a 30minute slot within the PPSP Atlanta session
regarding the peer protocol.

An updated version of "draft-ietf-ppsp-peer-protocol" should be
finished soon, thanks to the hard work of Arno and Riccardo.
They strive to take care of all open issues.
Within this slot we also would like to demo our PPSP implementation
available now on Android market.
  -johan.
On 16 October 2012 04:02, zhangyunfei <zhangyunfei@chinamobile.com> wrote:
> Hi all,
>     The IETF85 agenda has been published
> (https://datatracker.ietf.org/meeting/85/agenda.txt) . The ppsp session is
> currently planned on the morning in MONDAY, November 5, 2012 at Room 209.
>      Please let stefano and me know if you have plan to present in the
> meeting by Oct 23. Please note that the session time is subject to change
> before the IETF.
>     Thanks.
>
> BR
> Stefano and Yunfei
>
> ________________________________
> zhangyunfei
>
> _______________________________________________
> ppsp mailing list
> ppsp@ietf.org
> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ppsp
>

From zhangyunfei@chinamobile.com  Thu Oct 18 18:42:47 2012
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Date: Fri, 19 Oct 2012 09:42:37 +0800
From: zhangyunfei <zhangyunfei@chinamobile.com>
To: "Johan Pouwelse" <peer2peer@gmail.com>,  "stefano previdi" <sprevidi@cisco.com>, ppsp <ppsp@ietf.org>
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e>
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<BODY style=3D"MARGIN: 10px">
<DIV>Hi Johan,</DIV>
<DIV>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; It's a good news that we can see&nbsp;the demo sho=
w in=20
this IETF. Looking forward to meeting with you in Altanta.</DIV>
<DIV>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV>BR<BR>Yunfei&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV>&nbsp;</DIV>
<HR style=3D"WIDTH: 210px; HEIGHT: 1px" align=3Dleft color=3D#b5c4df SIZE=
=3D1>

<DIV><SPAN>zhangyunfei</SPAN></DIV>
<DIV>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV=20
style=3D"BORDER-BOTTOM: medium none; BORDER-LEFT: medium none; PADDING-BOT=
TOM: 0cm; PADDING-LEFT: 0cm; PADDING-RIGHT: 0cm; BORDER-TOP: #b5c4df 1pt s=
olid; BORDER-RIGHT: medium none; PADDING-TOP: 3pt">
<DIV=20
style=3D"PADDING-BOTTOM: 8px; PADDING-LEFT: 8px; PADDING-RIGHT: 8px; BACKG=
ROUND: #efefef; COLOR: #000000; FONT-SIZE: 12px; PADDING-TOP: 8px">
<DIV><B>From:</B>&nbsp;<A href=3D"mailto:peer2peer@gmail.com">Johan=20
Pouwelse</A></DIV>
<DIV><B>Date:</B>&nbsp;2012-10-18&nbsp;21:01</DIV>
<DIV><B>To:</B>&nbsp;<A=20
href=3D"mailto:zhangyunfei@chinamobile.com">zhangyunfei</A>; <A=20
href=3D"mailto:sprevidi@cisco.com">stefano previdi</A>; <A=20
href=3D"mailto:ppsp@ietf.org">ppsp</A></DIV>
<DIV><B>CC:</B>&nbsp;<A href=3D"mailto:arno@cs.vu.nl">Arno Bakker</A>; <A=20
href=3D"mailto:r.petrocco@gmail.com">Riccardo</A>; <A=20
href=3D"mailto:rauljc@kth.se">Raul Jimenez</A></DIV>
<DIV><B>Subject:</B>&nbsp;Re: [ppsp] ppsp session in IETF85</DIV></DIV></D=
IV>
<DIV>
<DIV>Dear&nbsp;Stefano&nbsp;and&nbsp;Yunfei,</DIV>
<DIV>We&nbsp;would&nbsp;like&nbsp;to&nbsp;request&nbsp;a&nbsp;30minute&nbs=
p;slot&nbsp;within&nbsp;the&nbsp;PPSP&nbsp;Atlanta&nbsp;session</DIV>
<DIV>regarding&nbsp;the&nbsp;peer&nbsp;protocol.</DIV>
<DIV>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV>An&nbsp;updated&nbsp;version&nbsp;of&nbsp;"draft-ietf-ppsp-peer-proto=
col"&nbsp;should&nbsp;be</DIV>
<DIV>finished&nbsp;soon,&nbsp;thanks&nbsp;to&nbsp;the&nbsp;hard&nbsp;work&=
nbsp;of&nbsp;Arno&nbsp;and&nbsp;Riccardo.</DIV>
<DIV>They&nbsp;strive&nbsp;to&nbsp;take&nbsp;care&nbsp;of&nbsp;all&nbsp;op=
en&nbsp;issues.</DIV>
<DIV>Within&nbsp;this&nbsp;slot&nbsp;we&nbsp;also&nbsp;would&nbsp;like&nbs=
p;to&nbsp;demo&nbsp;our&nbsp;PPSP&nbsp;implementation</DIV>
<DIV>available&nbsp;now&nbsp;on&nbsp;Android&nbsp;market.</DIV>
<DIV>&nbsp;&nbsp;-johan.</DIV>
<DIV>On&nbsp;16&nbsp;October&nbsp;2012&nbsp;04:02,&nbsp;zhangyunfei&nbsp;&=
lt;zhangyunfei@chinamobile.com&gt;&nbsp;wrote:</DIV>
<DIV>&gt;&nbsp;Hi&nbsp;all,</DIV>
<DIV>&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;The&nbsp;IETF85&nbsp;agenda&nbsp;ha=
s&nbsp;been&nbsp;published</DIV>
<DIV>&gt;&nbsp;(https://datatracker.ietf.org/meeting/85/agenda.txt)&nbsp;.=
&nbsp;The&nbsp;ppsp&nbsp;session&nbsp;is</DIV>
<DIV>&gt;&nbsp;currently&nbsp;planned&nbsp;on&nbsp;the&nbsp;morning&nbsp;i=
n&nbsp;MONDAY,&nbsp;November&nbsp;5,&nbsp;2012&nbsp;at&nbsp;Room&nbsp;209.=
</DIV>
<DIV>&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;Please&nbsp;let&nbsp;stefano&=
nbsp;and&nbsp;me&nbsp;know&nbsp;if&nbsp;you&nbsp;have&nbsp;plan&nbsp;to&nb=
sp;present&nbsp;in&nbsp;the</DIV>
<DIV>&gt;&nbsp;meeting&nbsp;by&nbsp;Oct&nbsp;23.&nbsp;Please&nbsp;note&nbs=
p;that&nbsp;the&nbsp;session&nbsp;time&nbsp;is&nbsp;subject&nbsp;to&nbsp;c=
hange</DIV>
<DIV>&gt;&nbsp;before&nbsp;the&nbsp;IETF.</DIV>
<DIV>&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;Thanks.</DIV>
<DIV>&gt;</DIV>
<DIV>&gt;&nbsp;BR</DIV>
<DIV>&gt;&nbsp;Stefano&nbsp;and&nbsp;Yunfei</DIV>
<DIV>&gt;</DIV>
<DIV>&gt;&nbsp;________________________________</DIV>
<DIV>&gt;&nbsp;zhangyunfei</DIV>
<DIV>&gt;</DIV>
<DIV>&gt;&nbsp;_______________________________________________</DIV>
<DIV>&gt;&nbsp;ppsp&nbsp;mailing&nbsp;list</DIV>
<DIV>&gt;&nbsp;ppsp@ietf.org</DIV>
<DIV>&gt;&nbsp;https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ppsp</DIV>
<DIV>&gt;</DIV></DIV></BODY></HTML>

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Subject: [ppsp] I-D Action: draft-ietf-ppsp-problem-statement-11.txt
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A New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line Internet-Drafts director=
ies.
 This draft is a work item of the Peer to Peer Streaming Protocol Working G=
roup of the IETF.

	Title           : Problem Statement and Requirements of Peer-to-Peer Strea=
ming Protocol (PPSP)
	Author(s)       : Yunfei Zhang
                          Ning Zong
	Filename        : draft-ietf-ppsp-problem-statement-11.txt
	Pages           : 25
	Date            : 2012-10-19

Abstract:
   Peer-to-Peer (P2P for short) streaming systems show more and more
   popularity in current Internet with proprietary protocols. This
   document identifies problems of the proprietary protocols, proposes
   the development of Peer to Peer Streaming Protocol (PPSP) including
   the tracker and peer protocol, and discusses the scope, requirements
   and use cases of PPSP.


The IETF datatracker status page for this draft is:
https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-ppsp-problem-statement

There's also a htmlized version available at:
http://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-ppsp-problem-statement-11

A diff from the previous version is available at:
http://www.ietf.org/rfcdiff?url2=3Ddraft-ietf-ppsp-problem-statement-11


Internet-Drafts are also available by anonymous FTP at:
ftp://ftp.ietf.org/internet-drafts/


From zhangyunfei@chinamobile.com  Fri Oct 19 20:17:33 2012
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<DIV>Hi all,</DIV>
<DIV>
<DIV>&nbsp;=20
We&nbsp;have&nbsp;submitted&nbsp;the&nbsp;update&nbsp;of&nbsp;the&nbsp;pps=
p&nbsp;ps&nbsp;draft,&nbsp;following=20
Martin and Stefano's careful&nbsp;review&nbsp;comments&nbsp;in the WGLC=20
and&nbsp;double-checking&nbsp;the&nbsp;previous&nbsp;AD&nbsp;ballot.&nbsp;=
 The=20
information on the draft are as follows. We appreciate much of Martin and=20
Stefano's help. Thanks.</DIV>
<DIV>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV>BR</DIV>
<DIV>Yunfei</DIV>
<DIV>&nbsp;&nbsp; </DIV></DIV>
<DIV>&nbsp;</DIV>
<HR style=3D"WIDTH: 210px; HEIGHT: 1px" align=3Dleft color=3D#b5c4df SIZE=
=3D1>

<DIV><SPAN>zhangyunfei</SPAN></DIV>
<DIV>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV=20
style=3D"BORDER-BOTTOM: medium none; BORDER-LEFT: medium none; PADDING-BOT=
TOM: 0cm; PADDING-LEFT: 0cm; PADDING-RIGHT: 0cm; BORDER-TOP: #b5c4df 1pt s=
olid; BORDER-RIGHT: medium none; PADDING-TOP: 3pt">
<DIV=20
style=3D"PADDING-BOTTOM: 8px; PADDING-LEFT: 8px; PADDING-RIGHT: 8px; BACKG=
ROUND: #efefef; COLOR: #000000; FONT-SIZE: 12px; PADDING-TOP: 8px">
<DIV><B>From:</B>&nbsp;<A=20
href=3D"mailto:internet-drafts@ietf.org">internet-drafts</A></DIV>
<DIV><B>Date:</B>&nbsp;2012-10-20&nbsp;11:10</DIV>
<DIV><B>To:</B>&nbsp;<A href=3D"mailto:hishigh@gmail.com">hishigh</A></DIV=
>
<DIV><B>CC:</B>&nbsp;<A href=3D"mailto:zongning@huawei.com">zongning</A>; =
<A=20
href=3D"mailto:zhangyunfei@chinamobile.com">zhangyunfei</A></DIV>
<DIV><B>Subject:</B>&nbsp;New Version Notification for=20
draft-ietf-ppsp-problem-statement-11.txt</DIV></DIV></DIV>
<DIV>
<DIV>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV>A&nbsp;new&nbsp;version&nbsp;of&nbsp;I-D,&nbsp;draft-ietf-ppsp-proble=
m-statement-11.txt</DIV>
<DIV>has&nbsp;been&nbsp;successfully&nbsp;submitted&nbsp;by&nbsp;Yunfei&nb=
sp;Zhang&nbsp;and&nbsp;posted&nbsp;to&nbsp;the</DIV>
<DIV>IETF&nbsp;repository.</DIV>
<DIV>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV>Filename: &nbsp;draft-ietf-ppsp-problem-statement</DIV>
<DIV>Revision: &nbsp;11</DIV>
<DIV>Title:=20
&nbsp;Problem&nbsp;Statement&nbsp;and&nbsp;Requirements&nbsp;of&nbsp;Peer-=
to-Peer&nbsp;Streaming&nbsp;Protocol&nbsp;(PPSP)</DIV>
<DIV>Creation&nbsp;date: &nbsp;2012-10-20</DIV>
<DIV>WG&nbsp;ID: &nbsp;ppsp</DIV>
<DIV>Number&nbsp;of&nbsp;pages:&nbsp;25</DIV>
<DIV>URL:&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp=
;&nbsp;&nbsp;http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-ietf-ppsp-problem-s=
tatement-11.txt</DIV>
<DIV>Status:&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;ht=
tp://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-ppsp-problem-statement</DIV>
<DIV>Htmlized:&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;http://tools=
.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-ppsp-problem-statement-11</DIV>
<DIV>Diff:&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbs=
p;&nbsp;http://www.ietf.org/rfcdiff?url2=3Ddraft-ietf-ppsp-problem-stateme=
nt-11</DIV>
<DIV>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV>Abstract:</DIV>
<DIV>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;Peer-to-Peer&nbsp;(P2P&nbsp;for&nbsp;short)&nbsp;st=
reaming&nbsp;systems&nbsp;show&nbsp;more&nbsp;and&nbsp;more</DIV>
<DIV>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;popularity&nbsp;in&nbsp;current&nbsp;Internet&nbsp;=
with&nbsp;proprietary&nbsp;protocols.&nbsp;This</DIV>
<DIV>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;document&nbsp;identifies&nbsp;problems&nbsp;of&nbsp=
;the&nbsp;proprietary&nbsp;protocols,&nbsp;proposes</DIV>
<DIV>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;the&nbsp;development&nbsp;of&nbsp;Peer&nbsp;to&nbsp=
;Peer&nbsp;Streaming&nbsp;Protocol&nbsp;(PPSP)&nbsp;including</DIV>
<DIV>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;the&nbsp;tracker&nbsp;and&nbsp;peer&nbsp;protocol,&=
nbsp;and&nbsp;discusses&nbsp;the&nbsp;scope,&nbsp;requirements</DIV>
<DIV>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;and&nbsp;use&nbsp;cases&nbsp;of&nbsp;PPSP.</DIV>
<DIV>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nb=
sp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp=
;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&=
nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nb=
sp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp=
;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&=
nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV>The&nbsp;IETF&nbsp;Secretariat</DIV>
<DIV>&nbsp;</DIV></DIV></BODY></HTML>

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Subject: [ppsp] I-D Action: draft-ietf-ppsp-peer-protocol-03.txt
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A New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line Internet-Drafts director=
ies.
 This draft is a work item of the Peer to Peer Streaming Protocol Working G=
roup of the IETF.

	Title           : Peer-to-Peer Streaming Peer Protocol (PPSPP)
	Author(s)       : Arno Bakker
                          Riccardo Petrocco
                          Victor Grishchenko
	Filename        : draft-ietf-ppsp-peer-protocol-03.txt
	Pages           : 54
	Date            : 2012-10-21

Abstract:
   The Peer-to-Peer Streaming Peer Protocol (PPSPP) is a transport
   protocol for disseminating the same content to a group of interested
   parties in a streaming fashion.  PPSPP supports streaming of both
   pre-recorded (on-demand) and live audio/video content.  It is based
   on the peer-to-peer paradigm, where clients consuming the content are
   put on equal footing with the servers initially providing the
   content, to create a system where everyone can potentially provide
   upload bandwidth.  It has been designed to provide short time-till-
   playback for the end user, and to prevent disruption of the streams
   by malicious peers.  PPSPP has also been designed to be flexible and
   extensible.  It can use different mechanisms to optimize peer
   uploading, prevent freeriding, and work with different peer discovery
   schemes (centralized trackers or Distributed Hash Tables).  It
   supports multiple methods for content integrity protection and chunk
   addressing.  Designed as a generic protocol that can run on top of
   various transport protocols, it currently runs on top of UDP using
   LEDBAT for congestion control.


The IETF datatracker status page for this draft is:
https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-ppsp-peer-protocol

There's also a htmlized version available at:
http://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-ppsp-peer-protocol-03

A diff from the previous version is available at:
http://www.ietf.org/rfcdiff?url2=3Ddraft-ietf-ppsp-peer-protocol-03


Internet-Drafts are also available by anonymous FTP at:
ftp://ftp.ietf.org/internet-drafts/


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<DIV>Hi Arno,</DIV>
<DIV>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; Would you please summarize the main changes of thi=
s=20
version of draft? That will&nbsp;be helpful to review the draft. Thanks.</=
DIV>
<DIV>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV>BR</DIV>
<DIV>yunfei</DIV>
<DIV>&nbsp;</DIV>
<HR style=3D"WIDTH: 210px; HEIGHT: 1px" align=3Dleft color=3D#b5c4df SIZE=
=3D1>

<DIV><SPAN>zhangyunfei</SPAN></DIV>
<DIV>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV=20
style=3D"BORDER-BOTTOM: medium none; BORDER-LEFT: medium none; PADDING-BOT=
TOM: 0cm; PADDING-LEFT: 0cm; PADDING-RIGHT: 0cm; BORDER-TOP: #b5c4df 1pt s=
olid; BORDER-RIGHT: medium none; PADDING-TOP: 3pt">
<DIV=20
style=3D"PADDING-BOTTOM: 8px; PADDING-LEFT: 8px; PADDING-RIGHT: 8px; BACKG=
ROUND: #efefef; COLOR: #000000; FONT-SIZE: 12px; PADDING-TOP: 8px">
<DIV><B>From:</B>&nbsp;<A=20
href=3D"mailto:internet-drafts@ietf.org">internet-drafts</A></DIV>
<DIV><B>Date:</B>&nbsp;2012-10-22&nbsp;13:45</DIV>
<DIV><B>To:</B>&nbsp;<A=20
href=3D"mailto:i-d-announce@ietf.org">i-d-announce</A></DIV>
<DIV><B>CC:</B>&nbsp;<A href=3D"mailto:ppsp@ietf.org">ppsp</A></DIV>
<DIV><B>Subject:</B>&nbsp;[ppsp] I-D Action:=20
draft-ietf-ppsp-peer-protocol-03.txt</DIV></DIV></DIV>
<DIV>
<DIV>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV>A&nbsp;New&nbsp;Internet-Draft&nbsp;is&nbsp;available&nbsp;from&nbsp;=
the&nbsp;on-line&nbsp;Internet-Drafts&nbsp;directories.</DIV>
<DIV>&nbsp;This&nbsp;draft&nbsp;is&nbsp;a&nbsp;work&nbsp;item&nbsp;of&nbsp=
;the&nbsp;Peer&nbsp;to&nbsp;Peer&nbsp;Streaming&nbsp;Protocol&nbsp;Working=
&nbsp;Group&nbsp;of&nbsp;the&nbsp;IETF.</DIV>
<DIV>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV>Title&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbs=
p;:&nbsp;Peer-to-Peer&nbsp;Streaming&nbsp;Peer&nbsp;Protocol&nbsp;(PPSPP)<=
/DIV>
<DIV>Author(s)&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;:&nbsp;Arno&nbsp;B=
akker</DIV>
<DIV>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nb=
sp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp=
;&nbsp;&nbsp;Riccardo&nbsp;Petrocco</DIV>
<DIV>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nb=
sp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp=
;&nbsp;&nbsp;Victor&nbsp;Grishchenko</DIV>
<DIV>Filename&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;:&nbsp;draft-=
ietf-ppsp-peer-protocol-03.txt</DIV>
<DIV>Pages&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbs=
p;:&nbsp;54</DIV>
<DIV>Date&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp=
;&nbsp;:&nbsp;2012-10-21</DIV>
<DIV>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV>Abstract:</DIV>
<DIV>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;The&nbsp;Peer-to-Peer&nbsp;Streaming&nbsp;Peer&nbsp=
;Protocol&nbsp;(PPSPP)&nbsp;is&nbsp;a&nbsp;transport</DIV>
<DIV>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;protocol&nbsp;for&nbsp;disseminating&nbsp;the&nbsp;=
same&nbsp;content&nbsp;to&nbsp;a&nbsp;group&nbsp;of&nbsp;interested</DIV>
<DIV>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;parties&nbsp;in&nbsp;a&nbsp;streaming&nbsp;fashion.=
&nbsp;&nbsp;PPSPP&nbsp;supports&nbsp;streaming&nbsp;of&nbsp;both</DIV>
<DIV>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;pre-recorded&nbsp;(on-demand)&nbsp;and&nbsp;live&nb=
sp;audio/video&nbsp;content.&nbsp;&nbsp;It&nbsp;is&nbsp;based</DIV>
<DIV>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;on&nbsp;the&nbsp;peer-to-peer&nbsp;paradigm,&nbsp;w=
here&nbsp;clients&nbsp;consuming&nbsp;the&nbsp;content&nbsp;are</DIV>
<DIV>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;put&nbsp;on&nbsp;equal&nbsp;footing&nbsp;with&nbsp;=
the&nbsp;servers&nbsp;initially&nbsp;providing&nbsp;the</DIV>
<DIV>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;content,&nbsp;to&nbsp;create&nbsp;a&nbsp;system&nbs=
p;where&nbsp;everyone&nbsp;can&nbsp;potentially&nbsp;provide</DIV>
<DIV>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;upload&nbsp;bandwidth.&nbsp;&nbsp;It&nbsp;has&nbsp;=
been&nbsp;designed&nbsp;to&nbsp;provide&nbsp;short&nbsp;time-till-</DIV>
<DIV>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;playback&nbsp;for&nbsp;the&nbsp;end&nbsp;user,&nbsp=
;and&nbsp;to&nbsp;prevent&nbsp;disruption&nbsp;of&nbsp;the&nbsp;streams</D=
IV>
<DIV>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;by&nbsp;malicious&nbsp;peers.&nbsp;&nbsp;PPSPP&nbsp=
;has&nbsp;also&nbsp;been&nbsp;designed&nbsp;to&nbsp;be&nbsp;flexible&nbsp;=
and</DIV>
<DIV>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;extensible.&nbsp;&nbsp;It&nbsp;can&nbsp;use&nbsp;di=
fferent&nbsp;mechanisms&nbsp;to&nbsp;optimize&nbsp;peer</DIV>
<DIV>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;uploading,&nbsp;prevent&nbsp;freeriding,&nbsp;and&n=
bsp;work&nbsp;with&nbsp;different&nbsp;peer&nbsp;discovery</DIV>
<DIV>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;schemes&nbsp;(centralized&nbsp;trackers&nbsp;or&nbs=
p;Distributed&nbsp;Hash&nbsp;Tables).&nbsp;&nbsp;It</DIV>
<DIV>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;supports&nbsp;multiple&nbsp;methods&nbsp;for&nbsp;c=
ontent&nbsp;integrity&nbsp;protection&nbsp;and&nbsp;chunk</DIV>
<DIV>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;addressing.&nbsp;&nbsp;Designed&nbsp;as&nbsp;a&nbsp=
;generic&nbsp;protocol&nbsp;that&nbsp;can&nbsp;run&nbsp;on&nbsp;top&nbsp;o=
f</DIV>
<DIV>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;various&nbsp;transport&nbsp;protocols,&nbsp;it&nbsp=
;currently&nbsp;runs&nbsp;on&nbsp;top&nbsp;of&nbsp;UDP&nbsp;using</DIV>
<DIV>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;LEDBAT&nbsp;for&nbsp;congestion&nbsp;control.</DIV>
<DIV>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV>The&nbsp;IETF&nbsp;datatracker&nbsp;status&nbsp;page&nbsp;for&nbsp;th=
is&nbsp;draft&nbsp;is:</DIV>
<DIV>https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-ppsp-peer-protocol</DIV>
<DIV>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV>There's&nbsp;also&nbsp;a&nbsp;htmlized&nbsp;version&nbsp;available&nb=
sp;at:</DIV>
<DIV>http://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-ppsp-peer-protocol-03</DIV>
<DIV>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV>A&nbsp;diff&nbsp;from&nbsp;the&nbsp;previous&nbsp;version&nbsp;is&nbs=
p;available&nbsp;at:</DIV>
<DIV>http://www.ietf.org/rfcdiff?url2=3Ddraft-ietf-ppsp-peer-protocol-03</=
DIV>
<DIV>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV>Internet-Drafts&nbsp;are&nbsp;also&nbsp;available&nbsp;by&nbsp;anonym=
ous&nbsp;FTP&nbsp;at:</DIV>
<DIV>ftp://ftp.ietf.org/internet-drafts/</DIV>
<DIV>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV>_______________________________________________</DIV>
<DIV>ppsp&nbsp;mailing&nbsp;list</DIV>
<DIV>ppsp@ietf.org</DIV>
<DIV>https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ppsp</DIV></DIV></BODY></HTML>

------=_001_NextPart254133251415_=------


From a.bakker@vu.nl  Mon Oct 22 00:12:59 2012
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Date: Mon, 22 Oct 2012 09:12:55 +0200
From: Arno Bakker <arno@cs.vu.nl>
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On 22/10/2012 09:07, zhangyunfei wrote:
> Hi Arno,
> Would you please summarize the main changes of this version of draft?
> That will be helpful to review the draft. Thanks.

Hi Yunfei et al

there is still a revision history at the back of the document. I will 
update the tickets soon:

    Arno

    -03	2012-10-22 Major revision

        *   Updated Abstract and Introduction, removing download case.

        *   Resolved Ticket #4: Added explicit CHOKE/UNCHOKE messages.

        *   Removed directory lists unused in streaming.

        *   Resolved Ticket #22, #23, #28: Failure behaviour, error codes
            and dealing with peer crashes.

        *   Resolved Ticket #13: Chunk ranges are the default chunk
            addressing scheme that all peers MUST support.

        *   Added a section on compatibility between chunk addressing
            schemes.

        *   Expanded the explanation of Unified Merkle Trees as a method
            for content integrity protection for live streams.

        *   Added a section on forgetting chunks in live streaming.

        *   Added "End" option to protocol options and corrected bugs in
            UDP encapsulation, following Karl Knutsson's comments.

        *   Added SHA-2 support for Merkle Hash functions.

        *   Added content integrity protection methods for live streaming
            to the relevant protocol option.

        *   Added a Live Signature Algorithm protocol option.

        *   Resolved Ticket #24+27: The choice for UDP + LEDBAT as
            transport has now been reflected in the draft.  TCP and RTP
            encapsulations have been removed.

        *   Superfluous parts of Section 10 on extensibility have been
            removed.

        *   Removed appendix with Rationale.

        *   Resolved Ticket #21+25: PPSPP currently uses LEDBAT and the
            DATA and ACK messages now contain the time fields it
            requires.  Should other congestion control algorithms be
            supported in the future, a protocol option will be added.



From sprevidi@cisco.com  Mon Oct 22 01:19:34 2012
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Hi Folks,

looking forward to your demo !

Thanks.
s.


On Oct 18, 2012, at 3:01 PM, Johan Pouwelse wrote:

> Dear Stefano and Yunfei,
> We would like to request a 30minute slot within the PPSP Atlanta session
> regarding the peer protocol.
> 
> An updated version of "draft-ietf-ppsp-peer-protocol" should be
> finished soon, thanks to the hard work of Arno and Riccardo.
> They strive to take care of all open issues.
> Within this slot we also would like to demo our PPSP implementation
> available now on Android market.
>  -johan.
> On 16 October 2012 04:02, zhangyunfei <zhangyunfei@chinamobile.com> wrote:
>> Hi all,
>>    The IETF85 agenda has been published
>> (https://datatracker.ietf.org/meeting/85/agenda.txt) . The ppsp session is
>> currently planned on the morning in MONDAY, November 5, 2012 at Room 209.
>>     Please let stefano and me know if you have plan to present in the
>> meeting by Oct 23. Please note that the session time is subject to change
>> before the IETF.
>>    Thanks.
>> 
>> BR
>> Stefano and Yunfei
>> 
>> ________________________________
>> zhangyunfei
>> 
>> _______________________________________________
>> ppsp mailing list
>> ppsp@ietf.org
>> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ppsp
>> 
> 


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<DIV>Hi all,</DIV>
<DIV>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; The following is the Webex information for p=
psp in=20
ietf 85. Those who cannot attend the meeting at Atlanta could access the m=
eeting=20
online. Looking forward to "seeing" you online<IMG=20
src=3D"cid:_Foxmail.0@2B9C90CA-8BD6-453B-BD9C-9793C65D02F9">.</DIV>
<DIV>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV>BR</DIV>
<DIV>Yunfei</DIV>
<HR style=3D"WIDTH: 210px; HEIGHT: 1px" align=3Dleft color=3D#b5c4df SIZE=
=3D1>

<DIV><SPAN>zhangyunfei</SPAN></DIV>
<DIV>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV=20
style=3D"BORDER-BOTTOM: medium none; BORDER-LEFT: medium none; PADDING-BOT=
TOM: 0cm; PADDING-LEFT: 0cm; PADDING-RIGHT: 0cm; BORDER-TOP: #b5c4df 1pt s=
olid; BORDER-RIGHT: medium none; PADDING-TOP: 3pt">
<DIV=20
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ROUND: #efefef; COLOR: #000000; FONT-SIZE: 12px; PADDING-TOP: 8px">
<DIV><B>From:</B>&nbsp;<A href=3D"mailto:messenger@webex.com">Cindy=20
Morgan</A></DIV>
<DIV><B>Date:</B>&nbsp;2012-10-23&nbsp;00:11</DIV>
<DIV><B>To:</B>&nbsp;<A=20
href=3D"mailto:zhangyunfei@chinamobile.com">zhangyunfei</A></DIV>
<DIV><B>Subject:</B>&nbsp;Meeting invitation: ppsp</DIV></DIV></DIV>
<DIV>
<DIV class=3DFoxDiv20121023094747081862><FONT size=3D2=20
face=3D"Tahoma, Arial, sans-serif, Helvetica, Geneva"><BR>Hello , <BR><BR>=
Cindy=20
Morgan invites you to attend this online meeting. <BR><BR>Topic: ppsp <BR>=
Date:=20
Monday, November 5, 2012 <BR>Time: 9:00 am, Eastern Standard Time (New Yor=
k,=20
GMT-05:00) <BR>Meeting Number: 640 134 302 <BR>Meeting Password: 1234=20
<BR><BR><BR>------------------------------------------------------- <BR>To=
 join=20
the online meeting (Now from mobile devices!)=20
<BR>------------------------------------------------------- <BR>1. Go to <=
A=20
href=3D"https://ietf.webex.com/ietf/j.php?ED=3D162955682&amp;UID=3D1282530=
452&amp;PW=3DNNTBlZDhhOGM1&amp;RT=3DMiMxMQ%3D%3D"=20
target=3D_blank>https://ietf.webex.com/ietf/j.php?ED=3D162955682&amp;UID=
=3D1282530452&amp;PW=3DNNTBlZDhhOGM1&amp;RT=3DMiMxMQ%3D%3D</A>=20
<BR>2. If requested, enter your name and email address. <BR>3. If a passwo=
rd is=20
required, enter the meeting password: 1234 <BR>4. Click "Join". <BR><BR>To=
 view=20
in other time zones or languages, please click the link: <BR><A=20
href=3D"https://ietf.webex.com/ietf/j.php?ED=3D162955682&amp;UID=3D1282530=
452&amp;PW=3DNNTBlZDhhOGM1&amp;ORT=3DMiMxMQ%3D%3D"=20
target=3D_blank>https://ietf.webex.com/ietf/j.php?ED=3D162955682&amp;UID=
=3D1282530452&amp;PW=3DNNTBlZDhhOGM1&amp;ORT=3DMiMxMQ%3D%3D</A>=20
<BR><BR><BR>------------------------------------------------------- <BR>Fo=
r=20
assistance <BR>------------------------------------------------------- <BR=
>1. Go=20
to <A href=3D"https://ietf.webex.com/ietf/mc"=20
target=3D_blank>https://ietf.webex.com/ietf/mc</A> <BR>2. On the left navi=
gation=20
bar, click "Support". <BR><BR>You can contact me at: <BR><A=20
href=3D"mailto:cmorgan@amsl.com">cmorgan@amsl.com</A> <BR>1-510-492-4085=20
<BR><BR>To add this meeting to your calendar program (for example Microsof=
t=20
Outlook), click this link: <BR><A=20
href=3D"https://ietf.webex.com/ietf/j.php?ED=3D162955682&amp;UID=3D1282530=
452&amp;ICS=3DMI&amp;LD=3D1&amp;RD=3D2&amp;ST=3D1&amp;SHA2=3DAAAAAqVc-8Ltv=
gn0dvry0ywfekrVapLaG219oiDm2Fzkw9Py&amp;RT=3DMiMxMQ%3D%3D"=20
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AAqVc-8Ltvgn0dvry0ywfekrVapLaG219oiDm2Fzkw9Py&amp;RT=3DMiMxMQ%3D%3D</A>=20
<BR><BR>The playback of UCF (Universal Communications Format) rich media f=
iles=20
requires appropriate players. To view this type of rich media files in the=
=20
meeting, please check whether you have the players installed on your compu=
ter by=20
going to <A=20
href=3D"https://ietf.webex.com/ietf/systemdiagnosis.php">https://ietf.webe=
x.com/ietf/systemdiagnosis.php</A>.=20
<BR><BR>Sign up for a free trial of WebEx <BR><A=20
href=3D"http://www.webex.com/go/mcemfreetrial"=20
target=3D_blank>http://www.webex.com/go/mcemfreetrial</A> <BR><BR><A=20
href=3D"http://www.webex.com" target=3D_blank>http://www.webex.com</A>=20
<BR><BR><BR><BR>IMPORTANT NOTICE: This WebEx service includes a feature th=
at=20
allows audio and any documents and other materials exchanged or viewed dur=
ing=20
the session to be recorded. By joining this session, you automatically con=
sent=20
to such recordings. If you do not consent to the recording, discuss your=20
concerns with the meeting host prior to the start of the recording or do n=
ot=20
join the session. Please note that any such recordings may be subject to=20
discovery in the event of litigation. <BR></FONT></DIV></DIV></BODY></HTML=
>

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From sprevidi@cisco.com  Tue Oct 23 03:25:39 2012
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To: ppsp <ppsp@ietf.org>
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Subject: [ppsp] Pre-meeting information
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Folks,
 
below you have the documents that are going to be presented (and/or 
status update will be given) during our next meeting in Atlanta:
 
Problem Statement: 
     draft-ietf-ppsp-problem-statement-11.txt
Survey: 
     draft-ietf-ppsp-survey-03.txt
Peer Protocol: 
     draft-ietf-ppsp-peer-protocol-03.txt
Tracker Protocol: 
     draft-cruz-ppsp-base-tracker-protocol-01.txt
Extended Tacker Protocol: 
     draft-huang-ppsp-extended-tracker-protocol-01.txt
 
We want the Peer Protocol, Tracker Protocol and Survey drafts to 
be moved to the next step in the publication/standardization 
process and therefore attention from the WG is required.
 
Questions and concerns have been raised in the past and, I believe, 
there have been addressed in latest versions of the different 
documents.
 
We will ask the WG to approve (or defer) these document for the 
next cycle in the standardization process.

Please, be prepared to raise your concerns, your possible 
alternative proposals or, simply, your approvals.
 
Thanks.

s. and y.

From rachel.huang@huawei.com  Tue Oct 23 22:53:08 2012
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From: "Huangyihong (Rachel)" <rachel.huang@huawei.com>
To: "ppsp@ietf.org" <ppsp@ietf.org>
Thread-Topic: [ppsp]FW: New Version Notification for draft-huang-ppsp-extended-tracker-protocol-01.txt
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Subject: [ppsp] FW: New Version Notification for	draft-huang-ppsp-extended-tracker-protocol-01.txt
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Subject: [ppsp] ppsp draft agenda for IETF 85 is posted
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<DIV>Hi all,</DIV>
<DIV>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; We have posted the draft ppsp agenda in IETF 85 (<=
A=20
href=3D"http://www.ietf.org/proceedings/85/agenda/agenda-85-ppsp">http://w=
ww.ietf.org/proceedings/85/agenda/agenda-85-ppsp</A>)=20
according to the authors' requests. Please let Stefano and me know if you =
have=20
any comments and suggestions on this BEFORE Oct 28 when the revision of th=
e=20
agenda is permitted. Thanks.</DIV>
<DIV>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV>BR</DIV>
<DIV>Stefano &amp; Yunfei </DIV>
<DIV>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV>&nbsp;</DIV>
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<DIV><SPAN>zhangyunfei</SPAN></DIV></BODY></HTML>

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From dusan.gabrijelcic@gmail.com  Wed Oct 24 06:19:15 2012
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Subject: [ppsp] Enhanced Closed Swarm draft
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Dear all,

please receive attached a draft on Enhanced Closed Swarm protocol. Though
the draft was submitted on time it has been unfortunately submitted under
wrong name with no time to correct it and it is at the moment not listed
under officially submitted drafts. We are posting the draft to the mailing
list in agreement with PPSP chairs, kindly allowing the post. The draft
will be submitted officially as soon as possible (after 5th of November).

The draft covers Enhanced Closed Swarm protocol, an access control
mechanisms suitable for P2P content delivery systems and its application in
Peer-to-Peer Streaming Peer Protocol (PPSPP). The draft will be briefly
presented on the forthcoming IETF meeting by Johan.

Any comments or suggestions are welcome.

Kind regards, Dusan.
-- 
~~~~~~~~~~
Dusan Gabrijelcic
e-mail: dusan@e5.ijs.si

--14dae9340f9595009904cccdee98
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Dear all,<br><br>please receive attached a draft on Enhanced Closed Swarm p=
rotocol. Though the draft was submitted on time it has been unfortunately s=
ubmitted under wrong name with no time to correct it and it is at the momen=
t not listed under officially submitted drafts. We are posting the draft to=
 the mailing list in agreement with PPSP chairs, kindly allowing the post. =
The draft will be submitted officially as soon as possible (after 5th of No=
vember). <br clear=3D"all">

<br>The draft covers Enhanced Closed Swarm protocol, an access control mech=
anisms suitable for P2P content delivery systems and its application in Pee=
r-to-Peer Streaming Peer Protocol (PPSPP). The draft will be briefly presen=
ted on the forthcoming IETF meeting by Johan. <br>

<br>Any comments or suggestions are welcome.<br><br>Kind regards, Dusan.<br=
>-- <br>~~~~~~~~~~<br>Dusan Gabrijelcic<br>e-mail: <a href=3D"mailto:dusan@=
e5.ijs.si">dusan@e5.ijs.si</a><br>

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