From nobody Fri Feb 1 14:09:12 2019 Return-Path: X-Original-To: recentattendees@ietf.org Delivered-To: recentattendees@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from ietfa.amsl.com (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3CB15130EC7; Fri, 1 Feb 2019 14:08:53 -0800 (PST) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit From: IETF Secretariat To: "IETF Announcement List" Cc: recentattendees@ietf.org, ietf@ietf.org, 104all@ietf.org X-Test-IDTracker: no X-IETF-IDTracker: 6.90.0 Auto-Submitted: auto-generated Precedence: bulk Reply-To: agenda@ietf.org Message-ID: <154905893323.28457.5857994424810427491.idtracker@ietfa.amsl.com> Date: Fri, 01 Feb 2019 14:08:53 -0800 Archived-At: Subject: [Recentattendees] REMINDER: The early bird cutoff is Monday, February 4th at 23:59 X-BeenThere: recentattendees@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 List-Id: Recent IETF Attendees List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 01 Feb 2019 22:08:54 -0000 IETF 104 Hosted by: Cisco/ CZ.NIC Prague, Czech Republic March 23-29, 2019 IETF 104 Information: https://www.ietf.org/how/meetings/104/ Early Bird Deadline REMINDER: The early bird deadline for registration is, Monday, February 4th. Be sure to register and pay before the deadline passes! Register online at: https://ietf.org/meeting/register.html NOTE: If you have started the registration process but not completed payment, your registration record will be deleted at UTC 23:59 on Monday, February 4. After February 04 at UTC 23:59 you will be required to re-enter your data and the registration fee will be $875 USD (excluding VAT) until the next registration deadline on March 11, at which the registration fee will become $1,000 USD (excluding VAT). Accommodations 1. Hilton Prague (Headquarters Hotel, block of 500 rooms) Room Rate: $169.36 (single) $186.95 (double) USD. Includes daily breakfast, in-room high speed internet, access to Health Club and pool. VAT of 15% (taxes subject to change) is excluded from the above prices. Reservation Cutoff Date: 10 March 2019 Cancel with No Penalty: 21 Days prior to check-in/ arrival Distance to Meeting Venue: N/A Reservations: http://eventsathilton.com/show/5c41ed0749e7d06a7247f805 2. Hilton Prague Old Town (Overflow hotel) Room Rate: Discounted 10% off of Hotel’s Best Available Rate at the time of booking. Includes breakfast, in- room high speed internet, access to the fitness center and pool. VAT of 15% (taxes subject to change) is excluded from the above prices. Reservations Cutoff Date: No Cut-off Date Cancel with No Penalty: Up to 48 hours prior to check-in/arrival Distance to Meeting Venue: 1.8 km Reservations: https://tinyurl.com/IETF104HiltonOldTown 3. InterContinental Prague (Overflow hotel) Room Rate: $162.65 (single) $179.90 (double) USD. Includes breakfast, in-room high speed internet, fitness center and pool. VAT of 15% (taxes subject to change) is excluded from the above prices. Reservations Cutoff Date: 22 February 2019 Cancel with No Penalty: 14 days prior to check-in/arrival Distance to Meeting Venue: 2.3 km Reservations: https://tinyurl.com/IETF104InterContinental More details at: https://www.ietf.org/how/meetings/104/hotel/ Code Sprint The IETF 104 Code Sprint in Prague will, as always, let you work on fixing those things about the datatracker which you most urgently desire to do something about. When: Saturday, March 23 from 09:30 to 18:00 Where: Hilton Prague, Room TBD Signup: https://trac.tools.ietf.org/tools/ietfdb/wiki/IETF104SprintSignUp More information: https://trac.tools.ietf.org/tools/ietfdb/wiki/IETF104Sprint Hackathon The IETF is holding a Hackathon at IETF 104 to encourage developers to discuss, collaborate and develop utilities, ideas, sample code and solutions that show practical implementations of IETF standards. When: Saturday March 23 and Sunday March 24 Where: Hilton Prague, Room TBD Signup for the Hackathon: https://www.ietf.org/registration/ietf104/hackathonregistration.py More information can be found here: https://www.ietf.org/how/runningcode/hackathons/104-hackathon/ Keep up to date by subscribing to: https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/hackathon The Hackathon is free to attend and open to all. Extend the invitation to colleagues outside the IETF! Descriptions and information regarding the technologies for the hackathon are located on the IETF 104 Meeting Wiki: https://trac.ietf.org/trac/ietf/meeting/wiki/104hackathon Don’t see anything that interests you? Feel free to add your preferred technology to the list, sign up as its Champion and show up to work on it. Note: you must login to the wiki to add content. If you do add a new technology, we strongly suggest that you send an email to hackathon@ietf.org to let others know. You may generate interest in your technology, and find other people who want to contribute to it. From nobody Mon Feb 4 07:02:30 2019 Return-Path: X-Original-To: recentattendees@ietf.org Delivered-To: recentattendees@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from ietfa.amsl.com (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id A67CA12008A; Mon, 4 Feb 2019 07:02:04 -0800 (PST) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: IETF Secretariat To: "IETF Announcement List" Cc: recentattendees@ietf.org, ietf@ietf.org, 104all@ietf.org X-Test-IDTracker: no X-IETF-IDTracker: 6.90.0 Auto-Submitted: auto-generated Precedence: bulk Reply-To: agenda@ietf.org Message-ID: <154929252467.22845.12843818083637298342.idtracker@ietfa.amsl.com> Date: Mon, 04 Feb 2019 07:02:04 -0800 Archived-At: Subject: [Recentattendees] Early Bird Registration Ends Today! X-BeenThere: recentattendees@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 List-Id: Recent IETF Attendees List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 04 Feb 2019 15:02:05 -0000 IETF 104 Hosted by: Cisco/ CZ.NIC Prague, Czech Republic March 23-29, 2019 IETF 104 Information: https://www.ietf.org/how/meetings/104/ Early Bird Deadline REMINDER: The early bird deadline for registration is today, Monday, February 4th. Be sure to register and pay before the deadline passes! Register online at: https://ietf.org/meeting/register.html NOTE: If you have started the registration process but not completed payment, your registration record will be deleted at UTC 23:59 on Monday, February 4. After February 04 at UTC 23:59 you will be required to re-enter your data and the registration fee will be $875 USD (excluding VAT) until the next registration deadline on March 11, at which the registration fee will become $1,000 USD (excluding VAT). If you have any questions or need assistance, please do not hesitate to contact: ietf-registrar@ietf.org From nobody Fri Feb 22 16:06:07 2019 Return-Path: X-Original-To: recentattendees@ietf.org Delivered-To: recentattendees@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from ietfa.amsl.com (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id C3025130E85; Fri, 22 Feb 2019 16:05:43 -0800 (PST) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit From: IETF Agenda To: "IETF Announcement List" Cc: recentattendees@ietf.org, ietf@ietf.org, 104all@ietf.org X-Test-IDTracker: no X-IETF-IDTracker: 6.91.0 Auto-Submitted: auto-generated Precedence: bulk Reply-To: agenda@ietf.org Message-ID: <155088034379.5518.4616383450543152946.idtracker@ietfa.amsl.com> Date: Fri, 22 Feb 2019 16:05:43 -0800 Archived-At: Subject: [Recentattendees] IETF 104 Preliminary Agenda X-BeenThere: recentattendees@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 List-Id: Recent IETF Attendees List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sat, 23 Feb 2019 00:05:44 -0000 IETF 104 Prague, Czech Republic March 23-29, 2019 Hosts: Cisco and CZ.NIC The IETF 104 Preliminary Agenda has been posted. The final agenda will be published on Friday, March 1, 2019. https://datatracker.ietf.org/meeting/104/agenda.html https://datatracker.ietf.org/meeting/104/agenda.txt IETF 104 Information: https://www.ietf.org/how/meetings/104/ Register online at: https://www.ietf.org/how/meetings/register/ Don’t forget to register for these exciting IETF 104 events! Hackathon Signup: https://www.ietf.org/registration/ietf104/hackathonregistration.py More information: https://www.ietf.org/how/runningcode/hackathons/104-hackathon/ Keep up to date by subscribing to: https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/hackathon Code Sprint Signup: https://trac.tools.ietf.org/tools/ietfdb/wiki/IETF104SprintSignUp More information: https://trac.tools.ietf.org/tools/ietfdb/wiki/IETF104Sprint From nobody Fri Feb 22 21:08:58 2019 Return-Path: X-Original-To: recentattendees@ietf.org Delivered-To: recentattendees@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from ietfa.amsl.com (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3C99912785F; Fri, 22 Feb 2019 21:08:39 -0800 (PST) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: IETF Agenda To: "IETF Announcement List" Cc: recentattendees@ietf.org, ietf@ietf.org, 104all@ietf.org, wgchairs@ietf.org X-Test-IDTracker: no X-IETF-IDTracker: 6.91.0 Auto-Submitted: auto-generated Precedence: bulk Reply-To: agenda@ietf.org Message-ID: <155089851917.5347.209761560453230605.idtracker@ietfa.amsl.com> Date: Fri, 22 Feb 2019 21:08:39 -0800 Archived-At: Subject: [Recentattendees] Further Clarification Re: IETF 104 Preliminary Agenda X-BeenThere: recentattendees@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 List-Id: Recent IETF Attendees List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sat, 23 Feb 2019 05:08:39 -0000 Hi everyone, Our message earlier today announcing the preliminary agenda [1] was missing some further context. As previously mentioned by Alissa after IETF 103 [2], the IESG wanted to continue the unstructured time experiment at IETF 104. Wednesday's schedule has regular sessions until 13:20, unstructured time in the afternoon, and the plenary in the evening at 17:10. This leaves almost four hours of unstructured time for attendees to reserve for side meetings. During this period, there will also be one unique Technology Deep Dive session with the acronym WGTLGO [3]. Monday through Friday, we will have two rooms available for attendees to reserve for side meetings as usual. On Wednesday afternoon, we will have five rooms available for side meetings. Further details about how to sign up for these rooms will be announced shortly. Thanks, IETF Secretariat [1] https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/ietf-announce/_JeP2fQ7rHPosZWpNtpl8I_uL5U [2] https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/ietf-announce/H64AuTYhxsGqM1a8BfTkszCZyso [3] https://www.ietf.org/blog/ietf104-bofs/ From nobody Mon Feb 25 07:29:54 2019 Return-Path: X-Original-To: recentattendees@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: recentattendees@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 089C6130EE3; Mon, 25 Feb 2019 07:29:46 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.998 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.998 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE=-0.0001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=gmail.com Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 8TfV__D3ULsA; Mon, 25 Feb 2019 07:29:43 -0800 (PST) Received: from mail-lf1-x130.google.com (mail-lf1-x130.google.com [IPv6:2a00:1450:4864:20::130]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 517A312D4F2; Mon, 25 Feb 2019 07:29:43 -0800 (PST) Received: by mail-lf1-x130.google.com with SMTP id q12so7220921lfm.0; Mon, 25 Feb 2019 07:29:43 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20161025; h=mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date:message-id:subject:to :cc; bh=+a7xbNFk49SXUJBccELRhXc4xlnI3O0pQF4iVOrABec=; b=gPhOrxKMSTkCpCjGSB/K9NIIYo7Yo/Ss+Iv8pJnmQvgz6zvSU1A+V6keg1KyNbZoyK KdmiOtar/h+JHggx6/8qWsnfRhTE8UfqZsTZb+rJfwt8xRa8tIxiEueTn3LJUhha0NCU NqI91ZuOkLt1HxzQgbfOhDNj/+xj1rdIxitjYLHBpmvXxlP3ANMatP8LyNLtVYvyU7xB iVcs1pauOnd53B23SCiKw1BPqMdK7cjNhOoOz/PGswJWS2sHK0jV6UEJnfd7h+g4n2gR IPB21XS+NmN2kUslx02SLgu9aGit04fPscSYCHVJHcavJU4MFAFMMAmlVZuhbVtw4RXu J1iA== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date :message-id:subject:to:cc; bh=+a7xbNFk49SXUJBccELRhXc4xlnI3O0pQF4iVOrABec=; b=gBnvqsBNwHaMJcrLV0UgyHPxc4rM6NBLni479qVkIJRsHz4UoacfNn5nHbl9DBcrX5 uFWv6hREzbOfxTDv9xGcFcLAU/6SXsUOkRVsml/17DqKP8qGyLCvklRFtNgbeiw4oHXG zDc+t49iPpw6s4nF4wFLvmkBbv8M4t82nQezoeGKcUwP4zABdlaV6226pqWWjHu17EfZ NpYgNLpxT1mjAAAeAKoyhr65eStade63Sn3Oi4tUkRqEi68j8o9Bvkwr+3qR13njrRs2 YRhmmcN1JjFf/STdPpRxN57lfp4L1jJrgZje79MiJQ1EK2kSPfs+Fb+lwuVRkRpjVQPS WjNQ== X-Gm-Message-State: AHQUAuZZdeUymLhZti8Hn5qolCPlrhE3rogGV0CZG2Ztmf0Kmmgjyqui XWCdATA+Hi3pLnwC7wnNa9aXUKFlG8q2r/rhePKA+yxt X-Google-Smtp-Source: AHgI3IYlJP79yAVqkFAcsbUiMRJIMN5LE70eKHVPuODjkzfOTqVl33GtlAHMV1ph0qaxzFvXUFRShGo9t8M9C4a99sY= X-Received: by 2002:a19:4948:: with SMTP id l8mr11443375lfj.156.1551108580824; Mon, 25 Feb 2019 07:29:40 -0800 (PST) MIME-Version: 1.0 References: <155089851917.5347.209761560453230605.idtracker@ietfa.amsl.com> In-Reply-To: <155089851917.5347.209761560453230605.idtracker@ietfa.amsl.com> From: Greg Mirsky Date: Mon, 25 Feb 2019 07:29:29 -0800 Message-ID: To: agenda@ietf.org Cc: IETF Announcement List , wgchairs@ietf.org, recentattendees@ietf.org, IETF list , 104all@ietf.org Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="000000000000f7dcb40582b99b85" Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Recentattendees] [104all] Further Clarification Re: IETF 104 Preliminary Agenda X-BeenThere: recentattendees@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: Recent IETF Attendees List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 25 Feb 2019 15:29:47 -0000 --000000000000f7dcb40582b99b85 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Dear All, I'm disappointed to find that the number of conflicts for me at IETF-104 is as high as in Bangkok which was two times higher than at any meeting before. I'm stressed that I'll have to run from DetNet to BFD to deliver presentations on work being done, forget being able to follow the discussion adequately. If that's the new normal, then why to come to the meeting at all. I strongly encourage IESG to let us use all available time for WG sessions and let attendees use their time for "corridor talks". Regards, Greg On Fri, Feb 22, 2019 at 9:08 PM IETF Agenda wrote: > Hi everyone, > > Our message earlier today announcing the preliminary agenda [1] was > missing some further context. As previously mentioned by Alissa after IETF > 103 [2], the IESG wanted to continue the unstructured time experiment at > IETF 104. > > Wednesday's schedule has regular sessions until 13:20, unstructured time > in the afternoon, and the plenary in the evening at 17:10. This leaves > almost four hours of unstructured time for attendees to reserve for side > meetings. During this period, there will also be one unique Technology Deep > Dive session with the acronym WGTLGO [3]. > > Monday through Friday, we will have two rooms available for attendees to > reserve for side meetings as usual. On Wednesday afternoon, we will have > five rooms available for side meetings. Further details about how to sign > up for these rooms will be announced shortly. > > Thanks, > IETF Secretariat > > > [1] > https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/ietf-announce/_JeP2fQ7rHPosZWpNtpl8I_uL5U > [2] > https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/ietf-announce/H64AuTYhxsGqM1a8BfTkszCZyso > [3] https://www.ietf.org/blog/ietf104-bofs/ > > -- > 104all mailing list > 104all@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/104all > --000000000000f7dcb40582b99b85 Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Dear All,
I'm disappoi= nted to find that the number of conflicts for me at IETF-104 is as high as = in Bangkok which was two times higher than at any meeting before. I'm s= tressed that I'll have to run from DetNet to BFD to deliver presentatio= ns on work being done, forget being able to follow the discussion adequatel= y. If that's the new normal, then why to come to the meeting at all.=C2= =A0
I strongly encourage IESG to let us use all available time fo= r WG sessions and let attendees use their time for "corridor talks&quo= t;.

Regards,
Greg




On Fri, Feb 22, 2019 at 9:08 PM IETF Agen= da <agenda@ietf.org> wrote:
Hi everyone,

Our message earlier today announcing the preliminary agenda [1] was missing= some further context. As previously mentioned by Alissa after IETF 103 [2]= , the IESG wanted to continue the unstructured time experiment at IETF 104.=

Wednesday's schedule has regular sessions until 13:20, unstructured tim= e in the afternoon, and the plenary in the evening at 17:10. This leaves al= most four hours of unstructured time for attendees to reserve for side meet= ings. During this period, there will also be one unique Technology Deep Div= e session with the acronym WGTLGO [3].

Monday through Friday, we will have two rooms available for attendees to re= serve for side meetings as usual. On Wednesday afternoon, we will have five= rooms available for side meetings. Further details about how to sign up fo= r these rooms will be announced shortly.

Thanks,
IETF Secretariat


[1]=C2=A0 https://mai= larchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/ietf-announce/_JeP2fQ7rHPosZWpNtpl8I_uL5U [2]=C2=A0 https://mai= larchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/ietf-announce/H64AuTYhxsGqM1a8BfTkszCZyso [3]=C2=A0 https://www.ietf.org/blog/ietf104-bofs/

--
104all mailing list
104all@ietf.org https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/104all
--000000000000f7dcb40582b99b85-- From nobody Mon Feb 25 12:26:23 2019 Return-Path: X-Original-To: recentattendees@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: recentattendees@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 19D97130FF6 for ; Mon, 25 Feb 2019 12:26:17 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.999 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.999 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE=-0.0001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=unavailable autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (1024-bit key) header.d=krose.org Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id wSaopAjkt2Oz for ; Mon, 25 Feb 2019 12:26:13 -0800 (PST) Received: from mail-yw1-xc44.google.com (mail-yw1-xc44.google.com [IPv6:2607:f8b0:4864:20::c44]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 8A4B4130FB8 for ; Mon, 25 Feb 2019 12:26:13 -0800 (PST) Received: by mail-yw1-xc44.google.com with SMTP id o184so4185113ywo.5 for ; Mon, 25 Feb 2019 12:26:13 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=krose.org; s=google; h=mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date:message-id:subject:to :cc; bh=onyFgb3xHCe4YbcgWAvW5VrdVyRGQfaqlKFhTmP4Yjc=; b=YgJdAEMWQkrPoSci86xhqHnZ7jXF9pl3sR+41Bf9EIKqooaK65T5wyfygNxQQtW1mb b9OTXnUPyK4x4lar+mhdjY9waxnCvQCM6i6GLS2/kphaW6+EP13pAM8ndbwp4FFPIdrC J6y+ZM6zKcFsEYzWOheWonm8/xE4CW3lYdNJ8= X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date :message-id:subject:to:cc; bh=onyFgb3xHCe4YbcgWAvW5VrdVyRGQfaqlKFhTmP4Yjc=; b=DaXXfQyl+4dBLSpdKfbiN6VKvsnKXHSKD5P7VNF+71niSAGxlgLhWtv1m/Kah1pZ9N SYWJrj6YhBIJ5eGa+Qh8oJ3gi7JL3KTBXJt6OtLssowpIMa+dSe05PtsqZJkjygJ5PhL 3RVF2fa83XvRmm+BPd+sAlvPlRCjSiOn0caLFq99WDUE4Bgal4OeTD0+7GcIKODjehpB LpTA+SfVVCtFITNA1r2PgFYn4IxR83Gr7BT9SkYb7GsMxzkSxo9cUrRH0dC6vfTjO4j7 KBRkyUneHRUPLAcGCj7HGYz1DpBYIjEIL3lD9HntmNReu/u5CZU+hTLI212aSQT9jxyx jHZA== X-Gm-Message-State: AHQUAua/rHNf/Mb00gih/NTSojggqzXhIW2VyqTKJGjN3tx7a4mwVq6e jpDKDQbjIOYBFYr45RLiCL7Zp9xjauveHlXi9JdJHA== X-Google-Smtp-Source: AHgI3IbyzZkHdju05I8CpL51170tpy9cpUD5AJTwX5iLxPbMEs8CTm7/BswCnp1koE7zvKtRjZLC0GZn3V/a5VQEtqk= X-Received: by 2002:a0d:d8c3:: with SMTP id a186mr15459181ywe.221.1551126372392; Mon, 25 Feb 2019 12:26:12 -0800 (PST) MIME-Version: 1.0 References: <155089851917.5347.209761560453230605.idtracker@ietfa.amsl.com> In-Reply-To: <155089851917.5347.209761560453230605.idtracker@ietfa.amsl.com> From: Kyle Rose Date: Mon, 25 Feb 2019 15:26:00 -0500 Message-ID: To: agenda@ietf.org Cc: IETF Announcement List , WG Chairs , recentattendees@ietf.org, IETF Discussion Mailing List , 104all@ietf.org Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="0000000000006db3880582bdc055" Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Recentattendees] [104all] Further Clarification Re: IETF 104 Preliminary Agenda X-BeenThere: recentattendees@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: Recent IETF Attendees List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 25 Feb 2019 20:26:17 -0000 --0000000000006db3880582bdc055 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" There seem to be two separate issues here: 1. The meeting ends on Friday. 2. There is some combination of too few slots, too many (or too long) WG session requests, and not enough information about meaningful conflicts to construct a viable schedule. #2 is a problem that the secretariat can partially address through changes to the conflict declaration process. For example, by allowing chairs to specify *individuals* who need to be at particular sessions because they're presenting or are heavily involved in work, rather than via the working group proxy, which may (and does IME) encode preference as well as need, may become stale over the course of meetings, and often fails to capture critical conflicts. This is a hard problem, but if it's possible to get a viable schedule for the requested WG sessions given the number of slots, there is a solution. The secretariat can't address the problem of too many (or too long) WG sessions, because it's a judgment call on the part of those involved in the WGs. Perhaps sponsoring ADs can get more involved in deciding whether a WG really needs to consume an official meeting slot, or whether they really need as much time as requested for in-person work. This is also a hard problem, but if we're going to make the most efficient use of limited official in-person meeting time, hard choices will need to be made. (IMO, leave the draft status updates to the mailing list. Use the meeting for issues chosen in advance that will benefit from in-person discussion and collaboration.) #1, by contrast, is an easy problem to solve. Your WG can be assigned to a slot anywhere from Monday to Friday at the secretariat's discretion. Therefore: don't schedule your return trip until late on Friday at the earliest, or don't complain when you are scheduled to leave before the meeting ends. Which is on Friday. Seems straightforward. Kyle On Sat, Feb 23, 2019 at 12:08 AM IETF Agenda wrote: > Hi everyone, > > Our message earlier today announcing the preliminary agenda [1] was > missing some further context. As previously mentioned by Alissa after IETF > 103 [2], the IESG wanted to continue the unstructured time experiment at > IETF 104. > > Wednesday's schedule has regular sessions until 13:20, unstructured time > in the afternoon, and the plenary in the evening at 17:10. This leaves > almost four hours of unstructured time for attendees to reserve for side > meetings. During this period, there will also be one unique Technology Deep > Dive session with the acronym WGTLGO [3]. > > Monday through Friday, we will have two rooms available for attendees to > reserve for side meetings as usual. On Wednesday afternoon, we will have > five rooms available for side meetings. Further details about how to sign > up for these rooms will be announced shortly. > > Thanks, > IETF Secretariat > > > [1] > https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/ietf-announce/_JeP2fQ7rHPosZWpNtpl8I_uL5U > [2] > https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/ietf-announce/H64AuTYhxsGqM1a8BfTkszCZyso > [3] https://www.ietf.org/blog/ietf104-bofs/ > > -- > 104all mailing list > 104all@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/104all > --0000000000006db3880582bdc055 Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
There seem to be two separate issues here:
=
1. The meeting ends on Friday.

2. T= here is some combination of too few slots, too many (or too long) WG sessio= n requests, and not enough information about meaningful conflicts to constr= uct a viable schedule.

#2 is a problem that the se= cretariat can partially address through changes to the conflict declaration= process. For example, by allowing chairs to specify *individuals* who need= to be at particular sessions because they're presenting or are heavily= involved in work, rather than via the working group proxy, which may (and = does IME) encode preference as well as need, may become stale over the cour= se of meetings, and often fails to capture critical conflicts. This is a ha= rd problem, but if it's possible to get a viable schedule for the reque= sted WG sessions given the number of slots, there is a solution.
<= div>
The secretariat can't address the problem of too man= y (or too long) WG sessions, because it's a judgment call on the part o= f those involved in the WGs. Perhaps sponsoring ADs can get more involved i= n deciding whether a WG really needs to consume an official meeting slot, o= r whether they really need as much time as requested for in-person work. Th= is is also a hard problem, but if we're going to make the most efficien= t use of limited official in-person meeting time, hard choices will need to= be made. (IMO, leave the draft status updates to the mailing list. Use the= meeting for issues chosen in advance that will benefit from in-person disc= ussion and collaboration.)

#1, by contrast, is= an easy problem to solve. Your WG can be assigned to a slot anywhere from = Monday to Friday at the secretariat's discretion. Therefore: don't = schedule your return trip until late on Friday at the earliest, or don'= t complain when you are scheduled to leave before the meeting ends. Which i= s on Friday. Seems straightforward.

Kyle
=


On Sat, Feb 23, 2019 at 12:08 AM IETF Agenda <agenda@ietf.org> wrote:
Hi everyone,

Our message earlier today announcing the preliminary agenda [1] was missing= some further context. As previously mentioned by Alissa after IETF 103 [2]= , the IESG wanted to continue the unstructured time experiment at IETF 104.=

Wednesday's schedule has regular sessions until 13:20, unstructured tim= e in the afternoon, and the plenary in the evening at 17:10. This leaves al= most four hours of unstructured time for attendees to reserve for side meet= ings. During this period, there will also be one unique Technology Deep Div= e session with the acronym WGTLGO [3].

Monday through Friday, we will have two rooms available for attendees to re= serve for side meetings as usual. On Wednesday afternoon, we will have five= rooms available for side meetings. Further details about how to sign up fo= r these rooms will be announced shortly.

Thanks,
IETF Secretariat


[1]=C2=A0 https://mai= larchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/ietf-announce/_JeP2fQ7rHPosZWpNtpl8I_uL5U [2]=C2=A0 https://mai= larchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/ietf-announce/H64AuTYhxsGqM1a8BfTkszCZyso [3]=C2=A0 https://www.ietf.org/blog/ietf104-bofs/

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--0000000000006db3880582bdc055-- From nobody Mon Feb 25 12:33:33 2019 Return-Path: X-Original-To: recentattendees@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: recentattendees@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6A360131011; Mon, 25 Feb 2019 12:33:31 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE=-0.0001, SPF_PASS=-0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=gmail.com Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id LrvHD94HUlGX; Mon, 25 Feb 2019 12:33:30 -0800 (PST) Received: from mail-ot1-x330.google.com (mail-ot1-x330.google.com [IPv6:2607:f8b0:4864:20::330]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 2A750130FF5; Mon, 25 Feb 2019 12:33:30 -0800 (PST) Received: by mail-ot1-x330.google.com with SMTP id 32so9036447ota.12; Mon, 25 Feb 2019 12:33:30 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20161025; h=from:message-id:mime-version:subject:date:in-reply-to:cc:to :references; bh=iUu5Sks+lesdCJrNyZaS9DHfOWOugsX0eiDFqtDVzjY=; b=kZt542uEuX857kcVbl6bk4L5lhhuLORWcqoBY/3967mfZoEeab3GkeNHSWW6gWlx9q xZHgjhIhMXGCpHuyz12xp1w3bJylnJ7sHFceXbvq4WgZMCuzdMEvJ/N8pE/Q4PNnO2+p aHlzkWE4tdDZl3x97K/6ervksw8xygVOiiKMMZT1f0FQ4CRZGpipHpFDkJJi4MymefAm sqGjlQmP9BQ9b5G2yS7/q42GSHeFkP8u1+vUP4OOT4zSIimNHO5bgDrleAbygixOYCTk muICGjemoU9LsnwTYZZamz5EIVQ0Vi/Vv/l5cEfnmvsWXg2aSGzIG8MrZ6r8R7vKY2JT S/zw== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:from:message-id:mime-version:subject:date :in-reply-to:cc:to:references; bh=iUu5Sks+lesdCJrNyZaS9DHfOWOugsX0eiDFqtDVzjY=; b=avFa00yI0ZLOS2q9NZAw1UA+XoI3DjVA9jl9E459j6v4dkb7VE9VkL/hF4GzPYOP4g 09lX8XP6fbDWmVB6SFaGQdWsqD8544e6wdv1UyM8xOfL7EMPE5v+wwkBbKRaXDB+C4Nv s45RhMJLieFU52yty2kD8fLwBI+15T9eEFJb4FyHR+4ZY2CGcSki04Rm5pn2JjrTNr7l pUf6Xw95wa8OUMbaDHXY1zh2huEXG2O9bks/NisnMm7Hk2vBel0gcrq3zUHxS7t999JC h5UBKXYvnjM04sIMMT0DXIqVr8GQXRMXKSJO2scH/DxkqrPfOEtMWTo63Y7xUyZS5PR3 A8eA== X-Gm-Message-State: AHQUAuaYuUY3tXw9nM+23fKQUp8VZPc3YeM7eUo3yyvW45Ancsiri/Vp 3oo7Nl63+6FtL8gjXsMivGg= X-Google-Smtp-Source: AHgI3IYYgjcpTPMEDl9RT0WL/NKbl+T7WCqtLoi9qf0IJS+iYumpHmzFbOVQSwuG71632+zevuSpwQ== X-Received: by 2002:a9d:80e:: with SMTP id 14mr2540054oty.108.1551126809333; Mon, 25 Feb 2019 12:33:29 -0800 (PST) Received: from ?IPv6:2600:8802:5600:164::100b? ([2600:8802:5600:164::100b]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id 187sm4503646oid.22.2019.02.25.12.33.27 (version=TLS1_2 cipher=ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 bits=128/128); Mon, 25 Feb 2019 12:33:28 -0800 (PST) From: Fred Baker Message-Id: <9DE19647-BA11-4ACD-B57B-FE49D760F255@gmail.com> Content-Type: multipart/signed; boundary="Apple-Mail=_6DEA013D-E9B8-4684-B953-50EC8A256C9B"; protocol="application/pgp-signature"; micalg=pgp-sha512 Mime-Version: 1.0 (Mac OS X Mail 12.4 \(3445.104.2\)) Date: Mon, 25 Feb 2019 12:33:25 -0800 In-Reply-To: <8EB337F5-D68B-4160-A26C-E8C7693E13F2@gmail.com> Cc: Alissa Cooper , Working Group Chairs , IETF , recentattendees@ietf.org, 104all@ietf.org To: Stewart Bryant References: <155089851917.5347.209761560453230605.idtracker@ietfa.amsl.com> <23D062E4-4464-48C2-9464-61697C2351D6@cooperw.in> <3a201a22-6ed2-ab83-5205-a28af7ba49d7@labn.net> <8EB337F5-D68B-4160-A26C-E8C7693E13F2@gmail.com> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.3445.104.2) Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Recentattendees] [104all] Further Clarification Re: IETF 104 Preliminary Agenda X-BeenThere: recentattendees@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: Recent IETF Attendees List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 25 Feb 2019 20:33:32 -0000 --Apple-Mail=_6DEA013D-E9B8-4684-B953-50EC8A256C9B Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii > On Feb 24, 2019, at 11:34 PM, Stewart Bryant = wrote: >=20 > A better approach might be to ask people at registration what sessions = they needed to attend. An even better approach, although it delays feedback by one meeting, = would be to look into the IETFers Application data. People list what = they want to attend for the purpose of calendar maintenance. That would = inform the next meeting's agenda development. = --------------------------------------------------------------------------= ------ The fact that there is a highway to hell and a stairway to heaven is an = interesting comment on projected traffic volume... --Apple-Mail=_6DEA013D-E9B8-4684-B953-50EC8A256C9B Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: attachment; filename=signature.asc Content-Type: application/pgp-signature; name=signature.asc Content-Description: Message signed with OpenPGP -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- iQIzBAEBCgAdFiEEctjlJjQmVrp9uMq7EhdRnd2GP+AFAlx0URUACgkQEhdRnd2G P+C8KBAApDO7rcXP/bFuvA25Co3Bste1UT5ti/isybYf33Fwou1cheCAA1rTRwGe K9BZ+kvro7wozO02pUL9CUrdWoqb1VPsnHg0w31Q2Xqw6G/c99xP7NX0SHy5gQs1 +rWr5ofwJ+lAgCNNvxs2QzsYlhLO39m1txThMZ276h+K/QaU8zokxlluFWsEE9bF XXFWgVnqhl0oaxrIhbXB25bXp+66SJhAYR0kQMxThmG8ynrEEhtHRdEHjBmalRPQ JPe34tCUuyB4O+S4UQ7fW9L+bqF1eYi0OILBAqZwIn/0sGkt5J+PC+XN+wEeFzjl rOHLPJFwfxCbCK3CM2gQ9ZpJW9vLgMQXywnGVrWFhhHG9EWU8D1m3IX2KVLD4LA/ IMMIQssGPBxf7Gd12QstVHQJUNmzVAK/+QVybxfVXREJSik7pCZXX3yKvL5/9Z5Q x8ALhF/l2Ejz5orxa9zRc39e0wkwiHQwhaWOzv4Rm9r0W6EmyA7fFIlV9s/k/3K/ 2p2Rmw/dv5o8pgtywUgUsHTKhR6/dYfygWABbu8e7sjnlC67p6S7J84aV5ZJZNI4 BrXNC2vM610GObQQq8m8D4Due5s/kksg3B131ZIvwxJHkd1sCZYppi4CjJGsKY4C GwnhkKSPMxA8SHEqPx2PIQYmH0GtgT1sygAtMHqjocwJvq/b06c= =yCOa -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --Apple-Mail=_6DEA013D-E9B8-4684-B953-50EC8A256C9B-- From nobody Mon Feb 25 12:56:31 2019 Return-Path: X-Original-To: recentattendees@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: recentattendees@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1E6A0130FDA for ; 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Mon, 25 Feb 2019 12:56:25 -0800 (PST) MIME-Version: 1.0 References: <155089851917.5347.209761560453230605.idtracker@ietfa.amsl.com> In-Reply-To: From: Kyle Rose Date: Mon, 25 Feb 2019 15:56:13 -0500 Message-ID: To: "Les Ginsberg (ginsberg)" Cc: WG Chairs , "recentattendees@ietf.org" , IETF Discussion Mailing List , "104all@ietf.org" <104all@ietf.org> Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="0000000000007b8ff40582be2c04" Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Recentattendees] [104all] Further Clarification Re: IETF 104 Preliminary Agenda X-BeenThere: recentattendees@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: Recent IETF Attendees List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 25 Feb 2019 20:56:29 -0000 --0000000000007b8ff40582be2c04 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable On Mon, Feb 25, 2019 at 3:45 PM Les Ginsberg (ginsberg) wrote: > Kyle =E2=80=93 > > > > It seems to me that your summary has overlooked one key point. As per the > announcement: > > > > ** > > *Wednesday's schedule has regular sessions until 13:20, unstructured time > in the afternoon, and the plenary in the evening at 17:10. This leaves > almost four hours of unstructured time for attendees to reserve for side > meetings.* > > ** > > > > And part of your response is: > > > > ** > > *The secretariat can't address the problem of too many (or too long) WG > sessions,* > > ** > > > > Presumably the alternative could have been to have another slot in the > afternoon on Wednesday for WG meetings =E2=80=93 which would have provide= d more > flexibility in avoiding conflicts. > No contest. I should have listed that as a third issue. > Without taking sides, I think the question is whether the introduction of > =E2=80=9Cunstructured time=E2=80=9D is adding or subtracting value. > It really seems like we're trying to stuff too much into 5 days. (When you have 5 lbs of manure and a 4 lbs bag...) Were side meetings in the mornings, evenings, or during slots without important sessions not working? Are there groups that really are too busy to skip less important sessions in favor of collaborative side work? (E.g., there are WGs I *like* to attend, but when it conflicts with some work I *need* to do, I know where I'm going to be. These 3 weeks per year are precious, and with every session being recorded, anything I'm passively consuming gets watched later.) It's not like the entire IETF needs to collaborate in the same place at the same time, so I'm skeptical of the need for slots dedicated to unstructured work. That said, even with the addition of Wednesday afternoon to the available slots, the crunch would still exist. The other two issues need to be addressed. Kyle --0000000000007b8ff40582be2c04 Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
On Mon, Feb 25, 2019 at 3:45 PM Les Ginsberg (ginsberg) <ginsberg@cisco.com> wrote:
<= blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-l= eft:1px solid rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex">

Kyle =E2=80=93

=C2=A0

It seems to me that your summary= has overlooked one key point. As per the announcement:

=C2=A0

<snip>

Wednesday's schedule has = regular sessions until 13:20, unstructured time in the afternoon, and the p= lenary in the evening at 17:10. This leaves almost four hours of unstructured time for attendees to reserve for side meetings.

<end snip>

=C2=A0

And part of your response is:

=C2=A0

<snip>

The secretariat can't add= ress the problem of too many (or too long) WG sessions,

<end snip>

=C2=A0

Presumably the alternative could= have been to have another slot in the afternoon on Wednesday for WG meetin= gs =E2=80=93 which would have provided more flexibility in avoiding conflicts.


No contest. I should have listed that as a third issue.


Without taking sides, I think the question is whether the introduction o= f =E2=80=9Cunstructured time=E2=80=9D is adding or subtracting value.
=C2=A0
It really seems like we're t= rying to stuff too much=20 into 5 days. (When you have 5 lbs of manure and a 4 lbs bag...) Were=20 side meetings in the mornings, evenings, or during slots without=20 important sessions not working? Are there groups that really are too busy t= o skip less important sessions in favor of collaborative side work? (E.g., = there are WGs I *like* to attend, but=20 when it conflicts with some work I *need* to do, I know where I'm going= to be. These 3 weeks per year are precious, and with every session being r= ecorded, anything I'm passively consuming gets watched later.) It's= not like the entire IETF needs to collaborate in the same place at the sam= e time, so I'm skeptical of the need for slots dedicated to unstructure= d work.

That said, even with the addition of Wednesday afternoon to the available= slots, the crunch would still exist. The other two issues need to be addre= ssed.

Kyle

--0000000000007b8ff40582be2c04-- From nobody Mon Feb 25 13:24:56 2019 Return-Path: X-Original-To: recentattendees@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: recentattendees@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id BAA931279E6 for ; Mon, 25 Feb 2019 13:24:48 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.999 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.999 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE=-0.0001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=unavailable autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (1024-bit key) header.d=krose.org Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id SimMIpdxZMtt for ; Mon, 25 Feb 2019 13:24:46 -0800 (PST) Received: from mail-yb1-xb2c.google.com (mail-yb1-xb2c.google.com [IPv6:2607:f8b0:4864:20::b2c]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 62485130F66 for ; Mon, 25 Feb 2019 13:24:46 -0800 (PST) Received: by mail-yb1-xb2c.google.com with SMTP id c3so2060263ybo.11 for ; Mon, 25 Feb 2019 13:24:46 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=krose.org; s=google; h=mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date:message-id:subject:to :cc; bh=qRnP8nvaszZQiezrB8p9XQ3BCGwlCJbZKJazGdKTzds=; b=mmmzDvmaBxccA+sAFBrUlvy79VWs0XXTBL/mDrfL6uLTag6Sn1pQM6IpU7MuRhe2il eNLpb0WOmt+TuSengJDf6TtXB5jQocPQiMlkME0P13Y1m/WNgsqdRvUzFXyqvOnlIShq rzc09H7zkXdVTluWZI78j68ndgOzfF1xmZEy8= X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date :message-id:subject:to:cc; bh=qRnP8nvaszZQiezrB8p9XQ3BCGwlCJbZKJazGdKTzds=; b=pEBW38M9H1sv+S21Nsv3wuptk8yp9idrgd1WS8ngBeVo4XY8/snOaWsbY6ZfvpULLa OId3zda8+0ILwF3mh/67UPVLsi6AjB0wrt5Lzu2/t7961iC07yzVJwBQZOmAPG9sbx4L rwRy3P1b4UYSHF6aMGfT0Ss2FBY6eA/1cWZ/ovhGVFKzXytiZ8ZiKY1YHAuNi7uYlbUC OIZ3tVYiwx7H9hL//qPwNdsCoc2fm8j/moio2xA2Tgj8hxnCMZ1LN4qKo9qxMzaiffqM VEResXohDtVfCJsS9uFp/Mguw4kSaziPlDubj3707jcUMo8NjTM23d8by7a9PBTp8/MT EriA== X-Gm-Message-State: AHQUAuYCfuhSoSCL9KgiAAOhs7AhiAL0xIW2ewrnljlKWGRqdotpSUcn WfZiR3RHyB46sVZqKzG+cPO5eXebD5O1ooPdFQ1uCg== X-Google-Smtp-Source: AHgI3Ia9x1r9LcOUVZVG59n0yf4bx4070iqFbpoC0nIUgkA3teIwDCqmOUU7zxQ6TnBhxaX0dwHRhF/oXyzZhRktgu8= X-Received: by 2002:a25:5c7:: with SMTP id 190mr3851799ybf.437.1551129885382; Mon, 25 Feb 2019 13:24:45 -0800 (PST) MIME-Version: 1.0 References: <155089851917.5347.209761560453230605.idtracker@ietfa.amsl.com> <986B902E-4953-4683-AC77-110347442D27@fugue.com> In-Reply-To: <986B902E-4953-4683-AC77-110347442D27@fugue.com> From: Kyle Rose Date: Mon, 25 Feb 2019 16:24:34 -0500 Message-ID: To: Ted Lemon Cc: "Les Ginsberg (ginsberg)" , WG Chairs , "recentattendees@ietf.org" , IETF Discussion Mailing List Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="000000000000d1b4a90582be915d" Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Recentattendees] [104all] Further Clarification Re: IETF 104 Preliminary Agenda X-BeenThere: recentattendees@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: Recent IETF Attendees List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 25 Feb 2019 21:24:49 -0000 --000000000000d1b4a90582be915d Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable On Mon, Feb 25, 2019 at 4:02 PM Ted Lemon wrote: > On Feb 25, 2019, at 3:56 PM, Kyle Rose wrote: > > It really seems like we're trying to stuff too much into 5 days. (When yo= u > have 5 lbs of manure and a 4 lbs bag...) Were side meetings in the > mornings, evenings, or during slots without important sessions not workin= g? > Are there groups that really are too busy to skip less important sessions > in favor of collaborative side work? (E.g., there are WGs I *like* to > attend, but when it conflicts with some work I *need* to do, I know where > I'm going to be. These 3 weeks per year are precious, and with every > session being recorded, anything I'm passively consuming gets watched > later.) It's not like the entire IETF needs to collaborate in the same > place at the same time, so I'm skeptical of the need for slots dedicated = to > unstructured work. > > > The problem is that everyone has _different_ conflicts. Coming up with = a > time when everybody is available for any value of =E2=80=9Ceverybody=E2= =80=9D greater than > about three is quite difficult. So no, not the entire IETF, but that=E2= =80=99s an > extreme example of the actual problem. > How widespread of a problem is this? Most of the groups I'm involved in comprise folks who have the same conflicts I do, because we're all working in the same general areas. There are also 5 mornings and 4 or 5 evenings (if you count Sunday) available for cross-functional collaborative work that can't fit elsewhere. I suppose some attendees are enough in-demand that those are all spoken for, but if those folks are outliers, I'm not sure their needs should drive meeting policy. To figure this out, we really need some survey of the attendees to find out how *uniquely* helpful the unstructured time slots are to resolving conflicts for collaboration. --000000000000d1b4a90582be915d Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
On Mon, Feb 25, 2019 at 4:02 PM Ted Lemon <mellon@fugue.com> wrote:
On = Feb 25, 2019, at 3:56 PM, Kyle Rose <krose@krose.org> wrote:
It really seems li= ke we're trying to stuff too much into 5 days. (When you have 5 lbs of = manure and a 4 lbs bag...) Were side meetings in the mornings, evenings, or= during slots without important sessions not working? Are there groups that= really are too busy to skip less important sessions in favor of collaborat= ive side work? (E.g., there are WGs I *like* to attend, but when it conflic= ts with some work I *need* to do, I know where I'm going to be. These 3= weeks per year are precious, and with every session being recorded, anythi= ng I'm passively consuming gets watched later.) It's not like the e= ntire IETF needs to collaborate in the same place at the same time, so I= 9;m skeptical of the need for slots dedicated to unstructured work.<= /div>

The problem is that everyone has _differen= t_ conflicts. =C2=A0 Coming up with a time when everybody is available for = any value of =E2=80=9Ceverybody=E2=80=9D greater than about three is quite = difficult. =C2=A0 So no, not the entire IETF, but that=E2=80=99s an extreme= example of the actual problem.

How widespread of a problem is this? Most of the groups I'm involved i= n comprise folks who have the same conflicts I do, because we're all wo= rking in the same general areas. There are also 5 mornings and 4 or 5 eveni= ngs (if you count Sunday) available for cross-functional collaborative work= that can't fit elsewhere. I suppose some attendees are enough in-deman= d that those are all spoken for, but if those folks are outliers, I'm n= ot sure their needs should drive meeting policy. To figure this out, we rea= lly need some survey of the attendees to find out how *uniquely* helpful th= e unstructured time slots are to resolving conflicts for collaboration.
=

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([2600:8802:5600:164::100b]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id c26sm4460765otm.10.2019.02.25.17.03.07 (version=TLS1_2 cipher=ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 bits=128/128); Mon, 25 Feb 2019 17:03:08 -0800 (PST) From: Fred Baker Message-Id: <38BABB0F-75AB-48AA-B66C-BF6EA93D1762@gmail.com> Content-Type: multipart/signed; boundary="Apple-Mail=_9212F539-E2C5-4CF3-821A-654E74A8BDE9"; protocol="application/pgp-signature"; micalg=pgp-sha512 Mime-Version: 1.0 (Mac OS X Mail 12.4 \(3445.104.2\)) Date: Mon, 25 Feb 2019 17:03:06 -0800 In-Reply-To: <8A1CA67F-C9AA-4FF0-A678-F5D4B038D1FF@bangj.com> Cc: Working Group Chairs , recentattendees@ietf.org, IETF , 104all@ietf.org To: Tom Pusateri References: <155089851917.5347.209761560453230605.idtracker@ietfa.amsl.com> <23D062E4-4464-48C2-9464-61697C2351D6@cooperw.in> <3a201a22-6ed2-ab83-5205-a28af7ba49d7@labn.net> <8EB337F5-D68B-4160-A26C-E8C7693E13F2@gmail.com> <9DE19647-BA11-4ACD-B57B-FE49D760F255@gmail.com> <8A1CA67F-C9AA-4FF0-A678-F5D4B038D1FF@bangj.com> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.3445.104.2) Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Recentattendees] [104all] Further Clarification Re: IETF 104 Preliminary Agenda X-BeenThere: recentattendees@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: Recent IETF Attendees List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 26 Feb 2019 01:03:13 -0000 --Apple-Mail=_9212F539-E2C5-4CF3-821A-654E74A8BDE9 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Puzzling about the CC line, and have reduced it somewhat. I am a paid = attendee at IETF 104, and got a bounce from 104all@ietf.org saying that = mere mortals can't post to it. > On Feb 25, 2019, at 1:36 PM, Tom Pusateri wrote: >> On Feb 25, 2019, at 10:33 AM, Fred Baker = wrote: >>=20 >>=20 >>=20 >>> On Feb 24, 2019, at 11:34 PM, Stewart Bryant = wrote: >>>=20 >>> A better approach might be to ask people at registration what = sessions they needed to attend. >>=20 >> An even better approach, although it delays feedback by one meeting, = would be to look into the IETFers Application data. People list what = they want to attend for the purpose of calendar maintenance. That would = inform the next meeting's agenda development. >=20 > While a neat idea, it=E2=80=99s not currently possible because I = don=E2=80=99t save any private data. And while no user is associated = with that data, (I don=E2=80=99t even create users), it is something = that could be collected anonymously in the future. There=E2=80=99s a lot = that could be done with anonymous statistics or even creating actual = users (like automatic blue sheet sign in using Bluetooth LE Proximity = sensors or locating colleagues or subscribing to notifications), but I = haven=E2=80=99t had time to think through the GDPR implications. >=20 > Tom OK, I'm confused. There is this app, which runs on IOS or Android. I = don't know where the data is stored, but I know I can tell it what WGs I = care about and it will be displayed both on my phone, and on my laptop = in a calendar called "IETFers". If it can get from my phone to my = calendar on my laptop, it can get to somewhere else. I'm suggesting that = the "somewhere else" might anonymize the data and summarize it in some = useful way. Is that "every IETFer?" No. But I'll bet it's a large sample... --Apple-Mail=_9212F539-E2C5-4CF3-821A-654E74A8BDE9 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: attachment; filename=signature.asc Content-Type: application/pgp-signature; name=signature.asc Content-Description: Message signed with OpenPGP -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- iQIzBAEBCgAdFiEEctjlJjQmVrp9uMq7EhdRnd2GP+AFAlx0kEoACgkQEhdRnd2G P+AaOw//RhaqqCwnKgm5hcgJ8VkrBp6veKVjPaxICfTRKgSnMoJDLDiDQBTzheJv 1ty3eb13ejudym0gz7uQaWPwo5TM6BWWqS6PvvQZqjs8UAm0sbTClrIvkGQliXfz cBvBP6Yq8OyED+UulDc0XATGv4FIn09Ci3F1IXxPyfDwgs2DaOjTYXhkakybs9O8 KFVLj0eFC5CB78Ngn2V99Uq9/Po389wgsJZTrVDtyarpg0OnCImqQ4TP08+49vaP oTiRGrd/Cf2catG+kJUKUuDqqoLzoIEWocIEy3yBh4q+DSojw3coUDAkAiIOKrxT +1k+VKm7QWIz+tkLAZMGTHYOkIHYHKGsVmuLMtskeQCPIjoXVXU+dLDRfUDHDEWL jEf594XDQipshysMDrvNXdQc634eg8FXLjsKzX3Zwa2KulMUzoV5UD7PLarnK4kb bZc3aatgJ3Ncf/RKRLWv292XrtRvbnv3Swt+fkM9EOTMLrErL4+++OaKV+uCitwl RohCQJpipHcU/eeGns1sYMsfZ6IfKjjiy9ZCMbwPzOo3UyxEosRGagrsu9Xht6/m dtHOV8UBe95cs2gwkAt37t4cKINHqy7wlthbYe20Kpp+1m7mRf49rQ3k/hRAxCzk 4UugtrpK/7DKtbKLsR3ItK/D6JG/MmDazVT0NgDQgDmD0qmcRTE= =1ySn -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --Apple-Mail=_9212F539-E2C5-4CF3-821A-654E74A8BDE9-- From nobody Tue Feb 26 04:48:42 2019 Return-Path: X-Original-To: recentattendees@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: recentattendees@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id C9A52127287; Tue, 26 Feb 2019 04:48:33 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -4.201 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-4.201 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-2.3, SPF_PASS=-0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 5syTJcR-qv6x; Tue, 26 Feb 2019 04:48:31 -0800 (PST) Received: from tuna.sandelman.ca (tuna.sandelman.ca [209.87.249.19]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher AECDH-AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 5D896124BAA; Tue, 26 Feb 2019 04:48:31 -0800 (PST) Received: from sandelman.ca (unknown [IPv6:2607:f0b0:f:2:56b2:3ff:fe0b:d84]) by tuna.sandelman.ca (Postfix) with ESMTP id EBD9F3826A; Tue, 26 Feb 2019 07:48:26 -0500 (EST) Received: by sandelman.ca (Postfix, from userid 179) id A11F21DB1; Tue, 26 Feb 2019 07:48:29 -0500 (EST) Received: from sandelman.ca (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by sandelman.ca (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9FB341DA4; Tue, 26 Feb 2019 07:48:29 -0500 (EST) From: Michael Richardson To: Ted Lemon cc: Loa Andersson , Working Group Chairs , ietf@ietf.org, recentattendees@ietf.org, 104all@ietf.org, ietf-announce@ietf.org In-Reply-To: References: <155089851917.5347.209761560453230605.idtracker@ietfa.amsl.com> <23D062E4-4464-48C2-9464-61697C2351D6@cooperw.in> <3a201a22-6ed2-ab83-5205-a28af7ba49d7@labn.net> <2ad72bb2-6c16-f1a3-67b3-a25dfc641ce7@pi.nu> <9167b1c9-6385-35e0-69ff-91364150284f@pi.nu> X-Mailer: MH-E 8.6; nmh 1.7+dev; GNU Emacs 24.5.1 X-Face: $\n1pF)h^`}$H>Hk{L"x@)JS7<%Az}5RyS@k9X%29-lHB$Ti.V>2bi.~ehC0; <'$9xN5Ub# z!G,p`nR&p7Fz@^UXIn156S8.~^@MJ*mMsD7=QFeq%AL4m Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Recentattendees] [104all] Further Clarification Re: IETF 104 Preliminary Agenda X-BeenThere: recentattendees@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: Recent IETF Attendees List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 26 Feb 2019 12:48:34 -0000 --=-=-= Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Ted Lemon wrote: > they have good data. I=E2=80=99m saying they don=E2=80=99t have good = data. The fact > that you have a conflict is not good data. It=E2=80=99s an anecdote. = I don=E2=80=99t > have a conflict. > That=E2=80=99s also an anecdote. Anecdotes aren=E2=80=99t useful guid= ance here. I also think that the RTG area has had very good conflict resolution in the past, and that they don't have a lot of cross-area participants. That is, this agenda, which for many of us, is average for conflicts, is very surprising for some RTG area people, because they suddendly are experiencing what the rest of us have experienced for a decade. =2D- Michael Richardson , Sandelman Software Works -=3D IPv6 IoT consulting =3D- --=-=-= Content-Type: application/pgp-signature; name="signature.asc" -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- iQEzBAEBCAAdFiEEbsyLEzg/qUTA43uogItw+93Q3WUFAlx1NZ0ACgkQgItw+93Q 3WUMvAgAqyfsYrdw+2eQEEHG3pq/CZFIEfwjUtnFxfI2/pe+S79GlKgQrvHi9FDn BuuyzyePrsxL4BgVRsP65s79/GMFwAVK3qhXlR09Kd0fd8yvhuGwnzclxJHRWwvd ikg+fEcfRAo46ZAPhxcSGtqpCZbSAO5n7u/Mx+ZmT62Yqli011tCscJPvUB0++9P RyMsvapkZowbJKBlK/GVV6VfQuQols+eMsjthJ4jbsmLAaPKAWBTu/vqxM8zEuCl HkspTGao54aTtCi/mmtdDiShj6e+NjBWoqWTkVWFX3Ws/EuHHRXc3eLlm/2h7HXY TTt5l+lXoXj8paUBo5qR7MJjIFoSzQ== =d9Ag -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --=-=-=-- From nobody Wed Feb 27 08:43:03 2019 Return-Path: X-Original-To: recentattendees@ietf.org Delivered-To: recentattendees@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from ietfa.amsl.com (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2C96F130EA7; Wed, 27 Feb 2019 08:42:40 -0800 (PST) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit From: IETF Secretariat To: "IETF Announcement List" Cc: recentattendees@ietf.org, ietf@ietf.org, 104all@ietf.org X-Test-IDTracker: no X-IETF-IDTracker: 6.92.1 Auto-Submitted: auto-generated Precedence: bulk Reply-To: agenda@ietf.org Message-ID: <155128576013.13895.10243946457684203663.idtracker@ietfa.amsl.com> Date: Wed, 27 Feb 2019 08:42:40 -0800 Archived-At: Subject: [Recentattendees] IETF 104 Important Cutoff Dates X-BeenThere: recentattendees@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 List-Id: Recent IETF Attendees List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 27 Feb 2019 16:42:40 -0000 IETF 104 Hosted by: Cisco/ CZ.NIC Prague, Czech Republic March 23-29, 2019 IETF 104 Information: https://www.ietf.org/how/meetings/104/ Register online at: https://ietf.org/meeting/register.html 1. Registration 2. Accommodation Reminder 3. Accommodation Details 4. Code Sprint 5. Hackathon 1. Registration NOTE: The Standard Registration deadline is, Monday, March 11th. Be sure to register and pay before the deadline passes! Register online at: https://ietf.org/meeting/register.html 2. Accommodation Reminder: REMINDER: Hilton Prague (Venue Hotel) has a 21 day cancellation policy. Reservations must be cancelled at least 21 days prior to your planned check-in date to avoid penalty charges. 3. Accommodations Details: 1. Hilton Prague (Headquarters Hotel, block of 500 rooms) Room Rate: $169.36 (single) $186.95 (double) USD. Includes daily breakfast, in-room high speed internet, access to Health Club and pool. VAT of 15% (taxes subject to change) is excluded from the above prices. Reservation Cutoff Date: 10 March 2019 Cancel with No Penalty: 21 Days prior to check-in/ arrival Distance to Meeting Venue: N/A Reservations: http://eventsathilton.com/show/5c41ed0749e7d06a7247f805 2. Hilton Prague Old Town (Overflow hotel) Room Rate: Discounted 10% off of Hotel’s Best Available Rate at the time of booking. Includes breakfast, in- room high speed internet, access to the fitness center and pool. VAT of 15% (taxes subject to change) is excluded from the above prices. Reservations Cutoff Date: No Cut-off Date Cancel with No Penalty: Up to 48 hours prior to check-in/arrival Distance to Meeting Venue: 1.8 km Reservations: https://tinyurl.com/IETF104HiltonOldTown 3. InterContinental Prague (Overflow hotel) Room Rate: $162.65 (single) $179.90 (double) USD. Includes breakfast, in-room high speed internet, fitness center and pool. VAT of 15% (taxes subject to change) is excluded from the above prices. Reservations Cutoff Date: 22 February 2019 Cancel with No Penalty: 14 days prior to check-in/arrival Distance to Meeting Venue: 2.3 km Reservations: https://tinyurl.com/IETF104InterContinental More details at: https://www.ietf.org/how/meetings/104/hotel/ 4. Code Sprint The IETF 104 Code Sprint in Prague will, as always, let you work on fixing those things about the datatracker which you most urgently desire to do something about. When: Saturday, March 23 from 09:30 to 18:00 Where: Hilton Prague, Room Amsterdam Signup: https://trac.tools.ietf.org/tools/ietfdb/wiki/IETF104SprintSignUp More information: https://trac.tools.ietf.org/tools/ietfdb/wiki/IETF104Sprint 5. Hackathon The IETF is holding a Hackathon at IETF 104 to encourage developers to discuss, collaborate and develop utilities, ideas, sample code and solutions that show practical implementations of IETF standards. When: Saturday March 23 and Sunday March 24 Where: Hilton Prague, Room Grand Hilton Ballroom Signup for the Hackathon: https://www.ietf.org/registration/ietf104/hackathonregistration.py More information can be found here: https://www.ietf.org/how/runningcode/hackathons/104-hackathon/ Keep up to date by subscribing to: https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/hackathon The Hackathon is free to attend and open to all. Extend the invitation to colleagues outside the IETF! Descriptions and information regarding the technologies for the hackathon are located on the IETF 104 Meeting Wiki: https://trac.ietf.org/trac/ietf/meeting/wiki/104hackathon Don’t see anything that interests you? Feel free to add your preferred technology to the list, sign up as its Champion and show up to work on it. Note: you must login to the wiki to add content. If you do add a new technology, we strongly suggest that you send an email to hackathon@ietf.org to let others know. You may generate interest in your technology, and find other people who want to contribute to it. From nobody Wed Feb 27 08:50:05 2019 Return-Path: X-Original-To: recentattendees@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: recentattendees@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 148BC130FEC; Wed, 27 Feb 2019 08:50:03 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -4.2 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-4.2 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-2.3, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id NDH1_wJFWNro; Wed, 27 Feb 2019 08:50:00 -0800 (PST) Received: from tuna.sandelman.ca (tuna.sandelman.ca [209.87.249.19]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher AECDH-AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 86831130EED; Wed, 27 Feb 2019 08:50:00 -0800 (PST) Received: from sandelman.ca (unknown [IPv6:2607:f0b0:f:2:56b2:3ff:fe0b:d84]) by tuna.sandelman.ca (Postfix) with ESMTP id A37A8380BE; Wed, 27 Feb 2019 11:49:54 -0500 (EST) Received: by sandelman.ca (Postfix, from userid 179) id 1218355C; Wed, 27 Feb 2019 11:49:59 -0500 (EST) Received: from sandelman.ca (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by sandelman.ca (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0F82B556; Wed, 27 Feb 2019 11:49:59 -0500 (EST) From: Michael Richardson To: Tom Pusateri cc: Fred Baker , Working Group Chairs , IETF , recentattendees@ietf.org, 104all@ietf.org In-Reply-To: <8A1CA67F-C9AA-4FF0-A678-F5D4B038D1FF@bangj.com> References: <155089851917.5347.209761560453230605.idtracker@ietfa.amsl.com> <23D062E4-4464-48C2-9464-61697C2351D6@cooperw.in> <3a201a22-6ed2-ab83-5205-a28af7ba49d7@labn.net> <8EB337F5-D68B-4160-A26C-E8C7693E13F2@gmail.com> <9DE19647-BA11-4ACD-B57B-FE49D760F255@gmail.com> <8A1CA67F-C9AA-4FF0-A678-F5D4B038D1FF@bangj.com> X-Mailer: MH-E 8.6; nmh 1.7+dev; GNU Emacs 24.5.1 X-Face: $\n1pF)h^`}$H>Hk{L"x@)JS7<%Az}5RyS@k9X%29-lHB$Ti.V>2bi.~ehC0; <'$9xN5Ub# z!G,p`nR&p7Fz@^UXIn156S8.~^@MJ*mMsD7=QFeq%AL4m Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Recentattendees] [104all] Further Clarification Re: IETF 104 Preliminary Agenda X-BeenThere: recentattendees@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: Recent IETF Attendees List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 27 Feb 2019 16:50:03 -0000 --=-=-= Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Tom Pusateri wrote: >>> On Feb 24, 2019, at 11:34 PM, Stewart Bryant wrote: >>> >>> A better approach might be to ask people at registration what sessi= ons they needed to attend. >> >> An even better approach, although it delays feedback by one meeting, >> would be to look into the IETFers Application data. People list what >> they want to attend for the purpose of calendar maintenance. That wo= uld >> inform the next meeting's agenda development. > While a neat idea, it=E2=80=99s not currently possible because I don= =E2=80=99t save any > private data. And while no user is associated with that data, (I don= =E2=80=99t > even create users), it is something that could be collected anonymous= ly > in the future. There=E2=80=99s a lot that could be done with anonymous > statistics or even creating actual users (like automatic blue sheet > sign in using Bluetooth LE Proximity sensors or locating colleagues or > subscribing to notifications), but I haven=E2=80=99t had time to thin= k through > the GDPR implications. Your GDPR concerns are a good point. I don't think we need to go to BTLE to see if you are actually there. In particular, that fails to catch the case where people wanted to be there. Among those of us that don't use your app, but rather use the datatracker i= cs creation tool, we should have data in the logs about what people selected. Alas, Google calendar does not you edit the calendar URL, so it's hard to update what you want to add/remove items. So I added a layer of indirectio= n: cd /ssw/docs/SSW/ietf/meeting/ietf104 curl -s >agenda.ics 'https://datatracker.ietf.org/meeting/104/agenda.ics#6l= o,6man,6tisch,dnssd,homenet,lwig,gaia,hrpc,v6ops,opsawg,netconf,dnsop,anima= ,babel,bier,roll,tokbind,teep,suit,secevent,secdispatch,rats,ipsecme,ace,ac= me,dots,lamps,core,cbor,capport,cacao,ksk,smart' and I add this agenda.ics file to my calendar program(s). agenda.html takes the WG names as #foo,bar, while agenda.ics takes them as = ?foo,bar) What this does *not* tell you is which items I added for "like", and which ones I added because it's a must attend. Also I admit that this time I just copy and pasted from last time, and added a few things. In particular, part of this exercise is for me to see what conflicts I have. I wish I could intelligently subscribe to a calendar entry such that I'd get updates if it moved, but actually have it in my calendar, not have a new calendar. Instead, I'm force to copy entries to my calendar to remember how I've decided to resolve the conflict, and that breaks the updates (such as room changes). I suppose I should use your app and star things, but it's just too many moving parts :-) =2D- Michael Richardson , Sandelman Software Works -=3D IPv6 IoT consulting =3D- --=-=-= Content-Type: application/pgp-signature; name="signature.asc" -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- iQEzBAEBCAAdFiEEbsyLEzg/qUTA43uogItw+93Q3WUFAlx2v7YACgkQgItw+93Q 3WVORwgAshgVfQsGWbI8XiAXcq+gq9eOF6I7/udqNauFNrSWdjhMV0ZZ1caIj1N0 FqozEuHuVuKbnHtxcrBJKiK4wcEWApobG18VpeebsjG5R/c2cMp3XeOJXqNmwy4r 5ww+Fy9kavOKhMqhCUQqjQ9Va+MPisBIEqK3PhtrkVpPQGbcE0qNRxShmTiEgjyO xxXeCPU0VWoXyeV9BgJK3Pt1cX7bLIaVbzZJdNSR0kZakY/BseOiKHf/xA/1HrXl n3m7GAn9Gv6n3EG7ncm3D3m59WeXkONvm/fWUCyymbA1q3X9DodPnBh8QY5w3vpw Nvv5j7vJ92xSTKgeHPaGJVowAEhdug== =LOKR -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --=-=-=--