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"draft-ietf-nvo3-vxlan-gpe@ietf.org" , IETF IPPM WG , "sfc@ietf.org" Thread-Topic: [SUSPICIOUS] Re: [nvo3] Comments on draft-ietf-nvo3-vxlan-gpe Thread-Index: AQHU8Pwb4PQUm0Sk6kyANyiY2S4odqY4th6AgAhKgYCAAAxngIAAJG4AgAAoIIA= Date: Thu, 18 Apr 2019 00:18:29 +0000 Message-ID: <4C9CDD29-BDF8-425E-998F-B12C1BD7CA7C@cisco.com> References: <12ACA02A-BB51-4214-A72B-1AEFCCB914AC@cisco.com> <3AFD4751-CF3A-4939-A49A-FB981C68CADF@cisco.com> In-Reply-To: Accept-Language: en-US Content-Language: en-US X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: x-mailer: Apple Mail (2.3445.104.8) x-ms-exchange-messagesentrepresentingtype: 1 x-ms-exchange-transport-fromentityheader: Hosted x-originating-ip: [10.118.116.132] Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-ID: Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Outbound-SMTP-Client: 64.101.220.156, xch-rtp-016.cisco.com X-Outbound-Node: rcdn-core-8.cisco.com Archived-At: Subject: Re: [sfc] [SUSPICIOUS] Re: [nvo3] Comments on draft-ietf-nvo3-vxlan-gpe 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ESMTP id XnWwcVhP-3rX; Wed, 17 Apr 2019 17:49:14 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail-lj1-x22a.google.com (mail-lj1-x22a.google.com [IPv6:2a00:1450:4864:20::22a]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id ADA45120033; Wed, 17 Apr 2019 17:49:13 -0700 (PDT) Received: by mail-lj1-x22a.google.com with SMTP id h21so318927ljk.13; Wed, 17 Apr 2019 17:49:13 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20161025; h=mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date:message-id:subject:to :cc; bh=CWa0oGr0pe1svZPWxNBzRmESGnGjYp6DFSbq8/v3MUs=; b=GShRXdhuPfFpKkHwQjWw2l1LGw6b4BoBvJ2+bNSZY2DTiU/ONY6MzaWtpPfw8s6OY/ YwCNx4Rz6RJpZVjWVdU7Ult18Egtaw521lJMPbWZ6o7NkH/tSOLO9EsZEwNWLkNpvoZQ z9Rlr6ZJBdZYG/CKKfVwXnSa7jzT+lBLyCBcThiQq4YCZ6ZPclOndIgApjMiIax6ONvB uggnzoDiBRE52zRkaKNWcxJGfbbgvi68F0LAARiq4HHmVo+wXqepz+BJjaB4d0qT33u1 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-0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 References: <12ACA02A-BB51-4214-A72B-1AEFCCB914AC@cisco.com> <3AFD4751-CF3A-4939-A49A-FB981C68CADF@cisco.com> <4C9CDD29-BDF8-425E-998F-B12C1BD7CA7C@cisco.com> In-Reply-To: <4C9CDD29-BDF8-425E-998F-B12C1BD7CA7C@cisco.com> From: Greg Mirsky Date: Wed, 17 Apr 2019 17:49:04 -0700 Message-ID: To: "Carlos Pignataro (cpignata)" Cc: NVO3 , "draft-ietf-nvo3-vxlan-gpe@ietf.org" , IETF IPPM WG , "sfc@ietf.org" Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="000000000000db2fac0586c35e28" Archived-At: Subject: Re: [sfc] [SUSPICIOUS] Re: [nvo3] Comments on draft-ietf-nvo3-vxlan-gpe X-BeenThere: sfc@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: Network Service Chaining List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 18 Apr 2019 00:49:17 -0000 --000000000000db2fac0586c35e28 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Hi Carlos, thank you for the discussion. As the VXLAN-GPE is on the Informational track, there may be little point to discuss it. But as the draft has been adopted by NVO3 WG, I'm curious about the updates the editors have been making without the WG agreeing to that. I'm looking forward to hearing from any of the editors of VXLAN-GPE about the updates in the last two versions. Also, hope editors of the draft will find time to reply to my questions and consider my comments. Regards, Greg On Wed, Apr 17, 2019 at 5:18 PM Carlos Pignataro (cpignata) < cpignata@cisco.com> wrote: > Dear Greg, > > [Now adding the SFC WG Mailing list since you take us to a different WG > again] > > Thank you very much for fine-combing with a magnifying glass through all > the documents I=E2=80=99m currently co-authoring :-) > > It is refreshing to see that the only issues you find are non-issues, and > your questions easy to re-answer :-) > > At this point I am a bit at a loss of what your point is, or what you are > trying to prove bending text. Are you coding, deploying, or testing IOAM = on > NSH without data packets on VXLAN-GPE over IP? NSH is data as far as > VXLAN-GPE is concerned. IOAM shimmed in NSH is orthogonal to IOAM shimmed > in VXLAN-GPE. > > I feel this discussion about the O-bit already took place once or twice. > > Kind Regards, > > =E2=80=94 Carlos Pignataro > > PS: The Evil bit is defined for IPv4, should we therefore also define it > here? > > > > On Apr 17, 2019, at 5:54 PM, Greg Mirsky wrote: > > > > Hi Carlos, > > to add another quote from the draft-ietf-sfc-ioam-nsh that you've > co-authored, > > Packets with IOAM data included MUST follow this > > definition, i.e. the O bit MUST NOT be set for regular customer > > traffic which also carries IOAM data and the O bit MUST be set for > > OAM packets which carry only IOAM data without any regular data > > payload. > > > > So, if the only iOAM message is carried in or after an NSH, it is > identified as OAM. And, by your own example in the earlier note, so shoul= d > VXLAN-GPE. > > > > Regards, > > Greg > > > > On Wed, Apr 17, 2019 at 12:44 PM Carlos Pignataro (cpignata) < > cpignata@cisco.com> wrote: > > Hi, Greg, > > > > Adding the IPPM mailing list, since you reference it below, and point t= o > RFC 7799. > > > > Please see inline. > > > > > On Apr 17, 2019, at 3:00 PM, Greg Mirsky > wrote: > > > > > > Hi Carlos, > > > thank you for sharing your view on the design of the VXLAN-GPE > protocol. Please find my comments in-line tagged GIM>>. > > > > > > Regards, > > > Greg > > > > > > On Fri, Apr 12, 2019 at 5:23 AM Carlos Pignataro (cpignata) < > cpignata@cisco.com> wrote: > > > Greg, > > > > > > You seem to be confusing and mixing things up. > > > > > > Please see inline. > > > > > > > On Apr 12, 2019, at 2:50 AM, Greg Mirsky > wrote: > > > > > > > > Dear Editors, et al., > > > > I've read the latest -07 version and would like to share my comment= s > and questions with you: > > > > =E2=80=A2 in the earlier version of the draft, the O-bit was > introduced and defined as: > > > > OAM Flag Bit (O bit): The O bit is set to indicate that the packet > is an OAM packet. > > > > At the same time, in the latest version, the new Next Protocol valu= e > (0x81) to identify iOAM Data was introduced. Hence are my questions: > > > > =E2=80=A2 What must be the value of the O-bit when the value = of the > Next Protocol field is iOAM? > > > > > > The O bit =E2=80=9Cis set to indicate that the packet is an OAM packe= t=E2=80=9D. > > > IAOM is not an OAM packet. Hence, O bit clear if VXLAN-GPE > encapsulates a non-OAM packet and adds an IOAM shim. > > > GIM>> It is a very unexpected statement from you, > > > > I would tell you =E2=80=98expect the unexpected=E2=80=99, but that is n= ot the case > here... :-) > > > > If you actually read my statement, you will see "IAOM is not an OAM > *packet*.=E2=80=9D New emphasis added =E2=80=94 it is _not_ *an OAM packe= t*. > > > > I stand by it. It=E2=80=99s an augmented data packet of interest. > > > > > one of the co-authors of draft-ietf-ippm-ioam-data where the first > paragraph of the Introduction section defines iOAM as Hybrid Type 1 OAM, > according to RFC 7799 classification: > > > > This is still quite consistent with that definition, which I recommend > you re-read: > > > > RFC 7799 is about metrics and methods, not packet definitions. > > > > You will see that Active methods include a =E2=80=9Cdedicated measureme= nt packet > stream=E2=80=9D. =E2=80=9CActive Methods generate packet streams.=E2=80= =9D > > > > However, Hybrid Type I leverages =E2=80=9CAugmentation or modification = of the > stream of interest" > > > > Following your logic, if you change a packet field such as TTL/HL to > provide packet coloring, do you need to set the O-bit? > > > > > IOAM is to complement > > > mechanisms such as Ping or Traceroute, or more recent active probi= ng > > > mechanisms as described in [I-D.lapukhov-dataplane-probe].. In > terms > > > of "active" or "passive" OAM, "in-situ" OAM can be considered a > > > hybrid OAM type. While no extra packets are sent, IOAM adds > > > information to the packets therefore cannot be considered passive. > > > In terms of the classification given in [RFC7799] IOAM could be > > > portrayed as Hybrid Type 1. > > > > > > > =E2=80=A2 Do you plan to define the Next Protocol values for = active > OAM protocols, e.g., Echo Request/Reply, BFD, Performance Monitoring? > > > > > > I cannot speak to =E2=80=9Cplans=E2=80=9D (replying as =E2=80=9Cet al= .=E2=80=9D, not as =E2=80=9Ceditor=E2=80=9D), but > I expect OAM documents ought to have those requested, and you do not need > necessarily all of those =E2=80=94 the nex protocol IPv4 / IPv6 can encap= sulate > ICMP, UDP/BFD, etc., etc., etc., etc. > > > GIM>> Of course, use of the well-known port number, usually it is UDP > destination port, is one of the methods to demultiplex protocols. This > method is broadly used, for example, in MPLS OAM. But this method has som= e > disadvantages that were pointed out in the discussion of BFD over GENEVE = in > Prague by David Black (the last presentation in the minutes): > > > David: I want the BFD header to be as close to the thing whose > liveness I'm testing. The more headers you add in the middle, the more wa= ys > there are to break BFD without breaking the forwarding engine. The furthe= r > away I move BFD from the chunk of hardware's liveness I care about, the > more opportunities are for BFD and the hardware to not to tell me the sam= e > thing. > > > > > > > Theory and practice match in theory, less so in practice =E2=80=94 unle= ss you > are planning to update RFC 5881. > > > > This can be argued both ways (e.g., better to have common handlers, > etc.), but I take no position. I do say that in presence of deployed OAM > encapsulations, there=E2=80=99s no basis for your your comment about defi= ning a > protocol type for =E2=80=9CPerformance Monitoring=E2=80=9D as a protocol.= .. > > > > > > > > > > > =E2=80=A2 How to interpret the situation when the O-bit value= is 1 but > the value of the Next Protocol field is, for example, NSH, i.e.., not any > of OAM protocols? > > > > > > I expect it means there=E2=80=99s OAM within that NSH (sometimes ther= e=E2=80=99s no > such things as =E2=80=9COAM Protocols=E2=80=9D), or an unhandled OAM prot= ocol. > > > GIM>> Should that, i.e., OAM in NSH or immediately following NSH be > signaled using SFC NSH methods that are already defined in > draft-ietf-sfc-multi-layer-oam? > > > > > > Non sequitur =E2=80=94 I do not follow what signaling has to do with th= e > conversation, nor how that draft might be relevant. > > > > > Using the server layer, as you've suggested, seems as layer violation= . > > > > > > > This is a funny statement =E2=80=94 NVO3 is a layer violation :-) So ar= e > Pseudowires. Please do not take this statement too seriously, it is not > inviting discussion. > > > > > > =E2=80=A2 I believe that the use of the dedicated OAM flag an= d the > Next Protocol field for a fixed-size header that cannot include meta-data > is unwarranted and adds unnecessary complexity. > > > > > > Disagree. > > > > > > See example where protocol is IP carrying an OAM packet. > > > GIM>> When IP/UDP encapsulation is used for OAM, there's no, in my > opinion, any need to use the O-bit. The destination IP address must be as > described in RFC 8029 or RFC 5884 and the demultiplexing is done based on > the destination UDP port number. Clearly, O-bit is unnecessary if IP/UDP > encapsulation for OAM being used. > > > > > > > Fortunately, bit usage is a matter of definition and not opinion :-) > > > > Kind regards, > > > > Carlos. > > > > > > > > I suggest not to use O-bit in the VXLAN-GPE header and release it > into the Reserved field. I don't see the apparent benefit of using the > flag, as the VXLA-GPE uses the fixed size header and the header cannot > carry OAM data in it. The only role the VXLAN-GPE header must perform, in > my opinion, is to unambiguously identify the payload type that immediatel= y > follows the header as OAM (demultiplexing OAM protocols may be done in OA= M > Header shim). > > > > Much appreciate your consideration. > > > > > > > > > > Best, > > > > > > =E2=80=94 > > > Carlos Pignataro, carlos@cisco.com > > > > > > =E2=80=9CSometimes I use big words that I do not fully understand, to= make > myself sound more photosynthesis." > > > > > > > Regards, > > > > Greg > > > > _______________________________________________ > > > > nvo3 mailing list > > > > nvo3@ietf.org > > > > > https://secure-web.cisco.com/1j-jr64yh2D8yO92ibcqaN-H98ZCP3lQdHmsYPsH8lkj= sa4WlJ4kg3W4HL8qT25rCVittT5bFQox__OnSknV5w_wW69FvUhXkxqxKhi9MCiy5oH-JTucXN_= 7FK85q7jD-qEwRM5IXY68_Vfeb_XI2rKxyzwVsG_06KTGF09Bw9oHAOXUNFcdCw_oon_eruUhRP= tdwLc9UQNz2ThYP8ysf2pr64VU04VjMKmGwqYvzzyAsLTEbHrs7GVCqphT58T0st78_968rM5MK= FLk7EiWBj7gZPm_rDeBf63gUtxkcj-w8XybJiiO2tcFaeoAL_8m-ZT5L9-1VK4wZkHmR5C_Ldg/= https%3A%2F%2Fwww.ietf.org%2Fmailman%2Flistinfo%2Fnvo3 > > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > nvo3 mailing list > > nvo3@ietf.org > > > https://secure-web.cisco.com/1j-jr64yh2D8yO92ibcqaN-H98ZCP3lQdHmsYPsH8lkj= sa4WlJ4kg3W4HL8qT25rCVittT5bFQox__OnSknV5w_wW69FvUhXkxqxKhi9MCiy5oH-JTucXN_= 7FK85q7jD-qEwRM5IXY68_Vfeb_XI2rKxyzwVsG_06KTGF09Bw9oHAOXUNFcdCw_oon_eruUhRP= tdwLc9UQNz2ThYP8ysf2pr64VU04VjMKmGwqYvzzyAsLTEbHrs7GVCqphT58T0st78_968rM5MK= FLk7EiWBj7gZPm_rDeBf63gUtxkcj-w8XybJiiO2tcFaeoAL_8m-ZT5L9-1VK4wZkHmR5C_Ldg/= https%3A%2F%2Fwww.ietf.org%2Fmailman%2Flistinfo%2Fnvo3 > > --000000000000db2fac0586c35e28 Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Hi Carlos,
thank you for the discussion.
As = the VXLAN-GPE is on the Informational track, there may be little point to d= iscuss it. But as the draft has been adopted by NVO3 WG, I'm curious ab= out the updates the editors have been making without the WG agreeing to tha= t. I'm looking forward to hearing from any of the editors of VXLAN-GPE = about the updates in the last two versions. Also, hope editors of the draft= will find time to reply to my questions and consider my comments.

Regards,
Greg

On Wed, Apr 17, 2019 at 5:18 = PM Carlos Pignataro (cpignata) <cp= ignata@cisco.com> wrote:
Dear Greg,

[Now adding the SFC WG Mailing list since you take us to a different WG aga= in]

Thank you very much for fine-combing with a magnifying glass through all th= e documents I=E2=80=99m currently co-authoring :-)

It is refreshing to see that the only issues you find are non-issues, and y= our questions easy to re-answer :-)

At this point I am a bit at a loss of what your point is, or what you are t= rying to prove bending text. Are you coding, deploying, or testing IOAM on = NSH without data packets on VXLAN-GPE over IP? NSH is data as far as VXLAN-= GPE is concerned. IOAM shimmed in NSH is orthogonal to IOAM shimmed in VXLA= N-GPE.

I feel this discussion about the O-bit already took place once or twice.
Kind Regards,

=E2=80=94 Carlos Pignataro

PS: The Evil bit is defined for IPv4, should we therefore also define it he= re?


> On Apr 17, 2019, at 5:54 PM, Greg Mirsky <gregimirsky@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> Hi Carlos,
> to add another quote from the draft-ietf-sfc-ioam-nsh that you've = co-authored,
>=C2=A0 =C2=A0 Packets with IOAM data included MUST follow this
>=C2=A0 =C2=A0 definition, i.e. the O bit MUST NOT be set for regular cu= stomer
>=C2=A0 =C2=A0 traffic which also carries IOAM data and the O bit MUST b= e set for
>=C2=A0 =C2=A0 OAM packets which carry only IOAM data without any regula= r data
>=C2=A0 =C2=A0 payload.
>
> So, if the only iOAM message is carried in or after an NSH, it is iden= tified as OAM. And, by your own example in the earlier note, so should VXLA= N-GPE.
>
> Regards,
> Greg
>
> On Wed, Apr 17, 2019 at 12:44 PM Carlos Pignataro (cpignata) <cpignata@cisco.com&g= t; wrote:
> Hi, Greg,
>
> Adding the IPPM mailing list, since you reference it below, and point = to RFC 7799.
>
> Please see inline.
>
> > On Apr 17, 2019, at 3:00 PM, Greg Mirsky <gregimirsky@gmail.com> wrote:=
> >
> > Hi Carlos,
> > thank you for sharing your view on the design of the VXLAN-GPE pr= otocol. Please find my comments in-line tagged GIM>>.
> >
> > Regards,
> > Greg
> >
> > On Fri, Apr 12, 2019 at 5:23 AM Carlos Pignataro (cpignata) <<= a href=3D"mailto:cpignata@cisco.com" target=3D"_blank">cpignata@cisco.com> wrote:
> > Greg,
> >
> > You seem to be confusing and mixing things up.
> >
> > Please see inline.
> >
> > > On Apr 12, 2019, at 2:50 AM, Greg Mirsky <gregimirsky@gmail.com> w= rote:
> > >
> > > Dear Editors, et al.,
> > > I've read the latest -07 version and would like to share= my comments and questions with you:
> > >=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0=E2=80=A2 in the earlier version o= f the draft, the O-bit was introduced and defined as:
> > > OAM Flag Bit (O bit):=C2=A0 The O bit is set to indicate tha= t the packet is an OAM packet.
> > > At the same time, in the latest version, the new Next Protoc= ol value (0x81) to identify iOAM Data was introduced. Hence are my question= s:
> > >=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0=E2=80=A2 What must be the value o= f the O-bit when the value of the Next Protocol field is iOAM?
> >
> > The O bit =E2=80=9Cis set to indicate that the packet is an OAM p= acket=E2=80=9D.
> > IAOM is not an OAM packet. Hence, O bit clear if VXLAN-GPE encaps= ulates a non-OAM packet and adds an IOAM shim.
> > GIM>> It is a very unexpected statement from you,
>
> I would tell you =E2=80=98expect the unexpected=E2=80=99, but that is = not the case here... :-)
>
> If you actually read my statement, you will see "IAOM is not an O= AM *packet*.=E2=80=9D New emphasis added =E2=80=94 it is _not_ *an OAM pack= et*.
>
> I stand by it. It=E2=80=99s an augmented data packet of interest.
>
> > one of the co-authors of draft-ietf-ippm-ioam-data=C2=A0 where th= e first paragraph of the Introduction section defines iOAM as Hybrid Type 1= OAM, according to RFC 7799 classification:
>
> This is still quite consistent with that definition, which I recommend= you re-read:
>
> RFC 7799 is about metrics and methods, not packet definitions.
>
> You will see that Active methods include a =E2=80=9Cdedicated measurem= ent packet stream=E2=80=9D. =E2=80=9CActive Methods generate packet streams= .=E2=80=9D
>
> However, Hybrid Type I leverages =E2=80=9CAugmentation or modification= of the stream of interest"
>
> Following your logic, if you change a packet field such as TTL/HL to p= rovide packet coloring, do you need to set the O-bit?
>
> >=C2=A0 =C2=A0 IOAM is to complement
> >=C2=A0 =C2=A0 mechanisms such as Ping or Traceroute, or more recen= t active probing
> >=C2=A0 =C2=A0 mechanisms as described in [I-D.lapukhov-dataplane-p= robe]..=C2=A0 In terms
> >=C2=A0 =C2=A0 of "active" or "passive" OAM, &q= uot;in-situ" OAM can be considered a
> >=C2=A0 =C2=A0 hybrid OAM type.=C2=A0 While no extra packets are se= nt, IOAM adds
> >=C2=A0 =C2=A0 information to the packets therefore cannot be consi= dered passive.
> >=C2=A0 =C2=A0 In terms of the classification given in [RFC7799] IO= AM could be
> >=C2=A0 =C2=A0 portrayed as Hybrid Type 1.
> >
> > >=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0=E2=80=A2 Do you plan to define th= e Next Protocol values for active OAM protocols, e.g., Echo Request/Reply, = BFD, Performance Monitoring?
> >
> > I cannot speak to =E2=80=9Cplans=E2=80=9D (replying as =E2=80=9Ce= t al.=E2=80=9D, not as =E2=80=9Ceditor=E2=80=9D), but I expect OAM document= s ought to have those requested, and you do not need necessarily all of tho= se =E2=80=94 the nex protocol IPv4 / IPv6 can encapsulate ICMP, UDP/BFD, et= c., etc., etc., etc.
> > GIM>> Of course, use of the well-known port number, usually= it is UDP destination port, is one of the methods to demultiplex protocols= . This method is broadly used, for example, in MPLS OAM. But this method ha= s some disadvantages that were pointed out in the discussion of BFD over GE= NEVE in Prague by David Black (the last presentation in the minutes):
> > David: I want the BFD header to be as close to the thing whose li= veness I'm testing. The more headers you add in the middle, the more wa= ys there are to break BFD without breaking the forwarding engine. The furth= er away I move BFD from the chunk of hardware's liveness I care about, = the more opportunities are for BFD and the hardware to not to tell me the s= ame thing.
> >
>
> Theory and practice match in theory, less so in practice =E2=80=94 unl= ess you are planning to update RFC 5881.
>
> This can be argued both ways (e.g., better to have common handlers, et= c.), but I take no position. I do say that in presence of deployed OAM enca= psulations, there=E2=80=99s no basis for your your comment about defining a= protocol type for =E2=80=9CPerformance Monitoring=E2=80=9D as a protocol..= .
>
>
> >
> > >=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0=E2=80=A2 How to interpret the sit= uation when the O-bit value is 1 but the value of the Next Protocol field i= s, for example, NSH, i.e.., not any of OAM protocols?
> >
> > I expect it means there=E2=80=99s OAM within that NSH (sometimes = there=E2=80=99s no such things as =E2=80=9COAM Protocols=E2=80=9D), or an u= nhandled OAM protocol.
> > GIM>> Should that, i.e., OAM in NSH or immediately followin= g NSH be signaled using SFC NSH methods that are already defined in draft-i= etf-sfc-multi-layer-oam?
>
>
> Non sequitur =E2=80=94 I do not follow what signaling has to do with t= he conversation, nor how that draft might be relevant.
>
> > Using the server layer, as you've suggested, seems as layer v= iolation.
> >
>
> This is a funny statement =E2=80=94 NVO3 is a layer violation :-) So a= re Pseudowires. Please do not take this statement too seriously, it is not = inviting discussion.
>
> > >=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0=E2=80=A2 I believe that the use o= f the dedicated OAM flag and the Next Protocol field for a fixed-size heade= r that cannot include meta-data is unwarranted and adds unnecessary complex= ity.
> >
> > Disagree.
> >
> > See example where protocol is IP carrying an OAM packet.
> > GIM>> When IP/UDP encapsulation is used for OAM, there'= s no, in my opinion, any need to use the O-bit. The destination IP address = must be as described in RFC 8029 or RFC 5884 and the demultiplexing is done= based on the destination UDP port number. Clearly, O-bit is unnecessary if= IP/UDP encapsulation for OAM being used.
> >
>
> Fortunately, bit usage is a matter of definition and not opinion :-) >
> Kind regards,
>
> Carlos.
>
>
> > > I suggest not to use O-bit in the VXLAN-GPE header and relea= se it into the Reserved field.=C2=A0 I don't see the apparent benefit o= f using the flag, as the VXLA-GPE uses the fixed size header and the header= cannot carry OAM data in it. The only role the VXLAN-GPE header must perfo= rm, in my opinion, is to unambiguously identify the payload type that immed= iately follows the header as OAM (demultiplexing OAM protocols may be done = in OAM Header shim).
> > > Much appreciate your consideration.
> > >
> >
> > Best,
> >
> > =E2=80=94
> > Carlos Pignataro, carlos@cisco.com
> >
> > =E2=80=9CSometimes I use big words that I do not fully understand= , to make myself sound more photosynthesis."
> >
> > > Regards,
> > > Greg
> > > _______________________________________________
> > > nvo3 mailing list
> > > nvo3@ietf= .org
> > > https://secure-web.cisco.com/1j-j= r64yh2D8yO92ibcqaN-H98ZCP3lQdHmsYPsH8lkjsa4WlJ4kg3W4HL8qT25rCVittT5bFQox__O= nSknV5w_wW69FvUhXkxqxKhi9MCiy5oH-JTucXN_7FK85q7jD-qEwRM5IXY68_Vfeb_XI2rKxyz= wVsG_06KTGF09Bw9oHAOXUNFcdCw_oon_eruUhRPtdwLc9UQNz2ThYP8ysf2pr64VU04VjMKmGw= qYvzzyAsLTEbHrs7GVCqphT58T0st78_968rM5MKFLk7EiWBj7gZPm_rDeBf63gUtxkcj-w8Xyb= JiiO2tcFaeoAL_8m-ZT5L9-1VK4wZkHmR5C_Ldg/https%3A%2F%2Fwww.ietf.org%2Fmailma= n%2Flistinfo%2Fnvo3
> >
>
> _______________________________________________
> nvo3 mailing list
> nvo3@ietf.org > https://secure-web.cisco.com/1j-jr64yh2D8= yO92ibcqaN-H98ZCP3lQdHmsYPsH8lkjsa4WlJ4kg3W4HL8qT25rCVittT5bFQox__OnSknV5w_= wW69FvUhXkxqxKhi9MCiy5oH-JTucXN_7FK85q7jD-qEwRM5IXY68_Vfeb_XI2rKxyzwVsG_06K= TGF09Bw9oHAOXUNFcdCw_oon_eruUhRPtdwLc9UQNz2ThYP8ysf2pr64VU04VjMKmGwqYvzzyAs= LTEbHrs7GVCqphT58T0st78_968rM5MKFLk7EiWBj7gZPm_rDeBf63gUtxkcj-w8XybJiiO2tcF= aeoAL_8m-ZT5L9-1VK4wZkHmR5C_Ldg/https%3A%2F%2Fwww.ietf.org%2Fmailman%2Flist= info%2Fnvo3

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From: "Carlos Pignataro (cpignata)" To: Greg Mirsky CC: NVO3 , "draft-ietf-nvo3-vxlan-gpe@ietf.org" , IETF IPPM WG , "sfc@ietf.org" Thread-Topic: [SUSPICIOUS] Re: [nvo3] Comments on draft-ietf-nvo3-vxlan-gpe Thread-Index: AQHU8Pwb4PQUm0Sk6kyANyiY2S4odqY4th6AgAhKgYCAAAxngIAAJG4AgAAoIICAAAiMAP//wjaA Date: Thu, 18 Apr 2019 01:07:56 +0000 Message-ID: <5C94C616-82BD-49CE-BB20-A31F843E8806@cisco.com> References: <12ACA02A-BB51-4214-A72B-1AEFCCB914AC@cisco.com> <3AFD4751-CF3A-4939-A49A-FB981C68CADF@cisco.com> <4C9CDD29-BDF8-425E-998F-B12C1BD7CA7C@cisco.com> In-Reply-To: Accept-Language: en-US Content-Language: en-US X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: user-agent: Microsoft-MacOutlook/10.18.0.190414 x-ms-exchange-messagesentrepresentingtype: 1 x-ms-exchange-transport-fromentityheader: Hosted x-originating-ip: [10.118.116.132] Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="_000_5C94C61682BD49CEBB20A31F843E8806ciscocom_" MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Outbound-SMTP-Client: 64.101.220.158, xch-rtp-018.cisco.com X-Outbound-Node: rcdn-core-2.cisco.com Archived-At: Subject: Re: [sfc] [SUSPICIOUS] Re: [nvo3] Comments on draft-ietf-nvo3-vxlan-gpe X-BeenThere: sfc@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: Network Service Chaining List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 18 Apr 2019 01:08:05 -0000 --_000_5C94C61682BD49CEBB20A31F843E8806ciscocom_ Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64 RGVhciBHcmVnLA0KDQpBcyBhbiBpbm5vY2VudCBieXN0YW5kZXIsIEkgaGF2ZSBubyBkb2cgaW4g dGhpcyBmaWdodCAoaS5lLiwgbm8gcGVyc29uYWwgc3Rha2UgaW4gdGhlIGlzc3VlIHlvdSBrZWVw IHJhaXNpbmcpLCBidXQgeW91IHNlZW0gdG8gYmUgbWFraW5nIGEgcmF0aGVyIHN0cm9uZyBhY2N1 c2F0aW9uOiDigJx0aGUgdXBkYXRlcyB0aGUgZWRpdG9ycyBoYXZlIGJlZW4gbWFraW5nIHdpdGhv dXQgdGhlIFdHIGFncmVlaW5nIHRvIHRoYXTigJ0uIFlvdSB0YWxrIGFib3V0IHBsdXJhbCDigJx1 cGRhdGVz4oCdLCBhbmQgeW91IHVzZSBhIGNvbnRpbnVlZCB0ZW5zZSBvZiDigJxoYXZlIGJlZW4g 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