From nobody Tue Jul 2 05:51:07 2019 Return-Path: X-Original-To: sfc@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: sfc@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id F35DB12013B for ; Tue, 2 Jul 2019 05:51:05 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.3 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.3 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_05=-0.5, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW=-0.7, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (1024-bit key) header.d=joelhalpern.com Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id rqyNh8mZP_er for ; Tue, 2 Jul 2019 05:51:04 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mailb2.tigertech.net (mailb2.tigertech.net [208.80.4.154]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id DF315120096 for ; Tue, 2 Jul 2019 05:51:03 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mailb2.tigertech.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 45dPHW4VwyzmjRp for ; Tue, 2 Jul 2019 05:51:03 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=joelhalpern.com; s=2.tigertech; t=1562071863; bh=dt2Rp+xkz+LZnkyZj/Eqc0vWomSoIfMoEdOVIJRDclQ=; h=To:From:Subject:Date:From; b=WiaTpJgxvvmG82dnHpetf3X4sBUO0pr8kDlnaWZIK26UpvmnCDVTGyfMZU2nzSlaf Ccq6dqCm+ZuO6qBEE5gF17HMEwDHnC1HNNld7blGE2Z2VY70sksI1rNOEW399zZG51 CNwkaa90ayYDfPPA413hDWSNQPfxLG2pOuDfyBYs= X-Virus-Scanned: Debian amavisd-new at b2.tigertech.net Received: from Joels-MacBook-Pro.local (209-255-163-147.ip.mcleodusa.net [209.255.163.147]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by mailb2.tigertech.net (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 45dPHW1FZLzFqYK for ; Tue, 2 Jul 2019 05:51:03 -0700 (PDT) To: "sfc@ietf.org" From: "Joel M. Halpern" Message-ID: <78ca7c96-05d1-7d5a-86e1-2f18577a52da@joelhalpern.com> Date: Tue, 2 Jul 2019 08:51:02 -0400 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Macintosh; Intel Mac OS X 10.14; rv:60.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/60.7.2 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8; format=flowed Content-Language: en-US Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Archived-At: Subject: [sfc] Working group adoption declined: https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-mirsky-sfc-pmamm/ X-BeenThere: sfc@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: Network Service Chaining List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 02 Jul 2019 12:51:06 -0000 The working group has completed its adoption call for https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-mirsky-sfc-pmamm/ Due to lack of support, and ongoing discussion, the working group has declined to adopt this document. I do want to take this opportunity to point out to folks that thw roking group had agreed that OAM was important, and that we need to work on it. The number of people who are willing to actually do the work (not just writing, but reviewing, commenting, participating) is observably low. Both this and Security need more WG attention. I hope to see involvement on the email list from the WG on these topics. Yours, Joel From nobody Sun Jul 7 09:55:04 2019 Return-Path: X-Original-To: sfc@ietf.org Delivered-To: sfc@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from ietfa.amsl.com (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2FE0C12009E; Sun, 7 Jul 2019 09:54:57 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: internet-drafts@ietf.org To: Cc: sfc@ietf.org X-Test-IDTracker: no X-IETF-IDTracker: 6.98.3 Auto-Submitted: auto-generated Precedence: bulk Reply-To: sfc@ietf.org Message-ID: <156251849706.601.1801362972832908707@ietfa.amsl.com> Date: Sun, 07 Jul 2019 09:54:57 -0700 Archived-At: Subject: [sfc] I-D Action: draft-ietf-sfc-nsh-ecn-support-01.txt X-BeenThere: sfc@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 List-Id: Network Service Chaining List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sun, 07 Jul 2019 16:54:58 -0000 A New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line Internet-Drafts directories. This draft is a work item of the Service Function Chaining WG of the IETF. Title : Explicit Congestion Notification (ECN) and Congestion Feedback Using the Network Service Header (NSH) Authors : Donald E. Eastlake Bob Briscoe Andrew G. Malis Filename : draft-ietf-sfc-nsh-ecn-support-01.txt Pages : 21 Date : 2019-07-07 Abstract: Explicit congestion notification (ECN) allows a forwarding element to notify downstream devices of the onset of congestion without having to drop packets. Coupled with a means to feed back information about congestion to upstream nodes, this can improve network efficiency through better congestion control, frequently without packet drops. This document specifies ECN and congestion feedback support within a Service Function Chaining (SFC) domain through use of the Network Service Header (NSH, RFC 8300) and IP Flow Information Export (IPFIX, draft-ietf-tsvwg-tunnel-congestion-feedback). The IETF datatracker status page for this draft is: https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-sfc-nsh-ecn-support/ There are also htmlized versions available at: https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-sfc-nsh-ecn-support-01 https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/html/draft-ietf-sfc-nsh-ecn-support-01 A diff from the previous version is available at: https://www.ietf.org/rfcdiff?url2=draft-ietf-sfc-nsh-ecn-support-01 Please note that it may take a couple of minutes from the time of submission until the htmlized version and diff are available at tools.ietf.org. Internet-Drafts are also available by anonymous FTP at: ftp://ftp.ietf.org/internet-drafts/ From nobody Mon Jul 8 06:15:22 2019 Return-Path: X-Original-To: sfc@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: sfc@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 06BC21201CC for ; Mon, 8 Jul 2019 06:15:13 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.999 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.999 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE=-0.0001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (1024-bit key) header.d=futurewei.com Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id kmhzfX3nWJ9J for ; Mon, 8 Jul 2019 06:15:09 -0700 (PDT) Received: from NAM03-DM3-obe.outbound.protection.outlook.com (mail-eopbgr800098.outbound.protection.outlook.com [40.107.80.98]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id A8866120191 for ; 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Mon, 8 Jul 2019 13:15:07 +0000 From: James Guichard To: "sfc@ietf.org" Thread-Topic: WG Last Call draft-ietf-sfc-oam-framework-06 Thread-Index: AQHVFWHG6SZyvEyD3EGGLNC6v36bBKbA8JWQ Date: Mon, 8 Jul 2019 13:15:07 +0000 Message-ID: References: In-Reply-To: Accept-Language: en-US Content-Language: en-US X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: authentication-results: spf=none (sender IP is ) smtp.mailfrom=james.n.guichard@futurewei.com; x-originating-ip: [47.14.28.158] x-ms-publictraffictype: Email x-ms-office365-filtering-correlation-id: 269b1f80-9181-4de1-d9fc-08d703a64c70 x-microsoft-antispam: BCL:0; PCL:0; RULEID:(2390118)(7020095)(4652040)(8989299)(4534185)(4627221)(201703031133081)(201702281549075)(8990200)(5600148)(711020)(4605104)(1401327)(2017052603328)(7193020); SRVR:CH2PR13MB3478; x-ms-traffictypediagnostic: CH2PR13MB3478: x-ms-exchange-purlcount: 3 x-microsoft-antispam-prvs: x-ms-oob-tlc-oobclassifiers: OLM:6790; x-forefront-prvs: 00922518D8 x-forefront-antispam-report: SFV:NSPM; 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boundary="_000_CH2PR13MB36080759DE5185750C651A2AD2F60CH2PR13MB3608namp_" MIME-Version: 1.0 X-OriginatorOrg: Futurewei.com X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-Network-Message-Id: 269b1f80-9181-4de1-d9fc-08d703a64c70 X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-originalarrivaltime: 08 Jul 2019 13:15:07.6304 (UTC) X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-fromentityheader: Hosted X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-id: 0fee8ff2-a3b2-4018-9c75-3a1d5591fedc X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-mailboxtype: HOSTED X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-userprincipalname: jguichar@futurewei.com X-MS-Exchange-Transport-CrossTenantHeadersStamped: CH2PR13MB3478 Archived-At: Subject: Re: [sfc] WG Last Call draft-ietf-sfc-oam-framework-06 X-BeenThere: sfc@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: Network Service Chaining List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 08 Jul 2019 13:15:21 -0000 --_000_CH2PR13MB36080759DE5185750C651A2AD2F60CH2PR13MB3608namp_ Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Dear WG: Before closing this WG Last Call, we (the chairs) would like to better unde= rstand the level of interest and commitment the WG has on progressing OAM w= ork for SFC, starting with draft-ietf-sfc-oam-framework as a baseline. Plea= se reply to this email with either support for the document, or non-support= (we do not need this document). Silence does not imply support or lack the= reof so please take time to state your opinions with a brief rational for s= upport/non-support. Thanks! Jim & Joel From: James Guichard Sent: Tuesday, May 28, 2019 10:30 AM To: sfc@ietf.org Subject: WG Last Call draft-ietf-sfc-oam-framework-06 Dear WG: This message starts a new two week WG Last Call on advancing https://datatr= acker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-sfc-oam-framework/ for publication as an Informational RFC. Substantive comments and statements of support for publishing this document= should be directed to the mailing list. Editorial suggestions can be sent = to the authors. This last call will end on 11th June 2019. Thanks! Jim & Joel --_000_CH2PR13MB36080759DE5185750C651A2AD2F60CH2PR13MB3608namp_ Content-Type: text/html; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

Dear WG:

 

Before closing this WG Last Call, we (the chairs) wo= uld like to better understand the level of interest and commitment the WG h= as on progressing OAM work for SFC, starting with draft-ietf-sfc-oam-framew= ork as a baseline. Please reply to this email with either support for the document, or non-support (we do not= need this document). Silence does not imply support or lack thereof so ple= ase take time to state your opinions with a brief rational for support/non-= support.

 

Thanks!

 

Jim & Joel

 

 

From: James Guichard
Sent: Tuesday, May 28, 2019 10:30 AM
To: sfc@ietf.org
Subject: WG Last Call draft-ietf-sfc-oam-framework-06

 

Dear WG:<= /p>

 

This message starts a new t= wo week WG Last Call on advancing https://datatracker.ietf.o= rg/doc/draft-ietf-sfc-oam-framework/ for publication as an Informational RFC.

 

Substantive comments and st= atements of support for publishing this document should be directed to the = mailing list. Editorial suggestions can be sent to the authors.  This = last call will end on 11th June 2019.

 

Thanks!

 

Jim & Joel

&n= bsp;

&n= bsp;

 

&n= bsp;

--_000_CH2PR13MB36080759DE5185750C651A2AD2F60CH2PR13MB3608namp_-- From nobody Mon Jul 8 06:27:52 2019 Return-Path: X-Original-To: sfc@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: sfc@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id D0762120178 for ; Mon, 8 Jul 2019 06:27:50 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.497 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.497 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, HTTPS_HTTP_MISMATCH=0.1, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW=-0.7, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, UNPARSEABLE_RELAY=0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id iEB3Df_9oVfY for ; Mon, 8 Jul 2019 06:27:48 -0700 (PDT) Received: from relais-inet.orange.com (relais-inet.orange.com [80.12.66.41]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher AECDH-AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 8F123120165 for ; Mon, 8 Jul 2019 06:27:48 -0700 (PDT) Received: from opfedar07.francetelecom.fr (unknown [xx.xx.xx.9]) by opfedar21.francetelecom.fr (ESMTP service) with ESMTP id 45j5q71RdFz7tZp; Mon, 8 Jul 2019 15:27:47 +0200 (CEST) Received: from Exchangemail-eme6.itn.ftgroup (unknown [xx.xx.13.45]) by opfedar07.francetelecom.fr (ESMTP service) with ESMTP id 45j5q70Cy1z5vPR; Mon, 8 Jul 2019 15:27:47 +0200 (CEST) Received: from OPEXCAUBMA2.corporate.adroot.infra.ftgroup ([fe80::e878:bd0:c89e:5b42]) by OPEXCAUBM42.corporate.adroot.infra.ftgroup ([::1]) with mapi id 14.03.0439.000; Mon, 8 Jul 2019 15:23:56 +0200 From: To: James Guichard , "sfc@ietf.org" Thread-Topic: WG Last Call draft-ietf-sfc-oam-framework-06 Thread-Index: AQHVFWHG6SZyvEyD3EGGLNC6v36bBKbA8JWQgAAEtiA= Date: Mon, 8 Jul 2019 13:23:55 +0000 Message-ID: <787AE7BB302AE849A7480A190F8B93302EAC5A4F@OPEXCAUBMA2.corporate.adroot.infra.ftgroup> References: In-Reply-To: Accept-Language: fr-FR, en-US Content-Language: fr-FR X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: x-originating-ip: [10.114.13.245] Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="_000_787AE7BB302AE849A7480A190F8B93302EAC5A4FOPEXCAUBMA2corp_" MIME-Version: 1.0 Archived-At: Subject: Re: [sfc] WG Last Call draft-ietf-sfc-oam-framework-06 X-BeenThere: sfc@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: Network Service Chaining List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 08 Jul 2019 13:27:51 -0000 --_000_787AE7BB302AE849A7480A190F8B93302EAC5A4FOPEXCAUBMA2corp_ Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Hi Jim, all, I do support this effort. This is IMHO one of the missing pieces (in additi= on to standardizing key metadata TLVs). Cheers, Med De : sfc [mailto:sfc-bounces@ietf.org] De la part de James Guichard Envoy=E9 : lundi 8 juillet 2019 15:15 =C0 : sfc@ietf.org Objet : Re: [sfc] WG Last Call draft-ietf-sfc-oam-framework-06 Dear WG: Before closing this WG Last Call, we (the chairs) would like to better unde= rstand the level of interest and commitment the WG has on progressing OAM w= ork for SFC, starting with draft-ietf-sfc-oam-framework as a baseline. Plea= se reply to this email with either support for the document, or non-support= (we do not need this document). Silence does not imply support or lack the= reof so please take time to state your opinions with a brief rational for s= upport/non-support. Thanks! Jim & Joel From: James Guichard Sent: Tuesday, May 28, 2019 10:30 AM To: sfc@ietf.org Subject: WG Last Call draft-ietf-sfc-oam-framework-06 Dear WG: This message starts a new two week WG Last Call on advancing https://datatr= acker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-sfc-oam-framework/ for publication as an Informational RFC. Substantive comments and statements of support for publishing this document= should be directed to the mailing list. Editorial suggestions can be sent = to the authors. This last call will end on 11th June 2019. Thanks! Jim & Joel --_000_787AE7BB302AE849A7480A190F8B93302EAC5A4FOPEXCAUBMA2corp_ Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

Hi Jim, all,

 

I do support this effort. This = is IMHO one of the missing pieces (in addition to standardizing key metadat= a TLVs).

 

Cheers,

Med

 

De : sfc = [mailto:sfc-bounces@ietf.org] De la part de James Guichard
Envoy=E9 : lundi 8 juillet 2019 15:15
=C0 : sfc@ietf.org
Objet : Re: [sfc] WG Last Call draft-ietf-sfc-oam-framework-06<= o:p>

 

Dear WG:

 

Before closing this WG Last Cal= l, we (the chairs) would like to better understand the level of interest an= d commitment the WG has on progressing OAM work for SFC, starting with draf= t-ietf-sfc-oam-framework as a baseline. Please reply to this email with either support for the document, or non-su= pport (we do not need this document). Silence does not imply support or lac= k thereof so please take time to state your opinions with a brief rational = for support/non-support.

 

Thanks!

 

Jim & Joel

 

 

From: James Guichard
Sent: Tuesday, May 28, 2019 10:30 AM
To: sfc@ietf.org
Subject: WG Last Call draft-ietf-sfc-oam-framework-06

 

Dear WG:

 

This message starts a new two= week WG Last Call on advancing https://datatracker.ie= tf.org/doc/draft-ietf-sfc-oam-framework/ for publication as an Informational RFC.

 

Substantive comments and stat= ements of support for publishing this document should be directed to the ma= iling list. Editorial suggestions can be sent to the authors.  This la= st call will end on 11th June 2019.

 

Thanks!

 

Jim & Joel

 

 

 

 

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PDS_NO_HELO_DNS=1.295, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE=-0.0001, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=no autolearn_force=no Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id S7GzDdAaGRNF for ; Mon, 8 Jul 2019 17:45:17 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail-ua1-f41.google.com (mail-ua1-f41.google.com [209.85.222.41]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id D9B5E12036B for ; Mon, 8 Jul 2019 17:45:16 -0700 (PDT) Received: by mail-ua1-f41.google.com with SMTP id s4so5715619uad.7 for ; Mon, 08 Jul 2019 17:45:16 -0700 (PDT) X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date :message-id:subject:to:cc; bh=1B3QK4eCgyWrahKSGE7TGdmOiqVWOdghcEd/3c+ar0g=; b=U+S812xtB+fReahje+gnuSNLvg4C1f5pxwEP0tALoTVZCzcQQW3HGOhOkyl744MB1l BoopficuVRBvJYuoQg1C+AFB4MyaTw9q5BUp6dRFID5P+c+12uRHouAxgS0sflcoogFG +zDl8geU2/FRxutvA8ZtZSlrtraDNOlhsDYs98oTgbyyg5/b15C6qPNia3pRc24AuPKA NJkkFQuAIRDeBzyIvQo+yGhLg/XlVIau+L9wDtJLD0W8CG4pSQ22OxzetMjaFc53nDqT EGkHUs0L7TgeaqPMWDwRqZs/dyVwL7/vZd95vfXxJvBnWlsBpc10PGtNLcCA1XSRWX2X +NCA== X-Gm-Message-State: APjAAAXwAxZvOk0jCi/zvdQYMxWbeT5eQefnxTMnhgjWDaBv+KbnQcji 0KNC5WCX0rPgr7u+82uvnN6Y2ZFVsMfBlo24eNo= X-Google-Smtp-Source: APXvYqySwFAKHTS5xVfFYEyyf2OT3SVyg6XbpIMEgf5DXGSGgwlK/FI1YkmdnvQV7XxT/Qeq1IUn7o73phGb0ekThLQ= X-Received: by 2002:ab0:6503:: with SMTP id w3mr11301135uam.99.1562633115874; Mon, 08 Jul 2019 17:45:15 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 References: In-Reply-To: From: Anoop Ghanwani Date: Mon, 8 Jul 2019 17:45:04 -0700 Message-ID: To: James Guichard Cc: "sfc@ietf.org" Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="000000000000c939f1058d34dfe2" Archived-At: Subject: Re: [sfc] WG Last Call draft-ietf-sfc-oam-framework-06 X-BeenThere: sfc@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: Network Service Chaining List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 09 Jul 2019 00:45:23 -0000 --000000000000c939f1058d34dfe2 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable I support both the framework doc (co-author) and the development of OAM solutions for SFC. Thanks, Anoop On Mon, Jul 8, 2019 at 6:15 AM James Guichard < james.n.guichard@futurewei.com> wrote: > Dear WG: > > > > Before closing this WG Last Call, we (the chairs) would like to better > understand the level of interest and commitment the WG has on progressing > OAM work for SFC, starting with draft-ietf-sfc-oam-framework as a baselin= e. > Please reply to this email with either support for the document, or > non-support (we do not need this document). Silence does not imply suppor= t > or lack thereof so please take time to state your opinions with a brief > rational for support/non-support. > > > > Thanks! > > > > Jim & Joel > > > > > > *From:* James Guichard > *Sent:* Tuesday, May 28, 2019 10:30 AM > *To:* sfc@ietf.org > *Subject:* WG Last Call draft-ietf-sfc-oam-framework-06 > > > > Dear WG: > > > > This message starts a new two week WG Last Call on advancing > https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-sfc-oam-framework/ > > for publication as an Informational RFC. > > > > Substantive comments and statements of support for publishing this > document should be directed to the mailing list. Editorial suggestions ca= n > be sent to the authors. This last call will end on 11th June 2019. > > > > Thanks! > > > > Jim & Joel > > > > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > sfc mailing list > sfc@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/sfc > --000000000000c939f1058d34dfe2 Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
I support both the framework doc (co-auth= or) and the development of OAM solutions for SFC.

Thanks= ,
Anoop

On Mon, Jul 8, 2019 at 6:15 AM James Guichard <james.n.guichard@futurewei.= com> wrote:

Dear WG:

=C2=A0

Before closing this WG Last Call, we (the chairs) wo= uld like to better understand the level of interest and commitment the WG h= as on progressing OAM work for SFC, starting with draft-ietf-sfc-oam-framew= ork as a baseline. Please reply to this email with either support for the document, or non-support (we do not= need this document). Silence does not imply support or lack thereof so ple= ase take time to state your opinions with a brief rational for support/non-= support.

=C2=A0

Thanks!

=C2=A0

Jim & Joel

=C2=A0

=C2=A0

From: James Guichard
Sent: Tuesday, May 28, 2019 10:30 AM
To: sfc@ietf.org
Subject: WG Last Call draft-ietf-sfc-oam-framework-06<= /p>

=C2=A0

Dear WG:=

=C2=A0

This message starts a new two= week WG Last Call on advancing http= s://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-sfc-oam-framework/ for publication as an Informational RFC.

=C2=A0

Substantive comments and stat= ements of support for publishing this document should be directed to the ma= iling list. Editorial suggestions can be sent to the authors.=C2=A0 This la= st call will end on 11th June 2019.

=C2=A0

Thanks!<= /p>

=C2=A0

Jim & Joel<= /span>

= =C2=A0

= =C2=A0

=C2=A0

= =C2=A0

_______________________________________________
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Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="0000000000003ff401058d35ca9f" Archived-At: Subject: Re: [sfc] WG Last Call draft-ietf-sfc-oam-framework-06 X-BeenThere: sfc@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: Network Service Chaining List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 09 Jul 2019 01:50:53 -0000 --0000000000003ff401058d35ca9f Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Hi Jim, I've reviewed the latest version of the document and find that many of my earlier comments, questions have not yet been answered, addressed. In particular, I'd like to return to the question I've asked authors What is "availability"? As we know, OAM provides tools for Fault Management and Performance Monitoring ('F' and 'P' in FCAPS). Where does "availability", as discussed in this document, fit? Is it to detect a defect? Or is it a performance metric? If it is the former, then how it is related to other known FM OAM methods - connectivity verification and continuity check? If it is the latter,i.e., performance metric, then how it is measured? What is the unit of "availability" - second, number of packets? I've asked this question and have to bring it up again because I don't see in the document an explanation, definition, or reference to an existing document. I hope that the WG and you ask authors to address my comment and questions. Please note that I'm preparing more comments on the current version and will share them later this week (apologies, had to beat the IETF cut-off submission deadline). Regards, Greg On Tue, May 28, 2019 at 7:37 AM James Guichard < james.n.guichard@futurewei.com> wrote: > Dear WG: > > > > This message starts a new two week WG Last Call on advancing > https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-sfc-oam-framework/ > > for publication as an Informational RFC. > > > > Substantive comments and statements of support for publishing this > document should be directed to the mailing list. Editorial suggestions ca= n > be sent to the authors. This last call will end on 11th June 2019. > > > > Thanks! > > > > Jim & Joel > > > > > _______________________________________________ > sfc mailing list > sfc@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/sfc > --0000000000003ff401058d35ca9f Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Hi Jim,
I've reviewed the latest version of the do= cument and find that many of my earlier comments, questions have not yet be= en answered, addressed. In particular, I'd like to return to the questi= on I've asked authors What is "availability"? As we know, OAM= provides tools for Fault Management and Performance Monitoring ('F'= ; and 'P' in FCAPS). Where does "availability", as discus= sed in this document,=C2=A0 fit? Is it to detect a defect? Or is it a perfo= rmance metric? If it is the former, then how it is related to other known F= M OAM methods - connectivity verification and continuity check? If it is th= e latter,i.e., performance metric, then how it is measured? What is the uni= t of "availability" - second, number of packets?
I'= ve asked this question and have to bring it up again because I don't se= e in the document an explanation, definition, or reference to an existing d= ocument.
I hope that the WG and you ask authors to address my com= ment and questions.
Please note that I'm preparing more comme= nts on the current version and will share them later this week (apologies, = had to beat the IETF cut-off submission deadline).

Regards,
Greg

On Tue, May 28, 2019 at 7:37 AM James Guichar= d <james.n.guichard@fu= turewei.com> wrote:

Dear W= G:

=C2=A0=

This m= essage starts a new two week WG Last Call on advancing https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-sfc-oam-framework/ for publication as an Informational RFC.

=C2=A0=

Substa= ntive comments and statements of support for publishing this document shoul= d be directed to the mailing list. Editorial suggestions can be sent to the= authors.=C2=A0 This last call will end on 11th June 2019.

=C2=A0=

Thanks= !

=C2=A0=

Jim &a= mp; Joel





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--0000000000003ff401058d35ca9f-- From nobody Mon Jul 8 23:09:32 2019 Return-Path: X-Original-To: sfc@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: sfc@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0C0C01202E2 for ; Mon, 8 Jul 2019 23:09:32 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -0.702 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-0.702 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, PDS_NO_HELO_DNS=1.295, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE=-0.0001, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=no autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=gmail.com Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id pADYjnO352SN for ; Mon, 8 Jul 2019 23:09:30 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail-ed1-x534.google.com (mail-ed1-x534.google.com [IPv6:2a00:1450:4864:20::534]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 414D0120108 for ; Mon, 8 Jul 2019 23:09:30 -0700 (PDT) Received: by mail-ed1-x534.google.com with SMTP id p15so6119704eds.8 for ; Mon, 08 Jul 2019 23:09:30 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20161025; h=mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date:message-id:subject:to :cc; bh=a+24+KUOUzNQB7JKZVt8Jkh86G/NDh5zdqRtJXGKIdg=; b=jVb1pzalh5ulIbCzgp2kb6bEw/ZKtAAbgIco8bgsq2TEDomsilg5iomqyvUKAS1uHM Jso/MWh2YPPEUWgYvi2+H76pR4UNl4yODJGwKu0bO+6jh5e25ExY8/4T76rN7orsvds0 qSYMw3gVCC7e2gnmeZsNnGgjoc5xhC+0CLF4VUtlTyurCyqBVYJ/5y+3EN4MGcLtgQjP V7z3nt0a9yc3jQwjdgXI0HyO1lJcdA/Sy/LbV0Yhh8YNuSeCotDRbDeRi6cKYZQgsHd2 PCpQZV/QHzU/m0fq24mmkZ+36YQL2z6RbdwJOhZccR+gkefTq7u3Kvyq4hCgIRnWEf/q 18LQ== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date :message-id:subject:to:cc; bh=a+24+KUOUzNQB7JKZVt8Jkh86G/NDh5zdqRtJXGKIdg=; b=MwZVuEJsoT5kcpSCJ5Q2MpxZ3L9nv7ow0iiXxkJad9ZAxn37NfZOB8AdTDDrXPc9yW p1YSC1pOUdjxrPwvuoz1oSJWorK9sfRtRRLWNkrfTKMuC7+xq0CVyIHD4N0gCFFc6Yix kXJ5tha7lgeraihGh83FxxwjFPf2VnpCAo+oBtBax3hei4yVZFhpHTuRzaLMvpss6hME b37hoqbdIWCzK/zzaGWFIOSNpyGlVxXCwT2pDdPR3hGw0P8xToGn25zPS8CW722++mn6 PaNRamMtJhQ2uNNZ8YChOjpY9+FD2T6GBPcaEVKXkALfN+8YLfX3jYmml3m6oO+TucWv Yf0Q== X-Gm-Message-State: APjAAAUYk/mIryZexTfh3XI29oNrBWaxMAnZJdKEn5N2zPD1el7ND23s hmLup2aCB4+R3HCe1jpLXlIh7qRjGMBXf6VfVxLs7Q== X-Google-Smtp-Source: APXvYqy9VvNhMsk+mPP65AYOmGqN5/WCUmESZyqEfpZaNP6JwfGE2rGXRqPK/yCFVCXEcGl77gmZSz2MNCN90zFLkbM= X-Received: by 2002:a17:906:25c5:: with SMTP id n5mr19454898ejb.195.1562652568693; Mon, 08 Jul 2019 23:09:28 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 References: In-Reply-To: From: Sam Aldrin Date: Mon, 8 Jul 2019 23:09:17 -0700 Message-ID: To: James Guichard Cc: "sfc@ietf.org" Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="00000000000043b064058d3967f8" Archived-At: Subject: Re: [sfc] WG Last Call draft-ietf-sfc-oam-framework-06 X-BeenThere: sfc@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: Network Service Chaining List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 09 Jul 2019 06:09:32 -0000 --00000000000043b064058d3967f8 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable This document forms OAM solutions for SFC and is part of the charter. Would support this work, both as author and end-user. -sam On Mon, Jul 8, 2019 at 6:16 AM James Guichard < james.n.guichard@futurewei.com> wrote: > Dear WG: > > > > Before closing this WG Last Call, we (the chairs) would like to better > understand the level of interest and commitment the WG has on progressing > OAM work for SFC, starting with draft-ietf-sfc-oam-framework as a baselin= e. > Please reply to this email with either support for the document, or > non-support (we do not need this document). Silence does not imply suppor= t > or lack thereof so please take time to state your opinions with a brief > rational for support/non-support. > > > > Thanks! > > > > Jim & Joel > > > > > > *From:* James Guichard > *Sent:* Tuesday, May 28, 2019 10:30 AM > *To:* sfc@ietf.org > *Subject:* WG Last Call draft-ietf-sfc-oam-framework-06 > > > > Dear WG: > > > > This message starts a new two week WG Last Call on advancing > https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-sfc-oam-framework/ > > for publication as an Informational RFC. > > > > Substantive comments and statements of support for publishing this > document should be directed to the mailing list. Editorial suggestions ca= n > be sent to the authors. This last call will end on 11th June 2019. > > > > Thanks! > > > > Jim & Joel > > > > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > sfc mailing list > sfc@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/sfc > --00000000000043b064058d3967f8 Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
This document forms OAM solutions for SFC and is part of t= he charter.
Would support this work, both as author and end-user.
=

-sam

On Mon, Jul 8, 2019 at 6:16 AM James Guichard= <james.n.guichard@fut= urewei.com> wrote:

Dear WG:

=C2=A0

Before closing this WG Last Call, we (the chairs) wo= uld like to better understand the level of interest and commitment the WG h= as on progressing OAM work for SFC, starting with draft-ietf-sfc-oam-framew= ork as a baseline. Please reply to this email with either support for the document, or non-support (we do not= need this document). Silence does not imply support or lack thereof so ple= ase take time to state your opinions with a brief rational for support/non-= support.

=C2=A0

Thanks!

=C2=A0

Jim & Joel

=C2=A0

=C2=A0

From: James Guichard
Sent: Tuesday, May 28, 2019 10:30 AM
To: sfc@ietf.org
Subject: WG Last Call draft-ietf-sfc-oam-framework-06<= /p>

=C2=A0

Dear WG:=

=C2=A0

This message starts a new two= week WG Last Call on advancing http= s://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-sfc-oam-framework/ for publication as an Informational RFC.

=C2=A0

Substantive comments and stat= ements of support for publishing this document should be directed to the ma= iling list. Editorial suggestions can be sent to the authors.=C2=A0 This la= st call will end on 11th June 2019.

=C2=A0

Thanks!<= /p>

=C2=A0

Jim & Joel<= /span>

= =C2=A0

= =C2=A0

=C2=A0

= =C2=A0

_______________________________________________
sfc mailing list
sfc@ietf.org
https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/sfc
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DIR:OUT; SFP:1101; SCL:1; SRVR:CY4PR11MB1959; H:CY4PR11MB1767.namprd11.prod.outlook.com; FPR:; SPF:None; LANG:en; PTR:InfoNoRecords; A:1; MX:1; received-spf: None (protection.outlook.com: cisco.com does not designate permitted sender hosts) x-ms-exchange-senderadcheck: 1 x-microsoft-antispam-message-info: io5G2NA97w8AWekegcajEgDuYroACIcJRqJHrKMcDzMgkAbq4vwb8gfoHPao9Lu4YFnL0dy07QWZRWpsXIN+//KyvvCIwBtC2rB1G7XZRs/nqrc+AMpsz7S7Ujgjf3mBlctOaOMq+sYoDdowX6egxdduGeNZWvRn9ORaI1MpbpzaHhUqampOO/5PBSBhgTj9PdZ5VeKDS4/Ej6IbwLHtb6+UFmRFirodOz4yO0YAW3lSNpIshK0kQvuT1C9FFe+25DqpMHdLY8g/gbMtIsOthYHoiFf9+wDqeqMNr/qF4M16ZXs03dP7owkUvuiing9YVMQBKInHQCcFDlEPLYcsEFrEytz22sQ2RYh0Uu7EHNjMFEfV+41F3fKkNHOuDsSp+cS+lvhRROCzjL/QlWZwwI5KN9xt/73Y3VFRFTOQkX8= Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="_000_CY4PR11MB17671EABB0DB92F312C4B24ACDF10CY4PR11MB1767namp_" MIME-Version: 1.0 X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-Network-Message-Id: 916a6cf0-7b6d-43e9-0c89-08d70462ba68 X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-originalarrivaltime: 09 Jul 2019 11:43:57.4840 (UTC) X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-fromentityheader: Hosted X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-id: 5ae1af62-9505-4097-a69a-c1553ef7840e X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-mailboxtype: HOSTED X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-userprincipalname: venggovi@cisco.com X-MS-Exchange-Transport-CrossTenantHeadersStamped: CY4PR11MB1959 X-OriginatorOrg: cisco.com X-Outbound-SMTP-Client: 173.37.102.11, xch-rcd-001.cisco.com X-Outbound-Node: rcdn-core-5.cisco.com Archived-At: Subject: Re: [sfc] WG Last Call draft-ietf-sfc-oam-framework-06 X-BeenThere: sfc@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: Network Service Chaining List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 09 Jul 2019 12:16:57 -0000 --_000_CY4PR11MB17671EABB0DB92F312C4B24ACDF10CY4PR11MB1767namp_ Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Support, A useful document that outlines the layering and the options available for = OAM functions for SFC. A nit - the second paragraph talks about initiators that are relevant to S= -BFD only but it begins with "BFD or S-BFD ...". This could be made briefer= to limit it to S-BFD only. Thanks, Prasad From: sfc On Behalf Of James Guichard Sent: Monday, July 8, 2019 18:45 To: sfc@ietf.org Subject: Re: [sfc] WG Last Call draft-ietf-sfc-oam-framework-06 Dear WG: Before closing this WG Last Call, we (the chairs) would like to better unde= rstand the level of interest and commitment the WG has on progressing OAM w= ork for SFC, starting with draft-ietf-sfc-oam-framework as a baseline. Plea= se reply to this email with either support for the document, or non-support= (we do not need this document). Silence does not imply support or lack the= reof so please take time to state your opinions with a brief rational for s= upport/non-support. Thanks! Jim & Joel From: James Guichard Sent: Tuesday, May 28, 2019 10:30 AM To: sfc@ietf.org Subject: WG Last Call draft-ietf-sfc-oam-framework-06 Dear WG: This message starts a new two week WG Last Call on advancing https://datatr= acker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-sfc-oam-framework/ for publication as an Informational RFC. Substantive comments and statements of support for publishing this document= should be directed to the mailing list. Editorial suggestions can be sent = to the authors. This last call will end on 11th June 2019. Thanks! Jim & Joel --_000_CY4PR11MB17671EABB0DB92F312C4B24ACDF10CY4PR11MB1767namp_ Content-Type: text/html; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

Support,

 

A useful document that outlines the layering and the= options available for OAM functions for SFC.

A nit -  the second paragraph talks about initi= ators that are relevant to S-BFD only but it begins with “BFD or S-BF= D …”. This could be made briefer to limit it to S-BFD only.

 

Thanks,

Prasad

 

From: sfc <sfc-bounces@ietf.org> On = Behalf Of James Guichard
Sent: Monday, July 8, 2019 18:45
To: sfc@ietf.org
Subject: Re: [sfc] WG Last Call draft-ietf-sfc-oam-framework-06=

 

Dear WG:

 

Before closing this WG Last Call, we (the chairs) wo= uld like to better understand the level of interest and commitment the WG h= as on progressing OAM work for SFC, starting with draft-ietf-sfc-oam-framew= ork as a baseline. Please reply to this email with either support for the document, or non-support (we do not= need this document). Silence does not imply support or lack thereof so ple= ase take time to state your opinions with a brief rational for support/non-= support.

 

Thanks!

 

Jim & Joel

 

 

From: James Guichard
Sent: Tuesday, May 28, 2019 10:30 AM
To: sfc@ietf.org
Subject: WG Last Call draft-ietf-sfc-oam-framework-06

 

Dear WG:<= /p>

 

This message starts a new t= wo week WG Last Call on advancing https://datatracker.ietf.o= rg/doc/draft-ietf-sfc-oam-framework/ for publication as an Informational RFC.

 

Substantive comments and st= atements of support for publishing this document should be directed to the = mailing list. Editorial suggestions can be sent to the authors.  This = last call will end on 11th June 2019.

 

Thanks!

 

Jim & Joel

&n= bsp;

&n= bsp;

 

&n= bsp;

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(mail-lf1-x133.google.com [IPv6:2a00:1450:4864:20::133]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 606C612004F for ; Wed, 10 Jul 2019 15:33:38 -0700 (PDT) Received: by mail-lf1-x133.google.com with SMTP id z15so2658690lfh.13 for ; Wed, 10 Jul 2019 15:33:38 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20161025; h=mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date:message-id:subject:to :cc; bh=2nL0CCNiX8DpyB+c2JAljwUjfBnz+4h+GmDsXzCDf1s=; b=QNTO6bN+Q2mrwUiU+trKe2xoDZyEyNskHjdEGwSVlxQejVtej0dDFKX46lYRBz2G9/ yteNiihkFLasNCEAe62Vty4vDjcBf6jgOYJnHr8jTGB/CdkTrpbgVMtdJXQVTGSvvcuG YVx+NTbUdwXx4iUiIUaiobrkFwVdZlevt2MyLraAmnJozBsNchQs92WTZohAT5urEl+o Q73Tj6VswnO71/T04v5fahLc0uChnUT85edLEwcltgu6E2Ba7yQvS9IF0lLvjLKNtDYH eT0HePFOXoECRWjsK1iioy1ZLdDqhimFd+VEbHTXFFhjkXLjmUKVb1JXhUS1A/nbATH9 ALlw== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date :message-id:subject:to:cc; bh=2nL0CCNiX8DpyB+c2JAljwUjfBnz+4h+GmDsXzCDf1s=; b=fT5X76x4EmaKhQbp1WV2RlznlJUi/49r+rpdyyhMj9CQM3pqfQYZDqc9Ds8QrmIev8 OgcO3V3Uf4VbZcpaLgQE2PZ9//5mPms8QrkdEPj0Ym9KZa1uD4QDtHZrgsLEQtIhNJgf dYGhb4ipaFB0DyfIKsJmtCQnFAs8GP4zfWDcYHrfdf5OBKXmWbzlwUGObKGC6McIMVre XzCDSqB+/mJPDaRFg7MlYzBnuuTz8ThBHQnm3J0gNnsjrUCWm5nQ5wdAgc9eT7152kJU azNo1LaFxgrhNs+ZS6QiLdJ8lpHACe3WghrxT654kc7epnbLZ8IdXraEiTSg2ng+CEWz kvTA== X-Gm-Message-State: APjAAAXFxtoVQ/pNlP/kFeUPKWCsWWk4kPg5cvbrqNjZhjjaVJkmNtFC KLlc5A2m4NXmEMrNAWwHmGdVIof16KU2MiV6FbI= X-Google-Smtp-Source: APXvYqzKYUNpiNCE+J+rXWUmrwTFJQBshUI7Zvx/KE5Z20cwLphobTdNBkYhWfQIXZe8hxEtDEolYlRFJye+xW7SgcA= X-Received: by 2002:a19:9111:: with SMTP id t17mr33390lfd.113.1562798016377; Wed, 10 Jul 2019 15:33:36 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 References: In-Reply-To: From: Greg Mirsky Date: Wed, 10 Jul 2019 15:33:24 -0700 Message-ID: To: James Guichard Cc: "sfc@ietf.org" Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="0000000000009f383b058d5b442d" Archived-At: Subject: Re: [sfc] WG Last Call draft-ietf-sfc-oam-framework-06 X-BeenThere: sfc@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: Network Service Chaining List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 10 Jul 2019 22:33:40 -0000 --0000000000009f383b058d5b442d Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Hi Jim, Joel, et al., I have a question about the scope of the SFC OAM Framework. In Section 1.1 the scope is defined as: The focus of this document is to provide an architectural framework for SFC OAM, particularly focused on the aspect of the Operations component within OAM. Actual solutions and mechanisms are outside the scope of this document. But after reading it several times over, I believe that the scope of the document is more narrow and includes only OAM for SFC NSH. I couldn't find any discussion of OAM for SFC based on RFC 8595, nor I could find it being referenced in the framework. If it is outside the scope of this document, should it provide an explanation, identify it as an outstanding work for the future? Regards, Greg On Tue, May 28, 2019 at 7:37 AM James Guichard < james.n.guichard@futurewei.com> wrote: > Dear WG: > > > > This message starts a new two week WG Last Call on advancing > https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-sfc-oam-framework/ > > for publication as an Informational RFC. > > > > Substantive comments and statements of support for publishing this > document should be directed to the mailing list. Editorial suggestions ca= n > be sent to the authors. This last call will end on 11th June 2019. > > > > Thanks! > > > > Jim & Joel > > > > > _______________________________________________ > sfc mailing list > sfc@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/sfc > --0000000000009f383b058d5b442d Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Hi Jim, Joel, et al.,
I have a question about the scop= e of the SFC OAM Framework. In Section 1.1 the scope is defined as:
=C2=A0 =C2=A0The focus of this document is to provide an architectural f= ramework
=C2=A0 =C2=A0for SFC OAM, particularly focused on the aspect of= the Operations
=C2=A0 =C2=A0component within OAM.=C2=A0 Actual solution= s and mechanisms are outside
=C2=A0 =C2=A0the scope of this document.
But after reading it several times over, I believe that the sco= pe of the document is more narrow and includes only OAM for SFC NSH. I coul= dn't find any discussion of OAM for SFC based on RFC 8595, nor I could = find it being referenced in the framework. If it is outside the scope of th= is document, should it provide an explanation, identify it as an outstandin= g work for the future?

Regards,
Greg

On Tue, May 28, 2019 at 7:37 AM James Guichard <james.n.guichard@futurewei.com> wrote:

Dear W= G:

=C2=A0=

This m= essage starts a new two week WG Last Call on advancing https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-sfc-oam-framework/ for publication as an Informational RFC.

=C2=A0=

Substa= ntive comments and statements of support for publishing this document shoul= d be directed to the mailing list. Editorial suggestions can be sent to the= authors.=C2=A0 This last call will end on 11th June 2019.

=C2=A0=

Thanks= !

=C2=A0=

Jim &a= mp; Joel





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[73.189.13.44]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id 34sm3756764pgl.15.2019.07.10.19.59.57 (version=TLS1_2 cipher=ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 bits=128/128); Wed, 10 Jul 2019 19:59:57 -0700 (PDT) Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary=Apple-Mail-FBF9F380-2B86-4592-991A-29C9E71F9CA1 Mime-Version: 1.0 (1.0) From: Jeff Tantsura X-Mailer: iPhone Mail (16F203) In-Reply-To: Date: Wed, 10 Jul 2019 19:59:57 -0700 Cc: "sfc@ietf.org" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Message-Id: References: To: James Guichard Archived-At: Subject: Re: [sfc] WG Last Call draft-ietf-sfc-oam-framework-06 X-BeenThere: sfc@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: Network Service Chaining List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 11 Jul 2019 03:00:02 -0000 --Apple-Mail-FBF9F380-2B86-4592-991A-29C9E71F9CA1 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Jim, I support progressing the OAM work for SFC, it is very much needed to build a= proper and well designed set of solutions. Regards, Jeff > On Jul 8, 2019, at 06:15, James Guichard w= rote: >=20 > Dear WG: > =20 > Before closing this WG Last Call, we (the chairs) would like to better und= erstand the level of interest and commitment the WG has on progressing OAM w= ork for SFC, starting with draft-ietf-sfc-oam-framework as a baseline. Pleas= e reply to this email with either support for the document, or non-support (= we do not need this document). Silence does not imply support or lack thereo= f so please take time to state your opinions with a brief rational for suppo= rt/non-support. > =20 > Thanks! > =20 > Jim & Joel > =20 > =20 > From: James Guichard=20 > Sent: Tuesday, May 28, 2019 10:30 AM > To: sfc@ietf.org > Subject: WG Last Call draft-ietf-sfc-oam-framework-06 > =20 > Dear WG: >=20 > =20 >=20 > This message starts a new two week WG Last Call on advancing https://datat= racker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-sfc-oam-framework/ for publication as an Info= rmational RFC. >=20 > =20 >=20 > Substantive comments and statements of support for publishing this documen= t should be directed to the mailing list. Editorial suggestions can be sent t= o the authors. This last call will end on 11th June 2019. >=20 > =20 >=20 > Thanks! >=20 > =20 >=20 > Jim & Joel >=20 > =20 > =20 > =20 >=20 > =20 > _______________________________________________ > sfc mailing list > sfc@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/sfc --Apple-Mail-FBF9F380-2B86-4592-991A-29C9E71F9CA1 Content-Type: text/html; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Jim,

I support progressing the OAM work for SFC, it is very much needed to build a proper and well designed set of solutions.

Regards,
Jeff

On Jul 8, 2019, at 06:15, James Guichard <james.n.guichard@futurewei.com> wrote:

Dear WG:

 

Before closing this WG Last Call, we (the chairs) would like to better understand the level of interest and commitment the WG has on progressing OAM work for SFC, starting with draft-ietf-sfc-oam-framework as a baseline. Please reply to this email with either support for the document, or non-support (we do not need this document). Silence does not imply support or lack thereof so please take time to state your opinions with a brief rational for support/non-support.

 

Thanks!

 

Jim & Joel

 

 

From: James Guichard
Sent: Tuesday, May 28, 2019 10:30 AM
To: sfc@ietf.org
Subject: WG Last Call draft-ietf-sfc-oam-framework-06

 

Dear WG:

 

This message starts a new two week WG Last Call on advancing https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-sfc-oam-framework/ for publication as an Informational RFC.

 

Substantive comments and statements of support for publishing this document should be directed to the mailing list. Editorial suggestions can be sent to the authors.  This last call will end on 11th June 2019.

 

Thanks!

 

Jim & Joel

 

 

 

 

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--Apple-Mail-FBF9F380-2B86-4592-991A-29C9E71F9CA1-- From nobody Thu Jul 11 17:36:54 2019 Return-Path: X-Original-To: sfc@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: sfc@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2ECC912011B for ; Thu, 11 Jul 2019 17:36:52 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -0.702 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-0.702 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, PDS_NO_HELO_DNS=1.295, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE=-0.0001, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=no autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=gmail.com Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id DNQ0nt2FOLt2 for ; Thu, 11 Jul 2019 17:36:50 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail-lf1-x130.google.com (mail-lf1-x130.google.com [IPv6:2a00:1450:4864:20::130]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 3BB471200C7 for ; Thu, 11 Jul 2019 17:36:50 -0700 (PDT) Received: by mail-lf1-x130.google.com with SMTP id h28so5264308lfj.5 for ; Thu, 11 Jul 2019 17:36:50 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20161025; h=mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date:message-id:subject:to :cc; bh=f5KMDt4BEPe3rpxFQR32aB6yqvEqF2qx4yTbIY3ZI+o=; b=vPlvb+84HR2zwYjxW7BUEYUCTCexHY2WVaB9AbQiQ+mCjMtec14bG+bT8F79RhLLjt 1M+Fu9hLWPQG8JTVGj5VEyOe+YPkPtKPoNkotZPeYxnvIBRRtLXshRP70gdmgHumY9E5 tST/1pics0yQsKXxU0FbIr4kUHGN/VfrwKMNWwaAr+LD0buLPt9IVb/siIMBc1AZ+W+F XP4AgU9W1gF3Ef9JRt/EBZuRSOACUtuGRqPOtRUl2iGVB9HUc1IixfNbJCJXpNU4WVX6 4v0G99BYsryPfQnOF5LUUrEU34Wy6ackBtNEWNhXh7mFAmH/0wzvL7gXBgbgpK0tOK4g GwPg== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date :message-id:subject:to:cc; bh=f5KMDt4BEPe3rpxFQR32aB6yqvEqF2qx4yTbIY3ZI+o=; b=nC9GgY889KInj75nZiq6NCANy0Ew2P3NVtUt+xG9sB6W6b550Ijd8/pUVTKKZwfodr OReZpaEIawHmdT6KMvWwPfW7R1Pz/zGvXNu3hSrQ3ahN0oFxGuCs8JaSdI2JpqD1b3XR 9FGMBeQ/a81XVQWlnjDk58xSH3Jd5S0EbYkSi9+aKv8UGTs/IoUp0gK8Fqtoy56B/Pqs ORT7mSTbKpE8VUGKw9VNOca549lI1ReqJN8zr0196EB5gl2UlcF4AtVZCazMrA5xHgO6 4hXcUqt76eo0p3Wm29QWYnYwPyxpNkhrLKqmEXZnyZcLIPpMA4P7o4j+NSMaggUEH20m vFkg== X-Gm-Message-State: APjAAAWhQu2+ACrYtAyis+aHgyzulMGDhlSC5x7dXxrMbmKR8jHAYGWP IomZNBOktinlwZsF+LT1oadZT4OaCbZG21QE904= X-Google-Smtp-Source: APXvYqy8ATRVc892tIq3wNy+tJcT923BKgmtD2uyctp7klhJKWIemU+xLL86MrB9dTINSOg3W2iEzqJEfRsqY5PwiXI= X-Received: by 2002:ac2:5609:: with SMTP id v9mr3065287lfd.27.1562891808323; Thu, 11 Jul 2019 17:36:48 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 References: In-Reply-To: From: Greg Mirsky Date: Thu, 11 Jul 2019 17:36:37 -0700 Message-ID: To: James Guichard Cc: "sfc@ietf.org" Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="0000000000000ebed9058d711b29" Archived-At: Subject: Re: [sfc] WG Last Call draft-ietf-sfc-oam-framework-06 X-BeenThere: sfc@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: Network Service Chaining List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 12 Jul 2019 00:36:52 -0000 --0000000000000ebed9058d711b29 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Dear Jim, Joel, et al. I'd like to share my comments and questions to Section 5 Gap Analysis: - in Table 3 raises some questions: - E-OAM is not expanded, nor referenced in the rest of the document - MPLS_PM is not expanded, nor referenced in the rest of the documen= t - IPPM is expanded in Terminology but it is not clear how IP Performance Metrics are relevant to Performance Monitoring OAM soluti= ons - NVo3 OAM - it is not clear what is included in it, especially since there are no WG documents in NVO3 WG on OAM and the discussion of encapsulation of an active OAM in Geneve is about to begin - the title on the next page refers to Table 4: OAM Tool GAP Analysis (contd.) - one row assigned for SFC. Here, I think, maybe some mixed terminology. In Introduction SFC is for Service Function Chaining while in Terminology it is expanded as Service Function Chain. I recommend reassigning the row to SFP. - Configuration (the first column) in Table 4 is usually not considered as part of OAM. And neither Orchestration or Topology (discovery). I recommend removing that portion of the table from the document altogether. - also, Why the same readily available tools that provide Topology (discovery) and Notifications for overlay and underlay networks canno= t be used for SF and SFC/SFP? It appears that the conclusion expressed in section 5.2 contradicts the discussion in some of the further sections, for example, sections 6.4.1 and 6.4.2. Section 5.3 Required OAM Functions refers to O&M, not OAM functions in the following: Configuration, orchestration and manageability of SF and SFC could be performed using CLI, NETCONF, etc. Since the scope of the document includes only SFC OAM, not O&M (RFC 6291 explains the variances of OAM soup in great details), I recommend removing the sentence. Regards, Greg On Tue, May 28, 2019 at 7:37 AM James Guichard < james.n.guichard@futurewei.com> wrote: > Dear WG: > > > > This message starts a new two week WG Last Call on advancing > https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-sfc-oam-framework/ > > for publication as an Informational RFC. > > > > Substantive comments and statements of support for publishing this > document should be directed to the mailing list. Editorial suggestions ca= n > be sent to the authors. This last call will end on 11th June 2019. > > > > Thanks! > > > > Jim & Joel > > > > > _______________________________________________ > sfc mailing list > sfc@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/sfc > --0000000000000ebed9058d711b29 Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Dear Jim, Joel, et al.
I'd like to share my commen= ts and questions to Section 5 Gap Analysis:
  • in Table 3 ra= ises some questions:
    • E-OAM is=C2=A0 not expanded, nor referenced in the rest of the document
    • MPLS_PM is= =C2=A0 not expanded, nor referenced in the rest of the document
    • IPPM is ex= panded in Terminology but it is not clear how IP Performance Metrics are re= levant to Performance Monitoring OAM solutions
    • NVo3 OAM - it is not= clear what is included in it, especially since there are no WG documents i= n NVO3 WG on OAM and the discussion of encapsulation of an active OAM in Ge= neve is about to begin
    • the title on the next page refers to=C2=A0Ta= ble 4: OAM Tool GAP Analysis (contd.)
    • one row assigned for SFC. Her= e, I think, maybe some mixed terminology. In Introduction SFC is for Servic= e Function Chaining while in Terminology it is expanded as Service Function= Chain. I recommend reassigning the row to SFP.
    • Configuration (the = first column) in Table 4 is usually not considered as part of OAM. And neit= her Orchestration or Topology (discovery). I recommend removing that portio= n of the table from the document altogether.
    • also, Why the same rea= dily available tools that provide Topology (discovery) and Notifications fo= r overlay and underlay networks cannot be used for SF and SFC/SFP?
    It appears that the conclusion expressed in section 5.2 contradicts t= he discussion in some of the further sections, for example, sections 6.4.1 = and 6.4.2.
Section 5.3 Required OAM Functions refers to O&M, = not OAM functions in the following:
=C2=A0 =C2=A0Configuration, orchestratio= n and manageability of SF and SFC could be
=C2=A0 =C2=A0performed= using CLI, NETCONF, etc.
Since the scope of the document= includes only SFC OAM, not O&M (RFC 6291 explains the variances of OAM soup in great details)= , I recommend removing the sentence.

Regards,
= Greg


On Tue, May 28, 2019 at 7:37 AM James Guichar= d <james.n.guichard@fu= turewei.com> wrote:

Dear W= G:

=C2=A0=

This m= essage starts a new two week WG Last Call on advancing https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-sfc-oam-framework/ for publication as an Informational RFC.

=C2=A0=

Substa= ntive comments and statements of support for publishing this document shoul= d be directed to the mailing list. Editorial suggestions can be sent to the= authors.=C2=A0 This last call will end on 11th June 2019.

=C2=A0=

Thanks= !

=C2=A0=

Jim &a= mp; Joel





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X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.997 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.997 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE=-0.0001, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=gmail.com Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id KKtSlODivaRS for ; Mon, 22 Jul 2019 07:42:40 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail-lj1-x234.google.com (mail-lj1-x234.google.com [IPv6:2a00:1450:4864:20::234]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 53A881202CF for ; Mon, 22 Jul 2019 07:42:40 -0700 (PDT) Received: by mail-lj1-x234.google.com with SMTP id y17so13295524ljk.10 for ; Mon, 22 Jul 2019 07:42:40 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20161025; h=mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date:message-id:subject:to :cc; bh=A4tqqfSqV3N3+GDz0PrLN0p9M6E1iyqA+dsT9+UZAKM=; b=QVORBxVlVc/wz1W0svuKaZQL8Z/X5LX8zNfLTqjVv5bQUgiTZN0kuGN19DaP1c2iZS 14tFiPMN2sJqsGjW3qqDHRymlydGH/A8qbuGiyr/T4xRqtBc0lCsB53ULeJkSqUECC3Z oyUsM3/CBjDW58sMIsnHeh9wvlrTmw/Rgan8S5R+UQU5aAVf9ArX4ScnYhVDsqDCysuf 3t6NfV3DIG/KNE0XAMQ+fcEJycc4hy2jCq8CyZQaSZDh8mK29tgzMM/pxC7LgxZShREW KC6VI44++SU2ZXW2hBKUvX0Klnrkhj/ozrKWGSFbSSJVOr/Sg6lU+Y88ehtkXbaFsb48 aBLg== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date :message-id:subject:to:cc; bh=A4tqqfSqV3N3+GDz0PrLN0p9M6E1iyqA+dsT9+UZAKM=; b=PY3NSQNVavw0atJouqAhj9kYoZKd4q5rXPGNQ8weCiqfmhGOuJCc9Xvb5l4V3tBr6r NTiOc07LZAHmuM3jNqvPa37s7ZiLH6DwWm+0yAavO7Ku+jcEabI+Y2jgqepIix6cDTtj OqACmDfJBVJ2TNbkAt6i+zEsiFsK2Z2cyovUYWq9dl22TWyZjRvFAt4JE5r25aXFke/W Aot53n1zbFolnjvd1gKyJwgJeIABfW9uZi29wX2/jFWtPs8MTbu3JTOCPgJmBNJjGwe2 kMkv6nn02HY4Gi++6pgRDPS3K1Af/3ZGmKwMXQVs6igMCC7r6DL0jrvF82RUSYm6ZNLO JnNQ== X-Gm-Message-State: APjAAAUInNHzFONy8a1TntFRkTR36V77b7MXLiFPpGjFEoO5uua8nyVR 96idNXR6ELi6MwGZodSRpC+o5+ZRFd+78wo0IuQ= X-Google-Smtp-Source: APXvYqwDzAwhZA8lDYXrCV1UdaMbgzcXRKdkLfdbYgBCnKzUxINWSPtnZeoOA2hLSAO3BCYm+Yn5kmHUX0O55yxOjEc= X-Received: by 2002:a2e:9ac6:: with SMTP id p6mr20175126ljj.100.1563806558496; Mon, 22 Jul 2019 07:42:38 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 References: In-Reply-To: From: Greg Mirsky Date: Mon, 22 Jul 2019 10:42:21 -0400 Message-ID: To: James Guichard Cc: "sfc@ietf.org" Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="0000000000006aabaf058e461612" Archived-At: Subject: Re: [sfc] WG Last Call draft-ietf-sfc-oam-framework-06 X-BeenThere: sfc@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: Network Service Chaining List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 22 Jul 2019 14:42:50 -0000 --0000000000006aabaf058e461612 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Dear Jim, Joe, et al., I'd like to share my comments on Section of 6.4 of the draft. Much appreciate your consideration and response to my questions. - in regard to the applicability of ICMP the statement in Section 4.1.1 is "ICMP could be leveraged for connectivity function (defined in Sectio= n 4.1) to verify the availability of SF or SFC." When I looked through Section 4.1 I find some discussion of a Fault Management function but no clear definition of what is connectivity verification in SFC. More so, i= t appears that connectivity verification is being mixed with re-ordering detection, Path MTU Discovery, data integrity monitoring, and some sort = of policy verification. Real kitchen sink. At the same time, in other documents on network OAM, connectivity verification has been firmly defi= ned as a function that verifies that data have been received only form the expected source over the expected path. In conjunction with this, a misconnection error is defined to indicate that packets from another connection have been received. In other words, the connectivity verification function verifies not only that packets from A reach node B but that they arrive only on the red wire, not on blue or yellow. Said a= ll that, the interpretation of connectivity function in SFC may be differen= t but, in my opinion, Section 4.1 does not provide anything. Also, it is n= ot clear how the last bullet "Proactively test alternate or protected paths= to ensure reliability of network configurations" is specific to and require= s the use of a connectivity function and why it cannot be addressed by, fo= r example, continuity check function. - Also, the very last sentence of Section 4.1 concludes that ICMP in SFC "can be used for basic OAM functions". But I cannot find anywhere in the document where the term, notion of "basic OAM functions" has been discus= sed or defined. Which functions considered as basic? ICMP can be used as the fault management tool, to some extent because it is relatively processin= g extensive, but its value in performance monitoring is very low. Is PM OA= M not part of the basic OAM functions? - Section 6.4.2, in my opinion, may provide some context to how to interpret the use of "availability". From "BFD or S-BFD could be leverag= ed to perform SF or SFC availability" it appears that the availability is viewed as part of Fault Management OAM. (I'm still awaiting a response t= o my earlier questions specifically on the interpretation of "availability= " in the OAM Framework for SFC. - Further, in Section 6.4.2 the possible use is described as "Upon receiving the control packet, the last SFF in the SFC will reply back wi= th relevant DIAG code." But this is not how BFD in the Asynchronous mode operates, that is how only S-BFD works. The first sentence of the second paragraph refers to both BFD and S-BFD. But the rest of the paragraph describes the operation of S-BFD only, not of BFD in Asynchronous mode. = I believe that either the positioning statement must be modified or explanation of the operation of BFD in Asynchronous mode over SFP provid= ed. - Section 6.4.3 includes the statement about the applicability of iOAM to availability: "In-Situ OAM could be used with O bit set to perform SF availability and SFC availability or performance measurement." I interpr= et this conclusion as the indication that availability is considered as par= t of the Fault Management OAM toolset. If that is the case, I question the value of using one-way OAM for fault management because only the egress node may have the state and even that is not demonstrated in existing iO= AM documents. In order to detect path failure, a node must have information that can be used to detect the packet loss. That can be either monotonically increasing sequence numbers or the notion that packets mus= t be arriving at pre-determined intervals. Which mechanism can be used by iOAM? Also, since iOAM, in regard to availability, appears as single-way= FM OAM mechanism, that uses the actual data flow, what is its advantage comparing to, for example, collecting and comparing counters from ingres= s and egress? In other words, even if the egress can detect the loss of it= s availability for the particular SFP, how such a notion can be used? - I, again, have to point out that Section 6.4.4 references the individual draft that had expired 3+ years ago. Usually, that is the indication that neither authors nor the community are interested in the idea. Regards, Greg On Tue, May 28, 2019 at 10:37 AM James Guichard < james.n.guichard@futurewei.com> wrote: > Dear WG: > > > > This message starts a new two week WG Last Call on advancing > https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-sfc-oam-framework/ > > for publication as an Informational RFC. > > > > Substantive comments and statements of support for publishing this > document should be directed to the mailing list. Editorial suggestions ca= n > be sent to the authors. This last call will end on 11th June 2019. > > > > Thanks! > > > > Jim & Joel > > > > > _______________________________________________ > sfc mailing list > sfc@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/sfc > --0000000000006aabaf058e461612 Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Dear Jim, Joe, et al.,
I'd like to share my commen= ts on Section of 6.4 of the draft. Much appreciate your consideration and r= esponse to my questions.
  • in regard to the applicability o= f ICMP the statement in Section 4.1.1 is "ICMP could be leveraged for = connectivity function (defined in Section 4.1) to verify the availability o= f SF or SFC." When I looked through Section 4.1 I find some discussion= of a Fault Management function but no clear definition of what is connecti= vity verification in SFC. More so, it appears that connectivity verificatio= n is being mixed with re-ordering detection, Path MTU Discovery, data integ= rity monitoring, and some sort of policy verification. Real kitchen sink. A= t the same time, in other documents on network OAM, connectivity verificati= on has been firmly defined as a function that verifies that data have been = received only form the expected source over the expected path. In conjuncti= on with this, a misconnection error is defined to indicate that packets fro= m another connection have been received. In other words, the connectivity v= erification function verifies not only that packets from A reach node B but= that they arrive only on the red wire, not on blue or yellow. Said all tha= t, the interpretation of connectivity function in SFC may be different but,= in my opinion, Section 4.1 does not provide anything. Also, it is not clea= r how the last bullet "Proactively test alternate or protected paths t= o ensure reliability of network configurations" is specific to and req= uires the use of a connectivity function and why it cannot be addressed by,= for example, continuity check function.
  • Also, the very last senten= ce of Section 4.1 concludes that ICMP in SFC "can be used for basic OA= M functions". But I cannot find anywhere in the document where the ter= m, notion of "basic OAM functions" has been discussed or defined.= Which functions considered as basic? ICMP can be used as the fault managem= ent tool, to some extent because it is relatively processing extensive, but= its value in performance monitoring is very low. Is PM OAM not part of the= basic OAM functions?
  • Section 6.4.2, in my opinion, may provide som= e context to how to interpret the use of "availability". From &qu= ot;BFD or S-BFD could be leveraged to perform SF or SFC availability" = it appears that the availability is viewed as part of Fault Management OAM.= (I'm still awaiting a response to my earlier questions specifically on= the interpretation of "availability" in the OAM Framework for SF= C.
  • Further, in Section 6.4.2 the possible use is described as "= ;Upon receiving the control packet, the last SFF in the SFC will reply back= with relevant DIAG code." But this is not how BFD in the Asynchronous= mode operates, that is how only S-BFD works. The first sentence of the sec= ond paragraph refers to both BFD and S-BFD. But the rest of the paragraph d= escribes the operation of S-BFD only, not of BFD in Asynchronous mode. I be= lieve that either the positioning statement must be modified or explanation= of the operation of BFD in Asynchronous mode over SFP provided.
  • Se= ction 6.4.3 includes the statement about the applicability of iOAM to avail= ability: "In-Situ OAM could be used with O bit set to perform SF avail= ability and SFC availability or performance measurement." I interpret = this conclusion as the indication that availability is considered as part o= f the Fault Management OAM toolset. If that is the case, I question the val= ue of using one-way OAM for fault management because only the egress node m= ay have the state and even that is not demonstrated in existing iOAM docume= nts. In order to detect path failure, a node must have information that can= be used to detect the packet loss. That can be either monotonically increa= sing sequence numbers or the notion that packets must be arriving at pre-de= termined intervals. Which mechanism can be used by iOAM? Also, since iOAM, = in regard to availability, appears as single-way FM OAM mechanism, that use= s the actual data flow, what is its advantage comparing to, for example, co= llecting and comparing counters from ingress and egress? In other words, ev= en if the egress can detect the loss of its availability for the particular= SFP, how such a notion can be used?
  • I, again, have to point out th= at Section 6.4.4 references the individual draft that had expired 3+ years = ago. Usually, that is the indication that neither authors nor the community= are interested in the idea.
Regards,
Greg

On Tue, May 28, 2019 at 10:37 AM James Guichard <james.n.guichard@futurewei.com> wrote:=

Dear W= G:

=C2=A0=

This m= essage starts a new two week WG Last Call on advancing https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-sfc-oam-framework/ for publication as an Informational RFC.

=C2=A0=

Substa= ntive comments and statements of support for publishing this document shoul= d be directed to the mailing list. Editorial suggestions can be sent to the= authors.=C2=A0 This last call will end on 11th June 2019.

=C2=A0=

Thanks= !

=C2=A0=

Jim &a= mp; Joel





_______________________________________________
sfc mailing list
sfc@ietf.org
https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/sfc
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charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Dear WG: This email closes the WG LC for draft-ietf-sfc-oam-framework-09. The chairs= have concluded that there is enough support to move this document forward = for publication as an Informational RFC. Authors, please confirm that any I= PR you are aware of has been declared. Thanks! Jim & Joel From: James Guichard Sent: Monday, July 08, 2019 9:15 AM To: sfc@ietf.org Subject: RE: WG Last Call draft-ietf-sfc-oam-framework-06 Dear WG: Before closing this WG Last Call, we (the chairs) would like to better unde= rstand the level of interest and commitment the WG has on progressing OAM w= ork for SFC, starting with draft-ietf-sfc-oam-framework as a baseline. Plea= se reply to this email with either support for the document, or non-support= (we do not need this document). Silence does not imply support or lack the= reof so please take time to state your opinions with a brief rational for s= upport/non-support. Thanks! Jim & Joel From: James Guichard Sent: Tuesday, May 28, 2019 10:30 AM To: sfc@ietf.org Subject: WG Last Call draft-ietf-sfc-oam-framework-06 Dear WG: This message starts a new two week WG Last Call on advancing https://datatr= acker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-sfc-oam-framework/ for publication as an Informational RFC. Substantive comments and statements of support for publishing this document= should be directed to the mailing list. Editorial suggestions can be sent = to the authors. This last call will end on 11th June 2019. Thanks! Jim & Joel --_000_CH2PR13MB36083279DAC4BF4D9746DAF4D2C70CH2PR13MB3608namp_ Content-Type: text/html; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

Dear WG:

 

This email closes the WG LC for draft-ietf-sfc-oam-f= ramework-09. The chairs have concluded that there is enough support to move= this document forward for publication as an Informational RFC. Authors, pl= ease confirm that any IPR you are aware of has been declared.

 

Thanks!

 

Jim & Joel

 

 

 

From: James Guichard
Sent: Monday, July 08, 2019 9:15 AM
To: sfc@ietf.org
Subject: RE: WG Last Call draft-ietf-sfc-oam-framework-06=

 

Dear WG:

 

Before closing this WG Last Call, we (the chairs) wo= uld like to better understand the level of interest and commitment the WG h= as on progressing OAM work for SFC, starting with draft-ietf-sfc-oam-framew= ork as a baseline. Please reply to this email with either support for the document, or non-support (we do not= need this document). Silence does not imply support or lack thereof so ple= ase take time to state your opinions with a brief rational for support/non-= support.

 

Thanks!

 

Jim & Joel

 

 

From: James Guichard
Sent: Tuesday, May 28, 2019 10:30 AM
To: sfc@ietf.org
Subject: WG Last Call draft-ietf-sfc-oam-framework-06

 

Dear WG:<= /p>

 

This message starts a new t= wo week WG Last Call on advancing https://datatracker.ietf.o= rg/doc/draft-ietf-sfc-oam-framework/ for publication as an Informational RFC.

 

Substantive comments and st= atements of support for publishing this document should be directed to the = mailing list. Editorial suggestions can be sent to the authors.  This = last call will end on 11th June 2019.

 

Thanks!

 

Jim & Joel

&n= bsp;

&n= bsp;

 

&n= bsp;

--_000_CH2PR13MB36083279DAC4BF4D9746DAF4D2C70CH2PR13MB3608namp_-- From nobody Tue Jul 23 08:43:15 2019 Return-Path: X-Original-To: sfc@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: sfc@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 95D4412040B for ; Tue, 23 Jul 2019 08:43:00 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.557 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.557 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, FREEMAIL_FORGED_FROMDOMAIN=0.091, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, HEADER_FROM_DIFFERENT_DOMAINS=0.249, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE=-0.0001, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=no autolearn_force=no Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id Zyj2xU8vnvOc for ; Tue, 23 Jul 2019 08:42:59 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail-ua1-f48.google.com (mail-ua1-f48.google.com [209.85.222.48]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id EC189120405 for ; Tue, 23 Jul 2019 08:42:58 -0700 (PDT) Received: by mail-ua1-f48.google.com with SMTP id v20so17093307uao.3 for ; Tue, 23 Jul 2019 08:42:58 -0700 (PDT) X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date :message-id:subject:to:cc; bh=lpGn1tlDrlw7+50ceUZ01xxFAvM0k8pLeOc4HCBx5eo=; b=ZLmYYPCXJj/UE/zqgUUWBJ7E2rVP2c0Qn/D7elVP4hR7fN9dTN7z4Vq6sCTiiTxkl7 JxntSNCTvmyOR1HR/A9V87wOraXTyKQj8XgkB6mgFednpDwulSqXSEwOPEhi/4GfT47/ 3va0GwGIJyYLcM3QEyct9HYhS9zFPxdRm5EhUfR6I+7w0FJm/+o5yz0HoXLAJpfGQR3c dJ1fcyo64XB5DiiNisSqS6K/D3noJN1i5mDHPJSgJfDATKTSuaLTQuGXXz5lrllzi1mu CgwFYyfwsv7Pp6OJPn/HVz3iCaURXac17UTGt+2becGOzXKZad1lnhzgIO7FeoHw1Yvc D/XA== X-Gm-Message-State: APjAAAVOoYTnKRkQDs7XvpgdTK/zPUmotc0rB2NrcRckMlZeUn2++wiQ 3djs4lHdKBxZqhecDBarrX2iXCfyadP6kVX5fiE= X-Google-Smtp-Source: APXvYqxT54PTiz/a+bCvlLgXI5WgeICUn0aGSjQhhjbGdr+Z44p6NsA19Q1Hf5HnqyJvYe+q5E1qttlaG/wJPD+IjbQ= X-Received: by 2002:ab0:a1:: with SMTP id 30mr48046120uaj.29.1563896578083; Tue, 23 Jul 2019 08:42:58 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 References: In-Reply-To: From: Anoop Ghanwani Date: Tue, 23 Jul 2019 08:42:47 -0700 Message-ID: To: James Guichard Cc: "sfc@ietf.org" Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="0000000000000092a0058e5b0c00" Archived-At: Subject: Re: [sfc] WG Last Call draft-ietf-sfc-oam-framework-09 X-BeenThere: sfc@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: Network Service Chaining List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 23 Jul 2019 15:43:10 -0000 --0000000000000092a0058e5b0c00 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable I am not aware of any IPR. Thanks, Anoop On Tue, Jul 23, 2019 at 6:27 AM James Guichard < james.n.guichard@futurewei.com> wrote: > Dear WG: > > > > This email closes the WG LC for draft-ietf-sfc-oam-framework-09. The > chairs have concluded that there is enough support to move this document > forward for publication as an Informational RFC. Authors, please confirm > that any IPR you are aware of has been declared. > > > > Thanks! > > > > Jim & Joel > > > > > > > > *From:* James Guichard > *Sent:* Monday, July 08, 2019 9:15 AM > *To:* sfc@ietf.org > *Subject:* RE: WG Last Call draft-ietf-sfc-oam-framework-06 > > > > Dear WG: > > > > Before closing this WG Last Call, we (the chairs) would like to better > understand the level of interest and commitment the WG has on progressing > OAM work for SFC, starting with draft-ietf-sfc-oam-framework as a baselin= e. > Please reply to this email with either support for the document, or > non-support (we do not need this document). Silence does not imply suppor= t > or lack thereof so please take time to state your opinions with a brief > rational for support/non-support. > > > > Thanks! > > > > Jim & Joel > > > > > > *From:* James Guichard > *Sent:* Tuesday, May 28, 2019 10:30 AM > *To:* sfc@ietf.org > *Subject:* WG Last Call draft-ietf-sfc-oam-framework-06 > > > > Dear WG: > > > > This message starts a new two week WG Last Call on advancing > https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-sfc-oam-framework/ > > for publication as an Informational RFC. > > > > Substantive comments and statements of support for publishing this > document should be directed to the mailing list. Editorial suggestions ca= n > be sent to the authors. This last call will end on 11th June 2019. > > > > Thanks! > > > > Jim & Joel > > > > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > sfc mailing list > sfc@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/sfc > --0000000000000092a0058e5b0c00 Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
I am not aware of any IPR.

Thanks,
Anoop

On Tue, Jul 23, 2019 at 6:27= AM James Guichard <ja= mes.n.guichard@futurewei.com> wrote:

Dear WG:

=C2=A0

This email closes the WG LC for draft-ietf-sfc-oam-f= ramework-09. The chairs have concluded that there is enough support to move= this document forward for publication as an Informational RFC. Authors, pl= ease confirm that any IPR you are aware of has been declared.

=C2=A0

Thanks!

=C2=A0

Jim & Joel

=C2=A0

=C2=A0

=C2=A0

From: James Guichard
Sent: Monday, July 08, 2019 9:15 AM
To: sfc@ietf.org
Subject: RE: WG Last Call draft-ietf-sfc-oam-framework-06<= /u>

=C2=A0

Dear WG:

=C2=A0

Before closing this WG Last Call, we (the chairs) wo= uld like to better understand the level of interest and commitment the WG h= as on progressing OAM work for SFC, starting with draft-ietf-sfc-oam-framew= ork as a baseline. Please reply to this email with either support for the document, or non-support (we do not= need this document). Silence does not imply support or lack thereof so ple= ase take time to state your opinions with a brief rational for support/non-= support.

=C2=A0

Thanks!

=C2=A0

Jim & Joel

=C2=A0

=C2=A0

=C2=A0

Dear WG:=

=C2=A0

This message starts a new two= week WG Last Call on advancing http= s://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-sfc-oam-framework/ for publication as an Informational RFC.

=C2=A0

Substantive comments and stat= ements of support for publishing this document should be directed to the ma= iling list. Editorial suggestions can be sent to the authors.=C2=A0 This la= st call will end on 11th June 2019.

=C2=A0

Thanks!<= /p>

=C2=A0

Jim & Joel<= /span>

= =C2=A0

= =C2=A0

=C2=A0

= =C2=A0

_______________________________________________
sfc mailing list
sfc@ietf.org
https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/sfc
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Tue, 23 Jul 2019 15:45:30 +0000 From: James Guichard To: James Guichard , "sfc@ietf.org" Thread-Topic: WG Last Call draft-ietf-sfc-oam-framework-09 Thread-Index: AdVBRJj7uY5eAi2ZQ2mzMUj4zul8TwAJ7YcQ Date: Tue, 23 Jul 2019 15:45:30 +0000 Message-ID: References: In-Reply-To: Accept-Language: en-US Content-Language: en-US X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: authentication-results: spf=none (sender IP is ) smtp.mailfrom=james.n.guichard@futurewei.com; x-originating-ip: [207.115.96.130] x-ms-publictraffictype: Email x-ms-office365-filtering-correlation-id: 3988d103-6d51-422c-a0b9-08d70f84cab5 x-microsoft-antispam: BCL:0; PCL:0; RULEID:(2390118)(7020095)(4652040)(8989299)(5600148)(711020)(4605104)(1401327)(4534185)(4627221)(201703031133081)(201702281549075)(8990200)(2017052603328)(7193020); SRVR:CH2PR13MB3877; x-ms-traffictypediagnostic: CH2PR13MB3877: x-ms-exchange-purlcount: 4 x-microsoft-antispam-prvs: x-ms-oob-tlc-oobclassifiers: OLM:9508; x-forefront-prvs: 0107098B6C x-forefront-antispam-report: SFV:NSPM; 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boundary="_000_CH2PR13MB3608D01E1DB8B1AC5CF5AC9BD2C70CH2PR13MB3608namp_" MIME-Version: 1.0 X-OriginatorOrg: Futurewei.com X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-Network-Message-Id: 3988d103-6d51-422c-a0b9-08d70f84cab5 X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-originalarrivaltime: 23 Jul 2019 15:45:30.6455 (UTC) X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-fromentityheader: Hosted X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-id: 0fee8ff2-a3b2-4018-9c75-3a1d5591fedc X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-mailboxtype: HOSTED X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-userprincipalname: jguichar@futurewei.com X-MS-Exchange-Transport-CrossTenantHeadersStamped: CH2PR13MB3877 Archived-At: Subject: Re: [sfc] WG Last Call draft-ietf-sfc-oam-framework-09 X-BeenThere: sfc@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: Network Service Chaining List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 23 Jul 2019 15:45:37 -0000 --_000_CH2PR13MB3608D01E1DB8B1AC5CF5AC9BD2C70CH2PR13MB3608namp_ Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Dear WG: Apologies but I seem to have missed this email in response to the WG LC -> = https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/sfc/U0TJ1lGwzIAxjMTcMS4nBcoK1LY. Authors, before the chairs close the WG LC and move the document forward fo= r publication, can you please provide a response to the comments contained = within the highlighted email. Thanks! Jim From: sfc On Behalf Of James Guichard Sent: Tuesday, July 23, 2019 9:28 AM To: sfc@ietf.org Subject: Re: [sfc] WG Last Call draft-ietf-sfc-oam-framework-09 Dear WG: This email closes the WG LC for draft-ietf-sfc-oam-framework-09. The chairs= have concluded that there is enough support to move this document forward = for publication as an Informational RFC. Authors, please confirm that any I= PR you are aware of has been declared. Thanks! Jim & Joel From: James Guichard Sent: Monday, July 08, 2019 9:15 AM To: sfc@ietf.org Subject: RE: WG Last Call draft-ietf-sfc-oam-framework-06 Dear WG: Before closing this WG Last Call, we (the chairs) would like to better unde= rstand the level of interest and commitment the WG has on progressing OAM w= ork for SFC, starting with draft-ietf-sfc-oam-framework as a baseline. Plea= se reply to this email with either support for the document, or non-support= (we do not need this document). Silence does not imply support or lack the= reof so please take time to state your opinions with a brief rational for s= upport/non-support. Thanks! Jim & Joel From: James Guichard Sent: Tuesday, May 28, 2019 10:30 AM To: sfc@ietf.org Subject: WG Last Call draft-ietf-sfc-oam-framework-06 Dear WG: This message starts a new two week WG Last Call on advancing https://datatr= acker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-sfc-oam-framework/ for publication as an Informational RFC. Substantive comments and statements of support for publishing this document= should be directed to the mailing list. Editorial suggestions can be sent = to the authors. This last call will end on 11th June 2019. Thanks! Jim & Joel --_000_CH2PR13MB3608D01E1DB8B1AC5CF5AC9BD2C70CH2PR13MB3608namp_ Content-Type: text/html; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

Dear WG:

 

Apologies but I seem to have missed this email in re= sponse to the WG LC ->  https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/ms= g/sfc/U0TJ1lGwzIAxjMTcMS4nBcoK1LY.

 

Authors, before the chairs close the WG LC and move = the document forward for publication, can you please provide a response to = the comments contained within the highlighted email.

 

Thanks!

 

Jim

 

 

 

From: sfc <sfc-bounces@ietf.org> On = Behalf Of James Guichard
Sent: Tuesday, July 23, 2019 9:28 AM
To: sfc@ietf.org
Subject: Re: [sfc] WG Last Call draft-ietf-sfc-oam-framework-09=

 

Dear WG:

 

This email closes the WG LC for draft-ietf-sfc-oam-f= ramework-09. The chairs have concluded that there is enough support to move= this document forward for publication as an Informational RFC. Authors, pl= ease confirm that any IPR you are aware of has been declared.

 

Thanks!

 

Jim & Joel

 

 

 

From: James Guichard
Sent: Monday, July 08, 2019 9:15 AM
To: sfc@ietf.org
Subject: RE: WG Last Call draft-ietf-sfc-oam-framework-06=

 

Dear WG:

 

Before closing this WG Last Call, we (the chairs) wo= uld like to better understand the level of interest and commitment the WG h= as on progressing OAM work for SFC, starting with draft-ietf-sfc-oam-framew= ork as a baseline. Please reply to this email with either support for the document, or non-support (we do not= need this document). Silence does not imply support or lack thereof so ple= ase take time to state your opinions with a brief rational for support/non-= support.

 

Thanks!

 

Jim & Joel

 

 

From: James Guichard
Sent: Tuesday, May 28, 2019 10:30 AM
To: sfc@ietf.org
Subject: WG Last Call draft-ietf-sfc-oam-framework-06

 

Dear WG:<= /p>

 

This message starts a new t= wo week WG Last Call on advancing https://datatracker.ietf.o= rg/doc/draft-ietf-sfc-oam-framework/ for publication as an Informational RFC.

 

Substantive comments and st= atements of support for publishing this document should be directed to the = mailing list. Editorial suggestions can be sent to the authors.  This = last call will end on 11th June 2019.

 

Thanks!

 

Jim & Joel

&n= bsp;

&n= bsp;

 

&n= bsp;

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<1A1EA07A-94DB-4100-8149-119B7915E64B@cisco.com> From: Greg Mirsky Date: Tue, 23 Jul 2019 16:38:41 -0400 Message-ID: To: "Nagendra Kumar Nainar (naikumar)" Cc: James Guichard , "draft-ietf-sfc-oam-framework@ietf.org" , "sfc@ietf.org" Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="0000000000003f4cf8058e5f2ef0" Archived-At: Subject: Re: [sfc] WG Last Call draft-ietf-sfc-oam-framework-06 X-BeenThere: sfc@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: Network Service Chaining List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 23 Jul 2019 20:38:59 -0000 --0000000000003f4cf8058e5f2ef0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Hi Nagendra, thank you for your expedient response to my comments and questions. I am at IETF this week and will respond with my notes after IETF. Apologies for the delay, hope you'll understand. Regards, Greg On Tue, Jul 23, 2019 at 1:58 PM Nagendra Kumar Nainar (naikumar) < naikumar@cisco.com> wrote: > Hi Greg, > > > > Thank you for the comments. Please see our responses below. > > > > in regard to the applicability of ICMP the statement in Section 4.1.1 is > "ICMP could be leveraged for connectivity function (defined in Section 4.= 1) > to verify the availability of SF or SFC." When I looked through Section 4= .1 > I find some discussion of a Fault Management function but no clear > definition of what is connectivity verification in SFC. > > > > Section 4.1 already list some of the OAM functions that can be > performed as part of connectivity function. > > > > More so, it appears that connectivity verification is being mixed with > re-ordering detection, Path MTU Discovery, data integrity monitoring, > > > > Please refer Section 2.2.7 of RFC7276 that explains MTU > verification as part of Connectivity verification. Section 3.1.1 already > explains the rationale behind including policy verification. > > > > and some sort of policy verification. Real kitchen sink. > > > > The intention is to capture/highlight various OAM functions > based on the unique characteristics of SFC. Please read section 3.1.1 abo= ut > SF availability. It is already explained about what is (or why) policy > verification for SF availability. Accordingly, we humbly deny on this > comment. > > > > At the same time, in other documents on network OAM, connectivity > verification has been firmly defined as a function that verifies that dat= a > have been received only form the expected source over the expected path. = In > conjunction with this, a misconnection error is defined to indicate that > packets from another connection have been received. In other words, the > connectivity verification function verifies not only that packets from A > reach node B but that they arrive only on the red wire, not on blue or > yellow. Said all that, the interpretation of connectivity function in SFC > may be different but, in my opinion, Section 4.1 does not provide anythin= g. > > > > We dont understand your concern here. SFC OAM components > explains what is availability and PM for SF/SFC (Refer section 3.1.x and > 3.2.x) and tied it up with the function in section 4. The relevant sectio= ns > also highlight the difference in SFC (For example, what is availability i= n > terms of SF). > > > > Also, it is not clear how the last bullet "Proactively test alternate or > protected paths to ensure reliability of network configurations" is > specific to and requires the use of a connectivity function and why it > cannot be addressed by, for example, continuity check function. > > > > Thanks for highlighting this. We will add the same point under > Section 4.2. Hope that satisfies your concern. > > > > Also, the very last sentence of Section 4.1 concludes that ICMP in SFC > "can be used for basic OAM functions". But I cannot find anywhere in the > document where the term, notion of "basic OAM functions" has been discuss= ed > or defined. Which functions considered as basic? ICMP can be used as the > fault management tool, to some extent because it is relatively processing > extensive, but its value in performance monitoring is very low. Is PM OAM > not part of the basic OAM functions? > > > > Thanks. To avoid any confusion, we modified it as below. Does > the below modification help? > > > > "It could be observed that ICMP at its current stage may not be able > > to perform all required SFC OAM functions, but as explained above, it > > can be used for some of the connectivity functions." > > > > > > Section 6.4.2, in my opinion, may provide some context to how to interpre= t > the use of "availability". From "BFD or S-BFD could be leveraged to perfo= rm > SF or SFC availability" it appears that the availability is viewed as par= t > of Fault Management OAM. (I'm still awaiting a response to my earlier > questions specifically on the interpretation of "availability" in the OAM > Framework for SFC. > > > > Thanks, this looks like a valid point. We can change the same a= s > below: > > > > "BFD or S-BFD could be leveraged to perform continuity function for SF or > SFC." > > > > Further, in Section 6.4.2 the possible use is described as "Upon receivin= g > the control packet, the last SFF in the SFC will reply back with relevant > DIAG code." But this is not how BFD in the Asynchronous mode operates, th= at > is how only S-BFD works. The first sentence of the second paragraph refer= s > to both BFD and S-BFD. But the rest of the paragraph describes the > operation of S-BFD only, not of BFD in Asynchronous mode. I believe that > either the positioning statement must be modified or explanation of the > operation of BFD in Asynchronous mode over SFP provided. > > > > The intention is not to explain how it works for each BFD mode. > But to explain the common behavior. AFAIK/R, setting relevant DIAG code i= n > the response packet is common for both BFD and S-BFD. So we dont see any > confusion here. > > > > > > Section 6.4.3 includes the statement about the applicability of iOAM to > availability: "In-Situ OAM could be used with O bit set to perform SF > availability and SFC availability or performance measurement." I interpre= t > this conclusion as the indication that availability is considered as part > of the Fault Management OAM toolset. If that is the case, I question the > value of using one-way OAM for fault management because only the egress > node may have the state and even that is not demonstrated in existing iOA= M > documents. In order to detect path failure, a node must have information > that can be used to detect the packet loss. That can be either > monotonically increasing sequence numbers or the notion that packets must > be arriving at pre-determined intervals. Which mechanism can be used by > iOAM? Also, since iOAM, in regard to availability, appears as single-way = FM > OAM mechanism, that uses the actual data flow, what is its advantage > comparing to, for example, collecting and comparing counters from ingress > and egress? In other words, even if the egress can detect the loss of its > availability for the particular SFP, how such a notion can be used? > > > > Section 6.4 is all about the applicability of different tools. > It neither concludes nor prefers one over the other. How the data is > collected, interpreted, used for failure detection or signaled back to th= e > Initiator are expected to be explained in the solution document that > proposes iOAM as the tool for SFC OAM. As mentioned in the document scope= , > any solution specific info is outside the scope of this document and > accordingly we dont see a reason to include those details in this documen= t. > > > > I, again, have to point out that Section 6.4.4 references the individual > draft that had expired 3+ years ago. Usually, that is the indication that > neither authors nor the community are interested in the idea. > > > > This was already clarified by Carlos in different thread. The > concept in the draft is already implemented and available in ODL. > > > > Hope the above clarifies your queries. We are addressing the agreed > comments and editorial comments that you raised in the other thread. We > will submit a new version with the fixes. > > > > Thanks, > > Nagendra > > > > > > *From: *sfc on behalf of Greg Mirsky < > gregimirsky@gmail.com> > *Date: *Monday, July 22, 2019 at 10:44 AM > *To: *James Guichard > *Cc: *"sfc@ietf.org" > *Subject: *Re: [sfc] WG Last Call draft-ietf-sfc-oam-framework-06 > > > > Dear Jim, Joe, et al., > > I'd like to share my comments on Section of 6.4 of the draft. Much > appreciate your consideration and response to my questions. > > - in regard to the applicability of ICMP the statement in Section > 4.1.1 is "ICMP could be leveraged for connectivity function (defined i= n > Section 4.1) to verify the availability of SF or SFC." When I looked > through Section 4.1 I find some discussion of a Fault Management funct= ion > but no clear definition of what is connectivity verification in SFC. M= ore > so, it appears that connectivity verification is being mixed with > re-ordering detection, Path MTU Discovery, data integrity monitoring, = and > some sort of policy verification. Real kitchen sink. At the same time,= in > other documents on network OAM, connectivity verification has been fir= mly > defined as a function that verifies that data have been received only = form > the expected source over the expected path. In conjunction with this, = a > misconnection error is defined to indicate that packets from another > connection have been received. In other words, the connectivity > verification function verifies not only that packets from A reach node= B > but that they arrive only on the red wire, not on blue or yellow. Said= all > that, the interpretation of connectivity function in SFC may be differ= ent > but, in my opinion, Section 4.1 does not provide anything. Also, it is= not > clear how the last bullet "Proactively test alternate or protected pat= hs to > ensure reliability of network configurations" is specific to and requi= res > the use of a connectivity function and why it cannot be addressed by, = for > example, continuity check function. > - Also, the very last sentence of Section 4.1 concludes that ICMP in > SFC "can be used for basic OAM functions". But I cannot find anywhere = in > the document where the term, notion of "basic OAM functions" has been > discussed or defined. Which functions considered as basic? ICMP can be= used > as the fault management tool, to some extent because it is relatively > processing extensive, but its value in performance monitoring is very = low. > Is PM OAM not part of the basic OAM functions? > - Section 6.4.2, in my opinion, may provide some context to how to > interpret the use of "availability". From "BFD or S-BFD could be lever= aged > to perform SF or SFC availability" it appears that the availability is > viewed as part of Fault Management OAM. (I'm still awaiting a response= to > my earlier questions specifically on the interpretation of "availabili= ty" > in the OAM Framework for SFC. > - Further, in Section 6.4.2 the possible use is described as "Upon > receiving the control packet, the last SFF in the SFC will reply back = with > relevant DIAG code." But this is not how BFD in the Asynchronous mode > operates, that is how only S-BFD works. The first sentence of the seco= nd > paragraph refers to both BFD and S-BFD. But the rest of the paragraph > describes the operation of S-BFD only, not of BFD in Asynchronous mode= . I > believe that either the positioning statement must be modified or > explanation of the operation of BFD in Asynchronous mode over SFP prov= ided. > - Section 6.4.3 includes the statement about the applicability of iOAM > to availability: "In-Situ OAM could be used with O bit set to perform = SF > availability and SFC availability or performance measurement." I inter= pret > this conclusion as the indication that availability is considered as p= art > of the Fault Management OAM toolset. If that is the case, I question t= he > value of using one-way OAM for fault management because only the egres= s > node may have the state and even that is not demonstrated in existing = iOAM > documents. In order to detect path failure, a node must have informati= on > that can be used to detect the packet loss. That can be either > monotonically increasing sequence numbers or the notion that packets m= ust > be arriving at pre-determined intervals. Which mechanism can be used b= y > iOAM? Also, since iOAM, in regard to availability, appears as single-w= ay FM > OAM mechanism, that uses the actual data flow, what is its advantage > comparing to, for example, collecting and comparing counters from ingr= ess > and egress? In other words, even if the egress can detect the loss of = its > availability for the particular SFP, how such a notion can be used? > - I, again, have to point out that Section 6.4.4 references the > individual draft that had expired 3+ years ago. Usually, that is the > indication that neither authors nor the community are interested in th= e > idea. > > Regards, > > Greg > > > > On Tue, May 28, 2019 at 10:37 AM James Guichard < > james.n.guichard@futurewei.com> wrote: > > Dear WG: > > > > This message starts a new two week WG Last Call on advancing > https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-sfc-oam-framework/ > > for publication as an Informational RFC. > > > > Substantive comments and statements of support for publishing this > document should be directed to the mailing list. Editorial suggestions ca= n > be sent to the authors. This last call will end on 11th June 2019. > > > > Thanks! > > > > Jim & Joel > > > > > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > sfc mailing list > sfc@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/sfc > > --0000000000003f4cf8058e5f2ef0 Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Hi Nagendra,
thank you for your expedient response to = my comments and questions. I am at IETF this week and will respond with my = notes after IETF. Apologies for the delay, hope you'll understand.

Regards,
Greg

On Tue, Jul 23, 2019 at 1= :58 PM Nagendra Kumar Nainar (naikumar) <naikumar@cisco.com> wrote:

Hi Greg,

=C2=A0

Thank you for the commen= ts. Please see our responses below.

=C2=A0

in regard to the applica= bility of ICMP the statement in Section 4.1.1 is "ICMP could be levera= ged for connectivity function (defined in Section 4.1) to verify the availa= bility of SF or SFC." When I looked through Section 4.1 I find some discussion of a Fault Management function but no c= lear definition of what is connectivity verification in SFC.<= /span>

=C2=A0

<Authors> Section = 4.1 already list some of the OAM functions that can be performed as part of= connectivity function.

=C2=A0

More so, it appears that= connectivity verification is being mixed with re-ordering detection, Path = MTU Discovery, data integrity monitoring,

=C2=A0

<Authors> Please r= efer Section 2.2.7 of RFC7276 that explains MTU verification as part of Con= nectivity verification. Section 3.1.1 already explains the rationale behind= including policy verification.

=C2=A0

and some sort of policy = verification. Real kitchen sink.=C2=A0

=C2=A0

<Authors> The inte= ntion is to capture/highlight various OAM functions based on the unique cha= racteristics of SFC. Please read section 3.1.1 about SF availability. It is= already explained about what is (or why) policy verification for SF availability. Accordingly, we humbly deny on th= is comment.

=C2=A0

At the same time, in oth= er documents on network OAM, connectivity verification has been firmly defi= ned as a function that verifies that data have been received only form the = expected source over the expected path. In conjunction with this, a misconnection error is defined to indicate tha= t packets from another connection have been received. In other words, the c= onnectivity verification function verifies not only that packets from A rea= ch node B but that they arrive only on the red wire, not on blue or yellow. Said all that, the interpretation = of connectivity function in SFC may be different but, in my opinion, Sectio= n 4.1 does not provide anything.

=C2=A0

<Authors> We dont = understand your concern here. SFC OAM components explains what is availabil= ity and PM for SF/SFC (Refer section 3.1.x and 3.2.x) and tied it up with t= he function in section 4. The relevant sections also highlight the difference in SFC (For example, what is availability in= terms of SF).=C2=A0

=C2=A0

Also, it is not clear ho= w the last bullet "Proactively test alternate or protected paths to en= sure reliability of network configurations" is specific to and require= s the use of a connectivity function and why it cannot be addressed by, for example, continuity check function.<= /u>

=C2=A0

<Authors> Thanks f= or highlighting this. We will add the same point under Section 4.2. Hope th= at satisfies your concern.

=C2=A0

Also, the very last sent= ence of Section 4.1 concludes that ICMP in SFC "can be used for basic = OAM functions". But I cannot find anywhere in the document where the t= erm, notion of "basic OAM functions" has been discussed or defined. Which functions considered as basic? ICMP can be use= d as the fault management tool, to some extent because it is relatively pro= cessing extensive, but its value in performance monitoring is very low. Is = PM OAM not part of the basic OAM functions?

=C2=A0

<Authors> Thanks. = To avoid any confusion, we modified it as below. Does the below modificatio= n help?

=C2=A0

"It could be observ= ed that ICMP at its current stage may not be able

=C2=A0=C2=A0 to perform = all required SFC OAM functions, but as explained above, it

=C2=A0=C2=A0 can be used= for some of the connectivity functions."

=C2=A0

=C2=A0

Section 6.4.2, in my opi= nion, may provide some context to how to interpret the use of "availab= ility". From "BFD or S-BFD could be leveraged to perform SF or SF= C availability" it appears that the availability is viewed as part of Fault Management OAM. (I'm still awaiting a response= to my earlier questions specifically on the interpretation of "availa= bility" in the OAM Framework for SFC.

=C2=A0

<Authors> Thanks, = this looks like a valid point. We can change the same as below:

=C2=A0

"BFD or S-BFD could= be leveraged to perform continuity function for SF or SFC."=

=C2=A0

Further, in Section 6.4.= 2 the possible use is described as "Upon receiving the control packet,= the last SFF in the SFC will reply back with relevant DIAG code." But= this is not how BFD in the Asynchronous mode operates, that is how only S-BFD works. The first sentence of the second p= aragraph refers to both BFD and S-BFD. But the rest of the paragraph descri= bes the operation of S-BFD only, not of BFD in Asynchronous mode. I believe= that either the positioning statement must be modified or explanation of the operation of BFD in Asynchronous mo= de over SFP provided.

=C2=A0

<Authors> The inte= ntion is not to explain how it works for each BFD mode. But to explain the = common behavior. AFAIK/R, setting relevant DIAG code in the response packet= is common for both BFD and S-BFD. So we dont see any confusion here.

=C2=A0

=C2=A0

Section 6.4.3 includes t= he statement about the applicability of iOAM to availability: "In-Situ= OAM could be used with O bit set to perform SF availability and SFC availa= bility or performance measurement." I interpret this conclusion as the indication that availability is considered as part = of the Fault Management OAM toolset. If that is the case, I question the va= lue of using one-way OAM for fault management because only the egress node = may have the state and even that is not demonstrated in existing iOAM documents. In order to detect path fa= ilure, a node must have information that can be used to detect the packet l= oss. That can be either monotonically increasing sequence numbers or the no= tion that packets must be arriving at pre-determined intervals. Which mechanism can be used by iOAM? Also, si= nce iOAM, in regard to availability, appears as single-way FM OAM mechanism= , that uses the actual data flow, what is its advantage comparing to, for e= xample, collecting and comparing counters from ingress and egress? In other words, even if the egress can d= etect the loss of its availability for the particular SFP, how such a notio= n can be used?

=C2=A0

<Authors> Section = 6.4 is all about the applicability of different tools. It neither concludes= nor prefers one over the other. How the data is collected, interpreted, us= ed for failure detection or signaled back to the Initiator are expected to be explained in the solution document tha= t proposes iOAM as the tool for SFC OAM. As mentioned in the document scope= , any solution specific info is outside the scope of this document and acco= rdingly we dont see a reason to include those details in this document.

=C2=A0

I, again, have to point = out that Section 6.4.4 references the individual draft that had expired 3+ = years ago. Usually, that is the indication that neither authors nor the com= munity are interested in the idea.

=C2=A0

<Authors> This was= already clarified by Carlos in different thread. The concept in the draft = is already implemented and available in ODL.

=C2=A0

Hope the above clarifies your queries. We are addres= sing the agreed comments and editorial comments that you raised in the othe= r thread. We will submit a new version with the fixes.

=C2=A0

Thanks,

Nagendra

=C2=A0

=C2=A0

From: = sfc <sfc-bounces@ietf.org> o= n behalf of Greg Mirsky <gregimirsky@gmail.com>
Date: Monday, July 22, 2019 at 10:44 AM
To: James Guichard <james.n.guichard@futurewei.com>
Cc: "sfc@ietf= .org" <sfc@ie= tf.org>
Subject: Re: [sfc] WG Last Call draft-ietf-sfc-oam-framework-06

=C2=A0

Dear Jim, Joe, et al.,

I'd like to share my comments on Section of 6.4 = of the draft. Much appreciate your consideration and response to my questio= ns.

  • in regard to the applicability of ICMP the statement in Section 4.1.1 is &q= uot;ICMP could be leveraged for connectivity function (defined in Section 4= .1) to verify the availability of SF or SFC." When I looked through Se= ction 4.1 I find some discussion of a Fault Management function but no clear definition of what is connectivity verifi= cation in SFC. More so, it appears that connectivity verification is being = mixed with re-ordering detection, Path MTU Discovery, data integrity monito= ring, and some sort of policy verification. Real kitchen sink. At the same time, in other documents on network OAM, co= nnectivity verification has been firmly defined as a function that verifies= that data have been received only form the expected source over the expect= ed path. In conjunction with this, a misconnection error is defined to indicate that packets from another con= nection have been received. In other words, the connectivity verification f= unction verifies not only that packets from A reach node B but that they ar= rive only on the red wire, not on blue or yellow. Said all that, the interpretation of connectivity function= in SFC may be different but, in my opinion, Section 4.1 does not provide a= nything. Also, it is not clear how the last bullet "Proactively test a= lternate or protected paths to ensure reliability of network configurations" is specific to and requires th= e use of a connectivity function and why it cannot be addressed by, for exa= mple, continuity check function.
  • Also, the very last sentence of Section 4.1 concludes that ICMP in SFC &quo= t;can be used for basic OAM functions". But I cannot find anywhere in = the document where the term, notion of "basic OAM functions" has = been discussed or defined. Which functions considered as basic? ICMP can be used as the fault management tool, to some extent be= cause it is relatively processing extensive, but its value in performance m= onitoring is very low. Is PM OAM not part of the basic OAM functions?
  • Section 6.4.2, in my opinion, may provide some context to how to interpret = the use of "availability". From "BFD or S-BFD could be lever= aged to perform SF or SFC availability" it appears that the availabili= ty is viewed as part of Fault Management OAM. (I'm still awaiting a response to my earlier questions specifically on the interpreta= tion of "availability" in the OAM Framework for SFC.
  • Further, in Section 6.4.2 the possible use is described as "Upon recei= ving the control packet, the last SFF in the SFC will reply back with relev= ant DIAG code." But this is not how BFD in the Asynchronous mode opera= tes, that is how only S-BFD works. The first sentence of the second paragraph refers to both BFD and S-BFD. But the res= t of the paragraph describes the operation of S-BFD only, not of BFD in Asy= nchronous mode. I believe that either the positioning statement must be mod= ified or explanation of the operation of BFD in Asynchronous mode over SFP provided.
  • Section 6.4.3 includes the statement about the applicability of iOAM to ava= ilability: "In-Situ OAM could be used with O bit set to perform SF ava= ilability and SFC availability or performance measurement." I interpre= t this conclusion as the indication that availability is considered as part of the Fault Management OAM toolset. If that is the = case, I question the value of using one-way OAM for fault management becaus= e only the egress node may have the state and even that is not demonstrated= in existing iOAM documents. In order to detect path failure, a node must have information that can be use= d to detect the packet loss. That can be either monotonically increasing se= quence numbers or the notion that packets must be arriving at pre-determine= d intervals. Which mechanism can be used by iOAM? Also, since iOAM, in regard to availability, appears as s= ingle-way FM OAM mechanism, that uses the actual data flow, what is its adv= antage comparing to, for example, collecting and comparing counters from in= gress and egress? In other words, even if the egress can detect the loss of its availability for the particu= lar SFP, how such a notion can be used?
  • I, again, have to point out that Section 6.4.4 references the individual dr= aft that had expired 3+ years ago. Usually, that is the indication that nei= ther authors nor the community are interested in the idea.

Regards,

Greg

=C2=A0

On Tue, May 28, 2019 at 10:37 AM James Guichard <= james.n= .guichard@futurewei.com> wrote:

Dear WG:=

=C2=A0

This message starts a new two= week WG Last Call on advancing https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-= ietf-sfc-oam-framework/ for publication as an Informational RFC.

=C2=A0

Substantive comments and stat= ements of support for publishing this document should be directed to the ma= iling list. Editorial suggestions can be sent to the authors.=C2=A0 This la= st call will end on 11th June 2019.

=C2=A0

Thanks!<= /p>

=C2=A0

Jim & Joel<= /span>

= =C2=A0

= =C2=A0

=C2=A0

= =C2=A0

_______________________________________________
sfc mailing list
sfc@ietf.org
htt= ps://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/sfc

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ZmMiPmh0dHBzOi8vd3d3LmlldGYub3JnL21haWxtYW4vbGlzdGluZm8vc2ZjPC9hPjwvc3Bhbj48 YnI+DQo8L2Rpdj4NCjwvYmxvY2txdW90ZT4NCjwvZGl2Pg0KPC9ib2R5Pg0KPC9odG1sPg0K --_000_C1058B40139D4624BE1F42F4B89A2DC9ciscocom_-- From nobody Thu Jul 25 13:00:05 2019 Return-Path: X-Original-To: sfc@ietf.org Delivered-To: sfc@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from ietfa.amsl.com (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id CDDB51201E0; Thu, 25 Jul 2019 12:59:56 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: internet-drafts@ietf.org To: Cc: sfc@ietf.org X-Test-IDTracker: no X-IETF-IDTracker: 6.99.1 Auto-Submitted: auto-generated Precedence: bulk Reply-To: sfc@ietf.org Message-ID: <156408479676.17400.10703326678815585963@ietfa.amsl.com> Date: Thu, 25 Jul 2019 12:59:56 -0700 Archived-At: Subject: [sfc] I-D Action: draft-ietf-sfc-oam-framework-10.txt X-BeenThere: sfc@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 List-Id: Network Service Chaining List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 25 Jul 2019 19:59:57 -0000 A New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line Internet-Drafts directories. This draft is a work item of the Service Function Chaining WG of the IETF. Title : Service Function Chaining (SFC) Operations, Administration and Maintenance (OAM) Framework Authors : Sam K. Aldrin Carlos Pignataro Nagendra Kumar Ram Krishnan Anoop Ghanwani Filename : draft-ietf-sfc-oam-framework-10.txt Pages : 20 Date : 2019-07-25 Abstract: This document provides a reference framework for Operations, Administration and Maintenance (OAM) for Service Function Chaining (SFC). The IETF datatracker status page for this draft is: https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-sfc-oam-framework/ There are also htmlized versions available at: https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-sfc-oam-framework-10 https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/html/draft-ietf-sfc-oam-framework-10 A diff from the previous version is available at: https://www.ietf.org/rfcdiff?url2=draft-ietf-sfc-oam-framework-10 Please note that it may take a couple of minutes from the time of submission until the htmlized version and diff are available at tools.ietf.org. Internet-Drafts are also available by anonymous FTP at: ftp://ftp.ietf.org/internet-drafts/ From nobody Tue Jul 30 06:12:35 2019 Return-Path: X-Original-To: sfc@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: sfc@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id D0147120144; Tue, 30 Jul 2019 06:12:33 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.997 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.997 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE=-0.0001, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=gmail.com Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id cMXsHqGtocIM; Tue, 30 Jul 2019 06:12:30 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail-lf1-x12b.google.com (mail-lf1-x12b.google.com [IPv6:2a00:1450:4864:20::12b]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 7548712013D; Tue, 30 Jul 2019 06:12:29 -0700 (PDT) Received: by mail-lf1-x12b.google.com with SMTP id z15so40412460lfh.13; Tue, 30 Jul 2019 06:12:29 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20161025; h=mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date:message-id:subject:to :cc; bh=wMgVbzN5Rj5LOq6lAUf1CHkmvpQ3TVRhLULsMVj0Rt8=; b=ouBBNg1t14CtHCfDVfJ0lSbxRaGVMcr0pFcNVzfIDZ8rf6pq7W902EcnKn1DhFfxGI BQld9c/CUfgUsxXx9UlfVrHCy23yyGJX1HgwWijsWPognsNvTumfWbSij/RVt/4g+v86 9xy/yvI21gKpfvSe2v4RkCD+Y95oGi5vTBJnShKQDPvMR/gJHHEK0HeMlIwC+haUyn7b QGNPS1dH1O7WntkeQo8y5zM9HW0MRoFT+UhkhpCfMlKlJS7sTn5av7YZL5Ebv9ECpuSi KoJqPL2SLkCDNipG2IvGIpl5jP+RTMF7HAWNfJ6Onov/xX/fiXP6CMUwbTBwObuZrX12 pJww== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date :message-id:subject:to:cc; bh=wMgVbzN5Rj5LOq6lAUf1CHkmvpQ3TVRhLULsMVj0Rt8=; b=bMslmE+uQD9B5iwmLL+HWmXbgSkgXqyyK268tPqcYuvlgyuz+xIeYeOA+kPYrhmAgT /G9btBrDse9k1dQZJnn5/vx0k4RFxf03kUqUp7vu/uEqCPIBjMXT9KeCrVLPOtA4vpCg b0hq4/D/yGsYIXiR9Z6C4N3aTHZechCeCFTA5biAT6cPhgdIhW9xq809qEyLEpibjIco P3ZSIsouhNPawyAmTa7KuzstX3X9lOCCxZdvYDsfEuEQT4sMD7Q6aEVHEZ/Qs+CTn76H qTwND4VMF4sNzVweBJv5FKXOtAxT+kXHpydUBYBCBOhSQQ9pi5/NOGMFt/9Xf8IFgVEC ERYQ== X-Gm-Message-State: APjAAAUTprZK1TsTnWqiHh5RS2+BidatV7/tQfKZ7/nc6usGMI2zkPc7 T/+WbxrjAq72d2ZEeR5SOLRtqTXMNpGXJuNe2zQ= X-Google-Smtp-Source: APXvYqwehQVb28PvhJ1BK8i5uqX/tEcCxHv2w/dGsgEYjxQjDYiEbe5PFwtmT1buP4+QdARPmVg9rm/WVpiceLJlNKw= X-Received: by 2002:a19:9111:: with SMTP id t17mr20185062lfd.113.1564492347406; Tue, 30 Jul 2019 06:12:27 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 References: <1A1EA07A-94DB-4100-8149-119B7915E64B@cisco.com> In-Reply-To: <1A1EA07A-94DB-4100-8149-119B7915E64B@cisco.com> From: Greg Mirsky Date: Tue, 30 Jul 2019 09:12:16 -0400 Message-ID: To: "Nagendra Kumar Nainar (naikumar)" Cc: James Guichard , "draft-ietf-sfc-oam-framework@ietf.org" , "sfc@ietf.org" Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="0000000000009f00f2058ee5c248" Archived-At: Subject: Re: [sfc] WG Last Call draft-ietf-sfc-oam-framework-06 X-BeenThere: sfc@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: Network Service Chaining List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 30 Jul 2019 13:12:34 -0000 --0000000000009f00f2058ee5c248 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Hi Nagendra, much appreciate your responses. Please find my notes in-line tagged GIM>>. Regards, Greg On Tue, Jul 23, 2019 at 1:58 PM Nagendra Kumar Nainar (naikumar) < naikumar@cisco.com> wrote: > Hi Greg, > > > > Thank you for the comments. Please see our responses below. > > > > in regard to the applicability of ICMP the statement in Section 4.1.1 is > "ICMP could be leveraged for connectivity function (defined in Section 4.= 1) > to verify the availability of SF or SFC." When I looked through Section 4= .1 > I find some discussion of a Fault Management function but no clear > definition of what is connectivity verification in SFC. > > > > Section 4.1 already list some of the OAM functions that can be > performed as part of connectivity function. > GIM>> My question was about the definition of the connectivity verification function used in the document. Also, do you believe that connectivity verification is a composite function that includes other OAM functions? > > > More so, it appears that connectivity verification is being mixed with > re-ordering detection, Path MTU Discovery, data integrity monitoring, > > > > Please refer Section 2.2.7 of RFC7276 that explains MTU > verification as part of Connectivity verification. Section 3.1.1 already > explains the rationale behind including policy verification. > GIM>> Thank you for the reference to RFC 7276 but it does not state that Path MTU Discovery (PMTUD) is part of CV. I believe that PMTUD can as well be supported by the continuity check function and one of the examples is the method described in draft-ietf-bfd-large-packets . So, I don't feel you've addressed my question. > > > and some sort of policy verification. Real kitchen sink. > > > > The intention is to capture/highlight various OAM functions > based on the unique characteristics of SFC. Please read section 3.1.1 abo= ut > SF availability. It is already explained about what is (or why) policy > verification for SF availability. Accordingly, we humbly deny on this > comment. > GIM>> " Accordingly, we humbly deny on this comment." Which leaves me with no other option but to state that you've failed to resolve my technical comment. > > > At the same time, in other documents on network OAM, connectivity > verification has been firmly defined as a function that verifies that dat= a > have been received only form the expected source over the expected path. = In > conjunction with this, a misconnection error is defined to indicate that > packets from another connection have been received. In other words, the > connectivity verification function verifies not only that packets from A > reach node B but that they arrive only on the red wire, not on blue or > yellow. Said all that, the interpretation of connectivity function in SFC > may be different but, in my opinion, Section 4.1 does not provide anythin= g. > > > > We dont understand your concern here. SFC OAM components > explains what is availability and PM for SF/SFC (Refer section 3.1.x and > 3.2.x) and tied it up with the function in section 4. The relevant sectio= ns > also highlight the difference in SFC (For example, what is availability i= n > terms of SF). > GIM>> "SFC OAM components explains what is availability ..." Can you provide the quote from this or other SFC OAM document that defines the SFC availability? I've been asking for one to no avail. Thank you in advance for clarifying this. GIM>> "The relevant sections also highlight the difference in SFC (For example, what is availability in terms of SF)." So, do you believe that SFC availability has some differences from SF availability? What are they? Is there a difference in measuring method or measurement units between the availability of an SFC and an SF? Please clarify. > > > Also, it is not clear how the last bullet "Proactively test alternate or > protected paths to ensure reliability of network configurations" is > specific to and requires the use of a connectivity function and why it > cannot be addressed by, for example, continuity check function. > > > > Thanks for highlighting this. We will add the same point under > Section 4.2. Hope that satisfies your concern. > GIM>> Not really. Section 4.1 opens with "Connectivity is mainly an on-demand function ..." and closes with "Proactively test alternate or protected paths ..". That draws the question How on-demand function can be used to proactively monitor a path? Perhaps you can add an example. > > > Also, the very last sentence of Section 4.1 concludes that ICMP in SFC > "can be used for basic OAM functions". But I cannot find anywhere in the > document where the term, notion of "basic OAM functions" has been discuss= ed > or defined. Which functions considered as basic? ICMP can be used as the > fault management tool, to some extent because it is relatively processing > extensive, but its value in performance monitoring is very low. Is PM OAM > not part of the basic OAM functions? > > > > Thanks. To avoid any confusion, we modified it as below. Does > the below modification help? > > > > "It could be observed that ICMP at its current stage may not be able > > to perform all required SFC OAM functions, but as explained above, it > > can be used for some of the connectivity functions." > GIM>> The text is an improvement, thank you. But it refers to "all required SFC OAM functions" and I cannot find such list in the document. Can you propose another text? > > > > > Section 6.4.2, in my opinion, may provide some context to how to interpre= t > the use of "availability". From "BFD or S-BFD could be leveraged to perfo= rm > SF or SFC availability" it appears that the availability is viewed as par= t > of Fault Management OAM. (I'm still awaiting a response to my earlier > questions specifically on the interpretation of "availability" in the OAM > Framework for SFC. > > > > Thanks, this looks like a valid point. We can change the same a= s > below: > > > > "BFD or S-BFD could be leveraged to perform continuity function for SF or > SFC." > GIM>> Thank you, that works. > > > Further, in Section 6.4.2 the possible use is described as "Upon receivin= g > the control packet, the last SFF in the SFC will reply back with relevant > DIAG code." But this is not how BFD in the Asynchronous mode operates, th= at > is how only S-BFD works. The first sentence of the second paragraph refer= s > to both BFD and S-BFD. But the rest of the paragraph describes the > operation of S-BFD only, not of BFD in Asynchronous mode. I believe that > either the positioning statement must be modified or explanation of the > operation of BFD in Asynchronous mode over SFP provided. > > > > The intention is not to explain how it works for each BFD mode. > But to explain the common behavior. AFAIK/R, setting relevant DIAG code i= n > the response packet is common for both BFD and S-BFD. So we dont see any > confusion here. > GIM>> I am not saying that there's "any confusion", I'm pointing to clear technical mistake in the description of how BFD in Asynchronous mode operates. You may split the description of the mechanism for BFD and S-BFD or find another way to fix the erroneous text. > > > > > Section 6.4.3 includes the statement about the applicability of iOAM to > availability: "In-Situ OAM could be used with O bit set to perform SF > availability and SFC availability or performance measurement." I interpre= t > this conclusion as the indication that availability is considered as part > of the Fault Management OAM toolset. If that is the case, I question the > value of using one-way OAM for fault management because only the egress > node may have the state and even that is not demonstrated in existing iOA= M > documents. In order to detect path failure, a node must have information > that can be used to detect the packet loss. That can be either > monotonically increasing sequence numbers or the notion that packets must > be arriving at pre-determined intervals. Which mechanism can be used by > iOAM? Also, since iOAM, in regard to availability, appears as single-way = FM > OAM mechanism, that uses the actual data flow, what is its advantage > comparing to, for example, collecting and comparing counters from ingress > and egress? In other words, even if the egress can detect the loss of its > availability for the particular SFP, how such a notion can be used? > > > > Section 6.4 is all about the applicability of different tools. > It neither concludes nor prefers one over the other. How the data is > collected, interpreted, used for failure detection or signaled back to th= e > Initiator are expected to be explained in the solution document that > proposes iOAM as the tool for SFC OAM. As mentioned in the document scope= , > any solution specific info is outside the scope of this document and > accordingly we dont see a reason to include those details in this documen= t. > GIM>> I cannot find in your response what is being detected by iOAM. How, from OAM PoV, is the reception of iOAM packet at the edge SFF is different from receiving any data packet of the same flow? Without the clearly stated distinction, without explaining the benefit of using iOAM for this function the statement has no technical foundation and doesn't stand. > > > I, again, have to point out that Section 6.4.4 references the individual > draft that had expired 3+ years ago. Usually, that is the indication that > neither authors nor the community are interested in the idea. > > > > This was already clarified by Carlos in different thread. The > concept in the draft is already implemented and available in ODL. > GIM>> I cannot evaluate how the implementation is compared to the long-ago expired draft, so using that draft as the reference is not helpful to a reader. Can yu find another source? > > > Hope the above clarifies your queries. We are addressing the agreed > comments and editorial comments that you raised in the other thread. We > will submit a new version with the fixes. > > > > Thanks, > > Nagendra > > > > > > *From: *sfc on behalf of Greg Mirsky < > gregimirsky@gmail.com> > *Date: *Monday, July 22, 2019 at 10:44 AM > *To: *James Guichard > *Cc: *"sfc@ietf.org" > *Subject: *Re: [sfc] WG Last Call draft-ietf-sfc-oam-framework-06 > > > > Dear Jim, Joe, et al., > > I'd like to share my comments on Section of 6.4 of the draft. Much > appreciate your consideration and response to my questions. > > - in regard to the applicability of ICMP the statement in Section > 4.1.1 is "ICMP could be leveraged for connectivity function (defined i= n > Section 4.1) to verify the availability of SF or SFC." When I looked > through Section 4.1 I find some discussion of a Fault Management funct= ion > but no clear definition of what is connectivity verification in SFC. M= ore > so, it appears that connectivity verification is being mixed with > re-ordering detection, Path MTU Discovery, data integrity monitoring, = and > some sort of policy verification. Real kitchen sink. At the same time,= in > other documents on network OAM, connectivity verification has been fir= mly > defined as a function that verifies that data have been received only = form > the expected source over the expected path. In conjunction with this, = a > misconnection error is defined to indicate that packets from another > connection have been received. In other words, the connectivity > verification function verifies not only that packets from A reach node= B > but that they arrive only on the red wire, not on blue or yellow. Said= all > that, the interpretation of connectivity function in SFC may be differ= ent > but, in my opinion, Section 4.1 does not provide anything. Also, it is= not > clear how the last bullet "Proactively test alternate or protected pat= hs to > ensure reliability of network configurations" is specific to and requi= res > the use of a connectivity function and why it cannot be addressed by, = for > example, continuity check function. > - Also, the very last sentence of Section 4.1 concludes that ICMP in > SFC "can be used for basic OAM functions". But I cannot find anywhere = in > the document where the term, notion of "basic OAM functions" has been > discussed or defined. Which functions considered as basic? ICMP can be= used > as the fault management tool, to some extent because it is relatively > processing extensive, but its value in performance monitoring is very = low. > Is PM OAM not part of the basic OAM functions? > - Section 6.4.2, in my opinion, may provide some context to how to > interpret the use of "availability". From "BFD or S-BFD could be lever= aged > to perform SF or SFC availability" it appears that the availability is > viewed as part of Fault Management OAM. (I'm still awaiting a response= to > my earlier questions specifically on the interpretation of "availabili= ty" > in the OAM Framework for SFC. > - Further, in Section 6.4.2 the possible use is described as "Upon > receiving the control packet, the last SFF in the SFC will reply back = with > relevant DIAG code." But this is not how BFD in the Asynchronous mode > operates, that is how only S-BFD works. The first sentence of the seco= nd > paragraph refers to both BFD and S-BFD. But the rest of the paragraph > describes the operation of S-BFD only, not of BFD in Asynchronous mode= . I > believe that either the positioning statement must be modified or > explanation of the operation of BFD in Asynchronous mode over SFP prov= ided. > - Section 6.4.3 includes the statement about the applicability of iOAM > to availability: "In-Situ OAM could be used with O bit set to perform = SF > availability and SFC availability or performance measurement." I inter= pret > this conclusion as the indication that availability is considered as p= art > of the Fault Management OAM toolset. If that is the case, I question t= he > value of using one-way OAM for fault management because only the egres= s > node may have the state and even that is not demonstrated in existing = iOAM > documents. In order to detect path failure, a node must have informati= on > that can be used to detect the packet loss. That can be either > monotonically increasing sequence numbers or the notion that packets m= ust > be arriving at pre-determined intervals. Which mechanism can be used b= y > iOAM? Also, since iOAM, in regard to availability, appears as single-w= ay FM > OAM mechanism, that uses the actual data flow, what is its advantage > comparing to, for example, collecting and comparing counters from ingr= ess > and egress? In other words, even if the egress can detect the loss of = its > availability for the particular SFP, how such a notion can be used? > - I, again, have to point out that Section 6.4.4 references the > individual draft that had expired 3+ years ago. Usually, that is the > indication that neither authors nor the community are interested in th= e > idea. > > Regards, > > Greg > > > > On Tue, May 28, 2019 at 10:37 AM James Guichard < > james.n.guichard@futurewei.com> wrote: > > Dear WG: > > > > This message starts a new two week WG Last Call on advancing > https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-sfc-oam-framework/ > > for publication as an Informational RFC. > > > > Substantive comments and statements of support for publishing this > document should be directed to the mailing list. Editorial suggestions ca= n > be sent to the authors. This last call will end on 11th June 2019. > > > > Thanks! > > > > Jim & Joel > > > > > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > sfc mailing list > sfc@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/sfc > > --0000000000009f00f2058ee5c248 Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Hi Nagendra,
much appreciate your res= ponses. Please find my notes in-line tagged GIM>>.

Regards,
Greg

On Tue, Jul 23, 2019 at 1:58 PM Nagendr= a Kumar Nainar (naikumar) <naikuma= r@cisco.com> wrote:

Hi Greg,

=C2=A0

Thank you for the commen= ts. Please see our responses below.

=C2=A0

in regard to the applica= bility of ICMP the statement in Section 4.1.1 is "ICMP could be levera= ged for connectivity function (defined in Section 4.1) to verify the availa= bility of SF or SFC." When I looked through Section 4.1 I find some discussion of a Fault Management function but no c= lear definition of what is connectivity verification in SFC.<= /span>

=C2=A0

<Authors> Section = 4.1 already list some of the OAM functions that can be performed as part of= connectivity function.

GIM>>= My question was about the definition of the connectivity verification func= tion used in the document. Also, do you believe that connectivity verificat= ion is a composite function that includes other OAM functions?=C2=A0
<= blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-l= eft:1px solid rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex">

=C2=A0

More so, it appears that= connectivity verification is being mixed with re-ordering detection, Path = MTU Discovery, data integrity monitoring,

=C2=A0

<Authors> Please r= efer Section 2.2.7 of RFC7276 that explains MTU verification as part of Con= nectivity verification. Section 3.1.1 already explains the rationale behind= including policy verification.

GIM= >> Thank you for the reference to RFC 7276 but it does not state that= Path MTU Discovery (PMTUD) is part of CV. I believe that PMTUD can as well= be supported by the continuity check function and one of the examples is t= he method described in=C2=A0draft-ietf-bfd-large-packets. So, I don't = feel you've addressed my question.

=C2=A0

and some sort of policy = verification. Real kitchen sink.=C2=A0

=C2=A0

<Authors> The inte= ntion is to capture/highlight various OAM functions based on the unique cha= racteristics of SFC. Please read section 3.1.1 about SF availability. It is= already explained about what is (or why) policy verification for SF availability. Accordingly, we humbly deny on th= is comment.

GIM>> "=C2=A0A= ccordingly, we humbly deny on this comment." Which leaves me with no o= ther option but to state that you've failed to resolve my technical com= ment.

=C2=A0

At the same time, in oth= er documents on network OAM, connectivity verification has been firmly defi= ned as a function that verifies that data have been received only form the = expected source over the expected path. In conjunction with this, a misconnection error is defined to indicate tha= t packets from another connection have been received. In other words, the c= onnectivity verification function verifies not only that packets from A rea= ch node B but that they arrive only on the red wire, not on blue or yellow. Said all that, the interpretation = of connectivity function in SFC may be different but, in my opinion, Sectio= n 4.1 does not provide anything.

=C2=A0

<Authors> We dont = understand your concern here. SFC OAM components explains what is availabil= ity and PM for SF/SFC (Refer section 3.1.x and 3.2.x) and tied it up with t= he function in section 4. The relevant sections also highlight the difference in SFC (For example, what is availability in= terms of SF).=C2=A0

GIM>> &q= uot;SFC OAM components explains what is av= ailability ..."
Can = you provide the quote from this or other SFC OAM document that defines the = SFC availability? I've been asking for one to no avail. Thank you in ad= vance for clarifying this.
GIM>> "The relevant se= ctions also highlight the difference in SFC (For example, what is availabil= ity in terms of SF)."
So, do you believe that SFC availability has some differences from SF ava= ilability? What are they? Is there a difference in measuring method or meas= urement units between the availability of an SFC and an SF? Please clarify.=

=C2=A0

Also, it is not clear ho= w the last bullet "Proactively test alternate or protected paths to en= sure reliability of network configurations" is specific to and require= s the use of a connectivity function and why it cannot be addressed by, for example, continuity check function.<= /u>

=C2=A0

<Authors> Thanks f= or highlighting this. We will add the same point under Section 4.2. Hope th= at satisfies your concern.

GIM>&= gt; Not really. Section 4.1 opens with "Connectivity is mainly an on-d= emand function ..." and closes with "Proactively test alternate o= r protected paths ..". That draws the question How on-demand function = can be used to proactively monitor a path? Perhaps you can add an example.<= /div>
=

=C2=A0

Also, the very last sent= ence of Section 4.1 concludes that ICMP in SFC "can be used for basic = OAM functions". But I cannot find anywhere in the document where the t= erm, notion of "basic OAM functions" has been discussed or defined. Which functions considered as basic? ICMP can be use= d as the fault management tool, to some extent because it is relatively pro= cessing extensive, but its value in performance monitoring is very low. Is = PM OAM not part of the basic OAM functions?

=C2=A0

<Authors> Thanks. = To avoid any confusion, we modified it as below. Does the below modificatio= n help?

=C2=A0

"It could be observ= ed that ICMP at its current stage may not be able

=C2=A0=C2=A0 to perform = all required SFC OAM functions, but as explained above, it

=C2=A0=C2=A0 can be used= for some of the connectivity functions."

GIM>> The text is an improvement, thank you. But it refer= s to "all required SFC OAM functions&= quot; and I cannot find such list in the document. Can you propose another = text?

=C2=A0

=C2=A0

Section 6.4.2, in my opi= nion, may provide some context to how to interpret the use of "availab= ility". From "BFD or S-BFD could be leveraged to perform SF or SF= C availability" it appears that the availability is viewed as part of Fault Management OAM. (I'm still awaiting a response= to my earlier questions specifically on the interpretation of "availa= bility" in the OAM Framework for SFC.

=C2=A0

<Authors> Thanks, = this looks like a valid point. We can change the same as below:

=C2=A0

"BFD or S-BFD could= be leveraged to perform continuity function for SF or SFC."

GIM>> Thank you, that works.=C2=A0

=

=C2=A0

Further, in Section 6.4.= 2 the possible use is described as "Upon receiving the control packet,= the last SFF in the SFC will reply back with relevant DIAG code." But= this is not how BFD in the Asynchronous mode operates, that is how only S-BFD works. The first sentence of the second p= aragraph refers to both BFD and S-BFD. But the rest of the paragraph descri= bes the operation of S-BFD only, not of BFD in Asynchronous mode. I believe= that either the positioning statement must be modified or explanation of the operation of BFD in Asynchronous mo= de over SFP provided.

=C2=A0

<Authors> The inte= ntion is not to explain how it works for each BFD mode. But to explain the = common behavior. AFAIK/R, setting relevant DIAG code in the response packet= is common for both BFD and S-BFD. So we dont see any confusion here.

GIM>>= ; I am not saying that there's "any confusion", I'm point= ing to clear technical mistake in the description of how BFD in Asynchronou= s mode operates. You may split the description of the mechanism for BFD and= S-BFD or find another way to fix the erroneous text.=C2=A0

=C2=A0

=C2=A0

Section 6.4.3 includes t= he statement about the applicability of iOAM to availability: "In-Situ= OAM could be used with O bit set to perform SF availability and SFC availa= bility or performance measurement." I interpret this conclusion as the indication that availability is considered as part = of the Fault Management OAM toolset. If that is the case, I question the va= lue of using one-way OAM for fault management because only the egress node = may have the state and even that is not demonstrated in existing iOAM documents. In order to detect path fa= ilure, a node must have information that can be used to detect the packet l= oss. That can be either monotonically increasing sequence numbers or the no= tion that packets must be arriving at pre-determined intervals. Which mechanism can be used by iOAM? Also, si= nce iOAM, in regard to availability, appears as single-way FM OAM mechanism= , that uses the actual data flow, what is its advantage comparing to, for e= xample, collecting and comparing counters from ingress and egress? In other words, even if the egress can d= etect the loss of its availability for the particular SFP, how such a notio= n can be used?

=C2=A0

<Authors> Section = 6.4 is all about the applicability of different tools. It neither concludes= nor prefers one over the other. How the data is collected, interpreted, us= ed for failure detection or signaled back to the Initiator are expected to be explained in the solution document tha= t proposes iOAM as the tool for SFC OAM. As mentioned in the document scope= , any solution specific info is outside the scope of this document and acco= rdingly we dont see a reason to include those details in this document.

GIM>> I cannot find in your response what is being detected by = iOAM. How, from OAM PoV, is the reception of iOAM packet at the edge SFF is= different from receiving any data packet of the same flow? Without the cle= arly stated distinction, without explaining the benefit of using iOAM for t= his function the statement has no technical foundation and doesn't stan= d.=C2=A0

=C2=A0

I, again, have to point = out that Section 6.4.4 references the individual draft that had expired 3+ = years ago. Usually, that is the indication that neither authors nor the com= munity are interested in the idea.

=C2=A0

<Authors> This was= already clarified by Carlos in different thread. The concept in the draft = is already implemented and available in ODL.

GIM>> I cannot evaluate how the implementation is compared = to the long-ago expired draft, so using that draft as the reference is not = helpful to a reader. Can yu find another source?

=C2=A0

Hope the above clarifies your queries. We are addres= sing the agreed comments and editorial comments that you raised in the othe= r thread. We will submit a new version with the fixes.

=C2=A0

Thanks,

Nagendra

=C2=A0

=C2=A0

From: = sfc <sfc-bounces@ietf.org> o= n behalf of Greg Mirsky <gregimirsky@gmail.com>
Date: Monday, July 22, 2019 at 10:44 AM
To: James Guichard <james.n.guichard@futurewei.com>
Cc: "sfc@ietf= .org" <sfc@ie= tf.org>
Subject: Re: [sfc] WG Last Call draft-ietf-sfc-oam-framework-06

=C2=A0

Dear Jim, Joe, et al.,

I'd like to share my comments on Section of 6.4 = of the draft. Much appreciate your consideration and response to my questio= ns.

  • in regard to the applicability of ICMP the statement in Section 4.1.1 is &q= uot;ICMP could be leveraged for connectivity function (defined in Section 4= .1) to verify the availability of SF or SFC." When I looked through Se= ction 4.1 I find some discussion of a Fault Management function but no clear definition of what is connectivity verifi= cation in SFC. More so, it appears that connectivity verification is being = mixed with re-ordering detection, Path MTU Discovery, data integrity monito= ring, and some sort of policy verification. Real kitchen sink. At the same time, in other documents on network OAM, co= nnectivity verification has been firmly defined as a function that verifies= that data have been received only form the expected source over the expect= ed path. In conjunction with this, a misconnection error is defined to indicate that packets from another con= nection have been received. In other words, the connectivity verification f= unction verifies not only that packets from A reach node B but that they ar= rive only on the red wire, not on blue or yellow. Said all that, the interpretation of connectivity function= in SFC may be different but, in my opinion, Section 4.1 does not provide a= nything. Also, it is not clear how the last bullet "Proactively test a= lternate or protected paths to ensure reliability of network configurations" is specific to and requires th= e use of a connectivity function and why it cannot be addressed by, for exa= mple, continuity check function.
  • Also, the very last sentence of Section 4.1 concludes that ICMP in SFC &quo= t;can be used for basic OAM functions". But I cannot find anywhere in = the document where the term, notion of "basic OAM functions" has = been discussed or defined. Which functions considered as basic? ICMP can be used as the fault management tool, to some extent be= cause it is relatively processing extensive, but its value in performance m= onitoring is very low. Is PM OAM not part of the basic OAM functions?
  • Section 6.4.2, in my opinion, may provide some context to how to interpret = the use of "availability". From "BFD or S-BFD could be lever= aged to perform SF or SFC availability" it appears that the availabili= ty is viewed as part of Fault Management OAM. (I'm still awaiting a response to my earlier questions specifically on the interpreta= tion of "availability" in the OAM Framework for SFC.
  • Further, in Section 6.4.2 the possible use is described as "Upon recei= ving the control packet, the last SFF in the SFC will reply back with relev= ant DIAG code." But this is not how BFD in the Asynchronous mode opera= tes, that is how only S-BFD works. The first sentence of the second paragraph refers to both BFD and S-BFD. But the res= t of the paragraph describes the operation of S-BFD only, not of BFD in Asy= nchronous mode. I believe that either the positioning statement must be mod= ified or explanation of the operation of BFD in Asynchronous mode over SFP provided.
  • Section 6.4.3 includes the statement about the applicability of iOAM to ava= ilability: "In-Situ OAM could be used with O bit set to perform SF ava= ilability and SFC availability or performance measurement." I interpre= t this conclusion as the indication that availability is considered as part of the Fault Management OAM toolset. If that is the = case, I question the value of using one-way OAM for fault management becaus= e only the egress node may have the state and even that is not demonstrated= in existing iOAM documents. In order to detect path failure, a node must have information that can be use= d to detect the packet loss. That can be either monotonically increasing se= quence numbers or the notion that packets must be arriving at pre-determine= d intervals. Which mechanism can be used by iOAM? Also, since iOAM, in regard to availability, appears as s= ingle-way FM OAM mechanism, that uses the actual data flow, what is its adv= antage comparing to, for example, collecting and comparing counters from in= gress and egress? In other words, even if the egress can detect the loss of its availability for the particu= lar SFP, how such a notion can be used?
  • I, again, have to point out that Section 6.4.4 references the individual dr= aft that had expired 3+ years ago. Usually, that is the indication that nei= ther authors nor the community are interested in the idea.

Regards,

Greg

=C2=A0

On Tue, May 28, 2019 at 10:37 AM James Guichard <= james.n= .guichard@futurewei.com> wrote:

Dear WG:=

=C2=A0

This message starts a new two= week WG Last Call on advancing https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-= ietf-sfc-oam-framework/ for publication as an Informational RFC.

=C2=A0

Substantive comments and stat= ements of support for publishing this document should be directed to the ma= iling list. Editorial suggestions can be sent to the authors.=C2=A0 This la= st call will end on 11th June 2019.

=C2=A0

Thanks!<= /p>

=C2=A0

Jim & Joel<= /span>

= =C2=A0

= =C2=A0

=C2=A0

= =C2=A0

_______________________________________________
sfc mailing list
sfc@ietf.org
htt= ps://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/sfc

--0000000000009f00f2058ee5c248-- From nobody Tue Jul 30 06:26:51 2019 Return-Path: X-Original-To: sfc@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: sfc@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9A06E120150 for ; Tue, 30 Jul 2019 06:26:49 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.897 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.897 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, HTTPS_HTTP_MISMATCH=0.1, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE=-0.0001, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=gmail.com Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id fTYDPXcWjJa4 for ; Tue, 30 Jul 2019 06:26:47 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail-lf1-x12d.google.com (mail-lf1-x12d.google.com [IPv6:2a00:1450:4864:20::12d]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id DF5AB120168 for ; Tue, 30 Jul 2019 06:26:46 -0700 (PDT) Received: by mail-lf1-x12d.google.com with SMTP id p197so44688586lfa.2 for ; Tue, 30 Jul 2019 06:26:46 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20161025; h=mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date:message-id:subject:to :cc; bh=BFI/ONFcoJD5DfrnksSpQkJgccg0zbSsz6uRtLtVsl8=; b=ocQ6GEg8MliaNc9ygyofWRBHyvSK1C8x1fn1Gsm6/B47dWPTVQWYptIQ/Sl/4fLdP8 vRIOiX0P0BXyFLyXm7+NhJEWPVZ8gA7ZrHlej4vcMX+VNGzQ7+T3W7eWK3kXmsCkfNVE SZz7/bpzX1sf5fKPgJseuxHg7AWI6KALhOTP0FVUnWkeTDijKFLSYTasTSqyFjcQXMN5 csEijr2/E1b3nuiYDHVMH3OCqejcxMoW15xrtaY8m3SRgARGEbHhUgY7oZPubDwgWugC XIwLGGS98A0SJ9qDKILEz1OSEViwxSJXuZ1H86Am+aqnjsSmCEFlK5PXjsp3rhC96ysK 83qg== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date :message-id:subject:to:cc; bh=BFI/ONFcoJD5DfrnksSpQkJgccg0zbSsz6uRtLtVsl8=; b=mPZ9+/Rfdwssl5cgHkdfcIe0y+8vtrWstCpR9QoNYWNp0aF5cUA4F7LyTwAIzMokpW 7UeFjucid41r/uKMdBGQ+o/Ss1j2CjSlCdWR0YqAjXE19RhRgzLFmiX4S8NSDDT6l+2W zvPQFWBDdzsK2TSFPSDqpkWO2ADZVl2sAMyo1Ine8TQKHkB7xN/LrPxpln5q7uRTDCgH qnuI64JmfOvfivAovDcAHKtaSBKGjrKSKu82+7MXS7/JJtzWD0x3DZ/96rGA5vaKUAvn TfDK+a/lF3xN9j2wtW4XQnMU0yAsUOv1EQeEuNPZ+EP2Y+T29fz51TRJ1mV0XvQjqcn5 9zmA== X-Gm-Message-State: APjAAAVgqQt1qK8beGUI6KiRKueOhBIV/8xwxcdO4c+mkMXaD05nsQ9h MtlwpR2rIPxm1sBeaB/AouD5CJlljuua+uKSxFY= X-Google-Smtp-Source: APXvYqzo24mxhsjETwb4No1FyX5s3balBtDCSyQoOiEmfO+OdPtrZmBHL9vjSlsJUv+MOIMIlvZP1C+yFDiDR0LRUFA= X-Received: by 2002:a19:c711:: with SMTP id x17mr54850105lff.147.1564493204866; Tue, 30 Jul 2019 06:26:44 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 References: In-Reply-To: From: Greg Mirsky Date: Tue, 30 Jul 2019 09:26:34 -0400 Message-ID: To: "Carlos Pignataro (cpignata)" Cc: James Guichard , "sfc@ietf.org" Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="000000000000bad201058ee5f536" Archived-At: Subject: Re: [sfc] WG Last Call draft-ietf-sfc-oam-framework-06 X-BeenThere: sfc@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: Network Service Chaining List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 30 Jul 2019 13:26:49 -0000 --000000000000bad201058ee5f536 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Dear Jim, Joel, Editors, and All, -010 version was published recently. I was quite surprised to find that the discussion of O&M in SFC, i.e., SFC manageability, is now in its own section. To confuse things even more, Editors kept the original title of the table that lists various management tools: Table 4: OAM Tool GAP Analysis. That raises several questions: - How O&M tools related to the scope of the document on OAM? - Are Editors committed to resolving comments or hope that a commentator would not check back? I'm asking that last question because none of my comments from this note has been addressed by the recent update. Regards, Greg On Fri, Jul 12, 2019 at 9:24 AM Carlos Pignataro (cpignata) < cpignata@cisco.com> wrote: > Thank you for your comments, Greg. > > Please see inline. > > On Jul 11, 2019, at 8:36 PM, Greg Mirsky wrote: > > Dear Jim, Joel, et al. > I'd like to share my comments and questions to Section 5 Gap Analysis: > > - in Table 3 raises some questions: > - E-OAM is not expanded, nor referenced in the rest of the documen= t > - MPLS_PM is not expanded, nor referenced in the rest of the > document > - IPPM is expanded in Terminology but it is not clear how IP > Performance Metrics are relevant to Performance Monitoring OAM solu= tions > - NVo3 OAM - it is not clear what is included in it, especially > since there are no WG documents in NVO3 WG on OAM and the discussio= n of > encapsulation of an active OAM in Geneve is about to begin > - the title on the next page refers to Table 4: OAM Tool GAP > Analysis (contd.) > - one row assigned for SFC. Here, I think, maybe some mixed > terminology. In Introduction SFC is for Service Function Chaining w= hile in > Terminology it is expanded as Service Function Chain. I recommend > reassigning the row to SFP. > - Configuration (the first column) in Table 4 is usually not > considered as part of OAM. And neither Orchestration or Topology > (discovery). I recommend removing that portion of the table from th= e > document altogether. > - also, Why the same readily available tools that provide Topology > (discovery) and Notifications for overlay and underlay networks can= not be > used for SF and SFC/SFP? > > > Great points on the terminology ad acronym mis-uses. These should be > fixed. From expanding PM and fixing SFC=E2=80=99s expansion to explaining= for IPPM > is the protocols not the metrics. > > It appears that the conclusion expressed in section 5.2 contradicts the > discussion in some of the further sections, for example, sections 6.4.1 a= nd > 6.4.2. > Section 5.3 Required OAM Functions refers to O&M, not OAM functions in th= e > following: > > Configuration, orchestration and manageability of SF and SFC could be > performed using CLI, NETCONF, etc. > > Since the scope of the document includes only SFC OAM, not O&M (RFC 6291 > explains the variances of OAM soup > in great details), I recommend removing the sentence. > > > On configuration, I am OK removing the table column and sentence. I=E2=80= =99m also > OK moving that paragraph (and the one that follows) to a Manageability > Considerations section. > > Does the WG have a preference? > > Thanks, > > Carlos. > > Regards, > Greg > > > On Tue, May 28, 2019 at 7:37 AM James Guichard < > james.n.guichard@futurewei.com> wrote: > >> Dear WG: >> >> >> This message starts a new two week WG Last Call on advancing >> https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-sfc-oam-framework/ >> >> for publication as an Informational RFC. >> >> >> Substantive comments and statements of support for publishing this >> document should be directed to the mailing list. Editorial suggestions c= an >> be sent to the authors. This last call will end on 11th June 2019. >> >> >> Thanks! >> >> >> Jim & Joel >> >> >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> sfc mailing list >> sfc@ietf.org >> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/sfc >> > _______________________________________________ > sfc mailing list > sfc@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/sfc > > > --000000000000bad201058ee5f536 Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Dear Jim, Joel, Editors, and All,
-01= 0 version was published recently. I was quite surprised to find that the di= scussion of O&M in SFC, i.e., SFC manageability, is now in its own sect= ion. To confuse things even more, Editors kept the original title of the ta= ble that lists various management tools:=C2=A0Table 4: OAM Tool GAP Analysi= s. That raises several questions:
  • How O&M tools relat= ed to the scope of the document on OAM?
  • Are Editors committed to re= solving comments or hope that a commentator would not check back?
=
I'm asking that last question because none of my comments from thi= s note has been addressed by the recent update.

<= div>Regards,
Greg

On Fri, Jul 12, 2019 at 9:24 AM Carlos Pig= nataro (cpignata) <cpignata@cisco.= com> wrote:
Thank you for your comments, Greg.

Please see inline.

On Jul 11, 2019, at 8:36 PM, Greg Mirsky <gregimirsky@gmail.com> wrote:
Dear Jim, Joel, et al.
I'd like to share my comments and questions to Section 5 Gap Analy= sis:
  • in Table 3 raises some questions:
    • E-OAM is=C2=A0 not expanded, nor referenced in the rest of the document=
    • MPLS_PM is=C2=A0 not expanded, nor referenced in the rest of the d= ocument
    • IPPM is expanded in Terminology but it is not clear how IP = Performance Metrics are relevant to Performance Monitoring OAM solutions
    • NVo3 OAM - it is not clear what is included in it, especially since t= here are no WG documents in NVO3 WG on OAM and the discussion of encapsulat= ion of an active OAM in Geneve is about to begin
    • the title on the n= ext page refers to=C2=A0Table 4: OAM Tool GAP Analysis (contd.)
    • one= row assigned for SFC. Here, I think, maybe some mixed terminology. In Intr= oduction SFC is for Service Function Chaining while in Terminology it is ex= panded as Service Function Chain. I recommend reassigning the row to SFP.
    • Configuration (the first column) in Table 4 is usually not considere= d as part of OAM. And neither Orchestration or Topology (discovery). I reco= mmend removing that portion of the table from the document altogether.
      • =
    • also, Why the same readily available tools that provide Topology (disco= very) and Notifications for overlay and underlay networks cannot be used fo= r SF and SFC/SFP?

Great points on the terminology ad acronym mis-uses. These should be f= ixed. From expanding PM and fixing SFC=E2=80=99s expansion to explaining fo= r IPPM is the protocols not the metrics.

It appears that the conclusion expressed in section 5.2 contradicts th= e discussion in some of the further sections, for example, sections 6.4.1 a= nd 6.4.2.
Section 5.3 Required OAM Functions refers to O&M, not OAM function= s in the following:
=C2=A0 =C2=A0Configuration, orchestration and manageability of SF and = SFC could be
=C2=A0 =C2=A0performed using CLI, NETCONF, etc.
Since the scope of the document includes only SFC OAM, not O&M (RFC 6291 exp= lains the variances of OAM soup in great details), I recommend removing the= sentence.


On configuration, I am OK removing the table column and sentence. I=E2= =80=99m also OK moving that paragraph (and the one that follows) to a Manag= eability Considerations section.

Does the WG have a preference?

Thanks,

Carlos.

Regards,
Greg


On Tue, May 28, 2019 at 7:37 AM James= Guichard <james.n.guichard@futurewei.com> wrote:

Dear WG:

=C2=A0

This message start= s a new two week WG Last Call on advancing https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-sfc-oam-framework/ for publication as an Informational RFC.

=C2=A0

Substantive commen= ts and statements of support for publishing this document should be directe= d to the mailing list. Editorial suggestions can be sent to the authors.=C2= =A0 This last call will end on 11th June 2019.

=C2=A0

Thanks!

=C2=A0

Jim & Joel





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X-MS-Exchange-Transport-CrossTenantHeadersStamped: CH2PR13MB3704 Archived-At: Subject: Re: [sfc] WG Last Call draft-ietf-sfc-oam-framework-06 X-BeenThere: sfc@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: Network Service Chaining List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 30 Jul 2019 22:31:18 -0000 --_000_CH2PR13MB3608DFF8C20A51A8B2FC4B4ED2DC0CH2PR13MB3608namp_ Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64 RGVhciBHcmVnLA0KDQpGb3Igb3V0c3RhbmRpbmcgaXNzdWVzIHRoYXQgeW91IGZlZWwgYXJlIG5v dCBhZGRyZXNzZWQgaW4gdi0xMCBvZiB0aGlzIGRvY3VtZW50LCBwbGVhc2UgcHJvdmlkZSBhIGRl dGFpbGVkIGxpc3Qgb2YgaXRlbXMgKHdpdGggc3BlY2lmaWMgc3VnZ2VzdGlvbnMgb24gdGV4dHVh bCBjaGFuZ2VzIGlmIHJlcXVpcmVkKSBzbyB0aGF0IHRoZSBlZGl0b3JzIG1heSByZXNwb25kIG9u IHRoZSBtYWlsaW5nIGxpc3QgdG8gZWFjaCBpdGVtIGFuZCBob3BlZnVsbHkgd2UgY2FuIGNvbWUg dG8gYSB0aW1lbHkgcmVzb2x1dGlvbi4NCg0KVGhhbmsgeW91LA0KDQpKaW0NCg0KDQoNCkZyb206 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