From smythc@avaya.com  Tue Jun  2 05:56:42 2009
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Date: Tue, 2 Jun 2009 13:56:31 +0100
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Thread-Topic: [Simple] Partial Publication of elements with more than oneinstance possible
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From: "Smyth, Colm (Colm)" <smythc@avaya.com>
To: "Pankaj Munjal" <pankaj.munjal@gmail.com>
Cc: simple <simple@ietf.org>
Subject: Re: [Simple] Partial Publication of elements with more than oneinstance possible
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Hi Pankaj,

Many PIDF elements (including timed-status, but see Table 1 in RPID for
a longer list) can be distinguished by their from/until attributes, but
there is nothing to preclude peer elements having overlapping or even
identical time ranges.

As a result, timed-status has (and I believe requires) no guaranteed
unique identifier within the model; for operations that require one, you
can use XPath.

All the best,
Colm Smyth
Lead/Architect - Avaya Aura Presence Services | Unified Communications

-----Original Message-----
From: Pankaj Munjal [mailto:pankaj.munjal@gmail.com]=20
Sent: 01 June 2009 05:53
To: Smyth, Colm (Colm)
Cc: simple
Subject: Re: [Simple] Partial Publication of elements with more than
oneinstance possible

Hello Colm,

Thanks for the clarification.
For <note> and <display-name> xml:lang can be used.
But how about <timed-status> element?
According to RFC 4481, Section 3:
"More than one such element MAY appear within   a PIDF <tuple> element."

In this case, what shall be the unique identifier for any instance of
"timed-status"?

Regards,
Pankaj

On 3/12/09, Smyth, Colm (Colm) <smythc@avaya.com> wrote:
> Hi Panjaj,
>
> Each instance of <note> and <display-name> is distinguished by a=20
> locale (xml:lang).
>
> All the best,
> Colm Smyth
> Lead/Architect - Avaya Communication Manager <NG> Presence Server |=20
> Unified Communications AVAYA | smythc@avaya.com | +353 1 656 7843=20
> (x37843)
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: simple-bounces@ietf.org [mailto:simple-bounces@ietf.org] On=20
> Behalf Of Pankaj Munjal
> Sent: 12 March 2009 06:15
> To: simple
> Subject: [Simple] Partial Publication of elements with more than=20
> oneinstance possible
>
> Hello all,
>
> According to the Presence RFCs, there can be a few elements like=20
> <note>, <cipid>-<display_name> that can have multiple entries.
> However, they don't have ids associated with them to identify the=20
> instances.
>
> If my client is using partial publish to change values of one of such=20
> instances, then which instance shall be updated on the Server?
> (Assuming that my initial PUBLISH had more than one instance for such
> field)
>
> Is this scenario documented in some RFC/draft?
>
> Kindly suggest!
>
> Regards,
> Pankaj
> _______________________________________________
> Simple mailing list
> Simple@ietf.org
> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/simple
>


--
All the desirable things in life are either illegal, expensive,
fattening, or married to someone else!!

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--NextPart

A New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line Internet-Drafts directories.
This draft is a work item of the SIP for Instant Messaging and Presence Leveraging Extensions Working Group of the IETF.


	Title           : An Extensible Markup Language (XML) Document Format for Indicating A Change in XML Configuration Access Protocol (XCAP) Resources
	Author(s)       : J. Rosenberg, J. Urpalainen
	Filename        : draft-ietf-simple-xcap-diff-10.txt
	Pages           : 15
	Date            : 2009-06-22

This specification defines a document format that can be used to
indicate that a change has occurred in a document managed by the
Extensible Markup Language (XML) Configuration Access Protocol
(XCAP).  This format indicates the document that has changed and its
former and new entity tags.  It also can indicate the specific change
that was made in the document, using an XML patch format.  This
format allows also indications of element and attribute content of an
XML document.  XCAP diff documents can be delivered to clients using
a number of means, including a Session Initiation Protocol (SIP)
event package.

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--NextPart

A New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line Internet-Drafts directories.
This draft is a work item of the SIP for Instant Messaging and Presence Leveraging Extensions Working Group of the IETF.


	Title           : Presence Interdomain Scaling Analysis for SIP/SIMPLE
	Author(s)       : A. Houri, et al.
	Filename        : draft-ietf-simple-interdomain-scaling-analysis-06.txt
	Pages           : 62
	Date            : 2009-06-23

The document analyzes the traffic that is generated due to presence
subscriptions between domains.  It is shown that the amount of
traffic can be extremely big.  In addition to the very large traffic
the document also analyzes the affects of a large presence system on
the memory footprint and the CPU load.  Current approved and in work
optimizations to the SIP protocol are analyzed with the possible
impact on the load.  Separate documents contain the requirements for
optimizations and suggestions for new optimizations.

A URL for this Internet-Draft is:
http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-ietf-simple-interdomain-scaling-analysis-06.txt

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From wwwrun@core3.amsl.com  Tue Jun 23 08:07:19 2009
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Subject: [Simple] Last Call: draft-ietf-simple-interdomain-scaling-analysis (Presence Interdomain Scaling Analysis for SIP/SIMPLE) to Informational RFC
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The IESG has received a request from the SIP for Instant Messaging and 
Presence Leveraging Extensions WG (simple) to consider the following
document:

- 'Presence Interdomain Scaling Analysis for SIP/SIMPLE '
   <draft-ietf-simple-interdomain-scaling-analysis-06.txt> as an
Informational RFC

The IESG plans to make a decision in the next few weeks, and solicits
final comments on this action.  Please send substantive comments to the
ietf@ietf.org mailing lists by 2009-07-07. Exceptionally, 
comments may be sent to iesg@ietf.org instead. In either case, please 
retain the beginning of the Subject line to allow automated sorting.

The file can be obtained via
http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-ietf-simple-interdomain-scaling-analysis-06.txt


IESG discussion can be tracked via
https://datatracker.ietf.org/public/pidtracker.cgi?command=view_id&dTag=15780&rfc_flag=0


From rjsparks@nostrum.com  Tue Jun 23 09:04:12 2009
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This document is now in iETF LC.

When we address any other LC comments, we need to update the reference  
from draft-niemi-sipping-event-throttle to draft-ietf-sipcore-event- 
rate-control.

RjS

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--NextPart

A New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line Internet-Drafts directories.
This draft is a work item of the SIP for Instant Messaging and Presence Leveraging Extensions Working Group of the IETF.


	Title           : An Extensible Markup Language (XML) Document Format for Indicating A Change in XML Configuration Access Protocol (XCAP) Resources
	Author(s)       : J. Rosenberg, J. Urpalainen
	Filename        : draft-ietf-simple-xcap-diff-11.txt
	Pages           : 16
	Date            : 2009-06-24

This specification defines a document format that can be used to
indicate that a change has occurred in a document managed by the
Extensible Markup Language (XML) Configuration Access Protocol
(XCAP).  This format indicates the document that has changed and its
former and new entity tags.  It also can indicate the specific change
that was made in the document, using an XML patch format.  This
format allows also indications of element and attribute content of an
XML document.  XCAP diff documents can be delivered to clients using
a number of means, including a Session Initiation Protocol (SIP)
event package.

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From HKaplan@acmepacket.com  Thu Jun 25 11:34:28 2009
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From: Hadriel Kaplan <HKaplan@acmepacket.com>
To: Christer Holmberg <christer.holmberg@ericsson.com>, Adam Roach <adam@nostrum.com>, Ben Campbell <ben@estacado.net>
Date: Thu, 25 Jun 2009 14:33:26 -0400
Thread-Topic: [Simple] What ACM is all about [was: RE: MSRP-ACM compatibility]
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Subject: Re: [Simple] What ACM is all about [was: RE: MSRP-ACM compatibility]
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> -----Original Message-----
> From: simple-bounces@ietf.org [mailto:simple-bounces@ietf.org] On Behalf
> Of Christer Holmberg
> Sent: Wednesday, May 20, 2009 6:19 PM
>=20
> Unlike NAT behavior, there is no existing ACM behavior, so we don't need
> to make assumptions on how intermediates work regarding ACM.

Not to argue against the general sentiment of your points in this thread, b=
ut to be totally accurate, there *is* existing ACM behavior for intermediar=
ies - in the sense that many intermediaries already support msrp-acm-00, be=
cause they already support Comedia/rfc4145/rfc4572, which afaict acm-00 ess=
entially follows and thus they get "for free".  There are at least 3 differ=
ent middlebox vendors which support it, and something in the ballpark of 5k=
-10k deployed middlebox systems which support it right now, fwiw.

Whether there are any deployed *UA's* which do msrp-acm-00 for MSRP, I don'=
t know. (I've been told there are, but I don't know how many)=20

-hadriel

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--NextPart

A New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line Internet-Drafts directories.
This draft is a work item of the SIP for Instant Messaging and Presence Leveraging Extensions Working Group of the IETF.


	Title           : An Extensible Markup Language (XML) Document Format for Indicating A Change in XML Configuration Access Protocol (XCAP) Resources
	Author(s)       : J. Rosenberg, J. Urpalainen
	Filename        : draft-ietf-simple-xcap-diff-12.txt
	Pages           : 16
	Date            : 2009-06-26

This specification defines a document format that can be used to
indicate that a change has occurred in a document managed by the
Extensible Markup Language (XML) Configuration Access Protocol
(XCAP).  This format indicates the document that has changed and its
former and new entity tags.  It also can indicate the specific change
that was made in the document, using an XML patch format.  This
format allows also indications of element and attribute content of an
XML document.  XCAP diff documents can be delivered to clients using
a number of means, including a Session Initiation Protocol (SIP)
event package.

A URL for this Internet-Draft is:
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From ben@nostrum.com  Mon Jun 29 08:33:24 2009
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Subject: [Simple] Initial Draft Preapproval
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(as chair)

Hi All,

If anyone plans to submit an initial (i.e. 00) SIMPLE draft prior to  
the cutoff (6 July), please let the chairs know ASAP. Today, if at all  
possible.

For the record, I am not aware of any planned 00 drafts--so if you  
think we should already know about it, please remind us.

Thanks!

Ben.

From ben@nostrum.com  Mon Jun 29 08:45:03 2009
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My last sentence should have read

  "...so if you are planning one, and think we should already know  
about it..."

Thanks!

Ben (who apparently can't write today.)

On Jun 29, 2009, at 10:33 AM, Ben Campbell wrote:

> (as chair)
>
> Hi All,
>
> If anyone plans to submit an initial (i.e. 00) SIMPLE draft prior to  
> the cutoff (6 July), please let the chairs know ASAP. Today, if at  
> all possible.
>
> For the record, I am not aware of any planned 00 drafts--so if you  
> think we should already know about it, please remind us.
>
> Thanks!
>
> Ben.
> _______________________________________________
> Simple mailing list
> Simple@ietf.org
> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/simple


From ben@nostrum.com  Mon Jun 29 08:49:29 2009
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We currently have an agenda request from Christer (msrp-acm draft). Is  
there anything else we need to discuss in Stockholm?

Thanks!

Ben.

From gunnar.hellstrom@omnitor.se  Mon Jun 29 14:26:44 2009
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A draft on how to do real-time text based on MSRP was discussed a year =
ago,
as specified in=20
draft-hellstrom-simple-text-transmission-00.txt

The desired effect for real-time text could be achieved by specifying =
that
sequentially received text chunks and messages shall be presented =
adjacent
to each other if it is not ended by any presentation control character.  =
 =20
And an encouragement to transmit text in chunks of a suitable length. =
300 ms
or 1 sec were discussed.

The draft has timed out.

Now, real-time text implementations appear in more and more =
implementations,
and the old way to do messaging sentence-wise is not so dominating =
anymore.
Therefore there might be interest to complete the real-time text =
definition
for the MSRP environment.=20

If so, the draft could be revived and the discussion points revisited.
( The discussions were around:=20
	-Is it appropriate to use the chunk mechanism as transport borders.=20
	-How is real-time text capability in MSRP declared at SDP level so
that it can be negotiated in presence=20
	of multiple opportunities to code real-time text.
	-Is it feasible to transmit three chunks per second, or should it be
limited to a pseudo-real-time mode
	 with one second between transmissions. )

Is there any interest to revive this discussion?

Gunnar =20

-------------------------------------------------------------------
Gunnar Hellstr=F6m
Omnitor
gunnar.hellstrom@omnitor.se
Tel: +46708204288
www.omnitor.se

-----Original Message-----
From: simple-bounces@ietf.org [mailto:simple-bounces@ietf.org] On Behalf =
Of
Ben Campbell
Sent: Monday, June 29, 2009 5:50 PM
To: Simple WG
Subject: [Simple] SIMPLE Agenda Requests for IETF75

We currently have an agenda request from Christer (msrp-acm draft). Is =
there
anything else we need to discuss in Stockholm?

Thanks!

Ben.
_______________________________________________
Simple mailing list
Simple@ietf.org
https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/simple

__________ NOD32 4196 (20090629) Information __________

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From ben@nostrum.com  Mon Jun 29 15:08:19 2009
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Hi Gunnar,

Are you proposing this as an agenda item, or just in general? It =20
doesn't seem to be appropriate as an agenda item given that there's =20
been no discussion on the mail list in over a year.

If you have new information or proposals, and would like to update the =20=

draft to engage in future list discussion, by all means do so.

Thanks!

Ben.


On Jun 29, 2009, at 4:27 PM, Gunnar Hellstrom wrote:

> A draft on how to do real-time text based on MSRP was discussed a =20
> year ago,
> as specified in
> draft-hellstrom-simple-text-transmission-00.txt
>
> The desired effect for real-time text could be achieved by =20
> specifying that
> sequentially received text chunks and messages shall be presented =20
> adjacent
> to each other if it is not ended by any presentation control =20
> character.
> And an encouragement to transmit text in chunks of a suitable =20
> length. 300 ms
> or 1 sec were discussed.
>
> The draft has timed out.
>
> Now, real-time text implementations appear in more and more =20
> implementations,
> and the old way to do messaging sentence-wise is not so dominating =20
> anymore.
> Therefore there might be interest to complete the real-time text =20
> definition
> for the MSRP environment.
>
> If so, the draft could be revived and the discussion points revisited.
> ( The discussions were around:
> 	-Is it appropriate to use the chunk mechanism as transport =
borders.
> 	-How is real-time text capability in MSRP declared at SDP level =
so
> that it can be negotiated in presence
> 	of multiple opportunities to code real-time text.
> 	-Is it feasible to transmit three chunks per second, or should =
it be
> limited to a pseudo-real-time mode
> 	 with one second between transmissions. )
>
> Is there any interest to revive this discussion?
>
> Gunnar
>
> -------------------------------------------------------------------
> Gunnar Hellstr=F6m
> Omnitor
> gunnar.hellstrom@omnitor.se
> Tel: +46708204288
> www.omnitor.se
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: simple-bounces@ietf.org [mailto:simple-bounces@ietf.org] On =20
> Behalf Of
> Ben Campbell
> Sent: Monday, June 29, 2009 5:50 PM
> To: Simple WG
> Subject: [Simple] SIMPLE Agenda Requests for IETF75
>
> We currently have an agenda request from Christer (msrp-acm draft). =20=

> Is there
> anything else we need to discuss in Stockholm?
>
> Thanks!
>
> Ben.
> _______________________________________________
> Simple mailing list
> Simple@ietf.org
> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/simple
>
> __________ NOD32 4196 (20090629) Information __________
>
> Detta meddelande dr genomsvkt av NOD32 Antivirus.
> http://www.nod32.com
>
>


From root@core3.amsl.com  Tue Jun 30 01:00:01 2009
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Subject: [Simple] I-D Action:draft-ietf-simple-xcap-diff-13.txt
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--NextPart

A New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line Internet-Drafts directories.
This draft is a work item of the SIP for Instant Messaging and Presence Leveraging Extensions Working Group of the IETF.


	Title           : An Extensible Markup Language (XML) Document Format for Indicating A Change in XML Configuration Access Protocol (XCAP) Resources
	Author(s)       : J. Rosenberg, J. Urpalainen
	Filename        : draft-ietf-simple-xcap-diff-13.txt
	Pages           : 16
	Date            : 2009-06-30

This specification defines a document format that can be used to
indicate that a change has occurred in a document managed by the
Extensible Markup Language (XML) Configuration Access Protocol
(XCAP).  This format indicates the document that has changed and its
former and new entity tags.  It also can indicate the specific change
that was made in the document, using an XML patch format.  This
format allows also indications of element and attribute content of an
XML document.  XCAP diff documents can be delivered to clients using
a number of means, including a Session Initiation Protocol (SIP)
event package.

A URL for this Internet-Draft is:
http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-ietf-simple-xcap-diff-13.txt

Internet-Drafts are also available by anonymous FTP at:
ftp://ftp.ietf.org/internet-drafts/

Below is the data which will enable a MIME compliant mail reader
implementation to automatically retrieve the ASCII version of the
Internet-Draft.

--NextPart
Content-Type: Message/External-body;
	name="draft-ietf-simple-xcap-diff-13.txt";
	site="ftp.ietf.org";
	access-type="anon-ftp";
	directory="internet-drafts"

Content-Type: text/plain
Content-ID: <2009-06-30005737.I-D@ietf.org>


--NextPart--