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From: Bret Jordan <jordan.ietf@gmail.com>
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Date: Sun, 3 Mar 2019 09:16:38 -0700
To: smart@irtf.org
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Subject: [Smart] Hacked by Crypto
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All,

If you will be at RSA this week, I will be giving a talk about various =
new technologies and standards and what they will mean for operational =
security.  Specifically, how could a threat actor, intrusion set, or =
crime syndicate use these technologies to advance their objectives.=20

The main topics will be:
DNSSEC
DANE
DoH/DoT
Opportunistic DoH
TLS1.3
ESNI
QUIC

=
https://www.rsaconference.com/events/us19/agenda/sessions/14434-hacked-by-=
crypto =
<https://www.rsaconference.com/events/us19/agenda/sessions/14434-hacked-by=
-crypto>


Thanks,
Bret
PGP Fingerprint: 63B4 FC53 680A 6B7D 1447  F2C0 74F8 ACAE 7415 0050
"Without cryptography vihv vivc ce xhrnrw, however, the only thing that =
can not be unscrambled is an egg."


--Apple-Mail=_74E8258E-8DC7-4110-975C-B2FF4B1D2532
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
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	charset=us-ascii

<html><head><meta http-equiv=3D"Content-Type" content=3D"text/html; =
charset=3Dus-ascii"></head><body style=3D"word-wrap: break-word; =
-webkit-nbsp-mode: space; line-break: after-white-space;" =
class=3D"">All,<div class=3D""><br class=3D""></div><div class=3D"">If =
you will be at RSA this week, I will be giving a talk about various new =
technologies and standards and what they will mean for operational =
security. &nbsp;Specifically, how could a threat actor, intrusion set, =
or crime syndicate use these technologies to advance their =
objectives.&nbsp;</div><div class=3D""><br class=3D""></div><div =
class=3D"">The main topics will be:</div><div class=3D"">DNSSEC</div><div =
class=3D"">DANE</div><div class=3D"">DoH/DoT</div><div =
class=3D"">Opportunistic DoH</div><div class=3D"">TLS1.3</div><div =
class=3D"">ESNI</div><div class=3D"">QUIC</div><div class=3D""><br =
class=3D""></div><div class=3D""><a =
href=3D"https://www.rsaconference.com/events/us19/agenda/sessions/14434-ha=
cked-by-crypto" =
class=3D"">https://www.rsaconference.com/events/us19/agenda/sessions/14434=
-hacked-by-crypto</a></div><div class=3D""><br class=3D""></div><div =
class=3D""><br class=3D""><div class=3D"">
<div style=3D"caret-color: rgb(0, 0, 0); color: rgb(0, 0, 0); =
font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 14px; font-style: normal; =
font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; =
orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: =
none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; =
-webkit-text-size-adjust: auto; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; =
text-decoration: none;"><div class=3D"" style=3D"orphans: 2; widows: 2; =
font-variant-ligatures: normal; font-variant-east-asian: normal; =
font-variant-position: normal; line-height: normal; =
-webkit-text-decorations-in-effect: none;"><span =
class=3D"Apple-style-span" style=3D"border-collapse: separate; =
font-variant-ligatures: normal; font-variant-east-asian: normal; =
font-variant-position: normal; line-height: normal; border-spacing: 0px; =
-webkit-text-decorations-in-effect: none;">Thanks,</span></div><div =
class=3D"" style=3D"orphans: 2; widows: 2; font-variant-ligatures: =
normal; font-variant-east-asian: normal; font-variant-position: normal; =
line-height: normal; -webkit-text-decorations-in-effect: none;"><span =
class=3D"Apple-style-span" style=3D"border-collapse: separate; =
font-variant-ligatures: normal; font-variant-east-asian: normal; =
font-variant-position: normal; line-height: normal; text-align: =
-webkit-auto; border-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-decorations-in-effect: =
none;">Bret</span></div><div class=3D"" style=3D"orphans: 2; widows: =
2;"><span class=3D"Apple-style-span" style=3D"border-collapse: separate; =
text-align: -webkit-auto; border-spacing: 0px;"><span =
class=3D"Apple-style-span" style=3D"border-collapse: separate; =
text-align: -webkit-auto; border-spacing: 0px;"><div class=3D"" =
style=3D"word-wrap: break-word; -webkit-nbsp-mode: space; line-break: =
after-white-space;"><span class=3D"Apple-style-span" =
style=3D"border-collapse: separate; text-align: -webkit-auto; =
border-spacing: 0px;"><div class=3D"" style=3D"word-wrap: break-word; =
-webkit-nbsp-mode: space; line-break: after-white-space;"><span =
class=3D"Apple-style-span" style=3D"border-collapse: separate; =
text-align: -webkit-auto; border-spacing: 0px;"><div class=3D"" =
style=3D"word-wrap: break-word; -webkit-nbsp-mode: space; line-break: =
after-white-space;"><span class=3D"Apple-style-span" =
style=3D"border-collapse: separate; text-align: -webkit-auto; =
border-spacing: 0px;"><div class=3D""><font color=3D"#7c7c7c" =
face=3D"Calibre, Verdana" class=3D"" style=3D"font-variant-ligatures: =
normal; font-variant-east-asian: normal; font-variant-position: normal; =
line-height: normal; -webkit-text-decorations-in-effect: none;"><span =
class=3D"" style=3D"font-size: 11px;">PGP =
Fingerprint:&nbsp;</span></font><span class=3D"" style=3D"text-align: =
-webkit-auto; font-size: 11px;"><font color=3D"#7c7c7c" face=3D"Calibre, =
Verdana" class=3D"">63B4 FC53 680A 6B7D 1447 &nbsp;F2C0 74F8 ACAE 7415 =
0050</font></span></div><div class=3D"" style=3D"font-variant-ligatures: =
normal; font-variant-east-asian: normal; font-variant-position: normal; =
line-height: normal; -webkit-text-decorations-in-effect: none;"><span =
class=3D"" style=3D"color: rgb(124, 124, 124); font-size: 8pt; =
font-family: Calibre, Verdana; text-align: -webkit-auto;">"Without =
cryptography vihv vivc ce xhrnrw, however, the only thing that can not =
be unscrambled is an =
egg."</span></div></span></div></span></div></span></div></span></span></d=
iv></div>
</div>

<br class=3D""></div></body></html>=

--Apple-Mail=_74E8258E-8DC7-4110-975C-B2FF4B1D2532--


From nobody Sun Mar  3 08:36:18 2019
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To: Bret Jordan <jordan.ietf@gmail.com>, smart@irtf.org
References: <D22C801A-F090-4081-A15F-103EBCEDB3E6@gmail.com>
From: Stephen Farrell <stephen.farrell@cs.tcd.ie>
Openpgp: id=5BB5A6EA5765D2C5863CAE275AB2FAF17B172BEA; url=
Autocrypt: addr=stephen.farrell@cs.tcd.ie; prefer-encrypt=mutual; keydata= mQINBFo9UDIBEADUH4ZPcUnX5WWRWO4kEkHea5Y5eEvZjSwe/YA+G0nrTuOU9nemCP5PMvmh 5Cg8gBTyWyN4Z2+O25p9Tja5zUb+vPMWYvOtokRrp46yhFZOmiS5b6kTq0IqYzsEv5HI58S+ QtaFq978CRa4xH9Gi9u4yzUmT03QNIGDXE37honcAM4MOEtEgvw4fVhVWJuyy3w//0F2tzKr EMjmL5VGuD/Q9+G/7abuXiYNNd9ZFjv4625AUWwy+pAh4EKzS1FE7BOZp9daMu9MUQmDqtZU bUv0Q+DnQAB/4tNncejJPz0p2z3MWCp5iSwHiQvytYgatMp34a50l6CWqa13n6vY8VcPlIqO Vz+7L+WiVfxLbeVqBwV+4uL9to9zLF9IyUvl94lCxpscR2kgRgpM6A5LylRDkR6E0oudFnJg b097ZaNyuY1ETghVB5Uir1GCYChs8NUNumTHXiOkuzk+Gs4DAHx/a78YxBolKHi+esLH8r2k 4LyM2lp5FmBKjG7cGcpBGmWavACYEa7rwAadg4uBx9SHMV5i33vDXQUZcmW0vslQ2Is02NMK 7uB7E7HlVE1IM1zNkVTYYGkKreU8DVQu8qNOtPVE/CdaCJ/pbXoYeHz2B1Nvbl9tlyWxn5Xi HzFPJleXc0ksb9SkJokAfwTSZzTxeQPER8la5lsEEPbU/cDTcwARAQABtDJTdGVwaGVuIEZh cnJlbGwgKDIwMTcpIDxzdGVwaGVuLmZhcnJlbGxAY3MudGNkLmllPokCQAQTAQgAKgIbAwUJ CZQmAAULCQgHAgYVCAkKCwIEFgIDAQIeAQIXgAUCWj6jdwIZAQAKCRBasvrxexcr6o7QD/9m x9DPJetmW794RXmNTrbTJ44zc/tJbcLdRBh0KBn9OW/EaAqjDmgNJeCMyJTKr1ywaps8HGUN hLEVkc14NUpgi4/Zkrbi3DmTp25OHj6wXBS5qVMyVynTMEIjOfeFFyxG+48od+Xn7qg6LT7G rHeNf+z/r0v9+8eZ1Ip63kshQDGhhpmRMKu4Ws9ZvTW2ACXkkTFaSGYJj3yIP4R6IgwBYGMz DXFX6nS4LA1s3pcPNxOgrvCyb60AiJZTLcOk/rRrpZtXB1XQc23ZZmrlTkl2HaThL6w3YKdi Ti1NbuMeOxZqtXcUshII45sANm4HuWNTiRh93Bn5bN6ddjgsaXEZBKUBuUaPBl7gQiQJcAlS 3MmGgVS4ZoX8+VaPGpXdQVFyBMRFlOKOC5XJESt7wY0RE2C8PFm+5eywSO/P1fkl9whkMgml 3OEuIQiP2ehRt/HVLMHkoM9CPQ7t6UwdrXrvX+vBZykav8x9U9M6KTgfsXytxUl6Vx5lPMLi 2/Jrsz6Mzh/IVZa3xjhq1OLFSI/tT2ji4FkJDQbO+yYUDhcuqfakDmtWLMxecZsY6O58A/95 8Qni6Xeq+Nh7zJ7wNcQOMoDGj+24di2TX1cKLzdDMWFaWzlNP5dB5VMwS9Wqj1Z6TzKjGjru q8soqohwb2CK9B3wzFg0Bs1iBI+2RuFnxLkCDQRaPVAyARAA+g3R0HzGr/Dl34Y07XqGqzq5 SU0nXIu9u8Ynsxj7gR5qb3HgUWYEWrHW2jHOByXnvkffucf5yzwrsvw8Q8iI8CFHiTYHPpey 4yPVn6R0w/FOMcY70eTIu/k6EEFDlDbs09DtKcrsT9bmN0XoRxITlXwWTufYqUnmS+YkAuk+ TLCtUin7OdaS2uU6Ata3PLQSeM2ZsUQMmYmHPwB9rmf+q2I005AJ9Q1SPQ2KNg/8xOGxo13S VuaSqYRQdpV93RuCOzg4vuXtR+gP0KQrus/P2ZCEPvU9cXF/2MIhXgOz207lv3iE2zGyNXld /n8spvWk+0bH5Zqd9Wcba/rGcBhmX9NKKDARZqjkv/zVEP1X97w1HsNYeUFNcg2lk9zQKb4v l1jx/Uz8ukzH2QNhU4R39dbF/4AwWuSVkGW6bTxHJqGs6YimbfdQqxTzmqFwz3JP0OtXX5q/ 6D4pHwcmJwEiDNzsBLl6skPSQ0Xyq3pua/qAP8MVm+YxCxJQITqZ8qjDLzoe7s9X6FLLC/DA L9kxl5saVSfDbuI3usH/emdtn0NA9/M7nfgih92zD92sl1yQXHT6BDa8xW1j+RU4P+E0wyd7 zgB2UeYgrp2IIcfG+xX2uFG5MJQ/nYfBoiALb0+dQHNHDtFnNGY3Oe8z1M9c5aDG3/s29QbJ +w7hEKKo9YMAEQEAAYkCJQQYAQgADwUCWj1QMgIbDAUJCZQmAAAKCRBasvrxexcr6qwvD/9b Rek3kfN8Q+jGrKl8qwY8HC5s4mhdDJZI/JP2FImf5J2+d5/e8UJ4fcsT79E0/FqX3Z9wZr6h sofPqLh1/YzDsYkZDHTYSGrlWGP/I5kXwUmFnBZHzM3WGrL3S7ZmCYMdudhykxXXjq7M6Do1 oxM8JofrXGtwBTLv5wfvvygJouVCVe87Ge7mCeY5vey1eUi4zSSF1zPpR6gg64w2g4TXM5qt SwkZVOv1g475LsGlYWRuJV8TA67yp1zJI7HkNqCo8KyHX0DPOh9c+Sd9ZX4aqKfqH9HIpnCL AYEgj7vofeix7gM3kQQmwynqq32bQGQBrKJEYp2vfeO30VsVx4dzuuiC5lyjUccVmw5D72J0 FlGrfEm0kw6D1qwyBg0SAMqamKN6XDdjhNAtXIaoA2UMZK/vZGGUKbqTgDdk0fnzOyb2zvXK CiPFKqIPAqKaDHg0JHdGI3KpQdRNLLzgx083EqEc6IAwWA6jSz+6lZDV6XDgF0lYqAYIkg3+ 6OUXUv6plMlwSHquiOc/MQXHfgUP5//Ra5JuiuyCj954FD+MBKIj8eWROfnzyEnBplVHGSDI ZLzL3pvV14dcsoajdeIH45i8DxnVm64BvEFHtLNlnliMrLOrk4shfmWyUqNlzilXN2BTFVFH 4MrnagFdcFnWYp1JPh96ZKjiqBwMv/H0kw==
Message-ID: <4ab8d117-1aa8-f875-d77f-412c7f8935ee@cs.tcd.ie>
Date: Sun, 3 Mar 2019 16:36:07 +0000
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Subject: Re: [Smart] Hacked by Crypto
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From: Stephen Farrell <stephen.farrell@cs.tcd.ie>
To: Bret Jordan <jordan.ietf@gmail.com>, smart@irtf.org
Message-ID: <4ab8d117-1aa8-f875-d77f-412c7f8935ee@cs.tcd.ie>
Subject: Re: [Smart] Hacked by Crypto
References: <D22C801A-F090-4081-A15F-103EBCEDB3E6@gmail.com>
In-Reply-To: <D22C801A-F090-4081-A15F-103EBCEDB3E6@gmail.com>

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Bit of a pity to see a serious topic handled using such a
wildly inaccurate title. You may as well have said "hacked
by network" or "hacked by computer" or even "hacked by
arithmetic" as they'd all be as inaccurate.

I guess it is only the RSA show though.

S.

On 03/03/2019 16:16, Bret Jordan wrote:
> All,
>=20
> If you will be at RSA this week, I will be giving a talk about various =
new technologies and standards and what they will mean for operational se=
curity.  Specifically, how could a threat actor, intrusion set, or crime =
syndicate use these technologies to advance their objectives.=20
>=20
> The main topics will be:
> DNSSEC
> DANE
> DoH/DoT
> Opportunistic DoH
> TLS1.3
> ESNI
> QUIC
>=20
> https://www.rsaconference.com/events/us19/agenda/sessions/14434-hacked-=
by-crypto <https://www.rsaconference.com/events/us19/agenda/sessions/1443=
4-hacked-by-crypto>
>=20
>=20
> Thanks,
> Bret
> PGP Fingerprint: 63B4 FC53 680A 6B7D 1447  F2C0 74F8 ACAE 7415 0050
> "Without cryptography vihv vivc ce xhrnrw, however, the only thing that=
 can not be unscrambled is an egg."
>=20
>=20
>=20

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From: Bret Jordan <jordan.ietf@gmail.com>
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Date: Sun, 3 Mar 2019 10:48:15 -0700
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Subject: [Smart] Practical Example
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All,

For the past month in my free time I have been =E2=80=9Cwalking the =
packet=E2=80=9D through various combinations of these new technologies =
looking for problems, issues, and potential complications for =
operational security in the enterprise and critical infrastructure.  I =
have also started working on some proof of concept code that that can =
exploit these configurations.  Specifically I have been focused on stage =
1 and stage 2 delivery of an intrusion set since if you can prove stage =
2 delivery then the data exfiltration is easy.

1) I have not yet seen anything use this in the wild, but that is =
probably because most of these technologies are not yet broadly enabled.=20=


2) No, I am not going to release my toolkits or frameworks publicly

3) No, I will not discuss these attacks and exploits over public =
archived channels. Yes, threat actors do monitor lists like this one.=20

I would encourage others here to enable these new technologies in your =
sandbox and then start walking the packet through the entire =
configuration.  Once you do that, I would love to talk with you in =
person and see if your conclusions are similar to mine.=20


Thanks,
Bret
PGP Fingerprint: 63B4 FC53 680A 6B7D 1447  F2C0 74F8 ACAE 7415 0050
"Without cryptography vihv vivc ce xhrnrw, however, the only thing that =
can not be unscrambled is an egg."


--Apple-Mail=_24358CC2-CD9F-41B6-AB6F-8F4A64BD4371
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
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	charset=utf-8

<html><head><meta http-equiv=3D"Content-Type" content=3D"text/html; =
charset=3Dutf-8"></head><body style=3D"word-wrap: break-word; =
-webkit-nbsp-mode: space; line-break: after-white-space;" class=3D""><div =
class=3D"">All,</div><div class=3D""><br class=3D""></div><div =
class=3D"">For the past month in my free time I have been =E2=80=9Cwalking=
 the packet=E2=80=9D through various combinations of these new =
technologies looking for problems, issues, and potential complications =
for operational security in the enterprise and critical infrastructure. =
&nbsp;I have also started working on some proof of concept code that =
that can exploit these configurations. &nbsp;Specifically I have been =
focused on stage 1 and stage 2 delivery of an intrusion set since if you =
can prove stage 2 delivery then the data exfiltration is easy.</div><div =
class=3D""><br class=3D""></div><div class=3D"">1) I have not yet seen =
anything use this in the wild, but that is probably because most of =
these technologies are not yet broadly enabled.&nbsp;</div><div =
class=3D""><br class=3D""></div><div class=3D"">2) No, I am not going to =
release my toolkits or frameworks publicly</div><div class=3D""><br =
class=3D""></div><div class=3D"">3) No, I will not discuss these attacks =
and exploits over public archived channels. Yes, threat actors do =
monitor lists like this one.&nbsp;</div><div class=3D""><br =
class=3D""></div><div class=3D"">I would encourage others here to enable =
these new technologies in your sandbox and then start walking the packet =
through the entire configuration. &nbsp;Once you do that, I would love =
to talk with you in person and see if your conclusions are similar to =
mine.&nbsp;</div><div class=3D""><br class=3D""></div><br class=3D""><div =
class=3D"">
<div style=3D"caret-color: rgb(0, 0, 0); color: rgb(0, 0, 0); =
font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 14px; font-style: normal; =
font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; =
orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: =
none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; =
-webkit-text-size-adjust: auto; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; =
text-decoration: none;"><div class=3D"" style=3D"orphans: 2; widows: 2; =
font-variant-ligatures: normal; font-variant-east-asian: normal; =
font-variant-position: normal; line-height: normal; =
-webkit-text-decorations-in-effect: none;"><span =
class=3D"Apple-style-span" style=3D"border-collapse: separate; =
font-variant-ligatures: normal; font-variant-east-asian: normal; =
font-variant-position: normal; line-height: normal; border-spacing: 0px; =
-webkit-text-decorations-in-effect: none;">Thanks,</span></div><div =
class=3D"" style=3D"orphans: 2; widows: 2; font-variant-ligatures: =
normal; font-variant-east-asian: normal; font-variant-position: normal; =
line-height: normal; -webkit-text-decorations-in-effect: none;"><span =
class=3D"Apple-style-span" style=3D"border-collapse: separate; =
font-variant-ligatures: normal; font-variant-east-asian: normal; =
font-variant-position: normal; line-height: normal; text-align: =
-webkit-auto; border-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-decorations-in-effect: =
none;">Bret</span></div><div class=3D"" style=3D"orphans: 2; widows: =
2;"><span class=3D"Apple-style-span" style=3D"border-collapse: separate; =
text-align: -webkit-auto; border-spacing: 0px;"><span =
class=3D"Apple-style-span" style=3D"border-collapse: separate; =
text-align: -webkit-auto; border-spacing: 0px;"><div class=3D"" =
style=3D"word-wrap: break-word; -webkit-nbsp-mode: space; line-break: =
after-white-space;"><span class=3D"Apple-style-span" =
style=3D"border-collapse: separate; text-align: -webkit-auto; =
border-spacing: 0px;"><div class=3D"" style=3D"word-wrap: break-word; =
-webkit-nbsp-mode: space; line-break: after-white-space;"><span =
class=3D"Apple-style-span" style=3D"border-collapse: separate; =
text-align: -webkit-auto; border-spacing: 0px;"><div class=3D"" =
style=3D"word-wrap: break-word; -webkit-nbsp-mode: space; line-break: =
after-white-space;"><span class=3D"Apple-style-span" =
style=3D"border-collapse: separate; text-align: -webkit-auto; =
border-spacing: 0px;"><div class=3D""><font color=3D"#7c7c7c" =
face=3D"Calibre, Verdana" class=3D"" style=3D"font-variant-ligatures: =
normal; font-variant-east-asian: normal; font-variant-position: normal; =
line-height: normal; -webkit-text-decorations-in-effect: none;"><span =
class=3D"" style=3D"font-size: 11px;">PGP =
Fingerprint:&nbsp;</span></font><span class=3D"" style=3D"text-align: =
-webkit-auto; font-size: 11px;"><font color=3D"#7c7c7c" face=3D"Calibre, =
Verdana" class=3D"">63B4 FC53 680A 6B7D 1447 &nbsp;F2C0 74F8 ACAE 7415 =
0050</font></span></div><div class=3D"" style=3D"font-variant-ligatures: =
normal; font-variant-east-asian: normal; font-variant-position: normal; =
line-height: normal; -webkit-text-decorations-in-effect: none;"><span =
class=3D"" style=3D"color: rgb(124, 124, 124); font-size: 8pt; =
font-family: Calibre, Verdana; text-align: -webkit-auto;">"Without =
cryptography vihv vivc ce xhrnrw, however, the only thing that can not =
be unscrambled is an =
egg."</span></div></span></div></span></div></span></div></span></span></d=
iv></div>
</div>

<br class=3D""></body></html>=

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From nobody Sun Mar  3 23:55:28 2019
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Hi,

On 2019-3-3, at 19:48, Bret Jordan <jordan.ietf@gmail.com> wrote:
> 2) No, I am not going to release my toolkits or frameworks publicly
>=20
> 3) No, I will not discuss these attacks and exploits over public =
archived channels. Yes, threat actors do monitor lists like this one.

so, I guess we're done then?

Sorry for the flippant response, but the IETF and IRTF are all about =
discussing issues openly. If that approach isn't feasible, there isn't =
really much else we can engage over.

Lars


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From: Kirsty P <Kirsty.p@ncsc.gov.uk>
To: Stephen Farrell <stephen.farrell@cs.tcd.ie>, Bret Jordan <jordan.ietf@gmail.com>, "smart@irtf.org" <smart@irtf.org>
Thread-Topic: [Smart] Hacked by Crypto
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Date: Mon, 4 Mar 2019 13:55:41 +0000
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Archived-At: <https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/smart/XIwlLtOHJidEnIhwV4oWMvYZZ34>
Subject: Re: [Smart] Hacked by Crypto
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Thank you for bringing this talk to our attention. As Stephen notes, this i=
s indeed a serious topic and I'm glad that Bret is presenting on it at RSA.=
 I'm sure it will reach many people who need to be aware of the content of =
the talk, but aren't currently sighted.


I would also politely contest describing a conference that attracts 40k+ at=
tendees annually as "only the RSA show"... That could be perceived as a bit=
 dismissive, and I'd like to keep the list friendly for many reasons, but e=
specially to encourage those who are new to the IETF/IRTF to participate.


Kirsty


________________________________
From: Smart <smart-bounces@irtf.org> on behalf of Stephen Farrell <stephen.=
farrell@cs.tcd.ie>
Sent: 03 March 2019 16:36
To: Bret Jordan; smart@irtf.org
Subject: Re: [Smart] Hacked by Crypto


Bit of a pity to see a serious topic handled using such a
wildly inaccurate title. You may as well have said "hacked
by network" or "hacked by computer" or even "hacked by
arithmetic" as they'd all be as inaccurate.

I guess it is only the RSA show though.

S.

On 03/03/2019 16:16, Bret Jordan wrote:
> All,
>
> If you will be at RSA this week, I will be giving a talk about various ne=
w technologies and standards and what they will mean for operational securi=
ty.  Specifically, how could a threat actor, intrusion set, or crime syndic=
ate use these technologies to advance their objectives.
>
> The main topics will be:
> DNSSEC
> DANE
> DoH/DoT
> Opportunistic DoH
> TLS1.3
> ESNI
> QUIC
>
> https://emea01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=3Dhttps%3A%2F%2Fwww.=
rsaconference.com%2Fevents%2Fus19%2Fagenda%2Fsessions%2F14434-hacked-by-cry=
pto&amp;data=3D02%7C01%7Ckirsty.p%40ncsc.gov.uk%7Cee50ad85285f4eb8486008d69=
ff660ab%7C14aa5744ece1474ea2d734f46dda64a1%7C0%7C0%7C636872277875507480&amp=
;sdata=3DZhJUJ9u4KAOK7cTsdxv5lGL%2FvNAh9gRTBISdY4YnqUY%3D&amp;reserved=3D0 =
<https://emea01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=3Dhttps%3A%2F%2Fwww.r=
saconference.com%2Fevents%2Fus19%2Fagenda%2Fsessions%2F14434-hacked-by-cryp=
to&amp;data=3D02%7C01%7Ckirsty.p%40ncsc.gov.uk%7Cee50ad85285f4eb8486008d69f=
f660ab%7C14aa5744ece1474ea2d734f46dda64a1%7C0%7C0%7C636872277875507480&amp;=
sdata=3DZhJUJ9u4KAOK7cTsdxv5lGL%2FvNAh9gRTBISdY4YnqUY%3D&amp;reserved=3D0>
>
>
> Thanks,
> Bret
> PGP Fingerprint: 63B4 FC53 680A 6B7D 1447  F2C0 74F8 ACAE 7415 0050
> "Without cryptography vihv vivc ce xhrnrw, however, the only thing that c=
an not be unscrambled is an egg."
>
>
>
This information is exempt under the Freedom of Information Act 2000 (FOIA)=
 and may be exempt under other UK information legislation. Refer any FOIA q=
ueries to ncscinfoleg@ncsc.gov.uk

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1">
<style type=3D"text/css" style=3D"display:none;"><!-- P {margin-top:0;margi=
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<body dir=3D"ltr">
<div id=3D"divtagdefaultwrapper" style=3D"font-size: 12pt; color: rgb(0, 0,=
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6px;">
<span style=3D"font-size: 12pt;">Thank you for&nbsp;</span><span style=3D"f=
ont-size: 12pt;">bringing this talk to our attention</span><span style=3D"f=
ont-size: 12pt;">.&nbsp;As Stephen notes, this is indeed a serious topic an=
d I'm glad&nbsp;that Bret is&nbsp;presenting on it at RSA</span><span style=
=3D"font-size: 12pt;">.
 I'm sure&nbsp;it&nbsp;will reach many people who need to be aware of the c=
ontent of&nbsp;the&nbsp;talk, but aren't currently sighted.</span><br>
</p>
<div style=3D"font-family: Calibri, Helvetica, sans-serif, EmojiFont, &quot=
;Apple Color Emoji&quot;, &quot;Segoe UI Emoji&quot;, NotoColorEmoji, &quot=
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<div id=3D"x_divtagdefaultwrapper" dir=3D"ltr" style=3D"font-size: 12pt;">
<p><br>
</p>
<p>I would also&nbsp;politely contest&nbsp;describing&nbsp;a conference tha=
t attracts 40k&#43; attendees annually as &quot;only the RSA show&quot;... =
That could be perceived as a bit dismissive, and I'd like to keep the list =
friendly for many reasons, but especially&nbsp;to encourage those
 who are&nbsp;new to the IETF/IRTF to participate.</p>
<p><br>
</p>
<p>Kirsty</p>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
<p></p>
<br>
<br>
<div style=3D"color: rgb(0, 0, 0);">
<hr style=3D"display:inline-block;width:98%" tabindex=3D"-1">
<div id=3D"divRplyFwdMsg" dir=3D"ltr"><font face=3D"Calibri, sans-serif" st=
yle=3D"font-size:11pt" color=3D"#000000"><b>From:</b> Smart &lt;smart-bounc=
es@irtf.org&gt; on behalf of Stephen Farrell &lt;stephen.farrell@cs.tcd.ie&=
gt;<br>
<b>Sent:</b> 03 March 2019 16:36<br>
<b>To:</b> Bret Jordan; smart@irtf.org<br>
<b>Subject:</b> Re: [Smart] Hacked by Crypto</font>
<div>&nbsp;</div>
</div>
<div class=3D"BodyFragment"><font size=3D"2"><span style=3D"font-size:11pt;=
">
<div class=3D"PlainText"><br>
Bit of a pity to see a serious topic handled using such a<br>
wildly inaccurate title. You may as well have said &quot;hacked<br>
by network&quot; or &quot;hacked by computer&quot; or even &quot;hacked by<=
br>
arithmetic&quot; as they'd all be as inaccurate.<br>
<br>
I guess it is only the RSA show though.<br>
<br>
S.<br>
<br>
On 03/03/2019 16:16, Bret Jordan wrote:<br>
&gt; All,<br>
&gt; <br>
&gt; If you will be at RSA this week, I will be giving a talk about various=
 new technologies and standards and what they will mean for operational sec=
urity.&nbsp; Specifically, how could a threat actor, intrusion set, or crim=
e syndicate use these technologies to advance
 their objectives. <br>
&gt; <br>
&gt; The main topics will be:<br>
&gt; DNSSEC<br>
&gt; DANE<br>
&gt; DoH/DoT<br>
&gt; Opportunistic DoH<br>
&gt; TLS1.3<br>
&gt; ESNI<br>
&gt; QUIC<br>
&gt; <br>
&gt; <a href=3D"https://emea01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=3Dhttp=
s%3A%2F%2Fwww.rsaconference.com%2Fevents%2Fus19%2Fagenda%2Fsessions%2F14434=
-hacked-by-crypto&amp;amp;data=3D02%7C01%7Ckirsty.p%40ncsc.gov.uk%7Cee50ad8=
5285f4eb8486008d69ff660ab%7C14aa5744ece1474ea2d734f46dda64a1%7C0%7C0%7C6368=
72277875507480&amp;amp;sdata=3DZhJUJ9u4KAOK7cTsdxv5lGL%2FvNAh9gRTBISdY4YnqU=
Y%3D&amp;amp;reserved=3D0" id=3D"LPlnk998756" class=3D"OWAAutoLink" preview=
removed=3D"true">
https://emea01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=3Dhttps%3A%2F%2Fwww.rs=
aconference.com%2Fevents%2Fus19%2Fagenda%2Fsessions%2F14434-hacked-by-crypt=
o&amp;amp;data=3D02%7C01%7Ckirsty.p%40ncsc.gov.uk%7Cee50ad85285f4eb8486008d=
69ff660ab%7C14aa5744ece1474ea2d734f46dda64a1%7C0%7C0%7C636872277875507480&a=
mp;amp;sdata=3DZhJUJ9u4KAOK7cTsdxv5lGL%2FvNAh9gRTBISdY4YnqUY%3D&amp;amp;res=
erved=3D0</a>
 &lt;<a href=3D"https://emea01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=3Dhttp=
s%3A%2F%2Fwww.rsaconference.com%2Fevents%2Fus19%2Fagenda%2Fsessions%2F14434=
-hacked-by-crypto&amp;amp;data=3D02%7C01%7Ckirsty.p%40ncsc.gov.uk%7Cee50ad8=
5285f4eb8486008d69ff660ab%7C14aa5744ece1474ea2d734f46dda64a1%7C0%7C0%7C6368=
72277875507480&amp;amp;sdata=3DZhJUJ9u4KAOK7cTsdxv5lGL%2FvNAh9gRTBISdY4YnqU=
Y%3D&amp;amp;reserved=3D0" id=3D"LPlnk255870" class=3D"OWAAutoLink" preview=
removed=3D"true">https://emea01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=3Dhtt=
ps%3A%2F%2Fwww.rsaconference.com%2Fevents%2Fus19%2Fagenda%2Fsessions%2F1443=
4-hacked-by-crypto&amp;amp;data=3D02%7C01%7Ckirsty.p%40ncsc.gov.uk%7Cee50ad=
85285f4eb8486008d69ff660ab%7C14aa5744ece1474ea2d734f46dda64a1%7C0%7C0%7C636=
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UY%3D&amp;amp;reserved=3D0</a>&gt;<br>
&gt; <br>
&gt; <br>
&gt; Thanks,<br>
&gt; Bret<br>
&gt; PGP Fingerprint: 63B4 FC53 680A 6B7D 1447&nbsp; F2C0 74F8 ACAE 7415 00=
50<br>
&gt; &quot;Without cryptography vihv vivc ce xhrnrw, however, the only thin=
g that can not be unscrambled is an egg.&quot;<br>
&gt; <br>
&gt; <br>
&gt; <br>
</div>
</span></font></div>
</div>
</div>
This information is exempt under the Freedom of Information Act 2000 (FOIA)=
 and may be exempt under other UK information legislation. Refer any FOIA q=
ueries to ncscinfoleg@ncsc.gov.uk
</body>
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From: Kirsty P <Kirsty.p@ncsc.gov.uk>
To: "smart@irtf.org" <smart@irtf.org>
Thread-Topic: CARIS2 - thank you
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Subject: [Smart] CARIS2 - thank you
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SMART folks,


Thanks to everyone who attended the CARIS2 (Co-ordinating Attack Response a=
t Internet Scale) workshop last week, 28th February - 1st March, and thanks=
 to the Internet Society for their sponsorship! It was great to collaborate=
 with the diverse set of people and viewpoints in the room, and get a full =
range of perspectives on how to co-ordinate response to attacks at scale. I=
'm looking forward to working on the concrete actions and seeing our resear=
ch ideas blossom in SMART.


There will be a full write-up in due course and probably an interim update =
at the Prague meeting for SMART (confirmed for Monday 25th March, at 16:10-=
18:10). You can also find more detail on the workshop, included presented p=
apers, here:

https://www.internetsociety.org/events/caris2


Kirsty

This information is exempt under the Freedom of Information Act 2000 (FOIA)=
 and may be exempt under other UK information legislation. Refer any FOIA q=
ueries to ncscinfoleg@ncsc.gov.uk

--_000_CWLP123MB24670FC35CFFAAA98F93C702D7710CWLP123MB2467GBRP_
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<html>
<head>
<meta http-equiv=3D"Content-Type" content=3D"text/html; charset=3Diso-8859-=
1">
<style type=3D"text/css" style=3D"display:none;"><!-- P {margin-top:0;margi=
n-bottom:0;} --></style>
</head>
<body dir=3D"ltr">
<div id=3D"divtagdefaultwrapper" style=3D"font-size:12pt;color:#000000;font=
-family:Calibri,Helvetica,sans-serif;" dir=3D"ltr">
<p style=3D"margin-top:0;margin-bottom:0">SMART folks,</p>
<p style=3D"margin-top:0;margin-bottom:0"><br>
</p>
<p style=3D"margin-top:0;margin-bottom:0">Thanks to everyone who attended t=
he&nbsp;CARIS2 (Co-ordinating Attack Response at Internet Scale)&nbsp;<span=
 style=3D"font-family: Calibri, Helvetica, sans-serif, EmojiFont, &quot;App=
le Color Emoji&quot;, &quot;Segoe UI Emoji&quot;, NotoColorEmoji, &quot;Seg=
oe UI Symbol&quot;, &quot;Android Emoji&quot;, EmojiSymbols; font-size: 16p=
x;">workshop&nbsp;</span>last
 week,&nbsp;<span style=3D"font-size: 12pt;">28th February - 1st March, and=
 thanks to the Internet Society for their sponsorship!&nbsp;</span><span st=
yle=3D"font-size: 12pt;">It was great to collaborate with the diverse set o=
f people and viewpoints in the room, and get a
 full range of perspectives on how to co-ordinate response to attacks at sc=
ale.&nbsp;<span style=3D"font-family: Calibri, Helvetica, sans-serif, Emoji=
Font, &quot;Apple Color Emoji&quot;, &quot;Segoe UI Emoji&quot;, NotoColorE=
moji, &quot;Segoe UI Symbol&quot;, &quot;Android Emoji&quot;, EmojiSymbols;=
 font-size: 16px;">I'm&nbsp;</span><span style=3D"font-family: Calibri, Hel=
vetica, sans-serif, EmojiFont, &quot;Apple Color Emoji&quot;, &quot;Segoe U=
I Emoji&quot;, NotoColorEmoji, &quot;Segoe UI Symbol&quot;, &quot;Android E=
moji&quot;, EmojiSymbols; font-size: 16px;">looking
 forwar</span><span style=3D"font-family: Calibri, Helvetica, sans-serif, E=
mojiFont, &quot;Apple Color Emoji&quot;, &quot;Segoe UI Emoji&quot;, NotoCo=
lorEmoji, &quot;Segoe UI Symbol&quot;, &quot;Android Emoji&quot;, EmojiSymb=
ols; font-size: 16px;">d to working on the&nbsp;</span>concrete actions and=
 seeing
 our&nbsp;research ideas blossom&nbsp;</span><span style=3D"font-size: 12pt=
;">in SMART.</span></p>
<p style=3D"margin-top:0;margin-bottom:0"><span style=3D"font-size: 12pt;">=
<br>
</span></p>
<p style=3D"margin-top:0;margin-bottom:0"><span style=3D"font-size: 12pt;">=
</span><span style=3D"font-size: 12pt;">There will be a full write-up in du=
e course and probably an interim update at the Prague meeting for SMART (co=
nfirmed for&nbsp;Monday 25th March, at 16:10-18:10).
 Y</span><span style=3D"font-size: 12pt;">ou&nbsp;can also&nbsp;find more d=
etail on the workshop, included presented papers, here:</span></p>
<p style=3D"font-family: Calibri, Helvetica, sans-serif, EmojiFont, &quot;A=
pple Color Emoji&quot;, &quot;Segoe UI Emoji&quot;, NotoColorEmoji, &quot;S=
egoe UI Symbol&quot;, &quot;Android Emoji&quot;, EmojiSymbols; font-size: 1=
6px;">
<a href=3D"https://www.internetsociety.org/events/caris2" class=3D"OWAAutoL=
ink" id=3D"LPlnk1660" previewremoved=3D"true">https://www.internetsociety.o=
rg/events/caris2</a></p>
<p style=3D"font-family: Calibri, Helvetica, sans-serif, EmojiFont, &quot;A=
pple Color Emoji&quot;, &quot;Segoe UI Emoji&quot;, NotoColorEmoji, &quot;S=
egoe UI Symbol&quot;, &quot;Android Emoji&quot;, EmojiSymbols; font-size: 1=
6px;">
<br>
</p>
<p style=3D"font-family: Calibri, Helvetica, sans-serif, EmojiFont, &quot;A=
pple Color Emoji&quot;, &quot;Segoe UI Emoji&quot;, NotoColorEmoji, &quot;S=
egoe UI Symbol&quot;, &quot;Android Emoji&quot;, EmojiSymbols; font-size: 1=
6px;">
<span style=3D"font-size: 12pt;">Kirsty</span><br>
</p>
</div>
This information is exempt under the Freedom of Information Act 2000 (FOIA)=
 and may be exempt under other UK information legislation. Refer any FOIA q=
ueries to ncscinfoleg@ncsc.gov.uk
</body>
</html>

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Subject: Re: [Smart] Practical Example
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On Sun 2019-03-03 10:48:15 -0700, Bret Jordan wrote:
> various combinations of these new technologies

Out of curiosity, which new technologies are you talking about?  I'm
sorry if i'm missing context here, but i'm following the list and i
didn't see any reference to specific mechanisms.  If this is a reference
to a conversation that happened at CARIS2, could you provide pointers to
the details you're referring to for those of us who weren't able to make
it?

thanks,

        --dkg


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SMART folks,

We have an IRTF Wiki page. It contains a description of SMART and its aims,=
 relevant links that are by now buried somewhere in this mailing list, and =
other information that you might like to explore: https://trac.ietf.org/tra=
c/irtf/wiki/smart

Kirsty
This information is exempt under the Freedom of Information Act 2000 (FOIA)=
 and may be exempt under other UK information legislation. Refer any FOIA q=
ueries to ncscinfoleg@ncsc.gov.uk

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<body dir=3D"ltr">
<div style=3D"font-family: Calibri, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif; font-size=
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SMART folks,</div>
<div style=3D"font-family: Calibri, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif; font-size=
: 12pt; color: rgb(0, 0, 0);">
<br>
</div>
<div style=3D"font-family: Calibri, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif; font-size=
: 12pt; color: rgb(0, 0, 0);">
We have an IRTF Wiki page. It contains a description of SMART and its aims,=
 relevant links that are by now buried somewhere in this mailing list, and =
other information that you might like to explore:&nbsp;<a href=3D"https://t=
rac.ietf.org/trac/irtf/wiki/smart" id=3D"LPlnk484112">https://trac.ietf.org=
/trac/irtf/wiki/smart</a></div>
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<br>
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: 12pt; color: rgb(0, 0, 0);">
Kirsty</div>
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From: Kirsty P <Kirsty.p@ncsc.gov.uk>
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Thread-Topic: SMART Draft Agenda for IETF 104
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Subject: [Smart] SMART Draft Agenda for IETF 104
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SMART folks,

Our agenda for SMART's meeting at IETF 104 is up on Github!
Here's the link: https://github.com/smart-rg/meetings/blob/master/104/agend=
a.md
And it's also pasted below for your reference.

Kirsty

=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D

16:10 - Chair Time, Charter & Group Setup (Kathleen / Kirsty)
16:20 - Cisco: State of Cyber Security (David McGrew)
16:35 - Symantec: State of Cyber Security (TBC)
16:45 - Akamai: State of the Internet Report (Tim April)
17:00 - SE Labs: Testing for the good of the internet (Simon Edwards)
17:20 - Qrator: BGP hijacking (T=F6ma Gavrinchenkov)
17:40 - CLESS draft on endpoint security (TBC)
17:50 - Active Cyber Defence (NCSC Senior Speaker)
18:09 - Next time at SMART...



This information is exempt under the Freedom of Information Act 2000 (FOIA)=
 and may be exempt under other UK information legislation. Refer any FOIA q=
ueries to ncscinfoleg@ncsc.gov.uk

--_000_CWLP123MB2467664D06F1B683738EFAA1D7410CWLP123MB2467GBRP_
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<html>
<head>
<meta http-equiv=3D"Content-Type" content=3D"text/html; charset=3Diso-8859-=
1">
<style type=3D"text/css" style=3D"display:none;"> P {margin-top:0;margin-bo=
ttom:0;} </style>
</head>
<body dir=3D"ltr">
<div style=3D"font-family: Calibri, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif; font-size=
: 12pt; color: rgb(0, 0, 0);">
SMART folks,</div>
<div style=3D"font-family: Calibri, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif; font-size=
: 12pt; color: rgb(0, 0, 0);">
<br>
</div>
<div style=3D"font-family: Calibri, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif; font-size=
: 12pt; color: rgb(0, 0, 0);">
Our agenda for SMART's meeting at IETF 104 is up on Github!</div>
<div style=3D"font-family: Calibri, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif; font-size=
: 12pt; color: rgb(0, 0, 0);">
Here's the link:&nbsp;<a href=3D"https://github.com/smart-rg/meetings/blob/=
master/104/agenda.md" id=3D"LPlnk538745">https://github.com/smart-rg/meetin=
gs/blob/master/104/agenda.md</a></div>
<div style=3D"font-family: Calibri, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif; font-size=
: 12pt; color: rgb(0, 0, 0);">
<span style=3D"color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: Calibri, Arial, Helvetica,=
 sans-serif; font-size: 12pt;">And it's also pasted below for your referenc=
e.</span></div>
<div style=3D"font-family: Calibri, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif; font-size=
: 12pt; color: rgb(0, 0, 0);">
<br>
</div>
<div style=3D"font-family: Calibri, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif; font-size=
: 12pt; color: rgb(0, 0, 0);">
Kirsty</div>
<div style=3D"font-family: Calibri, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif; font-size=
: 12pt; color: rgb(0, 0, 0);">
<br>
</div>
<div style=3D"font-family: Calibri, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif; font-size=
: 12pt; color: rgb(0, 0, 0);">
=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D</div>
<div style=3D"font-family: Calibri, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif; font-size=
: 12pt; color: rgb(0, 0, 0);">
<br>
</div>
<div style=3D"font-family: Calibri, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif; font-size=
: 12pt; color: rgb(0, 0, 0);">
<span>16:10 - Chair Time, Charter &amp; Group Setup (Kathleen / Kirsty)<br>
</span>
<div>16:20 - Cisco: State of Cyber Security (David McGrew)<br>
</div>
<div>16:35 - Symantec: State of Cyber Security (TBC)<br>
</div>
<div>16:45 - Akamai: State of the Internet Report (Tim April)<br>
</div>
<div>17:00 - SE Labs: Testing for the good of the internet (Simon Edwards)<=
br>
</div>
<div>17:20 - Qrator: BGP hijacking (T=F6ma Gavrinchenkov)<br>
</div>
<div>17:40 - CLESS draft on endpoint security (TBC)<br>
</div>
<div>17:50 - Active Cyber Defence (NCSC Senior Speaker)<br>
</div>
<span>18:09 - Next time at SMART...</span><br>
</div>
<div style=3D"font-family: Calibri, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif; font-size=
: 12pt; color: rgb(0, 0, 0);">
<span><br>
</span></div>
<div style=3D"font-family: Calibri, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif; font-size=
: 12pt; color: rgb(0, 0, 0);">
<span><br>
</span></div>
<div style=3D"font-family: Calibri, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif; font-size=
: 12pt; color: rgb(0, 0, 0);">
<br>
</div>
This information is exempt under the Freedom of Information Act 2000 (FOIA)=
 and may be exempt under other UK information legislation. Refer any FOIA q=
ueries to ncscinfoleg@ncsc.gov.uk
</body>
</html>

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From nobody Mon Mar 25 01:46:02 2019
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From: Kathleen Moriarty <kathleen.moriarty.ietf@gmail.com>
Date: Mon, 25 Mar 2019 04:45:16 -0400
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Subject: Re: [Smart] New I-D: draft-taddei-cless-introduction
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Hello Arnaud,

The submission window should be back open now of you could post the draft.

I just read through the draft.  A big thank you to you and your colleagues
for your diligent work on this first revision.  Although you point out
there is much work to be done for other system types, this is a great
start.  Thank you for enumerating the difficulties in detection at the end
point, inferring the areas of research as well as explicitly calling out
some areas of research to transition detection capabilities away from
on-the-wire solutions. This could help set the stage for some useful
research work and guide solution development for more applied work as well.

Best regards,
Kathleen

On Tue, Mar 19, 2019 at 12:05 PM Arnaud.Taddei.IETF <Arnaud.Taddei.IETF=3D
40protonmail.com@dmarc.ietf.org> wrote:

> The draft was merged in the SMART Github so the below should read (with
> the correct URL):
>
> Name:           draft-taddei-cless-introduction
> Revision:       00
> Title:          *Capabilities and Limitations of an Endpoint-only
> Security Solution*
> *Document date:  2019-03-19*
> *Group:          Individual Submission*
> *Pages:          41*
> *URL:            *
> https://github.com/smart-rg/drafts/blob/master/draft-taddei-cless-introdu=
ction-00.txt
>
> Abstract
>
>    In the context of existing, proposed and newly published protocols,
>    this draft RFC is to establish the capabilities and limitations of
>    endpoint-only security solutions and explore benefits and
>    alternatives to mitigate those limits with the support of real case
>    studies.
>
>
> Sent with ProtonMail <https://protonmail.com> Secure Email.
>
> =E2=80=90=E2=80=90=E2=80=90=E2=80=90=E2=80=90=E2=80=90=E2=80=90 Original =
Message =E2=80=90=E2=80=90=E2=80=90=E2=80=90=E2=80=90=E2=80=90=E2=80=90
> On Tuesday 19 March 2019 15:17, Arnaud.Taddei.IETF <Arnaud.Taddei.IETF=3D
> 40protonmail.com@dmarc.ietf.org> wrote:
>
> FYI colleagues, I uploaded the following draft in Github for SMART.
>
> I was given 10' of the SMART agenda on Monday 25th at IETF104 at 4:10pm
> session.
>
> I am aware I passed the date for proper I-D submissions.
>
> At this stage I am simply looking for your consideration and feedback.
>
> I tried to respect all the rules to create an I-D but happy to learn.
>
> Name:           draft-taddei-cless-introduction
> Revision:       00
> Title:          *Capabilities and Limitations of an Endpoint-only
> Security Solution*
> *Document date:  2019-03-19*
> *Group:          Individual Submission*
> *Pages:          41*
> *URL:            *
> https://github.com/arnaudtaddei/drafts/blob/patch-1/draft-taddei-cless-in=
troduction-00.txt
>
> Abstract
>
>    In the context of existing, proposed and newly published protocols,
>    this draft RFC is to establish the capabilities and limitations of
>    endpoint-only security solutions and explore benefits and
>    alternatives to mitigate those limits with the support of real case
>    studies.
>
>
>
>
>
> Sent with ProtonMail <https://protonmail.com> Secure Email.
>
>
> --
> Smart mailing list
> Smart@irtf.org
> https://www.irtf.org/mailman/listinfo/smart
>


--=20

Best regards,
Kathleen

--00000000000062e1160584e73b38
Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

<div dir=3D"ltr">Hello Arnaud,<div><br></div><div>The submission window sho=
uld be back open now of you could post the draft.</div><div><br></div><div>=
I just read through the draft.=C2=A0 A big thank you to you and your collea=
gues for your diligent work on this first revision.=C2=A0 Although you poin=
t out there is much work to be done for other system types, this is a great=
 start.=C2=A0 Thank you for enumerating the difficulties in detection at th=
e end point, inferring the areas of research as well as explicitly calling =
out some areas of research to transition detection capabilities away from o=
n-the-wire solutions. This could help set the stage for some useful researc=
h work and guide solution development for more applied work as well.</div><=
div><br></div><div>Best regards,</div><div>Kathleen</div></div><br><div cla=
ss=3D"gmail_quote"><div dir=3D"ltr" class=3D"gmail_attr">On Tue, Mar 19, 20=
19 at 12:05 PM Arnaud.Taddei.IETF &lt;Arnaud.Taddei.IETF=3D<a href=3D"mailt=
o:40protonmail.com@dmarc.ietf.org">40protonmail.com@dmarc.ietf.org</a>&gt; =
wrote:<br></div><blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin:0px 0px 0=
px 0.8ex;border-left:1px solid rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex"><div>The =
draft was merged in the SMART Github so the below should read (with the cor=
rect URL):<br></div><div><br></div><div style=3D"box-sizing:inherit;color:r=
gb(85,85,85);font-family:Arial,&quot;Helvetica Neue&quot;,Helvetica,sans-se=
rif;font-size:14px;font-style:normal;font-variant-caps:normal;font-weight:n=
ormal;letter-spacing:normal;text-align:start;text-indent:0px;text-transform=
:none;white-space:normal;word-spacing:0px;text-decoration:none"><span style=
=3D"font-family:menlo,consolas,&quot;courier new&quot;,monospace,sans-serif=
"><span style=3D"font-size:10px">Name: =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 d=
raft-taddei-cless-introduction</span></span><br></div><div style=3D"box-siz=
ing:inherit;color:rgb(85,85,85);font-family:Arial,&quot;Helvetica Neue&quot=
;,Helvetica,sans-serif;font-size:14px;font-style:normal;font-variant-caps:n=
ormal;font-weight:normal;letter-spacing:normal;text-align:start;text-indent=
:0px;text-transform:none;white-space:normal;word-spacing:0px;text-decoratio=
n:none"><span style=3D"font-family:menlo,consolas,&quot;courier new&quot;,m=
onospace,sans-serif"><span style=3D"font-size:10px">Revision: =C2=A0 =C2=A0=
 =C2=A0 00</span></span><br></div><div style=3D"box-sizing:inherit;color:rg=
b(85,85,85);font-family:Arial,&quot;Helvetica Neue&quot;,Helvetica,sans-ser=
if;font-size:14px;font-style:normal;font-variant-caps:normal;font-weight:no=
rmal;letter-spacing:normal;text-align:start;text-indent:0px;text-transform:=
none;white-space:normal;word-spacing:0px;text-decoration:none"><span style=
=3D"font-family:menlo,consolas,&quot;courier new&quot;,monospace,sans-serif=
"><span style=3D"font-size:10px">Title: =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0<=
/span></span><b style=3D"box-sizing:inherit;font-weight:normal;color:rgb(0,=
0,0);font-family:-webkit-standard;font-style:normal;font-variant-caps:norma=
l;letter-spacing:normal;text-align:start;text-indent:0px;text-transform:non=
e;white-space:normal;word-spacing:0px;text-decoration:none"><span style=3D"=
background-color:transparent"><span style=3D"color:rgb(0,0,0)"><span style=
=3D"font-family:menlo,consolas,&quot;courier new&quot;,monospace,sans-serif=
"><span style=3D"font-size:10px">Capabilities and Limitations of an Endpoin=
t-only Security Solution</span></span></span></span></b><br></div><div styl=
e=3D"box-sizing:inherit;color:rgb(85,85,85);font-family:Arial,&quot;Helveti=
ca Neue&quot;,Helvetica,sans-serif;font-size:14px;font-style:normal;font-va=
riant-caps:normal;font-weight:normal;letter-spacing:normal;text-align:start=
;text-indent:0px;text-transform:none;white-space:normal;word-spacing:0px;te=
xt-decoration:none"><b style=3D"box-sizing:inherit;font-weight:normal;color=
:rgb(0,0,0);font-family:-webkit-standard;font-style:normal;font-variant-cap=
s:normal;letter-spacing:normal;text-align:start;text-indent:0px;text-transf=
orm:none;white-space:normal;word-spacing:0px;text-decoration:none"><span st=
yle=3D"background-color:transparent"><span style=3D"color:rgb(0,0,0)"><span=
 style=3D"font-family:menlo,consolas,&quot;courier new&quot;,monospace,sans=
-serif"><span style=3D"font-size:10px">Document date: =C2=A02019-03-19</spa=
n></span></span></span></b><br></div><div style=3D"box-sizing:inherit;color=
:rgb(85,85,85);font-family:Arial,&quot;Helvetica Neue&quot;,Helvetica,sans-=
serif;font-size:14px;font-style:normal;font-variant-caps:normal;font-weight=
:normal;letter-spacing:normal;text-align:start;text-indent:0px;text-transfo=
rm:none;white-space:normal;word-spacing:0px;text-decoration:none"><b style=
=3D"box-sizing:inherit;font-weight:normal;color:rgb(0,0,0);font-family:-web=
kit-standard;font-style:normal;font-variant-caps:normal;letter-spacing:norm=
al;text-align:start;text-indent:0px;text-transform:none;white-space:normal;=
word-spacing:0px;text-decoration:none"><span style=3D"background-color:tran=
sparent"><span style=3D"color:rgb(0,0,0)"><span style=3D"font-family:menlo,=
consolas,&quot;courier new&quot;,monospace,sans-serif"><span style=3D"font-=
size:10px">Group: =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0Individual Submission</=
span></span></span></span></b><br></div><div style=3D"box-sizing:inherit;co=
lor:rgb(85,85,85);font-family:Arial,&quot;Helvetica Neue&quot;,Helvetica,sa=
ns-serif;font-size:14px;font-style:normal;font-variant-caps:normal;font-wei=
ght:normal;letter-spacing:normal;text-align:start;text-indent:0px;text-tran=
sform:none;white-space:normal;word-spacing:0px;text-decoration:none"><b sty=
le=3D"box-sizing:inherit;font-weight:normal;color:rgb(0,0,0);font-family:-w=
ebkit-standard;font-style:normal;font-variant-caps:normal;letter-spacing:no=
rmal;text-align:start;text-indent:0px;text-transform:none;white-space:norma=
l;word-spacing:0px;text-decoration:none"><span style=3D"background-color:tr=
ansparent"><span style=3D"color:rgb(0,0,0)"><span style=3D"font-family:menl=
o,consolas,&quot;courier new&quot;,monospace,sans-serif"><span style=3D"fon=
t-size:10px">Pages: =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A041</span></span></spa=
n></span></b><br></div><div style=3D"box-sizing:inherit;color:rgb(85,85,85)=
;font-family:Arial,&quot;Helvetica Neue&quot;,Helvetica,sans-serif;font-siz=
e:14px;font-style:normal;font-variant-caps:normal;font-weight:normal;letter=
-spacing:normal;text-align:start;text-indent:0px;text-transform:none;white-=
space:normal;word-spacing:0px;text-decoration:none"><b style=3D"box-sizing:=
inherit;font-weight:normal;color:rgb(0,0,0);font-family:-webkit-standard;fo=
nt-style:normal;font-variant-caps:normal;letter-spacing:normal;text-align:s=
tart;text-indent:0px;text-transform:none;white-space:normal;word-spacing:0p=
x;text-decoration:none"><span style=3D"background-color:transparent"><span =
style=3D"color:rgb(0,0,0)"><span style=3D"font-family:menlo,consolas,&quot;=
courier new&quot;,monospace,sans-serif"><span style=3D"font-size:10px">URL:=
 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0</span></span></span></span></b><=
a href=3D"https://github.com/smart-rg/drafts/blob/master/draft-taddei-cless=
-introduction-00.txt" target=3D"_blank"><span style=3D"font-family:menlo,co=
nsolas,&quot;courier new&quot;,monospace,sans-serif"><span style=3D"font-si=
ze:10px">https://github.com/smart-rg/drafts/blob/master/draft-taddei-cless-=
introduction-00.txt</span></span></a></div><div style=3D"box-sizing:inherit=
;color:rgb(85,85,85);font-family:Arial,&quot;Helvetica Neue&quot;,Helvetica=
,sans-serif;font-size:14px;font-style:normal;font-variant-caps:normal;font-=
weight:normal;letter-spacing:normal;text-align:start;text-indent:0px;text-t=
ransform:none;white-space:normal;word-spacing:0px;text-decoration:none"><br=
></div><div style=3D"box-sizing:inherit;color:rgb(85,85,85);font-family:Ari=
al,&quot;Helvetica Neue&quot;,Helvetica,sans-serif;font-size:14px;font-styl=
e:normal;font-variant-caps:normal;font-weight:normal;letter-spacing:normal;=
text-align:start;text-indent:0px;text-transform:none;white-space:normal;wor=
d-spacing:0px;text-decoration:none"><span style=3D"font-family:menlo,consol=
as,&quot;courier new&quot;,monospace,sans-serif"><span style=3D"font-size:1=
0px">Abstract</span></span><br></div><div style=3D"box-sizing:inherit;color=
:rgb(85,85,85);font-family:Arial,&quot;Helvetica Neue&quot;,Helvetica,sans-=
serif;font-size:14px;font-style:normal;font-variant-caps:normal;font-weight=
:normal;letter-spacing:normal;text-align:start;text-indent:0px;text-transfo=
rm:none;white-space:normal;word-spacing:0px;text-decoration:none"><br></div=
><div style=3D"box-sizing:inherit;color:rgb(85,85,85);font-family:Arial,&qu=
ot;Helvetica Neue&quot;,Helvetica,sans-serif;font-size:14px;font-style:norm=
al;font-variant-caps:normal;font-weight:normal;letter-spacing:normal;text-a=
lign:start;text-indent:0px;text-transform:none;white-space:normal;word-spac=
ing:0px;text-decoration:none"><span style=3D"font-family:menlo,consolas,&qu=
ot;courier new&quot;,monospace,sans-serif"><span style=3D"font-size:10px">=
=C2=A0=C2=A0 In the context of existing, proposed and newly published proto=
cols,</span></span><br></div><div style=3D"box-sizing:inherit;color:rgb(85,=
85,85);font-family:Arial,&quot;Helvetica Neue&quot;,Helvetica,sans-serif;fo=
nt-size:14px;font-style:normal;font-variant-caps:normal;font-weight:normal;=
letter-spacing:normal;text-align:start;text-indent:0px;text-transform:none;=
white-space:normal;word-spacing:0px;text-decoration:none"><span style=3D"fo=
nt-family:menlo,consolas,&quot;courier new&quot;,monospace,sans-serif"><spa=
n style=3D"font-size:10px">=C2=A0=C2=A0 this draft RFC is to establish the =
capabilities and limitations of</span></span><br></div><div style=3D"box-si=
zing:inherit;color:rgb(85,85,85);font-family:Arial,&quot;Helvetica Neue&quo=
t;,Helvetica,sans-serif;font-size:14px;font-style:normal;font-variant-caps:=
normal;font-weight:normal;letter-spacing:normal;text-align:start;text-inden=
t:0px;text-transform:none;white-space:normal;word-spacing:0px;text-decorati=
on:none"><span style=3D"font-family:menlo,consolas,&quot;courier new&quot;,=
monospace,sans-serif"><span style=3D"font-size:10px">=C2=A0=C2=A0 endpoint-=
only security solutions and explore benefits and</span></span><br></div><di=
v style=3D"box-sizing:inherit;color:rgb(85,85,85);font-family:Arial,&quot;H=
elvetica Neue&quot;,Helvetica,sans-serif;font-size:14px;font-style:normal;f=
ont-variant-caps:normal;font-weight:normal;letter-spacing:normal;text-align=
:start;text-indent:0px;text-transform:none;white-space:normal;word-spacing:=
0px;text-decoration:none"><span style=3D"font-family:menlo,consolas,&quot;c=
ourier new&quot;,monospace,sans-serif"><span style=3D"font-size:10px">=C2=
=A0=C2=A0 alternatives to mitigate those limits with the support of real ca=
se</span></span><br></div><div style=3D"box-sizing:inherit;color:rgb(85,85,=
85);font-family:Arial,&quot;Helvetica Neue&quot;,Helvetica,sans-serif;font-=
size:14px;font-style:normal;font-variant-caps:normal;font-weight:normal;let=
ter-spacing:normal;text-align:start;text-indent:0px;text-transform:none;whi=
te-space:normal;word-spacing:0px;text-decoration:none"><span style=3D"font-=
family:menlo,consolas,&quot;courier new&quot;,monospace,sans-serif"><span s=
tyle=3D"font-size:10px">=C2=A0=C2=A0 studies.</span></span><br></div><div><=
br></div><div class=3D"gmail-m_3102818013635488217protonmail_signature_bloc=
k"><div class=3D"gmail-m_3102818013635488217protonmail_signature_block-user=
 gmail-m_3102818013635488217protonmail_signature_block-empty"><br></div><di=
v class=3D"gmail-m_3102818013635488217protonmail_signature_block-proton">Se=
nt with <a href=3D"https://protonmail.com" target=3D"_blank">ProtonMail</a>=
 Secure Email.<br></div></div><div><br></div><div>=E2=80=90=E2=80=90=E2=80=
=90=E2=80=90=E2=80=90=E2=80=90=E2=80=90 Original Message =E2=80=90=E2=80=90=
=E2=80=90=E2=80=90=E2=80=90=E2=80=90=E2=80=90<br></div><div> On Tuesday 19 =
March 2019 15:17, Arnaud.Taddei.IETF &lt;Arnaud.Taddei.IETF=3D<a href=3D"ma=
ilto:40protonmail.com@dmarc.ietf.org" target=3D"_blank">40protonmail.com@dm=
arc.ietf.org</a>&gt; wrote:<br></div><div> <br></div><blockquote class=3D"g=
mail-m_3102818013635488217protonmail_quote" type=3D"cite"><div>FYI colleagu=
es, I uploaded the following draft in Github for SMART.<br></div><div><br><=
/div><div>I was given 10&#39; of the SMART agenda on Monday 25th at IETF104=
 at 4:10pm session.<br></div><div><br></div><div>I am aware I passed the da=
te for proper I-D submissions.=C2=A0<br></div><div><br></div><div>At this s=
tage I am simply looking for your consideration and feedback.<br></div><div=
><br></div><div>I tried to respect all the rules to create an I-D but happy=
 to learn.<br></div><div><br></div><div><span style=3D"font-family:menlo,co=
nsolas,&quot;courier new&quot;,monospace,sans-serif"><span style=3D"font-si=
ze:10px">Name: =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 draft-taddei-cless-introd=
uction</span></span><br></div><div><span style=3D"font-family:menlo,consola=
s,&quot;courier new&quot;,monospace,sans-serif"><span style=3D"font-size:10=
px">Revision: =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 00</span></span><br></div><div><span sty=
le=3D"font-family:menlo,consolas,&quot;courier new&quot;,monospace,sans-ser=
if"><span style=3D"font-size:10px">Title: =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=
=A0</span></span><b style=3D"color:rgb(0,0,0);font-family:-webkit-standard;=
font-style:normal;font-variant-caps:normal;letter-spacing:normal;text-align=
:start;text-indent:0px;text-transform:none;white-space:normal;word-spacing:=
0px;text-decoration:none;font-weight:normal"><span style=3D"background-colo=
r:transparent"><span style=3D"color:rgb(0,0,0)"><span style=3D"font-family:=
menlo,consolas,&quot;courier new&quot;,monospace,sans-serif"><span style=3D=
"font-size:10px">Capabilities and Limitations of an Endpoint-only Security =
Solution</span></span></span></span></b><span style=3D"font-family:menlo,co=
nsolas,&quot;courier new&quot;,monospace,sans-serif"><span style=3D"font-si=
ze:10px"></span></span><br></div><div><b style=3D"color:rgb(0,0,0);font-fam=
ily:-webkit-standard;font-style:normal;font-variant-caps:normal;letter-spac=
ing:normal;text-align:start;text-indent:0px;text-transform:none;white-space=
:normal;word-spacing:0px;text-decoration:none;font-weight:normal"><span sty=
le=3D"background-color:transparent"><span style=3D"color:rgb(0,0,0)"><span =
style=3D"font-family:menlo,consolas,&quot;courier new&quot;,monospace,sans-=
serif"><span style=3D"font-size:10px">Document date: =C2=A02019-03-19</span=
></span></span></span></b><span style=3D"font-family:menlo,consolas,&quot;c=
ourier new&quot;,monospace,sans-serif"><span style=3D"font-size:10px"></spa=
n></span><br></div><div><b style=3D"color:rgb(0,0,0);font-family:-webkit-st=
andard;font-style:normal;font-variant-caps:normal;letter-spacing:normal;tex=
t-align:start;text-indent:0px;text-transform:none;white-space:normal;word-s=
pacing:0px;text-decoration:none;font-weight:normal"><span style=3D"backgrou=
nd-color:transparent"><span style=3D"color:rgb(0,0,0)"><span style=3D"font-=
family:menlo,consolas,&quot;courier new&quot;,monospace,sans-serif"><span s=
tyle=3D"font-size:10px">Group: =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0Individual=
 Submission</span></span></span></span></b><span style=3D"font-family:menlo=
,consolas,&quot;courier new&quot;,monospace,sans-serif"><span style=3D"font=
-size:10px"></span></span><br></div><div><b style=3D"color:rgb(0,0,0);font-=
family:-webkit-standard;font-style:normal;font-variant-caps:normal;letter-s=
pacing:normal;text-align:start;text-indent:0px;text-transform:none;white-sp=
ace:normal;word-spacing:0px;text-decoration:none;font-weight:normal"><span =
style=3D"background-color:transparent"><span style=3D"color:rgb(0,0,0)"><sp=
an style=3D"font-family:menlo,consolas,&quot;courier new&quot;,monospace,sa=
ns-serif"><span style=3D"font-size:10px">Pages: =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0=
 =C2=A041</span></span></span></span></b><span style=3D"font-family:menlo,c=
onsolas,&quot;courier new&quot;,monospace,sans-serif"><span style=3D"font-s=
ize:10px"></span></span><br></div><div><b style=3D"color:rgb(0,0,0);font-fa=
mily:-webkit-standard;font-style:normal;font-variant-caps:normal;letter-spa=
cing:normal;text-align:start;text-indent:0px;text-transform:none;white-spac=
e:normal;word-spacing:0px;text-decoration:none;font-weight:normal"><span st=
yle=3D"background-color:transparent"><span style=3D"color:rgb(0,0,0)"><span=
 style=3D"font-family:menlo,consolas,&quot;courier new&quot;,monospace,sans=
-serif"><span style=3D"font-size:10px">URL: =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=
=A0 =C2=A0</span></span></span></span></b><a href=3D"https://github.com/arn=
audtaddei/drafts/blob/patch-1/draft-taddei-cless-introduction-00.txt" style=
=3D"font-style:normal;font-variant-caps:normal;font-weight:normal;letter-sp=
acing:normal;text-align:start;text-indent:0px;text-transform:none;white-spa=
ce:normal;word-spacing:0px;color:rgb(149,79,114);text-decoration:underline;=
font-family:Calibri,sans-serif;font-size:14.6667px" target=3D"_blank"><span=
 style=3D"font-family:menlo,consolas,&quot;courier new&quot;,monospace,sans=
-serif"><span style=3D"font-size:10px">https://github.com/arnaudtaddei/draf=
ts/blob/patch-1/draft-taddei-cless-introduction-00.txt</span></span></a><br=
></div><div><br></div><div><span style=3D"font-family:menlo,consolas,&quot;=
courier new&quot;,monospace,sans-serif"><span style=3D"font-size:10px">Abst=
ract</span><span style=3D"font-size:10px"></span></span><br></div><div><spa=
n style=3D"font-family:menlo,consolas,&quot;courier new&quot;,monospace,san=
s-serif"><span style=3D"font-size:10px"></span></span><br></div><div><span =
style=3D"font-family:menlo,consolas,&quot;courier new&quot;,monospace,sans-=
serif"><span style=3D"font-size:10px">=C2=A0=C2=A0 In the context of existi=
ng, proposed and newly published protocols,</span><span style=3D"font-size:=
10px"></span></span><br></div><div><span style=3D"font-family:menlo,consola=
s,&quot;courier new&quot;,monospace,sans-serif"><span style=3D"font-size:10=
px">=C2=A0=C2=A0 this draft RFC is to establish the capabilities and limita=
tions of</span><span style=3D"font-size:10px"></span></span><br></div><div>=
<span style=3D"font-family:menlo,consolas,&quot;courier new&quot;,monospace=
,sans-serif"><span style=3D"font-size:10px">=C2=A0=C2=A0 endpoint-only secu=
rity solutions and explore benefits and</span><span style=3D"font-size:10px=
"></span></span><br></div><div><span style=3D"font-family:menlo,consolas,&q=
uot;courier new&quot;,monospace,sans-serif"><span style=3D"font-size:10px">=
=C2=A0=C2=A0 alternatives to mitigate those limits with the support of real=
 case</span><span style=3D"font-size:10px"></span></span><br></div><div><sp=
an style=3D"font-family:menlo,consolas,&quot;courier new&quot;,monospace,sa=
ns-serif"><span style=3D"font-size:10px">=C2=A0=C2=A0 studies.</span></span=
><br></div><div><br></div><div><br></div><div><br></div><div><br></div><div=
 class=3D"gmail-m_3102818013635488217protonmail_signature_block"><div class=
=3D"gmail-m_3102818013635488217protonmail_signature_block-user gmail-m_3102=
818013635488217protonmail_signature_block-empty"><br></div><div class=3D"gm=
ail-m_3102818013635488217protonmail_signature_block-proton">Sent with <a hr=
ef=3D"https://protonmail.com" target=3D"_blank">ProtonMail</a> Secure Email=
.<br></div></div><div><br></div></blockquote><div><br></div>-- <br>
Smart mailing list<br>
<a href=3D"mailto:Smart@irtf.org" target=3D"_blank">Smart@irtf.org</a><br>
<a href=3D"https://www.irtf.org/mailman/listinfo/smart" rel=3D"noreferrer" =
target=3D"_blank">https://www.irtf.org/mailman/listinfo/smart</a><br>
</blockquote></div><br clear=3D"all"><div><br></div>-- <br><div dir=3D"ltr"=
 class=3D"gmail_signature"><div dir=3D"ltr"><br><div>Best regards,</div><di=
v>Kathleen</div></div></div>

--00000000000062e1160584e73b38--


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--b1_7272b4fca56016dad2a419fcac8fb566--


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From: Kirsty P <Kirsty.p@ncsc.gov.uk>
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Thread-Topic: Meeting today
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Subject: [Smart] Meeting today
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--_000_CWLP123MB2467FB9A55617166098822C0D75E0CWLP123MB2467GBRP_
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

Hi everyone,

Just a reminder that we are meeting today at 4:10pm CET (in just over an ho=
ur).
All slide decks are available here: https://datatracker.ietf.org/meeting/10=
4/session/smart

And the agenda is pasted below for your information. See you there!

Kirsty

=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D

**Monday 25th March, 16:10-18:10**

Slide decks are available here: https://datatracker.ietf.org/meeting/104/se=
ssion/smart

* Chair Time, Charter & Group Setup (Kathleen / Kirsty) - 10 minutes
SMART's draft charter is here: https://github.com/smart-rg/drafts/blob/mast=
er/draft-charter.md

* Threat Landscape (Arnaud Taddei) - 15 minutes

* Malicious Uses of Evasive Communications and Threats to Privacy (David Mc=
Grew) - 15 minutes

* Testing for the good of the internet (Simon Edwards) - 20 minutes

* BGP hijacking (Toma Gavrichenkov) - 20 minutes

* CLESS draft on endpoint security (Arnaud Taddei) - 10 minutes
 The draft being discussed is draft-taddei-cless-introduction-00
 Available at https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-taddei-smart-cless-int=
roduction/

* One Snake (NCSC Senior Speaker) - 20 minutes

* Chair Wrap-Up & Discussion (Kathleen / Kirsty) - 10 minutes

This information is exempt under the Freedom of Information Act 2000 (FOIA)=
 and may be exempt under other UK information legislation. Refer any FOIA q=
ueries to ncscinfoleg@ncsc.gov.uk

--_000_CWLP123MB2467FB9A55617166098822C0D75E0CWLP123MB2467GBRP_
Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

<html>
<head>
<meta http-equiv=3D"Content-Type" content=3D"text/html; charset=3Diso-8859-=
1">
<style type=3D"text/css" style=3D"display:none;"> P {margin-top:0;margin-bo=
ttom:0;} </style>
</head>
<body dir=3D"ltr">
<div style=3D"font-family: Calibri, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif; font-size=
: 12pt; color: rgb(0, 0, 0);">
Hi everyone,</div>
<div style=3D"font-family: Calibri, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif; font-size=
: 12pt; color: rgb(0, 0, 0);">
<br>
</div>
<div style=3D"font-family: Calibri, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif; font-size=
: 12pt; color: rgb(0, 0, 0);">
Just a reminder that we are meeting today at 4:10pm CET (in just over an ho=
ur).</div>
<div style=3D"font-family: Calibri, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif; font-size=
: 12pt; color: rgb(0, 0, 0);">
<span style=3D"color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: Calibri, Arial, Helvetica,=
 sans-serif; font-size: 12pt;">All slide decks are available here:
</span><a href=3D"https://datatracker.ietf.org/meeting/104/session/smart" i=
d=3D"LPlnk823243" style=3D"font-family: Calibri, Arial, Helvetica, sans-ser=
if; font-size: 12pt;">https://datatracker.ietf.org/meeting/104/session/smar=
t</a><br>
</div>
<div style=3D"font-family: Calibri, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif; font-size=
: 12pt; color: rgb(0, 0, 0);">
<br>
</div>
<div style=3D"font-family: Calibri, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif; font-size=
: 12pt; color: rgb(0, 0, 0);">
And the agenda is pasted below for your information. See you there!</div>
<div style=3D"font-family: Calibri, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif; font-size=
: 12pt; color: rgb(0, 0, 0);">
<br>
</div>
<div style=3D"font-family: Calibri, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif; font-size=
: 12pt; color: rgb(0, 0, 0);">
Kirsty</div>
<div style=3D"font-family: Calibri, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif; font-size=
: 12pt; color: rgb(0, 0, 0);">
<br>
</div>
<div style=3D"font-family: Calibri, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif; font-size=
: 12pt; color: rgb(0, 0, 0);">
=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D</div>
<div style=3D"font-family: Calibri, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif; font-size=
: 12pt; color: rgb(0, 0, 0);">
<br>
</div>
<div style=3D"font-family: Calibri, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif; font-size=
: 12pt; color: rgb(0, 0, 0);">
<span>**Monday 25th March, 16:10-18:10**<br>
</span>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>Slide decks are available here: <a href=3D"https://datatracker.ietf.or=
g/meeting/104/session/smart" id=3D"LPlnk187859">
https://datatracker.ietf.org/meeting/104/session/smart</a>&nbsp;<br>
</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>* Chair Time, Charter &amp; Group Setup (Kathleen / Kirsty) - 10 minut=
es<br>
</div>
<div>SMART's draft charter is here: <a href=3D"https://github.com/smart-rg/=
drafts/blob/master/draft-charter.md" id=3D"LPNoLP545001">
https://github.com/smart-rg/drafts/blob/master/draft-charter.md</a>&nbsp;<b=
r>
</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>* Threat Landscape (Arnaud Taddei) - 15 minutes<br>
</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>* Malicious Uses of Evasive Communications and Threats to Privacy (Dav=
id McGrew) - 15 minutes<br>
</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>* Testing for the good of the internet (Simon Edwards) - 20 minutes<br=
>
</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>* BGP hijacking (Toma Gavrichenkov) - 20 minutes<br>
</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>* CLESS draft on endpoint security (Arnaud Taddei) - 10 minutes<br>
</div>
<div>&nbsp;The draft being discussed is draft-taddei-cless-introduction-00<=
br>
</div>
<div>&nbsp;Available at <a href=3D"https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-t=
addei-smart-cless-introduction/" id=3D"LPNoLP114820">
https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-taddei-smart-cless-introduction/</a>=
&nbsp;</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>* One Snake (NCSC Senior Speaker) - 20 minutes</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<span>* Chair Wrap-Up &amp; Discussion (Kathleen / Kirsty) - 10 minutes</sp=
an><br>
</div>
<div style=3D"font-family: Calibri, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif; font-size=
: 12pt; color: rgb(0, 0, 0);">
<br>
</div>
This information is exempt under the Freedom of Information Act 2000 (FOIA)=
 and may be exempt under other UK information legislation. Refer any FOIA q=
ueries to ncscinfoleg@ncsc.gov.uk
</body>
</html>

--_000_CWLP123MB2467FB9A55617166098822C0D75E0CWLP123MB2467GBRP_--


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From: Bret Jordan <jordan.ietf@gmail.com>
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Subject: [Smart] Nice blog post on cert abuse
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h=
ttps://www.helpnetsecurity.com/2019/03/26/using-encryption-to-conceal-and-=
launch-attacks/ =
<https://www.helpnetsecurity.com/2019/03/26/using-encryption-to-conceal-an=
d-launch-attacks/>


Thanks,
Bret
PGP Fingerprint: 63B4 FC53 680A 6B7D 1447  F2C0 74F8 ACAE 7415 0050
"Without cryptography vihv vivc ce xhrnrw, however, the only thing that =
can not be unscrambled is an egg."


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<html><head><meta http-equiv=3D"Content-Type" content=3D"text/html; =
charset=3Dus-ascii"></head><body style=3D"word-wrap: break-word; =
-webkit-nbsp-mode: space; line-break: after-white-space;" class=3D""><div =
class=3D""><a =
href=3D"https://www.helpnetsecurity.com/2019/03/26/using-encryption-to-con=
ceal-and-launch-attacks/" target=3D"_blank" rel=3D"noopener noreferrer" =
data-auth=3D"NotApplicable" class=3D"x_OWAAutoLink" style=3D"margin: =
0px; padding: 0px; border: 0px; font-variant-ligatures: normal; =
font-variant-numeric: inherit; font-variant-east-asian: inherit; =
font-stretch: inherit; font-size: 16px; line-height: inherit; =
font-family: Calibri, Helvetica, sans-serif, serif, EmojiFont; =
vertical-align: baseline; orphans: 2; widows: 2; background-color: =
rgb(255, 255, =
255);">https://www.helpnetsecurity.com/2019/03/26/using-encryption-to-conc=
eal-and-launch-attacks/</a></div><div class=3D""><br class=3D""></div><br =
class=3D""><div class=3D"">
<div style=3D"caret-color: rgb(0, 0, 0); color: rgb(0, 0, 0); =
font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 14px; font-style: normal; =
font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; =
orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: =
none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; =
-webkit-text-size-adjust: auto; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; =
text-decoration: none;"><div class=3D"" style=3D"orphans: 2; widows: 2; =
font-variant-ligatures: normal; font-variant-east-asian: normal; =
font-variant-position: normal; line-height: normal; =
-webkit-text-decorations-in-effect: none;"><span =
class=3D"Apple-style-span" style=3D"border-collapse: separate; =
font-variant-ligatures: normal; font-variant-east-asian: normal; =
font-variant-position: normal; line-height: normal; border-spacing: 0px; =
-webkit-text-decorations-in-effect: none;">Thanks,</span></div><div =
class=3D"" style=3D"orphans: 2; widows: 2; font-variant-ligatures: =
normal; font-variant-east-asian: normal; font-variant-position: normal; =
line-height: normal; -webkit-text-decorations-in-effect: none;"><span =
class=3D"Apple-style-span" style=3D"border-collapse: separate; =
font-variant-ligatures: normal; font-variant-east-asian: normal; =
font-variant-position: normal; line-height: normal; text-align: =
-webkit-auto; border-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-decorations-in-effect: =
none;">Bret</span></div><div class=3D"" style=3D"orphans: 2; widows: =
2;"><span class=3D"Apple-style-span" style=3D"border-collapse: separate; =
text-align: -webkit-auto; border-spacing: 0px;"><span =
class=3D"Apple-style-span" style=3D"border-collapse: separate; =
text-align: -webkit-auto; border-spacing: 0px;"><div class=3D"" =
style=3D"word-wrap: break-word; -webkit-nbsp-mode: space; line-break: =
after-white-space;"><span class=3D"Apple-style-span" =
style=3D"border-collapse: separate; text-align: -webkit-auto; =
border-spacing: 0px;"><div class=3D"" style=3D"word-wrap: break-word; =
-webkit-nbsp-mode: space; line-break: after-white-space;"><span =
class=3D"Apple-style-span" style=3D"border-collapse: separate; =
text-align: -webkit-auto; border-spacing: 0px;"><div class=3D"" =
style=3D"word-wrap: break-word; -webkit-nbsp-mode: space; line-break: =
after-white-space;"><span class=3D"Apple-style-span" =
style=3D"border-collapse: separate; text-align: -webkit-auto; =
border-spacing: 0px;"><div class=3D""><font color=3D"#7c7c7c" =
face=3D"Calibre, Verdana" class=3D"" style=3D"font-variant-ligatures: =
normal; font-variant-east-asian: normal; font-variant-position: normal; =
line-height: normal; -webkit-text-decorations-in-effect: none;"><span =
class=3D"" style=3D"font-size: 11px;">PGP =
Fingerprint:&nbsp;</span></font><span class=3D"" style=3D"text-align: =
-webkit-auto; font-size: 11px;"><font color=3D"#7c7c7c" face=3D"Calibre, =
Verdana" class=3D"">63B4 FC53 680A 6B7D 1447 &nbsp;F2C0 74F8 ACAE 7415 =
0050</font></span></div><div class=3D"" style=3D"font-variant-ligatures: =
normal; font-variant-east-asian: normal; font-variant-position: normal; =
line-height: normal; -webkit-text-decorations-in-effect: none;"><span =
class=3D"" style=3D"color: rgb(124, 124, 124); font-size: 8pt; =
font-family: Calibre, Verdana; text-align: -webkit-auto;">"Without =
cryptography vihv vivc ce xhrnrw, however, the only thing that can not =
be unscrambled is an =
egg."</span></div></span></div></span></div></span></div></span></span></d=
iv></div>
</div>

<br class=3D""></body></html>=

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