From nobody Sat Jul 1 16:25:24 2017 Return-Path: X-Original-To: taps@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: taps@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9AD1812741D for ; Sat, 1 Jul 2017 16:25:23 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -4.2 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-4.2 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-2.3, RP_MATCHES_RCVD=-0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id kM2GuWWBRdJ1 for ; Sat, 1 Jul 2017 16:25:20 -0700 (PDT) Received: from nasse.dc.kau.se (smtp.kau.se [193.10.220.39]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 07272127977 for ; Sat, 1 Jul 2017 16:25:19 -0700 (PDT) To: References: <3A3686B5-FF60-448E-9E13-4B493B472C6D@gmail.com> <77C2BA95-F95B-4597-9159-7D5FC4068860@gmail.com> From: Anna Brunstrom Message-ID: Date: Sun, 2 Jul 2017 01:25:12 +0200 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows NT 6.1; WOW64; rv:52.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/52.2.0 MIME-Version: 1.0 In-Reply-To: <77C2BA95-F95B-4597-9159-7D5FC4068860@gmail.com> Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="------------165871580D2BF1C96223EDCC" Content-Language: en-US X-ClientProxiedBy: Exch-A2.personal.kau (130.243.19.83) To Exch-A2.personal.kau (130.243.19.83) Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Taps] Prague agenda planning X-BeenThere: taps@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions on Transport Services List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sat, 01 Jul 2017 23:25:23 -0000 --------------165871580D2BF1C96223EDCC Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Hi Aaron, all, We plan to submit an update to the happy-eyeballs draft before the cut-off and would like to add that to the agenda as well. The update aims to address the feedback received so far. I think it fits nicely with the policy discussion. The HE framework in the draft includes a Policy Management component. The HE algorithm makes certain assumptions on what it provides, but it is not part of the HE algorithm itself. Two topics to discuss about the draft would be: * the interface between the HE algorithm and the policy management * what should be detailed in the specification of the HE algorithm and what should be left open for implementation Cheers, Anna On 2017-06-29 21:53, Aaron Falk wrote: > > Updated: > > 1. > > *|draft-gjessing-taps-minset-05.txt|* > > * There’s been some interesting discussion on the draft. Are > there any specific topics we should set aside time to discuss? > 2. > > *Transport Security Protocol Survey*, Tommy > > * The common features/interface presented by various security > protocols > * The ability to separate security handshakes from data encryption > 3. > > *Socket Intents, Concepts & Communication Granularity*, Phillipp > > 4. > > *Application- & System-Specified Policy & TAPS*, Brian? Tommy? > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > > * Michio Honda HotNets paper “PASTE: Network Stacks Must Integrate > with NVMM Abstractions > ” > o /“These days I'm working on networking interface for > non-volatile main memory (a.k.a. persistent memory and > storage-class memory), because with such devices networking > stack/API becomes a bottleneck in the end-to-end communication > that involves persistent media (disk or SSDs for now). I saw > some post-socket discussion in the minutes of the last > meeting, so I wonder if this type of work could give some > useful information to IETFers who design new transport API > standards.”/ > o Is there interest in this topic? AFAIK, there’s no Internet > Draft. I will inquire whether Michio intends to submit one. > May end up in TSVAREA > > > > _______________________________________________ > Taps mailing list > Taps@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/taps --------------165871580D2BF1C96223EDCC Content-Type: text/html; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit

Hi Aaron, all,

We plan to submit an update to the happy-eyeballs  draft before the cut-off and would like to add that to the agenda as well. The update aims to address the feedback received so far.

I think it fits nicely with the policy discussion. The HE framework in the draft includes a Policy Management component. The HE algorithm makes certain assumptions on what it provides, but it is not part of the HE algorithm itself.

Two topics to discuss about the draft would be:
* the interface between the HE algorithm and the policy management
* what should be detailed in the specification of the HE algorithm and what should be left open for implementation

Cheers,
Anna


On 2017-06-29 21:53, Aaron Falk wrote:

Updated:

  1. draft-gjessing-taps-minset-05.txt

    • There’s been some interesting discussion on the draft. Are there any specific topics we should set aside time to discuss?

  2. Transport Security Protocol Survey, Tommy

    • The common features/interface presented by various security protocols
    • The ability to separate security handshakes from data encryption

  3. Socket Intents, Concepts & Communication Granularity, Phillipp

  4. Application- & System-Specified Policy & TAPS, Brian? Tommy?

  • Michio Honda HotNets paper “PASTE: Network Stacks Must Integrate with NVMM Abstractions”
    • “These days I'm working on networking interface for non-volatile main memory (a.k.a. persistent memory and storage-class memory), because with such devices networking stack/API becomes a bottleneck in the end-to-end communication that involves persistent media (disk or SSDs for now). I saw some post-socket discussion in the minutes of the last meeting, so I wonder if this type of work could give some useful information to IETFers who design new transport API standards.”
    • Is there interest in this topic? AFAIK, there’s no Internet Draft. I will inquire whether Michio intends to submit one. May end up in TSVAREA


_______________________________________________
Taps mailing list
Taps@ietf.org
https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/taps

--------------165871580D2BF1C96223EDCC-- From nobody Mon Jul 3 01:16:54 2017 Return-Path: X-Original-To: taps@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: taps@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 40B6312EC3A for ; Mon, 3 Jul 2017 01:16:53 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.901 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.901 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, RP_MATCHES_RCVD=-0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 7LiLRw5T2pl7 for ; Mon, 3 Jul 2017 01:16:50 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail-out02.uio.no (mail-out02.uio.no [IPv6:2001:700:100:8210::71]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 1E3CD12EC04 for ; Mon, 3 Jul 2017 01:16:50 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail-mx01.uio.no ([129.240.10.26]) by mail-out02.uio.no with esmtp (Exim 4.82_1-5b7a7c0-XX) (envelope-from ) id 1dRwXH-000FaC-Nq for taps@ietf.org; Mon, 03 Jul 2017 10:16:47 +0200 Received: from 1x-193-157-254-65.uio.no ([193.157.254.65]) by mail-mx01.uio.no with esmtpsa (TLSv1.2:DHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384:256) user michawe (Exim 4.82_1-5b7a7c0-XX) (envelope-from ) id 1dRwXG-0006jq-RJ; Mon, 03 Jul 2017 10:16:47 +0200 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Mime-Version: 1.0 (Mac OS X Mail 10.3 \(3273\)) From: Michael Welzl In-Reply-To: Date: Mon, 3 Jul 2017 10:16:49 +0200 Cc: "taps@ietf.org" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Message-Id: <8B4E017A-47D9-49ED-84A2-303055E66CE6@ifi.uio.no> References: <149858819190.31089.15287933072764133714.idtracker@ietfa.amsl.com> To: "Philipp S. Tiesel" X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.3273) X-UiO-SPF-Received: Received-SPF: neutral (mail-mx01.uio.no: 193.157.254.65 is neither permitted nor denied by domain of ifi.uio.no) client-ip=193.157.254.65; envelope-from=michawe@ifi.uio.no; helo=1x-193-157-254-65.uio.no; X-UiO-Ratelimit-Test: rcpts/h 2 msgs/h 1 sum rcpts/h 2 sum msgs/h 1 total rcpts 56113 max rcpts/h 54 ratelimit 0 X-UiO-Spam-info: not spam, SpamAssassin (score=-5.0, required=5.0, autolearn=disabled, AWL=0.001, RP_MATCHES_RCVD=-0.001, UIO_MAIL_IS_INTERNAL=-5, uiobl=NO, uiouri=NO) X-UiO-Scanned: DE920092D526627E40B3B2B5DC57550E7437318F X-UiO-SPAM-Test: remote_host: 193.157.254.65 spam_score: -49 maxlevel 80 minaction 2 bait 0 mail/h: 1 total 85 max/h 8 blacklist 0 greylist 0 ratelimit 0 Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Taps] New Version Notification for draft-tiesel-taps-communitgrany-00.txt X-BeenThere: taps@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions on Transport Services List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 03 Jul 2017 08:16:53 -0000 Hi, +1 on discussing terminology: this is a painful read, because it=E2=80=99s= a document that puts a finger deep into a wound :-) So it seems to me that it=E2=80=99s clear we need to agree on a common = terminology. Since I won=E2=80=99t be there, just for the record: I = don=E2=80=99t have strong opinions about terminology. The one we=E2=80=99re using in minset (e.g. flow, ..) was a quick = choice, I=E2=80=99ll be happy to update along with what the majority = thinks. Cheers, Michael > On Jun 28, 2017, at 11:42 AM, Philipp S. Tiesel = wrote: >=20 > Hi, >=20 > as promised, here is our second draft towards automatic selection of = transport option. >=20 > It is primarily focusing on endpoint- and path selection and still = lacks details about Transport Protocol Stack Instance Selection. >=20 > Thanks to Mirja for early feedback preventing unnecessary terminology = issues. > Nevertheless, I expect some discussion about terminology. >=20 > I welcome feedback and suggestions where more detail/discussion is = needed.=20 >=20 >> Begin forwarded message: >>=20 >> From: internet-drafts@ietf.org >> Subject: New Version Notification for = draft-tiesel-taps-communitgrany-00.txt >> Date: 27. June 2017 at 20:29:51 GMT+2 >> To: "Philipp Tiesel" , "Theresa Enghardt" = , "Philipp S. Tiesel" = >>=20 >>=20 >> A new version of I-D, draft-tiesel-taps-communitgrany-00.txt >> has been successfully submitted by Philipp S. Tiesel and posted to = the >> IETF repository. >>=20 >> Name: draft-tiesel-taps-communitgrany >> Revision: 00 >> Title: Communication Units Granularity Considerations = for Multi-Path Aware Transport Selection >> Document date: 2017-06-27 >> Group: Individual Submission >> Pages: 10 >> URL: = https://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-tiesel-taps-communitgrany-00.tx= t >> Status: = https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-tiesel-taps-communitgrany/ >> Htmlized: = https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-tiesel-taps-communitgrany-00 >> Htmlized: = https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/html/draft-tiesel-taps-communitgrany-00 >>=20 >>=20 >> Abstract: >> This document provides an abstract framework to reason about the >> composition of multi-path aware systems in a protocol-independent >> fashion. It discusses basic mechanisms that are used in multi-path >> systems and their applicability to different granularities of >> communication units. This document is targeted as consideration >> basis for automation of destination, path and transport protocol >> selection within the transport layer. >>=20 >>=20 >>=20 >>=20 >> Please note that it may take a couple of minutes from the time of = submission >> until the htmlized version and diff are available at tools.ietf.org. >>=20 >> The IETF Secretariat >>=20 >=20 > AVE! > Philipp S. Tiesel >=20 > --=20 > Technische Universit=C3=A4t Berlin =E2=80=93 FG Internet Network = Architectures (INET) > office: MAR 4.024 / Sekr.: MAR 4.4, Marchstr. 23, 10587 Berlin > e-mail: philipp@inet.tu-berlin.de =E2=80=A2 phone: +49-30-314-75763 >=20 >=20 > _______________________________________________ > Taps mailing list > Taps@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/taps From nobody Mon Jul 3 08:00:45 2017 Return-Path: X-Original-To: taps@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: taps@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id F1BBB13165E for ; Mon, 3 Jul 2017 08:00:43 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -4.302 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-4.302 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-2.3, RP_MATCHES_RCVD=-0.001, SPF_HELO_PASS=-0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); 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Wood and posted to the > IETF repository. > > Name: draft-pauly-taps-transport-security > Revision: 00 > Title: A Survey of Transport Security Protocols > Document date: 2017-07-03 > Group: Individual Submission > Pages: 22 > URL: https://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-pauly-taps-transport-security-00.txt > Status: https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-pauly-taps-transport-security/ > Htmlized: https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-pauly-taps-transport-security-00 > Htmlized: https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/html/draft-pauly-taps-transport-security-00 > > > Abstract: > This document provides a survey of commonly used or notable network > security protocols, with a focus on how they interact and integrate > with applications and transport protocols. Its goal is to supplement > efforts to define and catalog transport services [RFC8095] by > describing the interfaces required to add security protocols. It > examines Transport Layer Security (TLS), Datagram Transport Layer > Security (DTLS), Quick UDP Internet Connections with TLS (QUIC + > TLS), MinimalT, CurveCP, tcpcrypt, and Internet Key Exchange with > Encapsulating Security Protocol (IKEv2 + ESP). This survey is not > limited to protocols developed within the scope or context of the > IETF. > > > > > Please note that it may take a couple of minutes from the time of submission > until the htmlized version and diff are available at tools.ietf.org. > > The IETF Secretariat > From nobody Mon Jul 3 08:09:06 2017 Return-Path: X-Original-To: taps@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: taps@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id C3E5C131661 for ; Mon, 3 Jul 2017 08:09:04 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.9 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.9 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, RP_MATCHES_RCVD=-0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id V-le8nruCEeV for ; Mon, 3 Jul 2017 08:09:02 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail.net.t-labs.tu-berlin.de (mail1.net.t-labs.tu-berlin.de [IPv6:2001:638:809:ff11:130:149:220:242]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 498CA131548 for ; Mon, 3 Jul 2017 08:09:02 -0700 (PDT) Received: from [130.149.220.45] (esmeralda.net.t-labs.tu-berlin.de [130.149.220.45]) by mail.net.t-labs.tu-berlin.de (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 9C2131586 for ; Mon, 3 Jul 2017 17:09:00 +0200 (CEST) References: <149909377344.22817.6295821331583731188.idtracker@ietfa.amsl.com> From: Theresa Enghardt To: taps@ietf.org X-Forwarded-Message-Id: <149909377344.22817.6295821331583731188.idtracker@ietfa.amsl.com> Message-ID: Date: Mon, 3 Jul 2017 17:09:00 +0200 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; Linux x86_64; rv:45.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/45.8.0 MIME-Version: 1.0 In-Reply-To: <149909377344.22817.6295821331583731188.idtracker@ietfa.amsl.com> Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="------------F5F626C2DE384AB2EBD2F21F" Archived-At: Subject: [Taps] Fwd: New Version Notification for draft-tiesel-taps-socketintents-bsdsockets-00.txt X-BeenThere: taps@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions on Transport Services List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 03 Jul 2017 15:09:05 -0000 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --------------F5F626C2DE384AB2EBD2F21F Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Dear TAPS, as promised, here is our third draft describing the Socket Intents prototype, including policies and several API variants that we implemented, as well as lessons learned from implementing these APIs. Best, Theresa -------- Forwarded Message -------- Subject: New Version Notification for draft-tiesel-taps-socketintents-bsdsockets-00.txt Date: Mon, 03 Jul 2017 07:56:13 -0700 From: internet-drafts@ietf.org To: Philipp Tiesel , Theresa Enghardt , Philipp S. Tiesel A new version of I-D, draft-tiesel-taps-socketintents-bsdsockets-00.txt has been successfully submitted by Theresa Enghardt and posted to the IETF repository. Name: draft-tiesel-taps-socketintents-bsdsockets Revision: 00 Title: A Socket Intents Prototype for the BSD Socket API - Experiences, Lessons Learned and Considerations Document date: 2017-07-03 Group: Individual Submission Pages: 24 URL: https://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-tiesel-taps-socketintents-bsdsockets-00.txt Status: https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-tiesel-taps-socketintents-bsdsockets/ Htmlized: https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-tiesel-taps-socketintents-bsdsockets-00 Htmlized: https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/html/draft-tiesel-taps-socketintents-bsdsockets-00 Abstract: This document describes a prototype implementation of Socket Intents [I-D.tiesel-taps-socketintents] for the BSD Socket API as an illustrative example how Socket Intents could be implemented. It described the experiences made with the prototype and lessons learned from trying to extend the BSD Socket API. Please note that it may take a couple of minutes from the time of submission until the htmlized version and diff are available at tools.ietf.org. The IETF Secretariat --------------F5F626C2DE384AB2EBD2F21F Content-Type: text/html; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

Dear TAPS,

as promised, here is our third draft describing the Socket Intents prototype, including policies and several API variants that we implemented, as well as lessons learned from implementing these APIs.

Best,
Theresa


-------- Forwarded Message --------
Subject: New Version Notification for draft-tiesel-taps-socketintents-bsdsockets-00.txt
Date: Mon, 03 Jul 2017 07:56:13 -0700
From: internet-drafts@ietf.org
To: Philipp Tiesel <philipp@inet.tu-berlin.de>, Theresa Enghardt <theresa@inet.tu-berlin.de>, Philipp S. Tiesel <philipp@inet.tu-berlin.de> 


A new version of I-D, draft-tiesel-taps-socketintents-bsdsockets-00.txt
has been successfully submitted by Theresa Enghardt and posted to the
IETF repository.

Name:		draft-tiesel-taps-socketintents-bsdsockets
Revision:	00
Title:		A Socket Intents Prototype for the BSD Socket API - Experiences, Lessons Learned and Considerations
Document date:	2017-07-03
Group:		Individual Submission
Pages:		24
URL:            https://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-tiesel-taps-socketintents-bsdsockets-00.txt
Status:         https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-tiesel-taps-socketintents-bsdsockets/
Htmlized:       https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-tiesel-taps-socketintents-bsdsockets-00
Htmlized:       https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/html/draft-tiesel-taps-socketintents-bsdsockets-00


Abstract:
   This document describes a prototype implementation of Socket Intents
   [I-D.tiesel-taps-socketintents] for the BSD Socket API as an
   illustrative example how Socket Intents could be implemented.  It
   described the experiences made with the prototype and lessons learned
   from trying to extend the BSD Socket API.

                                                                                  


Please note that it may take a couple of minutes from the time of submission
until the htmlized version and diff are available at tools.ietf.org.

The IETF Secretariat
--------------F5F626C2DE384AB2EBD2F21F-- From nobody Mon Jul 3 08:14:40 2017 Return-Path: X-Original-To: taps@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: taps@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0F04E131682 for ; Mon, 3 Jul 2017 08:14:39 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -4.301 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-4.301 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-2.3, RP_MATCHES_RCVD=-0.001, SPF_HELO_PASS=-0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=apple.com Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 4ZsKhO4G_EWR for ; Mon, 3 Jul 2017 08:14:37 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail-in2.apple.com (mail-out2.apple.com [17.151.62.25]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id E91DA12EC30 for ; 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Mon, 3 Jul 2017 08:14:25 -0700 (PDT) X-AuditID: 11973e11-327ff70000001c2e-d1-595a5f514dc3 Received: from nwk-mmpp-sz10.apple.com (nwk-mmpp-sz10.apple.com [17.128.115.122]) by relay6.apple.com (Apple SCV relay) with SMTP id BF.64.05199.15F5A595; Mon, 3 Jul 2017 08:14:25 -0700 (PDT) MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: multipart/alternative; boundary="Boundary_(ID_TUDWwhLtb2wOGzFe7L+V8g)" Received: from [17.234.8.56] (unknown [17.234.8.56]) by nwk-mmpp-sz10.apple.com (Oracle Communications Messaging Server 8.0.1.2.20170210 64bit (built Feb 10 2017)) with ESMTPSA id <0OSI006JDT01OU40@nwk-mmpp-sz10.apple.com> for taps@ietf.org; Mon, 03 Jul 2017 08:14:25 -0700 (PDT) Sender: tpauly@apple.com From: Tommy Pauly Message-id: References: <149909450116.22739.16813462864823613975.idtracker@ietfa.amsl.com> To: taps WG Date: Mon, 03 Jul 2017 08:14:24 -0700 X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.3439) X-Brightmail-Tracker: H4sIAAAAAAAAA+NgFlrDLMWRmVeSWpSXmKPExsUi2FAYpRsYHxVp8HOWocWdGAdGjyVLfjIF MEZx2aSk5mSWpRbp2yVwZXz+cZGl4LtzxYJt29gbGOfadDFyckgImEj8f9vMDGILCaxmktiy hLGLkQMsvu2ORBcjF1D4EKPEu48n2EBqeAUEJX5MvscCYjMLhEmsWTKRBaJoLpNE24V/rCDN wgISEpv3JILUsAmoSBz/tgFsvrBAiMT6ae/ZIebYSOx82cYIsddPYt/mP2DzRQSkJd7MOQ1W zyKgKrFzw2ZWiHtkJZb+CQFZJSEwh02if+IcxgmMArOQnDQLyUkQtpbE90etQDYHkC0vcfC8 LERYU+LZvU/sELa2xJN3F1gXMLKtYhTKTczM0c3MM9JLLCjISdVLzs/dxAgK3ul2gjsYj6+y OsQowMGoxMN7wT4qUog1say4MvcQozQHi5I4b/y9sEghgfTEktTs1NSC1KL4otKc1OJDjEwc nFINjGLX+I3VBdn59POeJP/QaDi8uvBRhNO5r+7MN5b+LVlnJ99cdDt2Vv5GjZc6M1ct/Nwi wf/Q4YnCfIFNC5nebfvt2LPTIsfTrOmtYZW45anPP/+bOapf83h3yF6Z4/SaCrXsEwYuh8Sn ysx/t9b60ERZzW+HnLUkj/qfjiy+6+dX56k27V/xRyWW4oxEQy3mouJEALC5/Y4/AgAA X-Brightmail-Tracker: H4sIAAAAAAAAA+NgFprOIsWRmVeSWpSXmKPExsUi2FBcpRsYHxVp0L9M1+JOjAOjx5IlP5kC GKO4bFJSczLLUov07RK4Mj7/uMhS8N25YsG2bewNjHNtuhg5OCQETCS23ZHoYuTiEBI4xCjx 7uMJti5GTg5eAUGJH5PvsYDYzAJhEmuWTGSBKJrLJNF24R8rSLOwgITE5j2JIDVsAioSx79t YAaxhQVCJNZPe88OMcdGYufLNkYQW0jAT2Lf5j9g80UEpCXezDkNVs8ioCqxc8NmVoh7ZCWW /gmZwMg7C8kVs5BcAWFrSXx/1ApkcwDZ8hIHz8tChDUlnt37xA5ha0s8eXeBdQEj2ypGgaLU nMRKM73EgoKcVL3k/NxNjOBwK4zawdiw3OoQowAHoxIP7wX7qEgh1sSy4spcYFBwMCuJ8G6L AQrxpiRWVqUW5ccXleakFh9inMgIdPNEZinR5HxgNOSVxBuamBiYGBubGRubm5jTUlhJnDfv fkSkkEB6YklqdmpqQWoRzFFMHJxSDYxys6zunFBz7dwpwb192RleTYeijQnHWLpqCuqEq28u /btzup/0dNcL+dcsejnNBR5NKl4fOCdd3mDP8Yh9r5qq2W7tKuYxzTpXs7vic1yv6ONfsreu q0+d3aH9Nkjjo/92hT611Z5Zq0K7tsRYatimnHmQVNyhv97Gwzu8eMa9+3cSv1fZmyqxFGck GmoxFxUnAgD2RdzGqgIAAA== Archived-At: Subject: [Taps] Fwd: New Version Notification for draft-kuehlewind-taps-crypto-sep-00.txt X-BeenThere: taps@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions on Transport Services List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 03 Jul 2017 15:14:39 -0000 --Boundary_(ID_TUDWwhLtb2wOGzFe7L+V8g) Content-type: text/plain; CHARSET=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT > Begin forwarded message: > > From: internet-drafts@ietf.org > Subject: New Version Notification for draft-kuehlewind-taps-crypto-sep-00.txt > Date: July 3, 2017 at 8:08:21 AM PDT > To: Mirja Kuehlewind , Christopher Wood , Tommy Pauly , "Christopher A. Wood" > > > A new version of I-D, draft-kuehlewind-taps-crypto-sep-00.txt > has been successfully submitted by Christopher A. Wood and posted to the > IETF repository. > > Name: draft-kuehlewind-taps-crypto-sep > Revision: 00 > Title: Separating Crypto Negotiation and Communication > Document date: 2017-07-03 > Group: Individual Submission > Pages: 12 > URL: https://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-kuehlewind-taps-crypto-sep-00.txt > Status: https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-kuehlewind-taps-crypto-sep/ > Htmlized: https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-kuehlewind-taps-crypto-sep-00 > Htmlized: https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/html/draft-kuehlewind-taps-crypto-sep-00 > > > Abstract: > Due to the latency involved in connection setup and security > handshakes, there is an increasing deployment of cryptographic > session resumption mechanisms. While cryptographic context and > endpoint capabilities need to be be known before encrypted > application data can be sent, there is otherwise no technical > constraint that the crypto handshake must be performed on the same > transport connection. This document recommends a logical separation > between the mechanism(s) used to negotiate capabilities and set up > encryption context (handshake protocol), the application of > encryption and authentication state to data (record protocol), and > the associated transport connection(s). > > > > > Please note that it may take a couple of minutes from the time of submission > until the htmlized version and diff are available at tools.ietf.org. > > The IETF Secretariat > --Boundary_(ID_TUDWwhLtb2wOGzFe7L+V8g) Content-type: text/html; CHARSET=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: quoted-printable

Begin forwarded message:

From: = internet-drafts@ietf.org
Subject: = New Version = Notification for draft-kuehlewind-taps-crypto-sep-00.txt
Date: = July 3, 2017 at 8:08:21 AM = PDT
To: = Mirja Kuehlewind <mirja.kuehlewind@tik.ee.ethz.ch>, Christopher Wood = <cawood@apple.com>, Tommy Pauly <tpauly@apple.com>, = "Christopher A. Wood" <cawood@apple.com>


A new version = of I-D, draft-kuehlewind-taps-crypto-sep-00.txt
has been = successfully submitted by Christopher A. Wood and posted to the
IETF repository.

Name: = draft-kuehlewind-taps-crypto-sep
Revision: 00
Title:= = Separating Crypto Negotiation and Communication
Document date: 2017-07-03
Group:= = Individual Submission
Pages: 12
URL: =            https://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-kuehlewind-taps-cryp= to-sep-00.txt
Status: =         https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-kuehlewind-taps-crypto-s= ep/
Htmlized:       https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-kuehlewind-taps-crypto-sep-00=
Htmlized:       https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/html/draft-kuehlewind-taps-cry= pto-sep-00


Abstract:
  Due to the latency involved in connection setup = and security
  handshakes, there is an = increasing deployment of cryptographic
=   session resumption mechanisms.  While cryptographic = context and
  endpoint capabilities need to be = be known before encrypted
  application data = can be sent, there is otherwise no technical
=   constraint that the crypto handshake must be performed on = the same
  transport connection.  This = document recommends a logical separation
=   between the mechanism(s) used to negotiate capabilities and = set up
  encryption context (handshake = protocol), the application of
  encryption and = authentication state to data (record protocol), and
=   the associated transport connection(s).




Please note that = it may take a couple of minutes from the time of submission
until the htmlized version and diff are available at tools.ietf.org.

The IETF Secretariat


= --Boundary_(ID_TUDWwhLtb2wOGzFe7L+V8g)-- From nobody Mon Jul 3 08:14:47 2017 Return-Path: X-Original-To: taps@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: taps@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id BBA0E131670 for ; Mon, 3 Jul 2017 08:14:45 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -4.301 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-4.301 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-2.3, RP_MATCHES_RCVD=-0.001, SPF_HELO_PASS=-0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=apple.com Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 8BDyoWdWzrVh for ; Mon, 3 Jul 2017 08:14:44 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail-in24.apple.com (mail-out24.apple.com [17.171.2.34]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 2472F12EC2D for ; 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Mon, 3 Jul 2017 08:14:32 -0700 (PDT) X-AuditID: 11ab0218-b453b9c000001882-a7-595a5f57fa94 Received: from nwk-mmpp-sz10.apple.com (nwk-mmpp-sz10.apple.com [17.128.115.122]) by relay3.apple.com (Apple SCV relay) with SMTP id B9.77.04862.55F5A595; Mon, 3 Jul 2017 08:14:30 -0700 (PDT) MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: multipart/alternative; boundary="Boundary_(ID_xNkJXswIUceqHsIoZFT93Q)" Received: from [17.234.8.56] (unknown [17.234.8.56]) by nwk-mmpp-sz10.apple.com (Oracle Communications Messaging Server 8.0.1.2.20170210 64bit (built Feb 10 2017)) with ESMTPSA id <0OSI006JDT01OU40@nwk-mmpp-sz10.apple.com>; Mon, 03 Jul 2017 08:14:29 -0700 (PDT) Sender: tpauly@apple.com From: Tommy Pauly Message-id: <31AF3404-1648-45F7-9C32-5A48F2F63AE2@apple.com> Date: Mon, 03 Jul 2017 08:14:29 -0700 Cc: Chris Wood , =?utf-8?Q?Mirja_K=C3=BChlewind?= To: taps WG X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.3439) X-Brightmail-Tracker: H4sIAAAAAAAAA+NgFtrGLMWRmVeSWpSXmKPExsUi2FAYrBsRHxVpcPuRoMWG1VNYLO7EODB5 LFnyk8nj2IevbAFMUVw2Kak5mWWpRfp2CVwZi+90MRe8l694t9StgfG0dBcjJ4eEgInE2q5W 1i5GLg4hgTVMErOPTWCHSbx7d4MZInGIUWJX82lmkASvgKDEj8n3WEBsZoEwicYnPSwQRd1M EjNXTQUq4uAQFpCQ2LwnEaSGTUBF4vi3DWC9wgI2EuvPf2UFKeEFsg9tdwQJswioSpyeAdHJ LJAu8bMxECQsIiAt8WbOabCwhICsxNI/ISCLJATmsEksXHySdQKjwCwkB81CctAssEnqElOm 5EKEtSWevLvACmGrSSz8vYgJWXwBI9sqRuHcxMwc3cw8IxO9xIKCnFS95PzcTYyggF7NJLGD 8ctrw0OMAhyMSjy8Gk5RkUKsiWXFlbmHGKU5WJTEeb8/CIsUEkhPLEnNTk0tSC2KLyrNSS0+ xMjEwSkFDGtdruv75vH9KKiS2f+Oh2lJsGn6N+5dv+XijabW5u4XtXz441v+3NmS86fXLjl7 mFHZRCZGf02kdLy6Q8u/jW8Fo29FJbRfjbxqekSN7fyiy365/45O7tMM7nr9udPhbPGfr9qG u5Ocu/bbe91qEa9ay1L3dPuGkqKmD+2TYx6Z2d0+fGhykhJLcUaioRZzUXEiAETiFIFJAgAA X-Brightmail-Tracker: H4sIAAAAAAAAA+NgFprPIsWRmVeSWpSXmKPExsUi2FBcpRsWHxVpsLSHyWLD6iksFndiHJg8 liz5yeRx7MNXtgCmKC6blNSczLLUIn27BK6MxXe6mAvey1e8W+rWwHhauouRk0NCwETi3bsb zF2MXBxCAocYJXY1n2YGSfAKCEr8mHyPBcRmFgiTaHzSwwJR1M0kMXPVVKAiDg5hAQmJzXsS QWrYBFQkjn/bANYrLGAjsf78V1aQEl4g+9B2R5Awi4CqxOkZEJ3MAukSPxsDQcIiAtISb+ac BgtLCMhKLP0TMoGRdxaSG2YhuWEWWLO6xJQpuRBhbYkn7y6wQthqEgt/L2JCFl/AyLaKUaAo NSex0lgvsaAgJ1UvOT93EyM4/AqDdzD+WWZ1iFGAg1GJh/eCfVSkEGtiWXFlLjAgOJiVRHi3 xQCFeFMSK6tSi/Lji0pzUosPMU5kBHplIrOUaHI+MDrySuINTUwMTIyNzYyNzU3MaSmsJM6b ez8iUkggPbEkNTs1tSC1COYoJg5OqQZG66Ws35I3Hf+nbtW2vk2jbElAauDOjLfWkSdT0+do fQ5r1az0zt84c/mL/X/mbJnuHTdlrcvd+FSJ6XW3/L8fc5Oumh4p2/TJVOSrqe22J3FXX043 MI56de2sDWvci5W5yw2/Zx2ez3XBeob555yXmyZoL601WvFu95/NxqVMLIsPHYkPzy3aqsRS nJFoqMVcVJwIABpHUsqyAgAA Archived-At: Subject: [Taps] New Drafts on Transport Security Interface for TAPS X-BeenThere: taps@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions on Transport Services List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 03 Jul 2017 15:14:45 -0000 --Boundary_(ID_xNkJXswIUceqHsIoZFT93Q) Content-type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-transfer-encoding: quoted-printable Hello, We=E2=80=99ve just posted two new documents that start addressing how to = incorporate security protocols into the TAPS framework for use alongside = transport protocols. At the meeting in Chicago, the question of how = security protocols should be handled was brought up, and we suggested = writing a draft to do a survey of Transport Security protocols, similar = to the work done in RFC 8095 and the transport usage drafts. This = document goes over several common transport security protocols and = analyzes their features and interfaces, particularly with regards to how = they interact with their associated transport protocols and = applications. A Survey of Transport Security Protocols https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-pauly-taps-transport-security-00 = The second document is an update of a draft that Mirja published earlier = this year, which we would also like to bring into TAPS. This document = takes a more normative approach, and suggests that transport security = protocols should allow separation of the handshake and record protocols = (similar to what QUIC does). This approach has an effect on the = interaction between the security and transport layers, and adds some = protocol-flexibility properties that complement the TAPS approach. Separating Crypto Negotiation and Communication https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-kuehlewind-taps-crypto-sep-00 = Best, Tommy= --Boundary_(ID_xNkJXswIUceqHsIoZFT93Q) Content-type: text/html; charset=utf-8 Content-transfer-encoding: quoted-printable Hello,

We=E2=80=99ve just posted two new documents that start = addressing how to incorporate security protocols into the TAPS framework = for use alongside transport protocols. At the meeting in Chicago, the = question of how security protocols should be handled was brought up, and = we suggested writing a draft to do a survey of Transport Security = protocols, similar to the work done in RFC 8095 and the transport usage = drafts. This document goes over several common transport security = protocols and analyzes their features and interfaces, particularly with = regards to how they interact with their associated transport protocols = and applications.

A Survey of Transport Security Protocols
https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-pauly-taps-transport-security= -00

The = second document is an update of a draft that Mirja published earlier = this year, which we would also like to bring into TAPS. This document = takes a more normative approach, and suggests that transport security = protocols should allow separation of the handshake and record protocols = (similar to what QUIC does). This approach has an effect on the = interaction between the security and transport layers, and adds some = protocol-flexibility properties that complement the TAPS = approach.

Separating Crypto Negotiation and Communication
https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-kuehlewind-taps-crypto-sep-00=

Best,
Tommy
= --Boundary_(ID_xNkJXswIUceqHsIoZFT93Q)-- From nobody Mon Jul 3 13:52:17 2017 Return-Path: X-Original-To: taps@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: taps@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 92E971296B3 for ; Mon, 3 Jul 2017 13:52:15 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -4.2 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-4.2 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-2.3, RP_MATCHES_RCVD=-0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id N29PUC1IXDqA for ; Mon, 3 Jul 2017 13:52:12 -0700 (PDT) Received: from nasse.dc.kau.se (smtp.kau.se [193.10.220.39]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 05B9412EB78 for ; Mon, 3 Jul 2017 13:52:07 -0700 (PDT) References: <149910371517.22840.7192146981657511542.idtracker@ietfa.amsl.com> To: "taps@ietf.org" From: Anna Brunstrom X-Forwarded-Message-Id: <149910371517.22840.7192146981657511542.idtracker@ietfa.amsl.com> Message-ID: <5b2e1125-ecca-d5e2-b0c6-73aabc4b92c5@kau.se> Date: Mon, 3 Jul 2017 22:52:01 +0200 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows NT 6.1; WOW64; rv:52.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/52.2.0 MIME-Version: 1.0 In-Reply-To: <149910371517.22840.7192146981657511542.idtracker@ietfa.amsl.com> Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="------------E63FB47DD4D6D2DE05DEF777" Content-Language: en-US X-ClientProxiedBy: Exch-A3.personal.kau (130.243.19.84) To Exch-A2.personal.kau (130.243.19.83) Archived-At: Subject: [Taps] Fwd: New Version Notification for draft-grinnemo-taps-he-03.txt X-BeenThere: taps@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions on Transport Services List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 03 Jul 2017 20:52:15 -0000 --------------E63FB47DD4D6D2DE05DEF777 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Dear all, We have submitted an update to the happy eyeballs draft. It aims to address the comments received on the previous version, and adds some other smaller clarifications. Best, Anna -------- Forwarded Message -------- Subject: New Version Notification for draft-grinnemo-taps-he-03.txt Date: Mon, 3 Jul 2017 10:41:55 -0700 From: internet-drafts@ietf.org To: Zdravko Bozakov , Zdravko Bozakov , Anna Brunstrom , Per Hurtig , Karl-Johan Grinnemo , Naeem Khademi A new version of I-D, draft-grinnemo-taps-he-03.txt has been successfully submitted by Karl-Johan Grinnemo and posted to the IETF repository. Name: draft-grinnemo-taps-he Revision: 03 Title: Happy Eyeballs for Transport Selection Document date: 2017-07-03 Group: Individual Submission Pages: 10 URL: https://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-grinnemo-taps-he-03.txt Status: https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-grinnemo-taps-he/ Htmlized: https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-grinnemo-taps-he-03 Htmlized: https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/html/draft-grinnemo-taps-he-03 Diff: https://www.ietf.org/rfcdiff?url2=draft-grinnemo-taps-he-03 Abstract: Ideally, network applications should be able to select an appropriate transport solution from among available transport solutions. However, at present, there is no agreed-upon way to do this. In fact, there is not even an agreed-upon way for a source end host to determine if there is support for a particular transport along a network path. This draft addresses these issues, by proposing a Happy Eyeballs framework. The proposed Happy Eyeballs framework enables the selection of a transport solution that according to application requirements, pre-set policies, and estimated network conditions is the most appropriate one. Additionally, the proposed framework makes it possible for an application to find out whether a particular transport is supported along a network connection towards a specific destination or not. Please note that it may take a couple of minutes from the time of submission until the htmlized version and diff are available at tools.ietf.org. The IETF Secretariat --------------E63FB47DD4D6D2DE05DEF777 Content-Type: text/html; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

Dear all,

We have submitted an update to the happy eyeballs draft. It aims to address the comments received on the previous version, and adds some other smaller clarifications.

Best,
Anna

-------- Forwarded Message --------
Subject: New Version Notification for draft-grinnemo-taps-he-03.txt
Date: Mon, 3 Jul 2017 10:41:55 -0700
From: internet-drafts@ietf.org
To: Zdravko Bozakov <Zdravko.Bozakov@dell.com>, Zdravko Bozakov <zdravko.bozakov@dell.com>, Anna Brunstrom <anna.brunstrom@kau.se>, Per Hurtig <per.hurtig@kau.se>, Karl-Johan Grinnemo <karl-johan.grinnemo@kau.se>, Naeem Khademi <naeemk@ifi.uio.no> 


A new version of I-D, draft-grinnemo-taps-he-03.txt
has been successfully submitted by Karl-Johan Grinnemo and posted to the
IETF repository.

Name:		draft-grinnemo-taps-he
Revision:	03
Title:		Happy Eyeballs for Transport Selection
Document date:	2017-07-03
Group:		Individual Submission
Pages:		10
URL:            https://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-grinnemo-taps-he-03.txt
Status:         https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-grinnemo-taps-he/
Htmlized:       https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-grinnemo-taps-he-03
Htmlized:       https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/html/draft-grinnemo-taps-he-03
Diff:           https://www.ietf.org/rfcdiff?url2=draft-grinnemo-taps-he-03

Abstract:
   Ideally, network applications should be able to select an appropriate
   transport solution from among available transport solutions.
   However, at present, there is no agreed-upon way to do this.  In
   fact, there is not even an agreed-upon way for a source end host to
   determine if there is support for a particular transport along a
   network path.  This draft addresses these issues, by proposing a
   Happy Eyeballs framework.  The proposed Happy Eyeballs framework
   enables the selection of a transport solution that according to
   application requirements, pre-set policies, and estimated network
   conditions is the most appropriate one.  Additionally, the proposed
   framework makes it possible for an application to find out whether a
   particular transport is supported along a network connection towards
   a specific destination or not.

                                                                                  


Please note that it may take a couple of minutes from the time of submission
until the htmlized version and diff are available at tools.ietf.org.

The IETF Secretariat
--------------E63FB47DD4D6D2DE05DEF777-- From nobody Mon Jul 3 16:31:19 2017 Return-Path: X-Original-To: taps@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: taps@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id F0B731317ED for ; Mon, 3 Jul 2017 16:31:17 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.999 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.999 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE=-0.0001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=gmail.com Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id txuLpQWrPUnF for ; Mon, 3 Jul 2017 16:31:16 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail-ua0-x241.google.com (mail-ua0-x241.google.com [IPv6:2607:f8b0:400c:c08::241]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id DDBFC1317C9 for ; Mon, 3 Jul 2017 16:30:46 -0700 (PDT) Received: by mail-ua0-x241.google.com with SMTP id j53so14187469uaa.2 for ; Mon, 03 Jul 2017 16:30:46 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20161025; h=mime-version:in-reply-to:references:from:date:message-id:subject:to :cc:content-transfer-encoding; bh=6i6WcVb2jVfjXXNngTOpCsHhAO7oSmJDC9tkXRauzK8=; b=G2tJlPCcIhm9/ej8RSARbXs3jQZtLM2JL/U+bDYIooGKhoHDrfzP0t9E6liVIfyy/9 7VpqVu326S2fDIyZkkFW7mXgMmBI1SLxyX3R/HVrLxYzaRfTZLUI9IsrbLhTNZmz3amQ BqTIi/FgqrsyKg7Ew8IjqQjzb8x7DhI2qeFD8jKMaEx9Ag2afREipC+aFcyucBvNhbn6 HGqA5O52XwpxGxNroVBY/tNLOtcCMcbr/fSXmvbU+y8zAXstQavqjeXPvMgMC+gJv/dn Ur5TnnOYsqoKdBvlfbjKzSp+NJMKQErC/wU9hdUxHAMC7CDzdnYbvwPW3rLWwTCZHl9B Ob1Q== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:in-reply-to:references:from:date :message-id:subject:to:cc:content-transfer-encoding; bh=6i6WcVb2jVfjXXNngTOpCsHhAO7oSmJDC9tkXRauzK8=; b=q+6b6azd9dAL0apEgIin2BH16fGVCXR7LFoM2U2rbhEG76FID+e2pXTVLTELw7o98J Ysb1URTzFcrSfPwS65FypztUEi4SOWnfLRrJxOzvznnUuGpricb+xNWByrvnGyNJDY8I F4VR6NeTgsUiheaDEZHvfo8c4OlYoackWGxe1VcOo6XL2NgDMzaXM+WVrd38oRGIgMiY mtEntjMYhysK7NBvY++nZnJs8/DhGkVFTA9LN/9VbitW/NuNDgf9yBe5mBnHfGfLiDBi qgKlSM7VhM8qBGQRhrQ/VvktfD9kbzqGso57kC3ZaASDjSonkPCdd+hFaR89zzUPKNrZ lt+Q== X-Gm-Message-State: AKS2vOw3FjNbbh/KLXshvzvQDAJDd7XYIFT549yqTW9Znyr5ZcOCuG4u dzSp7TJMi+R019qMrc3+37jBzE83iQ== X-Received: by 10.176.18.88 with SMTP id s24mr19423115uac.127.1499124646065; Mon, 03 Jul 2017 16:30:46 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 Received: by 10.159.59.203 with HTTP; Mon, 3 Jul 2017 16:30:45 -0700 (PDT) In-Reply-To: <197539C8-A6D7-4A94-9897-B0D49DE07781@apple.com> References: <197539C8-A6D7-4A94-9897-B0D49DE07781@apple.com> From: Zhen Cao Date: Tue, 4 Jul 2017 07:30:45 +0800 Message-ID: To: Tommy Pauly Cc: taps WG Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Taps] User-Space Networking in iOS 11 X-BeenThere: taps@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions on Transport Services List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 03 Jul 2017 23:31:18 -0000 Hello Tommy, Thank you for sharing this. Going through the slides of WWDC17, I have some clarification questions: a) the slides only plot WiFi when talking about the 'user-space', does that also apply to the cellular link? I ask this because the user-space packet io needs a different driver for different links as far as i know. b) does the user space networking always performs better than the kernel counterpart? Many thanks Zhen On Fri, Jun 9, 2017 at 3:50 AM, Tommy Pauly wrote: > Hello, > > I wanted to point the TAPS group to some of the work that we announced th= is > week at WWDC that relates to the Post-Sockets API effort. You can see a > video of the session here (relevant section at ~13:50), along with the > slides: > > https://developer.apple.com/videos/play/wwdc2017/707 > > In the current betas of iOS 11, we have introduced =E2=80=9CUser-Space Ne= tworking=E2=80=9D > beneath our networking APIs. The transport and IP protocols are now being > co-located with the security and application protocols in the process, > meaning that we are no longer using sockets within the implementation of > these APIs. This shift allows us to reduce the context switches between > protocol layers, and could potentially open opportunities for the kind of > stack flexibility and customization that the TAPS group is looking at. We= =E2=80=99re > excited to be making some first steps into a truly =E2=80=9CPost-Sockets= =E2=80=9D world! > > Thanks, > Tommy > > _______________________________________________ > Taps mailing list > Taps@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/taps > From nobody Wed Jul 5 09:42:41 2017 Return-Path: X-Original-To: taps@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: taps@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7FE32131848 for ; Wed, 5 Jul 2017 09:42:39 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE=-0.0001, SPF_PASS=-0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=gmail.com Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id mMXUpBDtj12B for ; Wed, 5 Jul 2017 09:42:38 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail-qt0-x22e.google.com (mail-qt0-x22e.google.com [IPv6:2607:f8b0:400d:c0d::22e]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id E6F6D13167C for ; Wed, 5 Jul 2017 09:42:37 -0700 (PDT) Received: by mail-qt0-x22e.google.com with SMTP id i2so191091275qta.3 for ; Wed, 05 Jul 2017 09:42:37 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20161025; h=from:to:cc:subject:date:message-id:in-reply-to:references :mime-version:content-transfer-encoding; bh=BxdvtR12mxiuuNrsqvrBzBNCdXOunGw06+ya+00m8GI=; b=FEvNttwzU8nyYwqsPFyQXDRmjVpG/5YcfQ3MWkxj69Vd9LLCFgU5pNmlcbJVdt3L2x hRVYFIrVp3tn+WL8xbbEDOwqlnW6i9U9fK+vDTsdKsB96/4TnKqXoM9QjjoSftrfTVyG qbMONTBIEjryjqxcepGSYB/iLG2t7naa8xz/GMr9wdirzPF+22PgYouIGkXvTHG1axHQ aC7jGuOemUgT2sajR6cWMy8bSZgrNwX5cIbA5L13TcIdJd2PdtDi1hltMV2VDmLsp2r5 /gZbVNV1Qtal2xqaqzk01fYd0PC2nEXWd5U5o7/+t4C8XLWbOzUJIFBfkAqzKeaEPANY RFnw== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:from:to:cc:subject:date:message-id:in-reply-to :references:mime-version:content-transfer-encoding; bh=BxdvtR12mxiuuNrsqvrBzBNCdXOunGw06+ya+00m8GI=; b=ZR9dpSM5cDMMOifRY8coa3GiopcYVLywB7zVCOxUwVBIc8G0h1/l+22r22Jmp5VpPW wmeSuvzwqx8gqwRENHZBDr4v3GhxP/2bwCol3bZlLmYnoPyDnA1dsOqeVGCLIwmAnk3I jm3CL8bAduPZiZ3uRt3hFepkhr35fqQsdm3lZnLm6QAWtRB5UWdzFKodoRddQ/Iun6Cw 7wYyd9ErjPRG3tkU38GqxYTVWrpFSbiGdvr49ZJ8+fD191H/wUeiio2SaWGbMCl/JP1y g2YQymfqD9BIJtlgd9eNc+wDNwlbaJfLisQ/a+/QklKMjtxD0vvUJk09kTITGc6zqFsV TVrg== X-Gm-Message-State: AKS2vOw4EOIQIFjCFVcEviscjZvkKvLchgLO6vH4bC2+a+QjMMayzaTg UeHm/2IF6ch5DTI0vjg= X-Received: by 10.200.3.98 with SMTP id w34mr56647224qtg.203.1499272956968; Wed, 05 Jul 2017 09:42:36 -0700 (PDT) Received: from [172.19.37.166] ([2601:184:4980:a321:c555:fa0a:3752:abaf]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id f29sm18554972qtc.13.2017.07.05.09.42.36 (version=TLS1_2 cipher=ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 bits=128/128); Wed, 05 Jul 2017 09:42:36 -0700 (PDT) From: "Aaron Falk" To: "Michael Welzl" Cc: "taps@ietf.org" Date: Wed, 05 Jul 2017 12:42:35 -0400 Message-ID: <1D39883A-FFBB-4D43-8834-D821AB47B401@gmail.com> In-Reply-To: <0E3F9805-5513-40F8-ADB2-D5F550EC771A@ifi.uio.no> References: <3A3686B5-FF60-448E-9E13-4B493B472C6D@gmail.com> <77C2BA95-F95B-4597-9159-7D5FC4068860@gmail.com> <0E3F9805-5513-40F8-ADB2-D5F550EC771A@ifi.uio.no> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Mailer: MailMate (1.9.6r5356) Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Taps] Prague agenda planning X-BeenThere: taps@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions on Transport Services List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 05 Jul 2017 16:42:39 -0000 On 29 Jun 2017, at 16:53, Michael Welzl wrote: >> 1. **`draft-gjessing-taps-minset-05.txt`** >> >> * There’s been some interesting discussion on the draft. Are >> there any specific topics we should set aside time to discuss? >> > > I appreciated this discussion much, but personally I don’t think > know of any specific topic that we need to discuss here - plus, there > seem to be plenty of other good things to talk about which will all > need time. Fair enough. In that case, my question is what it needed to finish the document? Are there any open issues? —aaron From nobody Wed Jul 5 09:55:59 2017 Return-Path: X-Original-To: taps@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: taps@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5E55B131D75 for ; Wed, 5 Jul 2017 09:55:58 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.699 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.699 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW=-0.7, SPF_PASS=-0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=gmail.com Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id UWWCqHoTw6WB for ; Wed, 5 Jul 2017 09:55:56 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail-qk0-x22b.google.com (mail-qk0-x22b.google.com [IPv6:2607:f8b0:400d:c09::22b]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 814DC131D72 for ; Wed, 5 Jul 2017 09:55:56 -0700 (PDT) Received: by mail-qk0-x22b.google.com with SMTP id p21so194888162qke.3 for ; Wed, 05 Jul 2017 09:55:56 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20161025; h=from:to:subject:date:message-id:in-reply-to:references:mime-version; bh=3PqyU4pIrngDax+lxIJISM+0OtSMu6xTLMca87Grfo8=; b=uJlY6MxFT0OhBoF4sxaBtVGwSPO9g9grvjfuW3925yvRWXmNYOHYMurg03fKji4WgZ xW6J6cCltAuopQSwxs0OQg4lYslNmtvZaQxDWEk00KMlvG5cjPHe1LiYY6BE+czarWnA rNbYa8DC4gv2/7k8MLijcbLVbztB+vH4j4sjQ3xkVt0UaRY3VNCqH8AyLc9Off+mZ3mL huFNRUpgQRK4lqfX24P9BgGN9VYGZwM6IPiOszaPRIC4ezsEyix68ZisbQw9Wheia0lr /S/0wcPtxfb/LPXPPORsmF+3OLYHIQNxsLiA0pEwok6zZIvYMXQO33ZEfVIrpee4jsOc l5rw== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:from:to:subject:date:message-id:in-reply-to :references:mime-version; bh=3PqyU4pIrngDax+lxIJISM+0OtSMu6xTLMca87Grfo8=; b=JGHXVQG9c2UGfAyVANnbtnYrjrNjugbv48/ci/dzki0m2VP/elMXasXTFNQimwreOH LOjQPyHmUkSrOFon1EB/Ua64gCNIiJnXvkYtV1xnatkTFnUZ7GyHRTA5DFhaWbz0kJre lNbsITUZHGVv1yBMtl/1fzbBRjk3aZSagjYTqqPVjYEapSapzVggxxDmkZJJxCQL4x/l WS8Ci5T0mr2/FRffNWTRLsnBJiMt3c60jx12wW3sJkGGjC4e9csVSYajJIFAWlEIECY3 i4jlmVg9pZFtEqI4ibvNaGDcs4lhpxSZ/UZzIZn+Cm48dqjD1q+McqSaRHoID87MJryX EKsg== X-Gm-Message-State: AKS2vOwN8g5Ne/lx9t1al/xS/Etl1q0xcc4OhtbYjoeXu6pW2V2y2s+r AIiMAdgA5VcA+bkMpDs= X-Received: by 10.55.146.133 with SMTP id u127mr56091411qkd.17.1499273755476; Wed, 05 Jul 2017 09:55:55 -0700 (PDT) Received: from [172.19.37.166] ([2601:184:4980:a321:c555:fa0a:3752:abaf]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id 127sm16139796qkd.24.2017.07.05.09.55.54 for (version=TLS1_2 cipher=ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 bits=128/128); Wed, 05 Jul 2017 09:55:55 -0700 (PDT) From: "Aaron Falk" To: taps@ietf.org Date: Wed, 05 Jul 2017 12:55:54 -0400 Message-ID: In-Reply-To: References: <3A3686B5-FF60-448E-9E13-4B493B472C6D@gmail.com> <77C2BA95-F95B-4597-9159-7D5FC4068860@gmail.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="=_MailMate_6EF13ACD-7F29-4C35-B89D-0293075B0BA2_=" X-Mailer: MailMate (1.9.6r5356) Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Taps] Prague agenda planning X-BeenThere: taps@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions on Transport Services List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 05 Jul 2017 16:55:58 -0000 --=_MailMate_6EF13ACD-7F29-4C35-B89D-0293075B0BA2_= Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed Updated: 1. **Minimal Set of Transport Services for TAPS Systems** [[XX who will present? XX]] * `draft-gjessing-taps-minset-05.txt` * Open issues to finalize doc 2. **Transport Security Protocol Survey**, Tommy Pauly * At the meeting in Chicago, the question of how security protocols should be handled was brought up, and we suggested writing a draft to do a survey of Transport Security protocols, similar to the work done in RFC 8095 and the transport usage drafts. This document goes over several common transport security protocols and analyzes their features and interfaces, particularly with regards to how they interact with their associated transport protocols and applications. For consideration as a TAPS working group doc. * `draft-pauly-taps-transport-security-00.txt`: The common features/interface presented by various security protocols * `draft-kuehlewind-taps-crypto-sep-00.txt`: The ability to separate security handshakes from data encryption 4. **Application- & System-Specified Policy & TAPS**, [[XX someone needs to frame this topic. who? Brian? Tommy? XX]] 3. **Socket Intents, Concepts & Communication Granularity**, Phillipp Tiesel * Socket Intents allow applications to share their knowledge about upcoming communication and express their performance preferences in an API independent way. Therefore, thy can be used by an OS/API to gain enough knowledge to perform access as well as transport protocol selection and tuning. * `draft-tiesel-taps-socketintents-00.txt`: concepts * `draft-tiesel-taps-communitgrany-00.txt`: endpoint and path selection * `draft-tiesel-taps-socketintents-bsdsockets-00.txt`: prototype 5. **Happy Eyeballs update**, Anna Brunstrom * `draft-grinnemo-taps-he-03.txt` (update expected) * The interface between the HE algorithm and the policy management * What should be detailed in the specification of the HE algorithm and what should be left open for implementation? --=_MailMate_6EF13ACD-7F29-4C35-B89D-0293075B0BA2_= Content-Type: text/html Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

Updated:

  1. Minimal Set of Transport Services= for TAPS Systems [[XX who will present? XX]]

    • draft-gjessing-taps-minset-05.txt
    • Open issues to finalize doc

  2. Transport Security Protocol Surve= y, Tommy Pauly

    • At the meeting in Chicago, the question of how security protocols sho= uld be handled was brought up, and we suggested writing a draft to do a s= urvey of Transport Security protocols, similar to the work done in RFC 80= 95 and the transport usage drafts. This document goes over several common= transport security protocols and analyzes their features and interfaces,= particularly with regards to how they interact with their associated tra= nsport protocols and applications. For consideration as a TAPS working g= roup doc.
    • draft-pauly-taps-transport-security= -00.txt: The common features/interface presented by various securi= ty protocols
    • draft-kuehlewind-taps-crypto-sep-00= =2Etxt: The ability to separate security handshakes from data encr= yption

  3. Application- & System-Specifi= ed Policy & TAPS, [[XX someone needs to frame this topic. w= ho? Brian? Tommy? XX]]

  4. Socket Intents, Concepts & Co= mmunication Granularity, Phillipp Tiesel

    • Socket Intents allow applications to share their knowledge about upco= ming communication and express their performance preferences in an API indepen= dent way. Therefore, thy can be used by an OS/API to gain enough knowledge to perfo= rm access as well as transport protocol selection and tuning.
    • draft-tiesel-taps-socketintents-00.= txt: concepts
    • draft-tiesel-taps-communitgrany-00.= txt: endpoint and path selection
    • draft-tiesel-taps-socketintents-bsd= sockets-00.txt: prototype

  5. Happy Eyeballs update, A= nna Brunstrom

    • draft-grinnemo-taps-he-03.txt (update expected)
    • The interface between the HE algorithm and the policy management
      • =
    • What should be detailed in the specification of the HE algorithm and = what should be left open for implementation?
--=_MailMate_6EF13ACD-7F29-4C35-B89D-0293075B0BA2_=-- From nobody Wed Jul 5 15:14:26 2017 Return-Path: X-Original-To: taps@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: taps@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4A193127333 for ; Wed, 5 Jul 2017 15:14:24 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -4.202 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-4.202 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-2.3, RP_MATCHES_RCVD=-0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id ZZy9H0wiyWzC for ; Wed, 5 Jul 2017 15:14:22 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail-out01.uio.no (mail-out01.uio.no [IPv6:2001:700:100:10::50]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 005FB127201 for ; Wed, 5 Jul 2017 15:14:21 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail-mx05.uio.no ([129.240.10.49]) by mail-out01.uio.no with esmtp (Exim 4.82_1-5b7a7c0-XX) (envelope-from ) id 1dSsYu-0007o2-Ci; Thu, 06 Jul 2017 00:14:20 +0200 Received: from 234.133.189.109.customer.cdi.no ([109.189.133.234] helo=[192.168.1.8]) by mail-mx05.uio.no with esmtpsa (TLSv1.2:DHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384:256) user michawe (Exim 4.82_1-5b7a7c0-XX) (envelope-from ) id 1dSsYu-0009mx-0R; Thu, 06 Jul 2017 00:14:20 +0200 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Mime-Version: 1.0 (Mac OS X Mail 10.3 \(3273\)) From: Michael Welzl In-Reply-To: <1D39883A-FFBB-4D43-8834-D821AB47B401@gmail.com> Date: Thu, 6 Jul 2017 00:14:32 +0200 Cc: "taps@ietf.org" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Message-Id: <7E01990A-EDDA-4C61-9DD5-374A3CF40245@ifi.uio.no> References: <3A3686B5-FF60-448E-9E13-4B493B472C6D@gmail.com> <77C2BA95-F95B-4597-9159-7D5FC4068860@gmail.com> <0E3F9805-5513-40F8-ADB2-D5F550EC771A@ifi.uio.no> <1D39883A-FFBB-4D43-8834-D821AB47B401@gmail.com> To: Aaron Falk X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.3273) X-UiO-SPF-Received: Received-SPF: neutral (mail-mx05.uio.no: 109.189.133.234 is neither permitted nor denied by domain of ifi.uio.no) client-ip=109.189.133.234; envelope-from=michawe@ifi.uio.no; helo=[192.168.1.8]; X-UiO-Ratelimit-Test: rcpts/h 3 msgs/h 2 sum rcpts/h 4 sum msgs/h 2 total rcpts 56162 max rcpts/h 54 ratelimit 0 X-UiO-Spam-info: not spam, SpamAssassin (score=-4.9, required=5.0, autolearn=disabled, AWL=0.091, TVD_RCVD_IP=0.001, UIO_MAIL_IS_INTERNAL=-5, uiobl=NO, uiouri=NO) X-UiO-Scanned: 8A7508381D229C763402FEC53D826AD345D18CE3 X-UiO-SPAM-Test: remote_host: 109.189.133.234 spam_score: -48 maxlevel 80 minaction 2 bait 0 mail/h: 2 total 1696 max/h 13 blacklist 0 greylist 0 ratelimit 0 Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Taps] Prague agenda planning X-BeenThere: taps@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions on Transport Services List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 05 Jul 2017 22:14:24 -0000 > On Jul 5, 2017, at 6:42 PM, Aaron Falk wrote: >=20 >=20 >=20 > On 29 Jun 2017, at 16:53, Michael Welzl wrote: >=20 >>> 1. **`draft-gjessing-taps-minset-05.txt`** >>>=20 >>> * There=E2=80=99s been some interesting discussion on the draft. = Are there any specific topics we should set aside time to discuss? >>>=20 >>=20 >> I appreciated this discussion much, but personally I don=E2=80=99t = think know of any specific topic that we need to discuss here - plus, = there seem to be plenty of other good things to talk about which will = all need time. >=20 > Fair enough. In that case, my question is what it needed to finish = the document? Are there any open issues? Well - IMO this version is a first =E2=80=9Creal complete=E2=80=9D = version - i.e. once the group reads, comments, and we incorporate fixes, = we can be done quite quickly. I don=E2=80=99t think there=E2=80=99s = anything truly major missing. I=E2=80=99m happy about the first comments that have already come in, = and we=E2=80=99ll address them in the next version (after Prague) - the = most important thing being to work out a more comprehensive list of = decisions to be taken *initially* (e.g. the reliability case that = Philipp and Theresa pointed out, that=E2=80=99s a clear bug). The draft will be presented by Naeem Khademi, who isn=E2=80=99t an = author, on behalf of us authors. I hope that=E2=80=99s acceptable! = I=E2=80=99ll do my best to be remotely available for discussion too. I think it makes sense for this presentation to focus on what=E2=80=99s = new: the abstract API that we designed. I think this is an interesting = thing with pretty straightforward yet important implications on other = TAPS APIs (I=E2=80=99d hope). Cheers, Michael From nobody Thu Jul 6 07:18:32 2017 Return-Path: X-Original-To: taps@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: taps@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5B30E131480 for ; Thu, 6 Jul 2017 07:18:31 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.7 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.7 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW=-0.7, SPF_PASS=-0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=gmail.com Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id UBJas7OWET1Z for ; Thu, 6 Jul 2017 07:18:30 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail-qk0-x236.google.com (mail-qk0-x236.google.com [IPv6:2607:f8b0:400d:c09::236]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id F0DD2127873 for ; Thu, 6 Jul 2017 07:18:29 -0700 (PDT) Received: by mail-qk0-x236.google.com with SMTP id v143so3351742qkb.0 for ; Thu, 06 Jul 2017 07:18:29 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20161025; h=from:to:cc:subject:date:message-id:in-reply-to:references :mime-version:content-transfer-encoding; bh=gMovxpQT2DiZ7Ribp+j9bGwXwoU+CDzhwMYK4PkZqgk=; b=HPw2eWf+oCq1LIWsV9xmMdo0JLjUG1hFl/lpsRewQ2rj2GR4j6QjcgaiNZuL5I1D7J l71zYxMHqFuh8TMBHoZ8c5ZhCgWQmLk+JVe7aT9nSljU17sVmVp2QyKgtNK7htZ6grYt e3mQKTiNOVFtG5ZrZDe4LQc4FRp5JN5u6ZOrlzjAkMQE0DVoEyq5+kUw52Vy5VJjxsbD nuT0lkPCET1UbBq95W04gD1LlAny7H2q7Q5UTRrtHMVlPYg3iHPU710Go8KmRQDo1BtC TmNKIRo4lFeKsKN5gxI/i6rCrZ72un24Oh3z9qrVd1UcNXlaGvwvt8aQ9sSNqrcWBR4P iwpg== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:from:to:cc:subject:date:message-id:in-reply-to :references:mime-version:content-transfer-encoding; bh=gMovxpQT2DiZ7Ribp+j9bGwXwoU+CDzhwMYK4PkZqgk=; b=hgYlfH/pd+7Hs6lMfzfpg//BcEix4DIzxJkA8mfDYnyyhK0coXcogyT4Yb/NVeCX+q Jiroer4+EkwN2IEUH8tuQhDlT3gldXm0ZdDUFNIlCgXeGWaUMteIEN4zQpfv1M9xT+g1 g9apRTdP+xygzpqarsbGN/x39gxoaA2U9uHS05h7nHtTaR+3qptg41xfKtp9rZd+LBwi /9sySz3YsuYDG6RQpDT50kSN8HmzNFh/gC2WQeGpCQjO2zB/lYcUMksBA3fbWa/wgwux 4UegY01VPuQC6a1efqEg/ebqKWrlY5gkmPNtk4M2BjPvz7Tf6+IOBA/viI2uF8U52Fsi 81Sw== X-Gm-Message-State: AKS2vOwfj+5USHDsZch4XFNzD/qFIzgNL0riBVgPX9RADIWY3XHaTg/T AWfHhAZd2TzjdEG9IZA= X-Received: by 10.55.41.232 with SMTP id p101mr57447238qkp.105.1499350709112; Thu, 06 Jul 2017 07:18:29 -0700 (PDT) Received: from [172.19.35.226] ([72.246.0.14]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id j17sm220842qta.49.2017.07.06.07.18.28 (version=TLS1_2 cipher=ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 bits=128/128); Thu, 06 Jul 2017 07:18:28 -0700 (PDT) From: "Aaron Falk" To: "Michael Welzl" Cc: "taps@ietf.org" Date: Thu, 06 Jul 2017 10:18:29 -0400 Message-ID: <2E367981-45AA-4A53-9F16-9C9179E69610@gmail.com> In-Reply-To: <7E01990A-EDDA-4C61-9DD5-374A3CF40245@ifi.uio.no> References: <3A3686B5-FF60-448E-9E13-4B493B472C6D@gmail.com> <77C2BA95-F95B-4597-9159-7D5FC4068860@gmail.com> <0E3F9805-5513-40F8-ADB2-D5F550EC771A@ifi.uio.no> <1D39883A-FFBB-4D43-8834-D821AB47B401@gmail.com> <7E01990A-EDDA-4C61-9DD5-374A3CF40245@ifi.uio.no> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Mailer: MailMate (1.9.6r5356) Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Taps] Prague agenda planning X-BeenThere: taps@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions on Transport Services List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 06 Jul 2017 14:18:31 -0000 >>>> 1. **`draft-gjessing-taps-minset-05.txt`** >>>> >>>> * There’s been some interesting discussion on the draft. Are >>>> there any specific topics we should set aside time to discuss? >>>> >>> > I think it makes sense for this presentation to focus on what’s new: > the abstract API that we designed. I think this is an interesting > thing with pretty straightforward yet important implications on other > TAPS APIs (I’d hope). > I see. Sounds like a fairly short slot then. Say 10min? > Cheers, > Michael —aaron From nobody Thu Jul 6 07:56:48 2017 Return-Path: X-Original-To: taps@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: taps@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 501CF1317A2 for ; Thu, 6 Jul 2017 07:56:46 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.699 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.699 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW=-0.7, SPF_PASS=-0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=gmail.com Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id X7y_o80VZpk2 for ; Thu, 6 Jul 2017 07:56:44 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail-qk0-x234.google.com (mail-qk0-x234.google.com [IPv6:2607:f8b0:400d:c09::234]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 6DC0313154C for ; Thu, 6 Jul 2017 07:56:44 -0700 (PDT) Received: by mail-qk0-x234.google.com with SMTP id p21so4309732qke.3 for ; Thu, 06 Jul 2017 07:56:44 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20161025; h=from:to:subject:date:message-id:in-reply-to:references:mime-version :content-transfer-encoding; bh=/0Cv85Jt9rgN+JmnyF0jT6lfG1fqcIleoJTs9dIj62s=; b=MXt/uTypNbWJzuVf0TD1/NcJFaICzCRILvahevOFcE3z1ckMutcq/fVrkTtxNRG88M iXYmJivo2lK3kMLy/ZUq7lQ0JUbFVCyDMPZZWPM6HOTtjiE4z4BJn2GZFrKOdw/VOMGk Bh+j1nwGVeb4lccAV3dil2VpakL+qundIbihXJODfklSLfxksaQKLN1BBuYC9GhXQgqc dtUih+jCVeOdXAwaTNu1kvO7W1s4nPrEdVPoTxjC9EAVWmePc+gv85+uxJoyxn9w0h/e tj1Q5NsFmpOh/E8Vu7jIY58c9xHHy5ob+C04d0sFx+vwKKW3wo0TVL+hJXagroyLta+q Ir0w== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:from:to:subject:date:message-id:in-reply-to :references:mime-version:content-transfer-encoding; bh=/0Cv85Jt9rgN+JmnyF0jT6lfG1fqcIleoJTs9dIj62s=; b=aShjd6iH8z79gxXGuFFiiJituWH6KXv8QTDqGrEpPeyOF5/dRTcZ2HV8JDLcGhP9L3 5alWBMspWG0nLuYGDGrwZoPHmTxKdj62dSz27L+uHvMWXoo1Hdg0EKgakqXIT4Tf3M75 8cCCeJElbHppES4sidelFhX9yWiX7/0bZZ7O1lNrAele3/0+0H7PQ0bnM/Z/6ThcihrD DPUf0SSMOtG2UH9YuJ4slXqcSBH+fkjxvrs5SdhxLHqR+xq0+Izd52zoaKAFzC8Tu64H KRwTjbYsv6Z/bU7w2KZg4v+9jbipqiZJ6Y7nCdLxge7+KUGwAh0LksLidGCvaOi8zQJj rkkA== X-Gm-Message-State: AKS2vOwwurZgXa3iyDhIpD7bk4rGvDKPoTwCcghDHhmqlBV8axGlcDC6 MTxPemc0mRUTdweKyAE= X-Received: by 10.55.190.134 with SMTP id o128mr55357589qkf.58.1499353003412; Thu, 06 Jul 2017 07:56:43 -0700 (PDT) Received: from [172.19.35.226] ([72.246.0.14]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id g25sm299491qte.57.2017.07.06.07.56.42 for (version=TLS1_2 cipher=ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 bits=128/128); Thu, 06 Jul 2017 07:56:42 -0700 (PDT) From: "Aaron Falk" To: taps@ietf.org Date: Thu, 06 Jul 2017 10:56:42 -0400 Message-ID: <83292426-F72C-4B29-BF39-3567BCDBFF4C@gmail.com> In-Reply-To: References: <3A3686B5-FF60-448E-9E13-4B493B472C6D@gmail.com> <77C2BA95-F95B-4597-9159-7D5FC4068860@gmail.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="=_MailMate_D82C024A-1554-4210-BF91-C9EE4F6B01D6_=" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Mailer: MailMate (1.9.6r5356) Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Taps] Prague agenda planning X-BeenThere: taps@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions on Transport Services List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 06 Jul 2017 14:56:46 -0000 --=_MailMate_D82C024A-1554-4210-BF91-C9EE4F6B01D6_= Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Updated. Still need a policy framing preso (#4) and timing. 1. **Minimal Set of Transport Services for TAPS Systems**, Naeem Khademi (presenting for authors) * `draft-gjessing-taps-minset-05.txt` * What’s new: the abstract API 2. **Transport Security Protocol Survey**, Tommy Pauly * At the meeting in Chicago, the question of how security protocols should be handled was brought up, and we suggested writing a draft to do a survey of Transport Security protocols, similar to the work done in RFC 8095 and the transport usage drafts. This document goes over several common transport security protocols and analyzes their features and interfaces, particularly with regards to how they interact with their associated transport protocols and applications. For consideration as a TAPS working group doc. * `draft-pauly-taps-transport-security-00.txt`: The common features/interface presented by various security protocols * `draft-kuehlewind-taps-crypto-sep-00.txt`: The ability to separate security handshakes from data encryption 4. **Application- & System-Specified Policy & TAPS**, [[XX someone needs to frame this topic. who? Brian? Tommy? XX]] 3. **Socket Intents, Concepts & Communication Granularity**, Phillipp Tiesel * Socket Intents allow applications to share their knowledge about upcoming communication and express their performance preferences in an API independent way. Therefore, thy can be used by an OS/API to gain enough knowledge to perform access as well as transport protocol selection and tuning. * `draft-tiesel-taps-socketintents-00.txt`: concepts * `draft-tiesel-taps-communitgrany-00.txt`: endpoint and path selection * `draft-tiesel-taps-socketintents-bsdsockets-00.txt`: prototype 5. **Happy Eyeballs update**, Anna Brunstrom * `draft-grinnemo-taps-he-03.txt` * The interface between the HE algorithm and the policy management * What should be detailed in the specification of the HE algorithm and what should be left open for implementation? --=_MailMate_D82C024A-1554-4210-BF91-C9EE4F6B01D6_= Content-Type: text/html; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

Updated. Still need a policy framing preso (#4) and timi= ng.

  1. Minimal Set of Transport Services= for TAPS Systems, Naeem Khademi (presenting for authors)

    • draft-gjessing-taps-minset-05.txt
    • What=E2=80=99s new: the abstract API

  2. Transport Security Protocol Surve= y, Tommy Pauly

    • At the meeting in Chicago, the question of how security protocols sho= uld be handled was brought up, and we suggested writing a draft to do a s= urvey of Transport Security protocols, similar to the work done in RFC 80= 95 and the transport usage drafts. This document goes over several common= transport security protocols and analyzes their features and interfaces,= particularly with regards to how they interact with their associated tra= nsport protocols and applications. For consideration as a TAPS working g= roup doc.
    • draft-pauly-taps-transport-security= -00.txt: The common features/interface presented by various securi= ty protocols
    • draft-kuehlewind-taps-crypto-sep-00= =2Etxt: The ability to separate security handshakes from data encr= yption

  3. Application- & System-Specifi= ed Policy & TAPS, [[XX someone needs to frame this topic. w= ho? Brian? Tommy? XX]]

  4. Socket Intents, Concepts & Co= mmunication Granularity, Phillipp Tiesel

    • Socket Intents allow applications to share their knowledge about upco= ming communication and express their performance preferences in an API indepen= dent way. Therefore, thy can be used by an OS/API to gain enough knowledge to perfo= rm access as well as transport protocol selection and tuning.
    • draft-tiesel-taps-socketintents-00.= txt: concepts
    • draft-tiesel-taps-communitgrany-00.= txt: endpoint and path selection
    • draft-tiesel-taps-socketintents-bsd= sockets-00.txt: prototype

  5. Happy Eyeballs update, A= nna Brunstrom

    • draft-grinnemo-taps-he-03.txt
    • The interface between the HE algorithm and the policy management
      • =
    • What should be detailed in the specification of the HE algorithm and = what should be left open for implementation?
--=_MailMate_D82C024A-1554-4210-BF91-C9EE4F6B01D6_=-- From nobody Thu Jul 6 08:11:48 2017 Return-Path: X-Original-To: taps@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: taps@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9987713162C for ; Thu, 6 Jul 2017 08:11:47 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -4.303 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-4.303 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-2.3, RP_MATCHES_RCVD=-0.001, SPF_HELO_PASS=-0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=apple.com Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id lnWBZ8KK3kRC for ; Thu, 6 Jul 2017 08:11:45 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail-in21.apple.com (mail-out21.apple.com [17.171.2.31]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 7D581129B66 for ; 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Thu, 6 Jul 2017 08:11:44 -0700 (PDT) X-AuditID: 11ab0215-43f899c000001b69-c4-595e53307d8e Received: from nwk-mmpp-sz11.apple.com (nwk-mmpp-sz11.apple.com [17.128.115.155]) by relay2.apple.com (Apple SCV relay) with SMTP id 5A.4B.09069.F235E595; Thu, 6 Jul 2017 08:11:43 -0700 (PDT) MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Received: from [17.234.51.70] (unknown [17.234.51.70]) by nwk-mmpp-sz11.apple.com (Oracle Communications Messaging Server 8.0.1.2.20170210 64bit (built Feb 10 2017)) with ESMTPSA id <0OSO007ORCVJ9V30@nwk-mmpp-sz11.apple.com>; Thu, 06 Jul 2017 08:11:43 -0700 (PDT) Sender: tpauly@apple.com From: Tommy Pauly In-reply-to: Date: Thu, 06 Jul 2017 08:11:42 -0700 Cc: taps WG Content-transfer-encoding: quoted-printable Message-id: <47E8A822-4D9E-415C-AAD5-A18B1967DF51@apple.com> References: <197539C8-A6D7-4A94-9897-B0D49DE07781@apple.com> To: Zhen Cao X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.3439) X-Brightmail-Tracker: H4sIAAAAAAAAA+NgFtrJLMWRmVeSWpSXmKPExsUi2FDorGsQHBdpsPOQvsWdGIvpe/8wOjB5 7Jx1l91jyZKfTAFMUVw2Kak5mWWpRfp2CVwZDXP3MhbcEKtY8nEfcwPjDqEuRk4OCQETiZfL NzJ1MXJxCAmsYZLYtPooE0zi+5wDzBCJQ4wSx870sIAkeAUEJX5Mvgdkc3AwC6hLTJmSC1HT zyTxccMVsLiwgITE5j2JIOXCAsYS5/c+Zwax2QRUJI5/2wBmcwoES3R/2Q1mswioSrw/dh9s L7OAtMTSb5MZIWxtiSfvLrBCrLWRmH97AwvErmZGidbe12ANIiDN62Yxg+yVEJCVWPonBKRG QmABm8Syz/OZJzAKz0Jy9iyEs2chWbGAkXkVo3BuYmaObmaekaFeYkFBTqpecn7uJkZQWK9m Et3BOP+V4SFGAQ5GJR5eAfe4SCHWxLLiytxDjNIcLErivCbJsZFCAumJJanZqakFqUXxRaU5 qcWHGJk4OKUaGNdfrzH4z/eZ8ayodvKx/Tx1XUUvcpYscDqj2bt81SHZPdK/lifrz5BtqBTV 7vkpoVpxaWmJYHL5Ona2GTzJP7cyfz2SdDFHn+F/7Omkf7zib1e+MBPxU1iqrLKjuHPt9FkP 5NYYtiyL1NtW1fpj85dG9TbrV3lN4sUT9/Mycy1bynVEcce5Z0osxRmJhlrMRcWJADOZAQ1M AgAA X-Brightmail-Tracker: H4sIAAAAAAAAA+NgFupikeLIzCtJLcpLzFFi42IRbCierasfHBdpcGqFicWdGIvpe/8wOjB5 7Jx1l91jyZKfTAFMUVw2Kak5mWWpRfp2CVwZDXP3MhbcEKtY8nEfcwPjDqEuRk4OCQETie9z DjB3MXJxCAkcYpQ4dqaHBSTBKyAo8WPyPSCbg4NZQF1iypRciJp+JomPG66AxYUFJCQ270kE KRcWMJY4v/c5M4jNJqAicfzbBjCbUyBYovvLbjCbRUBV4v2x+0wgNrOAtMTSb5MZIWxtiSfv LrBCrLWRmH97AwvErmZGidbe12ANIiDN62Yxg+yVEJCVWPonZAKjwCwkl85CuHQWkqkLGJlX MQoUpeYkVhrpJRYU5KTqJefnbmIEB2Gh8w7GY8usDjEKcDAq8fAmOMVFCrEmlhVX5gKDgoNZ SYR3qyRQiDclsbIqtSg/vqg0J7X4EGMV0C8TmaVEk/OBEZJXEm9oYmJgYmxsZmxsbmJOFWEl cV4TvthIIYH0xJLU7NTUgtQimOVMHJxSDYxxThfUz0U9c3vbuewt/wt+0UmbAyPnKDouvFzN cTA/a3v9IaW3d6ylH0fkvHdIPTX7hGStW7SxvMgPrg7fwLdhBgfyct5vuVYZ+WjZZWWrWSry XtuuLL/0a/mbeZ27H9usuxGt2WsTZ8Nue/P29w2H7WfPZ5Wf+fz7zqTjky95K6WcX/D7Qb69 EktxRqKhFnNRcSIA7dRgS50CAAA= Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Taps] User-Space Networking in iOS 11 X-BeenThere: taps@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions on Transport Services List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 06 Jul 2017 15:11:47 -0000 Hello Zhen, Wi-Fi was just the example interface in the slides. We are using the = user-space networking stack on Wi-Fi, Cellular, and some VPN interfaces. = You=E2=80=99re correct that there are different driver requirements for = these, but they look the same to user-space, which is only forming IP = datagrams (not down to link layer headers). With regards to performance, some of the main benefits are seen around = batching of packets through the interface to a process, and in being = able to process those batches through the entire stack at once. That = means that certain traffic patterns do benefit more than others. In = terms of user effect, this can translate into improved throughput for = CPU-bound loads, or CPU usage reduction for network-bound loads. Of = course, we will continue to tune and optimize this technology going = forward, so stay tuned in the future. Thanks, Tommy > On Jul 3, 2017, at 4:30 PM, Zhen Cao wrote: >=20 > Hello Tommy, >=20 > Thank you for sharing this. Going through the slides of WWDC17, I > have some clarification questions: a) the slides only plot WiFi when > talking about the 'user-space', does that also apply to the cellular > link? I ask this because the user-space packet io needs a different > driver for different links as far as i know. b) does the user space > networking always performs better than the kernel counterpart? >=20 > Many thanks > Zhen >=20 > On Fri, Jun 9, 2017 at 3:50 AM, Tommy Pauly wrote: >> Hello, >>=20 >> I wanted to point the TAPS group to some of the work that we = announced this >> week at WWDC that relates to the Post-Sockets API effort. You can see = a >> video of the session here (relevant section at ~13:50), along with = the >> slides: >>=20 >> https://developer.apple.com/videos/play/wwdc2017/707 >>=20 >> In the current betas of iOS 11, we have introduced =E2=80=9CUser-Space = Networking=E2=80=9D >> beneath our networking APIs. The transport and IP protocols are now = being >> co-located with the security and application protocols in the = process, >> meaning that we are no longer using sockets within the implementation = of >> these APIs. This shift allows us to reduce the context switches = between >> protocol layers, and could potentially open opportunities for the = kind of >> stack flexibility and customization that the TAPS group is looking = at. We=E2=80=99re >> excited to be making some first steps into a truly =E2=80=9CPost-Socket= s=E2=80=9D world! >>=20 >> Thanks, >> Tommy >>=20 >> _______________________________________________ >> Taps mailing list >> Taps@ietf.org >> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/taps >>=20 >=20 > _______________________________________________ > Taps mailing list > Taps@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/taps From nobody Thu Jul 6 08:20:22 2017 Return-Path: X-Original-To: taps@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: taps@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 49C3D1317A2 for ; Thu, 6 Jul 2017 08:20:17 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.901 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.901 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, RP_MATCHES_RCVD=-0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id Pl9ZmMyqH-RG for ; Thu, 6 Jul 2017 08:20:12 -0700 (PDT) Received: from virgo01.ee.ethz.ch (virgo01.ee.ethz.ch [129.132.2.226]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher AECDH-AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 518611315F7 for ; Thu, 6 Jul 2017 08:20:10 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by virgo01.ee.ethz.ch (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3x3Lyd11ZZzMmm7; Thu, 6 Jul 2017 17:20:09 +0200 (CEST) X-Virus-Scanned: Debian amavisd-new at virgo01.ee.ethz.ch Received: from virgo01.ee.ethz.ch ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (virgo01.ee.ethz.ch [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id GnI5FpmMN96q; Thu, 6 Jul 2017 17:20:07 +0200 (CEST) X-MtScore: NO score=0 Received: from [192.168.178.33] (p5DEC23D8.dip0.t-ipconnect.de [93.236.35.216]) by virgo01.ee.ethz.ch (Postfix) with ESMTPSA; Thu, 6 Jul 2017 17:20:07 +0200 (CEST) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Mime-Version: 1.0 (Mac OS X Mail 10.3 \(3273\)) From: =?utf-8?Q?Mirja_K=C3=BChlewind?= In-Reply-To: <83292426-F72C-4B29-BF39-3567BCDBFF4C@gmail.com> Date: Thu, 6 Jul 2017 17:20:06 +0200 Cc: taps@ietf.org Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Message-Id: <6181D4C3-5CD9-4380-BEF6-0869F2F0CF30@tik.ee.ethz.ch> References: <3A3686B5-FF60-448E-9E13-4B493B472C6D@gmail.com> <77C2BA95-F95B-4597-9159-7D5FC4068860@gmail.com> <83292426-F72C-4B29-BF39-3567BCDBFF4C@gmail.com> To: Aaron Falk X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.3273) Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Taps] Prague agenda planning X-BeenThere: taps@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions on Transport Services List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 06 Jul 2017 15:20:17 -0000 I believe the idea was actually to have the policy after the socket = intents talk; maybe even after HE? Mirja > Am 06.07.2017 um 16:56 schrieb Aaron Falk : >=20 > Updated. Still need a policy framing preso (#4) and timing. >=20 > =E2=80=A2 Minimal Set of Transport Services for TAPS Systems, = Naeem Khademi (presenting for authors) >=20 > =E2=80=A2 draft-gjessing-taps-minset-05.txt > =E2=80=A2 What=E2=80=99s new: the abstract API > =E2=80=A2 Transport Security Protocol Survey, Tommy Pauly >=20 > =E2=80=A2 At the meeting in Chicago, the question of how = security protocols should be handled was brought up, and we suggested = writing a draft to do a survey of Transport Security protocols, similar = to the work done in RFC 8095 and the transport usage drafts. This = document goes over several common transport security protocols and = analyzes their features and interfaces, particularly with regards to how = they interact with their associated transport protocols and = applications. For consideration as a TAPS working group doc. > =E2=80=A2 draft-pauly-taps-transport-security-00.txt: = The common features/interface presented by various security protocols > =E2=80=A2 draft-kuehlewind-taps-crypto-sep-00.txt: The = ability to separate security handshakes from data encryption > =E2=80=A2 Application- & System-Specified Policy & TAPS, [[XX = someone needs to frame this topic. who? Brian? Tommy? XX]] >=20 > =E2=80=A2 Socket Intents, Concepts & Communication Granularity, = Phillipp Tiesel >=20 > =E2=80=A2 Socket Intents allow applications to share = their knowledge about upcoming communication and express their = performance preferences in an API independent way. Therefore, thy can be = used by an OS/API to gain enough knowledge to perform access as well as = transport protocol selection and tuning. > =E2=80=A2 draft-tiesel-taps-socketintents-00.txt: = concepts > =E2=80=A2 draft-tiesel-taps-communitgrany-00.txt: = endpoint and path selection > =E2=80=A2 = draft-tiesel-taps-socketintents-bsdsockets-00.txt: prototype > =E2=80=A2 Happy Eyeballs update, Anna Brunstrom >=20 > =E2=80=A2 draft-grinnemo-taps-he-03.txt > =E2=80=A2 The interface between the HE algorithm and the = policy management > =E2=80=A2 What should be detailed in the specification = of the HE algorithm and what should be left open for implementation? > _______________________________________________ > Taps mailing list > Taps@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/taps From nobody Thu Jul 6 08:51:58 2017 Return-Path: X-Original-To: taps@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: taps@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id DAD5512EC0E for ; Thu, 6 Jul 2017 08:51:57 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.9 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.9 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id HlCCtNW7F7Ke for ; Thu, 6 Jul 2017 08:51:55 -0700 (PDT) Received: from capri.iway.ch (capri.iway.ch [212.25.24.45]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher AECDH-AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 793A7131488 for ; Thu, 6 Jul 2017 08:51:55 -0700 (PDT) Received: from gozo.iway.ch (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by localhost (Postfix) with ESMTP id 20838340DCF; Thu, 6 Jul 2017 17:51:54 +0200 (CEST) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by localhost (ACF/18338.3712); Thu, 6 Jul 2017 17:51:54 +0200 (CEST) Received: from switchplus-mail.ch (switchplus-mail.ch [212.25.8.236]) (using TLSv1 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by gozo.iway.ch (Postfix) with ESMTPS; Thu, 6 Jul 2017 17:51:54 +0200 (CEST) Received: from nb-10604.ethz.ch (account ietf@trammell.ch [82.130.102.91] verified) by switchplus-mail.ch (CommuniGate Pro SMTP 6.1.14) with ESMTPSA id 22996102; Thu, 06 Jul 2017 17:51:54 +0200 Mime-Version: 1.0 (Mac OS X Mail 9.3 \(3124\)) Content-Type: multipart/signed; boundary="Apple-Mail=_07CDC6A0-2CD1-422B-9935-DAFAF7B10A1E"; protocol="application/pgp-signature"; micalg=pgp-sha512 X-Pgp-Agent: GPGMail From: "Brian Trammell (IETF)" In-Reply-To: <6181D4C3-5CD9-4380-BEF6-0869F2F0CF30@tik.ee.ethz.ch> Date: Thu, 6 Jul 2017 17:51:53 +0200 Cc: Aaron Falk , taps@ietf.org Message-Id: <8A83CE10-C5BC-428B-B463-EEF2C4686EE8@trammell.ch> References: <3A3686B5-FF60-448E-9E13-4B493B472C6D@gmail.com> <77C2BA95-F95B-4597-9159-7D5FC4068860@gmail.com> <83292426-F72C-4B29-BF39-3567BCDBFF4C@gmail.com> <6181D4C3-5CD9-4380-BEF6-0869F2F0CF30@tik.ee.ethz.ch> To: =?utf-8?Q?Mirja_K=C3=BChlewind?= X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.3124) Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Taps] Prague agenda planning X-BeenThere: taps@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions on Transport Services List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 06 Jul 2017 15:51:58 -0000 --Apple-Mail=_07CDC6A0-2CD1-422B-9935-DAFAF7B10A1E Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 As did I. But if we want to separate the discussions more explicitly, = I'm happy to throw together five minutes of slides to frame the = discussion in a proposal-neutral way; I think we'll need at least twenty = for the discussion though. Cheers, Brian > On 06 Jul 2017, at 17:20, Mirja K=C3=BChlewind = wrote: >=20 > I believe the idea was actually to have the policy after the socket = intents talk; maybe even after HE? >=20 > Mirja >=20 >=20 >> Am 06.07.2017 um 16:56 schrieb Aaron Falk : >>=20 >> Updated. Still need a policy framing preso (#4) and timing. >>=20 >> =E2=80=A2 Minimal Set of Transport Services for TAPS Systems, = Naeem Khademi (presenting for authors) >>=20 >> =E2=80=A2 draft-gjessing-taps-minset-05.txt >> =E2=80=A2 What=E2=80=99s new: the abstract API >> =E2=80=A2 Transport Security Protocol Survey, Tommy Pauly >>=20 >> =E2=80=A2 At the meeting in Chicago, the question of how = security protocols should be handled was brought up, and we suggested = writing a draft to do a survey of Transport Security protocols, similar = to the work done in RFC 8095 and the transport usage drafts. This = document goes over several common transport security protocols and = analyzes their features and interfaces, particularly with regards to how = they interact with their associated transport protocols and = applications. For consideration as a TAPS working group doc. >> =E2=80=A2 draft-pauly-taps-transport-security-00.txt: = The common features/interface presented by various security protocols >> =E2=80=A2 draft-kuehlewind-taps-crypto-sep-00.txt: The = ability to separate security handshakes from data encryption >> =E2=80=A2 Application- & System-Specified Policy & TAPS, [[XX = someone needs to frame this topic. who? Brian? Tommy? XX]] >>=20 >> =E2=80=A2 Socket Intents, Concepts & Communication Granularity, = Phillipp Tiesel >>=20 >> =E2=80=A2 Socket Intents allow applications to share = their knowledge about upcoming communication and express their = performance preferences in an API independent way. Therefore, thy can be = used by an OS/API to gain enough knowledge to perform access as well as = transport protocol selection and tuning. >> =E2=80=A2 draft-tiesel-taps-socketintents-00.txt: = concepts >> =E2=80=A2 draft-tiesel-taps-communitgrany-00.txt: = endpoint and path selection >> =E2=80=A2 = draft-tiesel-taps-socketintents-bsdsockets-00.txt: prototype >> =E2=80=A2 Happy Eyeballs update, Anna Brunstrom >>=20 >> =E2=80=A2 draft-grinnemo-taps-he-03.txt >> =E2=80=A2 The interface between the HE algorithm and the = policy management >> =E2=80=A2 What should be detailed in the specification = of the HE algorithm and what should be left open for implementation? >> _______________________________________________ >> Taps mailing list >> Taps@ietf.org >> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/taps >=20 > _______________________________________________ > Taps mailing list > Taps@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/taps --Apple-Mail=_07CDC6A0-2CD1-422B-9935-DAFAF7B10A1E Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: attachment; filename=signature.asc Content-Type: application/pgp-signature; name=signature.asc Content-Description: Message signed with OpenPGP using GPGMail -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Comment: GPGTools - https://gpgtools.org iQIcBAEBCgAGBQJZXlyZAAoJEIoSt78L6kajodAP/3KSPXbRSKLkMVpnVqHQpi20 twV1qU7M/UrRa1UxCLWXyJmyeQRcXlSw8k4RQZ5SblamJJtJjPbbxTnJB1lIvKgz 92BpxJZXemq5wW7jDMLlw5g/bWyb3M2XGmnXIBPbZYCgCfbYfr0dDCcUPfnkNaPa 11wSvQ4p9CsEkUQczqfHV3L/1nkZxdsHM3kse8Dfxicdg58XKzdZJBTGh4G7uL9F eot83oFGM5NlO/mP+49T49EZRKGcCfQMaNuepMcqPxi8XBE8YrbBT27Xax1J3ov2 jOEhz1yp0yDZStgeskumb0GuM7iH52kAY/QgbzdxZ8sR6vRrldUzO8mpXlnJ4R7h LntYrNhEXkEaaghXnfIICPuwIS488XRuODpRkGl4uyvKht+Uh4sWVM7G+fjtLc3y 6i/LxjzUoqS5ZMzO+Fsd66ACt/OW1FZlF5k4LnCRuxAyvlDZqj70GyyT1TepXLVn vWh5vh/vWEn4X7aJL3oz7Mcix58gWWQJ6vI+4Dds8qkFf6lDXhfiTlg89x2ECELP j87l00RjyhGUeshqkdt7vbDhRTpaQaWdIwdL8RYr0sqglaNpKKQFt+NtKbzpl+sH fuGwxz3MaPZoIBP6QHe+vzexnrDnU98xyb4DGEhM2tqRrPk8FIp3ZwTEnEVfFL/Q Jz9maTrmBj98AMOl3/jn =uBqd -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --Apple-Mail=_07CDC6A0-2CD1-422B-9935-DAFAF7B10A1E-- From nobody Thu Jul 6 09:06:42 2017 Return-Path: X-Original-To: taps@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: taps@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 65F9D12EC2D for ; 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Thu, 06 Jul 2017 09:06:37 -0700 (PDT) Received: from [172.19.35.226] ([72.246.0.14]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id f203sm405565qkb.33.2017.07.06.09.06.36 (version=TLS1_2 cipher=ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 bits=128/128); Thu, 06 Jul 2017 09:06:36 -0700 (PDT) From: "Aaron Falk" To: "Brian Trammell" Cc: "Mirja =?utf-8?q?K=C3=BChlewind?=" , taps@ietf.org Date: Thu, 06 Jul 2017 12:06:35 -0400 Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <8A83CE10-C5BC-428B-B463-EEF2C4686EE8@trammell.ch> References: <3A3686B5-FF60-448E-9E13-4B493B472C6D@gmail.com> <77C2BA95-F95B-4597-9159-7D5FC4068860@gmail.com> <83292426-F72C-4B29-BF39-3567BCDBFF4C@gmail.com> <6181D4C3-5CD9-4380-BEF6-0869F2F0CF30@tik.ee.ethz.ch> <8A83CE10-C5BC-428B-B463-EEF2C4686EE8@trammell.ch> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="=_MailMate_B5201EED-0E03-47D1-A017-BC0C0799667A_=" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Mailer: MailMate (1.9.6r5356) Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Taps] Prague agenda planning X-BeenThere: taps@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions on Transport Services List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 06 Jul 2017 16:06:40 -0000 --=_MailMate_B5201EED-0E03-47D1-A017-BC0C0799667A_= Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit I don’t have a preference. I was assuming 1. frame the topic 2. look at a few applications / use cases 3. discuss / wrestle / free-for-all but I’m also ok with 1. example 1, 2, 3 2. abstract / summarize some questions 3. discuss / wrestle / free-for-all I’ll leave whoever wants to take the framing talk to tell me where they want it. Sounds like it’ll be Brian and have it after socket intents & HE. Yes? --aaron On 6 Jul 2017, at 11:51, Brian Trammell (IETF) wrote: > As did I. But if we want to separate the discussions more explicitly, > I'm happy to throw together five minutes of slides to frame the > discussion in a proposal-neutral way; I think we'll need at least > twenty for the discussion though. > > Cheers, > > Brian > >> On 06 Jul 2017, at 17:20, Mirja Kühlewind >> wrote: >> >> I believe the idea was actually to have the policy after the socket >> intents talk; maybe even after HE? >> >> Mirja >> >> >>> Am 06.07.2017 um 16:56 schrieb Aaron Falk : >>> >>> Updated. Still need a policy framing preso (#4) and timing. >>> >>> • Minimal Set of Transport Services for TAPS Systems, Naeem >>> Khademi (presenting for authors) >>> >>> • draft-gjessing-taps-minset-05.txt >>> • What’s new: the abstract API >>> • Transport Security Protocol Survey, Tommy Pauly >>> >>> • At the meeting in Chicago, the question of how security >>> protocols should be handled was brought up, and we suggested writing >>> a draft to do a survey of Transport Security protocols, similar to >>> the work done in RFC 8095 and the transport usage drafts. This >>> document goes over several common transport security protocols and >>> analyzes their features and interfaces, particularly with regards to >>> how they interact with their associated transport protocols and >>> applications. For consideration as a TAPS working group doc. >>> • draft-pauly-taps-transport-security-00.txt: The common >>> features/interface presented by various security protocols >>> • draft-kuehlewind-taps-crypto-sep-00.txt: The ability to >>> separate security handshakes from data encryption >>> • Application- & System-Specified Policy & TAPS, [[XX someone >>> needs to frame this topic. who? Brian? Tommy? XX]] >>> >>> • Socket Intents, Concepts & Communication Granularity, Phillipp >>> Tiesel >>> >>> • Socket Intents allow applications to share their knowledge >>> about upcoming communication and express their performance >>> preferences in an API independent way. Therefore, thy can be used by >>> an OS/API to gain enough knowledge to perform access as well as >>> transport protocol selection and tuning. >>> • draft-tiesel-taps-socketintents-00.txt: concepts >>> • draft-tiesel-taps-communitgrany-00.txt: endpoint and path >>> selection >>> • draft-tiesel-taps-socketintents-bsdsockets-00.txt: prototype >>> • Happy Eyeballs update, Anna Brunstrom >>> >>> • draft-grinnemo-taps-he-03.txt >>> • The interface between the HE algorithm and the policy >>> management >>> • What should be detailed in the specification of the HE >>> algorithm and what should be left open for implementation? >>> _______________________________________________ >>> Taps mailing list >>> Taps@ietf.org >>> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/taps >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Taps mailing list >> Taps@ietf.org >> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/taps --=_MailMate_B5201EED-0E03-47D1-A017-BC0C0799667A_= Content-Type: text/html; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

I don=E2=80=99t have a preference. I was assuming

  1. frame the topic
  2. look at a few applications / use cases
  3. discuss / wrestle / free-for-all

but I=E2=80=99m also ok with

  1. example 1, 2, 3
  2. abstract / summarize some questions
  3. discuss / wrestle / free-for-all

I=E2=80=99ll leave whoever wants to take the framing talk= to tell me where they want it. Sounds like it=E2=80=99ll be Brian and h= ave it after socket intents & HE. Yes?

--aaron

On 6 Jul 2017, at 11:51, Brian Trammell (IETF) wrote:

=

A= s did I. But if we want to separate the discussions more explicitly, I'm = happy to throw together five minutes of slides to frame the discussion in= a proposal-neutral way; I think we'll need at least twenty for the discu= ssion though.

Cheers,

Brian

On 06 Jul 2= 017, at 17:20, Mirja K=C3=BChlewind <mirja.kuehlewind@tik.ee.ethz.ch&g= t; wrote:

I believe the idea was actually to have the policy after the socket inten= ts talk; maybe even after HE?

Mirja

Am 06.07.20= 17 um 16:56 schrieb Aaron Falk <aaron.falk@gmail.com>:

Updated. Still need a policy framing preso (#4) and timing.

=E2=80=A2 Minimal Set of Transport Services for TAPS Systems, Naeem Khad= emi (presenting for authors)

=E2=80=A2 draft-gjessing-taps-minset-05.txt
=E2=80=A2 What=E2=80=99s new: the abstract API
=E2=80=A2 Transport Security Protocol Survey, Tommy Pauly

=E2=80=A2 At the meeting in Chicago, the question of how security proto= cols should be handled was brought up, and we suggested writing a draft t= o do a survey of Transport Security protocols, similar to the work done i= n RFC 8095 and the transport usage drafts. This document goes over severa= l common transport security protocols and analyzes their features and int= erfaces, particularly with regards to how they interact with their associ= ated transport protocols and applications. For consideration as a TAPS wo= rking group doc.
=E2=80=A2 draft-pauly-taps-transport-security-00.txt: The common featur= es/interface presented by various security protocols
=E2=80=A2 draft-kuehlewind-taps-crypto-sep-00.txt: The ability to separ= ate security handshakes from data encryption
=E2=80=A2 Application- & System-Specified Policy & TAPS, [[XX so= meone needs to frame this topic. who? Brian? Tommy? XX]]

=E2=80=A2 Socket Intents, Concepts & Communication Granularity, Phil= lipp Tiesel

=E2=80=A2 Socket Intents allow applications to share their knowledge ab= out upcoming communication and express their performance preferences in a= n API independent way. Therefore, thy can be used by an OS/API to gain en= ough knowledge to perform access as well as transport protocol selection = and tuning.
=E2=80=A2 draft-tiesel-taps-socketintents-00.txt: concepts
=E2=80=A2 draft-tiesel-taps-communitgrany-00.txt: endpoint and path sel= ection
=E2=80=A2 draft-tiesel-taps-socketintents-bsdsockets-00.txt: prototype<= br> =E2=80=A2 Happy Eyeballs update, Anna Brunstrom

=E2=80=A2 draft-grinnemo-taps-he-03.txt
=E2=80=A2 The interface between the HE algorithm and the policy managem= ent
=E2=80=A2 What should be detailed in the specification of the HE algori= thm and what should be left open for implementation?
_______________________________________________
Taps mailing list
Taps@ietf.org
https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/taps

____________________________________________= ___
Taps mailing list
Taps@ietf.org
https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/taps

--=_MailMate_B5201EED-0E03-47D1-A017-BC0C0799667A_=-- From nobody Thu Jul 6 09:17:05 2017 Return-Path: X-Original-To: taps@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: taps@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8168D12EC0B for ; Thu, 6 Jul 2017 09:17:04 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.699 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.699 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW=-0.7, SPF_PASS=-0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=gmail.com Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id LA2CerEylqfW for ; Thu, 6 Jul 2017 09:17:02 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail-qk0-x233.google.com (mail-qk0-x233.google.com [IPv6:2607:f8b0:400d:c09::233]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 71580127444 for ; Thu, 6 Jul 2017 09:17:02 -0700 (PDT) Received: by mail-qk0-x233.google.com with SMTP id p21so6436823qke.3 for ; Thu, 06 Jul 2017 09:17:02 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20161025; h=from:to:subject:date:message-id:in-reply-to:references:mime-version :content-transfer-encoding; bh=N13YQS0F0OngqN8tBg4lSce5t/gmg9R+D9XeXFiFnPo=; b=PbmWXNvNl+pVOufhDn61HVqfYa+GI0aCFy8eQciasPKGuwZ8n1NSpX91u+pJY0VMmI jYfmgCtnvAXEJFYUdWC1TqTGa1h41elIEyhvWdY5lCNnHPci7fPIbmlYHCzggFl+NQPI +pXf/1uDHikSlU8Z7+eILesjgEJ/M849qxKHTrrTjfJPrdjjQl+odJAKGFwCeNFdd2zL 7CcwRyvsIjNbeXa8EN7QjwVzmmTU5n+cRm6CC5PpT43wmOIzb+jr4pL7C5uTNMjCKPZ5 Wrbq2nJu6eFs2PVHCqDgy5rHRzazk9xrFhjak6/au6xgS5aZ6f1fHbafS31RYve9oK+U FWOw== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:from:to:subject:date:message-id:in-reply-to :references:mime-version:content-transfer-encoding; bh=N13YQS0F0OngqN8tBg4lSce5t/gmg9R+D9XeXFiFnPo=; b=MNllft82En+G3fwAmpMkDafyZLASOlJPByP/KqGoVolm4pcfedSMQGn8emg5icBIds LSm6IqssLJU4TCQi5U0eGSQvNZWf5WLYVm1q08uuHgS/KlrhxFfXWWs/7dOLKH+R/BBz LMCS2grVctcrcltyE2NZrQQGdXG7s5UcRaE6//hP1uOjmbXSuQUstmigZExyB5t5SiEB 6cwN0/QTnY2ok1/Bh4eK1+a11hxwPX1y5QAQiEFdlzMdTdhrFQMf1TEcgx+Iccvnl7yW 5a2dqKJ1o80vmUvWBcwDdras7HcHymy+RGjwtkjQDExaFSfGPb9s8liTND8sXItyu1H7 4n8A== X-Gm-Message-State: AKS2vOw6t0Trfk3ERifIimg1WzG3pnmfEWY68iR0EUIaJ48LvVsXCCHz tJzFPGVMZ19+Azc9HN0= X-Received: by 10.55.92.130 with SMTP id q124mr63592900qkb.205.1499357821233; Thu, 06 Jul 2017 09:17:01 -0700 (PDT) Received: from [172.19.35.226] ([72.246.0.14]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id c143sm404028qkg.64.2017.07.06.09.17.00 for (version=TLS1_2 cipher=ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 bits=128/128); Thu, 06 Jul 2017 09:17:00 -0700 (PDT) From: "Aaron Falk" To: taps@ietf.org Date: Thu, 06 Jul 2017 12:16:59 -0400 Message-ID: <66ECF69D-E26E-4A04-B8F9-BE767C90D0A5@gmail.com> In-Reply-To: <83292426-F72C-4B29-BF39-3567BCDBFF4C@gmail.com> References: <3A3686B5-FF60-448E-9E13-4B493B472C6D@gmail.com> <77C2BA95-F95B-4597-9159-7D5FC4068860@gmail.com> <83292426-F72C-4B29-BF39-3567BCDBFF4C@gmail.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="=_MailMate_BEAC5A3B-4D38-4E4D-906A-58900DC5A9A9_=" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Mailer: MailMate (1.9.6r5356) Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Taps] Prague agenda planning X-BeenThere: taps@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions on Transport Services List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 06 Jul 2017 16:17:04 -0000 --=_MailMate_BEAC5A3B-4D38-4E4D-906A-58900DC5A9A9_= Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Updated. 0. **Agenda Bash & Working Group Status**, Aaron Falk & Zahed Sarker, 10 min 1. **Minimal Set of Transport Services for TAPS Systems**, Naeem Khademi (presenting for authors), 20 min * `draft-gjessing-taps-minset-05.txt` * What’s new: the abstract API 2. **Transport Security Protocol Survey**, Tommy Pauly, 20 min * At the meeting in Chicago, the question of how security protocols should be handled was brought up, and we suggested writing a draft to do a survey of Transport Security protocols, similar to the work done in RFC 8095 and the transport usage drafts. This document goes over several common transport security protocols and analyzes their features and interfaces, particularly with regards to how they interact with their associated transport protocols and applications. For consideration as a TAPS working group doc. * `draft-pauly-taps-transport-security-00.txt`: The common features/interface presented by various security protocols * `draft-kuehlewind-taps-crypto-sep-00.txt`: The ability to separate security handshakes from data encryption 3. **Socket Intents, Concepts & Communication Granularity**, Phillipp Tiesel, 20 min * Socket Intents allow applications to share their knowledge about upcoming communication and express their performance preferences in an API independent way. Therefore, thy can be used by an OS/API to gain enough knowledge to perform access as well as transport protocol selection and tuning. * `draft-tiesel-taps-socketintents-00.txt`: concepts * `draft-tiesel-taps-communitgrany-00.txt`: endpoint and path selection * `draft-tiesel-taps-socketintents-bsdsockets-00.txt`: prototype 4. **Happy Eyeballs update**, Anna Brunstrom, 20 min * `draft-grinnemo-taps-he-03.txt` * The interface between the HE algorithm and the policy management * What should be detailed in the specification of the HE algorithm and what should be left open for implementation? 5. **Discussion: Application- & System-Specified Policy & TAPS**, Framed by Brian Trammell, 40 min --=_MailMate_BEAC5A3B-4D38-4E4D-906A-58900DC5A9A9_= Content-Type: text/html; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

Updated.

  1. Agenda Bash & Working Group S= tatus, Aaron Falk & Zahed Sarker, 10 min

  2. Minimal Set of Transport Services= for TAPS Systems, Naeem Khademi (presenting for authors), 20 mi= n

    • draft-gjessing-taps-minset-05.txt
    • What=E2=80=99s new: the abstract API

  3. Transport Security Protocol Surve= y, Tommy Pauly, 20 min

    • At the meeting in Chicago, the question of how security protocols sho= uld be handled was brought up, and we suggested writing a draft to do a s= urvey of Transport Security protocols, similar to the work done in RFC 80= 95 and the transport usage drafts. This document goes over several common= transport security protocols and analyzes their features and interfaces,= particularly with regards to how they interact with their associated tra= nsport protocols and applications. For consideration as a TAPS working g= roup doc.
    • draft-pauly-taps-transport-security= -00.txt: The common features/interface presented by various securi= ty protocols
    • draft-kuehlewind-taps-crypto-sep-00= =2Etxt: The ability to separate security handshakes from data encr= yption

  4. Socket Intents, Concepts & Co= mmunication Granularity, Phillipp Tiesel, 20 min

    • Socket Intents allow applications to share their knowledge about upco= ming communication and express their performance preferences in an API indepen= dent way. Therefore, thy can be used by an OS/API to gain enough knowledge to perfo= rm access as well as transport protocol selection and tuning.
    • draft-tiesel-taps-socketintents-00.= txt: concepts
    • draft-tiesel-taps-communitgrany-00.= txt: endpoint and path selection
    • draft-tiesel-taps-socketintents-bsd= sockets-00.txt: prototype

  5. Happy Eyeballs update, A= nna Brunstrom, 20 min

    • draft-grinnemo-taps-he-03.txt
    • The interface between the HE algorithm and the policy management
      • =
    • What should be detailed in the specification of the HE algorithm and = what should be left open for implementation?

  6. Discussion: Application- & Sy= stem-Specified Policy & TAPS, Framed by Brian Trammell, 40 = min

--=_MailMate_BEAC5A3B-4D38-4E4D-906A-58900DC5A9A9_=-- From nobody Mon Jul 17 14:31:32 2017 Return-Path: X-Original-To: taps@ietf.org Delivered-To: taps@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from ietfa.amsl.com (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id C0B981200F3; Mon, 17 Jul 2017 14:31:30 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: internet-drafts@ietf.org To: Cc: taps@ietf.org X-Test-IDTracker: no X-IETF-IDTracker: 6.56.0 Auto-Submitted: auto-generated Precedence: bulk Message-ID: <150032709075.24510.7112873852966051910@ietfa.amsl.com> Date: Mon, 17 Jul 2017 14:31:30 -0700 Archived-At: Subject: [Taps] I-D Action: draft-ietf-taps-transports-usage-udp-04.txt X-BeenThere: taps@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 List-Id: Discussions on Transport Services List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 17 Jul 2017 21:31:31 -0000 A New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line Internet-Drafts directories. This draft is a work item of the Transport Services of the IETF. Title : Features of the User Datagram Protocol (UDP) and Lightweight UDP (UDP- Lite) Transport Protocols Authors : Godred Fairhurst Tom Jones Filename : draft-ietf-taps-transports-usage-udp-04.txt Pages : 20 Date : 2017-07-17 Abstract: This is an informational document that describes the transport protocol interface primitives provided by the User Datagram Protocol (UDP) and the Lightweight User Datagram Protocol (UDP-Lite) transport protocols. It identifies the datagram services exposed to applications and how an application can configure and use the features offered by the Internet datagram transport service. The resulting road map to documentation may be of help to users of the UDP and UDP-Lite protocols. The IETF datatracker status page for this draft is: https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-taps-transports-usage-udp/ There are also htmlized versions available at: https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-taps-transports-usage-udp-04 https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/html/draft-ietf-taps-transports-usage-udp-04 A diff from the previous version is available at: https://www.ietf.org/rfcdiff?url2=draft-ietf-taps-transports-usage-udp-04 Please note that it may take a couple of minutes from the time of submission until the htmlized version and diff are available at tools.ietf.org. Internet-Drafts are also available by anonymous FTP at: ftp://ftp.ietf.org/internet-drafts/ From nobody Tue Jul 18 02:12:32 2017 Return-Path: X-Original-To: taps@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: taps@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id E228D131DC7 for ; Tue, 18 Jul 2017 02:12:31 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE=-0.0001, SPF_PASS=-0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (1024-bit key) header.d=krose.org Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id sChS09KYbkVw for ; Tue, 18 Jul 2017 02:12:30 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail-qt0-x229.google.com (mail-qt0-x229.google.com [IPv6:2607:f8b0:400d:c0d::229]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id D3276131945 for ; Tue, 18 Jul 2017 02:12:29 -0700 (PDT) Received: by mail-qt0-x229.google.com with SMTP id b40so10808652qtb.2 for ; Tue, 18 Jul 2017 02:12:29 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=krose.org; s=google; h=mime-version:from:date:message-id:subject:to; bh=Y4xz4BfG0XVkzSoAWD4NuHybo8VJsFUk1cG9yyFFF6k=; b=lZSvefPYL5dxOKEMNP8UF/EktbJoCddo9/K71mMmHgIlJ4b9oowkRKLxKgPzX9Yami cSrMHYJ6qzLkwzBy1FzB2A/iK6WD7R+qtgrQIBGxcAUD+c/nBbdPXt0VyK5qLD2r1uq8 yn/NSpzsQHkERC95ph9y1uUT1RpsPxjaWJEwQ= X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:from:date:message-id:subject:to; bh=Y4xz4BfG0XVkzSoAWD4NuHybo8VJsFUk1cG9yyFFF6k=; b=SUjvZGmr/mkyH5VqG8l3mhuY7Psha9olVDZJ6t9jh87N+zu0lkqfm2Rw2vgXYHhsGy kqIT26vyQAxWQ+ZxUAsaXIwrKPVwTR2aeonD5bSPo7GpnlHljnB7hSK7WVke21d6J6pu iz7cyH+lm/ttt89boK+iNg6HQ5vAFHAqivyggkxOyHIPqnP3odeRf2h8KrbX3McTjAyY 7atx3QwmQ1J/5RcmvOplevFBBRK/QXNY4TdZjLi+MkAvIAVFyZC/NDFFb4HznkOPhS+Z xrHX0R+9tZfEB2B76CwOiB88CyKpM5KPuLc7DnxKwTa1/ziEy15aqqlTBhNPgA6vEMR0 OdtQ== X-Gm-Message-State: AIVw1130jXnW5dHRVAdvn1kIKX71zRU4htdRqM7/WV9l/QNzMEEAV/eV 4SYlTshA07rbVdmSMW0CHb76Tqdo7qWD7Sfj4Q== X-Received: by 10.237.32.70 with SMTP id 64mr699808qta.218.1500369148721; Tue, 18 Jul 2017 02:12:28 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 Received: by 10.55.128.194 with HTTP; Tue, 18 Jul 2017 02:12:28 -0700 (PDT) X-Originating-IP: [2001:67c:370:128:5d46:1ee8:bdb9:d77a] From: Kyle Rose Date: Tue, 18 Jul 2017 11:12:28 +0200 Message-ID: To: taps@ietf.org Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="94eb2c0c98c8245197055493eaa0" Archived-At: Subject: [Taps] Charter change for security X-BeenThere: taps@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions on Transport Services List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 18 Jul 2017 09:12:32 -0000 --94eb2c0c98c8245197055493eaa0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Proposal: (1) Strike the last paragraph of the charter ("TAPS is not chartered to perform detailed analysis..."). (2) Change the third bullet right above it to read "Extension, modification, or creation of transport or security protocols" The idea being to permit analysis of the properties of security protocols with respect to the requirements of TAPS systems, but not to permit creation or customization of security protocols. Thoughts? Kyle --94eb2c0c98c8245197055493eaa0 Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Proposal:

(1) Strike the last paragraph of the= charter ("TAPS is not chartered to perform detailed analysis..."= ).

(2) Change the third bullet right above it to read "Extensio= n, modification, or creation of transport or security protocols"
The idea being to permit analysis of the properties of securit= y protocols with respect to the requirements of TAPS systems, but not to pe= rmit creation or customization of security protocols.

Thoughts?

Kyle
--94eb2c0c98c8245197055493eaa0-- From nobody Tue Jul 18 03:02:43 2017 Return-Path: X-Original-To: taps@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: taps@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id CEE0D131463 for ; Tue, 18 Jul 2017 03:02:41 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -4.202 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-4.202 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-2.3, RP_MATCHES_RCVD=-0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id Ze2gIqkLhLMO for ; Tue, 18 Jul 2017 03:02:40 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail-out01.uio.no (mail-out01.uio.no [IPv6:2001:700:100:10::50]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 25F95129AC4 for ; Tue, 18 Jul 2017 03:02:39 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail-mx05.uio.no ([129.240.10.49]) by mail-out01.uio.no with esmtp (Exim 4.82_1-5b7a7c0-XX) (envelope-from ) id 1dXPKv-0006qe-WB for taps@ietf.org; Tue, 18 Jul 2017 12:02:38 +0200 Received: from [185.81.136.26] (helo=[192.168.1.171]) by mail-mx05.uio.no with esmtpsa (TLSv1.2:DHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384:256) user michawe (Exim 4.82_1-5b7a7c0-XX) (envelope-from ) id 1dXPKu-000958-Nb; Tue, 18 Jul 2017 12:02:37 +0200 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Mime-Version: 1.0 (Mac OS X Mail 10.3 \(3273\)) From: Michael Welzl In-Reply-To: Date: Tue, 18 Jul 2017 12:02:34 +0200 Cc: "taps@ietf.org" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Message-Id: <05F414A1-A2B3-4EF6-A280-DC9DD421B3EC@ifi.uio.no> References: To: Kyle Rose X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.3273) X-UiO-SPF-Received: Received-SPF: neutral (mail-mx05.uio.no: 185.81.136.26 is neither permitted nor denied by domain of ifi.uio.no) client-ip=185.81.136.26; envelope-from=michawe@ifi.uio.no; helo=[192.168.1.171]; X-UiO-Ratelimit-Test: rcpts/h 2 msgs/h 1 sum rcpts/h 2 sum msgs/h 1 total rcpts 56365 max rcpts/h 54 ratelimit 0 X-UiO-Spam-info: not spam, SpamAssassin (score=-5.0, required=5.0, autolearn=disabled, AWL=0.000, UIO_MAIL_IS_INTERNAL=-5, uiobl=NO, uiouri=NO) X-UiO-Scanned: 84CE5233914AE6BCF87B8C45FCD57685E2AB7CA4 X-UiO-SPAM-Test: remote_host: 185.81.136.26 spam_score: -49 maxlevel 80 minaction 2 bait 0 mail/h: 1 total 20 max/h 6 blacklist 0 greylist 0 ratelimit 0 Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Taps] Charter change for security X-BeenThere: taps@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions on Transport Services List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 18 Jul 2017 10:02:42 -0000 Agree 100% - I think this proposal is exactly the right way to do it. Cheers, Michael > On Jul 18, 2017, at 11:12 AM, Kyle Rose wrote: >=20 > Proposal: >=20 > (1) Strike the last paragraph of the charter ("TAPS is not chartered = to perform detailed analysis..."). >=20 > (2) Change the third bullet right above it to read "Extension, = modification, or creation of transport or security protocols" >=20 > The idea being to permit analysis of the properties of security = protocols with respect to the requirements of TAPS systems, but not to = permit creation or customization of security protocols. >=20 > Thoughts? >=20 > Kyle > _______________________________________________ > Taps mailing list > Taps@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/taps From nobody Tue Jul 18 03:16:05 2017 Return-Path: X-Original-To: taps@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: taps@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id AC4CC12969E for ; Tue, 18 Jul 2017 03:15:59 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.9 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.9 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id Bd2TlRa31cM5 for ; Tue, 18 Jul 2017 03:15:57 -0700 (PDT) Received: from capri.iway.ch (capri.iway.ch [212.25.24.45]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher AECDH-AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 63982129B15 for ; Tue, 18 Jul 2017 03:15:57 -0700 (PDT) Received: from gozo.iway.ch (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by localhost (Postfix) with ESMTP id A4FE334014A; Tue, 18 Jul 2017 12:15:55 +0200 (CEST) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by localhost (ACF/18338.11919); Tue, 18 Jul 2017 12:15:53 +0200 (CEST) Received: from switchplus-mail.ch (switchplus-mail.ch [212.25.8.236]) (using TLSv1 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by gozo.iway.ch (Postfix) with ESMTPS; Tue, 18 Jul 2017 12:15:53 +0200 (CEST) Received: from dhcp-80c0.meeting.ietf.org (account ietf@trammell.ch [31.133.128.192] verified) by switchplus-mail.ch (CommuniGate Pro SMTP 6.1.14) with ESMTPSA id 24042311; Tue, 18 Jul 2017 12:15:53 +0200 Mime-Version: 1.0 (Mac OS X Mail 9.3 \(3124\)) Content-Type: multipart/signed; boundary="Apple-Mail=_13C2A12A-4802-4D70-8478-CD6174B842ED"; protocol="application/pgp-signature"; micalg=pgp-sha512 X-Pgp-Agent: GPGMail From: "Brian Trammell (IETF)" In-Reply-To: <05F414A1-A2B3-4EF6-A280-DC9DD421B3EC@ifi.uio.no> Date: Tue, 18 Jul 2017 12:15:50 +0200 Cc: Kyle Rose , "taps@ietf.org" Message-Id: <406114AF-F4DC-4FB4-B75E-54922F78799A@trammell.ch> References: <05F414A1-A2B3-4EF6-A280-DC9DD421B3EC@ifi.uio.no> To: Michael Welzl X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.3124) Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Taps] Charter change for security X-BeenThere: taps@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions on Transport Services List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 18 Jul 2017 10:16:00 -0000 --Apple-Mail=_13C2A12A-4802-4D70-8478-CD6174B842ED Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii +1. Cheers, Brian > On 18 Jul 2017, at 12:02, Michael Welzl wrote: >=20 > Agree 100% - I think this proposal is exactly the right way to do it. >=20 > Cheers, > Michael >=20 >=20 >> On Jul 18, 2017, at 11:12 AM, Kyle Rose wrote: >>=20 >> Proposal: >>=20 >> (1) Strike the last paragraph of the charter ("TAPS is not chartered = to perform detailed analysis..."). >>=20 >> (2) Change the third bullet right above it to read "Extension, = modification, or creation of transport or security protocols" >>=20 >> The idea being to permit analysis of the properties of security = protocols with respect to the requirements of TAPS systems, but not to = permit creation or customization of security protocols. >>=20 >> Thoughts? >>=20 >> Kyle >> _______________________________________________ >> Taps mailing list >> Taps@ietf.org >> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/taps >=20 > _______________________________________________ > Taps mailing list > Taps@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/taps --Apple-Mail=_13C2A12A-4802-4D70-8478-CD6174B842ED Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: attachment; 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Tue, 18 Jul 2017 12:36:38 +0100 (BST) X-AuditID: 1148940d-ed6789c000001d0d-49-596df2c69576 Received: from crk-mmpp-sz04 (crk-mmpp-sz04.euro.apple.com [17.66.12.168]) by relay1.euro.apple.com (Symantec Mail Security) with SMTP id D9.E4.10112.6C2FD695; Tue, 18 Jul 2017 12:36:38 +0100 (BST) MIME-version: 1.0 Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Content-type: text/plain; CHARSET=US-ASCII Received: from [17.235.214.107] (unknown [17.235.214.107]) by crk-mmpp-sz04.euro.apple.com (Oracle Communications Messaging Server 8.0.1.2.20170222 64bit (built Feb 22 2017)) with ESMTPSA id <0OTA00IDRAX1O420@crk-mmpp-sz04.euro.apple.com>; Tue, 18 Jul 2017 12:36:38 +0100 (IST) Sender: tpauly@apple.com From: Tommy Pauly In-reply-to: <406114AF-F4DC-4FB4-B75E-54922F78799A@trammell.ch> Date: Tue, 18 Jul 2017 13:36:36 +0200 Cc: Michael Welzl , Kyle Rose , "taps@ietf.org" Message-id: <1EDFF789-D5D2-4A52-ABF6-5D6D1B1E61C3@apple.com> References: <05F414A1-A2B3-4EF6-A280-DC9DD421B3EC@ifi.uio.no> <406114AF-F4DC-4FB4-B75E-54922F78799A@trammell.ch> To: "Brian Trammell (IETF)" X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.3439) X-Brightmail-Tracker: H4sIAAAAAAAAA+NgFnrJLMWRmVeSWpSXmKPExsUi6GTOrXvsU26kwYNOeYuNLe/YLNa/mMRm 8ePsTlaLOzEOLB5Llvxk8li9+iGzR9fF70weT/bPZAlgieKySUnNySxLLdK3S+DKOD/pPVPB Y66KW5OfszQwPuLoYuTgkBAwkWhZq9/FyMUhJLCISaKn8TJTFyMnWPzClQtMEInjjBJfmhtZ QRK8AoISPybfYwFpZhaQlzh4XhYkzCygJfH9USsLRP1cJokJR38zg9QIC0hIbN6TCGHqSzyd owVSziagInH82wZmEJtTwF7i162NYNNZBFQl7v46ygoxMk1i5tpLUFttJPreXIY6ZzejxLG2 P2DNIgJ6Eiv//GOB+EVWYumfEIjzF7BJ7LzONIFReBaSo2chHD0LydELGJlXMYrnJmbm6Gbm Geullhbl6yUWFOSk6iXn525iBEWAxxTeHYzXDxoeYhTgYFTi4ZVh844UYk0sK67MPcQowcGs JML75GNupBBvSmJlVWpRfnxRaU5q8SFGaQ4WJXFek1L5SCGB9MSS1OzU1ILUIpgsEwenVAOj f88FxfePr9oWS22WUBO5qlO9eebx+IKO2cVlj9PCuB60i8ZtPXHJ8I58vo9zUNuFeS8iyj+x 7v4SLWrC1ZJxI+Rp5Sueg4tNDRsu6+141nKcSVb0ZFLW5+tSxr9qg6cH27tdSxFICZN6aaBv evb+pq/XllwsntS5djrnhpLVorM+al5UZNVUYinOSDTUYi4qTgQA4fs6RnwCAAA= X-Brightmail-Tracker: H4sIAAAAAAAAA+NgFjrMLMWRmVeSWpSXmKPExsUi6MSzQvfYp9xIg+07pC02trxjs1j/YhKb xY+zO1kt7sQ4sHgsWfKTyWP16ofMHl0XvzN5PNk/kyWAJYrLJiU1J7MstUjfLoEr4/yk90wF j7kqbk1+ztLA+Iiji5GTQ0LAROLClQtMXYxcHEICxxklvjQ3soIkeAUEJX5MvsfSxcjBwSwg L3HwvCxImFlAS+L7o1YWiPq5TBITjv5mBqkRFpCQ2LwnEcLUl3g6RwuknE1AReL4tw3MIDan gL3Er1sbwaazCKhK3P11lBViZJrEzLWXoLbaSPS9uQx1zm5GiWNtf8CaRQT0JFb++Qd2joSA rMTSPyETGAVmITl0FsKhs5AcuoCReRWjaFFqTmKloV5qaVG+XmJBQU6qXnJ+7iZGcNCac+9g PL7b8BCjAAejEg9v3dXcSCHWxLLiytxDjBIczEoivE8+AoV4UxIrq1KL8uOLSnNSiw8xSnOw KInzFjyMiBQSSE8sSc1OTS1ILYLJMnFwSjUwxjtkzAku2Hxr5VrLzXduFNgsWflqid8LcVGt 4lt7+h1/p3/9o/+Ys1E3heXCYe0T6ov8LdXTmBw5ZnovKuu9srLufTT3K42vVR3b2TN/GMWV yDlz5XaZG93j0rg99dG6gyVvH3BdL327Z4Py41McRxJZrzw/Y7LKgLNyeub/rRy3qjN/3GzR V2Ipzkg01GIuKk4EADGkkZ9WAgAA Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Taps] Charter change for security X-BeenThere: taps@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions on Transport Services List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 18 Jul 2017 11:36:42 -0000 Agreed. Thanks for the text proposal, Kyle! Tommy > On Jul 18, 2017, at 12:15 PM, Brian Trammell (IETF) wrote: > > +1. > > Cheers, > > Brian > >> On 18 Jul 2017, at 12:02, Michael Welzl wrote: >> >> Agree 100% - I think this proposal is exactly the right way to do it. >> >> Cheers, >> Michael >> >> >>> On Jul 18, 2017, at 11:12 AM, Kyle Rose wrote: >>> >>> Proposal: >>> >>> (1) Strike the last paragraph of the charter ("TAPS is not chartered to perform detailed analysis..."). >>> >>> (2) Change the third bullet right above it to read "Extension, modification, or creation of transport or security protocols" >>> >>> The idea being to permit analysis of the properties of security protocols with respect to the requirements of TAPS systems, but not to permit creation or customization of security protocols. >>> >>> Thoughts? >>> >>> Kyle >>> _______________________________________________ >>> Taps mailing list >>> Taps@ietf.org >>> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/taps >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Taps mailing list >> Taps@ietf.org >> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/taps > > _______________________________________________ > Taps mailing list > Taps@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/taps From nobody Tue Jul 18 04:41:05 2017 Return-Path: X-Original-To: taps@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: taps@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 41F5F131DE5 for ; Tue, 18 Jul 2017 04:40:51 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -4.202 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-4.202 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-2.3, RP_MATCHES_RCVD=-0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id SBafyEskW2_H for ; Tue, 18 Jul 2017 04:40:48 -0700 (PDT) Received: from z9m9z.htt-consult.com (z9m9z.htt-consult.com [50.253.254.3]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 1D1671317BE for ; Tue, 18 Jul 2017 04:40:48 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by z9m9z.htt-consult.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 46DFF621BF; Tue, 18 Jul 2017 07:40:46 -0400 (EDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at htt-consult.com Received: from z9m9z.htt-consult.com ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (z9m9z.htt-consult.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id krl9lEU7SOyD; Tue, 18 Jul 2017 07:40:39 -0400 (EDT) Received: from lx120e.htt-consult.com (dhcp-831f.meeting.ietf.org [31.133.131.31]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher DHE-RSA-AES128-SHA (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by z9m9z.htt-consult.com (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 050A362196; Tue, 18 Jul 2017 07:40:35 -0400 (EDT) To: Tommy Pauly , "Brian Trammell (IETF)" References: <05F414A1-A2B3-4EF6-A280-DC9DD421B3EC@ifi.uio.no> <406114AF-F4DC-4FB4-B75E-54922F78799A@trammell.ch> <1EDFF789-D5D2-4A52-ABF6-5D6D1B1E61C3@apple.com> Cc: Kyle Rose , Michael Welzl , "taps@ietf.org" From: Robert Moskowitz Message-ID: Date: Tue, 18 Jul 2017 13:40:29 +0200 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; Linux x86_64; rv:45.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/45.8.0 MIME-Version: 1.0 In-Reply-To: <1EDFF789-D5D2-4A52-ABF6-5D6D1B1E61C3@apple.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=windows-1252; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Taps] Charter change for security X-BeenThere: taps@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions on Transport Services List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 18 Jul 2017 11:40:51 -0000 I just joined this list. I can work with this. Bob On 07/18/2017 01:36 PM, Tommy Pauly wrote: > Agreed. Thanks for the text proposal, Kyle! > > Tommy > >> On Jul 18, 2017, at 12:15 PM, Brian Trammell (IETF) wrote: >> >> +1. >> >> Cheers, >> >> Brian >> >>> On 18 Jul 2017, at 12:02, Michael Welzl wrote: >>> >>> Agree 100% - I think this proposal is exactly the right way to do it. >>> >>> Cheers, >>> Michael >>> >>> >>>> On Jul 18, 2017, at 11:12 AM, Kyle Rose wrote: >>>> >>>> Proposal: >>>> >>>> (1) Strike the last paragraph of the charter ("TAPS is not chartered to perform detailed analysis..."). >>>> >>>> (2) Change the third bullet right above it to read "Extension, modification, or creation of transport or security protocols" >>>> >>>> The idea being to permit analysis of the properties of security protocols with respect to the requirements of TAPS systems, but not to permit creation or customization of security protocols. >>>> >>>> Thoughts? >>>> >>>> Kyle >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> Taps mailing list >>>> Taps@ietf.org >>>> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/taps >>> _______________________________________________ >>> Taps mailing list >>> Taps@ietf.org >>> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/taps >> _______________________________________________ >> Taps mailing list >> Taps@ietf.org >> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/taps > _______________________________________________ > Taps mailing list > Taps@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/taps From nobody Tue Jul 18 05:17:32 2017 Return-Path: X-Original-To: taps@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: taps@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id E60BF12420B for ; 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Tue, 18 Jul 2017 05:17:12 -0700 (PDT) Received: from [172.19.152.191] ([2001:67c:370:128:6c6f:944a:9e01:5472]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id p140sm17333344wmb.28.2017.07.18.05.17.11 (version=TLS1_2 cipher=ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 bits=128/128); Tue, 18 Jul 2017 05:17:12 -0700 (PDT) From: "Aaron Falk" To: "taps WG" Cc: "Klock, Matti" , "Gorry Fairhurst" Date: Tue, 18 Jul 2017 14:17:11 +0200 Message-ID: <4BF8623C-6DFA-4A0A-9E48-00358D997668@gmail.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="=_MailMate_86319FB4-5664-4CB5-915E-7A180311FF14_=" X-Mailer: MailMate (1.9.6r5356) Archived-At: Subject: [Taps] TAPS-99 minutes X-BeenThere: taps@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions on Transport Services List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 18 Jul 2017 12:17:31 -0000 --=_MailMate_86319FB4-5664-4CB5-915E-7A180311FF14_= Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8; format=flowed; markup=markdown Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Matti did an awesome job with the [Etherpad meeting = notes](http://etherpad.tools.ietf.org:9000/p/notes-ietf-99-taps?useMonosp= aceFont=3Dtrue) = with an assist from Gorry. Please review them ASAP for any comments you = made or think should be included. =E2=80=94aaron --=_MailMate_86319FB4-5664-4CB5-915E-7A180311FF14_= Content-Type: text/html; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

Matti did an awesome job with the Etherpad meeting notes with an assist from Gorry= =2E Please review them ASAP for any comments you made or think should be= included.

=E2=80=94aaron

--=_MailMate_86319FB4-5664-4CB5-915E-7A180311FF14_=-- From nobody Tue Jul 18 05:21:48 2017 Return-Path: X-Original-To: taps@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: taps@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id BA907131B3A for ; Tue, 18 Jul 2017 05:21:47 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE=-0.0001, SPF_PASS=-0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=gmail.com Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id WRl4_WfoKAjT for ; Tue, 18 Jul 2017 05:21:45 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail-wr0-x22f.google.com (mail-wr0-x22f.google.com [IPv6:2a00:1450:400c:c0c::22f]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 05AE2131B29 for ; Tue, 18 Jul 2017 05:21:45 -0700 (PDT) Received: by mail-wr0-x22f.google.com with SMTP id w4so26363929wrb.2 for ; Tue, 18 Jul 2017 05:21:44 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20161025; h=from:to:cc:subject:date:message-id:in-reply-to:references :mime-version:content-transfer-encoding; bh=IkEUngRhUUFNetSh6MRWTNZMT1JMRHDKhCMbshM+vjA=; b=flrBmg72jTOT/F7O4K+eyQe/ICyJJVT+TNvj+YE1HTu72kXB8WBDDDNA17BdX0ATU5 K2Dj6QCJe3KvQ070Dw17nKxEVx8pUckvLyUXSjnBw76wQyYrFTdB0mkd5j4E/KNenUyK SXmInXZjzLgg/GA9SNbFRyQSOEBOxVjTaHBBfoTPbTibhNusZc77oV50uw97W4ht3/ok aVVxIuKZ30JptcWihmueI16vrU1rFZ3pdNaW6mMmGWVnk09pHH9NEy9ke8p+wAJU7uGX Fx6tDQ3XNyb1sKTRdEBdFrYy0BJevSbxrEoPaobZTcO0mHPkmFw8TYM73fP+LlucSVyZ unFA== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:from:to:cc:subject:date:message-id:in-reply-to :references:mime-version:content-transfer-encoding; bh=IkEUngRhUUFNetSh6MRWTNZMT1JMRHDKhCMbshM+vjA=; b=FrCF2h4LXTDIfkxXjqb4baYBPYIezvq88dpVda4I0R/3FnwviVcxV6CK4zEeEe5CQA YjFwvDQ1Le1/4OnYpVb2i69XP7e6BvGzPqpcmjC7c4YlWl4U6vDsGHqnuCy0BWvleJhZ /p+b01TsF6M1hMptPyRvEY2dp+yd1MwwbMl8ayULEm/MNo1oNU2osaaeBj0oEopOCf+U 9D7VMzCl+/bObg2NORO/oeXflth2vmqiQ3UbbYad+4gZ+6W755aLQrwjC2aqeE9QMy0R Lz4UswQc/ULUTS5miJL7HFk8m2+DL2ldQZRG6a7xk1YxTn+lM1kQhJ95x88ODacMY365 vd+Q== X-Gm-Message-State: AIVw111X45Y/WNOdmKgJ6qI/ePPPakbJZA7EEwc9ZN4D+Br0UbXkXMs5 7mmdHBx/76mEcQ== X-Received: by 10.28.37.193 with SMTP id l184mr2029120wml.24.1500380503128; Tue, 18 Jul 2017 05:21:43 -0700 (PDT) Received: from [172.19.152.191] ([2001:67c:370:128:6c6f:944a:9e01:5472]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id t62sm1878303wmb.24.2017.07.18.05.21.42 (version=TLS1_2 cipher=ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 bits=128/128); Tue, 18 Jul 2017 05:21:42 -0700 (PDT) From: "Aaron Falk" To: "Robert Moskowitz" Cc: "Tommy Pauly" , "Brian Trammell" , "Kyle Rose" , "Michael Welzl" , "taps@ietf.org" Date: Tue, 18 Jul 2017 14:21:41 +0200 Message-ID: <52746EE2-1898-4879-8B33-C2AF17FC812D@gmail.com> In-Reply-To: References: <05F414A1-A2B3-4EF6-A280-DC9DD421B3EC@ifi.uio.no> <406114AF-F4DC-4FB4-B75E-54922F78799A@trammell.ch> <1EDFF789-D5D2-4A52-ABF6-5D6D1B1E61C3@apple.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Mailer: MailMate (1.9.6r5356) Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Taps] Charter change for security X-BeenThere: taps@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions on Transport Services List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 18 Jul 2017 12:21:47 -0000 This is fine with me. Brief pause for any objections before making the charter change request to the ADs… —aaron On 18 Jul 2017, at 13:40, Robert Moskowitz wrote: > I just joined this list. > > I can work with this. > > Bob > > On 07/18/2017 01:36 PM, Tommy Pauly wrote: >> Agreed. Thanks for the text proposal, Kyle! >> >> Tommy >> >>> On Jul 18, 2017, at 12:15 PM, Brian Trammell (IETF) >>> wrote: >>> >>> +1. >>> >>> Cheers, >>> >>> Brian >>> >>>> On 18 Jul 2017, at 12:02, Michael Welzl wrote: >>>> >>>> Agree 100% - I think this proposal is exactly the right way to do >>>> it. >>>> >>>> Cheers, >>>> Michael >>>> >>>> >>>>> On Jul 18, 2017, at 11:12 AM, Kyle Rose wrote: >>>>> >>>>> Proposal: >>>>> >>>>> (1) Strike the last paragraph of the charter ("TAPS is not >>>>> chartered to perform detailed analysis..."). >>>>> >>>>> (2) Change the third bullet right above it to read "Extension, >>>>> modification, or creation of transport or security protocols" >>>>> >>>>> The idea being to permit analysis of the properties of security >>>>> protocols with respect to the requirements of TAPS systems, but >>>>> not to permit creation or customization of security protocols. >>>>> >>>>> Thoughts? >>>>> >>>>> Kyle >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> Taps mailing list >>>>> Taps@ietf.org >>>>> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/taps >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> Taps mailing list >>>> Taps@ietf.org >>>> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/taps >>> _______________________________________________ >>> Taps mailing list >>> Taps@ietf.org >>> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/taps >> _______________________________________________ >> Taps mailing list >> Taps@ietf.org >> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/taps > > _______________________________________________ > Taps mailing list > Taps@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/taps From nobody Fri Jul 21 03:09:20 2017 Return-Path: X-Original-To: taps@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: taps@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 631D11277BB for ; 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Fri, 21 Jul 2017 03:09:15 -0700 (PDT) Received: from [172.19.153.76] ([2001:67c:1232:144:4c40:7285:c814:e65b]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id c34sm8877619wra.80.2017.07.21.03.09.13 (version=TLS1_2 cipher=ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 bits=128/128); Fri, 21 Jul 2017 03:09:14 -0700 (PDT) From: "Aaron Falk" To: "taps WG" Cc: "Zaheduzzaman Sarker" , "Klock, Matti" Date: Fri, 21 Jul 2017 12:09:10 +0200 Message-ID: <1E7F2C99-45CC-4774-84D0-5788ED8C98B8@gmail.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="=_MailMate_86F7FFD3-EB20-446C-880A-BAC05541187E_=" X-Mailer: MailMate (1.9.6r5356) Archived-At: Subject: [Taps] draft TAPS-99 minutes uploaded X-BeenThere: taps@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions on Transport Services List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 21 Jul 2017 10:09:18 -0000 --=_MailMate_86F7FFD3-EB20-446C-880A-BAC05541187E_= Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8; format=flowed; markup=markdown Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable The Etherpad notes for the Prague TAPS meeting were so good that I=E2=80=99= ve = uploaded them as draft minutes = <[here](https://www.ietf.org/proceedings/99/minutes/minutes-99-taps-00.ht= ml)>. = If you see changes that should be made make them in the Ehterpad = <[here](http://etherpad.tools.ietf.org:9000/p/notes-ietf-99-taps?useMonos= paceFont=3Dtrue)> = and I=E2=80=99ll refresh the minutes submission. Thanks again, Matti! =E2=80=94aaron --=_MailMate_86F7FFD3-EB20-446C-880A-BAC05541187E_= Content-Type: text/html; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

The Etherpad notes for the Prague TAPS meeting were so go= od that I=E2=80=99ve uploaded them as draft minutes <here>. If you see changes that should be made make = them in the Ehterpad <here= > and I=E2=80=99ll refresh the minutes submission.

Thanks again, Matti!

=E2=80=94aaron

--=_MailMate_86F7FFD3-EB20-446C-880A-BAC05541187E_=-- From nobody Wed Jul 26 11:49:58 2017 Return-Path: X-Original-To: taps@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: taps@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8D6CC12EAF0 for ; Wed, 26 Jul 2017 11:49:57 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -4.2 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-4.2 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-2.3, RP_MATCHES_RCVD=-0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, WEIRD_PORT=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id Vrt94TNxJ_Vb for ; Wed, 26 Jul 2017 11:49:54 -0700 (PDT) Received: from z9m9z.htt-consult.com (z9m9z.htt-consult.com [50.253.254.3]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 8E6F412426E for ; Wed, 26 Jul 2017 11:49:54 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by z9m9z.htt-consult.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0B1946223C; Wed, 26 Jul 2017 14:49:53 -0400 (EDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at htt-consult.com Received: from z9m9z.htt-consult.com ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (z9m9z.htt-consult.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id VL8RNcB1gNzz; Wed, 26 Jul 2017 14:49:50 -0400 (EDT) Received: from lx120e.htt-consult.com (198.sub-70-194-1.myvzw.com [70.194.1.198]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher DHE-RSA-AES128-SHA (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by z9m9z.htt-consult.com (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id AF2A262236; Wed, 26 Jul 2017 14:49:49 -0400 (EDT) To: Aaron Falk , taps WG References: <1E7F2C99-45CC-4774-84D0-5788ED8C98B8@gmail.com> Cc: Zaheduzzaman Sarker , "Klock, Matti" From: Robert Moskowitz Message-ID: <55805577-bdfb-f203-e957-158126d77aca@htt-consult.com> Date: Wed, 26 Jul 2017 14:49:47 -0400 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; Linux x86_64; rv:45.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/45.8.0 MIME-Version: 1.0 In-Reply-To: <1E7F2C99-45CC-4774-84D0-5788ED8C98B8@gmail.com> Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="------------9078F15276A3A7CD2AB1D70F" Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Taps] draft TAPS-99 minutes uploaded X-BeenThere: taps@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions on Transport Services List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 26 Jul 2017 18:49:57 -0000 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --------------9078F15276A3A7CD2AB1D70F Content-Type: text/plain; charset=windows-1252; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Some notes on my comments. that is CANbus::= Controller Area Network Bus. This has been used in Automotive/Vehicle since early 90s. The new CAN FD messages can have up to 64 bytes payload (MTU) (up from 8 bytes of original CAN!). So it is not effective to have an Internetworking or Transport layer... On 07/21/2017 06:09 AM, Aaron Falk wrote: > > The Etherpad notes for the Prague TAPS meeting were so good that Ive > uploaded them as draft minutes >. > If you see changes that should be made make them in the Ehterpad > > and Ill refresh the minutes submission. > > Thanks again, Matti! > > aaron > > > > _______________________________________________ > Taps mailing list > Taps@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/taps --------------9078F15276A3A7CD2AB1D70F Content-Type: text/html; charset=windows-1252 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Some notes on my comments.

that is CANbus::= Controller Area Network Bus. This has been used in Automotive/Vehicle since early 90s. The new CAN FD messages can have up to 64 bytes payload (MTU) (up from 8 bytes of original CAN!). So it is not effective to have an Internetworking or Transport layer...

On 07/21/2017 06:09 AM, Aaron Falk wrote:

The Etherpad notes for the Prague TAPS meeting were so good that Ive uploaded them as draft minutes <here>. If you see changes that should be made make them in the Ehterpad <here> and Ill refresh the minutes submission.

Thanks again, Matti!

aaron



_______________________________________________
Taps mailing list
Taps@ietf.org
https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/taps

--------------9078F15276A3A7CD2AB1D70F-- From nobody Wed Jul 26 11:58:10 2017 Return-Path: X-Original-To: taps@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: taps@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 41B2B129B62 for ; Wed, 26 Jul 2017 11:58:09 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -4.2 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-4.2 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-2.3, RP_MATCHES_RCVD=-0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, WEIRD_PORT=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id ISFd06hsXhbq for ; Wed, 26 Jul 2017 11:58:07 -0700 (PDT) Received: from z9m9z.htt-consult.com (z9m9z.htt-consult.com [50.253.254.3]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 3779912426E for ; Wed, 26 Jul 2017 11:58:07 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by z9m9z.htt-consult.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 456296223E; Wed, 26 Jul 2017 14:58:04 -0400 (EDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at htt-consult.com Received: from z9m9z.htt-consult.com ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (z9m9z.htt-consult.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id BMQbUig930ni; Wed, 26 Jul 2017 14:57:58 -0400 (EDT) Received: from lx120e.htt-consult.com (198.sub-70-194-1.myvzw.com [70.194.1.198]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher DHE-RSA-AES128-SHA (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by z9m9z.htt-consult.com (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 0357362236; Wed, 26 Jul 2017 14:57:55 -0400 (EDT) To: Aaron Falk , taps WG References: <1E7F2C99-45CC-4774-84D0-5788ED8C98B8@gmail.com> <55805577-bdfb-f203-e957-158126d77aca@htt-consult.com> Cc: Zaheduzzaman Sarker , "Klock, Matti" From: Robert Moskowitz Message-ID: Date: Wed, 26 Jul 2017 14:57:52 -0400 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; Linux x86_64; rv:45.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/45.8.0 MIME-Version: 1.0 In-Reply-To: <55805577-bdfb-f203-e957-158126d77aca@htt-consult.com> Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="------------01E5C8CD88572DDA08033177" Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Taps] draft TAPS-99 minutes uploaded X-BeenThere: taps@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions on Transport Services List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 26 Jul 2017 18:58:09 -0000 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --------------01E5C8CD88572DDA08033177 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=windows-1252; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Oh, and the '15.9' comment is IEEE 802.15.9 KMP transport for 802.15.4. If you look at this you will see an approach for handling KMP as a side function from application record messaging. 802.15.4 forces this, as there is no ETHType like in 802.3 that 802.1X uses for traffic separation. So it is very much like what a Transport service may have to deal with. Disclaimer: I was the chair of 802.15.9. On 07/26/2017 02:49 PM, Robert Moskowitz wrote: > Some notes on my comments. > > that is CANbus::= Controller Area Network Bus. This has been used in > Automotive/Vehicle since early 90s. The new CAN FD messages can have > up to 64 bytes payload (MTU) (up from 8 bytes of original CAN!). So > it is not effective to have an Internetworking or Transport layer... > > On 07/21/2017 06:09 AM, Aaron Falk wrote: >> >> The Etherpad notes for the Prague TAPS meeting were so good that Ive >> uploaded them as draft minutes > >. >> If you see changes that should be made make them in the Ehterpad >> > > >> and Ill refresh the minutes submission. >> >> Thanks again, Matti! >> >> aaron >> >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Taps mailing list >> Taps@ietf.org >> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/taps > > > > _______________________________________________ > Taps mailing list > Taps@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/taps --------------01E5C8CD88572DDA08033177 Content-Type: text/html; charset=windows-1252 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Oh, and the '15.9' comment is IEEE 802.15.9 KMP transport for 802.15.4.

If you look at this you will see an approach for handling KMP as a side function from application record messaging. 802.15.4 forces this, as there is no ETHType like in 802.3 that 802.1X uses for traffic separation. So it is very much like what a Transport service may have to deal with.

Disclaimer: I was the chair of 802.15.9.

On 07/26/2017 02:49 PM, Robert Moskowitz wrote:
Some notes on my comments.

that is CANbus::= Controller Area Network Bus. This has been used in Automotive/Vehicle since early 90s. The new CAN FD messages can have up to 64 bytes payload (MTU) (up from 8 bytes of original CAN!). So it is not effective to have an Internetworking or Transport layer...

On 07/21/2017 06:09 AM, Aaron Falk wrote:

The Etherpad notes for the Prague TAPS meeting were so good that Ive uploaded them as draft minutes <here>. If you see changes that should be made make them in the Ehterpad <here> and Ill refresh the minutes submission.

Thanks again, Matti!

aaron



_______________________________________________
Taps mailing list
Taps@ietf.org
https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/taps




_______________________________________________
Taps mailing list
Taps@ietf.org
https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/taps

--------------01E5C8CD88572DDA08033177-- From nobody Wed Jul 26 14:22:14 2017 Return-Path: X-Original-To: taps@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: taps@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 56D4113178D for ; Wed, 26 Jul 2017 14:22:12 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.698 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.698 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW=-0.7, SPF_PASS=-0.001, WEIRD_PORT=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=gmail.com Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 5eR47-lwTLf0 for ; Wed, 26 Jul 2017 14:22:10 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail-qk0-x22f.google.com (mail-qk0-x22f.google.com [IPv6:2607:f8b0:400d:c09::22f]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 0E51F131471 for ; Wed, 26 Jul 2017 14:22:10 -0700 (PDT) Received: by mail-qk0-x22f.google.com with SMTP id x191so26728229qka.5 for ; Wed, 26 Jul 2017 14:22:10 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20161025; h=from:to:cc:subject:date:message-id:in-reply-to:references :mime-version:embedded-html; bh=fZa8en6eGHADHI6U/DJ1B+8qxCiOYrQgM732a8ptWbc=; b=UyQj5k+5DlEgsTRD5J3pAmY1jO/4k0WQrTwgELZVnDJ4/T8gQi+EhrRVc+SjMarheI ZkAP2chBoYPuZujtLY6wdby2rvJg9HIgBIjVgD0WyioHbm/KMiSGTqDpiDADpWywdaSu xOdV8E5IX3rPwQwWQtnA08b6kM5W7lwewaa4G8tJV5JToWHcMFmIYhKJsP+4NPsx7tdd +wa5lPk0aftS+nJZjkHxd7p5M+fGHRPh5A9PzpcFc61PBQ+rD2a2wxPfsMTl1/XYi+7K zGJz0GYHBbkAwgTkP2pwiJYSN3fg/6Y4siJcuGGEChQgm6QR9pM5OOR16OrPvASmhgDf Ndpw== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:from:to:cc:subject:date:message-id:in-reply-to :references:mime-version:embedded-html; bh=fZa8en6eGHADHI6U/DJ1B+8qxCiOYrQgM732a8ptWbc=; b=FEAEdVMyVAeU/viWbDO56Bm4OROR9dz4coCivCNDqZuCEeawHV9Aw28GPKzij1VK+f DPjfur0fm+RdNN5qBOI+ntVUSKj6zLfPkEy6qtklf4MIQQX6BnN81zIvnnEERJrYZ3aj lHj2cggq4lOul5aD6nboqNu2I1sdudtoix9MK1jhLfEIYxL770F+jDMYgbuh96CpbcJ2 SAkyEst9LpbgH0FUG0orVE6oNvA1pWHVA7wOwDZlIJ0FBVnwvlzS9UoDc1RtjFH8bTAU 8XR8BJVvndvdVBv6eATp3sOARWN36IeS//ND2SH8sndHo7hfHXAa/ZMTslZZwCl0Y/fG Pucg== X-Gm-Message-State: AIVw110kkJIUVOcH48Wp5ouGiPwXOZMApl5MyfHk8Zq7CQc6mFVuLzlT xD1nrLuQe8j0+EuGf2s= X-Received: by 10.55.165.137 with SMTP id o131mr3192211qke.226.1501104129111; Wed, 26 Jul 2017 14:22:09 -0700 (PDT) Received: from [169.254.166.194] ([72.246.0.14]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id u67sm12022278qkd.67.2017.07.26.14.22.08 (version=TLS1_2 cipher=ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 bits=128/128); Wed, 26 Jul 2017 14:22:08 -0700 (PDT) From: "Aaron Falk" To: "Robert Moskowitz" Cc: "taps WG" , "Zaheduzzaman Sarker" , "Klock, Matti" Date: Wed, 26 Jul 2017 17:22:07 -0400 Message-ID: <2BF5B1BD-1C74-456B-8119-7E348F20BFDF@gmail.com> In-Reply-To: References: <1E7F2C99-45CC-4774-84D0-5788ED8C98B8@gmail.com> <55805577-bdfb-f203-e957-158126d77aca@htt-consult.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="=_MailMate_135F2AF8-C366-43D7-A56C-CF36627323F1_=" Embedded-HTML: [{"HTML":[554, 3278], "plain":[175, 1552], "uuid":"133B93A0-7765-409C-B7E8-0873CF6A90CD"}] X-Mailer: MailMate (1.9.6r5356) Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Taps] draft TAPS-99 minutes uploaded X-BeenThere: taps@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions on Transport Services List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 26 Jul 2017 21:22:12 -0000 --=_MailMate_135F2AF8-C366-43D7-A56C-CF36627323F1_= Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Thanks for the additional information, Bob. I=E2=80=99ve added your comm= ents = and uploaded a revision to the minutes. --aaron On 26 Jul 2017, at 14:57, Robert Moskowitz wrote: > Oh, and the '15.9' comment is IEEE 802.15.9 KMP transport for = > 802.15.4. > > If you look at this you will see an approach for handling KMP as a = > side function from application record messaging. 802.15.4 forces = > this, as there is no ETHType like in 802.3 that 802.1X uses for = > traffic separation. So it is very much like what a Transport service = > may have to deal with. > > Disclaimer: I was the chair of 802.15.9. > > On 07/26/2017 02:49 PM, Robert Moskowitz wrote: >> Some notes on my comments. >> >> that is CANbus::=3D Controller Area Network Bus. This has been used i= n = >> Automotive/Vehicle since early 90s. The new CAN FD messages can have = >> up to 64 bytes payload (MTU) (up from 8 bytes of original CAN!). So = >> it is not effective to have an Internetworking or Transport layer... >> >> On 07/21/2017 06:09 AM, Aaron Falk wrote: >>> >>> The Etherpad notes for the Prague TAPS meeting were so good that = >>> I=E2=80=99ve uploaded them as draft minutes >> = >. = >>> If you see changes that should be made make them in the Ehterpad = >>> >> > = >>> and I=E2=80=99ll refresh the minutes submission. >>> >>> Thanks again, Matti! >>> >>> =E2=80=94aaron >>> >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> Taps mailing list >>> Taps@ietf.org >>> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/taps >> >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Taps mailing list >> Taps@ietf.org >> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/taps --=_MailMate_135F2AF8-C366-43D7-A56C-CF36627323F1_= Content-Type: text/html; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
<= p dir=3D"auto">Thanks for the additional information, Bob. I=E2=80=99ve = added your comments and uploaded a revision to the minutes.

--aaron

On 26 Jul 2017, at 14:57, Robert Moskowitz wrote:

Oh, and the '15.9' comment is IEEE 802.15.9 KMP transport for 802.15.4.

If you look at this you will see an approach for handling KMP as a side function from application record messaging.=C2=A0 802.15.4 force= s this, as there is no ETHType like in 802.3 that 802.1X uses for traffic separation.=C2=A0 So it is very much like what a Transport service may have to deal with.

Disclaimer:=C2=A0 I was the chair of 802.15.9.

On 07/26/2017 02:49 PM, Robert Moskowitz wrote:
Some notes on my comments.

that is CANbus::=3D Controller Area Network Bus.=C2=A0 This has bee= n used in Automotive/Vehicle since early 90s.=C2=A0 The new CAN FD message= s can have up to 64 bytes payload (MTU) (up from 8 bytes of original CAN!).=C2=A0 So it is not effective to have an Internetworking or Transport layer...

On 07/21/2017 06:09 AM, Aaron Falk wrote:

The Etherpad notes for the Prague TAPS meetin= g were so good that I=E2=80=99ve uploaded them as draft minut= es <here>. If you see changes that should be made make them in the Ehterpad <here> and I=E2=80=99ll ref= resh the minutes submission.

Thanks again, Matti!

=E2=80=94aaron



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