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boundary="_000_AM5PR0701MB25477DB68DEEDCADECDF4C5D931D0AM5PR0701MB2547_" MIME-Version: 1.0 X-OriginatorOrg: nokia.com X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-Network-Message-Id: 84264713-f631-4b90-d818-08d5555bd202 X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-originalarrivaltime: 06 Jan 2018 23:18:39.5798 (UTC) X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-fromentityheader: Hosted X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-id: 5d471751-9675-428d-917b-70f44f9630b0 X-MS-Exchange-Transport-CrossTenantHeadersStamped: AM5PR0701MB2401 Archived-At: Subject: [tcpm] Review of draft-ietf-tcpm-alternativebackoff-ecn-05 X-BeenThere: tcpm@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 Precedence: list List-Id: TCP Maintenance and Minor Extensions Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sat, 06 Jan 2018 23:18:51 -0000 --_000_AM5PR0701MB25477DB68DEEDCADECDF4C5D931D0AM5PR0701MB2547_ Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Authors, all, I have read draft-ietf-tcpm-alternativebackoff-ecn-05. I found some minor i= ssues that should be easy to fix; in many cases the issues are editorial. Y= et, I believe a document update would be useful. See below [ms]. Thanks Michael (with no hat on) ******************************* Abstract Recent Active Queue Management (AQM) mechanisms allow for burst tolerance while enforcing short queues to minimise the time that packets spend enqueued at a bottleneck. [ms] Nit: I am not sure if the term "recent" is really needed. IMHO any AQM= , including old vanilla RED, can have this property, if it is properly conf= igured. As a result, I think the sentence would also be correct without the= word "recent". This would somewhat avoid the question (in particular in th= e abstract) how to handle bottlenecks that use e.g. vanilla RED instead of = a "recent" AQM. 1. Definitions The key words "MUST", "MUST NOT", "REQUIRED", "SHALL", "SHALL NOT", "SHOULD", "SHOULD NOT", "RECOMMENDED", "MAY", and "OPTIONAL" in this document are to be interpreted as described in RFC 2119 [RFC2119]. [ms] Nit: Maybe the new wording in RFC8174 could be used. As an editorial n= it, Section 1 and 2 could be swapped, but the order may be a matter of tast= e. 4.1. Why Use ECN to Vary the Degree of Backoff? When packet loss is inferred using the retransmission timer and the given packet has not yet been resent by way of the retransmission timer (regarded as a notification of congestion), Standard TCP sets the ssthresh to the maximum of half of the FlightSize and 2*SMSS [RFC5681], which causes the TCP congestion control to go back to allowing only a BDP of packets in flight -- just sufficient to maintain 100% utilisation of the bottleneck on the network path. [ms] This reference of RFC5681 and eq. (4) therein only mentions the reacti= on to RTO (Section 3.1 in RFC5681) but omits the use in Fast Retransmit/Fas= t Recovery (Section 3.2 in RFC5681). Thus, the reference is a bit misleadin= g, since this section actually seems to be about Fast Retransmit/Fast Recov= ery. And, as a purely editorial remark, I think the sentence is long and ha= rd to parse. I think an alternative wording would be possible along the lin= es of: According to [RFC5681], when a TCP sender detects segment loss using the retransmission timer and the given segment has not yet been resent by way of the retransmission timer, the value of ssthresh must be set to no more of the maximum of half of the FlightSize and 2*SMSS. The same equation is also used during Fast Retransmit/Fast Recovery [RFC5681]. As a result, the TCP congestion control only allows one BDP of packets in flight. This is just sufficient to maintain 100% utilisati= on of the bottleneck on the network path. 4.2. Focus on ECN as Defined in RFC3168 Some transport protocol mechanisms rely on ECN semantics that differ from the original ECN definition [RFC3168] -- for example, Congestion Exposure (ConEx) [RFC7713] and Datacenter TCP (DCTCP) [I-D.ietf-tcpm-dctcp] need more accurate ECN information than that offered by the original feedback method. Other mechanisms (e.g., [I-D.ietf-tcpm-accurate-ecn]) allow the sender to adjust the rate more frequently than once each path RTT. Use of these mechanisms is out of scope for this document. [ms] I think [I-D.ietf-tcpm-accurate-ecn] specifies a scheme to provide mor= e than one feedback signal per RTT. It is not exactly clear to me what is m= eant by "adjusting the rate more frequently". Editorial nits: DCTCP is publ= ished as RFC 8257. And I think the subsection title could be repeated in th= e main text ("This specification focuses on..."). 4.3. Choice of ABE Multiplier ABE decouples the reaction of a TCP sender to inferred packet loss and ECN-signalled congestion when in the congestion avoidance phase by differentiating the scaling factor used in Equation 4 in Section 3.1 of [RFC5681]. [ms] Editorial nit: This sentence seems somewhat broken ("when"?). Maybe an= alternative would be: ABE decouples the reaction of a TCP sender to inferred packet loss and ECN-signalled congestion in the congestion avoidance phase. To achieve this, ABE uses different the scaling factor in Equation 4 in Section 3.1 of [RFC5681]. beta_{ecn} depends on how the response of a TCP connection to shallow AQM marking thresholds is optimised. beta_{loss} reflects the preferred response of each congestion control algorithm when faced with exhaustion of buffers (of unknown depth) signalled by packet loss. Consequently, for any given TCP congestion control algorithm the choice of beta_{ecn} is likely to be algorithm-specific, rather than a constant multiple of the algorithm's existing beta_{loss}. The recommended beta_{ecn} value in this document is only applicable for Standard TCP congestion control. [ms] In this section one has to reverse-engineer what "recommended beta_{ec= n} value in this document" means. Why not make this explicit? In addition, = with some editorial reordering this section could be easier to read, e.g., = as follows: The recommendation in Section 3 in this document corresponds to a value of beta_{ecn}=3D0.8. This recommended beta_{ecn} value is only applicable= for the standard TCP congestion control [RFC5681]. The selection of beta_{ecn} enables tuning the response of a TCP connection to shallow AQM marking thresholds. beta_{loss} characterizes the response of a congestion control algorithm to packet loss, i.e., exhaustion of buffers (of unknown depth). Different values for beta_{loss} have been suggested for TCP congestion control algorithms. Consequently, beta_{ecn} is likely to be an algorithm-specific parameter rather than a constant multiple of the algorithm's existing beta_{loss}. 5. ABE Requirements [ms] Edorial nit: An alternative title would maybe "ABE Deployment Requirem= ents". If the method is only deployed by some senders, and not by others, the senders that use this method can gain some advantage, possibly at the expense of other flows that do not use this updated method. Because this advantage applies only to ECN-marked packets and not to packet loss indications, in the worst case (e.g., an ABE-compliant TCP sender using beta_{ecn} =3D 1.0) the ECN-Capable bottleneck will still fall back to dropping packets, and the result is no different than if the TCP sender was using traditional loss-based congestion control. [ms] beta_{ecn} =3D 1.0 can imply that a TCP sender does not react *at all*= to ECN marks, right? If so, I would suggest to reword this section in orde= r to avoid the expression "ABE-compliant" for the case beta_{ecn} =3D 1.0. = For instance, the second sentence could be reworded to something like "Bec= ause this advantage applies only to ECN-marked packets and not to packet lo= ss indications, an ECN-Capable bottleneck will still fall back to dropping = packets if an TCP sender using ABE is too aggressive, and the result is no = different..." ABE also makes one congestion-response each RTT that congestion is signalled, and therefore there is no response to loss within the same round-trip time, since ABE has already made a reduction of the congestion window. ABE will however respond for each round-trip time that congestion continues to be signaled. [ms] Editorial nit: These sentences are hard to parse. The result of this Internet experiment will include an investigation of cases such as the ones listed above, and be reported by presentation to the TCPM WG (or IESG) or an implementation report at the end of the experiment. [ms] I am not sure if we really need this paragraph on process details, e.g= ., whether there will be a presentation. To me, it would be sufficient just= to identify what cases and issues need to be investigated as part of the e= xperiment. For what it is worth, as individual contributor, I think a TCPM = presentation summarizing the outcome of the experiment would be sufficient = for such a short document. But unless e.g. the IESG insists in such wording= , I don't see a need to specify the process inside the document. --_000_AM5PR0701MB25477DB68DEEDCADECDF4C5D931D0AM5PR0701MB2547_ Content-Type: text/html; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

Authors, all,

 

I have read draft-ietf-tcpm-alternativebackoff-ecn-0= 5. I found some minor issues that should be easy to fix; in many cases the = issues are editorial. Yet, I believe a document update would be useful. See= below [ms].

 

Thanks

 

Michael (with no hat on)

 

 

*******************************

 

Abstract

 

   Recent Active Queue Management (AQM) me= chanisms allow for burst

   tolerance while enforcing short queues = to minimise the time that

   packets spend enqueued at a bottleneck.=  

 

[ms] Nit: I am not sure if the term “recent” is really needed. IMHO any AQM, including old vanilla= RED, can have this property, if it is properly configured. As a result, I = think the sentence would also be correct without the word “recent”= ;. This would somewhat avoid the question (in particular in the abst= ract) how to handle bottlenecks that use e.g. vanilla RED instead of a “recent= 221; AQM.

 

 

1.  Definitions

 

   The key words "MUST", "M= UST NOT", "REQUIRED", "SHALL", "SHALL NOT&quo= t;,

   "SHOULD", "SHOULD NOT&qu= ot;, "RECOMMENDED", "MAY", and "OPTIONAL" in = this

   document are to be interpreted as descr= ibed in RFC 2119 [RFC2119].

 

[ms] Nit: Maybe the new wording in RFC8174 could be = used. As an editorial nit, Section 1 and 2 could be swapped, but the order = may be a matter of taste.

 

 

4.1.  Why Use ECN to Vary the Degree of Backoff= ?

 

   When packet

   loss is inferred using the retransmissi= on timer and the given packet

   has not yet been resent by way of the r= etransmission timer (regarded

   as a notification of congestion), Stand= ard TCP sets the ssthresh to

   the maximum of half of the FlightSize a= nd 2*SMSS [RFC5681], which

   causes the TCP congestion control to go= back to allowing only a BDP

   of packets in flight -- just sufficient= to maintain 100% utilisation

   of the bottleneck on the network path.<= o:p>

 

[ms] This reference of RFC5681 and eq. (4) therein o= nly mentions the reaction to RTO (Section 3.1 in RFC5681) but omits the use= in Fast Retransmit/Fast Recovery (Section 3.2 in RFC5681). Thus, the refer= ence is a bit misleading, since this section actually seems to be about Fast Retransmit/Fast Recovery. And, as = a purely editorial remark, I think the sentence is long and hard to parse. = I think an alternative wording would be possible along the lines of:

 

<ms>

   According to [RFC5681], when a TCP send= er detects segment loss

   using the retransmission timer and the = given segment has not yet been

   resent by way of the retransmission tim= er, the value of ssthresh must be

   set to no more of the maximum of half o= f the FlightSize and 2*SMSS. The

   same equation is also used during Fast = Retransmit/Fast Recovery

   [RFC5681]. As a result, the TCP co= ngestion control only allows one BDP

   of packets in flight. This is just suff= icient to maintain 100% utilisation

   of the bottleneck on the network path.<= o:p>

</ms>

 

 

4.2.  Focus on ECN as Defined in RFC3168

 

   Some transport protocol mechanisms rely= on ECN semantics that differ

   from the original ECN definition [RFC31= 68] -- for example, Congestion

   Exposure (ConEx) [RFC7713] and Datacent= er TCP (DCTCP)

   [I-D.ietf-tcpm-dctcp] need more accurat= e ECN information than that

   offered by the original feedback method= .  Other mechanisms (e.g.,

   [I-D.ietf-tcpm-accurate-ecn]) allow the= sender to adjust the rate

   more frequently than once each path RTT= .  Use of these mechanisms is

   out of scope for this document.

 

[ms] I think [I-D.ietf-tcpm-accurate-ecn] specifies = a scheme to provide more than one feedback signal per RTT. It is not exactl= y clear to me what is meant by “adjusting the rate more frequently”. Editorial nits: DCTCP is published as= RFC 8257. And I think the subsection title could be repeated in the main text (&= #8220;This specification focuses on…”).

 

 

4.3.  Choice of ABE Multiplier

 

   ABE decouples the reaction of a TCP sen= der to inferred packet loss

   and ECN-signalled congestion when in th= e congestion avoidance phase

   by differentiating the scaling factor u= sed in Equation 4 in

   Section 3.1 of [RFC5681].

 

[ms] Editorial nit: This sentence seems somewhat bro= ken (“<= /span>when= 221;?). Maybe an alternative would be:

 

<ms>

   ABE decouples the reaction of a TCP sen= der to inferred packet loss

   and ECN-signalled congestion in the con= gestion avoidance phase.

   To achieve this, ABE uses different the= scaling factor in Equation 4 in

   Section 3.1 of [RFC5681].

</ms>

 

   beta_{ecn} depends on how the response = of a TCP connection to shallow

   AQM marking thresholds is optimised. be= ta_{loss} reflects the

   preferred response of each congestion c= ontrol algorithm when faced

   with exhaustion of buffers (of unknown = depth) signalled by packet

   loss.  Consequently, for any given= TCP congestion control algorithm

   the choice of beta_{ecn} is likely to b= e algorithm-specific, rather

   than a constant multiple of the algorit= hm's existing beta_{loss}. The

   recommended beta_{ecn} value in this do= cument is only applicable for

   Standard TCP congestion control.

 

[ms] In this section one has to reverse-engineer wha= t “recommended beta_{ecn} value in this document” means. Why not= make this explicit? In addition, with some editorial reordering this secti= on could be easier to read, e.g., as follows:

 

<ms>

  The recommendation in Section 3 in this docum= ent corresponds to a value

  of beta_{ecn}=3D0.8. This recommended beta_{e= cn} value is only applicable for

  the standard TCP congestion control [RFC5681]= . The selection of

  beta_{ecn} enables tuning the response of a T= CP connection to shallow

  AQM marking thresholds. beta_{loss} character= izes the response of a

  congestion control algorithm to packet l= oss, i.e., exhaustion of buffers

  (of unknown depth). Different values for beta= _{loss} have been suggested

 for TCP congestion control algorithms.  C= onsequently, beta_{ecn} is likely

  to be an algorithm-specific parameter rather = than a constant multiple

  of the algorithm's existing beta_{loss}.

</ms>

 

 

5.  ABE Requirements

 

[ms] Edorial nit: An alternative title would maybe <= span style=3D"font-family:"Times New Roman",serif"> “ABE Deployment Requirements”.

 

   If the method is only deployed by some = senders, and not by others,

   the senders that use this method can ga= in some advantage, possibly at

   the expense of other flows that do not = use this updated method.

   Because this advantage applies only to = ECN-marked packets and not to

   packet loss indications, in the worst c= ase (e.g., an ABE-compliant

   TCP sender using beta_{ecn} =3D 1.0) th= e ECN-Capable bottleneck will

   still fall back to dropping packets, an= d the result is no different

   than if the TCP sender was using tradit= ional loss-based congestion

   control.

 

[ms] beta_{ecn} =3D 1.0 can imply that a TCP sender = does not react *at all* to ECN marks, right? If so, I would suggest = to reword this section in order to avoid the expression “ABE-compliant” for the case beta_{ecn} =3D 1.0. For instance, the second s= entence could be reworded to something like  “Because this advantage applies only to ECN-marked packets and not to packet loss i= ndications, an ECN-Capable bottleneck will still fall back to dropping pack= ets if an TCP sender using ABE is too aggressive, and the result is no diff= erent…&= #8221;

 

   ABE also makes one congestion-response = each RTT that congestion is

   signalled, and therefore there is no re= sponse to loss within the same

   round-trip time, since ABE has already = made a reduction of the

   congestion window. ABE will however res= pond for each round-trip time

   that congestion continues to be signale= d. 

 

[ms] Editorial nit: These sentences are hard to pars= e.

 

   The result of this Internet experiment = will include an investigation

   of cases such as the ones listed above,= and be reported by

   presentation to the TCPM WG (or IESG) o= r an implementation report at

   the end of the experiment.

 

[ms] I am not sure if we really need this paragraph = on process details, e.g., whether there will be a presentation. To me, it w= ould be sufficient just to identify what cases and issues need to be invest= igated as part of the experiment. For what it is worth, as individual contributor, I think a TCPM presentati= on summarizing the outcome of the experiment would be sufficient for such a= short document. But unless e.g. the IESG insists in such wording, I don’t see a need to specify the process inside the document.

 

--_000_AM5PR0701MB25477DB68DEEDCADECDF4C5D931D0AM5PR0701MB2547_-- From nobody Fri Jan 12 07:29:52 2018 Return-Path: X-Original-To: tcpm@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: tcpm@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id DED4B12E897; Fri, 12 Jan 2018 07:29:46 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.91 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.91 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE=-0.0001, T_RP_MATCHES_RCVD=-0.01] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id z0-jsakaiaNd; Fri, 12 Jan 2018 07:29:44 -0800 (PST) Received: from virgo01.ee.ethz.ch (virgo01.ee.ethz.ch [129.132.2.226]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher AECDH-AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 22FD4127775; Fri, 12 Jan 2018 07:29:43 -0800 (PST) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by virgo01.ee.ethz.ch (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3zJ69y3LYjzMnYs; Fri, 12 Jan 2018 16:29:42 +0100 (CET) X-Virus-Scanned: Debian amavisd-new at virgo01.ee.ethz.ch Received: from virgo01.ee.ethz.ch ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (virgo01.ee.ethz.ch [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id qI4N1J0cGADZ; Fri, 12 Jan 2018 16:29:41 +0100 (CET) X-MtScore: NO score=0 Received: from [192.168.178.33] (i577BCE26.versanet.de [87.123.206.38]) by virgo01.ee.ethz.ch (Postfix) with ESMTPSA; Fri, 12 Jan 2018 16:29:40 +0100 (CET) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Mime-Version: 1.0 (Mac OS X Mail 10.3 \(3273\)) From: =?utf-8?Q?Mirja_K=C3=BChlewind?= In-Reply-To: <5c189d4f-db3b-e3a5-c6c1-53d1b76e1ddc@strayalpha.com> Date: Fri, 12 Jan 2018 16:29:39 +0100 Cc: "Scharf, Michael (Nokia - DE/Stuttgart)" , multipathtcp Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Message-Id: <3FABAE7A-BCE7-496B-9722-4802A21C391F@tik.ee.ethz.ch> References: <1d4eda72-b822-c8b5-1207-d52ce2e3fe62@strayalpha.com> <787AE7BB302AE849A7480A190F8B93300A08560D@OPEXCLILMA3.corporate.adroot.infra.ftgroup> <787AE7BB302AE849A7480A190F8B93300A086275@OPEXCLILMA3.corporate.adroot.infra.ftgroup> <5c189d4f-db3b-e3a5-c6c1-53d1b76e1ddc@strayalpha.com> To: "tcpm@ietf.org" X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.3273) Archived-At: Subject: Re: [tcpm] [multipathtcp] Working group acceptance of draft-bonaventure-mptcp-converters ? X-BeenThere: tcpm@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 Precedence: list List-Id: TCP Maintenance and Minor Extensions Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 12 Jan 2018 15:29:47 -0000 Hi all, replying to Joe=E2=80=99s email but directed to the whole group as I = would like to clarify one point: Even though I think this was stated explicitly and correctly in the = initial mail by the chairs that was starting the adopting call, I would = like to note again that the current charter seems allow the group to = work on these kind of approaches. The original mails stated: > The TCPM charter states that the "WG mostly focuses on maintenance = issues > (e.g., bug fixes) and modest changes to the protocol, algorithms, and > interfaces that maintain TCP's utility". Assisting the deployment of = new TCP > extensions could be understood as one way to ensure TCP's utility. draft-bonaventure-mptcp-converters does not propose direct changes in = the TCP protocol itself but it aims to support deployment of TCP options = and thereby "maintains TCP=E2=80=99s utility". Of course this proposal could be seen as an application to TCP but given = the application is to enable deployment of TCP options such that TCP = extensions can be used by other over-the-top applications, it is very = closely interconnected to the TCP protocol itself. I proposed to discuss this doc in tcpm because I think TCP expertise is = needed here and I would feel uncomfortable if this work would happen in = a wg outside of the tsv area. An alternative would be to narrow the = scope of the proposed approach down to enable MCTCP support only and = proceed the work in the MPTCP group. However, as there is a much broader = TCP expertise in tcpm, I=E2=80=99m very certain that the quality of the = final work would be higher if the document would be adopted in tcpm = instead. To my understanding Joe=E2=80=99s initial emails was saying that he does = not support the adoption of this document in tcpm as over-the-top = applications are out of scope. As explained above, my assessment is that = this work is in scope for tcpm.=20 Effectively the questions that were originally ask in the adoption call = were not so much on the scope but: 1) Is there support for this work in tcpm, meaning are people in this = group willing to review and discuss this work? 2) Are there concerns against the adoption of this document?=20 I well notice that there have bee three people in the group that have = concerns regarding the question if this document is in scope. However, I = , and I believe the chairs as well, do not share these concerns based on = the provided arguments in the discussion.=20 Therefore, I would like to make another request to the group and try to = figure out if there is enough energy and interest in this group to = pursue this work in tcpm (instead of mptcp or potentially some non-tsv = group). Please let me know if you in general support the work and would = be willing to review and discuss the proposed draft in this group = (question 1 above)! Of course, please also let me/us know if there are other (technical) = concerns that would preclude the adoption of this work that did not come = up yet! Thanks, Mirja > Am 06.12.2017 um 05:26 schrieb Joe Touch : >=20 >=20 >=20 > On 12/5/2017 2:48 PM, Scharf, Michael (Nokia - DE/Stuttgart) wrote: >> Hi Joe, all, >>=20 >> Regarding "*out of scope for* TCPM": Whether a document is in scope = of TCPM, or not, depends on the TCPM charter wording.=20 > Although I appreciate that's strictly true, I doubt the charter would > change to include "haiku development". >=20 > By the same token, IMO, this doc falls into one of two categories: >=20 > 1) if, as is, it proposes direct placement of out-of-band data in the > SYN payload, I think it is a bad idea and not worth pursuing in TCPM >=20 > 2) if, instead, it is corrected to explain that its use of the data > channel for proxy information is simply a conventional application = data > path, then it would not be a "modification of TCP" at all (minor or > otherwise). If that isn't clearly out of scope for TCPM, I do not know > what is or ever would be (can we start haiku next, in that case?) >=20 > Joe >=20 > _______________________________________________ > multipathtcp mailing list > multipathtcp@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/multipathtcp From nobody Wed Jan 17 08:36:29 2018 Return-Path: X-Original-To: tcpm@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: tcpm@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6E17112D837; Wed, 17 Jan 2018 08:36:22 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.629 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.629 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW=-0.7, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_H4=-0.01, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_WL=-0.01, SPF_PASS=-0.001, T_RP_MATCHES_RCVD=-0.01, UNPARSEABLE_RELAY=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id lW7ipKPtIpuB; Wed, 17 Jan 2018 08:36:21 -0800 (PST) Received: from orange.com (mta135.mail.business.static.orange.com [80.12.70.35]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher AECDH-AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id B658B12D7F1; Wed, 17 Jan 2018 08:36:20 -0800 (PST) Received: from opfednr02.francetelecom.fr (unknown [xx.xx.xx.66]) by opfednr23.francetelecom.fr (ESMTP service) with ESMTP id 4A228C134D; Wed, 17 Jan 2018 17:36:19 +0100 (CET) Received: from Exchangemail-eme2.itn.ftgroup (unknown [xx.xx.31.3]) by opfednr02.francetelecom.fr (ESMTP service) with ESMTP id 21CB5120091; Wed, 17 Jan 2018 17:36:19 +0100 (CET) Received: from OPEXCLILMA3.corporate.adroot.infra.ftgroup ([fe80::60a9:abc3:86e6:2541]) by OPEXCLILM5D.corporate.adroot.infra.ftgroup ([fe80::9898:741c:bc1d:258d%19]) with mapi id 14.03.0361.001; Wed, 17 Jan 2018 17:36:16 +0100 From: To: "tcpm@ietf.org" CC: "multipathtcp@ietf.org" , "philip.eardley@bt.com" Thread-Topic: Support for MPTCP proxy work Thread-Index: AdOPsUpEvyVPY9VERSyas8Zhxd9EkQ== Date: Wed, 17 Jan 2018 16:36:16 +0000 Message-ID: <17833_1516206979_5A5F7B83_17833_99_1_88132E969123D14D9BD844E1CD516EDE14A6CAA2@OPEXCLILMA3.corporate.adroot.infra.ftgroup> Accept-Language: fr-FR, en-US Content-Language: fr-FR X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: x-originating-ip: [10.168.234.6] Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="_000_88132E969123D14D9BD844E1CD516EDE14A6CAA2OPEXCLILMA3corp_" MIME-Version: 1.0 Archived-At: Subject: [tcpm] Support for MPTCP proxy work X-BeenThere: tcpm@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 Precedence: list List-Id: TCP Maintenance and Minor Extensions Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 17 Jan 2018 16:36:22 -0000 --_000_88132E969123D14D9BD844E1CD516EDE14A6CAA2OPEXCLILMA3corp_ Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Hello WGs, In response to Mirja's message dated Jan. 12, I hereby express my support f= or MPTCP proxy work. I'm willing to contribute (already have), as well as r= eview/discuss as appropriate. Cheers, Christian. ___________________________________________________________________________= ______________________________________________ Ce message et ses pieces jointes peuvent contenir des informations confiden= tielles ou privilegiees et ne doivent donc pas etre diffuses, exploites ou copies sans autorisation. Si vous avez recu= ce message par erreur, veuillez le signaler a l'expediteur et le detruire ainsi que les pieces jointes. Les messages el= ectroniques etant susceptibles d'alteration, Orange decline toute responsabilite si ce message a ete altere, deforme ou = falsifie. Merci. This message and its attachments may contain confidential or privileged inf= ormation that may be protected by law; they should not be distributed, used or copied without authorisation. If you have received this email in error, please notify the sender and dele= te this message and its attachments. As emails may be altered, Orange is not liable for messages that have been = modified, changed or falsified. Thank you. --_000_88132E969123D14D9BD844E1CD516EDE14A6CAA2OPEXCLILMA3corp_ Content-Type: text/html; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

Hello WGs,

 

In response to Mirja’s message dated Jan. 1= 2, I hereby express my support for MPTCP proxy work. I'm willing to contrib= ute (already have), as well as review/discuss as appropriate.

 

Cheers,

 

Christian.

 

 

______________________________________________________________________=
___________________________________________________

Ce message et ses pieces jointes peuvent contenir des informations confiden=
tielles ou privilegiees et ne doivent donc
pas etre diffuses, exploites ou copies sans autorisation. Si vous avez recu=
 ce message par erreur, veuillez le signaler
a l'expediteur et le detruire ainsi que les pieces jointes. Les messages el=
ectroniques etant susceptibles d'alteration,
Orange decline toute responsabilite si ce message a ete altere, deforme ou =
falsifie. Merci.

This message and its attachments may contain confidential or privileged inf=
ormation that may be protected by law;
they should not be distributed, used or copied without authorisation.
If you have received this email in error, please notify the sender and dele=
te this message and its attachments.
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--_000_88132E969123D14D9BD844E1CD516EDE14A6CAA2OPEXCLILMA3corp_-- From nobody Wed Jan 17 08:42:30 2018 Return-Path: X-Original-To: tcpm@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: tcpm@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0662012D95C; Wed, 17 Jan 2018 08:42:26 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.919 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.919 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE=-0.0001, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_H3=-0.01, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_WL=-0.01, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 315JPbJQg5Mi; Wed, 17 Jan 2018 08:42:22 -0800 (PST) Received: from EUR01-HE1-obe.outbound.protection.outlook.com (mail-he1eur01on0129.outbound.protection.outlook.com [104.47.0.129]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 5867C12D7F1; Wed, 17 Jan 2018 08:42:21 -0800 (PST) Received: from VI1PR0602MB2942.eurprd06.prod.outlook.com (10.175.25.15) by VI1PR0602MB2942.eurprd06.prod.outlook.com (10.175.25.15) with Microsoft SMTP Server (version=TLS1_2, cipher=TLS_ECDHE_RSA_WITH_AES_256_CBC_SHA384_P256) id 15.20.407.7; Wed, 17 Jan 2018 16:42:18 +0000 Received: from VI1PR0602MB2942.eurprd06.prod.outlook.com ([fe80::70e0:4624:6f59:eb00]) by VI1PR0602MB2942.eurprd06.prod.outlook.com ([fe80::70e0:4624:6f59:eb00%14]) with mapi id 15.20.0407.012; Wed, 17 Jan 2018 16:42:18 +0000 From: LUIS MIGUEL CONTRERAS MURILLO To: "christian.jacquenet@orange.com" , "tcpm@ietf.org" CC: "multipathtcp@ietf.org" Thread-Topic: Support for MPTCP proxy work Thread-Index: AdOPsUpEvyVPY9VERSyas8Zhxd9EkQAALBww Date: Wed, 17 Jan 2018 16:42:18 +0000 Message-ID: References: <17833_1516206979_5A5F7B83_17833_99_1_88132E969123D14D9BD844E1CD516EDE14A6CAA2@OPEXCLILMA3.corporate.adroot.infra.ftgroup> In-Reply-To: <17833_1516206979_5A5F7B83_17833_99_1_88132E969123D14D9BD844E1CD516EDE14A6CAA2@OPEXCLILMA3.corporate.adroot.infra.ftgroup> Accept-Language: es-ES, en-US Content-Language: es-ES X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: authentication-results: spf=none (sender IP is ) smtp.mailfrom=luismiguel.contrerasmurillo@telefonica.com; 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boundary="_000_VI1PR0602MB2942A0C838B00E2218630C469EE90VI1PR0602MB2942_" MIME-Version: 1.0 X-OriginatorOrg: telefonica.com X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-Network-Message-Id: caf4033d-fa1a-4478-5694-08d55dc94602 X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-originalarrivaltime: 17 Jan 2018 16:42:18.5598 (UTC) X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-fromentityheader: Hosted X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-id: 9744600e-3e04-492e-baa1-25ec245c6f10 X-MS-Exchange-Transport-CrossTenantHeadersStamped: VI1PR0602MB2942 Archived-At: Subject: Re: [tcpm] Support for MPTCP proxy work X-BeenThere: tcpm@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 Precedence: list List-Id: TCP Maintenance and Minor Extensions Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 17 Jan 2018 16:42:26 -0000 --_000_VI1PR0602MB2942A0C838B00E2218630C469EE90VI1PR0602MB2942_ Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Hi all, I also support the work on MPTCP proxy. I'm willing to keep contributing in= this effort as well, also reviewing and discussing on it. In fact I have a= n additional use case I'm considering to contribute. Best regards Luis __________________________________ Luis M. Contreras Technology and Planning Transport, IP and Interconnection Networks Telef=F3nica I+D / Global CTIO unit / Telef=F3nica Distrito Telef=F3nica, Edificio Sur 3, Planta 3 28050 Madrid Espa=F1a / Spain Skype (Lync): +34 91 312 9084 Mobile: +34 680 947 650 luismiguel.contrerasmurillo@telefonica.com De: multipathtcp [mailto:multipathtcp-bounces@ietf.org] En nombre de christ= ian.jacquenet@orange.com Enviado el: mi=E9rcoles, 17 de enero de 2018 17:36 Para: tcpm@ietf.org CC: multipathtcp@ietf.org Asunto: [multipathtcp] Support for MPTCP proxy work Hello WGs, In response to Mirja's message dated Jan. 12, I hereby express my support f= or MPTCP proxy work. I'm willing to contribute (already have), as well as r= eview/discuss as appropriate. Cheers, Christian. ___________________________________________________________________________= ______________________________________________ Ce message et ses pieces jointes peuvent contenir des informations confiden= tielles ou privilegiees et ne doivent donc pas etre diffuses, exploites ou copies sans autorisation. Si vous avez recu= ce message par erreur, veuillez le signaler a l'expediteur et le detruire ainsi que les pieces jointes. Les messages el= ectroniques etant susceptibles d'alteration, Orange decline toute responsabilite si ce message a ete altere, deforme ou = falsifie. Merci. This message and its attachments may contain confidential or privileged inf= ormation that may be protected by law; they should not be distributed, used or copied without authorisation. If you have received this email in error, please notify the sender and dele= te this message and its attachments. As emails may be altered, Orange is not liable for messages that have been = modified, changed or falsified. Thank you. ________________________________ Este mensaje y sus adjuntos se dirigen exclusivamente a su destinatario, pu= ede contener informaci=F3n privilegiada o confidencial y es para uso exclus= ivo de la persona o entidad de destino. Si no es usted. el destinatario ind= icado, queda notificado de que la lectura, utilizaci=F3n, divulgaci=F3n y/o= copia sin autorizaci=F3n puede estar prohibida en virtud de la legislaci= =F3n vigente. Si ha recibido este mensaje por error, le rogamos que nos lo = comunique inmediatamente por esta misma v=EDa y proceda a su destrucci=F3n. The information contained in this transmission is privileged and confidenti= al information intended only for the use of the individual or entity named = above. If the reader of this message is not the intended recipient, you are= hereby notified that any dissemination, distribution or copying of this co= mmunication is strictly prohibited. If you have received this transmission = in error, do not read it. Please immediately reply to the sender that you h= ave received this communication in error and then delete it. Esta mensagem e seus anexos se dirigem exclusivamente ao seu destinat=E1rio= , pode conter informa=E7=E3o privilegiada ou confidencial e =E9 para uso ex= clusivo da pessoa ou entidade de destino. Se n=E3o =E9 vossa senhoria o des= tinat=E1rio indicado, fica notificado de que a leitura, utiliza=E7=E3o, div= ulga=E7=E3o e/ou c=F3pia sem autoriza=E7=E3o pode estar proibida em virtude= da legisla=E7=E3o vigente. Se recebeu esta mensagem por erro, rogamos-lhe = que nos o comunique imediatamente por esta mesma via e proceda a sua destru= i=E7=E3o --_000_VI1PR0602MB2942A0C838B00E2218630C469EE90VI1PR0602MB2942_ Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

Hi all,

 

I also support the wor= k on MPTCP proxy. I'm willing to keep contributing in this effort as well, = also reviewing and discussing on it. In fact I have an additional use case = I'm considering to contribute.

 

Best regar= ds

 = ;

Luis<= /o:p>

 = ;

__________________________________

Luis M. Contreras

 

Technology and Planning

Transport, IP and Interconnection Networks

Telef=F3nica I+D / Global CTIO unit / Telef=F3ni= ca

 

Distrito Telef=F3nica, Edificio Su= r 3, Planta 3

28050 Madrid

Espa=F1a / Spain=

&nb= sp;

Skype (Lync): +34 91 312 9084<= o:p>

Mobile: +34 680 947 650

luismiguel.contrerasmurillo@telefonica.com

 

 = ;

 = ;

De: multipathtcp [mailto:multipathtcp-bounces@ietf.org] En nombre de christian.jacquenet@orange.com
Enviado el: mi=E9rcoles, 17 de enero de 2018 17:36
Para: tcpm@ietf.org
CC: multipathtcp@ietf.org
Asunto: [multipathtcp] Support for MPTCP proxy work

 

Hello WGs,

 

In response to Mirja’s message dated Jan. 1= 2, I hereby express my support for MPTCP proxy work. I'm willing to contrib= ute (already have), as well as review/discuss as appropriate.

 

Cheers,

 

Christian.

 

 

______________________________________________________________________=
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 --_000_VI1PR0602MB2942A0C838B00E2218630C469EE90VI1PR0602MB2942_-- From nobody Wed Jan 17 09:31:26 2018 Return-Path: X-Original-To: tcpm@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: tcpm@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 610FB12E854; Wed, 17 Jan 2018 09:31:19 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -4.321 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-4.321 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-2.3, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_H3=-0.01, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_WL=-0.01, SPF_PASS=-0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (1024-bit key) header.d=uclouvain.be Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id u9uUEzpkQvDb; Wed, 17 Jan 2018 09:31:17 -0800 (PST) Received: from smtp2.sgsi.ucl.ac.be (smtp.sgsi.ucl.ac.be [130.104.5.67]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher AECDH-AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 94C1E12E04A; Wed, 17 Jan 2018 09:31:03 -0800 (PST) Received: from [192.168.1.32] (unknown [87.66.240.97]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) (Authenticated sender: obonaventure@smtp2.sgsi.ucl.ac.be) by smtp2.sgsi.ucl.ac.be (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 0D16167DC4E; Wed, 17 Jan 2018 18:30:55 +0100 (CET) DKIM-Filter: OpenDKIM Filter v2.9.2 smtp2.sgsi.ucl.ac.be 0D16167DC4E DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=simple/simple; d=uclouvain.be; s=selucl; t=1516210255; bh=XoYmz/8EaejP6/0eovxku2ZGTyFIio3UwcIpAay3kws=; h=Reply-To:Subject:To:Cc:References:From:Date:In-Reply-To; b=kb1T+k4Xa5Gly9y6rBR9PZhQqVya90gj4q1qGiUwV0eODZbnXDxpSM3yrvY8xzxt3 E5qD2n8/q6BLMlv0EBhakwH2rag6jq0tsNvu57Pcyeco2RHTF6Xfh7E6brev38C5Zl f8xKB16MSney2yLtEwmVGzuNbQTb4D16lAbUrz7s= X-Virus-Status: Clean X-Virus-Scanned: clamav-milter 0.99.2 at smtp-2 Reply-To: Olivier.Bonaventure@uclouvain.be To: christian.jacquenet@orange.com, "tcpm@ietf.org" Cc: "multipathtcp@ietf.org" References: <17833_1516206979_5A5F7B83_17833_99_1_88132E969123D14D9BD844E1CD516EDE14A6CAA2@OPEXCLILMA3.corporate.adroot.infra.ftgroup> From: Olivier Bonaventure Message-ID: <6f2c0f00-bae8-6356-0c2c-66ceee7c41b7@uclouvain.be> Date: Wed, 17 Jan 2018 18:30:54 +0100 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Macintosh; Intel Mac OS X 10.13; rv:52.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/52.5.2 MIME-Version: 1.0 In-Reply-To: <17833_1516206979_5A5F7B83_17833_99_1_88132E969123D14D9BD844E1CD516EDE14A6CAA2@OPEXCLILMA3.corporate.adroot.infra.ftgroup> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=windows-1252; format=flowed Content-Language: fr-classic Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Sgsi-Spamcheck: SASL authenticated, X-SGSI-Information: X-SGSI-MailScanner-ID: 0D16167DC4E.A4AF0 X-SGSI-MailScanner: Found to be clean X-SGSI-From: olivier.bonaventure@uclouvain.be X-SGSI-Spam-Status: No Archived-At: Subject: Re: [tcpm] [multipathtcp] Support for MPTCP proxy work X-BeenThere: tcpm@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 Precedence: list List-Id: TCP Maintenance and Minor Extensions Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 17 Jan 2018 17:31:19 -0000 Hello, > > In response to Mirja’s message dated Jan. 12, I hereby express my > support for MPTCP proxy work. I'm willing to contribute (already have), > as well as review/discuss as appropriate. As one of the co-authors of the TCP converter draft, I support this work and I'm willing to continue to work on it. As I've already expressed, I think that there are various use cases for such work Olivier From nobody Wed Jan 17 15:50:40 2018 Return-Path: X-Original-To: tcpm@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: tcpm@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 545CA12EACE; Wed, 17 Jan 2018 15:50:34 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.806 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.806 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW=-0.7, RDNS_NONE=0.793, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=no autolearn_force=no Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id SpvHZItFs_1Y; Wed, 17 Jan 2018 15:50:31 -0800 (PST) Received: from smfilter3.kt.com (unknown [14.63.245.79]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5AE9A12EACC; Wed, 17 Jan 2018 15:50:30 -0800 (PST) Received: from external ([10.215.33.56]) by smfilter3.kt.com (1.0) id w0HNnd800D3A; Thu, 18 Jan 2018 08:49:39 +0900 Received: from MAIL-MBX-02.corp.ktad.kt.com ([10.215.33.72]) by MAIL-FRT-06.corp.ktad.kt.com ([10.215.33.56]) with mapi id 14.03.0210.002; Thu, 18 Jan 2018 08:49:38 +0900 From: =?utf-8?B?7ISc7ISx7ZuIKDVHIENvcmUgUHJvamVjdCk=?= To: =?utf-8?B?TWlyamEgS8O8aGxld2luZA==?= , "tcpm@ietf.org" CC: multipathtcp Thread-Topic: [multipathtcp] [tcpm] Working group acceptance of draft-bonaventure-mptcp-converters ? Thread-Index: AQHTi7o6uNweWeh1vE+zElDeu5rv3aN4xDYR Date: Wed, 17 Jan 2018 23:49:37 +0000 Message-ID: References: <1d4eda72-b822-c8b5-1207-d52ce2e3fe62@strayalpha.com> <787AE7BB302AE849A7480A190F8B93300A08560D@OPEXCLILMA3.corporate.adroot.infra.ftgroup> <787AE7BB302AE849A7480A190F8B93300A086275@OPEXCLILMA3.corporate.adroot.infra.ftgroup> <5c189d4f-db3b-e3a5-c6c1-53d1b76e1ddc@strayalpha.com>, <3FABAE7A-BCE7-496B-9722-4802A21C391F@tik.ee.ethz.ch> In-Reply-To: <3FABAE7A-BCE7-496B-9722-4802A21C391F@tik.ee.ethz.ch> Accept-Language: ko-KR, en-US Content-Language: ko-KR X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="_000_AAA2913CE97A474D937BF3C760E855A79CF17AB3MAILMBX02_" MIME-Version: 1.0 Archived-At: Subject: Re: [tcpm] [multipathtcp] Working group acceptance of draft-bonaventure-mptcp-converters ? 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cipher=AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Wed, 17 Jan 2018 23:54:37 GMT Received: from xch-aln-008.cisco.com (173.36.7.18) by XCH-ALN-008.cisco.com (173.36.7.18) with Microsoft SMTP Server (TLS) id 15.0.1320.4; Wed, 17 Jan 2018 17:54:36 -0600 Received: from xch-aln-008.cisco.com ([173.36.7.18]) by XCH-ALN-008.cisco.com ([173.36.7.18]) with mapi id 15.00.1320.000; Wed, 17 Jan 2018 17:54:36 -0600 From: "Sri Gundavelli (sgundave)" To: =?utf-8?B?7ISc7ISx7ZuIKDVHIENvcmUgUHJvamVjdCk=?= , =?utf-8?B?TWlyamEgS8O8aGxld2luZA==?= , "tcpm@ietf.org" CC: multipathtcp Thread-Topic: [tcpm] [multipathtcp] Working group acceptance of draft-bonaventure-mptcp-converters ? Thread-Index: AQHTi7o6uNweWeh1vE+zElDeu5rv3aN4xDYR///f2gA= Date: Wed, 17 Jan 2018 23:54:36 +0000 Message-ID: References: <1d4eda72-b822-c8b5-1207-d52ce2e3fe62@strayalpha.com> <787AE7BB302AE849A7480A190F8B93300A08560D@OPEXCLILMA3.corporate.adroot.infra.ftgroup> <787AE7BB302AE849A7480A190F8B93300A086275@OPEXCLILMA3.corporate.adroot.infra.ftgroup> <5c189d4f-db3b-e3a5-c6c1-53d1b76e1ddc@strayalpha.com> <3FABAE7A-BCE7-496B-9722-4802A21C391F@tik.ee.ethz.ch> In-Reply-To: Accept-Language: en-US Content-Language: en-US X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: user-agent: Microsoft-MacOutlook/14.7.1.161129 x-ms-exchange-messagesentrepresentingtype: 1 x-ms-exchange-transport-fromentityheader: Hosted x-originating-ip: [10.70.231.2] Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="_000_D6852185F6CDsgundaveciscocom_" MIME-Version: 1.0 Archived-At: Subject: Re: [tcpm] [multipathtcp] Working group acceptance of draft-bonaventure-mptcp-converters ? X-BeenThere: tcpm@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 Precedence: list List-Id: TCP Maintenance and Minor Extensions Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 17 Jan 2018 23:54:41 -0000 --_000_D6852185F6CDsgundaveciscocom_ Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64 SGkgTWlyamEsDQoNCkkgc3Ryb25nbHkgc3VwcG9ydCB0aGUgd29yayBvbiBNUFRDUCBQcm94eS4g V2UgKGF0IENpc2NvKSBhcmUgZG9pbmcgc29tZSBpbXBsZW1lbnRhdGlvbnMgYW5kIGxpa2UgdG8g c2VlIGEgc3RhbmRhcmQgc3BlY2lmaWNhdGlvbnMgb24gdGhlIHNhbWUgZm9yIGludGVyb3AgYW5k IG90aGVyIHJlYXNvbnMuDQoNClJlZ2FyZHMNClNyaQ0KDQoNCg0KX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19f X19fX19fX19fX19fX18NCg0KRnJvbTogTWlyamEgS8O8aGxld2luZCA8bWlyamEua3VlaGxld2lu ZEB0aWsuZWUuZXRoei5jaDxtYWlsdG86bWlyamEua3VlaGxld2luZEB0aWsuZWUuZXRoei5jaD4+ DQpEYXRlOiAxMyBKYW51YXJ5IDIwMTggYXQgMTI6MzA6MDggQU0gR01UKzkNClRvOiB0Y3BtQGll dGYub3JnPG1haWx0bzp0Y3BtQGlldGYub3JnPiA8dGNwbUBpZXRmLm9yZzxtYWlsdG86dGNwbUBp 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([fe80::e5:e920:6f3d:3a9d%13]) with mapi id 15.20.0428.014; Thu, 18 Jan 2018 04:55:43 +0000 From: "Henderickx, Wim (Nokia - BE/Antwerp)" To: "Sri Gundavelli (sgundave)" , =?utf-8?B?7ISc7ISx7ZuIKDVHIENvcmUgUHJvamVjdCk=?= , =?utf-8?B?TWlyamEgS8O8aGxld2luZA==?= , "tcpm@ietf.org" CC: multipathtcp Thread-Topic: [multipathtcp] [tcpm] Working group acceptance of draft-bonaventure-mptcp-converters ? Thread-Index: AQHTj+4Ca3yCChCC1UycnBSZRhmCiKN4vTIAgABk5AA= Date: Thu, 18 Jan 2018 04:55:43 +0000 Message-ID: <4ADB8548-6498-4AA2-8D48-D6CA85B03ED6@nokia.com> References: <1d4eda72-b822-c8b5-1207-d52ce2e3fe62@strayalpha.com> <787AE7BB302AE849A7480A190F8B93300A08560D@OPEXCLILMA3.corporate.adroot.infra.ftgroup> <787AE7BB302AE849A7480A190F8B93300A086275@OPEXCLILMA3.corporate.adroot.infra.ftgroup> <5c189d4f-db3b-e3a5-c6c1-53d1b76e1ddc@strayalpha.com> <3FABAE7A-BCE7-496B-9722-4802A21C391F@tik.ee.ethz.ch> In-Reply-To: Accept-Language: nl-BE, en-US Content-Language: en-US X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: user-agent: Microsoft-MacOutlook/10.a.0.180109 authentication-results: spf=none (sender IP is ) smtp.mailfrom=wim.henderickx@nokia.com; x-originating-ip: [135.245.212.19] x-ms-publictraffictype: Email x-microsoft-exchange-diagnostics: 1; DB5PR07MB1445; 7:hXexcVWurzNtDFtfC87dFlnju0aAyTdUHj8TZu1ZjdCWlo9a2qA5Jg7GbEZslaj1HfbLCMnWdAOy8E/9+j7XNnf3Erlr4zZhX7S85gShUq8jql0p5I4lK6qVBWhyNEH36RQt3W55X1zeA0TDey4Fgm9XXkd3IvoG4cSyJIsJc0bEFDNHT73cQr94vZKn5fWBd+no+CIjd5b2U59Vc8awAZ+I4H3/Uy91TVnPLd7P2H2DvIUbd7SvjjEKtxaYJHtv x-ms-exchange-antispam-srfa-diagnostics: SSOS; x-ms-office365-filtering-correlation-id: 0c1f33ca-9693-462e-dbed-08d55e2fbafb x-ms-office365-filtering-ht: Tenant x-microsoft-antispam: UriScan:; BCL:0; PCL:0; RULEID:(7020095)(4652020)(5600026)(4604075)(3008032)(4534125)(4602075)(4627221)(201703031133081)(201702281549075)(48565401081)(2017052603307)(7193020); SRVR:DB5PR07MB1445; x-ms-traffictypediagnostic: DB5PR07MB1445: x-microsoft-antispam-prvs: x-exchange-antispam-report-test: UriScan:(28532068793085)(278428928389397)(95692535739014)(21748063052155); x-exchange-antispam-report-cfa-test: BCL:0; PCL:0; RULEID:(6040470)(2401047)(8121501046)(5005006)(3231023)(11241501184)(806099)(944501161)(3002001)(10201501046)(93006095)(93001095)(6055026)(6041268)(201703131423095)(201702281528075)(20161123555045)(201703061421075)(201703061406153)(20161123560045)(20161123562045)(20161123558120)(20161123564045)(6072148)(201708071742011); SRVR:DB5PR07MB1445; BCL:0; PCL:0; RULEID:(100000803101)(100110400095); SRVR:DB5PR07MB1445; x-forefront-prvs: 05568D1FF7 x-forefront-antispam-report: SFV:NSPM; SFS:(10019020)(366004)(376002)(346002)(39860400002)(396003)(39380400002)(189003)(199004)(53754006)(102836004)(82746002)(59450400001)(236005)(36756003)(105586002)(76176011)(53936002)(4326008)(106356001)(6506007)(53546011)(2950100002)(83716003)(93886005)(86362001)(99286004)(58126008)(606006)(6436002)(110136005)(66066001)(6486002)(5660300001)(54896002)(6512007)(6306002)(83506002)(25786009)(229853002)(26005)(97736004)(316002)(6246003)(966005)(6116002)(3280700002)(790700001)(68736007)(3846002)(3660700001)(14454004)(478600001)(8936002)(7736002)(33656002)(8676002)(81156014)(81166006)(561944003)(5250100002)(2501003)(230783001)(2906002)(2900100001); DIR:OUT; SFP:1102; SCL:1; SRVR:DB5PR07MB1445; H:DB5PR07MB1589.eurprd07.prod.outlook.com; FPR:; SPF:None; PTR:InfoNoRecords; MX:1; A:1; LANG:en; received-spf: None (protection.outlook.com: nokia.com does not designate permitted sender hosts) x-microsoft-antispam-message-info: SL6jHk5M2DfyhdZRz7klUCfJ3xql3VJI5jt6IdmKs+6oc8T/DdQR19+H2Jm8XfpMEGFyhFUl1vYmMOu98OK6cNQMAkh/+1spfAXocVrgqejMAbYHe/tP2X06P7nRWfTq spamdiagnosticoutput: 1:99 spamdiagnosticmetadata: NSPM Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="_000_4ADB854864984AA28D48D6CA85B03ED6nokiacom_" MIME-Version: 1.0 X-OriginatorOrg: nokia.com X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-Network-Message-Id: 0c1f33ca-9693-462e-dbed-08d55e2fbafb X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-originalarrivaltime: 18 Jan 2018 04:55:43.5241 (UTC) X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-fromentityheader: Hosted X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-id: 5d471751-9675-428d-917b-70f44f9630b0 X-MS-Exchange-Transport-CrossTenantHeadersStamped: DB5PR07MB1445 Archived-At: Subject: Re: [tcpm] [multipathtcp] Working group acceptance of draft-bonaventure-mptcp-converters ? 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X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.63 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW=-0.7, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_H4=-0.01, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_WL=-0.01, SPF_PASS=-0.001, T_RP_MATCHES_RCVD=-0.01, UNPARSEABLE_RELAY=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id PAPQ0CRzSLx9; Wed, 17 Jan 2018 22:45:49 -0800 (PST) Received: from orange.com (mta135.mail.business.static.orange.com [80.12.70.35]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher AECDH-AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 7500B124239; Wed, 17 Jan 2018 22:45:49 -0800 (PST) Received: from opfednr04.francetelecom.fr (unknown [xx.xx.xx.68]) by opfednr26.francetelecom.fr (ESMTP service) with ESMTP id D7BC120F3E; Thu, 18 Jan 2018 07:45:47 +0100 (CET) Received: from Exchangemail-eme2.itn.ftgroup (unknown [xx.xx.31.34]) by opfednr04.francetelecom.fr (ESMTP service) with ESMTP id B059A40093; Thu, 18 Jan 2018 07:45:47 +0100 (CET) Received: from OPEXCLILMA3.corporate.adroot.infra.ftgroup ([fe80::60a9:abc3:86e6:2541]) by OPEXCLILM6F.corporate.adroot.infra.ftgroup ([fe80::bd00:88f8:8552:3349%17]) with mapi id 14.03.0382.000; Thu, 18 Jan 2018 07:45:47 +0100 From: To: =?utf-8?B?TWlyamEgS8O8aGxld2luZA==?= , "tcpm@ietf.org" CC: multipathtcp Thread-Topic: [multipathtcp] [tcpm] Working group acceptance of draft-bonaventure-mptcp-converters ? Thread-Index: AQHTi7ow4xHf8gNu5kOdS914mBib/KN5NxnQ Date: Thu, 18 Jan 2018 06:45:47 +0000 Message-ID: <787AE7BB302AE849A7480A190F8B93300A0BD0DF@OPEXCLILMA3.corporate.adroot.infra.ftgroup> References: <1d4eda72-b822-c8b5-1207-d52ce2e3fe62@strayalpha.com> <787AE7BB302AE849A7480A190F8B93300A08560D@OPEXCLILMA3.corporate.adroot.infra.ftgroup> <787AE7BB302AE849A7480A190F8B93300A086275@OPEXCLILMA3.corporate.adroot.infra.ftgroup> <5c189d4f-db3b-e3a5-c6c1-53d1b76e1ddc@strayalpha.com> <3FABAE7A-BCE7-496B-9722-4802A21C391F@tik.ee.ethz.ch> In-Reply-To: <3FABAE7A-BCE7-496B-9722-4802A21C391F@tik.ee.ethz.ch> Accept-Language: fr-FR, en-US Content-Language: fr-FR X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: x-originating-ip: [10.168.234.6] Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64 MIME-Version: 1.0 Archived-At: Subject: Re: [tcpm] [multipathtcp] Working group acceptance of draft-bonaventure-mptcp-converters ? X-BeenThere: tcpm@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 Precedence: list List-Id: TCP Maintenance and Minor Extensions Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 18 Jan 2018 06:45:51 -0000 SGkgTWlyamEsIGFsbCwgDQoNCkkgcmVpdGVyYXRlIG15IHN1cHBvcnQgdG8gdGhpcyB3b3JrLiAN Cg0KQ2hlZXJzLA0KTWVkDQoNCj4gLS0tLS1NZXNzYWdlIGQnb3JpZ2luZS0tLS0tDQo+IERlwqA6 IG11bHRpcGF0aHRjcCBbbWFpbHRvOm11bHRpcGF0aHRjcC1ib3VuY2VzQGlldGYub3JnXSBEZSBs YSBwYXJ0IGRlDQo+IE1pcmphIEvDvGhsZXdpbmQNCj4gRW52b3nDqcKgOiB2ZW5kcmVkaSAxMiBq YW52aWVyIDIwMTggMTY6MzANCj4gw4DCoDogdGNwbUBpZXRmLm9yZw0KPiBDY8KgOiBtdWx0aXBh dGh0Y3ANCj4gT2JqZXTCoDogUmU6IFttdWx0aXBhdGh0Y3BdIFt0Y3BtXSBXb3JraW5nIGdyb3Vw IGFjY2VwdGFuY2Ugb2YgZHJhZnQtDQo+IGJvbmF2ZW50dXJlLW1wdGNwLWNvbnZlcnRlcnMgPw0K PiANCj4gSGkgYWxsLA0KPiANCj4gcmVwbHlpbmcgdG8gSm9l4oCZcyBlbWFpbCBidXQgZGlyZWN0 ZWQgdG8gdGhlIHdob2xlIGdyb3VwIGFzIEkgd291bGQgbGlrZSB0bw0KPiBjbGFyaWZ5IG9uZSBw 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In-Reply-To: <3FABAE7A-BCE7-496B-9722-4802A21C391F@tik.ee.ethz.ch> References: <1d4eda72-b822-c8b5-1207-d52ce2e3fe62@strayalpha.com> <787AE7BB302AE849A7480A190F8B93300A08560D@OPEXCLILMA3.corporate.adroot.infra.ftgroup> <787AE7BB302AE849A7480A190F8B93300A086275@OPEXCLILMA3.corporate.adroot.infra.ftgroup> <5c189d4f-db3b-e3a5-c6c1-53d1b76e1ddc@strayalpha.com> <3FABAE7A-BCE7-496B-9722-4802A21C391F@tik.ee.ethz.ch> From: Gregory Detal Date: Thu, 18 Jan 2018 09:09:50 +0100 Message-ID: To: =?UTF-8?Q?Mirja_K=C3=BChlewind?= Cc: "tcpm@ietf.org" , multipathtcp Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="94eb2c08086c5bc34e0563087f56" Archived-At: Subject: Re: [tcpm] [multipathtcp] Working group acceptance of draft-bonaventure-mptcp-converters ? X-BeenThere: tcpm@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 Precedence: list List-Id: TCP Maintenance and Minor Extensions Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 18 Jan 2018 08:10:34 -0000 --94eb2c08086c5bc34e0563087f56 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Hi Mirja, all, The converter draft describes an evolution of a solution that we (Tessares) have already deployed in several networks to combine xDSL and LTE with Multipath TCP. We and our customers would like to see a standard specification for interoperability reasons and we are committed to contribute to the development of this document. Regards, On Fri, Jan 12, 2018 at 4:29 PM, Mirja K=C3=BChlewind < mirja.kuehlewind@tik.ee.ethz.ch> wrote: > Hi all, > > replying to Joe=E2=80=99s email but directed to the whole group as I woul= d like to > clarify one point: > > Even though I think this was stated explicitly and correctly in the > initial mail by the chairs that was starting the adopting call, I would > like to note again that the current charter seems allow the group to work > on these kind of approaches. The original mails stated: > > > The TCPM charter states that the "WG mostly focuses on maintenance issu= es > > (e.g., bug fixes) and modest changes to the protocol, algorithms, and > > interfaces that maintain TCP's utility". Assisting the deployment of ne= w > TCP > > extensions could be understood as one way to ensure TCP's utility. > > draft-bonaventure-mptcp-converters does not propose direct changes in the > TCP protocol itself but it aims to support deployment of TCP options and > thereby "maintains TCP=E2=80=99s utility". > > Of course this proposal could be seen as an application to TCP but given > the application is to enable deployment of TCP options such that TCP > extensions can be used by other over-the-top applications, it is very > closely interconnected to the TCP protocol itself. > > I proposed to discuss this doc in tcpm because I think TCP expertise is > needed here and I would feel uncomfortable if this work would happen in a > wg outside of the tsv area. An alternative would be to narrow the scope o= f > the proposed approach down to enable MCTCP support only and proceed the > work in the MPTCP group. However, as there is a much broader TCP expertis= e > in tcpm, I=E2=80=99m very certain that the quality of the final work woul= d be > higher if the document would be adopted in tcpm instead. > > To my understanding Joe=E2=80=99s initial emails was saying that he does = not > support the adoption of this document in tcpm as over-the-top application= s > are out of scope. As explained above, my assessment is that this work is = in > scope for tcpm. > > Effectively the questions that were originally ask in the adoption call > were not so much on the scope but: > > 1) Is there support for this work in tcpm, meaning are people in this > group willing to review and discuss this work? > > 2) Are there concerns against the adoption of this document? > > I well notice that there have bee three people in the group that have > concerns regarding the question if this document is in scope. However, I = , > and I believe the chairs as well, do not share these concerns based on th= e > provided arguments in the discussion. > > Therefore, I would like to make another request to the group and try to > figure out if there is enough energy and interest in this group to pursue > this work in tcpm (instead of mptcp or potentially some non-tsv group). > Please let me know if you in general support the work and would be willin= g > to review and discuss the proposed draft in this group (question 1 above)= ! > > Of course, please also let me/us know if there are other (technical) > concerns that would preclude the adoption of this work that did not come = up > yet! > > Thanks, > Mirja > > > > > Am 06.12.2017 um 05:26 schrieb Joe Touch : > > > > > > > > On 12/5/2017 2:48 PM, Scharf, Michael (Nokia - DE/Stuttgart) wrote: > >> Hi Joe, all, > >> > >> Regarding "*out of scope for* TCPM": Whether a document is in scope o= f > TCPM, or not, depends on the TCPM charter wording. > > Although I appreciate that's strictly true, I doubt the charter would > > change to include "haiku development". > > > > By the same token, IMO, this doc falls into one of two categories: > > > > 1) if, as is, it proposes direct placement of out-of-band data in the > > SYN payload, I think it is a bad idea and not worth pursuing in TCPM > > > > 2) if, instead, it is corrected to explain that its use of the data > > channel for proxy information is simply a conventional application data > > path, then it would not be a "modification of TCP" at all (minor or > > otherwise). If that isn't clearly out of scope for TCPM, I do not know > > what is or ever would be (can we start haiku next, in that case?) > > > > Joe > > > > _______________________________________________ > > multipathtcp mailing list > > multipathtcp@ietf.org > > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/multipathtcp > > _______________________________________________ > multipathtcp mailing list > multipathtcp@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/multipathtcp > --=20 [image: Tessares SA] Gregory Detal=C2=BA | Co-Fou= nder & CTO gregory.detal@tessares.net | +32 486 83 50 51 Tessares SA | Hybrid Access Solutions www.tessares.net 1 Avenue Jean Monnet, 1348 Louvain-la-Neuve, Belgium =C2=BATRAAL Consulting SPRL --=20 ------------------------------ DISCLAIMER. This email and any files transmitted with it are confidential and intended= =20 solely for the use of the individual or entity to whom they are addressed.= =20 If you have received this email in error please notify the system manager.= =20 This message contains confidential information and is intended only for the= =20 individual named. If you are not the named addressee you should not=20 disseminate, distribute or copy this e-mail. Please notify the sender=20 immediately by e-mail if you have received this e-mail by mistake and=20 delete this e-mail from your system. If you are not the intended recipient= =20 you are notified that disclosing, copying, distributing or taking any=20 action in reliance on the contents of this information is strictly=20 prohibited. --94eb2c08086c5bc34e0563087f56 Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Hi Mirja, all,

The converter draft describes an evolution of a solution th= at we (Tessares) have already deployed in several networks to combine xDSL = and LTE with Multipath TCP. We and our customers would like to see a standa= rd specification for interoperability reasons and we are committed to contr= ibute to the development of this document.

Rega= rds,

On Fri, Jan 12, 2018 at 4:29 PM, Mirja K=C3=BChlewind <mirja.kuehlewind@tik.ee.ethz.ch> wrote:
Hi all,

replying to Joe=E2=80=99s email but directed to the whole group as I would = like to clarify one point:

Even though I think this was stated explicitly and correctly in the initial= mail by the chairs that was starting the adopting call, I would like to no= te again that the current charter seems allow the group to work on these ki= nd of approaches. The original mails stated:

> The TCPM charter states that the "WG mostly focuses on maintenanc= e issues
> (e.g., bug fixes) and modest changes to the protocol, algorithms, and<= br> > interfaces that maintain TCP's utility". Assisting the deploy= ment of new TCP
> extensions could be understood as one way to ensure TCP's utility.=

draft-bonaventure-mptcp-converters does not propose direct chan= ges in the TCP protocol itself but it aims to support deployment of TCP opt= ions and thereby "maintains TCP=E2=80=99s utility".

Of course this proposal could be seen as an application to TCP but given th= e application is to enable deployment of TCP options such that TCP extensio= ns can be used by other over-the-top applications, it is very closely inter= connected to the TCP protocol itself.

I proposed to discuss this doc in tcpm because I think TCP expertise is nee= ded here and I would feel uncomfortable if this work would happen in a wg o= utside of the tsv area. An alternative would be to narrow the scope of the = proposed approach down to enable MCTCP support only and proceed the work in= the MPTCP group. However, as there is a much broader TCP expertise in tcpm= , I=E2=80=99m very certain that the quality of the final work would be high= er if the document would be adopted in tcpm instead.

To my understanding Joe=E2=80=99s initial emails was saying that he does no= t support the adoption of this document in tcpm as over-the-top application= s are out of scope. As explained above, my assessment is that this work is = in scope for tcpm.

Effectively the questions that were originally ask in the adoption call wer= e not so much on the scope but:

1) Is there support for this work in tcpm, meaning are people in this group= willing to review and discuss this work?

2) Are there concerns against the adoption of this document?

I well notice that there have bee three people in the group that have conce= rns regarding the question if this document is in scope. However, I , and I= believe the chairs as well, do not share these concerns based on the provi= ded arguments in the discussion.

Therefore, I would like to make another request to the group and try to fig= ure out if there is enough energy and interest in this group to pursue this= work in tcpm (instead of mptcp or potentially some non-tsv group). Please = let me know if you in general support the work and would be willing to revi= ew and discuss the proposed draft in this group (question 1 above)!

Of course, please also let me/us know if there are other (technical) concer= ns that would preclude the adoption of this work that did not come up yet!<= br>
Thanks,
Mirja



> Am 06.12.2017 um 05:26 schrieb Joe Touch <touch@strayalpha.com>:
>
>
>
> On 12/5/2017 2:48 PM, Scharf, Michael (Nokia - DE/Stuttgart) wrote: >> Hi Joe, all,
>>
>> Regarding "*out of scope for* TCPM":=C2=A0 Whether a doc= ument is in scope of TCPM, or not, depends on the TCPM charter wording.
> Although I appreciate that's strictly true, I doubt the charter wo= uld
> change to include "haiku development".
>
> By the same token, IMO, this doc falls into one of two categories:
>
> 1) if, as is, it proposes direct placement of out-of-band data in the<= br> > SYN payload, I think it is a bad idea and not worth pursuing in TCPM >
> 2) if, instead, it is corrected to explain that its use of the data > channel for proxy information is simply a conventional application dat= a
> path, then it would not be a "modification of TCP" at all (m= inor or
> otherwise). If that isn't clearly out of scope for TCPM, I do not = know
> what is or ever would be (can we start haiku next, in that case?)
>
> Joe
>
> _______________________________________________
> multipathtcp mailing list
> multipathtcp@ietf.org
> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/mu= ltipathtcp

_______________________________________________
multipathtcp mailing list
multipathtcp@ietf.org
https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/multipa= thtcp



--
=
3D"Tessares<= /td>Gregory Detal=C2=BA | Co-Founder & CTO
gre= gory.detal@tessares.net | +32 486 83 50 51
Tessares SA | Hy= brid Access Solutions
www.tessares.net= =C2=A0
1 Avenue Jean Monnet, 1348 Louvain-la-Neuve, Bel= gium
=C2=BATRAAL Consulting SPRL
<= /div>


DISCLAIMER.
This email and any files transmitted with it are confidential an= d intended solely for the use of the individual or entity to whom they are = addressed. If you have received this email in error please notify the syste= m manager. This message contains confidential information and is intended o= nly for the individual named. If you are not the named addressee you should= not disseminate, distribute or copy this e-mail. Please notify the sender = immediately by e-mail if you have received this e-mail by mistake and delet= e this e-mail from your system. If you are not the intended recipient you a= re notified that disclosing, copying, distributing or taking any action in = reliance on the contents of this information is strictly prohibited.= --94eb2c08086c5bc34e0563087f56-- From nobody Thu Jan 18 05:06:56 2018 Return-Path: X-Original-To: tcpm@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: tcpm@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 786841201FA; Thu, 18 Jan 2018 05:06:50 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.911 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.911 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE=-0.0001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, T_RP_MATCHES_RCVD=-0.01] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 9BVyhBptOyIv; Thu, 18 Jan 2018 05:06:48 -0800 (PST) Received: from osiris.lip6.fr (osiris.lip6.fr [132.227.60.30]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id EB30E1205D3; Thu, 18 Jan 2018 05:06:47 -0800 (PST) Received: from tibre.lip6.fr (tibre.lip6.fr [132.227.74.2]) by osiris.lip6.fr (8.15.2/lip6) with ESMTP id w0ID6hMD021791 ; Thu, 18 Jan 2018 14:06:44 +0100 (CET) X-pt: osiris.lip6.fr Received: from portablesecci3.rsr.lip6.fr (portablesecci3 [132.227.85.235]) (authenticated bits=0) by tibre.lip6.fr (8.15.1/8.14.7) with ESMTPSA id w0ID6hkB005313 (version=TLSv1.2 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 bits=256 verify=NO); Thu, 18 Jan 2018 14:06:43 +0100 (MET) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Mime-Version: 1.0 (Mac OS X Mail 10.3 \(3273\)) From: Stefano Secci In-Reply-To: <3FABAE7A-BCE7-496B-9722-4802A21C391F@tik.ee.ethz.ch> Date: Thu, 18 Jan 2018 14:06:40 +0100 Cc: "tcpm@ietf.org" , multipathtcp Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Message-Id: <979F865A-CC5E-41F4-A16C-49193BB30FD6@lip6.fr> References: <1d4eda72-b822-c8b5-1207-d52ce2e3fe62@strayalpha.com> <787AE7BB302AE849A7480A190F8B93300A08560D@OPEXCLILMA3.corporate.adroot.infra.ftgroup> <787AE7BB302AE849A7480A190F8B93300A086275@OPEXCLILMA3.corporate.adroot.infra.ftgroup> <5c189d4f-db3b-e3a5-c6c1-53d1b76e1ddc@strayalpha.com> <3FABAE7A-BCE7-496B-9722-4802A21C391F@tik.ee.ethz.ch> To: =?utf-8?Q?Mirja_K=C3=BChlewind?= X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.3273) X-Greylist: Sender IP whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-4.4.3 (osiris.lip6.fr [132.227.60.30]); Thu, 18 Jan 2018 14:06:44 +0100 (CET) X-Scanned-By: MIMEDefang 2.78 on 132.227.60.30 Archived-At: Subject: Re: [tcpm] [multipathtcp] Working group acceptance of draft-bonaventure-mptcp-converters ? X-BeenThere: tcpm@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 Precedence: list List-Id: TCP Maintenance and Minor Extensions Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 18 Jan 2018 13:06:50 -0000 Hello, in LIP6 we're working since 2014 on MPTCP proxy design and experiments, = and I'm personally available to review also next versions of the MPTCP = converter work and participate to the discussions. Best, Stefano > Le 12 janv. 2018 =C3=A0 16:29, Mirja K=C3=BChlewind = a =C3=A9crit : >=20 > Hi all, >=20 > replying to Joe=E2=80=99s email but directed to the whole group as I = would like to clarify one point: >=20 > Even though I think this was stated explicitly and correctly in the = initial mail by the chairs that was starting the adopting call, I would = like to note again that the current charter seems allow the group to = work on these kind of approaches. The original mails stated: >=20 >> The TCPM charter states that the "WG mostly focuses on maintenance = issues >> (e.g., bug fixes) and modest changes to the protocol, algorithms, and >> interfaces that maintain TCP's utility". Assisting the deployment of = new TCP >> extensions could be understood as one way to ensure TCP's utility. >=20 > draft-bonaventure-mptcp-converters does not propose direct changes in = the TCP protocol itself but it aims to support deployment of TCP options = and thereby "maintains TCP=E2=80=99s utility". >=20 > Of course this proposal could be seen as an application to TCP but = given the application is to enable deployment of TCP options such that = TCP extensions can be used by other over-the-top applications, it is = very closely interconnected to the TCP protocol itself. >=20 > I proposed to discuss this doc in tcpm because I think TCP expertise = is needed here and I would feel uncomfortable if this work would happen = in a wg outside of the tsv area. An alternative would be to narrow the = scope of the proposed approach down to enable MCTCP support only and = proceed the work in the MPTCP group. However, as there is a much broader = TCP expertise in tcpm, I=E2=80=99m very certain that the quality of the = final work would be higher if the document would be adopted in tcpm = instead. >=20 > To my understanding Joe=E2=80=99s initial emails was saying that he = does not support the adoption of this document in tcpm as over-the-top = applications are out of scope. As explained above, my assessment is that = this work is in scope for tcpm.=20 >=20 > Effectively the questions that were originally ask in the adoption = call were not so much on the scope but: >=20 > 1) Is there support for this work in tcpm, meaning are people in this = group willing to review and discuss this work? >=20 > 2) Are there concerns against the adoption of this document?=20 >=20 > I well notice that there have bee three people in the group that have = concerns regarding the question if this document is in scope. However, I = , and I believe the chairs as well, do not share these concerns based on = the provided arguments in the discussion.=20 >=20 > Therefore, I would like to make another request to the group and try = to figure out if there is enough energy and interest in this group to = pursue this work in tcpm (instead of mptcp or potentially some non-tsv = group). Please let me know if you in general support the work and would = be willing to review and discuss the proposed draft in this group = (question 1 above)! >=20 > Of course, please also let me/us know if there are other (technical) = concerns that would preclude the adoption of this work that did not come = up yet! >=20 > Thanks, > Mirja >=20 >=20 >=20 >> Am 06.12.2017 um 05:26 schrieb Joe Touch : >>=20 >>=20 >>=20 >> On 12/5/2017 2:48 PM, Scharf, Michael (Nokia - DE/Stuttgart) wrote: >>> Hi Joe, all, >>>=20 >>> Regarding "*out of scope for* TCPM": Whether a document is in scope = of TCPM, or not, depends on the TCPM charter wording.=20 >> Although I appreciate that's strictly true, I doubt the charter would >> change to include "haiku development". >>=20 >> By the same token, IMO, this doc falls into one of two categories: >>=20 >> 1) if, as is, it proposes direct placement of out-of-band data in the >> SYN payload, I think it is a bad idea and not worth pursuing in TCPM >>=20 >> 2) if, instead, it is corrected to explain that its use of the data >> channel for proxy information is simply a conventional application = data >> path, then it would not be a "modification of TCP" at all (minor or >> otherwise). If that isn't clearly out of scope for TCPM, I do not = know >> what is or ever would be (can we start haiku next, in that case?) >>=20 >> Joe >>=20 >> _______________________________________________ >> multipathtcp mailing list >> multipathtcp@ietf.org >> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/multipathtcp >=20 > _______________________________________________ > multipathtcp mailing list > multipathtcp@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/multipathtcp >=20 From nobody Thu Jan 18 06:08:47 2018 Return-Path: X-Original-To: tcpm@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: tcpm@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 99E4212025C; Thu, 18 Jan 2018 06:08:39 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.911 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.911 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE=-0.0001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, T_RP_MATCHES_RCVD=-0.01] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id JePhM4lWgJ71; Thu, 18 Jan 2018 06:08:36 -0800 (PST) Received: from mx2.cnes.fr (mx2.cnes.fr [194.199.174.201]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 14A361241F3; Thu, 18 Jan 2018 06:08:34 -0800 (PST) X-IronPort-AV: E=Sophos;i="5.46,377,1511827200"; d="scan'208";a="15953598" X-IPAS-Result: A2H1AADwqWBa/wEBeApdGQEBAQEBAQEBAQEBAQcBAQEBAYMRMFYQdCcHg1aKJJBglzEUgXsHIguESU8CGoRDPxgBAQEBAQEBAQEDaCiFJAEBAQECAQEBIRE3AwsFCwIBBQMNCwICBh0DAgICJQsUARACBAENBQiKIwgQp0aCJyGJLgEBAQEBAQEBAQEBAQEBAQEBAQEBGQWBD4kBgy6DLwEBAoE8ARECASAVgwAxgjQFil+ZEIEQjm6GSoEnI4FghBuEBodYmHQfOmBwMhonToIqglQcGYFOQTcBiwQBgRYBAQE From: Kuhn Nicolas To: Stefano Secci , =?utf-8?B?TWlyamEgS8O8aGxld2luZA==?= CC: multipathtcp , "tcpm@ietf.org" Thread-Topic: [tcpm] [multipathtcp] Working group acceptance of draft-bonaventure-mptcp-converters ? Thread-Index: AQHTkF08hC6cAr1mI0GC3Vwe9b5Nx6N5qlRQ Date: Thu, 18 Jan 2018 14:08:05 +0000 Deferred-Delivery: Thu, 18 Jan 2018 14:08:00 +0000 Message-ID: References: <1d4eda72-b822-c8b5-1207-d52ce2e3fe62@strayalpha.com> <787AE7BB302AE849A7480A190F8B93300A08560D@OPEXCLILMA3.corporate.adroot.infra.ftgroup> <787AE7BB302AE849A7480A190F8B93300A086275@OPEXCLILMA3.corporate.adroot.infra.ftgroup> <5c189d4f-db3b-e3a5-c6c1-53d1b76e1ddc@strayalpha.com> <3FABAE7A-BCE7-496B-9722-4802A21C391F@tik.ee.ethz.ch> <979F865A-CC5E-41F4-A16C-49193BB30FD6@lip6.fr> In-Reply-To: <979F865A-CC5E-41F4-A16C-49193BB30FD6@lip6.fr> Accept-Language: en-US Content-Language: fr-FR X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: x-tm-as-product-ver: SMEX-11.0.0.4255-8.100.1062-23606.000 x-tm-as-result: No--33.052400-8.000000-31 x-tm-as-user-approved-sender: No x-tm-as-user-blocked-sender: No Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64 MIME-Version: 1.0 Archived-At: Subject: Re: [tcpm] [multipathtcp] Working group acceptance of draft-bonaventure-mptcp-converters ? X-BeenThere: tcpm@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 Precedence: list List-Id: TCP Maintenance and Minor Extensions Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 18 Jan 2018 14:08:40 -0000 SGksIA0KDQpXZSBhcmUgYWxzbyBjdXJyZW50bHkgd29ya2luZyBvbiB0aGlzIHRvcGljIGZvciBv dXIgc3BlY2lmaWMgU0FUQ09NIHVzZS1jYXNlLg0KSSBhbSB0aHVzIGF2YWlsYWJsZSBmb3IgcmV2 aWV3IGFuZCBjb250cmlidXRlIHRvIHdvcmsgb24gTVBUQ1AgY29udmVydGVyIHdvcmsuDQoNCktp bmQgcmVnYXJkcywNCg0KTmljbw0KDQoNCi0tLS0tTWVzc2FnZSBkJ29yaWdpbmUtLS0tLQ0KRGXC oDogdGNwbSBbbWFpbHRvOnRjcG0tYm91bmNlc0BpZXRmLm9yZ10gRGUgbGEgcGFydCBkZSBTdGVm YW5vIFNlY2NpDQpFbnZvecOpwqA6IGpldWRpIDE4IGphbnZpZXIgMjAxOCAxNDowNw0Kw4DCoDog TWlyamEgS8O8aGxld2luZA0KQ2PCoDogbXVsdGlwYXRodGNwOyB0Y3BtQGlldGYub3JnDQpPYmpl dMKgOiBSZTogW3RjcG1dIFttdWx0aXBhdGh0Y3BdIFdvcmtpbmcgZ3JvdXAgYWNjZXB0YW5jZSBv ZiBkcmFmdC1ib25hdmVudHVyZS1tcHRjcC1jb252ZXJ0ZXJzID8NCg0KSGVsbG8sDQoNCmluIExJ 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Received: from ietfa.amsl.com (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id C66091273B1; Fri, 19 Jan 2018 19:03:29 -0800 (PST) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: internet-drafts@ietf.org To: Cc: tcpm@ietf.org X-Test-IDTracker: no X-IETF-IDTracker: 6.69.0 Auto-Submitted: auto-generated Precedence: bulk Message-ID: <151641740976.3392.14487544781858109631@ietfa.amsl.com> Date: Fri, 19 Jan 2018 19:03:29 -0800 Archived-At: Subject: [tcpm] I-D Action: draft-ietf-tcpm-tcp-edo-09.txt X-BeenThere: tcpm@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 List-Id: TCP Maintenance and Minor Extensions Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sat, 20 Jan 2018 03:03:30 -0000 A New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line Internet-Drafts directories. This draft is a work item of the TCP Maintenance and Minor Extensions WG of the IETF. Title : TCP Extended Data Offset Option Authors : Joe Touch Wesley M. Eddy Filename : draft-ietf-tcpm-tcp-edo-09.txt Pages : 23 Date : 2018-01-19 Abstract: TCP segments include a Data Offset field to indicate space for TCP options but the size of the field can limit the space available for complex options such as SACK and Multipath TCP and can limit the combination of such options supported in a single connection. This document updates RFC 793 with an optional TCP extension to that space to support the use of multiple large options. It also explains why the initial SYN of a connection cannot be extending a single segment. The IETF datatracker status page for this draft is: https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-tcpm-tcp-edo/ There are also htmlized versions available at: https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-tcpm-tcp-edo-09 https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/html/draft-ietf-tcpm-tcp-edo-09 A diff from the previous version is available at: https://www.ietf.org/rfcdiff?url2=draft-ietf-tcpm-tcp-edo-09 Please note that it may take a couple of minutes from the time of submission until the htmlized version and diff are available at tools.ietf.org. Internet-Drafts are also available by anonymous FTP at: ftp://ftp.ietf.org/internet-drafts/