From thomas.morin@orange-ftgroup.com Wed Dec 1 03:39:04 2010 Return-Path: X-Original-To: tools-discuss@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: tools-discuss@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id D93CB3A6B41 for ; Wed, 1 Dec 2010 03:39:04 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -102.95 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-102.95 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.298, BAYES_00=-2.599, HELO_EQ_FR=0.35, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW=-1, USER_IN_WHITELIST=-100] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id y104InKS6oEz for ; Wed, 1 Dec 2010 03:39:03 -0800 (PST) Received: from p-mail1.rd.francetelecom.com (p-mail1.rd.francetelecom.com [195.101.245.15]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 26A9F3A6B3F for ; Wed, 1 Dec 2010 03:39:03 -0800 (PST) Received: from p-mail1.rd.francetelecom.com (localhost.localdomain [127.0.0.1]) by localhost (Postfix) with SMTP id 330BF8B81FF for ; Wed, 1 Dec 2010 12:29:59 +0100 (CET) Received: from ftrdsmtp2.rd.francetelecom.fr (unknown [10.192.128.47]) by p-mail1.rd.francetelecom.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id E78FE8B8002 for ; Wed, 1 Dec 2010 11:55:13 +0100 (CET) Received: from ftrdmel10.rd.francetelecom.fr ([10.192.128.44]) by ftrdsmtp2.rd.francetelecom.fr with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.4675); Wed, 1 Dec 2010 11:54:10 +0100 Received: from [10.193.15.246] ([10.193.15.246]) by ftrdmel10.rd.francetelecom.fr with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.4675); Wed, 1 Dec 2010 11:54:10 +0100 Message-ID: <4CF62952.1050304@orange-ftgroup.com> Date: Wed, 01 Dec 2010 11:54:10 +0100 From: Thomas Morin Organization: France Telecom Orange User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; U; ; ; ) Gecko/2010 Thunderbird/3.1.x MIME-Version: 1.0 To: tools-discuss@ietf.org Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="------------000106090205050202010805" X-OriginalArrivalTime: 01 Dec 2010 10:54:10.0426 (UTC) FILETIME=[157A35A0:01CB9146] Subject: [Tools-discuss] Two issues on draft-...@tools.ietf.org aliases X-BeenThere: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF Tools Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 01 Dec 2010 11:39:05 -0000 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --------------000106090205050202010805 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Hi, Here is a mailer-daemon I had when writing to draft-ietf-mpls-mp-ldp-reqs@tools.ietf. There are two issues appearing : 1) this mail was re-sent by the tools server re-using my address as sender, and among the receivers are some colleagues from my company; but the mail server of my company seems to reject mail coming into it with a sender address of somebody inside the company ; this seems like an issue that mailing list engine resolve properly (possibly thanks to the "Sender" SMTP header?) -- could such a fix, or another relevant one, be applied to draft aliases ? 2) the email address for one of the authors is the old address that was present in a early version of the dratf (luyuanfang@att.com ); the new address for this co-author (lufang@cisco.com) is not used by the tools.ietf.org engine even though it's been present in the recent version of the draft (since March 2007) ; is this a known issue ? a design limitation ? Thanks, -Thomas -------- Message original -------- Sujet: Mail delivery failed: returning message to sender Date : Wed, 01 Dec 2010 02:43:20 -0800 De : Mail Delivery System Pour : thomas.morin@orange-ftgroup.com This message was created automatically by mail delivery software. A message that you sent could not be delivered to one or more of its recipients. This is a permanent error. The following address(es) failed: vincent.parfait@orange-ftgroup.com (generated from draft-ietf-mpls-mp-ldp-reqs@tools.ietf.org) SMTP error from remote mail server after MAIL FROM: SIZE=3943: host relais-ias89.francetelecom.com [193.251.215.89]: 554 5.7.1: Sender address rejected: domain use is reserved thomas.morin@orange-ftgroup.com (generated from draft-ietf-mpls-mp-ldp-reqs@tools.ietf.org) SMTP error from remote mail server after MAIL FROM: SIZE=3943: host relais-ias89.francetelecom.com [193.251.215.89]: 554 5.7.1: Sender address rejected: domain use is reserved jeanlouis.leroux@orange-ftgroup.com (generated from draft-ietf-mpls-mp-ldp-reqs@tools.ietf.org) SMTP error from remote mail server after MAIL FROM: SIZE=3943: host relais-ias89.francetelecom.com [193.251.215.89]: 554 5.7.1: Sender address rejected: domain use is reserved luyuanfang@att.com (generated from draft-ietf-mpls-mp-ldp-reqs@tools.ietf.org) SMTP error from remote mail server after RCPT TO:: host cluster7.us.messagelabs.com [216.82.253.179]: 550 Invalid recipient (#5.1.1) --------------000106090205050202010805 Content-Type: text/html; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Hi,

Here is a mailer-daemon I had when writing to draft-ietf-mpls-mp-ldp-reqs@tools.ietf.

There are two issues appearing :

1) this mail was re-sent by the tools server re-using my address as sender, and among the receivers are some colleagues from my company; but the mail server of my company seems to reject mail coming into it with a sender address of somebody inside the company ; this seems like an issue that mailing list engine resolve properly (possibly thanks to the "Sender" SMTP header?) -- could such a fix, or another relevant one, be applied to draft aliases ?

2) the email address for one of the authors is the old address that was present in a early version of the dratf (luyuanfang@att.com ); the new address for this co-author (lufang@cisco.com) is not used by the tools.ietf.org engine even though it's been present in the recent version of the draft (since March 2007)  ; is this a known issue ? a design limitation ?

Thanks,

-Thomas


-------- Message original --------
Sujet: Mail delivery failed: returning message to sender
Date : Wed, 01 Dec 2010 02:43:20 -0800
De : Mail Delivery System <Mailer-Daemon@zinfandel.tools.ietf.org>
Pour : thomas.morin@orange-ftgroup.com 


This message was created automatically by mail delivery software.

A message that you sent could not be delivered to one or more of its
recipients. This is a permanent error. The following address(es) failed:

  vincent.parfait@orange-ftgroup.com
    (generated from draft-ietf-mpls-mp-ldp-reqs@tools.ietf.org)
    SMTP error from remote mail server after MAIL FROM:<thomas.morin@orange-ftgroup.com> SIZE=3943:
    host relais-ias89.francetelecom.com [193.251.215.89]:
    554 5.7.1 <thomas.morin@orange-ftgroup.com>: Sender address rejected:
    domain use is reserved
  thomas.morin@orange-ftgroup.com
    (generated from draft-ietf-mpls-mp-ldp-reqs@tools.ietf.org)
    SMTP error from remote mail server after MAIL FROM:<thomas.morin@orange-ftgroup.com> SIZE=3943:
    host relais-ias89.francetelecom.com [193.251.215.89]:
    554 5.7.1 <thomas.morin@orange-ftgroup.com>: Sender address rejected:
    domain use is reserved
  jeanlouis.leroux@orange-ftgroup.com
    (generated from draft-ietf-mpls-mp-ldp-reqs@tools.ietf.org)
    SMTP error from remote mail server after MAIL FROM:<thomas.morin@orange-ftgroup.com> SIZE=3943:
    host relais-ias89.francetelecom.com [193.251.215.89]:
    554 5.7.1 <thomas.morin@orange-ftgroup.com>: Sender address rejected:
    domain use is reserved
  luyuanfang@att.com
    (generated from draft-ietf-mpls-mp-ldp-reqs@tools.ietf.org)
    SMTP error from remote mail server after RCPT 
TO:<luyuanfang@att.com>:
    host cluster7.us.messagelabs.com [216.82.253.179]:
    550 Invalid recipient <luyuanfang@att.com> (#5.1.1)
--------------000106090205050202010805-- From lars.eggert@nokia.com Fri Dec 3 00:15:42 2010 Return-Path: X-Original-To: tools-discuss@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: tools-discuss@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7CEB728C1AC for ; Fri, 3 Dec 2010 00:15:42 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -103.091 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-103.091 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.508, BAYES_00=-2.599, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW=-1, USER_IN_WHITELIST=-100] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id rKe+6iphsLNv for ; Fri, 3 Dec 2010 00:15:41 -0800 (PST) Received: from mgw-da01.nokia.com (smtp.nokia.com [147.243.128.24]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5C3D228C1B2 for ; Fri, 3 Dec 2010 00:15:37 -0800 (PST) Received: from mail.fit.nokia.com (esdhcp030222.research.nokia.com [172.21.30.222]) by mgw-da01.nokia.com (Switch-3.4.3/Switch-3.4.3) with ESMTP id oB38GqP1024540 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=NO) for ; Fri, 3 Dec 2010 10:16:53 +0200 From: Lars Eggert X-Virus-Status: Clean X-Virus-Scanned: clamav-milter 0.96.5 at fit.nokia.com Content-Type: multipart/signed; boundary=Apple-Mail-15--475682550; protocol="application/pkcs7-signature"; micalg=sha1 Date: Fri, 3 Dec 2010 10:15:29 +0200 Message-Id: <98350789-FEAD-4A62-A65D-A196715DAE7F@nokia.com> To: Tools Team Discussion Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v1082) X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.1082) X-Greylist: Sender succeeded SMTP AUTH, not delayed by milter-greylist-4.2.6 (mail.fit.nokia.com); Fri, 03 Dec 2010 10:16:50 +0200 (EET) X-Nokia-AV: Clean Subject: [Tools-discuss] datatracker bug wrt IPR X-BeenThere: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF Tools Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 03 Dec 2010 08:15:42 -0000 --Apple-Mail-15--475682550 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Hi, the IESG datatracker shows the count of IPR disclosures on the "My = Documents" page. For draft-ietf-ippm-tcp-throughput-tm-08 and = draft-ietf-nsis-tunnel-13, that count is "1". The "1" is clickable, and resolves to these URLs for the two IDs: = http://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/ipr/search?option=3Ddocument_search&id_doc= ument_tag=3D19939 = http://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/ipr/search?option=3Ddocument_search&id_doc= ument_tag=3D14904 Both of these URLs lead nowhere, i.e., I get "The page you were looking = for couldn't be found." Lars= --Apple-Mail-15--475682550 Content-Disposition: attachment; filename=smime.p7s Content-Type: application/pkcs7-signature; name=smime.p7s Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64 MIAGCSqGSIb3DQEHAqCAMIACAQExCzAJBgUrDgMCGgUAMIAGCSqGSIb3DQEHAQAAoIIMRjCCBVAw ggQ4oAMCAQICEGxdPUZzCwUJ8KBiJwH+bYgwDQYJKoZIhvcNAQEFBQAwgd0xCzAJBgNVBAYTAlVT MRcwFQYDVQQKEw5WZXJpU2lnbiwgSW5jLjEfMB0GA1UECxMWVmVyaVNpZ24gVHJ1c3QgTmV0d29y azE7MDkGA1UECxMyVGVybXMgb2YgdXNlIGF0IGh0dHBzOi8vd3d3LnZlcmlzaWduLmNvbS9ycGEg KGMpMDkxHjAcBgNVBAsTFVBlcnNvbmEgTm90IFZhbGlkYXRlZDE3MDUGA1UEAxMuVmVyaVNpZ24g Q2xhc3MgMSBJbmRpdmlkdWFsIFN1YnNjcmliZXIgQ0EgLSBHMzAeFw0xMDEwMTUwMDAwMDBaFw0x MTEwMTUyMzU5NTlaMIIBEzEXMBUGA1UEChMOVmVyaVNpZ24sIEluYy4xHzAdBgNVBAsTFlZlcmlT aWduIFRydXN0IE5ldHdvcmsxRjBEBgNVBAsTPXd3dy52ZXJpc2lnbi5jb20vcmVwb3NpdG9yeS9S UEEgSW5jb3JwLiBieSBSZWYuLExJQUIuTFREKGMpOTgxHjAcBgNVBAsTFVBlcnNvbmEgTm90IFZh bGlkYXRlZDEzMDEGA1UECxMqRGlnaXRhbCBJRCBDbGFzcyAxIC0gTmV0c2NhcGUgRnVsbCBTZXJ2 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AQtBuhMn/5hr6AdM+OgWBUiFFXtKLwSeR8EzbtDQLXiugKUVm4sBJe/xDiJ5Gwzc39rI9crpmRrN rBUln7lljUewxxj6yNImlgAeEQcCxHXDImbDLMAAAAAAAAA= --Apple-Mail-15--475682550-- From lars.eggert@nokia.com Wed Dec 8 06:45:16 2010 Return-Path: X-Original-To: tools-discuss@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: tools-discuss@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id B92943A677C for ; Wed, 8 Dec 2010 06:45:15 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -102.818 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-102.818 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.181, BAYES_00=-2.599, J_CHICKENPOX_63=0.6, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW=-1, USER_IN_WHITELIST=-100] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 2uE62TDJQ6gq for ; Wed, 8 Dec 2010 06:45:14 -0800 (PST) Received: from mgw-da01.nokia.com (smtp.nokia.com [147.243.128.24]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6820A3A6907 for ; Wed, 8 Dec 2010 06:45:14 -0800 (PST) Received: from mail.fit.nokia.com (esdhcp030222.research.nokia.com [172.21.30.222]) by mgw-da01.nokia.com (Switch-3.4.3/Switch-3.4.3) with ESMTP id oB8Eke6Y008401 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=NO) for ; Wed, 8 Dec 2010 16:46:41 +0200 From: Lars Eggert X-Virus-Status: Clean X-Virus-Scanned: clamav-milter 0.96.5 at fit.nokia.com Content-Type: multipart/signed; boundary=Apple-Mail-107--20214431; protocol="application/pkcs7-signature"; micalg=sha1 Date: Wed, 8 Dec 2010 16:46:37 +0200 Message-Id: <72281A42-683F-4C0B-B1D6-AA7FCE518AD6@nokia.com> To: Tools Team Discussion Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v1082) X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.1082) X-Greylist: Sender succeeded SMTP AUTH, not delayed by milter-greylist-4.2.6 (mail.fit.nokia.com); Wed, 08 Dec 2010 16:46:38 +0200 (EET) X-Nokia-AV: Clean Subject: [Tools-discuss] Internet Draft Signatures X-BeenThere: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF Tools Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 08 Dec 2010 14:45:16 -0000 --Apple-Mail-107--20214431 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Hi, http://www.ietf.org/id-info/idsignatures.html has these instructions to verify the p7s signatures: openssl cms -verify -CAfile comodo.pem -content -inform = DER \ -in -out /dev/null However, openssl does not have a "cms" command on either Mac, FreeBSD or = Ubuntu Linux? 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lDMwmjZIKaHIR7eWtjisM0WcTHxurWCU69ImFmrDPnZWyE0pUnll97NfBP6MhAzSNOqGwhp1ntsa PsfR+bCW12Ts7e7kwRwRwPLNFZTLsoophCyat4MAAAAAAAA= --Apple-Mail-107--20214431-- From lars.eggert@nokia.com Wed Dec 8 06:45:23 2010 Return-Path: X-Original-To: tools-discuss@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: tools-discuss@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id B20EA3A6907 for ; Wed, 8 Dec 2010 06:45:23 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -102.62 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-102.62 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=-0.021, BAYES_00=-2.599, USER_IN_WHITELIST=-100] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id MWng-Lw6CKWR for ; Wed, 8 Dec 2010 06:45:23 -0800 (PST) Received: from mgw-da02.nokia.com (smtp.nokia.com [147.243.128.26]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id D31443A677C for ; Wed, 8 Dec 2010 06:45:22 -0800 (PST) Received: from mail.fit.nokia.com (esdhcp030222.research.nokia.com [172.21.30.222]) by mgw-da02.nokia.com (Switch-3.4.3/Switch-3.4.3) with ESMTP id oB8Ekmfe030067 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=NO) for ; Wed, 8 Dec 2010 16:46:50 +0200 From: Lars Eggert X-Virus-Status: Clean X-Virus-Scanned: clamav-milter 0.96.5 at fit.nokia.com Content-Type: multipart/signed; boundary=Apple-Mail-108--20205993; protocol="application/pkcs7-signature"; micalg=sha1 Date: Wed, 8 Dec 2010 16:46:46 +0200 Message-Id: <5695BA58-C133-415E-A928-032519544E0F@nokia.com> To: Tools Team Discussion Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v1082) X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.1082) X-Greylist: Sender succeeded SMTP AUTH, not delayed by milter-greylist-4.2.6 (mail.fit.nokia.com); Wed, 08 Dec 2010 16:46:46 +0200 (EET) X-Nokia-AV: Clean Subject: [Tools-discuss] p7s signatures X-BeenThere: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF Tools Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 08 Dec 2010 14:45:23 -0000 --Apple-Mail-108--20205993 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Hi, something is going wrong with the p7s signature generation for IDs in = the repository. Whatever script generates them is now generating p7s = signatures for p7s files... For example: ... draft-zorn-dime-rfc4005bis-02.txt.p7s.p7s draft-zorn-radius-keywrap-17.txt.p7s draft-zorn-radius-keywrap-17.txt.p7s.p7s draft-zyp-json-schema-03.txt.p7s draft-zyp-json-schema-03.txt.p7s.p7s Lars= --Apple-Mail-108--20205993 Content-Disposition: attachment; filename=smime.p7s Content-Type: application/pkcs7-signature; name=smime.p7s Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64 MIAGCSqGSIb3DQEHAqCAMIACAQExCzAJBgUrDgMCGgUAMIAGCSqGSIb3DQEHAQAAoIIMRjCCBVAw ggQ4oAMCAQICEGxdPUZzCwUJ8KBiJwH+bYgwDQYJKoZIhvcNAQEFBQAwgd0xCzAJBgNVBAYTAlVT MRcwFQYDVQQKEw5WZXJpU2lnbiwgSW5jLjEfMB0GA1UECxMWVmVyaVNpZ24gVHJ1c3QgTmV0d29y azE7MDkGA1UECxMyVGVybXMgb2YgdXNlIGF0IGh0dHBzOi8vd3d3LnZlcmlzaWduLmNvbS9ycGEg KGMpMDkxHjAcBgNVBAsTFVBlcnNvbmEgTm90IFZhbGlkYXRlZDE3MDUGA1UEAxMuVmVyaVNpZ24g Q2xhc3MgMSBJbmRpdmlkdWFsIFN1YnNjcmliZXIgQ0EgLSBHMzAeFw0xMDEwMTUwMDAwMDBaFw0x MTEwMTUyMzU5NTlaMIIBEzEXMBUGA1UEChMOVmVyaVNpZ24sIEluYy4xHzAdBgNVBAsTFlZlcmlT aWduIFRydXN0IE5ldHdvcmsxRjBEBgNVBAsTPXd3dy52ZXJpc2lnbi5jb20vcmVwb3NpdG9yeS9S 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blg3y1RRJx+rpreFs5DnVlOamx0fCFaqyHQ4xemwX5kYt/sJAlIsgEPR1aUelT9BDJSaSZ5ry6jD AfOzg5IuH2nbVvoNCa2An34+7XpBqDzDkDiKB8tMh62Qbwxxc5rs4b0oSsjtKgPBSlYvsjK3wdez r6tNOtQEiWQRaHQEyWPxTqK2rw2yVKLUx2Vgz82muhS6rzrDK7PWULXdknv5eJLpIP7nDrNKM/4U tn21zPtRWbi1kcBQpzXVFOd5NRkb9aSDvRpN8n4AAAAAAAA= --Apple-Mail-108--20205993-- From sm@resistor.net Wed Dec 8 07:28:46 2010 Return-Path: X-Original-To: tools-discuss@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: tools-discuss@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4C7CE3A67F6 for ; Wed, 8 Dec 2010 07:28:46 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -103.158 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-103.158 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=-0.159, BAYES_00=-2.599, J_CHICKENPOX_63=0.6, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW=-1, USER_IN_WHITELIST=-100] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 6SqgO0RjanGx for ; Wed, 8 Dec 2010 07:28:43 -0800 (PST) Received: from ns1.qubic.net (ns1.qubic.net [208.69.177.116]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id B4CB93A67E9 for ; Wed, 8 Dec 2010 07:28:43 -0800 (PST) Received: from SUBMAN.resistor.net ([10.0.0.1]) (authenticated bits=0) by ns1.qubic.net (8.14.5.Alpha0/8.14.5.Alpha0) with ESMTP id oB8FTJ6F023863 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=NO); Wed, 8 Dec 2010 07:30:05 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=simple/simple; d=opendkim.org; s=mail2010; t=1291822209; x=1291908609; bh=2ioxBEc0e8e6ll1930VoX/g4ddjgwsTQ54WzVCXVsdI=; h=Message-Id:Date:To:From:Subject:Cc:In-Reply-To:References: Mime-Version:Content-Type:Cc; b=GYCYNOR+8c+IU+WfS0CKJcmv1EVbLdi8sZpzLvAWlIiiLSf+Ynzi3OLCniIjm3In8 jBSGRs1fW9S/J8PACHixJv8CQS21ckn1Q6EgjM/Oqsr5gETY+HrYexWMvFhyGkS8Vl V56XE/GZLgXi0altSZ97u3x0wRhizwww3LDaMclM= DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=simple/simple; d=resistor.net; s=mail; t=1291822209; x=1291908609; bh=2ioxBEc0e8e6ll1930VoX/g4ddjgwsTQ54WzVCXVsdI=; h=Message-Id:Date:To:From:Subject:Cc:In-Reply-To:References: Mime-Version:Content-Type:Cc; b=azaNwTXGfQAxlc0AzXFhDDrZsyrhR+U0zRXAcPSDjms1CtxZBxkkGN5H5/Mdrm2Y1 TRtH0xQMmtKdgR4ZRvr1FVqxLmrsXyv1JZQO58MFrMVn3aplpYBMERfv1Ql4lbkUkZ +jT020CP9ELvcH/JloPmjjA89ci5OGMXp0TFjmAc= DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; s=mail; d=resistor.net; c=simple; q=dns; b=qz03K2Zpn4MXYzVUHz0xxWFlXfgPaYRpNCDOaAdxva/56lTUWAN0EUEQng48pevJz H4WF1ScwTfcP6xrxe37pktuIk8/Py4c1jixt6EsahDLqudxmxtlR58QPnZ1E03jk51I VVy3giExGuStIFK/LrzSJqjPCLZ6kavK+J8AIzI= Message-Id: <6.2.5.6.2.20101208072618.0a4b1c58@resistor.net> X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 6.2.5.6 Date: Wed, 08 Dec 2010 07:28:35 -0800 To: Lars Eggert From: SM In-Reply-To: <72281A42-683F-4C0B-B1D6-AA7FCE518AD6@nokia.com> References: <72281A42-683F-4C0B-B1D6-AA7FCE518AD6@nokia.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed Cc: Tools Team Discussion Subject: Re: [Tools-discuss] Internet Draft Signatures X-BeenThere: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF Tools Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 08 Dec 2010 15:28:46 -0000 Hi Lars, At 06:46 08-12-10, Lars Eggert wrote: >http://www.ietf.org/id-info/idsignatures.html > >has these instructions to verify the p7s signatures: > >openssl cms -verify -CAfile comodo.pem -content -inform DER \ > -in -out /dev/null > > >However, openssl does not have a "cms" command on either Mac, >FreeBSD or Ubuntu Linux? Support for CMS was added in version 1.0.0. Regards, -sm From ietfdbh@comcast.net Wed Dec 8 08:40:41 2010 Return-Path: X-Original-To: tools-discuss@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: tools-discuss@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id C2F503A6969 for ; Wed, 8 Dec 2010 08:40:41 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -102.547 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-102.547 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.052, BAYES_00=-2.599, USER_IN_WHITELIST=-100] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id KHVn9mX9Mr7b for ; Wed, 8 Dec 2010 08:40:40 -0800 (PST) Received: from qmta10.westchester.pa.mail.comcast.net (qmta10.westchester.pa.mail.comcast.net [76.96.62.17]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 862CA3A6819 for ; Wed, 8 Dec 2010 08:40:40 -0800 (PST) Received: from omta23.westchester.pa.mail.comcast.net ([76.96.62.74]) by qmta10.westchester.pa.mail.comcast.net with comcast id gg0s1f0041c6gX85Agi9bN; Wed, 08 Dec 2010 16:42:09 +0000 Received: from 23FX1C1 ([67.189.235.106]) by omta23.westchester.pa.mail.comcast.net with comcast id ggi81f00d2JQnJT3jgi8lG; Wed, 08 Dec 2010 16:42:09 +0000 From: "David Harrington" To: Date: Wed, 8 Dec 2010 11:41:20 -0500 Message-ID: <6F75CE6F0178486BBF6289675D1BE732@23FX1C1> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: Microsoft Office Outlook 11 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.5994 Thread-Index: AcuW9r2Ca2PP3eJnSgSFI9TjvW3DaQ== Cc: iesg@ietf.org Subject: [Tools-discuss] include-text X-BeenThere: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF Tools Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 08 Dec 2010 16:40:41 -0000 Hi, IIRC, Henrick said the next revision of the datatracker tool would allow people to choose different defaults for the include-text parameter. Can we please expedite this? I find the current setting, where I only get the first page, to be tremendously inconvenient, since I now have to click through multiple screens to be able to print the document, and then click back through multiple screens to get back to the datatracker page I started from. Also, since the top of the partial document page doesn't indicate the whole text is not present, I find it misleading. This has led me to make bad assumptions when I print out only the first page, or I search for something and find no instances in the document. Luckily, mnay of these times it is obvious to me that there should be at least one instance (or the printout is too short), so I realize I must only have the first page of the document. This is a real time-waster for me. I can only hope that those who requested this feature are getting some good benefit from it. I'm not. Can we either revert to the old approach, or get the customizable version deployed? Thanks, David Harrington Director, IETF Transport Area ietfdbh@comcast.net (preferred for ietf) dbharrington@huaweisymantec.com +1 603 828 1401 (cell) From lars.eggert@nokia.com Wed Dec 8 11:24:22 2010 Return-Path: X-Original-To: tools-discuss@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: tools-discuss@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 38CB13A6852 for ; Wed, 8 Dec 2010 11:24:22 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -102.62 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-102.62 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=-0.021, BAYES_00=-2.599, USER_IN_WHITELIST=-100] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id FmJW9CIaCfuQ for ; Wed, 8 Dec 2010 11:24:20 -0800 (PST) Received: from mgw-da02.nokia.com (smtp.nokia.com [147.243.128.26]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id B8EF23A6823 for ; Wed, 8 Dec 2010 11:24:20 -0800 (PST) Received: from mail.fit.nokia.com (esdhcp030222.research.nokia.com [172.21.30.222]) by mgw-da02.nokia.com (Switch-3.4.3/Switch-3.4.3) with ESMTP id oB8JPk5c007251 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=NO); Wed, 8 Dec 2010 21:25:47 +0200 X-Virus-Status: Clean X-Virus-Scanned: clamav-milter 0.96.5 at fit.nokia.com Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v1082) Content-Type: multipart/signed; boundary=Apple-Mail-113--3475685; protocol="application/pkcs7-signature"; micalg=sha1 From: Lars Eggert In-Reply-To: <6.2.5.6.2.20101208072618.0a4b1c58@resistor.net> Date: Wed, 8 Dec 2010 21:25:36 +0200 Message-Id: <93354F9C-0172-4FB6-86F4-FB72AF511033@nokia.com> References: <72281A42-683F-4C0B-B1D6-AA7FCE518AD6@nokia.com> <6.2.5.6.2.20101208072618.0a4b1c58@resistor.net> To: SM X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.1082) X-Greylist: Sender succeeded SMTP AUTH, not delayed by milter-greylist-4.2.6 (mail.fit.nokia.com); Wed, 08 Dec 2010 21:25:43 +0200 (EET) X-Nokia-AV: Clean Cc: Tools Team Discussion Subject: Re: [Tools-discuss] Internet Draft Signatures X-BeenThere: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF Tools Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 08 Dec 2010 19:24:22 -0000 --Apple-Mail-113--3475685 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii On 2010-12-8, at 17:28, SM wrote: > Support for CMS was added in version 1.0.0. Ah, good to know. Still, why didn't we use something that had a bit = wider tools support? I mean, I tried the most recent versions of MacOS, = FreeBSD and Ubuntu, and none of them can be used to verify this out of = the box? 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DjdFfiQWLrPddS8givPxspI5vrYHKPJ1RVYfzE9K5J5ZILWRDpWGCM99eGPryh0JTefDk6Zy2qAw XGdNchaYHlIb7/jGx5FTYbjny2sCtojo4XunGXUAAAAAAAA= --Apple-Mail-113--3475685-- From rjsparks@nostrum.com Wed Dec 8 12:01:15 2010 Return-Path: X-Original-To: tools-discuss@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: tools-discuss@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3F6473A6870; Wed, 8 Dec 2010 12:01:15 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -102.182 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-102.182 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.418, BAYES_00=-2.599, SPF_PASS=-0.001, USER_IN_WHITELIST=-100] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id vMSTmPYb65+b; Wed, 8 Dec 2010 12:01:14 -0800 (PST) Received: from nostrum.com (nostrum-pt.tunnel.tserv2.fmt.ipv6.he.net [IPv6:2001:470:1f03:267::2]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1E9253A686A; Wed, 8 Dec 2010 12:01:13 -0800 (PST) Received: from dn3-177.estacado.net (vicuna-alt.estacado.net [75.53.54.121]) (authenticated bits=0) by nostrum.com (8.14.3/8.14.3) with ESMTP id oB8K2aIq069121 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=AES128-SHA bits=128 verify=NO); Wed, 8 Dec 2010 14:02:39 -0600 (CST) (envelope-from rjsparks@nostrum.com) Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v1082) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii From: Robert Sparks In-Reply-To: <6F75CE6F0178486BBF6289675D1BE732@23FX1C1> Date: Wed, 8 Dec 2010 14:02:35 -0600 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Message-Id: <44B96A5F-2C74-43F6-9888-FAD0B6EDA360@nostrum.com> References: <6F75CE6F0178486BBF6289675D1BE732@23FX1C1> To: David Harrington X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.1082) Received-SPF: pass (nostrum.com: 75.53.54.121 is authenticated by a trusted mechanism) Cc: iesg@ietf.org, tools-discuss@ietf.org Subject: Re: [Tools-discuss] include-text X-BeenThere: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF Tools Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 08 Dec 2010 20:01:15 -0000 This is really getting in my way and I would also like to see it expedited. RjS On Dec 8, 2010, at 10:41 AM, David Harrington wrote: > Hi, > > IIRC, Henrick said the next revision of the datatracker tool would > allow people to choose different defaults for the include-text > parameter. Can we please expedite this? > > I find the current setting, where I only get the first page, to be > tremendously inconvenient, since I now have to click through multiple > screens to be able to print the document, and then click back through > multiple screens to get back to the datatracker page I started from. > > Also, since the top of the partial document page doesn't indicate the > whole text is not present, I find it misleading. This has led me to > make bad assumptions when I print out only the first page, or I search > for something and find no instances in the document. Luckily, mnay of > these times it is obvious to me that there should be at least one > instance (or the printout is too short), so I realize I must only have > the first page of the document. > > This is a real time-waster for me. I can only hope that those who > requested this feature are getting some good benefit from it. I'm not. > > Can we either revert to the old approach, or get the customizable > version deployed? > > Thanks, > David Harrington > Director, IETF Transport Area > ietfdbh@comcast.net (preferred for ietf) > dbharrington@huaweisymantec.com > +1 603 828 1401 (cell) > From tony@att.com Wed Dec 8 12:19:06 2010 Return-Path: X-Original-To: tools-discuss@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: tools-discuss@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1F9CE3A6823; Wed, 8 Dec 2010 12:19:06 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -106.483 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-106.483 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.116, BAYES_00=-2.599, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-4, USER_IN_WHITELIST=-100] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id bcdQ2hLrBX3g; Wed, 8 Dec 2010 12:19:05 -0800 (PST) Received: from mail167.messagelabs.com (mail167.messagelabs.com [216.82.253.179]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 095D23A6860; Wed, 8 Dec 2010 12:19:04 -0800 (PST) X-VirusChecked: Checked X-Env-Sender: tony@att.com X-Msg-Ref: server-3.tower-167.messagelabs.com!1291839629!33166189!1 X-StarScan-Version: 6.2.9; banners=-,-,- X-Originating-IP: [144.160.20.145] Received: (qmail 12924 invoked from network); 8 Dec 2010 20:20:32 -0000 Received: from sbcsmtp6.sbc.com (HELO mlpd192.enaf.sfdc.sbc.com) (144.160.20.145) by server-3.tower-167.messagelabs.com with DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA encrypted SMTP; 8 Dec 2010 20:20:32 -0000 Received: from enaf.sfdc.sbc.com (localhost.localdomain [127.0.0.1]) by mlpd192.enaf.sfdc.sbc.com (8.14.4/8.14.4) with ESMTP id oB8KKiUR004211; Wed, 8 Dec 2010 15:20:49 -0500 Received: from alpd052.aldc.att.com (alpd052.aldc.att.com [130.8.42.31]) by mlpd192.enaf.sfdc.sbc.com (8.14.4/8.14.4) with ESMTP id oB8KKeXb004072; Wed, 8 Dec 2010 15:20:40 -0500 Received: from aldc.att.com (localhost.localdomain [127.0.0.1]) by alpd052.aldc.att.com (8.14.4/8.14.4) with ESMTP id oB8KKKXc027460; Wed, 8 Dec 2010 15:20:20 -0500 Received: from dns.maillennium.att.com (dns.maillennium.att.com [135.25.114.99]) by alpd052.aldc.att.com (8.14.4/8.14.4) with ESMTP id oB8KKAKL026552; Wed, 8 Dec 2010 15:20:10 -0500 Received: from [135.70.242.195] (vpn-135-70-242-195.vpn.east.att.com[135.70.242.195]) by maillennium.att.com (mailgw1) with ESMTP id <20101208202010gw1004lkt6e> (Authid: tony); Wed, 8 Dec 2010 20:20:10 +0000 X-Originating-IP: [135.70.242.195] Message-ID: <4CFFE879.8010402@att.com> Date: Wed, 08 Dec 2010 15:20:09 -0500 From: Tony Hansen User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 6.0; en-US; rv:1.9.2.12) Gecko/20101027 Thunderbird/3.1.6 MIME-Version: 1.0 To: iesg@ietf.org, tools-discuss@ietf.org References: <6F75CE6F0178486BBF6289675D1BE732@23FX1C1> <44B96A5F-2C74-43F6-9888-FAD0B6EDA360@nostrum.com> In-Reply-To: <44B96A5F-2C74-43F6-9888-FAD0B6EDA360@nostrum.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: Re: [Tools-discuss] include-text X-BeenThere: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF Tools Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 08 Dec 2010 20:19:06 -0000 Just say no. I switched back to using tools.ietf.org/html for all documents. It doesn't have this problem and does more of the things I want it to do. Tony On 12/8/2010 3:02 PM, Robert Sparks wrote: > This is really getting in my way and I would also like to see it expedited. > > RjS > > On Dec 8, 2010, at 10:41 AM, David Harrington wrote: > >> Hi, >> >> IIRC, Henrick said the next revision of the datatracker tool would >> allow people to choose different defaults for the include-text >> parameter. Can we please expedite this? >> >> I find the current setting, where I only get the first page, to be >> tremendously inconvenient, since I now have to click through multiple >> screens to be able to print the document, and then click back through >> multiple screens to get back to the datatracker page I started from. >> >> Also, since the top of the partial document page doesn't indicate the >> whole text is not present, I find it misleading. This has led me to >> make bad assumptions when I print out only the first page, or I search >> for something and find no instances in the document. Luckily, mnay of >> these times it is obvious to me that there should be at least one >> instance (or the printout is too short), so I realize I must only have >> the first page of the document. >> >> This is a real time-waster for me. I can only hope that those who >> requested this feature are getting some good benefit from it. I'm not. >> >> Can we either revert to the old approach, or get the customizable >> version deployed? >> >> Thanks, >> David Harrington >> Director, IETF Transport Area >> ietfdbh@comcast.net (preferred for ietf) >> dbharrington@huaweisymantec.com >> +1 603 828 1401 (cell) >> > _______________________________________________ > Tools-discuss mailing list > Tools-discuss@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/tools-discuss From sm@resistor.net Wed Dec 8 15:30:01 2010 Return-Path: X-Original-To: tools-discuss@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: tools-discuss@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id AC0673A68BA for ; Wed, 8 Dec 2010 15:30:01 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -103.45 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-103.45 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.149, BAYES_00=-2.599, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW=-1, USER_IN_WHITELIST=-100] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id AiWT18pSoSux for ; Wed, 8 Dec 2010 15:29:55 -0800 (PST) Received: from ns1.qubic.net (ns1.qubic.net [208.69.177.116]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id A48B73A6868 for ; Wed, 8 Dec 2010 15:29:55 -0800 (PST) Received: from SUBMAN.resistor.net ([10.0.0.1]) (authenticated bits=0) by ns1.qubic.net (8.14.5.Alpha0/8.14.5.Alpha0) with ESMTP id oB8NVCp1019374 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=NO); Wed, 8 Dec 2010 15:31:19 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=simple/simple; d=opendkim.org; s=mail2010; t=1291851083; x=1291937483; bh=CgxbSHM3QFPufRYOCbCooqLJ/okLTWejQXpoWf+9wQc=; h=Message-Id:Date:To:From:Subject:Cc:In-Reply-To:References: Mime-Version:Content-Type:Cc; b=VeKF5kz8/jtDECe2bBtkubPBzpRiC1sfWbIUf3Y5AkIxg+B2kgdfSQEsEybUH7/Xo nSxi6kOim0/z/bAO3K7+uVJmXmnAxmPlzf9eY7Dun5sL/kQReMZsuNgZpSnFWinPzM AqZjXHRk00eOebcz5w0qwr1DWY4UZUdJ7jTKoLQw= DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=simple/simple; d=resistor.net; s=mail; t=1291851083; x=1291937483; bh=CgxbSHM3QFPufRYOCbCooqLJ/okLTWejQXpoWf+9wQc=; h=Message-Id:Date:To:From:Subject:Cc:In-Reply-To:References: Mime-Version:Content-Type:Cc; b=f9TL5enq0KyFq44LhdHVgalLEZRf7I/hpPMNtwhjhkvF1ViYdE0XQcVuA+qKdq0+H iK5xuKMVe9ZSMs8VkInxlNXy8gawveGDhPWObK5i4WY1cDjOtAsjKQVttVkboetVQE QikZkQZpKRJ+GiQpKfDPXCVsZuMY2D55PjXaXbQU= DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; s=mail; d=resistor.net; c=simple; q=dns; b=u1aYCPh/P42mf6DAIZ/murFlSGC+iMsVnnJWB1Qdp7q06n4vpAnPc+P1huO5EhPxz 3zpubjCZLPv7ICY7PDXiuLax9a50O7902bUc9Hu6SdioNM4RjXwsRVdcFwAqf6XvB+A y1DhKizvL/1bL+Zu6flqrTjo4BZYGWhx3T1jatQ= Message-Id: <6.2.5.6.2.20101208145945.0d18a330@resistor.net> X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 6.2.5.6 Date: Wed, 08 Dec 2010 15:30:21 -0800 To: Lars Eggert From: SM In-Reply-To: <93354F9C-0172-4FB6-86F4-FB72AF511033@nokia.com> References: <72281A42-683F-4C0B-B1D6-AA7FCE518AD6@nokia.com> <6.2.5.6.2.20101208072618.0a4b1c58@resistor.net> <93354F9C-0172-4FB6-86F4-FB72AF511033@nokia.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed Cc: Tools Team Discussion Subject: Re: [Tools-discuss] Internet Draft Signatures X-BeenThere: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF Tools Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 08 Dec 2010 23:30:02 -0000 Hi Lars, At 11:25 08-12-10, Lars Eggert wrote: >Ah, good to know. Still, why didn't we use something that had a bit >wider tools support? I mean, I tried the most recent versions of >MacOS, FreeBSD and Ubuntu, and none of them can be used to verify >this out of the box? FreeBSD 8.1 has OpenSSL 0.9.8n. Version 1.0.0 is in ports. CMS is a Full Standard (STD 70). RFC 5485 specifies the conventions for digital signatures on Internet-Drafts. It would have been better to use something that had a bit of wider tools support. Hopefully, the vendors will catch up soon. Regards, -sm From housley@vigilsec.com Thu Dec 9 06:12:41 2010 Return-Path: X-Original-To: tools-discuss@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: tools-discuss@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 25FC83A6B17; Thu, 9 Dec 2010 06:12:41 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -102.558 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-102.558 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.041, BAYES_00=-2.599, USER_IN_WHITELIST=-100] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id HTxM4DI1vJ1l; Thu, 9 Dec 2010 06:12:40 -0800 (PST) Received: from odin.smetech.net (mail.smetech.net [208.254.26.82]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 401263A694E; Thu, 9 Dec 2010 06:12:40 -0800 (PST) Received: from localhost (unknown [208.254.26.81]) by odin.smetech.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8A21A9A47BF; Thu, 9 Dec 2010 09:14:09 -0500 (EST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at smetech.net Received: from odin.smetech.net ([208.254.26.82]) by localhost (ronin.smetech.net [208.254.26.81]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id DkxdOMrg0cBy; Thu, 9 Dec 2010 09:14:00 -0500 (EST) Received: from [128.31.34.232] (31-34-232.wireless.csail.mit.edu [128.31.34.232]) (using TLSv1 with cipher AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by odin.smetech.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 83A079A47BC; Thu, 9 Dec 2010 09:14:08 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <4D00E437.8010703@vigilsec.com> Date: Thu, 09 Dec 2010 09:14:15 -0500 From: Russ Housley User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.1; en-US; rv:1.9.2.12) Gecko/20101027 Lightning/1.0b2 Thunderbird/3.1.6 MIME-Version: 1.0 To: tools-discuss@ietf.org References: <20101208220838.12463.53600.idtracker@localhost> <047e01cb972e$69049970$3b0dcc50$@huawei.com> In-Reply-To: <047e01cb972e$69049970$3b0dcc50$@huawei.com> X-Enigmail-Version: 1.1.1 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Cc: 'The IESG' Subject: Re: [Tools-discuss] Tim Polk's No Objection on draft-ietf-proto-wgdocument-states-10 (with COMMENT) X-BeenThere: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF Tools Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 09 Dec 2010 14:12:41 -0000 I do not think that clearing a DISCUSS should generate a message at all unless the content of the COMMENT has changed. Russ On 12/8/2010 6:19 PM, Adrian Farrel wrote: > Folks, this subject line looks like a bug to me. > > The email thread will be about the COMMENT, not about the No Objection > > Cheers > Adrian > >> -----Original Message----- >> From: iesg-bounces@ietf.org [mailto:iesg-bounces@ietf.org] On Behalf Of Tim >> Polk >> Sent: 08 December 2010 22:09 >> To: The IESG >> Cc: edj.etc@gmail.com; draft-ietf-proto-wgdocument-states@tools.ietf.org >> Subject: Tim Polk's No Objection on draft-ietf-proto-wgdocument-states-10: >> (with COMMENT) >> >> Tim Polk has entered the following ballot position for >> draft-ietf-proto-wgdocument-states-10: No Objection >> >> When responding, please keep the subject line intact and reply to all >> email addresses included in the To and CC lines. (Feel free to cut this >> introductory paragraph, however.) >> >> Please refer to http://www.ietf.org/iesg/statement/discuss-criteria.html >> for more information about IESG DISCUSS and COMMENT positions. >> >> >> >> ---------------------------------------------------------------------- >> COMMENT: >> ---------------------------------------------------------------------- >> >> In section 3.1, the document state withdrawn is listed but is not defined and no >> reference is given. Text was added that indicated this is self-explanatory, but I >> must be dense since I still don't know what it means, >> >> I do not want to delay things further, though, and see no harm in moving forward >> with this text. > > From henrik@levkowetz.com Thu Dec 9 06:12:44 2010 Return-Path: X-Original-To: tools-discuss@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: tools-discuss@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id BDA2A3A6B1A; Thu, 9 Dec 2010 06:12:44 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -102.569 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-102.569 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.031, BAYES_00=-2.599, NO_RELAYS=-0.001, USER_IN_WHITELIST=-100] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id nGNn6U3No9IX; Thu, 9 Dec 2010 06:12:43 -0800 (PST) Received: from merlot.tools.ietf.org (merlot.tools.ietf.org [IPv6:2a01:3f0:0:31:214:22ff:fe21:bb]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id A5A253A6B19; Thu, 9 Dec 2010 06:12:43 -0800 (PST) Received: from brunello.autonomica.se ([2a01:3f0:1:0:21e:c2ff:fe13:7e3e]:57547 helo=dyn-fg124.sth.netnod.se) by merlot.tools.ietf.org with esmtpsa (TLS1.0:RSA_AES_256_CBC_SHA1:32) (Exim 4.72) (envelope-from ) id 1PQhE9-0001Mj-Mm; Thu, 09 Dec 2010 15:12:11 +0100 Message-ID: <4D00E3B9.2000605@levkowetz.com> Date: Thu, 09 Dec 2010 15:12:09 +0100 From: Henrik Levkowetz User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Macintosh; U; Intel Mac OS X 10.6; en-US; rv:1.9.2.12) Gecko/20101027 Thunderbird/3.1.6 MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Robert Sparks References: <6F75CE6F0178486BBF6289675D1BE732@23FX1C1> <44B96A5F-2C74-43F6-9888-FAD0B6EDA360@nostrum.com> In-Reply-To: <44B96A5F-2C74-43F6-9888-FAD0B6EDA360@nostrum.com> X-Enigmail-Version: 1.1.1 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-SA-Exim-Connect-IP: 2a01:3f0:1:0:21e:c2ff:fe13:7e3e X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rjsparks@nostrum.com, ietfdbh@comcast.net, iesg@ietf.org, tools-discuss@ietf.org, henrik-sent@levkowetz.com X-SA-Exim-Mail-From: henrik@levkowetz.com X-SA-Exim-Version: 4.2.1 (built Mon, 22 Mar 2010 06:51:10 +0000) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes (on merlot.tools.ietf.org) Cc: David Harrington , iesg@ietf.org, tools-discuss@ietf.org Subject: Re: [Tools-discuss] include-text X-BeenThere: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF Tools Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 09 Dec 2010 14:12:44 -0000 On 2010-12-08 21:02 Robert Sparks said: > This is really getting in my way and I would also like to see it expedited. The functionality is available in 3.10, released 2010-12-07. Go to this page and click on 'on' under 'Show full document text...' in order to flip the switch to always show the full document: http://datatracker.ietf.org/cookies/ I guess we should provide a link at the bottom of the abbreviated document pages to flip this switch, too. Henrik > RjS > > On Dec 8, 2010, at 10:41 AM, David Harrington wrote: > >> Hi, >> >> IIRC, Henrick said the next revision of the datatracker tool would >> allow people to choose different defaults for the include-text >> parameter. Can we please expedite this? >> >> I find the current setting, where I only get the first page, to be >> tremendously inconvenient, since I now have to click through multiple >> screens to be able to print the document, and then click back through >> multiple screens to get back to the datatracker page I started from. >> >> Also, since the top of the partial document page doesn't indicate the >> whole text is not present, I find it misleading. This has led me to >> make bad assumptions when I print out only the first page, or I search >> for something and find no instances in the document. Luckily, mnay of >> these times it is obvious to me that there should be at least one >> instance (or the printout is too short), so I realize I must only have >> the first page of the document. >> >> This is a real time-waster for me. I can only hope that those who >> requested this feature are getting some good benefit from it. I'm not. >> >> Can we either revert to the old approach, or get the customizable >> version deployed? >> >> Thanks, >> David Harrington >> Director, IETF Transport Area >> ietfdbh@comcast.net (preferred for ietf) >> dbharrington@huaweisymantec.com >> +1 603 828 1401 (cell) >> > > _______________________________________________ > Tools-discuss mailing list > Tools-discuss@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/tools-discuss > From henrik@levkowetz.com Thu Dec 9 06:15:32 2010 Return-Path: X-Original-To: tools-discuss@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: tools-discuss@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 260EF3A6B24 for ; Thu, 9 Dec 2010 06:15:32 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -102.572 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-102.572 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.028, BAYES_00=-2.599, NO_RELAYS=-0.001, USER_IN_WHITELIST=-100] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 9fpUphQjx6N7 for ; Thu, 9 Dec 2010 06:15:31 -0800 (PST) Received: from merlot.tools.ietf.org (merlot.tools.ietf.org [IPv6:2a01:3f0:0:31:214:22ff:fe21:bb]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id AED323A69B5 for ; Thu, 9 Dec 2010 06:15:30 -0800 (PST) Received: from brunello.autonomica.se ([2a01:3f0:1:0:21e:c2ff:fe13:7e3e]:57599 helo=dyn-fg124.sth.netnod.se) by merlot.tools.ietf.org with esmtpsa (TLS1.0:RSA_AES_256_CBC_SHA1:32) (Exim 4.72) (envelope-from ) id 1PQhIa-0005a8-Ji; Thu, 09 Dec 2010 15:16:48 +0100 Message-ID: <4D00E4CC.6090703@levkowetz.com> Date: Thu, 09 Dec 2010 15:16:44 +0100 From: Henrik Levkowetz User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Macintosh; U; Intel Mac OS X 10.6; en-US; rv:1.9.2.12) Gecko/20101027 Thunderbird/3.1.6 MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Thomas Morin References: <4CF62952.1050304@orange-ftgroup.com> In-Reply-To: <4CF62952.1050304@orange-ftgroup.com> X-Enigmail-Version: 1.1.1 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-SA-Exim-Connect-IP: 2a01:3f0:1:0:21e:c2ff:fe13:7e3e X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: thomas.morin@orange-ftgroup.com, tools-discuss@ietf.org, henrik-sent@levkowetz.com X-SA-Exim-Mail-From: henrik@levkowetz.com X-SA-Exim-Version: 4.2.1 (built Mon, 22 Mar 2010 06:51:10 +0000) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes (on merlot.tools.ietf.org) Cc: tools-discuss@ietf.org Subject: Re: [Tools-discuss] Two issues on draft-...@tools.ietf.org aliases X-BeenThere: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF Tools Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 09 Dec 2010 14:15:32 -0000 Hi Thomas, On 2010-12-01 11:54 Thomas Morin said: > Hi, > > Here is a mailer-daemon I had when writing to > draft-ietf-mpls-mp-ldp-reqs@tools.ietf. > > There are two issues appearing : > > 1) this mail was re-sent by the tools server re-using my address as > sender, and among the receivers are some colleagues from my company; but > the mail server of my company seems to reject mail coming into it with a > sender address of somebody inside the company ; this seems like an issue > that mailing list engine resolve properly (possibly thanks to the > "Sender" SMTP header?) -- could such a fix, or another relevant one, be > applied to draft aliases ? I don't know what the right thing to do here is. If somebody can describe the proper solution to this, I'll implement it. > 2) the email address for one of the authors is the old address that was > present in a early version of the dratf (luyuanfang@att.com ); the new > address for this co-author (lufang@cisco.com) is not used by the > tools.ietf.org engine even though it's been present in the recent > version of the draft (since March 2007) ; is this a known issue ? a > design limitation ? This was a bug, and it was resolved shortly after you sent the message. Sorry for the delay in responding. Regards, Henrik > Thanks, > > -Thomas > > > -------- Message original -------- > Sujet: Mail delivery failed: returning message to sender > Date : Wed, 01 Dec 2010 02:43:20 -0800 > De : Mail Delivery System > Pour : thomas.morin@orange-ftgroup.com > > > > This message was created automatically by mail delivery software. > > A message that you sent could not be delivered to one or more of its > recipients. This is a permanent error. The following address(es) failed: > > vincent.parfait@orange-ftgroup.com > (generated from draft-ietf-mpls-mp-ldp-reqs@tools.ietf.org) > SMTP error from remote mail server after MAIL FROM: SIZE=3943: > host relais-ias89.francetelecom.com [193.251.215.89]: > 554 5.7.1: Sender address rejected: > domain use is reserved > thomas.morin@orange-ftgroup.com > (generated from draft-ietf-mpls-mp-ldp-reqs@tools.ietf.org) > SMTP error from remote mail server after MAIL FROM: SIZE=3943: > host relais-ias89.francetelecom.com [193.251.215.89]: > 554 5.7.1: Sender address rejected: > domain use is reserved > jeanlouis.leroux@orange-ftgroup.com > (generated from draft-ietf-mpls-mp-ldp-reqs@tools.ietf.org) > SMTP error from remote mail server after MAIL FROM: SIZE=3943: > host relais-ias89.francetelecom.com [193.251.215.89]: > 554 5.7.1: Sender address rejected: > domain use is reserved > luyuanfang@att.com > (generated from draft-ietf-mpls-mp-ldp-reqs@tools.ietf.org) > SMTP error from remote mail server after RCPT > TO:: > host cluster7.us.messagelabs.com [216.82.253.179]: > 550 Invalid recipient (#5.1.1) > > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > Tools-discuss mailing list > Tools-discuss@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/tools-discuss From rjsparks@nostrum.com Thu Dec 9 06:59:24 2010 Return-Path: X-Original-To: tools-discuss@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: tools-discuss@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7FA8628C121; Thu, 9 Dec 2010 06:59:24 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -102.495 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-102.495 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.105, BAYES_00=-2.599, SPF_PASS=-0.001, USER_IN_WHITELIST=-100] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id pb+u8FvPY4yL; Thu, 9 Dec 2010 06:59:23 -0800 (PST) Received: from nostrum.com (nostrum-pt.tunnel.tserv2.fmt.ipv6.he.net [IPv6:2001:470:1f03:267::2]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id E21D528C0EA; Thu, 9 Dec 2010 06:59:22 -0800 (PST) Received: from [192.168.2.105] (pool-173-71-48-4.dllstx.fios.verizon.net [173.71.48.4]) (authenticated bits=0) by nostrum.com (8.14.3/8.14.3) with ESMTP id oB9F0oQO061709 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=AES128-SHA bits=128 verify=NO); Thu, 9 Dec 2010 09:00:50 -0600 (CST) (envelope-from rjsparks@nostrum.com) Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v1082) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii From: Robert Sparks In-Reply-To: <4D00E3B9.2000605@levkowetz.com> Date: Thu, 9 Dec 2010 09:00:50 -0600 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Message-Id: References: <6F75CE6F0178486BBF6289675D1BE732@23FX1C1> <44B96A5F-2C74-43F6-9888-FAD0B6EDA360@nostrum.com> <4D00E3B9.2000605@levkowetz.com> To: Henrik Levkowetz X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.1082) Received-SPF: pass (nostrum.com: 173.71.48.4 is authenticated by a trusted mechanism) Cc: David Harrington , iesg@ietf.org, tools-discuss@ietf.org Subject: Re: [Tools-discuss] include-text X-BeenThere: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF Tools Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 09 Dec 2010 14:59:24 -0000 Thanks Henrik! RjS On Dec 9, 2010, at 8:12 AM, Henrik Levkowetz wrote: >=20 >=20 > On 2010-12-08 21:02 Robert Sparks said: >> This is really getting in my way and I would also like to see it = expedited. >=20 > The functionality is available in 3.10, released 2010-12-07. Go to = this > page and click on 'on' under 'Show full document text...' in order to = flip > the switch to always show the full document: >=20 > http://datatracker.ietf.org/cookies/ >=20 > I guess we should provide a link at the bottom of the abbreviated = document > pages to flip this switch, too. >=20 >=20 > Henrik >=20 >> RjS >>=20 >> On Dec 8, 2010, at 10:41 AM, David Harrington wrote: >>=20 >>> Hi, >>>=20 >>> IIRC, Henrick said the next revision of the datatracker tool would >>> allow people to choose different defaults for the include-text >>> parameter. Can we please expedite this? >>>=20 >>> I find the current setting, where I only get the first page, to be >>> tremendously inconvenient, since I now have to click through = multiple >>> screens to be able to print the document, and then click back = through >>> multiple screens to get back to the datatracker page I started from. >>>=20 >>> Also, since the top of the partial document page doesn't indicate = the >>> whole text is not present, I find it misleading. This has led me to >>> make bad assumptions when I print out only the first page, or I = search >>> for something and find no instances in the document. Luckily, mnay = of >>> these times it is obvious to me that there should be at least one >>> instance (or the printout is too short), so I realize I must only = have >>> the first page of the document.=20 >>>=20 >>> This is a real time-waster for me. I can only hope that those who >>> requested this feature are getting some good benefit from it. I'm = not. >>>=20 >>> Can we either revert to the old approach, or get the customizable >>> version deployed? >>>=20 >>> Thanks, >>> David Harrington >>> Director, IETF Transport Area >>> ietfdbh@comcast.net (preferred for ietf) >>> dbharrington@huaweisymantec.com >>> +1 603 828 1401 (cell) >>>=20 >>=20 >> _______________________________________________ >> Tools-discuss mailing list >> Tools-discuss@ietf.org >> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/tools-discuss >>=20 From tony@att.com Thu Dec 9 07:43:37 2010 Return-Path: X-Original-To: tools-discuss@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: tools-discuss@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 485693A6B56 for ; Thu, 9 Dec 2010 07:43:37 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -106.489 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-106.489 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.110, BAYES_00=-2.599, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-4, USER_IN_WHITELIST=-100] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id kCAytMM3OyZi for ; Thu, 9 Dec 2010 07:43:36 -0800 (PST) Received: from mail121.messagelabs.com (mail121.messagelabs.com [216.82.242.3]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2FFBB3A6B5A for ; Thu, 9 Dec 2010 07:43:36 -0800 (PST) X-VirusChecked: Checked X-Env-Sender: tony@att.com X-Msg-Ref: server-9.tower-121.messagelabs.com!1291909487!45490445!1 X-StarScan-Version: 6.2.9; banners=-,-,- X-Originating-IP: [144.160.20.145] Received: (qmail 8893 invoked from network); 9 Dec 2010 15:44:48 -0000 Received: from sbcsmtp6.sbc.com (HELO mlpd192.enaf.sfdc.sbc.com) (144.160.20.145) by server-9.tower-121.messagelabs.com with DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA encrypted SMTP; 9 Dec 2010 15:44:48 -0000 Received: from enaf.sfdc.sbc.com (localhost.localdomain [127.0.0.1]) by mlpd192.enaf.sfdc.sbc.com (8.14.4/8.14.4) with ESMTP id oB9Fj73n023370 for ; Thu, 9 Dec 2010 10:45:07 -0500 Received: from alpd052.aldc.att.com (alpd052.aldc.att.com [130.8.42.31]) by mlpd192.enaf.sfdc.sbc.com (8.14.4/8.14.4) with ESMTP id oB9Fj15s023270 for ; Thu, 9 Dec 2010 10:45:02 -0500 Received: from aldc.att.com (localhost.localdomain [127.0.0.1]) by alpd052.aldc.att.com (8.14.4/8.14.4) with ESMTP id oB9FigGS031487 for ; Thu, 9 Dec 2010 10:44:42 -0500 Received: from mailgw1.maillennium.att.com (dns.maillennium.att.com [135.25.114.99]) by alpd052.aldc.att.com (8.14.4/8.14.4) with ESMTP id oB9FibFc031247 for ; Thu, 9 Dec 2010 10:44:38 -0500 Received: from [135.70.114.25] (vpn-135-70-114-25.vpn.swst.att.com[135.70.114.25]) by maillennium.att.com (mailgw1) with ESMTP id <20101209154437gw1004lkute> (Authid: tony); Thu, 9 Dec 2010 15:44:37 +0000 X-Originating-IP: [135.70.114.25] Message-ID: <4D00F964.3010804@att.com> Date: Thu, 09 Dec 2010 10:44:36 -0500 From: Tony Hansen User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 6.0; en-US; rv:1.9.2.12) Gecko/20101027 Thunderbird/3.1.6 MIME-Version: 1.0 To: tools-discuss@ietf.org References: <6F75CE6F0178486BBF6289675D1BE732@23FX1C1> <44B96A5F-2C74-43F6-9888-FAD0B6EDA360@nostrum.com> <4D00E3B9.2000605@levkowetz.com> In-Reply-To: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: Re: [Tools-discuss] include-text X-BeenThere: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF Tools Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 09 Dec 2010 15:43:37 -0000 +1 On 12/9/2010 10:00 AM, Robert Sparks wrote: > Thanks Henrik! > > RjS > > On Dec 9, 2010, at 8:12 AM, Henrik Levkowetz wrote: > >> >> On 2010-12-08 21:02 Robert Sparks said: >>> This is really getting in my way and I would also like to see it expedited. >> The functionality is available in 3.10, released 2010-12-07. Go to this >> page and click on 'on' under 'Show full document text...' in order to flip >> the switch to always show the full document: >> >> http://datatracker.ietf.org/cookies/ >> >> I guess we should provide a link at the bottom of the abbreviated document >> pages to flip this switch, too. >> >> >> Henrik >> >>> RjS >>> >>> On Dec 8, 2010, at 10:41 AM, David Harrington wrote: >>> >>>> Hi, >>>> >>>> IIRC, Henrick said the next revision of the datatracker tool would >>>> allow people to choose different defaults for the include-text >>>> parameter. Can we please expedite this? >>>> >>>> I find the current setting, where I only get the first page, to be >>>> tremendously inconvenient, since I now have to click through multiple >>>> screens to be able to print the document, and then click back through >>>> multiple screens to get back to the datatracker page I started from. >>>> >>>> Also, since the top of the partial document page doesn't indicate the >>>> whole text is not present, I find it misleading. This has led me to >>>> make bad assumptions when I print out only the first page, or I search >>>> for something and find no instances in the document. Luckily, mnay of >>>> these times it is obvious to me that there should be at least one >>>> instance (or the printout is too short), so I realize I must only have >>>> the first page of the document. >>>> >>>> This is a real time-waster for me. I can only hope that those who >>>> requested this feature are getting some good benefit from it. I'm not. >>>> >>>> Can we either revert to the old approach, or get the customizable >>>> version deployed? >>>> >>>> Thanks, >>>> David Harrington >>>> Director, IETF Transport Area >>>> ietfdbh@comcast.net (preferred for ietf) >>>> dbharrington@huaweisymantec.com >>>> +1 603 828 1401 (cell) >>>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> Tools-discuss mailing list >>> Tools-discuss@ietf.org >>> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/tools-discuss >>> > _______________________________________________ > Tools-discuss mailing list > Tools-discuss@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/tools-discuss From tme@americafree.tv Tue Nov 30 06:33:56 2010 Return-Path: X-Original-To: tools-discuss@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: tools-discuss@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5B2F828C135; Tue, 30 Nov 2010 06:33:56 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -101.961 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-101.961 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.638, BAYES_00=-2.599, USER_IN_WHITELIST=-100] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id YqFPJZodg005; Tue, 30 Nov 2010 06:33:54 -0800 (PST) Received: from mail.americafree.tv (rossini.americafree.tv [63.105.122.34]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8D7333A6C5E; Tue, 30 Nov 2010 06:33:53 -0800 (PST) Received: from [IPv6:::1] (rossini.americafree.tv [63.105.122.34]) by mail.americafree.tv (Postfix) with ESMTP id 77648955CE49; Tue, 30 Nov 2010 09:35:04 -0500 (EST) Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v1081) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii From: Marshall Eubanks In-Reply-To: <4CF506EC.4020909@levkowetz.com> Date: Tue, 30 Nov 2010 09:35:04 -0500 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Message-Id: References: <4CE2CC11.3000206@bell-labs.com> <4CE2CE0F.7020604@bell-labs.com> <4CECDB59.4020509@cisco.com> <34AC4C9D87A14575A7D4FA6471F9C96E@23FX1C1> <4CED410A.9080107@att.com> <4CF202E4.8040405@bogus.com> <4CF506EC.4020909@levkowetz.com> To: Henrik Levkowetz X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.1081) X-Mailman-Approved-At: Thu, 09 Dec 2010 08:12:32 -0800 Cc: Joel Jaeggli , wgchairs@ietf.org, Tools Team Discussion Subject: Re: [Tools-discuss] Audio from IETF-79? X-BeenThere: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF Tools Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 30 Nov 2010 14:33:56 -0000 On Nov 30, 2010, at 9:15 AM, Henrik Levkowetz wrote: >=20 > On 2010-11-28 08:21 Joel Jaeggli said: >> On 11/24/10 8:44 AM, Tony Hansen wrote: >>> I'm thinking that after the time for a meeting is past, the speaker = icon >>> in the agenda could point to the archive location, possibly with a >>> change to the icon to indicate that it's now pointing at the archive >>> instead of the stream. >>>=20 >>> Henrik, thoughts? >>=20 >> the general thought was the existing name scheme is not sufficiently >> normalized to support that, it could potentially be however up to a >> point. the recorders postpend .# in ordering to keep from overwriting >> prexisting recordings, which happens if the recording is start and >> stopped, the recorder crashes or environmental hazards (like someone >> unplugging it occur). >=20 > It is as Joel says. The naming scheme for the recordings is = insufficiently > consistent over time and insufficiently well mapped to the meeting = slots > to easily (automatically) point to the right recording. I've tried to = scratch > this itch several times, but every time I've balked at the amount of = manual > work needed to normalize the naming scheme to something useful. Would it be a reasonable amount of work to set something up something = like this going forward (i.e., only for future meetings, and not worrying about ease of use of the past) ?=20= The need for audio recordings peaks about 1 month after the meeting, so = starting in Prague =20 would capture most of the need for the future.=20 Regards Marshall >=20 > Best, >=20 > Henrik >=20 >=20 >>> Tony Hansen >>> tony@att.com >>>=20 >>> On 11/24/2010 7:21 AM, David Harrington wrote: >>>> Hi, >>>>=20 >>>> The little speaker next to the agenda is the link to the live >>>> streaming. You need the archive. >>>>=20 >>>> =46rom http://www.ietf.org/ select Audio Archives (under previous = meeting) >>>> which leads to http://www.ietf.org/audio/ietf79/ >>>> Then look for the entry with ch4 for wed am. >>>> Unfortunately, I don't see such a listing, which makes me think it >>>> might not have been recorded. >>>>=20 >>>> dbh >>>>=20 >>>>=20 >>>> = ------------------------------------------------------------------------ >>>> *From:* wgchairs-bounces@ietf.org >>>> [mailto:wgchairs-bounces@ietf.org] *On Behalf Of *Benoit Claise >>>> *Sent:* Wednesday, November 24, 2010 4:31 AM >>>> *To:* Vijay K. Gurbani >>>> *Cc:* wgchairs@ietf.org >>>> *Subject:* Re: Audio from IETF-79? >>>>=20 >>>> Hi, >>>>=20 >>>> Historically, finding the audio has always been a source of >>>> frustration for me. >>>> Once I found the web site (thanks Vijay), then what is the right >>>> channel? >>>> Simple example: I want to listen to IPFIX, which was on Wed >>>> morning in Jade 1. >>>> I guess that the right channel is the number 4 because I see 4 = in >>>> the URL next to Jade1 at >>>> http://www.ietf.org/meeting/79/remote-participation.html >>>>=20 >>>>=20 >>>> Audio Streaming >>>>=20 >>>> Room Audio >>>> Emerald = http://videolab.uoregon.edu/events/ietf/ietf791.m3u >>>> Garden Ballroom 1 >>>> http://videolab.uoregon.edu/events/ietf/ietf792.m3u >>>> Garden Ballroom 3 >>>> http://videolab.uoregon.edu/events/ietf/ietf793.m3u >>>> Jade 1 http://videolab.uoregon.edu/events/ietf/ietf794.m3u >>>> Pearl http://videolab.uoregon.edu/events/ietf/ietf795.m3u >>>> Valley Ballroom A >>>> http://videolab.uoregon.edu/events/ietf/ietf796.m3u >>>> Valley Ballroom B >>>> http://videolab.uoregon.edu/events/ietf/ietf797.m3u >>>> Valley Ballroom C >>>> http://videolab.uoregon.edu/events/ietf/ietf798.m3u >>>>=20 >>>>=20 >>>> So looking for channel 4 wed morning at >>>> http://videolab.uoregon.edu/events/ietf doesn't return = anything... >>>> Note: on http://tools.ietf.org/agenda/79/, the little speaker = next >>>> to the WG doesn't produced anything for me. >>>>=20 >>>> I should be missing something obvious, but I would not like to = die >>>> stupid ;-) >>>>=20 >>>> Regards, Benoit. >>>>=20 >>>>> On 11/16/2010 12:24 PM, David A. Bryan wrote: >>>>>> Thanks! >>>>>>=20 >>>>>> At risk of really looking stupid (but I'll risk it since there >>>>>> are so >>>>>> many other reasons I look stupid all the time ;) )...how did = you >>>>>> know >>>>>> this/find it on the IETF page? >>>>>=20 >>>>> Navigate to the main IETF 79 page >>>>> (http://www.ietf.org/meeting/79/index.html). >>>>>=20 >>>>> =46rom there, click on "Remote Participation (Audio, Jabber, = WebEx) >>>>> link. >>>>>=20 >>>>> =46rom there, cut any of the streaming audio links --- >>>>> http://videolab.uoregon.edu/events/ietf/ietf791.m3u will do.=20 >>>>> Strip the >>>>> tail end of the resource to get to >>>>> http://videolab.uoregon.edu/events/ietf and from there you have >>>>> a link to the raw archives (all the way at the bottom.) >>>>>=20 >>>>> I agree ... not intuitive. >>>>>=20 >>>>> Ciao, >>>>>=20 >>>>> - vijay >>>>=20 >>=20 >>=20 >=20 From tme@americafree.tv Tue Nov 30 08:59:50 2010 Return-Path: X-Original-To: tools-discuss@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: tools-discuss@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id BB98528C10E; Tue, 30 Nov 2010 08:59:50 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -101.969 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-101.969 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.630, BAYES_00=-2.599, USER_IN_WHITELIST=-100] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id xAkmPk3qgrg5; Tue, 30 Nov 2010 08:59:49 -0800 (PST) Received: from mail.americafree.tv (rossini.americafree.tv [63.105.122.34]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id EAC6C28C0F9; Tue, 30 Nov 2010 08:59:48 -0800 (PST) Received: from [IPv6:::1] (rossini.americafree.tv [63.105.122.34]) by mail.americafree.tv (Postfix) with ESMTP id B0D7E955FD90; Tue, 30 Nov 2010 12:01:00 -0500 (EST) Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v1081) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii From: Marshall Eubanks In-Reply-To: <4CF52B97.10502@levkowetz.com> Date: Tue, 30 Nov 2010 12:01:00 -0500 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Message-Id: <75EF1F11-0313-4924-AC65-984011A2C9FC@americafree.tv> References: <4CE2CC11.3000206@bell-labs.com> <4CE2CE0F.7020604@bell-labs.com> <4CECDB59.4020509@cisco.com> <34AC4C9D87A14575A7D4FA6471F9C96E@23FX1C1> <4CED410A.9080107@att.com> <4CF202E4.8040405@bogus.com> <4CF506EC.4020909@levkowetz.com> <4CF52B97.10502@levkowetz.com> To: Henrik Levkowetz X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.1081) X-Mailman-Approved-At: Thu, 09 Dec 2010 08:12:32 -0800 Cc: Joel Jaeggli , wgchairs@ietf.org, Tools Team Discussion Subject: Re: [Tools-discuss] Audio from IETF-79? X-BeenThere: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF Tools Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 30 Nov 2010 16:59:50 -0000 On Nov 30, 2010, at 11:51 AM, Henrik Levkowetz wrote: > Hi Marshall, >=20 > On 2010-11-30 15:35 Marshall Eubanks said: >>=20 >> On Nov 30, 2010, at 9:15 AM, Henrik Levkowetz wrote: >>=20 >>>=20 >>> On 2010-11-28 08:21 Joel Jaeggli said: >>>> On 11/24/10 8:44 AM, Tony Hansen wrote: >>>>> I'm thinking that after the time for a meeting is past, the = speaker icon >>>>> in the agenda could point to the archive location, possibly with a >>>>> change to the icon to indicate that it's now pointing at the = archive >>>>> instead of the stream. >>>>>=20 >>>>> Henrik, thoughts? >>>>=20 >>>> the general thought was the existing name scheme is not = sufficiently >>>> normalized to support that, it could potentially be however up to a >>>> point. the recorders postpend .# in ordering to keep from = overwriting >>>> prexisting recordings, which happens if the recording is start and >>>> stopped, the recorder crashes or environmental hazards (like = someone >>>> unplugging it occur). >>>=20 >>> It is as Joel says. The naming scheme for the recordings is = insufficiently >>> consistent over time and insufficiently well mapped to the meeting = slots >>> to easily (automatically) point to the right recording. I've tried = to scratch >>> this itch several times, but every time I've balked at the amount of = manual >>> work needed to normalize the naming scheme to something useful. >>=20 >> Would it be a reasonable amount of work to set something up something = like this going forward (i.e., only >> for future meetings, and not worrying about ease of use of the past) = ?=20 >>=20 >> The need for audio recordings peaks about 1 month after the meeting, = so starting in Prague =20 >> would capture most of the need for the future.=20 >=20 > Looking at it from the viewpoint of connecting up a recording with a = WG > name, but keeping in mind that the audio people wouldn't want to keep > track of the actual WG names, I'd propose a naming following the = agenda's > timeslot names. These are 'Morning Session I', 'Morning Session II', > 'Afternoon Session I', 'Afternoon Session II' and 'Afternoon Session = III'. >=20 > Abbreviating this and merging with the current naming for meeting = number > and day, we would have for instance: >=20 > ietf80-ch1-mon-morning-i.mp3 > ietf80-ch1-mon-afternoon-i.mp3 > ietf80-ch1-mon-afternoon-ii.mp3 > ietf80-ch1-mon-afternoon-iii.mp3 > ietf80-ch1-tue-morning-i.mp3 >=20 I would propose a add on -=20 a - for the first segment of the session=20 b - for the second, etc. So, it might be ietf80-ch1-mon-morning-i-a.mp3 ietf80-ch1-mon-morning-i-b.mp3 ietf80-ch1-mon-morning-i-c.mp3 ietf80-ch1-mon-afternoon-i-a.mp3 That way, if the audio has a break or restart, it doesn't also break the = naming convention.=20 Regards Marshall > or alternatively, shorter: >=20 > ietf80-ch1-mon-am-i.mp3 > ietf80-ch1-mon-pm-i.mp3 > ietf80-ch1-mon-pm-ii.mp3 > ietf80-ch1-mon-pm-iii.mp3 > ietf80-ch1-tue-am-i.mp3 >=20 > etc. >=20 > The automatic appending of sequence numbers for re-started recordings > should work as it is with the schemes above. >=20 > The naming schema above seems to be close to what's currently in use, > but I'm not sure the current schema is quite as regular as the = proposed. > Also, in the current schema I always get a bit confused by seeing = 'noon', > which I guess is an abbreviation for afternoon, but it makes me think > of something related to 12 o'clock -- maybe the extra Thursday = lectures... >=20 > However, it is still the people who manage the audio recordings who = will > have to split and name the recordings to match the above; and they = should > have the last word on whether this is feasible and makes sense. >=20 >=20 > Best, >=20 > Henrik >=20 >=20 From Adrian.Farrel@huawei.com Wed Dec 8 15:18:22 2010 Return-Path: X-Original-To: tools-discuss@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: tools-discuss@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4CC563A69A4; Wed, 8 Dec 2010 15:18:22 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -105.408 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-105.408 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=1.191, BAYES_00=-2.599, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-4, USER_IN_WHITELIST=-100] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id nfenBStcn+TF; Wed, 8 Dec 2010 15:18:21 -0800 (PST) Received: from usaga03-in.huawei.com (usaga03-in.huawei.com [206.16.17.220]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8DF3E3A686B; Wed, 8 Dec 2010 15:18:21 -0800 (PST) Received: from huawei.com (usaga03-in [172.18.4.17]) by usaga03-in.huawei.com (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 2.14 (built Aug 8 2006)) with ESMTP id <0LD400GKXU51HA@usaga03-in.huawei.com>; Wed, 08 Dec 2010 17:19:49 -0600 (CST) Received: from 950129200 (dsl-sp-81-140-15-32.in-addr.broadbandscope.com [81.140.15.32]) by usaga03-in.huawei.com (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 2.14 (built Aug 8 2006)) with ESMTPA id <0LD400GP5U4ZV3@usaga03-in.huawei.com>; Wed, 08 Dec 2010 17:19:49 -0600 (CST) Date: Wed, 08 Dec 2010 23:19:47 +0000 From: Adrian Farrel In-reply-to: <20101208220838.12463.53600.idtracker@localhost> To: 'Tim Polk' , 'The IESG' Message-id: <047e01cb972e$69049970$3b0dcc50$@huawei.com> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook 14.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-language: en-gb Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Thread-index: AQJmloqrykE1zh/LIMQBRIyyEfEEyZJhL3PQ References: <20101208220838.12463.53600.idtracker@localhost> X-Mailman-Approved-At: Thu, 09 Dec 2010 08:12:32 -0800 Cc: tools-discuss@ietf.org Subject: Re: [Tools-discuss] Tim Polk's No Objection on draft-ietf-proto-wgdocument-states-10: (with COMMENT) X-BeenThere: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list Reply-To: Adrian.Farrel@huawei.com List-Id: IETF Tools Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 08 Dec 2010 23:18:22 -0000 Folks, this subject line looks like a bug to me. The email thread will be about the COMMENT, not about the No Objection Cheers Adrian > -----Original Message----- > From: iesg-bounces@ietf.org [mailto:iesg-bounces@ietf.org] On Behalf Of Tim > Polk > Sent: 08 December 2010 22:09 > To: The IESG > Cc: edj.etc@gmail.com; draft-ietf-proto-wgdocument-states@tools.ietf.org > Subject: Tim Polk's No Objection on draft-ietf-proto-wgdocument-states-10: > (with COMMENT) > > Tim Polk has entered the following ballot position for > draft-ietf-proto-wgdocument-states-10: No Objection > > When responding, please keep the subject line intact and reply to all > email addresses included in the To and CC lines. (Feel free to cut this > introductory paragraph, however.) > > Please refer to http://www.ietf.org/iesg/statement/discuss-criteria.html > for more information about IESG DISCUSS and COMMENT positions. > > > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------- > COMMENT: > ---------------------------------------------------------------------- > > In section 3.1, the document state withdrawn is listed but is not defined and no > reference is given. Text was added that indicated this is self-explanatory, but I > must be dense since I still don't know what it means, > > I do not want to delay things further, though, and see no harm in moving forward > with this text. From dromasca@avaya.com Thu Dec 9 07:01:44 2010 Return-Path: X-Original-To: tools-discuss@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: tools-discuss@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2A2EE28C0F3; Thu, 9 Dec 2010 07:01:44 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -102.535 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-102.535 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.064, BAYES_00=-2.599, USER_IN_WHITELIST=-100] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id LzQ3gV0GUmhU; Thu, 9 Dec 2010 07:01:42 -0800 (PST) Received: from de307622-de-outbound.net.avaya.com (de307622-de-outbound.net.avaya.com [198.152.71.100]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id DE91F28C0EA; Thu, 9 Dec 2010 07:01:41 -0800 (PST) X-IronPort-Anti-Spam-Filtered: true X-IronPort-Anti-Spam-Result: AlgFAK9+AE3GmAcF/2dsb2JhbACYP4s8eKZ2ApkYhUoEjieCWA X-IronPort-AV: E=Sophos;i="4.59,320,1288584000"; d="scan'208";a="222411625" Received: from unknown (HELO co300216-co-erhwest.avaya.com) ([198.152.7.5]) by de307622-de-outbound.net.avaya.com with ESMTP; 09 Dec 2010 10:03:10 -0500 X-IronPort-AV: E=Sophos;i="4.59,320,1288584000"; d="scan'208";a="552934425" Received: from unknown (HELO 307622ANEX5.global.avaya.com) ([135.64.140.12]) by co300216-co-erhwest-out.avaya.com with ESMTP; 09 Dec 2010 10:03:09 -0500 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft Exchange V6.5 Content-class: urn:content-classes:message MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Date: Thu, 9 Dec 2010 16:02:56 +0100 Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <4D00E437.8010703@vigilsec.com> X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: Thread-Topic: Tim Polk's No Objection on draft-ietf-proto-wgdocument-states-10(with COMMENT) Thread-Index: AcuXq1yXo6UBKu64SfuwUguXy5Gt2QABnTfg References: <20101208220838.12463.53600.idtracker@localhost><047e01cb972e$69049970$3b0dcc50$@huawei.com> <4D00E437.8010703@vigilsec.com> From: "Romascanu, Dan (Dan)" To: "Russ Housley" , X-Mailman-Approved-At: Thu, 09 Dec 2010 08:12:32 -0800 Cc: The IESG Subject: Re: [Tools-discuss] Tim Polk's No Objection on draft-ietf-proto-wgdocument-states-10(with COMMENT) X-BeenThere: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF Tools Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 09 Dec 2010 15:01:44 -0000 Actually as shepherding AD I find useful to receive a message about a DISCUSS was cleared. Moreover, you can look at this as a change as the DISCUSS text disappears. =20 Dan > -----Original Message----- > From: iesg-bounces@ietf.org [mailto:iesg-bounces@ietf.org] On=20 > Behalf Of Russ Housley > Sent: Thursday, December 09, 2010 4:14 PM > To: tools-discuss@ietf.org > Cc: 'The IESG' > Subject: Re: Tim Polk's No Objection on=20 > draft-ietf-proto-wgdocument-states-10(with COMMENT) >=20 > I do not think that clearing a DISCUSS should generate a=20 > message at all unless the content of the COMMENT has changed. >=20 > Russ >=20 > On 12/8/2010 6:19 PM, Adrian Farrel wrote: > > Folks, this subject line looks like a bug to me.=20 > >=20 > > The email thread will be about the COMMENT, not about the=20 > No Objection > >=20 > > Cheers > > Adrian > >=20 > >> -----Original Message----- > >> From: iesg-bounces@ietf.org [mailto:iesg-bounces@ietf.org]=20 > On Behalf=20 > >> Of Tim Polk > >> Sent: 08 December 2010 22:09 > >> To: The IESG > >> Cc: edj.etc@gmail.com;=20 > >> draft-ietf-proto-wgdocument-states@tools.ietf.org > >> Subject: Tim Polk's No Objection on=20 > draft-ietf-proto-wgdocument-states-10: > >> (with COMMENT) > >> > >> Tim Polk has entered the following ballot position for > >> draft-ietf-proto-wgdocument-states-10: No Objection > >> > >> When responding, please keep the subject line intact and=20 > reply to all=20 > >> email addresses included in the To and CC lines. (Feel free to cut=20 > >> this introductory paragraph, however.) > >> > >> Please refer to=20 > >> http://www.ietf.org/iesg/statement/discuss-criteria.html > >> for more information about IESG DISCUSS and COMMENT positions. > >> > >> > >> > >>=20 > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > >> - > >> COMMENT: > >>=20 > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > >> - > >> > >> In section 3.1, the document state withdrawn is listed but is not=20 > >> defined and no reference is given. Text was added that indicated=20 > >> this is self-explanatory, but I must be dense since I still don't=20 > >> know what it means, > >> > >> I do not want to delay things further, though, and see no harm in=20 > >> moving forward with this text. > >=20 > >=20 >=20 From ietfdbh@comcast.net Thu Dec 9 11:26:22 2010 Return-Path: X-Original-To: tools-discuss@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: tools-discuss@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0EFA83A6994 for ; Thu, 9 Dec 2010 11:26:22 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -102.557 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-102.557 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.042, BAYES_00=-2.599, USER_IN_WHITELIST=-100] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id bOxEf2+AI0T1 for ; Thu, 9 Dec 2010 11:26:08 -0800 (PST) Received: from qmta02.westchester.pa.mail.comcast.net (qmta02.westchester.pa.mail.comcast.net [76.96.62.24]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 937CA28C144 for ; Thu, 9 Dec 2010 11:25:54 -0800 (PST) Received: from omta22.westchester.pa.mail.comcast.net ([76.96.62.73]) by qmta02.westchester.pa.mail.comcast.net with comcast id h6fo1f0041ap0As527TRGQ; Thu, 09 Dec 2010 19:27:25 +0000 Received: from 23FX1C1 ([67.189.235.106]) by omta22.westchester.pa.mail.comcast.net with comcast id h7TQ1f00A2JQnJT3i7TQx0; Thu, 09 Dec 2010 19:27:25 +0000 From: "David Harrington" To: "'Robert Sparks'" , "'Henrik Levkowetz'" References: <6F75CE6F0178486BBF6289675D1BE732@23FX1C1> <44B96A5F-2C74-43F6-9888-FAD0B6EDA360@nostrum.com> <4D00E3B9.2000605@levkowetz.com> Date: Thu, 9 Dec 2010 14:26:17 -0500 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: Microsoft Office Outlook 11 In-Reply-To: X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.5994 Thread-Index: AcuXsd81VanOUHz6RlOehknWxq3ETAAJRC3Q Cc: iesg@ietf.org, tools-discuss@ietf.org Subject: Re: [Tools-discuss] include-text X-BeenThere: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF Tools Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 09 Dec 2010 19:26:22 -0000 +1 dbh > -----Original Message----- > From: Robert Sparks [mailto:rjsparks@nostrum.com] > Sent: Thursday, December 09, 2010 10:01 AM > To: Henrik Levkowetz > Cc: David Harrington; iesg@ietf.org; tools-discuss@ietf.org > Subject: Re: [Tools-discuss] include-text > > Thanks Henrik! > > RjS > > On Dec 9, 2010, at 8:12 AM, Henrik Levkowetz wrote: > > > > > > > On 2010-12-08 21:02 Robert Sparks said: > >> This is really getting in my way and I would also like to > see it expedited. > > > > The functionality is available in 3.10, released > 2010-12-07. Go to this > > page and click on 'on' under 'Show full document text...' > in order to flip > > the switch to always show the full document: > > > > http://datatracker.ietf.org/cookies/ > > > > I guess we should provide a link at the bottom of the > abbreviated document > > pages to flip this switch, too. > > > > > > Henrik > > > >> RjS > >> > >> On Dec 8, 2010, at 10:41 AM, David Harrington wrote: > >> > >>> Hi, > >>> > >>> IIRC, Henrick said the next revision of the datatracker tool would > >>> allow people to choose different defaults for the include-text > >>> parameter. Can we please expedite this? > >>> > >>> I find the current setting, where I only get the first page, to be > >>> tremendously inconvenient, since I now have to click > through multiple > >>> screens to be able to print the document, and then click > back through > >>> multiple screens to get back to the datatracker page I > started from. > >>> > >>> Also, since the top of the partial document page doesn't > indicate the > >>> whole text is not present, I find it misleading. This has > led me to > >>> make bad assumptions when I print out only the first > page, or I search > >>> for something and find no instances in the document. > Luckily, mnay of > >>> these times it is obvious to me that there should be at least one > >>> instance (or the printout is too short), so I realize I > must only have > >>> the first page of the document. > >>> > >>> This is a real time-waster for me. I can only hope that those who > >>> requested this feature are getting some good benefit from > it. I'm not. > >>> > >>> Can we either revert to the old approach, or get the customizable > >>> version deployed? > >>> > >>> Thanks, > >>> David Harrington > >>> Director, IETF Transport Area > >>> ietfdbh@comcast.net (preferred for ietf) > >>> dbharrington@huaweisymantec.com > >>> +1 603 828 1401 (cell) > >>> > >> > >> _______________________________________________ > >> Tools-discuss mailing list > >> Tools-discuss@ietf.org > >> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/tools-discuss > >> > From rjsparks@nostrum.com Thu Dec 9 19:28:39 2010 Return-Path: X-Original-To: tools-discuss@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: tools-discuss@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id D3F0128C122; Thu, 9 Dec 2010 19:28:39 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -102.502 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-102.502 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.098, BAYES_00=-2.599, SPF_PASS=-0.001, USER_IN_WHITELIST=-100] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id IbVuSFXH3+2s; Thu, 9 Dec 2010 19:28:31 -0800 (PST) Received: from nostrum.com (nostrum-pt.tunnel.tserv2.fmt.ipv6.he.net [IPv6:2001:470:1f03:267::2]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8582228C14F; Thu, 9 Dec 2010 19:28:29 -0800 (PST) Received: from [192.168.2.105] (pool-173-71-48-4.dllstx.fios.verizon.net [173.71.48.4]) (authenticated bits=0) by nostrum.com (8.14.3/8.14.3) with ESMTP id oBA3TqKx019082 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=AES128-SHA bits=128 verify=NO); Thu, 9 Dec 2010 21:29:52 -0600 (CST) (envelope-from rjsparks@nostrum.com) Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v1082) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii From: Robert Sparks In-Reply-To: <047e01cb972e$69049970$3b0dcc50$@huawei.com> Date: Thu, 9 Dec 2010 21:29:53 -0600 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Message-Id: <8FEE66C9-DB75-4E33-979B-65A75BE41CCE@nostrum.com> References: <20101208220838.12463.53600.idtracker@localhost> <047e01cb972e$69049970$3b0dcc50$@huawei.com> To: Adrian.Farrel@huawei.com X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.1082) Received-SPF: pass (nostrum.com: 173.71.48.4 is authenticated by a trusted mechanism) Cc: 'Tim Polk' , 'The IESG' , tools-discuss@ietf.org Subject: [Tools-discuss] Ballot position change email subject (was Re: Tim Polk's No Objection on draft-ietf-proto-wgdocument-states-10: (with COMMENT)) X-BeenThere: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF Tools Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 10 Dec 2010 03:28:40 -0000 I had my fingers in this last, and I thought about the layout of the = subject line quite a bit before laying it out this way. The short answer is that you can't win - sometimes the emphasis needs to = be on whether there's a comment, sometimes the most important piece of information is that the = position has changed. The best we can do is get all the information on the line to facilitate = searches. This layout will be the most useful to me in forming searches later. = That said, I don't care what that order the information comes in as long as its all = there.=20 I do care that we pick a way and leave it alone for awhile so that good = search tools can actually be built. With that in mind, do you feel strongly enough about this to argue for = changing it? RjS On Dec 8, 2010, at 5:19 PM, Adrian Farrel wrote: > Folks, this subject line looks like a bug to me.=20 >=20 > The email thread will be about the COMMENT, not about the No Objection >=20 > Cheers > Adrian >=20 >> -----Original Message----- >> From: iesg-bounces@ietf.org [mailto:iesg-bounces@ietf.org] On Behalf = Of Tim >> Polk >> Sent: 08 December 2010 22:09 >> To: The IESG >> Cc: edj.etc@gmail.com; = draft-ietf-proto-wgdocument-states@tools.ietf.org >> Subject: Tim Polk's No Objection on = draft-ietf-proto-wgdocument-states-10: >> (with COMMENT) >>=20 >> Tim Polk has entered the following ballot position for >> draft-ietf-proto-wgdocument-states-10: No Objection >>=20 >> When responding, please keep the subject line intact and reply to all >> email addresses included in the To and CC lines. (Feel free to cut = this >> introductory paragraph, however.) >>=20 >> Please refer to = http://www.ietf.org/iesg/statement/discuss-criteria.html >> for more information about IESG DISCUSS and COMMENT positions. >>=20 >>=20 >>=20 >> = ---------------------------------------------------------------------- >> COMMENT: >> = ---------------------------------------------------------------------- >>=20 >> In section 3.1, the document state withdrawn is listed but is not = defined and no >> reference is given. Text was added that indicated this is = self-explanatory, but I >> must be dense since I still don't know what it means, >>=20 >> I do not want to delay things further, though, and see no harm in = moving forward >> with this text. >=20 From Adrian.Farrel@huawei.com Fri Dec 10 00:49:04 2010 Return-Path: X-Original-To: tools-discuss@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: tools-discuss@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6C1693A6C7D; Fri, 10 Dec 2010 00:49:04 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -103.388 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-103.388 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=-0.789, BAYES_00=-2.599, USER_IN_WHITELIST=-100] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 8dyM+GT7dOcE; Fri, 10 Dec 2010 00:49:03 -0800 (PST) Received: from usaga01-in.huawei.com (usaga01-in.huawei.com [206.16.17.211]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7DF4B3A6C77; Fri, 10 Dec 2010 00:49:03 -0800 (PST) Received: from huawei.com (usaga01-in [172.18.4.6]) by usaga01-in.huawei.com (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 2.14 (built Aug 8 2006)) with ESMTP id <0LD700H3PF89DO@usaga01-in.huawei.com>; Fri, 10 Dec 2010 00:50:34 -0800 (PST) Received: from 950129200 (dsl-sp-81-140-15-32.in-addr.broadbandscope.com [81.140.15.32]) by usaga01-in.huawei.com (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 2.14 (built Aug 8 2006)) with ESMTPA id <0LD700EF4F87PI@usaga01-in.huawei.com>; Fri, 10 Dec 2010 00:50:33 -0800 (PST) Date: Fri, 10 Dec 2010 08:50:32 +0000 From: Adrian Farrel In-reply-to: <8FEE66C9-DB75-4E33-979B-65A75BE41CCE@nostrum.com> To: 'Robert Sparks' Message-id: <07b901cb9847$4eeff600$eccfe200$@huawei.com> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook 14.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-language: en-gb Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Thread-index: AQJmloqrykE1zh/LIMQBRIyyEfEEyQKRSWc7AmNamuqSO7shAA== References: <20101208220838.12463.53600.idtracker@localhost> <047e01cb972e$69049970$3b0dcc50$@huawei.com> <8FEE66C9-DB75-4E33-979B-65A75BE41CCE@nostrum.com> Cc: 'Tim Polk' , 'The IESG' , tools-discuss@ietf.org Subject: Re: [Tools-discuss] Ballot position change email subject (was Re: Tim Polk's No Objection on draft-ietf-proto-wgdocument-states-10: (with COMMENT)) X-BeenThere: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list Reply-To: Adrian.Farrel@huawei.com List-Id: IETF Tools Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 10 Dec 2010 08:49:04 -0000 Robert, It would be a mistake to think that I "feel strongly enough" about anything to spend time arguing about it. (Maybe not something to say during the NomCom period!) I see your motivation here and understand it. The only thing I can think to add to your considerations is: Is it the final state ("no objection") that is interesting, or is it the change from the previous state ("Discuss cleared")? Cheers, Adrian > -----Original Message----- > From: iesg-bounces@ietf.org [mailto:iesg-bounces@ietf.org] On Behalf Of > Robert Sparks > Sent: 10 December 2010 03:30 > To: Adrian.Farrel@huawei.com > Cc: 'Tim Polk'; 'The IESG'; tools-discuss@ietf.org > Subject: Ballot position change email subject (was Re: Tim Polk's No Objection on > draft-ietf-proto-wgdocument-states-10: (with COMMENT)) > > I had my fingers in this last, and I thought about the layout of the subject line > quite a bit > before laying it out this way. > > The short answer is that you can't win - sometimes the emphasis needs to be on > whether there's > a comment, sometimes the most important piece of information is that the > position has changed. > The best we can do is get all the information on the line to facilitate searches. > > This layout will be the most useful to me in forming searches later. That said, > I don't care what that order the information comes in as long as its all there. > I do care that we pick a way and leave it alone for awhile so that good search tools > can actually > be built. > > With that in mind, do you feel strongly enough about this to argue for changing > it? > > RjS > > > On Dec 8, 2010, at 5:19 PM, Adrian Farrel wrote: > > > Folks, this subject line looks like a bug to me. > > > > The email thread will be about the COMMENT, not about the No Objection > > > > Cheers > > Adrian > > > >> -----Original Message----- > >> From: iesg-bounces@ietf.org [mailto:iesg-bounces@ietf.org] On Behalf Of > Tim > >> Polk > >> Sent: 08 December 2010 22:09 > >> To: The IESG > >> Cc: edj.etc@gmail.com; draft-ietf-proto-wgdocument-states@tools.ietf.org > >> Subject: Tim Polk's No Objection on draft-ietf-proto-wgdocument-states-10: > >> (with COMMENT) > >> > >> Tim Polk has entered the following ballot position for > >> draft-ietf-proto-wgdocument-states-10: No Objection > >> > >> When responding, please keep the subject line intact and reply to all > >> email addresses included in the To and CC lines. (Feel free to cut this > >> introductory paragraph, however.) > >> > >> Please refer to http://www.ietf.org/iesg/statement/discuss-criteria.html > >> for more information about IESG DISCUSS and COMMENT positions. > >> > >> > >> > >> ---------------------------------------------------------------------- > >> COMMENT: > >> ---------------------------------------------------------------------- > >> > >> In section 3.1, the document state withdrawn is listed but is not defined and > no > >> reference is given. Text was added that indicated this is self-explanatory, but I > >> must be dense since I still don't know what it means, > >> > >> I do not want to delay things further, though, and see no harm in moving > forward > >> with this text. > > From housley@vigilsec.com Fri Dec 10 04:44:27 2010 Return-Path: X-Original-To: tools-discuss@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: tools-discuss@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7D1D928C0D8; Fri, 10 Dec 2010 04:44:27 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -102.599 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-102.599 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-2.599, USER_IN_WHITELIST=-100] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id TIifpJ51wvc1; Fri, 10 Dec 2010 04:44:26 -0800 (PST) Received: from odin.smetech.net (mail.smetech.net [208.254.26.82]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 10A5828C0D0; Fri, 10 Dec 2010 04:44:26 -0800 (PST) Received: from localhost (unknown [208.254.26.81]) by odin.smetech.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id D39D19A47B1; Fri, 10 Dec 2010 07:46:09 -0500 (EST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at smetech.net Received: from odin.smetech.net ([208.254.26.82]) by localhost (ronin.smetech.net [208.254.26.81]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id p-vnJxX0EKYV; Fri, 10 Dec 2010 07:45:53 -0500 (EST) Received: from [192.168.2.105] (pool-96-231-58-190.washdc.fios.verizon.net [96.231.58.190]) (using TLSv1 with cipher AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by odin.smetech.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id E3AB59A473C; Fri, 10 Dec 2010 07:46:08 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <4D02210C.1000105@vigilsec.com> Date: Fri, 10 Dec 2010 07:46:04 -0500 From: Russ Housley User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.1; en-US; rv:1.9.2.12) Gecko/20101027 Lightning/1.0b2 Thunderbird/3.1.6 MIME-Version: 1.0 To: "Romascanu, Dan (Dan)" References: <20101208220838.12463.53600.idtracker@localhost><047e01cb972e$69049970$3b0dcc50$@huawei.com> <4D00E437.8010703@vigilsec.com> In-Reply-To: X-Enigmail-Version: 1.1.1 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Cc: The IESG , tools-discuss@ietf.org Subject: Re: [Tools-discuss] Tim Polk's No Objection on draft-ietf-proto-wgdocument-states-10(with COMMENT) X-BeenThere: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF Tools Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 10 Dec 2010 12:44:27 -0000 I message that said a DISCUSS was cleared would be helpful, but authors take these as new comments. Russ On 12/9/2010 10:02 AM, Romascanu, Dan (Dan) wrote: > Actually as shepherding AD I find useful to receive a message about a > DISCUSS was cleared. Moreover, you can look at this as a change as the > DISCUSS text disappears. > > Dan > > >> -----Original Message----- >> From: iesg-bounces@ietf.org [mailto:iesg-bounces@ietf.org] On >> Behalf Of Russ Housley >> Sent: Thursday, December 09, 2010 4:14 PM >> To: tools-discuss@ietf.org >> Cc: 'The IESG' >> Subject: Re: Tim Polk's No Objection on >> draft-ietf-proto-wgdocument-states-10(with COMMENT) >> >> I do not think that clearing a DISCUSS should generate a >> message at all unless the content of the COMMENT has changed. >> >> Russ >> >> On 12/8/2010 6:19 PM, Adrian Farrel wrote: >>> Folks, this subject line looks like a bug to me. >>> >>> The email thread will be about the COMMENT, not about the >> No Objection >>> >>> Cheers >>> Adrian >>> >>>> -----Original Message----- >>>> From: iesg-bounces@ietf.org [mailto:iesg-bounces@ietf.org] >> On Behalf >>>> Of Tim Polk >>>> Sent: 08 December 2010 22:09 >>>> To: The IESG >>>> Cc: edj.etc@gmail.com; >>>> draft-ietf-proto-wgdocument-states@tools.ietf.org >>>> Subject: Tim Polk's No Objection on >> draft-ietf-proto-wgdocument-states-10: >>>> (with COMMENT) >>>> >>>> Tim Polk has entered the following ballot position for >>>> draft-ietf-proto-wgdocument-states-10: No Objection >>>> >>>> When responding, please keep the subject line intact and >> reply to all >>>> email addresses included in the To and CC lines. (Feel free to cut >>>> this introductory paragraph, however.) >>>> >>>> Please refer to >>>> http://www.ietf.org/iesg/statement/discuss-criteria.html >>>> for more information about IESG DISCUSS and COMMENT positions. >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >> --------------------------------------------------------------------- >>>> - >>>> COMMENT: >>>> >> --------------------------------------------------------------------- >>>> - >>>> >>>> In section 3.1, the document state withdrawn is listed but is not >>>> defined and no reference is given. Text was added that indicated >>>> this is self-explanatory, but I must be dense since I still don't >>>> know what it means, >>>> >>>> I do not want to delay things further, though, and see no harm in >>>> moving forward with this text. >>> >>> >> > From rjsparks@nostrum.com Fri Dec 10 06:38:17 2010 Return-Path: X-Original-To: tools-discuss@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: tools-discuss@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id F084E3A6B07; Fri, 10 Dec 2010 06:38:16 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -102.504 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-102.504 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.096, BAYES_00=-2.599, SPF_PASS=-0.001, USER_IN_WHITELIST=-100] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id JLzE3RaeibvW; Fri, 10 Dec 2010 06:38:15 -0800 (PST) Received: from nostrum.com (nostrum-pt.tunnel.tserv2.fmt.ipv6.he.net [IPv6:2001:470:1f03:267::2]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id EF2063A6944; Fri, 10 Dec 2010 06:38:14 -0800 (PST) Received: from [192.168.2.105] (pool-173-71-48-4.dllstx.fios.verizon.net [173.71.48.4]) (authenticated bits=0) by nostrum.com (8.14.3/8.14.3) with ESMTP id oBAEdfDP074083 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=AES128-SHA bits=128 verify=NO); Fri, 10 Dec 2010 08:39:41 -0600 (CST) (envelope-from rjsparks@nostrum.com) Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v1082) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii From: Robert Sparks In-Reply-To: <07b901cb9847$4eeff600$eccfe200$@huawei.com> Date: Fri, 10 Dec 2010 08:39:41 -0600 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Message-Id: References: <20101208220838.12463.53600.idtracker@localhost> <047e01cb972e$69049970$3b0dcc50$@huawei.com> <8FEE66C9-DB75-4E33-979B-65A75BE41CCE@nostrum.com> <07b901cb9847$4eeff600$eccfe200$@huawei.com> To: Adrian.Farrel@huawei.com X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.1082) Received-SPF: pass (nostrum.com: 173.71.48.4 is authenticated by a trusted mechanism) Cc: 'Tim Polk' , 'The IESG' , tools-discuss@ietf.org Subject: Re: [Tools-discuss] Ballot position change email subject (was Re: Tim Polk's No Objection on draft-ietf-proto-wgdocument-states-10: (with COMMENT)) X-BeenThere: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF Tools Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 10 Dec 2010 14:38:17 -0000 On Dec 10, 2010, at 2:50 AM, Adrian Farrel wrote: > Robert, >=20 > It would be a mistake to think that I "feel strongly enough" about = anything to > spend time arguing about it. (Maybe not something to say during the = NomCom > period!) >=20 > I see your motivation here and understand it. > The only thing I can think to add to your considerations is: > Is it the final state ("no objection") that is interesting, or is it = the change > from the previous state ("Discuss cleared")? Well, it's the current state, not necessarily the final state. Not all No Objection states come after DISCUSS states. The initial = position is often _very_ interesting. Adding the old state to the Subject line (if there was an old state) = would complicate searches. >=20 > Cheers, > Adrian >=20 >> -----Original Message----- >> From: iesg-bounces@ietf.org [mailto:iesg-bounces@ietf.org] On Behalf = Of >> Robert Sparks >> Sent: 10 December 2010 03:30 >> To: Adrian.Farrel@huawei.com >> Cc: 'Tim Polk'; 'The IESG'; tools-discuss@ietf.org >> Subject: Ballot position change email subject (was Re: Tim Polk's No = Objection > on >> draft-ietf-proto-wgdocument-states-10: (with COMMENT)) >>=20 >> I had my fingers in this last, and I thought about the layout of the = subject > line >> quite a bit >> before laying it out this way. >>=20 >> The short answer is that you can't win - sometimes the emphasis needs = to be on >> whether there's >> a comment, sometimes the most important piece of information is that = the >> position has changed. >> The best we can do is get all the information on the line to = facilitate > searches. >>=20 >> This layout will be the most useful to me in forming searches later. = That > said, >> I don't care what that order the information comes in as long as its = all > there. >> I do care that we pick a way and leave it alone for awhile so that = good search > tools >> can actually >> be built. >>=20 >> With that in mind, do you feel strongly enough about this to argue = for > changing >> it? >>=20 >> RjS >>=20 >>=20 >> On Dec 8, 2010, at 5:19 PM, Adrian Farrel wrote: >>=20 >>> Folks, this subject line looks like a bug to me. >>>=20 >>> The email thread will be about the COMMENT, not about the No = Objection >>>=20 >>> Cheers >>> Adrian >>>=20 >>>> -----Original Message----- >>>> From: iesg-bounces@ietf.org [mailto:iesg-bounces@ietf.org] On = Behalf Of >> Tim >>>> Polk >>>> Sent: 08 December 2010 22:09 >>>> To: The IESG >>>> Cc: edj.etc@gmail.com; = draft-ietf-proto-wgdocument-states@tools.ietf.org >>>> Subject: Tim Polk's No Objection on = draft-ietf-proto-wgdocument-states-10: >>>> (with COMMENT) >>>>=20 >>>> Tim Polk has entered the following ballot position for >>>> draft-ietf-proto-wgdocument-states-10: No Objection >>>>=20 >>>> When responding, please keep the subject line intact and reply to = all >>>> email addresses included in the To and CC lines. (Feel free to cut = this >>>> introductory paragraph, however.) >>>>=20 >>>> Please refer to = http://www.ietf.org/iesg/statement/discuss-criteria.html >>>> for more information about IESG DISCUSS and COMMENT positions. >>>>=20 >>>>=20 >>>>=20 >>>> = ---------------------------------------------------------------------- >>>> COMMENT: >>>> = ---------------------------------------------------------------------- >>>>=20 >>>> In section 3.1, the document state withdrawn is listed but is not = defined > and >> no >>>> reference is given. Text was added that indicated this is > self-explanatory, but I >>>> must be dense since I still don't know what it means, >>>>=20 >>>> I do not want to delay things further, though, and see no harm in = moving >> forward >>>> with this text. >>>=20 >=20 From marc.blanchet@viagenie.ca Tue Dec 14 07:02:31 2010 Return-Path: X-Original-To: tools-discuss@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: tools-discuss@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id B162D3A6DC1 for ; Tue, 14 Dec 2010 07:02:31 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -102.374 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-102.374 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.225, BAYES_00=-2.599, USER_IN_WHITELIST=-100] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id SuwQ+lCi-VX8 for ; Tue, 14 Dec 2010 07:02:30 -0800 (PST) Received: from jazz.viagenie.ca (jazz.viagenie.ca [IPv6:2620:0:230:8000::2]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8DDBE3A6DA9 for ; Tue, 14 Dec 2010 07:02:30 -0800 (PST) Received: from h109.viagenie.ca (h109.viagenie.ca [206.123.31.109]) by jazz.viagenie.ca (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 5B65A21C78 for ; Tue, 14 Dec 2010 10:04:10 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <4D078769.9060603@viagenie.ca> Date: Tue, 14 Dec 2010 10:04:09 -0500 From: Marc Blanchet User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Macintosh; U; Intel Mac OS X 10.6; fr; rv:1.9.2.13) Gecko/20101207 Lightning/1.0b2 Thunderbird/3.1.7 MIME-Version: 1.0 To: tools-discuss@ietf.org Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: [Tools-discuss] tools diff real-time X-BeenThere: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF Tools Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 14 Dec 2010 15:02:31 -0000 hello, I guess my comment is probably known and might be planned for next revs/integration efforts. And it is low priority compared to other stuff. But I wanted to make sure it was known. So: - when a new rev of a draft is submitted, immediatly the announcement goes. - sometimes people have been waiting a lot for that new rev. - then, you want to look at the diffs with the previous version. - but the tools page that provide the diff service does not know the existence of the new rev. it seems to be done async. it would be great if the tools providing diff is synched with the new revs of docs. again, low priority. it is just because I'm so used to our great tools that I want more... ;-) keep the excellent work and thanks. Regards, Marc. -- ========= IPv6 book: Migrating to IPv6, Wiley. http://www.ipv6book.ca Stun/Turn server for VoIP NAT-FW traversal: http://numb.viagenie.ca DTN Implementation: http://postellation.viagenie.ca NAT64-DNS64 Opensource: http://ecdysis.viagenie.ca From tony@att.com Wed Dec 15 05:28:59 2010 Return-Path: X-Original-To: tools-discuss@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: tools-discuss@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0DBFB3A7056 for ; Wed, 15 Dec 2010 05:28:59 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -105.878 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-105.878 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=-0.519, BAYES_00=-2.599, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-4, SARE_LWSHORTT=1.24, USER_IN_WHITELIST=-100] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id G0uAd4Q4m26Q for ; Wed, 15 Dec 2010 05:28:58 -0800 (PST) Received: from mail146.messagelabs.com (mail146.messagelabs.com [216.82.241.147]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1125B3A703C for ; Wed, 15 Dec 2010 05:28:57 -0800 (PST) X-VirusChecked: Checked X-Env-Sender: tony@att.com X-Msg-Ref: server-10.tower-146.messagelabs.com!1292419839!21122099!1 X-StarScan-Version: 6.2.9; banners=-,-,- X-Originating-IP: [144.160.20.145] Received: (qmail 26588 invoked from network); 15 Dec 2010 13:30:39 -0000 Received: from sbcsmtp6.sbc.com (HELO mlpd192.enaf.sfdc.sbc.com) (144.160.20.145) by server-10.tower-146.messagelabs.com with DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA encrypted SMTP; 15 Dec 2010 13:30:39 -0000 Received: from enaf.sfdc.sbc.com (localhost.localdomain [127.0.0.1]) by mlpd192.enaf.sfdc.sbc.com (8.14.4/8.14.4) with ESMTP id oBFDUxSk031614 for ; Wed, 15 Dec 2010 08:30:59 -0500 Received: from alpd052.aldc.att.com (alpd052.aldc.att.com [130.8.42.31]) by mlpd192.enaf.sfdc.sbc.com (8.14.4/8.14.4) with ESMTP id oBFDUtpM031561 for ; Wed, 15 Dec 2010 08:30:55 -0500 Received: from aldc.att.com (localhost.localdomain [127.0.0.1]) by alpd052.aldc.att.com (8.14.4/8.14.4) with ESMTP id oBFDUY8u022273 for ; Wed, 15 Dec 2010 08:30:35 -0500 Received: from dns.maillennium.att.com (mailgw1.maillennium.att.com [135.25.114.99]) by alpd052.aldc.att.com (8.14.4/8.14.4) with ESMTP id oBFDUXJe022250 for ; Wed, 15 Dec 2010 08:30:33 -0500 Received: from [135.70.79.141] (vpn-135-70-79-141.vpn.swst.att.com[135.70.79.141]) by maillennium.att.com (mailgw1) with ESMTP id <20101215133032gw1004lkase> (Authid: tony); Wed, 15 Dec 2010 13:30:32 +0000 X-Originating-IP: [135.70.79.141] Message-ID: <4D08C2F8.1080807@att.com> Date: Wed, 15 Dec 2010 08:30:32 -0500 From: Tony Hansen User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 6.0; en-US; rv:1.9.2.13) Gecko/20101207 Thunderbird/3.1.7 MIME-Version: 1.0 To: tools-discuss@ietf.org References: <4D078769.9060603@viagenie.ca> In-Reply-To: <4D078769.9060603@viagenie.ca> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: Re: [Tools-discuss] tools diff real-time X-BeenThere: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF Tools Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 15 Dec 2010 13:28:59 -0000 Getting it tied into the announcement system would be way cool. As a short term measure, when tools.ietf/org/html is asked to look for a version that's not on its server, it could pull it over in real time rather than waiting until the hourly sync has occurred. Anyone want to work on either mechanism? (nudge nudge) Tony Hansen On 12/14/2010 10:04 AM, Marc Blanchet wrote: > hello, > I guess my comment is probably known and might be planned for next > revs/integration efforts. And it is low priority compared to other > stuff. But I wanted to make sure it was known. So: > - when a new rev of a draft is submitted, immediatly the announcement > goes. > - sometimes people have been waiting a lot for that new rev. > - then, you want to look at the diffs with the previous version. > - but the tools page that provide the diff service does not know the > existence of the new rev. it seems to be done async. > > it would be great if the tools providing diff is synched with the new > revs of docs. > > again, low priority. it is just because I'm so used to our great tools > that I want more... ;-) > > keep the excellent work and thanks. > > Regards, Marc. > From lars.eggert@nokia.com Thu Dec 16 03:36:34 2010 Return-Path: X-Original-To: tools-discuss@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: tools-discuss@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 907A13A70DB for ; Thu, 16 Dec 2010 03:36:34 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -102.664 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-102.664 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=-0.065, BAYES_00=-2.599, USER_IN_WHITELIST=-100] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id eu121MjqMpWg for ; Thu, 16 Dec 2010 03:36:33 -0800 (PST) Received: from mgw-da02.nokia.com (smtp.nokia.com [147.243.128.26]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id D18E93A70C0 for ; Thu, 16 Dec 2010 03:36:33 -0800 (PST) Received: from mail.fit.nokia.com (esdhcp030222.research.nokia.com [172.21.30.222]) by mgw-da02.nokia.com (Switch-3.4.3/Switch-3.4.3) with ESMTP id oBGBcG2n026292 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=NO) for ; Thu, 16 Dec 2010 13:38:18 +0200 From: Lars Eggert X-Virus-Status: Clean X-Virus-Scanned: clamav-milter 0.96.5 at fit.nokia.com Content-Type: multipart/signed; boundary=Apple-Mail-21-659681292; protocol="application/pkcs7-signature"; micalg=sha1 Date: Thu, 16 Dec 2010 13:38:13 +0200 References: <20101216112851.7095.98897.idtracker@localhost> To: Tools Team Discussion Message-Id: <6C3E1B3E-11D4-4917-A9E5-B1392B15A0F8@nokia.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v1082) X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.1082) X-Greylist: Sender succeeded SMTP AUTH, not delayed by milter-greylist-4.2.6 (mail.fit.nokia.com); Thu, 16 Dec 2010 13:38:14 +0200 (EET) X-Nokia-AV: Clean Subject: [Tools-discuss] text encoding issue in "deferred ballot" email X-BeenThere: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF Tools Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 16 Dec 2010 11:36:34 -0000 --Apple-Mail-21-659681292 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Begin forwarded message: > Ballot of <draft-ietf-roll-trickle-06.txt> has been deferred by > Lars Eggert. The HTML entities should be converted in to ASCII for the email body. 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ESMTP id BE4433A6875 for ; Wed, 22 Dec 2010 12:37:50 -0800 (PST) Received: from [192.168.2.105] (pool-71-170-29-59.dllstx.fios.verizon.net [71.170.29.59]) (authenticated bits=0) by nostrum.com (8.14.3/8.14.3) with ESMTP id oBMKdmDb061740 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=AES128-SHA bits=128 verify=NO) for ; Wed, 22 Dec 2010 14:39:48 -0600 (CST) (envelope-from rjsparks@nostrum.com) From: Robert Sparks Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Date: Wed, 22 Dec 2010 14:39:48 -0600 Message-Id: To: Tools Team Discussion Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v1082) X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.1082) Received-SPF: pass (nostrum.com: 71.170.29.59 is authenticated by a trusted mechanism) Subject: [Tools-discuss] Bug in discuss page? X-BeenThere: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF Tools Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 22 Dec 2010 20:37:52 -0000 draft-ietf-l2vpn-vpls-bridge-interop shows up on=20 https://datatracker.ietf.org/iesg/discusses/ but it has no discusses. It does have discusses from previous IESG members - is that causing it = to show up on this page? (it shouldn't). RjS=