From nobody Mon Mar 1 12:58:15 2021 Return-Path: X-Original-To: tools-discuss@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: tools-discuss@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 04B1F3A22CE for ; Mon, 1 Mar 2021 12:58:14 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.898 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.898 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=kumari-net.20150623.gappssmtp.com Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 2pKSplxD3kac for ; Mon, 1 Mar 2021 12:58:11 -0800 (PST) Received: from mail-lf1-x12d.google.com (mail-lf1-x12d.google.com [IPv6:2a00:1450:4864:20::12d]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id A72093A22CD for ; Mon, 1 Mar 2021 12:58:10 -0800 (PST) Received: by mail-lf1-x12d.google.com with SMTP id m22so27779317lfg.5 for ; Mon, 01 Mar 2021 12:58:10 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=kumari-net.20150623.gappssmtp.com; s=20150623; h=mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date:message-id:subject:to :cc; bh=215FXwQsJGdSHe1C3Db17mdWWqQXM1kOsu0RzqtY66E=; b=dW1dNZI5LjKQNBIyG/wXNmz1z3Cb3ifDUedjb4liRWlWWQsYjPnd6ueDOcmx8tKO9x bHgHUoGJ3UsEKTwPaWaYm9aRkz/WY8C1R8dTb6s30UVQcUPrjZFnlBfBhSsbw35Bj2ud jTsnz5D7rukjJ210QhQLiMAYJkRWs7ugr3f8qWLUXs6uWHS+vw0SBtgs7Kj18mcN4iis rbX0yf1EHud6/oeP167cscfD7KKPubusIwayaeWYRUSeeX35Q/Z45phYI85mDXl501jz 4tGlYragMczqTB2245noJqWKqWFbLYfJLcg5VMIzy3EyUULcdrpPrvmxJCb9gmrCvERp AitQ== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date :message-id:subject:to:cc; bh=215FXwQsJGdSHe1C3Db17mdWWqQXM1kOsu0RzqtY66E=; b=HUom0hpix2XxHbO8cMtcGCd5u425H3CfNi1o/SvhaBCJK8XM3a7Y36cvZeh2zKJGCK 0Db5cCjaVTAEimuOxixRXaU8Ilc8WQ+TK1tLFYZEjOc6XaW5k3mnqKq2jB35lB5UAQyw G40/jqTzsafB/Rh2s850OPQmD0D7gMV8RlZyxHyBwawNMzB9HighWZgbrS1LxfH6/vU8 ilRF/WDGSJGNbeMn51kFaSiZgf5jBXVL+vK+31FZXmmDCGqDqqelajlXBq+Fe4dIYchn OUzKEvvXeZBddOzIVJ8nrQw7b8qtFjp3DUH72Ur8tCM+J7uy91N5JshcgWH10w8bq4nc TCRw== X-Gm-Message-State: AOAM5303gvcmFJ6v4Spl38+EcxHmaJI7+G1+RdodHpjQ65QIqSLOUgGy PY98zZZYO2BWRq3WBcmp8TIKSuciW2KXexa2szrC9Wzko44= X-Google-Smtp-Source: ABdhPJxDAPdNuLXKpodMZFQA9QPcHPUVijg4CHrCmAf4oly053wuaCyTmNA3Vket2OMRLVW/3R6SpHjG68yDg00xd7s= X-Received: by 2002:ac2:44c7:: with SMTP id d7mr9296239lfm.464.1614632286927; Mon, 01 Mar 2021 12:58:06 -0800 (PST) MIME-Version: 1.0 References: <780EF9C1-11FA-4ED2-B206-1FD82A1204CE@tzi.org> <3fee246b-7a01-7a4f-cb7a-a548f4040bd1@nostrum.com> <60392FB9.9060801@btconnect.com> <1d0d18c2-f63d-c867-99ed-68c4ab6aa425@nostrum.com> <872980DC-A1CC-43DD-94D5-8CEEE2537785@vpnc.org> <57C98EF1-BA00-4503-9BC1-3B1F891A3147@att.com> In-Reply-To: <57C98EF1-BA00-4503-9BC1-3B1F891A3147@att.com> From: Warren Kumari Date: Mon, 1 Mar 2021 15:57:30 -0500 Message-ID: To: "HANSEN, TONY L" Cc: tools-discuss Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="000000000000e7cc8205bc7fdf17" Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Tools-discuss] Serving a partial documents (was Re: [rfc-i] Citing drafts) X-BeenThere: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF Tools Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 01 Mar 2021 20:58:14 -0000 --000000000000e7cc8205bc7fdf17 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable On Fri, Feb 26, 2021 at 7:29 PM HANSEN, TONY L wrote: > On 2/26/2021, 1:39 PM, "Bob Hinden" wrote: > > > On Feb 26, 2021, at 10:07 AM, Paul Hoffman > wrote: > > > > On 26 Feb 2021, at 10:04, Eric Rescorla wrote: > > > >> On Fri, Feb 26, 2021 at 10:03 AM Robert Sparks < > rjsparks@nostrum.com> wrote: > >> > >>> So, I _think_ the way the main document page behaves now was > intended to > >>> protect people on low bandwidth or expensive bandwidth connection= s > from > >>> very large documents. > >>> > >>> Is that still something we should consider important? Or would it > be > >>> better if the main page served the whole document all the time? > >>> > >> > >> I think that's largely unnecessary at this time, especially given > that a > >> lot of people currently go to tools which serves the whole thing > > > > +1 to Robert's memory, and +1 to Ekr's proposal and reasoning. > > Agreed. > > Bob > > If you're logged in, you already have control over whether the full > document is shown be default or not. Preferences -> "Show full document > text by default?" controls that. I turned it on ages and ages ago. > Yah, that is stored in a cookie -- which gets annoying if you delete the cookie :-) > > However, the default has always been Off. Perhaps the default needs to > become On? > Yup, I'd support that. W > > Tony > > ___________________________________________________________ > Tools-discuss mailing list - Tools-discuss@ietf.org > This list is for discussion, not for action requests or bug reports. > * Report datatracker and mailarchive bugs to: datatracker-project@ietf.or= g > * Report tools.ietf.org bugs to: webmaster@tools.ietf.org > * Report all other bugs or issues to: ietf-action@ietf.org > List info (including how to Unsubscribe): > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/tools-discuss > --=20 The computing scientist=E2=80=99s main challenge is not to get confused by = the complexities of his own making. -- E. W. Dijkstra --000000000000e7cc8205bc7fdf17 Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable


On Fri, Feb 26, 2021 at 7:29 PM HANS= EN, TONY L <tony@att.com> wrote:<= br>
On 2/26/2021, 1:= 39 PM, "Bob Hinden" <bob.hinden@gmail.com> wrote:

=C2=A0 =C2=A0 > On Feb 26, 2021, at 10:07 AM, Paul Hoffman <paul.hoffman@vpnc.org> wrote:
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 >
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 > On 26 Feb 2021, at 10:04, Eric Rescorla wrote:
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 >
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 >> On Fri, Feb 26, 2021 at 10:03 AM Robert Sparks <<= a href=3D"mailto:rjsparks@nostrum.com" target=3D"_blank">rjsparks@nostrum.c= om> wrote:
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 >>
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 >>> So, I _think_ the way the main document page beh= aves now was intended to
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 >>> protect people on low bandwidth or expensive ban= dwidth connections from
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 >>> very large documents.
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 >>>
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 >>> Is that still something we should consider impor= tant? Or would it be
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 >>> better if the main page served the whole documen= t all the time?
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 >>>
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 >>
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 >> I think that's largely unnecessary at this time,= especially given that a
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 >> lot of people currently go to tools which serves the= whole thing
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 >
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 > +1 to Robert's memory, and +1 to Ekr's proposal = and reasoning.

=C2=A0 =C2=A0 Agreed.

=C2=A0 =C2=A0 Bob

If you're logged in, you already have control over whether the full doc= ument is shown be default or not. Preferences -> "Show full documen= t text by default?" controls that. I turned it on ages and ages ago.

Yah, that is stored in a cookie -- which gets= annoying if you delete the cookie :-)

=C2=A0

However, the default has always been Off. Perhaps the default needs to beco= me On?

Yup, I'd support that.=C2=A0
W
=C2=A0

=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 Tony

___________________________________________________________
Tools-discuss mailing list - Tools-discuss@ietf.org
This list is for discussion, not for action requests or bug reports.
* Report datatracker and mailarchive bugs to: datatracker-project@ietf.org
* Report tools.ietf.org bugs to: webmaster@tools.ietf.org
* Report all other bugs or issues to: ietf-action@ietf.org
List info (including how to Unsubscribe): https:/= /www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/tools-discuss


--
The computing scientist=E2=80= =99s main challenge is not to get confused by the
complexities of his ow= n making.
=C2=A0 -- E. W. Dijkstra
--000000000000e7cc8205bc7fdf17-- From nobody Tue Mar 2 05:07:22 2021 Return-Path: X-Original-To: tools-discuss@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: tools-discuss@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 678543A17A5 for ; Tue, 2 Mar 2021 05:07:20 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -6.899 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-6.899 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_HI=-5, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_H2=-0.001, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (1024-bit key) header.d=gmx.net Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 2_ol48lI_TAJ for ; Tue, 2 Mar 2021 05:07:19 -0800 (PST) Received: from mout.gmx.net (mout.gmx.net [212.227.17.21]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 833963A17A8 for ; Tue, 2 Mar 2021 05:07:18 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/simple; d=gmx.net; s=badeba3b8450; t=1614690435; bh=et+6Fc4rdU4vAdA1yibXRupTZlX7YogaEtJZFE7b770=; h=X-UI-Sender-Class:To:From:Subject:Date; b=IXFB99y4YEApEnpIsoxlp7gcxmhGUQR+k+vvAXWTWoJ+WJVpEakYFeELOlhaaq5L0 ZvjvzJsxRVhImiLhxFY+nYc7nr9WF+C8zyYDpfJXwTjwtCF1relhHBydDXawBb2Cri 9hOnXkZ9yiOYebp6ktztc8gsU98Z0o8BimLCLS+A= X-UI-Sender-Class: 01bb95c1-4bf8-414a-932a-4f6e2808ef9c Received: from [192.168.178.20] ([91.61.48.133]) by mail.gmx.net (mrgmx105 [212.227.17.168]) with ESMTPSA (Nemesis) id 1Ml6qC-1leGxK3aDE-00lSE5 for ; Tue, 02 Mar 2021 14:07:14 +0100 To: Tools Team Discussion From: Julian Reschke Message-ID: Date: Tue, 2 Mar 2021 14:07:14 +0100 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows NT 10.0; Win64; x64; rv:78.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/78.8.0 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Provags-ID: V03:K1:yU0WkQ8L+BuiG8NZ7+4G9ImWb1nXovpe2e4P8SvqKgJI8vk1uYK sJOY/QWsQDtXMNv8MqbjNUSLBJqavPG3G4GLnYg7Na7b5ADgTu0GVsj3uJZ4bG40auwMi9z Xz+Gww6VJbMbQ23/0J05o7JvwAmZ40C7LFyO0WmZSuFj2OaIG1tDueu9LSDGjfjA9+9NY+F IAJ0oNVgOwzMT3EgPfDVg== X-UI-Out-Filterresults: notjunk:1;V03:K0:0j6tbwTjwas=:i62pUJkIWqwjC4X1vR4kf2 0PJ9TBsquf33JHkxF/koqxSKZ/7DeLvTQRHrse0xlH2bamGXJWBQecDc/a8C4711FFM5dG7KT Aifq4+EFuXDnM/UCSg8np8MEvk2K8eeuAmnMV8G3jgbTf+RRbKJl+mAO416UJqzZ8hdg8KVWL m+A4Na5+A0At7LOQ49hKQFJZkwNlWfQdBOJo6MeYUb71RSgyV4rpGMh0lWKshIxJzVcuZ1TRe FHjwCFto6byozz2RYt8YhfVe9Ti+QsPi6o+1PVtc1txQW3fv5Udz0mnHJwVwVSPEfcHomKRrR omjDdF1Haa+ixfNsApoX0NVRBPKfZEeXRxt53OunMEeok/VasU8nH/PHdcHdassbS+mZ7o3OC ua4deOsJp2qrkryz44++0MVO1nqL8hLVCo2zR1oVHvB4o5arXuUmpE2PWneTkMVcWCibdUwgT IknDEqSwgyixbWVayzTnLhYNiqJuD07IrPUKWFkH6lTkfCiy2UnPO8jQSMKxq909LLLLdBXdZ 1JTCltNyd5CzTINwsfnGP3/2Ytaxa0tmiCB/9STAVgZ4VcvIkzH9F17x4Zi531b885n/aFgc+ sKf5qwRKp2VSlb/H826MFV2hH7UBEk+D6Dk0O9fNgtqNNmQPMwjPRMIHWEO+c+nJgkRam+6G0 0/CZqikdtCTtQqVPgQwTNalLoR7lfeR8mW4FTElwNoyeJQy/Zm9xpNZN0ctgITbRaDJDvm846 woVWuZskPxaJxwu5NdTPkaCPWgkJlPt6/S8Ppvgf2tsiH61vxyUSt9ihlT2FHP3nNWyHWYRmi qRCJSYTyu232V4zZk+QJ60iREAwr773ffasBuCkR+yvsOUc3VWlPiD9i6Xjm4JPzqG3TUu3dD xv6Jm+ECP++53npK96VQ== Archived-At: Subject: [Tools-discuss] https://tools.ietf.org/agenda/110/calendar borked? X-BeenThere: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF Tools Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 02 Mar 2021 13:07:20 -0000 Hi there, it seems the calendars served over here do not have any actual dates in them? (for instance, try <"https://tools.ietf.org/agenda/110/ics/ietf-110-webtrans.ics">). Best regards, Julian From nobody Tue Mar 2 07:42:34 2021 Return-Path: X-Original-To: tools-discuss@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: tools-discuss@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id A79DD3A2904 for ; Tue, 2 Mar 2021 07:42:32 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.08 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.08 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, NICE_REPLY_A=-0.001, T_SPF_HELO_PERMERROR=0.01, T_SPF_PERMERROR=0.01, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (1024-bit key) header.d=nostrum.com Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id hJXVp-tYtqWc for ; Tue, 2 Mar 2021 07:42:27 -0800 (PST) Received: from nostrum.com (raven-v6.nostrum.com [IPv6:2001:470:d:1130::1]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id AF0A13A2905 for ; Tue, 2 Mar 2021 07:42:27 -0800 (PST) Received: from unformal.local ([47.186.1.92]) (authenticated bits=0) by nostrum.com (8.16.1/8.16.1) with ESMTPSA id 122FgLvK002001 (version=TLSv1.3 cipher=TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 bits=256 verify=NO); Tue, 2 Mar 2021 09:42:22 -0600 (CST) (envelope-from rjsparks@nostrum.com) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=simple/simple; d=nostrum.com; s=default; t=1614699742; bh=CsDFhF19FrtGZaY8AJ2zdG1OYcOq3MI1UCQLQEBpl6w=; h=Subject:To:References:From:Date:In-Reply-To; b=h1h4x9s0Gn5wbjlFZ8dAUGbOKX6te5VrAotJzNvHTmngnEmAyqu0DcudFZR/0RcD3 FAR9ZI8y/VwSeAuR7bLiriCivqrDYOMi2ImadaLzQah4rVYy/W+briGNktHxqZOEID MlmIblr0FSmfgxhoxm4kKsPOiEhilesXjT/E6YEQ= X-Authentication-Warning: raven.nostrum.com: Host [47.186.1.92] claimed to be unformal.local To: tools-discuss@ietf.org, Julian Reschke References: From: Robert Sparks Message-ID: <0bc0f9f7-d80a-698d-856b-0fada6d1c886@nostrum.com> Date: Tue, 2 Mar 2021 09:42:16 -0600 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Macintosh; Intel Mac OS X 10.15; rv:78.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/78.8.0 MIME-Version: 1.0 In-Reply-To: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Language: en-US Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Tools-discuss] https://tools.ietf.org/agenda/110/calendar borked? X-BeenThere: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF Tools Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 02 Mar 2021 15:42:33 -0000 Hi Julian - Are the ics available from the datatracker not filling a need? RjS On 3/2/21 7:07 AM, Julian Reschke wrote: > Hi there, > > it seems the calendars served over here do not have any actual dates in > them? > > (for instance, try > <"https://tools.ietf.org/agenda/110/ics/ietf-110-webtrans.ics">). > > Best regards, Julian > > ___________________________________________________________ > Tools-discuss mailing list - Tools-discuss@ietf.org > This list is for discussion, not for action requests or bug reports. > * Report datatracker and mailarchive bugs to: > datatracker-project@ietf.org > * Report tools.ietf.org bugs to: webmaster@tools.ietf.org > * Report all other bugs or issues to: ietf-action@ietf.org > List info (including how to Unsubscribe): > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/tools-discuss From nobody Tue Mar 2 07:45:53 2021 Return-Path: X-Original-To: tools-discuss@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: tools-discuss@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id D72193A2915 for ; Tue, 2 Mar 2021 07:45:51 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.9 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.9 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, NICE_REPLY_A=-0.001, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_H2=-0.001, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (1024-bit key) header.d=gmx.net Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 1G2mYZ9wgRTe for ; Tue, 2 Mar 2021 07:45:47 -0800 (PST) Received: from mout.gmx.net (mout.gmx.net [212.227.17.21]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id A7C053A2913 for ; Tue, 2 Mar 2021 07:45:46 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/simple; d=gmx.net; s=badeba3b8450; t=1614699931; bh=FxltnjTlyqYGAUQXMZktuKdSNTTvT7Hp1bSRsR3bJ8k=; h=X-UI-Sender-Class:Subject:To:References:From:Date:In-Reply-To; b=Tkk1DOOGseA5MUN5AH0dLVaGnBJu0kvZtWCzyIphsNPPAUiGdfGl3Q/OybxUNAL7p y+zrF5OApc7FbKGwYasmDqvQK8d5QELHEpWo2LJ/dNAr1Kp/9zSlox6h6XJqnGoWIZ G3mK82cDckyYvi+5Yh2kJBx7CxY1pp0RktL0lZqM= X-UI-Sender-Class: 01bb95c1-4bf8-414a-932a-4f6e2808ef9c Received: from [192.168.178.20] ([91.61.48.133]) by mail.gmx.net (mrgmx105 [212.227.17.168]) with ESMTPSA (Nemesis) id 1N2mFY-1lvu2J1s0S-01351g; Tue, 02 Mar 2021 16:45:31 +0100 To: Robert Sparks , tools-discuss@ietf.org References: <0bc0f9f7-d80a-698d-856b-0fada6d1c886@nostrum.com> From: Julian Reschke Message-ID: <38b37377-eba9-279e-9c48-72fbe57d31c2@gmx.de> Date: Tue, 2 Mar 2021 16:45:30 +0100 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows NT 10.0; Win64; x64; rv:78.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/78.8.0 MIME-Version: 1.0 In-Reply-To: <0bc0f9f7-d80a-698d-856b-0fada6d1c886@nostrum.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Provags-ID: V03:K1:qSkAApPgTwVWAYsxcDtbeW20dstkH1Gidpr8LEqEVVKOsK+44ig ShgnZZ4lsHcbgdgw1Hu6+rPPZxqPKJf3f0TBy4yND/CyddGfVzmn21zjXd3II56OARU3fd6 SloDiTF8XwL1dCFciMBUvFdtNwPQeAhkzTxxrV2kDktVDS7RHDNtNZsCurywYL0V2LsTmW2 RAVQBQjmRSl1oO9jpQecQ== X-UI-Out-Filterresults: notjunk:1;V03:K0:cYsP1Rf8KeI=:CiB2dlP7fVGCCbouZ1W1xk hztyhcw8oGVBOfrvOjPUg09MhFqe0kUd+YXG2Uwgyl7acaSZI5K1II8Rb+CJybDzKCk7l5eCA /uZVnaUP7Y+bHsWD7Jv0pi+4b+KhrWtDiFQPkktQbBmRe5nq3h52Zr+Gp8jnvtYHe+t6DAGoC et5VNSkyAGdLpKXV9yC6qmLLEFJscMETLaqatFMpd7tFa0jQlq3WExFeDYiB7QM9449DFVD4g lTOIgYhUUA7ivOh+jS3OkhoZ1sH2obPMJCTArnTBIAPs+5wRuHqT1cNIg/wy5eie6TFuWDZIC V9sUIkpKVQDNfR+Jy/XlOeCJ8wnsqqvjEHdqtnT7iRzV0TyiPuhC1njAQIDoa46QMRtecoCco 0UnF20AYJHzTjZWgY+yExgSZrQVGmrH0smQv5tm5V+9bL4twrl3A58+hpyuVbhF1Q1zPLNG1e wjxohFveErtVRKz7RGalLmHyMYCq0PncFgyscLIUxEQQZQzNjNE3bqgj7bGA7X0Puii43l5Kn VA1IvFgpz+jqaKNxjYXQSn9UzTFYtVpDG+0Wtn34G2J5eswJbn4MduyiVS3H2Sm5+/3g5mXbw ZlS/uu+2BYADAYpr/6gbHk4iGzRZoKYEQyxLqVDi/GcIepEGEV2LCvlpRk8sN8+ShlM+AyoQV 1fJnWkEa4fY28jlqIf+UYl86GeRQueeRcaWh/Zckt2ABPivKoeaNEGTS2QfxUVPvGBGJoyqco 3mFZQIp4CshK7pHQvjKYORVL4tmNAWWxIVkPRon0ybiay2urVZLrNN8ZkHpzfzgdtH17EVbuc VJsx0lHRhYQqNcXG/joi1KAgcMvDMQnspAj/6BXN33lVC8d6xAOzr/1RFHXWMNiQ2NIHWVp3y OUrcipKCUaoWTdfWuVdg== Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Tools-discuss] https://tools.ietf.org/agenda/110/calendar borked? X-BeenThere: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF Tools Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 02 Mar 2021 15:45:52 -0000 Am 02.03.2021 um 16:42 schrieb Robert Sparks: > Hi Julian - > > Are the ics available from the datatracker not filling a need? I can and will try. Is tools variant known to be broken? Best regards, Julian From nobody Tue Mar 2 07:51:44 2021 Return-Path: X-Original-To: tools-discuss@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: tools-discuss@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9BEFF3A2578 for ; Tue, 2 Mar 2021 07:51:43 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.08 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.08 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, NICE_REPLY_A=-0.001, T_SPF_HELO_PERMERROR=0.01, T_SPF_PERMERROR=0.01, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (1024-bit key) header.d=nostrum.com Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id XhHNRGbXyOmZ for ; Tue, 2 Mar 2021 07:51:41 -0800 (PST) Received: from nostrum.com (raven-v6.nostrum.com [IPv6:2001:470:d:1130::1]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 590DB3A2926 for ; Tue, 2 Mar 2021 07:51:37 -0800 (PST) Received: from unformal.local ([47.186.1.92]) (authenticated bits=0) by nostrum.com (8.16.1/8.16.1) with ESMTPSA id 122FpVGM005386 (version=TLSv1.3 cipher=TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 bits=256 verify=NO); Tue, 2 Mar 2021 09:51:32 -0600 (CST) (envelope-from rjsparks@nostrum.com) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=simple/simple; d=nostrum.com; s=default; t=1614700292; bh=hhYer9nYHN6x1fNhIBCvqjCgo8COZiarXcj5jPHZfrw=; h=Subject:To:References:From:Date:In-Reply-To; b=mk1ng5lBq28pLWN+U4Czo4Bme0eazlZQ1X44+VnZ4edjrhRqaSjGqg/MkkEiqWIcQ HqqFRC2dSsFviHkO4bqnskARxzytvEvGPznom2Fu20dUuy4DsOicmqz4EYS8X/lDVl 2+u6dtycGfBC2Kx5R7vVDNgHF+YP1bea8URMuMnY= X-Authentication-Warning: raven.nostrum.com: Host [47.186.1.92] claimed to be unformal.local To: Julian Reschke , tools-discuss@ietf.org References: <0bc0f9f7-d80a-698d-856b-0fada6d1c886@nostrum.com> <38b37377-eba9-279e-9c48-72fbe57d31c2@gmx.de> From: Robert Sparks Message-ID: <1113cbec-169a-54c2-3c2c-8eabcde40324@nostrum.com> Date: Tue, 2 Mar 2021 09:51:26 -0600 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Macintosh; Intel Mac OS X 10.15; rv:78.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/78.8.0 MIME-Version: 1.0 In-Reply-To: <38b37377-eba9-279e-9c48-72fbe57d31c2@gmx.de> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Language: en-US Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Tools-discuss] https://tools.ietf.org/agenda/110/calendar borked? X-BeenThere: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF Tools Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 02 Mar 2021 15:51:44 -0000 On 3/2/21 9:45 AM, Julian Reschke wrote: > Am 02.03.2021 um 16:42 schrieb Robert Sparks: >> Hi Julian - >> >> Are the ics available from the datatracker not filling a need? > > I can and will try. If it's helpful, consider https://datatracker.ietf.org/meeting/110/agenda?show=webtrans Use the "Customize agenda view" panel to tune what you want and don't want to appear in the calendar, then subscribe to (or download) the Customized schedule link. > > Is tools variant known to be broken? It is supported by Henrik at best effort - I'll forward a note to him letting him know you've seen an issue. > > Best regards, Julian > From nobody Tue Mar 2 08:05:48 2021 Return-Path: X-Original-To: tools-discuss@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: tools-discuss@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id E30EC3A27A3 for ; Tue, 2 Mar 2021 08:05:46 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -6.9 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-6.9 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, NICE_REPLY_A=-0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_HI=-5, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_H2=-0.001, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (1024-bit key) header.d=gmx.net Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 6QnMzCv0bhGu for ; Tue, 2 Mar 2021 08:05:45 -0800 (PST) Received: from mout.gmx.net (mout.gmx.net [212.227.17.22]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id EFBEB3A293C for ; Tue, 2 Mar 2021 08:05:44 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/simple; d=gmx.net; s=badeba3b8450; t=1614701141; bh=nL2YUFbk3cybs2jCxPHJm4yPW1UdPQyPyFzSWJV7m/s=; h=X-UI-Sender-Class:Subject:To:References:From:Date:In-Reply-To; b=VQFSFIlK8t1yE6eOiLuZWDrAGP7vZ+4V9gnshzPEojw/zsQ1D92r1jxV8jI34OsS6 QLsMJOEMmIsx9VmDomGziX75rzKtpwc4uUV+tFJ74mvCpfKZEEM5IxSr1Tq5o3mHrz DyA2NbwZC8t0k2eqlTH3/O1u80sAEUK29r4dEAqA= X-UI-Sender-Class: 01bb95c1-4bf8-414a-932a-4f6e2808ef9c Received: from [192.168.178.20] ([91.61.48.133]) by mail.gmx.net (mrgmx105 [212.227.17.168]) with ESMTPSA (Nemesis) id 1ML9yc-1lY69H0l6I-00I9OM for ; Tue, 02 Mar 2021 17:05:41 +0100 To: tools-discuss@ietf.org References: <0bc0f9f7-d80a-698d-856b-0fada6d1c886@nostrum.com> <38b37377-eba9-279e-9c48-72fbe57d31c2@gmx.de> <1113cbec-169a-54c2-3c2c-8eabcde40324@nostrum.com> From: Julian Reschke Message-ID: <4e5be3ea-0a36-7035-d7e0-7a61ab672749@gmx.de> Date: Tue, 2 Mar 2021 17:05:41 +0100 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows NT 10.0; Win64; x64; rv:78.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/78.8.0 MIME-Version: 1.0 In-Reply-To: <1113cbec-169a-54c2-3c2c-8eabcde40324@nostrum.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Provags-ID: V03:K1:j/xw6qtzEZlVgU+LeIMXe8ETTOpo0xRNem2FX5RpirffBh1ndr3 MQvGR+iKgl3mY2PNoG8I4ZEgjmqAQyW6RwdgHcLzGDaz4sharod17z4AIWgiQqe2WoCGFYF ypiOjO7zUjuHcgRXG2K6TpSc3t92veOE+i79O4WJzB0SVRVcicjw01Pv/w6FF3UZjhO9t+N gnm164LBw2yo0CkQsQEEg== X-UI-Out-Filterresults: notjunk:1;V03:K0:c/13xmGp2sA=:WDFyeWNvRYBwVONEKvJqV6 2neMbeKj8HufJrYR9HkhgqMg/2l+SnMAVLCAXtAX723O4opKOraqVefbnyqj49qgNKQnCI4mH 6N1AKyog4+8TybEN/TeZ/QirMI6trQA0RRpw/RpZnepsxj/CPD8RCKDp6Un/V0Df69QEXvIfe wMuQ/MHA6qntSWkPquORIm5Nh8DOTAAV8BLCV8TuloQdnzgiCQv9/yI9QD1CJnvpJgyii0/QW Zjv0f1VOI+mudZ/I6nAidFRqi1alZ6FCXLlavfh+IBxcokZ3PXMJFINZderIf/YckdYGeLI+F IECQRzR+4W+kocSWDcw1GLhFqX/g3+ShLjy68iPhmyby050HdRurGWgP4kjoAl6EbyetJ3Tr/ +uS7hcQDzmku4pk3ld3HM7RBHTT6P9NQx/QKgA3A7zW/RDUxbxB2+SwacKOBHqtHXbb+viuCh EiE+ZgxjZNOpJOKoQ4XZszdtKvTpdR7Tap1F1qrXcGSmYEvtA+g5nTCJkNLihh1WVjWCYQub6 U9GkKEnexR/17+Crh4PlihrAL7TtotKWCvpylgf2envqfnPydR7OWhBoM5ac7brI8/Y4/8UB8 Z9isVRJorzAMaAr8Photk+M/1VdsBcIoLTvAJMKJzBK3rKF/ILHQ8vttj/YpGE19NnYOfedkx lpABWCU9lWXaBsZeoQJy5aMfKb0XWqMn5MGByaa+MOCSW9s5S9d4dcguDjyYRhTp/W+j+sjH8 7KYXC67uOXtUQDs0kuybqKEjipCFCA0Kfy/Thpnz/9A3TlxOJNU6Y1NupNV1CLJxXUhsVRaVO OdZ9/drggBJ6eXhspPu2MEG3ft2eFVsdbB8SCDyeTVlZJZ4lFLSgZi20z5ld6/i0Ui+G9ZSBX eKi54PpsMH2XBVk0NDAg== Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Tools-discuss] https://tools.ietf.org/agenda/110/calendar borked? X-BeenThere: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF Tools Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 02 Mar 2021 16:05:47 -0000 Am 02.03.2021 um 16:51 schrieb Robert Sparks: > > On 3/2/21 9:45 AM, Julian Reschke wrote: >> Am 02.03.2021 um 16:42 schrieb Robert Sparks: >>> Hi Julian - >>> >>> Are the ics available from the datatracker not filling a need? >> >> I can and will try. > > If it's helpful, consider > > https://datatracker.ietf.org/meeting/110/agenda?show=3Dwebtrans > > Use the "Customize agenda view" panel to tune what you want and don't > want to appear in the calendar, then subscribe to (or download) the > Customized schedule link. Tried and works for me. FWIW, downloading the ICS usually is the wrong thing. We should encourage users to *subscribe* to the ICS file (that is, in Thunderbird, configure this as a calendar on the network). >> Is tools variant known to be broken? > > It is supported by Henrik at best effort - I'll forward a note to him > letting him know you've seen an issue. Thanks, Julian From nobody Tue Mar 2 08:10:18 2021 Return-Path: X-Original-To: tools-discuss@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: tools-discuss@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2CDE33A299C for ; Tue, 2 Mar 2021 08:10:12 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.08 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.08 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, NICE_REPLY_A=-0.001, T_SPF_HELO_PERMERROR=0.01, T_SPF_PERMERROR=0.01, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (1024-bit key) header.d=nostrum.com Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id FIJ-gcZc1yFo for ; Tue, 2 Mar 2021 08:10:08 -0800 (PST) Received: from nostrum.com (raven-v6.nostrum.com [IPv6:2001:470:d:1130::1]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id A08D83A293C for ; Tue, 2 Mar 2021 08:10:08 -0800 (PST) Received: from unformal.local ([47.186.1.92]) (authenticated bits=0) by nostrum.com (8.16.1/8.16.1) with ESMTPSA id 122GA7Fp012031 (version=TLSv1.3 cipher=TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 bits=256 verify=NO) for ; Tue, 2 Mar 2021 10:10:08 -0600 (CST) (envelope-from rjsparks@nostrum.com) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=simple/simple; d=nostrum.com; s=default; t=1614701408; bh=5dCIGDv8xz3xPvACMnzO7Yp8IEkptNYG4w1xVQidbMI=; h=Subject:To:References:From:Date:In-Reply-To; b=jnj0nCodecYE+uaIS/YYgxLZsxBJeBY4xhFcojcrGyS7jje9xKrREqpWA/O8mbLNU OLAe5LcpwwM5hdsZJ7+e8ykz1jcs+OHT75wmZUrelTPfKYMIiaN2l1K3ogha0w0U0o OITuTIzYcYrhCpQLswNai2EY1w5cehPn4lxYOqs0= X-Authentication-Warning: raven.nostrum.com: Host [47.186.1.92] claimed to be unformal.local To: tools-discuss@ietf.org References: <0bc0f9f7-d80a-698d-856b-0fada6d1c886@nostrum.com> <38b37377-eba9-279e-9c48-72fbe57d31c2@gmx.de> <1113cbec-169a-54c2-3c2c-8eabcde40324@nostrum.com> <4e5be3ea-0a36-7035-d7e0-7a61ab672749@gmx.de> From: Robert Sparks Message-ID: <40b6c906-9f13-975c-d92c-79890dc6d471@nostrum.com> Date: Tue, 2 Mar 2021 10:10:02 -0600 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Macintosh; Intel Mac OS X 10.15; rv:78.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/78.8.0 MIME-Version: 1.0 In-Reply-To: <4e5be3ea-0a36-7035-d7e0-7a61ab672749@gmx.de> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Language: en-US Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Tools-discuss] https://tools.ietf.org/agenda/110/calendar borked? X-BeenThere: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF Tools Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 02 Mar 2021 16:10:17 -0000 On 3/2/21 10:05 AM, Julian Reschke wrote: > Am 02.03.2021 um 16:51 schrieb Robert Sparks: >> >> On 3/2/21 9:45 AM, Julian Reschke wrote: >>> Am 02.03.2021 um 16:42 schrieb Robert Sparks: >>>> Hi Julian - >>>> >>>> Are the ics available from the datatracker not filling a need? >>> >>> I can and will try. >> >> If it's helpful, consider >> >> https://datatracker.ietf.org/meeting/110/agenda?show=webtrans >> >> Use the "Customize agenda view" panel to tune what you want and don't >> want to appear in the calendar, then subscribe to (or download) the >> Customized schedule link. > > Tried and works for me. > > FWIW, downloading the ICS usually is the wrong thing. We should > encourage users to *subscribe* to the ICS file (that is, in Thunderbird, > configure this as a calendar on the network). Yes - we have webcal: links on several other pages to promote that behavior, and should make a similar change to this one. But when we started discussing that, there were people that noted they required download as corporate security policies made subscription impossible. RjS > >>> Is tools variant known to be broken? >> >> It is supported by Henrik at best effort - I'll forward a note to him >> letting him know you've seen an issue. > > Thanks, Julian > > ___________________________________________________________ > Tools-discuss mailing list - Tools-discuss@ietf.org > This list is for discussion, not for action requests or bug reports. > * Report datatracker and mailarchive bugs to: > datatracker-project@ietf.org > * Report tools.ietf.org bugs to: webmaster@tools.ietf.org > * Report all other bugs or issues to: ietf-action@ietf.org > List info (including how to Unsubscribe): > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/tools-discuss From nobody Tue Mar 2 08:17:12 2021 Return-Path: X-Original-To: tools-discuss@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: tools-discuss@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6223F3A2959 for ; Tue, 2 Mar 2021 08:17:07 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.098 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.098 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=gmail.com Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 63-wm_bFzhag for ; Tue, 2 Mar 2021 08:17:06 -0800 (PST) Received: from mail-wr1-x429.google.com (mail-wr1-x429.google.com [IPv6:2a00:1450:4864:20::429]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id C9C763A295E for ; Tue, 2 Mar 2021 08:17:05 -0800 (PST) Received: by mail-wr1-x429.google.com with SMTP id v15so20494827wrx.4 for ; Tue, 02 Mar 2021 08:17:05 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20161025; h=from:message-id:mime-version:subject:date:in-reply-to:cc:to :references; bh=TrgwwcQuDDonmFQ3TGfRNkAN9i/q5cRM+b9sfDFn9DQ=; b=PG1qK1ar3nk2+dMBnSMKcqX+RCZjWo7rVDpmY3pWQqadnb4YGh6JWUdA606tWvJwHh qAJW9mnDMA3btJeX2Gaqlw+5JrsfLiE1NpFCGl78pyJ/vetoUKlE9fEyxHtcDBG2cbt4 QHW3eipI/4i1y1rzeRwLQWL1N7+F1PLlrFn04nI1ZxXh0WTmMGG25OjAufniqru4275O F5Y3eT+JPW1bL918MyLwW3TyTLcVmvQtdvBuCP1fDfeEISWf4nfpOFj2eItrtscu4SrR NanphMvGRgYJRCjGsp1XW5LOfbU4eowjI1X59SxVYD+ZVMF7pANJpxNjZ0pb9Xj0Cxsn xzWg== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:from:message-id:mime-version:subject:date :in-reply-to:cc:to:references; bh=TrgwwcQuDDonmFQ3TGfRNkAN9i/q5cRM+b9sfDFn9DQ=; b=hqiS/TFDtpK3GGMD8cRq/h3U80UxkrCnM5SwC3yEVO2VEqiid3dIP95M8S+8ig7Pjw Lc5MeaNeYEhIxT5Yb5J/EbMi77JmniczRsKIkPAOTrzsPNBj3eTGYNJI8fyd/oX5rxqw 8sJgBcWVKRKyz5PN35Xn9DUjoQbJB3Co0/pP0Zd20ahzZitE1HOCa1XXbReEmHZEcEXJ /Stz4dQInHmEaIgPffZcgBt3RzRVlHg7PtsDoJOmwkQ0jbsF8dA2X261L3wQ8BKbhXsP dY9vwnWIZHRyVyatq0y8Exo04rzv0Z3V08MbLzYjW35FkVBBRR6IPEhBK829YxVqhQvr XSGw== X-Gm-Message-State: AOAM53320vbQx3gG/rpHpvnITIwkhAm32F26BVKeMj2wkuloRf4/tNtO qnjbh4xM3IO7iIQs5IRT9TI= X-Google-Smtp-Source: ABdhPJxhfEIUycL0b+1+kKw7BEVkfsPWHdUW/6ubkASggh5cedQAoNT/M6F/oVY9RjHOMTiyfignAw== X-Received: by 2002:a5d:4fca:: with SMTP id h10mr23589852wrw.70.1614701822855; Tue, 02 Mar 2021 08:17:02 -0800 (PST) Received: from [10.0.0.199] (c-24-5-53-184.hsd1.ca.comcast.net. [24.5.53.184]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id b15sm3989529wmd.41.2021.03.02.08.17.01 (version=TLS1_2 cipher=ECDHE-ECDSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 bits=128/128); Tue, 02 Mar 2021 08:17:02 -0800 (PST) From: Bob Hinden Message-Id: <751BBB53-AD64-444A-BBA8-1CB6D953D99F@gmail.com> Content-Type: multipart/signed; boundary="Apple-Mail=_2C49D54A-53FF-44A5-9340-4361144C2D6B"; protocol="application/pgp-signature"; micalg=pgp-sha512 Mime-Version: 1.0 (Mac OS X Mail 12.4 \(3445.104.17\)) Date: Tue, 2 Mar 2021 08:16:58 -0800 In-Reply-To: <1113cbec-169a-54c2-3c2c-8eabcde40324@nostrum.com> Cc: Bob Hinden , tools-discuss To: Robert Sparks References: <0bc0f9f7-d80a-698d-856b-0fada6d1c886@nostrum.com> <38b37377-eba9-279e-9c48-72fbe57d31c2@gmx.de> <1113cbec-169a-54c2-3c2c-8eabcde40324@nostrum.com> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.3445.104.17) Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Tools-discuss] https://tools.ietf.org/agenda/110/calendar borked? X-BeenThere: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF Tools Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 02 Mar 2021 16:17:07 -0000 --Apple-Mail=_2C49D54A-53FF-44A5-9340-4361144C2D6B Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Robert, > On Mar 2, 2021, at 7:51 AM, Robert Sparks = wrote: >=20 >=20 >=20 >>=20 >> Is tools variant known to be broken? >=20 > It is supported by Henrik at best effort - I'll forward a note to him = letting him know you've seen an issue. I have subscribed to = https://tools.ietf.org/agenda/110/ics/ietf-110-hrpc+rfcefdp+spring+iabopen= +v6ops+6man+tsvarea+tsvwg+shmoo+gendispatch+homenet+IETF-Plenary+intarea.i= cs with a refresh every day. This morning it was gone, after a few manual = refreshes it reappeared. I reported this to Henrik last week. Bob >=20 >>=20 >> Best regards, Julian >>=20 >=20 > ___________________________________________________________ > Tools-discuss mailing list - Tools-discuss@ietf.org > This list is for discussion, not for action requests or bug reports. > * Report datatracker and mailarchive bugs to: = datatracker-project@ietf.org > * Report tools.ietf.org bugs to: webmaster@tools.ietf.org > * Report all other bugs or issues to: ietf-action@ietf.org > List info (including how to Unsubscribe): = https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/tools-discuss --Apple-Mail=_2C49D54A-53FF-44A5-9340-4361144C2D6B Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: attachment; filename=signature.asc Content-Type: application/pgp-signature; name=signature.asc Content-Description: Message signed with OpenPGP -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- iQEzBAEBCgAdFiEEm0rfRsOCoyamPexGrut0EXfnu6gFAmA+ZPoACgkQrut0EXfn u6ja0wf8CJGfxg29TSdEEU+mo/zj5OUV7SyoZy6WwwQMD8Bl0DppzofEU1jNj10X veZ5PjblYhcIB2YUggJ0KIFceFsel3srMbAmO9dkBRP5tGcLZKxYuzM7lpN5eBib dTUCE4y+f3Ci1dwR+sOTkReKkskFXXznxsjdifztGvFDtlkyjOE3uUz+50tk4sQk dr9kmkot3agoSgg6CUVQjMRx0a/zA/4iFEswUMg5gJxbJrU7V5sgKtHGu6A8lGYA fUW/7TjGiUyru+QSrX07jxs6O/p/pqvkAR8TEVRCq+0M5PgdogTYW+Q4k8SytsNy TONTtcwwmjyuEUnmnZjqCqaHfMq11A== =ekfT -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --Apple-Mail=_2C49D54A-53FF-44A5-9340-4361144C2D6B-- From nobody Tue Mar 2 08:21:08 2021 Return-Path: X-Original-To: tools-discuss@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: tools-discuss@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4A7EC3A2954 for ; Tue, 2 Mar 2021 08:21:06 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.9 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.9 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, NICE_REPLY_A=-0.001, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_H2=-0.001, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (1024-bit key) header.d=gmx.net Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id XrBXiHGzn7hA for ; Tue, 2 Mar 2021 08:21:04 -0800 (PST) Received: from mout.gmx.net (mout.gmx.net [212.227.17.22]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 1118D3A1413 for ; Tue, 2 Mar 2021 08:21:03 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/simple; d=gmx.net; s=badeba3b8450; t=1614702062; bh=w764NtBz3VsPEbOeaAaDl3yn2ZnVUVE+WEyryAcjPXQ=; h=X-UI-Sender-Class:Subject:To:References:From:Date:In-Reply-To; b=a7mIGKQJugf4ETYk5lCIb5eeHUSWZJnppw40T5uJK71s+CCVsiGt+/KXa5eBn/cxG rXXRa9PmHGCcNCK1neyYMFAGv6K8Zb9DierhnRv2+9tVhFLQlnSdW/3W/rZ7Ar4owD kPSxy7ZDFLvvP60DBqe3GH983H909FnsAfdCoucI= X-UI-Sender-Class: 01bb95c1-4bf8-414a-932a-4f6e2808ef9c Received: from [192.168.178.20] ([91.61.48.133]) by mail.gmx.net (mrgmx104 [212.227.17.168]) with ESMTPSA (Nemesis) id 1N0X8u-1m2VC60qOq-00wTcI for ; Tue, 02 Mar 2021 17:21:02 +0100 To: tools-discuss@ietf.org References: <0bc0f9f7-d80a-698d-856b-0fada6d1c886@nostrum.com> <38b37377-eba9-279e-9c48-72fbe57d31c2@gmx.de> <1113cbec-169a-54c2-3c2c-8eabcde40324@nostrum.com> <4e5be3ea-0a36-7035-d7e0-7a61ab672749@gmx.de> <40b6c906-9f13-975c-d92c-79890dc6d471@nostrum.com> From: Julian Reschke Message-ID: Date: Tue, 2 Mar 2021 17:21:01 +0100 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows NT 10.0; Win64; x64; rv:78.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/78.8.0 MIME-Version: 1.0 In-Reply-To: <40b6c906-9f13-975c-d92c-79890dc6d471@nostrum.com> Content-Type: text/plain; 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X-BeenThere: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF Tools Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 02 Mar 2021 16:21:06 -0000 Am 02.03.2021 um 17:10 schrieb Robert Sparks: > > On 3/2/21 10:05 AM, Julian Reschke wrote: >> Am 02.03.2021 um 16:51 schrieb Robert Sparks: >>> >>> On 3/2/21 9:45 AM, Julian Reschke wrote: >>>> Am 02.03.2021 um 16:42 schrieb Robert Sparks: >>>>> Hi Julian - >>>>> >>>>> Are the ics available from the datatracker not filling a need? >>>> >>>> I can and will try. >>> >>> If it's helpful, consider >>> >>> https://datatracker.ietf.org/meeting/110/agenda?show=3Dwebtrans >>> >>> Use the "Customize agenda view" panel to tune what you want and don't >>> want to appear in the calendar, then subscribe to (or download) the >>> Customized schedule link. >> >> Tried and works for me. >> >> FWIW, downloading the ICS usually is the wrong thing. We should >> encourage users to *subscribe* to the ICS file (that is, in Thunderbird= , >> configure this as a calendar on the network). > > Yes - we have webcal: links on several other pages to promote that > behavior, and should make a similar change to this one. Uh, ugly. "webcal" is only provisionally registered without a spec link. (and it's really not a different protocol, just an "intent" connected to the handling of an http(s) resource). I would prefer a "copy ICS link to clipboard" option, or at least a statement next to the download button that "copy link target" will get you something you can subscribe to... > ... Best regards, Julian From nobody Tue Mar 2 08:24:24 2021 Return-Path: X-Original-To: tools-discuss@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: tools-discuss@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 88ECA3A2977 for ; Tue, 2 Mar 2021 08:24:22 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.08 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.08 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, NICE_REPLY_A=-0.001, T_SPF_HELO_PERMERROR=0.01, T_SPF_PERMERROR=0.01, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (1024-bit key) header.d=nostrum.com Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id ACnAEmr8nf2b for ; Tue, 2 Mar 2021 08:24:20 -0800 (PST) Received: from nostrum.com (raven-v6.nostrum.com [IPv6:2001:470:d:1130::1]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 279D33A2976 for ; Tue, 2 Mar 2021 08:24:20 -0800 (PST) Received: from unformal.local ([47.186.1.92]) (authenticated bits=0) by nostrum.com (8.16.1/8.16.1) with ESMTPSA id 122GOFe6017022 (version=TLSv1.3 cipher=TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 bits=256 verify=NO); Tue, 2 Mar 2021 10:24:15 -0600 (CST) (envelope-from rjsparks@nostrum.com) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=simple/simple; d=nostrum.com; s=default; t=1614702255; bh=YdXJ1DukkaVGed0nSrAj2uXDUjtofFQWPye85iFwvps=; h=Subject:To:Cc:References:From:Date:In-Reply-To; b=XckB/jE71LZJCcLHq7w+7IXixMoveNACNjk8d/rFxjSHOoCtUzQ9af62VISG1+5t2 AxgFwMKZoW8bpje4lQN4GjKE5Ir8sQDmd3Eg8qJUBnuXxp65Mijs+HJUkppQptehfu EIL15rglaiMKRwXfr5c6kbuTXZ94EosryTj54FHU= X-Authentication-Warning: raven.nostrum.com: Host [47.186.1.92] claimed to be unformal.local To: Bob Hinden Cc: tools-discuss References: <0bc0f9f7-d80a-698d-856b-0fada6d1c886@nostrum.com> <38b37377-eba9-279e-9c48-72fbe57d31c2@gmx.de> <1113cbec-169a-54c2-3c2c-8eabcde40324@nostrum.com> <751BBB53-AD64-444A-BBA8-1CB6D953D99F@gmail.com> From: Robert Sparks Message-ID: <70bc5781-c547-c4b2-9d3f-b5fbf0d0413f@nostrum.com> Date: Tue, 2 Mar 2021 10:24:10 -0600 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Macintosh; Intel Mac OS X 10.15; rv:78.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/78.8.0 MIME-Version: 1.0 In-Reply-To: <751BBB53-AD64-444A-BBA8-1CB6D953D99F@gmail.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=windows-1252; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Language: en-US Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Tools-discuss] https://tools.ietf.org/agenda/110/calendar borked? X-BeenThere: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF Tools Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 02 Mar 2021 16:24:23 -0000 On 3/2/21 10:16 AM, Bob Hinden wrote: > Robert, > >> On Mar 2, 2021, at 7:51 AM, Robert Sparks wrote: >> >> >> >>> Is tools variant known to be broken? >> It is supported by Henrik at best effort - I'll forward a note to him letting him know you've seen an issue. > I have subscribed to > > https://tools.ietf.org/agenda/110/ics/ietf-110-hrpc+rfcefdp+spring+iabopen+v6ops+6man+tsvarea+tsvwg+shmoo+gendispatch+homenet+IETF-Plenary+intarea.ics > > with a refresh every day. This morning it was gone, after a few manual refreshes it reappeared. I reported this to Henrik last week. Consider https://datatracker.ietf.org/meeting/110/agenda?show=hrpc,rfcefdp,spring,iabopen,v6ops,6man,tsvarea,tsvwg,shmoo,gendispatch,homenet,plenary,intarea and the corresponding .ics at https://datatracker.ietf.org/meeting/110/agenda.ics?show=hrpc,rfcefdp,spring,iabopen,v6ops,6man,tsvarea,tsvwg,shmoo,gendispatch,homenet,plenary,intarea > > Bob > > >>> Best regards, Julian >>> >> ___________________________________________________________ >> Tools-discuss mailing list - Tools-discuss@ietf.org >> This list is for discussion, not for action requests or bug reports. >> * Report datatracker and mailarchive bugs to: datatracker-project@ietf.org >> * Report tools.ietf.org bugs to: webmaster@tools.ietf.org >> * Report all other bugs or issues to: ietf-action@ietf.org >> List info (including how to Unsubscribe): https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/tools-discuss From nobody Tue Mar 2 09:35:45 2021 Return-Path: X-Original-To: tools-discuss@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: tools-discuss@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 72FDA3A0A69 for ; Tue, 2 Mar 2021 09:35:43 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.899 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.899 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id ELYpx6OHeTeM for ; Tue, 2 Mar 2021 09:35:41 -0800 (PST) Received: from tuna.sandelman.ca (tuna.sandelman.ca [209.87.249.19]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ADH-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 1B4DC3A0A65 for ; Tue, 2 Mar 2021 09:35:41 -0800 (PST) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by tuna.sandelman.ca (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3C24938995 for ; Tue, 2 Mar 2021 12:40:13 -0500 (EST) Received: from tuna.sandelman.ca ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id twP9x1BNAyWf for ; Tue, 2 Mar 2021 12:40:12 -0500 (EST) Received: from sandelman.ca (obiwan.sandelman.ca [IPv6:2607:f0b0:f:2::247]) by tuna.sandelman.ca (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0B7FA38994 for ; Tue, 2 Mar 2021 12:40:12 -0500 (EST) Received: from localhost (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by sandelman.ca (Postfix) with ESMTP id CE9D3BCA for ; Tue, 2 Mar 2021 12:35:37 -0500 (EST) From: Michael Richardson To: tools-discuss In-Reply-To: <751BBB53-AD64-444A-BBA8-1CB6D953D99F@gmail.com> References: <0bc0f9f7-d80a-698d-856b-0fada6d1c886@nostrum.com> <38b37377-eba9-279e-9c48-72fbe57d31c2@gmx.de> <1113cbec-169a-54c2-3c2c-8eabcde40324@nostrum.com> <751BBB53-AD64-444A-BBA8-1CB6D953D99F@gmail.com> X-Mailer: MH-E 8.6+git; nmh 1.7+dev; GNU Emacs 26.1 X-Face: $\n1pF)h^`}$H>Hk{L"x@)JS7<%Az}5RyS@k9X%29-lHB$Ti.V>2bi.~ehC0; <'$9xN5Ub# z!G,p`nR&p7Fz@^UXIn156S8.~^@MJ*mMsD7=QFeq%AL4m Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Tools-discuss] https://tools.ietf.org/agenda/110/calendar borked? X-BeenThere: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF Tools Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 02 Mar 2021 17:35:43 -0000 --=-=-= Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable I'll just mention that I use this bit of indirect script: #!/bin/sh mkdir -p /ssw/docs/SSW/ietf/meeting/ietf110 cd /ssw/docs/SSW/ietf/meeting/ietf110 GROUPS=3Dshow=3D6lo GROUPS=3D$GROUPS,6man GROUPS=3D$GROUPS,danish GROUPS=3D$GROUPS,madinas GROUPS=3D$GROUPS,ace ... curl -s >agenda.ics "https://datatracker.ietf.org/meeting/110/agenda.ics?$G= ROUPS" and I subscribe to that (plus cron). ("/ssw/docs" is a live NFS mount of my= web server) I do this because I realized that I had to unsubscribe/subscribe if I wanted to change the list of groups, since it's in the URL. Solved by a layer of = indirection... =2D- Michael Richardson . o O ( IPv6 I=C3=B8T consulti= ng ) Sandelman Software Works Inc, Ottawa and Worldwide --=-=-= Content-Type: application/pgp-signature; name="signature.asc" -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- iQEzBAEBCgAdFiEEbsyLEzg/qUTA43uogItw+93Q3WUFAmA+d2kACgkQgItw+93Q 3WWBdwf/RwyNp82/Mf3ml8bsgxK5bHHHd/YDOUxdj8K15Y6c5vxznLQD+yjtOwNW ZnfrhExAGQZTDNqTZ8E/J6BtJCgXL0GThy10qLdvMuBOGyHfHRCMsvpgWzsT1itM 2DMNcr8EoC/YVtsFjB1L1CcONb5Q83gJg0JL8gP5F3eFFIewvdxxNiiF3YIEi1Gl gTCT4SzoSeRYdD6nl7+4furE3LCg9q1R3Zy+3llsrCQdzrE1myTanEnRpHN9r+yt JMvRWoRqiDklaz0XnpnYtvPUk+fL5GqwJuVVxFraJyxB43KhelKPTzAuNH1CmwFS Zi27S+jKKIbTxFsMnUDvsPSK5ItKyg== =ypli -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --=-=-=-- From nobody Wed Mar 3 03:46:56 2021 Return-Path: X-Original-To: tools-discuss@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: tools-discuss@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 248B63A0E28 for ; Wed, 3 Mar 2021 03:46:55 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -0.654 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-0.654 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, NORMAL_HTTP_TO_IP=0.001, NUMERIC_HTTP_ADDR=1.242, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_NONE=0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id Whekt1tFsbJM for ; Wed, 3 Mar 2021 03:46:52 -0800 (PST) Received: from p130.piuha.net (p130.piuha.net [193.234.219.226]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id ACF243A0E25 for ; Wed, 3 Mar 2021 03:46:52 -0800 (PST) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by p130.piuha.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id E304A660169 for ; Wed, 3 Mar 2021 13:46:50 +0200 (EET) Received: from p130.piuha.net ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (p130.piuha.net [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id y_Bu8B-Y0I2W for ; Wed, 3 Mar 2021 13:46:49 +0200 (EET) Received: from [127.0.0.1] (p226.piuha.net [193.234.219.226]) by p130.piuha.net (Postfix) with ESMTPS id E85DD66020C for ; Wed, 3 Mar 2021 13:46:48 +0200 (EET) From: Jari Arkko Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Mime-Version: 1.0 (Mac OS X Mail 10.3 \(3273\)) Message-Id: <91F3E0A4-78A4-42BA-8F4C-B6A8A77B4D33@piuha.net> Date: Wed, 3 Mar 2021 13:46:47 +0200 To: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.3273) Archived-At: Subject: [Tools-discuss] tools.ietf.org oddness X-BeenThere: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF Tools Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 03 Mar 2021 11:46:55 -0000 I noticed odd behaviour with tools.ietf.org today. Click on a tools link = to a draft, get 404. E.g., = https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-arkko-emu-rfc3748bis My computer uses = 2001:1890:126c::1:2a or 64.170.98.42 to access the website. At first I = thought this might be that some process stopped and no drafts have been = updated. But then I also get to the draft, sometimes. And at other times = I get to a draft but depending on the version I request, I get a = different indication of what the highest level draft is. For instance, = for the following draft -11 is the correct latest version, and I can = currently get to the draft with = https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-core-dev-urn-11 but if I use = https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-core-dev-urn-00 it only shows = versions up to -10. Is one instance somewhere down/behind updates or = what=E2=80=99s going on? Maybe I haven=E2=80=99t got enough sleep or am doing something stupid. = Or there=E2=80=99s a local problem. But anyone else see any issues? Three trials with wget below, first with dns resolution and -6, the = second one with dns resolution and -4, and the third one with direct IP = address (4.31.198.62) and header/cert options to make that work. The = first two trials fail, the third one succeeds. Jari $ wget -6 https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-arkko-emu-rfc3748bis --2021-03-03 13:40:15-- = https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-arkko-emu-rfc3748bis Resolving tools.ietf.org (tools.ietf.org)... 2001:1890:126c::1:2a, = 2001:1900:3001:11::3e Connecting to tools.ietf.org = (tools.ietf.org)|2001:1890:126c::1:2a|:443... connected. HTTP request sent, awaiting response... 404 Not found: = (draft-arkko-emu-rfc3748bis-00.txt) 2021-03-03 13:40:18 ERROR 404: Not found: = (draft-arkko-emu-rfc3748bis-00.txt). $ wget -4 https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-arkko-emu-rfc3748bis --2021-03-03 13:40:23-- = https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-arkko-emu-rfc3748bis Resolving tools.ietf.org (tools.ietf.org)... 64.170.98.42, 4.31.198.62 Connecting to tools.ietf.org (tools.ietf.org)|64.170.98.42|:443... = connected. HTTP request sent, awaiting response... 404 Not found: = (draft-arkko-emu-rfc3748bis-00.txt) 2021-03-03 13:40:26 ERROR 404: Not found: = (draft-arkko-emu-rfc3748bis-00.txt). $ wget --no-check-certificate -4 = https://4.31.198.62/html/draft-arkko-emu-rfc3748bis --header "Host: = tools.ietf.org" --2021-03-03 13:41:24-- = https://4.31.198.62/html/draft-arkko-emu-rfc3748bis Connecting to 4.31.198.62:443... connected. WARNING: certificate common name '*.tools.ietf.org' doesn't match = requested host name '4.31.198.62'. HTTP request sent, awaiting response... 302 Found Location: https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-arkko-emu-rfc3748bis-00 = [following] --2021-03-03 13:41:26-- = https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-arkko-emu-rfc3748bis-00 Resolving tools.ietf.org (tools.ietf.org)... 4.31.198.62, 64.170.98.42 Connecting to tools.ietf.org (tools.ietf.org)|4.31.198.62|:443... = connected. HTTP request sent, awaiting response... 200 OK Length: 229753 (224K) [text/html] Saving to: 'draft-arkko-emu-rfc3748bis' draft-arkko-emu-rfc3748bis = 100%[=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D>] 224.37K 186KB/s in 1.2s =20 2021-03-03 13:41:28 (186 KB/s) - 'draft-arkko-emu-rfc3748bis' saved = [229753/229753] From nobody Wed Mar 3 05:13:52 2021 Return-Path: X-Original-To: tools-discuss@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: tools-discuss@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9AC5A3A10E4 for ; Wed, 3 Mar 2021 05:13:51 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: 1.08 X-Spam-Level: * X-Spam-Status: No, score=1.08 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, PDS_TONAME_EQ_TOLOCAL_SHORT=1.999, PDS_TONAME_EQ_TOLOCAL_VSHORT=0.999, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_BLOCKED=0.001, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_H3=-0.01, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_WL=-0.01, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=no autolearn_force=no Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id wDtPOOGKYBI1 for ; Wed, 3 Mar 2021 05:13:49 -0800 (PST) Received: from gabriel-vm-2.zfn.uni-bremen.de (gabriel-vm-2.zfn.uni-bremen.de [134.102.50.17]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher AECDH-AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 2FDF53A10E2 for ; Wed, 3 Mar 2021 05:13:49 -0800 (PST) Received: from [192.168.217.123] (p5089a828.dip0.t-ipconnect.de [80.137.168.40]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by gabriel-vm-2.zfn.uni-bremen.de (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 4DrDwB1yXwzym4; Wed, 3 Mar 2021 14:13:46 +0100 (CET) From: Carsten Bormann Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Mao-Original-Outgoing-Id: 636470025.76796-47d1f679ef93ce4d301d328eeeded0f7 Mime-Version: 1.0 (Mac OS X Mail 13.4 \(3608.120.23.2.4\)) Date: Wed, 3 Mar 2021 14:13:46 +0100 Message-Id: <81FC2389-5B3E-4252-8C0C-9F17B8B44046@tzi.org> To: tools-discuss X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.3608.120.23.2.4) Archived-At: Subject: [Tools-discuss] https://tools.ietf.org/demo/www.ietf.org/submit/ X-BeenThere: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF Tools Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 03 Mar 2021 13:13:52 -0000 Is this still alive? Should it be? Gr=C3=BC=C3=9Fe, Carsten From nobody Wed Mar 3 07:41:36 2021 Return-Path: X-Original-To: tools-discuss@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: tools-discuss@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id B3D2D3A150F for ; Wed, 3 Mar 2021 07:41:34 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.899 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.899 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 94t-Sgte2rFE for ; Wed, 3 Mar 2021 07:41:32 -0800 (PST) Received: from tuna.sandelman.ca (tuna.sandelman.ca [209.87.249.19]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ADH-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id E6A753A150D for ; Wed, 3 Mar 2021 07:41:31 -0800 (PST) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by tuna.sandelman.ca (Postfix) with ESMTP id D8724389A5; Wed, 3 Mar 2021 10:46:07 -0500 (EST) Received: from tuna.sandelman.ca ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id cVzkSQiTEqqM; Wed, 3 Mar 2021 10:46:07 -0500 (EST) Received: from sandelman.ca (obiwan.sandelman.ca [IPv6:2607:f0b0:f:2::247]) by tuna.sandelman.ca (Postfix) with ESMTP id 583AB389A4; Wed, 3 Mar 2021 10:46:07 -0500 (EST) Received: from localhost (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by sandelman.ca (Postfix) with ESMTP id AA6CF885; Wed, 3 Mar 2021 10:41:29 -0500 (EST) From: Michael Richardson To: Carsten Bormann cc: tools-discuss In-Reply-To: <81FC2389-5B3E-4252-8C0C-9F17B8B44046@tzi.org> References: <81FC2389-5B3E-4252-8C0C-9F17B8B44046@tzi.org> X-Mailer: MH-E 8.6+git; nmh 1.7+dev; GNU Emacs 26.1 X-Face: $\n1pF)h^`}$H>Hk{L"x@)JS7<%Az}5RyS@k9X%29-lHB$Ti.V>2bi.~ehC0; <'$9xN5Ub# z!G,p`nR&p7Fz@^UXIn156S8.~^@MJ*mMsD7=QFeq%AL4m Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Tools-discuss] https://tools.ietf.org/demo/www.ietf.org/submit/ X-BeenThere: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF Tools Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 03 Mar 2021 15:41:35 -0000 --=-=-= Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Carsten Bormann wrote: > Is this still alive? > Should it be? You are asking about, https://tools.ietf.org/demo/www.ietf.org/submit/ which my eyes had difficulty figuring out was mentioned in the subject. I think it should be turned into a redirect. I didn't try it, but it looks like it wouldn't work. =2D- Michael Richardson . o O ( IPv6 I=C3=B8T consulti= ng ) Sandelman Software Works Inc, Ottawa and Worldwide --=-=-= Content-Type: application/pgp-signature; name="signature.asc" -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- iQEzBAEBCgAdFiEEbsyLEzg/qUTA43uogItw+93Q3WUFAmA/rikACgkQgItw+93Q 3WWuRQf/eS9SRxfg4xBiU1TMCVLqSo0W5v/tq6DM+x2yWs2cIXnVT0YTQzBw15dI h3MIg904OV+uhfKskdfaBF7bmTzytM8yebNd6BVF2sRRQgC3Nd8vQODTdscan1CF GEL3+GHdhuIVMrd5mjp7mY5dWB7CnJi4c2sDDYIk4vO11IdY80QXLEt1XxizFodn WYKBoQn7ztezNDfFlSvK15Mnnsi18K3pyxxgwPVr+mGkKz/J+VZlSqb0WFIcR3kL GOWlR7jLmZ7uoNprGuYkZgrLCLSora79wfqqYbzxqxUtNP/UCsGZQneCYhqfYX1V twG2fPHS93XTiU/mXuuK92OWMTOOIw== =OveU -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --=-=-=-- From nobody Wed Mar 3 07:56:15 2021 Return-Path: X-Original-To: tools-discuss@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: tools-discuss@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4D2B13A1578 for ; Wed, 3 Mar 2021 07:56:14 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.918 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.918 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_BLOCKED=0.001, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_H3=-0.01, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_WL=-0.01, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 4Nn3q29zgZk7 for ; Wed, 3 Mar 2021 07:56:11 -0800 (PST) Received: from gabriel-vm-2.zfn.uni-bremen.de (gabriel-vm-2.zfn.uni-bremen.de [134.102.50.17]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher AECDH-AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 6DA143A1576 for ; Wed, 3 Mar 2021 07:56:11 -0800 (PST) Received: from [192.168.217.123] (p5089a828.dip0.t-ipconnect.de [80.137.168.40]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by gabriel-vm-2.zfn.uni-bremen.de (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 4DrJWX6D0BzyT3; Wed, 3 Mar 2021 16:56:08 +0100 (CET) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Mime-Version: 1.0 (Mac OS X Mail 13.4 \(3608.120.23.2.4\)) From: Carsten Bormann In-Reply-To: <24844.1614786089@localhost> Date: Wed, 3 Mar 2021 16:56:08 +0100 Cc: tools-discuss X-Mao-Original-Outgoing-Id: 636479768.4160039-31e99eb0e9ef3ab47b4e78dc524c1134 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Message-Id: <4264566C-9118-42B6-85BD-D32001DF8A35@tzi.org> References: <81FC2389-5B3E-4252-8C0C-9F17B8B44046@tzi.org> <24844.1614786089@localhost> To: Michael Richardson X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.3608.120.23.2.4) Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Tools-discuss] https://tools.ietf.org/demo/www.ietf.org/submit/ X-BeenThere: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF Tools Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 03 Mar 2021 15:56:14 -0000 On 2021-03-03, at 16:41, Michael Richardson = wrote: >=20 >=20 > Carsten Bormann wrote: >> Is this still alive? >> Should it be? >=20 > You are asking about, https://tools.ietf.org/demo/www.ietf.org/submit/ > which my eyes had difficulty figuring out was mentioned in the = subject. > I think it should be turned into a redirect. I didn't try it, but it = looks > like it wouldn't work. Well, it is a demo page (not intended to work), but if people are using = this to practice their submission skills while the real thing is down, = they will be highly misled. Gr=C3=BC=C3=9Fe, Carsten From nobody Wed Mar 3 08:49:13 2021 Return-Path: X-Original-To: tools-discuss@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: tools-discuss@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id D04B43A166E for ; Wed, 3 Mar 2021 08:49:11 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.097 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.097 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=gmail.com Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id b6tm1gzdOe85 for ; Wed, 3 Mar 2021 08:49:10 -0800 (PST) Received: from mail-ej1-x632.google.com (mail-ej1-x632.google.com [IPv6:2a00:1450:4864:20::632]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id E46F83A166C for ; Wed, 3 Mar 2021 08:49:09 -0800 (PST) Received: by mail-ej1-x632.google.com with SMTP id bm21so24693590ejb.4 for ; Wed, 03 Mar 2021 08:49:09 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20161025; h=mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date:message-id:subject:to :cc; bh=+yvI4mbcGcENJZEEYxbcnAJos2X4+GLE/DdGcmDOJds=; b=K4NsAH/aHpY6gdbXl2mTOWGbWvLQyx+e28av2tNf6ZiRCgG/i7ujsn3wE+It19xDE/ AidSbJNwV0XHOermnYXYgGlrsDmxh2K2atB1DCxa+QuMFPN5L0WtquVqt3YLzhuZMR/o dF2L4c7Yd8CvGoe98qV++YALyTQm/mAn/iBMft4uQ5D449KmmQz23MVzG0w0v8WDbNpr YvjMS9A7G1tsFAmx2zbYMidMxcVprZoJoMY4DU4RMdYiCQPDFrZ68WoePwDVcYOeNV4c /O8h3R4qfPDo2U0m9LtVq7k7sEy2XHyBqXUB8tpwfkxaekFXqJyYFQYOh7bms0Cm3CaW RC6Q== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date :message-id:subject:to:cc; bh=+yvI4mbcGcENJZEEYxbcnAJos2X4+GLE/DdGcmDOJds=; b=c17SagGNqgn8dx187FLfJOz5QKgZbq55IwphZOvILHzl3rU/6zXsiYfTpbwO/tK5tn I+SMO2Ky+l6m5RkdkixpDO7jzNhx4yEOekIhtkEO+a6edzT3baxDHfXOySXNQOs2+nDs LV4IY04JpNFhKiTts7xqZZWxvuCtKMt6hTjsWR9ercsujMfj2/REWKWGlP+kv1iRGa45 bqDEsWRInU+pnaMD55Je5Klas2vWncMpHtSxQzkv6NITIo9ZVozsyc/iVp83TXfnFiDs YfZ8qqSLYz4TSivjk16nlrpQfULyO9jpQJYxyiNoGpxa+oA3Fiuh1ejHM7Q4KFzQiyV2 fZuQ== X-Gm-Message-State: AOAM532ru6MPi3lqUO6AZUhKwr/xfuIcepTkBSSB5S5USo1y9Zof+GyK BAbNM+nSJJ9rMKoQyoZvefD/kxFXnwKh5IhTOSU= X-Google-Smtp-Source: ABdhPJySpRFRY+PqYLhYMgNIUTEhQLBlYSueyUMc6g0BTAH9Ei7zbCqwmSwpB+NWOLBDSUfGPwUt9FUle1UvzdpAI2A= X-Received: by 2002:a17:906:228d:: with SMTP id p13mr18809585eja.412.1614790147576; Wed, 03 Mar 2021 08:49:07 -0800 (PST) MIME-Version: 1.0 References: <81FC2389-5B3E-4252-8C0C-9F17B8B44046@tzi.org> <24844.1614786089@localhost> <4264566C-9118-42B6-85BD-D32001DF8A35@tzi.org> In-Reply-To: <4264566C-9118-42B6-85BD-D32001DF8A35@tzi.org> From: Richard Barnes Date: Wed, 3 Mar 2021 11:48:48 -0500 Message-ID: To: Carsten Bormann Cc: Michael Richardson , tools-discuss Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="00000000000022170a05bca4a188" Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Tools-discuss] https://tools.ietf.org/demo/www.ietf.org/submit/ X-BeenThere: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF Tools Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 03 Mar 2021 16:49:12 -0000 --00000000000022170a05bca4a188 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable If it was for a demo and the demo is over, it seems like it should just be deleted. --Richard On Wed, Mar 3, 2021 at 10:56 AM Carsten Bormann wrote: > On 2021-03-03, at 16:41, Michael Richardson wrote= : > > > > > > Carsten Bormann wrote: > >> Is this still alive? > >> Should it be? > > > > You are asking about, https://tools.ietf.org/demo/www.ietf.org/submit/ > > which my eyes had difficulty figuring out was mentioned in the subject. > > I think it should be turned into a redirect. I didn't try it, but it > looks > > like it wouldn't work. > > Well, it is a demo page (not intended to work), but if people are using > this to practice their submission skills while the real thing is down, th= ey > will be highly misled. > > Gr=C3=BC=C3=9Fe, Carsten > > ___________________________________________________________ > Tools-discuss mailing list - Tools-discuss@ietf.org > This list is for discussion, not for action requests or bug reports. > * Report datatracker and mailarchive bugs to: datatracker-project@ietf.or= g > * Report tools.ietf.org bugs to: webmaster@tools.ietf.org > * Report all other bugs or issues to: ietf-action@ietf.org > List info (including how to Unsubscribe): > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/tools-discuss > --00000000000022170a05bca4a188 Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
If it was for a demo and the demo is over, it seems like i= t should just be deleted.
--Richard

On Wed, Mar 3, 2021 at 10:56 A= M Carsten Bormann <cabo@tzi.org> = wrote:
On 2021-0= 3-03, at 16:41, Michael Richardson <mcr+ietf@sandelman.ca> wrote:
>
>
> Carsten Bormann <= cabo@tzi.org> wrote:
>> Is this still alive?
>> Should it be?
>
> You are asking about, https://tools.ietf.org/de= mo/www.ietf.org/submit/
> which my eyes had difficulty figuring out was mentioned in the subject= .
> I think it should be turned into a redirect. I didn't try it, but = it looks
> like it wouldn't work.

Well, it is a demo page (not intended to work), but if people are using thi= s to practice their submission skills while the real thing is down, they wi= ll be highly misled.

Gr=C3=BC=C3=9Fe, Carsten

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This list is for discussion, not for action requests or bug reports.
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* Report all other bugs or issues to: ietf-action@ietf.org
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--00000000000022170a05bca4a188-- From nobody Wed Mar 3 09:35:41 2021 Return-Path: X-Original-To: tools-discuss@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: tools-discuss@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id A94943A1735; Wed, 3 Mar 2021 09:35:35 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.847 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.847 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, FREEMAIL_ENVFROM_END_DIGIT=0.25, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=gmail.com Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id It_PtHdskyPr; Wed, 3 Mar 2021 09:35:34 -0800 (PST) Received: from mail-yb1-xb29.google.com (mail-yb1-xb29.google.com [IPv6:2607:f8b0:4864:20::b29]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 11AE23A1738; Wed, 3 Mar 2021 09:35:34 -0800 (PST) Received: by mail-yb1-xb29.google.com with SMTP id u3so25394043ybk.6; Wed, 03 Mar 2021 09:35:33 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20161025; h=mime-version:references:in-reply-to:reply-to:from:date:message-id :subject:to:cc; bh=uIk3jGO6o3CYm596WG3SAEG0+9FVsO5Z5OnMAEVUdUs=; b=umZGqeseyjhMq6YN3i6NkJYOjTOKYimXGCcB0xko5lvH4pDTmvl7i71DNUhSGM3RTs N8hP8mCekDiDuPNU5XZB8/D8p06LcXCcdA+aoQbK6pfA+rKscycvk/4X4rwSSurfVeet 8MJp/+u7wLkh3LoYjorm0GsrwERwWwHT5qNJ0IiBRF+R3viaZ26NegBtTIu9dqaMq0GL djkntN0yUv0lWjuAYc08B1Pi/7w/C+ypSWb6kCjeniyTWR3s1hHbgDn5KOLJQgEuxSl6 jQUy/FOd38ZtjkW+M191Dt13RD2kCNHKiPsdEv0o0uteQXs662pKmusJnLJ2jRexvnbT znHQ== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:references:in-reply-to:reply-to :from:date:message-id:subject:to:cc; bh=uIk3jGO6o3CYm596WG3SAEG0+9FVsO5Z5OnMAEVUdUs=; b=OpUm7AfU442SdHV6yaSGHe2GrHsWMoPiTel4I23vIkVHXMt9gtR4tP4RUKNgcHHA6Y DDfQiZIdkPeNqAB+sg9/Zng+ysR9YH8+HnQosEF5OJru8BWP+9+GdcASFF4c9DgrJuhF MAjie213UBf5DzmqTM0GVYNEw/ZLqKoGhfXlzmzS6AGbA2hwuanSDJVAqNG6+ipfmEUH lclpMbykcJrh2iTsivJRqwUiwNSPXsgIyzakqTnnCx9hJWXneHAOC/gLCqGIltoeyyIe 7hP299m2Z1c3fT/SdaIX+eB0s90P97fGnTqU3609WIJ0taO0YCfnkTe1rT4txpkfHj1S Z/KQ== X-Gm-Message-State: AOAM531Cg8ZZbG129G4wHbdWkoETRijG359aq/ZjYHgzvMqLdQv3gisl hCWGY+/a4yv2tS2p0ZBhZJI05X/eDlQh5GY4eXUg8t1Gx/Q= X-Google-Smtp-Source: ABdhPJwCAJ1H16pndMUGFc1vm2b06TRgynFh0W2mrjVFPU/i1cV3vDtPfNMWcOpIuU3zOFxpdru6hTRK9qNBQ0okL5g= X-Received: by 2002:a25:cbd5:: with SMTP id b204mr442983ybg.411.1614792931689; Wed, 03 Mar 2021 09:35:31 -0800 (PST) MIME-Version: 1.0 References: <1dba6704-e997-0ceb-ff85-b5f5f639b274@nostrum.com> In-Reply-To: Reply-To: sarikaya@ieee.org From: Behcet Sarikaya Date: Wed, 3 Mar 2021 11:35:20 -0600 Message-ID: To: tools-discuss Cc: 110attendees@ietf.org Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="00000000000014481e05bca5477f" Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Tools-discuss] [110attendees] Chat services during IETF 110 X-BeenThere: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF Tools Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 03 Mar 2021 17:35:36 -0000 --00000000000014481e05bca5477f Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Hi Robert, Thank you for this information. I made an account on matrix and used it a bit. It seems to work fine :) About the recovery key: I don't understand why at very login I have to upload it? Behcet On Thu, Feb 25, 2021 at 1:03 PM Robert Sparks wrote: > Please be aware of the ongoing chat services trials during IETF 110. > > There are instances of matrix and zulip running at > > https://matrix-trial1.ietf.org and https://zulip-trial1.ietf.org, > respectively. > > They are bridged into xmpp. > > There is also a web interface into the xmpp chatrooms at > https://xmpp-trial1.ietf.org. This service also allows the creation of > accounts, and can be used with any xmpp client. > > Each Meetecho session provides its own view into the xmpp chatroom > associated with the group's meeting. That chat can be participated in > through any of the three services. > > For more information see: > > > https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/ietf-announce/UtPuWgXhYbjyf7wHGJh4ax4kQrA/ > > > https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/ietf-announce/B1b71fKWGfAq0ZKJ0KSwxzn7WgI/ > > Discussion of the effectiveness of these services is encouraged. We are > particularly interested in hearing about the following: > > * Is providing local jabber accounts and a web interface to jabber > sufficient to address the access issues encountered in the past? > > * Are there features that matrix or zulip provide that are truly helpful > for progressing IETF work? If so, please describe how they are helping. > > Discussion should take place at tools-discuss@ietf.org, but we will also > be watching #trial1-feedback on both zulip and matrix. > > Robert Sparks - Tools Team Chair > > -- > 110attendees mailing list > 110attendees@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/110attendees > --00000000000014481e05bca5477f Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Hi Robert,

Thank you = for this=C2=A0information. I made an account on matrix and used it a bit. I= t seems to work fine :)

About the recovery key: I don= 9;t understand why at very login I have to upload it?

<= div>
Behcet
On Thu, Feb 25, 2021 at 1:03 PM Robert Sparks <rjsparks@nostrum.com> wrote:
Please be aware of the ongoing chat services trials du= ring IETF 110.

There are instances of matrix and zulip running at

https://matrix-trial1.ietf.org and https://zulip-trial1.ietf.o= rg,
respectively.

They are bridged into xmpp.

There is also a web interface into the xmpp chatrooms at
https://xmpp-trial1.ietf.org. This service also allows the creation = of
accounts, and can be used with any xmpp client.

Each Meetecho session provides its own view into the xmpp chatroom
associated with the group's meeting. That chat can be participated in <= br> through any of the three services.

For more information see:

https://mailarchive.= ietf.org/arch/msg/ietf-announce/UtPuWgXhYbjyf7wHGJh4ax4kQrA/

https://mailarchive.= ietf.org/arch/msg/ietf-announce/B1b71fKWGfAq0ZKJ0KSwxzn7WgI/

Discussion of the effectiveness of these services is encouraged. We are particularly interested in hearing about the following:

* Is providing local jabber accounts and a web interface to jabber
sufficient to address the access issues encountered in the past?

* Are there features that matrix or zulip provide that are truly helpful for progressing IETF work? If so, please describe how they are helping.

Discussion should take place at tools-discuss@ietf.org, but we will also
be watching #trial1-feedback on both zulip and matrix.

Robert Sparks - Tools Team Chair

--
110attendees mailing list
110attendees@iet= f.org
https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/110attendees=
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DIR:OUT; SFP:1101; X-OriginatorOrg: alum.mit.edu X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-OriginalArrivalTime: 05 Mar 2021 15:18:46.1503 (UTC) X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-Network-Message-Id: e5e89e8e-c029-47bc-8f94-08d8dfe9f87e X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-Id: 3326b102-c043-408b-a990-b89e477d582f X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-OriginalAttributedTenantConnectingIp: TenantId=3326b102-c043-408b-a990-b89e477d582f; Ip=[18.7.68.33]; Helo=[outgoing-alum.mit.edu] X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-AuthSource: BL2NAM02FT058.eop-nam02.prod.protection.outlook.com X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-AuthAs: Anonymous X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-FromEntityHeader: HybridOnPrem X-MS-Exchange-Transport-CrossTenantHeadersStamped: CY4PR12MB1494 Archived-At: Subject: [Tools-discuss] Tools resources that we use: bap X-BeenThere: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF Tools Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 05 Mar 2021 15:18:51 -0000 On 3/5/21 9:36 AM, Robert Sparks wrote: > Please drop notes to the tools-discuss list or directly to me as you > think of things. I'd like for you to catch them as you see you need them. > On 3/5/21 2:51 AM, Carsten Bormann wrote: >> On 2021-03-05, at 09:39, Stewart Bryant wrote: >>> To whom do we send a list of the tools resources that we use? >> We could start a discussion thread on tools-discuss. I use bap from time to time. Unfortunately AFAIK it is barely maintained. After I finished RFC7405 I asked Bill Fenner about incorporating support for it in bap. He was very hard to reach. I then implemented the necessary updates to bap and submitted a pull request. But it was never acted upon. I eventually just gave up. I'd really like to have better support for ABNF in the draft pipeline. Ideally ABNF checking would be an automatic part of the process. Unfortunately it is hard to do well. Much ABNF in drafts/RFCs has dependencies on ABNF in some other document, and those dependencies are stated informally so that it takes manual processing to prepare something that can be fully checked by bap. If/how to resolve this needs discussion and then probably some implementation work. Thanks, Paul From nobody Fri Mar 5 07:28:45 2021 Return-Path: X-Original-To: tools-discuss@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: tools-discuss@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id A8F073A26E1 for ; Fri, 5 Mar 2021 07:28:38 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.9 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.9 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, NICE_REPLY_A=-0.001, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_H2=-0.001, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (1024-bit key) header.d=gmx.net Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id SPkPjePSsSEv for ; Fri, 5 Mar 2021 07:28:36 -0800 (PST) Received: from mout.gmx.net (mout.gmx.net [212.227.17.20]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 45A003A26B7 for ; Fri, 5 Mar 2021 07:28:36 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/simple; d=gmx.net; s=badeba3b8450; t=1614958114; bh=p0uMdpdX90pSWbc5UDyy1/6nMzbCWjcBoN3//M0yLFg=; h=X-UI-Sender-Class:Subject:To:References:From:Date:In-Reply-To; b=NQJixdjxFjtd8x8oZ+DqR2H8g16a42DgjpvPRC2+PWyvd4NllOmp09Qj0t6KUN1OJ 0EQgy193RPZ4GkvOV3GuA8GZ9alq58Z2jq32TZB9u7jeIdhbf+qW/AYi8hUZ0DZA5/ kLzUVwDVbvv0Ihia/NLxbj/nHW+4FpOpjSHvZtys= X-UI-Sender-Class: 01bb95c1-4bf8-414a-932a-4f6e2808ef9c Received: from [192.168.178.20] ([91.61.54.253]) by mail.gmx.net (mrgmx105 [212.227.17.168]) with ESMTPSA (Nemesis) id 1MzhjF-1leYmu3ufR-00vgbV for ; Fri, 05 Mar 2021 16:28:33 +0100 To: tools-discuss@ietf.org References: <35440727.JitbitHelpdesk.46704.0bb5cf6e-5ee4-475f-a405-1f97b826a0a9@jitbit.com> <6C47036A-F803-4E77-A5A9-550C6E16C4C8@gmail.com> <331C7083-E6E8-4E5B-96F9-04D8724F70C7@gigix.net> <83F05A13-7785-4868-A9B3-59A27C941B79@gmail.com> <3791BB35-B715-4C5D-84E1-F127075528D9@tzi.org> <96af6f4f-a08e-c92b-9eb1-d653e2f5232f@nostrum.com> From: Julian Reschke Message-ID: <26d1b9ab-89d9-ab67-a1e3-e6a8f7b841e0@gmx.de> Date: Fri, 5 Mar 2021 16:28:31 +0100 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows NT 10.0; Win64; x64; rv:78.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/78.8.0 MIME-Version: 1.0 In-Reply-To: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Provags-ID: V03:K1:m8zOzyPZ+3Hzak8kgrRQFpaLQPwaY/1Uh1IGtwLwQajQeFn2uQV ZmyEbLtLAZ93yezDn+wIrNLviOp7OdZd8tb9hyy4wgWcAogmesi0W5zQ30UzD9Hf+1wGktq tEfvMZxRikOFXPOtcfntFGnKqQwZrJ6wK1qr/+/3TEwhTd1Rd/y6vmaopPus9YFHbfiUauM sOcvSR9CEZj1n2eDnFsKQ== X-UI-Out-Filterresults: notjunk:1;V03:K0:OfFjwKKYhkg=:AdFTV4nm2aa7hP2qAj58PA tBxYsCXXLllsw9Ly2xzp13LPQD+E58ei1PqkCcOiyvNYp5Sy599d4JsN/ZNsYbsUYH95G/7/o NCppxGoO6LGzNjOzyY4Z2uyaxTLIty0mNb6sJffafFGRfT9Qv9o9Au5fLv49wTAcdkV8vT4aL bXkUqTbpl62P854gAYSab+pPrRakzpq7x8tx+aiP6FWuLeOJ9TEzs2ZSKXX2OeIICCU39QPM8 6mIH0UlzU8968bINzsPFCrhkIg/OM65REwPv6O/KD8t9HjdM46DgqOEhv1M2pGxtyAvCI4yVh fOKGDBNb1GEnVmGKk1EIypxHSYwVqtVkZXwS7/Q9P/w0RtJjRPzBl05OXk22AmkvKoC/iaedy O/jSrXs5tqjhEKz6X0rss7l8+u7TDYEx1CvdUw/cENUfS5ZlElNxY/9fZrVinHePmaD+js9Qv zM9bBIhSfUP3zc5i/FYMfMffwJTDRHCE/mvtnoSw38EefbhEJUECAejC3rqcxbblXUU4gxkIY NeXhO3aCqMvdHOpAbnz+PhagCCBz0t/nIv02OJh9FxVVfQM5Jdge1xzKHFpE0+zXtZ/sTKdCg XekhSFgWKxQO2/VAFuG3Im7POH0YmtdtGw7pcMU9qH9N4TNCwetqdJbuDuPa22TDbKa8f6CW/ J23Sm/Oaop3ba761n/1LO4mPunXuXe9cpcj427IwB0YJAoaImBK4EO50T41RVVmZ11rcK4vEx +0MYIqMYY0n9MjRBlLA2HXfneSoNu+tvUTgPGVVFhbHq6Vj0zdZyFGcebnkbfTvH+iEuFuiLV THO9K/Q69hrgJRneRbPg1GBkHKOr/rGJ9XoHifIIbgBmXzQIae1IpSf58c17bVeG7myLWGuYU kbw/aV8AYiBhKj1tkuPg== Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Tools-discuss] Tools resources that we use: bap X-BeenThere: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF Tools Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 05 Mar 2021 15:28:44 -0000 Am 05.03.2021 um 16:18 schrieb Paul Kyzivat: > On 3/5/21 9:36 AM, Robert Sparks wrote: >> Please drop notes to the tools-discuss list or directly to me as you >> think of things. I'd like for you to catch them as you see you need the= m. > >> On 3/5/21 2:51 AM, Carsten Bormann wrote: >>> On 2021-03-05, at 09:39, Stewart Bryant >>> wrote: >>>> To whom do we send a list of the tools resources that we use? >>> We could start a discussion thread on tools-discuss. > > I use bap from time to time. Unfortunately AFAIK it is barely > maintained. After I finished RFC7405 I asked Bill Fenner about > incorporating support for it in bap. He was very hard to reach. I then > implemented the necessary updates to bap and submitted a pull request. > But it was never acted upon. I eventually just gave up. The http-core editors have their own fork (which does 7405, but also handles the HTTP #list production). See . > I'd really like to have better support for ABNF in the draft pipeline. > Ideally ABNF checking would be an automatic part of the process. > Unfortunately it is hard to do well. Much ABNF in drafts/RFCs has > dependencies on ABNF in some other document, and those dependencies are > stated informally so that it takes manual processing to prepare > something that can be fully checked by bap. If/how to resolve this needs > discussion and then probably some implementation work. In HTTP (core), we declare all ABNF productions that we import as prose, for instance, see . With that, the ABNF at least is self-contained and can be checked automatically (and we do that in our build process). Best regards, Julian From nobody Fri Mar 5 07:50:45 2021 Return-Path: X-Original-To: tools-discuss@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: tools-discuss@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 307B43A26DC for ; Fri, 5 Mar 2021 07:50:44 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.898 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.898 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_NONE=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id M4mxvcLni9cA for ; Fri, 5 Mar 2021 07:50:42 -0800 (PST) Received: from mail.smeinc.net (mail.smeinc.net [209.135.209.11]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher AECDH-AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 606703A26D8 for ; Fri, 5 Mar 2021 07:50:42 -0800 (PST) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.smeinc.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id CB701300B5D for ; Fri, 5 Mar 2021 10:50:39 -0500 (EST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at mail.smeinc.net Received: from mail.smeinc.net ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (mail.smeinc.net [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10026) with ESMTP id tAxDWQoi876C for ; Fri, 5 Mar 2021 10:50:38 -0500 (EST) Received: from [192.168.1.161] (pool-141-156-161-153.washdc.fios.verizon.net [141.156.161.153]) by mail.smeinc.net (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 6003E300474; Fri, 5 Mar 2021 10:50:38 -0500 (EST) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Mime-Version: 1.0 (Mac OS X Mail 12.4 \(3445.104.17\)) From: Russ Housley In-Reply-To: Date: Fri, 5 Mar 2021 10:50:37 -0500 Cc: tools-discuss@ietf.org Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Message-Id: <790B8B35-25D3-4AEC-A59B-1541CFD103F9@vigilsec.com> References: <35440727.JitbitHelpdesk.46704.0bb5cf6e-5ee4-475f-a405-1f97b826a0a9@jitbit.com> <6C47036A-F803-4E77-A5A9-550C6E16C4C8@gmail.com> <331C7083-E6E8-4E5B-96F9-04D8724F70C7@gigix.net> <83F05A13-7785-4868-A9B3-59A27C941B79@gmail.com> <3791BB35-B715-4C5D-84E1-F127075528D9@tzi.org> <96af6f4f-a08e-c92b-9eb1-d653e2f5232f@nostrum.com> To: Paul Kyzivat X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.3445.104.17) Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Tools-discuss] Tools resources that we use: bap X-BeenThere: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF Tools Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 05 Mar 2021 15:50:44 -0000 > On Mar 5, 2021, at 10:18 AM, Paul Kyzivat = wrote: >=20 > On 3/5/21 9:36 AM, Robert Sparks wrote: >> Please drop notes to the tools-discuss list or directly to me as you = think of things. I'd like for you to catch them as you see you need = them. >=20 >> On 3/5/21 2:51 AM, Carsten Bormann wrote: >>> On 2021-03-05, at 09:39, Stewart Bryant = wrote: >>>> To whom do we send a list of the tools resources that we use? >>> We could start a discussion thread on tools-discuss. >=20 > I use bap from time to time. Unfortunately AFAIK it is barely = maintained. After I finished RFC7405 I asked Bill Fenner about = incorporating support for it in bap. He was very hard to reach. I then = implemented the necessary updates to bap and submitted a pull request. = But it was never acted upon. I eventually just gave up. The last time that I used Bap, the case sensitive parts were in there. Russ From nobody Fri Mar 5 08:09:57 2021 Return-Path: X-Original-To: tools-discuss@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: tools-discuss@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id E5F4A3A275B for ; Fri, 5 Mar 2021 08:09:54 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.899 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.899 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id RFZ8DWluBaee for ; Fri, 5 Mar 2021 08:09:53 -0800 (PST) Received: from outgoing.mit.edu (outgoing-auth-1.mit.edu [18.9.28.11]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 817E93A275A for ; Fri, 5 Mar 2021 08:09:53 -0800 (PST) Received: from kduck.mit.edu ([24.16.140.251]) (authenticated bits=56) (User authenticated as kaduk@ATHENA.MIT.EDU) by outgoing.mit.edu (8.14.7/8.12.4) with ESMTP id 125G9fBN006097 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 bits=256 verify=NOT) for ; Fri, 5 Mar 2021 11:09:46 -0500 Date: Fri, 5 Mar 2021 08:09:41 -0800 From: Benjamin Kaduk To: tools-discuss@ietf.org Message-ID: <20210305160941.GJ56617@kduck.mit.edu> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline Archived-At: Subject: [Tools-discuss] tools we don't need to use (but do) X-BeenThere: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF Tools Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 05 Mar 2021 16:09:55 -0000 Since I think Robert asked for such things to go here: The www.ietf.org/rfcdiff service has handy links at the top to go to the left- or right-side drafts (when not using direct upload). For the case of drafts provided by draft name, these links go to https://tools.ietf.org/html/; they don't necessarily need to. -Ben From nobody Fri Mar 5 08:15:33 2021 Return-Path: X-Original-To: tools-discuss@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: tools-discuss@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9A8603A277C for ; Fri, 5 Mar 2021 08:15:30 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.003 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.003 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, NICE_REPLY_A=-0.001, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_H2=-0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (1024-bit key) header.d=alum.mit.edu Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id dOfWwN-HNzkj for ; Fri, 5 Mar 2021 08:15:28 -0800 (PST) Received: from NAM12-DM6-obe.outbound.protection.outlook.com (mail-dm6nam12on2042.outbound.protection.outlook.com [40.107.243.42]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 5DD773A2779 for ; 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Fri, 5 Mar 2021 11:15:25 -0500 To: Russ Housley Cc: tools-discuss@ietf.org References: <35440727.JitbitHelpdesk.46704.0bb5cf6e-5ee4-475f-a405-1f97b826a0a9@jitbit.com> <6C47036A-F803-4E77-A5A9-550C6E16C4C8@gmail.com> <331C7083-E6E8-4E5B-96F9-04D8724F70C7@gigix.net> <83F05A13-7785-4868-A9B3-59A27C941B79@gmail.com> <3791BB35-B715-4C5D-84E1-F127075528D9@tzi.org> <96af6f4f-a08e-c92b-9eb1-d653e2f5232f@nostrum.com> <790B8B35-25D3-4AEC-A59B-1541CFD103F9@vigilsec.com> From: Paul Kyzivat Message-ID: <4e0f025c-a4bb-e94a-1f83-ebe410e6301b@alum.mit.edu> Date: Fri, 5 Mar 2021 11:15:24 -0500 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Macintosh; Intel Mac OS X 10.16; rv:78.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/78.8.0 MIME-Version: 1.0 In-Reply-To: <790B8B35-25D3-4AEC-A59B-1541CFD103F9@vigilsec.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8; format=flowed Content-Language: en-US Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-EOPAttributedMessage: 0 X-MS-PublicTrafficType: Email X-MS-Office365-Filtering-Correlation-Id: 36206caa-0d44-47d7-e76e-08d8dff1e341 X-MS-TrafficTypeDiagnostic: BY5PR12MB4920: X-Microsoft-Antispam-PRVS: X-MS-Oob-TLC-OOBClassifiers: OLM:8882; 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DIR:OUT; SFP:1101; X-OriginatorOrg: alum.mit.edu X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-OriginalArrivalTime: 05 Mar 2021 16:15:26.4685 (UTC) X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-Network-Message-Id: 36206caa-0d44-47d7-e76e-08d8dff1e341 X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-Id: 3326b102-c043-408b-a990-b89e477d582f X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-OriginalAttributedTenantConnectingIp: TenantId=3326b102-c043-408b-a990-b89e477d582f; Ip=[18.7.68.33]; Helo=[outgoing-alum.mit.edu] X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-AuthSource: DM3NAM02FT063.eop-nam02.prod.protection.outlook.com X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-AuthAs: Anonymous X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-FromEntityHeader: HybridOnPrem X-MS-Exchange-Transport-CrossTenantHeadersStamped: BY5PR12MB4920 Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Tools-discuss] Tools resources that we use: bap X-BeenThere: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF Tools Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 05 Mar 2021 16:15:31 -0000 On 3/5/21 10:50 AM, Russ Housley wrote: > > >> On Mar 5, 2021, at 10:18 AM, Paul Kyzivat wrote: >> >> On 3/5/21 9:36 AM, Robert Sparks wrote: >>> Please drop notes to the tools-discuss list or directly to me as you think of things. I'd like for you to catch them as you see you need them. >> >>> On 3/5/21 2:51 AM, Carsten Bormann wrote: >>>> On 2021-03-05, at 09:39, Stewart Bryant wrote: >>>>> To whom do we send a list of the tools resources that we use? >>>> We could start a discussion thread on tools-discuss. >> >> I use bap from time to time. Unfortunately AFAIK it is barely maintained. After I finished RFC7405 I asked Bill Fenner about incorporating support for it in bap. He was very hard to reach. I then implemented the necessary updates to bap and submitted a pull request. But it was never acted upon. I eventually just gave up. > > The last time that I used Bap, the case sensitive parts were in there. Ah! So it is. I missed it going in. My other comments remain. 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X-BeenThere: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF Tools Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sun, 07 Mar 2021 12:29:50 -0000 Tools Team, I just want to say thank you for the tools style html format available direct from data tracker! I find this format to be much more readable on all my devices than the previous datatracker html format. Lou PS I was pleasantly surprised to see this format available this morning (not sure when it showed) and am cc'ing the wgchairs list in case others are equally unaware. From nobody Sun Mar 7 08:28:43 2021 Return-Path: X-Original-To: tools-discuss@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: tools-discuss@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 480363A18C2 for ; Sun, 7 Mar 2021 08:28:42 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -4.199 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-4.199 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-2.3, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 97NwVwkKL6QL for ; Sun, 7 Mar 2021 08:28:39 -0800 (PST) Received: from tuna.sandelman.ca (tuna.sandelman.ca [IPv6:2607:f0b0:f:3:216:3eff:fe7c:d1f3]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ADH-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id D1E9E3A18BC for ; Sun, 7 Mar 2021 08:28:39 -0800 (PST) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by tuna.sandelman.ca (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4C7EC389BD for ; Sun, 7 Mar 2021 11:33:31 -0500 (EST) Received: from tuna.sandelman.ca ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id ggQyfsmLkuEF for ; Sun, 7 Mar 2021 11:33:31 -0500 (EST) Received: from sandelman.ca (obiwan.sandelman.ca [209.87.249.21]) by tuna.sandelman.ca (Postfix) with ESMTP id F0574389BB for ; Sun, 7 Mar 2021 11:33:30 -0500 (EST) Received: from localhost (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by sandelman.ca (Postfix) with ESMTP id 196DD898 for ; Sun, 7 Mar 2021 11:28:38 -0500 (EST) From: Michael Richardson To: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-Attribution: mcr X-Mailer: MH-E 8.6+git; nmh 1.7+dev; GNU Emacs 26.1 X-Face: $\n1pF)h^`}$H>Hk{L"x@)JS7<%Az}5RyS@k9X%29-lHB$Ti.V>2bi.~ehC0; <'$9xN5Ub# z!G,p`nR&p7Fz@^UXIn156S8.~^@MJ*mMsD7=QFeq%AL4m Archived-At: Subject: [Tools-discuss] how to set I-D replacing when using API X-BeenThere: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF Tools Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sun, 07 Mar 2021 16:28:43 -0000 --=-=-= Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable When a document is adopted by a WG, there is a bit of pain in knowing who/what should set the "replaced-by" attribute. I *think* that it has to be done by the chair when they approve the documen= t, but I think that it isn't obvious that they can/need to do this. What makes this a bit vague is when the submitter uses the API to upload rather than doing it via the web interface. When done by web interface, I think that it can be done by the submitter. Is (should) there a way to do this via the /api/submit interface? =2D- Michael Richardson . o O ( IPv6 I=C3=B8T consulti= ng ) Sandelman Software Works Inc, Ottawa and Worldwide --=-=-= Content-Type: application/pgp-signature; name="signature.asc" -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- iQEzBAEBCgAdFiEEbsyLEzg/qUTA43uogItw+93Q3WUFAmBE/zUACgkQgItw+93Q 3WVtaQf9GYFfuMnOWG/ZgH756ZEY95S0FfXYzyuvybVmlDOiIWbWmc5KeVWGvVYN loYLdHcsEsZUSRgEhIwG3UbLCQKFdDVSPmCxqQDTLhUOsfbVOCyfbk+/bf1L6GoV ReTocbg2ucEDSlSTYYHzMa20Y0LNu/40HK86xIgxUQGx186B7bqZQfdTeBszCcUs fORE/2rp2qXFFzecjN4TAQrvLaemnavVrBfbX3LEX3YJsvSqbGzt72m+lGPl+Fps 84SlVBaqxUtECDdJnxy3Lkqqjdv5X95el4N/n/dNrSdezZLQ0DO5elx/seGTliFz slpOATnBpXjmBa5V1Xv8QNLnmvqMMA== =oHC7 -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --=-=-=-- From nobody Mon Mar 8 05:10:39 2021 Return-Path: X-Original-To: tools-discuss@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: tools-discuss@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id C57A13A29AA for ; Mon, 8 Mar 2021 05:10:36 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: 0.141 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=0.141 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, HTML_IMAGE_ONLY_12=2.059, HTML_IMAGE_RATIO_02=0.001, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_H3=-0.01, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_WL=-0.01, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001] autolearn=no autolearn_force=no Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id Qpq7r5KDxDNf for ; Mon, 8 Mar 2021 05:10:34 -0800 (PST) Received: from gabriel-vm-2.zfn.uni-bremen.de (gabriel-vm-2.zfn.uni-bremen.de [134.102.50.17]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher AECDH-AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id D30AD3A29A8 for ; Mon, 8 Mar 2021 05:10:33 -0800 (PST) Received: from [192.168.217.123] (p5089a828.dip0.t-ipconnect.de [80.137.168.40]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by gabriel-vm-2.zfn.uni-bremen.de (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 4DvJc82WLGzyTK for ; Mon, 8 Mar 2021 14:10:32 +0100 (CET) From: Carsten Bormann Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="Apple-Mail=_89D54A41-0449-45A6-8ACA-B9DD8442257D" X-Mao-Original-Outgoing-Id: 636901831.87107-9a77251a9328d97fe0e699ecee1fcde9 Mime-Version: 1.0 (Mac OS X Mail 13.4 \(3608.120.23.2.4\)) Message-Id: Date: Mon, 8 Mar 2021 14:10:32 +0100 To: tools-discuss X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.3608.120.23.2.4) Archived-At: Subject: [Tools-discuss] Meetecho countdown timer X-BeenThere: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF Tools Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 08 Mar 2021 13:10:37 -0000 --Apple-Mail=_89D54A41-0449-45A6-8ACA-B9DD8442257D Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Great idea =E2=80=94 realization maybe can be improved :-) Gr=C3=BC=C3=9Fe, Carsten --Apple-Mail=_89D54A41-0449-45A6-8ACA-B9DD8442257D Content-Type: multipart/related; type="text/html"; boundary="Apple-Mail=_D09FD5F3-8F7E-46D1-942A-5563D2CC3A61" --Apple-Mail=_D09FD5F3-8F7E-46D1-942A-5563D2CC3A61 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Type: text/html; charset=utf-8
Great idea =E2=80=94 realization maybe can be improved = :-)

Gr=C3=BC=C3=9Fe, = Carsten

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h=mime-version:references:in-reply-to:reply-to:from:date:message-id :subject:to:cc; bh=4RbDeI0n4OzUTl+Mdah7mg2BfpRvk4pUi1NtnzJ7HNo=; b=ryhDvjPDzhJoDvCQ2uLBHKhEEK+G/oDKySvp9NbT4lTaF8UuZQF38Nnokcbj3SEeFA btUF0wvs6Tav4nLEiBtDOz6p1Ud5/YJdFIMfGBdkfiDj/wF2a7ht8BoihUeuAl6yWnpL xbVoe9XVM935bnfhxTDfOAv/mHXPPHhKEpFKpZRDMSHaGmj3MaCInocM8sWVldncjkA+ eJNeelXC+QGCbpWvqaak6aJnxcHakq0SACalpeMpZi4r6RnjelnQcdt9PsRLI6zY8iUf A0Em0cZJjJyJe9tXtp9cdyPJ9oPQI1uux8EkxO9oARd6tc5lxi/D5EkKmTDav4ZC2gUQ gPmA== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:references:in-reply-to:reply-to :from:date:message-id:subject:to:cc; bh=4RbDeI0n4OzUTl+Mdah7mg2BfpRvk4pUi1NtnzJ7HNo=; b=MpDOsxewC4uNxQyv12BhUURtY2pq+Rz7QvSnR2Gbu2v8YsQ27CS2xhOw0RKVSCUCEI FDZgPiM2K4D2oGCzRprsJ6s5jbc1XTkeXc3nLLPd7OYk3ISucePzpAOfH5goGuH35wlR jBZj9dni0a5BotlH8hMBeqv3127FCoIQXFjTfo0E/K2m1u297NwaNR6x60juNN5CsgFV 5z3EZruKT0Zu2aE2dNrTeC/hZxPs7chvLQH63TYX/WXRlYFs5EJBmkUI937QLROGkyBa DEZuFF7d02GjvmCKLV5AxKLu09K8eC1xiiG1ySnrBC+NyjDBtdtqRMxxGSv0wt9tGdwn xbfQ== X-Gm-Message-State: AOAM531oGiHE30lHrr7iBz+Ep+uIDvKOyh3a9I+rzbdtA3O26uhCXrlZ VW+9jdhm6+vXO3+/yxAPiwsprkYlDVa6tjypOQHnLPMkVAQ= X-Google-Smtp-Source: ABdhPJzhEctiZJwfZVu0W79I0ih5v6zF5YQoQVpH2iD5McexpfEX7UJwM2GIK1QrAV/ekIxBHnwFowGXSLoMB/3Xhrg= X-Received: by 2002:a25:ca42:: with SMTP id a63mr34335569ybg.318.1615216494325; Mon, 08 Mar 2021 07:14:54 -0800 (PST) MIME-Version: 1.0 References: <1dba6704-e997-0ceb-ff85-b5f5f639b274@nostrum.com> In-Reply-To: Reply-To: sarikaya@ieee.org From: Behcet Sarikaya Date: Mon, 8 Mar 2021 09:14:43 -0600 Message-ID: To: Robert Sparks , tools-discuss , 110attendees@ietf.org Cc: Matthew Hodgson Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="00000000000061325805bd07e599" Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Tools-discuss] [110attendees] Chat services during IETF 110 X-BeenThere: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF Tools Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 08 Mar 2021 15:14:58 -0000 --00000000000061325805bd07e599 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" One more question/issue: How do I put my photo? On the settings menu, it seems to be possible to upload a picture but I could not make it work, upload and remove choices come up, I upload my picture and then what? If I press the upload button again, it goes back to my local disk. The other choice is remove. If I return, no picture is inserted. Behcet On Fri, Mar 5, 2021 at 1:11 PM Robert Sparks wrote: > It's been a little while since I started a Matrix account. I don't > remember _uploading_ the recovery key on first access, but I do remember it > getting created and me downloading it. But I may just not remember. > > Matthew - can you point Behcet at something that might help? > > RjS > On 3/3/21 11:35 AM, Behcet Sarikaya wrote: > > Hi Robert, > > Thank you for this information. I made an account on matrix and used it a > bit. It seems to work fine :) > > About the recovery key: I don't understand why at very login I have to > upload it? > > > Behcet > On Thu, Feb 25, 2021 at 1:03 PM Robert Sparks > wrote: > >> Please be aware of the ongoing chat services trials during IETF 110. >> >> There are instances of matrix and zulip running at >> >> https://matrix-trial1.ietf.org and https://zulip-trial1.ietf.org, >> respectively. >> >> They are bridged into xmpp. >> >> There is also a web interface into the xmpp chatrooms at >> https://xmpp-trial1.ietf.org. This service also allows the creation of >> accounts, and can be used with any xmpp client. >> >> Each Meetecho session provides its own view into the xmpp chatroom >> associated with the group's meeting. That chat can be participated in >> through any of the three services. >> >> For more information see: >> >> >> https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/ietf-announce/UtPuWgXhYbjyf7wHGJh4ax4kQrA/ >> >> >> https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/ietf-announce/B1b71fKWGfAq0ZKJ0KSwxzn7WgI/ >> >> Discussion of the effectiveness of these services is encouraged. We are >> particularly interested in hearing about the following: >> >> * Is providing local jabber accounts and a web interface to jabber >> sufficient to address the access issues encountered in the past? >> >> * Are there features that matrix or zulip provide that are truly helpful >> for progressing IETF work? If so, please describe how they are helping. >> >> Discussion should take place at tools-discuss@ietf.org, but we will also >> be watching #trial1-feedback on both zulip and matrix. >> >> Robert Sparks - Tools Team Chair >> >> -- >> 110attendees mailing list >> 110attendees@ietf.org >> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/110attendees >> > > --00000000000061325805bd07e599 Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
One more question/issue: How do I put my photo?
On the= settings menu, it seems to be possible to upload a picture but I could not= make it work, upload and remove choices come up, I upload my picture and t= hen what? If I press the upload button again, it goes back to my local disk= . The other choice is remove. If I return, no picture is inserted.

Behcet



On Fri, Mar 5, 2= 021 at 1:11 PM Robert Sparks <rj= sparks@nostrum.com> wrote:
=20 =20 =20

It's been a little while since I started a Matrix account. I don't remember _uploading_ the recovery key on first access, but = I do remember it getting created and me downloading it. But I may just not remember.

Matthew - can you point Behcet at something that might help?

RjS

On 3/3/21 11:35 AM, Behcet Sarikaya wrote:
=20
Hi Robert,

Thank you for this=C2=A0information. I made an account on matrix an= d used it a bit. It seems to work fine :)

About the recovery key: I don't understand why at very login I have to upload it?


Behcet
On Thu, Feb 25, 2021 at 1:03 PM Robert Sparks <rjsparks@nostrum.com> wrote:
Please be aware of the ongoing chat services trials during IETF 110.

There are instances of matrix and zulip running at

https://matrix-trial1.ietf.org and https://zulip-trial1.ietf.org,
respectively.

They are bridged into xmpp.

There is also a web interface into the xmpp chatrooms at
https://xmpp-trial1.ietf.org. This service also allows the creation of
accounts, and can be used with any xmpp client.

Each Meetecho session provides its own view into the xmpp chatroom
associated with the group's meeting. That chat can be participated in
through any of the three services.

For more information see:

https:= //mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/ietf-announce/UtPuWgXhYbjyf7wHGJh4ax4kQrA/<= /a>

https:= //mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/ietf-announce/B1b71fKWGfAq0ZKJ0KSwxzn7WgI/<= /a>

Discussion of the effectiveness of these services is encouraged. We are
particularly interested in hearing about the following:

* Is providing local jabber accounts and a web interface to jabber
sufficient to address the access issues encountered in the past?

* Are there features that matrix or zulip provide that are truly helpful
for progressing IETF work? If so, please describe how they are helping.

Discussion should take place at tools-discuss@ietf.org, but we will also
be watching #trial1-feedback on both zulip and matrix.

Robert Sparks - Tools Team Chair

--
110attendees mailing list
11= 0attendees@ietf.org
https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinf= o/110attendees

--00000000000061325805bd07e599-- From nobody Mon Mar 8 07:30:51 2021 Return-Path: X-Original-To: tools-discuss@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: tools-discuss@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5BFF53A2C39 for ; Mon, 8 Mar 2021 07:30:49 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.099 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.099 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, NICE_REPLY_A=-0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE=-0.0001, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=gmail.com Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 7Lo8YrK_xekI for ; Mon, 8 Mar 2021 07:30:48 -0800 (PST) Received: from mail-qk1-x736.google.com (mail-qk1-x736.google.com [IPv6:2607:f8b0:4864:20::736]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id E2E313A2C3B for ; Mon, 8 Mar 2021 07:30:47 -0800 (PST) Received: by mail-qk1-x736.google.com with SMTP id x10so9588927qkm.8 for ; Mon, 08 Mar 2021 07:30:47 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20161025; h=to:references:from:subject:message-id:date:user-agent:mime-version :in-reply-to:content-transfer-encoding:content-language; bh=2HJXXk+V4uu+Rp2GXa0esufGH5dpQ6V/i6i7nyUMMHA=; b=ThOz9zBo4cnfjj502N40NY0GAyAqeVTHD098W+iYXetbyy9Hv39YsXhAxxGIVGgpL3 gStny/bPdpWXmypt+YN3RgZkNzb47elaRbkU9vLVCcdI1GElATVHW1G6BArVDJkQ+jua gGdjm2gdCxFniOK0kMdxgk90I+ukBspk+MXDqZpkHVCeUcX9KT5hivsdQS5qnkEszTeI 0zRGRt5omJ1heySK6SLG+ETum60LUSfqXl9OnHF59Gsj3Yk0FjpEEUiXVjxrONzDMiBW QEIBg6cNXJdBO8gccvK7lALQifLPZb6MSfswRNCvJ3IUJ/uUBB6kfHTilK7+mVHWqG5U KSNg== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:to:references:from:subject:message-id:date :user-agent:mime-version:in-reply-to:content-transfer-encoding :content-language; bh=2HJXXk+V4uu+Rp2GXa0esufGH5dpQ6V/i6i7nyUMMHA=; b=ZicIt0lsTxwPf6CvbbPPF8BjGuHEElhw0wZblxUa+qso0trc0B5+yEHLU7v56FxnQP 7nkRE0cbJVxCVMhvH1CjydsssQIpfhmujiM7PWx2Nz0dZVTbT37GsNdCeBzAOkjvzUQo hUgo5g55NcWvfhn1830MdEqjvK0NWu3S4tJgf59MTGb/GtqBtKA3pyhGQcItu3KF2NIi zM+h5S+Z7GUZ7BP+ZrLZN1FQeX4hVen9LahjL81TilGLThnnrPZSuJ4iAabhuB5qBOhZ asVjZjZBgVcMO7FJZ3oz7+xjSTkRZS41ltIBxPW55aVCVU+GqobffPjimsOJd3smrJhO nKqw== X-Gm-Message-State: AOAM530/IisWVXrRRMXFseNWtTKQX8MmfC0PfdZNaPmHZPrsub5z7v5c OxbKiUbpzatvhbTLV+gsLSDW0PIklU8= X-Google-Smtp-Source: ABdhPJwth7kU1+a6/463D/VlAtEmpxOkMiOCfhpg16QDErGcvn0ySKua7LG0ODgGttMIntFm75oapw== X-Received: by 2002:a05:620a:1206:: with SMTP id u6mr19927957qkj.173.1615217443687; Mon, 08 Mar 2021 07:30:43 -0800 (PST) Received: from ?IPv6:2607:fea8:8a0:1397:91bc:a4cd:1f93:d140? ([2607:fea8:8a0:1397:91bc:a4cd:1f93:d140]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id m90sm7033764qte.44.2021.03.08.07.30.42 for (version=TLS1_3 cipher=TLS_AES_128_GCM_SHA256 bits=128/128); Mon, 08 Mar 2021 07:30:43 -0800 (PST) To: tools-discuss References: <93891e1d-4f5a-b9ad-910e-b439c7e10166@nostrum.com> From: Rene Struik Message-ID: <9036e793-e900-5d62-4915-c5b9904b328d@gmail.com> Date: Mon, 8 Mar 2021 10:30:40 -0500 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows NT 10.0; Win64; x64; rv:78.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/78.8.0 MIME-Version: 1.0 In-Reply-To: <93891e1d-4f5a-b9ad-910e-b439c7e10166@nostrum.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Language: en-US Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Tools-discuss] [110attendees] New and changing datatracker features X-BeenThere: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF Tools Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 08 Mar 2021 15:30:49 -0000 It would be nice to see which versions of an internet draft are actually = available (e.g., if a pdf version is not available for download, but a=20 text version is, one does not get error messages when trying to download = the pdf version, where it is not always clear whether this is a cache=20 issue on one's own machine or simple non-availability). If the draft tool could indicate this, that would be useful. Best regards, Rene On 2021-03-08 9:58 a.m., Robert Sparks wrote: > All - > > If you haven't noticed already, the htmlization for drafts at the=20 > datatracker changed with the latest release. > > See, for example,=20 > https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/html/draft-ietf-quic-applicability-10 > > You can see the full set of changes for each release at > > https://datatracker.ietf.org/release/ > > If there are things you wish the datatracker would do for you, please=20 > bring them up at tools-discuss@ietf.org. > > RjS > --=20 email: rstruik.ext@gmail.com | Skype: rstruik cell: +1 (647) 867-5658 | US: +1 (415) 287-3867 From nobody Mon Mar 8 08:42:24 2021 Return-Path: X-Original-To: tools-discuss@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: tools-discuss@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 521313A0ED2; Mon, 8 Mar 2021 08:42:22 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.097 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.097 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=gmail.com Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id Fk6KvTZoGJO1; Mon, 8 Mar 2021 08:42:20 -0800 (PST) Received: from mail-qk1-x732.google.com (mail-qk1-x732.google.com [IPv6:2607:f8b0:4864:20::732]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 268003A0ED1; Mon, 8 Mar 2021 08:42:20 -0800 (PST) Received: by mail-qk1-x732.google.com with SMTP id s7so9886710qkg.4; Mon, 08 Mar 2021 08:42:20 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20161025; h=mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date:message-id:subject:to :cc; bh=1LN2rymFtn9AZZhOuASngij/pZc0c1FcSouDIHQ8CjI=; b=AlfwEwPi+aDzFuYj6VqfSDFN2BjwKRiRZsuxIv2JSSn2CsKX/vzO9y1HhevqFJwWeg 9r6qVWXZfLV9D51PNbdOEaGV6X03gUhnYhsdKKJYmm4uzjYdDHrfgTWu7IVuhQtXMzDk Efe/DULivL1eKPm+nYnPxPrxc1KtYebW2iPZcQMToXYoRtaj8YZ3eYCf31QjTjiQAfiU AgIbma3d4XCitM1KOFgSR8NpKCNgBS56aul3OCK582X+y9IypkK/5Htn8Jwe7j3eZHfr plcu6MNLzaJpz4T5lRFZJiAmSPomSHfqJt8NaGkLepIO4iyxOLz+M8QEmprAVk0FQu/h xzJw== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date :message-id:subject:to:cc; bh=1LN2rymFtn9AZZhOuASngij/pZc0c1FcSouDIHQ8CjI=; b=nERFUAtE9wcyMj2kUCaVK2Sbz56s1Yq86uspxE4rPBN4H1E7i/BIJz4Q0YaWeNAKde DD6Lpqu4G/0cBfOP7J5lwlzJ3TQJ3n8012q+M9TOlKAxmYx7uL0fk09teR5nqgwV0Lnf VQQqjitDo8/S2cGx0J6rXXdjjzV9O9tvjyPj+da+M/afcSjyPZ2C0gBWZHKEOPEhdR5v Pd0UNMFmL4a9iExsEdVtsdLzgy0NLdNykSuuEok5RUeiaGQAOyUwrsGxu1zl4s0uaP5Q 72xNH4iuXqU1K3FzhFgWPfVbltKzggC6xVRY5+KowBhPJ6jsgP1w9uee13TSGv+2QC+o iqKw== X-Gm-Message-State: AOAM530VZoHr1OpRjFAaj9j86A2zmq0hC7RHIkh9lvLC0FHqC4d12/+q QlQEAW+t2nFHrsx21ew+JGZht9iqGIhaMAFQ0bo= X-Google-Smtp-Source: ABdhPJyjSqCGJFspNzqu6cY9yj0rAWCvKKGTPB4fz8OLdRTLfxmRAE5OJ9zy+2FW3RNz6ClneUaaEbfDlT96tTx4eIs= X-Received: by 2002:a05:620a:699:: with SMTP id f25mr13605059qkh.249.1615221737807; Mon, 08 Mar 2021 08:42:17 -0800 (PST) MIME-Version: 1.0 References: <1dba6704-e997-0ceb-ff85-b5f5f639b274@nostrum.com> In-Reply-To: From: "Andrew G. Malis" Date: Mon, 8 Mar 2021 11:42:02 -0500 Message-ID: To: sarikaya Cc: Robert Sparks , tools-discuss , 110attendees@ietf.org, Matthew Hodgson Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="000000000000ea7c4405bd091d63" Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Tools-discuss] [110attendees] Chat services during IETF 110 X-BeenThere: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF Tools Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 08 Mar 2021 16:42:23 -0000 --000000000000ea7c4405bd091d63 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Behcet, If you mean your photo for Meetecho, here is the info from the meetecho documentation for IETF 108 (I didn't see this in the IETF 110 documentation, but I'm sure it's still the same): Name and role Your name and role in the session (e.g. Participant or Chair) will appear in the upper left hand corner of the Meetecho window. Note that your profile picture is taken from the Gravatar (https://en.gravatar.com) service based on the email used during the login process (if available) and not images from the IETF Datatracker. Cheers, Andy On Mon, Mar 8, 2021 at 10:15 AM Behcet Sarikaya wrote: > One more question/issue: How do I put my photo? > On the settings menu, it seems to be possible to upload a picture but I > could not make it work, upload and remove choices come up, I upload my > picture and then what? If I press the upload button again, it goes back to > my local disk. The other choice is remove. If I return, no picture is > inserted. > > Behcet > > > > On Fri, Mar 5, 2021 at 1:11 PM Robert Sparks wrote: > >> It's been a little while since I started a Matrix account. I don't >> remember _uploading_ the recovery key on first access, but I do remember it >> getting created and me downloading it. But I may just not remember. >> >> Matthew - can you point Behcet at something that might help? >> >> RjS >> On 3/3/21 11:35 AM, Behcet Sarikaya wrote: >> >> Hi Robert, >> >> Thank you for this information. I made an account on matrix and used it a >> bit. It seems to work fine :) >> >> About the recovery key: I don't understand why at very login I have to >> upload it? >> >> >> Behcet >> On Thu, Feb 25, 2021 at 1:03 PM Robert Sparks >> wrote: >> >>> Please be aware of the ongoing chat services trials during IETF 110. >>> >>> There are instances of matrix and zulip running at >>> >>> https://matrix-trial1.ietf.org and https://zulip-trial1.ietf.org, >>> respectively. >>> >>> They are bridged into xmpp. >>> >>> There is also a web interface into the xmpp chatrooms at >>> https://xmpp-trial1.ietf.org. This service also allows the creation of >>> accounts, and can be used with any xmpp client. >>> >>> Each Meetecho session provides its own view into the xmpp chatroom >>> associated with the group's meeting. That chat can be participated in >>> through any of the three services. >>> >>> For more information see: >>> >>> >>> https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/ietf-announce/UtPuWgXhYbjyf7wHGJh4ax4kQrA/ >>> >>> >>> https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/ietf-announce/B1b71fKWGfAq0ZKJ0KSwxzn7WgI/ >>> >>> Discussion of the effectiveness of these services is encouraged. We are >>> particularly interested in hearing about the following: >>> >>> * Is providing local jabber accounts and a web interface to jabber >>> sufficient to address the access issues encountered in the past? >>> >>> * Are there features that matrix or zulip provide that are truly helpful >>> for progressing IETF work? If so, please describe how they are helping. >>> >>> Discussion should take place at tools-discuss@ietf.org, but we will >>> also >>> be watching #trial1-feedback on both zulip and matrix. >>> >>> Robert Sparks - Tools Team Chair >>> >>> -- >>> 110attendees mailing list >>> 110attendees@ietf.org >>> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/110attendees >>> >> >> -- > 110attendees mailing list > 110attendees@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/110attendees > --000000000000ea7c4405bd091d63 Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Behcet,

If you mean your photo for Meet= echo, here is the info from the meetecho documentation for IETF 108 (I didn= 't see this in the IETF 110 documentation, but I'm sure it's st= ill the same):

Name and role

Your name and role in the session (e.g. Partici= pant or Chair) will appear in the upper left hand corner of the Meetecho wi= ndow. Note that your profile picture is taken from the Gravatar=C2=A0(https://en.gravatar.com) service based o= n the email used during the login process (if available) and not images fro= m the IETF Datatracker.


Cheers,

Andy



On Mon, Mar 8, 2021 at 10:15 AM Behcet Sarika= ya <sarikaya2012@gmail.com= > wrote:
One more question/issue: How do I put my photo?
On the set= tings menu, it seems to be possible to upload a picture but I could not mak= e it work, upload and remove choices come up, I upload my picture and then = what? If I press the upload button again, it goes back to my local disk. Th= e other choice is remove. If I return, no picture is inserted.
Behcet



On Fri, Mar 5, 2021 = at 1:11 PM Robert Sparks <rjsparks@nostrum.com> wrote:
=20 =20 =20

It's been a little while since I started a Matrix account. I don't remember _uploading_ the recovery key on first access, but = I do remember it getting created and me downloading it. But I may just not remember.

Matthew - can you point Behcet at something that might help?

RjS

On 3/3/21 11:35 AM, Behcet Sarikaya wrote:
=20
Hi Robert,

Thank you for this=C2=A0information. I made an account on matrix an= d used it a bit. It seems to work fine :)

About the recovery key: I don't understand why at very login I have to upload it?


Behcet
On Thu, Feb 25, 2021 at 1:03 PM Robert Sparks <rjsparks@nostrum.com> wrote:
Please be aware of the ongoing chat services trials during IETF 110.

There are instances of matrix and zulip running at

https://matrix-trial1.ietf.org and https://zulip-trial1.ietf.org,
respectively.

They are bridged into xmpp.

There is also a web interface into the xmpp chatrooms at
https://xmpp-trial1.ietf.org. This service also allows the creation of
accounts, and can be used with any xmpp client.

Each Meetecho session provides its own view into the xmpp chatroom
associated with the group's meeting. That chat can be participated in
through any of the three services.

For more information see:

https:= //mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/ietf-announce/UtPuWgXhYbjyf7wHGJh4ax4kQrA/<= /a>

https:= //mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/ietf-announce/B1b71fKWGfAq0ZKJ0KSwxzn7WgI/<= /a>

Discussion of the effectiveness of these services is encouraged. We are
particularly interested in hearing about the following:

* Is providing local jabber accounts and a web interface to jabber
sufficient to address the access issues encountered in the past?

* Are there features that matrix or zulip provide that are truly helpful
for progressing IETF work? If so, please describe how they are helping.

Discussion should take place at tools-discuss@ietf.org, but we will also
be watching #trial1-feedback on both zulip and matrix.

Robert Sparks - Tools Team Chair

--
110attendees mailing list
11= 0attendees@ietf.org
https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinf= o/110attendees

--
110attendees mailing list
110attendees@iet= f.org
https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/110attendees=
--000000000000ea7c4405bd091d63-- From nobody Mon Mar 8 10:28:01 2021 Return-Path: X-Original-To: tools-discuss@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: tools-discuss@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id A50C33A1449; Mon, 8 Mar 2021 10:27:59 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.899 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.899 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id Wwv7SqK-lkfz; Mon, 8 Mar 2021 10:27:56 -0800 (PST) Received: from [192.168.0.110] (pool-72-66-99-52.washdc.fios.verizon.net [72.66.99.52]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id B45863A1447; Mon, 8 Mar 2021 10:27:55 -0800 (PST) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Mime-Version: 1.0 (Mac OS X Mail 14.0 \(3654.60.0.2.21\)) From: Greg Wood In-Reply-To: Date: Mon, 8 Mar 2021 13:27:53 -0500 Cc: sarikaya , 110attendees <110attendees@ietf.org>, Matthew Hodgson , tools-discuss , Robert Sparks Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Message-Id: <1AFC94BE-613A-4E01-961E-DF4DAFE42060@ietf.org> References: <1dba6704-e997-0ceb-ff85-b5f5f639b274@nostrum.com> To: "Andrew G. Malis" X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.3654.60.0.2.21) Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Tools-discuss] [110attendees] Chat services during IETF 110 X-BeenThere: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF Tools Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 08 Mar 2021 18:28:00 -0000 Hi, The approach has changed slightly since 108. Datatracker profiles are = now checked first for images, and then Gravatar. If you=E2=80=99d like = to add or change your IETF Datatracker profile picture, please send = email to: support@ietf.org Here=E2=80=99s the link to the full Meetecho Documentation for IETF 110 = (and the excerpt about pictures): https://www.ietf.org/media/documents/IETF110-Meetecho-Documentation.pdf Your name and role in the session (e.g. Participant or Chair) will = appear in the upper left hand corner of the Meetecho window. Note that = your profile picture is taken from your IETF Datatracker profile, if = available. If no picture is available in the IETF Datatracker, then a = picture is taken from the G=E2=80=8Bravatar=E2=80=8B service, if = available, based on the email used during the registration process (if = available) and not images from the IETF Datatracker. Hope that helps, -Greg > On Mar 8, 2021, at 11:42 AM, Andrew G. Malis = wrote: >=20 > Behcet, >=20 > If you mean your photo for Meetecho, here is the info from the = meetecho documentation for IETF 108 (I didn't see this in the IETF 110 = documentation, but I'm sure it's still the same): >=20 > Name and role > Your name and role in the session (e.g. Participant or Chair) will = appear in the upper left hand corner of the Meetecho window. Note that = your profile picture is taken from the Gravatar = (https://en.gravatar.com) service based on the email used during the = login process (if available) and not images from the IETF Datatracker. >=20 > Cheers, > Andy >=20 >=20 > On Mon, Mar 8, 2021 at 10:15 AM Behcet Sarikaya = wrote: > One more question/issue: How do I put my photo? > On the settings menu, it seems to be possible to upload a picture but = I could not make it work, upload and remove choices come up, I upload my = picture and then what? If I press the upload button again, it goes back = to my local disk. The other choice is remove. If I return, no picture is = inserted. >=20 > Behcet >=20 >=20 >=20 > On Fri, Mar 5, 2021 at 1:11 PM Robert Sparks = wrote: > It's been a little while since I started a Matrix account. I don't = remember _uploading_ the recovery key on first access, but I do remember = it getting created and me downloading it. But I may just not remember. >=20 > Matthew - can you point Behcet at something that might help? >=20 > RjS >=20 > On 3/3/21 11:35 AM, Behcet Sarikaya wrote: >> Hi Robert, >>=20 >> Thank you for this information. I made an account on matrix and used = it a bit. It seems to work fine :) >>=20 >> About the recovery key: I don't understand why at very login I have = to upload it? >>=20 >>=20 >> Behcet >> On Thu, Feb 25, 2021 at 1:03 PM Robert Sparks = wrote: >> Please be aware of the ongoing chat services trials during IETF 110. >>=20 >> There are instances of matrix and zulip running at >>=20 >> https://matrix-trial1.ietf.org and https://zulip-trial1.ietf.org,=20 >> respectively. >>=20 >> They are bridged into xmpp. >>=20 >> There is also a web interface into the xmpp chatrooms at=20 >> https://xmpp-trial1.ietf.org. This service also allows the creation = of=20 >> accounts, and can be used with any xmpp client. >>=20 >> Each Meetecho session provides its own view into the xmpp chatroom=20 >> associated with the group's meeting. That chat can be participated in=20= >> through any of the three services. >>=20 >> For more information see: >>=20 >> = https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/ietf-announce/UtPuWgXhYbjyf7wHGJh4ax= 4kQrA/ >>=20 >> = https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/ietf-announce/B1b71fKWGfAq0ZKJ0KSwxz= n7WgI/ >>=20 >> Discussion of the effectiveness of these services is encouraged. We = are=20 >> particularly interested in hearing about the following: >>=20 >> * Is providing local jabber accounts and a web interface to jabber=20 >> sufficient to address the access issues encountered in the past? >>=20 >> * Are there features that matrix or zulip provide that are truly = helpful=20 >> for progressing IETF work? If so, please describe how they are = helping. >>=20 >> Discussion should take place at tools-discuss@ietf.org, but we will = also=20 >> be watching #trial1-feedback on both zulip and matrix. >>=20 >> Robert Sparks - Tools Team Chair >>=20 >> --=20 >> 110attendees mailing list >> 110attendees@ietf.org >> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/110attendees >>=20 >=20 > --=20 > 110attendees mailing list > 110attendees@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/110attendees > ___________________________________________________________ > Tools-discuss mailing list - Tools-discuss@ietf.org > This list is for discussion, not for action requests or bug reports. > * Report datatracker and mailarchive bugs to: = datatracker-project@ietf.org > * Report tools.ietf.org bugs to: webmaster@tools.ietf.org > * Report all other bugs or issues to: ietf-action@ietf.org > List info (including how to Unsubscribe): = https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/tools-discuss From nobody Mon Mar 8 15:10:59 2021 Return-Path: X-Original-To: tools-discuss@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: tools-discuss@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 276B13A198B; Mon, 8 Mar 2021 15:10:56 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.847 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.847 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, FREEMAIL_ENVFROM_END_DIGIT=0.25, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=gmail.com Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id s-oV1rTcgitX; Mon, 8 Mar 2021 15:10:54 -0800 (PST) Received: from mail-yb1-xb34.google.com (mail-yb1-xb34.google.com [IPv6:2607:f8b0:4864:20::b34]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id D85C03A16AC; Mon, 8 Mar 2021 15:10:53 -0800 (PST) Received: by mail-yb1-xb34.google.com with SMTP id c131so11931699ybf.7; Mon, 08 Mar 2021 15:10:53 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20161025; h=mime-version:references:in-reply-to:reply-to:from:date:message-id :subject:to:cc; bh=t1kdUcbJWJ5XkCzYs6GM8ZiCedntUAzh9yBvOJnhSFI=; b=AGnk7XaDwiDgrf0gypF30+xkDAmSARujsM/HqB/WQ70A7BaupyI4wnzVV5TXgA21fp hdNOFq79Y024izZ94YWmiyw/j3ph0deKCe9hnQe+L0LjCuU6TuhCC85KuMJU7AhF73O6 0XpGpfA9QRM3KO4/DeBLFlbv5qq9jl+PjaQzcrTokSzckoCbpO/KXulEsT+BDl3sdQFV 0UX6xZIacjiN0jBMvGrdAx45CZUSQ2bKz5JdwFRsJQ5f+2J3ARZGI0HM3iBfielGEHen nPM2Pl3B1suZV5d1ufW1Z845qMTdjDzQm/4cBosta/tEiF3aT3+/1jd0+K3ESDF+Xvu+ CW5A== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:references:in-reply-to:reply-to :from:date:message-id:subject:to:cc; bh=t1kdUcbJWJ5XkCzYs6GM8ZiCedntUAzh9yBvOJnhSFI=; b=EBoXtAsjXtSiqBKAKBu4dHoPlIjxPgugpFwNWizCtJeErpeNMD2bAFFNH0oO6JPBlI uos0tHXMjbNJyYfX1vUoFCkQlMmDO7GCdvJPdolKh9GZevTdRmtlGi6i1Jz7uNx2UqbO IeABHxHDtQ+WZdU3E53/riRfIyDfDqOvx9CqpOFAI6rjwgejRSsWVc8B4oZB713OBpUS NqKGxpmJ+TbsahSzfriudwogWyuqeFqFbb16WPJykTV59wn3mBH6jy4nZi1PZVMbit2J rEXcZDLyCq4wzShJ6qEVyrfHR4qmIq0sEM3Ey3UtL23lojP1eAxjwd+p2bm/bpo8MJfE GiRA== X-Gm-Message-State: AOAM533PZAmDj77qoEbbJO3LKEzt7/W9I2UES2EenyO/wad7ZxRwFMT4 XvgkT0bh+yYyfAoaRf9KRHM5p1+W9aDssmiaNAw= X-Google-Smtp-Source: ABdhPJzh7p0wvlKeic4asKMZPcb0I0ft4o3YVDWI1Z9jj+naXBCj831wLDAxX6yKplsi8O0uZmBjA7Ss6oPP5I7SVNU= X-Received: by 2002:a25:20f:: with SMTP id 15mr34927198ybc.423.1615245053107; Mon, 08 Mar 2021 15:10:53 -0800 (PST) MIME-Version: 1.0 References: <1dba6704-e997-0ceb-ff85-b5f5f639b274@nostrum.com> In-Reply-To: Reply-To: sarikaya@ieee.org From: Behcet Sarikaya Date: Mon, 8 Mar 2021 17:10:42 -0600 Message-ID: To: "Andrew G. Malis" Cc: sarikaya , Robert Sparks , tools-discuss , 110attendees@ietf.org, Matthew Hodgson Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="0000000000009da23c05bd0e8b83" Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Tools-discuss] [110attendees] Chat services during IETF 110 X-BeenThere: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF Tools Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 08 Mar 2021 23:10:56 -0000 --0000000000009da23c05bd0e8b83 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" No my friend Andy, it was for Matrix. I think I am gonna skip using Matrix and switch back to Adium. Behcet On Mon, Mar 8, 2021 at 10:42 AM Andrew G. Malis wrote: > Behcet, > > If you mean your photo for Meetecho, here is the info from the meetecho > documentation for IETF 108 (I didn't see this in the IETF 110 > documentation, but I'm sure it's still the same): > > Name and role > > Your name and role in the session (e.g. Participant or Chair) will appear > in the upper left hand corner of the Meetecho window. Note that your > profile picture is taken from the Gravatar (https://en.gravatar.com) > service based on the email used during the login process (if available) and > not images from the IETF Datatracker. > > > Cheers, > > Andy > > > > On Mon, Mar 8, 2021 at 10:15 AM Behcet Sarikaya > wrote: > >> One more question/issue: How do I put my photo? >> On the settings menu, it seems to be possible to upload a picture but I >> could not make it work, upload and remove choices come up, I upload my >> picture and then what? If I press the upload button again, it goes back to >> my local disk. The other choice is remove. If I return, no picture is >> inserted. >> >> Behcet >> >> >> >> On Fri, Mar 5, 2021 at 1:11 PM Robert Sparks >> wrote: >> >>> It's been a little while since I started a Matrix account. I don't >>> remember _uploading_ the recovery key on first access, but I do remember it >>> getting created and me downloading it. But I may just not remember. >>> >>> Matthew - can you point Behcet at something that might help? >>> >>> RjS >>> On 3/3/21 11:35 AM, Behcet Sarikaya wrote: >>> >>> Hi Robert, >>> >>> Thank you for this information. I made an account on matrix and used it >>> a bit. It seems to work fine :) >>> >>> About the recovery key: I don't understand why at very login I have to >>> upload it? >>> >>> >>> Behcet >>> On Thu, Feb 25, 2021 at 1:03 PM Robert Sparks >>> wrote: >>> >>>> Please be aware of the ongoing chat services trials during IETF 110. >>>> >>>> There are instances of matrix and zulip running at >>>> >>>> https://matrix-trial1.ietf.org and https://zulip-trial1.ietf.org, >>>> respectively. >>>> >>>> They are bridged into xmpp. >>>> >>>> There is also a web interface into the xmpp chatrooms at >>>> https://xmpp-trial1.ietf.org. This service also allows the creation of >>>> accounts, and can be used with any xmpp client. >>>> >>>> Each Meetecho session provides its own view into the xmpp chatroom >>>> associated with the group's meeting. That chat can be participated in >>>> through any of the three services. >>>> >>>> For more information see: >>>> >>>> >>>> https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/ietf-announce/UtPuWgXhYbjyf7wHGJh4ax4kQrA/ >>>> >>>> >>>> https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/ietf-announce/B1b71fKWGfAq0ZKJ0KSwxzn7WgI/ >>>> >>>> Discussion of the effectiveness of these services is encouraged. We are >>>> particularly interested in hearing about the following: >>>> >>>> * Is providing local jabber accounts and a web interface to jabber >>>> sufficient to address the access issues encountered in the past? >>>> >>>> * Are there features that matrix or zulip provide that are truly >>>> helpful >>>> for progressing IETF work? If so, please describe how they are helping. >>>> >>>> Discussion should take place at tools-discuss@ietf.org, but we will >>>> also >>>> be watching #trial1-feedback on both zulip and matrix. >>>> >>>> Robert Sparks - Tools Team Chair >>>> >>>> -- >>>> 110attendees mailing list >>>> 110attendees@ietf.org >>>> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/110attendees >>>> >>> >>> -- >> 110attendees mailing list >> 110attendees@ietf.org >> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/110attendees >> > --0000000000009da23c05bd0e8b83 Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
No my friend Andy, it was for Matrix.

I= think I am gonna skip using=C2=A0Matrix and switch back to Adium.

Behcet

On Mon, Mar 8, 2021 at 10:42 AM Andrew G. Mal= is <agmalis@gmail.com> wrote= :
Behcet,

If = you mean your photo for Meetecho, here is the info from the meetecho docume= ntation for IETF 108 (I didn't see this in the IETF 110 documentation, = but I'm sure it's still the same):

Name and role

Your name and role in the session (e.g. Participant or Chair) will= appear in the upper left hand corner of the Meetecho window. Note that you= r profile picture is taken from the Gravatar=C2=A0(https://en.gravatar.com) service based on= the email used during the login process (if available) and not images from= the IETF Datatracker.


Cheers,

And= y



On Mon, Mar 8, 2021 at 10:15 AM Behcet Sarika= ya <sarikaya= 2012@gmail.com> wrote:
On= e more question/issue: How do I put my photo?
On the settings menu, it = seems to be possible to upload a picture but I could not make it work, uplo= ad and remove choices come up, I upload my picture and then what? If I pres= s the upload button again, it goes back to my local disk. The other choice = is remove. If I return, no picture is inserted.

Be= hcet



On Fri, Mar 5, 2021 at 1:11 PM Robe= rt Sparks <rjs= parks@nostrum.com> wrote:
=20 =20 =20

It's been a little while since I started a Matrix account. I don't remember _uploading_ the recovery key on first access, but = I do remember it getting created and me downloading it. But I may just not remember.

Matthew - can you point Behcet at something that might help?

RjS

On 3/3/21 11:35 AM, Behcet Sarikaya wrote:
=20
Hi Robert,

Thank you for this=C2=A0information. I made an account on matrix an= d used it a bit. It seems to work fine :)

About the recovery key: I don't understand why at very login I have to upload it?


Behcet
On Thu, Feb 25, 2021 at 1:03 PM Robert Sparks <rjsparks@nostrum.com> wrote:
Please be aware of the ongoing chat services trials during IETF 110.

There are instances of matrix and zulip running at

https://matrix-trial1.ietf.org and https://zulip-trial1.ietf.org,
respectively.

They are bridged into xmpp.

There is also a web interface into the xmpp chatrooms at
https://xmpp-trial1.ietf.org. This service also allows the creation of
accounts, and can be used with any xmpp client.

Each Meetecho session provides its own view into the xmpp chatroom
associated with the group's meeting. That chat can be participated in
through any of the three services.

For more information see:

https:= //mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/ietf-announce/UtPuWgXhYbjyf7wHGJh4ax4kQrA/<= /a>

https:= //mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/ietf-announce/B1b71fKWGfAq0ZKJ0KSwxzn7WgI/<= /a>

Discussion of the effectiveness of these services is encouraged. We are
particularly interested in hearing about the following:

* Is providing local jabber accounts and a web interface to jabber
sufficient to address the access issues encountered in the past?

* Are there features that matrix or zulip provide that are truly helpful
for progressing IETF work? If so, please describe how they are helping.

Discussion should take place at tools-discuss@ietf.org, but we will also
be watching #trial1-feedback on both zulip and matrix.

Robert Sparks - Tools Team Chair

--
110attendees mailing list
11= 0attendees@ietf.org
https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinf= o/110attendees

--
110attendees mailing list
110attendees@iet= f.org
https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/110attendees=
--0000000000009da23c05bd0e8b83-- From nobody Mon Mar 8 15:34:19 2021 Return-Path: X-Original-To: tools-discuss@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: tools-discuss@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 21C633A19E1; Mon, 8 Mar 2021 15:34:14 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.678 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.678 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_INVALID=0.1, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, KHOP_HELO_FCRDNS=0.001, NICE_REPLY_A=-0.001, T_SPF_HELO_PERMERROR=0.01, T_SPF_PERMERROR=0.01, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=no autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=fail (1024-bit key) reason="fail (message has been altered)" header.d=nostrum.com Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id w9zRhK6E-HE6; Mon, 8 Mar 2021 15:34:08 -0800 (PST) Received: from nostrum.com (raven-v6.nostrum.com [IPv6:2001:470:d:1130::1]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 053E93A19E0; Mon, 8 Mar 2021 15:34:07 -0800 (PST) Received: from unformal.local ([47.186.1.92]) (authenticated bits=0) by nostrum.com (8.16.1/8.16.1) with ESMTPSA id 128NXuYG044280 (version=TLSv1.3 cipher=TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 bits=256 verify=NO); Mon, 8 Mar 2021 17:33:56 -0600 (CST) (envelope-from rjsparks@nostrum.com) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=simple/simple; d=nostrum.com; s=default; t=1615246437; bh=qUyKu5wwuRG19WFiPQvC7LB8N5rysALxMT96IiYePwA=; h=Subject:To:Cc:References:From:Date:In-Reply-To; b=oKSWhx9VkiOVO7E4xdJmcIBqws9skXxyYFINlMdzz5i+eMnk36hraYvDHf4FRwTUP lBYisJ/B1fP+dTKacQaUFgEj6/af2O0758THMQp83rqBxQJe/C4yDA1rCL+mVrG+It J1xpbZimhDzww6Z/G21HkF3ccEloAaENkTvkgFD4= X-Authentication-Warning: raven.nostrum.com: Host [47.186.1.92] claimed to be unformal.local To: sarikaya@ieee.org, "Andrew G. Malis" Cc: tools-discuss , 110attendees@ietf.org, Matthew Hodgson References: <1dba6704-e997-0ceb-ff85-b5f5f639b274@nostrum.com> From: Robert Sparks Message-ID: <72e1106d-7a0a-0588-b00d-235144057dfa@nostrum.com> Date: Mon, 8 Mar 2021 17:33:51 -0600 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Macintosh; Intel Mac OS X 10.15; rv:78.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/78.8.0 MIME-Version: 1.0 In-Reply-To: Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="------------03E801E912032BD015E8F5CB" Content-Language: en-US Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Tools-discuss] [110attendees] Chat services during IETF 110 X-BeenThere: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF Tools Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 08 Mar 2021 23:34:14 -0000 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --------------03E801E912032BD015E8F5CB Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Hi Behcet - Sorry for my delay - If you go to settings/general, in the upper right there's an upload widget that will accept photos. You have to hit "Save" under your display name after uploading it for it to take. RjS On 3/8/21 5:10 PM, Behcet Sarikaya wrote: > No my friend Andy, it was for Matrix. > > I think I am gonna skip using Matrix and switch back to Adium. > > Behcet > > On Mon, Mar 8, 2021 at 10:42 AM Andrew G. Malis > wrote: > > Behcet, > > If you mean your photo for Meetecho, here is the info from the > meetecho documentation for IETF 108 (I didn't see this in the IETF > 110 documentation, but I'm sure it's still the same): > > Name and role > > Your name and role in the session (e.g. Participant or Chair) will > appear in the upper left hand corner of the Meetecho window. Note > that your profile picture is taken from the > Gravatar (https://en.gravatar.com ) > service based on the email used during the login process (if > available) and not images from the IETF Datatracker. > > > Cheers, > > Andy > > > > On Mon, Mar 8, 2021 at 10:15 AM Behcet Sarikaya > > wrote: > > One more question/issue: How do I put my photo? > On the settings menu, it seems to be possible to upload a > picture but I could not make it work, upload and remove > choices come up, I upload my picture and then what? If I press > the upload button again, it goes back to my local disk. The > other choice is remove. If I return, no picture is inserted. > > Behcet > > > > On Fri, Mar 5, 2021 at 1:11 PM Robert Sparks > > wrote: > > It's been a little while since I started a Matrix account. > I don't remember _uploading_ the recovery key on first > access, but I do remember it getting created and me > downloading it. But I may just not remember. > > Matthew - can you point Behcet at something that might help? > > RjS > > On 3/3/21 11:35 AM, Behcet Sarikaya wrote: >> Hi Robert, >> >> Thank you for this information. I made an account on >> matrix and used it a bit. It seems to work fine :) >> >> About the recovery key: I don't understand why at very >> login I have to upload it? >> >> >> Behcet >> On Thu, Feb 25, 2021 at 1:03 PM Robert Sparks >> > wrote: >> >> Please be aware of the ongoing chat services trials >> during IETF 110. >> >> There are instances of matrix and zulip running at >> >> https://matrix-trial1.ietf.org >> and >> https://zulip-trial1.ietf.org >> , >> respectively. >> >> They are bridged into xmpp. >> >> There is also a web interface into the xmpp chatrooms at >> https://xmpp-trial1.ietf.org >> . This service also >> allows the creation of >> accounts, and can be used with any xmpp client. >> >> Each Meetecho session provides its own view into the >> xmpp chatroom >> associated with the group's meeting. That chat can be >> participated in >> through any of the three services. >> >> For more information see: >> >> https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/ietf-announce/UtPuWgXhYbjyf7wHGJh4ax4kQrA/ >> >> >> https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/ietf-announce/B1b71fKWGfAq0ZKJ0KSwxzn7WgI/ >> >> >> Discussion of the effectiveness of these services is >> encouraged. We are >> particularly interested in hearing about the following: >> >> * Is providing local jabber accounts and a web >> interface to jabber >> sufficient to address the access issues encountered >> in the past? >> >> * Are there features that matrix or zulip provide >> that are truly helpful >> for progressing IETF work? If so, please describe how >> they are helping. >> >> Discussion should take place at >> tools-discuss@ietf.org >> , but we will also >> be watching #trial1-feedback on both zulip and matrix. >> >> Robert Sparks - Tools Team Chair >> >> -- >> 110attendees mailing list >> 110attendees@ietf.org >> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/110attendees >> >> >> > -- > 110attendees mailing list > 110attendees@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/110attendees > > --------------03E801E912032BD015E8F5CB Content-Type: text/html; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit

Hi Behcet -

Sorry for my delay - If you go to settings/general, in the upper right there's an upload widget that will accept photos. You have to hit "Save" under your display name after uploading it for it to take.

RjS

On 3/8/21 5:10 PM, Behcet Sarikaya wrote:
No my friend Andy, it was for Matrix.

I think I am gonna skip using Matrix and switch back to Adium.

Behcet

On Mon, Mar 8, 2021 at 10:42 AM Andrew G. Malis <agmalis@gmail.com> wrote:
Behcet,

If you mean your photo for Meetecho, here is the info from the meetecho documentation for IETF 108 (I didn't see this in the IETF 110 documentation, but I'm sure it's still the same):

Name and role

Your name and role in the session (e.g. Participant or Chair) will appear in the upper left hand corner of the Meetecho window. Note that your profile picture is taken from the Gravatar (https://en.gravatar.com) service based on the email used during the login process (if available) and not images from the IETF Datatracker.


Cheers,

Andy



On Mon, Mar 8, 2021 at 10:15 AM Behcet Sarikaya <sarikaya2012@gmail.com> wrote:
One more question/issue: How do I put my photo?
On the settings menu, it seems to be possible to upload a picture but I could not make it work, upload and remove choices come up, I upload my picture and then what? If I press the upload button again, it goes back to my local disk. The other choice is remove. If I return, no picture is inserted.

Behcet



On Fri, Mar 5, 2021 at 1:11 PM Robert Sparks <rjsparks@nostrum.com> wrote:

It's been a little while since I started a Matrix account. I don't remember _uploading_ the recovery key on first access, but I do remember it getting created and me downloading it. But I may just not remember.

Matthew - can you point Behcet at something that might help?

RjS

On 3/3/21 11:35 AM, Behcet Sarikaya wrote:
Hi Robert,

Thank you for this information. I made an account on matrix and used it a bit. It seems to work fine :)

About the recovery key: I don't understand why at very login I have to upload it?


Behcet
On Thu, Feb 25, 2021 at 1:03 PM Robert Sparks <rjsparks@nostrum.com> wrote:
Please be aware of the ongoing chat services trials during IETF 110.

There are instances of matrix and zulip running at

https://matrix-trial1.ietf.org and https://zulip-trial1.ietf.org,
respectively.

They are bridged into xmpp.

There is also a web interface into the xmpp chatrooms at
https://xmpp-trial1.ietf.org. This service also allows the creation of
accounts, and can be used with any xmpp client.

Each Meetecho session provides its own view into the xmpp chatroom
associated with the group's meeting. That chat can be participated in
through any of the three services.

For more information see:

https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/ietf-announce/UtPuWgXhYbjyf7wHGJh4ax4kQrA/

https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/ietf-announce/B1b71fKWGfAq0ZKJ0KSwxzn7WgI/

Discussion of the effectiveness of these services is encouraged. We are
particularly interested in hearing about the following:

* Is providing local jabber accounts and a web interface to jabber
sufficient to address the access issues encountered in the past?

* Are there features that matrix or zulip provide that are truly helpful
for progressing IETF work? If so, please describe how they are helping.

Discussion should take place at tools-discuss@ietf.org, but we will also
be watching #trial1-feedback on both zulip and matrix.

Robert Sparks - Tools Team Chair

--
110attendees mailing list
110attendees@ietf.org
https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/110attendees

--
110attendees mailing list
110attendees@ietf.org
https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/110attendees
--------------03E801E912032BD015E8F5CB-- From nobody Tue Mar 9 02:56:40 2021 Return-Path: X-Original-To: tools-discuss@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: tools-discuss@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 36E933A19E3; Tue, 9 Mar 2021 02:56:38 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.678 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.678 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_INVALID=0.1, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, KHOP_HELO_FCRDNS=0.001, NICE_REPLY_A=-0.001, T_SPF_HELO_PERMERROR=0.01, T_SPF_PERMERROR=0.01, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=no autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=fail (1024-bit key) reason="fail (message has been altered)" header.d=nostrum.com Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id yZ4UVdZ5hHKD; Tue, 9 Mar 2021 02:56:32 -0800 (PST) Received: from nostrum.com (raven-v6.nostrum.com [IPv6:2001:470:d:1130::1]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 8B7483A19C6; Tue, 9 Mar 2021 02:56:32 -0800 (PST) Received: from unformal.local ([47.186.1.92]) (authenticated bits=0) by nostrum.com (8.16.1/8.16.1) with ESMTPSA id 129Au6Rk049229 (version=TLSv1.3 cipher=TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 bits=256 verify=NO); Tue, 9 Mar 2021 04:56:07 -0600 (CST) (envelope-from rjsparks@nostrum.com) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=simple/simple; d=nostrum.com; s=default; t=1615287369; bh=gYe/5jinOgNw8PNedRG3/aVafqkVqOcl34xsBKPFjWU=; h=Subject:To:Cc:References:From:Date:In-Reply-To; b=s33XpzOIPN8lqKdcKWxeV/L7Io5E81Rz4X48BczJiX61HIDRoKYeUmeE5srMjSKlW 2ItA2fzSoes5p7n+knCOv2p5ZM1wIcj+TIZjcKkQJVycX16RRxKw97ljv3F7mnTAja gd0w9vsjT1dQMUvNz+KvBN3/sJd67F9e5vNwUEfA= X-Authentication-Warning: raven.nostrum.com: Host [47.186.1.92] claimed to be unformal.local To: Vasilenko Eduard , "sarikaya@ieee.org" , "Andrew G. Malis" Cc: "110attendees@ietf.org" <110attendees@ietf.org>, Matthew Hodgson , tools-discuss References: <1dba6704-e997-0ceb-ff85-b5f5f639b274@nostrum.com> <72e1106d-7a0a-0588-b00d-235144057dfa@nostrum.com> <6071b2f785694ef0804331c48a14afe6@huawei.com> From: Robert Sparks Message-ID: Date: Tue, 9 Mar 2021 04:56:01 -0600 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Macintosh; Intel Mac OS X 10.15; rv:78.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/78.8.0 MIME-Version: 1.0 In-Reply-To: <6071b2f785694ef0804331c48a14afe6@huawei.com> Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="------------0D0A33F1FB6EE8A0EDF0B00B" Content-Language: en-US Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Tools-discuss] [110attendees] Chat services during IETF 110 X-BeenThere: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF Tools Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 09 Mar 2021 10:56:38 -0000 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --------------0D0A33F1FB6EE8A0EDF0B00B Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit On 3/9/21 2:00 AM, Vasilenko Eduard wrote: > > Hi Robert, > > Ho to attach photo to datatracker profile? > Send an email to iesg-secretary@ietf.org > > What particular site in the Internet should I visit to search for > settings/general? Better to have URL. > The question below was about the matrix trial we are running at matrix-trial1.ietf.org > > I did assume that it should be the same site (datatracker.ietf.org), > but it looks like not the case. > > I have not found this widget on datatracker.ietf.org. There is no > anything at “upper right”. > > Documentation > That's the documentation for Meetecho. > > still claims that “your profile picture is taken from your IETF > Datatracker profile, if available. If no picture is available in the > IETF Datatracker, then a picture is taken from the Gravatar service” > https://www.ietf.org/media/documents/IETF110-Meetecho-Documentation.pdf > > > May be I am asking wrong person, then I would open IT case. > > Eduard > > *From:*110attendees [mailto:110attendees-bounces@ietf.org] *On Behalf > Of *Robert Sparks > *Sent:* Tuesday, March 9, 2021 2:34 AM > *To:* sarikaya@ieee.org; Andrew G. Malis > *Cc:* 110attendees@ietf.org; Matthew Hodgson ; > tools-discuss > *Subject:* Re: [110attendees] Chat services during IETF 110 > > Hi Behcet - > > Sorry for my delay - If you go to settings/general, in the upper right > there's an upload widget that will accept photos. You have to hit > "Save" under your display name after uploading it for it to take. > > RjS > > On 3/8/21 5:10 PM, Behcet Sarikaya wrote: > > No my friend Andy, it was for Matrix. > > I think I am gonna skip using Matrix and switch back to Adium. > > Behcet > > On Mon, Mar 8, 2021 at 10:42 AM Andrew G. Malis > wrote: > > Behcet, > > If you mean your photo for Meetecho, here is the info from the > meetecho documentation for IETF 108 (I didn't see this in the > IETF 110 documentation, but I'm sure it's still the same): > > Name and role > > Your name and role in the session (e.g. Participant or Chair) > will appear in the upper left hand corner of the Meetecho > window. Note that your profile picture is taken from the > Gravatar (https://en.gravatar.com ) > service based on the email used during the login process (if > available) and not images from the IETF Datatracker. > > Cheers, > > Andy > > On Mon, Mar 8, 2021 at 10:15 AM Behcet Sarikaya > > wrote: > > One more question/issue: How do I put my photo? > > On the settings menu, it seems to be possible to upload a > picture but I could not make it work, upload and remove > choices come up, I upload my picture and then what? If I > press the upload button again, it goes back to my local > disk. The other choice is remove. If I return, no picture > is inserted. > > Behcet > > On Fri, Mar 5, 2021 at 1:11 PM Robert Sparks > > wrote: > > It's been a little while since I started a Matrix > account. I don't remember _uploading_ the recovery key > on first access, but I do remember it getting created > and me downloading it. But I may just not remember. > > Matthew - can you point Behcet at something that might > help? > > RjS > > On 3/3/21 11:35 AM, Behcet Sarikaya wrote: > > Hi Robert, > > Thank you for this information. I made an account > on matrix and used it a bit. It seems to work fine :) > > About the recovery key: I don't understand why at > very login I have to upload it? > > Behcet > > On Thu, Feb 25, 2021 at 1:03 PM Robert Sparks > > wrote: > > Please be aware of the ongoing chat services > trials during IETF 110. > > There are instances of matrix and zulip running at > > https://matrix-trial1.ietf.org > and > https://zulip-trial1.ietf.org > , > respectively. > > They are bridged into xmpp. > > There is also a web interface into the xmpp > chatrooms at > https://xmpp-trial1.ietf.org > . This service > also allows the creation of > accounts, and can be used with any xmpp client. > > Each Meetecho session provides its own view > into the xmpp chatroom > associated with the group's meeting. That chat > can be participated in > through any of the three services. > > For more information see: > > https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/ietf-announce/UtPuWgXhYbjyf7wHGJh4ax4kQrA/ > > > https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/ietf-announce/B1b71fKWGfAq0ZKJ0KSwxzn7WgI/ > > > Discussion of the effectiveness of these > services is encouraged. We are > particularly interested in hearing about the > following: > > * Is providing local jabber accounts and a web > interface to jabber > sufficient to address the access issues > encountered in the past? > > * Are there features that matrix or zulip > provide that are truly helpful > for progressing IETF work? If so, please > describe how they are helping. > > Discussion should take place at > tools-discuss@ietf.org > , but we will also > be watching #trial1-feedback on both zulip and > matrix. > > Robert Sparks - Tools Team Chair > > -- > 110attendees mailing list > 110attendees@ietf.org > > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/110attendees > > > > > -- > 110attendees mailing list > 110attendees@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/110attendees > > --------------0D0A33F1FB6EE8A0EDF0B00B Content-Type: text/html; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit


On 3/9/21 2:00 AM, Vasilenko Eduard wrote:

Hi Robert,

Ho to attach photo to datatracker profile?

Send an email to iesg-secretary@ietf.org

What particular site in the Internet should I visit to search for settings/general? Better to have URL.

The question below was about the matrix trial we are running at matrix-trial1.ietf.org

I did assume that it should be the same site (datatracker.ietf.org), but it looks like not the case.

I have not found this widget on datatracker.ietf.org. There is no anything at “upper right”.

 

Documentation

That's the documentation for Meetecho.

still claims that “your profile picture is taken from your IETF Datatracker profile, if available. If no picture is available in the IETF Datatracker, then a picture is taken from the Gravatar service” https://www.ietf.org/media/documents/IETF110-Meetecho-Documentation.pdf

 

May be I am asking wrong person, then I would open IT case.

Eduard

From: 110attendees [mailto:110attendees-bounces@ietf.org] On Behalf Of Robert Sparks
Sent: Tuesday, March 9, 2021 2:34 AM
To: sarikaya@ieee.org; Andrew G. Malis <agmalis@gmail.com>
Cc: 110attendees@ietf.org; Matthew Hodgson <matthew@element.io>; tools-discuss <tools-discuss@ietf.org>
Subject: Re: [110attendees] Chat services during IETF 110

 

Hi Behcet -

Sorry for my delay - If you go to settings/general, in the upper right there's an upload widget that will accept photos. You have to hit "Save" under your display name after uploading it for it to take.

RjS

On 3/8/21 5:10 PM, Behcet Sarikaya wrote:

No my friend Andy, it was for Matrix.

 

I think I am gonna skip using Matrix and switch back to Adium.

 

Behcet

 

On Mon, Mar 8, 2021 at 10:42 AM Andrew G. Malis <agmalis@gmail.com> wrote:

Behcet,

 

If you mean your photo for Meetecho, here is the info from the meetecho documentation for IETF 108 (I didn't see this in the IETF 110 documentation, but I'm sure it's still the same):

 

Name and role

Your name and role in the session (e.g. Participant or Chair) will appear in the upper left hand corner of the Meetecho window. Note that your profile picture is taken from the Gravatar (https://en.gravatar.com) service based on the email used during the login process (if available) and not images from the IETF Datatracker.

 

Cheers,

Andy

 

 

On Mon, Mar 8, 2021 at 10:15 AM Behcet Sarikaya <sarikaya2012@gmail.com> wrote:

One more question/issue: How do I put my photo?

On the settings menu, it seems to be possible to upload a picture but I could not make it work, upload and remove choices come up, I upload my picture and then what? If I press the upload button again, it goes back to my local disk. The other choice is remove. If I return, no picture is inserted.

 

Behcet

 

 

 

On Fri, Mar 5, 2021 at 1:11 PM Robert Sparks <rjsparks@nostrum.com> wrote:

It's been a little while since I started a Matrix account. I don't remember _uploading_ the recovery key on first access, but I do remember it getting created and me downloading it. But I may just not remember.

Matthew - can you point Behcet at something that might help?

RjS

On 3/3/21 11:35 AM, Behcet Sarikaya wrote:

Hi Robert,

 

Thank you for this information. I made an account on matrix and used it a bit. It seems to work fine :)

 

About the recovery key: I don't understand why at very login I have to upload it?

 

 

Behcet

On Thu, Feb 25, 2021 at 1:03 PM Robert Sparks <rjsparks@nostrum.com> wrote:

Please be aware of the ongoing chat services trials during IETF 110.

There are instances of matrix and zulip running at

https://matrix-trial1.ietf.org and https://zulip-trial1.ietf.org,
respectively.

They are bridged into xmpp.

There is also a web interface into the xmpp chatrooms at
https://xmpp-trial1.ietf.org. This service also allows the creation of
accounts, and can be used with any xmpp client.

Each Meetecho session provides its own view into the xmpp chatroom
associated with the group's meeting. That chat can be participated in
through any of the three services.

For more information see:

https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/ietf-announce/UtPuWgXhYbjyf7wHGJh4ax4kQrA/

https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/ietf-announce/B1b71fKWGfAq0ZKJ0KSwxzn7WgI/

Discussion of the effectiveness of these services is encouraged. We are
particularly interested in hearing about the following:

* Is providing local jabber accounts and a web interface to jabber
sufficient to address the access issues encountered in the past?

* Are there features that matrix or zulip provide that are truly helpful
for progressing IETF work? If so, please describe how they are helping.

Discussion should take place at tools-discuss@ietf.org, but we will also
be watching #trial1-feedback on both zulip and matrix.

Robert Sparks - Tools Team Chair

--
110attendees mailing list
110attendees@ietf.org
https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/110attendees



--
110attendees mailing list
110attendees@ietf.org
https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/110attendees

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[134.102.50.17]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher AECDH-AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id D74A33A0BED for ; Tue, 9 Mar 2021 05:31:27 -0800 (PST) Received: from [192.168.217.123] (p5089a828.dip0.t-ipconnect.de [80.137.168.40]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by gabriel-vm-2.zfn.uni-bremen.de (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 4Dvx1n64QRzyYv; Tue, 9 Mar 2021 14:31:25 +0100 (CET) From: Carsten Bormann Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Mao-Original-Outgoing-Id: 636989484.373921-2806467127647c080f72e27b6922bc2f Mime-Version: 1.0 (Mac OS X Mail 13.4 \(3608.120.23.2.4\)) Date: Tue, 9 Mar 2021 14:31:25 +0100 Message-Id: <2210D44B-254E-4486-A906-6BBC6123D96F@tzi.org> To: tools-discuss X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.3608.120.23.2.4) Archived-At: Subject: [Tools-discuss] meetecho: Slide presenting X-BeenThere: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF Tools Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 09 Mar 2021 13:31:32 -0000 The biggest drawback of meetecho is that it does not support slide = presentation. Before you say that other webconf tools don=E2=80=99t either, there is = one that does: BBB The meetecho people should have a long hard look at that functionality. Would save approximately 10 min per meeting I have been in, in the last = 1=C2=BD days. Gr=C3=BC=C3=9Fe, Carsten From nobody Tue Mar 9 05:56:02 2021 Return-Path: X-Original-To: tools-discuss@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: tools-discuss@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1A1103A0CC7 for ; Tue, 9 Mar 2021 05:56:00 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.098 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.098 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=gmail.com Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id myXSmMBu7yYM for ; Tue, 9 Mar 2021 05:55:58 -0800 (PST) Received: from mail-pj1-x102a.google.com (mail-pj1-x102a.google.com [IPv6:2607:f8b0:4864:20::102a]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 7D1363A0CFF for ; Tue, 9 Mar 2021 05:55:58 -0800 (PST) Received: by mail-pj1-x102a.google.com with SMTP id j6-20020a17090adc86b02900cbfe6f2c96so5241547pjv.1 for ; Tue, 09 Mar 2021 05:55:58 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20161025; h=from:message-id:mime-version:subject:date:in-reply-to:cc:to :references; bh=E5Uwn70MkQzx2JoWOB66CyGHrTcI3Y2GDK3uJ/89yV4=; b=ZXyYMixmhqubf7PDexikKmAVJEmySSEZv3lbCrsKA8PR43tfD2dEHyc/plAhUfe6PN V5gCcj5ywL/cbJUqmDtk+JMAcO/VH/zA2Q+jZ/YhizclJmQJuFaFyvHsbfdWCa/IKZxo k7OvuCHfa69EuobU0YIPutMGhRmuSYaLZHy0Oa1gcC/Q/W2ztR6yhFjGHeDixj1w+Lxs 8YwY/hxTURc6HqLxKtI3a7H/mLKnB+OJsw3DwkN2y4qobJItGuGxMrB4C/L7x2gmGDMR d0f7q50Hro4xsesp4ui0S/FVBpkULQDyuo+ZBCEXrW+BJ6EpmuVREE2Rd4kqEgBsKWGx JklA== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:from:message-id:mime-version:subject:date :in-reply-to:cc:to:references; bh=E5Uwn70MkQzx2JoWOB66CyGHrTcI3Y2GDK3uJ/89yV4=; b=quGjVPz/G29G7ltG+OjAuXb0zwI+JcpUlTjdlueZRxK0tJGWY2FDRTfhDCoPBM5Y1X 6c4RVn09RqBKUw/TCSUW5ETNhMIEMeVvae9fWldUkLqsuPbd/TecdLyBb8Y8z0kOYbIt KJXs7Mnunipsu+W2yVfxevHs6RjpOKNcQqMnwRlMpcJ2Ap3wzHOt/LXoIHUzTCfrZs7F 85R43CqSLscqYG6obXduv/+rmo3ItJy9Koe5w2vaUIjXN7D62Gj4beXztFdgTfvufNvj X7WQwpWU5MEmcv0PT1pSMiK9ysNiCoEGFCmJ+n9tZzkLdJvjrAhFp9ApxKreEMwXiwT8 rorw== X-Gm-Message-State: AOAM533fsNt1PCfWp315OoDV4OTle1evkhZ4aCJhaKXcDprE/oAjK18i oQQ6BL+RWq/+Nn78aNNhE78= X-Google-Smtp-Source: ABdhPJw+Pl5+mXY5FAwqRhkJAV8DcIpsOGi2y3TfH7uP12wLazF20ZF5lWMe1ABjnMIYvvBRPr2K/A== X-Received: by 2002:a17:90a:bb91:: with SMTP id v17mr4683106pjr.24.1615298157989; Tue, 09 Mar 2021 05:55:57 -0800 (PST) Received: from ?IPv6:2601:647:5a00:9b7:ac7d:4d93:4ec0:d0b6? ([2601:647:5a00:9b7:ac7d:4d93:4ec0:d0b6]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id c193sm14353342pfc.180.2021.03.09.05.55.56 (version=TLS1_2 cipher=ECDHE-ECDSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 bits=128/128); Tue, 09 Mar 2021 05:55:57 -0800 (PST) From: Bob Hinden Message-Id: <604213CC-9D57-48DE-A026-416B047DC3EA@gmail.com> Content-Type: multipart/signed; boundary="Apple-Mail=_1FBBEE5E-5E6B-42E8-9A5E-A52A3D2F9873"; protocol="application/pgp-signature"; micalg=pgp-sha512 Mime-Version: 1.0 (Mac OS X Mail 12.4 \(3445.104.17\)) Date: Tue, 9 Mar 2021 05:55:55 -0800 In-Reply-To: <2210D44B-254E-4486-A906-6BBC6123D96F@tzi.org> Cc: Bob Hinden , tools-discuss To: Carsten Bormann References: <2210D44B-254E-4486-A906-6BBC6123D96F@tzi.org> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.3445.104.17) Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Tools-discuss] meetecho: Slide presenting X-BeenThere: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF Tools Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 09 Mar 2021 13:56:00 -0000 --Apple-Mail=_1FBBEE5E-5E6B-42E8-9A5E-A52A3D2F9873 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Carsten, > On Mar 9, 2021, at 5:31 AM, Carsten Bormann wrote: >=20 > The biggest drawback of meetecho is that it does not support slide = presentation. > Before you say that other webconf tools don=E2=80=99t either, there is = one that does: BBB Please clarify, it seems to work fine presenting slides. Do you mean = something more integrated than sharing an application? > The meetecho people should have a long hard look at that = functionality. > Would save approximately 10 min per meeting I have been in, in the = last 1=C2=BD days. In the session I chair, we load all of the slides ahead of time in = preview, it=E2=80=99s quite fast to go to the next presentation. Bob >=20 > Gr=C3=BC=C3=9Fe, Carsten >=20 > ___________________________________________________________ > Tools-discuss mailing list - Tools-discuss@ietf.org > This list is for discussion, not for action requests or bug reports. > * Report datatracker and mailarchive bugs to: = datatracker-project@ietf.org > * Report tools.ietf.org bugs to: webmaster@tools.ietf.org > * Report all other bugs or issues to: ietf-action@ietf.org > List info (including how to Unsubscribe): = https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/tools-discuss --Apple-Mail=_1FBBEE5E-5E6B-42E8-9A5E-A52A3D2F9873 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: attachment; filename=signature.asc Content-Type: application/pgp-signature; name=signature.asc Content-Description: Message signed with OpenPGP -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- iQEzBAEBCgAdFiEEm0rfRsOCoyamPexGrut0EXfnu6gFAmBHfmsACgkQrut0EXfn u6hbLgf9FOQYXLlt+5yLk1gSnPM8l2YHnw8ocpJv7czGrwIIz2tQj+079r6aXeDG sSIisGOhfyaCBTWSjWiPQzNChySaSqYupMGlkaYo5gx0kdMeeT6FNDP76OAIhJuc wz/tqI93cYSdCFrG0mm/LbZ+eJaG7NDyudPswcZvgA6hHmR7TCJzM5G7RT+YstEO YBRMO/eZ2bAWpYk7MuedFAx7kOPyEgE/6Uxq/izYQ0muG5003lxK/Qt5qvlsl3mS zNfo+rj9RNMdf258eJxKIht9GL0dcXILPRMrMpf130InJyExYOh4gzZXGAlcjMD2 SHaG6EQ+hgFZpFLY4S8oCWnDrXGz0Q== =wb1Q -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --Apple-Mail=_1FBBEE5E-5E6B-42E8-9A5E-A52A3D2F9873-- From nobody Tue Mar 9 08:36:11 2021 Return-Path: X-Original-To: tools-discuss@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: tools-discuss@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5244A3A1016 for ; Tue, 9 Mar 2021 08:36:10 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.1 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.1 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, NICE_REPLY_A=-0.001, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=iki.fi Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 4BcKiYY2_wsB for ; Tue, 9 Mar 2021 08:36:07 -0800 (PST) Received: from lahtoruutu.iki.fi (lahtoruutu.iki.fi [185.185.170.37]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id C07D53A0D75 for ; Tue, 9 Mar 2021 08:36:07 -0800 (PST) Received: from fireball.acr.fi (fireball.acr.fi [83.145.195.1]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 (256/256 bits) key-exchange X25519 server-signature RSA-PSS (2048 bits) server-digest SHA256) (No client certificate requested) (Authenticated sender: kivinen) by lahtoruutu.iki.fi (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id D89F01B002F1; Tue, 9 Mar 2021 18:36:04 +0200 (EET) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=iki.fi; s=lahtoruutu; t=1615307764; h=from:from:reply-to:subject:subject:date:date:message-id:message-id: to:to:cc:cc:mime-version:mime-version:content-type:content-type: content-transfer-encoding:content-transfer-encoding: in-reply-to:in-reply-to:references:references; bh=eMGkJucCKLdTOCTuRNsI18shx0awpgIsbA6J3xCCv6A=; b=b2zbepEJ/NHsuDJZJ1k0djUXHe/wlqLmIUvPKNpyYbgw8m8aYLDlbkaomW0AX2XfF+8qUH 4ZBoUmzkfSykplg6rS6fbAW/B5j/tPb1VgOM/CR8PTl331cGcWJeU1kaYmmUWeJcPmD5KV ckDmxaqf7gqjlxGedacWBHF05Y87jGpUofXx2+waV4yfm5SRBRZ/EUqGgBw0MnpVMo3aWA YpI78V1QBdeebwM9KUIvBkUxKD8HQm7Uo9xnDgJBBuw9IvJ8ys5DNGk41onKLxEAVyKvrQ f9TucxCyt5GBxfUkhhfD2qGShkUL0S5X31vUc8tJO4OU3LzKt3MkQ02d475M8g== Received: by fireball.acr.fi (Postfix, from userid 15204) id 432FB25C102B; Tue, 9 Mar 2021 18:36:04 +0200 (EET) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Message-ID: <24647.41972.199273.340938@fireball.acr.fi> Date: Tue, 9 Mar 2021 18:36:04 +0200 From: Tero Kivinen To: Bob Hinden Cc: Carsten Bormann , tools-discuss In-Reply-To: <604213CC-9D57-48DE-A026-416B047DC3EA@gmail.com> References: <2210D44B-254E-4486-A906-6BBC6123D96F@tzi.org> <604213CC-9D57-48DE-A026-416B047DC3EA@gmail.com> X-Mailer: VM 8.2.0b under 26.3 (x86_64--netbsd) X-Edit-Time: 5 min X-Total-Time: 5 min ARC-Authentication-Results: i=1; ORIGINATING; auth=pass smtp.auth=kivinen smtp.mailfrom=kivinen@iki.fi ARC-Seal: i=1; s=lahtoruutu; d=iki.fi; t=1615307764; a=rsa-sha256; cv=none; b=jpSqenR6OCdJDSCHOo7RBIPgmoSDUvu6wvXU+/JLOAwRDpPLog2b7OkvR14l99LurHC9U+ Fko6ZbHLTG4ZODyT2jrrFT7m88ZIy0F+dly6JX6YmhJbnSnRo4UIFRm+nBKRaY8OHWXHvC BMyeVrRiIWsryuGThXkTzgoinKRoZ4nkTDI/uzuy9Y2ppG1eSxR6gtbgSeAw/CfdGh7Oer fbax9xCwJ/vW/kKgan9P+4NzOb9RPNX5CDDFLOsG7n+48bphxD9b4S5RA5bWQvFAOctJCU 8D2mI8JC4YfhVOmkGKlliCSjrwJK8SQNo+m7DdRDkeWEj2keKLTRYL/bUU6gdA== ARC-Message-Signature: i=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=iki.fi; s=lahtoruutu; t=1615307764; h=from:from:reply-to:subject:subject:date:date:message-id:message-id: to:to:cc:cc:mime-version:mime-version:content-type:content-type: content-transfer-encoding:content-transfer-encoding: in-reply-to:in-reply-to:references:references; bh=eMGkJucCKLdTOCTuRNsI18shx0awpgIsbA6J3xCCv6A=; b=PHc8BZZ7j+TiwPeud7MoliT6Tkfr8Ige77yxtoUpfBcKsF7gQTHUHPRHmgY2zHETxLjHuF Pe2EV9aYjMUmrppKO5ok8N4wlPq1EFzxvRIu8VW/LifdE3uKw5QhRbxAkqkgDn6BA4n7fM Yxq9nMP8JzP7DJ/pZR0cKG7Jrvr4TFHLHo0tm78bYkV3VRTcUqmV4vOT6rXMPCloaAYeLS fp25ncOks/d1NY1Y9pNQIWPgAny2aTy62Rh9mq243de7IgxvMHXXvjc2Ic6szbjKQOr7Yn 5dbqzUyZWD9l8sf/uaSsz/VJ1vzYHoXmFNM7YPZgjmfa+CZgQIDQ/NNrbBqzmg== Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Tools-discuss] meetecho: Slide presenting X-BeenThere: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF Tools Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 09 Mar 2021 16:36:10 -0000 Bob Hinden writes: > In the session I chair, we load all of the slides ahead of time in > preview, it=E2=80=99s quite fast to go to the next presentation.=20 I have found it is even better to create one combined pdf slideset that contains all the presentations. I use attached script to generate it. My chair slides have few generic slides in the beginning, and then it has separator slides containing the list of presentations with the next presentation bolded, so I put that one slide before the actual presentation to separate it from the previous presentation etc. This creates slideset like: https://datatracker.ietf.org/meeting/110/materials/slides-110-ipsecme-c= ombined-slide-set-00 ---------------------------------------------------------------------- #!/bin/sh pdfseparate ietf-110-ipsecme-chair-slides.pdf chair-slides/chair-tmp-%0= 2d.pdf pdfunite \ chair-slides/chair-tmp-0[123456].pdf \ slides/slides-110-ipsecme-ikev2-labeled-ipsec-00.pdf \ chair-slides/chair-tmp-07.pdf slides/slides-110-ipsecme-group-key-m= anagement-using-ikev2-00.pdf \ chair-slides/chair-tmp-08.pdf slides/slides-110-ipsecme-iptfs-base-= draft-01.pdf \ chair-slides/chair-tmp-09.pdf slides/slides-110-ipsecme-iptfs-yang-= adoption-and-update-new-snmp-draft-00.pdf \ chair-slides/chair-tmp-10.pdf slides/slides-110-ipsecme-ikev2-confi= guration-for-encrypted-dns-00.pdf \ chair-slides/chair-tmp-11.pdf slides/slides-110-ipsecme-new-ikev2-p= ayload-format-00.pdf \ chair-slides/chair-tmp-12.pdf slides/slides-110-ipsecme-ikev1-grave= yard-00.pdf \ chair-slides/chair-tmp-13.pdf slides/slides-110-ipsecme-sdwan-edge-= discovery-00.pdf \ chair-slides/chair-tmp-14.pdf slides/slides-110-ipsecme-x509-altern= ative-signatures-00.pdf \ chair-slides/chair-tmp-15.pdf slides/slides-110-ipsecme-ikev2-simpl= ified-rekey-00.pdf \ chair-slides/chair-tmp-16.pdf slides/slides-110-ipsecme-ikev2-multi= -sa-performance-00.pdf \ chair-slides/chair-tmp-1[789].pdf \ ietf-110-combined.pdf rm -f chair-slides/chair-tmp-*.pdf --=20 kivinen@iki.fi From nobody Tue Mar 9 10:16:16 2021 Return-Path: X-Original-To: tools-discuss@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: tools-discuss@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id B7FFA3A1516; Tue, 9 Mar 2021 10:16:11 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.078 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.078 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_BLOCKED=0.001, T_SPF_HELO_PERMERROR=0.01, T_SPF_PERMERROR=0.01, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (1024-bit key) header.d=nostrum.com Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id FW0Ikmnrjfoq; Tue, 9 Mar 2021 10:16:08 -0800 (PST) Received: from nostrum.com (raven-v6.nostrum.com [IPv6:2001:470:d:1130::1]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 378E53A1511; Tue, 9 Mar 2021 10:16:08 -0800 (PST) Received: from unformal.local ([47.186.1.92]) (authenticated bits=0) by nostrum.com (8.16.1/8.16.1) with ESMTPSA id 129IG62R049778 (version=TLSv1.3 cipher=TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 bits=256 verify=NO); Tue, 9 Mar 2021 12:16:06 -0600 (CST) (envelope-from rjsparks@nostrum.com) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=simple/simple; d=nostrum.com; s=default; t=1615313766; bh=qDByaNFJ17dckTHcwjlWex3G5ZwOVH8ZgyNyqevB8jM=; h=To:Reply-To:From:Subject:Date; b=Zps4WMMTIoj72OOg0o2Gnz15pEWYYwN3exOqchY3YIVINyCvRKPM04vXEZ7LzfcsL 1UQzhR5btEoztfVT1+8MOWEiMEtoTbRxZCCmRTWo/J4+cHSIs78FH9VUbpv5dc5tIP QoYuVHyUj/KDkA8Dp+1zozCqhP/zsDvc2Sx5ow2s= X-Authentication-Warning: raven.nostrum.com: Host [47.186.1.92] claimed to be unformal.local To: ietf@ietf.org, tools-discuss Reply-To: tools-discuss From: Robert Sparks Message-ID: Date: Tue, 9 Mar 2021 12:16:01 -0600 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Macintosh; Intel Mac OS X 10.15; rv:78.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/78.8.0 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Content-Language: en-US Archived-At: Subject: [Tools-discuss] Clarifying the state of and the transition plan for tools.ietf.org X-BeenThere: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF Tools Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 09 Mar 2021 18:16:12 -0000 The services at tools.ietf.org are undergoing a transition. As most of you know Henrik Levkowetz has retired. He is continuing to support the services that he has provided for decades at tools.ietf.org on a best effort basis as we transition the essential features to LLC supported platforms. The plan is to finish the transition before IETF 111 and wind tools.ietf.org down. The process of moving these features has been ongoing for several years. Most have already been moved, but a few important ones remain. We have recently moved the tools.ietf.org style of presenting htmlized text documents into the Datatracker. The plan is to redirect those pages from tools.ietf.org into the Datatracker soon. We will be replacing the online xml2rfc and bibxml services with modern rewrites of the existing services. We are transitioning the svn/trac source repositories for the Datatracker and xml2rfc to the IETF Secretariat, with a longer term goal of moving them to GitHub. At the beginning of this meeting, we identified that the ability to add to individual sessions (as opposed to all sessions of a group) to a subscribable calendar needs to be added to the Datatracker. We will look again to identify any other features that need to be moved. But as you notice features at tools.ietf.org that are important but can't find at the Datatracker, please send a note either to me or to tools-discuss@ietf.org. Henrik and I communicate frequently, and he is supporting us with this transition on a best effort basis, but tools.ietf.org is not getting as much of his time as we have become accustomed to in the past. Please be patient with us during the next few months. As you identify issues with tools.ietf.org, please email Henrik or let me know, and I will bring them to Henrik's attention.  In general, neither the IETF Secretariat nor the tools team can address issues at tools.ietf.org directly. Our focus will be on moving functionality to platforms like the Datatracker. I would like to express my gratitude for all of the support Henrik has provided to the community over the last couple of decades. Early on, long before we started projects like the Datatracker, he set up several tools on his own that became very popular with the community. During this time, the domain tools.ietf.org was delegated to him, and he used it to gather the volunteer created tooling from many contributors. As the community grew, we began hosting more services at the IETF Secretariat. During Russ Housley's tenure as IETF Chair, the tools team, under the IOAC's direction, began moving essential services to IETF Secretariat-supported platforms. Through donated and contracted time, Henrik has been helping make these transitions as an ongoing process. But tools.ietf.org continued to be a set of services that he maintained and improved primarily by himself or through coordinating other volunteer effort. Of course, Henrik was also a principal architect and contributor for the Datatracker and xml2rfc, and we are richer for all of his hard work over decades on so many tools. -- Robert Sparks Tools Team chair From nobody Tue Mar 9 10:37:23 2021 Return-Path: X-Original-To: tools-discuss@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: tools-discuss@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id DA5283A1642 for ; Tue, 9 Mar 2021 10:37:21 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -9.601 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-9.601 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIMWL_WL_MED=-0.001, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001, USER_IN_DEF_DKIM_WL=-7.5] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (1024-bit key) header.d=cisco.com Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id UiwSezMAIl9l for ; Tue, 9 Mar 2021 10:37:20 -0800 (PST) Received: from aer-iport-4.cisco.com (aer-iport-4.cisco.com [173.38.203.54]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher DHE-RSA-SEED-SHA (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id EA9F13A163F for ; Tue, 9 Mar 2021 10:37:19 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/simple; d=cisco.com; i=@cisco.com; l=4500; q=dns/txt; s=iport; t=1615315040; x=1616524640; h=from:mime-version:subject:date:references:to:in-reply-to: message-id; bh=SjEOAyVn7zCklDkItHClZJq/8btgJm26mzAawzbjY1U=; b=B03CPT3iFPyp090kPVi8Nhl/7RXWv/bSfKQnsKTSU6Brs/7ln0nrzLfS es1NvJ/orWVNPMKYSV8RNEmZK9oZUeq/LjwBhzj/Wznb9eO0A3fiZflEN k5wWTH8OkatXvmERQ/r2i5cMYCeCqbOk4Bb00dPS696yepo+ZqoCKrgeC M=; X-Files: signature.asc : 488 X-IPAS-Result: =?us-ascii?q?A0CeAQA2v0dglxbLJq1QCh4BAQsSDECBRAuDIVYBJxIxj?= =?us-ascii?q?UWIWAOaXYFoBAcBAQEKAwEBIBQEAQGETQKBfyY3Bg4CAwEBAQMCAwEBAQEFA?= =?us-ascii?q?QEBAgEGBBQBAQEBAQEBAYY2DYZEAQEBAQIBfgsLGC5XBhMUglwBgmYhrFp0g?= =?us-ascii?q?TSKPhCBOYFTi3BCgguBESccgiouPoJcAgOBJwEHCwGDa4IrBIFVgVYeWkQqP?= =?us-ascii?q?GUFPoQShzeFGowbiw2RT4MJgy+BPYRWjEOGJAMfgzo8e4kchVOQEoZPq3kSU?= =?us-ascii?q?IN1AgQGBQIWgWoiaXAzGggbFWUBgj4JNRIZDY44NYg1hUQCQAMvOAIGCgEBA?= =?us-ascii?q?wmNCl4BAQ?= X-IronPort-Anti-Spam-Filtered: true X-IronPort-AV: E=Sophos;i="5.81,236,1610409600"; d="asc'?scan'208";a="33987145" Received: from aer-iport-nat.cisco.com (HELO aer-core-1.cisco.com) ([173.38.203.22]) by aer-iport-4.cisco.com with ESMTP/TLS/DHE-RSA-SEED-SHA; 09 Mar 2021 18:37:17 +0000 Received: from [10.61.144.47] ([10.61.144.47]) by aer-core-1.cisco.com (8.15.2/8.15.2) with ESMTPS id 129IbHlb002580 (version=TLSv1.2 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 bits=256 verify=NO) for ; Tue, 9 Mar 2021 18:37:17 GMT From: Eliot Lear Content-Type: multipart/signed; boundary="Apple-Mail=_ADF91ED4-F967-460B-ABE8-D617ED47CC1E"; protocol="application/pgp-signature"; micalg=pgp-sha256 Mime-Version: 1.0 (Mac OS X Mail 14.0 \(3654.60.0.2.21\)) Date: Tue, 9 Mar 2021 19:37:16 +0100 References: To: tools-discuss In-Reply-To: Message-Id: X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.3654.60.0.2.21) X-Outbound-SMTP-Client: 10.61.144.47, [10.61.144.47] X-Outbound-Node: aer-core-1.cisco.com Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Tools-discuss] Clarifying the state of and the transition plan for tools.ietf.org X-BeenThere: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF Tools Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 09 Mar 2021 18:37:22 -0000 --Apple-Mail=_ADF91ED4-F967-460B-ABE8-D617ED47CC1E Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Nicely put. > On 9 Mar 2021, at 19:16, Robert Sparks wrote: >=20 > The services at tools.ietf.org are undergoing a transition. >=20 > As most of you know Henrik Levkowetz has retired. He is continuing to = support > the services that he has provided for decades at tools.ietf.org on a = best > effort basis as we transition the essential features to LLC supported > platforms. The plan is to finish the transition before IETF 111 and = wind > tools.ietf.org down. >=20 > The process of moving these features has been ongoing for several = years. > Most have already been moved, but a few important ones remain. >=20 > We have recently moved the tools.ietf.org style of presenting htmlized = text > documents into the Datatracker. The plan is to redirect those pages = from > tools.ietf.org into the Datatracker soon. >=20 > We will be replacing the online xml2rfc and bibxml services with = modern > rewrites of the existing services. >=20 > We are transitioning the svn/trac source repositories for the = Datatracker > and xml2rfc to the IETF Secretariat, with a longer term goal of moving = them > to GitHub. >=20 > At the beginning of this meeting, we identified that the ability to = add to > individual sessions (as opposed to all sessions of a group) to a = subscribable > calendar needs to be added to the Datatracker. >=20 > We will look again to identify any other features that need to be = moved. But as > you notice features at tools.ietf.org that are important but can't = find at the > Datatracker, please send a note either to me or to = tools-discuss@ietf.org. >=20 > Henrik and I communicate frequently, and he is supporting us with this > transition on a best effort basis, but tools.ietf.org is not getting = as much of > his time as we have become accustomed to in the past. Please be = patient with us > during the next few months. >=20 > As you identify issues with tools.ietf.org, please email Henrik or let = me know, > and I will bring them to Henrik's attention. In general, neither the = IETF > Secretariat nor the tools team can address issues at tools.ietf.org = directly. > Our focus will be on moving functionality to platforms like the = Datatracker. >=20 > I would like to express my gratitude for all of the support Henrik has = provided > to the community over the last couple of decades. Early on, long = before we > started projects like the Datatracker, he set up several tools on his = own that > became very popular with the community. During this time, the domain = tools.ietf.org > was delegated to him, and he used it to gather the volunteer created = tooling from > many contributors. >=20 > As the community grew, we began hosting more services at the IETF = Secretariat. > During Russ Housley's tenure as IETF Chair, the tools team, under the = IOAC's > direction, began moving essential services to IETF = Secretariat-supported > platforms. Through donated and contracted time, Henrik has been = helping make > these transitions as an ongoing process. But tools.ietf.org continued = to be a > set of services that he maintained and improved primarily by himself = or through > coordinating other volunteer effort. >=20 > Of course, Henrik was also a principal architect and contributor for = the > Datatracker and xml2rfc, and we are richer for all of his hard work = over > decades on so many tools. >=20 > -- >=20 > Robert Sparks >=20 > Tools Team chair >=20 --Apple-Mail=_ADF91ED4-F967-460B-ABE8-D617ED47CC1E Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: attachment; filename=signature.asc Content-Type: application/pgp-signature; name=signature.asc Content-Description: Message signed with OpenPGP -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- iQEzBAEBCAAdFiEEmNC9kEYdsJKnsmEdh7ZrRtnSejMFAmBHwFwACgkQh7ZrRtnS ejNbLwgA22IKLSuh6oDfzXCTXO4lY/T5CVvZ82DAw/u3iVjF7w5nIP+OCcKaE/fg zulAebtSoCZAqTKUrVA6bIWcj9VuYyUH83YZ9MOLbih6ryykwkEC1lhBqrMH6f9g zh4G6XzE4f0N/wrTc8i3FlqBwzyuutRRldhbV0hgsY7ID3z7hR+0Gc9Z5QsIcjmn AyGPIkqKr5fWfa/RHIqPG6/IO+yVCqMyppyIXVUR1l81ZXEwnR6J2n/ahW0KSUDr E38axSvwfYGpr2P9SKEyQCXK+Ma/IK6gILx+5Az5qoeyrI474ulo50UYH1K5YaEt 7MJW2C+ZCdAS0JqMjiTuqPnYgpRH+A== =t3w7 -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --Apple-Mail=_ADF91ED4-F967-460B-ABE8-D617ED47CC1E-- From nobody Wed Mar 10 02:14:33 2021 Return-Path: X-Original-To: tools-discuss@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: tools-discuss@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6733A3A2114 for ; 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Wed, 10 Mar 2021 02:14:27 -0800 (PST) Received: from [192.168.178.57] ([62.3.64.16]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id z2sm33957080wrm.0.2021.03.10.02.14.26 (version=TLS1_2 cipher=ECDHE-ECDSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 bits=128/128); Wed, 10 Mar 2021 02:14:26 -0800 (PST) From: Stewart Bryant Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Mime-Version: 1.0 (Mac OS X Mail 13.4 \(3608.120.23.2.4\)) Message-Id: <6F352681-9B00-4B7C-BC9E-DF1D0905C48B@gmail.com> Date: Wed, 10 Mar 2021 10:14:23 +0000 Cc: Stewart Bryant To: tools-discuss@ietf.org, Robert Sparks X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.3608.120.23.2.4) Archived-At: Subject: [Tools-discuss] Request to retain kramdown compiler and author stats X-BeenThere: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF Tools Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 10 Mar 2021 10:14:31 -0000 Two tools that I find particularly useful, and hope are retained are: The experimental version of XML2RFC which supports the kramdown = compiler. I have found this useful when collaborating with others that = are new to kramdown, and also those that are unable to install the = kramdown compiler on their work machine due to company policy on third = part software. The other tool I find useful is the author statistics package which I = have used to generate various (personal) activity reports for my = management, updating my resume etc. I hope that both of these tools will be retained in the move. Best regards Stewart= From nobody Wed Mar 10 06:32:33 2021 Return-Path: X-Original-To: tools-discuss@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: tools-discuss@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id A1C343A0CC5 for ; Wed, 10 Mar 2021 06:32:31 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.9 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.9 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_H2=-0.001, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id NITXfR4DpGet for ; Wed, 10 Mar 2021 06:32:29 -0800 (PST) Received: from frasgout.his.huawei.com (frasgout.his.huawei.com [185.176.79.56]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher AECDH-AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 8E8103A0CC4 for ; Wed, 10 Mar 2021 06:32:29 -0800 (PST) Received: from fraeml734-chm.china.huawei.com (unknown [172.18.147.206]) by frasgout.his.huawei.com (SkyGuard) with ESMTP id 4DwZ8M6LhYz67x6h for ; Wed, 10 Mar 2021 22:24:19 +0800 (CST) Received: from yyzeml707-chm.china.huawei.com (10.218.33.71) by fraeml734-chm.china.huawei.com (10.206.15.215) with Microsoft SMTP Server (version=TLS1_2, cipher=TLS_ECDHE_RSA_WITH_AES_128_GCM_SHA256) id 15.1.2106.2; Wed, 10 Mar 2021 15:32:23 +0100 Received: from yyzeml709-chm.china.huawei.com (10.218.33.73) by yyzeml707-chm.china.huawei.com (10.218.33.71) with Microsoft SMTP Server (version=TLS1_2, cipher=TLS_ECDHE_RSA_WITH_AES_128_GCM_SHA256) id 15.1.2106.2; Wed, 10 Mar 2021 09:32:22 -0500 Received: from yyzeml709-chm.china.huawei.com ([10.218.33.73]) by yyzeml709-chm.china.huawei.com ([10.218.33.73]) with mapi id 15.01.2106.013; Wed, 10 Mar 2021 09:32:22 -0500 From: Bill Gage To: "tools-discuss@ietf.org" Thread-Topic: RE: [Tools-discuss] Clarifying the state of and the transition plan for tools.ietf.org Thread-Index: AdcVubOl12ysJVvBRVaubdjQ+gA8Vg== Date: Wed, 10 Mar 2021 14:32:22 +0000 Message-ID: Accept-Language: en-US Content-Language: en-US X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: x-originating-ip: [10.124.92.9] Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable MIME-Version: 1.0 X-CFilter-Loop: Reflected Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Tools-discuss] Clarifying the state of and the transition plan for tools.ietf.org X-BeenThere: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF Tools Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 10 Mar 2021 14:32:32 -0000 Are there any plans to migrate https://tools.ietf.org/dailydose/ to DataTra= cker? I find the daily summary there is invaluable. Cheers ...=20 /bill From nobody Wed Mar 10 06:56:32 2021 Return-Path: X-Original-To: tools-discuss@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: tools-discuss@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id F178B3A0E03 for ; Wed, 10 Mar 2021 06:56:27 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.92 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.92 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_H4=-0.01, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_WL=-0.01, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (1024-bit key) header.d=att.onmicrosoft.com Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id lRq5AuL4jL9V for ; Wed, 10 Mar 2021 06:56:26 -0800 (PST) Received: from mx0a-00191d01.pphosted.com (mx0b-00191d01.pphosted.com [67.231.157.136]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id ACEE03A0E14 for ; Wed, 10 Mar 2021 06:56:26 -0800 (PST) Received: from pps.filterd (m0083689.ppops.net [127.0.0.1]) by m0083689.ppops.net-00191d01. 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charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable MIME-Version: 1.0 X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-AuthAs: Internal X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-AuthSource: DM6PR02MB6924.namprd02.prod.outlook.com X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-Network-Message-Id: 18c64c82-3f16-491d-d198-08d8e3d49c4a X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-originalarrivaltime: 10 Mar 2021 14:55:56.6501 (UTC) X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-fromentityheader: Hosted X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-id: e741d71c-c6b6-47b0-803c-0f3b32b07556 X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-mailboxtype: HOSTED X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-userprincipalname: S4y95+XnIgtU/7R/pFEPjJiRTga+saY20SpppldkRJ4tEj+pRNb1lC4SlISOenuz X-MS-Exchange-Transport-CrossTenantHeadersStamped: DM6PR02MB4811 X-OriginatorOrg: att.com X-TM-SNTS-SMTP: 36E57DE1F1460D296B2FE3A812697B5722FEAABBEF06DC6EC686C4E34363B4F72 X-Proofpoint-Virus-Version: vendor=fsecure engine=2.50.10434:6.0.369, 18.0.761 definitions=2021-03-10_09:2021-03-10, 2021-03-10 signatures=0 X-Proofpoint-Spam-Details: rule=outbound_policy_notspam policy=outbound_policy score=0 phishscore=0 adultscore=0 suspectscore=0 mlxscore=0 lowpriorityscore=0 spamscore=0 bulkscore=0 malwarescore=0 priorityscore=1501 mlxlogscore=231 impostorscore=0 clxscore=1011 classifier=spam adjust=0 reason=mlx scancount=1 engine=8.12.0-2009150000 definitions=main-2103100075 Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Tools-discuss] Request to retain kramdown compiler and author stats X-BeenThere: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF Tools Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 10 Mar 2021 14:56:28 -0000 > Two tools that I find particularly useful, and hope are retained are: >=20 > The experimental version of XML2RFC which supports the kramdown compiler.= I > have found this useful when collaborating with others that are new to > kramdown, and also those that are unable to install the kramdown compiler= on > their work machine due to company policy on third part software. Ooh... that would be useful. I didn't know it existed. I've become resigned= to needing a personal Linux laptop for doing IETF work. But the more we ca= n get tools like this available online, the more we can make it so people n= eed nothing more than a browser (of their choice) and some really simple in= structions to do a basic ID. I think that should be a goal. Barbara =20 > The other tool I find useful is the author statistics package which I hav= e used to > generate various (personal) activity reports for my management, updating = my > resume etc. >=20 > I hope that both of these tools will be retained in the move. >=20 > Best regards >=20 > Stewart From nobody Wed Mar 10 07:00:34 2021 Return-Path: X-Original-To: tools-discuss@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: tools-discuss@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 754E43A0EFF for ; Wed, 10 Mar 2021 07:00:33 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.347 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.347 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIMWL_WL_HIGH=-0.248, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=akamai.com Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id neuCj4wjEdU7 for ; Wed, 10 Mar 2021 07:00:32 -0800 (PST) Received: from mx0a-00190b01.pphosted.com (mx0a-00190b01.pphosted.com [IPv6:2620:100:9001:583::1]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 583853A0EFC for ; Wed, 10 Mar 2021 07:00:32 -0800 (PST) Received: from pps.filterd (m0050093.ppops.net [127.0.0.1]) by m0050093.ppops.net-00190b01. 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spf=${SPFResult} (sender IP is 184.51.33.61) smtp.mailfrom=rsalz@akamai.com smtp.helo=prod-mail-ppoint6 Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Tools-discuss] Request to retain kramdown compiler and author stats X-BeenThere: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF Tools Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 10 Mar 2021 15:00:33 -0000 PiAgICBPb2guLi4gdGhhdCB3b3VsZCBiZSB1c2VmdWwuIEkgZGlkbid0IGtub3cgaXQgZXhpc3Rl ZC4gSSd2ZSBiZWNvbWUgcmVzaWduZWQgdG8gbmVlZGluZyBhIHBlcnNvbmFsIExpbnV4IGxhcHRv cCBmb3IgZG9pbmcgSUVURiB3b3JrLiANCg0KQXQgdGhlIHJpc2sgb2Ygc3RhcnRpbmcgWUFHVCos IEknbGwgcG9pbnQgb3V0IHRoYXQgaWYgdGhlIFdHIGlzIG9uIEdpdEh1YiBhbmQgdXNlcyBNYXJ0 aW4gVGhvbXNvbidzIHRvb2xzLCB5b3UgY2FuIGRvIGl0IGFsbCB2aWEgR2l0SHViIGFjdGlvbnMu DQoNCipZZXQgQW5vdGhlciBHaXRodWIgVGhyZWFkDQoNCg== From nobody Wed Mar 10 07:07:44 2021 Return-Path: X-Original-To: tools-discuss@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: tools-discuss@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id AF5D23A0DBA for ; 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Wed, 10 Mar 2021 09:10:40 -0600 (CST) (envelope-from rjsparks@nostrum.com) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=simple/simple; d=nostrum.com; s=default; t=1615389040; bh=yOsB3P/pCmbXgchBzc82UUs27gY66kZNDZNU+QVeB8Q=; h=Subject:To:References:Reply-To:From:Date:In-Reply-To; b=tR5sIz7HG6MBdvSzgwicfHS2e91oWgGTWPPlBVokYuShDYcSoITLLlZEvuLFbjckC mNRqS0cj/GVCtPN0fk/ApjHHXkxj/duwIAKxzvozMqnDHseo3x9rbA+/ZARqFLfyFG +ZmtwGs5jRG7tX31vZ1LR6eNmGNwzauNPq2UloWA= X-Authentication-Warning: raven.nostrum.com: Host [47.186.1.92] claimed to be unformal.local To: tools-discuss , ietf@ietf.org, krose@krose.org References: Reply-To: tools-discuss From: Robert Sparks Message-ID: Date: Wed, 10 Mar 2021 09:10:34 -0600 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Macintosh; Intel Mac OS X 10.15; rv:78.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/78.8.0 MIME-Version: 1.0 In-Reply-To: Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="------------BE64275D620391383D3BB042" Content-Language: en-US Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Tools-discuss] Meetecho on Android X-BeenThere: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF Tools Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 10 Mar 2021 15:10:44 -0000 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --------------BE64275D620391383D3BB042 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Hi Kyle - I'm moving this to tools-discuss. On 3/10/21 8:45 AM, Kyle Rose wrote: > Is there any way to make Meetecho usable on Android? I encounter two > main problems with the browser interface: > > * The UI is unusable in both portrait and landscape mode: elements > overlap, controls are either too big or too small, etc. > * When the screen sleeps, audio stops shortly thereafter, requiring me > to unlock. > > Considering that Android-on-phones is the world's most widely deployed > user platform, this seems like a significant barrier to participation. > > https://www.dropbox.com/s/ux3t5zuk5qjwpa0/2021-03-10%2009.44.17.png?dl=0 > > https://www.dropbox.com/s/kgcm0jvduq5slma/2021-03-10%2009.44.05.png?dl=0 > > > Kyle --------------BE64275D620391383D3BB042 Content-Type: text/html; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

Hi Kyle -

I'm moving this to tools-discuss.

On 3/10/21 8:45 AM, Kyle Rose wrote:
Is there any way to make Meetecho usable on Android? I encounter two main problems with the browser interface:

* The UI is unusable in both portrait and landscape mode: elements overlap, controls are either too big or too small, etc.
* When the screen sleeps, audio stops shortly thereafter, requiring me to unlock.

Considering that Android-on-phones is the world's most widely deployed user platform, this seems like a significant barrier to participation.

Kyle
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=E4=B8=8D=E6=9C=83=EF=BC=8C=E5=9B=A0=E7=82=BA=E4=B8=96=E4= =B8=8A=E5=8F=AA=E6=9C=89=E6=88=91=E5=8F=AF=E4=BB=A5=E5=AF=ABcopyright law = =E4=BB=96=E6=B2=92=E6=9C=89=E6=AC=8A=E5=8E=BB=E8=AA=AA=E4=BA=BA=E5=A4=A7=E6= =AC=8A=E5=8A=9B=EF=BC=8C=E8=80=8C=E6=98=AF=E4=BB=96=E4=B8=80=E7=9B=B4=E7=8A= =AF=E7=BD=AA=EF=BC=8C =E9=87=91=E5=8C=99=E5=82=B3=E7=B5=A6=E5=8F=A6=E4=B8= =80=E4=BA=BA=EF=BC=8C=E6=98=AF=E8=A6=81=E8=84=85=E6=B3=95=E5=BE=8B=E5=A5=95= =E5=8A=9B=EF=BC=8C=E8=80=8C=E4=B8=94=E4=BA=BA=E5=93=81=E6=80=A7=E6=A0=BC=E4= =B9=9F=E8=A6=81=E8=A8=88=E7=AE=97=E5=9C=A8=E5=85=A7=EF=BC=8C=E4=B8=8D=E5=8F= =AF=E9=9A=A8=E4=BE=BF=E8=A4=87=E5=88=B6=EF=BC=8C=E6=89=80=E6=9C=89=E4=B9=9F= =E6=9C=89=E8=AD=89=E6=98=8E=EF=BC=8C=E8=80=8C=E4=B8=94=E6=9C=AC=E4=BE=86=E8= =AA=8D=E9=8E=96=E5=8C=99=E4=B8=8D=E8=AA=8D=E4=BA=BA=EF=BC=88=E5=9C=A8=E7=B6= =B2=E8=B7=AF=EF=BC=89

=E5=9C=A8 2021=E5=B9=B43=E6=9C=8810=E6=97=A5 =E9=80=B1= =E4=B8=89 23:11=EF=BC=8CRobert Sparks <rjsparks@nostrum.com> =E5=AF=AB=E9=81=93=EF=BC=9A
=20 =20 =20

Hi Kyle -

I'm moving this to tools-discuss.

On 3/10/21 8:45 AM, Kyle Rose wrote:
=20
Is there any way to make Meetecho usable on Android? I encounter two main problems with the browser interface:

* The UI is unusable in both portrait and landscape mode: elements overlap, controls are either too big or too small, etc.
* When the screen sleeps, audio stops shortly thereafter, requiring me to unlock.

Considering that Android-on-phones is the world's most widely deployed user platform, this seems like a significant barrier to participation.

Kyle
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--000000000000d3c27905bd30255b-- From nobody Wed Mar 10 07:16:32 2021 Return-Path: X-Original-To: tools-discuss@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: tools-discuss@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id E12B83A0FED for ; Wed, 10 Mar 2021 07:16:30 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.901 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.901 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, NICE_REPLY_A=-0.001, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_H2=-0.001, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (1024-bit key) header.d=gmx.net Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id nmBQafBKBygW for ; Wed, 10 Mar 2021 07:16:29 -0800 (PST) Received: from mout.gmx.net (mout.gmx.net [212.227.15.19]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 2FFAC3A0FE7 for ; Wed, 10 Mar 2021 07:16:29 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/simple; d=gmx.net; s=badeba3b8450; t=1615389385; bh=izoZTedOO2sbqDSIkiTwbOu//mTMOijN5ZkSRxZkcrY=; h=X-UI-Sender-Class:Subject:To:References:From:Date:In-Reply-To; b=K0+8k3pUSK74IWVRyE6QIBX8P5AfYxeO3JoYxtH2T/KXS9buOY7twcH2+gU0XXIXs KOhp5iON7lwFxT5XXUnFp0PAu8Iembwpe8TCxX5gRqrE6YX9cbWb8q2q2O6hL0D+2b qrAXXpFWUEBorNOf67I1GRXWCViC/HEN9XBIvpGA= X-UI-Sender-Class: 01bb95c1-4bf8-414a-932a-4f6e2808ef9c Received: from [192.168.178.20] ([91.61.52.88]) by mail.gmx.net (mrgmx005 [212.227.17.190]) with ESMTPSA (Nemesis) id 1MDhhN-1lUhYc13wN-00Aj21 for ; Wed, 10 Mar 2021 16:16:25 +0100 To: tools-discuss@ietf.org References: <6F352681-9B00-4B7C-BC9E-DF1D0905C48B@gmail.com> From: Julian Reschke Message-ID: Date: Wed, 10 Mar 2021 16:16:23 +0100 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows NT 10.0; Win64; x64; rv:78.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/78.8.0 MIME-Version: 1.0 In-Reply-To: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Provags-ID: V03:K1:rgXMZaDb2bie5DcsEPVOjP1nNsjrVxnEPZy9i6PWaeH+OxGyvjD wbwlEcdu97QBEvMTuxDPk6EWzU01Q6+8aurxzgdUt1XFaGmIyX4jS3OaI3CXjM92HUAUNWG BrRA+G4IEGTen96gcMzhnGOp6LPG567m9rM0Kj9sXElXksrI7jvJj9YpaIohyA4qOrwBWab x7bYbvpLQ9HlqBHoEUHSA== X-UI-Out-Filterresults: notjunk:1;V03:K0:GCGas6Cpclo=:2vxr0BkgDP0S7r57zfPRPg WlDn7UerDztdqwrawetht6hD0K1f5r7DEHteE9M7fslFn8uyvUmMGQenm74/uU2SNzfd2mlN8 6pBilqQTS1O1fZsQI5qNvhItAGJnDgY58MCGqWaL96Bp5shY1LDtI55zD/cCaV0N22BqPGVlL YEVxdvCmpfwTMixTgTwGQOo9AQIynMgC+jDEMzUQ3kNMdN0f4pRAhWMDR7Y8aVwVwVkMRWlYw 4XyFjXqSLYCQjxOGqJkexw/3aS71g1xNFpfpIp4lISr2LaMCF+vk4F92yJm4D3FZSEmRIPBq7 YlAP5jbaYd+9+rRaV1Dufru7k4bY8vgULruOeuus5WzTqCpHJvBbFhfplgmf1sipBbFeTS9Gm 7CvZKZo3gCXCVqbgXNFwnJuaqyOTCYX+9R2QEKMi2JGCpD8QyJ9+SHbnmIkogFNzqoADkcQOE CFSbV7LHUPHK6ibwmWwioMExdEGIyNfWe5S3dCQbJJQI/todtfpii5eHhWzClkr2JZN0ziYkH iWJED61pQQj+JyxSC2xG4lJ6X6YwYjPyzDcM+1txwm8zBZHDufsxcUzqOcd2JPu1tGx/aAvVh zF5qHNwoQhWPG+bhml7c5JdiRli34jV6zYc9jbbeW1+WH8MZdlDqNYWXsvhI9ZCQpGMBV3GD3 CPHsDjuLxpLFUm8YTkHfOBpW7NvpsM6AhARBjMUZ0ZrbdMQWC41NrMFPIHD2Wm/pX+6PgDptX hLQF09Oh9XqafhorqYKPXLtqoabsjyZVTWQVTaMhOks4XMjr/GINLUpGYMDEwJGBcYiu/fnsm GoMsvLljq4gPnCLlTmsQvjFABYFMvT9pXozyMVrKIkfE+U188k5z1c2yTOPGsaVK1js7Q7sIT OX7/OIxJn922P/16BUkw== Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Tools-discuss] Request to retain kramdown compiler and author stats X-BeenThere: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF Tools Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 10 Mar 2021 15:16:31 -0000 Am 10.03.2021 um 15:55 schrieb STARK, BARBARA H: > > >> Two tools that I find particularly useful, and hope are retained are: >> >> The experimental version of XML2RFC which supports the kramdown compile= r. I >> have found this useful when collaborating with others that are new to >> kramdown, and also those that are unable to install the kramdown compil= er on >> their work machine due to company policy on third part software. > > Ooh... that would be useful. I didn't know it existed. I've become resig= ned to needing a personal Linux laptop for doing IETF work. But the more w= e can get tools like this available online, the more we can make it so peo= ple need nothing more than a browser (of their choice) and some really sim= ple instructions to do a basic ID. I think that should be a goal. > ... I'm running kramdown and xml2rfc just fine on Cygwin. And I'm pretty sure that WSL (Windows Subsytem for Linux) will even do better... Best regards, Julian From nobody Wed Mar 10 07:21:38 2021 Return-Path: X-Original-To: tools-discuss@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: tools-discuss@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id D8FC83A0FC0 for ; Wed, 10 Mar 2021 07:21:36 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.098 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.098 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (1024-bit key) header.d=krose.org Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id RRMk58XzY_AW for ; Wed, 10 Mar 2021 07:21:35 -0800 (PST) Received: from mail-yb1-xb2d.google.com (mail-yb1-xb2d.google.com [IPv6:2607:f8b0:4864:20::b2d]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id DFD6B3A0A1C for ; Wed, 10 Mar 2021 07:21:34 -0800 (PST) Received: by mail-yb1-xb2d.google.com with SMTP id d9so18265319ybq.1 for ; Wed, 10 Mar 2021 07:21:34 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=krose.org; s=google; h=mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date:message-id:subject:to; bh=bvBNOeHrzDGZsVwU1BeofeiOrBNLDisAkssdtmQzIes=; b=f5Xrpvx2tkSqmUk66WUF0hWY9xHoe866XDrLbj7h6xoJ2OqbhTJBuHWd4D9g/0b0PM Y036bb/OKP/y71nyrP/t6nNLYNMn2RYrGQJoEvwUO2lm9hHi6EyLr0zRLMKmw4snP5zG qqtye/h3evXH4KF3AT2mIXn6nZuiO2bXKUZIA= X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date :message-id:subject:to; bh=bvBNOeHrzDGZsVwU1BeofeiOrBNLDisAkssdtmQzIes=; b=OcHPzztikDi4ek195GzMbOdYrjZIFBdrG/jJvAmLByJfC34GARLhM9c1TkJ2eNq/PX mWRqimlZ2LfpiRnusUQD4I6EpZfGAuA26oLo21krNcKJ+8XxhikpJqbE1/81K9GNVbSi 0msyUY5aUuUaV+wyOEXDf2TGxu1/IAvLmXv1Iq2IHuACsx/RnBKmfhfvM0YVv1dr54ai qVg2xTjs5XKBGygYJ7YJBlf2nze7NZb1TWf8rTPjRWIRC0WJv9gsS2/DR3xgvLIolrUY 4bc4luTnsv6CdxZ8ndTYPm8BCzHj+ApAiEnFS2q5W/sweawbgsb7E+AxvDNbveGiVtja P24Q== X-Gm-Message-State: AOAM5310lsIG/cYWcHH2D70bTtbDLsXlLGzVpYfFw/MgT5r0vCE7sDpz QFYVQJg1JI3DMrFsvZgc4YZRrmu5/IV7x8LV+vqJj6y5Cx0= X-Google-Smtp-Source: ABdhPJy5hEVhD4Y8+5UYV/V3tWEgpF/876hHwCG3y/j1VeKtOFl/2TAyQurpiy+t1kwGAj7p6xdXAa/kcgcBATTPDvE= X-Received: by 2002:a25:ae64:: with SMTP id g36mr4992215ybe.296.1615389692289; Wed, 10 Mar 2021 07:21:32 -0800 (PST) MIME-Version: 1.0 References: In-Reply-To: From: Kyle Rose Date: Wed, 10 Mar 2021 10:21:21 -0500 Message-ID: To: tools-discuss Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="000000000000c87de605bd3038ff" Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Tools-discuss] Meetecho on Android X-BeenThere: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF Tools Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 10 Mar 2021 15:21:37 -0000 --000000000000c87de605bd3038ff Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" -ietf@ Thanks. Is there something I'm missing? I looked for a thick client and couldn't find one, so I assume the browser client is what's available. I do note that the sound doesn't drop* if I keep the screen on, but this is wasteful of battery when I'm only interested in the audio. *Usually. Sound drops and requires me to manually recycle it whenever my connectivity changes, e.g., from wifi to LTE or vice versa. Kyle On Wed, Mar 10, 2021 at 10:10 AM Robert Sparks wrote: > Hi Kyle - > > I'm moving this to tools-discuss. > On 3/10/21 8:45 AM, Kyle Rose wrote: > > Is there any way to make Meetecho usable on Android? I encounter two main > problems with the browser interface: > > * The UI is unusable in both portrait and landscape mode: elements > overlap, controls are either too big or too small, etc. > * When the screen sleeps, audio stops shortly thereafter, requiring me to > unlock. > > Considering that Android-on-phones is the world's most widely deployed > user platform, this seems like a significant barrier to participation. > > https://www.dropbox.com/s/ux3t5zuk5qjwpa0/2021-03-10%2009.44.17.png?dl=0 > https://www.dropbox.com/s/kgcm0jvduq5slma/2021-03-10%2009.44.05.png?dl=0 > > Kyle > > --000000000000c87de605bd3038ff Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
-ie= tf@

<= div class=3D"gmail_default" style=3D"font-size:small">Thanks.

Is there something I'm missing? I = looked for a thick client and couldn't find one, so I assume the browse= r client is what's available.

I do note that the sound doesn't drop* if I keep the screen = on, but this is wasteful of battery when I'm only interested in the aud= io.

<= div class=3D"gmail_default" style=3D"font-size:small">*Usually. Sound drops= and requires me to manually recycle it whenever my connectivity changes, e= .g., from wifi to LTE or vice versa.

Kyle

On Wed, Mar 10, 2021 at 10:10 AM Robert Spark= s <rjsparks@nostrum.com> = wrote:
=20 =20 =20

Hi Kyle -

I'm moving this to tools-discuss.

On 3/10/21 8:45 AM, Kyle Rose wrote:
=20
Is there any way to make Meetecho usable on Android? I encounter two main problems with the browser interface:

* The UI is unusable in both portrait and landscape mode: elements overlap, controls are either too big or too small, etc.
* When the screen sleeps, audio stops shortly thereafter, requiring me to unlock.

Considering that Android-on-phones is the world's most widely deployed user platform, this seems like a significant barrier to participation.

Kyle
--000000000000c87de605bd3038ff-- From nobody Wed Mar 10 07:27:09 2021 Return-Path: X-Original-To: tools-discuss@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: tools-discuss@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1B7E03A1093 for ; Wed, 10 Mar 2021 07:27:08 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.079 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.079 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, NICE_REPLY_A=-0.001, T_SPF_HELO_PERMERROR=0.01, T_SPF_PERMERROR=0.01, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (1024-bit key) header.d=nostrum.com Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id Z0aTzn6TCDrV for ; Wed, 10 Mar 2021 07:27:06 -0800 (PST) Received: from nostrum.com (raven-v6.nostrum.com [IPv6:2001:470:d:1130::1]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 75D853A108B for ; Wed, 10 Mar 2021 07:27:05 -0800 (PST) Received: from unformal.local ([47.186.1.92]) (authenticated bits=0) by nostrum.com (8.16.1/8.16.1) with ESMTPSA id 12AFR3Mn020255 (version=TLSv1.3 cipher=TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 bits=256 verify=NO) for ; Wed, 10 Mar 2021 09:27:03 -0600 (CST) (envelope-from rjsparks@nostrum.com) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=simple/simple; d=nostrum.com; s=default; t=1615390023; bh=vz5FXzPk/mMsNQUQ2zb6W2a/iJGcvrp8ppxUy6WORBY=; h=Subject:To:References:From:Date:In-Reply-To; b=UkPg6ku3op5UMT7WorZvBk/N99Jnw5bziKGOj7fa3dNCMGssRKX3D6X8GTdKraIZ2 igw7cyfjbsgWAPNBeMsRVp89Dp40lIdf3MrYLOVw7LccMWilNFOjgGgueWcshE6T3g 5tTkriZ/UZ51K9vd6zW3GNbk8rhukdVlN6hn4Drk= X-Authentication-Warning: raven.nostrum.com: Host [47.186.1.92] claimed to be unformal.local To: tools-discuss@ietf.org References: From: Robert Sparks Message-ID: Date: Wed, 10 Mar 2021 09:26:58 -0600 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Macintosh; Intel Mac OS X 10.15; rv:78.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/78.8.0 MIME-Version: 1.0 In-Reply-To: Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="------------591B1AFDCFC386113D568628" Content-Language: en-US Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Tools-discuss] Meetecho on Android X-BeenThere: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF Tools Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 10 Mar 2021 15:27:08 -0000 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --------------591B1AFDCFC386113D568628 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit For the immediate problem, if you are ok only being able to listen, consider using the live audio stream linked from the agenda. RjS On 3/10/21 9:21 AM, Kyle Rose wrote: > -ietf@ > > Thanks. > > Is there something I'm missing? I looked for a thick client and > couldn't find one, so I assume the browser client is what's available. > > I do note that the sound doesn't drop* if I keep the screen on, but > this is wasteful of battery when I'm only interested in the audio. > > *Usually. Sound drops and requires me to manually recycle it whenever > my connectivity changes, e.g., from wifi to LTE or vice versa. > > Kyle > > On Wed, Mar 10, 2021 at 10:10 AM Robert Sparks > wrote: > > Hi Kyle - > > I'm moving this to tools-discuss. > > On 3/10/21 8:45 AM, Kyle Rose wrote: >> Is there any way to make Meetecho usable on Android? I encounter >> two main problems with the browser interface: >> >> * The UI is unusable in both portrait and landscape mode: >> elements overlap, controls are either too big or too small, etc. >> * When the screen sleeps, audio stops shortly thereafter, >> requiring me to unlock. >> >> Considering that Android-on-phones is the world's most widely >> deployed user platform, this seems like a significant barrier to >> participation. >> >> https://www.dropbox.com/s/ux3t5zuk5qjwpa0/2021-03-10%2009.44.17.png?dl=0 >> >> https://www.dropbox.com/s/kgcm0jvduq5slma/2021-03-10%2009.44.05.png?dl=0 >> >> >> Kyle > > > ___________________________________________________________ > Tools-discuss mailing list - Tools-discuss@ietf.org > This list is for discussion, not for action requests or bug reports. > * Report datatracker and mailarchive bugs to: datatracker-project@ietf.org > * Report tools.ietf.org bugs to: webmaster@tools.ietf.org > * Report all other bugs or issues to: ietf-action@ietf.org > List info (including how to Unsubscribe): https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/tools-discuss --------------591B1AFDCFC386113D568628 Content-Type: text/html; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

For the immediate problem, if you are ok only being able to listen, consider using the live audio stream linked from the agenda.

RjS

On 3/10/21 9:21 AM, Kyle Rose wrote:
-ietf@

Thanks.

Is there something I'm missing? I looked for a thick client and couldn't find one, so I assume the browser client is what's available.

I do note that the sound doesn't drop* if I keep the screen on, but this is wasteful of battery when I'm only interested in the audio.

*Usually. Sound drops and requires me to manually recycle it whenever my connectivity changes, e.g., from wifi to LTE or vice versa.

Kyle

On Wed, Mar 10, 2021 at 10:10 AM Robert Sparks <rjsparks@nostrum.com> wrote:

Hi Kyle -

I'm moving this to tools-discuss.

On 3/10/21 8:45 AM, Kyle Rose wrote:
Is there any way to make Meetecho usable on Android? I encounter two main problems with the browser interface:

* The UI is unusable in both portrait and landscape mode: elements overlap, controls are either too big or too small, etc.
* When the screen sleeps, audio stops shortly thereafter, requiring me to unlock.

Considering that Android-on-phones is the world's most widely deployed user platform, this seems like a significant barrier to participation.

Kyle

___________________________________________________________
Tools-discuss mailing list - Tools-discuss@ietf.org
This list is for discussion, not for action requests or bug reports.
* Report datatracker and mailarchive bugs to: datatracker-project@ietf.org
* Report tools.ietf.org bugs to: webmaster@tools.ietf.org
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--------------591B1AFDCFC386113D568628-- From nobody Wed Mar 10 07:45:15 2021 Return-Path: X-Original-To: tools-discuss@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: tools-discuss@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 588CD3A11EF for ; Wed, 10 Mar 2021 07:45:13 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.1 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.1 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_BLOCKED=0.001, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_H2=-0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=lowentropy.net header.b=AOLG7RyQ; dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=messagingengine.com header.b=MJi3ryDA Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id bIK-1z8PhG_P for ; Wed, 10 Mar 2021 07:45:12 -0800 (PST) Received: from wout5-smtp.messagingengine.com (wout5-smtp.messagingengine.com [64.147.123.21]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ADH-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 29F5D3A11ED for ; Wed, 10 Mar 2021 07:45:12 -0800 (PST) Received: from compute1.internal (compute1.nyi.internal [10.202.2.41]) by mailout.west.internal (Postfix) with ESMTP id BFFE12037 for ; Wed, 10 Mar 2021 10:45:09 -0500 (EST) Received: from imap10 ([10.202.2.60]) by compute1.internal (MEProxy); Wed, 10 Mar 2021 10:45:09 -0500 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=lowentropy.net; h=mime-version:message-id:in-reply-to:references:date:from:to :subject:content-type; s=fm1; bh=t1P4tpUWaZOjOAz5uDHMgZMP7F/XPu/ 638MbLhvODjw=; b=AOLG7RyQFQoYWwi4GK0568eQdLIy69wF+ACQH8/W5EXHd/0 AOeofy20kZe8/U9Wylq9w7aMI1pGY4e1VDZwLngxx3BhgIMPgd9++151H1HlVreb NIJqm2yJcZ1W0Bs7m5INYGmfE13Z2yQhtSjJDmZjGp+cv2fieK6ukPbWPJlNOzkG x87x2psB8ZssT1mQqOESF8s5uXxBvtr6nLk8B44CJpXbope0QorJViB5DN0ZWue5 XwrHUh8MuwJ9ydtfJg0YUny0lFWlwW52Um/WQ9ZQs1FAeqZ0cHkWuxUcmjlscrIz EtysT7wouZgabGXTQiA5EnAyaom4G3uVF7/ewTA== DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d= messagingengine.com; h=content-type:date:from:in-reply-to :message-id:mime-version:references:subject:to:x-me-proxy :x-me-proxy:x-me-sender:x-me-sender:x-sasl-enc; s=fm2; bh=t1P4tp UWaZOjOAz5uDHMgZMP7F/XPu/638MbLhvODjw=; b=MJi3ryDAn5QW4ByBmKBhUe 5iq1MlU8dHlLpBLCd1gjIWx8eK/53MwkdkFN6ELI5He8lK5YHHqltamRs40yAXrX Rz+RsdStsrSUAxrKYEtkZck05iLJrxRgTUU63cECA/A6MO7BEhHay62IpXkrnxN0 In1DvwBdjibdYH9tcrAmEVXT50XU0OA1d/T+4JLednUoEzikw4SzT+0yrokBX3Rn 0OVSPwOj6WSbzfiSqQxmEpDEeBmdax1+GuKpk1/+qTk4T1i3e+9suacwFRx50B1q pVT2g5rIWV/Tadmc43Mb7j2hhf2u8ne3w0bcnuRGFRRKoKV2dsYUa2qKyJoUGIFw == X-ME-Sender: X-ME-Proxy-Cause: gggruggvucftvghtrhhoucdtuddrgeduledruddukedgkedvucetufdoteggodetrfdotf fvucfrrhhofhhilhgvmecuhfgrshhtofgrihhlpdfqfgfvpdfurfetoffkrfgpnffqhgen uceurghilhhouhhtmecufedttdenucenucfjughrpefofgggkfgjfhffhffvufgtsehttd ertderreejnecuhfhrohhmpedfofgrrhhtihhnucfvhhhomhhsohhnfdcuoehmtheslhho figvnhhtrhhophihrdhnvghtqeenucggtffrrghtthgvrhhnpeehfeetudduudehtdekhf dvhfetleffudejgeejffehffevkeduiefgueevkeefleenucevlhhushhtvghrufhiiigv pedtnecurfgrrhgrmhepmhgrihhlfhhrohhmpehmtheslhhofigvnhhtrhhophihrdhnvg ht X-ME-Proxy: Received: by mailuser.nyi.internal (Postfix, from userid 501) id C89D44E0097; Wed, 10 Mar 2021 10:45:08 -0500 (EST) X-Mailer: MessagingEngine.com Webmail Interface User-Agent: Cyrus-JMAP/3.5.0-alpha0-206-g078a48fda5-fm-20210226.001-g078a48fd Mime-Version: 1.0 Message-Id: <29179d6f-4fa9-4828-b333-18bed018fd9a@www.fastmail.com> In-Reply-To: References: <6F352681-9B00-4B7C-BC9E-DF1D0905C48B@gmail.com> <8D96C16F-06F9-4E6A-8E59-83FF6B159BD1@akamai.com> Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2021 02:44:47 +1100 From: "Martin Thomson" To: tools-discuss@ietf.org Content-Type: text/plain Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Tools-discuss] =?utf-8?q?Request_to_retain_kramdown_compiler_an?= =?utf-8?q?d_author_stats?= X-BeenThere: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF Tools Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 10 Mar 2021 15:45:13 -0000 On Thu, Mar 11, 2021, at 02:07, STARK, BARBARA H wrote: > I found the instructions for how to set this up to be something I > couldn't figure out. They seem to assume a level of knowledge I don't > currently possess. Happy to walk anyone through what it might take to get started here. I would take that as an opportunity to improve the documentation, which I will concede does assume a degree of familiarity with some of the tools. From nobody Wed Mar 10 07:46:41 2021 Return-Path: X-Original-To: tools-discuss@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: tools-discuss@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id D25243A11F8 for ; Wed, 10 Mar 2021 07:46:40 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.919 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.919 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_H3=-0.01, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_WL=-0.01, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 8oZ2IUbSCOsd for ; Wed, 10 Mar 2021 07:46:37 -0800 (PST) Received: from gabriel-vm-2.zfn.uni-bremen.de (gabriel-vm-2.zfn.uni-bremen.de [134.102.50.17]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher AECDH-AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 8FF673A11F3 for ; Wed, 10 Mar 2021 07:46:37 -0800 (PST) Received: from [192.168.217.118] (p5089a828.dip0.t-ipconnect.de [80.137.168.40]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by gabriel-vm-2.zfn.uni-bremen.de (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 4DwbzH51Fqz100y; Wed, 10 Mar 2021 16:46:35 +0100 (CET) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Mime-Version: 1.0 (Mac OS X Mail 13.4 \(3608.120.23.2.4\)) From: Carsten Bormann In-Reply-To: <29179d6f-4fa9-4828-b333-18bed018fd9a@www.fastmail.com> Date: Wed, 10 Mar 2021 16:46:35 +0100 Cc: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-Mao-Original-Outgoing-Id: 637083995.127576-4d7c36bada7013888d135d3bfded4048 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Message-Id: <7C1EB1B1-C6AD-47C2-AB94-1C27474677D3@tzi.org> References: <6F352681-9B00-4B7C-BC9E-DF1D0905C48B@gmail.com> <8D96C16F-06F9-4E6A-8E59-83FF6B159BD1@akamai.com> <29179d6f-4fa9-4828-b333-18bed018fd9a@www.fastmail.com> To: Martin Thomson X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.3608.120.23.2.4) Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Tools-discuss] Request to retain kramdown compiler and author stats X-BeenThere: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF Tools Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 10 Mar 2021 15:46:41 -0000 On 2021-03-10, at 16:44, Martin Thomson wrote: >=20 > Happy to walk anyone through what it might take to get started here. = I would take that as an opportunity to improve the documentation, which = I will concede does assume a degree of familiarity with some of the = tools. When I apply this to new repos, it just works. It=E2=80=99s when upgrading older repos that I get weird results=E2=80=A6 That would be a useful subject for an UPGRADING.md Gr=C3=BC=C3=9Fe, Carsten From nobody Wed Mar 10 08:35:47 2021 Return-Path: X-Original-To: tools-discuss@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: tools-discuss@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id A5D783A130D for ; Wed, 10 Mar 2021 08:35:45 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.1 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.1 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=iecc.com Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 4kuZdf02QFAn for ; Wed, 10 Mar 2021 08:35:44 -0800 (PST) Received: from gal.iecc.com (gal.iecc.com [IPv6:2001:470:1f07:1126:0:43:6f73:7461]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 1BAC63A1302 for ; Wed, 10 Mar 2021 08:35:44 -0800 (PST) Received: (qmail 92758 invoked from network); 10 Mar 2021 16:35:43 -0000 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=simple; d=iecc.com; h=date:message-id:from:to:subject:in-reply-to:references:mime-version:content-type; s=16a50.6048f55f.k2103; bh=UnenHh86T4OBy0OeBPCB9/iaXVT7xlFuqNDgPwrUBvY=; b=Cs3Fu4rq69URGlkvoIkdpjlT48J6YmoVdPCVC8cR1jSuxLyRS444LB0LiAUho9oOIwpQczve5CupO6kKH6EAVvN/5Oq6oqGUwWVzoPrLscWr7asTmC8dP4lRkABUqGaP21F6flalH18hwtZ1wiglRtuBuMXZhAW9CYXDdznyn50Ve9foDd2jeU6pxFwXWkwNljf3SeCq6DX8Wqwcrr6tWKxBThgFuJqBPS9vjLgZeqnQnhaJAZqUZk8j/banE99PqQFK84RfW+Rt5TEh9+dQgXV6m8hEVc61OPx5t0Y3YxfzLwHJcIeQPzZXX2uK4ra/6z/D8UiSUECZda5weqGnoQ== Received: from ary.qy ([IPv6:2001:470:1f07:1126::78:696d:6170]) by imap.iecc.com ([IPv6:2001:470:1f07:1126::78:696d:6170]) with ESMTPS (TLS1.2 ECDHE-RSA AES-256-GCM AEAD) via TCP6; 10 Mar 2021 16:35:42 -0000 Received: by ary.qy (Postfix, from userid 501) id 4742F6FF4ACB; Wed, 10 Mar 2021 11:35:41 -0500 (EST) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ary.qy (Postfix) with ESMTP id AA8F76FF4AAD; Wed, 10 Mar 2021 11:35:41 -0500 (EST) Date: 10 Mar 2021 11:35:41 -0500 Message-ID: From: "John R. Levine" To: "Kyle Rose" , "tools-discuss" In-Reply-To: References: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Tools-discuss] Meetecho on Android X-BeenThere: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF Tools Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 10 Mar 2021 16:35:46 -0000 > Is there something I'm missing? I looked for a thick client and couldn't > find one, so I assume the browser client is what's available. > > I do note that the sound doesn't drop* if I keep the screen on, but this is > wasteful of battery when I'm only interested in the audio. FYI, I'm using Meetecho on a 2015 vintage Galaxy Tab A and it works fine. It's not a performance issue, looks like it needs some tuning to recognize when it's on a phone and recognize things like you'd want to leave the audio on and the video off. > *Usually. Sound drops and requires me to manually recycle it whenever my > connectivity changes, e.g., from wifi to LTE or vice versa. I'm amazed it can keep the session up at all across connectivity changes since your IP address changes too. Regards, John Levine, johnl@taugh.com, Primary Perpetrator of "The Internet for Dummies", Please consider the environment before reading this e-mail. https://jl.ly From nobody Wed Mar 10 12:02:55 2021 Return-Path: X-Original-To: tools-discuss@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: tools-discuss@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 138623A1713 for ; Wed, 10 Mar 2021 12:02:53 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -17.599 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-17.599 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIMWL_WL_MED=-0.001, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, ENV_AND_HDR_SPF_MATCH=-0.5, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001, USER_IN_DEF_DKIM_WL=-7.5, USER_IN_DEF_SPF_WL=-7.5] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=google.com Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 3btLSbt5H_N3 for ; Wed, 10 Mar 2021 12:02:51 -0800 (PST) Received: from mail-qv1-xf32.google.com (mail-qv1-xf32.google.com [IPv6:2607:f8b0:4864:20::f32]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id EF9893A1710 for ; Wed, 10 Mar 2021 12:02:15 -0800 (PST) Received: by mail-qv1-xf32.google.com with SMTP id cx5so1433265qvb.10 for ; Wed, 10 Mar 2021 12:02:15 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=google.com; s=20161025; h=mime-version:from:date:message-id:subject:to; bh=aEimvynT2d2CBs3lMNW60cUZ+pLkszNLEY1hM6MQTfI=; b=akgH/qkUVAVaPzLN4VBzKdI1eUXjVnohP0oF0y0zYIZtQ/SAOUZx4Ay+vPVYw1Ialo VfC7rzvlz9ssd00nSj+nGSH/paURcrZqM1g8rY2tt/AaPFh3ImOodocbprF6rAoCQz5L v+ckVJeGYxqVIci2W8B3zTaXCuWOk6LISFW4fx1pG35rzOZy8g/k/xzAr1OxTbEhh9uO yGVLGq+fJQRG6i/EEVKkU7RvWtZkc8sHnmHr5qaaTY4fCFxMM2YyWwyxd28HNMWcmVck guIksxM49Z8KUyUQdbOY7bNmwOSgFOukRrCLv+Jeiqu92TWIP4vcoaXYLddKQdMrW41P RRPg== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:from:date:message-id:subject:to; bh=aEimvynT2d2CBs3lMNW60cUZ+pLkszNLEY1hM6MQTfI=; b=lAuLnfMiuis6Knk4A+A+qyRn4gdVmv4ghgGWtn9IJOUnmDQeC+pZS53U41nC4E8rl8 eA3/zHUJTiiUss6FUK3UOfCb24Fbcaqsm79rid1bwkhD0pvGSSitF+0tyncJcqMUzFJ+ IIa0zlzuaksafVGX2neC+RkLoPG4YX1iV0wmtzs6NLeIS4IFPimWXmy2pggBzkNbFefc kdjE0ZhvzJCM9hUoYGyXcLPmg57IAB5iCiXnMcpUyJ6IRHyhmQn3VBW3NjhwhpjcFqbs UWkMjPgW1KR0jK2HTZJqCpfQLXPBVoeqHrpUtaanAKRNsN6ScUllhu0BX/u6GaaoQ99X RYnQ== X-Gm-Message-State: AOAM5331EJgex2S/SWT/NqP1gDbDtO3T8gipfep/RrqeKRvl1Gc3sowv qcLNHvuaQ8BUf5UvT3FHi+NtanoDrN69IPc+eRlYQhIvQWWqdQ== X-Google-Smtp-Source: ABdhPJxNCAYIqcYCEZxMs0lrU32uKM74b7JNSmz/OrDZs9UmbK6dIdRc26+Vd9FMOAidjGjYMQ39iyV/laHX1W5dDvA= X-Received: by 2002:ad4:4732:: with SMTP id l18mr4674828qvz.6.1615406532987; Wed, 10 Mar 2021 12:02:12 -0800 (PST) MIME-Version: 1.0 From: Jeffrey Yasskin Date: Wed, 10 Mar 2021 12:02:01 -0800 Message-ID: To: Tools Discussion Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="000000000000917ce405bd3424fe" Archived-At: Subject: [Tools-discuss] Links from HTML I-Ds to datatracker/latest versions X-BeenThere: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF Tools Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 10 Mar 2021 20:02:54 -0000 --000000000000917ce405bd3424fe Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" I've noticed that the native-HTML version of internet drafts, like https://www.ietf.org/archive/id/draft-yasskin-wpack-bundled-exchanges-03.html 1) Don't link back to the datatracker's description of the draft: https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-yasskin-wpack-bundled-exchanges/ 2) Don't link to any later versions of the draft: https://www.ietf.org/archive/id/draft-yasskin-wpack-bundled-exchanges-04.html 3) Don't have an easy way to find a version-independent URL, like the htmlized version provides at https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/html/draft-yasskin-wpack-bundled-exchanges. This makes it dangerous to link to native-HTML versions of I-Ds because readers don't have any way to realize that they're reading an old version. I haven't dug into which tools would need to change to provide such links. Probably both xml2rfc and the datatracker itself? Are there issues with the /archive/ path segment that might imply these files can never change to incorporate the fact that the latest available version does change? Jeffrey --000000000000917ce405bd3424fe Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
I've noticed that the native-HTML version of internet = drafts, like=C2=A0https://www.ietf.org/archive/id/draft-yass= kin-wpack-bundled-exchanges-03.html

1) Don't lin= k back to the datatracker's description of the draft:=C2=A0htt= ps://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-yasskin-wpack-bundled-exchanges/
2) Don't link to any later versions of the draft:=C2=A0https://www.ietf.org/archive/id/draft-yasskin-wpack-bundled-exchang= es-04.html
3) Don't have an easy way to find a version-in= dependent URL, like the htmlized version provides at=C2=A0http= s://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/html/draft-yasskin-wpack-bundled-exchanges= .

This makes it dangerous to link to native-HTML v= ersions of I-Ds because readers don't have any way to realize that they= 're reading an old version.

I haven't dug = into which tools would need to change to provide such links. Probably both = xml2rfc and the datatracker itself? Are there issues with the /archive/ pat= h segment that might imply these files can never change to incorporate the = fact that the latest available version does change?

Jeffrey
--000000000000917ce405bd3424fe-- From nobody Wed Mar 10 12:09:09 2021 Return-Path: X-Original-To: tools-discuss@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: tools-discuss@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9DFA33A0D39 for ; Wed, 10 Mar 2021 12:09:07 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.099 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.099 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, NICE_REPLY_A=-0.001, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=gmail.com Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 4MP0d0IUNHv5 for ; Wed, 10 Mar 2021 12:09:06 -0800 (PST) Received: from mail-pg1-x533.google.com (mail-pg1-x533.google.com [IPv6:2607:f8b0:4864:20::533]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 54C573A1723 for ; Wed, 10 Mar 2021 12:08:45 -0800 (PST) Received: by mail-pg1-x533.google.com with SMTP id w34so11063072pga.8 for ; Wed, 10 Mar 2021 12:08:45 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20161025; h=subject:to:references:from:cc:message-id:date:user-agent :mime-version:in-reply-to:content-language:content-transfer-encoding; bh=L0quy6abqFHgrMQR3xLbbyKVDa7yD3XqihY7PJDz7mM=; b=YSMbpscOzky1fExDL87RKbBgEBa3n1fLzMt5rxHymI8/p1tutwJ7oF1D6xiMOB0odi XiJkSBKl1hdClQ/n4LtPDIfAG4W5CKcoZAvKX9TONSY+uHR7601UWqPr1rKhU5IuKvxt Hk66Y2sCF6Y6F2y1pzPdKTXv5QDqmm1w9DPqd8yk+2iLqFsVQNIEogdtv1yNJj6Ev54P sd2F8xfNej2JzXcFRI3Nkp18Q41nor75Ig5ka8lwgS3p/+9CXhfnr1Nc/IMriYOauJ1P IQa7YIBhNEdVJsVxoTzwIR5V8ocV7W86KdEbIEM2yzFRZM9c8xjnp1VJbc+lcNCw2B3u uPmw== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:subject:to:references:from:cc:message-id:date :user-agent:mime-version:in-reply-to:content-language :content-transfer-encoding; bh=L0quy6abqFHgrMQR3xLbbyKVDa7yD3XqihY7PJDz7mM=; b=htdZsYiY3hvsa+bf3R3wmSovPTg69twTrTmsC9UGo/Hun3q5gtfxo0Rz9XAh/ZO58A SVfGBnlPWlrhb3CkaTQWkXFLm2emb9MtVYXXOQVgu7yDvx6q62gvc/3Y0VEtcjjcUr1t 5KnnTGsVZOOfWwUYRW5jS/YNJfACNlcn3p7GnkKWE26VeqciMOThDmRhdXLEUS2ml68M zVqfm9aoOOmdW2N3L6NZA6DoNT+agMHVQW0YbvGbsEp04TdszhD3sm0BBonWGbVnwQBi 2T/Iq9KvxiQm97hlRVIF/1fA34eRNqK/ln8MmRYeQ8SAXwcfl/8iyBKaDf0X/p+U06qv gvmw== X-Gm-Message-State: AOAM533GeLgM8UvUf+LY6if+pUW2x0rjfIFuk4mywpno36LSxWjA3Hq2 J7HgDgjNoUokjBYW141OM9bjfzRZYDVnTA== X-Google-Smtp-Source: ABdhPJwWQCfBceQwN7K6vabN8Whk9BFMQjI43l3h0YOpqoprmZwpjjRzq+zKe8GflvcmXHcY9BB6VA== X-Received: by 2002:a63:1d26:: with SMTP id d38mr4291384pgd.385.1615406923389; Wed, 10 Mar 2021 12:08:43 -0800 (PST) Received: from [192.168.178.20] ([151.210.131.28]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id e22sm337173pgk.56.2021.03.10.12.08.41 (version=TLS1_2 cipher=ECDHE-ECDSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 bits=128/128); Wed, 10 Mar 2021 12:08:43 -0800 (PST) To: Robert Sparks References: <6F352681-9B00-4B7C-BC9E-DF1D0905C48B@gmail.com> From: Brian E Carpenter Cc: Stewart Bryant , tools-discuss@ietf.org Message-ID: <68dac1e8-b308-29c2-7d89-f61dba31de74@gmail.com> Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2021 09:08:38 +1300 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows NT 10.0; WOW64; rv:60.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/60.9.1 MIME-Version: 1.0 In-Reply-To: <6F352681-9B00-4B7C-BC9E-DF1D0905C48B@gmail.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Language: en-US Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Tools-discuss] Request to retain kramdown compiler and author stats X-BeenThere: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF Tools Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 10 Mar 2021 20:09:07 -0000 On 10-Mar-21 23:14, Stewart Bryant wrote: > Two tools that I find particularly useful, and hope are retained are: > > The experimental version of XML2RFC which supports the kramdown compiler. I have found this useful when collaborating with others that are new to kramdown, and also those that are unable to install the kramdown compiler on their work machine due to company policy on third part software. Assuming you mean https://xml2rfc.tools.ietf.org/experimental.html, yes, that's an essential tool and if it goes away I'll stop producing drafts. I have no intention of installing all that stuff on my Windows machine, even assuming it's possible. (Not to mention https://xml2rfc.tools.ietf.org/, but I always use the "experimental" version.) Note that https://xml2rfc.ietf.org redirects to https://xml2rfc.tools.ietf.org. I assume therefore that the 30% of draft authors who use a "web service" according to Jay's recent survey actually use tools.ietf.org. However, Robert told us: "We will be replacing the online xml2rfc and bibxml services with modern rewrites of the existing services." So that's fine, as long as the extras available at the "experimental" URL are retained. Brian From nobody Wed Mar 10 12:12:49 2021 Return-Path: X-Original-To: tools-discuss@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: tools-discuss@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 277703A172E for ; Wed, 10 Mar 2021 12:12:48 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.099 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.099 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, NICE_REPLY_A=-0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_BLOCKED=0.001, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=gmail.com Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id B6lO3MPTeg4i for ; Wed, 10 Mar 2021 12:12:46 -0800 (PST) Received: from mail-pf1-x429.google.com (mail-pf1-x429.google.com [IPv6:2607:f8b0:4864:20::429]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id ADF503A1719 for ; Wed, 10 Mar 2021 12:12:46 -0800 (PST) Received: by mail-pf1-x429.google.com with SMTP id e26so4240492pfd.9 for ; Wed, 10 Mar 2021 12:12:46 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20161025; h=subject:to:references:from:message-id:date:user-agent:mime-version :in-reply-to:content-language:content-transfer-encoding; bh=WNy1alXEbXQaoe+V2QaK5IpFd2nCDLFhhOGWSzlz9/4=; b=GgDSNFCF0TiFt+r1Tk8rvexcF2aZSuAqebukwHFPdPHTv5MntC/lBd+/AU9yUA7V24 xgSWwC2M7uxIrs3aZWZoQpv2+SjIwCHb49x9fFYZtul9KvbrbgqTWgGXM19UVolx4fIl wYSdf3csrmPUsWkFxcpHm2Bs/Ail+XMVkMwXp4EWEvVx4mXP5Od10iISrBFHkBgbdtks G9zByNXOM4H3o4cjm0dC6CaA2O2htyQM47FJMyfA2qnxZ8op7xLoSMzcjZvGoft/6anq BziHwFlg+6nH0MxpfDB6A8SJmxbQmIic5PQBakHw3NIZVEmhOroIYlH1j3gkaQjfZou+ DpXQ== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:subject:to:references:from:message-id:date :user-agent:mime-version:in-reply-to:content-language :content-transfer-encoding; bh=WNy1alXEbXQaoe+V2QaK5IpFd2nCDLFhhOGWSzlz9/4=; b=muQlMDA844fuJgM3zTrjs9ZfeKJEZgB1e6WXl/YSIpy4iEsJbP4ERlCBfTNeWDDG9q a6ltN9Cd8XBFUedPKCZbpZiTPO++jVZ6gLtMEST6ahJXwUe6Bj2RYfmno5CUBDfxaIsq eY6kLHxXyXMFXr6TSBa4oWAwk5MrcyxyS+UwCV6d7XWFAOib6787dZuo924mhimUtjpR sMJ+nSP7GhQW+0VC9+3xrVroG8w853fg9dbsc4dZgqEMTl4FaY312lGYDZ9Sy34ZAT8u 60zLILfRA1+KG1EMSsxPccOX/PEaeetW4mDNmpO9RXh+jGHl617MfmZ4Oy/QEjUdY/nE bVRQ== X-Gm-Message-State: AOAM533eUlMjM0JfFuGarOyRuKxF+t0faWdNoa3wwNc02p6bty9Gt/Ua BeKPg1agQ1op6m/r/PYQ4IlZDei9oQJRtQ== X-Google-Smtp-Source: ABdhPJyViMhNSe2zpHyN1QP9FtelhWLNxBy25XoSUNEPXamTmAfMvkRxneOZMPkafu28esnLMe9h2g== X-Received: by 2002:aa7:8a19:0:b029:1f6:6839:7211 with SMTP id m25-20020aa78a190000b02901f668397211mr4195645pfa.40.1615407164274; Wed, 10 Mar 2021 12:12:44 -0800 (PST) Received: from [192.168.178.20] ([151.210.131.28]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id 15sm300265pfx.167.2021.03.10.12.12.42 (version=TLS1_2 cipher=ECDHE-ECDSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 bits=128/128); Wed, 10 Mar 2021 12:12:43 -0800 (PST) To: Julian Reschke , tools-discuss@ietf.org References: <6F352681-9B00-4B7C-BC9E-DF1D0905C48B@gmail.com> From: Brian E Carpenter Message-ID: <92482c20-f2fe-48c4-2f44-d025158b143f@gmail.com> Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2021 09:12:39 +1300 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows NT 10.0; WOW64; rv:60.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/60.9.1 MIME-Version: 1.0 In-Reply-To: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Language: en-US Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Tools-discuss] Request to retain kramdown compiler and author stats X-BeenThere: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF Tools Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 10 Mar 2021 20:12:48 -0000 On 11-Mar-21 04:16, Julian Reschke wrote: ...> I'm running kramdown and xml2rfc just fine on Cygwin. And I'm pretty > sure that WSL (Windows Subsytem for Linux) will even do better... Why would I want to invest in that learning curve (or the GitHub one) when the web service is just so much easier to use? Fortunately the plan includes the web service anyway. Brian From nobody Wed Mar 10 12:18:14 2021 Return-Path: X-Original-To: tools-discuss@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: tools-discuss@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0EF6F3A1748 for ; Wed, 10 Mar 2021 12:18:12 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.6 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.6 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, NICE_REPLY_A=-0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW=-0.7, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_H2=-0.001, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (1024-bit key) header.d=gmx.net Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 8POUL7jtE5Wg for ; Wed, 10 Mar 2021 12:18:10 -0800 (PST) Received: from mout.gmx.net (mout.gmx.net [212.227.15.15]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 292003A1746 for ; Wed, 10 Mar 2021 12:18:09 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/simple; d=gmx.net; s=badeba3b8450; t=1615407487; bh=zb0kvq7B9IXTw1WAcLQdcTioQ9ru/Bs/7XxPeFNmwDw=; h=X-UI-Sender-Class:Subject:To:References:From:Date:In-Reply-To; b=ZpojXzWPbVk4LMFAcNB1k29/gsMD3MKdIDFoQ2B245qjrH0p4sMsKB0zytr38h4qB U+2BN3aaKIRR+BPmP9EGIMRrE3rEceGhAR5TJ9ozJu9jVzrZ/9rNUXsJRSc4A23Dgq Tb3cmel4VESQJUvcWMdMkK1O0qy94ylvagMRvndM= X-UI-Sender-Class: 01bb95c1-4bf8-414a-932a-4f6e2808ef9c Received: from [192.168.178.20] ([91.61.52.88]) by mail.gmx.net (mrgmx004 [212.227.17.190]) with ESMTPSA (Nemesis) id 1MfHEP-1lvu8D442l-00gryr for ; Wed, 10 Mar 2021 21:18:07 +0100 To: tools-discuss@ietf.org References: From: Julian Reschke Message-ID: <32ebbf43-85e7-d521-e70c-8c2bfab12aaa@gmx.de> Date: Wed, 10 Mar 2021 21:18:05 +0100 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows NT 10.0; Win64; x64; rv:78.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/78.8.0 MIME-Version: 1.0 In-Reply-To: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Provags-ID: V03:K1:LW61F95JDDg9IKLFjwOi+ccM2MFJNLpF0HgDExq6RQXJWhRgcBa 4gJrxZF6WilfBn+WnSl55UXliZ+6ueGDIEEXPUYlWNd6iUKUyGQvLVb6AQ5j28CAwCQMFyP QUoo9hmEhmjwEbsdlkiRZI9+jvKRDi4Iarv3KyEg6zoyZNWZnvLWwiyMyLANQtf4ygqtz32 Z9ABjk0WDLOGzvLl6v5Eg== X-UI-Out-Filterresults: notjunk:1;V03:K0:YRarcqtzJv0=:25+hHo45B0rSIUitW+lG/x Qsk87bgHw0s8Gv7LMBmQdxqzyRIZeIhBcW49qo4lXpx3BHBXq+Ph5ChNu01cc7vUZiK6bEDnR xd5g24zbABie3OvuLMwo/SlphUhqJKXHC2I7ynVTiUrwMJXgt3ZNFjpN878GGI6oea4kxmeP4 1QuBEPDqXPd9PECi/X8cQs/Qi0/4XOcmyNqzoBcoXX/JRxaS8wXJH/h/hzsJp9aL49iBhZuuf eak9zxZT7aWoqmwXnHZC7cVKP7Or3PizuLl1ZPBvnYMm//vi6HzBwVVT4wdthvQAkNbiXspmp R+xD9tv4mq0sEamyFQV5YCWc2puuA57YzLBBpU5m50TOwN1IY+IP9391ZtAPq9TGxaD56ZDpT Rnadyol9MZB0I1+xtJB58dzJ5RjmEvYcQY90EDKJ3F4Tjn5tSHDSweZbPHbolKr6exxgJV+XJ Nf/h+Q4PTgQJ6Iiss8ZPiJU9h6LGS/KaPeCfbY34g0XS2kXeNyY4xaZ3WujWf5tP8GDYn0xNb dRCAht4zQUcXc9GRCIwcwy2OtQ36m75JJXLBbK9psPyg6jIaeTMZMrL0z4kyd3AhzNLcREGu4 0NR4dhc5SrGoHoIJKPrK7BEuwr/qnkiW/Q+cxGzT6EhbSgfbL371ePHu9JxrjGMDQdi5fJXIB aVI3SvtgJfPvZRJQ4l/knwUap4iNRmUacsUR3Tz1Wkysazz2GP2ItsAspscqEVdTtTL6J+qUH yeUaUSbQX14LhNzEkohz2vPzSF7NWA9xdLUfoAvR4aMqYFKUwu1LzwGNgSO3J+MV7+TFu621b RRTZwc+wky0ZOspjueEQKcAJeZ9Kmmqpa2SQaBgQavQZoahqOHUcwCXtD5r5OExEI1U1RBOTI 18358e6aWuWDP/bCmbuw== Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Tools-discuss] Links from HTML I-Ds to datatracker/latest versions X-BeenThere: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF Tools Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 10 Mar 2021 20:18:12 -0000 Am 10.03.2021 um 21:02 schrieb Jeffrey Yasskin: > ... > I haven't dug into which tools would need to change to provide such > links. Probably both xml2rfc and the datatracker itself? Are there > issues with the /archive/ path segment that might imply these files can > never change to incorporate the fact that the latest available version > does change? > ... I don't think there's a requirement not to re-render Internet Drafts, so yes, this could be done. An alternative is to do this at displaytime using JS, I started to do that in rfc2629.xslt recently. Example: (and yes, that currently only notifies readers that the version is obsolete and doesn't provide links beyond that) Best regards, Julian From nobody Wed Mar 10 14:04:35 2021 Return-Path: X-Original-To: tools-discuss@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: tools-discuss@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id C27943A1993 for ; Wed, 10 Mar 2021 14:04:33 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.92 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.92 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_H4=-0.01, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_WL=-0.01, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (1024-bit key) header.d=att.onmicrosoft.com Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 4a1_etgUJTDW for ; Wed, 10 Mar 2021 14:04:32 -0800 (PST) Received: from mx0a-00191d01.pphosted.com (mx0a-00191d01.pphosted.com [67.231.149.140]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 9F6C53A1991 for ; Wed, 10 Mar 2021 14:04:32 -0800 (PST) Received: from pps.filterd (m0049297.ppops.net [127.0.0.1]) by m0049297.ppops.net-00191d01. 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Wed, 10 Mar 2021 14:15:11 -0800 (PST) Received: from [192.168.178.20] ([151.210.131.28]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id y9sm313217pja.50.2021.03.10.14.15.09 (version=TLS1_2 cipher=ECDHE-ECDSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 bits=128/128); Wed, 10 Mar 2021 14:15:10 -0800 (PST) To: Jeffrey Yasskin , Tools Discussion References: From: Brian E Carpenter Message-ID: <1db89591-3852-4b6e-8c7b-0e9407409edf@gmail.com> Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2021 11:15:06 +1300 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows NT 10.0; WOW64; rv:60.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/60.9.1 MIME-Version: 1.0 In-Reply-To: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Language: en-US Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Tools-discuss] Links from HTML I-Ds to datatracker/latest versions X-BeenThere: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF Tools Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 10 Mar 2021 22:15:15 -0000 On 11-Mar-21 09:02, Jeffrey Yasskin wrote: > I've noticed that the native-HTML version of internet drafts, like=C2=A0= https://www.ietf.org/archive/id/draft-yasskin-wpack-bundled-exchanges-03.= html >=20 > 1) Don't link back to the datatracker's description of the draft:=C2=A0= https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-yasskin-wpack-bundled-exchanges/ > 2) Don't link to any later versions of the draft:=C2=A0https://www.ietf= =2Eorg/archive/id/draft-yasskin-wpack-bundled-exchanges-04.html > 3) Don't have an easy way to find a version-independent URL, like the h= tmlized version provides at=C2=A0https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/html/dr= aft-yasskin-wpack-bundled-exchanges. >=20 > This makes it dangerous to link to native-HTML versions of I-Ds because= readers don't have any way to realize that they're reading an old versio= n. Really? When I tried with your draft -03, the links to updated drafts gav= e 404 errors. =20 > I haven't dug into which tools would need to change to provide such lin= ks. Probably both xml2rfc and the datatracker itself? Are there issues wi= th the /archive/ path segment that might imply these files can never chan= ge to incorporate the fact that the latest available version does change?= afaik, if your xml (v3) looks like this: the html rendering will point to the current version at the time the xml = file is converted, but via the tools server. The top bar there gives you = the versions up to date. There's also a link to the tracker. (That will have to be changed of course when tools.ietf.org goes away.) Looking at your -04 draft, that's exactly how it is, so whatever caused t= he wrong links in the -03 draft seems to have been fixed already. Regards Brian Carpenter From nobody Wed Mar 10 15:29:58 2021 Return-Path: X-Original-To: tools-discuss@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: tools-discuss@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id F37533A0D8A for ; Wed, 10 Mar 2021 15:29:56 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -17.599 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-17.599 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIMWL_WL_MED=-0.001, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, ENV_AND_HDR_SPF_MATCH=-0.5, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001, USER_IN_DEF_DKIM_WL=-7.5, USER_IN_DEF_SPF_WL=-7.5] autolearn=unavailable autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=google.com Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 2y5-9bCBGECF for ; Wed, 10 Mar 2021 15:29:55 -0800 (PST) Received: from mail-qt1-x829.google.com (mail-qt1-x829.google.com [IPv6:2607:f8b0:4864:20::829]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 5A0F43A0D81 for ; Wed, 10 Mar 2021 15:29:55 -0800 (PST) Received: by mail-qt1-x829.google.com with SMTP id w60so9613571qte.0 for ; Wed, 10 Mar 2021 15:29:55 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=google.com; s=20161025; h=mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date:message-id:subject:to :cc; bh=HqoIZ6RmabkLgEy8MxgQJCQ6TI4DrSKYBcfjgscznRQ=; b=TNqHFKcgvO64t8JFxWJpCCSUw550eF6GY5bsDcz69m3dlp53JoEvz06F7wBueQSiOs 2MPhZ5v9AJl+fRtlZx0OWd0WmQFDlF7zEOe2MP+pBinsaQfeGyOm/ufMb22tHLAtsmfT XhRT1UfoyysCAINDdjAwkMxAZe82jTy7qFHqIYvB5FpnJXWfZ3BJ87vwmh0YKJf+1u6a 453ChVcGqRJVcsUOFL/VDIVnybY5HxCMSXei8graGXPw+ZJ0+sqSJ7eHFuZXB9XYuAE6 60cwug212V980WRkalaYEftJqW7svaJxoEWzOoztSpNOWN520v3vgk0Lzioy/jItYgc1 hRkw== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date :message-id:subject:to:cc; bh=HqoIZ6RmabkLgEy8MxgQJCQ6TI4DrSKYBcfjgscznRQ=; b=jcfo7cyMnF0r+JeG2xZkH7fGP/VYZI2HJgygMrFhNcEPQX+ruCq7et45oWIAp+j3x+ IDnY6j/t7iTHfc+fW5+dsAN3vP5yEf6wYMtwiDDX37jM+AN4NQm8xZUu9PhVOs+PiQsJ fYVYvXjVynLhsIzS61L6U8gEXLlNTlUU+fjSSTVXjbwZCsGLHVVl6Rc3PGx3Q8qVu7HR IWxmnGwpMmNcdg/BZnYH+JN+Pt4+ftcOwmLG8ykGqgBoPwjuOc2nz7/i2SlYxS4XV+lQ Ug2QTOEzmIovYK6tVlUSEfN008wEBCs6O9GpI5o8ivBBcgnq9EwLpuHA6S2wr2zDCLhz s+5w== X-Gm-Message-State: AOAM532V46Xfe5rsmZ09uUmJRe85dxlZxVTuMjAwcD3xHgnbU2ts5TQx 0z86+3IvKMy05aYU5gii1CzVSo0mELm6DC0yniToXg== X-Google-Smtp-Source: ABdhPJyasyWYYpHo2mcwOWP/f6LW/GkAr8xse0hKGaWQv5ZxdiMmumGnP/u/I31ENoZyyOqbjytiVURGS3EtfpMpqso= X-Received: by 2002:ac8:44cc:: with SMTP id b12mr5059010qto.382.1615418992724; Wed, 10 Mar 2021 15:29:52 -0800 (PST) MIME-Version: 1.0 References: <1db89591-3852-4b6e-8c7b-0e9407409edf@gmail.com> In-Reply-To: <1db89591-3852-4b6e-8c7b-0e9407409edf@gmail.com> From: Jeffrey Yasskin Date: Wed, 10 Mar 2021 15:29:41 -0800 Message-ID: To: Brian E Carpenter Cc: Jeffrey Yasskin , Tools Discussion Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="0000000000003a228b05bd370b7e" Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Tools-discuss] Links from HTML I-Ds to datatracker/latest versions X-BeenThere: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF Tools Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 10 Mar 2021 23:29:57 -0000 --0000000000003a228b05bd370b7e Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" On Wed, Mar 10, 2021 at 2:15 PM Brian E Carpenter < brian.e.carpenter@gmail.com> wrote: > On 11-Mar-21 09:02, Jeffrey Yasskin wrote: > > I've noticed that the native-HTML version of internet drafts, like > https://www.ietf.org/archive/id/draft-yasskin-wpack-bundled-exchanges-03.html > > > > 1) Don't link back to the datatracker's description of the draft: > https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-yasskin-wpack-bundled-exchanges/ > > 2) Don't link to any later versions of the draft: > https://www.ietf.org/archive/id/draft-yasskin-wpack-bundled-exchanges-04.html > > 3) Don't have an easy way to find a version-independent URL, like the > htmlized version provides at > https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/html/draft-yasskin-wpack-bundled-exchanges > . > > > > This makes it dangerous to link to native-HTML versions of I-Ds because > readers don't have any way to realize that they're reading an old version. > > Really? When I tried with your draft -03, the links to updated drafts gave > 404 errors. > > > I haven't dug into which tools would need to change to provide such > links. Probably both xml2rfc and the datatracker itself? Are there issues > with the /archive/ path segment that might imply these files can never > change to incorporate the fact that the latest available version does > change? > > afaik, if your xml (v3) looks like this: > > > > the html rendering will point to the current version at the time the xml > file is converted, but via the tools server. The top bar there gives you > the versions up to date. There's also a link to the tracker. > > (That will have to be changed of course when tools.ietf.org goes away.) > > Looking at your -04 draft, that's exactly how it is, so whatever caused > the wrong links in the -03 draft seems to have been fixed already. > I think you might have confused the htmlized version ( https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/html/draft-yasskin-wpack-bundled-exchanges-04), which has the cross-links I want, with the native-HTML version ( https://www.ietf.org/archive/id/draft-yasskin-wpack-bundled-exchanges-04.html) that has better typesetting and table of contents, but is missing the cross-links I mentioned above. I'm not sure where the mention of came from, as it's not in my XML version at all ( https://www.ietf.org/archive/id/draft-yasskin-wpack-bundled-exchanges-04.xml ). Jeffrey --0000000000003a228b05bd370b7e Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
On Wed, Mar 10, 2021 at 2:15 PM Brian E C= arpenter <brian.e.carpent= er@gmail.com> wrote:
On 11-Mar-21 09:02, Jeffrey Yasskin = wrote:
> I've noticed that the native-HTML version of internet drafts, like= =C2=A0https://www.ietf.= org/archive/id/draft-yasskin-wpack-bundled-exchanges-03.html
>
> 1) Don't link back to the datatracker's description of the dra= ft:=C2=A0https://datatracker.= ietf.org/doc/draft-yasskin-wpack-bundled-exchanges/
> 2) Don't link to any later versions of the draft:=C2=A0https://www.ietf.org/archive/id/dr= aft-yasskin-wpack-bundled-exchanges-04.html
> 3) Don't have an easy way to find a version-independent URL, like = the htmlized version provides at=C2=A0https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/html/draft-yasskin-wpack-bund= led-exchanges.
>
> This makes it dangerous to link to native-HTML versions of I-Ds becaus= e readers don't have any way to realize that they're reading an old= version.

Really? When I tried with your draft -03, the links to updated drafts gave = 404 errors.

> I haven't dug into which tools would need to change to provide suc= h links. Probably both xml2rfc and the datatracker itself? Are there issues= with the /archive/ path segment that might imply these files can never cha= nge to incorporate the fact that the latest available version does change?<= br>
afaik, if your xml (v3) looks like this:

<xi:include href=3D"https://xml2rfc.tools.ietf.org/public/rfc/bibxml3/reference.I-D.foo-bar.= xml"/>

the html rendering will point to the current version at the time the xml fi= le is converted, but via the tools server. The top bar there gives you the = versions up to date. There's also a link to the tracker.

(That will have to be changed of course when tools.ietf.org goes away.)

Looking at your -04 draft, that's exactly how it is, so whatever caused= the wrong links in the -03 draft seems to have been fixed already.

I think you might have confused the htmlized= =C2=A0version (https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/html/draft-= yasskin-wpack-bundled-exchanges-04), which has the cross-links I want, = with the native-HTML version (https://www.ietf.org/archive/i= d/draft-yasskin-wpack-bundled-exchanges-04.html) that has better typese= tting and table of contents, but is missing the cross-links I mentioned abo= ve. I'm not sure where the mention of <xi:include> came from, as = it's not in my XML version at all (https://www.ietf.org/a= rchive/id/draft-yasskin-wpack-bundled-exchanges-04.xml).

=
Jeffrey
--0000000000003a228b05bd370b7e-- From nobody Wed Mar 10 17:14:33 2021 Return-Path: X-Original-To: tools-discuss@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: tools-discuss@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id D93573A0934 for ; Wed, 10 Mar 2021 17:14:31 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.099 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.099 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, NICE_REPLY_A=-0.001, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=gmail.com Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id dhOtoYvSuNvD for ; Wed, 10 Mar 2021 17:14:30 -0800 (PST) Received: from mail-pl1-x62d.google.com (mail-pl1-x62d.google.com [IPv6:2607:f8b0:4864:20::62d]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 399723A0928 for ; Wed, 10 Mar 2021 17:14:30 -0800 (PST) Received: by mail-pl1-x62d.google.com with SMTP id s7so9399936plg.5 for ; Wed, 10 Mar 2021 17:14:30 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20161025; h=subject:to:cc:references:from:message-id:date:user-agent :mime-version:in-reply-to:content-language:content-transfer-encoding; bh=jjiG4G86+Noe11QbYGiSc9JfoHwa0kE9wQj7gKOx5X8=; b=LOtrf+kEOSg8GqBbdKtF2Pm6KTd8byfULgJXNpgZDfuyBuXdYNW2roohZhMp2fTJ7L 68JRN9ZsjrlRArovssks1RAQYU32Ky8sHqitHMoS5+iSKsbuMuRi4fGNcZkY2ukNBAxh r6Gws/VYLLrGYrev27hNwm62TTmoZw7zsw1zn68kVR3cTiAVsHNTvrnGFswl6aowd2NP J3AF69Rz1fi3UOgP3jXuhklwQButvS4LMtwshbvXRGvD8FuIk/V/EdjcppXUi0I3HrhX IkIIQyamFjcZwYezuNF3vj1/bDXCQETIdNLC4x7Se+STSgqdBf4z5ihb7zvOV55gOrbT DWuQ== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:subject:to:cc:references:from:message-id:date :user-agent:mime-version:in-reply-to:content-language :content-transfer-encoding; bh=jjiG4G86+Noe11QbYGiSc9JfoHwa0kE9wQj7gKOx5X8=; b=julvgP0RkMcTX111h2KOSNaQW8vL4xoa0XBcxkH5dTcFta0qJLXGjMrTofUS2jVFwt q9d+KbNgenAq6hSgt0/RpU5YPuAEtIe77HF5ZY9rypslDSj7VdUGrMpWhKwUFUicZ5b3 jE22KBt8yC5YvXP9HLI4xxGz/iO4kINkvvATN+63tFx9DeStJOQVlZBmAONGWa3ocVmr ErBTgpNhvRyFbLadocln5RQTPoUlH90zkQl6VEeNZ244PlIpLATJO3gpQnF10Fmu5HxU b6xNhLVw5SfBtgg83i8Cn4Vcn3ljJeldeHKXWVPR4oICFfpYZGpULtrJPJ7gFTAI5U3P ElhA== X-Gm-Message-State: AOAM531MJWlVC89gDxtgtta1l+B9u6KJpSV73GyQCpRf1UqrvbX9Jv5T dhHgxm6aYVvbvuT2ziauOeY8ZNIUOD9IBw== X-Google-Smtp-Source: ABdhPJznsitsd0ogTYyt1z9DJcNNUKGtwwagyz/E7jSEQ1Wk5dTKsQTRehC3dZeDl0sWY7ioACeJdw== X-Received: by 2002:a17:902:8a91:b029:e6:3e11:b252 with SMTP id p17-20020a1709028a91b02900e63e11b252mr5580752plo.7.1615425268232; Wed, 10 Mar 2021 17:14:28 -0800 (PST) Received: from [192.168.178.20] ([151.210.131.28]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id u7sm604249pfh.150.2021.03.10.17.14.25 (version=TLS1_2 cipher=ECDHE-ECDSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 bits=128/128); Wed, 10 Mar 2021 17:14:27 -0800 (PST) To: Jeffrey Yasskin Cc: Jeffrey Yasskin , Tools Discussion References: <1db89591-3852-4b6e-8c7b-0e9407409edf@gmail.com> From: Brian E Carpenter Message-ID: Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2021 14:14:23 +1300 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows NT 10.0; WOW64; rv:60.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/60.9.1 MIME-Version: 1.0 In-Reply-To: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Language: en-US Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Tools-discuss] Links from HTML I-Ds to datatracker/latest versions X-BeenThere: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF Tools Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2021 01:14:32 -0000 On 11-Mar-21 12:29, Jeffrey Yasskin wrote: > On Wed, Mar 10, 2021 at 2:15 PM Brian E Carpenter > wrote: >=20 > On 11-Mar-21 09:02, Jeffrey Yasskin wrote: > > I've noticed that the native-HTML version of internet drafts, lik= e=C2=A0https://www.ietf.org/archive/id/draft-yasskin-wpack-bundled-exchan= ges-03.html > > > > 1) Don't link back to the datatracker's description of the draft:= =C2=A0https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-yasskin-wpack-bundled-exchan= ges/ > > 2) Don't link to any later versions of the draft:=C2=A0https://ww= w.ietf.org/archive/id/draft-yasskin-wpack-bundled-exchanges-04.html > > 3) Don't have an easy way to find a version-independent URL, like= the htmlized version provides at=C2=A0https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/h= tml/draft-yasskin-wpack-bundled-exchanges. > > > > This makes it dangerous to link to native-HTML versions of I-Ds b= ecause readers don't have any way to realize that they're reading an old = version. >=20 > Really? When I tried with your draft -03, the links to updated draf= ts gave 404 errors. >=20 > > I haven't dug into which tools would need to change to provide su= ch links. Probably both xml2rfc and the datatracker itself? Are there iss= ues with the /archive/ path segment that might imply these files can neve= r change to incorporate the fact that the latest available version does c= hange? >=20 > afaik, if your xml (v3) looks like this: >=20 > >=20 > the html rendering will point to the current version at the time th= e xml file is converted, but via the tools server. The top bar there give= s you the versions up to date. There's also a link to the tracker. >=20 > (That will have to be changed of course when tools.ietf.org goes away.) >=20 > Looking at your -04 draft, that's exactly how it is, so whatever ca= used the wrong links in the -03 draft seems to have been fixed already. >=20 >=20 > I think you might have confused the htmlized=C2=A0version (https://data= tracker.ietf.org/doc/html/draft-yasskin-wpack-bundled-exchanges-04), whic= h has the cross-links I want, with the native-HTML version (https://www.i= etf.org/archive/id/draft-yasskin-wpack-bundled-exchanges-04.html) that ha= s better typesetting and table of contents, but is missing the cross-link= s I mentioned above. I still don't understand what you want. The htmlized version has links to= https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/html/draft-yasskin-wpack-use-cases-01= and https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-yasskin-wpack-use-cases-01 which are essentially identical. The native HTML version links only to th= e second one, but I'm at a loss to see what's missing. > I'm not sure where the mention of came from, as it's not i= n my XML version at all (https://www.ietf.org/archive/id/draft-yasskin-wp= ack-bundled-exchanges-04.xml). Well, that's just the short way to encode I-D references in xml2rfcv3. It= looks as if kramdown does it a more noisy way. I guess it's irrelevant. Regards Brian From nobody Wed Mar 10 21:55:04 2021 Return-Path: X-Original-To: tools-discuss@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: tools-discuss@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8DBDB3A1152 for ; Wed, 10 Mar 2021 21:55:02 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.92 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.92 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_H3=-0.01, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_WL=-0.01, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id BDdhFEUb--PR for ; Wed, 10 Mar 2021 21:54:59 -0800 (PST) Received: from gabriel-vm-2.zfn.uni-bremen.de (gabriel-vm-2.zfn.uni-bremen.de [134.102.50.17]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher AECDH-AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 93DB23A114C for ; Wed, 10 Mar 2021 21:54:59 -0800 (PST) Received: from [192.168.217.152] (p5089a828.dip0.t-ipconnect.de [80.137.168.40]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by gabriel-vm-2.zfn.uni-bremen.de (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 4Dwyp83JpxzyXj; Thu, 11 Mar 2021 06:54:56 +0100 (CET) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Mime-Version: 1.0 (Mac OS X Mail 14.0 \(3654.60.0.2.21\)) From: Carsten Bormann In-Reply-To: Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2021 06:54:56 +0100 Cc: Jeffrey Yasskin , Jeffrey Yasskin , Tools Discussion Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Message-Id: <928CEB5D-42ED-4054-A0A7-EDBDFC39FD78@tzi.org> References: <1db89591-3852-4b6e-8c7b-0e9407409edf@gmail.com> To: Brian E Carpenter X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.3654.60.0.2.21) Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Tools-discuss] Links from HTML I-Ds to datatracker/latest versions X-BeenThere: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF Tools Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2021 05:55:03 -0000 I think this discussion is currently confused about the links that are = in a document to different documents vs. the desire for links that point = to a document with links to its status and current versions. It is the latter that need to be fixed, and then it will be easy to = include these links to get the former. Gr=C3=BC=C3=9Fe, Carsten From nobody Wed Mar 10 22:06:35 2021 Return-Path: X-Original-To: tools-discuss@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: tools-discuss@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 767B43A11AB for ; Wed, 10 Mar 2021 22:06:33 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -4.22 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-4.22 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-2.3, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_H3=-0.01, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_WL=-0.01, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id MF4K9Aqi1R1T for ; Wed, 10 Mar 2021 22:06:30 -0800 (PST) Received: from gabriel-vm-2.zfn.uni-bremen.de (gabriel-vm-2.zfn.uni-bremen.de [134.102.50.17]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher AECDH-AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 4B4663A11A7 for ; Wed, 10 Mar 2021 22:06:30 -0800 (PST) Received: from [192.168.217.152] (p5089a828.dip0.t-ipconnect.de [80.137.168.40]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by gabriel-vm-2.zfn.uni-bremen.de (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 4Dwz3S46vnzyWB; Thu, 11 Mar 2021 07:06:28 +0100 (CET) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Mime-Version: 1.0 (Mac OS X Mail 14.0 \(3654.60.0.2.21\)) From: Carsten Bormann In-Reply-To: <92482c20-f2fe-48c4-2f44-d025158b143f@gmail.com> Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2021 07:06:28 +0100 Cc: Julian Reschke , tools-discuss@ietf.org Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Message-Id: <56D36418-D189-45FC-8F40-94371EEAD21B@tzi.org> References: <6F352681-9B00-4B7C-BC9E-DF1D0905C48B@gmail.com> <92482c20-f2fe-48c4-2f44-d025158b143f@gmail.com> To: Brian E Carpenter X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.3654.60.0.2.21) Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Tools-discuss] Request to retain kramdown compiler and author stats X-BeenThere: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF Tools Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2021 06:06:34 -0000 On 10. Mar 2021, at 21:12, Brian E Carpenter = wrote: >=20 > On 11-Mar-21 04:16, Julian Reschke wrote: > ...> I'm running kramdown and xml2rfc just fine on Cygwin. And I'm = pretty >> sure that WSL (Windows Subsytem for Linux) will even do better... >=20 > Why would I want to invest in that learning curve (or the GitHub one) > when the web service is just so much easier to use? Fortunately the = plan > includes the web service anyway. That depends on your personal workflow. Some people like to be able to do a =E2=80=9Cmake=E2=80=9D (usually = mapped to a single key press) and get a result without further ado = within sub-seconds; this enables editing on the source and = near-simultaneously seeing one form of the result (usually the HTML form = these days). This requires a local installation and some caching of = dependencies. (Why is that a good thing? There is a certain fatigue that sets in when = one edits a document; seeing the same information in a different form = can surmount that fatigue. This is a rarely recognized reason for why = documents that are edited in a non-WYSIWYG environment turn out better = than WYSIWYG results, but it requires both forms to be readable =E2=80=94 = one more reason for the interest in humane markup such as markdown.) Gr=C3=BC=C3=9Fe, Carsten From nobody Thu Mar 11 00:01:39 2021 Return-Path: X-Original-To: tools-discuss@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: tools-discuss@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2E9993A0E66 for ; Thu, 11 Mar 2021 00:01:38 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.099 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.099 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (1024-bit key) header.d=eggert.org Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id FYWxbAeJsxRD for ; Thu, 11 Mar 2021 00:01:36 -0800 (PST) Received: from mail.eggert.org (mail.eggert.org [IPv6:2a00:ac00:4000:400:211:32ff:fe22:186f]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 678F53A03FC for ; Thu, 11 Mar 2021 00:01:36 -0800 (PST) Received: from [IPv6:2a00:ac00:4000:400:29b9:a500:a909:88e0] (unknown [IPv6:2a00:ac00:4000:400:29b9:a500:a909:88e0]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by mail.eggert.org (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id E1893600314; Thu, 11 Mar 2021 10:01:25 +0200 (EET) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/simple; d=eggert.org; s=dkim; t=1615449685; bh=h4o4O4HmAu8j6n2Yp23FhYD6zs93qsAsGrDuj0WnoiQ=; h=From:Subject:Date:In-Reply-To:Cc:To:References; b=hRT45Dm40HRg/r92Bbd+M6oy4Rgyj1UMTl5MQQSb/S0Ce+GTp1zVRs2PGsp39R0rj zyjmRkinfD747gaL/c/fydV6fK2LGzioVOJ8mOb0DDwW6YORuNN5QDbvmlH36lAuOi 5lMH+GxrzT+tehSYU/rhnuE3dCET7mGT5F1ToT9E= From: Lars Eggert Message-Id: <698B1E92-F96A-4912-81DA-33BF44633FE1@eggert.org> Content-Type: multipart/signed; boundary="Apple-Mail=_08B32B78-E7F7-4EC9-952C-9FCB90178D71"; protocol="application/pgp-signature"; micalg=pgp-sha512 Mime-Version: 1.0 (Mac OS X Mail 14.0 \(3654.60.0.2.21\)) Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2021 10:01:23 +0200 In-Reply-To: <56D36418-D189-45FC-8F40-94371EEAD21B@tzi.org> Cc: Brian E Carpenter , Julian Reschke , tools-discuss@ietf.org To: Carsten Bormann References: <6F352681-9B00-4B7C-BC9E-DF1D0905C48B@gmail.com> <92482c20-f2fe-48c4-2f44-d025158b143f@gmail.com> <56D36418-D189-45FC-8F40-94371EEAD21B@tzi.org> X-MailScanner-ID: E1893600314.A25A1 X-MailScanner: Found to be clean X-MailScanner-From: lars@eggert.org Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Tools-discuss] Request to retain kramdown compiler and author stats X-BeenThere: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF Tools Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2021 08:01:38 -0000 --Apple-Mail=_08B32B78-E7F7-4EC9-952C-9FCB90178D71 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Hi, On 2021-3-11, at 8:06, Carsten Bormann wrote: > Some people like to be able to do a =E2=80=9Cmake=E2=80=9D (usually = mapped to a single key press) and get a result without further ado = within sub-seconds; this enables editing on the source and = near-simultaneously seeing one form of the result (usually the HTML form = these days). This requires a local installation and some caching of = dependencies. if you have Docker installed, you do not need to install anything else = if you do things as described here: = https://github.com/larseggert/i-d-toolchain The command is slightly longer than "make", but I guess you could create = an alias and/or a shell script if you wanted to. Thanks, Lars --Apple-Mail=_08B32B78-E7F7-4EC9-952C-9FCB90178D71 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: attachment; filename=signature.asc Content-Type: application/pgp-signature; name=signature.asc Content-Description: Message signed with OpenPGP -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- iQIzBAEBCgAdFiEEmpq0ZpSoejRmyhheVLXDCb9wwVcFAmBJzlMACgkQVLXDCb9w wVeTBQ//fJvr54ZCitK8RI161sKXo4AI8IHyCq6GhkkwwRoEkuOo1Vgjz6NWf4rC jBZZblFZe4kZvpM7VkNK0+HynAW+Bvn0EahMoD/UohLWGanBd8nyPLp8fhFzAL4b zQC7RT4KTyDtjoKZJ+wmDa22ijAbGxn1ywwKg62YudG5fhKKioXgmfYSuH17xm6n Ggmdfae6K09ZFWIjAwSWkqHKsHvwoeS5DeXg+yOSuauUiZeOy/nwF3lcqccIofwI +6gEyVxGgPyt/mtWC4tlfy07y6CwKSUGIhvg86PQw5LMXnf21nxNQUT5pi3/KtLy v2t3xJ3zkYV1vhvALgoEOBvjhebXNfs7GrIx45EDb2x6o+2yrOG1wh94ujVY03FL moHLBwbFkQwWfOmxkphcl9wxBe42qzghFik1K5CpS5QmgZwPBaBxe9Rb2WdlJ90N aA8AbZhZY/pSob9nLe2zsEc8irInYTbE137LKH77u3i45HacKLaLAnCSBwrIFNH7 NFYFe0LtmTos/eAaARr0TRXndRrPAMAFKAev6EzsxC0dWYerZONg4OkN9gWx+NHn s6dSO4fgZcuRQayMc3ThS6W1SraScH2Nq1H15rMYZtN0NvwO3Qif9VX9BnT3rDba 1gJ+bPkLXWfszMVedk9VmMrprKQmmPpo84Su0RJqw6McDal49Lk= =6okM -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --Apple-Mail=_08B32B78-E7F7-4EC9-952C-9FCB90178D71-- From nobody Thu Mar 11 02:40:54 2021 Return-Path: X-Original-To: tools-discuss@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: tools-discuss@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 78AF73A1891 for ; Thu, 11 Mar 2021 02:40:53 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.097 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.097 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=gmail.com Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id QfvOkTZrxg5S for ; Thu, 11 Mar 2021 02:40:51 -0800 (PST) Received: from mail-io1-xd30.google.com (mail-io1-xd30.google.com [IPv6:2607:f8b0:4864:20::d30]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 9D13C3A1890 for ; Thu, 11 Mar 2021 02:40:51 -0800 (PST) Received: by mail-io1-xd30.google.com with SMTP id f20so21317479ioo.10 for ; 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Thu, 11 Mar 2021 02:40:48 -0800 (PST) MIME-Version: 1.0 References: <6F352681-9B00-4B7C-BC9E-DF1D0905C48B@gmail.com> <92482c20-f2fe-48c4-2f44-d025158b143f@gmail.com> <56D36418-D189-45FC-8F40-94371EEAD21B@tzi.org> <698B1E92-F96A-4912-81DA-33BF44633FE1@eggert.org> In-Reply-To: <698B1E92-F96A-4912-81DA-33BF44633FE1@eggert.org> From: Dhruv Dhody Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2021 16:10:09 +0530 Message-ID: To: Lars Eggert Cc: Carsten Bormann , Julian Reschke , tools-discuss@ietf.org Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="000000000000af3c9005bd406a44" Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Tools-discuss] Request to retain kramdown compiler and author stats X-BeenThere: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF Tools Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2021 10:40:54 -0000 --000000000000af3c9005bd406a44 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Hi Lars, In case this is useful for others who try your toolchain (can be added in readme) =3D=3D I got this error initially when I tried the command! docker: Error response from daemon: Head > https://docker.pkg.github.com/v2/larseggert/i-d-toolchain/i-d-toolchain/m= anifests/latest: > no basic auth credentials To fix this one needs to log into docker using GitHub username and personal access token as a password with read:packages scope. docker login -u $GITHUB_USERNAME -p $GITHUB_TOKEN docker.pkg.github.com Create a token here: https://github.com/settings/tokens/new with read:packages =3D=3D Then I faced this error -> n `read': No such file or directory @ rb_sysopen - > /id/draft-i-d-toolchain-test-00.md (Errno::ENOENT) > from > /usr/lib/ruby/gems/2.7.0/gems/kramdown-rfc2629-1.3.37/bin/kramdown-rfc262= 9:320:in > `' > from /usr/bin/kramdown-rfc2629:23:in `load' > from /usr/bin/kramdown-rfc2629:23:in `
' > *** kramdown-rfc failed, status 1 I realized the file is missing! duh! You do mention the local directory when describing kdrfc, but maybe make it explicit :) =3D=3D After that, it all worked like a charm! Thank you for making this public! =3D=3D I hope this helps anyone who tries it and faces similar errors! Thanks! Dhruv PS. I am on Ubuntu 18.04.5 LTS. On Thu, Mar 11, 2021 at 1:31 PM Lars Eggert wrote: > Hi, > > On 2021-3-11, at 8:06, Carsten Bormann wrote: > > Some people like to be able to do a =E2=80=9Cmake=E2=80=9D (usually map= ped to a single > key press) and get a result without further ado within sub-seconds; this > enables editing on the source and near-simultaneously seeing one form of > the result (usually the HTML form these days). This requires a local > installation and some caching of dependencies. > > if you have Docker installed, you do not need to install anything else if > you do things as described here: > https://github.com/larseggert/i-d-toolchain > > The command is slightly longer than "make", but I guess you could create > an alias and/or a shell script if you wanted to. > > Thanks, > Lars > > ___________________________________________________________ > Tools-discuss mailing list - Tools-discuss@ietf.org > This list is for discussion, not for action requests or bug reports. > * Report datatracker and mailarchive bugs to: datatracker-project@ietf.or= g > * Report tools.ietf.org bugs to: webmaster@tools.ietf.org > * Report all other bugs or issues to: ietf-action@ietf.org > List info (including how to Unsubscribe): > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/tools-discuss > --000000000000af3c9005bd406a44 Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Hi Lars,

In case this is useful for others who try = your toolchain (can be added in readme)

=3D=3D

I = got this error initially when I tried the command!

docker: Error response from daemon: Head <= a href=3D"https://docker.pkg.github.com/v2/larseggert/i-d-toolchain/i-d-too= lchain/manifests/latest">https://docker.pkg.github.com/v2/larseggert/i-d-to= olchain/i-d-toolchain/manifests/latest: no basic auth credentials
To fix this one needs to log into docker using GitHub username a= nd personal access token as a password with read:packages scope.

docker login -u $GITHUB_USER= NAME -p $GITHUB_TOKEN docker.pkg.g= ithub.com

Create a token here: https://github.com/settings/tokens/new with = read:packages

=3D=3D

Then I faced this error ->

n `read': No such file or directory @ rb_sysopen - /id/draft-i-= d-toolchain-test-00.md (Errno::ENOENT)
from /usr/lib/ruby/gems/2.7.0/gem= s/kramdown-rfc2629-1.3.37/bin/kramdown-rfc2629:320:in `<top (required)&g= t;'
from /usr/bin/kramdown-rfc2629:23:in `load'
from /usr/bin= /kramdown-rfc2629:23:in `<main>'
*** kramdown-rfc failed, stat= us 1

I realized the file is missing! duh!
You do mention= the local directory when describing kdrfc, but maybe make it explicit :)

=3D=3D=C2=A0

After that, it all worked like = a charm! Thank you for making this public!

=3D=3D
<= br>I hope this helps anyone who tries it and faces similar errors!

Thanks!
DhruvPS. I am on Ubuntu 18.04.5 LTS.



On Thu, Mar 11= , 2021 at 1:31 PM Lars Eggert <lars@e= ggert.org> wrote:
Hi,

On 2021-3-11, at 8:06, Carsten Bormann <cabo@tzi.org> wrote:
> Some people like to be able to do a =E2=80=9Cmake=E2=80=9D (usually ma= pped to a single key press) and get a result without further ado within sub= -seconds; this enables editing on the source and near-simultaneously seeing= one form of the result (usually the HTML form these days).=C2=A0 This requ= ires a local installation and some caching of dependencies.

if you have Docker installed, you do not need to install anything else if y= ou do things as described here: https://github.com/larseg= gert/i-d-toolchain

The command is slightly longer than "make", but I guess you could= create an alias and/or a shell script if you wanted to.

Thanks,
Lars

___________________________________________________________
Tools-discuss mailing list - Tools-discuss@ietf.org
This list is for discussion, not for action requests or bug reports.
* Report datatracker and mailarchive bugs to: datatracker-project@ietf.org
* Report tools.ietf.org bugs to: webmaster@tools.ietf.org
* Report all other bugs or issues to: ietf-action@ietf.org
List info (including how to Unsubscribe): https:/= /www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/tools-discuss
--000000000000af3c9005bd406a44-- From nobody Thu Mar 11 06:09:03 2021 Return-Path: X-Original-To: tools-discuss@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: tools-discuss@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 615C53A0DBE for ; Thu, 11 Mar 2021 06:09:01 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.097 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.097 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=gmail.com Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id UZm2pivUCOPV for ; Thu, 11 Mar 2021 06:08:59 -0800 (PST) Received: from mail-qt1-x830.google.com (mail-qt1-x830.google.com [IPv6:2607:f8b0:4864:20::830]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 456303A0DBC for ; Thu, 11 Mar 2021 06:08:59 -0800 (PST) Received: by mail-qt1-x830.google.com with SMTP id s2so1175607qtx.10 for ; Thu, 11 Mar 2021 06:08:59 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20161025; h=mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date:message-id:subject:to :cc; bh=+7c7Ee9MUvs1J2/ffAN2Ji86XoC98wCUDJzo+6bfBbg=; b=vUsxaPYogd8JEtWYmQTbsCfqDbOuagYb9gx+AHYzsYwoLJgZJIM6kN2S1ALwRqm+f4 rY6ldqkkM4B9XHD9ey7scQA+gZLR8NNr3Uo8rWA1kD9pyyV0OxJK1+Q5JAY1VWr+kVq+ jtexzdgb+sgjEK98jNtMXq4utdIH+g5ppFn1NJ0t4BojLglrRxxP14BRobzOT70g1f/M MTKjnmePJyphbiwABsJc6/z9N8iGv+1spaiwCe7OnF3JKrOLNYue5Exh9O8Bxd89a7q8 yff5ON1ZaFyaMuuxq0Okc+eu+OYVBrkVTKSVJDDX8sPdSMNNXdlByEqQdzOk0zt0X0jM rq7Q== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date :message-id:subject:to:cc; bh=+7c7Ee9MUvs1J2/ffAN2Ji86XoC98wCUDJzo+6bfBbg=; b=Y5IlINGXirEnYTFrQNI4zBv5XEsygrod8ZLQuN6AnaQDdPdIgXdfhAoqly3dZ3FgTe WVUzFg+CnRGjOimjeoLH6N8mAXoqZrLA3/i7gZTW8YBjP5PZMm2McKpeEymZfGRFpKtZ 1rds0cTPkOD+bo0d9Vhof2HxR6N0H2Wu0CHRHmP+HGDGea9ja94PVVo1UpcZHeqlYBqe 50KwcM8DBkQrZRbzGUSmUexwE7tROocFH2Y+mHpwzTtfTso/2Q9fjKySYSg2uM0Iw3CR v6SuqyHidj8ccls5opR0Z7EUVV5dh8wrZiR5vHGcD/Ol5DYcPKUJ5kwm4O2HqZGa4zpt ZUWg== X-Gm-Message-State: AOAM531+HfHYGpclo1JqN/XG+2Q0Rsts+hy3iswxyuIk/eS5CIcpRiFq xZ/tGP+DYVC9H24Nqqpa/cYKZ3veJouREJmnCsI= X-Google-Smtp-Source: ABdhPJwSUrTi7wSlpXR+66KPvlt/RENR86fwIL6wcC5+Yl5YiIwc4s+0xAgbDJDgalRNzbuJgu9JBV3qQQpN8d0Vup4= X-Received: by 2002:ac8:44cc:: with SMTP id b12mr7393467qto.382.1615471738113; Thu, 11 Mar 2021 06:08:58 -0800 (PST) MIME-Version: 1.0 References: In-Reply-To: From: "Andrew G. Malis" Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2021 09:08:41 -0500 Message-ID: To: Robert Sparks Cc: tools-discuss , Carsten Bormann Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="000000000000192aff05bd43530f" Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Tools-discuss] Clarifying the state of and the transition plan for tools.ietf.org X-BeenThere: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF Tools Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2021 14:09:01 -0000 --000000000000192aff05bd43530f Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Robert, Are you also porting the tools at https://xml2rfc.tools.ietf.org/experimental.html , especially the online version of KramDown? Thanks, Andy On Tue, Mar 9, 2021 at 1:16 PM Robert Sparks wrote: > The services at tools.ietf.org are undergoing a transition. > > As most of you know Henrik Levkowetz has retired. He is continuing to > support > the services that he has provided for decades at tools.ietf.org on a best > effort basis as we transition the essential features to LLC supported > platforms. The plan is to finish the transition before IETF 111 and wind > tools.ietf.org down. > > The process of moving these features has been ongoing for several years. > Most have already been moved, but a few important ones remain. > > We have recently moved the tools.ietf.org style of presenting htmlized > text > documents into the Datatracker. The plan is to redirect those pages from > tools.ietf.org into the Datatracker soon. > > We will be replacing the online xml2rfc and bibxml services with modern > rewrites of the existing services. > > We are transitioning the svn/trac source repositories for the Datatracker > and xml2rfc to the IETF Secretariat, with a longer term goal of moving them > to GitHub. > > At the beginning of this meeting, we identified that the ability to add to > individual sessions (as opposed to all sessions of a group) to a > subscribable > calendar needs to be added to the Datatracker. > > We will look again to identify any other features that need to be moved. > But as > you notice features at tools.ietf.org that are important but can't find > at the > Datatracker, please send a note either to me or to tools-discuss@ietf.org. > > Henrik and I communicate frequently, and he is supporting us with this > transition on a best effort basis, but tools.ietf.org is not getting as > much of > his time as we have become accustomed to in the past. Please be patient > with us > during the next few months. > > As you identify issues with tools.ietf.org, please email Henrik or let > me know, > and I will bring them to Henrik's attention. In general, neither the IETF > Secretariat nor the tools team can address issues at tools.ietf.org > directly. > Our focus will be on moving functionality to platforms like the > Datatracker. > > I would like to express my gratitude for all of the support Henrik has > provided > to the community over the last couple of decades. Early on, long before we > started projects like the Datatracker, he set up several tools on his > own that > became very popular with the community. During this time, the domain > tools.ietf.org > was delegated to him, and he used it to gather the volunteer created > tooling from > many contributors. > > As the community grew, we began hosting more services at the IETF > Secretariat. > During Russ Housley's tenure as IETF Chair, the tools team, under the > IOAC's > direction, began moving essential services to IETF Secretariat-supported > platforms. Through donated and contracted time, Henrik has been helping > make > these transitions as an ongoing process. But tools.ietf.org continued to > be a > set of services that he maintained and improved primarily by himself or > through > coordinating other volunteer effort. > > Of course, Henrik was also a principal architect and contributor for the > Datatracker and xml2rfc, and we are richer for all of his hard work over > decades on so many tools. > > -- > > Robert Sparks > > Tools Team chair > > --000000000000192aff05bd43530f Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Robert,

Are you also porting the tools = at=C2=A0https:= //xml2rfc.tools.ietf.org/experimental.html , especially the online vers= ion of KramDown?

Thanks,
Andy
=

On Tue, Mar 9, 2021 at 1:16 PM Robert Sparks <rjsparks@nostrum.com> wrote:
The services at tools.ietf.org = are undergoing a transition.

As most of you know Henrik Levkowetz has retired. He is continuing to
support
the services that he has provided for decades at tools.ietf.org on a best effort basis as we transition the essential features to LLC supported
platforms. The plan is to finish the transition before IETF 111 and wind tool= s.ietf.org down.

The process of moving these features has been ongoing for several years. Most have already been moved, but a few important ones remain.

We have recently moved the tools.ietf.org style of presenting htmlized text=
documents into the Datatracker. The plan is to redirect those pages from tool= s.ietf.org into the Datatracker soon.

We will be replacing the online xml2rfc and bibxml services with modern
rewrites of the existing services.

We are transitioning the svn/trac source repositories for the Datatracker and xml2rfc to the IETF Secretariat, with a longer term goal of moving them=
to GitHub.

At the beginning of this meeting, we identified that the ability to add to<= br> individual sessions (as opposed to all sessions of a group) to a
subscribable
calendar needs to be added to the Datatracker.

We will look again to identify any other features that need to be moved. But as
you notice features at tools.ietf.org that are important but can't find=
at the
Datatracker, please send a note either to me or to tools-discuss@ietf.org.

Henrik and I communicate frequently, and he is supporting us with this
transition on a best effort basis, but tools.ietf.org is not getting as much of
his time as we have become accustomed to in the past. Please be patient with us
during the next few months.

As you identify issues with tools.ietf.org, please email Henrik or let
me know,
and I will bring them to Henrik's attention.=C2=A0 In general, neither = the IETF
Secretariat nor the tools team can address issues at tools.ietf.org
directly.
Our focus will be on moving functionality to platforms like the Datatracker= .

I would like to express my gratitude for all of the support Henrik has
provided
to the community over the last couple of decades. Early on, long before we<= br> started projects like the Datatracker, he set up several tools on his
own that
became very popular with the community. During this time, the domain
tool= s.ietf.org
was delegated to him, and he used it to gather the volunteer created
tooling from
many contributors.

As the community grew, we began hosting more services at the IETF
Secretariat.
During Russ Housley's tenure as IETF Chair, the tools team, under the I= OAC's
direction, began moving essential services to IETF Secretariat-supported platforms. Through donated and contracted time, Henrik has been helping mak= e
these transitions as an ongoing process. But tools.ietf.org continued to be a
set of services that he maintained and improved primarily by himself or through
coordinating other volunteer effort.

Of course, Henrik was also a principal architect and contributor for the Datatracker and xml2rfc, and we are richer for all of his hard work over decades on so many tools.

--

Robert Sparks

Tools Team chair

--000000000000192aff05bd43530f-- From nobody Thu Mar 11 06:10:22 2021 Return-Path: X-Original-To: tools-discuss@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: tools-discuss@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4E5133A0DC4 for ; Thu, 11 Mar 2021 06:10:20 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.079 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.079 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, NICE_REPLY_A=-0.001, T_SPF_HELO_PERMERROR=0.01, T_SPF_PERMERROR=0.01, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (1024-bit key) header.d=nostrum.com Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 0paPggiGprUf for ; Thu, 11 Mar 2021 06:10:18 -0800 (PST) Received: from nostrum.com (raven-v6.nostrum.com [IPv6:2001:470:d:1130::1]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 2F39E3A0DC2 for ; Thu, 11 Mar 2021 06:10:18 -0800 (PST) Received: from unformal.local ([47.186.1.92]) (authenticated bits=0) by nostrum.com (8.16.1/8.16.1) with ESMTPSA id 12BEABgv087549 (version=TLSv1.3 cipher=TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 bits=256 verify=NO); Thu, 11 Mar 2021 08:10:11 -0600 (CST) (envelope-from rjsparks@nostrum.com) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=simple/simple; d=nostrum.com; s=default; t=1615471812; bh=dfl7xaLyV0xewEf9zrLtQP1sCTucwjwmq4kTOxwja78=; h=Subject:To:Cc:References:From:Date:In-Reply-To; b=L1oheBA/tlgI/ryB7pKBZ4zvSxPiWD3eflPpxBNq4djKWSuVw5LHM3m07hbojNSjb WnZOoSnOmWiozvOxNw0faSfZZlMKyknSCwds4gMXTvDhOhGWgHnnI/9dZgbsJgDhi7 MYPdhb1P6ptgDHTz2Ldf3/vgjJE07tMBB+znmbHg= X-Authentication-Warning: raven.nostrum.com: Host [47.186.1.92] claimed to be unformal.local To: "Andrew G. Malis" Cc: tools-discuss , Carsten Bormann References: From: Robert Sparks Message-ID: Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2021 08:10:06 -0600 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Macintosh; Intel Mac OS X 10.15; rv:78.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/78.8.0 MIME-Version: 1.0 In-Reply-To: Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="------------F3A842BE624631E786046AC9" Content-Language: en-US Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Tools-discuss] Clarifying the state of and the transition plan for tools.ietf.org X-BeenThere: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF Tools Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2021 14:10:20 -0000 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --------------F3A842BE624631E786046AC9 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit On 3/11/21 8:08 AM, Andrew G. Malis wrote: > Robert, > > Are you also porting the tools at > https://xml2rfc.tools.ietf.org/experimental.html > , especially the > online version of KramDown? Yes, the planned replacement online xml2rfc service will have all of those conversions available. > > Thanks, > Andy > > > On Tue, Mar 9, 2021 at 1:16 PM Robert Sparks > wrote: > > The services at tools.ietf.org are > undergoing a transition. > > As most of you know Henrik Levkowetz has retired. He is continuing to > support > the services that he has provided for decades at tools.ietf.org > on a best > effort basis as we transition the essential features to LLC supported > platforms. The plan is to finish the transition before IETF 111 > and wind > tools.ietf.org down. > > The process of moving these features has been ongoing for several > years. > Most have already been moved, but a few important ones remain. > > We have recently moved the tools.ietf.org > style of presenting htmlized text > documents into the Datatracker. The plan is to redirect those > pages from > tools.ietf.org into the Datatracker soon. > > We will be replacing the online xml2rfc and bibxml services with > modern > rewrites of the existing services. > > We are transitioning the svn/trac source repositories for the > Datatracker > and xml2rfc to the IETF Secretariat, with a longer term goal of > moving them > to GitHub. > > At the beginning of this meeting, we identified that the ability > to add to > individual sessions (as opposed to all sessions of a group) to a > subscribable > calendar needs to be added to the Datatracker. > > We will look again to identify any other features that need to be > moved. > But as > you notice features at tools.ietf.org that > are important but can't find > at the > Datatracker, please send a note either to me or to > tools-discuss@ietf.org . > > Henrik and I communicate frequently, and he is supporting us with this > transition on a best effort basis, but tools.ietf.org > is not getting as > much of > his time as we have become accustomed to in the past. Please be > patient > with us > during the next few months. > > As you identify issues with tools.ietf.org > , please email Henrik or let > me know, > and I will bring them to Henrik's attention.  In general, neither > the IETF > Secretariat nor the tools team can address issues at > tools.ietf.org > directly. > Our focus will be on moving functionality to platforms like the > Datatracker. > > I would like to express my gratitude for all of the support Henrik > has > provided > to the community over the last couple of decades. Early on, long > before we > started projects like the Datatracker, he set up several tools on his > own that > became very popular with the community. During this time, the domain > tools.ietf.org > was delegated to him, and he used it to gather the volunteer created > tooling from > many contributors. > > As the community grew, we began hosting more services at the IETF > Secretariat. > During Russ Housley's tenure as IETF Chair, the tools team, under > the IOAC's > direction, began moving essential services to IETF > Secretariat-supported > platforms. Through donated and contracted time, Henrik has been > helping make > these transitions as an ongoing process. But tools.ietf.org > continued to > be a > set of services that he maintained and improved primarily by > himself or > through > coordinating other volunteer effort. > > Of course, Henrik was also a principal architect and contributor > for the > Datatracker and xml2rfc, and we are richer for all of his hard > work over > decades on so many tools. > > -- > > Robert Sparks > > Tools Team chair > --------------F3A842BE624631E786046AC9 Content-Type: text/html; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit


On 3/11/21 8:08 AM, Andrew G. Malis wrote:
Robert,

Are you also porting the tools at https://xml2rfc.tools.ietf.org/experimental.html , especially the online version of KramDown?
Yes, the planned replacement online xml2rfc service will have all of those conversions available.

Thanks,
Andy


On Tue, Mar 9, 2021 at 1:16 PM Robert Sparks <rjsparks@nostrum.com> wrote:
The services at tools.ietf.org are undergoing a transition.

As most of you know Henrik Levkowetz has retired. He is continuing to
support
the services that he has provided for decades at tools.ietf.org on a best
effort basis as we transition the essential features to LLC supported
platforms. The plan is to finish the transition before IETF 111 and wind
tools.ietf.org down.

The process of moving these features has been ongoing for several years.
Most have already been moved, but a few important ones remain.

We have recently moved the tools.ietf.org style of presenting htmlized text
documents into the Datatracker. The plan is to redirect those pages from
tools.ietf.org into the Datatracker soon.

We will be replacing the online xml2rfc and bibxml services with modern
rewrites of the existing services.

We are transitioning the svn/trac source repositories for the Datatracker
and xml2rfc to the IETF Secretariat, with a longer term goal of moving them
to GitHub.

At the beginning of this meeting, we identified that the ability to add to
individual sessions (as opposed to all sessions of a group) to a
subscribable
calendar needs to be added to the Datatracker.

We will look again to identify any other features that need to be moved.
But as
you notice features at tools.ietf.org that are important but can't find
at the
Datatracker, please send a note either to me or to tools-discuss@ietf.org.

Henrik and I communicate frequently, and he is supporting us with this
transition on a best effort basis, but tools.ietf.org is not getting as
much of
his time as we have become accustomed to in the past. Please be patient
with us
during the next few months.

As you identify issues with tools.ietf.org, please email Henrik or let
me know,
and I will bring them to Henrik's attention.  In general, neither the IETF
Secretariat nor the tools team can address issues at tools.ietf.org
directly.
Our focus will be on moving functionality to platforms like the Datatracker.

I would like to express my gratitude for all of the support Henrik has
provided
to the community over the last couple of decades. Early on, long before we
started projects like the Datatracker, he set up several tools on his
own that
became very popular with the community. During this time, the domain
tools.ietf.org
was delegated to him, and he used it to gather the volunteer created
tooling from
many contributors.

As the community grew, we began hosting more services at the IETF
Secretariat.
During Russ Housley's tenure as IETF Chair, the tools team, under the IOAC's
direction, began moving essential services to IETF Secretariat-supported
platforms. Through donated and contracted time, Henrik has been helping make
these transitions as an ongoing process. But tools.ietf.org continued to
be a
set of services that he maintained and improved primarily by himself or
through
coordinating other volunteer effort.

Of course, Henrik was also a principal architect and contributor for the
Datatracker and xml2rfc, and we are richer for all of his hard work over
decades on so many tools.

--

Robert Sparks

Tools Team chair

--------------F3A842BE624631E786046AC9-- From nobody Thu Mar 11 06:21:24 2021 Return-Path: X-Original-To: tools-discuss@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: tools-discuss@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id B95573A0E26 for ; Thu, 11 Mar 2021 06:21:21 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.097 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.097 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE=-0.0001, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=gmail.com Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 7Efp-p2KStbR for ; Thu, 11 Mar 2021 06:21:19 -0800 (PST) Received: from mail-qt1-x82a.google.com (mail-qt1-x82a.google.com [IPv6:2607:f8b0:4864:20::82a]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id C9D8B3A0E25 for ; Thu, 11 Mar 2021 06:21:19 -0800 (PST) Received: by mail-qt1-x82a.google.com with SMTP id j7so1213334qtx.5 for ; Thu, 11 Mar 2021 06:21:19 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20161025; h=mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date:message-id:subject:to :cc; bh=soClGJJH2rASYmyeVu6KXv/xIZIwcximD1vlhlnvU3M=; b=Tqjuql56F1MA83cboZDfpZt8FP/cyo58Npryz8JPLYWESlDg6131aWZVRqd5Mr4GYM TyPKfetv1Tf7RRUjRMWXnmjMLr09qDLBgjdT/AzRsBNfQ0byenGzJdXxjygKTUiCPDtB 4D7cwstT9GDVG3kvR9O08TlExxJOkJUjZJqkPBDMZpZ2BBB+rLCYprTF5NyLflLDM3UZ vyeZPeQo8xlL0BOI/yL84jvjV5/1OnJpSXOHtwZpoMNqEemVXMm3HatWGRUE9sgRqOjL HCaIVs1kxerNXV4njYlDKy6ADD5a6vdQ04ZQzI4Q1PzIsk6bF7+JQWYJkxHQ4q+rpAFR fmPA== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date :message-id:subject:to:cc; bh=soClGJJH2rASYmyeVu6KXv/xIZIwcximD1vlhlnvU3M=; b=svUOeeWXd/p3hn3+lidNz6meGs0ofYasEZdAWuo2v3/lnW3523auXR7cLysdo7huLR CpcCnNzesoVeR2isNdo22gq1s6fJt6+pCF9sme3nkyUzz0qXKpXp99QwmeMK8u9iTMzA 7uZ7reWPD+eVKHaehG8JXEi/G2Hwr0qPksF92TY+Bk/9YedhVSpvf0Jlw3cgZVAU5YwV mbZhIruIk4IkjJ1UnvMkMvapvGBLd/YIEjhYzwJKbDNx7x+lMeWThdTRTGUJhr4juF7V FDXwuu3o8fHjrWFRImfTT9eGINWraMOyl62/fU6Y243HljOOEUkgKATfTGD46JxvUcZj OIdw== X-Gm-Message-State: AOAM533sbUVISzdv4guogNdlJ8MmNA/70QunySJFpu8SrwIkmMMovOTe m+55nVzhMALu2l1kX0z+xOxWlGZ1h5yaxXAhk/EGmpWFWrA= X-Google-Smtp-Source: ABdhPJzHRUXNi7mc+/og/7hrMzLlUsGseKkZP8z9FSjDnOBKK+xk4VK7TRj5q37yI0Clzpd5BAkIrql3GE9l+e5b0W0= X-Received: by 2002:aed:3ae1:: with SMTP id o88mr7354197qte.154.1615472478832; Thu, 11 Mar 2021 06:21:18 -0800 (PST) MIME-Version: 1.0 References: In-Reply-To: From: "Andrew G. Malis" Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2021 09:21:02 -0500 Message-ID: To: Robert Sparks Cc: tools-discuss , Carsten Bormann Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="0000000000003ecb7d05bd437fa2" Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Tools-discuss] Clarifying the state of and the transition plan for tools.ietf.org X-BeenThere: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF Tools Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2021 14:21:22 -0000 --0000000000003ecb7d05bd437fa2 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Robert, Thanks. much appreciated! Cheers, Andy On Thu, Mar 11, 2021 at 9:10 AM Robert Sparks wrote: > > On 3/11/21 8:08 AM, Andrew G. Malis wrote: > > Robert, > > Are you also porting the tools at > https://xml2rfc.tools.ietf.org/experimental.html , especially the online > version of KramDown? > > Yes, the planned replacement online xml2rfc service will have all of those > conversions available. > > > Thanks, > Andy > > > On Tue, Mar 9, 2021 at 1:16 PM Robert Sparks wrote: > >> The services at tools.ietf.org are undergoing a transition. >> >> As most of you know Henrik Levkowetz has retired. He is continuing to >> support >> the services that he has provided for decades at tools.ietf.org on a best >> effort basis as we transition the essential features to LLC supported >> platforms. The plan is to finish the transition before IETF 111 and wind >> tools.ietf.org down. >> >> The process of moving these features has been ongoing for several years. >> Most have already been moved, but a few important ones remain. >> >> We have recently moved the tools.ietf.org style of presenting htmlized >> text >> documents into the Datatracker. The plan is to redirect those pages from >> tools.ietf.org into the Datatracker soon. >> >> We will be replacing the online xml2rfc and bibxml services with modern >> rewrites of the existing services. >> >> We are transitioning the svn/trac source repositories for the Datatracker >> and xml2rfc to the IETF Secretariat, with a longer term goal of moving >> them >> to GitHub. >> >> At the beginning of this meeting, we identified that the ability to add to >> individual sessions (as opposed to all sessions of a group) to a >> subscribable >> calendar needs to be added to the Datatracker. >> >> We will look again to identify any other features that need to be moved. >> But as >> you notice features at tools.ietf.org that are important but can't find >> at the >> Datatracker, please send a note either to me or to tools-discuss@ietf.org >> . >> >> Henrik and I communicate frequently, and he is supporting us with this >> transition on a best effort basis, but tools.ietf.org is not getting as >> much of >> his time as we have become accustomed to in the past. Please be patient >> with us >> during the next few months. >> >> As you identify issues with tools.ietf.org, please email Henrik or let >> me know, >> and I will bring them to Henrik's attention. In general, neither the IETF >> Secretariat nor the tools team can address issues at tools.ietf.org >> directly. >> Our focus will be on moving functionality to platforms like the >> Datatracker. >> >> I would like to express my gratitude for all of the support Henrik has >> provided >> to the community over the last couple of decades. Early on, long before we >> started projects like the Datatracker, he set up several tools on his >> own that >> became very popular with the community. During this time, the domain >> tools.ietf.org >> was delegated to him, and he used it to gather the volunteer created >> tooling from >> many contributors. >> >> As the community grew, we began hosting more services at the IETF >> Secretariat. >> During Russ Housley's tenure as IETF Chair, the tools team, under the >> IOAC's >> direction, began moving essential services to IETF Secretariat-supported >> platforms. Through donated and contracted time, Henrik has been helping >> make >> these transitions as an ongoing process. But tools.ietf.org continued to >> be a >> set of services that he maintained and improved primarily by himself or >> through >> coordinating other volunteer effort. >> >> Of course, Henrik was also a principal architect and contributor for the >> Datatracker and xml2rfc, and we are richer for all of his hard work over >> decades on so many tools. >> >> -- >> >> Robert Sparks >> >> Tools Team chair >> >> --0000000000003ecb7d05bd437fa2 Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Robert,

Thanks. much appreciated!
=

Cheers,
Andy


On Thu, Mar = 11, 2021 at 9:10 AM Robert Sparks <rjsparks@nostrum.com> wrote:
=20 =20 =20


On 3/11/21 8:08 AM, Andrew G. Malis wrote:
=20
Robert,

Are you also porting the tools at=C2=A0https://xml2rfc.too= ls.ietf.org/experimental.html , especially the online version of KramDown?
Yes, the planned replacement online xml2rfc service will have all of those conversions available.

Thanks,
Andy


On Tue, Mar 9, 2021 at 1:16 P= M Robert Sparks <rjsparks@nostrum.com> wrote:
The services at tools.ietf.org are undergoing a transition.

As most of you know Henrik Levkowetz has retired. He is continuing to
support
the services that he has provided for decades at tools.ietf.org o= n a best
effort basis as we transition the essential features to LLC supported
platforms. The plan is to finish the transition before IETF 111 and wind
tools.ietf.org down.

The process of moving these features has been ongoing for several years.
Most have already been moved, but a few important ones remain.
We have recently moved the tools.ietf.org style of presenting htmlized text
documents into the Datatracker. The plan is to redirect those pages from
tools.ietf.org into the Datatracker soon.

We will be replacing the online xml2rfc and bibxml services with modern
rewrites of the existing services.

We are transitioning the svn/trac source repositories for the Datatracker
and xml2rfc to the IETF Secretariat, with a longer term goal of moving them
to GitHub.

At the beginning of this meeting, we identified that the ability to add to
individual sessions (as opposed to all sessions of a group) to a
subscribable
calendar needs to be added to the Datatracker.

We will look again to identify any other features that need to be moved.
But as
you notice features at tools.ietf.org that are important but can't find
at the
Datatracker, please send a note either to me or to tools-discuss@ietf.org.
Henrik and I communicate frequently, and he is supporting us with this
transition on a best effort basis, but tools.ietf.org is not getting as
much of
his time as we have become accustomed to in the past. Please be patient
with us
during the next few months.

As you identify issues with tools.ietf.org, please email Henrik or let
me know,
and I will bring them to Henrik's attention.=C2=A0 In general= , neither the IETF
Secretariat nor the tools team can address issues at tools.ietf.org
directly.
Our focus will be on moving functionality to platforms like the Datatracker.

I would like to express my gratitude for all of the support Henrik has
provided
to the community over the last couple of decades. Early on, long before we
started projects like the Datatracker, he set up several tools on his
own that
became very popular with the community. During this time, the domain
tools.ietf.org
was delegated to him, and he used it to gather the volunteer created
tooling from
many contributors.

As the community grew, we began hosting more services at the IETF
Secretariat.
During Russ Housley's tenure as IETF Chair, the tools team, under the IOAC's
direction, began moving essential services to IETF Secretariat-supported
platforms. Through donated and contracted time, Henrik has been helping make
these transitions as an ongoing process. But tools.ietf.org continued to
be a
set of services that he maintained and improved primarily by himself or
through
coordinating other volunteer effort.

Of course, Henrik was also a principal architect and contributor for the
Datatracker and xml2rfc, and we are richer for all of his hard work over
decades on so many tools.

--

Robert Sparks

Tools Team chair

--0000000000003ecb7d05bd437fa2-- From nobody Thu Mar 11 12:08:03 2021 Return-Path: X-Original-To: tools-discuss@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: tools-discuss@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id C50543A1139 for ; Thu, 11 Mar 2021 12:08:02 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.099 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.099 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, NICE_REPLY_A=-0.001, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=gmail.com Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id ko7rq-CXfJl8 for ; Thu, 11 Mar 2021 12:08:01 -0800 (PST) Received: from mail-pl1-x634.google.com (mail-pl1-x634.google.com [IPv6:2607:f8b0:4864:20::634]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id BB6A93A1137 for ; Thu, 11 Mar 2021 12:08:01 -0800 (PST) Received: by mail-pl1-x634.google.com with SMTP id q12so308107plr.1 for ; Thu, 11 Mar 2021 12:08:01 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20161025; h=subject:to:cc:references:from:message-id:date:user-agent :mime-version:in-reply-to:content-language:content-transfer-encoding; bh=rkNmh5xsZXzP8yLaizQ2fRu9U041E1tA/cam3MOfY7c=; b=DpRxhmf2zkT4MEO8NOzmY3oUEKcYDxLpiVpmuAPknQWB1oGnfpVGFfkH5KbOYh3vnv oY9FVF8TMgwMf8EUnElOj/vJTkCRdgngxs49IxRyOi8SBA7e5oztYocWzIDrKMrrGKL7 jGLzm53QFC8VSDG7sbUzdzuh5TRnoxyJM4hGQtfFwcoCHm6IQ3597lqXwexBhIJHvvMe 2vePicZtlItB+HAElusuFq5aa179OxFFNJhBBklnGx8qBF3lgOlJM9AFd3KYF+ZiTbGu fMYY6/YAada1C4Aa6VRILciER0LotTpFjz6VjmxxDOijIBJUB+g2+RGSBn+cjznDCvTT zjpQ== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:subject:to:cc:references:from:message-id:date :user-agent:mime-version:in-reply-to:content-language :content-transfer-encoding; bh=rkNmh5xsZXzP8yLaizQ2fRu9U041E1tA/cam3MOfY7c=; b=uQTxCEZhL7NU7M+XrYWTHpG8txO564Lge2xlPykR7tKihECakTHdYYwA1dfkulPq9M HMyhS6aGyKwVWHDawIQxW2A5oTC8rXdexBX8WWtKdya9cKqOjRamHx4toimKcJvXdxqe s0/njEtks8IZMcggg+SQZzRb11RH7yCNOD/y2mCcq9Fepg3CXPaRGrB00GEwLT30xKPu agaxFWHkkFTrOpyjAF1sTk5JzS3gekHq5Ej1qoKt5irCbYrtKO6oPMvMfPx6TzF7Y0ET uOutLGHtWUJQSHjRK78fZsxUPZpPPv4AZL5Q4C6pgc1crzJGUFqTwdhlD6zI3Ov/CIPQ Np/A== X-Gm-Message-State: AOAM533AK4Erxf+ZlgvxFDb3VevSZK4ja0vLnguCm48cm9KIrlxZqOkC /2fwUZlJRAg26PNVkkaZ7q8FpIBKy47vTA== X-Google-Smtp-Source: ABdhPJywjlSRGIuDnFrXV2TFPsJ+8EhBvZolst2/uCE2mkneLxKWRftZ1tZdte+TnxDpkybUbnjNwA== X-Received: by 2002:a17:902:463:b029:e4:c045:4831 with SMTP id 90-20020a1709020463b02900e4c0454831mr9791173ple.34.1615493280063; Thu, 11 Mar 2021 12:08:00 -0800 (PST) Received: from [192.168.178.20] ([151.210.131.28]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id nk3sm3099119pjb.17.2021.03.11.12.07.57 (version=TLS1_2 cipher=ECDHE-ECDSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 bits=128/128); Thu, 11 Mar 2021 12:07:59 -0800 (PST) To: Lars Eggert , Carsten Bormann Cc: Julian Reschke , tools-discuss@ietf.org References: <6F352681-9B00-4B7C-BC9E-DF1D0905C48B@gmail.com> <92482c20-f2fe-48c4-2f44-d025158b143f@gmail.com> <56D36418-D189-45FC-8F40-94371EEAD21B@tzi.org> <698B1E92-F96A-4912-81DA-33BF44633FE1@eggert.org> From: Brian E Carpenter Message-ID: <9397bb38-8897-50d4-87f0-dfddfaeb1c9f@gmail.com> Date: Fri, 12 Mar 2021 09:07:56 +1300 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows NT 10.0; WOW64; rv:60.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/60.9.1 MIME-Version: 1.0 In-Reply-To: <698B1E92-F96A-4912-81DA-33BF44633FE1@eggert.org> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Language: en-US Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Tools-discuss] Request to retain kramdown compiler and author stats X-BeenThere: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF Tools Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2021 20:08:03 -0000 On 11-Mar-21 21:01, Lars Eggert wrote: > Hi, >=20 > On 2021-3-11, at 8:06, Carsten Bormann wrote: >> Some people like to be able to do a =E2=80=9Cmake=E2=80=9D (usually ma= pped to a single key press) and get a result without further ado within s= ub-seconds; this enables editing on the source and near-simultaneously se= eing one form of the result (usually the HTML form these days). This req= uires a local installation and some caching of dependencies. >=20 > if you have Docker installed, you do not need to install anything else = if you do things as described here: https://github.com/larseggert/i-d-too= lchain Is that going to work if I install docker on Windows 10? =20 > The command is slightly longer than "make", but I guess you could creat= e an alias and/or a shell script if you wanted to. None of which beats the convenience of a web service, IMHO. Also, since w= e're talking elsewhere about making the IETF more inviting for newcomers,= don't forget that a large fraction of the engineering population expects= an installable Windows application. (That's something GitHub got right, = in fact: GitHub Desktop rocks.) Regards Brian From nobody Thu Mar 11 12:10:38 2021 Return-Path: X-Original-To: tools-discuss@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: tools-discuss@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7C93D3A1154 for ; Thu, 11 Mar 2021 12:10:36 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.099 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.099 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (1024-bit key) header.d=eggert.org Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id h5Ei-wGztOyY for ; Thu, 11 Mar 2021 12:10:35 -0800 (PST) Received: from mail.eggert.org (mail.eggert.org [IPv6:2a00:ac00:4000:400:211:32ff:fe22:186f]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id E46A93A1157 for ; Thu, 11 Mar 2021 12:10:34 -0800 (PST) Received: from [IPv6:2a00:ac00:4000:400:78ee:ae78:bc5f:e4c0] (unknown [IPv6:2a00:ac00:4000:400:78ee:ae78:bc5f:e4c0]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by mail.eggert.org (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id D4EEB600314; Thu, 11 Mar 2021 22:10:25 +0200 (EET) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/simple; d=eggert.org; s=dkim; t=1615493425; bh=2AM/UbueG7nJCzG6CePAr5kM9zUU2RvZmsGoxUO0H88=; h=From:Subject:Date:In-Reply-To:Cc:To:References; b=Mncuw2nKXMsNyHuWdbfAvr7wSRP8OTCMI2izXqph4Dekd/6rMGiHP88lH2vqEEsX/ bdgcNgZ9nt8DO8e2pKHxrTlGR2rOwlMJzNL9jEFZ+A+M50LsFv6xXTdM4hkuPG2zhp aR5KLOqZ8lEJiIaWfTTyzBVZocerSw7cYvCKWCFo= From: Lars Eggert Message-Id: <50CBE8D0-9979-44F6-AFB2-71F5CFBC0751@eggert.org> Content-Type: multipart/signed; boundary="Apple-Mail=_E673D5E1-F7FF-4282-AA84-C2424348D053"; protocol="application/pgp-signature"; micalg=pgp-sha512 Mime-Version: 1.0 (Mac OS X Mail 14.0 \(3654.60.0.2.21\)) Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2021 22:10:23 +0200 In-Reply-To: <9397bb38-8897-50d4-87f0-dfddfaeb1c9f@gmail.com> Cc: Carsten Bormann , Julian Reschke , tools-discuss@ietf.org To: Brian E Carpenter References: <6F352681-9B00-4B7C-BC9E-DF1D0905C48B@gmail.com> <92482c20-f2fe-48c4-2f44-d025158b143f@gmail.com> <56D36418-D189-45FC-8F40-94371EEAD21B@tzi.org> <698B1E92-F96A-4912-81DA-33BF44633FE1@eggert.org> <9397bb38-8897-50d4-87f0-dfddfaeb1c9f@gmail.com> X-MailScanner-ID: D4EEB600314.A3C43 X-MailScanner: Found to be clean X-MailScanner-From: lars@eggert.org Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Tools-discuss] Request to retain kramdown compiler and author stats X-BeenThere: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF Tools Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2021 20:10:37 -0000 --Apple-Mail=_E673D5E1-F7FF-4282-AA84-C2424348D053 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Hi, On 2021-3-11, at 22:07, Brian E Carpenter = wrote: > On 11-Mar-21 21:01, Lars Eggert wrote: >>=20 >> if you have Docker installed, you do not need to install anything = else if you do things as described here: = https://github.com/larseggert/i-d-toolchain >=20 > Is that going to work if I install docker on Windows 10? I don't know, since I don't have a Windows machine. I can report it = works on MacOS and Linux. > None of which beats the convenience of a web service, IMHO. Also, = since we're talking elsewhere about making the IETF more inviting for = newcomers, don't forget that a large fraction of the engineering = population expects an installable Windows application. (That's something = GitHub got right, in fact: GitHub Desktop rocks.) Correct, and I'm not suggesting that this is a replacement for a web = service. It can be a replacement for installing all the required pieces = of the toolchain manually, however. Thanks, Lars --Apple-Mail=_E673D5E1-F7FF-4282-AA84-C2424348D053 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: attachment; filename=signature.asc Content-Type: application/pgp-signature; name=signature.asc Content-Description: Message signed with OpenPGP -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- iQIzBAEBCgAdFiEEmpq0ZpSoejRmyhheVLXDCb9wwVcFAmBKeTAACgkQVLXDCb9w wVdkWg/7B7XjLgFcLa+tnbLi+vjCdmQXV+H5jzUBCxXyGyGVkSaodWC2bauvSA/l IKQxliOqAA7ov9cWeRWtg3lpRcClurghFXtjgUhpRAj4nSz7Gbki1eSZLuxvi+UE P0527rewF7Tqga4/gtZneVhucYDDY6BAbtCMm3eH1a6RGD0gsbSeBaNrxwiXqNDY rFDCUjqFp09LsqI3ro0/UnHsMADFKu96ElXlWHN2If+0T5GczN93CAOHXjM1/KYs FHxxuh1lbDuHX3Z7UO9+Dv/gjuiQTChmqX06iOqfrOUXSMhBJDnJ71PRtQnJr484 yP+0vjlK7r3g/TCxtfuzlmPs6oCKAyG8dB+t/5tB6ol0HF6IH8EVPvLojsKDV7vU khCxqdzHwwS+WlChzP5Gq/2ggNJcR7xYrjKkWOfHRtE11YBu1oM+MoGCt+YNCh9w w4ORTA0koCjEV9L757w+s+G5aO/v13wwbdkNUvqQXgsERsv+RoZ3MjTrcOiZ5eWK XKotgQEvpsZSLd6y0NSGYBJ1vki9kLBRXo3WGztk9Jnjgnk1s6H2dSEv3nr5kgUO NThlIgSNS1+EuL+pgAF1CPicIT3HKV4WD+QsTDFKR+EpyCg14wv1UimGxB8uIief rFdBAs/GumR1mJjkhDIQ4zSXS9CSuxGAQChGTjSteJXXjRvMjtk= =moCH -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --Apple-Mail=_E673D5E1-F7FF-4282-AA84-C2424348D053-- From nobody Thu Mar 11 12:15:42 2021 Return-Path: X-Original-To: tools-discuss@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: tools-discuss@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9A3363A11BD for ; Thu, 11 Mar 2021 12:15:41 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.099 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.099 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (1024-bit key) header.d=eggert.org Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 8hYY5tGlU0M1 for ; Thu, 11 Mar 2021 12:15:40 -0800 (PST) Received: from mail.eggert.org (mail.eggert.org [IPv6:2a00:ac00:4000:400:211:32ff:fe22:186f]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 7D58F3A11BC for ; Thu, 11 Mar 2021 12:15:40 -0800 (PST) Received: from [IPv6:2a00:ac00:4000:400:78ee:ae78:bc5f:e4c0] (unknown [IPv6:2a00:ac00:4000:400:78ee:ae78:bc5f:e4c0]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by mail.eggert.org (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id A14A1600314; Thu, 11 Mar 2021 22:15:27 +0200 (EET) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/simple; d=eggert.org; s=dkim; t=1615493727; bh=L04XAhJdDyeQesOQnLzp7TgFE93eMQslMAILi6vmnfg=; h=From:Subject:Date:In-Reply-To:Cc:To:References; b=MQoyp49AZb0NJyDHEoWHjWijNuG4LG64kRUQhlrStnw43VeRNYst0BldTMagMEhC/ Nz5LZ9c/9P9vZSSMs0TtoC03P5A6RRQwDtVjoktPd/xj0ofxqrJF62xdxCY5OaZomz Y53xVmPF0udv+9ff8uxMQjDYa3QCZfAwAuPimpco= From: Lars Eggert Message-Id: Content-Type: multipart/signed; boundary="Apple-Mail=_94086D4E-869E-4E11-8BEB-A5566CC757B6"; protocol="application/pgp-signature"; micalg=pgp-sha512 Mime-Version: 1.0 (Mac OS X Mail 14.0 \(3654.60.0.2.21\)) Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2021 22:15:27 +0200 In-Reply-To: <9397bb38-8897-50d4-87f0-dfddfaeb1c9f@gmail.com> Cc: Carsten Bormann , Julian Reschke , tools-discuss@ietf.org To: Brian E Carpenter References: <6F352681-9B00-4B7C-BC9E-DF1D0905C48B@gmail.com> <92482c20-f2fe-48c4-2f44-d025158b143f@gmail.com> <56D36418-D189-45FC-8F40-94371EEAD21B@tzi.org> <698B1E92-F96A-4912-81DA-33BF44633FE1@eggert.org> <9397bb38-8897-50d4-87f0-dfddfaeb1c9f@gmail.com> X-MailScanner-ID: A14A1600314.A0066 X-MailScanner: Found to be clean X-MailScanner-From: lars@eggert.org Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Tools-discuss] Request to retain kramdown compiler and author stats X-BeenThere: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF Tools Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2021 20:15:42 -0000 --Apple-Mail=_94086D4E-869E-4E11-8BEB-A5566CC757B6 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii On 2021-3-11, at 22:07, Brian E Carpenter = wrote: > Also, since we're talking elsewhere about making the IETF more = inviting for newcomers, don't forget that a large fraction of the = engineering population expects an installable Windows application. = (That's something GitHub got right, in fact: GitHub Desktop rocks.) Forgot to add: If someone wanted to, one could install a web server = exposing a simple web service that executes the toolchain a part of the = docker image. It might even be possible to package this into something = clickable. I haven't found a need to do this, but would happily merge a = PR. Thanks, Lars --Apple-Mail=_94086D4E-869E-4E11-8BEB-A5566CC757B6 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: attachment; filename=signature.asc Content-Type: application/pgp-signature; name=signature.asc Content-Description: Message signed with OpenPGP -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- iQIzBAEBCgAdFiEEmpq0ZpSoejRmyhheVLXDCb9wwVcFAmBKel8ACgkQVLXDCb9w wVeAjA/+Idb4jCgmHJRZvB1rwZAtJhgYm/0jxA+9u+Ywlkei2pVxEd9NIAlwNCH2 Kja+kb0F0CG97ygIUdL31WGG3f2EWx/EtIOr9FIUk+3q3OTs7e0Lm8lbEUPeCkzu 8wPh7VhUoTJmwnCpt15mhYXRGPeBoheFV8scsRqB1G+WkR80oxRFSIpfjio1yINr 9skfh4BEpcasJxwSyFnYYfdtT1piAMUQgjYH890yZaWsbzgDv95sElyHB1qyNOAk F4FhlwcwjUwfN7pX6Skuk3G10Axa8BXMQwTngc3HUwSvn73nQljKsPQll2ApZaKT 4BKFPz5yeTyAUfF0rRyHEeFtHxZBPb7EaekeaYxdJPCh+4VgSOl2DEEnWEBHZIE2 URMF5H2WahvyUh1ifiUnYWZblmZd8Fb30eLo622+ny5gEsSQfVNyuqwE0XWBSxse GWo3M+g2HAtWgwQKtdBMOkpdUR6Qa8xtBufmh4KZo0pfyAWtGkUZiyzyIVBUvmcE 71cox7WsWnSuwb6pVtGQOHhozJot86L6In3riMF0AT42VzOuU/pyzxcBNOvUyZk2 7hwZR6FmTw54Fsa0D/hwuRxfwCQ8xnW7M4SAwUpC0hSc0M9UWtyAiuA9R5r9GwAR PGh2hjCt+Z81/HD9JYVxH6+KVkww7HMV1XJOFmjkFbdPV1DvClQ= =K8dy -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --Apple-Mail=_94086D4E-869E-4E11-8BEB-A5566CC757B6-- From nobody Thu Mar 11 23:22:16 2021 Return-Path: X-Original-To: tools-discuss@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: tools-discuss@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id CFA9A3A0CCC for ; Thu, 11 Mar 2021 23:22:14 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -6.9 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-6.9 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, NICE_REPLY_A=-0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_HI=-5, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_H2=-0.001, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (1024-bit key) header.d=gmx.net Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id SuE6yBagXP4O for ; Thu, 11 Mar 2021 23:22:12 -0800 (PST) Received: from mout.gmx.net (mout.gmx.net [212.227.15.15]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 977CF3A0CC5 for ; Thu, 11 Mar 2021 23:22:11 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/simple; d=gmx.net; s=badeba3b8450; t=1615533727; bh=4KTAuUhCieWb7sr/RsyMjqurIpyGV+hqHSx1ZEYEras=; h=X-UI-Sender-Class:Subject:To:References:From:Date:In-Reply-To; b=iZSUUhNVP//MfEuyo6tA0/OwhF+9zcfvuP6Ytzn5v677oDlCOl/ir7RRKnhJZ5LFE DqhGChqZmYPGcjYwckujHKZTM5LUh24P+3PNgeHPiIldRioONo8+WtAALUQVLLDjNY ss4Qe/TnOt2PmZzf8feU2ARYMBk/kNOKLApy0sIg= X-UI-Sender-Class: 01bb95c1-4bf8-414a-932a-4f6e2808ef9c Received: from [192.168.178.20] ([84.171.156.227]) by mail.gmx.net (mrgmx005 [212.227.17.190]) with ESMTPSA (Nemesis) id 1M3UZ6-1lK3tF0XdC-000aYM for ; Fri, 12 Mar 2021 08:22:07 +0100 To: tools-discuss@ietf.org References: <6F352681-9B00-4B7C-BC9E-DF1D0905C48B@gmail.com> <92482c20-f2fe-48c4-2f44-d025158b143f@gmail.com> <56D36418-D189-45FC-8F40-94371EEAD21B@tzi.org> <698B1E92-F96A-4912-81DA-33BF44633FE1@eggert.org> <9397bb38-8897-50d4-87f0-dfddfaeb1c9f@gmail.com> From: Julian Reschke Message-ID: Date: Fri, 12 Mar 2021 08:22:06 +0100 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows NT 10.0; Win64; x64; rv:78.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/78.8.0 MIME-Version: 1.0 In-Reply-To: <9397bb38-8897-50d4-87f0-dfddfaeb1c9f@gmail.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Provags-ID: V03:K1:E9An3QEeszx38uNozCumx2jSELI/70Z2lWeUS077P906YSM6uxz 0we1iPE8aPOWZubtyzAUnZcJhnYFIekS27FzrrNYxzy9PU7gAQsmvljrN/ig+HmAKFUujSE zPFNfyeEzcTztDyNaPxak32bmjv7oS8P8ZfF0VXojhVqb78a97cvUie1ZyD4X0JLF7Qf4aj FZSkptmxwOw/dMhMnfOEg== X-UI-Out-Filterresults: notjunk:1;V03:K0:uXZai1ydRgk=:xtIteRpNP3B1h8QLVGH2Ir elq0zQ6KG08X2EXSKZV+nIwR8r4xY8tGNu0ADrr+O1sWcrrtGWzA0t5JLE62zfvuLX19gTUA5 ArGvLOez/owLVEwgiifsT14Wl3cSFoKAYj8qSBQokb8I7SE3z7t7Hk+xcnrQbP0XgsTC85edB V6U2MMwR1m3B77O9RiXeWgMMurF3xTaiWOXh/4e5V49ymaEX6fzj+ZcggolQJ7RLQG/VWcRcx Yzbu7F93kdMIrTCPixJq0aSQ5JWh5epX5OPgezoO64jM+WiiAtl04vCIlpeZyTRIVmSNnagwV Ohk8BB7TEkdSKx3BZ40JjzJC7bNRcrD4VgUjsMbtTKBPMTnKgYAer5plmYSorVUlO073FNQ7s coT3lpPrV83N9L3FwGHto6VEBxYsPA7OTGIk9qYw6wCZXgfInzLyTPolM23l1jtG8g720AyT1 6OHWr6lJMp5u3OMDb6feN4wO3e/hPGA/oeq1sWVLAi7NI+R4bRWMGAujkBMeL3rjaWQ/Tvtqa GSPRdJTFTiDiLOPlfOPEtQBIWIJIouo/ZfM6dzPsk0yGP/czBDMTTvtKVndRFjeBB0RF2ch5N RT+/1W2HjRh7etdrG4+EtJbVUUskUN2McCcnnd6kBbp6qJo/ANcPeXXOmlfKfH5eEY7b4gc0i rM+3hHSOKR8bMszaEeA0W18nPyn+qYhrKHZvFax3zp9PVNV26gWO/uEhwqTPC+IfZ5oEwtgMY 6/ARMaGGqm22FaTweziGjmIBsG1P/MLiikyzXzy1+4qG5B797xAZfkfJHjQ9Im3h+DlF+/F+B 8CGF6L8g7pl+6NFPqkhS6XbzFzDrLaVzkVLz3NpbkmhcqqAMSLwJmvnEUDJ+WD+QEYFaI6rv3 j8y4JQ++LPiuB/k/DSQw== Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Tools-discuss] Request to retain kramdown compiler and author stats X-BeenThere: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF Tools Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 12 Mar 2021 07:22:15 -0000 Am 11.03.2021 um 21:07 schrieb Brian E Carpenter: > On 11-Mar-21 21:01, Lars Eggert wrote: >> Hi, >> >> On 2021-3-11, at 8:06, Carsten Bormann wrote: >>> Some people like to be able to do a =E2=80=9Cmake=E2=80=9D (usually ma= pped to a single key press) and get a result without further ado within su= b-seconds; this enables editing on the source and near-simultaneously seei= ng one form of the result (usually the HTML form these days). This requir= es a local installation and some caching of dependencies. >> >> if you have Docker installed, you do not need to install anything else = if you do things as described here: https://github.com/larseggert/i-d-tool= chain > > Is that going to work if I install docker on Windows 10? It's supposed to. >> The command is slightly longer than "make", but I guess you could creat= e an alias and/or a shell script if you wanted to. > > None of which beats the convenience of a web service, IMHO. Also, since = we're talking elsewhere about making the IETF more inviting for newcomers,= don't forget that a large fraction of the engineering population expects = an installable Windows application. (That's something GitHub got right, in= fact: GitHub Desktop rocks.) > ... "a large fraction of the engineering population expects an installable Windows application" - seriously? I happen to use Windows as my work machine, but it seems that among engineering people I'm a minority. Best regards, Julian From nobody Thu Mar 11 23:26:50 2021 Return-Path: X-Original-To: tools-discuss@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: tools-discuss@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id ABB353A0CF4; Thu, 11 Mar 2021 23:26:48 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.098 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.098 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE=-0.0001, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=gmail.com Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id m2Xj-15rDKoM; Thu, 11 Mar 2021 23:26:47 -0800 (PST) Received: from mail-lf1-x12b.google.com (mail-lf1-x12b.google.com [IPv6:2a00:1450:4864:20::12b]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id AE4033A0CF5; Thu, 11 Mar 2021 23:26:46 -0800 (PST) Received: by mail-lf1-x12b.google.com with SMTP id e7so44205699lft.2; Thu, 11 Mar 2021 23:26:46 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20161025; h=from:to:references:in-reply-to:subject:date:message-id:mime-version :thread-index:content-language; bh=McVk7NNtGtOsjhSVzMoePO6ccA0fJqjRBLTWru7+mgY=; b=plGiydtliGBarenv0ovQssqkRMekE8M+cRc2OObhsqWAMrV9nwMqhB+gNWY0ns6S0l E9fGJMUCSUDGgifbzthKQMrrpdVvDe3cKqMkz9PaId/YmG4Z02Vy7cb0XMRmdZYnVORn jA5QQ4cnxdIiddY2F+ZLM8tBR37VZJhjXQ1zbNeo4kbUL7yU2rZfvjZk0MrgVGzeN5rg nlj8eVNhw0r7R/gmGG55W54woCthvoTA9YGEj0MpyerLJOu5yPH1mQJ5p75QWBNe6tKz vlteE//3cBkQDTFDpuItmXCo3d+ivomLXo/XnKpOyZFi7MY72Bpk3JpJpgSwDRMicZA8 ZYPg== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:from:to:references:in-reply-to:subject:date :message-id:mime-version:thread-index:content-language; bh=McVk7NNtGtOsjhSVzMoePO6ccA0fJqjRBLTWru7+mgY=; b=VuCUbzogrjxpDda5p9agHCABDL2+9zvCu5JmmX313k8DuHdeov3YUE9aOdpeOW2Q6s zOmQB7ZqJtSly7R/A+HNTuUY0I6sCRThpRpg5hlB+/3jJ/22cDCJ8ZF4cLZLml4PhNjY pgu/WgZ2I+W8/5ySGhq5VNm64BsDuNUiWrG3G+nsoPmhkPsWxSRaTGOJhbiuV3rtWo0R 3lAmdjVrNfd7HGm95NbaOjGdZtcWXRyl9di8qnGV4d2t0R5Ooc0Sz8X+Vj0rhFTOyrtE IfnRApkqHWAcOBjBCNM5pCvstUowKPSCLeX769HtB+vohosfdNqn7apKTc4VECbL2nch pUcQ== X-Gm-Message-State: AOAM5330dByg3vimO/lsBdOsdZnBvZ/45XoA6BQU4aE3mbgOakmJyp3i MhCYaqwMxB/4kb2oWKdWTFBihdh9yDw= X-Google-Smtp-Source: ABdhPJwfhHalNlPVpAeUwjoqeqOzM1yET/HKwOZ8WMGiVehWMcRszD0pSzDfEC3Do3m7booczaPQNA== X-Received: by 2002:a05:6512:945:: with SMTP id u5mr4524191lft.229.1615534002884; Thu, 11 Mar 2021 23:26:42 -0800 (PST) Received: from buildpc ([93.188.44.203]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id p6sm1565302lfc.71.2021.03.11.23.26.41 (version=TLS1_2 cipher=ECDHE-ECDSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 bits=128/128); Thu, 11 Mar 2021 23:26:42 -0800 (PST) From: "Valery Smyslov" To: "'tools-discuss'" , , References: In-Reply-To: Date: Fri, 12 Mar 2021 10:26:39 +0300 Message-ID: <030901d71711$0b5212d0$21f63870$@gmail.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_030A_01D7172A.30A03530" X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook 14.0 Thread-Index: AQGmGTpPWDn1quRBj/0cbhhpSPLIVAGr12gEqtSPHNA= Content-Language: ru Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Tools-discuss] Meetecho on Android X-BeenThere: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF Tools Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 12 Mar 2021 07:26:49 -0000 This is a multipart message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_030A_01D7172A.30A03530 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Hi, =20 last time I tried Meetecho on Android I had the same experience. Unfortunately, it was not possible to use it at all, since UI didn=E2=80=99t take phone screen specifics into considerations and some controls were inaccessible. =20 Regards, Valery. =20 =20 Hi Kyle - I'm moving this to tools-discuss. On 3/10/21 8:45 AM, Kyle Rose wrote: Is there any way to make Meetecho usable on Android? I encounter two = main problems with the browser interface: =20 * The UI is unusable in both portrait and landscape mode: elements = overlap, controls are either too big or too small, etc. * When the screen sleeps, audio stops shortly thereafter, requiring me = to unlock. =20 Considering that Android-on-phones is the world's most widely deployed = user platform, this seems like a significant barrier to participation. =20 https://www.dropbox.com/s/ux3t5zuk5qjwpa0/2021-03-10%2009.44.17.png?dl=3D= 0 https://www.dropbox.com/s/kgcm0jvduq5slma/2021-03-10%2009.44.05.png?dl=3D= 0 =20 Kyle ------=_NextPart_000_030A_01D7172A.30A03530 Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

Hi,

 

last time I tried Meetecho on Android I had the same = experience.

Unfortunately, it was not possible to use it at all, = since

UI didn=E2=80=99t take phone screen specifics into = considerations

and some controls were inaccessible.

 

Regards,

Valery.

 

 

Hi Kyle -

I'm moving this to = tools-discuss.

On 3/10/21 8:45 = AM, Kyle Rose wrote:

Is there any way to make Meetecho usable on Android? I = encounter two main problems with the browser = interface:

 

* = The UI is unusable in both portrait and landscape mode: elements = overlap, controls are either too big or too small, = etc.

* When the screen = sleeps, audio stops shortly thereafter, requiring me to = unlock.

 

Considering that Android-on-phones is the world's most = widely deployed user platform, this seems like a significant barrier to = participation.

 

Kyle

------=_NextPart_000_030A_01D7172A.30A03530-- From nobody Fri Mar 12 00:12:20 2021 Return-Path: X-Original-To: tools-discuss@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: tools-discuss@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0274A3A0EE1 for ; Fri, 12 Mar 2021 00:12:19 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.919 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.919 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_H3=-0.01, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_WL=-0.01, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id xPr8WK0RnafO for ; Fri, 12 Mar 2021 00:12:14 -0800 (PST) Received: from gabriel-vm-2.zfn.uni-bremen.de (gabriel-vm-2.zfn.uni-bremen.de [134.102.50.17]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher AECDH-AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id A9D493A0EE5 for ; Fri, 12 Mar 2021 00:12:14 -0800 (PST) Received: from [192.168.217.118] (p5089a828.dip0.t-ipconnect.de [80.137.168.40]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by gabriel-vm-2.zfn.uni-bremen.de (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 4Dxdp44XztzySV; Fri, 12 Mar 2021 09:12:12 +0100 (CET) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Mime-Version: 1.0 (Mac OS X Mail 13.4 \(3608.120.23.2.4\)) From: Carsten Bormann In-Reply-To: Date: Fri, 12 Mar 2021 09:12:12 +0100 Cc: Brian E Carpenter , Julian Reschke , tools-discuss@ietf.org X-Mao-Original-Outgoing-Id: 637229531.9463249-500f33dfeb9e382212c45abe6d0a0998 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Message-Id: References: <6F352681-9B00-4B7C-BC9E-DF1D0905C48B@gmail.com> <92482c20-f2fe-48c4-2f44-d025158b143f@gmail.com> <56D36418-D189-45FC-8F40-94371EEAD21B@tzi.org> <698B1E92-F96A-4912-81DA-33BF44633FE1@eggert.org> <9397bb38-8897-50d4-87f0-dfddfaeb1c9f@gmail.com> To: Lars Eggert X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.3608.120.23.2.4) Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Tools-discuss] Request to retain kramdown compiler and author stats X-BeenThere: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF Tools Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 12 Mar 2021 08:12:19 -0000 On 2021-03-11, at 21:15, Lars Eggert wrote: >=20 > Forgot to add: If someone wanted to, one could install a web server = exposing a simple web service that executes the toolchain a part of the = docker image. It might even be possible to package this into something = clickable. I haven't found a need to do this, but would happily merge a = PR. Want! Gr=C3=BC=C3=9Fe, Carsten From nobody Fri Mar 12 07:14:41 2021 Return-Path: X-Original-To: tools-discuss@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: tools-discuss@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1E7EE3A124E for ; Fri, 12 Mar 2021 07:14:39 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.899 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.899 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id uxOfdXSeh37n for ; Fri, 12 Mar 2021 07:14:36 -0800 (PST) Received: from tuna.sandelman.ca (tuna.sandelman.ca [IPv6:2607:f0b0:f:3:216:3eff:fe7c:d1f3]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ADH-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 34F4D3A1552 for ; Fri, 12 Mar 2021 07:13:37 -0800 (PST) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by tuna.sandelman.ca (Postfix) with ESMTP id B0F5E38A10 for ; Fri, 12 Mar 2021 10:18:46 -0500 (EST) Received: from tuna.sandelman.ca ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id GDTaJuMpeoqd for ; Fri, 12 Mar 2021 10:18:46 -0500 (EST) Received: from sandelman.ca (obiwan.sandelman.ca [IPv6:2607:f0b0:f:2::247]) by tuna.sandelman.ca (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4AD9B38A0E for ; Fri, 12 Mar 2021 10:18:46 -0500 (EST) Received: from localhost (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by sandelman.ca (Postfix) with ESMTP id B75BFFC for ; Fri, 12 Mar 2021 10:13:34 -0500 (EST) From: Michael Richardson To: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-Attribution: mcr X-Mailer: MH-E 8.6+git; nmh 1.7+dev; GNU Emacs 26.1 X-Face: $\n1pF)h^`}$H>Hk{L"x@)JS7<%Az}5RyS@k9X%29-lHB$Ti.V>2bi.~ehC0; <'$9xN5Ub# z!G,p`nR&p7Fz@^UXIn156S8.~^@MJ*mMsD7=QFeq%AL4m Archived-At: Subject: [Tools-discuss] some more meetecho thoughts X-BeenThere: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF Tools Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 12 Mar 2021 15:14:39 -0000 --=-=-= Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Some thoughts/refinements. I think we are supposed to post them here, righ= t? 1) when the participants clicks on the _share screen_ button that it should immediately ask the participant to select the window to share, but just not transmit until the chair gives them the media slot. Ideally, showing the participant what they are transmitting. This would eliminate many of the delays in switching presenters. (Unified slide decks are good, but not always better if the agenda is mo= re fluid.) But, I think, the more important thing is that it would allow participan= ts to sort out the local permissions, browser compatibility, etc. and they could do this if they wanted, in the three minutes before the meeting st= arts. It might also be good if multiple slide sharers could be "on deck", with the chair switching between them. {Personally, I'd even like to have multiple windows shared and swap between them fast, but that's perhaps t= oo esoteric.} 2) it would be really cool if the chairs could see a preview of the share before they agree, but that's really not required :-) 3) could chairs give presentation permission to a participant before they ask? that seems to occupy 10s of back and forth in some meetings. Yes, that's an interaction with (1). 4) of course, doing it the BBB way, projecting PDF from a server, and allowing the mouse to hover, even draw, is WAY better, so (1) above is really only important if this isn't coming. 5) I'd sure like to put all the video frames under my slides. Others might disagree, but that seems to fit my screen real-estate bette= r. I want the slides bigger. =2D--- While we've had training session for chairs, and some for participants, it's not enough I think. It would be great if there was a room online, perhaps configured for 5 participants max, where the first person to arrive gets chair permission. (And maybe the room would reboot every hour or so) If nothing else, that would let mentoring on the tool occur. =2D- Michael Richardson . o O ( IPv6 I=C3=B8T consulti= ng ) Sandelman Software Works Inc, Ottawa and Worldwide --=-=-= Content-Type: application/pgp-signature; name="signature.asc" -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- iQEzBAEBCgAdFiEEbsyLEzg/qUTA43uogItw+93Q3WUFAmBLhR4ACgkQgItw+93Q 3WWieQf/UZgeYv7RUuAR7TARLSHPsqGcxIYTQVLh8/cikwMHQmmFE0ldxlDQ9DT7 htu1yjT/AQ4fxoPPYUeb5DS6e+M96Crk16xH8D0iys+f8SUpwhIOthIopEDHrieK AlGVDN9G/j8WGjxQCsbZ6EaFYGh+mFyavzRSCRQ1X7dF9y7upXxVGU2cGL7LwANk W8LlXP4RSTeUv++OxUoz5lIq31dt9aD3/lpOkqE5SFSbpLeydW+0GxuwJlYfoJ/t Pj67+XNpE5f/rb3a3U7hoAfJSPlgQks8x1FckFyZNeCA44WbOuz8LicAv56cAjkg TgXC5duyvS5QaG1XkJblf1K/aOsIIA== =GVh/ -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --=-=-=-- From nobody Fri Mar 12 07:30:10 2021 Return-Path: X-Original-To: tools-discuss@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: tools-discuss@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 49ACB3A1308 for ; Fri, 12 Mar 2021 07:30:08 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.919 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.919 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_H3=-0.01, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_WL=-0.01, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 2EWwYCZi1E43 for ; Fri, 12 Mar 2021 07:30:05 -0800 (PST) Received: from gabriel-vm-2.zfn.uni-bremen.de (gabriel-vm-2.zfn.uni-bremen.de [134.102.50.17]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher AECDH-AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 2368A3A1300 for ; Fri, 12 Mar 2021 07:30:05 -0800 (PST) Received: from [192.168.217.118] (p5089a828.dip0.t-ipconnect.de [80.137.168.40]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by gabriel-vm-2.zfn.uni-bremen.de (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 4DxqWH2YLgzyf9; Fri, 12 Mar 2021 16:30:03 +0100 (CET) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Mime-Version: 1.0 (Mac OS X Mail 13.4 \(3608.120.23.2.4\)) From: Carsten Bormann In-Reply-To: <10380.1615562014@localhost> Date: Fri, 12 Mar 2021 16:30:02 +0100 Cc: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-Mao-Original-Outgoing-Id: 637255802.8614579-c6f0b79526dc971381bc9dc7ffbd04fb Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Message-Id: References: <10380.1615562014@localhost> To: Michael Richardson X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.3608.120.23.2.4) Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Tools-discuss] some more meetecho thoughts X-BeenThere: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF Tools Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 12 Mar 2021 15:30:08 -0000 On 2021-03-12, at 16:13, Michael Richardson = wrote: >=20 > 3) could chairs give presentation permission to a participant before = they > ask? that seems to occupy 10s of back and forth in some meetings. > Yes, that's an interaction with (1). (+1) > 4) of course, doing it the BBB way, projecting PDF from a server, and > allowing the mouse to hover, even draw, is WAY better, so (1) above = is > really only important if this isn't coming. (+100) > 5) I'd sure like to put all the video frames under my slides. > Others might disagree, but that seems to fit my screen real-estate = better. > I want the slides bigger. That=E2=80=99s interesting. Normally our screens are too wide, so = organizing things horizontally is the right thing. But I need the = CODIMD nodes to the right of the meetecho window, so I could indeed use = the video streams below the slides. Maybe make this responsive=E2=80=A6 Gr=C3=BC=C3=9Fe, Carsten From nobody Fri Mar 12 07:33:11 2021 Return-Path: X-Original-To: tools-discuss@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: tools-discuss@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 738973A131F for ; Fri, 12 Mar 2021 07:33:10 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.919 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.919 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_H3=-0.01, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_WL=-0.01, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id x-DM26BGl7BP for ; Fri, 12 Mar 2021 07:33:08 -0800 (PST) Received: from gabriel-vm-2.zfn.uni-bremen.de (gabriel-vm-2.zfn.uni-bremen.de [134.102.50.17]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher AECDH-AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 94E933A130E for ; Fri, 12 Mar 2021 07:33:08 -0800 (PST) Received: from [192.168.217.118] (p5089a828.dip0.t-ipconnect.de [80.137.168.40]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by gabriel-vm-2.zfn.uni-bremen.de (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 4DxqZq1Jkjzyf9; Fri, 12 Mar 2021 16:33:07 +0100 (CET) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Mime-Version: 1.0 (Mac OS X Mail 13.4 \(3608.120.23.2.4\)) From: Carsten Bormann In-Reply-To: Date: Fri, 12 Mar 2021 16:33:06 +0100 Cc: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-Mao-Original-Outgoing-Id: 637255986.730359-5063761a12c99d72af7d4b207b004bb7 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Message-Id: References: <10380.1615562014@localhost> To: Michael Richardson X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.3608.120.23.2.4) Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Tools-discuss] some more meetecho thoughts X-BeenThere: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF Tools Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 12 Mar 2021 15:33:10 -0000 On 2021-03-12, at 16:30, Carsten Bormann wrote: >=20 > nodes=20 *notes! Gr=C3=BC=C3=9Fe, Carsten From nobody Sat Mar 13 12:36:58 2021 Return-Path: X-Original-To: tools-discuss@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: tools-discuss@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id CFF4D3A0C35 for ; Sat, 13 Mar 2021 12:36:56 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.232 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.232 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, KHOP_HELO_FCRDNS=0.001, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_SOFTFAIL=0.665, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=no autolearn_force=no Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id HJhgDYHMZWLc for ; Sat, 13 Mar 2021 12:36:54 -0800 (PST) Received: from relay.sandelman.ca (minerva.sandelman.ca [IPv6:2a01:7e00::3d:b000]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ADH-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 075613A0C33 for ; Sat, 13 Mar 2021 12:36:54 -0800 (PST) Received: from dooku.sandelman.ca (desktop4.sandelman.ca [209.87.249.16]) by relay.sandelman.ca (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 4E82C1F44E; Sat, 13 Mar 2021 20:36:49 +0000 (UTC) Received: by dooku.sandelman.ca (Postfix, from userid 179) id 1C67B1A02D3; Sat, 13 Mar 2021 15:36:48 -0500 (EST) From: Michael Richardson To: Carsten Bormann cc: tools-discuss@ietf.org In-reply-to: References: <10380.1615562014@localhost> Comments: In-reply-to Carsten Bormann message dated "Fri, 12 Mar 2021 16:30:02 +0100." X-Mailer: MH-E 8.6+git; nmh 1.7.1; GNU Emacs 26.3 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/signed; boundary="=-=-="; micalg=pgp-sha512; protocol="application/pgp-signature" Date: Sat, 13 Mar 2021 15:36:48 -0500 Message-ID: <1505131.1615667808@dooku> Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Tools-discuss] some more meetecho thoughts X-BeenThere: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF Tools Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sat, 13 Mar 2021 20:36:57 -0000 --=-=-= Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Carsten Bormann wrote: >> 5) I'd sure like to put all the video frames under my slides. Others >> might disagree, but that seems to fit my screen real-estate better. = I >> want the slides bigger. > That=E2=80=99s interesting. Normally our screens are too wide, so or= ganizing > things horizontally is the right thing. But I need the CODIMD nodes = to > the right of the meetecho window, so I could indeed use the video > streams below the slides. Maybe make this responsive=E2=80=A6 Yes, my screen is two monitors' wide, but I only want to use 1/4 of that width for meetecho. Because codimd, because jabber window, because telegra= m, etc. In general, I have most windows in portrait mode, and my next desk will accomodate three monitors in portrait mode. =2D- Michael Richardson , Sandelman Software Works -=3D IPv6 IoT consulting =3D- --=-=-= Content-Type: application/pgp-signature; name="signature.asc" -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- iQEzBAEBCgAdFiEERK+9HEcJHTJ9UqTMlUzhVv38QpAFAmBNIl8ACgkQlUzhVv38 QpBrLwf9EziFJRq3dVv83FCnQTi7hEOhem+q/07qINnyWfLrT2SeNShflFiPMGaG LnPvDZpljOvZ6YhOsUI/W6bXtDvzgOIyRtB3bgX9+sUjlJIciJYnpsduO9Ae4qfP WXWMByS+oh4CbICGhACzS9tM2V8cau6ZXddN7RvE1AwZdcDYRndbPhycbGnke8Ku 4mNYX+ftaJLlY63YiP+3iC9GgUngwQDWruZ3BE44mvZm5/KXszbgmQUU2m73hG42 vW7d7QWFPK0kuIUtToogFXVr2v+cFq3tmVWPD2BmjHLMxaD/Xt/fJxrX8MSXbjua 51PfafxZt37534x2OzXj0dyG2jQP3w== =uf3F -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --=-=-=-- From nobody Sat Mar 13 12:37:37 2021 Return-Path: X-Original-To: tools-discuss@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: tools-discuss@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id D9DB53A0C40 for ; Sat, 13 Mar 2021 12:37:34 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.233 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.233 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, KHOP_HELO_FCRDNS=0.001, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_SOFTFAIL=0.665] autolearn=no autolearn_force=no Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id NfwfSoaXpWQj for ; Sat, 13 Mar 2021 12:37:33 -0800 (PST) Received: from relay.sandelman.ca (minerva.sandelman.ca [IPv6:2a01:7e00::3d:b000]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ADH-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 456943A0C38 for ; Sat, 13 Mar 2021 12:37:33 -0800 (PST) Received: from dooku.sandelman.ca (desktop4.sandelman.ca [209.87.249.16]) by relay.sandelman.ca (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 80B6E1F44E; Sat, 13 Mar 2021 20:37:29 +0000 (UTC) Received: by dooku.sandelman.ca (Postfix, from userid 179) id AC9AA1A02D3; Sat, 13 Mar 2021 15:37:28 -0500 (EST) From: Michael Richardson To: Tero Kivinen cc: Carsten Bormann , tools-discuss@ietf.org In-reply-to: <24651.40638.2390.738023@fireball.acr.fi> References: <10380.1615562014@localhost> <24651.40638.2390.738023@fireball.acr.fi> Comments: In-reply-to Tero Kivinen message dated "Fri, 12 Mar 2021 19:02:54 +0200." X-Mailer: MH-E 8.6+git; nmh 1.7.1; GNU Emacs 26.3 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Date: Sat, 13 Mar 2021 15:37:28 -0500 Message-ID: <1505158.1615667848@dooku> Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Tools-discuss] some more meetecho thoughts X-BeenThere: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF Tools Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sat, 13 Mar 2021 20:37:35 -0000 Tero Kivinen wrote: >> > 5) I'd sure like to put all the video frames under my slides. > >> Others might disagree, but that seems to fit my screen real-estate >> better. > I want the slides bigger. >> >> That=E2=80=99s interesting. Normally our screens are too wide, so o= rganizing >> things horizontally is the right thing. But I need the CODIMD nodes >> to the right of the meetecho window, so I could indeed use the video >> streams below the slides. > At least in chrome you can go to the slides and right click on them a= nd > select "Picture in picture", which will pop them out as separate video I'll try that next time. From nobody Sun Mar 14 14:35:04 2021 Return-Path: X-Original-To: tools-discuss@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: tools-discuss@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3D1133A15F4 for ; Sun, 14 Mar 2021 14:35:03 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.899 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.899 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id WARYc4lftl_i for ; Sun, 14 Mar 2021 14:35:01 -0700 (PDT) Received: from jays-mbp.localdomain (unknown [158.140.230.105]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 9AD293A15F3 for ; Sun, 14 Mar 2021 14:35:01 -0700 (PDT) From: Jay Daley Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Mime-Version: 1.0 (Mac OS X Mail 13.4 \(3608.120.23.2.4\)) Message-Id: <92319CB2-D3E0-433F-81A1-4AFE2220B854@ietf.org> Date: Mon, 15 Mar 2021 10:34:58 +1300 To: Tools Discussion X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.3608.120.23.2.4) Archived-At: Subject: [Tools-discuss] Deletion of unused and broken trac instances X-BeenThere: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF Tools Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sun, 14 Mar 2021 21:35:03 -0000 To support Robert as The Tools Team PM, I am working on an RFP to move = all the wiki pages in existing trac instances to a new wiki product and = all the issues to GitHb repositories. In preparation for this work, I = propose to have all broken and unused Trac instances deleted so that we = do not waste resources having those migrated. =20 - Broken instances are ones that cannot be started by the Trac software. = They may well contain data but as no support calls have been raised = since they broke some years ago, I am assuming they are no longer = needed.=20 - Unused instances are those with no edits made and no issues raised. The following lists have been circulated to the IESG and WG Chairs and = one instance moved from one list to another. Please note: there are = multiple examples where a specific WG/Team uses a set of wiki pages = underneath inside another wiki, not actual wiki set aside for that = purpose, which remains unused. e.g. genart pages are under the gen wiki = not the specific genart wiki, which is unused. This is just a final check to make sure there are no concerns with this = deletion. Please let us know in the next few days if you do have a = concern. PS There will be a follow up this week about what Wiki product I propose = we switch to. thanks Jay 1. List of the broken instances along with an estimated date for when = they broke. 24 in total. Jun 10 2019 ITU-T-CITS Oct 22 2014 aaadoctors Jun 11 2019 add Jul 10 2015 appsdir Oct 22 2014 genart Jun 26 2019 iepg Oct 22 2014 intdir Oct 22 2014 iotdir Jun 11 2019 lake Jun 11 2019 loops Jun 26 2019 mentor Oct 22 2014 mibdoctors Jun 11 2019 mops Oct 22 2014 opsdir Oct 22 2014 perfmetrdir Oct 22 2014 raiart Oct 22 2014 rsvpdir Oct 22 2014 rtgdir Oct 22 2014 sdpdir Oct 22 2014 secdir Oct 22 2014 smartpower Jun 27 2019 tdd Oct 22 2014 tsvdir Oct 22 2014 yangdoctors 2. List of unused Trac instances. 159 in total 16ng 6renum acme ancp apparea aqm arcmedia armd artarea artart atoca autoconf avtext babel banana bcause bfcpbis bimi bmwg cacao calext capport capwap cbor cdni cellar cfrg coinrg coms cose csi curdle cuss dart dcrouting dcrup detnet doh drip driu emodir enum eppext extra fecframe genarea gendispatch geojson ghost git grow hackathon hotrfc hrpc i18ndir i18nrp ianaplan iasa2 iasa20 iccrg ice icnrg ideas ietf ila imapapnd insipid ipfix ipwave irtfopen isis jmap jsonbis justfont karp keyprov kitten ksk l2sm l2tpext l2vpn lamps ledbat lmap lsr lsvr maprg marf masque mboned mip6 mipshop mls modern monami6 morg netrqmts netslicing netvc nfsv4 nfvrg nwcrg openpgp opsarea opsawg opsec p2psip pals panrg paw paws pcn pearg perc privacypass qirg qresync quic raiarea rats rfcplusplus ript rsoc rtgarea rtgyangcoord rum saag sasl savi sdnrg secevent sidrops sip sipbrandy splices storm straw supa t2trg taps tcpinc teep tmrid tokbind tools-arch trill tsvarea tsvart txauth v6ops vcarddav vipr vnrg webpush webtrans wgtlgo wpack wugh xrblock --=20 Jay Daley IETF Executive Director jay@ietf.org From nobody Sun Mar 14 15:23:05 2021 Return-Path: X-Original-To: tools-discuss@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: tools-discuss@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 50F943A16C0 for ; Sun, 14 Mar 2021 15:23:03 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.85 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.85 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, HEADER_FROM_DIFFERENT_DOMAINS=0.25, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=iecc.com header.b=VJcIJz71; dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=taugh.com header.b=rjLqxJ/b Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id F7k1Xu4Jfr6w for ; Sun, 14 Mar 2021 15:23:00 -0700 (PDT) Received: from gal.iecc.com (gal.iecc.com [IPv6:2001:470:1f07:1126:0:43:6f73:7461]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 00B6C3A16C8 for ; Sun, 14 Mar 2021 15:22:59 -0700 (PDT) Received: (qmail 23100 invoked from network); 14 Mar 2021 22:22:57 -0000 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=simple; d=iecc.com; h=date:message-id:from:to:cc:subject:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding:cleverness; s=5a3a.604e8cc1.k2103; bh=Jwr8lb462WnOM8G9oz0GKpCfFgkyRA3Tebno477XVUQ=; b=VJcIJz71i1yHTtElQym3RhWrd2/bHTYWANVdHZGBLW04L/ZpkAWKBCIkli5vn3VeJZVPZOQdmpvEkhijZuWKBkAROZThYXVyvbJHXITXyibOr5Ac0q3sdlpicXuH/5OyE3HM1n9r51siqsQXmSO+olPNtIvPb6sxsak+3Ln5nNpi55SYaLLQ3Erdw9P6YqNUYOfJ6W+xeTo012hry3arb9cwsYy8vuOmnmGkJPGMwTuQX8RzllMtqjVmKCKy01wmuMeQwlXRuMuTlafptZyWL8PumxVJV4AgGYz6RiwDaVfRTsb0lvtIFCqwUlbH9Jyp31Snhhan2x/Vhyjk5bCfCg== DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=simple; d=taugh.com; h=date:message-id:from:to:cc:subject:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding:cleverness; s=5a3a.604e8cc1.k2103; bh=Jwr8lb462WnOM8G9oz0GKpCfFgkyRA3Tebno477XVUQ=; b=rjLqxJ/bKZxN5wMGCGonlGM4sKlDbBLFEotLsMYwEXmgE3nWxTKSoif/PcwC90JcxdRIWOGFbmybpllZJU5CnhnIRtBqWj/HFeDkIxeH7y7PFRDHMJJerIzufzwztnLw3UO98jYxifimS/HLYGMdFPH5kd8B7k9RivsrJm29l17Lf6w0www1yElwfHyOx9HybAhBBzDRU05ageWVfjwP6TLpqtW4DXS543iQjJZu0r39eGjRwfq8RZQB9HOMe5PACjI1ZUHj0kdbTcnXcsuEeO8NrmET6pV6lMFW8HpHIJ1rTWGas5GGw3J37b5OBaZ4PGYZaimOGb9qWalJqYtCaw== Received: from ary.qy ([IPv6:2001:470:1f07:1126::78:696d:6170]) by imap.iecc.com ([IPv6:2001:470:1f07:1126::78:696d:6170]) with ESMTPS (TLS1.2 ECDHE-RSA AES-256-GCM AEAD) via TCP6; 14 Mar 2021 22:22:56 -0000 Received: by ary.qy (Postfix, from userid 501) id A666B707A3D8; Sun, 14 Mar 2021 18:22:56 -0400 (EDT) Date: 14 Mar 2021 18:22:56 -0400 Message-Id: <20210314222256.A666B707A3D8@ary.qy> From: "John Levine" To: tools-discuss@ietf.org In-Reply-To: <92319CB2-D3E0-433F-81A1-4AFE2220B854@ietf.org> Organization: Taughannock Networks X-Headerized: yes Cleverness: minimal Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-transfer-encoding: 8bit Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Tools-discuss] Deletion of unused and broken trac instances X-BeenThere: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF Tools Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sun, 14 Mar 2021 22:23:03 -0000 It appears that Jay Daley said: >To support Robert as The Tools Team PM, I am working on an RFP to move all the wiki pages in existing trac instances to a new wiki >product and all the issues to GitHb repositories. In preparation for this work, I propose to have all broken and unused Trac >instances deleted so that we do not waste resources having those migrated. Do we plan to keep backups of the broken instances in case someone in the future thinks there was something of interest in them? I don't propose offering a recovery service, just "here's a copy of the files, good luck and let us know if you find anything." R's, John > >- Broken instances are ones that cannot be started by the Trac software. They may well contain data but as no support calls have >been raised since they broke some years ago, I am assuming they are no longer needed. > >- Unused instances are those with no edits made and no issues raised. > >The following lists have been circulated to the IESG and WG Chairs and one instance moved from one list to another. Please note: >there are multiple examples where a specific WG/Team uses a set of wiki pages underneath inside another wiki, not actual wiki set >aside for that purpose, which remains unused. e.g. genart pages are under the gen wiki not the specific genart wiki, which is >unused. > >This is just a final check to make sure there are no concerns with this deletion. Please let us know in the next few days if you do >have a concern. > >PS There will be a follow up this week about what Wiki product I propose we switch to. > >thanks >Jay > > >1. List of the broken instances along with an estimated date for when they broke. 24 in total. > >Jun 10 2019 ITU-T-CITS >Oct 22 2014 aaadoctors >Jun 11 2019 add >Jul 10 2015 appsdir >Oct 22 2014 genart >Jun 26 2019 iepg >Oct 22 2014 intdir >Oct 22 2014 iotdir >Jun 11 2019 lake >Jun 11 2019 loops >Jun 26 2019 mentor >Oct 22 2014 mibdoctors >Jun 11 2019 mops >Oct 22 2014 opsdir >Oct 22 2014 perfmetrdir >Oct 22 2014 raiart >Oct 22 2014 rsvpdir >Oct 22 2014 rtgdir >Oct 22 2014 sdpdir >Oct 22 2014 secdir >Oct 22 2014 smartpower >Jun 27 2019 tdd >Oct 22 2014 tsvdir >Oct 22 2014 yangdoctors > > >2. List of unused Trac instances. 159 in total > >16ng >6renum >acme >ancp >apparea >aqm >arcmedia >armd >artarea >artart >atoca >autoconf >avtext >babel >banana >bcause >bfcpbis >bimi >bmwg >cacao >calext >capport >capwap >cbor >cdni >cellar >cfrg >coinrg >coms >cose >csi >curdle >cuss >dart >dcrouting >dcrup >detnet >doh >drip >driu >emodir >enum >eppext >extra >fecframe >genarea >gendispatch >geojson >ghost >git >grow >hackathon >hotrfc >hrpc >i18ndir >i18nrp >ianaplan >iasa2 >iasa20 >iccrg >ice >icnrg >ideas >ietf >ila >imapapnd >insipid >ipfix >ipwave >irtfopen >isis >jmap >jsonbis >justfont >karp >keyprov >kitten >ksk >l2sm >l2tpext >l2vpn >lamps >ledbat >lmap >lsr >lsvr >maprg >marf >masque >mboned >mip6 >mipshop >mls >modern >monami6 >morg >netrqmts >netslicing >netvc >nfsv4 >nfvrg >nwcrg >openpgp >opsarea >opsawg >opsec >p2psip >pals >panrg >paw >paws >pcn >pearg >perc >privacypass >qirg >qresync >quic >raiarea >rats >rfcplusplus >ript >rsoc >rtgarea >rtgyangcoord >rum >saag >sasl >savi >sdnrg >secevent >sidrops >sip >sipbrandy >splices >storm >straw >supa >t2trg >taps >tcpinc >teep >tmrid >tokbind >tools-arch >trill >tsvarea >tsvart >txauth >v6ops >vcarddav >vipr >vnrg >webpush >webtrans >wgtlgo >wpack >wugh >xrblock > >-- >Jay Daley >IETF Executive Director >jay@ietf.org > From nobody Sun Mar 14 15:44:33 2021 Return-Path: X-Original-To: tools-discuss@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: tools-discuss@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id DC6673A1731 for ; Sun, 14 Mar 2021 15:44:31 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.898 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.898 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id eV2JVLhb0r1L; Sun, 14 Mar 2021 15:44:30 -0700 (PDT) Received: from jays-mbp.localdomain (unknown [158.140.230.105]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 20BE63A1730; Sun, 14 Mar 2021 15:44:28 -0700 (PDT) From: Jay Daley Message-Id: Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="Apple-Mail=_A6053E1C-EB8D-4A2B-9E2F-392A2D89F95D" Mime-Version: 1.0 (Mac OS X Mail 13.4 \(3608.120.23.2.4\)) Date: Mon, 15 Mar 2021 11:44:25 +1300 In-Reply-To: <20210314222256.A666B707A3D8@ary.qy> Cc: tools-discuss@ietf.org To: John Levine References: <20210314222256.A666B707A3D8@ary.qy> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.3608.120.23.2.4) Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Tools-discuss] Deletion of unused and broken trac instances X-BeenThere: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF Tools Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sun, 14 Mar 2021 22:44:32 -0000 --Apple-Mail=_A6053E1C-EB8D-4A2B-9E2F-392A2D89F95D Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii > On 15/03/2021, at 11:22 AM, John Levine wrote: >=20 > It appears that Jay Daley said: >> To support Robert as The Tools Team PM, I am working on an RFP to = move all the wiki pages in existing trac instances to a new wiki >> product and all the issues to GitHb repositories. In preparation for = this work, I propose to have all broken and unused Trac >> instances deleted so that we do not waste resources having those = migrated. =20 >=20 > Do we plan to keep backups of the broken instances in case someone in > the future thinks there was something of interest in them? I don't > propose offering a recovery service, just "here's a copy of the files, > good luck and let us know if you find anything." Yes we do. Jay >=20 > R's, > John >=20 >=20 >=20 >>=20 >> - Broken instances are ones that cannot be started by the Trac = software. They may well contain data but as no support calls have >> been raised since they broke some years ago, I am assuming they are = no longer needed.=20 >>=20 >> - Unused instances are those with no edits made and no issues raised. >>=20 >> The following lists have been circulated to the IESG and WG Chairs = and one instance moved from one list to another. Please note: >> there are multiple examples where a specific WG/Team uses a set of = wiki pages underneath inside another wiki, not actual wiki set >> aside for that purpose, which remains unused. e.g. genart pages are = under the gen wiki not the specific genart wiki, which is >> unused. >>=20 >> This is just a final check to make sure there are no concerns with = this deletion. Please let us know in the next few days if you do >> have a concern. >>=20 >> PS There will be a follow up this week about what Wiki product I = propose we switch to. >>=20 >> thanks >> Jay >>=20 >>=20 >> 1. List of the broken instances along with an estimated date for = when they broke. 24 in total. >>=20 >> Jun 10 2019 ITU-T-CITS >> Oct 22 2014 aaadoctors >> Jun 11 2019 add >> Jul 10 2015 appsdir >> Oct 22 2014 genart >> Jun 26 2019 iepg >> Oct 22 2014 intdir >> Oct 22 2014 iotdir >> Jun 11 2019 lake >> Jun 11 2019 loops >> Jun 26 2019 mentor >> Oct 22 2014 mibdoctors >> Jun 11 2019 mops >> Oct 22 2014 opsdir >> Oct 22 2014 perfmetrdir >> Oct 22 2014 raiart >> Oct 22 2014 rsvpdir >> Oct 22 2014 rtgdir >> Oct 22 2014 sdpdir >> Oct 22 2014 secdir >> Oct 22 2014 smartpower >> Jun 27 2019 tdd >> Oct 22 2014 tsvdir >> Oct 22 2014 yangdoctors >>=20 >>=20 >> 2. List of unused Trac instances. 159 in total >>=20 >> 16ng >> 6renum >> acme >> ancp >> apparea >> aqm >> arcmedia >> armd >> artarea >> artart >> atoca >> autoconf >> avtext >> babel >> banana >> bcause >> bfcpbis >> bimi >> bmwg >> cacao >> calext >> capport >> capwap >> cbor >> cdni >> cellar >> cfrg >> coinrg >> coms >> cose >> csi >> curdle >> cuss >> dart >> dcrouting >> dcrup >> detnet >> doh >> drip >> driu >> emodir >> enum >> eppext >> extra >> fecframe >> genarea >> gendispatch >> geojson >> ghost >> git >> grow >> hackathon >> hotrfc >> hrpc >> i18ndir >> i18nrp >> ianaplan >> iasa2 >> iasa20 >> iccrg >> ice >> icnrg >> ideas >> ietf >> ila >> imapapnd >> insipid >> ipfix >> ipwave >> irtfopen >> isis >> jmap >> jsonbis >> justfont >> karp >> keyprov >> kitten >> ksk >> l2sm >> l2tpext >> l2vpn >> lamps >> ledbat >> lmap >> lsr >> lsvr >> maprg >> marf >> masque >> mboned >> mip6 >> mipshop >> mls >> modern >> monami6 >> morg >> netrqmts >> netslicing >> netvc >> nfsv4 >> nfvrg >> nwcrg >> openpgp >> opsarea >> opsawg >> opsec >> p2psip >> pals >> panrg >> paw >> paws >> pcn >> pearg >> perc >> privacypass >> qirg >> qresync >> quic >> raiarea >> rats >> rfcplusplus >> ript >> rsoc >> rtgarea >> rtgyangcoord >> rum >> saag >> sasl >> savi >> sdnrg >> secevent >> sidrops >> sip >> sipbrandy >> splices >> storm >> straw >> supa >> t2trg >> taps >> tcpinc >> teep >> tmrid >> tokbind >> tools-arch >> trill >> tsvarea >> tsvart >> txauth >> v6ops >> vcarddav >> vipr >> vnrg >> webpush >> webtrans >> wgtlgo >> wpack >> wugh >> xrblock >>=20 >> --=20 >> Jay Daley >> IETF Executive Director >> jay@ietf.org >>=20 >=20 >=20 --=20 Jay Daley IETF Executive Director jay@ietf.org --Apple-Mail=_A6053E1C-EB8D-4A2B-9E2F-392A2D89F95D Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Type: text/html; charset=us-ascii

On 15/03/2021, at 11:22 AM, John Levine <johnl@taugh.com> = wrote:

It appears that Jay Daley  <jay@ietf.org> said:
To support Robert as The = Tools Team PM, I am working on an RFP to move all the wiki pages in = existing trac instances to a new wiki
product and all the = issues to GitHb repositories.  In preparation for this work, I = propose to have all broken and unused Trac
instances = deleted so that we do not waste resources having those migrated. =  

Do we plan to keep = backups of the broken instances in case someone in
the = future thinks there was something of interest in them? I don't
propose offering a recovery service, just "here's a copy of = the files,
good luck and let us know if you find = anything."

Yes we do.

Jay


R's,
John




- Broken = instances are ones that cannot be started by the Trac software. =  They may well contain data but as no support calls have
been raised since they broke some years ago, I am assuming = they are no longer needed.

- Unused = instances are those with no edits made and no issues raised.

The following lists have been circulated to = the IESG and WG Chairs and one instance moved from one list to another. =  Please note:
there are multiple examples where a = specific WG/Team uses a set of wiki pages underneath inside another = wiki, not actual wiki set
aside for that purpose, which = remains unused.  e.g. genart pages are under the gen wiki not the = specific genart wiki, which is
unused.

This is just a final check to make sure there are no concerns = with this deletion.  Please let us know in the next few days if you = do
have a concern.

PS There = will be a follow up this week about what Wiki product I propose we = switch to.

thanks
Jay


1.  List of the broken = instances along with an estimated date for when they broke.  24 in = total.

Jun 10  2019 = ITU-T-CITS
Oct 22  2014 = aaadoctors
Jun 11  2019 add
Jul 10  2015 appsdir
Oct 22 =  2014 = genart
Jun 26  2019 iepg
Oct 22  2014 intdir
Oct 22 =  2014 = iotdir
Jun 11  2019 lake
Jun 11  2019 loops
Jun 26 =  2019 = mentor
Oct 22  2014 = mibdoctors
Jun 11  2019 mops
Oct 22  2014 opsdir
Oct 22 =  2014 = perfmetrdir
Oct 22  2014 raiart
Oct 22  2014 rsvpdir
Oct 22 =  2014 = rtgdir
Oct 22  2014 sdpdir
Oct 22  2014 secdir
Oct 22 =  2014 = smartpower
Jun 27  2019 tdd
Oct 22  2014 tsvdir
Oct 22 =  2014 = yangdoctors


2. =  List of unused Trac instances.  159 in total

16ng
6renum
acme
ancp
apparea
aqm
arcmedia
armd
artarea
artart
atoca
autoconf
avtext
babel
banana
bcause
bfcpbis
bimi
bmwg
cacao
calext
capport
capwap
cbor
cdni
cellar
cfrg
coinrg
coms
cose
csi
curdle
cuss
dart
dcrouting
dcrup
detnet
doh
drip
driu
emodir
enum
eppext
extra
fecframe
genarea
gendispatch
geojson
ghost
git
grow
hackathon
hotrfc
hrpc
i18ndir
i18nrp
ianaplan
iasa2
iasa20
iccrg
ice
icnrg
ideas
ietf
ila
imapapnd
insipid
ipfix
ipwave
irtfopen
isis
jmap
jsonbis
justfont
karp
keyprov
kitten
ksk
l2sm
l2tpext
l2vpn
lamps
ledbat
lmap
lsr
lsvr
maprg
marf
masque
mboned
mip6
mipshop
mls
modern
monami6
morg
netrqmts
netslicing
netvc
nfsv4
nfvrg
nwcrg
openpgp
opsarea
opsawg
opsec
p2psip
pals
panrg
paw
paws
pcnpearg
perc
privacypass
qirg
qresync
quic
raiarea
rats
rfcplusplus
ript
rsoc
rtgarea
rtgyangcoord
rum
saag
sasl
savi
sdnrg
secevent
sidrops
sip
sipbrandy
splices
storm
straw
supa
t2trg
taps
tcpinc
teep
tmrid
tokbind
tools-arch
trill
tsvarea
tsvart
txauth
v6ops
vcarddav
vipr
vnrg
webpush
webtrans
wgtlgo
wpack
wugh
xrblock

-- =
Jay Daley
IETF Executive Director
jay@ietf.org




-- 
Jay Daley
IETF = Executive Director
jay@ietf.org

= --Apple-Mail=_A6053E1C-EB8D-4A2B-9E2F-392A2D89F95D-- From nobody Sun Mar 14 15:50:58 2021 Return-Path: X-Original-To: tools-discuss@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: tools-discuss@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 22F403A174C; Sun, 14 Mar 2021 15:50:57 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.098 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.098 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_BLOCKED=0.001, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (1024-bit key) header.d=bluepopcorn.net Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id A203AuMHfoYR; Sun, 14 Mar 2021 15:50:55 -0700 (PDT) Received: from v2.bluepopcorn.net (v2.bluepopcorn.net [IPv6:2607:f2f8:a994::2]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 9C8243A174B; Sun, 14 Mar 2021 15:50:55 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; q=dns/txt; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=bluepopcorn.net; s=supersize; h=Content-Transfer-Encoding:Content-Type: MIME-Version:References:In-Reply-To:Message-ID:Date:Subject:Cc:To:From:Sender :Reply-To:Content-ID:Content-Description:Resent-Date:Resent-From: Resent-Sender:Resent-To:Resent-Cc:Resent-Message-ID:List-Id:List-Help: List-Unsubscribe:List-Subscribe:List-Post:List-Owner:List-Archive; bh=VpbTuZ7T1UAt+QtnjbXCDbbeJe9GBE8K+pNuMNBdxwk=; b=Y/lf2StZNuj4rhAGG0MsEu1wIf B16vhe0OZiLCTdNIHvxKsVA1X89idxjH3su0JTTZd2HvcWN6VbKKaQ8bfpSLcc5AoqGfP66cH811P SZtRyplmh4lAnPSsiy9ssTaViZpfLsC5A+Di8h+7OBbaI1GHrfVt8o2c+1jozAFHkNYY=; Received: from [2601:647:4400:1261:e162:6c95:d14:8f0b] (helo=[10.10.20.144]) by v2.bluepopcorn.net with esmtpsa (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.92) (envelope-from ) id 1lLZZW-0004N9-6f; Sun, 14 Mar 2021 15:50:54 -0700 From: "Jim Fenton" To: "Jay Daley" Cc: "Tools Discussion" Date: Sun, 14 Mar 2021 15:50:53 -0700 X-Mailer: MailMate (1.13.2r5673) Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <92319CB2-D3E0-433F-81A1-4AFE2220B854@ietf.org> References: <92319CB2-D3E0-433F-81A1-4AFE2220B854@ietf.org> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8"; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Tools-discuss] Deletion of unused and broken trac instances X-BeenThere: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF Tools Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sun, 14 Mar 2021 22:50:57 -0000 Jay, On 14 Mar 2021, at 14:34, Jay Daley wrote: > To support Robert as The Tools Team PM, I am working on an RFP to move > all the wiki pages in existing trac instances to a new wiki product > and all the issues to GitHb repositories. In preparation for this > work, I propose to have all broken and unused Trac instances deleted > so that we do not waste resources having those migrated. Does “all the issues” include the Datatracker issues? The current issue tracking system is hooked to subversion, where the datatracker code is managed, and I suspect we would lose that if the issues were migrated to GitHub. Unless there is also a plan to move the code to GitHub as well, of course. -Jim From nobody Sun Mar 14 16:02:29 2021 Return-Path: X-Original-To: tools-discuss@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: tools-discuss@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id E3B453A040F for ; Sun, 14 Mar 2021 16:02:28 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.898 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.898 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id DDgRe2DWVE2L; Sun, 14 Mar 2021 16:02:27 -0700 (PDT) Received: from jays-mbp.localdomain (unknown [158.140.230.105]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id C089A3A03FA; Sun, 14 Mar 2021 16:02:26 -0700 (PDT) From: Jay Daley Message-Id: <080B4ED4-8FB6-4A2E-A2B5-5C11C3C73F04@ietf.org> Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="Apple-Mail=_29BCAC00-4F7D-40BC-B808-6F306B18F39C" Mime-Version: 1.0 (Mac OS X Mail 13.4 \(3608.120.23.2.4\)) Date: Mon, 15 Mar 2021 12:02:23 +1300 In-Reply-To: Cc: Tools Discussion To: Jim Fenton References: <92319CB2-D3E0-433F-81A1-4AFE2220B854@ietf.org> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.3608.120.23.2.4) Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Tools-discuss] Deletion of unused and broken trac instances X-BeenThere: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF Tools Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sun, 14 Mar 2021 23:02:29 -0000 --Apple-Mail=_29BCAC00-4F7D-40BC-B808-6F306B18F39C Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 > On 15/03/2021, at 11:50 AM, Jim Fenton wrote: >=20 > Jay, >=20 > On 14 Mar 2021, at 14:34, Jay Daley wrote: >=20 >> To support Robert as The Tools Team PM, I am working on an RFP to = move all the wiki pages in existing trac instances to a new wiki product = and all the issues to GitHb repositories. In preparation for this work, = I propose to have all broken and unused Trac instances deleted so that = we do not waste resources having those migrated. >=20 > Does =E2=80=9Call the issues=E2=80=9D include the Datatracker issues? = The current issue tracking system is hooked to subversion, where the = datatracker code is managed, and I suspect we would lose that if the = issues were migrated to GitHub. Unless there is also a plan to move the = code to GitHub as well, of course. Sorry, I should have explained that Datatracker and xml2rfc sit outside = of this project as they are much larger code/issue bases. And yes, as = noted in Robert=E2=80=99s email [1], these are being moved to GitHub as = complete migrations. Jay [1] = https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/tools-discuss/oYrAxb3KayPzZ4SNB1DVZT= DPPNo/ >=20 > -Jim >=20 --=20 Jay Daley IETF Executive Director jay@ietf.org --Apple-Mail=_29BCAC00-4F7D-40BC-B808-6F306B18F39C Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Type: text/html; charset=utf-8

On 15/03/2021, at 11:50 AM, Jim Fenton <fenton@bluepopcorn.net> wrote:

Jay,

On 14 Mar 2021, at 14:34, = Jay Daley wrote:

To support Robert as The Tools Team PM, I am working on an = RFP to move all the wiki pages in existing trac instances to a new wiki = product and all the issues to GitHb repositories.  In preparation = for this work, I propose to have all broken and unused Trac instances = deleted so that we do not waste resources having those migrated.

Does =E2=80=9Call the issues=E2=80=9D= include the Datatracker issues? The current issue tracking system is = hooked to subversion, where the datatracker code is managed, and I = suspect we would lose that if the issues were migrated to GitHub. Unless = there is also a plan to move the code to GitHub as well, of course.

Sorry, = I should have explained that Datatracker and xml2rfc sit outside of this = project as they are much larger code/issue bases. And yes, as noted in = Robert=E2=80=99s email [1], these are being moved to GitHub as complete = migrations.

Jay



-Jim


-- 
Jay Daley
IETF = Executive Director
jay@ietf.org

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Zm8vaWV0Zi1hbm5vdW5jZQ0KPiANCj4gX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19f X19fX19fX19fX19fX18NCj4gSUVURi1Bbm5vdW5jZSBtYWlsaW5nIGxpc3QNCj4gSUVURi1Bbm5v dW5jZUBpZXRmLm9yZw0KPiBodHRwczovL3d3dy5pZXRmLm9yZy9tYWlsbWFuL2xpc3RpbmZvL2ll dGYtYW5ub3VuY2UNCg== From nobody Mon Mar 15 13:53:44 2021 Return-Path: X-Original-To: tools-discuss@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: tools-discuss@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id D2DA23A0E74 for ; Mon, 15 Mar 2021 13:53:42 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -6.9 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-6.9 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_HI=-5, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id YT41HgWn2MQG for ; Mon, 15 Mar 2021 13:53:40 -0700 (PDT) Received: from raoul.w3.org (raoul.w3.org [128.30.52.128]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id D2E013A0E76 for ; Mon, 15 Mar 2021 13:53:40 -0700 (PDT) Received: from c-24-63-251-193.hsd1.ma.comcast.net ([24.63.251.193] helo=sams-2020-air) by raoul.w3.org with esmtpsa (TLS1.3:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.92) (envelope-from ) id 1lLuDb-0001Qn-Ak; Mon, 15 Mar 2021 20:53:39 +0000 Date: Mon, 15 Mar 2021 16:53:38 -0400 (EDT) From: Samuel Weiler To: tools-discuss@ietf.org cc: plh@w3.org Message-ID: <834d516-4c99-c8d-aedd-cd843de3fe5@w3.org> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Archived-At: Subject: [Tools-discuss] BCP links to multiple RFCs broken (in inconsistent ways) X-BeenThere: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF Tools Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 15 Mar 2021 20:53:43 -0000 When one BCP number points at two docs, e.g. BCP14, the tools site shows a concatenation of the RFCs: https://tools.ietf.org/html/bcp14 The datatracker does inconsistent things. For BCP14, it only shows 2119, not 8174: https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/html/bcp14 For others, the datatracker misses all of the RFCs, instead pointing at an earlier i-d: https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/html/bcp6 https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/html/bcp9 https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/html/bcp13 -- Sam From nobody Mon Mar 15 14:15:10 2021 Return-Path: X-Original-To: tools-discuss@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: tools-discuss@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id F3B0D3A0EF4 for ; Mon, 15 Mar 2021 14:15:07 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.4 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.4 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, FREEMAIL_FORGED_FROMDOMAIN=0.249, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, HEADER_FROM_DIFFERENT_DOMAINS=0.25, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_H2=-0.001, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001] autolearn=no autolearn_force=no Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id hqlk3JEspCUG for ; Mon, 15 Mar 2021 14:15:05 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail-wr1-f46.google.com (mail-wr1-f46.google.com [209.85.221.46]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 64C8E3A0EF3 for ; Mon, 15 Mar 2021 14:15:05 -0700 (PDT) Received: by mail-wr1-f46.google.com with SMTP id j7so6384058wrd.1 for ; Mon, 15 Mar 2021 14:15:05 -0700 (PDT) X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:from:date:message-id:subject:to; bh=f0T/oHSEtjMVl6A8t7h0vB3oX7JccMF9Cf2sCyZLk9s=; b=YD/KfP7pwxjootGubviNNchlHTZwJp+L/UU5o7rjLiukA+i51HyB1gmFSOhQEtoG27 I4WMRcm7ZEgLzKyzpHKm6BFb5D4Z4t4AafUNX0RR/ASVtiiSgJMHkjB6TIfP5L0Pddjw RCmmpWGeWB5LuOTDOFsPxEoJPWGaB7OvRmnS6Pv0cekCfDcBlTj2njG9BszMPkJk24mW 7BVtwE5qY5/z1PSw2q7ev+FTY86Hi5CUQJRq9XvbbY3gH9YK7CmUdfu0Kvf+rAakpKGV o7nBo4iqw2WM6FKD5wnnIO4lDl1YpscdHuqjXX744iqd3ryexUXyigQVBDA8NRLy4GfX LaMg== X-Gm-Message-State: AOAM531ZAl8fXkPJRiPtm181FbsiYG1w27RECP6DXYnpxEJHiFf9Et9g cE1C1oj9AlXk5EH6xU8wXQRnjAuk9InTq9r6xe+fXpgUlA8= X-Google-Smtp-Source: ABdhPJwtCfXCAt+WX5Zht6HcAxZ04liTrdZX68GE6zHAeY9meKD/yXQfsuXwj3WAaQL/KNM1ki9piVuHpegX9dIrWJY= X-Received: by 2002:adf:fec5:: with SMTP id q5mr1426293wrs.43.1615842903646; Mon, 15 Mar 2021 14:15:03 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 From: Erik Nygren Date: Mon, 15 Mar 2021 17:14:53 -0400 Message-ID: To: tools-discuss@ietf.org Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="00000000000048e4f905bd99be16" Archived-At: Subject: [Tools-discuss] zulip feedback X-BeenThere: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF Tools Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 15 Mar 2021 21:15:08 -0000 --00000000000048e4f905bd99be16 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" I used Zulip during IETF110 and was quite pleased with how well it worked. I ended up not needing to use a Jabber client at all, and while still in a relay-mode it still added significant value for being able to search through and organize messages. I've used Zulip before outside of IETF, and I think some of the features Zulip provides would be extremely valuable if we switch to it as a primary tool. For example, the ability to have multiple active "topics" within a stream means that participants could more easily organize feedback on different topics within a meeting. Right now it can get quickly confusing in Jabber/XMPP with multiple parallel conversations within a WG chat, and Zulip provides a great ability to help organize this. It was hard to test this out during IETF110 due to the limited number of people using Zulip. Some improvements with the integration based on user-feedback also put us in a good position to do a broader trial of Zulip during IETF 111. Thanks! Erik --00000000000048e4f905bd99be16 Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
I used Zulip during IETF110 and was quite pleased with how well = it worked.=C2=A0 I ended up not needing to use a Jabber client at all, and = while still in a relay-mode it still added significant value for being able= to search through and organize messages.

I've used Zulip before out= side of IETF, and I think some of the features Zulip provides would be extr= emely valuable if we switch to it as a primary tool.=C2=A0 For example, the= ability to have multiple active "topics" within a stream means t= hat participants could more easily organize feedback on different topics wi= thin a meeting.=C2=A0 Right now it can get quickly confusing in Jabber/XMPP= with multiple parallel conversations within a WG chat, and Zulip provides = a great ability to help organize this.=C2=A0 It was hard to test this out d= uring IETF110 due to the limited number of people using Zulip.=C2=A0
Some improvements with the integration based on user-feedback also put us= in a good position to do a broader trial of Zulip during IETF 111.

Than= ks!

=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 Erik

--00000000000048e4f905bd99be16-- From nobody Mon Mar 15 14:52:54 2021 Return-Path: X-Original-To: tools-discuss@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: tools-discuss@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 968AA3A1047 for ; Mon, 15 Mar 2021 14:52:52 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.899 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.899 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id xMJXBEH42tCI for ; Mon, 15 Mar 2021 14:52:51 -0700 (PDT) Received: from jays-mbp.localdomain (unknown [158.140.230.105]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 43FA23A1043 for ; Mon, 15 Mar 2021 14:52:51 -0700 (PDT) From: Jay Daley Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Mime-Version: 1.0 (Mac OS X Mail 13.4 \(3608.120.23.2.4\)) Message-Id: <43C2AB59-6956-4314-82E9-1FAD36275363@ietf.org> Date: Tue, 16 Mar 2021 10:52:47 +1300 To: Tools Discussion X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.3608.120.23.2.4) Archived-At: Subject: [Tools-discuss] RFC and I-D publication feature matrix X-BeenThere: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF Tools Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 15 Mar 2021 21:52:52 -0000 As we all know, RFCs are published on three sites: RFC Editor site, = Datatracker and tools.ietf.org; and I-Ds on a different three: = www.ietf.org, Datatracker and tools.ietf.org. These documents are = published in TXT, HTMLised TXT, native HTML, PDF and XML, with different = sites publishing different combinations, different metadata, different = features, different URL structures and different combinations of links = to each other. To understand this and to help the various groups/people think about = what changes are needed to declutter this, I=E2=80=99ve been through = each of the three site and drawn up a comprehensive feature matrix: = https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1Ljj4QV6YmvQo4F8MtydZH9owvwH-dMOJcw= Saz5CW4E0/edit?usp=3Dsharing I so far have not looked at this through the lens of sub-series (e.g = BCP) Please let me know if you see any errors or omissions. Jay PS the switch between RFC 8179 and RFC 8719 for examples is deliberate = not a typo. --=20 Jay Daley IETF Executive Director jay@ietf.org From nobody Mon Mar 15 18:40:03 2021 Return-Path: X-Original-To: tools-discuss@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: tools-discuss@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 81C343A16AC; Mon, 15 Mar 2021 18:40:02 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.899 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.899 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id kVtnVyqxtXJn; Mon, 15 Mar 2021 18:40:00 -0700 (PDT) Received: from tuna.sandelman.ca (tuna.sandelman.ca [IPv6:2607:f0b0:f:3:216:3eff:fe7c:d1f3]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ADH-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 287E93A16AA; Mon, 15 Mar 2021 18:39:59 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by tuna.sandelman.ca (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5B1BA389A4; Mon, 15 Mar 2021 21:45:21 -0400 (EDT) Received: from tuna.sandelman.ca ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id NqFt-cllfr9Z; Mon, 15 Mar 2021 21:45:20 -0400 (EDT) Received: from sandelman.ca (obiwan.sandelman.ca [IPv6:2607:f0b0:f:2::247]) by tuna.sandelman.ca (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1E487389A2; Mon, 15 Mar 2021 21:45:20 -0400 (EDT) Received: from localhost (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by sandelman.ca (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9312F1FB; Mon, 15 Mar 2021 21:39:55 -0400 (EDT) From: Michael Richardson To: Jay Daley cc: Tools Discussion In-Reply-To: <43C2AB59-6956-4314-82E9-1FAD36275363@ietf.org> References: <43C2AB59-6956-4314-82E9-1FAD36275363@ietf.org> X-Mailer: MH-E 8.6+git; nmh 1.7+dev; GNU Emacs 26.1 X-Face: $\n1pF)h^`}$H>Hk{L"x@)JS7<%Az}5RyS@k9X%29-lHB$Ti.V>2bi.~ehC0; <'$9xN5Ub# z!G,p`nR&p7Fz@^UXIn156S8.~^@MJ*mMsD7=QFeq%AL4m Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Tools-discuss] RFC and I-D publication feature matrix X-BeenThere: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF Tools Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 16 Mar 2021 01:40:03 -0000 --=-=-= Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Jay Daley wrote: > As we all know, RFCs are published on three sites: RFC Editor site, > Datatracker and tools.ietf.org; and I-Ds on a different three: > www.ietf.org, Datatracker and tools.ietf.org. These documents are > published in TXT, HTMLised TXT, native HTML, PDF and XML, with > different sites publishing different combinations, different metadata, > different features, different URL structures and different combinatio= ns > of links to each other. Yes. That's quite a list and feature matrix. What have we done :-) > Please let me know if you see any errors or omissions. Information density is too high for me to see anything, but gosh I think you must have gotten it all there. =2D- Michael Richardson . o O ( IPv6 I=C3=B8T consulti= ng ) Sandelman Software Works Inc, Ottawa and Worldwide --=-=-= Content-Type: application/pgp-signature; name="signature.asc" -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- iQEzBAEBCgAdFiEEbsyLEzg/qUTA43uogItw+93Q3WUFAmBQDGsACgkQgItw+93Q 3WXSawgArB2Gj4MJeQY/JRv0MvkdsNqYR6a/JpWS1i3CEeICVKe6uYM+vVklUCXr CPVuitHfSbbJ5yubS9gALxgmU9ZssdUTSF1NU9x2N0ldE1M+3XUTvvPvzUg2tm3y brY5lEYpEN5bcIctmopZZ2NI9pBeU2V+1onkcj0mdRd2SyvTbWDFmvKPPDhgcKk6 39An+7G6v0cp7dFML+Ji0mFBlkWa0DPYrzzHKzpeVh2uTs/Jh2QmMzU451+iqB3e ub1a4sC0aZwbPxBG0V1HiGV67mwHAfz7sO3n8sIzsCSZR71q/ILJp1DWXHdIt93y qC37mF77Z3p1vkOB/lYeIZJFsgFUaQ== =mYAV -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --=-=-=-- From nobody Tue Mar 16 02:27:20 2021 Return-Path: X-Original-To: tools-discuss@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: tools-discuss@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id A35983A2005 for ; Tue, 16 Mar 2021 02:27:18 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: 0.648 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=0.648 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_ADSP_CUSTOM_MED=0.001, FORGED_GMAIL_RCVD=1, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, NICE_REPLY_A=-0.001, NML_ADSP_CUSTOM_MED=0.9, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_H4=-0.01, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_WL=-0.01, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_SOFTFAIL=0.665, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=no autolearn_force=no Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id H3-17kazhk-U for ; Tue, 16 Mar 2021 02:27:17 -0700 (PDT) Received: from sainfoin-smtp-out.extra.cea.fr (sainfoin-smtp-out.extra.cea.fr [132.167.192.228]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 211513A2004 for ; Tue, 16 Mar 2021 02:27:08 -0700 (PDT) Received: from pisaure.intra.cea.fr (pisaure.intra.cea.fr [132.166.88.21]) by sainfoin-sys.extra.cea.fr (8.14.7/8.14.7/CEAnet-Internet-out-4.0) with ESMTP id 12G9R5Av022589; Tue, 16 Mar 2021 10:27:05 +0100 Received: from pisaure.intra.cea.fr (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by localhost (Postfix) with SMTP id C87F22048D6; Tue, 16 Mar 2021 10:27:05 +0100 (CET) Received: from muguet1-smtp-out.intra.cea.fr (muguet1-smtp-out.intra.cea.fr [132.166.192.12]) by pisaure.intra.cea.fr (Postfix) with ESMTP id BA4D1202EF4; Tue, 16 Mar 2021 10:27:05 +0100 (CET) Received: from [10.14.9.77] ([10.14.9.77]) by muguet1-sys.intra.cea.fr (8.14.7/8.14.7/CEAnet-Internet-out-4.0) with ESMTP id 12G9R5dN018651; Tue, 16 Mar 2021 10:27:05 +0100 To: Michael Richardson , tools-discuss@ietf.org References: <10380.1615562014@localhost> From: Alexandre Petrescu Message-ID: <03a3fea4-96e4-8cda-4275-8c6dc0cffedf@gmail.com> Date: Tue, 16 Mar 2021 10:27:05 +0100 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows NT 10.0; Win64; x64; rv:78.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/78.8.1 MIME-Version: 1.0 In-Reply-To: <10380.1615562014@localhost> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8; format=flowed Content-Language: fr Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Tools-discuss] some more meetecho thoughts X-BeenThere: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF Tools Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 16 Mar 2021 09:27:19 -0000 Le 12/03/2021 à 16:13, Michael Richardson a écrit : > > Some thoughts/refinements. I think we are supposed to post them here, right? > > 1) when the participants clicks on the _share screen_ button that it should > immediately ask the participant to select the window to share, but just > not transmit until the chair gives them the media slot. > Ideally, showing the participant what they are transmitting. As a side note, it is a good idea that can be tried to give the presenter the possibility to share the screen. In detail there are two things: slide advancement and mouse pointing. The slide advancement can be done by chairs listening to indications from presenter saying 'next slide please'. But the pointing with the mouse is best done by the presenter. The presenter moves the pointer to the relevant parts of the screen that /she talks about. I find that way of presenting to be useful for listeners. This pointing with the mouse could be achieved naturally by the presenter if it is her who shares the screen (not the Chairs), or it can be a new 'pointer sharing' button similar to 'screen sharing'. > > This would eliminate many of the delays in switching presenters. > (Unified slide decks are good, but not always better if the agenda is more > fluid.) > > But, I think, the more important thing is that it would allow participants > to sort out the local permissions, browser compatibility, etc. and they > could do this if they wanted, in the three minutes before the meeting starts. > > It might also be good if multiple slide sharers could be "on deck", with > the chair switching between them. {Personally, I'd even like to have > multiple windows shared and swap between them fast, but that's perhaps too > esoteric.} This mechanism could be tried too. > > 2) it would be really cool if the chairs could see a preview of the share > before they agree, but that's really not required :-) > > 3) could chairs give presentation permission to a participant before they > ask? that seems to occupy 10s of back and forth in some meetings. > Yes, that's an interaction with (1). > > 4) of course, doing it the BBB way, projecting PDF from a server, and > allowing the mouse to hover, even draw, is WAY better, so (1) above is > really only important if this isn't coming. Yes - for the drawing part - a pointer sharing option (mouse sharing). > > 5) I'd sure like to put all the video frames under my slides. > Others might disagree, but that seems to fit my screen real-estate better. > I want the slides bigger. 6) the presenter should see the videos of attendees (like in a real room), and the attendees should see the video of the presenter (also, like in a real room). Right now we have mostly the videos of Chairs most of the time. It works well when it is the Chairs who talk, and their guidance is probably the most important out of a meeting. But this way of working (see mostly the Chair videos) can some times be confusing, and even provoke some problems some times. 7) there should be an option of a compiled version of meetecho so I can try it outside the browser. I suspect there might be some performance problems because of running inside some particular browser. I can never know until I try. Alex > > ---- > > While we've had training session for chairs, and some for participants, it's > not enough I think. > It would be great if there was a room online, perhaps configured for 5 > participants max, where the first person to arrive gets chair permission. > (And maybe the room would reboot every hour or so) > If nothing else, that would let mentoring on the tool occur. > > > -- > Michael Richardson . o O ( IPv6 IøT consulting ) > Sandelman Software Works Inc, Ottawa and Worldwide > > > > > > ___________________________________________________________ > Tools-discuss mailing list - Tools-discuss@ietf.org > This list is for discussion, not for action requests or bug reports. > * Report datatracker and mailarchive bugs to: datatracker-project@ietf.org > * Report tools.ietf.org bugs to: webmaster@tools.ietf.org > * Report all other bugs or issues to: ietf-action@ietf.org > List info (including how to Unsubscribe): https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/tools-discuss > From nobody Tue Mar 16 02:43:38 2021 Return-Path: X-Original-To: tools-discuss@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: tools-discuss@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 867EF3A2054 for ; 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Tue, 16 Mar 2021 09:43:22 +0000 From: Thomas Fossati To: "tools-discuss@ietf.org" Thread-Topic: The Zulip experience Thread-Index: AQHXGkjNkwZfIO9rr0yxfgBnM2xVZg== Date: Tue, 16 Mar 2021 09:43:22 +0000 Message-ID: <7B34753A-9954-47B6-8F8E-2A24DF5355CB@contoso.com> Accept-Language: en-GB, en-US Content-Language: en-GB X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: user-agent: Microsoft-MacOutlook/16.46.21021202 Authentication-Results-Original: ietf.org; dkim=none (message not signed) header.d=none;ietf.org; dmarc=none action=none header.from=arm.com; x-originating-ip: [82.12.10.179] x-ms-publictraffictype: Email X-MS-Office365-Filtering-HT: Tenant X-MS-Office365-Filtering-Correlation-Id: 215da9d4-d924-4519-d158-08d8e85ff514 x-ms-traffictypediagnostic: DBBPR08MB4806:|AM0PR08MB5139: X-Microsoft-Antispam-PRVS: x-checkrecipientrouted: true nodisclaimer: true x-ms-oob-tlc-oobclassifiers: OLM:9508;OLM:10000; X-MS-Exchange-SenderADCheck: 1 X-Microsoft-Antispam-Untrusted: BCL:0; X-Microsoft-Antispam-Message-Info-Original: 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 X-Forefront-Antispam-Report-Untrusted: CIP:255.255.255.255; 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Tue, 16 Mar 2021 09:44:27 -0500 (CDT) (envelope-from rjsparks@nostrum.com) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=simple/simple; d=nostrum.com; s=default; t=1615905867; bh=DVji6IwCiUHJI0wSD0oywR3HIPC8yFMTghzpv433cfM=; h=To:References:From:Subject:Date:In-Reply-To; b=S/IP0E51WwVMC1jkjOPHZwh4CeTfj5rArbo/wCPrgOUnqb6XskfOVAsqm1+BwoMc8 I6Hk0N0HBR4u0rleCY68w5JJsRl4Aa5fpWDYVql20eo/Sw4bi7nzAbH5kinoKu572P beovJMUNBoPcqDXYCADnZLHqajd8c7042hGWKNPA= X-Authentication-Warning: raven.nostrum.com: Host [47.186.1.92] claimed to be unformal.local To: tools-discuss@ietf.org References: <834d516-4c99-c8d-aedd-cd843de3fe5@w3.org> From: Robert Sparks Message-ID: <35d1f7ae-df08-590d-9245-96e20f32ee66@nostrum.com> Date: Tue, 16 Mar 2021 09:44:21 -0500 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Macintosh; Intel Mac OS X 10.15; rv:78.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/78.8.0 MIME-Version: 1.0 In-Reply-To: <834d516-4c99-c8d-aedd-cd843de3fe5@w3.org> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Language: en-US Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Tools-discuss] BCP links to multiple RFCs broken (in inconsistent ways) X-BeenThere: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF Tools Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 16 Mar 2021 14:44:33 -0000 Thanks Sam - Adding that to a ticket that had noted part of that problem = already. See https://trac.tools.ietf.org/tools/ietfdb/ticket/3233 RjS On 3/15/21 3:53 PM, Samuel Weiler wrote: > When one BCP number points at two docs, e.g. BCP14, the tools site=20 > shows a concatenation of the RFCs: > > https://tools.ietf.org/html/bcp14 > > > The datatracker does inconsistent things.=C2=A0 For BCP14, it only show= s=20 > 2119, not 8174: > > https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/html/bcp14 > > > For others, the datatracker misses all of the RFCs, instead pointing=20 > at an earlier i-d: > > https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/html/bcp6 > https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/html/bcp9 > https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/html/bcp13 > > -- Sam > > ___________________________________________________________ > Tools-discuss mailing list - Tools-discuss@ietf.org > This list is for discussion, not for action requests or bug reports. > * Report datatracker and mailarchive bugs to:=20 > datatracker-project@ietf.org > * Report tools.ietf.org bugs to: webmaster@tools.ietf.org > * Report all other bugs or issues to: ietf-action@ietf.org > List info (including how to Unsubscribe):=20 > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/tools-discuss From nobody Tue Mar 16 08:51:24 2021 Return-Path: X-Original-To: tools-discuss@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: tools-discuss@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 57AB83A121C for ; Tue, 16 Mar 2021 08:51:23 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.897 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.897 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_NONE=0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id v7InRGxHo-TJ for ; Tue, 16 Mar 2021 08:51:21 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail.smeinc.net (mail.smeinc.net [209.135.209.11]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher AECDH-AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 388E23A121B for ; Tue, 16 Mar 2021 08:51:21 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.smeinc.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 552AF300B72 for ; Tue, 16 Mar 2021 11:51:18 -0400 (EDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at mail.smeinc.net Received: from mail.smeinc.net ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (mail.smeinc.net [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10026) with ESMTP id Jc-JQQLGOsHF for ; Tue, 16 Mar 2021 11:51:16 -0400 (EDT) Received: from [192.168.1.161] (pool-141-156-161-153.washdc.fios.verizon.net [141.156.161.153]) by mail.smeinc.net (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id DC6A53001A8; Tue, 16 Mar 2021 11:51:15 -0400 (EDT) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Mime-Version: 1.0 (Mac OS X Mail 12.4 \(3445.104.17\)) From: Russ Housley In-Reply-To: <35d1f7ae-df08-590d-9245-96e20f32ee66@nostrum.com> Date: Tue, 16 Mar 2021 11:51:16 -0400 Cc: tools-discuss@ietf.org Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Message-Id: References: <834d516-4c99-c8d-aedd-cd843de3fe5@w3.org> <35d1f7ae-df08-590d-9245-96e20f32ee66@nostrum.com> To: Robert Sparks X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.3445.104.17) Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Tools-discuss] BCP links to multiple RFCs broken (in inconsistent ways) X-BeenThere: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF Tools Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 16 Mar 2021 15:51:23 -0000 Why doesn't the datatracker serve the .html file for the BCP from the = RFC Editor? Russ > On Mar 16, 2021, at 10:44 AM, Robert Sparks = wrote: >=20 > Thanks Sam - Adding that to a ticket that had noted part of that = problem already. >=20 > See https://trac.tools.ietf.org/tools/ietfdb/ticket/3233 >=20 > RjS >=20 > On 3/15/21 3:53 PM, Samuel Weiler wrote: >> When one BCP number points at two docs, e.g. BCP14, the tools site = shows a concatenation of the RFCs: >>=20 >> https://tools.ietf.org/html/bcp14 >>=20 >>=20 >> The datatracker does inconsistent things. For BCP14, it only shows = 2119, not 8174: >>=20 >> https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/html/bcp14 >>=20 >>=20 >> For others, the datatracker misses all of the RFCs, instead pointing = at an earlier i-d: >>=20 >> https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/html/bcp6 >> https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/html/bcp9 >> https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/html/bcp13 >>=20 >> -- Sam >>=20 >> ___________________________________________________________ >> Tools-discuss mailing list - Tools-discuss@ietf.org >> This list is for discussion, not for action requests or bug reports. >> * Report datatracker and mailarchive bugs to: = datatracker-project@ietf.org >> * Report tools.ietf.org bugs to: webmaster@tools.ietf.org >> * Report all other bugs or issues to: ietf-action@ietf.org >> List info (including how to Unsubscribe): = https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/tools-discuss >=20 > ___________________________________________________________ > Tools-discuss mailing list - Tools-discuss@ietf.org > This list is for discussion, not for action requests or bug reports. > * Report datatracker and mailarchive bugs to: = datatracker-project@ietf.org > * Report tools.ietf.org bugs to: webmaster@tools.ietf.org > * Report all other bugs or issues to: ietf-action@ietf.org > List info (including how to Unsubscribe): = https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/tools-discuss From nobody Tue Mar 16 14:27:08 2021 Return-Path: X-Original-To: tools-discuss@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: tools-discuss@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8782B3A0FEC for ; Tue, 16 Mar 2021 14:27:06 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.899 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.899 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id SEN6QNb2R3FU for ; Tue, 16 Mar 2021 14:27:04 -0700 (PDT) Received: from tuna.sandelman.ca (tuna.sandelman.ca [IPv6:2607:f0b0:f:3:216:3eff:fe7c:d1f3]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ADH-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 9124A3A0FED for ; Tue, 16 Mar 2021 14:27:04 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by tuna.sandelman.ca (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2EF51389AC for ; Tue, 16 Mar 2021 17:32:31 -0400 (EDT) Received: from tuna.sandelman.ca ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id GVaah2sqyBoQ for ; Tue, 16 Mar 2021 17:32:30 -0400 (EDT) Received: from sandelman.ca (obiwan.sandelman.ca [IPv6:2607:f0b0:f:2::247]) by tuna.sandelman.ca (Postfix) with ESMTP id BE3D6389A3 for ; Tue, 16 Mar 2021 17:32:30 -0400 (EDT) Received: from localhost (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by sandelman.ca (Postfix) with ESMTP id 26752D5 for ; Tue, 16 Mar 2021 17:27:03 -0400 (EDT) From: Michael Richardson To: tools-discuss@ietf.org In-Reply-To: References: <834d516-4c99-c8d-aedd-cd843de3fe5@w3.org> <35d1f7ae-df08-590d-9245-96e20f32ee66@nostrum.com> X-Mailer: MH-E 8.6+git; nmh 1.7+dev; GNU Emacs 26.1 X-Face: $\n1pF)h^`}$H>Hk{L"x@)JS7<%Az}5RyS@k9X%29-lHB$Ti.V>2bi.~ehC0; <'$9xN5Ub# z!G,p`nR&p7Fz@^UXIn156S8.~^@MJ*mMsD7=QFeq%AL4m Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Tools-discuss] BCP links to multiple RFCs broken (in inconsistent ways) X-BeenThere: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF Tools Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 16 Mar 2021 21:27:07 -0000 --=-=-= Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Russ Housley wrote: > Why doesn't the datatracker serve the .html file for the BCP from the= RFC Editor? That's a good question! I think that aside from reducing duplication, it would also raise the SEO of that copy, and I think that we want to point more to rfc-editor.org, where = errata, etc. are best available. =2D- Michael Richardson . o O ( IPv6 I=C3=B8T consulti= ng ) Sandelman Software Works Inc, Ottawa and Worldwide --=-=-= Content-Type: application/pgp-signature; name="signature.asc" -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- iQEzBAEBCgAdFiEEbsyLEzg/qUTA43uogItw+93Q3WUFAmBRIqYACgkQgItw+93Q 3WXI1Qf7BCAS7Pu72GtQyF9QJ+3zksgbIB7PF4KNNvocUMN+UYZh/bqcWUtAmlR9 LJAFTxfcjk+T/VIWRb555XV7KDp1PmD54uk4zGnmXYmZ7mBVPIkvpMt6wuWbxMXE ivWppNTuV/lWcXKC7jjlo2oL3TnfGcT9IKZ8a4s0eihDklgeEo+rh0sWCx9ABP6K g5FwNuGnHe+nW4U0AwVtOc2IppGC6JErCn1kmqgkPg4QYBXn48b63AxOG9Hce4bH 1sLafSF9aatQn0A37gQqFCIg0ytA4x5rzckjCQ6AsiMWAzk6LE2EmIDGB8XuXHdB Jb7A1FFbjZRv26DR2vk8U20QGZ/4bQ== =SFW9 -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --=-=-=-- From nobody Wed Mar 17 14:08:07 2021 Return-Path: X-Original-To: tools-discuss@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: tools-discuss@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5D1B03A14ED for ; Wed, 17 Mar 2021 14:08:05 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.899 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.899 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id zLznIZD85fBP for ; Wed, 17 Mar 2021 14:08:04 -0700 (PDT) Received: from jays-mbp.localdomain (unknown [158.140.230.105]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id EC8303A14E8 for ; Wed, 17 Mar 2021 14:08:03 -0700 (PDT) From: Jay Daley Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Mime-Version: 1.0 (Mac OS X Mail 13.4 \(3608.120.23.2.4\)) Message-Id: <046E0411-BA06-4BAA-8BA6-7F73BB048604@ietf.org> Date: Thu, 18 Mar 2021 10:08:00 +1300 To: Tools Discussion X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.3608.120.23.2.4) Archived-At: Subject: [Tools-discuss] Chat services - my feedback X-BeenThere: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF Tools Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 17 Mar 2021 21:08:05 -0000 For these trials I've continued to use Jabber, which I=E2=80=99m very = familiar with, added on Matrix and used it for non-IETF use and tried = Zulip regularly. My preference by a long way is Zulip. My reason for discounting Jabber is that the clients are simply too = crude and that actively hampers my experience. I can=E2=80=99t see any = likelihood that will change so far as is needed to make this a = competitor despite big improvements like movim. My reason for discounting Matrix is that it=E2=80=99s nothing more than = a working version of jabber with the same one-dimensional approach to = chat. That=E2=80=99s fine for a realtime conversation, but very poor = for asynchronous communications as we have in the IETF. While threading = is on the roadmap [1] it=E2=80=99s being added as a feature not a core = design choice. Zulip on the other hand has a much more sophisticated chat model with = the use of Streams and Topics within them, which has significant = potential to actively enhance the work of the IETF rather than simply = redirect a bunch of messages to a different platform as happens with the = Jabber/Matrix. Used well, and that would not be hard, Zulip could be a = very powerful tool. Tim April has provided some useful thoughts on that = already [2]. Jay [1] https://github.com/vector-im/roadmap/issues/8 [2] = https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/tools-discuss/WAvOx6dkPKu-UanUYtzeNh= Gjydg/ --=20 Jay Daley IETF Executive Director jay@ietf.org From nobody Thu Mar 18 12:13:30 2021 Return-Path: X-Original-To: tools-discuss@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: tools-discuss@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id DECFF3A3217 for ; Thu, 18 Mar 2021 12:13:28 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: 0.052 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=0.052 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_40=-0.001, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, FREEMAIL_ENVFROM_END_DIGIT=0.25, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE=-0.0001, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, TVD_SPACE_RATIO=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=gmail.com Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id YH4kNXZH7gNs for ; 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Tue, 30 Mar 2021 15:28:27 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 Date: Tue, 30 Mar 2021 15:28:27 -0700 From: Glen To: tools-discuss@ietf.org In-Reply-To: <7CC7A427-33B2-42CE-82A1-D1216C3FD3A9@akamai.com> References: <7CC7A427-33B2-42CE-82A1-D1216C3FD3A9@akamai.com> User-Agent: Roundcube Webmail/1.4.11 Message-ID: <74714f5b0bf73919f199a135a137f2a5@amsl.com> X-Sender: glen@amsl.com Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Tools-discuss] Chat services X-BeenThere: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF Tools Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 30 Mar 2021 22:28:29 -0000 On 2021-03-30 09:35, Salz, Rich wrote: > I am also a Zulip fan. I liked Jay’s note [1] and will emphasize > Jay’s mention of Tim’s suggestions [2] as they really show how to > make good use of the tool. I wonder if we have any feedback from our > IT folks about the operational aspects of the various tools? CC’ing > Glen. > Zulip is great; it seems to be the only tool that got feedback > post-110. It’s open source, which some will find interesting > and/or compelling. Hi Rich, Everyone - Certainly. So we had three different things we were trying out, and I'll first summarize my experience with each, from an IT perspective. PROSODY + CONVERSE Prosody is simply a Jabber server. In this case, we were using Prosody as a platform on which we were issuing individual Jabber accounts to people. This was in response to a commonly-heard concern that some people found it difficult to find Jabber servers of their own to use. In the past I have, every few meetings, gone out and searched for live Jabber servers that worked, and provided a "top 5" list to participants. In this case, since we were doing trials, we just offered to let people sign up for IETF-provided (but temporary) accounts. Converse is a Javascript-based Jabber client. In this case, we used it to allow people with local Prosody accounts to use a web-based client for Jabber, and to connect to chatrooms on the IETF Jabber server. This was the most simple of the systems overall. It just provided a basic Jabber client, and Jabber account server. As expected, it was simple to operate. Deployment was via prepackaged RPM, with some hack work to integrate Converse. It worked well in our private-cloud-based shared hosting setup, and was low maintenance. Administrative things like adding and removing accounts and changing passwords was command-line easy, and utilization was low. There is no database per se, just a directory tree of per-user .dat files, so it's pretty simple on the backend as well. From a user perspective, it's... Jabber. It solves the connectivity problems we've heard people report, and it's fine in that role. MATRIX Matrix is an alternative instant messaging platform. In this case, we were using Matrix directly, but as a kind of bridge-to-Jabber client, where individuals could connect through a bridge to IETF Jabber rooms, thereby using Matrix as kind of a glorified Jabber client. This system was easy to install. Deployment was via pip/PyPI, with a Python-standard virtual environment. Configuration was straightforward. Operationally, however, there were a number of challenges, most of which pertain to the Matrix design paradigm. The first challenge I discovered as a result of a warning from my backup system that a server backup was taking longer than expected. I discovered after a hunt that we had a database file that had grown (quickly!) to 90GB. By default, Matrix uses Sqlite3, but I was later informed by the Matrix team that I should have chosen Postgres. Nonetheless, the database size was problematic. Searching online, I discovered that in Matrix, individual servers are all linked together (hence, I suspect, the name), and content - both user accounts and conversation history - exist on many servers at the same time. Our Matrix node was not an "IETF Matrix Server" so much as an "IETF-hosted mirror of parts of the global Matrix network." As I tried to work with the database by hand, I discovered that a number of (hidden and unwanted) chat rooms had been mirrored to our server, and a number of hidden chatrooms had been created on our server - which appeared to account for a lot of the space utilization I observed. In Matrix, administration is based on room ownership, not server ownership; as a result, it was almost impossible for me to "break in" to a hidden room, or perform any type of real moderation functions from a server perspective. Server operations have to be done via a CURL-driven API, and are not as robust as I'd need them to be. That means that there is no way for us to impose structure on a Matrix deployment, or to enforce terms of Note Well participation in a Matrix environment. I would also not have been able to handle account issues or password resets or requests of that type. For our purposes, it's more or less an external public chat. The final operational challenge I faced was bridging. On Matrix, the bridging to Jabber was custom work done by the Matrix team, off-site (i.e. not a part of our server.) To this date, I have no way of setting up a bridge between Matrix and Jabber. As a result, I was unable to add access to some additional Jabber rooms for 110, or to interact with the server directly for that purpose. I understand that Matrix is under active development and, in the future, I am certain that these issues will become more clearly defined and implemented. For now, however, operating Matrix is challenging on these levels. Because of the database loading and content, I would not operate this on a shared server, but I would set up separate hosts just for Matrix. As others have mentioned, from a user perspective, it's essentially enhanced Jabber. It's much more a global community/chat environment that isn't really "owned" by any participant. In my mind it's kind of "what (fill in older messaging system of your choice) should have been." ZULIP: Zulip is not so much an instant messaging platform as a structured collaboration platform. It does provide instant messaging, and it does work well, but it is much more specific in its design paradigm and does not attempt to be a global messaging system (like Jabber or Matrix.) Instead, it is focused on being operated and used by a specific organization (such as the IETF.) and on organizing conversations and content in an intuitive, readable way. Unlike the other software, which could be deployed as individual packages in a shared server environment, Zulip requires a dedicated virtual server/host on which to run. I never run anything without a backup, so in operation I'd want to set up at least two (or more) separate virtual hosts in order to provide the redundancy we give the IETF on its other platforms. This is not a problem - on the AMS private cloud, it was easy to set up a new host, but the OS requirement was for a Linux flavor other than the one I normally use, so my initial path was a bit different. However, once I provisioned the server, everything else was pretty much automatic. Deployment was via a tarball download with a self-enclosed shell script, which ran a form of puppet to perform serverwide configuration of database, email, webserver... basically everything. After launching the script, it was very hands-off. Pre-launch configuration involved just a few changes to some config files, followed by a re-run of the deployment to update everything to match. Operationally, Zulip was very easy to administer and manage. Since this was a separate server I had to make some minor changes to hook in email, and I used the "matterbridge" program to provide bridging between Jabber and Zulip. In-system administration is really nice, with clear controls over streams, and lots of flexibility in how the system is configured. I was able to deal with typical administrative issues, and access and understand the database layout, without any trouble at all. Zulip has a very interesting hybrid API/Bot system that let us do things like link in list archives into the Zulip system. Of course the IETF has a powerful and custom Mail archive tool, but it was very interesting to see how easy it was to feed mailing list content into Zulip, in a way that was useful and intuitive. There are other opportunities there as well: At one point, for example, I found myself playing with server monitoring systems, and feeding server performance and/or uptime notifications into Zulip as kind of a "status page" test, and considering other ways of connecting Zulip with (for example) things like Gitlab and the like. There is a lot of interesting potential there. From a user perspective, Zulip is not Jabber. It has a Jabber-like ability, but it's really more like a combination of Jabber plus Slack plus an Email archive plus an application bridge. Indeed, I could see Zulip being used by the IETF as a Slack replacement quite effectively: It brings a number of improvements over Slack that I believe are compelling, and the integration of Jabber conversations with Email lists plus Zulip's own stream/threading model could potentially bring the best of all worlds to a single site. FINAL COMMENTS In the deployment of all three systems, I was very grateful to have the support and guidance of experts in each of the particular systems we tried. While each system has benefits and challenges, the people were universally patient and excellent. I wish to thank all of the teams for answering my questions and being patient with my inquiries as I undertook to operate all three systems for the IETF. Jabber is Jabber (by which I mean to imply: "We know it, it's been here forever, and we're used to it") and I think that it's useful, and I think it works reasonably well. We do have the occasional number of connectivity complaints from time to time, and it's "server-to-server" mentality makes diagnosing connectivity issues challenging. So I was kind of sad to see so much attention in these trials focused on "bridging to Jabber." Speaking only for myself, I really wanted people to look at Prosody/Converse from the point of view of "did this solve my connectivity problem", and at Matrix/Zulip from the point of view of "what uniqueness/benefit might these platforms bring *beyond* Jabber." In my role as the IETF's operations vendor, I don't set any policies or make any decisions, and that's as it should be: It is the users who should be providing feedback to the leadership, and the leadership who should be making the decisions about the best ways forward. I have tried to encourage this on all three platforms with messages posted on them from time to time during the trial period. I myself gave all three platforms equal time and participation, both in terms of setup, administration/operations, and user testing. That said, speaking only as an individual, at the end of the day, I found myself personally gravitating towards Zulip, not only because it was the most pleasant to administer and operate, but also because I felt it was the most unique environment, and brings with it the greatest potential for benefit to the IETF and the community. I think we're going to need to continue to use Jabber for a long time, and I think that running Prosody/Converse to provide that might be a good thing to consider doing long-term. But looking at each package individually, I think that Zulip brings such functional improvements that it is worth operating on its own, whether the IETF continues with Jabber, or not. I hope this information was helpful, and would be happy to answer specific questions if that would be helpful. Glen -- Glen Barney IT Director AMS (IETF Secretariat) From nobody Tue Mar 30 18:06:50 2021 Return-Path: X-Original-To: tools-discuss@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: tools-discuss@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id C37F43A0DC2 for ; Tue, 30 Mar 2021 18:06:47 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.899 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.899 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id ct7A8Mzk6w9D for ; Tue, 30 Mar 2021 18:06:43 -0700 (PDT) Received: from jays-mbp.localdomain (unknown [158.140.230.105]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 1157B3A0DBE for ; Tue, 30 Mar 2021 18:06:42 -0700 (PDT) From: Jay Daley Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Mime-Version: 1.0 (Mac OS X Mail 13.4 \(3608.120.23.2.4\)) Message-Id: Date: Wed, 31 Mar 2021 14:06:39 +1300 To: Tools Discussion X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.3608.120.23.2.4) Archived-At: Subject: [Tools-discuss] Gathering requirements for a new wiki X-BeenThere: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF Tools Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 31 Mar 2021 01:06:48 -0000 I=E2=80=99m helping out the Tools Team PM (Robert) with the migration of = functionality from tools.ietf.org and one area that needs addressing is = wikis. We currently use Trac to provide wikis though Trac itself has a = broader applicability for software project management. The Secretariat = maintains a Trac installation at https://trac.ietf.org with separate = instances for each current Working Group (WG), Directorate, Team, and = most concluded WGs. Some of the wiki instances only point to other = resources, others are reasonably detailed, while the majority appear to = be unused or broken (cannot be started).=20 The full usage stats are: =E2=80=A2 Total 364 =E2=80=A2 Unused 157 =E2=80=A2 Broken 28 =E2=80=A2 In use - wiki 140 =E2=80=A2 In use - issues 39 We are proposing to replace Trac with a new wiki product and instead of = having multiple public instances, have a single community wiki, with the = existing pages copied over. This will be a true community wiki with any = member of the community able to add/change pages and reorganise as = needed, moderated by other members of the community and the secretariat, = and provided they have a datatracker login to authenticate with. = Private pages will be allowed, but their creation controlled by the = admins. In multiple small discussions with the community, the following = requirements have emerged for new wiki software: =E2=80=A2 Strategic =E2=80=A2 Must be available at reasonable cost (to the IETF LLC) = for possibly thousands of users. =E2=80=A2 Must be widely used, well documented, actively = developed and actively supported to ensure that we do not end up with a = dead-end product. This includes any required plugins. =E2=80=A2 Must be a specific wiki product and not a larger = product that includes a wiki as one part of its functionality, to = prevent complications and overlaps with other tools. =E2=80=A2 Must be scalable to support tens of thousands of users = to support the full IETF community and reasonable future growth. =E2=80=A2 Content =E2=80=A2 Must support a text based input language. =E2=80=A2 Must support code snippets, maths expressions and = diagrams to enable the full representation of the same kind of content = as found in I-Ds and RFCs. =E2=80=A2 Must provide an excellent mobile experience. =E2=80=A2 Must provide content backup, change visibility, and = the ability to revert changes =E2=80=A2 Should support Markdown by default for page content. =E2=80=A2 Should support git for content backup and change = visibility. =E2=80=A2 Should provide a WYSIWYG editor for Markdown that can = be used interchangeably with direct Markdown editing. =E2=80=A2 Should have a themable interface to enable the wiki to = be given a look and feel consistent with www.ietf.org. =E2=80=A2 Integration =E2=80=A2 Must support OIDC for authentication and role = permissions. =E2=80=A2 Must support custom module development. =E2=80=A2 Should support Matomo for web analytics so that these = can be integrated with our website statistics. =E2=80=A2 Local management (if self-hosted) =E2=80=A2 Must support either MySql/MariaDB or PostgreSQL as = those are the database products supported by the IT operations team. =E2=80=A2 Must run on Linux and should run in a Docker container = to fit with the management processes of the IT operations team. We would like your views on these requirements so that we can move to = assessing products. thanks Jay --=20 Jay Daley IETF Executive Director jay@ietf.org From nobody Wed Mar 31 00:14:11 2021 Return-Path: X-Original-To: tools-discuss@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: tools-discuss@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3BC6A3A1D82; Wed, 31 Mar 2021 00:14:09 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -4.219 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-4.219 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-2.3, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_H4=-0.01, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_WL=-0.01, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id JWMHfE47oIWq; Wed, 31 Mar 2021 00:14:07 -0700 (PDT) Received: from gabriel-vm-2.zfn.uni-bremen.de (gabriel-vm-2.zfn.uni-bremen.de [134.102.50.17]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher AECDH-AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id E4E993A1D80; Wed, 31 Mar 2021 00:14:06 -0700 (PDT) Received: from [192.168.217.152] (p548dc178.dip0.t-ipconnect.de [84.141.193.120]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by gabriel-vm-2.zfn.uni-bremen.de (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 4F9HcC5fyGzyNK; Wed, 31 Mar 2021 09:14:03 +0200 (CEST) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Mime-Version: 1.0 (Mac OS X Mail 14.0 \(3654.60.0.2.21\)) From: Carsten Bormann In-Reply-To: Date: Wed, 31 Mar 2021 09:14:03 +0200 Cc: Tools Discussion Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Message-Id: <716C2CB2-FB86-403C-AC08-727D105C2CBA@tzi.org> References: To: Jay Daley X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.3654.60.0.2.21) Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Tools-discuss] Gathering requirements for a new wiki X-BeenThere: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF Tools Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 31 Mar 2021 07:14:09 -0000 On 31. Mar 2021, at 03:06, Jay Daley wrote: >=20 > =E2=80=A2 Must support a text based input language. Given that content often flows back and forth between I-Ds and Wikis, = that language SHOULD be markdown. Gr=C3=BC=C3=9Fe, Carsten From nobody Wed Mar 31 01:52:27 2021 Return-Path: X-Original-To: tools-discuss@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: tools-discuss@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 64E223A209D for ; Wed, 31 Mar 2021 01:52:26 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.899 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.899 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id uDuU9mdZAGA3; Wed, 31 Mar 2021 01:52:21 -0700 (PDT) Received: from [192.168.1.110] (unknown [158.140.230.105]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 62B383A209B; Wed, 31 Mar 2021 01:52:21 -0700 (PDT) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable From: Jay Daley Mime-Version: 1.0 (1.0) Message-Id: Date: Wed, 31 Mar 2021 21:52:16 +1300 Cc: Tools Discussion To: Carsten Bormann X-Mailer: iPhone Mail (18D70) Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Tools-discuss] Gathering requirements for a new wiki X-BeenThere: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF Tools Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 31 Mar 2021 08:52:26 -0000 T=EF=BB=BF > On 31/03/2021, at 8:14 PM, Carsten Bormann wrote: >=20 > =EF=BB=BFOn 31. Mar 2021, at 03:06, Jay Daley wrote: >> =E2=80=A2 Must support a text based input language. >=20 > Given that content often flows back and forth between I-Ds and Wikis, that= language SHOULD be markdown. Yes it says that four lines further down. A number of people have recommend= ed that is a MUST but we=E2=80=99ve gone for a SHOULD unless the feedback is= otherwise.=20 Jay --=20 Jay Daley IETF Executive Director +64 21 678840 >=20 > Gr=C3=BC=C3=9Fe, Carsten