From nobody Tue Feb 1 17:09:18 2022 Return-Path: X-Original-To: tools-discuss@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: tools-discuss@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id F373C3A1932 for ; Tue, 1 Feb 2022 17:09:16 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.1 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.1 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=bangj.com Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id fkO-j-2KM3Uo for ; Tue, 1 Feb 2022 17:09:11 -0800 (PST) Received: from oj.bangj.com (69-77-154-174.static.skybest.com [69.77.154.174]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher AECDH-AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 60A2F3A0125 for ; Tue, 1 Feb 2022 17:09:09 -0800 (PST) Received: from [107.13.246.59] (mta-107-13-246-59.nc.rr.com [107.13.246.59]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by oj.bangj.com (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id C81B91C780 for ; Tue, 1 Feb 2022 20:09:07 -0500 (EST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/simple; d=bangj.com; s=201907; t=1643764147; bh=npo4ujRrELKBPJoIefkSw0naNKEAqZ1f3Bn0Tha8EXg=; h=Date:Subject:References:To:From:In-Reply-To:From; b=r4SzdghKPj2WL01z5KDR6Sj/fmYX9Vt3YfoST5uqPXEoIe8dV/YN5KL5GynPfb69/ iOpf64fT3OgvQ56m8Z4erjbxmEGAquK+jAdJAxyMVSBJ3QjBQwWLdrY9g58jadVqGJ k9qMEhIH25yoFoqxYNV8kL0uB4OMePlMzs4lHU9RxoJAaBkmHR1cCeRh1OGfT11kla 88UeATZvr+QehCmMe5EEmgaD/qc31jEWFVGxjAMuBqYfCydBEuv71K1uto4JmkWF/q T0T3Ig0MSLi0xB0IRVnIjs0QFLeQeGHEA7mhO3UrUfX45+XPOAb6a1ZzE+qTI6Cth3 /GGlniOkXyWaA== Message-ID: <9174867a-2b84-1ce9-38ab-206c6b32f569@bangj.com> Date: Tue, 1 Feb 2022 20:07:48 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; FreeBSD amd64; rv:91.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/91.4.1 References: <20220201071749.E12CBECB8D@rfc-editor.org> Content-Language: en-US To: tools-discuss@ietf.org From: Tom Pusateri In-Reply-To: <20220201071749.E12CBECB8D@rfc-editor.org> X-Forwarded-Message-Id: <20220201071749.E12CBECB8D@rfc-editor.org> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Archived-At: Subject: [Tools-discuss] RFC Email announcements X-BeenThere: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF Tools Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 02 Feb 2022 01:09:17 -0000 The following email was received this morning announcing a new RFC. I think the link supplied to this document could be improved by referencing the rfc page instead of the info page. https://www.rfc-editor.org/rfc/rfc9187.html Here's why: 1. We should maximize the content and not the meta data. This is a common theme and I think we should be doing everything we can to emphasize the content we create and that is used by the most number of people and not the meta data that is used by a much smaller administrative group. 2. The rfc page contains a link at the top to the info page if that's what you really want but it probably isn't because there's already lots of meta data in the email. 3. If you're really into meta-data, the top of the rfc page also contains a link to the datatracker. :) Thanks, Tom -------- Forwarded Message -------- Subject: RFC 9187 on Sequence Number Extension for Windowed Protocols Date: Mon, 31 Jan 2022 23:17:49 -0800 (PST) From: rfc-editor@rfc-editor.org To: ietf-announce@ietf.org, rfc-dist@rfc-editor.org CC: drafts-update-ref@iana.org, rfc-editor@rfc-editor.org A new Request for Comments is now available in online RFC libraries. RFC 9187 Title: Sequence Number Extension for Windowed Protocols Author: J. Touch Status: Informational Stream: Independent Date: January 2022 Mailbox: touch@strayalpha.com Pages: 10 Updates/Obsoletes/SeeAlso: None I-D Tag: draft-touch-sne-02.txt URL: https://www.rfc-editor.org/info/rfc9187 DOI: 10.17487/RFC9187 Sliding window protocols use finite sequence numbers to determine segment placement and order. These sequence number spaces wrap around and are reused during the operation of such protocols. This document describes a way to extend the size of these sequence numbers at the endpoints to avoid the impact of that wrap and reuse without transmitting additional information in the packet header. The resulting extended sequence numbers can be used at the endpoints in encryption and authentication algorithms to ensure input bit patterns do not repeat over the lifetime of a connection. INFORMATIONAL: This memo provides information for the Internet community. It does not specify an Internet standard of any kind. Distribution of this memo is unlimited. This announcement is sent to the IETF-Announce and rfc-dist lists. To subscribe or unsubscribe, see https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ietf-announce https://mailman.rfc-editor.org/mailman/listinfo/rfc-dist For searching the RFC series, see https://www.rfc-editor.org/search For downloading RFCs, see https://www.rfc-editor.org/retrieve/bulk Requests for special distribution should be addressed to either the author of the RFC in question, or to rfc-editor@rfc-editor.org. Unless specifically noted otherwise on the RFC itself, all RFCs are for unlimited distribution. The RFC Editor Team Association Management Solutions, LLC _______________________________________________ IETF-Announce mailing list IETF-Announce@ietf.org https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ietf-announce From nobody Tue Feb 1 17:59:23 2022 Return-Path: X-Original-To: tools-discuss@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: tools-discuss@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id EC2B73A1C43 for ; Tue, 1 Feb 2022 17:59:21 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.812 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.812 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, NICE_REPLY_A=-0.714, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=gmail.com Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 5_wuL5vl3WBG for ; Tue, 1 Feb 2022 17:59:17 -0800 (PST) Received: from mail-pj1-x1033.google.com (mail-pj1-x1033.google.com [IPv6:2607:f8b0:4864:20::1033]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 5B2B63A1C40 for ; Tue, 1 Feb 2022 17:59:17 -0800 (PST) Received: by mail-pj1-x1033.google.com with SMTP id y5-20020a17090aca8500b001b8127e3d3aso4505451pjt.3 for ; Tue, 01 Feb 2022 17:59:17 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20210112; h=subject:to:references:from:message-id:date:user-agent:mime-version :in-reply-to:content-language:content-transfer-encoding; bh=go9s4APl/fM0F3kYifpX5VpeN5ey8rdkj72dw/wSK9Y=; b=l3RwlnBxLO+FTm1AGnL4KUzTWIjYmsUuuUZHkKzoHt74fPN2+IGyVuJfgnaUS3EU8F rWpKn12KxKLobJjyW6OaXzElYdGLJ/KcFL/ucqviNnuX3j8uVQ34GrIYv57JpftOFqCj CMFMMemOsw4WrlETpeCNSaF/2Us5/GHcVCwpkKIQwFslNknI2qjy+GXqYx33RtJfuUDm Vi5PJ/lrTS5iV2G6StLZMw+4DJFZL4t3X7pbWi+C80NYCF+DVf72f+CCQCv/sGXxF+uh qf4Va+I4qYhsC48qK/H9Bas9YZCUOYJx+eGCxEzljE1A8x5B6qL810mWnbl9h4kmFzb9 TN5A== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20210112; h=x-gm-message-state:subject:to:references:from:message-id:date :user-agent:mime-version:in-reply-to:content-language :content-transfer-encoding; bh=go9s4APl/fM0F3kYifpX5VpeN5ey8rdkj72dw/wSK9Y=; b=49YksbJB0P7wkYcIyWsUvvXz8TlVOsMKeqwhgCsTN2eyfFjEmykUyZVb+LpCQdkaAG lpgVN0KKH6gYTBHx8J7XgcDrMT7v1z6NpXHE9c0VDN5nMEDCu3ufgqTdXTVTAWj3Mr9N IDJ0kr8Si5a6l8kin7V//J41OkCjjI24VLd86PQU0Dqu3seGykDu5YTUi4TZZHk1OGYx RHZaMYA6fkAwb0PF+5dDM+sVsHIiQZw0OegBXzKUBEnDQ5lOPW6cNApcHKUZO2SSh3T9 ZMv3FFgFdp5rwXDTI4lJRMc72LSD1D7S+U8bXlAHfLLzGPatpEtgw3QNleLr+rZpwnZN IteA== X-Gm-Message-State: AOAM530cyqJMKSYmJuTKO+G1mtNLyyedCfB0E0uEOereTyy7rExo1c5i Ln5wBNBcQ8QW1KvYnInwW6p9kK4GiyUY6A== X-Google-Smtp-Source: ABdhPJx4IACf4g8EA1+mK7aLKbecSHCs7LMzOiwvjsG2c59js1m7SzgLlhBOvuBrXQxlY5pemorElQ== X-Received: by 2002:a17:90a:9dcc:: with SMTP id x12mr5559994pjv.13.1643767156674; Tue, 01 Feb 2022 17:59:16 -0800 (PST) Received: from ?IPv6:2406:e003:1071:1701:80b2:5c79:2266:e431? ([2406:e003:1071:1701:80b2:5c79:2266:e431]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id u33sm23719133pfg.195.2022.02.01.17.59.15 for (version=TLS1_3 cipher=TLS_AES_128_GCM_SHA256 bits=128/128); Tue, 01 Feb 2022 17:59:16 -0800 (PST) To: tools-discuss@ietf.org References: <20220201071749.E12CBECB8D@rfc-editor.org> <9174867a-2b84-1ce9-38ab-206c6b32f569@bangj.com> From: Brian E Carpenter Message-ID: Date: Wed, 2 Feb 2022 14:59:13 +1300 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows NT 10.0; Win64; x64; rv:78.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/78.10.0 MIME-Version: 1.0 In-Reply-To: <9174867a-2b84-1ce9-38ab-206c6b32f569@bangj.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8; format=flowed Content-Language: en-US Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Tools-discuss] RFC Email announcements X-BeenThere: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF Tools Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 02 Feb 2022 01:59:22 -0000 On 02-Feb-22 14:07, Tom Pusateri wrote: > The following email was received this morning announcing a new RFC. > > I think the link supplied to this document could be improved by > referencing the rfc page instead of the info page. > > https://www.rfc-editor.org/rfc/rfc9187.html Disagree. Here's why: 1. The info page shows the current status, e.g. Historic, Updated By, and so on. We need people to be aware of the status before reading or citing an RFC. For example, it tells me that RFC9817 is not from the IETF. It tells me that RFC2460 is obsolete. That is not an "administrative" matter. It's what you need to know before reading the text. 2. We probably agree that the HTML is the best one to actually read, but opinions may differ. Brian > > Here's why: > > 1. We should maximize the content and not the meta data. This is a > common theme and I think we should be doing everything we can to > emphasize the content we create and that is used by the most number of > people and not the meta data that is used by a much smaller > administrative group. > > 2. The rfc page contains a link at the top to the info page if that's > what you really want but it probably isn't because there's already lots > of meta data in the email. > > 3. If you're really into meta-data, the top of the rfc page also > contains a link to the datatracker. :) > > > Thanks, > Tom > > > > -------- Forwarded Message -------- > Subject: RFC 9187 on Sequence Number Extension for Windowed Protocols > Date: Mon, 31 Jan 2022 23:17:49 -0800 (PST) > From: rfc-editor@rfc-editor.org > To: ietf-announce@ietf.org, rfc-dist@rfc-editor.org > CC: drafts-update-ref@iana.org, rfc-editor@rfc-editor.org > > A new Request for Comments is now available in online RFC libraries. > > RFC 9187 > > Title: Sequence Number Extension for Windowed Protocols > Author: J. Touch > Status: Informational > Stream: Independent > Date: January 2022 > Mailbox: touch@strayalpha.com > Pages: 10 > Updates/Obsoletes/SeeAlso: None > > I-D Tag: draft-touch-sne-02.txt > > URL: https://www.rfc-editor.org/info/rfc9187 > > DOI: 10.17487/RFC9187 > > Sliding window protocols use finite sequence numbers to determine > segment placement and order. These sequence number spaces wrap around > and are reused during the operation of such protocols. This document > describes a way to extend the size of these sequence numbers at the > endpoints to avoid the impact of that wrap and reuse without > transmitting additional information in the packet header. The > resulting extended sequence numbers can be used at the endpoints in > encryption and authentication algorithms to ensure input bit patterns > do not repeat over the lifetime of a connection. > > > INFORMATIONAL: This memo provides information for the Internet community. > It does not specify an Internet standard of any kind. Distribution of > this memo is unlimited. > > This announcement is sent to the IETF-Announce and rfc-dist lists. > To subscribe or unsubscribe, see > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ietf-announce > https://mailman.rfc-editor.org/mailman/listinfo/rfc-dist > > For searching the RFC series, see https://www.rfc-editor.org/search > For downloading RFCs, see https://www.rfc-editor.org/retrieve/bulk > > Requests for special distribution should be addressed to either the > author of the RFC in question, or to rfc-editor@rfc-editor.org. Unless > specifically noted otherwise on the RFC itself, all RFCs are for > unlimited distribution. > > > The RFC Editor Team > Association Management Solutions, LLC > > > _______________________________________________ > IETF-Announce mailing list > IETF-Announce@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ietf-announce > > ___________________________________________________________ > Tools-discuss mailing list - Tools-discuss@ietf.org > This list is for discussion, not for action requests or bug reports. > * Report datatracker and mailarchive bugs to: datatracker-project@ietf.org > * Report tools.ietf.org bugs to: webmaster@tools.ietf.org > * Report all other bugs or issues to: ietf-action@ietf.org > List info (including how to Unsubscribe): https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/tools-discuss > From nobody Tue Feb 1 18:24:38 2022 Return-Path: X-Original-To: tools-discuss@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: tools-discuss@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id A1D573A1D11 for ; Tue, 1 Feb 2022 18:24:37 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.1 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.1 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=bangj.com Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 3PCyiuV-sWLJ for ; Tue, 1 Feb 2022 18:24:31 -0800 (PST) Received: from oj.bangj.com (69-77-154-174.static.skybest.com [69.77.154.174]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher AECDH-AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id C8E533A1D0F for ; Tue, 1 Feb 2022 18:24:29 -0800 (PST) Received: from smtpclient.apple (mta-107-13-246-59.nc.rr.com [107.13.246.59]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by oj.bangj.com (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 0BC381C795; Tue, 1 Feb 2022 21:24:28 -0500 (EST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/simple; d=bangj.com; s=201907; t=1643768668; bh=/xpsQc6UzlDkLqS/C1Notk0evQEWt0JqiEWPbNYUbZE=; h=From:Subject:Date:References:Cc:In-Reply-To:To:From; b=P0W96rChw5BwoX159IHH59e9kNhAWgGeG/qC4Jn1Ak7LXbuT3jaQmQy5QVc6m2ni/ ywTOq/jcG/VgeDFgy+Gdsqg9BLrF8CSKe5CWvVbq7Z1+I66eAgYikIM5KDZym0aK3b TghIyvCqKQ1UQySgUFBZloMiDLYft4ywJcMMHwstT/lb/z5pF0pf410P+Z2r/i+sEn BT7PXOPLh9stxJkp/gLZ/Rcp9Vlwz+XCW+QLEkX2BYtMfS8dsbBscRvHv5hD+b4qlv PUnyEx2LZwoVl1hCvJ0KOOCHaAT8CzKfGng7N+8Xx6gDfec8QjWOaNAIyc190JVs6E 6rFJgR5qWJgkQ== Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable From: Tom Pusateri Mime-Version: 1.0 (1.0) Date: Tue, 1 Feb 2022 21:24:27 -0500 Message-Id: <8B7F0011-EBAC-4881-9B50-C539B1371EC5@bangj.com> References: Cc: tools-discuss@ietf.org In-Reply-To: To: Brian E Carpenter X-Mailer: iPad Mail (19C63) Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Tools-discuss] RFC Email announcements X-BeenThere: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF Tools Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 02 Feb 2022 02:24:38 -0000 That=E2=80=99s in the email. I=E2=80=99ve already decided I wanted to read i= t when I clicked on the link. We publish documents not meta data. And my preference would have the rfc links be in the document References too= (not the info links). Tom > On Feb 1, 2022, at 8:59 PM, Brian E Carpenter wrote: >=20 > =EF=BB=BFOn 02-Feb-22 14:07, Tom Pusateri wrote: >> The following email was received this morning announcing a new RFC. >> I think the link supplied to this document could be improved by >> referencing the rfc page instead of the info page. >> https://www.rfc-editor.org/rfc/rfc9187.html >=20 > Disagree. Here's why: >=20 > 1. The info page shows the current status, e.g. Historic, Updated By, and s= o on. We need people to be aware of the status before reading or citing an R= FC. For example, it tells me that RFC9817 is not from the IETF. > It tells me that RFC2460 is obsolete. >=20 > That is not an "administrative" matter. It's what you need to know before r= eading the text. >=20 > 2. We probably agree that the HTML is the best one to actually read, but o= pinions may differ. >=20 > Brian >=20 >> Here's why: >> 1. We should maximize the content and not the meta data. This is a >> common theme and I think we should be doing everything we can to >> emphasize the content we create and that is used by the most number of >> people and not the meta data that is used by a much smaller >> administrative group. >> 2. The rfc page contains a link at the top to the info page if that's >> what you really want but it probably isn't because there's already lots >> of meta data in the email. >> 3. If you're really into meta-data, the top of the rfc page also >> contains a link to the datatracker. :) >> Thanks, >> Tom >> -------- Forwarded Message -------- >> Subject: RFC 9187 on Sequence Number Extension for Windowed Protocols >> Date: Mon, 31 Jan 2022 23:17:49 -0800 (PST) >> From: rfc-editor@rfc-editor.org >> To: ietf-announce@ietf.org, rfc-dist@rfc-editor.org >> CC: drafts-update-ref@iana.org, rfc-editor@rfc-editor.org >> A new Request for Comments is now available in online RFC libraries. >> RFC 9187 >> Title: Sequence Number Extension for Windowed Protocols >> Author: J. Touch >> Status: Informational >> Stream: Independent >> Date: January 2022 >> Mailbox: touch@strayalpha.com >> Pages: 10 >> Updates/Obsoletes/SeeAlso: None >> I-D Tag: draft-touch-sne-02.txt >> URL: https://www.rfc-editor.org/info/rfc9187 >> DOI: 10.17487/RFC9187 >> Sliding window protocols use finite sequence numbers to determine >> segment placement and order. These sequence number spaces wrap around >> and are reused during the operation of such protocols. This document >> describes a way to extend the size of these sequence numbers at the >> endpoints to avoid the impact of that wrap and reuse without >> transmitting additional information in the packet header. The >> resulting extended sequence numbers can be used at the endpoints in >> encryption and authentication algorithms to ensure input bit patterns >> do not repeat over the lifetime of a connection. >> INFORMATIONAL: This memo provides information for the Internet community.= >> It does not specify an Internet standard of any kind. Distribution of >> this memo is unlimited. >> This announcement is sent to the IETF-Announce and rfc-dist lists. >> To subscribe or unsubscribe, see >> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ietf-announce >> https://mailman.rfc-editor.org/mailman/listinfo/rfc-dist >> For searching the RFC series, see https://www.rfc-editor.org/search >> For downloading RFCs, see https://www.rfc-editor.org/retrieve/bulk >> Requests for special distribution should be addressed to either the >> author of the RFC in question, or to rfc-editor@rfc-editor.org. Unless >> specifically noted otherwise on the RFC itself, all RFCs are for >> unlimited distribution. >> The RFC Editor Team >> Association Management Solutions, LLC >> _______________________________________________ >> IETF-Announce mailing list >> IETF-Announce@ietf.org >> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ietf-announce >> ___________________________________________________________ >> Tools-discuss mailing list - Tools-discuss@ietf.org >> This list is for discussion, not for action requests or bug reports. >> * Report datatracker and mailarchive bugs to: datatracker-project@ietf.or= g >> * Report tools.ietf.org bugs to: webmaster@tools.ietf.org >> * Report all other bugs or issues to: ietf-action@ietf.org >> List info (including how to Unsubscribe): https://www.ietf.org/mailman/li= stinfo/tools-discuss >=20 > ___________________________________________________________ > Tools-discuss mailing list - Tools-discuss@ietf.org > This list is for discussion, not for action requests or bug reports. > * Report datatracker and mailarchive bugs to: datatracker-project@ietf.org= > * Report tools.ietf.org bugs to: webmaster@tools.ietf.org > * Report all other bugs or issues to: ietf-action@ietf.org > List info (including how to Unsubscribe): https://www.ietf.org/mailman/lis= tinfo/tools-discuss From nobody Tue Feb 1 18:48:10 2022 Return-Path: X-Original-To: tools-discuss@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: tools-discuss@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id B11873A1DC5 for ; Tue, 1 Feb 2022 18:47:59 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.812 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.812 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, NICE_REPLY_A=-0.714, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=gmail.com Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id DS0ii2CIH5bZ for ; Tue, 1 Feb 2022 18:47:54 -0800 (PST) Received: from mail-pf1-x42a.google.com (mail-pf1-x42a.google.com [IPv6:2607:f8b0:4864:20::42a]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 12D803A1DDC for ; Tue, 1 Feb 2022 18:47:54 -0800 (PST) Received: by mail-pf1-x42a.google.com with SMTP id 192so17590145pfz.3 for ; Tue, 01 Feb 2022 18:47:54 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20210112; h=subject:to:cc:references:from:message-id:date:user-agent :mime-version:in-reply-to:content-language:content-transfer-encoding; bh=iTgAJ8Ed6oUfM6OnWh3hvaqZPj8fCjTEGOfT7SWSqqw=; b=dUnOo6WZnZ5Bj3bZFCxlko/GBrZ4N83MJrasPvzP0cfh1PsLHO93abyE9rQg8M9AuT Ta+ZPLOhY4qoim0kVrQUZz3ysqdb1N3IA1rcEWy/VLGCnEtJGlO26gukMpWroVQWl/df qhXuiksTQe7Kii7KsBzgQibNxq0i1saMb674Af/GFgbmNuwjsp/9VghGT3poZYa/Sy3u RLpJL4tkENc1vB/wsZ7rJUOtF8SHzd2Nx8FhjN5wN5AHBtys9n102leVgcvb9qw+nb1j GFcCbyEhUBvngma0giQmbKWNRgbSA8Ij6RyAjL2r/0f/8/ohs1oK3lSzdY63tzDLoA1A LOPw== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20210112; h=x-gm-message-state:subject:to:cc:references:from:message-id:date :user-agent:mime-version:in-reply-to:content-language :content-transfer-encoding; bh=iTgAJ8Ed6oUfM6OnWh3hvaqZPj8fCjTEGOfT7SWSqqw=; b=NPz80GoGzYcpOjDhk/AHi9/3JLEXA0H0j6cvneJp6xCBO+KJ1VcxlDKgXM2hAV/XyO anFj3hL4tWCWWg0I0KuuLyLNsnufundVEFAPitZVvfWrDSo29ZnS27Bd5tTl6Vs2LNQt iOYrXXCz8HKbme/t5qWUs5jvH5TDcbCOzY4AvEc6yAQLIPAhZ5jV8oBiHNvzetiEAV/q 9prfmDzUWJUZZUBI3eHHtXrT1mNcPShF0fmrEhGiJAz1QrgK5EJ1uEYYhepD1SilbM50 AVPlfjpIYeyCzcd2xRy8M6w3LzFJ16fCkUv9YNJfkiP8jnmbzdU4ZBukunJDYrtwdyCz H7gQ== X-Gm-Message-State: AOAM533yuqO5EsZ8B7TJJ9fZ9awN+FAUHmFIq3yxniNfmr1pejlFX/oV Aep4243qP9SLBoQPk0mS+DagB9cgqBet4g== X-Google-Smtp-Source: ABdhPJwK2olWhyWMe+LqNo1r2KmW77nEujUXVkWMQso0nW9apmzUSx8wnoKTRtk1AN9qYopRl1V8Rg== X-Received: by 2002:aa7:85d8:: with SMTP id z24mr27708671pfn.86.1643770070696; Tue, 01 Feb 2022 18:47:50 -0800 (PST) Received: from ?IPv6:2406:e003:1071:1701:80b2:5c79:2266:e431? ([2406:e003:1071:1701:80b2:5c79:2266:e431]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id s8sm22070958pfw.158.2022.02.01.18.47.48 (version=TLS1_3 cipher=TLS_AES_128_GCM_SHA256 bits=128/128); Tue, 01 Feb 2022 18:47:50 -0800 (PST) To: Tom Pusateri Cc: tools-discuss@ietf.org References: <8B7F0011-EBAC-4881-9B50-C539B1371EC5@bangj.com> From: Brian E Carpenter Message-ID: <9352c3e9-28ae-1b0b-30e3-a9f1edd937dd@gmail.com> Date: Wed, 2 Feb 2022 15:47:47 +1300 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows NT 10.0; Win64; x64; rv:78.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/78.10.0 MIME-Version: 1.0 In-Reply-To: <8B7F0011-EBAC-4881-9B50-C539B1371EC5@bangj.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8; format=flowed Content-Language: en-US Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Tools-discuss] RFC Email announcements X-BeenThere: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF Tools Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 02 Feb 2022 02:48:09 -0000 Tom, The email is transitory; the point is to use the info URL as the primary = reference, for the reasons I gave. That's what the RFC Editor service has=20 decided to do, and I fully support that choice. Regards Brian On 02-Feb-22 15:24, Tom Pusateri wrote: > That=E2=80=99s in the email. I=E2=80=99ve already decided I wanted to r= ead it when I clicked on the link. >=20 > We publish documents not meta data. >=20 > And my preference would have the rfc links be in the document Reference= s too (not the info links). >=20 > Tom >=20 >> On Feb 1, 2022, at 8:59 PM, Brian E Carpenter wrote: >> >> =EF=BB=BFOn 02-Feb-22 14:07, Tom Pusateri wrote: >>> The following email was received this morning announcing a new RFC. >>> I think the link supplied to this document could be improved by >>> referencing the rfc page instead of the info page. >>> https://www.rfc-editor.org/rfc/rfc9187.html >> >> Disagree. Here's why: >> >> 1. The info page shows the current status, e.g. Historic, Updated By, = and so on. We need people to be aware of the status before reading or cit= ing an RFC. For example, it tells me that RFC9817 is not from the IETF. >> It tells me that RFC2460 is obsolete. >> >> That is not an "administrative" matter. It's what you need to know bef= ore reading the text. >> >> 2. We probably agree that the HTML is the best one to actually read, b= ut opinions may differ. >> >> Brian >> >>> Here's why: >>> 1. We should maximize the content and not the meta data. This is a >>> common theme and I think we should be doing everything we can to >>> emphasize the content we create and that is used by the most number o= f >>> people and not the meta data that is used by a much smaller >>> administrative group. >>> 2. The rfc page contains a link at the top to the info page if that's= >>> what you really want but it probably isn't because there's already lo= ts >>> of meta data in the email. >>> 3. If you're really into meta-data, the top of the rfc page also >>> contains a link to the datatracker. :) >>> Thanks, >>> Tom >>> -------- Forwarded Message -------- >>> Subject: RFC 9187 on Sequence Number Extension for Windowed Protocols= >>> Date: Mon, 31 Jan 2022 23:17:49 -0800 (PST) >>> From: rfc-editor@rfc-editor.org >>> To: ietf-announce@ietf.org, rfc-dist@rfc-editor.org >>> CC: drafts-update-ref@iana.org, rfc-editor@rfc-editor.org >>> A new Request for Comments is now available in online RFC libraries. >>> RFC 9187 >>> Title: Sequence Number Extension for Windowed Protocol= s >>> Author: J. Touch >>> Status: Informational >>> Stream: Independent >>> Date: January 2022 >>> Mailbox: touch@strayalpha.com >>> Pages: 10 >>> Updates/Obsoletes/SeeAlso: None >>> I-D Tag: draft-touch-sne-02.txt >>> URL: https://www.rfc-editor.org/info/rfc9187 >>> DOI: 10.17487/RFC9187 >>> Sliding window protocols use finite sequence numbers to determine >>> segment placement and order. These sequence number spaces wrap around= >>> and are reused during the operation of such protocols. This document >>> describes a way to extend the size of these sequence numbers at the >>> endpoints to avoid the impact of that wrap and reuse without >>> transmitting additional information in the packet header. The >>> resulting extended sequence numbers can be used at the endpoints in >>> encryption and authentication algorithms to ensure input bit patterns= >>> do not repeat over the lifetime of a connection. >>> INFORMATIONAL: This memo provides information for the Internet commun= ity. >>> It does not specify an Internet standard of any kind. Distribution of= >>> this memo is unlimited. >>> This announcement is sent to the IETF-Announce and rfc-dist lists. >>> To subscribe or unsubscribe, see >>> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ietf-announce >>> https://mailman.rfc-editor.org/mailman/listinfo/rfc-dist >>> For searching the RFC series, see https://www.rfc-editor.org/search >>> For downloading RFCs, see https://www.rfc-editor.org/retrieve/bulk >>> Requests for special distribution should be addressed to either the >>> author of the RFC in question, or to rfc-editor@rfc-editor.org. Unle= ss >>> specifically noted otherwise on the RFC itself, all RFCs are for >>> unlimited distribution. >>> The RFC Editor Team >>> Association Management Solutions, LLC >>> _______________________________________________ >>> IETF-Announce mailing list >>> IETF-Announce@ietf.org >>> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ietf-announce >>> ___________________________________________________________ >>> Tools-discuss mailing list - Tools-discuss@ietf.org >>> This list is for discussion, not for action requests or bug reports. >>> * Report datatracker and mailarchive bugs to: datatracker-project@iet= f.org >>> * Report tools.ietf.org bugs to: webmaster@tools.ietf.org >>> * Report all other bugs or issues to: ietf-action@ietf.org >>> List info (including how to Unsubscribe): https://www.ietf.org/mailma= n/listinfo/tools-discuss >> >> ___________________________________________________________ >> Tools-discuss mailing list - Tools-discuss@ietf.org >> This list is for discussion, not for action requests or bug reports. >> * Report datatracker and mailarchive bugs to: datatracker-project@ietf= =2Eorg >> * Report tools.ietf.org bugs to: webmaster@tools.ietf.org >> * Report all other bugs or issues to: ietf-action@ietf.org >> List info (including how to Unsubscribe): https://www.ietf.org/mailman= /listinfo/tools-discuss From nobody Tue Feb 1 19:03:03 2022 Return-Path: X-Original-To: tools-discuss@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: tools-discuss@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2B36B3A1E48 for ; Tue, 1 Feb 2022 19:03:01 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.898 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.898 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_BLOCKED=0.001, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 00ZP7i5Ps_Dg for ; Tue, 1 Feb 2022 19:02:56 -0800 (PST) Received: from ietfx.ietf.org (ietfx.amsl.com [4.31.198.45]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ADH-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 747743A1E46 for ; Tue, 1 Feb 2022 19:02:56 -0800 (PST) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfx.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5743F4096D36; Tue, 1 Feb 2022 19:02:56 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com Received: from ietfx.ietf.org ([4.31.198.45]) by localhost (ietfx.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id PmnUzekCckxb; Tue, 1 Feb 2022 19:02:56 -0800 (PST) Received: from smtpclient.apple (unknown [158.140.230.105]) by ietfx.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 7231A4096D30; Tue, 1 Feb 2022 19:02:55 -0800 (PST) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Mime-Version: 1.0 (Mac OS X Mail 15.0 \(3693.40.0.1.81\)) From: Jay Daley In-Reply-To: <9352c3e9-28ae-1b0b-30e3-a9f1edd937dd@gmail.com> Date: Wed, 2 Feb 2022 16:02:50 +1300 Cc: Tom Pusateri , tools-discuss@ietf.org Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Message-Id: References: <8B7F0011-EBAC-4881-9B50-C539B1371EC5@bangj.com> <9352c3e9-28ae-1b0b-30e3-a9f1edd937dd@gmail.com> To: Brian E Carpenter X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.3693.40.0.1.81) Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Tools-discuss] RFC Email announcements X-BeenThere: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF Tools Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 02 Feb 2022 03:03:01 -0000 In previous discussions on this same point a number of people have noted = that this is a not a binary choice as the landing page can be both the = info page and show the document as well. The discussion then normally = expands to cover individual preferences on what format is displayed by = default and the possibility of storing a preference. That then can take = a detour into the use of cookies for storing preferences and a reminder = that this is expressly covered in the Privacy Statement. A point is = sometimes raised about how to avoid a cluttered page if it is both an = info page and a document page, to which others then reply that this is = trivial with Javascript while providing a perhaps cluttered fallback for = those who do not wish to enable Javascript. All need now is for the RFC Editor Future Program to complete so that we = can all understand the new mechanism for proposing, agreeing and = implementing such changes. Jay > On 2/02/2022, at 3:47 PM, Brian E Carpenter = wrote: >=20 > Tom, >=20 > The email is transitory; the point is to use the info URL as the = primary reference, for the reasons I gave. That's what the RFC Editor = service has decided to do, and I fully support that choice. >=20 > Regards > Brian >=20 > On 02-Feb-22 15:24, Tom Pusateri wrote: >> That=E2=80=99s in the email. I=E2=80=99ve already decided I wanted to = read it when I clicked on the link. >> We publish documents not meta data. >> And my preference would have the rfc links be in the document = References too (not the info links). >> Tom >>> On Feb 1, 2022, at 8:59 PM, Brian E Carpenter = wrote: >>>=20 >>> =EF=BB=BFOn 02-Feb-22 14:07, Tom Pusateri wrote: >>>> The following email was received this morning announcing a new RFC. >>>> I think the link supplied to this document could be improved by >>>> referencing the rfc page instead of the info page. >>>> https://www.rfc-editor.org/rfc/rfc9187.html >>>=20 >>> Disagree. Here's why: >>>=20 >>> 1. The info page shows the current status, e.g. Historic, Updated = By, and so on. We need people to be aware of the status before reading = or citing an RFC. For example, it tells me that RFC9817 is not from the = IETF. >>> It tells me that RFC2460 is obsolete. >>>=20 >>> That is not an "administrative" matter. It's what you need to know = before reading the text. >>>=20 >>> 2. We probably agree that the HTML is the best one to actually read, = but opinions may differ. >>>=20 >>> Brian >>>=20 >>>> Here's why: >>>> 1. We should maximize the content and not the meta data. This is a >>>> common theme and I think we should be doing everything we can to >>>> emphasize the content we create and that is used by the most number = of >>>> people and not the meta data that is used by a much smaller >>>> administrative group. >>>> 2. The rfc page contains a link at the top to the info page if = that's >>>> what you really want but it probably isn't because there's already = lots >>>> of meta data in the email. >>>> 3. If you're really into meta-data, the top of the rfc page also >>>> contains a link to the datatracker. :) >>>> Thanks, >>>> Tom >>>> -------- Forwarded Message -------- >>>> Subject: RFC 9187 on Sequence Number Extension for Windowed = Protocols >>>> Date: Mon, 31 Jan 2022 23:17:49 -0800 (PST) >>>> From: rfc-editor@rfc-editor.org >>>> To: ietf-announce@ietf.org, rfc-dist@rfc-editor.org >>>> CC: drafts-update-ref@iana.org, rfc-editor@rfc-editor.org >>>> A new Request for Comments is now available in online RFC = libraries. >>>> RFC 9187 >>>> Title: Sequence Number Extension for Windowed = Protocols >>>> Author: J. Touch >>>> Status: Informational >>>> Stream: Independent >>>> Date: January 2022 >>>> Mailbox: touch@strayalpha.com >>>> Pages: 10 >>>> Updates/Obsoletes/SeeAlso: None >>>> I-D Tag: draft-touch-sne-02.txt >>>> URL: https://www.rfc-editor.org/info/rfc9187 >>>> DOI: 10.17487/RFC9187 >>>> Sliding window protocols use finite sequence numbers to determine >>>> segment placement and order. These sequence number spaces wrap = around >>>> and are reused during the operation of such protocols. This = document >>>> describes a way to extend the size of these sequence numbers at the >>>> endpoints to avoid the impact of that wrap and reuse without >>>> transmitting additional information in the packet header. The >>>> resulting extended sequence numbers can be used at the endpoints in >>>> encryption and authentication algorithms to ensure input bit = patterns >>>> do not repeat over the lifetime of a connection. >>>> INFORMATIONAL: This memo provides information for the Internet = community. >>>> It does not specify an Internet standard of any kind. Distribution = of >>>> this memo is unlimited. >>>> This announcement is sent to the IETF-Announce and rfc-dist lists. >>>> To subscribe or unsubscribe, see >>>> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ietf-announce >>>> https://mailman.rfc-editor.org/mailman/listinfo/rfc-dist >>>> For searching the RFC series, see https://www.rfc-editor.org/search >>>> For downloading RFCs, see https://www.rfc-editor.org/retrieve/bulk >>>> Requests for special distribution should be addressed to either the >>>> author of the RFC in question, or to rfc-editor@rfc-editor.org. = Unless >>>> specifically noted otherwise on the RFC itself, all RFCs are for >>>> unlimited distribution. >>>> The RFC Editor Team >>>> Association Management Solutions, LLC >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> IETF-Announce mailing list >>>> IETF-Announce@ietf.org >>>> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ietf-announce >>>> ___________________________________________________________ >>>> Tools-discuss mailing list - Tools-discuss@ietf.org >>>> This list is for discussion, not for action requests or bug = reports. >>>> * Report datatracker and mailarchive bugs to: = datatracker-project@ietf.org >>>> * Report tools.ietf.org bugs to: webmaster@tools.ietf.org >>>> * Report all other bugs or issues to: ietf-action@ietf.org >>>> List info (including how to Unsubscribe): = https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/tools-discuss >>>=20 >>> ___________________________________________________________ >>> Tools-discuss mailing list - Tools-discuss@ietf.org >>> This list is for discussion, not for action requests or bug reports. >>> * Report datatracker and mailarchive bugs to: = datatracker-project@ietf.org >>> * Report tools.ietf.org bugs to: webmaster@tools.ietf.org >>> * Report all other bugs or issues to: ietf-action@ietf.org >>> List info (including how to Unsubscribe): = https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/tools-discuss >=20 > ___________________________________________________________ > 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RCVD_IN_DNSWL_HI=-5, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_H2=-0.001, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id p8yljg9DucaC for ; Wed, 9 Feb 2022 07:38:04 -0800 (PST) Received: from mail-vk1-f178.google.com (mail-vk1-f178.google.com [209.85.221.178]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 06DCB3A0AF9 for ; Wed, 9 Feb 2022 07:38:03 -0800 (PST) Received: by mail-vk1-f178.google.com with SMTP id w207so874684vkd.2 for ; Wed, 09 Feb 2022 07:38:03 -0800 (PST) X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20210112; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:from:date:message-id:subject:to; bh=23x+bEUIJlQyu7Nb3sTZHEFbXratXipI+pqJKSAQALc=; b=6AM0iY0pz1ntMNx9Yfxq240B2HT3vgGld9JcoEsc4mbJBIp7IZOiZ217WDYhIbcBrT 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List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 09 Feb 2022 15:38:06 -0000 The participant list in Meetecho currently intermixes "Participants" (who are coming through Meetecho) and "Jabber Users" (who are in the jabber room but are not on Meetecho). What I'd like to see is that they sort the attendance list so that "Participants" show up above all the "Jabber Users". It's annoying, when I'm looking for who is on a call, to have to sift through the list by eye to see who is in as "Participant", as we often have a lot of people who just automatically join the WG jabber room as part of their jabber client login, but they're not actually attending the meeting at hand. Barry From nobody Wed Feb 9 08:04:54 2022 Return-Path: X-Original-To: tools-discuss@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: tools-discuss@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 80CBD3A08C6 for ; Wed, 9 Feb 2022 08:04:52 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.1 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.1 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=sandelman.ca Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 0mzozQsWK-R5 for ; Wed, 9 Feb 2022 08:04:47 -0800 (PST) Received: from tuna.sandelman.ca (tuna.sandelman.ca [209.87.249.19]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ADH-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 8DA883A08C2 for ; Wed, 9 Feb 2022 08:04:46 -0800 (PST) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by tuna.sandelman.ca (Postfix) with ESMTP id B0198389C8; Wed, 9 Feb 2022 11:12:27 -0500 (EST) Received: from tuna.sandelman.ca ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id s1_DRjHXxS-C; Wed, 9 Feb 2022 11:12:26 -0500 (EST) Received: from sandelman.ca (obiwan.sandelman.ca [IPv6:2607:f0b0:f:2::247]) by tuna.sandelman.ca (Postfix) with ESMTP id 19E10389C7; Wed, 9 Feb 2022 11:12:26 -0500 (EST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/simple; d=sandelman.ca; s=mail; t=1644423146; bh=HA9NMSreUbUJk/bWKMLtEzil0GKSJNKAN9yp8psVgYE=; h=From:To:cc:Subject:In-Reply-To:References:Date:From; b=Khh/Nmsfj9aNX/9GSLQMt0WSLBujtaX7RoStSpIjhuW9gprdeSmUDtpDIEHGmoM3C NOr5T+iFQg7AfCo9A0fpwdzLdRWhI0k0VriM02RRcP/5F1RgAa3NpT8qPc3TLXkRt+ 5hVzWhRBQtlZNvfJ/SwHVEnPtyfmQiaI2gFikvkyYauBYNl9zBZRnWPwwkd4zPhj1+ wsD/AjEuACiNugZI0Lqg++q6C+lwCA6+0mO69SZ7fGd5w+ivTBAmna+JvyBcb2MOdA SpwDDUrBFt8y1W8FfhP7PLsLFWFo7Fcm+FrzVGMQxp8kuhtWmuAF4RKZU8Ibx75DBY I1fteX9iRkslQ== Received: from localhost (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by sandelman.ca (Postfix) with ESMTP id 86A5840; Wed, 9 Feb 2022 11:04:44 -0500 (EST) From: Michael Richardson To: Barry Leiba cc: Tools Team Discussion In-Reply-To: References: X-Mailer: MH-E 8.6+git; nmh 1.7+dev; GNU Emacs 26.1 X-Face: $\n1pF)h^`}$H>Hk{L"x@)JS7<%Az}5RyS@k9X%29-lHB$Ti.V>2bi.~ehC0; <'$9xN5Ub# z!G,p`nR&p7Fz@^UXIn156S8.~^@MJ*mMsD7=QFeq%AL4m Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Tools-discuss] How Meetecho sorts the participant list X-BeenThere: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF Tools Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 09 Feb 2022 16:04:53 -0000 --=-=-= Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Barry Leiba wrote: > The participant list in Meetecho currently intermixes "Participants" > (who are coming through Meetecho) and "Jabber Users" (who are in the > jabber room but are not on Meetecho). What I'd like to see is that > they sort the attendance list so that "Participants" show up above all > the "Jabber Users". It's annoying, when I'm looking for who is on a I agree that it would be good to have that sort option. I'd also like to have a MRU sort option so that whomever has spoken recently bubbles to the top. Finally, it would be nice if I could somehow connect my: > "Participant", as we often have a lot of people who just automatically > join the WG jabber room as part of their jabber client login, but > they're not actually attending the meeting at hand. to my Meetecho login, and therefore just show up once, also solving some of the annoyance. (And who is "half-shot", I wonder) =2D- Michael Richardson . o O ( IPv6 I=C3=B8T consulti= ng ) Sandelman Software Works Inc, Ottawa and Worldwide --=-=-= Content-Type: application/pgp-signature; name="signature.asc" -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- iPMEAQEKAB0WIQSk7ZHEG9TCGBNASfm/sjw/rPYc8wUCYgPmHAAKCRC/sjw/rPYc 82XNBf9RtAsMFOkR4PQcEhGRrEDuRf3E+he089ki5mvaY6YCKJdhUUL0F8LrAC1E IsAkRzLizgrM3M90oHSdFjSDoWnovjQ0FSsAdqWqrlCboARY4E3bswt1Rs5h8Zxg DTgXYRI1g2aiHgNif/x+riAdrwaHlGR9VyLDK6TWf+k40+1sgO3aAhTXCGkyk49X GIvapenyrJ0EOQ0boHzaIiO/mE0kwZjLjdPq+onsso7P2zuLzzoqDOZejtZIq+P3 M56wN68= =x6rY -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --=-=-=-- From nobody Wed Feb 9 10:14:14 2022 Return-Path: X-Original-To: tools-discuss@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: tools-discuss@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id D18173A0B6B for ; Wed, 9 Feb 2022 10:14:11 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -0.869 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-0.869 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, HEADER_FROM_DIFFERENT_DOMAINS=0.25, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_BLOCKED=0.001, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_NEUTRAL=0.779] autolearn=no autolearn_force=no Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 93ZnJSsLtyb5 for ; Wed, 9 Feb 2022 10:14:10 -0800 (PST) Received: from faui40.informatik.uni-erlangen.de (faui40.informatik.uni-erlangen.de [IPv6:2001:638:a000:4134::ffff:40]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ADH-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 102A83A0B3D for ; Wed, 9 Feb 2022 10:14:09 -0800 (PST) Received: from faui48e.informatik.uni-erlangen.de (faui48e.informatik.uni-erlangen.de [IPv6:2001:638:a000:4134::ffff:51]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 (256/256 bits) key-exchange X25519 server-signature RSA-PSS (4096 bits) server-digest SHA256) (No client certificate requested) by faui40.informatik.uni-erlangen.de (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 3F0315499EB for ; Wed, 9 Feb 2022 19:14:02 +0100 (CET) Received: by faui48e.informatik.uni-erlangen.de (Postfix, from userid 10463) id 2CD654EA5DE; Wed, 9 Feb 2022 19:14:02 +0100 (CET) Date: Wed, 9 Feb 2022 19:14:02 +0100 From: Toerless Eckert To: Tools Team Discussion Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline Archived-At: Subject: [Tools-discuss] kramdown-rfc2629 problems on MacOS Mojave X-BeenThere: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF Tools Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 09 Feb 2022 18:14:12 -0000 MacOS Mojave, can not get kramdown-rfc2629 to work for any file: kramdown-rfc2629 draft-eckert-bier-cgm2-rbs-00.mkd /System/Library/Frameworks/Ruby.framework/Versions/2.3/usr/lib/ruby/2.3.0/erb.rb:864:in `eval': (erb):107: multiple assignment in conditional (SyntaxError) ; end ^ from /System/Library/Frameworks/Ruby.framework/Versions/2.3/usr/lib/ruby/2.3.0/erb.rb:864:in `result' from /Library/Ruby/Gems/2.3.0/gems/kramdown-rfc2629-1.5.25/bin/kramdown-rfc2629:404:in `xml_from_sections' from /Library/Ruby/Gems/2.3.0/gems/kramdown-rfc2629-1.5.25/bin/kramdown-rfc2629:513:in `' from /usr/local/bin/kramdown-rfc2629:22:in `load' from /usr/local/bin/kramdown-rfc2629:22:in `
' Any idea how to fix something like that without becoming a ruby expert ? Thanks! 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Wed, 9 Feb 2022 13:32:06 -0500 From: "Salz, Rich" To: Toerless Eckert , Tools Team Discussion Thread-Topic: [Tools-discuss] kramdown-rfc2629 problems on MacOS Mojave Thread-Index: AQHYHeDdlaGeNIRuYECHNV5BMKgIAayLiuqA Date: Wed, 9 Feb 2022 18:32:05 +0000 Message-ID: References: In-Reply-To: Accept-Language: en-US Content-Language: en-US X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: user-agent: Microsoft-MacOutlook/16.58.22020202 x-ms-exchange-messagesentrepresentingtype: 1 x-ms-exchange-transport-fromentityheader: Hosted x-originating-ip: [172.27.118.139] Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-ID: <7463A2C3D9CBE644B2C3C3BD0420062D@akamai.com> Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Proofpoint-Virus-Version: vendor=fsecure engine=2.50.10434:6.0.425, 18.0.816 definitions=2022-02-09_09:2022-02-09, 2022-02-09 signatures=0 X-Proofpoint-Spam-Details: rule=notspam policy=default score=0 mlxlogscore=678 adultscore=0 spamscore=0 malwarescore=0 phishscore=0 suspectscore=0 mlxscore=0 bulkscore=0 classifier=spam adjust=0 reason=mlx scancount=1 engine=8.12.0-2201110000 definitions=main-2202090097 X-Proofpoint-GUID: RutULXUdnE-WsVgeaHdKuVo_va7nUSsl X-Proofpoint-ORIG-GUID: RutULXUdnE-WsVgeaHdKuVo_va7nUSsl X-Proofpoint-Virus-Version: vendor=baseguard engine=ICAP:2.0.205,Aquarius:18.0.816,Hydra:6.0.425,FMLib:17.11.62.513 definitions=2022-02-09_09,2022-02-09_01,2021-12-02_01 X-Proofpoint-Spam-Details: rule=notspam policy=default score=0 phishscore=0 mlxlogscore=667 suspectscore=0 clxscore=1011 bulkscore=0 impostorscore=0 spamscore=0 lowpriorityscore=0 priorityscore=1501 adultscore=0 mlxscore=0 malwarescore=0 classifier=spam adjust=0 reason=mlx scancount=1 engine=8.12.0-2201110000 definitions=main-2202090098 Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Tools-discuss] kramdown-rfc2629 problems on MacOS Mojave X-BeenThere: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF Tools Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 09 Feb 2022 18:32:36 -0000 DQoNCu+7v09uIDIvOS8yMiwgMToxNCBQTSwgIlRvZXJsZXNzIEVja2VydCIgPHR0ZUBjcy5mYXUu ZGU+IHdyb3RlOg0KDQogICAgTWFjT1MgTW9qYXZlLCBjYW4gbm90IGdldCBrcmFtZG93bi1yZmMy NjI5IHRvIHdvcmsgZm9yIGFueSBmaWxlOg0KDQogICAga3JhbWRvd24tcmZjMjYyOSBkcmFmdC1l Y2tlcnQtYmllci1jZ20yLXJicy0wMC5ta2QgDQogICAgL1N5c3RlbS9MaWJyYXJ5L0ZyYW1ld29y a3MvUnVieS5mcmFtZXdvcmsvVmVyc2lvbnMvMi4zL3Vzci9saWIvcnVieS8yLjMuMC9lcmIucmI6 ODY0OmluIGBldmFsJzogKGVyYik6MTA3OiBtdWx0aXBsZSBhc3NpZ25tZW50IGluIGNvbmRpdGlv bmFsIChTeW50YXhFcnJvcikNCiAgICA7ICAgIGVuZCANCg0KDQpIb3cgZGlkIHlvdSBpbnN0YWxs IGtyYW1kb3duLCBldGM/ICBJIHVzZWQgImJyZXciIGFuZCB1cGdyYWRlZCBldmVyeXRoaW5nLiBG b3IgZXhhbXBsZSwgSSdtIG9uIHJ1YnkgMi42LjNwNjIgIEFuZCB0aGVuIEkgaW5zdGFsbGVkIGty YW1kb3duLg0KDQo= From nobody Wed Feb 9 10:38:39 2022 Return-Path: X-Original-To: tools-discuss@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: tools-discuss@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 377563A0C2F for ; 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Wed, 9 Feb 2022 19:38:25 +0100 (CET) Received: by faui48e.informatik.uni-erlangen.de (Postfix, from userid 10463) id DB5AE4EA5DE; Wed, 9 Feb 2022 19:38:25 +0100 (CET) Date: Wed, 9 Feb 2022 19:38:25 +0100 From: Toerless Eckert To: "Salz, Rich" Cc: Tools Team Discussion Message-ID: References: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Disposition: inline Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit In-Reply-To: Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Tools-discuss] kramdown-rfc2629 problems on MacOS Mojave X-BeenThere: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF Tools Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 09 Feb 2022 18:38:37 -0000 Alas i once decided to go for ports and they seem to have no currenty ruby, but stuck at 1.8. So i am using Mojave's very own ruby 2.3 But i had recently new-installed Mojave and didn't have problems with even older MacOS versions. Cheers Toerless On Wed, Feb 09, 2022 at 06:32:05PM +0000, Salz, Rich wrote: > > > On 2/9/22, 1:14 PM, "Toerless Eckert" wrote: > > MacOS Mojave, can not get kramdown-rfc2629 to work for any file: > > kramdown-rfc2629 draft-eckert-bier-cgm2-rbs-00.mkd > /System/Library/Frameworks/Ruby.framework/Versions/2.3/usr/lib/ruby/2.3.0/erb.rb:864:in `eval': (erb):107: multiple assignment in conditional (SyntaxError) > ; end > > > How did you install kramdown, etc? I used "brew" and upgraded everything. For example, I'm on ruby 2.6.3p62 And then I installed kramdown. > -- --- tte@cs.fau.de From nobody Wed Feb 9 11:45:44 2022 Return-Path: X-Original-To: tools-discuss@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: tools-discuss@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id E7DD73A0ABE; Wed, 9 Feb 2022 11:45:20 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.811 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.811 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, NICE_REPLY_A=-0.714, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_BLOCKED=0.001, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=unavailable autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=gmail.com Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id xVggC1h1UWuF; Wed, 9 Feb 2022 11:45:14 -0800 (PST) Received: from mail-pl1-x62f.google.com (mail-pl1-x62f.google.com [IPv6:2607:f8b0:4864:20::62f]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 979503A0A2A; Wed, 9 Feb 2022 11:45:14 -0800 (PST) Received: by mail-pl1-x62f.google.com with SMTP id u12so1663370plf.13; Wed, 09 Feb 2022 11:45:14 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20210112; h=subject:to:references:from:message-id:date:user-agent:mime-version :in-reply-to:content-language:content-transfer-encoding; bh=Zvd1zs8GcjprvVz8QuO+AnEd2q7wsfi9WrWHup34Fso=; b=Flx3iXPuesl/gZcEF/6pmR2EX8pP7Q5UR+3v4+Ds+Jvnlmgr1pgBcVbLrQp327d5Wt eaKp9qZZBTBozWAAR/F4bA5ws701F3qxvfEtURPskL+te4iHQe67sG8CkdZdDG/Gh+uw VLowmujDhx3fuWHmB17EcsQZfrl229Nhv3HJmBmXCY6mjQCnGrF0pweViOQ100bmnwiH +KhLcqP3n+yjdMT9vbdw5YwTi3d2Fi6dMCnFiICy7dNP8PfVeCoUYImnG/nixM5G4+zo /ysA4+LtxOZIjuak693tMw8k9v41V54ZEEQXNVgYyKFobar7R4HA8Q1AJGf5yyeR5IMu g/Qw== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20210112; h=x-gm-message-state:subject:to:references:from:message-id:date :user-agent:mime-version:in-reply-to:content-language :content-transfer-encoding; bh=Zvd1zs8GcjprvVz8QuO+AnEd2q7wsfi9WrWHup34Fso=; b=2VleRuJaaFdySWMfZB61ZOkZSchh+qMXg4iK/0+a3uypJUhJihqbM+kdm7M1D6X0bv rlCkFPUMUd6HwwLxGWLioz96EWCxKbXGx2oepeZlch7INlrPMSTUvS4KnMng0qMfxqXL clKGAmctL+aok34WKgLGA+Yfx2IHbpb2D5xRMKcePCL5HSb0UcFhBPmEexTFWIQc3IEr 7pcPbfDcpl7I6iqcjC0bjfxMORT/U6AijG6tzLnNBwvp4e7JYmG48hc/2eIlGY+NG2Sh zTqs7EA59igEVHxjmQZLxqDrE+HuGHgvTkzWAiK5nxA1zRfUzhH0MkSHfXZx9/0FjJUu VV7w== X-Gm-Message-State: AOAM5317gDbsK01jg6Gq3UOi7zkXArc8FZTOV+iOLU/Ky3KExHrlnU2o WYsqR/jPPQaak7ec3zCJicjZU6V5QoQ= X-Google-Smtp-Source: ABdhPJxyTAaJbuZIpV+5KlKBrt9Md+Cp2WaJBY9L8sBS8JljR/FUmPu+5laHBMh8V2wwMktF1Tigdg== X-Received: by 2002:a17:903:120c:: with SMTP id l12mr3717274plh.135.1644435913217; Wed, 09 Feb 2022 11:45:13 -0800 (PST) Received: from ?IPv6:2406:e003:1180:7001:80b2:5c79:2266:e431? ([2406:e003:1180:7001:80b2:5c79:2266:e431]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id nu7sm7572481pjb.30.2022.02.09.11.45.10 (version=TLS1_3 cipher=TLS_AES_128_GCM_SHA256 bits=128/128); Wed, 09 Feb 2022 11:45:12 -0800 (PST) To: "Eric Vyncke (evyncke)" , "ietf@ietf.org" , "admin-discuss@ietf.org" , "tools-discuss@ietf.org" References: From: Brian E Carpenter Message-ID: <5eebed71-98e7-8e99-374a-266abfe176ba@gmail.com> Date: Thu, 10 Feb 2022 08:45:07 +1300 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows NT 10.0; Win64; x64; rv:78.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/78.10.0 MIME-Version: 1.0 In-Reply-To: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8; format=flowed Content-Language: en-US Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Tools-discuss] [admin-discuss] Update on www.ietf.org analytics and proposal for next steps X-BeenThere: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF Tools Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 09 Feb 2022 19:45:30 -0000 =C3=89ric, > prioritizing and improving content on the most visited pages Right, but IMHO an equally important point is looking at which pages are = less visited *and why not*. Is it because they are not so important, or b= ecause they are hard to find? Are there pages that we would consider impo= rtant that nobody looks at? > The aggregated data is made available to the IETF LLC staff, contractor= s whose role requires it, and the Internet Engineering Steering Group. I would suggest that EMO also needs to see the data. Are people finding a= nd using the educational/tutorial material? There isn't enough detail in = the overview reports to answer that (it's all hidden in the "Others" cate= gory), but thanks for publishing them. Regards Brian Carpenter On 09-Feb-22 21:18, Eric Vyncke (evyncke) wrote: > Hello, >=20 > This note provides a follow up on the deployment of analytics on www.ie= tf.org [1] and proposes next steps for deploying ana= lytics on other IETF websites. >=20 > Per the implementation plan [2], the IESG and IETF Tools Team have revi= ewed the current deployment on www.ietf.org and have=20 confirmed it is delivering anticipated results. In the past year, informa= tion from web analytics on has been used by IETF LLC staff and the Secret= ariat to understand and improve use of www.ietf.org in various ways, incl= uding by: >=20 > * prioritizing and improving content on the most visited pages > * identifying reachability issues for specific URLs > * understanding sources of visitors to web pages > * tailoring site-wide features to improve access to specific content >=20 > Aggregated analytics is available to the community at: >=20 > =E2=80=8B=E2=80=8Bhttps://www.ietf.org/policies/web-analytics/ >=20 > During the discussion around the initial call for community input, seve= ral responses suggested expanding the scope of web analytics to include o= ther IETF Internet properties. >=20 > Based on the IESG and Tools Team reviews, and experience gained in the = past year, and requests by maintainers of other IETF websites, we propose=20 to implement analytics on: >=20 > * IETF Datatracker (datatracker.ietf.org) > * The IETF meeting registration system (registration.ietf.org) > * Sites using the new wiki platform, Wiki.js (e.g. chairs.ietf.org an= d authors.ietf.org)[3] > * Related Internet properties such as yangcatalog.org >=20 > These deployments would replicate and conform to the implementation pla= n developed for www.ietf.org . They would NOT enable=20 cross domain linking.[4] As with the initial deployment on www.ietf.org <= http://www.ietf.org>, the IESG and Tools Team would review these deployme= nts after one year to ensure they are delivering the expected results. >=20 > The IESG appreciates any input from the community on this proposal and = will consider all input received by February 23, 2022. >=20 > Regards, >=20 > =C3=89ric Vyncke >=20 > On behalf of the IESG >=20 > [1] https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/ietf/g0uqkYtFx3aFeOwyLxY7ob1D= dTI/ >=20 > [2] https://www.ietf.org/media/documents/www.ietf.org-AnalyticsProposal= -Revised-2019-09-24.pdf >=20 > [3] https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/tools-discuss/eGihlMqjx9yKQqW= hqnn4DtgKaSg/ >=20 > [4] https://matomo.org/faq/how-to/faq_23654/ >=20 >=20 From nobody Wed Feb 9 11:50:23 2022 Return-Path: X-Original-To: tools-discuss@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: tools-discuss@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com 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SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id KluCao_xjGPD; Wed, 9 Feb 2022 14:58:19 -0800 (PST) Received: from gabriel-smtp.zfn.uni-bremen.de (gabriel-smtp.zfn.uni-bremen.de [134.102.50.15]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ADH-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 097253A0C4F; Wed, 9 Feb 2022 14:58:18 -0800 (PST) Received: from [192.168.217.118] (p5089ad4f.dip0.t-ipconnect.de [80.137.173.79]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by gabriel-smtp.zfn.uni-bremen.de (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 4JvFfH4FsCzDCbX; Wed, 9 Feb 2022 23:58:15 +0100 (CET) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Mime-Version: 1.0 (Mac OS X Mail 13.4 \(3608.120.23.2.7\)) From: Carsten Bormann In-Reply-To: Date: Wed, 9 Feb 2022 23:58:14 +0100 Cc: Tools Team Discussion , rfc-markdown@ietf.org X-Mao-Original-Outgoing-Id: 666140294.705855-85224e9fc7ea6a7d300d69044a4b8343 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Message-Id: References: To: Toerless Eckert X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.3608.120.23.2.7) Archived-At: Subject: [Tools-discuss] Old Rubies (Re: kramdown-rfc2629 problems on MacOS Mojave) X-BeenThere: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF Tools Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 09 Feb 2022 22:58:24 -0000 Hi Toerless, You may want to know about the rfc-markdown@ietf.org mailing list [1]. (Rfc-markdown readers: please do read on, this is not unimportant.) Given that you have started the thread over on tools-discss, I=E2=80=99ll = dual-post. > On 2022-02-09, at 19:14, Toerless Eckert wrote: >=20 > = /System/Library/Frameworks/Ruby.framework/Versions/2.3/usr/lib/ruby/2.3.0/= erb.rb:864:in `eval': (erb):107: multiple assignment in conditional = (SyntaxError) Right. This is a regression that we introduced on 2021-11-25 while = putting in the venue feature (PR #148); it was first released in 1.5.18 = 2021-11-29 AFAICT.=20 (But see also below.) > So i am using Mojave's very own ruby 2.3 BINGO. > But i had recently new-installed Mojave and didn't have problems with = even older MacOS versions. So if whatever you had before was as ancient as Mojave=E2=80=99s Ruby = is, you didn=E2=80=99t update your kramdown-rfc since November. Shame = on you. But let me give a bit of context here. .oOo. ## Context kramdown-rfc's gemspec says: s.required_ruby_version =3D '>=3D 2.3.0' Ruby 2.3.0 was released six years ago (2015-12-25). The reason we try to reach so far back is that operating system platforms often get shipped with Ruby versions that already were old at first shipment, and don't update the version over the lifetime of the operating system (e.g., bleeding-edge macOS Monterey still ships with Ruby 2.6). In particular, macOS High Sierra ships with a system Ruby of version 2.3, which we still wanted to support. We do recommend running kramdown-rfc with a recent Ruby, so the considerations here are relevant only for those who do run it on the System Ruby. Interestingly now, from 2021-10-29 (1.5.13) to 2021-12-16 (1.5.24), kramdown-rfc shipped with code that only parses successfully from Ruby 2.6 upwards. So maybe backwards compatibility back to High Sierra's system Ruby is not that important? Or is the section of the user community that runs system Ruby identical with the section that never updates kramdown-rfc either? There is not that much in terms of vulnerabilities that an old Ruby version causes with kramdown-rfc, so there is no strong incentive to upgrade, except maybe for the occasional warning with ancient Rubies. Back to the incident: Ruby 2.6.0 was released three years ago (2018-12-15), so it is not surprising that this is a reasonable baseline for most of us. I only noticed the regression on a repo that had an old Travis install that for some reason was still using Ruby 2.4. So should we be more aggressive in requiring recent Ruby versions? Every self-respecting Ruby programmer wants to use the updates Ruby 3.0 brought a year ago, but that update may still be a bit too aggressive for some users. For now, we would probably just move the baseline up to 2.6, as we inadvertantly already did. Similar considerations of course also apply to other tools, such as the cddl tool. I'd also be interested in learning from the battle scars of IETFers having the equivalent problem with their tools running on Python (Python 2 anyone?) or JavaScript (outside the browser, which is pretty much force-updated these days). .oOo. ## Plan So here=E2=80=99s what I plan to do. I=E2=80=99ll release a 1.5.26 with = a quick fix for Ruby 2.3 in an hour or so (this also has other new = features, so this will be fun). Toerless: Since you now have volunteered to serve as the Ruby 2.3 guinea = pig, you=E2=80=99ll tell me whether that fixes the problem immediately = at hand. But I do want to give up supporting Ruby 2.3 at some point. The main = reason is that we=E2=80=99d need a much more sophisticated testing = strategy to avoid having these regressions over and over. The new = baseline will be 2.6 (as included as System Ruby since macOS Catalina, = but the recommendation stands to install home-brew and a recent Ruby =E2=80= =94 we are at 3.1.0 now, BTW). To provide data for deciding on the flag day, since 1.5.25, kramdown-rfc = reports the Ruby version it was run under in the headers of the = generated XML; I haven=E2=80=99t started mining that data yet. But = maybe that won=E2=80=99t be that useful, because people with ancient = Rubies are likely to run ancient kramdown-rfcs, so I probably need to = make a sample based on submission dates. (I also can=E2=80=99t detect = people who use kramdown-rfc and xml2rfc to generate plaintext and submit = that.) Gr=C3=BC=C3=9Fe, Carsten [1]: https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/rfc-markdown From nobody Wed Feb 9 16:41:29 2022 Return-Path: X-Original-To: tools-discuss@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: tools-discuss@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8C2203A0FD4 for ; Wed, 9 Feb 2022 16:41:27 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.9 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.9 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id QltiN9janCfb for ; Wed, 9 Feb 2022 16:41:22 -0800 (PST) Received: from gabriel-smtp.zfn.uni-bremen.de (gabriel-smtp.zfn.uni-bremen.de [IPv6:2001:638:708:32::15]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ADH-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id BD7763A0ED6 for ; Wed, 9 Feb 2022 16:41:20 -0800 (PST) Received: from [192.168.217.118] (p5089ad4f.dip0.t-ipconnect.de [80.137.173.79]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by gabriel-smtp.zfn.uni-bremen.de (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 4JvHx76jMfzDCbb; Thu, 10 Feb 2022 01:41:15 +0100 (CET) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Mime-Version: 1.0 (Mac OS X Mail 13.4 \(3608.120.23.2.7\)) From: Carsten Bormann In-Reply-To: Date: Thu, 10 Feb 2022 01:41:15 +0100 Cc: "Salz, Rich" , Tools Team Discussion X-Mao-Original-Outgoing-Id: 666146475.520053-9a1a0392d22756ef2fc86bc573d12619 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Message-Id: <75FD7103-9EE8-481E-802E-992A0BA4A083@tzi.org> References: To: Toerless Eckert X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.3608.120.23.2.7) Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Tools-discuss] kramdown-rfc2629 problems on MacOS Mojave X-BeenThere: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF Tools Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 10 Feb 2022 00:41:28 -0000 > So i am using Mojave's very own ruby 2.3 kramdown-rfc 1.5.26 should have fixed the regression. (At least it works for me with a Ruby 2.3.3 I dug out.) Please try! gem update Gr=C3=BC=C3=9Fe, Carsten From nobody Thu Feb 10 07:00:30 2022 Return-Path: X-Original-To: tools-discuss@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: tools-discuss@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4F0BC3A08BD for ; Thu, 10 Feb 2022 07:00:24 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.674 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.674 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIMWL_WL_HIGH=-0.576, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=akamai.com Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id e6Qt8jmQWn8d for ; Thu, 10 Feb 2022 07:00:18 -0800 (PST) Received: from mx0a-00190b01.pphosted.com (mx0a-00190b01.pphosted.com [IPv6:2620:100:9001:583::1]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id F28A23A089A for ; 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Thu, 10 Feb 2022 10:00:01 -0500 From: "Salz, Rich" To: Tools Team Discussion Thread-Topic: analytics question Thread-Index: AQHYHo7g+jU4+J6mmEG/dV4ILkVP3w== Date: Thu, 10 Feb 2022 15:00:00 +0000 Message-ID: <7DF9F36D-3651-4118-917B-09768BCF46CB@akamai.com> Accept-Language: en-US Content-Language: en-US X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: user-agent: Microsoft-MacOutlook/16.58.22020202 x-ms-exchange-messagesentrepresentingtype: 1 x-ms-exchange-transport-fromentityheader: Hosted x-originating-ip: [172.27.118.139] Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="_000_7DF9F36D36514118917B09768BCF46CBakamaicom_" MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Proofpoint-Virus-Version: vendor=fsecure engine=2.50.10434:6.0.425, 18.0.816 definitions=2022-02-10_06:2022-02-09, 2022-02-10 signatures=0 X-Proofpoint-Spam-Details: rule=notspam policy=default score=0 bulkscore=0 adultscore=0 mlxscore=0 spamscore=0 malwarescore=0 mlxlogscore=337 phishscore=0 suspectscore=0 classifier=spam adjust=0 reason=mlx scancount=1 engine=8.12.0-2201110000 definitions=main-2202100080 X-Proofpoint-ORIG-GUID: dFaj9szoG4PqkgYgPH-wwjgy1s8QB4Lz X-Proofpoint-GUID: dFaj9szoG4PqkgYgPH-wwjgy1s8QB4Lz X-Proofpoint-Virus-Version: vendor=baseguard engine=ICAP:2.0.205,Aquarius:18.0.816,Hydra:6.0.425,FMLib:17.11.62.513 definitions=2022-02-10_06,2022-02-09_01,2021-12-02_01 X-Proofpoint-Spam-Details: rule=notspam policy=default score=0 mlxlogscore=333 malwarescore=0 suspectscore=0 clxscore=1015 lowpriorityscore=0 impostorscore=0 adultscore=0 priorityscore=1501 mlxscore=0 spamscore=0 bulkscore=0 phishscore=0 classifier=spam adjust=0 reason=mlx scancount=1 engine=8.12.0-2201110000 definitions=main-2202100081 Archived-At: Subject: [Tools-discuss] analytics question X-BeenThere: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF Tools Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 10 Feb 2022 15:00:27 -0000 --_000_7DF9F36D36514118917B09768BCF46CBakamaicom_ Content-Type: text/plain; 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Thu, 10 Feb 2022 07:11:30 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.898 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.898 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_BLOCKED=0.001, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=unavailable autolearn_force=no Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id uwXyv6MUP0Qm for ; Thu, 10 Feb 2022 07:11:25 -0800 (PST) Received: from ietfx.ietf.org (ietfx.amsl.com [4.31.198.45]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ADH-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id BA68B3A08A9 for ; Thu, 10 Feb 2022 07:11:25 -0800 (PST) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfx.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id BB03640C3E56; Thu, 10 Feb 2022 07:11:24 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com Received: from ietfx.ietf.org ([4.31.198.45]) by localhost (ietfx.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id Xbw9T-OUdqE5; Thu, 10 Feb 2022 07:11:24 -0800 (PST) Received: from smtpclient.apple (unknown [70.18.229.17]) by ietfx.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 7EF304096D3C; Thu, 10 Feb 2022 07:11:24 -0800 (PST) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Mime-Version: 1.0 (Mac OS X Mail 15.0 \(3693.60.0.1.1\)) From: Greg Wood In-Reply-To: <7DF9F36D-3651-4118-917B-09768BCF46CB@akamai.com> Date: Thu, 10 Feb 2022 10:11:23 -0500 Cc: Tools Team Discussion Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Message-Id: <91747A21-DB2D-42C8-890F-975954A56A00@staff.ietf.org> References: <7DF9F36D-3651-4118-917B-09768BCF46CB@akamai.com> To: "Salz, Rich" X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.3693.60.0.1.1) Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Tools-discuss] analytics question X-BeenThere: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF Tools Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 10 Feb 2022 15:11:31 -0000 Hi Rich, =C3=89ric sent the note yesterday: = https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/tools-discuss/T1l_Olgr39HOd_kpiNXyDc= Yh24o/ The published information about our web analytics approach does cite = Matomo On-premises: https://www.ietf.org/policies/web-analytics/ Your note is a helpful reminder that we do need to update that page = if/when analytics is extended to include the other Internet properties = covered, so I=E2=80=99ve flagged a follow up on that. Thank you, -Greg > On 10, Feb2022, at 10:00, Salz, Rich = wrote: >=20 > I didn=E2=80=99t see the draft letter go out yet, so maybe there=E2=80=99= s time for this suggestion. > =20 > Given the controversy around Google analytics (just ruled illegal by = French authorities[1]), it might be worth adding a sentence that = explicitly says > Data is analyzed and kept on the IETF servers and not = sent anywhere else > Or suchlike. > =20 > [1] = https://noyb.eu/en/update-cnil-decides-eu-us-data-transfer-google-analytic= s-illegal > ___________________________________________________________ > Tools-discuss mailing list - Tools-discuss@ietf.org > This list is for discussion, not for action requests or bug reports. > * Report datatracker and mailarchive bugs to: = datatracker-project@ietf.org > * Report tools.ietf.org bugs to: webmaster@tools.ietf.org > * Report all other bugs or issues to: ietf-action@ietf.org > List info (including how to Unsubscribe): = https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/tools-discuss From nobody Thu Feb 10 07:14:09 2022 Return-Path: X-Original-To: tools-discuss@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: tools-discuss@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id A9B853A08B6; Thu, 10 Feb 2022 07:14:04 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.676 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.676 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIMWL_WL_HIGH=-0.576, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=akamai.com Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id djqG-lnSrfMl; Thu, 10 Feb 2022 07:14:00 -0800 (PST) Received: from mx0b-00190b01.pphosted.com (mx0b-00190b01.pphosted.com [IPv6:2620:100:9005:57f::1]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 482303A0C9A; Thu, 10 Feb 2022 07:14:00 -0800 (PST) Received: from pps.filterd (m0050096.ppops.net [127.0.0.1]) by m0050096.ppops.net-00190b01. 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Thu, 10 Feb 2022 10:13:54 -0500 From: "Salz, Rich" To: Greg Wood , "Salz, Rich" CC: Tools Team Discussion Thread-Topic: [Tools-discuss] analytics question Thread-Index: AQHYHo7g+jU4+J6mmEG/dV4ILkVP36yNN6KA//+s4YA= Date: Thu, 10 Feb 2022 15:13:54 +0000 Message-ID: References: <7DF9F36D-3651-4118-917B-09768BCF46CB@akamai.com> <91747A21-DB2D-42C8-890F-975954A56A00@staff.ietf.org> In-Reply-To: <91747A21-DB2D-42C8-890F-975954A56A00@staff.ietf.org> Accept-Language: en-US Content-Language: en-US X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: user-agent: Microsoft-MacOutlook/16.58.22020202 x-ms-exchange-messagesentrepresentingtype: 1 x-ms-exchange-transport-fromentityheader: Hosted x-originating-ip: [172.27.118.139] Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-ID: <088C4ACB1E128644A0D06E8A9495501F@akamai.com> Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Proofpoint-Virus-Version: vendor=fsecure engine=2.50.10434:6.0.425, 18.0.816 definitions=2022-02-10_06:2022-02-09, 2022-02-10 signatures=0 X-Proofpoint-Spam-Details: rule=notspam policy=default score=0 mlxlogscore=945 adultscore=0 spamscore=0 malwarescore=0 phishscore=0 suspectscore=0 mlxscore=0 bulkscore=0 classifier=spam adjust=0 reason=mlx scancount=1 engine=8.12.0-2201110000 definitions=main-2202100081 X-Proofpoint-ORIG-GUID: rcIPZ31_atqTTPqq8afoQk8oEGPYFU-O X-Proofpoint-GUID: rcIPZ31_atqTTPqq8afoQk8oEGPYFU-O X-Proofpoint-Virus-Version: vendor=baseguard engine=ICAP:2.0.205,Aquarius:18.0.816,Hydra:6.0.425,FMLib:17.11.62.513 definitions=2022-02-10_06,2022-02-09_01,2021-12-02_01 X-Proofpoint-Spam-Details: rule=notspam policy=default score=0 priorityscore=1501 mlxscore=0 adultscore=0 spamscore=0 suspectscore=0 mlxlogscore=915 malwarescore=0 clxscore=1015 impostorscore=0 phishscore=0 bulkscore=0 lowpriorityscore=0 classifier=spam adjust=0 reason=mlx scancount=1 engine=8.12.0-2201110000 definitions=main-2202100082 Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Tools-discuss] analytics question X-BeenThere: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF Tools Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 10 Feb 2022 15:14:05 -0000 T24gMi8xMC8yMiwgMTA6MTEgQU0sICJHcmVnIFdvb2QiIDxnaHdvb2RAc3RhZmYuaWV0Zi5vcmc+ IHdyb3RlOg0KDQo+ICAgIMOJcmljIHNlbnQgdGhlIG5vdGUgeWVzdGVyZGF5Og0KPiAgICAgICAg ICAgICAgICBodHRwczovL21haWxhcmNoaXZlLmlldGYub3JnL2FyY2gvbXNnL3Rvb2xzLWRpc2N1 c3MvVDFsX09sZ3IzOUhPZF9rcGlOWHlEY1loMjRvDQoNCkd1ZXNzIEknbSBmdXJ0aGVyIGJlaGlu ZCB0aGFuIEkgdGhvdWdodCA6KQ0KDQpUaGFua3MgZm9yIHRoZSBpbmZvIQ0KDQoNCg== From nobody Tue Feb 15 05:07:45 2022 Return-Path: X-Original-To: tools-discuss@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: tools-discuss@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3D58E3A0997 for ; Tue, 15 Feb 2022 05:07:42 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.899 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.899 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id cpc-8MclLp5i for ; Tue, 15 Feb 2022 05:07:37 -0800 (PST) Received: from slice.pfrc.org (slice.pfrc.org [67.207.130.108]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id B070B3A096B for ; Tue, 15 Feb 2022 05:07:37 -0800 (PST) Received: from smtpclient.apple (99-59-193-67.lightspeed.livnmi.sbcglobal.net [99.59.193.67]) by slice.pfrc.org (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id D18BA1E334; Tue, 15 Feb 2022 08:07:36 -0500 (EST) From: Jeffrey Haas Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="Apple-Mail=_2E2BF68F-2670-4829-8384-3408030BC2E2" Mime-Version: 1.0 (Mac OS X Mail 14.0 \(3654.120.0.1.13\)) Date: Tue, 15 Feb 2022 08:07:36 -0500 References: <20220214212121.GC15589@pfrc.org> To: tools-discuss@ietf.org Message-Id: <2FF63E31-4AD4-47BD-8816-43DF619864F6@pfrc.org> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.3654.120.0.1.13) Archived-At: Subject: [Tools-discuss] notes.ietf.org markdown rendering inconsistencies? X-BeenThere: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF Tools Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 15 Feb 2022 13:07:42 -0000 --Apple-Mail=_2E2BF68F-2670-4829-8384-3408030BC2E2 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii =46rom a thread to wgchairs. The thread was helpful in discussing that we're running tooling that = implement two slightly incompatible flavors of markdown.[1] =20 My request for this thread is that ietf tooling should be consistent, = regardless of what flavor we choose. One shouldn't use the GUI for the = notes tool, run an import and find that the output isn't rendered = properly. I've since used the wisdom from the thread to go back and update my = minutes by adding the necessary newlines before lists. However, that = shouldn't have been necessary. -- Jeff [1] The thread essentially explained that expecting consistency from = markdown is perhaps an inappropriate behavior. While my gut response is = to say we, the ietf, chose poorly I've been through 20 years of such = light markup tooling. Choose your pain. > Begin forwarded message: >=20 > From: Jeffrey Haas > Subject: notes.ietf.org markdown rendering inconsistencies? > Date: February 14, 2022 at 4:21:21 PM EST > To: wgchairs@ietf.org >=20 > Since this might be a known issue, I figured I'd start here: >=20 > https://datatracker.ietf.org/meeting/interim-2022-idr-02/session/idr >=20 > The minutes were done in the notes site. They display nicely there. = (See > link via tiny icon at top of meeting.) >=20 > The minutes generated from the notes site render improperly for some = of the > lists. This results in difficult to read minutes. In particular, = bullet > lists after a statement with a colon. >=20 > Any suggestions on best way to generally address this? >=20 > And should the bug for this go to tools-discuss or a different alias? >=20 > -- Jeff --Apple-Mail=_2E2BF68F-2670-4829-8384-3408030BC2E2 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Type: text/html; charset=us-ascii =46ro= m a thread to wgchairs.

The thread was helpful in discussing that we're running = tooling that implement two slightly incompatible flavors of markdown.[1] =  

My = request for this thread is that ietf tooling should be consistent, = regardless of what flavor we choose.  One shouldn't use the GUI for = the notes tool, run an import and find that the output isn't rendered = properly.

I've = since used the wisdom from the thread to go back and update my minutes = by adding the necessary newlines before lists.  However, that = shouldn't have been necessary.

-- Jeff

[1] The thread essentially explained = that expecting consistency from markdown is perhaps an inappropriate = behavior.  While my gut response is to say we, the ietf, chose = poorly I've been through 20 years of such light markup tooling. =  Choose your pain.

Begin = forwarded message:

From: = Jeffrey Haas <jhaas@pfrc.org>
Subject: = notes.ietf.org markdown = rendering inconsistencies?
Date: = February 14, 2022 at 4:21:21 PM = EST
To: = wgchairs@ietf.org

Since this might be a known issue, I figured I'd start = here:

https://datatracker.ietf.org/meeting/interim-2022-idr-02/sessio= n/idr

The minutes were done in the = notes site.  They display nicely there.  (See
link= via tiny icon at top of meeting.)

The = minutes generated from the notes site render improperly for some of = the
lists.  This results in difficult to read = minutes.  In particular, bullet
lists after a = statement with a colon.

Any suggestions on = best way to generally address this?

And = should the bug for this go to tools-discuss or a different alias?

-- Jeff

= --Apple-Mail=_2E2BF68F-2670-4829-8384-3408030BC2E2-- From nobody Tue Feb 15 05:11:58 2022 Return-Path: X-Original-To: tools-discuss@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: tools-discuss@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 626543A099F for ; Tue, 15 Feb 2022 05:11:57 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.599 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.599 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW=-0.7, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id il12xDCGPARZ for ; Tue, 15 Feb 2022 05:11:53 -0800 (PST) Received: from gabriel-smtp.zfn.uni-bremen.de (gabriel-smtp.zfn.uni-bremen.de [134.102.50.15]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ADH-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 4D2FF3A09B9 for ; Tue, 15 Feb 2022 05:11:53 -0800 (PST) Received: from [192.168.217.118] (p5089ad4f.dip0.t-ipconnect.de [80.137.173.79]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by gabriel-smtp.zfn.uni-bremen.de (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 4JyhLv12ZGzDCck; Tue, 15 Feb 2022 14:11:51 +0100 (CET) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Mime-Version: 1.0 (Mac OS X Mail 13.4 \(3608.120.23.2.7\)) From: Carsten Bormann In-Reply-To: <2FF63E31-4AD4-47BD-8816-43DF619864F6@pfrc.org> Date: Tue, 15 Feb 2022 14:11:50 +0100 Cc: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-Mao-Original-Outgoing-Id: 666623510.754565-edebf1f7087a34f34cee34b9313e6634 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Message-Id: <48B85819-7861-42B9-A95F-A657C6CEBFE3@tzi.org> References: <20220214212121.GC15589@pfrc.org> <2FF63E31-4AD4-47BD-8816-43DF619864F6@pfrc.org> To: Jeffrey Haas X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.3608.120.23.2.7) Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Tools-discuss] notes.ietf.org markdown rendering inconsistencies? X-BeenThere: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF Tools Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 15 Feb 2022 13:11:57 -0000 On 2022-02-15, at 14:07, Jeffrey Haas wrote: >=20 > =46rom a thread to wgchairs. >=20 > The thread was helpful in discussing that we're running tooling that = implement two slightly incompatible flavors of markdown.[1] =20 Yep. In Archived-At: = , Robert Sparks wrote: >> I am working on >>=20 >> * making it so that the datatracker can pull things out of=20 >>=20 >> notes.ietf.org for you, applying de-gfm automatically That would be useful to have. Gr=C3=BC=C3=9Fe, Carsten From nobody Tue Feb 15 08:41:31 2022 Return-Path: X-Original-To: tools-discuss@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: tools-discuss@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9F69A3A0E5C for ; Tue, 15 Feb 2022 08:41:19 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.994 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.994 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_INVALID=0.1, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, KHOP_HELO_FCRDNS=0.399, NICE_REPLY_A=-0.714, T_SPF_HELO_PERMERROR=0.01, T_SPF_PERMERROR=0.01, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=fail (1024-bit key) reason="fail (message has been altered)" header.d=nostrum.com Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id BawoGGCYvsPy for ; Tue, 15 Feb 2022 08:41:14 -0800 (PST) Received: from nostrum.com (raven-v6.nostrum.com [IPv6:2001:470:d:1130::1]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 231D73A0E77 for ; Tue, 15 Feb 2022 08:41:14 -0800 (PST) Received: from [192.168.1.114] ([47.186.48.51]) (authenticated bits=0) by nostrum.com (8.17.1/8.16.1) with ESMTPSA id 21FGf9OV072469 (version=TLSv1.3 cipher=TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 bits=256 verify=NO); Tue, 15 Feb 2022 10:41:09 -0600 (CST) (envelope-from rjsparks@nostrum.com) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=simple/simple; d=nostrum.com; s=default; t=1644943271; bh=+5CkYJMP0u1au/SAPRVygDz7IFnxpqP1UZ1K+C8r2Ck=; h=Date:To:References:From:Subject:In-Reply-To; b=LJ+jcSEFM10LTb0CB+23UR1sbNnejvM9WrwFjRCwFZNeSaDI9MPAEteaMd4tB5cRi zV/padJumrQO8tNk2bgGGfgOavvnaK7m9jHSVVafySwejiqp/I1Sc7Y9pIvDSxVRZs 0VoLMd9mhahUGK0P/je2iGywIq+De4ULDlkmC6Gg= X-Authentication-Warning: raven.nostrum.com: Host [47.186.48.51] claimed to be [192.168.1.114] Message-ID: Date: Tue, 15 Feb 2022 10:41:03 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Macintosh; Intel Mac OS X 10.15; rv:91.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/91.6.0 Content-Language: en-US To: tools-discuss@ietf.org, Jeffrey Haas , Carsten Bormann References: <20220214212121.GC15589@pfrc.org> <2FF63E31-4AD4-47BD-8816-43DF619864F6@pfrc.org> <48B85819-7861-42B9-A95F-A657C6CEBFE3@tzi.org> From: Robert Sparks In-Reply-To: <48B85819-7861-42B9-A95F-A657C6CEBFE3@tzi.org> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Tools-discuss] notes.ietf.org markdown rendering inconsistencies? X-BeenThere: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF Tools Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 15 Feb 2022 16:41:29 -0000 On 2/15/22 7:11 AM, Carsten Bormann wrote: > On 2022-02-15, at 14:07, Jeffrey Haas wrote: >> From a thread to wgchairs. >> >> The thread was helpful in discussing that we're running tooling that implement two slightly incompatible flavors of markdown.[1] > Yep. In Archived-At: , Robert Sparks wrote: > >>> I am working on >>> >>> * making it so that the datatracker can pull things out of >>> >>> notes.ietf.org for you, applying de-gfm automatically > That would be useful to have. It's _there_. If you've used notes.ietf.org for a meeting (at the link the meeting tools generate), you'll get an [Import from notes.ietf.org] button on the minutes row on pages like https://sandbox-cf.ietf.org/meeting/interim-2022-cbor-03/session/cbor (Pointing to the sandbox so you can play with it without affecting production) That workflow fetches the note and runs de-gfm over it - and then gives you a preview of the result. Jeff - did you follow this flow with your session? Right now https://sandbox-cf.ietf.org/meeting/interim-2022-idr-02/session/29265/import/minutes looks pretty good, but that's probably because you changed the relevant notes page already. If that's the case, maybe there's more that we need to do than just run de-gfm? > > Grüße, Carsten > > ___________________________________________________________ > Tools-discuss mailing list - Tools-discuss@ietf.org > This list is for discussion, not for action requests or bug reports. > * Report datatracker and mailarchive bugs to: datatracker-project@ietf.org > * Report tools.ietf.org bugs to: webmaster@tools.ietf.org > * Report all other bugs or issues to: ietf-action@ietf.org > List info (including how to Unsubscribe): https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/tools-discuss From nobody Tue Feb 15 08:46:36 2022 Return-Path: X-Original-To: tools-discuss@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: tools-discuss@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id F3B293A0E35 for ; Tue, 15 Feb 2022 08:46:34 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.9 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.9 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id nLlUXMVsMjXd for ; Tue, 15 Feb 2022 08:46:33 -0800 (PST) Received: from slice.pfrc.org (slice.pfrc.org [67.207.130.108]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3FAAB3A0E46 for ; Tue, 15 Feb 2022 08:46:33 -0800 (PST) Received: by slice.pfrc.org (Postfix, from userid 1001) id A999B1E342; Tue, 15 Feb 2022 11:46:31 -0500 (EST) Date: Tue, 15 Feb 2022 11:46:30 -0500 From: Jeffrey Haas To: Robert Sparks Cc: tools-discuss@ietf.org, Carsten Bormann Message-ID: <20220215164629.GN15589@pfrc.org> References: <20220214212121.GC15589@pfrc.org> <2FF63E31-4AD4-47BD-8816-43DF619864F6@pfrc.org> <48B85819-7861-42B9-A95F-A657C6CEBFE3@tzi.org> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: User-Agent: Mutt/1.5.21 (2010-09-15) Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Tools-discuss] notes.ietf.org markdown rendering inconsistencies? X-BeenThere: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF Tools Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 15 Feb 2022 16:46:35 -0000 Robert, On Tue, Feb 15, 2022 at 10:41:03AM -0600, Robert Sparks wrote: > >>>notes.ietf.org for you, applying de-gfm automatically > >That would be useful to have. > > It's _there_. > > If you've used notes.ietf.org for a meeting (at the link the meeting > tools generate), you'll get an [Import from notes.ietf.org] button > on the minutes row on pages like Yeah, I used that. That's what started this thread. Now, if there's the chance that my original import ran prior to that software being installed, I'm happy to take this as an answer of, "Works now!". If it was present when I hit import, it likely still had issues. I suggest checking the inputs for my interim meeting. > https://sandbox-cf.ietf.org/meeting/interim-2022-cbor-03/session/cbor > > (Pointing to the sandbox so you can play with it without affecting > production) > > That workflow fetches the note and runs de-gfm over it - and then > gives you a preview of the result. > > Jeff - did you follow this flow with your session? Right now > > https://sandbox-cf.ietf.org/meeting/interim-2022-idr-02/session/29265/import/minutes > > looks pretty good, but that's probably because you changed the > relevant notes page already. I updated the inputs on notes to add the suggested empty line before bullet lists, then re-used the import button. I didn't try running import again without changes. -- Jeff From nobody Tue Feb 15 09:07:21 2022 Return-Path: X-Original-To: tools-discuss@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: tools-discuss@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1B04B3A0E6F for ; Tue, 15 Feb 2022 09:07:19 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.899 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.899 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id idyiyN4sATdJ for ; Tue, 15 Feb 2022 09:07:14 -0800 (PST) Received: from gabriel-smtp.zfn.uni-bremen.de (gabriel-smtp.zfn.uni-bremen.de [IPv6:2001:638:708:32::15]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ADH-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 045183A0D3E for ; Tue, 15 Feb 2022 09:07:12 -0800 (PST) Received: from [192.168.217.118] (p5089ad4f.dip0.t-ipconnect.de [80.137.173.79]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by gabriel-smtp.zfn.uni-bremen.de (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 4JynZJ6LCZzDCc7; Tue, 15 Feb 2022 18:07:04 +0100 (CET) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Mime-Version: 1.0 (Mac OS X Mail 13.4 \(3608.120.23.2.7\)) From: Carsten Bormann In-Reply-To: <20220215164629.GN15589@pfrc.org> Date: Tue, 15 Feb 2022 18:07:04 +0100 Cc: Robert Sparks , tools-discuss@ietf.org X-Mao-Original-Outgoing-Id: 666637624.536733-b9a6e92cd393d2878e9c723523ae1f40 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Message-Id: <7BA363D8-F429-4D03-9D1A-D3311FBAD8A2@tzi.org> References: <20220214212121.GC15589@pfrc.org> <2FF63E31-4AD4-47BD-8816-43DF619864F6@pfrc.org> <48B85819-7861-42B9-A95F-A657C6CEBFE3@tzi.org> <20220215164629.GN15589@pfrc.org> To: Jeffrey Haas X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.3608.120.23.2.7) Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Tools-discuss] notes.ietf.org markdown rendering inconsistencies? X-BeenThere: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF Tools Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 15 Feb 2022 17:07:19 -0000 On 2022-02-15, at 17:46, Jeffrey Haas wrote: >=20 > Now, if there's the chance that my original import ran prior to that > software being installed, I'm happy to take this as an answer of, = "Works > now!=E2=80=9D. Thank you for the additional details! I just tried de-gfm=E2=80=99ing a version of the idr minutes from = 2022-02-01 out of hedgedoc (in the menu, select revisions, then select a = revision, and then download). I used the bog standard tool Marked 2 to = look at the result, and it looks fine. Maybe there are further incompatibilities between datatracker=E2=80=99s = markdown interpreter and the relatively standard markdown de-gfm spits = out? Gr=C3=BC=C3=9Fe, Carsten From nobody Tue Feb 15 20:14:46 2022 Return-Path: X-Original-To: tools-discuss@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: tools-discuss@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 242203A086D for ; Tue, 15 Feb 2022 20:14:44 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.099 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.099 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_BLOCKED=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=bangj.com Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id qe4pZ7Z5FCx0 for ; Tue, 15 Feb 2022 20:14:39 -0800 (PST) Received: from oj.bangj.com (69-77-154-174.static.skybest.com [69.77.154.174]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher AECDH-AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 356DC3A082B for ; Tue, 15 Feb 2022 20:14:38 -0800 (PST) Received: from smtpclient.apple (mta-107-13-246-59.nc.rr.com [107.13.246.59]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by oj.bangj.com (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id B6B461D8FF; Tue, 15 Feb 2022 23:14:36 -0500 (EST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/simple; d=bangj.com; s=201907; t=1644984877; bh=IJCSGEjB1+UjW9UToQDERKsRiuyY0kJgq+Q6gFglXL0=; h=From:Subject:Date:In-Reply-To:Cc:To:References:From; b=PGtYvUnprZpB2NisiUfNk/aGsB56mZ3zYERCgsf8oZ1VQBRZ3P/STU34n5yAJCuEP XZeWw+BDuI/mfZTggVLPuNfcQhjmGlFO/X4FdLIsrJfsh7q/tm2lOyFVfEvxBqQopr 0LoBKJQw0uIdgq8pVRj9O9Iqq45FnS6EYioXMPuFTTMeag4wFHWW7eKG+dWvqbxXbq hovZUDw5zMG4DVg30KNPB9AJM8BWt4RnKoiGiU6NxYf8cBDeWaFU6Co8WBXqaLrJvg Q2Nawm5cIGPsS+0YtO0SNXz30+mF+0VRsdJd+N4V7SB4FVRrWHxul1UgV9mwX2uwxM RfxalT4pzsQtg== From: Tom Pusateri Message-Id: Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="Apple-Mail=_E4E21BB6-EAA4-4EC8-BF87-D6E6FC49CAB0" Mime-Version: 1.0 (Mac OS X Mail 14.0 \(3654.120.0.1.13\)) Date: Tue, 15 Feb 2022 23:14:35 -0500 In-Reply-To: <7BA363D8-F429-4D03-9D1A-D3311FBAD8A2@tzi.org> Cc: Jeffrey Haas , tools-discuss@ietf.org, Robert Sparks To: Carsten Bormann References: <20220214212121.GC15589@pfrc.org> <2FF63E31-4AD4-47BD-8816-43DF619864F6@pfrc.org> <48B85819-7861-42B9-A95F-A657C6CEBFE3@tzi.org> <20220215164629.GN15589@pfrc.org> <7BA363D8-F429-4D03-9D1A-D3311FBAD8A2@tzi.org> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.3654.120.0.1.13) Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Tools-discuss] notes.ietf.org markdown rendering inconsistencies? X-BeenThere: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF Tools Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 16 Feb 2022 04:14:44 -0000 --Apple-Mail=_E4E21BB6-EAA4-4EC8-BF87-D6E6FC49CAB0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 > On Feb 15, 2022, at 12:07 PM, Carsten Bormann wrote: >=20 > On 2022-02-15, at 17:46, Jeffrey Haas wrote: >>=20 >> Now, if there's the chance that my original import ran prior to that >> software being installed, I'm happy to take this as an answer of, = "Works >> now!=E2=80=9D. >=20 > Thank you for the additional details! >=20 > I just tried de-gfm=E2=80=99ing a version of the idr minutes from = 2022-02-01 out of hedgedoc (in the menu, select revisions, then select a = revision, and then download). I used the bog standard tool Marked 2 to = look at the result, and it looks fine. >=20 > Maybe there are further incompatibilities between datatracker=E2=80=99s = markdown interpreter and the relatively standard markdown de-gfm spits = out? >=20 > Gr=C3=BC=C3=9Fe, Carsten The datatracker renders markdown using the markdown2 package from pypi: https://pypi.org/project/markdown2/ = It was selected because it implements the original markdown spec as = written by John Gruber. http://daringfireball.net/projects/markdown/ = Markdown2 also supports some extensions as outlined in the docs here: https://github.com/trentm/python-markdown2 = If a compatibility problem is found, issues can be opened at the above = github page. Thanks, Tom --Apple-Mail=_E4E21BB6-EAA4-4EC8-BF87-D6E6FC49CAB0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Type: text/html; charset=utf-8
On = Feb 15, 2022, at 12:07 PM, Carsten Bormann <cabo@tzi.org> = wrote:

On 2022-02-15, at 17:46, Jeffrey Haas <jhaas@pfrc.org> = wrote:

Now, if there's the chance that my original import ran prior = to that
software being installed, I'm happy to take this = as an answer of, "Works
now!=E2=80=9D.

Thank you for the additional = details!

I just tried de-gfm=E2=80=99ing a = version of the idr minutes from 2022-02-01 out of hedgedoc (in the menu, = select revisions, then select a revision, and then download). =   I used the bog standard tool Marked 2 to look at the result, = and it looks fine.

Maybe there are further = incompatibilities between datatracker=E2=80=99s markdown interpreter and = the relatively standard markdown de-gfm spits out?

Gr=C3=BC=C3=9Fe, Carsten

The = datatracker renders markdown using the markdown2 package from = pypi:


It was selected because it implements the original = markdown spec as written by John Gruber.


Markdown2 also supports some extensions as = outlined in the docs here:


If a compatibility problem is found, issues can be = opened at the above github page.

Thanks,
Tom

= --Apple-Mail=_E4E21BB6-EAA4-4EC8-BF87-D6E6FC49CAB0-- From nobody Wed Feb 16 13:01:44 2022 Return-Path: X-Original-To: tools-discuss@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: tools-discuss@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 694263A0ABC; Wed, 16 Feb 2022 13:01:41 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.678 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.678 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_INVALID=0.1, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_BLOCKED=0.001, T_SPF_HELO_PERMERROR=0.01, T_SPF_PERMERROR=0.01] autolearn=no autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=fail (1024-bit key) reason="fail (message has been altered)" header.d=nostrum.com Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id fbXlJmjU7PmD; Wed, 16 Feb 2022 13:01:37 -0800 (PST) Received: from nostrum.com (raven-v6.nostrum.com [IPv6:2001:470:d:1130::1]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 1CABC3A0AD7; Wed, 16 Feb 2022 13:01:37 -0800 (PST) Received: from [192.168.1.114] ([47.186.48.51]) (authenticated bits=0) by nostrum.com (8.17.1/8.16.1) with ESMTPSA id 21GL1XIU069255 (version=TLSv1.3 cipher=TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 bits=256 verify=NO); Wed, 16 Feb 2022 15:01:34 -0600 (CST) (envelope-from rjsparks@nostrum.com) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=simple/simple; d=nostrum.com; s=default; t=1645045294; bh=BryXFFEAFNWZe/fAxufHZyRUamjwetpaDIvDe+VvV4Q=; h=Date:To:From:Subject; b=iwUinQwq1Xmz/woMdjSTTKX2cnO3gDOdQdarNZYgONl6cAUNco6tEy+CHrIkWEPgy 3OGKRklcTQmVwLow6dk6E0xz3NC4LKJQ/a3+aJa0hMHRYSh8WD76gHVVEV72pZ6ZwP uGzPLLwGRLx88NSXriFMNDGGunic5h+7juWo68m4= X-Authentication-Warning: raven.nostrum.com: Host [47.186.48.51] claimed to be [192.168.1.114] Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="------------6yDPba0ls4aatLZcINeZkUFl" Message-ID: Date: Wed, 16 Feb 2022 15:01:28 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Macintosh; Intel Mac OS X 10.15; rv:91.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/91.6.0 Content-Language: en-US To: xml2rfc-dev@ietf.org, XML2RFC Interest Group , rfc-markdown@ietf.org, tools-discuss From: Robert Sparks Archived-At: Subject: [Tools-discuss] New xml2rfc release: v3.12.2 X-BeenThere: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF Tools Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 16 Feb 2022 21:01:42 -0000 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --------------6yDPba0ls4aatLZcINeZkUFl Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit This is _not_ an automated message - we'll build automated mail about releases into the repositories later (or better, people can subscribe to the repository for new releases directly). xml2rfc's repository is now at https://github.com/ietf-tools/xml2rfc/ This release is our first from github. It fixes https://github.com/ietf-tools/xml2rfc/issues/700 As before: > The preferred way to install xml2rfc is by doing 'pip install xml2rfc', > and 'pip install --upgrade xml2rfc' to upgrade. If there are system- > installed python modules which pip will not upgrade, you may have to > use 'pip install --upgrade --no-deps xml2rfc' and install dependencies > manually. Many thanks to Nick, Kesara, and Jennifer for building out and testing the infrastructure needed to make this release. RjS --------------6yDPba0ls4aatLZcINeZkUFl Content-Type: text/html; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

This is _not_ an automated message - we'll build automated mail about releases into the repositories later (or better, people can subscribe to the repository for new releases directly).

xml2rfc's repository is now at https://github.com/ietf-tools/xml2rfc/

This release is our first from github.

It fixes https://github.com/ietf-tools/xml2rfc/issues/700

As before:

The preferred way to install xml2rfc is by doing 'pip install xml2rfc',
and 'pip install --upgrade xml2rfc' to upgrade.  If there are system-
installed python modules which pip will not upgrade, you may have to
use 'pip install --upgrade --no-deps xml2rfc' and install dependencies
manually.

Many thanks to Nick, Kesara, and Jennifer for building out and testing the infrastructure needed to make this release.

RjS

--------------6yDPba0ls4aatLZcINeZkUFl-- From nobody Wed Feb 16 15:01:31 2022 Return-Path: X-Original-To: tools-discuss@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: tools-discuss@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id A27F53A0CF0; Wed, 16 Feb 2022 15:01:28 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.9 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.9 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id K-t29BSXgtuB; Wed, 16 Feb 2022 15:01:24 -0800 (PST) Received: from gabriel-smtp.zfn.uni-bremen.de (gabriel-smtp.zfn.uni-bremen.de [IPv6:2001:638:708:32::15]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ADH-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id DFD3C3A1774; Wed, 16 Feb 2022 15:01:22 -0800 (PST) Received: from client-0015.vpn.uni-bremen.de (client-0015.vpn.uni-bremen.de [134.102.107.15]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by gabriel-smtp.zfn.uni-bremen.de (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 4JzYNY4dsQzDCcg; Thu, 17 Feb 2022 00:01:17 +0100 (CET) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Mime-Version: 1.0 (Mac OS X Mail 13.4 \(3608.120.23.2.7\)) From: Carsten Bormann In-Reply-To: Date: Thu, 17 Feb 2022 00:01:17 +0100 Cc: XML2RFC Dev , XML2RFC Interest Group , rfc-markdown@ietf.org, tools-discuss X-Mao-Original-Outgoing-Id: 666745277.135753-c8cf86bd10ffc28fdfec1c7586d0ad8c Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Message-Id: <940EB617-0D88-4518-885D-E76B8EA63492@tzi.org> References: To: Robert Sparks X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.3608.120.23.2.7) Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Tools-discuss] New xml2rfc release: v3.12.2 X-BeenThere: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF Tools Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 16 Feb 2022 23:01:29 -0000 On 2022-02-16, at 22:01, Robert Sparks wrote: >=20 > This release is our first from github. Congratulations! =F0=9F=8D=BE=F0=9F=8E=89=F0=9F=8E=8A Kudos for the team that made this happen. And many thanks for = https://github.com/ietf-tools/xml2rfc/blob/main/svn-history/xml2rfc-revmap= .txt =E2=80=94 I don=E2=80=99t have tooling to consume this yet, but = I=E2=80=99ll sure have it soon... Gr=C3=BC=C3=9Fe, Carsten From nobody Wed Feb 16 21:59:29 2022 Return-Path: X-Original-To: tools-discuss@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: tools-discuss@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8ED543A11E2; Wed, 16 Feb 2022 21:58:24 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.9 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.9 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id U-6SyemAmyC1; Wed, 16 Feb 2022 21:58:23 -0800 (PST) Received: from ran.psg.com (ran.psg.com [IPv6:2001:418:8006::18]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id DF1943A11E4; Wed, 16 Feb 2022 21:58:22 -0800 (PST) Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1] helo=ryuu.rg.net) by ran.psg.com with esmtp (Exim 4.93) (envelope-from ) id 1nKZo3-000a7F-7L; Thu, 17 Feb 2022 05:58:19 +0000 Date: Wed, 16 Feb 2022 21:58:18 -0800 Message-ID: From: Randy Bush To: Robert Sparks Cc: xml2rfc-dev@ietf.org, XML2RFC Interest Group , rfc-markdown@ietf.org, tools-discuss In-Reply-To: References: User-Agent: Wanderlust/2.15.9 (Almost Unreal) Emacs/26.3 Mule/6.0 (HANACHIRUSATO) MIME-Version: 1.0 (generated by SEMI-EPG 1.14.7 - "Harue") Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Tools-discuss] [xml2rfc] New xml2rfc release: v3.12.2 X-BeenThere: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF Tools Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 17 Feb 2022 05:58:25 -0000 > This release is our first from github. can't speak to other attributes, but it is faster from comcast portland. randy From nobody Thu Feb 17 06:23:09 2022 Return-Path: X-Original-To: tools-discuss@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: tools-discuss@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 355983A08AE; 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Thu, 17 Feb 2022 14:22:42 +0000 From: Ronald Tse To: Robert Sparks CC: "xml2rfc-dev@ietf.org" , XML2RFC Interest Group , "rfc-markdown@ietf.org" , tools-discuss Thread-Topic: [xml2rfc-dev] New xml2rfc release: v3.12.2 Thread-Index: AQHYI3h05tdSDkCfWUik5/0nBMkmaKyXzLOA Date: Thu, 17 Feb 2022 14:22:42 +0000 Message-ID: <73B345C2-4E4E-48E1-A5A5-9A3DC959A013@ribose.com> References: In-Reply-To: Accept-Language: en-US Content-Language: en-US X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: x-mailer: Apple Mail (2.3693.60.0.1.1) authentication-results: dkim=none (message not signed) header.d=none;dmarc=none action=none header.from=ribose.com; x-ms-publictraffictype: Email x-ms-office365-filtering-correlation-id: d0dee395-e6fc-4b77-1921-08d9f220f5b1 x-ms-traffictypediagnostic: PS1PR01MB3513:EE_ x-microsoft-antispam-prvs: x-ms-oob-tlc-oobclassifiers: OLM:8882; x-ms-exchange-senderadcheck: 1 x-ms-exchange-antispam-relay: 0 x-microsoft-antispam: BCL:0; x-microsoft-antispam-message-info: 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 x-forefront-antispam-report: CIP:255.255.255.255; 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boundary="_000_73B345C24E4E48E1A5A59A3DC959A013ribosecom_" MIME-Version: 1.0 X-OriginatorOrg: ribose.com X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-AuthAs: Internal X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-AuthSource: HK0PR01MB2001.apcprd01.prod.exchangelabs.com X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-Network-Message-Id: d0dee395-e6fc-4b77-1921-08d9f220f5b1 X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-originalarrivaltime: 17 Feb 2022 14:22:42.2660 (UTC) X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-fromentityheader: Hosted X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-id: d98a04ff-ef98-489b-b33c-13c23a2e091a X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-mailboxtype: HOSTED X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-userprincipalname: CMTe1qsLH3xCw8uT+iODg+uszE4gpOQ+/os2C4dw5VuFyRW7IVQ8vo/biTZUINcm X-MS-Exchange-Transport-CrossTenantHeadersStamped: PS1PR01MB3513 Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Tools-discuss] [xml2rfc-dev] New xml2rfc release: v3.12.2 X-BeenThere: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF Tools Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 17 Feb 2022 14:23:02 -0000 --_000_73B345C24E4E48E1A5A59A3DC959A013ribosecom_ Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Congratulations to the xml2rfc team! This is an excellent step that will se= rve the community well. Ron _____________________________________ Ronald Tse Ribose Inc. +=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D+ This message may contain confidential and/or privileged information. If you are not the addressee or authorized to receive this for the addressee, you must not use, copy, disclose or take any action based on this message or any information herein. If you have received this message in error, please advise the sender immediately by reply e-mail and delete this message. Thank you for your cooperation. +=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D+ On 17 Feb 2022, at 5:01 AM, Robert Sparks > wrote: This is _not_ an automated message - we'll build automated mail about relea= ses into the repositories later (or better, people can subscribe to the rep= ository for new releases directly). xml2rfc's repository is now at https://github.com/ietf-tools/xml2rfc/ This release is our first from github. It fixes https://github.com/ietf-tools/xml2rfc/issues/700 As before: The preferred way to install xml2rfc is by doing 'pip install xml2rfc', and 'pip install --upgrade xml2rfc' to upgrade. If there are system- installed python modules which pip will not upgrade, you may have to use 'pip install --upgrade --no-deps xml2rfc' and install dependencies manually. Many thanks to Nick, Kesara, and Jennifer for building out and testing the = infrastructure needed to make this release. RjS _______________________________________________ xml2rfc-dev mailing list xml2rfc-dev@ietf.org https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/xml2rfc-dev --_000_73B345C24E4E48E1A5A59A3DC959A013ribosecom_ Content-Type: text/html; charset="us-ascii" Content-ID: <7E6FC0589B7A98468253AF5BD4249431@apcprd01.prod.exchangelabs.com> Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Congratulations to the xml2rfc team! This is an excellent step that will se= rve the community well.

Ron

_____________________________________

Ronald Tse
Ribose Inc.

+=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D+
This message may contain confidential and/or privileged
information.  If you are not the addressee or authorized to
receive this for the addressee, you must not use, copy,
disclose or take any action based on this message or any
information herein.  If you have received this message in
error, please advise the sender immediately by reply e-mail
and delete this message.  Thank you for your cooperation.
+=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D+

On 17 Feb 2022, at 5:01 AM, Robert Sparks <rjsparks@nostrum.com> wrote:

This is _not_ an automated message - we'll build automated ma= il about releases into the repositories later (or better, people can subscr= ibe to the repository for new releases directly).

xml2rfc's repository is now at https://github.com/ietf-tools/xml2rfc/

This release is our first from github.

It fixes https://github.com/ietf-tools/xml2rfc/issues/700

As before:


The preferred way to install xml2rfc is by doing 'pip insta=
ll xml2rfc',
and 'pip install --upgrade xml2rfc' to upgrade.  If there are system-
installed python modules which pip will not upgrade, you may have to
use 'pip install --upgrade --no-deps xml2rfc' and install dependencies
manually.

Many thanks to Nick, Kesara, and Jennifer for building out an= d testing the infrastructure needed to make this release.

RjS

_______________________________________________
xml2rfc-dev mailing list
xml2rfc-dev@ietf.org=
https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/xml2rfc-dev

--_000_73B345C24E4E48E1A5A59A3DC959A013ribosecom_-- From nobody Thu Feb 17 08:52:25 2022 Return-Path: X-Original-To: tools-discuss@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: tools-discuss@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 455B83A0C21 for ; Thu, 17 Feb 2022 08:52:22 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.079 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.079 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, T_SPF_HELO_PERMERROR=0.01, T_SPF_PERMERROR=0.01, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (1024-bit key) header.d=nostrum.com Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id z1-JTjXAR0Vw for ; Thu, 17 Feb 2022 08:52:17 -0800 (PST) Received: from nostrum.com (raven-v6.nostrum.com [IPv6:2001:470:d:1130::1]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 93FD63A0C32 for ; Thu, 17 Feb 2022 08:52:17 -0800 (PST) Received: from [192.168.1.114] ([47.186.48.51]) (authenticated bits=0) by nostrum.com (8.17.1/8.16.1) with ESMTPSA id 21HGqGOC099552 (version=TLSv1.3 cipher=TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 bits=256 verify=NO) for ; Thu, 17 Feb 2022 10:52:16 -0600 (CST) (envelope-from rjsparks@nostrum.com) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=simple/simple; d=nostrum.com; s=default; t=1645116736; bh=ZJIAokah+OE4f69OfILk0r/zBYrKUT7HuOKLfuqJQNo=; h=Date:To:From:Subject; b=YSgBwBz8U0OcBU9Fq3W/9j/eCyT2fEdMGC+8dznmYTb6ciSjp0s8YsMj7Afp6K/cY Use2LPz9aICo7KbtkiFAxWyqC8om746HWw+lyMxbC0FNIJAHS8a6vzX1nKP1eoWLzN mk3MInQzGXTOMvERBYtqqscAgG0LnMNkhetINyYg= X-Authentication-Warning: raven.nostrum.com: Host [47.186.48.51] claimed to be [192.168.1.114] Message-ID: <0d096ae4-095b-096d-bd96-0e884023e949@nostrum.com> Date: Thu, 17 Feb 2022 10:52:10 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Macintosh; Intel Mac OS X 10.15; rv:91.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/91.6.1 Content-Language: en-US To: tools-discuss From: Robert Sparks Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Archived-At: Subject: [Tools-discuss] Tools team meeting to coordinate future workshops X-BeenThere: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF Tools Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 17 Feb 2022 16:52:23 -0000 All - The tools team will be meeting soon to prioritize, refine, and start scheduling the next set of workshops. Anyone can attend. The doodle for the session is at https://doodle.com/poll/39ygusrk9wmdcx97. I plan to chose the date early next week. We will be working with what's at https://github.com/ietf-tools/tools-workshops. Proposals for other workshops, refinements to the suggested workshops, and other comments are welcome. PRs are encouraged. RjS From nobody Thu Feb 17 15:34:16 2022 Return-Path: X-Original-To: tools-discuss@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: tools-discuss@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 19A983A1408 for ; Thu, 17 Feb 2022 15:34:15 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.897 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.897 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_BLOCKED=0.001, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id zJIGeKFJ7Nm6 for ; Thu, 17 Feb 2022 15:34:10 -0800 (PST) Received: from ietfx.ietf.org (ietfx.amsl.com [4.31.198.45]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ADH-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 7657E3A1405 for ; Thu, 17 Feb 2022 15:34:10 -0800 (PST) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfx.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 49743404BFA1; Thu, 17 Feb 2022 15:34:10 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com Received: from ietfx.ietf.org ([4.31.198.45]) by localhost (ietfx.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id YcuzrXKDnQCK; Thu, 17 Feb 2022 15:34:10 -0800 (PST) Received: from smtpclient.apple (unknown [158.140.230.105]) by ietfx.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 8CDD5404BFA0; Thu, 17 Feb 2022 15:34:09 -0800 (PST) From: Jay Daley Message-Id: Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="Apple-Mail=_261D36AE-8167-4826-BBBB-66837AC31DFE" Mime-Version: 1.0 (Mac OS X Mail 15.0 \(3693.40.0.1.81\)) Date: Fri, 18 Feb 2022 12:34:05 +1300 In-Reply-To: Cc: tools-discuss To: Tim April References: <3318CCB9-0C79-47D4-A365-10AAAFE67160@ietf.org> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.3693.40.0.1.81) Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Tools-discuss] Zulip implementation Service Plan X-BeenThere: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF Tools Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 17 Feb 2022 23:34:15 -0000 --Apple-Mail=_261D36AE-8167-4826-BBBB-66837AC31DFE Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Apologies for the long delaying replying - most of your suggestions were = incorporated at the time, just not replied to. Some comments: First, thanks for taking the time to properly review this, > On 2/09/2021, at 1:43 PM, Tim April wrote: >=20 > Hi Jay, >=20 > In re-reading the document I have a few comments for further = discussion: >=20 > 1.2: Do we expect all users to understand what OIDC is? Could = =E2=80=9CDatatracker OIDC=E2=80=9D be replaced with =E2=80=9CDatatracker = Single Sign-On=E2=80=9D? >=20 We normally just say "using your Datatracker credentials" or "login" or = something similar so this now says that. > 1.3: I would also suggest adding this to the end of the section. = =E2=80=9C#NOTEWELL will be a default stream for all users.=E2=80=9D This = can be configured through the organizational settings for the instance. >=20 Done > 2.1: For the first bullet under the mailing list mirror note, I would = replace >=20 > =E2=80=9CIn this configuration they can choose not to subscribe to the = list mirror.=E2=80=9D > With >=20 > =E2=80=9CIn this configuration they can choose not to subscribe to the = list mirror in zulip or to mute the stream them to view or search the = mirrored messages without receiving notifications for them.=E2=80=9D Done. > 3.1: It may also be worth noting that attachments will also be = retained for some period of time. >=20 Done > 3.1: It may be worth calling out the message edit time restriction, if = enabled. In the tulip services that I host / operate, we have the edit = timer set to 10 minutes just to limit the length of time that of the = change to somewhere near the time the conversation happened. >=20 Done > 3.1: As an operator, from time to time I get requests to delete = messages, either because someone sends something sensitive to the = service or they misspeak and may feel it is something which could have = negative impact on others. It may be up to Jay, Lars and Counsel as to = what policy / process could be used to delete a message, but I would = suggest thinking a little about that before the switch announcement. >=20 We don=E2=80=99t get that with Jabber so it seems best to leave this for = now and only address it if we get an issue. > 3.2: This section is very vague about under what circumstances DMs may = be inspected. My instinct is to avoid anything which I do not expect to = be public on the IETF zulip system with the wording of this section, but = I feel like that remove some of the usefulness of the system. In the = corporate space, there is usually a well defined policy which governs = the ability for operators to access messages under three conditions: >=20 > 1) Verified lawful request from an agency with jurisdiction (usually = verified by counsel) > 2) Explicit policy which defines the conditions under which access may = be granted to a set of messages (Eg: HR dispute, discovery, harassment = claims, etc). > 3) Extraordinary conditions under which a quorum of some set of = participants documents a need to access messages. > Some of these policies also include criteria under which the parties = to these messages will be informed that the message was retrieved. >=20 I don=E2=80=99t think we can predetermine what the policy is because = ultimately the community is free to set whatever policy there is = consensus for. > 4 - Other Integrations: Are additional integrations allowed to be = deployed by IETF participants? Are there criteria to do so? Who needs to = be contact/involved/informed to do something like that? >=20 Again I think it=E2=80=99s too soon to try and work that out in advance. = I would expect anyone who wants a new integration to raise that here or = directly with Robert as per our other tools. cheers Jay > Thanks! >=20 > --tim >=20 > On 1 Sep 2021, at 19:57, Jay Daley wrote: >=20 > Hi >=20 > I=E2=80=99ve put together a Service Plan for our upcoming Zulip = implementation based on work by Tim April and had that reviewed and = revised by a number of people who were involved in the trial. Robert is = now happy for this to be shared for comment and any further revisions. = Please find the document at >=20 > = https://github.com/ietf-tools/zulip-implementation/blob/main/Service-Plan.= md = >=20 > The aim to is sign this off at the next Tools meeting in two weeks = time. >=20 > cheers > Jay >=20 > --=20 > Jay Daley > IETF Executive Director > exec-director@ietf.org >=20 > ___________________________________________________________ > Tools-discuss mailing list - Tools-discuss@ietf.org > This list is for discussion, not for action requests or bug reports. > * Report datatracker and mailarchive bugs to: = datatracker-project@ietf.org > * Report tools.ietf.org bugs to: webmaster@tools.ietf.org > * Report all other bugs or issues to: ietf-action@ietf.org > List info (including how to Unsubscribe): = https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/tools-discuss = --=20 Jay Daley IETF Executive Director exec-director@ietf.org --Apple-Mail=_261D36AE-8167-4826-BBBB-66837AC31DFE Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Type: text/html; charset=utf-8 Apologies for the long delaying replying - most of your = suggestions were incorporated at the time, just not replied to. =  Some comments:

First, thanks for taking the time to properly review this,

On 2/09/2021, at 1:43 PM, Tim April <ietf@tapril.net> = wrote:

Hi = Jay,

In re-reading the document I have a = few comments for further discussion:

1.2: = Do we expect all users to understand what OIDC is? Could =E2=80=9CDatatrac= ker OIDC=E2=80=9D be replaced with =E2=80=9CDatatracker Single = Sign-On=E2=80=9D?

We = normally just say "using your Datatracker credentials" or "login" or = something similar so this now says that.

1.3: = I would also suggest adding this to the end of the section. =E2=80=9C#NOTE= WELL will be a default stream for all users.=E2=80=9D This can be = configured through the organizational settings for the = instance.

Done

2.1: = For the first bullet under the mailing list mirror note, I would = replace

=E2=80=9CIn this configuration =
they can choose not to subscribe to the list mirror.=E2=80=9D

With

=E2=80=9CIn this configuration =
they can choose not to subscribe to the list mirror in zulip or to mute =
the stream them to view or search the mirrored messages without =
receiving notifications for them.=E2=80=9D
Done.

3.1: = It may also be worth noting that attachments will also be retained for = some period of time.

Done

3.1: = It may be worth calling out the message edit time restriction, if = enabled. In the tulip services that I host / operate, we have the edit = timer set to 10 minutes just to limit the length of time that of the = change to somewhere near the time the conversation = happened.

Done

3.1: = As an operator, from time to time I get requests to delete messages, = either because someone sends something sensitive to the service or they = misspeak and may feel it is something which could have negative impact = on others. It may be up to Jay, Lars and Counsel as to what policy / = process could be used to delete a message, but I would suggest thinking = a little about that before the switch = announcement.

We don=E2=80=99t = get that with Jabber so it seems best to leave this for now and only = address it if we get an issue.

3.2: = This section is very vague about under what circumstances DMs may be = inspected. My instinct is to avoid anything which I do not expect to be = public on the IETF zulip system with the wording of this section, but I = feel like that remove some of the usefulness of the system. In the = corporate space, there is usually a well defined policy which governs = the ability for operators to access messages under three conditions:

1) Verified lawful request =
from an agency with jurisdiction (usually verified by counsel)
2) Explicit policy which defines the conditions under which access may =
be granted to a set of messages (Eg: HR dispute, discovery, harassment =
claims, etc).
3) Extraordinary conditions under which a quorum of some set of =
participants documents a need to access messages.

Some of these policies also = include criteria under which the parties to these messages will be = informed that the message was = retrieved.

I don=E2=80=99t think = we can predetermine what the policy is because ultimately the community = is free to set whatever policy there is consensus for.

4 - = Other Integrations: Are additional integrations allowed to be deployed = by IETF participants? Are there criteria to do so? Who needs to be = contact/involved/informed to do something like = that?

Again I think it=E2=80=99= s too soon to try and work that out in advance.  I would expect = anyone who wants a new integration to raise that here or directly with = Robert as per our other tools.

cheers
Jay

Thanks!

--tim

On 1 Sep 2021, at 19:57, Jay Daley wrote:

Hi

I=E2=80=99ve put together a Service Plan for our upcoming Zulip = implementation based on work by Tim April and had that reviewed and = revised by a number of people who were involved in the trial. Robert is = now happy for this to be shared for comment and any further revisions. = Please find the document at

https://github.com/ietf-tools/zulip-implementation/blob/main/Se= rvice-Plan.md

The aim to is sign this off at the next Tools meeting in two weeks = time.

cheers
Jay

--
Jay Daley
IETF Executive Director
exec-director@ietf.org

___________________________________________________________
= Tools-discuss mailing list - Tools-discuss@ietf.org
This list is for discussion, not for action requests or bug reports.
* Report datatracker and mailarchive bugs to: datatracker-project@ietf.org
* Report tools.ietf.org = bugs to: webmaster@tools.ietf.org
* Report all other bugs or issues to: ietf-action@ietf.org
List info (including how to Unsubscribe): https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/tools-discuss


-- 
Jay = Daley
IETF Executive Director
exec-director@ietf.org

= --Apple-Mail=_261D36AE-8167-4826-BBBB-66837AC31DFE-- From nobody Fri Feb 18 07:48:58 2022 Return-Path: X-Original-To: tools-discuss@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: tools-discuss@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id C5D653A1061 for ; Fri, 18 Feb 2022 07:48:55 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -6.9 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-6.9 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_HI=-5, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 5Bs8d3LhvB9t for ; Fri, 18 Feb 2022 07:48:53 -0800 (PST) Received: from slice.pfrc.org (slice.pfrc.org [67.207.130.108]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id AD2D73A112C for ; Fri, 18 Feb 2022 07:48:53 -0800 (PST) Received: by slice.pfrc.org (Postfix, from userid 1001) id 215031E342; Fri, 18 Feb 2022 10:48:53 -0500 (EST) Date: Fri, 18 Feb 2022 10:48:53 -0500 From: Jeffrey Haas To: Tom Pusateri Cc: Carsten Bormann , tools-discuss@ietf.org, Robert Sparks Message-ID: <20220218154852.GW15589@pfrc.org> References: <20220214212121.GC15589@pfrc.org> <2FF63E31-4AD4-47BD-8816-43DF619864F6@pfrc.org> <48B85819-7861-42B9-A95F-A657C6CEBFE3@tzi.org> <20220215164629.GN15589@pfrc.org> <7BA363D8-F429-4D03-9D1A-D3311FBAD8A2@tzi.org> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: User-Agent: Mutt/1.5.21 (2010-09-15) Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Tools-discuss] notes.ietf.org markdown rendering inconsistencies? X-BeenThere: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF Tools Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 18 Feb 2022 15:48:56 -0000 Tom, [description about what tools IETF uses elided] On Tue, Feb 15, 2022 at 11:14:35PM -0500, Tom Pusateri wrote: > If a compatibility problem is found, issues can be opened at the above github page. Clearly a compatibility issue was found. It'd be helpful to know whether this thread has resulted in some sort of work the tools team will pick up or whether you're saying it now falls to the complainant to chase this all the way through the tools producers that the team has chosen to leverage. Mostly so I can know whether it's worth bothering to report problems in the future. :-) -- Jeff From nobody Fri Feb 18 09:04:30 2022 Return-Path: X-Original-To: tools-discuss@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: tools-discuss@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 084B73A120C for ; Fri, 18 Feb 2022 09:04:16 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.1 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.1 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=bangj.com Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id RyVbsDUDKQkl for ; Fri, 18 Feb 2022 09:04:09 -0800 (PST) Received: from oj.bangj.com (69-77-154-174.static.skybest.com [69.77.154.174]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher AECDH-AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 13C923A125D for ; Fri, 18 Feb 2022 09:04:03 -0800 (PST) Received: from smtpclient.apple (mta-107-13-246-59.nc.rr.com [107.13.246.59]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by oj.bangj.com (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 475C61DC3F; Fri, 18 Feb 2022 12:04:02 -0500 (EST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/simple; d=bangj.com; s=201907; t=1645203842; bh=qKemaqTU9QFv+BrUAEumBRfvI6g0AIpsYYwwdyEeLtI=; h=From:Subject:Date:References:Cc:In-Reply-To:To:From; b=PFOQfqq3yVqW2NEKAS8hnV/+ZDmbtvYvuXJql/cOwU8Im5wUzJ4sMqdRouiUdsU9l oZiUoPFLmPPj91s640RGtzg1g8WgBgUXyB/jD+fOcicTz798dQquNvruU7t7sJBci4 p1jxZ/GnYQkK6L3zukKLyoGvlC1EUSin9mozNAtT3Ln8TEgVeLsTaQKYOvpLTuOa0O Raof88ZWYYQSSMyNvzujzX/pM2AVOP4MLADi0kSfs77d+OYl2gcyJMH7WMvZqPLjRl 1UCg9MmZTFKlQl//tlngEm1gnOnvBcE0iY8NjjeU1mgg1sVud25Q6gemmI8OcMnMdf kSj3I60109Geg== Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable From: Tom Pusateri Mime-Version: 1.0 (1.0) Date: Fri, 18 Feb 2022 12:04:01 -0500 Message-Id: <6E220522-F121-4C23-B0BD-350330202748@bangj.com> References: <20220218154852.GW15589@pfrc.org> Cc: Carsten Bormann , tools-discuss@ietf.org, Robert Sparks In-Reply-To: <20220218154852.GW15589@pfrc.org> To: Jeffrey Haas X-Mailer: iPad Mail (19D52) Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Tools-discuss] notes.ietf.org markdown rendering inconsistencies? X-BeenThere: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF Tools Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 18 Feb 2022 17:04:27 -0000 Jeffrey, Sorry, I did not intend to infer that you=E2=80=99re on your own. O= bviously, we want all the tools to work together in a compatible way. My pur= pose was to inform that the datatracker was trying to follow the Markdown sp= ec as much as possible. With Markdown, this has been difficult because the s= pec is under-specified. =E2=80=9CEmbrace and Extend=E2=80=9D has been the rule of thumb for any proj= ect using Markdown it seems so incompatibilities are everywhere. Carsten=E2=80=99s note seemed to indicate he tried to reproduce the incompat= ibility from the original note and after running it through the de-github ma= rkdown extension tool, he was not able to reproduce it. Maybe I misread that= . So given the currently know information, can you reproduce it and explain ho= w so I can dig into more? Thanks, Tom > On Feb 18, 2022, at 10:54 AM, Jeffrey Haas wrote: >=20 > =EF=BB=BFTom, >=20 > [description about what tools IETF uses elided] >=20 >> On Tue, Feb 15, 2022 at 11:14:35PM -0500, Tom Pusateri wrote: >> If a compatibility problem is found, issues can be opened at the above gi= thub page. >=20 > Clearly a compatibility issue was found. >=20 > It'd be helpful to know whether this thread has resulted in some sort of > work the tools team will pick up or whether you're saying it now falls to > the complainant to chase this all the way through the tools producers that= > the team has chosen to leverage. >=20 > Mostly so I can know whether it's worth bothering to report problems in th= e > future. :-) >=20 > -- Jeff From nobody Fri Feb 18 09:21:49 2022 Return-Path: X-Original-To: tools-discuss@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: tools-discuss@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id D114F3A120E; Fri, 18 Feb 2022 09:21:46 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.099 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.099 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=sandelman.ca Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 2uA-4eKOpEUA; Fri, 18 Feb 2022 09:21:41 -0800 (PST) Received: from tuna.sandelman.ca (tuna.sandelman.ca [209.87.249.19]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ADH-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 8870E3A120D; Fri, 18 Feb 2022 09:21:41 -0800 (PST) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by tuna.sandelman.ca (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9A9DA38B9B; Fri, 18 Feb 2022 12:29:55 -0500 (EST) Received: from tuna.sandelman.ca ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id D4OQMDXgGAbz; Fri, 18 Feb 2022 12:29:55 -0500 (EST) Received: from sandelman.ca (obiwan.sandelman.ca [209.87.249.21]) by tuna.sandelman.ca (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1E22A38B25; Fri, 18 Feb 2022 12:29:55 -0500 (EST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/simple; d=sandelman.ca; s=mail; t=1645205395; bh=iMK2Pz8dUaXBSrJAOfQ2E6oc+aUCFD1FaUKavesD02Q=; h=From:To:cc:Subject:In-Reply-To:References:Date:From; b=NHkTjG448o54D5qev+7opRsd2A9MySrB+KRYKnRUOF3LTLugA44cLBv/x5bXXuJhY Urvj+W8Ie+jVKV8BF0nCOeSWmcapXXml1d5aJLrcgcQIfjqd9ZNbCx+K/Veh+hv1rT WzytP047+UcTHZba9adF/pKDg/5ARH7LWRYTEY7qPfqWY8GZwRfLQYjfUH9ILx/hXp Pk9CUiuaJ9VLT+YMIrFlpP02w6HeTari6bKtv4y6E3wtz6RFysokPQmwylwMBIBdg/ 2F1Upgl2qUxo/xKFQPsGVsfkn+q+K6fLj8S0YQ+JyUw36Bc8JhvCfyQt1gz5HYZWv6 MI5ceBDfWPluA== Received: from localhost (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by sandelman.ca (Postfix) with ESMTP id 82E5A624; Fri, 18 Feb 2022 12:21:39 -0500 (EST) From: Michael Richardson To: Jay Daley cc: tools-discuss In-Reply-To: References: <3318CCB9-0C79-47D4-A365-10AAAFE67160@ietf.org> X-Mailer: MH-E 8.6+git; nmh 1.7+dev; GNU Emacs 26.1 X-Face: $\n1pF)h^`}$H>Hk{L"x@)JS7<%Az}5RyS@k9X%29-lHB$Ti.V>2bi.~ehC0; <'$9xN5Ub# z!G,p`nR&p7Fz@^UXIn156S8.~^@MJ*mMsD7=QFeq%AL4m Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Tools-discuss] Zulip implementation Service Plan X-BeenThere: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF Tools Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 18 Feb 2022 17:21:47 -0000 --=-=-= Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Seeing this message reminded me to try Zulip. I didn't find zulip info any= where. I read the linked service-plan, and I wondered, if Zulip will authenticate via DT, can't it assume that the DT has shown the notewell to the participant? =2D- Michael Richardson . o O ( IPv6 I=C3=B8T consulti= ng ) Sandelman Software Works Inc, Ottawa and Worldwide --=-=-= Content-Type: application/pgp-signature; name="signature.asc" -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- iPMEAQEKAB0WIQSk7ZHEG9TCGBNASfm/sjw/rPYc8wUCYg/VowAKCRC/sjw/rPYc 860nBf4nLEDxuhzYfrJlBatLALxWNREFTcsZeF0W+dToAtarZvfdm2SofHAzu/s2 cWUllmeI0tQnbglKW64Mm8buCSzVGG9mDwttZk0kNkUCWp9QBjgXsKyB+GVd807G S4Dg8Zf8KUHu2x6UnT4Ls0qL0+5sPE5IFHDoB6kXtldyPaDu4lXqDK9vnpWFrz6G +opB0wRTYJNlIg8T+GWmg2XpxlLLwoA6StAZosz90oZ70o6Wi1PZNqMjScRsjn80 Kq51efg= =Fawf -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --=-=-=-- From nobody Fri Feb 18 09:23:20 2022 Return-Path: X-Original-To: tools-discuss@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: tools-discuss@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5DF373A120F for ; Fri, 18 Feb 2022 09:23:18 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -6.899 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-6.899 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_HI=-5, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id bUplhorQXqWk for ; Fri, 18 Feb 2022 09:23:13 -0800 (PST) Received: from gabriel-smtp.zfn.uni-bremen.de (gabriel-smtp.zfn.uni-bremen.de [IPv6:2001:638:708:32::15]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ADH-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id AC99B3A0BAD for ; Fri, 18 Feb 2022 09:23:13 -0800 (PST) Received: from client-0015.vpn.uni-bremen.de (client-0015.vpn.uni-bremen.de [134.102.107.15]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by gabriel-smtp.zfn.uni-bremen.de (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 4K0dnV1vFNzDCd4; Fri, 18 Feb 2022 18:23:10 +0100 (CET) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Mime-Version: 1.0 (Mac OS X Mail 13.4 \(3608.120.23.2.7\)) From: Carsten Bormann In-Reply-To: <6E220522-F121-4C23-B0BD-350330202748@bangj.com> Date: Fri, 18 Feb 2022 18:23:10 +0100 Cc: Jeffrey Haas , tools-discuss@ietf.org, Robert Sparks X-Mao-Original-Outgoing-Id: 666897790.025329-9bc34699a146aa7955746274b67f317a Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Message-Id: <3820F2C3-235B-4FA0-8B73-A318A053BD44@tzi.org> References: <20220218154852.GW15589@pfrc.org> <6E220522-F121-4C23-B0BD-350330202748@bangj.com> To: Tom Pusateri X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.3608.120.23.2.7) Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Tools-discuss] notes.ietf.org markdown rendering inconsistencies? X-BeenThere: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF Tools Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 18 Feb 2022 17:23:19 -0000 On 2022-02-18, at 18:04, Tom Pusateri wrote: >=20 > So given the currently know information, can you reproduce it and = explain how so I can dig into more? I have a copy of the original form of the hedgedoc notes, but it is not = easy to use the datatracker sandbox to try to recreate the complete = situation. But trying that further is certainly on my list=E2=80=A6 Gr=C3=BC=C3=9Fe, Carsten From nobody Fri Feb 18 11:19:53 2022 Return-Path: X-Original-To: tools-discuss@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: tools-discuss@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 63FF43A1352 for ; Fri, 18 Feb 2022 11:19:51 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -7.793 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-7.793 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, NICE_REPLY_A=-0.714, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_HI=-5, T_SPF_HELO_PERMERROR=0.01, T_SPF_PERMERROR=0.01, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (1024-bit key) header.d=nostrum.com Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id DAHlMGO6mtU9 for ; Fri, 18 Feb 2022 11:19:46 -0800 (PST) Received: from nostrum.com (raven-v6.nostrum.com [IPv6:2001:470:d:1130::1]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id E2D253A1350 for ; Fri, 18 Feb 2022 11:19:46 -0800 (PST) Received: from [192.168.1.114] ([47.186.48.51]) (authenticated bits=0) by nostrum.com (8.17.1/8.16.1) with ESMTPSA id 21IJJVaM002834 (version=TLSv1.3 cipher=TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 bits=256 verify=NO); Fri, 18 Feb 2022 13:19:32 -0600 (CST) (envelope-from rjsparks@nostrum.com) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=simple/simple; d=nostrum.com; s=default; t=1645211973; bh=9I/c+5/IjTSFT85XwDliVjmIowaTtqg0jyjAr4r3rXk=; h=Date:Subject:To:Cc:References:From:In-Reply-To; b=VlBRPwgy4QlF3Lt6qBwVcCvhbOTYQ2KKv2PFRtPzm1Mgvx57FJuG9d8X4paw8UNK0 1n9XkXWkBo/Hvo0MFefO3kj5Bk8yEoD4nxknwmNdjRDM60ENa9BnerXLGkG7OMOwII /o2W2JAEgWtVLYK4ayucgVgVtea54gTbW66gCzOE= X-Authentication-Warning: raven.nostrum.com: Host [47.186.48.51] claimed to be [192.168.1.114] Message-ID: Date: Fri, 18 Feb 2022 13:19:26 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Macintosh; Intel Mac OS X 10.15; rv:91.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/91.6.1 Content-Language: en-US To: Carsten Bormann , Tom Pusateri Cc: Jeffrey Haas , tools-discuss@ietf.org References: <20220218154852.GW15589@pfrc.org> <6E220522-F121-4C23-B0BD-350330202748@bangj.com> <3820F2C3-235B-4FA0-8B73-A318A053BD44@tzi.org> From: Robert Sparks In-Reply-To: <3820F2C3-235B-4FA0-8B73-A318A053BD44@tzi.org> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Tools-discuss] notes.ietf.org markdown rendering inconsistencies? X-BeenThere: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF Tools Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 18 Feb 2022 19:19:52 -0000 On 2/18/22 11:23 AM, Carsten Bormann wrote: > On 2022-02-18, at 18:04, Tom Pusateri wrote: >> So given the currently know information, can you reproduce it and explain how so I can dig into more? > I have a copy of the original form of the hedgedoc notes, but it is not easy to use the datatracker sandbox to try to recreate the complete situation. But trying that further is certainly on my list… And mine > > Grüße, Carsten > From nobody Fri Feb 18 12:41:08 2022 Return-Path: X-Original-To: tools-discuss@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: tools-discuss@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 493A23A1446 for ; Fri, 18 Feb 2022 12:41:06 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.792 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.792 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, NICE_REPLY_A=-0.714, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_BLOCKED=0.001, T_SPF_HELO_PERMERROR=0.01, T_SPF_PERMERROR=0.01, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (1024-bit key) header.d=nostrum.com Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id nUzxm2bumoYL for ; Fri, 18 Feb 2022 12:41:01 -0800 (PST) Received: from nostrum.com (raven-v6.nostrum.com [IPv6:2001:470:d:1130::1]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 3F0BB3A143F for ; Fri, 18 Feb 2022 12:41:00 -0800 (PST) Received: from [192.168.1.114] ([47.186.48.51]) (authenticated bits=0) by nostrum.com (8.17.1/8.16.1) with ESMTPSA id 21IKesf4014273 (version=TLSv1.3 cipher=TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 bits=256 verify=NO); Fri, 18 Feb 2022 14:40:56 -0600 (CST) (envelope-from rjsparks@nostrum.com) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=simple/simple; d=nostrum.com; s=default; t=1645216857; bh=gEumJG0ZQomH7LabG191wmXgr1/KB5vN+wFz64xRfZM=; h=Date:To:Cc:References:From:Subject:In-Reply-To; b=D9DkC1w+sDWYd/wkeL3yXDpbXP8Objg3S89h+FUE0VNZK+C6yowsOt0suZ55Mlbw2 gtNbYkhqAg/p1im/3yBxj9JYJA7m6iRawfn95EyACC0E7zykDhKqwdD6ZUoW/41q3d /154EHxrqshFCio0xlcpPrDpgoR1PuvDtF/5SE+c= X-Authentication-Warning: raven.nostrum.com: Host [47.186.48.51] claimed to be [192.168.1.114] Message-ID: <138307c0-f47b-2515-48a4-06c96c80c8e3@nostrum.com> Date: Fri, 18 Feb 2022 14:40:49 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Macintosh; Intel Mac OS X 10.15; rv:91.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/91.6.1 Content-Language: en-US To: Jeffrey Haas , Tom Pusateri Cc: Carsten Bormann , tools-discuss@ietf.org References: <20220214212121.GC15589@pfrc.org> <2FF63E31-4AD4-47BD-8816-43DF619864F6@pfrc.org> <48B85819-7861-42B9-A95F-A657C6CEBFE3@tzi.org> <20220215164629.GN15589@pfrc.org> <7BA363D8-F429-4D03-9D1A-D3311FBAD8A2@tzi.org> <20220218154852.GW15589@pfrc.org> From: Robert Sparks In-Reply-To: <20220218154852.GW15589@pfrc.org> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Tools-discuss] notes.ietf.org markdown rendering inconsistencies? X-BeenThere: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF Tools Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 18 Feb 2022 20:41:07 -0000 On 2/18/22 9:48 AM, Jeffrey Haas wrote: > Tom, > > [description about what tools IETF uses elided] > > On Tue, Feb 15, 2022 at 11:14:35PM -0500, Tom Pusateri wrote: >> If a compatibility problem is found, issues can be opened at the above github page. > Clearly a compatibility issue was found. > > It'd be helpful to know whether this thread has resulted in some sort of > work the tools team will pick up or whether you're saying it now falls to > the complainant to chase this all the way through the tools producers that > the team has chosen to leverage. > > Mostly so I can know whether it's worth bothering to report problems in the > future. :-) Hey Jeff - that feels a little hostile, even with the emoticon - I hope that's just email getting in the way. Yes, we're going to improve the notes->minutes pipeline. The issue you ran into is one I think we can address. What Carsten and I have been trying to convey is that the entire problem space around markdown is Hard (even the browser community hasn't come together on what its mime-type should be), and to get the really nice features of notes vs what we need for archival of minutes, there will be compromises, sometimes in frustrating places. RjS > > -- Jeff From nobody Fri Feb 18 12:47:48 2022 Return-Path: X-Original-To: tools-discuss@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: tools-discuss@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 57E2E3A114C for ; Fri, 18 Feb 2022 12:47:45 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.899 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.899 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_BLOCKED=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id BPEU1uMNhGd8 for ; Fri, 18 Feb 2022 12:47:40 -0800 (PST) Received: from slice.pfrc.org (slice.pfrc.org [67.207.130.108]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9EFF13A11AF for ; Fri, 18 Feb 2022 12:47:37 -0800 (PST) Received: from smtpclient.apple (99-59-193-67.lightspeed.livnmi.sbcglobal.net [99.59.193.67]) by slice.pfrc.org (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 646D61E341; Fri, 18 Feb 2022 15:47:36 -0500 (EST) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Mime-Version: 1.0 (Mac OS X Mail 14.0 \(3654.120.0.1.13\)) From: Jeffrey Haas In-Reply-To: <3820F2C3-235B-4FA0-8B73-A318A053BD44@tzi.org> Date: Fri, 18 Feb 2022 15:47:35 -0500 Cc: Tom Pusateri , tools-discuss@ietf.org, Robert Sparks Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Message-Id: <53227302-0FDF-4895-8766-9A298115C682@pfrc.org> References: <20220218154852.GW15589@pfrc.org> <6E220522-F121-4C23-B0BD-350330202748@bangj.com> <3820F2C3-235B-4FA0-8B73-A318A053BD44@tzi.org> To: Carsten Bormann X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.3654.120.0.1.13) Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Tools-discuss] notes.ietf.org markdown rendering inconsistencies? X-BeenThere: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF Tools Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 18 Feb 2022 20:47:46 -0000 > On Feb 18, 2022, at 12:23 PM, Carsten Bormann wrote: >=20 > On 2022-02-18, at 18:04, Tom Pusateri wrote: >>=20 >> So given the currently know information, can you reproduce it and = explain how so I can dig into more? >=20 > I have a copy of the original form of the hedgedoc notes, but it is = not easy to use the datatracker sandbox to try to recreate the complete = situation. But trying that further is certainly on my list=E2=80=A6 FWIW, the only changes I did from -00 of the notes to the currently = published -01 of the notes was take any bullet list preceded by a = descriptive sentence ending in a colon is added a newline between the = two. So, this is hopefully easy to reproduce from the published content. -- Jeff From nobody Fri Feb 18 12:48:56 2022 Return-Path: X-Original-To: tools-discuss@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: tools-discuss@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6A1DD3A1411 for ; Fri, 18 Feb 2022 12:48:54 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.793 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.793 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, NICE_REPLY_A=-0.714, T_SPF_HELO_PERMERROR=0.01, T_SPF_PERMERROR=0.01, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (1024-bit key) header.d=nostrum.com Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id gtjozzFeSDDN for ; Fri, 18 Feb 2022 12:48:49 -0800 (PST) Received: from nostrum.com (raven-v6.nostrum.com [IPv6:2001:470:d:1130::1]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id C35433A1452 for ; Fri, 18 Feb 2022 12:48:49 -0800 (PST) Received: from [192.168.1.114] ([47.186.48.51]) (authenticated bits=0) by nostrum.com (8.17.1/8.16.1) with ESMTPSA id 21IKmmt1015383 (version=TLSv1.3 cipher=TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 bits=256 verify=NO) for ; Fri, 18 Feb 2022 14:48:48 -0600 (CST) (envelope-from rjsparks@nostrum.com) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=simple/simple; d=nostrum.com; s=default; t=1645217328; bh=V/fh9x2cO77JjmrAnq+PUQgS4R6J98sOcdxEc/nRtpA=; h=Date:Subject:To:References:From:In-Reply-To; b=Ii1LXMdnliStKD/L+shvSa+icpXaYyF6RRPFDhka3f7NFBX7fuuV8nRhHzMYt41Ig VerX/9UzyHA7wfOG6nzSCrwbxGrblznktZWsdDDx8EgYW8+3yjz2kRF+K6O3l55fsh GCxUw+gOWOEBl0g0WAPqMI0coLil0lgyhKjEatgw= X-Authentication-Warning: raven.nostrum.com: Host [47.186.48.51] claimed to be [192.168.1.114] Message-ID: <182c8482-2328-4f1f-10a9-6b95e1a79e7d@nostrum.com> Date: Fri, 18 Feb 2022 14:48:42 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Macintosh; Intel Mac OS X 10.15; rv:91.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/91.6.1 Content-Language: en-US To: tools-discuss@ietf.org References: <3318CCB9-0C79-47D4-A365-10AAAFE67160@ietf.org> <18381.1645204899@localhost> From: Robert Sparks In-Reply-To: <18381.1645204899@localhost> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Tools-discuss] Zulip implementation Service Plan X-BeenThere: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF Tools Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 18 Feb 2022 20:48:55 -0000 Jay is currently working on the Zulip setup, and I think the note-well setup is in transition at the moment. Come back to this in a few days please. RjS On 2/18/22 11:21 AM, Michael Richardson wrote: > Seeing this message reminded me to try Zulip. I didn't find zulip info anywhere. > > I read the linked service-plan, and I wondered, if Zulip will authenticate > via DT, can't it assume that the DT has shown the notewell to the > participant? > > > -- > Michael Richardson . o O ( IPv6 IøT consulting ) > Sandelman Software Works Inc, Ottawa and Worldwide > > > > > > ___________________________________________________________ > Tools-discuss mailing list - Tools-discuss@ietf.org > This list is for discussion, not for action requests or bug reports. > * Report datatracker and mailarchive bugs to: datatracker-project@ietf.org > * Report tools.ietf.org bugs to: webmaster@tools.ietf.org > * Report all other bugs or issues to: ietf-action@ietf.org > List info (including how to Unsubscribe): https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/tools-discuss From nobody Fri Feb 18 13:02:14 2022 Return-Path: X-Original-To: tools-discuss@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: tools-discuss@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4DD513A0A50 for ; Fri, 18 Feb 2022 13:02:12 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.9 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.9 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id D4y6nz7iO0rr for ; Fri, 18 Feb 2022 13:02:06 -0800 (PST) Received: from slice.pfrc.org (slice.pfrc.org [67.207.130.108]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 655873A1485 for ; Fri, 18 Feb 2022 13:02:06 -0800 (PST) Received: from smtpclient.apple (99-59-193-67.lightspeed.livnmi.sbcglobal.net [99.59.193.67]) by slice.pfrc.org (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 860DC1E341; Fri, 18 Feb 2022 16:02:05 -0500 (EST) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Mime-Version: 1.0 (Mac OS X Mail 14.0 \(3654.120.0.1.13\)) From: Jeffrey Haas In-Reply-To: <138307c0-f47b-2515-48a4-06c96c80c8e3@nostrum.com> Date: Fri, 18 Feb 2022 16:02:05 -0500 Cc: Tom Pusateri , Carsten Bormann , tools-discuss@ietf.org Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Message-Id: <9DF163D2-F057-4C04-BA69-6C2D560A06C0@pfrc.org> References: <20220214212121.GC15589@pfrc.org> <2FF63E31-4AD4-47BD-8816-43DF619864F6@pfrc.org> <48B85819-7861-42B9-A95F-A657C6CEBFE3@tzi.org> <20220215164629.GN15589@pfrc.org> <7BA363D8-F429-4D03-9D1A-D3311FBAD8A2@tzi.org> <20220218154852.GW15589@pfrc.org> <138307c0-f47b-2515-48a4-06c96c80c8e3@nostrum.com> To: Robert Sparks X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.3654.120.0.1.13) Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Tools-discuss] notes.ietf.org markdown rendering inconsistencies? X-BeenThere: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF Tools Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 18 Feb 2022 21:02:13 -0000 Robert, > On Feb 18, 2022, at 3:40 PM, Robert Sparks = wrote: >=20 >=20 > On 2/18/22 9:48 AM, Jeffrey Haas wrote: >> Tom, >>=20 >> [description about what tools IETF uses elided] >>=20 >> On Tue, Feb 15, 2022 at 11:14:35PM -0500, Tom Pusateri wrote: >>> If a compatibility problem is found, issues can be opened at the = above github page. >> Clearly a compatibility issue was found. >>=20 >> It'd be helpful to know whether this thread has resulted in some sort = of >> work the tools team will pick up or whether you're saying it now = falls to >> the complainant to chase this all the way through the tools producers = that >> the team has chosen to leverage. >>=20 >> Mostly so I can know whether it's worth bothering to report problems = in the >> future. :-) >=20 > Hey Jeff - that feels a little hostile, even with the emoticon - I = hope that's just email getting in the way. I can certainly see how it can be interpreted as hostile. Please = instead consider it as "resigned to life sucking for the one reporting = the issue" after having multiple such interactions this week across = different organizations. One example included reporting a valid issue = on very large commercial software from a certain large Washington State = company in the US and knowing that I get to suffer likely without a fix = and another on a small software system built on open source stuff that = could get better but only if I'm willing to do the work myself. I know we're here in IETF on IT issues in a weird mix of community = support and a certain amount of contracted support. So, frankly, while = I don't intend to come off as pissy, I also don't have the energy to do = the fight to have done this bit of work on my own. And I seriously = wanted to know if that's what I was being told yet again this week. >=20 > Yes, we're going to improve the notes->minutes pipeline. The issue you = ran into is one I think we can address. I'm glad to hear that's the case! I'd be satisfied with "a ticket has = been filed for later work" one way or the other. >=20 > What Carsten and I have been trying to convey is that the entire = problem space around markdown is Hard (even the browser community hasn't = come together on what its mime-type should be), and to get the really = nice features of notes vs what we need for archival of minutes, there = will be compromises, sometimes in frustrating places. As discussed in the wgchairs thread, this is hardly my first trip = through human-friendly markup hell. After the initial exchange I was = readily able to rectify my problem, so the key thing was addressed. The = remainder was my end of community service in making sure the discrepancy = was noted so that the next party wasn't similarly impacted. You all are doing the IETF community good service by doing this stuff. = I owe you all a libation of choice when we get the opportunity to meet = in person next. But forgive me if I'm a bit soul weary from other = similar interactions with much less happy outcomes this week. -- Jeff From nobody Fri Feb 18 13:18:23 2022 Return-Path: X-Original-To: tools-discuss@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: tools-discuss@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id D7EE63A1291 for ; Fri, 18 Feb 2022 13:18:21 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.793 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.793 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, NICE_REPLY_A=-0.714, T_SPF_HELO_PERMERROR=0.01, T_SPF_PERMERROR=0.01, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (1024-bit key) header.d=nostrum.com Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 2MtyXekARXeT for ; Fri, 18 Feb 2022 13:18:17 -0800 (PST) Received: from nostrum.com (raven-v6.nostrum.com [IPv6:2001:470:d:1130::1]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id DA8743A14C5 for ; Fri, 18 Feb 2022 13:17:27 -0800 (PST) Received: from [192.168.1.114] ([47.186.48.51]) (authenticated bits=0) by nostrum.com (8.17.1/8.16.1) with ESMTPSA id 21ILHOrm019204 (version=TLSv1.3 cipher=TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 bits=256 verify=NO); Fri, 18 Feb 2022 15:17:25 -0600 (CST) (envelope-from rjsparks@nostrum.com) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=simple/simple; d=nostrum.com; s=default; t=1645219045; bh=YyvVX4G+xEnvrcrKG40XUV/e8NzPaXJFfyNx3DfCFLo=; h=Date:To:Cc:References:From:Subject:In-Reply-To; b=kMDjlq8k0RfljOpRkYEfOzJsJeeE5TXzS363T6bRz/PNDOVyuTAwKHtRDi3/isGu7 UPzJqn83yuDAAOBc2Cnp+oJ88NEl2Ntwgs0uBOsDYjKgfkk6DEvE7uGbq8xYrJsW1a 875Eju9gJy215ZA6CyTGL5l/WGmXBR0JEWQ/cucc= X-Authentication-Warning: raven.nostrum.com: Host [47.186.48.51] claimed to be [192.168.1.114] Message-ID: <41c2a666-dec2-54e6-a888-ebfb2ddf6336@nostrum.com> Date: Fri, 18 Feb 2022 15:17:19 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Macintosh; Intel Mac OS X 10.15; rv:91.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/91.6.1 Content-Language: en-US To: Jeffrey Haas Cc: Carsten Bormann , tools-discuss@ietf.org References: <20220214212121.GC15589@pfrc.org> <2FF63E31-4AD4-47BD-8816-43DF619864F6@pfrc.org> <48B85819-7861-42B9-A95F-A657C6CEBFE3@tzi.org> <20220215164629.GN15589@pfrc.org> <7BA363D8-F429-4D03-9D1A-D3311FBAD8A2@tzi.org> <20220218154852.GW15589@pfrc.org> <138307c0-f47b-2515-48a4-06c96c80c8e3@nostrum.com> <9DF163D2-F057-4C04-BA69-6C2D560A06C0@pfrc.org> From: Robert Sparks In-Reply-To: <9DF163D2-F057-4C04-BA69-6C2D560A06C0@pfrc.org> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Tools-discuss] notes.ietf.org markdown rendering inconsistencies? X-BeenThere: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF Tools Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 18 Feb 2022 21:18:23 -0000 Trimming - On 2/18/22 3:02 PM, Jeffrey Haas wrote: > > I'm glad to hear that's the case! I'd be satisfied with "a ticket has been filed for later work" one way or the other. The equivalent is happening, but I think there are several things we're going to touch and I'm still discovering places to touch. I'll send a pointer to how it will be tracked when that's concrete (I considered a placeholder in trac, but I think it would get obviated with other places to track very quickly.) > > > > You all are doing the IETF community good service by doing this stuff. I owe you all a libation of choice when we get the opportunity to meet in person next. I really look forward to that. > But forgive me if I'm a bit soul weary from other similar interactions with much less happy outcomes this week. Yes, I definitely understand that pain. > > -- Jeff > > ___________________________________________________________ > Tools-discuss mailing list - Tools-discuss@ietf.org > This list is for discussion, not for action requests or bug reports. > * Report datatracker and mailarchive bugs to: datatracker-project@ietf.org > * Report tools.ietf.org bugs to: webmaster@tools.ietf.org > * Report all other bugs or issues to: ietf-action@ietf.org > List info (including how to Unsubscribe): https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/tools-discuss From nobody Fri Feb 18 13:22:52 2022 Return-Path: X-Original-To: tools-discuss@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: tools-discuss@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1F7F53A14BB for ; Fri, 18 Feb 2022 13:22:50 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.078 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.078 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_BLOCKED=0.001, T_SPF_HELO_PERMERROR=0.01, T_SPF_PERMERROR=0.01, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (1024-bit key) header.d=nostrum.com Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id DPifATfqpDqc for ; Fri, 18 Feb 2022 13:22:45 -0800 (PST) Received: from nostrum.com (raven-v6.nostrum.com [IPv6:2001:470:d:1130::1]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 9C43C3A1432 for ; Fri, 18 Feb 2022 13:22:23 -0800 (PST) Received: from [192.168.1.114] ([47.186.48.51]) (authenticated bits=0) by nostrum.com (8.17.1/8.16.1) with ESMTPSA id 21ILMLMa019868 (version=TLSv1.3 cipher=TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 bits=256 verify=NO) for ; Fri, 18 Feb 2022 15:22:22 -0600 (CST) (envelope-from rjsparks@nostrum.com) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=simple/simple; d=nostrum.com; s=default; t=1645219342; bh=9VUUnhH9aOupfzdhztp3HIP8yejbzH34OxycMkdwlAg=; h=Date:To:From:Subject; b=GRh6ouiybf20UZ7HNiZgih1kqJfV63sp8WAmETK82GD/dSp0pZNLhwVz+LE1DQP3F uUOafdnkWI2+GI2P3RofiHqrnL44k68LnVdQpm89AIE1vK0xlTvLvOTDqlcfh3Oh4h 1tzEAl8xvXpzDgrDvlph0s/rV8gl+jWLO7q+v3cA= X-Authentication-Warning: raven.nostrum.com: Host [47.186.48.51] claimed to be [192.168.1.114] Message-ID: <47ae63f5-bb6c-f65a-0399-3f3096c55325@nostrum.com> Date: Fri, 18 Feb 2022 15:22:16 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Macintosh; Intel Mac OS X 10.15; rv:91.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/91.6.1 Content-Language: en-US To: tools-discuss From: Robert Sparks Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Archived-At: Subject: [Tools-discuss] Pyquery issue on Monterey/m1 max/macports X-BeenThere: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF Tools Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 18 Feb 2022 21:22:50 -0000 If anyone has the cycles to play with it, I'm a bit stumped with pyquery's behavior on my m1 mac. I have some evidence that it's probably macports specific. I've put a simple reproducer here: https://github.com/rjsparks/test_pyquery. The readme shows what happens where it goes wrong. I've nudged macports at their IRC channel, and pyquery at https://github.com/gawel/pyquery/issues/230. Any help would be appreciated. RjS From nobody Fri Feb 18 13:30:38 2022 Return-Path: X-Original-To: tools-discuss@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: tools-discuss@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 524663A1236; Fri, 18 Feb 2022 13:30:07 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -6.679 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-6.679 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_INVALID=0.1, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_HI=-5, T_SPF_HELO_PERMERROR=0.01, T_SPF_PERMERROR=0.01, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=fail (1024-bit key) reason="fail (message has been altered)" header.d=nostrum.com Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id qDzUAtnvi1Vt; Fri, 18 Feb 2022 13:30:01 -0800 (PST) Received: from nostrum.com (raven-v6.nostrum.com [IPv6:2001:470:d:1130::1]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 96F643A14C2; Fri, 18 Feb 2022 13:30:01 -0800 (PST) Received: from [192.168.1.114] ([47.186.48.51]) (authenticated bits=0) by nostrum.com (8.17.1/8.16.1) with ESMTPSA id 21ILTx5A020772 (version=TLSv1.3 cipher=TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 bits=256 verify=NO); Fri, 18 Feb 2022 15:30:00 -0600 (CST) (envelope-from rjsparks@nostrum.com) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=simple/simple; d=nostrum.com; s=default; t=1645219800; bh=8UkwA+XZ7nYhuvUjqVyv7oHcZKuRnqqK75cFqvtaQ0A=; h=Date:To:From:Subject; b=grEGPIdI9LrHHp0caZe5oJIfWeko76uMLBBth9wTEunMaEqS6j8ioeRLoD0KbbRrk Fu0S/FqE+3EwzASgl3t47ESmpjFRVxdgfEiPFTOTjtZ4Vx78w6AA2T8/ki0YvG7xg+ rvnrPCZSQGOJ8pisrJLeuhvc17/yqjbxt0ZGHaCE= X-Authentication-Warning: raven.nostrum.com: Host [47.186.48.51] claimed to be [192.168.1.114] Message-ID: Date: Fri, 18 Feb 2022 15:29:54 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Macintosh; Intel Mac OS X 10.15; rv:91.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/91.6.1 Content-Language: en-US To: IETF Codesprints , tools-discuss From: Robert Sparks Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Archived-At: Subject: [Tools-discuss] Codesprint at IETF 113 X-BeenThere: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF Tools Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 18 Feb 2022 21:30:08 -0000 We will hold a hybrid-meeting codesprint at IETF 113. We'll coordinate the codesprint using https://notes.ietf.org/notes-ietf-113-tools. If you plan to participate, please add yourself to the list on that page. Our plan is dynamic. We expect to transition the datatracker to github well before the sprint, and the sprint's plan will evolve as that transition completes. RjS From nobody Sun Feb 20 15:18:49 2022 Return-Path: X-Original-To: tools-discuss@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: tools-discuss@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 085983A0C0E for ; Sun, 20 Feb 2022 15:18:47 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -6.899 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-6.899 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_HI=-5, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 0ovJjomVAWAk for ; Sun, 20 Feb 2022 15:18:42 -0800 (PST) Received: from ietfx.ietf.org (ietfx.amsl.com [4.31.198.45]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ADH-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 37EAE3A00DF for ; Sun, 20 Feb 2022 15:18:42 -0800 (PST) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfx.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2200E404BFA1; Sun, 20 Feb 2022 15:18:42 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com Received: from ietfx.ietf.org ([4.31.198.45]) by localhost (ietfx.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id zXjKU-uTLlLa; Sun, 20 Feb 2022 15:18:42 -0800 (PST) Received: from smtpclient.apple (unknown [158.140.230.105]) by ietfx.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 6B9AD404BFA0; Sun, 20 Feb 2022 15:18:41 -0800 (PST) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Mime-Version: 1.0 (Mac OS X Mail 15.0 \(3693.40.0.1.81\)) From: Jay Daley In-Reply-To: <182c8482-2328-4f1f-10a9-6b95e1a79e7d@nostrum.com> Date: Mon, 21 Feb 2022 12:18:37 +1300 Cc: tools-discuss , Robert Sparks Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Message-Id: <272F3199-62AD-4B12-8AB2-1FA00219CC83@ietf.org> References: <3318CCB9-0C79-47D4-A365-10AAAFE67160@ietf.org> <18381.1645204899@localhost> <182c8482-2328-4f1f-10a9-6b95e1a79e7d@nostrum.com> To: mcr+ietf@sandelman.ca X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.3693.40.0.1.81) Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Tools-discuss] Zulip implementation Service Plan X-BeenThere: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF Tools Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sun, 20 Feb 2022 23:18:48 -0000 > On 19/02/2022, at 9:48 AM, Robert Sparks wrote: >=20 > Jay is currently working on the Zulip setup, and I think the note-well = setup is in transition at the moment. Come back to this in a few days = please. The Zulip service now has a default stream #NOTEWELL with two topics and = one message per topic: - A reminder of IETF policies. This is the Note Well text - Terms of Service. Link to = https://github.com/ietf-tools/zulip-implementation/blob/main/Service-Plan.= md, where to propose changes and who to contact for stream requests. The next step is for the Secretariat to set up their internal processes = for responding to stream requests and then we should be good to go. =E2=80=94=20 One other thing. There are few Zulip settings that we haven=E2=80=99t = discussed and feedback is welcome: 1. Permission to change name and email. Both of these are turned off = as the expectation is that Datatracker will be the source for both of = those. 2. Show preview of uploaded and linked images. Currently on. 3. Show preview of linked websites. Currently off. 4. Who can access user email addresses. Currently everyone. Jay >=20 > RjS >=20 > On 2/18/22 11:21 AM, Michael Richardson wrote: >> Seeing this message reminded me to try Zulip. I didn't find zulip = info anywhere. >>=20 >> I read the linked service-plan, and I wondered, if Zulip will = authenticate >> via DT, can't it assume that the DT has shown the notewell to the >> participant? >>=20 >>=20 >> -- >> Michael Richardson . o O ( IPv6 I=C3=B8T = consulting ) >> Sandelman Software Works Inc, Ottawa and Worldwide >>=20 >>=20 >>=20 >>=20 >>=20 >> ___________________________________________________________ >> Tools-discuss mailing list - Tools-discuss@ietf.org >> This list is for discussion, not for action requests or bug reports. >> * Report datatracker and mailarchive bugs to: = datatracker-project@ietf.org >> * Report tools.ietf.org bugs to: webmaster@tools.ietf.org >> * Report all other bugs or issues to: ietf-action@ietf.org >> List info (including how to Unsubscribe): = https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/tools-discuss >=20 > ___________________________________________________________ > Tools-discuss mailing list - Tools-discuss@ietf.org > This list is for discussion, not for action requests or bug reports. > * Report datatracker and mailarchive bugs to: = datatracker-project@ietf.org > * Report tools.ietf.org bugs to: webmaster@tools.ietf.org > * Report all other bugs or issues to: ietf-action@ietf.org > List info (including how to Unsubscribe): = https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/tools-discuss --=20 Jay Daley IETF Executive Director exec-director@ietf.org From nobody Mon Feb 21 07:02:22 2022 Return-Path: X-Original-To: tools-discuss@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: tools-discuss@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1FCC53A113E; 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Mon, 21 Feb 2022 13:17:37 -0500 (EST) From: Michael Richardson To: "Salz\, Rich" , Jay Daley , "April\, Tim" , tools-discuss , Robert Sparks In-Reply-To: <17976827-2A15-4622-9595-ABDD6326E28F@akamai.com> References: <3318CCB9-0C79-47D4-A365-10AAAFE67160@ietf.org> <18381.1645204899@localhost> <182c8482-2328-4f1f-10a9-6b95e1a79e7d@nostrum.com> <272F3199-62AD-4B12-8AB2-1FA00219CC83@ietf.org> <17976827-2A15-4622-9595-ABDD6326E28F@akamai.com> X-Mailer: MH-E 8.6+git; nmh 1.7+dev; GNU Emacs 26.1 X-Face: $\n1pF)h^`}$H>Hk{L"x@)JS7<%Az}5RyS@k9X%29-lHB$Ti.V>2bi.~ehC0; <'$9xN5Ub# z!G,p`nR&p7Fz@^UXIn156S8.~^@MJ*mMsD7=QFeq%AL4m Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Tools-discuss] Zulip implementation Service Plan X-BeenThere: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF Tools Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 21 Feb 2022 18:18:07 -0000 --=-=-= Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Salz, Rich wrote: >> 1. Permission to change name and email. Both of these are turn= ed >> off as the expectation is that Datatracker will be the source for bo= th >> of those. > That makes sense. What happens if I connect via meetecho and/or jabber and/or Zulip. Will I wind up with a name clash? =2D- Michael Richardson . o O ( IPv6 I=C3=B8T consulti= ng ) Sandelman Software Works Inc, Ottawa and Worldwide --=-=-= Content-Type: application/pgp-signature; name="signature.asc" -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- iPMEAQEKAB0WIQSk7ZHEG9TCGBNASfm/sjw/rPYc8wUCYhPXQQAKCRC/sjw/rPYc 84Z+Bf9kFgIi0+hpLJl9kbKPA5AIrkxYW55V105Avb3XN/7paCNHsnFfC3PNhGRJ ki1GoCduN2uSl3yZtkJp1fNQvBc3v0G9YQ3UotdgodSqj0qDuIVPu93W0TwmCkvS 2HxnYyXymNIVO8lCYvp5gbFfDsqxSWcIEMmentUTbmoE+MT1ieQzhvCVir8/rOiS sKQqoiKL98ImZB4zPudIrmcrbtCE7LWFCuUyAuCSKIX4ekppF+tz0a7cr8zKJYAB qbW3ENA= =KWux -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --=-=-=-- From nobody Mon Feb 21 13:20:56 2022 Return-Path: X-Original-To: tools-discuss@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: tools-discuss@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9F3BE3A07F3 for ; Mon, 21 Feb 2022 13:20:53 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.898 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.898 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_BLOCKED=0.001, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id v7Iz1B3RJ78Z for ; Mon, 21 Feb 2022 13:20:49 -0800 (PST) Received: from ietfx.ietf.org (ietfx.amsl.com [4.31.198.45]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ADH-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 703B23A07E3 for ; Mon, 21 Feb 2022 13:20:49 -0800 (PST) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfx.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4E61B4092790; Mon, 21 Feb 2022 13:20:49 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com Received: from ietfx.ietf.org ([4.31.198.45]) by localhost (ietfx.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id HxPxSDlvU-Jd; Mon, 21 Feb 2022 13:20:49 -0800 (PST) Received: from smtpclient.apple (unknown [158.140.230.105]) by ietfx.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 4283E404BFB3; Mon, 21 Feb 2022 13:20:48 -0800 (PST) Content-Type: multipart/signed; boundary="Apple-Mail=_7DFECA02-1938-4BC3-B46D-C8A5B8AA5D0D"; protocol="application/pgp-signature"; micalg=pgp-sha256 Mime-Version: 1.0 (Mac OS X Mail 15.0 \(3693.40.0.1.81\)) From: Jay Daley In-Reply-To: <18098.1645467457@localhost> Date: Tue, 22 Feb 2022 10:20:47 +1300 Cc: "Salz, Rich" , "April, Tim" , tools-discuss , Robert Sparks Message-Id: <5D8B61BA-9BC5-46F4-BD79-058347162C98@ietf.org> References: <3318CCB9-0C79-47D4-A365-10AAAFE67160@ietf.org> <18381.1645204899@localhost> <182c8482-2328-4f1f-10a9-6b95e1a79e7d@nostrum.com> <272F3199-62AD-4B12-8AB2-1FA00219CC83@ietf.org> <17976827-2A15-4622-9595-ABDD6326E28F@akamai.com> <18098.1645467457@localhost> To: Michael Richardson X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.3693.40.0.1.81) Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Tools-discuss] Zulip implementation Service Plan X-BeenThere: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF Tools Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 21 Feb 2022 21:20:54 -0000 --Apple-Mail=_7DFECA02-1938-4BC3-B46D-C8A5B8AA5D0D Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 > On 22/02/2022, at 7:17 AM, Michael Richardson = wrote: >=20 >=20 > Salz, Rich wrote: >>> 1. Permission to change name and email. Both of these are = turned >>> off as the expectation is that Datatracker will be the source for = both >>> of those. >=20 >> That makes sense. >=20 > What happens if I connect via meetecho and/or jabber and/or Zulip. > Will I wind up with a name clash? We will need to test that. Jay >=20 > -- > Michael Richardson . o O ( IPv6 I=C3=B8T = consulting ) > Sandelman Software Works Inc, Ottawa and Worldwide >=20 >=20 >=20 >=20 -- Jay Daley IETF Executive Director exec-director@ietf.org --Apple-Mail=_7DFECA02-1938-4BC3-B46D-C8A5B8AA5D0D Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: attachment; filename=signature.asc Content-Type: application/pgp-signature; name=signature.asc Content-Description: Message signed with OpenPGP -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- iQIzBAEBCAAdFiEEteUdwVZRcQwi2bcWICxpEHTRWFMFAmIUAi8ACgkQICxpEHTR WFOXABAAlo2PbMwCMGJ9QppvOZsOoiUxTh7ai8SZlqzeZL9E+CA7XkIFSvyNqIu0 owrpnMA2USZewDVnz+b3Z2iM9/LvSQbj40JqXnRmb2AOmSCbo/jYt0mjkj16iSrD c0v0TAaaog1yr9KzPA7ol38Ls9ZfCiyDLBFTeNxZRycyfGWVO4Ojio7jbb/ljFwz VfoqtN05k3lJqUoxu5NA+OSqbJwEFA+k1QiNZr8VXKutv5aG/ECgoy5AWEkUZd6B xJwIydOUHQrZFjDKM3U1ZtD6MGXq398rXK7HJCca3z5jJTDGlFU8KUMTbJ6Xo185 ltIzCLCSPjcaJVmvtIjjyxKpVLHhHgCqa/H53OSP80kD5E/wJjwZOaVsfU1KeqnG EZUGvX4bEGscutE9NakvnMTbi0NMk6AZ2RZ3aClT7eX+kHaBY+mZwWp1xejvROVw PtaDoRWDpUmWRL6W5cjN43oZes6u36y+J3riZzhFbzvFPzJnS5V4lYpsHw/2r4On +bMfYn0LNjHJ1OwRu2CRCha/CkzTqbkZ1OwGqJP+G59dGG8yU9Me+zJrOljAksqq iF+NssND5ZcZTL6zyjl6++yf7p2mHRnlofBg/GegGLAY+/1VQnXJvWfvSKuAu17O ZG+YlmzsbC4kO63nD7AwSE9O7sC8W59sndwKCf5CIEcLoCBlfik= =U83/ -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --Apple-Mail=_7DFECA02-1938-4BC3-B46D-C8A5B8AA5D0D-- From nobody Tue Feb 22 05:02:43 2022 Return-Path: X-Original-To: tools-discuss@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: tools-discuss@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 845E13A0FE6; Tue, 22 Feb 2022 05:02:40 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -7.673 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-7.673 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIMWL_WL_HIGH=-0.576, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_HI=-5, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_NONE=0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=akamai.com Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id YGG9_6BzOJXE; Tue, 22 Feb 2022 05:02:36 -0800 (PST) Received: from mx0a-00190b01.pphosted.com (mx0a-00190b01.pphosted.com [IPv6:2620:100:9001:583::1]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 16AF03A07A0; Tue, 22 Feb 2022 05:02:32 -0800 (PST) Received: from pps.filterd (m0050093.ppops.net [127.0.0.1]) by m0050093.ppops.net-00190b01. 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Tue, 22 Feb 2022 07:02:28 -0600 From: "Salz, Rich" To: Michael Richardson , Jay Daley , "April, Tim" , tools-discuss , Robert Sparks Thread-Topic: [Tools-discuss] Zulip implementation Service Plan Thread-Index: AQHYJFbm3YgF1ZVNdkuMADZYrWkjLqyZ8+GAgAA52gCAA06MgIAAs8wAgACKcICAAOZzAA== Date: Tue, 22 Feb 2022 13:02:27 +0000 Message-ID: <5E076D6B-08BE-4695-9A73-DE8E2EA7E804@akamai.com> References: <3318CCB9-0C79-47D4-A365-10AAAFE67160@ietf.org> <18381.1645204899@localhost> <182c8482-2328-4f1f-10a9-6b95e1a79e7d@nostrum.com> <272F3199-62AD-4B12-8AB2-1FA00219CC83@ietf.org> <17976827-2A15-4622-9595-ABDD6326E28F@akamai.com> <18098.1645467457@localhost> In-Reply-To: <18098.1645467457@localhost> Accept-Language: en-US Content-Language: en-US X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: user-agent: Microsoft-MacOutlook/16.58.22021501 x-ms-exchange-messagesentrepresentingtype: 1 x-ms-exchange-transport-fromentityheader: Hosted x-originating-ip: [172.27.118.139] Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-ID: Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Proofpoint-Virus-Version: vendor=fsecure engine=2.50.10434:6.0.425, 18.0.816 definitions=2022-02-22_02:2022-02-21, 2022-02-22 signatures=0 X-Proofpoint-Spam-Details: rule=notspam policy=default score=0 adultscore=0 bulkscore=0 malwarescore=0 suspectscore=0 spamscore=0 mlxscore=0 mlxlogscore=651 phishscore=0 classifier=spam adjust=0 reason=mlx scancount=1 engine=8.12.0-2201110000 definitions=main-2202220076 X-Proofpoint-ORIG-GUID: 4Ap0jeMifGUmBtVBic4588yjsf1HRnZp X-Proofpoint-GUID: 4Ap0jeMifGUmBtVBic4588yjsf1HRnZp X-Proofpoint-Virus-Version: vendor=baseguard engine=ICAP:2.0.205,Aquarius:18.0.816,Hydra:6.0.425,FMLib:17.11.62.513 definitions=2022-02-22_02,2022-02-21_02,2021-12-02_01 X-Proofpoint-Spam-Details: rule=notspam policy=default score=0 impostorscore=0 priorityscore=1501 mlxlogscore=635 clxscore=1015 mlxscore=0 lowpriorityscore=0 suspectscore=0 malwarescore=0 spamscore=0 phishscore=0 adultscore=0 bulkscore=0 classifier=spam adjust=0 reason=mlx scancount=1 engine=8.12.0-2201110000 definitions=main-2202220077 Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Tools-discuss] Zulip implementation Service Plan X-BeenThere: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF Tools Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 22 Feb 2022 13:02:41 -0000 PiAgICBXaGF0IGhhcHBlbnMgaWYgSSBjb25uZWN0IHZpYSBtZWV0ZWNobyBhbmQvb3IgamFiYmVy IGFuZC9vciBadWxpcC4NCiAgICBXaWxsIEkgd2luZCB1cCB3aXRoIGEgbmFtZSBjbGFzaD8NCg0K QXMgIG1lZXRlY2hvIGFuZCB6dWxpcCBib3RoIHVzZSB0aGUgZGF0YXRyYWNrZXIsIGl0IHNob3Vs ZCBiZSB0aGUgc2FtZS4gIEFzIGphYmJlciBkb2Vzbid0LCBpdCBzaG91bGQgYmUgdGhlIHNhbWUg YXMgaXQgaXMgbm93Lg0KDQo= From nobody Tue Feb 22 07:56:17 2022 Return-Path: X-Original-To: tools-discuss@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: tools-discuss@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 284173A0E70; 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Tue, 22 Feb 2022 11:04:13 -0500 (EST) Received: from tuna.sandelman.ca ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id Pv0TVTsT_Mfd; Tue, 22 Feb 2022 11:04:12 -0500 (EST) Received: from sandelman.ca (obiwan.sandelman.ca [209.87.249.21]) by tuna.sandelman.ca (Postfix) with ESMTP id C7BE638DC1; Tue, 22 Feb 2022 11:04:12 -0500 (EST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/simple; d=sandelman.ca; s=mail; t=1645545852; bh=glm6IaSRwNtnwot8wUEKnpDVuwqPzgbhFPjXlKkj7u0=; h=From:To:Subject:Date:From; b=UvoPbGCVT8ZF3ZEgSahyaXGDWpDF88WqjEixHIlSWg2zfe6JQgbUE0Ue8fZjakGrk 15YQkZIQtQhWQJsaRef7VIPBEl4iI4GMb4TIuFaXXBqPE3ClJMwANgQ4X6+lHdcXmX 0DV3CXbCtKOmQoHgjrj4lNc/8OGv/0K6OEnVpd1K79bUY6nHPkFuzzpWvm9CIBIJva wlbCvs7jOdDrWNBoa8NkrcTnznWZbPdGXk2UED40xqwQf5kIALe0ejr6L/A1YJSfZ4 vmaNnZ4kuHi0GJfdaki1lC4rORTQzVjs+TNBH6HUMQoUdgvQWThcFlYyewIG1Ga5+C /3dd1GerRvIqA== Received: from localhost (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by sandelman.ca (Postfix) with ESMTP id 63C96442; Tue, 22 Feb 2022 10:55:42 -0500 (EST) From: Michael Richardson To: wgchairs@ietf.org, tools-discuss@ietf.org X-Attribution: mcr X-Mailer: MH-E 8.6+git; nmh 1.7+dev; GNU Emacs 26.1 X-Face: $\n1pF)h^`}$H>Hk{L"x@)JS7<%Az}5RyS@k9X%29-lHB$Ti.V>2bi.~ehC0; <'$9xN5Ub# z!G,p`nR&p7Fz@^UXIn156S8.~^@MJ*mMsD7=QFeq%AL4m Archived-At: Subject: [Tools-discuss] who is attending my WG session X-BeenThere: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF Tools Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 22 Feb 2022 15:55:51 -0000 --=-=-= Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Many WG lists and some area lists are now featuring threads about who is attending in person, remotely, etc. post-mailman3 switch, I wonder if the ML membership could be reflected into the DT, but even before that, it would be nice if people could RSVP to the meetings. Maybe as many as four states: * Not attending * Attending in person * Attending remotely * (Conflicted) will review recording =2D- Michael Richardson . o O ( IPv6 I=C3=B8T consulti= ng ) Sandelman Software Works Inc, Ottawa and Worldwide --=-=-= Content-Type: application/pgp-signature; name="signature.asc" -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- iPMEAQEKAB0WIQSk7ZHEG9TCGBNASfm/sjw/rPYc8wUCYhUHfQAKCRC/sjw/rPYc 860iBf4+PasN+hcE/TrMuLDCJlJtPFjWkYZVIVmt+OgpOowikMFk7hNHC9P89o/D yObsa/PqI1ASqdszYc0cH5Gm8IBleftb9OjbDKIFb+I3ziwYbR4xGbVK8iYpMDbi Un0ZidRR5Foqfiu85LpbUg4IFV0p02LhF+wuRmREL9mBP6Jip0RS+w7XEol4sm/Z xBwYGsAP1PRn+kaFx7slki2vNQ3RKeD5j8rplM15hRZzgtMVN9RuAmE91BeHAmww gA2eI9I= =IBJD -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --=-=-=-- From nobody Tue Feb 22 08:14:41 2022 Return-Path: X-Original-To: tools-discuss@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: tools-discuss@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7DBCB3A0BE1; Tue, 22 Feb 2022 08:14:38 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.899 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.899 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id BuYdNONZOdVO; Tue, 22 Feb 2022 08:14:33 -0800 (PST) Received: from gabriel-smtp.zfn.uni-bremen.de (gabriel-smtp.zfn.uni-bremen.de [IPv6:2001:638:708:32::15]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ADH-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 0156A3A0BD9; Tue, 22 Feb 2022 08:14:32 -0800 (PST) Received: from [192.168.217.118] (p5089ad4f.dip0.t-ipconnect.de [80.137.173.79]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by gabriel-smtp.zfn.uni-bremen.de (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 4K344P2YVHzDCfb; Tue, 22 Feb 2022 17:14:29 +0100 (CET) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Mime-Version: 1.0 (Mac OS X Mail 13.4 \(3608.120.23.2.7\)) From: Carsten Bormann In-Reply-To: <16818.1645545342@localhost> Date: Tue, 22 Feb 2022 17:14:29 +0100 Cc: IETF WG Chairs , tools-discuss@ietf.org X-Mao-Original-Outgoing-Id: 667239268.897716-18fc6e367c39cba76fa401d95d3ffd1d Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Message-Id: References: <16818.1645545342@localhost> To: Michael Richardson X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.3608.120.23.2.7) Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Tools-discuss] [irsg] who is attending my WG session X-BeenThere: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF Tools Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 22 Feb 2022 16:14:39 -0000 On 2022-02-22, at 16:55, Michael Richardson = wrote: >=20 > it would be nice if people could RSVP to the > meetings. Maybe as many as four states: > * Not attending > * Attending in person > * Attending remotely > * (Conflicted) will review recording +100. A possible side effect could be that people would be encouraged to make = up their minds about a conflict earlier, so they turn up more prepared = for the meeting they actually do go to. 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On 22.02.22 17:14, Carsten Bormann wrote: > On 2022-02-22, at 16:55, Michael Richardson wrote: >> >> it would be nice if people could RSVP to the >> meetings. Maybe as many as four states: >> * Not attending >> * Attending in person >> * Attending remotely >> * (Conflicted) will review recording > > +100. > > A possible side effect could be that people would be encouraged to make up their minds about a conflict earlier, so they turn up more prepared for the meeting they actually do go to. > > Grüße, Carsten > > ___________________________________________________________ > Tools-discuss mailing list - Tools-discuss@ietf.org > This list is for discussion, not for action requests or bug reports. > * Report datatracker and mailarchive bugs to: datatracker-project@ietf.org > * Report tools.ietf.org bugs to: webmaster@tools.ietf.org > * Report all other bugs or issues to: ietf-action@ietf.org > List info (including how to Unsubscribe): https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/tools-discuss From nobody Tue Feb 22 10:11:19 2022 Return-Path: X-Original-To: tools-discuss@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: tools-discuss@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 08D213A1191 for ; Tue, 22 Feb 2022 10:11:16 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.793 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.793 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, NICE_REPLY_A=-0.714, T_SPF_HELO_PERMERROR=0.01, T_SPF_PERMERROR=0.01, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (1024-bit key) header.d=nostrum.com Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id YqtYvjrmwj2u for ; Tue, 22 Feb 2022 10:11:09 -0800 (PST) Received: from nostrum.com (raven-v6.nostrum.com [IPv6:2001:470:d:1130::1]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 90CDC3A11A3 for ; Tue, 22 Feb 2022 10:11:09 -0800 (PST) Received: from [192.168.1.114] ([47.186.48.51]) (authenticated bits=0) by nostrum.com (8.17.1/8.16.1) with ESMTPSA id 21MIB7KD007914 (version=TLSv1.3 cipher=TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 bits=256 verify=NO) for ; Tue, 22 Feb 2022 12:11:07 -0600 (CST) (envelope-from rjsparks@nostrum.com) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=simple/simple; d=nostrum.com; s=default; t=1645553467; bh=Ycsxt/TYxKWVWyO4fNta6XiWRouzBE3gfVhQmChK8Os=; h=Date:Subject:From:To:References:In-Reply-To; b=iMvi1m6vwTjSpgPUSq2ebpx0wXoYTLpwP4OTmPMSeET7cm+tufcdH+ucRvOvnl0Rg jLVKxLIJVGGEvWj2KFNOjgk1PZwHgvBCbtQKsM6tyfu9oA3f4Kukzyq2oPcjqorsKg T2vAtvE6hW5Ma31fx8tWUOBPcsD/tQOwNtqIqEKk= X-Authentication-Warning: raven.nostrum.com: Host [47.186.48.51] claimed to be [192.168.1.114] Message-ID: <139122d6-2e40-5da4-9927-8ae8bcec39d3@nostrum.com> Date: Tue, 22 Feb 2022 12:11:05 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Macintosh; Intel Mac OS X 10.15; rv:91.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/91.6.1 Content-Language: en-US From: Robert Sparks To: tools-discuss References: <0d096ae4-095b-096d-bd96-0e884023e949@nostrum.com> In-Reply-To: <0d096ae4-095b-096d-bd96-0e884023e949@nostrum.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Tools-discuss] Tools team meeting to coordinate future workshops X-BeenThere: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF Tools Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 22 Feb 2022 18:11:16 -0000 This meeting will be Thursday 3Mar at 2000 UTC. See https://datatracker.ietf.org/meeting/interim-2022-tools-03/session/tools for coordinates and ics. RjS On 2/17/22 10:52 AM, Robert Sparks wrote: > All - > > The tools team will be meeting soon to prioritize, refine, and start > scheduling the next set of workshops. > > Anyone can attend. The doodle for the session is at > https://doodle.com/poll/39ygusrk9wmdcx97. I plan to chose the date > early next week. > > We will be working with what's at > https://github.com/ietf-tools/tools-workshops. > > Proposals for other workshops, refinements to the suggested workshops, > and other comments are welcome. PRs are encouraged. > > RjS > From nobody Tue Feb 22 12:13:08 2022 Return-Path: X-Original-To: tools-discuss@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: tools-discuss@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9C92E3A0C41; Tue, 22 Feb 2022 12:12:57 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.098 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.098 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_BLOCKED=0.001, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=sandelman.ca Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id IX1f6rcBowox; Tue, 22 Feb 2022 12:12:52 -0800 (PST) Received: from tuna.sandelman.ca (tuna.sandelman.ca [IPv6:2607:f0b0:f:3:216:3eff:fe7c:d1f3]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ADH-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 334C43A0688; Tue, 22 Feb 2022 12:12:51 -0800 (PST) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by tuna.sandelman.ca (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5679838E4A; Tue, 22 Feb 2022 15:21:20 -0500 (EST) Received: from tuna.sandelman.ca ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 7R7Mh9hh-7QH; Tue, 22 Feb 2022 15:21:19 -0500 (EST) Received: from [127.0.0.1] (unknown [142.169.78.123]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_128_GCM_SHA256 (128/128 bits) key-exchange X25519 server-signature RSA-PSS (2048 bits) server-digest SHA256) (No client certificate requested) by tuna.sandelman.ca (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 96EEE38E49; Tue, 22 Feb 2022 15:21:18 -0500 (EST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/simple; d=sandelman.ca; s=mail; t=1645561278; bh=+UYz+cMB3uq5UKAzRi8PhxDA6UxgtUmHfaWjiLsrQSk=; h=Date:From:To:CC:Subject:In-Reply-To:References:From; b=zhXakLFUY3RFo6/8RnDJNQHdD/XTmSMaaWWkyoE4jXVSOY6VOVw37f57rTu1LrJB/ XjajY2pPZsK+4/fweDN56WfO2ZkemCD5QQ1Iy4PrrLctUhcD1fO7TwsUGTbAL99u+7 zoRd4JKD7gkW7jQqHJcOcwypIHzgacGaIaw4q+MeUOv4eF+yl30XJxaPi/keA/Ypot YzTvyHlMrkmmXt/1s2jpCuQS2w3WT7fE6rjmU1/BgMUMEzYxCTwKsV+TvSSzyXD43H Lll6DwdJCfPgAypyQoDeSxTQzC/mAWLyd8FqgVh/Dk8KlX+Q/KiEr82toO0rvuSkhu xqPJ7vA5Ycc/g== Date: Tue, 22 Feb 2022 15:12:45 -0500 From: Michael Richardson To: Henk Birkholz , Carsten Bormann , Michael Richardson CC: IETF WG Chairs , tools-discuss@ietf.org User-Agent: K-9 Mail for Android In-Reply-To: <1d6d1658-f671-e55e-e0db-e697547776f9@sit.fraunhofer.de> References: <16818.1645545342@localhost> <1d6d1658-f671-e55e-e0db-e697547776f9@sit.fraunhofer.de> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Tools-discuss] [irsg] who is attending my WG session X-BeenThere: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF Tools Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 22 Feb 2022 20:12:58 -0000 On February 22, 2022 12:33:03 p=2Em=2E EST, Henk Birkholz wrote: >If I am really honest to myself, there is a: > * (Conflicted) and won't bother to review to the recording >missing here=2E "Not attending" would be the honest answer=2E --=20 Sent from my Android device with K-9 Mail=2E Please excuse my brevity=2E From nobody Tue Feb 22 17:42:37 2022 Return-Path: X-Original-To: tools-discuss@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: tools-discuss@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 73B063A0CC9 for ; Tue, 22 Feb 2022 17:42:34 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.9 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.9 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_H2=-0.001, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=unavailable autolearn_force=no Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id jNnlzSuZjltb for ; 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[98.229.239.247]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id s7sm974583qki.20.2022.02.22.17.42.28 (version=TLS1_2 cipher=ECDHE-ECDSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 bits=128/128); Tue, 22 Feb 2022 17:42:28 -0800 (PST) From: Tim April To: "Salz, Rich" Cc: Jay Daley , mcr+ietf@sandelman.ca, "April, Tim" , tools-discuss , Robert Sparks Date: Tue, 22 Feb 2022 20:42:26 -0500 X-Mailer: MailMate (1.14r5857) Message-ID: <722CEF73-4EB9-4BC9-839C-323F24430E30@tapril.net> In-Reply-To: <17976827-2A15-4622-9595-ABDD6326E28F@akamai.com> References: <3318CCB9-0C79-47D4-A365-10AAAFE67160@ietf.org> <18381.1645204899@localhost> <182c8482-2328-4f1f-10a9-6b95e1a79e7d@nostrum.com> <272F3199-62AD-4B12-8AB2-1FA00219CC83@ietf.org> <17976827-2A15-4622-9595-ABDD6326E28F@akamai.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Tools-discuss] Zulip implementation Service Plan X-BeenThere: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF Tools Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 23 Feb 2022 01:42:35 -0000 Inline --tim On 21 Feb 2022, at 10:02, Salz, Rich wrote: > 1. Permission to change name and email. Both of these are turned = off as the expectation is that Datatracker will be the source for both of= those. > > That makes sense. Agreed, if there is a source of truth, keeping the relying services pinne= d in this way is important. An important thing to test is how changes to = email or name are propagated to the system. I have seen it done through a= sync process (like LDAP) or to require the user to logout and then log b= ack in. Documenting that early might be useful. A slight reason to make t= he email editable would be to have notifications (missed notifications, l= og in notices, etc) sent to a different email address. > > 2. Show preview of uploaded and linked images. Currently on. > > No real preference, but it reminds me to make sure animated gifs are di= sabled or the built-in ones are removed. (Curse you party parrot :). Pe= rhaps Tim April (on cc) knows what we did at akamai. Although not that I= think of it, not thrilled with linked images (security people are parano= id about being tracked), but can live with it. I believe the image preview option will grab the image once per server an= d serve the cached image, but that should be checked (clients should grab= the image from the server and not the origin). We disabled it on the ser= ver I admin for non-privacy related reasons and we=E2=80=99re considering= turning it on. I thought there was a ticket to make preview configurable= by the user, but I don=E2=80=99t know if that was ever pushed. I find th= at preview is incredibly valuable for meetings so you can interact passiv= ely with the chat system rather than needing to click on image links for = context, an example is if someone were to post the slide images to a stre= am as a talk was being given for people that are not on meet echo. Animat= ions are always a tricky situation, but I am in favor of the preview by d= efault. > > 3. Show preview of linked websites. Currently off. > > Yes, good idea. I have recently looked at this code in the codebase and found it to be re= asonable. The server will generate the preview and provide text and maybe= a cached image as the preview. I=E2=80=99m slightly in favor of this fea= ture being enabled. I would suggest contacting the developers about the s= afety story around this if considering it. > > 4. Who can access user email addresses. Currently everyone. > > Since IETF zulip is only available to IETF datatracker users, this is r= easonable. > As long as the syncing discussed in 1 are well handled, I see no issue wi= th allowing them to be visible. > > > ___________________________________________________________ > Tools-discuss mailing list - Tools-discuss@ietf.org > This list is for discussion, not for action requests or bug reports. > * Report datatracker and mailarchive bugs to: datatracker-project@ietf.= org > * Report tools.ietf.org bugs to: webmaster@tools.ietf.org > * Report all other bugs or issues to: ietf-action@ietf.org > List info (including how to Unsubscribe): https://www.ietf.org/mailman/= listinfo/tools-discuss From nobody Tue Feb 22 18:55:01 2022 Return-Path: X-Original-To: tools-discuss@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: tools-discuss@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1B5653A0DF9 for ; Tue, 22 Feb 2022 18:54:58 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.895 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.895 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_BLOCKED=0.001, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_NONE=0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=rtfm-com.20210112.gappssmtp.com Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id tMq-D_FihJo8 for ; Tue, 22 Feb 2022 18:54:55 -0800 (PST) Received: from mail-il1-x134.google.com (mail-il1-x134.google.com [IPv6:2607:f8b0:4864:20::134]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id CB1023A0DDD for ; Tue, 22 Feb 2022 18:54:54 -0800 (PST) Received: by mail-il1-x134.google.com with SMTP id y5so1886314ill.13 for ; Tue, 22 Feb 2022 18:54:54 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=rtfm-com.20210112.gappssmtp.com; s=20210112; h=mime-version:from:date:message-id:subject:to; bh=gCIfE/IM0aYT9IshJWXikHI1fEWUFPMb4Cqv1z0CN7U=; b=QOm+3BflkfZX0l5rSPujtveEEumtPgU2KBjyOmy+rMEuUwrLrLbGB+g7lIircWxMvv oZ/cZxUbehVUJimKZ8fwYqVKx9SWBJCmiSj4WiCgKZlfLxHPkNs1OJH7gI/44RtI3K8T ZayTbwYvZOXQG71p5FCecwo6In0QFDVZ+Fm21BnP/l51mX4m0bVtwbYgdg+FcjnQPyxf ivi0CqKfixUgg1T9MDYSI9BpGn+B5ph29/LHjDNiZmilSpHg8PYkRD3WBVKyRpIEbF76 5fxxRWdHlQ2gUznMI+MMaf5v5wl/sY+nha0NevMRtQ141drUvIwn0khm+0HqipAHDdzP JdPQ== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20210112; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:from:date:message-id:subject:to; bh=gCIfE/IM0aYT9IshJWXikHI1fEWUFPMb4Cqv1z0CN7U=; b=2UMPYw5zx2Hxe4YeGdYhYsgpe6FrGZ4+Ra6qorXfJhriUPQbaOnXb7Ono99z1rnwDg F4R5UPap2gEAgVDJNT1+fL9FzJURZ+f8/+BJSIoPQP6mwrTLi53MTJJ9VYk8G1dFx4lE q0GW0o3UR8KyTgH03w2SlgGZP0udzmfNXxLu/lSbUq+Pq0kfhW3KF7LyGQvu4lMbHQEw saHtvArjzsOA/ph+ruvAQBdZC8XjUtDUodmdIUo9fY3C8RkRYrvjLatZLiif5iwEEvXo xGNqGjHz09woC4fADXspfv0/U++SaXGrYjC6YEB8N7BHnhkvl/w6PgMsWgy7SQkkLKYz DOxQ== X-Gm-Message-State: AOAM531j+PTtoZWIlJDAInFgevkyBFOq0k6MWGglKUV7ARX+u10Mzcfw NDji6pjFo7aqOVwr6ELArijkBXq0F9oxUxZ5F7USX5cQ+CY= X-Google-Smtp-Source: ABdhPJzcHkZeYFpslvEIygui/NtFOciW+5feryHQDDZD+9+CcIBnQx/MukWkSSUtTi02p5sUkgS0XkFb9R5aIJM4s+Q= X-Received: by 2002:a05:6e02:1887:b0:2c2:4311:cc5a with SMTP id o7-20020a056e02188700b002c24311cc5amr10175406ilu.39.1645584893422; Tue, 22 Feb 2022 18:54:53 -0800 (PST) MIME-Version: 1.0 From: Eric Rescorla Date: Tue, 22 Feb 2022 18:54:17 -0800 Message-ID: To: tools-discuss Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="0000000000000542d105d8a697a7" Archived-At: Subject: [Tools-discuss] Oauth DT->Registration X-BeenThere: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF Tools Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 23 Feb 2022 02:54:59 -0000 --0000000000000542d105d8a697a7 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" I just went to register and I got prompted with an OAuth dialog to give permission for the registration system to see my information from DT. Is there some reason why we need this? Generally, it seems like people should expect that www.ietf.org, datatracker.ietf.org, and registration.ietf.org can share information between them. -Ekr --0000000000000542d105d8a697a7 Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
I just went to register and I got prompted with an OA= uth dialog to give permission for the registration system to see my informa= tion from DT. Is there some reason why we need this? Generally, it seems li= ke people should expect that www.ietf.org, datatracker.ietf.org, and <= a href=3D"http://registration.ietf.org">registration.ietf.org can share= information between them.

-Ekr









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Wed, 23 Feb 2022 08:26:11 -0600 From: "Salz, Rich" To: Tim April CC: Jay Daley , "mcr+ietf@sandelman.ca" , "April, Tim" , tools-discuss , Robert Sparks Thread-Topic: [Tools-discuss] Zulip implementation Service Plan Thread-Index: AQHYJFbm3YgF1ZVNdkuMADZYrWkjLqyZ8+GAgAA52gCAA06MgIAAs8wAgAKZDACAAIGQgA== Date: Wed, 23 Feb 2022 14:26:10 +0000 Message-ID: <781C4801-73D2-4571-BADA-F87E2F5A05DD@akamai.com> References: <3318CCB9-0C79-47D4-A365-10AAAFE67160@ietf.org> <18381.1645204899@localhost> <182c8482-2328-4f1f-10a9-6b95e1a79e7d@nostrum.com> <272F3199-62AD-4B12-8AB2-1FA00219CC83@ietf.org> <17976827-2A15-4622-9595-ABDD6326E28F@akamai.com> <722CEF73-4EB9-4BC9-839C-323F24430E30@tapril.net> In-Reply-To: <722CEF73-4EB9-4BC9-839C-323F24430E30@tapril.net> Accept-Language: en-US Content-Language: en-US X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: user-agent: Microsoft-MacOutlook/16.58.22021501 x-ms-exchange-messagesentrepresentingtype: 1 x-ms-exchange-transport-fromentityheader: Hosted x-originating-ip: [172.27.118.139] Content-Type: text/plain; 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Wed, 23 Feb 2022 08:48:14 -0600 (CST) (envelope-from rjsparks@nostrum.com) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=simple/simple; d=nostrum.com; s=default; t=1645627694; bh=k4201t9imLyBjvj6oiy7X/5/YjaFrWY77GLNnVHPJ08=; h=Date:Subject:To:References:From:In-Reply-To; b=VeZ/JklfqpLbTsBg1OKw7hBINLQi1XzdeYm/r3kXB2ORcr9ymQgXVDG0nF2GkQxqZ Dcyhue449sl8kirpq6ldlJ61SGesydYj4qcaNxPJsHe/POSqvufoCCUqCyey23s+ej 4Ov2ixlawWIPir6P2Jh+F8uYLiUF/9SZ/FH6wLqw= X-Authentication-Warning: raven.nostrum.com: Host [47.186.48.51] claimed to be [192.168.1.114] Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="------------tnoP1sCudwA5UbL9TeERQFzz" Message-ID: <161819e5-33a7-0dcc-e899-03c1d67122a6@nostrum.com> Date: Wed, 23 Feb 2022 08:48:08 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Macintosh; Intel Mac OS X 10.15; rv:91.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/91.6.1 Content-Language: en-US To: tools-discuss@ietf.org References: From: Robert Sparks In-Reply-To: Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Tools-discuss] Oauth DT->Registration X-BeenThere: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF Tools Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 23 Feb 2022 14:48:22 -0000 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --------------tnoP1sCudwA5UbL9TeERQFzz Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit The important thing was the login. We'll look at not asking for the grants. RjS On 2/22/22 8:54 PM, Eric Rescorla wrote: > I just went to register and I got prompted with an OAuth dialog to > give permission for the registration system to see my information from > DT. Is there some reason why we need this? Generally, it seems like > people should expect that www.ietf.org , > datatracker.ietf.org , and > registration.ietf.org can share > information between them. > > -Ekr > > > > > > > > > > > ___________________________________________________________ > Tools-discuss mailing list -Tools-discuss@ietf.org > This list is for discussion, not for action requests or bug reports. > * Report datatracker and mailarchive bugs to:datatracker-project@ietf.org > * Report tools.ietf.org bugs to:webmaster@tools.ietf.org > * Report all other bugs or issues to:ietf-action@ietf.org > List info (including how to Unsubscribe):https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/tools-discuss --------------tnoP1sCudwA5UbL9TeERQFzz Content-Type: text/html; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

The important thing was the login. We'll look at not asking for the grants.

RjS

On 2/22/22 8:54 PM, Eric Rescorla wrote:
I just went to register and I got prompted with an OAuth dialog to give permission for the registration system to see my information from DT. Is there some reason why we need this? Generally, it seems like people should expect that www.ietf.org, datatracker.ietf.org, and registration.ietf.org can share information between them.

-Ekr










___________________________________________________________
Tools-discuss mailing list - Tools-discuss@ietf.org
This list is for discussion, not for action requests or bug reports.
* Report datatracker and mailarchive bugs to: datatracker-project@ietf.org
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It seems to me like it ought to be possible to make this invisible to the user. -Ekr On Wed, Feb 23, 2022 at 6:48 AM Robert Sparks wrote: > The important thing was the login. We'll look at not asking for the grants. > > RjS > On 2/22/22 8:54 PM, Eric Rescorla wrote: > > I just went to register and I got prompted with an OAuth dialog to give > permission for the registration system to see my information from DT. Is > there some reason why we need this? Generally, it seems like people should > expect that www.ietf.org, datatracker.ietf.org, and registration.ietf.org > can share information between them. > > -Ekr > > > > > > > > > > > ___________________________________________________________ > Tools-discuss mailing list - Tools-discuss@ietf.org > This list is for discussion, not for action requests or bug reports. > * Report datatracker and mailarchive bugs to: datatracker-project@ietf.org > * Report tools.ietf.org bugs to: webmaster@tools.ietf.org > * Report all other bugs or issues to: ietf-action@ietf.org > List info (including how to Unsubscribe): https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/tools-discuss > > ___________________________________________________________ > Tools-discuss mailing list - Tools-discuss@ietf.org > This list is for discussion, not for action requests or bug reports. > * Report datatracker and mailarchive bugs to: datatracker-project@ietf.org > * Report tools.ietf.org bugs to: webmaster@tools.ietf.org > * Report all other bugs or issues to: ietf-action@ietf.org > List info (including how to Unsubscribe): > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/tools-discuss > --000000000000f247a805d8b290e4 Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Thanks. It seems to me like it ought to be possible t= o make this invisible to the user.

-Ekr
=

On Wed, Feb 23, 2022 at 6:48 AM Robert Sparks <rjsparks@nostrum.com> wrote:
=20 =20 =20

The important thing was the login. We'll look at not asking for the grants.

RjS

On 2/22/22 8:54 PM, Eric Rescorla wrote:
=20
I just went to register and I got prompted with an OAuth dialog to give permission for the registration system to see my information from DT. Is there some reason why we need this? Generally, it seems like people should expect that www.ietf.org, datatra= cker.ietf.org, and re= gistration.ietf.org can share information between them.

-Ekr










___________________________________________________________
Tools-discuss mailing list - Tools-discuss@ietf.org
This list is for discussion, not for action requests or bug reports.
* Report datatracker and mailarchive bugs to: datatracker-project@ietf.org
* Report tools.ietf.org=
 bugs to: webmaster@tools.ietf.org
* Report all other bugs or issues to: ietf-action@ietf.org
List info (including how to Unsubscribe): https://www.ietf.org/mailm=
an/listinfo/tools-discuss
___________________________________________________________
Tools-discuss mailing list - Tools-discuss@ietf.org
This list is for discussion, not for action requests or bug reports.
* Report datatracker and mailarchive bugs to: datatracker-project@ietf.org
* Report tools.ietf.org bugs to: webmaster@tools.ietf.org
* Report all other bugs or issues to: ietf-action@ietf.org
List info (including how to Unsubscribe): https:/= /www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/tools-discuss
--000000000000f247a805d8b290e4-- From nobody Wed Feb 23 18:47:46 2022 Return-Path: X-Original-To: tools-discuss@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: tools-discuss@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 354F13A1341 for ; Wed, 23 Feb 2022 18:47:45 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.898 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.898 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_BLOCKED=0.001, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id E_unwjy8sCWg for ; Wed, 23 Feb 2022 18:47:42 -0800 (PST) Received: from ietfx.ietf.org (ietfx.amsl.com [4.31.198.45]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ADH-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 832953A1347 for ; Wed, 23 Feb 2022 18:47:41 -0800 (PST) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfx.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 71A734092791 for ; Wed, 23 Feb 2022 18:47:41 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com Received: from ietfx.ietf.org ([4.31.198.45]) by localhost (ietfx.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id gy-382vY9gYI for ; Wed, 23 Feb 2022 18:47:41 -0800 (PST) Received: from smtpclient.apple (unknown [158.140.230.105]) by ietfx.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 1B236409278F for ; Wed, 23 Feb 2022 18:47:40 -0800 (PST) From: Jay Daley Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Mime-Version: 1.0 (Mac OS X Mail 15.0 \(3693.40.0.1.81\)) Message-Id: <3CC0625E-90FE-43DE-AEC0-D18D9F9A1C20@ietf.org> Date: Thu, 24 Feb 2022 15:47:36 +1300 To: tools-discuss X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.3693.40.0.1.81) Archived-At: Subject: [Tools-discuss] Outstanding updates to authors.ietf.org now complete. X-BeenThere: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF Tools Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 24 Feb 2022 02:47:46 -0000 There were a few outstanding updates required to the authors.ietf.org = site that have now been made: 1. The inclusion of a Quick Start Guide. This is at the front of = https://authors.ietf.org/en/getting-started and reflects the text = discussed on the emo-dir list. The reference to the GitHub I-D template = template is a bit clumsy and could be tidied up. (Also, I am of the view = that is too complex for a quick start guide, but in the rough on that = one). 2. An explanation of the standard character entities and examples of = their usage as provided by the RPC = https://authors.ietf.org/en/templates-and-schemas#character-entities 3. In the RFCXML vocabulary, removing references to the RSE and/or = lists maintained by the RSE that never existed. Some minor tidying up is needed to reflect the renaming of kramdown-rfc = but that=E2=80=99s now pretty much normal maintenance. Jay --=20 Jay Daley IETF Executive Director exec-director@ietf.org From nobody Wed Feb 23 18:52:45 2022 Return-Path: X-Original-To: tools-discuss@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: tools-discuss@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5B60D3A011F; Wed, 23 Feb 2022 18:52:43 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.899 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.899 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id odDFK5rtTQsk; Wed, 23 Feb 2022 18:52:40 -0800 (PST) Received: from gabriel-smtp.zfn.uni-bremen.de (gabriel-smtp.zfn.uni-bremen.de [IPv6:2001:638:708:32::15]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ADH-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 3F2213A1354; Wed, 23 Feb 2022 18:52:37 -0800 (PST) Received: from [192.168.217.118] (p5089ad4f.dip0.t-ipconnect.de [80.137.173.79]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by gabriel-smtp.zfn.uni-bremen.de (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 4K3yB93KVGzDCdX; Thu, 24 Feb 2022 03:52:33 +0100 (CET) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Mime-Version: 1.0 (Mac OS X Mail 13.4 \(3608.120.23.2.7\)) From: Carsten Bormann In-Reply-To: <3CC0625E-90FE-43DE-AEC0-D18D9F9A1C20@ietf.org> Date: Thu, 24 Feb 2022 03:52:33 +0100 Cc: tools-discuss X-Mao-Original-Outgoing-Id: 667363952.994586-a774b8e809b191875ac52a3999aefb42 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Message-Id: <3451C30D-2F61-4C79-B4A1-8D36F18855D6@tzi.org> References: <3CC0625E-90FE-43DE-AEC0-D18D9F9A1C20@ietf.org> To: Jay Daley X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.3608.120.23.2.7) Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Tools-discuss] Outstanding updates to authors.ietf.org now complete. X-BeenThere: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF Tools Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 24 Feb 2022 02:52:44 -0000 On 2022-02-24, at 03:47, Jay Daley wrote: >=20 > https://authors.ietf.org/en/templates-and-schemas#character-entities Why doesn=E2=80=99t this point to the other markdown skeletons? (What this page calls =E2=80=9Ctemplates=E2=80=9D=E2=80=A6) Markdown doesn=E2=80=99t have the concept of a schema, so the =E2=80=9Cyet= =E2=80=9D is confusing. Gr=C3=BC=C3=9Fe, Carsten From nobody Wed Feb 23 19:39:41 2022 Return-Path: X-Original-To: tools-discuss@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: tools-discuss@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9EC013A0DB1 for ; Wed, 23 Feb 2022 19:39:38 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -6.899 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-6.899 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_HI=-5, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id MZaBUqNzU9Ci for ; Wed, 23 Feb 2022 19:39:34 -0800 (PST) Received: from ietfx.ietf.org (ietfx.amsl.com [4.31.198.45]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ADH-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 78D0F3A0D9F for ; Wed, 23 Feb 2022 19:39:34 -0800 (PST) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfx.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 590154092792; Wed, 23 Feb 2022 19:39:34 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com Received: from ietfx.ietf.org ([4.31.198.45]) by localhost (ietfx.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 7oIZH1c4Wysh; Wed, 23 Feb 2022 19:39:34 -0800 (PST) Received: from smtpclient.apple (unknown [158.140.230.105]) by ietfx.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id C3D10409278F; Wed, 23 Feb 2022 19:39:33 -0800 (PST) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Mime-Version: 1.0 (Mac OS X Mail 15.0 \(3693.40.0.1.81\)) From: Jay Daley In-Reply-To: <3451C30D-2F61-4C79-B4A1-8D36F18855D6@tzi.org> Date: Thu, 24 Feb 2022 16:39:27 +1300 Cc: tools-discuss Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Message-Id: <27EF8D96-7047-4C03-998E-951D2115BC1D@ietf.org> References: <3CC0625E-90FE-43DE-AEC0-D18D9F9A1C20@ietf.org> <3451C30D-2F61-4C79-B4A1-8D36F18855D6@tzi.org> To: Carsten Bormann X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.3693.40.0.1.81) Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Tools-discuss] Outstanding updates to authors.ietf.org now complete. X-BeenThere: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF Tools Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 24 Feb 2022 03:39:39 -0000 > On 24/02/2022, at 3:52 PM, Carsten Bormann wrote: >=20 > On 2022-02-24, at 03:47, Jay Daley wrote: >>=20 >> https://authors.ietf.org/en/templates-and-schemas#character-entities >=20 > Why doesn=E2=80=99t this point to the other markdown skeletons? > (What this page calls =E2=80=9Ctemplates=E2=80=9D=E2=80=A6) If you let me know what other ones it should point to then I will add = them. >=20 > Markdown doesn=E2=80=99t have the concept of a schema, so the = =E2=80=9Cyet=E2=80=9D is confusing. Yeah, wishful thinking. Jay >=20 > Gr=C3=BC=C3=9Fe, Carsten >=20 --=20 Jay Daley IETF Executive Director exec-director@ietf.org From nobody Wed Feb 23 19:44:25 2022 Return-Path: X-Original-To: tools-discuss@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: tools-discuss@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id A0F073A0DCB; Wed, 23 Feb 2022 19:44:23 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.899 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.899 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id PX4r9lFFknF7; Wed, 23 Feb 2022 19:44:19 -0800 (PST) Received: from gabriel-smtp.zfn.uni-bremen.de (gabriel-smtp.zfn.uni-bremen.de [IPv6:2001:638:708:32::15]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ADH-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id E09543A0DC9; Wed, 23 Feb 2022 19:44:18 -0800 (PST) Received: from [192.168.217.118] (p5089ad4f.dip0.t-ipconnect.de [80.137.173.79]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by gabriel-smtp.zfn.uni-bremen.de (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 4K3zKp2KH7zDCdf; Thu, 24 Feb 2022 04:44:14 +0100 (CET) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Mime-Version: 1.0 (Mac OS X Mail 13.4 \(3608.120.23.2.7\)) From: Carsten Bormann In-Reply-To: <27EF8D96-7047-4C03-998E-951D2115BC1D@ietf.org> Date: Thu, 24 Feb 2022 04:44:13 +0100 Cc: tools-discuss X-Mao-Original-Outgoing-Id: 667367053.895522-c238df9f9cae73cc0cb1f41e7fdd6763 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Message-Id: <4823AF64-7EAE-4CA3-833D-D95072CE726A@tzi.org> References: <3CC0625E-90FE-43DE-AEC0-D18D9F9A1C20@ietf.org> <3451C30D-2F61-4C79-B4A1-8D36F18855D6@tzi.org> <27EF8D96-7047-4C03-998E-951D2115BC1D@ietf.org> To: Jay Daley X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.3608.120.23.2.7) Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Tools-discuss] Outstanding updates to authors.ietf.org now complete. X-BeenThere: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF Tools Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 24 Feb 2022 03:44:24 -0000 On 2022-02-24, at 04:39, Jay Daley wrote: >=20 > If you let me know what other ones it should point to then I will add = them. Maybe we can make life easier by pointing to just one more skeleton: = https://github.com/cabo/kramdown-rfc/blob/master/examples/draft-rfcxml-gen= eral-template-standard-00.xml-edited.md Of course, the YAML header looks awful in github=E2=80=99s default = rendering, so maybe: = https://raw.githubusercontent.com/cabo/kramdown-rfc/master/examples/draft-= rfcxml-general-template-standard-00.xml-edited.md I=E2=80=99m sure this semi-cadillac skeleton needs some more work, but = it already shows most of what is needed for a draft today. I probably = should put out rendered versions of that skeleton as well... Gr=C3=BC=C3=9Fe, Carsten From nobody Wed Feb 23 23:22:54 2022 Return-Path: X-Original-To: tools-discuss@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: tools-discuss@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id A03713A0831; Wed, 23 Feb 2022 23:22:51 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -7.099 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-7.099 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_HI=-5, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (1024-bit key) header.d=eggert.org Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id lTZ1KFurZ7Rt; Wed, 23 Feb 2022 23:22:47 -0800 (PST) Received: from mail.eggert.org (mail.eggert.org [IPv6:2a00:ac00:4000:400:211:32ff:fe22:186f]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 128FB3A0836; Wed, 23 Feb 2022 23:22:41 -0800 (PST) Received: from smtpclient.apple (unknown [IPv6:2a00:ac00:4000:400:7869:6e33:4bad:4f76]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by mail.eggert.org (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 021C71D24B7; Thu, 24 Feb 2022 09:22:21 +0200 (EET) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/simple; d=eggert.org; s=dkim; t=1645687342; bh=wHe0i51E0whk3g1mDKMkuQT06N02/uUxayVPBI16F2k=; h=Subject:From:In-Reply-To:Date:Cc:References:To; b=ttR0kRYSmLO98jET6wyATcQlnO/QApQNk9lsTge+A86iH7OToBAHIRjSG30x6tH4k jO0e1n6AJkWOyOnY8HLnS6Bm6KWDV5TKjGLyB3McR8Mw5tOrz76LujEcaBHvKiZ5bV 6L79RD55zGhc+UY6Vxhb9lYRwbW3NN8huVTFnQnM= Content-Type: multipart/signed; boundary="Apple-Mail=_CFB7792D-2699-4116-AE14-DA270E8F2609"; protocol="application/pgp-signature"; micalg=pgp-sha512 Mime-Version: 1.0 (Mac OS X Mail 15.0 \(3693.60.0.1.1\)) From: Lars Eggert In-Reply-To: <3451C30D-2F61-4C79-B4A1-8D36F18855D6@tzi.org> Date: Thu, 24 Feb 2022 09:22:21 +0200 Cc: Jay Daley , tools-discuss Message-Id: <0D5AF394-6EE6-4A3A-A6AD-F7EE758AB924@eggert.org> References: <3CC0625E-90FE-43DE-AEC0-D18D9F9A1C20@ietf.org> <3451C30D-2F61-4C79-B4A1-8D36F18855D6@tzi.org> To: Carsten Bormann X-MailScanner-ID: 021C71D24B7.A16FE X-MailScanner: Found to be clean X-MailScanner-From: lars@eggert.org Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Tools-discuss] Outstanding updates to authors.ietf.org now complete. X-BeenThere: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF Tools Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 24 Feb 2022 07:22:52 -0000 --Apple-Mail=_CFB7792D-2699-4116-AE14-DA270E8F2609 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Hi, On 2022-2-24, at 4:52, Carsten Bormann wrote: > On 2022-02-24, at 03:47, Jay Daley wrote: >> https://authors.ietf.org/en/templates-and-schemas#character-entities this is probably a larger ask, but I think it would make sense to split = this wiki more thoroughly in a "drafting in Markdown" and "drafting in = XML" branches. This is already somewhat there by having left-menu pages with those = titles (I'd order Markdown first, however). But then the page a the URL above (and possibly) others mix XML and = Markdown content on one page, which makes them look busy and makes them = carry content that is irrelevant for authors using the other toolchain. Thanks, Lars --Apple-Mail=_CFB7792D-2699-4116-AE14-DA270E8F2609 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: attachment; filename=signature.asc Content-Type: application/pgp-signature; name=signature.asc Content-Description: Message signed with OpenPGP -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- iQIzBAEBCgAdFiEEmpq0ZpSoejRmyhheVLXDCb9wwVcFAmIXMi0ACgkQVLXDCb9w wVdSBg//e3NgrsaMgMALCpu/JCcCmFbFqJl+kYDPjnVWphmztLkHNmRSDana2AUb 0q93l8etsP8fKH3At8ebmXpQZN71vpPUxENp++caSc40Sk+ygdsNjCGlGCWk8O58 sw3ysG9S8ris3pMsUkMCvnyWLttaC78rfArBI4/kA3EUbbeSg4vOwAkrXIKmmcYh A+lXN07tHcwKeCG8C7cLVF3rjMl+bex9qd++6Z4Swd3AnyGp3CQcWtdyofhC6G8e U2mTeias4COd3Hlf8f/Yhyt4qRqsEObCIDNE64VOU1IiD013rN40Qn7PVFEZty0G pQd4W46X4NyfvyQaZBNFC2/joTvLOrEHuOrnfh2Iwbg4m+KfRKcfv6/R1q4rCIW0 MKHtemjomGUBFHuzQHxHWqmp/E7QF2763NfITLNW44YIREwBCAt792UeqIj2VYTY XAP7RMuv71dMjbzOlpHPNUbkd34tZgBrqf4TIkvI9UR2KYf03dXs6OlRMZN1aAAN B2o90zZFUHnZpCTe4f98TZ1EjtLTwKHsYKK59ZNbVI3YYPBUpiAD75P0dGk0RJnA vqGnJs5GOo6FvEfcXv+u9SmHAWox6tshxHMHLvVz7bDO6X1bC7ie55/UclXULoXs bsPSogKgemp4cONrvA6r4xxEqa/LPj1KTWoHJxsx5v4yOyHcKFQ= =5n/3 -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --Apple-Mail=_CFB7792D-2699-4116-AE14-DA270E8F2609-- From nobody Thu Feb 24 07:28:53 2022 Return-Path: X-Original-To: tools-discuss@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: tools-discuss@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id AC38A3A0937; Thu, 24 Feb 2022 07:28:50 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -5.897 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-5.897 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, MAY_BE_FORGED=1, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_HI=-5, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_NONE=0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 3Btnf-PU6qMs; Thu, 24 Feb 2022 07:28:47 -0800 (PST) Received: from mail.proper.com (Opus1.Proper.COM [207.182.41.91]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 27B5B3A092B; Thu, 24 Feb 2022 07:28:47 -0800 (PST) Received: from [10.32.60.156] (76-209-242-70.lightspeed.mtryca.sbcglobal.net [76.209.242.70] (may be forged)) (authenticated bits=0) by mail.proper.com (8.15.2/8.15.2) with ESMTPSA id 21OFRfmO033216 (version=TLSv1.2 cipher=ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 bits=256 verify=NO); Thu, 24 Feb 2022 08:27:42 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from paul.hoffman@vpnc.org) X-Authentication-Warning: mail.proper.com: Host 76-209-242-70.lightspeed.mtryca.sbcglobal.net [76.209.242.70] (may be forged) claimed to be [10.32.60.156] From: Paul Hoffman To: tools-discuss Date: Thu, 24 Feb 2022 07:28:44 -0800 X-Mailer: MailMate (1.14r5798) Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <0D5AF394-6EE6-4A3A-A6AD-F7EE758AB924@eggert.org> References: <3CC0625E-90FE-43DE-AEC0-D18D9F9A1C20@ietf.org> <3451C30D-2F61-4C79-B4A1-8D36F18855D6@tzi.org> <0D5AF394-6EE6-4A3A-A6AD-F7EE758AB924@eggert.org> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Tools-discuss] Outstanding updates to authors.ietf.org now complete. X-BeenThere: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF Tools Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 24 Feb 2022 15:28:51 -0000 On 23 Feb 2022, at 23:22, Lars Eggert wrote: > this is probably a larger ask, but I think it would make sense to > split this wiki more thoroughly in a "drafting in Markdown" and > "drafting in XML" branches. +1. As someone who helps near-novice draft authors who don't understand either Markdown or XML, I can assure you that the more we make those separate, the better it will be for the folks we are trying to help in our community. --Paul Hoffman From nobody Thu Feb 24 08:32:00 2022 Return-Path: X-Original-To: tools-discuss@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: tools-discuss@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 545BF3A0BD6 for ; Thu, 24 Feb 2022 08:31:58 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -7.098 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-7.098 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_HI=-5, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=gmail.com Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id hlW3W19U30Tm for ; Thu, 24 Feb 2022 08:31:53 -0800 (PST) Received: from mail-wr1-x433.google.com (mail-wr1-x433.google.com [IPv6:2a00:1450:4864:20::433]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 603593A0BC6 for ; Thu, 24 Feb 2022 08:31:53 -0800 (PST) Received: by mail-wr1-x433.google.com with SMTP id r10so529834wrp.3 for ; Thu, 24 Feb 2022 08:31:53 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20210112; h=mime-version:subject:from:in-reply-to:date:cc:message-id:references :to; bh=h68KFmKYC2cOBOhkI7Rvx1HihDroVSDyGO2VmoNVq3s=; b=W/f3zeQci9srpZG1uTN9QaKae3y/tgqP4nFj9QzxUeV8d12Gkl0Mj3sjlwdjrDOgt5 nPiIZVWmsFkNYAA9XRITZne/DliWLfWBqKOFsH+4mh14yf9IepB4ZOLt8NERf4q93lmh yXCKrNOVUBu0ggExPHlHiGcMlxzmTDfK/L1MSNIuqYbT6P7iOCZye07IxYRH3WWLtGhh GCihYP1TH1YFbIRKTwaVHgiHacMy4+S2wwdWBTLqPVK5pY7+PWmlnQgAe+fOMwngxm9x K7++ncBCdHfdWgN/gq4GJMtIJTLa0IDTeXDSF16mCwPjmA+NO/JDMHlJ0a18toxH/Jbf pzqw== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20210112; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:subject:from:in-reply-to:date:cc :message-id:references:to; bh=h68KFmKYC2cOBOhkI7Rvx1HihDroVSDyGO2VmoNVq3s=; b=V/GYjra3RA1fWCDqz1KeMif/e/SUlSdPHIGFNCgUX3o7KTJOQWSM0iV2ZNAy7J7NaA bQEFcE1Oak0TSzDPllgmmu1CWWfJdLvGSN49JZQ+TDM8rH0SfJey5+njdr94OTP1OxW7 3hZ5S0oDHjf7SzsRDAH4GKNcR8hCU+QjCL5r5+VP5ZDUTbB4emta49FIS9j7caF+pBnW b6N+e3q59SakuMrJ7+0/67N51ic1DDodFwn8vi9o6IGOimRGXnwAw/0Im4p9O7QVWedB sMyaDTFscMtmZAaGcgk/3jHftgcQbbvS/FOGOglvQU7xEyTMfsVtdfjjo8PUNgtlUnMi 9PFg== X-Gm-Message-State: AOAM531s1jT6UhrGj3fDcR7XXQn7AnBh95VtA69L4h3swUhMfg3T7Slp kolqXyNw44dFXaCvbrGCvTSwHo8LE7Y= X-Google-Smtp-Source: ABdhPJwRKt6+HlAzpNkcezxi+EFp4S0kzApamsXbEuyyl7/dichDO+KD44xja5k2koHhLllrWuvxpg== X-Received: by 2002:a5d:4e83:0:b0:1ea:99dd:d335 with SMTP id e3-20020a5d4e83000000b001ea99ddd335mr2974901wru.16.1645720311137; Thu, 24 Feb 2022 08:31:51 -0800 (PST) Received: from smtpclient.apple ([2600:1700:4383:c05f:501e:f78e:3737:9681]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id a1sm3506897wrf.42.2022.02.24.08.31.49 (version=TLS1_2 cipher=ECDHE-ECDSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 bits=128/128); Thu, 24 Feb 2022 08:31:50 -0800 (PST) Content-Type: multipart/signed; boundary="Apple-Mail=_84BF07E0-F140-4542-8731-E3A6D48DC9A7"; protocol="application/pgp-signature"; micalg=pgp-sha512 Mime-Version: 1.0 (Mac OS X Mail 15.0 \(3693.60.0.1.1\)) From: Bob Hinden In-Reply-To: Date: Thu, 24 Feb 2022 08:31:46 -0800 Cc: Bob Hinden , tools-discuss Message-Id: References: <3CC0625E-90FE-43DE-AEC0-D18D9F9A1C20@ietf.org> <3451C30D-2F61-4C79-B4A1-8D36F18855D6@tzi.org> <0D5AF394-6EE6-4A3A-A6AD-F7EE758AB924@eggert.org> To: Paul Hoffman X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.3693.60.0.1.1) Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Tools-discuss] Outstanding updates to authors.ietf.org now complete. X-BeenThere: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF Tools Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 24 Feb 2022 16:31:59 -0000 --Apple-Mail=_84BF07E0-F140-4542-8731-E3A6D48DC9A7 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Paul, > On Feb 24, 2022, at 7:28 AM, Paul Hoffman = wrote: >=20 > On 23 Feb 2022, at 23:22, Lars Eggert wrote: >=20 >> this is probably a larger ask, but I think it would make sense to = split this wiki more thoroughly in a "drafting in Markdown" and = "drafting in XML" branches. >=20 > +1. As someone who helps near-novice draft authors who don't = understand either Markdown or XML, I can assure you that the more we = make those separate, the better it will be for the folks we are trying = to help in our community. I agree. That would even make it more useful for me:-) Bob >=20 > --Paul Hoffman >=20 > ___________________________________________________________ > Tools-discuss mailing list - Tools-discuss@ietf.org > This list is for discussion, not for action requests or bug reports. > * Report datatracker and mailarchive bugs to: = datatracker-project@ietf.org > * Report tools.ietf.org bugs to: webmaster@tools.ietf.org > * Report all other bugs or issues to: ietf-action@ietf.org > List info (including how to Unsubscribe): = https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/tools-discuss --Apple-Mail=_84BF07E0-F140-4542-8731-E3A6D48DC9A7 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: attachment; filename=signature.asc Content-Type: application/pgp-signature; name=signature.asc Content-Description: Message signed with OpenPGP -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- iQEzBAEBCgAdFiEEm0rfRsOCoyamPexGrut0EXfnu6gFAmIXsvIACgkQrut0EXfn u6h1qQgAimjUmZJQgNYA0vLL4UoXDjSHMDuosXpXAesbMD6HJjOE6TUhKvJmXTYV roMQObxPQ53OmPZiN/iu5Y8KcZ2OuH9MmTZz/MaxzXxim3E5SbAx+SZMV71/GT8L R27QWJveXqnb5zoRc4w7oCD4kSqZkv3c/cK5Aauc0eB9PJEdJhStQqi9bIflZJh/ 8T3qvsWA3J9Mweu4CtDwuuM+73Az1Jp9myJ0/88TQzcK/reNixu6jXDBn3I0nx0E U+aA1xegFlmPHYCihdioCuDrEsKUDK2cf0Zn5J9zvvYyW56o+Z0zLVBraAzeyjGx k+DkurTkksexB2Prq+66f3j/eM+qEA== =VhXc -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --Apple-Mail=_84BF07E0-F140-4542-8731-E3A6D48DC9A7-- From nobody Thu Feb 24 12:57:13 2022 Return-Path: X-Original-To: tools-discuss@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: tools-discuss@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id BE6CD3A07D6 for ; Thu, 24 Feb 2022 12:57:09 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -7.792 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-7.792 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, NICE_REPLY_A=-0.714, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_HI=-5, T_SPF_HELO_PERMERROR=0.01, T_SPF_PERMERROR=0.01, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (1024-bit key) header.d=nostrum.com Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id J1rTc_qo8QKI for ; Thu, 24 Feb 2022 12:57:04 -0800 (PST) Received: from nostrum.com (raven-v6.nostrum.com [IPv6:2001:470:d:1130::1]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 41B173A0923 for ; Thu, 24 Feb 2022 12:57:02 -0800 (PST) Received: from [192.168.1.114] ([47.186.48.51]) (authenticated bits=0) by nostrum.com (8.17.1/8.16.1) with ESMTPSA id 21OKv0JD066046 (version=TLSv1.3 cipher=TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 bits=256 verify=NO); Thu, 24 Feb 2022 14:57:01 -0600 (CST) (envelope-from rjsparks@nostrum.com) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=simple/simple; d=nostrum.com; s=default; t=1645736221; bh=zF+kC2mdZO7WDcFfvmo+ozstvxr4b8byUBTFakODKRY=; h=Date:Subject:To:Cc:References:From:In-Reply-To; b=NnMY8PdQcNGY7LlTILpvGVUKNGXNqA/8iuRPc0p21zVmhh75X8XPu9bMX4mNccZN+ KXTk5j+CagW8k3pfDMAC/KzH1qusavNiF/KDjcNcU2ihppqpeNLy7ZJoN8j98T3S9V nmmFTwq+Zc9EO3ffAdQ/GUcnl8OC/XFokt0hO3tg= X-Authentication-Warning: raven.nostrum.com: Host [47.186.48.51] claimed to be [192.168.1.114] Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="------------CzObl03aUy04cECQEJ0bD5ea" Message-ID: Date: Thu, 24 Feb 2022 14:56:55 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Macintosh; Intel Mac OS X 10.15; rv:91.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/91.6.1 Content-Language: en-US To: Eric Rescorla Cc: tools-discuss References: <161819e5-33a7-0dcc-e899-03c1d67122a6@nostrum.com> From: Robert Sparks In-Reply-To: Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Tools-discuss] Oauth DT->Registration X-BeenThere: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF Tools Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 24 Feb 2022 20:57:10 -0000 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --------------CzObl03aUy04cECQEJ0bD5ea Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit This is done On 2/23/22 11:11 AM, Eric Rescorla wrote: > Thanks. It seems to me like it ought to be possible to make this > invisible to the user. > > -Ekr > > > On Wed, Feb 23, 2022 at 6:48 AM Robert Sparks > wrote: > > The important thing was the login. We'll look at not asking for > the grants. > > RjS > > On 2/22/22 8:54 PM, Eric Rescorla wrote: >> I just went to register and I got prompted with an OAuth dialog >> to give permission for the registration system to see my >> information from DT. Is there some reason why we need this? >> Generally, it seems like people should expect that www.ietf.org >> , datatracker.ietf.org >> , and registration.ietf.org >> can share information between them. >> >> -Ekr >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> ___________________________________________________________ >> Tools-discuss mailing list -Tools-discuss@ietf.org >> This list is for discussion, not for action requests or bug reports. >> * Report datatracker and mailarchive bugs to:datatracker-project@ietf.org >> * Reporttools.ietf.org bugs to:webmaster@tools.ietf.org >> * Report all other bugs or issues to:ietf-action@ietf.org >> List info (including how to Unsubscribe):https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/tools-discuss > ___________________________________________________________ > Tools-discuss mailing list - Tools-discuss@ietf.org > This list is for discussion, not for action requests or bug reports. > * Report datatracker and mailarchive bugs to: > datatracker-project@ietf.org > * Report tools.ietf.org bugs to: > webmaster@tools.ietf.org > * Report all other bugs or issues to: ietf-action@ietf.org > List info (including how to Unsubscribe): > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/tools-discuss > --------------CzObl03aUy04cECQEJ0bD5ea Content-Type: text/html; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

This is done

On 2/23/22 11:11 AM, Eric Rescorla wrote:
Thanks. It seems to me like it ought to be possible to make this invisible to the user.

-Ekr


On Wed, Feb 23, 2022 at 6:48 AM Robert Sparks <rjsparks@nostrum.com> wrote:

The important thing was the login. We'll look at not asking for the grants.

RjS

On 2/22/22 8:54 PM, Eric Rescorla wrote:
I just went to register and I got prompted with an OAuth dialog to give permission for the registration system to see my information from DT. Is there some reason why we need this? Generally, it seems like people should expect that www.ietf.org, datatracker.ietf.org, and registration.ietf.org can share information between them.

-Ekr










___________________________________________________________
Tools-discuss mailing list - Tools-discuss@ietf.org
This list is for discussion, not for action requests or bug reports.
* Report datatracker and mailarchive bugs to: datatracker-project@ietf.org
* Report tools.ietf.org bugs to: webmaster@tools.ietf.org
* Report all other bugs or issues to: ietf-action@ietf.org
List info (including how to Unsubscribe): https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/tools-discuss
___________________________________________________________
Tools-discuss mailing list - Tools-discuss@ietf.org
This list is for discussion, not for action requests or bug reports.
* Report datatracker and mailarchive bugs to: datatracker-project@ietf.org
* Report tools.ietf.org bugs to: webmaster@tools.ietf.org
* Report all other bugs or issues to: ietf-action@ietf.org
List info (including how to Unsubscribe): https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/tools-discuss
--------------CzObl03aUy04cECQEJ0bD5ea-- From nobody Thu Feb 24 12:59:30 2022 Return-Path: X-Original-To: tools-discuss@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: tools-discuss@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id DFA1C3A07C0 for ; Thu, 24 Feb 2022 12:59:29 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.899 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.899 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id Ibg_UMYNwHEX for ; Thu, 24 Feb 2022 12:59:25 -0800 (PST) Received: from ietfx.ietf.org (ietfx.amsl.com [4.31.198.45]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ADH-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 350953A07B4 for ; Thu, 24 Feb 2022 12:59:25 -0800 (PST) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfx.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1C4244092790; Thu, 24 Feb 2022 12:59:25 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com Received: from ietfx.ietf.org ([4.31.198.45]) by localhost (ietfx.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id WpSU3jTny0zX; Thu, 24 Feb 2022 12:59:25 -0800 (PST) Received: from smtpclient.apple (unknown [158.140.230.105]) by ietfx.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 5465A409278F; Thu, 24 Feb 2022 12:59:24 -0800 (PST) Content-Type: multipart/signed; boundary="Apple-Mail=_5F26B1E5-894D-4282-8FC4-EA044FBFC86E"; protocol="application/pgp-signature"; micalg=pgp-sha256 Mime-Version: 1.0 (Mac OS X Mail 15.0 \(3693.40.0.1.81\)) From: Jay Daley In-Reply-To: <0D5AF394-6EE6-4A3A-A6AD-F7EE758AB924@eggert.org> Date: Fri, 25 Feb 2022 09:59:19 +1300 Cc: Carsten Bormann , tools-discuss Message-Id: <8B39C721-989E-4D9B-B052-3B3745E7F19B@ietf.org> References: <3CC0625E-90FE-43DE-AEC0-D18D9F9A1C20@ietf.org> <3451C30D-2F61-4C79-B4A1-8D36F18855D6@tzi.org> <0D5AF394-6EE6-4A3A-A6AD-F7EE758AB924@eggert.org> To: Lars Eggert X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.3693.40.0.1.81) Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Tools-discuss] Outstanding updates to authors.ietf.org now complete. X-BeenThere: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF Tools Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 24 Feb 2022 20:59:30 -0000 --Apple-Mail=_5F26B1E5-894D-4282-8FC4-EA044FBFC86E Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 > On 24/02/2022, at 8:22 PM, Lars Eggert wrote: >=20 > Hi, >=20 > On 2022-2-24, at 4:52, Carsten Bormann wrote: >> On 2022-02-24, at 03:47, Jay Daley wrote: >>> https://authors.ietf.org/en/templates-and-schemas#character-entities >=20 > this is probably a larger ask, but I think it would make sense to = split this wiki more thoroughly in a "drafting in Markdown" and = "drafting in XML" branches. >=20 > This is already somewhat there by having left-menu pages with those = titles (I'd order Markdown first, however). >=20 > But then the page a the URL above (and possibly) others mix XML and = Markdown content on one page, which makes them look busy and makes them = carry content that is irrelevant for authors using the other toolchain. This templates page is pretty much the only page that can neatly be = split into two pages, one for RFCXML and one for Markdown. Apart from = those that are already RFCXML specific, the rest of the pages are all = task oriented and their content cannot be practically split into two = (that=E2=80=99s also a bad idea from a usability perspective). So we could split this template page and have a Markdown section of the = menu, but for now it is going to a lonely section with just one page in = it with barely five lines of text, which is something I=E2=80=99ve been = trying to avoid based on previous feedback about not having short pages. = However, if we think the Markdown-specific section will grow over time = then it=E2=80=99s best to do that now and fix up all the links before = they get embedded in lots of other sites. Thoughts? Jay >=20 > Thanks, > Lars >=20 -- Jay Daley IETF Executive Director exec-director@ietf.org --Apple-Mail=_5F26B1E5-894D-4282-8FC4-EA044FBFC86E Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: attachment; filename=signature.asc Content-Type: application/pgp-signature; name=signature.asc Content-Description: Message signed with OpenPGP -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- iQIzBAEBCAAdFiEEteUdwVZRcQwi2bcWICxpEHTRWFMFAmIX8acACgkQICxpEHTR WFMQOw//Zo9d0Wjz8VCBNGFlpCBlijdKlYT76FmJNrT5XFFyQaRjnV2Z4SeRUkGF nJxDjsdaUjVRPHnL+fiujBfNNXhN+y/YtuCuPzGTdgTXa6Rrx56UqjEdnOsmrwlk WU9ivA/2D3VD7RG6c6k+8iiJsZFDC4bnWiRVG1p+R6444M/EaQOzyONhD/VHWSbd gEGaoP5GrrtEN6xHrQrzIemOVkjBGOAa5BuDwHUwZhRX+PbSQS+TLbAgdyp6xlrR S7Gn+v3ZSBECPhNBTbgyBbLHtKjL3RGp16OK7zP8nm9mzf7+Jnf8UfOe8Y2G8nZg LZ4rBGOi/Tx7o8CxrmxbW+8T7lhBF3s89UCvtvVODzUGQQsMZOZYmd9sw04SAkM7 qQuhzFOBHGsdkIax31LF0P5cizz0PSb3XTb5V3VMZ6HOru+WstGz+wjm6ipcLdS8 3Wg4stp0yemNAJ1jxtY7IN2FYI7WDjwXNnky+THXQndR6+ZDES7mU6zyMKnV3bjV Zns/lbXP5fWhZCsG+YM2wuijFsoRafqzrHBkFz6zZHss7C4/V90jEHn8oPAQStnk 63xr8iT8adgjuf2YR4jEsZIVOvT+m0P6SKCBOLbFzAJcH2i1JD6S4RoO8xwJqM5s 5eA0YVB+CERunZzipSo7ZedHEjHWClEG6hQ4c3HIPzkNPtY0FiY= =z1yV -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --Apple-Mail=_5F26B1E5-894D-4282-8FC4-EA044FBFC86E-- From nobody Thu Feb 24 13:01:13 2022 Return-Path: X-Original-To: tools-discuss@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: tools-discuss@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 004AA3A07B9 for ; Thu, 24 Feb 2022 13:01:10 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.896 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.896 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_NONE=0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=rtfm-com.20210112.gappssmtp.com Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id bbkJQc9C4FL9 for ; Thu, 24 Feb 2022 13:01:06 -0800 (PST) Received: from mail-il1-x129.google.com (mail-il1-x129.google.com [IPv6:2607:f8b0:4864:20::129]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 9F1EF3A090C for ; Thu, 24 Feb 2022 13:01:06 -0800 (PST) Received: by mail-il1-x129.google.com with SMTP id d7so2744662ilf.8 for ; Thu, 24 Feb 2022 13:01:06 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=rtfm-com.20210112.gappssmtp.com; s=20210112; h=mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date:message-id:subject:to :cc; bh=j2K+/fTdR0noz35H/TuHJAUta+YSPkCclqWJblurb4Y=; b=Co6rzGo4N8RxoPZ0UQ3r6gU4mv6vxNPt/PE6QBR4sGghzcQWmk2xtCrU9OrqGjWMCc a2m8ai6gpWm0Z+66QaAQ0DcGc5PIL8OHuuzlzNf74TVu4eDYLMeP5V/H9gK99NGhcmx0 IA864yxEerVqez9eA8p6nGXl1XoPC8NHCueXz/8jJujM/MHg6h4eix1xu4oRVm19xzUL edd1WGvCobsjYu8oiyuDAgTYsuGgZJCpPMIzrwFNdRuKXmP2Lya22tP0vpuzjV8Pf1Nj YLzsLmt8ok1MHzQNp8cjFF4DjLSNweyETpNbbbT/WAggqmOJZTlLByw+NYb3bC61RhkI QkFw== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20210112; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date :message-id:subject:to:cc; bh=j2K+/fTdR0noz35H/TuHJAUta+YSPkCclqWJblurb4Y=; b=Zn8zV5djqDLEfDjaMCeV2Ctem+hTpeG33NE9wqx8O9CDq9FDnSAkdAiXPXZtrOZt9D Apv0Awcm+QDGvnw1vm/Sm53u7rSI296Jdke3rKsw3A6oahYO2sY8X2B1BfPL017QGZxI KG7VfAvX6jDDx5boKFnkaaZ0H898IQ+J6yNg14tRVHYi4EZ+r3JdPz6xus0qUDtCfOeK Akd+vMjQGx9+HuVtfo/KHsWuw0GorC+mU2MHDrspe667pbc6WANu2lztpZx6Jwd8jRoo X2gQO+Rjww00FXe1TgVXnctGxVN9zQBkGL8AO1E+OqpajtkZcGQpTm0VAU6MnF5lryUh RQ0w== X-Gm-Message-State: AOAM531CnV6pflfVLe3MvYCiXcbAe2LLuEJvpgmFi0pBtRN0kFHwv/gj 6ecQA98dUzmN1fAgqAhu5UHG8uZmFl3ecExlzAwB8w== X-Google-Smtp-Source: ABdhPJxWNMpgdHxgKizIIbiwoGlm1iQZ6M+d0CITt/ONJI7FddCKKpCa5zeciwRft3zZflfBHR07QrJS9RhAbcyb23c= X-Received: by 2002:a05:6e02:1887:b0:2c2:4311:cc5a with SMTP id o7-20020a056e02188700b002c24311cc5amr3708509ilu.39.1645736465470; Thu, 24 Feb 2022 13:01:05 -0800 (PST) MIME-Version: 1.0 References: <161819e5-33a7-0dcc-e899-03c1d67122a6@nostrum.com> In-Reply-To: From: Eric Rescorla Date: Thu, 24 Feb 2022 13:00:29 -0800 Message-ID: To: Robert Sparks Cc: tools-discuss Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="0000000000006b32d205d8c9e106" Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Tools-discuss] Oauth DT->Registration X-BeenThere: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF Tools Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 24 Feb 2022 21:01:11 -0000 --0000000000006b32d205d8c9e106 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Great! On Thu, Feb 24, 2022 at 12:57 PM Robert Sparks wrote: > This is done > On 2/23/22 11:11 AM, Eric Rescorla wrote: > > Thanks. It seems to me like it ought to be possible to make this invisible > to the user. > > -Ekr > > > On Wed, Feb 23, 2022 at 6:48 AM Robert Sparks > wrote: > >> The important thing was the login. We'll look at not asking for the >> grants. >> >> RjS >> On 2/22/22 8:54 PM, Eric Rescorla wrote: >> >> I just went to register and I got prompted with an OAuth dialog to give >> permission for the registration system to see my information from DT. Is >> there some reason why we need this? Generally, it seems like people should >> expect that www.ietf.org, datatracker.ietf.org, and registration.ietf.org >> can share information between them. >> >> -Ekr >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> ___________________________________________________________ >> Tools-discuss mailing list - Tools-discuss@ietf.org >> This list is for discussion, not for action requests or bug reports. >> * Report datatracker and mailarchive bugs to: datatracker-project@ietf.org >> * Report tools.ietf.org bugs to: webmaster@tools.ietf.org >> * Report all other bugs or issues to: ietf-action@ietf.org >> List info (including how to Unsubscribe): https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/tools-discuss >> >> ___________________________________________________________ >> Tools-discuss mailing list - Tools-discuss@ietf.org >> This list is for discussion, not for action requests or bug reports. >> * Report datatracker and mailarchive bugs to: >> datatracker-project@ietf.org >> * Report tools.ietf.org bugs to: webmaster@tools.ietf.org >> * Report all other bugs or issues to: ietf-action@ietf.org >> List info (including how to Unsubscribe): >> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/tools-discuss >> > --0000000000006b32d205d8c9e106 Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Great!

On Thu, Feb 24, 2022 at 12:57 PM Robert Sparks &= lt;rjsparks@nostrum.com> wro= te:
=20 =20 =20

This is done

On 2/23/22 11:11 AM, Eric Rescorla wrote:
=20
Thanks. It seems to me like it ought to be possible to make this invisible to the user.

-Ekr


On Wed, Feb 23, 2022 at 6:48 AM Robert Sparks <rjsparks@nostrum.com> wrote:

The important thing was the login. We'll look at not asking for the grants.

RjS

On 2/22/22 8:54 PM, Eric Rescorla wrote:
I just went to register and I got prompted with an OAuth dialog to give permission for the registration system to see my information from DT. Is there some reason why we need this? Generally, it seems like people should expect that www.ietf.org, datatracker.ietf.org, and registration.ietf.org can share information between them.

-Ekr










________________________________________________________=
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Tools-discuss mailing list - Tools-discuss@ietf.org
This list is for discussion, not for action requests or bug reports.
* Report datatracker and mailarchive bugs to: datatracker-project@ietf.org
* Report tools.ietf.org=
 bugs to: webmaster@tools.ietf.org
* Report all other bugs or issues to: ietf-action@ietf.org
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an/listinfo/tools-discuss
___________________________________________________________
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This list is for discussion, not for action requests or bug reports.
* Report datatracker and mailarchive bugs to: datatracker-project@ietf.org=
* Report tools.ietf.org bugs to: webmaster@tools.ietf.org
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--0000000000006b32d205d8c9e106-- From nobody Fri Feb 25 04:42:23 2022 Return-Path: X-Original-To: tools-discuss@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: tools-discuss@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 024E43A0B47 for ; Fri, 25 Feb 2022 04:42:18 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -0.044 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-0.044 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_ADSP_CUSTOM_MED=0.001, FORGED_GMAIL_RCVD=1, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, NICE_REPLY_A=-0.714, NML_ADSP_CUSTOM_MED=0.9, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_SOFTFAIL=0.665, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=no autolearn_force=no Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id OokitLJPDvrL for ; Fri, 25 Feb 2022 04:42:16 -0800 (PST) Received: from cirse-smtp-out.extra.cea.fr (cirse-smtp-out.extra.cea.fr [132.167.192.148]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 153063A0B75 for ; Fri, 25 Feb 2022 04:42:15 -0800 (PST) Received: from pisaure.intra.cea.fr (pisaure.intra.cea.fr [132.166.88.21]) by cirse-sys.extra.cea.fr (8.14.7/8.14.7/CEAnet-Internet-out-4.0) with ESMTP id 21PCgDCb029850 for ; Fri, 25 Feb 2022 13:42:13 +0100 Received: from pisaure.intra.cea.fr (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by localhost (Postfix) with SMTP id 0A91B205700 for ; Fri, 25 Feb 2022 13:42:13 +0100 (CET) Received: from muguet2-smtp-out.intra.cea.fr (muguet2-smtp-out.intra.cea.fr [132.166.192.13]) by pisaure.intra.cea.fr (Postfix) with ESMTP id F2FE82056B8 for ; Fri, 25 Feb 2022 13:42:12 +0100 (CET) Received: from [10.8.32.130] (is245935.intra.cea.fr [10.8.32.130]) by muguet2-sys.intra.cea.fr (8.14.7/8.14.7/CEAnet-Internet-out-4.0) with ESMTP id 21PCgC0O019154 for ; Fri, 25 Feb 2022 13:42:12 +0100 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="------------CXrVV0D5DfkpuHz8k8MDPb2k" Message-ID: Date: Fri, 25 Feb 2022 13:42:31 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows NT 10.0; Win64; x64; rv:91.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/91.6.1 Content-Language: fr To: tools-discuss@ietf.org References: <7f2430b2-ff42-74a0-4788-cab92c18cb78@gmail.com> <24970.31541.811733.279425@fireball.acr.fi> <24970.59722.666358.972665@fireball.acr.fi> <63d75857-903e-67d7-0805-b9bc145219ff@gmail.com> <24974.29967.296570.69590@fireball.acr.fi> <93db6664-8e04-02b6-539b-e4f65f7860c6@gmail.com> From: Alexandre Petrescu In-Reply-To: Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Tools-discuss] Clickable URLs in slides displayed in Meetecho - and live translator? automated live typer? X-BeenThere: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF Tools Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 25 Feb 2022 12:42:18 -0000 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --------------CXrVV0D5DfkpuHz8k8MDPb2k Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Do you know whether there exists a live translator of language, open source, from ukrainian language? I remember having seen live transcriptor, typer (not translator) in a Teams meeting for English.  What was being said live by a participant was then being seen as text at the bottom of the window.  It was automatic, not human typer. Alex Le 17/12/2021 à 10:53, Alexandre Petrescu a écrit : > Sorry, to correct myself. > > The watcher's ability to advance slides in Teams is not related to the > pptx-vs-pdf format.  Someone displays pdfs and I can advance them, > some other person displays pptxs and I can advance, other pptx I can > not advance.  There must be some other criteria in Teams that allows > the watcher to advance or not the slides.  I dont know what. > > Alex > > Le 17/12/2021 à 10:20, Alexandre Petrescu a écrit : >> I mean, _certain_ presentations can be advanced by the watcher in Teams. >> >> Probably only the pptx slides can, whereas the pdfs not. >> >> Hopefully a more capable tool than Teams would allow the watcher to >> advance _all_ slides of any file format. >> >> Alex >> >> Le 17/12/2021 à 10:04, Alexandre Petrescu a écrit : >>> fyi I see now that in Microsoft Teams it is possible that the >>> watcher (not the presenter) can advance slides and click on URLs... >>> >>> Hopefully such functionality is available in meetecho soon. >>> >>> Le 12/11/2021 à 18:36, Alexandre Petrescu a écrit : >>>> >>>> >>>> Le 12/11/2021 à 15:07, Tero Kivinen a écrit : >>>>> Alexandre Petrescu writes: >>>>>> Clickable URLs is one thing, but 'hoverable' URL would be an >>>>>> advancement as well, probably. >>>>> >>>>> Something like what is now in the >>>>> https://kivinen.iki.fi/ietf-112-combined/slide-001.html pages? >>>> >>>> YEs, hovering a second time over the distinguished "BCP 79" does >>>> display >>>> the tooltip "IPR in IETF Technos". >>>> >>>> This is yes what I meant, and thank you very much. >>>> >>>> This does help a lot during the meeting in order to understand what >>>> the >>>> presenter means without having to download the pdf, click the URL, >>>> load >>>> other pages.  It is a real shortcut. >>>> >>>> Alex >>>> >>>>> >>>>> It does load the titles from the datatracker using datatracker api >>>>> when you first hover over the RFC or BCP name, and that will take >>>>> some time, so you might need to move mouse out from the link and back >>>>> in to get the tooltip visible (browsers wait for unspecified time >>>>> before they show the title when you stop, and depending on the >>>>> network speed and datatracker load the title might or might not be >>>>> loaded at that time). >>>>> >>>>> The script to do conversion is in the same directory: >>>>> https://kivinen.iki.fi/ietf-112-combined/find-pdf-http-links3.py >>>>> and the javascript loading the titles is in the slides.js file in >>>>> same directory. >>>>> >>>>>> Hovering over a URL which tells an RFC would conveniently display >>>>>> its title without actually having to click on it.  An example of >>>>>> such hoverable behaviour is the experience of browsing through >>>>>> wikipedia. >>>> >>>> ___________________________________________________________ >>>> Tools-discuss mailing list - Tools-discuss@ietf.org >>>> This list is for discussion, not for action requests or bug reports. >>>> * Report datatracker and mailarchive bugs to: >>>> datatracker-project@ietf.org >>>> * Report tools.ietf.org bugs to: webmaster@tools.ietf.org >>>> * Report all other bugs or issues to: ietf-action@ietf.org >>>> List info (including how to Unsubscribe): >>>> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/tools-discuss >>> >>> ___________________________________________________________ >>> Tools-discuss mailing list - Tools-discuss@ietf.org >>> This list is for discussion, not for action requests or bug reports. >>> * Report datatracker and mailarchive bugs to: >>> datatracker-project@ietf.org >>> * Report tools.ietf.org bugs to: webmaster@tools.ietf.org >>> * Report all other bugs or issues to: ietf-action@ietf.org >>> List info (including how to Unsubscribe): >>> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/tools-discuss >> >> ___________________________________________________________ >> Tools-discuss mailing list - Tools-discuss@ietf.org >> This list is for discussion, not for action requests or bug reports. >> * Report datatracker and mailarchive bugs to: >> datatracker-project@ietf.org >> * Report tools.ietf.org bugs to: webmaster@tools.ietf.org >> * Report all other bugs or issues to: ietf-action@ietf.org >> List info (including how to Unsubscribe): >> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/tools-discuss > > ___________________________________________________________ > Tools-discuss mailing list - Tools-discuss@ietf.org > This list is for discussion, not for action requests or bug reports. > * Report datatracker and mailarchive bugs to: > datatracker-project@ietf.org > * Report tools.ietf.org bugs to: webmaster@tools.ietf.org > * Report all other bugs or issues to: ietf-action@ietf.org > List info (including how to Unsubscribe): > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/tools-discuss --------------CXrVV0D5DfkpuHz8k8MDPb2k Content-Type: text/html; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit

Do you know whether there exists a live translator of language, open source, from ukrainian language?

I remember having seen live transcriptor, typer (not translator) in a Teams meeting for English.  What was being said live by a participant was then being seen as text at the bottom of the window.  It was automatic, not human typer.

Alex

Le 17/12/2021 à 10:53, Alexandre Petrescu a écrit :
Sorry, to correct myself.

The watcher's ability to advance slides in Teams is not related to the pptx-vs-pdf format.  Someone displays pdfs and I can advance them, some other person displays pptxs and I can advance, other pptx I can not advance.  There must be some other criteria in Teams that allows the watcher to advance or not the slides.  I dont know what.

Alex

Le 17/12/2021 à 10:20, Alexandre Petrescu a écrit :
I mean, _certain_ presentations can be advanced by the watcher in Teams.

Probably only the pptx slides can, whereas the pdfs not.

Hopefully a more capable tool than Teams would allow the watcher to advance _all_ slides of any file format.

Alex

Le 17/12/2021 à 10:04, Alexandre Petrescu a écrit :
fyi I see now that in Microsoft Teams it is possible that the watcher (not the presenter) can advance slides and click on URLs...

Hopefully such functionality is available in meetecho soon.

Le 12/11/2021 à 18:36, Alexandre Petrescu a écrit :


Le 12/11/2021 à 15:07, Tero Kivinen a écrit :
Alexandre Petrescu writes:
Clickable URLs is one thing, but 'hoverable' URL would be an
advancement as well, probably.

Something like what is now in the https://kivinen.iki.fi/ietf-112-combined/slide-001.html pages?

YEs, hovering a second time over the distinguished "BCP 79" does display
the tooltip "IPR in IETF Technos".

This is yes what I meant, and thank you very much.

This does help a lot during the meeting in order to understand what the
presenter means without having to download the pdf, click the URL, load
other pages.  It is a real shortcut.

Alex


It does load the titles from the datatracker using datatracker api when you first hover over the RFC or BCP name, and that will take
some time, so you might need to move mouse out from the link and back
in to get the tooltip visible (browsers wait for unspecified time
before they show the title when you stop, and depending on the
network speed and datatracker load the title might or might not be
loaded at that time).

The script to do conversion is in the same directory: https://kivinen.iki.fi/ietf-112-combined/find-pdf-http-links3.py and the javascript loading the titles is in the slides.js file in same directory.

Hovering over a URL which tells an RFC would conveniently display
its title without actually having to click on it.  An example of
such hoverable behaviour is the experience of browsing through
wikipedia.

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--_000_BAF91639524642AEBD35FF0EC274D439ciscocom_-- From nobody Mon Feb 28 20:07:22 2022 Return-Path: X-Original-To: tools-discuss@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: tools-discuss@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id E3D9C3A1866 for ; Mon, 28 Feb 2022 20:07:19 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.908 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.908 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, T_SCC_BODY_TEXT_LINE=-0.01, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id pYljW3VkQWL4 for ; Mon, 28 Feb 2022 20:07:15 -0800 (PST) Received: from ietfx.ietf.org (ietfx.amsl.com [4.31.198.45]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ADH-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 51F353A18F5 for ; Mon, 28 Feb 2022 20:07:06 -0800 (PST) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfx.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 22A92404BFA1; Mon, 28 Feb 2022 20:07:06 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com Received: from ietfx.ietf.org ([4.31.198.45]) by localhost (ietfx.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 6TFWM9dhtoY4; Mon, 28 Feb 2022 20:07:06 -0800 (PST) Received: from smtpclient.apple (unknown [158.140.230.105]) by ietfx.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 9B61F404BFA0; Mon, 28 Feb 2022 20:07:04 -0800 (PST) From: Jay Daley Message-Id: <5222D862-5FBD-4ED6-A67A-0B63D83CF99F@ietf.org> Content-Type: multipart/signed; boundary="Apple-Mail=_B3F99A0D-E269-4B54-B349-83526C524755"; protocol="application/pgp-signature"; micalg=pgp-sha256 Mime-Version: 1.0 (Mac OS X Mail 15.0 \(3693.40.0.1.81\)) Date: Tue, 1 Mar 2022 17:06:58 +1300 In-Reply-To: <8B39C721-989E-4D9B-B052-3B3745E7F19B@ietf.org> Cc: Carsten Bormann , tools-discuss To: Lars Eggert References: <3CC0625E-90FE-43DE-AEC0-D18D9F9A1C20@ietf.org> <3451C30D-2F61-4C79-B4A1-8D36F18855D6@tzi.org> <0D5AF394-6EE6-4A3A-A6AD-F7EE758AB924@eggert.org> <8B39C721-989E-4D9B-B052-3B3745E7F19B@ietf.org> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.3693.40.0.1.81) Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Tools-discuss] Outstanding updates to authors.ietf.org now complete. X-BeenThere: tools-discuss@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF Tools Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 01 Mar 2022 04:07:20 -0000 --Apple-Mail=_B3F99A0D-E269-4B54-B349-83526C524755 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="Apple-Mail=_EF1DF8F2-C015-40F3-8343-B41CCAC73887" --Apple-Mail=_EF1DF8F2-C015-40F3-8343-B41CCAC73887 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Following up on this. I haven=E2=80=99t split out that templates page = but after a number of offlist discussions, I have changed the flow and = added some more content that should support people who just want to get = on with it quickly and to nudge them to Markdown unless all the = pre-conditions are met for a good XML experience. Jay > On 25/02/2022, at 9:59 AM, Jay Daley wrote: >=20 > Signed PGP part >=20 >=20 >> On 24/02/2022, at 8:22 PM, Lars Eggert wrote: >>=20 >> Hi, >>=20 >> On 2022-2-24, at 4:52, Carsten Bormann wrote: >>> On 2022-02-24, at 03:47, Jay Daley wrote: >>>> = https://authors.ietf.org/en/templates-and-schemas#character-entities >>=20 >> this is probably a larger ask, but I think it would make sense to = split this wiki more thoroughly in a "drafting in Markdown" and = "drafting in XML" branches. >>=20 >> This is already somewhat there by having left-menu pages with those = titles (I'd order Markdown first, however). >>=20 >> But then the page a the URL above (and possibly) others mix XML and = Markdown content on one page, which makes them look busy and makes them = carry content that is irrelevant for authors using the other toolchain. >=20 > This templates page is pretty much the only page that can neatly be = split into two pages, one for RFCXML and one for Markdown. Apart from = those that are already RFCXML specific, the rest of the pages are all = task oriented and their content cannot be practically split into two = (that=E2=80=99s also a bad idea from a usability perspective). >=20 > So we could split this template page and have a Markdown section of = the menu, but for now it is going to a lonely section with just one page = in it with barely five lines of text, which is something I=E2=80=99ve = been trying to avoid based on previous feedback about not having short = pages. However, if we think the Markdown-specific section will grow = over time then it=E2=80=99s best to do that now and fix up all the links = before they get embedded in lots of other sites. >=20 > Thoughts? >=20 > Jay >=20 >>=20 >> Thanks, >> Lars >>=20 >=20 > -- > Jay Daley > IETF Executive Director > exec-director@ietf.org >=20 >=20 >=20 -- Jay Daley IETF Executive Director exec-director@ietf.org --Apple-Mail=_EF1DF8F2-C015-40F3-8343-B41CCAC73887 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Type: text/html; charset=utf-8 Following up on this.  I haven=E2=80=99t split out that = templates page but after a number of offlist discussions, I have changed = the flow and added some more content that should support people who just = want to get on with it quickly and to nudge them to Markdown unless all = the pre-conditions are met for a good XML experience.

Jay

On = 25/02/2022, at 9:59 AM, Jay Daley <exec-director@ietf.org> wrote:

Signed PGP = part


On 24/02/2022, at 8:22 = PM, Lars Eggert <lars@eggert.org> wrote:

Hi,

On 2022-2-24, at 4:52, = Carsten Bormann <cabo@tzi.org> wrote:
On 2022-02-24, at 03:47, Jay Daley <exec-director@ietf.org> wrote:
https://authors.ietf.org/en/templates-and-schemas#character-ent= ities

this is = probably a larger ask, but I think it would make sense to split this = wiki more thoroughly in a "drafting in Markdown" and "drafting in XML" = branches.

This is already somewhat there by = having left-menu pages with those titles (I'd order Markdown first, = however).

But then the page a the URL above = (and possibly) others mix XML and Markdown content on one page, which = makes them look busy and makes them carry content that is irrelevant for = authors using the other toolchain.

This templates page is pretty much the only page that can = neatly be split into two pages, one for RFCXML and one for Markdown. =  Apart from those that are already RFCXML specific, the rest of the = pages are all task oriented and their content cannot be practically = split into two (that=E2=80=99s also a bad idea from a usability = perspective).

So we could split this = template page and have a Markdown section of the menu, but for now it is = going to a lonely section with just one page in it with barely five = lines of text, which is something I=E2=80=99ve been trying to avoid = based on previous feedback about not having short pages.  However, = if we think the  Markdown-specific section will grow over time then = it=E2=80=99s best to do that now and fix up all the links before they = get embedded in lots of other sites.

Thoughts?

Jay


Thanks,
Lars


--
Jay Daley
IETF Executive = Director
exec-director@ietf.org




-- 
Jay = Daley
IETF Executive Director
exec-director@ietf.org

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